h1-high-heat-strategies

[honest kernel]

Made wonders for my Zeus shield play

[unreal pasture]

So you'll be immediately worse... and then you'll get better...
And it's not clear if you'll ever get better with a custom setup

[honest kernel]

^ those were my fears

but a game like Hades, building muscle memory is actually kinda fast

[unreal pasture]

mix/maxing usually turns frustrating kind of quickly

[honest kernel]

Took me like a day or two of playing to get used to it

Which is ... pretty fast for the benefits

[unreal pasture]

Do you ever have those days where it's like... something about your setup feels wrong and you can't figure it out at all?

[honest kernel]

For me ? honestly no, because I'll do janky setups if I feel the need to

But I could see it

[unreal pasture]

Ah. that was me today... I played so many runs and couldn't get out of tartarus... I got to Elysium once today and my gfx card crashed

[honest kernel]

Not knowing what to optimize can be a real pain

[unreal pasture]

run was so insane as well... had everything. Second Wind, Athena dash, athena aid, lightning strike, jolted

[warm osprey]

What aspect

[honest kernel]

on rail ?

[unreal pasture]

Zagreus fist

That's all I've been playing

[honest kernel]

👀

[unreal pasture]

So I had 100% dodge already

Assuming I could proc a ruthless reflex

[warm osprey]

Dodge gets capped right

At 80?

[honest kernel]

Not anymore

[warm osprey]

Oh what

[honest kernel]

Or at 'least, not now

[warm osprey]

Thats sick

[honest kernel]

There was a clip that showed a 100% dodge build against a soul catcher

Never got hit

[warm osprey]

Interesting

[honest kernel]

Getting there in the first place is ... inconsistent

[warm osprey]

Yeah sounds silly to go for

[honest kernel]

And in the meantime, you run with a weapon and an aspect with sub-par damage

[warm osprey]

Unseeded atleast

[honest kernel]

Not a good recipe for high heat

Or for consistent high heat, rather

[warm osprey]

What is probability of seeing Pat in a run

[honest kernel]

I actually don't know off the top of my head

My guess would be something around 40% ? Not sure

[shy gulch]

~31%

[honest kernel]

Close enough

[warm osprey]

And are is finding the Sack weighted evenly?

[shy gulch]

we had this discussion earlier, its in the speedrunning speedtechs chan

no

its weighted in our favor

[honest kernel]

2-3 sacks more likely

[shy gulch]

the math is somewhere but basically theres a 54% chance for a 2 sack

[warm osprey]

Oh lol

[honest kernel]

And 85%-ish to get a 2 or 3 sack

[warm osprey]

I thought I was hitting 20%ers lol

[honest kernel]

or something

[shy gulch]

same lol

[warm osprey]

So its insanely unlucky to get a 6

[honest kernel]

a 5 sack, but yeah

[warm osprey]

Oh ye

[honest kernel]

it's like 1.5% or something ridiculous

[warm osprey]

Cuz cant on first

[honest kernel]

... There are 5 chamber wings in styx, not 6

[warm osprey]

Ye me dumbo

So its like 1/5 to get Pat and 2 sack

Oh wait its 31% not 54%

34%

So its like 17 to get both

[honest kernel]

3/10

approximately

Not sure on both

[rain sedge]

the korean guy didn't come? 😦

[honest kernel]

Probably not yet

Not sure

He ended the stream, probably went to do something else

[shy gulch]

how are you supposed to play something like the fists at high heat

i cant seem to evade any non staggerable opps attacks

[unreal pasture]

If you don't get breaching cross... it's kind of obnoxious

or long knuckle... which is another great hammer

But yeah, like ... most fist hammers are bad

[warm osprey]

Yo I use shadowplay but it seems to not work sometimes

Any of you have that issue

[vital grove]

I'm finding fists to be my least favorite weapon on 32

[warm osprey]

53 heat seems a big step up from 52

[vital grove]

Spear you can cheese with Achilles cast murder

Sword has Poseidon

But fist, mehh

[lusty mirage]

so how do i find "the korean guy"'s stream?

[honest kernel]

search for hades3234 on twitch/yt

[mossy zinc]

Try both and see what works best for you.

[vital grove]

I like seeking on Eris more than ricochet but both are good

[warm osprey]

wait thats the 41

[gentle bridge]

idk why im trying 40 heat gil fists but im having this feeling that gil fists is like arthur but fast enough

[warm osprey]

wait I dont think I have the last fists unlocked

[rain sedge]

you really are not missing much lmfao

[warm osprey]

wdym

oh ur sayin they are buttcheeks

[vital grove]

They're good for Merciful End, I think

[spice whale]

Honestly, I think the aspect of Gilgamesh is kind of fun with things like Ruthless Reflex.

[honest kernel]

Gilgamesh is what Zag sword aspired to be for the longest time : A dash-centric aspect

But uh, y'know, the most damaging dashes are either Eris-boosted Tidal Dashes, or Divine Dash for Merciful End

Best you can get outside of that is Blade Dash, which is pretty great, but needs about as much work, if not more, then Merciful End to be worth

[fierce garden]

LOL I've been trying to unlock the last skelly statue. Been doing runs and getting smoked...whats that? Oh...32 not 36 heat...

I may need remedial reading classes

[rain sedge]

or yknow, you could just be a retrash and do gilga 50 with blade dash

[rain sedge]

advice is pinned on this channel, hit us if you need specific advice

[fierce garden]

ha thanks. I was reading it a bit earlier. I'm just a moron for thinking it was 36 and not 32 lol. Run is a lot easier with less hard labor

[rain sedge]

hard labor makes your labor hard

[fathom cloud]

Am I weird for maxing HL at 32 - I tried to avoid JS, CP, AP, RI, and TD3

[mossy zinc]

Nope. I'd do HL5 at 32.

But I'd also take TD3.

[spice whale]

TD3 is just really tight, I feel.

[rain sedge]

I mean I also take HL5, but for beginners that's half of your effective HP

feels like there are other easier pacts, if not faster

[fierce garden]

So HL5 + Guan Yu? ezpz

[rain sedge]

TD3 isnt tight, it just needs a bit of practice pls

[rain sedge]

there's some psycho that do that, don't mock him 👀

[mossy zinc]

I see so many newer players clear with like 2 DDs left cosistently at HL0.

