Do it with all the aspects
#h1-high-heat-strategies
distant lichen
D:
weak shuttle
Jury Duty makes the Erebus gates a nightmare >:(
pseudo kernel
lmao jury duty
weak shuttle
Without it I'm fine, but I keep dashing into enemies as they spawn because I have big dumb fast brain
mossy zinc
It's Jury Summons. 
distant lichen
Jury duty i say
pseudo kernel
yeah its jury duty
gaunt fiber
pseudo kernel
yes
mossy zinc
Does that mean your stream has ended?
Good, average player skill among live Hades streams has increased. Way fewer deaths happening. That's how it works, right?
pseudo kernel
Zag met the death by timer
death by clock
mossy zinc
As expected. The man lives up to the legend.
gaunt fiber
I punched my way through elysium no free room allowed
waxen relic
death by clock
If there was a clock you'd know what time it is or am i wrong
gaunt fiber
Chariots are so easy on Malphon
mossy zinc
It's 7:48.
pseudo kernel
its 7:49
gaunt fiber
Good, average player skill among live Hades streams has increased. Way fewer dea...
Hard to quantify tbh
waxen relic
been a while since i checked so i wasn't sure anymore
mossy moon
It's 7:48.
wait, I thought it was about 48 past 7:00
honest kernel
Nah, it's just a little before 8.
mossy moon
oh right, how many minutes before 8?
mossy zinc
12 minutes before 8.
mossy moon
thank you
weak shuttle
It's Jury Summons. <:squirtnya:472124054644457472>
Oh 
woops!
mossy zinc
weak shuttle
Like I was saying. Dreary Summons makes the wheels on my uwu-bus stop going 'round and 'round
(If I'm gonna embarass myself, I might as well go all-in 🤷♀️)
distant lichen
any tips against the shield guys in elysium? D:
gaunt fiber
They have two attacks : a range one which is predictible and a melee one. The latter is a two hits attack which end up in a pretty big aoe so be careful.
My advice would be to bait the melee attack, then dash right behind them as they initiate the first hit. Don't forget your cast to have boiling blood online to kill them asap
mossy zinc
My best advice for Greatshields is they spawn facing right, so you can always backstab from the left. 
true fable
^
any enemies in this game actually should spawn facing right
so you can use that for ez spawn backstabs if you have shadow
neat sonnet
Tips for Hera 32? I apparently suck at the aspect despite it being how I had my highest heat prior to coming here
true fable
dont overload casts
unique zephyr
Tips for lucifer 32?
gaunt fiber
divine dash
true fable
for both luci and hera, try to bait enemies into groups by dashing in circles if you have to
the more enemies you can hit with a hera cast/luci special the better
dont waste time on forcing it but its pretty easy to do intuitively if youre just a little patient
obviously this only works on enemies with melee behavior
witches, archers, etc are a different problem
distant lichen
I FINALLY DID IT!!! 32 heat with Chiron with a super scuffed build
I want to thank everyone who believe in me thank you tahnk you very much 😆
distant lichen
Hehe i just spent all day trying to win that run
mossy zinc
What was the build?
distant lichen
https://clips.twitch.tv/SincereFilthyFinchM4xHeh-OCJnZ6ZFrdl98F2q
With epic sure footing?
mossy zinc
She had Sure Footing, but I don't think it affects Poison damage at all. It was just Myrmidon Bracer, Hallowed Ground, Weak, and Bronze Skin. You can see she takes damage outside of the aura but not when inside.
If it affected Poison damage, you'd just take no damage at all from 1 stack of Poison because it would round down to 0. And that's not what happens.
And HS doesn't affect poison damage.
solar maple
I think HS affects poison only from the ground trap
same with sure footing
tbh I forget that trap exists most of the time haha
distant lichen
After playing 32 heat and then going back to 10-20 heat it just feels way to easy
coarse field
does the the death defiance from the legendary chaos boon work with sd? and would i have to lose it first on the encounter that the chaos thing would evolve?
static plover
Yes, and no
Specifically because chaos legendary is +1 DD (for the current run) and something like athena's DD's are specifically refreshes
coarse field
ah makes sense. I've never taken it before since i assumed it was like athenas. Thanks!
honest kernel
how legit is your run if the game kinda breaks in the middle but is still playable
ok it stopped being playable nvm
waxen relic
someone remind me why the sack mechanic still is as it is
got a 4 sack and a 5 sack and a tiny vermin and just now a just awful ely with RI4 32 Hera
but i'm getting better
honest kernel
funny rng
ok I kept wanting to do mirrorless with rama and then I pick hestia and win first try
honest kernel
thanks 
mossy zinc
I believe my highest mirrorless is still 33.
mossy zinc
Hades Women's No-mirror Make-up Leaderboard
- Toffel (40)
- Nyaanyaa (33)
honest kernel
mossy zinc
gaunt fiber
someone remind me why the sack mechanic still is as it is
because game bad
unique zephyr
So uh I probably have to take AP1 for 45 heat. How do you deal with the salt? I only cleared with AP on its own for the prophecy lol
I can easily avoid AP at 40
But at 45 even for Rama the pact without AP and RI still isn’t great
bright mango
You can probably max js and cp
unique zephyr
I may just 24 x 32 first tbh
solemn pulsar
true fable
just dont use rerolls on stupid things and you should be good
the best way to deal with ap1 is to go "aw crap" whenever a boon you like gets crossed out and move on with your life
mossy zinc
You can usually get close to the same builds with AP1, it just takes a little longer
lofty orbit
i realized the best time to do a max heat run would be the || tenth escape as dad doesnt fight you ||
halcyon flame
good luck getting that far though
lofty orbit
yeah
static plover
EM4 isn't unlockable till after the credits yeah
unique zephyr
I think you have to have seen credits
static plover
60 heat is still attemptable as the 10th escape, but again glhf
unique zephyr
I don’t think you get a victory screen on 10th escape
static plover
you don't get a victory screen yeah
it might still show up in the admin room though
true fable
yea, just wouldnt count for src
robust elm
I don’t think you get a victory screen on 10th escape
I remember that you have one, strange
halcyon flame
yeah you don't get a victory screen on the 10th escape
he just lets you pass then and there
honest kernel
looks ok
I'd take dc1 off personally
it slows you down
I think I’d personally put on CF before a couple of those
honest kernel
looks good
dawn drift
mossy moon
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/761220441049661442/840869701550604308/98-...
