tank-balance-discussion

[winter dagger]

ru too looooooong

[granite pebble]

Plus that juicy 320 HE alpha

[austere citrus]

they should seriously give ru 251 and kwk 30 320 he alpha or at least 300.

[fickle shoal]

(From Jpc_1023, with an added part from me)

Replace the standard shell with AP from APCR or buff the base pen to 255 (265 with calibrated)

Buff the overall speed and mobility of the tank 45/47kmh (51 with SuperSpeedBoost) seems reasonable

And give the HE shell some actual Alpha so it’s no longer worse than standard against Spall targets and hits for more than standard

[winter dagger]

Ru 251 would be wayyyy too good with that alpha

[nocturne mauve]

No it wouldn’t lmao, everything has spall liner

[granite pebble]

Mediums, heavies, every light except French lights, and every TD except British and German glass cannon TD's:

[winter dagger]

The rear of American heavies be dreaming

[granite pebble]

Carnarvon with it's continent sized rear:

[fickle shoal]

M60 and M48:

[exotic ginkgo]

Is the WZ 111 1-4 getting a nerf as some point or is it the wz-111

[thorny timber]

Wanna slap that with he 🙃,anyways nerf caernavron

[cunning socket]

Nerf grille… too OP

[valid cave]

Obviously

[unique scaffold]

chief mk6 with its hunongous lower glacis and hull

[slender latch]

What alpha does the 114 SP2 have?

[fathom glacier]

I think 620 alpha dmg

[winter dagger]

sconq with its universal level rear

[ornate shuttle]

i genuinely hope all the blitz hangar stats are wrong
those changes are literally Horrid
we have things like AMX m54 losing EVERYTHING just to get a 3% mobility buff? 😂😂 thats really different than what i imagined Reading your news of amx getting so many nerfs but "terrain cc, engine power and h traverse are all improved!"
and then there is a 1-3% max improvement in all those areas... like Cmon you can't be seriously thinking 20.33 > 21 effective hp/t is a fair buff for everything the tank is losing that gotta be a joke 😂

[hoary elm]

Nop its 100% legit

[twilit crystal]

its gaining a massive buff on hard terrain, follow the roads and you are as fast as an amx 50b, its armor is not getting nerfed its a rework. The upper hull is harder to heat spam now especially with heavy heat pen nerfs but lower plate is easier to pen. its gaining dpm but losing alpha. The AP to heat sucks thogh lol

[sharp forge]

Hmmm 🤔

[austere citrus]

why is 111 5a getting upper plate nerf lol. why not upper plate buff? same for 111 4

[brazen snow]

Vk 72.01k getting better upper and lower turret cheak buff and 500 dpm

[twilit crystal]

the armor buff doesn't matter, still getting penned by any heat, its also only 200 not 500 dpm lol, at the cost of alpha.

[brazen snow]

Still it's something better about the tanks

[winter dagger]

the mobility buff is the best thing tho, wont be a big piece of immovable garbage anymore

[frigid urchin]

Giving a light tank heavy dpm noice

[final warren]

Eh, the armor buff is negligible imo. 95% of tier X just loads prammo and pens your massive lower plate

[fringe quest]

Especially it’s a tier 9 🗿

[fathom glacier]

And HEAT will be same alpha dmg

[void siren]

Use the stock gun it’ll be better

[stone drum]

Yes, but the hard terrain buff means that it's actually getting less of an overall mobility buff.

[brazen snow]

Still the vk 72.01k armor will be more troll with buff and its is 500 dpm buff not 200

[nimble zodiac]

Blitzhangar shows it to be about 200

[stone drum]

Running standard provisions it gained about 200 in open test.

[verbal igloo]

I dont think the grille was nerfed enough tbh. Lets kill it. Finish what you started wg

[lone sandal]

knowing they're going to nerf the grille again sooner or later
they might as well just utterly destroy the grille now

[fickle shoal]

(From Jpc_1023, with an added part from me)

KPZ-70:

Replace the standard shell with AP from APCR or buff the base pen to 255 (265 with calibrated)

Buff the overall speed and mobility of the tank 45/47kmh (51 with SuperSpeedBoost) seems reasonable, along with engine power and terrain resistance (which ofc buffs hull traverse and acceleration)

And give the HE shell some actual Alpha so it’s no longer worse than standard against Spall targets and hits for more than standard

And buff the camo, it has barely better camo than an E100 while being half as tall

[solid sequoia]

It has more camo than the E100 lol

[fickle shoal]

@solid sequoia yup am wrong I was thinking about a diff heavy (that is more chonky)

[solid sequoia]

You recall incorrectly, the KPZ has more camo

[clever mortar]

I don't see a reason of continuing the nerf for grille.
In the poll near 90% guys voted no against it.
Regardless, they will do it anyways.

[stone drum]

That's an absolutely massive buff for an already well performing heavy tank.

[fickle shoal]

It would lose some armor and the speed buff id be fine with just 45 km/h and better acceleration so it can even get to 40 let alone 45

(Hell, maybe one day they'll redo the tank and uptier it, but that's a dream)

Also, it's only barely breaking 50% wr, and has a low survival rate for its tier and among heavies at 33% (although that can be chocked up to the players, however 20 is still the tank)

[unique scaffold]

wait till grille have 10⁰ hull traverse 400shell velo, 2100 dpm and they will stop

[slender latch]

Just give grille 560 alpha and 9s reload at this point it won't be able to outtrade other tanks anymore but at least DPM

[thorny timber]

Or just,remove it from the game and find any other german td or just give an artillery a td gun to use lol

[fickle shoal]

Waffentrager E100 walks in: "gentlemen!"

(Joke)

[thorny timber]

I ain't hearing out that guy,unless his intra is like 5-6s long then it's ok i guess

[primal sundial]

no, 1 sec intra, 4 shell, 750 alpha. lets go
oh and basically no dispersion bloom after firing. 30 sec reload to match the faster pace of blitz 😂

[twilit crystal]

I mean it kind of exists already. 4005 is basically it

[primal sundial]

that is nothing like the wtf100, except for it's weakness to he I guess

[rose ledge]

Grille is ruined in my idea

[clever mortar]

Same in my idea

[thorny timber]

it should be something like the t28 defender not like a fv4005 but more of a defender like tank,12cm gun with 3/4 bullets in each clip,around 540-460 dmg depending on how its balanced and at least 6-7/5-6 sec intra in each shell to make sure it can't yolo at all and doesn't become toxic due to just dumping the shells and running away,oh and also so super consumables

[ornate warren]

Bruh.

[ember mountain]

give T95 100% stationary camouflage so its historically accurate.

no other tank has hidden in a bush in its own training/testing grounds for 27 years

[remote sluice]

if this happens then foch 155 should get its high alpha and long intraclip autoloader gun back. this current gun is incredibly generic

[exotic gorge]

Can anybody say whats done with Turret traverse speed Kranwagn in 10.3?

[exotic gorge]

Someone, pls, who knows how Turret traverse speed changed in 10.3, because in Wot Hangar i dont see this changes written. I need T110E5 and Kranwagen

[full token]

@exotic gorge check #coming-soon

[exotic gorge]

There is 0 information. 90% written Just “we buffed”, or “we debuffed this and this”))

[clear shuttle]

its not getting buffed or nerfed

[exotic gorge]

Oh oke, thanks

[thorny timber]

wish it did,wg just has some personal beef with the french for no reason

[clear shuttle]

if it was it would of been stated

[trim beacon]

Buff T95

[quick lichen]

Very specific

[teal sonnet]

Will the conqueror ever get its turret buffed? Even not to the point of being historically accurate, 10-20mm increase would greatly benefit the tank. It may have a good gun but its turret armor is weak enough to be penned by tier 8 mediums

[remote sluice]

maybe not w the 50b and batchat bcus i personally feel like 50b still a great tank after the nerfs, and batchat is getting a huge buff, but foch 155 has been tampered with over and over again ever since it got the autoloader.

lets see the foch’s history:

• first added: a fast td with no armor and mediocre dpm, the only thing good abt it was the alpha
• autoloader buff: it was glorious. it has much much more armor and a huge autoloading 155mm that was insanely scary at the time
• nerf: alpha got heavily nerfed, dpm stayed the same. single shot gun got nerfed to 560 alpha for some reason
• 9.1: small dpm buffs for foch, stock gun was still bad
• ? update: foch alpha nerf again, dpm nerf, accuracy nerf, shell velocity nerf. something once unique was turned into a generic autoloader. single shot gun alpha buff is nice
• 10.3: small buffs that doesnt help the tank that much. single shot gun got nerfed bcus reasons

idk abt u but the foch has been tampered with so many times. it was never balanced, either bad or OP. then suddenly it was dropped into a pile of french boredom that misses 70% of its shots for some reason.

could be a skill issue on my part but how come the foch cant hit shots at medium range? its right where the tank is supposed to be at and i struggled to make it work after the 500 alpha “rebalance”

[fathom glacier]

It should be fixed.

Grille 15: alpha dmg will be to 640/545/960. reload time will be nerfed to 12 sec or 13 sec. Camouflage will became better. Speed KM/H to 45 (I don’t care about mobility).

It would be happy for all players

[marsh belfry]

so basically pre nerf grille except camo

[remote sluice]

yea just undo the changes the grille does not deserve this

[stone drum]

Its because the tank has awful gun arc, forcing you to move and make your shots bloom out à ton.

[austere citrus]

give foch 3x500 autoloader with 3 second interval

[teal sonnet]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1001153605375623294/1102529545497755718/20000.png this is how the conqueror turret should be, we currently have less that 2/3 of that, which kinda makes no sense when some mediums of the same tier have better, yes it may lose the penetration on hesh and ap for the armour, just like how the super conqueror has less hesh pen and worse aim even when it has the same gun in compensation for it’s heavy turret armour.

[thorny timber]

Giving foch 3 shells might not be statically bad but it loses its unusual value,which is a double shot TD

[remote sluice]

i would much rather have two shells for better versatility than having three shells with an absurd amount of reload

[merry pelican]

mino?

[solid sequoia]

This goes against everything WG is trying to do with camping TDs lol

[austere citrus]

you would rather have 2x500 vs 3x500?

[remote sluice]

indeed i do

[fickle tinsel]

I don't think the grilles being nerfed enough they should just remove the gun entirely so it's a moving target that can't shoot back

[scenic kindle]

why did wargaming basically nerf fv4202

[primal sundial]

intra clip speed is pretty important to autoloaders, and also the thing that requires careful balancing. probably why he would prefer 2x500. so would I tbh, if the 3x500 came with any more then 3 sec intra clip

[final warren]

I'd rather have the 2 shot as well. It's just much more versatile and effective compared to 3 shots. You are exposed for half the time, do 2/3 the amount of dmg, and you have a lower clip reload allowing you to do more tactical reloads

[ember idol]

Typical "not to fond of British tanks" treatment

[lone sandal]

hell no 💀

[stone drum]

Not worth the trade off, the gun is the speciality.

[austere citrus]

they should bring back 2x560, 2x500 is just so bad

[thorny timber]

Grille 15: alpha nerfed to 0.1/0.3/0.5 reload time will be nerfed to 10 light years,you are instantly spotted from the start and sitting at the same place for a moment without moving activates the self destruct protocol

But seriously,this is just bad and still motivates 40%ers to camp in grille and do nothing all day,just let off some camo from it and most importantly the spall liner. And then remake it in a way where it can stay on the support or the 2nd line without the need to snipe

[granite pebble]

Obj 268:

[winter dagger]

Hori:

[stone drum]

This is just horrendous in every sense of the word.

Grille should be balanced to be something of a tier X Skorpion G or Superhellcat.

Starting the game passively before taking an increasingly aggressive support role.

[winter dagger]

It should be played second line just like the tier nine, not the tier 8

[chilly token]

How about making wt pz4 tier 10 or give grille more turret rotation angle to the sides. Grille turret and low gun depression make it worse than wt

[stone drum]

not talking about RHM, I'm talking about the quick premium tank.

[winter dagger]

Well yeah, but from a tech tree perspective, the change in play styles is something I always hated like the tortoise and the 183

[exotic gorge]

Yeah, like T110E4 HP debuff? -250 hp, now its 1750, and where os it written?

[teal sonnet]

I dont wanna get penned by a lower tier in my turret when im a heavy bro, drop the reload or the hesh pen or smth

[stone drum]

Why is the Foch singleshot gun just getting a straight nerf???

It's loosing like .03 dispersion without compensation.

[solid sequoia]

The British high tier heavies were never about armor, they are about the gun

[fickle shoal]

it's not about the armor, it's about sending a message.

[teal sonnet]

“Not about armor” bro did u even look at the image i sent

[solid sequoia]

Oh no! A game isn’t historically accurate for the sake of balance! Bro do you even know how many tanks don’t have their historical armor? The British high tier heavies all sacrifice armor to have a good gun. Accept that fact and git gud.

[stone drum]

The reload & hesh penetration along with the handling + accuracy are literally the sole reasons of playing the conqueror, if you don't like the armour just play a different tank.

[teal sonnet]

😭thats why i said no need for the actual historical accurate armor, just a slight buff to actually make it feel like a heavy.

[solid sequoia]

Not all heavies feel the same. They aren’t all super heavy behemoths that can block anything.

[royal stream]

You can not say that wargaming doesn't hate
Thay do

[teal sonnet]

Most can go hull down and be almost impenetrable. Ones that aren’t like the e100 can angle its turret and block. Other heavies can wiggles the turret and block.

The conq simply has two thin turret cheeks on both sides, even with those spots hidden somehow you still have the really weak cupola and gunner sights.

[solid sequoia]

And it also has one of the best guns on a heavy tank in the game

[teal sonnet]

6-7 degrees in gun depression

[austere citrus]

when are we getting a heavy tank that can just take on almost anything (besides high pen prammo from TDs) frontally? like imagine a tornvagn at tier 10

[silent ibex]

I think tanks that are gonna have 4000 dpm shouldn't have 4000 dpm, in the next update

[austere citrus]

realistically heavy tanks (like actually heavy tanks and not class of tanks) shouldnt be able to go through bushes or have terrible terrain resistence because they sink in the mud (like in real life).
this would give light tanks and lighter tanks such as light TDs or mediums or even smaller heavies an advantage

[past vale]

Heavy tanks are balanced by having bad DPMs and not great gun handling, even heavies with "good DPMs and gun handling" have stats that can be considered mediocre for meds and TDs, the 113, E6 and Chieftain barely scratch 3K DPM, thats bad for tier X medium standards. The same for gun handling, the Strv K and Concept have worse gun handling than 90% of the mediums.

Players need to understand that meds are not supposed to beat heavies frontally, they are supposed to farm them from the sides

[twilit crystal]

The 113 rn is 3400. Other than the leo all other meds are under 3600. It is not bad at all

[stone drum]

As of now most mediums are just straight up inferior to most heavies.

[void siren]

I want to plow straight through cover by driving over it

[exotic girder]

Not at all sounds like you dont know how to play mediums then. You cant beat a frontal engagement with a heavy your not supposed to. Use your superior dpm and mobility

[stone drum]

Lol, on average my wr is 10% higher in mediums than heavies at tier X.

However I'm stating the objective facts, not my individual experiences.

[exotic girder]

Can you elaborate on your point that they are worse, I also tend to do better in my tier 10 mediums. The only tier x heavies i really like are the 260 and Vk72.

[lone sandal]

diabolical oversimplification

[stone drum]

Mediums as a general rule perform worse than heavies for players across demographics, due to heavies being so fast, having good guns, and having much higher durability (including Hp) than mediums.

Check blitzanalysiz.com if you do not believe me.

@exotic girder even for the absolute best players, they just perform better in heavies, because mediums don't offer any additional reward or higher skill cap than heavies.

[exotic girder]

Because they have a low skill set to perform well, mediums change the battle more though. If you have good mediums you win if you have bad mediums you lose. All the heavies really need to do is hold until the mediums can flank.

[distant river]

Heavies perform better than meds across the board, have a look on blitzanalysiz for the past few updates for each player segment

[exotic girder]

Yes i never disagreed with this, Thank you for agreeing with me

[stone drum]

he was disproving you, lol

[winged barn]

A heavy that goes med side will crush med side. A medium that goes heavy side will get stuck in the stalemate. Heavies have far more impact on a battle.

[exotic girder]

This completely untrue

[stone drum]

Ok, then explain why Strv K a heavy is meta, yet M60 a medium is not? Despite M60 being faster, having a much better gun, and arguably even more armour.

[twilit crystal]

This is why every map should be like winter malinovka, sending your entire team to med side should be a death trap

[austere citrus]

agreed, mediums flanking means nothing when they hit you for 600 when you hit for 350 and they actualy have armor to protect themselves

the problem with blitz is that the maps are so small/close quarters that heavies win every time (plus HP bonus)

if maps were bigger like in PC then it would be different

[exotic girder]

Because the strv K is completely broken, it has better armor, about the same mobility, the same DPM, but waayyyy more health. Its not balanced thats why its meta. Compare a E-100 to a STB1 is more fair comparison.

[austere citrus]

strv k is overrated ngl, its decent but its not THAT good. obj 777 II > strv k easily

[clear shuttle]

only reason the strv K is as relevant as it is now is because it has heavy HP while having medium statistics such as 3.4k dpm (as you pretty much just mentioned)
it also has super speed boost which pretty much allows you to move to places quickly and get to early positions fast

if anything id say the only time its actually unbalanced is when a good player is playing it (or when the player decides to just go mediums side regardless)

[stone drum]

M60 actually has way better mobility, not even similar lol. It also has more dpm, an overall better gun, way better viewrange & camo, and it even has arguably superior armour in some situations. The only thing it really has over m60 is the fact it is a heavy and therfore gets way more hp.

Heavy tank hp allows it to do things m60 simply cant and that's is why heavies are superior to mediums. Also btw m60 is one of the top performing mediums as of current.

@clear shuttle to be honest, Strv k was balanced in an extremely unfun way. They should have made the tank extremely comfortable & versatile at the cost of hp.

[exotic girder]

I think you have zero idea what you are talking about

[stone drum]

Do you not grasp the concept Heavies are simply just better in blitz???

@exotic girder then why do heavies dominate competitive line-ups...

[exotic girder]

They arent better just easier for the average player to perform well in.

[clear shuttle]

the strv k is easier to win in for the average player because all you have to do is monkey brain take it to meds side and beat the opposite meds since you’re basically a glorified M48/M60 with more hp

[winged barn]

He did say average players smh

[twilit crystal]

heavies are basically better for all players except at the very right end of the bell curve where maybe meds equal heavies

[uneven turtle]

Waiting for m48 to get 246 turret thickness go zzzzzzz

[austere citrus]

most meds suck, completely useless, like who plays obj140

stb-1 with 11 degrees of gun depression (and its getting 3k dpm prammo?) thats gonna be op.

it also has upper plate armor and turret armor

carro 45t is really strong with 4x380 clip

[twilit crystal]

batchat will be the tank where the good player can excel next update. Unlike the sheridan it isn't a free 600 damage bush sniping

[past vale]

Least delusional take, take some stats from 10.1

[stone drum]

I don't know what your implying by that, but do look at relative WR, lol.

Average WR is an almost worthless metric.

