halo-discussion

[analog salmon]

whereas finishing off a team mate already hurt by the enemy would only be say 1 strike

[devout kite]

I don’t understand why people would betray in rank if your team is winning

[analog salmon]

rn finishing off a team mate doesnt penalise you at all

[analog salmon]

my guess in ranked is people use smurfs and just troll

i have zero doubt smurfing is common in halo infinite just like mcc

[young glen]

The salt is strong.

[analog salmon]

the fact you have to play 20 social games isn't going to stop it

people smurf in mcc in social all the time, so why wouldnt they also smurf in infinite, if your good enough at the game your placement matches are going to be pretty easy

[woeful wigeon]

Get thrown into a 3v4 slayer and get ranked down by -7 after going positive and almost winning a man down. What a fine experience.

[crystal iron]

I guess there's no update next week, they just fixed the exchange not working 🥹

[olive brook]

My hopes and dreams, gone. Destroyed

[steel tangle]

Is the MCC still going to get updates new armours etc?

[crystal iron]

😭

[crystal iron]

Only 343 knows answer to this question

[steel tangle]

Ah

[steel tangle]

I presume we wont get out then 343 got hit hard during microsofts lay offs apparently

[crystal iron]

we're getting more updates, but more armour is unknown

Yeah

[woeful wigeon]

Anyone else 99.9999% sure they lied when they said MMR isn't used in ranked matchmaking anymore after initial placement?

[analog salmon]

It’s not used to matchmake, it’s still ultimately used to determine how your CSR changes

Basically all they did is get to a point where CSR matches MMR better

I reckon anyway

[grave ether]

I remember reading that over time your CSR eventually matches up with you MMR

[woeful wigeon]

nope, not true. it's still used to find players and/or set teams. irrefutable game histories are telling that story that can't technically be confirmed because they don't return MMR from the stats API in ranked team matches (I wonder why)

the truth is they are incompetent or there is some conspiracy lead by someone up top like Phil Specter to keep Trueskill 2 in place because they built their career on Microsoft Research's biased, subjective based, severely flawed paper

[smoky wave]

The conspiracy is in your head, go outside

[woeful wigeon]

ok then they are incompetent. you're right, that's always the more likely thing

[grave ether]

It might be used in over team balancing if they can't find anyone matching CSR quickly, or I can see it being used if there's a premade fireteam so it needs to balance that with who they match up against and who their extras might be.
I haven't read up/remember all the details on the current system with the changes but it does make sense

[woeful wigeon]

it's just funny that they went so far as to lie about actually changing how matchmaking works

[fervent magnet]

yo pfp is so fire

[smoky wave]

Oh right now I remember you, alright better not wasting my time about it

[ruby knoll]

You have a terminal case of skill issue

[grave ether]

Remember, CSR earned/gained is based on multiple factors but mainly, if you lose a match, you will lose CSR. If you win a match you will gain CSR. How much is based on you and your teammates performance against who the enemy team is and their performance

[left snow]

The CSR system only looks at the result, the skill gap between you and them, and your MMR vs your CSR. The score and your performance in that game aren't taken into account.

[left snow]

The players are chosen on CSR. But the teams are balanced on MMR. Which is why you get uneven teams post placement - or when groups are travelling in squads. Overall it's still fine, the average MMR gap between teams in about 3.5 for me this season, but I've had games where the skill difference has jumped out by over 70 - which is silly.

[crystal iron]

what if that's how it should work but its broken like the stability of matchmaking

[smoky wave]

Well, Phil Spencer is in touching that matchmaking

[left snow]

Your MMR is your best representation of your current skill level. It's like a form indicator. So it makes sense for the match maker to use it. Your CSR is more "stable".

[left snow]

Your MMR goes up and down with form. It looks like 343 have left it more volatile than you would think. Which helps with matchmaking and detecting Smurfs etc. But when you see a graph of MMR over time it tends to have a saw tooth pattern to it.

Your CSR then "chases" your MMR. It's like an average of your current MMR. Or a better description is probably a "line of best fit". So, yes. Your CSR and MMR pretty much move together.

[woeful wigeon]

An engineer gives a talk on Youtube that I think mostly breaks down the initial version of Halo Infinite's TrueMatch system and it is comical to watch. He tries to sell horrible ideas as gold and glosses over all of the details that expose it as what it is - what keeps killing competitive Halo

A reminder, MCC Halo 3 ranked popularity was thriving after the fixes and when they changed the BE to use this system it killed the popularity. It turned a 50 into a 25.

[grave ether]

Is that team based MMR? Because as far as I know there's no way to see your individual MMR

[left snow]

They didn't lie. People were getting confused and frustrated with the CSR system. But instead of putting more effort into explaining it - or even better, fixing it, they took the soft option of making everyone's CSR's match up pre-game. Even it actually meant that the game was now matched worse (on the basis of current skill - your MMR).

I guess it doesn't make a lot of difference overall. Except post placement and when you face a squad of players who have found a patch of form.

[smoky wave]

Lmao

You know what

[left snow]

Team MMR. Which is essentially your average MMR plus or minus a few weightings (eg. for squads).

[crystal iron]

it sounds stressful being a competitive player, just be like me and hunt and kill elites in custom game lobbies

[smoky wave]

Just play videogames

[crystal iron]

Halo2A multiplayer is so underrated :(

[left snow]

The best way to fix the system is to let it match on MMR. We know that TrueSkill2 works - so let it be. But stop "hiding" this number. It's not something to be ashamed of. Let us look up our MMR. Show us graphs of MMR for each game mode over time.

And then fix the CSR system. Reduce the scale. Probably not all the way back to 1-50. But I think 1-117 would be a nice touch.

What we have now is a scale of 1-2000+. It lacks precision. People are losing their minds over a handful of points that don't really mean much. Your skill rank shouldn't be something you "grind" game to game.

[olive brook]

mfw i wait 20 minutes for a match on a specific game just for mcc “restart the search”

[serene badger]

I had to overcome that and just go back to my roots of simply playing halo to enjoy it.

But, my kids play on my account. So my stats are prob all wack.

[left snow]

How does True Match kill competitive Halo?

[analog salmon]

imo its not even that bad. Solo/duos worked well. Forcing solos to play against stacks is really my only gripe. I accept two queues was problematic, but they should not be putting solos against stacks.

i feel like most people are just mad they peak and then nit pick every time their CSR doesn't change how they think it should

Even as a S2 Onyx I really have no problem playing this game stuck D5, I just wanna have fun matches

I've basically stopped playing this game very much because 1. I play solo and I don't have an interest in stacking and 2. there's no maps for ranked

[left snow]

To try and keep people playing ranked they set up a system where you get CSR for every win. A little dopamine hit. To try and keep you grinding / keep playing.

The problem is that just because you won it doesn't mean you have actually increased in skill. So your MMR doesn't go up. So all this "borrowed" CSR disappears on your next loss.

And that just frustrates people. Especially if it was a close game, or they played well. And it's a thousand times worse if it's because someone quit.

We need a lower scale on the CSR - that better reflects relative skill. And something else to keep players coming back. An XP rank to grind. Or rewards for getting 'x' number of wins in a season.

[grave ether]

I've thought about the stack problem before but someone has to back fill if fireteams of say 3 are queued up, not sure how you could fix that without pulling a single to fill the spot

The only thing I can come up with is have the solo/duo queue and an openplay like they did in the beginning

[analog salmon]

3+1 v 4 or
2+2 v 3+1 or
2+1+1 v 1+1+1+1
is all fine

its 4 v 1+1+1+1 that's a problem

imo an intelligent single queue is ideal

[left snow]

Even 3+1 vs 1+1+1+1 is troublesome. Especially with the objective game modes.

[grave ether]

I'm curious how often that is happening. 4v1+1+1+1
I don't play ranked much at all anymore so I haven't been paying attention to that side of it.
Most fun I've had in ranked is when the HCS was going on. So many people online at that time matches felt balanced and great. After that it went back to frustration and I haven't really been back

[analog salmon]

from what i can tell the game makes basically no effort to match the number of stacks in a game

[grave ether]

You think it's MMR/CSR balance > Stacks?

[left snow]

I've been keeping an eye on the stacks over the last few weeks. I've seen a lot of 3+1 vs solos. But never a 4 vs solos. But we're only talking a small sample size here.

[analog salmon]

seems that way

[woeful wigeon]

Where to start...this is just my understanding of why and I'm not going to write a fuller thing b/c it's not worth my time (yet I still play, SMH), but here are some thoughts:

1. It trades off search time for fairness. Its search times are not even that much faster than other systems which happen to work fine even in low population environments. Rather than try to improve other systems, they though it would be a good idea to try to predict the skill of the players in the match using 15min - 1hr old stale data where it continually considers a thundering herd of constantly out of sync data. This can contribute to a potential circle-of-hell scenario for most players.
2. The training dataset for the model that's used to compute MMR in team based playlists is entirely composed of LAN FFA matches. Like, WTF?
3. It prides itself on being able to predict an outcome at 64% - in Halo 5, no numbers released for Infinite AFAIK, but it's likely way lower - which is not impressive, bootstrapped by matches that are already based on unfair assumptions, making it even less impressive. It might as well be a coin flip.
4. Players have no insight into how MMR is computed. If it is a black box model based on FFA LAN matches, how is anyone surprised that its performance is terrible? No Halo stats API have returned **individual **MMR stats in team playlists. We've been asking for it, yet they have only returned it in FFA playlists. Why?
5. What is the point of trying to predict outcomes of matches when matchmaking anyway? You already have a skill ranking that is based on wins and losses that can be used with a range filter.
   The T2 / TM based ranked matchmaking system is vastly inferior to Trueskill 1 with traditional matchmaking in almost every way except those that don't matter much. It uses machine learning to solve a manufactured problem. Its goal is to provide more fair matches, but the data is clear, it does not do that.
   What did I miss?

[vocal coral]

Sup, i got an issue with Halo tmmc, anyone can help me?

[young glen]

#1075989764026675210

[ruby knoll]

Its moments like these that make me thank god for not letting me care about video game ranking

[grave ether]

This article actually explains some of your questions and points as to why they use the system they use and how things are calculated behind the scenes. Which gives players insight into how MMR is computed:

MMR... is the numerical representation of skill for a specific playlist as measured by the TrueSkill2 system.
TrueSkill2 uses a variety of data about each player’s performance in multiplayer matches (including wins, losses, kills, deaths, etc.) to build this understanding model and determine each player’s skill.

https://www.halowaypoint.com/news/closer-look-halo-infinites-ranked-experience

BUT keep in mind that for ranked there have been some changes since they switched to CSR based matchmaking instead of MMR, (which can be read here https://www.halowaypoint.com/news/playlists-ranked-matchmaking-season-3)
But the base of how it works is the same

[analog salmon]

i mean its the same system that decides how your games play out in social :)

[ruby knoll]

I also don't care about match outcome after a match ends

I used to play server based fpses more often back in the day. No matchmaking or anything

[woeful wigeon]

That does not give any detail about how MMR is computed, it simply states what it is.

[woeful wigeon]

Solid ad hominem fallacy bro, you really know your stuff.

[grave ether]

MMR is computed based off of the trueskill rating. Then tells you how the trueskill rating is computed. Does it go into exact perfect detail? No. But it explains enough that you can get a good general sense of what it's doing.

[woeful wigeon]

And it does not say how it considers those stats, because it's a black box. The question is why they don't want us to know what it is.

[grave ether]

Not hard to understand the better the player the higher the MMR

[woeful wigeon]

All they have to do is let us see the individual MMR stats in team playlists, yet they refuse to show us that information for fear that they will be shamed after continuously making the vague claim that "it closely correlates".

[grave ether]

Giving out all details could allow for abuse and manipulation for the system. Makes sense. It's not a huge conspiracy. There's even a whole article on trueskill and how it works you can delve into https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/research/publication/trueskill-2-improved-bayesian-skill-rating-system/

[woeful wigeon]

Thanks for splaining to me, I know what it is I've read it. Care to address any of my points above?

[crystal iron]

halo 3 rat

[grave ether]

[smoky oasis]

Halo 3 rat is neat.

[plain junco]

Yeah. Same thing happens in other games stg, it really gets annoying when there's no escape even in casual playlists

[signal ivy]

Reach Squirrel > H3 Rat

[plain junco]

goofy auuggghhhh

[left snow]

1. It's a game. The MM has to take wait times into consideration - otherwise there would be even fewer players than we have know.

2. The training data set may have been. But TrueSkill2 was put up against millions of data points from Halo 5.

3. Why would the behaviour be different from Halo 5? And I'm sure the relevant bodies at 343 would be looking at the TS2 data for Halo Infinite to make sure it's behaving as expected.

4. Agree 100%. There is no reason to hide the MMR. We need to see it plotted against time for all our game modes. And if they plotted it against CSR I'm sure we'd all take a collective breath and go, yeh - that's how it works. The graphs put up by Josh Menke in Waypoint were always instructive.

[left snow]

6. The point of "predicting" the outcome is just a way validate the system.

Basing it purely on wins and losses would work eventually - it would just be very, very slow to sort everyone out.

