h1-high-heat-strategies

[undone tartan]

I can’t really explain it

It’s just

[steel widget]

[trim sigil]

Deadpan and smile kinda clash ngl, though I could see it a bit

[quartz mantle]

is

[steel widget]

Lies

[undone tartan]

Yeah I definitely don’t think it matches the emoji you said

[trim sigil]

🤔

Unless I am the only one who sees both dusa and bouldy smiling

otherwise I'm simply confused

[undone tartan]

Yes, they are smiling. That doesn’t mean they’re the same as the smile emoji

Zote is also smiling in the emote

That is certainly not how that emote is used though

[trim sigil]

the upside down smile is also not a 100% smile, so yeah

[mossy zinc]

Lol people use for anything and everything.

[left prism]

is versatile

[lucid atlas]

So then could be called the “Shattered Shackle” of emojis?

[flat flicker]

[undone tartan]

What

Shattered Shackle is very situational

[undone tartan]

Alright. I changed my mind. EM4 is just impossible. I give up.

I can never and will never beat 50 heat with EM4 and it’s truly idiotic that I keep attempting it

I’m going back to RI2

[narrow carbon]

If you don’t like RI2 either, then Hestia and Rama can handle AP2

[undone tartan]

I’m not going back to Hestia

That was so miserable

I hate RI2, but Hestia does not make it any less terrible

[narrow carbon]

Yeah, I don’t like the reload-dash-shoot waltz either

[undone tartan]

Wow I love that this Erebus gate spawned 4 bruiser warper brimstones from 4 different directions

I absolutely hated that Hestia literally has some rooms that are unbeatable. There are some rooms in Tartarus or Elysium that are automatically a run ender and that makes me want to die

[lucid atlas]

[undone tartan]

Yeah RI2 basically is barely fun at all because my build is terrible and I get nothing but garbage from every door. But at least it’s actually possible for me to win

[next wyvern]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/516820825777635338/892798427325431858/20210929_224152.jpg

can i get out of this?

or is this dead run

it started great

[hardy garden]

savior numbskulls

[undone tartan]

What weapon?

I would argue that RI2 on its own is worse than any 20 heat pact

I would argue that RI1 on its own is worse than any 20 heat pact, actually

[next wyvern]

it's chiron 32

[undone tartan]

Oh Chiron? Yeah that’s a dead run pretty much

It absolutely sucks

I empathize with that

[next wyvern]

But hey at least thid is early

not like teleporting speeder mini wheels

[undone tartan]

Yeah it could have been chamber 34

Nah those are fine

[next wyvern]

nope

i cant react fast enough to those bs

[undone tartan]

The issue is speeder savior greatshields

That’s a dead run for most weapons

[hardy garden]

hl4 fo2 em4

[undone tartan]

I stand by what I said

[eternal hare]

you get used to it after a while

[undone tartan]

Maybe EM4 AP2 LC4 HS would be worse

I’m honestly at the point where I’d argue that Dark Foresight is better than Greater Reflex

Second best thing on the mirror

Still not better than DDs obviously

[next wyvern]

at least it isnt clone saviour

or else i'll cry

Rip my epic artemis special

[undone tartan]

Why is cloner savior or cloner seeker possible but speeder seeker is not? Those are both worse than speeder seeker would be

[next wyvern]

you will be mised

Oh btw

for Chiron

Special volley or concentrated one is prioritized?

my guess is special?

[undone tartan]

Relentless of Concentrated you mean?

[next wyvern]

ya

[undone tartan]

“Special volley”

[next wyvern]

i mean

it gives you 4 more special

[ripe ermine]

Concentrated > Relentless but either is good. Both is better

[next wyvern]

seems pretty special to me

concen is better?

or is it depends on which special boon?

Relent would be better on like Demeter special right?

[ripe ermine]

It’s more damage than relentless regardless. Yeah maybe with Demeter and arctic blast

Relentless is still good. I’m not turning it down if that’s on offer

[undone tartan]

But conc volley makes your special do more than double damage. That’s also pretty special is it not?

Piercing volley makes your special do +400% damage to armor. That sounds kinda special

[bronze viper]

This is true for paper math but there are a lot of instances where if you're in a weird position, like next to a wall, lots of enemies, or in point blank range, where concentrated might not do much at all

I mean I'd still take conc over relentless probably, since it doesn't hurt your animation time either.

Concentrated also has nonsense interactions with special speed. Idk if you need rare or epic (I think epic) but you can get multiple sequential volleys to stack the concentrated buff between them.

[jaunty falcon]

I think you might also need relentless for this? Not sure exactly

[bronze viper]

Yeah not sure.

[undone tartan]

Well relentless also makes your special animation longer

[solar maple]

it's possible with just conc volley, but relentless/special speed/both makes it way less finicky

[undone tartan]

That’s absurdly strong

[solar maple]

eh sort of

you have to special a bunch of times in a row which means you're basically locked in place

[undone tartan]

Wouldn’t that triple your special damage, if not more?

[solar maple]

it's super jank to get to work on its own -- you have to angle your special precisely and it only works at certain spacings

and moving enemies can mess it up

[undone tartan]

Yeah but I mean with relentless and special speed

[solar maple]

yeah if you get both it will do a ton of damage

[undone tartan]

I’d imagine that chaining 4 specials like that could chunk an entire Hades phase with the optimal build

The optimal Chiron build would make EM4 look so easy

More so even than Beowulf would I bet

[solar maple]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/787779476888354816/887145463793475604/chironAngle.mp4 here's an example

first I do the specials normally, then I stack them with the angle

this is conc + relentless, no special speed

[undone tartan]

But then the third special

But yeah that’s very interesting, thanks!

I didn’t know you could do that until today

[solar maple]

with special speed you don't even need to angle it

just mash the special button lol

or at least with good rarity

[undone tartan]

Does rare work?

[solar maple]

I don't remember exactly

[undone tartan]

Fair

[solar maple]

I was meaning to try to do an em4 run with this strat but getting perfect hammers in high heat

also I suck at chiron lmao

[undone tartan]

How can you suck at Chiron

Is there more to playing it than I thought?

If so, I’m also bad at Chiron

[solar maple]

[undone tartan]

Would you say relentless volley is the 5th best Rama hammer?

[eternal hare]

no

[solar maple]

I prefer pretty much any hammer that has the word "attack" on it

[undone tartan]

Sniper shot?
Repulse shot?

[solar maple]

it's better than repulse

close to sniper

[undone tartan]

Explosive?

[eternal hare]

explosive is a fine 2nd hammer

if you have twin/triple 1st

[solar maple]

but yeah twin/triple >>>>>> everything else

[undone tartan]

Ofc

What if you have drunken or frost flourish?

[solar maple]

I mean relentless is better than nothing

[undone tartan]

Sure sure

But I would have thought it’s a lot better than Explosive or Sniper

[bronze viper]

There's always Painkakke's Chiron 50

[solar maple]

there is that yeah

[bronze viper]

It's a different build path. If you start Dio and aim to pom aggressively then relentless can be very good.

[undone tartan]

Well I definitely wouldn’t do that tbh

Is it better than chain shot (especially if you have triple or twin already)?

[eternal hare]

twin chain >>> twin relentless

[bronze viper]

Chain triple is bugged

[undone tartan]

Yeah I know

[bronze viper]

Relentless only matters if you have dio or maybe Demeter specials. And even with Dio, only if you get it early with poms

It's great if you fulfill those requirements though.