[nimble zodiac]

People vouching for medium tank competition when a heavy tank gets to med side a mere 15 seconds late but plays DOOM against the enemy mediums

Where is this higher skill cap for mediums if their only advantage is being able to run away from heavies? 😂

[past vale]

Oh nice, the heaviums lead the list, no wonder that heavies that allow for the same flexibility as meds are the ones with higher relative wr lmao

[nimble zodiac]

Bro really said mediums are good because heavies are better when they’re faster.

This is so dented

[stone drum]

That would be cool and all if the fastest heaviums are actually lagging behind there busted brethren in relative WR cough Obj 260 cough 50b cough.

[past vale]

Coping lmaoooo, the E6 is a great tank and nobody says otherwise

[nimble zodiac]

E6 is great, I don’t think there’s disagreement there, but the opinion is that other heavies are greater

[stone drum]

@past vale
My opinion is not that e6 is in any way not going to be busted, it's actually a major concern about 10.3 I have. I just stated outdated data.

[stone drum]

Just why WG...?

[twilit crystal]

Is that more inaccurate than the jgeroo

[keen dew]

because french

[remote sluice]

cant have good things anymore w the foch 155 innit?

[night geode]

++++

[stone drum]

About the same i think?

[lone sandal]

❓

[clear shuttle]

777 II imo isnt as flexible as many of the other heaviums but thats just me

[gleaming apex]

thereal_clown#0 has been warned.

[ornate warren]

We gotta need its old design back

Also just stuck in my mind, can’t wg change every single detail on foch this update? I mean its not even released yet, and foch has lost its majority of fun which I assume wg can clearly see it

[slender latch]

Is maus really that good basing on the top 20 relative winrate? Just find it hard to believe since its most likely underpowered.

[mortal falcon]

Bad players overperform/Good players far underperform; bad players outnumber good players by a considerable amount.

What having some armor, being very slow, and the most HP in game does (crazy how you do more damage when you survive longer)

[slender latch]

So is it a decent tank now or are there there better ones?

[primal sundial]

it isn't great and it isn't terrible

[remote sluice]

honestly, if theyre gonna nerf the 215b’s armor to this extent, it should have 40kph top speed, hell even 45kph (remove speed boost if so) to rlly make it a heavium if thats what wg want this tank to be. the 10.3 215b is kinda stuck in a grey zone where its not fast enough to be a heavium, but it doesnt have enough armor to be the current heavy tank it is. a heavium wannabe id say

[teal sonnet]

I tried to only discuss the conq but seeing you guys talking about 215b aswell…

[chilly crane]

where do you find these?

[past vale]

Oh wow, now that you mention it, 40%ers don't perform on meds and lights. Funny to see the STB-1 and Pattons there, as +55% players actually have high relative wr with them.

@chilly crane you can find nice data on https://blitzanalysiz.com/ might not be complete but it has has data that shows how many low tier stat padders exist, winrate by career winrate and such

[clear shuttle]

it was already kind of a heavium

what i wouldnt of minded is if they gave it its pre 9.1 UFP back and made the top speed 38-40 kph
then removed super speed boost

or alternatively buffed the side armour and removed reactive

or just did a slight mix of all of them while removing super speed boost and reactive at the same time

[remote sluice]

yea just remove the super speed boost and give it 40+ kph top speed. i dont mind not having armor, but give it speed. 36kph is garbage for a heavium

[teal sonnet]

Or just give it a better lower plate

[clear shuttle]

why would it need a better lower plate..

[teal sonnet]

So i can actually angle it?

[solid scaffold]

Its sides are weak anyway and the ufp is below the standard of the average ht

[remote sluice]

ur side is rlly weak so even if the lower plate was better, ppl will still pen ur side with ease

try baiting ppl w ur tracks while sidescraping. it works well for me

[teal sonnet]

As in being able to bait shots by angling the front

[stone drum]

Continue...

Notice how heavies & tank destroyers that perfrom the role of heavy dominate the graph.

If you legitimate believe heavies are balanced, especially versus mediums, then you are Delusional.

[void siren]

This signifies that the m60, m48, and t-22 medium are overpowered and need nerfs

We must clear the board of these “mediums” and “lights”

[acoustic estuary]

🤔

[stone drum]

you got me there for a moment

Lol

[void siren]

I agree with ya - all the heavy tds should be nerfed. Every tank on the top 20 relative wr chart should have the 3 heavily drawn bars

If we don’t have enough heavies, just stop the work on these new “Czech mediums” and replace them with another fun, very very unique and balanced heavy line!

why is the minotauro so high and where is the badger what

[stone drum]

It's because the minotauro has a turret and the ability to hold and push, allows it to literally perfectly assume the role of a heavy.

[slender latch]

Can't believe badger is actually at the top 20 wr must be pretty strong now after the buffs

[twilit crystal]

its got stupid good traverse, if you keep your gun pointed down a lot of center lower plate shots will bounce, its top speed is acceptable at 31 and it has great gold pen with not too shabby standard. Also dpm is solid. Only thing holding it back right now is the horrific otm dispersion on a tank that needs to wiggle in the open.

[orchid grove]

The big reason you see TDs at the top is because of type based MM. Tanks like Badger, E3, E4 and 268v4 functionally give your team an extra heavy while simultaneously burdening the other team with a totally useless tank like Grille, or 183 (the most played TDs by far). It’s like playing 7v6 every game

[void siren]

The existence of the 183 and grille completely break t10 td balancing by making the td slot useless in like 70% of the games

[thorny timber]

most tds are helpless without team mates in t10

[slender latch]

I thought regular battles were never type based MM but just random since you can have 4 HTs, 3 TDs while enemy has 3 HTs, 3 TDs, 1 MT like they are unbalanced on each team?

[void siren]

Eu is alive so matchmaker tries harder to make fair matches

[orchid grove]

The way it works is that you can’t have 2 or more tanks of one type compared to the enemy team. So you can have games where one team has 3 heavies, and the other team has 2, but never a game where you can have 4 heavies compared to the 2 heavies of the other team

[winter dagger]

And then you spam HE

[void siren]

And the turret is forwards, lowering engine deck he splash damage

[thorny island]

After so much time I got the Sheridan and the Is-7, but now I want something good, something that has good damage per minute, good armor and is self-reloading. What dou you recommend?

[austere citrus]

mih vi yoh

2x450 clip is super op ngl

decent armor too (blocks enough shells)

speed decent

[nimble zodiac]

In a slower game, it certainly has advantages, but the 310x3 is more versatile

[twilit crystal]

The 450 still has like 2500 dpm . Its hardly terrible for the alpha. In current patch t57 is superior . Has similar armor profile and drops 1200 .

[humble depot]

It’s 300x3

[void siren]

they're talking about clip size
we know what its dpm is

uh you had a x10 :/
I don't think any tank has a 300x10 clip, (except maybe the wt auf e100)

also on a different note why isnt it 310

[humble depot]

What? I said the alpha on the 105mm is 300.

[winter dagger]

It had 4 shot 640 alpha derp gun lol

[stone drum]

Honestly after 10.3, I think T57 will fall off hard. It's getting forced into a boring and incredibly toxic role of being a hull down clipper.

Seriously, dpm & penetration nerfs, hull armour nerfs, but turret armour & hp buffs??
Not to mention they aren't even resolving the issue of clip-booster.

[humble depot]

I got confused

[nimble zodiac]

Thank you

[glad cove]

Sta 1 would be more enjoyable with 200-300 more dpm

[stuck acorn]

STA-1 would honestly be a little bit more enjoyable with anything

[twin egret]

It has one of the highest heat pens at it's tier

[stuck acorn]

Oh great, anyway

This is one of the most worthless strong points a tank can have. What will you do with pen if everything besides it is garbage?

Penetration is a parameter that allows you to put other stats to a better use, it's not causing a tank to be stronger by itself for the most part

[clear shuttle]

give it slightly better handling and ill be fine with it

[glad cove]

All sta-1 has is pen it lacks mobility, armor, dpm

All sta needs is more dpm or more alpha
But either way needs mobility

The indien pz received buffs that honestly should go to the sta 1 as well

[sullen copper]

@left grail will the lower tiers be changed due they share the same modules? Or will this be fixed later on? Because Vickers CR is getting literally annihilated at this point without any kind of proper change. 400 dpm nerf suddenly makes no sense.

[winter dagger]

Time to sell my whole grille tech tree

[glad cove]

Instead of messing with t10 wg just needs to fix all t1-9 tanks that are either old or just trash

[void siren]

use... the stock gun

[azure marten]

Rhm is safe for now

Oh

[void siren]

rhm has a minor alpha nerf

[winter dagger]

I will just play scorpion g

[stone drum]

This ace-bar is absolute insanity, after they removed the dpm Foch just died.

@void siren 1172 exp.

[void siren]

show us deep exp analysis

💀💀💀💀💀

[stone drum]

Here

[forest ridge]

Played the Jackson and they need to buff it
After the hellcat buff its really gotten worse

[granite pebble]

At least the St.Emile is really fun at least

[willow hawk]

No. Hellcat needs nerf.

[harsh ravine]

always wondered why they switched around the jackson and hellcat’s DPM.

[willow hawk]

Because WG thinks they know what’s best for the game, and they think they know how to balance tanks. Apparently WG does so well, Blitz is now at this current state:
Heavy tanks dominate meta
Mediums are continually nerfed and irrelevant
TDs are unflankable
Lights become dark.
IS-4 has identity/playstyle reassignment (why???)
Patton gets pen nerf (why??? Pen was one of its few remaining strengths, if not, its only strength)
WZ light gets butchered DPM for a lil more pen (that’s not a buff, we aren’t ID-10Ts)

[granite pebble]

Mediums got super buffed in 10.3 though? The only thing that got made worse was the T-22

[forest ridge]

I can agree on that as well, if it's really sluggish it needs to more armoured

[ember idol]

Jackson before the first Hellcat buff was truly an underrated goat

It's a shame how Blitz threw it down the bus to make the Hellcat relevent

[slender latch]

Don't know if people remember this tank but T25 AT was like a tier 7 badger with good mobility, armor and even dpm paired with a super speed boost but was pretty unpopular even before its nerf in 8.9 I think

[twilit crystal]

Yeah it was crazy op. Tank went at 60 kmh with heavy tank armor

[peak maple]

is 3 defender reduction of CD between projectiles and the total CD of the drum

[clear shuttle]

no

[humble depot]

The main issue with mediums has always been penetration. When none of them receive penetration buffs while heavies see armour buffs, that’s still a nerf.

[remote yarrow]

Yeah I remember playing it

[queen geyser]

In my opinion if you see the new patton armor its a buff for the tank

[orchid grove]

How about no. The last thing we need is an armored T57 at tier 8

[ember mountain]

but IS-3 Defender deserves a comeback

[stone drum]

Honestly total clip time reduction & an aimtime buff would be monumental to it.

[remote yarrow]

They're not listening to community so that's normal

[winter dagger]

5 - 5.5 seconds would help

[clear shuttle]

how to make the m-IV-yoh even more irrelevant

[stone drum]

I wasn't referring to the shell reload time, I was referring to the time it takes the whole clip to reload.

[outer glen]

T25/2 literally took at7 role as dpm monster at t7 and having much more versatility than at7
With turret armor buffed its troll unlike b4 its paper
Maybe at7 needs a buff on its copula or something maybe 25km idk any suggestions?

Ngl after playing the t25/2 i feel its better than the t25 at too

[nimble zodiac]

If you’re playing AT 7 with a cyclic gun, you’re playing it wrong

@stone drum Nah. Me and my platoonmate literally carried a game from using two AT 7 pew pews

[stone drum]

I agree, the autoloader needs more shells.

[winter dagger]

The clip itself is long, but reducing it overall while unironically give it a whole lot more DPM than the intra clip

[stone drum]

I'm aware, thats most of why i prefer a clip reload buff down to like 20s.

[winter dagger]

I feel 22 - 24 seconds is a good range, because you still have other autoloader of the same tier with 20 - 21 sec reloads with 3 sec intra clip, so a slightly shorter reload, a slightly more accurate on move dispersion maybe with a tiny intra clip buff while make it fun again

[willow hawk]

But…but…pew pew gun for the memes…!

[uneven turtle]

Wait what’s the pen nerf for patton for its AP/HEAT/HE respectively?

[azure marten]

I say remove the autoloader entirely and just give it a 1 second reload

[slender latch]

Maybe they can give IS3D a 2 shell autoloading gun instead with 430-450 alpha while keeping the intra- and inter- clip

[humble depot]

That would be boring

[winter dagger]

It'd be a worse t77

[slender latch]

Maybe reducing magazine reload time or intra-clip time to compensate for the 3rd shell?

[thorny timber]

it just needs a bit of accuracy,soviet and autoloaders never seem mix with each other

@solid sequoia it has got to have something over the t28 def to play with,so

[solid sequoia]

752 and K-91:

[nimble zodiac]

It’s a meme how good it is

[winter dagger]

752 is the only good autoloader that plays more like a tier ten than the k91

[solid sequoia]

K91 is still strong lmao

[stone drum]

K91 isn't strong at all, it's one of the worst tier X mediums!

[pliant summit]

How come

[hearty elm]

What’s happening to the E 100 in 10.3?

[queen geyser]

More alpha, less reload and dpm check yourself on the news sites

[winter dagger]

Note his words🫠

[hearty elm]

What channel is the balance changes in? @queen geyser

[queen geyser]

U have dms open ? Imma send u link

[humble depot]

It’s a joke based on WoT PC. They have a fake version of the K-91 with a rear-mounted turret.

[winter dagger]

Real k91

[humble depot]

No. There was a real rear-turreted K-91 planned, but it was very different to the one seen in WoT PC. The one in WoT PC is basically the one we have with a rear turret.

[winter dagger]

K91 on April fools ^

[unique scaffold]

k91 brother

[frigid torrent]

Where is my kranvagn 2.5 sec interclip

[queen geyser]

In your dreams probably, or u didnt take your shizo pills

[unique scaffold]

Is this getting a buff or a nerf next update?

[slender latch]

In a distant future wg has to be planning to replace 183 with another tank like badger it can be any made-up armored TD taken from someone's dream or smth.

[pale oyster]

They won't, as much as it would be better for the game.

[unique scaffold]

Hopefully they won't

[void siren]

A burf

[slender latch]

I hope they do tho 183's a connonfodder and unreliable on pubs

[twilit crystal]

Mostly a nerf. Turret armor is overall stronger but more consistent which means less troll bounces. Hull armor is weaker . 300 dpm nerf of course . Pen nerf also hurts and the only real buff Is 50 hp

[vestal basalt]

I Wonder How much FV 215B Forward Max speed increase

[twilit crystal]

Its 2 kmh lmao. 215b is so screwed

[cunning socket]

They screwed FV215b so much they even gave out its ultra-rare camo for free💀

[unique scaffold]

💀

[stone drum]

It's getting an overall nerf, but it's currently an extremely powerful vehicle. It wont bad, but it wont be as good as it used to be. The penetration & dpm nerfs you will absolutely feel.

[thorny timber]

almost everything is going apcr or getting direct pen nerfs,like why?

[misty haven]

me happi meh kran gettin buffed ^^

[teal minnow]

You never know what kind of people wg are

[thorny timber]

one might also argue that its an indirect buff to heavy armor...

[twin egret]

They're replacing it with an animated one

[little talon]

Hi

[winter dagger]

2 weeks from now

[hazy frost]

So far, the worst changes are on:
IS-4: (worse hull armor and a good chunk of HP removed)
AMX 50B: armor is now non-existent
FV-183: worse dispersion, worse HESH dmg and worse shell velocity, it will perform even worse from now on
Super Conqueror: much worse HE pen
AMX mle 54: worse armor, worse dmg, worse pen and no more tungsten shells
WZ 111-5A: which is even worse now, worse armor and dmg WZ-113: which lost DPM and accuracy when the tank already had meh dispersion
T57 Heavy: the reload nerf is unnecessary
Vickers Light: as if gun mantlet nerf wasn't bad enough the dmg nerf will hurt the tank quite a lot
Grille: nerfing its dmg down to 580 and reducing its shell velocity is just downright dumb

[tawdry iris]

AMX 50B deserves that nerf

[primal sundial]

fv 183 should get nerfed more tbh. I don't think I see as many useless people in a tank as that one. Just halve the alpha so it doesn't have a drawcard to it

[solid sequoia]

The only bad nerf here is the Vickers, the rest are either net buffs or nerfs so small they won’t really affect the tank

[void siren]

Great idea! It gets a buffed fv4005 autoloader!

[primal sundial]

please don't ping me for such nonsense. you can turn them off when you reply.

[void siren]

I refuse (yer original post was nonsense, so ya get le pings)

[primal sundial]

I have made a request that is really simple for you to accomodate. In fact, it is harder for you not to, then it is for you to do so. Please do not harass me.

[frank bone]

No it doesnt, 50B is alr an easy tank to deal with, so remove the frontal armour is completlry stupid. And not to mention the HE able sides and rear.

[solid sequoia]

You willingly put your suggestion out on a public forum, accept the fact that people will discuss it. You are asking to make the largest caliber in the game have less alpha than 130mm guns.

[primal sundial]

I don't care about responding to me, just turn off your pings. Is it really that hard?? Clearly I ask for a reason. And yet you both deliberately choose to continue to ping me.

[oak ember]

Did they nerd the cupola of the E3? Im getting penned by a t22medium !!!! This makes zero sense

[round sand]

U need to know that it is posible for any tier 10 tank to pen the cupola with the right ammo or luck

[stone drum]

AMX-50b change is excellent, the tank gets better mobility + gun and finally the armour is reverted to more historical amounts.

As of recent WG has shown that they know how to balance AMX-50.

@stuck acorn exactly, it rewards good players and punishes bad players.

[queen geyser]

I also like the amx50b changes

[stuck acorn]

50b and T57 changes are absolutely justified.

Also 50b never had any armor to begin with, so for a good player this change is a massive buff, not a nerf

Relying on armor that might or might not bounce depending on if enemy has eyes or not, is not what a good player does

[fickle shoal]

A good player tries not to bleed HP anyways

[gentle rover]

Selamün aleyküm türk kardesimlerim ekleyebilir mi?

[drowsy plaza]

English only here. Thx.

[slender latch]

Is the 10.3 50B going to have its old DPm back pre-9.1 of the 3 shell gun?

[civic ocean]

fr fr it's getting a buff?

I love 60 tp it didn't need a nerf

[humble depot]

“Won’t really affect the tank”

So tell me, how is losing most of its armour not detrimental to the gameplay of the IS-4?

[solid sequoia]

It lost hull armor but a lot of other tanks also lost pen. The IS-4 keeps an impenetrable turret and gets better mobility and a better gun. It’s going to be fine, if not better than it currently is

[chilly token]

Except is4 turret isn’t impenetrable

[dry rivet]

I don’t see why they would want to nerf 5A. Its frontal armor is already bad, and what it had going for it was the alpha. It could do high 400s and low 500s. There is no logic in buffing reload minimally and desecrating alpha. The same is done with a number of med tanks too.

What I can only think of is that WG is trying to reduce frequency of lopsided battles by introducing in-game forgiveness for mistakes made. One mistake = 500 hit points lost. With rebalance, it will be less, leaving the player with more HP to use. Again, it’s catering to the lower performers population.
IMO players like these should be punished for their mistakes. Otherwise they do not belong in tier X to even start with.

