h2-builds-and-combat

[tall notch]

theres no way it eats more magick than omegaspam anubis right

if i dont click cut above too early

[brave dove]

cut above is so delicious though...

[tough pasture]

i remember there used to be someone here who stanned for eos aspect. is that user still here?

What's a good build combination for eos? i imagine zeus is a must, no? (preferably attack, right?)

What's a good olympian for the special? hera? ares? maybe hestia?

[uneven palm]

Any of those are good specials or Zeus or Poseidon. Hera or Apollo real good on attack

The daybreaker pulses hit for like 150? You want a +% on it.

Weed Killer is a nice-to-have. “Clean” hammers are best probably. Night arcana is also good since you’re doing O attack then O special

[tough pasture]

@uneven palm thanks. somehow zeus on attack doesn't feel as strong as I was expecting. I didn't quite realize the pulse was doing so much damage. you're right that % builds on pulse would be better.

[hot tendon]

What sources are best for boon info and prerequisites?

[brazen ore]

the codex?

[sterile portal]

did aspect of pan used to be a lot better or do i just have higher standards now?? i remember a while ago it used to be one of my insta-win weapons but i just died from vow of time level 2 because of how low the dps was, and its been a really slow damage dealer in general in my last couple runs with it

i dont think ive ever had a problem with time level 2 on any other weapon

[uneven palm]

It’s been nerfed a lot. Like Poseidon doesn’t work as well on special and they lock you in place while firing O specials.

[tough pasture]

aspect of pan is definitely weaker now...especially with scorch getting nerfed.

[uneven palm]

To be clear, Scorch is still greatly buffed from prior patches, especially on specials. Probably that’s the play on Pan now

[tough pasture]

@uneven palm

(because it worked beautifully on eos), I hav a question about pan aspect and the zeus/demeter duo boon with demeter special:

does each arrow trigger an instance of the lighting strike if i have demeter on special? Because if it does, THEN WELCOME BACK rama pre-nerf special from hades 1!

[uneven palm]

No, Hail Storm just triggers bolts on a timer while they’re frozen. Your weapon has nothing to do with it other than maybe applying Freeze

[sudden ledge]

So how exactly does Nightspawn work?

[arctic fable]

You've got to sprint while holding spacebar

Then it like gives you attackspeed or damage or somefin like that

[sudden ledge]

Gotcha

I wanna make Coat work so bad because it's so cool but kinda ass 😭

[arctic fable]

I think it's decent

Trying to get Shiva right now, last hidden aspect

[uneven palm]

After hitting something with an Omega sprint, your attacks/specials spawn bonus punches/missiles that do reduced damage. So lotta hits and this patch they can now all correctly apply on-hit effects like Scorch or Waves

Nyx pretty good this patch IMO

[sudden ledge]

Oh that's sick actually

[uneven palm]

Just rain Scorch over the entire room

[arctic fable]

Already got Hel, Nergal, Morrigan, Anubis and Supay

Just Need SHIVA

[ocean ibex]

how does nyx deal with single target damage?

[arctic fable]

I hate Selene

I think she's a waste of a boon but that's just my opinion

Like she's OK in certain builds but I personally hate her

[sudden ledge]

You said that just as I finished nuking Charon like ten times every minute with my Nyx build lmao

[arctic fable]

She does look slay tho

Wait

You can fight Charon?

[ocean ibex]

with what, just spamming the bong?

[arctic fable]

Tell me your secrets...

[sudden ledge]

Chronos

[ocean ibex]

no, you cannot fight charon

[arctic fable]

Ohhhhhhhhhhh

[sudden ledge]

Always get their names mixed up

[arctic fable]

Nevermind

[sudden ledge]

I would never nuke skelebro

[arctic fable]

Me neither

But I loved the borrowing mechanic in Hades 1

It was just peak cinema

Cuz he beat my ass every time

[sudden ledge]

Fight was fun as hell too

[arctic fable]

https://tenor.com/view/me-atrapaste-es-cine-its-cinema-cinema-esto-es-cine-gif-17729711691959966457

[civic salmon]

is there anyway to spam omega specials with autofire now?

[past salmon]

So like

Omega boost does weirdly high damage and most of my runs tend to just get beach ball which is also pretty great

[elfin forge]

fr?

[past salmon]

And then just flat damage soup build

[ocean ibex]

300 base right?

[elfin forge]

weird

[past salmon]

Yeh

[ocean ibex]

what the hell and hell is a soup build

[elfin forge]

what cores do you aim for on nyx?

I was going like, hestia spec, apollo atk, and then some other stuff

[past salmon]

Just stacking flat damage
Like Waves/Static Shock/Blitz etc

[past salmon]

Pos Attack start still seems best

[ocean ibex]

ooo okay

[elfin forge]

whoa

does nightspawn cause any issues with the waves ICD?

[past salmon]

No cuz waves icd isn't a real icd

There is specifically listed moves that have an icd and then it just doesn't exist for other weapons/moves

[elfin forge]

I thought it was like, a cd between hits of a single attack

[elfin forge]

lol that's messed up

[past salmon]

Like you can stack Hel up to 8 billion% attack speed and still get a wave proc on every attack

[elfin forge]

I was thinking that was because every shot is counted as a separate attack

while Pan ospec was like a bunch of ticks of a single attack

but if it's all individually coded then 🤷

[past salmon]

Dagger O-Special, Coat dash attack and Morrigans full combo are the most relevant ones I can remember that have an icd

[ocean ibex]

do you have a nyx vod, foolish? (like a recent one)

[elfin forge]

how does anubis atk work with waves? I've heard it's real bad

[ocean ibex]

i have a really hard time understanding like, how to play basically any coat aspect

[past salmon]

No sorry I've been playing hiddens recently probs soon tho it's on my list

[elfin forge]

I've done like, odash into special spam with Hestia for scorch, not sure how that fares or if it's even close to being good

[past salmon]

I still need a sub 6 on the patch for Hel and Nergal and then I'll move onto non-hiddens

[elfin forge]

it was pretty safe and decent dps but it seems like you have a lot of options with nyx

[past salmon]

It mistakenly had an icd I think but I believe(?) it was fixed in the recent patch

[uneven palm]

Naw it’s still real janky. Like sometimes it works perfectly other times no waves at all

[past salmon]

Lovely

[elfin forge]

lemme give it a spin rn

[uneven palm]

Mel and Nyx do special attack attack as a baseline combo. You can attack while missiles are flying. Do an O special to open waves for more missiles. This works on Selene too but there you’d maybe prefer to use Night arcana and do more O attacks to burn magick and activate Skyfall.

[elfin forge]

I tested it, it's one wave per enemy with normal attack. Omega attack can shoot out one wave per tick

[uneven palm]

Try it in another room. In my experience it works for a room and then things get weird

[elfin forge]

wait I can replicate it

dash attack doesn't have multiple waves
attack does

[uneven palm]

I’ve found not even that is reliable

[elfin forge]

I think?

[regal kettle]

aspect of hel omega attack is so fkn slow to activate, no way they expect you to stand still that long

[elfin forge]

no it seems to work

[elfin forge]

why the heck you using hel oattack

[spring raft]

Do I have bad rng, or is anyone else not gotten Seismec Hammer duo boon? 3 runs I've had everything but it doesn't show up from either Poseidon or Heph 😮

[elfin forge]

you need a heph hammer strike boon, and a poseidon cast boon

[regal kettle]

every attack on a hidden aspect should be viable, and theres a whole hammer for it now

[elfin forge]

pretty specific combo

[spring raft]

Yeah I have both of those 😂 . That's the problem

[elfin forge]

weird

[elfin forge]

nah it's consistent enough that I'm gonna call it that

sprinting and then attack counts as a dash attack too

which means... you want to walk around?

[uneven palm]

Maybe that was my problem. Frustrating as heck

[elfin forge]

I'm gonna f10 this lmao

[uneven palm]

Good call I meant to do that

Throw it on the “why do you hate damp uncle????” pile #h2-feedback message

[elfin forge]

people really be so salty about supay's death lol

[spring raft]

Well what do you know. Good old complaining worked . ty for the pointers though o/

[elfin forge]

they're mourning the death of a war criminal who is still out there

[uneven palm]

People just see “my favorite thing was nerfed A LITTLE” and freak out

I see folks complaining that Scorch got nerfed this balance patch and I’m like uhhhh do you understand how good you have it?????

[opaque yoke]

To make Medea’s Skull deal more damage,
should I use attack and cast boons,
or special and cast boons?
Also, does it benefit from effects that increase area of effect?

The mechanics are unique, so I'm not sure which boons actually apply and how they work.

[elfin forge]

Medea Skull is a combo weapon where you click attack and then special. The dash will do a special hit, then an attack explosion. You repeat this over and over.
The most common setup is to put Zeus on Special, and then a powerful boon on Attack(Ares, Aphro, Hera). That way, the special hit will apply blitz, and then the attack explosion will trigger the blitz immediately, resulting in a very potent combo.

For your remaining boons, like Cast and Dash, you will want boons that help with AOE and crowd control. Freeze, Gust, Hitch, Daze, and Weaken are all going to be helpful.

[quaint mauve]

does anubis tick damage scales with strike speed in any way?

i've tested it with hephaestus and it procs its attack once per cast, even if it ticks again

[past salmon]

yeh I mean its literally still a top 5 aspect at bare minimum lmao

[elfin forge]

nope

[spiral wadi]

is it known if incandescent aura considers magick recovery that goes past the max magick you can get, like if you have 100 max magick and you have 70 left, then get a source that gives 100 magick, does it count for full 100 or only 30

[willow phoenix]

Only 30

It works really well if you have a good way to burn and regen magick super fast

[hollow briar]

Only what you actually Regen. Otherwise imagine Heph's Gain

[spiral wadi]

rough ok

[civic ocean]

been cooking with nergal and it is a lot of fun, have to get better at r4 grandpa but other than that it is giga fun

[wet grove]

nergal is funny, I should do it again with the repeating omega special but actually build into it

[wispy perch]

nergal is kind of bugging me in that it is all such close range

[civic ocean]

It does make chronos hard since you can't just trade with him at high fear

I have to get better at clipping him with the hitboxes but I feel the power of the build for sure

[willow phoenix]

ah night bloomed bomb dude at Rivals Cerberus is bugged, deals 0 damage

another one to the buggy night bloom list

[willow phoenix]

#h2-feedback message
@edgy nacelle Fyi you have to start with Ares keepsake to get Ares Godsent. Your path of stars layout and upgrades is determined on Hex pickup, not the first path of stars you get. Which means for Skyfall it's determined on run start. You can instantly check what your path layout looks like on the boon submenu from the moment the run starts

[tall notch]

Chronos? I'm being gatekept by hecate in high fear Nergal 😭

[fluid onyx]

I did not realise the Chronos attack where you have to stand in that ring shape was also an instant kill. Learn something new every day.

[storm ingot]

how can i select certain aspect? i have them all unlocked and leveled up but i can't select them i just have aspect of pan active

[tall notch]

you come up to where the weapon is floating and press right bumper (on controller, idk what it is for mouse and kb), a menu that lets you pick an aspect should open then

[storm ingot]

oh i see, i was trying to change it in the pool lol, ty ty

[safe kettle]

is air quality just like the best boon in the game?

i feel like it just breaks so many weapons and other boons if you activate it

[tall notch]

it's balanced by the fact that it's tricky to assemble in higher difficulties. 5 air is a steep requirement and then you still need to get the boon

[safe kettle]

isnt the requirement to see it only 3 air?

[tall notch]

I don't know what the req is but the fact remains that you have to gather 5 air to make use of the infusion and if you take it before that it's pretty much a dead boon pick

[safe kettle]

it has a cost but once on its honestly stronger than most other ele infusions

[tall notch]

Getting it on is the hard part when under a time limit 😦

Don't get me wrong I love aq builds but it's very much a meme

[sly plaza]

Man new Selene coat feels kinda dope

I’m a siege platform out here dropping missiles and comets on people

[polar prawn]

so i missed the Unseen Update and only got back for the patch a few days ago

this is nerfed Supay? it still feels pretty nuts

[pseudo pond]

anyone discovered op nergal build yet?

I tried quite a few most of them are kinda meh

[wicked thorn]

how do you guys like to build/play aspect of morrigan (blades)?

