lore-discussion

[limber ridge]

I checked, he's actually hunched there, so probably still around 7 foot/212 cm

Also Jacob is about 5'9/175, from that same chart.

I can't really tell Iris' height from there but she looks taller than Jacob.

[limber ridge]

Oh, also Mya is 4'9 from a missing poster in that book iirc

[dusty trench]

I know. I’m talking actual lore.

It’s alr

@safe charm I feel like this could be an interesting idea. This is the one I could find.

[limber ridge]

Actual Lore as in current Lore right?

[dusty trench]

Yes

[inland folio]

i may be wrong but

at the time HN1 was released this could be passed of as like the first background house

and they just kept it like that

[ripe berry]

👍

[ripe berry]

yeah I know, but I'm just saying that with future content this was potentially expanded upon

unrelated but
#hn3-discussion message
#hn3-discussion message

the skin colors in HN3 have no lore reason for being the way they are
Already somewhat figured this because Historian is already Blue pre-1980, but good to see confirmation

further shows a point I made that HN often combines feelings/thoughts with reality

only question becomes if there's any rhyme or reason behind the colors or if it's just random

[dusty trench]

Btw I added RBC

[ripe berry]

👍

although I'd recommend not pinging people when bringing up shared ideas in the future
(they might be busy, might not want to be pinged, etc, etc.)

[dusty trench]

Alr

[dusty trench]

This just made me think of something that I kinda had in mind for a while. The safari is depicting like an island, which safaris are known at. And these imagination worlds, are made up of Aaron and Mya’s imagination, obviously seen in Mya’s point of view. But Aaron draws the island despite not knowing his father crashed on there in bad blood. Time later on tho as the grew up, Aaron would learn that his dad crashed there, and Mya too a bit. Which ca tie into the many mentions and thought’s in H&S and Mya’s perspective before. So I believe this stage is in a way portraying the island in a sense. Where Mr. Peterson experimented with time and manipulation of the stuff around him, which is why there’s the animals, showing him manipulating the environment around him even wild life is impacted. Even the big bird protecting its baby, ca show a little bit of Mr. Peterson. And the Tiger costume Aaron has can be like the animalistic side of the town, that’s cursed and greedy. Animalistic, wild, and dangerous. Sneaky, and causing stuff in the background. Taking the animals there work. Taking the most weaker and more vulnerable. Representing cult. And why not attack Theodore represented through the giant bird is because he is dangerous and in rage. Trying to protect his son. But he is in rage and paid attention to his surroundings, and could hurt someone and risk his son. So we the traveler and explorer, representing the puzzle masters, have to separate Aaron from his father for the better unfortunately, which this ties to something I said on HN2 and other stuff too. And also shows Mya’s love for animals, which can be more of the representation since she loves animals and this is an imagination land, but reality is slowly kicking in. Which the error trophies show seeing things in a different view in reality. That’s because the puzzle masters were testing to prevent Mya’s death but cult was ahead, which I elaborated on above.

[ripe berry]

<@&1162799252192379000>

(there was a scam, it got deleted right before I pinged the mods, sry mods)

[dusty trench]

What’s that that keeps popping up

[dusty trench]

Oh

Anyways…

[ripe berry]

then there's the other stages

[dusty trench]

Getting to that

[ripe berry]

noting that Stage 3 could be the same city as Stage 2 as iirc certain assets are reused between the two?

[ripe berry]

I'd say due to that Stages 2 and 3 should probably be viewed as a pair if you want to try to parallel it to anything else in lore

[dusty trench]

More on the this stuff it’s showing Mr. Peterson’s experiments basically made the timeline what is later on. He was willing to manipulate the environment around him which in turn can cause worse for others, and could risk their lives. For his own goal of going to a dream reality where nothing went wrong for him. That’s why the Bird in the middle of map, representing Mr. Peterson is in the middle. Because this level is showing the in a way kind of Mr. Peterson’s mindset. Not literally, but like Mya learning about what’s going on (and Aaron too just not his overall perspective). Showing the center of the Peterson story around Mr. Peterson trying to protect his family at all cost, so that the cult and bad luck doesn’t get to him and ruin his plans and experiments, which the island being the big huge starting point for that. And everything else all around like the tiger and the critters representing the cult and all of the bad luck surrounding the storyline, all pf the critters hiding away from the dangerous sneaky Tiger. Which can even show a little bit of The Guest symbol in ways of how it was destructed into a dangerous negative symbol. And even how he is shows non character many times is wild and animalistic. Also super powerful over others impacting them in negative ways. Also the island while planned early on I used as a main example for that act because the island you can think to Theo crashing there, but also islands in HN have been used as representation and such, and I just tied the nature life and the world to that, so island as a concept can tie to multiple other views, concepts, and ideas within the world of HN. Like referring to island doesn’t just always have to be the Mr. Peterson son experiments, that just me bringing up another view of something planned and tying it to another concept and view of the ideas of nature and the world in HN. This can also tie to the wildlife in HN too, in many ideas, views, concepts.

And when I said experiments that can refer to one view or multiple. Because it doesn’t just have to be Mr. Peterson. Because we see things in HN2 aswell like the sea stuff, even HE. But, it can also tie to other things, even island in a view be a symbolic or metaphorical thing. Even related to fantasy aspects of HN or distorted memory the journey character has been on. Like sandbox in HE has giant versions of the sandbox blocks that are in the lobby. And sandboxes are describes as a mini island. We can even look at SN menu and even Nicky’s yard and tree house, Theo’s house stuff, and many, many more things, even the HN2 museum town map. HND and SN maps, it can really tie to this entire series, even HN3 rn and many sandbox or exploring secrets and such. It ca be more than just one thing. Like a view of story without the island, you can still use ideas from it or use it as a symbol (you’ll see me talk more on this in the future I technically already have). Which bring’s me straight into the city.

Now this ties into this, as this says act 2 is corruption in town, the figures of power in city like police representing cultist. Which goes straight into what I’m about to say. Angie’s into The Guest symbol showing the corruption of the town. As cold corporate behavior and evil greedy business started getting involved, destructed what was once towns symbol of hope and spread negativity keeping away the dark storm, now bringing it upon others.

[dusty trench]

Why it’s a city is because it’s representing the corporate nature of what the town slowly provides over the years, greedy for more money and milking out more stuff in GA. But really that only creates more problems. Homeless people everywhere, robbers who retaliate out of anger and frustration because they wish they had more. Murder cases happening around, and other crime investigations and more detectives getting involved. But really the hire ups the police are evil and causing most of this stuff, representing the cultist. So private investigators have to step in. This can even show Mr. Peterson too in a way. Like how he was big and famous for his park inventions, especially after the time period he f the island incident which this act takes place after. Incidents at the parks that he tried to hide and run away from, trying to stay away from his fears of bad luck catching up to him. Taking away everything. But his experiments, and stuff he did made him the monster in people’s eyes, similar to Guest symbol and later on he goes down destructive path (hint hint). Ands little bit of Mya learning more and trying to understand everything. But Aaron and Mya only want to see the good in their father. We see that through Mya’s mind of imagination dream lands, but reality slowly starts to slip in. Us stealing the money isn’t for evil, it’s because we are taking back what the cult stole. The money was taken by the greedy hands of evil business behind the aces behind a corporate picture. This can even parallel the big city in HN games, as the city is describes lowk super corporate like the big infamous city in HN. And even how no one cares or worries much about the smaller town of Raven Brooks, since they are in a bigger city. Which I’ve talked about before when talking about HN3 environment and aesthetic. But this leads to act 3, fire city. This is showing the destruction of the town. All of the pain, suffering, loss, all being bright down to the people in town.

[dusty trench]

All of the bad luck cult unleashed, even on them. As this can even show Mr. Peterson, all of everything leading him down a destructive path. Also seen as a destructive symbol like The Guest. Bringing pan and destruction upon the town folks, which is obviously represented by the fire, and fire costume Aaron leaving a fire trail. And firefighter Mya representing puzzle masters trying to save everyone in town from the storm and chaos being unleashed. And now that leads to act 4. The cold reality of what’s going on is slipping in way more than before. The town is destroyed, but remains as filled with the cold evil spreading all around, represented through the snow and ice, and Aaron’s costume (which is like taxidermist and cop costume being like Keith, both cultist). But Mya refuses to accept the truth, and tries to stay in her imagination because of cults influence, as through the ravens which I explained. And even relating to Mr. Peterson as well. As he wants to go to his dream reality so bad, but the bad luck catches up to him. But this shows something. All these acts play out in a very constructive order, paralleling HN story order in a way. Act 1 being the past with Mr. Peterson experiments and his motive being represented all around. Act 2 showing the corruption of everything over time, act 3 showing the destruction, like HN2 later on in the pics. And even a small town is in that act, which has a lake next to it with a contraption that is of a cloud to create rain. It’s like Mya using the power of Mayak for good reason, to put out the flames, and spread peace. This contraption connects to the city, showing how powerful Mayak truly is. Butt people choose to use that power for bad or their own control. Because the cloud was still and not moving, showing how nature is being manipulated and causing the destruction we see. And then we set the natural flow of the world and our weather free which freed everyone else we save. Letting life and the world to freedom.

[magic quarry]

@dusty trench

I have a question

[dusty trench]

Yea

[magic quarry]

Is there anyway I could get mods for the game

[dusty trench]

Modb and steam.

And gamejolt

[magic quarry]

Alright, on the app store?

[dusty trench]

No

But I’ve seen people use mods for mobile

Idk how tho

[magic quarry]

Thanks

[dusty trench]

Like mod menus and such

[dusty trench]

Your welcome

Anyways back to lore.

[ripe berry]

I know you didn't say anything about Stage 5 yet but may I note

• Stage 5 is the only stage without an Error Area
• Stage 5 starts out with a storm-like background before changing to daytime

[dusty trench]

And act 4 showing what is to become of the town, like HN3. This is showing the puzzle masters trying to tell Mya what’s going to happen, and trying to get her to reality to prevent her death, but it fails. Why there’s the zombies is representing the mindlessness of people in town, the recklessness and how people move around like zombies, similar to vandals design and how people view them. Vandals being blinded by severe mental issues, and mindless around like zombies, also could imply drug use too as they move around and look like zombies or drug addicts, and even react like someone who is on heavy drugs. Like maybe using it to cope or relive stress, and be happy and have dopamine rush around to relieve themselves. But slowly get addicted and later on have a crash in there brain and start retaliating more out of anger, and are heavily addicted to substances. Drug use is a thing in HN presented in books, and I even compared like drug use to like act 2 of H&S. And it ca also tie to spiritual stuff with mannequins like Mr. Peterson’s experiments, HE as an example. And his controlling mindset overtime as he gets more insane, even tie to the cult too. People I tow becoming more aggressive and maybe even bloodthirsty slowly falling into the same traps as the cult, and other bad influences. Why the guy Aaron is as is attacking you is because you still have brain with knowledge, but are slowly becoming mindless lil everyone else. Everyone else already mindless puppets no need of attacking them really, because cult sees you as a threat. But you have been tricked by cult, and are now there puppet. Them slowly taking away your self control, and manipulate your mind represented through the brains. Probably making you think your saving all of the people and having them gain their intelligence, but really are giving yourself away as a sacrifice.

[dusty trench]

And this is showing in Mya’s mind, representing her being tricked into a puppet, and she was the perfect vessel into not only finding out who they should vote use to get the info from Mr. Peterson (Maritza being close to Mya and cult using Maritza), but also Mr. Peterson is also obsessed with his dream imagination reality, she never really learned how to come to terms with reality at the right times. Mother died, Mr. Peterson isn’t around too much and always working and worried about his experiments. Aaron is in rage and huge mental anguish. And Mya is young. So why not use the younger version one who’s seen as the innocent one for the job. Also the fact they planed on killing her off to ruin Peterson’s lives more. And that’s where act 5 kicks in which is where reality kicks in too late at the end. And as you mentioned yes, has a storm like background with the wind blowing outside the windows. And I theorized before that the pace before going to the roof is distorted version of attic because of Mya’s fear. And the feeling of something bad is going to happen. Mya however when going to the roof, comes to terms with reality and imagination combined together. To create the sensation of hope. She bring light into what’s going on and tries to understand Aaron and her fathers motives. As she sees Aaron’s face is shocked and coming to realization. She portrays in her mind Mr. Peterson burying her before she actually dies, so she can see the good in what happens and the human side of her father and Aaron not blinded by rage and mental anguish. Why it’s been showing Aaron wearing the costumes portraying this stuff relating to cult is because puzzle masters trying to get Mya to understand what’s going on, and her imagination is using all this stuff as symbols for what’s really going on. And the fact that each act has representation of her father in a way, it’s showing that she knows her dad is afraid of Aaron becoming cursed by cult or an omen.

