h2-builds-and-combat

[olive tusk]

can appear later

[tall notch]

Mel flames do okay at the casual level where the lack of piercing doesn't ruin you as much, so i guess they're in an alright spot balance wise?

[junior trail]

i like mel torches more because i feel like moros is too busted

[rare ermine]

So just recently I’ve dropped excellence in favor of artificer and night

Seems pretty good so far but i have yet to turn something into boon. It keeps turning into hearts

[ornate frost]

I mean hey hearts are still better than ash/bones

[stable herald]

how does Local Climate work with Circe? does standing in one omega cast boost both?

[dreamy veldt]

https://www.reddit.com/r/Hades2/s/INfM3npndQ

Thoughts?

I had an open mind going into it and then they said bro is easily S tier and I was like ok this is cope

[silent crow]

i think ares is good

[dreamy veldt]

But I'm known for being wrong

[silent crow]

not S tier but he is good

he just has a giant disparity post-Vow of Wards

[ornate frost]

He’s not awful, but I would certainly not complain if they buffed him

I do think it’s a little silly that the boons of the God of War are so small compared to the Goddess of Love or the God of Sun in pure raw % damage

[glass bone]

His Core abilities aren’t as universally strong as other gods. You’d love to get Hitch or Freeze. Apollo’s big % damage and Daze and Lucid Gain being immediately are amazing. Blitz is consistent damage, etc. And for the gods that need investment (Hestia / Heph), the payoff is massive, unlike Ares.

In general Ares has 3 main parts:

1. wounds, which unlike Hitch or Freeze, has a built in cooldown for enemies. The power source is a big deal, but unless you get big % damage, it may be worth it to take something else.
2. Swords. This one just sucks. There’s a delay between the damage ticks, and there’s a limit of one sword per blade. Getting the duo at high fear is kinda mandatory to build around.
3. Plasma. The extra movement speed is nice for 2 specific bosses, but the attack speed may not really be noticeable for a lot of aspects.

[ornate frost]

Mostly also I dislike mechanics that make me pick up extra things mid-battle, in this case the little plasma balls

[dreamy veldt]

Yeah like I'm not saying he's bad, but easily s tier? I need some extra opinions on that one

[silent crow]

disagree with u on the swords i think his cast sword is the only bad one

the dash is surprisingly good

[glass bone]

Oh yeah… right. The limit is on the cast I think?

[dreamy veldt]

I do like his dash

[ornate frost]

I mean forget S-tier he may very well be bottom tier, relatively. But that’s the thing, right? Having the “bottom tier” option still be reasonably competitive with the rest of the pack ultimately says good things about where the game is balancewise as a whole

[glass bone]

Still, I do think I’d rather take Blinding Rush or Frigid Rush for support, or Zeus Rush for damage.

[silent crow]

the cast and cutabove but most times ur not proccing cutabove that fast and the damage on cutabove is good anyway

ares cast has the unique designation of being both bad damage and no curse

i think ares and zeus rush are pretty similar for damage but ares is more practical

[glass bone]

The one big thing Ares has imo outside of Plasma for high fear, is Mutual Destruction

That is a big deal. And I’d love to see Ares as a third or fourth god for it

[ornate frost]

I do think there’s a lot of potential with just a few small tweaks, like slightly increasing his base % boost, or reducing the Wounds internal cooldown, or increasing plasma pickup range even more, etc.

[silent crow]

i mean realistically wounds is never going to be good on high fear

tis how it be when you put in a vow that gives every enemy two blue hearts

[glass bone]

I mean Wicked Onslaught is nice to grab

[silent crow]

theres also the fact that his duos are honestly really good

[glass bone]

Really the problem is the % isn’t high enough without rarities and Poms / JPom a lot of the time…

[dreamy veldt]

I mean sure, but at least from what I've seen, people aren't saying Ares bad therefore game bad, just that Ares is the worst potentially

[ornate frost]

Is there a god you’d position as worse than Ares?

[dreamy veldt]

I'm not qualified to answer this

[silent crow]

aphro

[glass bone]

Of the 9 standard Boon-givers… probably not?

[silent crow]

im not a big fan of her stuff weak is an inconsistent curse for defensive uses because of the short duration and close-range application methods and her atk/special arent practical

her attack boon is very marginally better than other gods' for having no curse and a range requirement and while the special has a very high % boost most specials in this game are ranged attacks

[glass bone]

Staff is sort of midrange, and Axe and Skull are close range

[silent crow]

you are not using axe special to deal primary damage

the axe special aspect is charon which uses the omega special which is a screen nuke

[dreamy veldt]

I would like the "close" area to be more clearly communicated

[glass bone]

That’s fair. I was just commenting on the “most specials are close range”

[silent crow]

and staffs special is a literal sniper shot u lose so much versatility

[glass bone]

You can definitely build Mel Staff and Anubis around Aphro Special though

My Mel Staff 62 back in EA did that.

[silent crow]

you can but you need investment and atp thats pretty similar to ares

the staff hammer that gives you a range reduction and 2x special is probably pretty great with it though

[bronze flax]

Regarding the swords, I feel they could work as they do with Ares/Heph duo and fall immediately and that solve all the issues imo

[silent crow]

his cast would still be horrible

epic sword ring currently deals the same dmg as common anvil ring

its hilarious

[bronze flax]

More swords

Give it more falling swords. More. MORE!

[rare ermine]

Its sad 😢
Tell them to give ya boi ares a minor dmg buff

[bronze flax]

I just thought it'd be funny if Ares/Heph duo would make the swords add Glow lol

[silent crow]

honest to god
i think plasma just needs to apply attack speed

straight up drop the pickup mechanic

its just ramping attack speed

considering how so many boons in this game are less "sometimes good" like hades 1 and more just guaranteed value

[sinful marlin]

Mel staff might be better than circe ngl

[rare ermine]

Ares duo boons are also so underwhelming

Makes swords fall twice and make swords fall faster

Ok the swords falling twice is okay but the faster part is 😔

Just get blitzzed at that point

[sinful marlin]

Doubling damage on casts

Applying effects of damage taken boons

Omega cast follows you

All good duos

[silent crow]

HEINOUS AFFRONT

[silent crow]

its falling twice and +50% damage its a really big boost

[sinful marlin]

Yes heinous affront is great

[silent crow]

and the fall faster part adds base damage and makes it much easier to spam aoe's across the entire room

[sinful marlin]

Faster part helps with the fact that it is possible for swords to miss if the enemy leaves the circle

[rare ermine]

Double dmg on cast is a duo he has..?

[silent crow]

ares/demeter

[sinful marlin]

Bro the double swords doubles his cast damage

[dreamy veldt]

Heinous affront is what they call my outfits at parties

[silent crow]

do you just not wear clothes

[sinful marlin]

And demeter straight up doubles omega cast damage

[dreamy veldt]

No I do, my style just isn't undestood

[silent crow]

ares/pos is also a really big damage boost

[sinful marlin]

Basically every duo is great except maybe hera but it's also decent

[sinful marlin]

Goes incredibly hard with hel

[rare ermine]

Oh i havent had demeter appear on my runs in a long while. Havent been foxusing on cast dmg and more on utility

[silent crow]

and ares/hestia is just. insane. +300 cast damage lol

or you get the juiciest ospecial of your life

[sinful marlin]

Yup

[silent crow]

i think ares/aphro is the worst one

[fervent garnet]

anyone got a good all rounder arcana build?

[rare ermine]

I think charon is my least used axe aspect

[sinful marlin]

Ares aphro is just funny

[silent crow]

ares/hera basically just gives you 20% global speed to everything which is pretty good

permanent metallic droplet

[sinful marlin]

With or without fates whim?

[sinful marlin]

I've been sleeping on plasma but this sounds good

[fervent garnet]

either is fine, no plan on using hades keepsake

[sinful marlin]

So without fates whim then

[deft whale]

does aspect of nyx synergize well with the night arcana and what is a hideous build you'd recommend

[tall notch]

noooot really, omega boost is the only omega I would use with that thing

[silent crow]

1. no
2. mel staff apollo special use the ospecial

[ornate frost]

I think the argument then is what you get with similar levels of investment:

• Mel staff doesn't need additional investment for Aphro special to be good (esp if running Zeus attack for instant blitz or Dual Moonshot)
• Aphro attack, with no additional investment, is a substantial damage increase on most aspects that want big % boost (such as attack on all axes)
• Glamour Gain is free constant curse application on magick-light aspects
• Shameless Attitude is good free damage, as is Sweet Surrender; Secret Crush gives a good amount of power
• Heartbreakers are a solid DPS increase on any aspect with moderate magick consumption
• Ares also has some solid duos so they're more balanced in this respect, but Aphro gets stuff like Romantic Spark and Burning Desire, which are potentially run-winning almost on their own

I really think it's difficult to justify saying "Aphrodite is potentially the worst god in the game" (not your exact words but an extrapolation of "is Ares the worst god?" followed by your assertion that "no, Aphrodite might be worse") when she's so powerful with so many builds with less investment than it typically takes for Ares to pop off