[undone tartan]

With Thunder Flourish, how many bolts will you get without relentless and how many will you get with it?

[eternal hare]

1 and 1

[quartz mantle]

There’s no delay on the special arrows so you get one (1) bolt from it relentless or no

[undone tartan]

[eternal hare]

it's quite bad

[quartz mantle]

Although

I swear I’ve noticed it do more with relentless so that may be either confirmation bias or the special arrows bouncing between enemies more and generating more bolts that way

But nothing particularly grounded in any actual research so take that with quite a bit of salt

[bronze viper]

Relentless + thunder is still fine since it makes your AoE in crowded rooms a bit better and makes ricochet more consistent

It's not like... Amazing though lol.

I'd still say it's definitely the 6th best hammer lol, but Rama gets a great hammer pool also because it can't get flurry (oh man if only) concentrated or charged (it used to be able get charged LOL)

Or piercing

[undone tartan]

Is it wrong to say that Dark Foresight is better than Greater Reflex?

[bronze viper]

Uh. I guess? It's like comparing apples to greater reflex oranges though lol.

[eternal hare]

they do different things but I reckon people tend to be able to clear much more consistently with a second dash more so than if they had only a single dash but more non-meta resources

[solar maple]

also depends quite a bit on the weapon

[bronze viper]

3rd dash is a lot less important than 2nd so I'd say that foresight is better than +1

[quartz mantle]

They’re like different things tho

[bronze viper]

+2/+3 are different beasts though, they are pretty degenerate boons

[solar maple]

I'd want 2 dashes on sword but on shield I'd take 1 dash DF

[eternal hare]

are you sure pseudo

didn't you coach me into doing 50-heat shields with just an attack boon and cshot

[solar maple]

did you see my zag shield 55? RI3

[eternal hare]

you have neither the 2nd dash nor DF in that case though so that doesn't invalidate anything

[solar maple]

but yeah both DF and GR have variable values on different aspects

[bronze viper]

Also it's kind of hard to separate in my head because "not having dark foresight" is so often heavily correlated to -50 health and -100 gold, and no rerolls

[solar maple]

and they are both very different

I probably still have only like 5 clears with any levels of RI lol

[bronze viper]

Mirror good

[solar maple]

beo 54, rama 50 hestia 50. Is that it? lol

oh and zag 55

oh and I did a zeus 50 with RI3

so that's 5

[bronze viper]

I only play with RI0 now lol. I don't really tryhard this game anymore so fun wins out over not fun

[eternal hare]

idk man I think ri2 is kinda fun

[bronze viper]

Copium overdose

[eternal hare]

nothing makes me feel more alive like barely being able to afford a sell boon by a margin of 1 gold in the tart endshop

[solar maple]

it's hard to keep pushing heat because at a certain point I run out of options that aren't RI

I guess I should just do 56 next

I also still really want to get that fresh file 32 heat clear but it's too hard. have to run RI3.75 lol

idk part of the fun of the game is making weird builds and utilizing them in new ways

like that beo run I did where my dash did more damage than my cast vs bosses

[hoary pasture]

special beo best beo

[solar maple]

banned

[eternal hare]

was that the blade dash run

[solar maple]

yeah that was my arty cast 50 with blade dash

blade dash best dash btw

[bronze viper]

Why doesn't it viciously cycle

[solar maple]

it does but only half

[bronze viper]

Wuh

Blade dash still hunts iirc.

Half?

[solar maple]

nah it doesn't hunt

[bronze viper]

Lame

[solar maple]

Vicious cycle is a SCAM and only does half what it says it does on most blades

[bronze viper]

Which half. Didn't even know it did multiple things

[solar maple]

#787779451865399368 message

posted a bunch about it on speedcord

[bronze viper]

Welp

That sucks LOL

[trim sigil]

Not being able to access the linked msg also sucks, heh

[jaunty falcon]

Ares aid: +2 damage

Slicing flare: +0 damage

Everything else: +1 damage

[trim sigil]

Ah, thank you. Yeah this is depressive

[jaunty falcon]

The linked message is in the speedrunning discord, doesn't look like youre in it

[trim sigil]

Well, that's why i couldn't access it, indeed

[hardy garden]

thats kinda a scam

[undone tartan]

How about on rail?

[undone tartan]

I disagree with every fiber of my being

[undone tartan]

How about not being able to afford it by 138 gold

[undone tartan]

It does “+2” except actually +1 on everything except Ares’ Aid

[jaunty falcon]

No

+0 on slicing flare

[undone tartan]

Also that

But who uses slicing flare

[jaunty falcon]

I'll check

Kontra?

[solar maple]

I did 50 heat slicing flare

[undone tartan]

Damn

[solar maple]

it was miserable lol

[undone tartan]

Yeah that sounds really awful

AP2?

I’d imagine AP2 is the only way that could be bearable, RI2 or EM4 would be hell

[solar maple]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/725021639506526249/819773395980910612/Screen_Shot_2021-03-11_at_7.21.11_PM.png I mean it was hell

[undone tartan]

EM4

Yikes

[solar maple]

also pretty funny at the time I was struggling with hestia 50 heat lol

[hoary pasture]

gamer

[solar maple]

somehow I was better at slicing flare beo than hestia

[undone tartan]

Wait. How are you at max health? Where did the last 6% come from?

Wait that’s just normal touch of Styx

[solar maple]

patty + athena DD boon

I think

[undone tartan]

Even if that’s ToSD, that should only add up to 94%

Unless

[solar maple]

DDs heal a base of 50%

[hallow garnet]

sorcery

[solar maple]

that's not SD

[undone tartan]

Ohhh

Right!

I got it

[dense oasis]

https://imgur.com/ienJPjL

How can I make 40 heat a bit less painful

[undone tartan]

What aspect

First: remove CP1 and put JS1 instead

[jaunty falcon]

Remove CP

FO2

Do that

[dense oasis]

fo2 less painful?

[quartz mantle]

Less than AP

[dense oasis]

He said CP

[undone tartan]

Next: Remove AP and probably a level of CF and put FO2

[quartz mantle]

Yea

[waxen relic]

with FO2 the pain will be over quicker.

[mossy zinc]

Definitely do FO2. What aspect are you using?

AP1 is fine.

[dense oasis]

I am gonna try Demeter Fists

[quartz mantle]

CP1 and AP1 are 3 total heat

[dense oasis]

Eris doesnt work

[quartz mantle]

Interesting

[undone tartan]

You want to do your first 40 with fists?

That’s certainly a challenge

[jaunty falcon]

Ouch

[quartz mantle]

AP1 can be fine but you should definitely do FO2 first

[undone tartan]

I don’t advise AP1 at all, personally

[quartz mantle]

And I'd put heat into HS before CF personally

[undone tartan]

I wouldn’t

[dense oasis]

Ok here goes nothing

[mossy zinc]

HL5 LC4 JS2 EM2 BP2 MM UC FO2 HS DC2 AP1 TD3 should be decent for Malphon if you're going with Lightning Strike.

[dense oasis]

YEah zeus

full zeus

always

[mossy zinc]

Yeah, do that then.

[undone tartan]

If you’re not used to HS, I’d probably not use it especially for fists

Lernie is gonna be harder than champions

[mossy zinc]

You're also quite alone in saying that, though.