[chilly token]

They keep nerfing accuracy, penetration and buffing dpm. They just want you to spam more gold

[dry rivet]

Aka, they want to nerf good players’ capability of quickly and effectively snapshotting—no—even fully aimed in. This way, poorer performers stand a chance of surviving longer in battle.

Wargaming: can’t nerf player skills, so nerf the tank.

Update 10.3 is all about showing forgiveness to less skilled players and making battles last longer. However it doesn’t eliminate the fact that you still have clueless players who sit back and do nothing, or get lost on the map and have no idea where to go.

Instead of dancing around the issue, Wargaming should resolve it directly. The tanks are not the main issue, so the solution isn’t the ridiculous rebalance changes we see in 10.3.

The real issue is, players are progressing wayyyy too fast up the tiers, and there is not enough tank diversity in the lower tiers. This deprives many new players of the gaming experience, different tank playstyles, and time they need to learn the game.

All the new players are simply buying their way up the higher tiers or being crutches by PA, boosters, and insane x3,x4, and x5 multipliers. They cheat themselves because they haven’t learned the game. They hit battle, get punished, die in the first minute, and repeat.

[real bison]

the real crutch is the fact they they are matched with bots and more clueless players

the reason you see more newer "freshies" yoloing or doing dumb things is because they werent punished for doing so against bots or other freshies

just balance the game with more punishing playstyles

or something that is fun to play and fair to play against

[willow hawk]

Another problem is battles need to last longer. Buffing reload time isn’t the way to go. A lot of players play tanks opportunistically, taking every chance to exploit the mistakes of their opponents. In this case, gun penetration, gun handling/dispersion, and gun alpha takes priority. Reload times should be nerfed, not buffed.
This way games can last longer because players will be forced to understand the weight of their in-gameplay mistakes.

Yep 👍

[stone drum]

Both grille and the (fake) AMX m4 got nerfed quite hard, and grille arguably got nerfed harder than vickers.

Saucy pfp btw

[solid sequoia]

Except it really is. You need rng in order to have a chance of going through it.

@stone drum Grille is going to be better at 2nd like support due to dpm, which is how the tank should be played now anyways, and the AMX M4 is getting buffed lol, better armor, better dpm, and better mobility

[dry rivet]

Doing this is also a form of player forgiveness. (Which is good) Because of the long reload times, opponent players have time to recover from their mistakes instead of being dumped with a load of hostile fire. And, this means less lopsided battles, because losing half or three quarters of your Hitpoint pool due to one mistake and the enemy’s fast reloads isn’t fun.

[stone drum]

The grille is getting an overall mobility nerf, less alpha, shell velocity, view range etc for only a small dpm increase (which isn't a bad thing)

As for the AMX, the Mobility barely got Buffed, it didn't even gain an extra effective 1° of traverse or any tangible horsepower buff. The armour buff it got was also a mistake by WG, it was supposed to be 190 and likely will be in live server. To top it off it gained a negligible amount of dpm inexchange for the power & reliably of its gun.

These fake mobility buffs honestly disgust me, it's tantamount to blatantly lying.

[willow hawk]

Although I’m not a French tank loving guy, it’s nonsensical that the AMX mle54 is getting armor nerf. All it had was strong upper frontal armor. What’s the point of playing the tank now?

[dry rivet]

because Wargaming wants tanks to be different from themselves/their former identities, not to be different from each other.
All the balance changes are somewhat consistent, so it shows Wargaming is slacking off when it comes to balancing tanks. Most of it is just armor nerfs, pen nerfs, alpha nerfs and reload buffs. Slight armor buffs for some here and there.

[fringe quest]

It’s armor is staying the same you know, when is gets it PBR, is armor for buffed, and then the changed comes and nerfed it, I seen how it looks and it’s the same profile, so the armor is basically not been touched

[willow hawk]

I don’t think mle 54 got PBR yet…idk where you’re coming from. It’s a whole load of unwarranted nerfs with some fake buffs.

[graceful elk]

Massive lower plate. Didn’t the bar used to be red? I could have sworn it was.

[willow hawk]

That still doesn’t answer my question. You just showed the difference between 258mm pen and 340mm pen.
Someone correct me if I’m wrong, but so far mle 54 has not received PBR. It will receive armor nerf, firepower nerfs, and fake/non-effective mobility buffs.

[fickle shoal]

it will be getting pbr

[slender latch]

If that's the case then that would be just a bad habit of "balancing" when they just cater to bad players at tier 10 instead of the average players. Well I guess statistically in WG's perspective, an average player in blitz must be bad players so they are in fact a majority of the playerbase.

[stone drum]

That was a mistake on their part.

[leaden flare]

idk im welcoming most of the heavy changes as theyve been incredibly powerful for a long time so nerfs really dont hurt those tanks
despite the fact that dpm or mobility buffs for armor nerfs on heavys are smth that makes them much better for more skilled players imo

[dry rivet]

It’s more of Wargaming running out of ideas to try to get out of the mess they made. They listen to the wrong opinions and ignore good ones, and they’re confident in their own decisions. The only ones looking silly are them because of their outlandish balance changes.

[nimble zodiac]

From what I can tell, the upper plate is getting buffed while the lower plate and shoulder plates are getting nerfed, both by 10mm, which isn't that significant

People can always cry about the 450 alpha, though

[willow hawk]

Aren’t the shoulders weak enough? Lmao. I occasionally get penned there even without angling

[drowsy plaza]

Seriously the 60TP is absolutely brain dead to play. The smallest lower plate ever…

[drowsy plaza]

Yet most meds also see pen nerf’s too. It’s like WG just likes to throw 💩 into a fan to see what sticks to a wall. Making heavy tanks faster is just mind blowing based on the fact that they significantly out HP Meds, plus they clobbered a number of tanks dispersion when combined with the pen nerf’s for standard ammo they seem to want folks to spam Prammo - which mean the STB is going to be loving life. The fact they aren’t even following their own balance data that they originally set out, and BlitzAnalysiz just shows they aren’t really doing balancing, they are just rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic. There isn’t an actual attempt to balance tanks, just change then around so others are better performing. For what purpose? Maybe to encourage others to grind other lines and buy more garage slots? Not sure. But it really doesn’t make a lot of sense when you look at performance data.

[scenic olive]

T62a has become what I always wanted the 140 to be😔

[dapper zenith]

To me the reason for this upcoming balances changes has to be setting up for a bigger change, maybe something like an equipment overhaul. there’s no way WG had someone choose all these different buffs/nerfs, from what I see it’s setting up so that new equipment in spotting, penetration and mobility won’t make some vehicles ridiculously broken

[civic ocean]

fr fr 5a didn't need a nerf. what it need was at least a pen buff decent tank that's one of its pitfulls imo

[civic ocean]

literally only thing wrong with it no need for nerf of gun i don't see it as an issue its just troll thats all

[civic ocean]

good point

[fickle shoal]

The kpz 70 should receive speed buff to 45 km/h and type 71 equipment, and change standard rounds to AP

[nimble zodiac]

Lol that’d be broken
Nine degrees of gun depression? Sheesh.

[solid sequoia]

Consider the fact that the Kpz 70 is doing fine as is, if not a little overperforming

[fickle shoal]

It's only a little over 51% win rate and it's majoritively dying in battles

[fringe quest]

When M60 PBR, been waiting for a lonnng time

[solid sequoia]

By basis of how the game works, tanks will die more than not. Every game, at least 7 tanks die, many time more than that, making the average death ratio of a tank higher than 50%. And over 51% is performing quite well. All in all, the kpz doesn’t need a buff, you do.

[fickle shoal]

I play it fine, I'm only saying other players, and tbch why should I even play the kpz if I can grab a T30 or 34 and be basically the same tank (if you play them both as heavies). I'm fine with at least small mobility buffs to it, any special equipment can be WGs mistake to make. And for said mobility buffs if it loses armor I'm double fine, it was already pretty easy to go through

[willow hawk]

It really shows WG gave up on the idea of balancing. Catering to heavy meta, nerfing tier 10 med pen a second time forces normal players to use calibrated instead of rammer.
For players like myself, I didn’t mind the first time WG made a tier 10-wide med penetration nerf because we had the newly introduced calibrated rounds perk to redeem some of the lost pen. Now, it leaves cali users in the dust because there’s no way to redeem from the pen nerf.

[slender latch]

Might it be possible that all tanks get the Improved Gun Stab and Improved Suspension equipments if they overhaul the system.

[clear shuttle]

please not all tanks 💀

[coral helm]

hey dev, why did my sheridan's reload time of 13 seconds suddenly become 14 seconds after the update?

[leaden flare]

I didn't understand the pen nerf on meds either
I would've understood it somewhat if they in exchange for standard pen would've gotten extra prammo pen

The update in terms of random battles is going to be dominated by the likes of STB e5 and a few other imo

[wooden lynx]

Good thing is that Leopard 1 pen is unharmed (:

[real bison]

lol no

-20kph reverse capable
can avoid low rolls at the click of a button
moron proof turret
tiny lower plate which RNG loves sending shells to hit the underbelly or tracks when at an angle
better pen than the IS-7 whilst having as much armour
better mobility and armour than the VZ, and somehow weighing less

[slender latch]

Is the charioteer HESH alpha going to be nerfed to 380? I think I saw this somewhere but forgot.

[ember idol]

It's the cheap HESH one, probably to force players to use the main one more

[slender latch]

I thought it would be the other way around so they force people to also carry the standard HE? Or that blitzhangar displayed it incorrectly.

[ember idol]

Nah that would be pointless for less pen and less alpha 💀

And if they do want people to carry standard HE, they would nerf the pen and add on more dmg to up the stakes

[teal sonnet]

#vehicles-discussion message

[slender latch]

If you look at the shell icon I think the standard HE is the one getting nerfed instead of the premium HESH.

Also I was confused at first when you said cheap HESH I thought you meant the standard HE which is also HESH.

Edit: My bad I thought you meant the premium HESH, either way standard HE would basically become useless now on Char.

[clear shuttle]

cheap hesh is standard he tho..

[ember idol]

Yes, that was what I stated💀

[drowsy plaza]

Long balancing rant incoming. So looking at data from https://blitzanalysiz.com/update/10.1/10/. It is virtually impossible to reconcile the “rebalance” that WG is attempting to conduct currently with the data from player performance. Just looking at tier X (because let’s face it you need to set X as the bar and adjust other tiers from that). We have the top tanks by relative WR (relative WR is important to consider as it takes the players average WR in that tier compared to a tank. That is the easiest method of showing over performance. Then one looks at the lowest relative WR results. Strange right? 14 of the bottom tanks are Meds or Lights. While non of the better performance tanks are meds or lights. What are they, generally heavy armored tanks, yes the StrvK is the outlier as a heavium - and two heaviums sit in the bottom (Mk6 and Obj 260) but that can get discussed later as to why those tanks are where they are. Yes averages are generally bad, simply because the player base isn’t exactly strong these days. So let’s look at what I will call statistically relevant populations the 65%+ and 55-65% in tier players. The 65%+ group isn’t represented well in X due to the limited # of players so there are not a great deal of tanks represent. So the 55-65% group gives the largest reliable player results with a number of tanks. Shocker what tanks are over performing there, inversely let’s look at the worst performance in those players. Generally lights and meds and some of the less armored TD’s plus a sprinkling of heaviums. /more to follow

So if you just look at the average WR and Average Damage results, while not segregated for player WR levels in tier they also show some remarkably similar results. The StrvK is again the outlier, as the rest of the top results are heavy armored tanks but when you look at the most popular tanks and the most played tanks the StrvK doesn’t show up. The 183 and it’s tragic existence jumps the shark as usual. But just looking at Medium tanks https://blitzanalysiz.com/update/10.1/10/medium-tanks/. It’s clear that regardless of player skill levels that they and Lights suffer comparatively. The absolutely mind boggling HP buff that heavy tanks got flies in the face of any justification. Considering HT’s where already over-performing compared to other tank types.

[winter lynx]

What they need to do is ban people who lose matches in purpose

[drowsy plaza]

WG has a major fail in dealing with trolls, however the problem is a large amount of players aren’t trolling their are just hopelessly clueless, and that makes it difficult for WG to determine if a player that is doing 400 average damage in tier X is trolling or just awful. The in game reporting system is setup terribly and the only real method of reporting is opening a ticket with WG and attaching a replay - which isn’t exactly the easiest thing in iOS. If WG was actually serious about these issues they would fix the in game report system to allow for attachment of replays in game - it’s their interface, and it’s almost like they have made it as awkward as they can.

[winter lynx]

They need to increase the platoon size from 2 to 5

[cunning socket]

Make it 7. Become clan vs clan

[winter lynx]

If the enemy team only loses 1 to 2 tanks and it's like literally impossible for your team to win. This means the match is RIGGED and I know for a FACT every single one of you have been in tons of matches where it was absolutely IMPOSSIBLE to win

[void siren]

Even the best 65% heavy player turns into a 52% dimwit when playing a med/light

[ornate shuttle]

its not gaining any dpm though
the penetration nerf is massive, you need to use calibrated, negating all dpm nerf.
305 heat is just horrific, standard Ap getting nerfed as well
so its just a Alpha nerf, without buffing the accuracy back
its horribly accurate for a 450 alpha poor dpm gun
they nerfed accuracy when they included tungsten, but now it has lower alpha and no tungsten... no reason for trash accuracy no??
Also, Its 2% faster on medium terrain.
i agree the buff is decently big on hard terrain, but do you understand hard terrain is like 5% of the map right? its irrelevant, its unnoticeably faster in 99% of the situations, and its just losing alpha

[stone drum]

The hard terrain buffs actually make the overall mobility buffs near irrelevant, as the tank is barely getting a traverse or acceleration buff on medium terrain.

[stable gulch]

That doesnt mean its rigged...

[stone drum]

Its also important to look at stats in context, this is in 10.1, before Strv K was out in crates and as such the Strv is borderline exclusively used by Competitive players, Such Is evidenced by its extraordinarily high player win-rate at tier. In that context its no shock Strv K performs well, as such is an inherent quality of its playerbase.

[drowsy plaza]

You mistake a terrible player base for rigging.

That is a major part of it. Frankly for most players the Strv K isn’t OP at all and is a sub performer. It shines in certain situations due to the mobility and DPM, but it’s arguably the best heavium tank out there. Having AP as standard gives it better base pen than the Mk6, and Concept, and 1mm better than the AP on the E6. It also as you point out hasn’t been watered down by the player base like the Mk6 has. When more players get it who aren’t 65%+ players it’s going to sink like a rock. The Nerf’s aren’t really justified in that sense, and would only be justified by a lot more heavy tanks being significantly nerfed. Which is absolutely not what WG seems to want, as catering to the lowest common denominator seems to be the new thing.

[slender latch]

Apparently IS4 is going to lose armor while gaining a mobility buff while IS7 gets nerfed on mobility. IS7 once again will have thicker armor than IS4, WG sure likes to switch the armor on these.

[stone drum]

I think the best approach would have been to simply remove the strv K's Sandbag armour & speed boost consumable in exchange for 52/17 kph top speeds in addition to changing the penetration to 255/295/105 ap/ap/hesh & shell velocity to 1400, 1000, 1150.

Or something along those general lines

[winter dagger]

Budget fv4202

[uneven turtle]

50tp prot with gear oil: my speed :(

[nimble zodiac]

It ain’t that busted

[unique scaffold]

How is it busted

[subtle egret]

prog 46 at tier 7

[unique scaffold]

Of course yes, if you tell me, I have to believe your words, what's the point of playing the game for 8 years, for someone to tell me that "it's not that broken" Thanks and good day ❤️

[glad cove]

Buff sta 1

[visual bane]

Thx wargaming for the most random and undeserved nerf in history. Rip is4 next Update.

[unique scaffold]

Lol another one 💀 😔

[nimble zodiac]

I’m happy to talk this out. With my experience as well, we can come up with a more accurate assessment of how well this tank will perform.

[stuck acorn]

It doesn't seem to be busted at all tbh. It seems to be broken and stupidly designed, but not overpowered by any means

[fickle tinsel]

why is every tank getting watered down by nerfing what makes it unique? is7 fast superheavy? nerf speed is4, slow superheavy with insane armor? nerf armor e100 known for its alpha? they threw nerfing the alpha around until mad community backlash. isnt it common sense that they should nerf other aspects of the tank instead??

[jaunty hornet]

E 100's alpha isn't getting nerfed, it's actually getting buffed a bit with the reload getting nerfed.merged.

Aside from that I agree. I get they want to shake the meta up, but not by changing things on certain tanks that don't need them.

[fickle tinsel]

There was a scare a while ago that they wanted to nerf it to like 600 or something and it got massive backlash. Honestly insane NGL. But yeah, the decisions are confusing. The is7 should be very fast. The is4 should be a monster hulldown and side scraping. They should pay for it with poor gun handling and dpm. Tanks should strongly fit a role and be unique. The game simply won't be as fun if every tank is mediocre at every role and only slightly different from each other. Tanks like the t95e6 and bourrasque are highly saught after despite not being OP simply because they actually have an interesting and unique playstyle

Also if I can go on a tangent it seeks like lately they've been giving all these tanks good gun depression instead of better all around armor with poorer gun dep. I miss when side scraping was a thing instead of (or in addition to) camping hulldown

[nimble zodiac]

Your two examples are sought after because they’re too good at their playstyle 👀

Sidescraping is less viable because of 3CRB, which I hope they’d fix >:l

[fickle tinsel]

But I mean if they're too good, there's better ways to nerf. Take the is7 speed for example. Instead of nerfing its speed, nerf something like the turret traverse speed so if they use said speed to chase a med, there's a chance they could get COD'd in response. That's a better way of balancing things out IMO

[gleaming apex]

regice508#0 has been warned.

[whole flame]

buff grille

[unique scaffold]

<@&481447501690568709> Why delete my message?

[unique scaffold]

Read the warning

[unique scaffold]

i see, sorry, thanks

[stone drum]

IS-5 got Buffed and IS-4 has long be unrecognizable from its "classic" state.

[slender latch]

Is it true E4 will have less or the same HP as T30 in 10.3? Also dpm getting nerfed all for what +2km/h top speed buff lol.

[solid sequoia]

It will have 50 less HP than the T30, it’s losing around 200 dpm iirc, but it’s getting a massive accuracy boost and a bit of an armor profile change. It’s a fair change imo, the current E4 is too strong anyways

[quick lichen]

😂

[clear shuttle]

the 600 alpha thing was a bug in the OT, i dont think they specifically said they were gonna reduce it to 600

[twilit crystal]

Yeah plenty of bourrasque esque tanks exist at tier 8. Stg or Skoda wi

[nimble zodiac]

STG? What makes it like Bourrasque?

[stone drum]

The e4 has been so mid for so long, them finally making it a decent tank was a nice change.

Regardless they just nerfed it way too hard, now it will likely be worse than it was pre-buff.

@solid sequoia its literally getting the pre-buff accuracy & dpm... but with less penetration, velocity, alpha, mobility in exchange for extra armour.