[fierce garden]

I demand a stream or video immediately from said psycho

my god imagine a max heat run with guan yu

[rain sedge]

@gaunt fiber you got a new fan

also nya, did you do HL5 for the RI4 LC4 GY thingy?

[fierce garden]

*groupie

So now that I've side tracked this channel some, is the fists dodge build viable for high heat runs?

[rain sedge]

dodge is additive, so yea

I did my 40 with lambent plume zag fist

didnt even get dodge boon from hermes

hold up lemme find it

#h1-victory-boasting message

here

[gaunt fiber]

Yay a groupie

[fierce garden]

looks like its fairly straighforward like any other dodge build run, thats good

[rain sedge]

with a better hermes luck you can getr 10% extra dodge from common, and something absurd from second wind

[fierce garden]

I'm trying out ruthless reflex this time around

[rain sedge]

that's a yikes

[fierce garden]

hard to get used to not having the extra dodge

[gaunt fiber]

Want an autograph or something

[fierce garden]

body shot?

[gaunt fiber]

Lmao

HL5 is not the hard part of GY btw

[rain sedge]

WeirdChamp

you basically have 1/4 HP, no?

[gaunt fiber]

Hey you're not supposed to be a tank

[dire steppe]

tbh a lot of the zag aspects except spear could be solved by simple buffs

obviously zag sword is good if it’s 40% move and attack speed

[fierce garden]

as an encounter smash and grab kind of player, its terrifying to me lol

[gaunt fiber]

Yeah I guess

Can you imagine GY without mirror and HL5?

[fierce garden]

I would prefer not to thnx

ugh this run isnt going well. lost my last DD on the first satyr path. no way i beat EM4 this way

[gaunt fiber]

Why you EM4

[rain sedge]

stop flexing astaos

[gaunt fiber]

Dude

[rain sedge]

wait, you are running DD and EM4 for 32?

that aint good

[gaunt fiber]

You keep callin me a psycho

And I can't flex on my sole achievement

[sly remnant]

DDs good on Guan Yu

[gaunt fiber]

That's rough

[fierce garden]

yeah, zag fists. EM4 wasnt bad on 16

[rain sedge]

yea..... it's pretty different on 32

trust

king tail didnt even use EM4 for his 58

[sly remnant]

do you have FO2 HL5 on @fierce garden ?

[true fable]

astaos groupies? what in gods name

[sly remnant]

if its FO0 EM4 is fine

[mossy zinc]

@warm osprey congratulations on 52! Did you submit it to the leaderboard?

[gaunt fiber]

Damn you all

[rain sedge]

✅ Daily Astaos bully

[mossy zinc]

I think so? Don't remember.

How do groupies have groupies?

[sly remnant]

guys let astaos have this one win

[gaunt fiber]

I'm not

[rain sedge]

oh also unrelated

[fierce garden]

FO is +40% and HL is +20% (I'm on hellmode from right out the gate)

[mossy zinc]

Nope. Apparently had HL0.

[rain sedge]

the word "simp" and "incel" is now banned on twitch

[sly remnant]

EM4 is fine with that

[rain sedge]

errr your pacts are making it really hard for you

[mossy zinc]

Using them to harass is banned.

Context matters.

[sly remnant]

i'd drop one FO for more HL tho

[rain sedge]

idk man tyler, I won't recommend FO2 and EM4 for your first 32

yea I'd do that too

or JS/CF

[mossy zinc]

FO results in a lot more damage taken over a run than HL.

[fierce garden]

I figured FO was good to help with clearing rooms faster for lambent plume?

[sly remnant]

i'd probably go FO0

[mossy zinc]

I think FO2 is fine on Malphon tbh under the condition that you do only EM2.

FO2 EM3 with Malphon can be brutal.

[honest kernel]

EM3 fists are rough

[clever otter]

thats what i did

[tidal flame]

Alma did you make 32?

[mossy zinc]

EM3 FO0 is chill.

[sly remnant]

Em4 FO0 is chill

[mossy zinc]

Well, once you know the fight at least.

[rain sedge]

I mean you almost never time out for lambent plume unless you get some greatshields with bad BP

[honest kernel]

"Why is it so hard to hit Thesues in his car- oh great I ate two hits from bumping into him and he's blasting off"

[fierce garden]

EM3 fists isnt too bad

[clever otter]

i cheated and redid the hades fight, but yes

[tidal flame]

Nice!

[rain sedge]

how's 59 going b a j?

[sly remnant]

congrats alma!

[honest kernel]

Not going for it

Not today

[fierce garden]

I feel like I constantly am running out of time. no idea why. I dont normally get more than maybe 20% on LP

[honest kernel]

Not just you

[sly remnant]

timer hard

[honest kernel]

If you don't kill Theseus quickly on EM3, he can just stall you hard

[gaunt fiber]

Blessed message passing by

[honest kernel]

It's actually annoying for Zeus shield lmao

[warm osprey]

@mossy zinc nah my shadowplay wouldnt work for it, I got a 51 up but it only shows from asphodel so I cant submit

[honest kernel]

Unless I get good hammers, it's gonna take a while to get him

[mossy zinc]

Aw.

[honest kernel]

AKA Pulverizing blow, Explosive Return, Sudden/Minotaur Rush, and Charged Shot

Which, granted, is a bunch

[true fable]

just submit the victory screen anyway robloxfan

[honest kernel]

but with AP2 in mind ? gets a bit frisky

[sly remnant]

we can theoretically do 59heat without AP2

[rain sedge]

there's a tab just for victory screen

[sly remnant]

i mean i know when it cooperates its free heat

[honest kernel]

With Hellmode, yeah

[sly remnant]

but

idk baj i think you are good enough

[honest kernel]

... It's actually not that bad of an idea LMAO

[rain sedge]

+1 to this, you got this king

[honest kernel]

Roll with Artemis special again

[sly remnant]

if you want it do it

but its still just a number

you don't need to prove yourself to anyone

[honest kernel]

