#h1-high-heat-strategies

1 messages · Page 54 of 1

snow tusk
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Lol

vague patio
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yeah that's one part of it, the other part is the dash cancel of the reload animation

snow tusk
vague patio
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shoot -> dash -> (reload while dashing)

snow tusk
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Just zeus attack and pew pew dodges

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I found a reload animation cancel

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Using special or dashing

vague patio
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don't want zeus attack with empowered shot, get a percentage boost

snow tusk
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Well, surely one of you already found that, but still

snow tusk
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Guide says to use zeus, i tried zeus

vague patio
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oh got it

snow tusk
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And art or aphrodite on spec

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Pos dash

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Although i disagree with that one for higher heat, prefer athena

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(For chiron at least)

sly cove
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i think literally every weapon is easier than chiron for 32

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have i even done chiron 32

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idr

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actually i think i did play chiron with like pos special or some dumb shi idk

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nem pos arthur achilles gy beo zagshield zeus rama dem and all rails > chiron

oblique crane
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sword in general feels harder to me than chiron at 32, but also i just suck with all non-shield melee haha

shy plinth
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Poseidon can effectively be ranged

snow tusk
sly cove
upper juniper
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Even without ME like hangover and zap still handle 32 really well

sly cove
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zapfists basically plays like eris and eris goobs 32

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i dont understand the chiron hype like at all

upper juniper
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Dio is zap but you can back off and still crank out damage from the rest of the 11 other hangover ticks

sly cove
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like i didnt like zagbow but chiron didnt fix any of my issues with it

upper juniper
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Not liking zagbow should be a crime

sly cove
sly cove
upper juniper
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were u kbm?

sly cove
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yes

upper juniper
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makes sense

sly cove
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aim assist doesnt help

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its just hesty but bad

upper juniper
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It requires a lot more skill to use on kbm fs

sly cove
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i get so much hate for playing kbm

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my friend was hating on me for playing hollow knight kbm

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like its literally a fine control scheme

upper juniper
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No hate on kbm I just couldn’t

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for Hades

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Using a stick for aiming just feels right

south violet
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(#screwbow #biased)

honest crypt
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not liking hera bow should be a crime

ivory drum
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hera bow hurt fingers :(

verbal atlas
honest crypt
sly cove
oblique crane
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like max hestia 32 is WAY easier than max chiron, but is that true at both level 1?

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maybe it is but it doesn't feel obvious to me haha

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or was that in a 50+ context?

left prism
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lightning strike or attack only chiron

languid notch
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At higher levels tho Hestia is loads better

verbal atlas
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delta chamber: the hammer just sets it apart from chiron bow yeah

languid notch
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I don't much enjoy Chiron for ANYTHING, let alone heat. It's my least favourite bow.

oblique crane
left prism
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isn't it 3

languid notch
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How much does a base bow shoot?

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Can't remember the last time i pressed special on a non-rama bow

oblique crane
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i thought it was 7, but apparently it's 9

languid notch
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It's 4 at level 1 then

south violet
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I'd say for both at minimum level the level 0 zagrail equivalent is probably still stronger

oblique crane
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speaking of rail, on zag/eris at 40+ heat, if you have half of clockets, does finishing clockets have priority over delta chamber for 2nd hammer? my immediate thought is yes but i wonder if i'm undervaluing the iframes

south violet
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hmmmmmmmmm boon-dependent I think?

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if you have a strong jolted it's probably pretty sane to take delta over anything else. as opposed to this, if your attack is hot garbage anyway, may as well scale your damage where it'd be worth to

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probably also dependent on heat-level

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at 40 you don't need to care, even at 45 probably fine to take clockets

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but above that the iframes end up being so comfy ZagPls

oblique crane
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makes sense, thanks

sly cove
sly cove
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if u have a viable special

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but maybe im underrating delta

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clockets is just so broken

manic latch
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jumping from hellmode to 8 heat to 16 heat, now tryna beat 32heat, any tips?

verbal atlas
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that should cover the majority of things

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any other questions you may have feel free to ask around here!

manic latch
verbal atlas
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that being all non hidden aspects yeah?

manic latch
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can see there I haven't finished story etc

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I noticed the armored enemy perk, can be run ending, got a basically unkillable blue shield crystal on death barge

upper juniper
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That’s more on mm than bp

manic latch
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idk how much easier things will be mow that i have unlocked meg companion, i didnt really use dusa

upper juniper
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I’m actually pretty sure bp can’t apply to minibosses

verbal atlas
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gotcha (i would recommend finishing the story first, but nonetheless) learning how to manage tight deadline 3 is very useful for 32 heat, learning how to do proper builds, learning forced overtime 2 timings

upper juniper
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It would purely be bp

verbal atlas
manic latch
upper juniper
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Yes

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Miniboss doors are signified by the icon on the door

manic latch
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im doing forced overtime 7 minutes rn

upper juniper
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you walk thru miniboss and you can get power couple, witches or barge

manic latch
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i cant do 5 minutes until i have some more upgrades

upper juniper
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Tight Deadline is more about how you go about your build

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and your raw combat skills

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unless you have like literally no mirror

manic latch
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i mean 32heat will take me 25minutes total

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its not enough

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any way to know if its the deathbarge

upper juniper
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Nope

manic latch
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honestly most annoying mini boss

verbal atlas
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nope Bouldy

upper juniper
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Raw 1/3

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There’s a reason the speedrunnmodpack bars it

manic latch
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damn

upper juniper
manic latch
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been planning to remove the heal stuff and go full dmg insteaad

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like high confidence instead of 50hp

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bot that im lacking damage

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not

verbal atlas
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i would recommend going for the +50 vs the high confidence unless you're not doing lasting consequences 4

manic latch
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i have lasting consequences 1 as part of hellmode

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i mean it helps but

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some of the bosses die before acorn gets used up anyway

verbal atlas
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one of the main strategies used in high heat is to do LC4 + running stubborn defiance

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and use stubborn defiance as a sort of sudo heal

manic latch
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i did that a lot before

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esp in asphodel

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kms after encounter in magma to get heal

verbal atlas
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seems like you're on the right track regarding using traps to heal 😌

manic latch
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frfr

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it took me 50 runs to get my first clear, albiet a lot of them was for artemis story.
either way I was tryna save as mych as possible in asphodel

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I had one run where I got the money = damage upgrade, had 900 coins at end of elysium

verbal atlas
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asphodel in general is the shortest biome in the game

manic latch
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good riddance

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honestly all the biomes are so ass, I just like the bosses

verbal atlas
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^that goes into the damage calculation stuff

manic latch
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makes sense

verbal atlas
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what aspect do you want to try 32h on?

manic latch
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rn just zag fists

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its the fastest

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exagryph is also good with snowballinf but takes long to get going

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i tried 6heat with the sword using a cast build but having no real ranged option is kinda rough at the satyrs

verbal atlas
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what was your keepsake order ideas?

manic latch
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ive been running pouch for money first, then on apshodel I just choose one to level, after that if im not feeling super confident i go acorn

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since acorn just makes the asterius and yapper fight so easy

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getting a lot of boons is good since i have to clear one every region as well

upper juniper
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Forcing gods lets you max out your damage by actually putting together a build

verbal atlas
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Okay, you usually start god keepsake for build consistency, for fist thats going to be zeus start for attack. Acorn is really good for heroes and dad fight yeah. Asphodel can be a few things, second god keepsake, earring, could take pouch ig?

manic latch
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thats fair

verbal atlas
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fast hitting things like zeus as a general rule of thumb

manic latch
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i melt everything once i get to hydra usually

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I tried using the only 1 boon choice pact, that one is rough

verbal atlas
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yep approval process really sucks

manic latch
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im a fan of poseidon actually

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esp with rupture

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i can see how zeus would work tho

verbal atlas
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more often you want poseidon dash because you can chain it into your regular attacks + still getting rupture also can help with styx in the form of room clear

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static discharge from zeus is really good

languid notch
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Static discharge

manic latch
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ive been doing something similar i guess

verbal atlas
manic latch
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near misses on zeus with jolted gives me free jolt attacks

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then if i happen to get something else good off of him i can take it, otherwise i can change into a different route

verbal atlas
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zeus attack also lets you take damage control more easily is the other thing, and you end up getting more jolted procs off of attack vs the near miss effect

manic latch
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true

verbal atlas
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also can open up into zeus legendary for funny damage (not really a high heat thing but something to consider)

manic latch
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what do you think of selling your main attack if its low rarity?

