dnd-lore

[loud karma]

Please tell

[burnt iron]

I think Torg Eternity might interest you. It's a bit of a math-heavy system but it's a really neat setting. Reality-bending wizards from alternate worlds invade Earth and replace parts of Earth with parts of their own worlds where the laws of reality work differently

[loud karma]

It’s does interest me, I will check it out

[burnt iron]

You can play everything from an elven wizard to a cybered-up Tokyo street samurai

[late storm]

So, how do harpies reproduce in your setting?

[burnt iron]

Abducting humanoid males as mates since they're an all-female species. I think that's how it's usually assumed to happen...unless in your setting harpies can reproduce among themselves somehow

[late storm]

what do they do with the males after?

[iron saffron]

Snack.

[unkempt merlin]

Harpies don't. Sorta. Harpy Matriarchs are cursed individuals (haven't decided on the nature of the curse quite yet). They lay eggs that hatch into the other types of harpies, no other being needed.

[burnt iron]

likely eat them. Though perhaps a male who survives with a particularly good singing voice may be able to distract them long enough to escape

[unkempt merlin]

Sorry, was talking about in my setting

[stuck breach]

Mate with the males and then eat them

[burnt iron]

figured 🙂

[late storm]

Ok

[digital elk]

hi, anyone know where i can start looking for astronomy/astrology research within dnd? i'm making a character that dabbles in astronomy, divination, stuff like that and want some knowledge so there's less talking out of my ass lmao. I'm new to dnd so my first guess would be wikipedia for dnd astronomy but i'm having trouble finding much. any help appreciated! always viable to just wing it within dm's limits if i dont find anything concrete i suppose xD

[burnt iron]

I don't know if there really is any standard. It depends on what world you're in. Talk to your DM, maybe come up with your own system if they allow it

[stuck breach]

It might not be something which has ever been very well developed, it's pretty niche

[digital elk]

im surprised there arent like at least major constellations/celestial bodies to match major deities :c i tried looking for something similar but there doesnt seem to be much

[eager bay]

Do you prefer the old way of handling spellcasters in 3.Xe and prior over 4e and 5e?

I personally think it depends on the setting and how low- or high-magic it be. Standard to low fits Vancian better IMHO

[iron saffron]

There are but they're setting specific

[white ravine]

Surprisingly, no!

Its just completely awful because there is 0 difference physically between them

[hazy fox]

Well, maybe Metabaron style might work.

[sly jackal]

Is there a connection between stars and the astral plane in forgotten realms? I'm working with a player whos playing a stars Druid and wants to implement the fey touched feat into his characters story. He wants to "unlock" it through some insight he gains while gazing at the stars

So far the closest I've got is using the astral plane to travel between planes

[unkempt merlin]

That's what the Astral plane is for

[white ravine]

Astral plane is less space and more psychic dimension. It's vaguely space-like, but it doesn't operate on the same rules/principles.

For a fey touched feat regarding stars? Have them stargazing one night, looking at the constellations up in the speckled sky.

Then have one look at them.

By the time they blink it's back to normal, but they can immediately tell something is very different when they can suddenly teleport.

[sly jackal]

Ik, I'm saying that's the closest thing i can think of, hoping it's got to do with the stars

[white ravine]

If you want actual space, check out Wildspace.

It's the actual space of space.

[sly jackal]

Hmm what's the connection though

Between the star and fey magic

[white ravine]

That's for you to decide. Maybe an archfey thought it would be funny to gift the druid and see what they'd do with it.

[sly jackal]

Right

[white ravine]

Maybe that constellation is cursed, and the hag that enchanted the stars to have that baleful gaze dooms the people it lays its glistening eyes upon.

[sly jackal]

I see

Dm power haha

[white ravine]

Fey exist as representations of nature and of "imagination", and the night sky surely falls into that category

Go wild with it

[sly jackal]

Thank you

[eternal zodiac]

This is weird. Why is the newest Legend of Drizzt book cheaper than the previous one? I’m stumped

[left spindle]

Maybe they want to get people into the series?

[white ravine]

Check the reviews of the new book compared to previous. Might tell you something

[final gale]

I think crystal dragons being described as tossing snowballs playfully at adventurers is just so cute

[fresh river]

I think so too

I love how they added that small detail

[eager bay]

How do you picture the difference between high and wood elves?

[iron saffron]

One is snotty aristocrats and the other are tree hugging hippies.

[eager bay]

ofc

[hazy fox]

This is why I prefer Warhammer Fantasy.
Snotty Aristocrats but also either capable sailors (Cothique), guerillas (Nagarythe), marines (Lothern), wizards (Saphery), and wild Horseman (Ellyrion).
Also tree hugging hippies who commune with hunt god, annual wild hunt on neighboring villages, and will put an arrow between your eyes along with forest that will kill anything other than elves and tree folks.

There is true tree hugging hippies, but they live with High Elves.

[burnt iron]

high elves may be arrogant, but they've earned it. They have a fairly enlightened society (trending toward chaos and good their societies aren't weighed down by bureaucracy or over-burdened with greed and corruption), some of the greatest art, and they respect nature while not feeling bound to live in caves or huts. They see the importance of living alongside nature and know the dangers of over-harvesting lumber, over-hunting, and so forth. They are arrogant, yes, because their long lives do tend to lead them to have a patronizing view of other races...not out of cruelty or hate, but because they often recognize the mistakes humans are making because they've seen it before. Their arrogance can lead them down dangerous paths sometimes but the best among them learn to temper that arrogance. They may come off as a bit condescending, but their neighbors know them as loyal friends.

Wood elves may love nature, but hippies they are not. While as noble of spirit as their kindred, they also often lead shorter lives for the forests, even in the heart of their enclaves, are not safe places. Their desire to preserve nature at any cost often puts them at odds with their neighbors and they tend toward the practical far more than their high elf cousins do. They do create art and beautiful things, but their art is based more around creating beautiful tools, armor, and weapons that are simple, elegant, and beautiful at the same time. They tend to care less about what happens outside their forest domains, focusing much more on the here and now. This often makes them seem surprisingly short-sighted to humans used to dealing with the far-sighted high-elves, but also makes them more practical allies.

[iron saffron]

Legolas is a wood elf.
Galadriel is a high elf.

[hazy fox]

Ignoring starting six genocidal wars just because one of their kingdoms convinced them and also got slap on the wrist for that shenanigans while also probably wiping out possibly good Drow civilization and may have strenghtened Lolth.
Also starting an apocalypse as well.
Ironically, the only good (at least lack patronizaing attitude) High Elves are Moon Elves, and maybe Sun Elves who weren't raised in Evermeet and spend time with other races.

[burnt iron]

I mean she asked for our impressions. I wasn't going with any particular world's canon

[hazy fox]

Apologies.

[burnt iron]

No worries 🙂

[eager bay]

Yep! More specifically, Galadriel was among those who were in Valinor for some time, the Noldor

[eager bay]

heyo anyone got like alot of knowledge on mindflayers? 😛 could use some help if so discussing my character

[brittle sundial]

This is a good place to start: https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Mind_flayer

It has a lot of lore and information on them

There is also the entry in the Monster Manual

[dry pendant]

I reccommend The Illithiad. It's a 2nd Edition book but it has tons of info about them. It even gets into the minute details like what they smell like (the answer is onions, garlic and sometimes even vanilla!) and how they sleep! (on beds of damp moss)

Lords of Madness from 3rd edition is also a great source.

[analog oxide]

Doesn't 5e still use memory slots at default? How is it different than 2e, 3e?

[eager bay]

Spell slots in 5e aren’t bound to spell preparation

[left spindle]

in 3e you prepared individual spells. if you expected to cast fireball twice you prepared two fireballs.

in 5e if you prepare spells you prepare a certain number, and you can cast however many you want.

if you have 4 3rd level slots they can all be fireball

and you only have to prepare it once

[analog oxide]

Oh ok so that's like the cleric spell slots in 2e etc. They got whatever spells they knew but had the slots for the number

So that's what we did for my 3.xe game. What u described for 5e. Then we just went to spel pts 🙂 next change will be even bigger 😄

[main palm]

A question, can vampires reproduce and if so, if they had a demon partner, would the demon child be half demon half human or half undead?

[burnt iron]

generally vampires cannot reproduce. However dhampirs can be created if a vampire bites and infects a woman who is pregnant (as I recall, I might be getting my editions mixed up again). They cannot reproduce through the normal way however as they're undead, their bodies no longer function

[main palm]

That's why I am confused cuz in one the dhampirs backstoires it's said one of your parents is a vampire

[burnt iron]

could be they became a vampire later on

[white ravine]

Likely yes, if they totally give in to their nature

[modest badger]

5e has also played very loose with how parentage and heritage works. A tiefling previously is typically not a half-fiend or cambion, but someone with fiendish heritage down the line. Xanathar's potential backgrounds for tieflings had a devil as a parent.

[unkempt merlin]

They didn't even necessarily need any direct devil heritage. The first tieflings in a few settings were simply transformed by the power of a pact.

[blissful umbra]

yeah. no offense, but in my mind a better question for this channel would be if there has been an jnstance of a vampire reproducing and what the result was in the lore

[spiral night]

based

[eager bay]

Galadriel’s a Noldor, right?

[zenith dust]

she's both Noldor and Teleri

if you use her in your campagin she can be huge

[eager bay]

Noldor and Teleri in general? How tall for the range?

[unique spruce]

Elendil was like 8 feet tall

Which dnd god or deity would be the closest to the hate and bloodlust of Khorne

[lime holly]

Rak Tulkhesh, the Overlord of War in Eberron

In the forgotten realms, war and death are seperate domains. Bhaal is the god of murder while Tempus is the god of warfare.

[white ravine]

Of Khorne specifically? Demogorgon.

He exists purely out of the sake of rage, and quite literally gets more powerful as things devolve into bloodshed and carnage around him.

[unique spruce]

He’s a demon lord right?

[white ravine]

Yup.

Big guy too. Nasty.

[weak tendon]

Tbf all of the chaos gods are closer to demon lord than celestial god

[analog oxide]

demogorgon is a demonlord and self proclaimed prince of demons due to power but in older editions (1e i think and 2e for sure he was also a lesser god. when 3e came around (and then 4e and 5e now) he;'s no longer a god but for your game u could alwasy treat him differently if needed

[serene crater]

I mean yeenoghu was also a pretty bloodthirsty demon lord, though his version was more an endless voracity rather than a desire to just kill things

[eager bay]

Elendil was described as "more than a man high and half a ranga," so about 7'11"

and depending on the source, Elu Thingol is either 8'2" or just under 9 feet, so like 8'10"

[zenith dust]

LOTR isn't an official D&D setting, you won't find official answers about the hugeness of LOTR elves

[eager bay]

No I know

[zenith dust]

then it's probably for off-topic I think

plus you can literally make things as inflated as you want without approval

[eager bay]

meet me there

[quaint geyser]

Is there a Faerun equivalent to Japan?

[hazy fox]

Either Wa or Kozakura, which is two for some reason.

[quaint geyser]

Where exactly are those? I couldn't find them on the map.

[hazy fox]

Well, in the “exotic oriental lands of Kara-Tur” (I maybe paraphrasing but they used these words)…
OR if you want to contribute cluelessness of if it wants to be pan Asian or close to analogue common in 2E and 3E, maybe use Shou Lung or Tu Lung like Samurai but with Chinese names.
Examples being Baldur’s Gate 2, old I’Cath lore (though probably you can chalk up to White Wolf being the writer), or old magazine modules where it is suggested that you play as “samurai of local Jito” despite being in Fantasy China.

[iron saffron]

https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/forgottenrealms/images/c/cf/TorilProjection.png

[quaint geyser]

Oh yeah, I didn't think of zooming out to the world map. Thank you.

[carmine pilot]

how cab i learb about d&d lore

can

[iron saffron]

Which edition and campaign setting?

[carmine pilot]

1e

[iron saffron]

It's mostly Greyhawk lore then.

There are a couple of Greyhawk wikis as well as Youtubers, such as Greyhawk Grognard, AJ Pickett, and Lord Gosumba, who talk about Greyhawk lore.

[stuck breach]

Lots of Greyhawk info on r/Greyhawk, too

[azure mural]

Guys I need big help with setting some important lore

Can I talk about it here?

[iron saffron]

Only if it's official D&D campaign lore.

[azure mural]

It’s set in the forgotten realms mostly

[iron saffron]

Ask away then!

[azure mural]

So the idea is: more than 8000years ago Corellon and Shadevari had an atropal, and they tried to cover the thing dividing the body of the atropal in a lot of pieces dividing them among the planes. They tried to hide it but somehow some mortals got to know about it’s existence and formed a cult to riform the atropal and unleash the chaos among the world

[iron saffron]

Shadevari is a type of monster, not a god though.

[azure mural]

But I dunno how to make it possible for mortals to get to know it, cause I first thought about kiarsalee trying to get it back during the silence of lolth but it is in the 1383 DR and the campaign is set in the 1492DR

[azure mural]

Wasn’t it the name of Selûne and Shar before they divided?