[pseudo pond]

hestia on attack, zeus on special, and demeter on cast, get demeter/hestia duo

or, I saw some people use hera on attack or cast

[wicked thorn]

what sorta hammers you look for?

i feel like im just awkward on it so far, feels very different than the aspect of pan which is what i normally play

[willow phoenix]

Apollo for attack is good too, the aoe is huge and apollo legendary can make make chaining triad easier

[pseudo pond]

tbh, doesn't synergize that well with hammer, just get is morrigan ones if you can

and there are some tips on using it

use special apply blitz first, and dash atk while holding atk alpha, then release

you can get some very fast combo to proc the curse damage

[wicked thorn]

got it, ill see if i can try to build that

[pseudo pond]

granted, for me it just doesn't scale that well pass the first two zones on surface

700 damage looks high but it doesn't really scale tbh

[wicked thorn]

im not doing super high fear or anything so shouldnt be a problem

[pseudo pond]

true, still, I think it's an innate problem with hades 2 scaling, but gl

[willow phoenix]

I haven't had any scaling problem with morrigan so far tbh

[pseudo pond]

well, cuz of the boons not really because of the weapon right

777 damage in final stage is kinda a joke

[cloud scarab]

serious question how the hell are you supposed to not get hit by the fireballs on Morrigan againt rival Eris ? The special distance isn't far enough

[pseudo pond]

you can position to kinda gather the fire balls on one side

but need to keep a tap on the timing to dodge before it drops on you

[cloud scarab]

so annoying, the only problem I have with Morrigan

[pseudo pond]

yeah, bullet hell

[willow phoenix]

The bombs she put always follow you, so you can set it up so they chain explode then leave like a cast to pop it

[tall notch]

if you are playing below 40 fear, you can take night, prioritise born gain and alternate between oatk and ospecial. you will be almost permanently berserking and it's nigh-impossible to die in rooms

[pseudo pond]

I see, will get it a try

[tall notch]

also some people like @brave dove will consider this controversial, but taking hordes 3 as some of your vows lowkey makes the build better because its easier to berserk

[pseudo pond]

hmm, interesting, never thought of it

btw, how is surpay's change?

[brave dove]

'I made the game twice as hard but I can berserk more easily' sounds like a really bad trade deal tbh-

[pseudo pond]

haven't tried post rework

[tall notch]

It's fairly powerful but the playstyle is not as smooth as it was

[brave dove]

also doesn't hordes 3 give unrivaled chronos his old miniboss phase back

[pseudo pond]

I see

[brave dove]

double thornspitters upon ye

[pseudo pond]

shame, loved how smooth it used to be

[tall notch]

hear me out--- you will tank more hits but since youre perma berserking you will heal it all off and enter bosses always topped up even with scars 3 pain 3

[tall notch]

yeah but who even runs ur chronos

[brave dove]

not nergal players, that's for sure-

[tall notch]

valid, i did say above that the weapon is only good like below 40f

[brave dove]

I'm doing rivals 4 surface at 32 for reasons that even I don't really understand 😩

[tall notch]

and who is running r4 at 32f unless they actually want things to be harder

are you a masochist by any chance? actually dont answer, i have tried the lance of ares build

[brave dove]

I got babalitied three times last night btw

[brave dove]

yes you have the worst erebus known to man however cerberus evaporates on contact once you actually get there-

[pseudo pond]

any particularly op build post mid patch?

[tall notch]

in my unbiased opinion, nyx coat aiming to start with hestia special and freestyling it from there

[pseudo pond]

really?

[brave dove]

nyx coat is very strong since the Unseen Update

[pseudo pond]

everyone is like crazy for hesia all the sudden, I am not sure how powerful she is without demeter

[brave dove]

like it got the buff it needed and it's now in a really solid spot

poseidon also works for nyx if you prefer

[pseudo pond]

oh, nvm, I was thinking about shiva

[tall notch]

this build in particular wants scorch because nightspawns make nyx really multihit

[pseudo pond]

I see, let me take a look

[tall notch]

hold on-- will every rocket fire off a wave??

[pseudo pond]

any duo boons to watch out for?

[tall notch]

or does the icd kick in

[willow phoenix]

it used to, but dunno about now

[brave dove]

the icd will kick in on ospecial but it doesn't interfere with nightspawn afaik

[tall notch]

freezer burn, hailstorm is really good if you can get it

[pseudo pond]

ah, so the old formula, got it

[tall notch]

i havent really considered poseidon when i realised one nightspawn special can almost cap scorch on someone

[brave dove]

see my theory is hestia attack

because exhaust riser isn't nerfed for hestia

and poseidon on special

[tall notch]

and what next, you start sword hilt for whatever the hell the reason was?

[willow phoenix]

does the special from launcher frame trigger nightspawn?

[brave dove]

you can't get lance of ares otherwise

[tall notch]

just dont get a selene start and artificer into ares room 2, its that easy

[brave dove]

doesn't work

[tall notch]

wait actually? okay thats just awful

[brave dove]

skyfall tree generates at the start of the run you have to start sword hilt

[tall notch]

so you cant even gamble to have a playable build

[brave dove]

it is, to be fair, I think the only thing holding aspect of selene back from being genuinely S-tier and arguably needing nerfs

[pseudo pond]

quick question, haven't really kept up with updates, scrotch had several reworks/buffs now right?

[brave dove]

Lance of Ares once it's rolling is ridiculous paying a price early game for that is fine and even fair I think

[pseudo pond]

how does it work now exactly

[brave dove]

scorch works more or less the same as always but it's 100dps base consumption now

and the application numbers are higher

[tall notch]

its so wild to think of 100 dps scorch when you remember what it was in patch 1 😭 😭 😭

[pseudo pond]

ah, I see

[brave dove]

wasn't it like poseidon tier damage except on a delay

[tall notch]

base scorch was a whooping 40 dps

[brave dove]

yeah that sounds about right

[tall notch]

you actually had to click air quality to make that playable

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4IvsUusSBU this is basically as good as patch 1 scorch gets

[brazen ore]

I gotta watch ur vods for how to play nyx i play it like an idiot

[pseudo pond]

damn

aspect of nyx is crazy

howcome I didn't notice how powerful it was? it used to feel like crap

[brazen ore]

i'll be honest i usually need to see how top players handle aspects before i can really understand their potential bc i'm not really good at figuring out the best attack combos, and i think some aspects really rely on that

[willow phoenix]

They only really buffed it on the Unseen update, Olympian effects used to not work with the Nightspawn

[pseudo pond]

ah, I see

[silent crow]

PT was also the legendary

[tall notch]

it was still a fun playstyle before the unseen update, but it definitely lacked power

[sage flame]

praying for eos buffs on 1.0 🙏

[tall notch]

I still don't really understand why torch regular attack is not allowed to pierce enemies

[glass bone]

So the Medea skull nerf doesn’t matter it seems. I just cleared Surface 32 in my fastest time yet out of Any% Fear AND 32 Fear (17:48.48), and still took about 1000 damage (and went through 5-6 Death Defiances because of Athena). I don’t think I am a terrible player, but despite it being a victory, this feels like a loss.

[sage flame]

it doesn't????

bruh

[tall notch]

it used to before the unseen patch rework and moros still does

[sage flame]

????????

eos prejudice ig

[brave dove]

mel torches... forever forgotten...

[tall notch]

yeah its even worse for mel

at least eos can fire its daybreak and go into special mode, mel actually wants to hold down attack

the only thing mel torch can do is that cheeky build where you stack channel speed so that every other hit is an oattack which still pierces

[silent crow]

is spamming specials rven worth it it seems like u can only get 1 up consistently

[willow phoenix]

the special was changed to be very short duration, so you spam it so it keeps hitting the enemy

since there's no more stupid projectile limit on eos you can also use o spec before spamming special

[tall notch]

you do one ospecial and spam reg special. you also click night and keep up omega combo for dps

[silent crow]

can u even get both the ospec and reg spec to hit at once

[tall notch]

well if you have multiple enemies, one of them can be hit by ospec and one of them by spec. or i think you could hit with both on a big ass boss

[topaz meteor]

Any good Momus builds? I'm struggling to get good dmg with the staff

[tall notch]

hera attack used to be good

[topaz meteor]

Used to? 😅

[tall notch]

i mean ik it was before but with this patch momus got slightly nerfed and im not sure how much it affected the power level. maybe its still good maybe its too slow, would have to test more to give you a definite answer

[willow phoenix]

You can prob still just fish for Apollo legendary with Momus. Like Apollo, Demeter, Ares sounds good for Momus

Last god could be Hera, Pos, Zeus, or Heph

[topaz meteor]

Thank you! Speaking of Ares, what does Wound actually mean? I'm not sure what "strike" refers to, like the normal attack or?

[willow phoenix]

Any hit from attacks or specials, can be normal or Omega. So if you have ares on attack, your attack will proc wound

The way wound works is that it's a bonus damage on an enemy on applying it with a 3sec cd on each enemy.

[topaz meteor]

Thanks got it! That sounds much more powerful than what I initially thought lol

[willow phoenix]

It's pretty powerful, especially with the followup boon Grievous Blow. It gives you 10% chance at base to deal double damage on wounded enemy

For any hit, so it can double damage any damage you have

[topaz meteor]

What about his gain boon? I tried once and it kinda blows, trying not to use hera's born gain all the time lol

[willow phoenix]

his gain kinda sucks at base but can be good if you have a bunch of his other plasma related boons, especially his legendary

[lilac shore]

@tall notch Whats your usual go-to way of playing Nyx? Core-boons, hammers, special/attack-focused. Watched a bit of your 58f run, but struggling a bit to replicate. Would love to get some tips if you have some:)

[tall notch]

click hestia special. early on you kinda wanna use both the spec and the attack, but once you get scorch going most of your damage is likely to be the special. obviously you want all of the hammers that affect regular special. you want to have enough magick to have nightspawn active at pretty much all times -- at the start of the run you dont have to prioritise a gain, but its good to have one by sirens

omega channel speed is good because it affects your sprint, so you want the arcana that gives that and its a really good blessing from hermes/chaos

[safe kettle]

his gain is also good if you dont need it for magicka imo

its meh for magicka but it just gives “free” stats

[lilac shore]

thanks for the input. I guess i missjudged early on in trying to go for attack and replicating a bit of mel coat gameplay (cleared 50f on that).

Doy ou ever use omegaspecial/attack or even go for auto-fire? (ithink i saw some people do that). Thanks for the help @tall notch

[tall notch]

Oh yeah im on autofire, i hold spec and sometimes tap attack

[lilac shore]

alright, will try that out

[tall notch]

have fun!

[safe kettle]

btw i think they changed hestia dash because they knew supay would come, imagine if you could run around immune to projectiles while autofiring at stuff

[brave dove]

I think they changed hestia dash because it was persistently super buggy

[civic ocean]

Apollo start, drop Origination for Excellence or Unseen if you have mana issues, take Night, start Hecuba

Start Apollo attack and look for his dash and one of the other reqs for Exceptional Talent

Take Hera for Born Gain, with Demeter and I guess Zeus as possible backups? The build is insanely mana hungry

I like to get arctic ring from demeter but the only other really important boons are Winner's Circle and Geyser Spout.

The gameplay is just alternating Oatk and Ocast for Night

I am not certain if Geyser Spout and Prominence Flare still exclude each other but if they no longer do the ideal Apollo takes are Nova Strike Prominence Flare Blinding Rush into Exceptional Talent.

If you are playing high fear then Vampiric Cataclysm is busted but otherwise any of the Oattack hammers are insane

[uneven palm]

I'd do O casts too, especially on Momus since it's 3x

[civic ocean]

Yes it's so so much damage with Gspout and Wircle

Like you can go origination if you want but I honestly found it superfluous at 50f during Warsong and I don't think Rivals makes anything like way tankier other than Sirens?