TrueSkill2 is really just wins and losses. Just that it looks at who you beat to speed up the process.

7. I don't know how you can say that TS2 is "vastly inferior" to TS1. The data appears pretty conclusive?

[left snow]

In the end, the "circle of Hell" for most people is that they have found their TrueSkill2 rank and can't go higher.

This is true for any skill in life. Halo, Chess, crochet. You improve until you hit your skill plateau and it's a long, hard, grind to go up from there.

What Infinite does is "tease" you for token CSR for beating a side that is ranked the same and/or below you.

But the reality is that your MMR isn't going up because you aren't any better than you were last week.

So when the CSR has the chance to fall back it does hard. And this oscillation frustrates people. They feel the game "stole" their hard earned rank.

Truth is it's just oscillating around their actual - and probably never to change - rank.

[left snow]

Partly because it's a proprietary algorithm. But you can look up how ELO type systems work. And there is an interesting set of articles by Moserware. If you google those you can see exactly how the maths behind TrueSkill2 work.

And from Microsoft's discussion paper we can see some of the parameters they use. Particularly Kills per minute and to (a lesser extent) Deaths per minute.

[plucky river]

Marty O'Donnell is trying to stay relevant again. He says he choses to work on small projects but more likely Studios don't want to be involved with his behaviour.

[grave ether]

I believe this is spot on. And why so many are asking for a progression system to be included in the game outside of a battle pass or ranked play, as it allows everyone to feel like we are working towards something and progressing, when our skills themselves as a gamer may not be.
It'll be interesting to see what the team comes up with as they have said they are working on a system.

[crystal iron]

https://tenor.com/view/halo-arbiter-halo3-prophet-truth-gif-21300865

[tardy turtle]

Marty's behavior is... so disappointing. I will grant that Bungie screwed him over, but he's not exactly acting the saint either

[woeful wigeon]

1. That's your opinion, and I think has already been proven false. For example, searching H3 MCC in spring of 2020 when they used TS1 with traditional matchmaking, ranked playlists were thriving. They pretty quickly died when 343 introduced T2/TM as the ranked MCC backend, so I'm pretty confident that the reverse is true. Perhaps a better example is looking at the popularity of ranked Infinite now. It was so low they had to remove the solo/duo and consolidate to a single playlist only a year post launch.
2. What do you mean by "was put up against Halo 5". It sucked in H5 almost as much as it does now, in my opinion. Evidence is in the population decline of H5 since launch. By 2020 its ranked matchmaking population numbers were dwarfed by Halo 3 in MCC, a then 13 year old game.
3. They are different games. The predictability varies per game type, per map (equipment, weapons, movement flow), per skill range, etc. That 68% number in H5 was an aggregate across all matches of Team Slayer only, and they shared no information about which maps or weapons were present, etc. They very well may have known from the start that it performed worse the higher in narrow skill range it went, but just conveniently decided not to share that data.
4. I'm not sure which graphs you're referring to but I can say that looking at the kill count predictions on waypoint, they were way off for me most of the time.

[left snow]

Whatever it is I hope it encourages people to keep playing ranked throughout the Season.

[grave ether]

For me personally, I'll come back to ranked more when some of the desync and melee problems get a bit better. It's not so much of team unbalances or matchmaking issues that make me stay away.
I actually enjoy the CSR changes this season. On that note I just wish my rank was based on me individually and not so much as a focus of team performance.
If I remember rightknow that's how it was in the beginning and the majority didn't like it so that's when it switched to the team focus but it is what it is I guess

[serene furnace]

You ever just feel tired of Halo? Not just Infinite, like, the franchise as a whole

[plain junco]

if it was fun to play, no

messing up 4 mainline titles in a row does not help

[serene furnace]

It's not that, I enjoy the 343 games just as much as the Bungie ones. I think I'm having a general videogame burnout

[left snow]

1. It's all opinion. But I'm not sure what's been "proven". I always find it difficult to correlate the popularity of H3 at it's peak with modern gaming. It's a different era. And I'm not sure you can just use it to "prove" much. Ranking? Match Making? No Sprint? etc.

2. Microsoft used millions of data points from Halo 5 to develop TrueSkill2.

3. They may or may not be "different" games. But that's not the point of ELO type ranking systems. You want to reduce all the variables down to a win or a loss (which also makes sense in minimising the data foot print).

All you are doing is sorting the players into a normal distribution - but using some fancy maths to estimate how much to change rank depending on your rank, their rank, and how confident that the system is in those ranks.

4. On the Halo 5 waypoint threads - players could ask Josh Menke and he would produce graphics of their MMR vs games played. Depending on what he put up - they would be vs game mode or CSR. You could see how MMR saw toothed over time - and how CSR did it's best to average it out.

And he would also let people know their KPM vs a target skill rank. I was always disappointed that this sort of info wasn't freely available.

As for the kill count predictions on Waypoint. They are calculated form your KPM in that mode. So if they are way off most of the time - the only explanation is that you are not very consistent. Looking back over Season 3 so far - my expected kills are within 0.6 over all and expected deaths within 1.5. So very accurate. I may not be very good - but I am consistent.

[crystal iron]

2 chatgpt's talking to each other in this channel

[serene furnace]

It's not the game, it's the player. The Halo 3 Battle Rifle sucks, but you can dominate with it if you have the skill

[plain junco]

could be brunout. maybe try revisiting old titles you love

[plain junco]

the BR was good its just in H3 it was projectile

[left snow]

I don't have a huge problem with desync (touch wood) - but there just aren't any local games from Australia. I'm lucky if the game isn't flashing "unstable latency" at me all the time.

I'm undecided on the CSR changes. The post placement games were very uneven. For me they ranged -25 to +68 on team MMR for the first dozen or so games - and that is quite a gap.

And while the overall average delta is only 3 or so - I'm still seeing big jumps (out to the 70's) when squads are involved.

And as for the individual rank - it's frustrating on a game by game basis - especially when you play well in a loss. But it washes out over time. But you need to keep in mind it's a reflection of your ability to play a team role - there will always be some players who are higher skilled but just don't help the team as much - and those who are lower skilled - but contribute more to the team.

Just like any team sport.

I've always found it interesting that people put up examples of being the top dog in a losing match (using whatever metric in the most convenient) - but never point out the times they struggled personally but where carried by team mates to the W.

It all washes out over time.

[serene furnace]

Have you considered the idea of just not playing ranked?

[crystal iron]

can't play ranked due to lack of players/desync, can't play BTB due to desync/dedicated server issues, we're not doing very well here are we
the current state of matchmaking is "avoid half the playlists and it'll be fine"

[woeful wigeon]

"there will always be some players who are higher skilled but just don't help the team as much - and those who are lower skilled - but contribute more to the team"
No, this is a false narrative. You're being way too generous to T2/TM, pretending it's perfect. When searching solo, higher skilled players are getting matched with terrible teammates game after game where they are top 50% or MVP in 90% of matches and can't rank up. If the system did not consider MMR in any way and matched traditionally, it would be accurate. It was in TS1 and it absolutely is not in T2/TM.

[grave ether]

It may wash out over time but for a while it felt like most of my matches I was either top dog of a losing team or being carried to a win and clearly being the worst member on the team. That middle ground sweet [sweat] spot of close matches was so rarely felt in ranked it at times.

That's why I personally prefer an individual performance metric over teams. I love stats and knowing exactly where I stand skill wise. I also love playing against people much higher in skill than me because I enjoy trial by fire and learning ways I can find to counteract a playstyle. But I don't like getting punished for a loss when I couldn't carry well enough. In turn I don't like getting rewarded when I know I was the one holding the team back.

I do think they could implement a better reward system that encourages team play. But I also know it's hard to balance these things and have a system that caters to different kinds of players

[left snow]

How is it a false narrative? It's a team game. And there are plenty of "skills" that contribute to the team performance over and above conventional skill metrics.

And I'm not trying to be generous to TS2. No system is perfect. But it, and ELO systems in general, are amazing for what they can do. I'm not particularly strong in maths - but I've always found the concepts interesting.

As for the current matchmaking issues. That comes back to population. In an ideal world all the players in the game would have nigh on identical MMR (you need some variation for the system to actually work though). Unfortunately the MM has to extend the skill range in games because of the low population. So you get top dogs who have to carry and lower ranked players who have to survive.

[left snow]

Being in the top 50% or MVP isn't really all that relevant. And do we even know what metrics these represent?

If the team you beat is ranked below you it doesn't matter if you were MVP or not - you shouldn't rank up. You didn't prove anything except you were better than that team - and the system already knew that.

If it actually ranked you up - all it would result in is you being put into games where the other team are way better - and you would lose.

[left snow]

I'm the same. I love looking at the individual stats. And it took me a while to come around to KPM and DPM. But over time I've come to see why they stand out as the most useful stats.

Sure, there will always be those unrecognised one percenters. Team communication. Sacrificing yourself to take out the opponent with camo. Dying to return the flag. And so on. But if you do those things you will win more of those 50:50 games and it will eventually be reflected in your rank.

[crystal iron]

hey guys I'm playing with the official bungie team

[left snow]

Who knows. One day we might have an AI "umpire" who judges each and every act in the game to decide who was genuinely the MVP.

[grave ether]

Wipe them out. All of them!

[crystal iron]

but then they won't give me recon armour

[grave ether]

[woeful wigeon]

If the population is so low why are wait times pretty much always still under a minute? I hear this excuse a lot and it is not a good one. The same behavior was exhibited at launch in Infinite when the population was massive. The populations are now low precisely because of how bad T2/TM is at matching players fairly.

[left snow]

Wait times are deceptive. The MM can "look ahead" to see what matches may be available. If it can't see any better options it just gets on with what it's got.

Post launch the issues were more with system going too far the other way - using players further away to get the better match ups.

As for the cause of the lower population. I would say lack of content, desync, and no XP progression system are all much stronger reasons than TS2. Going even further I would say there is no problem with TS2 - it does what it needs to do very well. The problem is with the CSR. And 343 could do that so much better.

[woeful wigeon]

The wait times seem pretty accurate to me. For me, what doesn't line up with what you're saying is that it actually matches fast and unfairly. I would understand more if it tried for a few minutes to find a fair match and then gave up and produced an unfair match but that's not what's happening.
I believe it's a much better argument to suggest that lack of content, desync, and no XP progression system were more leaned into as subconscious excuses by the masses for failing to perform when the system set them up for failure in matches they had no business being in.

[worldly tendon]

It seems to me like the real rub comes from the fact that what TrueSkill2 aims to do (and does do fairly well), and what most players who want to play Ranked want out of playing it, are naturally at cross purposes.

[smoky stone]

I don't understand, why do they keep adding ranked FFA where the match time takes 3+ mins? Add RANKED TEAM SLAYER

[left snow]

Yeh. People try and see an ulterior motive in TrueSkill2. There isn't one.

You rank up with a win and down with a loss. It's simple. The bigger the upset the more your rank can change. And the more you play at a consistent level your rank starts to resist change. It's just a sorting system with some fancy algorithms to make it faster.

And we know it does this well.

What people want is a reward for grinding wins - regardless of who you beat. They don't want to face the reality that their skill has hit the plateau part of the skill curve. Hopefully 343 are still working on one.

[worldly tendon]

Basically, tho I'd say it's less that they don't want to face the reality of the skill plateau, but that it feels like there's no reasonable way to prove to the system that you've surpassed it after hitting it. Because even if it is more a more strictly accurate read on their skill over time, it still incentivizes people to just stop playing Ranked once they hit their high point instead of trying to keep getting better.

[left snow]

What do you mean by "unfairly".

First of all the matches aren't "unfair". They are matched on MMR. And I imagine that they are still running pretty much 50:50 overall on that basis.

An individual match may blow apart because of team dynamics. That's going to happen because there is no way of knowing how four solo players are going to gel.

And the MM system has to cater for everyone. It may very well find 8 players from the meaty part of the population that are closely matched. But it has to bring players from the tails into games in a speedy time as well.

You are probably right when you say some players have no business being in a certain match. I'm sure the MM would prefer they wouldn't. But no-one is being set up for failure. You'll more than likely find that the opposition team had a similar set up - but they managed to work it out as a team.

[left snow]

And I'd agree that the current MM makes it hard to prove yourself. You need a solid game vs players a bit better than you - and the MM is likely to struggle to find you that type of team.

It does feel from various chats that some players are getting rank locked a bit. If you are P3, for example, and a big chunk of P4-5 players have given up on ranked for the season, there is likely a pocket of rank debt that leaves the MM helpless to find you the matches you need to prove yourself.

[worldly tendon]

Players want their individual games on any given play session to feel suitably rewarding without feeling like their past few thousand games are weighing them down like an anchor, which simply runs counter to the kind of long-term consistency that Trueskill2 is trying to create.

[plain junco]

I think the problem with the targeted 50:50 is the way it seems to play out in practice. Steamrolls happen a lot across many modern SBMM titles which makes me question the MMR situation

[left snow]

If I was 343 I would add in a simple win system into ranked. Get a point for each win. And then give out a military rank at the end of the season for accumulating wins. There needs to be an incentive to keep playing even after you've hit your rank plateau.

