h2-discussion

[elfin heron]

For a little while there I was afraid hades 2 wasn't going to get anything ;-;

[old depot]

vow of rival last bosses are both bs -_-

I thought chronos was ok but then was caught in a time stop during his one hit kill moves

[gusty maple]

Fun fact, that's also possible without vow of rivals (totally didn't just happen to me after like ~100 runs of never dying to Chronos)

[solid cradle]

I don't find Typhon that bad but Chronos is insane yea

[old depot]

I mean typhon is sort of a mixed bag for me since one theres so much stuff on the screen I find it hard to not get hit which I prefer, and I always use up at least two death defiences on the child phase

[graceful dune]

Chronos is bullet hell bs

When on Rivals third phase

[woeful latch]

|| Icarus is the last character I need to level my friendship with and he literally hasn't shown up for 7 surface runs, and 2 underworld runs. He hasn't appeared in the crossroads for all that time as well. Do I need to do something specific? What Is going on with him? ||

[cursive nacelle]

can just be unlucky unfortunately

[woeful latch]

:((

Is he more likely to show up on surface or underworld?

[cursive nacelle]

npcs do have a pity timer

[woeful latch]

Surface in the sea yeah?

[cursive nacelle]

so he will be forced to spawn in even if you are the unluckiest player in the universe

yeah surface

[craggy totem]

He cannot ever show up in the Underworld. He can only appear in Thessaly or Olympus.

[woeful latch]

I'm like almost certain he did at least once

[craggy totem]

Nope.

[woeful latch]

Maybe it was Herc

[craggy totem]

Herc can't either.

[woeful latch]

One of the surface random encounter NPCs showed up in the underworld once and I was surprised

[craggy totem]

The only combat encounter NPCs you get in the Underworld are Artemis and Nemesis.

Unless you're thinking about using Gorgon Amulet to summon Athena. (But presumably if you're doing that then you already know and wouldn't be surprised by it!)

[cursive nacelle]

artemis can show up both under and over

[sweet cove]

Did you have the Gorgon eyes for Athena

[woeful latch]

I've used it a few times but that's not what Im thinking of, I know you summon her

[sweet cove]

Artemis can show up in both routes, and Icarus and Heracles are surface only

[opal obsidian]

icarus is… flighty

[crude dragon]

He can't show up in the Underworld

Only Thessaly and Olympus

[merry echo]

I just realized death stranding won no rewards

And kojima was watching the entire thing

[silver mantle]

Sad Kojima indeed

[simple epoch]

Dear god I just defeated chronos for a second time. With axe and haspestus atack and special.

And.. he just died.. just like that.. there wasent even a fight.

I never even killed [Redacted] that fast

THink the entire fight was like.. 15 seconds

[nova oar]

Surely not 15 seconds, my fastest chronos kill is 32 seconds

[broken glen]

Is that regular or VoR

[thin laurel]

tbh chronos has a lot of time waste-y phase change animations, so if you shave those off I can 100% believe the parts where you even could damage him took 15s

[nova oar]

Oh absolutely yeah

[tropic ravine]

That’s like world record timing

[tropic ravine]

🤯

[nova oar]

And for a 2nd chronos fight ever, even my pb of 5.30 doesn't have a sub 30s chronos

[tropic ravine]

I can never understand how some people get 5 mins runs

I can only get 10

[nova oar]

Uhhhh grinding, strats, and practice

[tropic ravine]

How many hours do you have

[nova oar]

370, about 560 nights

Done sub 7.30 on all uw aspects, and i'm doing sub 10 all aspects on the surface

[tropic ravine]

I see

[nova oar]

Once you max out meta progression and get enough game knowledge you can get pretty fast consistent times just by clearing rooms quicker

[old depot]

Im a bit annoyed by the phase transition invincibility since it also makes them completely heal from the hundreds points of scorch they accrued >.<

just let me delete them for once smh

[nova oar]

Scorch is never gonna be good for phasing bosses

[thin laurel]

part of it is also knowing what to do, not even like… skill.
i.e. speedruns have a very solved keepsake order for the most part, and knowing which encounters pause timer goes a long way

[nova oar]

@thin laurel did I ever send you my fast chronos fight

I hope I clipped it

[thin laurel]

yesssss you did I think

[nova oar]

Not the Mel axe one

[tropic ravine]

I know both but I change my keepsakes a tiny bit

[nova oar]

Cause I had a faster one

[nova oar]

What's your keepsake lineup

[tiny gust]

currently writing an article about Hades 2's vocabulary and here are the percentages for

How much each god talks about their trait (zeus' lightning, poseidon's ocean, hestia's fire, etc)

Ares - 60.7%
Hestia - 55.1%
Hephaestus - 47.0%
Poseidon - 40.9%
Dionysus - 39.7%
Selene - 38.6%
Demeter - 34.5%
Aphrodite - 34.2%
Hera - 31.0%
Hermes - 24.5%
Apollo - 23.7%
Artemis - 16.3%
Athena - 14.1%
Zeus - 8.6%

[thin laurel]

tbh if you aren’t specifically going for speed there’s no real reason to usw the speed keepsakes.
I don’t rly like using fig leaf, for instance, but it absolutely saves a lot of time

[tiny gust]

im floored by how little zeus talks about storms and lightning, i could've sworn his percentage would be higher

[thin laurel]

which aspect was this then idr if I’ve seen it

[tropic ravine]

I use the same keepsakes just change the order and switch out the crit keepsakes for the knuckle bones

[nova oar]

I think it was nergal??

[nova oar]

Just use antler 😈

[tropic ravine]

Athena, fig leaf, echo, knuckle bone

I would be willing to Change echo

But idk what to pick

[tropic ravine]

i always get hit fo some reason

[nova oar]

I figured it out it was my heroic chaos than run

[thin laurel]

tbh if you don’t want to use antler then I’d probably use lion fang (or metallic droplet on weapons that channel a lot). knuckle bones isn’t that great for speeds for the most part imo

[nova oar]

I would never take echo, recommend is pom->fig->amulet->antler/fang

[thin laurel]

also, are you post-credits yet? I assume athena start is because you play strength and want to have your build open to any gods rather than planning a build

[old depot]

"Now this is a fight" says heracles while he and prometheus are on the other side of the arena while I wait for the fire to let me past so I can get to the fight

[tropic ravine]

Yes I am and I just use it because it’s a free room and some defense

I have like close to 20 ish wins

[nova oar]

Take the free room in fields, not region 1

[tropic ravine]

Ok

[thin laurel]

no interest in jeweled pom…? it’s crazy op

[tropic ravine]

What is pom?

[nova oar]

Jewelled pom?

[tropic ravine]

Is that the dates whim

[thin laurel]

post-credits keepsake you get by gifting ||hades||

[tropic ravine]

I already have

I forgot what it does lowkey

[nova oar]

Use that keepsake first region

[thin laurel]

every boon you get offered for the entire run (even after you take it off) starts at lv4 lmao
and you get a free random hades boon room 1

it’s absurdly strong

[tropic ravine]

Oh wow

[nova oar]

Boosts power so much

[tender oracle]

that is until you disable fate's whim

[nova oar]

Can pretty easily leave erebus around 1.30

[tropic ravine]

Alright thanks

Hopefully I can get better runs with Medea

[thin laurel]

and true! but also even if you break fate’s whim (i.e. by taking athena keepsake) you don’t lose levels on the boons you already have, you just stop getting bonus levels on new ones

[tender oracle]

you also lose the hades boon iirc

[thin laurel]

so by region 3 you should be fine to break it, I p much always do for speeds

[nova oar]

If you're playing medea it's technically faster to start with zeus but that's up to you

[thin laurel]

yup! altho sometimes that doesn’t matter tbh, like life tax has already done its thing

[tropic ravine]

Ok thanks everyone

Appreciate the help

[thin laurel]

welcome, and have fun with jpom! super fun keepsake imo

[tender oracle]

some of the hades boons sadly only apply to the final boss so taking it off means you basically never had a hades boon to begin with 💔

[tropic ravine]

Yeah

Sucks

[thin laurel]

tbh for speeds I rarely care that much about those ones. old grudge is fine but for a low fear speedrun your dps should be good enough to phase him before it even hits tbqh

[midnight moss]

Is there someone who does ||the trade-y stuff of Nemesis|| in Hades I, or is that type of thing Hades II only?