[silent crow]

mel staff requires a playstyle change for aphros pecial to be good

[fervent garnet]

sure

[silent crow]

and ares is pretty decent damage increase on. anything

the actual % doesnt matter as much in this game bc of how much u get from arcana already

[sinful marlin]

https://h2crossroads.pages.dev/ArcanaDeck/?deck=WyJjMSIsImM2IiwiYzciLCJjMTEiLCJjMTIiLCJjMTMiLCJjMTQiLCJjMTUiLCJjMTYiLCJjMTciLCJjMjAiLCJjMjEiLCJjMjIiLCJjMjQiXQ==

[silent crow]

not to say it doesnt matter but i think ppl have this idea that ares atk/special are horrible without the t2's or duos but theyre pretty serviceable shut up vow of wards

[ornate frost]

I don't think that's true though? Your long-distance snipes are less effective with Aphro special, certainly, but I find that when I'm on Mel Staff I'm within "close distance" range most of the time I'm in combat anyways so I wouldn't say my playstyle noticeably changes

[sinful marlin]

This is what I used to run with before 1.0, it's pretty good and useful in most situations

[sinful marlin]

What do you think is good atk and special to get for mel staff 60 fear

[ornate frost]

If you are a player that's mostly hitting distant enemies with Mel special though, then sure, I can see why you'd personally favor Aphro special less

[ornate frost]

Zeus attack 100%, Special can be anything with a good % increase (Aphro is the most popular but it doesn't have to be her specifically)

[sinful marlin]

True

[silent crow]

zeus/ any %

[fervent garnet]

no wayward son is worrying but eh, seems good enough

[sinful marlin]

Zeus attack is quite useful

[silent crow]

freeze attack is underrated imo

[sinful marlin]

If you go fates whim you can have wayward son

[dreamy veldt]

I love everything that freezes

[fervent garnet]

what would that build look like?

[sinful marlin]

https://h2crossroads.pages.dev/ArcanaDeck/?deck=WyJjMSIsImMyIiwiYzMiLCJjNiIsImM3IiwiYzgiLCJjMTEiLCJjMTIiLCJjMTMiLCJjMTQiLCJjMTUiLCJjMTgiLCJjMTkiLCJjMjAiLCJjMjQiXQ==

[silent crow]

is burning desire really that good

[sinful marlin]

https://h2crossroads.pages.dev/ArcanaDeck/?deck=WyJjMSIsImMyIiwiYzMiLCJjNiIsImM3IiwiYzgiLCJjMTEiLCJjMTIiLCJjMTMiLCJjMTQiLCJjMTUiLCJjMTgiLCJjMTkiLCJjMjQiXQ==

@fervent garnet this is the correct one

You lose queen in fates whim

[fervent garnet]

yeah i thought queen would be deactivated

ill try both

[sinful marlin]

Basically the play with fates whim is:

In first region use artificer to convert 3 minor rewards to major ones

In second region put on time piece and convert 4 minor rewards to gold

You can also convert chaos and onion and other things based on the game plan

[ornate frost]

I mean it's arguably one of the best duos available for Scorch builds, no? Alongside Freezer Burn and Scalding Vapor

[fervent garnet]

is time piece the chronos keepsake? havent found him while having nectar with me yet lmao

[sinful marlin]

Yes it's known popularly as the chlorex

[sinful marlin]

Freezer burn is so good 🩷

[opal pecan]

Chrolex, I think; Chlorex sounds like cleaning solution (what would that keepsake effect be 🤔 )

[austere trail]

deal 999 damage once per run

[opal pecan]

It depends on how easily you can keep your Scorch uptime with your build without Burning Desire, I think. If you're already keeping it up anyway, probably less value.

[silent crow]

i should probably put all my stuff into one message if i am going to have an actual discussion

in nearly all these cases (the attack, glamour gain, random small damage boosts, duos) aphro isn't really the best in slot its more like "something ill take if i get it" which is similar to why people argue ares as the worst god

but unlike aphro ares can actually turn from "good enough" to "actually strong" with a couple of extra stuff added on, aphro doesn't have that ceiling to me since her offense is based in high % boosts which arent as valuable anymore (compared to crits/flat damage from blades) and her other main mechanic the heartthrobs are pretty weak even with the apollo duo

[silent crow]

shi is scaling vapor good these days everyone hated it in EA

[silent crow]

if ur already keeping it up the boon does nothing lol

[opal pecan]

I was imagining you could theoretically alter your playstyle to incorporate a bit where you flit around and smack everybody, but yeah

[ornate frost]

I'll admit that I'm not confident enough in my knowledge of Scorch and, by extension, Steam mechanics to say for sure. It could be worse than I think it is, and I'll let someone more knowledgeable say their piece on that front should they scroll by (similar with Burning Desire).

[silent crow]

wait wanst it bugged for like half of EA and did nothing

[sage flame]

I think scalding vapor is good

[sage flame]

and yeah something like that

[opal pecan]

Which one of those was bugged?

[sage flame]

scalding vapor pretty sure

[silent crow]

i feel old and slow

[dreamy veldt]

Me every day

[ornate frost]

Here is where I'm not sure I agree though. Perhaps it stems from a misunderstanding on one of our parts on how damage is calculated, but as I understand it Aphro's big % boosts are quite good and valuable? I would certainly consider her if not best-in-slot then at least 2nd place for a lot of aspects (eg. Aphro special on Mel staff is arguably bis if running Zeus attack, Aphro special is, if not bis for most Axe attacks, then at least 2nd or 3rd next to Apollo or Hera (higher than where Ares would rank at any rate), and I think Glamour Gain is absolutely bis for a lot of magickless aspects because the only other thing that would go in that slot and offer some benefit is Tough Gain, and I'd prefer the free constant curse application)

[sage flame]

actually scrolling back through the speedcord it seems like scalding was used a lot and did work even like over a year ago

[ornate frost]

Like Aphrodite's not my favorite goddess or anything, but I don't think I could ever consider her [the worst in the game]

[opal pecan]

I was about to chime in to defend her, but it struck me that I wasn't around for the beginning of the conversation -- she might be the worst goddess specifically if that's what the convo was

[ornate frost]

Worst boon-giver

[silent crow]

i said she's the worst of the 9 main boon givers

[opal pecan]

Oh. Well, yes, then I disagree too 😆

[ornate frost]

At the very least, if I'm doing a Fates Whim run and thus not gunning for any hyperspecific build, I am on average more happy to see an Aphrodite door than an Ares door

[silent crow]

glamour gain takes away huntress tho so it might not even be the best in that case

then again i dont know if huntress is meta

[sage flame]

idk she's like heph a lot to me, I like a lot of her support boons and her cast and gain

[silent crow]

shes like a worse heph to me bc striaght up DR and health boosts are worse than armor

[opal pecan]

Her cast is one of my favorites, the CC is unique

[sage flame]

I find the DR more useful than huntress past region 2 imo but that's just me

she's def not as strong as heph defensively and not as strong as like zeus or hera on your main attack/special

[silent crow]

does this hades 2 website have usage stats for arcana

[sage flame]

so kinda has a weird niche

[opal pecan]

Would you say she's an all-rounder? 🤔

[ornate frost]

Is this what you're looking for? https://h2crossroads.pages.dev/ArcanaStats

[silent crow]

oh it does

[opal pecan]

That's only for people who submit their runs to that website, right?

[dreamy veldt]

Mood

[sage flame]

like sorta

[silent crow]

yeah but they tend to be good players

they take huntress on the fates whim build at least

[opal pecan]

Just clarifying the scope here

[sage flame]

yeah but they're all like high fear clears so it's pretty useful

[silent crow]

sorta? apollos the real all rounder

[ornate frost]

@silent crow Also I will say: while I disagree with you, I appreciate that at this point we've had a reasonably long debate that has remained entirely civil, I think. No insults, no "you're dumb for thinking this" or whatever, just simple exchanges of "I think you're wrong and here's why I think that", so thanks for that much at least

[opal pecan]

I hate Daze for being a %chance

[sage flame]

yeah I'll turn on/off huntress depending on my aspect

[dreamy veldt]

After "unlocking" Ares I was always so excited to see him, but now I kind of just always avoid him

[silent crow]

thank u too mate

[sage flame]

I honestly don't mind ares all that much, but I only really use wounds

[dreamy veldt]

@ornate frost ur dumb
@silent crow ur ugly

[silent crow]

no im very pretty

[dreamy veldt]

Based

[ornate frost]

I mean, yeah I don't dislike Ares to the point of actively avoiding him. I'm coming at this more from an Aphrodite-defense angle than an Ares-attack angle honestly

[ornate frost]

It's true but I'm self-conscious about it

[opal pecan]

When Ares gets into my god pool, I sort of groan inside because I know now a good % of the boons I get offered are gonna be useless or unappealing to me. For example, I'm ideally never going to be missing enough health to make his "missing health" boons that useful. And I don't like pickups, and as previously indicated, I don't like relying on %chance

(this is personal preference)

[silent crow]

anyway about the % boosts
since all damage is additive in this game aphro's high % boosts dont matter as much?
like ur going from say 140% to 200% damage comparing ares to aphro which isnt that that much and thats comparing lowest % scaling to highest

flat damage / base power on the other hand scales much better since base power will take all your attack % boosts and add onto it (so like, take the 50 power and add 140%) and flat damage will take all your GLOBAL % boosts and add onto it (so add 200% to whatever high number flat dmg) which is why i think ares scales better

[sage flame]

I like grievous and mutual destruction cause red funny numbers go brr

[silent crow]

cutabove is like top 3 boons for me

[sage flame]

cut above!!!! so real

[opal pecan]

That's the one with omega blades right? I do like it on builds that do omega moves.