[topaz meteor]

Thanks! I don't think I've ever dropped the Origination arcana lol will be interesting to not look for curses

[civic ocean]

You can try sticking to it if you want but I typically drop both Origination and Boatman when playing underworld and am debating whether or not to keep Boatman on for Surface

The rarity increases for Chaos and Hermes boons help the build out a lot (chaos mana boons and O move speed buffs just sort of break the build(

[uneven palm]

Orig is kinda meh on that aspect yeah. Like once you’ve got like 100%+ on attack/special the 50% additive doesn’t move the needle so much

[civic ocean]

I am sure it would be fine I just find it a bit difficult to trigger it with Apollo and Poseidon as cores and Heph as a defensive god that I often slot 4th

And both Unseen and Excellence are v strong earlygame

[willow phoenix]

Still sad they just moved it to legendary lol. If two Hestia legendaries get demoted to normal boons by 1.0 it'd be funny

[civic ocean]

Hestia legendary was very interesting to me when AQ worked with scorch but now it seems less powerful

In my exp its quite easy to get to 999 scorch dunno about everyone else

[willow phoenix]

Even back then it's still kinda weak since the 400 scorch has a 3 second cd, that is if you even meet a projectile that can be deleted

[civic ocean]

Yes and it having smolder ring as a hard req is also like quite bad

Since if you are going scorch you are often starting hestia and taking strike

So if you are playing denial you can crush your own legendary like half the time

[willow phoenix]

It's not like smolder ring is that good too lol

[civic ocean]

Its quite bad compared to strike and flourish now but its better than it used to be

[uneven palm]

It’s pretty significant damage. Now though you need like epic and a Pom to maintain orig

[spiral wadi]

smolder ring kinda wack when paired with pyro

[brave dove]

well it's a fairly solid cast

[sage flame]

yeah I know they don't wanna "overtune" hestia but it would have been nice to see her cast get a little higher numbers or change how it applies the scorch to ensure origination is more consistent

or hot pot or anything else requiring scorch to be active on an enemy

[tall notch]

I kind of want her to have a cast that's not scorch related, kind of like the "new" sprint

[paper tapir]

i forgot what its called but when u use the item to enhance a boon, if u dont use it and keep going with that item* across stages, it should still activate right? cuz rn ive been using a poseidon item and im not getting a single boon from this guy. no way its just luck moment right

[willow phoenix]

Are you in Thessaly? But yes if it's not used you can still use it again next biome, you can check on the keepsake description if it's used or not

[paper tapir]

i was yes, not a single boon from him lmao

[willow phoenix]

Thessaly is sometimes buggy like that

Honestly dunno why sgg hasn't fixed that yet

[paper tapir]

dang, alright thanks. i really thought i was super unlucky

[brave dove]

it's not a bug sometimes thessaly just doesn't give you a boon

but also the 'prioritise this god' aspect doesn't stick around on god keepsakes

[willow phoenix]

If you don't meet that god at all it still works though

At least last time I tried it

[brave dove]

I think in this case they did already have poseidon, didn't use the rarification but kept the keepsake on and then happened to not get a poseidon boon in thessaly?

[willow phoenix]

There's 2 parts of the keepsake effect, the 'meeting this god is likely' and rarify part. If you met the god but don't use the rarify the first part disappears from the text

[willow phoenix]

Wait so they used it from Ephyra?

[brave dove]

Yeah, that's what they said

i forgot what its called but when u use the item to enhance a boon, if u dont use it and keep going with that item* across stages, it should still activate right

[willow phoenix]

I assumed the don't use it mean not meeting pos lol

[civic ocean]

just tried supay and first time cleared 39 heat F2 R4 underworld and y'all are telling me this thing used to be STRONGER?! lmao

Don't even think I had a good build are you supposed to use the omega? I just ran around in a circle with heat rush and everything died

[uneven palm]

Omegas give you more projectiles and such but yeah Heat Rush stomps there

[civic ocean]

is the ball my special or my attack

[brazen ore]

You can use the omega but i feel like a lot of the time my major damage is heat rush, the autofire is sort of just like a curse application system. Ball is special

[civic ocean]

Yeah I had like arctic and then engagement ring and uhh flame strike I think

just completely mogged everything but p3 chronos which is still an insane fight]

its insane how strong autofire and rush boons are though its hard to get hit

[willow phoenix]

The omegas kinda makes it worse ngl lol

[civic ocean]

its really fun too, I guess I'll keep it

[willow phoenix]

anyone know if Launcher Frame works with Nyx Nightspawn?

[solemn loom]

Community PBs. select name to highlight to show PBs if exist for each weapon type.
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1272385014150991875/1391131087249473577/Screenshot_2025-07-05_at_2.58.04_PM.png?ex=686ac749&is=686975c9&hm=7e2228ed8b252a17ae8b146ae9002ae0092d335893a28d4aa8ca5c7566ebd2af&=&format=webp&quality=lossless&width=1232&height=792

[hollow briar]

Really interesting to see Axe doesn’t have an over-50 clear yet

I know Rivals is really punishing for the slower Aspects, but good lord

[civic ocean]

Oh really that seems weird

Surely there’s an axe clear over 50 out there

[solemn loom]

After you said that, I thought I made an error.

[hollow briar]

Hm. I guess I could do a Nergal 53F and take Void III

Doesn’t sound too horrible, but does make Erebus pretty reset-heavy if things don’t go swimmingly lol

[brave dove]

Thanatos 52 sounds reasonable enough

Judgement Nergal sounds kind of horrible if you don't hit some good stuff to help with Scylla

though, right, no vow of rivals

[hollow briar]

Yeah, Rival-less Scylla gets massacred by O-Attack Nergal

[willow phoenix]

apparently not lol

[hollow briar]

Damn

[onyx wave]

does hestia-hera duo only proc when you’re not at full magik?

[sage flame]

it procs when you restore magick

[tall notch]

Charon may be capable of 58 but i just don't have the patience to get good with that weapon

[real rune]

Recommended Mel staff playstyle ?

[glass bone]

I imagine that you’ll want to use OSpecials, along with doing Attack + Special combos. I haven’t done it consistently, but I think you can replace the final hit of the attack combo with a Special for bosses / more damage.
Also, because the buff is +40 Base damage, I imagine Aphrodite Special or other Percent damage specials are strong.

[real rune]

What are the good boons for Ospec with mel staff ?

[glass bone]

At lower fears, I imagine that Exceptional Talent could be strong. It would be 30 Magick for 2 shots of 120 minimum (not assuming any Special boons or other effects are applied).

I haven’t used Mel Staff a lot though (I used Momus a lot pre-Unseen, and I use a mix of Anubis and Circe post-Unseen), so I could be missing one insane combo, but Exceptional Talent jumps out at me at a first glance for good boons.

I also imagine most of the Special hammers are good to aim for too.

Ok, so at higher fears, perhaps the aim is to go for Giga Moonburst, which with no attack boons, makes Mel OSpecial do 240 damage for 40 Magick.

[cosmic steppe]

finally coming around updating the game, was thinking about anubis with incandescent aura ever since the patchnotes dropped

[glass bone]

You know, now I am thinking perhaps the best Strat for Mel Staves is using Normal Special for single targets, and OSpecial or Attack + Special combos for group damage. Need to try it out more myself though.

[willow phoenix]

For Mel staff the normal special is much better imo, just some attack special combo with it

If you want to do an O special build just use anubis

[real rune]

I totally forgot i can just normal special. And that works with huntress too.

So, zeus on the spesh ?

[willow phoenix]

Aphro probably the best

To make full use of all the power

[real rune]

Oh, yeah. Flat + %damage

[glass bone]

Common Aphrodite is 100% more damage. So that would be 160 damage to nearby foes per shot

[willow phoenix]

Make sure to get the dual moonshot hammer too if possible

[real rune]

Thanks everyone

Time for a test run

If i don't like it, then i'll just max out momus for the rank 5 hidden aspect requirement

[glass bone]

So then the Mel Staff combo to do is 2 attacks plus a special shot?

[willow phoenix]

I usually just dash attack - attack - special

Or just dash attack - special

[glass bone]

I myself am interested in doing Mel Staff or Momus, because I have succeeded in Anubis, but somehow not with Circe on 32. Figured that doing the other staves could help me do better than just spam Anvil Ring because “it’s so busted guys, just trust me”

Got to break out of the bad habit cycle, and this could be how.

[willow phoenix]

I found tidal ring arctic gale much easier on Circe tbh

Demeter in general seems very good with it

Like if you can get something like Local Climate + Geyser Spout + Winner Circle + Hostile Environment your build is kinda done too

[glass bone]

What about AQ for Arctic Gale and the Psychic Leash? Is that worth it?

[willow phoenix]

AQ is good for a lot of demeter and cast stuff so it's good. Like you can buff gust, meat grinder, prom flare, arctic ring

[glass bone]

Ok, I think I realize it now. The reason why Anvil Ring + Winner’s Circle was so revered, was because you can have it be a separate combo outside of a different weapon combo. But for Charon Axe (and now Circe Staff), the weapon(s) relies on the cast to be strong compared to its other aspects.

E.g. Medea Skull could use Anvil Ring and Winner’s Circle as a combo along side Zeus Special + some attack boon.
Charon Axe and Circe Staff do not work that way.

[glass bone]

I’ll try this out next time I get Staff on Grave Thirst so I can get a 32 finally on a Surface Staff (my newest priority is Lance of Ares).

[civic ocean]

Things that go nutty with Air Quality:

-Planning for it and not taking any offensive arcana
-Rapture Ring, Engagement Ring, Storm Ring, Arctic Ring
-Arctic Gale, Frigid Sprint, Heat Rush, Prominence Flare
-Rapid hit weapons, Static Shock, Support Fire, Poseidon Waves

I have cleared 39 Fear Rivals 4 with Circe using AQ so it is definitely fine

[topaz meteor]

Hello again! What's a good build for the staff, aspect of Melinoe?

[glass bone]

You want things that give percentage damage and attack speed, because the base damage of Specials is really high (80, which is the same as a regular OSpecial). Therefore, you could replace Furies or Sorceress with Huntress depending on your loadout, and look for stuff like Aphrodite Special, Dual Moonshot (best hammer supposedly), and a Plasma setup to gain a whole bunch of attack speed.

[tall notch]

is aq circe the new air fryer?

[civic ocean]

Idk I am not sure AQ is like higher fear viable but 32 and under it seems okay. Wanna test it out with other stuff and learn what other weapons and aspects it can work with. I am on skull now for putting together builds. This Hel seems interesting but maybe a bit weak at first but idk. I liked Mel skull.

Not with AQ just in general. Persephone Heph is a lock for me

[brave dove]

AQ is good but you can't plan for it reliably IME

[civic ocean]

Depends what you mean, it's like pretty easy to get with you take zeus within biome 1 or 2 keepsake

[brave dove]

I've only managed to reroll for it when I've hit narcissus

[brave dove]

well I'm thinking onion + denial + like, a zeus pool that doesn't also contain aphro, basically

[tall notch]

i guess it may be a viable strategy to start zeus and hope aq eventually shows up if you just keep building zeus? storm ring is still pretty good

[brave dove]

also the best AQ boons are demeter

[civic ocean]

With onion it's harder true but with the shade, hermes, narc, chaos, apollo, aph, artemis etc you can usually put it together reasonably well ig?

[brave dove]

like if you don't get air from non-zeus non-gathering sources, you are taking air quality as your fifth zeus boon

that just is not reliably happening, no chance nuh uh

[civic ocean]

Oh and hera, too

[brave dove]

and sometimes the shades can screw you out of the gathered air until like, tartarus

[civic ocean]

Sometimes yeah

[brave dove]

now, if you hit narcissus and get the stardust gift

then the conversation changes because you can maybe swing AQ before you even hit fields

like it can be your third zeus boon and that is actually reliable-ish

[civic ocean]

The way I would look at it is the goal is to try and activate AQ before biome 2 boss and see how that goes.

[brave dove]

as it is on high fear a lot of the time I do manage to get AQ it's like, just before chronos and don't get me wrong it helps but it doesn't define the run that way

[civic ocean]

Yeah it will be interesting to see what the climb looks like

[tall notch]

is the elements chaos blessing still in the game?

[civic ocean]

Yep

[tall notch]

then you can just like luck out and get both that and narc, old school air fryer to get AQ before scylla

[civic ocean]

Idk like I personally dislike the onion strongly enough that it will probably be my jump from 59 to 62

So we'll see how the build climbs up to there, already no consistently beating r4 Chronos at 39 with like any of the chosen weapons so far

Just AQ Circe and Supay so far but I think Supay is going to Surface

[hollow briar]

Forfeit’s your line drawn that late? Interesting, interesting

[civic ocean]

just the most unfun vow other than void and fun keeps me interested

[hollow briar]

Oh, for sure, I do get that, I just wouldn’t peg that as the lynchpin… on second thought tho, there’s only a few that I would say are feasibly the most undesirable fun-wise, so

[tall notch]

Whst if they add a vow that adds +200% damage to the first hit you take every room?

