h1-high-heat-strategies

[mossy zinc]

The leaderboard is pinned.

[honest kernel]

I usually wait for big attacks to finish like spin or the skewer to attack

otherwise I just put some specials into him

[pastel socket]

Wow, 64 was done with Zeus shield, did that aspect get a major buff or something

[honest kernel]

no?

its just good

[pastel socket]

Is it, around the time the game released nobody used it

Especially not in high heat runs

[honest kernel]

do you mean early access or 1.0 release

[spice lava]

Well, I wasn't there when the game released, but people probably weren't using it at high heat because... High heat wasn't a thing when the game released? 😮

[honest kernel]

it's not the most popular high heat weapon for sure

but its good

[pastel socket]

I mean like 1 month after 1.0

And pretty much all the way until 1.0 people seemed to universally consider it to be the worst shield aspect, perhaps tied with base version

[honest kernel]

uhm

not rly

[mossy zinc]

I don't remember anyone thinking that.

[honest kernel]

chaos shield was pretty bad after ot got nerfed

and that was 1.0

zag shield no one thinks is that good

if you mean it was overshadowed by beo, for sure

beo is very popular

[pastel socket]

I'm talking about the time beo wasn't in the game lol

[honest kernel]

thats not one month after 1.0

?

[mossy zinc]

Beowulf came in Blood Price.

[spice lava]

Yeah something sounds wrong on the timeline

[honest kernel]

yeah

[pastel socket]

Hmm

[mossy zinc]

And Beowulf was broken lol.

[pastel socket]

Oh yeah I guess it was added shortly before 1.0

[honest kernel]

like everything?

sry I dont get what you mean

[pastel socket]

Wasn't it one of the last updates before release

[mossy zinc]

Blood Price was the last major update before 1.0, yes.

[spice lava]

Nyaa cleared 52 heat with beo during Summer 2020 so 1 or 2 months before the official release of the game which was 1.0 if I get it right

[mossy zinc]

The reason "no one" played Zeus Aspect at high heat was that there were like 15 people who even did 40+ at all and only 5 who did 50+.

[pastel socket]

But anyway, since the game appeared on Steam until a bit after full release I didn't see anyone using Zeus shield at 32 heat or above as anything but a meme

[mossy zinc]

I didn't even have any levels in it yet because I didn't have Titan Blood for it and cared more for other aspects.

[honest kernel]

a lot of aspects were left unexplored in general as nya said

and old chaos prob overshadowed it

[spice lava]

Yeah, the game was just released, there wasn't that much people working on high heat before that

[pastel socket]

are there any other weapons that people started using unlike before

[spice lava]

If Rama wasn't a thing before the release, maybe People like Tailesque showed visible results about how to use it at high heat

[honest kernel]

it was tho

so yeah

[pastel socket]

I think it was mostly special Rama before it got nerfed

[mossy zinc]

That got nerfed in like the first couple days in the Blood Price beta lol.

Bow was a lot worse before 1.0, anyway.

Tailesque mained Hades Aspect in Early Access.

[honest kernel]

I think ledger got down the first rama high heat runs

I was working on them but he was faster

[jaunty falcon]

What was Rama special like before the nerf?

[mossy zinc]

A light machine gun lol.

https://youtu.be/LkW-_KDewo4

[true fable]

zeus shield is the most popular shield for high heat in china

except for ykc who does not care what other people think

and simply ties the heat record with beowulf

[mossy zinc]

I think in the English-speaking lands, people just don't care to compete with Baj with the aspect, so they play other ones lol.

[true fable]

yup

ive tried

aspect is hard

might put in some more time on it after some anyheat

but i want to try 58 beowulf

[mossy zinc]

I'll probably do more high heat again and stuff. m getting to a point at any heat where it's too much RNG for me.

[solar maple]

I was doing some 55 heat zeus attempts today, got very close

I wouldn't say I'm competing with baj though haha

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/787779476888354816/838142554037157908/Screen_Shot_2021-05-01_at_12.59.01_PM.png timer got the better of me

maybe a special boon would help

[mossy zinc]

Now you're even posting "almost won this" high heat Zeus Aspect screenshots just like Baj posts his clips.

[solar maple]

indeed

[mossy zinc]

In a couple weeks, you'll be posting clips.

[solar maple]

56s of overtime was pretty funny though

timed out just as phase 2 ended

[unique zephyr]

Got Rama 40

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/725021639506526249/838201739748442152/unknown.png

[shy plinth]

Well done

[unique zephyr]

Thanks! This took a while and a lot of improvement in mechanics

This took like a week

[honest kernel]

nice congrats!! 💞

[mossy zinc]

Congratulations! 💕

[torn sluice]

Now that I've maxed every possible upgrade

I think I shall start my journey of heat mastery

Any pointers I should note going in?

My first objective is to bring Arthur to 24

[celest grail]

theres a pinned heat guide in this channel

its made for 32 heat, but the chart in it applies for every heat level

[torn sluice]

'Heal with SD instead' ?

Stubborn Defiance?

Wait, would the buffs from hydralite affect SD?

[honest kernel]

if you intentionally die with SD at the end of a room, hydralite will heal you after that happens

so in effect, yes, they stack

[halcyon flame]

if you're using sd you probably have lc4 on by this point

and lc4 affects hydralite so it just does nothing

[honest kernel]

true

[mossy zinc]

No. That's what Touch of Styx is for—more healing from your SD.

[torn sluice]

Oh right, that's what I meant

[violet thistle]

I’ve got a question, and I’d appreciate some guidance.

I’m on a 32-Heat Zagreus Fists run, and I’ve just beaten the duo. I’m at 166/200 HP, with enough Touch of Styx Dark to take me to Dad, even if I 3-sack Styx.

I’m centring my run around dodge: I’ve carried the Lambent Plume all the way and gotten it to about 20%, plus 15% dodge from the fists and 15% more from a boon (I forget the name). So my question is about the keepsake for Styx: keep the Plume, or swap for the Acorn?

I’m on EM3, not EM4.

[mossy zinc]

What level of HL are you using?

If HL0, use Lambent Plume. If HL5, use Evergreen Acorn.

If you go into the fight with 80% of your max HP and Touch of Styx Dark, Lambent Plume is worth about 200 HP. Acorn can block over 400 damage in the fight if you use HL5.

[honest kernel]

they said HL 32

[violet thistle]

HL = Hard Labour.

[honest kernel]

oh i see

my bad

still learning all the acronyms

[violet thistle]

I’m out now, so I don’t remember, but it’s either HL1 or HL3.

[mossy zinc]

I'd probably take the Lambent Plume at HL1 and Evergreen Acorn at HL3.

[violet thistle]

I’m home. It’s HL1. I’ll keep the Plume.

[sly cradle]

I do not quite understand, why take plume away right at the end at all, if you took it with intent to level it on a dodge focused build?

[violet thistle]

I took Plume from the beginning.

[honest kernel]

since acorn potentially saves more dmg

acorn is very very powerful

[violet thistle]

It’s actually now at 24%, with 15% Greater Evasion and 15% from the fists. Assuming it’s additive, that’s 54%. And I’ll have 12 minutes to get through Styx.

