Rebind everything to it then
#h1-builds-and-combat
gleaming current
main osprey
i mean
gleaming current
Just in case 
static jacinth
They might all just trigger.
gleaming current
Imagine if zag just does every attack at once
Dash strike special cast
Also bon appetit swan
nova goblet
f i gave up bc i ran into some satyrs and i have. personal bias against satyrs
gleaming current
Very commonly in last zone
nova goblet
(sees enemies) ah no
gleaming current
Technically broken speartip helps a lot as you get 1.5 secs leeway
nova goblet
i have skull earring to help max my lighting+hellfire damage
nova goblet
honestly... not sure
static jacinth
I think skull earring just boosts all damage.
nova goblet
but what i am sure of is seeing athena on hellfire have an infinite y axis
static jacinth
Like Pierced butterfly.
silk mountain
Which one is better? Olympian Favor or Dark Foresight?
nova goblet
and its fun just seeing projectiles get trapped between 2 bombs get reflected over and over
gleaming current
More boons or rarer boons, up to you mostly
I prefer more to sell excessive ones and get more chances for needed
static jacinth
I like better boons because taking a common boon hurts my soul.
silk mountain
I don't quite understand what Dark Foresight does. It increases chance for what?
static jacinth
For rooms that give run upgrades.
gleaming current
For that you will meet room rewards that aren't darkness/gemstones/keys/nectar pool
static jacinth
nova goblet
aka not gems/darkness/coins etc
static jacinth
You have a better chance for the gold rooms.
silk mountain
Ohhh
static jacinth
And a lower chance for blue rooms, basically.
silk mountain
Okay, okay. I get it now. Thanks!
gleaming current
(Have yet to figure out if 10% is on 100% scale or just multiplying the gold chance)
For example, if initial chance is 50/50, would dark foresight do 60/40 or 55/45
static jacinth
You'd probably have to bug the dataminers to find out.
Or Greg.
All the devs probably know.
pseudo stream
Btw given my silly spreedsheet we made, it seems like the Adamant Rail is kinda bad at aspects
gleaming current
Meanwhile spear is just bad 
main osprey
excuse you
gleaming current
mediocre, okay okay
The only bad weapon is officially zag sword
and even it can be made working
main osprey
alright, leaving Asphodel with 449 max health
unkempt pagoda
now consider this: an aphrodite boon that increased damage by how high your hp is
gleaming current
Busted blasted boon that i want
main osprey
:3
gleaming current
also ouchie
ig double edge + passion dash was somewhere equal to that tho
main osprey
wait
is there a limit to how frequently heaven's vengeance can trigger against a single target?
rare kayak
spear is bad but theres something to be said about spin aspect
main osprey
which one/
rare kayak
hades
the area coverage is fun even if it makes me get hit 80% more in elysium because i overuse it
one day ill get a zeus chain skewer run going on zagspect spear
main osprey
it's hilarious
rare kayak
theres something to be said about theseus just continuously driving into a pillar while talking crap to zag
“you blackguard! I will run you over!”
gleaming current
Hades aspect should have been the power of default spear charge ngl
Current default is way too underwhelming
static jacinth
What, default spear? It's not bad for special builds.
With Zeus or Demeter or something.
Toss toss toss.
gleaming current
Oh, I meant spin charge
Not sure how i avoided mentioning it for the whole sentence lol
static jacinth
I'm not sure I follow ^^
Do you mean the punishing sweep buff should have been default?
gleaming current
Ye
static jacinth
I guess it would have made the spin better.
But it does fit the theme they have with the other special buffer aspects.
Talos, Eris, Nemesis.
gleaming current
Yeah that's also fair
turbid needle
Is Snap Nova the worst hammer in the game for being completely unusable and unhealthy to even watch, is it the best hammer for being the most bizarre thing in the game lmao @turbid needle
@fallow niche I really like Snap Nova.
fallow niche
😳
turbid needle
I wish it didn't have the return move, and the dash range could be cut juuust a little bit, but after a little practice it's kind of a straight upgrade for Nemesis.
fallow niche
Yeah the issue is the return move
turbid needle
I think I'd still rather have Double or Super Nova, but base 70 damage is big.
fallow niche
I'm specifically talking about the absolute jank of the return move
turbid needle
Two Dash-Strikes is enough to expire the return.
turbid needle
Yeah, just gotta learn to not mash Special too much.
fallow niche
I mean this is a game where I think we all want to mash buttons 
gleaming current
I keep triggering bot with reactions, but holy hell, this is something
gleaming current
It looks exactly like I feel like my first run was going on, and it's amazing
fallow niche
speedrunners are talking about using it to break the game somehow and I'm looking forward to that
not in it being fast way, but in it breaking something about the game way
If they ever remove the return then I think it'll be my favorite hammer since that lunge forward is super cool
gleaming current
Snap Nova 
Double Nova into dash 
pseudo stream
any advice on a fun sword aspect? D:
I guess my spreadsheet says Poseidon is Smooth haha, nevermind
main osprey
excal has big numbers >:3
unkempt pagoda
excalibur has big boy numbers
unkempt pagoda
nemesis also has big boy numbers to a lesser extent, and incorporates both attack and special into your gameplay
pseudo stream
my spreadsheet says that needs to be maxed out to be worth it
analog sail
If you have GY spear, you only need 5 blood spent on the weapon to unlock the final aspect
static jacinth
Spreadsheets are a handicap.
pseudo stream
no, spreadsheets are a way to organize information - in this case, consensus was many of the aspects are only worth using when capped, Nemesis made it onto that list
analog sail
Also, play what seems fun if you can't optimize
unkempt pagoda
the last thing in my mind when i think of a fun aspect is a spreadsheet lol
static jacinth
Nemesis gets half of its bonus upfront. It's fine, really.
analog sail
You can basically play anything as long as you're not high heat, so
gleaming current
Most sword aspects need to be maxed out to be "optimal", so 
turbid needle
Every Aspect has been used to clear 32 Heat.
static jacinth
Even Zagreus Sword.
pseudo stream
but the goal is to avoid wasting titan's blood
turbid needle
Yup.
pseudo stream
I got my first win with Zag1, movement speed is no joke 😛
unkempt pagoda
you will get enough blood don’t worry lol
static jacinth
A joke is exactly what I would qualify it as 😄
turbid needle
I guess if Skelly's quest isn't important, you don't need to "waste" blood on Zag Aspect.
But like Onyx said, there's more than enough Titan Blood in the game.
unkempt pagoda
bounties, broker, prophecies, etc
gleaming current
Even nemesis1 will be better than zag5 so you may try it regardless
static jacinth
Zag aspect is the one aspect where I'd be happier if it had less stats.
