general-chat

[craggy shoal]

Me: Yo a new mouse would be cool

My backpack: Please let me die

[frosty sinew]

bruh

[craggy shoal]

I guess that's for next paycheck lol

Car payment is due tomorrow. Whatever else I have to payoff. *cough* Affirm loans

[olive plaza]

I mean it could be anything from, just needs windows installed, to the motherboard

But more than likely it's either an SSD failure or the m.2 on the board is dead

If you were to run the diagnostic and it shows the SSD exists, it's definitely worth the money

70 dollars for a gaming laptop where the only problem is you have to load windows, that would be a steal

[craggy shoal]

If you're not afraid of fixing things, $70 is well worth it imo

[spark plume]

So I have a Security System for my Place an I need to replace the Hard Drive in the DVR Box what 1TB HDD do you Recommand me getting

[craggy shoal]

Is this for constantly recording CCTV footage (or similar)? I'd go with any Western Digital Purple hard drive. They're made for stuff like that

[spark plume]

I do Record 24/7

[craggy shoal]

Yeah go with WD Purple

[spark plume]

Thank you very much due to the Stander HDD that cam with it it Died an dont know when it died on my

[craggy shoal]

Yikes. I'm curious though, what kind of hard drive?

I wouldn't put a WD Blue in that thing, even a server drive tbh

[olive plaza]

It's especially worth it if there's no hardware issue. Literally just plug in a windows flash drive and go

If there's an SSD failure that brings about another layer of, do you wanna open the laptop.

If it's the motherboard, forget it

[spark plume]

it was Seagate Barracuda 1TB that came with the System

[craggy shoal]

If it's the motherboard, the only thing you can try doing is pulling the CMOS battery. If that doesn't work, you're out $70; just dump it at that point

[olive plaza]

WD Purple or Seagate Skyhawk

[craggy shoal]

That's a weird choice of a hard drive. Those things are meant for desktop computers

[olive plaza]

Those are the two to consider, they are made for surveillance applications so they are made for 24/7 operation

[craggy shoal]

Yeah Skyhawk also isn't bad

[olive plaza]

What I don't recommend is getting an SSD

[spark plume]

I did ask them about the Slyhawk 4TB an they told me that would work but it would only use 1TB of 4TB

[spark plume]

No I wouldn't

[olive plaza]

SSDs wear out when you write a lot of data to them, that's what causes them to fail. So putting one into a surveillance system where it gets video written to it all the time is gonna make it fail prematurely

Unless you get an enterprise rated SSD, which costs a few grand

[craggy shoal]

My parents bought a Reolink NVR surveillance system. It's amazing other than it came with a dead hard drive (WD Purple. I suspect it was because of the vibrations from the device traveling). I ended up replacing it with another WD Purple and it's been running ever since

[olive plaza]

@spark plume is this a super mission-critical surveillance system? Or is this just for home use

[spark plume]

How Long. Cause the one I have the HDD Died in a Year an 5 months

[olive plaza]

hang on you said vibrations in travel

are you using this in a vehicle

[spark plume]

The Security System I have is in the Link --> https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07719HQQS?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_fed_asin_title&th=1

[craggy shoal]

The original drive was dead on arrival. The new drive has lasted for more than a year and does show any signs of failing any time soon. I think I replaced the drive some time around late May or early June of 2024

[spark plume]

Ok looking at the HDD right now

[olive plaza]

So are you using this in a vehicle

because if it died due to "vibrations in travel" you need to change up your setup unless you wanna continually replace hard drives

[craggy shoal]

Nah we got it through Amazon (so we had it delivered obviously lol)

Vibrations that took place some time within shipping and prior to delivery

Idk though. Could've been anything that killed it

[olive plaza]

oh that makes more sense

I was here like

[craggy shoal]

Yeah I just have a network surveillance system for my GTI 💀

[olive plaza]

I was picturing a work van

[spark plume]

Is this what you are recommand ---> https://www.newegg.com/purple-wd10purz-1tb-hard-drive-for-video-surveillance-5400-rpm/p/N82E16822231532

wanna make sure I get the Right one?

[olive plaza]

@spark plume i was noticing Newegg sells the 1TB Purple drives refurb for $28

you can literally buy 2 of those and still spend less than 1 new drive

[spark plume]

Really

[craggy shoal]

Yeah that should be fine. A lot of people would say to upgrade to 7200rpm, but I don't think it's needed if it's just for surveillance

[olive plaza]

https://www.newegg.com/purple-wd10purx-1tb/p/N82E16822236662

[spark plume]

That is Correct

[craggy shoal]

Ehhh I don't trust refurb. That's just me though. I never do refurb storage unless it's from serverpartsdeals

[olive plaza]

this is from TR Reuse

I've bought plenty of laptop parts from them on eBay

That said, it's exactly what I said before, you can buy 2 of the used drives for less than 1 new one

so you take your chances

if this is a super critical surveillance system, then yeah spend the money and buy new

if this is for surveillance on your house

buy 2 of the used ones

then you have a backup if the first one fails

[spark plume]

Im doing the 2 for 1 cause money is very tight

[olive plaza]

I just do recommend plugging each drive into your PC beforehand and running crystaldiskinfo

check the drives both work and aren't failing

that way you don't install one, put the other in the drawer, and turns out the second one was bad the whole time

[spark plume]

True to that an if they are failing I can send it back right?

Thank you @craggy shoal & @olive plaza

[olive plaza]

yep. that's the idea

[arctic lily]

What makes that different from the g502 hero

[frosty sinew]

not the new one

[arctic lily]

so better to save money and get hero

[frosty sinew]

nah

money a concept

[arctic lily]

subjective to opinion

[frosty sinew]

true

[dusk knot]

People of wegg

I have grave news to announce....

[proud jackal]

[atomic current]

hi theo

[nocturne flicker]

Dorm PC?

I recognize that chair

The ones at my college had light blue cushions but that design is seared into my mind

[frosty sinew]

yessir

[olive plaza]

I'll take one please

[nocturne flicker]

Mod breaking rule 3

[sinful blade]

It’s legal shhhh

[upper rain]

i am purchasing a 7900 xt tomorrow

[lone mango]

Lighter

[arctic lily]

of course

[lone mango]

But logitech switches

[royal crow]

Hell yeah

I told you so

[upper rain]

huh

[upper rain]

what did tou tell me

[royal crow]

You told me to get a 9070 instead of a 7900xt

Now ur getting a 7900xt

Lol

[upper rain]

oh lol, i still stand by that. i'm getting 7900 xt out of interest, not because i think it's a good option at equal price

[royal crow]

💀 💀

[upper rain]

?