[dusty trench]

And I’ve talked about dolls in the past and their metaphorical meaning. Even the doll representing Mya in a way, like in one of the cinematic trailers, doll is falling but a raven catches it. And Aaron knocking doll off the roof like how he accidentally pushes Mya off roof foreshadowing. This make me think that the doll with that spiritual metaphorical representation in that game is that the Diane doll is Mya’s symbol of hope to her. She carries it around with her beside its super important, and her mom always taught her stuff and this doll is that representation of her. The voodoo doll like representation is representing the similarities between Mya and her mom. And even how thy are both used as puppets led into a trap. And the voodoo metaphor too. Their legacy will live on forever in peace. As we see in HN2, with Diane and Mya mannequin’s hugging Quentin. Which shows a symbol of peace in life, and hope for the future to see the positive side of the world. It can outcome as Quentin having good luck to show him surviving later on or having others survive like his sister. Or outcome of that can be Quentin going to peace as he passes away.

[dusty trench]

But this does show that he knows Mya and Diane are dead. In S&R we see Guest doll to as walkie talkie to switch to Guest, and Aaron doll as walkie talkie to Aaron. Which the dolls are called voodoo and obviously it’s like some voodoo metaphor right here. Even switching to one another has the raven feathers fly around you and distorted crow nosies play. This ties more into the Raven metaphors. As ravens are usually portrayed with symbols of luck omens, symbols of life and death. And it hints at the cult using them as puppets, trying to ruin Peterson’s lives and drive them insane blinded by mental anguish to cause something bad. And we see that with Aaron, and Mr. Peterson. They are trying to put the picture onto Peterson like they did to Roger and Adele, and drive them do things that are horrible. But it falls bag one them a lot, as we see with Mr. Peterson killing lot of them, which shows that they dot have everything under control as they are blinded by the greed in there eyes and there drove to get what they want, they don’t realize that the bad luck they unleashed is coming right back for them. And even each act the ravens are seen and depicted more evil like, and in the end credits representing the cult. Them manipulating the life around them to do their work. Mr. Peterson doing the same later on, making him seem as a destructive person in people’s minds. Doing things that are unforgivable. And even I noticed something about the dolls and toys showing stuff as I explained, but the Diane doll also in HN1, S&R, SN, and HND, shows a ton too. Mya getting doll in the SN reel tape as a Christmas present.

This being a big one part of another discussion.

[dusty trench]

And even spiritual stuff with like the spirit realm and stuff. And ravens seeing the opposite side of the world that is like distorted, as we see when switching to Guest. And he sees what we can’t. The fat that it’s all one big set up like a stage play, which ties into this directly and I’ve spoke on it in the past worms tuff looking like a toy box in HN and other metaphors that are like childlike children stuff used metaphorically. Even tying to imagination and dream stuff too I’ve discussed. This is shown with character’s turning into cardboard cut outs. We get glimpses of that but Guest sees it way more clear. It’s like opening the gate to viewing things the opposite way. Even voodo doll and stuff are represent ion of playing with life and death, using other minds. Controlling others minds and bodies for their own benefit. Which ties into things I discussed previously about Aaron. It’s like Ravens being able to view the spirit realm and just seeing the distorted truth of reality as a symbol. And that’s being represented here. Because they are said in folklore or have the power of manipulating life and death with luck and omen. Thats be she ravens are very smart and are related to weather like the magnetic fields, which are seen to bring pain and destruction. They can keep storm away, or bring them. Also their appearance being very aware and watching without directly looking at you makes them more cunning. And even mysterious, which can tie into the sneaky and in the background portrayal of the cult and Guest.

[dusty trench]

It could give us an idea of stuff relating to premise in HN3, and the message. Not like an actual reason why there skin tones are like that, but kind of like how people view the town in a way. But not a specific reason why certain character are a certain color or not. As he says they are trying to achieve the feeling of fading memory and melancholy. And as he says they look normal to each other. And he used the example of Psychonauts being “normal” within game world. Because it’s kind of like a meta thing similar to the guidebook, a message from the devs. Some of the outside city members are kind of like us, a viewer. We are viewing this strange world in a strange place, with people who seem strange or crazy at times but it’s normal to them. Because they adapted to the nature of the town or grew up there. The skin tones are like a reflection of the mood and atmosphere of town, and how the viewers see the town and town members that the people in town find normal to them. If they were to go out or the city or outside of raven brooks, they might view it weird too. But no actual lore reason for skin tones specifically. It’s like a reflection of the viewers in a meta like way, and can give us an idea of the vibe and atmosphere within the story. Even the body proportions of characters can tie to this as well. It’s to set the mood within the story, for us to reflect on the idea and message they are trying to convey.

[ripe berry]

there could be some kind of reasoning behind most of the colors because like:
Ted and Guest have normalish colors (they're two of the most infamous entities in Raven Brooks folklore thus the memory of them wouldn't be as "fading")
Signed and Jaunsz are Green (no clue why this is)
Isaac, Iris, and their parents are Purple (and they're family so of course they share the same color)
and Blue seems to be the default color because Historian, Jacob, Coned, Covered and the people in photos in the Museum/Cinema all share that color

[dreamy sluice]

default color

[dusty trench]

Oh yea. Because like it’s not a specific lore reason behind like why characters have specific colors and such and others don’t, but it’s like that. Also can tie into what I said about H&S Stage/act 4 comparing to HN3 and the thing with zombies being like puppets in town in a way, with some normal kinda people who aren’t like hostile, but are there. I guess to portray newcomers into town witnessing the horrors, and even some people who are new but are getting brainwashed guy watching television before taking his brain which I said what that meant. Like the legacy of the town through these members, showing what the outcome of towns folks are.

[tacit barn]

Why is raven brooks in hello neighbor 3 abandoned?

[ripe berry]

it's 2028 and all of the stuff that happened in the town made most people leave

[dusty trench]

Like storms, murders, tragedies, other issues with town and people being scared, wondering is being there is safe to live in, etc.

[tacit barn]

Oh so that’s why iris, jacob isaac and everyone else are the only people in town

[dusty trench]

Which can tie to this.

[tacit barn]

Oh that makes sense

[ripe berry]

and HN3 lets us decide the ultimate fate of Raven Brooks, how that legacy continues on

[dusty trench]

Like how the fate happens.

[tacit barn]

I still wonder what happened to Aaron

Like is he still alive

[dusty trench]

Which fits considering we get a bunch of lore and differences in media, and even it plays out like folklore. It’s not all accurate. Different stories in one universe. And we try to piece them together to figure out the story. And some stuff is mysterious.

We work with what he have in each story.

[dusty trench]

Last time we see him is in HN2

We don’t know if he is alive afterwards.

[ripe berry]

(honestly I think HN3 being the final entry in the timeline works great for it's ideas because putting it anywhere before the end of the timeline would invalidate the player's choices as there'd only be one "canon" ending to HN3, which would be the one that best aligns with whatever state we see Raven Brooks in next)

[tacit barn]

Wait since ravenbrooks is abandoned, did the mayor from hn2 go too?

[dusty trench]

Which is 2010’s timeline period, and late 2000’s

[ripe berry]

most likely

[dusty trench]

He could be dead

[ripe berry]

his house is destroyed during an implied storm shown via photos in HN2

[tacit barn]

Maybe

[ripe berry]

(would've been shown in-gameplay but they scrapped the expansion of HN2 to work on HN3)

[tacit barn]

Patch 10?

[ripe berry]

I mean, he'd be 85 by the time of HN3 (same age as Theodore)

[ripe berry]

yep

[tacit barn]

What if they didn’t work on hello neighbor 3 and finished patch 10

I really watched to see patch 10

[ripe berry]

Theodore and the Historian living as long as they canonically do is a miracle (Historian is said to be the oldest citizen of HN3's Raven Brooks putting her as older then Theodore)

[tacit barn]

I still wonder, why does the guest look so different in hello neighbor 3?

[ripe berry]

no clue, even despite the Guest Lore being expanded on by HN3

[dusty trench]

Or like the ending to raven brooks, and Mr. Peterson. We have focused on there for so long. And we know GA expands outside of Raven Brooks, so we can get stories focusing on what’s happening outside of there. Historian dead, Mr. Peterson most likely dead, old cultist not around and dead, maybe cameo through mention or picture outside of town like people in the future related to one carrying on legacy. Guest can be dead too. New stories within the HN universe, but Raven Brooks story is done. New characters, all outside of town because it’s gone. And it can even be called something different than Hello Neighbor because that makes sense. New stories in the universe of HN, and maybe characters can learn about Raven Brooks through like photos and newspapers, finding out GA came from there. But no mention of too much stuff from Raven Brooks stories, as these are new stories outside of that.

[tacit barn]

Honestly in my opinion I don’t really like the design of the guest in hn3

[ripe berry]

(we STILL don't know who the Guest is though)

[dusty trench]

We are close to figuring out the concept of what Guest design is based off in lore, with Raven Aman festival, and the whole thing about that being related to the entire HN story. Just not the identity of Guest character.

[tacit barn]

Maybe it could be mr petersons brother?

I’m quite confused because in the books they say he has a sister but in the show he has a brother

[dusty trench]

No that was Lisa who was Mr. Peterson’s sister

He has two siblings

[tacit barn]

Oh

His parents built the mayak weather station in the books right

[ripe berry]

yeah

[dusty trench]

Lisa not living in RB anymore. But could be a puzzle matter later on (not sure tho because not too much evidence). Puzzle masters group is Norman Darby, Jay Roth, Miguel Esposito, Ms. Tillman, Rita. Later on Enzo joins them I believe.

[ripe berry]

(I have this poorly made image showing the evolution of the Guest in-universe and how it got twisted overtime)

[dusty trench]

I seen this, and it’s lowkey tuff tho.

Also where is the question mark one from again

[ripe berry]

(as per https://docs.google.com/document/d/15H6d6o9x9KPWlWkfTHauWoY91CS6ow3Ay49r169X7NY/edit?tab=t.0)

[ripe berry]

tickets in SN for the GAAP

[dusty trench]

Alr now I remember

[dusty trench]

Wait then that’s during the park statue then.

[dusty trench]

Also yes

[ripe berry]

I guess they just had two slightly different depictions of the Guest
a cartoonish mascot
and one with more realistic appearance/proporitons

[dusty trench]

Which is kind of common with like Chuck-e-Cheese mascots, and McDonald’s.

[dusty trench]

More realistic probably to depict the history of RB slightly in a way. And stay true to the real Guest, like for his approval or sum.

Even tho Guest don’t work wit em.

[ripe berry]

If I remake this image I'd add the original Guest appearance (HG/HN2 Alphas/GN2/HNVR) and try to find a way to represent that two depictions of the Guest were in use at once (SN Mascot and HE Mascot)
(and also make the graffiti and ritual statue also be represented as depicting the same era of the Guest's history)

[dusty trench]

Oh cool.

OG guest appearance before HN2 Guest design’s. S&R and SN depicting that version of Guest time period.

As his design will be explained in AS.

Weather to t mean his HN2 design with no cloak happens after another incident that happened when he was in his older look, and cloak look of the design is another incident after a previous. And Alex means explain cloak Guest look. Or maybe it will show an incident in n how he got all beat up, and then when he gets cloak all in S3.

And some incident or incidents in 2020’s (2010’s maybe in a way) time period explain his look in HN3.

[ripe berry]

what do you think of this being the new image?

[ripe berry]

(I tried to make it more clearly show the history of the in-universe symbol of the Guest + the character we know of the Guest)

[dusty trench]

I like this. It makes sense.

Maybe the AS Guest park sign can be from before because it is in HN2 on picture. But overall it makes sense placing it there in the time period because of what Cult did to the park, so either way it makes sense.

[ripe berry]

I used the park sign to represent the reopening that'll occur in the AS

[dusty trench]

Ahh

I mean either way, it makes sense

[ripe berry]

and the HN3 GAAP Logo simultaneously represents the original opening of the GAAP and the slightly different design the cutouts and stuff around the GAAP use compared to the corporate art

[marsh idol]

can you put the origins of each iterations

[shell gull]

You can clearly tell he’s been wearing the same sweater from HN2 all the way to HN3, has the same stripes and the red sleeves. It’s just become smaller on him which is why the end of the sleeve is all the way to his elbow. It’s also not baggy anymore, you can tell it’s dirty and has twigs and dirt stuck to it from the Forest. He also tore the left sleeve.