Get rid of the dash distance.
analog sail
Well if you don't wanna waste blood, then you should pick an aspect you know you're gonna play later and start upgrading it now
turbid needle
I need to use it more, the 25% Dash increase will probably throw me off badly, but it only took me two runs to get used to Snap Nova, and a 25% movement speed increase is fantastic.
static jacinth
It's not bad.
unkempt pagoda
the goal is getting the v1.0 clear with zag sword
analog sail
Inb4 true ending requires 32 heat
gleaming current
would blood price but 40 heat suffice? 
static jacinth
I feel like there will be some requirement for the proper ending. Or at least some IG justification for looping more and making friends.
For people who pick up the game at version 1.0.
unkempt pagoda
i expect a large scale quest centering around the major players in the game who don’t have a quest attached to them yet
(but that’s #h1-story-discussion territory)
static jacinth
All I want, besides more story and information, is to be friends with Tisiphone and Artemis.
There's something so sad about how Tisiphone talks to you.
pseudo stream
which god synergizes super well with Poseidon's Aspect?
is there a Tear attacks thing?
turbid needle
5 of the 8 Olympians have Casts that lodge in enemies, so they tend to work a little better than the last three.
pseudo stream
yeah, and Artemis has Exit Wounds? I don't trust that thing to drop though
turbid needle
It's a roguelite. You're gambling for the build you want, always.
Artemis does have Exit Wounds, which works with both Infernal and Stygian Soul.
gleaming current
Well, no reason to use stygian for Poseidon aspect tbf
But exit wounds should be a good addition to the build, and True Shot is not worst cast pick either
Let's see actually
Crush Shot is rather short-ranged but has pretty good damage
Phalanx Shot is deflect boogaloo but not much aside from that
True Shot is having fun with crits and stuff
Electric Shot is great AoE but pretty hard to pick up the stones as they end up in random positions
Flood Shot is washing away crowds, not great single target though. It does have the duo with Demeter that i have no idea what it does
dry ember
Actually I highly recommend Lightning Phalanx build on Poseidon Sword
your clear speed is nutty
untold vortex
even with non-lodging casts you still get the damage bonus on poseidon aspect :3
unkempt pagoda
^
both demeter cast and ares cast really appreciate posword’s cast buff
which is more than enough reason alone to use it
(poswordon?)
pseudo stream
woah. if you halfway beat a heat, skipping to the next heat doesn't refresh the earlier bounties?
lame 😛
pseudo stream
Phalanx Shot on Poseidon Aspect seemed rad, deflected the crap out of Elysium (stopped working at Styx)
stoic thicket
You will always complete the lowest unfinished heat you have access to when you exceed the heat gauge, and you have to do the heat levels in order.
No skipping ahead.
grizzled oyster
Flood shot with demeter duo was some kind of ice spike that flys really slow. It makes some smaller pools, chills and knocks back, if i remember correctly. It felt really weird.
dire wedge
Blizzard Shot is borderline OP
unreal owl
I assume Hestia is one of the builds that works badly at rank 1? xD
gilded knoll
I mean it's not ideal, but you could clear with it xD
grizzled oyster
Good to know that blizzard shot is good. i got it by accident and it was more of an extra to my build.
spark lotus
is damage bonus from the butterfly saved after a player takes it off?
gleaming current
You can't reequip it later just as every keepsake, so technically it's not saved
Either full butterfly or busted
charred pilot
Can I assume spliting bolt and double strike combo
random hull
Assume it's good? Yes
charred pilot
Yeah it's all lightning effects has a % chance to trigger a second time and all lightning bolts create an additional burst
unkempt pagoda
zeus, probably
but any is good
dio grants quick hangover stacking, ares provides room-wide doom procs, etc
silk mountain
Aight, thanks
broken nexus
I wish I could get Rama bow to work - it just feels so clumsy swapping from special to try to set up a good attack. My crappy reflexes can't cope.
keen zealot
Which boons go with Excalibur are the best?
unkempt pagoda
artemis, but any of the high damage modifier gods can work (aphrodite!, athena, demeter)
poseidon isn't recommended since he has such a low attack modifier
random hull
Divine Strike gets extra points for projectile tennis.
pseudo stream
are legendary boons better than normal ones? considering mirror of night upgrades
restive solar
not necessarily. Legendary boons are very different than normal boons. I wouldn't say they're comparable.
Legendary boons can increase the potency of an existing build, but you need normal boons for them to mean anything
clever matrix
I think the mirror upgrade that gives you rare or better boons has a higher chance of occurring
inner ivy
does anyone have any tips for the shield? I haven't unlocked any ||aspects|| on it yet.
oh
inner ivy
i imagine base shield is pretty rough huh?
iron shale
i started out with jsut dash heavy attack builds
inner ivy
i see
inner ivy
i think i only use the dash attack, everything else seems either slow or weak
iron shale
the aspects makes the shield alot cooler
inner ivy
ill try to grind some out
inner ivy
i mainly have been grinding heat on fists and wanted to give it a try, it looked like it has a lot of defensivep otential
inner ivy
ill give it a try
iron shale
there is lots of cool stuff
inner ivy
i really love the athena special on shield specifically, makes stuff like the witches circle trivial
iron shale
poseidon zeus duo boon with poseidon special on zeus shield
is also crazy
or just dionysus special and aprodite attack
inner ivy
ah that combo
i think for the last 2 weeks or so ive been using that duo almost exclusively
iron shale
how high are you with malphon ?
pseudo stream
re: legendary vs rare, it's actually legendary vs epic (10% to 20%) and it seems that epic is probably significantly better? or are duo boons also good enough to be worth considering?
inner ivy
ive been meaning to give that a try. ive mostly been playing with zag aspect
get epic hermes dodge chance boon and roll the dice
iron shale
@pseudo stream duo and legendaries are more fun = D
inner ivy
ive also been lacking in aquiring duo boons. i just recently watched a video that said duo boons have requirements to get them to drop?
iron shale
yes
most duo boon requirements are you have to have a base slot boon of both
so attack dash cast call special
pseudo stream
hmm... 10% increase for stuff you may not even qualify for does seem significantly worse
static jacinth
A relatively large amount also synergize specifically with a cast.
iron shale
and then there are some like demeter artemis were of course you need demeter cast
static jacinth
If you're often going for duos and legendaries, it makes them crop up a fair bit more.
inner ivy
i see
iron shale
i play mostly with rares + duo mirror
inner ivy
so lets say i have artemis cast and ares special. does this mean hunting blades has a higher chance to spawn?
iron shale
and its not like you have a higher chance
it means it can only appear from that point on
inner ivy
i should experiment with this
iron shale
the wiki has nice lists
inner ivy
ill take a look
iron shale
on what you need
iron shale
good ?
inner ivy
hmm
ive gotten that artemis boon that says all damage you do have a 5% crit chance and im kinda like...... ok?
iron shale
yes ?