verbal atlas
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never

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you kinda just have to stick with it especially if its a core part of your build

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and a few poms usually off set

manic latch
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yeah but you can roll it or something better

verbal atlas
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i wouldnt recommend that gamble, and genuinely boon rarity shouldnt be a concern at 32h

honest kernel
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Is there a way to make hidden stygius viable? I like it but it's so slow

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Are there any good pairings for it?

verbal atlas
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athena attack is the high heat meta for it bc deflect comfy, it is defintely one of the harder aspects to pilot in high heat tho

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theres some combo "tech" like knowing that you can continue your standing strike combo even through dashes

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or doing 2 attacks between waves so your third attack hits when the wave is spawned

honest kernel
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What's good for high heat shield of Zeus? I was doing good until heat 15, but when I limit the options I don't get jolt enough for Zeus to be worth it.

verbal atlas
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high heat zeus is just zeus special

honest kernel
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I already got a clear with hidden stygius was just wondering what works well with it so thanks! Athena and Aphrodite (for more damage reduction) it is!

verbal atlas
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there is also aphro special, but that almost just requires to get an early explosive return on the really high heats (so nothing id expect you to be going for probably)

upper juniper
forest token
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shadow slash is more damage with good swings

verbal atlas
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dedge is still viable, ik for cheesy's modded arthur reccy its shadow slash starting hammer

forest token
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and cursed slash is just tanking

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dedge is like usable tho

verbal atlas
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dedge is dedge

forest token
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yeah it's certainly not bad, but it's not that fast bc it doesn't have the big swings for damage

honest kernel
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What is dedge?

forest token
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double edge hammer

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generally considered the best sword hammer, but it's more dubious for arthur

honest kernel
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I like cursed slash but I never seem to get it.

honest kernel
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I had no idea you could get trippy shot and the lightning rod duo. I love this game.

sly cove
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js isnt that bad either idt? i dont run zeus tho so idk + js is always ass

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free dc lets stuff like rama/eris/zeus get away with stuff that hesty/beo would get fried by

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2 heat goes a long way

honest kernel
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I don't understand any of that :/

sly cove
# honest kernel I don't understand any of that :/

basically the 40 heat base core of any weapon is starting from hard labor 5 lasting consequences 4 convenience fee 2 benefits package 2 middle management underworld customs extreme measures 3 forced overtime 2 tight deadline 3

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by having a fast attack that breaks shields easily zeus shield can run damage control relatively freely which frees up 2 heat that you would otherwise put in like approval process or routine inspection or calithenics program

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which are not fun pact clauses btw

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zeus^2 needs relatively few boons to work tho which is why u see it at 64 heat

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so zeus is also more approval process resistant than other aspects ie demfists that want merciful end which is super highrolly before factoring in no rerolls and approval process

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u cant just type for 10 mins and not say anythung 😭😭😭

manic latch
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@verbal atlas made it to asterius and yapper on 32heat, i was not ecpecting machine guns and carpet bombibg

verbal atlas
manic latch
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yeahh

honest crypt
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asterius go spinnnnnn

honest kernel
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Is it weird I find em3 easier because the tracking spear throw isn't in his moveset?

honest kernel
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If I do 32 heat does it lock me out of PoP bounties or does it just complete the last level?

left prism
honest kernel
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But like, will it jump straight to 33 or to the next level I would've had?

forest token
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next level you would've had

honest kernel
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A'ight thanks!

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I'm at 17 with the shield and I didn't want to miss titan blood.

shy plinth
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The bounty levels go 1-20

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Going over can earn you the reward, but the reward level only goes up by 1 each time

sly cove
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em3 fo2 spin is so cooked

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unless u got op ass shield

honest kernel
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He also starts summoning the gods at 1/3 instead of half and he's stunned for most of that, so that's amother perk instead of a hindrance imo

verbal atlas
honest kernel
sly cove
ashen garnet
sly cove
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ig its easier to kill asterius before triggering phase 2 theseus

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in em3

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asterius spin is also just hell still tho

sly cove
honest kernel
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I just dodge asterius and hope my attacks on thesius get absorbed by him as well. Usually works out for me.

sly cove
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its like the twins in terraria

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u always dps down spazmatism first

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and then u just kill retinazer after

ashen garnet
sly cove
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well its like not hard on speed heat

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if u have a broken build like mirage beo

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and no cp

honest kernel
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I just rush around with whatever I got for that and throw my shield in place and if it's a good setup kaboom no more bullman and chariot. Although I did have 160% Aphro damage with Excalibur earlier and it was over in twenty seconds.

verbal atlas
sly cove
verbal atlas
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rama can damage still and eris can as well

sly cove
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sword and fist can still cast

verbal atlas
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? rama can still do pshots during bull whirlwind, and rail still has access to both special and gun can be done in range still

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for an example of rama still doing damage during that attack id look at ocaml's 50 speed playad's 64 misremebered runs

sly cove
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i was pretty sure bull outranged u at least given charge time and such

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and yea rail can still do damage i was just being hyperbolic cuz main damage loop with tdash and stuff is gone

verbal atlas
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i have done it plenty atp

verbal atlas
vague patio
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pois sword, first pom into aphro attack or arty special?

upper juniper
vague patio
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is first pom into attack in general?

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for pois sword?

upper juniper
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It’s just about how often you’re going to be using each vs the relative value of pomming each

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Sometimes a boon doesn’t really scale well at all with poms vs ones that do

south violet
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Artemis' crit cores as a whole don't really care about poms or rarity

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The bonus is too slight

vague patio
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ah

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ok so probably pom aphro over artemis in general

upper juniper
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I mean arte special first pom is +16% to the aphro strikes +20% but you’re also going to be using the strike a load more often ngl

south violet
ashen garnet
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Choice is hammer-dependant aswell

blissful atlas
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Do you guys evenly do your heat level?. Like I done all weapons on heat 0, then I did them all on heat 1, now planning to them all on heat 2, etc…..

verbal atlas
sly cove
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i did like

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shield up to heat 10

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and then i just did whatever

honest kernel
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I need some recommendations to beat heat 32. I can comfortably do 20 with Arthur and Zeus Shield, but the speed diff is destroying me on boss 3 when I do 32.

verbal atlas
honest kernel
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  1. Is it easier if I put it on +40 speed and on 2?
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I just want this useless trinket so I can go back to Hades 2

verbal atlas
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in general id say em2 fo2 is easier than em3 yes

upper juniper
shy plinth
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Have you read the 32 heat guide?

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Or at least skimmed it?

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We can give quick advice in this channel but the pinned guide is quite comprehensive

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We're happy to help, but I would def recommend perusing the pinned guide to get an idea of what you might be doing differently from more "meta" picks - generally speaking I'd think the more typical successful pacts will include EM3, but there's flexibility around how you approach 32

honest kernel
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I finally did it!!! (albeit with health draining as I ran out of time) I put speed to 20 instead of 40 and lowered em to 2 and just went approval process and underworld customs and got lucky with Athena attack on Arthur!!! Thank you so much!!!!

upper juniper
honest kernel
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I used lc2, cf2, em2, bp2, mm, uc, fo1, ri1, ap2, and td3. I can't believe I finally did it! Thanks whoever told me to lower the boss diff! I was too used to fighting em3 on normal speed...

sly cove
sly cove
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what in christ is this pact build

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no wonder u were struggling

honest kernel
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That was what worked after I was struggling :/

sly cove
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😭😭😭

honest kernel
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Better that than calisthenics or pain with that ungodly speed 💀

sly cove
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i dont see how having zero boons would help u win

sly cove
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😭😭😭

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way easier

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and u get an actual build

honest kernel
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I can handle everything on its own except the 40% haste. That was what was doing me in so I redistributed the points. 🤷 Idk, it worked.

sly cove
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same difference

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idk ri1/ap2 are disgusting on their own and thats at 50 heat

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i would never take either one before 45 😭😭😭

languid notch
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What heat is this?

sly cove
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no rerolls + no dark foresight + no picking your boons how the hell do u even get a run going

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no antivorime either i assume

languid notch
honest kernel
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Arthur with Athena attack and getting disposable boons when I could. It was 20% skill, 80% luck. I still don't know wtf tbh.