[quartz mantle]

Idk if it's just me but I struggle more against base Theseus than I do against chariot man lmao

[undone tartan]

Alright

[jaunty falcon]

Not on fists

[undone tartan]

HS on fists at 40 heat seems like an awful idea to me

[jaunty falcon]

So does EM3

[undone tartan]

Honestly Lernie might be harder than Hades with that pact

[mossy zinc]

Just... stop walking into magma.

[shy plinth]

Seems like a good problem to have

[undone tartan]

Nyaa they’re new to high heat

[mossy zinc]

m talking to you.

[quartz mantle]

I really think you're over valuing HS

[undone tartan]

Have you done 40 heat with fists?

[mossy zinc]

Indeed.

[quartz mantle]

Idk man it doesn't seem that bad

[gaunt fiber]

It's one heat sir no less

[quartz mantle]

True!

[undone tartan]

Uno have you ever done EM2 HS with fists

[quartz mantle]

Yea

[undone tartan]

Alright

[quartz mantle]

Pride lernie heads are annoying but like other than that it's pretty fine

[undone tartan]

Well I still strongly disagree

[mossy zinc]

I did 41 Heat with Malphon when nobody else had and y'all hadn't started playing the game yet.

[gaunt fiber]

I've done EM4 and HS

[dense oasis]

3 rooms in tartarus

progress

[undone tartan]

In fact, I would probably avoid HS for my 45 heat fists fun.

[quartz mantle]

Alright you do you

And I will avoid CF for my 50 heat runs

[jaunty falcon]

Just do 50 heat without HL5 LC4 HS

[mossy zinc]

I mean if it works better for you, that's fine.

[jaunty falcon]

EZ 40 heat

[undone tartan]

I just think, especially for someone who’s new to high heat, that HS on fists is not a good idea at all. But whatever, I’ve already said that. Kat, let me know if you die to Lernie (for science)

[mossy zinc]

Reviving for SD healing without HS takes forever, too.

[undone tartan]

It really doesn’t take that long

[mossy zinc]

It does.

[undone tartan]

Three seconds is not “forever”

[gaunt fiber]

No HS for magma reset is the true hell

[mossy zinc]

It's a lot more than three seconds, though.

[shy plinth]

Three seconds is like how long a GY spin attack takes to charge up

[gaunt fiber]

Mr Hat please

[jaunty falcon]

4 seconds is forever, and that's peer pressure

[mossy zinc]

What if it's bugged and actually 5 seconds. No one would ever find out.

[jaunty falcon]

Yep

[undone tartan]

So your argument is that HS is good because you can save a few seconds resetting in lava

[jaunty falcon]

What if it did 8× damage sometimes

[solar maple]

don't get me started on peer pressure 👀

[shy plinth]

Imagine if giant chunks of damage just ap-peered out of nowhere

[quartz mantle]

Beo moment

[flat flicker]

[undone tartan]

You can also save so much time resetting in the Hades fight by getting hit by a pot

[shy plinth]

Eh that's kind of unpleasant though

It's a very jarring experience

[mossy zinc]

I didn't say lava. You said lava.

[undone tartan]

It tends to happen with fists

[gaunt fiber]

🥁

[shy plinth]

I just wanted to make the pun

[undone tartan]

Fists are probably the most vulnerable weapon to Hades pots

[pseudo flame]

HS is Heightened Security the trap perk right?

[shy plinth]

Ye

[quartz mantle]

No It's Hot Sauce

[gaunt fiber]

Hyper Sprint

[pseudo flame]

that one sux on the last area 😦

[mossy zinc]

I mean that kinda depends on the player that's piloting the Fists.

[jaunty falcon]

Hush selivery

[undone tartan]

Hey Frost you record a fresh file win yet?

[quartz mantle]

We're adding sriracha to the Pact of Punishment for some extra spice

[pseudo flame]

lol didn't i tell u I'm focusing on hell mode Fresh clear

[undone tartan]

Mmmkay don’t forget to record it

[pseudo flame]

and prolly gonna try it again weekend

but if i feel like doing fresh file normal, i suppose i could ss it

[undone tartan]

Screenshot?

[undone tartan]

Yes it does. This is a player who’s heat PB is 32. So…

[gaunt fiber]

Are you trying to look down on people

[undone tartan]

No

I’m saying they’re probably not extremely experienced at avoiding traps with fists, since they’re newer to high heat

I’m not either, as I have made kinda obvious

[gaunt fiber]

Avoiding traps with fists is not that much different than other melee aspects

[undone tartan]

Specifically lava against Lernie and pots against Hades

[gaunt fiber]

The difference I can tell is the Lernie fight where you have to be patient

Other than that it's the same

[pseudo flame]

HS is just not noticeable so much until u accidentally got hit most of the time, and cost u DD

[gaunt fiber]

Absolutely

It just happens

[undone tartan]

Not gonna be a DD, it’s gonna be either your only stubborn defiance or it’s gonna be your entire run. It’s 40 heat

[pseudo flame]

but well, if you're 40 heat

ur skill level should be good anyway

[undone tartan]

Which they are

[pseudo flame]

so should not worry too much

[undone tartan]

They haven’t beat 40 heat before

And I believe their PB is 32 but I could be wrong

[pseudo flame]

i mean, 32 heat a lot of people jump to it, so there's easier build

[gaunt fiber]

Heat PB has nothing to do with HS lmao

You try it, you die, you pay attention

[undone tartan]

I have beat 45 with 5 aspects and I still have a lot of trouble with HS fists

[pseudo flame]

PB?

[gaunt fiber]

Personal best

[undone tartan]

Well they were saying it did

They said “but well, if you're 40 heat, ur skill level should be good anyway”

[pseudo flame]

that's just my opinion 😄

there's no reward for 32+ heat

felt like average people would stop there

[undone tartan]

Interesting. Have you beat 40 heat

[pseudo flame]

i'm sure i answered that b4

guess you're not listening

😦

[undone tartan]

Yeah, it was rhetorical

[gaunt fiber]

Yeah some people have their souls bound to the game

[undone tartan]

My point is, why would you know if you’ve never beat 40 heat? It’s an interesting opinion to have since you have literally personal experience or even a decent logic to back it up. It seems like you kinda just made it up

[pseudo flame]

how would you set up 40 heat then?

[undone tartan]

#h1-victory-boasting message

Worked for the 19 aspects that I beat 40 with

Ofc just because it worked doesn’t inherently make it optimal

[gaunt fiber]

"I'm not looking down" :)

[undone tartan]

I’m not.

They asked

[gaunt fiber]

Oh you added a period that must be right

[daring hedge]

late to the lernie HS discussion, but honestly i've found that one of the most important things to keep in mind irt that is: you can dash into and out of lava without getting hurt with the right timing, which will frequently save you from getting hit by various lernie attacks

[undone tartan]

Huh?

[shy plinth]

Didn't you question the personal experience during the shackle discussion yesterday despite not having your own

Can't do both things

I'm all about academic discussion but it's hard to keep track of what's acceptable here

[undone tartan]

I’ve done runs with shackle, just not truly boonless

[pseudo flame]

ur 40 heat is already different than mine

[undone tartan]

That’s normal

[pseudo flame]

and one of the perks you put in, i 100% avoid

[undone tartan]

Yeah which one?

[mossy zinc]

Everyone is welcome to share their opinions and ideas.

