Those like 5 poms you put into pp that could've net you like probably more than 100% damage depending on how many poms you had on it before
#h1-builds-and-combat
tight basin
last dirge
Sure. I just dont think it would have made the difference
last dirge
I probably should have just taken deadly flourish
plain river
Sure. I just dont think it would have made the difference
It would’ve
cunning urchin
That can very easily be the difference between needing 2 hits and needing 1 hit to kill a Splitter, for example.
tight basin
yeah 100% more consistent damage wouldn't have made the difference
drowsy saddle
how much do you need to get 100% crit on something
like nem has the largest aspect boost right
but then how many poms and stuff
hunters mark would probably be the most efficient pom for crit right?
'
cunning urchin
Hunter's Mark is the most important t2 boon in crit builds I'd say, yeah.
For that reason.
warm snow
like nem has the largest aspect boost right
oooh
so crits can't crit then
warm snow
i meant nem's crit can't also get +200%d, yk
cunning urchin
There are no double crits, no.
vagrant crane
there’s heart rend though
which adds on an extra 50% crit per crit
Heat Rene, We Deliver The Full Crit For Your Crit
summer mesa
It adds only an extra 50%?
summer mesa
It say's it's **+**150%
summer mesa
So more than double the normal damage
vagrant crane
well yeah because it’s a crit
but 300+150 is 450
so with heart rend a crit deals 4.5x damage
summer mesa
Bruh
vagrant crane
while without it a crit does 3x
late wasp
You can get Mirage Shot with Arti call, right?
tight basin
yeah
most cast builds prefer artemis attack to open mirage shot, but if you get scammed and are only offered call, then you just take it
late wasp
Ok which hammer: Piercing Volley, Rapid Shot, Twin Shot
tight basin
this is hera?
late wasp
yes
tight basin
flurry is the best hera hammer but it can be difficult to use
late wasp
Alright
tight basin
otherwise, twin shot would be good
plain hollow
In what situations is ||Demeter|| a good choice of god? From my perspective the benefits they give are pretty weak outside of higher heat runs. Even Aphrodite seems to have more of an application.
tight basin
No need for spoiler here btw
Demeter is a good god for cast based aspects for snow burst and ravenous will. Chill is good utility, and for passion flare beo specifically you have 3 boons that can activate pstatus
Side note, not many builds in general use pstatus and passion beo is one of the few that do
plain hollow
Maybe it's a bad habit but I tend to judge too many gods by their damage rather than their utility.
tight basin
Dem damage cores are kinda mid tbf
plain hollow
I similarly wonder if I underrate Ares, Aphrodite, and Athena and overrate Artemis, Zeus, and Dionysus.
tight basin
Aphrodite has the highest % modifier lmao
plain hollow
I know but she has no damage beyond that. The higher modifier is meant to compensate for weak not dealing additional damage.
tight basin
Ares sucks unless you're building for merciful End or hunting blades
plain hollow
Although she DOES have a boon that makes weak enemies more damage susceptible.
tight basin
I know but she has no damage beyond that. The higher modifier is meant to compen...
Sometimes the raw damage is enough
Like on hestia or hera
Just one shot them lol
Aphrodite on rail special is strong
plain hollow
Poseidon turns Styx into a joke of a biome, but he's pretty blegh on bosses.
And I think Ares has some utility at least, although I don't know if I'd want him on just about any weapons attack or special.
tight basin
Poseidon turns Styx into a joke of a biome, but he's pretty *blegh* on bosses.
That's why people take flood shot or tidal dash
Get breaking wave on top of that and Styx is irrelevant
Tdash is also good for tart
plain hollow
Is Athena good for anything but her dash and a few of her utility boons?
Most I can think of is "she's good if you can trigger merciful end" like you said about Ares.
plain hollow
Speaking of %, Zeus attack seems a bit tough to judge because he doesn't have any damage % on his attack last I checked.
tight basin
Great for high heat with DD cheese
tight basin
Speaking of %, Zeus attack seems a bit tough to judge because he doesn't have an...
Yeah but he's good on fists and especially rail
plain hollow
Although I have had good success with him on faster weapons, especially with a few boons.
Yeah.
tight basin
Static discharge is strong
tight basin
Although I have had good success with him on faster weapons, especially with a f...
That's where Zeus is best
plain hollow
It's good but it needs a bit of setup. Luckily Zeus sets himself up pretty nicely.
"For this Zeus attack you need Zeus boons. Go figure."
tight basin
Yeah he's like the one god where you just grab everything
plain hollow
I think the only boon of his that might be kind of iffy is the one where your god gauge increases more when you are hit, and that's simply because it encourages you to get hit.
Other than that, checking the wiki I can see a situation where every single one would not just be good, but incredible.
Dash might be iffy too but I won't turn up my nose if it's all I can get.
tight basin
Yeah he's always nice to get a ton of
plain hollow
I should maybe give Demeter more of a spin. I might think she's iffy solely because I don't use her. I had a similar opinion on Dionysus my first playthrough before realizing hangover isn't a bad effect.
Especially if you can stack it easily.
opaque hollow
Yeah he's always nice to get a ton of
Got some of ny favourite duos as well
plain hollow
Sea Storm is so fun, especially if you try to do a super soaker build.
tight basin
I should maybe give Demeter more of a spin. I might think she's iffy solely beca...
Tbf you never build around her core boons unless you wanna do meme beams lol
Iirc her duos are kinda mid, her damage kinda mid
Good supporting stuff tho
opaque hollow
Yeah i prefer dio for support
solar siren
Greater Inferno, Triple Beam or Triple Bomb for a super soaker build? hammer just got offered to me right off the bat so idk what to choose
lucid oar
Triple bomb
warm snow
Good supporting stuff tho
rare crop is responsible for 70% of all my heroic end boons
waxen iron
Is Athena good for anything but her dash and a few of her utility boons?
Deflect is good for any attacks that covers a wide area. For example, Athena special bow makes you invisible.
Other than that, Merciful End.
vagrant crane
using the special at all on bow is kind of not ideal
but also athena just has a decent %
fine cope on % taking aspects that start like tdash
sure footing is nice if you've got hs on
warm snow
is it really? how does the math look
vagrant crane
?
trap damage is multiplicative
so if you've got 90% DR from traps and they're doing like 6x
then they're doing 60% of normal damage
warm snow
mmm
tight basin
Heightened security on makes sure footing extremely good
Dad pots doing 150 with HS is horrible
last dirge
Deflect is good for any attacks that covers a wide area. For example, Athena spe...
