h2-builds-and-combat

[drowsy basin]

Nergal is essentially spamming omega attack?

Yeah I must admit

[spark crown]

That's a way to play it

[drowsy basin]

I'll keep you in touch for my progress. Thanks for the advice!

And I swear, I'm not that bad at this game, I can handle +20 fear with any other weapon. It's just axe my problem.

[spark crown]

Nah your good 👍

I have a 200loss streak for 60f ATM

[drowsy basin]

Well I'm just a causal player then, I'm satisfied with one 40f run cleared XD

[spark crown]

Tbh that's higher than most get to

[drowsy basin]

I'm the kind of player that doesn't push it more than the game is asking 👴

[spark crown]

Tbh it starts to feel much easier as you add more XD

Tho for me taking of certain vows makes the run slower

[spark crown]

stares at frenzy

[drowsy basin]

Eris running out is very frustrating

[spark crown]

I tend to run out of time at poly and have at least 1-2 min left when starting eris

[drowsy basin]

Right now I suck at vor bosses, I have to keep getting good with them

[spark crown]

I only have tips for promecles

[drowsy basin]

The first tries I thought I'd never manage to do the Prometheus memory game with Heracles rushing at me but it turns out pretty easy

[spark crown]

yes also highly recomend knuckle bones for em especially if you have hitch

[drowsy basin]

Why is that? Noob here remember

[spark crown]

hitch shares damage and when knuckle bones trigger it shares that damage basically making it count twice

[drowsy basin]

Ok so knuckle bones is the best keepsake for mount olympus

[spark crown]

yeah

[drowsy basin]

That's the moment I'm using the golden ticket

[tough torrent]

Interesting

I've been doing hammer there if I don't specifically need something else

[spark crown]

Hammer will last all the way from r2 - end of run so taking it second is usually better unless you are running chrolex(ew)

[tough torrent]

I guess if you take no optional rooms it lasts

But the first two keepsakes are kind of locked up for me whether im doing whim or rerolls

For rerolls im usually taking God keepsakes the first two, and for whim its poms and chrolex

[spark crown]

There's not really many optional rooms on surface atleast but I tended to have 2-3 rooms left whenever I used hammer r2 while grabbing most rooms in uw

[tough torrent]

Hmm

[tough torrent]

Wait so do the launch doors in Olympus not make you climb faster?

[spark crown]

They do???

[tough torrent]

I dont know???

[spark crown]

If they do I've never heard of it

[tough torrent]

I assumed so cause like
They're launching you

I feel like I remember some sort of mel voice line about taking the long way but maybe that was for something else

Idk been a while

[drowsy basin]

I always have bad rng with hammers so I’m used with not relying on it

[tough torrent]

It's not great yeah but the options for generic value trinkets is kind of limited

[alpine raft]

it isnt like tartarus extra rooms no

inside is same amount of rooms as out

[tough torrent]

O

[final sedge]

Is the increased attack power or armor for the first few seconds of an encounter basically garbage? Maybe I'm not fast enough, but I can't barely get to two enemies before it expires.

[wild drift]

Pretty ok for normal encounters, pretty meh for bossfights especially the armor if you have Lovers card

The armor is the nerfed version already, iIrc it used to be just invulnerability for the first n seconds which was obviously much better

[final sedge]

even if I was invulnerable I wouldn't think it was that good. Also, hard to rewire my brain to think 100 damage is okay to take, and hard for me to take that much damage if I'm also dishing it out.

[keen bluff]

7 seconds of free dmg is pretty good

or however long security system is

(if it was invulenerability, since id assume it would be used over things like snow queen, lovers, etc)

[wild drift]

I didn't play at the time so I only know from watching old videos but I think Mint Condition was like 12 seconds of invulnerability at epic which is just insane

12 seconds of pure DPS, you could do entire boss phases

[opal pecan]

It's pretty dece, and if you also have Heavy Metal then it's also another "start of encounter" damage boost to go with Hydraulic Might

It's not like you have to deliberately take damage, just have an awareness of "I don't have to play as carefully"

Like if a bot comes out of the gate in its machine gun mode, instead of spending time dodging around, you can just bull your way right up to its face and whack it full strength

[tough torrent]

Implying i dont do that whether or not I have sec system

[fiery kraken]

unfortunately snow queen and lovers get eaten before armor from security system

[surreal hazel]

Security system does let you yolo like a moron with hydraulic might

[spark crown]

^^^ :P

[dry jay]

is the ankh viable long term?
ive just gotten it recently and greatly enjoyed using it
it seems strong but I haven't tested it on higher fear yet

[austere trail]

yep

[split igloo]

how does Athena's deflection thing work? assuming I got the special deflect, do I need to hit an enemy's attack with that slow moving projectile?

seems super impractical tbh

[opal pecan]

Yes. It's not really something that is worth relying on offensively.

Just an extra little bonus really.

I would say that in terms of the deflect boons that Athena can offer in H2, Mental Block > whatever the special one is called > Divine Dash.

This is personal opinion.

[split igloo]

Ares' wounds seem meh too, big damage on first hit, then nothing for 3 seconds, okay on specials, but I wouldn't take the strike version

[opal pecan]

Reason being, you already have iframes on dash, and as you yourself observed, the special thing is a bit fussy.

If you are running the Messenger arcana, that does decrease the value of Mental Block somewhat, ofc.

[opal pecan]

You'd mainly be taking it for the % bonus, Origination proc, and potentially proccing Wounds-related boons such as Grievous Blow and Heinous Affront

[split igloo]

I eventually got some other boon that made wounds drop orbs that you auto-collect in combat, it's like a minor buff but ends when you leave the room

[opal pecan]

Yeah, you need a specific duo if you want to keep plasma

I think even the Ares glazers are less enthused about the plasma part of his kit

[split igloo]

idk about Ares, the wound flourish + that cast where swords drop on enemies are decent but not amazing

he took so long to unlock, so a little underwhelming perhaps

[opal pecan]

He uh... provides atmosphere :P But if you've unlocked the codex, you could read through some of his secondary boons and check 'em out.

Note that Light Smite, Apollo's revenge boon that works with Heinous Affront, hits (almost?) every enemy in the encounter

[split igloo]

his whole character is "dude I love killing, you're probably just like me amrite" lol

[split igloo]

so at this point I can no damage the first 3 UW bosses, but Chronos' scythe combo is not very intuitive and I end up bleeding hp

it's too fast so I basically just try to dash behind him when he twitches and it semi-works, but not super consistent

[opal pecan]

The one where he throws and it goes spinny spin or the one where he slashes and leaves a trail

[split igloo]

the 3 hit combo and the throw, both are annoying

[opal pecan]

For the throw, someone told me that apparently when it's coming out and when it finishes its arc, it apparently hits slightly behind Chronos as well

So this is one of the times where you shouldn't hug a boss's back too closely

[split igloo]

I know it goes clockwise because the time meme

[digital juniper]

yeah what DD does is basically increase your dash iframes

[tough torrent]

Yeah as was said, its like fine on its own, but scales really well with secondary boons

Also, like, the one big hit is often all you need for most mobs

[split igloo]

yeah but might as well just run Heph blast then, though Ares has a curse as well all in one boon

[opal pecan]

Yes, and as previously alluded to, various boons which specifically proc based on Wounds

[tough torrent]

i believe the 50 base power of the wound proc factors in to the % modifier on the attack/spec

fwiw

[split igloo]

oh yeah, what the hell is an omega combo? there's an arcana that boosts this, do you need to execute more than one omega move in a quick succession?

[opal pecan]

Just in succession, either the window is super generous or it doesn't check

*More than one kind, specifically

[split igloo]

doesn't look like it's worth it

[opal pecan]

It's worth putting on for aspects that do a lot of different omega moves in succession naturally

[tough torrent]

basically the only time i've gotten it naturally often enough to notice the icon is with Momus lol

[opal pecan]

Assuming you have spare grasp

Moros would potentially benefit, for instance

[tough torrent]

ah yeah

[opal pecan]

Shiva perhaps

[tough torrent]

like all the torches like using both o spec and o attack

[alpine raft]

i think eos is the best user but its still niche

[tough torrent]

eos is weird. it feels like a reverse moros lol

channel your attack and them spam channeled specials, instead of the other way around lol

[alpine raft]

with night you ospecial first and the daybreaker gets crit chance on its special

[tough torrent]

weird

[alpine raft]

well you do that combo anyway but thats why its decent with night

[tough torrent]

oh so like the mimic specials dawnbreaker does count as omega damage?

not just the blast it does once in a while

[alpine raft]

im not certain if it counts for stuff like cut above, but im almost certain it inherits the crit chanve

have to ask plasma

[umbral horizon]

Is the same way on Momus?