[hollow briar]

https://tenor.com/view/choke-scuffle-little-mermaid-gif-8448087

[tall notch]

Oh no not my mailbox

[brave dove]

it will be a smoking crater

[arctic fable]

I'm in the middle of a 8 fear run

[tall notch]

But i don't have a mailbox

[arctic fable]

And frinos is beautiful

[brave dove]

that's what you think

[arctic fable]

He blocked hecates morph attack

https://tenor.com/view/frinos-my-beloved-gif-1738824983898293252

[topaz meteor]

Great thank you! Will try this

[silent crow]

should be x4 damage actually

112!

[tall notch]

112!

[tall notch]

Ah yeah x2 per level

Or was ir suffering 1 +100% and suffering 2 +300%

[silent crow]

thats x2 per level

[polar ravine]

any advice for the great surface random chaos trial

[hot tendon]

What keepsakes do you guys usually use? For region 1 and 2 usually god keepsake to get tsrgeted boon, then 3 is charon purse and 4 is tooth. Anything else worth mentioning?

[glass bone]

Yes. A lot. But for simplicity sake, I guess I’ll highlight a few;

• Gorgon Amulet is used in most runs that have Strength over Death, because Athena’s boons are very strong.
• At Rank 3, Experimental Hammer can be taken in Region 3, and its effect will last for the rest of the run (including any side rooms in Tartarus). Some try to go further by aiming for the Echo boon that would give a Rank 1 Hammer in Tartarus for any weapon that relies on a specific hammer (if it didn’t show up), or just for weapons that benefit from a lot of hammers.
• Moros’s Keepsake (which I am forgetting the name of) acts like a Death Defiance for multiple rooms kind of, though of course if you don’t win in 10 seconds, and don’t have another Death Defiances, you die. Can be pretty useful to take if you have a bunch of Death Defiances saved up and are worried about the mini-rooms, or want to get a lot of burst damage out of a boss with the 10 seconds invulnerability.
• I don’t know if it’s used still, but the Metallic Droplet has been claimed to be useful in Mourning Fields for speedrunners in order to speed up said region.
• There is also Fig Leaf that speedrunners sometimes run, though I don’t know if it’s still really strong for speeding things along

[grave forge]

That one fig leaf one in the second normally is what I do

Normally the end is the Moros thing
I use the gorgon amulet if I’m low on death defy

First one is a god one
Selene one or the purse

[wicked thorn]

Same, idk if I'm just lazy but getting to skip 3 rooms is so nice

[grave forge]

Yea

[brave dove]

There's also Antler!

[grave forge]

That’s the Artemis one no?

[arctic fable]

I agree

[dim kelp]

@pallid garden I’m gonna pick up on the boar thing here, so it doesn’t get lost in discussions of Dio thongs and whatnot

#h2-discussion message

Gotcha. Well, the boar is always in a specific room, at the bottom right with the skull, so you can wait to take that room last if you want to do it. That way you’ll have as much power as you can to face him.

[arctic fable]

I usually use god ones for duo boons

[minor path]

He may be a frog but frinos is the GOAT

[arctic fable]

Yaaaaaaaaaaaas

[pallid garden]

Thanks I'll keep that in mind

[dim kelp]

And I think probably if you’re having trouble reading the attacks, it’s likely that you’re kinda wrapped up in frantic button-mashing and missing information and/or getting locked into animations and getting hit. Since you don’t have any particular time pressure, it might help to just not attack it for a bit and focus on trying to dodge with the minimum movement needed

The boar has a small repertoire of attacks with quite a lot of time in between, so you’ll have time to attack after dodging, once you’ve got the hang of it

[pallid garden]

Right I have real problems with weapons that have long animations like the axe. Supay was a godsend for me but they killed it within a few days so I'm a bit disheartened

But I had a good time with Hel

[dim kelp]

As Pizza mentioned, the boar does have kind of a “gotcha” in that it can kick you if you’re right behind it, which is typically a safe zone against enemies

[pallid garden]

I just have to get used to it

[dim kelp]

If you didn’t know, you can cancel the big chop animation of the axe with your special

If you practice that, and also try to slow down a bit and be more deliberate with your attack presses to avoid buffering more attacks than you intend, that should make it easier

(This is assuming you want to learn to get better with the axe—it’s okay to just not be into the weapon)

[dim kelp]

FWIW, I think Supay is still plenty strong. Yes, it got nerfed, and it looks weird and unbalanced with only one regular special flame, but the core playstyle is still there and functional

It’s also possible that you are under-utilizing the various damage buffs you can get from the arcana, like Huntress, The Furies, Origination, or Night? That wouldn’t specifically make the boar harder to deal with, but since you mentioned that it feels really tanky, I wondered if there are some basic adjustments you could make for more damage across builds

[unborn relic]

What's a good way or good god combo to maximize damage from the axe? Tried running a lot of aphrodite and apollo on aspect of melinoe and charon, but I have yet to even rlly dent prometheus.

[dim kelp]

Charon is more of a cast weapon, so you’ll generally want to build around making your Ω cast strong, though Apollo is quite good too on special and for his gain boon (since you can forcibly cause the cast to expire, giving you infinite magick regen)

[unborn relic]

I seeeeee

[dim kelp]

Not just Ω cast actually—it also benefits anything that does a single burst of damage with the cast, rather than damage over time

[unborn relic]

Omg wow I didnt even think of that

[dim kelp]

Because casting and immediately detonating allows you to place a new cast immediately, so you can spam that burst

[unborn relic]

I was running glam gain

[dim kelp]

Tidal Ring is really good because Meat Grinder, Prominence Flare, and Arctic Gust all add rapid damage to the cast, which procs Froth damage like crazy

Glamour Gain is a good choice for melee weapons that don’t require much magick. The main benefit is just anything you’re in range to hit being weak

[unborn relic]

Guess that works better for melinoe then

[dim kelp]

But with Charon, you’re gonna want chonkier gain so you can spam your cast-Ω special combo

[unborn relic]

Does the attack buff from aphrodite affect omega? its an easy google ik but im rlly not sure

[dim kelp]

Aphrodite’s attack and special boons do apply to the Ω versions, but the “nearby enemies” restriction is pretty small. I think it’s about the size of the regular Mel axe swing

[unborn relic]

ahhh thats fair

still feel like u could nuke with the axe spin if you built right

[dim kelp]

Aphro/Poseidon duo allows the buff to apply to all damage

[unborn relic]

thank u so much btw for the tips

[dim kelp]

Yeah, Aphro gives you the biggest number on attack/special, with the tradeoff of the range restriction and the lack of a curse to proc origination

I think Demeter and Hephaestus are always good options for a melee build too, because they offer good defensive utility

[unborn relic]

oh yah ig the freeze cast could mitigate that

[dim kelp]

Freeze is really good if you’re gonna get close

[unborn relic]

does freeze slow down all bosses?

[dim kelp]

Aphro also has Wispy Wiles for dodge chance, which can also be quite nice for safety in a weapon that has long animations

[dim kelp]

I believe so, but don’t quote me on that

[unborn relic]

awesome

[glass bone]

I’ve done a few Charon runs recently, and for Magick alone, I have tried out Apollo keepsake for Lucid Gain

[dim kelp]

Also, if you haven’t tried Thanatos yet, I recommend it. Even if you aren’t using the omegas a lot, the attack speed bonus is really nice

[unborn relic]

Yeah that's the one I have yet to try actually haha

I'll have to give it a whirl

[dim kelp]

Yeah, Lucid Gain works really nicely with Charon. It’s kind of a weird gain boon, where it’s like either extremely meh or easy infinite magick, depending on your setup

[glass bone]

Aye. Out of the 4 axes, I kind of feel like Mel Axe is the worst. Nergal is slower, but it has the use case of uncapped regeneration. If I wanted to not use Nergal, but use an axe, I’d use Thanatos. If I had to use an axe but didn’t want to play axe, I’d play Charon.

The other thing with Charon, is it’s one of the weapons where Eternity is really strong. The slowdown effect means you won’t be screwed over as much by even Frenzy or Rival attacks. Just be sure to dash if need be while charging the special

[dim kelp]

I think that’s a good way of putting it. I don’t love heavy attack weapons, so Nergal isn’t my favorite either, but I find Mel axe pretty rough without attack speed buffs

[glass bone]

And also be sure to switch off the Charon dedicated arcana for anything else. I made that mistake and uh… it hurt (still won a 32 with a dead arcana slot, but would have been cleaner without Eternity on Medea).

[dim kelp]

Oh no, that’s like the worst aspect to have accidentally left Eternity on for

[glass bone]

My original loadout had Lovers replaced by Eternity.

1000+ damage in that run, yet still a clear. Idk how

[dim kelp]

1000+ damage taken??

[glass bone]

Yes

I went through about 5-6 death defiances from Athena + Death, and most of those were panic at the final region.

[dim kelp]

FWIW, I think Than is not terrible on lower levels. Nergal is just like dreadful to ever get Berserk up if you don’t have it maxed, but having a bit less attack speed on Than is still fine

[glass bone]

The thing I saw recently with Patch 10 is, unless you want to get Berserk up, it’s better to attack, then do a dash with Nergal

**They nerfed the dash attack damage, but buffed the regular attack damage. Attacking then dashing during the animation gives you that dodge chance and the added damage.

Dash attack then becomes a sort of… special attack, in this case, where you throw it out as a quick response to some low health enemy that’s near you.

Oh, speaking of which; if you don’t want to use Nergal, the one tip I saw is to attack twice, then use special, to give be moving around more.

So a combo could be like… dash attack, attack, attack, special. Then some more dash attacks and attacks, special repeat. Each time replacing the third swing with special

If you want an example of what this would look like, you can look up Myntkaramell axe videos (the ones for Than and Mel aspects, since again, Charon is super different, and they haven’t uploaded a video on YT for Patches 9 and 10 to cover Nergal).

Just note that said gameplay is at 50+ fear, so don’t fret if everything can’t be matched perfectly.

I know that this was a text wall, but I hope this helps @unborn relic

[hot tendon]

Thanks for details, when is Strenght picked over Death?

[glass bone]

Summary, because it’s still a debate; Depends on Arcana, and where you are at in the game.
In general, you want to get both Divinity and Queen activated. On Arcana alone, you choose Death to aim for the 2nd Column Divinity, and Strength for either the 1st or 3rd Column Divinity.
As for gameplay, it factors on so many things. Vow of Rivals (especially 4 on both Surface and Underworld) and Scars 3 prefer Death, while Gorgon Amulet and Vow of Time prefer Strength. Death provides more protection, at the cost of Strength’s added damage bonus.

At the very highest end, Strength is obviously better, because if you never get hit, then Strength is better. But even top players are likely to get hit at times, so how much you value protection determines if you choose Strength or Death

Although I guess what I will say about the protection aspect is that Strength would love to use Wayward Son, because Strength values healing.

Honestly, perhaps the answer to give is “Pick your favorite, but know that both have their pros and cons.”

E.g. Death loses on the 20%, and can’t choose Gorgon Amulet without sacrificing the Death Defiances, while Strength forces you to not take Lucky Tooth and Moros’ Keepsake, and will not save you against Chronos One-Shots or any hypothetical stun-locks.

[unborn relic]

Thank you so so much for all the help! Those r exactly the kinda tips I was looking for as well! I actually still have to unlock Nergal so I’ll make sure to keep all that in mind til then.

[arctic fable]

Nergal berserk make you attack faster, heal when you hit and damage up right?

(I'm about to get shiva) eeeeeeèeeeeeeeee

[orchid fog]

any recommendations for boons on Persephone Skull?

[civic ocean]

I like starting Heph, and rarifying an upgraded strike. Then I look for Ares for flourish, grievous blow and mutual destruction and Hestia for the double blast duo while trying to get the strike down to 2 seconds. Apollo duo works as well.

It's pretty easy to get Heph strike to like 7 seconds, and even lower if Excellence is taken or if you go underworld.

[uneven palm]

Heinous Affront + Light Smite goes v hard on Persephone. Pretty much instant Sprouted

[willow phoenix]

If you're playing a blast build I think prioritizing Apollo is much more important imo since backburner works with blast. You can easily reach double blast damage with that

Then from that you have a bunch of duos you can go with like chain reaction, love handles, and room temperature. For max damage, love handles + chain reaction + sunny dispo is probably the highest but needs 3 duos. I like room temperature perma freeze build since it makes things a lot easier and just needs 1 duo and low cd blast

[night lagoon]

You sure will

[night lagoon]

Really, any non-Poseidon Boon works for it. Hephaestus is notable because of the free poms making Heph cores' greatest weakness less apparent

[wild pine]

What is wrong with Poseidon? Skull attack is reasonably fast, poseidon's pom scaling ain't bad, and it's olympian damage for sprouts.

