oh it does, huh?
#h1-builds-and-combat
heady peak
You always wish you had EM4 enabled on the runs that went well
but sometimes when you do enable it, and the run isn't going well, you wish you didn't lol
silver summit
that's why i always have EM4 on now
"if the run isn't good, i'm gonna die before anyways"
lime jolt
You need parting shot
silver summit
yeah that's what i said earlier, "do you have parting shot"
which knusp posted an image riight before i managed to press enter lol
cosmic citrus
ok, so I have parting shot now, and usual cast hits don’t get backstab bonus
heady peak
I'm sorry for just butting in like that
silver summit
it's okay it was just a fun timing coincidence
i thought it was pretty funny lol
b
cosmic citrus
but, when a foe is exposed (I also have blinding flash), then the cast gets bonus
heady peak
In case anybody is interested - I went with the rarity increase from slippery favour, and now chaos has shown up again to offer me this, after I already gained exclusive access in tartarus... this time it's probably an easy choice to go for extra cast 😄
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/398896768399704082/823581418009264128/unknown.png?width=1246&height=701
silver summit
unless you want another +10% on legendary
silver summit
what flourish should i take on zeus shield?
somber drum
Why can't all the boons be fluorishes on the Zeus shield...
silver summit
what boon should i take on my special for zeus shield
silver summit
might take demeter since i like granny
i did zeus yesterday so yeah i wanted to change lol
smoky atlas
athena or zeus on zeus shield are some of my favorites
idle carbon
wow curse of drowning is bad
stuck basalt
i quite like it on occasion
jovial fulcrum
i hear some people love it on talos fist
idle carbon
I sold it first chance when I realized enemies dont get the cast on them
stuck basalt
works especially well with firsts
fists*
yeah it’s so@good on talos cause u can just drag everyone in range
i don’t rlly take advantage of boiling blood
i tend to forget or just want the cast back so i can cast again lol
dusky drum
I sold it first chance when I realized enemies dont get the cast on them
Bad news boon intensifies
Take Stygian and try to nab bad news from Hermes
idle carbon
well to late for that now
jovial fulcrum
had Bad News hunting blade run and Bad News crystal clarity run back to back earlier lol
pulsar jewel
If you use a special build is Rama better than Chiron more or less?
I guess it's important to either use Zeus or Dionysus specials for the damage not to depend on the very low base damage. But if you are then I feel like it's just better than Chiron
idle carbon
chiron is such a slow weapon
silver summit
Doesn't rama just shoot 3 - that doesn't sound very big- idk
I don't find chiron slow
idle carbon
rama kills fast if you know what you are doing
lime jolt
chiron is such a slow weapon
Dont u dare say that
fervent elbow
Not as slow as Arthur swings
silver summit
Someone almost got wr with it I think. 6 minutes or smth
silver summit
Aspects do come into play about who the best is, but your own skill and ability to use a weapon still comes into'play
idle carbon
why is that 6:17 not in the list btw
idle carbon
verifiers couldn't believe in their eyes prolly
how can such a slow weap get 6:17
heh heh
kudos to
lime jolt
oop lili came
idle carbon
whoever did that
worldly pier
Might have something to do with getting 10 free rooms
lime jolt
Yeah the room luck was insane
idle carbon
lols
worldly pier
But Magnil played it well for sure
lime jolt
Are you doing splash dash start?
lime jolt
Yes
idle carbon
mm okay
idle carbon
stupid barge of death
clever barn
Lovecrimson got it two days ago
Is there a video?
clever barn
Thx
idle carbon
why in these videos
they always die first then the run starts
what's the reason
to like validate they are not cheating ?
hollow wraith
maybe to skip any intro cutscenes
lime jolt
No its to prove that its unseeded
idle carbon
oh
makes sense
great it's chinese/japanese or something
cant see what hammer he got
idle carbon
lime jolt
idle carbon
lol yeah so many free rooms
pisses me off kinda I'ma stop watching
my luck is never this good
he got every free room in tartarus possible, except thanatos which is better to get in ely
lemme guess he gets thana in ely
gusty rapids
yeah
lime jolt
But his skill is still insane
gusty rapids
I was mostly impressed w how much damage they were getting even early on
conc volley temp flourish sea storm is better than I thought
gusty rapids
lol
there are probably less than 5 ppl in the world who could’ve gotten a 6:17 on chiron w that seed
lovcrimson is absurd
idle carbon
yes I couldn't get that time even with the same seed
still tho I don't remember ever getting that many freebies in tart
that's what annoys me
gusty rapids
I mean that’s just a result of lovcrimson grinding chiron for 2 weeks straight
theyd been getting quite a few low 7 minute runs, this time the rng lined up and they managed to push that down to 6:17
idle carbon
the real skill test would be to put people in the exact same seed, like you know exactly what you are going to get
and let the reflexes speak
but such a system doesn't exist so
lime jolt
Lili did that
pulsar jewel
Oof on like min 3:20 he eats like three shackles from the hands
pulsar jewel
That's gotta piss him off when he made the record =D
cunning urchin
still tho I don't remember ever getting that many freebies in tart
Tbh free rooms in Tartarus don't matter as much. Elysium and Styx matter a lot more.