[mystic mango]

Momus I know activates cut above

It activates anything that counts as omega hits or omega damage but not ocean swell or fine line

Idk if momus inherits crit chance

[mystic mango]

Just the dawnbreaker itself counts as the omega

Anything from specials is just a mimic

So specials inherit any effects from your specials including crit chance

[alpine raft]

hm its looking like both eos daybreaker specials and momus turrets dont crit w night

[opal pecan]

It's only a crit %chance though, right

Or are you looking at code

[spiral wadi]

man, brought selene into fields during a 67 run but getting the talent chaos thing that reduces the amount of magic i use severely guts hex charging :(

[alpine raft]

i tested it for like 3 minutes on skelly

[opal pecan]

Dang... that's dedication

[flint widget]

im aware that turrets dont crit with night but to find out daybreaker specials dont crit too is crazy

[inner tendon]

What's the best order for Zag, Hades, and Chronos keepsakes for a Fates' whim run?

[median anvil]

start with jpom, take chrolex second zone

zag's is more niche and is mainly used for fun runs

[inner tendon]

Got it. Thanks. Just recently maxed my judgement arcana and first time trying out those keepsakes. While they are a lot less powerful in runs, they are a lot of fun to mix things up lol

[vernal quiver]

You shouldn't be running judgment at all unless its 65f

Theyre wayyyy stronger than rerolls too and its not close

[surreal hazel]

The specials are specisls

And yes, the daybreaker pulses are the only thing eos does that is tagged as omega attack damage

[digital juniper]

the fact that you’re running selene 67 is jarring of itself😭

[white sun]

how does the aspect of persephone sprouted work

[median anvil]

lets you steer the skull around like tokyo drift

[spark crown]

Olympian damage = time time = damage damage = win

[surreal hazel]

Basically olympian damage charges a meter that gets spent on the next oSpecial you fire

More meter, longer oSpecial

It might not be the best dps to even extend oSpecial, but you're totally invuln during it so you can away with riskier plays and just barge your way out

You can of course just choose to ignore that part of the aspect and play for pom highrolling

[tough torrent]

Could be cool to block oneshots or other big hits

[flint widget]

dodging normally still better tho

[tough torrent]

Nou

[surreal hazel]

Yeah you still need to charge it

More for stopping yourself getting ganked

Or use it to wipe hitch across an entire horde

[tough torrent]

I mean chronos needs to charge his things up too

It wouldnt be great against like Simon says cause its so drawn out but yknow

[umbral horizon]

Take rapid driver and just punch everytime

[white sun]

can i get like a really good special build for persephone

dont really know how the ability works

and what things charge the meter

[tough torrent]

Dealing Olympian damage (so most things with colored damage numbers)

[odd bolt]

Blitz, scorch, hephaestus blasts

Wounds surprisingly enough

[tough torrent]

Even ares mini crits

[odd bolt]

Ares falling blades too

[granite minnow]

Hey guys, what arcana can you recommend for Shadow Torches on Aspect of Melinoi?

[dry jay]

Anubis has gotta be my favorite aspect
Only with it have I done a deathless run through the surface

I no longer need to rely on death defy

[odd bolt]

https://h2crossroads.pages.dev/ArcanaDeck/?deck=WyJjMSIsImM2IiwiYzciLCJjMTEiLCJjMTMiLCJjMTQiLCJjMTUiLCJjMTYiLCJjMTciLCJjMjEiLCJjMjIiLCJjMjMiXQ==

that is assuming youre not running fates whim, you can switch strength for death as well if you prefer

[granite minnow]

Thx🙌

[dire flare]

Which aspects do folks like putting hestia/apollo/heph on? I wanna do a nutty slow cooker run. I'm also torn on the 4th god, poseidon has a nice duo with heph, hera is usually good, is anyone a standout?

[opal pecan]

Coat is pretty nutty with Slow Cooker, as well as with Poseidon :)

Could do something like Pos attack/Hestia special/Apollo cast/Heph rush if you want to specifically open up Seismic Servo

[dire flare]

I will try this, tyvm!

[digital juniper]

for a big slow cooker, fast hitting aspects will benefit more. Coat or Hel would be really nice with it

[tall notch]

Actually, hear me out

Moros

Both the attack and the special benefit from slow cooker and you benefit from all these 3 gods

[opal pecan]

Sayin that like coat doesn't benefit on both too? :P

[tall notch]

Yeah because I wanna plug a more unusual choice

[opal pecan]

But also Anubis maybe (where I'd maybe say Hestia attack/Heph special/Pos cast/Apollo sprint)

[digital juniper]

oh yeah slow cooker should buff the attack explosions with all that extra %

[dire flare]

Moros is the aspect i first fell in love with and i just completed my first 32 fear run with it, so not unusual for me specifically 😅 I'll probably do coat and then moros

[opal pecan]

Oh sick, what a coincidence 😆

[tall notch]

4th god I'm tempted to say Ares, having both Heph and Apollo goes hard for a sword build

[umbral horizon]

slow cooker + trick knives and go brrr

[dire flare]

I'm still fairly new and there are a lot of builds i haven't had the chance to try, yet

[opal pecan]

Infinite builds ;D

[wild drift]

Infinite builds in this game yet I play blitz 80% of the time

One day I will join the Fates' Whim gang one day

[spiral wadi]

wtf why are we assuming aspect of selene

i got total eclipse in oceanus and wanted to get scorch godsent

[opal pecan]

LMAO

[digital juniper]

oh LMAO

[umbral horizon]

unlock jpom and you can try everything

[digital juniper]

i was like when did you reach Vyt levels of masochism

[spiral wadi]

but then talent chaos made me literally take like triple the time to charge it

so not worth

[dire flare]

I do about 50% of my runs with jpom and calling card

[opal pecan]

What if I argue that aspectless Selene seems less maso than aspect(gimmick)less Shiva

[digital juniper]

should’ve just hit that hex dress from arachne and kept it smh my head

[spiral wadi]

lmaoo

[digital juniper]

i mean i would’ve said sure but Vyt cleared 67 shiva gimmickless because its base attack is decent

[alpine raft]

shiva moveset is pretty good besides dash strike

[spiral wadi]

but yea i wish talent didn't affect hex charging like it's already ass enough to play with hexes, don't need another variable that makes it worse

[opal pecan]

Couldn't you just flip it around and say that Selene's base dash-strike is decent and its special can Shimmering

[spiral wadi]

surely patch 2 drops and they make it so reducing omega cost doesn't reduce hex charge

surely

[granite minnow]

Guys, do the Moros Aspect on the torches and Aphrodite's attack go together? Right when the explosion happens? I just can't figure it out.

[dire flare]

Ok I'm trying this first after all lol. I took hestia's keepsake and got offered apollo and heph before the hecate fight so we're off to a good start. Heph attack is already on 6sec cd as well

I'm trying to decide on my first apollo boon

He's offering epic extra dose and common cast and gain

[opal pecan]

Do you have Origination yet?

[dire flare]

No but i took extra dose anyways. It'll work itself out in oceanus

[alpine raft]

lots of attacks are better but its usable

[granite minnow]

For example? I've seen many people use Hera in attack, but I don't quite understand why.

[alpine raft]

hitch is really good. next bests are probably zeus, hestia, or apollo

[opal pecan]

Hitch is a good curse and also Hera damage cores come with pretty good %dmg bonuses

Also, are you using Origination?

[digital juniper]

add that to the bingo card

[spiral wadi]

u right

https://imgur.com/kf76dgV there we go

[alpine raft]

whats this about story softlock w hazard boom

[spiral wadi]

if u use hazard boom to end ur run before picking up entropy

ur completely locked out of surface cuz the game expects u to have entropy

and so u can't get the incantation to end chronos

[digital juniper]

if you defeat typhon and then kill yourself with hazard boom before picking up entropy you literally can’t progress the story

[spiral wadi]

it was never mentioned in any of the patch notes and i believe was discovered a bit after the most recent hotfix in like november

it's like no one playing casually will probably see this happen but it is still a thing anyway so

[dry lava]

Is there a good build for rupture ring with circle staff?