[trim shoal]

Poseidon on skull is possibly one of the most powerful combinations in the game (in my experience)

[civic ocean]

Oh are they always blasted from behind sorta thing?

[willow phoenix]

Yeah you pretty much always get backstab with blast

[civic ocean]

Ah okay I'll put Apollo higher up I guess I think it's in ideal four but not sure if it's 2 or 3 or 4 probably 2 or 3 since I think Ares is good for a lot of stuff

specifically the flourish

[willow phoenix]

Ares is good but if you're hunting for all the duos you don't really have that much slot left lol

[civic ocean]

Yeah I think it's fine to get one of the three or four maybe? IDK still experimenting

[wispy perch]

Hey, I really dislike all skull except Persephone. I think it may be a skill issue lol. Like idk how Medea is supposed to actually work. Anyone have advice?

[elfin forge]

Medea is a combo weapon where you use one attack, then one special, and then use it like an explosive melee weapon

The way the damage works is that special will hit the enemy, then the attack explosion. As a result, you really want zeus special, and then a powerful attack like aphro or ares or hera

That way your attack-special combo will apply blitz, then instantly trigger it, resulting in massive damage

gameplaywise, you're basically mashing attack and special over and over again, aiming at enemies, and trying to avoid getting hit because special has no iframes

because you're only using one skull per special, ammo management is nonexistent

Medea also doesn't really use Mana, so feel free to prime it all away, and pick a beneficial gain like Aphro or Heph

[willow phoenix]

How do you usually play the skull? Like say mel skull

[dim kelp]

I like Tidal Ring for Persephone. The big burst of up-front damage makes the Sprouted charging feel consistent, and having Froth as well makes it very flexible to synergize with other cast buffs. Tidal Ring with Flutter Flourish also opens up Island Getaway, so you can get a really big percent buff on the special with no range restriction. (Even if you don’t get Island Getaway, though, you can get most of your omega special damage within range for the buff with decent steering.)

I’ve been looking to put Heph on attack as well, but in that case I don’t really want the CD to get below 4-5s, so that the Sprouted cycle isn’t significantly longer

I often like to have Glowing Coal or Lightning Lance too, to make it easier to safely farm Sprouted and actually charge up the omega special

[polar ravine]

is it just me or is the sprouted effect very inconsistent when it comes to length?

like sometimes it lasted for a short dash and other times it lasted quite a bit longer

[civic ocean]

I have some suspicion that there is some lag on hits that shortens the duration

[polar ravine]

it was especially apparent since i had apollo legendary which doubled the omega special but it didnt really feel like it at times

i wondered if it in fact actually didnt work with it

[willow phoenix]

I don't think Apollo legendary works with skull o special afaik

[prime ore]

do crits apply before or after air quality

like is dmg boosted to 50 then multiplied

[civic ocean]

Air Quality is last in calc

[prime ore]

lame

[civic ocean]

Air Quality is cool conceptually but lame in practicality yeah

In fact I think we are back at square one for infusions in this patch where like almost none of them are really worth building around anymore

[prime ore]

ive had it rly pop off with Poseidon, artemis arrows and zeus static before

but getting artemis arrows is a big luck thing

[civic ocean]

I used to talk a lot about Air Quality + Scorch here but they just recently patched that out

[prime ore]

with the uhh fist weapon*

[wise knot]

I just found out that Shiva aspect can be good. Not as good as other aspects, but still good.

It does not involve using omega attack at all.

Just find a suitable magick boon - the best is Poseidon flood gain. But Flood gain is bonker in its niche already.

Find % special damage boon - the best is of course aphrodite, but any will do.

Pray to your god of choice that you get Elephant Cannon from Hammer (It should have been its baseline imo)

just spam omega special like there is no tomorrow.

In conclusion: Shiva aspect needs another rework for sure.

Also, Its omega attack boost doesn't apply to Apollo's legendary second strike. PSA

[grave forge]

Tbh I normally do axe and then every single Aphrodite one + that one rarity increasing Demeter thing

Literally any axe version

[opaque yoke]

https://ibb.co/gZ9cJkKq
Double reward chance 100%

[fluid onyx]

Curious: what's the highroll for Black Night Banishment on high heat?

For removing a vow

[past salmon]

time ig
maybe rivals but probably time

[stable barn]

someone on reddit found out circe can't remove VoR

[dim kelp]

It depends on how much damage you’ve done with your cast Olympian damage you’ve dealt since you last used it. There’s a meter next to your healthbar that fills up and a sound effect when it’s maxed out

[glass bone]

That I think was pre-Unseen. Now it’s Olympian damage (so stuff like Blitz, Scorch, etc.).

[dim kelp]

Is it really? Huh. I guess the way I build it doesn’t make a big difference

Regardless, the meter is how you know what to expect from it

[dim kelp]

Maybe Hordes, Grit, or Fangs? Those vows add a lot of difficulty when maxed, but aren’t something you build or train muscle memory around, and don’t have any kind of cumulative effect that persists after the vow is removed. That’s just a guess though

[glass bone]

The one I’d want to add is Scars (if it’s at 3). Going from 100% to 50% is perhaps a big deal if you have taken a bunch of damage.

[dim kelp]

Circe takes the whole vow, however many levels you’ve got, so it would take that back to scars 0

The reason I didn’t include that is that scars impacts arcana and build choices that you can’t take back

[glass bone]

Oh.

[dim kelp]

Like, you wouldn’t play with wayward son, and you would have allowed vow of denial to take any “useless” heal-effect boons out of the pool if possible, right?

[glass bone]

Fair. Though for about half the run, fountains can still help.

[dim kelp]

So I would think that would be lower-impact as a vow to remove mid-run, because the effects of those choices would persist

I doubt anyone would be mad about having Scars 3 removed tho

And maybe being able to get full fountain healing would be enough to put that at the top

Reducing the number/HP/armored enemy threat level back to normal probably reduces the amount of damage taken quite a bit tho, which makes scars 3 easier to handle

[brave dove]

it's almost certainly timer

unless you mean like 32 in which case black night banishment isn't any kind of highroll, circe has better picks than the best possible vow banish there

[forest oxide]

How do you guys beat unrivalled bosses with Nergal

[dim kelp]

Get Iron Core early and pile on any sources you can find of faster/more numerous hits, reduced damage received, or chance for enemies to miss?

I know you can’t force Iron Core, I’ve just found it much harder to deal with rivals bosses without it, can’t get enough healing hits in before it expires

The extra range from Apollo attack is real nice for safety too, and getting him in the pool means you can get Daze too

I guess maybe the other thing is trying to resist the urge to constantly bonk. You should be doing a lot of damage per hit, so you can afford to take your time looking for safer hit opportunities and focusing on avoiding damage

Also, don’t do what I did and let Prometheus do his ridiculously-long-lived stripe of fire across the whole arena, that sucked

[last cape]

Yep the biggest thing I find with the unrivalled bosses is knowing when it's not your turn. That goes even moreso with the heavier and slower weapons. What's nice with Nergal is that thanks to the range, it can be your turn more often than you think as long as you're good at spacing. I don't personally find iron core as important as things like dashing heave or swift strike though

The healing and berserk duration is good but you'd rather kill the boss faster

[dim kelp]

Iron Core allows you to get a lot more healing out of the hit-and-run playstyle you need to adopt in a lot of those fights

I haven’t been using the dash strike as much since patch 10

[last cape]

Yeah it's a lot less good when you don't have the hammer now

[dim kelp]

Which one is swift strike?

I don’t see it on the wiki. Did you mean rapid slash?

[tall notch]

Here's the neat part, you don't

[dim kelp]

Given that they’re asking here and not in #h2-discussion , I assume they’re interested in finding more success with Nergal specifically, not just complaining about how it’s difficult to use

I know you’re just being humorously hyperbolic, but that can be pretty disheartening when someone is genuinely looking for advice

[last cape]

rapid slash yes

[dim kelp]

Does rapid slash affect the dash-strike too? Or is it kind of an either-or thing with dashing heave?

[last cape]

Yeah it affects the dash strike

[dim kelp]

I have found Psychic Whirlwind to be quite nice on Nergal as well, though you do have to have the timing and spacing down pretty well to use it consistently in the unrivaled fights

Being able to get the whirlwind hits and still do normal attacks and specials gets berserk online real fast tho

[topaz meteor]

Thank you SO MUCH!! I got 300k dmg on the special, highest I ever got in both games, got lucky with hammers and boons

[forest oxide]

Thanks for all the advice! I saw a streamer (Haelian) run Nergal with Apollo’s boons and it looked quite good with it. He didn’t have to be as close to the enemy as one would usually need to be to get some bonks in, which minimises the danger of the aspect a good bit

But yeah thanks! I’m NOT gonna try Nergal on unrivalled surface bosses because there’s just too much to invest there to fail but I’ll give it a whirl in the underworld again

[plush vapor]

omega special spam, play it like charon axe

[forest oxide]

Yeah this is true. I stopped getting screwed over too much by Poly when I stopped trying to rush him every damn time - breakthrough I know lol - but with these unrivalled bosses I definitely find that they’re harder to brute force

[forest oxide]

Lmaooo ikr. I watched detective’s playthrough with F54 and I was shocked to see them not have a single VoR turned on

[tall notch]

I am not surprised considering how hard Hecate gatekeeps Nergal. you can kill her but it takes ages and then gl meeting timer

like by the time you charge up a whirl, you won't even get most of its ticks and she's already probably away from you

[plush vapor]

yeah this was most important to me with chronos last phase especially
just stay away and give lots of space when needed

[forest oxide]

Then I tried Nergal on Hecate and I got demolished. It was so unwieldy against her as you put it

[forest oxide]

Yeah slower weapons just suck against her - even with Pan, but the time I’ve dropped cast and launched ospecial she’s already gone

[forest oxide]

Yup, though with Prometheus and Heracles I find that I still need to rush and brute force them otherwise I’m dead

[dim kelp]

That was the video where he took Heaven Splitter at the beginning? I saw that, and I think it would have been easier if he’d taken a different first hammer, clickbait title notwithstanding. But yeah, Apollo attack feels close to a must-pick to me. It’s an aspect where I’m genuinely excited to see Dazzling Display and Extra Dose

Nergal also feels quite good with Passion Rush to me, which has generally felt lackluster since the Weak duration nerf. The fact that you can keep dashing through the whole attack sequence means you’re still getting good uptime on Weak

And I’m usually running Huntress, so I don’t want Glamour Gain

[glass bone]

Nice!

[hot tendon]

what is Ascpect of Persephone actually doing to special? cause i didnt notice it being longer

[uneven palm]

Unlike the other skulls you can steer during the O special. You’ve gotta do 2k Olympian damage (Blitz, Waves, etc) to fill the gauge. When it’s full you get 2 extra seconds on the O special

[hot tendon]

i get the feeling that hitch doesnt charge it

[uneven palm]

Hitch does not

Bolts, waves, scorch, fireballs, heartthrobs, Heph blasts, Artemis arrows, wounds (weirdly)

[hot tendon]

well it sucks now c ause i got apollo on special and hera on attack, but the added boon levels are making up for it so i dont care, i started with heroic hera on attack

(rarified from epic)

[dim kelp]

Wounds count as Olympian damage? I guess that kinda makes sense, given that Ares has an Olympian buff infusion, but it’s weird for something that adds weapon power to count

I didn’t even notice that the Persephone charge condition had changed from cast damage to Olympian damage, so I was building to maximize cast damage like I had prior to the Unseen update, and that worked very nicely

I have also been going for Heph attack, but that was just to take advantage of the poms, I didn’t realize that it was benefitting the aspect too

If Wounds count towards charging Persephone, then Hestia/Ares duo might work quite nicely? I like Glowing Coal for getting the cast damage going at a distance so I can charge the o-special safely

[uneven palm]

Yeah blasts are good for spiking the gauge on crowds

Yeah wounds is weird here but it seems to fill the gauge.

