#h1-builds-and-combat

1 messages · Page 139 of 1

waxen dragon
#

Darn it, failed a Beowulf and regular rail gun run

rotund sluice
tropic palm
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Im so bad at anything other than shield, fists or spear damn

formal mesa
#

Yeah been playing for a while but rediscovering the game with my brother 1nd forgot how the stacking keepsakes worked haha

final coyote
#

King DDD

rotund sluice
#

I’m a Mac

plain river
#

Rail is like really good but not everybody figures out how to build it right away and a bad rail build just feels like your hitting with rubber pellets

plain river
#

I was this close 🤏 to grabbing thunder dash on crit nem just now

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Would’ve been so bad

tropic palm
#

but wdym dash stirkes

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bow has dash strikes??

rotund sluice
tropic palm
#

I neber knew this

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damn

rotund sluice
#

Bro they’re central to playing the bow

tropic palm
#

I just did bow normally

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and got to hades

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without using dash strikes

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💀

rotund sluice
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Did you win?

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Learn dash strikes

tropic palm
#

I may or may not be bad at playing bow sword and rail

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also the fact that

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my builds are never completed

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even with keepsakes

rotund sluice
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Never?

tropic palm
#

okay they're completed in elysium

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never is an exaggeration

rotund sluice
#

Depends on the build

tropic palm
#

Posei dash + Dio Special + Aphro Attack

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and

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Posei Dash + Artemis Attack + Aphro Special

rotund sluice
#

Weapon?

tropic palm
#

Bow

rotund sluice
#

Sounds like Chiron

tropic palm
#

yep

rotund sluice
#

You don’t need splash dash for Chiron tho

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That’s last priority over the other two

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It’s nice

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But certainly not needed

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Also what do you count as “finishing” that build

tropic palm
#

Just getting these three 💀

rotund sluice
#

Do you not have rerolls?!

tropic palm
#

I do

rotund sluice
#

They’re core boons!

tropic palm
#

its just that bad

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my luck

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lemme see if i can get heartrend on a new run

rotund sluice
#

If you want duos remember to use gods legacy

tropic palm
#

its amx

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max

rotund sluice
#

Also of course it’s gonna take three biomes to get three boons from three different gods

plain river
rotund sluice
plain river
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Um

tropic palm
rotund sluice
#

Or Ooga booga work too

rotund sluice
#

At least think he is

plain river
#

dash strikes are 50% faster and deal 2/3’s of the damage so you do the same amount of base damage but you’re way more mobile and you can benefit from dash-strike bonuses

tropic palm
plain river
#

and you just pump out more consistent damage

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can’t get stunned as easily

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umm

rotund sluice
#

And you dodge more

plain river
#

I’ve got a pretty good clip somewhere

rotund sluice
#

Though Sar uses Chiron

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Sooo

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It’s not as important to spam

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(Personally I dislike Chiron but to each their own)

plain river
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There

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Mind you this boss fight is done with FO2 on so meg or alecto or whoever is 40% faster

rotund sluice
#

Thing go fast

tropic palm
#

Oh yeahh

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Alecto is hard with bow

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so dash strike would help

plain river
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just

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In general

rotund sluice
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Most bosses are easier with dash strike

plain river
#

There isn’t really a reason to ever

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stop dash-striking

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unless you get so good with bow that you know the breakpoints by heart

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and then you know when to standing strike

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or you’re using pseudotech

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But I am not teaching newbies pseudotech

tropic palm
#

Bro speaking einstein now

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wth is pseudotech

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😭

rotund sluice
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You don’t need to know

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Some animation cancel bs

plain river
rotund sluice
plain river
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Tbf I am

rotund sluice
#

My point exactly

plain river
#

I was gonna say my best times are now on Eris and Fists but my best heat is still 40 with bow

rotund sluice
plain river
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Sweat like

tropic palm
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Sweatiest

plain river
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Indidn’t pick the game up again 4 days ago

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After not playing for like

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6 months

tropic palm
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Lazy sweatiest

rotund sluice
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Sweat like I’m jealous as hell and I’m venting

tropic palm
#

Bro got the pro jealous 💀

rotund sluice
#

Bud he’s played more than me

tropic palm
#

I have ares attack and posei dash, what cast should I do

plain river
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He’s just annoyed cuz I swapped weapons and beat his best time and then I swapped to his weapon and beat his best time

tropic palm
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posei?

rotund sluice
tropic palm
rotund sluice
rotund sluice
plain river
tropic palm
rotund sluice
#

CURSE OF DROWNING?!

plain river
#

You just grab what you need and then fill the rest in with whatever you can find that doesn’t kill your duo odds

rotund sluice
#

WHAT DOES HE NEED

plain river
#

help

tropic palm
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idek what the duo bw the two is

rotund sluice
#

HE HAS ARES ATTACK AND NO DDASH FOR ME

tropic palm
#

I just got them and it shreds

rotund sluice
plain river
#

not both

rotund sluice
plain river
#

they both have great builds independent of each other

tropic palm
plain river
#

But they do not have a good build when used together

tropic palm
#

but im shredding

rotund sluice
#

Also where are you rn?

tropic palm
#

Elysium

plain river
# tropic palm but im shredding

They are both strong independently, so they work fine together, but they lowkey don’t work as well together as they do on their own independent builds

rotund sluice
tropic palm
#

😭

plain river
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Like what was my pace earlier with pure ares strike no ME um

rotund sluice
#

Like imma be honest grabbing Zeus cast might just let you get sea storm and be better than if you never touch that attack again

tropic palm
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bruh

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getting hated on for getting a shredder build 😭

rotund sluice
#

POSEIDON DASH IS SHREDDING

plain river
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Oh yeah I beat Hades at like 10:38 without ME but with ME that build would’ve cleared like 2 minutes earlier

rotund sluice
tropic palm
#

YOU GO AND TRY THE BUILD

rotund sluice
plain river
#

Tbf if he has no poms in tdash

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Doom might be doing work yk

tropic palm
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in any

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except when im forced

plain river
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what the heck

tropic palm
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:D

rotund sluice
plain river
#

a pom literally doubles tdash value

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And

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doom

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you’re throwing

tropic palm
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thanks

plain river
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you’re welcome

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The pom scaling on tdash and doom is crazy

rotund sluice
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You know what

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I retract all statement

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I apologise

rotund sluice
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WTH

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Poms plz

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Love for Pom

plain river
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2 levels in doom raises your damage by 50