[tall notch]

For Moros I would've 100% clicked the gain

[spiral wadi]

ye, rapture gets really good crowd control value i like having hitch and either blitz or scorch on top of it

[wild drift]

Blitz on Special and Scorch on Attack for Thermal Dynamics Burning Desire (and Romantic Spark but that's overkill on not-Supay)

Was the build for one of my first surface clears

[spiral wadi]

nutty

[jolly aurora]

welp im gonna be back on the grind for the first time in a couple months

[fast prawn]

whats a good charon build?

giga cleaver i know

but idk others

[spiral wadi]

basically a lot of omega cast effects like prominence flare

[tough torrent]

Just like AQ o cast more or less yeah

Focus on casts like posiden and apollo

Heph isnt terrible either since the 3 blast all still happen even if you pop the circle early (at least they do with winner circle)

[fast prawn]

alr

[flint widget]

check my charon clear in victory boasting

[fast prawn]

ooo ok

yeah i got howling soul from jpom

[flint widget]

replace zeus with poseidon and get geyser spout snd ez

[fast prawn]

urgh my main reason for disliking charon is it just doesnt fit my playstyle thats why im trying to learn it

along with such an awful ephyra 😭

[flint widget]

u really dont want zeus hestia and aphro on charom tbh

thing with howling tho is

[tough torrent]

Zooz bad confirmed

[flint widget]

if u get giga cleaver you cant get double explosion

double explosion is basically get omega special in

and then spam cast

that allows you to get double omega cast explosions

[fast prawn]

holy christ i just ended cyclops with 1 hp

i hate medea so much

[flint widget]

it works if u dont have howling

do u dash while channeling omega special

[fast prawn]

i was poisoned too my attack hit like a milisecond before i wouldve died

[flint widget]

and do u have eternity on

[fast prawn]

i do not, ill try that

eternity?

these are my cards holup

[flint widget]

arcana

[fast prawn]

ion remember which eternity is

is it on?

[flint widget]

uh

yeah

[fast prawn]

hooray

ignore that i made my arcana into a sticker

[turbid karma]

your arcana setup is a sticker? 😭

[fast prawn]

it comes up more than you'd think

[flint widget]

turn off the two cards to the left of eternity tho

[fast prawn]

LISTEN I SCREENSHOTTED IT AND PUT IT INTO A RANDOM PRIVATE SERVER

[fast prawn]

oh hell no im keeping wayward son

[flint widget]

and then remove the nyx card

[fast prawn]

i love wayward son

[jolly aurora]

gods i need to get back into the groove

[flint widget]

ok remove hermes then

and then get boatman in

[fast prawn]

sur

boatman????

i get money so fast tho, esp with chrolex

i dont use fear unless i need nightmare so if ur thinking of debt

ive gotten the true ending, i just dont mess with fear that much (im only doing it this game for nightmare from prometheus and the surface clear statue from skele)

[flint widget]

dont underestimate free early game gold

[fast prawn]

anyways i gotta continue this run later, i gotta go do smth

thanks for the tips :D and ill try out boatman

[tough torrent]

Boatman is like having a free hit of chrolex at the start of the run

Which is handy cause that is when you dont have chrolex

[fast prawn]

i c

[turbid karma]

without debt it should let you buy two boons in the first region shops

[fast prawn]

when tf should i be purging with chrolex

i always purge upgraded boons that i dont need

[turbid karma]

R2!

oh hm- like miniboss boons?

[fast prawn]

yeah

since they purge for a lot extra

in general i just purge boons i dont need

i never purge magick hearts minor rewards (artificer) or hammers

just boons i dont need esp miniboss ones

well if i have like 400 magick then ill purge if im right near the end

[alpine raft]

usually you purge minors onions and magick if you dont need it in r2

[fast prawn]

ah i use artificer so i never purge those

also just seems not worth it when i can purge some other random unneeded boon for double the coins

onions is a good idea, ty for that

[tough torrent]

If im on FW I also purge poms

[alpine raft]

well hopefully you use all 3 in erebus

[fast prawn]

i c

[fast prawn]

oh yeah

sometimes i have like 1 more artificer left in oceanus but always gone very fast

[tough torrent]

And if I have hera/demeter on deck then I purge more aggressively too

Cause I might get cherished keepsake

And reset chrolex

[fast prawn]

honestly purging miniboss boons i dont need has been working great for me

[alpine raft]

how much money you need jeez

[fast prawn]

so ima just keep doing that

[tough torrent]

I need to buy everything from every shop

[fast prawn]

purging 4 minibosses and i can buy the nightmare / moondust and everything else in shop as long as i get a few coin rooms or troves

even 2 minibosses and 2 normal

[tough torrent]

purging miniboss boons sounds crazy no matter how you slice it to me

[turbid karma]

I can’t say it would be my preferred approach even on max debt but i guess if it works it works?

[alpine raft]

even on max debt you never need to purge a boon, minors are easily enough

[turbid karma]

the occasional chaos purge is very nice though

[drowsy basin]

Finally beat 20f with Charon axe. Thought it would be cool with big splashes everywhere but it was less dps vs bosses and a lot more stress dodging stuff after all and the run was a lot longer.

Maybe it was because I didn't have Hera on special (not on the successful run)

[final sedge]

Any tips on actually getting tall order to work?

[tough torrent]

just go for boons over anything else if you have a choice at doors

[final sedge]

8 of everything is crazy

[tough torrent]

8 of one thing

i made that mistake too

[final sedge]

ohmigosh... is that what it means?

[tough torrent]

it has or

if you see Hera's infusion first, you kind of get baited so i get it

[final sedge]

i got tricked by "or" again

[flint widget]

reading comprehension curse strikes again

[final sedge]

is it global buff?

[flint widget]

yes

similar to orig

[final sedge]

ok I have a new interest in seeing it work sometime

Is it just me or does it seem like Chaos boons aren't as good as they were in hades 1... or is it just that there are so many more options now they often don't feel good?

I used to love fishing for extra casts in hades 1, but not sure there is an equivalent for chaos in hades 2.

[tough torrent]

there's a lot mor options, and getting a bad negative can ruin a good positive

[final sedge]

the stun after you take damage is a killer for me

[tough torrent]

ok, well there's more options to compensate for the options that didnt translate i guess, lol

[final sedge]

also like 5 rooms without seeing the outcome is rough

[tough torrent]

one of these days i'm gonna be like

playing Coat or something, and then hit up chaos

and all three boons are gonna be "take 5 when you use Attack"

[tough torrent]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/268784286985879553/1474218210860470342/image.png?ex=69990c33&is=6997bab3&hm=047a2da0b582da5543b81b22b54c0852f8516fd259aeaa26e76a83b88eab5a9b

whoops

[spiral wadi]

dw blitz is this game's flagship mechanic

[tough torrent]

i was doing the destiny trial

so a pressed myself out of heinous affront

[spiral wadi]

D: doom

[keen bluff]

reroll

[tough torrent]

i did

jsut to see if it would ban it as well

its ok i had trick knvies and epic blood spree so i still won

[sly hazel]

I realize I’ve committed a grave sin for running Strength and fully leveled Death + Toula + Luckier Tooth

But also…it’s a bunch of of death defiances with one big hurrah at the end of my life

[white sun]

embrace being a pureblood and remove all those death defiances u dont need death defiances if u never intend to get hit + big numbers makes me happy

[sly hazel]

Never! I’m too bad at not getting hit for that!

[mystic mango]

Honestly you’d probably get more worth out of going Frinos for the extra health or Gale for the damage reduction. Toula at max level is an extra DD with 101 healing but having more health or negating damage will make you less likely to need the death defiances to begin with

Frinos at max level gets you up to 110 health without any centaur hearts which makes early game pretty easy

And also any health you have is more healing you receive from food and wells

Toula’s value is pretty low over the course of a full run, in my opinion, besides occasionally helping for room clear

[narrow acorn]

man i had a good run going for me. Heroic heph cast with cherished heirloom white antler, rallying cry, tall order, extended family, local climate, meat grinder, and uncommon grace.

... and I lost it all to a poorly timed dodge. So sad

[mystic mango]

Dayum that’s a lot of blast buffs

Did you have curses for origination too?

[narrow acorn]

yeah i KNOW i'm really salty that I let myself slip up like that

I had origination and strength. But halfway through the run I realized I had forgotten to make sure lovers was active

[mystic mango]

Meaty blasts

Hera is great with heph aside from the fact the duo is mediocre on most aspects

But the inherent damage buffs are great

[narrow acorn]

My only defense going into typhon was one gale block, a circe-boosted gale dodge change, and blood spree.

[mystic mango]

How many times have you beaten Typhon?

[narrow acorn]

So white antler was probably not a good choice, but man I couldn't pass it up when I had everything else going on too.

[mystic mango]

Ah right wantler

Forgot you said that never mind

[sly hazel]

Maybe I should switch up my build since I’m in the late game, post epilogue

[mystic mango]

I was wondering if you weren’t used to him yet but playing wantler tells me you’re not new lol

[narrow acorn]

yeah ive beaten typhon a couple hundred times now, I default frenzy 2 rivals 4.