But it's probably best to just keep learning stuff under AP2

Since if I want to push it higher, that's what I need to turn on anyways

So far, EM4's the hurdle I need to get past

After that, with CP1 and CP2

The last one ? Full on mirrorless

... It's actually so close yet so far at the same time

Max heat clear

[fierce garden]

ya'll are nuts

[true fable]

^

[sly remnant]

we are a ways away from max heat given our current understanding

[honest kernel]

And to think like 2-3 months ago I was sweating at 32 heat lmao

[rain sedge]

I can see a 62 heat clear, I cant see a 64 heat clear

the RI4 is too much

[sly remnant]

in our current understanding of the game i am with schad

[honest kernel]

Well, I did get to Elysium mirrorless on the first try I did for the heck of it

I don't think it's that far off

Still a ways to go

[sly remnant]

if theres a weapon that could do it

its shield i reckon

[rain sedge]

for 62 heat, you need to be real good at EM4 (like retrash), get lucky with timer (a lot of free rooms and 2 sac), lucky with boons (AP2). The rest we already can do

[honest kernel]

Zeus shield could do it

[rain sedge]

we're not that far off

[sly remnant]

zeus shield has the best chance

[rain sedge]

like, tail didn't even lose SD on his 57

[honest kernel]

I didn't as well, altho that was on not EM4

[rain sedge]

add EM4, that;s 61. Add CP, that's 62 - all he needs is luck with room and timer

so yeah, I dont think we're that far off

retrash has shown us EM4 is very doable at high heat if you're good

by "we" obviously I mean "them", not including casuals like moi

[honest kernel]

EM4 rama with one dash sounds ... insanely difficult

[sly remnant]

yes

[honest kernel]

Not even Tailesque does it

yet

[true fable]

"add EM4" is quite the caveat

LMAO

[rain sedge]

that's where you high roll for greatest reflex

[honest kernel]

I'm almost there

[rain sedge]

well retrash did it

[true fable]

look its fine just add a little EM4 on the side

[rain sedge]

we know it's possible skill-wise

timer just needs more free rooms

[true fable]

sure for TD2

im not too sure about TD3

it sounds like a lot

[honest kernel]

TD3 could do it

[true fable]

probably skull earring mandatory

[rain sedge]

again, free rooms

[honest kernel]

my 57 was on CP2 TD3

With DC2 and JS3

[rain sedge]

I mean if you get chaos every biome, fountain every biome, story every biome

you'll do it

2sac obv

[true fable]

chaos/story will most often make you miss midshop

just fyi

if you get them early in the biome

not always but very commonly

and then you also just need to clear each biome in ~4 minutes

[sly remnant]

i think if mirrorless is the future

[true fable]

which mega sucks

[sly remnant]

we can't take chaos

[gaunt fiber]

EM4 free heat until Hades

[honest kernel]

With Zeus shield, you'd need the following :

• A good special
• A good call
• A good hammer (Charged Shot, Explosive Return, Pulverizing Blow)
• Late Elysium free rooms
• A 2-sack

[sly remnant]

maybe the meta for max heat is chaos egg

[honest kernel]

^ lowkey

[true fable]

..

EGG

[sly remnant]

ultimately max heat is playing the lottery

[true fable]

nice anvil @warm osprey

[sly remnant]

and thats the part i don't like

[true fable]

gamer power move

[rain sedge]

^this is why I dont grind high heat

some lotteries are "fine" like rolling for legendary etc

some... like sac... are really not

[sly remnant]

yea this channel is the same as any heat speedrunners just with more dying

[true fable]

hmm

[rain sedge]

speedrunning rouguelites in itself is a bit of a weirdchamp hobby if we're being honest

[fierce garden]

when using myrmidon bracer (30% reduction) and in conjunction with bronze skin (12.5%) for example, is damage reduction additive or multiplicative?

[honest kernel]

Multiplicative

[fierce garden]

ah ok

so 100 base damage * .7 = 70 * .875 = 61.25 damage ultimately

[true fable]

imagine playing a roguelike

[sly remnant]

hades is def a weird roguelike

[honest kernel]

It's a roguelite that plunged DEEP in an RPG approach

[sly remnant]

especially for speedrunning/high-heat purposes

[fierce garden]

this is my first roguelike ever

[sly remnant]

which is the only endgame we have

[fierce garden]

30 years of gaming and never played one before this year

[honest kernel]

Oh Hades' far from my first

It's like my 7th or something like that

[true fable]

its my first

[fierce garden]

is my math right by the way?

[true fable]

im going back and doing some others though lol

StS RL2 and RoR2 mostly

[honest kernel]

Sounds about right to me

Nowadays it's mostly Hades and whatever I feel like playing on off times

For now, One Step From Eden and Nova Drift

[fierce garden]

My life is hades and rocket league atm

[rain sedge]

it's my first

[sly remnant]

hades is a weird one

[fierce garden]

damn ruins the stupid build I was thinking would be fun

[rain sedge]

😳

[shy plinth]

Hades def an atypical roguelike

[sly remnant]

don't go in expecting other roguelikes to be like hades

[honest kernel]

Can't do invicible builds with Arthur I'm afraid

[fierce garden]

stubborn roots
divine protection
bronze skin    12.5%
different league 18%
ravenous will 10%
positive outlook 20% at epic? heroic?
high tolerance 15%```

[rain sedge]

I aint playing any other roguelikes, seems like a huge time sink

[honest kernel]

You can get real close tho

[shy plinth]

Slay the spire is worth the time imo

[honest kernel]

^

[shy plinth]

Game is great

[rain sedge]

im trying to move away from games

[honest kernel]

I can attest to that

Still getting updates too

[rain sedge]

I'm too old and probably should focus on my career rather than playing on my switch during work hours

[true fable]

slay the spire is my decompress from hades game

[fierce garden]

I'm torn between Slay the spire and also BoI

want to play both

[true fable]

now i just need a decompress from games game

[shy plinth]

There is a middle ground between switch at work and no games

[sly remnant]

StS's endgame is also much less of a roulette machine than hades

[rain sedge]

recently I blocked all dota-related things from my pc lol

[honest kernel]

Not sure if I want to get into Binding of Isaac

[true fable]

same

[fierce garden]

@rain sedge career is just there to help me afford my hobbies

[honest kernel]

Like, the closest game I played to it was Undermine

[true fable]

i listened to pretty interesting podcast with edmund mcmillan

[shy plinth]

That rabbit hole seems deep

[fierce garden]

hobbies arent my escape from my career

[honest kernel]

And I didn't like the gameplay loop too much

[true fable]

seems very interesting game

[mossy zinc]

@fierce garden stacking DR is a good idea. Every point of DR gives more eHP than the previous one.