inner ivy
how do i make that useful? 5% doesnt really seem all that useful to me
main osprey
it's also just a small global damage buff
inner ivy
i see
i used to play monster hunter world, and in that game anything below 95% crit was deemed bad. i guess i was applying that logic here
iron shale
its not monster hunter world for sure
if you want big damage hits
aphro or artemis attack ro special is the way to go
inner ivy
right
as far as i can tell DoT is very popular in this game huh? stuff like hangover and doom
iron shale
doom isnt a dot
only dots are styx poison hangover and the one freeze boon from demeter
i geuss aphro ares duo is a dot xD
inner ivy
oh! i have another quick question if you dont mind
iron shale
sure
inner ivy
ive been having an issue where ill fly through the first 3 levels quite easily, and then ill reach hades and not be able to kill him because my damage seems to be so low
iron shale
well what are you builds ?
steady hatch
i think it's easier to learn how to dodge other bosses' abilities
inner ivy
i tend to do aphro and ares/dio
but i guess i dont focus on getting a particular duo boon, i just kinda grab whatever i can get
steady hatch
ares and dio aren't necessarily great against bosses unless you have a very specific setup
inner ivy
i see
iron shale
Dio aphro
inner ivy
so should i be trying to go in with a specific duo boon synergy in mind?
inner ivy
im kinda hung up on dio because earlier on i really needed the poison to kill thesius and asterius so i always grab it
iron shale
But yeah its also more of a whole picture thing
Like mirror
Keepsakes
Companion even if you wanna go that far
static jacinth
The important thing about fighting hades is to avoid taking damage.
Learn his patterns.
inner ivy
see thats the thing
static jacinth
You can't just face tank him unless you're in a very comfortable position.
Since he's very hurty.
unkempt pagoda
the most important thing about fighting hades is not dying
inner ivy
i generally do very well, then get hit with a burning blood and die
inner ivy
and if i dont get long knuckle with malphon im toast
static jacinth
Wait for him to attack, then slip in for some hits, then back away again.
If you've got extra dashes, you have more room to be cheeky.
inner ivy
yea, thats true
steady hatch
i found fists to be trickier until i learned how to avoid abilities
iron shale
Also you can use skellys keepsake
inner ivy
its usually the burning blood that gets me and i get clipped by his spin
iron shale
For another death defie
inner ivy
ive been better about avoid ing it
yea i used to use the tooth, but i like going in with achilles keepsake. has good synergy with aphro
thanks for the tips guys. so what i need to do is have more build synergy regarding boons/mirror and play safer against hades
steady hatch
acorn gets better if you play with hard labor on
inner ivy
is that the one that negates the first 3 instances of damage during a boss fight?
steady hatch
it gets up to 5
static jacinth
Yes.
steady hatch
try to learn to avoid hades' spin is the main thing imo
inner ivy
hard labor...
steady hatch
heat option, +dmg from foes
unless you have that on skelly keepsake does kinda the same
inner ivy
ah, the flat damage upgrade
i can see why that would be better than achilles with that activated
static jacinth
Skelly keepsake is 100 health, plus whatever overflow damage Hades does.
Each spin does 40 damage.
inner ivy
right
static jacinth
So max level Acorn blocks 200 damage.
Maybe a shade less if you get hit by other things.
steady hatch
it's easy to burn acorn charges on summoned foes tho
static jacinth
Got to learn to dodge those at least.
inner ivy
though, i have seen some discussion that says once you use acorn and its gone you have a dead item
steady hatch
200 is best case scenario
static jacinth
I mean, you only bring it along for Styx.
Who cares if it's a dead item at that point?
inner ivy
thats what i mean
steady hatch
it dies instead of you
static jacinth
Achilles's keepsake wouldn't block 150-200 damage through the whole fight most likely.
inner ivy
yea thats the thing
ill give it a try
i dont think ive ever played with hard labor on though
that one scares me
steady hatch
you don't need to
i just mentioned that when hard labor is on, acorn is the clear winner
static jacinth
Hard labor isn't required for Acorn to be better.
inner ivy
yea i understand
I still kinda struggle against some of the more bullet hell aspects of the game
inner ivy
I can kill the hydra Everytime, but it's not perfect. I usually end up losing a good amount of health or 1-2 death defiance
static jacinth
Remember that dodging gives a whole lot of i-frames.
inner ivy
Yes indeed, I love them iframes
Stuff like the witches circle without Athena cast/dash is rough for me
steady hatch
athena attack is great too
main osprey
another thing to remember: dash-strikes lose i-frames
inner ivy
I used to play spear and had no issues at all
But spear didn't feel as satisfying as malphon
static jacinth
Athena dash doesn't actually add iframes.
Just makes your iframes more reflective.
steady hatch
spear is the clunkiest of them all...
inner ivy
Right
I feel like the iframes in this game are quite generous
Relative to other games I've played at least
main osprey
actually, re: Athena dash
it does add i-frames, in a way, in that your dash-strikes still have i-frames
gleaming current
Not true ones, but close enough analogue, that is
A few attacks will pass through
inner ivy
I imagine the touhou players are laughing at the hydra fight
gleaming current
Hydra fight isn't even bullethell smh
inner ivy
I guess it's not exactly bullet hell
But there's lots of spam on the screen to avoid, that's close enough aha
But to backtrack a bit, spear is clunky? How so?
It felt pretty neutral to me
steady hatch
personally i just find it slow and awkward compared to other weapons
gleaming current
Spear is sword without swings 
steady hatch
and i couldn't think of good builds to go for
inner ivy
I see
steady hatch
right now im testing hades and it seems a lot better than i thought
inner ivy
I find sword to be unplayable for me. I can't even kill Meg consistently with it. No idea why
gleaming current
Haelian opened my eyes on hades aspect actually
Seems pretty intriguing with 150% buff
steady hatch
i noticed that someone did 46ish heat with hades aspect
inner ivy
Ah the spin
gleaming current
Punishing sweep, mind you
inner ivy
The spin is a very big animation commitment to me, so I kinda had to pass on that
Unless I can get the quick charge spin
gleaming current
Aint gonna need full spin charge to get buff and poke foes, so ig it can work without the quick spin at times
steady hatch
i decided to take it for a spin on 34 heat
steady hatch
that boon has some crazy numbers
main osprey
I only have lambent plume for extra movespeed, and this is the last hermes boon I'm gonna get, so I'm not taking it, but dang
main osprey
xD
steady hatch
not saying i'll actually finish this run...
inner ivy
Tbh I've cheated my way to my low 6 heat
I just took extreme measures and convince fee
Convienece fee
The "easy" pacts
gleaming current
Obviously you won't take something harsh like routine inspection 3 for that. Lel
inner ivy
Oof
static jacinth
I take Extreme Measures, Benefits Package, Tight Deadline 1, Heightened Security. Those are relatively easy pacts to start things off with.