If I got it wrong sorry, it’s meant to be Corellon with the sisters before they stopped being one creature

Did I say something bad?

[white ravine]

No, just these things take a ton of research

Especially what you just asked. I read a ton of dnd lore and half of the things you just said were completely new to me

[azure mural]

Oh

Sorry

[white ravine]

Dont apologize, if anything its refreshing

[iron saffron]

I never heard of the Corellon spawning an atropal thing before.

[white ravine]

If you got sources that could help narrow things down

Get us some groundwork

[azure mural]

That’s it, it didn’t happen, I need it for the lore so it makes sense that they couldn’t just kill the atropal

[iron saffron]

Oh okay, it's your table's lore.

[white ravine]

Ahhhh...

Okay, well keep in mind atropals are very magically charged beings.

[azure mural]

Yea but I want to make it the most coherent with the canon lore I can

[white ravine]

Could be the fact that while the atropals fragmented being exists across multiple planes, it's more a vestige.

Attacking it is like trying to cut smoke since it's so thoroughly discorporated.

As pieces of it are brought together though, it regains figments of power but also becomes more tangible.

When it is fully reformed, its power becomes active and it can rain hellfire, but can also be cut down.

A ghostly situation, in ways.

[azure mural]

I thought about the pieces giving power to stuff (ex: a shining island that first was just the ruin of one of netheril islands and become a shining island after getting in contact with the atropal piece)

Would that make sense?

[white ravine]

Id go for the opposite/worse effect.

Instead of a ruin of netheril, have it be a netherese city constantly in a flaming freefall, swarming with volatile magical beings like golems and elementals

Atropals exume abhorrent and vile energy, they would corrupt instead of purify, even if you try to bend its latent magic.

[prime bronze]

Anyone knows who's the closest archdevil/deity to chain devils?

I'm having a hard time finding info about it

[stuck breach]

Chain devils are lesser devils, they are above barbed devils and below bone devils. Many of them live in Minauros, the third layer of the Nine Hells, which Mammon rules.

[azure mural]

Anyone of the ruler of the hells

[white ravine]

I'd say Mammon, given their highest density is in his layer.

[prime bronze]

Thanks for the info

[thorn relic]

Just a random thought I had. If there was a wolf race what would their relationship/thoughts on lycanthropy be?

[cunning girder]

Depending on the specific lore, lycanthropy could be a curse/corruption of the wolf race. I believe that might be the Kanon relationship between Shifters and Lycanthropes in Eberron

[unkempt merlin]

The Origins are "questioned" in Kanon. Some people in setting say Shifters came first. Others say that Lycans came first.

Shifters say that Lycanthropy begin as a gift from the moon for their best warriors

[white ravine]

I'd say Lycanthropes would be effectively returning to your 'pure form', given how exactly lycanthropy works

I can imagine they wouldn't bother those people, and may even be allowed to stay as a result (even while shifted)

[eager bay]

I know D&D has elves live for 750 years; is that the average, min, or max?

[unkempt merlin]

Depends on the setting. The way its listed in 5e doesn't specify if it's an average,min, or max. Don't remember off the top of my head for older editions

[eager bay]

For simplicity's sake, FR

[mellow ferry]

1st edition

High elves live between 1,201 - 1,600 years
Wood elves live between 1,101 - 1,350 years
Drow live between 801 - 1,000 years

2nd edition

High elves live between 354 - 750 years
Wood elves live between 329 - 725 years
Drow live between 228 - 525 years

3rd edition

High elves live between 426 - 1,020 years
Wood elves live between 354 - 750 years
Drow live between 354 - 750 years

4th edition

High elves live 300+ years
Wood elves live well over 200 years
Drow live longer than both, assuming they don't meet a violent end

5th edition

Elves live up to 750 years old.

[white ravine]

Up to would be the cap in 5e

Also, jeez drow got screwed.

[eager bay]

Which of them do you prefer?

[mellow ferry]

Me?

I guess 3rd edition

It doesn't screw over drow and it seems a reasonable amount of time for an elf to live

[eager bay]

You think high elves would’ve come after wood and drow or before?

[mellow ferry]

How do you mean "come after"?

[eager bay]

like, in evolution or whatever

Even if D&D tend to be highly creationist (depending on setting, ofc)

[mellow ferry]

In the Forgotten Realms, wood elves came first, then high elves later. Certain wood elves then got transformed into drow by Corellon after they did a genocide.

[eager bay]

Okay, so like how the equivalent to high elves in Tolkien’s world be the ones who saw the light of the Two Trees of Valinor

[mellow ferry]

No.

The wood elves came from the feywild because they were explorers and found portals to the Material Plane.

The High elves advanced their magical knowledge in the feywild but made a massive mistake while performing a ritual and their homeland there was destroyed in a self-inflicted cataclysm. They came to the prime as refugees.

It's said in 4th edition materials that wood elves are descended from the eladrin, but that's a really sketchy and convoluted lore track to follow.

[eager bay]

interesting

Both would be from eladrin then

[storm dagger]

Eladrin were just High Elves in 4e

[mellow ferry]

Mordenkainen's Tome of Foes says that all elves come from Arvandor, then went to the feywild, and that the eladrin were just the elves that chose to stay in the feywild when all of the other elves left for the Prime.

This kind of tracks, but not 100%, since in 4th edition, eladrin was synonymous with high elf - so all of your sun/gold and moon/silver elves were collectively called eladrin.

Before that though, eladrin were a kind of celestial, like a chaotic archon.

[storm dagger]

Before that they were the chaotic good outsiders from Arborea

And not actually related to elves in any way

[mellow ferry]

Apart from some visual similarities.

[storm dagger]

Here is one for example

https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/forgottenrealms/images/f/f5/Shiradi_3e.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20191228184554

[mellow ferry]

What it boils down to, ultimately, is who you ask.

Like I said: really sketchy and convoluted lore.

What's certain is that in the Realms, the various subraces of elves came to the prime in several waves of migrations, with each wave having it's own reason for making the journey.

...though saying that, the shadar-kai are also sketchy.

First they were fey, then they were humans, now they're elves.

[deep skiff]

soon they will have to find a way to shoehorn Ardlings in too

[mellow ferry]

Ardlings are just aasimar with animal heads - they haven't introduced guardinals into 5e yet, but ardlings could easily be their descendants

[white ravine]

A coup, but same difference. Gotta love Corellon marrying the literal worst person possible.

[storm dagger]

I think Corellon had multiple partners

[white ravine]

Right, because he had to replace the literal worst one

[hollow sonnet]

Can anyone here help me understand the Shadowfell? It’s meant to be a desolate lifeless plane of darkness right?

[white ravine]

Yup. Sucks the literal liveliness right outta you.

[hollow sonnet]

Can anything live there? Or is it just barren?

[white ravine]

Its like hades in a way. Except instead of leaving you bitter and angry, it just leaves you.

[white ravine]

Things can, but food generally is either bland or gross and water feels stale and uncomfortable to consume. Often not harmful, but not good either.

Most prevalent natives are the Sorrowsworn, being what they are as manifested negative feelings.

[hollow sonnet]

I don’t know where I got the misconception from that the Drow live there

[tender moon]

Darkbad

[hollow sonnet]

Maybe I was thinking of Lolth…

[white ravine]

Your thinking the Shadar-kai. They're somewhat drow-esque, but instead of matriarchal demon worship they act more like hellraiser demons but elven.

Nasty piercings, self inflicted wounds, etc.

[hollow sonnet]

Hmm from my understanding of the cosmology… just as there are entrances into the Feywild in the material plane, similar entrances also exist for the Shadowfell too right?

[white ravine]

Correct.

Difference lies in location, mainly.

[hollow sonnet]

Yeah Feywild is mostly forests not sure about Shadowfell though

I keep thinking caves or “dark” areas

[white ravine]

Well the feywild portals exist in places of pure nature.

Dense groves, fairy circles, clean springs.

You can stand in a fairy circle during a storm, only for the rain to intensify then vanish as your in a new world.

Shadowfell rifts exist in places of pure misery.

Abandoned asylums, downtrodden slums, mass graves, undisturbed battlefields.

[hollow sonnet]

Or a very depressed town?

[white ravine]

Misery and depression are different

At least in this case

But generally, the overlap is enough.

If say the town's pet owlbear mascot died, everyone would be sad but a shadowfell portal wouldnt open

They manifest in places of hopelessness, emptiness, and general feelings of dismay.

[hollow sonnet]

So… it can be said that if an area gets miserable enough… like a slave camp or a very miserable town, they can get transported to the Shadowfell…?

[white ravine]

Transported? Most likely.

If theyre unlucky that is. Signs of nasty monsters manifesting may start before it gets that bad though. Shadows warping, faint whispers. Soon enough, it'll be like the place never existed.

Or...well...the people there that is.

The shadowfell doesnt steal places, it mirrors them. A mountain in the normal world may be impossibly tall in the feywild.

[hollow sonnet]

And how long can being from the Material plane last in the Shadowfell becoming literal shadows of their former selves?

[white ravine]

I believe its...charisma save every day or lose X charisma?

I cant recall

But when it comes to the shadowfell, that slave camp may have a lich presiding over an army of sentient zombies, toiling away at pointless tasks. One digs a hole, another fills it later.

[hollow sonnet]

Cos a town wide plague is definitely going to cause misery. Add on a tyrannical overlord, high taxes, famine… and it’s getting there

[white ravine]

Oh yeah. Definitely.

Start with minor magical phenomena, then you can have people start mutating into sorrowsworn. When it gets really bad, people begin getting warped to the shadowfell city when they go to bed, causing dozens of disappearances every night.

If not returned in a few days, they'll be lost forever.

[hollow sonnet]

Looks at current world So I guess having a multiversal threat attacking your reality killing people, enslaving millions, and razing cities is not healthy for this whole Shadowfell business then

[white ravine]

Well...thats only part of how it works.

The other part is it's a prison plane.

[hollow sonnet]

When misery is global… the Shadowfell is gonna get a pretty big kick in power

[white ravine]

Beings of true unbridled evil get themselves warped to the shadowfell, trapped in their personal hell.

You may know one of them by name, even.

[hollow sonnet]

Probably not. I am a bit behind on lore

[white ravine]

A particular...Strahd Von Zarovich?

[hollow sonnet]

Ah yes the vampire

[white ravine]

Correct. Tyrant lord who killed his brother to try and take his wife, who threw herself from a balcony to save herself.

In recompense after his vile transformation, himself and his land was taken to the shadowfell where he's forever doomed to chase his quarry in an endless night across a dead land.

[hollow sonnet]

I imagine beings with strong enough magic can escape their personal hells with Plane Shift

[white ravine]

There's several others. Mad doctors living in twisted asylums, deformed pirates riding utop monolithic undead, hysterical druids protecting the most vile in nature.

[white ravine]

Nope. Physically no escape for them beyond the destruction of the shadowfell itself, mostly.

[hollow sonnet]

Even plane shift can’t break them out?

[white ravine]

Nope.

It is their eternal hell, and the powers that be will keep it that way.

Not to say they wont try and leave.

But the mists of barovia have never been kind to Strahd.

[hollow sonnet]

So then it stands to reason no sapient being would ever want to voluntarily visit the Shadowfell then?

Sounds like the perfect place to hide strong magical artifacts.

[white ravine]

No. Its EXTREMELY potent with necromantic magic.

You want to understand the secrets of undeath? The shadowfell is your perfect laboratory.

Only upgrade is the negative energy plane, but that will kill you in minutes without several enchantments or unless you are a VERY strong undead yourself ala liches or vampires.

[hollow sonnet]

Hmm I smell a Zombie Apocalypse a-brewing

Or a Vampire Ghoul Apocalypse

[white ravine]

For context, Acererak (yes, that Acererak) had a base IN the negative energy plane.

He kept a simulacrum there dedicated to doing nothing but violently torturing a kidnapped rival.

God I love that guy...

But yeah, you want an easy zombie apocalypse?

Go to a mass grave/fresh battlefield

Find a portal to the shadowfell

And then start raising undead.

Roughly translating across editions, necromancy spells would be boosted by several slot levels just by the latent energy.

However, healing magic and fire spells suffer.

[hollow sonnet]

Fire spells? Why them specifically? You would think it’s Radiant spells

[white ravine]

Its both. Anything that produces light or heat is dampened, since the shadowfell is defined by its cold and dark atmosphere.

[hollow sonnet]

Ah. So Celestials would really hate the Shadowfell

[white ravine]

Oh absolutely.

At least the bargain bin LG mount celestia types.

Go find an angel of like...Shar.

They'd probably drop an entire ball of undead like its castelvania on top of you before shooting you with enough necrotic to turn your soul to ash.

[hollow sonnet]

Hmm now to find an artifact that is strong enough that it needs to be hidden in the Shadowfell where few souls dare traverse

[white ravine]

Artifacts generally should be fine in the shadowfell

Neat idea I saw was having the hand of vecna act as a highly juiced up crawling claw if disembodied while in the shadowfell

Which is just...hoo boy.

"Oh its just another zombie ha-"
"It casts finger of death."
...
"W H A T ?"