[true fable]

the intro has me very intrigued

[sly remnant]

BoI is showing its a age a bit now

[true fable]

for isaac

[honest kernel]

Still a great game, but I didn't like it

[mossy zinc]

eHP = HP/(1-DR)

[shy plinth]

Dead cells also very deep

But grindy

[honest kernel]

DEAD CELLS

[fierce garden]

hol up, now i gotta wrap my head around that

[honest kernel]

I need to get into that one

[shy plinth]

It's a good game

Also spelunky 2 just came out

[honest kernel]

Spelunky shares that same Binding of Isaac vibe to me

Not sure I'd like it that much

[shy plinth]

Yeah they're both punishing and focused entirely on player mastery

[honest kernel]

I've seen many ways you can die in that game

[shy plinth]

Dead cells is closer to hades with a good bit of permanent progression

[honest kernel]

And oh boi

Punishing's an understatement

[shy plinth]

Yeah

[fathom cloud]

Back when we discussed DR and eHP: #h1-high-heat-strategies message

[mossy zinc]

Good explanation here. https://forum.albiononline.com/index.php/Thread/24102-Effective-HP-Formula-Check-my-work/

eHP is effective HP.

[graceful vortex]

which chamber # are the bosses in this game?

[shy plinth]

14 24 36

[graceful vortex]

12, 24 36

ok

cool

thank u

knew i was off on one

[shy plinth]

Asphodel is short

[honest kernel]

^

7 encounters in most runs or something like that

[true fable]

lol RL2 is punishing

ive died in the first 4 rooms in RL2 before

[sly remnant]

free rooms in asphodel often determine if you'll time out in elysium at 40+

[true fable]

that game is hard

[honest kernel]

Rogue Legacy, right ?

I could get into that one, maybe.

[mossy zinc]

14/24 sub 12. https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/725021639506526249/791365527418175508/Hades_1265.png?width=770&height=433

[shy plinth]

Nice

[graceful vortex]

when y oure on td3 do you actively take shops knowing that you cant buy anything from them cause its a free chamber?

[honest kernel]

Noice

[shy plinth]

Mirage shot crush shot lul

[sly remnant]

yes

[shy plinth]

The crush shotgun

[honest kernel]

Yup

Same with Chaos Gates ... most of the time on AP2

[true fable]

yeah thats the one

[graceful vortex]

oh chaos gates count as free chambers too?

damn

[sly remnant]

TD3 is weird. its very manageable from 32-40 but gets immensely harder past 40

[honest kernel]

They do, assuming it's not before the pre-boss room

[shy plinth]

Yeah though a chaos gate in the room before endshop extends the act

[true fable]

chaos gates are "free chambers" in the sense you can take them to avoid stuff

[shy plinth]

What Baj said

[graceful vortex]

is there a way to always have the chamber # show up lol

[true fable]

nah

[sly remnant]

theres a mod

[true fable]

just hit select/B when you enter a room

[sly remnant]

you'll also just start to get a feeling honestly

[honest kernel]

^

[graceful vortex]

ok i see, so i started asphodel in chamber 17

what did i do to get that

[mossy zinc]

Poseidon, Excalibur, Gilgamesh, Achilles, Zag Rail, Zag Spear, Lucifer, Zag Sword, Zeus are left.

[shy plinth]

Took a chaos gate in 12

[sly remnant]

probably chaos before endshop

[honest kernel]

Or Erebus

Erebus does the same thing

[true fable]

you took chaos 13, endshop 14, boss 15, interchamber 16

[shy plinth]

Ah yeah

[true fable]

yeah or erebus

[graceful vortex]

oh i see interchambers count too

like the chamber between floors

[honest kernel]

Yup

[sly remnant]

about half of those are fine and half of those are not fine. best of luck. making good progress

[graceful vortex]

wow ok asphodel is short

[true fable]

so here's why i dont completely rate chaos as "free chambers" unless its the end of the biome

[sly remnant]

asphodel v short

[rain sedge]

people were talking about spelunky 2, apparently that's a roguelite

[true fable]

chaos will occasionally cause you to miss story/midshop, which are actual free chambers

[honest kernel]

Spelunky 2's closer to a proper roguelike than a roguelite lol

[true fable]

once youve already seen those then yes chaos is 100% free

[sly remnant]

like i said....asphodel normally determines if you are gonna time out in elysium because its so easy to miss the free chambers

[rain sedge]

wdym, can you explain pls

[graceful vortex]

what is midshop

[true fable]

otherwise you're just rolling the die on not getting shafted by RNG

[fathom cloud]

The shop in the middle of the biome

[sly remnant]

so midshop is essentially guaranteed

[graceful vortex]

oh theres a guaranteed shop in the middle of each region?

what the

lol

[honest kernel]

I'llTakeIt.jpg

[true fable]

the TLDR is exits are weird

and chaos screws up room offerings

[sly remnant]

the only exception is asphodel midshop

[true fable]

yeah you can do nothing wrong and miss asphodel midshop

[sly remnant]

missing midshop is a big deal

[honest kernel]

"Essentially" meaning unless you are stupid unlucky

You should see it

[sly remnant]

like in my beo 50 i hit every midshop

i don't consider that lucky.

[rain sedge]

wait what

so I shouldnt take chaos gates?

[sly remnant]

chaos is weird

[true fable]

no

you just take them and cry

[honest kernel]

You want them in the second half of biomes

[fathom cloud]

Chaos chaotic confirmed

[honest kernel]

Ideally

[true fable]

you hope for them in the second half, after youve already seen your story/midshop or smth

[honest kernel]

To skip the larger rooms

[true fable]

but

[graceful vortex]

so i shouldnt be taking chaos in chamber 1/2?