[bronze viper]

40 heat still leaves a lot of room open for personal preference and expression fwiw

There isn't a canonical 40 heat setup

[pseudo flame]

i think you would know... if you know my playstyle

[undone tartan]

I don’t

[solar maple]

even if you have to tank a hit or two of HS lava it's still better than eating a blue head slam

the lava is my home

[gaunt fiber]

except if you're Guan Yu because both kill

[undone tartan]

All I know about you is that you claim to have beat fresh file and seemed to take great enjoyment from calling it easy after I said I spend 30+ hours grinding it

[pseudo flame]

i might have mislead you then

[undone tartan]

Oh wait lmao you mean tight deadline

You do 40 heat with TD0?

[pseudo flame]

i thought i said getting to Hades on fresh file is easy

[undone tartan]

It’s not.

[pseudo flame]

normal mode

[undone tartan]

And you didn’t say that

[pseudo flame]

fresh file hell mode i'm having trouble with Elysium

at least, Elysium hell mode is drainin health quick

by the point i made to boss, if i did, tends to have less than 90 hp 😦

[undone tartan]

I’ve ended up with less than 90 max HP entering champions

[pseudo flame]

lol you're avoiding hp pick up?

[undone tartan]

No

But without Dark Foresight, that can happen

[pseudo flame]

sure, but less than 100hp, felt like you're purposely avoiding any centaur heat room, or charon shop

by the time u reach thessus

[gaunt fiber]

Yeah 2 hearts in 3 biomes is definitely achievable lol

[undone tartan]

Yes it is. It’s not guaranteed though

Whatever, doesn’t really matter

[pseudo flame]

so u plan to just no damage Styx and Hades?

[undone tartan]

No? I don’t avoid them

[pseudo flame]

how'd u survive Hades minion phase with 90 hp, can't imagine you can consistently reach there with high dmg build

[undone tartan]

You don’t

What are you not understanding about this

[pseudo flame]

i dun understand why you would wanna reach Thessus with 90 max hp lol

[undone tartan]

Also of course I don’t “consistently reach there”. I’ve already said I only reached Hades once

[undone tartan]

I DONT WANT TO

[pseudo flame]

30 hrs, let's say 10 fail run

[undone tartan]

??

Runs do not take 3 hours

[pseudo flame]

how many times u would reach Thesssus with 90 hp?

[undone tartan]

One time. It happened a singular time

[pseudo flame]

i mean 10 of your fail attempts during ur 30 hrs attempt

[undone tartan]

“You didn’t get an attack boon in Tartarus? Why? I don’t think you want to avoid getting an attack boon. Furies are gonna be harder without an attack boon”

What are you not understanding about this? I said it happened one time ever. It wasn’t intentional, and I wasn’t “avoiding hearts”. It just happened one time.

[pseudo flame]

so... you get to 45 heat, but fresh file you have a hard time to get to Elysium most of the time

sounds right?

[undone tartan]

Yes

[pseudo flame]

did u stream?

[undone tartan]

No

[pseudo flame]

alright

[undone tartan]

And I’m not looking for advice

[bronze viper]

holy cow this is still going on?

pls

[pseudo flame]

he sure loves to bring it up

[undone tartan]

Yeah idk why I haven’t left yet

[undone tartan]

What??

[pseudo flame]

you're the one who asks me if i got a new fresh file normal clear yet

[hoary pasture]

lmao

It's entertaining

[pseudo flame]

the moment i log in and wonder about HS

[undone tartan]

I asked once, because you claim to have done it but have no evidence. So I was checking in if you recorded one

[pseudo flame]

that i agree

[undone tartan]

Why are you trying to point fingers

[mossy zinc]

1. Be kind.

[bronze viper]

I don't know if it's so much "finger pointing" as it is... reading the chat log

[undone tartan]

“he sure loves to bring it up”

[mossy zinc]

3. Stay on topic.

[honest kernel]

[undone tartan]

I said it in #h1-victory-boasting, but thanks again to everyone who helped me on my path for 50 heat. And thanks for everyone’s patience on the many occasions that I became very frustrated with the game, I apologize for that.

[shy plinth]

Well done

[mossy zinc]

Congratulations!

[ripe ermine]

Nice dude

[mossy zinc]

All you needed to win was a fruitless argument about HS and fresh file on the side.

[undone tartan]

I’m definitely glad I decided to just do RI2 instead of EM4

[bronze viper]

It was the fuel that kept him going

[mossy zinc]

"Damn those high heaters. I'll show 'em. "

[undone tartan]

It’s funny because I was doing that stupid pointless argument while also going through Elysium

[undone tartan]

I wasn’t exactly arguing with a high heater

[mossy zinc]

"You probably think HS is easy, too, you stupid Greatshield. Die! "

—UnholyPancake, 2021

[undone tartan]

I didn’t get a single bad greatshield room

Oh also, that run was not even close, at least at the end. I had like 500 health left

Technically I think it was 446 health

[mossy zinc]

Non-EM Hades is kind of free on Beowulf.

[bronze viper]

I live in constant fear that normal Dad will cheat and spin a second time or spear chuck anyway

[mossy zinc]

Unless you're doing 52 Heat in Blood Price.

[gaunt fiber]

Just don't play against normal dad ever, no more fear

[mossy zinc]

Then he's the hardest boss ever and only the most amazingest player could beat him.

[bronze viper]

Amir, picks and bans phase for EM4 summons pls

[gaunt fiber]

LOL

Hades bans Meg

[mossy zinc]

Fidi ftw.

[undone tartan]

It kinda is, yeah. Which is why I’m confident RI2 was the correct choice (for me)

[undone tartan]

I kept expecting him to do a second spin

[quartz mantle]

Every time I see him do the swing swing I mentally prepare for the spear yeet

[mossy zinc]

You don't know that. Sample size is too small. You should do at least 10 more wins.

[quartz mantle]

Even if I'm watching someone else fight him

[gaunt fiber]

I've played a bit of speed 40 lately

normal dad feels so slow and weak

[undone tartan]

Wym speed 40

[bronze viper]

40 heat speedruns

[gaunt fiber]

40 heat but speedruns

[undone tartan]

Ah

[mossy zinc]

40m speedruns. The first player to win in exactly 40m wins.

[undone tartan]

Remember that time I got but did not record a 40 heat wr with Chiron

[mossy zinc]

Nope.

[bronze viper]

pepperidge farm remembers

[mossy zinc]

Never happened. Don't remember it. You got video footage as proof it happened?

[gaunt fiber]

Cookies

[undone tartan]

Very true

[gaunt fiber]

what's Chiron 40 wr?

[undone tartan]

To be clear, I in no way think I should have credit for that wr nor do I think it was very impressive that I got it

I just think it’s kinda cool and a bit funny that I did

[gaunt fiber]

15:32

yeah that's slow

[undone tartan]

Yeah

My time wasn’t even sub 15

Although I wasn’t really playing as fast as possible

[bronze viper]

my only remaining WR is my -1 second Zag Bow 50 run lol

[gaunt fiber]

I have a very contested one

[undone tartan]

50 heat in negative one second?

[gaunt fiber]

40 GY

[bronze viper]

Idr the actual time, but I beat the existing record by a second :3

[undone tartan]

That’s pretty cool

[gaunt fiber]

There's only one GY run on the 40 heat board

[mossy zinc]

I still have 5-or-so 32 Heat WRs.

4?

Anyway.

Mirrorless boonless WR.

[eternal hare]

looking forward to your sub-8

[gaunt fiber]

at 40

sure

[bronze viper]

Nah at 50 scrub

[eternal hare]

I believe

[undone tartan]

Sub 8 40 heat

[eternal hare]

it's more common than you think

[undone tartan]

Modded or unmodded?