[sage flame]

blood spree is funny with antler

[silent crow]

i said earlier that i think plasma should just drop the pickup mechanic and straight up give u atk speed

bc it being a pickup implies that its strong enough to justify the inconvenience (it isnt)

[opal pecan]

I would probably instantly always take Ares on axe and not hate it on other weapons if that happened.

[silent crow]

i mean that sounds pretty balanced to me unironically

[opal pecan]

I would be okay with keeping Grisly Gain as a pickup so it's still different from Cardio Gain.

[austere trail]

when I first started playing I thought there would be a legendary boon to automatically pick up the plasma

[silent crow]

aint that weird

what a crazy stupid idea you had there

/j

[dreamy veldt]

Don't say that about yourself 😠

[silent crow]

idk why i keep thinking im gonna have a special unique arty blades run

its just not an interesting aspect

[opal pecan]

What's the most boring aspect overall iyo and is it different from what you consider the weakest aspect

[dreamy veldt]

Hmm

[opal pecan]

(I don't know that I have a take on the latter personally but you can probably gather the former)

[ornate frost]

Probably Mel Axe?

[silent crow]

boring: artemis
weak: idk like. artemis

[opal pecan]

LMAO

[silent crow]

aw cmon mel axe is pretty cool

[ornate frost]

What does it offer that's interesting that the other axe aspects don't though?

[silent crow]

its interesting bc it forces you to alter the axe combo more

since the power boost is the same on all the hits and the dash attack

[dreamy veldt]

I feel like there's two forms of boring that I'm conflicting between

[silent crow]

so u wanna be doing the first 2 hits and the dash attack more often

[dreamy veldt]

Because like, on paper Mel axe and staff are the most boring, but in practice Mel axe is one of the most fun weapons to me

[sage flame]

mel torches just makes me want to play moros instead

[silent crow]

usually i blame moros torches being broken for this but nah. they just didnt do good with mel torches

sorry guys

[vocal tartan]

So, question

[dreamy veldt]

I would probably say Eos in terms of gameplay though?

[silent crow]

really??

[dreamy veldt]

Not that I don't like it but it just feels slow sometimes

[vocal tartan]

If I start with the pom but lose Fates' Whim later, do I retroactively lose the bonuses?

[dreamy veldt]

Yes

[vocal tartan]

Okay cool.

[sage flame]

I LOVE EOS

[opal pecan]

You keep the levels on the boons you already picked up but you lose the Hades blessing

[dreamy veldt]

Oh wait I misread sorry

This is why you shouldn't listen to me 💀

[vocal tartan]

Follow-up question: What's the best keepsake to take for act 4 if you're more concerned about survivability than offense but would prefer not to take the Tooth?

[dreamy veldt]

Probably knuckles right

[opal pecan]

Knucklebones if you think you can survive the normal encounters that precede the boss.

[vocal tartan]

That makes sense.

My go-to is usually the fleece but I don't think that'll be great for this particular build

[sage flame]

pin? if you have good dps and can dodge enough to only need 10 more seconds of dps tho. otherwise knucklebones

[dreamy veldt]

Also same, but I don't think any of the aspects are boring

[ornate frost]

Knuckles or Pin (if you're running DDs)

[vocal tartan]

I'm on Strength

[opal pecan]

Surely preferring not to take the tooth indicates-- yeah

[ornate frost]

Probably just Knuckles then

[vocal tartan]

also on 24 fear so Pray For Mojo

[silent crow]

the droplet is underrated with casuals

[sage flame]

I was gonna mention droplet too as an option

[vocal tartan]

Huh!

Droplet IS an option 🤔

[opal pecan]

I like Droplet a lot, but does it help with survivability? I could imagine people careening into traps or whatever

[sage flame]

sand beat me to it

[vocal tartan]

You also hit faster with it, right?

[opal pecan]

Yes, you do, and channel too

[silent crow]

hit, channel move faster

[vocal tartan]

Heck with it, I'll try droplet

[silent crow]

nah people dont do that with only 20% movespeed

[opal pecan]

Nice, good luck!

[sage flame]

I mean krill issue atp you arent making it out of tart anyway

[opal pecan]

I guess so?

[silent crow]

this was a concern when the plasma speed buff was uncapped and people were offing themselves at typhon because their walking was faster than the dash

[opal pecan]

LMAO

But I was definitely also thinking about people talking about putting one toe out of line during Chronos instakill

[sage flame]

that was like 100%+ move speed tho

[silent crow]

200%+ really

[austere trail]

😭

[sage flame]

true

[silent crow]

most people dash into the circle i believe and dash distance is always the same so its not a big deal

[dreamy veldt]

Playing Persephone and incorrectly assumed Hera special counted for meter

And I have Demeter attack

Building up to be a goated build

Toula enjoyer pog

[sage flame]

yeah you gotta get something that isn't just %

[dreamy veldt]

???

[sage flame]

hitch I assume

hit a b on there instead of an h lol

[dreamy veldt]

Ohhhh

[sage flame]

unfortunate

[dreamy veldt]

Yeah I thought hitch would count lol

[opal pecan]

Hera special does have more than just %

[sage flame]

I mean yeah

but hitch never counts for like anything apparently

[dreamy veldt]

F

[opal pecan]

Oh 😔

[sage flame]

it doesn't get boosted by olympian damage+

[vocal tartan]

Oof. So close.

Had Big T on the ropes.

[opal pecan]

Ohhh this was a Surface run

[dreamy veldt]

The thing I hate about that is that I can never tell if I had him on the ropes

[hearty ibex]

I wouldn't call this build "good" but it is somehow fun for a few runs: persephone skull, start hestia keepsake, take denial fear. Reset until you get hestia cast room 1 at a decent power (at least 100 scorch/second). You are only allowed to use scorch to deal damage (except for killing pillars in surface). Pyro technique is the most important thing to aim for after room 1, rarity not so important but put a few poms in it. Once you have the technique getting the cast to keep up is next most important: either Aphrodite duo (weak from glamout gain, other weak sources deal damage) or cast% damage boosts (from chaos, arachne, well items: only really possible in underworld and even there the duo is better). After you get that duo you can look into getting supernova for bigger aoe or the Aphrodite-Poseidon duo so your scorch never expires (and you can focus on dodging while enemies burn).

[dreamy veldt]

There's times where I feel like I'm doing 1000 DPS and it takes me 5 minutes to to win and times where I feel like a wet noodle and win in 2

[opal pecan]

You can sort of tell by how fast you are getting through his phases

When I got my Surface PB the other day he basically didn't have an opportunity to really do more than, like, one attack in each phase max

[sage flame]

best part about this is you don't need denial and can supplement the cast with even more damage from zeus or something, but I can't tell if this is a cast only challenge run or not

[dreamy veldt]

Today I killed him before he ever did the double tongue laser which hasn't happened before

[opal pecan]

Hell yeah!!!

Screw you, Typhon, and your various anatomical armaments!!!!!

[silent crow]

i dont like it when typhon uses his body on me

[hearty ibex]

it's a scorch only challenge. denial is to make it easier to get pyro technique.

the goal is for the 2nd highest damage source at the end to be just a few hundred from traps since those are too hard to avoid

[tawny imp]

how do i use shiva

[dreamy veldt]

Very carefully

[opal pecan]

What's the context for this question, because I assume you know the literal answer

[tawny imp]

no like i dont know how to play with this weapon

do i just omega special omega attack

[flint widget]

yeah

[dreamy veldt]

Omega special > stand in circle > omega attack

[opal pecan]

You don't have to omega attack all the time, you can save it for beefier enemies

[flint widget]

equip night card also

[opal pecan]

Just normal special/attack is enough for trash mobs

[flint widget]

and do not dash strike

dash strike shiva sucks ass

[opal pecan]

I personally am never gonna be able to break [the habit of dash striking](#h2-victory-boasting message) so I can't cook with Shiva

[dreamy veldt]

I'll definitely use normal attacks on Shiva sometimes but I basically never normal special lol

Only in a pinch

[opal pecan]

TFW the magick

[tawny imp]

do i want % boons for both special attack

[flint widget]

apollo atk and hera special are ideal

[opal pecan]

They're better than they are on normal coats due to the higher base power iirc

[sage flame]

apollo special is nice and apollo attack is also nice tbh

[flint widget]

hera to spread hitch for the balls

plus aoe

who doesn't love hitting enemies with your big balls

[opal pecan]

They're really rather small 🤔

[sage flame]

theyre average okay

[neat phoenix]

Does anyone know if Athena's trinket disables Fate's Whim?

[austere trail]

it does

[opal pecan]

Yes, it does.