ME is obviously more meta but I love divine strike on gilgamesh for this reason
I used to do backstabs though lol
Aggro an enemy, dash past them and rotate so you are facing their back, repeat
You can sort of tie it into your attack combo and dash strikes
Obviously fists attack isnt gonna be one/two shotting anything, but its solid
Speaking of Demeter though, if you do a build, I suggest something like Zeus shield and really aiming hard for tier 2 and her legendary
Otherwise chill is pretty trash
Arctic Blast will help a lot
Her duos besides the cast ones are also pretty bad
An epic Rare Crop however can be anything from useless to game changing. I almost got it on my attack for gilga ME last night
vagrant crane
crop is bugged as hell
last dirge
Yeah unfortunately
vagrant crane
i avoid it because i dont wanna gamble on weird rng damage
last dirge
Went on my newest boon which was a hydraulic might I was gonna sell
100% bonus dmg tho
I just wanted it for the doom scaling
I did some math last night on what you need for 1000 dooms in a ME build
About 185 base. Reachable on Epic ofc but much easier on Heroic
vagrant crane
simply manip eury
last dirge
And then a divine dash based ME build and Hyper Rush
You could true
ME kinda proves my meme about Maim
I really should have taken the unique hammer
Boosting the doom in any way possible is good imo
Getting something like Hyper Rush is way harder. Especially since it requires epic Rush
I wouldnt use it at high heat but I took a maim spin and I was fine
I probably would have avoided it with the hammer
Would have had 299 dooms, versus 249. With how rapid you can do ME dash strikes on Gilga, 50 damage is a lot
Maybe it's too marginal though. I just didnt get the good hammers that run.
lucid oar
Epic rd def isnt required
ME gets a lot of its scaling from impending doom
Making rd less relied on
+dashes is often preferred
ivory turtle
K, out of Flurry, Point-Blank and Twin, what would be best for Chiron? I think Flurry to speed up tagging
vagrant crane
uh
well
twin is a good option if you want to pivot to playing bad zagbow
point blank and twin probably less useful than flurry if you're trying to actually use the aspect's bonus
tight basin
flurry on chiron is actually pretty good imo
kinda like same theory behind flurry hera; get the shot out as fast as possible so the brunt of your damage comes out sooner
only issue is that you'd much rather have conc and relentless on chiron than flurry lol
flurry is a good cope pick tho
vagrant crane
well you'd actually want twin because you're playing zagbow 
ivory turtle
That moment when Im playing aph attack and Dio special and I forgot to turn on privileged status
I'm not coping horribly tho so that's good
vagrant crane
should only be a 15% additive diff
ivory turtle
Also I accidentally rerolled twice in tart so I reset and managed to get relentless so that's a plus lol
ivory turtle
Yeeeee :))
vagrant crane
nice
ivory turtle
Is chain shot a good take for Chiron?
ivory turtle
I'm getting that, twin or point-blank
vagrant crane
twin probably just for the dps
ivory turtle
That makes sense
ivory turtle
You can do that! Another strong take is Athena on attack, big deflect make happy
Take anything I say with many grains of salt because I am very casual with this game lol
But that's fun! Putting Artemis on dash is good esp if you get double-edge
tight basin
just pom sphro attack?
yeah that's pretty much all you have to do on arthur
going for smair afterwards is nice for iframes and supplementary damage
last dirge
what can i do with arthur?
You can legit do special builds. Benefits a lot from swift flourish but not necessary. Really you want Double Nova.
Then another special hammer, ideally Super Nova
Artemis or Aphro works. Even Athena works.
tight basin
dash nova
last dirge
I got that and seriously considered it
Dash strike builds work too
Its dash strikes arent any slower but still do more dmg iirc
vagrant crane
Its dash strikes arent any slower but still do more dmg iirc
they are slower
as in
if you quickly dash twice it will only do one
last dirge
If you are going for attack one or the real upsides is it hits a massive area
vagrant crane
arthur has weird dstrike tech where you just hold mouse1
last dirge
Idk I do something in my muscle memory on controller
Hard to explain unless I'm doing it
last dirge
Special only is fun because you always have the consecration up
vagrant crane
if its dash strikes werent any slower people would actually speedrun it
last dirge
It turns magma to normal ground and negates some poison stacking
tight basin
it negates all trap damage
last dirge
On top of everything else
Yeah
Best defensive effect in the game
Even if a trap is touching the corners of it, it works
tight basin
yeah but it's hardly used in the extreme ends lol
vagrant crane
the real best defensive effect is actually doing damage
last dirge
Fair yeah
tight basin
not used in heat (except between waves) because it's so slow
last dirge
It's also clunky as hell without the right build
tight basin
and then because it's slow it's not used in speedrunning
i find it funny that the special sucks at high heat
"sucks"
last dirge
You can spam it pretty fast with epic swift flourish
tight basin
more like no time to actually use it
well at high heat you're not given that choice lol
vagrant crane
You can spam it pretty fast with epic swift flourish
ap2 ri1:
last dirge
Yeah
last dirge
I'm not talking about high heat specifically. Just the issues with it.
tight basin
if they got epic swift flourish in the 57 run they might've used it more, but i doubt it
tight basin
I'm not talking about high heat specifically. Just the issues with it.
yeah fair
last dirge
It's really easy to use though tbh. Just facetank
Especially if you get the special working
tight basin
but i just wanted to point out that despite how good it is defensively, it's hardly used at all at high heat
last dirge
Dont bother with high confidence
Yeah
It's hard to apply and kinda small
And the hammer to fix its size adds no damage
It also lasts a while but not that long, really just long enough to be an issue where its useless
Past the first enemy crowd
That's why I was surprised when the special build I did was actually very solid
last dirge
Does Crush Shot auto backstab with Parting Shot?
