#tank-balance-discussion | WoT Blitz Official | Page 151

full token Feb 1, 2020, 6:06 AM

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MH is broken. It’s useless now. Doesn’t look like it’ll be getting fixed any time soon, so it’s no point using it now. If players are bothering you ingame, report them to the customer service with a ticket. MH will not do anything to them, and don’t expect much of it either

crystal spoke Feb 1, 2020, 6:31 AM

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It's not broken it just never did much to begin with it only mutes after too many complaints (not sure how many)

noble siren Feb 1, 2020, 6:59 AM

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@twilit crystal I would like to see Maus receiving buff on the armor behind the tracks to the point where only Tds can pen there.

forest heath Feb 1, 2020, 1:07 PM

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Monthly reminders that the predator UM needs to be buffed

cold holly Feb 1, 2020, 2:00 PM

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Pls balanced collector's tanks T1-T8

fathom vault Feb 1, 2020, 3:26 PM

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Seriously how a light tank with missile, OP APCR, anti-HE skirts and eventually have armor can pass the balance test?

full token Feb 1, 2020, 3:36 PM

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One of the testers here said something about the missile system during test being quite different with lower damage, and some bugs and unreliability, which made testers use much fewer of them, and so WG tried to improve the missiles. I guess the spaced armor and Apcr etc seemed fine to them then

noble siren Feb 1, 2020, 4:32 PM

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@fathom vault how is the APCR of Sheridan OP and HE protection against HE makes the tank OP

plush trellis Feb 1, 2020, 5:22 PM

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@noble siren big bro momento. The fact that it can rival tds pen. Making hulldown and super heavies useless. Come on dude 😂 plus keeping light perks while having good armor. 😂 😂 👌

indigo knot Feb 1, 2020, 5:27 PM

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Actually even if you remove missiles and give it similar KPF70 gun heat pen it will be a solid tank

night thunder Feb 1, 2020, 5:27 PM

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Well some suggestion to the current tier x meta so its balanced:

M48 Patton: Buff its reload by around 0.3 and increase turret thickness by 20mm frontally and maybe sides ?.

T110e4: increase reload speed a bit ? Cuz its least competitive td

Sheridan: nerf the atgm pen to around 280 and reduce average damage to 460 perhaps. The fact that it can frontally pen is 7 turret and maus upper plate is absurd so we need that to be checked.

Is 7: needed a tad of mobility buff and perhaps accuracy to make it unique as atm its the least competitive ht because some tanks overshadowed it.

Object 140: reduce reload by 0.3 ? So it can compete better in current meta as well.

Fv215b 183: what i have in mind for 183 is maybe just increase dispersion but buff mobility slightly

4202: Slight dpm buff ?

Stb: nerf side armor :V

regal grove Feb 1, 2020, 5:32 PM

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60 km/h Grille day 43

plush trellis Feb 1, 2020, 5:37 PM

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@regal grove yes

unique scaffold Feb 1, 2020, 5:42 PM

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So make the 183 even less accurate and make it slightly faster what a great idea

night thunder Feb 1, 2020, 5:42 PM

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Well yes it will make it less campy but still retain its main trait which is to deal absurd damage.

ah that would just be making life difficult for everyone as its harder to kill if thats the case. @autumn zodiac

autumn zodiac Feb 1, 2020, 5:44 PM

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I say nerf the camo further and give it more Armor

karmic steeple Feb 1, 2020, 5:45 PM

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Delete it from the game and add something easier to balance

full token Feb 1, 2020, 5:47 PM

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Like a badger which would also fit the line better, but that option is gone. Or make up a fake tank and add it in

jade cargoBOT Feb 1, 2020, 6:10 PM

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dynoSuccess HornyUnicorn#3127 has been warned.

unique scaffold Feb 1, 2020, 6:10 PM

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Shame people can't make valid points without cursing

dense yoke Feb 1, 2020, 6:18 PM

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List of tanks I want a buff on:

▪Gib is7 it's speed back, buff it's gun handling. gib more 100 more hp and gib 10+ hull. it will be on top there.

▪Make the e100 lowerplate a little stronger and give it a stronger turret aswell.

▪Make maus checks Strong

▪Buff vk 75 sidesarmor.

✅ : Yes, please(all without speed)
❌ : Don't give it those buffs for is7

👍 do the buff for e100
👎 Don't do it for e100

🇾 : Yes better checks for maus.
🇳 : Don't buff it's cheeks

😁 : buff vk 75's sides
😠 : Don't buff vk 75

night thunder Feb 1, 2020, 6:22 PM

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@dense yoke e100 is already a good novel tank doesnt need a buff rlly. The vk is also a good novel tank. If u buff the maus cheeks its gonna be rushed anyways so kinda pointless

round sundial Feb 1, 2020, 6:25 PM

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E100 is currently one of the worst T10 tanks in the game, it has too weak armour and all it has left is alpha dmg for a heavy, but I find that E4 can do everything E100 can and better with the exception of sidescraping.

unique scaffold Feb 1, 2020, 6:35 PM

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He just wants to buff the heavies because he’s mad his weak spots keep getting hit even though they are supposed to

dense yoke Feb 1, 2020, 6:36 PM

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@night thunder I personally think the e100 is beyond trash. I would rather have on it a turret buff, vk sides is meh.

@unique scaffold I don't own any of these tanks except is7. it would be very nice to have a buff on them to make them more competitive.

night thunder Feb 1, 2020, 6:38 PM

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@round sundial well thats why i say its a novel tank its gonna be excelling on maps like himmels/dynasty where u can use some sidescrapping position to hold points.

E4 is erm well u dont go frontline in td thats a general known fact but that doesnt mean u should camp either. E4 is basically ez pen with not that good side armor.

Vk 72 is alright as its decent at rushing

nimble zodiac Feb 1, 2020, 6:40 PM

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Maus does not need buffed cheeks, all you have to do is angle em

noble siren Feb 1, 2020, 6:44 PM

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E100 is kinda mediocre now and kinda keeps up with the new tanks.

Vk72 is the definition of wastes 6 milion and garage slot. The tanks just sucks, the gun is bad the armor doesn't exist, the speed is kinda ok. When I see this tank as enemy it is free damage for me.

Maus doing kinda "fine" too like E100 but easily beatable by other heavies cause the gold ammo. And with that weak spot behind the tracks is just like, miss the lfp pen the tracks.

Is7 can use only slightly gun stats buff.

karmic steeple Feb 1, 2020, 6:49 PM

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@fathom vault please post that paragraph again if you can w/o the bad word so it doesn’t get removed it had some great points

clear fulcrum Feb 1, 2020, 6:50 PM

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so ima just put it out there...but when are premium heavy tanks from t6-7 going to get an armor buff... because in all honesty the premium are now getting power creeped...a good example is the vk 45 03...which for its tier it provides an adequate specialty at everything...but its turret armor is in need of a drastic buff...however instead of buffing the turret i wanted to put it out there that the turret should be completely changed or at least another module introduced which provided a turret similar to the vk 45 02 A researchable turret...because the current Porsche turret is not exactly fit to bounce shots and such like normal german heavies do on the majority of the time

nimble zodiac Feb 1, 2020, 7:02 PM

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Maybe beef up the VK 45.02 a bit

chrome rapids Feb 1, 2020, 7:55 PM

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nerf T92E4

full token Feb 1, 2020, 7:59 PM

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What tank is a T92e4?

dense yoke Feb 1, 2020, 8:17 PM

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I think he means t92e1

bold dagger Feb 1, 2020, 8:21 PM

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because the T26E4 needs anything but a nerf lol

latent snow Feb 1, 2020, 9:21 PM

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Vk4503 feels like pre buff tiger 2. Big, no armor and bad turret

karmic steeple Feb 1, 2020, 9:24 PM

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Let’s leave it where it is 😅

nimble zodiac Feb 1, 2020, 9:38 PM

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I think it’s fair to say VK 45.03 is outperformed by Tiger I ._.

zealous juniper Feb 1, 2020, 9:40 PM

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can we get a ping indicator in the garage. it cant be that hard.. we get one in battle so why not let us see what our packet loss is before even pushing battle. is it because this game is so trash it needs the players? to make teams? or is it because the developers are brain dead?

flat bane Feb 1, 2020, 10:27 PM

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Buff the frontal hull armor on the superstructure of the HO-RI to 280mm and give it a gun mantel. Also buff the sides to 100mm. Also increase the gun depression form left to right a bit. Also buff the HP to 1900

acoustic shard Feb 1, 2020, 11:09 PM

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It's not even in the game yet dude...

steel plaza Feb 1, 2020, 11:16 PM

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It's not enough that tanks from the tree don't earn anything, and if they earn it, they don't have enough for add-ons, they also make such a number

📎 Screenshot_20200202-000508.jpg

karmic steeple Feb 1, 2020, 11:19 PM

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Honestly with the way things have been being buffed recently why don’t we lay off the buffs for a bit? Especially on a tank that isn’t coming out for awhile

steel plaza Feb 1, 2020, 11:31 PM

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I can't play a battle because I don't have enough extras. Wwrryyy

Thx for imfo @karmic steeple

karmic steeple Feb 1, 2020, 11:32 PM

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@steel plaza I literally don’t speak that language on your screen and your English is a little off
Sorry man

nimble zodiac Feb 1, 2020, 11:33 PM

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Use credit boosters, premium account certificates, or get a premium, a recommended is the Löwe. I wanna see how Ho-Ri competes normally before considering changes

steel plaza Feb 1, 2020, 11:41 PM

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@nimble zodiac i dont must.

@karmic steeple it's Google Language...
Poliglotka fiu. Hi.

📎 IMG_20200202_003725.jpg

karmic steeple Feb 1, 2020, 11:42 PM

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Still have no idea what’s happening dude lol

regal grove Feb 1, 2020, 11:45 PM

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That moment when you’re complaining about credits even though you have 103 days of premium and more premium tanks than my garage

grand pulsar Feb 2, 2020, 12:18 AM

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Lol

steel plaza Feb 2, 2020, 12:30 AM

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Ok (send 10min)
Thank you for the information :) @Xela9#4961 @MS-1#1707 @xXABCXx#8458

flat bane Feb 2, 2020, 4:17 AM

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No dumb, you spammed this in every chat

karmic steeple Feb 2, 2020, 4:17 AM

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Can a mod get this man

simple idol Feb 2, 2020, 4:28 AM

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Old premium tanks need buff

karmic steeple Feb 2, 2020, 4:32 AM

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What is that even supposed to mean

flat bane Feb 2, 2020, 4:40 AM

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He's gone finally

torpid furnace Feb 2, 2020, 4:59 AM

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By the way WG... this is unacceptable. This guy has 48 battles and 56% WR. 3 premiums. Spamming gold. THIS HAS TO STOP NOW

📎 bs.PNG

nimble zodiac Feb 2, 2020, 5:20 AM

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Nah, just a reroll and some money spent. I don’t see anything wrong honestly, besides irrelevancy ._.

drifting depot Feb 2, 2020, 6:00 AM

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Ma man this isn't even the place to talk about that lelel

plush trellis Feb 2, 2020, 6:00 AM

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"Spamming gold". You know it can also be reverted to credits too

flat bane Feb 2, 2020, 6:06 AM

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Lol

stoic light Feb 2, 2020, 6:30 AM

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no way thats a re roll with that trash damage

nimble zodiac Feb 2, 2020, 6:51 AM

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Yes it is a reroll, but most of them are actually good. Can someone save Panther II from being a cardboard box?

crystal spoke Feb 2, 2020, 7:10 AM

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Depends if someone builds a replica out of metal

harsh ravine Feb 2, 2020, 7:23 AM

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The Panther has better armor, more DPM than the Panther 2, which is really sad coming from the balancing department

formal vale Feb 2, 2020, 9:15 AM

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Imagine complaining about people spamming premium ammo anymore (aside from the ATGMs). Smh

drifting depot Feb 2, 2020, 10:32 AM

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I shall shake your hand sir

forest heath Feb 2, 2020, 10:38 AM

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The predator UM still needs to be buffed, it already suffers from the poor gun depression making it only useful in select areas of the map. Just give it a penetration buff on standard armor piercing from 165mm base to 170 base. This is probably the most humble balance suggestion in the whole chat for the last month

drifting depot Feb 2, 2020, 11:28 AM

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Predator the big fat chonky boi change my mind

forest heath Feb 2, 2020, 11:44 AM

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I don’t disagree with that notion, nor do I want that to change. But a buff is long overdue, since the tier VII landscape has changed so much it’s hard for the chonky boi to keep up

karmic steeple Feb 2, 2020, 1:28 PM

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I think you said s*** in there lol still

fathom vault Feb 2, 2020, 1:38 PM

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fine, I will repost that when I catch someone ask the devs to buff the T92.

karmic steeple Feb 2, 2020, 1:48 PM

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Yus

unique scaffold Feb 2, 2020, 4:27 PM

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new tanks need a nerf

soft spindle Feb 2, 2020, 6:13 PM

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Wow what a productive message

nimble zodiac Feb 2, 2020, 6:32 PM

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I think Predator needs it, besides (no pun intended) the sides are paper, who why allow such a weak front?

jade cargoBOT Feb 2, 2020, 7:25 PM

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dynoSuccess HornyUnicorn#3127 has been warned.

regal grove Feb 2, 2020, 7:47 PM

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60 km/h Grille day 44

noble siren Feb 2, 2020, 10:00 PM

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Grille needs that speed change my mind

compact nymph Feb 2, 2020, 10:05 PM

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Or just balance the WT and Grille so you can just swap their tiers, wich will be a better choice.
A WT with slightly more pen and accuracy along with faster reload will be a better T10 than the Grille is

Edit: I doubt that a speed buff would change anything to the fact is has worse traverse (barely better than an IS-7, but without the armor), worse gun depression, worse camo, no 360 degrees turret and atrocious gun bloom compared to the Waffenträger auf Pz IV, while still being a tier higher. @dense yoke

dense yoke Feb 2, 2020, 10:09 PM

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@compact nymph i like Hans Grüber idea. No offence and have a nice day.

lime adder Feb 2, 2020, 10:29 PM

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how do u pen vk 72

orchid grove Feb 2, 2020, 10:30 PM

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@lime adder Load gold and shoot the lower plate, or shoot the hull cheeks on the rear

mental pollen Feb 2, 2020, 10:31 PM

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Hello guys, is there any API developers here that can answer some questions about the API references ?

coarse harness Feb 2, 2020, 10:31 PM

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I'd rather have ether the same gun dep over the front as sideways or wider gun arc so you could work better on the ridge lines
Talking about the grille

noble siren Feb 2, 2020, 10:32 PM

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No reason to not give it the 60km/h speed cause for being so slow lost a battle with like 8k damage. Everything can catch with you, you have no armor, the mobility is generally trash on this tank.

mellow cape Feb 2, 2020, 10:33 PM

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@lime adder shoot here, even APCR from E50M pens it at this angle

📎 2020-02-02_20_32_39-Window.png

coarse dawn Feb 2, 2020, 11:26 PM

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@mellow cape Did you pen the side armor on that VK?

nimble zodiac Feb 3, 2020, 12:56 AM

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well yes but actually yes, buff it ._.

mellow cape Feb 3, 2020, 12:58 AM

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@coarse dawn Yes I shot the part below the turret which is rounded and weak when you angle it

flat bane Feb 3, 2020, 2:10 AM

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The T7-9 Japanese TDs need a buff

surreal hound Feb 3, 2020, 2:13 AM

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You know how the kv2 has no pen, well make the atgm tanks have a lower pen so people dont have to complain and the atgms are less common in matches for the balence of teams.

nimble zodiac Feb 3, 2020, 2:49 AM

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@surreal hound KV-2 has enough pen T-T

coarse dawn Feb 3, 2020, 2:58 AM

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Yeah don't know what you mean by KV2 has no pen

crystal spoke Feb 3, 2020, 3:12 AM

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It may have no pen by t10 standards but by t6 it's got plenty

coral dock Feb 3, 2020, 4:11 AM

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Not after its HE nerf not as good at all

nimble zodiac Feb 3, 2020, 4:26 AM

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It’s still good, it just can’t miraculously derp heavies from the front now.

compact nymph Feb 3, 2020, 6:05 AM

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Again, the KV-2 is not supposed to be good. Otherwise it would be even more overplayed. Same goes for the 183. They have high alpha and roughly everything else is pretty bad. They are fine in their current state

upper lodge Feb 3, 2020, 12:50 PM

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Please devs, add more armor to the gun mantlet of the obj 263, it would make the tank 10 times better

nimble zodiac Feb 3, 2020, 1:14 PM

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Sure, some heavies and the TDs can pen the mantlet, but there are so many weakspots: the sides if allowed to hit, and the deck is an overmatchable plate. The mantlet is a gamble to heavies and a few TDs

noble siren Feb 3, 2020, 1:59 PM

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Pffff ahahhahah you serious?

surreal hound Feb 3, 2020, 2:33 PM

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@nimble zodiac the kv2 cant pen like meds but to balance them from all the other they have less pen then the usual cause of the high damage per shot

autumn zodiac Feb 3, 2020, 5:50 PM

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I find it amusing that 76mm of HE pen isn't enough for some people in tier 6.

Calibrated shells should be used for the 152mm anyhow so if 84mm in tier 6 still isn't enough, it's a user Error

austere moat Feb 3, 2020, 5:54 PM

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So, apparently we have forgotten about a dead tank...
Let's take a look at the VK 30.02 D in comparison with the rest of the tier...
Miserable (145mm) penetration, some of the worst DPM at the tier, mediocre mobility, disgusting turret traverse, disgusting gun statistics, useless armor... May as well just remove the tank, it's that bad currently...

📎 unknown.png

karmic steeple Feb 3, 2020, 6:01 PM

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Only tank in the game below a 49% wr

autumn zodiac Feb 3, 2020, 6:09 PM

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If the Ace Bar for KV-2 doesn't show how it's still Overperforming than not much else can't.

📎 Screenshot_20200203-130800.png

unique scaffold Feb 3, 2020, 6:10 PM

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@autumn zodiac my dude u don't get an ace with such dmg and kills even with kv1s or E8

austere moat Feb 3, 2020, 6:16 PM

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Another issue in the present in the Black Prince... 56% winrate is.... yeaahhhhh

📎 unknown.png

jagged crescent Feb 3, 2020, 6:32 PM

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armor buff was dumb

autumn zodiac Feb 3, 2020, 7:09 PM

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@unique scaffold that Ace Bar is higher than a tier 10 average Ace Bar, E8 generally requires about 2.5k damage and about 3 kills for a mastery

austere moat Feb 3, 2020, 7:54 PM

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yeah, what the HELL is the meaning of that buff. PLEASE nerf it's DPM, or it's gun depression, or it's pen. That thing is WAY too much

coarse harness Feb 3, 2020, 7:55 PM

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It has the lowest AP pen out of every T7 tech tree heavy

dense yoke Feb 3, 2020, 8:06 PM

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@austere moat i like a challenge for the newbies to focus on.

austere moat Feb 3, 2020, 8:07 PM

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not lowest, but close to. And besides, it already spits dpm. Now it's just a lumbering titan. It's the KV-4tress of tier 7, and it has DPM instead of big boom damage

Let's just think:
If I can give 3500 damage 3 games in a row and only a first class in each, even though I got 4 kills in 1, and that's BEFORE it got an armor buff, what can it do NOW

Let's also think:
It can win a 1v1 versus most tier 8 tanks in the game currently, even some of the "OP Premiums" out of sheer DPM

coarse harness Feb 3, 2020, 8:37 PM

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Well if you are stupid enough to just sit in front of it on flat ground then you deserve it
But yeah the tank was great after the buff, OP with the consumables and now with the totally unnecessary armor buff it is even more broken

acoustic shard Feb 3, 2020, 9:13 PM

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How to Fix Tankenstien: Mobility buff, 20mm side armor buff. And A Reduction of the reload on the Big gun to 14.2 seconds running rammer

coarse harness Feb 3, 2020, 9:22 PM

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The armor buff is not that important but I agree with the rest

nimble zodiac Feb 3, 2020, 10:36 PM

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How about choose one of those, all would kinda overdo it

hollow basin Feb 3, 2020, 10:38 PM

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20mm of side armor is pretty specific

sour comet Feb 3, 2020, 11:03 PM

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Buff speed to t95

neon summit Feb 3, 2020, 11:03 PM

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Should obj 140 receive buff?

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Like the hatch make it a tiny bit smaller

untold marlin Feb 4, 2020, 12:13 AM

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Maybe, I rather have a pennetration buff for 140 though

regal grove Feb 4, 2020, 12:25 AM

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60 km/h Grille day 45

drifting depot Feb 4, 2020, 4:21 AM

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I mean, currently there's no reason to go for the obj140 over the t62a other than the speed, you know it has less armor worst gun less gun depression and stuff why not give it higher penetration and idk a little more acceleration?

sage geyser Feb 4, 2020, 4:31 AM

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Replace obj 140 with t-62, it has 4 gun depression and same armour. So choose accurate gun with-7 depression for t62a or -4 depression gun with bigger alpha for t62

latent snow Feb 4, 2020, 6:22 AM

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What? Obj has -6 of gun depression.
Am I missing something here?

warped wind Feb 4, 2020, 6:36 AM

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@latent snow Nope @sage geyser is wrong

sage geyser Feb 4, 2020, 6:37 AM

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@warped wind @latent snow I am saying replace obj 140 with t62, but it has 4 depression but 115mm gun

warped wind Feb 4, 2020, 6:46 AM

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@sage geyser Gun Depression on the Obj 140 is 6 deg

sage geyser Feb 4, 2020, 6:54 AM

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@warped windik that I am saying removing the obj 140 and replace it with T-62

So you have T-62 with 115mm gun and -4 depression
And the T-62A which we have in-game with -7gun depression but a 100mm gun

warped wind Feb 4, 2020, 6:56 AM

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@sage geyser wtf give teh 62 A 4 deg thats one hell of a nerf i dont thing that will work maybe just keep the 62A as is and giev the 140 a buff

round sundial Feb 4, 2020, 7:00 AM

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T62A is good rn, but overrated. STB is still miles better.

sage geyser Feb 4, 2020, 7:17 AM

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@warped wind omg when did I say give t62a 4 degrees

I am saying T-62 should replace the obj140
And leave the T-62A alone

The T-62 have bigger alpha than T-62A due to 115mm gun but at 4 degrees depression.
The T-62A will have the same old 100mm but at 7 degrees depression
Ugh why dose it take people so long to understand

warped wind Feb 4, 2020, 7:17 AM

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wont happen

austere moat Feb 4, 2020, 7:25 AM

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T-62 is a different tank from T-62A btw. Lol i personally would like to see something new in a buff to the 140... I, for one, am interested in what WG has planned for that tank. Extra dpm? More alpha? More traverse? Better view range?

distant river Feb 4, 2020, 7:27 AM

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The 140 just needs it's depression advantage back and it will have a reason to be played again. It was fairly balanced choice between the 2 with the 140 being more common because it was more flexible but that wouldn't be as big of a factor as the T62A is pretty flexible now.

unique scaffold Feb 4, 2020, 7:32 AM

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nah, leave it at 6 degrees but buff its turret and speed. Will be a better armoured and quicker tank with a worse gun and worse gun depression, simple.

iron hearth Feb 4, 2020, 9:36 AM

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Maybe a dpm buff , from 5.2 sec to 4.9 sec, or a gun handling buff (best option in my opinion)

drifting depot Feb 4, 2020, 10:10 AM

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Look, t62a gun and armor obj 140 speed and overall mobility, what about that?

unique scaffold Feb 4, 2020, 10:12 AM

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Im a noob in that game D:

distant river Feb 4, 2020, 10:46 AM

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@drifting depot T62A can take more hulldown positions and is much stronger in them as well has having a more accurate gun. The 140 only has 5kmph better top speed and worse effective hp/t, as well as better hull armour but you shouldn't be using that at all really.

