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#h1-story-discussion
crystal glacier
stark raven
Lol I met him the first time after 40+ runs... I'm very bad at this lol
crystal glacier
naaah, you just don't have 500 hours of binding of isaac logged
and like 100 hours of nuclear throne
that game is hektik
atomic forge
forgive me if this has been mentioned 300 times but how tf is the story going to ‘end’ while we clearly have to go back to the underworld to experience the endgame?
the olympians get mad and banish you to the underworld forever?
like sisyphus lmao
doomed to forever try to keep escaping
normal kiln
the main thing that excites me about 1.0 is this
i have legitimately no idea
I honestly doubt Zag would choose to leave the underworld forever tho, even if Hades let him
like, the whole game is about building relationships, the most significant of which are with people from the underworld
it would be kinda weird if Zag just gave that up forever
So anyway, I guess what I'm saying is that maybe he comes back voluntarily? idk
atomic forge
persephone makes him realize that escaping and his relationships is what gives him purpose or something
🤷♀️
normal kiln
i ran across the idea somewhere that the reason Zag keeps dying (from a story perspective, obviously the real reason is that we need to git gud lol) is that he doesn't really want to leave, so he isn't really, truly giving it his all
when he does escape, the narrator says "let's pretend that didn't happen" because some part of Zag himself wants to believe that
prolly not what supergiant are going for, but its a fun theory
fervent skiff
I mean there is another theory that Nyx is purposefully keeping Zagreus in the underworld as the Olympians do mention that immediately after Zag reaches the surface, its almost as if an intense darkness envelopes you.
Not sure on why she would do that though
normal kiln
huh
that's interesting, though it raises questions about why she would help you to try and escape, only to prevent to you succeeding
dense sparrow
she is the mastermind thats why
normal kiln
i mean, ngl it does sound like something she might do
I have zero clue why but like
i can imagine it
fickle comet
Because she hides his path to Persephone. 
dense sparrow
nyx is a neutral force, a being not unlike chaos, there is no telling what, or why she does what she does
fickle comet
Lady Nyx is always on my side. 💗
normal kiln
Because she hides his path to Persephone.
in all seriousness, this is probably the actual answer
dense sparrow
nyx is a neutral force, a being not unlike chaos. There is no telling what, or why she does what she does
she may do it for more personal reasons, like how chaos help us
normal kiln
tho is it fun to read too much into the fact that he can't properly leave, even that that's likely just a temporary early access thing
dense sparrow
remember that both chaos and nyx are protogenoi
fickle comet
Darkness can still envelop him in 1.0 because the Olympians are apparently not supposed to find out where Persephone is now. So it would make sense if it stays.
normal kiln
(hint: the entirely of said knowledge comes from this game)
Oh yeah you're probably right about the darkness, I was talking about the idea that Nyx is somehow behind his "convenient deaths"
fickle comet
And then, the reason for escaping the underworld over and over again will be that Zagreus wants to visit his mom again, and Hades will be like "You're going to see your mother again? I won't allow it!"
normal kiln
sounds like a job for APHRODITE (activates call)
dense sparrow
repeating, nyx is a protogenos and does not act in a comprehensible way
i dont think aphro is bi, seeing that there is no evidence on it, but you do you i guess
normal kiln
i mean, each to their own but i find the idea that aphrodite isn't bi to be... pretty unlikely
dense sparrow
she is omnisexual, and so she isnt bi and is bi also
keen light
Idk what the 1.0 release is gonna look like story wise, but going from a lot of dialogue and codex entries, as well as the snow in the final arena, makes me think Demeter is going to be involved in some way
a lot of the duo boon dialogues with her are pretty exciting for that prospect as most of the other olympians seem wary/confused as to why shes causing so much strife up on the surface. TBH im not too deep into the story progression, so i could be missing other dialogues against this
open berry
well clearly dem is involved bc she's still not able to be max bonded rn
her and hades are the only chara left
so I feel that's a pretty safe assumption
actually on that note maybe getting her max bond will be required for the ending 
I've been wondering how they're going to trigger the gameplay loop into hitting the true ending and figured for one thing it may be locked behind a minimum successful run count but yknow honestly locking it behind like... dem bond could work and makes sense too. maybe hades but we don't know how many hearts he'll end up having but it would also keep players continuing their early access files from seeing the ending right away when 1.0 drops too
keen light
I've just joined the discord in the past couple of days after playing since steam launch so idk if this has been mentioned somewhere, but im kinda hoping for a StS-esque short but brutal final stretch of areas on the surface. But now that I type it out I realize I have no idea what I want and am just excited for SG to blow me away yet again :3
honestly one of my favorite games of all time and its not even finished yet
open berry
ah unfortunately we already know there won't be further gameplay than what we currently have
I don't necessarily mind this but given the amount of narrative needing to be tied up I'm def curious how it'll be handled
atomic forge
Wait I havent encountered Demeter very often but
I read on the subreddit that Demeter says Helios (?) told her he saw Persephone enter the underworld. But she thought it was nonsense and is convinced mortals took her away so she is pulling eternal winter on them
And I thought I had just spoilered myself right then (which is fine) but the comment was a reply to a post about mythological theories so idk if they were talking about real mythological or game canon
drifting citrus
||it's from a potential convo with dem in-game||
keen light
Fair, I didnt know if they had confirmed or denied a possibility of a final surface act. One of my favorites was the first time i got zeus x demeter duo, zeus hits her with ||"Your wit is as dry as the earth lying fallow in your care. Perhaps you should get back to tending that."|| or something like that
Love me some deity drama
keen light
yea almost all of the demeter x ___ duos have some spicy back and forths
open berry
a lot of the duos have two diff convos so even if you've seen one they may have another
atomic forge
random question but is demeter actually not pronounced like deemeeter
keen light
i switch but generally land on dem - i - ter
atomic forge
i was rather surprised to hear then say dehmehter
atomic forge
i get you i think
keen light
ive noticed a lot of classical greek pronunciations lean towards the softer sounds rather than hard
so meh, rather than me
open berry
def everything I'm looking at has more emphasis on the long e sound
might be something to ask in the next qa, if there was any reason behind the pronunciation they went with
though maybe I'm just used to zag's voice but thinking about the two pronunciations in my head, what they went with flows better so who knows
next qa is gonna be fun, so many people asking about what they'll do post 1.0 I bet lol
waxen vigil
im personally really glad they use dehmehter because i've been saying it that way since i was a kid and always got corrected but finally,, vindication
restive elk
I never heard how Ares was pronounced, before this game. For 19 years of my life I thought that it was "arEs".
waxen vigil
my mom taught me how to say all the olympians' name when i started reading percy jackson at like age 6 but i never actually got dionysus right :/
like i always said it as "die AWNy sus" instead of die awn NY sus
fast idol
to be fair some pronounciations are kinda hecked over by english pronounciation
lord Z00S
void plover
I've always wondered if it should be like Zay-us
fast idol
i can only speak for german pronounciation where it is something akin to Zois
but that is only thanks to how we pronounce the eu sound
mystic mortar
Lawd zoos
fast idol
oh lawd he coming
restive elk
I just call him Zevs.
feral flower
I believe that, if you were to go full greek on it, Zeus should be pronounced Zevs.
But at some point being accurate just confuses people.
fast idol
I saw one pronounciation thats like
Djevs or something
restive elk
Heeeeeey, being a slav ain't that bad now.
keen light
Zoose. If there were two it would be Zeese
runic terrace
zoose tycoon....untitled zoose game....
bold niche
weren't U and V confused at some point?
i mean, W is still double-U, not double-V
keen light
....Zuus?
normal kiln
zws
open berry
me clenching my fist and begging myself not to succumb to brainworms and meme
oh well too late
zuwus
s
neon ibex
It took me embarassingly long to realise that Hercules was well...Hercules in English lol.
"Keep hearing that word but wtf...ooh its him."
high nacelle
I found out not too long ago that Hercules and Heracles are the same thing. Heracles is greek and Hercules is roman, I think.
open tiger
yup
crimson temple
Is there any relation between Heracles and eggs? Because as it turns out, the statues depicting a hero holding an egg in Elysium and the House (which reveals that it is indeed Heracles) are supposed to be him. I couldn't figure out why he is shown in that particular pose.
dense sparrow
Can i see the statue?
crimson temple
It's the Sculpture, Heroic which is offered by the house contractor.