I got Crush Shot and a natural Divine Strike in tart + power shot and I dont want to restart
vagrant crane
Does Crush Shot auto backstab with Parting Shot?
no
vagrant crane
it doesn’t have huge hit box
last dirge
I even had an extra cast already
last dirge
I am though
tight basin
good atk%, crush shot, and snow burst is really all you need
and the atk isn't even needed lol
last dirge
I want a run where parting shot is good
tight basin
I am though
i mean that's fine, but you dont have to restart the run for it
tight basin
I want a run where parting shot is good
welp, phalanx shot hera is prob the only reliable way because parting shot kinda just sucks in general
vagrant crane
parting shot sucks
tight basin
no cast build really wants parting shot because others exist that are better or just dont need it at all
tight basin
like you can make a case for phalanx shot on ahcilles, but 1) dont have funny backstab like hera 2) might as well just get lightning phalanx if you're getting a duo. also lightning strike is good on achilles so double bonus
vagrant crane
so if you wanna use it do that build
vagrant crane
you said you did crush shot
vagrant crane
I've never gotten it before
i envy you
i got it so often back when i did heartbreak strike start to ddash aspho
last dirge
Lmao blessed
Natural aphro
I thought crush shot worked too
I've gotten parting shot lots. I've never done the build.
Never gotten it to work
tight basin
because it doesn't work well lol
vagrant crane
like you can make a case for phalanx shot on ahcilles, but 1) dont have funny ba...
rather get splitting
vagrant crane
just get the zoos
tight basin
also lightning phalanx is still good because you're saving a lot of time in rooms
vagrant crane
tmw you see him once but never again
i would simply not do that
tight basin
fair
last dirge
Lmao I didnt get it
Still time but my eurydice boosts are gone and so are my dice
That's ridiculous
tight basin
it do be like that sometimes
cunning urchin
Poseidon turns Styx into a joke of a biome, but he's pretty *blegh* on bosses.
I think you're greatly underestimating the damage that Tidal Dash adds in boss fights. 
Especially with Wave Pounding.
plain hollow
Perhaps. I know tidal dash is hilarious in Styx, though.
"Woe. Ocean be upon thee."
vagrant crane
And I think Ares has some utility at least, although I don't know if I'd want hi...
ares is wholly useless outside of blades or ME
he sucks at doing the flat damage, his rifts suck
vagrant crane
Battle Rage is pretty amazing on certain aspects.
Oops! All Urge to Kill
tight basin
if you have battle rage with demeter's charged upper i'm assuming the battle rage bonus doesn't apply to all of them right
or is that wrong to assume
vagrant crane
if you want battle rage ares gives you call, urge to kill, and blood frenzy
vagrant crane
so real
cunning urchin
Urge to Kill is alright.
cunning urchin
Nice in Cast builds.
💤
tight basin
tidal dash without poms go hard
vagrant crane
What's a pom? I only do RTA.
a pom is a boon that gives you 5 hundred damages
cunning urchin
tidal dash without poms go hard
That's like the only thing I pom on Zag Bow lol.
tight basin
makes sense lmao
vagrant crane
the hestia guide says for rta to pom tdash to lvl5 in tart and then shackle your way through the world
tight basin
i'm assuming you just start tidal and aim for artemis atk?
tight basin
the hestia guide says for rta to pom tdash to lvl5 in tart and then shackle your...
yeah that makes sense lol
vagrant crane
be the shackle you want to see in elysium
cunning urchin
i'm assuming you just start tidal and aim for artemis atk?
You assume that I start Tidal?
Me?
tight basin
yeah because isn't that what's better for zag bow rta lmao
or like zag bow in general
vagrant crane
zag aoe real
tight basin
i wouldn't think zag bow rta and igt starts would be different
cunning urchin
The optimal start for both IGT and RTA is obviously Heartbreak Strike.
tight basin
unmodded igt starts artemis attack lol
modded igt starts tidal dash
those were wr for zag bow
cunning urchin
Tidal Dash start into miniboss Attack or potentially no Attack in Tartarus isn't necessarily faster than Attack start into miniboss Tidal Dash (or potentially Hunter Dash).
They're each better at dealing with different encounters, basically.
Deadly Strike start gets you good chance for early Hunter's Mark + good chance for Heart Rend with Passion Dash. Heartbreak Strike start hits breakpoints fast and good chance for Heart Rend + doesn't need to proc Weak with dash for Heart Rend + Smair potential. Tidal Dash start gives you great AOE damage early + good chance for Breaking Wave to save a lot of time in Styx.
lucid oar
unmodded igt starts artemis attack lol
Unmodded wr is an ancient record
That’s still the tounis 6:2x?
ashen glen
Hi there. So, I'm stood outside the door to Hades, I have a couple of Well of Charon items that have 5 encounters left on them. If I go into another Satyr door, are my Well items going to expire before I get to the boss?
ashen glen
Googling suggests that they are randomly 4 or 5 chambers long, so I think it'd be up to RNG whether I got out of there with my Well items?
ashen glen
thanks!
late wasp
What do you have to do to unlock the final few hearts to forge a bond with Hermes
cunning urchin
What do you have to do to unlock the final few hearts to forge a bond with Herme...
Talk to him with the Lambent Plume at max level and equipped.
late wasp
Got it
late wasp
Well I guess I’ll try out that one build where you stack up as much dodge chance as you can
So I know you need the Zag fists and the plume, but what else
plain river
greater evasion, second wind, ruthless reflex
last dirge
I personally used to do lots of lambent plume builds on gilga
If you see hyper sprint get it
Dodge is solid but it doesnt stack additively iirc
Get the dash strike hammer if you see it
That kinda stuff. You could also just go a cast build. You only need Plume equipped in Asphodel where Hermes shows up first.
Remember, Bad News is bugged so it's just +50% global dmg
And Plume is all you need for it
tight basin
Dodge is solid but it doesnt stack additively iirc
It does
last dirge
I thought you couldnt reach 100 dodge?
lucid oar
You can
last dirge
My bad then. I was going off of some runs I've seen/done
warm snow
what would be the most broken hammer trio, if getting one didn't lock out others?
ex: triple cluster rocket
valid dagger
It would probably be bow hammers
plain river
Twin triple (point blank/flurry) would
Tbh that’s the big 3 I can think of
Triple clockets, funny flurry/spread/delta, triple twin (flurry or pointblank) would be the 3 notable options of the unlocked combos
the rest is like
Flurry world splitter cruel thrust
how would that even work, who knows
tight basin
Hazard clockets would be funny
vagrant crane
Hazard clockets would be funny
but what would the rocket part do
imagine the rockets get the hazard damage but you still hit yourself
so you have to instaphase bosses or else you’re just stuck there
tight basin
but what would the rocket part do
Faster
last dirge
You can get duos from the 2 boon rooms right?