unkempt pagoda
take middle management, and start working on forced overtime to get the practice in
steady hatch
currently im playing without forced overtime
unkempt pagoda
HS is deceptively difficult to work with lol
steady hatch
it's one of the hardest options imo
especially if you have slow animations to work with
(like the spear spin)
unkempt pagoda
it's not fun to get hit by a 100 dmg elysium arrow lmao
inner ivy
Heightened security scares me
I think I might have heightened security 1 activated tho...
unkempt pagoda
i didn't realize how much i get snagged by a tartarus trap or land on the edge pixel of lava until i turned HS on
inner ivy
That's what happens to me too
I used to mess around with pierced butterfly, and I noticed I would take a bit of trash damage and not get the buff
It's always the lava or a trap
gleaming current
Best way to die is to enable HS and then chain dash into lava pools
inner ivy
At least in Tartarus/Asphodel
gleaming current
trying to dodge them
inner ivy
Oh yeah dude
It's like, I just gotta kill this one guy to proc the butterfly
And I touch 1 lava pixel and it's gone
unkempt pagoda
but with HS now you can take 5 damage at a time instead of 1 on lava 😎
inner ivy
That's....
unkempt pagoda
and it ramps! fun fun fun
gleaming current
Oh hey, gotta save a few seconds killing yourself with lava for SD
beneficial pact condition
inner ivy
Is lambent plume and the butterfly just for meming?
gleaming current
Sorta
unkempt pagoda
doesn't feel beneficial whenever i dash on to lava trying avoid lernie's heads
inner ivy
I can't imagine them working on high heat
gleaming current
Me neither unless actual god is playing
unkempt pagoda
i mean, they're challenge runs on their own right
gleaming current
Jury Summons
inner ivy
That's a hard counter the the plume
unkempt pagoda
don't take it
gleaming current
Benefits Package 2 is surprisingly effective at killing pierced butterfly runs
unkempt pagoda
you don't want to take JS with tight deadline anyways
and forced overtime can actually help out with TD and plume, since it makes enemies spawn faster
gleaming current
And approach you faster, even
Although some like bloodless become pain in the arse
unkempt pagoda
or savior numbskull rooms
inner ivy
You know
This is an interesting game, I'm normally very bad at rougelikes
I hated the binding of issac
static jacinth
That's because Binding of Isaac is kind of a bad roguelike.
inner ivy
The rng factor was too high imo
static jacinth
I've used both butterfly and lambent plume in 10ish heat.
They're not bad.
Just sort of inflexible.
main osprey
just finished a plume run on 9 heat
inner ivy
Jesus
unkempt pagoda
when you have TD2 you want to kill things fast anyways, so plume is actually sorta synergistic
main osprey
I think I got the plume bonus from every room?
would've been fine if I'd taken TD, actually didn't have it
unkempt pagoda
butterfly on the other hand
main osprey
blehg
inner ivy
What a god
unkempt pagoda
butterfly is for runs without TD
main osprey
take plume, and get Rush Delivery
inner ivy
So were you just invincible with 70% dodge chance?
main osprey
nah
unkempt pagoda
since every room is basically an erebus room
main osprey
30ish%, plus 36% after using my call
inner ivy
Erebus.... I don't think I've seen that. Should I have seen that by now?
unkempt pagoda
multiplicative
main osprey
oo, yeah
inner ivy
I have
main osprey
then check the contractor
inner ivy
I did see something mentioned about that... Didn't buy it tho
unkempt pagoda
so around 45% dodge
main osprey
yup
and I had Artemis' boon that increases the rate at which my gauge goes up with crits, plus pressure points
I had a really solid DPS build
unkempt pagoda
if you can, avoid benefits package 2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=76f9TJvB7Gk
main osprey
absolutely shredded armor
oof
yeah
I don't even need to follow that link
BP1 is a solid pact option
BP2 is hell mode but worse
unkempt pagoda
bp2 is hell
unkempt pagoda
savior (the regenerating blue hearts) interacts really badly with speeder (increased speed), and i also had forced overtime on
inner ivy
Yikes
inner ivy
So
unkempt pagoda
bp2 is chaotic
inner ivy
Do you think this game will get seeded runs eventually?
I don't know if that's the right term
steady hatch
it's sort of happening already
unkempt pagoda
i'm not sure if sgg would give us the ability to seed runs, but you can share seeds pretty easily already
unkempt pagoda
by sharing save files
inner ivy
I'd love to do some custom seed shenanigans
My absolute favorite build is Poseidon special malphon
inner ivy
Shoryuken people into walls and just mug them
main osprey
check out #h1-victory-boasting
inner ivy
But it's a shame it doesn't really work on bosses :(
Bro
How did you manage to beat Hades in time?
Did you just liquify him?
main osprey
yeah
inner ivy
I've seen clips of people doing that, gotta try it for myself
valid locust
If you like to SRK people, wait til you hit them with Shinkuu Hadouken.
pseudo stream
what did people say were the best calls? Athena and Dionysis?
main osprey
that sounds about right, though some of the others have situational OP-ness
main osprey
ooh yeah, Pos is really good
pseudo stream
trying to decide between epic athena attack (magnet fists) or epic athena call
unkempt pagoda
attack will have more use, assuming an attack talos build
static jacinth
I might go for Athena call.
Fists have better attacks, and having free reign to wail on bosses is really good.
Fists of Malphon also generate god gauge really fast.
pseudo stream
do they? how so?
also I kinda regret it but I went for the fists 😢 turns out they don't deflect as well as I was hoping
valid locust
Aphrodite's call with her Zeus Duo Boon might be the best.
static jacinth
They just generate it very quickly.
I'm not sure about the mechanics exactly. I guess it's some per hit gain thing.
And yeah, fist attacks are very fast, so the deflect window isn't huge.
pseudo stream
that's the 5% per second one? got that for the first time last run, coupled with +20% damage after using a call
was... rad
also just bought my first Titan's Blood! (for money)
unreal owl
what are your recommendations for a good Hestia build/run?
fallow niche
@unkempt pagoda Hows does it feel knowing that I just put Spear at the top of the leaderboard this update 
i will force people to respect my bae zag spear ❤️
pseudo stream
woah. Zag spear is that strong?
turbid needle
Flurry Jab is.
pseudo stream
that's the triple poke?
random hull
The continuous poke.
pseudo stream
oh it's that good? I think I had it once
dry ember
what are your recommendations for a good Hestia build/run?