[worldly tendon]

That would be the simplest way.

[left snow]

That's where Season resets come in. Your MMR curve is made wide and volatile again. It's is free to move - so if you have actually improved in skill, this is your chance.

Invariably players come out with a similar rank though. Such is life.

[plain junco]

No elite weapon skins, armour or nothing

Literally zero point to ranked

[worldly tendon]

Indeed, but I think what people want is the ability to reset their individual MMR on their own rather than have to wait for a system-wide reset

[left snow]

It's not so much the MMR situation - it's the emphasis on team work. Anecdotally the steam rolls happen in objective games, and in particular CTF. And there is no way to predict how four random players are going to gel as a team.

The example I always think about is getting four specialist snipers on a map sans snipers. 🙂

Slayer is more forgiving. You can cover the team cracks with an individual performance.

[worldly tendon]

This isn't terribly workable for several reasons, but it does seem to be the desire.

[left snow]

There isn't a huge point in resetting your MMR back to scratch (mu of 900 and sigma of 300). It would just create some horribly mismatched placement games.

I think going in with your same mu and just widening sigma is fine. The increased volatility of your MMR gives you an excellent chance to re-rank. And as long as 343 keep Seasons to 3 months or so, it will be fine.

[plain junco]

Yeah but this isn't as complex teamwork wise as say in overwatch and yet I've had steamrolls both ways. Either way I more or less meant it in the particular context surround how the algorithm actually decides who to matchmake, because ironically a similar situation was present in OW2 in the sense than your actual rank had no bearance on where you would actually get matchmade because your MMR is what matchmaking is based off of, which is a hidden stat.

[worldly tendon]

Hopefully you're right about it working fine for 3 month seasons

[left snow]

I really don't know why they insist on keeping MMR hidden. We should be able to look it up on Waypoint.

[plain junco]

I'm getting the feeling waypoint will be history soon

the forums were the first straw

[worldly tendon]

I sadly wouldn't be shocked. I've yet to come across a game that really did the tie-in app idea very well, and fewer and fewer people use desktops to browse these days.

[plain junco]

Destiny 1 and 2 are the only ones I can think of

Everything is integrated into one app which is nice, forums, LFG, bug reports, inventory, news, updates + hot fixes, even rewards and such

[worldly tendon]

Haven't tried to it so I can't speak to it. Is it fairly smooth?

[plain junco]

It is, works great both on my old iPhone and the android I have now

Basically their API can be implemented into any application so this is how 3rd party apps like Destiny Item Manager can do what the app can do like transfer inventory items but they are strictly inventory focused so they have additional options in that aspect

[worldly tendon]

Mmk, cuz I know some others that were fairly ambitious, but always ended up being super clunky in execution

[plain junco]

Surprisingly this is one rare time bungie did something right with Destiny; the API is generally seamless

[left snow]

Halo 5 had a pretty good API. I was looking forward to playing with Infinite's. But for some reason they never made one. 😦

[coarse dagger]

The site isn't going anywhere

[twin crag]

I've been waiting for a ranked match (which shows estimated time of 1:42) for the past 10mins

whoops
I didn't scroll

but it is true, cus I'm searching rn 🤷

it timed out :(

[twin crag]

interesting how the channel is very quiet during the Asian active hours

[river minnow]

how do you still talk about this

like, its been stated 100s of times that the game isnt very popular in asia

[coarse dagger]

Also a Sunday and a holiday weekend

[empty rapids]

if you're leading your team by 20+ kills you shouldn't be penalized for leaving if the second top best person has 5 kills 10 min into the match tbh

[next shard]

If you're leading your team by 20+ kills then you're winning a lot of fights and having fun. I think if you hate fun you should be penalized for quitting.

either that or you're not playing the objective and in that case you should definitely be penalized

[empty rapids]

i guess, my team mates just don't grab the odball or play zones

they mostly go in 1 at a time, die or never do objective and at times it feels like i'm carrying outright. Which i don't mind but it sucks that there's not as much clear information maybe for new players

[quiet juniper]

Isn't the Mark V (b) in halo infinite basically a Gen 3 upgrade of the original Mark V (b) like the Mark VI Gen 3 is a Gen 3 upgrade of Mark VI?

[twin crag]

apparently this is also when people are more free and play games more

so people begged for forge maps and now the wait time on Community Collection is about 4:42 which is higher even compared to ranked, which is about 2:13

[young glen]

I mean, anecdotally speaking, I want forge maps in matchmaking but I don't want to play the same 4 maps over and over.

So I play quick play, as that playlist now has some in rotation.

[crystal iron]

It doesn’t mean that more people will play in your region

[coarse dagger]

Not all the time, people go away for short breaks

[steep ice]

can anyone play with me and teach me

i just downloaded it

anyone

ill play any gamemode

[young glen]

Probably best to throw a comment in #lfg-social if you're looking for a partner. Otherwise, remember to aim for the head only when their shields are broken, unless you're using specific weapons like the sniper.

[twin crag]

yea just everyday just during asian active time, and they've been doing a long time

[steep ice]

ok

[twin crag]

I don't think wait times are regional at all, but I could be wrong

[crystal iron]

They are regional

[twin crag]

where did they say that
I would like to know more, maybe find out how they are calculated

[magic night]

One way to check. Two people from different regions hop on, check the estimated wait for a given playlist. If they're different, wait times are regional, if they're the same, wait times are global.

[supple tulip]

Because of the new update I can no longer play the game… it says error occurred while updating… anyone know why?

[young glen]

Ireland, EU here:

Quick play: 0:26
Ranked FFA: 3:12
Team Snipers: 0:51

@twin crag, do your estimated times match up?

[twin crag]

let me check after this, i just got into a match

[magic night]

US East here

Quick play: 0:18
Ranked FFA: 2:13
Team Snipers: 0:44

[young glen]

More info needed, post a thread in #1075989764026675210 after reading the pinned post by Sam.

[young glen]

So regional.

[next shard]

NA west, I have 0:26, 2:35, 0:51 respectively

[magic night]

Looks like it

[young glen]

Hmm, same wait times for both social playlists is interesting considering you're from NA west.

[next shard]

actually surprised how close it is from it being 7am here compared to afternoon in Ireland

nearly identical

[magic night]

With a few more data points, we could probably come to a reasonable conclusion about how it works.

[crystal iron]

Australia:
QP: 1:00
Ranked: Doesn’t queue
Team snipers: 2:30

That’s just from my perspective, qp and snipers could have better or worse queue times depending on when I search

[next shard]

oasis is such a cesspool of spawn killing, but only on the one side of the map

[ocean palm]

guys...

[crystal iron]

What

[ocean palm]

Joe Staten left Microsoft 😦

[magic night]

Good for him. Means he's probably found another opportunity that he wants to do more than his previous one.

[ruby fossil]

I wish Breaker wasn’t in rotation now that we have Oasis.

[signal ivy]

bring back btb unlimited 24/7 Oasis

[ruby fossil]

The map was not built for BTB, it’s genuinely frustrating to play on

[ruby knoll]

Nah

[radiant sundial]

ello

[river minnow]

i love oasis

[radiant sundial]

ye

its a nice map, with plenty of room for my specialty, warthog gunning

[red kiln]

(100% achievements in infinite)

[young glen]

Nice.

[twin crag]

i mean if they are global then yea they would be identical

[young glen]

Well it would've been nice if you provided your own considering you were wondering lmao

[twin crag]

I can provide now, cus then as I said, I was in a match

but then everyone will have to provide again as well, cus since then it would have changed

[young glen]

What's your estimate for QP? I'll quickly check after you post. But it looks like it's regional as Rok's was different and so was the Aussie dude

[twin crag]

we have to check at the same time,
afaik, client refreshes wait times everytime you go to the main menu (campaign, MP, forge one)

welp im in match again

[sick egret]

ctf on nuketown is so much fun lol

[static storm]

hey guys, in what ranked did you got placed after your placements? just curios.

[woeful wigeon]

I think this lends to my point that when the system tries to match using historical individual statistical performance in each game rather than purely wins vs. losses it introduces an unnecessary margin of error that can throw off the whole system. There are no observable data points that can measure how a player reacts to certain nuanced situations, when they make clutch plays or decisions that positively or negatively influence the game, communication, etc. This is where TrueSkill 2 falls flat on its face and TS1 cannot because it only considers what matters at the end of the day - whether your team wins or loses and who you are playing against.

[plain junco]

Plat 4

[woeful wigeon]

Using MMR during initial placements completely subverts the strategy to use CSR after initial placements are finished. Also, players who have already placed can still match with placers still getting placed. This contradicts the release notes stating MMR is only used during initial placement. It must be used all the time. So they just tried to bald faced lie to us?
Anyway, it taints initial placement . The system will continue to match using a flawed MMR foundation that can never be corrected unless reset and MMR is not used at all.

[plain junco]

Identically how ow2 works, funny how they hide your mmr in that game too

[woeful wigeon]

These TS2 / TM systems have spread to poison most competitive games nowadays, unfortunately.

There is a common theme, yet for some reason the industry continues to fail to realize it and take action 🤷‍♂️

[plain junco]

Yep. Can't even escape it in casual settings, played cod recently?

[zenith holly]

Do you ever get tired of starting up infinite and then to find out most of your settings are reset?

[plain junco]

Is that only an Xbox bug because it doesn't seem to happen on pc?

[zenith holly]

Ah figures

[plain junco]

Very stupid though indeed, hasn't it been around for a while too?

[coarse dagger]

There's a patch in development for it

[plain junco]

Is there a patch in development for the forge bugs

[coarse dagger]

A bunch of Forge issues were fixed recently, but yes bugs are still being tracked and fixed

Make sure you're submitting tickets for issues you encounter

[sullen kiln]

Please refer to the Halo Support site for additional information and/or to submit a ticket concerning any issues you may be experiencing.

https://aka.ms/HaloSupport

[plain junco]

What's the difference between flagging an issue and a bug report

Does the former need a video or something

[coarse dagger]

A bug report is logged and tracked, sent directly to dev teams for investigation

Having video evidence to go with a bug report goes a long way, as does any instructions for reproducing an issue

[twin crag]

P6 i think

[plain junco]

Yes ok I have some. How big is the file submission limit or is there one? I use shadoplay to record so the files are a bit larger than needed

[coarse dagger]

40 or 50mb I believe

Look into a program called Handbrake, supposed to be good to help reduce file sizes

[plain junco]

I usually just use the 8mb video converter, they have options for that size

[crystal iron]

you could also just upload it to youtube then use the trim feature to crop the video and post an unlisted link, or download the trimmed video

[plain junco]

Well yes

[coarse dagger]

Media size limited to 49MB.

There we go

[plain junco]

ight

[quick umbra]

any1 down for ranked or 1v1 BRs

[coarse dagger]

#lfg-competitive

[left snow]

TS2 is also wins and losses. The only performance metric is a weighting for kills per minute. And that really just ranks you faster as opposed to higher (you can't bluff your KPM vs higher ranked opponents).

[left snow]

Using CSR to match post placement is largely irrelevant. For most players, with a settled rank, the MMR and CSR are close enough to be equivocal. You'll always get someone having a form swing - but because teams are eventually divided on MMR you can adjust for that in most cases.

The two exceptions are post placement (CSR < MMR) and when squads limit the MM choices.

So yes, MMR is used all the time. But that's good - it's the best representation of your moment to moment skill/form. You have that information and it would be silly not to use it.

I don't think the matching on CSR would really affect your initial placement. Not by much anyway. Sure, you might get some uneven games early (especially higher ranks with the maximum placement of D2) - but remember that your post result MMR changes on the opposition MMR and not their CSR.

And I'm not sure they were lying? Tashi was quite open on Twitter that MMR was still used to divide the players into teams.

I don't get this "flawed" MMR. We know the accuracy of TrueSkill2 - so it's not flawed. It's certainly frustrating when they hide it and then let the conspiracy theories flow freely. And God knows they could do better with the CSR system.

But if you aren't going to use TrueSkill2 / MMR - you are going to need an alternative that is at least as good.

[limber fox]

how to kill players with that skeleton thing weapon in last level?

[tardy turtle]

Skeleton thing? Also last level of which game?

[coarse dagger]

Kill from far away

[young glen]

Hit them very hard.

[coarse dagger]

Oh, wait if you have skull

[limber fox]

escalation

[tardy turtle]

Lethal force usually does the trick

[coarse dagger]

Use the shroud

It's requires 2 hits to kill

With the skull

Spam shroud with your team and confuse the enemy

[limber fox]

usually one team goes to level 10 quite easily and then the enemy team catches up

because of literal no range at all

[young glen]

That can happen if you charge mindlessly and don't take control of the interiors alongside using shroud

I'd avoid pressing enemies if they're on the high ground while you're equipped with the skull, unless the use of shroud can give you enough cover... and try to stick with a team mate.

when 1 skull don't do trick, 2 skulls do.

