h1-builds-and-combat

[tender latch]

That juicy 10% bonus damage

Take quick recovery to sell it for more gold🧠

[random relic]

qr kinda useful though

[soft kiln]

I lost that run to speedy big chariots 😭

[tender latch]

Tragedy, simply get the enemies

Get armored splitters with Athena dash

[tight basin]

epic quick recovery effectively reduces all damage by 50% so it's not bad considering most of the damage you take is from a mistimed dash

obv not the greatest but like

out of those 3 it's pretty good

[tender latch]

Simply run cshot beo and win

I'll comfily take em4 fo2 if it means I don't have to suffer from uc ap ri

[random relic]

the problem is that the timing window is tight

but its still really good even if it only procs like 1/5 hits

[dreamy prism]

jesus man

purple QR in a heartbeat

that boon is so sneaky op at good rarity

[soft kiln]

Oh ok I'll try it higher

[strange lark]

I've never seen quick reload be useful on any weapon other than hera

[dreamy prism]

[random relic]

[magic dagger]

uses weapons

[acoustic vale]

plays hades

[random relic]

decides not to play hades

[acoustic vale]

exists

[magic dagger]

I did that once; went pretty well ngl

got me out of my inability to do non fresh file runs

[edgy harness]

anyways I did wanted a bit of challenge with those two pacts

[tight basin]

dc makes a lot of weapons slower, only exception is like fists but even then the uppercut can one shot some early encounters
jury summons is fine at lower heat, but once you start ramping it up a bit it becomes super tedious and not worth taking

[edgy harness]

Trying to get better slowly while moving up each heat

I see

[tight basin]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/668865849079103539/884878890739335178/unknown.png

this is pretty much the recommended pacts per heat

you'll notice that DC and JS are never taken because they're that bad lmao

[edgy harness]

Damn that's one hell of a sheet

Yeah lol

[tight basin]

em1 can be a bit rough at first but you'll get used to it pretty quickly, tight deadline 1 is pretty free

[edgy harness]

I did em1 and wasn't bad at all

I'll prolly watch out for the third one

[tight basin]

yeah timer can be intimidating, but considering you just did lvl 1 guan yu with js and dc on and was still within td1, you can easily do it

actually all your pb's except for the bow is within td2

and i'm sure with more practice the times will get lower

[edgy harness]

I tried timer first time today with no special added stuff, i dont remember if i took it with JS or some other but it was huge window with like 18 min at the end lol

I'll see how I can do with EM and timer

[tight basin]

should be fairly easy

oh you should take fated persuasion on your mirror btw

and fiery presence

[edgy harness]

Oh I was considering fiery presence yesterday

what did fated persuasion again

[tight basin]

reroll boons

[tight basin]

it's better on nearly all weapons, the initial hit one shots a lot of early enemies and will let you go faster

yeah shadow is better against bosses, but it's not like you're really trying to get those backstabs, you just hit them

[edgy harness]

That's why some boon I took the other day that had a similar effect seemed really good lol

wait EM3 at 6 heat?

[tight basin]

yeah

em3 is pretty rough tho

obviously better to learn it early but don't expect to do too great on your first try lol

[edgy harness]

Yeah that's what I'm expecting lol

[tight basin]

oh another good one to learn early is forced overtime

each level makes enemies act 20% faster including their projectiles

so you kinda have to relearn the timings for everything

but once you learn it it becomes second nature and can sorta become free heat

[edgy harness]

I saw that one and yeah I need to watch better on where I step

Even for traps

[tight basin]

don't take heightened security btw it sucks lmao

[edgy harness]

Yeah figures

[cunning urchin]

the pacts recommended by RidiculousHat*

Heightened Security is fine.

[tight basin]

oh right i forgot who made it

[cunning urchin]

Also, Heightened Security is fun.

[edgy harness]

[cunning urchin]

Because traps without HS are just irrelevant.

[tight basin]

it's not that bad but like, when it does happen you just die

[edgy harness]

I can't evade that lava

[cunning urchin]

HS makes you actually pay attention to trap locations.

[edgy harness]

[cunning urchin]

Have you tried, like, just not walking into it?

[edgy harness]

Good idea

[random relic]

wow what a good idea how did i never think of that

[tender latch]

If you're not nuking them, the strategy is more or less the same as regular heroes fight. Kite asterius, don't get blasted by theseus, kill asterius first and then smack theseus

The main difference is that theseus zooms through the center and can obliterate your health, and you need to be more careful of asterius since he has the annoying beyblade attack

• you have to empty dash to stay safe from his ground slams, instead of just getting behind him

[edgy harness]

Oh okay, so the regular but with better timing lol

[tender latch]

Pretty much. Don't dash strike when asterius slams unless you're getting a lot of range on him

Or you can just build for as much damage as possible 🧠

[edgy harness]

Afk revenge build or whatever that was

i know that'd be the worst idea for that fight lmfao

[tender latch]

Yep

[edgy harness]

It took me several deaths to realize I had to take down Asterius first back then

[random relic]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=czTtNMdFWvw

[edgy harness]

EM4

I want to hear the theme when I actually get there lol

[tender latch]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Upsm3E2NUI8

Also

Essential boons: bronze skin

[random relic]

so true

[grand zenith]

Stood on ‘im.

[grand zenith]

https://youtu.be/pu9GJiq-CsU

[random relic]

https://youtu.be/a1a9X77nqsQ hermes kinda best girl ngl

[grand zenith]

Facts.

[tender latch]

For what reason are you using bracer

[strange lark]

Myrmidon bracer best keepsake

[tight basin]

true

[gloomy canyon]

Thinking of doing a beowulf run. I dont want a boon cheat sheet, but any general build suggestions?

Or gods you would recommend for it

[cunning urchin]

Mirage Shot on Beowulf does 100% instead of the normal 30%.

Use that info however you see fit.

[dreamy prism]

poseidon flare, arty attack, duo

[gloomy canyon]

Sorry i havent looked at hades for a minute and forgot what flare was for a sec lol

[strange lark]

I like blizzard shot on beo

That's just me tho I'm so quirky 🤪

[lucid oar]

I like shackle beo

Only noobs need a cast boon 👍

[tight basin]

damn that just reminded me that i gave up on my 40 heat shackle beo

[proper furnace]

Can confirm

[dreamy prism]

ddash

[strange lark]

Stop dying

[dreamy prism]

ddash unironically extremely op with lucy because lucy has issues destroying projectiles

and is overall sticky

[lucid oar]

Rd

Lmao

No

[dreamy prism]

average underdrive fan

[lucid oar]

Do you have a special boon

[dreamy prism]

what did you have on special

[lucid oar]

So common rd

Maybe ur crit rng just sucks

[tender latch]

f

[lucid oar]

Jolted?