[dusty trench]

Yea many things he has done and gone through led to this. I really am curious and excited to see his origin and character throughout the rest of media like AS and HN3. To understand more of the character that’s been hidden away. And if they can still keep that mysteriousness of him, that’d be perfect.

[wanton roost]

What about this is this important or

[dusty trench]

I theorize Cultist symbol. And we know it was used early on because it’s in S&R asa drawing in Nicky room. So symbol used throughout timeline of how powerful cult views Guest. More like the tale of Guest that’s like supernatural. Seen as a god like figure of sorts. Likely created when Ravens Society started being evil and cult like, greedy and corporate. So like a while after the creation of festival, before cancellation.

[wanton roost]

So this figure is just a symbol?

[dusty trench]

Could be a symbol of what’s under the costume.

[wanton roost]

I thought before that this is what Alex meant of how what guest comes to be

[dusty trench]

Could be a symbol of that.

Maybe the symbol design is of that, is Guest is creature.

[wanton roost]

Maybe

I mean look at it compared to the AS

[dusty trench]

Symbol maybe created by people who see the dark side of town and festival. And cult as we see later on plays in the rumors, so maybe even earlier before they fully start playing into the ghost town thing is thy started spreading the symbol around as a symbol of Raven Man. And the symbol design represents how powerful he is, but it ca even show why he truly looks like which can add in the power thing. That is if he is creature.

[dusty trench]

Well idk if he’s Franklin tbh

There’s some evidence he is. But a ton of evidence he isn’t.

[wanton roost]

Like theo being guest?

[dusty trench]

Franklin most likely dead once you learn about the details.

[dusty trench]

Probably not either. Some people think it’s Mr. Peterson from one of the loops.

[wanton roost]

I mean I don't think we know how deep the pit is who knows maybe before he broke his bones on the fall that pink beam occurs

[dusty trench]

I think you might want to watch these vids

And you can read the discussion which ties directly in. Has some pretty good theorizing.

Discussion starts here

[wanton roost]

Alright ima see them

[limber ridge]

I honestly think it's purely for the uncanon Valley effect Nikita has talked about in previous devlogs.

[limber ridge]

85 isn't too crazy of an age but given all that Teaserpon experienced it's quite a lot (airplane crash and the giant crow statue come to mind)

[charred wharf]

Honestly yeah, I thought he'd be dead earlier considering all of that stress in his life

[vagrant igloo]

uncanon valley is where canon goes to be retconned

[limber ridge]

But that would be outright time travel. In a time loop the characters' minds rewind back, rather than their bodies.

[vagrant igloo]

but so does the environment

[limber ridge]

Yup

[vagrant igloo]

how can just apply it some things but not others 😭

[limber ridge]

Speaking specifically of what happens to characters here because that's what the message i'm replying to is moreso about

[limber ridge]

Hold on they do look scarily similar. That's a good catch. Don't think it's their intention but if so that's a good catch.

I still doubt it's Franklin, because guest's backstory does most likely happen in real time, and The way they're teasing it, it feels like it will be something/someone unexpected.

[dusty trench]

Yea that’s the issue with that theory some people claim. Btw I was just saying it was mentioned before not by me, I don’t really see that.

[limber ridge]

Oh ik.

Just my thoughts on the theory

[dusty trench]

Yea I agree

[limber ridge]

In which book does Aaron draw the island again? Was it bad blood or grave mistakes?

[dusty trench]

Bad blood

[limber ridge]

Ahh. Just the book i'm on.

[dusty trench]

Oh nice re reading them

Traveling through time is interesting as it’s not literally that, it’s more like as the event of the story drive Mr. Peterson so much so he rests the time line, that meaning stuff happens and go against the plan of Mr. Peterson and what he wants timeline to be, so that Mr. Peterson can jus reset it after learning what happened next when they do this. And rings prevent them from forgetting after loop. And when loops happen the try to find quicker ways for the story to move forward and try to prevent something bad from happening like Mya’s death, but they can’t achieve Eve try thing unfortunately. They try to find different ways to move the story forward in the fastest ways possible. The rings having them not forget anything.

[limber ridge]

Hmm. Steampunk looking dial.

Looks like one of the luck devices from the books and pilot

[dusty trench]

Rings from Reset day

[limber ridge]

The one from the pilot is flatter than the book one though and fits a Little better with the gems/rings/whatever else.

[dusty trench]

True

[limber ridge]

The flatter part really makes me feel like it's a part of the luck device.

[dusty trench]

Like how coin luck devices in AS are flat, which fits perfectly to hide behind the coin model.

Hide all the machinery. Once cultist are re opening park.

[limber ridge]

Not in the pilot necesarily, Since it followed a different story from the books.

[dusty trench]

Just a similar vibe

[limber ridge]

Oh btw do we have any info on where the pilot AS could have went or was planned to play out?

[dusty trench]

Ooh, Not really

Maybe some people idk

[limber ridge]

Ok

[dusty trench]

I heard stuff about original idea for AS

[limber ridge]

Hmm. I feel like the kids in pilot don't know about the Ravens yet. There were certain hints to that but i can't remember really.

[dusty trench]

Don’t know if it’s true but, like each episode would be dif perspectives or something kinda like that (dont take it from me cause idk if it’s true).

[limber ridge]

That would have been interesting.

If it was true.

[dusty trench]

Yea

Rings are such an interesting concept, same with ten gem stuff too

[limber ridge]

I think the pilot was meant to be non-canon right?

[dusty trench]

Actually, this could’ve been like a fan idea pitch.

[dusty trench]

I’m pretty sure it was just to set the ground works for an idea of what show could be like.

So not sure.

Like to see if they would run with it.

Or use it as a vibe check for series and characters.

[limber ridge]

Oh yeah. So in a sense it was like an Alpha/beta/demo/prototype.

But for the show.

[dusty trench]

Yea that how I see it

Cause it’s not canon

[dusty trench]

Yea

But ideas could be used, as Alex said Pilot has missing stuff that can show some stuff in lore as an idea for what thy have for ten story.

[limber ridge]

Just imagine If we had gotten something like that for the books.

[dusty trench]

Only thing if that sort is original Missing Pieces cover which used as placeholder teaser later on

[limber ridge]

I kinda like how we didn't because then there'd be just more insanity trying to figure out a scrapped storyline we'd likely never see.

[dusty trench]

And books had no reason to have lol a scrapped storyline in Missing Pieces since it was always ment for games canon lore and what was meant to be presented his in a book view that expands it a little that fits the corner book, and that side of Nicky’s perspective.

[charred wharf]

You write and edit so fast Dark should I be worried 😭

[dusty trench]

You should be, proud, lol

[charred wharf]

But honestly I'm planning to read the books fully (even if I am not a fan of them so far), is there anything that got scrapped from them?

[eager island]

that was for finding a sponsor

if a network had funded them early on, that storyline would have continued

[dusty trench]

Only that MITH was going to be in graphic novel 2 and early scrapped designs.

[charred wharf]

I see!

[dusty trench]

There for, a way for that to tie to other media. Hence missing scenes Alex mentions that would tie stuff together.

Later if a network came, they would turn Pilot into EP1

And of course refine stuff and add those scenes but finished.

Also this was going to happen. As EP1 and AS through out has missing screen to explain stuff. Like a scene name at to be in S2 EP1 where Nicky says you have no idea what happened to, him. Looking at Mayak referring to Franklin.

[limber ridge]

Interesting how they'd know Franklin so early.

[dusty trench]

Nicky specifically, as he was in basement.

Others probably know too tbh an that makes sense. Maybe learn during events of HE, and what S&R and SN show. As they know about Mya’s death and how she dies because of S&R.

[dusty trench]

Also consider the painting in S1 EP1

And it being in Trinity’s mindset.

[dusty trench]

But yea it is interesting

[limber ridge]

So you'd think, but Nicky is the one saying the line where he is asking what happened

[dusty trench]

I was talking about this

[charred wharf]

Sorry I laughed at Trinity's face, she looks very silly there

[dusty trench]

Stern ahh face

[limber ridge]

Nicky is the one saying the line. It implies the other 2 or atleast Trinity learned of that before him.

[limber ridge]

Really sucks that they removed this too because that was one of the scenes i was waiting for most

[dusty trench]

Yea I wish this got implemented. Maybe in re airs.

[dusty trench]

How? He is saying you have no idea what happened there to him which is him saying Trinity and Delroy have no idea what happened. But he does.

[limber ridge]

Re-airs? Oh think i might have an idea of what you're talking about.

This?

[limber ridge]

Ah. I misunderstood it then. So either Trinity heard of it from a newspaper or smth or this is mid a narration of Nicky.

[dusty trench]

Yea like when they planed to re air EP1 to have more of the scenes they plan, but they didn’t and they can do this later on when they get more budget through the kickstarter. And maybe a physical release and pad online version of the show that has these full scene’s, extra scenes, and dialogue. And it has the full picture all in one cohesive understanding, instead of just waiting for later on for how things work. They ca call it like Hello Neighbor Welcome to Raven Brooks full version, and the cover has like extra scenes, dialogue, maybe even enhancements in like the cinematic look a bit, and bonus content like behind the scenes. This content can even reveal stuff we didn’t see in series and reveal stuff that only physical and paid versions have. Like logo at top or bottom of series, with the stuff put on the left or right side but is very noticeable I guess. This seems realistic for Tinybuild imo and there business and even can get series more exposure and have people want to learn more. Also can raise budget later on for stuff cause of sales. I would love a physical version of AS, would literally be peak. Putting that stuff on there cover more noticeable would give people more of a reason to even buy it’s the kickstarter if goes well or some other thing in TB they making many off of, can raise up budget and they can do a ton of things with AS such as something like this.

[limber ridge]

I feel like episode 1 of season. 2 was rewritten rather than just having a scrapped scene.

[dusty trench]

Maybe lol newspaper from HN3 of the kid that I believe to be Franklin, other one to be Archivist. And or maybe seen a family portrait of Franklin, and Nicky explained it to them later on.

[dusty trench]

Maybe

But idk

[limber ridge]

I can't really see a moment where the scene could have fit in If the episode or at least that scene wasn't rewritten.

[dusty trench]

Would Mae some sense tho with the re write thing that happened. They had to tweak ideas for this view in story so it ca fit other better, and juts have a better idea presented in the story for new audience and fans that makes sense.

[limber ridge]

The scene has to be after Delroy appears, because, well, he is there in the storyboard. But when he does appear it's just him and Nicky arguing, if they randomly stopped then decided to resume fighting it would be weird.

[dusty trench]

Which again can go into a paid release like physical copy going out to more audiences like for people who watched free version of show to see a ton more content and lore.

[dusty trench]

Would have to like they calm down for a bit likely cause of Trinity. But Nicky or Delroy or both said or did something that angers one of them and they fight again. Maybe Delroy asking who’s him, or who’s Franklin and Nicky get’s mad and basically says something of like how he shouldn’t be here or apart of this.

[limber ridge]

I guess there is one part. It's when Trinity calms them down the first time. Trinity could talk about how she looked into GAAP and found out of the Franklin incident at the mayak, maybe she suggests the cultist killed him or whatever, then Nicky tries to correct her but Delroy interupts and that's when Nicky mentions he heard stuff at Peterson.

Made a list of HN entries and who's perspective it is, as well as adding how and why the events are twisted from reality in parantheses(i.e. memory, imagination, metaphor etc)

[dusty trench]

Which would mean it have to be in between 8:12 and 8:13 shots. It kinda sounds like a little cut with the dialogue of Nicky saying he heard stuff about past happening pretty quick, shot cutting out fast when it panned out. When Trinity calms them down then what you said happens. Except that she looks into GAAP and Peterson’s history of rides, find out he had a restraining order, a series of incidents thy occurred at parks even GAAP. Then she brings up her finding out about Franklin through newspaper while a storm that happened Halloween day. And suggest it happened at the weather station but doesn’t know exactly how. And then that’s where Nicky explains what happened. Maybe in that scene Nicky is walking while talking out of fear. Like how he is looking at Mayak and it’s like some intense shot where he walks back a bit facing away from them looking dome or sum with Trinity and Delroy looking at him as he explains, which fits AS. And Delroy asks like how do you know this stuffs and that’s where the rest happens.

[dusty trench]

Oh cool. Care to share.