[woeful wigeon]

"The only performance metric is a weighting for kills per minute"
I'm sorry, but this is a terrible idea. Half mixing performance with a metric that much of the time misses the mark as far as contribution to the team ads more noise to the evaluation. We've already talked about how there are so many other important things that contribute to wins and losses and the high margin for error particularly in objective based game types.

"close enough to be equivocal." Prove it.

Nothing you said makes MMR being used in matchmaking sound appealing. Considering it at all results in a much higher rate of unfair matches than traditional matchmaking on win/loss only.

"remember that your post result MMR changes on the opposition MMR and not their CSR."
This makes no sense, why in the world we want to do it this way? This is what results in players above diamond 2 getting stuck in a lower CSR distribution than what should be their MMR distribution.

"We know the accuracy of TrueSkill2 - so it's not flawed"
The data they used is cherry picked, and they have not released the most important data points the model training considered. Why not? Because it would never hold up to scrutiny. All we need to do is look at the trend across the competitive team games that use it. People hate how unfair TS2/TM is at higher ranks. I am going to keep beating this dead horse until it sinks in - any system that does not build its ranks by only considering using wins and losses is flawed because that is all that matters in team matches

What I continue to not understand is why people think that having a more predictable match in matchmaking is better.** If matchmaking has done its job every match should be as close to a coin flip as possible**

[ruby knoll]

I prescribe to you 4 months of a padded cell

[obsidian pine]

I feel like the game is missing something. The Assassinations in game I wish came back.

[tardy turtle]

Yeah, I was really hoping we'd see those by now

[real vapor]

I hope in the next update they add wolftooth helmet attachment to other helmets

like anubis

[uneven bison]

And for mark 7 and firefall

Dual antennas would look really cool on those helmets

[verbal summit]

Shout out to the food callback from 343 8 days ago or so

[left snow]

It's not half mixing any metrics. Microsoft crunched the numbers and the only one that stood out in in terms of improving the efficiency of ranking was KPM.

Everything else was either useful but not worth the data footprint, not useful in terms of being washed out in the result, or actually a negative predictor of rank (assists?).

KPM is a very good judge of 1v1 skill. And that's arguably the most important skill. The only way to have an Onyx KPM in an Onyx lobby is to be an Onyx level player.

TrueSkill2 uses KPM as a weighting. And it appears to be used to identify big fish in a small pond. Where it can rank you up faster and/or detect smurfs.

I am a very average player - but I often get to play in high Diamond / Onyx lobbies (courtesy of better friends). In those games I can cultivate a respectable KD or KDA. I often lead the way in assists, ball time, and accuracy. But I am not an Onyx level player - and the easiest stat to prove that is my KPM in those lobbies.

As for CSR being equivocal to MMR - what's to prove. Your CSR is literally designed to chase your MMR. That's what it does. And if you are playing consistently (ie. your MMR isn't jumping all over the place) of course your CSR will closely match it.

The only thing I need to say to make MMR appealing to matchmaking is to say that it is the best assessment of your current skill level. What else do you need?

And I'm not sure why you are so against TS2. It literally ranks you according to wins and losses. Which I think from your post above is what you want. The effect of KPM is only a weighting - and is not a factor when playing vs your own rank (you can't fake your KPM). So in most cases you can ignore it.

And yes. MM is trying it's best to produce coin flip matches. But if you want two near-identical teams you are going to need a much bigger population. Until then it can only do what it can do with the population at hand.

[signal ivy]

I feel like this should have been a thread or DM lol

[coarse dagger]

Probably a good idea at this point, feel free to continue in a thread

[celest heron]

We've already talked about how there are so many other important things that contribute to wins and losses and the high margin for error particularly in objective based game types.
I'll only add that I believe Menke already tried adding obj stuff in the equation and it didn't turn out good.

[left snow]

It was Microsoft. It's detailed in their discussion paper.

[cloud pebble]

Do i want a brain aneseuym by trying halo2 legendary

Is it worth trying chat

[celest heron]

yes, and Menke also did his own tweeks with H5 which he talked about on Waypoint.

[empty rapids]

i did it with my boi

it's not as bad as people make it out to be

we did h2 legendary on my og xbox with a copy of h2 collectors edition

[left snow]

TS2 mentions "tunable" parameters. I assume they are various weightings to "nudge" your population into keeping a bell curve shape.

Menke himself always came across as a W/L man.

[cloud pebble]

Memorizing the jackal spawn points feel like a crapshoot

Weirdly i think the flood stages are easier bz of that

[tardy turtle]

Gravemind at level start

I will grant that Jackal snipers are manageable, but that... That was a monstrosity.

[empty rapids]

idk maybe i pushed it out of my head

it wasn't easy, but i don't remember it being that hard lol

[plain junco]

some of the spawns in h2 were pure bs but yeah it wasn't too bad overall

[empty rapids]

man why is it so hard to get invited into a comp/social game in infinite in the lfg channels. Like it's strangely inactive always

like, this is something i've noticed over the course of the last couple of months

[lime robin]

Does anyone know how to uninstall the HD textures on Halo Infinite and if you can uninstall them before installing the game?

[crystal iron]

on steam its under properties, dlc

[lime robin]

... right, I forgot to mention it's the MS Store 🥲

[plain junco]

rip

[crystal iron]

click on the 3 small dots, then manage game

[plain junco]

windows store sucks good luck finding it

[karmic ridge]

Probably cause the only people left playing are ones that know each other and don't want to play with a random person

Just a guess, but the games have fallen pretty far tbh

It's just the hardcore people like me who've become satisfied just playing on their own and don't expect to meet up with other people to play since the popularity has dropped so much

[plain junco]

i love getting mm into a 3v4 ranked

[cloud pebble]

Any landmarks for infinite to look forward to

Before it looks all gloom and doom

[empty rapids]

the game is fun, the gameplay loop is fun lol

just waiting on maps and stuff has been pretty slow, it's gradually ramped up though in the last few months

[plain junco]

i'm waiting on ranked rewards and progression that doesn't suck

[karmic ridge]

I mean it'll be ages before they add more stuff since they gotta port the whole thing to unreal 5

[woeful wigeon]

It s not half mixing any metrics

[plain junco]

yeah. slipstream seemed like a stupid idea in the first place, this was all accomplishable on the tiger engine or whatever they called the h5 one

[analog salmon]

Slipspace and it’s the same engine with better tools so no

What was stupid was not reworking the engine prior to halo 5

So much effort was probably wasted getting halo 5 shipped with existing tools that were then ultimately getting overhauled for halo 6

Probably one of Bonnies biggest mistakes was not delaying halo 5 so her studio could build the tools they would need for post-360 development

Anyhow

Berserking brutes are such a pain in this game if you don’t want to rely solely on the grapple

Like I’ve been playing mostly using thrust this play through but they just close distance too fast and eat bullets

[analog salmon]

Honestly some of the boss fights are also just borked on heroic if you don’t grapple

Not impossible but so annoyingly hard compared to the rest of the game

Imo they should have balanced the game around thruster and then if you wanna use grapple all the time that’s your choice

Like having to absolutely nail the thrust timing to avoid getting hit by escharum is just tedious

He just locks onto you even mid thrust

Also doesn’t help the hammer is just broken and damages you behind solid objects

I don’t even get it, you thrust out the way and he hammers the air next to you but you still die

It’s the most unsatisfying combat

If anything thrusting just gets you killed

I gave up, switched to grapple, and it was a complete cake walk

You just grapple to one side of the room, shoot, grapple to the other side of the room

Such a disappointing encounter

[restive otter]

Anyone having the most random "problem with dedicated server" disconnects with BTB?

[crystal iron]

eh, i just had my game crash while searching and i noticed a heap lot of stutter when scrolling through the armor cores and their menus after first launch into S3. i kinda like the new stuff visuals but the performance while already havign set everything to low is underwhelming

[plain junco]

clearly they weren't able to make use of any of those tools to a meaningful degree

it's foundationally the same engine. they've already abandoned it unsurprisingly

[jolly tartan]

Agreed

[analog salmon]

or modernising Blam takes a lot more resources and/or time then Microsoft would give them

I lean towards them just being unstaffed for developing a triple A title. Also over ambition since they really didn't need to bother with the open world idea. I wouldnt be surprised if the higher ups assumed because a lot of time was going into engine reworking and tools, that going open world would be easy.

frankly back in 2011 they probably needed to have had a significant amount of resources going into just reworking the engine/tool separate from those focused on shipping Halo 4

just like Bungie did dedicating a team to building the foundation of Tiger/Destiny while Reach was also in development

im not even sure Halo 4 had any significant reworking considering hitting 720p and subjectively improved lighting came at the cost of much reduced SFX quality

[knotty haven]

Will we have to rebuy the coatings for future cores?

[crystal iron]

If those future cores will have the same coatings, yes

[knotty haven]

So cross core coating is a lie😭

[tardy turtle]

Oh look, this again.

We don't know. There has been no news on cross-core anything.

[analog salmon]

i mean they are selling the same coating locked to different cores

what hasn't been explicitly said is pretty obvious at this point

universal cross core without double dipping is obviously not happening

i think the best case scenario is they allow all armour to work on Mark 7 core

since that would mean they could still sell cores locked coatings and they only have to make all armour compatible with mark 7 coatings

[tardy turtle]

Unless all of those coatings just get rolled into one

[analog salmon]

so you think even though they're currently selling the same coating for different cores separately, they're going to just effectively unlock it for people who only bought the coating once?

like im pretty sure they would then have to refund people who bought said coating twice

[tardy turtle]

I don't know, but it's possible

[analog salmon]

and what about people buying bundles of the same coating?

[tardy turtle]

No purchase is forced

Will it suck if that happens? Sure

[analog salmon]

its possible they could make everything free for everyone and just decide not to make any more money

[tardy turtle]

But it's like Preorder or Deluxe exclusive armor becoming available

[analog salmon]

obviously what's going to happen and what's possible are not the same thing

the difference is no publisher just gives away all its delux content for free a year later

[crystal iron]

No one has ever said that it’s true as far as I know

[analog salmon]

it was vague wording but in fairness it was clear what people thought they meant

so i dont really have any sympathy if 343 now came out and said "actually we didn't say you wouldnt have to buy the same coating twice for different cores, we always intended to charge you multiple times"

i think there is just an internal struggle within 343 between the majority of the studio who probably do actually care about the game in contrast to the sales team and management who just care about the bottom line because that's likely what determines their career success

hoping that a more player first approach to monetisation will increase how many players are willing to spend money is a risk they will not take

which would explain the mixed messaging around cross core. maybe the devs said sure cross core is doable, but the sales team are not feeling so generous

[tardy turtle]

It likely is a matter of getting the green light from Microsoft

[knotty haven]

Need customization team to open talk. The dev who actually communicate with players is only forge lord...

[fringe wharf]

anyone else noticed that footsteps dont work properly in this game after the changes 343 implemented on them for no reason?

you will never .... ever ..... hear anyone coming behind you until its too late. Footsteps used to work fine in the past and never had a problem with them but ofc what wasnt broken had to be fixed

try playing tactical slayer without footstep sounds and see how fun it is now

[tardy turtle]

Tbh I never really paid mind to footsteps even in SWAT

That said, filling tickets is the best way to get that addressed, though it is a known issue being worked on, if memory serves

[wind pumice]

bro does anyone elses game like randomly lag and teleports you somewhere ???? and now my melee attacks sometimes don't work

[uneven bison]

Rubber banding?

You probably are having some desync problems

[analog salmon]

devs will not have the final say realistically. cosmetics are not just another aspect of the product, they are the product. just because you make something doesnt mean you get to decide how its distributed by your company to their customers

in fact the level of dissatisfaction with Infinite's monetisation makes it completely impossible for the customisation team to have any interaction with the player base. they would just get bombarded with complaints they can do nothing about.

whereas obviously nobody expects the forge guy to be able to give them cross core lol

[final echo]

they should banned all extra devices of cheats and mods devices to play unfairly. Also disable agains a crew when it solo play make it extra hard to rank up

I start hate halo for that reason

[frosty hedge]

How long does the level up Set stay in the Shop?

[signal ivy]

until tomorrow at 1PM eastern

[plain junco]

Real Destiny production didn't start until after reach at the very least, they were still with Microsoft at this point. Bungie figured out how to adapt Blam to Tiger for destiny's application in a relatively short timespan; it's no secret Splistream caused massive issues for 343 and they had essentially double the time to figure it out. I'm not saying Bungie is in any way superior because Destiny had a slew of issues too (releasing half-baked, cut content literally installed on disc, etc.) But foundationally it was a massive shift in formula, halo has not been.

[final echo]

from gold 4 solo to gold 1 fk I wont play rank in teams

[plain junco]

Halo 4, with all of it's flaws, was put together in 2 years and released complete on launch, with a fully fledged customization and progrsssion system to boot. I find that truly remarkable even if 4 was a meme gameplay wise

[analog salmon]

i dont really know what you mean by "real Destiny production" and Bungie split from Microsoft well before Reach

Just after Halo 3 launcher iirc

and Tiger is forked from a Blam core that branched off from Halo 3's codebase

of course they were focused on Reach as a studio but a decent amount of resources were going into Tiger a long time before Destiny

[plain junco]

Pre production maybe. But real production didn't start until around when reach was mostly finished. Keep in mind destiny was basically ready to go in 2013 but got its story hacked up

https://youtu.be/e6poyWQVZAA seen these videos?