Wtf

I’m not sure if heroes are particularly good with lucy

I know lernie is very good

Dad too

Rarity

[dreamy prism]

unlike you

[lucid oar]

waaaa

Dash?

Idk you seem to have a decent build

vruh

No image perms for underdrive fans

Just paste image link

Lvl1 tidal looks like the weak link

As well as eternal

[tight basin]

i was gonna say the biggest issue here is eternal

lvl 1 tdash sucks yeah but not having luci ramp up in damage makes you lose a lot of dps as well

[tender latch]

How 2 install damage bar mod

[tight basin]

modding discord moment

[random relic]

triple bomb

+arty special

=big damage

oh then idk what you were doing wrong

[random relic]

charged skewer with a % special

preferably arty or aphro

benefits of arty vs aphro are the same as on everything else

if you dont get charged skewer you should take quick spin

and if you dont see that take massive spin

and if you dont see that then gl lmao

damage rotation is special -> dash strike x2

[magic dagger]

serrated point is better

[random relic]

[magic dagger]

but yeah, charged special works fairly well

[random relic]

serrated is really not nice on gy

[cunning urchin]

There's like... several tiers at least between Charged Skewer and Serrated Point.

Serrated Point is decent enough though.

[random relic]

not just because cskewer is way better but also because the limited health pool from gy means that the -dash% from serrated hurts a lot

i mean the % damage reduction is the same, 10%

but yeah thats one of the benefits of aphro on gy

the benefit of arty is that it scales better through chaos/hermes/arty t2s and isnt as rarity dependent

aphro is better initally at epic and also has weak

whats considered a minus

i mean nothing oneshots you lol

the hp reduction isnt that bad

its -50%

oh

well i mean get it to level 5 then

[magic dagger]

or

[dreamy prism]

average underdrive fan

[gloomy canyon]

What are the companions you should never use? I want to save ambrosia

Or just ones not worth upgrading in general

[errant narwhal]

it totally depends but i think the agreed best companion to use for damage is meg

so if you only use her you dont have to upgrade the other ones

[gloomy canyon]

I guess i'll level up shady, and leave it at that then

[errant narwhal]

though ambrosia is not a scarce resource

if you get all bounties and prophecies and such youll have spares even if you upgrade everything and forge all bonds

[tender latch]

^ I have 40 and nothing to do with them even though I used a ton early game for titan blood

[strange lark]

i have 69 ambrosia and titan blood

[tender latch]

Based

[strange lark]

@soft kiln

https://youtu.be/Sw71YcKj9xI

in this run you can see how fast the flurry jab dash strikes are

theres always one fast dash strike and an normal attack afterwards

and spamming dash while holding attack will make you attack super fast

serrated point makes the dashstrike animation longer since there are more hits in a dstrike

so you cant spam as well with serrated

[soft kiln]

ok i guess i won't take them together anymore

also holy crap c9

how

@random relic came over here

[random relic]

oh

oops

anyways yeah 185 is an absolute achilles god

[strange lark]

no im an achilles god

i have a sub8

how many of those does 185 have

[random relic]

like 50000 probably

also god the fact that that run has a 1:30 aspho is so sad

imagine if it was like a 1:!0 aspho

[strange lark]

man if only it had a 1:#0 aspho

[soft kiln]

dude passed rod for hunter's mark

[strange lark]

rod makes casts harder to pickup

thats probably why he didnt take it

i also think he hates rod for some reason

[random relic]

and also mark is really good

[soft kiln]

i don't get why he didn't sell thunder flourish if he wanted hunting blades

[strange lark]

its good damage

[random relic]

it does lots of damage

[soft kiln]

thunder flourish is good on achilles? for real?

[random relic]

yeah

it does like 50 damage from the special alone and then theres jolted

[strange lark]

the general achilles combo is dstrike dstrike special over and over again

with some casts inbetween

[random relic]

buffs your special damage from like 30 to 250

[strange lark]

well special first then dstrike

[soft kiln]

oh man that opens up so much

[strange lark]

yeah but just get the boons 🙂

[random relic]

just rod lol

[soft kiln]

well it also makes smair easier to get

[random relic]

you dont really go for smair on achilles

because you start tidal and get arty attack and ares cast

preferably

the only time youd really ever happen into smair is lightning strike aphro flourish

and i dont know how much people take aphro special lmao

[soft kiln]

i'm not trying to speed run atm adn don't always want to start tidal

a lot of my achilles runs just start with egg or something because i want to be surprised in tart

[strange lark]

egg start based

[random relic]

egg start

[soft kiln]

what non-god keepsake would you rather start with then

[strange lark]

plume strats can be fun

shackle

or you can be retrash and start coin purse

egg strats are funny because you cant guarantee a chaos gate

so half the time its useless

[random relic]

idk i guess id just start shackle?

[soft kiln]

most of the time there's at least one gate

[random relic]

if you arent going to start tidal you should at least get some damage out of the gate

[random relic]

like 60% of the time lol

and taking a keepsake that means you dont take like 20 damage that you heal back anyways is just ehh

rarity bonus good though

...if you get a pertinent boon

[soft kiln]

my main issue with shackle if i'm not trying to speedrun is i like the long term benefits these others give

although shackle will randomly win tart if you got unlucky with boons and are weak

[strange lark]

start shackle and reset for tidal dash start

[soft kiln]

yeah i care a lot more about the rarity bonus

[soft kiln]

hah there we go

[random relic]

that rarity bonus is only going to matter on like max 40% of your chaos boons anyways

like

cast damage attack dstrike and uhhhhhh

idk what else

[soft kiln]

chance to find better boons

[random relic]

oh yeah that ones not bad

[soft kiln]

real good for duos

i've randomly had a bunch of ME runs by starting with egg XD

[strange lark]

extra cast is good

[random relic]

yeah but were talking about rarity scaling

[strange lark]