[royal crow]

Nuthin

[upper rain]

can an arcmaxxer start chipletmaxxing too or is this too much?

[olive plaza]

I'm actually about to order lunch, if you have the thing

[olive plaza]

You know how I know I'm hungry? I read this as "Chipotlemaxxing"

[upper rain]

i'm hungry too, i'm waiting for my chicken to finish marinading and then i'm making some fire lunch

i haven't eaten anything all day

and i've been up since 4

[olive plaza]

In what timezone

If eastern, F

If Pacific, meh

[fossil venture]

This a decent pc?

Only 150

Or best offer prob can get it for 100

I just need something to play gta on

[olive plaza]

I wouldn't

7th gen, doesn't officially support Windows 11. And Windows 10 stops getting updated next month

Plus it's a hard drive, not SSD

[elfin mural]

you can bypass to use win 11- but

in the condition and age that it is

not worth it

[fossil venture]

Ok

So it’s best for me to get a gaming laptop that atleast has windows 11

What about this one

[lone mango]

[upper rain]

eastern

[upper rain]

i need a chiplet arc immediately

[rigid sinew]

GOOD MORNING EVERYONE

[upper rain]

give me what i desire, intel

[upper rain]

good afternoon

[lone mango]

Everybody needs chiplet right now

Amd you are so close

[upper rain]

i hope rdna 5 is chiplet and the chiplets work

rdna 3 is chiplet but the chiplets dont work

sad!

[lone mango]

Yeah we need chiplet compute instead

But at least they tried

[upper rain]

i think the layout for rdna 3 chiplets make sense considering they weren't economically or technologically ready for a proper interposer design, which you kinda need for a dual GCD design

but even the more limited approach they used was pretty busted

[lone mango]

Yeah they had to do with what they got

[upper rain]

they had to desync the frontend from the shaders 💀

imagine how RDNA 3 would have performed if it had, you know, actually decent IPC

[lone mango]

I wonder how much of its power draw comes from integrated fan out

[mental yoke]

you kids like motorcycles?

[upper rain]

idle power draw suggests that it is not an insubstantial amount

[nocturne flicker]

That's what somebody doing something sus would say

[pliant berry]

oh boy, anyone good with fixing ground loop issues

[lethal jasper]

erm why is it flipped

[nocturne flicker]

Pepeg marketing

The acer lettering on the gpu is backwards, they flipped the image

[lethal jasper]

monsters making gpus for pcs to be put on the left

they must be stopped

i might buy this it looks better than the pulse and is cheaper

surely it wont go out of stock before i start buying the parts

[upper rain]

surely

[verbal birch]

@mental yoke u left r moto?

dork

[rigid sinew]

#announcements

[dusk knot]

I'll win this time....

@rigid sinew ma'am..... I did nothing

[rigid sinew]

Hmm that’s weird

[dusk knot]

[opaque sedge]

uh guys

what should i do

i havent downloaded anything suspicious

[dusk knot]

I figured it out @rigid sinew

[royal crow]

anyone know why dsc ptb seems to take a lot longer to load than on web

actually normal client is bugged too

when wegg accidentally leaks next intel gpu

[nocturne flicker]

https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/answers/questions/5545190/threats-detected-trojan-win32-vigorf-a

[opaque sedge]

Phew i do have openrgb installed hopefully its just that

Thanks weary

[dense locust]

Windows flagged my Rgb software

Probably yours too

[opaque sedge]

Man fck rgb

I’m removing the rgb headers tmr

[dense locust]

The software probably fine

Might just be a false flag

[opaque sedge]

Praying

Cuz cyberpunk’s been crashing for me a lot

[dense locust]

Unless someone pushed an update but I don’t think my rgb software updates automatically

[opaque sedge]

Hmm i did go to keychron’s browser to change the rgb setting for my keyboard

But doubt that would be the cause

[dense locust]

https://youtu.be/H_O5JtBqODA?feature=shared

Maybe this is why

[opaque sedge]

Yeah just ran a full scan and yup its flagging openrgb

And quarantined the winring0 file

@dense locust all false alarms right 💀

[dense locust]

All of those say ring0 I guess that just shows how many apps use it

[nocturne flicker]

It seems like all fan related software, a dude says FanControl is triggering it too

Wait does FanControl do rgb too?

[dense locust]

Seems it’s anything with ring0

[nocturne flicker]

Oh I see

Winring0 finally getting snapped? Has the day come?

[dusk knot]

I'm learning HTML5

[unreal trail]

[dusk knot]

Another lizard

[nocturne flicker]

Ban he

[lone mango]

guys

https://www.newegg.com/sapphire-tech-amd-11349-03-21g-radeon-rx-9070-16gb-graphics-card-double-fans/p/N82E16814202460?Item=N82E16814202460

@upper rain

[dusk knot]

I am guys

It's not XT. I sleep

😴

[lone mango]

2/3 of the power draw for like 85-90% of the perf

I wake

[opaque sedge]

Its still a heck of a card for that price

[nocturne flicker]

I saw that

Why was it removed

[rancid juniper]

thought it was something mundane after thinking about it

[nocturne flicker]

I believe it means you can also record audio to go along with what you snip?

Kinda weird to put into a screenshot app but okay

[rancid juniper]

yea

[nocturne flicker]

Does snipping tool also allow video screen cap?

[rancid juniper]

yes

[nocturne flicker]

Oh

I didn't know that

[nocturne flicker]

That makes more sense then

I only use the old one

[rancid juniper]

so i guess this is windows built in screen recorder?

[nocturne flicker]

I mean as long as they don't steal the videos and audio

They don't steal that right?

[rancid juniper]

[dusk knot]

I agree. If you have the money, it's a decent buy

[rigid sinew]

i got all the stressful stuff done at work hehehehe

[icy ore]

good go home for the day

[rigid sinew]

lmfaoooo i cant

i get off at 6 today

[ancient swift]

Did y'all see the legion go 2 price?

Starts at 1099$. 😭

However. It's the first device with an HDR True black 1000 rating.

1200p, 16:10, OLED, 144HZ with VRR.

1099$: Z2, 16GB RAM 1TB SSD
1179$: Z2, 32GB RAM, 1TB SSD.