[limber ridge]

Perspectives:
HN1:
Act 1: reality.
Act 2: Nicky (imagination)
Act 3-4: Nicky (symbolical)
Hide and seek: Mya (imagination)
Secret neighbor: kids (imagination)
HN2: Quentin (mostly accurate, missinterpretation where it's not)
HNVR: all kids (imagination and symbolism)
HE: Enzo (memory)
HND: Nicky(Memory)
Nicky triliogy: Nicky (Memory)
Aaron triliogy: Aaron (missinterpretation)
Reset day: Piper (missinterpretation)
Bosco Bay: Jen and Allie (dreams and metaphors)
Raven Brooks Disaster: Regina and Pris (symbolism)
WTRB: Trinity (memory)
Movie: Nicky (unknown)
HN3: Protagonist (Memory)

How accurate would You Say it is?

[wanton roost]

I'm so frickin scared when Alex said "the perspective for the movie you'll see"

[limber ridge]

Oh, what i mean by "missinterpretation" is that the events may be happening in the present but the character misunderstands exactly what was going on, which i'd say would make sense Since as a 8 year old(iirc) child Aaron won't understand exactly everything correctly

[limber ridge]

Think he confirmed it'll be Nicky

[wanton roost]

Well that's good

[dusty trench]

This is actually pretty good of like the overall of what each game shows mostly in that respective medium. I love it 👍. I will not that Piper’s could be misinterpretation mostly, but as of it being through memory or anything like that is unknown.

[wanton roost]

Imbir lore

[limber ridge]

"His" here is referencing Nicky.

[dusty trench]

I feel like Imbir is just observing around a bit. I mean it’s a stray cat just trying to survive. Imbir will help others depending on if they take care of them and convince the cat enough.

[wanton roost]

Do you think it'll just be nicky or the gang as well

[wanton roost]

I think what he said was a joke

[limber ridge]

I think the gang will be there but it'll be Nicky's perspective

[limber ridge]

Yh same

i still think Imbir will legit play a major-ish part.

Just not as an MC or protagonist

[dusty trench]

No I know Imbir isn’t main character or anything like that and yes definitely joke. But I just saying what I believe to be the case which is that Imbir isn’t like that big lil main character or anything of that sort.

[limber ridge]

Would have been cool to be neighbor lowkey

[dreamy sluice]

the hn movie where all you do is watch a cat do cat things and only get glimpses of the rest of the plot in the background

[dusty trench]

Peak

[wanton roost]

He ain't wrong

[limber ridge]

"a world class writer has joined"

[wanton roost]

If it was actually real the only thought I'd have in mind of her being big in the movie is collecting keys lol

[dusty trench]

lol. Or Nicky giving Imbir a treat and Imbir just shows up randomly through out film. Helps Nicky a bit in a direction when Nicky gives Imbir a treat.

[wanton roost]

Or imbir would pull the alien ref from ep 2 s2 if she didn't like the treat

[limber ridge]

Imbir is gonna help Nicky discover all of the secrets behind Raven Brooks

[dusty trench]

Imbir is the twist villian

[wanton roost]

Imbir ate raven brooks

[dusty trench]

Cinema

Creating the Imbir verse instead

[wanton roost]

what if the cult does something with mayak and after one step they get into the building is a half eaten mayak by imbir and they all run away

man I forgot this is lore discussion

[dusty trench]

All of the Mayak power is in Imbir now, and creates not just a town, but an entire universe with the Mayak power. Creating new dimensions, weather, teleportation stuff. Imbir is Hello Neighbor now. Building the cat society instead of the ravens society.

Because Ravens and Cats went into war.

[limber ridge]

Can't believe we all just said "It's lore discussion time" and started Lore discussing all over the place.

[wanton roost]

Imbir ate hello neighbor and changed it to hello neimbir

[dusty trench]

Obviously our goat Imbir would win.

[dusty trench]

Yes really lore relevant.

I think we solved Hello Neighbor 4 guys. Imbir takes over.

[wanton roost]

I dont think hn will never end tbh

[limber ridge]

Im beer is OP lol

[dusty trench]

After HN3 they clear up 2010’s time period and 2020’s time period.

[wanton roost]

Yeah

[dusty trench]

Slowly start adapting hat stuff into movies and books.

[wanton roost]

I think there'll be more games too

[dusty trench]

After they clear up that stuff, they do this after Raven Brooks end.

[dusty trench]

Probably, it makes sense.

4th mainline gave a prequel to HN3.

In 2010’s or late 2000’s

[limber ridge]

I think there'll be more games too, just they won't take place after HN3.

[wanton roost]

A hello mayak would be nice

Roger peterson as the protagonist

[limber ridge]

Real.
"Hello Eyeball"

[limber ridge]

Or Adele.

[dusty trench]

Wait

It’s like HG

But Roger and Adele

And in the past

[limber ridge]

Yeah, what i was thinking.

[wanton roost]

Oh like choosing who we play as

[limber ridge]

Oh wait. Why would Roger or Adele try to break into Mayak? Did they lock it and lose the keys?

[dusty trench]

Yes

[ripe berry]

yo wassup chat
what's the discussion rn?

[limber ridge]

Were there like differences between Beatrix and Quentin other than appearance and cutscenes? I've Heard from somewhere that one was faster and one could jump higher but unsure.

[dusty trench]

Wsp 👋

[limber ridge]

Lehho

[wanton roost]

Heyo idk what were talking about exactly but ig rn like if there was ever a mayak game what would it be about

[dusty trench]

Discussing game idea for a Roger and Adele game

[limber ridge]

Lwk maybe this can continue on #hello-neighbor

[wanton roost]

Roger and Adeles last names are lore

[limber ridge]

Hmm. I wonder what they could be.

[dusty trench]

Y’all wanna move to main discussion

[ripe berry]

Lehho, mai rooy Ieghnrob! Loodeyb, lil ese uyo taler!

[wanton roost]

I'm not sure it's been long since I played it

[vagrant igloo]

as far as I'm aware, no

[dusty trench]

Game can in an open sandbox town setting where Mayak is home base, And you go to Peterson’s at night.The games goal would be to re claim Mayak tech that was stolen and hidden within different cultist houses. How you do it, you decide. You also collect luck devices as a bonus but reason if that Roger and Adele take them apart and take back the Mayak tech stolen within them. You can interact with town folks, attend the town square which they are setting up a festival and you can help. Interact with young Theo Franklin and Lisa when you’re at house. And even Ike. You break into different cultist houses and when bringing tech to Mayak, you actually have to repair the tech and move worse around like HE but instead it’s not like HE. And you can enter others houses as well, helping the set up the festival. Like one way game can happen is helping with festival in all locations like the school, others houses, factory etc. but you have to to gain the trust of Pepe since the Tavish’s broke the deal and no one trust you much in town so it’s like HN3. And later on you go to work and sneak into the cultist house and get the tech and info on the cult and what they worship. Notes and stuff learning some cultist motive’s and the overall reason why. And even notes on when n thy were doing experiments. And when you get all the stuff do Mayak, then you use the Mayak tech to cause a lightning strike onto electrical cords and stuff leading to the Golden Apple factory and burning it. Or you can’t take the tech back and burn it down with gadgets and items to just burn the factory down up close. But either way it gets to when the burn down factory in book to ruin cults business. But they get caught for burning it down anyways. But some police plan to assassinate Roger and Adele in prison since they are cultist. So either Roger and Adele escaoe jail, or get assasinated in jail. But either way they die btw. Just one way last longer. But yea that’s my concept for how it can work.

They can add other stuff like when Norman reaches out to Roger and Adele in game too.

[limber ridge]

Cool ideas that could go to #hello-neighbor as well

[dusty trench]

Yup

[limber ridge]

Which painting?

[charred wharf]

oh I think he means the painting with Theodore and Franklin

[limber ridge]

That's in episode 6 i think.

But yh probably what he's talking about.

[dusty trench]

Yup

[novel oyster]

Question if the neighbor cars destroyed since the accident why is it there and working?

In act 1

[dreamy sluice]

i don't know what implies it was destroyed (if something does i've missed it)

[novel oyster]

The car crash

[dreamy sluice]

car crashes don't always fully destroy a car

[novel oyster]

The neighbors car is destroyed in the dream sequence

[dreamy sluice]

hn1 has a broken car mesh they could've used in said dream sequence

[novel oyster]

We can see it is

[dreamy sluice]

but it's not broken

it's tipped over

[dreamy sluice]

this mesh is used in act 2

[novel oyster]

It is broken same one in act 2

[dreamy sluice]

one second, i'm checking

okay it is broken, my bad

that's weird

"my wife's dying, i gotta go get my second car!"

[novel oyster]

He is an engineer tho so

[marsh idol]

he fixed it

[novel oyster]

[frosty goblet]

Who is the thing do he have a lore

[dusty trench]

the thing is the general metaphorical concept representation of fear in the hello neighbor universe, made for the audience to see. Any “mentions” of it from any character is metaphorical, and every time we see it. It’s actually a message for the audience referring to something else, like something that would cause fear and trauma. Like something bad to happen. Such as Nicky’s mentions of the thing, any portrayal of him “seeing” it, and warning about a shadow. All metaphorical, he isn’t actually saying that. There are many hints within media that show you or little details that tell you that no character is seeing it. Because it isn’t a character per se. It’s why the dark essence Mr. Peterson shadow is a thing. Getting over your fears, stop thinking both traumatic moment, and don’t have fear and trauma take over your mind and fade your memories into nightmares. That’s what we see in act 2 of first game, a memory fogged by corrupted fear.

[frosty goblet]

Oke

Also in the basment then

[dusty trench]

What?

[wanton roost]

Basically just nickys fear

maybe aarons fear too.

[frosty goblet]

Maybe her sister died of him in hide and seek that neighbor game

[wanton roost]

she just died cuz aaron accidentally pushed her

[dusty trench]

Also

Don’t forget

Cult

[wanton roost]

Oh yeah

[frosty goblet]

But nicky is free by aaron trauma like in basment

[dusty trench]

Nicky frees Aaron first seen in AS, and even in first game seen in act 3 and finale. But I can help explain this. Lemme find it first.

But yea Nicky trauma mainly basement

[frosty goblet]

Plus the grief

[dusty trench]

Read these messages by me. Only the text walls, and the short reply at bottom of that.

It’s long text of lore and analyzing

Ties into what you said

[limber ridge]

Fear in general, for Nicky, Aaron, Ted and anyone else.

Giant neighbor however represents Nicky's fear only.

[dusty trench]

The giant neighbor in HN1 is Nicky. The giant neighbor in S&R is dif, but similar in showing a characters fear.

[limber ridge]

Yup

[limber ridge]

Does the one from SaR show the fear of the kids or of Aaron?

[dusty trench]

Both in a way (I believe). Let’s say game is Aaron’s perspective, he would be picturing the rescue squad in like trying to understand there fears. Or is one of the squad members, and it’s of how they view them but through there perspective.

Mainly it’s for rescue squad mostly in the main portrayal. But in who we view it through, that’s up for discussion. But it can be a SN type of situation where it’s multiple, I feel like most pep don’t really talk about it like that. Like it ca partially be like that.

[limber ridge]

I see

Alex in reference to episode 11. What could he have meant by the guest part?

Rn i believe it's something in the black book but maybe there was something else

[dusty trench]

Likely something in the book

And more of what we seen

Of the cultist costumes being like Guest

Hinting at the symbols and imagery the cult centers around, although it’s corrupted.

[limber ridge]

Maybe the questions would have been where or what is going with the guest If he hasn't appeared in S2

[dusty trench]

What if this is a depiction of The Guest, drawing in metaphorical sense. It’s almost like some god like powerful being, like the tales and culture of town but corrupted.

[dusty trench]

Also I remember the old AS lofi stream. Mr. Peterson was drawing in his black book smiling and after a while it would switch to day and night. But it would repeat itself. In the book he was drawing amusement park stuff, stick figures, ravens, combinations like some really hard math, pathways like a map and it has huge X’s, and also scribbles of text just to show he was writing notes. The video is low quality but the animation repeat itself and gets higher quality for a reason ima say in a bit and you can see the stuff very clearly, even in the background. Which in the background was a board, which had pictures of Trinity, Maritza, Enzo, and Nicky. Also binoculars wear hung up, and his shovel is in the back too. But there was something else on the board, and it was literally a drawing of The Guest holding shovel. And it’s of Guest full appearance, which ca show he has more info on him. There’s two second drawing’s on that same paper off to the bottom right thats of Guest beak and his hand. Arrows point at his body to show he is studying Guest, even unseen text to show notes he’s taking. And in the lofi stream I remember that I got I would check back to the stream to see if there was more Easter eggs like in another lofi stream year after the AS one im talking about of Quentin in his chair and it’s an up close version of HN2 main menu and Quentin was sitting in a different position. Only Easter egg there was OST for stuff that was meant to be in patch 10, nothing else. But anyways, someone recorded it and posted it on YouTube right afterwards. The day and nights kept switching and everything was becoming distorted and glitchy, and a mysterious voice taking in the back that was distorted, and said character names. It said Nicky and Trinity 2 separate times. And after separate time said Aaron & Mya in same sentence. Each time the said those names voice got louder, and would also do this weird whisper that’s creepy. And also the voice would breathe hard, and laugh.

https://youtu.be/tyUGaOBkz4o?si=SZVdpgsxRLGabXGr

Here’s the vid of that segment at and all the other stuff I said. This was the only weird lore event that happens during the stream. Other than that it’s cool scenery with TB references and even he has pizza and box of speedrunners bars next to his old computer, and some totally reliable packages in the back. Stream would play random OST from HN and even old and iconic soundtracks.