[mossy zinc]

Dodge is additive, yes.

[violet thistle]

OK, we’ll see how this goes. Thanks, all!

[ashen garnet]

Are you running with Ruthless Reflex by any chance ?

[violet thistle]

Nope, Greater Reflex and Divine Dash.

[mossy zinc]

Lambent Plume is effectively adding +75% HP in that build. That's about +239 HP.

[ashen garnet]

Well that's still a lot of chances to dodge, but you can still choose to take the acorn like nyaanyaa said

[violet thistle]

Oh, and Hunting Blades. Got that before Alecto. 😁

[mossy zinc]

| 1/.7 - 1/.46 | = 75%.

Lambent Plume should be better here.

[honest kernel]

i get where these numbers are coming from, but why is this the calculation? genuinely curious

i wouldve thought it would be 1 - (.46/.7)

[mossy zinc]

1/.7 is your eHP without Lambent Plume. 1/.46 is your eHP with Lambent Plume.

[honest kernel]

i see

thanks

ok yeah that makes sense

just ran through that on paper and i understand now

thanks for humoring me

[mossy zinc]

Sure.

[sly cradle]

But if you were to swap levelled plume for an acorn, wouldn't it be better to take other keepsakes instead of plume rather than focus on levelling it at all?

[unique zephyr]

Dio attack or zeus attack for fists? 40 heat

[mossy zinc]

Sure.

[unique zephyr]

No I meant, which one is better

dio or zeus

[mossy zinc]

Probably, yes. Lambent Plume runs work better with Ruthless Reflex because any additional Dodge chance adds more eHP than the previous.

[mossy zinc]

Lady Aphrodite.

[unique zephyr]

On attack?

[mossy zinc]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/630312677855461377/774519226211762206/772250944590839808.gif

On everything!

Lightning Strike is better for DPS.

[halcyon flame]

unhealthy fixation fists 🧠

[mossy zinc]

Than Drunken Strike.

[halcyon flame]

lightning strike also handles encounters better

and if you get aphrodite then you know what that means

[violet thistle]

Took a little while because I was playing conservatively, but I got all six weapons at 32 Heat!

[honest kernel]

nice

[violet thistle]

Finished with SD gone and 208/273 HP. Lost the SD in phase 1, so phase 2 wasn’t too bad at all.

[mossy zinc]

Congratulations! 💕

[halcyon flame]

i kind of want to try 6x40 but fists scare me

[mossy zinc]

Now do the other 18 aspects.

[halcyon flame]

i'm not exactly sure about splash dash gilgamesh working a second time

[mossy zinc]

Malphon > Stygius.

[halcyon flame]

40 heat could be a good opportunity to try out lightning phalanx on poseidon

[mossy zinc]

Why do that when you can take Crush Shot?

[halcyon flame]

big damage + deflect + bouncing = easy encounters

[mossy zinc]

I don't understand.

[halcyon flame]

crush shot is good but like, i have to get within hurting range

[honest kernel]

fists arent scary once u look into them a bit

I also used to hate them

but they can be very cheesy

[halcyon flame]

i mean i don't hate fists

but i have to constantly be in hurting range

[mossy zinc]

Crush Shot's range is a lot better than people give it credit for.

[halcyon flame]

yeah blown kiss is good but i'm not taking any chances

[mossy zinc]

And it stuns anyway.

m not talking about Blown Kiss.

[halcyon flame]

i probably am taking a lot of chances going for lightning phalanx anyway though

[mossy zinc]

For example.

Heresy.

[unique zephyr]

How did you cheese fists

[honest kernel]

imo cheesing fists is making a build that lets you kinda play braindead with attack

like me, zeus or dio

i cant not read dio as dio

and not dio

truth

[barren plinth]

DIO

[unique zephyr]

Died to dad on fists 40 😦

I just can't seem to avoid damage while dealing it with fists

[honest kernel]

its hard yes 😔

[unique zephyr]

it's much easier to take advantage of Dad's recovery time after you iframe his attacks with Rama lol

[mossy zinc]

You should be able to get about 12 hits in after a spin, and then after the next spin, you can backstab with a Dash-Upper.

[unique zephyr]

Fists used to be my favorite weapon until I did high heat

[mossy zinc]

Maybe fewer than 12 I dunno, but you should be able to land a Gigacutter every other spin at least, pretty much.

[true fable]

keep in mind that on fists you really dont have to engage him all the time

most of your DPS isnt from actually attacking

attacking is a way to build your special

and ideally, apply jolted

if youre running zeus attack

otherwise it doesnt actually do that much damage

[mossy zinc]

Pretty much. About 50% or more of my DPS is typically Dash-Upper and Call.

Against Hades.

[true fable]

makes sense

sadly fists dont do a whole lot of damage by themselves

[mossy zinc]

And then the rest is split between Dash-Strikes, Chain Lightning, and Jolted, while base Attack is like not even 10%?

[true fable]

i forgot to post it

but speaking of fists

zag fists 50 is done

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/771815559410876446/838205326494924820/Screenshot_411.png?width=1202&height=676

only talos/gilga/zag sword now

[mossy zinc]

Ah yes, the classic Lady Athena + Lord Ares build on Malphon.

[true fable]

LOL

i personally like the holy shield VM

[honest kernel]

nice

[true fable]

actually carried me vs dad

saved like 4 or so acorn charges

[honest kernel]

what a cursed build

[mossy zinc]

Congratulations!

[honest kernel]

literally

[true fable]

lol

[mossy zinc]

No 💕 for you, though.

[true fable]

i got forced into heavy knuckle

LOL

is it because theres no aphro

[mossy zinc]

Heretic.

[unique zephyr]

Does this mean damage control is bad on fists?

[true fable]

no

[unique zephyr]

or should I still run DC at 40

ah ok

I should be dash uppering a lot more

I've been pretty much exclusively attacking

and I feel like giga cutter leaves me super unsafe

[mossy zinc]

You keep asking about DC on Malphon lol.

DC or no DC is not why you're losing. Just keep practicing.

[unique zephyr]

Yeah. I don't know anything about when to dash upper

is the thing

I find that when I use giga cutter I take a huge hit

or a regular dash upper too sometiems

[mossy zinc]

As a rule of thumb, you should be using your Dash-Upper asap any time it's charged.

Well, you can dash away immediately after your Dash-Upper, you don't need to just sit there.

That is if you use your first dash for the Dash-Upper.

If you use your second dash for it, you better make sure that you're positioned safely or that whatever you were hitting is dead.

[unique zephyr]

This is good info, especially about keeping a dash in reserve

i'm finding myself clearing rooms faster already

how much does fists want poms?

for zeus start

I know jolted loves poms

not sure about the attack though

[mossy zinc]

You want poms on Special, Call, and Static Discharge.

[true fable]

^

if you have a damage dash boon then pom that too

[mossy zinc]

Lightning Strike > Zeus' Aid > Double Strike > Splitting Bolt is your ideal route to Splitting Bolt.

Much better than Lightning Strike > Storm Lightning > Splitting Bolt.