Can I offer you a nice egg in this trying time?
fierce tendon
Heracles; Bringer of Egg
dense sparrow
i dont think there is a reference, the closest to Heracles would be a stymphalian egg (unlikely), or maybe it's an apple of Hesperieds
and zag, having not ever seen an apple, thought that it was an egg
crimson temple
I mean, there is no vocal confirmation that's an egg. That's what I think it is due to the strong resemblance to the phoenix egg traps in Elysium.
fierce tendon
Maybe he just really like eggs for breakfast
dense sparrow
How do you know its Ηερακλες
crimson temple
The narrator will clearly state it's him when you buy the statue and examine it.
sudden tulip
anyone remember what hades says when you ask about why there are rewards for pact
fierce tendon
Broadly something about how he needs to make sure his security is up to snuff and because you keep beating the security you are technically to be issued with a reward for finding the faults. And because Hades is bound by the rules, he can't prevent you being rewarded by the system
sudden tulip
Oh
Im just wondering how titan blood and diamonds get to charon or the styx shop
If there is any reason really
I guess charon has access to everything hades has access to
fierce tendon
Charon has his sources, but he won't say. My guess is that either A) the bounty rewards and Charon's Duty Free just get stocked from the same place or B) Charon is minted with bounties and sells the excess
sudden tulip
is that large door in the hallway filled with titans or something
fierce tendon
Or, of course, the boring option C) simply because it makes the videogame work more betterer this way
sudden tulip
the large door doesnt open yet right?
fierce tendon
Turns out the non-imprisoned titans are just really keen blood donors?
atomic forge
Charon kills the bosses himself first
sudden tulip
according to mythology titans are supposed to be locked in tartarus
fierce tendon
Not all of them
Helios, for example, and Prometheus did not side with Cronus in the Titanomachy and so were spared
sudden tulip
Charon kills the bosses himself first
he seems very much capable of doing so
well the blood probably comes from those in tartarus
idk where in the in-game tartarus they would be anyway
open berry
funnily the text on the pact mentions them
feral flower
The two bosses that drop Titan Blood are the furies and Hades.
Both of which are descended from titans.
That's probably the reason.
midnight sinew
Hellooo boys, so I am in dire need of some assistance
It involves the games many fake-out endings that it supplies because it's in early access
I must document them, before 1.0 drops, so send them here and @ me, send them in my DMs, whatever you can do! I gotta make sure at least most of them are documented
normal kiln
a worthy task indeed
i assume you want exact text, so i’ll let you know next time i win i guess
midnight sinew
yeah a screenshot would be preferable
normal kiln
sure
stark raven
Honestly yes
That would be so cool
maybe a bit op, but still
would be hella cool as a mod
"ah yes let me just swap model and moveset"
About the end game "how-Zag-died-this-time" my favourites are the "he stepped on a gardening rake" and "he slipped on a fruit"
normal kiln
my favourite is the mundanity ending
followed closely by the one with the beetle
the way logan delivers the narrator just arbitrarily coming up with a deadly bug is on point
azure needle
i can grab them all
just a sec
How shall that all work out for him? Alas, it is as yet too soon to say.
Pretend for now that the Lord Hades absolutely clobbered him.
Beyond this point, our tale of the Underworld's determined Prince cannot further continue at this time. But time does not stand still, and more, much more, shall someday be revealed....
For now, there is no more to say or show from here, so let us say instead that Zagreus was cruelly killed, again.
The trials of Prince Zagreus have only just begun...
Our tale of the Underworld Prince is far from finished. But the rest of it shall have to wait until another time.
The tale of death-defying Zagreus shall continue at a later time.
The Underworld Prince is getting rather good at this. But let us say he perished anyhow.```
The duty-shirking Prince then met another of his fated deaths, in fashion best left to imagination.
Prince Zagreus proceeded onward toward his certain doom, entirely too graphic to describe.
Beyond this point lies such a horrifying fate that we had better speak no more of it for now.
Just then, erm, how about a very small yet very deadly beetle landed upon Hydra-slaying Zagreus, ending his attempt?
The never-learning Zagreus then... carelessly fell off a precipice, or something, plunging him into the rapids of the Styx.
The unrelenting Underworld Prince again vainly attempted to proceed beyond the current limits of this tale.
The hint-ignoring Prince again attempted to transgress, to no avail, into domains not yet prepared for his arrival.
Although there are innumerable ways for one to die, our danger-seeking Prince has come to know a sizable variety.
The clever-minded Prince again eluded certain death, up to a certain point, but then, predictably made one of his fatal mistakes, again.
The oft-impatient Zagreus appears to take repeated deaths in stride, and so, here comes another one for him.
Having ventured successfully much farther than before, the surface-seeking Prince encounters setbacks far too hideous to be described.```
Filled with such confidence, the Prince neglected to avoid, erm, stepping on a toxic strain of fungus, so rare you'd not have heard of it.
Having somehow defeated grim Lord Hades in a thrilling fight, Prince Zagreus discovers... it was all a dream! A rather deadly nightmare, actually.
Despite having transcended past the confines of the Underworld yet again, Prince Zagreus proves utterly unable to get past this point.
Imagine that Prince Zagreus experiences some sort of joyous outcome, for a change, in contrast to the arbitrary and unfortunately painful death he shall experience... now.
After defeating his lord father, yet again, Prince Zagreus begins to shiver, and catch cold. And, as is well known, there sadly is no cure for such a thing.
As he explores the wonders of the world, Prince Zagreus discovers a quaint farm, in which he carelessly trespasses, stepping on a farming-tool, which swoops up and strikes him in the forehead, fatally.
One might suppose the Prince's tale most likely ends akin to other tales of the heroes of our time, like so:
The favor-doing Zagreus then walks into a chamber, black as night, but with a blood-red pool, and from it comes a voice which says: Would you mind diving in these waters, Prince? To which the Prince replies, Oh! Sure.
Mere moments from his final victory, the Prince, in his great haste, ignored surveying each side of a rather busy crossing, where a swiftly-passing chariot collided with him, very forcefully.
In his great hurry to explore the country-side, the hapless-footed Prince steps on the peel of a most-exotic sallow-colored fruit, and tumbles backward with such sudden, violent force that you-know-what occurs.
There are a myriad of tales to be told, of both great deeds and of vainglorious defeats, and this has been a tale that falls somewhere in the middle, overall.
He cannot kill me like this every time, believes the Underworld Prince. He shall eventually have no more ideas. But the Prince, as often is the case, is wrong.
Just when his victory was all but certain, a fissure opens underneath the feet of the ill-fated Prince, and from it vents a cloud of superheated water-vapor; steam, as it is known! And probably you know what happens next.
One of these days, or nights, not so very long from now, the Prince may finally traverse beyond this point. And then, what shall become of him and I? Well, hopefully, not this:
Upon the surface realm, the mortal-loving Prince would doubtless find that death still comes in a variety of different forms. One of the most common, yet perhaps least interesting, involves simply waiting... long... enough... until...
Having achieved his goal, the Underworld Prince discovers that the mortal realm is utterly bereft of the life-threatening excitement to which he has grown accustomed, and the lack of anything of note to do, the sheer mundanity, results in this:
@midnight sinew
midnight sinew
oh damn
that's really helpful, thank you
do you think you could grab the text that appears above them too?
azure needle
uh can i have an example
mystic mortar
The first one is F A T H E R
midnight sinew
yeah like that
azure needle
i'll look
midnight sinew
big thanks!
azure needle
Prince
Trials
Underworld
Defying
Rather Good
Spears
Duty
Doom
Horrifying
Beetle
Precipice
Unrelenting
Transgress
Variety
Clever
Another
Setbacks
Wall
Fungus
Dream
Confines
Change
Shiver
Tool
Tale
Sure
Chariot
Demises
Peel
Glorious
Ideas
Steam
Not This
Waiting
Mundanity```respectively
midnight sinew
And these are all in the order of which you posted them?
azure needle
Thus having stilled the deathless raging of the bone-forged Hydra, willful Zagreus now presses ever forward, upward, toward his goal: the surface, where his long-lost birthmother resides.
The myriad of challenges and dangers that await beyond the flame-hot river shall be revealed and overcome upon a later time.
Let us imagine that the Prince did not go far, before falling once more into his father's house....
[Zagreus]
Thus having vanquished the heroic king of Athens, willful Zagreus now presses ever forward, upward, toward his goal: the surface, where his long-lost birthmother resides.
Our tale of the Underworld Prince is far from finished. But the rest of it shall have to wait until another time.
[Journey]
The next stage of the Prince's journey to the surface would bring even greater peril and surprise, the likes of which shall have to be described some other time.
Imagine, if you will, the Underworld Prince soon meets one of his typical, ignoble deaths.
[Pretend]
Pretend our deftly-footed Prince did not survive the boastings of the Champion back there.