[sly remnant]

chaos is fine in 1/2

[graceful vortex]

if i wanna zoom

[true fable]

no, take it anyway because it's a free room

[graceful vortex]

ok

[true fable]

just cry a little while you do it

[sly remnant]

^bright's got the right idea

[true fable]

a guaranteed free room now is better than the possibility for a free room later

[honest kernel]

^

On average

[true fable]

unless youre super duper high rolling

[graceful vortex]

i still dont understand why cry a lil

because it migiht mess up the chance of me getting a midshop?

[honest kernel]

If you go for the biggest of highrolls, you don't

[true fable]

because it means you will probably miss midshop/story

[graceful vortex]

ok

wdym by story

[shy plinth]

Friend rooms

[true fable]

so it's like net 0 on free rooms

[graceful vortex]

ook

[sly remnant]

sys, eury, pat

[shy plinth]

Sisy eury patty

[honest kernel]

The ! Rooms

[rain sedge]

my head hurts

[graceful vortex]

gotu

u broke schad

LMAO

[honest kernel]

Schad wtf

[rain sedge]

stop

look I'm so bored at work

I started drinking at 4pm

[graceful vortex]

schad's head hurt so much

[rain sedge]

ok?

[graceful vortex]

they forgot how to type

[rain sedge]

I aint in the mindset to understand these complicated things

ok, so take chaos, but cry a bit

[sly remnant]

i might start drinking soon

[true fable]

LOL

[rain sedge]

cool stuff

[graceful vortex]

is there any way to skip all the mini boss rooms in a run

[true fable]

to add to the other kind of crying you have to do

[graceful vortex]

i feel like i do cry when i get barge of death

[sly remnant]

possible but hard

[shy plinth]

If the biome is a sandwich don't take chaos in the meat portion

[graceful vortex]

in aspohdel

[shy plinth]

But the bread is fine

[honest kernel]

Now THAT is an analogy

[fierce garden]

this is the most apt allegory I've seen

wait

is it an analogy or allegory?

[shy plinth]

Analogy

[honest kernel]

...

I wasn't sure myself lmao

[true fable]

its funny because lili always says never to buy interchamber lights of ixion

[fathom cloud]

Also not on the very last bit of bread?

Its a metaphor

[shy plinth]

Allegory is like a moral story

[rain sedge]

can story rooms and midshop only appear in the meat and cheese position?

[true fable]

because that just locks you out of getting chaos later in the biome

[rain sedge]

wtf what

[honest kernel]

Chaos having a cooldown of like 10 encounters makes that fact good

[true fable]

yeah story and midshop have fixed chamber number spawns

[rain sedge]

you can only get 1 chaos per biome?

[true fable]

no theres just a set room cooldown

[honest kernel]

^

10 is the number I recall

might be a bit off

[true fable]

which you can bypass buy having an absurd number of lights

[rain sedge]

what are these numbers?

[true fable]

but thats routing stuff

[graceful vortex]

baj why are you no longer zeus shield expert

[true fable]

good question

[honest kernel]

Oh yeah the nickname got erased

[true fable]

idk what the exact chamber numbers are

[shy plinth]

Chaos CD is 8

[honest kernel]

When I left the server for a day to decompress

lmao

[rain sedge]

baj did you do a schad and ragequit the server

[graceful vortex]

dang this server causing u stress?

[rain sedge]

lmfao

[honest kernel]

T'was that bad

[rain sedge]

I ragequitted too when I was doing 40

[true fable]

i think tart is 4-11? aspho 18-21?

[honest kernel]

59 heat be like that

[shy plinth]

Also no chaos gates after 6th chamber of elysium

[true fable]

not sure about elysium

[rain sedge]

wtf ok

ok thanks bright

yea I also quit the server after my sword 40 failed

if I close my eyes

[graceful vortex]

damn im only on 18 heat 👽

[true fable]

lm double check in sr discord

[honest kernel]

But I should be good for a while

[rain sedge]

I still can see it

me, halfway through poseidon special animation, with exit wounds

dad at 2% HP

[graceful vortex]

how do i unlock meg's relationship bar

she has the best keepsake right

[rain sedge]

and SOMEHOW I died mid animation

[honest kernel]

Patrocleus looks like a 29-34 to me

[rain sedge]

or the time I got 5 sacced on a perfect shield 40 and lost by like 5s or so

[honest kernel]

For fixed room encounter spawns

[true fable]

patty seems like that

[shy plinth]

I believe that's correct

[rain sedge]

almost made me quit this stupid ass game

[graceful vortex]

is there a save somewhere with everything unlocked on normal mode? i dont want to have to do it all over cause my only file is in hell mode

[true fable]

its on sr.com

[honest kernel]

^

[graceful vortex]

ty

[true fable]

check it out under resources

im realizing i got

cold fusion

stubborn roots

and second wave

in my 50 heat

and no sea storm

i hate AP

AP conspires to make me look like a fool

somewhere amir is laughing very hard

[honest kernel]

"Why don't you turn it off ?"

[rain sedge]

every time a run times out / fails due to sac mechanic, amir gets stronger

[true fable]

"it's two heat just turn it off"

[rain sedge]

iT's jUsT 5 hEaT

[true fable]

i can hear that in my head rn

dude

literally yesterday

i had a viewer heckle me about heightened security

"you seem to be dying a lot to those traps it's only 1 heat have you considered turning it off"

UNIRONICALLY

[dire steppe]

that’s some hypnos vibes

[honest kernel]

Amir secretly Hypnos confirmed ?

[rain sedge]

was it astaos' smurf account

[honest kernel]

[mossy zinc]

You seem to be dying a lot to those traps it's only 1 heat have you considering gitting gud.

[rain sedge]

you seem to get a lot of duos crossed out, have you considered not being unlucky?

[fierce garden]

I ws gonna try to rewrite the comment to be more like hypnos, but damn, its pretty much spot on. maybe just a "WOW" at the beginning

[true fable]

pain

[mossy zinc]

Tell me more.

[fierce garden]

hellmode is always HL1 LC1 JS1 CP1 and PL1 right?