Is it the first you pick or the 2nd that can get duos?
soft shoal
You cannot
vagrant crane
You can get duos from the 2 boon rooms right?
you cant
last dirge
Okay
last dirge
Why is the game refusing to give me duos
I took nothing that would open up another duo
cunning urchin
It be like that sometimes.
last dirge
I have a like 900 damage flood shot
Yeah
So it still rips
But tripling that would be nice
Heroic 7 + 2 like +75% cast boons
No snow burst either
I didnt have ps but it's still nice
still vortex
That feeling you were targeting a duo for your whole run and never got it.
still vortex
The talos fists and the fists in general seem buggy and weak. I hate fists.
vagrant crane
The talos fists and the fists in general seem buggy and weak. I hate fists.
fists can be annoying but also super satisfying
build ME on them
proper furnace
weak i can agree
still vortex
I just got merciful end. Tell me the way. It still seems to suck
vagrant crane
i mean
warm snow
fists are very fun imo
except Talos
proper furnace
I just got merciful end. Tell me the way. It still seems to suck
add divine dash if you havent
vagrant crane
their weakness only matters at higher levels
still vortex
I have
vagrant crane
I just got merciful end. Tell me the way. It still seems to suck
not good without ddash
still vortex
I have dash
proper furnace
then your build is done basically
just keep dash striking
also just in case what lvl is your doom atk
warm snow
make sure doom is on attack and not special
still vortex
Punch and then dash thru to do 130 damage? Big whoop
vagrant crane
Punch and then dash thru to do 130 damage? Big whoop
your doom should proc for more than that but also 130 damage per dash is no joke lol
warm snow
doom boobs
vagrant crane
don’t you literally start ares
proper furnace
thats why im asking
still vortex
I used Athena first because I figured I needed her on both dash and special. And then got ares keep sake act 2 but used 4 keys resetting and still didn’t get ares on attack
still vortex
And then had nothing on attack all the way to act 4
proper furnace
ares start also means you can pom it a few lvls without issue
vagrant crane
but also getting vorimed sucks
still vortex
Yeah this run was rng hell
proper furnace
yeah basically athena start aint really worth
better just hope for nat athena in tart or force in aspho
from there you can cope whenever ME doesnt show up and grab dash
doom can get through the first area without much issue
still vortex
The only thing going for this run is I got artemis legendary and hunting blades 😜
But this all came in act 4
proper furnace
at least talos has some useful effect there lmao
vagrant crane
The only thing going for this run is I got artemis legendary and hunting blades ...
hb not bad on talos
they deal free extra dmg
proper furnace
is still talos sadly
vagrant crane
well yeah talos is talos sadge
proper furnace
so your starts are a bit more clunky thanks to your special
still vortex
I hate demeter also, I always miss the satisfying special. I hate Gilgamesh claws too and I hate how plain zag fists are. I just hate fists.
proper furnace
thats fair
still vortex
I have the hammer where you supposed to get a explosion where you special, but it seems to cancel out if I dash so it’s worthless.
proper furnace
im blaming talos on that
cuz on the other 3 fists that just doesnt happen from what i remember
vagrant crane
I have the hammer where you supposed to get a explosion where you special, but i...
eupper works on dupper
still vortex
I like all the other weapons better.
Okay still cleared but woof that run. Not fun.
warm snow
once you like, finish your build; what keepsake do you go for, and what do you pick in doors
like if i already have ME with impending before Elysium, what to go for next?
vagrant crane
like if i already have ME with impending before Elysium, what to go for next?
check ananke fists guide
tight basin
Probably acorn lmao
warm snow
yea probably
tight basin
If not acorn, probably purse or Artemis/Poseidon, depending on whoever's cast you already have
Going for CoD is less important but idrk if you'd rather have flood shot for breaking wave Styx or not but deadly reversal is really good
cunning urchin
I wouldn't care much for Flood Shot in a Merciful End build.
tight basin
yeah prob not
CoD is neat on it tho
i guess
if you dont want to take acorn or purse into elysium lol
last dirge
The talos fists and the fists in general seem buggy and weak. I hate fists.
Fists are good. Talos is very fun and decent if you know how to use them well.
Fists are polarizing though because melee combat is just worse than ranged generally
warm snow
everything is viable, but some aspects have higher potential
last dirge
Yeah
Talos is definitely a more "go crazy" aspect
Little reason to use it otherwise
cunning urchin
Idk what you mean by "buggy" though.
warm snow
Idk what you mean by "buggy" though.
sometimes special doesn't pull them in
last dirge
I should try to do CoD on it instead of Achilles and see it that works
See Talos is also a castspect
Probably the worst tbh but the pull has some synergies
tight basin
I should try to do CoD on it instead of Achilles and see it that works
CoD probably works better on fists and maybe sword because they have shorter range
then again idk the range of CoD lol
last dirge
Yeah
It's quite large
Like probably around 2x a beo cast
Maybe less but it's quite large
tight basin
that sounds a bit much
last dirge
Like greater consecration size
Maybe I'm misremembering. It's big though
Maybe it's more visual than actually large
tight basin
i was gonna assume just flood shot aoe size lmao
cunning urchin
if you dont want to take acorn or purse into elysium lol
I wouldn't take anything but Acorn in Elysium. Even without High Confidence, just simply not getting interrupted saves plenty of time.
tight basin
"good"
last dirge
It's just hard to use and kinda bad to get
It hits like a truck
I have a 900 damage flood shot rn
With cod that hits 3 times
And synergizes easily with hyper rush
tight basin
I wouldn't take anything but Acorn in Elysium. Even without High Confidence, jus...
yeah if it isn't a caspect i would take acorn into ely unless idrc about how the run ends up and think "might as well this could be fun"
last dirge
Or Achilles special or Talos special
pine scaffold
i think i take dashes right
https://imgur.com/a/egw4Ku9
warm snow
i used to run mom pom by elysium
last dirge
Not saying its good for high heat. I think it's kinda dangerous. But it's a strong cast duo.
tight basin
i think i take dashes right
https://imgur.com/a/egw4Ku9
if you feel like gambling for rush delivery then hyper sprint is better, but the more consistent option will always be the dashes
pine scaffold
ill just hope for hyper sprint later on
tight basin
i would take hyper srpint but that's just speedrunner brain lol
non-ME speedrunner brain
pine scaffold
casual brain
lucid oar
Dashes are amazing with flurry jab, not great without it
Id probably take hyper sprint
pine scaffold
i just have extending
last dirge
Rush Delivery is always nice but not necessary in all builds.