So if you have the choice between Storm Lightning and Zeus' Aid, grab the Call.

[unique zephyr]

Also, is common rarity jolted still worth taking

is splitting bolt enough to run Legacy over Pride?

[true fable]

no

IMO

splitting is good but just get it

[unique zephyr]

to both?

[true fable]

[unique zephyr]

should I skip common rarity jolted for call

[true fable]

hmm

i would

but that's banking on finding jolted again

[mossy zinc]

Yeah, take the Call. Call should do more damage over the run than Jolted anyway.

Malphon builds god gauge super fast.

I take God's Legacy when I want a shot at a large number of Duo Boons or legendaries.

[unique zephyr]

I just looked at the codex, it's baffling that lightning strike isn't a prerequisite for double strike

[mossy zinc]

Why?

[unique zephyr]

Because it's a lightning boon like the others

[mossy zinc]

Lightning Strike and Electric Shot are Chain Lightning.

[ashen garnet]

AP2 Elysium Pain when you built around flat boons

[mossy zinc]

Thunder Flourish, Thunder Dash, etc. are Lightning Bolts.

[unique zephyr]

Ooooh

ok

that makes sense

Splitting bolt doesn't affect chain lightning then?

[mossy zinc]

It does.

Storm Lightning unlocks Splitting Bolt.

Chain Lightning > Storm Lightning
Lightning Bolts > Double Strike + High Voltage

And all of those tier 2 boons unlock Splitting Bolt.

[ashen garnet]

Splitting literally double your attack damage (at least), could be worth a chaos trip to pick favor

[mossy zinc]

You should take Chaos Gates anyway, but not specifically for Favor.

Though it's always a good pick.

[ashen garnet]

Always for 40 without AP, but I really love favor because it's like having a mini pride/legacy in a single boon

[mossy zinc]

I'd always go for it with AP2, too.

Unless it's before boss shop.

But can be great before boss shop to get a chance for better free rooms before the boss.

[unique zephyr]

After having actually used giga cutter I have concluded that DC2 is not in fact, free on fists

[mossy zinc]

Especially if you can't afford anything from shop and there are no other exits but shop and the Chaos Gate.

[unique zephyr]

DC2 only seems free on Rama

[mossy zinc]

That's what I've been saying.

[ashen garnet]

You need to get used to it and not engage with a cast/giga. Otherwise it's pretty cheap heat for 🤜🤛

[ashen garnet]

I don't want to brick a run because I am forced to pick a wild roiling

[violet thistle]

Knock knock. It’s my backlog, and they want a word with you. 😉

[bright mango]

I don’t find dc free on rama since it denies spawn killing

[true fable]

after some difficulty with dem attack

i have completed 40 heat on eris

with all possible attack boons

[mossy zinc]

Difficulty with FO0?

Congratulations!

[true fable]

LOL

saved the best for last

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/787779476888354816/838540308752105483/Screenshot_423.png

[mossy zinc]

Congratulations! 💕

Not highlighting Heartbreak Flourish. Very questionable.

[true fable]

a grievous error, even

[honest kernel]

522 health

oh my

[true fable]

life affirmation is good

although i didnt really use any of that health anywhere huh

[torn sluice]

I just had a billion dollar idea

I can use the extra buttons on my mouse for attacks

Now my mouse is fully in control of my aggression

MB1 is attack
MB2 is cast
MB4 (back page) is special

Now I can stop awkwardly limiting myself to angles when I dash-special

[honest kernel]

I've got Special on M2, Cast on M3, and Reload on M4. There's an M5 I could use to shuffle around Cast 'cause clicking the Mouse Wheel is a little annoying, but it's a little far.

Man, I may get another MMO mouse.

[halcyon flame]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/725021639506526249/838589801044115487/Hades_300.png

athena start is the key

next is probably bow

[unique zephyr]

Any tips for fists? I have trouble with 40 heat fists

I’ll try Athena attack

[halcyon flame]

honestly i don't know what to tell you

athena attack is good because it's safe and secures dds

deadly flourish because... obviously

you also wanna get deadly reversal once you get deadly flourish, it helps a lot with dps

[unique zephyr]

I feel like I’m so bad at this game sometimes lol

Especially with melee weapons

[honest kernel]

Swinging Divine Dash Merciful End is pretty nuts.

[halcyon flame]

merciful end is strong but uh i hope you're ready for a lot of resets

[unique zephyr]

I don’t want to go for ME

[torn sluice]

Demeter Ass Blasting

Something I enjoy going for is Demeter Aspect
Artemis Special
Frost Dash
Athena Fists
Kinectic Launcher

Artemis for big crit numbers
Dash to slow and debuff
Athena Fists for Exposed as well as keeping projectiles away
Kinectic Launcher for making Giga Cutter worth your while, with added damage and range

[bright mango]

You don’t need kinetic launcher to make your specials good btw

For dem fists or just malphon in general

[halcyon flame]

kinetic launcher is still good

exploding is better but it's one or the other 🤷‍♂️

something i just realized about kinetic launcher is that it EASILY clears out witches

[true fable]

kinetic launcher also removes your ability to dash upper technically

all subsequent specials you do are simply specials

which wont benefit from dash strike boosts or hunter dash

[halcyon flame]

what's a good js1 ap0 cf1 40 heat pact for hera

[true fable]

lol

well

there you go

there it is

[halcyon flame]

i have js2 on

but js2 sucks ass

but all the other options also suck ass

[unique zephyr]

Yeah there’s like, CP1 lol

I tinkered with the pact and I can’t see a good pact with both JS1 and CF1

[halcyon flame]

i mean honestly cp1 shouldn't be too much of a problem for hera since it does a lot of burst damage

but also ew calisthenics program

[true fable]

JS2 is fine

just manage your casts better

[mossy zinc]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/725021639506526249/829690234346274836/Hades_2100.png

I guess you swap HS for JS1 or something if you want JS1?

[halcyon flame]

i already have hs on

ap1 is just... no

[mossy zinc]

It's not too bad.

I think you're being too picky, just set something and go for it lol.

[true fable]

^

Ap1 is the only other option

at some point you have to learn how to deal with mobs on hera

that is simply the way of things

[unique zephyr]

You can either game better or take AP

[mossy zinc]

I mean AP1 also just means game better lol.

[quartz mantle]

AP1 means don't get carried by boons

as hard*

[unique zephyr]

Or get lucky?

[mossy zinc]

You still have 4 rerolls, anyway.

[quartz mantle]

Yea but getting lucky is boring

[unique zephyr]

What about hammers though

[mossy zinc]

And it often just changes the order in which you get the boons you want rather than what boons you get.

[unique zephyr]

For AP1

[quartz mantle]

AP isn't that bad until you start putting things like JS and TD3 on where you need better dps to beat the timer

[mossy zinc]

Hammers don't matter that much for Hera, anyway.

[quartz mantle]

and not getting the boons you need can hurt your damage a lot

[unique zephyr]

I was thinking about Rama 45

[true fable]

rerolls are kind of strong

[unique zephyr]

If I didn’t do AP I’d have to do CP1

[true fable]

people tend to blow them too early

[mossy zinc]

That and when there are perfectly good options to take instead of rolling.