@unique scaffold It will still be a T62A just without depression and still worthless

round sundial Feb 4, 2020, 10:49 AM

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I think maximov has a point. That does sound like a reasonable buff. Also T62A is quite overrated atm, yes it's good but it lacks severely when compared to STBs and even T22.

mellow cape Feb 4, 2020, 11:43 AM

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I think the 140 is fine personally

gleaming flicker Feb 4, 2020, 11:56 AM

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I don't feel much difference on t62A and obj.140 too. Because I don't play those tank Hull down all the time. I rather use it for agresive flank. But the recent buff made some significant changes into the gameplay of t-62A. I appreciate with it

open marlin Feb 4, 2020, 5:21 PM

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@sage geyser Why remove the 140? Just don’t play it since it’s not meta

nocturne mauve Feb 4, 2020, 5:56 PM

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Wow you guys cannot read

formal vale Feb 4, 2020, 6:14 PM

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The 140 does need a little buff imo. I've said it many times before and I'll say it again, just give it its old turret back. That way it has the armor to go hull down, but it can still be penned through the top (in exchange for top speed). The gun handling, traverse, speed, etc are already fine. The issue lies in the fact that the T-62A can easily poke ridgelines and be aggressive where the 140 is more team reliant.

Dont get me wrong, I love the 140, but it's kinda been left in the dust with all these 62A buffs.

austere moat Feb 4, 2020, 6:23 PM

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We think the 140's been "left in the dust" Let's take a nice little peek at the FV4202.
It needs something. Either reliable DPM on the L7A1 gun, or more reliable penetration on the L7B. What does the FV4202 do against the HE-immune Sheridan? Or the superheavies that are literally impenetrable to the L7B gun? Or if it has the L7A1, what does it do against the russian mediums that have 2 seconds better reload than it?
That tank has just been forgotten and left farther and farther behind. It's lucky if it keeps up with tier 9, if i am going to be honest, much less with 10s

And don't say it's fine. It's like the Leopard 1. In the right hands, it's a great tank, but those "right hands" are very rare and far between...

I would honestly be happy if they removed 1 second from the L7A1 reload, and add 20-30mm pen to the L7B's standard round. 255 mm pen is nearly useless at tier 10, and the L7A1's dpm is by far the worst of any T10 med, if I am correct. (Progetto has less, when used badly, but you get 2800 if you want to pen anything somewhat armored (HEAT) or you do get 3300 if you load APCR, and fight with meds.

unique scaffold Feb 4, 2020, 6:25 PM

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Go back to the glorious month where the 4202 had APCR, HEAT, and HESH all available for one gun.

coarse harness Feb 4, 2020, 6:42 PM

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255 pen is useless ?
That's new

random mist Feb 4, 2020, 6:43 PM

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I just have two things to ask from developers and that is to bring back the D.W.2 and make a credit event where we get a ton of credits

austere moat Feb 4, 2020, 6:43 PM

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255 pen is not enough when it comes to heavy tanks, which is the present meta 🤷

compact nymph Feb 4, 2020, 6:58 PM

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255 is the pen of the WT i've been using for over 300 battles, and I rarely had to use HEAT (less than 15 times)
#justaimbetter

austere moat Feb 4, 2020, 7:22 PM

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the WT is a tier 9 TD. The FV4202 is a tier 10 medium with very little useful armor.
Hm, I guess meds don't really like brawling with heavies, you have a point there. Still though, I feel like the L7B can't do jack versus superheavies, and the dpm isn't high enough without spamming HESH to make up for the lack of armor on the turret

formal vale Feb 4, 2020, 7:29 PM

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@austere moat use calibrated shells. That's pretty much standard nowadays ever since they nerfed tier 10 mediums and added the current equipment system we have now.

Edit: For reference, the E50M has 245mm of APCR pen. I use calishells and find no issue with the tank. The same goes for Russian meds, the Batchat, 30B, etc.

sour comet Feb 4, 2020, 8:19 PM

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Buff t95 please I find the armour to pointless on it.

round sundial Feb 4, 2020, 8:35 PM

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Actually, why not give the FV4202 a gun that has APCR, HEAT and HESH at once ? It will become quite versatile, but without broken armour, speed or DPM.

nocturne mauve Feb 4, 2020, 8:48 PM

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Seems an interesting idea, first tank with 2 premium ammo types

unique scaffold Feb 4, 2020, 9:01 PM

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Buff KV-1

austere moat Feb 4, 2020, 9:02 PM

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@round sundial It had that once. They had to nerf it because it was too broken
I personally would be A-OK with it, but we will see what happens

round sundial Feb 4, 2020, 9:03 PM

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@austere moat Times change, I believe with the current meta centered around strong turret tanks, and overall the strength of T10 meds increasing, I believe it would be ok and would give it an advantage not seen anywhere else.

keen junco Feb 4, 2020, 9:04 PM

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Nerf tiger 2

austere moat Feb 4, 2020, 9:24 PM

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hard disagree
Buffs to a lot of tanks would be acceptable, but don't remove any tanks, and nerfs are not necessary...in most cases... if we are buffing everything else

Ah, okay

unique scaffold Feb 4, 2020, 9:25 PM

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@austere moat this guys said that before in here many times I think it’s best to assume he himself doesn’t know what he’s saying

twilit crystal Feb 4, 2020, 9:39 PM

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uh 255 apcr is WAY different from 255 AP, 255 AP will always go through e100s lower plate, 255 APCR will ofen struggle

regal grove Feb 4, 2020, 10:34 PM

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60 km/h Grille day 46

frigid grove Feb 4, 2020, 11:01 PM

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Type 59 is the best.

austere moat Feb 4, 2020, 11:14 PM

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what's the shell normalization of APCR that makes that struggle so much? @twilit crystal
Like, what makes it so different from AP shell normalization?

twilit crystal Feb 4, 2020, 11:15 PM

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Its 2 vs 5 degrees which is pretty big

acoustic shard Feb 4, 2020, 11:33 PM

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Rate of Fire Buff needed For Tankenstien. From 16.8 down to 14 seconds of reload (with the 130 of cores). As well as a better power weight ratio, Hull and turret traverse. A decent increase to it's engine power top as well as average speed would make it a legit threat 12mm more pen to it's Normal ap shell and 5 or 6 more pen to it's prem ap would be good as well but not REALLY needed.

plucky hatch Feb 5, 2020, 9:58 AM

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48,59 my team average win rate, and other team have 53,27 average win rate, good balance....

unique scaffold Feb 5, 2020, 10:16 AM

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wow what a massive difference, totally game breaking and making it impossible to carry. omg. blame yourself first before blaming your team and you might, only might improve

junior wind Feb 5, 2020, 10:20 AM

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6 39-47% and me in my team and 5 60+ and 2 50+ in enemy team

unique scaffold Feb 5, 2020, 10:30 AM

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The only problem I have is constantly getting 30% platoons while the enemy gets a 65% platoon. That is bs and a lost game from the start.

noble siren Feb 5, 2020, 10:31 AM

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Why everyone say that the current meta is heavy and Td when from tier 7-10 I mostly see meds and light tanks. And in tier 10 1-4 heavies

noble siren Feb 5, 2020, 11:56 AM

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Can we buff the whole armor on Vk72 the flp, the fup and the sides. To the point that this tank can be considered as a heavy tank?

sleek pebble Feb 5, 2020, 12:05 PM

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either that , or give it mobility, or put down to tier8, as it is in WoT_PC

whoops, I meant VK90 😄

distant river Feb 5, 2020, 12:27 PM

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@plucky hatch Read the pinned messages and look at the average over more than 1 battle before complaining, it's RANDOM MM for a reason.

@junior wind and @unique scaffold same goes for you too, you only remember the bad teams you get so until you actually collect some data (which will prove you wrong) then don't say anything about teams, especially not in the channel where it literally says not to complain about MM.

@noble siren The meta has changed thanks to the ATGMs to include meds and lights, people just remember the painfully boring 3 heavy 3 TD meta because we've had it for so long

unique scaffold Feb 5, 2020, 12:30 PM

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defends ATGMs = argument even more invalid than people with anime profile pics

distant river Feb 5, 2020, 12:42 PM

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Right yeah all of what I said was defending ATGMs wasn't it, maybe try reading it again and understanding what I wrote?

unique scaffold Feb 5, 2020, 1:04 PM

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defends ATGMs = argument even more invalid than people with anime profile pics
@unique scaffold

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Players with anime profile pictures > players who make arguments with no factual basis.

ember thunder Feb 5, 2020, 1:09 PM

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put russian rear mounted tech tree tanks in the game

unique scaffold Feb 5, 2020, 2:01 PM

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Because a tank that has impenetrable frontal armour, HE protection, amazing mobility, huge alpha and can shoot you without exposing itself is completely balanced and anyone who complains is just salty and needs to learn how to adapt to this obviously unnecessary and broken introduction to the game. Oh, right, factual basis is only what mods say it is. No problem, please introduce arty into blitz, we can't wait.

#

And that concludes today's lesson on how to compose a strawman argument. Thank you to our guest teacher @unique scaffold

Now let's get into the "meat and potatoes" of what you said.

First you should clarify that you are talking about two different tanks.

The T92. Don't shoot the upper plate. The turret is an easy pen.
The Sheridan. Don't shoot it with HE. AP is an easy pen.
They alpha is definitely nice. It also comes with a 13-16 second reload depending on the tank. That should be plenty of time to put a serious hurting on the tank in question.
Hitting from cover. For every Iverson landing unbelievable shots there are 20 players putting missiles in the dirt. Secondly while the pen is high aiming via third person can be problematic. A quick turn of the turret or chassis can often times absorb the missile hit with minimal damage. Personally I rarely see a T92 or Sheridan shooting missiles as a benefit to the team. More often than not they are just poking holes in the ground. The missiles are an annoyance but they can be dealt with.

hollow basin Feb 5, 2020, 2:29 PM

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@unique scaffold yes artys would be awesome to have in game

noble siren Feb 5, 2020, 2:32 PM

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@unique scaffold finally someone with good arguments and not biased opinion for something!!!

burnt venture Feb 5, 2020, 4:21 PM

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@unique scaffold Just another point: these tanks sorta destroyed the meta though. Nowadays you either see camping lights trying to use missiles and being useless, or lights running through teams and using APCR while being chased by other lights. I think I'll go back to the heavy meta, thank you very much.
On another note, several tech tree tanks have been overperforming for three patches now, and WG refuses to fix them.
Standard B is still pretty broken because they only changed the gun handling and the mobility (a little). It still has the broken HE and still is better than the PTA in almost every way. Also, I completely disagree with the autoreloading mechanic. Enticing players to empty their clips beats the point of the mechanic.
Tiger II, no words needed here. Nerf the damn lower plate already.
Both the Foch and the Foch 155 need to have their old cupola weakspots back. Otherwise they are much too strong, and I'm tired of bouncing off of their cupolas with HT and TD AP rounds even when it says that you can pen. Spamming premium at weakspots is not fun, and a heavy should be able to pen an assault TD in the weakspot. Oh, and the Foch 155 gun nerf did jack. The autoloading gun should NOT have higher DPM, thank you. You either play with a two-shot autoloader with bad DPM or you play single shot with normal TD DPM. Can't have both, and the reduced alpha doesn't do anything if you just decrease the clip reload.

And its not like these problems are NEW or anything, these tanks have been overperforming for two or three patches now.

austere moat Feb 5, 2020, 4:56 PM

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🍿 battle of the titans 🍿

unique scaffold Feb 5, 2020, 5:05 PM

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@burnt venture I agree that the meta has been shifted. That being said I think that we are still in the midst of the transition. It is undeniably hectic out there right now but I'm starting to see signs of a new equilibrium being reached.

As far as the balance items you mentioned you'll get no argument from me on any of them.

forest heath Feb 5, 2020, 5:22 PM

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Regular reminder that the predator UM still needs a buff...
AP base pen from 165-170 ( this change must happen)
Buff Frontal armor ( this change would be great but I want the AP buff first and foremost, I would still be satisfied if the predator only got a penetration buff)

chilly crane Feb 5, 2020, 6:16 PM

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Fv really need a buff
The stats are ridiculous

📎 PhotoGrid_1580926563047.jpg

unique scaffold Feb 5, 2020, 6:19 PM

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The buff is called removing it

cunning kindle Feb 5, 2020, 6:19 PM

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^

karmic steeple Feb 5, 2020, 6:22 PM

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^

plush trellis Feb 5, 2020, 6:33 PM

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^

jagged crescent Feb 5, 2020, 6:59 PM

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~~AP alpha buff~~

exotic light Feb 5, 2020, 7:07 PM

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Buff me

burnt venture Feb 5, 2020, 7:20 PM

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These are 55%-65% wr players in the game, who obviously know NOT to play the 183 because it is unfun for both sides most of the time. But guess who plays the 183 all day long? 50%ers. So we are stuck with the 183. It has by far the lowest games with better players simply because after the nerf it is no fun to play anymore. Huge, slow, armor-less, no camo, terrible dispersion. I haven't seen a 183 pen HESH since before the nerf, everybody is afraid to use HESH now because it is just so unreliable. Only average players that think that "big alpha is fun" will ever grind the tank. It isn't even useful in comp, only for memes. The grind to it goes through some of the worst tanks in the game, for a disappointing tier X.

Add to the fact that it is extremely reliant on the team, which aren't very good these days, and you get just horrific stats.

I'll take my buffed Jageroo and leave, thank you very much.

exotic light Feb 5, 2020, 7:27 PM

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After ATGM comes 183 became less effective so we simply need a lil bit of hp or reload or even speed buff or maybe adding ATGM to 183 instead of HESH and HESH instead of HE if you want players to stop spamming HESH just make it expensive

karmic steeple Feb 5, 2020, 7:29 PM

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@exotic light I’m pretty sure you’re trolling plz tell me you’re trolling
I’m honestly scared

unique scaffold Feb 5, 2020, 7:48 PM

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Bufd the T-34 frontal armor

jagged crescent Feb 5, 2020, 8:02 PM

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If you're talking about the new tier 8 prem, bounce shots with ur turret lmao

unique scaffold Feb 5, 2020, 8:03 PM

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Almost, I mean, the Sherman is good bc of it's frontal armor

noble siren Feb 5, 2020, 8:55 PM

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Met a player with more than 3k battles in fv183 and he had like 2.5+k average damage and 60% WR absolute Chad.

regal grove Feb 5, 2020, 9:58 PM

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60 km/h Grille day 47

austere moat Feb 6, 2020, 1:33 AM

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I would appreciate a buff to the entire rest of tier 7, and then every single tier 8 tech tree tank that exists other than the tiger II

karmic steeple Feb 6, 2020, 1:49 AM

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That’s the best way to balance

austere moat Feb 6, 2020, 1:59 AM

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and then tier 6 will need buffs, and then tier 5s will need buffs, and then tier 4s will need crazy buffs, then tier 1-3 need crazy buff. This is the mistake that has been made
Oh, I forgot, then tier 9 will need buffs to keep up with 8 (Already does in some ways), and then WG will have to rush the tier 10 buffs

exotic light Feb 6, 2020, 3:17 AM

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Please buff me

iron lynx Feb 6, 2020, 3:21 AM

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Removing it is a pretty good buff

unreal quiver Feb 6, 2020, 3:21 AM

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is there any way to retrieve old legendary avatars?

unique scaffold Feb 6, 2020, 4:02 AM

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@exotic light no one cares

sage geyser Feb 6, 2020, 4:32 AM

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Make kv2 TD, it's a TD gun on a heavy hull. Just like you wouldn't put T30 as heavy

flat bane Feb 6, 2020, 4:32 AM

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Buff the Japanese TDs 👏 👏 👏

thick rover Feb 6, 2020, 5:18 AM

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Seriously.. Not even released yet

prime lake Feb 6, 2020, 6:12 AM

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how is the new atgm tanks balance?

flat bane Feb 6, 2020, 6:38 AM

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I mean, considering how bad the HO-RI is, I wouldn't be surprised the rest of the line are also as bad.

drifting depot Feb 6, 2020, 7:12 AM

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What's ho-ri's gun caliber and top speed [armor doesn't really matter unless it's slow as hell ngl]

compact nymph Feb 6, 2020, 7:18 AM

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14,9cm gun and 50 km/h top speed. But next time ask in #vehicles-discussion please @drifting depot

flat bane Feb 6, 2020, 7:25 AM

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Tbh HO-RI needs a bit more armor on the superstructure and sides, and a HP buff to 1900. However, it needs a nerf to the Prem ammo, it should lose a bit more DPM.

thick rover Feb 6, 2020, 8:26 AM

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Lol

analog badger Feb 6, 2020, 9:45 AM

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Tog II*

unique scaffold Feb 6, 2020, 10:03 AM

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Since they buffed regular M6 side armor, they should do the same to M6A2E1 and the EXP variant, i am sick of being blown up by a T49 HE, having just 30 mm of armor

wet wharf Feb 6, 2020, 10:06 AM

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TBH, the EXP should probably get better hull armour on the front. Having weak sides is okay provided the frontal armour is outstanding. BL- 10s punch through the upper plate all day long

iron lynx Feb 6, 2020, 10:10 AM

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The EXP already has good frontal armor, BL-10 is supposed to punch through anything

unique scaffold Feb 6, 2020, 10:13 AM

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Even many tanks prammo can pen it with a direct hit, but that's manageable in hulldown mode, i don't worry about that. It's only about sides and rear, they are so poorly armored that a heavy tank like the EXP is literally demolished by HE of T49, 128 or 130 mm, or 152 mm guns. So, if regular M6 received armor buffs, then the superior variants should receive them also

compact nymph Feb 6, 2020, 10:16 AM

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M6 exp even gets blown up with 105mm HE from the VK 45.02 A lol. 44mm side armor means overmatch from any 150mm gun. Maybe buff it a bit (55mm or so) to have them stop complaining. Still, keep the rear armor as it is (it’s an US tank, don’t forget it)

unique scaffold Feb 6, 2020, 10:31 AM

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Sides to 75 mm or so, like regular M6, which is also in Tier 6. That armor in Tier 7 or 8 is sufficient to deter HE spam

bold dagger Feb 6, 2020, 11:18 AM

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YEAH

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i approve

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wholeheartedly

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FYI people

📎 image0.jpg

bold dagger Feb 6, 2020, 11:19 AM

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bold dagger FYI people

inner goblet Feb 6, 2020, 11:19 AM

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-10 to APCR pen? Really? Does Wargaming honestly think that 10mm is going to make a difference?

silent delta Feb 6, 2020, 11:20 AM

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but indeed it will help against heavies

bold dagger Feb 6, 2020, 11:21 AM

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10mm is something folks

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something

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its not enough but we’re going in the right direction

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what it does mean is that they will really struggle to pen Tier 9 and 10 heavies frontally

noble siren Feb 6, 2020, 11:23 AM

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@bold dagger they could pen tier 10 heavies? Nice meme. Idc about the ATGM nerf cause it was fully reasonable but to touch my APCR was just unreasonable. And now when the ATGM does nothing reduce the cost for it too.

bold dagger Feb 6, 2020, 11:25 AM

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the APCR was the most broken part about it. still will tbh. that gun handling combined with the massive alpha and pen meant that you could get positive trades with anything

dreamy eagle Feb 6, 2020, 11:25 AM

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I still believe that the t92e1 should just become a regular t92. Since it would be able to do it's job with it's regular turret. It would also be more effective than giving it atgm, but changing the turret to the original t92 turret would most likely give it a speed buff and nerf it's armor.

bold dagger Feb 6, 2020, 11:25 AM

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and APCR is the ammo you should be shooting most of the time

analog badger Feb 6, 2020, 11:27 AM

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Just reduce the HEAT pen to 280-290 and we good for both, T92E1's armor should be reduced.

shadow ridge Feb 6, 2020, 11:32 AM

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Deactivation of Auto AIM on touch control for the missiles would also be good, as with mouse and keyboard 🤔 😉

quaint raptor Feb 6, 2020, 11:32 AM

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230mm pen on tier10? Amazing
I bet it would only be able to shoot leopard1

compact nymph Feb 6, 2020, 11:40 AM

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I destroyed a platoon of T-62s in my VK 45.02 B, back to the times I hadn’t the 12,8cm. (K.w.K L/68 has 225mm pen). So, you can shoot other things than a Leo with 230mm APCR @quaint raptor

exotic light Feb 6, 2020, 11:43 AM

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@unique scaffold NO U
Please buff me

unique scaffold Feb 6, 2020, 11:43 AM

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Batchat buff when?

noble siren Feb 6, 2020, 11:44 AM

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When you nerf the frontal armor

quaint raptor Feb 6, 2020, 11:45 AM

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Vk4502 is tier9 and sheridan is tier10
Why there is no pen gap between tier9 missile and tier10 missile

unique scaffold Feb 6, 2020, 11:45 AM

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Based off the most recent balance charts both batchats desperately need a buff.

frail quiver Feb 6, 2020, 11:49 AM

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@lusty silo dear Ribble, why ammo penetrations values are so different between T49 and the tier 9 successor? I think light tank howitzers should have way less standard pen values than regular medium tanks at the tier. That's the case with T49. And now you are giving 230mm standard pen for the tier 9 LT howitzer? Shouldn't be it like 180 mm to encourage howitzer drivers to flank? Why a LT howitzer that can use HE effectively has comparable amount of standard pen to other medium tanks at this tier? It doesn't make any sense...
And please can you do something with LT howitzer spam at higher tiers? Playing regular light tanks is very painful experience 😫

exotic light Feb 6, 2020, 12:05 PM

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I became underpowerd just give me some maneuverability or hp or even reload buff and for players who is spamming my HESH just make it expensive to buy Please 🥺 small buffs makes difference

atomic hound Feb 6, 2020, 12:14 PM

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So the French lights are utterly terrible now, as we knew, the t28 bottoms the list as usual, with no change. Tiger 2 v high but not touched, and the atgm nerfs aren't enough, because it's still all too easy to hit tanks over hills without any risk to yourself. They need to increase rocket speed and decrease turning speed to make this impossible, at least at close ranges (i.e. the other side of a hill like on canyon, Normandy, mines, Middleburg, etc.)

indigo knot Feb 6, 2020, 12:14 PM

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Lol.... Batchat both tier 9 and 10
While I heard someone saying they are still effective in the game....smh

true wedge Feb 6, 2020, 12:16 PM

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@frail quiver its not a howitzer lol the Kpz-70 has the same type of gun

unique scaffold Feb 6, 2020, 12:21 PM

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@indigo knot I said that. Personally I felt like I was not affected in how I was playing the Batchat. That being said I greatly overestimated how others were playing them. I was mistaken.

frail quiver Feb 6, 2020, 12:25 PM

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@true wedge WG can call it whatever they like. They should give it wot PC penetration and everyone would be happy

indigo knot Feb 6, 2020, 12:33 PM

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They should have nerfed the tier 9 pen more....
220 & 290 should have been the pen for normal and premium rounds

Same is the case of Standard B....it has similar gun to tier 10 in terms of pen values(its pen value also need nerf like 232 AP and 275 Heat)

karmic steeple Feb 6, 2020, 12:40 PM

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I think the batchats probably needed a buff before the ATGMs and the missiles have just exposed the problem even greater

lusty silo Feb 6, 2020, 1:19 PM

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Lol.... Batchat both tier 9 and 10
While I heard someone saying they are still effective in the game....smh
@indigo knot

I think the batchats probably needed a buff before the ATGMs and the missiles have just exposed the problem even greater
@karmic steeple

Batchats suffered the most after ATGM release because they are matched together. So we kind of expected BC efficiency decrease. BC buff will be considered when we see how ATGM changes work out.

frail quiver Feb 6, 2020, 1:32 PM

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Batchats suffered the most after ATGM release because they are matched together. So we kind of expected BC efficiency decrease. BC buff will be considered when we see how ATGM changes work out.
@lusty silo the same thing happened to t8 light tanks when t49 was introduced. Even during its nerfed state light tanks are painful to play against it

indigo knot Feb 6, 2020, 1:35 PM

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^
Unless you are T54lwt
Though I thought Leo1 would have suffered the same fate as Batchat...but stats are just like last update(still the worst WR in its class)

unique scaffold Feb 6, 2020, 1:41 PM

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I am ok with the slight nerf of ATGM, now please give missiles to Kpfpz 70 too, it is the only other tank in game capable of shooting them

plush trellis Feb 6, 2020, 1:42 PM

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Looking at charts, holy crap the atgms are more broken than i thought. Missiles are problem in this game, they shouldn't have come. They should've stay in events such as mad games or uprising.

indigo knot Feb 6, 2020, 1:45 PM

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^

cunning kindle Feb 6, 2020, 1:46 PM

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^^
I mean only players that wanted atgm back that i kno of were the ones who abused it during t49A event on pc

noble siren Feb 6, 2020, 1:52 PM

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So when will the Leo receive proper buff and not just "decrease the reload time by 0.3 sec"

plush trellis Feb 6, 2020, 1:52 PM

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Its seems like wg wants to test them out first. I think the best step is to remove the missile itself. Wg promise not to bring artillery at blitz, but they brought something a lot worst xD. @cunning kindle i will say artillery people too.
@noble siren care to actually answer us from yesterday debate? Or is everyone who doesn't like the missile is "bias" or are you just going do clown emojis instead of debating? 😂

ember thunder Feb 6, 2020, 2:04 PM

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why did wg nerf apcr now it is the lowest among all tier 10s and the damage in missiles is low too...we need a reload buff
@unique scaffold it will promote more atgm spam too

unique scaffold Feb 6, 2020, 2:07 PM

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@ember thunder rlly

dense yoke Feb 6, 2020, 2:25 PM

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Is7 buff when? @lusty silo, sorry for ping.

unique scaffold Feb 6, 2020, 2:36 PM

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@ember thunder wait do you think that the atgm spam will be a better thing?

noble siren Feb 6, 2020, 2:44 PM

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@plush trellis the ATGMs are good addition to the game because before them all we had was "The one with impenetrable turret on the hill wins" and it's still like that. So many tanks with turrets you can't pen. And this is the whole game, whoever reaches first the hill wins the match. And the new tank Sheridan prevents that cause I can punish them for camping a hill. The ATGMs should not be removed but reworked and not from the way of using but pen and damage values. But who cares about that if they can't camp somewhere without punished. But about the problem you say nothing else but "OMG rockets= arty but it's even worse, OMG easy to use, OMG so OP" so yeah... that's why I put clown faces under comments like yours, they are just laughable...

hollow basin Feb 6, 2020, 2:45 PM

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@ember thunder its not really a good thing to spam atgm...i wouldnt be surprised if many people leave if they buff it back or buff it in general

twilit crystal Feb 6, 2020, 3:01 PM

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Lol batchat stats( look what happens when actually good players stop playing the batchat)

karmic steeple Feb 6, 2020, 3:03 PM

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Knowing how to work ridge line is not equal to “camping a hill”. You can also contest those ridges in other armored turret tanks pretty effectively. And most turrets are not impenetrable you have to wiggle a lot to be able to bounce a lot of shots. And I just don’t understand how being able to hit people from behind complete cover is a balanced feature in any way. Even if the meta is bad (which it really isn’t), there are much better ways to switch it up, such as just nerfing certain tanks and buffing others instead of adding a mechanic that can not be balanced

burnt venture Feb 6, 2020, 3:08 PM

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@noble siren What kind of point is that? "Hill camping"? We have mediums and lights for a reason, which is to dig those hulldown heavies out of position by flanking. We have teams for a reason, so you can push a flank. And your point that there are "so many tanks with impenetrable turrets", looking just at tier X, most of the turrets have weakspots. The only ones with impenetrable turrets have like no gun depression. No, man, the one with the impenetrable turret on the hill does NOT win. That is why we have flanks in the game... for mediums to exploit heavies that only hold one position the entire game.