[nova oar]

I didn't clip it are you kidding me

[thin laurel]

I’d feel the worst about losing gigaros or unseen ire personally.
at high fear (or specifically rivals 4) losing deep dissent REALLY sucks tho

[tropic ravine]

I don’t really think so

[nova oar]

Thanatos

[tender oracle]

i believe that is new to hades 2
hades 1's nemesis equivalent is thanatos, who only does the contest

[tropic ravine]

Oh yeahhh

Not trading though sadly

[thin laurel]

I think that’s h2 only
Nemesis is kind of similar to Thanatos, but Than just did the “beat him to get a reward” thing, Nem does like 5 things

[nova oar]

I never take gorgon if I have deep dissent at rivals 4

[tropic ravine]

But your not really missing out on much tbh

When trading

[thin laurel]

I do if I’m out of DDs and echo didn’t give me any for 62
feels bad, but like. deep dissent is not worth 3 DDs worth of health to me, usually

if I were a better player maybe lol, ik some ppl can go into rivals chronos with naked antler and no DDs and not worry but uh. that is not me, at 62, no thank you

[nova oar]

There's alr only like a hundred 62 runners

[dry whale]

Whats the difference between a god and a titan

[crude dragon]

That's a great question, I'm glad you asked

[nova oar]

Titans are older and more general in what they represent

[tropic ravine]

This goes into Greek mythology but like gods are what as you know and titans can be really special and gods and titans are enemies and have been in wars

[thin laurel]

in h2 lore or in mythology generally?

[crude dragon]

(It's almost entirely semantics)

[nova oar]

But i'm sure the nerds will give you a better answer

[tropic ravine]

If I remember correctly

[dry whale]

H2

[tropic ravine]

Not much difference then

I think

That’s relevant to the lore

[thin laurel]

in h2 lore it seems like titans are generally embodiments of what they represent, not gods presiding over it—i.e. apollo is a god of light but light wouldn’t stop existing if he died, but Selene IS the moon, Chronos IS time

[tropic ravine]

Selenes a titian?

[dry whale]

But titans are very similar to gods right?

[nova oar]

Yep

[tropic ravine]

Never knew that

[tropic ravine]

Pretty much in hades 2

[thin laurel]

yup! Mel’s first dialogue to her is “great titaness, the eye of night, I draw you down, lend me your light”

nyx and her children similarly seem to embody their domains, tho, so it’s blurry

[tropic ravine]

Cool

[dry whale]

Also lorewise is chaos the strongest character in the hades universe?

I assume so right

[thin laurel]

I wouldn’t powerscale chaos tbh

chaos is the originator of all things. truly who knows how that relates to “strength”

[tranquil wren]

if they decided to intervene in anyway. it'd be extremely over for anyone involved

[tranquil wren]

the trials seem to portray chaos as omnipotent

[nova oar]

Plus this is really the first piece of media in which chaos is an actual entity

[tropic ravine]

Hellish are you a speedrunner? I swear I’ve seen you on the leaderboards

Or I’m tweaking

[glossy shadow]

To power scale chaos, there's not much they can do w/o shattering the wheel

[dry whale]

Are hades and zeus equals in power?

[tranquil wren]

nope! but I do want to submit one of my 32F surface "speedruns"

[tropic ravine]

Really hard to power scale gods

[dry whale]

Ah okay

[tropic ravine]

I mean if you want you can see their actual boons and see what’s stronger

[nova oar]

What's your fastest 32 time?

[thin laurel]

gods also just do different things 🤷
like, the fates are a very different type of immortal in terms of what they can do. idk if the fates could kill typhon in combat, but they can do things no other gods can do at all

[dry whale]

I figured cuz even in the game some gods have praised zeus power so i figured supergiant purposely wanted to make clear hes the strongest

[tranquil wren]

11:32:13 (surface)

[tropic ravine]

Like hades can take 20% of ||chronos|| hp in an instant but Zeus has amazing boons in general

Ahhh why is it not spoiler

[tranquil wren]

you need ||

[nova oar]

Pretty good

[thin laurel]

also doesn’t need to be a spoiler, this channel everything is fine except the ending + stuff after it

[tropic ravine]

Still I don’t want anyone to be spoiled even if slight possibility

[dry whale]

Ive been curious about somethin but idk if i should ask cuz i feel like i will find out soon

[thin laurel]

which is very polite! esp cause a lot of new players do hang out here even tho #h2-for-new-players exists

[storm glen]

Castlevania: Aria of Sorrow

[thin laurel]

but boss names I think are p chill, it’s not a plot point or anything, with “death to chronos” as her first line of dialogue I think most ppl can guess that Mel is going to fight him lol

[tranquil wren]

wait what

[tropic ravine]

Yeah, I remember when I got spoiled the ||true ending||, but thankfully I got it when they ||changed it||, also thanks

[tranquil wren]

oh wait nvm
but tbf idk if it's the greek version haha

[nova oar]

What?

[thin laurel]

lmfao I know that chaos is in a castlevania game because of the damn vampire survivors DLC…. I should rly play a castlevania game fr

[tranquil wren]

there's also chaos from sonic

[tropic ravine]

Ahhh I was thinking of foolish not hellish

[devout cairn]

what about that final fantasy game where the guy is obssessed with killing chaos

[nova oar]

😭

[dry whale]

Ive won 7 runs now and ||zag and mel keep talkin bout how they gonna stop and get rid of chronos|| ive been curious how that works cuz if they do that wont the game stop havin a final boss 😭

[thin laurel]

is that catnod emoji from something specific
it looks very neko atsume art style lol but so do a lot of things

[nova oar]

You'll find out

[tranquil wren]

if you want a more modern experience, bloodstained is pretty good too! made by the same guy who was behind symphony of the night

[tropic ravine]

Play the game

[tranquil wren]

it's from the celeste discord but I believe they got it from neko atsume lol

omg the cooldown is back to 5s, I just noticed
finally

[tropic ravine]

They obviously ask uh oh to kill chronos and uh oh one taps him

The end

[dry whale]

That would make me cry

[tranquil wren]

they have a lot of other cat emotes too, very cute

[devout cairn]

soon we will be able to post images

[tropic ravine]

Sad tears or happy tears

[thin laurel]

ooh I should try celeste again wait 👀 didn’t think abt that.
I own it but last time I tried it (I tried like 3 times) it was my first real platformer and I sucked so bad it wasn’t fun for me

[dry whale]

Sad

[tropic ravine]

O why so

[tranquil wren]

celeste is so good!! it was my first platformer too and I'm glad I stuck with it

[dry whale]

I hate uh oh

[thin laurel]

but I’ve played HK and silksong since then, which aren’t solely focused on platforming but…. idk. might finally click with it

[tropic ravine]

😡😡😡

[dry whale]

YES

[tranquil wren]

I actually started to hate HK's movement after playing Celeste lol

[dry whale]

😭😭😭

[thin laurel]

very fair, even after silksong I find HK movement a tad boring and it’s barely different

[nova oar]