[unique zephyr]

I like to think I can get better enough at Rama to eventually handle JS3 CP1

Yeah I’ve learned to not get greedy with rerolls

Often taking a mediocre boon is better

Kind of sucks when you have to burn a reroll at the purging well though

[unique zephyr]

Isn’t that usually when you start taking AP?

When you’re taking both of those heat factors

[mossy zinc]

Every time I watch high heat streamers, people be like "Epic Ocean's Bounty with AP2? Let's roll for Dash. Nope, didn't get it. Let's spend 2 more rerolls on this. Damn, common Tempest Flourish? Guess we take that. We're sure unlucky."

[solar maple]

with AP2 I tend to think of rolls as more of a veto than a tool for looking for specific things

[mossy zinc]

Pretty much.

[unique zephyr]

Can you sell ocean’s bounty?

[solar maple]

yes

or wait which one is that? you can sell the +% gold one, not the instantly get gold one

[unique zephyr]

I was thinking of sunken treasure

Ooops

I would reroll sunken treasure just to get a boon to sell

[solar maple]

yeah I would usually do the same

[true fable]

i reroll sunken

oceans bounty is legit good

[unique zephyr]

Mainly for when you get a forced replacement right

[solar maple]

not just replacements, but generally just awful boons

[unique zephyr]

How awful does it have to be for you to reroll it

[solar maple]

it depends on the situation

early on in the run I am more likely to roll to try to get a core boon to do damage if the god is good

later on I tend to have fewer rolls and hold onto a roll for the well, and tbh there often isn't that much to roll into

it really depends on the god -- how many things they have that are actually good

you also have to consider if you have a sell boon yet

[true fable]

on my fists 50s so far i've been running AP2 and rolling only for DDs or jolted

[solar maple]

on my fist 50 I didn't roll any boons

[honest kernel]

Got my first 32 heat win! https://i.imgur.com/zcxTNeY.png

congrats

[mossy zinc]

Congratulations! 💕

Who needs an Attack boon when you have Heartbreak Flourish.

[honest kernel]

ikr

[halcyon flame]

i should actually consider taking ocean's bounty with CF on

[solar maple]

it's really not terrible. even if you sell later you get good value

[tidal flame]

Luci on no attack.
You might not like it but this is what optimal looks like.

[halcyon flame]

what is optimal is triple bomb

that's it

[mossy zinc]

You need Triple Bomb only for DC2, so that the third bomb can do damage.

[halcyon flame]

yeah dc2 is totally free on lucifer with triple bomb

[halcyon flame]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/725021639506526249/838683987651199026/Hades_302.png

ap still stinky

next is poseidon sword

also 200th clear

[mossy zinc]

Congratulations ×200! 💕

[violet thistle]

Nicely done!

[halcyon flame]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/761220441049661442/838726282501160991/Hades_303.png

zeus man why you gotta make me choose

[mossy zinc]

I don't understand. Only one of them is a Lady Aphrodite boon. The choice is perfectly obvious.

[halcyon flame]

but if i take lightning phalanx then that means better chances at getting a dd

[mossy zinc]

It means heresy is what it means.

[halcyon flame]

final shop, zeus again

smoldering was crossed out but i can reroll

lightning dash it is then 😔

[mossy zinc]

https://imgur.com/a/Z9Y4S7T

[pseudo kernel]

oh no

[halcyon flame]

styx shop, aphrodite

got smoldering :)

[mossy zinc]

It looks like Lady Aphrodite had mercy on you, after all.

The sacred crocodiles shall have to wait.

You should be grateful that Lady Aphrodite is so forgiving.

[halcyon flame]

opened up a pool and accidentally sold it

[mossy zinc]

.....

[pseudo kernel]

nice

[mossy zinc]

https://imgur.com/a/Z9Y4S7T

[halcyon flame]

you've been juked, i didn't actually sell it

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/761220441049661442/838738652778725437/Hades_304.png

[mossy zinc]

Congratulations! 💕

[pseudo kernel]

woah thats crazy

i had no idea

[mossy zinc]

Don't play with my heart like that.

[halcyon flame]

oh and also 6x40 is done

[pseudo kernel]

nice

[mossy zinc]

When's 24×40?

[halcyon flame]

cast build with no arty/poseidon

No

[mossy zinc]

When?

[halcyon flame]

no

[mossy zinc]

Tomorrow?

[halcyon flame]

no

[mossy zinc]

spammy | 6/24 × 40 Heat

[halcyon flame]

[mossy zinc]

[unique zephyr]

Nice! I still have fists and sword to do 😦

I think I actually need help on those, I’m finding Rama 32 mirrorless easier than 40 sword and fists

I feel close to beating Rama 32 mirrorless I just need to get better at fighting Dad

[vale bison]

Any tips for 48 Heat?

[solar maple]

which aspect?

[vale bison]

Uuuuh...all of them, in general??

My idea is to do a 6x48, but with the aspects that I didn't use in my 6x40

So, for example, Poseidon's

Gilgamesh

Hera

Beowoulf

Zagreus Spear

Zagreus Rail

Yeah, there it is

[halcyon flame]

zag rail at 48 heat?

what are your other options for rail

[solar maple]

I've never done 48 heat myself (only 50+ or 40-), so I'm not exactly sure what a pact would look like but it's probably similar to 50

RI0 is probably a good idea for most things at 48 heat I think

[halcyon flame]

why not just go 50 at that point

[solar maple]

actually if you are not on hell mode often you will probably do a standard hell mode 50 but with no PL and no CP, so either RI0 AP2, RI2 AP1, or RI0 AP1 EM4, depending on the aspect

[vale bison]

Oh

It is finally time for RI2 then

[solar maple]

yeah you start to run out of options at the very high heat

[vale bison]

All the pacts you mentioned are very scary

[solar maple]

generally you have to take 2 of RI2, AP2, TD3 and EM4 at 50 heat. You can technically do only 1 of those at 48, but timer will be hard with all the other stuff

wait no

you ony have to take 1

hm let me think about a 48 heat pact for a sec

[vale bison]

Actually, you guys convinced me to just go straight to 50 Heat

[halcyon flame]

have fun uhh suffering with zag rail

[solar maple]

yeah zag rail at ~50 is pretty rough

the damage just isn't there

[vale bison]

Oh, okay then

[solar maple]

you really need to find jolted I think for zag rail to do anything

and that can be hard with ap/ri

[halcyon flame]

spread fire is probably still kinda rough

it's powerful but just not safe to use

[vale bison]

My brain still can't process that EM4 on high heat is even doable

[solar maple]

it's very tough

[halcyon flame]

it totally is doable

[shy plinth]

I recommend watching retrash vods

It's fun

[halcyon flame]

just... less doable than you think

[solar maple]

it's more doable with high dps shields -- beowulf and zeus, but it is possible with everything

and yeah if you want to see great em4 play, watch some retrash vods from the spreadsheet in the pins

[vale bison]

I will!