[mystic mango]

Start just running strength alone

[narrow acorn]

I am good enough to regularly beat ~34ish fear but not good enough to regularly beat 40+

[mystic mango]

It’s a lot more mileage than DD

[mystic mango]

Yeah I regularly run 40 fear right now but I am not used to rivals 4 yet

[narrow acorn]

Rivals 3 and 4 are pretty rough on the surface tbh so that's understandable.

[narrow acorn]

its funny this was basically my ability cap in Hades I as well.

[wild drift]

Honestly the main roadblock for me on surface 40+ fear is time

[narrow acorn]

I almost never play 5 minute timer tbh. I'd rather stick with 7 to give myself breathing room and take a different fear to make up the difference.

[wild drift]

With Medea I take too much damage but timer is decent, with Mel Staff I can mitigate damage better but the timer is bad

[narrow acorn]

Actually I suppose it depends on the aspect. mel toch, medea, and circe staff I can usually beat just fine with 5 min timer

[narrow acorn]

I forgot to mention this was all with circe staff and winners circle so I had constant double hammers

So, even more reason to be salty about the loss

[mystic mango]

I find surface 3 easier than underworld 3 for Hecate and Scylla alone

And rivals typhon is way easier than chronos cause the third phase is just a skill check rather than a real fight

Rivals chronos scares me

[narrow acorn]

rivals chronos is extremely tough especially if you don't have a decent long range option

[mystic mango]

He can’t just be avoided by standing close to him like normal Chronos

Since normal chronos you just have to stand in his face and always dodge to his right and he can never hit you

That was what made me struggle with normal chronos early on was not realizing most of his attacks are long ranged and you can just hug him for safety

Typhon is kinda the same way but you have to dodge the chin attack

Rivals typhon is just normal typhon with a stage hazard, no knockdown phase, a slightly harder to avoid attack, and a skill check to make sure if you still have your brain turned on

[surreal hazel]

The rush combo in phase 3 is a hell pf a wakeup call when first learning him

[tough torrent]

I be giving grandpa second ideas about revolting the way I beat the story, turned on r4 and now die to his force ghosts 9 out of 10 times

Almost always in p3

But sometimes I just stub my toe on an instakill by accident in 2

[drowsy basin]

What would be the best setup for a no boon run?

[wild drift]

Maybe Morrigan because it has the flat 777

[drowsy basin]

I was thinking that too, with Unseen arcana for permanent mana regen.

[wild drift]

Mel Staff, Mel Axe, Medea all have built-in damage boosts too, would probably have to get lucky with hammers though

[drowsy basin]

Do hammers count as boons?

[mystic mango]

Try getting the Hermes boom that gives dodge chance and see if grabbing a hammer counts

If not then it’s not a boon

But for real purposes no it shouldn’t be counted as a boon

[surreal hazel]

No. They are not boons

Boons come from gods alone

[drowsy basin]

Ok so no Selene too?
I assume Circé or Medea helping is ok?

[surreal hazel]

Selene is a titan

So only artemis, athena, hades and dio npcs give boons

Hades being the weird exception in that he gives boons that aren't olympian boons

[drowsy basin]

So a run with Selene coat would be possible. But I guess I'll go with Morrigan

[surreal hazel]

Danaid dagger is your friend

[umbral horizon]

I think Medea

Only normal attack and special and dont need magic regen

[drowsy basin]

I'll try that too!

[frank siren]

I did it with mel staff. If you absolutely cannot avoid a boon, you can purge it at the purging pool. At the end, chronos only cares if you get to him with no boons. I made it so that echo gave me a third hammer in the fields so that is probably the best bang for your buck

chrolex also helps so you can just turn boons into money

[opal pecan]

Well, he's not an Olympian :P

[surreal hazel]

but he is the only boon giver who isn't

[opal pecan]

Nepotism is inescapable 😔

[tough torrent]

Archaic seal danaid dagger my beloved

[grave parrot]

how should i build aspect of anubis it feels kinda weird compared to like every other weapon . .

[austere trail]

scorch/waves/blitz on atk and %dmg on special

gameplay usually goes like: dash strike -> special/omega special

drop casts as much as you can (goes without saying)

[keen bluff]

Zeus attack probably and just get a nice curse and pct on special

[austere trail]

you can get kinda slick with it by dashing away from an enemy you're close to and then dropping an omega attack down

try it out with skelly

[keen bluff]

Are the shade hammers good for Anubis?

[austere trail]

yea I quite like them, but shimmering/rapid moonshot is still a very good choice to prioritise

[runic crescent]

Anyone have any tips for someone wanting to get into speedrunning the game?

[tough torrent]

Get used to frenzy 2

Get used to pausing the game when you make decisions

Mainly door choices

Always pick rooms that are free (pause the timer) including shops even when you have not enough money

Except hades in tart

For more specific stuff than that I would ask someone who actually speedruns

[runic crescent]

I watched a couple and I did notice they pause a lot

[tough torrent]

I think fig leaf and Gorgon amulet are important but idr why

[runic crescent]

fig is bc it gives u a free room

gorgon is prob because if ur running 0 death defiance u basically get her to show up guaranteed

and she makes the room she shows up in a free room

[digital juniper]

gorgon amulet is primarily used in fields because while athena is on the screen, she pauses timer

so you can light up the tree if you haven’t already, look where all the rewards and the exit are, and pick up any minor rewards

[tough torrent]

interesting

wait she pauses even before you talk to her? never noticed lol

[digital juniper]

yep! and timer stays paused for a few seconds after you pick up her boon

the time that she does her fly away animation and stuff

[tough torrent]

oh dont you always wanna take chaos gates too, unless they're against a free room

not sure

[digital juniper]

absolutely

[tough torrent]

im just saying things that help with playing on timer 3

[vernal quiver]

speedrunning is basically just every mid shop, npc, chaos, miniboss is an auto take

you can do jpom but then your at the whims of luck even more than youd normally be so if you wanna just finish runs you do rerolls

[tough torrent]

oh yeah, you take shadow vow too

for the uhhhhhi forget the name but the miniboss in erebus that makes the screen dark

[vernal quiver]

yeah its exclusivley for the shadow spiller

[digital juniper]

@runic crescent

https://mobalytics.gg/hades-2/guides/how-to-speedrun

https://youtu.be/hMmholFSJoc

should cover all you need for now

[tough torrent]

yeah that thing

[opal pecan]

Well, not every Chaos

[runic crescent]

Yall are givin me great info I really appreciate it

[opal pecan]

Only if there isn't a better skip room right in front of ya

[vernal quiver]

yeah if its next to an npc or shop take those instead

[tough torrent]

i said that

[opal pecan]

And in Fields and Tartarus it doesn't skip at all

[tough torrent]

i am just regurgitating stuff i read here

oh that i didnt know

[vernal quiver]

can you even get chaos in fields >->

[opal pecan]

Not naturally but you can get Ixion

[vernal quiver]

i dont think ive seen a single gate there ever

[tough torrent]

in the first room where the time is paused

[opal pecan]

You do get Wells of Charon occasionally, in addition to the well in the pre-region room

[tough torrent]

yeah if you buy gate

[opal pecan]

The reasoning for buying Ixion in/just-before Fields is 1) some arcane BS about RNG and 2) in case Fields gives you a three-reward room to start, and you want to take the Chaos to essentially reroll the Fields room that you actually have to fight

[tough torrent]

i wonder what the triple reward doors look like in chaos realm 💀

[opal pecan]

(AKA "pls give me a normal two reward room to start omg")

[tough torrent]

or it just shows one reward doesnt it

[tough torrent]

simply get an easy sprint speed boon to make up your time

[tough torrent]

weird run rn where im some time unironically using o spec to trigger morrigan triads

[frank siren]

Its one where chaos is in like, a middle platform that you have to dash to and there are three choices on an L shape

[digital juniper]

yeah and those are always minor rewards right?

[narrow acorn]

Does aspect of Charon omega special trigger the Apollo/Zeus duo?

[alpine raft]

nope

[narrow acorn]

Darn. Ah well

[mystic mango]

Yeah since it’s an extra stage-2 charge

It only activates any normal omega effects

[frank siren]

No they can be shops or npcs too

[mystic mango]

Yeah you also don’t get the secondary effects from the incantation for stuff bought at shops

Not counting buying nectar from Hermes since that drops the physical reward

It can be purged but IDK if that nectar can be artificer’d though

But should still give the Pom slice effect

[umbral horizon]

So how about hostile enviroment?

[mystic mango]

I mean I’d imagine it should since it just buffs the omega cast damage, right?

[umbral horizon]

Zeus/Apollo duo boon text is "you can channel". So we dont need to fully charge, do we?

[mystic mango]

You don’t have if you don’t want to but you have to charge it if you want the effect but Charon won’t activate it

But hostile environment I’m pretty sure it would continue following you while charging then drop wherever the explosion is

[odd bolt]

To get the effect you need to

it's a really "meh" duo at best

Works great with air quality I guess

[umbral horizon]

So we just waste magic if do not fully charge?