[indigo ginkgo]

In Forgotten Realms - can someone tell me if Dalereckoning is as sinister as it sounds? I just read about it that it was basically some sort of establishment of Dale. But it's also called Freeman's Reckoning. Did the humans in Dale start an uprising or something?

The name sounds pretty benighted.

[indigo yoke]

Dalereckoning (DR) is a year numbering system in Forgotten Realms campaign setting. Dalereckoning uses the Calendar of Harptos to define the years. It is taken from the Year of Sunrise, when the Standing Stone was raised by the elves of Cormanthor and the human Dalesfolk.

Not sure if that's what you were looking for

[indigo yoke]

Where did you read about it?

[indigo ginkgo]

Forgotten Realms wiki about calendars & the way years are counted.

[indigo yoke]

In some texts, primarily those which do not have direct ties to Dales history, Dalereckoning is called Freeman's Reckoning (FR). The calendar is widely used in Faerûn but has not spread beyond its shores.

[indigo ginkgo]

Why is it called a reckoning? Did something happen?

[indigo yoke]

What I can find is that the humans of Dale and the elves of Cormanthyr made peace and marked the erection of a stone obelisk as the start of the calender

"Made peace"

[spark haven]

reckoning also simply means "understanding of", "thinking about", "working with"

[indigo yoke]

It's actually a symbol of unity

[indigo ginkgo]

Ah.

[indigo yoke]

Not necessarily over a conflict, I'm looking into it more

[spark haven]

It doesn't strictly require...punishment

[indigo yoke]

The smattering of human settlers that huddled in small villages at the edges of Cormanthor and Cormanthyrian led by Coronal Eltargrim Irithyl came to an agreement known as the Dales Compact. The conditions of this pact gave the future-Dalesfolk non-forested, and non-elven claimed areas of land on which to settle and ceased any and all logging efforts deeper into the forest. Furthermore, the Standing Stone was erected as a monument to this new alliance between elf and man.[2] This turning point in both civilizations also marked the beginning of the Dale Reckoning calendar for centuries to come.[32]

It was a non-aggression pact basically

[indigo ginkgo]

alright then.

[mellow ferry]

Elves: 'So, you've been living in elven territory for two centuries now. We haven't bothered you, and you've not bothered us. However, you're starting to breed and expand more than we're comfortable with, so we're going to need assurances that you won't cut down too many of our trees or try to kill us. Cuz, ya know, if you do, we'll retaliate.'

Early dalesfolk: 'Sounds good. We don't have any plans to kill any elves, and as long as we can cut down some trees, we're happy not overexploiting what's available.'

Elves: 'Cool. Let's make it official. Mark the occasion with a ceremony and a bit of magic.'

Early dalesfolk: 'OK. Hey, you know what might be a fun idea? Marking this year as the beginning of a new age of peace and cooperation. A "year 1" if you will.'

Elves: 'Uh...sure. We don't care, you do what you like, we'll continue marking the years our own way. Just don't get any funny ideas, and maybe when your great, great, great, great, great, great, great grandkids are all grown up, we'll let you trade with us.'

[left spindle]

does anyone else imagine the Dalesfolk as a bunch of copies of Dale Gribble from King of the Hill wearing tunics

because it would totally make sense that they would come up with their own calendar and reject the old one for being created by McDonald's or something

[graceful jolt]

In the Forgotten Realms, is it possible for a creature to still be a cleric and sell their soul to another entity?
Case in point, a cleric of Helm, Lawful Neutral god vigilance and protection, selling their soul to Levistus to bring an ally back from the dead after failing to protect them.
How would the deity react to it, given what his follower is doing?

[spark haven]

There's a few angles to it. For one, few if any deities are omniscient, omnipotent, or omnipresent so it IS possible to keep a secret from a god

After that, one can consider that not all deities necessarily shuffle one's soul to an afterlife-plane. Some are purely concerned with what you accomplish in the Material, some are only concerned with being worshipped at all, etc etc

And for those that do, how many of them are a hard requirement? Isn't ascension to Valhalla a reward for your deeds? Couldn't someone invited to Valhalla, in theory, decline because of prior obligations?

[left spindle]

There's an equivalent to this in Descent Into Avernus, a priest of Lathander who gives his soul to Zariel. There's not really anything Lathander can do about it, especially with the priest in hell. But I can imagine a more pragmatic deity might have noticed and had the priest sequestered or even killed to prevent their soul getting into Zariel's hands

[indigo yoke]

Gods mostly care about retaining followers and the upholding on the tenants of their portfolio. If a cleric of Helm sells their soul to Levistus but still acts within the expectations of Helm I'm sure their would be plenty of leeway

[eager bay]

What is needed for a given acolyte of a deity to become a cleric per se?

as in, gain access to divine magic

Specifically thinking in Greyhawk

[modest badger]

Depends on the deity honestly. And edition.

[burnt iron]

Every deity I think has their own rituals. For example in the Forgotten Realms the cleric of Tyr Tarl Desanea had to go through 'the test of the sword' where he's given a sword and told to fight a teacher but the true test is to know when to throw the sword away

and that was his final test to become a cleric

[mellow ferry]

In the Realms, everyone is polytheistic. They pray to all of the gods whenever they're about to do something that could benefit from a bit of divine help, or feel thankful for something that could conceivably have been a blessing from a god. Priests and clerics concentrate their worship on one specific deity over and above all others. They are far more fervent in their faith and devotion to their patron god; they proselytize to recruit more worshipers, and in return, they're given divine magic so as to perform miracles in their god's name, improve the state of their god's church, and further their god's goals in the mortal realm.

A priest selling their soul to another entity, so long as that entity is not diametrically opposed to the priest's god, doesn't automatically earn the ire of the god. It just means that the entity gets the priest's soul instead of that soul going to the afterlife that they would have otherwise gone to.

Helm is the god of guards and protectors. Levistus is a corrupting influence who typically has his servants pretend to believe in one ideal, while actually serving another. That kind of duplicity would make the priest a very suspect guardian, as their motivations and reliability would be questionable, which would anger Helm and potentially result in proscription.

In Greyhawk, things were (originally at least) more Moorcockian. Clerics worshipped the gods pantheistically along alignment lines.

You worshipped either the gods of law, the gods of chaos, the gods of good, or the gods of evil. You still had one patron deity, but you prayed to all of the gods who shared your chosen divine alignment. You got access to the spheres of the gods you were on good terms with, but if you pissed off one of the aligned gods you worshipped, you'd lose access to the spheres provided by that individual god. As long as you didn't piss off your patron though, you were still good to go.

I'm not well-versed enough in this particular line of Greyhawk lore to say specifically how one earned those spells in the first place, but as Paladin states, there was probably a ritual of faith that one had to complete/pass to earn the attention of your patron.

[shy rover]

I need help with information on lolth. I have a stat block for her I’m wanting to use in my campaign however I can’t find any information on her size? I have one that says she is gargantuan and another that says she is huge. There’s no size listed I can find.

[hazy apex]

why is ilmater lawful good when every diety of love is neutral or chaotic good

[iron saffron]

He's about self sacrifice, compassion, and the greater good, hence, lawful good.

[hazy apex]

none of that sounds lawful

[burnt iron]

he's also the third god in the lawful good triad, serving as part of a sort of mini-pantheon with Torm and Tyr, both lawful good. He urges martyrdom rather than fighting against oppression which is definitely more lawful in scope

[iron saffron]

How so? Lawful is that you put others (your community/nation) above yourself.

[mellow ferry]

Gods can be whatever size or shape that they want. Pick one, and if it gives her more of an advantage to change her size, have her do that.

Her avatar tends to be medium though.

[hazy apex]

others above yourself is good. doing so via order and structure is lawful.

[iron saffron]

Lawful Evil gangster would put his gang over himself.

[hazy apex]

.. devils are lawful evil. do you see them putting other devils above themselves? no, they kill each other to rise in the ranks.

[iron saffron]

I'm East Asian — culturally East Asians put the community over yourself. You think of the group over the individual Hence, lawfulness.

[mellow ferry]

But they obey the devils of higher rank than them.

To the letter, if not the spirit of their instructions anyway.

[iron saffron]

They're still selfish but they will listen to their overlords. They have strict armies and discipline. This is why they manage to succeed in stopping the hordes of demons on Avernus because of their discipline — they think of the "greater good" of devil kind in stopping the demonic invasion.

[hazy apex]

see listening and following strict discipline is lawful.

i don't see that with ilmater

i see ilmater as neutral good

[iron saffron]

Again, look at the gangster analogy — gangsters are evil and selfish in that they will kill others (innocents and other gangsters) but they have loyalty to their gangs above all. A honour among thieves.

[burnt iron]

not necessarily. Lawful is also discipline, it's habit, it's having a strict code and following it. It's devotion to tradition, to institutions, and yes to community but it doesn't have to be all of these things at once

[iron saffron]

Again lawfulness is the group over the individual. Chaotic is the individual over the group.

[mellow ferry]

Ilmater will forgive somebody, even if it's not the right thing to do.

[burnt iron]

but it isn't just that. That's an oversimplification of what lawfulness is.

[eager bay]

And then Mystara's got no deities in the traditional sense

[iron saffron]

That's true but I was trying to sum it up in the simplest of terms in a sentence.

[eager bay]

rather the Immortals, who were mortal beings who transcended their humanity so to speak

however that works

[iron saffron]

Welcome to 49 years of D&D alignment arguments...

[burnt iron]

about 30 years for me :p

[left spindle]

Tradition, community, and institutions are are all tools to empower the group over the individual so I think it works out

[iron saffron]

I was referring to the lifetime of D&D, not your experience in D&D. 😛 (about 42 years for me)

[left spindle]

I never liked the "lawful means having a strict code" thing because I don't think lawful characters are more or less likely to have a strict code than chaotic ones

[burnt iron]

ooh, sorry :p my bad

[burnt iron]

my feeling is that it's not just having a strict code, it's the 'and keeping it' bit. A chaotic character is much more likely to have a code and then be willing to bend or break the rules they set for themselves because circumstances dictate.

Because the circumstances trump their code.

The lawful character whose code dictates obedience to a higher authority will find a way to work within the system when they feel that higher authority has gone wrong, whereas the chaotic character will disobey and then reconcile their behavior later because the circumstances dictate that their code is, in this case, wrong

[left spindle]

If you're an anarchist revolutionary trying to overturn all social structure, it's likely you have a strong set of principles and have thought out your ethics very closely.

Likewise, it's entirely possible for a lawful character to essentially outsource their ethics to what the public law is without having an particular stance of their own.

Raw milk is illegal? And good that it be! It's a health hazard! What's that? The Duke has permitted its sale and recommends two glasses a day? Well, it's good for the youth to build strong frames

[burnt iron]

Except that a lawful character isn't about obeying the law. A lawful character may just as well protest the changing of tradition by the Duke because clearly all evidence and rationality says that the duke is wrong.

[hazy apex]

so what i'm understanding is for some reason it's a lawful good action to take a bullet for someone you don't know

rather than just a good action

[burnt iron]

It can be both.

Ilmater is, in this case, lawful good not just because he sacrifices himself for others but because he teaches more of a submissive passive-resistance to authority. Martyrdom as a symbol and as a way of protecting others, not simply as 'it was the right thing to do at the time'

[hazy apex]

i'm just confused because i'm writing someone who is an incarnation of love as a primordial force who became that after dying to protect a child vampire (who did nothing wrong and just wanted people to not be scared of her) from vampire hunters

but every love deity is cg or ng but ilmater is lg

[burnt iron]

Love isn't chaotic though

[zenith dust]

disagree

[hazy apex]

sune is chaotic good. aphrodite is chaotic good.

[burnt iron]

And Ilmater isn't a deity of love, he's a deity of sacrifice

[spark haven]

Why do they all have to be the same alignment ?????

[hazy apex]

love is sacrifice

[iron saffron]

Ilmater's teaching of love is not towards a single individual but for others as a whole, for their well being.

[spark haven]

why can't they represent different aspects of the experience

[burnt iron]

love is more than just sacrifice however.

[hazy apex]

because i need an alignment that covers love as a whole

[spark haven]

Love is bigger than just "feel good"

[left spindle]

I've never been a fan of the "lawful vs chaotic means having a consistent personal ethos versus an inconsistent one" because it overshadows what that ethos is. It's like if good versus evil were based on whether you think what you're doing is right. At that point the system sort of breaks down because people with no consistent motivations are about as common as people who think what they're doing is wrong and they should be stopped.

[spark haven]

There's the internal work you have to do, the external relationships you have to build

And different types of love, familial, tribal, romantic, etc etc

[left spindle]

I think love is too big and unique a concept to be squeezed down into "which cosmic teams of ethics and morality are you on"

[spark haven]

Love IS sacrifice, but it's also selfishness, being strong enough to assert your boundaries

[burnt iron]

totally fair. Honestly I don't even LIKE alignment as a system anymore. I don't really even use it in my games

Except to help new players with roleplaying.