Deadly Strike Heartbreak Strike Huntee Dash or most any %damage boon. Hestia is strong but fairly one dimensional. You just buff your attacks, that's it.
cunning urchin
Divine Dash > Hunter Dash.
dry ember
Who needs safety when you shoot for 500 per
cunning urchin
Divine Dash gives you more mobility.
solemn pumice
I hate stubborn defiance and I only use it because I'm missing Touch of Styx for the prophecy but it never shows up. Is there some hidden condition for it to show up?
cunning urchin
Nope.
solemn pumice
Is there any reason to use stubborn defiance? It seems plainly worse until you get touch of styx dark
And then you can just kill yourself at the end of fights for free heals
cunning urchin
It lets you circumvent the lack of healing when you have Lasting Consequences at 4.
solemn pumice
Ah, so it's just a high heat thing
cunning urchin
And it gives you more effective HP over a run. Death Defiance gives you more HP in a single encounter.
solemn pumice
I figure if you're constantly dying throughout the run, you're going to have a hard time with the bosses
cunning urchin
Some weapon aspects are especially strong in boss fights, and the bosses are generally more predictable.
Chaos Aspect is great at room clearing but struggles in boss fights.
Hestia is the opposite.
solemn pumice
Maybe it's just me but most of my losses are to bosses
cunning urchin
Well, there are a lot of pacts that have a big impact on regular chambers.
But they don't affect boss fights much or at all.
E.g., Benefits Package makes elites way stronger, but it has no effect on bosses.
iron shale
@solemn pumice yeah i felt the same as you
i actually only saw its value on high heat
when i made my first 32 heat run
with the touch of styx dark upgrade its ultra strong
when you got no healing because of pact
dire wedge
Once I learned about abusing Stubborn Defiance I've never returned to Death Defiance since.
novel tapir
Not until you start trying fairly high heat numbers imo
Newer players should stick with DD
static jacinth
That's the beauty of the game. All the options are viable, depending on situation and playstyle.
Don't get too caught up on 'Better'.
mighty ermine
except maybe zag sword 
eternal quartz
I avoided Zag's sword until the previous Weekly Challenge and it turned out to be quite alright, suprisingly
depends on the heat ofc
mighty ermine
yeah, i absolutely think it's viable still
just wouldn't ever see someone call it broken, probably
eternal quartz
oh, I misread it, thought it's been called broken XD
gleaming current
I figure if you're constantly dying throughout the run, you're going to have a hard time with the bosses
@solemn pumice That's true, it's probably the biggest limitation in SD viability: low safety pool on boss encounters
However, it also means that you won't die from fatigue after several hard encounters (be it regular rooms or earlier bosses) that get rid of all DD charges
Personally preferring SD since it is a resource to be actively used rather than one that discourages spending it. Constantly reviving in rooms to keep health on point and grab chaos/other benefits on the way. Patty is almost always a run winner, too
Not spending obols on heals as well, just max health
weary gust
does athena/artemis duo requires you to actually deflect a projectile?
cunning urchin
Any attack, not necessarily a projectile.
barren otter
Can Chaos' legendary show up if you use stubborn defiance?
cunning urchin
Yes.
barren otter
Good to know
inner ivy
This is good
Each mirror effect seems to fairly balanced and had uses (as far as I can tell) and a lot is based on preference. As far as I can't see nothing is straight busted
gleaming current
Fiery presence is rather underwhelming most of the time, other than that pretty much anything is nice and has a worthy niche
SD is busted but you gotta work for it hard to be busted
static jacinth
Honestly, even Fiery Presence has its place.
If you're going Hestia Rail, it's often the better choice.
Makes clearing rooms loads faster.
Which lets you more comfortably reach bosses, which Hestia Rail does just fine at thanks to range.
gleaming current
Indeed
cunning urchin
Hestia imo is the single best aspect for boss fights.
static jacinth
It's super safe, which matters a lot, and does excellent damage.
green plover
I'm really struggling to use the rail's attack as an offensive measure on its own. Mostly because it's not compatible with my playstyle.
I would prolly use it only for an effect e.g Doom.
mighty ermine
it pairs very handily with lightning strike from zeus, since that boon loves rapid hit, low base damage attacks
green plover
It's mainly due to how I use the hit-and-run and stun to my benefit.
Which is something not doable with Rail at all.
mighty ermine
yes, you have to maintain proper spacing even with unarmored foes
green plover
I meant Rail's attack. You can do it with the special but it's slow.
green plover
I use the stun more.
I don't care about the damage when I'm just trying to stun enemies.
iron shale
why stun when you can oneshot = D
mighty ermine
you don't have to stun if you keep your distance, really
gleaming current
Can't oneshot armored foes 
earnest quartz
What's the consensus on the cast lodge mirror? The one where you do either 50% more damage or slows the enemy
Does the 50% just add to your other damage bonuses or is it multiplicative with your other bonuses
mighty ermine
additive
gleaming current
Almost everyone I know likes damage one, but slow/weaken is extremely viable on bosses too
and ye it's additive
earnest quartz
Additive doesn't seem that strong though
green plover
Keepin distance is really difficult or doesn't matter because foes close in on you really quickly, especially where it matters, like in Styx and Ely.
Or attack from quite far away.
earnest quartz
The debuff doesn't affect attack speed?
mighty ermine
i don't know what to tell you other than it is possible to keep your distance from foes and not need stun
including elysium and styx foes
green plover
Like I said in the beginning, it's not the playstyle I've developed.
mighty ermine
right, and i don't really have much advice for that other than you will eventually get used to it, if you keep playing with the rail
green plover
I just have to get used to enemies not stunning only for the Rail attack. I somehow end up relying mainly on its special for damage.
I just tried a wonky run with the Rail and me being used to the stun caused by other weapons really hurt me when I rushed in to hit a respawning Soul, attacked it instinctively or when I'd just launched my special elsewhere and then my damage just wasn't enough to kill it.
static jacinth
Does Darkness from treasure troves heal you with that one mirror buff?
mighty ermine
do you remember which attack boons you had during runs where you felt you couldn't do decent damage with your attack?
@static jacinth yeah
if you don't have lasting consequences active, it's a huge heal usually!
gleaming current
Around 60-75hp is pretty fat indeed
green plover
Yeah, wonky build, I tried to use Artemis just because, Hades, I could.
mighty ermine
i'd definitely recommend trying zeus attack on rail for some good results fast
it also snowballs easily into jolted and potentially splitting bolt
green plover
Well, I have had pretty good, even broken rail runs. It's just that I tried to make the Attack the main focus of the build in a different way and it didn't really work out. That exposed the flaws in my playstyle also some potential flaws of the Rail's design (not necessarily flaws, I can't really explain it correctly) and whatever misplays I shoud avoid with it.
mighty ermine
it sounds like you've had a constructive learning experience in the end, then, which sounds good to me
you'll only get better with rail from there
gleaming current
Rail definitely has it rough coming from other weapons, mostly because you can't move and attack without a dash
(bow is pretty similar case but it is burst damage, opposed to hold to fire)
green plover
it sounds like you've had a constructive learning experience in the end
I made it a learning experience by giving it some proper thought. I was internally screaming blood and darkness at the build and the weapon when I was in Styx. Lost all my DDs in there for the first time. And then I gave up struggling against Hades and let him kill me.
green plover
I'll try the weekly challenge. Am I supposed to record the runs?