what the feck...
devout quiver
That chiron pact is the same one i used for Gilgamesh.
only took four tries, two of which died at meg
mossy zinc
Yeah, turn off DC.
halcyon flame
dc in general kinda sucks
devout quiver
well, over what then
honest kernel
ok?
devout quiver
I died at Tis, lol. Still need meta resources, so just following thirst
It was a dumb mistake too, i forgot to trigger SD before walking in to the boss fight
honest kernel
oh okay
light nymph
i realized the best time to do a max heat run would be the || tenth escape as da...
also a no hit run
devout quiver
bow's up very next run lol
crimson crown
I’m doing a 32 heat run with Demeter fists does anyone have a good build for me please?
jaunty falcon
ME or Zeus attack, Artemis special. Drunken strike is ok as well.
crimson crown
Cool thanks👍
mossy zinc
I’m doing a 32 heat run with Demeter fists does anyone have a good build for me ...
Only the finest selection of builds here. #h1-builds-and-combat message
bright mango
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/761220441049661442/840869701550604308/98-...
“Fill heat gauge to 4”
halcyon flame
vestal osprey
what are the easiest heat modifiers to use?
for now im using the absorption one plus extreme measures and its not too bad
kinda annoying tho
quartz mantle
Starting off with Tight Deadline, Extreme Measure up to 2, Underworld Customs, Middle Management, or Benefits Package are all relatively simple pact options that change up your runs
mossy zinc
Middle Management is not easy if you're new to Heat.
unique zephyr
It's good to get used to early, though
I disagree with Benefits Package being easy
BP2 is a lot harder than BP1 for me
I think MM is easier than BP1 personally
pearl barn
Convenience Fee is also basically free, CF1 is nothing, CF2 makes boons from Charon prohibitively expensive, but you don't have to rely on them
mossy zinc
I don't know about that. CF hurts your builds a whole lot. You can get way broken builds with CF0 very easily.
pearl barn
Agree to disagree, I guess.
It is good to get used to MM early, also for some people (me included) EM3 Heroes is easier than regular Heroes fight, being able to focus on the bull without a surface-to-surface missile flying at me every 3 seconds
gaunt fiber
I remember saying that too
it was until high heat
until mr Asterius got the damn rockets
unique zephyr
Asterius can go at hyper speed in FO2
mossy zinc
Yeah, EM3 can be brutal at high heat. Most high heat runs that die in Elysium die to Chariots or EM Asterius, probably.
unique zephyr
EM3 affects the Asterius mini boss, too
pearl barn
I do think it's a little moot point, as I don't think I've ever seen high heat without EM3 anyway
mossy zinc
32 is mostly EM2.
unique zephyr
Eh, I do EM3 for my 32 heat runs
mossy zinc
Sure. But that's on you.
gaunt fiber
non EM3 is speedy pact tbh
pearl barn
If the person who originally asked this is still reading it, experiment with the modifiers and don't just follow advice assuming it's the easiest when it won't necessarily apply to you
The beauty of the whole thing is that it gets individually tailored difficulty
mossy zinc
Tbh if you're starting with Heat, the best thing you can do for longterm is to just try everything and get experience with all the different pacts.
bright mango
^^^^^^
pearl barn
Every guide is screaming to never do AP or RI, yet those got me a 32 win, (while having HL or FO even at 1 completely destroys my rhythm) so everyone's experience may vary
pearl barn
Eh, worked out for me.
There are also things to consider that can make pacts more doable than they seem. TD adding surplus time between locations helps deal with the timer a lot better
(sack tho)
(blasted sack)
mossy zinc
Worked out isn't the same as worked as well as it could have. 32 is very forgiving, anyway, so a lot of things can work very well.
pearl barn
Actually I think we're getting off-topic, as easiest pacts in 32 context and easiest pacts for other things (like farming 1-20 rewards) can be different too
pearl barn
True
mossy zinc
"Easy" is honestly very subjective, though.
pearl barn
Absolutely.
mossy zinc
People develop different skills at different levels.
Most players who do their first 32 are very far from optimal in anything.
I have a quick 32 Heat guide with a pact that's worked best so far for the players I've guided through 32, but it's always a starting point, and sometimes I recommend adjustments based on how the pact is working for them.
Though usually, they find the skills they need to learn are relatively easy to pick up, and luck can easily be on their side and carry a lot of the run.
pearl barn
I think the entire idea of the pact is really cool and a nice way to have a tailored challenge that doesn't just demand exact same thing from everyone
I've had issues with postgames of games I otherwise loved on this
pearl barn
Good thing the game doesn't actually give you any in-game incentive to do 50+ unlike some games [cough] Pantheon of Hallownest [cough]
mossy zinc
Absolutely.
crimson ivy
Good thing the game doesn't actually give you any in-game incentive to do 50+ un...
pain
pearl barn
pain
crimson ivy
i hate the poh
mossy zinc
And 32 is still challenging enough to make meme runs entertaining.
mossy zinc
Though lately m more into doing that at 40, I think.
pearl barn
Excalibur facetank?
mossy zinc
That's not a meme, that's a legit strat lol.
crimson ivy
okay thats
mossy zinc
Tempest Strike keeps knocking foes out of your spin lol.
crimson ivy
yep
mossy zinc
But the knockback is huge.
pearl barn
RI4 
crimson ivy
very unethical lmao
mossy zinc
So it's actually hilarious and surprisingly effective.
mossy zinc
RI4 <:shadeembarassed:520448365809500175>
Well, I did start the high heat mirrorless category on the leaderboard lol.
pearl barn
What's with Posideon legendary boons all being memes
crimson ivy
true
pearl barn
First time I ever got a legendary boon was Poseidon's "get more fish" boon
crimson ivy
holy crap
pearl barn
Then I discovered there was an achievement for selling legend boons lol
distant cradle
What tough it's think be a ok beo build for 32 heat?