[limber ridge]

This image could also be what Alex was talking about when he said we saw the guest in a way. This, and that one cultist from typical Raven behaviour are all my main suspects.

[dusty trench]

Why specifically that cultist?

[limber ridge]

Beak open. Differentiates him a Little from other cultists.

He generally looks different from others, gray cloak, lighter beak.

[dusty trench]

Hold on that is true

Good catch

[limber ridge]

What is interesting about that one is that instead of following the kids, like just about every other one, he runs from them.

[potent harness]

Hold up

let him cook?

[limber ridge]

Not really my catch. More browny really. The thing about the chase is mine though.

[dusty trench]

Both of ya’ll clocked that

[limber ridge]

That's a very random detail but...
It's something to note.

[dusty trench]

It’s like that one looks like, professional, almost like the real deal. I’m pretty sure when Alex posted picture of that, he later referred it as Guest (iirc in that sentence). The beak is actually open and we see it closed at some shots too, unlike cultist who only have they’re back positions to look normal, or like a smirk of sorts, but thats an illusion to make it seem like that because of camera angles. Like when cultist is laughing encountering Ivan and Mr. Murtaugh, the camera is positioned to make it look like that cultist is smiling. And even that person in EP1 is more professional like, with all the ravens coming out of nowhere circling and then attacking kids all of them having scratch marks, and it begins to storm and rain, also the poof smoke as it disappears, it’s really like more professional even with the looks unlike the cultist which are just copying and have a kinda worn down, a little beat up gray cloak. But that one’s looks fitted nice, clean, and not worn at all. More of a dark mysterious look than cultist, which are like a copy. Fits the follower narrative. Also, that’s like the most we hear crooking noises, while the cult is voices in costume don’t really sound bird and when they do make noises it’s still more like a grunt, and you ca hear the human. So that character we get introduced to in S2 EP1 isn’t a cultist after all. It’s our GOOSEY BOY (maybe).

[limber ridge]

I don't think he's the guest already.

[dusty trench]

Understandable

[potent harness]

Wait, but...

If that's the case... then who the hell is this "Crow Face" supposed to be?

[dusty trench]

One of other cultist from another media (maybe other media or a random). Dale Tapps, Gordon Cleave, or officer Keith.

[dusty trench]

Honestly I still don’t either but I never really thought about that. I always thought EP1 of S2 had a different vibe than the rest. Partly because of the flashback, and it being most important episode rn because of flashback.

[limber ridge]

I think maybe Gerda.

[potent harness]

Bruh

Gerda is literally labeled right there next to Abanante

[limber ridge]

That's the one that was feeling agressive and wanted to kill Maritza right of the bat(ha see what i did there?) no?

Aggresivity fits Gerda.

[dusty trench]

Oh because she is aggressive

[dusty trench]

Right as I sent lol

[limber ridge]

Can be anyone though.

Harold, Gordon, Dale, etc.

[dusty trench]

I mean, we didn’t hear the other 2 standing next to Abenante’s voice, they were just standing there the whole time. While we heard Mayor, Abenante, and that one.

[limber ridge]

Granted, they should be arrested by now(Gordon and Dale) so maybe Harold or Keith.

[dusty trench]

Which yea, honestly fits Gerda. And maybe Leslie. But also think about the fact that Gerda while meant to be in S3, is confirmed not in there anymore. So that can be Gerda.

Other too being most likely Harold or Keith because of what you said.

[potent harness]

Yeah we've heard Abanante, Mayor and "Crow Face"

[limber ridge]

The way i'd have it though, the fist cultist is Gerda, and The second to right one is Tavish maybe or someone else.

[dusty trench]

That’s what I said

[potent harness]

I know

[dusty trench]

K

[limber ridge]

Why does Abanante feel like such a leader figure though. You'd think that would be the role of the Mayor.

[potent harness]

I like to think that both of them share the leader role

[dusty trench]

That is interesting.

[limber ridge]

And Abanante is just more decisive?

[dusty trench]

Yea, he does speak up more while taking a bit that episode.

[potent harness]

and that Gerda and Leslie are just their lackeys

[dusty trench]

He seems like the calm leader, while Abenante is more stricter. I mean makes sense, as she deals with children all day for her job.

[dusty trench]

Gerda grouped them together

[limber ridge]

The mayor's first line in that scene is "we know your secrets, neighbor"(wait is the Mayor neighbor to Esposito family?), which isn't like any order or any statement on what to do with Maritza. Just like a neutral statement. Then the fist cultist wants to kill her and Abanante is the one to decide what they do to her.

[dusty trench]

When they were kids because of Halloween newspaper (theory).

[limber ridge]

Interesting. Leslie and Gerda are also the ones that "really" killed Franklin.

[potent harness]

I imagine that Gerda was just an innocent girl who got drawn into their friend group and they ended up being a bad influence on her

[dusty trench]

Maybe it’s like because Abenante in their eyes has been just the calm principal, but is now a traitor so it’s like she is more evil than the others.

[limber ridge]

Tbf that feels more like Leslie.

[potent harness]

kinda by accident

[limber ridge]

Well yeah.

[limber ridge]

A traitor how?

[dusty trench]

Not like that, but like how they never knew she was a cultist.

And figuring that out is a shocker, and they feel even less safe knowing thy go to school being run by a evil cultist.

[limber ridge]

It's really interesting how Abanante was trying to stop Trinity from breaking in Teaserpon's basement despite the fact that cult is against him.

[limber ridge]

Oh, like a perspective thing right?

[potent harness]

I wonder what crimes she committed that day

[dusty trench]

Wasn’t thinking that, but yea that can work

[tribal talon]

I am in chemistry class

[limber ridge]

Cool.

[dusty trench]

Robbed a clothing store

[dusty trench]

Nice

Or actulay, she has a ton of money from her cult business so the crime as that she bought something using money of the greedy work she has done.

[potent harness]

Also it was so sus how she just walked outta there with two whole bags in her arms

[charred wharf]

I just know Trinity felt awkward after this, I always hated seeing my teachers and principals in the bathrooms for some reason 💔

[limber ridge]

Need somewhere to store that corpse in.

[potent harness]

Abanante's presence alone was enough to distract her from asking about the bags

[dusty trench]

Wait. Feather falls from her. She just got out of cultist attire. Doing the dirty cult business all night underground, hidden vent that leads to bathroom she was able to put attire in her bags.

[potent harness]

Nah we all know she just flushes the corpse away

[charred wharf]

True !

[wanton roost]

Any lore we talking about today?

[limber ridge]

Mmm

aybe

[dusty trench]

Hello Nibor is real guys

[limber ridge]

Naighbir*

[dusty trench]

Yes

[limber ridge]

Niaghbior*

Ok i'll stop.

[dusty trench]

lol 💀

[dusty trench]

What if this is a hint at Guest voice that’s distorted.

[potent harness]

Naybur*

[charred wharf]

Omg..

[dusty trench]

lol

[limber ridge]

I wonder why he's calling out to Nicky so agresively. I can understand Trinity, but Nicky?

[shy blaze]

Good gift for neighbours

😮‍💨

[dusty trench]

Him bringing up Nicky to the rescue squad in an aggressive way since kind of like in GN2 metaphorical portrayal, Guest playing with there fears by bringing them up. Like he brings up how Trinity lost Nicky and how she betrayed him to play with her mind a bit by bringing up her fears and mistakes. Would honestly fit Guest character a bit from what we’ve seen in like S&R, portrayal in SN, and GN2 a bit. And even HN2 like he is angered. And he can be bringing it up out of rage to like play with rescue squads fears further if she like angers him. And he could bring it up to Mr. Peterson too, would add onto S&R and GN2 a bit more. And lol if they fight, Guest brings it up out of rage since he’s angered and tries to make him feel weakened by his fears and mistakes.

[dusty trench]

Yes. THE best gift for your neighbors.

[limber ridge]

If i knew there were many deleted scenes in wtrb i'd try to find out where they could be but that's too long of a rewatch and most could probably only be small lines or more still frames/extra angles.

Most probably means like 99%.

[ripe berry]

Wait
wait WAIT WAIT WAIT
so in Hello Neighbor 2 there's only 3 houses that even qualify for being the Esposito Household if it's the Mayor saying that
BUT only one of them is noteworthy because it's a household with NOT ONE, BUT TWO OF MJ/MITH'S TAPES
(specifically the Red and Blue Tapes)

[limber ridge]

Espositos are also like fairly rich. Is one of the houses more rich-looking?

[ripe berry]

no (or well maybe, idk what qualifies for a "rich looking background house" when all of them get repeated a bunch)
but then again this is Hello Neighbor 2
they couldn't even be bothered to make a proper model for Nicky's House

[limber ridge]

Red and blue are colours that very much remind me of Enzo and Maritza.

[ripe berry]

however I will note the house with the two tapes has the most stuff outside of it of the 3 potential options

it has a bunch of planter boxes with bushes and flowers in the back, some of what looks like construction work going on on the side of it, and a few props outside such as a bike.
the other two background houses that are Neighbor's to the Mayor's have nothing in comparison (metal fence and normal-looking bushes)

which of these three would you most see as the potential Esposito Household

[charred wharf]

Either the first or third one, honestly..? Unsure though

[limber ridge]

Green, just from what i see, the least likely.

[ripe berry]

Same, I'm saying the third one here because it's the one with the implied plot importance due to having two of the tapes lol

[limber ridge]

Also red.

Beautiful re- wait.

That one house from HN1 is also red.

The one you theorised is Smith's.

[ripe berry]

and if you're wondering why Miguel Expsotio potentially having two of MJ's tapes is important
just read this old document from 2023, it doesn't explain everything but it should introduce you to some of the ideas being thrown around
https://docs.google.com/document/d/15H6d6o9x9KPWlWkfTHauWoY91CS6ow3Ay49r169X7NY/edit?tab=t.0

[charred wharf]

Honestly I doubt anyone would have two kids in a house like this 😭

[limber ridge]

Eh.

[charred wharf]

Frigid you good? 💔

[limber ridge]

I could see it.

[charred wharf]

Sorry but the Danganronpa sprite jumpscared me

[ripe berry]

WAIT YEAH
Although (and I know maps change on the regular with HN, as Raven Brooks has like 5 different layouts) the potential MitH house is behind Theodore's in HN1 while the potential Esposito Household is behind Nicky's (or where Nicky's would be if they had given it a unique model for HN2)

[charred wharf]

I mean, aren't Nicky and Enzo friends? It would be most likely if they lived not so far away

[ripe berry]

That too

[charred wharf]

Also the fact Maritza was best friends with Mya and Lucy, I'd genuinely just assume they live nearby

[ripe berry]

ALSO, in the AS, when the Inventor's Club walk home from school, they're still all together when passing by Trinity's House, which at the very least implies wherever Enzo and Maritza DO live can be reached relatively quickly by passing through Friendly Court (or at the very least they haven't reached their houses yet by the time they reach Friendly Court)

[charred wharf]

Yeah!

[limber ridge]

Would also imply Delroy and Ivan live close-ish.

[charred wharf]

I wonder where Ivan's parents are ngl

[ripe berry]

and what's one of the first things we learn about Ivan in the AS?
He's met Mr. Peterson directly.

[charred wharf]

Honestly?? I feel like he did try to talk to him about all of the tinkering stuff, maybe he was interested?

I'd assume Theodore just turned the entire thing down and maybe even said something threatening to him

[ripe berry]

ALSO ain't it mighty suspicious Delroy just happened to be roaming the tunnels under Raven Brooks in AS Ep. 3?
Even if he's not directly a part of the cult, there's still something going on with him we haven't been told

[limber ridge]

Y'know, the cult did somehow someway know where the kids were during episode 10.