[Bloodless]
Then, erm, valiantly striding Zagreus was set upon by seven Bloodless Slam-Dancers, and slain. Or something of the sort.
[Misfortune]
The burning fields of Asphodel again proved unable to stop the flame-resistant Prince, but then, misfortune struck, just like it always does.
[Inescapable]
The master of this realm, Lord Hades, states that death is inescapable. There is considerable credence to his claim.
[Dismay]
Thus did the fate-confronting Prince traverse Elysium, where he discovers to his great dismay such horrors as can only be detailed at some other, later time.
As hero-thwarting Zagreus approaches perilously closer to the surface, he... perhaps gets caught within a rockfall of some sort.
[Dangers]
With oft-undocumented dangers of Elysium well behind him, now Prince Zagreus faces an even greater threat... one which I shall get back to you about.
[Stifling]
So stifling is the thick darkness past Elysium, that the ill-fated Prince there bumps his head extremely hard, and dies.
[Behind You]
Beyond the splendors of Elysium, the ever-patient Prince shall find his fate, eventually, but not right now, because--oh no, watch out!
[Joy]
So joyfully did Zagreus attempt to gain the surface that, why, he just rose too quickly; and we know how that one goes, from Icarus' tale.
[Victory]
Whilst well within arm's reach of victory, the bull-defeating Prince succumbs to a large pack of sinisterly harmless-seeming rodents.
the first entry is for asphodel as last biome
all the others are for elysium last biome
midnight sinew
Got it, then that should be all! Yeah I was considering looking into the code for this but I not only had zero idea how, but zero experience to do so, do you mind if I DM you if I need any more assistance? These quotes pages are gonna take a long ass time
azure needle
no problem
midnight sinew
Thanks so much!
feral flower
@midnight sinew I've got some screenshots if you like.
midnight sinew
Ah thank you but Madigan's provided them all via source code, but I appreciate it!
feral flower
All right.
trim rock
I especially like the rodent one because at the time it seemed like a random joke only for it to turn out that no, that's actually what the final area is like
grizzled zinc
Hi guys! Did anyone complete the favors of Aphrodite and Zeus? I somehow can't make any progress with their relationships. By now, I have completed every favor, except for theirs, and it frustrates me quite a lot.
According to wiki: "Aphrodite's favor requires Zagreus to illustrate his capacity for love, both platonically and passionately, by forging bonds with Dusa and either Thanatos or Megaera (or all three)."
I had forged bonds with all three and even had conversations with Aphrodite about all of the relationships. Still, no favor completed.
According to wiki: "Zeus' favor involves hearing the other Gods' opinions of him, as well as seeing Zeus express a desire to reconnect with Hades, along with Hades' response."
I had herd the Hades' response like 20-30 runs ago. Still, no favor completed.
drifting citrus
Aphrodite
although there was supposed to be a fix to a bug (aphrodite's favor wouldn't advance) this update, there's still been reports of people who can't unlock her hearts. you might be one of them
Zeus
you know when you pick up a boon and they have a line commenting on a god you've already gotten that run? you need all of those about zeus
open berry
yeah sorry expanding on specifics for whats needed unlocking 
has been on my to do list for a while but i've been unable to get around to it @grizzled zinc if you want the exact dialogue for zeus i have them haphazardly thrown here https://hades.gamepedia.com/User:Bereou/Sandbox
the original comment on the page for unlocking zeus was incorrect so i tried to adjust it to more accurately point out that you need to collect varying rumours about zeus from other gods. don't focus on the hades part, that only a small portion of what's required
grizzled zinc
Oh, I see. Thank you!
open berry
there is some important demeter dialogue needed as well so if you're having trouble with it my guess is you're probably still missing one of their duo convos maybe
grizzled zinc
Hm... I'm not sure, as I've already received that Duo. Not sure if the convo started with Zeus though. I kinda assumed that after a hundred runs I had already got all of the remarks about Zeus, but I'll try to farm them again as well as the Duo one. Thank you!
open berry
there is not just one duo convo
zeus and demeter have two different ones for the same duo
you need them both
many duos have two different convos between the gods, where one initiates, and then the other initiates the second convo
so if you've gotten, say, the one that demeter initiates, then target zeus and try getting the one that he initiates. same duo boon, different convos
i've found that a lot of people dont realize the duo boons can have multiple interactions, though i dont think there is any more than two for most? of them
its definitely my goal to clarify these things before 1.0 drops but its a matter of finding time and motivation 
grizzled zinc
I see. I did assume that, since they often have this ABA dialogue structure, there are two variants, depending on the god whose boon you pick up, when getting the duo. And they often have such a nice comedic vibe to them))
Making detailed explanations of these things seems daunting as hell) Still, thank you for what's available. All of the info has been a huge help!
dense sparrow
he deserve it, much as Alecto deserve more love, but the same as her, he doesnt get it
open berry
what 
atomic forge
man
i triggered the charon fight for the first time
but i had +56% damage taken from chaos
i didnt realize what would happen
unkempt sapphire
ooooof yeah charon hits hard
atomic forge
charon instantly reacting to taking the gold cracked me up
i thought it was going to be a loan
cause it said borrow
lmao
open berry
it didnt say borrow, it said "borrow" with quotes
the quotes should be an indication something will happen lol
atomic forge
i dont read!! 😔
grizzled zinc
The first time I took his money I was like: "Is he gonna kill me? Is he gonna kill me?" [I take the money and get transported to Erebus]. "Now This is a Part Where He Kills Me!"
open berry
zag actually says thats how they bond
than comments about it too
fighting charon isnt supposed to be seen as a negative, relationship wise
atomic forge
if you kill him does he disappear for the rest of the run or something
grizzled zinc
@atomic forge You better see it for yourself
atomic forge
ha okay
open tiger
(if you really want to know, obviously we can tell you--but it is fun to find out for yourself)
open tiger
about 22% for the bag to show up in every mid-biome shop
atomic forge
that was my first in ~23 hours of gameplay
open tiger
ah, it doesn't show up until you've beaten the final boss
atomic forge
oh idk how long i had him cleared
grizzled zinc
The first time it showed for me was right after beating the Final Boss. The second time... 5-6 runs later)
grizzled zinc
Do you guys know which female demi-god is Demeter talking about?
https://imgur.com/a/vDgNvMc
atomic forge
I honestly don't know
in greek myth I believe her only daughters are ||persephone|| and despiona, and their fathers were not mortals
open tiger
she is referring to || Persephone, who in this game has a mortal father ||
grizzled zinc
@open tiger Whoa, thank you. ||I thought the fact that gods in the game think that a goddess is dead was pretty weird!||
grizzled zinc
Btw, there's this dialogue before the Theseus fight, where Zagreus proposes Asterius to fight alongside him. I think I've just had this exact experience))) All it took is an Aphrodite's Call and Smoldering Air. You recharge your Call faster than the Charm effect expires, hehehe)
brazen parrot
I just recently got past the last boss for the first time and ... am abit confused about that ending.
Why do we get "clobbered" story-wise regardless?
Is that just a placeholder for after 1.0 or was there some reason for that happening I missed alongside the travel or will it be explained later on, given enough follow-up attempts?
atomic forge
It's a placeholder for 1.0
however as you know the endgame is still in the underworld
so no one knows how 1.0 will resolve this
im guessing that after the real ending there is something that convinces zagreus to go back
brazen parrot
Alright. Good to know.
I feared I missed some story-explanation about that.^^
Indeed curious then how that then will be resolved in 1.0.
Maybe ...
||"Zagreus stepped into the overworld and saw all people with masks and the Coronavirus around and was like 'nope, gotta rebuild the lounge first'."||
atomic forge
lol
atomic forge
there are still things to be revealed as you keep going
grizzled zinc
Maybe Zagreus will need ||the power of friendship|| to get to the true ending? (:
brazen parrot
On another note, we indeed do not know when exactly the game takes place ... just because it is with Greek mythology doesn't exclude it takes place in 2029 when Terminators wreck the earth.
The underworld is ever busy.
(Going by how characters mention that there are a lot of souls coming in lately.)
atomic forge
||There's a canon reason for that already||
brazen parrot
Oh, there is?
||Is it later in the game, due to more character interactions? I can't recall someone mentioning the precise reason for that.||
brazen parrot
Alright. I wait for that then.
Thanks for not spoilering :)
(Although this of course is a spoiler-y chat by the nature of its naming ^^")
obtuse wasp
okay i'll do it in here i guess. should i be maining a single weapon to get past Final Boss Round 2?