1349$: Z2E, 32GB RAM, 1tb SSD.

1479$: Z2E, 32TB RAM, 2TB SSD. 😭 That's laptop pricing. What the hell lol

[nocturne flicker]

Mini 'laptop' means big laptop prices

[ancient swift]

I was expecting it to be expensive. But I didn't expect it to be that much for the Z2E

[upper rain]

finally msrp!

[velvet summit]

sometimes i forget how old madonna is

she's almost 70

she does not look like that

[olive plaza]

LETS GO i knew you had it

My boss is a little bit of a dip sometimes

So I got that dual-5090 system all put together yesterday and started running some heavy AI workloads on it, cuz that's the only thing I know of that can run both GPUs at full throttle. I set it all up like an hour before closing yesterday, and left it to run overnight, to make sure it wouldn't shut off or overheat.

My boss shut it off when he went to leave.

He said, and I quote, "the fans were running loud so I shut it off"

[rigid sinew]

Oh goodness 🤣

[olive plaza]

I was like, you know with two 5090's the fans are gonna be a little loud

[royal crow]

No crap Sherlock😂

[olive plaza]

So yeah I got it back up and running again before I left today. It's gonna run all weekend now

[nocturne flicker]

Inb4 it gets shut off again

[atomic current]

give me physical access and I'd do the same

[olive plaza]

oh no, I told him I was gonna start it again. So if he shuts it off again then when I come in monday I'm just taking it all apart

then he can explain to his brother who runs the company with him, why we don't have a PC to take photos of

cuz I'm not gonna allow that to get listed for sale without proper testing

Sorry about my exacting standards

deal with it

LOL

We're a stubborn bunch of people at my day job but we all understand one another's position

[unreal trail]

[dusk knot]

hmmm

[dusk knot]

have your parent ever potty trained you? 🤔

[frigid stag]

sink pissa

[opaque sedge]

Mah heart…

[fresh timber]

no

[nocturne flicker]

Can you make your fans sound like geiger counters

[dusk knot]

is PT on?

[opaque sedge]

Dude… i’m alr pushing a 4070super on 3440x1440p… so the answer to that is… hell no

[dusk knot]

https://tenor.com/view/yoda-gif-20889681

[royal crow]

I'm no miku fan but this is tuff

[opaque sedge]

Gimme ur 5080 and i’ll record path traced footage

[dusk knot]

your request has been filed

[opaque sedge]

Lol

[dusk knot]

have you tried OC?

[opaque sedge]

Nope

[dusk knot]

AND fake frames?

[upper rain]

i need this and the asus hatsune miku 5060 to go in my hatsune miku case

[opaque sedge]

Yeah but i have a modpack thats eating up my cpu which is causing bottlenecks at times so i have stuck to native taa for now 💀

[upper rain]

absolute peak

[opaque sedge]

Man crazy to think that a 7800x3d still bottlenecks a 4070super on an internal render res of 1080p in cyberpunk with high crowd density

[upper rain]

this is a different hatsune miku line than i originally saw

there is another hatsune miku x asus collab too

[royal crow]

Didn't the creator of hatsune miku introduce more characters?

[upper rain]

there are more vocaloid mascots yah

[royal crow]

Ah

[upper rain]

white hatsune miku line\

[dusk knot]

awww

[upper rain]

this would look better in my case, but it asia exclusive

[dusk knot]

man...i want this

[opaque sedge]

Dont aww me

[dusk knot]

as a man...i would

[upper rain]

same but it's like $4000 on aliexpress :(

asia exclusive

[opaque sedge]

Whut

[upper rain]

absolute horror

[dusk knot]

https://tenor.com/view/family-guy-peter-griffin-wait-stop-it-stop-gif-18848485

[dusk knot]

NOOOOO!

also arent all our wallets empty?

[opaque sedge]

Either this is a badly timed message or ur hinting at smth i am not comfortable with

[dusk knot]

bad timing

[upper rain]

i have like 25k in my bank rn

[opaque sedge]

Good

[dusk knot]

in ugandan dolllars

[upper rain]

nuh uh

[dusk knot]

the poorest of us

😔

[upper rain]

MY ARC CRASHED AGAIN

HORROR

JP i am lending my mother and sister one of my arc's soon... how much time do you think i will be playing tech support?

[dusk knot]

a matter of days

or less

[opaque sedge]

SHIT BRUH I’M STILL GETTING BOTTLENECKED IN NATIVE 3440x1440p

[upper rain]

https://tenor.com/view/1-gif-16802062075499853211

[dusk knot]

shes kinda...needs PT, breh

[upper rain]

you'll always be bottlenecked by something if you're doing it right

[opaque sedge]

A 7800x3d bottlenecking a 4070super in native 3440x1440p is crazy tho 😭

[upper rain]

cpu bottlenecked?

[opaque sedge]

Yeah

[dusk knot]

use another overlay

[opaque sedge]

Gpu isnt maxing out in big crowds

[upper rain]

okay it's joever

[opaque sedge]

Defender’s flagged stuff like afterburner and such in my system atm

[dusk knot]

use ngreedai overlay

[opaque sedge]

Thats what i’m using

[dusk knot]

oof

i often dont use it

[opaque sedge]

Fps count gets bugged at times and shows up as n/a

[dusk knot]

no in-game fps counter?

[opaque sedge]

Cyberpunk doesn’t have it

[dusk knot]

hm

[opaque sedge]

Could use steam overlay but its misreporting gpu usage atm

@dusk knot behold bottleneck

Some of its likely thanks to the modpack

[dusk knot]

what do you have again?

to your eyes, how many fps do you think youre getting?

[opaque sedge]

70

[dusk knot]

hm

turn on FG

[opaque sedge]

4070super and 7800x3d

[dusk knot]

damn

thats a really good build

im still on a 5800x3d

[opaque sedge]

First one too

U guys helped with it

[dusk knot]

oh right

glad its working

[opaque sedge]

Yup

Had troubles with the 7900xt settled for a 4070super later on

[dusk knot]

nice

[opaque sedge]

Alright enabled frame gen

[dusk knot]

it should still FEEL like 70fps

[opaque sedge]

@dusk knot 120-130 frames and gpu’s maxing out at crowded areas

[dusk knot]

4xFG?