How about driving your mediums and pushing the med flank with skill and flanking the heavies, instead of going EZ mode and lobbing missiles onto tanks that can't do anything about it. Medium tanks are supposed to be made for that.

Even if you remove the ATGM mechanic, the Sheridan and T92 would still be extremely competetive tanks, excellent flankers, peek-a-boomers, etc. Don't give me that bull about how rockets are balanced, this game was just not made for missiles at all. So take your stupid argument home.

ember thunder Feb 6, 2020, 3:13 PM

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I'd say remove atgm and give it 220 mm pen HESH with high damage and lower reload

twilit crystal Feb 6, 2020, 3:20 PM

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@frail quiver actually I love the cycle of tier 8 lights. I think the 251 and 13 90 can get a slight buff but they all have something special with their gun

coarse harness Feb 6, 2020, 3:29 PM

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I would say the 13 90 could use some kind of buff
Thinking about better P/W ratio, gun handling or clip reload

noble siren Feb 6, 2020, 3:29 PM

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Lmao do you even play tier 10. Who said that the impenetrable turrets are on the heavies, have you heard of tanks like STB, T62, Obj140, E50M, Wz121, 121B. Nearly all of these tanks have good depression and good DPM. For these tanks is enough to go tp the hill where the enemy team is and that's all. I don't think that needs some skill if you ask me... Without ATGM Sheridan will become less effective in some scenarios.

So take your wrong argument home.
@burnt venture I think this is for you Lol

unique scaffold Feb 6, 2020, 3:33 PM

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I'd really appreciate it if both of you could remain civil please @burnt venture @noble siren

twilit crystal Feb 6, 2020, 3:38 PM

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I'm just happy batchat buff will be quite likely

burnt venture Feb 6, 2020, 3:38 PM

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The 140, 121 and 121B have good gun depression? Nice one. I can't even say the T62A has good gun depression, 7 deg is more yes but not that much.
E50M turret is easily countered by HEAT rounds. So is the STB's cheeks, and the STB also has no armor anywhere else.
Bottom line is, tanks that can shoot other tanks without direct line of sight is just not meant for the game, because you should not be punished for being spotted in cover. Hills are useless with these missile tanks. Hulldown is a legitimate strategy to put your tank in a strong position.
Oh, and you think the ATGMs will actually just aim for the armored, fast, hulldown targets? No, ofc they won't, they will go for softer targets like a Leo 1 or a lumbering heavy like the E-100. Still quite a moot point in most situations. @noble siren

cloud dome Feb 6, 2020, 3:47 PM

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@noble siren you ever played E50m and gotten heat spammed threw your turret 24/7 only counter to heat spam in E50m is just to ram them so they can’t shoot it. 140 has the two cupolas that is easy to pen if you above 140 height it’s easy pen. 140 not played as much as t62a because of the buff to it. And if you want depression tank look at m48/60 Both got weakpoints but can bounce shots. The tank that suffers the most from missile spam is German heavys because of lack of speed and size and not having 360+ armour everywhere.

orchid grove Feb 6, 2020, 3:49 PM

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These balance charts just go to show that for all the cries that “the meta is becoming less slow because of missiles”, the exact OPPOSITE happened. The meta got heavier; not lighter. If you look at the tanks that had big moves in relative position for winrate, tanks that fell in relative position from last update to this update, they were tanks like AMX 50b, Leopard 1, and Bat Chat. Tanks that benefited? Maus, E-50M, JgPz E-100, all the most heavily armored tanks in their classes.

And for what it’s worth, the idea that missiles would reduce camping and speed up the meta was ridiculous on its face. When you make aggressive plays, it’s to take an important hulldown. But if you take that hulldown and still get shot as if you were in the open anyway, you won’t even make that play in the first place. And just getting hit by a missile isn’t going to give you the sudden urge to YOLO into the open either. All missiles have done is made it so that lightly armored tanks have nowhere to hide, while at least heavier tanks can possibly absorb the missiles

twilit crystal Feb 6, 2020, 3:53 PM

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I am pretty surprised wg is touching the penetration on apcr and the armor in a one update nerf. They usually never do one update nerfs and I am disappointed they are touching the parts that are normal on a one update nerf considering the fact the tank is very good avg wise but it's still within the realm of other tier x. It looks like the foch and progetto and not a charioteer. I think the tank that got the most screwed in 6.7 was probably the chieftan. I never bounced one. Chieftan with the t92 coz it has no mantle but it depends on going hull down

burnt venture Feb 6, 2020, 3:53 PM

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Right @orchid grove because ATGMs punish lightly armored tanks so much more, people regularly already focus lighter tanks for easy damage and the ATGMs made that even worse. To guarantee a pen, you would just target the Leo 1 over the E50M, any day of the week.

This turns the meta into either stupidly long stalemates, where both sides are afraid to push and the ATGM lights are camping in the back, or games that are complete chaos due to everybody attacking and YOLOing.

open marlin Feb 6, 2020, 4:20 PM

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@orchid grove Dude the meta got lighter in pubs. There are like 3-5 med/lights every tier 8-10 game

unique scaffold Feb 6, 2020, 4:20 PM

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@orchid grove you got it wrong, at least i was saying that the meta becomes light (Sheridan) and heavies that are able to counter the thing, which is extreme BS and should never happen.

viscid kettle Feb 6, 2020, 4:31 PM

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Seems like the T92 only needs a weaker upper plate and reduced damage with APCR...

austere moat Feb 6, 2020, 4:51 PM

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Honestly the nerfs it got are perfect. Less HEAT pen, alpha, 49mm of frontal Armor so 150+mm guns overmatch it and can’t bounce
Oh. Damn. It’s 52. Cancel that, now it just can’t bounce Jag and FV183. Should’ve done it 50...

coarse harness Feb 6, 2020, 4:52 PM

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*52mm

twilit crystal Feb 6, 2020, 4:52 PM

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Ah bouncing 3 skorpion shots was the best meme

unique scaffold Feb 6, 2020, 4:52 PM

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230mm pen worries me

formal scarab Feb 6, 2020, 5:51 PM

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I heard someone said the 140 has a good turret. Whoever wrote this i laughed. I really like you now 🙂

night wharf Feb 6, 2020, 6:01 PM

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Which is the best tier 6 British tank??

karmic steeple Feb 6, 2020, 6:22 PM

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Cromwell

iron hearth Feb 6, 2020, 6:30 PM

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230mm pen + normalization of apcr shells, you wont be able to pen t54/obj140 frontally .., i can understand lowering the pen on the t92 couse it will face tier 8 too , but the sheridan it's getting screwed

twilit crystal Feb 6, 2020, 6:31 PM

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^ 230 Really is garbage

indigo knot Feb 6, 2020, 7:04 PM

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Just remove the missiles....give tier 10 its 240 AP pen back.....and give them Heat 275-280 for tier 9 and 290-295 for tier 10
This missile mechanism will be hard to balance(either it will be trash or broken)...so removing it is better

plush trellis Feb 6, 2020, 8:08 PM

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@noble siren i was going to work and coudnt reply, but I can see a ton of people already took stuff out of what i was going to say 🤷

coarse harness Feb 6, 2020, 8:25 PM

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The WZ-120 has 220mm pen, the T-54 219, the M46 Patton 218
All AP tho but 230 in T9 is not bad at all even if it's APCR

And with this nerf the slow missle can be a disadvantage as well cuz people have to use it against armored targets and they can angle up against it

thin ermine Feb 6, 2020, 8:51 PM

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Please dont cry about the penetration values. Especially when the t49 does just fine with 160 pen

twilit crystal Feb 6, 2020, 9:05 PM

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230 APCR is literally the worst possible pen in tier 9 except maybe the d54 gun in t54

noble siren Feb 6, 2020, 9:11 PM

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@thin ermine T49 is whole different story and giving it HESH would be better

latent snow Feb 6, 2020, 10:02 PM

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dont nerf sheridan just t92, look at the charts

karmic steeple Feb 6, 2020, 10:13 PM

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“Oh no my high alpha light tank can’t penetrate the front of heavy tanks reliably”

austere moat Feb 6, 2020, 10:27 PM

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^^
I think that Wargaming may have gotten the nerfs on the ATGM tanks just right, to be honest. The frontal armor buff is gonna be 90% useless as the only things that overmatch it are the Jag and an FV183, but nerfing the pen as hard as they did makes it much better to fit more of a support role niche. Still utterly breaks the bat chats, but...

unique scaffold Feb 6, 2020, 10:28 PM

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Glad they left the spaced armor on the Sherdian alone.

twilit crystal Feb 6, 2020, 10:29 PM

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Reminder the batchat was always bad lol

ivory fractal Feb 6, 2020, 10:32 PM

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Always? It was mediocre at worst. What about that buff they mentioned long time ago, the 2.5 intra clip reload. Oh yeah WG said it’ll make it too good...

karmic steeple Feb 6, 2020, 11:28 PM

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Spaced armor being left alone on the Sheridan is fine.
Now give it to all the other lightly armored tanks and were good to go :/

regal grove Feb 6, 2020, 11:48 PM

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60 km/h Grille day 48

twilit crystal Feb 6, 2020, 11:52 PM

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Literally any angle above 40 degrees means 220 AP >230 APCR+the t92 APCR is garbage at the slowest shell velocity for any med/light at tier IX

solemn sapphire Feb 7, 2020, 12:01 AM

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Honestly it needs the nerf. 9 times out of 10 the people using them are only using the missiles and camping in the back

thin ermine Feb 7, 2020, 12:35 AM

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@unique scaffold there was no reason to remove the spaced armor anyways, PC survives with it, blitz should too,

stiff edge Feb 7, 2020, 2:15 AM

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i think they should get rid of the spaced armour completely at the back, because rn u can only HE the sides/rear of turret and very bottom of the rear. it would be a nice way to make it so that they dont show their rears

coral bobcat Feb 7, 2020, 2:44 AM

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Buff the 183 is garbage now

austere moat Feb 7, 2020, 2:48 AM

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183 could use a camo buff and a HESH pen nerf, but we dont need good HESH. Make it spam AP
Its garbage but its annoying asf. It ruins game for 8 players: their team, because they lose, and the guy they shoot, because theyre 10% HP

charred narwhal Feb 7, 2020, 2:49 AM

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Jesus everyone complains about it being a total beast and now it's garbage. Just accept one or the other since they will never just barely buff or nerf to make to perfect and the meta will always change as well as new takes being added to counter it.

nimble zodiac Feb 7, 2020, 2:51 AM

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It’s just too much of an outlier to be commonly agreed on, huh?

karmic steeple Feb 7, 2020, 2:55 AM

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If they reduced the alpha to a reasonable level I would be fine with balancing it back into the meta. Until then? It can go rot in the hole it’s in right now

ember thunder Feb 7, 2020, 3:11 AM

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nerfing the damage of missiles to 490 isn't it a bit too much?

open marlin Feb 7, 2020, 3:18 AM

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Not enough. Need to remove missle idk how many times it must be said

austere moat Feb 7, 2020, 3:19 AM

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It needs to be line of sight. Literally, make it sniper mode onlyand itll be fine

Because you can sit behind a rock and lob missiles at red tanks for 7 minutes straight

charred narwhal Feb 7, 2020, 3:20 AM

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I don't understand why everyone hates them. But ok

random mist Feb 7, 2020, 4:01 AM

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Cause they not real pro when they hide behind a rock and shoot missles at us while real pro use real tank

ember thunder Feb 7, 2020, 4:10 AM

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tbh I think wg should remove missiles and increase apcr pen to 245 and give it 200mm hesh with high damage and make reload a bit more

unique scaffold Feb 7, 2020, 4:40 AM

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What’s the point of nerfing the ATGM tanks pen if they can still use calibrated shells?

ember thunder Feb 7, 2020, 4:42 AM

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its forcing them to use cs and decrease reload time

unique scaffold Feb 7, 2020, 4:50 AM

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No I meant next update they are nerfing the heat pen to like 310 and apcr to 230 like what’s the point they still use calibrated shells they fire over hills or use speed to get away making their reload irrelevant Becuase they just drive off only meds and lights have a chance of taking them out cause of speed

crystal spoke Feb 7, 2020, 4:52 AM

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If they run away there goes all of its dpm aswell

ember thunder Feb 7, 2020, 5:11 AM

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@unique scaffold lets see what happens after 6.8 releases

unique scaffold Feb 7, 2020, 5:37 AM

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you’ve never seen a defenseless chieftain try chasing a atgm tank while the guy MLG’ed a ATGM around the rock have u?LOL

@ember thunder

ember thunder Feb 7, 2020, 5:44 AM

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well I have done it myself many times @unique scaffold

unique scaffold Feb 7, 2020, 5:52 AM

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fair enough @ember thunder

abstract slate Feb 7, 2020, 8:28 AM

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Id just like to point out that with pen boost heat will stell be as good as non boosted pre nerf, so it doesnt make that big a difference

📎 Screenshot_20200207-092722_Calculator.jpg

coarse harness Feb 7, 2020, 8:31 AM

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Then you have to give up even more DPM which is already garbage
You'll have 1700 DPM in T9 not to mention the fly time of the missle lol

noble siren Feb 7, 2020, 9:00 AM

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Bruh these people. If they use CS they will have worse DPM then before can't you understand this?

abstract slate Feb 7, 2020, 9:09 AM

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@noble siren loss of Gun rammee combined with alpha reduction is why it drops so much, but you can still use it to get safe dmg so whatevs

exotic light Feb 7, 2020, 11:05 AM

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@lusty silo Do WG thinking of buffing me in any of further updates or ill just accept my fate as underpowered tank??

thick rover Feb 7, 2020, 11:16 AM

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@exotic light they think that it's balanced and the stats is because noobs camp base and idk be a noob in it I forgot the phrasing

exotic light Feb 7, 2020, 11:21 AM

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The stats because of several reasons (slow - huge - camoless - no armor at all - bad aiming time - slow reload - low hp) @thick rover

karmic steeple Feb 7, 2020, 11:21 AM

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If they reduced the alpha to a reasonable level I would be fine with balancing it back into the meta. Until then? It can go rot in the hole it’s in right now

exotic light Feb 7, 2020, 11:36 AM

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@karmic steeple maybe if they give me same jgpz E100 gun but with additional HESH shells and return back my concealment it still can derp 1000s to decent to lightly armored tanks

karmic steeple Feb 7, 2020, 11:37 AM

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As long as it can’t derp away 75% of a tanks HP I’m cool with it

thick rover Feb 7, 2020, 12:19 PM

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@exotic light yes thank you, tell that to wg

fathom vault Feb 7, 2020, 2:28 PM

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Why even complain about T92's dpm being low? Are we suppose to stand still shooting face to face til death does us part in this game? The ATGM should be removed, or heavier nerfed. Because by staying behind covers scoring free damage is always a profitable trade. Dpm is low, but the enemy won't be able to shoot. A perfect tool for those can't learn any symbolic skills: hulldown, angling, firing on the move, peek-a-boom, reverse angling, etc That is not how world of tanks works.

noble siren Feb 7, 2020, 3:17 PM

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@fathom vault sigh

grizzled remnant Feb 7, 2020, 3:53 PM

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Yes, However the ATGM is not a fire and forget system. It still takes skill to hit tour target, and from what I've seen, its not a sure penetration every time.

charred narwhal Feb 7, 2020, 3:53 PM

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"Skill"

ember thunder Feb 7, 2020, 3:54 PM

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well a normal player wont fire over obstacles and pen it everytime

burnt venture Feb 7, 2020, 3:59 PM

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Firing over obstacles is the problem. No line of sight tanks shouldn't exist, because they make cover worthless. Remove ATGMs, they are not fun for the receiving end and after further nerfs they will not be fun for either end.
One reason people hate Arty so much in PC is that you never know if you are actually safe or not from arty, which makes people so much more afraid to push and take risks, which makes the game more boring. These ATGMs are doing the same, people are afraid to push up or take positions that they otherwise would take because they are afraid a missile can hit them at any time.

Making hills worthless when literally 75% of the game is centered around hill fights is sort of counterintuitive.

And don't hit me with that stuff about how missiles are hard to use. They aren't, especially when people have had some practice. I'm not talking about looping shots across the map, I'm talking about parking on the opposite side of the hill and lobbing missiles at anything you see in third person. Point gun in the air, aim at target using third-person lookout, and click. That is it. In maps like Yamato Harbor or Port Bay, this makes the entire point of the hills useless, especially when they were choke points before.

@charred narwhal I have really never taken this amount of issue with any other OP tank. I would acknowledge that they are OP and annoying, but I never called for their removal. This is an entirely new mechanic, one that breaks the logic of World of Tanks IMHO. So that is why I call for it's removal. This game is based on line-of-sight, that is how people get damage and in doing so they take a risk of getting damaged. Having tanks that can shoot others while being 100% guaranteed safe is stupid. The 183 was slightly ridiculous, but at least it couldn't hit you OVER anything...

grizzled remnant Feb 7, 2020, 4:04 PM

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Yeah, I can see tour point.

noble siren Feb 7, 2020, 4:04 PM

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@grizzled remnant finally someone who actually knows something about ATGM system

charred narwhal Feb 7, 2020, 4:07 PM

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I doubt anyone is willing to sit in the open for 15+ seconds just to hit someone if they make missile sniper only. Removing them isn't an option because they are new, no one would be willing to remove something brand new. They will nerf and buff when needed. This is exactly like the 183 argument. "It's too op nerf it" "no now it's trash buff it" just shut up and play the game. Not everything can be equal. If we remove something people will complain about another thing until everyone has single shot pz2 guns all over.

@burnt venture I can get this but they are new. You asking for removal isn't going to change a thing because there are tons of people who like the tanks. They will simply nerf the tanks until people complain and then buff until complaints come in again. Repeat. It's how the game works. WG don't care too much about customer satisfaction. They might ignore the tanks altogether after a while and add more OP tier 9-10 prems ~~that shouldn't have been added in the first place~~ to counter them. The system was meant to remove campers who sit in the back. It backfired. Just wait and see what happens. The game is already starting to be ruined and we, the players, can't do much.

vast kiln Feb 7, 2020, 4:11 PM

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Lmao WoT PS4 just got a nee tier 8 premium arty.

burnt venture Feb 7, 2020, 4:11 PM

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@vast kiln the M53/55 with the barrage mode? Yeah I saw it. It blew up the community lmao

fathom vault Feb 7, 2020, 4:16 PM

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I have seen many ATGM players guided the missile so perfect, scoring damage as if they were unicum in traditional tanks. And when the enemy, especially meds, push them, they panic and do normal noob behavior, and true, thats usually a noob, who dusted away old school, WOT-related skills to learn such bias way to bust skilled players.
And how terrify broken it is when in pro's hand?

coarse harness Feb 7, 2020, 4:22 PM

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I mean how do you find the worthy T92 players !?
I haven't met any of them
I haven't seen any enemy player curving perfect missles at anyone
After the update when 3-3 T92 were on each side usually one of them did more than 1K dmg and it's still the case

👇 👇 👇

charred narwhal Feb 7, 2020, 4:25 PM

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I have yet to see amazing missile shots too. Mostly it's just someone yoloing and using missiles for higher pen

karmic steeple Feb 7, 2020, 4:33 PM

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I’ve seen plenty there are many examples

noble siren Feb 7, 2020, 4:41 PM

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Everyone are just overestimating about these incredible shots, some artillery strikes, and rocket spammer in the new tanks. I wished I could see some of that, but I only met like 5-10 people doing this and they were unicums. Can't see the "no-skill" about using the new tanks. The gun on Sheridan is fine (for now) 240 APCR on that TD gun is fairly fine and see no reason for nerfing it.

distant river Feb 7, 2020, 5:08 PM

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I think since the update I've only been hit by an annoying rocket when I shouldn't have been 3 times, all by unicums. 2 were from the same person near when they were first introduced and I wasn't used to them and one was a genuinely amazing shot that looped around the map and hit me from the side. I could have avoided it or done something but I wasn't expecting it at all. Other than that every missile shot I've taken has been direct line of fire or a miss (or often both). People come here complaining saying how easy it to to do ridiculous shots because they've seen a unicum do 2 or 3 on a video but they haven't done anything like that themselves. If the turning radius was nerfed instead of everything else then there would be no reason to complain

noble siren Feb 7, 2020, 5:17 PM

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@distant river exactly there are people who will almost say that they got hit in the spawn at the start of the game

unique scaffold Feb 7, 2020, 5:21 PM

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Tbh wargaming nerfing it to 230mm proves they literally have no idea how to balance the game at all they do realize that 230mm APCR literally can’t go through almost anything at T10 right?

distant river Feb 7, 2020, 5:37 PM

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If anything it's forcing people to shoot more missiles which is exactly what the playerbase doesn't want (and they are actually right on something)
I don't agree with the alpha nerf either, when you have things like the 121 that only do 70 less damage with armour and half the reload you are going to be pretty useless. It feels like they are turning the sheridan into a 183 which I don't think anyone wants to see

karmic steeple Feb 7, 2020, 5:54 PM

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I do. Features like those deserve the nerfs

charred bobcat Feb 7, 2020, 5:59 PM

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The tier 9 getting nerfed apcr rounds is fine. They should nerf the missiles more rather than nerfing the apcr on the sheridan

chilly crane Feb 7, 2020, 6:44 PM

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FV 215b 183 needs a buff.

distant river Feb 7, 2020, 6:46 PM

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Remove it's HESH and HE and give it HEAT and buff it's camo to what it used to be and it's UFP, without removing the HESH you can't buff it at all without further ruining tier 10

karmic steeple Feb 7, 2020, 7:19 PM

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Alpha needs to be lowered to maybe a little more than jageroo

dense yoke Feb 7, 2020, 10:13 PM

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buff is7 turret so it is inpennable.

karmic steeple Feb 7, 2020, 10:23 PM

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It already is basically?
That’s not what needs buffing

coarse dawn Feb 7, 2020, 10:46 PM

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Could they fix the repair costs of t49 back to T8 levels since we now have T9/10 american light tanks. After all the reason its repair costs are so high is because it was an end tank to that line

unique scaffold Feb 7, 2020, 10:58 PM

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He’s been asking for an is7 buff so it’s best to ignore him

karmic steeple Feb 7, 2020, 11:24 PM

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Lol ok

dense yoke Feb 7, 2020, 11:47 PM

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@unique scaffold no offence, but this doesn't have to do with you.