languid notch
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-# system shutdown

sly cove
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i still dont see how that could possibly be any easier

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i would rather do hl5 fo2 lc4 em3 cp1 js1 than this

honest kernel
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Now I'm doing the epilogue 🫠 I'm proud of myself. I didn't think I'd ever get 32 at all, let alone before these darn dialogue lines!

sly cove
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is em4 epilogue locked

honest kernel
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No. Just credit ending. I got done fast with that and it still took 20 or something runs to pop.

hoary pasture
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What matters is you did it

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The pact is pretty nice

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Got a mix of everything

shrewd dagger
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What conditions would you recommend for an 8 heat run?

upper juniper
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Should be 8

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Could swap out middle management for like hard labour 1 / lasting consequences 1

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Or hard labour 2

shrewd dagger
shy plinth
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If you check the pins, there's a spreadsheet that shows heat options to help ramp up to 32 starting from 1

sly cove
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if ur planning on doing the other 2 trophies id do fo2 em2 for 9 heat ngl

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maybe fo2 mm

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just to get ur reps in with the faster speed

vague patio
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how do I get better? I've been slamming against a wall in 32 heat with nemesis sword. I would estimate 90% of the runs end before hades at a boss.

Current pact
HL0 LC4 CF1 EM3 BP2 MM UC FO2 TD4

I start aphro, aim special but take a rare attack if offered. I think most of my weakness is in bossfightning, where I take too much incidental damage and run out of life, but sometimes I also just die to a difficult room

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should I drop some heat until I can consistently get to hades at FO2?

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gotten to hades about 3 times without any safeties and died, though I got to 2nd life bar

left prism
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If you don't plan to go higher than 32 I'd swap to hl5/cf2 (or js1) and fo0

vague patio
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I think if I had a safety I could have won

left prism
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Do you know how to get death defiances from athena with stubborn?

vague patio
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yes

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though I honestly didn't know I couldn't add a dd if I hadn't lost my stubborn, wasting a boon my last run

left prism
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Ouch

left prism
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Tho my recommendation if you want a sword 32 heat is just click pos sword and ignore the sword gameplay

vague patio
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I mean I'm willing to try anything

left prism
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Idk if you are going for all weapons 32 or all aspects tho

shy plinth
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Are you playing on PC?

vague patio
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I'm going all weapon

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on PC with controller

shy plinth
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Can you record a run?

vague patio
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I've got gun, fists, bow

shy plinth
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Upload it unlisted and we can check it out to give advice

vague patio
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I don't know how, so I'd have to do some learning

shy plinth
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OBS->Youtube should be relatively easy. We can give text advice too, but seeing it is very helpful for communication

vague patio
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ok

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I'll do a little of research and figure something out

shy plinth
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I recommend OBS studio and then you can drag the output file straight to youtube 🙂

vague patio
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ok

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my computer is really old so there may be issues, but I can do it next time

shy plinth
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If it's a huge pain then we'll keep giving text advice

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What's your mirror?

vague patio
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it's the standard mirror I'm pretty sure

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same as this:

shy plinth
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Probably, but might as well check

vague patio
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hmm I can't paste an image

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same as this one

shy plinth
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Ok if you're matching the bananas guide then you can't go wrong

vague patio
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I don't have the ability to record it at the moment, but I will try to follow up in the future with a recording

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god's pride for rarity on attack/special rather than trying for duos

shy plinth
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That sounds correct

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What bosses do you find yourself losing to? And are there any particular builds you're going for as far as damage output?

vague patio
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is pos sword any easier ? Just play it as a cast build ?

shy plinth
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I mean, if I'm being honest, the easiest sword is "merciful end"

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Which can be any of them except arthur

vague patio
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I've felt like that's so RNG dependent

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but I probably should give it another try or two

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athena first or ares?

shy plinth
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If you athena or ares in tart and then do the other one in asphodel you'll probs get it

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I personally go athena first but have been told generally that it is incorrect to do so

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My logic is that we need the special for duo eligibility and the dash so that we actually do damage, but if you go ares first, you can roll down for attack and make sure you can get through tartarus

vague patio
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I've typically struggled with the chip damage on the bosses - hard to dash in, get my attacks and dash out of the way

shy plinth
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This is with merciful end or in general

vague patio
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and a few large hits kill me

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in general

shy plinth
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When doing SD+LC4, your primary objectives are as follows:

  1. Dodge hits
  2. Make a build that allows for high damage output
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But if you're focusing on when to do damage, you're gonna end up going 1:1 with bosses and you lose that trade

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You'll wanna focus on precision of movement and getting safe damage in while letting your build do the work to actually get their health bar down

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Have you watched any high heat runs

vague patio
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lots of haelian

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haven't seen others doing 32 heat sword runs

shy plinth
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I would recommend watching higher heat sword runs and watch the movement more than you watch anything else

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The way they execute is something that you can emulate

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Lemme find a couple

vague patio
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the build I typically follow is aphro special (take higher rarity attack if offered), then artemis or athena into zone 2 (whichever I'm missing), though sometimes the boons offered don't let me do that

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my most successful run found zeus call into smoldering air

shy plinth
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So if you hit aphro artemis athena, what's your damage output?

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I guess you can deadly reversal?

vague patio
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I think it's the increased damage to weak

shy plinth
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Heart rend?

vague patio
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yes

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or rush delivery

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and a chaos boon

shy plinth
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You might just be hampering your own success by not aiming for a higher output ceiling here

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Typically for 32, you don't have as much restriction on what boons and builds you can get, so you want to go for something that's gonna melt bosses

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I'm having trouble envisioning that path here

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Smoldering air would certainly do it

left prism
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I like aphro start into smair usually

shy plinth
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https://youtu.be/Z1vqXMSHz8M?si=H_44fNWeTTcOTQpd&t=1595 this is a 51 heat run from Tailesque and it's timestamped to the Heroes fight. Take a look and see if they do anything that you don't

YouTube
Tailesque
Hades - 51 Heat - Aspect of Nemesis

1:33 - start of the run.

Love to avoid the second hammer with sword out of fear from being AP2 forced into Cursed Slash or Flurry Slash. Extremely barebones "build"... Extra dash from Hermes was really nice though.

Trying a different recording setup, so the video quality should be overall more crisp, especially during more chaotic fights like ...

▶ Play video
#

I love Tail's general execution and watching their videos really helped me learn what good movement could look like

vague patio
#

what is another route to damage?

shy plinth
vague patio
#

I'll take a look

left prism
#

My sword 32 was pos with phalanx iirc

#

(ignoring that I go Epic RD and the full smair setup 🙂 )

#

Smair or ME will help a lot for the runs that don't get double edge

shy plinth
#

Yeah, I mean the thing about ME is that it homogenizes runs

#

So if you're not sure what to do, athena start ME is about as safe as it gets

vague patio
#

I'll definitely try that one

#

do you restart if you don't get ares in zone 1?

#

or are you ok putting on ares keepsake into zone 2 ?

shy plinth
#

I always go god keepsake in the first two biomes

left prism
#

If I'm gonna run ME I'd just do ares start and commit to it

shy plinth
#

What keepsake have you been taking in asphodel?

left prism
#

If you don't like ME, go for smair def

vague patio
#

so far it's been aphro into athena (dash) or artemis (attack) depending on what else I pick up

shy plinth
#

If I were doing ME, I'd do either ares->athena or athena->ares. If I were doing Smair, I would do aphro->zeus

verbal atlas
#

you could also do zeus attack strats croven but if you’re doing nem then yeah its just aphro

left prism
#

:Boulyai:

upper juniper
#

Smair also lets you do artemis -> heart rend with weak applied off your strike and R O D

vague patio
#

ROD?

shy plinth
#

In rod we trust

#

Lightning Rod

#

Zeus+Artemis duo

vague patio
#

can you get that with the 1 stone on timer?