Been trying and got close with eris but wanna try and clear it on beo
mossy zinc
Passion Flare, then go for Mirage Shot, Heart Rend, Smoldering Air, that kind of stuff.
And lots of poms on your Cast.
unique zephyr
At 45 heat turns out AP1 isn’t even the hardest part, it really isn’t that bad above 40 heat
smoky comet
Hey guys
what's your strategy for Underworld Customs?
Because I'm the type of guy to try and keep as much boons as possible but sell any "useless" or "temporary" ones
oh wait
just treat the Underworld Customs like the Pool of Purging but no gold
honest kernel
it gives you gold tho
it just forces you to use the pool of purging once in each transistion area
are you able to reroll that pool?
spice lava
Yes
honest kernel
oh then thats not bad at all
spice lava
Depends of the aspects, some don't need as much boons as others
Having few boons is an easy way to control UC
But some boons are not sellable
honest kernel
its usually very manageable yeah
shy plinth
Just keep a sellable boon in mind every floor
You really only need to go out of your way to keep that in mind in tartarus
Easy enough to sell a hermes boon or a random tier 2 in asphodel and elysium should be real easy, just save a roll for each purging pool to make sure you don't lose something you're building around
honest kernel
Just know that eventually you WILL be forced to give up one necessary part of a 3-boon combo, like one of Deadly Strike, Heartbreak Flourish, or Heart Rend, so you will be forced to break a build.
quartz mantle
That is why you save rerolls
and also just like have more boons than just what you need for your build
halcyon flame
it's also obviously pretty important to know which is the least important to keep in that case
are you using guan yu with heartbreak flourish, deadly strike and heart rend? you'd be fine without deadly strike or heart rend, you can totally retrieve either one in the next biome
not building charged skewer? just lose heartbreak flourish, heart rend isn't always essential
mossy zinc
Way easier to replace an Attack than a Duo Boon.
halcyon flame
yeah definitely better to just lose deadly strike though lmao
it's a core boon so you're absolutely more likely to get it back than heart rend
mossy zinc
No, it's better to sell a Duo Boon if it does nothing when you keep it.
halcyon flame
...which is why i initially said you're fine with losing either one
mossy zinc
Except selling your Attack hurts your DPS a lot.
halcyon flame
whichever one is better to lose may also depend on what other boons you have, right? like say, h.mark
in the case of h.mark it's probably better to just get rid of heart rend
honest kernel
The scenario is having to choose between one of three keystone boons in a build, though.
Selling Deadly Strike means you can't crit to benefit from Heart Rend, Heartbreak Flourish takes away your Weak applicator, and Heart Rend is Heart Rend.
My point is that UC will force you to eventually make this choice some day, so come to peace with it now before you set the game down for a week like I did the first time I had to do it.
mossy zinc
I find people always have way unrealistic expectations with UC and AP somehow.
honest kernel
In which direction?
halcyon flame
being forced into a situation like this though can honestly be very, very rare
mossy zinc
Way too high hopes, planning in ways that require way too much luck.
halcyon flame
you're likely to also pick up less important boons that you maybe be better with losing, and this is only really likely to happen early on
later on, you probably have more boons, and more stuff you should be fine without
mossy zinc
You should pick Duo Boons in Tartarus with the expectation to sell it if you have UC, then be happy if you happen to get a fourth boon and have one reroll.
But even then, selling the Duo Boon is often the right choice.
That's 400+ obols.
honest kernel
I just don't play above 32 Heat so I don't have to take UC or AP.
mossy zinc
UC is pretty chill nowadays with Dark Foresight.
halcyon flame
i mean i got my hera and poseidon 40 clears with it on fairly easily
mossy zinc
AP1 can get you essentially the same builds as AP0, it just might take a little longer because you take boons in a different order. It hurts mostly for Lord Hermes boons because you only see him twice.
halcyon flame
having slightly more limited boon options is better than having to deal with much harder encounters in elysium
mossy zinc
And your poms may be allocated sub-optimally, but still not too bad.
New update for the Player Index on the High Heat Leaderboard. The index is now sorted by highest heat (and by clear date in case of a tie). We've also added a column showing the number of aspect WRs a player holds. Thanks to @shy plinth for all the groundwork. https://imgur.com/a/aKm2ZiH
mossy zinc
@north dove that's a nice 13 you have.
mossy moon
New update for the Player Index on the High Heat Leaderboard. The index is now s...
who's that person 3rd from the bottom
I've never seen their name before in my life
mossy zinc
I think the WR for most high heat WRs held at the same time still belongs to @proud jay though probably lol.
halcyon flame
i should get around to learning em4 with beo
halcyon flame
i've only done it twice
mossy zinc
Invincible shield goes boom. What's there to learn?
halcyon flame
i dunno, not being hit by a spear throw for 100?
honest kernel
New update for the Player Index on the High Heat Leaderboard. The index is now s...
I'll ... probably stick with my one WR for a hot while
lmao
mossy zinc
lol
mossy zinc
i dunno, not being hit by a spear throw for 100?
How do you get hit? You have a shield.
mossy moon
jokes on you losers I have no World Records
mossy zinc
who's that person 3rd from the bottom
I've never seen their name before in my li...
Somebody who saw what you said about Lady Aphrodite yesterday.
mossy moon
Somebody who saw what you said about Lady Aphrodite yesterday.
who hasn't, amirite
mossy zinc
i managed to get a wr the other day <:squirtnya:472124054644457472>
Where? I don't see it.
proud jay
I think the WR for most high heat WRs held at the same time still belongs to <@!...
what's even better is that i can't be beaten at any heat WR count
halcyon flame
it was 8:30, feelin good, then cgull proceeds to sub 8 with beo
how am i gonna beat sub 8 
pseudo kernel
how am i gonna beat sub 8 <:shadegrief:520448187358642194>
go faster than 8 min
honest kernel
I've still never gotten a sub-10.
honest kernel
what's even better is that i can't be beaten at any heat WR count
Especially not with the current times being thrown around nowadays
Like holy moly
halcyon flame
proud jay
apparently i had 15/23 high heat records in early access
mossy zinc
Nice.
proud jay
plus one tied
that's 45 lucifer, but haelian's run was done on pre-patch where it was slightly stronger
mossy zinc
@halcyon flame having a WR pending leaderboard verification for over a week and then losing it one day before they both get verified is somewhat discouraging submissions tbh. That's what happened to me with Hera RTA WR.