[rain sedge]

mmm-hmm

[dire steppe]

whats PL2? you take extra damage when you take a large hit? lmao

[true fable]

PL2 is insta death if you take more than 50 damage in a hit

[dire steppe]

did you mean Guan Yu

[honest kernel]

Hey that's me in my high heat runs already

[true fable]

LOL

[honest kernel]

The Guan-Yu experience

[dire steppe]

personal liability 10: you get sued if you die

[fierce garden]

ha well I guess I just included the number since it counts as 1 heat lol

[honest kernel]

PL69 : Lol I hope you are ready to no-hit this game

[warm osprey]

how do u turn on the room number in top right

[honest kernel]

It's not permanently on

I think it's a toggle in the in-game settings, and you can see hit by pressing B/select while you enter a room

Or while you are browsing your boons in a room

[fierce garden]

ah dammit. steam sale has BoI I think

[dire steppe]

whats boi

[honest kernel]

Binding of Isaac

[rain sedge]

talking about b o i

[honest kernel]

Popular dungeon crawler that plays like a roguelike

[rain sedge]

you still havent told me where you profile come from @true fable

[true fable]

ssbm

or fire emblem

[honest kernel]

It's the melee icon for Roy, from the Fire Emblem series

[true fable]

depending on your point of view

[dire steppe]

hades is the only roguelike i like more than noita

[rain sedge]

I TOLD YOU IT'S A JRPG

you said I was DOA

wtf

[honest kernel]

Altho didn't roy technically appear in smash first ?

[rain sedge]

I was so close too, dragon quest and fire emblem is basically the same game

[fierce garden]

I'd have to check out noita

[dire steppe]

it’s a roguelike but... it’s also like dust

[fierce garden]

I really wouldnt mind finding another game like hades

[honest kernel]

Noita is dope

[gaunt fiber]

What am I reading

[honest kernel]

It's probably the most sandbox-esque roguelike out there

[rain sedge]

wdym, you know I'm right

[honest kernel]

Even more than Risk of Rain 2

by a long shot

[rain sedge]

hang on let me google dragon quest gameplay

[dire steppe]

dragon quest gameplay is garbage tbh

there’s no variety for so much of the game all you can do is attack and heal

[rain sedge]

Wikipedia: Dragon Quest,[a] formally published as Dragon Warrior in North America until 2005,[b] is a series of Japanese role-playing video games

literally jrpg

[gaunt fiber]

Dark souls is a jrpg

[fierce garden]

whoops

[dire steppe]

i have DQXI but no desire to finish it because at least from what i’ve so far played the fighting is really uninteresting

[fierce garden]

shoot* I derailed this channel again

[rain sedge]

this channel was never on topic

[gaunt fiber]

^

[honest kernel]

Never has been

[dire steppe]

this is the only channel i read in this server

[fierce garden]

LOL

fair enough

[rain sedge]

ok imma take this win bright, I was super close

[rain sedge]

yeah... if you venture outside this channel it gets kinda uh, wild

[dire steppe]

i think FE is a grid based tactical fighting thing though

[gaunt fiber]

Builds and combat altered my health, too much GY hate

Here the hate is on me so it's fine

[rain sedge]

yeah, I play FE three houses

very pog game btw

[dire steppe]

to be fair GY is pretty bad if you play at a low level

[fierce garden]

I liked Disgaea 5 way more than FE

[dire steppe]

it’s only good when you realize youre not supposed to get hit and it has more dps

[rain sedge]

have you played FE 3 houses

[honest kernel]

"More DPS"

If only

[rain sedge]

more dps
Eris is laughing

[dire steppe]

charged skewer seed start implied

[gaunt fiber]

Lmao

[fierce garden]

admittedly not that one. earlier ones I did and was annoyed by how you couldnt get the whole story in one cartridge

[honest kernel]

Flurry Jab Achilles still faster by a landslide

[rain sedge]

FE 3 houses is ultra good

have 200 horus or so there

[dire steppe]

is flurry achilles better than hunting blades achilles

[rain sedge]

the voice acting is insane

[honest kernel]

Why not both

Not that hard to implement

[dire steppe]

that’s too much raw power for one man to wield

[honest kernel]

You want Artemis attack or dash anyways

[fierce garden]

Is it a full game this time around? Or do I have to spend $180 to get all the content?

[gaunt fiber]

GY is not fast yeah. But GY players I watch are just playing slow too

[fierce garden]

I need to see a fast GY run

[honest kernel]

But for real, Zeus Cast on Achilles is the speedrunning meta

[dire steppe]

i kinda find boss fights with eris to be hard unless i have splitting bolt

[gaunt fiber]

Good luck

[dire steppe]

also because KBM, when i play eris i have to switch auto aim on and off constantly

[honest kernel]

It's either going to be Charged Skewer with Heart Rend ... or Merciful End

I wish I was kidding

[fierce garden]

yikes

[dire steppe]

like when fighting meg i have to turn it off mid fight to shoot away the projectiles

[gaunt fiber]

Charged skewer is slower than serrated

[mossy zinc]

^

[honest kernel]

Hmm

[true fable]

fire emblem was a series that taught me not to take difficulty too seriously lmao

[honest kernel]

I could see it

Altho dodging stuff sounds hard as hell

[fierce garden]

I wish the GY charge up was maybe 25% faster by default. Would make it way more usable I feel

[true fable]

@rain sedge im surprised you didnt recognize my pfp from FE

[dire steppe]

one day we will discover how hades massive spin allows you to do a spin attack much larger than the spear length

[honest kernel]

I just wish it didn't cut the max hp that badly

[true fable]

extendurrrr

[dire steppe]

does hades aspect usually take DC?