[neat phoenix]

RIP, thanks

[opal pecan]

Anything that summons an Olympian.

[dreamy veldt]

What level 4 keepsake should I use going into fields using Persephone, already used pom and card

[neat phoenix]

Shame. Eris really messed me up, and I am running on empty rn. Welp, here's hoping Selene can carry me

[opal pecan]

What build

[dreamy veldt]

Gonna use fleece going to Tartarus probably

Demeter attack, Hera special, Aphrodite cast

Apollo dash gain

[opal pecan]

Could do the Metallic Droplet funny for getting through Fields faster

[dreamy veldt]

Usually I would use hammer but because it's level 4 it makes it 30 encounters which feels like a waste

[opal pecan]

Or for a permanent bonus, you could grab Embryo for a free Heroic Chaos boon

[dreamy veldt]

Oh wait true

I totally missed that it affects the rarity not the time it lasts

[opal pecan]

Yeah, it's great

[dreamy veldt]

Ok bet

[opal pecan]

I also think that lv4 Concave Stone is best used in Fields rather than any other zone

Because you can pick which boon to use that 100% chance on due to the multi-reward rooms

[sage flame]

me when droplet doesnt make u sprint faster, just "move" aka walk

sadge

[opal pecan]

Why they do this....

[sage flame]

real

[opal pecan]

Idea: keepsake that lets you delete one normal (not boss or miniboss) enemy from the game

I immediately pop it on holehearts whatever the sucky dudes in Fields are called

[austere trail]

oh the big yellow ones?

[opal pecan]

The roombas....

[odd bolt]

Yeah they are gone

[austere trail]

I really hate the ora ora ones in fields

[odd bolt]

I would choose them too

[opal pecan]

I can run away from punchy dudes, I can't run away from Vacuum Cleaner

MFs got world-class cutting-edge future-proof suction

[odd bolt]

On the surface the big automatons are immediately gone, or at least I would remove their defense mode

[opal pecan]

The dudes that have a bunch of different attacks including rapidfire machine gun?

[odd bolt]

Yeah

[opal pecan]

Yeah they are rude, esp with Frenzy

[neat phoenix]

Good news! She showed up, anyway! Typhon won't know what hit him

[odd bolt]

Auto-Watchers

That's their name

[opal pecan]

Divine Intervention for reals, Deus Ex RNGchina

[neat phoenix]

I like to think it's Eris calling her in as an apology for dealing 500 damage

As much as she may hate it, when I die, her games end, too

[dreamy veldt]

Ok I now have level 6 heroic Aphrodite special for +370% damage

[sage flame]

worst part about toula only is aggroing one of these guys and toula doesnt target them

so the whole fields room

this mf is chasing me around

vacuum bastards

[opal pecan]

I almost never get hit by their damaging attacks, so they don't show up on the damage taken leaderboard, but they should add a category for "psychic damage taken"

"Time wasted." "Instances where the vacuum dragged you into other enemies."

[dreamy veldt]

Just got +184% on backstab damage from Apollo, to go with my +230% attack damage from Aphrodite 🔥

[opal pecan]

Vacuum bros would topscore every time on that one.

[dreamy veldt]

I love Persephone

[tawny imp]

i finally got supay

and by that i mean i need to extract shadows for it which i cant because i dont have enough bones because i spent it all on nightmares and moon dust

[opal pecan]

Wait, bones?

[tawny imp]

i need to buy fabric

apollo cast is not worth it right

[spiral wadi]

lmao i bought a dd from hermes shrine in olympus fountain room and it was 1 away into prom fight

what a scam

[neat phoenix]

I... thought I had God Mode on the entire time, and only just noticed on the results screen that I didn't. I won with exactly 1 HP left.
Yikes

"... A bit too close", yeah Mel, you're not wrong

[austere trail]

well, at least now you know you don't need godmode!

[neat phoenix]

I prefer to think of it as me having earned God Mode, now. If I can do that, I deserve the safety net

[proper cloak]

I mean it's alr

Free status effect application

[austere trail]

if somehow I have not got enough to get orig by prom/cerb then I will be taking it

[tawny imp]

i cant play my circe without winnres circlke

[neat phoenix]

I am a little upset Chronos didn't have any special line about Mel being taller, tho. Even Dyonisus said something

[proper cloak]

Apollo cast + winners circle is pretty solid

[neat phoenix]

I like your name. That's an excellent idea.

[silent crow]

nah its pretty good

[opal pecan]

It's quite good with Howling Soul if you can swing it

[tawny imp]

really getting sick of medea's glazing

[flint widget]

i mean medea is amazing for speedrunning and low/mid fear but high fear its kinda eh

[tawny imp]

no i literally mean her glazing poly

[opal pecan]

LMAO

[flint widget]

i mean, do u want to be on a cyclops' bad side

also how does that relate to h2 builds and combat

[opal pecan]

It's Medea, I don't think she's doing it because she's intimidated by him.

What's the best skull for high fear? /curious, not that it'll impact me

[flint widget]

im not the right guy to answer that question

havent played other skulls besides medea on high fear

tried hel 62 for a bit and it sucks ass

mel and perseph idk yet

[tawny imp]

isnt it just medea

[opal pecan]

Persephone's gimmick seems like it might be helpful offsetting some of the vows, I suppose

[flint widget]

medea is just very unsafe in general so its kinda eh for high fear

ideally, the things that make a weapon good for high fear is early high dmg output and safety

medea has high dmg output but not safety cuz like its close range

[dreamy veldt]

https://imgur.com/a/mKCrz92

https://imgur.com/a/Vm8VU3S

[flint widget]

theres a reason why mel staff and circe staff are top tier

[glass bone]

Give me a few hours. I’m on my last skull (Medea) 62 UW

ATM, Hel is great when you high roll, Persephone works fine if you high roll or not, and Mel Skull is probably best when you low roll between the non-Medea skulls

Oh also that’s my last 62 UW period

[tawny imp]

what boons are good on persephone skull

[opal pecan]

Ohh nice

[glass bone]

Best ones are probably Scorch Attack / Cast, and Blasts (not Dash)

[tawny imp]

so i want either heph besides hestia attacks and casts

[glass bone]

That’s because Pyro Technique and Blasts scale massively with Poms

[tawny imp]

ngl it feels like the persephone bonus never works on me i never get high level boons

[opal pecan]

Double up with double mom to offset the RNG?

[glass bone]

Persephone used to have a 1/6 chance of giving each value, but in Patch 10 its chances were nerfed / “fixed”

[tawny imp]

WAIT I WAS USING MEL SKULL THATS WHY 😭

[opal pecan]

LMAO GOLDIE

[glass bone]

Oh. Wow….

“You look just like your mother” - Hades

[flint widget]

nice one

[opal pecan]

NGL that literally happened to me the other day, I figured I would try going fast with Persephone and somehow ended up on Mel skull

But I'm crap at all the skulls so y'know whatever

[tawny imp]

is the special any good

[glass bone]

It’s pretty important to 3/4 of the skulls, yeah

[flint widget]

still waiting for the day when sgg add mel skulls shell buff to wide grin

[glass bone]

Even for Mel Skull, special is a movement tool

[tawny imp]

i meant more the sprouted omega special

[glass bone]

Ooh… it can work yeah.

[opal pecan]

I once took out an entire Summit room with the Persephone omega special

[glass bone]

You do need some big Olympian damage to refund it well tho

[opal pecan]

Why doesn't hitch count :(

[tawny imp]

hmm maybe freezer burn

hitch works on all sources of damage right including curses

[glass bone]

If I had to guess; Hitch itself is not the damage. It is just sending regular damage to other sources

Probably should though tbh if it doesn’t already

[tawny imp]

hera demeter duo with jewel pom 🙏

[gusty palm]

I feel like Momus needs a buff. . .

[viral yew]

Staff has 3 amazing aspects I would rather leave it to die

[dreamy veldt]

Ankh is amazing?

[gusty palm]

Okay listen though like a 0.2 cooldown reduction overall would be good

[dreamy veldt]

Give me a fuide

Guide

I've only played it twice I think lol

[elder lichen]

Whats a good build for coat omega special spam?

[gusty palm]

Anubis is really good, you get good dps to carry for a while in the shades spawning after enemy death

With the right build the attack on Anubis is crazy

[manic shuttle]

get heph legendary

[viral yew]

It is yes

[gusty palm]

Kk

[viral yew]

Shiva, don't bother on the other aspects

[tawny imp]

what attacks

[glass bone]

Zeus / Hestia / Poseidon

[dreamy veldt]

Now that I've finished the quest of winning with every aspect idk if I'm ever gonna play anything besides Persephone or morrigan but if I do touch Anubis again I'll keep that in mind

[dreamy veldt]

Or Mel axe

If you couldnt tell, I like big numbers

[tawny imp]

my anubis is level 1 😔

[dreamy veldt]

Get your nightmare up not your funny up

[vague eagle]

Anyone have advice for completing the final Fates prophecy?