It really shines in like call builds
pine scaffold
such as smair?
last dirge
Yeah. Its global dmg
pine scaffold
ah ok
cunning urchin
If I have ME going into Asphodel, grab Adamant Arrowhead and go for True Shot or maybe Pressure Points and then the usual. If I don't have ME, Owl Pendant obviously. And then Acorn in Elysium until the end of the run.
last dirge
Which effects even stuff you normally can't boost much, like calls which scale hard and do a lot of dmg
And Doom, for ME
Hangover too
pine scaffold
on second thought imma prolly take hyper sprint
tight basin
It really shines in like call builds
mostly shines in flat damage builds like ME, beo, hera, achilles, eris
soft shoal
HS RD is just awesome
last dirge
Yeah
tight basin
calls sure but also that's not really where rd shines
pine scaffold
now time to hope for dashes
last dirge
Bad phrasing. That's where it hits the hardest. Is that better?
pine scaffold
brain dumb mb
last dirge
Because calls just hit hard
last dirge
You can get +100% cast dmg a lot easier than hyper rush
tight basin
and you can stack them on top of each other for more damage lol
last dirge
Of course
I'm speaking specifically of the fact that there is no "call damage" boost besides global damage
While there are plentiful cast damage boosts
"Plentiful"
cunning urchin
I think you're just moving the goalposts at this point.
lucid oar
There are quite a few sources of global damage
vagrant crane
sweet surrender real
lucid oar
And the best calls scale well with other stuff too
cunning urchin
The three sources of global damage that I know the best:
Common Rush Delivery
Common Rush Delivery
Common Rush Delivery
tight basin
what about sweet surrender
cunning urchin
what about sweet surrender
Technically a debuff.
last dirge
I'm not moving goalposts lmao I just wasnt clear
cunning urchin
The modders: hypermodded will fix all your RNG issues
cunning urchin
Common Rush Delivery
Common Rush Delivery
Common Rush Delivery
Hypermodded:
lucid oar
Just set hermes rarity to all epics smh
vagrant crane
mistral dash or frost strike for blizzardchilles
lucid oar
Frost strike
cunning urchin
Just set hermes rarity to all epics smh
The only change I made was turning off "Darkness!" entirely instead of only insta Darkness lol.
vagrant crane
no i am going to be funny
tight basin
mistral dash or frost strike for blizzardchilles
why would you consider mistral
vagrant crane
nvm arty on door
vagrant crane
why would you consider mistral
because strike does little
tight basin
was it common
vagrant crane
blue
tight basin
thats not bad
vagrant crane
i have no extra casts :(
cunning urchin
It was only a mirage.
vagrant crane
good thing achilles is busted
cunning urchin
i have no extra casts :(
Did you pay Amir $5 before your run?
vagrant crane
unfortunately not
unique mason
Is Zeus the best attack boon for eris rail?
For up to 32 heat
Or would dionysis be better
tight basin
Zeus is better as long as you're not running ap and/or ri
Zeus atk really wants jolted, and less choices means you're less likely to guarantee it
warm snow
I'm just past asphodel and haven't got ME
what do i do, since i've already used ares+athena keepsake?
agile salmon
Wait for Jesus himself to sprinkle pixie dust on your RNG
plain river
I'm just past asphodel and haven't got ME
what do i do, since i've already used ...
Take hourglass
plain river
it's gilg
Hourglass is a standard pick for elysium
Well
Aside from like acorn
It lets you stack up a bunch of buffs to bring to dad fight and just generally helps you through elysium
cunning urchin
If you don't have Merciful End yet, I would consider Coin Purse in Elysium. Otherwise just grab Acorn.
agile salmon
Hourglass is a standard pick for elysium
Who is hourglass from again? Sorry i forget
warm snow
charon
plain river
Charon
cunning urchin
Hourglass doesn't do too much for Gilgamesh with Merciful End.
agile salmon
Thanks. I’ve been focused on everything but keepsakes in my PC runs. I need more nectar lol
plain river
typically god keepsake -> different god keepsake -> acorn or hourglass (or something else dependent on situation) -> acorn or sigil
warm snow
screw it, acorn
agile salmon
Acorn is one i use for Elysium and Hades himself lol
tight basin
Acorn into ely and Styx are pretty typical
Hourglass and sigil shenanigans are generally for like speedrunning
Hourglass shines for castpects but anything else it's kinda eh
warm snow
chamber 8 ME! be still, my heart
agile salmon
chamber 8 ME! be still, my heart
Congrats
ivory turtle
NIIIIICE
warm snow
think i'll try for support fire and PP
ivory turtle
Question: if I'm going for all Zeus (playing Zeus aspect) would it be more optimal to go for Fated authority?
warm snow
probably
plain river
No
well
Actually yes
If all you want is zeus
Rather then just typical zeus^2 where you take what you get and otherwise branch out into smair, and then rd from hermes
ivory turtle
I guess throwing pos in there for sea storm could be fun tho
tight basin
think i'll try for support fire and PP
get artemis cast and get deadly reversal
plain river
Keep fated persuasion on and take aphrodite for smouldering air on zeus call and hyper sprint -> rush delivery from hermes
But if you want to go like
All zeus supporting boons
for the funny
Then take authority
tight basin
to be completely fair, authority to get more zeus is like the one time i'd say it's good
ivory turtle
OHHHH gotcha
tight basin
just because it shows a boon doesn't mean it'll turn into another boon
miniboss doors are guaranteed to be boons tho
it's gonna be a skull door that has a boon on it
gold laurel
if there's a skull on it but it's a blue laurel (gems or darkness) then it's an elite room and it wont give you a boon
ivory turtle
These are awesome tips!! Thank you :DD
tight basin
oh does it keep the laurel
ivory turtle
And you don't want to reroll more than like once right?
plain river
The price doesn’t keep going up so iirc
ivory turtle
Ooooh that's good to know actually
plain river
Why not to get that extra zeus early
Actually
Check that in game
Because I could be wrong
ivory turtle
Will do
plain river
I haven’t touched authority in a while
plain river
Since it just isn’t optimal in 99% of cases
tight basin
for miniboss i'd say maybe spend 2 on it
ivory turtle
Ooooooh then cycle through
plain river
Since before then it can pull from all 8
plain river
And so unless door mechanics work definitely then just pulling from available options at pure randomness
ivory turtle
So wait until God pool is full
plain river
It would make it go from 1/9 to 1/5
ivory turtle
Then just go reroll on miniboss
tight basin
i'd still reroll tart miniboss door tho
plain river
hermes can get rerolled into can’t he?
tight basin
no clue
ivory turtle
Should I try to fill attack cast and dash with different gods?