[solid sequoia]

Definitely not, it will still have good dpm with much better accuracy now

[granite pebble]

The E4 is already capable of pulling off insane snapshots, it's going to become even better now that you'll be able to just run vstab, it's still going to have 100 more base dpm than old E4.

The mobility, armor, and dpm is absolutely worth what it lost and it's still going to be a strong tank, albeit it has less HP now iirc

[main tulip]

Imo the pre-buff version with the current mobility and 1 more degree of gun depression would be the ideal version of E4 imo

[stone drum]

Lol they cant make up their minds on the poor e4. 9.1, 10.0, and 10.3 in order.

[clear shuttle]

note their making the cupola smaller with pbr 💀

[granite pebble]

Right.

I forget that I can't trust literally ANY of the changes they put in the discord.

10.3 E4 might as well just be a worse E3 if I'm being honest

I'm glad I have no desire to play the game, and that WG continues to validate my lack of desire.

[main tulip]

How many more of the discord-announced-changes were outright lies?

[granite pebble]

I can't wait for the Lesta server to absolutely DOG on the other WG servers with the changes they make, just like how the WOWS lesta server is making changes that everybody wanted for ages.

Either way, I got Starfield, Armored Core, and Baulders Gate to keep me preoccupied in the time being while WG figures out how they can make the most nonsensical balancing changes to tanks to "keep the game fresh" while simultaneously not changing anything about the meta, effectively making the game play the exact same but with different tanks.

@main tulip the E5's hull basically wasn't nerfed, the AMX M4 Mle got armor buffs, the IS-4's armor effectiveness is practically preserved except against premmo, the E4 got absolutely eviscerated, which these 4 are the only ones I know off the top of my head

[queen geyser]

Huh pretty sure they said its just a preview and that they still can work on parameters , its just that people cant wait until changes even make it to live server to make a opinion

[stone drum]

Lol, lesta is way worse afterall they are the ones making the changes

[granite pebble]

Do you understand what feedback is? The changes they make are awful for the overall health and they're literally pulling back on changes they did without even openly saying that's that what they did.

We also know WG, people weren't happy about the Foch 155 changes and guess what Foch got? Nothing.

@stone drum LESTA is sperate from EU and NA servers now, the things they change and decide to do wont go through to NA and EU, look at WOWS, the RU server pop started dying and so all of a sudden they decided to start making changes that people have asked for for years, but those said changes aren't going through to EU or NA.

[queen geyser]

Huh ? I dont need to understand what feedback means since nobody talked about that, I talked about that "WG is lying"

[granite pebble]

You literally said "It's just people can't wait for it to make it to live server to form opinions"

And yes WG DID lie about the changes they said they would be making in this discord. The only thing they said they would do to the E4 is change it to APCR and HEAT, bring the alpha down by 10, increase the accuracy,and increase top speed by 2, yet it got its mobility absolutely nuked, and it lost even more dpm.

So yes, they lied, that is not an "opinion" it is a literal fact.

[queen geyser]

Uh ok u surely talk alot for not reading so much

Here again: #coming-soon message

[scenic olive]

It’s literally gonna be a worse version of when wg first buffed it, it’s a fact. I agree with thefochguy, the tvp has been busted for so long and wg are just now nerfing it, I think wg could of at least let the e4 shine for a bit longer or just nerfed the dpm down to 2900/3000 and left the tank the same

[granite pebble]

You sure seemingly can't get your point across for someone trying to insult someone else

Congratulations you have done nothing

Man I sure have high hopes for these changes after WG destroyed the Foch, nerfed it more, and then didn't give it anything while making changes they didn't say they were making to the E4, Amx M4, and Grille.

[solid sequoia]

It’s for sure going to be better than when it was first buffed lol

[queen geyser]

Yes because u are ignoring what I have said, they gave us a preview about changes they might going to do but might change numbers depending on tests they do. The gave us a preview, then changes some Numbers, thats not lying thats wg just giving us not as much information as we would want to, then again Wg could have just not giving us any Information at all and just hit us with the live Patch we they didnt

Thats why im saying wait for live patch before forming a opinion because a) Wg does not listen to us b) they might even just dont change anything or diffrent then u expect

[scenic olive]

How? because it got its top speed increased by 2? It’s pen got crapped on compared to what it was, mobility got put back to what it was, the alpha got nerfed and apcr/heat is literally the worst ammunition load out possible, it is most definitely gonna be worse than when it was first buffed

[stone drum]

If they didn't listen to us then TVP would never have been nerfed.

@scenic olive
Nah HEAT/APCR/HE is the worst possible loadout lol

@solid sequoia compared to previous iterations it's gun is overall worse.

@queen geyser you dont know what they do or do not listen to... lol. You do not speak for nor represent their company. They also do not appear to have too much consistency in such matters regardless.

[solid sequoia]

It’s armor profile got better and it’s more accurate, allowing it to use its gun more

@stone drum the gun may be slightly worse but the rest of the tank is better

[queen geyser]

Im pretty sure they only listen to super testers and their own plans and statistics, because the feedback gathered here is far to disorganized to read or is Just screaming weird stuff (Buff xyz!!!! WG are u stupid????? Etc.)

@stone drum huh ? Where does that come from now, u just said that if they wouldnt listen to us Tvp would never have been nerfed ? U can just copyposta your very text right there for yourself

[stone drum]

Considering the Mobility is on par to previous iterations it's not really notable.

Biggest thing is the armour is better, but the gun is significantly worse.

@queen geyser that was an example of sardonic humor, I'm sorry you failed to understand it in the context of the conversation.

[granite pebble]

They also gave us a preview of the Foch 155 and Foch changes, the majority of people who had played the tanks thought the changes were bad, and they still went through with them 💀

Your faith in WG to actually do anything based off of community feedback is... appalling.

The entire consensus of the Strv K is that it was only strong in a good players hands and yet it was still nerfed, the grille has been steadily getting nerfed with absolutely no compensation, the FV4202 hasn't been relevant in the meta for literal ages and yet it borderline got nothing, the 215b is getting its armor nuked for borderline nothing, a lot of these changes have been known for a while and they still went through into 10.3 test server despite the general consensus was that the changes weren't good.

But yes, continue to have blind faith in a company that is notorious for going years without actually paying attention to feedback from literally anyone except the "silent majority"

[queen geyser]

Huh?

@granite pebble Bro I never said they changes are good, makes sense or anything pls dont put words in my mouth
I only wanted to tell u, that wg was not lying because they said they might change numbers which surprise they did

[clear shuttle]

they might change numbers but its almost never based off of community feedback

[queen geyser]

Yea that is bad but shouldnt be a surprise by now

[twilit crystal]

sneaky low profile , high alpha, good camo, has a bit more armor but its hardly reliable, bad gun depression.

[violet island]

@granite pebble is your brain actually this degenerated or why can you not write a single message without being condescending

[granite pebble]

I give the energy that is given, if someone doesn't understand what the implications of their words mean thats not my problem.

And the implications of their words when they started this was like they were shilling for WG, which quite frankly I don't see anyone who shills for a company like WG as anyone worth being polite to.

[scenic olive]

It’s still worse than pre buff😭

[twin egret]

I wonder what the WR statistics are in the open test server for each tank

[nimble zodiac]

Grille’s getting compensation :(

[granite pebble]

Yeah, in the form of a med terrain nerf, which makes the speed increase and the hard terrain buff mean a lot less since med terrain is the main terrain type on a lot of maps

[nimble zodiac]

Well the main compensation I meant was the reload buff. If you meant effectively no compensation, go ahead, but I saw just compensation :p

[granite pebble]

Fair enough lol

I feel bad for the Grille tbh, has no camo, it's mobility is effectively becoming worse, it's lost it's alpha, the gun handling is still awful aside from standing still, makes me wonder why they don't just remove the entire tank line at this point since they have a vendetta against that tank style

[nimble zodiac]

But remember that WG is phasing Grille out of the sniping playstyle because the Grille is not a heavy tank

[granite pebble]

"The grille is a toxic tank, it's super accurate and mobile"

JgPz with better effective armor than the E-100 and Tungsten running refined:

I'd rather deal with a mobile glass cannon platform with no camo and an 11 second reload 640 alpha gun rather than what's essentially a turretless super heavy with 800 alpha that is occasionally guaranteed to do a minimum of 840

[short gyro]

Is it true that T110E4 will only have 1750 hp? it looks so bad for a Tier t10 tank to have less hp than most T8s

Most Tier 10s can do 460+ average, so.... 4 shots is all it takes to kill a T110E4 now.. light tanks and medium tanks got more hp

How daheck do u play it now then

[granite pebble]

The HP nerf would be fine if it had kept the base 2800 dpm and mobility, but yes, their initial iteration of the E4 is with 1750 hp and considerably worse mobility

[granite pebble]

Well the tank has pretty good armor and it's main weakspot is becoming smaller, so you're just a light tank HP heavy American super heavy essentially.

Or you play it like a second line support TD.

Either way the tank is going to become substantially less fun than its 10.2 counterpart.

[short gyro]

Play it like a derp T32 ok

[short gyro]

E4 with No hp, armor isnt reliable when enemies can load premium and snipe ur cupola, slow so u cant even wiggle to avoid shots, all u can do is raise ur gun to try to block for ur cupola, not even 3k base dpm,
Armor ❌
Mobility ❌
Gun ❌ 😭

[clear shuttle]

remind me whos idea it was to make the cupola smaller with pbr

[stone drum]

They should replace grille with Skorpion 15cm imo.

[lone sandal]

LOL e4 no armour???? 😭💀

[slender latch]

They reduced E4's HP and buffed dispersion I think WG intends it to snipe or support like the Grille does today. On a side note E3 be getting a 150HP buff with almost no compensation lol.

[twilit crystal]

smaller with pbr makes sense, it was getting absurd that meds with heat struggled to pen it

[short gyro]

When did i say no armor, I said" armor isnt reliable when enemies can load premium and snipe ur cupola" 🤨

Armor not good
Mobility not good
Gun mid

[lone sandal]

LOL e4 armour not good????

[nimble zodiac]

Load premium and snipe your cupola?

[short gyro]

its so easy fighting an E4 with its cupola hanging out

[clear shuttle]

you must play anything but meds and lights then

[spiral zenith]

where are the changes released for non-tier-10 tanks for 10.3? I saw some people talking about borsig and waffle nerfs so i’m curious about any other lower tier changes

[twin egret]

E4 's cupola was so troll, I'm glad it's getting a nerf to it

[ancient rampart]

The E4 has a super troll Cupola
That thing isn't as easy to pen as you may think

[short gyro]

Charioteer's Hesh is getting changed from 440 to 380
its standard ap only does 350

[short gyro]

fr

[slender latch]

Not a nerf but buff, pbr will make the hatch smaller and thicker plus they added a layer of spaced armor

[twin egret]

it's actually weaker, not stronger

[ember idol]

The T-54 is getting some alpha buff on the gun with no pen

Charioteer's free HESH is getting a -60 alpha nerf

Type 61's 105mm gun is going the same changes as the STB-1, aking the STA-1 the odd one out of the JP mt

Vickers CR dart rounds are getting nerfed to the same damage to its HEAT rounds

VK45B is getting the same equipment treatment to the VK72

That's pretty much it other than tier 10 as far as we know

[slender latch]

Looking at blitzhangar I guess the pbr did make it thinner but when hulldown I think its effective thickness is better since it's not big or flat anymore

[twin egret]

The spaced armour makes it worse thanks to the 3CR rule and normalization

[violet island]

So if I say someone who is stupid doesn’t deserve me to be polite to him that means I can just be an absolutely mean guy to you as your mouth is obviously far more developed than your brain looking at your response to nerf/buffs and you giving any consideration to the feedback of the community with a lot of rather bad players

[short gyro]

Tier 9 and 8 Changes

T-54

• Increase damage by 20 for all of its shells

VK 45.02 B

• Equipment and Improved Suspension

WT auf Pz. IV

• Decrease damage by 20 for all of its shells
• Reload changed from 14.86 to 14.38

Vickers CR

• APCR damage decreases by 50

Type 61

• Standard AP and HE loses 20 damage
• Premium Rounds damage increases by 20

Rhm.-B. WT

• Decrease damage by 20 for all of its shells
• Reload changed from 17.26 to 16.68

Charioteer

• Hesh damage decreases by 60

[granite pebble]

I'm glad we can both agree that it would in fact be stupid to shill for a multi-million dollar company that continues to make poor decisions that not only hurts their image but also causes their population to bleed further because they simply cannot be trusted :)

And yes if someone does seen like they're being a WG shill, I do in fact support someone's right to talk to them as they please. Which there is a difference between talking about the good things they have done, and seemingly defending blatant awful decisions/blatantly lying.

The stats that blitzhangar had posted iirc was before ANY TESTING had even happened on the open test server due to delays, which would in fact mean that WG lied about them even adjusting stats based off of test results, none the less even doing changes in which they had initially said they would, which is something that what's his face seemingly couldn't understand.

[subtle egret]

nice to see wg removing all the fun from every tank to make this game more boring

[unique scaffold]

@granite pebble just to be clear. You are not welcome to speak to people as you see fit here.

@violet island the same goes for you.

[slender latch]

If blitz becomes boring you can try other games being released like Warthunder Mobile or Tank Company and tank related games.

[subtle egret]

yes i did try other games rarely play blitz nowadays

[remote sluice]

lets see here

• 215b loses all its armor which it never had in the first place
• foch 155 doing 500 damage w a 155mm gun
• is4 becomes a generic heavy
• vickers light now has the lowest alpha of all lights
• e4 goes back to its pre-buff era (but only a bit better)
• many more but i dont remember

[subtle egret]

grille t57 vk72 is7 is4 4005 4202 vickers light fv215 hori wz113 wz132-1 foch155 amx50b.. basically all the fun stuff about these tanks are removed/nerfed for no reason

[clear shuttle]

is-7 and vk 72 will still be fun imo

[unique scaffold]

Is FV183 getting nerfed?

[queen geyser]

They are changing lot about it, most importantly the are buffing the alpha of the ap and normal he but nerfing the alpha of the high pen he, just look at up yourself

[unique scaffold]

Where?(some grammars was wrong it was hard for me to understand)

[remote sluice]

to add in, strv k loses its quirk as a very fast heavium, mino becomes even slower for some reason, progetto now has 290 heat pen, etc etc

[queen geyser]

#coming-soon message

[subtle egret]

yup all this changes doesnt make sense to me
mino doesnt even need speed nerf at all, prog with 295mm heat pen is already quiet low

[humble depot]

Nothing about the 50b that was “fun” is being nerfed. Nobody used the armour. It never relied on the armour. Stop complaining about the armour nerf.

[slender latch]

50B also doesn't need a 4-shell gun, simply the old 3-shell gun had better gun handling and reload unless they also found it "toxic" for a fast HT.

[glad cove]

Buff sta 1

[stone drum]

Precisely.

@slender latch things have changed since the 3 shell days, the 3 shell just wouldn't be a good idea to implement anymore. The new 10.3 stat will be good.

@orchid grove think, it's better the fake armour gets nerfed than the gun or mobility, so I'm very happy about that. Plus the 50b is getting armour that very close to the correct level which is also exciting for me. I think this will be a good change to help balance the 50bs firepower with even more vulnerability (which decreases chances it wil be nuked later).

[orchid grove]

The armor definitely hurts though. Now that you can essentially just auto-aim the 50 b it's harder to get the time you need to aim. Also, I definitely relied on the armor to bounce shots against mediums while on reload lol

[fickle tinsel]

guys when is my obj 752 getting a third shell in clip with proportional dpm buff

[violet island]

why only 3 shells when you can also have 5 shells with the same reload as before, half the intra clip, 25% more alpha better engine power and armor?

[fickle tinsel]

Honestly I'm not going to lie it is a bit annoying because when I play the obj 752 it is to win (obviously) but wargaming is wasting a lot of my time by having me actually have to enter into the battle and making me waste precious time dumping hapless tier 8 mediums with 860 clip potential I think a good improvement to the tank would be to have the game automatically end when I start a battle with the 752 and call it a win on my behalf I think that'd be a lot easier and more efficient

[grizzled flame]

Can we talk about the AMX M4 45?
The Good: Agile. Pen is high enough to engage most T9s without pressing 2. Passable accuracy and aimtime. Climbs hills well. Depression to the front is excellent.

The Bad: Huge target, both turret and hull. Armor is barely enough to protect it from T5s and T6 meds. Thin plates and huge mean arty bait. Sides are overmatchable by 122s. Low HP. Crippling module damage problems. Terrible gun handling and DPM. Depression over the sides and rear are non-existent, a big problem on a tank this tall. Cross map speed is as bad as a typical heavy.

It's essentially a Tiger H without the Tiger H's major strengths: a best-in-tier gun and best-in-tier HP pool. Alternately take an FCM and downtier it while stripping off it's meager armor. Then give it a damaged engine and a heavy nerf to gun handling and reload.

It is absolute garbage as a heavy tank and fights for last in class/tier with the Black Prince. Can't trade, can't take damage, too slow to play as a medium. It's a tank with no real role and nothing it does well. Its not so bad it's unplayable, especially with how bad most players are below tiers 9 & 10, but it IS bad.

[void siren]

this looks like a copy paste from wot pc - are you thinking straight...?
+2/-2 mm is long gone

[grizzled flame]

Yeah, copy paste but this tank absolutely needs a buff man, it's literally the worst tier 7 heavy, no armour and it's absolutely slow with trash mobility

[stone drum]

It already got a pretty big buff, If you use the 105mm gun it's actually a pretty good tank.

@queen geyser do ignore how they absolutely crippled the 90mm gun.

[queen geyser]

There are many other tanks that need more Attention thats for sure

[fickle tinsel]

buff lt423!!

[grizzled flame]

Ik that, but the armour and speed needs to be buffed

[umbral ember]

Is there any chance wargaming will not implement the changes on the grille?
I was grinding the line when WG released the balance change. I always wanted the grille so I am still grinding for it.

[violet island]

The Changes are so inconsequential that it doesn’t matter

[stone drum]

It was supposed to redefine the way It played, not just outright nerf it.

[winter dagger]

Well it redefined it too hard... From the glorious 640 to 580 over two years...

[nocturne cypress]

The Grille 15 needs rebalanced

[summer holly]

Please buff the Choeftain mk6 make the turret impervius but still ceep the weak hatch

[fickle shoal]

???

[wooden lynx]

It's crazy that I got penned by a Sheridan to the front of my turret and not the cupola(I was a Chieftain mk6)

[thorny timber]

Meh,it's not like anyone is gonna hit anything other than your cupola in you are hulldowning anyways,if they do then they just have good luck or hate themselves

[fickle shoal]

thats prammo, and if your not just sitting still there's still a chance

(is that with cali btw)

[stone drum]

No cali.