This will be my 10th or so try. I think the main issue seems to be me misjudging who the final enemy is... either I kill the last enemy before using Moros DD, or I kill what I think is the last enemy, only to find there is another wave, which I fail to kill within 10 seconds

[opal pecan]

The tip I got was kill every enemy except one or two, then let the one or two kill you, then kill them.

[tawny imp]

CIRCE REMOVED VOW OF TIME

my goat

[viral yew]

Hate it when that happens

[opal pecan]

If she removes Hubris, that doesn't un-prime anything that Hubris already primed, right? Or un-remove anything Denial already removed? (Just suddenly thinking about BNB value)

[dreamy veldt]

It unprimes

Not sure about denial, but I was shocked when she removed hubris and I got my ~70 magick back

[opal pecan]

Huh! TIL.

[hidden wind]

so i uh
if i remain at fates whim after unequipping jewel pom do i keep the buffs? id guess no but the wording is a bit open

[opal pecan]

You keep the buffs, yes.

[hidden wind]

OH

[opal pecan]

That's why people are big on equipping it z1 or otherwise as early as possible. All three post-ending keepsakes work that way btw.

[hidden wind]

well then
in that case
moon beam ? does selene count a sa god for fates whim?

[opal pecan]

She's not an Olympian, so you're good with Moon Beam.

[hidden wind]

explains why the reqs are like that
thank you

[hidden wind]

maxxed esus flask here i come

[dreamy veldt]

Oh I didn't know that

[opal pecan]

Hermes/Dionysus/Artemis keepsakes are also fine to take since they don't summon their respective gods.

[dreamy veldt]

I just assumed it wouldn't count cause you're still like, making something happen ie messing with fate

Yeah those three make sense though

[viral yew]

Athena does cancel it tho 😭

[hidden wind]

fates dont like block dash smh

[opal pecan]

The wording of FW is pretty specific basically, if you follow what it says in the tooltip exactly to the letter then you're good.

[dreamy veldt]

I really need to talk to Athena

But the testament keeps wanting me to do underworld sadge

[hidden wind]

makes me think
can you encounter athena naturally on alymp after you get her keepsake?

[viral yew]

Yes

[hidden wind]

got the opposite problem
wanna swap?

[dreamy veldt]

Also what's the requirement for unlocking rivals 3, just beating both of the rivals 2?

[hidden wind]

so theoreticaly double athena boons? hell yea

[viral yew]

Yes

[dreamy veldt]

Kk

[viral yew]

No you only get her once

[hidden wind]

but if you get her iwthout the keepsake(at olympus) cant you then summon her at typhons?

[dreamy veldt]

So I'll kill two birds with one stone next surface run

[viral yew]

No

[hidden wind]

damn

thats a shame
also shiva gang lesgo

[dreamy veldt]

Once I unlock rivals 3 and 4 I think I'll be unspoilable and I can do my favorite thing with games I like

Make tier lists

[viral yew]

Join the Coat Gang

[hidden wind]

done

[opal pecan]

I refuse to edit my name, but hell yeah

[hidden wind]

btw speaking of
how does back regsitration for teh coat work anyways?

feels jankier than tf2

[dreamy veldt]

Mine is superior

[opal pecan]

Back registration? With the Apollo boon or

[hidden wind]

i kind o get projectiles but what about big aoe melle attacks?
if the attackhitbox is bigger than me and ocver both my front and back what does it count as?

[hidden wind]

the shield

[opal pecan]

Ahh

[hidden wind]

this mainly pertains to chronos as there are few attacks as big as that that are also blockable

ought i face the direction hes slashing from instead?

[dreamy veldt]

Hey anyone know how many ticks Lunar ray is

For air quality purposes

I've had the requirements for Ares zeus duo for the last three boons and no luck

Now going into Tartarus

Oh, I apparently was like resting my thumb on the a button and just clicked the first Hades boon i got offered

Which was the healing one while I'm at max hp

[opal pecan]

You're just gonna flex on them and show how much you don't need any damn Hades blessing is what

[dreamy veldt]

Lol

[fallow holly]

Chat how good is Strength really in comparison to just stacking up on Death Defies? I feel like it makes a majority of the run a lot easier but at the final boss im terrified, and if I had 4 death defies in my back pocket im a lot more confident

[opal pecan]

How much Fear?

[fallow holly]

Does it matter? Im not asking for a specific run just in general

Lets say all 4 rivals

[opal pecan]

Yes, it matters, because higher Fear can weaken Strength's, well, strengths

Without any Fear or only certain vows, there's not really much that bosses can do to you that Strength can't mitigate, aside from goofing up Chronos instakill dodges

[fallow holly]

Well yeah, I guess im more asking about rival fights actually. I feel like specifically rivals chronos could tear through strength

[opal pecan]

No comment on that from me then, as I have gone out of my way to avoid Rivals; just lettin you know I ain't avoiding the question 🫡

[surreal hazel]

depends a lot on the build

+20% matters a lot if you're blitzing, clasting or blasting, but if you're already stacking big +% from other places then it doesn't do a lot

[fallow holly]

Only time i feel like it’d just be flat better than death defies for me is if I get some sort of weakness build with that one ares under 40 hp healing boon

[dreamy veldt]

Imagine if that boon was % based

[fallow holly]

That would be broken

[dreamy veldt]

Yeah

There's nothing in games I love more than lifesteal but I'm literally never at 40hp

[opal pecan]

The damage reduction on Strength does make a pretty big difference (absent damage/heal-modifying vows) imo, I really felt the ouch in my bones when I had to take DDs

[dreamy veldt]

If I get hit while I'm under 40 I'm just dead

Uhhh

[tawny imp]

i like ares lifesteal earlier in runs if i need a crutch

sometimes i just get an ares boon with no important takes and it helps a lot on the first 2 regions if i fall low with strength

[dreamy veldt]

https://imgur.com/a/eiScNU1

[ornate frost]

If you're not at high fear, Strength and Death are close enough that it generally comes down to personal preference (I personally like Strength more, but others like Death more and are just as valid). At high fear though (like 50+ probably), Death is generally just going to be an overall safer option, especially since at that point Vow of Scars hurts Strength more than Death.

[junior dome]

does boosted ignition work well with medea?
for example does your special buff your attacks the moment you use it so they benefit from +15power when that special connects and triggers them? or not until AFTER your special finishes casting? does the +15 apply to all attacks or just the first that detonates?

[dreamy veldt]

Yeah I didn't end up taking any damage so it did absolutely nothing

[surreal hazel]

it works the same way it does with the other aspects

medea still has a regular skull throw attack, it's just that the skull is told to stick to Mel when fired and to have a longer fuse time

when you smack into enemies with it to detonate it, it's the same as a mel/persephone skull attack colliding with an enemy

the extra velocity on boosted ignition obviously doesn't do much on Medea, but that's about it for differences

you dash/special, the next attack you fire is boosted

[junior dome]

next attack you use? so if you load 5 attacks, special into someone, they all detonate with no buff, then the next atttack you load gets +15?

[surreal hazel]

yes

[junior dome]

glad i just took +2 shells

[surreal hazel]

errr, boosted ignition was the better choice, easily

stop overloading medea, just use one and special constantly, it's much better

[junior dome]

ahhh, cool, ill try that for a bit

i put aphro on attack, dunno if that was the call

[surreal hazel]

it's fine

normally the trick is to have blitz/hitch going

[junior dome]

and i imagine into poly i'll be doing a lot of overlaoding, because i wanna get in and out

ok, spec is still open, may go for zeus on that

[surreal hazel]

if you can proc origination with your aattack and special, you get the easiest origination proc going

[dreamy veldt]

I never even thought about just loading one each time until I watched someone else play it

[surreal hazel]

Heaven Flourish is an excellent choice on medea

[dreamy veldt]

Now I just faceroll, as god intended

[junior dome]

loading just one attack then dashing probably works way better with blitz flourish 🤔

[surreal hazel]

if the attack adds a curse then blitz will always have origination benefitting it

(or take glamour gain, in your case)

[dreamy veldt]

I never thought I would find plinking useful in another video game but here we are

[hidden wind]

chat should i settle for iotic gain on a charon build? i barely touch it but it feels extremely prime heavy

[surreal hazel]

ionic gain?

[hidden wind]

its a common lvl 4 so its not getting better

[hidden wind]

zeus mana regen

[surreal hazel]

That doesn't prime anything

[hidden wind]

sorry misspoke
very prime heavy as in it needs a very high max mana

i keep calling max mana prime for some reason

[surreal hazel]

that's a confusing thing to get mixed up, lol

definitely works better with more max cap, yeah

[hidden wind]

it is
the idea of "oh this is my prime when it comes to my magic capacity, my peak" just popped up an di kinda ran iwth that

[hidden wind]

any advise on how much max i should persue?