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That’s basically two rarity bumps

tropic palm
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depends on rarity

plain river
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what

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poms are independent of rarity

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They scale exactly the same for all rarities of a boon

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Going from level 1 on tdash to level 2 is always +21 damage

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Same thing with doomo

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Level 1 -> is 30 and level 2 -> 3 is 21 iirc

tropic palm
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im p. sure not

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cast when epic has more damage

plain river
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Level 1 -> 2 is +20% on aphro strike

tropic palm
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when pom

rotund sluice
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Imma take his word for it

plain river
tropic palm
tropic palm
rotund sluice
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Im hating on the pomlessness

plain river
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And I can literally just hop into a game and tell you how much a pom will give you

tropic palm
plain river
#

It’s a science

tropic palm
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do it for different rarities too

rotund sluice
plain river
#

This is a graph taken straight from game code

tropic palm
#

Im not doing heartbreak flourish...?

rotund sluice
#

Those seem pretty identical

plain river
tropic palm
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you're telling me, that if i were to upgrade my common tdash rn

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i would get 30

rotund sluice
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Yes

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Oh sorry no

tropic palm
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and if i got epic tdash in next run, i would also get 30 only?

plain river
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What

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Epic tdash goes 49 + 21 = 70 at level 2

tropic palm
#

You said that rarity doesnt matter

tropic palm
plain river
#

Rarity doesn’t affect the value a pom adds

rotund sluice
#

They are

plain river
tropic palm
#

lemme see for myself

plain river
#

Going from level 1 to level 2 on tdash will always boost it by 21

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Going from level 1 to level 2 on aphro strike will always boost it by 20

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Going from level 1 to level 2 will always boost a doom strike by 30

rotund sluice
#

In math terms:
On a graph, approximating the increase to our linear equation (it’s not) the different rarities would have different y-intercepts but all the same gradient (the increase from poms)

plain river
#

The rarities though

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It depends on the boon whether or not the value of a rarity is static

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Like a common doom will always be 50 to start, then 75 for rare, then 100 for epic

tropic palm
rotund sluice
#

Wait actually

tropic palm
#

Thats more clear

rotund sluice
#

Math saves the dayyyy

plain river
#

But for the +% strikes they go up by 1.3-1.5* the bonus for rare, but 1.8-2.0 for epic

plain river
#

the

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helly

tropic palm
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lemme see if Wiki has info

plain river
#

Wiki sucks

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Wiki is maybe 90% accurate on the information it does contain

rotund sluice
plain river
#

Every so often I’ll check something and go “huh that doesn’t look right”

rotund sluice
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Even if it confirms what we’re doing

plain river
#

and then low and behold

rotund sluice
#

It’s not

plain river
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Like unironically what is so hard to believe about a graph that is made with the data ripped straight from the game files 😭

tropic palm
#

Shackle, the easier way to say this is, some boons have % increase while some have base no, increase

plain river
#

what

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Which part are you hung up on

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like

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this whole time I thought you didn’t believe me when I said “hey the value a pom adds at a given level is the same independent of rarity”

rotund sluice
rotund sluice
rotund sluice
tropic palm
#

My common tdash was offered to upgrade by 21, now will the same happen for rare and epic

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thats it

plain river
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yes a rare tdash will get +21 from it’s first pom

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And so will an epic

tropic palm
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thats it

plain river
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that’s

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what I’ve been trying to convey

rotund sluice
#

Yes

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And me with the linear graphs thingamabob

plain river
#

I feel like I said that pretty much word for word

tropic palm
#

I also still wont take poms unless forced

plain river
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A few times

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bruh

rotund sluice
plain river
#

You’re just shooting yourself in the foot

tropic palm
#

Thanks

rotund sluice
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you know what

tropic palm
#

I appreciate the complement

rotund sluice
#

Let them be

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You do you Sar

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If it works it works

plain river
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Maybe it’s too 5:53am but I don’t get it

rotund sluice
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And if it’s not working then they know why

rotund sluice
tropic palm
#

ill let you know when i win

plain river
#

like at worst you make your tdash at least 40% better than it was without any poms

tropic palm
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with only the forced poms i get

plain river
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and

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you’ll have given yourself a harder time for what

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you can absolutely win without poms

rotund sluice
#

Yes

plain river
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You don’t need boons at all

rotund sluice
#

Duh

plain river
#

boonless category my beloved

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oh ykw without any boons you can upgrade, poms give you like 100 or 120 obols instead

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money making activies

rotund sluice
#

I didn’t know that

plain river
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I don’t remember the precise value but it’s at least 100

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It might be 120 but it’s def a multiple of 10

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I haven’t seen it in like 2 years but I remembered cuz we’re on the topic and then I started talking about boonless

rotund sluice
#

I can think of a few reasons

plain river
#

being an absolute mad lad should be done for insanities sake

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not performativity

rotund sluice
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Oh fun

rotund sluice
plain river
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I dunno

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I’m talking about of my bum

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😁

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I feel like anybody who describes themself as “an absolute madlad” is a bit

rotund sluice
plain river
#

that’s rather unmad

rotund sluice
plain river
#

like you understand what I’m talking about thou

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Self-proclaimed absolute madlads are rarely mad

rotund sluice
#

Madness comes to a point where one understands their madness and doesn’t care

plain river
#

or lad

rotund sluice
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Is that not mad?

plain river
#

see

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That takes

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a step farther

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Than most

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“Absolute madlads” have ever taken

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I would agree with you though, if someone shambled out of an alleyway, shaking, and told me they were an “absolute madlad”, I’d believe them

rotund sluice
#

Like being mad and not realising it is pretty mad, but KNOWING and IGNORING is a mad decision, which makes it madder. And “Absolutely madlad” KNOWS it’s a weird thing to say, and denies the societal contract of “sanity”, abandoning anything for what they wish. And tho that’s a mad philosophy, they advance beyond it with indifference and does it anyway.

plain river
#

have you ever seen the bellcurve memes

rotund sluice
#

No

plain river
#

oh

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Um

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k

rotund sluice
#

Dm me

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Might be easier

plain river
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Do you know what a bellcurve is?