[zenith dust]

Love is what you want it to be. Love is heaven to the lonely

[left spindle]

Yeah. My hot take is that it's only useful if you really want to have a mechanic where the Gods pick teams due to objective moral and ethical forces that exist, magically, and are quantifiable by the GM. Otherwise it's just a mess.

[burnt iron]

in older editions it was important for a lot of things, but now that it really has no effect on the game mechanics I mostly just ignore it. For some people it's a helpful roleplay tool, but I would rather tell people to just play their character

[left spindle]

I've seen a couple OSR games do a version of alignment that's kind of a neo-Moorcock way that I'm into

In those, Lawful characters are those who are inherently aligned with the gods, whose domain is maintaining the powers of fate and tradition. Even trickster gods exist to fill a role and maintain the cycle of destiny. The vast majority of people are neutral and have no ties, but clerics do, and so can certain species like dwarves

Versus chaotic, which is about extradimensional entities that want to separate us from fate and warp things and break down structures. And Wizards are chaotic, and maybe elves

It has nothing to do with your ethos, your morals, or even your choices. It's a cosmic effect that takes hold when you use magic.

[eager bay]

Which do you like more, Mystara or FR?

Greyhawk is more S&S; the other two more high fantasy proper

[left spindle]

tbh I don't know anything about Mystara

also if you need one alignment for love

love is a battlefield, war is evil, battle is chaotic. Love is chaotic evil

[burnt iron]

lol

[white ravine]

FR, 100%

[eager bay]

Mystara seems to have a total old-school anime and jRPG aesthetic to it

[left spindle]

I think that's because a lot of old school anime and JRPGs were strongly influenced by 1e D&D

And AD&D

[eager bay]

Greyhawk is more sword-and-sorcery, like Conan, Elric, and Grey Mouser

[shy rover]

I know the avatar is usually medium but in her arachnid form is what I’m aiming for. Most of the other demon lords are huge so I might stick with that

[eager bay]

yeye, Advanced and BECMI

[white ravine]

Medium for Lolth as a default seems odd if nothing else

Given well...what Lolth is.

[eager bay]

I do earnestly think the way they had magic in the early days fit Greyhawk better than FR

mainly because Greyhawk be lower-magic anyway. Is Mystara naturally mid or high?

I know FR’s high-magic for sure

[white ravine]

I wouldnt call FR high magic

High magic would be more eberron and ravnica, where everyone and their mother has a hold of it

[eager bay]

Aah kk

[iron saffron]

Outside of the Thayan, Netherese or Halruaan nations, most of Toril magic wouldn't be so common that it's trivial.

[white ravine]

Yeah, there are higher magic zones like netherese cities

[eager bay]

And IIRC the Netherese are mostly long-gone now

[white ravine]

Where everything from the ground youd walk on and the books youd read would be charged full of power

Mostly, if memory serves...three cities survived?

[eager bay]

never heard of Ravnica ngl

[iron saffron]

Halruaa are the descendants of the Netherese. The Netherese are back (I think they were trapped in some other dimension (from the top of my head))

[eager bay]

but Eberron for sure

[white ravine]

MTG setting

My favorite before I got into FR

[eager bay]

Aah ok

Never knew WotC did a collab with MtG

or at least never made the connection

[white ravine]

...WOTC owns MTG

[iron saffron]

WotC was all about MtG until they bought out D&D from TSR

[eager bay]

Oh

Oh okay

Honestly never knew that either

[iron saffron]

The MtG/D&D crossover is "corporate synergy"

[eager bay]

But yeah, I like when magic be rare, but not so rare or corrupting it not be worth pursuing

Something like 5% of the population have magic, primarily it be wizards, and like 10% of them be Lv7+

that’d be for standard, right?

[unkempt merlin]

thats not what high magic is. Eberron is low magic. As the most commonly accessible with magic is... low level. FR is high magic, as the most common magic in the scheme of the world is... high.

Eberron is wide low, Ravnica is wide high, FR is narrow high

[zenith dust]

Eberron is wide yeah

except in sharn where it's literally vertical ;D

[covert island]

[eager bay]

wdym

[unkempt merlin]

I am 99% sure I explained this to you in #dm-discussion recently

[eager bay]

You did IIRC

Basically, high vs. low be what the average max level most spellcasters can do be

while narrow vs. wide be how widespread

[unkempt merlin]

here is the message link for ya #dm-discussion message

[left spindle]

honestly Eberron feels like the low vs high magic thing breaks down for it

wide magic feels like the best descriptor

I can see how it'd be called low relative to Faerun because of there being no gods directly interfering, few high powered wizards roaming around

but at the same time, you have things like a nation run by liches, you have trains and airships powered by bound elementals, the defining moment of the setting's political climate is a magical nuke that went off and created a wasteland

I can't call it low magic with all this stuff being so crucial

[unkempt merlin]

the main focus of the setting, Khorvaire, is low wide most certainly

[eager bay]

Would low vs. high magic affect the highest spell level possible?

[unkempt merlin]

not necessarily

[white ravine]

I'd say so

While a low magic setting could have someone that could freeze people solid be terrifying, a high magic setting needs a SIGNIFICANTLY higher bar to justify 'highest spell level' status

Cone of Cold vs Karsus' Avatar for example

[eager bay]

Yeah, and Greyhawk definitely caters to low-magic

[white ravine]

One, in a world where magic is already sparse, is scary.

The other, in a world where magic is prevalent, is also scary.

However, you'd be more likely to see people throwing cones of cold around in a high magic setting where a low magic setting resident would scream in terror.

[left spindle]

I just can't call any setting where "a hovering train powered by a lightning elemental is robbed by wandslinging golem bandits" is a normal news item "low magic"

Can't do it

[eager bay]

For my world was thinking about 5% of the population be properly trained with magic, mainly arcade, and about 10% of them be Lv7+ (so Lv4 spells and higher)

would that be narrow mid?

[white ravine]

That's medium, yeah

Low magic is like ehhh...I kind of want to say in an uneducated view, LOTR.

[eager bay]

or ASOIAF

[white ravine]

yup, those are letters

[eager bay]

or anything S&S like Conan, Elric, and Grey Mouser

[eager bay]

*A Song of Ice and Fire

[white ravine]

Ah.

Ehhh...not sure on that one. Been a while.

[eager bay]

but this is where Greyhawk be fitting in

[unkempt merlin]

the thing with those is its all based on the low level spells

[left spindle]

LOTR is a much better example, "magic" as in spells is something reserved for superhuman beings and even then they mostly do things like lighting pipes and dying

[unkempt merlin]

I hate to inform you that is exactly the opposite.

LOTR is quintessential high magic fantasy.

The most common type of magic is powerful magic.

[white ravine]

That's fair, I suppose.

[eager bay]

Most people define "low" and "high" magic the way you define narrow and wide

magic in Tolkien is definitely softer though

[unkempt merlin]

Hard vs Soft magic systems are another thing entirely lol

[left spindle]

"summom a lightning elemental and bind it to power a hovertrain" is a low level spell?

even in 3.5 you had to be caster level 9th to attempt it

[eager bay]

@unkempt merlin This mid-magic/standard, ye?

[unkempt merlin]

The trains themselves are based on the concepts of spells like Levitate.

Elemental Binding is just Eberron's version of "thing that makes magic gooder" (among other things like Dragonshards)

Elemental Binding allows bypassing of the normal capabilities of most people. Its also notably hard to do and stuff like the lightning rails and airships need "exceptionally magical people" (aka dragonmarked heirs) to make use of them

[eager bay]

Low vs. high magic be less about power and more about rarity

[unkempt merlin]

Eberron, like most settings, has things to "amp up" the magic in it. But the magic that is most common in the setting is low.

[unkempt merlin]

indeed

well.

[eager bay]

So LotR by definition be low-magic

[unkempt merlin]

Rarity in terms of "what the most common form of magic is"

Wide vs Narrow is "how rare magic in general is"

[eager bay]

Aah kk

[eager bay]

would likely depend on character level tier lel

[unkempt merlin]

thats why I clarified with this bit

[left spindle]

Elemental Binding is a specific process laid out in the original handbook as an enhanced version of planar binding empowered by a dragonshard. Planar binding is a 5th level spell in 5e and 6th level in 3.5. If your country's infrastructure is based around modes of transport that can only be made with 6th level spells, surely that is not low magic anymore. You have a whole economy riding on the back of superpowerful mages

[unkempt merlin]

hardly. The generality of the setting is frankly unconnected to character stuff (or frankly even a specific system).
In Eberron (and frankly dnd in general) the whole point is that PCs are exceptional. They are capable of doing things in ways that the majority of people aren't. In Eberron, thats them being able to cast magic so quickly (via slots and stuff), where most people are limited to cantrips and longer ritualized versions of spells (with and without the assistance of magic items).

In the FR, its being able to use magic... at all

[unkempt merlin]

Its important to note that Elemental Binding in general, like I mentioned, is considered hard to do (and harder to do effectively). The "most powerful" stuff the majority of people have even heard of caps out at that 5/6 range. Things higher than that are considered myth or legend. Its also notably not individuals (generally) who perform elemental binding (and similarly powerful rituals).

The area of focus of the setting (Khorvaire) does have powerful magic. But in the overall scheme its still "low" compared to whats usually possible, and also notably quite rare, with specific use cases and users (again I mention that elementally powered stuff requires dragonmarked heirs for the most part).

Aerenal is a higher magic area of the setting. While Khorvaire is low with magic of 1-3 being what most people interact with, Aerenal has that bumped up to 4/5, with stuff of 7-9 being notably less "mythological" compared to elsewhere.

[left spindle]

And then you have Argonessen

[unkempt merlin]

indeed!

I could've been more clear initially when calling Eberron a low magic setting, but yea, its got higher magic areas

Its like how the FR is High Narrow, but that Narrow becomes quite Wide in other parts of the setting.

[still blaze]

Does anyone have any fiend patron suggestions for a multiclass druid/warlock?

[white ravine]

Do you want demon, devil, or yugoloth?

I can give answers for all three

[unkempt merlin]

What setting?

[still blaze]

I'm thinking a demon or devil

And if it plays into anything, my character does not know she is a warlock at the moment

[white ravine]

Devils are a lot more personally oriented. What's something your character wants?

Demons however, they're more interested in corrupting you. They want to take you from your highest point and then rip everything away before you die.

[eager bay]

I’d go Druid and Archfey Warlock

[round brook]

Hey, I am building feats that I can attatch to player sheets so they get all the relevant information for their Forgotten Realms nationality to improve their understanding of the Realms. Now I’m looking for 3rd party 5ed books describing the nations of forgotten realms in detail, preferably with a few area specific subclasses or so to make them all feel special. Rashemen and The Great Dale are my favourites so far. Thay, Land of the Red Wizards was nice, but a little thin on gameplay content for my taste. Any suggestions from you guys?

[mellow ferry]

Eberron is a world where everyone and his dog has some access to magic - especially in the cities - but spellcasters higher than 10th level (and therefore spell effects higher than 5th level) are incredibly rare outside of specific, typically very insular, places.

The Forgotten Realms is a world where only certain people have a gift for magic, but those that do are always encouraged to pursue it, and should they, they have the potential to be obscenely powerful. Certain countries though have a far higher than average chance of it's people having the gift of magic because of their long history associated with magical power.

[mellow ferry]

I worked with a Forgotten Realms designer - Tom Costa - on a DM's Guild product called Forgotten Characters of the Realms. It's very crunchy, with heavy influences from 3rd edition D&D (which is what he mainly worked on while he was employed by WotC) but is also quite heavy on the lore. We're currently near completion of a follow-up book, but it's not got a release date yet.
Not exactly a regional guide like you're looking for, but it might be useful: https://www.dmsguild.com/product/207031/Forgotten-Characters-of-the-Realms

As for actual regional guides, there's Baldman Games' Moonshae guide which was approved by Doug Niles, the author of the Moonshae novels: https://www.dmsguild.com/product/248303/Moonshae-Isles-Regional-Guide

M.T. Black's very well done Calimshan guide: https://www.dmsguild.com/product/301438/Calimshan-Adventurers-Guide

And of course, Ed Greenwood's own guide to the Border Kingdoms: https://www.dmsguild.com/product/244431/The-Border-Kingdoms-A-Forgotten-Realms-Campaign-Supplement

[round brook]

I have the moonshae guide and tye border kingdoms one, borh are a bit thin on content, but do the trick when it comes to geography. Never seen Calimshan one before, great tip. Forgotten characters looks awesome. I’ve missed it before because the presentation looks a bit messy and I prefer ordering stuff as hardback. Will get it now that you opened my eyes to it. Are there some subclasses that can be tied to regions in it? Im hoping to tie nationality mechanically to the characters by restricting some 3P subclasses so not only race matters on the character sheet.

[mellow ferry]

There's two new classes and tonnes of new subclass options, several of which are tied to regions in the FR e.g. the Way of the Jordain monk subclass who are trained to be guards of Halruaa's ruling class of wizards, or the Shadow Walker rogue subclass who are members of the Shadowmasters of Telflamm.