[ripe berry]

(tldr; the books are part of a time loop and some people in Raven Brooks know, with the document specifically pointing out Theodore, Norman Darby, and Jay Roth, but implying that Ike, Miguel Esposito, Rita Ryland (minor books character) and Ms. Tillman (due to Reset Day) might also be aware)

[ripe berry]

but at the same time Delroy and his family definitely don't have the best relationship with the Cult if they ARE a part of it
after all the whole incident with his Dog... Dog...

(why can't you be creative with names Delroy)

[glacial whale]

I’ve named my cats cat so I thought it was cool of Delroy to do that

[ripe berry]

...fair.

[glacial whale]

Yea I get your point though

Sorry did I derail the conversation

[ripe berry]

not at all no

[charred wharf]

I'd be more worried if he named his dog "lizard"

[limber ridge]

Which pet wins in a fight though, Dog or Kibbles?

[charred wharf]

Do we even know what Kibbles is 😭

[ripe berry]

(or well there's actually 5 background houses that could be labelled as the Mayor's "Neighbor" (and therefore could technically be the Esposito Household) but 2 of them are on the edge of the map, reuse the Green and Red House Models, and have literally nothing, not meant to be reachable at all in gameplay, so I'd rather choose the Red House that has props then the Red House that doesn't and also isn't even meant to be reachable)

[charred wharf]

Some ppl say Kibbles would be a bunny or smth

[charred wharf]

Honestly true

[limber ridge]

Fertilizer currently, i'd imagine.

[charred wharf]

DUDE

[ripe berry]

💀

[charred wharf]

Oh my god😭

I like to think of Trinity having a job as a paper girl, so maybe it was a dog or something similar..?

[limber ridge]

Trinity feels more like she'd have a cat imo.

[charred wharf]

Maybe?

[tribal talon]

the green one eminds me of the GreenhouseM13 house in the first game

[ripe berry]

yo uh @dusty trench sorry for the ping but just making sure you notice this part of the conversation when you come back online

(I know the tapes are surrounded by feathers and put in literal nests so I could be reading this completely wrong but still just figured it was a noteworthy idea)

[limber ridge]

@ripe berry How accurate would You say this is?

[ripe berry]

I'd say pretty well

[limber ridge]

Any corrections?

[ripe berry]

not really no

[shy blaze]

yea

[dusty trench]

Yea I can see this being the case, I like this theory. And even the stuff you pointed out about the kids lie where they’re walking is interesting too, including how cult would know where all of them are. Also something to consider is the fact raven brooks is said small town, an how like everyone knows each other and know where most people live but yea I can see this.

[ripe berry]

yeah, guess it just depends on how you view the evidence ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[wanton roost]

I just noticed something guys

[dusty trench]

Ooh I seen that, always thought it was strange how similar they are

Wait

[wanton roost]

the broken glass on the top of nickys window and the glass at the bottom is aarons

[dusty trench]

What if during S2, Aaron has encounters Nicky we just hevent seen it. Or like checked up on him.

[wanton roost]

what do us lore people think about this..

[wanton roost]

hmmm maybe

we will probably know about smth like that in season 3 about aaron since he's very important there

[limber ridge]

The first one i think is on HND, but in which window?

[dusty trench]

Just won’t be present, atleast not fully. Maybe his shadow animation like in S1.

[dusty trench]

Yes

[dusty trench]

Oh Aaron’s house

Missing Pieces ending

[wanton roost]

Aaron

[wanton roost]

Maybe or more creaking doors signifying him

[dusty trench]

And characters mentioning it’s him or mentioning him like cult or Guest, since I even theorizes that the voice in the lofi vid I sent above could be distorted Guest audio.

And it mentions Aaron and Mya.

[limber ridge]

If that's true the guest must be connected to those 4 kids he named in some way.

[dusty trench]

AS Trinity’s perspective. Mentions Nicky to kind of get in Trinity’s mind a bit and play with her fears and remind her of what she did to him. And same with Peterson maybe but probably mentions Aaron and Mya to Mr. Peterson, or something cool is he also mentions Aaron and Mya to Trinity too hinting at the Aaron trilogy. Maybe near like the ending of AS.

[wanton roost]

Even theo "I miss my boy

[dusty trench]

Trying to get into Trinity’s head to release him.

Which he succeeds.

[wanton roost]

I still wonder how she will be free the most likely is the bars

And her friends will probably reunite

[dusty trench]

Police maybe

[dusty trench]

At first just grouping together maybe on accident while at park. And then they get the motive to group whether by building something for inventors club.

[wanton roost]

not sure tbh no one was watching trinity when she easily entered in ep 7

[charred wharf]

Honestly, what kind of Police doesn't notice a girl sneaking in to talk to a guy 😭

also nobody was guarding anything, he just walked out

[wanton roost]

Yeah

[dusty trench]

Yea fr lol

[charred wharf]

dude imagine when they finally check in only to find a 14 year old in there

man, Theodore sure changed a lot!

[wanton roost]

I'd keep her in

[charred wharf]

Why 😭

my emoji.. istg okay

[wanton roost]

Risked her friends to an urge of death

She got maritza ganged up by birds man

[charred wharf]

honestly true, but that's still a kid 😭

[wanton roost]

I am not freeing that girl if she did that to me

[charred wharf]

i'd honestly blame the parents since they refuse to get her actual therapy and move towns instead

[wanton roost]

Thinking about being jumped by a group of birds actually sounds super damn crazy

[charred wharf]

and they decided to send her to a boarding school as if it will change anything

[dusty trench]

It just shows how many people get away with crimes anyways that not much people are in jail within Raven Brooks. Vandals around, cult members even being in police force, and all around town. They don’t worry much about the crimes in town because pf they’re shady business work and crimes committed behind the scenes. They mainly worry if someone or the crime is going against them or if it benefits them, such as Roger and Adele, and Mr. Peterson. It’s really shows how they just are careless, even the higher authority in town. They only exits to keep everyone in town contained and within their trap, making it feel safe when in reality it’s not. It’s all big stage play in Hello Neighbor, people fighting for control, and people fighting for freedom.

[wanton roost]

Back in the season 2 hype days I think we all thought we'd get a therapy episode

[dusty trench]

Even Jail looks pretty, empty.

[charred wharf]

tbh I don't like the show because of how they made the characters act, sure they fleshed them out but - not in the greatest way imo

[charred wharf]

exactly 😭 the entire town is just corrupt atp

[dusty trench]

Yea, it only gets worse by HN3 vandals are really present.

[wanton roost]

She should've sent her back to boarding school in the first place right after they blamed her and her friends for burning the house down

Episodes later you see them drinking coffee and biscwuits

Like nothing even happened

[charred wharf]

I feel like they either ignore the problems or blame their daughter for them (Her mom, mostly - her dad just agrees with her 😓 )

[dusty trench]

I feel like that intentional, like relating to Trinity’s perspective. Since AS she is putting herself in Nicky’s shoes, like going through what he went through in a way. Trapped in her own fear, and feeling consequence so she can grow better.

[wanton roost]

You probably right but trinity trying to grow is whole different level

[dusty trench]

Also can tie into them in S&R pushing the timeline forward so act 3 can happen. Which is what Aaron freeing Nicky shows.

[dusty trench]

Wdym whole dif level.

[wanton roost]

She got one of her friends kidnapped by a cultist to almost getting her boyfriend ran over to almost getting herself ran over by a truck over a damn book and is kind of responsible for Ivan looking at his favourite teacher that gave him a b+ die violently

[charred wharf]

She didn't know cultists would show up, did she tho??

[dusty trench]

Yea

Part of it being influenced form when they were in loop in HE.

It’s her looking back at that time

[limber ridge]

Tbf they all kinda agreed to go. When they all leave in episode 7 She doesn't even scream at them.

[dusty trench]

He didn’t but, still got her friends into it.

[charred wharf]

but yeah, what she did is pretty messed up (which is why I don't like the AS, she isn't fit as a leader). She's still just a 14 year old, and at the same time others did it willingly if you look at this in this way

[wanton roost]

she wanted to know who crowface is and forced everyone to go out looking for him even if there was one crowface one of her friends would be in grave danger

[charred wharf]

I know they could've trusted her with this stuff but cmon, they had free will in this

[dusty trench]

Yea good point. She realizes what she kind of did.

[charred wharf]

I didn't watch the AS in a while, I might forget some stuff

[charred wharf]

exactly 😭

not everything is solely her fault

[dusty trench]

Her friends are responsible too, as we even see in books, and even in AS.

[limber ridge]

The AS has many problems but i don't think this is really that bad because it's not like Trinity is being put in a positive light and shown as a good leader. She is facing consequences for actions. Now if She doesn't have any redemption or doesn't make an apology, i'm eating my words.

[charred wharf]

Tbh it's quite a mystery what the writers can do

[wanton roost]

they are DEAD

[charred wharf]

you saw how they butchered Enzo and gave him a braincell at the very end of the season, I am worried he's gonna turn into a puppy following her around once again

[dusty trench]

Well she can have redemption. They can all have redemption, as they set the events for the future to happen.

Lemme find that stuff hol up

[dusty trench]

Guest will take everyone out

[limber ridge]

Nah.

[dusty trench]

I know quoting Alex

[limber ridge]

Alex meant that as in he could take everyone down.

[dusty trench]

Yep

[limber ridge]

Oh my bad.

[dusty trench]

It’s fine your good

[dreamy sluice]

this is why forest dweller has metal beak

[wanton roost]

"They'll be fine just like nickt"

[limber ridge]

5 episodes. They already have to explain the mayak and Guest in those, reunite the team and introduce Finch somehow.

[dusty trench]

Why did it take me so long to type that 😭

[wanton roost]

My heavens I ain't know it was even metal

[charred wharf]

those are metal..?

[potent harness]

PFFT-

I read that as mental beak

[dreamy sluice]

you gotta get close to guy's face to see it, but yeah

[charred wharf]

the beak that makes you mentally ill

[dreamy sluice]

it appears to be a metal beak painted yellow

you can see scuff marks around the edges

going silver

[dusty trench]

Maybe Finch encounters them after hearing about what happened to Nicky getting set to mental facility. And Trinity agrees to like befriend her. And also interestingly, they hint at them being somewhat trusting in AS because Trinity asks Finch where Nicky is of all people.

[dreamy sluice]

and it has some kind of like

cord type thing going through it

[limber ridge]

You know what would be really cool, If in episode 17 or 18, before the kids go into Mayak, Trinity says what Ted said to Franklin and tells them they don't have to do this.

[dreamy sluice]

i can't send images, i have no embed

[potent harness]

Just like Nicky

[wanton roost]

plot twist" after episode 5 episode guest will release

[dusty trench]

Ooh

[dreamy sluice]

nicky roth found out the beak was metal

[charred wharf]

I made a gif of him smashing the window give me a sec 😭

[limber ridge]

I thought they were strings at first but i think they're like... Rods?

[limber ridge]

And they lied about 18 episodes...

[charred wharf]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1445764064625033394/1448737306180587615/ezgif-4e0678461da221cb.gif

Why is he like this

[dreamy sluice]

they get longer when the beak opens

i think they're like

think they're called tension cords?

[wanton roost]

What if those white lines on his mouth is the bars from where trinity got locked in and guest ate em and now some of em are stuck on his beak/j

[dreamy sluice]

iunno

[dusty trench]

These streak of text walls can tie into what I’ve said above.

[dreamy sluice]

that's some fragile wood

[charred wharf]

termite 🐜

[limber ridge]

Tbf Nicky does can super throw so

Wait.

Was that actually intented as a super throw reference?

[wanton roost]

I'm still locked in on this

[limber ridge]

I think Alex said we would at some point. But he was most likely joking.

Here

But i think it was a joke because soon before that someone said they'll animate their own series If we get AS news

[wanton roost]

yeah.. those were good times

[dusty trench]

Also this is can tie into the other kids doing stuff already since hey hint at them being curious. Finch being asked where Nicky is by Trinity, also Finch walking around at night why would she. Delroy being in tunnels and claiming to Nicky that he knows stuff too, Ivan encountering Peterson but not wanting to speak about it. Eve Maritza being next to a photo of Lucy in S1. And then showing Maritza and Enzo’s dad, but their dad matches description of him in books. Even them referencing no one in town believing Nicky, except Trinity who caches on first like in books. But no one believing him, is kind of like when Nicky was framed for stuff in Raven Brooks. Like the mannequins being placed where he went, stuff under his bed. And no one not even Maritza believing him, and being like uncomfortable to be around him. And Trinity is the last one to not believe him, paralleling AS when she did what he’d in to Nicky. And what I mentioned about Guest above and how they can reveal the fact of AS fitting in, even of all the other stuff about AS being distorted and fogged by fear of Trinity but even her trying to understand her friends, why there’s Enzo and Maritza mom present, like how thy wish they had their mom with her. Ivan not wanting to speak up about what he experienced with Mr. Peterson. Delroy trying to be friend so why Nicky in S2 EP1, like he is trying to redeem himself. And Finch too feeling bad about how she treated Nicky. AS exaggerates some stuff based on the characters, and we view it in Trinity’s mindset.