pulsar jewel
so do those who speedrun just run runs and then like discard most of their runs at styx when they don't get good cerberus luck?
i guess you get a fair amount of runs per hour anyways so i guess it's alright but still
pulsar jewel
well you know, the sack is random
lime jolt
Oh
Well some runs are so good that a 3 sack works
But mostly a two sack is necessary
pulsar jewel
that's what i mean
idle carbon
Tbh free rooms in Tartarus don't matter as much. Elysium and Styx matter a lot m...
he got to furies in 1:35 lol I can't get to furies before 3 with chiron
sub10 is guaranteed if you get to furies before 2
I mean
if styx is nice
cunning urchin
No, it's not.
lime jolt
I mean it kinda is
pulsar jewel
how often does 2 sack happen?
lime jolt
If you’re good at the other biomes
pulsar jewel
if it's vanilla i don't feel it happening often
lime jolt
Sub 2 tart is on sub 8 pace
idle carbon
I restart whenever I get to furies at 3:00
cuz I know for sure that sub10 is not happening
experienced it many times
lime jolt
It could
idle carbon
there is no way to kill hades under 1 minute unless you have a perfection build
cunning urchin
They said sub 2 at Furies, not sub 2 through Tartarus.
pulsar jewel
i don't speedrun but tartarus is the second longest act, so i imagine luck there matters as well
lime jolt
Ohhh
lime jolt
there is no way to kill hades under 1 minute unless you have a perfection build
You normally want to kill hades under a minute
lime jolt
tart is longest
Noooooooo
pulsar jewel
@idle carbon well styx is depending on how you look at it
idle carbon
I thought tart has the most floors and aspho has the least
pulsar jewel
isn't it?
idle carbon
definitely feels like it
cunning urchin
Tartarus also has the weakest enemies and smallest chambers.
pulsar jewel
that isn't true
idle carbon
I don't think
lime jolt
Lol
pulsar jewel
14 24 36 are the bosses
idle carbon
I go thru elysium faster than tart lol there is sth wrong with me at tartarus
pulsar jewel
tartarus has 12 encounters + boss, asphodel has 6 + boss, elysium has 8 + boss
idle carbon
see 8
lime jolt
But tartarus is still the fastest
pulsar jewel
it's both the shortest act, and has the least encounters
idle carbon
that's also
cunning urchin
Anyway, sub 2:30 Tartarus is a good pace for sub 10, but if your build falls off, that's not gonna matter.
idle carbon
something to consider
pulsar jewel
it's not, asphodel is trivially faster
lime jolt
asphodel has stupid enemies
idle carbon
oh come on
pulsar jewel
what stupid enemies?
pulsar jewel
we can use this guy's speedrun just now that was pasted
cunning urchin
Asphodel can be faster, but you can also get some bad rooms.
pulsar jewel
he's 2min igt through Act1
he's 3min igt through Act2
asphodel is trivially the fastest act
pulsar jewel
you don't have to skip asphodel, it skips itself
idle carbon
asphodel does have annoying enemies and huge rooms
pulsar jewel
there is maximum 7 encounters in asphodel
cunning urchin
Well, Asphodel is typically faster for me than Tartarus.
idle carbon
tartarus has 12 floors and it takes decades unless you get free rooms IMO
cunning urchin
On Malphon, I think my average is like 2:20 Tartarus and 4:20 Asphodel?
pulsar jewel
Let's say we'll concede something if you find a speedrun where asphodel isn't faster than tartarus
Somewhere from top50
lime jolt
My good times are 1:5x for tartarus and 3:x for asphodel
pulsar jewel
Are you top50?
lime jolt
Top 200
pulsar jewel
Nice!
lime jolt
I’m not very good
cunning urchin
That's with what aspect?
lime jolt
Eris/achilles
pulsar jewel
I didn't expect you to actually speedrun
cunning urchin
I can see that. Eris and Achilles are both so consistently fast.
pulsar jewel
Don't sell yourself short top200 is better than most
lime jolt
But I’m trying to get faster
pulsar jewel
8 36s
idle carbon
sub what
lime jolt
8:36
idle carbon
that's good lol I dont have sub9 yet and my sub10 is just with eris and zagreus spear
lime jolt
Dont worry. You’ll get there
idle carbon
I'd rather finish heat 50
pulsar jewel
but yeah, tartarus has easier enemies
cunning urchin
tartarus has 12 floors and it takes decades unless you get free rooms IMO
If Tartarus is taking so long, you're not front-loading the damage in your build and wasting too much time taking out trash mobs.