I really enjoyed the main story

[thin laurel]

love having a sprint
love clawline
love diagonal pogo

[tropic ravine]

Hot take Silksong feels like a chore to play

[nova oar]

REAL

[dry whale]

😡😡😡

[nova oar]

Silksong was only a chore cause it was too easy

[tropic ravine]

Even my friend who loves the first game (and me as well) didn’t like it at all

[thin laurel]

all I know abt celeste is like. mountain. uhh… ||dark inner self version maybe||. ||🏳️‍⚧️ I think||

[tropic ravine]

Correct

[nova oar]

Yeah pretty much

[tranquil wren]

yep, ||very trans. the dlc level confirmed it||

[tropic ravine]

Also broooo you spoiled the mountain part

[nova oar]

Isn't the ending have a trans flag in the back

[thin laurel]

hot take: most people I’ve seen dislike silksong are people who loved hollow knight 🤷
it’s weirdly common. for me I like the gameplay of silksong more by a pretty wide margin tbqh, loved that game

[tropic ravine]

The plot twist

[tranquil wren]

in the farewell ending, there's a trans flag under her computer

[thin laurel]

but I also played HK1 for the first time in 2025 lmaooo so

[tropic ravine]

Reall

[storm glen]

bruh can we stop silksong convos

[rotund hearth]

Hot take: Persephone > medea

[rotund hearth]

Lolll

[nova oar]

It's not the same game lmao, I loved them both but still prefer the hk story, silksong combat is better and i'm sure i'll love the dlc

[thin laurel]

it’s been like 2 seconds long and mainly in the context of bringing up celeste 🤷

[tropic ravine]

Why so

Medea has best dps in the game

[thin laurel]

very hot take
but also for personal preference yeah I get it

[tropic ravine]

Ye

[thin laurel]

I think rn Mel skull is my favorite skull. it’s not stronger than medea but I like range and it’s a bit underrated

[tropic ravine]

Very cold take thanatos hammer is really fun

And Medea gets kinda boring sometimes

[storm glen]

perseph is one of my least favorite aspects

[thin laurel]

I’m not bored by medea yet, but only because I disliked playing it until pretty recently. I sucked at that weapon lol

[storm glen]

truth nuke

[tropic ravine]

I remember when I used to use all 4 ammo at once and not use attack and special combo lol

It sucked

[thin laurel]

momskull is kinda weird since like. I like the base skull moveset, so sure, it’s fun. but the aspect bonus isn’t very interesting to play around imo, and I have the most fun just playing it like Mel skull without a preference for % attack

[storm glen]

i hate momskull basically being a statstick

[tropic ravine]

Is mom skull Persephone?

[thin laurel]

this was never my issue, I just sucked at aiming the special and extreme close range isn’t my thing

[thin laurel]

yeah it’s just faster to type lol

[storm glen]

its so hard to actually build around the ospecial bc a long duration move like that doesnt benefit from most stuff in this game

you just put a % special and be done

[tropic ravine]

Mom skull or Medea?

[storm glen]

mom

[tropic ravine]

HOT take sister blades suck so bad it’s not even funny

[storm glen]

idk its annoying that the aspect is just flat dmg squared insyead of an actual gimmick

[rotund hearth]

Persephone just moves faster when I use it. Like with medea, I'm waiting for the shells to fire and with Persephone, I can spam and it's just good. Like I'm pairing it with Apollo attack, Hestia special and static shock and clearing runs in seconds

[rotund hearth]

Personal preference. The blades are my favourite

[storm glen]

not that spicy a lot of ppl hate them

[tropic ravine]

I can see why it has so much potential

[tranquil wren]

mel blades and morrigan are very fun

[jolly hound]

Blades with Poseidon attack go brrr. And static shock

[thin laurel]

I have to agree and it makes me sad
taking me forever to clear 62 with, it’s the last weapon type I need. I like blades more than axe at baseline but they struggle a bit rn

[tropic ravine]

Yes but it’s so situational

Like a lot of other boons won’t work

[rotund hearth]

I've learned to like the other weapons (even the axe) but getting trick knives on pan is just so peak

[jolly hound]

Have you heard of our lord and savior trick knives

[rotund hearth]

Blades with freeze is good

[jolly hound]

Blitz on the special and brrrr

[tropic ravine]

I have not explain pls

[thin laurel]

Mel blades special is surprisingly op with % or blitz, even without trick knives

[rotund hearth]

I'll do my next run with medea just to see if it's that better than Persephone

[jolly hound]

It’s a hammer that when you dash attack you auto fire three specials

[thin laurel]

oh also trick knives is absurdly good, one of the most op hammers in the game and makes all 3 blades which can get it go nuclear

[tropic ravine]

That lowkey has potential

[shrewd silo]

Chronos 9 out of 9 times

[thin laurel]

you might like Mel skulls more actually, they have better synergy with apollo attack then persephone and then you can play them almost the same way you already are

[jolly hound]

Not lowkey, it’s a contender for best hammer in the game

[tropic ravine]

Really?

Need to play more runs with it ig

[thin laurel]

100%
trick knives is absurdly good, it just wins runs

[shrewd silo]

I still woulda won even if || it didn't give me infinite death defiances||

[jolly hound]

Really really

[tropic ravine]

What’s everyone’s opinions on the mech suit

[tropic ravine]

Did you get the || true ending ||

[tranquil wren]

nyx and mel are pretty fun imo. shiva's great as well

[rotund hearth]

Blades work with anything other than like Hephaestus and Ares and maybe aphro

[thin laurel]

REALLY good with both Pan and Mel blades, since their aspect bonuses work really well with it.
still good with Arty blades but iirc they’re coded so that trick knives specials can’t crit from the riposte, which is sad.
morrigan can’t get trick knives but if it could it would be kinda absurd

[shrewd silo]

|| the one where you get your family back and don't kill chronos|| ?

[rotund hearth]

Also wouldn't take Hestia on the attack. Scorch is better on the cast paired with blitz or freeze attack

[tropic ravine]

|| yep ||

[thin laurel]

imo blades work with hephaestus but then you’re playing heph as your weapon not blades lol.
both my 40 fear mel blades runs were just heph special 🤷 heph works on anything, it’s pretty weapon agnostic

[shrewd silo]

Is there a ||bad ending|| you can get

[tropic ravine]

|| nope ||

[shrewd silo]

I'm just really surprised I never lost to chronos

[thin laurel]

still the single highest number I’ve seen on a damage board lol https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1233146305308528650/1402577390865223730/Screenshot_2025-08-06_at_1.59.35_AM.png?ex=693dd43c&is=693c82bc&hm=7c019ced7fb723297c3b99d608050168e701a77d07666cb15702a1a66067db27&
did I use the aspect at all? no. but heph doesn’t care, he just carries

[tropic ravine]

for me, if you quit the game I feel like that’s the bad ending because that means ||chronos stopped the timeline and ultimately won||

Or Mel gave up

[tranquil wren]

no grit I'm assuming?