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Cuz I’ll rig this up in like

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2 minutes

rotund sluice
plain river
#

Lowkey

rotund sluice
#

lol

plain river
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I blanked on how to actually make something bell curve shaped

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So it took me longer than I anticipated

rotund sluice
#

There should be one where it’s just
“Is madlad”

plain river
#

That is the rightside

rotund sluice
#

Ah I see

plain river
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I imagine

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Cuz in my theoretical mind world the left side is an idiot with a high view of themself

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The middle has a good grasp of themself and others

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And the right has a good grasp of themself

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and knows they are infact the madlad, nobody else

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This is so far off topic

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I need to beat your fists pb with this nifty new sword build Alex told me

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Apparently my views of sword speedrunning are outdated 😔

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but good news is is this new build is so much more consistent cuz instead of ME it uses tdash

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Crit nem but you start with tdash and take shoals and bwave

plain river
#

Ngl would it kill the game to let me start off with dedge

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or at least breaching slash so I can shred armour

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wdym my options were cruel thrust world splitter and dash nova

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Dying takes to long so I’m going to keep giving up and then breaking more pots to shift rng

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For goodness sakes man

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I’m judt trying to get a good speedrun time

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Maybe after sub10 I should go sub8 all weaps

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It doesn’t seem that implausible

rotund sluice
#

Like flurry jab

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Rocket bomb

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Twin/triple shot

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Relentless volley

plain river
rotund sluice
#

Charged skewer

plain river
#

I didn’t realise I was implying that I was starting c1 with the hammer

rotund sluice
#

Oh you aren’t?

plain river
#

I mean I get a few chambers in and then reset when I see the hammer at like c4 and it’s bad

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Cuz no double edge for sword is so much time loss

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or breaching cross for fists

rotund sluice
#

If you’re offered it c4 then you’re likely gonna be offered it in Tartarus if you give up

plain river
#

Yeah

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But you can rng manip the seed so easily

rotund sluice
#

yeah idk how…

plain river
#

the first room reward is always set in stone

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But after that

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Breaking pots, having cast stones hit the ground, reloading, and summoning all shift rng by 1 rng value

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so you can effectively roll a new seed after c1, or after c2

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this is actually uber useful when there is a chaos exit in c1

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Cuz you can guarantee a good chaos

rotund sluice
#

Oo yay

plain river
#

This also disqualifies a run from speedruns

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😁

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you can do this same trick on the anvil in styx and bouldy boons

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And it should work for eurydice but for whatever reason it didn’t

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back when I tried it last

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Those are the only 3 room rewards that will let you exit the run after taking them and reenter the room before you bought/pick them up

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So as long as you shift it an amount of times you haven’t shifted it already

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You’ll have a new seed value and can get a different reward

hardy wedge
#

zeus shield is now my favorite weapon
just had extremly fun playing with zeus on special, ares on attack and cast, artemis on aid and aphrodite on dash
found the zeus special plus the hunting blades super strong and easy to use
plus it was my first time killing hades without dying

rotund sluice
#

Congrats on the deathless fight!

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Zeus shield is considered very safe

hardy wedge
rotund sluice
#

Luck is a skill

hardy wedge
#

now im wondering if i should spend my titan blood upgrading the shield or chiron bow

rotund sluice
#

Well you like the shield

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So max out aspect of Zeus

hardy wedge
#

yh the funny thing is, i started using the chiron bow bcs i liked it a lot, so i just did a bunch of runs with weapons that i hadnt done a run yet, to get more titan blood, and now i find something that i enjoyed just as much 🥲

rotund sluice
hardy wedge
still vortex
#

For merciful end build on Zeus shield, think Athena is better on special or attack?

plain river
#

meanwhile chiron lowkey sucks until level 4-5

plain river
#

and since the doom is typically the most important part of the build, the rarity scaling of both curse of pain and agony means an epic does 100, and the main difference is poms after that... but lowkey the pom dif isn't high enough imo

#

it's also just nice to be able to do the d-strike doom -> ddash drop by yourself if you end up further away from your shield than intended

hardy wedge
#

my chiron is lvl 3, i could upgrade it to 4 rn

plain river
plain river
#

yeah

hardy wedge
#

idk if i should like focus on one weapong that i like and use it all the way to end game, or just try to be as versitile as possible and try everything

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the problem is i absolutly despise the sword and the gun (i havent got any aspects for any of those)

plain river
#

sword it's lowkey no questions asked Nemesis

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it's level 1 is the strongest and honestly it's level 1 is probably the strongest of the sword aspects with the others at level 5

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Rail has options because every aspect is good at the minimum

hardy wedge
#

ig i just havent played around with the sword too much, the move set feels soo weird, ive grown used to the bow/fists

plain river
#

Eris is your best bet, Hestia literally triples it's damage from level 1 -> 5 so I'd put that off until you have more blood unless you want to go all in on it