[surreal hazel]

eh

feel it out as you're going

[hidden wind]

fair

i guess ill hjave to base it on how much i consume for 7 seconds

[surreal hazel]

it'd be nice to not use it at all in a room, but yeah

[junior dome]

yeah, over time i started to realize that aphro gain was good just for this purpose (not to mention damage reduction)

same with +x seconds freeze on demeter, huge for origination uptime

[surreal hazel]

ionic gain will always recharge faster than you need it, so rarity and poms barely do anything

[surreal hazel]

Actually not relevant for that

the thaw state counts for origination and it's 10 seconds counting from when freeze is applied

but ignore my nitpickiness, cold storage is good

and it makes her legendary more reliable, as well as at least 3 duos

[junior dome]

thaw state counts for origination
😮

https://tenor.com/view/sealyx-naked-gun-the-naked-gun-facepalm-facepalm-meme-gif-11743768702765397589

[surreal hazel]

obviously all demeter curses can't stack with each other for origination, it needs to be two different olympian curses

[hidden wind]

?

[junior dome]

didn't realize she had multiple curses

[surreal hazel]

Chill and freeze are different

chill is caused by Frigid Rush and Arctic Gale and slows enemies down, Freeze just stops them (or significantly slows them)

[junior dome]

oh gust

i thought that was just pure dps

[surreal hazel]

nah, they just tickle enemies... until you get Air Quality online, where it's loldamage

[silent crow]

gusts do good damage at high rarity

[surreal hazel]

hardly the reason you're taking the boon though

[rain wagon]

High rarity + pom levels (Jeweled Pom) and they hurt

[surreal hazel]

gale is great because it layers a curse onto a cast that could also be doing a curse, instaorigination

and both gusts halve enemy projectile speeds

[rain wagon]

It sure can be, at around 60 fear, with certain aspects, you really notice those gust boons, if only for Wards clear, but also the area damage.

[surreal hazel]

oh yeah, it just removes vow of wards, sure

[ornate frost]

Gale is great because she gives me dodge chance and blocks attacks for me

[surreal hazel]

slap

[rain wagon]

O.o

Yes, we were talking about Gale, the pet.

[surreal hazel]

Gale, not Gale

[rain wagon]

😛

[ornate frost]

Isn't the secondary Demeter curse called "Gust"?

[surreal hazel]

arctic gale causes it, so it's confusing

and internally it's called "LegacyChill" since it's a retooling of the hades 1 Chill effect

which is why I call it chill

[ornate frost]

Question about wards actually: does the game count the damage you do but then simply nullify it postcalc? Or rather, to get to my actual question: if I apply Blitz with a strike, and my next strike would normally deal more than 120 damage but deals nothing because of the ward, can said strike still activate Blitz?

[night furnace]

Anyone have a favorite Aspect of Circe build? Quickly discovering how much I like the style and deciding which direction to go with it. I've been running Storm Ring but considering alternatives

[surreal hazel]

yeah, the full damage numbers are calculated for ward hits

[ornate frost]

The most popular Circe builds focus on either Storm Ring (Zeus) or Scorch Ring (Hestia) I believe

[surreal hazel]

your blitz example literally only matters for Rivals Cerb though

[ornate frost]

It was more to satisfy curiosity than for practical application

[night furnace]

I did see that. Was going to try Hestia on cast because I really like her boons

[surreal hazel]

Her legendary gets sillier still with Circe

but also Apollo's supernova is great

but if you want to go full memestrat, play for glorious disaster on circe

[ornate frost]

Apollo pairs really well with any Circe build, yeah

[surreal hazel]

if you get air quality going on glorious disaster, then you get +3000 damage plus whatever the cast and omega would do

[ornate frost]

Speaking of Apollo-Circe: does Lucid Gain doubleproc? I think I recall seeing it did but wanted to make sure I didn't make that up

[night furnace]

Yeah I'm writing up my next build and it's got quite a bit of Apollo already

[surreal hazel]

not sure, hard to actually need tha tmuch in one go

[ornate frost]

I often go magickless on Circe unless I get a bunch of strong o-cast boons anyways, so it often doesn't matter, but as with earlier: mostly asking out of curiosity / a desire to better understand game mechanics, than for true practical application

[surreal hazel]

not sure

depends if the boon is written to only look at Mel's own cast or any cast

I know it doesn't repeat-proc on a momus repeating pulse

[ornate frost]

In general though I think Momus pulses aren't coded as another instance of an o-attack/special/cast though, right? Like they don't proc stuff like Fine Line or Ocean Swell again either, for instance

Though that said I know that Momus echoes do repeat some things and I don't always remember which they do and which they don't

[surreal hazel]

but they do cause a tick of the cast effects

it's a single tick cast that instantly detonates

or something like that

[night furnace]

I think I'll do the Cerce build with Hestia on Cast, Apollo for all the extra fun, maybe Zeus for Blitz on attack for the duo boon? Then maybe the Heph special that explodes?

[ornate frost]

I do think if you're focusing on Hestia Cast, it could be good for one of the four core gods to be Aphro for the duo

[night furnace]

ah for the scorch not diminishing? I like that

[surreal hazel]

does mean you're relying on glamour gain to maintain weakness

because well, passion rush isn't exactly good at it

[night furnace]

I think so, or the rush but it's harder to do

[surreal hazel]

depends how deep in you are, but there's always the burning island setup

Needs posideon

[opal pecan]

Glamour Gain + Island Getaway?

Plus the Burning Desire ig

[surreal hazel]

and Burning Desire

basically you go around spreading scorch on everything and leave them to burn while you spread more scorch

[tawny imp]

ok yeah i see the vision with anubis now

it just creates a giant zone where everything dies instantly

[night furnace]

Do we want Pyro Technique on the cast with a Cerce build or no?

[surreal hazel]

if you get burning desire, absolutely positively yes

otherwise it's not that imporant

[opal pecan]

Pyro Technique is almost always nice to have

[surreal hazel]

assuming your only source of scorch is smoldering

[spiral wadi]

usually i get pyro anyway esp now that scorch cast double applies

[ornate frost]

I think you generally want Pyro Technique for any build where you want scorch dealing a decent amount of damage, and not just to proc Origination

[tawny imp]

yeah its only bad if you have freezer burn right

or air quality

[surreal hazel]

it can also mess with origination procs by burning it away too fast

air quality doesn't apply to scorch

[spiral wadi]

honestly that's a skill issue just have more procs

[surreal hazel]

(any more)

[night furnace]

Do boons that increase cast damage (Ordinary Chasm) affect regular casts with say Scorch from Hestia? Or only when cast as omega?

[surreal hazel]

Chasm affects cast damage, but doesn't affect smolder ring

there was a time in EA when it did and it was silly

[silent crow]

stabbing rush lowk goated

[surreal hazel]

Chasm says "Casts", meaning normal and omega is affected

[night furnace]

But a regular cast isn't doing damage right?

[surreal hazel]

not without a boon on top

[opal pecan]

If you Glowing Coal for example, I believe that counts as cast damage

[surreal hazel]

but take like, Storm ring, those lightning strikes are cast damage

yes, glowing coal and lightning lance are themselves cast damage

[night furnace]

ah ok yeah that makes sense

[surreal hazel]

(And olympian damage)

[meager wadi]

just unlocked supay and shiva so anyone got a lil rundown on what boons are good for both?

assuming high% atk for shiva and lots of magik gain and throw a curse on the special, gameplay loop is just Ospecial Oattack?

and for supay i got no idea

[surreal hazel]

Supay's base damage is looow but you get a lot of hits out constantly

[viral yew]

For Shiva you want apollo attack apollo special, curse on cast and sprint

[surreal hazel]

You want good curses like blitz and hitch

[dreamy veldt]

Got Hephaestus legendary which let's Persephone randomly give up to +9 levels!

......but it was at the end of the summit

[viral yew]

Use one ospecial, charge up the oattack while it bounces, and then hit whichever unfortunate enemy is in your way

[meager wadi]

ya i was gonna ask if i should actually try to get max stacks or just use it per special

[surreal hazel]

Oh and nexus rush on supay is incredible

[viral yew]

Never go for max stacks, takes too long and not worth it, unless you're in the prom memory game or smth

[uneven palm]

Yes, you get double magic back with Lucid Gain on Circe

[meager wadi]

and for supay is the atk boons probably pos/hestia kind of stuff

[surreal hazel]

yeah that jazz

[meager wadi]

keep oatk and ospecial uptime i assume

[edgy nacelle]

yup
hestia poseidon zeus all have lots of good boons for supay.
hera sprint is also very funny for room clear lol, but not great for bossing.
romantic spark (aphro zeus duo) goes hard

[surreal hazel]

special more importantly, but it dependson the build

[viral yew]

Supay is a vessel for Olympian damage, rather than doing any damage itself

[edgy nacelle]

personally I often end up with a build where I mostly ignore omegas on supay but it rly depends, you have options 🤷

[surreal hazel]

Also an origination machine since you can be using your cast/rush at the same time as your attack and special just doing what they want

[meager wadi]

what hammers are good for supay? does the auto fire gain benefits from those?

[surreal hazel]

auto fire still cares for attack speed

it's still an attack

[runic pollen]

I'm using shield. Right now I have Dyonisus' boon on my special (epic), but I have the option to switch to Artemis' special (heoric) right now, should I do that?

I'm very new to the game

[surreal hazel]

but hidden helix feels like one of the best choices

[runic pollen]

oh wait

[surreal hazel]

You are in the wrong category

[runic pollen]

wrong channel

[runic pollen]

my bad!