[analog salmon]

they were pretty open about the development of Tiger and how much work went into building it. They had engineers working on Tiger before the engineers working on ODST had even finished and started on Reach

Reach being built off ODST, not a separate branch of code as is sometimes assumed

[analog salmon]

the exact same thing can be said about Reach

[plain junco]

I know. Which makes infinite all the more funny

[analog salmon]

and I would say Reach is far more of a technological leap from ODST then 4 is from Reach

[plain junco]

Absolutely

[analog salmon]

I just think Microsoft has not taken Halo seriously since Bungie left, it's always been about milking a cash cow to them. No real understanding of the fact it requires investment to stay relevant

"if COD can just rehash the same game every year why cant we"

obviously 343's developers understood that wont fly but they can only do what they can do

[plain junco]

Microsoft has let the franchise sink into the ground for over a decade at the hands of 343. Take that in, the same span of halo 1-reach and we have had meme after meme for 4 entries straight

[signal ivy]

4 entries?

[plain junco]

H4, h5, mcc, infinite

[signal ivy]

ah

[plain junco]

Least halo wars 1 and 2 were good

[signal ivy]

4 was amazing

best in the franchise

[plain junco]

Storyline wise it was alright. Everything past that point was either downgraded or changed to mirror a very obvious competitor. Infinity gamemodes were a joke but otherwise I liked the MP

[analog salmon]

there's not really a distinction between Microsoft and 343 management. You clearly have the talent and ambition at 343 but what can they do

[plain junco]

I don't know, I'm not either. But what I do know is halo infintie had a budget of 500 million USD, so I'm really not certain it's about investment

[analog salmon]

its pretty obvious to me. Its not rocket science that when your starting up a new studio using tools that are outdated and unfamiliar to your expanding team, you should spend the money and time fixing that before building a new title for a new console generation

that to me shows complete incompetence at the top

and that's not speculation, it's confirmed by Bonnie herself that the team complained about the tools throughout Halo 5's development

[coarse dagger]

That budget is nothing more than a baseless rumor

[plain junco]

Oh for sure, Halo 5 I actually sympathize with because that game made up for the launch within 2 months

[plain junco]

Fair enough

[analog salmon]

I mean it's clear the management weren't aware of the need to allocate resources towards engine/tools when it was needed back in 2012, so i wouldn't be at all surprised if they under-resourced the development of the new engine and tools for Infinite

[fallow merlin]

Does anyone know what the architectural inspirations are for Bungie era Forerunner structures.

[analog salmon]

ultimately its about having people in management who understand what's required to keep up in the video game industry, not just how to run a business

[glacial tartan]

Maybe after 10-15 releases we’ll start to realize if 343 can do it or not. Personally I’m unconvinced, every game so far has been a booming success and 343 can’t be blamed for anything yet.

[analog salmon]

tru

[glacial tartan]

I say give them another decade or so of Halo, why change a working model

[plain junco]

I just find it quite strange that the 343 employees who did mention things only ever took issue with Microsoft themselves, which looking at the intern policy they had would make more sense

[knotty haven]

Contractors

[plain junco]

Look, I'm wholly convinced a modern day Halo 3 isn't happening. What I do know is if 343 is to continue developing halo Microsoft either needs to let halo take a very long development period, if that's necessary to have a complete, functional title at launch

Or end it

[glacial tartan]

My comment was 100% sarcastic

[plain junco]

And give the IP to one of their recently acquired studios, which I thought was going to happen when I saw the thing on Twitter which was then not true

[crystal iron]

imagine that Spartan.

[plain junco]

Hahaha, can't tell these days

[analog salmon]

most idiotic thing Microsoft could do is lay off all of 343. its not going to happen but Christ if you can't see the underlying potential in a game like Infinite and how much talent that studio clearly has idk what to say

[glacial tartan]

Is anyone seriously talking about laying off all of 343?

[analog salmon]

pretty much its what's implied when anyone saying they should give the IP to someone else

[iron scaffold]

people who ask "why is 343 still allowed to make halo games after so many failures" don't seem to realize that in spite of how much the community might consider their games to be trash that they have been successful from a financial perspective.

[plain junco]

Obviously that's the worst case scenario. Microsoft won't kill the cash cow after how ludicrous the shop and battle pass systems have become.

[iron scaffold]

and a financial perspective is all microsoft needs to let them continue

[plain junco]

Of course. Though Doom Eternal and Elden ring sort of proved if your game is good it will make money anyway

[iron scaffold]

clearly they don't really care about public perception if the game makes bank

[plain junco]

Well, that's their prerogative. I sleep easy knowing I haven't spent a dime on infinite, we'll see if Microsoft cares

[analog salmon]

problem is for a free to play game, Infinite probably has pretty high average revenue per player. For me personally Halo is the only game I've spend a dime for just cosmetics (two Battle Passes)

so i can imagine management spinning the game as being a great success from that perspective

[iron scaffold]

granted its somewhat hard to know with infinite given the campaign is on gamepass

[analog salmon]

i think the game would do at least as good financially with a player first approach that encourages more players to spend money because there's value

but at the end of the day, if it's making money how things are, Microsoft are a business and will avoid the risk

why ultimately I think independence helped Bungie a lot

they likely cared a lot about their reputation

now, maybe not so much lol

[glacial tartan]

Microsoft acquired Bungie before they even released Halo right?

[plain junco]

Yes

[glacial tartan]

Doesnt seem relevant to mention Bungie's independence here.

Although you may be describing the short period between Msoft and Sony that Bungie had

[plain junco]

I would spend money if that were true. I'm not spending money on a battle pass with half of the things I don't want in it. I spent more on Halo 5 than infinite, even if the difference is only about 20 bucks. Just keep in mind that I will still rail bungie day in, day out. I do not place bungie on a pedestal because it's not the same company anymore, and Destiny was far off of what we were shown. That being said I have spent more money on Destiny than likely halo as a franchise because of how their DLC system works

[analog salmon]

its relevant because Bungie was not absorbed into Microsoft to the point of becoming a merely a division of XGS

343 is very much a division of XGS

so i mean their degree of independence they had throughout their time under microsoft

which was enough that they could amicably split off

microsoft didnt do that out of kindness

[plain junco]

Bungie was smart from day 1. 343 was made specifically to produce halo, I don't think anyone but old bungie could really grasp what halo development should look like

[glacial tartan]

Ah you actually meant "true" when I sarcastically said 343 cant be blamed for anything

[analog salmon]

the industry has just changed, the cost of producing a triple A title has skyrocketed. you cant just say "bungie developed great games in 3 years so there's no excuse why 343 can't"

[plain junco]

But again games like elden ring exist, and they did that in about the same time span as infinite, heck they even made their game open world just like infinite

Sony seems to have a much better grasp on their game development, as much as I hate to say it

[analog salmon]

i just think its a meaningless comparison. we dont know enough about 343 to say they did or did not have enough resources, but there's a lot of indication imo that they are under resourced and Microsoft attitude to Halo has been to milk it rather then grow it

[knotty haven]

Agree. We know how long it takes Fable, Perfect Darkness, Hellblade2 and Avowed to develop, and there is still no news about Gears 6

XGS has a bad management over their studios

[plain junco]

I'm not saying 343 isn't entirely to blame, but I think one of the biggest yikes for me was the "we hired people who hated halo" thing. That was just a trollge moment

[uneven bison]

I feel like there’s more context to that statement

[plain junco]

I think the recent acquisitions might have been intentional for Microsoft. They probably knew they don't have much to go off of for first party games

[glacial tartan]

343 has owned Halo for longer than Bungie at this point

Eventually people need to realize what that means

[knotty haven]

Yeah, but who knows whether those newly acquired studios will also suffer from poor management. It would be funny if we see all Xbox games fail

[uneven bison]

Well exclusive wise, that certainly won’t happen

Last I checked Forza was doing pretty well for itself

[knotty haven]

Check dlc then

[uneven bison]

I’m not entirely sure what that’s supposed to mean 🤨

[plain junco]

That's like the one exception because Sony hasn't made a decent racing game since like gt5 lol

Sorry wrong reply

[analog salmon]

The fact Certain Affinity was mostly responsible for developing Halo 4's multiplayer shows how much commitment Microsoft had to developing an internal studio to replace Bungie...

In 2012, Certain Affinity tackled the challenge of Halo 4. Alongside 343 Industries, Certain Affinity developed features and content for Forge, the map and game mode editing tool. Additionally, Certain Affinity developed multiplayer game modes including the Dominion game mode and full concept-to-feature-complete development of 10 PvP maps. This project showed off Certain Affinity’s resources as a multi-disciplined studio, providing engineers, artists, and designers who functioned as a core extension of the 343 team and delivered one of the year’s largest titles.
https://www.certainaffinity.com/games/halo/

[uneven bison]

Well it still kinda applies actually

Sony has not made a good racing game for awhile

[knotty haven]

Their dlc for Forza5 is badly received and old fans thus hate PG

[analog salmon]

between the agreement Bungie would leave Microsoft and the release of Halo 4 is 5 years, for some context

[plain junco]

Aye. I miss the motorstorm days

[uneven bison]

Oh, I haven’t played forza in forever so I didn’t really know anything

Probably shouldn’t have said anything in the first place 😅

[plain junco]

Wait so 343 didn't even really do the multiplayer...

That actually makes it even funnier

[analog salmon]

"full concept-to-feature-complete development of 10 PvP maps" and they also did all the DLC

[plain junco]

Wow

[uneven bison]

For 343 or Certain affinity

[plain junco]

So 343 only worked on the campaign and still messed it up

[analog salmon]

imo it shows that Microsoft were not serious about building an internal studio comparable to Bungie

[uneven bison]

That’s more a matter of opinion, because whereas multiplayer can be objectively bad, campaigns differ wildly

[magic night]

It says Certain Affinity worked on multiplayer, but it does not say they were the ones working on it exclusively.

[knotty haven]

Same with Infinite campaign, just check the credits list..

[plain junco]

I find that a little hard to believe after what bungie did for microsoft, frankly. I get what you're saying but ehhh

[uneven bison]

Like some people love halo 4 and vehemently hate halo reach campaign wise, so it’s tricky to pin down just how good a campaign is

[knotty haven]

Airship images did the character art
Adamhawk did the concept images
Axis did animation
CA gave them project directors
Counterpunch studios did animation
Experis did a lot of the testing
Insight global gave them a general manager
Lakshya Digital did art
Liquid Development did art and 3D art
Mandali games did the enviroment art
Mindwalk did animation
Naure Studios did character art
OF3D did enivroment art
Pixel Mafia gave them directors and 3D art
Red hot GG did Art
Pixel Smash did the UI
Room 8 Studios did enivroment art
Skybox labs gave them forge, art and animation
Spearasoft did art and animation
Coalition did animation, gameplay, narrative, rigging, and design
Undead labs did animation and technical art
@plain junco

[uneven bison]

At least for halo, because I heard cod vanguard campaign was absolutely terrible

[analog salmon]

"Certain Affinity developed multiplayer game modes", what exactly did 343 do in terms of the MP experience?

[plain junco]

I'm not so sure I agree with muliplayer being objectively bad, but halo 4's campaign was extremely linear in comparison to the battlefields of 3 and reach. Would have been a good time to focus on the story and that is a high point of it, but some parts are kind of jank like the librarian explaining us the entire situation with the didact in 5 minutes of dialogue like bruh

[analog salmon]

i mean im sure 343 were involved in some capacity given they had to be

[magic night]

That wording doesn't indicate that they exclusively developed game modes, just that they worked on an usnpecified amount of game modes

[analog salmon]

you cant develop a halo campaign and mp in isolation

[uneven bison]

That’s bad writing, which can also be objectively bad cough Attack of the clones cough

[plain junco]

Yeah...

[analog salmon]

i mean its halo 4, its not like its a huge leap from halo reach

[plain junco]

I don't consider Attack of the clones objectively bad, not after the Disney memes

[uneven bison]

Those two are more similar than people give them credit for

[uneven bison]

I don’t hate the story I hate the writing. It gave us the clones after all, which are one of the best parts of Star Wars

[plain junco]

Fair enough, we got the chad clone wars series so yeah

[ancient sun]

Does anyone know what happens if you try to enter a code on Waypoint for a cosmetic you've already got?
Does it tell you that you already own the item?

Because for the 2xp codes, it obviously didn't do that.

[uneven bison]

But Disney Star Wars is bad as in it’s like offensively bad, like ruining luke, and disregarding established lore rules for the sake of spectacle

[plain junco]

Yeah, and retconning several elements of the EU

[uneven bison]

Whereas prequels are just poor dialogue bad

[plain junco]

Republic commando 2 when

[uneven bison]

Now!

[plain junco]

Give me imperial commando, that would be a good sequel

Not the turncoat crap we got in battlefront 2

The new one that is

Can you imagine a game like that...