Pretty much.
idle carbon
it genuinely pisses me off
pulsar jewel
but it's 14 chambers vs 10, and 50% more encounters
it takes a certain amount of time to move from chamber to chamber and pick up the boon
lime jolt
I'd rather finish heat 50
50 heat is way harder than sub9
idle carbon
whenever I get to furies and see that 3:XX on the right corner
I start getting
yes
weird feeling
idle carbon
If Tartarus is taking so long, you're not front-loading the damage in your build...
latter probably
fervent elbow
I got my first sub-9 with Zag spear when I couldn't get flurry jab on Achilles
lime jolt
50 heat is 
and I’m never doing it again
cunning urchin
Well, I'd be quite upset with myself if getting sub 3 Tartarus was as easy for you as it is for me considering how many more hours I've put into the game lol.
idle carbon
believe me
cunning urchin
You shouldn't be upset with yourself, your times are very good. You're making good progress.
lime jolt
^^^
fervent elbow
50 heat is <:residentzag:580097451197857816> and I’m never doing it again
You will do 50 heat Eris
lime jolt
I’m staying under 45 heat for the next week or so
idle carbon
you need those free rooms
cunning urchin
That's fine, Eris 50 counts as 45 at best.
idle carbon
you will not get a sub3 in tart without several free rooms
and skill
well more like 2:30
3 is not THAT hard
cunning urchin
I mean you'll see mid-shop anyway.
idle carbon
you get only 1 free room
and reach furies in 2:20 ?
that's really good
iunno how
cunning urchin
Yes.
pulsar jewel
@lime jolt do you mean one additional free room?
idle carbon
have a problem with other regions
turbid needle
does anyone know whats the best hammers for aspect of gilgamesh
pulsar jewel
@turbid needle not a hammer but if you can construct it ares athena doom build slaps very hard with gilgamesh
lime jolt
<@!811054495026380860> do you mean one additional free room?
Yeah
So exiting furies at around 2:20
turbid needle
rn i have to pick between colossus knuckle , flying cutter , quake cutter
tappi ik the build
idle carbon
wait do you mean 2:20 including the boss ?
turbid needle
just wondering the hammers
cunning urchin
Rush Kick is legit on Gilga
Ew.
pulsar jewel
Are gilgamesh dashes shorter?
idle carbon
wait do you mean 2:20 including the boss ?
sorry didn't see your reply earlier
lime jolt
Are gilgamesh dashes shorter?
Yes
lime jolt
sorry didn't see your reply earlier
Yes
silver summit
but they give +2 dashes and also hold to dash
pulsar jewel
wait what?
silver summit
hold space to dash
idle carbon
that's impressive in my book lol
pulsar jewel
did not know that either =D
silver summit
you can see it on top left when you equip gilga
lime jolt
Lmao
silver summit
Just hold dash
no that's the tip for non-em4 hades fight smh
cunning urchin
Rush Kick adds 0 damage to your Dash-Upper but makes it a lot slower.
silver summit
not for gilga
turbid needle
Rush Kick adds 0 damage to your Dash-Upper but makes it a lot slower.
You use it to approach enemies, then get your dashes in.
On other fists, lol you dash faster to them
but on Gilga ... it's actually a little bit faster
And saves your dashes to use directly on them
Not the best hammer, I'll admit
But it's at 'least useful
Unlike on other fists lmao
pulsar jewel
It's like 5% shorter
cunning urchin
I suppose it's good for ME.
turbid needle
it's definitely not 5 % lol
pulsar jewel
Almost imperceptible
cunning urchin
lol 5%.
turbid needle
It's more like 30%
pulsar jewel
It definitely is not
turbid needle
A little bit more distance then Serrated Point
cunning urchin
Anyway, if your build in any way relies on Dash-Uppers for damage, Rush Kick will actively hurt it.
turbid needle
a smidge, even
pulsar jewel
Sec
turbid needle
Anyway, if your build in any way relies on Dash-Uppers for damage, Rush Kick wil...
That is entirely fair
pulsar jewel
That's the difference
Starting point is the T-corner in front of gilgamesh
It's 10% max
Serrated Point makes your dash not actually move you faster than without dashing
turbid needle
On testing on my end
You are correct
I will still say the difference, in a practical run, is noticeable enough
pulsar jewel
I wouldn't notice it
You have way more displacement with gilgamesh
I guess I would notice it if it wasn't a bit shorter then, you'd be flying
If you get greater reflex can you hold dash?
Or is this QOL only for gilga?
turbid needle
Only for Gilga it seems
There's also the tidbit about dash cooldown only ending when you are done with your salvo of dashes
Which very much applies to Gilga, especially since there's a cap on how fast you can dash with gilga
lime jolt
Only time I use gilga is for dash only runs
pulsar jewel
Yeah I don't play it unless I do the ares athena duo build
But even then I nowadays do it with the zeus shield instead
It's super inconsistent but ares on zeus shield special and then you try to get the double attack hammer with athena on primary and basically get a doom expiry between every shield proc =P
turbid needle
oh I know this build too well
pulsar jewel
it's higher damage in theory than the gilgamesh with doom on attack
lime jolt
Lol baj
pulsar jewel
and deflect on dash
turbid needle
enough to piss me off on Merciful End's shenanigans
lime jolt
Lmao
turbid needle
My fastest Elysium exit was with that build
at 4:54
Sadly, sack rng didn't cooperate
lime jolt
F
pulsar jewel
how probable is 2sack?
lime jolt
54%
pulsar jewel
It's that probable?
I thought it was way less
Well it's not the worst then as far as speedrunning is concerned
turbid needle
i didnt get athena but i got something just as cool
got epic ares attack / epic aphrodite special
and got the duo boon too
cursing longing
turbid needle
Well it's not the worst then as far as speedrunning is concerned
Until you get 5-sacked with a tiny vermin
Because that is what happened in that attempt
valid dagger
Best rng possible
turbid needle
The fact it's at the end of a run makes it so frustrating
pulsar jewel
Does the sack beyond 3 even matter?