If you couldn't realise that was a joke.

karmic steeple Feb 8, 2020, 12:31 AM

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On this server I take everything as serious

twilit crystal Feb 8, 2020, 12:48 AM

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T92 makes more credits than t49

orchid grove Feb 8, 2020, 2:25 AM

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@karmic steeple IS-7 turret is not impenetrable. Most tier X’s loading gold don’t have too much issue penning the IS-7 in the cheeks

nimble zodiac Feb 8, 2020, 2:32 AM

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Dang, the meta is now loading gold

karmic steeple Feb 8, 2020, 2:35 AM

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Oh oof

regal grove Feb 8, 2020, 3:13 AM

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60 km/h Grille day 49

orchid grove Feb 8, 2020, 3:40 AM

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@nimble zodiac If you think the meta is loading gold now, back in the day, prammo did the same damage as normal shells, so I literally ran full APCR on my 50B and IS-7

flat bane Feb 8, 2020, 5:38 AM

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The Japanese TDs need a buff ngl

full token Feb 8, 2020, 5:40 AM

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They haven’t even been added yet, so no one other than testers know about how they’ll be, and changes can still happen to the stats before release

noble siren Feb 8, 2020, 9:18 AM

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@orchid grove be more specific not every tier 10 can pen Is7's cheeks

thick rover Feb 8, 2020, 10:14 AM

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@full token yea idk what he's on about lmao

junior wind Feb 8, 2020, 10:38 AM

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📎 bandicam_2020-02-08_12-33-23-229.png

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thx wg for nice balance in rating

clear fulcrum Feb 8, 2020, 5:12 PM

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It's a nice thing missles getting nerfed...they needed it

orchid grove Feb 8, 2020, 5:17 PM

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I have mixed feelings on it. On the one hand, nerfing them is obviously good. On the other hand, my fear is that it will now be “balanced” on the stat sheet, and WG will stop here and leave the garbage missile mechanic in the game

dense yoke Feb 8, 2020, 6:39 PM

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.

flat bane Feb 8, 2020, 9:52 PM

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@thick rover bruh I'm just saying considering how bad the T10 is, the rest of the line is also going to be as bad. Oof you don't get that?

tawny sail Feb 8, 2020, 10:00 PM

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What is your massively flawed logic behind this statement?
And which tank aswell?

flat bane Feb 8, 2020, 10:04 PM

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I was taking about the HO-RI, I just looked it up on Blitz tank compare and it's actually doing pretty good. Almost 60% WR and 2.6k average dmg and a 46% survival rate. So nvm, hopefully the rest of the line is as good.

@orchid grove wait really? It seems pretty solid for a normal player like me. Do you remember or know the usual stats of a good test tank at T10?

orchid grove Feb 8, 2020, 10:08 PM

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@flat bane That's actually pretty bad stats for a test tank. You have to remember that test tanks are given to players in the best competitive clans in the game

nimble zodiac Feb 8, 2020, 10:32 PM

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I love how he assumed because the tier X is bad that all tanks in the line are bad

flat bane Feb 8, 2020, 10:36 PM

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Ngl it happend in the past so I won't be surprised if it happen again. Lmaooo then WG will start buffing them to make them more popular. Just like with all the Chinese tanks.

orchid grove Feb 8, 2020, 11:01 PM

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@flat bane Test tanks usually have like 2800 DPB, and like a 65% WR

flat bane Feb 8, 2020, 11:02 PM

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Oh, in that case HO-RI is performing pretty badly

jade cargoBOT Feb 8, 2020, 11:34 PM

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dynoSuccess ZroZlame#3785 has been warned.

regal grove Feb 8, 2020, 11:54 PM

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Imagine flaming a tank before it becomes public
60 km/h Grille day 50

flat bane Feb 9, 2020, 1:31 AM

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Imagine spending 2 months asking grille to get 60km/h 🤔

karmic steeple Feb 9, 2020, 1:51 AM

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It’s worth it

unique scaffold Feb 9, 2020, 1:52 AM

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im disappointed in the new Japanese tier 10 td, the Ho-Ri. What bothers me is that its the Ho-Ri version one but not the Ho-Ri version 2.... Version 2 has the whole gun and everything closer to the middle of the hull.... but ya know what, whatever...

thick rover Feb 9, 2020, 2:10 AM

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@flat bane I'm telling you maybe you should consider the tank specs after it's release and then ask for buffs or nerrfs lmao don't get that?

flat bane Feb 9, 2020, 2:17 AM

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@thick rover I'm just saying that in the past, usually when a T10 tech tree tank is added that is not too good,the rest of the tanks leading up to it are not as great as well. Take the Foch line and the Chinese TDs/meds when they were added. So I'm just making a assumption that this will be the case here to. Rofl you don't get that?

thick rover Feb 9, 2020, 2:26 AM

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¯_(ツ)_/¯ it's fine just stay in that bubble I won't comment @flat bane

Bold assumption nonetheless

flat bane Feb 9, 2020, 2:27 AM

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Appreciate it @thick rover ¯_(ツ)_/¯, don't bring anything sharp around my "bubble".

Not "bold" tbh It has happened multiple times in the past.

nimble zodiac Feb 9, 2020, 2:55 AM

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Foch was fine tho ._.

austere moat Feb 9, 2020, 2:57 AM

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Negatory. There’s a reason there was two or more per tourney, and most troll strats involved 7 foches

flat bane Feb 9, 2020, 3:27 AM

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I'm saying when it was first added into the game, before any buffs :/

austere moat Feb 9, 2020, 4:46 AM

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Oh yeah it was 100% fine before, just unpopular because the grind was pretty bad

mystic cedar Feb 9, 2020, 5:26 AM

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It's totally balanced that a lower tier tank can two shot a tier VIII heavy tank from the front without a fire or an ammorack

unique scaffold Feb 9, 2020, 6:18 AM

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@orchid grove they aren’t given to best players in best competitive clans though, the majority are played by decent players in EU, and some that are in clans that are totally not competitive 😂

flat bane Feb 9, 2020, 7:11 AM

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:0

austere moat Feb 9, 2020, 7:53 AM

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They are given to good enough people who are interested in testing, and have a history in good clans or tournament past, generally. Correct me if I am wrong though.

river portal Feb 9, 2020, 10:10 AM

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tbh the only problem with sheridan is the missiles so wg just need to remove it instead of forcing it to the game just listen to pros in this game

noble siren Feb 9, 2020, 10:21 AM

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@river portal who are these pros be more specific plz

river portal Feb 9, 2020, 10:27 AM

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@noble siren it can be the players of best clans in the game

viscid breach Feb 9, 2020, 11:01 AM

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Not all players in good clans are good players. Ive seen quite a few 40%ers in high wr clans, people that have absolutely no idea what they are doing in battle, leading me to have to carry them. And im only a 60%er, where the majority of their clan members are 65%+ with like 20k games more experience than me.

Also, the missiles are fine atm imo. The nerf will be nice for letting me driving my E 100 around without having to hug a wall, incase i see a missile so i can duck behind it to make the ATGM dip into the dirt, but overall it doesn't change much. They will still fly exactly the same, and still be just as effective for good players, and just as crap for bad players. If you get hit and penned by missiles, it is your own fault for not seeing them and reacting to it. It is easy to dodge them due to the weird aiming mechanic for them if youre in a tank with any decent mobility. If you dont have mobility, you have armour. So angle it. E 100 was fine, and is gonna be even better against the ATGM's, it just suffered a bit when you werent focused on them and they got a shot into your turret side. As soon as the camera passes over terrain or a destructible object, the missile buries itself in the dirt or flies wildly out of control anyway, so ya just gotta get behind a solid bit of cover to evade the missiles.

@unique scaffold the TANKS have 60%. Not the ATGMs. The tanks are at 60% wr because they genuinely were a bit too good. Firing missiles decreases your performance in battle. APCR rounds, standard shells, are far more effective than the missiles. The missiles are definitely good atm, and the balance should stop all the crybaby whining from noobs, too. It aint gonna stop people using them in a situation that requires their use. The APCR is still a better round to use in most battle situations, but sitting on a hill, firing ATGMs at campers to make em move is the best use for ATGM's.

unique scaffold Feb 9, 2020, 11:04 AM

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@viscid breach the missiles are far from being fine or balance at the moment mr 60%

unique scaffold Feb 9, 2020, 11:32 AM

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@viscid breach my dude i can tell that the tanks have 60% because of the ATGMs too, the concept of being able to deal easy damage without having to risk losing hp for it, aka trade, is broken in itself. Basic stuff, yes the apcr is good and it needs nerfed a bit, but the most important thing is actually the ATGM shells, a mechanic that must not be in this game as there is no place for it. @white vessel you see the name of the sheridan player behind a hill, then u see a shell coming towards you and hitting you, without any chance of getting a shot back in, everyone would get mad at that, and that happens too often. B R O K E N and nobody can deny it.

white vessel Feb 9, 2020, 11:33 AM

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Missiles are flxible as they have unlimited gundep @viscid breach

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Middleburg is unplayable if enemies have a moderately good sheridan driver.

viscid breach Feb 9, 2020, 12:14 PM

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Lmao you get mad at Sheridan drivers for firing ATGMs? Have you even TRIED using an ATGM yourself? I compliment them on a good shot if they manage to actually hit and pen me with an ATGM. Because I know how bloody difficult it is to aim the things if your target won’t stay still, and keeps ducking behind the cover of ridges or buildings. If you are in a position where the Sheridan can do that, you’re most likely in the middle of a field, which is your own fault. Not anyone else’s. You made the choice to drive there. You can’t blame your mistakes on anything other than yourself.

And for the record, yes. There is a place for ATGMs in the game. They make it more difficult for campers, and give an added challenge to the game, thereby making it more fun. Having an easy game isn’t fun. It gets boring. If there’s no challenge, there’s no point in playing.

noble siren Feb 9, 2020, 1:06 PM

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For the community is obviously harder to camp in medium with impenetrable turret a hill than hitting with rocket (it's easier on PC, but way harder on mobile devices), for me the only problem is the high penetration, but people rant about it so whatever. At least they should have nerfed the Fochs like they did with Sheridan, and not buffing it...

karmic steeple Feb 9, 2020, 1:19 PM

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With the foch I dont understand why they buffed that cupola. Now it’s trolly and you sometimes need to load HEAT just to guarantee a pen. Like what’s the point of a weakspot if you have to hold premium ammo just to guarantee a pen?

noble siren Feb 9, 2020, 1:29 PM

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They need to nerf the frontal armor and the weekspots

unique scaffold Feb 9, 2020, 1:38 PM

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@viscid breach you are either trolling or just have simply no clue, yes i have played the tank, am a 69% player with 4200 WN8 and from my experience they are completely broken. It is simple, the 2 tanks are able to be useful in every single position on every single map, add to that the fact that they are goddamn quick and get wherever they want, whenever they want. Recipe for a broken mechanic. No place for such shells in this game.

latent snow Feb 9, 2020, 1:56 PM

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That moment when a Unicum can play a tank better than a normal player

nimble zodiac Feb 9, 2020, 6:16 PM

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@neon topaz please revise the rules 🙂

jade cargoBOT Feb 9, 2020, 6:28 PM

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dynoSuccess BugMan#0522 was muted

regal grove Feb 9, 2020, 7:42 PM

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60 km/h Grille day 51

dense yoke Feb 9, 2020, 7:53 PM

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Grille is now a Camping tank. Would be amazing if it got speed buff.

nimble zodiac Feb 9, 2020, 8:51 PM

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Wow, a TD is doing what they primarily did?

formal bane Feb 9, 2020, 8:56 PM

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Pls give the Pershing a buff pls
It's very underpowered
Just give it alittle bit more pen and a quicker reload it's easily killed by everything

thin ermine Feb 9, 2020, 10:11 PM

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The ATGMs arent hard to use at all. When behind cover you can point your reticle at an open target and fire and watch them have almost no chance of dodging it

latent snow Feb 9, 2020, 10:13 PM

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Except if they go behind cover -_-

rigid fossil Feb 9, 2020, 10:40 PM

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ATGM’s aren’t for campers though, are they? They’re used predominantly over ridge lines. I feel like most players supporting ATGM’s are trying to use the ‘get good’ argument to act like they’re a good player.

In reality, this rendition of missiles is the step in the door to a full port of artillery to blitz. They’re testing the waters. If we let them put ATGM’s in fully, it’ll be the equivalent of arty for blitz. We shouldn’t let them do that.

The real way to deal with ‘campers’ is by using your mobility. By using your brain and by using tactical manoeuvres to make their position useless. Not by using op mechanics.

dense yoke Feb 9, 2020, 11:47 PM

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@nimble zodiac what about a new way to use a td? Gril is paper it makes sende that it has speed. A tank that can snipe and be a monster in close range i like that. or even if the tank needs to change spot real quick or run from the enemy.

nimble zodiac Feb 9, 2020, 11:58 PM

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Oh the Germans are renowned for little baby engines, even the line before grille reflects this, with Tier V engines up until it has to be tier X like all the other modules

karmic steeple Feb 10, 2020, 2:19 AM

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Grille needs it tho Bc once it’s spotted you could easily be dead or almost dead
Need some speed to reposition faster

latent snow Feb 10, 2020, 5:54 AM

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@rigid fossil I am saying just go behind cover because I have avoided a bunch of missiles like this. The things are super slow so it really isn’t hard to do.

orchid grove Feb 10, 2020, 6:31 AM

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All of you are focusing on the wrong thing. It's not about how hard it is to use missiles. The argument against missiles is actually airtight and can be boiled down to this fundamental reality:

Missiles are primarily about hitting people behind cover. Hitting people behind cover is stupid

Unless the pro missile crowd can disprove one of these 2 sentences, NOTHING ELSE MATTERS. It doesn't matter if they're hard to use, or unreliable, or can be countered, or whatever. Unless one of these 2 statements can be disproved, they have no case. End of story.

Don't get bogged down in the details. Focus on this fundamental argument.

formal vale Feb 10, 2020, 7:14 AM

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Saying that an entire genre of mechanics is dumb simply because your subjective feelings about it are negative does not equate to a fundamental reality and "airtight" logic. @orchid grove

twilit crystal Feb 10, 2020, 7:16 AM

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the basics of this game are literally based on peek a boo and using cover to minimize incoming damage, by removing hull down cover from the game you effectively change the game in a stupid direction that was not meant for the other 30 tanks at tier X

unique scaffold Feb 10, 2020, 7:21 AM

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@formal vale What do you mean by subjective feelings? No matter how hard the ones pro atgms try, the mechanic will never have a place in this game. If it is not based on trading, it has no place in the game. no matter how hard the balance team will try to make it even, they will either be useless, or broken. These shells literally negate massive parts on maps where tanks used their strengths for their benefit. Take Middleburg for example, C area is now killed cause nobody wants to be shot at with no way to get a shot back. If u don’t have a sheridan in your team, you’re at a disdvantage, that much of a difference makes 1 single tank. Totally unhealthy for this game. @formal vale im pretty sure he just used the worst ‘stupid’ instead of something like; bad for the game, unhealthy etc. I don’t think we should pay attention to that. I’ll take a look at ur idea

formal vale Feb 10, 2020, 7:24 AM

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@unique scaffold subjective in that he think's they're "stupid". That's an opinionative statement that's not grounded in facts. So calling it a "fundamental reality" is entirely disingenuous. Although I agree that ATGMs are bad for the game in their current state, being able to hit something around cover is not entirely a bad mechanic when executed correctly. Unfortunately, they've been executed poorly in their current state.

I've proposed my ideas in #666263717033541662 and I'm not really willing to restate them atm (it's nearly midnight).

noble siren Feb 10, 2020, 8:20 AM

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It's interesting how the majority of noobs take the effort to say what is balanced and what is OP. But they can't take the effort to understand how this game works.

For me missles should be slow and not have that high pen. The APCR should stay as it is now because you literally can't pen anything.

versed fable Feb 10, 2020, 12:00 PM

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To solve this problem they could add the trophy systems as a consumable

drifting depot Feb 10, 2020, 2:02 PM

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If a trophy system is actually added it would make missiles completely useless dude, just swap them for normal heat shells is it that hard?

crude pumice Feb 10, 2020, 2:24 PM

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renerf t62's gun depression. it's overpowered with hard tarret.

gleaming star Feb 10, 2020, 3:02 PM

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Buff the KpfPz 70 engine. The real model has a higher top speed.

round sundial Feb 10, 2020, 3:19 PM

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@crude pumice You're wrong. It's quite good, but definitely not OP at this point in time, there are better meds in T10, such as STB1 and T22.

unique scaffold Feb 10, 2020, 3:23 PM

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No one wants to grind for STB-1 the line is complete trash to get it

gleaming star Feb 10, 2020, 3:28 PM

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I'm currently grinding for the STB-1 . I'm busy with the STA-1 It takes some finesse to use, otherwise it is a fun tank.

reef lynx Feb 10, 2020, 3:28 PM

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su 122 54 needs an armor buff and dpm nerf

round sundial Feb 10, 2020, 3:29 PM

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It's true but it doesn't mean it's not the best T10 med in the game currently. And Type 61 is quite excellent , I recommend that tank

dense yoke Feb 10, 2020, 3:29 PM

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Yes make tortoise the dpm boss of tier 9

noble siren Feb 10, 2020, 3:31 PM

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@round sundial then nerf Stb and T22 then?

formal bane Feb 10, 2020, 3:35 PM

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Buff pershings reload

unique scaffold Feb 10, 2020, 3:35 PM

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T-22 got nerfed slightly w bigger armor profile when atgms came in

vale lava Feb 10, 2020, 3:56 PM

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T28 seems to be DPM boss of the game

karmic steeple Feb 10, 2020, 4:01 PM

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Negative

gleaming star Feb 10, 2020, 4:01 PM

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It will be interesting to see if they give KpfPz 70 missiles. If they do the T92 and the Sheridan will be the least of people's problems

coarse harness Feb 10, 2020, 4:03 PM

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After all the complainimg they definitely won't add more ATGM

twilit crystal Feb 10, 2020, 4:22 PM

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Kpf with missiles would be a meme with it using 15 degrees of gun depression and just using every bridge

humble nebula Feb 10, 2020, 4:44 PM

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For me personally... I dont have much problem with the atmg shells, but i think that the tanks are broken even if we exclude the missiles. I mean that quick a tank with a td gun ?? It's too hard to hit them with that sloped turret.. And do I even have to say about the troll armor in the tier 9 e1 ?? It's too bouncy... Now add the missiles and we have a tank that even newbies can play with 2k avg damage

unique scaffold Feb 10, 2020, 4:45 PM

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a TD gun?

twilit crystal Feb 10, 2020, 4:54 PM

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td gun. Has 2100 dom with 80 less dmg than a 640 damage gun with 240 pen with 900 meters shell velocity lol

humble nebula Feb 10, 2020, 4:57 PM

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@unique scaffold i mean in terms of alpha...

full token Feb 10, 2020, 5:00 PM

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E100 has a td gun?

drowsy plaza Feb 10, 2020, 5:03 PM

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@humble nebula show me a tier X TD with that low dpm or pen

twilit crystal Feb 10, 2020, 5:07 PM

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560 alpha is td alpha? I guess the problem is that after tier 8 there isn't any diversity in fast tank alpha. You have Russians with 310. China with 400 and the rest at 350. At tier 8 china gets 400. Rev gets 350 and some get 190. Tier 7 has 160 to 280.. honestly I never saw a major problem with the base tanks besides the trolly armor on the t92 and gun handling on move being a tad too good

humble nebula Feb 10, 2020, 5:10 PM

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@drowsy plaza there isn't any but these tanks are more effective than td... Just peek boom 540 damage nd cover

noble siren Feb 10, 2020, 5:15 PM

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@humble nebula if it worked like that... You have no armor, shit pen on long ranges, trash accuracy. Usually you get punished if you just "Peek boom 540 damage and cover".

They don't lol, this is not Progetto to rush someone and make 1k+ damage every battle. Leo is the hardest med to play.

humble nebula Feb 10, 2020, 5:21 PM

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@noble siren than explain to me why even super noobs do so good in this tank... But give them leopard 1 with that laser gun and they won't do even 1/4th of the damage they do in sheri nd e1

twilit crystal Feb 10, 2020, 5:25 PM

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Show me the super noobs doing good lol firing standard rounds. Even then the gun doesn't resemble a td at all. It has great on the move accuracy but terrible sniping accuracy with bad pen.

unique scaffold Feb 10, 2020, 5:27 PM

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It has one of the best velocity in his primary shell so what's your point? It has an absurd acceleration and can reach a spot before others therefore having time to aim and shoot..And with that speed on the shell it will likely hit

humble nebula Feb 10, 2020, 5:31 PM

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Yep it can use HE more effectively

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Just go to Blitzstars.com and compare all the tier 10 mt/Lt with the Sheridan... You will see that it has the highest Avg damage; highest avg kills; highest avg kill/death ratio; highest survival rate; highest avg spots; highest damage ratio and 55.63% avg wr which is higher than most of the mt/lt except the stb1 which has 57% avg wr

nocturne mauve Feb 10, 2020, 5:50 PM

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@unique scaffold actually T-22 got buffed, the armour profile is smaller

unique scaffold Feb 10, 2020, 5:54 PM

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Yeah just re checked the sliders confused me on blitz hanger

distant river Feb 10, 2020, 6:50 PM

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@humble nebula 🤔

It's still a new tank so most of its players are unicums and it still doesn't have the highest stats

📎 Screenshot_2020-02-10-18-47-38-394_com.android.chrome.jpg

unique scaffold Feb 10, 2020, 7:01 PM

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'most of its players are unicums' - extremely false. From what i know, and i do think i am right, unicums first of all see how the tanks are doing overall, then rush it.

distant river Feb 10, 2020, 7:04 PM

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Ofc like every single new tank released the 273 players are just going to be average 👌

regal grove Feb 10, 2020, 9:26 PM

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60 km/h Grille day 52

grand goblet Feb 11, 2020, 1:00 AM

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Why u counting that @regal grove
(Just curious)
Oh gotcha thanks for the answer

regal grove Feb 11, 2020, 1:01 AM

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I am curious to see how long it’ll take for Grille to have it
If it has that it’ll become good again
And fun*

nimble zodiac Feb 11, 2020, 1:03 AM

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Can this be counted somewhere else? Because clearly it's about to hit two months and your reposts aren't considered

flat bane Feb 11, 2020, 1:43 AM

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Well if he's allowed to say that for 52 days straight, then I'm allowed to say this. The HO-RI needs to lose more DPM with prem shells. Also, buff the superstructure to 270mm and the sides to 100mm, and give it 1900 HP.

thick rover Feb 11, 2020, 3:07 AM

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I don't think there is any relavance between him repeating something for 52 days and that

flat bane Feb 11, 2020, 4:46 AM

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I mean, I've been saying that for about a week or so because the tank really isn't performing well. Plus I don't want another repeat of the Foch line where they over buff it because it's unpopular or underperforming.

noble siren Feb 11, 2020, 5:04 AM

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Bruh the tank is not even out yet...

flat bane Feb 11, 2020, 6:09 AM

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Bruh go into Blitz tank compare you'll see all the current stats

crystal halo Feb 11, 2020, 6:31 AM

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I think the at 7 needs a buff

flat bane Feb 11, 2020, 6:36 AM

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Most of the AT series need buffs now ngl

humble nebula Feb 11, 2020, 6:56 AM

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@flat bane exactly... @distant river do tank compare... There the stats are different.. and dont compare it with premium t10 meds

tribal lodge Feb 11, 2020, 8:33 AM

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rocket ammo is too op. remove it

wild loom Feb 11, 2020, 8:40 AM

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Maybe instead of talking of rockets, add 2 more degrees of gun depression to wz-120 120mm gun? no?

tribal lodge Feb 11, 2020, 9:41 AM

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even meadsy say it is too op and should be remove

round sundial Feb 11, 2020, 9:45 AM

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Meadsy said many things. Doesn't neccesarily mean it's right

tribal lodge Feb 11, 2020, 9:54 AM

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look at his recent vid comment about atgm. lot of people hate it a should be remove. @round sundial

unique scaffold Feb 11, 2020, 10:05 AM

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https://youtu.be/LwRz-9FU-xM

YouTube

Meadsy69

THEY ARE RUINING THE GAME!