Also

[dusty trench]

This would be an interesting thing to be in S3

And tie into this stuff too.

[limber ridge]

Delroy and Finch lowkey seem friendly/respectul to Trinity.

[limber ridge]

I sorta... Hope not.

It would all be very cool but they already have a lot to wrap up in 5 episodes, each likely 10-14 Minutes, maybe 16 If we really really stretch it.

[potent harness]

Delroy is somewhat chill with her

Finch seems to only tolerate her

[dusty trench]

Probably not exactly like a therapist, but like a reference to like self therapy. Or Theo and Guest say some stuff that basically reveal that, like your trapped within your own fears and trapped within a moment. It can reveal loops and reveal the fact of Trinity and the Ganesh being consumed by fear.

Without showing future, to fit in more stuff since it’s 5 episodes.

[limber ridge]

Idk. Trinity decided to ask Finch specifically for where the rest of the club was iirc.

[wanton roost]

Burn finch

[limber ridge]

Maybe.

[dusty trench]

Specifically Nicky

[limber ridge]

Have her get shocked by the mayak thing.

[limber ridge]

I think She named Enzo and Maritza

[dusty trench]

Honestly some cook disputes like that would fit Theo’s character, and I already explained Guest above how it ca work.

[limber ridge]

Yeah. Peterson is the best part of the show.

[dusty trench]

FR tho

[limber ridge]

Both because his lines hit hard and because Armen is excelent at Voice acting.

[wanton roost]

Yes let her die

[dusty trench]

Oh lord 💀✌️

[limber ridge]

I'd rather a redemption but i just know they're not doing it.

If they do a proper redemption arc for Finch, i'm gonna try to find the error world in real life.

[potent harness]

I like to think that Trinity and Finch are in the same class

[limber ridge]

Yeah but all the other kids from season 1 also seem like that.

(backround kids, i mean)

[wanton roost]

Delroy in the cooool kids class where all the cool kids belong all pippin coolll

Finch In the hell class

[limber ridge]

Yeesh.

Am i trippin or did Alex actually Say the kids are aged up in wtrb?

[wanton roost]

Wdym by aged up

[dreamy sluice]

they're all in their 20s in season 1 trust

[limber ridge]

Like they made them older

[limber ridge]

Lol

That's funny to think about.

[wanton roost]

Probably those therapy episodes hype lol

[potent harness]

Yeah they're all 37

[wanton roost]

Dang man they friends with a 7 Yr old that died

[limber ridge]

Found it!

[dusty trench]

I mean either way, they get close enough. Like even I theorized that Nicky blinds they set the eights of act 3 to happen, as he portrays Aaron saving him. And even late Ron he portrays other events too, like Aaron escaping in act 3, which I theorized because of many details and key points that fit AS. And while he doesn’t portray his friends much, there is hints of stuff. Even the puzzle masters too. Also HND he would learn more.

[wanton roost]

I think in the books they're younger

Maritza is 11

[limber ridge]

In the books they're like 12-13

[wanton roost]

And in the AS they are middle schoolers

[limber ridge]

Minus Maritza and Mya, they are like 10-11

Isn't 12-13 middle school already?

So that would make Trinity for example, a minimum of 14.

[wanton roost]

So maritza is 13

Abd Enzo maybe 15? Idk 14

[limber ridge]

Where i am 14 is still middle school but idk If it's the same in wherever they are.

[limber ridge]

She could be 12.

[dusty trench]

14 cause middle school

[limber ridge]

Although, aging up by 1 year only is very redundant of You ask me.

[wanton roost]

I'm gon be 15 in like a month and I'm a 9th grader so im still middle school

[limber ridge]

Yk what, i'll just pretend Alex thought the kids were 10-12 in the books and move on with my life.

[dusty trench]

Even the aging up can show what I talked about above. And the thing of losing track of time. The cell phones, which can also show the tech and even hint at loops in a way that’s metaphorical, representing the actual time periods and how RB has been manipulated by the experiments of time and other stuff.

[limber ridge]

Sheesh Man, Dark knows how to say stuff that can tie into anything.

[potent harness]

https://tenor.com/view/stare-gif-3613293371727723981

You know what you're doing

[dusty trench]

lol, gotta find connections

[limber ridge]

I think You were present when Alex said he aged them up.

Just shapeshifted.

As leakstacks

[limber ridge]

Oh now i get it.

[wanton roost]

Let's talk.. lore

[limber ridge]

...sure

[dusty trench]

Yep (I think). Remember seeing it back then don’t remember where.

[limber ridge]

What Lore do we have?

[wanton roost]

so what exactly is also in the mayak

Except the tunnels

or what is the tunnels also connected to

[limber ridge]

The tunnels might be connected to Ted's basement honestly.

Was gonna Say why does Ted have his house built on the base of his enemies.

[wanton roost]

Probably especially the AS and sn basement I have a feeling it's alot more

we know the school is also connected

[limber ridge]

But remember the house was of Roger and Adele too before.

[dusty trench]

Bruh I want sending lore

[limber ridge]

Tsk tsk tsk

Smh with these bots Man.

Not neighborly at all

[dusty trench]

Fr

[dusty trench]

Yes bro, I’m sending lore

Ima send them slowly, and fewer attaches

[limber ridge]

Go ahead

[wanton roost]

The mayak?

wait really? I didn't know that

[limber ridge]

No, Ted's house. It was of Roger and Adele before.

[wanton roost]

Ohh

[potent harness]

I'm calling it now...

One of Season 3's episodes will be called "Rise of The Guest"

[dusty trench]

This can even tie into hinting at the events of the time loops and experiments. Became HE and SN stuff is here and other notes from game, and even similar stuff. Because why would they be there so early on? Because they aren’t. Btw there’s more images coming.

[wanton roost]

Or season 3 won't have a guest episode at all it's outside of that it isn't season 3 it's just gonna be..

Guest episode

[dusty trench]

That’s all

[limber ridge]

Guest episode will actually be so long it'll count as it's own season.

[wanton roost]

If it happens Worth the wait

A whole hour of guest episode yes please

[limber ridge]

And we'll see stuff from guest's perspective.

[wanton roost]

I wonder what the guest does when he takes everyone out especially the kids

If they gonna be fine like nicky

[limber ridge]

He won't take everyone out.

Ngl i don't buy teleportation stuff.

[dusty trench]

On maybe, what if they say kids are in loop or like trapped within there own fears, maybe show the investigation board, and show clock portrayal and even show tech of stuff in Mayak by characters using it or showing the blue print’s, and kids can have they’re investigation stuff from the class room shown too. But it never actually shows the events of like HE sandbox fully, but kind of. Since it’s fogged by fear. So get show the loop and teleportation in a different way.

[wanton roost]

Teleportation is a strong word.. for tjis

[dusty trench]

The devices

The machines Peterson uses to teleport the kids somewhere where they are trapped in loop.

They literally transported

[limber ridge]

Oh, that makes more sense.

[dusty trench]

His board has like a warping thing.

[wanton roost]

Like the one from secret neighbor?

[limber ridge]

So like not to a different location, but to a looped timeline sort of?

I know there were theories of pockets dimensions.

[dusty trench]

SN hints at this with the teleporting machine, I discussed this before taking about the island experiments.

So yes.

[wanton roost]

That makes alot more sense

[limber ridge]

Pocket dimensions could be like localized time loops maybe.

[dusty trench]

So maybe since it’s fogged by fear, and because it’s a dif view, they won’t show the getting transported to island or anything like that how HE does. But reveals the loops and the fact of fear fogged memory and losing track of time no in a different way in AS. Maybe showing picture of island.

Like books.

This entire discussion. Super long but it ties in directly to this entire discussion.

[wanton roost]

Ima go sleep guys

[dusty trench]

Alr gn ✌️

[wanton roost]

I'm tired and tomorrow is school I don't want a b+

Goodnight all fine theorists

[dusty trench]

Ivan reference

[limber ridge]

Browny Lore is real

Browny is smarter than Ivan.

Gn as well. It's nearing 12 midnight.

[dusty trench]

Alr gn ✌️

[charred wharf]

Don't be like Ivan.. Gn Browny!

[ripe berry]

GN2 You!

[ripe berry]

wait yeah
I remember getting into a debate at some point about if the "Dream Car" being visible here prevented Hello Engineer from being canon to the AS

(not sure if it was here or somewhere else though)

[dusty trench]

Well everything is canon. This I believe is showing the fact of listing track of time. Hinting at how we see loops portrayed in HE, even related to the kids minds. Like they might reveal loops differently in AS because fogged by fear.

[ripe berry]

I think at the time I originally thought
"this definitely contradicts the lore"
but then found that it somewhat worked by going through the HE Intro frame by frame (obligatory MatPat joke here)?
#hello-neighbor message

[dusty trench]

Also, what if Mr. Murtaugh was researching what kids were experimenting and researching since he doesn’t know what they are really experimenting with so he is curious and just trying it out. Because he is always watching them and peeping in, just trying to understand his students

[dusty trench]

Oh yea Enzo drawing card on a board

[ripe berry]

bc like
Enzo has the idea to get the parts from the Park basically immediately, then scraps it, then later the Inventor's Club decides "wait, this could actually work"

[dusty trench]

Ooh

Yea that works

[ripe berry]

as pointed out in the specific message from that conversation I linked

[ripe berry]

also notice this is NOT 1:1 with the Dream Car in-game
It's missing the Guest Statue on the front

[dusty trench]

Yes I notice

Always interested me

They can still reveal loops differently tho.

In a way that fits AS view

Also its event are fogged by fear and the mindset exaggerated.

[ripe berry]

I mean yeah
AND you provided more evidence that the AS is likely a memory
as things exist that shouldn't yet (like the trophies)

[dusty trench]

And you added more context on the time period which adds into what said about Mr. Murtaugh right above.

[ripe berry]

also pretty sure the camera never shows that corner of the room with the trophies when Mr. Peterson was a kid, which makes it further feel intentional

[dusty trench]

Yea, everything is different that time period.

Even the investor club logo

[ripe berry]

the teleportation device from SN is also missing in 1950s Inventor's Club

and actually, nice bit of continuity
Theodore grew up right around the time of the Space Race so of course this poster is there in the 1950s Inventor's Club

[ripe berry]

although this puts the scene a bit later then I thought it was tbh
October 1957 (October 4th 1957 is when the Space Race Started) at the earliest
(I've had this scene occuring around 1955 in my head)

[dusty trench]

Also, while not the same, is similar to the stuff used in the future. Like thy thing in the box, and the tv. And considering the bullies before becoming full cultist are investigating Mayak, they took tools from there and tried to experiment with it in club. And years later, rescue said kids go through old stuff to use and expand that tech that has been stored in the classroom for years. Al’s hinting at it being Mayak tech.

[ripe berry]

which actually puts Theodore at ~14 at the time, sameish age as the current Inventor's Club Members in the AS

[dusty trench]

Oh yea

[ripe berry]

(who would've thought a random background detail would be useful in narrowing down the exact year Franklin's Death occurs)

[ripe berry]

assuming the Halloween Incident occurred when Gerda was 10 and that Gerda and Theodore are the same age
this means there's a 4 year gap between the Halloween Incident and Franklin dying

(or, it's not confirmed but I'll refer to it as a death until stated otherwise)

[dusty trench]

Which that fits.

[dusty trench]

Something I’ve thought about for a while was the three headed raven skulls on Aaron’s held room door. Which Nicky frees him from. Which 3 headed ravens (often 3 ravens) is a real common thing in symbolic folklore. Representing deep wisdom, prophecy, transformation, a connection to the spirit realm which give’s significant knowledge of the core of the world and the universe. And that can tie to The Guest and even why we see in S&R showing a bit of what was depicted in that game, or hinting at it. Like a kind of earlier depiction of Guest in a way.

That’s why I replied to that message because it ties in.

[ripe berry]

neat connection!

[dusty trench]

Thanks

[dusty trench]

And that can tie to these messages about the doll representation in S&R. It fits in perfectly.

Not the colt thing of HN3 that’s just after because I scrolled up.