The time is in the doghouse regardless after that
turbid needle
Yeah
Mainly because you have to do a regular Styx encounter
lmao
But even then, it's like a 80-ish %
to get a 2 or 3 sack
pulsar jewel
It still sucks but it isn't the worst. There's some one hour games with a coinflip at the end, and then there's even longer games with a worse than coinflip at the end..
lucid oar
Can someone tell me what exactly "two sack mentality" is? I have a rough idea but I'm not fully sure
pulsar jewel
They should still add some official speedrunning mode which normalizes it to like 3sack oslt
It would leave the door open for the masochists that want the rng and better times than 3sack, but 3sackkers could have their own category =D
turbid needle
Can someone tell me what exactly "two sack mentality" is? I have a rough idea bu...
Basically, you skip the second Styx miniboss in favor of a regular encounter room reward. Styx regular encounters are, on average, slower then a Styx miniboss encounter. Normally, to save yourself from a 3 sack, you'd do both styx minibosses first, then go for the regular rooms
lucid oar
Basically, you skip the second Styx miniboss in favor of a regular encounter roo...
Thanks for clearing that up.
turbid needle
It would leave the door open for the masochists that want the rng and better tim...
That's kinda what's happening. It won't be official ever, because SGG isn't directly behind the modding, to my knowledge.
But it's in the making
The closest to official we will get is leaderboards official
cunning urchin
2-sack mentality is good when you know you have to get a 2-sack for your goal anyway, and that reward would help you a lot more than the miniboss reward.
turbid needle
Say, getting a regular room god boon instead of a styx miniboss obol reward on the second styx wing chamber
When you don't plan on shopping in the Styx shop
man im in love with curse of longing
imagine if i got merciful end now with it
lime jolt
CoL
cunning urchin
If you got Merciful End with it, Curse of Longing wouldn't do anything anymore.
silver summit
Hyper dash activates after dashing, so do you get extra speed during the second dash, and therefore more damage with rush delivery on the 2nd dash strike?
turbid needle
No. You'd only refresh the hyper sprint speed buff duration
It won't stack
Still good to do
silver summit
That's not what I said-?
pulsar jewel
But is the movement speed technically still in effect during the second dash?
silver summit
That's what I said^
pulsar jewel
ye
cunning urchin
You'll get the bonus damage during the first dash already, either way.
silver summit
I was gonna ask that afterwardss lol
turbid needle
Most notable in Merciful End builds
silver summit
Like does it hyper sprint at the start or at the end of the dash
Thanks for the answer :p
cunning urchin
Also anything with Tidal Dash.
Good reason practically every speedrun rerolls for Hyper Sprint + Rush Delivery unless you really need your rerolls for something else or there's like an Epic Greatest Reflex or something.
Or Auto Reload for a Cast build.
gusty rapids
hermes can just boost your build SO much if you get the specific boon you want from him
unfortunately it can be difficult to get
cunning urchin
Yeah, he can also just give you practically nothing at all lol.
cunning urchin
At least all his boons are purgeable.
silver summit
I'I'd take greater evasion
cunning urchin
Side Hustle at least does something there.
gusty rapids
i would take side hustle, but it doesnt particularly matter
silver summit
It's like the "my build isn't centered around dodging, but it's always nice to have a random dodge save me when I fluke"
I watched a video about how like things that you aren't focusing on, like a random small chance to dodge, randomly save you or something, boosts confidence and makes you feel generally nicer
So- ye I guess
cunning urchin
I don't fluke. 
gusty rapids
gusty rapids
personally i see side hustle as the "may let you buy one more thing you couldnt have", which i value more than the chance to dodge
id rather get an extra boon, or an extra pom
thats where im coming from at least
cunning urchin
Depends on heat etc.
gusty rapids
oh right
i was mostly talking about from speedrun perspective there
high heat that dodge chance can become MUCH more valuable
silver summit
Yeah I didn't think of Side hustle cuz lately i'I've been playing with convenience fee at max so side hustle is practically null if I get it late
cunning urchin
Speedrun, my mentality is go fast or die lol.
silver summit
How about go fast and die
gusty rapids
i dont usually think of surviving when speedrunning, i usually dont get close to dying
unless im playing the SWORD
sword dangerous :(
cunning urchin
"It's -4 HP on every Attack, but it's +32% Attack damage afterwards!"
gusty rapids
literally me LOL
cunning urchin
Cursed and guan yu ignore lc4 right
Right.
gusty rapids
and yes cursed slash and GY ignore any LC
gusty rapids
hammers and aspect specific features ignore LC
static karma
I have 32 all weapons but sword
cunning urchin
I have 5 left for 24x sub 10 IGT and 7 left for 24x 40+ Heat.
pulsar jewel
2sack side hustle is like 210 gold on first floor of elysium
so not that much?
around 400 if you get it ~early in tartarus
turbid needle
I used to take side hustle but now im just shooting for the hermes boons that improve dashes or dmg
turbid needle
its also a lot less worth with cf pact on
gusty rapids
its the "i spent 3 rolls on hermes and he told me he hated me so im taking side hustle"
pulsar jewel
unless you're farming the diamonds / bloods in styx very little reason to take it
cunning urchin
What Side Hustle can get you before the next couple shops is a lot more important than what it can get you until Styx.
gusty rapids
^yee
pulsar jewel
i play fated authority for the consistent 4 god pools + consistent god rerolls in styx, i don't miss missing with fated persuasion 😄
cunning urchin
Styx shop is a waste of time more often than not.