[odd bolt]

I believe you still get a regular ocast??

Not sure I've used it like twice

[alpine raft]

after you charge a normal ocast you can then charge again for the duo

[umbral horizon]

I am confused about it and Giga Moonburst, so if I release it before the full charge, does it buff any effect or not?

[alpine raft]

giga works the same, you can release after normal channel time to do normal ospecial

both just add optional extra channeling for their use

[spark crown]

https://tenor.com/view/yearning-yearn-looking-out-over-sea-mood-ocean-gif-12656616320013018256

[split igloo]

having done a few clears, mirrored builds are the most overtuned on the staff, stack all the +damage buffs (snuffed candle, cardio gain + incandescent aura etc) and it gets silly by Typhon

[median anvil]

dual moonshot can also get silly

[wild drift]

Yeah even with boons at common level 1, Zeus dash-strike into Hera dual special gives you 30 + 80 + 2(80*1.6) = 366 damage, at epic level 1 that's 478

[drowsy basin]

GG
I did it yesterday with morrigan. Managed to get non avoidable boons on cast so I don't use them by mistake and purged 2 in total. I'm not a skilled olayer but did it first try

[tough torrent]

Gorgon amulet kills whim, right?

[median anvil]

yes

[tough torrent]

hmm

is it worth losing 3 ranks on every boon to swap because i'm out of DDs lol

[keen bluff]

if you alr have your build then yeah

[mystic mango]

You keep the ranks

[keen bluff]

renewed faith is like a 50% chance w 0 rerolls iirc

[tough torrent]

o

[mystic mango]

You lose the hades boon though

[tough torrent]

darn i should have definitely done that

[mystic mango]

Yeah it’s a decent last-ditch effort especially if you have something like life tax that you’ve already fully exhausted

[tough torrent]

i have a 40% last gasp so

[mystic mango]

Would be goated with heph blasts

[tough torrent]

i got kind of shafted because im in the middle of the echo/narc quest so echo was not in her room lol

do overlapping circe staff casts stack burn with hestia cast

i kind remember, like, so casts do stack and some dont

[mystic mango]

Yes thats something they fixed in the post-release patch

Tidal ring doesn’t stack though if they happen at the same time

Or sword ring

[median anvil]

<@&456908176877551658> give him all the prerequisites for king tide in erebus but make sure he never gets poseidon again for the rest of the run

[indigo walrus]

Always a new sentence every time with you guys. I love it.

[surreal hazel]

Make all his endshop boons be shocking loss, steady growth, plentiful forage, reckless abandon and cherished heirloom

[flint widget]

whys cherished there

[opal pecan]

Cherished in endshop is great for Lion Fang :P

[surreal hazel]

Well okay. Just trying to think of boons that you love early game

There we go, sea star and buried treasure

[opal pecan]

Sea Star is very funny

as an endshop boon 😂

[mystic mango]

Steady growth

[warm quiver]

Apollo legendary boon plus aspect of Thanatos is so stupid

chaos put me on that and now I can't get off

[mystic mango]

"Call this build "The Matrix". Cause I'm in this B, and I can't get out"

[tough torrent]

uhhhhhhh

i got polymorphed but somehow killed all the witches instantly

so now i am morphed while hec is active

also does supay buff gigaros dash??? lol

[shrewd fjord]

510 mana on aspect of supay

holy spam this build is putting stuff everywhere

i spent maybe a minute on prometheus

[tough torrent]

oh i have light smite that makes sense

[shrewd fjord]

about to go into typhon with 640 mana with crazy regen

[digital juniper]

it doesn’t

[tough torrent]

i sure love me origination depending on Zooz special and light smite

its so great

[austere trail]

gigaros dash used to "buff" supay with its hitstun but it no longer has that

[tough torrent]

my giga dash was doing more than 40 for some reason but now its back so idk

[surreal hazel]

Supay doesn't get to enjoy hitstun basically ever

[tough torrent]

i got froth and daze dash woo, all you gotta do is open discord and complain this game is so easy

[digital juniper]

affected by globals no? strength furies orig etc

[tough torrent]

oh ig

i reached chronos p3 without losing a dd the entire run :0

i only lost 1 dd in p3

blitz damage isn't affect by, like... Like if i've got Zooz spec and a chaos boon for +55% spec damage that doesnt do anything for blitz right?

[digital juniper]

yeah it doesn’t affect it

[mystic mango]

It’s considered a “god effect”

so only affected by global buffs or stuff that specifically states god effects like extended family or rallying cry

So obviously having something like weed killer and blitz attack wouldn’t apply to the blitz

[tough torrent]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/268784286985879553/1474922602383540275/image.png?ex=699b9c37&is=699a4ab7&hm=670231ac2df949ba5f4c2fec0177df99bc784d0384ea0f4cdf65e257ce3f1e5f

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

i sure do just have 3k gold and am not buying anything else at the end shop

[mystic mango]

“Oh right, I’m just rich and can pay for healthcare”

[tough torrent]

i might be getting somewhere. I beat three 32f with rivals 4 on today after being stuck on it for like a week

[spark crown]

time to run 32f

[tough torrent]

once i get 32 on all weapons i might drop some of the heat to see if i can get a single digit time

even 9 i'd be cool with tbh 💀

[spark crown]

9.99

[tough torrent]

just wanna beat my friend who's got at 10 minute time

[spark crown]

(9.59 but still)

[tough torrent]

i think rn my best time is like 14 something, but that was with rivals 4 on

and without shadow

[frank siren]

You'd be surprised... if you do just frenzy 2 and only take optimal rooms, you'll have a hard time getting over 9 minutes

[tough torrent]

Perhaps

[spark crown]

Whats the best charon cast

[flint widget]

tidal or arctic

[spark crown]

i accidently too leathal snare over viatal strike T_T

[umbral horizon]

Pay to win bro

[split igloo]

best boons for the axe? wounds?

[median anvil]

apollo or hera attack

if playing charon, on special

[split igloo]

thanatos

[median anvil]

apollo or hera attack then

[split igloo]

and the special?

[median anvil]

you won't be using it a lot, whatever is fine

[split igloo]

huh, the charged special is crazy, esp if you get the hammer that makes it hit twice

I use it all the time

[median anvil]

oh a fellow thanatos ospecial enjoyer

[split igloo]

lmao

[median anvil]

yeah then same, apollo or hera on special works great

[split igloo]

alright, thanks

[tough torrent]

o spec is good for range

so i end up using it a lot because when i get close to enemies i take damage usually x)

[split igloo]

axe has good range on its attacks, so you don't need to be too close, but the special is really great for nuking a whole group, so satisfying

[tough torrent]

In chronos p2 you can o spec to hit him during the stand in this circle attack

Is the main one that jumps out at me

I like wound on it tbh

Since I use it infrequently enough that it generally gets the wound boost

[spark crown]

reached rivals typhoon on 32f charon T_T

had no cast boons T_T

wait no that was the morrigan run i made it to room before typhoon without cast boon on charon

wait im wrong again i took zag in olympus

Thessaly*******

im too tired for ts

https://imgur.com/aOrO3Po https://imgur.com/mqsfTlj

[white sun]

is nergal just horrible

or am i using it wrong

im tryna use nergal to get a feel for it on 24 fear but it just doesnt seem to do anything

[opal pecan]

Have you max ranked it? It's quite bad when unleveled.

[white sun]

its rank 3 as of now

i thought to get a feel for it before i put all my nightmare into it cause its lowk a hassle

[opal pecan]

Max rank it, but also, note that it will benefit more from a Strength oriented arcana setup

You'll get plenty of nightmare, no worries

[naive grove]

Which is best build for aspect of pershephone?

[wild drift]

I've never used it but it sounds like Hephaestus would be funny with the free poms

[naive grove]

Ye I tired got bored with that

So looking to try some other build

[spark crown]

its heph zeus posidion hera iirc

[white sun]

i usually use heph on attack hestia on cast hera on special

[umbral horizon]

How does Apollo lego work on skull? Fire 2 skull?

[prisma gust]

I'm pretty sure it's just one skull hits twice

Aaanyways I'm really starting to like Morrigan

[surreal hazel]

Fires two. Only the first spawns ammo

0.2 second delay, as is standard

[umbral horizon]

is it the same with ospecial?