[uneven bison]

On a side note, I’ve noticed Disney has been tossing more legends material into the new shows. Mount Tantiss in the bad batch was originally a mountain from the thrawn book trilogy that Cboath used to lure Luke into

And uh, all of the Ahsoka trailer

[plain junco]

I'm not surprised. They can't come up with anything good themselves so of course they draw on content they dismissed years ago

[grave ether]

Yeah, I've tried a code before I didn't realize I had redeemed already and it said something like "code has already been redeemed"

[ancient sun]

I know it says this for when you try to use a specific code that was already redeemed.
But what if you had a second code for the same item?

[uneven bison]

They can, because we got rogue one and andor, they just won’t take time and actually try and make a movie that’s good, instead of a cash cow

[plain junco]

But that's what I mean both of those are drawing from established things

[grave ether]

It might work like a twitch drop where you can redeem it again but only have one in your inventory, but I wonder if it uses up [wastes] the code or not

[uneven bison]

Really? I’m not aware of very much pre established lore around the Death Star plans

Wait dark forces never mind

[ancient sun]

This is what I'm trying to find out

[plain junco]

Yeah. Plus the period of 3-4 was even established in the movies, and games like Force Unleashed made that their entire setting

[uneven bison]

Force unleashed from what I understand was less then canon

[plain junco]

It is now...

[uneven bison]

Due to some glaring plot holes that some endings create

[grave ether]

It was canon until it wasn't

[plain junco]

If disney didnt change some things the good ending would have most definitely have been canon

[grave ether]

Only one ending is a canon one. Just like Mass Effect has a canon despite what we pick

[plain junco]

Ye

[uneven bison]

There was some stuff in EU that definitely should not have been kept, but a lot of it could’ve been kept

[plain junco]

Yeah like I get it, right, I'm not certain if something like Death Troopers needs to be kept, but Old Republic? Come on man

[grave ether]

That's kind of the fun of star wars though, it's all out there in every direction and you get to build up and enjoy what you pick and choose because there is so much to pick from now

[uneven bison]

There was a comic I read, I don’t remember the name, where Luke and Leia went into some sort of bubble city, and on multiple occasions refer to blasters as “laser pistols.” And they also have a very passionate smooch

[analog salmon]

Sir, this is a Wendy's

[plain junco]

Uh oh

[analog salmon]

sorry xd
im just joking continue

[plain junco]

Society if 1313 wasn't cancelled

[grave ether]

Look, the Christmas Special exists. Need anything more be said about star wars having good and bad elements simultaneously

[uneven bison]

But the Lego Christmas special…

I hereby dub all Lego Star Wars shorts canon

[plain junco]

Lego star wars is canon don't care

[grave ether]

No no, the Christmas Special

[plain junco]

Based

Yeah the og

[uneven bison]

Mind evaporator.

Nuf said

[plain junco]

Still waiting on the Boba fett Christmas special skin for battlefront 2

[uneven bison]

Dice was pulled over to freaking 2042 instead of finishing battlefront 2

Still salty about that

[plain junco]

God I meme on 343 a lot but DICE is especially frustrating

[uneven bison]

343 is competent compared to the clownfoolery that ea and dice pull

[plain junco]

Im pretty sure out of all the times dice Stockholm messed up, dice LA cleaned up the mess

At the very least that was true for 4

[uneven bison]

Dice is Harvey dent the way I see it

One half corrupted, the other a good man

[plain junco]

Yeah

2042 was the nail in the coffin for me

I will not be buying another battlefield game for a long time

[uneven bison]

I heard 1 is super active

[plain junco]

I swear, 1 and 5 look graphically superior to 2042. How does that happen?

Haven't played in a bit but not surprised

[crystal iron]

the same way a 2007 halo game has better explosion effects than a 2021 halo game

[plain junco]

Ah, true

[uneven bison]

One was an explosion, the other was a small pop!

[plain junco]

Fire.jpg

[uneven bison]

You ever seen the beginning of velocipastor?

[plain junco]

Can't say I have

[uneven bison]

Hold on let me find the gif

[plain junco]

It won't let you upload just put the link

[uneven bison]

https://youtu.be/Bg82z3UWLQQ

[plain junco]

this

this is satire right

[uneven bison]

Funniest thing I’ve seen for awhile

I think it is, there is just no way it’s serious

[plain junco]

That's even worse than oh hi mark

[low musk]

Has there ever been a discussion or news recently talking about any future content for the game?

[uneven bison]

There is an event soon, I think, some new weapon leaks but very little has been revealed

[low musk]

I haven't been looking for leaks, though the interest for me has been slowly fading. Hopefully we may still have a shot at some Firefight and hopefully more vehicles/weapons in the future. God I miss the Mantis

[plain junco]

Most of the content will be forged, I reckon

Happened to halo 5

[low musk]

Yeah. I don't entirely hate that. I've seen some pretty good stuff from Forge, especially that 'Last Resort' map that looked pretty nice, even though the scripting issues kept the blades from spinning

[plain junco]

Oh I don't either. Just sort of ironic

[low musk]

If they can bring back the OG Shotgun and Railgun, maybe a few other really fun weapons, I'd be happy just having those so when Infection eventually returns, there might be more fun to be had, though that is subjectively an opinion on my part

Imagine how big the game might get if they actually made a Halo 3 Anniversary xD

[plain junco]

I think you're better off looking to community mods for that, the most that'll happen officially is a season dedicated to halo 3

[karmic ridge]

Nah

Oh come on, the bot censors me when I just try to describe something

Well screw it, I'm not typing all that out again

[coarse dagger]

It was 1 sentence, but ok lol

[signal ivy]

lol

they typed more complaining about it than just retyping it

[low musk]

I am impressed though with the community for last resort. I’m really looking forward to a ‘Stand-off’ remake if it hasn’t already been made

[crystal iron]

the CE remaster mod by Kashiiera looks good, just play that

[loud egret]

Halo

[crystal iron]

Halo 2

[uneven bison]

Halo 3?

[loud egret]

Halo 3 ODST

[crystal iron]

Halo wars

[loud egret]

Halo CE: Anniversary

[crystal iron]

Halo reach

[uneven bison]

The timeline has been ruined!

[crystal iron]

It’s alternative timeline lol

[loud egret]

Im bad halo fan

[crystal iron]

Halo combat evolved

[loud egret]

I forgot about reach

[crystal iron]

Let’s start again

Halo CE

[ocean palm]

How much do you guys think it would cost to create a suit of mjolnir armor and augment a humans body to wear it?

[crystal iron]

huh that was weird, opening the nvidia overlay on mcc made my monitor turn to 100% brightness

flash banged

[red kiln]

Fellas i just got my first ever Infinite perfection!

[crystal iron]

Billions to even create this technology

[plain junco]

unthinkable cost. if you want a real alternative though look into 3d printing, fused deposition modeling using a steel or aluminum infused filament

[wanton torrent]

General question. Can random people just join my forge session? I can’t figure out a way to make it private/unjoinable. After I ran a public custom game a bunch of randoms keep joining while I’m trying to fix problems in forge? I’m very confused

Seems like a glitch but I’m not sure

[crystal iron]

and again it confirms itsself: too many cooks ruin the soup

[ruby knoll]

Eh

[rugged quartz]

Try going into custom games and setting the lobby private

[wind pumice]

oof

[left snow]

Played a couple of games of Ranked last night before going to bed. Both were 25ms ping! After pretty much a month of 220ms+. It was awesome! So nice to actually land a melee... and not get shot around corners.

I even died once because I jiggled behind cover with my shields crackling and I took my hands off the controller expecting to just drop dead... and I didn't... and then came a grenade and I couldn't pick up the controller in time to avoid it. 🙂

[crystal iron]

what a joke that game just was, BTB CTF on Breaker and half of my team was doing nothing, counting the sand particles or so, 0 kills 0 deaths 0 assists or even just deaths. nobody dared to cross into enemy territory, nobody picked up power weapons, i felt like watching a kindergarten

[crystal iron]

Unbelievable. How is it possible that your whole team was like that?

[left snow]

I had a game last night, in ranked, and twice a team mate walked up to me with fully laden rockets - and dropped them at my feet. Like for me to pick up and use, not trying to kill me. I was flabbergasted.

[crystal iron]

yeah its super weird

[crystal iron]

Cool

[grave ether]

Good teammate good. Must protect

[crystal iron]

my god i just want to win one BTB - either half the team is braindead or the game just randomly crashes with less than 80%GPU util and not even 50%CPU util
why does the performance degrade so much with each new P-A-T-C-H? the game was more stable in beta

[coarse vale]

anyone got any tips for diamond to onyx? ive been stuck diamond 3 for ages

[white birch]

Could be a disconnect issue, like it was two or so weeks back. I'd load into a game, run forward for like 2 minutes then lag out instantly. Apparently I was still in the game though or something so.

[left snow]

After the second one I did actually follow them around and help out!

[lime robin]

Oh man, this Sniper coating looks sick.

I guess it'll be worth it to do the challenges in one night

Even though I have to wake up at 7:00 AM

[tardy turtle]

I just need to finish my Drengr armor set so I can finally make my Armors TikTok

[signal ivy]

Mfw I forgot to do my challenges

[tardy turtle]

When do they reset?

[signal ivy]

tomorrow at 2PM eastern

[tardy turtle]

Ope, there goes mine lol

[golden field]

Did they fix the bug where your settings would reset when you started the game?

[flint fiber]

Agree or disagree? This helmet should be added to infinite https://imgur.com/a/RYMFwGW

[uneven bison]

Well it kind of is for mark 7, but for the mark v b it isn’t

[knotty haven]

https://twitter.com/DeanThePigeon/status/1645401649731518464?t=XdmJOREXhcOUjE9eszPA6g&s=33 Imagine mk4 in Infinite...

[lime robin]

I just got to the ultimate and felt an immense laziness feeling

[lime robin]

Mkay, I may not be so bad after all

pain

[coarse vale]

Yes. Pain.

[lime robin]

And done

Not gonna lie, these matches restored my confidence on Sniper MnK

I sucked at it on BTB for some reason, but here I was relatively stabler.

[velvet cosmos]

Congrats on the quick finish.

[lime robin]

Now, to sleep

For I have to wake up at 6:00

[velvet cosmos]

Sleep well.

[frosty condor]

That’s what I did Sunday

[zenith holly]

Hard to believe it could take someone almost two days at least to complete the challenges.

[flint fiber]

Well it did used to go on the reach armor

[lime robin]

I was stuck on the road on Sunday

[wind lark]

What is the chief’s fav food

[crystal iron]

dorito covered pizza

[novel lodge]

Taco bell Powered rocket launcher

[plain junco]

Chiefs favourite food is an MA5C assault rifle. It is an air-cooled, gas-operated, magazine-fed, fully-automatic bullpup rifle that fires 32 rounds of 7.62×51mm ammunition

[sick egret]

is it normal to have 160 ping when hosting online custom games?

i assumed it was going to be better or as usual (i'm around 60) but it is worse somehow

[outer sand]

Tears of his enemies

[outer sand]

Traveling is fun

[spark bluff]

Wrong

[outer sand]

My bad

[spark bluff]

I mean unless wanting to throw up your guts is fun

[outer sand]

Depends who you ask

Do you get car sick?

[crystal iron]

can someone explain how people just oneshot-melee you from the front?
No matter where I hit, its always just shieldbreak and then another slap. But i just again had a dude just leaping towards me from the front in sniper game with me not having any damage and he just slaps me and im dead instantly.

same for double-melee, i can hit melee as fast as I can, its a slap, recoil, slap - i had a dude in the same match just leap-slap me and instantly slapping me again while I also slapped him but had still my slap-recoil going .. like how do ppl melee twice as fast?

[grave ether]

Backsmacks are one hit, always possible someone shot you at the same time you got punched in the front. Did you get theater to watch it better?

[crystal iron]

32TB storage on my rig, i record every game i play since im in QA for documentation

[grave ether]

That's not what I asked but ok

[crystal iron]

i have it live recorded, theater afaik is not a great source of information. if they didnt completely overhaul the system, it sometimes even loads the wrong map while trying to review a game or doesnt load correct assets

[young glen]

So much slapping ahhhh

[grave ether]

The point is, did you review the footage to see what might've happened? And theater can be a good tool since it's close enough despite its load asset issues as it lets you see from more angles.
It's been my experience when I encounter scenarios like this, If I go back and watch the footage, I'll see something else happening that I missed while in the match.

If the case is that you didn't miss something, then send in the footage in a ticket to support so they can see what's going on.

[crystal iron]

reviewed it frame by frame, we slap each other, no gunshot can be heard or muzzle flash can be seen in the first and i die, he lives to tell the tale. second one I miss him with the S7, he knocks me out onetap with melee, no backslap which would have a different kill icon

[uneven bison]

I have the feeling that 343 wants each armor to be more “seasonal” and the mark 7 be the one they consistently add stuff to.

In which case I’m not complaining.