[eternal hare]

there are several of them now

[gaunt fiber]

I'd go for unmodded unseeded

[undone tartan]

I’m sure it’s possible

[gaunt fiber]

hm

[bronze viper]

I mean yeah obv it's possible, ocaml has 7:30 50 heat

[undone tartan]

Wait really?

[gaunt fiber]

There's a gap between Rama/Beowulf and Guan Yu

[mossy zinc]

Resets should count towards RTA.

[bronze viper]

https://www.speedrun.com/hades#50_Heat

[undone tartan]

Ocaml exactly tied my PB but with 41 more heat

[gaunt fiber]

Yeah the camel kinda killed the category

[eternal hare]

it's not dead

there's time to save

[mossy zinc]

Sounds like you had the better strategy.

[bronze viper]

5 seconds in the big Asphodel room lmfao

[eternal hare]

better chaos placement

etc

[gaunt fiber]

yeah but it's 50

[bronze viper]

Literally 5 seconds just not playing the game feels good.

[undone tartan]

Yeah 9 heat tends to be faster than 50 heat, at least in my experience

[gaunt fiber]

it's so much heavier than any heat resets

• accidental resets

[eternal hare]

like dying to lernie while on-build on-pace

[mossy zinc]

Evidently not. But your run was a lot easier, and in the end you got the same result. Making things harder for yourself isn't very efficient.

[honest kernel]

congrats for the 50 clear!

[undone tartan]

Thank you

[undone tartan]

My first run that’s not on 50 heat I get 8 boons in Tartarus. Oh how I missed you, Dark Foresight (it was still CF2 btw)

[unique zephyr]

Congrats on 50! 50 heat made me take an indefinite break from the game, I admire your dedication

[undone tartan]

Thank you!

[daring hedge]

going back to RI0 after running RI2 for a while genuinely feels like cheating lol

also big congrats

[undone tartan]

Is crit chance additive?

[eternal hare]

yes

[bronze viper]

You got a 50 clear? Retroactive congrats

[daring hedge]

i think they meant attempting 50 heat made them take that break

[unique zephyr]

That is what I meant

sorry if I was unclear

[solar maple]

no they got it

congrats btw 👀

[daring hedge]

lol we were talking about bacchus

but yeah pancake got the W

[solar maple]

oh oops

[fresh kraken]

Question what happens when you run out of time with tight deadline

[hardy garden]

5 dmg a second

[undone tartan]

Damn the difference between 47 and 50 heat is insane

Absolutely astronomical

[shy plinth]

I think it’s 3

[undone tartan]

[mossy zinc]

That's why I said the other day you're kinda trying to skip a lot going from 45 to 50 lol. You see what I mean now?

[undone tartan]

Well no I definitely already knew

But it blew my mind how removing 3 heat allowed me in 2 runs to do what I couldn’t even get close to in ~30 runs

[mossy zinc]

Yeah, there's a difference between knowing something in theory and actually experiencing it.

[shy plinth]

Theoretically

[next acorn]

B-b-b-but, round number

[mossy zinc]

50's not a round number.

Don't you see those straight lines?

60, now that's a round number.

[undone tartan]

[mossy zinc]

30 is a round number.

[shy plinth]

The left side of 30 is kinda pointy

[mossy zinc]

No.

You're wrong.

[shy plinth]

Look at that 3

[mossy zinc]

It's perfectly round.

You just have a low resolution monitor, that must be it.

[shy plinth]

I uh

Do not think that is it

[mossy zinc]

It is.

Haven't you learned by now not to question me.

[shy plinth]

Right right

[gaunt fiber]

That's exactly how dumb we are

Lemme reach that arbitrary number that looks kinda good

[dense oasis]

I am doing some low heat runs with EM4, FO2, TD3 and HS to practice

So, so much easier without all the other stuff

I thought I would struggle but no

[vital grove]

50 heat is pretty intense yeah

I said good enough after doing it just once

[trim sigil]

It's free motivation

[steel widget]

Gotta reach 42

[dense oasis]

40 heat IS HELL

help

[mossy zinc]

No.

There is no escape.

[dense oasis]

[hoary pasture]

What aspect

[mossy zinc]

Maybe be more specific about what you need help with.

[hoary pasture]

Just keep retrying

[dense oasis]

Yeah, I need help with winning a run at 40 heat

What if I try lvl 1 Lucifer

[mossy zinc]

What aspect, what's your pact, what's killing you?

[dense oasis]

I have been trying with Eris zeus build. What is killing me usually are charging enemies in Tartarus, those blue skeletons that do a combo in Asphodel and Great Shields in Elysium the few times I have reached there.

Also I take a hit everytime the bull is charging. Every single time.

[mossy zinc]

Kind of hard to give specific tips for the Louts without seeing what you're doing.. I guess just a general tip is don't just dash without a reason. You want to wait for them to start their attack and then dash.

And in most situations, circle your enemies when you move.

[dense oasis]

What is your general strategy with Witch's Circle without a way to deflect?

[mossy zinc]

For the Numbskulls, I guess just dash away hugging the walls and keep attacking them. If you have a Dash boon already, be more aggressive.

[bronze viper]

Stay on the borders of the screen and focus on killing one at a time. This is very time consuming but the safest way to kill them.

Eris can pretty easily use the speedrunny strat that clusters them all together by standing in the lower side corners of the screen then gunning them all down at the same time though.

There's videos (I guess look up 4-witch Megs)

[quartz mantle]

https://youtu.be/jC91e7JBSAQ

Thing

Found it

[dense oasis]

thx

Looks easy enough

Will mess it every time

[mossy zinc]

You don't need to use the mouse on rail. Just dash over there, attack the Witch there with auto-aim to make Zag face it, then time the summon.

It's not too hard tbh. You'll probably do fine just winging it until you get it down.

[bronze viper]

When he initiates a charge, go directly to a wall (not a pillar, unless you're very confident). Bull-sempai can approach either from 90 degrees, or an acute angle (either left or right). Try to position yourself so it's not 90 degrees on the approach . Dash inside the acute angle, and he has to crash into the wall

[bronze viper]

Yeah, my point wasn't the 4-witch Meg, the positioning just forces them to cluster though so you can chain them to death with Eris

[mossy zinc]

That works, too.

But learning the Witch setup makes the fight trivial.

There are two ways to deal with the bull charge depending on your position. If you're between two obstacles, dash through him as he comes close, so that he'll crash into either obstacle trying to do a 180. If you're close to one obstacle, dash away from the obstacle at the last moment, so that he'll crash into it.

If you're not in either of those positions, get there asap when you see him begin his charge.. and also if he's off-screen and you don't know what he's up to.

Obstacles include the arena wall(s), the pillars, and Theseus.

[bronze viper]

tl;dr everyone at high heat has to develop their own sorcery for managing charges lol

wildly depends on your reactions and positioning

[mossy zinc]

Well, those are the two ways, really. Anything else is just variations of that.

Also if you have the Acorn, you can just tank a hit. That's fine sometimes.

Oh, and don't try dashing through a pillar. That ends badly more often than not.

[bronze viper]

Unless I'm literally between two pillars, I find dashing through Asterius is super super finicky, and that specific position is hard to find unless you're already there (you can't really camp between pillars while Theseus is joy riding on the outside circle)

[mossy zinc]

Oh, but it's super easy in the solo Asterius fight.