[unique zephyr]

I don’t find I get much education from them

But it is fun

I don’t think I’m at a high enough level to learn from them

[solar maple]

I would say they are most helpful after you die to em4 a few times

[unique zephyr]

I’m still struggling with 40 heat lol

I don’t turn on EM4 right now

I do want to actually clear 40 lol

[solar maple]

when you get stuck on a particular move/sequence, you can see how he deals with it

[unique zephyr]

That’s a good idea to help me grind EM4

[solar maple]

personally, if I were doing the aspects you listed I would do EM4 for beowulf (my main aspect) and hera, and em3 for the others

beowulf is the best aspect for fighting em4 generally

though of those I've only done 50 with poseidon and beo

[vale bison]

Alright, I guess i'm trying Beowulf first then

Thanks for the help, guys!

[unique zephyr]

45 heat Rama is tough, I only got to Meg on my furthest attempt 😦

I want to do 50 heat one day but I am not sure if it's attainable for me...I hope it is, I have overcome stuff I thought I couldn't so I hope this is the case for this time too

[honest kernel]

you got this easy clap

[honest kernel]

50 is very rough but you can do it with practice!

I also thought I'd never do it

[bright mango]

Retrash vods are pretty helpful

[vital grove]

The higher heats can be grindy.

[grim hamlet]

Hello everyone,
I'm having problems completing the game with 32 heat. I don't know exactly what conditions to chose and what builds are gonna be best for it. I'd appreciate some help, than you in advance.

[waxen relic]

There's some guidance in the pins.

[neat sonnet]

If you’re looking for weapon-specific gods/boons/hammers, ask away though, these folks know their stuff

[unique zephyr]

How much forced overtime are you comfortable with using?

[grim hamlet]

at the moment no more then one but I can learn to do more

[vital grove]

You should get accustomed to TD2 at least, it's extremely easy to do

Then move to TD3 once you're safely under 20 minutes every run

[unique zephyr]

I was asking about the increased speed

Not tight deadline

[vital grove]

I'd stay away from Approval Process and Routine Inspection

[unique zephyr]

TD2 is good to get used to though, TD3 is hard but I find it fun

[grim hamlet]

yeah that's what I was talking about

[vital grove]

Forced Overtime 2 you should just turn on and leave on. You'll get used to it.

Lasting Consequences 4 and Stubborn Defiance is a good combo that becomes necessary when you go over 32 but can be good to run on 32 as well

[grim hamlet]

ok thanks for an advice

[mossy zinc]

Nyaanyaa's 32 Heat Guide
HL5 LC4 CF2 EM3 BP2 MM UC TD3
Stubborn Defiance
Eternal Rose > Owl Pendant > Lucky Tooth/Acorn > Acorn

Here's my guide.

[unique zephyr]

Her pact is what I used before I got used to FO2

[honest kernel]

what weapon?

[pseudo kernel]

any weapon

that pact works with any weapon

[honest kernel]

nice

ill give it a shot sometime

[vital grove]

Yeah you can swap out HL5 and CF2 to CF1 for FO2 and

[unique zephyr]

Or CF0 and HL1 for FO2

CF1 is way more impactful than HL1

[spice lava]

Depends if your issue is gathering boons or taking damages

[mossy zinc]

That pact is based on both my own experiences and my results helping newer players beat 32 Heat.

[unique zephyr]

It’s a great FO0 pact and the one I used for my first 32 heat clear

I definitely like it 🙂

[honest kernel]

oh you guys dont like FO?

i almost always have FO on, i don't see much difference between that and normal

[unique zephyr]

Nah we do, her guide is specifically for people just getting into high heat who may not be used to FO

Like me when I first started

[honest kernel]

ah gotcha

makes sense

[waxen relic]

If you're good at FO2 you can go close to hitless on FO0 which helps clearing a lot.

[honest kernel]

guess that makes sense

[mossy zinc]

If I do 32 nowadays, it's either for speedruns or for some challenge like mirrorless, boonless, whatever.

Speedrun pact would be HL5 LC4 EM2 BP2 UC FO2 HS TD3.

[unique zephyr]

I should try speedrunning using that pact once I get much better at high heat

I haven’t tried any heat speedrunning yet, I might? Idk yet

TD3 has made me interested in going fast

[mossy zinc]

Or you should try running that pact to get much better at high heat.

[unique zephyr]

Now that I’ve done 40 that pact feels perfectly doable, yeah

Since I run FO2 HL5 and HS on 40 anyway

I’ve gotten better at avoiding traps

For the most part

EM2 lava can sometimes hurt a bit still

But that’s a skill thing that I can work on

Avoiding CF and EM3 seems very nice, I’ll try that pact

[honest kernel]

high heat got speedrunning included

I dont rly feel like I need to rush more

[mossy zinc]

I like the practice for higher heats.

[honest kernel]

fair enough

[honest kernel]

boonless em3 is stupid hard

[proud jay]

hey i did a thing

54 heat zag shield (seeded), this time also recorded

[mossy zinc]

Congratulations! Nice to see you back doing some high heat things.

[proud jay]

yeah it's been a while

i realized that while AP2 makes for a terrible experience, seeding a hammer makes it much better

[mossy zinc]

Seeded solves a lot of AP2 problems for weaker aspects, yeah.

[tame mist]

whats a good 42 heat zag shield pact, without ap

[mossy zinc]

HL5 LC4 CF2 JS3 EM3 BP2 MM UC FO2 HS TD3 maybe.

[honest kernel]

nice bablo 👌

also maybe im shooting too high with going boonless 40 right away

but the rooms arent any issue I just have to play the bosses squeaky clean

[mossy zinc]

What's your pact?

[honest kernel]

hl5 lc4 cf2 em3 bp2 mm uc fo2 hs td3

I was thinking about ap1 but I would just pray on rng not to get locked into a bad boon choice

[mossy zinc]

Yeah, AP with boonless sucks.

You could try RI1 and save 2 Heat elsewhere.

[honest kernel]

I tried running dd instead of sd but it didnt go super well either

maybe take heat off cf and buy all the kisses of styx

im gonna try thx

[mossy zinc]

Or LC2 and get actual healing?

CF2 is nice, though.

Cheap Centaur Hearts.

[honest kernel]

[mossy zinc]

If you buy CF0 poms without any pommable boons, you get money back.

[honest kernel]

aaaand no reroll hermes killed the run

[mossy zinc]

Nooooo.

[honest kernel]

aphro be like "strike dash or different league sweetie :)"

guess i can do hitless

and i got hit

tempest strike, tidal dash or bounty 💩

boss reward is darkness so its doomed I suppose

[mossy zinc]

Darkness doesn't benefit your run if you don't have Dark Regeneration.

So that's fine.

[quartz mantle]

You can't sell Bounty tho

Or is it the other one

[mossy zinc]

You can sell Ocean's Bounty.

[honest kernel]

I had dark regen

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/624635342116618243/839252979319701514/unknown.png

anyway I did it 💓

[mossy zinc]

Congratulations~! 💕

[honest kernel]

thanks for the lc2 tip it worked well with dds

and I could kill hades easily

[mossy zinc]

💕

https://tenor.com/view/pan-thumbs-up-dragonball-like-approve-gif-9565085

[ripe crane]

Hestia Bestia

[honest kernel]

thanks

[unique zephyr]

I wonder if I have finally hit my skill cap

Having a stupidly hard time with 45 heat Rama

[mossy zinc]

Well, it's 45 Heat.