They are ruining the game!

Today I need to rant... Just how much are missiles ruining the game?

To become a patreon
https://www.patreon.com/Meadsy69

Join my discord server
https://discord.gg/dckHKTB

To send me replays
Meadsyreplays@hotmail.com

To donate
https://streamlabs...

▶ Play video

distant river Feb 11, 2020, 10:30 AM

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@humble nebula Those stats are the correct stats, and why shouldn't I compare it to prems? The T22 is OP but it's being powercrept a bit and the "completely and totally broken OP" Sheridan has a 2% worse WR. It still only has 273 players compared to the next lowest which is 1166 (T22) and it's pretty obvious most of not almost all of those are going to be unicums, but it's still being beaten in stats by the 30b which isn't exactly known for being a great tank.

reef lynx Feb 11, 2020, 11:48 AM

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FV4202 needs an autoreloader like on progetto 65

humble nebula Feb 11, 2020, 12:31 PM

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Remove apcr from the Sheridan nd e1... Thats one solution.... Just heat and He... Evn without the missiles the tanks are OP ... They're too versatile

sleek pebble Feb 11, 2020, 12:32 PM

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Khmmm, ATGM only Sheridan and t92, HE and HEAT

hollow basin Feb 11, 2020, 12:34 PM

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@humble nebula but the heat is what the problem is.....heat...atgm...potato, patato

unique scaffold Feb 11, 2020, 12:37 PM

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that is all we need, people to rely even more on ATGM, no. we gotta remove them

humble nebula Feb 11, 2020, 12:41 PM

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@unique scaffold because i don't think WG is going to remove the ATMG... So atleast remove the apcr

tired drum Feb 11, 2020, 2:30 PM

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So, the people with contributor accounts like bushka and meadsy are now voicing out against ATGMS and wargaming is only doing a nerf which wont help anything, they need to react to the contributors the ATGMS have no place in the game and are slowly killing it, trust me i have seen 2 or 3 atgms get behind a ridge or hill were u cant shoot them and just launch missile after missile and kill tanks that cant even shoot back! Wargaming needs to respond with deleting this tanks before their game gets deleted by the majority of players.

charred narwhal Feb 11, 2020, 2:33 PM

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As has been stated many times before, they will not remove something they JUST added less than a month ago. They will fiddle with it and try to balance them. Look at the 183. People say over and over to nerf it but once it's nerfed, they all complain it's too weak and they need to buff it. Repeat. It's a cycle and yet the 183 hasn't been replaced or removed. So again, they will not remove something they just added and will try to fix it before taking such drastic measures.

hollow basin Feb 11, 2020, 2:33 PM

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😭 its like shooting a fish in a barrel...with a barrel with dinamite
@tired drum

twilit crystal Feb 11, 2020, 2:36 PM

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The nerf is really dumb. The missile mechanic is super broken while the base tank is probably just overcooked and needed more data

nimble zodiac Feb 11, 2020, 2:39 PM

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@crystal halo @flat bane the AT series just got a major armor buff, and now they’re somewhat abusable

viscid kettle Feb 11, 2020, 2:50 PM

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Since the sky is falling, can you guys just learn and adapt while WG figures out the best approach to balancing ATGMs? Clearly something needs to change, but that doesn't mean that ATGMs need to be pulled because they have interrupted your gameplay as you like it.

nimble zodiac Feb 11, 2020, 2:53 PM

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There’s no adapting to being shot without being able to shoot back generally. The missile velocity may change some way of using them efficiently, but they still have a broken mechanic. The only way to counter a somewhat good player in em is to rush them with high DPM meds, which may not be a good choice because it pushes your boundaries to get struck by TDs, just to kill off a tank that’ll gradually melt you away otherwise.

drowsy plaza Feb 11, 2020, 2:59 PM

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I still fail to see them dominating unless it’s a good player. The Progetto still has a significantly higher avg dmg in tier X than the Sheridan and a remarkably better WR even after the nerf. Yeah heavy tanks are less effective- but honestly I’m fine with that as since 3.8 they have been overly dominant. Medium tanks are now much more effective and as long as you have good SA and don’t act like your impenetrable hulldown the Missile tanks aren’t hard to deal with.

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I would still like a Targeting fix for then though.

twilit crystal Feb 11, 2020, 2:59 PM

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Winrate is useless when it's clearly better players using and spamming the sheridan. Spamming is key word here

viscid kettle Feb 11, 2020, 3:01 PM

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@nimble zodiac There are many scenarios already where you cannot pen a tank with anything you got... which means you have to come up with a different strategy. How is this any different?

drowsy plaza Feb 11, 2020, 3:04 PM

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@twilit crystal the NA average WR for the Sheridan is around 48% how does that mean better players spamming it?

nimble zodiac Feb 11, 2020, 3:08 PM

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This is different because they can find a way not to expose their tank in order to shoot you. Other than hulldown, this isn’t really something to easily strategize against in pub matches if at all. A missile tank with support can confidently sit there, knowing that they can’t rush them without being destroyed by supporting meds or TDs. Sure any tank can do that some way, but a new mechanic with high pen missiles flying at you isn’t really easy to counter, unless they’re alone, which isn’t too likely for fairness. I think T92E1 and Sheridan can have a special place by simply being able to out-trade tanks in their type. Like the Chimera trading 440 for 225/280/310/400, T92E1 can trade 560 for 310/350/400, and Sheridan can trade 560 for 310/350/400/420 (by their type I mean lights and mediums due to their general direction)

twilit crystal Feb 11, 2020, 3:11 PM

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Unicom sheridan on green vs red. Only one winner. 90% of games with sheridan have an enemy sheridan

viscid kettle Feb 11, 2020, 3:13 PM

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@nimble zodiac I still don't see the difference. Missiles are slow and if you are far away, most tanks can dodge - it's not a sure thing to fire a missile. In my own T9/T10 games, they aren't really affecting me much other than having to change my strategies. &&I will also say that I play mobile exclusively, so maybe its different on PC

tribal lodge Feb 11, 2020, 3:16 PM

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how bout when u are in a low health and then u hide behind the rock. but enemy missile can shoot you. u cant even see the enemy tank hull to shoot

unique scaffold Feb 11, 2020, 3:17 PM

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How about structure that more properly please

nimble zodiac Feb 11, 2020, 3:18 PM

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Well, here’s to hoping your HE shell lands on the turret of Sheridan 😂🥂

twilit crystal Feb 11, 2020, 3:21 PM

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Like avoiding key parts of the map like the center in canyon? Literally shot an stb 1 trying to reach center by loading adrenaline and rushing center to shoot a nuke. Then he reached it and I hit him again

tired drum Feb 11, 2020, 3:25 PM

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You cant even hold a ridge line now, you dont even have to peak to be shot cause missiles come flying over the hill and hit you, if you cant hold a ridge being hull down, what are you supposed to do?

drowsy plaza Feb 11, 2020, 4:41 PM

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Barrel swat it.

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Honestly it works better than expected

unique scaffold Feb 11, 2020, 4:54 PM

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It really does

full token Feb 11, 2020, 5:04 PM

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Wdym by that?

viscid kettle Feb 11, 2020, 5:08 PM

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Swing the barrel in the path of the missile because it doesn't give you HP damage.. only module damage on barrel

unique scaffold Feb 11, 2020, 5:25 PM

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@drowsy plaza So what if it has lower average damage vs the progetto? The broken part is that it doesn’t need to trade to get damage, the shells have too much potential and can clutch too hard, some matches that are totally unwinnable. This is unhealthy for the game. For example, if you don’t have a Sheridan in your team when playing tournaments, you are most likely to lose. How is 1 tank out of so many t10s being essential balanced? Instead of looking at its stats, look at its potential, no other tank comes even close to it, by far. This ‘NEW AND INNOVATIVE’ gameplay simply spells the death of the game, no matter how much we like it. Add to that the fact that teh S. Conq is going to be in crates 😂 Also, RIP to most usual aggressive spots taken by tanks where they used their strenghts, ATGMs gonna hit u without u having any chance of doing damage to them 🙂 Totally fun

hollow basin Feb 11, 2020, 5:30 PM

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@unique scaffold preach it brother 🙂

austere moat Feb 11, 2020, 6:35 PM

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Well, he has a point. This "New and Innovative Gameplay" has absolutely shifted the meta, has destroyed the niches very lightly fit by some tanks, and has made others absolutely unplayable. The mechanic is insanely easy to abuse, and it is supremely difficult to counter, especially in good hands.

Iverson is proof of that. He's a god in the tank, and he has unlimited potential. He essentially has a way to print wins now. He can likely do the same in other tanks, but now those other tanks have to chance to fight back against him.

Not to mention that playing any tank that is decently immobile is hellish, and thanks to how the mechanic works, armor angles are very very ineffective, and instead you have to work your *** off to beat their shots. And that's JUST the missiles. Let's not ignore that the FASTEST TANK IN THE GAME has 152 MM APCR AND HE AS WELL.

noble siren Feb 11, 2020, 6:41 PM

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"Oooh nooo I stay in open, and got hit by rocket, omg this is so OP omg, omg" seriously I really wanna see people dominating in Sheridans. So many noobs cry about the ATGM system, "I stay behind rock I got shot plz nerf" If YOU ARE COVERED YOU CANNOT BE HIT is that hard to understand??? You can't aim precisely with ATGM at long distances on mobile devices, but on PC you can. The tank are not that OP when things like T22, T62, STB and other meds with strong turrets exist. The ATGM system works perfectly on bad players cause they usually stay in the OPEN AREA WITHOUT ANY COVER.

If someone can show a video how he domintes on unicums with Sheridan, because 90% of tje cry babies claim that noobs dominate battles in Sheridan. I will be very grateful if at least you people ( the crying ones ) have some evidence and facts to show instead of just saying randome things.

I'm OK with tje ATGM nerf but the APCR pen values should not be touched.

austere moat Feb 11, 2020, 6:53 PM

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Anyone have clips of Iverson in action, destroying anyone and everyone in his Sheridan? I don't... However numbers don't lie.... And these numbers say they're broken as all hell

He will crush with any tank, yes. But do his stats not stand out in his Sheridan at all? I would think they do.

📎 6.png

karmic steeple Feb 11, 2020, 6:53 PM

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You can get hit from behind cover they can do this thing called arcing shots and they can go over cover I dont understand why that’s so hard for YOU to understand

drowsy plaza Feb 11, 2020, 6:56 PM

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@austere moat Iverson is going to crush you regardless of what he is driving. His Sheridan stats don’t stand out. I mean folks with 3k+ avg damage in tier X aren’t tied to a tank to preform.

viscid kettle Feb 11, 2020, 7:00 PM

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I'd still love to see those metrics on PC vs Mobile on the atgms

drowsy plaza Feb 11, 2020, 7:01 PM

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@austere moat go look at his stats. Technically he underperforms in the Sheridan in terms of WR and Avg Dmg.

twilit crystal Feb 11, 2020, 7:02 PM

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ill admit i hate people using iverson's sheridan shot against the e75(its not gonna happen for almost any player)

formal vale Feb 11, 2020, 7:11 PM

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I would 100% support WG removing the missiles for a little bit to do some major tuning on the mechanic itself.

Seriously, the general populace shouldn't need to deal with this until they figure out what the issue really is.

I was very skeptical of the idea that these ATGMs would be blatantly OP when they first came out. "Give it a month or so to let people figure out how to counter them".

Well it's been a month. They're still broken.

Edit: Remove the ATGMs, not the tanks themselves is what I mean. I'd really like to see these tanks play with regular HEAT ammunition.

grave bear Feb 11, 2020, 7:19 PM

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atgms are basically as overperforming as charioteer, the only difference is that charioteer didnt ruin tier 9-10 meta

twilit crystal Feb 11, 2020, 7:25 PM

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Uh no charioteer had 2200 avg dmg every other tier 8 had 1900

formal vale Feb 11, 2020, 7:29 PM

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On a semi-unrelated note, I do think the Charrioteer could use a buff. Just the aim time and dispersion values. Anything more would be too much imo.

austere moat Feb 11, 2020, 7:29 PM

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I would like to see it tested with just sniper mode, to be honest

unreal kettle Feb 11, 2020, 7:50 PM

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With the new update to all the panther and the IS, t29, etc. will the su-152 get more pen to help with this because it only has 148 pen with collaborated shells using the 152mm gun and I’m finding myself using HEAT a lot and I’m losing lots of credits with that

grave bear Feb 11, 2020, 8:00 PM

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Lmao you anyway needed heat, honestly i've almost never used AP in kv2 / su152
always used HE or gold

viscid blade Feb 11, 2020, 8:00 PM

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Bruh I just used HE or AP, if u can’t pen just splash and do like 350

jagged crescent Feb 11, 2020, 8:01 PM

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The module and crew dmg is a plus

noble siren Feb 11, 2020, 8:04 PM

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@austere moat that's why I talk only about Sheridan because the tier 9 one is completely OP amd broken and it should receive some serious nerf. But the Sheridan is in a good spot atm for me. Never have the problem to deal with one of them or all of them. But in tier 8-9 the tier 9 is just OP, you can't do pretty much anything.

drowsy plaza Feb 11, 2020, 9:00 PM

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My personal T92E1 needs a buff. 28 games 50% this month. 2400 avg dmg - but hard to carry a team with its DPM....

formal vale Feb 11, 2020, 9:03 PM

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@drowsy plaza I personally struggled with the T92E1 at first as well. But you have to learn when and where to put your shots. Your effective dpm is much much higher than your theoretical dpm, so it's very much worth making every shot count.

stoic pebble Feb 11, 2020, 9:11 PM

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You always need time to get used to a tank. I was not doing very good in my first 75 ish games in the T92 but now I'm pulling huge numbers consistently.

drowsy plaza Feb 11, 2020, 9:11 PM

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I was 76% with 2500 avg dmg in my first 50 some odd games.

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I had Sheridan in live test so I was familiar

twilit crystal Feb 11, 2020, 9:14 PM

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the live test was a meme because of the spaced armor, WG shoudl really just put an article of each test tank and some basic tips to kill them.

unique scaffold Feb 11, 2020, 9:21 PM

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I'm a 40%er in the Sherdian over the past 30 days.

coarse harness Feb 11, 2020, 10:14 PM

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When I started to play with the T92 I spammed the rockets like crazy just cause of the fun and to try the new mechanic
I had like 2,5K avg dmg
Then I started to play seriously
I used like 1 or 2 missles out of 10 shots, only when I needed that extra pen or the unlimited depression and I curved some shots on ridgelines of course
I reached 3K and I was pretty satisfied with it but it went up further and further and I can still improve it pretty easily
And just to mention it I don't have the lookout area enabled🤷🏻‍♂️
So yeah the tank would be OP without missles as well
In most situations instead of using ATGM for the memes you can be much more effective with a good old flanking, peak-a-boo or hit and run
I think the planned nerf on these tanks are pretty good (exept for the APCR pen nerf on the Sheridan) but people won't stop crying about it no matter what🙃

📎 Screenshot_2020-02-11-22-45-59-300_net.wargaming.wot.blitz.assistant.jpg

latent snow Feb 11, 2020, 11:40 PM

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it changes the way people play, and people dont like change i guess

nimble zodiac Feb 11, 2020, 11:44 PM

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It changes the way people play so conservative playstyles are out the window. Basically forcing them to either retreat or lose too much by charging the missile tank

unique scaffold Feb 12, 2020, 12:57 AM

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You gotta change the way you use the missiles. Even if it’s lower damage and pen, it can still be shot to hit the side, without even exposing your tank at all. Sure, less damage per shot. But you’ll still be able to have a high reward for no risk.

flat bane Feb 12, 2020, 4:12 AM

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@nimble zodiac the AT's got a buff? When and how much armor was boosted 🤔

nimble zodiac Feb 12, 2020, 4:28 AM

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Update 6.7: AT 7s cupola buffed from 101mm to 130mm, and AT 8s cupola got buffed from 101mm to 120mm, with strengthened side weakspot. More hull armor was included too; covers super angled plates @flat bane pics are AT 8 changes

📎 image0.png 📎 image1.png

unique scaffold Feb 12, 2020, 5:45 AM

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@noble siren im glad that you don’t struggle with them, you are probably a 4000+ WN8 player that wins more than 70% of his games easy. Actual thing is the SIMPLE fact that it negates almost every aggressive positions that good players and even average players took to use their tank’s strengths, how is it balanced that 1 tank is essential in tournaments. Simply hitting shots without having to risk anything for it is a broken concept. Guys stop looking at the tanks average stats ffs, just think about it, at least 1500 damage you do with the missiles are most of the times a HP advantage! You don’t have the need to trade for it! That gives you a higher chance of winning, and no other tank has such ability. I have played almost 60 games on multiple accounts, and have a 78% wr and 3600+- avg dmg, took me way more effort to have such averages in the 215b. Most of my clutch games were me vs 1,2,3 players, but i was most of the time full hp! Why? Because i used missiles the right way! So i have seen worse players do the same thing, play hidden until they need to go out, with full hp and ready for a fight. Before you call me a crybaby, i am not complaining about them because i lose when i encounter them. In the past months i have quit playing my main acc and played on different other accounts, only with the Sheridan, annoying players almost every single game.

noble siren Feb 12, 2020, 9:23 AM

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@unique scaffold if you are good player and use everything right you can't blame the tank for working the way it was meant.

unique scaffold Feb 12, 2020, 9:42 AM

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@noble siren the way it was meant as in negating most usual positions where tanks were supposed to go now they can't and have to either rush in or hide? Very intelligent. @noble siren wait i don't get it didn't you call them like, balanced? The ATGMs not the tank

noble siren Feb 12, 2020, 9:45 AM

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Well not my fault for the poor design @unique scaffold

coarse harness Feb 12, 2020, 10:03 AM

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They are broken because they can do things other tanks can't
Kinda like the consumables

forest heath Feb 12, 2020, 10:33 AM

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My main problem with the atgm tanks is that they are stupidly well armored for light tanks, they are completely Hesh, HEAT or HE proof and even manage to bounce AP more often than I like. I can’t describe to you how many times I have managed to bounce a shot from them with my E-100

full token Feb 12, 2020, 10:36 AM

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Not completely he proof. You can still pen them on the turret and on the rear of the T92 with it, but it’s not very easy to hit

sleek pebble Feb 12, 2020, 10:41 AM

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T92 has only the wedge shape. doesnt have layered armor

sheridamn has a few places on the hull that isnt layered

exotic light Feb 12, 2020, 11:22 AM

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@sleek pebble yes the lower plates but theire hard to shoot i wish they let us pen the turret with HE

hearty steeple Feb 12, 2020, 11:29 AM

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But the problem with these new lights is not whether you can HE them or not. Removing the spaced armour isn't going to make the tank more balanced

forest heath Feb 12, 2020, 11:41 AM

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Remove the missiles and nerf the armor to reasonable standards

exotic light Feb 12, 2020, 11:54 AM

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The ones who says ATGMs is not OP here is the answer

📎 JPEG_20200212_145303.jpg

distant river Feb 12, 2020, 12:05 PM

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Wow one game where someone managed to do almost 5k damage shows so much! 🤦‍♀️

nimble zodiac Feb 12, 2020, 1:10 PM

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Guys, let 6.8 roll out with their planned nerfs and then ask for more

plush crypt Feb 12, 2020, 1:36 PM

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😄 😄 😄 just smasher

unique scaffold Feb 12, 2020, 1:43 PM

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@exotic light you realize that player do 5k damage in all sorts of tanks fairly often right?

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And do you really give him a thumbs down for playing well? How petty.

noble siren Feb 12, 2020, 1:45 PM

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@unique scaffold that's what kind of people the playerbase is most of the time...

unique scaffold Feb 12, 2020, 1:47 PM

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I know. It's sad.

hollow ledge Feb 12, 2020, 3:00 PM

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@exotic light You get triggered that someone has a good game in a tank you don’t like, so you downvote him?

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Yeah, that seems like a a fair and rational reaction......

exotic light Feb 12, 2020, 3:12 PM

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I was soo angrey so i give him thumbdown for saying Ez @hollow ledge

hollow ledge Feb 12, 2020, 3:12 PM

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So?

exotic light Feb 12, 2020, 3:26 PM

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So its just the tank man nothing personal everyone plays this tow tanks deserve dislike becaus he lost his humanity just by clicking the PLAY button@hollow ledge

rocky parcel Feb 12, 2020, 3:27 PM

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I have been downvoted for playing the Smasher as well

unique scaffold Feb 12, 2020, 3:31 PM

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Smasher is understandable Sheridan still isn’t really

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Neither is understandable. Downvoting a player because you don't like the tank they played is beyond petty.

polar linden Feb 12, 2020, 4:03 PM

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delete guided missiles

hollow ledge Feb 12, 2020, 4:05 PM

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@exotic light you downvote people because they play a tank they grinned for?

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Bro, complain to WG or something, he’s just playing a tank in the game

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I play the T92E1, do I deserve downvotes?

hearty steeple Feb 12, 2020, 4:07 PM

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The excessive amount of salt in the community kind of annoys me at this point

noble siren Feb 12, 2020, 4:15 PM

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Damn the APCR is sometimes a really stupid shell. Didn't pen 4 times in row the side's of T62 with Sheridan. Is there any chance to replace the APCR with just AP or it won't be realistic or something else?

exotic light Feb 12, 2020, 4:21 PM

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@hollow ledge if you spam ATGMs like he did so yes you deserve and say Ez at the end of the match so unsport and so glad for ATGM nerf

orchid grove Feb 12, 2020, 4:21 PM

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@hollow ledge He said it was because he said "EZ", which IMO is understandable

hollow ledge Feb 12, 2020, 4:23 PM

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@exotic light You left out an important detail

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I can understand downvoting someone who says EZ

unique scaffold Feb 12, 2020, 4:26 PM

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Unfortunately even a blatantly toxic player calling everyone racial slurs doesn’t actually receive the complaint most of the time, so the annoying dude who says EZ probably won’t receive it either

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@hollow ledge he didn't leave the important detail my dude, you just failed to see it lol he even pinged you.

jade cargoBOT Feb 12, 2020, 4:41 PM

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dynoSuccess Warning logged for Paddington#3646. They were not warned.

unique scaffold Feb 12, 2020, 4:46 PM

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Well at least he carried his weight before calling out "EZ". Only thing worse than that is the player who does nothing, gets carried, and then calls out "EZ" over global.

mellow cape Feb 12, 2020, 4:46 PM

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Dont downvote people if you want something to actually happen to them, send in a ticket

noble siren Feb 12, 2020, 4:59 PM

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As you can see Sheridan is so ez to play that people don't even bother to do damage. Even when there were 2 of them.

📎 Screenshot_2020-02-12-18-56-40-036_net.wargaming.wot.blitz.jpg

unique scaffold Feb 12, 2020, 5:13 PM

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you really wanna base it on 1 game? i can send screenshots too lmfao, this goes to nothing, so many good arguments against them and so few ones pro... must mean something

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Gonna waste 10 mins, but whatever.
#666263717033541662 exists for a reason.

nocturne mauve Feb 12, 2020, 5:27 PM

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People who say “Ez” have no respect

jade cargoBOT Feb 12, 2020, 5:33 PM

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dynoSuccess FoxTrot774#2045 has been warned.

hollow ledge Feb 12, 2020, 6:35 PM

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@unique scaffold no he edited it to say EZ afterwards

dense yoke Feb 12, 2020, 6:41 PM

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yes mabye same min

formal vale Feb 12, 2020, 10:02 PM

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I only say "EZ" if someone else has an attitude. They start trash talking and then we beat them up, that's when I whip out the EZ card

meager spruce Feb 12, 2020, 10:32 PM

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People who are posting screenshots are picking out the ones that will best serve their point/s.

jagged crescent Feb 12, 2020, 11:55 PM

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It’s almost as if we like to cherry pick the items that support our arguments the most

empty copper Feb 13, 2020, 12:26 AM

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Can we talk about Tier V HT balance?

KV-1 has the worst pen, DPM, aim time, and bloom, and second-worst dispersion of all tanks in the tier.