The new book we're working on has more

[drifting pumice]

I wanna be a Skilletmaster of Teflon or whatever.

[round brook]

I really don’t get why WotC wont open up the editor to allow for integration of full 3rd party production and a 3rd party store within DnDbeyond instead of forcing all those customers to external sites that can provide no digital integration. I would have bought all of the above in a heartbeat in addition to already owning most of it as hardback.

[iron saffron]

Maybe they'll do that with One D&D now that D&D Beyond is owned by WotC.

Remember that they stopped doing the Dev Talk videos after the buyout.

[hazy fox]

So has anyone checked out Let's Read TSR?

It's a blog commentary on TSR novels.

[jaunty raft]

Do people talk about DL lore here?

[hazy fox]

Maybe.
But didn't know much except Tanis and Kenders' meme as "hated player race".

[white ravine]

You can yeah

[round brook]

In The Great Dale there is a background for members of the shadowmasters as well. Been looking for the subclass.

[round brook]

Looking at my list now of nations I want to do this for there are SO much untapped stuff in FR. So many nations mentioned just as a parenthesis that could be brought to life. Cant wait for your second release! 🙂

[iron saffron]

Nice! I'm currently working on a side quest adventure that takes place in Halruaa. Added a magehound and looking in the Jordain order.

[gilded pollen]

Also,does anyone else just look at Reddit so many times when writing just for menus and stuff

[white ravine]

Sometimes, important to look at a lot of sources for inspiration

[mystic merlin]

How does that work? They are able to perform magic, how do they think they do it?

[stone burrow]

Anyone here play Paladins? The world lore makes it seem like the ideal setting for a dnd campaign

[iron saffron]

Which world lore?

[burnt iron]

Which setting? Sorry, a bit confused. You mean the class Paladin?

[tidal shore]

No there’s a game called Paladins

[burnt iron]

Oh, never heard of it

[iron saffron]

Okay... we'll that's #non-dnd-topics territory then.

It has nothing to do with D&D lore.

[serene crater]

I think they mean to incorporate the lore into a dnd campaign

[iron saffron]

That's fine but it doesn't fall under the purview of this channel. It would go to #homebrew or #dm-discussion then.

[magic jackal]

Can't speak for that character, but I once had a Warlock who didn't know they were a Warlock. They were at the end of their proverbial rope, thought they were hallucinating when they heard a voice in their head ask them if they wanted a way out of their current predicament. They of course agreed, woke up in a swamp, their head hurting and full of knowledge of weaponry and martial prowess, and found that when they reached for their innate magic (they were an Elf, they had some natural innate magic) they were able to do more with it.

A major part of their character journey was figuring out just what in the nine hells happened to them that fateful day, and what the consequences of it were, which was interspersed with them going on an enforced negative arc of growing more and more devilish as they grew more and more powerful over the course of the campaign.

[magic jackal]

Different world, different rules for Fiends.

[serene crater]

ah

[magic jackal]

And the Campaign is over my dude.

[serene crater]

oh, my bad XD

I thought you were building a character

[oblique blade]

do we know if the events of bg3 will be canon to dnd?

[left spindle]

the concept of "canon" in D&D is very wobbly -- the writers of 5e books don't necessarily expect you to have read all the Drizzt books and likely haven't read them all either, so things get changed or left out all the time

[mellow ferry]

According to the last canon statement that WotC put out, novels, video games, comics, etc. are not canon. Neither is anything released before 5e came out.

Only official splats and adventures, released after July 2014 are canon to 5e settings.

So no, BG3 will not be considered canon by the designers unless they decide to write about it themselves.

Of course, what the designers consider canon, and what you consider canon are two totally different things.

[hot shadow]

there's about as much canon in dnd as there is war in Ba Sing Se

[white ravine]

Treat it like comic book canon. There's canon, which is usually the most relevant stuff, but then there's 'canon' which is everything that's been paved over or retreaded time and time again.

[wary parrot]

Who's the god of vengeance in forgotten realms?

[sonic perch]

Would anyone wanna write with me, I’m working on a novel

[sharp owl]

You want #non-dnd-topics

[mellow ferry]

Hoar the Doombringer. God of poetic justice, retribution, and revenge.

[long rivet]

How much should a house cost in Neverwinter circa 1370DR, post-Wailing Death? Somewhere in the Beggar's Nest, since I told one of the players in my game it's the cheapest option

I don't use 5e canon, I use older canon because I just played through Neverwinter Nights

[iron saffron]

Seriously...?

[mystic merlin]

I think edg reenwood would be able to answer you actually

[eager bay]

How long do you see dragons living for?

[serene crater]

it depends, they can live for quite some time, though greatwyrms usually are more than a century

fizbans I believe goes into detail about it

[eager bay]

I personally picture them like Fire Emblem's dragons, and probably not the base chromatic/metallic dichotomy

maybe like 5,000-7,000 years, or more maybe

[serene crater]

ah

I could be wrong though on my anaylsis

[eager bay]

wdyt

[serene crater]

its possible, though I guess it depends on which setting or lore you're trying to follow. Though I could see ancient and greatwyrms being like that

[eager bay]

I don't like the idea of certain races being all one alignment personally

Have it broken up between fire, water, wind, earth, and sky dragons maybe?

[spark haven]

From what I've seen they're kinda like Tolkien's elves: undying but not indestructible. A dragon that isn't starved or stabbed will continue to age and grow.

[eager bay]

Grow their whole life?

[spark haven]

To some extent. I believe the growth is much more extreme at younger stages

Just like anything else that grows and changes over time

Once you hit ancient greatwyrm, you're probably only growing a centimeter a century, but you're still growing

[eager bay]

Centimeter in length?

[spark haven]

That's what I've always understood as the "power" of dragons. They can afford to wait a hundred or a thousand years, sleeping or hiding, slowly growing stronger

[eager bay]

Like, how long from nose to tail do you think for in their prime or whatever

[spark haven]

i don't have theories written down in that much detail just laying around

it's just a broad mental framework

i'd adjust it based on the type of dragon, the circumstances of its life, etc etc

[eager bay]

Different than the dragon types in RAW?

[spark haven]

if those are present in the story i'm telling, sure

[eager bay]

Yeah, I see mine being more like Fire Emblem's

live for, what, five to seven millennia? More?

[unkempt merlin]

Dragons become Ancient at 1k years iirc

Well

1k years + a bunch of magical requirements. Cause dragon age categories aren't achieved via just age

[analog garnet]

Hello, I have a random question regarding some lore/location. Could the feywild be entered from faerun and exit in Krynn? I have a character idea and want to make sure something like that would not (completely) undermine their backstory.

[spark haven]

portals and other less savory and stable means of getting between places are everywhere, i don't see why not

[analog garnet]

Well then, that partly decimates the backstory of my character, but also adds to it as well. Thanks 🙂

[spark haven]

I mean, by that same token, there's no reason you can't invent an obstacle to travel. A portal deadzone caused by an ancient calamity, whatever you like

There's precedent for that sort of thing. Spellplagues, antimagic fields, mythals

[analog garnet]

Mind if I send you the backstory so you can see what I mean?

[iron saffron]

This is something you should talk to your DM about since they control the campaign setting.

[night hollow]

Just because an option exists, doesn’t mean it’s feasible to get to

The Feywild is all magicky. Even if there was a portal, it doesn’t mean it’d be easy to find. Maybe it only works on Friday the 13th’s or it walks up and moves away. OldMan said it well.

Maybe the portal is being guarded/kept secret. Who knows, who cares. Ask your DM

[analog garnet]

They did approve the backstory, but I don't think either of us thought 'bout the feywild when talking 'bout it.

[night hollow]

The Astral Sea is what I’d consider for multiverse traveling

The Feywild is too chaotic for reasonable navigation

Unless you have experience with the Fey, I’d only consider it if I was truly desperate

Don’t know if my characters would even think of trying it either

Is you character stranded in Faerun, from Krynn?

[analog garnet]

Ahh. Well the idea is that my character, was knocked though a portal on Krynn near the end of the War of the Lance. Weird unstable portal chaos happened, resulting in them landing in Faerun at level 1.

More specifically he landed in Faerun during the events of Descent into Avernus. So not only location stranded but possibly time stranded as well. Due to the nature of the Feywild it would be amusing to use that as a way for him to get home to where (and when) he came.

[night hollow]

That could be something p desperate

[iron saffron]

Again, talk to your DM. They may nix the entire idea altogether because they don't want to mix campaign settings (especially considering DL has their own set of DL-only Backgrounds).

[analog garnet]

Right, I had already worked with the DM a bit, and while he is a "Knight of Solamnia" He does not get the feat, instead he has the Knight Background, and no retainers. Which I am fine with.

Plus for added roleplay flavor, he has disadvantage on history checks. Because yes he knows Krynn history quite well, but when it comes to Faerun history, it's questionable lol

[iron saffron]

This is Ask Your DM territory rather than lore...

[analog garnet]

Alright. I'll work with them; I was just wondering if from a Lore perspective how it would work as I actually don't know much about the Faywild.

[eager bay]

Oh, so you mean that they can't die of old age, right?

[spark haven]

Exactly. They don't die, but they can be destroyed or deprived of what they need to continue living

e.g. air, food, "faith", etc

a headcanon which, to my understanding, was more or less reinforced by Fizban's, with dragons being represented as effectively avatars of the Material Plane itself

[eager bay]

What about if they were to assume a humanlike form. Relative to their equivalent age?

I guess I'm also trying to ask what age would be considered their "prime" so to speak

[iron saffron]

Great Wrym — unlike other creatures dragons get more powerful as they age.

[eager bay]

source?

[iron saffron]

All Monster Manuals.

[eager bay]

I see

Just trying to think how big my world's dragons be, at least in their prime or whatever

[iron saffron]

Again, they continue to grow until they reach Ancient/Great Wrym age.

[eager bay]

Aah, then I guess how big an adult dragon be. Different from MM?

[iron saffron]

Each editions' dragon sizes were different. I think they were the biggest in 3.5E

[hardy wave]

Well then you get dragons as old as Palarandusk that is so old it can't physically exist for long in the material plane

Palarandusk was old even before Netheril was founded iirc. Super powerful. But super fragile.

[unkempt merlin]

Yea, it just requires more than time though

[mystic merlin]

Eh. The backgrounds are just like every other aside from the feat.

[iron saffron]

Which is why some DMs won't allow it because it includes the starting feat.

The background specifically says only for the DL setting.

[mystic merlin]

You can literally make the same background, with name, description and choices in proficiency but without the feat using the PHB though.

[iron saffron]

...

This is outside the domain of this channel.

[mystic merlin]

It was as soon as the DM disallowing backgrounds came up 😄

Per the PHB rules you can build up any position that exists in the lore using the existing framework. Even being a knight of Takhisis, with dm permission 🙂

[iron saffron]

Again, I had suggested multiple times above "Ask Your DM."

[mystic merlin]

I saw that, my point is that you don’t need to ask your DM to engage with the default lore, and the default players handbook rules on backgrounds. The application is player facing and doesn’t require permission, unless it goes against the dungeon, Masters established setting for this game.

[iron saffron]

Anyway, we're far from the Lore aspect of this channel.

[mystic merlin]

No, I’m expressly discussing how to execute the game lore via the books. They are connected, otherwise, I would not have responded.

As they noted, using the existing knight background for knight of Solamnia works a treat 🙂

I enjoy seeing people do that because of the intended expression

[serene crater]

quick question, though would it make sense for a netherese wizard to have connections to the red wizards of thay (and I mean more in historical such as attire or in beliefs), just doing some research and looking around to build a bbeg

[white ravine]

There are some very ancient netherese liches that still exist, very well could have a bargain set in with the thay wizards or maybe had a hand putting their empire together.

[serene crater]

I had the idea to have a netherese lich inspired from the Harbinger from Halo infinite, in which a red wizard aligned with my group of bbeg's saw her as a useful ally. (Unsure if she could've been a precursor to the red wizards or just known by them, hence I aksed) They offered to help anihilate the modrons as long as they could repurpose a netherese city to be used as a portal to the nine hells.

[white ravine]

Annihilating the modrons is a lot easier said than done

[serene crater]

she wanted revenge on them (still trying to think of a reason for why they attacked her, though so far I'm thinking it was because she tried to breach planes)

though nobody said she was going to be successful in her revenge XD, just she would attempt it with the bbeg's army of mercenaries and devils

[iron saffron]

Orcus couldn't destroy the modrons, just disrupt their scheduled marches.

[white ravine]

Frankly, Orcus didn't try destroying them

...Dont think anyone has, even. How would you start?

[iron saffron]

Remember, their leader Primus is essentially a god.

Well, Orcus tried by murdering Primus and usurped him.

[white ravine]

Not his end goal, though. He left as soon as he got what he wanted

[analog oxide]

biggest in 2e with possible exception the epic dragons in 3.xe

and not including dragon gods with powers to change shape size. the largest natural dragons were in 2e spelljammer that i know of

orcus did murder him. IIRC, whie powerful his 2e stats didnt have him as an actual god.

primus did 20d8 per attack 🙂

[analog oxide]

maybe destroy the plane itself externally. (ie. not from within mechanus) ? not sure how. dont think there are any items in D&D lore that can do that directly, but it could work i guess ? if u r on mechanus, the Mediators would stop you...