I'm at least getting there regularly, but i keep rotating weapons based on that darkness boost
its just frustrating
normal kiln
if you’re getting there regularly it’s probably only a matter of time before you start winning, regardless of weapon
drifting citrus
if you haven't tried it yet, it might be worth your while
thorn compass
grizzled zinc
@brazen parrot There's an Ares' Rail dialogue in which he says that he wonders what warfare will be like should mortals uncover the secrets of the Rail. So, most likely, the game takes place before 16th century or something
atomic forge
Also the Aspect of Guan Yu. He fought in the 3rd century. So its probably before that as well. I just assume its vague greek times with little historical reference. After all its entirely myth-based
grizzled zinc
Oh yeah! Completely forgot about the aspects conversations!
brazen parrot
Of course, it's just a fun little mind game to kind of backtrack the train of thoughts that went into the game :)
But those two are interesting interesting points. Not sure about Guan Yu, since I didn't use that aspect yet.
And "secrets of the rail" maybe also mean the neverending ammunition and capability to shoot and throw grenades at the same time 
fallen prairie
From whatever dialogue I've heard/read, the game is set at a time ||when it's like an Ice Age outside, according to what Demeter said and due to there being an 'eternal winter' oustide also there's a huge war on the surface, according to what Ares said.||
molten badge
how do i unlock the hidden aspect for stygius?
grizzled zinc
@molten badge Wait for the hidden Spear aspect, invest 5 titan blood in Stygius and wait
molten badge
thanks
open berry
For future reference how to unlock aspects is pinned to this channel. you can just direct people to the pins
austere crane
@open berry I’m toying with the idea that all the other aspects were held by figures who either partially failed in their tasks or died in pursuit of their ultimate goal. Arthur is murdered by Mordred, Guan Yu is executed by Sun Quan and later deified, Beowulf dies slaying the dragon, Lucifer fails to overthrow heaven and is cast down. Rama is the tough one in my short period of research, but some accounts say he either gave up his avatar willingly or ended his life for other reasons, usually near a river.
That would link to Zag dying repeatedly while trying to reach the surface. Maybe the weapons like wielders they know will pay any cost to succeed. Mostly though, I think the link is that the legendary aspects are not Greek and usually from different time periods to Zag, everything else might be a bit more sketchy and indeed overcomplicating it haha. We’ll see when the final aspect gets released
open berry
well the thing we are in agreement with is that whatever the theme is here, it connects with zag in some manner. something related to zagreus, and either the gameplay loop as you pointed out, or maybe varying aspects of his life, personality or something, that would tie the aspects directly in with the story rather than just being random neat choices. there's definitely a deliberate choice behind what we got, the trouble is just figuring out what that intent was. but for sure it has to tie back in with zag, as the fates themselves are ensuring zag receives the waking phrases and unlocks the aspects
the only one thats felt obvious to me in terms of theming and connection with zag is luci lmao. the others are less clear to me
obtuse wasp
small side note: i think the acorn from eurydice and the artemis call were big helps just now 👍
mint flicker
For aspect of guan yu do i need to get five aspects over all weapons or into varatha
sudden tulip
There are only 3 in varatha so... over all weapons I'd assume
mint flicker
by all into varatha i meant 5 upgrades total
sudden tulip
According to the pin, you need to get 5 aspects
so the level of the aspect shouldn't matter
open tiger
correct
whole path
@brazen parrot its a place holder, its been happening since the start of early access when you reached the end
granite gale
it took me soo many runs just to get hades killed or so i though only to find out he has a freaking second stage what the heck he's already crazy hard what's with this second stage bs sorry for complaining i enjoy this game but seriously it took me soo long to get his first stage down i don't know if i can get good enough to beat the second stage
posting here because its apparently spoiler
stark raven
I'll be honest: I had to use god mode to beat him.
The same thing happened to me, didn't know he had a second phase and I got rekt ahahha
dusty matrix
Can't wait to get stomped by EM4
atomic forge
it is comical
how bad i am
at killing hades
entire run is a breeze, maybe theseus will pop a defiance
hades. god awful at avoiding damage
mystic mortar
theseus is scarier than daddy tbh
atomic forge
he's better because he hardly moves
acoustic loom
does god mode disable the boss rewards? never used it
open berry
it does not
all god mode is is further difficulty adjustment that you can turn on and off at any point
glad stag
Hello all.. I have a few questions.
atomic forge
hi
open tiger
hello!
glad stag
So, I've been going through the process of getting "Bonds" and unlocking Companions..
I have not been able to unlock Sisyphus at all.. I have given him as much Nectar as I can, and have yet to be prompted to do his favor.
open tiger
You also need to talk to || Nyx ||
glad stag
I have.
open tiger
Have you || gotten her at least to her lock ||?
glad stag
I mean, it's been several (dozens?) of runs.
I have.. I am at the point now where I need to do her favor.
(I am saving up darkness atm)
open tiger
You also need to talk to || Meg and Hades (Hades only has one dialogue about it) ||, have you done that?
glad stag
I talk to everyone before and after every run.
I do not remember specifically if anything was said on that topic by those characters.
I'm just wondering if I'm missing a trigger that I am unaware of.
open tiger
Figured xD I did the same
There are a few dialogues between Meg and Sisy?
glad stag
I have seen some of those yes.
Like, when she's scolding him. I have got to the point where (how do I add spoiler tags?)
open tiger
Then I think you should have all of it--if it's been a few runs now, I'd 
|| like this ||
glad stag
|| I have seen Meg tell Sis that she's going to lay off of him ||
open tiger
What you can do is include your discord tag on the bug report, and ask if you're missing anything--if one of the devs has the chance, they might ping you if you're missing something
glad stag
|| Than has been harping on him though ||
open tiger
Hmm, don't remember exactly what all the required dialogues are. Lemme double-check the wiki real quick
Doesn't look like || Than's || dialogue is required
glad stag
The other thing I wanted to ask about, was the Fated Prophecy for the Bow.. For some reason I cannot find the last Daedalus upgrade.
open tiger
which one are you missing?
glad stag
I was wondering if maybe || Than || needs to be talked to before the trigger for Sis
Uhm.. 1 sec
open tiger
Nope, || Than || is not directly involved with Sis
glad stag
Ok good.
Maybe it just hasn't happened yet due to a lot of other triggers being dealt with
Charged Volley
open tiger
possible. If it takes much longer, might want to . The main thing is if you're not getting any more ! dialogue from Nyx for a few runs
glad stag
done 83 attempts, and I've used the Bow 15 times.. which is actually more than it took me to get most of the others
open tiger
For Charged Volley, make sure you're not using Chiron or taking Relentless Volley
That was the last one for me as well >.>
glad stag
I hate the bow and ideally would like to stop using it
heh
I am at the stage where I am trying to get bonds with everyone.. Do Bonds with the Olympian Gods do anything?
glad stag
Gotcha.. I was thinking maybe they unlocked their Legendaries or something
open tiger
nope, those are unlocked from the start
it's even possible to get them during the very first run
glad stag
Interesting. Most Gods I need like 1-2 more Boons from to have them fully done in the Fated Prophecy's.. Maybe after I save up a bunch of darkness for Nyx I'll start unlocking the rerolls, and equip the high % for Legendaries
It was just coincidence then... When I bonded with Poseidon, right after that dialogue he gave me a Legendary
dusty matrix
RNG does whatever it wants 
glad stag
Yeah
Do you have to unlock the Companions in any specific order, or must you have X before you can have Y?
open tiger
no order
glad stag
K.. Cool. I was just wondering if maybe Sis was hard locked to be last or something
dusty matrix
Although, there is dialogue that has priority
so it may take a bit for some
I think Sis was my first or second actually lol...
glad stag
Understandable. Basically just making sure there's nothing wrong. I don't mind being patient.
Funny. Dusa was my first. 🙂
Is there any consensus on what the "Best" Companion is?
dusty matrix
Personal preference, but I like Shady best, quick heals and damage also works on Redacted
dusty matrix
Oh yeah Sis
viscid fjord
Yup yup the all powerful Boulder
glad stag
Gotcha.
dusty matrix
Boyo is my second favorite
glad stag
Dusa is nice in the meantime.. Not big damage numbers but she is consistent in that she doesn't require any aim and can do decent damage output. Haven't tried Boyo yet.
viscid fjord
Sis is my go to companion. The bonus healing and being able to use it on any boss is very nice
dusty matrix
Boyo is the only other one that works on Redacted if I recall
viscid fjord
I thought none of them did except sis
glad stag
Does Skel do decent damage?
dusty matrix
Opposite, Boyo does work as the bait
glad stag
Gotcha
dusty matrix
Spawns in with ~250 hp?
viscid fjord
Skele can't be used on charron though
glad stag
Question about romances.. Are you considered "in a romance" once you reach the cupid bow/arrow, or only after you fill up their hearts?
dusty matrix
Oh really?