[crystal iron]

aaand crash

man social slayer is nice to play but 1 out of 3 times it crashes midgame

[north stag]

Oh I hate that so much

esp on the MCC where I get punished if I don't rejoin in time

[crystal iron]

yes you just stickied 2 ppl and cut the ziplining guy in half, thats a nice load of medals you just got there, would be a shame if I just accidently cra--

[north stag]

I should play that playlist maybe I liked big team social a lil better tho

[analog salmon]

Honestly I would take 6 month seasons to avoid the stability issues. The game has never been this broken for this long since the BTB being borked

I don’t play very often any more but dear lord it’s a struggle

loses connection to infinites servers so I have to restart and then it resets my settings

[gilded arch]

Is it just me or does it feel like the Bandit rifle should do more damage than it actually does?

[analog salmon]

Actually I lie my setting are okay this time 😄 just played the cinematics again randomly

[analog salmon]

Think the problem would be it would be meta over AR and SK with any more damage

[fallen flame]

you would not want 6 month seasons let's be real haha

[analog salmon]

Only feels weak compared to single shot precision in past halo games

[gilded arch]

Wouldn't that be a good thing though?

It would be a solid competitor with the BR

[analog salmon]

I mean it depends how many maps per season, if we still got 3 maps a season I would be happy to wait as long as 5 months for the next season if it means stability

[fallen flame]

Stability issues would be nice to have, i really want PC optimizations mostly though

[gilded arch]

BTB CTF can get crazy

[analog salmon]

Honestly I would be fine if the map team focus on BTB

Bandit completely changed BTB for me, I really want more of Oasis

[misty vale]

BTB is the best mode and it ain't close imo

[analog salmon]

I’m an arena and BTB guy

But I just think forge maps in infinite are good enough that really the art team should focus on BTB

I still think btb needs more vehicles but it’s undeniable the bandit along with the various vehicle balancing changes have improved the gameplay a ton

Whereas in Season 1 BTB was just not a good experience for me

At minimum I hope we’re getting a btb map every season

[fallen flame]

problem with btb at the moment is the vehicles

and the pelican drop in is so bad

[analog salmon]

The bigger map helps avoid one team stealing the others drop

The drops on high power are so neutral that it’s really just whichever team has the upper hand gets all drops

[fallen flame]

why can't it be like the old way where it all spawns at the base

it does work on some maps but even so i still want it like the old way tbh

[analog salmon]

I’m actually amazed they shipped an update that completely breaks the customisation menu at times

[tardy turtle]

? Spawns have always been where it's safe

[analog salmon]

You would have thought the whole way the game is monetised having a major issue would be a priority

Generally if a restart fixes a problem it’s not a big deal but when restarting can reset your settings it kinda just makes me lose all interest in customisation

[plain junco]

Bandit is fine it's the recoil that makes it trash against the br

It's not visual anymore so you do have to compensate

[fallen flame]

Bandit is amazing

[plain junco]

I lost all interest in customization when I realized the only tangible method of using said customization is by paying for something I then have to progress like 80 levels for a measly amount of armour. It really is stupid though how a bug like the reset hasn't been fixed yet

[fallen flame]

the battle pass is cluttered with the same old items which makes it not good

[plain junco]

It is but compared to the H5 DMR there is actual recoil not just visual bounce

[plain junco]

Yeah that too

[analog salmon]

Recoil is what infinite nails. Bungie should have utilised recoil not bloom in reach imo

Well less bloom

[plain junco]

They should have but in h5 the DMR was honestly on par with the BR I'd say

The role of the bandit is... ambiguous? If it's not a long range precision rifle, and it's a mid range rifle, it does what the BR does but worse on every metric that determines operability at that range, like zoom and physical recoil

[fallen flame]

there is so many xp and challenge swaps in the BP

[plain junco]

Yeah the BP system is such a terrible replacement for reach/4 Era progression it's not even funny

[fallen flame]

and then you got the same emblems and that and the same coatings on different tiers

[plain junco]

Like I would spend money on this game if the progression didn't suck

[fallen flame]

same with some of the armour pieces make the same shoudlers bundled together in the same tier

[plain junco]

Ironically OW2 has this saaaaame problem. No real point doing anything but ranked because that's the way you can get gold skins and that didn't change since ow1, but in infinite doing ranked is literally pointless besides a stupid emblem

[fallen flame]

that's why i don't bother with ranked haven't even touched ranked in infinite

[plain junco]

Yeah, don't blame you

[smoky wave]

The good thing is they don't expire so I don't have the feeling to "play all day" for the bp

[fallen flame]

that's the best part about the BP

[smoky wave]

There are some stuff that needs to be improved tho

[plain junco]

Yeah but they don't expire in MCC and they are objectively better in MCC

[smoky wave]

But overall I'm fine with it

[fallen flame]

i'm all for improvement on the BP but i usually get the BP for progression

[plain junco]

I just don't care, I want more capstone challenges and challenge based armour customization alongside a standard leveling syztem

Remember how H4 did it, like that

[fallen flame]

we have to wait and see what they do with the progression system

[plain junco]

Been just over a year, frankly every live service title has this bs now so I don't see it changing

[analog salmon]

I basically see it as a replacement secondary to the AR. The sidekick and AR are too close and have too big of a gap with the BR in BTB, you get spawn trapped too easy

[plain junco]

When the Dollar Store accounted for 50% of all new retail openings in 2022 the BP system is here to stay because people are only spending a few bucks max

[plain junco]

Yeah they do, what I'm confused on though is the DMR is closer to that of the H5 magnum in TTK but without the BS aim assist or magnetism which is good, but they gave it some relatively strong physical recoil

So at most mid range engagements you're better off using the BR anyway since it's just point and click

[gilded arch]

I love being kicked for inactivity when I can't even see what's happening because it wouldn't load up

[analog salmon]

Honestly sidekick+AR starts is just dull

[fallen flame]

the sidekick is dull

[analog salmon]

The bandit should just replace it across the board

I think comparing the bandit to the BR is just the wrong comparison to make. It only has to be good enough that you can take on a player that’s picked up a BR

Rn the sidekick can’t do that outside of relatively close range

So it just doesn’t work well as a secondary to the AR

The bandits weakness in close range is a non issue paired with an AR

Ranked will probably have to stick with BR but the bandit makes social much more enjoyable for me. Right now I’ve lost all interest in quick play because of the sidekick starts

Im confused why team slayer has AR+BR and AR+SK starts but not AR+Bandit

[plain junco]

The problem is the br just is more consistent across the board, you need a little bit of time to train the compensation on the DMR where as on the BR the recoil is all visual

[analog salmon]

Yeah I switched to kbm this season so I can’t really judge how the bandit feels for everyone but honestly I would be fine with making it easier to use for controller if that means it can be more widely accepted

Like the BR is still pretty easy for controller

[fallen flame]

is there something wrong with the aiming lately it feels so off

[plain junco]

I am on KBM too but I would say the recoil actually hurts pc players more than console because the sticky aim sort of counteracts some of the recoil anyway

[magic night]

BR has a slow time to kill and is consistent/easy, the Bandit is slightly faster and slightly more difficult to use. Seems pretty straightforward to me in terms of balancing.

[white birch]

Skill vs reliability

[plain junco]

That would be true if the recoil was all visual, precision semi auto rifles will always be more difficult than 3 round burst or automatic weapons regardless of the game because the punishment for missing one round is more than missing one from a burst

So when you tack on the physical recoil, now you also have to compensate your shots

[magic night]

That's part of the risk/reward play and where skill comes in.

[plain junco]

Of course, but this is identically why scouts haven't been relevant at any point in Destiny's PVP and it's all visual recoil there

In h5 the recoil was all visual so the BR and DMR were basically on par (ignoring all the magnetism and aa on both) just dependent on the scope for the range application

[white birch]

Dead Mans should ahve been able to two-tap people from halfway across the map. The rifle looks like an elephant gun, let it hit like one

[plain junco]

I'm still not convinced that was a scout

[white birch]

Eat dirt, Hunter Hand-Cannon Stasis users. I STILL hate you

[plain junco]

It was an exotic hand cannon in disguise nice try Bungie

[olive brook]

mcc keeps kicking me out of matchmaking when it finds enough players and the games ui just stops working after

[analog salmon]

i think 343 should just ignore the haters and make Team Slayer and Quick Play switch up the loadout. I wanna see:
AR+Bandit (all maps)
AR+Commando (all maps)
AR+BR (maps without long sight lines)
AR +sidekick (only small maps where someone picking up a precision isn't going to spawn trap easily)

[young glen]

That seems like it'd be fun

[white birch]

Community Collection having AR/SK works pretty well, maybe they can keep it there.

[serene furnace]

One of the highlights of MCC and Halo 5 is having a dedicated action sack playlist

Infinite could benefit from that too, nothing but wacky custom games that will actually give you xp for the progressions, especially with how advanced Forge is in this

[vast halo]

Woah did anyone else see that cinematic that played after the weeklies just reset??

[crystal iron]

What cinematic?

[vast halo]

The same one I’ve seen every single time I’ve started halo since season 3 dropped

[devout kite]

Can the game modes be in alphabetical order please lol

[teal idol]

What does the last upgrade for threat sensor do?

[serene furnace]

Increases the area of effect and shows you a healthbar for the enemies that updates in real time

[rugged quartz]

Why would you even comment on that like that..?

[undone arch]

why does everyone think you have to 3 cap everytime, just hold 2 in strongholds EZ

[crystal iron]

https://twitter.com/HaloSupport/status/1645859561700757504

Halo Support (@HaloSupport)

Three new community-made Forge maps have been added to #HaloInfinite matchmaking via a backend update! Curfew, Solution, & Vagabond are now available in the Community Collection, Tactical Slayer, & Fiesta playlists. If you're playing, relaunch to see these changes in-game. (1/2)

Likes

163

Twitter · Apr 11, 2023, 6:41 PM

[deft bloom]

Did they take any out or just added 3 new ones

[proven pollen]

added 3 it seems

old ones are still there, at least I have played one so far

[teal idol]

Curfew's a sick one. Haven't played vagabond I'll hop in there and check it out

Salvation's a great social map and I think the other two from round one could be good ranked maps

[analog salmon]

idk about that last bit lol

[ruby iris]

I love how Infinite's menu's just don't even work half the time.

[crystal iron]

user error

[ruby iris]

No really https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/2058749335396722709/8B6D1474C3D593D7A414167B1560C9DB1FF79C02/?imw=5000&imh=5000&ima=fit&impolicy=Letterbox&imcolor=%23000000&letterbox=false

[coarse dagger]

Submit a support ticket

[sullen kiln]

Please refer to the Halo Support site for additional information and/or to submit a ticket concerning any issues you may be experiencing.

https://aka.ms/HaloSupport

[ruby iris]

The Halo Infinite drinking game, every time the game crashes, take a shot. I'm on my third.

[crystal iron]

I used to wake up excited to play halo btb, now I wake up wondering what my next halo support ticket title is going to be

[smoky oasis]

I guess I've lucked out. I haven't really had a crashing issue since S3 launch, and not really before that.

I've played a lot of Infinite, so proportional to my number of games I can't really be mad at the crashes I've had.

Maybe I've spoken too soon lol

[young glen]

Neither have I.

I actually crashed like... +5 times on the Xbox One versus maybe 1-2 times on the PC since launch. I guess we're the lucky ones considering some people get their setting reset all the time and stuff, argh.

[ruby knoll]

ditto for pc

[sullen anvil]

Should the MCC get an update where it’s intro matches the Infinite intro?

[smoky oasis]

I've had my settings reset a few times but I never change much so it's always a quick fix.

[crystal iron]

would kinda be pointless when many people have disabled new skins

[sullen anvil]

God MCC sbmm sucks

I love getting farmed every round just for winning one close game

[ruby lake]

is peacemaker still gonna be in the shop tomorrow?

[sullen anvil]

Oh my god I WANT ONE ROUND WHERE IM NOT GETTING FARMED WHAT IS THIS GAME

[smoky oasis]

Peaceeaver, yes. It'll be in the shop all week.

[ruby lake]

YES

i was getting anxious because i really want that bundle ever since i saw it in the trailer

[sullen anvil]

I win one single very close match and then I’m just put with fresh installs and against people who have been playing since launch

[smoky oasis]

Yeah, man, SBMM is rough. Sadly it has pretty much taken over all of multiplayer gaming.

I'm not a fan of it either. But I don't have any meaningful suggestion to fix it.

[sullen anvil]

Simple. Relax it a ton or just remove it entirely. I’m sick and tired of these horribly unfair matches

[smoky oasis]

Removing it leads to pretty poor player retention sadly.

[coarse dagger]

Did you encounter these same issues in previous Halo games?

[smoky oasis]

I would be in favor of maybe relaxing it though.

Not knowing any numbers behind it of course.

[sullen anvil]

I never got to experience halo back in its heyday. I stay away from infinite because it’s too competitive for me. I get more balanced matches with MCC but some times it just pulls a complete 180. If I win one single match, the rest of my games are basically steak wins for the enemy team

I seriously want the sbmm relaxed a ton in the “social” matchmaking of MCC. I got to play the legacy games before they shut down and Halo 3 felt so much more playable compared to MCC

[ancient sun]

Seems really strange that the narrative story items are not earnable, but paid in the store.