[white ravine]

That'd involve a pretty much universally-dooming flustercluck

[analog oxide]

yeah. like i have planes collapsing in my campaign but thats meant to be like a comics level crossover threat level event campaign. i cant imagine most DMs want to get into stuff to that extent without just some basic plot methods to resolve it

[mystic merlin]

What’s a True Ghoul?

Apparently that’s a big thing in early Greyhawk, way back in the days of magazines. True Ghouls who came through a portal to the negative material

[analog oxide]

all i can find is: "True ghouls" were featured in Wolfgang Baur's Dungeon adventure "Kingdom of the Ghouls," and the template was derived from Monte Cook's "Ghoul and Ghast Template."

"The Ecology of the Ghoul" (Dragon 252) and "The Kingdom of the Ghouls" (Dungeon 70).

[mystic merlin]

Rassun frassun

Guess it’s to the Dungeon Mag bins to dig!

[woven bronze]

Anybody know what the deep gnomes are supposed to be? The most recent player stats say very little other than that they live underground

[iron saffron]

Deep gnomes, aka svirfneblin, are a sub-race of gnomes who live in the Underdark.
https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Deep_gnome

[hazy fox]

Either Gnomes are too optimistic that underdark's gloomy nature just barely made a dent (at least notch it down to True Neutral), or they are immune to it like Flumph.

[mellow ferry]

Stats for them as player characters for 5e originally appeared in the Elemental Evil Player's Companion. They got reprinted in Monsters of the Multiverse.

[dapper shale]

Is it possible to connnect Kyber to Forgotten Realms? I was thinking something along the lines of a "shared" Underdark.

[mystic merlin]

Per the existing set ups, “no”, in that eberron is established as not being part of the same sort of multiverse expectations.

That said, the spell Dream of the Blue Veil can expressly do that, which means an area of thin boundaries that acts like a natural dream of the blue veil is technically on the table and perfectly cromulent as a DM decision!

[dapper shale]

I 100% forgot about that spell! Amazing idea! What I'm having difficulty right now is to establish "lorewise" how that multiverse expectation could be "folded".

[unkempt merlin]

Kyber is lorewise a separate plane (occasionally multiple, depending on who you ask) than the Material Plane of Eberron

The underdark in the FR is a part of the material plane.

[mystic merlin]

🤔

The underdark is not boiling hot, even though by rights it should be at least uncomfortable.

I bet there’s a whole expansive ecology relating to a combination of phaerzress and I want to say yellow mold?, that causes a slow siphoning of core heat into the vast mold patches which are used to feed other energy sources such as stench kows, some insects, and a variety of other fungus.

[dapper shale]

The second problem that comes with my question is how to handle the players. Right now the party is at the Forgotten Realms (near Neverwinter). I have two clerics, two paladins and one warlock in the party. See the problem?

I'm doing a post-Spellplague story btw.

[mystic merlin]

I do not?

Is it the “No gods in ebberon” thing? They should be able to stumble and then realize they can adapt their skill to the new world by channeling through faith.

I would suggest a series of skill tests with low DC using arcana, and bonuses or guaranteed successes for role playing exploring this gap in their power and meditating on their faith and relationship to their god.

The Paladin should be fine. Oaths are oaths and do not derive power from a god, and this should be remarked on as a clue for the clerics to realize their faith assists them.

In ton olden days a cleric got 1-3rd level spells through their own skill and devotion, with 4-5th being bestowed upon them by servitors such as angels, and only 6+ level spells being granted by their god

[dapper shale]

Yes it was.

[dapper shale]

I'm stealing this!!!

[dapper shale]

That is a very good point tbh

[eager bay]

@dapper shale Wait, Eberron has no gods?

[dapper shale]

I think the problem is the definition of Gods.

[iron saffron]

The Dark Sun setting has no gods.

[eager bay]

Yeah. I don't care for creationist BS. Maybe life naturally evolved over billions of years but then these "gods" be a race of primordial spacefarers who arrived on the world way back when and helped influence evolution.

kinda like the monoliths from 2001: A Space Odyssey

[eager bay]

didn't know that

[dapper shale]

Dark Sun is amazing. However in my experience it was always hard to keep the story going after 10 sessions.

[iron saffron]

I never played it. I've bought some of the books but by the time it was out my friends had moved on from D&D to typical high school stuff (I just bought Ravenloft, Spelljammer, Planescape, and Dark Sun books because I found them interesting despite not playing).

[analog oxide]

i ran darksun for years....

still my fav setting (although most of my friends like me to run planescape based stuff due to the freedom)

[dapper shale]

Please share with me the skills to keep the story going because lorewise I was pretty bad at it.

[mystic merlin]

Eberron has more realistic religion. There are gods but they aren’t big wizards that walk around making demands and answering telephone calls from up and coming besties.

[dapper shale]

Or manifesting as avatars to boss around.

[mystic merlin]

But Eberron has no gods in the sense that you cannot go find and kill the silver Flame in combat, etc.

[eager bay]

Yeah, but can still call upon their power

[analog oxide]

sounds like a challenge for my group 😛

[mystic merlin]

Ebberon does what 5e kinda leans toward; religion is important, actual entity up top is not.

[dapper shale]

I think the difference is ontological and not on the terms of epistemology.

[dapper shale]

Imagine if they manage to do that.

[mystic merlin]

Still call upon power attributed to them, sure.

But a Paladin already gains their magic through their oath, so that’s not weird.

[eager bay]

but what about clerics

[dapper shale]

In my understanding is more about the faith itself.

[mystic merlin]

But yeah ruining the multiverse happens all the time.

I managed to accidentally create an artifact of transcendent, corrupting evil… and gave it to the goddess of light and healing who headed that world’s pantheon

After long enough the sun itself is now the source of true evil!

[dapper shale]

Stares at Strahd Do the Strahd accent True Evil you said???

[unkempt merlin]

The gods of Eberron (the Sovereigns) are, both in and out of setting, not proved to definitively exist.

[dapper shale]

Like I said its a problem in the ontology to make them compatible.

[unkempt merlin]

There are other powers, such as the silver flame and the overlords, that do definitively exist, but they are also definitively not gods

[mystic merlin]

Strahd is a petty evil imo.
That world only exists in a timeline fracture radiating from the Valistar’s poor decisions now though, and is homebrew besides. So no more on that here, must be a legacy talk 😛

[analog oxide]

nothing specail. same as any game. u need players that want to play and all i do, as i need more content, ive alraedy thoguth ahead of options for where the players can go drepending on what they do next

beyond that. i just go with the flow and let players take the lead overall

[dapper shale]

I agree but I love the aesthetics of Barovia.

[dapper shale]

My players want to play but they have the tendency to ask a LOT of questions.

Hence why I'm asking here in the pool of knowledge so I can look smart 😛

[analog oxide]

my players will ask me to redo stuff in the game that doesnt make sense in teh game itself. so asking a lot of questions is fine 😄 😄

[mystic merlin]

I do too but I feel uncomfortable trying to play a different sort of medieval I haven’t been able to research. Eastern Europe stuffs eludes me and is made worse by having a player group that’s mostly descended from that region. I worry about being crass

[dapper shale]

I try not to do that because...I know that I have the tendency to go beyond the common sense. By the time I stop it became one big fanfic and the books are just for the illustrations.

[dapper shale]

Same but I try my best. I never did a Barovia story beyond the original. But I know that there is like a major problem with the concept/category of Vistani.

[mystic merlin]

Even besides that.

Like, the native Traladari culture of the area now known as Karameikos is based off of Romanian and similar cultures (I don’t even know what the category woudl be called 😕 ), and I just… gloss over and around that because it’s not something I even know enough about to start educating myself.

Need to find an expert I think, or make it up and avoid the similarities.

[analog oxide]

my player want stuff to flow and make sense to tehm. once i stopped doing an attack since i thought it was too much. they said why did the giant stop. they said. no lets redo those rounds. if they die, they die hehe. giant picked up someone but instead of doing what they expected , i just tossed the player aside. . they said that made no sense. so should redo it properly

[analog oxide]

when u say they ask too many questions and this somehow means the campaign cant run that long. what do u mean?

[mystic merlin]

I like giants yeeting people into other people

But I’m a monster. feytouched advanced troglodyte with Witch template, to be more precise

[analog oxide]

ya i just threw him to the side to do some damage. but last time a giant like this grabbed them. they did a lot more. so when i re did it. the giant used the player as a club and started beating the rest of them with him.

so target takes damage and the player in his hand takes damage as well on each hit

then he started to slam him on the ground like he was trying to break a can or something against rocks. and then tossed him 🙂

[mystic merlin]

At low levels when that’s super scary I like to use arbitrary death saves for that.

“I didn’t ask you how many hit points you had, I asked you to make four death saving throws” is unfair if that’s not the kind of game running, but it definitely gets the correct vibe across when you’ve been bludgeoned with an entire horse drawn wagon

[analog oxide]

we do stuff like sustained/repetitive saves. so like years ago when a dragon grabbed a player and began pulling on the legs and torso. 3 failed saves and the character is torn apart regardless of hp. (assumng the craetures str is crazy high enough that ripping someone in half is reasonable). but players can try to interupt it to save them.

so there's always a chance to save someone. but my monsters are mean to players 😄

[mystic merlin]

I understand why they got rid of stuff like that, but I do miss them in small or appropriate doses

[analog oxide]

i dont think stuff like that was ever a rule. was it?

[eager bay]

What are the demihuman races in your world if you do any homebrew?

[analog oxide]

our DMs did that stuff to us. and we used it as well cause it made sense. it fit the style of the craetures, etc

oh wait. 2e combat and tactics kinda had stuff like that. it had detailed crit hits. but i dont recall rules for stuff like ripping players or monsters in half, etc

[mystic merlin]

I stick to the generic fantasy allotment usually.
I have ONE homebrew world that was intended to have none of em, which started with cursed crow people, dragon men, disembodied demons, incarnated devils, and living ice sculptures that reproduced by working in concert to find living ice and chisel or mould it into the form of their child, but at the last minute someone else added in elves and humans and dwarves and stuff and I was sad so I abandoned the project.

[woven dagger]

Is a Kelemvor knight stronger than a necromancer knight?

[dapper shale]

Sometimes is more like "Why" followed by another "Why". Now what I mentioned about Dark was different. I run out of ideas about running a story in wastelands. Feel like Mad Max with swords so I don't think the players have too much fun. In my experience they tended to be more nihilistic in Dark setting than in FR or Kyber.

[dry pendant]

I have no idea what a necromancer knight is. Is this some kind of homebrew your DM made up?

Necromancers tend to be wizards and clerics.

[woven dagger]

Sorry, a OC I created.

[analog oxide]

so in general. most of my freinds whom ive DMed variosu combiantions of them , they all like exporation and action more than anything else. so the wasteland is perfect for exploring unknown areas. mapping out hidden tombs. finding remnants ofthe ancient world (ie. when they had trees!) hehe

my friends also LOVE being gladiators and becoming like 'athletes'/'champions' in the world. so they dont mind being gladiators. either willingly or even starting off as slave gladiators like in spartacus..

[dry pendant]

none of that is official lore so I can't answer that question. sorry

[analog oxide]

they may esacpe or they have even tried to rise up as actual champion gladiators ..and gain freedom or then turn on the owners, etc.

[iron saffron]

That's something you should talk to your DM about then.

[woven dagger]

Oh sorry, I forgot to mention this us just researching for my writing.

[serene crater]

quick question, but would Vecna have existed around the time of the Netherese, or at least crossed over into Faerun during the time of their empire?

[iron saffron]

Vecna is not from Toril (Forgotten Realms) but from Oerth (Greyhawk) so the chronological timelines may not be 1:1

[serene crater]

hrmm

[mystic merlin]

“Yes”

Vecna exists in the forgotten realms and seems to exist there before the rise of the netheril empire. The trick is that he has access to time travel; he’s noted as having gone back in time in fifth edition to a time which is before the netherese.

[serene crater]

hmm. interesting

[mystic merlin]

There’s a Greyhawk on Toril?

[iron saffron]

At some point in his existence Vecna managed to steal one of the original black obelisks created by the enigmatic group known as the Weavers. He used the powerful artifact to travel to essentially remove all trace of the Weavers from known history and stole all knowledge regarding the obelisk's creation. By some means, that information came into the hands of the arcanists of ancient Netheril

[iron saffron]

The parenthesis is for the campaign setting name because not everyone knows the name of the planet proper.

Whoops typo. Thanks.

Fixed.

[mystic merlin]

Then I think you put Greyhawk twice by accident and one of them was supposed to be— yeah that

Keyboards are fast

[iron saffron]

I type too fast at times.

[analog oxide]

the weavers.. is it a refernce to spell weavers?

that obelisk is what my players right now are trying to figure out 🙂

[mystic merlin]

We don’t know.