Also, beating my 32 shield WR and then complaining that you lost it again is just rude.
halcyon flame
sorry about that
proud jay
regarding early access vs now, it's definitely much tougher now to get any records
mossy zinc
The problem with getting any WRs with less popular aspects or in less popular categories is always that you bring attention to it lol.
proud jay
back then it was more about innovation since there wasn't any idea what's actually good
halcyon flame
less crying about losing wrs more building hera backstab damage for the monthly challenge
mossy zinc
Unless you're like the expert (e.g., Baj with Zeus Aspect), odds are there are gonna be 3+ people trying to beat your record by a minute or two lol.
honest kernel
I was about to say "I sure would have hoped that it happened with Zeus shield"
halcyon flame
yeah i kinda had it coming lmao
it's not like i can compare 8:30 32 heat igt to i dunno, 60 heat unseeded beowulf?
proud jay
I was about to say "I sure would have hoped that it happened with Zeus shield"
how fast could you pull off a 58 heat zeus shield run
halcyon flame
are you asking him to speedrun 58 heat
honest kernel
Well if I could do my current 61 heat setup but on TD2
idk
somewhat soon-ish ?
But I don't play on doing any high heat stuff for a hot while
proud jay
i see
mossy zinc
back then it was more about innovation since there wasn't any idea what's actual...
Yeah, I did much better then relatively just having better strategy than most players. But the more popular the game is and the more developed the meta, the harder it is to get ahead with just that.
proud jay
just wondering since i noticed it's still sitting at 57
honest kernel
Oh yeah I straight up went to 60+
Because EM4 was the only pact to turn on, really
proud jay
oh right
mossy zinc
Like, any average speedrunner knows how to optimize Eris builds nowadays. There may be small differences between average runners and top runners, of course, but the build is not so much what makes the difference anymore.
proud jay
... Actually let me just do my 57 heat pact but on hellmode
yeah lol
halcyon flame
if i wanna hit 50 heat i should make a hell mode save
mossy zinc
Back in Early Access, a lot of people didn't even know Eris had global damage lol.
halcyon flame
cp is a usual take at 50 anyways right?
proud jay
actually i might want to try 57-58 heat zeus shield myself
mossy zinc
You don't need Hell mode for 50.
solar maple
i dunno, not being hit by a spear throw for 100?
it's beowulf. The spear does 105. Watch out!
mossy zinc
Most 50 Heat clears are in normal mode.
mossy zinc
it's beowulf. The spear does 105. Watch out!
It does 0, wdym.
proud jay
@honest kernel after playing a bunch of zag shield i realized zeus shield is like playing co-op with a special you can actually use
halcyon flame
i mean yeah but that one free heat just seems real nice
honest kernel
<@456226577798135808> after playing a bunch of zag shield i realized zeus shield...
Yeah. You are the base shield but you dual wield a yo-yo
mossy zinc
i mean yeah but that ***one*** free heat just seems real nice
It ain't free. You'll just die even more to Witches in Tartarus lol.
honest kernel
I mean
halcyon flame
then again i wouldn't trust myself to ever really be bothered to figure out how to use a save file editor to apparently change a single value so maybe i'll just do 50 on normal mode lol
proud jay
im really only terrified of EM4
honest kernel
55 heat is big already
honest kernel
im really only terrified of EM4
The only reason I didn't bother with EM4 in the first place is that I didn't want to learn the fight if I could get away with it
proud jay
yeah same
honest kernel
Zeus shield can do the fight really well
I'm just at a point where the timer's gonna kick my butt if I don't go aggro
proud jay
the highest heat EM4 i've done to this day is 50
mossy zinc
51 for me.
honest kernel
... Did I even do anything EM4 related above 32 heat ?
solar maple
em4 with AP2+RI builds is a pain
honest kernel
solar maple
takes so long
honest kernel
4-5 minutes minimum, yeah
mossy zinc
My strategy was "I dunno this fight lol let's just get +3 dashes and stupid burst damage with Rama, that should do it."
halcyon flame
is it possible to run away from em4 at 50 heat with beo or do i really need to just not die to superduper dad
halcyon flame
ew
mossy zinc
is it possible to run away from em4 at 50 heat with beo or do i really need to j...
Why would you run away? You want to face towards him to block, not away.
halcyon flame
em4 it is
waxen relic
obv you can run from em4 until 60 heat
solar maple
How do you get hit? You have a shield. <:dusa:522248771409543188>
this was my strategy for em4 🙂
mossy zinc
Just keep bull-rushing back and forth in the bottom-right corner.
honest kernel
But real talk, depends on the rest of your pact
mossy zinc
Edge of the stage will protect your back.
solar maple
Just keep bull-rushing back and forth in the bottom-right corner.
this is actually what I do
not a joke
mossy zinc
Yeah, I wasn't joking lol.
solar maple
just clarifying because it looks like one haha
honest kernel
... And here I am actually trying to intercept his attacks based on a good timing
I've been doing it all wrong
mossy zinc
It's just how you do the fight with Beowulf.
halcyon flame
i haven't really bothered to utilise the bajillion i-frames that bullrush has until i decided to speedrun 32 heat
solar maple
you have to approach him more if you have bad damage
halcyon flame
solar maple
with beo you can afford to sit in the bottom right and wait for him to come to you
mossy zinc
Ancient teachings.
So, with this new tech, are you finally gonna beat 61? I recall you've been getting to EM4 somewhat consistently.
halcyon flame
the key is charge shot
halcyon flame
on the fence?
honest kernel
Charged Shot is, uh an insane damage boost
mossy zinc
Well, you get to just bull-rush back and forth a lot more instead of having to be particularly careful. That might help with DPS.
honest kernel
The hickup is that you need to actually block things, instead of bullrushing through them
And that gets awkward for positionning on 1-dash
The last thing you want against EM4 is to be stuck in an awkward spot
I've tried the fight a few times with Charged Shot. Doable, but hella risky
on 1-dash
mossy zinc
Single-dash Charged Shot is a lot like single-dash bow.
honest kernel
Fine until EM4, pretty much
mossy zinc
Yeah.
waxen relic
yeah
gaunt fiber
yeah
mossy zinc
It's unfortunate that we can't reasonably have a death count column for the player index.
halcyon flame
how high would those numbers be
mossy zinc
I'd assume the WR would go to Astaos. He has the Guan Yu advantage.