[opaque sedge]

Lots of ghosting tho cuz havent enabled dlaa or dlss

[opaque sedge]

40 series doesn’t have 4x

Just 2x

[dusk knot]

OH RIGHT

for now

[dusk knot]

tunr on PT and tell me how much you get. your pc will be fine

[opaque sedge]

[dusk knot]

[opaque sedge]

Getting like 20 frames

[dusk knot]

doubt

i would say......40fps

without FG

[opaque sedge]

This is with framegen

[dusk knot]

https://tenor.com/view/mane-im-dead-gif-6502286207230651503

[opaque sedge]

No upscaling tho

[dusk knot]

bruh

turn it on

DLSS is great

[opaque sedge]

66 frames with dlss quality and frame gen

[dusk knot]

but how does it feel ?

[opaque sedge]

Horrid latency

[dusk knot]

turn it off. weve seen enough

😔

[opaque sedge]

Yuh

[dusk knot]

i really should buy CP77......

just for the graphics...

[fresh timber]

thanks @idle nexus for putting me on with woot

[opaque sedge]

U HAVENT PLAYED IT YET DAFUQ

What the hell bruh

[dusk knot]

[opaque sedge]

Its one of the best games of all times right now

I’m dissapointed jp

Stick some iron in your mouth and pull the trigger

(Line from the game)

[opaque sedge]

https://tenor.com/view/cyberpunk-stick-some-iron-up-your-mouth-and-pull-the-trigger-johnny-silverhand-gif-26931703

[dusk knot]

💀

[opaque sedge]

The game’s so peak bruh

Keanu reeves talks shit to your face

Thats peak

[dusk knot]

ik. but i will get it when its on sale

[remote geode]

aww

[dusk knot]

hello

[opaque sedge]

Dont aww me

[remote geode]

awwww

[dusk knot]

🤨

[opaque sedge]

[nocturne flicker]

I'm never going to play it

[opaque sedge]

[nocturne flicker]

Not interested

[opaque sedge]

But u would love it

[nocturne flicker]

I'm not interested though

[dusk knot]

[opaque sedge]

Then stick some iron in your mouth and pull the trigger

[nocturne flicker]

I never even got in the initial hype train and crash after release

[opaque sedge]

One of my favorite games i’ve played in the past year

I’ve only played games in that past year tho

[proud jackal]

[nocturne flicker]

It is 5 years old

[opaque sedge]

Newer games dont even compare

[nocturne flicker]

I mean, they have the same crash and burn launches

[hoary zodiac]

Based

[opaque sedge]

Dafuq bro

Is this revenge for the final dn joke

[hoary zodiac]

What

[hoary zodiac]

Do you think everything revolves around deez nuts

[opaque sedge]

https://tenor.com/view/say-that-again-gif-968943876633031890

Really bro

[hoary zodiac]

It's only going to become less funny when you post it the 50th time

[opaque sedge]

Nah hasn’t even been 5 yet

Anyways

Cyberpunk is peak

[misty sparrow]

Well yeah, they're round

[hoary zodiac]

But anyways back to what I was saying

The game was released in a slop state

Don't care what happened afterwards it wasn't worth the asking price at launch

[frigid stag]

it makes new games look optimized

imagine paying 2k for a gpu and you get below 60 fps

[nocturne flicker]

Starfield wasn't bad at launch. It is just a trash game

[abstract oyster]

Anyone able to help me get a new pc to post in build chat?

[opaque sedge]

Dude cyberpunk runs pretty great now

[hoary zodiac]

The slop must be fueled

[remote geode]

my ex boyfriend said it was repetitive bethesda slop for the bethesda shills 😭

[frigid stag]

boomers were defending it on twitter “you dont need more than 30 fps, fps doesnt matter in having fun”

[nocturne flicker]

It was

[frigid stag]

i mean at launch like 4k was rough

[hoary zodiac]

It's outrageous that games are allowed to release in such a state these days

[opaque sedge]

Yeah i imagine people were still on 20 series back then

[nocturne flicker]

It had a handful of interesting quests and then filler and trash

[hoary zodiac]

The over $60 asking price should mean that they have no excuse

[opaque sedge]

But rn its a pretty awesome game

[frigid stag]

most were on way older gpus thats why the game got that reputation

[opaque sedge]

Game also seemed to be broken asf

[remote geode]

why is your fingertips sore

[hoary zodiac]

I wouldn't say that

[frigid stag]

https://tenor.com/view/cyberpunk-2077-steins-gate-nvidia-gtx-750ti-gif-2709742967928015405

[hoary zodiac]

I'm pretty sure it had issues even on Turing

[opaque sedge]

https://tenor.com/view/umm-awkward-say-what-what-was-that-gif-5424377

[frigid stag]

idk my friend ran it fine on his card

[hoary zodiac]

What is "fine"

[opaque sedge]

I pressed too many funny buttons thats why

[frigid stag]

60 fps 1080p

[opaque sedge]

Monster hunter wilds getting below 60 frames on a 4070super with an internal render res of 1720x720p

[hoary zodiac]

That doesn't make it any better

[opaque sedge]

FAK U CRAPCOM

[hoary zodiac]

Neither of these are good

[opaque sedge]

I HOPE U GO BANKRUPT

[frigid stag]

its not just the fps that game is broken

[opaque sedge]

I was being sarcastic

Saying that the game doesn’t run fine

[nocturne flicker]

It also got that rep because they promised a last gen console release and it was garbage

[abstract oyster]

I didnt have any issues on monster hunter wilds thankfully

[frigid stag]

they did and then pulled it away from the ps4

[hoary zodiac]

That's the whole game in general

They over promised and under delivered

[frigid stag]

gave people refunds

[hoary zodiac]

Shouldn't have made those claims if they couldn't deliver

[frigid stag]

it was getting like 15-20 fps on ps4

[hoary zodiac]

They got what they deserved

[opaque sedge]

Oh yeah there’s a lot of obv cut content if u have a keen eye for stories in the game

[frigid stag]

on ps4 pro 30-45 apprently

[hoary zodiac]

I don't

[opaque sedge]

I do unfortunately

[hoary zodiac]

Have not played and will not play

[opaque sedge]

WHY NOT BRUH

It’s genuinely a good game

Now

[hoary zodiac]

Will not support an industry that releases slop

[nocturne flicker]

And that is part of the problem because they overhyped it

[hoary zodiac]

The whole game was overhyped

They stretched themselves way too thin

And as a result the release was slop

Compared to what they promised

If I paid $60+ for that game at launch I would've been pissed

[opaque sedge]