[white ravine]

I mean frankly, Vecna is also a time traveler. He kind of exists on a whole other timespan compared to everything else.

[mellow ferry]

According to some designers, yes.

Officially, according to WotC, maybe.

[graceful jolt]

Is there a canon guardian to the book of vile darkness? Otherwise what is a good suggestion for a monster(or person) to guard it?

[mystic merlin]

Which designer leaked that? Can you source that for me?

[mystic merlin]

Artifacts “walk“. They don’t really have guardians, because they don’t generally sit around waiting.

Typically, an artifact is going to be found in someone’s path because it wants to be used. That’s why you always see these big mountain temples, full of priests and guards. They have the artifact on display in the middle of their courtyard or something; if you were to put an artifact in a bolt and then lock the door and throw away the key; if you open the vault again in six months, it probably wouldn’t be in there. It would have somehow moved.

[analog oxide]

there are some artifacts that are like owned/guarded but those, while super powerful, are also like family/racial created artifacts that were made specfiically for them. so they have guardians/owners. in older lore/editions, the treasures of evermeet for example

the rulers blades, the arcstaff of khavoerm, the ring of winter i think just sits around until found. dnt think its ever disappaered like taht but cant recall

[mellow ferry]

Eric L. Boyd, author/contributor to of 17 official books as well as numerous canon magazine articles, published Jergal: Lord of the End of Everything in 2021.
In it, he describes how the Faerunian god Jergal was the last survivor of Toril's ancient spellweaver colony in what would later become western Netheril. Jergal only survived by dint of being in the process of being born at the time that the entire race was attempting to ascend to divinity.

The spellweavers had a backup plan in case things went wrong - a code that would explain how a single spellweaver could reverse time to just before their attempt, so they could try again. The stones that held the code though had been scattered all over the multiverse in the same event that had killed his people. Jergal played a key role in developing the magic of Netheril with this goal in mind.
However, it goes on to say that Jergal eventually realised that he'd never practically be able to find every single one of the scattered stones containing the code, so he began work on a different plan that would at least ensure the survival of the knowledge of his people if not the people themselves.

So while Eric doesn't explicitly state 'the weavers are definitely spellweavers', he does say 'the spellweavers predated Netheril, and created a bunch of stones that could reverse time to counteract a cataclysm, and the last spellweaver passed on knowledge to the Netherese about those stones.' which is pretty much what it says on p255 of Rime of the Frostmiden.

That's the Verifiable information I can give you anyway...I've worked with Eric Boyd on some other stuff that isn't ready to be published yet (the final version of Jergal: Lord of the End of Everything took, like, six years to finally get out the door).

[mystic merlin]

Fabulous. When, and if, in the ungiven future, the rest of his works are published. I hope you remember me enough to send me a ping 🙂

And it’s only four dollars on DM’s guild, that is most tubular

[mellow ferry]

OK. That's you and @round brook. I should start a list.

[mystic merlin]

I wonder how to reconcile that gerbil survived, and yet his people did not? It might be a simple matter of timeline, bifurcation as I can buy for supremacy, but I’m trying to get away from that, not lean into it!

I need to pull up the dragon magazine and go over what we know about the time dragons as well. I may finally after all these years be able to bring this story to something resembling a conclusion.

Closure, my beloved.

[prime bronze]

Anyone's got a breakdown on the lore of the quasielemental plane of salt?

I'm having trouble finding information about it

[white ravine]

Few notes I can make on it:

1: Creatures that are made of water or rely on water are quickly and thoroughly dehydrated
2: Its inhabited mainly by native mephits and shriveled undead.

The salt mephits that live there can blast enemies with blinding salt which also has the unique property of revealing invisible enemies.

They could also physically suck the moisture out of things around them, once a day.

Also, fire immunity but vulnerability to moisture.

[prime bronze]

Thanks! All info I can get is great

[white ravine]

I'd imagine you make your players roll constitution akin to extreme heat, with a slightly altered mixture of a mummy lord's environmental effects that make water spoil (evaporate) and food rot (wither)

[prime bronze]

I'd probably make water spoil but make food last longer (cured) in exchange for further dehydration on consumption

Helpful advice nontheless

There's no dieties? No realms? No cities?

Just big salt waste with interactions with the neighboring realms?

[white ravine]

Some food would last longer yeah

There is the doomguard, basically a philosophical group that says that decay and entropy are necessary and should even be embraced

[prime bronze]

Well that at least gives me something to work from

[white ravine]

As for deities though...nothing.

Though im sure you can have deities from the elemental earth plane (evil ones primarily) in there for...'business'.

[prime bronze]

I would have never thought that something so specific wouldn't have at least a diety

Guess that's one mark off the list

[white ravine]

Better question, why would anyone ever go to the elemental plane of salt?

[prime bronze]

Well, for the NPC that I'm writing is to obtain a very specific kind of power to challenge water based demigods

[white ravine]

Sounds about right. Elemental princes of earth might be a good place to start as a bigger bad supporting the NPC

[prime bronze]

He's supposed to be one of the leaders of group that uses the potential power of the inner planes and the phlogiston to conceal and keep the outer planes away, I've yet to work the specifics out

Think of it as a Carceri type scenario but run by some guys of the material plane, next step will probably have something to do with the Inevitables

[white ravine]

Have the party come across a quarut or something similar massacring some followers of that NPC, and they get to have the clockwork nightmare on their side temporarily as the quarut does its job with the players tagging along on their own mission

They see the quarut barreling down hallways tearing apart enemies, maybe even stealing kills from the players as it races around the fortress it's been assigned to work at as the group tries to do their own thing

[prime bronze]

Interesting idea, I could use that to make it a 4 ways kind of fight, the inevitables trying to keep everything at bay, the organization of said NPC resisting and capturing any oposing threat, the Outer Planes having enough of this, and the players hanging on for dear life in the middle of all of this

I love it

Utter chaos

[vernal geode]

I have an aasimar character who is the child of a male angel and a female human cleric, and he hates his mortal blood and want to become fully divine, is there a way he can do that lore wise?

[spark haven]

sure, lots of mortals have ascended to godhood through various means

usually through unseating an existing god, but you accumulate enough followers, you become a powerful enough necromancer, etc etc

[vernal geode]

how about an angel?

like an archon or a deva

he just doesn't wanna have mortal blood, he is fine with serving a god as an angel

[spark haven]

I guess it depends on your setting of choice. Some places, angels and other inhabitants of the "heaven"/celestial plane are people who have died. In others, the Celestial plane is just a place that exists with its own native citizens

But, with the blessing of the patron of the plane, I don't see why a mortal couldn't be promoted

With dedicated service and a true heart, it seems like a reasonable reward

[vernal geode]

does him having celestial blood help?

[spark haven]

Depends on whether the person in charge of "heaven" is into nepotism

they usually are

since you don't maintain a firm hold on power by distributing it widely amongst strangers

and ultimately, this is all stuff you'll have to clear with your DM anyways so they could fully veto anything

but as far as most canons go, a mortal becoming an "angel" is very low on the list of exceptional events

[prime bronze]

You can ascend to become a Deva, Solar or Planetar by a willing god, it's quite doable, altough it has some requirements for it to happen

[analog oxide]

when do u need info by. online i find references to the the older 2e planescape books/sets which i havem but i cant go thru them now... maybe 2nite? pm me if no one can get u more info and i can see if there's more detailed lore in those books.

[prime bronze]

said requirements can be, and I say can be because it can be any amount of any of these:
-Doing a glorious deed for a good natured god that belongs to the upper realms. (i.e Yggdrasil)
-Go to a determined Holy Shite for the ritual to happen.
-Absorbing and utilising a god's power to make the ritual.
-Travel to Good natured Planes (i.e Elysium, Mount Celestia, possibly Positive Energy Plane).

[mystic merlin]

Use some sort of mechanism to introduce more phlogiston to the ethereal plane in order to “thicken” it, weakening astral tethers and setting it up so only the echoes and elemental planes are easily accessible even to scrutiny?

[prime bronze]

Great idea

Gonna write that real quick

[static smelt]

Can Warfoges be converted in mind flayer?

[outer apex]

not really anything for a precedent but I would say yes, they are humanoid. I do think it would result in an abnormal illithid rather than a normal mind flayer

[static smelt]

That's what I'm wondering, if it's down purely to having a brain, does the planet magic fluid in a warforge count as such?

[outer apex]

There are illithids on eberron but nothing on the interaction between the two races

[mellow ferry]

Not even all humanoids with brains can successfully undergo ceremorphosis, so I'd surmise that a warforged wouldn't be able to myself. As has been said though, there's no precedent for it.

It certainly wouldn't be a typical transformation regardless.

Perhaps if a mind flayer colony managed to get their hands on a creation forge?

[spark haven]

The way I see it, Warforged still think. Somewhere in there, there's a bundle of psychic energy churning away. That should be enough for a hive to work with, IMO

The usual larval implantation probably wouldn't work, but they have lots of tools at their disposal, ya know?

even if it were just brute-force..."enhanced interrogation" and brainwashing

[static smelt]

Can a drow half dragon become a drider?

[outer apex]

are you referring to a Zekyl?

[static smelt]

Ye ye

Or dragon drow in general

[outer apex]

likely not, as they were hunted by Menzoberranzan drows for being heretics

and driders are formed from people who are in the service of Lloth who displease her/fail her

[static smelt]

No chance for overlap with that though?

[outer apex]

actually, 100% no, because 5th ed MM says only drow can be made into drider, I would say a half drow cannot be made into one

[static smelt]

Sweet I'm down with this

[dusty current]

This may not be lore related, but why doesn't dragonborn have some type of dark vision? It's strange to me.

[outer apex]

the playtest for onednd or whatever does have them with it

[dusty current]

Ah well I have not kept up with that. Thx for letting me know.

[outer apex]

it was likely more a mechanical reason than lore based in the past

[spark haven]

the omission is strange, considering how liberally they hand out darkvision

[dusty current]

Yeah, everyone in my group has DV but the DB lol

[mellow ferry]

It was because the original dragonborn - the dragonborn of Bahamut, could take only certain aspects of the abilities of true dragons, while cutting themselves off from all of the others. This was a design decision made for balance purposes.

When they made dragonborn a core player race, they picked one of those upgrades - the breath weapon - and stuck with it.

[iron saffron]

The 4E dragonborn had normal vision (no lowlight vision).

[stuck breach]

The 5e version of dragonborn also has no darkvision

[dusty current]

Yea, I figured it being that type of creature it would have some type of vision.

[mystic merlin]

What type of creature?

Remember, they are not dragons. They are humanoids.

[dusty current]

Yep

[left spindle]

If you went and added them all up I bet the majority of playable humanoid races have darkvision.

Therefore darkvision is a typical humanoid thing, QED

[white ravine]

A major slice of playable races do yeah

[unkempt merlin]

It's like a 48/52 split for without/with iirc

Also some dragonborn do have darkvision, the exandrian ones

[mystic merlin]

Majority how? One of each example or adding up how many there actually are? Humans are far and away the most numerous, after all

[mellow ferry]

I think they mean of the racial options given in the rulebooks, there are more playable races with darkvision than without.

[unkempt merlin]

Not that many more however (despite what people will try to get you to think ;P)

[ruby sandal]

Most of the races in the player's handbook do.

[white ravine]

Out of the official races (not including the DMG's NPC races, MPMM's reprints, and assuming I can do my math right) there are around 32 races that have darkvision (or superior) and 18 that lack it

Actually wait, my math is very off.

[unkempt merlin]

Only counting base races (no subraces or variants that go against the norm), it's 22 (23 depending on if you count MMM genasi separately due to the base race being different in terms of having it or not)

[white ravine]

yeah you got it roughly

Its a...mess.

[unkempt merlin]

26 don't have it

+/- 1 with genasi again

[white ravine]

Frankly, darkvision isnt even that bad

Just...everywhere

[unkempt merlin]

Outliers are EEPC Fire Genasi, Marked Humans, Exandria Dragonborn... and a few others

It's not even that it's everywhere. As I posted, technically more races don't have it (my previous check was a few books ago, aka pre witchlight, so a number of races since then).

It's just that the races that do have it are the ones with the most variants and subraces (elves, tieflings, dwarves, etc)

[white ravine]

This is fair

[dapper shale]

Technically you could use the ritual that was applied to Zaknafein.

[mystic merlin]

That would be “one example from each” Yeah, but then even if we go with just actual played characters, humans are still most prosperous 😛

[eager bay]

Wdyt regarding prepared vs. spontaneous casting?

[mystic merlin]

I think the answers of the people who frequent this channel are fairly well-documented on that question.

I don’t think you’ll get any new insight.

[mystic merlin]

Redoing my research and annoyed to find Vecna apparently accounted for my plans to destroy him before I was born 😕

[mystic merlin]

Also amused that he pulls the same stunt twice; cross a boundary while dead/discorporated then resume full power

[analog oxide]

Hehe poor Meek:p

Plans foiled

[molten copper]

Can anyone help me find some more info on this thing with Hill Giants ? I've heard from a Mr Rhexx vid they have a special game or past time where it's like soccer except scoring is smashing a small creature or a opponents skull on the goal

[mystic merlin]

That’s fine. The desperation when things go sideways is half the fun!