[dreamy veldt]

Oh wow, ur Prom was uhhhh

Hard

[edgy nacelle]

rivals or normal

[dreamy veldt]

Rivals

It was cool though

[edgy nacelle]

also “the morrigang” HELL YEAH 🗡️

[dreamy veldt]

But wow the memory game is 1000% harder now 😂

[edgy nacelle]

it IS lol
it’s kind of fun tho imo if you were good at the base memory game since it adds a challenge and you can damage heracles during it
but it’s one of the harder fights in the game for sure I’d say

[dreamy veldt]

Now I have 3 more unrivaled bosses

[edgy nacelle]

also a lot of people choose to focus on one boss or the other during it, but ppl disagree on who…? I like to focus prom, but other ppl want to get the melee over with

[dreamy veldt]

Don't tell me what they are

[edgy nacelle]

enjoy :D and good luck with them when you get there

[dreamy veldt]

Ty

[viral yew]

Bouta start a turf war

[dreamy veldt]

That run was a lot more stressful

Going into Typhon with one dd instead of 4

https://imgur.com/a/KYwmCMB

This server has made me realize how inept I am at finding and sending gif embeds

Took me 8 minutes to get it correctly

[surreal hazel]

Spoilers, it's Cerberus, Chronos and Typhon

[dreamy veldt]

https://tenor.com/RxMd.gif

[austere trail]

special appearance with scylla and the sirens

[surreal hazel]

For all of those, bosses, yes

[edgy nacelle]

scylla is just really good at networking
so many guest artists

[austere trail]

tbh I probably shouldn't go naming random fights because you might actually not like it lol

[edgy nacelle]

I so badly want artemis to sing a scylla song in the crossroads and for Mel to complain but then also know every lyric and the full harmony if you make her duet it….

cottagecore witchy huntress cover of I Am Gonna Claw

[opal pecan]

Eris standing with her back against a wall like a Medic in a Highlander match I swear to god

[dreamy veldt]

Rook a chaos curse that damages me for attacking

While playing skull

And I had to fight unrivaled Hecate with it

[edgy nacelle]

oof
special spam time I guess
which aspect? do you have a damaging cast?

[meager wadi]

what are best shiva hammers?

[opal pecan]

Man, I think I just can't fw the zipping around on skulls lol, this build melted Typhon but I kept running around like a chicken with its head cut off in normal encounters

[edgy nacelle]

same
reasons I suck at medea tbqh

[opal pecan]

...yeah it was Medea haha

I literally waste more time trying to recover my positioning than I save from the heavy hits lmao

[dreamy veldt]

Finally echo gave me something funny

I have level 30 Zeus revenge

[silent crow]

that is like. so bad

[dreamy veldt]

Might get hit and do 3000 damage

[silent crow]

big might

[dreamy veldt]

Oh wow

Unrivaled Cerberus

That was crazy

I very much died

[opal pecan]

Did you do 3000 damage revenge to him

[dreamy veldt]

No!

Ok I might have to try if I wanna win that fight

(try in the sense of not auto click Persephone for every run)

Though I won't lie I don't really know how I'm supposed to play that fight, kinda just seems like everywhere is the danger zone

You could say...the floor is lava

[silent crow]

you hafv to wait for one danger zone to clear, then dash into it from another danger zone that will clear later

[dreamy veldt]

Unfortunate

Are any particular weapons better for it

[sick lodge]

I feel like every fight is easier with a ranged weapon

[dreamy veldt]

I feel it doesn't even matter cause bro takes up the whole screen anyway

[sick lodge]

Are you playing with frenzy too? I feel like it gets significantly harder with frenzy (same with everything else though)

[dreamy veldt]

Uhhh

I don't remember actually

Yes frenzy 1

But I can easily ditch it

[sick lodge]

Frenzy is especially brutal if you don't know the attack patterns

[dreamy veldt]

Yeah makes sense

Shadow debt it is

It's been a while since I've felt this discouraged lol, usually if I lose i just wanna immediately go back and get my revenge but rn I'm thinking like this might be my ceiling

[silent crow]

nah it aint

[dreamy veldt]

Should I try Persephone again or something else

[obtuse willow]

Keep at it, that ceiling will raise

I’ve found the most success starting with zags keepsake and setting myself up early. Then pushing god keepsakes for a certain build or using the gold one from chronos

[dreamy veldt]

I've been doing pom into card with Persephone

[harsh prism]

Is it a crazy take to say scylla rivals is the hardest boss? I think she has killed me the most followed by Prom

[dreamy veldt]

Otherwise I start with card

[dreamy veldt]

Yeah probably

[signal coral]

its known to be one of the hardest fights on frenzy 2

[dreamy veldt]

Oh lol frenzy2 players

[signal coral]

most top players consider rivals 4 chronos to be harder though I think

but scylla is probably the second hardest fight for underworld

[dreamy veldt]

That's very interesting, but only in frenzy2?

[signal coral]

well all the fights are a lot easier without frenzy 2

[harsh prism]

That's fair I havent unlocked EM4

[obtuse willow]

Frenzy isn’t bad you just have to adjust to it. But once you do.. it’s just how you play

[dreamy veldt]

Well no I mean, is Scylla still considered harder than Cerberus if no frenzy

Unrivaled versions

[sick lodge]

I reckon so

[obtuse willow]

Hard yes. Or at least more annoying.

[harsh prism]

At least by Cerberus you can have a build online usually to blow him up or tank it

[sick lodge]

Ngl the power jump for unrivaled Hecate was pretty significant too

[harsh prism]

Scylla if you get unlucky and can't blow up tentacles it's a miserable fight

[sick lodge]

But I assume I'm just used to fighting her now

[harsh prism]

I found Hecate not too bad

[sick lodge]

Killing the drummer on rivals Scylla is annoying

[signal coral]

typically yes

[dreamy veldt]

Interesting

[rare ermine]

Can i get tips on how to dodge rivals typhon tongue slams?

Or should i just run away to the other side of the arena

[signal coral]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1051942150025269309/1429376521021427732/Hades_II_-_2025-10-19_12-51-23_AM.mp4?ex=690907df&is=6907b65f&hm=f7d544fbd8b1b634b7ec5dc28bb4ebbf91929e2879b62411204b127d0c3d7000&

Or you can just hide in a corner

Video from red, its not my gameplay

[indigo badger]

cant belive i made a build so bad with supay that it went full circle into being a good idea

[obtuse willow]

Literally every supay success I’ve had

[austere trail]

that looks sick as hell but I'm a fan of the "hide in a corner" strat

[rare ermine]

Dang how am i supposed to do this on frenzy2

Back to the grind

[indigo badger]

the idea was to use the fact that you dont really need to wait between Oattacks and Ospecials, thus you can spam them in what is ecencailly a magick sink, the payoff being fine line and ocean swell

[signal coral]

That video is frenzy 2

The easier thing to do is just hide in a corner tbh

But that might not always be possible

[dreamy veldt]

What weapon can carry me the hardest into ur cerberus

[signal coral]

So its good to know how to actually dodge the move too

[signal coral]

Whatever you are best at

[rare ermine]

Exactly!! How am I supposed to do it
Person in the video did it perfectly

[indigo badger]

managed to get flood gain on epic, then proceeded to basically have 6 seconds where I can just spam Omegas like they are free (they are) to a point its worryingly effective

[signal coral]

Stronger weapons are obviously easier but at most levels skill and experience with the weapon is a lot more important

[signal coral]

Practice

[dreamy veldt]

I'm gonna try Mel axe then

But question is do I wanna go for fw or no

[rare ermine]

The grind 😔

[signal coral]

I think mel axe is flexible enough that fw is not a problem

Dont need gain, can use any % attack

(Hopefully not ares attack but its workable)

[dreamy veldt]

I just always pray for Aphrodite Demeter duo with that weapon and was trying to decide if I want to try rerolling for it or leaving it up to the fates

[obtuse willow]

It’s good with anything if you build right

[dreamy veldt]

But my default is generally fw

[signal coral]

Aphro dem duo isn't that good

[obtuse willow]

Well and if upgraded

[dreamy veldt]

It's just a personal preference

[signal coral]

If it shows up its fine but its not worth gunning for

[dreamy veldt]

But noted

Hmm

Unfortunately I think this is gonna be a trial and error/comes with practice thing

But I hate error

[obtuse willow]

Accept the error as part of the process haha

[dreamy veldt]

I haven't done that in life yet so don't hold your breath

[rare ermine]

I’m doing frenzy2 rivals4 pain2 thanatos surface

[obtuse willow]

It’s a hard shell to break out of. You’ll see more success in games like this though trying stuff out not expecting to succeed every time!

[rare ermine]

That hermes boon that reduces shot speed carried me so hard

[dreamy veldt]

I guess I'll try fw

And when I lose I'll cry and then try no fw

[obtuse willow]

What does fw mean? Dumb moment

[rare ermine]

Fates whim?

[obtuse willow]

Did you get through the early game without losing at all? If so, that’s pro af lol

[obtuse willow]

Sounds right lol

[sudden belfry]

tips for supay?