I've picked Side Hustle just to have +10 obols to shoot me over 150 for Styx mid-shop because I wanted a shot at Smoldering Air or something there.
pulsar jewel
i don't take shops until the pool is full, i haven't felt it was consistent enough to do before that
slap in the face to get something like ares / dionysus when you're not doing their build
how often is it that if there's a boon next to a shop, the shop has that boon?
it's not like 100% but it's way over 50%
cunning urchin
All of Lady Aphrodite's boons are my favorite boons.
lime jolt
ofc ofc
fervent elbow
Does duo boons count as 1 unique Olympian boon for Family Favorite ?
just wanted to be sure
cunning urchin
I've heard it counts for both, but I never bothered to verify.
It wouldn't affect my decisions.
surreal wasp
does double edge work on arthur dash strike combo?
surreal wasp
sadness
abstract flower
Do +Attack Chaos boons also boost dash-strike?
spiral badge
All dash attacks are attacks, but not all attacks are dash attacks
So yes, for chaos and beyond
idle carbon
omg I did it
cunning urchin
Sub 10 sword?
pulsar jewel
family favorite counts all the unique olympian gods you have boons from
idle carbon
sub10 chiron
pulsar jewel
duo boons require you to have a boon from both gods, you can't get them otherwise
cunning urchin
Congratulations!
pulsar jewel
ergo duo boons don't matter for FF
idle carbon
thanks it took forever
I gave up around 2 times at hades cuz I had only like 30 seconds
this time I had 1 minute and my dps was ridiculous
so it worked
pulsar jewel
i've heard rumors about the chaos boons being different regarding attack vs dash-attack
no idea if there's any merit to them
namely some people say chaos specifically would categorize attack to only affect your attack and not dash-attack
pulsar jewel
i probably don't believe it without seeing positive evidence though, it would be super weird for one god's boons to act differently than all other gods, even if it is chaos which is kind of special
tame zodiac
today I learned you can hold attack and dash w/ gilgamesh for super fast dash strikes
I always thought gilga is the worst hidden aspect, maybe this'll change my opinion
opal lodge
i probably don't believe it without seeing positive evidence though, it would be...
tappi, all attack chaos boons affect dash strike dmg but not the other way around
pulsar jewel
another way of saying not good
opal lodge
not really
gusty rapids
not quite yeah
opal lodge
it does a ton of damage
pulsar jewel
yeah if nothing contests you
opal lodge
if youre contested, reload + empty dash
pulsar jewel
then you're back at zero damage
pulsar jewel
the special is awkward to use as well
opal lodge
perhaps that is why you feel like it is bad
you cant use the special
the specials a pretty important part of its kit
it does 100 base
pulsar jewel
i heard rumors on the internets that eris does 60 base, doesn't require you to shoot it to activate it
and you get 75% global damager if you sit in it
so i will restate what i said
somber drum
I actually liked the specials on lucifer more as stationary damage towers than as bombs
pulsar jewel
the special is awkward to use
somber drum
One time I had triple bomb plus that special hammer that makes the shockwaves better
It was like I WAS the magma
pulsar jewel
You need to hit the damn bomb for three ticks for it to explode
You invest 30 damage to do it
And you get a whopping 10 more aoe for it?
somber drum
But if you don't hit it it pulses constant shockwaves that damage nearby enemies
pulsar jewel
The damage is pitiful, and it doesn't track
opal lodge
tappi, if you dont like luci, thats chill
pulsar jewel
It's 20 damage
somber drum
So it still functions somewhat similar to the standard area bomb
opal lodge
but its a pretty solid aspect
fervent elbow
I like my lucifer bombs to explode
opal lodge
and any aspect next to eris can look pretty weak
pulsar jewel
No I'm humoring arguments why it would actually be better than any of the rest of the hidden aspects
opal lodge
it is better at least than gilga and arthur
pulsar jewel
No it isn't
opal lodge
ok
pulsar jewel
Arthur has a viable moveset right from the start
Beowulf has an actual build that slaps
opal lodge
viable perhaps if you play on <40 heat
pulsar jewel
Ie. goes into the range of super powerful, so while the aspect itself isn't necessarily the most powerful, at least it has a build that is
opal lodge
arthur struggles a lot on higher heats and is likely the slowest aspect in the game
idle carbon
arthur is viable for 32
pulsar jewel
You're arguing high heat for the lucifer now?
The aspect that requires you to stay still???