It got a huge nerf to side armour recently, and then the T1 Heavy and BDR G1 B got significant armour buffs. Now the T1 Heavy has more side armour than the KV-1 has front armour. In fact the KV-1 has the worst frontal hull armour in the tier, and since the nerf it has the second-worst side armour.

KV-1 has middle-of-the-range camo, but pays for it with the worst view range by far in the tier.

Unsurprisingly, this plays out as you'd expect: KV-1 trails badly in damage per battle, damage ratio, kills and kill:death ratio, and survival when compared to the T1 Heavy. Looking at the winrate curves it's clear that while KV-1 may be balanced now, T1 Heavy is just brokenly overpowered, especially in the hands of more capable players.

Can we please get the T1 Heavy armour buffs wound back a bit, get the KV-1's side armour back, and maybe either a front armour and/or firepower buff for the iconic Russian?

I'm not a good enough person to leave my T1 in the garage, but I have to admit every time I take it out to tick off those Encounter kill, HT win, toon kill and toon win missions I do feel just a little bit dirty.... plus I'd like to be able to drive my KV-1 again without feeling like the runt of the litter. If I want that feeling, I'll drive my Churchill III and at least I'll make some credits while everyone pokes holes straight through my armour regardless of angle or sidescrape...

📎 unknown.png

nimble zodiac Feb 13, 2020, 12:30 AM

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Bdr got armor buffs?

safe lotus Feb 13, 2020, 12:30 AM

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Wargaming is not better in the last 5 years. Thx for nothing

indigo tinsel Feb 13, 2020, 12:33 AM

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I’m really starting to get sick of WG making tier 10 tanks that should be in the tech tree into premium tanks. Like the chieftain, the WZ111-5A, and more. And now they’re doing it with the super conqueror as well which is just plain dumb. Putting the best and most well known tier 10 tanks behind a HUGE paywall? Not okay in my opinion. They are getting far too greedy. They are adding these new “vickers” British heavy tanks into the British tech tree in tier 9 and 10, tanks that literally no one cares about, and then selling the super conqueror as a premium. I really love blitz and I can look past balance issues and other issues, but this is really starting to get on my nerves. I’d probably be literally the LAST player to permanently quit this game, but even so, this is still angering me. They really need to stop it with the tier 10 premiums and focus on tier 8 premiums, I don’t care how many tier 8 premiums they add as long as they are vaguely balanced.

regal grove Feb 13, 2020, 12:53 AM

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60 km/h Grille day 53

empty copper Feb 13, 2020, 1:42 AM

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@nimble zodiac In update 6.4:

So it was not ok for the KV-1 to have 75mm side armour, but it was OK for the BDR to get its side armour buffed to 80mm. I was smh at the time and having driven all these tanks since, even more so now.

📎 unknown.png

ebon falcon Feb 13, 2020, 2:28 AM

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There is no #tank-balance-discussion before any #666622130934251560 towards T92 & Sheridan tanks. Thank you, good night.

unique scaffold Feb 13, 2020, 2:31 AM

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T92E and Sheridan, with their missiles and speed, have a completely unfair advantage for players who use those attributes effectively. Those tanks need to be seriously nerfed, or missiles need to be removed from the game,

autumn zodiac Feb 13, 2020, 2:38 AM

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While the missiles need to be changed I can't say the Argument of "unfair advantage for players who use those attributes Effectively" is a sound argument.

The issue is the maneuverability it just too much, Missiles should be only able to make minor adjustments to flight path

ebon falcon Feb 13, 2020, 2:49 AM

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@autumn zodiac So there's no problem with Spaced armour in these two, along with big alpha gun, penetration?

autumn zodiac Feb 13, 2020, 2:49 AM

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Penetration is also confirmed to be Nerfed...

Spaced armor is pretty much only on the Sheridan, and it's not a tiny Tank either, while it gets the Perk Light tanks get for Camo Rating it's neither stealthy nor a small target

nimble zodiac Feb 13, 2020, 3:34 AM

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@empty copper At least KV-1 has an awesome turret

empty copper Feb 13, 2020, 4:44 AM

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You can still kind of sidescrape in it too, but you're relying on ricochet so the angles are more restricted and you have to expose more thin front plate to fire.

unique scaffold Feb 13, 2020, 5:41 AM

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@meager spruce well that is kind of the whole point of sending screenshots, right? proving your point innit?

meager spruce Feb 13, 2020, 5:54 AM

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@unique scaffold yeah, but they pick out what best suits them. For example they do 15 battles in Gravedigger. In 14 battles they do 0 dmg and in 1 they do 4K (for example). Then they send a message saying "ProOF tHAt gRAvEdiGgeR iS OP" with only the battle with 4k dmg attached.

nimble zodiac Feb 13, 2020, 5:59 AM

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I think Grave’s balanced, mediocre pen, and the gun depression kills it. Overall a heavy boi, which remains fast somehow

versed fable Feb 13, 2020, 6:24 AM

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the missile is not going anywhere so embrace it. The future is now

gleaming flicker Feb 13, 2020, 7:50 AM

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Please devs... Remove the missile tonk 😏
Or balance their trajectory, curving limit, Increase the speed to make it hard for close range shots, trickshot etc.😏

stray rock Feb 13, 2020, 8:43 AM

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please nerf @worthy basin hehehe

worthy basin Feb 13, 2020, 8:45 AM

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please don't 😂

mellow cape Feb 13, 2020, 8:46 AM

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Amaunet already got nerfed from purple to blue stats sadly 😭

nimble zodiac Feb 13, 2020, 1:15 PM

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You were too good at the game, something had to be done 👀

latent snow Feb 13, 2020, 2:35 PM

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Would everyone be happy if the missiles were bad at turning? I don’t want this feature removed :/

hearty steeple Feb 13, 2020, 2:49 PM

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There are no amount of nerfs to the tanks they hate and no amount of buffs to the tanks they love that will satisfy the community. Some popular CCs said that they want the feature removed and i respect their opinion. But this place is an echo chamber.

unique scaffold Feb 13, 2020, 5:16 PM

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@unique scaffold in English please

unique scaffold Feb 13, 2020, 6:14 PM

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Not the channel to discuss MM in

noble siren Feb 13, 2020, 7:54 PM

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Is there any way we can balance the community first and then the tanks?

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And will there be any nerf for E3, Foch155 and Stb?

drifting depot Feb 13, 2020, 8:26 PM

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I think I don't need to say anything...

noble siren Feb 13, 2020, 8:37 PM

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...

distant river Feb 13, 2020, 8:40 PM

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You don't need to say anything because it's already been said by someone else and posting a link to a video here is completely useless?

And a you did what you just agreed was useless anyway because... ? @drifting depot

drifting depot Feb 13, 2020, 8:41 PM

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Exactly

flat bane Feb 13, 2020, 9:03 PM

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Ok

regal grove Feb 14, 2020, 2:06 AM

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60 km/h Grille day 54

flat bane Feb 14, 2020, 3:43 AM

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20 Km/h Grille day 129

tribal lodge Feb 14, 2020, 1:47 PM

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Buff jagdtiger speed. it is too slow for that tank. cant even climb a hill without getting pen

drifting depot Feb 14, 2020, 4:26 PM

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Climbing a hill won't make your armor stronger to begin with m8 and the real life one was far slower

stone vapor Feb 14, 2020, 9:12 PM

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missles wouldnt be as broken if they were lazer guided rather than lock ur turret and shoot into the air then hit

distant river Feb 14, 2020, 9:19 PM

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No they would be completely and utterly useless

nimble zodiac Feb 14, 2020, 10:17 PM

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Not completely... there's still the "hit the dude behind a building" manuever

distant river Feb 14, 2020, 10:23 PM

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Not if the are laser guided/line of sight in sniper mode only

latent snow Feb 14, 2020, 11:13 PM

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I don’t even use missiles in my t92, the shell velocity on the apcr is just so good

drifting depot Feb 15, 2020, 12:32 AM

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As long as you're able to hit something from behind cover without any sort of risk other than getting rushed while reloading it's just broken

nimble zodiac Feb 15, 2020, 12:55 AM

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@distant river but... you can make the missile hit the "cover" but you have to time it right. Let it fly and then look at the cover and the missile flies where the enemy is

tough temple Feb 15, 2020, 1:37 AM

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Rumours says the sheridan will get serious nerfs, tbh that's very good.

It means WG heard us

Idk, they nerfed only 10mm pen on APCR @unique scaffold

unique scaffold Feb 15, 2020, 1:44 AM

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Rumors have it wargaming instead increased ATGM spam by nerfing the wrong ammunition

crude pumice Feb 15, 2020, 2:17 AM

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ATGM will get nerf together, and ATGM shooting is cause of low dpm.
I don't worry spam spam spam spam egg spam bacon spam...

unique scaffold Feb 15, 2020, 2:18 AM

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@tough temple you do know 230mm pen on APCR at T10 literally can’t go through almost anything

crude pumice Feb 15, 2020, 2:27 AM

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it's doubt. 230mm with calibrated shell has 240mm and it can go through tier10 like 183's HESH.
T92 and sheridan have best mobility, so they will have to do run and gun more, not camp and sniping.

unique scaffold Feb 15, 2020, 2:30 AM

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@crude pumice APCR is weaker and worse than AP and btw the 152mm doesn’t have the same gun length or power as the 183 and if they even do have the best mobility having to run CS just to get back upto the old pen which was still weak makes them unbearable to drive and no Sheridan or T92 ever sniped if you saw one doing that odds are they were a 46%er

regal grove Feb 15, 2020, 2:51 AM

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60 km/h Grille day 55

crude pumice Feb 15, 2020, 3:27 AM

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@unique scaffold It is still good as it is not nerfed by 220mm penetration HEAT bullets. Historically, Sheridan had 20 HEATs and 9 ATGMs, and should be pleased with the great benefits of just being able to fire the APCR. (I think these tanks should be changed to 220mm HEAT.)
The game doesn't have to be historical, but these tank adjustments are no good.
It is clear that it is too strong considering that they are fast, single shot powerful, good penetration, good concealment, and it can ignore the enemy's defense posture with missiles.
The risk of taking damage per shot was too low, so it's reasonable to nerf the amount of damage done instead of increasing the risk of taking damage.

visual lance Feb 15, 2020, 4:23 AM

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WarGaming should nerf fv badger, armor is broken too

harsh mist Feb 15, 2020, 4:23 AM

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NERF ATGM

soft spindle Feb 15, 2020, 4:46 AM

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Every tank is balanced, some are just more balanced then others

flat bane Feb 15, 2020, 6:35 AM

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Nerf MS-1 it's too strong compared to the other T1... oh wait 5.5 happend. 👏 😭

distant river Feb 15, 2020, 9:29 AM

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@nimble zodiac Yeah you can make it hit the rock, just not the tank behind the rock

unique scaffold Feb 15, 2020, 10:24 AM

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The sp1c auto loader gun should be buffed ( I think the magazine reload time should be decreased )

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That and buff the penetration to at least 175mm, not only it got overnerfed 3 years ago but it got power creeped by the numerous tier 7 buffs

tough temple Feb 15, 2020, 11:35 AM

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Guys what do you think about a buff on FCM 50 t? It's a balanced tank but demands high skill with meds from the player because it's bigger than E50 M, have a mediocre agility for medium and the armor... welp at least you won't get so much HE with that armor.
The only really good things on the tank are the HP poll and the cannon but that's not enought to be as popular as other tier 8 premium tank

That's the proof about why FCM needs a buff @distant river, the tank is balanced but you need great skills for reach it

distant river Feb 15, 2020, 11:38 AM

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I think the first thing you said is perfect "it's a balanced tank" ie it needs no changes at all

If a tank is balanced then by definition it needs no buffs or nerfs 🤦‍♀️

full token Feb 15, 2020, 11:46 AM

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So do you know what happens when you take a balanced tank and give it buffs? @tough temple

hearty steeple Feb 15, 2020, 11:47 AM

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You foch up that tank. That is what happens

tough temple Feb 15, 2020, 11:48 AM

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It's balanced when you get the playstyle of the FCM, and even with it your stats won't be as high as other tanks
It's the hardest tank to play in tier 8
So a buff would make it easier

distant river Feb 15, 2020, 11:49 AM

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It's either balanced or it's not, and it's definitely balanced. It is definitely not the hardest tank to play at tier 8 and it definitely needs no nerfs or buffs

mellow cape Feb 15, 2020, 11:49 AM

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Lmao its one of the weakest tier 8 tanks and it doesnt need a buff

unique scaffold Feb 15, 2020, 11:50 AM

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FCM is a great tank actually, weird trollish armour on the front and turret that get way more bounces than it should, great pen on its ammo and decent gun depression. @tough temple hardest tank to play is a tank that is bad. I’d say the 13 90 is the hardest one to play. @tough temple easily gets rekt by a t44? With 100 more hitpoints? 37 more pen? Also dont forget that it is way more flexible than the t44 with the combination of extra pen and gun depr. The size of it is not an issue if u know the positions to play it in. It is kind of a beast against lower tier meds and still holds up well against t9 with that penetration. There are worse tanks that need buffs, the FCM is a perfect tank. Not touched for a while just how it should be. Also by trollish armour im talking about the actual turret and the front plate, no tracks involved.

tough temple Feb 15, 2020, 11:58 AM

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@unique scaffold the "trolling armour" is called as 30mm of tracks

But an actual French heavy tank with an ultra size and mediocre speed, makes the tank don't fit so much at the medium tank game. The only thing that you can do is flank at long distances and give support by the sides of the battlefield

I played a lot with 13 90 and welp, at least it isn't a vehicle bigger than an E50M, and at least can run 62km/h

Even @mellow cape agree it's one of the weakest tier 8, but about the "doesn't need a buff" part that he said... I wish it's irony

It's a great tank in the hands of who really knows how to work with this tank, but the average player than fights in a T-44 can just erase the FCM

mellow cape Feb 15, 2020, 12:01 PM

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@tough temple that part is irony sorry for not making it clear

distant river Feb 15, 2020, 12:11 PM

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Just because it's not op like most tier 8 prems it doesn't mean it's one of the weakest tanks at tier 8 🤦‍♀️

If it's a balanced tank then it shouldn't be changed. It is a balanced tank. It doesn't need a change. Good players do well, bad players don't. That is exactly how every other tank works as well. It needs to change at all. @tough temple

tough temple Feb 15, 2020, 12:15 PM

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Actually I never said about OP premium tanks at tier 8 while talking about FCM but here we go.

You don't need an OP tank to compare, say 3 names of tier 8 medium tank and let's compare in blitzstars
@distant river, compare how players do with the tank, wr and general stats

Welp if you didn't say names in 5 minutes, so I'll show 3 medium tanks that really fits perfectly and how players use them

distant river Feb 15, 2020, 12:28 PM

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Compare all of them and see that it has a WR of 49% (better than average) and it is about half way up the list for all stats. It is balanced. It doesn't need any change at all

tough temple Feb 15, 2020, 12:32 PM

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That's the average player's numbers in 4 different French medium tanks

Want with another 3 tanks being compared?

(The seccond image shows what things are being compared)

📎 Screenshot_20200215-093106.jpg 📎 Screenshot_20200215-093115.jpg

distant river Feb 15, 2020, 12:38 PM

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And those 3 are all great tanks, even the CDC which only has slightly better stats than it, all you are showing is that it's worse than 3 good prems... 🤦‍♀️

If you think a tank with a WR 5% higher than average should get a buff then you really need to think about what's going on inside your head.

You have agreed that it is a balanced tank. It is not too good and it is not too bad. It does not need to be changed. How hard is this to understand? I can't really put it in simpler language but you still don't look like you understand.

tough temple Feb 15, 2020, 12:42 PM

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I said "It's a balanced tank but demands high skill with meds from the player".
(Now I'll copy and paste what you said)
How hard is this to understand? I can't really put it in simpler language but you still don't look like you understand

I compared most of tier 8 premium medium tanks, and only where is wins on stats, most of times are from number of player's, average spots and rarely average dmg

📎 Screenshot_20200215-093824.jpg 📎 Screenshot_20200215-093737.jpg 📎 Screenshot_20200215-093553.jpg

distant river Feb 15, 2020, 12:51 PM

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You really don't understand at all do you? If a good players do well and average players don't, then it's exactly the same as every other tank that isn't OP...

You still don't have a clue about what to compare things to because you are still only looking at prems and anyone with half a brain knows that most prems at tier 8 are too good. Try comparing it to balanced tanks and you will see that they have basically the same stats, because the FCM is balanced
Try comparing it to tanks that are too good (like you are doing) and you will see that it is worse than them, because the FCM is balanced

See how these are all balanced tanks below, and it has similar stats (slightly better than 2 because it's a prem so no grind). See how it doesn't need any changes at all?

📎 Screenshot_2020-02-15-12-49-51-870_com.android.chrome.jpg

tough temple Feb 15, 2020, 12:54 PM

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We usually compare premiums with premiums, ma friend

distant river Feb 15, 2020, 1:01 PM

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That's your first issue there, why on earth would you do that? You compare tanks against everything at that tier, and see that it has average WR, and damage which are basically the only 2 things you need to look at.
Obviously if you try and compare a balanced tank against great tanks then the balanced one is going to look worse isn't it? It doesn't take a genius to figure this out or to figure out that the FCM needs no change whatsoever.

dense yoke Feb 15, 2020, 1:08 PM

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imo i think fcm is meh. every tank can pen the armor, somtimes it will bounce. it is soooooo huge, that it is so annoying, i mean trying to run from a tank or hide behind a bulding from a tank is gonna be a pain for the fcm because its big. it has speed which is nice. but imo it needs a buff to compete with other premiums.

distant river Feb 15, 2020, 1:11 PM

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So basically you want to make the tank too good making tier 8 even worse, well at least we all know that's one person's opinion to completely ignore in the future...

Handy reminder to everyone, if what you are suggesting is going to make the game worse, don't suggest it and save yourself the trouble of losing the argument

P.S. it might be worth reading the rules again you seem to have missed the no politics bit

@dense yoke It's got a great gun and a troll turret and hull if you know how to use it as well as speed, you shouldn't be relying on it's armour at all. Again you are making the stupid point about making it as good as the other premiums that are too good which will break tier 8 more.

dense yoke Feb 15, 2020, 1:20 PM

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imo fcm needs buff. Great gun, speed and big tank which is bad.

distant river Feb 15, 2020, 1:21 PM

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So you are saying it needs a buff because it's big? Wow what a well thought out and backed up point you have made 🤦‍♀️

jade cargoBOT Feb 15, 2020, 1:27 PM

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dynoSuccess SAAS#4430 has been warned.

karmic steeple Feb 15, 2020, 2:03 PM

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Fcm is a great tank tbh

wind turret Feb 15, 2020, 2:05 PM

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I have 100% win rate in it and a good amount of battles in it, i things is relatively balanced

distant river Feb 15, 2020, 2:18 PM

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2000 people still play it, just because you can't play it well it doesn't mean other people can't 🤦‍♀️

latent snow Feb 15, 2020, 2:57 PM

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Sheridan should not get apcr pen nerf change my mind

crystal spoke Feb 15, 2020, 2:58 PM

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It's also been quite a while since the fcm was sold (personally its balanced but I just cant seem to mesh it into my style)

regal grove Feb 15, 2020, 3:28 PM

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60 km/h Grille day 56
Fcm in good hands can farm damage. Fcm in bad hands gets farmed. Even though Imo it’s on the lower end, it is balanced - and that’s what the other tanks should strive to be - good strengths and obvious weaknesses
*if a tank doesn’t have that good strengths, it should not have any big weaknesses; the good gun is countered by size, countered by almost HE-proof armor; the perspective of balanced in tier 8 is just messed up by dooky-strong tier 8’s powercreeping balance in the tier

cerulean agate Feb 15, 2020, 3:43 PM

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so Ive been playing with chaffee for a bit now, my only complaints is just its top speed. 56 for a light tank is just awful, compared it to the t21, type64, cromwell. The tank just cant glide like a usual light. Mostly Id play it like a medium with great accuracy and camo, and no armor, like a obj140, problem is I just cant stand against that a light tank has a topspeed in the 50s kmph

dense yoke Feb 15, 2020, 6:23 PM

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@distant river oh please, you're starting to get annoying when doing 🤦‍♀️. i mean no offence, but if you keep doing this there wont be anyone who like you. Also every fcm i meet dies by my teammate hands or mine

nimble zodiac Feb 15, 2020, 6:24 PM

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@distant river no I mean when the missile gets far enough it’ll arc into the tank and not the rock in front of it

karmic steeple Feb 15, 2020, 6:37 PM

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@dense yoke he’s right though the fcm is definitely playable and I do great in it. Just have to learn how to play it

dense yoke Feb 15, 2020, 7:27 PM

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@karmic steeple Yes. Every tank has a diffuculty of learning it. But i just havent met any good fcm players yet. i said fcm was trash because of the players i met in a fcm fighting me.

karmic steeple Feb 15, 2020, 7:34 PM

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So based on your own experience a tank is bad?

twilit crystal Feb 15, 2020, 7:47 PM

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i still dont get why WG buffed every tier 6 heavy to be unpennable by the kv2 which ruined balancing in so many aspects such as the ARL instead of just giving them spaced armor lol

noble siren Feb 15, 2020, 8:29 PM

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Whoever says that 230mm or 240mm of APCR pen is enough at tier 10, has never played Sheridan. This type is so garbage that you can bounce side armor of T62 4 times in a row shot at angle of 90°. Wg should not touch the APCR if they gonna change something it should be only the ATGM.

karmic steeple Feb 15, 2020, 9:00 PM

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Don’t really know where you’re bouncing at it should easily go through the side
The strongest armor of point of the sides only has 95mm

nocturne nova Feb 15, 2020, 9:17 PM

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delete this trash rockets

true relic Feb 15, 2020, 9:49 PM

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@noble siren your aim must be really bad cause its 75mm thick armor and its pretty easy to not hit the tracks and pen

jade cargoBOT Feb 15, 2020, 10:16 PM

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dynoSuccess Pearchy#3290 has been warned.

flat bane Feb 15, 2020, 10:16 PM

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Lol

plush trellis Feb 15, 2020, 10:16 PM

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@noble siren bruh momento. Do you even think before debating? 😂
@odd sun agreed

drowsy plaza Feb 15, 2020, 10:21 PM

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The APCR on the T92E1 already tended to bounce off the side of IS-3 turrets - with CS on the T92E1. Shouldn’t bounce - now with the lesser pen....

karmic steeple Feb 15, 2020, 10:25 PM

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How tho most of it isn’t even 200mm thick

plush trellis Feb 15, 2020, 10:26 PM

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Magic

flat bane Feb 15, 2020, 10:40 PM

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@plush trellis did he say 240mm of APCR pen is bad? On a T9 and T10 light tank?

He can't pen the side of a T62A.....

plush trellis Feb 15, 2020, 10:41 PM

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T10, the problem is. His 230-240mm of apcr can't pen 75mm of side armor. 😂 @flat bane

drifting depot Feb 16, 2020, 12:38 AM

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Ma man you gotta be really bad at the game or just be extremely unlucky with rng to not pen 75mm of side armor with anything at tier 9 and 10, even stock tanks

latent snow Feb 16, 2020, 12:49 AM

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I think he just shot too low and just did track damage

main tulip Feb 16, 2020, 1:48 AM

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Anyone else think Challenger should be buffed, irl it was able to keep up with Cromwells, so I think it could use a bit of a mobility buff at least

plush trellis Feb 16, 2020, 2:35 AM

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Yes, i think it should get a buff. I also think the amx ac 46 needs one too.

harsh ravine Feb 16, 2020, 2:45 AM

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theyre gonna say "We are satisfied with their playstyle"

flat bane Feb 16, 2020, 2:56 AM

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Amx ac 46 needs a buff ngl

empty copper Feb 16, 2020, 5:13 AM

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@distant river I like how you use Centurion I as an example of a balanced tank. Good one, I nearly snorted coffee out my nose 😂 That tank has been last or second last on the WG balance charts for 55-65% players as long as I can remember. The relative win rate charts in your screenshot show the same thing - Cent I underperforms for all players at all skill levels. It's just a horrible dog of a tank and I cannot understand why it's been allowed to languish in that state for so long.

flat bane Feb 16, 2020, 8:53 AM

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:0

unique scaffold Feb 16, 2020, 9:36 AM

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@empty copper you’re wrong, the centurion 1 is not a horrible tank, it just asks for more skill and a different gameplay. Just like leo 1 at t10, also one of the last on the charts, do you also think the leo is a ‘horrible dog of a tank’?

noble siren Feb 16, 2020, 10:34 AM

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Just said that the APCR will not be that reliable with low pen at tier 10 (for Sheridan) didn't meant that 240 pen is weak, and that I couldn't pen the sides of the T62 because it's weak but because of the type of ammo. If it was AP I was not going to have problem with 230 pen. My idea was that the APCR will be absorbed by the tracks of the heavy tanks which happens to me a lot (not completely sure that it works like that so no need to put clown faces on every person with different opinion)

quiet veldt Feb 16, 2020, 11:23 AM

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What is your thoughts on letting the player use MGs on the tanks but only for about 15-20 meters and only for a short time (cant pen the tank) and only 1x per battle

empty copper Feb 16, 2020, 1:35 PM

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@unique scaffold more skill? The tank underperforms at all skill levels. That's not my opinion, that's what the numbers say. No matter how highly skilled the player, they will win more in other tanks at the tier than they do in the Centurion I.