[thin laurel]

I think? this was ages ago tho, it was my second clear for 40 fear all aspects above and below so it was uh. a while ago

[tranquil wren]

oh lol fair

[thin laurel]

grit + horses inflate damage numbers for sure, + any build that consolidates damage in one source

[tranquil wren]

the evil and intimidating horse 🐴

[thin laurel]

but still, the highest I usually see is like… mid 300k range, for stuff like storm ring circe

[thin laurel]

believe it or not I tried to stop autocorrect from saying horses three times 😭 it hates hordes

[tranquil wren]

lmao

[thin laurel]

siri plays alliance in wow confirmed I guess

[tranquil wren]

I think that's a reference I'm too young to know

[thin laurel]

maybe? I have no idea how old you are, I played world of warcraft very briefly in middle school lol but idt it was the height of its popularity

but the two factions are alliance and horde
so if autocorrect hates the word hordes then. alliance player ig /j ofc

[tranquil wren]

ah gotcha

[tropic ravine]

WHat the

[thin laurel]

play heph blasts 🔥 they’re fun af
duo boons + poms and rarity and they’re all you need lol

[tranquil wren]

momus with heph blasts is just incredibly fun too

[thin laurel]

tbh 90k from special alone is also rather nice, mel blades backstab bonus is no joke

[tranquil wren]

back burner is just incredible with it

[thin laurel]

YEAH
back burner underrated in general

I love taking back burner + the backstab hammer for morrigan lol, and then going like. scorch attack, usually

altho tbh for 62 sweeping ambush scorch attack has been my jam, or hitch attack but idk, I love scorch morrigan

[simple epoch]

Wait did I accidentally set a record

[storm glen]

idk how people underrate it its such a big number youd think its a noob trap

[simple epoch]

AND I DID NOT SCREEN SHOT IT AND DO IT BEFORE I HAD THE RUN TRACKER

[craggy totem]

People underrated backstab-related stuff a weird amount in this game

[nova oar]

If it was your second chronos win ever I highly doubt it

[simple epoch]

That was my second win yes

And when I said 20 sec it's really a guestimate

[nova oar]

Yeah mostly likely a fast run but not a wr

[simple epoch]

But if I'm being generous the entire fight phase 1 and 2 was sub 35

Why is it whenever I'm not recording I do really good

[tranquil wren]

the record keep should have all your runs, even from before they arrive

[nova oar]

https://imgur.com/a/2G0u6wu like this speed? (Don't watch the end of the fight there are spoilers)

[storm glen]

it kept all my runs from EA its so funny seeing the empty slots

[simple epoch]

It will not be at that rank now. But last year or so I had rank 15 on the sword on speed run.com

[craggy totem]

(It doesn't keep a video recording but it does tell you exactly how long the run was)

[simple epoch]

Does it track how long each boss fight took?

[craggy totem]

Nop

[simple epoch]

[nova oar]

I would definitely believe around 30 seconds but a 15-20 second fight is impossible afaik

[simple epoch]

Wait that means no one can disprove me. Guys it was actually sub 10sec

[nova oar]

Catastrophic misspelling

[simple epoch]

Sorry my mind slipped to Dyo's art

[tropic ravine]

You would absolutely need the best luck ever as he uses moves that makes him impervious for soooo long

[nova oar]

Pretty sure his invuln moves add up to around 15 seconds anyway

My best chronos is a 32 (which i didn't record) my next best is a 33

[simple epoch]

Well I has haspestus attack down to 2 sec, special down to 5. Max damage on the fall hex with fire lady's god mosifer.

[tropic ravine]

Is Haelian in this server

[nova oar]

Might have a faster medea one?

[simple epoch]

And the buff for 18% damage to isolated tsrgets

[tropic ravine]

Fire lady

[simple epoch]

Geandma

[tropic ravine]

lol

[craggy totem]

Eh? Sky Fall's godsent is with Ares, not Hestia.

[tropic ravine]

Hestia the goat

[craggy totem]

Hestia is godsent on Phase Shift A DIFFERENT HEX

[nova oar]

He might lurk but never seen him comment, glad he's not tho cause some of his takes are buns

[nova oar]

You mean total eclipse

[tropic ravine]

Really like what

[simple epoch]

I thought it was for all? I'll double check exactly which he's tomorrow

[tropic ravine]

I watch his vids a lot to be better

[craggy totem]

String me up, dye me purple, and tie feathers in my hair

[craggy totem]

No, every god gets one (1) specific hex

[simple epoch]

Oh well heatias one. And a lot of small damage boost

Dear god's I can't type tonight

[nova oar]

He doesn't recommend lovers, and his boon tier list was very questionable, I wouldn't watch him to get better as he mostly just does niche and super broken builds that aren't typically achievable, go watch boated

[tropic ravine]

Ok

[rotund hearth]

Alright. Testing medea again after an OP Persephone run

[tropic ravine]

Wait boated just liked my comment an hour ago

So peak

[nova oar]

You might be just bad at medea cause perseph is hella mid

[craggy totem]

Mom slander smh

[simple epoch]

Am I the only one that really don't like nearly every weapon in H2

[craggy totem]

You are probably not special

[simple epoch]

H1 just felt like it had more fun normal weapons

[storm glen]

i feel like he would be fine in discussion

[tropic ravine]

How many wins did you have? And at the start yes

[simple epoch]

Not enough

[tropic ravine]

The aspects make the weapons much better

[storm glen]

normal has been out of style since forever

[craggy totem]

Imagine being normal

[nova oar]

I just disagree with alot of his takes, i'm sure he's reasonabl

[rotund hearth]

It's not good for spam imo. I fire my attack and have to wait for it to attack... Before I can fire another attack

[nova oar]

You may need to get used to all the aspects and weapons, they're alot better balanced than they were in h1

[simple epoch]

I don't want to form too strong opinions yet as I haven't gotten to far into the story and there is plenty more for me to unlock

[craggy totem]

You're not supposed to spam on Medea, though?

[nova oar]

What?

[tropic ravine]

You are 100%

[storm glen]

hades 2 content creation space is so small hes the most popular one its kinda weird bc hes one of those players that can back up weird takes bc hes actually good at the game

you wouldnt think someone like that would be the top youtuber

[simple epoch]

Oh absolutely. I'm more just saying. A typical sword and bow weapon. Just miss the typical weapons that zag had

[rotund hearth]

Then that's fair. Doesn't just suit my style then

[simple epoch]

Tho I'm sure some modder was working on that. Or was it H1 boons?

[nova oar]

Yeah i mean I watched the video, I understand his reasons, just don't agree cause i'm too speed/high fear pilled

[nova oar]

You absolutely do spam medea what

[craggy totem]

Are you using a very different definition of spam than what I'm imagining

[storm glen]

u js gotta get used to it

[craggy totem]

Cos when I see "spam" I'm thinking about mashing one (1) button

[nova oar]

Probably

[tranquil wren]

you spam two buttons with medea (atk and spec)

[simple epoch]

Properly true. I've barely used the skull and black cot yet

But I just miss my baby the adamant rail ..

[nova oar]

https://imgur.com/a/gkIJ84S

Is this not spam (vor chronos spoilers)

[rotund hearth]

It's too bloody slow

[simple epoch]

I will never forgive Eris for not giving it to me

[thin laurel]

you do spam medea, you should never be waiting for your attack to go off
it’s a VERY close range weapon, you click attack then immediately launch into an enemy with your special, making the attack explode immediately. you can spam that super fast

[storm glen]

SLOW???

[nova oar]

You're playing it wrong then, it literally has instant attacks and is the fastest aspect in the game

[craggy totem]

Are we talking about the same... what do you mean by slow, exactly?

[nova oar]

Are you waiting for the attacks to go off

[craggy totem]

Are you primarily relying on omega attacks or something?

[rotund hearth]

INSTANT attack???

[thin laurel]

“I fire my attack and have to wait for it” makes me think you aren’t hitting enemies with your special

[tranquil wren]

igmur link 🥀
but no I agree, medea is a spam aspect

[storm glen]

EA vow of suffering strats

[craggy totem]

You're meant to load up the attack then instantly headbutt your explosive-primed self into the enemy

[storm glen]

camp boulders in oceanus with the detonation

[tranquil wren]

you need to atk then special to immediately fire it
it's not worth loading up more than 1 or 2, just repeatedly atk -> spec

[nova oar]

Go watch my link if you've done vor chronos

[tranquil wren]

oatk or ospec for huntress or for clearing eris' bombs in rivals

[thin laurel]

medea attacks as fast as you can click 2 buttons, if you’re at melee range and can aim 🤷

[rotund hearth]

I mean, I want the attack to hit lol. It's absolutely a playstyle thing because I didn't know you had to fire your special for your attack to work.