[stuck acorn]

350 is only on a small part of the turret below the gun. Rest is smth like 250/230

the red part is 350, light red is 250/230 and orange (above the gun etc) is 160

[granite pebble]

The VK 72 is being made better by a large margin, but overall yes, 10.3 overall isn't going to make the game feel any more fresh than how it currently is since nothing about the meta is actually changing, it's just the tanks that are being used will change slightly

[lone sandal]

they should consider not majorly changing tanks that already have unique playstyles

[winter dagger]

Well they are on the best brownies known to man so I don't think that happening

[lone sandal]

good point, why would they want actual variety in gameplay when they can just turn half of the tanks into hulldown demons

[nimble zodiac]

For future reference, when including that bottom section of the screenshot, the "cal.shel" will be lit up if cali is used
Same thing for the "e.armor"

[lean siren]

Does anyone remember the tanks categorization of WG ? At least 8 categories if I have a good remember

[fickle shoal]

i don't use armor inspectors to much, i noticed it a little after editing the message

[solid sequoia]

#devs-answers message

[granite pebble]

I like how their "classifications" directly conflict with each other

[void siren]

I love dreadnought stormtroopers

[granite pebble]

I love dreadnought and first line heavy tanks (they arent the same at all, what do you mean?)
Oh and long range support sniper TD's (Once again not the same, what are you? Crazy? How could you EVER imply that these two roles are the exact same???!!!???)

[lean siren]

Thank you very very much !!!

[slender latch]

From ribble's post

• Devastator (causes huge damage in a short period of time);
• Dreadnaught (blocks and absorbs damage);
• Stormtrooper (first-line heavy);
• Cavalry (maneuverable tank, effective in flanking);
• Sniper (shoots from long distance and keeps that distance);
• Close assault (heavy with weaker armor but more accurate gun than in a Stormtrooper);
• Close support (well-armored TD, fights in short distance);
• Long support (ambush TD with an accurate gun and no armor);
• Half-heavy (Cavalry/Stormtrooper hybrid, less mobile than Cavalry and has lower firepower than a Stormtrooper);
• Scout (fast tank with low armor protection, provides initial spotting).

Just remembered ribble just left WG just back in 2022, man time passed by so fast.

[twin egret]

most of these classifications just fall short or don't fit well on some tanks

[past vale]

Yeah they don't for obvious reasons, the game would be boring if they actually fitted all tanks perfectly to this descriptions

[twin egret]

so what's the point of creating them lol
back in my day, things would be called glass cannons, heaviums, scouts, etc.

[wicked quest]

They don’t make sense at all either nor does it specify what tiers should these roles apply to

[azure marten]

“Back in my day...” 🤓

[past vale]

Back in the day you only had Soviet, American and German heavies, people only called the IS-8 a heavium kek

[twin egret]

Nah I joined when brits were introduced

[main tulip]

Wait ribble left?

[chilly crane]

Ayo
ribble left a while ago

[terse drum]

Delete annihilator

[fringe quest]

^

[still holly]

How about matchmaking balance discussion ?

[vestal basalt]

The MM will never Balance

[hybrid swallow]

Mad Games needs some balancing.
A Panther 2 being able to ram you and totally destroy your FULL HP while only taking minimal damage is ridiculous

[wicked quest]

You do know it’s got a special ability right

[hybrid swallow]

Yeah an EXTREMELY unfair one.

[nimble zodiac]

Good luck chief.
@hybrid swallow

[gleaming apex]

cade28461846 was muted.

[brittle reef]

among us

[primal sundial]

amx12t should get a track width buff 😂. the tokyo drift is unreal

[queen geyser]

There is a reason its called mad games

[azure marten]

They should give it high-octane fuel instead of invisibility. The T-34-3 has high-octane fuel and rammer rig but it’s actually balanced because you can see it coming.

[fair pebble]

Hey where did the list of balancing changes go?

[subtle egret]

grille with 3.1k dislikes

[chilly crane]

WG: this if fine 🤠🔥

[unique scaffold]

they hide it

[drowsy plaza]

Maybe discuss the idiot modes in the channels related to them. Instead of complaining about it here that is dedicated to the normal battle modes.

[round rock]

Pls buff Chieftan turret chiecks

[drowsy plaza]

It doesn’t need that. Just jockey around. The game doesn’t need any more brain dead turret tanks. Use the gun depression and jockey back and forth. The image is at full depression and CS HEAT on the Sheridan. It’s fine

Added image from Armor Inspector (I keep forgetting the slow mode not being a mod anymore)

[void siren]

You don’t understand - they want to bounce calibrated jagd e100 prammo 😛

[ornate warren]

Fr 💀

[stone drum]

If your not hulldown they cut through your turret like its paper

[elfin wharf]

Prime example of bad teams, they should balance the matchmaker and i posted this here because there arent any channek aimed towards matchmaker balancing which there should imo

[primal sundial]

what does that have to do with tank balance discussion? you are saying your tank should be nerfed, since it shouldn't be able to perform that good with a bad team?

[granite pebble]

I think I see the issue here, you simply focused on farming damage whilst your giga-chad T57 knew where the real winning strat is and that's insuring that the enemies are in fact dead and a potential two/one shot

[lost crane]

Wtf ? 260 dmg for Heat ? I hope it’s a mistake.

[slender latch]

STB getting AP premium, now it can finally ditch standard AP and load gold all the way. This makes Japan tech tree so unique, WG did a good job on this ngl.

[subtle egret]

pay2win premium ammo

[twilit crystal]

Tbh theres still a penalty and even a slight penalty baits good players into shooting standard. Watch HRF ho ri streams, he does usually shoot premium AP when needed but there are a few risky shots he really should have been shooting gold instead of standard

[primal sundial]

time spent aiming is lowering dpm 😄

[twilit crystal]

Still STB premium AP is going to be way more toxic than Ho ri, usually 300 AP pen is enough for most stuff. 245 standard AP is trash though and the 300 gold AP is going to spike it up

[slender latch]

Hori is near OP if you can afford to load full gold only losing -20 alpha while having mobility, camo and grille-like gun even with CS if you like. But still manages to be balanced since not all can afford to full gold ammo.

[leaden flare]

the balancing point of it certainly isnt prammo

[stiff idol]

when will the wz121 get tungsten shells

[winter dagger]

And the t100 Lt had 290 AP pen and running rammer on it doesn't make it lose that much in terms of prem pen compared to other meds/lights. The stb with 300 AP is effectively 320-330 pen, with 3.5k DPM. And 11 deg gun depression with a rock turret. Ratings about to see an evolution

[lime marten]

Hello

[fickle tinsel]

Can I just say that the t22 desperately needs a buff? It's pitiful at its current stage. Sluggish, god awful traverse speed, and bullied by every tank with gun dep not to mention it has pretty mediocre gun handling. It can't even brawl other mediums anymore when the traverse is so bad LOL. Them nerfing the t22 further is crazy

[winter dagger]

10.3 bruh, next update

[solid sequoia]

The T-22 is going to be a better med bully in 10.3 lol

[fickle tinsel]

I didn't see any significant buff to its mobility but it looks like theyre killing the dpm further

[solid sequoia]

The buffs to the armor are pretty significant

Also the mobility buffs are by far more significant than losing <100 dpm lmao

[fickle tinsel]

i didn't realize armor was getting buffed. no changes are in blitzhangar at least

edit: no i know ab that somehow i scrolled past it both times lOL

[solid sequoia]

Did you not realize scrolling down was a thing???

[stuck acorn]

it's literally a 10mm ufp buff. It won't change anything. T22 change is a blant nerf

[fickle tinsel]

it won't be good unless it can actually traverse at a reasonable speed. other meds will get to the side of it so easily as it is rn

[solid sequoia]

It will essentially be impervious to any med standard rounds without cali

[winter dagger]

Lol

[stuck acorn]

except it won't. It would need to stand perfectly frontally in order to be this way and have a high ground since T22 is flat so most tanks get a good angle on it.

So not only you would need to somehow point your hull exactly to something as fast as a med, but wouldn't be able to traverse at your will in order to keep this "armor" which will turn grey anyway as soon as your enemy switches to gold.

What a great addition!

[fickle tinsel]

the armor was already troll its baiting shots into the hull that made it good at brawling which wont happen with the terrible traverse speed

enemy can just get to your side with the traverse bro

[solid sequoia]

If the enemy switches to gold they will then lose dpm, which allows you to just bully them further. It’s honestly a pretty nice buff to the tank as long as you can play it properly

[stuck acorn]

@solid sequoia It's not a nice buff at all, since as i said, they need to switch to gold only in very specific scenario which will happen like never lol. And if that scenario somehow happened, they would need to switch to gold even without this worthless "buff".

that's how T22's post buff armor looks when placed perfectly and on the flat ground.

And that's not including normalization which every single medium tank standard shell has. Don't be delusional, it will get buttered by anything just as it used to.

T22 only ever bounced anything because of wiggling and baiting shots to angled parts, not because armor thickness itself, which was made much less effective by traverse nerfs. Without getting back the traverse T22's armor won't work

[solid sequoia]

Here’s the middle of the upper plate on flat ground. And blitz hangar accounts for normalization lol, so yes, it will be rather good med standard rounds.

[mystic gorge]

More like a pure rebalance. Removing dpm and buffing ufp is a fair trade. I mean the tank is still going to remain the best med for hulldown gameplay. Also for brawling 🤷🏻‍♂️

[stuck acorn]

No, blitz hangar does not account for normalisation, it shows a raw effective armor lmao, where did you get that absolute absurd from? Since every single shell type has different normalisation ranging from 0 to 5 degrees it's impossible to account for it.

Also what you've shown is what something like E25 would see. Hull is lower than the turret and T22 is flat, therefore every single tank will aim at your hull from at least slightly from above. And since T22's armor is completly angle reliant it completly cripples any leftovers from what you call armor "imprevious to standard shells"

@mystic gorge I'm not complaining about T22 getting nerfed since it will still be strong, i'm just replying to this guy's obviously false claim, but no, DPM for worthless armor change is not a fair trade. It's trading something for nothing

@primal sundial They could add additional numbers for different shells, i know, but accounting for it in current format of showing only raw and effective value wouldn't make sense, that's what i meant

[primal sundial]

not to take one side or the other, it would be simple to show normalisation in it. It is just another number they have to plug into the app

[nimble zodiac]

Just do the easy math, lol
110/cos(66 - 5[for AP])
Degrees, not radians, for those who actually will

The POV is pretty clearly above T-22's gun level

[solid sequoia]

“Also what you’ve shows is what something like an E25 would see” I showed it at the same angle as you though.

[mystic gorge]

The armor buff was to bring the T22’s armor back to what it was pre med buff where they all received AP for standard. AP has a higher normalization degree which handles angled surfaces better. Which was an indirect nerf to the T22’s armor profile (especially on the pike nose). So I’d say it’s a buff but to each their own

[nimble zodiac]

I personally think the armor buff is yet another band-aid to cover 3CRB making the side armor less relevant 🤔

Wish they'd fix it. I'd love to contact WG about it

[stuck acorn]

Well, then you clearly didn't aim anywhere near middle of ufp. On this screen i aimed at the furthest possible corner of ufp and it shows roughly the same value as your screen and very suspiciously shows exact same angle value. I don't want to accuse you of anything, but it looks very suspiciuos if your angle value is 3 degrees higher considering the fact that we both positioned the tank the same way and theoretically aimed at the exact middle.

Also again, even if it was 260 effective, with even 2 degrees of APCR normalisation it would drop all the way down to like 245 and with 5 degrees of AP even T9 med would pen that

3CRB is just bs

@solid sequoia 🤦‍♂️ how does that seem as a middle of UFP to you? Middle of ufp is well... in the middle

[solid sequoia]

I put a dot where I aimed.

[nimble zodiac]

66° is important against APCR, that makes about 250mm effective armor. Run EA on that and you have yourself a nice upper plate that can resist 230mm AP. Definitely can bully medium tanks that don't have their prammo to switch to, not to mention the still-hilarious side armor profile to bait with.

[winter dagger]

Armor on t22 is not bad now, but leo with 4k DPM laughs at armor

[stone drum]

Its getting an almost irrelevant armour buff... lol...

Outright nerf.

@past vale you know people who dont use it on flat ground?

@solid sequoia mate, by your logic the IS-5 has an excellent upperplate that is immune to most tier 8 heavies standard rounds and we all know how that works out In reality.

[solid sequoia]

Look at the rest of the conversation lol, it’s not an outright nerf

[past vale]

WHO uses their T-22 Medium in flat ground? It will be better if using gun depression, that's the playstyle of most meds

[nimble zodiac]

T-22 was popular specifically because it could play with its armor on flat ground. The autoricochet sides (RIP) were one of its main features. The chaotic way it was played was rather unique

Type 71 has a form of similarity that way. Bait that side armor plate to ricochet shells with the lower plate

[lost crane]

After 10.3, if you want an armored russian tank, you can play the T62a

[twilit crystal]

t22 was op mostly coz it was so rare, the moment WG sold it that Christmas for gold everyone figured out how to deal with the armor

[fickle tinsel]

all the other meds getting gun depression buffs killed it as well and the massive traverse nerf was the nail in the coffin

@past vale clearly you don't own the tank despite having an opinion on it if you're saying that its playstyle revolves around "using the gun depression" lol

[fair pebble]

Why?

[stone drum]

Literally no medium with the sole exception of Stb-1 has gotten a gun depression buff in tier X in recent history.

[queen geyser]

Actually nerfs no? Patton got gundepression nerf and leo1 will get one aswell no?

[fickle tinsel]

The t62 did

[nimble zodiac]

Ages ago

Back in update 8.3, WZ-120 got 5° gun depression instead of 3°

[stone drum]

recent history

I got married and had kid in that period of time.

[nimble zodiac]

Update 6.10, where the heavies got all the beef they could ever ask for 🥶

[nimble zodiac]

Ah, update 6.6, when T-62A received 7° gun depression instead of 5°
Finally found it
Like I said, ages ago.
Near the beginning of 2020 💀

[fickle tinsel]

I don't get your point? I never specified a timeline except that it was after the t22s release which all those updates are

[nimble zodiac]

My point is that T-62's gun depression buff was certainly NOT in recent history, as FochGuy claims. You said the T-62A did get a recent GD buff.

That buff happened half a Blitz ago

[fickle tinsel]

Recent history is a moot point seeing as the point he is responding to is me saying it's fallen off since it's release and citing reasons as to why it's no longer as good as it was SINCE RELEASE

[solid sequoia]

The T-22 is mainly no longer good due to meds getting buffed around it, and then the med AP shell change

[nimble zodiac]

You tried to refute his statement, under his rules. I don't care about T-22's decline. You replied to his statement implying that T-62A's GD buff was recent at all. That's all I'm talking about
"The t62 did" is all I'm talking about from you

I have no comment on your points on T-22. T-22 can just rot away. I don’t care about that

[fickle tinsel]

Ok good job then you and him made a meaningless point. Does this mean you agree with mine? Lol

hahahahaha salty!!

[stone drum]

Lol fast IS-3 go brrrt.

[queen geyser]

Bro u literally said "ALL the other Mediums got gundepression buff" yet we have 2 which got one over like 3 years and even one medium where it got nerfed

[fickle tinsel]

I meant all the meds which got gun depression buffs, because they are a valid component to the t22s powercreep. t62 diffs the t22 now between the gun dep buff and other buffs whereas earlier it was much closer

[queen geyser]

Idk T62A has cupola while T22 dosnt, T62A turret gets (atm) rly essy penned which T22 dosnt, T62A has paper hull which T22 Well dosnt, I always laugh wenn I Reverse sidescrape and a grille only track crits me 3 times in a row

I feel like its fair that T62a got that gundepression because the armor is much worse

[fickle tinsel]

yeah t62 deserved it for sure. When the t62 had the 5 degrees or whatever it got fully bullied by the t22. Then doing the traverse nerf to the t22 was just overkill though

[drowsy plaza]

The T-62A depression buff was another example of WG not thinking things through. It totally demolished the point of the 140. 5 degrees of depression was fine for it given the other strengths it had compared to other meds. They buffed it in a vacuum, instead of thinking what would occur to most other meds. Yes it needed it in consideration of HT’s, but it threw the Med balance away. It then got gun nerf’s probably because they realized the aftermath several updates later. It would have been much better to simply nerf a lot of the HT’s and leave the 62 sitting as a decent Med with limited depression

[twin egret]

Weird that the Minotauro weighs 57 tons, like shouldn't it weigh more?
wow, even a tier 7 weighs more than it

[stone drum]

AMX m4 mle. 54:

[twin egret]

piñata tank
probably a lot of empty space inside

[fickle tinsel]

it was really funny though because obj 140 resolutionists stubbornly insisted the 140 was still better despite being ap pennable through the turret. you could say they died on more than a few hills for their agenda

[stone drum]

Raw steel calculations put it out at 82-85 tonnes.

[deep cosmos]

where can i get the armor model for wot blitz?

[ember idol]

Blitzhangar and armour inspector

[fair pebble]

I just noticed they are nerfing the 907’s armor, whyyyyy it was perfectly fine! The 10 hp damage buff is not worth this at all

[hollow thistle]

Isn't Minotauro OP?
Great armor and good gun

[keen dew]

it sucks

[unique scaffold]

Lol not even close

[twin egret]

It's getting worse next update imo

[ember idol]

Not much if it has the mobility of a slug on charcoal

[clear shuttle]

its worth all the other unnecessary stuff its getting tho

[fathom glacier]

Only when your enemy are not great then it’s good tank. If your enemy are very good then it sucks

[hollow thistle]

So I haven't played the game for quite some time, and when i played it recently, i also noticed that Hts and Tds got faster, that Mts doesn't have much of advantage over them.
What do you think?

[slender latch]

E100 still has MT hull traverse speed, I'm surprised they haven't touched it. Also E6 will get better DPM and terrain buff.

[thorny timber]

its not good when you play with players who know what they're doing,even if it has a half traverse turret it's still vulnerable to get circled and the reserve shell just sucks

[compact nymph]

‘’Good gun’’
How amusing

[real bison]

why would you need armour again?

[quartz snow]

I dont feel like a lot of people seem to remember much about the 9.0 update. That update MASSIVELY buffed heavy traverse speeds. Before, heavies were already dominating the meta, but now it's 2x worse. Effectively reducing MTs effectiveness

[slender latch]

They didn't because most players just focus on the firepower and armor aspect of a heavy and probably thought the traverse buff wouldn't matter much

[whole flame]

fr when i use my t95e6 im faster or as fast as the mediums on my team lol

[quartz snow]

Im fine with heaviums, but they should not have as much dpm as mediums too.
I'd cap it at 3k dpm maximum

My main concern was actual heavies (IS-4, IS-7, E-100, etc) that got massive terrain and traverse speed buffs. Circling these vehicles became impossible

[humble depot]

The armour is exceptionally unreliable, and the gun is mediocre at best.

[clear shuttle]

and now the vk 72

[drowsy plaza]

I suspect in 9.0 that WG changed yet again from their balancing criteria. Originally it was days from 55-65% players, then it was class balancing. In 9.0 it seems they took balancing from a 50-55% player perspective, and now from a 40-45% perspective.

[stone drum]

I don't think thats the case, because if it was balancing by 40-45% perspective then heavies would be getting tremendous nerfs & mediums would be getting mega-buffs.

[gritty meteor]

Sorry but I hate that Hot Dog Sausage event to the core. Who was able to score avatar?