Me rn

[opaque sedge]

Oh yeah i’m pretty pissed at crapcom atm

[hoary zodiac]

I'm talking about cyberpunk

But yes

Also applies to monster hunter

[opaque sedge]

Got hard muted in the wilds maincord 💀

Dont tell theo

[hoary zodiac]

The consumer should not have to pay $60+ for slop

If the studio wasn't capable of delivering what they promised

They shouldn't have promised it

[misty sparrow]

then again if they fixed the game similar to a NMS situation I think it's justified to support that

[opaque sedge]

Nah still wait for heavy sales

[hoary zodiac]

At least they didn't completely coward out after launch

It still doesn't justify the launch

But it's not the worst case scenario

[frigid stag]

let me guess its console users who dont even know what fps is

[opaque sedge]

Oh my sweet summer child its so much worse

Had people there saying the game ran fine

[frigid stag]

lmao

[opaque sedge]

You wanna know what their definition for fine was

[frigid stag]

30 fps?

[hoary zodiac]

This is why I don't buy AAA games

[opaque sedge]

35fps locked with 4x frame gen resulting in 140 on a 5060ti

[frigid stag]

XDD

[opaque sedge]

One idiot genuinely said that

And guess what

[hoary zodiac]

I will not support an industry that charges $60-70+ for slop content that runs like crap on the latest hardware

[frigid stag]

hes probably on like 80ms lag

[opaque sedge]

He said air coolers for cpus are inadequate

[hoary zodiac]

Does he have a 14400f too

[frigid stag]

might as well use voice commands for the frame rendering

[hoary zodiac]

I think the whole AIO vs air cooler debate is pretty stupid

Imo the aesthetic is the only factor here

[opaque sedge]

[hoary zodiac]

Unless it's a 14900k

[north crescent]

Ikr. No cooler best

[frigid stag]

what cpu does he have

[opaque sedge]

Forgot but dont think it was intel

[hoary zodiac]

If you have a 14900k or something that puts out a crap ton of heat

Yeah AIO starts to make sense

[opaque sedge]

He said that comment for a build list someone posted

Guess what cpu that list had

[hoary zodiac]

But otherwise even the $30 RK120 is way way more than adequate for most CPUs

[opaque sedge]

7500f

[hoary zodiac]

That can be cooled with a single tower bruh

Even a stock cooler

[opaque sedge]

And the list had a single tower

[frigid stag]

you might as well delid higher end amd cpus the ihs is so thick

[hoary zodiac]

That's perfectly fine

[opaque sedge]

Dude really said not enough was spend for cooling

😭

That server was the rotten vale from mhworld

[frigid stag]

an aio is like 60 buckd

[opaque sedge]

Thermalrights sure

[north crescent]

Buddy wants some $300 C*rsair AIO?

[opaque sedge]

Good value

[frigid stag]

thats not unreasonable

[hoary zodiac]

I think people online don't understand the concept of "spending more money doesn't always get better performance"

[opaque sedge]

And good performance

[hoary zodiac]

To be fair a RK120 is $30

[frigid stag]

ive seen even funnier things

[hoary zodiac]

It's half the price and will still be overkill for a 7500f

[frigid stag]

some mf paid like 6 grand for his 4090 pc last year. shilling corsair ram being the best

[hoary zodiac]

It's only aesthetics at play here

[nocturne flicker]

It also makes sense in situations where longer saturation times are useful

[frigid stag]

bro had 5600mhz ddr5

[hoary zodiac]

Like if he was arguing aesthetics yeah

But if he wants to argue performance

[north crescent]

Locked pmic my beloved

[hoary zodiac]

That thing's not going to get near throttling

[hoary zodiac]

Was it cl40 too

[opaque sedge]

Omg bruh… please tell me he had an x3d cpu

[frigid stag]

idk probably cl36

[hoary zodiac]

AHAHAHAHHA

That is atrocious

[frigid stag]

yeah

[hoary zodiac]

For 5600

[north crescent]

Was it four dimms?

[frigid stag]

has a 7800x3d

[opaque sedge]

I have one too

[nocturne flicker]

As do I

[frigid stag]

“its 2x faster than a i7 bro”

[hoary zodiac]

He probably had a ROG cheap plastic X chipset too

[nocturne flicker]

5800x3d

[opaque sedge]

When microcenter bundles were good

[hoary zodiac]

Meanwhile the humble B650 Eagle AX could run an X3D fine with it's chad 12 phase vrms

[frigid stag]

told him you can run faster ram on intel and beat his cpu. bro thought you need liquid cooling or nitrogen for 7600mhz

[hoary zodiac]

No

That board is overpriced

Garbage

That's not worth $170

[opaque sedge]

LOOK AT THE PRICE OF THE CPU BRUH

ITS A BUNDLE

[nocturne flicker]

ASUS and ASUS Tuf is garbage

[hoary zodiac]

Yeah still garbage board

My argument still stands

[frigid stag]

like i dont get how u can pay almost 6 grand and not research how this stuff works

[hoary zodiac]

Not worth $170

The whole bundle is worth it but $170 for that board is outrageous

[frigid stag]

i think he got it partially liquid cooled but it was all corsair build kits for water cooling

[opaque sedge]

For a 7800x3d with a usable board and decent ram for 480 is a good price

[hoary zodiac]

That's not the point

The point is charging $170 for that board is stupid

[nocturne flicker]

Tuf boards frequently have or they did last I check spontaneous issues where parts of the board malfunction at or shortly after installation

[opaque sedge]

Dont think b650 atx boards were any cheaper during the time tbh

[hoary zodiac]

Still not worth $170

[opaque sedge]

Yeah bad bios

[hoary zodiac]

For mediocre vrms

[opaque sedge]

Yeah sadly they dont bundle gigabyte boards with x3d cpus now

[frigid stag]

remember when they came out those boards were like 300 bucks almost

[opaque sedge]

Its asus

[hoary zodiac]

Now, several months ago

[opaque sedge]

And msi i think

[hoary zodiac]

It's worth $140 at most

[hoary zodiac]

Asus plastic moment

I love paying double for plastic

[nocturne flicker]

For AM4, I personally had two TUF boards just have stuff randomly fail and when I was looking at AM5 it was a frequent complaint for specifically the Tuf boards

[frigid stag]

the strix ones were like 500

for b650e

[hoary zodiac]