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zag is kind of a discount eris

hardy wedge
#

guess i will try the nemesis sword

plain river
#

are you kbm or controller

hardy wedge
#

controller

plain river
#

ok yeah

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I find sword to be

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a bit annoying to use

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I've been trying to sub10 with all my weapons and sword is the one I've been using rn

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it's playstyle is similiar to fists w/ the dash-strikes but you have to be way more precise on your dash-strikes

hardy wedge
#

yeah alot of the times i miss it

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ive grown used to the fast attack type of build

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the sword feels so slow

plain river
#

I pretty much find that if I want to hit on the second strike, I have to dash and then wait a bit and strike

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so that it's within the d-strike range of time

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but I have enough time to aim it

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it's annoying but I'm getting there

hardy wedge
#

you will get there eventually

plain river
#

I'm so close

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I got a 10:08 earlier

hardy wedge
#

what are the pacts your going with?

plain river
#

it's just the speedrun pact

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extreme measures 2, forced overtime 2

hardy wedge
#

i havent gone past heat 2 tbh, im still kinda new to the game, i havent unlocked everything yet

plain river
#

EM2 makes the heads bunch up in the lernie fight so it's easier to take multiple out at a time, and forced overtime 2 causes enemies to spawn faster and move to you faster

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I've done 40 heat w/ zag bow and 32 with pretty much every other weapon

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aside from spear

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because I lowkey suck w/ spear

hardy wedge
plain river
hardy wedge
plain river
#

see my spear problems are the same as my sword problems, they're both very thin dash-strikes

hardy wedge
#

i rlly like the dash strike on the spear

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but i have no idea what builds to rock on weapons that doesnt hit as fast, like how do you make it strong with such few hits

plain river
#

uhhh it's pretty much mainly +%

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like

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aphrodite typically has the largest +% modifier

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and the weak debuff is the most beneficial secondary effect of the +% gods aside from arte

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like for zag bow it's normally between artemis and aphrodite strike, and then the other on something else to open heart rend

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for nemesis it's either a crit build like that, or Merciful End

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shield is usually just charged shot with +%

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It sounds like you definitely don't have the hidden aspects atp

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so idk if I should comment

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if you look at like pos sword, achilles, bugowulf, hera, and talos they can all pretty easily go for cast builds

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also

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chaos

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chaos

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chaos

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Chaos is your friend for damage

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strike damage and dash strike damage go crazy on most weapons

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so does special damage on like sword, rail, zeus shield, special focused spear builds, fists

hardy wedge
#

i could unluck 3 or 4 rn, i just dont know where to spend my titan blood

plain river
#

do you have guan-yu already?

hardy wedge
#

i tought it would be bad

plain river
#

Merciful End is good on everything that breathes

hardy wedge
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not bad

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but not as good

plain river
#

how so?

hardy wedge
#

merciful end is the duo that aplies doom everytime a attack that deflects hit

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right?

plain river
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yeah

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wait

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no

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it drops doom everytime a creature with doom is hit by a deflecting damage source

hardy wedge
#

yeah

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so wouldnt it make sense that a fast hitting weapon does more damege then a slower one?

plain river
#

so it works the same way that it does on fists and every other weapon that would run merciful end, you put doom on strike, athena on special, and take divine dash, and dash-strike like hell

plain river
hardy wedge
#

i mean like, cant you aply the merciful end effect on normal attack? hence why fast hitting would be better

plain river
#

ME builds use divine dash to trigger it, so the dash-strike hits, applies doom, and then divine dash hits

plain river
hardy wedge
#

yeah, normal fist attacks can deflecy, with athena

plain river
#

that's why the ddash combo works so well

plain river
hardy wedge
#

🤯

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ive been doing it wrong

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this whole time

plain river
#

that's why I clarified earlier

hardy wedge
#

oooohhh

plain river
hardy wedge
#

in my mind it was something like
doom on normal attacks
normal attacks can deflect
just spam

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oh so thats why i saw a few people saying aspect of demeter is great with merciful end, since it can hit multiple times with its special

plain river
#

www

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thats

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not really the right logic?

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aspect of demeter is the best option for fists because it hits multiple times with the special, but the special multi-hit is independent of any ME shenanigans

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none of the other fists really have a good damage boost

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but the demeter special is a solid nuke, especially with athena +%

hardy wedge
#

ok so wait, lets say i put doom on normal attacks, athena on special to deflect, i aply the doom and the hit the multiple strike special, would all of the strikes trigger merciful end?

plain river
#

no

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what Merciful End does is that

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an enemy that has doom has like a 1.1 second duration before it drops

hardy wedge
#

yeah so ive got the wrong idea this whole time

plain river
#

hitting w/ a deflecting boon makes the time remaining 0

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so you still have to reapply the doom afterwards

hardy wedge
#

yeah make sense now why the dash strike is better

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you can deflect and aply doom at the same time

plain river
#

👍

#

that's why practically every weapon is good at running it

hardy wedge
#

yeah just i was just thinking rn, if merciful end worked the way i tought

#

fists would be like

#

extremly op

plain river
#

if it worked the way you thought, I reckon the speedrunning times of fists would spike up actually

#

actually wait I second

#

if ME worked how you thought initially, how would it even work

#

because as far as I can tell, you initially thought it made deflect boons apply doom

hardy wedge
plain river
#

but what doom damage number would it use

hardy wedge
#

to be precise i tought it worked like, put doom on normal attacks, put athena on special, look for merciful end, and than look for athena boom that makes normal attacks deflect

#

i tought it would be like

#

everytime i attacked

#

with normal attack

still vortex
hardy wedge
#

it would inflict the doom instantly

plain river
#

you can't have two cores for the same slot at the same time

still vortex
hardy wedge
#

yeah ive never actually managed to pull it off

#

thats why

#

lol

#

i legit spent like 20 hours trying

plain river
still vortex
hardy wedge
#

i told you i was new in the game

plain river
#

I guess it's just I had immediately gathered/assumed you couldn't get two cores from the game ui and the exchange system