Seems to be the case, just asking. Because I'll have to see how it works with Windows' recording,
errant narwhal
Some people just share their victory screens, so you don’t need to record it
dry ember
Yeah no recording needed. Just use the honor system that you followed the instructions. If you check the Weekly Hall of Fame, plenty of people just submitted screenshot.
inner ivy
so
with regards to malphon, what do you think is a good boon combo?
im thinking of trying aphro/artemis
cunning urchin
Divine Strike + Hunter Dash > Support Fire + Deadly Reversal.
broken wadi
ooh, I need to try support fire on the fists, that sounds dope
broken wadi
last fist run I had was dyonysus attack, but the rest of the boons were utterly busted, so not sure I can judge based on that lol
cunning urchin
It's not bad for room clearing, helps a lot with Damage Control, but the damage on bosses isn't good.
broken wadi
huh, I guess it helped a lot with making use of the feather that run
cunning urchin
Once you cap your stacks, any extra hits will just be the base damage.
hybrid frost
Is Curse of Drowning worth taking with Hera Bow?
cunning urchin
No idea. 
hybrid frost
Seems like its counter to the bow's intended function.
cunning urchin
Maybe try it out, and see if you can make it work effectively.
hybrid frost
Well, I've got Point-Blank Shot so it might work out.
mighty ermine
could probably work especially paired with point-blank shot. an unorthodox way to play, but yeah
cunning urchin
Most builds that are meta now were very unorthodox or niche at some point.
mighty ermine
would synergize perfectly with snow burst as well if you could manage to net that
cunning urchin
Coronacht often doesn't have that much distance anyway.
Or maybe it's just me lol.
If you want a lot of backstabs, you have to be pretty aggressive and get close and personal.
hybrid frost
Hmm, doesn't look like multiple loaded cast are staking.
mighty ermine
huh, thought that they should considering they do with beo loading
hybrid frost
Well the behavior is weird. If I load 3 stones, only 2 pop out of Zag when the pulse ends. The 3rd is refunded imediately.
And the dmg doesn't seem to be going up with 2 or 3.
silk mountain
Is it just me, or spear is really the worst weapon?
turbid needle
Common consensus right now is Bow is weakest.
Current patch speedrun WR was done with the spear.
mighty ermine
flurry jab is wild
cunning urchin
Varatha is also the second weapon to clear 50 Heat after Aegis.
turbid needle
I knew it was super strong.
mighty ermine
silk mountain
Or maybe Guan Yu is simply not for me, I might try other aspects
cunning urchin
What level is your Guan Yu Aspect?
silk mountain
2, I think
cunning urchin
It's very hard to play without maxing it out.
Even at Lv.5, it can be very rewarding but still a challenge.
limber estuary
I'm about to start a run with Guan Yu, any recommendations? Never tried it before and idk what boons to go for
cunning urchin
You can't make a lot of mistakes with -50% HP.
Divine Strike is great for an Attack build.
stuck elbow
Tbh Guan Yu at higher heat gets really rough. Elysium turns you to mush due to the lower HP
cunning urchin
You'll also want to try to get Quick Spin.
silk mountain
What aspect is best for lower heat, then? I was thinking about Zagreus and trying some sort of special build
turbid needle
Zag or Achilles.
cunning urchin
Deadly Flourish and Heartbreak Flourish are both great for a Special build on Guan Yu. Ideally, you'll want Charged Skewer for that.
mighty ermine
zag spear with explosive launcher makes for very breezy low heat runs if you want to do that
cunning urchin
Zagreus Aspect is the cheapest to max out, too.
5 Titan Blood for max level. That's just 2.5 clears.
limber estuary
Deadly Flourish and Heartbreak Flourish are both great for a Special build on Guan Yu. Ideally, you'll want Charged Skewer for that.
@cunning urchin I'm gonna try that and I'll come back to report, thanks!
cunning urchin
And then you have a max-level weapon to get more clears with.
silk mountain
I still need to check what these flourishes are, but thanks for answers 😄
These charts are pretty handy, but I don't understand duo boon charts
mighty ermine
deadly is artemis (low % and crit chance) while heartbreak is aphrodite (high % and weak)
silk mountain
Time to try Zagreus, then
stoic thicket
Zag aspects are generally pretty good, aside from maybe the sword. That Zag aspect is certainly useable but just kinda "meh".
keen zealot
Artemis with Excalibur is good
I can wreck like 750dmg in a level 1 crit
But it's slow
dry ember
inner ivy
Oof, vanilla shield is so rough my god
I like how I can punch people into walls for free but... This dmg is pitiful
dry ember
there is a reason why it's F tier in my list
and don't even let me tell you about pre Blood Price Zag Shield
turbid needle
Zag Shield is incredibly strong. 40 base damage on Attack and Dash-Strike is massive.
limber estuary
Just did my run with Guan Yu, went Artemis Special + Charged Skewer. It was ok, I didn't have problems clearing the run (only heat 2) but it felt kinda boring to play. With the low health,I felt like all I could do was dashing - special - dashing, wasn't really fun
dry ember
to some, winning is fun, to others, challenge is fun
limber estuary
Sure :) I might give Guan Yu another chance later, but not for now
dry ember
try serrated point build
with hunter dash and deadly strike
if you want the thrill of a glass canon build while relying mostly on melee range attacks
broken nexus
just can't get rama bow to work though have been focussing on levelling it up. Thinking of refocussing to chiron to see if that's better. Any thoughts on relative strength. I'm not a good player so the easier to use the better. If that seems a good swap, any tips for using Chiron, or boons / gods to look out for?
random hull
Chiron is good against single targets, and with stackable statuses. Good combinations include Heartbreak Strike + Drunken Flourish, preferably with Low Tolerance; or Curse of Agony + Divine Flourish (or the reverse) with Merciful End.
Chiron is pitifully weak at level 1, and is best upgraded as far as you can.
Frost Flourish + Arctic Blast is also quite effective.
As for hammers, Relentless Volley + Concentrated Volley is the dream combo.
mighty ermine
yeah
worn sand
Is it just me or is the magnetic fist aspect pretty underwhelming/weak?
Feels like it’s strictly worse than the other aspects
broken nexus
any views on why eurydice awards are best in which circumstances ? finding this hard to judge
mighty ermine
it's usually not too complex, really. pom porridge is great for when you have a good amount of boons, with some that you value currently and would benefit from levels. ambrosia delight is an easier choice to make when you've got fewer boons but you value them enough to upgrade and improve level scaling down the road. refreshing nectar i'll typically take if my boons so far are pretty bad or if i have almost nothing anyway
that's how i work it out personally, but i figure a lot of other players feel similarly to an extent
broken nexus
thanks that's helpful
and is there a consensus with the mirror on god's pride vs god's legacy?
tepid ridge
Both are good, but legacy feels like it scales well in the late game once you know what gods and their boons open up which options.
pseudo stream
That’s epic vs legendary?
keen wedge
is crush shot with hera aspect good ?
unkempt pagoda
there are recent high heat clears (40, 42) with crush shot hera, so i assume so
i've heard the hitbox can be a little wonky at times
keen zealot
Yoooo, I can't seem to make malphon awesome
It pwns in the brginning
But in late game, the regular attacks can't stigger enemies
And I ended up getting hits
Any suggestions?
hearty elbow
Athena attack is great for learning in the beginning, especially against armored casters
frank tide
kind cloud
Does anyone have any suggestions for a rama build (for around 12-18 heat)?