I guess that makes sense
Charon probably the method in which Skele is contracted
viscid fjord
Yeah just checked the wiki. The fury companion can't be used on fury or final boss, thanatos companion cant be used on thantos or final boss, dusa cant be used on final boss, skelly cant be used on final boss, Achilles cant be used on final boss, and sis can be used anywhere
viscid fjord
Sorry meant skeleton cant be used on charron
dusty matrix
Oh yeah
viscid fjord
He can be used on final boss
Sis and skele only on final boss but sis can be used anywhere. Everything else has some restriction
glad stag
Makes sense from a lore perspective.
viscid fjord
Yeah I do enjoy that. Though thats the main reason why I only use the sis compaion besides the nice heal and alright damage I just like having the option to use it anywhere
viscid fjord
Yeah my second companion if somebody told me not to use sis would be Achilles though
dusty matrix
Achilles is solid
viscid fjord
Its very fast so landing the 2 hits can be pretty easy. Not amazing on ads but good on miniboss or boss rooms cause you jusy want to kill 1 or 2 things
dusty matrix
And who doesn't want the dynamic duo
sonic glen
than is the one I use most times
3.5k damage on theseus? yes, please
he also hits like half the arena, so
static cedar
almost never manages to hit EM3 Theseus, tho, sadly
vapid parcel
em3 is when i use antos bc they can hit them and there's funny interactions
normal kiln
I wait until theseus phases and then drop it as soon as he leaves invincibility
he always opens with calling the gods in phase 2, and he has to stand still for that so it hits every time
Than, that is
Catching Asterius as well is a little trickier
open berry
people remember to use companions? 😳
stark raven
I usually remember because I'm like "ok it's been 5 minutes since I last saw Than" so I'm not sure I count
glossy prism
I end up getting to hades with all 5 charges still there sometimes
dusty matrix
I usually need to use a charge on Theseus/Asterius, as I lose all my DDs there
glad stag
Depends on my build.
atomic forge
How do I get the Beowulf aspect?
fervent skiff
primal cipher
I've just got back into the game again but I've finished all of the bounties and skelly statues
I'm not sure what to do now, I'm still having fun but without in-game incentives I don't want to burn out
stark raven
Has someone beat 57 heat?
neon ibex
@stark raven SAME. Reason why I use the Than companion. Im too forgetful for the other companions mostly.
stark raven
You 🤝 Me
Loving Than
neon ibex
Same wavelength, same wavelength~
fierce tendon
And here's me who's never gone above 20 Heat
mystic mortar
D A D D Y
Few tales are told of Daddy, whose very name inspires fear and penitence, reminding us of the inevitable fate which we all share.
I, however, mean to tell you such a tale. Listen, carefully...
mint flicker
What are skelly's prizes?
mint flicker
Preciate
mint flicker
@open tiger how do i unlock them? i checked the corner out but theres nothing there
open tiger
Interact with the items there--Skelly should tell you something about them
(there are 3 tall objects)
mint flicker
theres nothing there at all?
open tiger
the very bottom of the courtyard?
I guess bottom right was a bit unclear, apologies for that
they're just to the left of the starting doorway
mint flicker
nothin just three empty plates like there were for the weapons
open tiger
..can you drop a screenshot? Upload it to something like imgur and send the link here
mint flicker
the channel isnt letting me drop a SS ill DM
open tiger
that's why I said a link, but that also works
so that others can see it:
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/752988439938596966/752988498994266233/20200908152408_1.jpg?width=965&height=543
mint flicker
i only need to beat redacted once right? or do i need to with every weapon
open tiger
just once should be enough
stark raven
I was thinking, is it mentioned why Hypnos decided to help Zagreus with the whole put-the-entire-house-to-sleep? I mean I don't remember anything that mentions why Hypnos decided to go with it
open berry
it's literally never brought up again
which I feel like is a fairly significant hole in the earlier narrative, considering it's part of what starts zag's quest in the first place. and given zag doesn't particularly have a close bond with hypnos to start with, what reason is there to do something like literally putting the house to sleep so zag may rummage through his father's paperwork
not sure if 1.0 will address this or if we're supposed to be led to believe hypnos just does it for funzies despite the repercussions one should receive from hades for such a stunt lol
stark raven
I hope it will get mentioned somehow ;;
It's a bit of a stretch if he did it for fun imo, it's literally a "Ah yes I'm going to put the whole house to sleep, your father included, so you can search in his paperworks. I'm going to get punished for it but whatever let's do it"
It makes no sense to me
open berry
like I know I have established myself as biased towards hypnos but even still the new dialogue in blood price establishes that zag is meanspirited towards hypnos for no reason, so you can't even say they had a close enough bond prior to that for hypnos to see it as doing zag a favour
and iunno, given how hades is and his temper, I feel like we should have heard about his irritation from that, at the very least. you don't just put the god of the dead to sleep and nothing comes of that. in myth zeus came after hypnos for forcing him to sleep
stark raven
Maybe he lost a bet? But yeah at least we should have heard of Hades rage or something
Well, can't do much but wait and hope
final temple
so what is the time heart thing for hades...what is it waiting for to progress?
open tiger
that means it's not been added yet
open berry
this one?
open berry
yeah its what swan said. if its this one then you need to initiate some sort of quest or do a specific action to proceed
final temple
yeah i'm pretty far with everyone and had all weapons unlocked and lvld. just usually try not to look up as much as possible
the time thing is great to know though ha
mint flicker
what is Cerberus' locked event
open berry
literally just ||keep petting him||
mint flicker
damn i wasnt doing enough of that then i do it every chance i get
feral flower
I didn't know about it.
I just pet Cerberus each time I talked to him.
Because he's a good boy boy boy.
mint flicker
he is truly a good boy but there is one better boy and that is solo
mint flicker
so are my skelly prizes bugged or did i not do something
open tiger
I'm guessing it's bugged, maybe verify game files?
foggy bone
So I just had an interesting coincidence that might be intentional. I just completed my last weapon's 20 Heat run and celebrated by having a surprise threesome with Than and Meg awaiting me in my chambers. Was that a coincidence?
open tiger
yup
foggy bone
Wow, lucky me
open tiger
yup lol
crystal raven
Maybe Hypnos puts the entire house to sleep often - it's not like Zag would know, as he'd also be asleep. So maybe it's a low risk option for him
idle lake
I hope Hades' final lore pieces won't be locked under enormous amount of heat levels
fierce tendon
Same
If anything is locked behind Heat, I hope it's only behind EM4 and nothing else, or give the final boss their own separate EM like how Snake Oil used to be separate
mint flicker
Verified game files and nothing for skelly's prizes
do i need to beat redacted on higher heat?
open berry
Uhm yes..? you need to do 8, 16 and 32 heat
mint flicker
i was asuming there would be something there saying like hey beat it on this heat lvl
open berry
there's a prophecy for it but I don't recall what it says since climbing heat doesn't interest me so I haven't really thought about the statues in a hot minute
mint flicker
the prophecy just says earn the first of skelly's prizes
open berry
I'm not aware of what your issue is but the required heat are specific levels and you should be able to interact with the statues immediately upon finishing required heat from my experience
mint flicker
there arent any statues tho
open berry
Have you finished 8 heat
mint flicker
no only 7
open berry
Then that's why
I just said they're at 8, 16, 32
That's required, you won't get them at any lower heat
finish 8 and see if the first one pops up
crimson temple
Even before then, there should be three draped objects in the courtyard that are interactable (one of them will shake and display the necessary heat).
open berry
will it show the heat? that's probably how everyone knows LOL I've probably seen that and forgot
open berry
You do get a bonus for it so it's not wasted at least
royal coyote
Oh I do?