You must be joking
opal lodge
what metric would you use for a "good" aspect
ive done 50 with luci, as have many others
its good for 50
opal lodge
arthur is not
idle carbon
(gotta be real careful with hades tho, arthur kinda sucks against fo2 hades)
opal lodge
beowulf is but this isnt about beowulf
pulsar jewel
That's bull crap
opal lodge
lol
idle carbon
(like really)
pulsar jewel
somber drum
(gotta be real careful with hades tho, arthur kinda sucks against fo2 hades)
Could you compensate with decay+consecrated ground?
opal lodge
ah yes, retrash, who has also done 55 heat zagreus sword
good example
retrash, who has also done 54 heat lucifer
lmao
like come on bruh
idle carbon
Could you compensate with decay+consecrated ground?
the ground does help, yes
gusty rapids
retrash LMAO
opal lodge
just say you dont like luci and go
gusty rapids
retrash cleared 55 heat with zag sword and dash nova
using a run by him to argue an aspect is good
is not a great argument
pulsar jewel
You made the argument arthur can't do 50 heat, you were wrong
idle carbon
but still, gotta be more careful than other aspects cuz you are a slow hitting tank against a pretty fast hades
gusty rapids
he said it wasnt GOOD at 50 heat, compared to luci
opal lodge
i never said that
gusty rapids
every single aspect can do 50 heat
opal lodge
i said it isnt good at 50 yeah
gusty rapids
proven multiple times over
cunning urchin
Aspects don't do 50 Heat, players do.
cunning urchin
Fair.
opal lodge
LOL
hardy condor
why can't we post photos here 
idle carbon
but still, gotta be more careful than other aspects cuz you are a slow hitting t...
other than that, arthur 32 is pretty nice except yea hades can ruin your fun
opal lodge
its to avoid botspam
hardy condor
damn, wanted to show off my build
cunning urchin
For the record, Stygius 40+ sucks, and Excalibur is no exception.
opal lodge
you can upload to somewhere like imgur and then post the link here
somber drum
the ground does help, yes
I meant the T2 Demeter Curse that only works if all enemies are chilled, that's gotta be the ticket for FO2 Arthur right? I remember fighting EM3 Asterius and getting hit by his jump attack because I couldn't adapt to his super slow decayed shockwaves.
idle carbon
oh I never did 35+ so iunno
opal lodge
its fine, i think luci hater begone
although i doubt he'll be looking to do 40+ on arthur
gusty rapids
For the record, Stygius 40+ sucks, and Excalibur is no exception.
hard agree
lime jolt
i don't mind exaclibur at 40
cunning urchin
Just the fact alone that you can pew-pew from a distance makes it better than any sword for 40+.
opal lodge
excalibur at 40 is okish
gusty rapids
eh
hardy condor
i got the boon where i ignore dmg if hit once every 20s and 2 daedaluses where i just sit still and hold the mouse button aswell as hella crit from artemis
gusty rapids
i did one (1) attempt, died to heroes, and was sad
hardy condor
(on the spear)
cunning urchin
Okayish is about right.
idle carbon
I meant the T2 Demeter Curse that only works if all enemies are chilled, that's ...
yeah you are talking about killing freeze, causes decay dot, if you aren't racing against td3 it could work
gusty rapids
oh actually i did 2 and the next one i died to speedy savior numbskulls
and was SO sad
lime jolt
It took a bit of practice to do fo2 with arthur
cunning urchin
But the gap grows with along with heat.
idle carbon
It took a bit of practice to do fo2 with arthur
it was fine until hades, I struggled with hades a lot on fo2 arthur
(32 heat)
fervent elbow
It took a bit of practice to do fo2 with arthur
I yoloed my first 40 heat sword with 40 heat Arthur + FO2
idle carbon
and I even had the rare attack speed buff from hermes
lime jolt
The hardest part of hades for me are skulls, and with divine dash, I have no problems whatsoever with hades
cunning urchin
Killing Freeze does a ton of damage vs Hades by the way.
idle carbon
also my arthur was lvl 1 only
lime jolt
Killing freeze is one of my fav boons
lime jolt
Hallowed ground does nothing at high heat
idle carbon
less dmg no ?
fervent elbow
Arthur lvl 1 is ready to use
lime jolt
^^^
fervent elbow
Artemis or Aphrodite are fine
pulsar jewel
it's so slow i'd go for aphrodite
lime jolt
both r good
pulsar jewel
there's a lot more to a build than just your attack boon =P
pulsar jewel
it probably won't change things, on hades artemis attack is probably better because you've gotten some alternative attack damage already by that point
ie. artemis is better on hades than aphrodite for pure damage
pulsar jewel
if your damage sucked it sucked because the build didn't have enough synergy / things in it
pulsar jewel
artemis is basically a multiplier to damage which starts off worse than other attacks more or less, ie. it's "only" around 50% increased damage without any synergy
but because crits are multiplicative it ends up being higher than most other boons if you get the damage increase elsewhere
idle carbon
like chaos boons
opal lodge
yes
idle carbon
yea I'll run one more 32 arthur, not satisfied with last 1
cunning urchin
lol
idle carbon
and I won't level it up since you guys said 1 is enough
cunning urchin
Deadly Strike starts off better than everything else at common and is only behind Heartbreak Strike at rare+.