Hey

For the low low price of $500

You get a seven segment display

That probably costs them a couple cents

[frigid stag]

and like 800 for crosshair with some led display

nah no led screen on strix

[hoary zodiac]

Wait

IT DOESN'T HAVE A SEVEN SEGMENT DISPLAY

SCAM

Literally just cheap plastic 💀

[frigid stag]

theyre cheaper now only like 250 iirc

[hoary zodiac]

You say that but

Compare that to the $150 board

💀

Pretty much the same thing but with less cheap plastic

[frigid stag]

i mean it has better vrms and other features

[hoary zodiac]

Not worth $250

I can get a whole X chipset

[opaque sedge]

Oh right those got cheaper too

[remote geode]

i once was in a buffet and i fell in love with this gravy

[hoary zodiac]

I'm taking those pcie lanes

[remote geode]

and now i just keep making it

[opaque sedge]

Gigabyte reminds me

[remote geode]

😋

[opaque sedge]

They released an oled 1440p monitor china only atm for the equivalent of 4 us hundies

[hoary zodiac]

https://pcpartpicker.com/product/mhWJ7P/gigabyte-x870-eagle-wifi7-atx-am5-motherboard-x870-eagle-wifi7

Brb checking vrms

[frigid stag]

it would be worth it a lot if you could actually run faster ram and get more performance on those higher end boards

but 6400 1:1 still best

compared to 8000 2:1 in games

[hoary zodiac]

Ok to asus's credit

The vrms are slightly better

Oh wait

[frigid stag]

asrock has some decent ones too

[hoary zodiac]

Eh

I wouldn't trust asrock

With an X3D

[frigid stag]

taichu is nice

yea i wouldnt recommend it with a zen 5 cpu

maybe the 600 series boards dont melt tho

[opaque sedge]

They finally had good rep too right…

Rip asrock

[hoary zodiac]

But then again

The vrms are slightly worse

But it's $189

So

🤷‍♂️

[lone mango]

They still kill chips

Just way more with 800

[hoary zodiac]

Oh wait

They're both around the $180-200 range

Hmm

Goose what do you think

[opaque sedge]

Asus boards are shitty with free rgb software like openrgb btw

[hoary zodiac]

Gigabyte X870 wifi 7 or Strix B650E-E Wifi

[opaque sedge]

Bruh

[hoary zodiac]

I feel like it's down to pcie lanes

[opaque sedge]

The gigabyte duh

[hoary zodiac]

Well it's not that clear cut

The vrms are slightly worse

[opaque sedge]

Wouldn’t the x870 have more?

[hoary zodiac]

And the eagle costs slightly more

[hoary zodiac]

Yes

[lone mango]

For some reason I really want that 9070 for $550

[hoary zodiac]

It depends if the pcie lanes are the deciding factor or the vrms are

But at the same time

Literally both of these boards can drive X3Ds fine so

[opaque sedge]

Wbt my board?

[hoary zodiac]

What board

[opaque sedge]

Asus tuf b650-E wifi

[north crescent]

Last time I tried it was just a bit more setup or smth. Worked fine otherwise

But that was am4 era

[hoary zodiac]

Oops cropped it out

I mean it's not the worse

Just not worth $170

It's solid but definitely not worth $170

just looking at vrms

[opaque sedge]

Still got me that cpu for 2 hundies thx to it

[hoary zodiac]

I'm not looking at that

I'm looking at a scenario where a consumer walks into microcenter and just buys that board

In your specific case it's a good deal

[acoustic palm]

hi gang

[opaque sedge]

Icic

[acoustic palm]

whats the daily debate

[opaque sedge]

Ur

Cough excuse me

[hoary zodiac]

When I said it's not worth $170

[lone mango]

This $550 9070 is tempting me

[hoary zodiac]

I was looking at individual price

[acoustic palm]

ooooooh

where

[hoary zodiac]

The bundle is worth it

[lone mango]

Newegg

[hoary zodiac]

Even with mediocre ram it would be worth

[lone mango]

I sent in deals

[hoary zodiac]

Because the overall price/perf is significantly better

[lone mango]

Even though its two fan, it is still not hot

[opaque sedge]

They’ve started skimping on ram on the newer bundles

[hoary zodiac]

$170 isn't the worst price for a B650 with 12 phase either

So

[lone mango]

Sapphire made an efficient design this generation

[hoary zodiac]

It's not that atrocious

Just overpriced

[misty sparrow]

I was thinking about it too, but realized I had a 3060Ti and don't care that much

[opaque sedge]

Cl36 with speeds lower than 6000 mhz iirc

[acoustic palm]

it is

[hoary zodiac]

Which is completely outweighed by the X3D

It's suboptimal priced I'll say that

(motherboard)

[hoary zodiac]

Bundles exists half the time to get rid of garbage nobody wants

[opaque sedge]

Most pc parts nowadays

[heady plinth]

Why would it have more?

[acoustic palm]

what bundle

[opaque sedge]

Higher end board chipset

[acoustic palm]

mc?

[hoary zodiac]

It is literally listed on the specifications of the X870 chipset

It has more because that's AMD designed X870 to have more

[heady plinth]

They shifted the names from 600. X870e gets a double chipset, x870 does not. Only difference from a b650e is the mandatory usb4.

[heady plinth]

Different models can have different layouts and allocations for how they use lanes but it doesn't have more.

[frigid stag]

its funny how the x670/e is better in some ways

[heady plinth]

Looks like hardware unboxed agrees with me.

[opaque sedge]

Oh right like asrock

[heady plinth]

What about asrock?

[opaque sedge]

Think their boards have different pcie lanes or smth i forgot

[lone mango]

Its getting 70c hotspot in this video im watching

Thats nice

[acoustic palm]

damn

pull a froog

@upper rain make him do it

[lone mango]

Edge is 48 lmao

[nocturne flicker]

Still has randomly dying mobo components

[lone mango]

Such a delta

[heady plinth]

No. Afaik, they did make the only b650 with a gen 5 slot and the only b850 with a gen 4 slot. Those were optional though. Closest thing I can think of to what you might means.

[hoary zodiac]

I'm confused here

You'll still be able to use more PCIE lanes on X870 than you would on B650 no?

[heady plinth]

No. They're the same. X670, x670e, x870e had a double chipset and 8 extra lanes available routed into it. Typically they'd have some extra/faster USB ports and an extra m.2 slot.