#

like

#

within the hour I had the game

#

actually it's kinda surprising that you wouldn't've run into an exchange if that was 20 hours

#

or any lengthy period of time

still vortex
#

I haven’t messed around with merciful end much. Like I think I only had it once before. And I have 550 hours into it. Like 400 clears and I’ve cleared heat 32.

plain river
#

lemme check how many times I've used ME

hardy wedge
#

there a lot of game mechanics that im still learning, i found out today that i can only get up to 4 different gods in each run

plain river
#

29 times used

still vortex
#

You can force more with trinkets.

plain river
#

forcing more with trinkets is like

#

ill-advised unless you need them

#

you can naturally get all 8 though

still vortex
#

But I play family favorite almost all the time

plain river
#

but it takes some set-up

plain river
still vortex
#

But it does you get 5% per each God

hardy wedge
plain river
#

no

#

forcing your build is good

#

but expanding your god pool lowers your own build consistency

still vortex
#

Not using trinkets it’s just a random meme run

plain river
hardy wedge
#

yeah i always try to stick to 3 gods most of the time

plain river
#

it's pretty much

still vortex
#

I’m trying to get into privilege status more often

plain river
#

force 2nd most important for asphodel

#

even if you found them in tart, usually best to grab them again

still vortex
#

Most of my runs I’m going for choice duos anyways so forcing God’s with trinkets is a must

plain river
#

the utility/ defense for ely and defense for hades

hardy wedge
plain river
#

the trinkets make the next boon you see that god until you pick it up

#

so

still vortex
plain river
#

ohhhhh

#

I'm blind

#

yeah you just swap your keepsake

#

if you really wanted you could seed your run but at that point just get all the gods you want in tartarus

still vortex
#

I play on vanilla switch.

plain river
#

The brute force method

#

Is

#

Uh

#

Tedious

#

Well

#

it’s only tedious if you want a lot

still vortex
#

I don’t. Part of the fun is what the fates give me.

plain river
#

w/ the same seed

#

but the rng in Hades is calculated on the fly as you play

still vortex
plain river
#

essentially, every time you break a pot, everytime a cast stone hits the ground, everytime you reload, or everytime you summon

#

you shift rng by 1 value

plain river
#

force closing app

#

unsure

still vortex
#

For blood in the app seems to restart me. I’m in Skelly’s room before I start the run and it starts exactly the same.

plain river
#

then yeah

#

same thing

still vortex
#

It’s cheesy and I feel like it’s dishonorable but sometimes if my seed is just so horrible I start to run over again with a completely different direction

plain river
#

so you can essentially get the exact same tartarus up to a point

#

and then break off

still vortex
#

The worst is when you use a faded authority reroll trying to get Athena’s dash and you have to re-roll twice and you still don’t get it

plain river
#

so like you could get an epic doom from Ares and then play up till you get first hammer, find out it isn't dedge and then give-up the run to keep the epic dooms tart

#

the lengths you have to go to replicate the speedrunning modpack lmao

still vortex
#

I don’t try to touch speed running on the Nintendo switch in comparison to PC gamers with a speed run back

plain river
#

anyhow, I find this works really well if I A) get a good start (epic starting boon for what I want) but an bsymal first hammer, or if the run starts with a chaos immediately in the first room

plain river
#

speedrunning categories are all divided into

#

"modded" and "unmodded"

#

you'd only be competing w/ unmodded players

still vortex
#

My fastest endgame timer run was 17 minutes so I don’t think I am anywhere close to a good speed run category

plain river
#

true

#

that's why you work on it

#

I decided to try to sub10 all my weapons cuz my only sub10 was zag bow as of like a week ago

still vortex
#

I’ll think about. 80s is more of my Zen relaxation game rather than my stressful go fast game.

plain river
#

and then I nailed fists down and then I dropped an 8:01 on my first attempt w/ Eris

#

which was lowkey insane I had a lot of good luck

#

and now I'm trying for sword and it's much harder but I just want sub10

still vortex
#

Nemesis?

plain river
#

yeah

#

there isn't really an other option for sword

still vortex
#

I never got dash striking like a speed runner down. It’s awkward timing that I can’t figure out.

plain river
#

it's harder on controller

#

are you talking about sword specifically thou because I have no problems w/ like any weapon but sword and spear

still vortex
#

I like Poseidon sword. Or Arthur if I want to get to 400+ life and face tank hades

plain river
still vortex
# plain river it's harder on controller

I mean nemesis Artemis dash striking with chaos and hammer boons to boost dash strikes. I should’ve been dominating but the dash strike in rapid combo was hard for me

plain river
#

yeah

#

it's rough

#

I miss a decent number of my strikes

#

my time would be lower if I could hit for the life of me

#

even my best attempt had so many misses

#

like

#

10:08 would've been like a

#

idek

#

tidal dash carries

#

my d-strikes are just along for the ride

still vortex
#

How much does rupture contribute?

plain river
#

I think maybe 1 or 2 of my runs have had Rupture out of like probably 8 attempts atp

#

because poseidon just screws off after he gives me his first boon in tart

#

It should contribute a fairly decent amount

plain river
#

You just quit the run instead of giving-up after you see what you get

#

They’re pretty much the only things that will let you do this

still vortex
#

I love rupture and jolted. They are goated.