[surreal hazel]

Basically. Each projectile it spawns gets another spawn 0.2 seconds later from the same spot and direction, works as you'd expect with twisting crash if you have it

[split igloo]

is the Messenger arcana worth using?? the description is kinda vague, I'm not sure what it does specifically

[alpine raft]

you can time your cast to be a mini-dash. learning to use it is pretty rewarding but otherwise its usually on just bc it's one grasp

[split igloo]

yeah I guess not sure what else I can put on to pad out a 30 grasp build

I guess the speed boost you get from Messenger is more meaningful than the handful of i-frames it gives

but this reminds me, how does Messenger work with ranged casts like Howling Soul?

[stable herald]

It activates when you launch your cast, after aiming it. So the timing isn't as instantaneous

I'm ride or die for Messenger, being able to dodge an attack and drop your cast at the same time is amazing. But I'm also ride or die for Winner's Circle

[vernal quiver]

Youd be surprised the iframes can save you in a lot of risky positions

And in certain fights at high fear learning how to abuse those frames is super valuable

[split igloo]

how does Air Quality work? does it boost the curses that deal a little damage multiple times per second? could be OP if it does

[opal pecan]

It doesn't boost Scorch

(and Scorch is the only Curse ™ that does damage multiple times a second. there are lots of other non-curse boons/effects though, and they do get boosted by AQ)

[vernal quiver]

air quality specifically is at the end of damage calculation, so after orig, furies, and other modifiers it checks to see if its under 50

so normally it ends up doing nothing 99% of the time, and like escalier said scorch is unaffected

[split igloo]

hmm, what about gust, shock etc

[opal pecan]

Shock isn't a curse in H2

But good point about Gust!

AQ is very good with Gust.

[split igloo]

yeah but it procs many times per second, so I figured it would be strong with air quality?

[opal pecan]

Yes, but I was only talking about Curses ™ , so I didn't mention it :P

[vernal quiver]

generally AQ is at its best with ares blades and demeter gusts

otherwise it kinda does nothing

[split igloo]

idk, could be strong on a mirrored thrasher Zeus build

[vernal quiver]

not really, jpom static shock already does 25 base

[split igloo]

what's jpom

[opal pecan]

Endgame keepsake.

[vernal quiver]

jeweled pom, post credits keepsake

[opal pecan]

This channel is all spoilers allowed, btw

[vernal quiver]

but with that 25 base from jpom you add orig strength and furies and youre already at 50 with no other modifiers

[split igloo]

air quality base damage is 50, so isn't this a 200% boost?

[vernal quiver]

AQ is after everything else

[opal pecan]

Yah but when you add the other bonuses, it's gonna be more than 25 damage already

Especially/even more so if you get one or more boons that specifically boost SS

[split igloo]

well I don't have the post-ending keepsakes yet, so it could be useful for me, I'll try it if it drops again

[vernal quiver]

so like static shock as the example, 25 base damage, 100% bonus(orig, furies, strength), so 50, then the game checks to see if its under AQ

AQ works with ares blades and demeter justs since they have such a low base that even with all the mods it doesnt reach the 50 minimum

[split igloo]

oh yeah, is AQ after literally everything else, that is strength/origination/huntress?

[opal pecan]

^

[split igloo]

then I guess it's meh outside of gust

[opal pecan]

It's also quite good with Prominence Flare!

And apparently, heh, with Hel if you put an on-hit on your strike boon lmao

[vernal quiver]

eh pos waves and static break AQ pretty fast, itd only really be nice for the bullet itself which isnt your main damage anyway

and i think with everything up your bullet still gets close to breaking AQ so the increase isnt too substantial

[opal pecan]

Yes, I am specifically talking about the base attack itself

Ditto Supay iirc? idr which one of them is lower base damage

[vernal quiver]

supay its a monster from what ive heard yeah

[vernal quiver]

maybe im just slow assuming its 10 base huntress, orig, strength, furies you still only hit like 25 so its still a 2x

hard to build towards with the air element at high fear ofc

[opal pecan]

Alr I booted up the game to check with all arcana disabled and Hel is 20 per whack while Supay does 10 and 15

Damn, Supay

[digital juniper]

supay moment

[shrewd fjord]

i loooooooooooooooooove supay omfg

the spam

its so peak

[prisma gust]

I had the ultimate Heph build

Volcanin strike+flourish
Grand Caldera
Rude Awakening
Chain Reaction
Seismic Servo

[umbral horizon]

I always run out of time in the first region with Supay. Do u guys have any tips?

[tough torrent]

make sure you have a gain of some kind so you can spam channels in the boss

zooz/hera spec, hesta/posiden attack sort of stuff

[umbral horizon]

It's really suck in Ephyra when I run out of magic and take too long to break Pylon

[vernal quiver]

get luckier

the weapon has such a rough start its hard to give tips that arent just the the build faster

gigaros, toula, early gain are all small things that can help but its just hard to get off the ground as is

[frank siren]

The guide will be updated after some more testing but the rooms in ephyra have different sizes and wave lengths. Easy rule of thumb is never take any on the back wall except the top right corner and all the ones in the front are usually really fast.

Id also do 3 underworld runs to guarantee medea if youre doing surface

Supay does struggle with pylons... howling soul would be unironically really good as a jpom start since you can break pylons with one cast

[tough torrent]

you just have to make sure to do it during the fight while your special is twirling

this run is a shining example i love morrigan. Beat Eris, but the only attack i've been offered is demeter attack (after having ring already)....

but who cares if i'm missing an attack boon, triad does the thing anyhow

[wild drift]

My Supay playstyle is "reset if I don't get Romantic Spark before first boss"

[mellow totem]

what is clanger

how get it

[alpine raft]

wdym

[opal pecan]

Think they're asking about the Fangs perk, for the prophecy

[wild drift]

Clanger is impervious until you kill every other enemy in the wave

Getting Clanger + Bigger Anchor is disgusting

[opal pecan]

I had a Clanger-something punchy guy in Fields once, hated that

[mellow totem]

i just happened to never get clanger despite playing like a billion vow of fangs runs

got it now!!! (hooray!)

[split igloo]

strength + moon water is an OP combo, virtually impossible to lose

you get 6-7 estus style flasks that heal for 45-55 hp. and they refresh at fountains, that's 300-350 hp, and the strength arcana basically doubles it, you can tank everything

this game needs a balance patch

[viscid zephyr]

Nah its a game thats supposed to be beaten. Its supposed to get easier through upgrades like arcana and aspects until 0 fear becomes a reliableish victory for even those struggling

[spark crown]

clanger summit enemys are evil

rolling them in olympus sucks

[wild drift]

Can't remember, do they get bound by casts still?

[spark crown]

i dont think so

its the same effect as boss phases

[wild drift]

Yeah just imagining a Clanger Bruiser/Swifter Horror in Olympus while you're surrounded by Auto-Forcers just makes me want to never play surface again lol

[median anvil]

i think clanger and swifter can't be together

clanger and spiller are incompatible with a bunch of other perks

[wild drift]

Oh yeah I guess the wiki article for it is outdated like a bunch of others

[spiral wadi]

i wish impervious and swifter were incompatible

[digital juniper]

TIL it’s called swifter

[spiral wadi]

potion of swiftness from minecraft

[spark crown]

Thinking of smashing out some 32f

first run..... howling soul charon T_T

f it im making it work

is solar ring good on charon

im assuming so?

10s rivals poly clear

[wild drift]

No idea but at least Apollo gives you Lucid Gain and Super Nova and Prom Flare

[spark crown]

in 3 boons he gave me prom flare and thats it T_T

aint no way rivals eris just 4 killed me T_T

im mad

ngl

https://imgur.com/qBN3fCk

https://imgur.com/6AEqYaz

[tall notch]

Your stats window is glitching out I think

[spark crown]

how so

[tall notch]

I don't see the 60

[spark crown]

#h2-builds-and-combat message

im not doing 60f as im already burnt the hell out from school

who tf made resturant plates wheigh 1kg each without food

[tall notch]

What're they making these plates out of?

[spark crown]

and why tf is it etiqute to only carry them in the left hand

[spark crown]

basic ceramic T_T

anyway night build chat im sleeping nice and early as i have classes at the crack of dawn

[tough torrent]

Yesterday I had impervious and the vacuum one together I think

[wild drift]

And I've definitely seen Clanger + Swifter (in fact I just saw one in a Haelian video)

[tough torrent]

The vacuum and the immune for a few seconds or something are the two worst by a lot for me

[wild drift]

The Clanger is impervious until you kill everything else that spawned alongside it

[tough torrent]

O

Wow I hate it

[wild drift]

How does Gift Gift Gift work with Metallic Droplet?

[surreal hazel]

you get like, 200secs of a copy of metallic droplet in the next zone

[umbral horizon]

also wantler?

[median anvil]

you get 20% crit chance but limited to 30 max hp for tartarus

[umbral horizon]

Oh does it work? 2 regions using wantler?