Neat, did not know that haha
I'm playing on God mode so I cna get the story cause it's great
mystic mortar
sometimes he even gives you the ultimate bonus
12% ambiguity
royal coyote
But is there a story thing for giving Bouldy nectar?
royal coyote
Mmm
normal kiln
last run i found sisyphus but i didn’t have any nectar left to give to bouldy, as i had spent it all on diamonds
i felt awful
pls forgive me bouldy
open berry
achieve spoilers: ||hey supergiant if this doesnt end up being an ares icon im going to be sad https://gyazo.com/d487bf0912ab9a97cddb1226fb037ca6||
stark raven
I can't wait to have a Thanatos icon in my achievement showcase
open berry
well at the very least im 99.99% positive theres gonna be a than trading card
open berry
hmm bastion and transistor had 5 cards, pyre had 8. they might cap out hades 8-10? my guess is its gonna be house npcs. much as i want cards of the gods for obvious reasons, at the same time badges with a ton of cards are a pain.......
maybe there will be a background with all the olympians or smth 
stark raven
oof yeah, I usually craft badges with only 5/6 cards
but for Hades I'll deal with whatever number they choose
open berry
maybe there will be a hypnos, i want a foil hypnos 
azure needle
can someone like, dm me a pic of the achievement descriptions
open berry
foils are rare but i tend to buy a lot of packs for specific series sometimes. a couple months ago i got foils two days in a row from packs i made lul
stark raven
Ohh I see 👀
I got a foil only once in my entire life, but it was for a game I didn't play much and sold it
Never bought packs tho, how do they work?
supple dagger
I don't think I ever really got a foil the usual "rando Steam drop" way. I've only gotten them through the marketplace.
open berry
if anyone lists packs after those drop, depending on price some of yall might catch me in your market transactions LOL
atomic forge
Ok can someone tell me how to reunite orpheus and eurydice
i have the prophecy. nyx told me it's involved with the admin chambers. i go in there and cant interact with anything other than the normal statistic stuff. what am i missing?
stark raven
||Go where you make renovations, you should find the contract there||
atomic forge
dont have any new contracts
open tiger
@atomic forge do a run or two, that's how the game updates story quest lines
atomic forge
I did one run but not two i guess i will try again
primal cipher
Wait, we've got steam achievements now?
open tiger
they're testing them
not functional yet
scroll up just a little bit in #h1-discussion , I reshared the reddit link where Greg talked about it
primal cipher
Oh ok, thanks
upbeat willow
the link is also in #h1-tech-support if you can't find it in #h1-discussion
crystal raven
Do we think all of the achievements listed are all that there will be?
open tiger
no idea
crystal raven
Presumably they can add more in once it's live. They seem kind of... tame
open tiger
¯_(ツ)_/¯
crystal raven
And I also don't suppose we know if the achievements apply retroactively or not
open tiger
no idea--though I imagine some of them will, by checking against the Prophecy List
some of them, like || getting 30% on the plume ||, might be a bit harder to do retroactively
crimson temple
Either checking against the list, or the codex, I guess (||looking at the fishing achievement||)
Or against the admin chamber records, even.
pure belfry
Greg made a comment about retroactive achievements in the reddit https://www.reddit.com/r/HadesTheGame/comments/ippmyv/i_thought_achievements_werent_supposed_to_be/g4m0ru3/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
crimson temple
I don't see anything really nailbitingly hard among the bunch. But I'd also wager that the list is only preliminary, and further achievements could be added to it.
open tiger
One thing I do remember them mentioning (and I'm paraphrasing as best as I can recall) is that they didn't want to have any official achievements be super challenging, since they didn't want to put pressure on people who want to collect all of the achievements for a game.
crimson temple
That's fine by me.
||What I feel is missing are a few of the more interesting run clear messages. Like Souvla Snacker||
crimson temple
Be that as it may, it's a nice selection and I'm looking forward to gathering all of them.
crystal raven
I've been playing some Necrodancer and have long gotten used to the fact I will not gain a whole bunch of achievements
prime mulch
the ending achivement called "one for the ages", wat does that mean?
fierce tendon
That the story will be one for the ages?
fervent skiff
I've been playing some Necrodancer and have long gotten used to the fact I will not gain a whole bunch of achievements
@crystal raven I completely feel you dude. Necrodancer's achievements are an absolutely pain to get
open berry
@crystal raven they mentioned achieves in last qa btw #ask-supergiant message
the important note is they didn't want to do super difficult achievements
as swan previously noted lol
@open tiger next time just in:ask-supergiant achievements or smth to find it
open berry
lmao it might be one I have muted bc I haven't seen
open tiger
#h1-discussion , but it was several hours ago
open berry
well! that's not muted but I am simply oblivious
anyway I'm excited to 100% hades hehe
open berry
I honestly can't be bothered with the other games admittedly. I think the only one for hades I'll have to make an effort with is than's, I'm not sure what the highest bonus I've gotten
I just do not have attention span anymore to devote to completing everything in games lmao those days are long past
I can't pull up steam rn, was there even one for all of skelly's prizes? I feel like I only saw the first two
frozen jolt
Just the first two
open berry
that's what I thought I saw. kinda weird, I was definitely expecting all three relieving though, I won't have to put myself through 32 heat lul
frozen jolt
Oh for sure, I was hoping there wouldn’t be an achievement for it lol
stark raven
oof ye I'm glad there is no 32 heat, I haven't gotten the first prize yet
open tiger
Makes sense—32 is definitely getting into the challenging range
Only reason I have it is because of an insanely good 40-heat that I managed to clutch out of nowhere lol
open berry
I've really only played up to 20. I've tried 30+ but I wasn't really having fun with it
open tiger
I was shaking like mad after I finished, not doing that again for a bit
open berry
I figured it would still be reasonable to expect all three prizes as a high difficulty achievement but I am glad the third one isn't there LOL
normal kiln
i keep throwing myself at 40 and it’s got to a point where it’s weirdly relaxing
like, i’m nowhere close to winning but there’s just something satisfying about how much stuff is happening at once
mystic mortar
lol same
accept dying
normal kiln
big agree
stark raven
The first 2 are 8 and 16 right?
normal kiln
yeah
stark raven
What is the easiest pact combo to get the 16 one?
I've only played extreme measures, the one that lets enemies ignore one attack, and the +20% spawn rate
drifting citrus
try at least 1 rank each of forced overtime and tight deadline
frozen jolt
I recommend getting used to forced overtime 2, since it’s worth a lot of heat and once you get used to it it’s like playing the game normally
normal kiln
turning FO on early and using it consistently is a good idea if you’re planning to push high long term, but if you only want to beat 16 i’m not sure it’s the easiest
open tiger
The top 5 or so (other than LC) don't add too much at 1 rank, and I can usually get away with two ranks of HL and be fine
stark raven
I see, thank you! I'll try those then
normal kiln
also some people run fast enough that TD is basically free
stark raven
turning FO on early and using it consistently is a good idea if you’re planning to push high long term, but if you only want to beat 16 i’m not sure it’s the easiest
@normal kiln I think I'll try to get 32 for the sake of completition, but for now I'll fly "low" and try to reach 8 and 16 first
normal kiln
i am not one of them, lol
but if you are you should defs use it
in that case getting used to FO is probably a good idea
mystic mortar
I wouldn't say it's the easiest, but my 16 heat build is TD2, FO2 and EM3
stark raven
mmmmm depending on the weapon I can be fast or super slow
I wouldn't say it's the easiest, but my 16 heat build is TD2, FO2 and EM3
@mystic mortar Gonna write this down, thanks 👀
open tiger
Oh yeah, EM3 good to get used to
open berry
Tight deadline stresses me out
normal kiln
same
sudden tulip
That's like the worst possible 16 heat if you want to win, but the best possible conditions to practice for higher heat
mystic mortar
EM3 was my first heat because it looked like it would be fun, and then I turned on FO2 and TD2 because they also looked fun
open tiger
1 and 2 are kinda tame imo, 3 changes the most, and 2 and 3 require you to play the most differently
mystic mortar
I make decisions for fun instead of ease
open tiger
Not gonna say anything more than that if you haven't done them ^.^
stark raven
EM are def more fun!
sudden tulip
EM3 is not fun with fists
open berry
me, running em3 with fists all the time: whoops
frozen jolt
I’m avoiding EM3 since I play almost exclusively with fists and it was not a fun time the one time I tried it
frozen jolt
It’s very tough compared to the other two, and they’re not exactly easy either
normal kiln
you’re absolutely right, tho
open berry
the way I play games tends to come down to 'recklessly throw yourself into danger and smash your head into the wall until it works' and maybe that's why I like ares and the fists so much
stark raven
the way I play games tends to come down to 'recklessly throw yourself into danger and smash your head into the wall until it works' and maybe that's why I like ares and the fists so much
@open berry big mood
normal kiln
depending on build em3 champions can be harder than hades
open berry
but mostly I just love hearing theseus laughing like a maniac, it brings me joy
mystic mortar
depending on build champions can be harder than EM3 champions
normal kiln
ares doesn’t encourage recklessness, tho? not for me, anyway
sudden tulip
i've gotten used to hades, and the attacks are honestly easier to dodge than EM3 on any build
open berry
Oh let me clarify, I don't mean sgg ares specifically but ares in general
normal kiln
i like him cause he works with my play style of “tickle the enemy then run away and hope it dies of natural causes”
oh fair
sudden tulip
more like tickle and then divine dash into them and repeat with merciful end
normal kiln
oh man
i had like 10 chances to get merciful end today and it just wouldn’t come up
i’m still angry
stark raven
YOU get doom, YOU get doom, EVERYONE GETS DOOM
open berry
ares is one of my fav olympians in mythos in general :v but yes I do love sgg ares too even if he's not my fav boon giver
sudden tulip
just ignore all other gods and only go for athena and ares
for the duo
who needs other gods anyway
sudden tulip
yeah it happens
normal kiln
yeah
sudden tulip
whats worse is getting merciful end in tartarus and then having to sell the ares/athena boons you got because UC
open berry
woof.. ..