plain river
#

Jolted is just busted

#

Ruptured is pretty decent too but I don’t see it nearly as often

plain river
spice cargo
#

oh whoops, wrong channel, thank you @plain river

proper furnace
spice cargo
plain river
#

Now that I’ve sub10 sword all that are left is

#

spear and shield

#

The lesser evil is clearly achilles

#

I don’t wanna touch bugowulf

#

My fastest shield clear is like a 10:53 w/ zeus so

#

odds are I can avoid using it

#

If I’m just goated

jolly chasm
#

No

#

Fall to the dark side

#

We have cool bugs over here

plain river
#

mmm

#

I lowkey just don’t like using shields

#

Do you know what the speedrunning meta is for zeus shield rn

jolly chasm
#

ER ME

plain river
#

Because whatever it is will decide if mirage shot beo is better

#

Oh gosh do I really wanna grind out

#

ME again

jolly chasm
#

Or ZAP er

plain river
#

😭

jolly chasm
#

Er is in rn

#

Cshot is out the door

rotund sluice
#

Er

plain river
#

I wasn’t really expecting it to be anything other than ER

jolly chasm
#

Explosive return

plain river
#

I think I’ve known that for a while but I just wasn’t clear on the boons

#

If ME was prefered or zap

#

Or something else entirely

#

Next thing I know it’s Artemis flourish w/ heart rend and you just stack up 80 billion chaos +%

jolly chasm
#

Zap is too rd reliant

coral forge
plain river
visual cypress
#

Jus realised this is h1 w ho ops

rotund sluice
#

Plz delete your message then

tropic patio
#

I've been trying to complete a run with Aspect of Guan Yu, but that health reduction thing always punches me in the face because I suck at dodging Theseus' spear, any suggestions/boons I should pick to solve this? Thanks!

feral siren
#

For one- level up guan yu if you havent. It is practically unplayable at lower levels

#

For two- remember that you can hide behidnd the pillars

tropic patio
#

Noted!

dull viper
#

athena attack is super strong on guan yu

tropic patio
dull viper
plain river
coral forge
hard pewter
#

I hate Guan yu with a passion.

#

The aspect not the guy

#

Seemed like a cool guy

plain river
rotund sluice
#

Yo what’s the best way to build Hera

#

I know crush shot

#

But what else

valid dagger
# rotund sluice But what else

Try to get snow burst from Demeter and some decent attack. Put all your poms in Crush shot and take chaos gates if they appear, you can use the hourglass trinket to further scale your cast from wells of charon. Grab Quick reload or the usual Rush delivery from hermes for better bossing and room clearing. For hammers flurry is pretty good but will take some getting used to. Twin and Triple shot are always good picks.

steel anchor
#

Whats the best build for sub 10 min run ?

plain river
#

Because that essentially decides the aspect and everything else after that

plain river
steel anchor
#

Yeah I mainly use aspect of beowulf and go for dionysius cast and poseidon everything else

#

@plain river

plain river
#

Ah so that’s a bit different from the usual speedrun build

#

where you take poseidons cast and artemis strike and hunt for mirage shot

steel anchor
#

Yeah my best time is like 15 min 😭

plain river
#

It’s not like an abysmal beowulf build

plain river
steel anchor
#

I see

#

Thanks

plain river
#

and

#

your mirror also plays a major part into it to

steel anchor
#

Wait a sec ill send ss

plain river
#

I figure you’re probably going to get stopped by the needing to send imbedded images part so I’ll just send a ss of my own

#

You’re essentially going to want this, but swap thick skin for high confidence

#

Oh

#

and swap stubborn defiance for death defiance

steel anchor
steel anchor
plain river
#

This was when I was attempting 32 heat on a fresh save file so like

#

hence the stubborn defiance instead of death

steel anchor
#

Oh ok

#

Wouldn't gods legacy be better to get the duo boon ?

plain river
#

Not really? You have really solid odds of finding the duos regardless, and the overall boost to your build for getting epics is usually way more worth it

#

but

#

iirc

#

beowulf is one of the few builds where you can justifiably run legacy to find mirage shot earlier

#

since mirage shot literally doubles your damage thanks to Bug-owulf

steel anchor
#

Oh wow lol

plain river
steel anchor
#

Wait really

#

Well that's good to know

plain river
#

It’s only slicing flare, icy flare and thunder flare that don’t

#

slicing flare and icy flare are a little wierd but thunder flare is treated as a lightning bolt instead of a cast by the game so it has 0 cast damage for mirage shots purposes

steel anchor
#

I also heard that zueses aspect is better for speedrun is that true ?

plain river
#

It isn’t true

#

Zeus is better for heat

#

Beo is the speedrunning shield

#

You just can’t really keep up with the shear damage output of loaded casts

#

it’s so much base damage to get multiplied by additive that you just wipe bosses hp bars out

#

and flood flare or tidal flare or whatever it’s called has so much aoe it can handle itself well in regular rooms

steel anchor
#

I see

#

What about companions ?

plain river
#

Battie

#

she’s really the only companion on the table for speedrunning

steel anchor
#

Well yeah, sorry I mean the uhhh

#

The other things

#

Jeepsakes

plain river
#

There’s a battie guide somewhere that’ll help you with knowing where the important times to use her are

steel anchor
#

Keepsakes*

plain river
#

Oh

steel anchor
#

I'd go poseidon from the start

#

But like what do I pick after ?

plain river
#

Tartarus: force posiedon
Asphodel: force artemis
Elysium: hourglass
Styx: hades call or hourglass tbh

plain river
plain river
#

For the mid-biome area after Elysium to the Hades fight

#

and Hades call just gives you on demand damage

steel anchor
#

True, but wouldnt i want to save up for the charon shop at the end ?

#

I mean coins

plain river
#

No for speedrunning you take every shop you can find and use your obols over the run

#

Also the boosts you can get from wells with hourglass

#

are usually more massive than anything you could pull out of styx shop

#

getting extra casts and cast damage

#

For the most part you want to use your obols as you get them, to get your build together early for consistency and coast through the entire run at max power

steel anchor
#

Okay thanks, you helped me A LOT

plain river
#

I’m trying to think of really anything else I could say

#

There’s a lot of technical skill that you can learn if you watch the sleepsoul intro to speedrunning guide tbh

#

It’s like 3 years old but it’s good enough that there hasn’t needed to be a more recent one made

#

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bxwSsTPubI&pp=ygUPU0xFRVBzb3VsIGhhZGVz

YouTube
SleepSoul
How to Speedrun Hades - Basic Guide (2022)

Community Discord: https://discord.gg/uAvy8W3RdC
My Twitch channel: https://twitch.tv/sleep_soul
Text version of this guide: https://docs.google.com/document/d/16aaLsNytmQFv9JCJN4huTzGqQAREDGezD_fkQe5b4Ms/edit
Collection of other guides: https://www.speedrun.com/hades/guide/1i726

Timestamps:
0:00 Intro
0:44 Leaderboard Categories
1:36 Getting S...