Rather just shoot the shells like a gun. Hence me enjoying Persephone

[nova oar]

Oh my god 😭

[tropic ravine]

REAL

[rotund hearth]

Shoot then retrieve shoot again and blah blah

[tropic ravine]

Aspect of lucifer my beloved

[craggy totem]

It's written in the aspect description :P But yeah, you literally cannot shoot Persephone- or Mel-style shells on Medea. The normal attack has no range.

[tropic ravine]

(Not Satan)

[nova oar]

Do you not read

[thin laurel]

many such cases

[thin laurel]

try playing medea the way we’re recommending tho 👀 and lmk how it feels
attack-special as a close range combo, using special to dash back and forth through enemies

[rotund hearth]

||(I can't read)|| but yeah I'll try completing a run with it (I'm getting melted)

[tropic ravine]

More like they will be fried into Swiss cheese

[thin laurel]

medea is very risky since you play at close range and launch into enemies lol, but it also does ABSURD damage very very fast

+90% attack and special damage is kinda nuts, and since you use your special to make your attack explode you’re super mobile

[tropic ravine]

Yeah

Thing is you’ll probably kill all enemies before they start to do attacks

[thin laurel]

dash and special are also fun af to use together on skulls (other than Hel, rip skull movement)

[storm glen]

also skull hammers are stupid broken

volatile array might be the single most underrated hammer in the game

[craggy totem]

I love Volatile

[storm glen]

50% multiplicative damage on attacks

[nova oar]

Once you get good at it tho the risk is just not there, I face tanked sirens at 50f and still left with half health and full dss

[rotund hearth]

Why does it almost feel like there an inside joke I'm missing on. Like is it really the same aspect?😭. Am I on a different patch lol

[storm glen]

respectfully how did you not figure out thats how the aspect worked like did you experiment with it at all

[thin laurel]

look up the current world record speedrun lol, medea isn’t necessarily easy to use but if you use it right it just melts. like 80% of the speedrun leaderboard is JUST medea lol

[tropic ravine]

It is extremely good we ar not joking

[craggy totem]

I don't think it's easy to figure out from first principles if you never saw the description

[thin laurel]

I don’t even like it all that much, but it’s the single best aspect in the game for dealing damage fast

[storm glen]

like the way you figure out stuff in video games is by pressing all the buttons

[nova oar]

You just never played it correctly

[rotund hearth]

I did try it with smelly and noticed it took a bit to attack (hence me never using it until post game when I'm trying everything out)

[storm glen]

if you just press all the buttons you'll figure it out

[craggy totem]

I think it's very easy to fall into the "oh, I Totally Figured It Out, it hits after a delay" trap

*spoiler: they did not figure it out

[thin laurel]

I can understand not figuring it out with medea if you’re stuck in mom/mel skull brain and are waiting to use your special to retrieve ammo

[fervent frost]

Hmmm, the Hermes legendary doesn't work quite as I expected

[shrewd silo]

I like a lot of the new gods character designs but ares was better on the previous games

[storm glen]

nah ludovici ares in game is peak

[fervent frost]

it seems to deduct gold first before armor

[thin laurel]

I do genuinely recommend looking up footage of someone else using it btw, to get the rhythm and aiming of how it works

[storm glen]

i wish we still had slow medea tbh

[rotund hearth]

Lol. I watched the record video on foolish's channel. I know it's popular but like, idk. I'll screen record and send it to you

[storm glen]

or. slower. it was still fast

[fervent frost]

stupid hermes boon taking my money

even with all this armor

[thin laurel]

yeah ngl I almost always hate that boon
it makes sense to me that it activates before armor even if it's not like. good that it does that lol

I only rly take it if I have no use for money for the rest of the run, and a lot of money

easiest with a specific post-ending keepsake

[fervent frost]

yeah but the hermes boon says that you lose money instead of HEALTH

(i took it becuase I have like triple money from chaos and that keepsake

[thin laurel]

I just almost never take it 🤷 money is useful

[fervent frost]

yeah but I have like 4k of it

[crude dragon]

You take it once for the prophecy and then never again

[thin laurel]

I mean if you're getting good value out of it then by all means
but it seems like you aren't liking the boon at all lmao

[craggy totem]

I don't mind seeing it in final boss shop if I have a lot of cash on hand

Not gonna be using that $$ anymore anyway

[rotund hearth]

I only took that during my first strength run cause I had no DD

[storm glen]

hermes and chaos legendaries are awkward in this game

[craggy totem]

Chaos legendary is a direct personal insult and deliberate attempt to troll me as an individual

[thin laurel]

I've taken it 7 total times on my save file, out of 567 runs
I take it in final shop most often since then it's basically just free health

[storm glen]

in hades 1 chaos changed their boons depending on ur mirror idk why they dont do that in yhis game

[fervent frost]

i took it because I foresaw that I'd be taking no health damage at all (which is true)

[thin laurel]

what sort of armor do you have? if it's trusty shield/security system then I understand being annoyed

[fervent frost]

of course it's trusty shield

[thin laurel]

but if it's shop armor, heavy metal, or an arachne dress and you don't need the money I'd rather lose money than armor which doesn't replenish

and if it's trusty shield it'd only save you a couple hits each room tbh
still annoying, but. idk, I hate the hermes leg, the hermes leg being bad never surprises me because I assume whenever I take it it will do whatever would be most annoying

[fervent frost]

and hermes used to be GOOD

well i'm at the end shop now and can still buy everything out lololol

[storm glen]

hermes is good his legendary is bad

[tropic ravine]

Hermes’ is good?

[fervent frost]

i knew it wasn't good but my god it's even worse than I thought

[tropic ravine]

I only pick like 2 boons from him

[thin laurel]

I like h2 hermes boons way more than h1 ngl
partly just personal preference, but he has so many good things lol

[storm glen]

h1 hermes is very unbalanced

[fervent frost]

lol now it's all the heph armor

and i still have like 1.5k gold

[thin laurel]

which 2 do you tend to pick?

[storm glen]

some of his boons are game breaking others are useless

[tropic ravine]

Coin bonus and free 100 coins, first item you buy in world gets duplicated

[thin laurel]

those are good, but also idt they're his top 2 boons for me (which are success rate and nitro boost)

[storm glen]

im always surprised by how good nimble mind is

[tropic ravine]

My builds don’t really need succes tbh

[craggy totem]

I love Nimble Limbs

[tropic ravine]

I forgot what nitro boost does

[thin laurel]

racing thoughts and nimble limbs are also good in their niche, tall order is honestly very solid, mean streak and hasty retreat aren't amazing but are pretty solid in general, the only boon I don't rly like is stutter step

[thin laurel]

speed bonus + you get effectively 1-4 free hits per room depending on rarity

[craggy totem]

I like to see Stutter Step if I have a dash-specific boon tbh, but that might be placebo

[storm glen]

oh yeah its called racing thoughts mb

[tropic ravine]

How does it give free hits

[craggy totem]

Heaven knows I don't have the reflexes to make full use of tiny little increments probably

[tropic ravine]

Hasty retreat I use sometimes

[thin laurel]

success rate in general is like. if your build can use it it's amazing
not every build can, but if you have any crit effects, double strike, etc etc it's just REALLY good

[fervent frost]

success rate is great

[thin laurel]

it's like snow queen/lovers but only while you're sprinting
negates 1-4 instances of damage in every room

[fervent frost]

mostly because you only get offered it when it's relevant

[storm glen]

i feel like success rate is overrated a lot its no better than poms in a lot of scenarios

[tropic ravine]

Does it work with keepsakes

Does anyone else also feel like hades is really popular yet fan base is so small

[rotund hearth]

Eh. It depends. Putting success rate on shocking loss is guaranteed meltdown

[tropic ravine]

YouTubers barely get views

[craggy totem]

Yah but it simultaneously "poms" every single boon you have, including unpommables

As opposed to having to actually get that many poms, separately.