[honest kernel]

Like, the downside is CLEARLY a relic of it being the first 4th aspect released

[gaunt fiber]

GY is really well designed. But not for extreme heats

[honest kernel]

^ Honestly, this

[rain sedge]

I played only one FE game

[honest kernel]

If you want a weapon with a different playstyle, well there ya go

[true fable]

thats fair

i think

theres a really good video

about difficulty in video games

that always feels very applicable to high heat

[dire steppe]

i need to try playing arthur the proper way

where you’re supposed to stand in the circle and deflect everything or whatever

[honest kernel]

B E E F

That's the Arthur playstyle

[true fable]

if youre interested in it it's called "how fire emblem balances hard modes (it doesn't)"

[dire steppe]

i end up just using it like. a slow zag sword

[honest kernel]

Is it just permadeath or something

[rain sedge]

yea lol I remember the hardest difficulty in FE:3 houses was a bit wild

[true fable]

um

they basically give all enemies the ability to attack you whenever you initiate combat

do twice as much damage

take half as much

double attack you

and inflict status/CC

it's great

[gaunt fiber]

Epic swift flourish messes up my timings but the dps buff is real

[dire steppe]

honestly i mean no one is asking the game to be balanced around 55 heat but it should at least be balanced at 32

[true fable]

oh and infinite reinforcements

[honest kernel]

That alone sounds like something that just breaks the designed gameplay flow in half lmao

[true fable]

yeah fire emblem awakening was quite the game

very accessible for casual play

and then you turn on lunatic + and just die

[gaunt fiber]

I don't get the Lunatic difficulty tbh

[dire steppe]

noita is not accessible for casual play tbh

[gaunt fiber]

People just reset

[dire steppe]

at all

i still haven’t beaten it

[honest kernel]

Game's hard as balls

You still get tons of fun without beating it

But uh

Yeah

[dire steppe]

hopefully your balls aren’t hard

[true fable]

the video does a really good breakdown of why lunatic exists

[honest kernel]

You get what I meant

[true fable]

or why stupidly hard modes in games are a good thing

because they are good preparation for the most stupidly hard mode

life

[dire steppe]

sgg’s modular difficulty thing is pretty cool tho

[honest kernel]

^

[dire steppe]

except hell mode

[honest kernel]

^^^^^^^^

[gaunt fiber]

^

Oh Bright I noticed Tulioz gifted me a sub

[dire steppe]

like if i start some game

[true fable]

indeed

[dire steppe]

how am i supposed to know if i want easy medium or hard

[true fable]

he gifted like 5 lmao

[gaunt fiber]

Is he here?

[dire steppe]

i don’t know how hard medium is

[true fable]

absolute madman

nah he's in the speed discord sometimes

[gaunt fiber]

Prolly was asleep

Damn

[true fable]

he's basically in every hades chat ever though

so you'll see him

[gaunt fiber]

I'll thank him when I can

[rain sedge]

getting money 👀

I need one of those money things]

[gaunt fiber]

You could have Hades on steam for free

Not what I mean Baj lol

[honest kernel]

I know

[rain sedge]

lmfao how

[gaunt fiber]

How dare you

You just had

To phone record a high heat switch run

[rain sedge]

[dire steppe]

money talk reminds me i need to go job searching again

[gaunt fiber]

I feel you

[cinder cave]

Maybe job searching in 2021 will be easier than 2020

[rain sedge]

Imagine job searching during covid, that's a super yikes

I got lucky my job started as the pandemic starts

[dire steppe]

student research pays less than the stop & shop deli

[rain sedge]

I've also heard that

I did 1 year of research for my masters, it's a super hard pass for me from that point onwards for research and academia

[dire steppe]

Yeah not planning to do academia really

[sly remnant]

yea i do not feel like being poor my whole life

[gaunt fiber]

[mossy zinc]

Excalibur is slow.

[sly remnant]

is it?

[tidal flame]

Hot take

[true fable]

LOL try premed gap year jobs

literal minimum wage

for ass work

[tidal flame]

Scribing?

[true fable]

yup

you can only get part time because god knows your employer isnt paying for your health insurance LMAO

[cinder cave]

Which country?

[tidal flame]

USA! USA! USA!

[cinder cave]

UK has it pretty bad

[true fable]

its cali minimum wage so it looks good

[cinder cave]

% of people on zero hours contracts have been going up and up for 10+ years

that's fair

[true fable]

and then you realize your rent is like 1 bajillion dollars a month

[true fable]

yeesh

[cinder cave]

glad I don't live in NYC/ London though

ez 5 bajillion a month

[sly remnant]

austin's expensive but p chill honestly

compared to other big cities

[cinder cave]

Austin, TX?

[sly remnant]

ye

[tidal flame]

Twin Cities can be chill also.

[cinder cave]

since yknow pretty sure Australia has an Austin or whatever

xd

[tidal flame]

But Cali is rough.

[cinder cave]

my sister actually lived in SF and then NYC

dunno how she afforded to pay the rent like ever

[tidal flame]

Your sister d better be loaded

[cinder cave]

nah she just worked in the film industry and worked 75 hour weeks

[honest kernel]

...

[tidal flame]

Or that

[honest kernel]

75 hour weeks

[shy plinth]

Nyc is expensive lol

[honest kernel]

jesus

[shy plinth]

But I don't work 75 hrs

[sly remnant]

lmao i feel that. video game industry rough too

[cinder cave]

well yeah if ur not at the top of the food chain, like a producer

yeah you work 70+ for the grind phases

[sly remnant]

decembers without releases are actually p chill

but when you are releasing

i live at my desk

[shy plinth]

It gets crunchy

[cinder cave]

tbf, sounds like indie games can get crunchy too?

[sly remnant]

my studio does a decent enough of job of trying to give me my time back

[cinder cave]

what was Hades like on its way to release I wonder

[honest kernel]

When does it not

[mossy zinc]

@gaunt fiber did you see my Guan Yu upgrades tier list, red shade?

[mossy zinc]

Yes, it is.

[tidal flame]

We have some noclips documentary

[sly remnant]

whats your build? i've never struggled making arthur go fast personally

[true fable]

red shade lol

[mossy zinc]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/725021639506526249/791384905883320370/Hades_1268.png?width=770&height=433

Slow.

[sly remnant]

losing boiling blood with arthur is an interesting decision

[honest kernel]

Or for general speedruns

You shouldn't need it

Abyssal I mean

Arthur also wants "double" hammers

And finally, Artemis Attack

[sly remnant]

also i know you love aphro but arti on attack really is optimal

yea exactly what baj said

[gaunt fiber]

I have not seen it yet. Is it for high heat, mirrorless?

[true fable]

nyaanyaa

have you tried dash striking

[mossy zinc]

I have.

[true fable]

could also just do pash dash start

[sly remnant]

pash dash for heart rend is pretty braindead arthur go fast

[true fable]

• DS for heart rend or smth

[mossy zinc]

Yeah, I might do that for Heart Rend.