Or take secondary boons so I can fill with Zeus later?
tight basin
this is zeus shield right
tight basin
if you're going for all zeus support boons, i'd try to get stuff that doesn't open duos
for cores
so like idk
could take stygian soul so you cant open lightning rod
tidal dash doesn't open sea storm
ivory turtle
Wait really?? Odd
tight basin
any athena core that isn't cast, but make sure it doesnt open extra duos
warm snow
does doom only proc once you stop attacking?
is that why dire misfortune is so good?
ivory turtle
I had to take Demeter on attack, but tbh I think that duo won't be too bad
tight basin
Wait really?? Odd
tdash is just strong and common, would make it very easy to get sea storm lol
ivory turtle
Ahhh gitch
tight basin
I had to take Demeter on attack, but tbh I think that duo won't be too bad
well it's bad because you're always applying jolted anyways
so it's just useless
tight basin
i think ideally your cores should be artemis/athena attack, artemis cast, artemis/athena/poseidon dash
with stygian soul
so you dont get lightning rod
ares can work in some core if you dont take a vengeance boon
ooh aphrodite's cores can work too as long as you dont pick up a call for smair
but also smair kinda good lol
ivory turtle
Smair would be very good for Zeus call
tight basin
yeah def
ivory turtle
Ok so glad I reset, it decided to give me snow burst as an option instead of forcing one of my choices to be replacing with Dem special
tight basin
oh btw if you sell a god's boon, they're still in your god pool
so you can do that if you want
keep pommables to a small number
ivory turtle
Gods go into your god pool regardless of whether they take a core slot or not right?
tight basin
yeah
they're also in your pool even if you sell it
so you can have a 4 god pool but only have 1 present god lol
tight basin
based
warm snow
best aspect in the game
ivory turtle
I guess I'll take crush shot for the possibility of smoldering air in the future
What if I just,,, keep the Zeus keepsake equipped until ely
plain river
does doom only proc once you stop attacking?
is that why dire misfortune is so g...
Nope
And dire misfortune isn’t “so good”
Doom will proc whenever it’s timer is up, regardless of you attacking or not
and dire misfortune doesn’t get much mileage because builds that actually care about the doom damage build ME
ivory turtle
What if I just,,, keep the Zeus keepsake equipped until ely
Imma do it what the heck
tight basin
What if I just,,, keep the Zeus keepsake equipped until ely
i mean you just get higher rarity and that's it lol
well i guess tbf you only want zeus boons so sure
vagrant crane
ix if egg
last dirge
Woo another +3 dashes greater reflex gilgaMEsh
No impending though
Almost could have gotten deadly reversal which would have been neat
It's not a constant +20% crit but it's active fairly often. I just didnt get enough obols or a purge boon option for a 450 athena.
I didnt even open the duo until Styx
warm snow
does deadly reversal have the same stats as PP? as in applying to all damage
tight basin
Yeah
warm snow
hot
last dirge
Yeah thats why I wanted it. But when I saw Artemis early I didnt want to risk opening that duo and not getting ME
Also almost got heroic attack but nah
Rare Crop appeared at the end and chose Ravenous Will lmao
I did cast in my opener so it mattered for 3 seconds.
tight basin
criting on doom procs kinda neat
cunning urchin
Ravenous Will gud.
warm snow
once i have curse of nausea, can i purge curse of vengeance and be fine?
i'm running hangover chiron
plain river
once i have curse of nausea, can i purge curse of vengeance and be fine?
Yup
It’s actually advantageous too
Limits your options for pomming
vagrant crane
plain river
All hangover boons scale brilliantly with poms
Only a little glare
I have some really bad shots
Yes it is poseidon
Also that isn’t a ss, can’t tell if you were joking
warm snow
joke, yes
plain river
I was doing my usual darkness farming
But without bouldy
Pos start -> dio -> grab all eclipses when possible and look for exclusive access to boost rarity on eclipses
last dirge
Finally got CoD Achilles. And a Chaos cast dmg boon, Fully Loaded, hyperrush (common/rare), and +3 dashes with greater reflex
I dont see how this is a bad duo
You could just spam cast and dash with Poseidon
It's just funny to use. Especially against flame wheels.
Sometimes its great against them. Sometimes it doesnt help at all.
languid hornet
#h1-victory-boasting message
@cunning urchin hangover builds should use privileged status?
unique mason
Explosive or seeking fire for Zeus eris rail?
lucid oar
Whats the third option
unique mason
I think it was the 5 specials -30%dmg one
valid dagger
That's the one
cunning urchin
https://discord.com/channels/456889434672201729/725021639506526249/1088685407316...
Yeah.
lucid oar
I think it was the 5 specials -30%dmg one
Yeah cluster bomb is the second best hammer on eris rail, the other 2 are bottom 3 prob
soft pollen
We doing a March Monthly? 👀
cunning urchin
We doing a March Monthly? 👀
A little delay, but yes. 
soft pollen
last dirge
You can shoot 5 rockets from 3 of the 4 rail aspects
It's like in the top builds in the game
Getting cluster bomb first is ideal
So if that is your first hammer, you're in luck
Yes I'm late. I'm curious to know if they got rockets though.
plain river
Rockets > clockets first hammer wdym
yes cluster first hammer gives you slightly better odds for rocket 2nd hammer but rocket first hammer makes the game a whole lot faster
late wasp
Is Heavy Knuckle any good
lucid oar
Not really
vagrant crane
if you get it on a hammer start it can be fun to build for
but if you get it in the middle of a normal fists build it kinda sucks
plain river
It has funny niche on talos but not particularly good
last dirge
Though once I was doing a Talos build and got a epic Swift Strike and regretted not taking the Heavy Knuckle
But yeah it's one of the eh hammers since it changes your build entirely.