Skill caps are a myth, anyway, but they can become self-fulfilling prophecies if you believe in them.

Learning and skill improvement aren't linear.

And neither is performance improvement.

[unique zephyr]

That’s good to keep in mind, so there will be plateaus sometimes? And I do know I can improve since I’ve done so since the past month

Was just venting a bit

[mossy zinc]

I don't like to think of them as plateaus because that implies being stuck in some way.

What can happen is that your performance improves very slowly and barely noticeable, then suddenly jumps up.

Or something else that can happen is that you're noticeably learning but while you're doing so, your performance is decreasing.

Which can be very confusing because you think you understand better, but you're doing worse.

[shy plinth]

#h1-builds-and-combat message

This was you too 🙂

[mossy zinc]

Learning new things can do that.

[shy plinth]

Remember how far you've come before you tell yourself that you can't go any further

[mossy zinc]

But eventually your performance will pick up again and you'll do even better than before.

[pseudo kernel]

Nice

[mossy zinc]

Gotta have faith in your methods even when the going gets rough for awhile.

[shy plinth]

Also, if 45 feels really difficult: Yes

Yes it is

[mossy zinc]

It's not as difficult if you have like 1k hours in the game, surprisingly.

Much of that at high heat.

Speaking of that, @unique zephyr, how many hours do you have in the game now?

[unique zephyr]

380.9 hours

[unique zephyr]

Wow, thanks for reminding me, this gives me perspective 🙂

I don’t even remember that post haha

[shy plinth]

Searched for your tag and the word "skill", sorted by oldest, and there we go

We all start somewhere and you've come real far

[mossy zinc]

Maybe one day, Discord links on mobile will actually work.

It takes me to #h1-builds-and-combat but not to the actual post lol.

[shy plinth]

Yeah it's an issue with loading conversation back to November

https://i.imgur.com/rF4rUJh.png

There you go 🙂

[mossy zinc]

Kinda agree with Bacchus93 there. 5 Heat is def the ceiling.

[ashen garnet]

Is Family Favorite allowed for boonless ? 🤔

[solemn pulsar]

only if you dont do damage at any point while having a boon 🧠

[unique zephyr]

Now I’m curious what my pact was for 5 heat lmao

My own journey is inspirational to me haha

Proves I can do things I set my mind to 🙂

[mossy zinc]

We've not excluded any boonless for having Family Favorite.

So we won't do that now.

[gaunt fiber]

If you get hit while having a revenge boon, is it a reset?

[mossy zinc]

Not if the revenge effect whiffs.

Otherwise, yes.

[gaunt fiber]

Makes sense

Kinda want to try a revenge build featuring Aphrodite and Ares

With curse of longing

It should work right?

[mossy zinc]

Might be worth updating the rules for things like that at some point, but boonless is not a very popular category, anyway.

[gaunt fiber]

yeah turns out having boons feels nice

and it can get tedious to avoid boons and stuff

[honest kernel]

oh i didnt think about ff

tbh

it would havw given me dmg boost during points in the run

[mossy zinc]

Me either lol. I think we gotta discuss the rules a bit more in-depth for the category at some point and formalize them.

But not now.

[honest kernel]

gonna slip by for now

[mossy zinc]

I need to get my sleepies. 💕

[honest kernel]

gnight

[unique zephyr]

Good night!

[mossy zinc]

Nyainyai Toffel~! Good night not-Toffels!

[honest kernel]

[gaunt fiber]

[eternal cedar]

Hey guys, new to endgame stuff, I should work through each heat on my way up to the 16 in the pinned post right? or does it matter?

[unique zephyr]

Only for getting bounties you'd need for leveling weapons you want to use for high heat, I had some weapons below 10 heat on the bounties when I first started high heat

high heat is more for personal achievement than anything else

[halcyon flame]

^^ there's no incentive to go above 20 heat aside from a statue and nothing else. anything above 32 heat you would do for the sake of having bragging rights

[eternal cedar]

okay cool thanks!

just gunna farm darkness til i have everything in the mirror maxxed, then ill just go straight for higher heats

[honest kernel]

just max the important talents

[mossy zinc]

https://imgur.com/a/19iWUvU

That's looking a lot like the ones I made in Early Access.

Except those were 40–50, mostly.

[devout quiver]

what's this a rating of

[mossy zinc]

Aspect WRs.

[halcyon flame]

didn't retrash do 60 eris?

and 57 heat zag sword?

[shy gulch]

those were both seeded

i assume this is unseeded

[mossy zinc]

Unseeded, yes.

[halcyon flame]

hera sitting at the bottom like 😔

[mossy zinc]

Quick update. https://imgur.com/a/sB5Bo4k

Just saw that @daring hedge did 53 Zag Bow earlier. Congratulations!

[honest kernel]

was that rama special spam rama

[mossy zinc]

Hmm? The 60 Heat WR? lol

[honest kernel]

you said early access right

[mossy zinc]

These are current WRs.

[honest kernel]

I see

[mossy zinc]

I haven't made a list like that since Early Access is what I said.

[devout quiver]

most of Tail's winning runs are on YT

[mossy zinc]

They're also linked on the high heat leaderboard, yes.

[solar maple]

poor hera

also nemesis 52 zag sword 55 is pretty funny

[halcyon flame]

60 heat nemesis when

[mossy zinc]

Be the 60 Heat Nemesis you want to see in the world.

[halcyon flame]

no

[dusty bramble]

What's the first two there?

[mossy zinc]

Rama and Beowulf.

[dusty bramble]

I wonder if first aspect of shield is the best non hidden aspect there?

[halcyon flame]

all of them are good

[dusty bramble]

[halcyon flame]

there's really no "best" aspect for shield

not even in high heat imo

[dusty bramble]

Gotta try. I break my wrist playing Zag Sword last time

[mossy zinc]

It's between Beowulf and Zeus for the shield, the other two are not in the conversation.

And Beowulf is crippled eventually by RI3+.

[bright mango]

All of them are great except for zag shield

[neat sonnet]

well, zag shield has a higher wr than chaos 👀

[mossy zinc]

It does.

[bright mango]

I was thinking of trying to get a 53 chaos

It’s entirely possible

[mossy zinc]

Thinking of it doesn't get you WR.

[bright mango]

I’ve been trying

Seeing how Ri3 works with chaos

It’s way harder on chaos than zeus tho

[proud jay]

hey i did another seeded run

54 zag bow

[mossy zinc]

Nice! Congratulations!

[proud jay]

https://imgur.com/HbSmMnI
i just got handed everything

[pseudo kernel]

nice

[mossy zinc]

Very nice.

How often did you press Special?

[proud jay]

not once

[mossy zinc]

That's what I thought lol.

[bright mango]

bablo on a tear

[honest kernel]

nice

[neat sonnet]

is there a link to the mod that lets you choose the initial chamber item? I think I'd have more motivation with that to push heat

[solar maple]

https://github.com/parasHadesMods/EllosStartingBoonSelectorMod is the one that works with approval process

[neat sonnet]

dope! I haven't modded my game before, so how do I add it on?