#

so I could try ME or smair as primary builds, rather than heart rend

upper juniper
#

Nope

vague patio
#

and I go 3 stones but collect opens up lightning rod

upper juniper
#

Heart Rend as a primary build is pretty consistent if you aren’t depending on hitting Athena as well bouldy

ashen garnet
#

World Splitter can be a decent build option on it's own if you don't mind the slow attack rate, putting a %-based boon on the attack and resetting a bit for the hammer dusa

upper juniper
#

Can hunt dedge while you’re at it

#

and just proceed if you find either

sly cove
shy plinth
#

Trueeeee

sly cove
#

if u get athena dd + pat it hsould just be a win tho tbh

#

idk abt smair like its good but u need a zeus core and zeus cores arent exactly good on nem

#

maybe just start aphro and adapt to what u get

#

pos sword is not easier to play than nem imo

#

but u do get better chance of athena dds

#

heart rend nem for 40

vague patio
#

got there! thanks folks!

strong palm
#

huge kudos!

sly cove
#

goat work

#

now do 40

vague patio
#

working on 32 heat with all weapons, just spear left

#

then maybe some sub X minute run

vague patio
#

reading banana's guide in starting to build up for 32 heat on spear. Looks like achilles cast build? Any suggestions for the god keepsake for tartarus?

#

thinking artemis attack and see if we find ares or demeter

south violet
#

poseidon dash start at 32 probably. high up, zeus attack or dionysus attack are probably better to deal with damage control.

#

some people also start ares / athena cast which ig could work too

#

I'd also overall advise strongly against using demeter cast for purposes other than fun regardless of aspect, it's called the "meme beam" for a reason

vague patio
#

don't think it's good enough even with the cast buff?

south violet
#

achilles does provide 150 additive to casts too, this is true, but it just doesn't compare

#

like man, would you rather use a strategy that requires 1 boon to work (with any additional duos or tier 2s being a nice bonus) or a strategy that requires 2 boons including a duoboon (which is required for the beam to track even remotely well)

vague patio
#

so basically make it an attack build

#

I'm just reading banana's guide, which talks primarily about the cast builds

south violet
#

but demeter cast ain't it because of how needy it is to make do close to anything

honest crypt
#

will demeter cast eat up all achilles' buff

south violet
#

it's not global, it's specific to attack / cast

honest crypt
#

but it's limited to 4 uses right

#

so demeter cast only uses one of them

south violet
#

ah, right, that's what you meant

#

I read "call" earlier facepalmeline

honest crypt
#

I did make a typo bouldy

south violet
#

good, I'm not completely insane yet 😌

honest crypt
#

still slapping a +% on a beam that gives ~10 per hit is sad

south violet
upper juniper
#

it gives you something solid to rely on as a basis until you hit the relevant cast duo and even then you still have a pretty large window between casting hunting blades and being able to recover them where you should be striking

#

It also happens that the strikes used for the 2 main cast builds on achilles really benefit achilles

vague patio
#

the attack boons?

#

or the dash boons?

upper juniper
#

Yes the strike boons really benefit achilles

#

Artemis crit chance pops off really hard with the innate +150% additive achilles gives and the sheer number of hits you put out with either flurry jab or serrated point

#

zeus for lightning phalanx really pops off on the attack speed as well

#

the main dash boon achilles cares about is tidal dash and that gives you a really solid base to work off as well

vague patio
#

serrated point good? I'm concerned about lack of dash distance

#

I guess you just get used to it

upper juniper
#

Ideally you don’t take it and taking both it and flurry jab is an anti-synergistic combo

sly cove
#

idk achilles feels really unsafe to play

#

and serrated makes it worse

#

crystal clarity is highroll reliant but really good and safe

#

alternatively my 40 heeat run was zeus attack broken smair

vague patio
#

anyone have a video of achilles spear high heat run? the key for me getting through the sword was seeing the movement/attack cycle, I bet something similar would be good for me to clear 32 heat spear

#

(I'm not committed to achilles, just seemed easiest)

forest token
#

to be clear, i don't remember what happened here i just remember doing it

#

i just know the pact was really horrendous

#

so don't copy the pact lmfao

hoary pasture
#

thats a lovely pact

#

idk what youre talking about

forest token
#

so true bestie

vague patio
#

feels like my minimum range on the controller is quarter screen and it's a lot slower process, and I can't aim it as easily since it autolocks

forest token
vague patio
#

alas, promising run for 32 heat spear derailed by a 5 sack

#

with controller, the throw automatically locking onto a spinning asterus has cost me a few runs

south violet
left prism
sly cove
#

tbh

vague patio
#

I've been trying artemis attack and seeing which cast boon I get

bleak frost
#

damage control might as well just be 1-2 free heat for fists right? because like obv the attack speed will make you go right through it, it just depends on the enemy count

verbal atlas
bleak frost
#

alr

sly cove
#

i feel like its kinda bad for sword and zagshield

#

and then obviously its really bad for beo hesty

#

probably annoying for gy asw?

#

and zagbow

south violet
south violet
# sly cove i feel like its kinda bad for sword and zagshield

Atrocious on arthur, fine enough on zagshield/chaos as an alternative to other timewaster-heats, fine on non-arthur swords as an alternative to calisthenics program or jury summons, bad on zagbow / chiron / hera (hera can barely handle dc1 though when using the cast-build)

vague patio
#

Wow, turns out 32 heat is easy if you have all the zeus boons and do the "headless chicken" strategy. Drop all casts in a corner and run around until hades dies

#

I guess I'll count it. 32 heat with all weapons done

bleak frost
south violet
bleak frost
#

oh yeah heat 16 lets go

left prism
vague patio
#

what should my next goal be?

#

under X minute speedrun ?

#

just finished 32 heat with all weapons

languid notch
#

Try sub 10

verbal atlas
#

sub 8

languid notch
vague patio
#

awesome

ivory drum
#

Sub 4

#

Someone’s gotta do it

verbal atlas
ivory drum
#

No

#

You already got that

verbal atlas
#

sounds like you need to get to grinding then

upper juniper
ivory drum
#

:|

sly cove
upper juniper
#

32 heat (all aspects)

sly cove
#

32 allspects is free tbh its just 32 all weps but more

bleak frost
#

yeah thats what that means

forest token
#

It's just a lot of time generally

#

18 more runs minimum

#

I think like I first tried nost of them when I started doing it but it still took a lot of time lmao

bleak frost
#

tbh he didnt say it wouldnt be harder or more annoying, he just mansplained it to us

sly cove
small basalt
#

why are you here 😭

sly cove
#

as someone with over 10 40 heat runs under my belt

#

smth smth

small basalt
#

i don’t have any

#

🔥

bleak frost
small basalt
bleak frost
small basalt
bleak frost
#

yeah i would use any other option if they were more recognizable

verbal atlas
sly cove
#

im washed

verbal atlas
#

idk ive never actually seen the copy pasta myself

sly cove
#

Idk man as someone with around 10 40 Heat runs under my belt I will literally always take Divine Dash over pretty much everything. Unless the build really requires a specific dash to create a broken interaction, Divine Dash is good with every build, every weapon, and is simply incredible. I agree with the top post of this comment chain that 8.5 is a little weird for easily the best Dash in the game.

ashen garnet
#

Idk man as someone with around 10 40 Heat runs under my belt I will literally always take Divine Dash over pretty much everything. Unless the build really requires a specific dash to create a broken interaction, Divine Dash is good with every build, every weapon, and is simply incredible. I agree with the top post of this comment chain that 8.5 is a little weird for easily the best Dash in the game.

bleak frost
#

i have a sneaking suspicion that this guy might have around 10 40 heat wins under his belt, something about how he talks

left prism
#

I love you divine dash copypasta

sly cove
#

hades copypastas in general

vague patio
#

Is there a guide for speedrunning hades akin to bananas' 32 heat one pinned somewhere?

#

I know the basics (pausing, em2 + fo) but that's about the extent of it

upper juniper
#

Lemme find it

#

There’s also guides for a lot of technical things on speedrun.com

#

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bxwSsTPubI&pp=ygUPU0xFRVBzb3VsIGhhZGVz

YouTube
SleepSoul
How to Speedrun Hades - Basic Guide (2022)

Community Discord: https://discord.gg/uAvy8W3RdC
My Twitch channel: https://twitch.tv/sleep_soul
Text version of this guide: https://docs.google.com/document/d/16aaLsNytmQFv9JCJN4huTzGqQAREDGezD_fkQe5b4Ms/edit
Collection of other guides: https://www.speedrun.com/hades/guide/1i726

Timestamps:
0:00 Intro
0:44 Leaderboard Categories
1:36 Getting S...