[thin laurel]

yes, cherished heirloom + heroic success rate gets you to 80% universal crit on white antler lmao
it can also make the echo keepsake reach 100%, but that keepsake is uh. bad
it even works with stuff like aspect bonuses to crit rate (i.e. Than axe, Mel flames), and iirc even the Night arcana card

[craggy totem]

And also boons where pomming increases something other than the %chance

[tropic ravine]

Why is echo keepsake bad it’s 2 boons

[thin laurel]

it affects everything other than Raki specifically, daze, dodge, and I believe boon rarity chance.
but like. everything else is boosted. insane with ares crit boons

[cunning laurel]

random other boon

[rotund hearth]

Also success rate on Thanatos axe

[thin laurel]

you don't get to choose which boons. it's one of the only keepsakes in the game which can actively make you weaker, by forcing you to take a sacrifice boon or a boon which bricks your build

[rotund hearth]

Or anything with Artemis crit

[tropic ravine]

What? I picked echo because she never picked sacrifices for me

Crazy

[thin laurel]

you don't get to choose when it triggers, if it triggers at all, or what it chooses.
it can pick reckless abandon from dionysus and suddenly your 600 damage axe attack deals 5 damage most of the time

[tropic ravine]

I see

[thin laurel]

or it can pick king's ransom/queen's ransom and delete half your build when you don't want it to

[rotund hearth]

It can be more annoying (and I say this as a stone enjoyer) when you take it because you have a Zeus or Demeter in your pool and it ends up taking the double on Ares😶‍🌫️

[thin laurel]

best case scenario it picks a boon you really want, maybe a second duo boon
worst case it literally bricks the run
on average you get something kinda meh which won't do much 🤷

also yeah, it often just takes something you truly don't need, you have no control so it's just....... idk. it can highroll, but it's generally. iffy

[craggy totem]

I have genuinely no idea why they implemented it like that instead of it letting you choose after it randomly activates

It doesn't seem like it would be THAT op

And Echo herself is a helpful character, not like Eris lol

[storm glen]

inside joke probably

[rotund hearth]

Cause you don't control what reward it chooses. It literally can ignore your first two boons only to choose one that you only picked so you'd have a fourth god

[storm glen]

they knew echo as a character was bad so they made her keepsake bad on purpose so you hate her more

[rotund hearth]

BOON BOON BOON and REWARD REWARD REWARD my precious

[rotund hearth]

Echo isn't bad!!!

[thin laurel]

you rly do win the award for the person I disagree with most often on this server who isn't like.... someone I dislike LMAO, this is quite a take

[fervent frost]

echo keepsake is..... pretty darn good

[storm glen]

i am honored to be both vaguely respected and universally reviled

[nova oar]

Echo keepsake is super bad

[nova oar]

😘

[fervent frost]

actually

[rotund hearth]

I like it more than most people do (then again most of my takes are hot) but I understand why people like it. I still think it's better than A LOT of keepsakes though

[thin laurel]

you're liked, I just find you baffling sometimes, esp when you say a take with the tone that other ppl probably agree (i.e. "I thought we all just begrudgingly accepted that hera is op, wym you like her")

[fervent frost]

when you think about it it can force you into bad boons

[rotund hearth]

Wait, question and not to revisit the medea thing but would Hermes metallic droplet increase the attack speed?

[fervent frost]

it's just good, but not awful

[craggy totem]

Yes, that's what we've been explaining lol

[storm glen]

its because i am multiple people

[nova oar]

It's really good at bricking your run and not giving you anything good

[storm glen]

we all outnumber you. we will always be the majority

[fervent frost]

I say it's a skill issue, because you losers can't just ROLL GOOD

[cunning laurel]

i would never ever take echo, i think that means its bad

[craggy totem]

TBF I feel like it's just a bit worse than EH in this respect.

[storm glen]

have you considered the fact that the reason i take a boon is because the other 2 boons were worse than it

[rotund hearth]

RNG issue

[nova oar]

I would take bell over concave stone

[storm glen]

EH is like a 1/11 chance on specific weapons maybe

[nova oar]

https://imgur.com/a/f85bVtB

[craggy totem]

Like I said.... a bit worse ;P

[rotund hearth]

EH is what again?

I like random hamma though

[storm glen]

dude concave is like. near guaranteed brick a lot of the time with denial

[gusty maple]

Do y'all ever pick the chaos one or is it way too random

[fervent frost]

I still like echo keepsake is usually a net positive rather than negative, like a small positive

[rotund hearth]

I got possessed array EH on my first skull run and it was so peak

[craggy totem]

Yah, my point is just that they're both gambling keepsakes where you ought to avoid it in certain circumstances, but one of them has more Certain Circumstances than others

[storm glen]

and also just the inherent contradictionary design of giving you random boons you didnt pick

[tropic ravine]

Imagine you could choose what boon you could take

[nova oar]

Then it would be usable

[fervent frost]

if echo let you pick the second boon

[thin laurel]

if I'm already gambling I'd rather it be more than a very slight net positive
why risk bricking my build when on average it's like. meh

[storm glen]

concave stone imo is genuinely worse than bell

[nova oar]

I just said that

[storm glen]

we just said that

[fervent frost]

we just said that

[nova oar]

Bell doesn't get worse than max pain so it's alr better than stone

[fervent frost]

which is very flavorful for echo

[storm glen]

bell is like what 27% global damage at the end of a run? thats pretty good

[rustic basin]

I like it on anything other than a Skull build that doesn’t want Wide Grin and Axes that don’t want whichever one turns your Attack into a more powerful slam

[nova oar]

And only the equivalent of 1 pain vow

[fervent frost]

i like jeweled pom

[cunning laurel]

thats barely more than 1 boon

[rotund hearth]

And taking 27

[rustic basin]

Buzz Lightyear gif

[storm glen]

27% global is pretty strong and rare

[fervent frost]

why force build when you can make everythin good

[nova oar]

If I can clear 62 I can handle 27% more damage

[rustic basin]

It’s just rarely what I want over either Chrolex, Leaf, or anything else in Oceanus lol

I like it conceptually but it’s not really the first bottle I’m reaching for

[storm glen]

did you want to play 62 with void 2

[rustic basin]

I mean, yeah

[craggy totem]

Got the order of comments mixed up and thought you were saying you wouldn't take jpom over those things

[thin laurel]

I typically take it in fields if I have nothing better to do 🤷 ik it works in oceanus but oceanus is more competitive

[craggy totem]

Brain shorted out like "wait what and why are you taking it in Oceanus anywa-- oh"

[fervent frost]

is the current meta to go for builds with god keepsakes?