You would want a %dmg attack boon instead of your flat attack boon you would usually take on fists.
last dirge
Just did another Arthur special run. Gambled on getting Double Nova as my second hammer and got it.
Started thinking I would do Deadly Reversal. But that's kinda weak without Double Nova so I took a Heroic Heartbreak Flourish.
Still havent broken over 300%
As soon as I got double nova it became the easiest run ever
This is like the Ganon meta of Hades.
I also got epic Swift Flourish tbf. Usually would have gone Hypersprint but Swift really really helps Arthur outspeed enemy attacks
fleet glacier
sword has the worse hammers and its very unsafe
vagrant crane
sword has the worse hammers and its very unsafe
double edge
ivory turtle
Oh my gosh, Zeus shield with lotsa Zeus just shreds through Champions
mild ridge
Someone have the best build for nemesis blade ?
mild ridge
Merciful end hmm, thanks
cunning urchin
Someone have the best build for nemesis blade ?
I wrote a Nemesis guide here if you're interested: #h1-for-new-players message
mild ridge
I wrote a Nemesis guide here if you're interested: https://discord.com/channels/...
Sure thanks
earnest helm
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1028112977100017666/1088676979093540864/o...
should I proceed to pom Dio Nye Sus to oblivion so enemies get drunk and then dies really quickly
warm snow
it's cast that poms best
last dirge
All of Dio poms great, but yeah his cast and call do the best.
Well core boons at least. Luckily he also has unpommables
finite juniper
Hey I was wondering what the best or most optimal things for the mirror of night were
I feel like I've picked good ones but if there is better then I'd like to know
vagrant crane
Hey I was wondering what the best or most optimal things for the mirror of night...
Fiery presence, chthonic vitality, death defiance, greater reflex, boiling blood, infernal soul on cast builds, thick skin if not speedrunning, family favorites, dark foresight, god's pride, fated persuasion
deep pockets
finite juniper
ok thanks
cunning urchin
Hey I was wondering what the best or most optimal things for the mirror of night...
You can find two great mirror guides pinned in #h1-for-new-players.
clever frigate
so I'm having a run with Malphon 0 heat that started off focusing around strikes and dashes only, but I have now developed it into the Head-Detacher Uppercutter™️, which revolves around:
Deadly Flourish (LVL4), for %113 more uppercut damage resulting in nastily high crits,
Pressure Points, for when I'm not attacking with my uppercut,
Draining Cutter, for 2% of my max health when I kill with the uppercut
Greatest Reflex and Quick Recovery, to zip around with two more dashes and regain some health if I dash after taking some damage,
and Stubborn Roots to tie everything off with a nice bow on top
also my first run so far to make it past Elysium without using a Death Defiance, so that's fun :D
oh nice, I get to add Lightning Reflexes to incentivize dashing before getting hit! that's not gonna happen, I'm most likely gonna rely on Stubborn Roots to carry me through Hades
last dirge
Lighting rod time
opaque hollow
Stubborn roots and haven't used death defiance
Every time i get it i have a very good hades fight and lose like 100 health total
last dirge
Yeah it's not very good.
Mostly focus dmg duos
This includes modifying effects. For example Scintillating Feast on a Trippy Shot/Flare build can be quite good if you dont just want to pom Trippy exclusively
Add in Jolted and pom that a bit and you have some passive dmg
Sort of a pseudo Zeus Call
Even better, cast duos like Hunting Blades or Lightning Phalanx or Curse of Drowning
Or Smouldering Air, which I've seen some people call the strongest duo. Definitely the most versatile.
If it doesnt give an immediate effect that improves the pace of your run, it probably isnt very good.
So like Merciful End is king because it speeds up a rather strong flat dmg effect by a huge degree.
Even better with Impending Doom
Literally can double your Doom dmg with an Epic lvl 2.
Duos that dont provide immediate benefits like this to your build are usually a waste.
last dirge
I'm wondering. Would Heartbreak Strike + True Flare Beowulf be any good?
Seems a little memey and reversed
valid dagger
I'm wondering. Would Heartbreak Strike + True Flare Beowulf be any good?
It wouldnt compare at all to a good Beowulf build. But Beowulf is a strong weapon, whether the build is good or not kinda depends on what you’re doing.
Some people have done 50 heat beowulf with every flare and some atrocious builds
warm snow
how good is phalanx and hunter's flare?
vagrant crane
how good is phalanx and hunter's flare?
phalanx is like passion flare but slightly worse
and hunters flare is pretty not good
warm snow
i see
last dirge
Yeah just looking for alt builds. I had a really good trippy flare run recently anyway. Even got Mirage.
Try Lightning Phalanx on Achilles
Nuts
Get 4 casts, pom cast, maybe get Mirage Shot once every few runs if you get lucky, and you basically room clear.
tight basin
I'm wondering. Would Heartbreak Strike + True Flare Beowulf be any good?
it's good in the sense that it's beo so you'll be fine lmao
plain river
…no
Typically Rama does actually focus on attack
With aphro attack
Then dio or zeus special is just added on
ivory turtle
Oh shoot that would hit hard
plain river
dio gives low tolerance and dot damage, zeus special gets you smair and jolted spread all around
warm snow
it is
tight basin
A beefy % attack, Aphro is very good (ideally not common), or you can go for Artemis because crits, any high rarity % attack can do except Poseidon (avoid that one), for the Special you want flat damage, it's not hard to come by, usually not worth forcing tho, Ares Dio Zeus are the main ones, you can go for Demeter and try to get Killing freeze, it can work pretty well, for the Dash there arent many options because most of them are either anti-synergy or just dont do anything, Artemis however is probably the best in slot dash, because Rama relies on dash strikes and getting dash strike damage is just good, Athena is a good one too because deflecting is nice, another important thing for Rama is hammers, ideally you want Triple Shot or Twin Shot for your first hammer, if not offered you can go for Perfect or Point Blank, and for the second hammer you usually want Perfect or Point Blank (assuming Triple or Twin first) but the order can be the other way here, if you get Perfect Shot as first hammer then it's fine too, hammers to avoid are Sniper shot (blocks Twins shot) and also doesnt do anything, and Repulse shot, Explosive is a bit of an odd one, it's nice in some scenarios but hard to play, Chain shot is okay, wont do much in bosses. Rama is difficult and needs practice but it's really good when it comes to heat especially, it's a good idea to watch vods of people who are good at it and try to implement their movement and decision making in your runs
Thanks MiKE
tight basin
I'm probably gonna go for Dio
For speedrunning, rama starts with zeus because it's bigger aoe and you can get jolted. Can also lead up to smoldering air or lightning rod later
Ofc if you're not speedrunning starting aphro atk is fine but Zeus start makes dealing with aoe in general a lot easier
last dirge
I'm also fond of Bad Influence on Rama
If I'm trying for that I do twin shot/triple shot deadly strike
Aphro does open up a better duo though
tight basin
bad influence kinda eh
doesn't really do anything in boss fights
basically a situational hunters dash
glass patio
Fun builds here please
cunning urchin
No fun, only win. 
last dirge
Fun and win, Scintillating Feast Beo
Just did it myself. Got +3 casts from Chaos even.