[unique scaffold]

Buff 60tp

[livid bane]

Wargaming seems to love ERA

[drowsy plaza]

Yes clearly a balance issue

[slender latch]

VK72 getting improved suspension would like give it traverse of a Type 71 with a TD gun 🙉

[void siren]

It looks like that was the 9.1 update

[native folio]

T-34-85 Rudy is perfectly balanced

[drowsy plaza]

@stone drum Not really as they just ignore meds since 3.8 😉

[fair pebble]

A medium is supposed to have armor

[whole flame]

buff grille tbh

[livid bane]

What is it then

[stone drum]

its really sad, they could give mediums composite armour & smoothbore guns, but they would somehow still be inferior to heavies in blitz.

[dim sapphire]

kv-2 should be buffed 😉

[ruby parcel]

^

[mystic gorge]

I would disagree considering the dpm buffs meds r getting next update level the playing field A LOT. This is on the open test server and the HP gap here is very noticeable. This gap in dpm/HP is very reminiscent to old blitz where heavies had 2k HP at most and meds could just simply out dpm them

[stone drum]

That is one of the absolute highest mediums in the game in a 1v1 situation though.

In reality i seriously doubt you will be able to fully utilise the dpm.

[fickle tinsel]

heavy should lose a straight trading exchange because it has armor while the 140 doesn't lol. most players will bounce a few realistically or the e5 will actually be using the tank properly (hull down)

[nimble zodiac]

Also that E5 was… not great. You hit every shot but one while the E5 was either lagging or didn’t know the concept of traversing both the hull and turret

I guess 140 can win in an isolated situation, but E5 would have done better, even if that grants trust in an average E5 player

[fickle tinsel]

e5 still would've won in an isolated situation if he didn't manage to bounce his first shot on a paper tank and then shoot the air before dying because he doesn't know how to traverse his tank and sat still like one of the tutorial bots

edit: yeah im agreeing w that, that it should be more balanced. i miss meds being able to brawl

[mystic gorge]

thats yaro, my teammate from JKR and a top 1 player lol. if he isn't good then I don't even wanna know what the rest of the playerbase is considered lol

@fickle tinsel yes ofc. However, for a long time we have been in a state of the game where even in a sheer dpm trade contest, heavies would still win due to the HP gap that they have over meds. meds gaining more dpm helps aid them when they have to brawl heavies. which imo is a major buff considering the state of meds rn where u have to tiptoe around every heavy due to the HP difference

[nimble zodiac]

I'm going to assume he just gave up those last seconds then. Or lagged really badly
That first shot was the key. I'd say it was even

[wicked quest]

He did give up last seconds any skilled person knows rotating your hull with the turret makes you track better he accepted his fate then

Imo seeing this brings a smile to my face it’s incredibly annoying taking on a heavy and still losing majority of HP because their a meat shield

[twin egret]

How's the STB then?

[drowsy plaza]

@mystic gorge if the E5 hadn’t pushed into the open and initiated hulldown you would have been a lot worse off. Frankly the whole 7% Rammer from 3.8 I blame the 10% rammer would be a lot better as it creates a larger gap between CS and Rammer and thus rewards players who can aim, and situate better. Both of you are top 1% players and not great examples for balance though ;). Some thing that works well for you isn’t going to work for the majority of others - including those of us who barely hang on to the top 10%.

[twilit crystal]

also at the end the e5 wasnt even turning his hull

[twin egret]

so was it a skill issue or what

[fickle tinsel]

eh i still run calibrated on any heat tank like the e5

[mystic gorge]

cuz he knew it was pointless, dpm gap was too great at that point

[twilit crystal]

its both the rammer and the optics heavies now all use

[mortal falcon]

ok so when a medium is forced to run CS by wargaming making redder and redder tanks, heavies can close the DPM gap even more?

10% rammer is not it and your balancing idea is for a very different game, one of 8 years ago

[winter dagger]

Well you always have outliers like the obj 140 and leo 1 in terms of DPM but meds should not be staring at heavies in the front realistically

[drowsy plaza]

Seriously that’s pointless. What do you think you gain? If you can’t use 340mm HEAT is 374mm really helping? That’s just kind of mind blowing. Some tanks I’d use CS on due to lackluster standard pen and not wanting to take the DPM loss from Prammo but the E5 really doesn’t need CS for pubbies.

[fickle tinsel]

I notice a large difference personally. I think the odds of me getting one less bounce is more common than me getting one more shot due to a slightly faster reload. Many tanks have turrets especially that I notice are fully red at the lower 300s and fully pennable at higher 300s of pen. The e100 is one prime example of that

[queen geyser]

I found out that on every tank there is a least one person who plays cali and think its good and important

@fickle tinsel very nice prime example on why u should use rammer, E100 is paper against higher 300s of pen so it dosnt make a diffrence if u shoot 340 pen or 374 pen at it because its both above 300, but shooting 340pen gives u 10% DPM increase

[drowsy plaza]

Try aiming? The E100 as max depression and Enhanced Armor is an example - but 9/10 times you can get to a position first to but hulldown on them and either lace their lower plate with standard - or use non CS HEAT on their turret

[zenith steppe]

I just realized the 140 next update is going to have a sub 4 seconds reload with adrenaline. That’s mental

[stuck acorn]

Don't worry, it won't make it any less of worse leopard though

Leo 1 has higher top speed, more gun depression, more alpha and DPM, better gun handling/accuaracy in general and after even further 140 armor nerfs, neither will bounce anything

[unique scaffold]

If you're using CS on E5 you need serious help

[fickle tinsel]

@queen geyser @drowsy plaza E100 with angled turret straight on is 350mm for front and side. Maus upper plate is 345mm. e50m upper plate 350mm. amx mle upper plate 345 mm. Is7 upper plate 350mm straight on. Obj 263 superstructure 360mm. First couple tanks I looked at. It makes a massive difference lol. Idk why you'd think WG would put no consideration into what the armor values comes out to.

[zenith steppe]

I think it’ll be better than the Leo in some regards, for rushing heavies it’ll definitely be better as more Armour prevents being HE’d and lower profile means dealing with tanks is easier. And I don’t even want to imagine running double 140 in a toon. The perma-tracking ability it will get will be absolutely insane

[queen geyser]

kekw angled turret, yes ofc but just dont shoot the angled turret then, the E100 cant shoot at you that way anyways, btw even if you perfectly angle it as a E100 there are still 2 weakspots on the turret that gets u penned by 310+ pen guns, the turret Ring and the small angle between turret front and side

yes I completly understand why you are using cali and it makes perfect sense for your playstyle @fickle tinsel

[fickle tinsel]

wym? I always angle my turret when im expecting a shot that I can't pull back from. Thats superheavy 101 for any tank with large flat planes. 60 tp upper plate, just barely over 340. Type 71 ~350 ufp using any amount of gun dep. 268/4 cheeks fluctuate 330-350 wiggling. Have i made my point clear yet?

[slender latch]

Would it be good if they gave maus like 4k HP but nerf its armor since it never really relied on the armor

[real bison]

please tell me youre joking

anyways, the thing that im gonna like least is the fact that the 50M is basically becoming highly resistant to 340 HEAT with enhanced armour and full gundep

i love brainless hulldown! i love brainless hulldown!

[fickle tinsel]

my point is if I don't shoot that's -350 potential damage whereabouts which in itself is more additional damage than what I'd likely get in the same battle with rammer because in most cases with heavies the rammer isn't being used to its full potential anyway since you're just peekabooming when the opportunity arises. That top bar is notoriously rng based in heavies and playing hulldown optimally I'm showing the minimum amount of my tank which means aiming for the turret face at the very top

thats such a terrible counterpoint. Im saying most players are wasting that half second saved anyway lining up for their next poke. Nobody stresses about being maximally efficient with their shots so the quarter second or whatever realistically isn't going to make any practical difference in most cases. It's far more rare that you're spamming the fire button needing to get the shot out as fast as possible than you are benefiting from the 30 more heat and able to take a shot you couldn't otherwise

[queen geyser]

so you would say if E5 would have 60s reload you would still play it with the same potential because you are just peekabooming when the opportunity arises

okay sorry for the "terrible counterpoint", yours is much better: most players are wasting that half second saved anyway lining up for their next poke
Good that you count yourself to most players, and I can agree most people should just play cali on every tank + HP

[mystic gorge]

Well no the 140 would have better overall handling. Leo has better stationary accuracy but the 140 will be the best gun for all gameplay. It’s going to have .277 dispersion with .08 on move. Making it easily the most accurate gun in the game for 9/10 situations

Also 140 is getting another major engine buff, making it accelerate faster than any tank in the game. Definitely not slower than the Leo 1

[real bison]

ngl i feel like the 140 gets permastared less than the leo 1

real problem in modern blitz tbh, plus the natural handling and mobility advantage helps

[queen geyser]

I have one problem with 140, it has no gun depression, its very cool that im super mobile and have a nice gun but the 0 gundepression helds me back from playing multiple positions, meanwhile Leo1 is sitting on a decent workable one

leo1 has also higher alpha, means it needs to peak less and it has reticle means in the situation where u rly need it (a shoot that needs to be aimed in rly quick or peekabo fights at ridgeslines) its gonna be godlike and even better then 140

im still hyped about 140, but in my opinion Leo1 will still be better, by alot

[fickle tinsel]

im wanting to grind that chinese light but im wondering if the obj 140 will be better? i haven't really compared the stats

[queen geyser]

chinese light will lose all its dpm with made it interesting (together with its mechanic) but to be fair the new reload and alpha with synergise with the ability more

if you dont rly care but the ability from the WZ light, 140 will be 100% better

WZ light will sit around 3100 DPM next update, 140 at 3800

[mystic gorge]

well as of rn, the 140 plays better as a light than the 132-1. People may disagree with me but 140 still has a far better view range, better handling, same dpm, better armor.

That being said, the two tanks won't really be alike next update so its up to you to decide on what you want

[slender latch]

Nope but imagine if it had 4k HP with like grille armor

[real bison]

so essentially the worst HP piñata ever

like it can barely fight back

a Leo 1 would eat it for a small snack and carry on with its day

[mystic gorge]

while i agree that Leo 1 will be a better overall farmer, I prefer the 140's profile more due to it being mostly HE proof and its just smaller. Allows the tank to be far more aggressive (Something that I like in my tanks). And personally, the minute you hit 3700+ dpm, it doesn't matter the difference in dpm between two tanks above 3700 dpm. its more than enough to rip through a tank in less than a minute. Another ability the 140 will have over a tank like the leo is perma tracking. I'm aware permatracking is relatively rare in blitz due to every player running two repairs but the fact that the 140 will be able to perma track without adrenaline active against any tank is a pretty interesting capability.

[slender latch]

Then bump up the HP to 5k it would make it the best bullet sponge like really all it has is HP

[queen geyser]

Well no gundepression often stops me from being aggressive since many positions that I Like to play rely on it

[real bison]

that wouldn’t help it either

it’s large, so you can’t easily hide it
you’ve made it have no armour, so it’ll always be penned
it already lacks tank vs tank capability, and you’re taking away the one thing that keeps it where it is

[slender latch]

Tho i just suggested it to have that it could be relevant since E100 also does its job but with better armor. But you gotta admit its only great for gravity mode for ramming.

[cunning socket]

Laughs in T62a and stb

[real bison]

except those two have cupolas, and both don’t really bounce 300mm pen HEAT off of their cheeks

@mystic gorge at least you can hit the M48’s cupola

[mystic gorge]

M48 as well. Turret cheeks are becoming resistant to anything that’s ~340mm of pen or less

[solid sequoia]

Carro isn’t becoming 340 heat resistant afaik, but it’s still getting a cheek buff which is interesting

[nimble zodiac]

Carro’s turret will be able to deal with about 330mm HEAT, which EA can bring up

Full gun depression, though

[solid sequoia]

Oh, well then 😂

[twin egret]

more gun depression by 2

[stray yew]

Buff the LTTB

[solid sequoia]

It doesn’t need a buff lol

[ancient rampart]

It doesn’t need one

[twin egret]

We might as well create a poll, asking players from a scale of 1 to 10 for each tank on their opinion if the tank in question needs a buff or nerf, with 1 being a hard agreement of the tank needing a nerf, 10 being a hard agreement of the tank needing a buff, and 5 being a argeement of the tank needing neither a nerf or a buff

[stone drum]

Too vote in poll you need to take an IQ test and score a 110+ and have atleast a 55% wr with 15k battles

[exotic girder]

TL-7-120 needs a buff either more depression or make the hatch smaller, rn its just a worse M103

[thorny timber]

That'd be a really bad idea if you include all players,most of them don't even know that intraclip and interclip is different how will you expect them to carry off a vote

[analog tide]

Who more thinks that amx 50b and is 4 are ruined after the uptdate

[wooden lynx]

Anyone that can actually play the 50b will think that it's just a overall buff to the 50b.

[solid sequoia]

It’s a buff for the 50b and IS-4

[twilit crystal]

no lol, the 50b absolutely depends on the armor to randomly supplement the hp pool, there are plenty of games where i bounce 2-3k in the 50b , getting a moderate gun handling buff ,minor dpm and hull traverse buff isn't enough. IMO give it 200 more hp to compensate for 0 armor

[granite pebble]

Not only that, but people fail to realize that the nose of the 50b's hull being as strong as it currently is the reason why it's able to ram like it can, without that armor...well, good luck

[ancient rampart]

AMX 50b is actually better
It didn’t have much armor to begin with losing a bit ain’t going to hurt it when it’s gaining so much more

[twin egret]

Don't cry because it's over, be happy because it happened

[clear shuttle]

its gonna be 4005 v2

[fierce sentinel]

man i have NEVER seen so many people dislike some tank changes on the US lines

[violet island]

If you need cali for those tanks the problem isn’t behind the screen but rather in front of the screen. Sorry to tell you about this

[winged barn]

Guy points out many real cases of cali heat making a massive difference

Ah yes, he has a skill issue for not HE penning 100% of his shots with 100% of his reload utilized.

[uneven turtle]

Just make obj 140 a light and give it its long deserved on movement concealment. It feels like a light at this point. Also prototyp is just a heavy t10 mt. Change my mind

[violet island]

all of his arguments are trash for cali, Angled E100 turret you go through the bar at the top, Maus you autopen the turret front with 340 heat or if you want to argue for cali you go through the cheeks with AP, I won't even talk about the E50M argument. AMX has massive cuppola, IS-7 is a tank where you almost never see the upper plate and not the lower plate or a head on upperplate and 263 is trash overall so it doesn't really matter, also you can lolpen it next to the gun if you are even slightly to its side

[leaden flare]

The bar on top of e100 is stupidly hard to hit
It's not like you can just stand there and aim for 5min and even then it's small and rng says no quite often

[clear shuttle]

who even shoots or goes for the bar on the top of the E-100 💀

[ember idol]

Anything taller than the E100's hull

[slender latch]

It's not even a reliable pen just like the E3's hatch tho a 183 could pen it with HESH if lucky.

[gloomy anchor]

263 isn't trash

[stable gulch]

I mean it really isnt that difficult to aim for it

[leaden flare]

It is

@stable gulch it is when the e100 is even slightly smart and not 10m in front of you or when your tank is rather flat and so on

[cunning socket]

Not everyone uses aimbots like you🤡

[violet island]

I like the aimbot that some people call hands

[winged barn]

Is7 has a trash turret. There are a few grey pixels to snipe.
10/10 argument.
You do realizw guns have inaccuracy, correct? Having a large penetrable area makes up for bad rng.

If its a tank for brute forcing things frontally with 340 heat, imma be taking cali.

[clear shuttle]

is-7s turret is strong until you meet someone who knows the real armour profile of it
even then in some scenarios it can hold up

[queen geyser]

So u play E5 with cali aswell?

[fickle tinsel]

🤦‍♂️

Bro really debunked his own aegument in the first line

[violet island]

how did I debunk my argument first line

[fickle tinsel]

You really started off by saying just aim for the top bar in a heavy which is massively rng dependant and upon missing loses you more damage than you would've gained by running rammer LOL. Your entire argument neglects the existence of rng as if you can aim for the weak spots perfectly every time.

[orchid grove]

Why are you handicapping yourself by giving your tank tier 8 levels of DPM so that you can attempt to fight enemy tanks in strong positions?

🧠

[violet island]

I would count this argument as valid for something like Kran cuppola or pc chief cuppola, none of the weakspot I mentioned are even remotely close to that size and can all be consistently hit on heavy fighting distance. My statement with the problem infront of the screen still stands I guess

[queen geyser]

because he dosnt stresses about being maximally efficient with their shots so the quarter second or whatever realistically isn't going to make any practical difference in most cases

[leaden flare]

Nope can't hit the top bar of e100 consistently at all 😂
That e100 can stand still and I'm fully aimed at the bar in a Leo and I'd still miss it when not going reticle cali 😂

I'd rather aim at the bar in the lower turret than that unreliable bar at the top

[fickle tinsel]

e100 bar isn't a consistent pen at all in heavies and you ignored the other 10 tanks i pointed out as you were unable to formulate any sort of counter argument LOL. Bro really said "I won't even talk about the e50" and "the 263 is trash anyway" and didn't even begin to address tanks like the 60tp and type 71 that i also mentioned. Next time guy queues a 263 I guess he's just planning to sit and let himself get farmed because he can't pen the "trash tank" ? 😂😂

[violet island]

can you tell me which one I missed from your message @fickle tinsel
E 50M has turret front and massive lowerplate
60TP has drivers hatch and cuppola+even slight sidescrape and the turret ring is a safe pen
Type 71 is a design issue, only thing where cali is mildly tolerable
263 is even a single bit to the side already free pen, if you get farmed by a 263 the problem is infront of the screen

[fickle tinsel]

That's crazy bro is continuing to cite extremely small weakspots as though rng doesn't exist in the game and every fight is a face hug where the enemy isn't moving at all

[violet island]

As your main argument is rng, you do know that you can still lowroll pen, right?
Unless you are playing your heavies from the redline I honestly don’t understand how your aim can be so bad that you can’t pen any of the weakspots I am mentioning, even @stable gulch and me can hit those and our aim is already pretty bad

[fickle tinsel]

Yeah bro you're pixel shotting weakspots that are notoriously difficult and RNG based when not facehugging with perfect accuracy every time. I'm sure you take less than .7 additional seconds to aim as well, which is how much time you save with rammer to have a higher chance of bouncing. Also when 263s see you they just turn 180 degrees and give you a free HE pen to the rear so you don't even have to worry about heat penning them

Also I found what I believe is your account on blitzstars and while I'm not gonna stat shame you I can definitely say the skill issue isn't mine 😬😬😬

[violet island]

It amazes me how people can make their own skill issue into an argument

[next zodiac]

The e100 bar isnt part of the main armor.You can Only pen the armor under the bar (thats the actual weakspot)

[fickle tinsel]

If I found his account correctly this guy doesn't play t10 at all. Which makes sense as he said he would also just perfectly pen the orange sliver (999 mm) at a distance next to the gun mantlet of a 263 if its lower plate was covered

edit: actually i think he means the purple mantlet which he doesn't realise is 350 mm straight on LOLOL

[next zodiac]

Who do you mean?