He dies twice as fast.
gaunt fiber
Fear is for the weak
waxen relic
wonder if sgg has data on total of runs and stuff
mossy zinc
wonder if sgg has data on total of runs and stuff
We have the data in the permanent record, technically.
waxen relic
only our own
mossy zinc
Yes.
waxen relic
not all the Zaggies in the world
waxen relic
He's a god what do i know
for some folks he doesn't even return to the house immediatly when he dies
sth about a cheating mirror or sth
mossy zinc
Yeah, would just be a funny metric.
solar maple
I also want to push into the 55+ range with zeus
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/771815559410876446/841365511035682826/Screen_Shot_2021-05-10_at_10.25.15_AM.png that didn’t take long 👀
unique zephyr
Why ruthless reflex? I don’t really use it, seems like one dash would be a pain, no?
I don’t really play shield though
solar maple
with shield it's not so bad
unique zephyr
Nice job on the clear!
solar maple
also, with this pact the timer is the hardest part
so I need any dps I can get
especially vs em4
solar maple
yeah it gets pretty good uptime with the mess of enemies flying around the screen on 55 heat
pearl barn
I can see that, 50% global damage with Zeus special flying around like a UFO is a lot
solar maple
it costs a bit of safety, but I like the trade overall
also it gives hermes another good option -- +dashes usually isn't so great with 2 dashes on shield, it's just overkill
but with 1 it's quite nice
pearl barn
Oh yeah you can regain dashes if you Hermes
mossy moon
hey I'm trying to do an Aspect of Chaos run, 13 Heat, any tips?
honest kernel
oh
why em4
its kinda hard
well take js2 or somethin
MM
BP1
theres many choices
depends on what ur comfortable with
EM4 is really hard.
this channel is kinda for 32+ strats btw
mossy moon
well shoot if anyone's got some help for me
mossy moon
this channel is kinda for 32+ strats btw
doesn't say that in the Rules
honest kernel
I mean I helped you
mossy moon
yeah, and I'm grateful
mossy moon
well
it's nice to get some help from people that know better than me
so I can be better, myself
unique zephyr
What’s your pact?
mossy moon
JS2
BP2
MM
TD2
unique zephyr
That should be fine I think
unique zephyr
If you can’t make the time shift around JS2
honest kernel
em2 is rly free
pseudo kernel
JS2
BP2
MM
TD2
I would probably go js1 bp1 em2 mm td2 lc1
Idk how much heat that is tho
unique zephyr
Good luck! Your pact should be fine 👍
waxen relic
Finally! https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/725021639506526249/841415936506200075/20210510224515_1.jpg
pseudo kernel
Nice
waxen relic
Made a 4-sack happen with the power of having much time as well as buying sunken treasure and Strong Drink
And with that it's RI4 32 all castpects done (gilga instead of talos)
mossy zinc
Nice. m sure the others will come eventually.
honest kernel
congrats!
distant cradle
I am in P A I N
halcyon flame
32 heat mirrorless castspects 
unique zephyr
I know people joke that “approval process is a fun and interesting pact of punishment” but I’m learning about boons I have ignored for the entirety of my Hades play, I didn’t think AP1 would make me learn more about the game
It’s not a pact I’d take at or below 40 heat but there is a point where the other choices are worse
honest kernel
who said AP is fun I only see suffering lmao
merry otter
Imagine how much easier AP would be if you couldn't see the crossed out boons
unique zephyr
Imagine how much easier AP would be if you couldn't see the crossed out boons
This is my main issue with AP
unique zephyr
who said AP is fun I only see suffering lmao
Hey I’m trying to cope lmao
At 45 the AP0 pacts are worse
honest kernel
ap1 isnt the worst thing tho ur right
Yeah I tried ap2 just to see how it was and the only thing I could concentrate on was how good my build could have been
covert chasm
I intend to get all aspects 32 or so, but there's no way I'm taking AP. Might as well stand for Anti Phun.
unique zephyr
AP isn't a 32 heat thing
You can easily avoid it at 40 too, I'm trying 45 heat Rama
mossy zinc
who said AP is fun I only see suffering lmao
Me.
true fable
AP1 is fine
AP2 is terrible
AP2 would be ok if you could reroll hammers
but you cant
true fable
i think flurry slash is still worse but we're splitting hairs at that point
mossy zinc
@honest kernel HL5 LC4 JS1 EM3 BP2 MM UC FO2 HS DC2 TD3 should work fine on Eris.
honest kernel
oof HS
mossy zinc
Swap God's Legacy to God's Pride if you're going for Lightning Strike start, and swap Golden Touch to Deep Pockets.
Make sure you grab the Owl Pendant in Asphodel for DDs.
And Divine Dash because why not.
honest kernel
yeah thats fair enough, i took golden touch this time because of CF2, i was just hoping for some nice boons in styx which i ended up getting
mossy zinc
Unless see natural Poseidon in Tartarus, then just go for Tidal Dash.
honest kernel
Make sure you grab the Owl Pendant in Asphodel for DDs.
thats a good point, i should do that
mossy zinc
But even then probably throw in the Owl Pendant in Asphodel just for DDs.
honest kernel
Unless see natural Poseidon in Tartarus, then just go for Tidal Dash.
yeah poseidon i usually go tidal dash first and poseidon call second
ok yeah good stuff to keep in mind thanks
ill give it a shot later
mossy zinc
Not entirely with DC2 and MM, but yeah.