The'horrible dog' is my opinion. Cent I is slow, huge, lacks any hull armour, and the 'strong turret' is easily penned by tier IX tanks. The alpha is terrible and forces continuous exposure in a tank that is unable to brawl and unable to run if pushed.

I don't own the Leo 1 so I don't really have an opinion. It is statistically weaker than the T-62A though, especially among highly skilled players who get more out of the T-62A than they can get out of the Leopard 1.

Compare the Centurion with the T-44. The better the player, the more wins they get with the T-44; but you don't see the same thing with the Centurion, because it's - yup - a horrible dog of a tank.

Edit: @unique scaffold I know how to read a chart, pal. And what the charts say is that if you are getting a higher win rate out of your Centurion I than out of your T-44, then you are a very rare bird indeed, because practically no-one else is managing that trick.

unique scaffold Feb 16, 2020, 1:38 PM

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@empty copper i can assure you that you have no idea what u r talking. The centurion is definitely not that weak of a tank, and the comparison you did was pretty bad, t44 barely has any frontal armour except the turret, no pen and only 7 degrees of gun depr, the centurion is way more flexible and in the right hands it can be a pain to go against. Also t9 tanks pen anything so that is a bad comparison. There are many other tanks with better stats on paper but less flexibility which may be more foolproof but can’t give u that much when u master them, unlike the centurion. Oh yeah btw leo 1 is statistically the worst t10 med, but it is way more flexible than the likes of obj 140 or 121b, it can perform way better than the 2 if played correctly. @empty copper im glad that u can read, but can you play? If you could do it well the you not have any issue with the centurion. Checked your stats on the cent and it clearly tells me you have no clue how to play it. No offense but i can’t take this seriously when it seems like it is a personal matter.

unique scaffold Feb 16, 2020, 2:21 PM

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best DPM in game
best gun
highly mobile
‘Leopard is statistically worst tank in game’
Yeah, no.

distant river Feb 16, 2020, 2:23 PM

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@dense yoke I'm not here to get people to like me I'm here to make this game better for everyone, which doesn't include buffing s balanced tank.

@nimble zodiac So you have to rely on pure luck to hit any useful shots? Sounds like something people will love...

@empty copper The cent 1 is a balanced tank, great if you know how to play it, and if you don't then it will suck.

tribal lodge Feb 16, 2020, 2:51 PM

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make all td have faster travere speed

drowsy plaza Feb 16, 2020, 3:10 PM

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@karmic steeple yeah. I bounced 3/4 APCR on a IS-3 in nearly this exact position. Fortunately he was a low 40%’er who just sat and let me hit him. He was in the River on Canyon. I couldn’t get any further forward as there where two tds spawn. Then bounced another off the center of his engine deck

📎 image0.png

crystal spoke Feb 16, 2020, 3:13 PM

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The cent 1 is one of my favorite ridge liners as when used properly it's a good tank. Why are you comparing a medium to the teir above of course its gonna get penned that just how theirs work and a t44 isn't a good comparison since they are drastically different in playstyle

karmic steeple Feb 16, 2020, 3:32 PM

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Idk what to tell ya it should be an easy pen

lunar niche Feb 16, 2020, 3:50 PM

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You're shooting a russian tank, ofcourse it will get magical bounce.

formal vale Feb 16, 2020, 4:57 PM

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@drowsy plaza did they have the stock turret or the top turret?

meager spruce Feb 16, 2020, 5:22 PM

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@empty copper I just want to say that a lot of good players (such as meadsy or 3very) prefer to play the leo 1 over other tier 10 meds because if you got the skills, you can outplay any other tank. In short, leo1 is very skill based.

unique scaffold Feb 16, 2020, 5:25 PM

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Ye I probably would not do all that well in it

nimble zodiac Feb 16, 2020, 6:33 PM

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@distant river I guess luck means timing your shots correctly

regal grove Feb 16, 2020, 6:56 PM

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I don’t ever remember a centurion I player carrying me or the over fan ever in 20k battles 🤔
60 km/h Grille day 57

drowsy plaza Feb 16, 2020, 7:00 PM

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Cent I suffers from weak eyebrow so anyone who can aim can scalp you. It’s been powercrept and the reverse speed is it’s only real bonus over the Caernarvon. It can perform- but needs positioning with time and distance to work.

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@karmic steeple so many easy Pens have been bouncing of late for me. Same IS-3 bounced two here. Generally I hate fighting IS type tanks unless I have god like pen as the Stalinium seems to absorb more than it should. Eventually I just nailed him with a heat missile.

📎 image0.png

jagged crescent Feb 16, 2020, 7:21 PM

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The APCR of the new lights are perfectly fine. I'm just more miffed with the unrealistic missile mechanics that can mean easy 90 degree verticle turns at a range of less than 100 meters

"Hee Hoo lemme lob a missile like they're a basketball"

austere moat Feb 16, 2020, 8:33 PM

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@meager spruce thé question we should ask about the leopard 1 is:
Would Meadsy, or 3very, use it in a tournament match? Would they choose it over an STB-1, or a T-62A, or a T-22?

That should tell how the tank deals against other players.
The Leopard 1 is a skill-based tank, for sure. You rely on your skill, and the lack of skill from your opponents. Face any 60%er in a leopard against any 60%er in, say, an STB. Or a T-22. Or a T-62. 9/10 times, the leopard will lose. Not to mention the fact that unless you wanna show off your *** to the reds, the leopard is the only HE magnet of them.

In my opinion, the charts made in #devs-answers should be based off of how they deal in tournament play, not how they deal in pub play. Base buffs and nerfs off the pros, facing pros, not the high level players facing versus the low level players.

unique scaffold Feb 16, 2020, 8:36 PM

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STB-1 I rate

meager spruce Feb 16, 2020, 8:43 PM

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@austere moat sorry, forgot to clarify that I was meaning a 1v1 on a flat ground. Also about the tourney part you said, the caller for the team decides what tanks the players take for what maps and on some occasions a leo may be more beneficial than a T62.

formal vale Feb 16, 2020, 9:13 PM

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1v1s on flat ground never happen. It's useless to call that sort of situation into question.

orchid grove Feb 16, 2020, 9:15 PM

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I only have Leopard in 1 strat, and other than that, it's only good as a climbing tank

twilit crystal Feb 16, 2020, 9:37 PM

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literally fighting in a 1v1 in flat ground is a dumb idea in most tanks, always try to fight distance for damage whenever you can

austere moat Feb 16, 2020, 9:54 PM

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That should be how balance is looked at. Not at how good or bad a tank is on paper, or how 55-65% players play against 30-70% players, but how 55-65% players do while organized against other 55-65% players.

heady moat Feb 16, 2020, 10:15 PM

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Do you would like that wg buff the turret of the E 100? The turret of this SUPER heavy is much weak for tier 10 parameters, level 9 tds and some heavys can pen without gold ammo and it is sad... Vote 1 for yes and vote 2 for no.

severe valve Feb 16, 2020, 10:16 PM

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I think the sheridans armor should be buffed because I get penned in it too often

austere moat Feb 16, 2020, 10:17 PM

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It does need another 15-20mm turret armor. DMG you have to admit the tank is rather weak currently
They have a point - it is a super heavy, and it does get penned in the turret with ease - the only things that struggle at all are tier 9 meds, it seems.
At its absolute strongest point with enhanced Armor, it only gets 340mm on any point in the turret

severe valve Feb 16, 2020, 10:26 PM

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yeah it needs to be heavier too because when I ram the E100 at full speed I take too much damage

karmic steeple Feb 16, 2020, 10:36 PM

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Shouldn’t the missiles be able to turn faster too? Isn’t the point to be able to hit stuff like a heat seeking missile? Kinda silly that some stupid building can make me miss my missile shot

austere moat Feb 16, 2020, 10:41 PM

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@severe valve What, you disagree with the opinion that the E-100 is a bad tank? It's playable in pubs, but it is very mediocre at best.

severe valve Feb 16, 2020, 10:44 PM

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no I"m talking about the sheridan

jagged crescent Feb 16, 2020, 10:52 PM

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I honestly prefer a LFP buff for the E100
Most I can get out of the LFP is 250-260 of the armor at PERFECT angle. Enhanced armor may buff that to 260-270 but most tanks (aside from meds which would flank for side shots) have pen to go through that.

Response to NMH: It doesn’t have to be major or mandatory Maybe like 5mm buff if it needs a buff at all. Either way, using the e100 in comps isn’t going to work.

austere moat Feb 16, 2020, 11:09 PM

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That's the point of a weak spot.... Don't eliminate that sort of weak spot... Instead, eliminate the unintended weakspot that's now a weakspot...

empty copper Feb 17, 2020, 1:02 AM

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So the argument is that the Centurion I is balanced, despite routinely coming last or 2nd last in pretty much any important performance measure amongst tier VIII meds (except survival, it's only 4th last for that) for players with overall 45-55% win rates. This (we are told) is because in the hands of a player who 'gets it', it's more versatile than any other tier VIII medium.

So who are these players who 'get it'? Not 55-65% win rate players; for them, the Centurion I is 3rd last for win rate and 2nd last for damage on the WG balance charts. Not any of the top 3 record holders in the Centurion either; for all of them, the Centurion lags behind their other tier VIII mediums for damage, kills, damage and kill ratios, spots and survival. Only the top Centurion I player of all time had a higher win rate in it than in the other tier VIII meds, and even then, it's only a 28-battle sample (so heavily influenced by honeymoon matches and less statistically significant than that player's results in other tanks with more games played). And even then, the only area where the cent stands out is the win rate, when every other measure shows it lagging the competition, in the hands of the best Centurion player on blitzstars.

I'm really curious now; who are these players for whom the Centurion I outperforms their other tier VIII meds?

nimble zodiac Feb 17, 2020, 1:11 AM

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I say buff the turret :p

jagged crescent Feb 17, 2020, 1:12 AM

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For both centurions, there’s a part behind the turret mantle where there’s literally no armor (that means there’s around 200m of armor there only factoring the mantle). I’d just fix that and maybe buff the cheeks around the mantle

📎 image0.png

nimble zodiac Feb 17, 2020, 2:23 AM

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@jagged crescent Obj. 252U and many other tanks have mantlet-only armor

jagged crescent Feb 17, 2020, 2:53 AM

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The Obj 252Us mantlet is thicker and more sharpy angled. And the rest of the turret front is basically an auto-bounce
@nimble zodiac

vale sun Feb 17, 2020, 3:39 AM

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the e100 is fine tbh
definitely in a much better position than the t110e4, and meds would struggle with a buffed e100 turret even more than they already do
Also, the e100 lower plate must be kept big and weak, otherwise the Maus would need a buff to compensate

jagged crescent Feb 17, 2020, 5:05 AM

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Ok but what about tweaking the the gun stats of the german heavies either. None of them go past the 2250 mark without special equipment and the bullet velocity for the E100 sucks

main tulip Feb 17, 2020, 5:11 AM

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I say give the E100 the Maus turret, better gun handling, and 100 extra hitpoints

unique scaffold Feb 17, 2020, 5:12 AM

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Buff the cheeks by 25mm and call it a day @vale sun because mediums are supposed to pen the turrets of heavy tanks frontally use your brain

twilit crystal Feb 17, 2020, 5:23 AM

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I'd rather buff the side turret of the e100. Reward angling but if he faces you its pennable

prime sparrow Feb 17, 2020, 5:36 AM

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That would be a hawt buff.

sage geyser Feb 17, 2020, 5:58 AM

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Mediums are suppose to make heavys obsolete

prime sparrow Feb 17, 2020, 6:21 AM

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How a tank is classified is arbitrary. The jpan is a td. You would be a fool to camp in it. The Matilda is a medium. You would be a fool to drive circles around the map in it. Use a tank for what it’s good at.

flat bane Feb 17, 2020, 6:34 AM

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Finally somebody with common sense 👏 👏 👏

vale sun Feb 17, 2020, 6:46 AM

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@unique scaffold There's no mantlet whatsoever. In theory it should be pennable, no? It's a flat turret face. Get your head out of your rear before you even begin telling me to "use my brain". The E100 doesn't deserve a turret as good as the maus', it has a 152mm gun.

unique scaffold Feb 17, 2020, 7:22 AM

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@vale sun It weighs 132 tonnes and a turret the size of a barn it’s turret should at least be able to bounce shots frontally try and pen the turret of an IS7 or IS4 with a medium those tanks are also way smaller and faster I also don’t think that your argument about the turret being as good as the Maus makes much sense either since the maus would still have better turret armour and a larger mantlet. Also it’s a 15cm gun not a 152 small detail but whatever

vale sun Feb 17, 2020, 7:25 AM

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It's. Flat.
Do math.

harsh ravine Feb 17, 2020, 7:26 AM

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we can all agree we want the Super Conqueror as a tech tree tank

mellow cape Feb 17, 2020, 8:06 AM

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No, how about we also remove sheridan and T92E1 from the tech tree and add them back as collectors in crates, as well as T-62A because thats what PC did, oh and a new tier 8 missile tank T49A 🤡

flat bane Feb 17, 2020, 8:08 AM

#

War Gaming? Lol Clown Gaming

jagged crescent Feb 17, 2020, 8:18 AM

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“Mediums are suppose to make heavys obsolete” I don’t think you know what mediums actually are

distant river Feb 17, 2020, 11:04 AM

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@nimble zodiac Noone can hit shots behind cover anywhere near reliably, it needs skill and timing and a hell of a lot of luck. I've hit 2 shots like that, and both were completely by accident.

nimble zodiac Feb 17, 2020, 1:01 PM

#

@prime sparrow the Matilda, indeed in the past was a medium, but is now classified as a heavy tank. And @distant river if they were accidents were you ever trying to do it in the first place?

crude pumice Feb 17, 2020, 1:05 PM

#

WG must nerf ATGM tanks immediately, other balancing do in v 6.8.1.

latent snow Feb 17, 2020, 1:45 PM

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They are already nerfing them in 6.8

drifting depot Feb 17, 2020, 2:07 PM

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._.

unique scaffold Feb 17, 2020, 3:32 PM

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Naw they aren't, not really

formal vale Feb 17, 2020, 4:17 PM

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@distant river I think it's important to understand what people mean by being hit behind cover. Whenever I say it (which is rare), I mean that they're hitting me over a ridge line or any form of cover where I was hull down where they don't even expose themselves to anyone. I don't blame them for doing it, it's the logical thing to do. Its just that WG shouldn't allow that sort of stuff.

drifting depot Feb 17, 2020, 6:04 PM

#

You guys know about the new warpacks that came along atgms right, a warpack is basically a cheat for the game.....

viscid kettle Feb 17, 2020, 6:30 PM

#

why don't we have better anti-cheat features for android and PC?

drifting depot Feb 17, 2020, 6:32 PM

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You know how rare it is to come across a cheater right? All I'm saying is this new cheat that came out ._.

quick lichen Feb 17, 2020, 8:04 PM

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Because no one needs a video to discuss tank balance

regal grove Feb 17, 2020, 9:28 PM

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60 km/h Grille day 58

flat bane Feb 17, 2020, 10:22 PM

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20 km/h Grille day 127

sonic spear Feb 17, 2020, 11:13 PM

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@regal grove May I propose another idea? From the perspective of a frequent Grille driver and enthusiast

The speed isn’t necessarily the problem with the Grille, I’ve noticed it’s more the acceleration and hull traverse that are to blame for its somewhat subpar mobility for a light tank destroyer, 50 Km/h is a great speed for it, especially considering the massive gun sitting on top.

So my proposition is buff the P/W ratio from 22.2 to 24.0 and increase the hull traverse from 30.62 to approximately 38.50, then it can hit its top speed more quickly and lose less speed on turns

acoustic shard Feb 17, 2020, 11:28 PM

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Vindicator buff ever? All it needs is 6 depression, 26 more Heat pen and 8 more He pen and it's great. a little less weak points on the front will do it good as well.

regal grove Feb 18, 2020, 12:27 AM

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@sonic spear very good idea, the acceleration is mainly the problem for its more than sluggish pace
But anyways ima keep at the daily grind, until WG buffs the Grille speed somehow

nimble zodiac Feb 18, 2020, 12:35 AM

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IS-7 top speed = Grille 15 top speed. Unless my equipment makes the difference from IS-7

potent onyx Feb 18, 2020, 12:42 AM

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Can’t wait for this update to drop to refresh my anger

noble siren Feb 18, 2020, 4:23 AM

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Just started playing Is8 and boy this tank is really hard. It should receive some kind of gun buff.

stiff edge Feb 18, 2020, 4:43 AM

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nah, it needs armour buff. it does need buff tho

quick lichen Feb 18, 2020, 4:47 AM

#

Is8 is perfectly fine as is

austere moat Feb 18, 2020, 4:59 AM

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It’s a high floor high ceiling tank. Not unlike the Leopard 1 and FV4202, and other such difficult vehicles to play.

unique scaffold Feb 18, 2020, 5:29 AM

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i’d argue that the is8 is a great tank actually, just look at its speed and gun stats, also turret is great. Not gonna talk much about the sides, just that they are the trolliest ones in the game. Fun tank overall

unique scaffold Feb 18, 2020, 5:45 AM

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Is8 is p decent from what I’ve seen ST-Is also a decent alternative

vale sun Feb 18, 2020, 5:57 AM

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ST-I is very, very good

unique scaffold Feb 18, 2020, 5:58 AM

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ST-1 is also a very good tank where you rely on your armour and angling, the is8 needs different positions but is still good at moving around the map, also the dpm is lovely

dense yoke Feb 18, 2020, 7:07 AM

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Is8 is nice after getting full and 100% crew

chilly crane Feb 18, 2020, 8:05 AM

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I really hope WG will buff BC25t, it's not very competitive in the current meta, and wif you look at winrate stats, it's one of the lowest #devs-answers

prime sparrow Feb 18, 2020, 8:17 AM

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They should give it another shot in the mag. Longer clip reload to compensate obviously.

quick lichen Feb 18, 2020, 11:45 AM

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The bats are the weakest because the other light tank completely counters it and dominates it

#

The Sheridan/t92 is faster and easily one shot out trades the bats which need to expose for far longer to dump their clips. Come to think of it, sometimes missile tanks don’t have to expose themselves at all

latent snow Feb 18, 2020, 2:24 PM

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I ran away from a missile in my batchat

frigid rapids Feb 18, 2020, 2:39 PM

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I ran away from missiles in tier8-10

unique scaffold Feb 18, 2020, 5:46 PM

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Please buff the T-34-3. It's a fun tank and I like to play it but it is inferior to the Chimera in every single way. Either give it a bit more pen, reload, front hull, anything. Or nerf Chimera. But you won't since it is a prem. So buff the T-34-3.

mellow cape Feb 18, 2020, 5:48 PM

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Ok lets buff SU-152 too because smasher is just a better version of it

crystal spoke Feb 18, 2020, 5:56 PM

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Let's not and say we did

humble olive Feb 18, 2020, 5:58 PM

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If we are on the topic of bigger callibers, then why don’t you give a normal hesh round to the 5,5 inch on the conway, that would deal (around) 770 damage? (Subsequently nerfing the reload to ~14 seconds when maxed out to avoid a tier IX charioteer ) The tank is not that special by itself, and paying the price being lack of premium round and having 0,38 dispersion just to get extra 30 alfa damage compared to it’s peers like the waffle makes it pointless to play with the bigger gun.
Having a unique feature like truly best potential alfa at tier IX would make the tank much more interesting to play and it would finally make sense to stop playing the L1, once you’ve spent those 60k xp.

drowsy plaza Feb 18, 2020, 6:15 PM

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@unique scaffold T-34-3 has a better turret due to shape and a much better Prammo round. As well as better aim time.

unique scaffold Feb 18, 2020, 6:17 PM

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Aim time is good. But the good turret is kinda useless since it has no gun depression at all.

twilit crystal Feb 18, 2020, 6:28 PM

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the real stupid part of the conway is just like the foch, they nerfed the bad gun on the conway for no reason

latent snow Feb 18, 2020, 6:52 PM

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Which gun is bad on the Conway?

twilit crystal Feb 18, 2020, 6:54 PM

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well the conway used to have a super fast reload 120 mm that was pretty OP by WG standard so they nerfed(overnerfed it too) but no one thought the 14 cm was op but they still nerfed that one even though the conway is just an inferior pz iv lol with way less camo and larger profile and a slower reload and worse gun handling,only advantage is armor(not much)and speed boost consumable which is pretty useful ill admit but not god tier.It is mostly HE proof anyway so no need to carry the HE provision just use extra food

unique scaffold Feb 18, 2020, 7:09 PM

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Thing was over powered back then had the HP of a T10 med and more than enough dpm to assert dominance over any tank in the tiers

twilit crystal Feb 18, 2020, 7:10 PM

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but the 14 cm was fine lol, although i remember deleting a leo in 15 seconds was the biggst meme ever, speed boost to prevent COD +adrenaline

quick lichen Feb 18, 2020, 7:27 PM

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The 14 cm is great for trading because most people originally thought you had a 120 mm

twilit crystal Feb 18, 2020, 7:31 PM

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I mean now most people use the 14 cm anyway

unique scaffold Feb 18, 2020, 7:32 PM

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I once brawled an E100 in it with the 120mm and I managed to score 6k damage that game

jade cargoBOT Feb 18, 2020, 8:26 PM

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dynoSuccess JohnNguyenWorld#1000 has been warned.

wind yarrow Feb 18, 2020, 8:29 PM

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In all honesty, I think that the KV-2 should have a better HE pen value. It is a 152 mm gun after all.

twilit crystal Feb 18, 2020, 8:41 PM

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The grile has 75 lol

sonic spear Feb 18, 2020, 9:06 PM

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So....you’re saying let’s take a tank that can one-shot almost everything from tiers 5-7....and allow it to do so more reliably

nimble zodiac Feb 18, 2020, 9:09 PM

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@wind yarrow KV-2 can already HE penetrate a bunch of tier VI tanks, sadly most of the tier V tanks. No.

dense yoke Feb 18, 2020, 10:18 PM

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make t49 not able to research t57 heavy if sheridan is not removed

dense yoke Feb 18, 2020, 10:52 PM

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@nimble zodiac doesn't the kv2 have a 540 alpha damage?

nimble zodiac Feb 18, 2020, 11:00 PM

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@dense yoke 640 with AP, 960 with HE, which derpy demands a buff with

dense yoke Feb 18, 2020, 11:23 PM

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@nimble zodiac isn't that enough to one shot tier 5 tanks? i mean they probably will have like 50-70 hp if they don't get oneshotted

sonic spear Feb 18, 2020, 11:37 PM

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@dense yoke the maximum roll for the KV-2’s HE is 1200, more than enough to kill all tier 5’s and 6’s, as well as a large portion of tier 7’s (Lights/TDs), this isn’t even counting the potential fire damage

nimble zodiac Feb 18, 2020, 11:40 PM

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@dense yoke yes, the AP can do 640 damage, up to 800; it devastates tier Vs and ruins a tier VI's day, even though they should be glad they didn't get HE'd

regal grove Feb 19, 2020, 12:31 AM

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60 km/h Grille day 59
Imagine not understanding commitment*

nimble zodiac Feb 19, 2020, 12:32 AM

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Imagine asking for a Grille buff for two months, got getting one, but asking anyways

sonic spear Feb 19, 2020, 12:53 AM

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While the Grille benefitted nicely from the recent concealment buff, it’s quite small in comparison to the Gun arc and hull traverse nerfs it received previously, which it now needs in this current phase of the game due to more tanks with much better mobility. It’s lightly armored and not very mobile by comparison, and has little to no chance of surviving a flank because of it

wind yarrow Feb 19, 2020, 1:56 AM

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Are yall shaming me for wanting a tank buff? Lol. In all seriousness though, I think that the missile discussion going on is stupid. The answer is simple. Take. It. Out. It's unfair. But I havent been on the receiving end of it yet, so idk how it is. Also, I said what I said (mostly as a joke) for historical accuracy, which I guess is hard to ask for lol.

nimble zodiac Feb 19, 2020, 3:00 AM

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I never shamed you, I just said no ._.

crystal spoke Feb 19, 2020, 3:15 AM

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Disagreeing isn't shaming they just said it shouldn't be buffed

crystal halo Feb 19, 2020, 5:13 AM

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Tiger 2 needs a nerf

humble olive Feb 19, 2020, 6:28 AM

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@twilit crystal I’m not saying the conway is bad, just that it has next to nothing going for it in comparison to WT

full token Feb 19, 2020, 6:50 AM

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Harder to HE than WT

drifting depot Feb 19, 2020, 7:21 AM

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It can actually bounce ._. That mantlet tho, no wonky gun depression and it's slightly faster

coarse harness Feb 19, 2020, 7:26 AM

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But that extra 70 dmg/shot isn't worth the lack of APCR/HEAT
It should do like 600/750/900 dmg IMO

graceful garden Feb 19, 2020, 7:54 AM

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So use the small gun like a normal person and get insane DPM on a mobile platform that troll bounces, easy.

crude pumice Feb 19, 2020, 9:12 AM

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T92E1 become well balanced now. but i think the hull is bit strong could ricochet 152mm.

graceful garden Feb 19, 2020, 9:22 AM

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It's not even close to being well balanced as long as it retains the atgms

crude pumice Feb 19, 2020, 9:32 AM

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@graceful garden do u use ATGMs now?
They can't pen easily like before and dmg nerf make it cause of low DPM.
if u wanna get high dmg with ATGM tanks, it's really hard to try now. so i think well balanced.

mellow cape Feb 19, 2020, 9:39 AM

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@crude pumice pen nerf did nothing it still pens heavies like butter

📎 2020-02-19_06-21-40.mp4

graceful garden Feb 19, 2020, 9:42 AM

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@crude pumice LMAO okay
"300 mm hard to pen"

Yeah buddy try getting good. And you still can hit from behind cover

unique scaffold Feb 19, 2020, 9:52 AM

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because of angles duh

crude pumice Feb 19, 2020, 10:02 AM

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@mellow cape Yes, then?
I don't think of just one success you show.
As you repeat 480dmg over 16 + α seconds, your allies will melt like butter first.

hot sun Feb 19, 2020, 10:12 AM

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Why pop out and get shot when you can hide and still pen with the ATGM. Theres a thing called effective dpm. Fire apcr if you can safely do so,and if you cant, use the broken mechanic called atgm. Atgms allow peeps to maximize effective dpm behind cover, even tho it has a longer reload rate cause of flight time.