pulsar jewel
i mean more is better but yeah it doesn't affect dps
i fully upgraded arthur quite late
fervent elbow
Arthur needs some more practice
pulsar jewel
@cunning urchin against bosses yes
there's more to combat simulation than naive damage calculations
you overcrit against trash
aphrodite means you need X amount less hits for every enemy
this is very important for slow attacking weapons like arthur
to put it into other words because crits deal triple multiplicative damage it means 15% of the time you gain 200% more damage, which is 30% more damage overall, naively
but it's not the same thing as actually having 30% more damage
cunning urchin
I mean, don't learn anything then. Fine with me.
pulsar jewel
well you're the one not learning here
opal lodge
looooool
pulsar jewel
if you compare arthur start with artemis vs aphrodite, you will very quickly find out the true difference
opal lodge
you know nyaanyaa is the biggest aphro advocate on this server right
pulsar jewel
you can't think of artemis as 56% increased damage, you only crit 15% of the time
lime jolt
Nyaanyaa is the biggest aphrodite simp I know
pulsar jewel
aith arthur if you're critting on trash, you're overkilling by a few hundred damage, that's wasted
coral cave
arguing with nyaa 
opal lodge
pplaff he doesnt know
coral cave
el no sabe 
pulsar jewel
@opal lodge do you think the advice is poor?
pulsar jewel
that aphro on arthur has an easier start than artemis
opal lodge
they give you different things
lime jolt
Each have their advantages
opal lodge
^
lime jolt
As I said, artemis scales better with herself, and aphro with poms and rarity
Also aphro weak is really nice
idle carbon
who uses arthur when there is nemesis anyway amirite
opal lodge
if im going for speed i pick arty, if im going for high heat i'll start athena anyway and take whatever decent attack i find
coral cave
🥱
lime jolt
Bu-but boss damage
pulsar jewel
and crits in this game are 3x, they're not 2x
somber drum
Arthur: Athena on attack, Zeus on special, end of discussion.
opal lodge
😦
pulsar jewel
tappi: @cunning urchin against bosses yes
coral cave
Arthur: Athena on attack, Zeus on special, end of discussion.
homeboy over here would disagree
opal lodge
🦻
coral cave
nvm
lime jolt
ok moving on
fervent elbow
I actually tested Athena attack on a 50 heat Arthur attempt
it ended by a time out at final boss
somber drum
homeboy over here would disagree
I was trying to pick the worst imaginable ones but autocorrect autocorrected me to a More viable choice.
coral cave
i see
fervent elbow
Boonless Arthur ?? Shackle is here
opal lodge
but they both do the same thing
now as for why you would run DC on arthur
thats a good question
idle carbon
ds is good on what, unironically speaking
fervent elbow
Rama
lime jolt
Eris
idle carbon
isn't eris = zeus
pulsar jewel
also why you gotta get into it with everyone in this channel
lot of people get in my face with what i feel is poor info
pulsar jewel
i never left
fervent elbow
Rama special just remove those blue hearts
coral cave
you should have
coral cave
funnee
lime jolt
Rama special just remove those blue hearts
On my 40+ rama runs I don't have it on. I find it too annoying
opal lodge
but yeh DC is essentially free heat on rama
lime jolt
Its probably a good idea to have it on tho
opal lodge
wait really pengy
idle carbon
why would you use drunken strike on rama
opal lodge
like
idle carbon
I don't get it
somber drum
Drunken strike should be fine, it has a great shoot through
lime jolt
just special them pengy
BUT AHHH IT TAKES SO LONG
fervent elbow
Numbskulls with DC are quite some annoying things
lime jolt
It's probably the right choice, but I don't like it
idle carbon
oh ares one is called curse of pain nvm
opal lodge
dio flourish also ticks more times and does it quicker
somber drum
It seems like for DC drunken strike would be good to have in your kit, depending on the situation you can hit more targets with the attack than with the special so you're always in a good position.
opal lodge
drunken strike rama is just a waste
just put it on special and call it a day
big % boon on attack will carry you far
opal lodge
i suppose
curse of pain is like fine
tailesque says any of zeus/ares/dem/dio/athena special can do things
and aphro
idle carbon
uhhh
random but
if you pick athena special then throw the shield on zeus aspect
and follow the shield
do you become like invulnurable
somber drum
It's hard not to catch the shield like that
idle carbon
you catch the shield as soon as you get near it ?
no
you gotta click special button again to catch it
somber drum
Oh yeah you're right, that's only if it hits a wall or something
idle carbon
and the shield stops after traveling a little
means you can have your safe bubble
wait I'll test it I am curious
somber drum
Right I was mistakenly thinking you catch it if you touch it when it stops, but it spins for quite a while before it returns on its own.
idle carbon
yep it does exactly that
as long as you're moving with your shield and stay in it
it deflects the things coming at you lol
nice
it doesn't defend you from the doomstone lasers tho
somber drum
I guess elites can still get you but everyone else should be stunned
Maybe slam dancers Will be a problem too. I forget how close they get.
opal lodge
it mostly does
somber drum
And I doubt you are safe from poison puddles in Styx
opal lodge
there are some moves you cant deflect and have to i frame through
theseus' spin is an obvious one
idle carbon
yea but anything you can normally deflect, you are safe from it in the shield
wretched sneak just killed himself cuz he kept warping to me while I am in my shield
this is fun 
somber drum
wretched sneak just killed himself cuz he kept warping to me while I am in my sh...