normal kiln
oh no
that’d be the worst lol
UC is such a shot in the dark
sometimes it’s basically free, and sometimes it will not leave your build alone
sudden tulip
i pity the people who use fated authority
sudden tulip
^me when i realised the ways of stubborn defiance
open tiger
UC is free heat for a boonless run 👀
normal kiln
🤔
sudden tulip
shattered shackles ftw
open tiger
That change made it so much easier lmao
mystic mortar
new shackles make boonless runs a lot less impressive than they used to be imo
they're still fun tho
normal kiln
i wanna switch to SD but it would require me learning to not lose 2-6 DDs to champions
yes i know you can’t have 6, therein lies the problem
open tiger
Hey, 16 heat boonless is still pretty hard
open berry
I actually use shackles now after the change
frozen jolt
You can have 6 if you get 2 defiances from chaos, no?
sudden tulip
i use SD for guan yu, medium heat fists and 20+ heat anything
normal kiln
wait you can get the chaos legendary twice?
huh
guess there’s no reason why not, tho it’s be unlikely
sudden tulip
if you pray to rngesus chaos
frozen jolt
I think it’s possible, I think I’ve seen someone post it before if I’m not wrong
but who knows
azure needle
you can't get non-chaos boons more than once right, even ones like sunken treasure
normal kiln
i dunno about sunken treasure specifically, but you definitely can’t normally
open tiger
I think you can get ST more than once
normal kiln
but chaos don’t follow no rules
azure needle
yeah obviously not standard ones
sudden tulip
By the way is it just me or do poms always show the same set of boons twice/thrice
open tiger
Just RNG, afaik
normal kiln
what, you mean if you reroll them?
sudden tulip
no
i find one pom, upgrade something from the set of 3
find another pom, and i find the same set of 3
open berry
that's what the poms want you to think
stark raven
e v i l p o m s
normal kiln
yeah okay so that’s been bugging me
evil poms
i’m not a big greek myth buff, but iirc persephone was trapped in hades because she ate a pomegranate
so if pomegranates trap you in the underworld, why are we eating them to try to help us escape?
i’m becoming convinced that there is a pomegranate conspiracy at work
stark raven
That's what I've been wondering too
mystic mortar
lol
the poms we eat are from olympus, not the garden in Dad's backyard
fierce tendon
Well, Persephone wasn't a cthonic god, it wasn't the pomegranates as such but the fact she ate the fruit of the underworld
mystic mortar
supposedly
fierce tendon
It's a similar rule in some fairy tales, where eating fairy's food has dire consequences
mystic mortar
also, if you'll look at the codex, darkness appears to be a much bigger problem than the poms
mystic mortar
the narrator, the gods, and Zag all say that they're from the gods
normal kiln
like i said, a conspiracy
fierce tendon
The fact they taste "zesty" and not bitter and like condensed parental disappointment
mystic mortar
LUL
normal kiln
The fact they taste "zesty" and not bitter and like condensed parental disappointment
this is, admittedly, an extremely good counterargument
open berry
I like how I made a hehe funni joke and come back to conspiracy theories
normal kiln
see, nobody liked my theory that bouldy is actually persephone in disguise either
but like, it all makes sense
(none of this makes sense)
bold niche
everything can make sense if you have enough will to believe
normal kiln
hmm good point
stark raven
see, nobody liked my theory that bouldy is actually persephone in disguise either
@normal kiln I didn't know about this one, please enlighten me
stark raven
Imma grab a cup of tea then
normal kiln
bouldy is secretly persephone
in a disguise
that’s it
extremely sophisticated
Imma grab a cup of tea then
oh no
now i feel like a need something more substantial
open tiger
No no, that was plenty substantial
open tiger
Ooh
stark raven
It all makes sense
normal kiln
um, so, think about it: it’s winter outside (as we know from demeter) and persephone has to be in the underworld when it’s winter. Plus, we know she’s been shrouded in darkness by Nyx, and Nyx works mostly in the underworld (citation needed).
Also, Hades doesn’t leave the underworld (citation needed) so why does he turn up to fight you outside? He could do it inside the door if he wanted. And the narrator explicitly states that cerberus still treats Hades as his true master, even if he has a soft spot for Zag. If that’s true, would the doggo really let you leave? And Hades like to say on occasion that you’ll never escape, even after you’ve beaten him multiple times.
Anyway, so I propose when you think you’ve reached the surface, you’ve actually like, looped around into the back entrance of the underworld or something
You’ve never really left, and persephone never really left. She’s been hiding in plain sight as bouldy.
Or something
thanks for coming to my ted talk
That's why you can give Bouldy infinite nectar
this is a way better argument scratch everything i just said
normal kiln
that’s lucky, considering i was making it up on the spot lol
um, no whoops i mean it’s based on rigorous research
open tiger
Oh of course!
normal kiln
nods seriously
pastel raptor
hey i´m posting this here because i don´t know where to post it else, but the Achivements are visible on steam and they might contain some spoilers
pastel raptor
ah ok
open berry
I think greg has noted on both they may contain spoilers, I for sure saw him mention it on steam
fierce tendon
He's still catching up with the news, he was at a big party last night. I mean, he's still at the same party but still
open berry
oh yeah I think that was one of the newer blood price lines lmao? There was a bunch of earl(ier) run dialogue that got added
just minding my business rampaging through the underworld and getting weird lines I should have been long past
open tiger
that dialogue can also be delayed for various reasons
I got a similar line from Meg recently
open berry
I'd have to double check when I'm home but I'm p sure it was blood price, I had exhausted dialogue prior to the update
I don't run if I don't have dialogue to chase after :v
open tiger
lol
sudden tulip
I got a similar line from Meg recently
yeah about elysium
and i usually hear "heard you made it all the way last time"
which...should come after the elysium dialogue i'd assume
open tiger
yeah, those are some of the dialogues that end up a bit disjointed if you clear fast, and they seem to be lower priority than other dialogues
open berry
checks my ares spreadsheet... honestly I think a few characters got run-related lines in blood price bc ares got at least 2
open tiger
neat
hushed pilot
Please don't tell me that I'll have to complete the game entirely again because of the achievements.
open tiger
nope
@hushed pilot https://www.reddit.com/r/HadesTheGame/comments/ippmyv/i_thought_achievements_werent_supposed_to_be/
hushed pilot
Oh, great.
[sigh of relief]
open tiger
@fair light Pardon the ping, but could you make a brief post in the #announcements channel about the Achievements showing up on Steam and being tested? That way people who just see them randomly pop up aren't confused ^.^"
fair light
Sure.
open tiger
Thank you!
open berry
we stan greg
that reminds me there was a thread I was looking at yesterday bc people were arguing over dumb stuff and greg popped in to remind everyone to be civil, and the op was like, I see you're a gentleman, that encourages me to support you
something to that effect
was kinda funny
the whole thread was dumb
open tiger
lol
primal cipher
Do people have a favourite god in the game? As in, no matter the build they'll flock to their boon
graceful quail
I like dementer in terms of personality and mostly for the "freeze to death!" Cool effect in bosses
But artemis is the kind of "extra damage, it just fit"
primal cipher
It's probably Artemis for me, the look of the abilities are great and it leads to some of my favourite duos. Athena is also fantastic but her later boons don't interest me as much (especially with some bosses being immune to reflect dmg)
bold niche
some gods are always nice.. some only goes with certain builds
like, Poseidon is fun when you have something like dash build
Ares and Artemis are always nice
bold niche
there were some runs when i didn't even use normal attacks sometimes
you just yeet bad guys around the room and that's it
primal cipher
ahah yeah, and a solid festive fog destroys any tight area
It's so satisfying to shock and freeze shade in a drunken mist
I think I beat the boss on one run basically just with that cast
open tiger
but have you beaten the boss with just dash?
open berry
points at my name
stark raven
About one of the messages in feedback: ||can someone spoil me the dialogue between Zag/Than/Meg when they do the funzies all together?||
open berry
uh I can look for it in a bit when I'm not being a potato
warm silo
I just paid 8888 of something for something but what do i do next? talk to nyx?
stark raven
uh I can look for it in a bit when I'm not being a potato
@open berry 👀 I'm very much interested, and being a potato is good
I just paid 8888 of something for something but what do i do next? talk to nyx?