▶ Play video
vague patio
#

thx

upper juniper
# vague patio thx

A lot of it can come down to your game sense for making out-of-combat decisions too

#

which doors to take, when you can sell boons, when you want to take what keepsakes for elysium and styx, which boons you want to pick out of your options and when you want to buy well buffs / use your rerolls

#

then figuring out combat gamesense for just general using your weapon but also grouping enemies and abusing enemy spawn mechanics is also there (I haven’t really learned this stuff yet ngl)

sly cove
#

i kinda know the spots to spawnmanip but im pretty sure i play way too sloppily anyways

#

the big one that comes to mind is the bridge room in elysium

#

enemies can only spawn on screen so stay on one end when enemeis are spawning so u dont have to go between the two sides

forest token
#

between waves go stand in a corner lmao

#

and try and stay in one area as much as you can before you have to move

vague patio
#

is 10 minutes like 32 heat? reasonably challenging but doable with practice?

south violet
#

it's hard to give a 1-to-1 estimate since in either case it's pretty aspect-dependent and the skills involved are different, but yeah that sounds reasonable

#

maybe sub-9 <=> 32 heat, idk

jaunty falcon
#

32 heat is a little easier than sub 10 imo

left prism
#

I agree I think
Or at the very least your first sub 10 can get really lucky

forest token
#

going fast for sub10 is a bit more difficult thatn surviving for 20 mins lmao

upper juniper
#

sub9 is a bit much

sly cove
#

eris is broken

vague patio
#

I managed to get clockets on my first eris run (3rd ever speed run attempt) and clocked a 10:05, so I believe that

jaunty falcon
#

Hestia is pretty broken too

#

For 32

nimble valve
upper juniper
# nimble valve What build?

literally like any +% strike (ideally artemis or aphrodite), and you either take hammers that increase your strike aoe (like richochet fire or piercing fire) or good special hammers (rocket bomb, cluster bomb, triple bomb)

#

you can use tidal dash to help efficiently deal with small enemies and for boss damage or divine dash for added defensive utility

nimble valve
#

Thank you

keen panther
#

i feel like whatever build i come up with for h32 sword does have potential but because i get 5:00 for each floor i tend to rush it all and tank a lot of damage. what are some strategies to quickly clear rooms without taking tons of damage? i also almost always lose a DD to EM Asterius since i also tend to tank absorb a lot of damage whilst trying to damage him. can i have some tips or build suggestions please

south violet
# keen panther i feel like whatever build i come up with for h32 sword does have potential but ...
  • pause when making a choice. This saves at least 1 second per choice, more or less depending on choice-complexity and your decision-making speed.
  • some aspects have an easier time in high heat than others. Swords are quite notoriously an unsafe weapon (which doesn't mean it's bad per se, it's just hard to play well).
  • doing a dashstrike takes away all dash iframes you may have. Therefore, try not to press attack whenever an enemy move is coming your way.
verbal atlas
bleak frost
#

especially bc it does barely any damage to you

verbal atlas
#

it can once you have a good special on it

#

and mixed with more limited healing options

#

the scarier part of it is that it briefly prevents you from moving allowing you to get punished (iirc this also exists for base rail special?)

bleak frost
#

oh yeah that seems terrible

#

oh wait getting hit by it or shooting it?

verbal atlas
#

hit by it

bleak frost
#

oh alr

verbal atlas
#

hazard is also good room clear and dps all in one

#

ricochet tends to fall off in higher heats bc of dc2 + js3 + savior etc

bleak frost
#

yeah that makes sense

verbal atlas
#

(to be clear you dont take dc2 on hestia, but damage control effects make hestia's dps and ways of dealing with it much harder)

south violet
#

Thus most noticable on hazard bomb and a bit on cluster bomb too. Matters on non-hazard less if you can just dash out of the shortdash though.

keen panther
#

augh

#

i guess ill do something else than the sword

#

Zeus shield wooo wow thats so skillful

shy plinth
#

There are quite a few diff sword builds that will work at 32

#

Have you reviewed the guides for what mirror and pact choices to make

keen panther
#

nop

bleak frost
#

oh yeah i need to look at mirror choices for high heat

south violet
keen panther
#

i either lose a ton of time or take too much damage to stand a chance against Hades

shy plinth
# keen panther nop

Would strongly recommend posting your mirror and pact here before doing more 32s

#

There are some very common assumptions that people make when entering the land of high heat and they almost always make things harder than they need to be

#

Everyone has a super cursed first time 32 pact (myself included)

keen panther
#

oh you got no idea how cursed my first was

#

ill try again some later after reading some stuff from pins

shy plinth
#

Good plan, Bananas has a great guide. If you share what you're currently using on pact and mirror you'll probs get some faster tips too

bleak frost
shy plinth
#

Put them on imgur or gyazo or something and then link them

#

Or post them in a diff discord and then do copy link

bleak frost
#

there we go

#

thanks

shy plinth
#

Not bad, though you are def making things slower by skipping stubborn defiance+lasting consequences 4

#

Jury summons and DC will slow you down

#

Should still be doable, but if you can learn stubborn defiance+lc4, it's likely easier

#

Otherwise, good choices imo

#

You could also shift a couple points from jury summons to convenience fee if you'd rather

bleak frost
#

i havent tried much on lc at all but it went badly when i did it even with stubborn and i havent tried convenience fee at all so ill probably take 1 of jury and put it into convenience fee

shy plinth
#

Stubborn+lc4 is generally the way to go if you want to climb above 32

bleak frost
#

dont think ill try that any time soon, probably get 32 on a few weapons if even that and then go to hades 2 after doing the story more

shy plinth
#

Your call - if you don't wanna do sd+lc4 this should be fine as long as you're not doing Arthur or hestia

bleak frost
#

ill still do stubborn just bc i dont have enough to get death defiance up and am too lazy to do a reset on mirror but yeah im doing either gilgamesh or demeter, ive been using gilgamesh the most but had a great run with demeter recently and seems easy enough to recreate or at least attempt to

shy plinth
#

If you're doing fists, this is even easier - do merciful end

bleak frost
#

yeah i did try that a while ago but on a lot lower heat, ill cycle through the main 2 i do and merciful end just to keep it different every time

#

idk if i even fully remeber one of the 2 i typically do bc i havent done it in a while

vague patio
#

with fists, can you do dc2?

south violet
#

dc2 is fine on all of them except maybe gilga

azure kayak
#

I think give up on EM4 heat 32 (at the very least for now) I think. I think I might just dislike heat 32 but I finally managed to get an other win with different settings.

I really wanted to try and win on em4 and a little bit often but it's just too hard. Beside I dont think I enjoy heat 32 in general.

But if anyone know some strategies for that. share them with me lol.

shy plinth
#

There are quite a few pinned resources on 32 in here, especially Bananas' heat guide

#

Would not recommend EM4 at 32 though, it is QUITE hard

keen panther
#

true

forest token
#

Em4 32 heat might be the reason why you're not enjoying it lmfao

shy plinth
#

I really don't like EM4 as an experience

#

All the stress of the run compounds right at the end

#

It's a big difficulty jump and an opportunity to express skill, but I never got good enough to enjoy it

azure kayak
shy plinth
#

It's doable, you just have to learn it - would guess for most people the play there is to drop LC4 so you can keep DDs and stack em up. But EM4 is still a lot to learn and you have to do a whole run to get there

azure kayak
shy plinth
#

You def don't have to take FO2 at 32

languid notch
#

You can

#

Especially if you’ve learnt how to use it and are used to it

shy plinth
#

Yeah, just saying that there are options

#

Generally out of TD3, FO2, and HL5, you only need two of those

languid notch
#

That there are

azure kayak
#

My other clears had FO1 but Hard labor at 80%. For Em4 I just thought I couldnt do it with the stubborn defiance without getting lucky with patty.

shy plinth
#

FO1 HL4 seems like the worst of both worlds tbh

#

Faster and harder hitting is tough

azure kayak
#

Then I remember at first it was about trying to win with different settings like some peoples I seen and then try to do EM4 heat 32... but this is just too much. I dont see how I would do it aside using the rail

shy plinth
#

It's mostly about learning the fight and making sure you get a strong build going

#

Also, the simpler answer is the same as everything else on 32

#

"Merciful end"

south violet
#

(derogatory)

shy plinth
#

I mean

#

Yes, but. Gets the job done lol

south violet
#

God I love looking for doom rarity because epic starts literally 50 base damage higher, then hoping UC doesn't make me sell my build

shy plinth
#

We're not here for fun, we're here to win, which is fun

azure kayak
#

yeah but then the sword on the FO gets turn into a glorified dash spear. Shields I mostly use Zeus. I think I'm going to have fun, from my perspective trying to play each weapons on heat 32 or em4 heat 32. Feels like too restricted or many things needs to go right.