Double Strike and Jolted
Cover the arena with bolts
Just go for an attack that wont open another duo. I personally got Deadly Strike. Make sure you have Stygian Soul as Trippy Flare has unique properties that delay its return to you.
Getting +3 cast stones from chaos probably wont happen, but pick up those temporary ones from wells.
1 of those even punished me for attacking. The first punished casts.
The third decreased dash length. I had Relentless.
Had that during Champions.
Just pom trippy flare foremost as it has broken scaling. It goes beyond what is displayed.
Beyond that, like Jolted and Double Strike, or your attack boon.
Double Strike applies to Jolted triggers right? Regardless it does improve the dps of Scintillating a fair bit.
Avoid Demeter. You dont want Ice Wine.
It has a delay before it is released when you rush.
warm snow
ice wine is powerful but the delay hurts
last dirge
Yeah. Makes it too tricky to use. Scintillating meanwhile just adds zoos to your trippy flare
warm snow
yeah it's fun how they csan stack
last dirge
The bolts do solid dmg too
60 iirc
Special bolts normally reach maybe 40
Jolted bolts reach much higher ofc
60 is like Call dmg
And since I have 4 casts I really just covered the Styx rooms with lightning aoes
Makes the passive effect of trippy more useful at least. It does kinda counter-synergize with Jolted though
But you have Trippy Beo dmg
plain river
Yeah. Makes it too tricky to use. Scintillating meanwhile just adds zoos to your...
Scillanting feast is pretty bad because if you are getting use out of it something has gone wrong, at least for trippy flare
warm snow
is there a guan yu guide somewhere?
or should i just check pins
its just keepsakes idk about
into aspho
cunning urchin
is there a guan yu guide somewhere?
last dirge
Scillanting feast is pretty bad because if you are getting use out of it somethi...
Enemies can spawn into it but fair
It handles vermin great in Styx
bright turret
what's a decent build for nemesis?
plain river
what's a decent build for nemesis?
Either merciful end (ares strike -> athena flourish -> merciful end -> divine dash) or like a crit build where you either throw aphrodite and artemis around, either way you’re looking for hammers based on the icons listed on this here tierlist
The tierlist goes left to right in terms of good to less good within their own tiers
plain river
Either merciful end (ares strike -> athena flourish -> merciful end -> divine da...
The crit build can go a few different ways, like aphro strike -> hunter dash or artemis strike -> aphro special -> heart rend
bright turret
XD
i've got an arty attack build, but somehow also ended up with mirage shot and aphro cast
plain river
either way for merciful end you also look out for impending doom, and crit builds you get hunters mark if you see it
bright turret
i'll go for aphro special and heart rend, then I can have 2 builds at once
plain river
either way for merciful end you also look out for impending doom, and crit build...
Both massively increase your ability to deal damage
bright turret
yeah, i did a few merciful end builds and wanted to go for a crit one
bright turret
it's only heat 4 and i've already beaten the 2 EM bosses so it's pretty easy on that front
plain river
Zeus would be nice to splash in at that point if you found them naturally
then that fills out your god pool and you start getting more consistent boons
plain river
Zeus would be nice to splash in at that point if you found them naturally
Smouldering air good
what is your poseidon core for mirage shot?
bright turret
dash lol
plain river
kool
Just double checking that call was open
Have a nice day, I’m going to bed now because it’s maybe 4:09am in my timezone and I need to be awake in less then 3 hours
glass patio
Fun rail builds?
blissful barn
does anybody know some fun nemisis sword builds?
warm snow
I'm sure @cunning urchin would love to tell you
cunning urchin
does anybody know some fun nemisis sword builds?
My Nemesis Guide: #h1-for-new-players message
cunning urchin
what's a decent build for nemesis?
^ for you, as well.
bright turret
^ for you, as well.
Oh nice, I can use that next time. Thanks!
last dirge
Just did a zag shield run. Went Artemis, got Athena and ddash, Deadly Reversal. Got an epic/rare hyperrush and Cshot + Ferocious Guard.
Ferocious Guard seemed a little more interesting than Breaching Rush since I was hoping to get RD.
Was worth it
vagrant crane
ferocious guard doesn't apply to rd
tight basin
does the speed boost not work with rd tf?
vagrant crane
i'm confusing it with something else
tight basin
last dirge
Shouldnt all movement speed increases apply
vagrant crane
well
vagrant crane
i know at least one hammer who gives you speed doesn't apply to rd
tight basin
i know at least one hammer who gives you speed doesn't apply to rd
idk any other hammer that gives you speed
tight basin
the only other boons that gives speed is second wind, greater haste, and hyper sprint
last dirge
Yeah idk any off the top of my head
vagrant crane
i think i'm schizoing
tight basin
or at least weird
last dirge
Yeah dad call is the weird one
vagrant crane
i think it overrides hyper sprint?
tight basin
prob dad call
last dirge
It does kinda yeah
tight basin
because the other stuff works fine, dad call is the only weird one
vagrant crane
yeah i think dad call overrides hyper sprint
warm snow
there should be more prerequisites for RD
vagrant crane
what else
warm snow
Poseidon call, zagsword, ignited ichor
last dirge
Tbf Plume is one
vagrant crane
sprint plume haste
last dirge
You could always equip Plume to try to get it
vagrant crane
ichor is like
warm snow
it's an investment
last dirge
Immediately equipping it and not even getting 1 boost would still unlock it
It's a prereq
vagrant crane
plume is real if not legacy