Always just look at the spec of each board though, what you get will vary by model

X870 has guaranteed pcie 5 and USB 4 on the rear. That's the only differences from b650.

[hoary zodiac]

Are the "8 extra lanes" not more pcie lanes?

[heady plinth]

That's only on x870e, not x870.

[hoary zodiac]

Ok that's fair

[heady plinth]

They changed the naming pattern and shifted things up a tier. A620 basically turned in b840 too.

[hoary zodiac]

That does bring up another question

Why the hell did AMD made X870 into a glorified B850

[heady plinth]

💵

[hoary zodiac]

Actually a scam

This is actually disgusting

[lone mango]

Yeah 800 kinda mid fr

[hoary zodiac]

There is zero reason to get it over B650

So basically

Going back to the strix

The strix is actually better

[lone mango]

X870 is really more like b850e

[hoary zodiac]

Because we're taking pcie lanes out of the equation

[heady plinth]

$200 for the b650e strix is better than $200 for an eagle yeah.

[lone mango]

That moment when x670 has more lanes than x870

[icy ore]

[hoary zodiac]

Not even that it's like $189 vs $200

[heady plinth]

Better vrm, upgraded audio. Unless you care about the usb4 ports it's just better.

[hoary zodiac]

Cheaper and better vrms

I'd rather just spend $150 on an b650 eagle and not spend more money but like

Jesus christ the $190-200 range doesn't look good at all

[heady plinth]

Depends what's on sale. X670e tomahawk has been around there recently.

[hoary zodiac]

X870 is a ripoff

[hoary zodiac]

Even X670 would be way better in terms of features if I'm reading this chart correctly

You should actually get more lanes no?

https://pcpartpicker.com/product/4jKscf/msi-x670e-gaming-plus-wifi-atx-am5-motherboard-x670e-gaming-plus-wifi

Gonna check vrms brb

[heady plinth]

It can be. Does t necessarily mean will be. There were lower end x670 too that didn't come close to fully utilizing what they had available. Gotta create product segmentation.

[fair onyx]

Anybody know any good places to buy a PCIe gen 4 bifurcation riser?

[hoary zodiac]

Eh

Kinda mediocre in terms of vrms

[heady plinth]

That's not mediocre. It's very overkill even for a 9950x or 7950x.

[hoary zodiac]

Yeah but compared to B650s around the same price

[heady plinth]

14x 80a is a lot more than you could ever need.

[hoary zodiac]

Well yes but

If we're just looking at vrms

I'd rather buy a cheaper B650

[heady plinth]

Vrm once it's a little past good enough isn't gaining you anything. Just look at connectivity features and save yourself some stress.

[hoary zodiac]

I guess you get some more lanes

[heady plinth]

That also doesn't really matter. You want to look at what they're used for.

[arctic lily]

what is going on

[fair onyx]

I need to find a PCIe gen 4 x 2x 8 lane splitter with a built in PCIe switch, if anybody knows where to get something like that. I have a feeling they will be very expensive though :<

[arctic lily]

we got sherlock holmes

[hoary zodiac]

You're looking at enterprise hardware

I don't think you're going to find a supplier by asking in newegg

[fair onyx]

A simple PCIe splitter? That's a common thing

Look at this product I found on google.com https://www.google.com/search?ibp=oshop&q=PCI-E 4.0 X16 1 to 2 Expansion Card Gen4 Motherboard Split Card PCIe-Bifurcation X16 to X8X8 Adapter Replacement&prds=catalogid%3A4853703325833914371%2Cgpcid%3A11582901780236438771%2CheadlineOfferDocid%3A-6772186896873528771%2CimageDocid%3A9971988461476318658%2Cmid%3A576462860244124976%2Cmno%3A5%2Cpvo%3A25%2Cpvt%3Ahg%2Csori%3A0&pvorigin=25&hl=en&gl=us&shndl=37&shmd=H4sIAAAAAAAA_7XMTU7CQBjG8ShhwxFcvReglQYMNCGmRSQY-bDtosFFnS_oKJ0Zpy8Jsuq1uA1HoY1nYPs8-f865_uOWU_m3Sn0nUdIe0_QA9TgwfRoiCqlVjAhlsNMqD4sNObCUt0MsdlL_P_qXnRDuT1YRrApGqZG0mE6hIATg8JCJMyeMFEIhQ-fOaLxXRc9Z1di3TCH6cKVBdmJ8vl3jFT5wZKPZiyevw7eYpm9bPLTSQ5qgPKlTULvz26SLT3Q5CcKk8x756soHn1_BJl_Szyt2l-X1rFqV3eX1hX_KocMPAEAAA&shmds=v1_AdeF8KgpxuixJDlCxlJMG6n_uaUmi19iEDfTrxRaZ2hfUS0bxQ&shem=pvflt&source=sh%2Fx%2Fprdct%2Fhdr%2Fm1%2F2&kgs=c59e6e5997d66bc7

Breh

[rancid juniper]

What a link

[hoary zodiac]

Oh wait

I was thinking of a different type of pcie switch

I was thinking of something like this

[fair onyx]

I need a splitter with a split chip on it, so I can use it to split my PCIe on a non bifurcated motherboard

[hoary zodiac]

You're just running gen 4 with gen 4 lanes right?

[acoustic palm]

😭

[fair onyx]

Yeah

Just wanna split from 1 16x to 2 8x

[hoary zodiac]

Yeah I was thinking of something different

Like running gen 4 with gen 5

[lone mango]

Are returns free though

[fair onyx]

Ohhhh, no haha

[hoary zodiac]

I don't think there is demand for that kind of product

[fair onyx]

I know they exist, I just wasnt sure if anybody has tried any here

[hoary zodiac]

There's not enough demand for it to be easily accessible

It's most likely custom orders

For enterprise

Unless you want x4

[nocturne flicker]

https://www.amazon.com/JMT-Expansion-PCIe-Bifurcation-Spaced-Supply/dp/B0CVTNLL21?