If not, you need an insane level of skill floor to be higher to compensate.

shy plinth
#

Speaking as someone that has done 32x24 while being bad, you do not need an insane level of skill, trust me

#

You need a good pact, a good mirror, an understanding of what kind of build is good enough to get you through a run, and practice

#

There are some duos that will just hard carry you regardless of the weapon and some weapon/aspect specific builds that will hard carry

azure kayak
#

Yeah I guess heat 32 there isnt the fun improvisation at the same level. You really need to know your stuff and what to shoot for or what to back up for

shy plinth
#

It's really a matter of perspective

#

I think you'd be surprised at how much you can get away with at 32

#

Hang around in here long enough and you'll start to see those 50 heat grinders that really have no options and live on pure execution

south violet
#

you can beat 32 heat with the worst pact in existence with sufficient skill and a good enough aspect

#

it's just... not fun or easy or reliable to do so

shy plinth
#

Generally speaking I found 32x24 to be a fun challenge that gave me some good practice and helped me build skills without going ultra crazy

azure kayak
#

Well I tried to make the duo for Dio and Aphro happen for 2-3 runs and on the one I just won I could make it... It was so akward but the aphro legendary save me (but also mixed me up during the hades fight lol )

#

Posted it in boasting in case ur curious

shy plinth
#

Have you posted your pact/mirror?

azure kayak
#

I tend to shift things around in terms of my pact

south violet
#

avoid having multiple sources of hangover. to decide what damage to deal, the game takes the damage of the most recently-applied source of hangover. by using dio attack you are essentially rendering your call worthless.

azure kayak
#

oh... I didnt know that

#

so many little details that arent oblivious to notice barbLUL

#

But it make sense now that it being told to me that way.

south violet
#

there's a fair amount of stuff the game unfortunately doesn't tell the player, yeah

azure kayak
#

I wish more games had more ways to tell you meta stuff if you seek it out. Like I didnt even know until I watched healian play hades 2 that ur gods pool is like set to 4 gods. And I dont even know really how it works. just that it exist lol

south violet
#

there's a speedrunning discord server which arguably is the best place to ask questions and learn/read stuff about the game and its metas, if you're interested.

azure kayak
#

I might just take a peak for some of the meta things. but aside from that I dont have any interest in speedrunning

south violet
#

oh, that's completely fine, it's just the most reliable source of hades and hades 2 mechanics info I know so that's why I'm recommending it

azure kayak
#

Anyway, if you guys know some good strategies for EM4 Heat 32 I might give it a shot just to get it out of my system.

I did win with all weapon types once. So if I cant get around to it. I might just lower the heat for fun sakes in future runs. Or maybe I will come to love at least FO1 barbLUL

south violet
#

also bananas' 32 heat guide, in the pinned messages of this channel provides good info and tips, some I personally mildly disagree with but even in those cases isn't insane

azure kayak
#

Yeah. I did look at both pinned guides as a baseline for heat 32 and try to work off that.

Thx for the guide tho I appreciate it. Imma take a look. Don't know if im not too demoralized to try again. But im still curious

#

But I dont think I have H32x24 in me regardless lol. Since im also playing hades 2

south violet
#

hey, those aren't mutually exclusive!

azure kayak
#

Its just the time commitment and my sanity lol

azure kayak
#

Like can peer pressure mess up my attack hangover I just applied

south violet
azure kayak
#

Oh... So I really want hangover on either attack or ult.

forest token
#

32 is a heat level where you can take weird ass mirror/pact/build and still be fine without too much bs

#

Unless you take ap2 ri4 lmao

#

Anything higher gets substantially more difficult

azure kayak
#

I guess I would need to get better cause force overtime 2 really feel too much for me. Im not having fun. And as I go I just got increasingly more frustrated

#

But its a preference things.

#

Im not saying its bad.

forest token
#

Taking breaks from high heat is valid lol it can get frustrating

#

Fo2 is also rough if yo're not used to it yet

azure kayak
#

Well it's just too much GOGOGOGO. I can see it being fun an exhilarating for others but for me. I love my small moments to breath and brief pauses.

I did get better at it. But man.

vague patio
#

so question about the hangover

#

if you have a low damage hangover stacked 5x

#

then hit them with a high damage one

#

will all 5 now do the high damage?

verbal atlas
#

correct

#

the opposite is also true to this however

#

hangover damage is based on whichever rate was most recently applied

upper juniper
#

The only real “high damage” stack is dio call anyways at that hits 6 times on a minicall

azure kayak
#

oh wow... so peer pressure was screwing me over and if I ever end up with dio ult when I have it on attack I should apply it with attack to stack and let the call do more damage ?

upper juniper
#

so you don’t have to worry about it when you have dio on strike or special

azure kayak
shy plinth
#

What keepsakes are you using each run btw?

azure kayak
#

me ? depends. either I start with a god or mom pom. And in Elysium I either take the acorn, sometimes the hourglass or spear point. Styx. Acorn

shy plinth
#

What do you do in asphodel?

#

And why mom pom first?

bleak frost
#

get the more important boons you start with levelled up early or something like that

shy plinth
#

Early mom pom seems pretty risky with underworld customs

bleak frost
#

wait actually idk he probably got a better explanation than what i said

shy plinth
#

The general meta keepsake path is god keepsake->diff god keepsake->acorn->acorn. Hearing Zeus op when he dosent ghost you. made me wonder if we're taking god keepsakes for the first two biomes to target a build

#

Because if not, that could explain a bunch

forest token
azure kayak
# shy plinth And why mom pom first?

well if I dont have anything in mind at the start I take the pom for extra levels. But usually I dont know. I use a god if I have an idea. most my attempts earlier I tried to build some of the things in the guides here lol

bleak frost
bleak frost
shy plinth
#

Makes sense, I think generally you can target a god for most aspects, but if you don't want to, I might recommend coin purse

#

I wouldn't recommend mom pom as a keepsake

#

You're talking about 2-3 poms

#

In particular, never take it for asphodel. Asphodel is always 10 chambers

forest token
#

coin purse my beloved

#

asphodel is 6 combats max lol

shy plinth
#

Yeah

forest token
#

no 7

#

but still lmao

shy plinth
#

If there's a particular god you're looking for, I would def recommend god keepsakes for biomes 1 and 2 - but if you're really open to whatever, take coin purse

#

One of the important tricks there is to make sure you don't take more than 3 gods unless you have what you're targeting naturally

#

That way you can keepsake the 4th one for asphodel

azure kayak
shy plinth
#

Yeah. It reads a lot better than it plays

bleak frost
#

is kinetic launcher on demeter good?

forest token
#

it's fine

#

you don't really use it for the gimmick of the power shot

bleak frost
#

yeah thats what i was thinking

forest token
#

it just launches the special faster but that's about it

shy plinth
#

If I'm on fists I'm just looking for breaching cross and rolling knuckle

#

Kinetic launcher and explosive upper are both like fine

bleak frost
#

well it doesnt seem terrible especially because if its way too much for a single enemy and theyre kinda lined up it can work well but not really for much else

forest token
#

rolling?