Just get between a pillar and a wall. No Theseus bombs there.

[bronze viper]

Lol, per my comment about personal sorcery, this is how Bright does it, 100% of the time, and I have never gotten it to work for me

[mossy zinc]

Harder to do when Theseus is around, yeah. But it's good to be aware of the tactic.

Well.

[bronze viper]

He dashes through the pillar backwards then through it again back to front

[mossy zinc]

It works, but I wouldn't recommend it to somebody just starting to learn the fight.

You need to be very on-point.

[bronze viper]

I made a save to practice it and dodged like... 1 charge out of n-many (by dashing through pillars back and forth)

[mossy zinc]

lol

@dense oasis are you on PC, and do you know how to make practice saves?

[bronze viper]

We should probably just save instructions to do that on a Google Doc or something lol. It's simple but so laborious to describe in text

[mossy zinc]

Save files are in ...\Documents\Saved Games\Hades.

Get into the chamber you want to practice, then backup your Profile1_Temp.sav in a new folder called "practice saves" or whatever you like. Rename the temp.sav to something descriptive like "EM3 Eris Heartbreak Strike" or whatever, so that you know what it's for later.

When you want to practice the fight, replace Profile2.sav or whichever slot with your practice save. Then just start the game and load your save from profile 2. (If you're not starting in the fight, open the menu and "Give Up". Then load the save again.) You should be in the fight now.

When you win the fight or die, open the menu (during the death animation), select "Give Up", then reload the save, and you'll be at the beginning of the fight again.

[bronze viper]

Depending on if you change binds between aspects or whatever (shouldn't apply to tons of people but it affects me enough to be annoying), also copy Profile#.ctrls over as well

[dense oasis]

Hey sorry I was playing. just saw it. Yes I am on PC. I didn't know about practice saves. I read your reply.

I really can't do it with Eris

Need a different aspect. Not Chiron

Any suggestions?

[mossy zinc]

I suggest practice.

Picking your best aspect and sticking with it for practice is gonna do you better than trying to switch around to find an easier one.

[trim sigil]

Switching between weapons won't do you much favor as you have to re-acclimate to each one. Gotta pick one you personally enjoy and then spend some time perfecting the playstyle

[dense oasis]

Hera it is then

[mossy zinc]

Sounds good.

[dense oasis]

What pacts for hera? Thinking about Poseidon Cast

[mossy zinc]

I'd take Crush Shot.

[hallow garnet]

of course you would

[dense oasis]

Was thinking poseidon for the area

[hallow garnet]

crystal beam

[mossy zinc]

Crush Shot is uncontested #1 on Hera.

I guess Phalanx Shot is alright for high heats, too.

The AOE from Crush Shot is good enough, and you just do way better damage.

If you haven't read my Hera guide, I'd recommend doing that. #h1-discussion message

You'd want the mirror setup from that except SD instead of DDs and probably Thick Skin instead of High Confidence.

[dense oasis]

Was about to ask that lmao

Why God's Pride over Legacy if we are looking for Mirage ASAP

[bronze viper]

technically you're looking for Snow Burst ASAP lol

Mirage is secondary

[left prism]

hera doesnt really need to look for mirage

[dense oasis]

Good start

Rolled 3 times, crush shot was crossed out all 3

nice

[hallow garnet]

good

[undone tartan]

Oooh Hera 40 is really hard

Or it was for me

I had more trouble with Hera 40 than with any spear

[bronze viper]

Yeah I agree, I think it's by a sizeable margin the hardest bow for 40

[undone tartan]

I would not suggest it, but if you want to use it then I’m sure you can get it

[mossy zinc]

Snow Burst, Master Chaos, Lord Hermes...

[undone tartan]

But Hera for me was harder than every single aspect except 3 of the swords and 3 of the fists

If you’re really struggling with your first 40, then I really wouldn’t suggest Hera

[mossy zinc]

HL5 LC4 CF1 EM3 BP2 MM UC FO2 HS AP1 TD3 should be decent.

[bronze viper]

shrug nothing stops them from trying it lol. I don't think you shouldn't try something because it's hard, as long as you find it fun.

Can't count the number of people telling me that Rama was pointless in Early Access (in fairness, it kind of was)

[undone tartan]

Yeah that’s fine. But they also just gave up Eris because they found it too hard

[mossy zinc]

I don't think you shouldn't try something just because it's hard for UnholyPancake.

[undone tartan]

Well they can try it, I’m just warning that it’s gonna be very difficult

Hera 40 was harder than Hestia 47

It was harder than Demeter 40

[mossy zinc]

Guess who found out who's not a Hera main.

[bronze viper]

In other news, Hestia 60 is down

(by Zyruvias)

[mossy zinc]

Nice.

[undone tartan]

I used to be though, or at least it was my 2nd favorite aspect

But going past 32 with Hera made me stop really liking Hera

It makes the aspect feel absolutely terrible

[bronze viper]

I think that threshold is at 45+ but yeah I agree. 50 Hera is just not fun

[mossy zinc]

Eh, I only find it annoying with CP and if you don't get a good Shot from Master Chaos.

[bronze viper]

It's the last bow I have to get to 50+ and I have no desire to try

[undone tartan]

Well I did 32 Hera in a few tries back when I was much less experienced at the game, but it took me 10+ attempts to do 40 Hera even after doing 45 with multiple aspects

It was jarring how much worse it got

Like swapping from Demeter to Zag fists

[dense oasis]

https://imgur.com/3tddTsq

[mossy zinc]

Addled Shot it is.

[dense oasis]

I have 2 minutes left. I can reach and kill meg without cast 100%

[mossy zinc]

No, keep using your Cast.

[bronze viper]

Yeah, keep casting, just don't get hit

You can't die (directly) from Chaos curses

[quartz mantle]

Blood for the blood god

[hallow garnet]

blood for zagreus?

[mossy zinc]

If you get hit and die, you just start over. If you make it, you have a decent boon. Not much time lost, it's just Tartarus.

And either way, it's good practice.

[dense oasis]

How did you know I am in Tartarus

Oh wait I told you

nvm

[bronze viper]

we're watching your screen right now

[mossy zinc]

Alecto texted me.

[dense oasis]

Boss demeter boon next. Please snow burst

[mossy zinc]

Ravenous Will is great, too.

[hoary pasture]

Meme beam incoming

[bronze viper]

But Snow Burst does roughly the same/more damage than Mirage Shot lol, so yeah

[hoary pasture]

How much heat is this

[hallow garnet]

imagine alecto shows up haha

[hoary pasture]

Nice

[dense oasis]

No snow burst, ravenous will was crossed out. rolled 2 times

Had to get Flourish

[hoary pasture]

Rip

[bronze viper]

It be like that sometimes :3 At least you got through the boss with the cast chaos curse

So that's not bad

[dense oasis]

It was the bombers

I didnt take damage

outside the chaos curse

[bronze viper]

legit

[mossy zinc]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/725021639506526249/893141749512421376/Hades_4382.png?width=876&height=493

Took me like.

1 tries.

Could have been Lv.13 Crush Shot, but a Wavemaker hit me from off-screen in Erebus.

[dense oasis]

Can you do that again, but record it or stream or smth? I wanna see how you play

[mossy zinc]

This one is from last month. https://youtu.be/dAqtmKhacSc

[dense oasis]

I would have liked to watch the 16 minutes run

oh that one is 15 mins

nvm

[mossy zinc]

Oh, I don't really pay attention to that lol. I do troves sometimes when I feel like it or go fishing and stuff.