[ripe berry]

also- I wonder if any of the things on the board in 1950s Inventor's Club have any lore relevance outside of the one about Giant Crows (Forest Protectors)

(I know this is a image of an early version of that board but it's the only thing I have that gives a clear, unobstructed, shot)

the only differences between this and the final version are:
removal of the Potion Craft Ad (it instead seems to be No Time to Explain)
"RAVEN" is changed to "GIANTS?"
and adding the word Mayak next to the location

[dusty trench]

And all of that stuff we see in the show anyways

[dusty trench]

And ties to this message.

[ripe berry]

like what does the burning of a local house have to do with the Mayak and/or the Cult?

[dusty trench]

Roger and Adele maybe burned cultist house, like they did factory. Or maybe cultist burned house while experimenting with the wether stuff and shocked lightning and it his electrify box and cause a fire. Maybe like weaker lighting to just car a fire maybe not explosion and then fire. But the again Trinity’s house exploding also was just considered it burnt down, beset explosions causing fires is a thing. Ya know.

Most likely cult did it with their experiments.

[ripe berry]

also, I wonder what happened at the Weather Station in the 1950s to put it in the state we see in the AS

[dusty trench]

Also I am not saying a storm caused Trinity’s house, atleast not fully. Because luck device was used those connected to weather.

So kinda.

[dusty trench]

Yea

[ripe berry]

like, if we didn't know the place was active into 1963 it'd seem abandoned

[dusty trench]

Maybe accidents happened there with experiments that also caused Mayak to like rumble and electric stuff to crash and get out of control, like the terrible storm newspaper and Franklins incident. Maybe even later ton too.

Gtg for a bit I’ll return

[ripe berry]

this is not how a building that we KNOW should be active should look

and the state it's in ALSO doesn't look like it was naturally abandoned by Roger and Adelle, but instead like it was abandoned in a hurry and like some kind of fight occurred

(abandoned in a hurry because files, notes, letters, blueprints, and drinks were all left behind)
(a fight because there's no way those dented drawers/cabinets, knocked over chairs/tablets, and broken computers all could've occurred naturally with time, not to mention parts of it are boarded up on the outside)

even when they're down in the tunnels you can see cobwebs and everything's covered up that indicate nothing down there has been in use lately as of the 1950s either

however, oddly those cobwebs in the tunnels are still there in ~1996

[ripe berry]

thinking about it some more
the clues of a fight is most likely due to the Halloween Incident

the only thing left is:
Why did Roger and Adelle abandon their work ~1953 (assuming the Halloween Incident was after they abandoned the location) only to return to being at it by 1960?

[dusty trench]

Maybe it was too dangerous because ravens society was stealing tech from them and experimenting for their own doing. They left in a hurry to avoid danger, probably during an accident. They found it too dangerous.

Which Franklin incident cause the Mayak building to rumble, with electricity forming all around heavy rumbling and shaking on the whole building even the tunnels.

[dusty trench]

👆

[ripe berry]

which doesn't explain the 2nd half of why by 1960 they return

but that does explain the first half

[dusty trench]

(2nd half) Probably during that time period, Roger and Adele just had to take a long break because it was dangerous, and they were facing legal trouble’s since they don’t want to be apart of it anymore. And they went to jail. And while in jail, got the news that Franklin went missing. And after being released pieced everything together, and Theo probably told them after they ask him questions (maybe has been to therapy or sum but didn’t tell anyone because they would t believe him, or he started retaliating out of anger and fear), they found out how he died. So Roger and Adele had to steal tech back from ravens society, set up for the return of there experiments. And they began work again. But this time were expanding even more, getting into time experiments and teleportation stuff, but it didn’t last too long since they didn’t get far. They were trying to bring Franklin back first. And that’s where Mr. Peterson inspiration of going back to past and save Franklin, which Franklin is the motive.

[dusty trench]

Also consider that when Franklin asks Theo, “Who would I go home to without you there? Dad?” Implying that their parents aren’t there.

[ripe berry]

I do have to note that ~1961 the Tavishes were funding things iirc

[ripe berry]

but then the funding gets cut and then using the tunnels they (are implied to) burn the original Golden Apple Factory down as presumably revenge on the cult, before vanishing from the public eye around 1963

[dusty trench]

Funding probably getting cut because Roger and Adele stopped teaming with them be case ie they began time experiments to bring Franklin back, but it didn’t last too long. Probably plan something secretly, to the down ravens society to put all the blame on them and prove they are responsible for Franklin’s death. The ravens society found out and they cut funding.

Roger and Adele maybe blamed for the previous terrible storm incident. The one and they are arrested for that. But coming back and starting time experiments but didn’t go too far. They try to put ravens society in a trap to put all evidence is on them, and prove what they did to Franklin and the other storm incidents. Ravens society caught on so they cut funding and everything went down hill again from there.

[ripe berry]

yeah that makes sense

[ripe berry]

(the Mayak is also described to look kind of like this in the books, like Roger and Adelle had left in a hurry, so it's safe to assume it still looks similar to this in 1996)

[dusty trench]

Probably left in a hurry twice. Because two arrest.

[ripe berry]

even if they could never prove that Roger and Adelle did it

[dusty trench]

Them rushing in a hurry was the perfect strategy to make it seem like they were at full blame.

Causing something so out of control to happen, so that Roger and Adele they would hurry in a fish to get away out of trying to stay safe and not be apart of it.

[ripe berry]

even without the proof, everyone suspected them.

[dusty trench]

Causing that whole storm so they couldn’t gather evidence.

[ripe berry]

and not too long after, Roger and Adelle end up dead

[dusty trench]

And Mr. Peterson comes trying to finish the job.

[dusty trench]

Also adding onto this, an old teaser of AS shows this person running although, with a more unfinished design and tie as a belt which isn’t presenting, other than that one thing it’s the same exact design and depicting the same scene. I know specifically when because if you look, it’s the same background as 8:58 of S2 EP1, and if you look at that shot you see person isn’t there first, but then comes down from the air sliding down hill. Make me think that person was running and jumped up in the air and slid down, or maybe jumped up and bounced off a tree. That places this teaser right in between shot 8:57 and 8:58. This can add as more evidence to that person maybe being Guest, as in HN 2 he jumps super high, and even an old teaser of HN2 he’s climbing trees and jumps down from one. Also he can hang and grab onto wall and jump high in SN, you can climb with the dashing and if you aim right.

You can see the knee bottom right. Also in AS.

[dusty trench]

Also got a more clear shot of the lore in the background board from old lofi stream before HN2 beta, that’s in AS style. It’s clearly The Guest.

This shows that he has researched on The Guest, even his appearance. And has more info on him. His had at top right of paper, and his head and beak bottom right. And even arrow’s pointing at Guest body with unseen text showing he is taking notes of Guest appearance and studying him. And not just this.

[dusty trench]

But this.

[dusty trench]

And this.

2 things that I think are depictions of The Guest in a way.

[potent harness]

Here's a higher quality ver. of the image
Also look, it's the gang's early redesigns

[dusty trench]

YAY. Thank you 🙏.

[dusty trench]

The Nicky design isn’t bad just the eye circle looks out of sync with the eyes. Trinity’s head is super stretched looking and her far looks pale. Maritza hat looks too small for her head and her eye brows stay in one expression. And Enzo looks faded.

Not bad designs per se,

just not as good only because of some minor issues.

[potent harness]

fair

at least their foreheads aren't as atrocious like they were in the pilot

Trinity and Mari especially

[dusty trench]

Oh yea. Those will never compare to final.

Final 10x better.

[potent harness]

Delroy got very lucky

He was pretty much perfected by his second design, the only differences are his bag handle, that line seperating his hair the side of his head and bright colors

[dusty trench]

His hair looks lighter, like he’s already growing gray hair or sum.

[dusty trench]

Yea.

[potent harness]

Yeah he suffered from the same cooler tones which Trinity also had in the pilot

[dusty trench]

Yea, but other than that the same.

Least errors in early designing than the others.

[shell gull]

Wait a minute that’s that one Guest Art for Hello Guest…

Of him holding the shovel.

[dusty trench]

Yep

Just the legs are spread out more here than paper.

Other than that the same.

[potent harness]

For anyone that wants the full image
Here you go!

[dusty trench]

So beautiful

Got the nighttime one?

[shell gull]

In his notebook he’s doodling items in the game digging up the bag and a storm. Which is some really good attention to detail to something like this.

[potent harness]

Quality's not as good but this is the only one I could find

[dusty trench]

Still love it

Thanks

[dusty trench]

These designs aren’t bad they look good, just some minor issues like shadows and skin tone. Other than that once those are fixed they would be actually pretty good. Like Delroy who has had the same design just they fixed lighting and shadows.

[potent harness]

I still find it funny how some traits from their early redesigns managed to slip into a few shots of the very first episode

Enzo's black tie, Ivan's big forehead and Trinity's old head shape

[dusty trench]

Yea that is funny, I mainly remember the Ivan one since it’s the most noticeable. It’s nothing bad, just a little funny.

[ripe berry]

it haunts the HN Fandom

[ripe berry]

Ivan grows the forehead

[marsh idol]

funny leg position

[wanton roost]

Idk why but this makes me think of smth I want... a hn wtrb ost..

[charred wharf]

Oh god. 😭

They expanded his cranium

[limber ridge]

I am relatively convinced on that person being the guest but not at the time of S2 Ep1 because the guest's backstory will likely happen in real time with hints from Alex.

[wanton roost]

Good mornin every1

[limber ridge]

Good morning to You, even If it's way past morning at me.

[wanton roost]

I actually got a b+ today on biology just saw my report card

[wanton roost]

Goodmornin frigid and tr33

[limber ridge]

No antibiotics for that.

[wanton roost]

Atleast I got a on everything else

[empty bone]

everybody its not about the neighbor is not the villian its you the player the traps the keys its not out of wanting to murder you and kill his kid its out of fear because his family dies and he is the only one left

[limber ridge]

Do we know what Roger and Adele were framed for by the cult in Aaron's triliogy?

[marsh idol]

no not really so far

[limber ridge]

Pretty sure that teaser was a 2 second clip of him running.

[dusty trench]

Maybe it can be origin on how his character gets so animalistic like how we see in HN2, or like on why he’s so, like he is. Because while this person is more like The Guest and way different from other cultist, he does move a lot more human like, while Guest is more animalistic. Maybe before he would be under the beak in a suit, but he would take off the mask. Maybe it’s like, how he got bound to being the raven man, why he has all this rage in him, why he looks the way he does, and we’ll see exactly who it is. Maybe like before going into rage and killing cultist, we will understand his motive before going into rage. And they can do it in a different way if he is a creature, but idk.

[dusty trench]

Yea but that teaser isn’t in AS and it’s from that shot so I believe it’s a missing scene.

[dusty trench]

But I still do believe those other two things are depictions of The Guest in a way.

[limber ridge]

Same.

[limber ridge]

I'm fairly certain Alex shared it somewhere as a 2 second clip of him running. That's probably what most trimmed scenes are like.

Do You remember where you got the image from?

[ripe berry]

I think I have the clip saved as a gif?

[limber ridge]

Might not even be 2 seconds but can i see it?

[ripe berry]

not sure if sharing it's allowed or not so idk

(it was from the tinyClub)

[limber ridge]

Oh.

Literally asked 2 other people about it when i first saw them and they legit told me "Alex on discord"

But no If it's from tinyclub it's probably not allowed.

[ripe berry]

I think it falls into a gray area since AS S2 Ep. 1's out but it's not used in the episode

actually wait wasn't there a thread where someone was allowed to post a tinyClub imagev(it was a spoiler thread)? I might just post the gif there

[limber ridge]

I mean If You consider you could sure but i wouldn't recomend.

[limber ridge]

Wait allowed as in no one said anything about it or allowed as in some tB person gave permission?

[ripe berry]

I think tB gave permission?

or Jacky did

idk

posted it #1051519521061617774

or no wait
they just didn't care I think lol

anyways, let's move on

[ripe berry]

I'm unsure if this bloke is the Guest or not

on one hand, yeah, they look different then the other Raven Society members

on the other, it could just be an early design that made it's way into the final episode somehow

no wait no
they had the final design when this scene was shown

I could actually maybe see it being the same outfit

also may I note
#hello-neighbor message

implies we've seen the Guest with a cloak and said cloak will be damaged in the final episode

[wanton roost]

So finally we agree that this could be the guest in s2 ep1?

[charred wharf]

Imo not rlly, could be but I personally don't think it's him

[wanton roost]

I mean it's the only one who doesn't match a cultist perfectly