▶ Play video
steel anchor
#

Tysm

plain river
#

The only differences are some weapons have slight alterations to the builds he presents

steel anchor
#

Isn't there something to do with the seed or am I bugging ?

plain river
#

wdym “something to do with the seed”

#

because

#

There’s a lot of things you could be talking about

steel anchor
#

Idk 😭 😭 i heard it somewhere

#

But idk

plain river
#

Like you could mean how the game puts you back at the same point before the run if you hit give up, so you enter the run with the same seed, or you could be talking about how the seed is essentially incremented by 1 by the game whenever a cast stone hits the ground, a pot is broken, you reload the rail or you summon a companion

#

you could maybe be talking about rng manipulating (save scumming) bouldy/eurydice/anvil

steel anchor
plain river
#

yeah

#

It uses the above tidbit about how the game increments the seed over whenever those happen

#

Bouldy boons, eury rarity (should work, not actually 100% as of recent events), and the Anvil in styx can be brute forced to give you what you want

#

Because they’re one of the few things that will let you take them, see what you get, and then quit the run and re-enter before you picked them

#

so you can shift the seed over again and get a new outcome

#

and then shift the seed over a different number of times and get a new outcome

#

Eurydice rarity should work but most of the time it isn’t the play anyways

#

You essentially need a hyper sprint boosted rush delivery for it to matter

#

and then you just want the boost to hit rush delivery and anything else (if your main attacking core scales well with rarity, then that)

jolly chasm
#

Except on Beo

plain river
#

Otherwise you take Refreshing Nectar

#

Doesn’t flood flare scale horribly with rarity

jolly chasm
#

Ambrosia is by far the worst one from eury for speed

steel anchor
jolly chasm
plain river
#

? I could’ve sworn it’s like a 12 damage increase

jolly chasm
#

Cshot + random damage being the two most common

jolly chasm
#

Common lvl 11 is the same as lvl epic 7

plain river
#

I might be too tidal dash and curse of agony pilled

plain river
#

and you should be able to save scum ambrosia but I’m not so sure about that anymore since the last time I tried I got the same result every time

#

which is statistically possible it’s just the odds would’ve been pretty low

#

I’m fairly certain I’ve done it in the past but honestly it’s such a rare situation to be in where I have rush delivery before Eury and I that’s practically the only time I’d even consider taking ambrosia

lost tundra
#

hey guys, i joined today with a question about the zeus shield

#

i recently beat the game with Chiron and dyonisus special, and i found that zeus shield also stacked up

#

for the shield, would building with ares instead of dyonisus be more preferable? or should i keep it the same

proper furnace
#

Ares works if you do merciful end

#

And yeah dio will work just fine

lost tundra
#

maybe someday when RNG gives me merciful end

#

i usually run Chiron bow with dyonisus on special and Aphro on attack for duo boon, and then get Ares and dyonisus duo boon if i'm feeling lucky

#

i know Artemis is more optimal, but there's just something about making your opponent die to extreme amounts of alcohol that makes me feel happy

plain river
#

It’s not that crazy of a difference

lost tundra
#

yeah

#

i want to run shield, because its the same concept, but like... bow and arrow

#

🙂

plain river
#

I mean

#

if you’re running chiron you aren’t really playing bow tizomg

lost tundra
#

you're running aimbot

plain river
#

I’m assuming you mean they’re similiar because they both have charge-up?

lost tundra
#

yeah

#

and both stack things like Dyo and demeter

plain river
#

oh

#

eh

lost tundra
#

you can't prove to me demeter exists

plain river
#

bow does not do stacking outside of chiron

lost tundra
#

shes a figment of our imagination

lost tundra
plain river
#

Tbh on 99% of builds I’d rather dem got removed from the game for consistencies sake

jolly chasm
#

She’s kinda a secondary god in general tbh

lost tundra
#

i honestly forget that chiron isnt the only bow. i kinda just ran fists, beat the game, then read through sum of the weapons then saw chiron and it was love at first sight

jolly chasm
#

No build revolves around dem except meme beam

lost tundra
#

then, i met the hammer that game my special 4 more arrows and it became a throuple

plain river
#

Hera w/ snow burst but even then it’s not because of her cores

plain river
#

Ofc you can have both but it’s like conc > relentless

lost tundra
#

maybe someday when RNG lets me get Conc

#

hear me out tho

#

if you play spear, you're basically playing sniper

plain river
#

Eh

lost tundra
#

prove me wrong

plain river
#

Hestia

lost tundra
#

that's a purple sniper

rotund sluice
jolly chasm
#

E launcher does go hard

plain river
#

Hestia and then if you really want to play a sniper you go explosive launcher w/ chsrged skewrr

#

or guan-yu w/ charged skewer

lost tundra
#

[REDACTED]