[dense oasis]

I see what the problem is

I can't play like that

[hoary pasture]

Lol

Nyaanyaa has a better gaming chair is all

[dense oasis]

The ultimate flex here is that she watches all dialogues, and doesn't pause to decide rooms. Or rather does so rarely. I am impressed.

[mossy zinc]

The timer is paused during dialogue anyway.

[dense oasis]

I know. But the timer psychologically stresses me and I am always in spaz mode

Maybe this is why I fail. I dash like an idiot all the time

[mossy zinc]

I think I recommended practicing with just EM3 FO2 TD3, didn't I?

And yeah, you don't wanna dash mindlessly. Every dash should be deliberate. You don't want to be caught off-guard with your dashes on cooldown when you need to avoid an attack.

[dense oasis]

Yeah but the low heat number triggers me

[mossy zinc]

EM2 FO2 is a speedrun pact. And putting on TD3 gets you used to the timer being there.

But since you'd want to do EM3 at 40, it's good to put that on to get more practice in the fight... unless you make a practice save for that anyway.

The good thing about that vs doing runs at 40 is that you can do more full runs and that way get more experience with the build and what's important.

[undone tartan]

I didn’t say it’s hard enough that you wouldn’t be able to do it

[mossy zinc]

And focusing on getting your clear times down while you do that will force you to focus on clearing encounters more efficiently.

You don't have to get, like, competitive speedrun times or anything like that. But it's an efficient method for practice.

Like, not instead of doing runs at 40 Heat but in addition to doing that.

[mossy zinc]

Wasn't even a challenge.

[undone tartan]

The more you play with TD3, the less it will stress you out. The only time it stresses me out is when I’m about to run out of time in a bossfight, or when I’m very low and get a bad room that is hard to do quickly

[mossy zinc]

I can only conclude that 40 Heat with Hera is free.

[undone tartan]

[mossy zinc]

The only time it stresses me out is when I’m about to run out of time in a bossfight
Doesn't even register with me anymore emotionally lol.

[bronze viper]

It's usually at the exact moment that I realize I can use my extra DDs as timers that my brain decides to run into attacks during bossfights

[undone tartan]

Well I mean when I have 5 seconds left and specifically if it’s Hades or EM3 Champions

Especially if I’m just entering the fight and I have like no time left

Then I play way worse because of it, but only because I kinda have to play as fast as I possibly can

I’m likely to take more damage to time than I will from making mistakes playing quickly

[mossy zinc]

Nope. No emotional effect on me.

[undone tartan]

Is there a gameplay affect on you? Do you get hit more?

[mossy zinc]

I mean I register it and maybe play less risk-averse depending on the situation.

[dense oasis]

You are so good at this game

Wait a second

41 heat without blue hearts?

[mossy zinc]

You wouldn't want to take DC on Hera.

Also that's Hell Mode.

[undone tartan]

God no don’t do DC for Hera

[dense oasis]

Ok so 40 heat without DC ok

I had DC in my runs

[undone tartan]

[mossy zinc]

No DC on Hera, yeah.

[dense oasis]

DC2 actually

[undone tartan]

Oh god

[mossy zinc]

Nyaanyaa Mewmew — Today at 3:35 PM
HL5 LC4 CF1 EM3 BP2 MM UC FO2 HS AP1 TD3 should be decent.

[undone tartan]

That sounds like a complete nightmare

[mossy zinc]

Use that one.

[hoary pasture]

The first heat I did was dc1 on zag bow lol

[dense oasis]

Was trying to strip it with the special

[mossy zinc]

Maybe swap out CF1 for JS1.

[undone tartan]

I wouldn’t use DC2 on Hera at 50 heat

[dense oasis]

I am gonna do the practice runs you said

EM3 FO2 and TD3

[mossy zinc]

Well.

You wouldn't use Hera at 50.

[undone tartan]

True

I certainly wouldn’t

[dense oasis]

man that's 18 heat

I need 2 more for the bounties

MM?

[undone tartan]

MM is good for practice in general

I never turn off MM

[mossy zinc]

Yeah, I guess turn on MM or maybe turn on HS and one point somewhere else for the bounties.

[dense oasis]

I am at 20 now

that's the max for bounties isnt it

[mossy zinc]

Yes.

[bronze viper]

The special button should be unbound for Hera lol

Barring weirdnesses like Charged + Conc Volley

With Deadly Flourish or something lol

[undone tartan]

Yeah Hera special is abysmal without charged and with charged it’s just bad

[mossy zinc]

[undone tartan]

It can be helpful for savior numbskulls though

[mossy zinc]

There are some niche uses for it.

[undone tartan]

Outside of savior, it’s useless I think

[bronze viper]

Thunder Flourish + Jolted is another okay usage for special on Hera

[quartz mantle]

Nah you gotta hit those gold pots

[mossy zinc]

Well, you're wrong.

[undone tartan]

True!

[dense oasis]

Even with just EM3, FO2, MM and TD3 I finished Tartarus with just 18 seconds left .

[mossy zinc]

Nice.

[bronze viper]

On Hera? That's not bad. Hera has a lot mechanical stuff to manage.

[ripe ermine]

Good job. You don’t need huge amounts of time on the clock. You just need to get there. You’ll bank some in Asphodel probably

[mossy zinc]

@dense oasis try to avoid any and all pommable boons that don't add excellent DPS by themself already.

To get more poms on your Cast.

[dense oasis]

Will keep that in mind

[undone tartan]

Epic hyper sprint or rare greatest reflex for 45 heat Eris? I already have epic greater evasion

It’s gotta be GR right?

[mossy zinc]

If it's not Crush Shot, you only really want to pom Snow Burst, Hunter's Mark, Tidal Dash, and maybe Zeus' Aid and Static Discharge if you have Smoldering Air.

Maybe Heartbreak Strike once or twice.

And Crush Shot poms always come first.

[bronze viper]

I'd take reflexes here, especially since you can't (most likely lol) get Rush Delivery anymore. Dashes also good for Eris DPS in general because of burst fire during dash strike

[jaunty falcon]

Dashes definitely

[undone tartan]

Yeah I took reflex

[mossy zinc]

Both aren't wrong picks tbh.

Sturdy + Epic Greater Evasion is a lot of eHP, and you get a shot at Rush Delivery in the Temple of Styx.

[jaunty falcon]

GR is more damage and more safety now

Yeah both are good picks

[bronze viper]

Grrr

[mossy zinc]

@dense oasis if you look at your victory screen and mine... you got 12 poms but only a Lv.4 Cast. I got 10 poms but a Lv.11 Cast. That's the kind of difference that can make.