[soft kiln]

i don't mind trying plume or purse

i usually start with shackle on gy

[random relic]

theres just too many factors that have to go right for egg to make a difference

[soft kiln]

but also

i hate gy

[random relic]

why do you hate god keepsakes so much lol

[soft kiln]

i don't i start with them all the time

i just don't want to start with them every time

because sometimes i don't want to decide whta i'm going for from teh start

i have 326 attempts so far. knowing i'm starting with tdash every time gets old imo

tdash is just an example, i know you don't start tdash on everything

[random relic]

hm

fair enough ig

i really like trying to optimize my gameplay lol

hence why im a speedrunner

[strange lark]

speedrunners 🤮

[soft kiln]

i'm still optimizing, just with more constraints

[random relic]

6:59 unmodded 32

[soft kiln]

i don't need to optimize before c1. i like optimizing based on what i find

[strange lark]

thats high heat

not speedrunning

[soft kiln]

maybe it comes from playign so many deckbuilders

[random relic]

[soft kiln]

or drafting magic

[strange lark]

yeah having random builds can be fun

hence why i play with ap2 ri2 all the time

[soft kiln]

yeah like i'm still making choices but i have to figure out the path along the way

[random relic]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/845087924717486140/1020737095234486412/unknown.png

perfectly normal 32 pact

definitely not optimized for speed

[strange lark]

yeah

[random relic]

hmmmmmm

[soft kiln]

if it was for IGT isn't tight deadline bad

[strange lark]

well you would usually use uc over mm

so not actually optimised

[strange lark]

yeah but its 32 heat

6 heat from td3 is a lot

[soft kiln]

that's fair

[strange lark]

tarts get kinda sad without survival rooms yeah

[random relic]

theres no faster 6 heat lol

[strange lark]

ri3

[random relic]

true

the only timeloss in that pact is em3 bp mm and td

[strange lark]

bp is technically a timeloss and a timesave

since it makes armored enemies spawn sooner

[random relic]

true

if you get lucky its a timesave

[random relic]

and speeder

[strange lark]

em3 is really only used on beo and sometimes eris

and mm is only there for barge

[random relic]

lmao

mm is still 100% timeloss though

[strange lark]

yeah

[random relic]

with styx and whatnot

its only timeloss in bombers and styx right lol

pretty good tbh

[strange lark]

yeah

which is why tiny vermin meta for speedrunning with mm

[tender latch]

trash run, didn't thank shade

[random relic]

hmm

[strange lark]

its kinda true tbh

[random relic]

does it really equalize that much?

[strange lark]

maybe idk

i legit havent gotten tiny vermin in like 5 months

[random relic]

damnn

cracked aoeui

[strange lark]

i deleted him from the game files

[random relic]

lmao

[plain river]

Based

[random relic]

"you can play modded to not get tiny vermin"
"nah i think ill just delete him from the files"

[strange lark]

it totally works and wont mess up your game

[tight basin]

imagine walking into the tiny vermin chamber and it's just empty and you can't leave lmao

[gloomy canyon]

So does hermes attack speed buff affect draw speed of the bow?

Or just the arrow

[tight basin]

i think just draw speed of the bow, but only for standing attacks and not dash strikes

even if it does make the arrow go faster i doubt it's worth it, the arrow flies fast enough already imo

[tight basin]

Ngl I forgot aspect levels were a thing

[dreamy prism]

average underdrive fan

get more blood

[plain river]

Wait does lightning flourish lucifer instantly explode itselg

[tight basin]

Maybe if it chains from an enemy to itself?

[plain river]

well

Lightning flourish

So it drops a bolt on itself

[tight basin]

Idk how it'd work on luci because it's bad lmao

[plain river]

I mean

[tight basin]

Couldn't you just shoot it tho

[plain river]

Yes it is 4 iq

to use lightning flourish luci

Because no %

wait ME lucifer with ares attack and the bombs just exploding constantly around the enemy

I mean pulsing

Rather than exploding

I know pulsing luci is 4iq

But like

Idk I think this would be funny

Does anyone have meme builds that wouldn’t be painful to play

[tight basin]

That's fair

The idea is to dash into it so you're more likely to shoot it

And also since it's most likely gonna be near an enemy it'll chain to it anyways

Or that

You're likely to be firing anyways

[cunning urchin]

It explodes when enemies are in proximity, basically.

[plain river]

Then just get % on flourish from chaos and hermes ez

[tight basin]

So it's for when you don't want to detonate it yourself

Exactly

Get like 4 epic chaos flourishes

And then regret not taking arty special

[dreamy prism]

dire lucifortune

ares attack endless chamber dire misfortune impending doom

[cunning urchin]

It's basically a proximity mine.

[dreamy prism]

it's a pretty bad build but it's funny

[soft kiln]

started a zeus shield run with plume and natural'd into ares/athena

i have the opportunity in a god challenge room to switch ares special to athena special and then take ares attack

does that work any better for ME? or does it kinda not matter

fwiw ares special is epic lvl 3 right now

[tight basin]

i don't think it exactly matters for zeus shield, since you can just hit them into your special

oh yeah don't change the ares special

already have good poms and rarity

ME time

also like every zeus shield build, flat damage is better on the special

[soft kiln]

but that's because it does multiple hits

[tight basin]

also i think you technically don't need the dash for zeus

[soft kiln]

that doesn't matter for doom so much

although dire misfortune will be nice

[tight basin]

i mean the atk does more base damage than the special straight up so a % on that would be better anyways

and like a 60% buff on the special will make the 30 damage hits do like 46 or something

[soft kiln]

it was going to be 186% :p

but i hear ya

unfortunately i only have common athena attack so not great

[tight basin]

rip

if you're building to ME tho the % on that isn't gonna matter too much tho lol

[manic cradle]

what boons should I look for with aspect of chaos?