[solar maple]

I would take a look at the modding server pinned in #self-promotion

I think they have a guide

[neat sonnet]

all righty

[honest kernel]

I'm going to upload my boonless even if I had ff on if thats okay

[mossy zinc]

Sure! The run is perfectly legal for the leaderboard.

[honest kernel]

its a mirror talent and not a boon

[visual radish]

Its possible to play boonless?

[pseudo kernel]

yes

[visual radish]

OwO

Is it in a hard mod?

[pseudo kernel]

no

[visual radish]

How can it happen??

[pseudo kernel]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/725021639506526249/833407072749748224/Screenshot_161.png

[honest kernel]

basicially you pick up boons but dont use them

[pseudo kernel]

yeah

[honest kernel]

if you pick up cast dont cast ect

[pseudo kernel]

and then in between biomes you just purge them all

[honest kernel]

and then you purge them asap

[visual radish]

:ooo

My brains completly forgot the purge thingy

[honest kernel]

ppl usually use shackle since it gives you a 100% dmg buff

for not having boons

[visual radish]

What is dmg?

[honest kernel]

damage

[pseudo kernel]

damage

[visual radish]

Oki so what is a damage buff at the end??

Sorry ^^"""

[honest kernel]

a damage increase

[visual radish]

Oooh

[honest kernel]

shackle adds +100% to your base damage

so it increases it

[visual radish]

Thank you for explaining and for giving words

[pseudo kernel]

shackle gives you a buff to your attack, cast, and special when you dont have boons

[honest kernel]

np

[neat sonnet]

wooo zeus 32

[pseudo kernel]

epic

[neat sonnet]

apparently I got to styx a week or so ago and had to quit out but I just destroyed dad

sea storm + many other funny things are very good

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/310192867110813707/839529948494037083/unknown.png

[pseudo kernel]

nice

[neat sonnet]

yeah the mirage shot was a funny one, especially when I got jolted in styx for sea storm

well really the whole thing was busted

[honest kernel]

time to do mirrorless I feel like this one will be easier

[visual radish]

Im kinda regreting trying boonless for now lol

[mossy zinc]

'Tis good practice.

[visual radish]

I failed cuz couldnt get rid of the dash provided by Aphrodite

Lol i barely survived Elysium so wont survive to find doggy's food lol

[honest kernel]

nvm its hard

[visual radish]

I died in the maze area

[pseudo kernel]

rip

[visual radish]

Yeah

At least for once i had so much money for me to buy the 1000 coins costing item lol

[pseudo kernel]

nice

[visual radish]

I will retry when i learn to play well lol

Without god mod could have died in Asphodèle

[grim hamlet]

You not only finished the game like this but also used 20 heat!

That is impressive

[pseudo kernel]

Thank you

[grim hamlet]

But if you used golden touch instead of deep pockets your gold would stack more easily

[pseudo kernel]

I did that on a different run

[grim hamlet]

oh ok

[honest kernel]

athena gives me no dd's on ri4?

[shy plinth]

Correct

She refills DD slots and you don't have any to refill

[honest kernel]

😔 thx

[visual radish]

Dd?

[honest kernel]

death defiance

[mossy zinc]

Last Stand and Deathless Stand can't show up at all if you don't have a DD/SD slot.

[visual radish]

Oooh

[torn vapor]

Or that'd be a troll move

[gaunt fiber]

Skelly is the way

But you'd have to use it anyway so heh

[thorn quartz]

I’m trying to reach 32 heat with fists. As of now I’m at 18 heat, and the runs have been going smoothly until now. Everything is pretty much fine until Theseus and Asterius, who take all of my death defiances so I usually end up dying to Hade’s second phase.

[mossy zinc]

18 Heat isn't the same as 18 Heat. What's your pact?

[shy plinth]

Yeah not all 18 heat is created equal

[mossy zinc]

If you're doing EM3 or EM4 on Malphon, my simple advice is to just not do that. You only need EM2 for 32, anyway.

[thorn quartz]

well that was easier than i thought

[mossy zinc]

Malphon has a way harder time with EM3 than other weapons.

[thorn quartz]

yeah i was using em3

[shy plinth]

I don't think em3 is that bad for what it's worth but it definitely is harder on fists than on not-fists

[mossy zinc]

EM3 FO2 is a very stupid fight with Malphon.

Your attack windows vs Asterius are small; you often need two dashes to get clear of his ground pound if you don't have Divine Dash, which completely wastes that opportunity because you can't really dash back in in time to deal damage; most people I've seen actually don't know the timing to deflect his ground pound with Divine Dash and just never do it because it's not intuitive at all that it also cancels the shockwave; the spin wastes 5 seconds every time where the best you can do is throw a most likely very weak Cast at him; you can waste a lot of time chasing Theseus when he's zooming around the arena; since you're so close, you can easily take contact damage from the hitbox in front of him because your Attack hurtbox reached through him or he turned awkwardly.

EM3 and EM4 are very anti melee.

And since they overbuffed bow, Malphon doesn't have the DPS advantage, either.

Not that the buffs were bad because bow is a ton of fun, but it's not exactly balanced lol.

I guess if you high-roll for Merciful End, that takes care of it. But that's one specific build that also just kind of ignores Malphon mechanics in favor of just playing ME lol.

[shy plinth]

You can also smolder!

[mossy zinc]

True I suppose lol.

[shy plinth]

How could you forget about a strategy that starts with eternal rose

[mossy zinc]

Tbh because I didn't really do high heat Malphon since 1.0.

[shy plinth]

It's fun! You get to punch things

Though I would bet fists are the second least popular weapon in this channel

Only really ahead of spear

And tbh Astaos might flip that stat on his own

[mossy zinc]

I mained Malphon in Early Access.

I stopped playing Malphon high heat in 1.0 because of EM4 pretty much.

That fight is not fun with Malphon.

It's so anti-melee.

[shy plinth]

That is true

[mossy zinc]

It's ridiculous imo how much more punishing EM4 mechanics are for melee than for ranged weapons.

[shy plinth]

Except for beo

[mossy zinc]

Shield is shield. I don't count that for melee. It's its own category.

A lot of problems don't exist if you have invincibility lol.

[unique zephyr]

Shield is great because it can block

I’m starting to diverge between my best and most favorite weapon, I’m best with Hestia but it’s starting to bore me, I like Rama so far but I’m worse at it right now

[mossy zinc]

Just trying to destroy EM4 skulls with Malphon is ridiculously hard.

You need to commit dashes just to even be in attack range lol.

Meanwhile, EM4 skulls might as well be normal skulls for ranged weapons.

I can get behind his aura that pushes you out during 360 beams.

That affects all weapons equally more or less.

But why during triple beam?

That has zero effect on ranged weapons.

But again you waste dashes just to stay in attack range with Malphon.

Need to destroy urns to stop healing? Just snipe them all from where you're standing.

Need to do it with Malphon? Have fun dashing across the whole damn stage punching things that will hit you for 150 if you mess up dashing out or i-framing in time.