[nova oar]

Gonna play all my runs with bell now

[rustic basin]

I didn’t want to play with Wards more than I wanted to play with Void II

[storm glen]

oh i thought you lost a bet

[thin laurel]

whereas fields if my build, HP, and DDs are in a good place it's fun to gamble

[storm glen]

weong.reply

[fervent frost]

I've been playin at fates whim a lot more and it just feels.... better

[thin laurel]

and as I said the other day lol this is roughly my thought process for region 3 https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1426118288198602775/1448518676721434746/flowchart-fun.png?ex=693d87e4&is=693c3664&hm=096cb897ae7e27c1dc5be5889066db3588e6ab325e1dec77c7de5adf39052082

[rustic basin]

No LOL it was a gag at first and then the first run died to Cerb, so it felt pretty passable

[craggy totem]

Yeah, I lost a bet and the stakes were "my ability to parse chronological time"

[fervent frost]

for every feelsbad with a boon pick with the pom, it feels like everything is better

[rustic basin]

Shouldn’t have to do it again unless I want to speed up with Nergal’s 62

But even then, Wards is sometimes a legitimate help with getting Berserk healing off

[nova oar]

Opens up a lot more builds

[fervent frost]

especially with surface runs too

[dry whale]

Could someone tell me why certain words are spelt the way they are?

Examples being, daemons or magick

[craggy totem]

For the Vibe

[rotund hearth]

I've seen the light. Mel skull is superior

[craggy totem]

SGG didn't come up with those spellings ftr

[nova oar]

Medea is still the best skull tho

[tranquil wren]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daimon interesting read imo

[rotund hearth]

Magick has been used for a while to separate it from magic. It's pretty common in the fantasy genre. Daemons is new though

[craggy totem]

Daemon is not new

[tranquil wren]

also magick has also been just a variant spelling of the word magic

[rotund hearth]

New for me rather

[rotund hearth]

It's the same thing. Magick is just used to say magic but not magic. It's a quirk

[craggy totem]

They should have spelled it daimon 😏

[rotund hearth]

Also I think magic with a k is what modern witches use to distingush it from like magic tricks and cards and what not. Idk

There's also dracon

Which I know nothing about but it sounds cool when Mel says it

[icy halo]

Magick with a k is what people who want to feel fancy about their magic call it

It's the same as faerie vs fairy - faerie isn't actually older or more authentic at all (it's Victorian lol), it just looks radder

[craggy totem]

Dracon just semi throwback to the Greek (drakon)

I guess kinda like how they spelled it Heracles and not Herakles

[foggy sable]

toula just did the final hit on polyphemus

[cunning laurel]

tbf ive never seen herakles before

[craggy totem]

That would just be a direct transliteration from Greek!

Like if they had spelled Chaos as Khaos or something

That's actually a terrible example since it's a digraph

[rotund hearth]

I know this goes back to the first game but idk why it's Erebus and not Erebos. Like I like the change but it didn't need changing lol

[craggy totem]

In general I've been assuming that they've been going with the romanized transliterations, SGG didn't come up with this either

[rotund hearth]

That's fair

[craggy totem]

Idk if they did come up with anything genuinely unprecedented, in terms of name variants... well, all the ch- fish like charp I guess hahahah

[rotund hearth]

I saw a video essay that said Hades 2 was the Devs opportunity to put in all the Greek myth figures they couldn't fit into 1. Hence the characters basically doubling in number. Makes me wonder who they've left out that could be in a Hades 3

[rotund hearth]

Lolll.

[rotund hearth]

I don't think there should be a Hades 3 though

[tropic ravine]

Agreed, diff family but same wold is my idea

[verbal field]

Time for Aeneas to shine (?)

Uuuh who else. Perseus. Europe. Ganymede

Asclepius

[thin laurel]

I don’t want another mythology roguelike next, let alone a greek one, I want a supergiant games original world again

another hades-like in 2 or 3 games? sure. but idt it’s super healthy for the devs to get pigeonholed into doing mythology interpretations

[merry whale]

a supergiant rhythm game would be extremely funny

a couple bangin rhythm games dropped a few days ago

[verbal field]

Yeah, Hades 3 is a massive stretch, and a different mythology like, Idk, the Aztecs' Mitclán, would feel like the Rick Riordan of videogames and I ain't playing that 🤣

[craggy totem]

I and my irl bud who also loves SGG have for years bandied about the idea of them doing some kind of game where the music is wrapped up with the mechanics

[broken glen]

SGG has amazing original worldbuilding, I wanna see more of that

[craggy totem]

So like, if they do put out a rhythm game or something, I'll damn well be there lol

[thin laurel]

I’ll play whatever they release next, I just think like….. use the popular acclaim of hades to fund and advertise an original project! they didn’t set out to be The Mythology People

[merry whale]

yeaa it's very cool to play games tied to music sgg could def pull it off

[verbal field]

Music centred game yes please

[broken glen]

Does transistor not count

[thin laurel]

I’d also love to see the same gameplay concept of transistor but more polished and iterated on tbh. not a sequel since I think that story should be a one off, but

[craggy totem]

I think music is deeply tied to the plot of Transistor but not into the core mechanics

[thin laurel]

imo transistor ties the music to the storytelling and atmosphere a ton, but it’s not like music comes up as a combat mechanic beyond the ost dropping out and turning into a minimal ambient version with red humming during turn()s

[storm glen]

i want a game where yiu play as the Super Giant

[merry whale]

idk i still need to play the other sgg games so prob will wait for steam winter sale hopefully

and also hope they run on deck fine

[craggy totem]

Barring straight up bugginess, my experience leans toward "older games are less resource hungry anyway"

[merry whale]

transistor is the only deck verified one but prob will just get the rest of the collection anyway

[thin laurel]

I love transistor so much… also hades 1 and 2 have a lot of transistor dna in them tbh

the build customization system is very boon-like, but it’s like…
“what if every god just had one boon, but you could choose to use it as an active ability, a tier 2 upgrade to another active ability, or a passive ability” kind of. so many possible permutations

load() + jaunt() + breach() my beloved

[verbal field]

I bought Transistor a while ago but haven't played it. I'll get to it after finishing Hades 2's storyline

[craggy totem]

I don't remember a lot about the specific abilities anymore but I do remember loving jaunt()

[verbal field]

I got it along with Bastion, which I did play and quite liked

[thin laurel]

load = bomb you need to hit with something else to pop (it’s lucifer special from h1 without the pulses lol)
upgrading it with jaunt makes it blow itself up instantly
upgrading it with breach makes you able to drop it at long range

[craggy totem]

The combinatorics of it all!!!!!!

[wintry wharf]

Just learned from Hecate that Gale is pronounced literally Ga-le, I always called her as in, Gail

[hollow lily]

It's 2:10 am

[cunning laurel]

i swear mel says it when you tame her

[hollow lily]

And I finally finished the game

[craggy totem]

She says it when Gale tanks a hit too: "Thanks, Gale"

[wintry wharf]

Well, I never take Gale so hah 👍

[cunning laurel]

that'll do it. gale is good though!

[hollow lily]

One of the better familiars that's for sure

Toula fcking sucks

[pallid cradle]

Gale is good for higher fear even tho I question if Frinos isn't just better

[verbal field]

I love Toula. Fishing stresses me out

[craggy totem]

Frinos isn't just better

Well. Frinos is the better confidant.

And the better cutie-patootie with a blobby booty

[verbal field]

I've been forgetting to bring cookies to tame Gale for like ten runs

I swear I will do it next time!

[nova oar]

they did not, in fact, do it next time

[thin laurel]

Frinos is only better if you lose your Gale barriers to rly weak hits early in a region
at high fear with vow of pain on Gale can 100% block more total damage than Frinos gives you extra health, and then has some nice dodge chance on the side

[verbal field]

My priorities are giving treats (nectar) to the cutie-patootie (Icarus) I want the most to bring home

[nova oar]

TWINKY GAY BOY

[thin laurel]

tbqh I think Toula is better than Frinos for high fear, at least assuming you’re playing with DDs. waking her up is annoying, but the extra DD is quite good (and can be refilled and upgraded by echo and athena)
if you’re running strength at high fear and are awful at dodging weak enemies ig Frinos is best, but if you’re running strength at high fear I assume you’re good enough for Gale to be better

Frinos is great for confiding in, making psyche farming less annoying, funny hearty appetite builds, and sheep ball negation when you’re a new player. but I think he kinda struggles to find a place in most runs in the mid to late game

[verbal field]

Psyche farming is a lot of fun wdym

[craggy totem]

I got sidetracked into thinking about Melinoe's harem and realizing that she's the only one in that entire polycule who just says what's on her mind directly -- no avoidance, no posturing, no reticence or riddles. Gods help them.