[median anvil]

yeah but why would you do that though

timer and damage thresholds are never a problem in fields

you're better off having the whole 30% crit chance for tartarus

[split fog]

ive got a question - who is the best god for torches? cuz as ive been attempting to get a nigthmare from prometheus in a torches run, ive been experimenting with builds, but usually i rely on hera poseidon or zeus

[surreal hazel]

Strong choices

But honestly they're pretty freeform on attack, special loves hitch and blitz though

[split fog]

last run, i managed to get froth from poseidon and also the steam duo boon, and i put hestia in specials still during ephyra... i think i had poseidon for cast, hera for attack and running + zeus for moves and hesita for specials

[surreal hazel]

You can absolutely make that work

I think you might be looking at the wrong place for your troubles with prometheus, you might be legit having skill issues with that fight

No build will save you from that

[split fog]

yeeee, i know, and thats fine... tho its less that im a noob, and more that it takes me a while to get adujested and actually learn how to beat each regions

[surreal hazel]

And that's the intended experience

[split fog]

with underworld, i simpply git gooder and now i can easily finish runs and defeat chronos

[surreal hazel]

You are enjoying and feeling the game out like the professionals fun-designers wanted you to

[split fog]

i just need to overcome typhon for the first time, and then things will get much easier from that point on

[tough torrent]

all of my best torch runs have started with zooz special and literally any other curse on the attack

[odd bolt]

imo Hera is the best one

but ofc not mandatory, plenty of other choices can work

[vernal quiver]

Hera special zeus attack and everything turns green and dies

[wild drift]

Does Reckless Abandon override Wicked Thrasher?

It seems so since I see 555 and not 585 lol

[surreal hazel]

it's pure damage, it overrides everything

the only thing that can change the damage numbers at the end is Air Quality

if your conclusion to reading this is "wow, doesn't that make Reckless Abandon utterly terrible?" then yes. Yes it is.

[wild drift]

Yeah I knew it was awful but for some reason my mind tricked me into believing it would interact differently with the hammer (probably becuase I got the hammer after lol), luckily it was on Circe so the attack didn't matter

Other options were Drunken Stupor (not using Omegas) and Bounce Back (Scars 3)

[surreal hazel]

bounce back is still okay on scars 3, I guess

drunken stupor is fine on staff as they're pretty quick

[wild drift]

Bounce Back does 0 healing at Scars 3 (it was actually what I was hoping for until I saw it didn't go through Scars), Drunken Stupor is fine yeah but I ended with 0 max magick to Hubris so yeah

[surreal hazel]

wait I thought it was scars 4 that was 0 healing, derp

well, you live you learn

[broken spoke]

Do something hurtful and 2 do nothing

Classic dio

[wild drift]

I get the confusion cause Scars 3 gives 4 fear (1+1+2)

[surreal hazel]

yeah, that's probably it

[tawdry geyser]

Anyone think pom keepsake is a bit op?

[surreal hazel]

oh totally

[tawdry geyser]

Makes the game so much easier than trying to get a specific build

And as if having lvl4 boons on all your damage sources wasn't enough, you also free up 7 arcana points

[wild drift]

Yeah FW was what let me enjoy some omega-using aspects like Morrigan since it let me have Sorceress and Eternity (also helps that Morrigan doesn't really have a "dream" build setup because of some good hammers and of course its flat 777)

Gonna try it with Anubis too

[surreal hazel]

you will lose out on getting as many duos since you have no Queen or Rerolls but eh

[tawdry geyser]

Duos don't matter enough, you still get them a decent amount of times without queen

[wild drift]

Yeah I like having rerolls more especially on Scars 3 to be able to roll for Athena's Renewed Faith

[tawdry geyser]

You can get unlucky with bad rng on the early poms but if that's the case then you know pretty early in the run that you're doomed

Maybe if I had a deeper understanding of the poms I'd find rerolls more useful.

I prefer having build control but my win rate is so much higher with fw

[surreal hazel]

Quite, you get them enough.

[surreal hazel]

Levelling is defined per boon and follows various different scaling laws, rules and caps

It's.... honestly a bit of a mess, some boons basically don't improve much at all, some boons scale harder from poms than even rarity

[wild drift]

Yeah I feel like in H1 it was a lot more straightforward how much you would want to keep pomming each type of boon

[surreal hazel]

Some scale amazingly on the first couple and nosedive afterwards, others It's more linear

[wild drift]

Here there's so much more variety

[surreal hazel]

But suffice to say, when you're running jpom, the individual poms you get as room rewards or in the shop are all but dead draws

[wild drift]

And since you're probably running Artificer and using Chrolex you're getting to transform nectars and selling poms

[tawdry geyser]

Yeah it's more that past the core boons I'm not super familiar with what each God offers at tier 2 to know ideal god pools of the top of my head

[surreal hazel]

Hereditary Bane and Pyro Technique spring to mind

[tawdry geyser]

Yeah definitely

Re: scaling it seems like flat damage scales better

[surreal hazel]

The former scales a linear 10% per pom (but only 5% per rarity), the latter scales like crazy to start with but tails off after a few poms

[surreal hazel]

Fun fact, Heaven Strike flattens off at +15 power for the third and subsequent pom, but heaven flourish only does +10

[tawdry geyser]

% boons not much point beyond lvl2 or 3

[surreal hazel]

Wave Strike and Flourish are a fixed +5 per level or rarity

Rapture Ring has the exact same values as Herditary Bane

[tawdry geyser]

Blitz is a bit crazy huh

Storm ring also seems a bit too good

[surreal hazel]

Blitz do be crazy

Storm ring also is a flat +5 per level and the only bad thing you can say about it is the lack of a curse

Zeus' strike/flourish/ring boons are kinda ridiculous, his other two cores are comically weak

[wild drift]

If Ionic Gain didn't need you to interact with it it'd be way better

[tawdry geyser]

Zeus so good cos all his other boons boost his core boons

I think ionic is ok tbh

[surreal hazel]

Yeah, Zeus starts out super strong and then builds on it

Ionic is overshadowed by much better choices, but it's not unusable

[tawdry geyser]

Ye

[surreal hazel]

doesn't actively fight against the Huntress, so that's nice

[tawdry geyser]

And it's good if you have a no-omega build and want to keep Artemis arcana active

Yeah

[surreal hazel]

but given that you want to spread your core slots around as many different gods as you can usually, do you really want to be wasting a core boon on Ionic Gain?

[tawdry geyser]

Just to fill the slot

To improve rng elsewhere

But it does totally refill your mana so not terrible

Just introduces an extra minigame

[surreal hazel]

Gain Boons generally suffer a bit from being a core boon that doesn't build onto that god's tier 2, and ionic gain definitely has that problem

A zeus boon that doesn't cause lightning strikes or chain lightning? What even is the point?

tbf there's like, only two gain boons that do actually step you up to the T2 functions other than just legendary prereqs

Grisly and Glamour Gain

[tawdry geyser]

Agreed for sure, I've just found that I'm usually in a much stronger position by then. If you're down to 0 DD when switching keepsakes you're already in trouble

[surreal hazel]

and to no-one's surprise, they're below average for actual mana recovery

I guess you could be pedantic and say Flood Gain opens the door to Seismic Servo, and flood gain is very good

[tawdry geyser]

I like glamour for weak on closer range weapons yeah

I always feel like I'll regret it if I'm on aphro and don't get a weak boon

[surreal hazel]

glamour gain is kinda nutty for how good it is for things other than mana recovery, it even causes problems for the huntress

but an aura of -30% damage around you at all times?

in a world where Brave Face has you paying mana for that?

Yeah, it's pretty good, and it's cool how Aphrodite's boons all kinda build on the same idea in different ways

She wants you to get up close and personal

her hearthrobs need you to get close, her cast pulls them in, passion rush wants you do dance around them up close, glamour gain makes being close safer, flutter boons only work when up close

Ignoring the fact that she's a generally lower tier god, I love the design consistency in her boons

[tawdry geyser]

Huh I didn't expect that she's low tier, I feel like her Demeter and Apollo are pretty solid

Poseidon and Ares seem weaker

Zeus and hera very strong

[surreal hazel]

Low tier only really matters in extreme fear/speedrun scenarios where you're pushing for optimisation

No god is unusable

and yes, the King and Queen of Olympus are ridiculous

Ares is super fun to build around, but there's no ignoring the fact that his boon design is terrible for certain vows

posideon is a mixed bag, he can be a dud but he also has some absolutely crazy boons YES I SEE YOU THERE GYSER SPOUT

[tawdry geyser]

Yeah. I still like Ares. Putting him on e.g. Mel axe attack is fun. And the boons that give double damage chance are great

[surreal hazel]

putting +300-400 base power on your omega cast that only has 150 to begin with is absolutely nuts

That's +200% damage that multiplies with other cast/global damage bonuses

[tawdry geyser]

Ok I guess that's the optimal Thanatos build then

[surreal hazel]

Thanatos? You mean Charon?