[sly remnant]

you can just turn off your brain

numbers get big

[honest kernel]

Supernova Hoarding Slash

Yeah you aren't getting a fast time with those hammers lmao

[sly remnant]

those might be the two worst arthur hammers outside of cursed slash

[rain sedge]

London is expensive a f, but a lot of people live on the outskirts

also UK job market is waaaaay better than the US ones

even for medicine

trust

[mossy zinc]

That's Piercing Wave not Hoarding Slash lol.

[honest kernel]

Guess I don't know sword hammers uh

Either way, Piercing Wave not that good

[mossy zinc]

It was that, Dash Nova, or Greater Consecration.

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[sly remnant]

i think greater consecration with aphro special

[honest kernel]

Got the cold shoulder there lmao

[sly remnant]

altho those all suck so

[mossy zinc]

Greater Consecration doesn't add damage.

[sly remnant]

i'm aware

[mossy zinc]

Low tier hammer.

[honest kernel]

'Tis the kind of run that speedrunners reset in Elysium

[true fable]

could just reset for double nova/double edge

[sly remnant]

the ideal arthur speedrun setup is arti attack and dash with aphro special

[honest kernel]

When they get the second hammer lol

[mossy zinc]

Yeah, just kept going for practice.

[true fable]

fair

i hate making arthur go fast

[sly remnant]

really?

its median is pretty decent for sword

[honest kernel]

I like it

[sly remnant]

you can't zoom like nem

but its got a lot of built in speed

[honest kernel]

It's just that ... It's optimal time skyrockets with the right hammers

[true fable]

it just feels bad

i want to swing

[sly remnant]

you can swing in tartarus

stop after that lol

[true fable]

maybe

ive never claimed to be an arhtur player

LMAO

[honest kernel]

I swing because of JS3

Otherwise, Dash attack all the way

With the occasional special for R A N G E

Unless I do meme cursed slash runs

[mossy zinc]

Slicing Shot DPS is good.

[sly remnant]

yea but the things you pass up to enable that dps is bad

passing up battle rage or jerds to kill on arthur is a weirdchamp from me

slicing shot is "i'll maybe go faster later"

battle rage is go fast now

[true fable]

battle rage on arthur is so sick

basically +100% damage in rooms

[mossy zinc]

I had Epic Battle Rage.

[true fable]

i respect the hunting blades take

depending on when it was

[sly remnant]

i didn't mean that run specifically

just that hunting blades are about the last thing i want from ares

i can think of 3 or 4 things i'd rather have

not to mention taking slicing shot opens up T2s that makes it harder to get the things i actually want from ares

[mossy zinc]

Pretty sure like half my DPS vs Hades came from Casts.

[sly remnant]

yea hunting blades are great at going fast later

i never argued that

[mossy zinc]

Engulfing Vortex is enough for most things tbh for Slicing Shot to stay on target.

[sly remnant]

i mean you are a good player i trust your judgement

if you like slicing shot take slicing shot

[true fable]

now i wanna see if i can go fast on some random arthur run

goes against my being though

[mossy zinc]

Slicing Shot does 20 damage per tick every 0.1 sec for 4 sec. That's 40 ticks in total for 800 damage in an AOE.

That's a Lv.1 common.

That's the highest damage per cast you can get.

[sly remnant]

yes but you are talking about damage that takes time to get

when in a speedrun

time is your most precious resource

[mossy zinc]

Throw it out and focus your attacks elsewhere.

[tidal flame]

But not all ticks will hit the enemies though

[sly remnant]

well we will agree to disagree. but i appreciate the math and well-reasoned arguments nonetheless

[mossy zinc]

No, but even if only half of it hits, that's 400 damage per cast in an AOE.

Engulfing Vortex or Hunting Blades make sure it stays on target.

[tidal flame]

That's a lot of investment still.

[mossy zinc]

That's one t2 lol.

You could whiff 87.5% of your hits and still deal the same damage that Trippy Shot does.

[tidal flame]

Well I usually don't see my forced God twice in a run tbh :(

[mossy zinc]

I didn't force it, saw him in Tartarus, knew I was gonna go for Arrowhead in Asphodel anyway.

[tidal flame]

Ok nvm.

[true fable]

nyaanyaa electric shot unironically good on arthur

fixes a lot of arthur's strange reach issues in tart/aspho

[mossy zinc]

I had so many jerkies and stuff and my DPS still sucked lol. I wish you could Cast between swings or something.

Special seems unusable if you want DPS.

[true fable]

im trying arthur and it feels pretty slow

bablo's set good times with double nova

but you need it early

[mossy zinc]

Hmm I guess that would work if you get it early.

[true fable]

we'll see where this run goes

[sly remnant]

i mean i'm 3:02 out of tartarus with no free rooms outside of chaos and midshop

and i'm super rusty on arthur

[true fable]

i had 2:45 out but aspho feels very slow

4:00 out of miniboss

rofl

im gonna leave aspho at 6 minutes

this weapons trash

[mossy zinc]

At least that's a sub 12 time.

[true fable]

yeah im not a fan

good luck nyaanyaa

LOL

i just want to play arthur at a leisurely TD2 pace

[mossy zinc]

2:23.96 Tartarus.

[sly remnant]

good time

[mossy zinc]

And a Light of Ixion. Nice.

[true fable]

thats pretty solid for any weapon

[tidal flame]

Yeah that's good

[true fable]

let alone arthur

[tidal flame]

On Arthur I'm happy to get a 2:50 tbh

[true fable]

dont jinx it nyaanyaa

you know the rules

[mossy zinc]

Double Edge + Heartbreak Strike.

[sly remnant]

chamber 33 naked swordsmen

kill me

[mossy zinc]

Chaos > Eurydice > Thanatos Asphodel so far lol.

[sly remnant]

i missed every npc room

kill me

[gaunt fiber]

Lemme quote because lazy

[mossy zinc]

Yes, that one.

Did you see it?

[sly remnant]

9:48 elysium ain't gonna cut it

[gaunt fiber]

I'm seing it

That's why I asked

Is it for high heat, in general?

[mossy zinc]

Yes.

[gaunt fiber]

Hm