[sullen anvil]

I can’t even play custom games now because I’ve left so many matches in a row now. I couldn’t stand just getting farmed every match. It’s horribly unfun

Why can’t I just kick back, shut my brain off, and just play halo

[young glen]

Wouldn't this be due to SBMM being weak?

[sullen anvil]

it’s driving me insane

even if I do get better at the game- I’ll still get punished with horrible teammates so there is no winning

I’ve never touched ranked halo in my life but for some reason I can’t help but feel like I’ve been playing it all this time. Instead of it just being Ranked, there’s just some label taped over it that says “social”

[ruby lake]

it is

[smoky oasis]

No, not necessarily. He could be being placed in games that are above his capabilities because someone on his team has a high MMR and it's "balancing" the teams.

[smoky oasis]

Frankly, it has been that way for a very long time. Often times the only difference between ranked and social is the visible rank. Matchmaking will be stricter in ranked, but even ranked will allow you to play with people above or below you, if search times require it.

Halo 3 operated on a similar system.

[sullen anvil]

Most of the time I was the top scoring player

[smoky oasis]

That is a pretty good indicator that SBMM is at play.

[sullen anvil]

These matches I was only getting to like 5-11 kills

the first match of the day I was getting farmed on a pit slayer

Seriously don’t know what I did to deserve this. I’m never usually the mvp but typically the top 50% of the team

shouldn’t I be matched and paired with players that match my skill level more instead of just giving me fresh installs going against HCS world champions

I seriously don’t know why “social” is so sweaty

[smoky oasis]

Well I don't know what to think. On the one hand you're saying that most of the time you're the top scoring player, and then the other you say you're usually never the MVP.

Not sure if SBMM is the issue here.

[sullen anvil]

I’m meaning the top 3

[ruby lake]

i just pray i get that good players lol

[smoky oasis]

Top scoring doesn't mean top 3, it means top scoring.

Bad teammates happen. No matchmaking system will ever prevent that.

I don't have the time to go digging into your match history or anything, but SBMM usually only negatively effects people on each end of the skill distribution.

[sullen anvil]

I’ve only had like one close game my entire day so far. The rest have just been steak wins for the enemy team. I seriously don’t know what to think either because I’m not a good player at all

Everything that I’m saying right now probably doesn’t even make any sense anymore or keeps contradicting a previous sentence or argument

[smoky oasis]

Well I get that you're frustrated. Matchmaking can certainly do that.

[sullen anvil]

Could it be because of low population? No one ever really plays H2A MP and each game has been horribly unbalanced every time I played

[magic night]

Low population is the primary reason skill based matchmaking provides subpar matchups.

Not enough players within your immediate skill range and with a decent enough connection to provide a match within a reasonable amount of time, so it expands the search parameters to include players from a wider skill range. It'll still try to make the average skills of both teams as close as possible.

[round forge]

I only just realised a bug in Halo: CE Anniversary. At the end of the first stage when using anniversary graphics the Halo ring isn't there when you are shown falling towards it. It's such a huge thing I'm shocked I never noticed it before.

[sullen anvil]

Oh my god I just played another match and I GOT ROLLED AGAIN WHY DOES THIS GAME HATE ME SO MUCH I JUST WANT TO PLAY HALO

I tried getting back into matchmaking after a little while but no guess I’ll not be playing

[left snow]

I think people are mostly getting frustrated with the match maker. Because of low population (and/or squads) the teams are made up of a wide skill spread. This leaves some people having to "carry" and others having to hang on to survive.

But we need SBMM. Random would be a lot worse (unless you're a very good player who likes to chill back with double figure KD, or a streamer).

[sullen anvil]

I understand the importance of sbmm but my god getting farmed game after game is getting really frustrating and instantly removes me from halo in general

and with their competitive focus with halo, why should I even bother playing if they won’t cater to social players

I also hate the argument “just get good” because that has so many cons too. If I get good then I’ll just get paired with worser teammates and making me having to do all of the heavy lifting and 4v1 all the time

or 8v1, 12v1 you get the idea

[left snow]

But the alternative is worse. Those that "get gud" farming their stats.

I really think 343 need to take a different tact. Introduce some sort of handicapping system so that players of all skills can compete on the same battlefield. You could play with scores (less for killing a lower ranked player), weapons and equipment (the better ones don't show up for better players), and spawn abilities (eg. a temporary OS on spawn).

We've experimented with scripting to have games that track your in game K/D. And your score for being killed changes with that (K/D x 10). And when you spawn back in you get an OS for between 5 to 60 seconds depending on how you are going (5 + (1 - K/D) * 55). It's worked pretty well - and the lower ranked players feel involved and get a chance to actually improve - as opposed to being constantly spawn killed.

The "penalties" for being good shouldn't really worry anyone - because it's a social playlist and you are just there to play Halo with your friends. But in the end people will argue that they "deserve" to be good. And we're back to square one.

[crystal iron]

divert all resources to odst 2 🐀

[round forge]

Not ALL resources but it should certainly be getting made.

[crystal iron]

divert 99% of resources to hiring hans zimmer compose new odst jaz music, other 1% for game dev

[round forge]

I'd say the biggest focus should be bringing on more staff as it is evident to me that they don't have enough staff to manage the workload they have giving continued maintenance to two separate games, not to mention future titles.

[turbid terrace]

WTF happened to Infinite? It's been a while since I've played but it took less than a minute to encounter the same freaking crashes as everyone else. I just got crashed out of two games already and had been basically teleporting in-match. Plus, just getting into a game doesn't work the first time around. Jesus f-ing christ man.

[formal stratus]

are there community maps in fiesta right now?

[spark bluff]

How many more years until they fix Halo infinite?

The ping is so trash

[crystal iron]

well mcc released in 2014, and didn't start getting proper fixes until 2019 so 5 years

does 343 still add things to the MCC on pc? If so can the add the customization option to add or remove the ammo belt to chest pieces in halo reach ?

[fallen flame]

2018 for console 2019 was for pc I'm pretty sure

[crystal iron]

console also got the seasonal update releases when the games came out 1 by 1 on pc with fixes n stuff

[rotund radish]

im getting 40 fps when i always get 120 and my aiming is so weird when everything is the same

so much bugs in the update

[tame crane]

Is there a way to see how many matches you've played with a specific person in halo infinite? Asking because someone says ive played less matches with another person than with them and im not sure its accurate.

Whoever answers this please ping me so i see the response

[left snow]

Halo Tracker has a most played with list. Not sure how accurate it is. Or over what time frame it extends.

[tame crane]

how do i find that?

[left snow]

Go to HaloTracker. There is a menu bar just under your gamertag; Overview, Matches, Detailed, Medals.

Choose Matches.

Scroll down and on the left had side under the Activity Panel is a list of team-mates and your games / win percentage. But I don't know it's context.

[sharp ginkgo]

When do you think they’ll announce the season 3 extension?

[onyx latch]

The extension to the season they shortened?

[sharp ginkgo]

Shortened by 7 days?

[onyx latch]

If it got extended it'd likely be back to the original length.

[sharp ginkgo]

But no roadmap or anything for season 4

[tepid latch]

we're barley halfway through season 3 my guy

[onyx latch]

Eh. I'm not expecting anything until it's one month out tbh.

[sharp ginkgo]

This was the last road map. Covered a lot of content : https://www.google.com/search?q=halo.infinite+roadmap+season+3&rlz=1CDGOYI_enAU859AU859&hl=en-GB&prmd=niv&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjJ75-mxqP-AhWOyzgGHbe6CuQQ_AUoAnoECAIQAg&biw=414&bih=724&dpr=3#imgrc=M85dgQRuV2s8SM&lnspr=W10=

[tepid latch]

you made a forum post about this and everyone tried to tell you that, why are you coming back here

[onyx latch]

Doomposting?

[tepid latch]

fr

[sharp ginkgo]

A road map from November 8th , 2022 to June 27 2023. Is a long time to have a nice idea of the future of halo

But now…. Nothing.

When was the last ODST drop pod content update?

[tepid latch]

The roadmap was made because players were unsure of the future of halo infinite content and seasons were 6 months long, Season 3 has dropped with tons of improvements and they've assured us that they are on track for seasonality (to release at a consistent pace) If we're getting content every 3 (and a little bit) months, there is very little reason to keep dropping roadmaps. No other game does this either, you dont see CoD, APEX or Fortnite dropping constant roadmaps for the future of their content, they release a teaser and a trailer towards the end of the season and then we all wait in anticipation

[sharp ginkgo]

They stated for more transparency between development and the player base, and yet after knowing what was coming 8 month in advance, we don’t know what’s coming out in two months. That said, the two develops who made this statement have since left the company so, unsure how far that statement will go.

Kind of the same with the Cross core statement

[onyx latch]

Yep, I was right.

[sharp ginkgo]

Asking questions isn’t doom posting.

[tepid latch]

You've asked it already in a forum post and got your answer there too

[sharp ginkgo]

Triggering your own insecurities with the franchise isn’t my problem

[onyx latch]

Lmao

[tepid latch]

🤷

[onyx latch]

"Insecurities"

[sharp ginkgo]

Assuming you have both spent a lot of money in the in game store, and feel like your investment is being questioned here.

[onyx latch]

Right. We're insecure.

[sharp ginkgo]

Sorry to hear that

[onyx latch]

🙄

[wide trout]

Where was this forum post made?

[tepid latch]

https://discord.com/channels/471722331820130324/1094713568202596352

the first portion is hard to read 😭

[onyx latch]

The Forerunners and the Covenant, apparently. Regarding your RvB reference.

[sharp ginkgo]

I would be surprised if season 4 contains anything more than some forge maps and a new range of cosmetics (shaders, emblems etc) you are considering a 7 month and 11 month season was made when they had an extra 70+ staff members, and now they have to deliver more content with less. They’re either gatekeeping content (infection, firefight etc) already in the game, just not made public or they’re outsourcing work again (halo 4, halo 5)

[wide trout]

Right so, @sharp ginkgo, you’ve already gotten into an argument with another moderator about this, I’d advise that you discontinue or you may face a warning or a mute

[onyx latch]

... And the Banished too, actually, considering the Ravager.

[fleet whale]

[onyx latch]

Well, that likely just made it very easy.

[tepid latch]

😬

[wide trout]

With pleasure

[onyx latch]

I'm sure his 39 subscribers very much enjoyed his content.

[vast jetty]

Greetings Spartans and Troopers.

[wide trout]

Hey Marge

[tepid latch]

oh... oh my, i cant believe i live in the same country as him 😭

[modest violet]

Resorting to bigotry was a wild 4D chess play there

[noble urchin]

how the heck do you leave a customs lobby after the match is over?

[obtuse storm]

Fireteam menu?

[crystal iron]

whos the mapdesigner for Launch Site?
delete your resume and leave the industry mate..
cant believe it, cramped layout and then you place Aircraft spawns on the map and you know what would be extra fun? u kno, how about we add invisible walls everywhere in the AIR that deal DMG when you fly against them?!

the real fun is to fly fragile aircraft in the air just to ram into an invisible maze of walls that deal more damage than 80% of the entire weapon loadout available to spartans

[analog salmon]

There’s no wasp / banshee spawn lol

It’s just how fiesta works

You can get a tank on launch site or behemoth

[crystal iron]

its not just fiesta, aircraft can spawn in different modes on that map

[analog salmon]

Such as

[crystal iron]

and tanks are okay, they dont leave the ground and they cant see their obstacles, invisible walls 60m over a building kinda hard to spot

[analog salmon]

Such as?

Didn’t think so

I don’t play fiesta and I don’t care for it, but if you have a problem with how it spawns vehicles, maybe give them feedback about that

It’s quite obviously completely random and has nothing to do with how maps were designed

Only factor that seems to determine what vehicle can spawn is how big the pad is

I don’t even play fiesta barely ever and I know this

As for launch site, it could quite easily be fixed. With Bandit starts and some changes it could easily be a fan favourite for One Bomb or One Flag

It’s obviously not great for a lot of modes but neither was High Ground

[fiery pewter]

Bruh, they still haven't fixed the setting reset bug?

[crystal iron]

what really bothers me is the invisible walls
its 2023 and we have a truckload of games that are close to 20 years old that have "exclusion zones" where you can fly in but not stay as foot soldier bc else you lose HP or die after a countdown. simple as that.
Not even hard to program, and even if you cant have that, why place invisible walls anyway? its not like thats the main exploit to sit on a building roof in the middle of nowhere when the game objective is hardly ever to stay alive the longest

[noble urchin]

the fact ppl can just camp inside the loot rooms on Fragmentation to keep control of the objective points in total control blows my mind. literally nobody can get in there until the door opens, and every time it does, theres a dude with overshield and rockets waiting lol

[crystal iron]

or a gravy hammer

rdy to deliver some hot sauce

[spark bluff]

This is just dumb

10 bandit kills and cannot be swaped

Ultimate is trash

[coarse dagger]

Try and keep it constructive please

[hasty hedge]

Lauchsite could definitely get wider. Seems too one-sided since it's mainly purp[sed for one flag.

I could see it be made into a ring "O" shape than a U shape