[gaunt fiber]

Grrr

[dense oasis]

I need to study on which boons are pomable. I still don't know exactly

[jaunty falcon]

"For reference purposes:
It was brought up during VOD review there isn't a reference list of unpommable non legendary non duo boons available from each god/goddess. Here it is:

AphroditeBond Aphrodite AphroditeBond
Life Affirmation
Broken Resolve
Blown Kiss (requires Crush Shot)

AresBond Ares AresBond
Blood Frenzy
Engulfing Vortex (requires Slicing Shot, Blade Dash, or Ares' Aid)
Dire Misfortune (requires Curse of Agony or Curse of Pain)

ArtemisBond Artemis ArtemisBond
none frowning

AthenaBond Athena AthenaBond
Sure Footing
Deathless Stand
Last Stand

DemeterBond Demeter DemeterBond
Rare Crop
Nourished Soul
Ravenous Will
Arctic Blast (requires Frost Strike, Frost Flourish, Mistral Dash, Demeter's Aid or Snow Burst)
Killing Freeze (requires Frost Strike, Frost Flourish, Mistral Dash, Demeter's Aid or Snow Burst)

DionysusBond Dionysus DionysusBond
Premium Vintage
Strong Drink
After Party

PoseidonBond Poseidon PoseidonBond
Ocean's Bounty
Sunken Treasure

ZeusBond Zeus ZeusBond
none frowning" - 😤😤😤😤😤😤😤

Oh that didn't format correctly

[mossy zinc]

Should maybe mention that you're quoting Bright01.

[undone tartan]

Also keep in mind what boons cannot be sold

Namely rare crop, nourished soul, sunken treasure, or either of Athena’s “stand” boons

I may have missed one or two

[jaunty falcon]

Empty inside it seems

[daring hedge]

Premium vintage

Basically if a boon spawns stuff for you to grab, it cannot be purged

[undone tartan]

Oh yeah I forgot premium vintage

If you’re Nyaa then all of Aphrodite’s boons are unpurgable

[unborn fjord]

she has two?

[undone tartan]

Yes

[left prism]

deathless and last stand

[undone tartan]

Last stand is better but they both give a DD

[unborn fjord]

oh right, one give more hp per dd one give more i frames right

[undone tartan]

Last stand is actually great with SD even if you don’t get a DD (but I usually won’t take it out of hope that I’ll get offered it later when it can give me a DD)

[ripe ermine]

Yeah I’ll take Last Stand even if I goofed and forgot to suicide. It’s potentially many hundreds of HP over the run

[dense oasis]

How would one approach a high heat (let's say 40) Arthur run?

[undone tartan]

Smoldering Air

Here’s my 40 heat Arthur run

#h1-victory-boasting message

I unfortunately didn’t find smoldering air

But still it was a super strong build, not even close

(Also 14:10, nice)

[bronze viper]

My go to build for any aspect I don't want to play is Tidal Dash start -> Razor Shoals, aiming for Poseidon's Aid + Rip Current

[quiet mountain]

i like smoldering aphro since it is penultimate boss defense

[undone tartan]

Smoldering Aphro can be okay, but it’s much worse than Poseidon, Athena, Zeus, and Dionysus

And arguably worse than Demeter

If you can get Demeter tier 2s

[bronze viper]

I like Splash Dash since it lets you ignore the aspect from beginning of run to end

[quiet mountain]

poop my pants

[undone tartan]

[full fossil]

What's the ultimate boss defense?

[quiet mountain]

ya it’s dps is garbage but it’s good for making boss do turnaround

if u have the timings down and no ads

[undone tartan]

Again, it’s fine. It’s definitely decent, but it’s still way worse than most other calls imo

Unless you have a level 16 call or something

[undone tartan]

Probably rip current Poseidon’s aid tbh

[quiet mountain]

i think it shines particularly in not being too out of the way for building into with a other, main build you really focus on. not something to build to but nothing to scoff at

i’ve just been using it lately since i find it fun

[undone tartan]

Yeah but if I’m going for SAir, I might as well get a better call

[bronze viper]

Lol, Rip Current is incredibly broke, I don't think any call even remotely comes close for defense + offense

[undone tartan]

Yeah

It’s one of my favorite boons in the game

It just carried me to an easy 45 heat Eris win

Well, kinda easy. Except the two Elysium rooms where I was at less than 20 health with no DD. But those were before I got rip current anyway

[bronze viper]

I think Razor Shoals is probably mine. It ticks 10/sec, so it does a pretty mean approximation of Smoldering Air if you can maintain the debuff long enough

[undone tartan]

Oh I love razor shoals

But it’s possibly worse than Poseidon’s other tier 2s

[quiet mountain]

i definitely don’t disagree with that
but then you need 3 core gods + the call you really want

it’s certainly easier to happen upon smoldering zeus or aphro

but ya i agree with there being literally any other option for a call focused build

[bronze viper]

Depends on context. There is no better boon in the game period for EM3 LOL

[undone tartan]

True, RS melts EM3

[undone tartan]

But Smoldering Zeus call is like 2x as good as smoldering aphro call

[next acorn]

Learning boss patters

[quiet mountain]

for dps ya

[undone tartan]

No it’s amazing for safety too

[quiet mountain]

y

[undone tartan]

I-frames + enemies can’t kill you if they’re dead

[quiet mountain]

hell mode momen

[undone tartan]

?

[bronze viper]

I mean... I don't think you can claim Smoldering Zeus is better for defense because of iframes lmfao

[undone tartan]

No, not better. But very good

[bronze viper]

I happen to agree but still

[quiet mountain]

no i frame for hell mode

[bronze viper]

If you're talking iframes then Artemis' Aid is the best

[undone tartan]

But the DPS is way better than the small safety

[quiet mountain]

i think

[undone tartan]

You’re wrong

[quiet mountain]

where

[undone tartan]

Hell mode in no way impacts call I-frames

[undone tartan]

Athena’s in the best

[next acorn]

You thinking of PL?

[bronze viper]

All it does is pop your little blue safety bubble, your free built-in Spearpoint

[next acorn]

That just gets rid of the shield you get after taking too much damage

[quiet mountain]

it is an enigma

[undone tartan]

It’s not

[quiet mountain]

unknown to all

[undone tartan]

Not really

It’s actually quite simple

[quiet mountain]

we will never know

[next acorn]

Plenty of people know

And have known

[quiet mountain]

a mystery

mirage even

[undone tartan]

[next acorn]

like mirage shot being bugged

[undone tartan]

True

[quiet mountain]

feature

[next acorn]

It’s jot a bug it’s just mirage flare

[brave frost]

hey guys quick question

im kinda hardstuck on heat 9 with fists. im taking deaths as early as tartatus and its kinda disheartening. any tips?

[gaunt fiber]

Well at this point, only practice. What are the 9 heat?

Avoid RI, FO2 if you're only starting. Malphon is a tough weapon to play but with practice only, you should be able to clear past your current heat easily.
You can stunlock enemies, be careful with the armored baddies. In general, just observe your enemies, learn their patterns so you don't dash mindlessly and take unnecessary damage.
Malphon is all about commitment at high heat, as in dashing in is taking a risk but you have to, otherwise you don't deal damage.

[undone tartan]

Also avoid AP, CP, JS, and HS (at 9 heat)

[gaunt fiber]

Be mobile, cancel your combos, move around your enemies to bait/dodge attacks

[brave frost]

let me get the list of my modifiers

it feels like all im doing is running around cancelling into dash strike

[undone tartan]

Wym cancelling into dash strike

[brave frost]

i know 9 is hyper low, so thats why im a bit frustrated

[gaunt fiber]

Be careful while dash striking as you lose your iframes

divine dash is quite good on malphon as a beginner

But I'm sure you'll get better with pure practice. Hades is hard, it's ok to die

[bronze viper]

never really stops being good lol

[gaunt fiber]

When you need more damage with big boi heats

[undone tartan]

56?

I guess maybe anything 50+

[brave frost]

so i have, jury summons max, EM2, calistenics program max, damage control 1

[gaunt fiber]

when time is a problem

mainly EM4 for me

[undone tartan]

Makes sense