[obtuse willow]

Ignore the buff to rush boons unless you get a good one 😳

[sudden belfry]

i hear poseidons is good, is that true?

[obtuse willow]

I prefer his boon on attack or special with supay since they automatically hit. But his rush is okie

[sudden belfry]

mm, how about hestia?

[silent crow]

hestia sprint? its aight
shes better on atk/spc

[obtuse willow]

Haven’t personally had any success making her rush boon do much.. but maybe it can lol

[sudden belfry]

gotcha

whats the best rush for it then

[silent crow]

zeus probably, but dont focus on it

[sudden belfry]

gotcha

[silent crow]

invest in flat damage on atk special itll do more

[sudden belfry]

i have hestia atk rn, is that okay

[silent crow]

ya

[sudden belfry]

oh i meant special ooos
should i do pos atk for their duo

[ornate frost]

Honestly you can always get both Poseidon Rush and Poseidon Attack/Special and shoot for the legendary

[dire shell]

Is metallic droplet any good?

[ornate frost]

I hear Supay drops off at higher fear, but at the very least I can personally confirm that up to 32F, Poseidon Supay is perfectly viable and tons of fun

[obtuse willow]

True! Sucks that most rush boons just feel kinda bad though

Like I was so excited getting that aspect

I’ll still be trying more though lol

Well, more combos to possibly make the less good ones work anyways

[ornate frost]

One thing that's really nice about Supay is that you can devote a lot more of your mental load to just dodging since you don't really have to worry about pressing the attack or special buttons. My first blind run of Rivals Chronos was a Supay run and I think part of why I was able to win it was because I could just focus on running around and dodging lol

[silent crow]

most rush boons arent bad just not built around constant use

[obtuse willow]

Yeah. Agreed!

Having a build around it would be.. fun though

[ornate frost]

Genuinely I think Supay is one of the most fun aspects in the game; and seeing "rush" in the victory screen having contributed 200k-300k damage is hilarious

[obtuse willow]

And when i found out the aspect didn’t reaaaally allow that as I thought it did at first I was just sad. But it’s fun in other ways

[rare brook]

I need to learn how to not take much dmg during Prometheus - Heracles fight with frenzy 2 activated

[obtuse willow]

Just lots of dodging, focusing him, and a good build really

[rare brook]

Better to focus Prome or Heracles?

[obtuse willow]

I prefer focusing Heracles but to each their own

[dreamy veldt]

No but I'm not supposed to lose anymore unless it's 20+ fear!!

[uneven palm]

Prometheus. Heracles is much worse in his back half IMO

[obtuse willow]

Why’s that? Are you supposed to be one of these…goddesses I hear so much about?

[dreamy veldt]

I just don't like failure

I at least know with a game like this though that for the first big chunk you're supposed to repeatedly lose so that's fine

But now it's like

Wrong

[graceful dragon]

I know they reassigned the Chronos unpause to Rivals only, but what happened to the incantation that let you pause?
I already had it unlocked in Early Access, but now it's not working.

I did do the story reset, but the rest of the incantations should still be active

[spark crown]

howling soul sucks why do i have yo stand still to use the damn thing

[opal pecan]

You do?

[spark crown]

mhm it stops all momentum aswell T_T

so you cant even slide to move a littl

unless you are moving god speed

[spiral wadi]

yea it's not as free as normal cast unfortunately

[opal pecan]

Huh, here I thought I was just Pressing Keys Rong

[ornate frost]

The earlier convo got me in the mood for a Supay run and it's honestly even more fun than I remembered https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/766380795576188969/1434716124351828119/image.png?ex=69095703&is=69080583&hm=9361e284c29e3e1f07bfc0ae449494b3edf86c9ba5ad30dc5eb2d4888656040e&=&format=webp&quality=lossless&width=1522&height=856

Having the majority of damage come from the little lava puddles that Hestia sprint leaves behind is just stupid fun

By the time I was in Oceanus I only ever pressed two buttons in combat for the entire rest of the run: Sprint and sometimes Cast

[obtuse willow]

Got me wanting to do it now… I’m glad you had fun 😂

Literally might just restart

[bronze flax]

Ok, never again taking Zeus's boon that allows you to aim your cast, it feels so slow that I got timed out before arriving Prom... With Time 2

That and also use Aspect of Momus better

[obtuse willow]

Just tapping it and having it ranged is nice

[opal pecan]

The Zeus one? But that's instant

[dire shell]

Can I equip the experimental hammer in act 2 and keep the hammer all the way?

[rare brook]

Yeah, tested that and removing Prometheus first makes combat easier

[opal pecan]

What rank is your EH?

[spark crown]

https://imgur.com/KP1ePjp

how does this work with scars?

is it normaly 100%

[dire shell]

3. I use in region 3 often cuz it’s fun and often stroooong

[spark crown]

https://imgur.com/B2FdnsH end of region 1 and ive already exausted a god T-T

turns out aphro with no strike on axe is very bad T-T

gave it up for lvl 4 heroic rapture ring

[opal pecan]

Yes, it's normally 100%

[opal pecan]

If you take it for region 2, I don't think you're guaranteed it'll last, depending on your routing?

[dire shell]

Oh I see. So if you avoid fights and whatnot it can?

[opal pecan]

I'm not 100% sure whether you can, but I'm fairly sure that it's possible to run out

Cos every single reward claim in Fields counts as a separate encounter

[junior dome]

are multiple +x% max health boons additive or multiplicative?

[spark crown]

ive seen the light for engraved pin i shall now ascend

[junior dome]

also, does collosus driver on Hel mean i get damage reduction while its flying?

[spark crown]

GIVING CHIRIBDIS SHADOWS IS A WAR CRIME

[spiral wadi]

true

[dire shell]

Is Proper Upbringing better than it seems? It seems both expensive AND very underwhelming

[austere trail]

I've found it relatively easy to get the necessary elements since getting the greatest gift of gaia

[obtuse willow]

I mean..ask Zeus and all his kids that hate him how good proper upbringing is ;p

[austere trail]

and some boons, especially if pommed, work pretty well when rarified

[opal pecan]

Proper Upbringing ain't really that expensive compared to some of the others imo, but yeah, GGG helps

[dire shell]

Yeah… but is it… good? I find I often don’t have many commons

[austere trail]

upgrading rarities is always a good idea
for example if you have common nitro boost, then you now get two free hits per encounter

[tawny imp]

rare nimble boon + 30% faster attack hammer on nergal 🔥

[austere trail]

but if you don't have many common boons and the ones you do have don't really benefit from upgrading to rare, then no need to pick it over something else important

[tawny imp]

this might be the run i finally take queens ransom

using hera attack

[spark crown]

whats best god for aspect of pan

gonna try and roll exceptional talent

[glass bone]

The best thing for Pan is Trick Knives. So ideally you want Zeus or Hera special

Mel Blades and Artemis may have escaped that stigma, but imo, Pan is TK the aspect still…

Even though yes you can clear 62 Fear without TK and without JPom

[spark crown]

🔥

[tawny imp]

Zeus

[spark crown]

i will never remove my baby jpom

[tawny imp]

Fun fact this actually applies for every aspect

[flint widget]

except charon

[austere trail]

idk for charon

[glass bone]

Charon is an exception

[tawny imp]

Ok I don’t run Charon and also it was mild hyperbole but yeah

[austere trail]

another reason why charon is the goat. reject blitz supremacy

[flint widget]

if i saw zeus instead of apollo poseidon or ares i would crash out lowk

[glass bone]

Oh also Shiva for the Omega strategy.

But high fear still probably wants Zeus

[flint widget]

but ngl charon feels kinda slow tbh

[bronze flax]

So, update, it turns out I was bad with the build 💀

[flint widget]

like it's powerful ik but the channel time tho

maybe i just don't get it idk

[spark crown]

damn tk is super good on pan T-T

[flint widget]

tk should be base kit for pan ngl

[fallow holly]

What weapon [not aspect] do we reccomend for 32+ fear runs

[viral yew]

Staff

[vernal quiver]

Staff yeah

[spark crown]

ok hera tk pan is op af

[fallow holly]

alr staff it is

[spark crown]

axe fr :P

[vernal quiver]

Or flames they're also all pretty strong

But staff is disgustingly consistent

[viral yew]

Axe can suck it

[obtuse willow]

Whatever you’re best with

[vernal quiver]

True 32f anything works easily

[ornate frost]

Whatever grave thirst lands on tbh

[flint widget]

any weapon any aspect and jpom that shi

[spark crown]

apollo sprint or cast size (with lvl 4 jpom) on aspect of pan

i took cast size

time for mel coat

[viral yew]

COAT GANG

[opal pecan]

HELL YEAH MEL YEAH

[viral yew]

Join the Coat Gang

[spark crown]

mel coat and apollo sprint must hit the speed cap very quick huh

[bronze flax]

There is a Chaos trial with that and I can confirm that in fact, it is speeeeeeeed

[opal pecan]

I've been here the whole time

[viral yew]

You gotta do the server nickname thing

[bronze flax]

Now I am curious to see if there is a gang for every weapon lol

[opal pecan]

LMAO

[viral yew]

Nah, just us