[plain river]

chaos shield

I think you can just play it like bad zag shield hope for charged shot and use aphrodite attack zeus call look for smouldering air

Don’t use the special because it’s bad

[tight basin]

if you do want to use the special, dionysus, ares, or zeus are good picks for them

dio wants poms, ares wants rarity and poms, zeus wants jolted

and jolted wants poms

[tender latch]

Ares is nice to set and forget

Zeus and dio want constant reapplying

But chaos can just throw 5 shields to coat everyone with doom then do whatever for a second

[manic cradle]

aight ty

[dreamy prism]

same with zeus

[tight basin]

same with every shield

[lunar crown]

heavy knuckle - flying cutter or rush kick?

zag aspect

aiming for high dodge chance

[dreamy prism]

what's on your attack and special rn

[lunar crown]

nothing

i just started

using feather

[strange lark]

reset rush kick for funnies

[dreamy prism]

yeah rush kick is pretty funny

all of those suck though

[lunar crown]

am leaning for heavy \

ik

[strange lark]

no heavy bad

[lunar crown]

ill take flying then

[dreamy prism]

yeah it's probably the best

[tight basin]

What does flying cutter do again

Oh wait I can use the bot

[lunar crown]

my first boon is athen either dash or flourish not sure

[tight basin]

Yeah flying cutter kinda eh

[dreamy prism]

ddash

[tight basin]

Ddash gaming

[dreamy prism]

idk man as

[tight basin]

Someone with

[lunar crown]

so i have 15% dodge from fist and 14% from feather

does that mean i have 29%

or is it counted differently

[strange lark]

yeah its additive

[lunar crown]

thx i beat that run

was mostly reduction of damage and dodge, i think i had about 40% dodge

and good dmg from aphro for charged special 289% dmg

each charged gave me around 500 dmg

[dreamy prism]

corngrats! 🌽🎉

[gloomy canyon]

Any good links to help me with tidal dash positioning for achilles spear?

[tender latch]

Get flurry jab hammer and just beat them up

[gloomy canyon]

Well i was trying to "git gud" for a friendly IGT tournament and i want to optimize it as much as i reasonably can

If i wasn't rusty as heck i wouldn't care as much

[strange lark]

Can I join the igt tournament

And can I bring my friend croven with me

[cunning urchin]

Not for Tidal Dash specifically, but if you haven't studied chamber layouts and spawn manipulation yet, definitely do that. https://www.hades-guides.ovh/index.php/chamber-layout/

Beyond that tbh just practice a lot, that's the best way to get better at it. There's a lot of intuitive decision making that you just learn and refine through practice.

[plain river]

Just save scum clockets on achilles

[cunning urchin]

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1eAOEli9KqJOVyPD7U-6D1o1yZx1tDMQWLDcMJr8G84E/edit
https://docs.google.com/document/d/18uZziGYDyVCwc-XgcveoY8MXp6Lwq0BD6xDV38cuYWo/edit

There's also these two guides for Achilles specifically.

And maybe watch a couple runs from the top of the leaderboard.

What's the average IGT for you and your friends?

[gloomy canyon]

To be determined. Frankly, i met them not too long ago

[cunning urchin]

Did you get a sub 10 yet? Sub 8?

Just wanna get an idea of what your level and experience is.

[gloomy canyon]

Id have to double check but i doubt i can do it again easily without shaking off my rust

Let me check though

[tight basin]

sub7

[cunning urchin]

What's the tourney format? Are you using the speedrun modpack?

[gloomy canyon]

Vanilla anyheat iirc. We're still deciding which format but ill be in either any heat vanilla or no heat vanillla

My best was 16 minutes. But i never really tried breaking records at the time

So i wasnt using the strats

[plain river]

I mean fo2 and em2 should make you faster than 0 heat I think

[gloomy canyon]

I'm sorry, what? lol

[plain river]

Fo2 makes enemies come to you faster and em2 makes lernie fight faster

no?

[gloomy canyon]

Ooh forced overtime.

[cunning urchin]

EM2 FO2 is standard for speedruns.

Yep.

[plain river]

Igt speedrun… might as well use codex tech 📈📈📈📈

[tight basin]

Lmfao

[cunning urchin]

If your best is 16m, you don't really need to read the Achilles mechanics guide tbh because that time is better spent practicing.

[gloomy canyon]

You mean pause the igt with codex right?

[plain river]

I was joking about codex tech

using it is cringe and painful

[gloomy canyon]

Oh

[cunning urchin]

Start Tidal Dash, get Flurry Jab, get Deadly Strike + Hunter's Mark or Lightning Strike + Static Discharge. Get poms on Tidal Dash and Hunter's Mark/Static Discharge.

Also look for Breaking Wave etc.

[plain river]

Reset run if no c1 flurry jab /j

[cunning urchin]

Y'all should just use the speedrun modpack for your tourney tbh to reduce the RNG. Like if you have two even players racing Achilles and one gets Flurry Jab and the other one doesn't, the one who gets Flurry Jab wins.

Better to just ensure both players start with Flurry Jab to even things out.

[plain river]

So it’s more of a skill difference than an rng difference

[cunning urchin]

The tournies before the speedrun modpack had a lot of moments like that.

[gloomy canyon]

Just found out we agreed to not use mods due to platform differences

[cunning urchin]

Same with Zag Bow. If one gets Twin Shot and the other only gets Special hammers, the one who gets Twin Shot already has double the DPS.

[plain river]

Makes sense

[cunning urchin]

Ah rip.

[gloomy canyon]

Im on vanilla anyways

[rose nexus]

Could ban certain hammers or something

If it’s meant to be tryhard and not just casual fun

[gloomy canyon]

Its a friendly competition. Nothing hardcore. I just want to not suck lol

[plain river]

Are you all using the same aspect?

[gloomy canyon]

No

[rose nexus]

Oh Hades

[cunning urchin]

Well, with just the basic understanding of the build and grinding runs, you should be able to push down to sub 10 at the very least, and with a little more practice than that down to getting sub 10 pretty consistently... assuming 2-sack at least.

[gloomy canyon]

Just whoever gets best IGT wins within X hours

[plain river]

I need a better grasp of speedrun strats

My fastest run still isn’t sub10

[rose nexus]

Move to the side of the door and pause

I’ve picked up that much from watching one video

[plain river]

[rose nexus]

[plain river]

I think it might also be some fundemental skills that need polishing and decision making

[cunning urchin]

If you understand the basics of the build, knowing any deeper strats isn't gonna make up for lack of practice tbh. Practice is the #1 factor.

You just gotta do a lot more runs.

[rose nexus]

Manifest easy floors into existence

[plain river]

True

I should probably stop doing meme builds

[gloomy canyon]

Well any strats for EM2?

[cunning urchin]

Just kill everything.

[gloomy canyon]

I mean fair

[cunning urchin]

DDs are a resource, don't worry about that when speedrunning.

Also make sure you run High Confidence btw.

[plain river]

It literally just makes the lernie heads closer together and also closer to you so

Free time

[gloomy canyon]

Ah

[rose nexus]

Me when I just realized what lernie is thanks to that comment

[plain river]

?

[rose nexus]

I kept seeing the name and didn’t realize it was hydra

[plain river]

Are you not far enough into the game for zag to call him lernie yet

[rose nexus]

Nope

17 runs

Or so

[cunning urchin]

Make sure you don't dash mindlessly on magma too much because that will slow you down and potentially actually kill you. But speedruns are really just being hyper-aggressive and not minding your HP at all.