#

do you mean long knuckle

shy plinth
#

The one that's good on dash strikes

forest token
#

oh why that one

#

it is rolling but why would you want that lmao

shy plinth
#

Maybe I'm misremembering since I played so much ME

azure kayak
#

kinectic seems to work if you have nothing better or need to avoid the slow combo fist

shy plinth
#

I guess typically on fists you actually do more standing attacks

#

Memory playing tricks on me here

bleak frost
#

exclusive access mid asphodel shop thats huge

forest token
#

rolling gives you like 60% damage on dash strikes but it's a base like 10 attack lmao

shy plinth
#

You right you right

#

I'm just scrolling the fist hammers and they all seem so mid

#

I don't remember being excited about any of these

bleak frost
forest token
#

breaching cross is the big one

#

long knuckle good for safety

#

explosive upper good on demeter

#

that's about it lmao

shy plinth
#

Gross

bleak frost
#

what

azure kayak
#

I used to like playing with the spear until I got into higher heats. im sure im doing something wrong bad damn

shy plinth
#

I don't think spear really scales up that well except for guan yu cultists

#

Eh it's got more success at high heat than sword or fists though

azure kayak
#

I would have though fist did more damage

shy plinth
#

Ranged safer

#

Though keep in mind we're talking like extremely high heat

bleak frost
#

damn am i really gonna have to sell tdash

azure kayak
#

Maybe I will try to make a meme beam run with apollo happen just for the sake of laughing if it ever works there.

forest token
#

not apollo lmao

shy plinth
#

You may be mixing up your games

bleak frost
#

yeah i was confused there

shy plinth
#

H1 does have meme beam if you go artemis demeter

#

But remember, fully loaded is a myth

azure kayak
#

I meant to say "Aspect of Achilles"

#

keep mixing up some names in these games lol

shy plinth
#

Ah sure

#

Can also just do poseidon sword

azure kayak
#

iirc what I used to do is farm for chaos, farm for artemis, and some hermes cast I think ? Using stygian soul so I can keep a rotation

#

it gets really hilarious when there is like 7-8 of them still firing and locking on to hades or whatever

vague patio
shy plinth
#

You can, just less optimal

#

Way less likely to build up synergy

azure kayak
shy plinth
#

Does a lot of damage

vague patio
#

"farm" means "reset repeatedly" in this context?

shy plinth
#

Poseidon sword also just has a flat +50% cast damage buff, don't need to overthink it really

#

Lightning phalanx is strong if you get the pieces, phalanx cast does a lot of base damage if I recall

azure kayak
#

having 3 cast and phalanx shot used to be one of my favorite thing when I was new at the game. Big orbs goes bbrrrr with big numbers.

shy plinth
#

If you get hera bow and parting shot it can also be a decent bit of damage, but tbh it's hard to argue against just doing crush shot

azure kayak
#

I think I still have that weapon to level up lol. some of them I still didnt play much with them

bleak frost
#

em3 is such bs

shy plinth
#

Are you going for bull first

#

You get used to it, asterius is the hard thing to adjust to, but once you adapt it's not so bad imo

#

EM3+FO2 took me a while to adapt to since asterius hits so hard

bleak frost
#

i went for theseus but asterius was kinda getting in the way, i just needed a bit more hp and i wouldve been fine i think

shy plinth
#

Always go for asterius first

#

Always always

bleak frost
#

oh yeah i kinda forgot i had fo2 on, it doesnt even seem that bad tho

shy plinth
#

It isn't unless you get to mid-stage theseus and then the screen is a fireworks show for no reason mid fight

bleak frost
shy plinth
#

It's because when you get him to mid health with asterius still around you no longer have a safe place to stand

bleak frost
#

oh alr

shy plinth
#

Kill the bull first, that's the dangerous part of the fight

#

But when you get theseus to mid-level and he does his god call, you're fighting him, the bull, and the ground

bleak frost
#

yeah i never knew who to go for first, thanks tho

shy plinth
#

Also, if you're using meg companion

#

Press up on the d-pad once, then use your companion

bleak frost
#

oh yeah that was probably a good idea

shy plinth
#

Just a quick tap

#

Meg call goes perpendicular

#

So if you press up and immediately call, it hits em both

bleak frost
#

i need to use them more ngl, i only find a few uses for them during an entire run and i have it max, i could definitely use it more for the minibosses

#

or just annoying rooms

shy plinth
#

You should not be ending your run with any left

#

You can use one on the third phase of lernie and it's an insta kill

bleak frost
#

yeah i did that once, idk why i didnt do it a second ago

sly cove
#

u dont need to think abt attack cycle

azure kayak
#

Welp tried a few run for em4 with beams... Got demolished. The only time I had a shot. I got the tracking thing at the end of styx and was half beaten and missing time. Even when I lowered it to 23 lol

#

Something I don't get... Is when I use a God's trinket to start the run but I struggle to see them again in tartarus and even asphodel. Literally choking my run.

left prism
#

Are you filling up your god pool/using dark foresight?

upper juniper
shy plinth
#

Yeah, the general approach is to keepsake a god in the first biome, get two more, then keepsake your final god in the second biome - or if the thing you're looking for happens naturally in the first biome, you can just get up to 4 gods right away

#

(You can still keepsake in the second biome)

#

Pulling your victory screen from the other channel - there are tweaks to your pact if you want them, but I generally think your mirror is fine to good. Only question for me here is fiery presence

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Depends what aspect you're using though

#

Fam fave, dark foresight, god's pride, and fated persuasion are good calls. IMO, SD+LC4 makes for a better pact than using DDs does, but that's up to you and I believe has been discussed already

#

Actually, for what it's worth - I do think infernal soul is usually better than stygian soul. Stygian is probably better with dio cast and demeter beams tho

azure kayak
vague patio
#

(or pick your higher damage attack)

azure kayak
azure kayak
shy plinth
#

Yeah that's cool, follow the guides and ignore me

#

Are you able to record any of your runs? You might get better feedback that way

azure kayak
#

beside im not even sure if we're talking about the mirror thing or other atm

shy plinth
#

Oh don't worry you're good, sorry, I was unclear

#

I meant "I have not been playing hades 1 in a while so it is entirely possible my question about fiery presence is dumb"

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And at least one of the pinned guides is from me lol

#

I asked a question, you had a good answer

upper juniper
shy plinth
#

Hrm that's fair

#

I'm mostly thinking of the burst damage

azure kayak
#

I dont know what to think about the cast. Like stygian is better to keep apply the cast status and maintain it but infernal damage burst is nice

shy plinth
#

Tbh I doubt it matters that much

azure kayak
#

Im at chamber 5 with the zeus bracelet on a five minute timer and I got my first boon and the 2 chamber offered to me was Poseidon and Ares barbLUL lmao

shy plinth
#

I would insta sea storm there

#

But not sure what you're playing etc

azure kayak
#

ahh... damn ! that would have been a better idea. Im trying a rama special with zeus. I like this build.

bleak frost
#

damn that sounds really fun i normally go for hangover on rama special

#

bro how tf are you meant to do anything against armored numbskulls in erebus

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such bs

azure kayak
#

Erebus ? You mean tartarus ?

bleak frost
#

in erebus gates

azure kayak
#

Oh. Thats the neat think. You dont

#

But seriously aside normal speed I dont know. Bait out it dash attack doge it hit it and dont be greedy and repeat iirc

#

But in forced overtime I cant help. I dont know how I do it if I manage

bleak frost
#

yeah so i guess i just need to hope then bc im using fists so that sucks

#

on fo2

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and also the next room had like a total of 80 armored ones for some reason

#

not the like see through clone ones tho

azure kayak
#

Yeah with fist I don't know. If it just one skull. I could manage. But multiple of them and the grabby hands are so much worst at fo2

bleak frost
#

yeah its just guarenteed damage, but like i was not about to take artemis to mess up my build for it

azure kayak
#

If ur using demeter I guess you try to charge the special and then use it on them.

Talos well I would say chess them out on by one but FO2 ... Im not sure how. The others im not famillar.

#

Also use ur cast on them

bleak frost
#

yeah cast wouldve probably helped

azure kayak
#

For the bonus dmg

#

Keep in mind im just pitching ideas. Im no where near as good or knowledgeable as the regular people that are around here lol

bleak frost
#

yeah tbh im not amazing either, practicing 32 heat rn and cant get past em3 asterius and theseus, but i havent tried since i learned to go for asterius first so idk

azure kayak
#

Welp I run out of time before even the boss and at the boss I was at 0... Gg. I guess I could have play with the bow better. But rng really screwed me. I even had the hammer I wanted for that build.

bleak frost
#

yeah i just got really unlucky with my past few runs, forced some bad boons for my build onto me or had like less than 10 obols needed to get the 2 items needed from the shop for the past 4 runs(wild luck)

azure kayak
bleak frost
#

yeah thats kinda what i did but id move behind pillars really late sometimes and get hit every once in a while

#

but em3 is kinda just bs imo, it just makes the fight not fun and more annoying

shy plinth
#

It really is just about getting used to it. Like it's def harder, but it's just a different fight

#

Feels more like a dps check than anything

#

Have y'all watched any of the videos of successful high heat runs on the leaderboard in the pins

sly cove
sly cove
#

slower and harder

#

unless ur other choices are trash

azure kayak
#

I DID IT !!!!