[tawdry geyser]

Err

Yes

[surreal hazel]

Then yes, definitely what you want to see

Local Climate giving like +120% ocast damage when you're stood in it just makes your cast a nuke

[tawdry geyser]

Nice

I have a bad record with charon

Time to start min-maxing with all these boons

[surreal hazel]

it's a tricky one to get down and a bit of a one trick pony, but there's no questioning the raw power of big kaboom

[tawdry geyser]

I tended to go Apollo for the area expansion

[surreal hazel]

Start with Lucid Gain and go from there

and yes, that means you get apollo and thus supernova is on the table

[tawdry geyser]

Yeah

[median anvil]

plasma i think you've legit forgotten the boon values without jpom

[surreal hazel]

I was assuming those, yes

and also maybe

[tawdry geyser]

Plus the thing where you get a second explosion after Ω cast

[surreal hazel]

Prominence flare? ehhh, less important

[median anvil]

common level 1 climate gives 20% i think

[surreal hazel]

well yeah, but we were talking jpom earlier so I kinda ran with it

likewise me saying Gyser giving +300

[tawdry geyser]

Hmm ok

I was thinking of going for a specific build

Back to the pom rng then

[surreal hazel]

If your target is still near you and alive after eating an ospecial and a souped up omega cast then I guess you're fighting a boss because little else is surviving that

[surreal hazel]

Still makes the point that Gyser Spout is still crazy compared to other %damage cast boons

[surreal hazel]

If you're running jpom, you need to have a few different build ideas in mind so that you can work with what you're given

and yeah, this is one of the problems with Charon, sometimes you're just going to get an awkward set of gods to work with and you might as well reroll

[tawdry geyser]

Easier on surface and I think surface is where I've struggled with charon

Having said that I'm not sure I can be bothered to go higher fear with all the aspects now

I've got a few favourites

[surreal hazel]

You don't need to, it can be fun to just play at a level that keeps it fun

[tawdry geyser]

Yeah

I'm on 40f rn, I'll keep using all the weapons but drop a few aspects I think

[surreal hazel]

My idea of a fun unthinking set of vows is hordes, grit and rivals. It's not optimal, it's not pushing the envelope, but it's a nice playground to see what interesting combos pop up and have enemies last long enough to use those combos

[tawdry geyser]

Nice. Hordes and extra baddie health are not so bad if you ease up on the timer limit

[tough torrent]

Would that change each hit of knife? Like morrigan hits 3 times so would the minimum be 3x5?

[surreal hazel]

Yes

[surreal hazel]

Also the multihit is 5 stabs

[split igloo]

forgot to mention, I've got moon water with an interesting perk last time, the perk made it so that it doesn't reset on fountains, you get to keep all the charges
basically, I had 17 charges, each worth 55 hp, at Typhon, it's ridiculous
yes, that's 935 hp, while you get to keep Strength

[tough torrent]

Seems like it'd be pretty neat.

So many hits so you're likely to get at least one 55 and break even, with the chance for a "crit"

[tough torrent]

That MW perk is neat but likkkkke. I only ever get it when I end up picking up a hex in Mourning fields or something

So its basically useless

[surreal hazel]

Even so, only worth it if you have wave or flame strike, or heck even heaven strike

[tough torrent]

Like you gotta invest a lot in it early

[surreal hazel]

and pray for Success rate

[surreal hazel]

It's good but somehow still not as frankly ridiculous as Panacea

[tough torrent]

Me when all I have is pressure points for chance based perks, and every Hermes boon offers succ rate

[split igloo]

what if you take Athena's stalwart stand, then kys as much as possible, then take Hades' last gasp, do you just one shot Chronos?

[surreal hazel]

it's still only a linear +% gain, which admittedly can go very high

But also Chronos is damage gated so eh

If you want to see +% go wild, get a Creation and then Chant boon from Chaos

two if you can

[tough torrent]

I never even thought about last stand + last gasp

Probably works with morose trinket too?

I still have not managed to roll Chaos's infusion lol

[surreal hazel]

Gotta get aether early to do it. Chaos won't appear naturally after oceanus after all

[tough torrent]

Me when I floor 1 duo

Is it just duos that give pink blob or

[median anvil]

also creation from chaos i think?

[tough torrent]

O

[cursive ruin]

Hello.. so i just got hades' keepsake and learnt about fates whim.. how do you set up arcana for it? Do you have to run strength and death together or something?

[wild drift]

There are plenty other useful cards to fill the 7 grasp like Sorceress, Wayward Son, Furies, Messenger, Huntress, Eternity, Night, and Artificer

Though I agree on non-magick spending aspects some of these are useless

[cursive ruin]

But you lose out on queen if you activate more than two of the same cost right? Can you just not run queen with fates whim stuff then?

[wild drift]

Yeah I just abandon Queen on Fates' Whim since it's harder to build specifically for useful duos anyway

[cursive ruin]

Huh.. i see..

[wild drift]

But you will still get duos occasionally of course, the thing is with the levels up you might be less reliant on duos

I still prefer having rerolls and build control on most aspects but Fates' Whim is probably stronger in general, there's a reason most high fear runners use it basically every time

[cursive ruin]

Ye i think i might prefer build control too.. but i want to rank up the keepsakes i have

[median anvil]

you can with strength and death but honestly, queen isn't that big of a deal

in fact, neither is divinity

[wild drift]

Also lets you discover stuff you might not have thought of

[cursive ruin]

I do ditch divinity often lol

Its just uptil now queen seemed easy enough to satisfy so i never considered ditching it

[frank siren]

A common boon with jpom is often equal to or better than a level one purple

[tough torrent]

I really tried to keep Queen on my deck, but it was was forcing me to cut one of Lovers, Enchantress or Artificer

And then with FW it made getting a line for excellence tricky as well

[frank siren]

on fates whim, I don't bother with rarity

[alpine raft]

full line for fw is just middle horizontal or middle vertical

[tough torrent]

Yeah

But it was hard making that line while having queen

[frank siren]

yep I do middle vertical so divinity is a bonus

[turbid karma]

I run something roughly like this for my core arcana cards - https://h2crossroads.pages.dev/ArcanaDeck/?deck=WyJjMSIsImMyIiwiYzMiLCJjNiIsImMxMSIsImMxMiIsImMxMyIsImMxNCIsImMxNSIsImMxNyIsImMxOCJd

oh sorry i screwed up

that should work now

that’s with FW/jeweled pom, of course

I fill in the 3 spare arcana ofc, I just forget how. Most likely persistence + messenger, might be eternity (although i doubt it)

you can run that same general setup with strength instead of death, since they cost the same

I’d recommend not running strength and death together — you can, but strength ends up being a wasted 4 grasp for most of the run because it’s only active when you have no DDs left

[final sedge]

Tip for strength, more life goes a long way if you are still getting hit.

[opal pecan]

Here's the Strength setup: https://h2crossroads.pages.dev/ArcanaDeck/?deck=WyJjMSIsImMyIiwiYzMiLCJjNiIsImM3IiwiYzgiLCJjMTEiLCJjMTMiLCJjMTQiLCJjMTUiLCJjMTciLCJjMTgiLCJjMjMiXQ==

Well, it should also auto-activate Divinity because middle column, per previous comment

[final sedge]

Any options that include excellence the queen and or divinity?

[spiral wadi]

since no rerolls, the only way ur getting queen is if u run both strength and death

which is like fine cuz in theory u lose ur dds and u start playing strength

[final sedge]

Ew

[spiral wadi]

but game has a lot of dd-replenish mechanics and also game is built around dd so it's like ass

strength divinity u have to do middle column (from huntress to strength) (which the setup fulfills)

[final sedge]

I both like and dislike the arcana compared to the mirror. I don’t like giving up some of my cards to play others. Oh well.

[spiral wadi]

tbh i do find it funny how like the one actual "take this or that" is strength vs death

[alpine raft]

why would you need both for queen

[spiral wadi]

they're the only 4-cost

without reroll corner

[alpine raft]

yea so why would you need both

[spiral wadi]

to activate queen?

point is putting on both is objectively a bad idea

[alpine raft]

oh as in theres no other use for grasp

[spiral wadi]

ye, the way queen works is that u get 2 of each cost, which adds up to 30

but also on jpom u literally get lv4 boons so ur less reliant on duos anyway

like obv duos r still cracked but u can usually get by comfortably without too much trouble

so u tend to get more value picking either strength or death and throwing the remaining arcana on other stuff like artificer, huntress, night, messenger, etc

[tough torrent]