I missed out the period of time when rama+zeus special was a weapon of mass destruction. Now it's been nerfed and I can't find any builds that impress me.
(For minor context, I dislike the bow - A LOT. I just can't adjust to any of the aspects no matter what I try.)
keen zealot
Athena boons seem to do a lot of deflecting
Not so much offense, no?
I usually avoid picking her lol
unkempt pagoda
she has pretty good damage modifiers, and her cast is quite strong
gleaming current
As far as im aware her damage % on attack boons is amongst the worst
But oh well deflect on certain attacks creates impenetrable walls
hearty elbow
Does anyone have any suggestions for a rama build (for around 12-18 heat)?
@kind cloudAt that heat level, Dio special with Aphro'Ares attack, and aim for the duo(s) is great, it should wreck
I like Aphro special with Artemis attack too and Divine Dash
Pretty sure Athena's % bonuses are tied for 2nd with Demeter
kind cloud
@hearty elbow
I tried aphro special. I immediately did not like it because I knew damage would not scale in later levels especially against final bosses.
But dio special is intriguing. I'll try that. Thank you.
I've noticed that chaos shield is kinda similar to rama aspect in that the builds that optimize chaos shield seem to optimize rama aspect as well.
static jacinth
On attack, Aprhodite has the best one. followed up with Demeter and Athena. Then Poseidon at Third. Artemis at Fourth for raw bonuses, but she adds crit.
The rest add their own debuffs instead.
hearty elbow
Rama is not that flexible. There is stuff that works and stuff that doesn't. Heartbreak Floursih for spreading Weak easily for Heart Rend
static jacinth
For special it's actually a little different IIRC.
With Poseidon taking second place, and then Demeter and Athena at third.
kind cloud
I figured rama needed a duo boon to make it strong. I just never seemed to get the right ones. The only one that kinda worked was zeus+poseidon
hearty elbow
@static jacinth You are correct with both statements
static jacinth
But Aprhodite remains the one with the highest raw bonus for both special and attack.
hearty elbow
It doesn't. It needs attack hamers, of which there are plentiful
For low/medium heat, Triple Shot + Chain Shot is my favorite. It will obliterate packs, and gives you serious shotgun damage too
static jacinth
Also at lower heats, your attack with shared suffering lets you do tons of damage to bosses.
So long as you can hit that power shot window.
hearty elbow
Oh god no, I never go for the power shot with Rama, it's such a trap.
You don't need it as long as you have Triple/Exploding/Point Blank shot
static jacinth
At higher heat it takes too long and enemies will bop you in the face for trying.
Which is honestly sad. Poor bow.
hearty elbow
It's my favorite aspect but it has... problems. It's nowhere near as bad as people say though, and it's pretty cleanly the best Bow aspect, for whatever that matters
kind cloud
i'm doing a rama+zeus special run right now. I'm trying for poseidon dash with razor shoals.
static jacinth
I enjoy it a fair bit.
Though I also really enjoy playing with aspect of Chiron too. I feel like it's not as bad as people say as well.
But I'll have to work my way up to 40ish heats to prove it.
I think the damage you get from it is respectable enough.
Even if it struggles with swarms.
hearty elbow
It's not as bad as people say. But it's not good lol, and has no avenues for very high heat
static jacinth
I think it'll fall apart in the high 40s for sure.
But at 40 I think it's quite doable.
hearty elbow
Just don't go DC or JS, ezpz
static jacinth
DC is workable I think. Just get a good dash for rats, like Poseidon or Ares.
hearty elbow
I tried Chiron at 32, it's mostly harmless, then i lost 2 DD's to tiny rats in Styx
to DC2*
static jacinth
Ouch.
hearty elbow
And that was the last time I'm taking DC2 on Chiron lol
static jacinth
Haha.
Well I'll see how I feel.
I want to reach heat 20 on all weapons first.
Then focus on climbing with the one.
I'm also slowly accustoming myself to FO and EM3 while I do it.
Since I'm still having a rough time with Asterius.
hearty elbow
That's what I did. Got to 20 with everything then put all my eggs in the mastering Rama basket
I just want to beat the current record of 48, that's not asking too much ❤️
static jacinth
That's the Rama record?
hearty elbow
And bow, yes
static jacinth
Well, good luck to you!
hearty elbow
thanks!
modest steppe
What are the best boons and hammer upgrades for Chaos Shield?
hearty elbow
Boons: Thunder, Drunken, Curse of Pain (Agony? Can never remember which is the special)
Hammers: Sudden Rush, Explosive Return, Charged Shot (not with explosive return obv) Ferocious Guard
kind cloud
Well, i got zeus legendary and i can confirm it's pretty damn good on rama special (but not super elite like it is on chaos shield)
light leaf
@hearty elbow curse of pain is the special yes
orchid iris
does anyone know if curse of drowning works with razor shoals
cunning urchin
Agony => A => Attack.
unkempt pagoda
pain -> P -> Pspecial 
@orchid iris i would assume so, since it just causes your flood shot to pulse around you, and flood shot can inflict rupture
also, that’d be a weird interaction if it didn’t rupture
cunning urchin
Psecial.
orchid iris
It seems to but I’m not sure that it works with second wave, cuz I ended up with all 3 of them and the waves didn’t seem to be doubled on the pulse
turbid needle
Obviously sPecial.
random hull
I think in retrospect that Curse of Fear and Curse of Terror would have been fitting names for the doom boons - named after Ares' children.
cunning urchin
I think the names in the game are pretty good.
turbid needle
Someone in here a few days ago was wondering what the trigger for Hermes in Styx was, and it at least is not having a prereq for his Legendary. No Auto Reload on this run and yet here is here.
static jacinth
You mean in Styx rooms or in the shop?
turbid needle
Shop.
turbid heart
how does attack speed increase work for Lucifer aspect? i mean i dont really see it shooting faster?
cunning urchin
That was me. And I found out I just completely glossed over his boon in the shop 99% of the time because I wouldn't have 900 obols anyway.
unreal owl
is Lucifer any good at rank 1?
eternal quartz
imo yes, as I don't really use its special
beam is fun to use and with Zeus attack for example is quite good. Or Poseidon, where you act like a firefighter with water hose 😉
unreal owl
I see 😂
eternal quartz
bit different playstyle than your usual rail, but worthwhile for sure
rare kayak
honestly no idea what its special does
is it just increased blast damage on special?
the laser does a lot of the work, it stacks damage pretty decently fast and can scale well with something like zeus boon
random hull
The special gives off stunning damage pulses before ignited, making the orbs good for crowd control and status infliction.
rare kayak
i meant the level up, not what the special does
random hull
Oh, that would be increased explosion damage
rare kayak
i dont think the orb pulse damage increases on level up
but i could be wrong
i wonder if minos run triggers on the special
random hull
Orb pulse is seperate from that, I think, but that can be tested out on Skelly. Don't have the time now, though
rare kayak
ive found limited success on sisyphus on minos btw
the coin and darkness creates a corner which traps the bull a lot easier than the columns
gilded knoll
Lucy aspect can trap EM Theseus and apparently neither of them can destroy the orbs?