[uneven palm]

Can get a big cast or something, those count for filling the gauge

[dim kelp]

I had a Persephone run where I lucked into pretty much everything I wanted with rarity and levels, and glow clang attack into glowing coal tidal ring arctic gust was filling up my gauge instantly almost every time

I think Bridal Glow hit the Glow boon, so I was getting like 24% damage boost off of the clangs? Something like that. That was a run where I was happy to take the new Natural Selection too, just to make my Pom levels even sillier

[tall notch]

nope, but hitch is still very good on special so you may still want hera around

[uneven palm]

Could also get Dying Wish which counts. Hera special is best-in-slot probably

[dim kelp]

I think Aphrodite is quite good too, though I would probably prefer Hera if I could get her. Tidal Ring is so flexible for farming up Olympian damage though, so you open up Island Getaway pretty easily, and then you can get the Big Number without the range restriction

[brazen ore]

wait, wounds filling the gauge is super weird. i had no idea that was how it worked

[dim kelp]

Do Wounds get buffed by Extended Family and Rallying Cry too?

[tall notch]

guys, i got an idea. what if they made it so that when you pause during sirens, melinoe hums along to the song?

[gaunt canopy]

Melinoe hates this idea

[tall notch]

she secretly loves scylla and the sirens and when she paused the time, no one but her can hear her joyous humming

it's very in character for her to pause time just to enjoy the song in peace

[dim kelp]

I like it, put it in feedback and I’ll vote for it

[gaunt canopy]

She isnt pausing time, we are, which is why the chronos gimmick makes no sense

[tall notch]

#h2-feedback message

[dim kelp]

I loved that Scylla somehow knew that I had Mel put up a poster of her in her room

[hot tendon]

i could completely ignore persephone longer O Special cause the boons were just amazing

[dim kelp]

But but… zoomies

[brazen ore]

zoomies and free invuln

[uneven palm]

Yes. It’s weird. The portion of the attack coming from Wounds (the +50 power and any percentage boosts on it) is Olympian damage and does get boosted by like Rallying Cry, possibly multiplicatively

[brazen ore]

if eris gets to have 20 bazillion invlunerability stages and fly off the map for half the fight i do too

[uneven palm]

Discussing it in the speedcord the other day #1218621088049659930 message

[hot tendon]

gosh my first eris kill was paid with sweat and blood

[dim kelp]

That is absolutely wild

[uneven palm]

Yeah I noticed it when I was doing Heinous Affront on Persephone and building the gauge with just wounds. Surprised me

[brazen ore]

I wonder if that's a bug or if that's intended. I guess if Olympian damage is just everything that increases additively then that kinda tracks but it's still super surprising.

is wounds better than a lot of other olympian damage for filling the gauge, or is it kinda rough bc of the cooldown for it?

oh nvm I looked at the speedcord discussion. OK so it's not great unless you have other stuff helping out it's just surprising that it counts

[reef agate]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oPce83LxXJs Does this still work or has patches changed/nerffed it?

[civic ocean]

I would think that heph blasts have to be the best no?

I get it like twice a room rn at 39f

[brazen ore]

It takes over 1000 olympian damage to fill the meter fully iirc so unless you get lucky with the poms on Heph, twice a room is not gonna cut it

imo scorch is better

[civic ocean]

Thats like one blast on a crowd plus a bit right

And midgame it can just be like one blastish?

Maybe its not like that tho

[brazen ore]

I was thinking that is really gonna suck on boss fights, though. I don't know. Heph's attack is definitely more viable on persephone than anywhere else, but I still think scorch or the light smite/heinous affront thing is better for filling the gauge

[civic ocean]

I am not super sold on the ospec being that good in boss fights either tbh it has felt pretty underwhelming thus far

[brazen ore]

I think it's pretty good in terms of having invulnerability on demand

[civic ocean]

It’s not on demand though it takes heckin long to execute the move

Where you just stand still

[brazen ore]

Sure but the same could be said for pretty much any omega that you can't charge while moving

Idk. I was able to facetank pretty successfully with momskull. Not at high fear, though. I imagine it probably falls off then. But it was pretty easy to just rack up scorch stacks, omega special, and do some damage while the stacks ticked down and I was safe.

[civic ocean]

Yeah and I would say the same for those in terms of using them as defensive options in boss fights

Maybe you want like Zeus then and do an omega build

[brazen ore]

I guess I phrased it weird. I don't mean like, you save your ospec until you see an attack coming. I more mean like, you get periods of 2 seconds where you don't have to worry about dodging and can clear up projectiles on screen and reposition yourself with impunity.

But I do think it doesn't scale forever. Like, if you're doing enough olympian damage to fill the meter incredibly quickly, you're doing 2000 damage insanely fast, and if you can do 2000 damage insanely fast without getting hit, at a certain point the ospec invulnerability isn't doing much because you're already melting health

[civic ocean]

Yeah, what excites me about Persephone is the relative ease you can get to 7-5 second blasts and potentially down to 2 with a few poms

Which I think like really opens things up with apollo ares and hestia

[brazen ore]

I do think in terms of being the only weapon where Heph blasts are even somewhat viable, it's worth taking Heph just cause when else are you gonna get to do that

Even if I don't think it's the most optimal way to play it lol

[civic ocean]

This is often my approach to most weapons vs like the meta options

Like with Charon my thoughts immediately go to “this is the best Ares Swords will ever be, how far can I push them?” Etc etc

[brazen ore]

Oh yeah. It's nice to see the full potential of a boon/god, even if it's not necessarily the full potential of the aspect

[sly plaza]

Medea is still entirely able to do this

[reef agate]

Yeah i just tried it and was successful run

[stuck token]

For Persephone I really prefer Aphrodite special, Hestia attack, Poseidon dash. Persephone boon bonus helps get a high level pyro technique to bump the burn rate, burning desire keeps the burn going without having to land more attacks, and island getaway keeps the burn going even when you're far away. Persephone charges fast from the burn, it's reliable vs bosses (chronos will lose 1/4-1/3 HP during his phase 2 triple blast opener, and there's a ton of complimentary boons along the way from nervous wreck to flash fry, etc.

[sterile birch]

hey y'all! really struggling with typhon on rivals four. I feel his attacks paired with chronos makes it really difficult to find any leeway to dodge especially with frenzy-- any advice with attack patterns?

[glacial jackal]

Hi, I came back on the game after few months and I got a question, how do I change the default keepsake? Because the ghost onion keep being equipped at the start of all run and I'm lowkey loosing it

[sterile birch]

i think you might have set the ghost onion to a prioritized keepsake, if it has a engraving-esque border on the top right then right click the keepsake to remove this trait

[glacial jackal]

Yes it has, but the right click does nothing

[sterile birch]

there should be a suggestion/hint on the bottom right of your screen that mentions "deprioritize", click whatever that button might be

[glacial jackal]

Ok, don't have any option for that, so i guess I should probably ask in tech support

thank for the help

[sterile birch]

aw sorry to hear that best of luck

[forest oxide]

Thanks for all the advice! I ran Nergal with Apollo and Aphrodite, it was really good. Managed to get all the way to Cerberus until the dog demolished me after his second phase. The way the map is set out is quite unconducive to good Nergal plays haha but of course I should also consider Getting Good

[sterile birch]

try nergal with hephaestus and ares! focus on getting heph's legendary and pair it with ares on attack to unlock grevious blow -- then min-maxing attack % and attack speed are really helpful

[dim kelp]

Unrivaled Cerberus? I think I’ve only faced him with Nergal once, but I really got beat up lol

[forest oxide]

That’s interesting! Something like, Ares for attack and Heph for special?

[forest oxide]

Unrivalled Cerby yes haha it was just awful the map was killing me in ways I’ve never been killed before (by maps)

[sterile birch]

if nergal is at rank 5, rank 6 decreases it to 4 attacks to trigger berserk which is effectively halving the downtime between your berserks

[sterile birch]

yeah! the reason why i also prefer using ares for nergal currently is because of martial arts which also boosts attack damage % by the amount of earth elements you have

[hollow briar]

(A single O-Attack charges Berserk, which is... balanced)

[sterile birch]

your main goal is definitely get the heph legendary

[sterile birch]

or just O-special + an attack iirc, regardless rank 6 nergal is really busted

[forest oxide]

Cool! Thanks for the tip - I really want to make Nergal work with VoR so I’m keen to try anything haha. And that’s a cool set up - I had the notion that Ares would do well with Nergal and also I need to pick up Heph more often. Ever since they got rid of Mint Condition I’ve not been too keen on him lol

[sterile birch]

heph is so fun! I've been trying out heph more and there's a lot of builds that work well with him

you can do something similar with aspect of morrigan, where you just stack heph's attack, special, and dash boon and try to get ares's rallying cry and hera's extended family

since you tend to use both the attack and special very often to trigger blood triad with aspect of morrigan it incentives the heph boons to trigger often, this gets buffed really well with chain reaction(heph and hestia's duo boon)

[forest oxide]

Cool! Thanks a lot, I’ll keep these in mind - I’m gonna lick my wounds with Morrigan if I still get demolished with the HephAres Nergal build lol thanks

[sterile birch]

my suggestion with using morrigan is to O-attack -> special -> charge O attack(which also does regular attack during the charging -> special

once you get familiar with that attack pattern, its really easy to execute

[sterile birch]

with proper buffs and levels your heph blasts can do like 800-1000 damage which is on par with the blood triad

[forest oxide]

Yeah for sure! That’s the most intuitive attack pattern I feel. Morrigan only starts to feel clunky when you don’t start with oattack imo

[sterile birch]

and at higher levels their cooldown is significantly less as well

best of luck! you got this

[unkempt stratus]

Hey! Im trying to get to Chronos with Shiva and I keep dying to Unrivaled Scylla. What's the best build you've found so far with it?

I think it may be my least favorite Aspect on my least favorite weapon.

[willow phoenix]

Apollo on attack then O attack spam everything, pray for Apollo legendary and Counter Supreme

Get Night Arcana and alternate between O special and O attack for stronger enemies for crit chance

[tall notch]

it's arguable whether you will consider this a shiva build, but clicking hera and spamming reg attack can be more effective than it sounds

[willow phoenix]

yea Shiva's base moveset is already pretty good without using its destruction gimmick

[pseudo pond]

Anything works with hel in high heat?

The atk felt really bad when you have to dash so much in high heat

[tough pasture]

Can someone please explain to me why medea is doing so much damage in this build?

Joeza has (up to the king vermin fight):
-ares attack (rare)
-zeus special (epic)
-zeus cast (heroic after rarify start)
-poseidon high surf (epic)
-hammer colossus driver
-artemis vital signs (15% critical chance when enemies have 80+%)

There seems to be some tremendously impressive synergy between posiedon's high surf and the ares attack.

See the battle versus hecate at 3:50 or king vermin at 5:40.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uVqPzWVw4tk

[dim kelp]

Genuinely, I think the surface unrivaled bosses might be easier with Nergal than UW. I was less experienced with the aspect in my UW attempts, so that was part of it, but with the surface bosses, I felt it was a lot easier to control my exposure to damage while still doing meaningful damage of my own. Like, the UW fights are more bullet-hell-ish, so just navigating to get into damage range without getting hit felt harder. Surface feels like there’s more places I can chill and kinda stage an attack and then retreat back to, if that makes sense?

[dim kelp]

I don’t think this is really a build synergy thing. I think this player is just mechanically good with a very high-damage aspect and is maximizing global damage buffs

[uneven palm]

Medea has big damage boost built-in so Ares attack with the +50 from wounds chunks. And it’ll instantly pop blitz for more damage, and look like they’ve got a huge Storm Ring too

[dim kelp]

I don’t see that they have any secondary boons that would be causing any of their cores to really interact

Ah, yeah wounds helps pop blitz, that’s true

[uneven palm]

They’ve just got good boons and are attacking fast

[tough pasture]

I suppose what I'm not understanding in the build is what's happening with high surf and the ares attack.

In oceanus, there's this triangular blast that's happening where both blue and red are overlayed. I've just never seen that before...

[dim kelp]

Regular Medea should pop blitz real fast too tho. Wounds only help on the first one

[uneven palm]

The red is Wounds application, blue is high surf

Like on King Vermin High surf is probably doing next to nothing since it looks like he has time to attack once

[tough pasture]

what's also interesting to me (and someone asked this in the comment of his video) is why he opted for ionic gain over static shock in oceanus. But seeing the AOE of medea, I suppose he felt it was not needed.

i've got a lot to learn about this game but so little time...

#AdultLife
#Dammit

[uneven palm]

Guessing but the best hammer for Medea there would be Possessed so maybe they were trying to leave magick open for that

[dim kelp]

The ares boon turns the attack explosion red, and that’s happening constantly because the player is cycling attack special back and forth over their target. I think you’re just seeing that over the wave from the Poseidon boon, it’s not interacting

[uneven palm]

Like there’s no obscure interaction here. Medea just strong

[tough pasture]

shows how little I know.