@warm silo Yup
warm silo
Is there ever another way to spend diamonds after early game?
open tiger
The music player Jukebox
strong pilot
Can also turn them into Ambrosia at the Wretched Broker iirc
stark raven
very much correct
strong pilot
Which can be turned into Titan Blood
rancid jackal
i'm working on unlocking some 4th weapon aspects rn and i know guan yu is the prerequisite for that. i have the guan yu aspect revealed but do need to spend the titan blood for it to count or is revealing it enough to get access to the other 4th aspects?
open tiger
@rancid jackal check the pins here
rancid jackal
ty
open tiger
o7
wooden scaffold
hey guys how do i put the black spoilers text over stuff?
arctic rover
||type a message,highlight the text and press the eye||
cloud ember
you put this | twice in before and after the text you want to hide
or that
||lol||
arctic rover
eyup
arctic rover
see on my keyboard thats ~
open tiger
Weird
fierce tendon
I think it depends on what region the keyboard is set to
open tiger
I'm talking about the hardware, not the keyboard settings
fierce tendon
Yeah, the hardware has also been known to vary based on region. The main offenders being currency symbols
It's more uniform nowadays, but old keyboards were weird about this
open tiger
Mm, true
fierce tendon
Either way, in desktop you can right click to mark spoiler and on phone then | is easy enough to find in the symbols pages (second page is conventional I think)
wooden scaffold
So how do i set up the boss fight with ||Charon||?
I cant seen to get the opportunity to steal from his bag
fierce tendon
Can only be found in mid biome shops, never the shops before a boss
wooden scaffold
From any area?
fierce tendon
At which point there's a lowish chance to find said goodiebag
Any of Tartarus, Asphodel or Elysium
open tiger
22% chance in each mid-biome shop
final temple
how i unlock weapon aspects after buying weaps
frozen jolt
check the pins in this channel!
lofty lodge
||tristan - songs, some items from contractor and if you need exchange for ambrosia / titan blood||
summer sage
Does anyone know the exact step by step to unlocking Hypnos' favor? I have gotten thru to the conversation he has with Than where Than helps him make his lists and focus his work but cannot trigger the conversation after that. I have max hearts in Than and all hearts in Hypnos all the way up to his locked heart. I have finished multiple runs after that last conversation and I cannot trigger the event further.
open berry
it's a long chain of events
Just keep at it
there really no exact steps due to the nature of how dialogue progresses. I can tell you that you still have a few parts left
summer sage
ok. Thanks @open berry
open berry
have you had than show up in runs recently
summer sage
So that means if I keep just doing runs no specific boons or gods or anything, Than will just keep talking to Hypnos?
Yes
Multiple times and still cannot see him talking to hypnos
i even talked to him solo in the house one run and then came back and he was not talking to hypnos
open berry
has than had other dialogue related to other things at least
summer sage
That's why i was thinking man, its just been a while
yes he has
just random stuff though nothing major
open berry
the dialogue may have prioritized something else. there's really no way to force the event
summer sage
i have pretty much exhausted most of his major dialogue. I got him to max affection romance months ago
ok gotcha. then thats really all i needed to know it looks like. I'll keep churning out runs
Thanks so much @open berry
open berry
I do know that some parts of their event were locked behind 'you need to do a few more runs between these pieces of dialogue before the next section will trigger' so all I can say is keep trying runs
their quest is (imo) unnecessarily long lol
as far as I know though there's nothing specific you need to do other than continue runs and allowing it to progress, so if nothing is happening, keep trying
do come back if it's been some time and you still haven't seen progress, then something may be up and we can try and figure it out from there
summer sage
Awesome. Will do @open berry
lusty wasp
So you can get a painting that shows zag and than as babies. But shouldn’t death be much older than Persephone?
open berry
i think the portrait is just for fun, its not necessarily meant to reflect canon, especially seeing as there's plenty of dialogue hinting at basically everyone being way older than zag
visual terrace
Not sure where to post this so I'm reposting it here after #h1-discussion
Not sure if it's a bug but ||I've slept in my bed and roamed around while everyone was asleep. I discovered that Nyx is not my real mother, but after that scene there's no mention of that moment whatsoever. It's like it didn't happen at all.|| Is this normal?
feral flower
People will talk about it in some conversations.
But it doesn't come up all the time.
Also, that's the past.
It's a flashback.
visual terrace
Ooh. Thanks. I didn't get that it's a flashback at all. Thanks for that! Really helped.
I found it weird that ||Athena referenced Nyx being Zag's mom still|| though. 🤷♂️ But thanks for clearing it up for me.
atomic forge
the athena thing specifically is covered eventually
atomic forge
hey, can we have multiple relation with all the character(i mean with the ones like dusa meg ect) and if we can does it change something with the story or it's all ok?
open berry
theres no negative consequences, no
it impacts nothing whether you romance them all or turn everyone down
final temple
doing a hell mode play and have been trying to get bouldy pet have sisy full nectard out and have seen him like 12 times and still no quest. did i forget something?
open tiger
@final temple || Nyx ||?
final temple
i think shes too her lock heart as well. do i have to start chaos as well?
open tiger
Nope
You have the || Administrative Chamber ||? And there's a few dialogues between || Meg and Sis that you need to see ||
normal kiln
pretty sure you need to ||give bouldy nectar at least once|| as well
open tiger
don't think so
normal kiln
oh really? it happened for me straight after i did that, but i guess that was just chance
dawn crater
||Love the new Charon fight. I kinda laughed in his face the whole time with Aegis||
I was like, Free gold!.. and suddenly that happened
zenith flume
||is there a reason why theseus can invoke the gods power?||
feral flower
The gods want to grant him power.
Since he's a legendary hero and all.
That's pretty much it.
open berry
It's mentioned he's earned their favour
clear oracle
Although I do notice that the Gods whom Theseus invokes are never the same Gods that grant Zagreus his boons during the run.
open berry
yeah that's largely just gameplay related more than anything else
but earning favour with gods is significant, and it's why you get that subplot later with poseidon. as we all know if there's one major things the gods dished out punishment for, it's hubris lol
pale grail
do you have to unite Opeus and his girl friend before learning the Lyre?
dense sparrow
nah
lunar kiln
to learn the lyre or to unlock the lyre
to unlock the lyre you need to have ||freed orpheus, convinced him to sing again, and bought a certain amount of stuff from the contractor, after which he may talk to you about if you want to play music someday||
to learn how to play the lyre you have to keep interacting with it many many times
atomic forge
Does anyone know what is the condition to get Ares to unlock his final heart?
fierce tendon
I think you need to complete the War God's Thirst prophecy first?
atomic forge
Did that. So I just need to talk to him again?
upbeat willow
yeah, keep talking to him till you get the convo
sometimes dialogue RNG can be a pain sadly
fallow nova
it took be a while to unlock the Ares favor too.
strong pilot
Honestly I'd be looking forward to starting a fresh file for the 1.0 release just to revisit a lot of the incidental dialog
The Autograph Saga is a riot
The first time seeing ||"LERNIE|| VANQUISHED" is simply flawless
glad stag
I believe unlocking Ares last heart is 10,000 kills?
normal kiln
that sounds right yeah
glad stag
The only 2 I don't have unlocked are Zeus and Aphrodite..
thorny surge
That is
An awful lotta kills but it checks out
glad stag
||And I have a romance with meg and have given the other two all of the hearts I can..||
I dunno.. When I got it I had like 20,000 kills..
normal kiln
rng gonna rng
open berry
@thorny surge it's retroactive, you don't have to earn that amount after getting the prophecy, it counts your total kills up to that point. dunno how early it'll show up on a fresh file but if you put any significant time into the game you'll get it as you're doing runs. I don't even run near as much as some people here and still had well over the required amount by the time it got added
thorny surge
Yeah, the game does shower you with skeletons doesn’t it
stark raven
Is there a particular condition to make Chaos "defiance" boon spawn? It's the only one I have left for the profecy
crimson temple
You need to have at least one other Chaos boon, the rest is pure luck.
It's rare, befitting to its legendary status.