#

[REDACTED]

plain river
#

It’s a three button game wdym

#

Spam special, dash and then strike while special is on cooldown

lost tundra
#

with the right build i've seen players barely move

#

but honestly every weapon is broken with the right build

plain river
#

with the right build most of what you do is move bouldy

lost tundra
#

matter of fact, ZAGREUS himself is broken with the right build

plain river
lost tundra
#

ive seen a clip of zagreus beating hades by not attacking or moving

lost tundra
plain river
#

It’s also just really consistent to get triple bomb because of the relatively small amount of hammers that luci has

lost tundra
#

i find that ironic how the best build for lucifer consists of bombs when it has silly laser

plain river
#

it’s like how the best build for chiron is just discount zag bow

lost tundra
#

take that back

plain river
#

actually a more serious comparision would be chaos being bad zag shield

lost tundra
#

i wont accept it

plain river
#

chirons gimmick does have like

lost tundra
plain river
#

one use case

#

for higher heat but I can’t remember what exactly

jolly chasm
plain river
#

do not recall the upside to it over zag bow

lost tundra
jolly chasm
#

Chiron speed is so unfun if you play it like zag bow

lost tundra
#

nothing yall can say to get me to hop off the alcoholism

#

game-wise, of course

plain river
#

iirc chiron does have a higher heat record than zag bow right? But I can’t remember what about chiron puts it in that position

jolly chasm
#

Tim

#

Tim puts Chiron in that position

#

Guy is cracked

plain river
lost tundra
#

ive seen that bow do many things

plain river
#

So if we threw someone of equal skill at it wjth zag bow we should expect to eventually see the same results?

jolly chasm
#

Although I don’t remember if the cursed ass Zeus attack stuff got zag bow to 60

plain river
#

loaded casts are just insane

#

and shared suffering is

lost tundra
#

bull rush 3 cast load go brrr

#

chiron with poseidon is funny

#

it's like watching a tsunami

plain river
#

Ngl every time I think about the fastest Hades fight time I’m reminded of just how much of the Hades fight is just… the invincibility bubbles

#

Came to mind cuz you mentioned the bull rush

#

and I’ve been doing a lot of speed recently

lost tundra
#

hermes? viable?

plain river
#

what

jolly chasm
#

Hermes is the strongest god in the game lmao

lost tundra
#

actually, i take that back

plain river
#

Hermes is overpowered lmao

#

or

#

I don’t want to disparrage the word but Hermes is

#

compared to everything else people say is OP in Hades

lost tundra
#

guys i was ragebaiting

#

ive played dodge build, i know what he can do if you let him cook

plain river
lost tundra
#

40*

jolly chasm
#

Dodge build pales in comparison to rush delivery

plain river
jolly chasm
lost tundra
plain river
#

Do you mean dodge chance or extra dashes

lost tundra
#

dodge chance

plain river
#

I was hoping I’d been mistaken

lost tundra
#

no, you weren't

#

i promise it was a one time thing guys

plain river
#

Speed is too crazy tbh

lost tundra
#

last time i played i ran chiron (like i said, you cant get me off the alcoholism) and i ran the sturdy after dash build, so it was like father and son shield bonding

#

like, i was around the end and one of the rooms had it, so i was like, "sure, why not?"

#

i was done building the alcohol madman, so giving him a little bubble wasn't a huge difference

plain river
#

The other day I had hyper sprint with 3 ichors for 3.46* movespeed with rare rush delivery

plain river
lost tundra
#

gotta go fast! ah build

plain river
#

Goated run sctually lemme pull it up

lost tundra
#

level nine doom

#

why?

plain river
#

wdym why all my damage was doom

#

it was a merciful end build

#

And I didn’t find impending doom until late late

#

So every pom I could went to doom

lost tundra
#

ohhhh i see the merciful end

#

i lowkey just saw dyonisus aid and got excited

#

bet yall could NEVER guess my favorite god

plain river
#

Dio aid is such good damage but I think I got it in styx

jolly chasm
plain river
#

So I didn’t have many chances to use it

plain river
#

Was the 14 ichors run controlled thanthink

jolly chasm
#

The most juiced rd of all time in unseeded

lost tundra
#

shackle can you guess my favorite god?

jolly chasm
#

Dio

plain river
#

Probably Nyx

#

or Hypnos

lost tundra
#

i like how shackle got it right on the first, but i fooled Edward with the distraction of speaking about Dyo this whole time

jolly chasm
#

Meanie :(

lost tundra
#

my favorite god to build tho ISN'T dyo

plain river
#

See I’ve got a track record to maintain

lost tundra
#

i just really like alcoholism these days

plain river
#

I’ve never been wrong in my life

#

(This is a lie)

lost tundra
#

bet you cant guess my favorite god to build though

plain river
#

But I do say it all the time when I’m right about things I shouldn’t possibly know 😁

#

eh

#

Alcoholism mentioned you seem like a gambler artemis

#

2nd guess would be poseidon

lost tundra
#

puts on a pirate hat and starts playing a sea chanty on a rusty sax

#

damn

plain river
#

Yeaaaaa

lost tundra
#

hes too good

plain river
#

The instincts are still at it

lost tundra
#

it's just so funny to watch as i push enemies around

#

underrated character trust

plain river
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Underrated character in like

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his personality sense

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or building

lost tundra
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building

jolly chasm
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I don’t think you can call pos builds underrated bouldy

plain river
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I reckon if you talk to anyone who has spent much time here they’ll be pretty accurate

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I can’t talk for reddit or youtube or gamijg journals

jolly chasm
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Literally the best build in the game revolves around POs

plain river
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That’s stone age level Hades gameplay

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mirage shot beo is too strong and tidal dash is too strong but his strike and special suck

lost tundra
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i might be on the wrong side of Hades media then

plain river
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Pretty much everywhere outside of the discord is the wrong side ngl

lost tundra
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gonna have to update my poseidon gameplay then

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what do you recommend?

plain river
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You know where the high heat gamers and the speedrunners talk? I mean it’s mostly in the speedrunning discord but afew of them are regularly over here

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and not reddit

lost tundra
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reddit and me have never looked eye to eye

jolly chasm
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The hades Reddit is hell

plain river
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I mean

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that’s most gaming subreddits ngl

lost tundra
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i want to see someone solo demeter run

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that would be absolute cinema

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with spear