Thanks for the clarification friends.

[wet grove]

Sea Star + Success Rate + Uncanny Fortitude + Spiritual Affirmation is hilarious

[uneven palm]

ANOTHER!

[wet grove]

ONE MORE

[tough pasture]

I gotta be frank: I think I know less than 20% of the olympian skills by name.

I don't even know what combos I should be trying for outside of the zeus+demeter duo.

just ignorance & vibes on my part...

[dim kelp]

I don’t know all of them still

[wet grove]

compared to hades 1 this game feels a lot more arranged around vibes-ing together builds

[dim kelp]

Medea is a really high-exposure high-damage aspect, so it looks like magic in the hands of someone who knows what they’re doing, but when you try to use it for the first time you miss all your specials and get owned and die

[wet grove]

rather than having specific boon-weapon synergies that shred

[elfin forge]

actually it is basically magic

[topaz meteor]

Hello, I need help with a build for the axe that's not aspect of Charon, I'm struggling because of how slow it is

[dim kelp]

Also, it’s a bit unintuitive that it’s actually stronger to just load one attack and special, rather than trying to load all of them

[elfin forge]

sincerely, someone who first tried all statue attempts thanks to medea being kinda good last patch

[tough pasture]

is thermal dynamics even a thing? I can't seem to induce that one in about 30 runs i've done since the latest update + patch

[dim kelp]

Thanatos is less slow

[elfin forge]

you could try a ranged cast like Hestia or Zeus so you can set the cast far away and deonate it from range

[topaz meteor]

Yes but I would lose Mortality I get hit a lot 🤣

[elfin forge]

oh wait you said not aspect of charon

Uh Mel axe + Aphro or Apollo attack should do good, just use dash attack a lot

[dim kelp]

Honestly, that’s okay. You can still benefit from the higher attack speed

[tough pasture]

lol, yep...i can attest to not understanding medea and avoiding/underrating the skulls.

[topaz meteor]

Okay! Any boons / hammer to try for?

[elfin forge]

maybe it's just me but skulls and torches are kind of the same where there's like, one aspect that plays "traditionally"

[dim kelp]

Skull is a weird weapon. It doesn’t evoke any particular sense of how it should work or be played, like the axe and knives do

[elfin forge]

which both happen to be the mel aspects

[elfin forge]

I feel like mel skull is pretty intuitive, based on the stats and ammo mechanic. You shoot until you're out, then you reload, like a grenade launcher or something

[tough pasture]

yeah, I know what you mean.

I couldn't figure out the torches until someone explained moros to me and demonstrated it...and then I finally realized that moros was basically the hades 2 version of chaos shield with explosive return from hades 1

[glass bone]

I think that as an overall weapon, Skulls are probably #2 best, aside from Staff (that’s to say, Staff in my opinion has 4/4 strong aspects, Skull has 3/4 strong aspects, because I feel like there’s almost a gap between Mel Skull and the other 3).

[dim kelp]

I found the lingering ammo mechanic confusing, but that was before they changed it so you collect them with special. But, I suppose that was similar to zag cast. I hated collecting bloodstones too

[elfin forge]

what's the bad aspect on skull lol

they're all incredibly strong

[tough pasture]

I feel like the torches are the best but that's because I've become quite intuitive with them.

I think the "intuitiveness" matters a lot for me. (Hence, I struggle with xinth coat and avoid it like it's the plague.) 😂

[wet grove]

Sea Star can duplicate onions and this boon is my new favourite in this game

[brave dove]

Dashing Heave, for Mel axe

[elfin forge]

coat is super intuitive, it's just fists with some kinda janky rockets you shoot sometimes

[glass bone]

Maybe I’m underrating Mel Skulls, but like… it feels like Persephone is now better Mel Skulls. Though if Mel Staff is a strong weapon, I think I need to try it again.

[elfin forge]

also an omega attack you can press if you want to, I suppose

[tough pasture]

I can't get it to "click" in my mind.

And I was super excited for them when I saw that the coat aspects were basically mech-style/gundam-style weapon.

I get that there's a fist aspect to it but something about it just feels off for me. I wish I could put it better into words.

[brave dove]

mel skulls really want the +ammo count hammer then they become really funny

[tough pasture]

persephone is now stronger than mel skulls in my humble and non-guru opinion.

[elfin forge]

mel skulls with +ammo is quite funny

[dim kelp]

You can always try to double down on attack speed. Plasma, hammers, Hermes. I rather like Hera on attack, because you can spread the damage pretty quickly

[glass bone]

Yeah, that’s what I missed. I am guessing that Mel Skulls is built akin to Mel Staff, but shifting Special damage to Attack damage.

[elfin forge]

yeah just shoot attack 4 times, then special off to the side

basically just keep magdumping

since it's an aspect with big power, you want a big % god like Aphro or Apollo

[glass bone]

Also, how does Mel Skulls work with Wide Grin? Do all skulls get the missing skull bonus?

[elfin forge]

nope avoid wide grin

[dim kelp]

No, it’s an anti-synergy

[maiden notch]

does air quality affect gust?

[elfin forge]

yes

[glass bone]

Well that’s a shame. The alternative would probably be oppressive.

[dim kelp]

Air Quality applies to everything except scorch (though of course some things will never have low enough damage to be overridden)

[maiden notch]

amazing, gonna go for that then. final boon choice before unrivaled typhon lol.

And I'm a little nervous bc my dumbass forgot that athena keepsake only works if you lack death defiance so that was a goddamn waste of a final keepsake

[elfin forge]

that's why ya play strength

[maiden notch]

(And I still had one left...)

[elfin forge]

athena keepsake is basically the strength keepsake

[topaz meteor]

Ooooh so smart with Hera! Do I use any omega or just normal attacks?

[maiden notch]

eh, I'm not good enough for that on higher heats. Still die too much. 😓
need the buffer of DD to make it through the boss fights consistently as i learn them well enough to deal with w/e the speed fear is called.

[brave dove]

if that happens in the future, I usually just int all my DDs room 1 and fish for renewed faith

with that said, she's not guaranteed to offer it-

[tough pasture]

Also, playing hades 2 on controller is a very different experience for me than playing hades 1 on mouse & keyboard.

I wonder if I would like xinth coat a lot more if I played hades 2 in m+k.

[brave dove]

if you're thinking about gauntlets playing coat like gauntlets is probably the worst possible way to play coat

[elfin forge]

isn't that playstyle a bit buffed now because the faster speed

idk how you're meant to exactly play black coat, I usually either see dashattack spam or attack+special spam

and then you avoid the omegas like the black death

[brave dove]

Nyx can make it work because Nyx is really strong atm, but night cycling is how I play coat

[dim kelp]

You can open with o-attack if you want. If you charge it and then dash without letting go of attack, you’ll dash and then start the spin where you end up. So you can channel out of range and then move in with the spin, or charge up while a wave is spawning in. O-special is your ranged option. Also, regular special will cancel your big chop, which can help with not getting hit (though it’s not as scary as on Mel axe)

[brave dove]

@tall notch does autofire spam, I believe

[elfin forge]

yeah

[tough pasture]

yeah, i've figured this out...

[brave dove]

the way I view is your attack is to stagger and finish enemies

your special is what actually kills them

[ebon grove]

I know it's probably not good on higher fear (Only just done 24/32 and all) but I absolutely love Launcher Frame on Xinth

[brave dove]

there's a few ways to approach this - autofire's mechanically finicky but really really strong, night cycling I would argue is very straightforward but a lot of other people tell me they hate it

[maiden notch]

yeah I uh, remembered when I got to the final shop lol.... not much to be done at that point.
ended up dying, just too much going on in that fight and didn't manage to stack much health this run. oh well, was a fun break in my day anyway.

[brave dove]

guy I tagged 5 secs ago is tbh a much better coat player than me and will have better insight as to the precise approaches, but focusing on your regular attacks and punching them to death is genuinely probably the worst way to play coat

even if you're using attacks, coat has an incredible (...relative to the basic attack sequence) dash attack

[dim kelp]

We had an attack spam coat for like a week…

[elfin forge]

how's the new basic attack working out for coat?

unseen buffed the damage, p10 sped up the startup of first attack

[fleet basalt]

How does the 30% increased hex damage from circe work with the Hex that resurrects enemies?

[brave dove]

it's nice but not a huge gamechanger compared to exhaust riser poseidon getting taken out back

[elfin forge]

wait it affects coat?

huge rip

[uneven palm]

Wide Grin is bad for Mel Skull attacks but extremely good for Omega attacks just because you fire 4 bombs at once. I'll pivot hard into that if it shows up early

[uneven palm]

yeah, you get roughly half the waves you "should"

sad day

[tall notch]

Hi yes what's up

[brave dove]

tagged you for coat talk :p

[elfin forge]

how's mel coat doing

[tough pasture]

question: how good is seething marauder (the hammer) on axe?

I've never taken it but it seems like it should be very strong, no?

It reads "your attacks also deal 60 damage to surrounding foes, for each and every strike.

That combined with either dashing heave (the other hammer upgrade) or the omega attack should be very effective in melee combat, no?

[plush vapor]

an extra 60 dmg per hit on a slow atking weapon isnt that great tbh

[tough pasture]

even if you're using cast to hold them at bay?

[hollow briar]

It’s pretty nice even at higher Fear if it’s any consolation; you wanna be using the auto-fire tech anyway (hold Spesh and click Attack to basically do both at once) and Launcher helps with that marginally

[ebon grove]

[hollow briar]

Worse than Nyx (and always was IMO) but it’s still a Coat Aspect, so it’s a safe choice

[hollow briar]

Seething works on every single O-Attack hit and also is just generally good for getting extra DMG in (especially for Wards)

[elfin forge]

it works on dash attack though, which turns about 40 power to 100 power

[hollow briar]

It’s also an area all around you, so it’s nice for having your back against swarms

[tough pasture]

That's what I was thinking. I'm watching a mynt run and mynt chose something else but I started wondering about seething's effectiveness in a different scenario.

[hollow briar]

Could’ve been the worse option depending on the context, yeah. Overall still a rather good Hammer afaik (I only really play Nergal with Axe so I can’t speak too much for it, though)

I did my time with Than/Mel and Charon is Charon lol

[tough pasture]

mynt is playing on max fear and mynt opted for the special hammer that erases 35% of enemies armor.

I understand why mynt chose special one. mynt has all the magick primed so omega attacks are a no-go. So since mynt needs another source of damage, mynt opted for special. Besides, special is a good way to deal with the double hearts vow.

[sage flame]

was it surface or uw?

melting hammers are pretty good imo

[tough pasture]

surface.

[sage flame]

esp on surface, lotta annoying mini bosses with lots of armor

[brave dove]

melting hammer is mandatory on surface at that kind of fear if you don't want to pass a coinflip, or it was in warsong

[sage flame]

yarg, dracon, the like

[tough pasture]

warsong

[brave dove]

yeah I mean in warsong that was the case, I think yarg got nerfed in unseen but afaik yarg just straight killed your timer if you rolled it on some weapons without melting on max fear in warsong

well, that or corrosion on sight

(I don't play much surface, I am not remotely an authority on it this is what I remember hearing at the time)

[hollow briar]

That makes sense. It’s worse now iirc but armor shred is very worthwhile

[tough pasture]

Also, RIP mint condition.

[hollow briar]

Will be missed. At least Security System is still like, very good imo

[tough pasture]

security system is a cheap imitation of it; doesn't provide the same level of security as mint condition did considering how hard the enemies hit in (ultra) high heat.

ETA: but it's certainly better than nothing.

[hollow briar]

For sure, for sure, but I’m also kinda… glad? I dunno, MCon was just so absurdly strong that even tho I didn’t advocate for a nerf or anything, it’s nice to tone it down a bit from what was essentially Hikari’s jackpot from JJK (if you get the reference)

[tough pasture]

i'm new to JJK (reading through it now). So I'm not familiar with that character but I understand the sentiment: eliminating mint condition and adding a weaker version of it makes sense for the competitive balance of the eventual 1.0 update.

I'm chuckling at the typhon fight mynt had. It seems like the enemy AI suddenly got caught in a crazy loop for a long while where it kept doing the face smash over and over and over and over and over.

That's like the best thing that can happen in the fight because it's the easiest attack to dodge.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bmhGTt3JuyI

[hollow briar]

Yeah, no, I like to consider myself decent at the game but Mynt’s so cracked at Axe that it’s pretty insane to watch

[tough pasture]

yeah, mynt's precision is incredible.

mynt was the one that taught me how to dash in between the combo attacks of the axe.