[primal sundial]

I believe he meant this orange bit around it, since he said shooting into it as soon as you get towards the side. The times you could be far enough around to pen it and not have shot at the sides are pretty limited, so it doesn't really help his case, just saying what my understanding of it was. The thin bar at the base of the superstructure is also a fairly easy pen if you can take time to aim

[fickle tinsel]

I don't know why he assumes any competent 263 driver would give him a free pen to the side. The thin bar at the base of the superstructure doesn't take heat to pen anyway which makes it kind of irrelevant but for the sake of why you wouldn't pen ap there all the time, obviously it's not going to happen reliably due to dispersion unless they go for a facehug

also the taking the time to aim just goes back to my earlier point that if you take more than an additional .7 seconds to aim because you're not running cali, youre negating the advantage of rammer while still taking more of a risk with less pen

[nimble zodiac]

The bar is main armor, not spaced armor. You can shoot it to deal damage

Avoid shooting the parts that hang over though, it’s spaced
Quite sure 😇

[next zodiac]

Are you sure?

[orchid grove]

It’s main armor. I go for that shot sometimes if I’m sort of above the E-100

[winged barn]

If im feeling like participating in a heavy slugfest, less time spent aiming (wider penetrable area) means less time I am being aimed at. This means less shots that im hoing to eat. As long as the enemies die its a non issue.

Also, being able to counter good players in good positions is always useful for winning, even if it leads to less damage farmed.

[winter dagger]

So let's just forget rng is a thing

[glad cove]

Day 4: Buff sta 1

[stone drum]

Strv K should have the dpm nerf from 10.3 reverted and instead have sandbags removed.

[wooden lynx]

You're mentioning weakspots that 98% of the times you won't pen because of the size of it. You're saying things about reliably hitting tiny weakspots as if you have perfect accuracy and no existing dispersion.

@fickle tinsel I dm'd you, can you check it pls

[fickle tinsel]

I was baffled by his logic until I realized he has 22 career battles at tier 10 despite acting like he's an expert LOL

[humble depot]

Remove SSB.

[nocturne cypress]

So i opened my game and played and played and played till i had the wt auf pz 4 and it was good and balanced, then i got the grille 15 and it was the same tank exactly with a different shape, it sucks and its not worth getting because fv215b whatever that british one is is better in every way

[stone drum]

It's already getting removed so I didn't mention it, albeit I enjoyed the Mobility.

It would have been nice to see the top speeds changed to 51/17 after they removed it tho.

@twilit crystal its mostly used for the reverse speed buff though.

[twilit crystal]

Super speed needs to be reworked. Should be a percentage buff to top speed and only for forward. It should also half your reverse speed.

[violet island]

I honestly don't want to believe you are this bad at aiming
@fickle tinsel your entire argument is that you have a skill issue, I got to 5k rating in t10 last season, bot mm doesn't matter either way dunno why you smallbrain are so focused on that. Also, have you ever tried flanking the enemy, hard concept for someone like you but it should help with your obsession with cali into something that is better (rammer). yes yes, mobility and turret is hard for you to use I realised.
@winter dagger bad players get better through RNG and good players suffer more than they profit from it, I have an idea on what side of that you are.
@primal sundial Try flanking turretless tds aswell, nullifie all their frontal armor and the need for cali

[nimble zodiac]

I run rammer because I don’t try to engage armored tanks when they’re at their strongest. I wait for THEM to make the mistakes of engaging ME when I’m advantaged to

[wooden lynx]

"being this bad at aiming" proceeds to point out really small weakspots

You're saying that as if your heavy has Leopard 1 dispersion. Not ALL the time your shots will land directly where you aimed. I run rammer to my meds, I can work around with the mobility. But with heavies Cali is always the better choice since you won't be as mobile.

You're acting like some kind of expert here bud when you have 22 career games in Tier 10 as if you have experience yourself. Never in my sub 500 games in my E100 I have been penned on the top bar of my turret. Any smart player would just load premium to reliabily pen an E100, because players much rather take a bit of damage rather than taking a risk of shooting a tiny weakspot.

[fickle tinsel]

@wooden lynx I'm guessing he's some kind of troll

@nimble zodiac we're talking about running cali heat on heavies. meds are a different deal obviously

[violet island]

you are arguing for E5 with cali and call me the troll?

[wooden lynx]

Because Cali has always been the better option for heavies, unfortunately not everyone is intelligent enough to understand.

And yes you are a troll, you debunked your own arguement when you started pointing out tiny weakspots that you miss 98% of the time. You can ask any E100 player when they ever got penned on the tiny bar on the roof of the turret. You will receive an answer of never.

[violet island]

@fickle tinsel you wanna tell me your ign, as you are obviously trying to say that I have no experience cause I only played 22 games on t10 then you surely have nothing against me checking out your stats to see where your claims are coming from.
@wooden lynx same goes for you, if it is ToonTownKat26 on ASIA than I am very sorry for you but I guess when you are this kind of player and can't use the reload boost you get from rammer and need to get every single bit of pen to pen anything I guess cali is better for you. the player that I was talking to, that is playing heavies as well and is a lot better than both of us is pretty certain that rammer is the better choice
so you are scared that you are bad at the game, seems like that's also a nice way to show that your ego is just as fragile as your game knowledge

[nimble zodiac]

I primarily play heavies, so uh…?
I wasn’t talking about meds

[wooden lynx]

Well I am sorry for you too because I only perform better compared to you in Tier 10, just because you had a glimpse of the armour profile does not mean it actually easy to hit💀

Bud you have 22 career games in Tier 10, 1,002 total career games. Mostly because of fighting bots due to newbie MM.

[fickle tinsel]

@violet island Sure. My t10 stats took about a ~300 dip from the event but I still don't mind sharing
https://www.blitzstars.com/player/com/IronBehemoth

Also you can probably tell from my blitzstars that I've recently returned to the game. Here are my old stats aswell (only the ss I could find from a glance - didn't attach it put me on 5 min cooldown again LOL)

[queen geyser]

so u play your E5 with cali ?

[solid sequoia]

Tbh if you can’t pen a spot with 340 heat, you’re aiming at the wrong spot

[violet island]

just as a slight help, most of those where in a platoon with someone who is infact not in bot mm so I'd say the averages are pretty fine for someone who has to play against actual players at t10 at 1k games, maybe you should grow some balls and show your stats
Can you just send your name, I can also just send screens of random things like my 3.1k T77 dpg which is better than any of your t10 dpgs

[orchid grove]

??? Cali is almost always a total waste on heavies in pubs.

Loading HEAT to chip away at heavies in strong positions with trash DPM is a total waste of time, and handicaps your ability to influence the game.

And the reality is that there’s just not that many situations where cali makes a difference. The vast majority of targets it makes no difference on. Paper tanks, sides and rears, easy weakspots like lower plates, etc… Zero difference. And in the spots you can’t normally pen, still no difference for the vast majority of them. There’s some niche targets that just hover in the perfect range for cali to make a difference, but the reality is that you miss out in way more damage opportunities when targets juuuussst get away from you because you trashed your DPM for no good reason

[wooden lynx]

Most definitely btw 90% of this are solo and still performs better than you

[queen geyser]

E5 ? IGN ? ah wait found it

ah u cant play E5 with rammer because u dont have it, ah okay

[fickle tinsel]

Here are the only ss of my old stats I could find @violet island satisfied?

[winter dagger]

Yeah I'm on the side of not trying to be an fps esports gamer in a tank game, if an e100 had an angled turret, sorry but I'm not aiming at that little microscopic bar. Ever. It's like trying to snipe a kranvagn's cupolas. Possible, but why, so cali is good in front line tanks ONLY, and tanks that cannot front line, don't run it like the leo and e50m. One works better with cali than the other. And bad players getting good rng doesn't mean crap when they yolo in and die. Rng is just another factor that can't be controlled, just like how much iq some people can have. Maybe you have good aim, but this is a mobile game, our thumbs are all we have, so rng + mobile aim counts a whole lot more when trying to aim at a slit of tiny armor with a very high chance to not hit it. This is my point.

[orchid grove]

Even for the angled E-100 turret example, it’s not a valid one because cali makes no real difference lol. Here’s cali vs no cali

[queen geyser]

yea but I still dont get the E100 argument, it literally makes no diffrence if the E100 is frontally to you, if the E100 is angled well dont shoot it, it cant shoot you anyway

the armor is around 360-370 on the weakest spots when u angle the turret with the E100, so if you lowrollpen you still bounce with 374, or when the E100 slightly moves around it becomes RNG again if you hit

where is the advantage that is worth of putting E5 at 2000 DPM ? I dont get the E100 argument

[fickle tinsel]

didn't angle properly. 350 350 is possible. e5 also sits slightly lower than the e100 and thus looks up

@orchid grove my argument from above was those just get away scenarios are the only real advantage of rammer but imo it happens less often than a situation where you have to work around inadequate pen or get trolled out of a shot by pen difference

turret ring is only really consistent in a facehug

[orchid grove]

People just don’t understand the difference rammer makes. They assume it only matters in scenarios when you fire 10 shells in a row. They don’t realize that the real difference it makes is that several times per game, you lose out on shot opportunities because an enemy juuussstttt gets away behind a corner by a second so you lose out on damage

[nimble zodiac]

It can angle to about 360/360 or 370/370 with EA. CS will make a big difference here but a sane heavy player will just cram a shell into the turret ring. CS serves lazy people.

[stone drum]

Honestly I would run Cali on post 10.3 AMX m4 mle. 54.

250 apcr doesn't cut it in tier X.

[fickle tinsel]

@queen geyser The e100 argument assumes the e100 peekabooms and angles the turret upon pulling back. Or if you just get caught out in general and need to get out.

Well you aren't buttering that 340 if they angle unless you have Cali LOL

If you have teammates you'd wait for him to look away and you should have time to angle before he can turn back to you. You're not going to poke on a preaimed hulldown e5 regardless because he'd just shoot and pullback lol.

[slender latch]

CS is decent for any player if they want the benefit of higher pen if they don't like inspecting armor on each tank. I personally run CS too on hori just for the bliss of 399mm pen lol

[queen geyser]

bro but peekaboo into what ? Into a hulldown E5 ? Best he can do it HE splash, and u just butter a 340 heat into his turret ?

HE CANT ANGLE IF HE PEEKABOOS YOU
HE WILL LOOK STRAIGHT AT YOU

[nimble zodiac]

I love all this talk about E100 vs CS HEAT when most heavy tanks don’t care if you have CS or not, their weakspots are very difficult to constently hit

@slender latch I state again, CS is for lazy people :p

@winged barn I mean, if you expose yourself vulnerably too much just to get shots, you’re not quite gonna like the outcome, CS or not 😉
Even then, getting out of the line of fire faster applies basically to the boxy Germans and a few other easy to hit armored plates

[winged barn]

Lazy? Or people that just get in and out of the line of fire faster?

[orchid grove]

Those scenarios are way more common than scenarios where cali makes a difference. Go ahead, play some games, tell me how many shots you pen with cali that wouldn’t have penned with rammer. I gurantee that it’s less than one every 3 or 4 games

[winter dagger]

Cali and rammer is good in their own ways, I just don't like it when someone says only one matters, same thing with previous EA and HP equipment debate. On the E5 I run rammer because base heat pen is high enough, but on something like a wz121, even though rammer sounds better, cali is more important because front line tank like I said before. I once dueled a leo 1 who ran cali and me running rammer. Guess who won. Anyways, my point, rammer should not be put off as a bad equipment, likewise cali, when in fact it can change the game completely when it matters. Now vents on autoloaders/reloaders are in my opinion, far too niche to use. Also I know e100 wasn't best example but thought it on the spot without much research

[winter dagger]

As of right now, it's not good compared to other TDs at tier ten. HRF said himself it wasn't good, because it's basically inaccurate at range, with only godly DPM and a strong armor... On the front lol, but the update will make it much better on both those fronts, hopefully 263 will feel better to play, as I won't get nuked on the side anymore

[stone drum]

Vents benefits literally every situation.

[winter dagger]

Well educate me cause I never use it enough, all I know it buffs a bit on every stat

[orchid grove]

Vents vs CS depends on the tank, but some tanks I think do benefit more from vents than CS. AMX 50 B is a poster child for benefitting more from vents than cali. It desperately needs accuracy, traverse and view range, but with 340 APCRs, cali gives little to no benefit.

[twilit crystal]

Bc is tempting for both. It will have pretty bad pen next patch but at the same time the vents and food combo for 335 view range is tempting

Either help your biggest weakness or buff your best strength

[orchid grove]

BC I think is gonna be interesting to setup. You can go for broke on the view range and run optics/vents, or standard combat setup and run camo net/cali

[stone drum]

Honestly I like the viewrange change, because it allows alot more flexibility than before, plus its not like B-C instantly taps you & disappears, unlike sheri

[twin egret]

Autoloaders

[twilit crystal]

Its still so freaky that even with camo net it has the same view range as most meds

[sour moon]

Please, buff the reverse speed of KPz70

[orchid grove]

Yeee. I’m gonna try the full view range setup and see if I can break some maps. You know the maps where the enemy depends on spots where they can remain unspotted (like the spawns on Oasis, corners on campstilla, etc…)

[stone drum]

Honestly it will be fine with like 2.8k dpm vs most meds running around with 3.4k-3.6k

[pseudo bobcat]

Meanwhile me being silly and run Cali on all of my meds just to stand a chance fighting against heavies kekw

I would suggest people to just try both equipment on their tanks for a few battles and let them judge which equipment is more beneficial on which tank because there's really no one size fits all and considering some people has different playstyle could mean that some people might use a different sets of equipment that suits them more

[winter dagger]

So that's why some people recommended vents on the mino

[uneven turtle]

Mino seems ok as it is with the pen. Plus why wouldn’t you go for extra mobility with the vents. I’m about to get it today(as F2P) so I hope I can play it well LOL

[rapid basin]

Minos decent rn idk why they are nerfing it

Like ffs it's slower than the maus it's gonna be damaged engine dead driver maus after 10.3

[subtle egret]

no idea how wg thinks that mino need mobility nerf

[uneven turtle]

Vz 55, a lot of players like the changes. Just proves wg can balance but it depends on how drunk they are

[rapid basin]

Well they are drunk almost 24/7 cause like 80% of the rebalences make 0 sense and stupid and ofcourse they don't give a fk about the community like they don't care at all this probably marks the start of wg downfall cause all of there other WOT games are garbage now to

[fickle shoal]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/369836244064272386/1048913764889673728/attachment-3.gif

[void siren]

Uhhh ignoring the nostalgia for the +2/-2 days, the critique of the grille changes is correct

Sadly you can’t do anything

[rapid basin]

Sadly. Also watch me get banned for no reason it'd happened before
Banned for laughing in balance, asking members questions. Wow i can't war war thund

[void siren]

I mean the f word is quite literally outlawed in #rules , including any abbreviations

And there were never any "good old times", as blitz is currently better than it was when tier 10s curbstomped tier 8s

[rapid basin]

Remember when WOT used to be a fun game on all devices? All the fun glitches that would send you flying? But wg patced them for no reason, and when it wasn't p2w and tanks were balanced.
Not anymore wg got greedy premiums got overpowered and became unbalanced, maps were full of invisible walls, don't you miss the old days when it was fun? Now it's gone.
It's even worse that wg won't fix bugs I tried contacting mods and wg support a month ago about a chat box bug. Never got a response I tried about 4 times. So wg will patch harmless glitches for no reason but won't fix bugs that do cause issues wg dosnt listen to the community at all so what's the point of upvotes/down votes if they won't listen grille has 3200 down votes and 280 upvotes, but wg doesn't care and will put it into the game anyway wotb is going to die at this rate and the other WOT games have already died wg greed killed it. Just play WT at this point atleast they listen to there community @void siren I meant good times as in WOT pc and console I got warned for saying WT lol so I reposted

[void siren]

uhhhhhhhhh
(wot pc and wot console are absolutely terrible - everyone hates arty and +2/-2 mm, and thus blitz is better. Don't be nostalgic for those - 7 players means you have a greater impact!)

Also consider that maybe - just maybe - WG just wants to kill the grille for a while - they don't care about the responses, they just want a gauge in case they revert it sometime later.

Tl;dr other games and old times bad, devs don't need to listen to community, WG make grille kil and everyone's happy because grille bad

[remote sluice]

i use CS only to get more HESH pen on the FV215b lol

other than that i mainly use rammer for the juicy dpm

for some autoloaders i use vents (foch, 50b), but for stuff like progetto which kinda struggles w pen, i use CS

[twilit scroll]

best non premuim T10 medium tank?

[slender geyser]

Carro?

[primal sundial]

😂 if you do it like that, there aren't very many prem t10 at all

[chilly token]

T62

[slender latch]

STB or 121. U can grind stb in next update it will have better dpm and prem AP

[pseudo bobcat]

STB or Leopard for me

[ionic egret]

depends on the type of the tank

[uneven turtle]

Not even the type of tank, it’s about the situation

[subtle mica]

Cant go wrong with stb1

[violet island]

wotpc is in a better space than in a long time with wg doing needed changes atm that are pretty good for the game. I will never understand why people would play WT without being forced to, the concept of oneshots is just ass. The Grille changes won’t be noticed by 99% of the community cause they don‘t play grille to even close of the potential anyways, most of the downvotes don‘t matter cause there is no reason to listen to the complains of players regarding balancing that are just not capable of understanding balancing.

[clear shuttle]

they’ll notice the low rolls and only complain more

[slender latch]

If the alpha difference between 580 and 600 was negligible why did they even feel the need to nerf it that's pretty weird. Same to tanks that got negligible buffed alpha.

[void siren]

Bruh stop it

Pc is hell with tanks

[stable gulch]

What...? It is currently going into a pretty good direction

[pine sage]

wot pc is in a horrid place rn what are you on lol?

[violet island]

why am I even suprised that it's 2 NA players saying that wot pc is at a bad place rn

[void siren]

“A good direction” isn’t much when it starts off in the gutter. Ah yes i love 500 hp tanks (arty), rocket booster tanks, everything being hulldown and an endless grind

If you like wot pc, stop complaining over here! Go play wot pc!

[pine sage]

i have over 117k battles on wot pc and been playing since 2012 i can honestly say the games in a horrid state rn, everything is outclassed by hulldown meta, you can literally buy equipment, research boosts(tech tree line certificates) you literally cant have fun anymore if you want to win you have to meta slave it not to mention the decaying credit economy where prammo is needed anything tier 8+ if you want to be relevant in the battle

[stable gulch]

Oh god thats a lot of copium at once. Pls chill before you hurt yourself because of it. And i am gonna be honest with you, all i can read from that message is a big skill issue.

@void siren you have a point in terms of arta, because its still stupid. However its not even close to how stupid it was once. The bz line is neither really good nor really bad, it just exists and nothing more. Everything being hulldown is not really surprising, considering that most tanks (beside a few paper tanks) can play hulldown and usually profit from it. The point with endless grind is simply as wrong as it could be. It has never been as easy and fast as now to get from t1 to t10. And as a last question: are people not allowed to play both games? Because you cant seem to handle it

[clear shuttle]

if the game isnt fun simply stop playing it for a while or forever

[pine sage]

considering you didnt even properly respond to anything i stated and instead said "skill issue" shows how much you actually know regarding the game so i wont waste my time debating someone who cant even give a proper point to counter

[pine bison]

He's a troller for sure, just writing in purpose of writing....