That's why I "notoriously", as I've been told recently lol, don't like the fight. I don't mind it with e.g. Rama, that's actually kinda fun, but I don't enjoy at all how unbalanced imo it is for melee.

[mossy zinc]

Yeah, Hestia kinda bland. Also it's kind of physically tiring to play. So many button presses.

[unique zephyr]

I feel like I’m not engaging with the game as much

Rama meanwhile rewards me for knowing enemy attack patterns

Also because it can take DC2 easily I can run AP0 RI0 EM3 for 45 heat

I’m stubborn and hate approval process more than I should

JS3 + CP1 + TD3 is very hard but it feels less bad than having your desired boons crossed out

[mossy zinc]

I think it's between Zag Bow and Hestia for me for most bland yet physically tiring aspects.

[unique zephyr]

I find Hestia a bit more bland

[mossy zinc]

Once you can consistently power-shoot with Zag Bow, there isn't much to do.

Hestia at least let's me use the Special.

[unique zephyr]

You need to commit a bit for power shot

Hestia you just shoot instantly

[mossy zinc]

Zag Bow is just Dash > hold Attack > release > repeat.

And if you don't get good hammers, it's awfully slow, and there's nothing you can do about it.

There are some ways to optimize like lining up shots and releasing power shots asap to keep your rate of fire much higher than if you always release late in the power shot window.

But I can't play the weapon for very long anymore at this point.

[unique zephyr]

I’m finding ways to get a bit better at Rama each time

I find it an interesting weapon

[mossy zinc]

Also finding the right release timing for enemies that you can kill before power shot timing.

[unique zephyr]

It’s hard but I want to get good at it

How do you like Rama

Fun wise

[mossy zinc]

It's fun.

More things to learn with Rama than with the other bows.

[unique zephyr]

So you mentioned this yesterday and I’m curious how this happens

And why, since I think that’s what’s going on right now

[mossy zinc]

Because you're focusing on learning something specific and not paying as much attention to other things.

Or you're experimenting with various new strategies or tactics, figuring out what works.

And a lot of them probably won't work the way you expected at first.

[mental ginkgo]

speaking of rama, is it better to just special spam or should I special and then normal? (for single target dps)

[mossy zinc]

You learn a lot from it, but that learning comes in part from figuring out what doesn't work.

Through trial and error.

[halcyon flame]

special every enemy in the room > hit something with your attack > repeat

[mossy zinc]

@mental ginkgo Special first, then Dash-Strike.

[mental ginkgo]

ah ok, thanks!

[unique zephyr]

Ah ok, I’ll just practice and have faith it will pay off

I notice myself getting a bit better incrementally

How do I deal with shifters with Rama?

I lose a lot of time to them

[unique zephyr]

@mossy zinc I notice you like Crush Shot a lot. Why is it good and how can I use it effectively?

Range makes it seem like a downgrade to boonless cast for the sake of boiling blood

[halcyon flame]

high base damage, applies weak, decent aoe with blown kiss, i don't personally have much to say about it

it's just kinda strong

[honest kernel]

its the most damaging cast that lodges I think?

Phalanx hits harder at Epic and Heroic, I think.

[halcyon flame]

crush shot hit harder in comparison when both are at common but phalanx shot just scales better with rarity

it's hard to compare

[honest kernel]

I see

[celest grail]

also, its an aphrodite boon

[unique zephyr]

Taking a short break from high heat for now, started playing Bastion

thanks for everything, I just need a mental and physical break

[honest kernel]

take breaks yeah 👍

[halcyon flame]

don't tell me you're buying into the aphrodite propaganda now

[true fable]

i like phalanx better on most non hera weapons

but on hera crush shot feels better

i still like phalanx for boss dmg but crush shot and hera is a match made in heaven

[visual radish]

There’s an aphrodite propaganda????

[honest kernel]

lead by lady nya

[visual radish]

Oooh

[unique zephyr]

Aphrodite does have pretty good boons for weapons that benefit from percent based damage

[hearty onyx]

Is it really propaganda if it's true

[kindred panther]

That reminded me of Tyrion Lannister:

It's not slander if it's true.

hehe but I'd say there is a difference. I'd argue that propaganda is defined by the reaction its author intends to elicit from the reader and not by the content of the message itself.

In other words, one can create propaganda without lying, if the facts are presented in a way that elicits a reaction that they would otherwise not, I'd still call that propaganda.

[frigid igloo]

Why do people take skelly's keepsake with lasting consequences at 100%?

[bright mango]

It still restores 100 health

[frigid igloo]

wouldnt ever green acorn be better?

[bright mango]

It’s usually used for elysium where enemies can get really scary

Sometimes asphodel as well

[frigid igloo]

yeah I am on a 50 heat run and about to enter elysium so didnt want to make the wrong choice

[bright mango]

Well at 50 heat it’s very situational

Can you survive elysium enemies your build?

Do you already have an Athena dd?

[frigid igloo]

I dont have an athena dd

and I am running classic eris

with athena dash

[bright mango]

Do heroes normally use up one of your dd’s with acorn?

With athena dash I would take acorn

There’s still a chance you can get an extra DD

[frigid igloo]

yeah thats what I was thinking

tysm!!

[bright mango]

Just remember that it’s very situational👍

[spice lava]

Tooth is taken when the biggest runkillers come from the rooms before the boss than facing the boss itself but yeah, situational

[ashen garnet]

I want to believe that you will try again

[honest kernel]

can some1 explain to me again how ri4, tooth and athena dd interact

do i need to lose my tooth to refill

or do I just take it for free and run

[pseudo kernel]

yeah

[gaunt fiber]

Nothing is free I fear

[mossy zinc]

If I remember right, you need to lose your Lucky Tooth in the same room that you take her boon, and if you unequip Lucky Tooth, her DD is gone.

[gaunt fiber]

You'll need to lose it since Athena's DDs are refill

[honest kernel]

thanks

no cheese 😔

[gaunt fiber]

🧀

Here take it

[honest kernel]

✋

[gaunt fiber]

:(

[mossy zinc]

The real Lucky Tooth cheese strat for mirrorless is equipping it to get Stubborn Roots, then taking Acorn later.

[honest kernel]

tbh I was thinking about running dem hard

and I tried but it didnt go super well

shes kinda underwhelming on rama special

[mossy zinc]

Are you doing LC4 or LC0?

[honest kernel]

I am doing lc2

should I just put 0

[mossy zinc]

Could try it. Whatever helps you stay near max HP.

[honest kernel]

I will try it thanks

[mossy zinc]

If you only die to bosses, and you reach bosses with near max HP, then reducing LC won't help you much really.

But if you reach them frequently with noticeably less than max HP, lowering LC should bump that up.

[honest kernel]

bp2 kills me a bunch tbh

[neat sonnet]

BP2 seems to be like that

[distant lichen]

Are there any tips for 32 heat?

[unique zephyr]

There are pact tips on the pins

What’s your favorite weapon aspect

[distant lichen]

I'm trying with chiron

but my favourite is Hera bow

[honest kernel]

then play hera

[spice lava]

Both 😏