[rose nexus]

3 dad attempts

[plain river]

Just win already 👍👍👍

[rose nexus]

I been trying

Are you supposed to avoid the green jars or break them from a distance

[cunning urchin]

Yes.

[plain river]

Yes

[rose nexus]

Me when dash strike button mash fails me because of jars

[cunning urchin]

Here's a compilation of tips for the fight that I've written in the server at some point or another. https://docs.google.com/document/d/137Vqe-8fvStMJ_HMlBKWwq3SVdoOED0lOpBBSmgGwtQ/edit?usp=sharing

Might help you.

[rose nexus]

You a real one

[gloomy canyon]

I assume use gods pride instead of legacy

For achilles

[plain river]

Nyaanyaa mewmew is actually a fake one

[plain river]

Unless your build wants multiple duos and legendaries

Most of the time rarity >>> duo chance

[gloomy canyon]

Yeah thought so

Hunting blades is so satisfying though. When it works, it works lol

[plain river]

It works but even still

I haven’t switched off epic chance in forever

And I haven’t noticed much change

[cunning urchin]

Of course you wouldn't notice change if you don't change anything.

[plain river]

Don’t worry I have all the braincells all the time

It’s a scam anyways

[random relic]

@tender latch my understanding of why ff is better is that you dont always apply both status effects since sometimes youre at range and also you want the first cast to get the bonus

[tender latch]

Speaking of which

[random relic]

so if youre being optimistic, you lose out on the ff bonus for snurst attack and first cast and only get it for the last 2 casts

[tender latch]

why tf do people use twin shot hera

[random relic]

beeg damage

[tight basin]

flurry is better if you're good at it

[random relic]

youre generally in melee range most of the time

[tender latch]

I don't need to be good at it

[random relic]

and yeah typically with modded people do flurry start

[tender latch]

I just pause between shots 💪

[random relic]

sounds like a recipe for disaster

[tight basin]

i start twin because i'm bad 😎

[random relic]

lmao based

i got like a totally random 8:1x hera time and i tried playing it again a few days ago and i cant match it at all

so idk wtf i did lol

[tender latch]

You probably got the rooms

[cunning urchin]

Because it's good.

Idk what to tell you. Double Attack damage is good.

Can really speed up Tartarus a lot, especially. But just generally good throughout the run.

[tender latch]

Asphodel enemies hopping 7 light years away seems like a pain to deal with

[cunning urchin]

Well.

Just skip Asphodel.

[spark kite]

Heyo I have a question.

Do the lightning bolts from Scintilating Feast benefit from buffs to Cast Damage, like from Achiles Spear or the Chaos Boon?

[cunning urchin]

No.

[spark kite]

thx

[cunning urchin]

[plain river]

Only way to buff those is zeus boons and global +%

[spark kite]

Yeah main reason I asked was bc I got Dio cast with Achiles, and I was wondering if taking the Zeus keepsake was worth it.

[plain river]

Scillanting feast isn’t bad tbf

Wouldn’t shoot for it though

[spark kite]

Probably still okay, but in hindsight I might've preferred Poseidon (bc I already had Artemis)

[plain river]

It’s a good pick up

[spark kite]

Poseidon may still be worth it for Elysium 🤔

I got Arty Attack, Dio cast, Zeus dash and Demeter call, and already got Ice Wine. This build is so all over the place xD

[plain river]

Definitely

Taking splash dash = good

mirage shot also good

oh already have zeus dash 🤔

could hope for exchange

or take tempest flourish for mirage shot

[spark kite]

I'ma aim for Poseidon's Call or Special (after purging Demeter bc of Underworld Customs)

[plain river]

I think hoping for exchange into tidal dash > flourish > aid

would be my line of choice

then hope for zeus or dio aid instead of going for pos aid

[spark kite]

Can you get an exchange option on a core boon that's already Epic?

[plain river]

Yes

It’ll go to heroic

[spark kite]

Oh okay, wasn't aware that worked with exchanges too.

[plain river]

Twice I’ve tried to play aspect of demeter with demeter flourish and both times I ended up switching off for an exhange for a heroic

So would take tidal dash if possible, then flourish if no dash, then pos aid if no flourish

Imo

[spark kite]

Aight, just hit the Flourish.

Thx for the help

[cunning urchin]

Call > Flourish

[tender latch]

Nah just highroll into c4 Athena call smair

[plain river]

🤔 why?

[cunning urchin]

Because it's a good Call, and your Special doesn't really matter much on Achilles Aspect. Tempest Flourish will also knock back enemies, which isn't ideal really on that aspect.

[acoustic vale]

Note that Poseidon call is worse on keyboard

[turbid needle]

Skill issue

[lucid oar]

True

[cunning urchin]

Can't relate. Never had skill issues in my life.

[random relic]

yeah this ones a skissue pos call is fine on kbm

[tight basin]

@mellow flax you should also change up your mirror, not for a better time, but just better overall choices. change golden touch to deep pockets, olympian favor to dark foresight, and gods' legacy to gods' pride

oh and boiling blood over abyssal blood

[mellow flax]

I have maxed out only those u mentioned that I used for this run, will focus on collecting more darkness for the others

Thanks for the tipps!

[tight basin]

oh another one actually

high confidence is generally only used if you want speedrun

otherwise, the other one is better for more overall hp

i forgot the name, dark vitality or whatever

[wary adder]

it's called thick skin

[tight basin]

that's the one

[random relic]

thick skin is fine if you arent going for like sub10 times

[tight basin]

where'd i get dark vitality from lmao

[random relic]

dark regen + cthonic vitality

= dark vitality

[tight basin]

the amount of darkness you currently have dictates your hp

[tender latch]

Based

Get a % of total darkness as healing per room

[tight basin]

lmao the maxed save file has like 300k darkness on it

[tender latch]

Exactly

[random relic]

i wonder how much darkness i have

[wary adder]

got 500 darkness from a voidskate recently like wow thanks now i can upgrade fated authority

[tight basin]

fated authority gaming

[manic cradle]

does the hunters mark and deadly reversal crit chance increase apply to attacks that aren't empowered by pp or an arti boon?

[proper furnace]

Yeah

Hunters also applies to traps/summons/Than

[tender latch]

No way lmao

what does than do

Go past 9999? Just deal the same damage but with a different font to show it's a crit?