If you haven't read this yet, I'd recommend it. Unless of course you like to figure things out on your own, which is valid, too. https://www.hades-guides.ovh/index.php/eris-rail-guide/
Just keep in mind that's for DPS, and high heat can have different priorities.
honest kernel
ill give it a look, i think id like to have my own interpretations of certain things but its always helpful to see what other people think
mossy zinc
E.g., Life Affirmation has huge value at high heat and has quietly carried a lot of high heat runs.
honest kernel
yeah that makes complete sense, life affirmation is fantastic
You could say that about Aphrodite in general
Honestly
Great damage, good effect, great duos
hence why we're got the disciple of aphrodite here
mossy zinc
m both her disciple and high priestess. 💕
mossy zinc
Heretic! 
honest kernel
average ME user vs. average aphrodite appreciator meme when
true fable
theres no such thing as good boons in styx
if you got them in styx they were by definition fairly useless
honest kernel
oh i meant like good for styx
idk man First Styx chamber Breaking Wave kinda nice
useful in styx
waxen relic
i got saved by Strong Drink and Sunken Treasure in Styx yesterday 
mossy zinc
Nice.
You know one difference between Disciples of Lady Aphrodite and ME heretics?
We finish all of our runs. 💕
mossy zinc
You don't have to until 64 lol.
honest kernel
this is the same reason i will likely never to a fresh file speedrun
waxen relic
just RI4 ain't that bad
quartz mantle
Mirrorless can be fun
mossy zinc
We have a mirrorless category on the high heat leaderboard because mirrorless runs can be fun.
See?
honest kernel
Mirrorless means you have to be more picky with your other pact conditions
Which, you absolutely can be
Since you get 8 heat from RI4
Still undervalued, but hey, it's something
waxen relic
less of a go ham playstyle which can be fun
halcyon flame
is greater reflex still alright for 50 beo?
unique zephyr
My only mirrorless so far was Hestia 32
Guan Yu and Rama are others I have my eye on for mirrorless 32
solar maple
oh the mirror option
yeah extra dash is fine
either is good
RR is more important when you have to take RI1/2 because you need any dps you can get. Before that it's just whatever you are comfortable with
I was doing greater reflex for me 50 streaks
halcyon flame
i guess you really don't need the ruthless reflex damage since you take ap1 with 50 beo right?
solar maple
yeah I do AP1 RI0
you get plenty of damage
RR is still fine at 50 though, if you are used to 1 dash gameplay
unique zephyr
I won Rama 45 heat!!!
pseudo kernel
nice
halcyon flame
blade dash carry
solar maple
blade dash good
unique zephyr
AP1 moment
there once was a time where I didn't think I could clear even 0 heat without athena dash lol
and blade dash unironically pretty good if you're stuck with it
halcyon flame
still better than drunken dash
honest kernel
mistral pretty trash
blade dash might be better than zeus dash
havent used zap dash in a while
unique zephyr
Oh right I forgot about zeus dash lol
honest kernel
just hard to justify any dash over tidal or athena, or artemis in special cases
but ap1 taketh and taketh
unique zephyr
Artemis dash is ideal for Rama, I think
If you aren’t going special build
The dashes are pretty unbalanced, yeah
honest kernel
I will accept that artemis is the meta for rama but I'm comfy with other builds
quartz mantle
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/765636994831089726/796957155554361414/Hades_2021-01-07_23-16-48_Trim.mp4 Old clip of mine on the topic of big numbers = fun
unique zephyr
I wish it showed you how much damage you did on killing blows on bosses
halcyon flame
splitting headache stonks
bright mango
Guan Yu and Rama are others I have my eye on for mirrorless 32
I do not reccomend gy for mirroless at all
honest kernel
I won Rama 45 heat!!!
poooog
mossy zinc
Guan Yu is great for mirrorless, though.
mossy moon
hm, why so?
honest kernel
innate healing
mossy moon
ah, yeah, right
pseudo kernel
hm, why so?
25 health
honest kernel
charged skewer
gaunt fiber
spin
bright mango
The one dash strikes mess me up
mossy zinc
Practice.
gaunt fiber
The one dash strikes mess me up
yeah it's pretty bad
Mirrorless kinda kills Guan Yu's tartarus
which is usually really strong
mossy zinc
I don't think Tartarus was ever Guan Yu's realm.
gaunt fiber
it is
you one shot witches brimstones and small stuff
Well timed spins crush spawning thugs/louts
Numbskulls crumble with the mighty dash strike
mossy zinc
He was more active in China, though.
bright mango
bright mango
Honestly depends on how good you are. i don’t think there’s actually a “good” mirrorless weapon other than shield
unique zephyr
I wasn't going to do EM4 anyway
mossy zinc
Who knew.
unique zephyr
Any tips for 40 heat fists? I'd prefer not to use ME
I either die or struggle to not time out when trying not to die, I once got to dad and died but usually die early
Is dio attack start or aphro special start a real thing?
halcyon flame
divine strike is great
not the best dps but it's really safe
getting deadly flourish is a no-brainer and also lets you get deadly reversal, which helps with dps
honest kernel
dio atk is real and good
mossy zinc
I always start with Heartbreak Flourish, yes. It's a "real" thing, whatever that means.
Easy Access to Smoldering Air, or you can pivot into Curse of Longing.
Or Low Tolerance even.
halcyon flame
dio attack + arty special + aphro dash -> splitting headache + low tolerance + heart rend
unique zephyr
does dio attack scale with rarity a lot or should I run legacy for the duos
since dio has good duos
halcyon flame
i don't think hangover scales that much with rarity
poms are still super good to find for hangover nevertheless
unique zephyr
As someone whose best weapon is bow fists are hard
at least I got 45 Rama yesterday, yay
halcyon flame
also i never really though about hangover fists maybe i'll try that sometime
i'm not sure if i'll try going for 45 beo anytime soon
maybe i'll take a break before i try to make another accomplishment for myself in this game
unique zephyr
45 heat took me 59 tries so a break may be good if you’re feeling like you need one before tackling something hard. It may take you fewer tries, but just an idea of how hard it was for me compared to anything else I did
At least a few of those tries were resets, though
honest kernel
hangover fists also get to make use of blackout for once
unique zephyr
I don’t want to high roll
mossy zinc
Drunken Strike is far from optimal, FYI.
honest kernel
wym high roll
you wont always get it but its nice if you do
it works without too
thats all
mossy zinc
You only need two priority boons from Lord Dionysus, that's not too hard to get.
mossy zinc
On Attack? Lightning Strike or Curse of Agony.
honest kernel
I'm recommending drunken strike because it worked out the best for me when I learned fists
but thats different for everyone else
unique zephyr
To start with as a keepsake I mean
Although my movement needs more work than my build
mossy zinc
Yeah, wasn't saying it can't work, just it's not optimal. One benefit is it scales well with poms even if you get no tier 2 boons for it.