It's like the same argument about using normal pramo shells. It's better to pen all your shots and do damage to a heavily armored tank, rather than bounce 50% of your normal shells and cause less damage overall. Effective dpm helps win games.

serene sphinx Feb 19, 2020, 10:14 AM

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Sigh...... Maybe make the maximum amount you can take about ATGM?
Maybe only cease the spam of ATGM,this problem will not be a theat.....
I guess 2-4 rounds is fine

unique scaffold Feb 19, 2020, 10:19 AM

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i was thinking, maybe after shooting ATGM shells, the reload doubles until you can shoot again? literally half the dpm if you use ATGM so the effectiveness is lowered

graceful garden Feb 19, 2020, 10:38 AM

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@odd sun Consumable on 4005 gets it to 2 seconds and is 100% useless.

Batchat would be good with a 4 shell clip

mellow cape Feb 19, 2020, 10:39 AM

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4 shell clip is too broken

crude pumice Feb 19, 2020, 10:48 AM

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and not important how many shells on clip.
it's matter of time to take dmg.

coarse harness Feb 19, 2020, 10:48 AM

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Just give it 2,5 intraclip and maybe some gun handlig as well

dense yoke Feb 19, 2020, 11:49 AM

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or give it armor that rivals the armor of sheridan 6.7

cunning kindle Feb 19, 2020, 12:33 PM

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Or u kno give it speed like Sheridan so it too can run from mts

autumn zodiac Feb 19, 2020, 5:08 PM

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If Batchat had 350 alpha it would do just fine.

orchid grove Feb 19, 2020, 5:10 PM

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#350*4

wind yarrow Feb 19, 2020, 5:29 PM

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@nimble zodiac @crystal spoke I was making a joke, hence the lol. I dont get offended that easily.

nimble zodiac Feb 19, 2020, 6:29 PM

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Man a Batchat that sprays 1400 damage a clip sounds like a good idea, when FV4005 pops 1380 👀💧

unique scaffold Feb 19, 2020, 6:33 PM

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give the batchat the gun of the pc batchat. 5 round autoloader, 390 alpha damage. thatll be totally fair XD

humble lintel Feb 19, 2020, 6:44 PM

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yea reload for 1min then

unique scaffold Feb 19, 2020, 6:50 PM

#

id honestly take it

dense yoke Feb 19, 2020, 6:53 PM

#

buff the turret speed on charioteer and nerf its armor to be like a t49 armor but a bit better.

👍 = yes

👎 = no

😀 = buff char somehow

craggy dust Feb 19, 2020, 7:50 PM

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6 months of research I have come to the conclusion,noobs have higher chance of getting a tank out of crates,why?so they spend more money in the future,one friend who has 2k battles and doesn't have any T10s got t22 med with 20 dollars,another friend spent 60 didn't get it,he has 20k battles.of? @crystal spoke

crystal spoke Feb 19, 2020, 7:51 PM

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Could you post the raw research in interested in seeing it @craggy dust

Or at least dm me it

You said you researched it for 6 months I'm curious about the raw data from the 6 months

drifting depot Feb 19, 2020, 7:59 PM

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Lowe better sides? Or at least 350 alpha just like most 105mm guns seem to be doing recently?

nimble zodiac Feb 19, 2020, 8:29 PM

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No, Lowe is still a strong tank, not to mention your 30 minute millionaire

drifting depot Feb 19, 2020, 8:35 PM

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I mean, the sides ._. 80mm

cerulean gust Feb 19, 2020, 9:20 PM

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That’s an f

mental pasture Feb 19, 2020, 9:21 PM

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Yes the sides are weak... welp, the armor by it self isn't that all but Hey, at least the turret works @drifting depot

drifting depot Feb 19, 2020, 10:17 PM

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Hard to get on a hull Down position and holding it for as much time as other tanks ._. Usually you get rushed from the opposite side and by the time you turn around you're already dead

crystal spoke Feb 19, 2020, 11:37 PM

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If you stick with your team you wont need to worry as much since your a second liner heavy and if you are getting rushed its usually a better idea to back up instead of turning around

nimble zodiac Feb 19, 2020, 11:39 PM

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Lowe is a good tank for doing confident damage. If you take a position that proves a nuisance to the enemy, you've done good, because the Lowe is great at picking enemies down while minimizing effective backfire with the turret. The sides aren't necessarily good but it can still sidescrape

regal grove Feb 20, 2020, 12:54 AM

#

Lowe used to be good and an amazing money maker. With Tiger II buff, Lowe (in comparison to others) is now just an amazing money maker.
60 km/h Grille day 60

jagged crescent Feb 20, 2020, 1:53 AM

#

I mean it's still good. It's just overshadowed

drifting depot Feb 20, 2020, 4:04 AM

#

^

graceful garden Feb 20, 2020, 4:06 AM

#

Lowe still has a great gun and can do well. The turret really isn't anything to ignore either, it's a very hard pen.

drifting depot Feb 20, 2020, 5:48 AM

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The main problem is the hull for me no less no more

hearty steeple Feb 20, 2020, 6:35 AM

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It is still good at what it does, print credits. Hull is weak? Hulldown exists for a reason. Plus it has a great gun

drifting depot Feb 20, 2020, 6:37 AM

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Harder to hull down with 8 degrees than with 10 and a tall as hell tank but ok

graceful garden Feb 20, 2020, 6:37 AM

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Great gun. It's a venerable tank that's stood the test of time and can perform. Just lacks mobility.

formal vale Feb 20, 2020, 7:08 AM

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Yeah, I dont think this is something an account with less than 100 battles should be seeing.

For reference, this was on my FreeToPlay experiment

📎 World_of_Tanks_2020-02-19-23-07-07.jpg

orchid grove Feb 20, 2020, 7:09 AM

#

$40 of gold for $5? Sign me up!

viral needle Feb 20, 2020, 7:13 AM

#

if WG was smart they’d make buying the offer crash the game repeatedly for 13 days

austere moat Feb 20, 2020, 7:14 AM

#

I recently made a reroll on EU, and in my first 25 battles, I got a pop up deal for 6k gold, a deal for a T34, a deal for 90 days premiums, and, worst of all, a deal for 1 million free experience.

If I got the 90 day prem or 6k gold deal ($3 for gold 2500 gold for 90 day prem) on my main I’d have jumped on either one. But they specifically target starters with tempting offers to “help them progress faster”

drifting depot Feb 20, 2020, 1:39 PM

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And then the wg team says they're trying to increase the time new players stay at low tiers ._.

drowsy plaza Feb 20, 2020, 2:57 PM

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@regal grove the Löwe used to be a total dog back in 2014-17 It got a at least one buff past where it was really deserved for that credit coefficient. I mean look at the other premiums with a super high credit coefficient...

drifting depot Feb 20, 2020, 3:18 PM

#

Dayum didn't see it that way ._.

sweet prism Feb 20, 2020, 6:16 PM

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Can someone enlighten me what would be the point of driving FV215B or Chieftain, if Superconqueror gets 10° gun depression with forward mounted turret?

frigid monolith Feb 20, 2020, 6:19 PM

#

Exactly

mellow cape Feb 20, 2020, 6:29 PM

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@sweet prism Gun handling, but thats about it

noble siren Feb 20, 2020, 6:43 PM

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Imagine not playing hull down tank in tier 10 these days. Seriously what is this thing with super armored turret + crazy depression of the gun.

drifting depot Feb 20, 2020, 7:07 PM

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Would be better if wg stopped making tech tree tanks into premiums

knotty cave Feb 20, 2020, 7:42 PM

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That ain’t gunna happen. This is a mobile game first. A world of tanks game second. And as all mobile games go, anything that can get a price tag, will.

unique scaffold Feb 20, 2020, 7:59 PM

#

The Progetto 65 should get a buff (the nerf was not fair)
For Example
DPM
5km/h more
Aim Time
More HE Pen (the Standard b have 110)
Armour buff

#

How about....

no.

Progetto 65 is already a very good tank that the nerfs barely touched.

dense yoke Feb 20, 2020, 8:13 PM

#

Opinions bro, opinions..

unique scaffold Feb 20, 2020, 8:18 PM

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armor buff
Progetto has one of the most trollish front plates of meds
5kmh buff
Oh boy more things being able to outrun almost everything
dpm buff
Who in their right minds is sane enough to call for a dpm buff on an autoloading system like the progs?
aimtime
The gun was nerfed for a reason
more HE pen
Your just gonna make another imbalanced prog
”I took a full hp prog in my is7 yes is7! Progs gun and pen stats aren’t that onpar to other meds to begin with coupled with how is7 is very resistant against progs ammunition

orchid grove Feb 20, 2020, 8:50 PM

#

@sweet prism Super Conq’s gun is a lot worse than 215b’s with lower DPM, and the dispersion is also worse (not to mention worse aim time than KV-2). Also, FV heavy gets the special consumables as well.

Super Conq in its current state will almost definitely be better than Chieftain though

sturdy fractal Feb 20, 2020, 8:50 PM

#

As long as it's not tech tree, let it remain shit

unique scaffold Feb 20, 2020, 9:00 PM

#

@orchid grove reckon that aim time is wrong, no way they give such aimtime on this kind of gun, totally out of place. For those gun stats it defo needs bigger alpha and maybe less dpm. @orchid grove yea but they’re taking these from the supertest right? maybe WG itself got it wrong and are going to change it? I mean it is very possible, just seems super weird with that circle closing in so slow and that bad dispersion ( for a Brit gun)

orchid grove Feb 20, 2020, 9:05 PM

#

@unique scaffold That ridiculous aim time is from Blitzhangar, which I consider to be super reliable, and this leaked picture from Blitznews also shows a super ridiculous aim time as well (even by the new aim time system)

The gun handling is amazing at .12/.12 (better than some mediums even), so it won’t bloom much, but aiming will basically do nothing, so it remains to be seen which side has the greater effect

📎 image0.jpg

twilit crystal Feb 20, 2020, 9:13 PM

#

Yup blitzhabgar is always 100% true because it's from the game files. So the only way that something gets past it is if wg does a 1 update nerf

grave quarry Feb 20, 2020, 9:16 PM

#

Psst hey, wanna buy sikret dokumints?
http://forum.wotblitz.eu/index.php?/topic/53473-is-3-defender-2nd-gun-proposal/

World of Tanks Blitz official forum

IS-3 Defender 2nd gun proposal - Soviet Tanks

IS-3 Defender 2nd gun proposal - posted in Soviet Tanks: I was thinking of giving IS-3D a second gun
Heres the concept122 mm D-25TB
Loading type: Automatic autoreloader (no loader > vents and food dont improve loading times)
Damage:

APCR: 400 > 390
HEAT: 340 > 335
Penetrat...

twilit crystal Feb 20, 2020, 9:57 PM

#

No

acoustic shard Feb 20, 2020, 10:36 PM

#

Buff Vindicators Gun depression From 2 to 6 prem Heat pen from 225 to 250 and He from 80 To 88. And side armor from 55 to 65

nimble zodiac Feb 20, 2020, 11:09 PM

#

@remote isle you can delete that now

latent snow Feb 20, 2020, 11:12 PM

#

It just needs gun depression and ap standard round

stiff edge Feb 20, 2020, 11:41 PM

#

its already fine as is

drifting depot Feb 21, 2020, 2:15 AM

#

Ap as standard ammo and 4 degrees of depression so it can get those pesky French lights

drowsy plaza Feb 21, 2020, 2:16 AM

#

No

autumn zodiac Feb 21, 2020, 2:19 AM

#

Vindicator is fine where it is in my opinion.

Sure it's not strong, but it's strong enough to deal damage. Allow me to rephrase that, it's strong enough to hold it's own in tier 7 and 8

The Prammo does more than sufficient damage with its penetration

unique scaffold Feb 21, 2020, 2:20 AM

#

8? Ahahaha that’s funny

robust coyote Feb 21, 2020, 2:20 AM

#

the armor is fine
the tank does damage like what a SU152 should do

unreal quiver Feb 21, 2020, 6:44 AM

#

why my tickets took so long to be responded?

drifting depot Feb 21, 2020, 7:24 AM

#

Idk usually takes less than a minute here

lusty latch Feb 21, 2020, 11:21 AM

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@unreal quiver it can take up to a week max, depends on the region you uploadthem from on how fast they get answered i guess

acoustic shard Feb 21, 2020, 1:56 PM

#

the tanks lack of gun depression along with the it's very limited elivation forces you to play it very passive in tier 8 and 7 as well. And for what ever reason the vindicaror has a rediculios 225 pen pn it's prem shell. instead of the standard 250 the smasher and SU Have. It needs all the help it can get. The side's are so week the most tier 7 meds can pen it somwere with HE.

frigid rapids Feb 21, 2020, 3:50 PM

#

Remove the vindicator

visual lance Feb 21, 2020, 3:57 PM

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Wg should fix matchmaking and don't let bots low wr in high wr in our team

noble siren Feb 21, 2020, 4:00 PM

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@visual lance the MM is "random" and not biased, and this is not the channel to talk about MM. You can't stop noobs from buying their progress to high tiers because that's WG's fault and it will always be part of the game

dim field Feb 21, 2020, 4:21 PM

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It's only rigged if I lose

frigid rapids Feb 21, 2020, 4:23 PM

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Thats the spirit🤪

noble siren Feb 21, 2020, 4:24 PM

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@dim field the MM is trash and you can't deny it

visual lance Feb 21, 2020, 4:30 PM

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Most game mobile is bots and bad players, that's why PC always is best

drifting depot Feb 21, 2020, 4:32 PM

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Don't bring a completely different type of argument like the platform ._.

dim field Feb 21, 2020, 4:37 PM

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Mm is fine. We aren't getting matches with 4 tier 8, 3 tier 7 on 1 team vs 7 tier 8.

Some of the players however, I will agree are pretty sketchy.

unique scaffold Feb 21, 2020, 5:00 PM

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The armor issue in the game is rigged , there are some piece events which need 60% more pirce than the gun maxed does with the maxed pirce ammo , some of the worse effects , suddenly there happen some kills that in reality need to get other angels or even some driving to get to the flanks

Strangely it’s not required all the time

Guess it’s just a bunch of bugs

dusky cargo Feb 21, 2020, 7:01 PM

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devs pleeease buff the predator um, its the tier 7 heavy that got forgotten, its armour has so many weak spots and flat angles that it can't side scape, and the gun has the pen of a light tank

noble siren Feb 21, 2020, 8:11 PM

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Nerf the frontal armor on Foch. I can't pen it nowhere but the lower plate which is smaller than the cupola.

austere bone Feb 21, 2020, 9:14 PM

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BUFF WZ 111 1GFT the reload time is ridiculous its not even turreted and the reload time sucks aswell the gun handling dispersion is .413 and buff its armor to 230 and buff the tier 10 to 250. Or at least buff the side armor as soon as i angle just a little i get penned or as soon as someone switches to heat or apcr your entie hull armor becomes pennable

quiet veldt Feb 21, 2020, 9:17 PM

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That's kinda the point of prammo @austere bone

nimble zodiac Feb 21, 2020, 9:25 PM

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@austere bone it’s a sin to angle pike nose tanks. Oh you mean the tier X... don’t angle, boom

coral bobcat Feb 21, 2020, 10:08 PM

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WG buff the 183 actually your numbers show its the worst TD 😎

flat bane Feb 21, 2020, 11:36 PM

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183 is a kind of tank that just can't be balanced unless a huge overhaul will happen

dense yoke Feb 22, 2020, 1:11 AM

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What if 183 gets a nerf reload that will drop its reload seconds to 25-30, with camo buff, and armor buff? it will have a 1800dpm(normal) and hesh 2600 dpm or something?

mental pasture Feb 22, 2020, 1:41 AM

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I agree with a concealment and armor buff, but A reload buff looks out of question

drifting depot Feb 22, 2020, 2:41 AM

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Just make every tank literally the same with different models at this point who cares, the game is in such a bad state

jagged crescent Feb 22, 2020, 5:26 AM

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AP shell alpha damage buff on the 183?

regal arrow Feb 22, 2020, 5:49 AM

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Wargaming please nerf this moving brick frontal armor , everybody with calibrated shell on tier 7 and 6 can’t even pen on this peace of cram

📎 image0.png

nimble zodiac Feb 22, 2020, 5:50 AM

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That’s why you aim, for the cupola, the turret sides, the plate directly upwards from the tracks, literally watch it turn a tiny bit and it’s butter

flat bane Feb 22, 2020, 8:17 AM

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Bruh that thing is a auto pen

verbal thistle Feb 22, 2020, 8:25 AM

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M6A2E1 Is an easy pen on sides and turret cheeks for many tanks. Also don’t mind using HE on sides. You can easily out manoeuvre it.

coarse dawn Feb 22, 2020, 12:00 PM

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Less of balance discussion but more of a suggestion. Could we get an option to turn off in game music, I dont like the pre-battle music. I know your music team has worked hard on it but I don't like it.

dense yoke Feb 22, 2020, 1:30 PM

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@mental pasture I meant nerf reload timer or just nerf the speed.

coarse dawn Feb 22, 2020, 2:04 PM

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They could fix the missiles by making it a direct line of sight, just like a real laser. Meaning you cant control the missile over a ridge, and once dLOS is lost the missile will not respond to control anymore

noble siren Feb 22, 2020, 2:15 PM

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@coarse dawn then there will be no reason to put ATGMs in game if you need whole year till the rocket hits duh...

coarse dawn Feb 22, 2020, 2:30 PM

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Its not going to slow down the missile, it just means you cant control it without a line of sight.
You could use something like 0 time raycasting, a second ray fired the same time as the missile, then check if the ray collides with any surface between the origin and the target. If yes, missile will continue on a straight line and not respoond to player aim control; if no, missile will maintain player aim control.

This way, you must maintain a direct line of sight, like a real laser would. But you can still change the direction of the missile. You could even add an effect to tell the player whether they have dLOS or not, like a red X attached to the reticle that changes shape or color.

noble siren Feb 22, 2020, 3:45 PM

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@coarse dawn the idea is bad

unique scaffold Feb 22, 2020, 4:14 PM

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proceeds to call the idea bad with no counter argument, i call that ‘big brain’

noble siren Feb 22, 2020, 4:27 PM

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@unique scaffold it's bad cause the point of making this type of shells was to hit while behind cover, not expose yourself long enough so the fv 183 in the spawn can hit you. That's why the idea is bad, it makes you exposed at the price of literally nothing, everything will be able to hit you, the rocket will take so long to hit that the enemy will be able to react without problem and still trade with you. It's enough reasonable to call the idea bad EDIT: the other most simple way is putting HEAT and buffing the HE values to not be laughable

unique scaffold Feb 22, 2020, 4:31 PM

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@noble siren the point that the ATGMs should hit behind cover was enforced by WG, trading damage with 0% risk is a completely broken concept, any kind of rework or nerf that will increase the % of risk is always welcome, as it is the only way to balance it, that is why i consider the idea decent, with some tweaking needed

mental pasture Feb 22, 2020, 4:50 PM

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@regal arrow this area is M6A2E1 feature, it was made for be impenetrable in frontal armor
Nerf it is making the tank obsolete

That's why the tank have no armor at sides and behind, it can't even sidescrape

coarse dawn Feb 22, 2020, 6:01 PM

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@noble siren the game was never built to support ATGMs in the first place. All the maps, vehicles and strats are developed for conventional shell firing tanks.

Playing to the defensive strengths of your tank minimizes risks (eg going hulldown, sidescraping, hill hugging, firing from camo). But there is no tank capable of engaging or firing without taking any risks (weakspots, weak armor, slow speed etc), there's always a chance someone will get you, except ATGMs. With ATGMs you have the ultimate defensive strength, being able to fire from cover, after all the terrain is impenetrable.

noble siren Feb 22, 2020, 6:05 PM

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@coarse dawn that's why you leave it as it is now or making the ATGM a Heat round and buffing the HE, not making waste of ammo slot

coarse dawn Feb 22, 2020, 6:20 PM

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I don't think you understand my message

noble siren Feb 22, 2020, 7:58 PM

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Just saying that the ATGM will be useless and waste of ammo type

dusky cargo Feb 22, 2020, 9:41 PM

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can the T34 get a hull buff like the T29 did?

unique scaffold Feb 22, 2020, 9:58 PM

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what is the point, you’re supposed to play the tank in a certain way, going hulldown and using the great pen

nimble zodiac Feb 22, 2020, 10:19 PM

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Yup, T34 is one of the primary tanks in tier 8 just for that pen and turret armor

drowsy plaza Feb 22, 2020, 10:25 PM

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@noble siren the ATGM needs a change. Folks are literally lobbing then up and over cover. Curving slightly over a berm is one thing. Lobbing it over a house it ridiculous

dusky cargo Feb 22, 2020, 10:42 PM

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@unique scaffold so you can bully tier 7s more effectively :3

nimble zodiac Feb 22, 2020, 10:42 PM

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@dusky cargo actually, the upper plate on T34 is quite solid against tier 7s. Besides, the point of T34 is to hulldown as much as possible, so bully tier 7s that way

latent snow Feb 23, 2020, 12:43 AM

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The teir 10 Chinese td is just sad, just a fat brick with a front plate that is melted by gold ammo and sides as strong as tissue paper

unique scaffold Feb 23, 2020, 12:44 AM

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Oh gee I wonder what TD doesn’t have sides that can be clear

nimble zodiac Feb 23, 2020, 1:00 AM

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Oh no oh gosh if only 14mm was effective even on the front! But yeah, only the Jageroo seems to have competence with gold shells to the front... at the superstructure anyways...

flat bane Feb 23, 2020, 1:16 AM

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Oh no no the WZ 113g FT has nice frontal armor. Use all your gun depression and angle a bit, not even gold can pen it.