It's the little things
cunning urchin
It's nice. Won't make or break a run, usually.
lime jolt
It’s just kinda a meme
turbid needle
Amir's way of nerfing Artemis and Zeus.
fierce bronze
guessing its worse at high heat? lol
cunning urchin
Nah, it's actually quite nice.
I also wouldn't be sad to purge it for UC, though.
fierce bronze
UC?
fierce bronze
oh the pact of punishment
turbid needle
It does have good damage, and if you just lay down multiple Casts around a stationary enemy.
cloud vault
The range is especially ridiculous if you invest in high voltage a bit
dusky drum
What's a good build with Ares?
Merciful end is always a treat or you could go a faster weapon like rail with dire misfortune and impending doom
raw junco
Merciful end is always a treat or you could go a faster weapon like rail with di...
I liked the rail one! Will try it out. Thanks!
dusky drum
Yea ares is best on faster weapons so dire misfortune and impending can work well and merciful end is just powerful
still vortex
I need a fist aspect and boon focus target. Who wants to give a suggestion?
cunning urchin
I need a fist aspect and boon focus target. Who wants to give a suggestion?
Any of that with Demeter Aspect:
#h1-builds-and-combat message
#h1-high-heat-strategies message
turbid needle
I've beaten the game for the first time using Talos with Demeter boons
woven ivy
does the sword dash strike count as a thrust?
gusty rapids
no
woven ivy
ok thanks
magic rivet
When I dash between the Arthur combo, do I press attack and then dash into position, or do I dash into position first then press attack?
fierce bronze
Atk then dash, or you just do the dash strike
Im assuming you want the two broadswings
finite iris
It depends on which strike you start with. If you dash strike you need to strike one more time standing still to start the normal attack combo, after the first strike you can dash between the following attacks for bigger swings. Tbh just beat skelly around a bit and try out all button combinations.
fringe summit
How long can it take before i can finally unlock Meg as a summon?
Because i gave her all the nectar i could, and it's been like 6 runs without being able to give her that other stuff
magic rivet
Atk then dash, or you just do the dash strike
Oh thanks
magic rivet
It depends on which strike you start with. If you dash strike you need to strike...
I know that, I just want to know which combo is better
finite iris
well one is better to hit targets further away, the other one lets you perform a bigger swing while moving. Choose according to the situation.
clever barn
https://youtu.be/PwmYoER5254
idk why but i didn't see the ping, thanks a lot!
i don't get why they concetrated so much on cast thou
turbid needle
Any good Guan Yu builds?
sleek quarry
Any good Guan Yu builds?
Special build
Charged Hammer
And some high % boons
You win
turbid needle
Which God to aim?
turbid needle
Ok
sleek quarry
I think the special build is the only strong in that weapon imo
i dont use spear that often
But you can build a HUGE spin build
turbid needle
Ooh
proven osprey
Aphrodite/Artemis/Athena/Demeter on the Attack. Any % boon on the special, the best being Artemis, Aphrodite and Poseidon. You want to build around the first hammer you get. Charged skewer > Quick and Massive spin are the best hammers. If the hammers are bad, try to improvise with a call, hunter's mark from Artemis, Rupture from Poseidon, that kind of stuff. Optimal dps rotation : Special > Dash strikex2. You can and should include cast in this rotation (it cancels the special wind up as well as the dash)
Cast is especially important for Tartarus, Guan Yu owns this biome
sleek quarry
artemis special
crits 😋
fringe summit
Mweh
If you're not getting Cluster or Rocket Bombs, would you take Triple Bomb or Flurry Fire?
worldly pier
Flurry
jovial fulcrum
This might be the most frustrating rng I've ever gotten.
Mirage Shot on Hera with 2 chaos grasps, but the only cast I've been offered all run is arty
turbid needle
Decided to try Hades aspect, I got wrecked at the Hydra using Guan Yu.
woven ivy
guan yu is bad at base but good once maxed
and try focusing on special for guan yu
hades is nice try getting quick spin imo
magic rivet
You only need it once every ten seconds
woven ivy
i guess so
turbid needle
I'm experimenting with boons atm, I haven't encountered any hammer rooms yet :(
turbid needle
Wait, I'm using Hades right now.
magic rivet
Also Guan yu since the special does decent Damage, especially with Charged Skewer
turbid needle
Ooh
woven ivy
i usually use arty special for guan yu lmao
turbid needle
Ok, Artemis Fowl special.
strange lark
which aspect?
hard robin
any, to be fair, tho I use achiles aspect the most
strange lark
for achilles you should aim for flurry jab, serrated edge, and zeus attack
it is my favorite spear build
hold attack and spam dash if you get flurry jab
and occasionally spear rush
limber cloak
serrated messes with flurry dash strikes a lot
magic rivet
It's because there's a reduced range
chrome girder
guys
strange lark
what
strange lark
uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
chrome girder
is it even viable?
chrome girder
doom on special aphro on attack
limber cloak
you're better off doing merciful end, if you want to do doom chiron
strange lark
????????