But then you'd still need the poms to actually hit it.
mossy zinc
m not talking about full builds but just the Attack itself.
honest kernel
I see
mossy zinc
I care more about my Special than my Attack, anyway.
If most of your DPS is not coming from your Special and that's not because it's ME, just play Zag Fists or Talos.
Probably Talos over Zag Fists, even. A lot of my DPS on Zag Fists still comes from Special.
honest kernel
hats true
static ravine
honest kernel
idk what your question is here to be honest
shy plinth
Most fun one is definitely AP2
honest kernel
I think bp2 is fun as long as you dont combine it w too many other pacts
makes some enemies go crazy
halcyon flame
poppers in elysium with js3 on
pearl barn
How many heat levels in does Excalibur facetank remain viable?
mossy zinc
Somewhere between 32 and 40, probably?
halcyon flame
heartbreak strike with some decent use of consecrated ground is alot of dr
you should be able to take a decent amount of hits just fine
"decent" as in 6-7 hits on high heat
mossy zinc
You'd want more than that for a high heat tank build.
halcyon flame
mossy zinc
Excalibur is still one of the best for clearing 32 in terms of ease.
When speed becomes a factor, it falls off. It's not exactly a speedrun aspect.
devout quiver
Excalibur best castpect
halcyon flame
if your best time is sub 9 i don't see why you would exactly be running td2 at 40 heat
pseudo kernel
ye but its on rail
i havent done it on fists yet
i struggle to get sub 10 on any other weapon
halcyon flame
13:47 is fairly decent, i'm sure you'll be fine on td3
pseudo kernel
alright
halcyon flame
time is probably the least of your worries at 40 heat, anyway
mossy zinc
Pact for Malphon, yes?
pseudo kernel
alright
mossy zinc
Do HL5 EM2 instead.
halcyon flame
i used this pact for my 40 clear https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/725021639506526249/838589801044115487/Hades_300.png
quartz mantle
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/659820450297282585/842043366397050950/Scr...
CF2 🤢
halcyon flame
divine strike is not exactly the best dps but it's very safe and should be decent enough to keep up with td3
it's probably also better to take legacy instead of pride on the mirror
deadly reversal and maybe heart rend are pretty nice, especially smoldering air if it becomes available
mossy zinc
Dash-Uppers are most of your DPS anyway. Attack doesn't matter too much.
halcyon flame
em2 for fists at 40 heat is understandable but i wonder what a 40 pact with em2 looks like
mossy zinc
Easy.
halcyon flame
dc2??
pseudo kernel
guys i got 4% damage reduction from bouldy, this is gonna be an easy win
quartz mantle
Almost a bronze skin right there
halcyon flame
js3 is kinda yikes after deciding to turn on ap1 because js2 actually gave me a hard time with hera
turns out time isn't your concern with js, it's encounters. particularly elysium
mossy zinc
Malphon doesn't really have a problem with JS3 DC2. CP2 is an issue for Hades and Styx minibosses, mainly, and EM3 if you take that.
It's not free, of course, but very doable. You shouldn't be timing out.
Very bad Tartarus not withstanding, I guess.
honest kernel
oh EM3 is usually fine for me with malphon, its much easier to stick onto theseus with malphon than it is with some other weapons
mossy zinc
Sigh. People never believe me that EM3 is brutal for Malphon high heat until they get brutally murdered.
honest kernel
em3 is kinda awful with sword and fists ye
manageable on 40 tho, havent tried higher
gaunt fiber
ashen garnet
Zeus attack without jolted is pretty weak ok
I know, that's why I am really reconsidering Zeus attack as the must-have boon. Malphon standard attack rate of fire allowing to chain-stun is kind of an anti-synergy with jolted + there's a handful of mobs which you would rather stun than allow to trigger jolted or do as they please
But it's great AoE to clear room and zeus synergies with call builds are really nice
mossy zinc
Any Attack on Malphon is pretty weak. Lightning Strike and Curse of Agony are still the best.
ashen garnet
Any Attack on Malphon is pretty weak. Lightning Strike and Curse of Agony are st...
I wish we could get more from hangover without Low Tol or CoN 
wintry sluice
what boon do people typically recommend for chaos shield aspect? I thought Zeus would be okay but it felt underwhelming the times I've used it
mossy zinc
Thunder Flourish + Static Discharge, yeah.
wintry sluice
i myself could be the underwhelming aspect in the equation
jolt is usually a good answer lol, thanks
mossy zinc
Curse of Pain and Drunken Flourish are decent, too.
Or you can shotgun enemies with Heartbreak Flourish or Deadly Flourish.
wintry sluice
👍
quartz mantle
Curse of Pain and Drunken Flourish are decent, too.
This one does well with Privileged Status
jaunty falcon
Its also worth mentioning, you get explosive return, heartbreak flourish is better than deadly flourish because the explosion cannot crit.
true fable
arguably thunder flourish is better than either since return also procs any effects but just pure % wise heartbreak is good
slow cairn
You ever just get continuously screwed by RNG? Approval process has decided I shouldn't get an attack boon. Been offered one and it's been denied every time, and I'm about through with Asphodel. It's getting ridiculous at this point.
unique zephyr
What heat are you doing? At 40 and below you can easily avoid approval process
I only felt the need to turn it on at 45 heat
slow cairn
I'm at 40
slow cairn
Well I'm trying it out because a lot of other runs are giving me issues, so experimenting with what I can get away with.
And when RNG is on my side, AP isn't a big deal, y'know?