But yeah, combine the 2e stuff with the 5e stuff and you get a much different Villain.

[mystic merlin]

Sorry, I’ve never heard of that :<

[white ravine]

I cant remember any source for that one, but stuff-stuff (chubby bunny but with people) is absolutely a thing they do

[restive summit]

TW dnd movie
||This just occurred to me and my dad.
Do we know which setting Honour Among Thieves is taking place in?||

[unkempt merlin]

Yes, FR

[analog oxide]

Confirmed FR. Iirc the city is never winter and one of the monsters in the trailer is a named monster in dnd lore

[grim dagger]

We have #999985185481302076 for discussion of the movie.

[serene crater]

The red wizards

[analog oxide]

Not just that. The dragon

[storm dagger]

The Red Dragon is Themberchaud who appears in Out of the Abyss

[analog oxide]

Right

[snow laurel]

Hey, putting together a planescape campaign. Are there any "interdimensional" or "interplanar" crime lords or syndicates, particularly those that may have a foothold in sigil?

[hazy fox]

So I wanted to ask something, but not sure if it has been discussed since their inceptions.
How would you compare Hordelands to Ethanagar? From many let's read on Horde campaign of Forgotten Realms, I hear a consensus that Ethanagar seems to make concept of "Mongols in Fantasy" better than Hordelands...other than former being too rigid on close to its historical counterpart but Ethanagar at least applying fantasy races and magic (not!Genghis conscripting dwarves for logistics and even have magic schools established).

(On another note, Anyone wonder that DnD doesn't seem to thought up India before even in OA era.
Not that it would have been in setting priority or modern sensitivity proof but feel like an odd choice since many fantasies actually had not!India thought up.
Like only Mystra and Ravenloft seems the only one one.)

[prime bronze]

What would a greatful guardian naga, unchained from an evil curse fron the Yuan-Ti, do for the adventurer that liberated him?

[magic jackal]

Nagas are intelligent serpents that inhabit the ruins of the past, amassing arcane treasures and knowledge.

The first nagas were created as immortal guardians by a humanoid race long lost to history. When this race died out, the nagas deemed themselves the rightful inheritors of their masters’ treasures and magical lore. Industrious and driven, nagas occasionally venture out from their lairs to track down magic items or rare spellbooks.

Nagas never feel the ravages of time or succumb to sickness. Even if it is struck down, a naga’s immortal spirit reforms in a new body in a matter of days, ready to continue its eternal work.

Wise and good, the beautiful guardian nagas protect sacred places and items of magical power from falling into evil hands. In their hidden redoubts, they research spells and hatch convoluted plots to thwart the evil designs of their enemies.

A guardian naga doesn’t seek out violence, warning off intruders rather than attacking. Only if its foes persist does the naga attack, accosting enemies with its spells and poisonous spittle.
I imagine, being a very intelligent, and good creature, that considers itself the master of its domain, and wards off evil, it would reward the adventurer with some magic item or lost arcane knowledge from its collection. Or perhaps it might offer them help with something in return.

I mean, a Guardian Naga ally would no doubt be formidable.

[spark haven]

A tricky question. This guardian naga has been under someone else's thrall for however long. Do they still have resources, followers, or strength (of their own) to spare? Maybe hit them with this: "Take one of my scales. If you're ever in need, break it in half and speak my name three times. I will come."

The Naga itself could be the "gift". An ace-in-the-hole for an encounter sometime in the future

[prime bronze]

The naga(nagas, they were 2 guardian nagas and 1 bone naga) happened to be cursed be an anathema touched by Mershaulk, which in turn made them become Yuan-Ti slaves, the party managed to kill said anathema and save them from that curse, they also had to slay the nagas to get to thay point

The demiplane they were in also kind of went kaboom so I have no idea what really happens at that point

Although 1 naga managed to get out

Since it was in an unchecked room of the Yuan-Ti barracks

The idea of the Naga itself being the gift sounds fantastic though

[prime bronze]

This question is one I can't find info about

What happens to an immortal creature if the plane it exists in stops existing?

[main palm]

lore wise, at which level can a wizard become immortal?

[prime bronze]

Usually through lichdom which requieres either a very intricate and complicated ritual or the disaproval for a godhood ascent from said wizard

[obsidian gate]

clone spell though

[main palm]

i heared wizards can slow their aging somehow? is it just natural as they grew more powerful, like the arcane power in theri body slows their aging?

[main palm]

i heared cloning just results in the wizard soul going mad

[outer apex]

Clone does not have any history of that, in any edition

[left spindle]

maybe he's thinking of Manshoon

[main palm]

I forget who it was, but the mage started to clone himself and split his soul for each clone instead of the normal process which is to just have clones if your body is destroyed

[mystic merlin]

Lore-wise, immortality is never easily accessible and always has some sort of cost, catch, or setback. Lichdom robs you of the ability to grow, think truly clearly, and enjoy things. Vampirism or spectral forms saddle you with emotion- and mind-warping hungers, needs, and habits that you’ll convince yourself was how you always were and so won’t notice your shackles. Cloning has the possibility of the clones activating at the wrong time, either like that one villain who has hundreds of himself all claiming to be the original, or else a clone that awakens and then goes to kill the doppelgänger (you) that replaced it. Reincarnation can restore you to youth but risks you changing over time and forgetting your “original” self. Becoming a construct has similar issues, preventing growth. Demon or devil form usually comes with a secret “we torture you until your brain warps and you’re not really the same person” phase the fiends don’t tell you about. Goodly forces tend not to do this sort of thing at all, so there’s no angelic ascension, though demigodhood is on the table if you’re incredible enough.

Further, there exists an entire class of axiomatic being who’s sole goal is to ensure “all creatures die” comes true even for those wizards who simply try to capture the essence of astral timelessness ima. Demiplane and live there for eternity, unchanging.

[outer apex]

could just vibe on the astral plane like the Gith

[mystic merlin]

That’s a hold over. In 1-3e, clone would awaken when made, period, so you’d have to pay the wizard to only cast the spell after you died. If it came around earlier, it would try to replace you.

3.5-5 changed it so the spell just made a vessel to pop out of, which is safer for players but also undermines most other stuff. Why not be a clone forever? That seems much safer than lichdom, now.

The guy who had a bunch of clones active all at once is a plot point from yon olden days when clone always worked like that, it’s good to see they came up with a justification for it that works with the 5e rules 🙂

[mystic merlin]

Yep. Then it’s just an interminable wait until the inevitables get you 😉

[main palm]

A question how do wizards prolong their life time?

Is it a natural thing like it's a natural ability they gain? Like aging slowly

[iron saffron]

Unlike monks and druids, wizards have no class ability to stop ageing.

Hence why some try to become liches or quaff a lot of potions of longevity.

The Halruaan wizard-king researched a longevity spell to grant himself "immortality" (he died in a fight against an archmage who had co-developed the spell with).

[main palm]

Oh isee so it's a ritual to age slowly as a wizard?

[iron saffron]

There's no official longevity spell. That was part of the lore of that particular NPC.

[main palm]

Okey, now I have a question about PCs wizards making a spell, lore wise, how would a wizard make a spell or a ritual?

[iron saffron]

So the short answer is wizards age as fast as everyone else (except for high level monks and druids)

[iron saffron]

Ask Your DM.

[main palm]

I am the DM lol

[iron saffron]

Ask yourself.

In 5E ageing has little consequences (in older editions Str, Dex and Con would be lowered as you got older while Int and Wis iimproved).

[main palm]

I mean it does have an effect

[mystic merlin]

Even those only stop deterioration. Monks and Druids still die when their time is up.

Lore-wise a wizard would do multiple quests related to finding information and then, depending on what’s possible, either learn how to become undead (plus make plans to hubristically overcome the drawbacks), or else slow their aging, or else develop potions of longevity, or else become a different creature somehow (which is usually an entirely character arc)

[main palm]

You will be immune to the effects that would age you xD

[mystic merlin]

Those affects don’t do anything though. A ghost aging You forty years is like a ghost taking away forty hit points. If you aren’t losing your last year the game doesn’t care 😛

[main palm]

I mean there is strong effects later on

Some effects later on will only give you 10 days left or a day

Or an hour

[mystic merlin]

And I mean there are not, unless you’re choosing a rules set where old age penalizes your attributes.

There’s no real way to know if you’re on your last hour.

The dm could roll that, sure, but that’s not the system doing that.

[iron saffron]

Is your campaign going to be that long that it will matter exact how old a PC is?

[main palm]

No not really, he just wanna be immortal or slow his aging this a long campaign we reached our first year

[iron saffron]

There are some older players (such as @analog oxide) who have campaigns that have lasted decades (real world time).

[mystic merlin]

Eh. I’m sorry, I’m being pugnacious over nothing. This is about lore and lore-wise getting old matters. After all, the dwarf in dragon Lance died of heart attack

[main palm]

In game wise this is their third year

Like his main goal was to gain a kind of half-immortality, he has clones, but he likes not to age in his birth body

[mystic merlin]

I became fey, myself. Fey don’t have natural lifespans after all.

[main palm]

He doesn't wanna lose his mind too, and he hates undead also he dislikes the fey, he likes his human body

[mystic merlin]

Then he’s, from a lore standpoint, hosed.

Magic Jar can be modified to be a permanent thing and he can become a body snatcher but that’s borderline undead (our wizard who tried that basically became a suel lich)

[main palm]

I will explain better his character's fantasy, he believes that his knowledge and mastery over arcana could led him to becoming a great mage, he thinks human wizards are superior to other races including non wizard humans, and thinks his rightful place as a wizard to rule over vast territories. He likes his human body and wants to stop his aging somehow without going mad or losing his humanity

He basically thinks wizards are better fit to rule over the world then other people

[mystic merlin]

You’re running into a problem here where “lore” is “what exists already”. The answers are going to be different for lore, for mechanics-per-edition, and for what you’ll come up with as homebrew.

There are oodles of unofficial cool ideas! But they aren’t game lore 🙂

[iron saffron]

This is falling into #dm-discussion territory then because you're not really asking about official D&D lore then.

[main palm]

Yo you correct mb

@mystic merlin I just wanna know how lore wise, some wizards are able to live longer then expected?

[wraith cypress]

Guys, can I ask, are there some Good or Lawful aligned "undead", kinda like celestials?

[iron saffron]

There are plenty of lawful evil undead such as skeletons.
There are good-aligned undead (such as ghosts, baelnorns (elven liches), and archliches).

[wraith cypress]

I was more thinking lawful non-evil

Like newtral or good

[iron saffron]

Ghosts can be of any alignment.

[wraith cypress]

I see

[daring vessel]

there's the primordial force of death itself but that might be more powerful tan you need

[iron saffron]

Undead tend to be created by evil necromancers with negative/necrotic energy.

[wraith cypress]

I guess if you raise a dead body or skeleton it's always gonna be evil aligned right? If it was good it would "resurrect"

[iron saffron]

Archliches and baelnorn are one of the few exceptions because they chose to be undead for a noble cause.

[iron saffron]

What?

[wraith cypress]

Yah, if you try the creation of a skeleton or zombie but not using "evil" aligned magic/energy

Some kind of fey or celestial

[iron saffron]

Raise Dead doesn't affect undead.

[wraith cypress]

Not undead, just dead

[iron saffron]

That makes no sense.

[wraith cypress]

Haha

I was thinking what if this Fey tries to raise the dead

And was looking for non-evil "undead"

[iron saffron]

Celestials can't be undead because their spirits are reabsorbed by their home plane when they die (on their home plane).

Undeath is essentially only for creatures from the Material Plane.

[prime bronze]

What happens to an immortal creature if the plane it exists in stops existing?

[vernal geode]

Wdym?

[prime bronze]

The situation is:
Some nagas were temporarily slayed in a pocket plane that got destroyed by a rift from the Abyss

[vernal geode]

There is a lot of types of immortal creatures

[prime bronze]

So, do they just come back after some days to the material plane? Are they adrift in the astral plane? What happens now?

[vernal geode]

Nages just die if they are killed anyways

They aren't demons, they are created by an old magical race

[prime bronze]

No they don't, they come back to life after X days

Even if it wasn't the case, what would happen to a creature that can come back to life over time in that situation?

[vernal geode]

Oh you correct

[iron saffron]

Depends on the plane of existence they're from.

You have to be a tad more specific on your question.

Nagas are not outsiders (from the Inner/Outer planes) but are Monstrosities.

[prime bronze]

It's a pocket plane made by Mershaulk, it got destroyed as that plane's magic was absorbed for the formation of a rift from the 74th layer of Abyss

The pocket plane conncected directly to the Material Plane, where Yuan-Ti went to gather sacrifices for Mershaulk

In order for all this could happen

[wraith cypress]

I found the deathless, from Eberron, is there something similar in the Forgotten Realms setting?

[prime bronze]

It's a weird situation for these Nagas to be in, and I have no idea what to do

[vernal geode]

Aren't like Naga's usually ruling a territory or something