#

Won an em4 heat 32 win

left prism
#

Gg

azure kayak
shy plinth
#

Good work

forest token
#

gamer

azure kayak
#

You know the funny thing is before the fight I took a picture of my build cause I was like. it was a fun build time to die to hades. but in phase 1 I was doing pretty well and I was like .... hold on... this is doable ... I'm I finally gonna win this barbLUL

#

Btw thx @shy plinth for the em4 guide you shared to me yesterday. it not like I remember and applied everything. But I kept telling myself. "keep dodging to the side to be safe. in his opposite direction (aka crossing him) like mentioned there it help

shy plinth
#

I don't think that was me!

#

But I'm glad it helped

azure kayak
#

was it banana ?

shy plinth
#

It was @south violet

azure kayak
#

oh no it was @sly cove how could I have forgot

#

Well thank you for the guide lol 😅

#

I guess I thought it was you cause you were more recent in my mind

shy plinth
#

Because I yap more lol

#

It's a good group here, glad we could help

sly cove
azure kayak
#

it was

#

just checked

sly cove
#

oh

#

ok then

shy plinth
#

It was not

#

Was alexca

sly cove
#

😭😭

shy plinth
#

Ur still great dw

azure kayak
#

I mean guide wasnt their

sly cove
#

chat does anyone remember the x best/worst keepsake names

#

is that too much of a throwback

shy plinth
#

That might be before my time

#

Was that in ea

sly cove
#

no

azure kayak
#

sorry

sly cove
#

i didnt play the game in ea

#

probably like 2022

shy plinth
#

Damn we have 5 yrs of 1.0 history

azure kayak
#

lol I keep messing up the names silly me

sly cove
#

damn i really havent gone back and improved on that level 50 ddash run with erebus strats

azure kayak
#

but yeah during the fight I dodged in the direction he was moving with the spin and I was like ... ok ... ok see this is like you just read yesterday. either just avoid it completly or move opposite or away to the side

sly cove
#

idr if i used fauth

azure kayak
#

Since I guess up EM4 heat being a regular thing or doing it with fist, swords etc... I was like ... what if I try my lighting rama build again

#

the double lightning chance is pretty vital to the build. And since Demeter was in my pool early I tried to shoot for the duo that extent jolt.

#

And the legendary was the extra spicy sauce that made my victory more possible. But even with the legendary it was doable for me. But I still needed Zeus to show up more then 2-3 times. thats the real luck here barbLUL

azure kayak
#

I got some questions. I watched Haelian recently and learned about the concept of "4 god pools" and I hear "filling my core slots"

So about the pool.

Does that mean that the first 4 different god I accept a boon from is gonna define the future rng on my doors and have no other ones appear ?

If so. Lets say I take 4 gods in tartarus and force a fifth one via trinkets, I'm assuming that this god will only appear once and not be part of the pool right ?

And then about the "core slots" Im deducing that these have increased odds of showing up so filling up the things like atk, special, dash, cast, call.

Would increase my odds of getting offered a duo boon etc... Is that right ?

left prism
#

Lvl 0 os gonna answer most but just quickly: call is weird where it is a core but has no priority for those things

#

But as you said, yeah it helps for duos

honest crypt
#

legends say alexca is still typing to this day

left prism
#

Why are there so many bouldys

verbal atlas
#

bc bouldy manifest is i

south violet
# azure kayak I got some questions. I watched Haelian recently and learned about the concept o...

Does that mean that the first 4 different god I accept a boon from is gonna define the future rng on my doors and have no other ones appear ?
Sorta? wmicletsgo Do want to rephrase to make sure there are no misunderstandings though:

  • view the god-pool as a "set", in the mathematical sense (every element can only appear once). every unique olympian among the 8 base ones (Athena, Ares, Dionysus, Artemis, Zeus, Poseidon, Aphrodite, Demeter) you pick up a boon from gets added to this god-pool. if the cardinality of this set exceeds 3 (you have 4+ gods in the pool), the game will pick only among this pool of gods when randomly picking gods throughout the rest of the run.
  • this isn't to be confused with the godpool of the save-file, which tracks what gods you have collected a boon from on the save file, which decides which gods can appear in shops (a mechanic which becomes irrelevant the moment one has met all available gods on one's playthrough)

If so. Lets say I take 4 gods in tartarus and force a fifth one via trinkets, I'm assuming that this god will only appear once and not be part of the pool right ?

  • the godpool only prevents the game from randomly picking to have a new god get added to the pool to the first place, it doesn't change what happens when the player "forces" a god using a keepsake (the god then gets added to the pool, "expanding" AKA "overfilling" the godpool).
  • occasionally, it is possible for the player to overfill the godpool through entering a midshop with a godpool of size 3, only if there is a god one doesn't have yet in shop, and a different god the player hasn't met before either in the chamber thereafter.

And then about the "core slots" Im deducing that these have increased odds of showing up so filling up the things like atk, special, dash, cast, call.

  • as nooby stated, call is an impostor susknight among core-boons. it can be used in the place of a coreboon for the purposes of the boon-tree and appears on the sidebar to the left where the cores are, however none of its other properties are core-like: it isn't forced on the first screen when the player is missing all core-boons (and hence cannot appear on first boon without using rerolls), it isn't given "priority" (aka better chances of appearing than others) when picking boons (can point you to the boon selection procedure if you have questions about this), don't appear as far up on the god's boon selection screen as possible, and cannot be replaced.
  • before calls get added, cores behave the simple rule of "if at least 1 coreboon is unfilled, guarantee at least 1 of these unfilled coreboons per god's boon." This rule works independently from the priority-boon system.
  • after calls get added, this property is revoked and replaced with the following: "add every unfilled coreboon to the list of priority-boons". priority-boons don't just include cores though, they also include effect-applying boons of gods without cores that apply a status effects (blinding flash, hunter's mark, static discharge, razor shoals)
  • replacements are pretty rare.
    essentially, you can increase your odds of getting the boons you want by taking priority-boons, as well as filling cores with gods beneficial (opening tier 2 boons you want) or at least non-intrusive to your build (don't do much for your build, but won't brick your build or lock you out of much better options). It's also possible to increase your odds of getting a certain core boon by filling the other core-boons, since cores you've already filled are unlikely to get replaced unless the game doesn't have any other choices outside of cores and shiny boons (duo/lego).
south violet
#

excuse the holy paragraph

shy plinth
verbal atlas
#

holy paragraph indeed

azure kayak
# south violet > Does that mean that the first 4 different god I accept a boon from is gonna de...

Sorry I totally forgot to reply.

So essentially during a run once you get to 4 gods. Doors stops showing you anything but the 4 you have made contact with. But ! The pool can go up in numbers if I either try to force it with keepsakes or get unlucky in a certain scenario where my pool is at 3 with the shop plus doors.

And as for the core boons. Im not sure I understood all about the call part but essentially its an imposter and the other core boons are almost guaranteed to have 1 core boon pop in the menu choice until fulfil the 4 ones.

But then there are other priorities boons to look out for.

So if I want to look out for zeus legendary. Better have my core filled and other priorities filled to increase the odds and not have like a cast take the place of a slot.

This also applies for duo boons but I also need to be aware of not being able of not opening too many undesirable duo boon paths if any at all.

But lets say I want the duo boon for Zeus/Poseidon and im not particularly interested in razor shoals and would rather take an other one, but I should also consider taking Razor Shoals just to give me better odds ?

#

If I understood correctly ^

south violet
#

note that duoboons and legendaries in hades are considered almost the same thing by the game. opening a worthless legendary when you're looking for a given duo reduces your odds of getting a useful shiny boon.

#

(as seen here)

honest crypt
# south violet

oh miniboss rooms actually decrease your chances of getting duos and legos?

forest token
#

By like 2% lmao

#

The only time the 2% would ever be considered would be like Styx shop

#

Or Styx in general I guess

#

Midshops I guess if the next room is miniboss

#

But hard to blame the 2% if you don't get it tho lmao