Haven't tried it for a little while though, so it might've been patched out xD
hearty elbow
I need... something to clarify what you even mean by that. Can enemies not step over the bombs or something? If this existed I'm pretty sure it doesn't anymore, since I've used Hellfire in EM3 (maybe that's different because of the AoE explosions and attacks) and the bombs pretty much explode instantly
random hull
The orbs are physical obstacles to Zagreus at least (from what I remember), so they might be to non-attacking enemies. They will immediately blow up when attacked, so they will not halt Theseus on his chariot significantly. The explosions may stagger non-armored normal enemies.
hearty elbow
Yeah, I was mostly intrigued because he specifically said EM Theseus. Maybe it's during his "taunt" phase?
valid locust
@cunning urchin think you had a point with these Beowulf Charged Flight shenanigans, hit a 3K crit with this
hearty elbow
Yeah it feels like ranged Arthur
valid locust
bleh, thought it was the victory boasting channel
charred pilot
Does the Acorn work against Charon?
gleaming current
It's not the last zone encounter so supposedly no
charred pilot
yeah i thought so.
worn sand
How many hammer rooms can you skip & still get 2 by the end of the run?
tepid ridge
Lmao Asterius’ charge is so jank
unkempt pagoda
Near-Miss! Near-Miss! Near-Miss! Near-Miss! Near-Miss!
eternal quartz
I have a feeling, that zana was like "I'm quicker than him, I'm quicker than him, I can do it!-- Damn, forgot about Theseus..."
also, that was a lucky shot
unkempt pagoda
i like to think they coordinated that shot
clever matrix
I didn't realize that theseus's spear can also hit asterius. makes the fight more fun if you try to lead the shot to hit him instead
also kind of sad since they're friends
unkempt pagoda
charming one of them while they're close and in the middle of an attack will basically take care of a phase for you
clever matrix
oh yeah I love using charm
trim gate
how many lvls in shield of chaos should i have for it to start using it?
dry ember
at least 3 imo, ideally max
trim gate
i mean i would guess max is best for all weapons, i mean minimum to be viable
unkempt pagoda
you want it maxed though, more than some other aspects
inner ivy
hmm
can anyone offer some tips for the sword? i have no idea why i keep dying on heat 0 with it...
its functionally a malphon reskin but i always seem to take so much trash damage
cunning urchin
Dash-Strike. Hit and run.
Ideally with Nemesis if you have it.
But if the enemy doesn't have armor, you can just stunlock them.
stoic thicket
Get into a rhythm of special -> dash strike -> dash strike.
inner ivy
ah
i got some terribad hammer upgrades so i was really relying on the dash attack
its suprisngly good
i had the one that makes your attack super slow but do 90 base damage. thats such a trap aha
unkempt pagoda
the hitbox might still be bugged
inner ivy
the hitbox was extremely small
it seemed to be a very very thin rectangle in front of you
a lot of the sword hammer upgrades seem.... lack luster?
or am i mistaken?
calm cosmos
I seem to have lots of trouble with the Spear, anyone have a build I should be looking for?
unkempt pagoda
flurry jab for attack, serrated point for dash attack, exploding launcher for special, massive/quick spin for spin builds
hades spear likes one of the spin hammers + either serrated point (for attack builds) or exploding (for special builds)
of course, you can always go quick + massive for hades spear, since it has built-in spin support, for a great spin build
guan yu likes quick spin or its exclusive hammer, and really really loves charged skewer
inner ivy
spin...
unkempt pagoda
i've heard good things about distant jab, since it turns a midrange weapon to essentially a melee long range one, but i haven't personally tried it
calm cosmos
Is there any reason to use the base spear over the spinny one?
dry ember
they all spin, some are longer, some are girthier
i do think Hades Spear is the more exciting spear to use
(personal preference, not based on scientific testing)
cunning urchin
Zagreus Aspect holds the current WR for speedruns.
Hades Aspect holds the WR for highest heat cleared with the Eternal Spear.
Basically, they both can be very strong.
static jacinth
Zagreus aspect is quite good. Special spam.
turbid needle
Haelian just took the WR back with Nemesis and is currently working on widening the gap, but if you're really unsure just look for Flurry Jab on Zag or Achilles Aspect, that's what got the record while it stood.
unkempt pagoda
hades speedrun summoning salt video when
unkempt pagoda
right
turbid needle
Chaos right or Trial right?
unkempt pagoda
oh i didn't even see that
main osprey
don't see chaos?
turbid needle
Zoom in, gate's behind my resources.
clever matrix
id say go get chaos?
turbid needle
Check my boons.
turbid needle
Thanks zana, Onyx.
cunning urchin
The correct answer was Erebus.
main osprey
lmao
turbid needle
It was that or Chaos, but Chaos is throwing me either a fatty Ambush boon or Affluence, and I think I'm taking Affluence since I have so much gold.
Er, Pauper's Affluence, that is.
agile charm
Chaos shield OP? Feels kinda OP
main osprey
a little bit?
clever matrix
why doesn't crystal beam do chill effect? 😔
main osprey
because there's an upgrade for it that gives it chill
it would stack chill way too fast by default
static jacinth
Just grab another.
unreal owl
does pressing space during Varatha's left click charging count as dash strike?
main osprey
nope, that's dash --> spin attack
clever matrix
oh i just got offered glacial glare (applies chill to cast) or cold embrace (aphro/dem duo) lol
main osprey
cold embrace is tricky to pull off
clever matrix
I guess it could work for bosses that chase you?
main osprey
kinda? it still has limited range
and it doesn't go through everything, I don't think
instead of tracking enemies slowly, it tracks you super quickly
clever matrix
hmm yeah I think I'd prefer glacial glare since i'm too used to using cast and then running away
dire wedge
cold embrace is tricky to pull off
Yes, you need to have a build with it in mind to maximize its potential. I wasn't a believer until I started building around it.
clever matrix
anyone know if roiling shot affects aspect of hera
dire wedge
After the roiling curse wears off it should