[hollow briar]

Like holy hell, I pretty much never take Antler because my worst aspect of gameplay is still by far taking random hits

And then we’re just casually using the slowest Weapon with it. Bonkers

[golden flare]

does anyone know if fourth degree + aspect of pan + ares on special and fireball on special actually does anything? like if the regular specials hit first before the fireball does then it won't reapply wounds with the bonus i assume? but i can't tell easily amidst all the other stuff going on

[hot tendon]

is Supay just going on autopilot doing O moves every 4 secs?

[uneven palm]

I thought Seething didn’t proc on dash-strikes. Did they fix that this patch?

[wide swan]

Just got back into playing after not playing at all for a half a year and I wanna know what’s the current meta/general best stuff to do?

[brave dove]

what's your goal?

there's nothing as all-encompassing as mental block strats right now, the meta varies on what you're trying to do and tbh balance is in a state where every aspect can clear 50 fear without tremendous difficulty

[atomic ibex]

This is a real stupid question, since it is generally considered (before the last patch at least) the best staff, but how do I properly build momus? I usually put hitch in the attack, set a omega attack snake, and start using the regular attack. But I never manage to do well on 30+ fear like that

[atomic ibex]

You want a good rush boon I'm supay, and focus on properly using that

[forest hinge]

I feel like Hestia rush the best one last patch, was my favorite but idk how to really “build” around it other than global dmg, and I don’t think static shock procs from it either

[uneven palm]

Use your whole kit. Omega casts hit hard and 3x on Momus. Like I usually do O cast, then whichever of O attack/special has a better boon/hammer. Put a big +% on everything.

[empty musk]

Zeus rush is still definitely the best rush on Supay bc it's the only spammable and continous sprint in the game that can scale thru secondary/duos.

Poseidon and Ares are prob second in terms of damage output and scaling but they require you to dash spam instead of sprinting which doesn't work as well in Hades 2

100% the rush nerf was aimed at it, just wished they buff the other rushes to compensate bc 70% of them have terrible damage output

[worthy skiff]

Also I’ve been trying to figure this out a while. What does the skull’s aspect of persophone actually do. It’s somewhat vague and confusing and never seems to work and the fandom/reddit stuff I found seemed souta outdated. Could someone just lay it out for me?

[cerulean panther]

Whenever you deal damage with Olympian effects (Scorch, Hitch damage, Poseidon splashes, etc.) the little meter next to your health and Magick bar fills up a bit. Whenever you use your Omega Special with charge in the meter, you become Impervious, your Omega Special lasts longer, and it can change direction.

With the meter and Aspect maxed out, it lasts an additional 2 seconds, which doesn't sound like a lot of time but is in a game as fast as Hades 2.

[worthy skiff]

Ohhh I thought it had to do with your special boom and didn’t realize it was a metre I thought it was static thx a lot

[cerulean panther]

No problem.

[uneven palm]

Just confirmed this. Yes, Seething still does not trigger on dash-strikes

[wintry pasture]

hey chat do yall think incandescent aura or born gain would be a better pickup, btw my whole entire magick bar is primed, asking for a friend

[wintry grove]

Zeus and flames go nicely together. Who else should I try for flame builds??

[cerulean panther]

Aphrodite's Duo prevents Scorch from losing its stack while it deals damage. Demeter's Duo lets you instantly expend Scorch stacks for increased damage, kinda like Merciful End.

[tulip sonnet]

i’m worrying about a potential build: anyone wanna help me out? xinth hitch attack + hestia spec + tough gain to proc brave face and incandescent aura

i fear that it’s simply just going to not be hardy enough—any tips on the fourth god?

[willow phoenix]

For max survivability? Apollo for warm breeze

[sudden ledge]

Oh my god Anubis is bad

How does one make this work

[willow phoenix]

Drop dash attack, drop cast, O special everything into it

Anubis is very strong imo

Strong enough that you can make it work while ignoring parts of its kit

[sudden ledge]

Gotcha

What attack and special boons should I shoot for

[willow phoenix]

Hestia for attack probably the best

For special Apollo, Aphro, Hera are very good

You also want to get controlled burn from Hestia if you're doing O special a lot

[tall notch]

Hitch attack + hestia special are probably enough to clear up to like 40f on nyx coat

[fluid onyx]

Patch notes said that "rivals moves" aren't affected as much by vow of frenzy now. Anyone know how that works? Are they just blanket not as affected by the speed increase?

[spiral wadi]

i imagine it means frenzy has reduced effect on rivals

originally i was like "noo my frenzy" then i had to fight updated scylla/cerberus a number of times

[indigo bronze]

Yes, for sure among all boons, there are hidden probabilities to appear. Sea is a hard one without any prerequisite.

[hot tendon]

Dropping my arcana setup - i mostly use magick heavy weapons and enjoy using Hexes (momus, charon), any ideas on what to improve? perhaps im using something objectively undertuned instead of something overtuned or at least normally tuned

https://imgur.com/a/I5IKU7q

i lowkey wanna use excellence but dont know what to drop

[edgy nacelle]

The magick regen arcana is generally not worth it imo. It is in some scenarios (and early game), but if you play a magick heavy weapon you'll probably want a good magick regen boon too. A lot of Gain boons (notably Born Gain) are enough to keep your magick full all on their own, and 5 cost for an arcana that a boon can make redundant is a lot.

Most people run Origination since the universal damage bonus is really nice, and pretty easy to set up, so that's what I'd recommend. If you like excellence you can run it too, but imo it's less impactful

[hot tendon]

I wanted to get apollo legendary 3 times, had all prerequisites but still couldnt roll it, perhaps i did something wrong on the way but i feel that excellence would be the key to that

Yes i also thought of origination, also i wonder if i should change anything else up? I saw the 10% sprint and move through enemies is good

[tall notch]

Unless you're very good at bosses, i wouldn't skip lovers

Also yeah why is unseen there

On momus specifically since you mentioned that's what you play I'd click night for omega combos and more dmg

[hot tendon]

yeah, i wanted to change things up a bit but im torn on what to drop, everything looks kinda ok or useful to me from what i already have*

[tall notch]

Remove unseen click lovers + night

[edgy nacelle]

have you unlocked the ability to save more than one arcana preset? tbh I might do a specific one for momus and a different one for charon, if you play both aspects a lot

[hot tendon]

yep

Oki i changed unseed into lovers and night for momus, and got origination for charon preset

i guess i should play the mana familiar once i unlock it :D

[edgy nacelle]

that familiar is great yeah! tbh for Charon, Apollo's gain on its own is really good and usually enough to keep your mana full 100% of the time with no other help, so I often start with apollo keepsake and use a different familiar

[tall notch]

In high fear I'd probs still start Hecuba because without that the first 3 rooms can be a pain 😭

[edgy nacelle]

OH true for sure, at least depending on what vows you select! I just don't like playing axe on high fear lol I'm bad at it 😅 so for me personally that rarely comes up lol

[tall notch]

There's a certain point in fear where you no longer really get to select 😭

[hot tendon]

i prefer aiming for fireball cast from hestia on charon and just blast from afar

much safer for my noob ass

[pseudo pond]

does poseidon have ICD on anubis attack?

[willow phoenix]

I tried it and it seems like it triggers waves on every tick. But every now and then I feel like it's not triggering waves at all, so it might be buggy, not sure

[pseudo pond]

yeah, same

hmm, so the previous minot patch didn't fix it huh

[hot tendon]

does Charon have use from Night or is it only when i actually use O Cast, not just trigger it from O Special

ok just tested it but doesnt seem to work

[sly plaza]

I caved. I’m using DD again 🥲

I will miss you Athena 😭

[eternal sparrow]

So I just fought Prometheus and lost. How are you supposed to dodge his flame attack that you need to remeber? It comes out so fast and when he summons enemies I need to kill them whilst remembering like 5-6 ways the flames will come. It seems a bit much.

[tall notch]

You can lose all dds in Erebus and refill with Athena keepsake in Oceanus
Peak plays right there

[willow phoenix]

The enemies don't stay, they'll attack like once then leave

Just focus on dodging the flames, if you have a hard time you can pause too

Or worst case just i frame it by dodging to the top

[olive tusk]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1229455811802038352/1391762846404055051/image.png?ex=686d13a8&is=686bc228&hm=365ebb15390fcdeff9d2b4a9c553fcd3d210b5df55a28d31cd552134f79b75a2&

unreal luck all of a sudden

[tall notch]

what are these yellow border boons?

[olive tusk]

legendaries

[tall notch]

oh i dont get legendaries nowadays

[olive tusk]

You have to get the prerequisites, after that it's not that rare

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1229455811802038352/1391764377761480816/image.png?ex=686d1515&is=686bc395&hm=c0eef58add08a1d415e88e21f3af69e0852527b1a354358ffb92392053a4f5f7&

great game, completely destroyed typhon

[pure grove]

Three legendaries is crazy. How’d you even manage that? Just track all 3 and hope for the best?

[crystal holly]

Hey yo guys, Suggest build for Annubis pls, Tryna do 32 fear underworld. I try to go for hestia attack w zeus but need to perfect it.

[tall notch]

at 32f you could probably just click hera special and spam ospecials until everything dies

[crystal holly]

oh yea that sounds cool. Idk i feel like the bosses gets pretty annoying if your focused more on the normal foes and encounter clear but im still learning so.

[willow phoenix]

Peak anubis gameplay fr

[tall notch]

it's fun watching enemies zoom around all over the place after pulling them in

[crystal holly]

i never thought of it that way lol i always focused on attacks cuz of the area feild

[tall notch]

getting the prereqs is often the tricky part when you can go through all of oceanus without seeing a boon

[olive tusk]

snipe travel deal like crazy, have atleast 5 rerolls

plus, this build's foundation is through ephyra, which is probably the best stage ever for setting up builds

[olive tusk]

i was only tracking apollo, and got the other two through sheer luck

[past salmon]

The safest build for Anubis is just Hestia attack i think

Special spam is great and strong but it will also get you hit plenty lmao

[olive tusk]

apollo has easily been the best for ospecial spamming
for attack a lot of gods have been nice, i like poseidon

[tall notch]

yeah thats why i said its good in 32f, you won't get punished for getting hit that much

btw what does morrigan want to build these days? i should finally get around to learning that spect

[proven edge]

ever since I dropped magick regen I havent looked back

magick early game isnt that big of a deal and born gain is soooo good, which is nice cuz hera is good too

[tall notch]

I still use it sometimes but its for really niche builds

[proven edge]

I only felt annoyed without it using Hel

cuz 50 magick on the special is a lot

[uneven palm]

Apollo attack is nice for additional AOE coverage. Hestia or Hera aren’t bad either. Final Slice is great since you go right into the “final” one after a dash-strike. Sweeping Ambush and Wicked also great.

[glass bone]

What about Trick Knives? (I.e. a combo of Dash attack into like… OSpecial)

[uneven palm]

Can't get Trick Knives on Morrigan

[past salmon]

Anyfear is Apollo Attack start and possibly maybe hit Lego

It's fairly build agnostic tho

[proven edge]

the goat Foolish

[tall notch]

I meant for high fear, I don't speedrun 😭

like does it have a coldshade build that may take 22 minutes but it will clear 58f

[past salmon]

Then Hestia attack I think

[tall notch]

o thanks, you the goat 🔥🔥

[past salmon]

Idk I did like 1 62F on it and died to uhh Cerb???? Literally how 😭

[tall notch]

and do you just play it like other blades or should i actually learn the triad combos

[sage flame]

at least for bosses the combos are worth

[past salmon]

Triad alot

[sage flame]

since it's just rotating your moveset anyway (common blitz special W)

[past salmon]

Triad gets more useful on high fear lol
In anyfear you can kinda just ignore it outside of bosses and it doesn't make much difference but you should pretty constantly be getting Triad proccs in rooms on high fear

[sage flame]

grit go brr I suppose

[tall notch]

@past salmon has ocast morrigan ever kicked off?

[past salmon]

No

[sage flame]

lmao

[tall notch]

why not? 😦

[past salmon]

Also wards
It's pretty good to hit an enemy with a tactical nuke right after removing their wards

[past salmon]

Because it's slow as piss and O-Attack is an actually fantastic move

[tall notch]

so do you want to be oattacking in rooms like all the time?

[past salmon]

Pretty damn often yeh