[remote sluice]

just my personal opinion so it might not sit well w some, but here’s what i think

light: sheridan & bat chat (sheridan is a great light tank w a huge gun and high heat pen w calibrated shells. batchat is a light autoloader w 3k dpm)
medium: leo 1 (a very fast tank w a lazer gun w moderately high alpha)
heavy: m6 yoh, kran, e5, type 71, e100, 60tp, 215b (yoh, kran are great hulldown autoloaders, e5 is a flexible tank thats also getting buffed soon, type 71, e100 and 60tp are generally super easy to play, 215b is much much harder to play but if u can make it work, the tank is a serious monster)
td: 268, jgpz e100 (268 is mobile w high alpha, jgpz e100 has a huge gun w nice armor. i could add in the foch 155 cus its fast and it has a huge autoloader gun, but thats just my taste)

[stable gulch]

What am i supposed to say? You based your points on the fact that you have over 100k games and started playing in 2012. And yet it looks like you dont really know the game. Neither is everything outclassed by hulldown tanks nor is it required to spam gold only at t8 and higher. Yes, you can buy equipment... by buying credits and spending it on equipment (or gold and converting it to credits, same thing). I can do the same thing in blitz. You can get a few more blueprints if you buy the improved battle pass, but it doesnt really make a big difference. You can have a lot of fun and win even with tanks that arent meta. Your points are purely based on your personal experience, ignorance when it comes to developing better game understanding and ignorance to map and balance changes. My experience however just doesnt line up with the stuff you said. I also simply try to improve every game i play. If you really wanna try and tell me that i know nothing about that game, I would like to know your account name (you can send it as a dm) and i can also tell you mine if you want

[cunning socket]

Because it is. Complete pay to win. Spam gold or lose.

[violet island]

what except BZ-176 is pay to win in wot?

[past vale]

They just started fixing things (Chief and 279 nerfs, V4 too) but it doesn't fix that most of tier 10 is a credit sink. Also people call it now "Big Brother Blitz" because matches last less nowadays, (15-0 simulator) Tbh the economy in Blitz is miles better, gotta give credit to the ones in charge, you get rewarded for playing better, tank repairs don't exist, currencies are very condensed (gold, credits and free XP, no bonds and etc), you don't go bankrupt for running rations, consumables are cheap......... If you selectively shoot prammo, repair when necessary, have a premium account and do at least 1.8-2k dmg in tier 10, you can pull profits in Blitz, running full provisions and all.

[stable gulch]

I mean, i can play t10 and make profit in pc, while using gold, food and a big repkit (and even dying). However in general t10 was never designed to be profitable and it will never really be, except for good players that simply perform good. I agree that blitz economy is better in that way, since you dont lose credits super fast. Games being super fast these days is a point i dont fully agree with. They became faster over the last few years, but not that much. 15:0 (or 0:15) are happening more often these days, but its not like they happen every third game or so. The avg time for a game is probably still around like ~7 to 8 mins i would say, but the problem with that is imo not really the tank balancing. Its rather the map design in different cases as well as the player. That tank repair exist is imo a good thing, because in theory it should motivate people to play more careful instead of throwing their tank away.

[humble depot]

After 10.3, I’d suggest the following:

E 50 M
Leopard 1
T-62A
STB-1
WZ-121

[vestal basalt]

For the T-62A recommend to play the LT line first till tier 8 then get into tier 9 MT

[proud plover]

Blitz is simpler, and easier to learn. Grinding a tech tree is faster plus it doesn't take much of your time. The battles only last for like 2-4mins at most. It's just flat out better for people that don't like devoting their entire day grinding. Except if your a masochist then PC version is for you so it depends on the person.

[remote sluice]

could be a major skill issue on my part, but shots on pc cant seem to hit where i aim at, while it does much more on blitz

[void siren]

Volume vs Gaussian dispersion

[stable gulch]

While i agree with blitz being simpler and easier to learn, i dont fully agree with the second part. I wont disagree with blitz having the faster grind and faster games (After all one game is 15v15 and the other 7v7, with a big difference also in map size), but i will disagree that you have to grind the entire day to get somewhere. In the last few years they added stuff to make grinding way faster, like removing a lot of lowtiers from the techtree, adding blueprints to reduce the research costs for new tanks, top of the tree (every month 2 new vehicles are tott for a month) with missions to get xp when playing tanks of that line, etc. In the end it however is a personal preference as you said

[past vale]

I just listed like half of the issues, crew management is silly too, even WT has a simpler crew training mechanic, the new "extra super vip premium account" situation, people not liking stell hunter..... Yeah the game has seen better days, that's the complain from the player base. Also if you don't notice 15-0 simulator then you probably didn't play back then, but that's more a boomer complaint.

[stable gulch]

Crews are anything but difficult to get behind. The ideas they had so far to rework it were never seen as good changes by the community, so they dropped most of the stuff and implemented only a few things and changes. The "extra super vip premium account" (i assume you are talking about wot plus) is not an issue in the slightest, people not liking a special mode you dont have to play at all isnt a real problem either (no one is forcing you to play it), same goes for all the other special fun modes. The game literally has never been in a state as good as its now, due to all the changes they made over the years. That doesnt mean there arent any problems, no one says that there arent any problems. Same goes for the whole "15:0 simulator". I said it happens way more often now, compared to a few years ago. That still doesnt mean it happens super often. From all the things you mentioned so far, only one thing is kind of an actual problem for the game, that wg has problems to find a solution for and that the people complain about (games being really fast and ending 15:0). No one is really complaining about the crew system, since wg is working on changes and improved several aspects of it. Wot plus is also not a thing people are complaining about, because no one cares about it. The special modes like steel hunter? Yeah, people say they dont enjoy them and some give ideas what could be changed. And then they simply dont play them, if they dont enjoy them.

[spice silo]

if you are playing a medium tank with a rammer and are in front of heavies, you have skill issue. simple as that. I run rammer on most tanks with some exceptions and I dont struggle to get 3k dmg on average in a tier X battle lol. For a decent player cali on mediums or lights is pointless as you wanr dpm primarly. Heavies with 330 heat pen also dont need it. Cali makes sense on autoloaders and tanks with really bad accuracy

[orchid grove]

I agree, I think we’re on the same side here. #RammerForLyfe

[spice silo]

indeed. I mean I recommend cali for new players or ones who still learn the game, but rammer usually makes you a better player, you are essentially forced to think more in something like a medium tank

tbh cali is a BS eq that should never exist in the first place, lol

[remote sluice]

Cali is only good for stuff like Sheridan, where it can reliably pen things. its poor base pen will not help it at all even w the xtra dpm rammer gives it

i also use Cali on the FV215b cus i need that juicy HESH pen and 340 APCR, and most autoloaders/ autoreloaders

otherwise i just use rammer cus dpm

[spice silo]

exactly. although I also use it in E100, because of the gun

[winter dagger]

Yes, and sometimes certain meds that have hulldown capabilities of a heavy (e50m and stb imo although stb won't need cali after 10.3) would run cali. Fv4202 for that hesh doesn't count for this, but good take

[burnt venture]

Cali is useful in only 4 situations:

• big gun tanks with long reloads and low DPM, where rammer wouldn't help at all
• autoloaders / autoreloaders (although some autoreloaders can still benefit from vents)
• HESH tanks / tanks with any kind of HE based gameplay
• Meeting important pen thresholds in select situations depending on playstyle (for example, STB runs cali because its playstyle frontally engages heavy tanks a lot more than other mediums, or 140 runs cali because 290 HEAT pen is garbage)

Otherwise, rammer should ALWAYS be the go-to. There's no reason to not run rammer because brawling is basically the name of the game

[twilit crystal]

oh yeah just realized stb 1 is gonna run Rammer from now on so even more broken 💀(Imo 140 should just run rammer anyway, no point playing the pen fight)

[winter dagger]

And wz121 that heat pen is just so 🚮

[burnt venture]

running rammer on 140 just helps you out DPM all 3 of the other 140 players on NA server 🗿

[winter dagger]

Leo 1 running rammer behind you be like:

[fickle tinsel]

we were talking about heavies only, with a focus on the e100 and e5

[ancient rampart]

Calibrated is basically required on the KPZ 70 because of it's very low pen and the fact APCR is it's standard shell

[winter dagger]

It's a big derp gun too, so penning is better than shooting more usually

[exotic girder]

TL-7-120 needs a gun depression or aim time but the super weak hatch currently makes it subpar especially when the M103 is just flat better in every way

[void siren]

The tl-7-120 isn’t galaxy sized

[exotic girder]

Yes but its got a weaker hull, turret that has an auto pen hatch, less gun depression and its basically the same on other stats

[burnt venture]

TL-7-120 is like one of the worst heavy tanks at tier 9 lol

Huge hatch, no gun depression, traverse speed and reverse speed are terrible, gun handling is terrible, and the only thing it has going for it is the size which on a heavy tank is worthless.

In testing it had 3k DPM and Tugsten and while that was OP, having M103 firepower on a tank that sacrifices this much just to be small is hilarious

[void siren]

I mean if you stay solely on hard ground, its just barely half decent with one of the highest accelerations out of the heavies

[exotic girder]

Not even the IS-8, 50tp, 50tp prototype all out class it in mobility and acceleration

[stone drum]

Maybe if they gave the traverse speed a nice buff it would be better.

[burnt venture]

I mean we had like 3 or 4 tanks in a row that all had the same downsides. Terrible traverse, terrible reverse.

VZ-55, 452K, TL-7, and the 777 version II all have the exact same thing. 7 deg gun dep, hulldown kind of, meh gun, and terrible traverse and reverse but good forward speed.

So tell me more about how the 10 difference in alpha damage numbers make tanks unique

[pseudo bobcat]

I mean the Leopard 1 definitely is unique since it has 360 alpha but what makes a Leopard I unique is that it's a Leopard and it's fast, the gun is awesome, it's flexible, it has good dynamics so I kinda get your point

[burnt venture]

Alpha damage numbers are not unique at all. 10 alpha damage does not make the tank any more different to play. It only cause more frustration because now you have to keep track of all these alpha numbers, and then the maxroll skill throws in ANOTHER random factor where you have just no clue what all of these alphas' maxrolls even are.

And then ofc another awful part is that 10 damage difference means there's a huge overlap in damage rolls. There's almost no point trading shots with someone that has 10 alpha lower than you because the chance that they roll higher is still very high.

It's a trash way of balancing tanks because it takes such a standardized thing and makes it go everywhere for no other reason than this made-up idea of diversity

[pseudo bobcat]

I see, what solution do you propose to fix this then?

[orchid grove]

WG should balance tanks by actually leaning into their strengths and weaknesses rather than their drunk monkey throwing darts at a board style of balance that they seem to be doing.

[stone drum]

Buff ARL 44 penetration!

[burnt venture]

people still be running the 90mm DCA even after they buffed the 105 and nerfed the 90 so much that on the M4 45 the 105mm has better gun handling than the 90mm

No matter how hard they try, they cannot make people stop playing the 90mm DCA. Hilarious

[exotic girder]

No way its already the most OP tier 6 lmfao

[pseudo bobcat]

yes I think they should have small gradual changes that leans into this instead of random extremely drastic changes that makes little sense (I'm staring at you 215b)

[burnt venture]

Churchil VIII > any tier 6 heavy

[orchid grove]

Also based. Remember that 2v2 tourney we did?

[void siren]

Tooooooooog

[burnt venture]

I mean tbf it is overpowered. Outside of the slowest shell velocity in the game, it's hilarious that a tank with 270 alpha, decent AP and 220mm HEAT pen, and 350 damage on 50mm pen HE can still basically have the same DPM as Churchill 7, but still have 1 deg more gun depression, more armor, and better mobility.

It's actually busted, but nobody bought it cuz tier 6

[exotic girder]

This is valid i love that thing, easy ace farming

[stone drum]

It really just pisses me off they crapped on the tier 7 & 8s gun because of the tier 6 even though they used a completely different gun.

People will never use the 105mm gun over the 90mm dca as that's the arls iconic gun, they should have just nerfed the dpm & let it be.

@exotic girder spark would like to talk to you, ARL hasn't been the most "OP tier 6" for a good while.

It should definitely have it's penetration, atleast half of it returned. Loosing 47mm of penetration is actually stupid on WGs Part, now it doesn't even have particularly good pen in tier 6.

@burnt venture I'm not saying to give it back 212mm of penetration, but 165mm is an absolute insult, just give it like 180-185mm.

[burnt venture]

the issue though is that the pen completely broke the tier. Tier 8 medium pen on a tier 6 heavy tank just meant that ARL was an instant win-condition in any kind of game because it was the only tank that just ignored everybody else's frontal armor, including itself.

If you give it back the pen, it needs to have like abysmal DPM in order to stop it from being incredibly dominant.

[unique scaffold]

@native canyon English only

[winter dagger]

Churchchil Mk. 6 with the armor of a tier 7 heavy

[twilit crystal]

That was 212 though. It should have been put at 175 which the kv1s has

[winged barn]

Kv1s has 160 now

[nimble zodiac]

I mean, at this rate:
212 -> 200 -> 180 -> 165
We’ll get 140 pen next

Like it’s an A B A B pattern with upward scaling

[twin egret]

Should some tanks be moved up or down a tier in your guy's opinion? I wouldn't say tech tree tanks though, but more like premium tanks

[wicked quest]

I hold a firm opinion Kpz should be uptiered it’s just incredibly boring the way it exists

[queen geyser]

in generally this isnt something that should be not be considered, but I think its very hard to do, usually premium tanks seperate by price and the tier does impact the price very hard, doing switchero of that could some people upset rly hard, however I do not rly care about that because in my opinion Balance of the game is for the greater good so it would be fine

[ancient rampart]

Ferdinand should be a tier 7 with it's top gun removed

[solemn forum]

When will Hetzer get graphic improvement??

[twin egret]

The moment the FV4202 gets pbr

[twilit crystal]

752 should be a tier ten. Give 10 more heat pen and call it a day

[ancient rampart]

It already has 340 base HEAT
it doesn't need anymore lol

[solid sequoia]

The only thing keeping 752 from being a tier 10 is its HP. Literally +300 HP makes it a tier 10 tank.

[winged barn]

Tigers 1 and 2 should have both been downtiered

[wicked quest]

I don’t think so if they were downtiered they would leave a weird gap gameplay wise in it that would just be filled by a tiger clone like löwe or Keiler it’s why tiger got buffed anyways

[primal sundial]

they would have to be nerfed so much they would essentially end up different vehicles. They are already quite strong in their tier, moving them down and trying to make them balanced would require massive changes

[slender latch]

If they could switch WT and Grille's tier I wouldn't mind that, but WT keeping the 640 alpha while grille just 580 alpha and change the HP.

[clear shuttle]

more than just a simple alpha and hp change will be done if that happened, alot more

and id rather keep the grille in tier 10 and the wt in tier 9

[fathom glacier]

Wt and Rhm will get nerfed too. Same alpha dmg from grille. 600 > 580

[slender latch]

Will the 4-shell 100mm SA47 changes from BC 25 (tier 10) also apply to its tier 9 next update?

[winged barn]

You do realize just how much they have been buffed to actually be able to stay in their tiers, correct? Actually every aspect of them was buffed, and not by an insignifigant margin.

[primal sundial]

Nope, I don't, but my question is so? what does how weak they may have been ages ago have to do with how they would do now if you dropped them a tier? They are both really strong tanks. I'm not actually sure when they needed a buff, since they were both quite strong three years ago and they both quite strong now. And hopefully you are referring to specific buffs to those two tanks, rather then the general changes that resulted in the heavy meta we see currently

[winged barn]

I said "should" it would have been so much easier at the time. Notice the past tence.

[humble depot]

It makes no sense though. It’s not like WoTB is meant to be historical, so why try and balance tanks in that way?

[primal sundial]

when? as I said, they were probably even stronger a few years ago with less strong newer prems/tech trees, and they are currently quite strong. I haven't played wotb consistently, or since it released, but I have never felt they were weak tanks when I have played them or run across them. Statistically they probably suffer a bit as well, for being the ''famous'' ww2 tank and it's apparent upgrade

[rare tapir]

#Edtron123 what are u typing from 69 hours

[past vale]

Tiger 2 had terrible armor even back in the day, it is stronger than most premiums too, this iteration is the strongest Tiger 2 there has been. It is fighting comparable tanks, most of tier 8 are "late war tanks" like the IS designs, a lot of them have unrealistic stats to make them more enjoyable (imagine firing 3 shells per minute on an IS-3). Tier 7 is more about tanks that came in the middle of the war and tier 5-6 is early war designs. You cannot put a year range because some countries had better designs earlier than others.

PS: The bot silenced me for no reason and the chat bugged

[glad cove]

Buff sta 1

[rapid basin]

It is getting buffed red to rework😐

[glad cove]

Idk if it is because none of the stb1 changes rly effected the sta 1 or even the type 61 during update 9.1

[rapid basin]

Slower.
Faster reload
Less alpha
Type 61 is unchanged

[glad cove]

Is it just a rework where it gets just 100 more dpm or will it be bigger buff than that, Because as it stands the r u 251 is just a better sta 1 in every way except he shell resistance

[humble depot]

The Type 61 is getting changes to bring the gun in line with the STB once 10.3 hits.

[rapid basin]

That's 9.3 we are getting 10.3 rn
Also why neef minooooo

[stone drum]

They seriously should have.

[winter dagger]

It has 340 heat already, more pen on the standard???

[twilit crystal]

Yeah woops

[winter dagger]

Lol

[remote sluice]

wait i thought the Type 61 is getting a similar gun to the STB-1 next patch? BlitzHangar says that

[stone drum]

It is

[frigid torrent]

Mino objt 268 and vk72 which one to get

[worn tapir]

maybe update

[rapid fox]

I checked play store there is no update

[unique scaffold]

vk72 or obj 268

[wheat halo]

will warg nerf the tvp ?

[frigid torrent]

Vk will be so nice

[unique scaffold]

so go for vk if u can play ht well

[worn tapir]

Boys i wanna grow my clan but idk how'

[bold knoll]

Hello, will there ever be a limit on the number of premium vehicles in rating battles? And will the KV-13 return to the game?

[humble depot]

Lmao what

[thorny timber]

we didn't even get kv6 and it will be an unbalanced addition to the game

[winter dagger]

Vk72

[alpine kettle]

WG, why still nerf FV215B when its already unplayable?

[thorny timber]

I wouldn't exactly call it unplayable but yeah,the nerf can't be justified properly

[twin egret]

It's stupid, hell now the 183 is better than the 215b now possibly after this

[junior basin]

So after the IS-4 nerf, will it at least sidescrape alright? I think it's the only heavy to have an upper plate which can be penned by regular ammo no

[twin egret]

A lot of heavies can have their upper plate be penned by regular ammo

[thorny timber]

183 Armor change was plain out dumb,i thought all tanks that had hesh were supposed to have a reasonable amount of Armor or no Armor at all?

[junior basin]

oh what seriously? well sorry, I meant 250-260 mm apcr. Well at least going from the fortress it is to this now seems a bit wierd. IDM it, I love heaviums although by the looks of it it will be a subpar heavium

[twin egret]

In that case then it's really just 4 heavies in total: the FV215b, T95E6, AMX 50B, and the IS-4 itself