$42 range on ebay after shipping too

[remote geode]

I'm bored

I wonder if my B580 can handle playing around with LLMs

[lone mango]

Does newegg actually charge restocking fees

[lone mango]

It should but it won't be fast

[remote geode]

i see

i wonder what this case is a clone of

[fair onyx]

I've been looking at some, but I don't think they are the right thing unfortunately

[fair onyx]

Ah yeah, unfortunately that's not the right thing :<

[fresh timber]

yp

@acoustic palm

@fair onyx wassup hommie

[lone mango]

yo

[fresh timber]

what do i do with my new woot iphone

[lone mango]

9070 for 550

i do not need it but this is very tempting

[lone mango]

idk i use phones like a normie

discord banking and linkedin

i do nothing fancy with phones

[remote geode]

so....

https://pcpartpicker.com/list/yDxBVF

i think i may have built a pretty mediocre system

[sinful blade]

@fresh timber welcome back

[fair onyx]

been good enough I guess

the boyfriend and I had our one year anniversary

[remote geode]

woohoo!

congratulations !!

[upper rain]

get it and MOD IT

[lone mango]

I’m gonna return my 9060 xt while I still can

The fans are gonna splurge fluid everywhere watch it happen

I have two days to do it

[sinful blade]

Wife and I had our one year marriage on the third
Anniversary gang

[velvet summit]

how long total

[fair onyx]

oh nice <3

Mine was on August 29th :3

[remote geode]

https://tenor.com/view/transmit-this-cat-when-they-least-expect-it-transmit-this-bunny-slow-loading-transmitting-fakeout-gif-532479633164265025

[lethal jasper]

• .-. .- -. ... -- .. - / - .... .. ... / -.-. .- - / .-- .... . -. / - .... . -.-- / .-.. . .- ... - / . -..- .--. . -.-. - / .. -

[misty sparrow]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/380251591418183680/1241100942242218134/slownet.gif

[sinful blade]

5 years

Okay

Someone help

[velvet summit]

Nice

[remote geode]

what is this

[sinful blade]

What is the correct answer

If you just say the touch display and fax, it’s incorrect

[royal crow]

Interesting cat ya got there😂

[sinful blade]

It’s for my work

[sinful blade]

Idk if I’m just blind

[velvet summit]

You forgot ethernet

[sinful blade]

But the Ethernet is on the 7301

[velvet summit]

Oh oh

[sinful blade]

Am I dumb

[velvet summit]

Automatic document feeder (adf)

[velvet summit]

Maybe some combination is wrong... Hmm

[sinful blade]

https://tenor.com/view/i-am-losing-my-grip-on-reality-i-have-gone-clinically-insane-my-descent-to-madness-is-complete-ive-gone-completely-mental-i-am-beyond-the-point-of-no-return-gif-23191724

[velvet summit]

Try all?

[sinful blade]

Incorrect

[velvet summit]

Damn

All but usb?

[sinful blade]

Okay what the frick

It was USB, Touch, and fax

[velvet summit]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-insane-gif-21702784

[sinful blade]

https://tenor.com/view/blinking-eyes-white-guy-blinking-meme-what-huh-gif-26334322

[velvet summit]

That doesn't seem right

[sinful blade]

It’s 100% not

[misty sparrow]

https://tenor.com/view/drake-computer-notebook-explaning-gif-21152267

[velvet summit]

???

[sinful blade]

This was the solution

[velvet summit]

So they're gonna gloss over the ADF

🧐

[sinful blade]

But as you can CLEARLY SEE
the usb is available on both models
So is the ADF

[velvet summit]

OH

[sinful blade]

Oh wait

[velvet summit]

I was reading the chart wrong?

[sinful blade]

The FRONT usb is only on the screen one

[velvet summit]

Damn

[sinful blade]

This thing is dumb as hell

[misty sparrow]

Why does your workplace want you to know the difference between these printers anyway?

[lone mango]

These lowball offers on my 6600

Even newegg trade in will give me more

[misty sparrow]

What sort of lowball offers are they giving you

[sinful blade]

I’ve learned so much about printers

These are all the classes I’ve been in

[lone mango]

100

[velvet summit]

Five dollars and a bacon cheeseburger

[misty sparrow]

$100?

[velvet summit]

I would go insane after comparing 262 printers

[sinful blade]

Thankfully

Its all HP products

[misty sparrow]

I'm pretty sure a 6600 is worth at least more than that

like $175

[sinful blade]

Literally nothing but HP

[velvet summit]

Damn

[lone mango]

That is what ebay told me to set but I did 160

[velvet summit]

No Xerox

[sinful blade]

Most new HP printers come with free 2 years worth of ink in the box

[misty sparrow]

so you're comparing shit printers

https://tenor.com/view/theyre-the-same-picture-the-office-pam-the-office-us-gif-20757621

[sinful blade]

If you guys need an hp printer, lmk
I got $100 off and a discount

[velvet summit]

Ink that dried up in a week?

[sinful blade]

Yes

Hp is dogwater
But it’s all my place carries

[velvet summit]

💀

Do you only sell HP printers and nothing else

[misty sparrow]

Dunder Mifflin if they only sold HP Printers

[sinful blade]

Nah
I work at staples

[velvet summit]

"hey babe let's go to the hp printer shop"

Oh

[sinful blade]

Staples has a big deal with staples

And hp it turns out

[velvet summit]

Wait isn't staples Canadian or am I tripping

[sinful blade]

I dunno

I only speak in printers

[misty sparrow]

I'm pretty sure they have some US locations

[velvet summit]

Oh it's american

[sinful blade]

https://tenor.com/view/cool-printer-printer-awesome-gif-11359060109894382566

[misty sparrow]

I'm happy we have liquid ink printers now

[velvet summit]

They just have a fair bit of stores in canada

[misty sparrow]

Cartridge printers were always a scam

[sinful blade]

I don’t own my own printer

[misty sparrow]

And I don't know why, but HP printers were always a hit or miss

[sinful blade]

They’re almost always garbage

[misty sparrow]

They always had problems

[velvet summit]

Can you print things for free as an employee

[sinful blade]

Nah, but I get discount
And I get rebates
And deals

[velvet summit]

Oh

Lame

Now that I think about it

[sinful blade]

However

I get access to two things

[velvet summit]

My house has pretty much only HP printers

Plus a brother and epson

[sinful blade]

SELLPRO and Intel Retail Edge Program

I can get free stuff from both

[velvet summit]

3 HP 1 brother 1 epson

Wait

[lone mango]

I have the epson et 3600

[velvet summit]

4 hp

[lone mango]

This thing is old but it has lasted a long time

[sinful blade]

They’re nearly on the 8000 series
I think it’s time for an upgrade

[lone mango]

We don't print enough for it to matter

ngl

[sinful blade]

That’s true