[cunning urchin]

Than can do more than 9999 damage.

[tender latch]

Incredible

[unreal tree]

than crits are very funny

[manic cradle]

can lightning bounces with storm lightning bounce back to someone they've already bounced to?

[dreamy prism]

would be shocked it they could

[manic cradle]

if that was a pun, I only just now understood it

[near pelican]

Does anyone know of a resource (list etc) for finding strong/fun/unusual builds with each weapon/aspect? Right now I’m looking for a fun Guan Yu build.

[lucid oar]

https://www.leereamsnyder.com/blog/hades-build-guide

[near pelican]

I always use the weapon with the darkness buff since I’m grinding for ranks. I feel like every time I get a certain weapon I do the same thing, for example if it’s spear I just do Achilles and get Hunting Blades.

[near pelican]

Thanks!

[plain river]

Super soaker guan-yu or special focus

[near pelican]

Super soaker?

[plain river]

Poseidon attack + sea storm + quick spin + massive spin

It works

[sweet blade]

How does Zeus' special boon work exactly? Does it have an internal cooldown between procs or can it only hit an enemy once per special? I've heard of both of those

[tight basin]

there's an internal cooldown, like 0.2 seconds between each lightning strike

because of the internal cooldown, it generally only hits an enemy once on chiron bow

once or twice

[sweet blade]

oof, build ruined

[tight basin]

i mean thunder flourish is meta for high heat on chiron because it provides some aoe

[cunning urchin]

Thunder Flourish still sucks in high heat.

[plain river]

The latter is subjective based on the weapon/aspect used

[sweet blade]

e.g. Exagryph special, hitting multiple enemies at the same time

[plain river]

I know it more as like chiron or demeter if you hit the same target a bunch of times at once it’ll only really drop 1 maybe 2 bolts but idk about aoe’s like rail special

Or like cluster bomb on rail with zeus special idk how that works

I can test that out rn though because my super soaker build died in last phase of dad fight

I generally wouldn’t take flat damage like zeus on something like rail special though

[cunning urchin]

The cooldown is per target. So you can hit multiple enemies just fine within the cooldown period, but not the same enemies multiple times.

[plain river]

Hmm

Sounds like super soaker zag shield time

[cunning urchin]

It's not "super soaker" unless it's Lucifer, you know.

[random relic]

no, its like top 3 options lol

[plain river]

It’s super soaker if I have tempest strike and sea storm

I was running legit super soaker earlier though

Lucifer

eternal chamber

Splash strike

Sea storm

Everything else

[lunar crown]

triple shot or perfect shot?

i have hera with explosive shot

[magic dagger]

absolutely not how that works

[lucid oar]

Triple

(I’m aware that you’ve probably finished the run already)

[lunar crown]

ye thanks anyway

[plain river]

[tight basin]

Flurry shot bow can be a super soaker

And considering you're not doing only dash strikes you can pick up swift strike from Hermes to go faster

[plain river]

Flurry fire swift strike zag rail can be super soaker

Zag shield can be super soaker

any shield can be super soaker

[tight basin]

Flood shot beo is shotgun super soaker

[rose nexus]

What boons does Achilles want?

[tight basin]

depends on how you want to build it really, hunting blades with mirage shot is a typical one most people do

if you get flurry jab as your first hammer, you can build for zeus atk

[random relic]

yeah pretty much that

[rose nexus]

So start Artemis trinket?

[random relic]

worth noting that stuff like phalanx/trippy shot also do a ton of damage on achilles

[random relic]

arty or poseidon for splash dash

[tight basin]

ngl i dont know how to start blades achilles, i heard people start tidal dash

which like yeah mirage shot is great but wouldn't you want to prioritize hunting blades so the cast is actually useful?

[random relic]

splash dash is standard speedrun start

[random relic]

splash dash is for damage without the cast lol, since the build isnt reliable

[tight basin]

ah

[random relic]

if you arent speedrunning id start arty/ares

for hb

[tight basin]

makes sense then

[random relic]

but as mentioned, other casts are still busted on achilles

like phalanx shot can do like 500+ in one cast out of tart if you just put like 1 or 2 poms into it and that doesnt even need a duo to be super good

[rose nexus]

No arty special in c1

[surreal nymph]

I haven't beaten the game on any higher heat than 9 so far. I have a few tabs open w/ recommended builds but I'm always afraid to go higher. I'd like to at least get to 16 to get Skelly's 2nd achievement. Haha.

[plain river]

Jump to 32 heat rn

[rose nexus]

Yeah

[plain river]

📈📈

Matty did it

[rose nexus]

Don’t look back

[plain river]

You can too

[rose nexus]

Sub32 is subhuman

Me, admittedly a goblin

[plain river]

Actually matty jumped from 8 heat to 32 so if you’ve cleared 9 heat you should be fine

[surreal nymph]

I'm still relatively new to the game. I've beaten it like 39 times or something, but definitely don't have things memorized in terms of what books to go for for any given weapon/aspect.

[plain river]

Please don’t seriously take into account anything I just said 👍👍👍

I mean matty jumping from 8 heat to 32 heat is true but the rest shouldn’t be listened to

[surreal nymph]

EM3 seems pretty doable. Other stuff is where I start to get a little less sure. I'm never gonna take that trap one. I'm terrible about accidentally dashing into traps/lava/etc

[rose nexus]

Is that the guy who posted in boast with 32 all weps?

[surreal nymph]

I need to grind to get more darkness to get more rerolls because I'm in the middle of a fist run and couldn't get Athena's dash. Have Ares on attack, Athena on special, Poseiden on dash.

[plain river]

Idk a lot of people have 32 with all weapons

That doesn’t narrow it down

[magic dagger]

if your nine heat includes FO2, you're ready for 32 heat

[rose nexus]

Just yesterday

Said something about a charity stream

[plain river]

No

[surreal nymph]

I think my 9 heat was only FO1.

[plain river]

that was not matty

[magic dagger]

the fella you're thinking of calls himself rivalgas

[tight basin]

learn forced overtime 2 and tight deadline 3, get used to lasting consequences 4 and stubborn defiances

[surreal nymph]

Thanks I'll give that a try.

Any recommended weapon/aspect/build?

[rose nexus]

Zag fists

Punish yourself

[plain river]

aspect of lucifer, eternal chamber, tempest strike, sea storm

[tender latch]

Use arthur/sure footing 🧠

[surreal nymph]

I got my first Arthur clear yesterday. Hadn't ever used it before.