But right now, it's annoying. Though maybe I shouldn't complain because I got Low Tolerance on Rama with +4 arrows on special in Tartarus.
slow cairn
Oh hey, that ended up being my first time clearing 40, and I only got an attack in the last zone.
mossy zinc
Good strategy accounts for AP odds.
unique zephyr
Had a good zeus shield 32 heat run...then got 5 sacked 😦
next acorn
shy plinth
Generate more numbers
celest grail
Probably died to timer
halcyon flame
exactly just dont die lol!
true fable
F
pseudo kernel
rip
true fable
happens
frigid igloo
yep
bright mango
sadge
vital grove
So it goes
honest kernel
guyssss i beat 32 heat for the second time and man it is such a good feeling
i forgot to swap my mirror things but it ended up being ok
i ran with only 25% LC
so not having SD wasn't so bad
outer peak
pogggg congrats dude
hot reef
I’m doing a fresh file hell mode run and
I need a significant amount of help
I have been leaning very heavily on god mode before this lmao
honest kernel
eh you mean like fresh file runs or just a normal hellmode playthrough
hot reef
Kind both? I mean for this specific one it doesn’t matter how many times I do it but eventually I wanna be able to get through the whole thing on my first run (I’ll be doing a new save file)
shy plinth
Uh you are making an enormous difficulty jump
hot reef
I’m not using the mirror of night or keepsakes tho since I’m basically training
shy plinth
God mode to hell mode is ridiculous
hot reef
Uh you are making an enormous difficulty jump
I have realized this
shy plinth
Fresh file runs are incredibly hard
hot reef
But I have made it my duty to make myself suffer ig
honest kernel
yeah this is crazy hard stuff
shy plinth
There isn't really help to provide in this circumstance, you simply have to learn a whole lot of high level skills all at once if this is the approach you're taking
honest kernel
I havent beaten fresh file hellmode myself
shy plinth
You're gonna die a lot
hot reef
You're gonna die a lot
Probably
shy plinth
No, definitely lol
shy plinth
I would recommend turning off god mode on your regular save file and just doing runs
honest kernel
zag sword is also awful
shy plinth
You have to learn how hard the enemies hit
hot reef
I just wanna see what the special dialogue is without just watching it or reading it or smth
honest kernel
yeah i would second that
shy plinth
You can get there but you can't take chemistry 101 and then apply for a chem doctorate
honest kernel
the one thing I'd do is trying to get ME because fresh file gives you athena and ares
hot reef
zag sword is also awful
Eh it’s ok, I’ve been maining twin fists tho so I kinda miss the high dps
shy plinth
What's the highest heat you've cleared
hot reef
E
honest kernel
sry im a bit tired
hot reef
What's the highest heat you've cleared
18 thus far
hot reef
sry im a bit tired
You’re cool
shy plinth
With god mode on or otherwise?
shy plinth
I would strongly recommend building your skills slowly instead of jumping this far into the deep end
hot reef
Go for hell mode once I suck less
shy plinth
Why not try runs without god mode on
hot reef
Yeah that’s what I’ll do
shy plinth
There are a lot of skills you can learn by just pushing heat
hot reef
I did a regular fresh file run with no god mode the other day, died because of Theseus
The singular dash is terrible
shy plinth
There are a lot of difficult things about fresh file
hot reef
Yeah
shy plinth
You can replicate it by doing a zag sword RI4 run if you want
hot reef
I know zero terminology sorry but- R14?
shy plinth
Routine inspection 4
hot reef
Ah I see
Welp I’ll just do a new file and practice not having god mode on
Maybe one of these days Theseus won’t kill me
shy plinth
I'll mention again that I think going straight to fresh file will be discouraging and there are a lot of skills to learn just pushing heat and turning off god mode
But if you want to go straight for a new start, glhf
hot reef
Do I lose my resistance if I turn off god mode and then turn it back on later?
shy plinth
No
hot reef
Alright then
shy plinth
But if you can get to theseus on a fresh file run you have probably graduated past the need for god mode
And if you want to learn good habits you have to keep it off
Otherwise you'll just be too used to facetanking
hot reef
I don’t think I’m bad at the game but before this I mainly just focused on doing as much damage as humanly possible because it was fun
shy plinth
Nothing wrong with that but it is at odds with your goal
hot reef
Yeah
shy plinth
So to make progress towards your goal you'll have to rebuild a lot of habits
hot reef
I’m focusing on being more cautious now
unique zephyr
For context: I did 45 heat and several 40 and 32 heat runs and I would probably take over 50 tries to beat fresh file
hot reef
For context: I did 45 heat and several 40 and 32 heat runs and I would probably ...
Yikes
shy plinth
It is extremely hard
honest kernel
not having deateh defiances is really tough, single dash is really tough, not having the extra health is tough, not having keepsakes is tough, just everything really
shy plinth
Zag sword blows
unique zephyr
I’ve done mirrorless Hestia and single dash is a huge loss
Can’t imagine single dash sword
With no Hermes
unique zephyr
No call, no DDs
hot reef
I don’t mind the sword, it’s my 3rd favorite weapon
unique zephyr
It was mine too until I did high heat
honest kernel
sword supremacy
hot reef
But not having the healing each room is hard
unique zephyr
It’s the only weapon I don’t have 40 heat on at least one aspect
hot reef
I have to watch myself
honest kernel
hellmode is also a bit of a different beast because it makes it even harder
unique zephyr
I just don’t feel like going through the pain of 40 heat sword
honest kernel
bacchus, btw, ive been wondering how long youve been playing for
shy plinth
Hell mode fresh file feels on par with something in the mid 40s heat wise
honest kernel
but with practice you can do it
hot reef
Honestly I only turned on hell mode initially because I figured if I jumped into the deep end, it would be a lot easier going back to the shallow pool
Works for me in other games
shy plinth
It's absolutely doable, it's just such a huge jump from where you were coming from
hot reef
But hades not making it easy dam
unique zephyr
I think hell mode fresh file only became a leaderboard category recently right
honest kernel
yeah i beat 50 but fresh file hellmode makes me
shy plinth
If you don't get discouraged feel free but it's a really, really big change
hot reef
Well
In general, any tips you guys can give me? Skills I should focus on?
unique zephyr
Turn off god mode and do 0 heat clears
shy plinth
Turn off god mode and practice not getting hit