[tight basin]

doing 32 heat for the first time on arthur probably isn't recommended ngl lmao

[tender latch]

It isn't lol

Just use chiron and run away

[tight basin]

TD:

[tender latch]

td2 still leaves you time

[surreal nymph]

Chiron w/ Art special is fun.

[tender latch]

I did 32heat bow with chiron because
1: Rama annoying even though I love it, fo2 armored strongbows are hell for rama
2: I already did a bunch of hera
3: Ngl I should have gone with zagbow, would've been fun

Pretty sure tailesque's highest chiron clear had that

athena attack art special lmao

Poor dude had to use like 3 targeted specials just to kill one bother

[tight basin]

td3 is easy tho

[cunning urchin]

Tbh that sounds like Heightened Security would be excellent to push you out of your comfort zone and to pay more attention to trap locations and timings. We were all terrible at one time.

There's also no real secret to getting more comfortable at higher heats than you're comfortable at now... Your first runs likely all ended pretty badly, but you just kept going for it and got better at it. It's the same thing with pushing heat. At first it's difficult, but you get better with practice and experience and eventually something like 16 Heat will feel very chill.

[rose nexus]

I hear EM2 is secretly based

[tender latch]

Not even secretly

Openly

It lets you kill lernie heads faster

[plain river]

Literally speedrun strats to use it

Makes lernie fight faster

[tight basin]

Also a lot harder lmao

Lernie tax

[errant narwhal]

@rose nexus snow burst happens on you when you load your cast

[rose nexus]

Ahh that’s unfortunate

[lucid oar]

It’s actually good that way

Kill an exalted in elysium with casts, use snow burst to kill the soul, repeat

[tight basin]

If you wanted to chill on the atk you'd use frost strike, which is the second best way to inflict privileged status

[earnest oak]

What's the best cast to get with the Hera bow?

[plain river]

Pos and aphro are good otherwise idk

trippy flare high roll

[tight basin]

Poseidon cast for Hera? Never heard about that one

[plain river]

Hmm

Oh wait

Hera != beo

Splash shot != splash flare

mirage shot doesn’t do 100% on hera either so

Disregard what I said

[acoustic vale]

No cast hera gaming

[tight basin]

Shackle hera

[acoustic vale]

Tooth hera no cast gaming

[plain river]

Hera is just discount zag bow anyways just forget about the cast /j

[tight basin]

True

[acoustic vale]

Imagine Lucifer but deflect applied to the whole beam

[tight basin]

does it not do that

ik you can cheese the bull fight with divine strike eternal chamber but that's because he's right in your face

[gloomy canyon]

can you still get duo boons it double god chambers?

[cunning urchin]

No.

[gloomy canyon]

i forgor

sad

[acoustic vale]

No. Only the tip. Which is sad cause I'd love to just spin in witches circle

[tight basin]

Damn

Luci sucks

[dreamy prism]

but legendaries are fair game

[rose nexus]

@thorn tendon you can upload to Imgur and then post the link here, it will auto embed

[thorn tendon]

oh ic

[rose nexus]

Or even just post to another server (can make your own) then copy the media link

And paste that

[thorn tendon]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/725021639506526249/1022436772287877150/unknown.png rewatching the hades fight from some insane run i recorded a while ago (that's one hit)

[rose nexus]

What was that damage from?

[thorn tendon]

hazard bomb + a zillion buffs

calc says it maxed out at 5107 with that build but i didn't catch that on camera

[spark kite]

Hey peeps, I'm back with a mechanical question.
Does Hermes' Swift Strike increase the speed at which the Shield's Bull Rush charges up?

[unreal tree]

it only increases the speed of the standing attack, which technically makes it faster to pull up the block

but the charge time isnt reduced

[spark kite]

Okay, thx ^^

[acoustic vale]

What do you guys think the worst two sword hammers to get in a run are? I'm thinking cursed slash and something else

[plain river]

Cursed world splitter

[acoustic vale]

What does world splitter do again?

[proper furnace]

Atk combo is replaced by big chop

90 base dmg

Doesnt hurt it just does nothing

[plain river]

well like you can’t even use cursed slash well if you have world splitter as well

Otherwise cursed slash dash nova

[lucid oar]

Dash nova

[hexed lagoon]

Once I got a bad anvil and got world splitter and cursed slash

That was my first win tho

[strange lark]

Retrash build

[tight basin]

Retrash gaming

[plain river]

Should’ve just rng manipulated the anvil smh

[hexed lagoon]

Damn I'll try that next time. Unmodded rng manipulation

[plain river]

Unmodded rng manipulating anvil is a thing

I do it all the time

[plain river]

It just also relies on save scumming

Fingers crossed for epic swift strike 📈

Hmm

Blue swift strike we take those

[surreal nymph]

I'm trying to work on that prophecy to beat the game with every pact of punishment thing but I'm a bit scared of the one w/ 400% trap damage. I'm bad at avoiding traps.

[plain river]

you don’t have to run them all on the same run

You can run it by itself

[surreal nymph]

Yeah that's my plan.

I just need to train myself to focus on NOT stepping on them. Haha.

[rose nexus]

Get heroic Athena trap boon 🧠

[plain river]

Yeah just get heroic sure footing

Take 95% less trap damage

[rose nexus]

Would that combo mean magma would still shred you? Or does sure footing affect magma too

[plain river]

Sure footing affects magma

[rose nexus]

The pact specifies both but the boon just says traps

K

[plain river]

it’ll actually let you stand on magma for a little without taking damage before the damage ramps up iirc

[rose nexus]

Some runs it feels like magma ramps up quicker

Like I can barely touch the sliver of magma in between some of the tighter asphodel maps and take damage

Yet other times I can be super sloppy with my dashes on the maps with wide magma bars and it doesn’t even start to damage me

[plain river]

Only if you have sure footing thou

[rose nexus]

Don’t understand it

[surreal nymph]

So equip the Athena keepsake in Tartarus and hope for a good sure footing? It's not really 95% is it? Best I've seen is like 30% I feel like.

[plain river]

I was joking about intentionally picking it up

[surreal nymph]

Haha.

[plain river]

But it does scale hard with rarity

[surreal nymph]

I actually HAD wondered if that'd be useful.

[plain river]

Rare is like 60%, epic is 90% and heroic is 95%

[surreal nymph]

Wow.

[plain river]

But

I wouldn’t go out of my way for it

Just avoid traps

[surreal nymph]

I was thinking Chiron might be good to help me avoid traps.

Since I don't have to dash around TOO much w/ that.

Do dad's evil hands count as traps?

[plain river]

Would just say any ranged weapon instead of just chiron

[plain river]

No but the pots in dad fight do

[surreal nymph]

The skull guys?

Oh that's what I meant. The pots that turn into evil hand pits.

[plain river]

the green pots in phase 2

yes those

[surreal nymph]

I feel like that's gonna be the hardest pact to clear with.

I've already cleared w/ most of the others.

[plain river]

Not really

I think ap1 is more annoying and fo1 if you aren’t used to it

Although if you do have problems with traps it might

Like you have said you do

[surreal nymph]

I haven't done AP yet.

[spark kite]

I actually used traps for some of my bounty runs. It's actually a great way to get better at the game, since you should be able to avoid all traps all the time. Dad's hands really are the most difficult part.

[surreal nymph]

FO I think I've done.

[plain river]

Wouldn’t go out of my way to use HS for heat though it can be rough

[surreal nymph]

I'm just trying to do low heat runs w/ 1 or 2 I haven't used so I can fill that prophecy.

Then I'll use ones that are more easily doable for higher heat runs.

[plain river]

Thats how I did iirc

It was a long time ago when I did it though

So I don’t really remember

[surreal nymph]

np. I'm sure I'll figure it out.

[tender latch]

Not with hs, since damage is additive

[plain river]

true

but damage reduction isn’t additive

It is true that hs means that won’t happen

[tender latch]

Wait what

Is it actually multiplicative

There's no way

[tender latch]

#h1-victory-boasting message

Nah, it is additive 😔

[plain river]

I’m 90% sure that isn’t true

Wait

Nevermind

That is odd

Sure footing additive but other damage reduction surely isn’t

[random relic]

damage reduction is multiplicative

and so is sure footing

@tight basin wtf lmao

[plain river]

See I am right

🧠🧠🧠🧠

📈📈📈📈

[random relic]

yep you are

[tender latch]

Wow

Yet another thing that makes athena s+++ for high heat

[plain river]

You should never have doubted me

[plain river]

It doesn’t?

unless you’re talking bronze skin

[tender latch]

I'm a monkey brain speedrunner whose highest heat is 32 on a couple weapons lmao

[random relic]

based

[tender latch]

I don't take sure footing because I only see athena to get c3 ME c4 ddash 💪

[strange lark]

Athena sux ngl

[plain river]

I’m a monkey brain just trying to get final resource director rank

[strange lark]

I like monkey

Especially in the game blons tower defense

[plain river]

I like monkey
I hate bloons

[tender latch]

Nah athena goated

I love invalidating an entire enemy type by mashing spacebar

[random relic]

???? what are you saying

[plain river]

Words

[random relic]

sf multiplicative
athena bad

???

[plain river]

I said they ain’t bad

[random relic]

do you know what s+++ means

[plain river]

uh

Ohhhhh

[random relic]

[plain river]

I thought they were censoring a certain 4 letter word that starts with s

[random relic]

bruh

[tender latch]

Oh

I was

So confused

[plain river]

Understandably

[tight basin]

Oh right I forgot lmao

I am not very bright as you can tell

Sure footing absolutely based then

[tender latch]

Fr

Athena is like miles above the rest for high as hell heat, but like

What're considered the best ones at that point?

Kinda confused tbh since eris takes dio over zeus, but zeus shield still spams zeus even if they're both running ap2

[tight basin]

Zeus shield hits often enough I guess idk

[tender latch]

I mean so does eris it's a literal rifle

[tight basin]

I'd assume that since Zeus is a shield it can get away with more stuff

Or maybe it just needs more aoe because rail has a bomb idk

[dreamy prism]

I think zeus also staggers enemies

so jolted is less valuable than rail

[tender latch]

wait what

wouldn't that work the other way

If they're staggered then jolted can't proc as much

[tight basin]

Well that's why Zeus shield still runs zeus

It staggers so jolted doest proc

Rail atk doesn't stagger so jolted procs

[random relic]

??? that doesnt make any sense

are you ok lmao

anyways @tender latch i think the reason zeus still runs zeus is because zeus special does way more damage than zeus attack and would apply dio special really slowly

[tender latch]

Wait, how? Jolted needs them to attack, so staggers/stuns mean they can't trigger it as much

[random relic]

right

i was talking to bananas

who said less jolted procs is why zeus runs zeus

[tight basin]

I was clarifying with @dreamy prism said

[tender latch]

😵‍💫

[random relic]

still doesnt make any sense

ignore those 2 smh

but yeah itd take a long time for zeus shield to stack dio special

[tender latch]

Really? I thought it just goes out there and vibes while smacking people

[dreamy prism]

well the point is that zeus shield staggering means that jolted is less valuable

hence zeus shield special is less dependent on jolted and thus doesn't need to run dio

[tender latch]

Ah

[random relic]

??? that still doesnt make any sense lmao

all that means is that itd be even better with jolted

it doesnt say anything about how good zeus special without jolted is (or more importantly why you use it)

[dreamy prism]

but it means that zeus is comparatively better than dio

[random relic]

no it doesnt

lmao

[dreamy prism]

since dio is run when high level jolted is both important and not realistic

[random relic]

right

they were asking for why zeus is better than dio

[dreamy prism]

and jolted is less important on zeus shield compared to eris

[random relic]

yeah that doesnt mean anything though

youre assuming that using zeus special without jolted is better than using dio special

and using it to justify itself

[strange lark]

Don't use the special on shield just run cshot

[dreamy prism]

que

[random relic]

the question was like
dio is better than zeus on eris ap2 because you cant reliably get jolted
if you cant reliably get jolted on zeus shield ap2 either then why do you run it instead of dio special?

[dreamy prism]

yeah

and part of it is that jolted is less impactful

[random relic]

no

that doesnt make any sense

[dreamy prism]

it makes perfect sense

[random relic]

no

[dreamy prism]

uh yes it does

[random relic]

zeus shield stunning just means that jolted will increase your dps less than it does on eris

[dreamy prism]

yes

[random relic]

that doesnt say anything about the dps of either of them without jolted though

[dreamy prism]

hence not getting jolted consistently is more manageable for zeus shield vs eris

and hence partially why zeus shield prefers zeus over dio compared to eris

[random relic]

yeah but that doesnt explain why you run zeus and not dio

lmao

[dreamy prism]

uh yeah it does