[verbal field]

It brings me Age of Empires 2 "wololo" monk memories

[thin laurel]

if you want to skip it then Frinos is good for that at least. if you don’t want to skip it then it’s just 1 fewer use cases for frinos tho lol

[verbal field]

https://tenor.com/view/wololo-age-of-empires-empires-szaman-shaman-gif-21642450

[thin laurel]

admittedly I made a new save file for each patch before 1.0, and after a certain point farming psyche gets a bit dull, I just want to get back to max grasp if I’m already used to it. first time through I didn’t mind it rly

[verbal field]

Fair enough

I have been playing for less than two weeks, so everything is still fresh and new and exciting 😂

[verbal field]

I love her approach so far, she's not oblivious to the advances of others, but also doesn't take it personal if things go strangely, and she's very practical

And so earnest, who could not love her? (Narcissus could not love her, but he's Narcissus, so we don't care)

Narcissus is so freaking funny, I enjoy standing at the very entrance of his chamber to listen to him talking to his reflection

The inflection of his voice cracks me up

[cunning laurel]

laurel

[craggy totem]

It's so good

[wintry wharf]

Just watched someone take Boon x3 from Echo, and only got a single option? Last night was a Chaos trial, why does that apparently affect?

[cunning laurel]

perhaps they had every boon from previous night but 1

[verbal field]

First time I heard "Laura" and it got me in stitches. Laurel is still pretty funny, but Laura, oh, mate 🤣

[cunning laurel]

oh is it laura i forget

havent seen him in a bit 😔

[craggy totem]

It's Laurel

[verbal field]

I think it's Laurel in English and some localisations changed it to Laura

I'm almost positive it says Laura in my text box (German)

I'll try to confirm next time I see him

The thing is that it makes sense for him to call her Laurel because that's the plant the Greek used to crown their champions and gods

[cunning laurel]

hmm interesting

[verbal field]

Granted, Laura as a name comes from the word laurel/laureate, but it's too recent to be known by the ancient Greek civilization, it's more of a medieval name of Latin origin

Considering that the plant laurel is called Lorbeer in German, though, I completely understand that they went for the name Laura instead

I think the common name for laurel in English is bay leaf? At least when it's used to season food lol

[cunning laurel]

oh cant believe i didnt recognize that

[verbal field]

In Spanish (my first language) laurel is called, well, laurel, so it made it easier to spot

[thin laurel]

laurel is a fairly well known english word too—the bay laurel is the type that has bay leaves, but people also use it idiomatically in the greek sense, i.e. “resting on one’s laurels,” “due laurels” and so on

[devout cairn]

why yall talking about yanny

[verbal field]

What's yanny

[devout cairn]

anyone to get my epic reference

[verbal field]

Sjsjs I'm so sorry, I only watched the animatics up to Polyphemus

[devout cairn]

no not Epic reference, but a reference that happens to be epic

nvm...

[verbal field]

Oh

Lmfao

I'm so sorry (x2)

[devout cairn]

it's okay

[crude dragon]

It's from a really old audio recording that either sounds like "yanny" or "laurel" depending on a bunch of things like your speakers

[verbal field]

now that you say that, it rings a bell

[thin laurel]

depending on whether your speakers are black and blue or white and gold…. 👗

[wintry wharf]

So since friend is about to unlock it, Supay wanted like, Hestia attack, Zeus special was it?

[thin laurel]

hestia, zeus, and poseidon boons in general are good on attack special and rush, kind of in any combo tbh. just on-hit effects

supay special generally tends to carry the most for my runs

[wintry wharf]

👍

[tropic ravine]

I know right

[tidal cliff]

Raki hit Cerberus counter and got me killed😭

[wispy forum]

i love the game awards art in #announcements so much

i love melinoe and maelle's outfits

also, hornet just hanging out lol

[opal obsidian]

funny how everyone directly next to mel won awards (including mel)

[opal obsidian]

dk won family game, silksong won adventure, hades ii won action, and e33 won many things

[dire ibex]

Noticed while doing the pitch-black stone challenge 'Trial of the Drifter' (circe staff) that Hostile Environment (the Ares/Demeter duo) doesn't cause your cast to also actively follow your familiar, and I think it'd be super cool if it did. This isn't a bug I just think it'd be neat

[shrewd silo]

Engraved pin 466 health and mutual destruction is a great combo

[wintry wharf]

Does Supay work with Night? Since technically auto attack, does that break Omega combo?

[craggy totem]

What does it do instead? /never tried this

[dire ibex]

It casts at the familiar's location and then just stays there

Since circe staff doubles your cast on your familiar

So it'll follow melinoe as she moves but the familiar's cast is stationary

[craggy totem]

Oh interesting. I would have guessed that the second ocast would join up with your primary ocast, albeit a bit lagged.

I guess it's a bit of a grey area as far as the boon wording goes 🤔 It would be fun if it did follow the familiar though.

[hearty fog]

"Ares stinks." He has two boons that can double almost all damage in the game with minor conditions.

I watched one meteor from Total Eclipse do over 5000 damage.

[grave gorge]

Another night, another failed circe run

This time to the one-shot on rivals typhon, I was like a quarter second too slow getting to the safe circle

...that was attempt #26 of this ridiculous self-imposed goal

Imma go read a book, that's enough hades for one night

[nova oar]

What goal?

[grave gorge]

Don't ask me how it evolved to this, but:
-beat surface at my normal 35 fear
-using circe
-using winners circle

I vould change any of those three criteria and probably have a way easier run, but I don't wanna. I've been trying this enough that anything less will feel like giving up

[nova oar]

Doesn't seem that bad tbf

[craggy totem]

FWIW, giving up can always be a temporary state ;P

[grave gorge]

YOU WOULD THINK
BUT FOR SOME REASON IT'S BEEN WAY HARDER THAN OTHER WEAPONS

[grave gorge]

(In response to "doesn't seem that bad")

[craggy totem]

Anyhoo difficulty is always in the, er, hands of the player, I suppose

[grave gorge]

Super true

To the chronos one-shot, though
That's tilting lmao
That run had EVERYTHING I could have wanted

[nova oar]

Running for winners circle specifically is rough

[grave gorge]

Yeah, a fair number of runs have been reset because it refused to show up

[craggy totem]

Are you whimming or are you hard rerolling for it? /curious

[nova oar]

Surely it's rolls

[craggy totem]

The human spirit is a strange and sometimes strangely indefatigable thing 😆

[grave gorge]

Oh I'm hard rolling it

I usually play jpom, but not on these runs lol

I'm generally starting with apollo keepsake, then either aro phial (which always hits the worst option) or whatever god I want that I don't already have

[craggy totem]

Of course it always hits the worst option eheh

[grave gorge]

Every time I look
I go "good hit, good hit, that would suck, great hit, great hit. Okay, 20% chance of disappointment"
And yet, every time

[noble sapphire]

This is a really specific request but does anyone have a gif of Mel doing the "return to shadow now" spell and vanishing into the mark of hades
I think it would be a really funny way to peace out of a convo

Also, is it my imagination or does Aphrodite now share the streak across the eyes that Ares has?* I'm not too familiar with their relationship in Greek myth- I see them paired up in EPIC, and they share motifs here- and I know that Aphrodite has a war-goddess epithet, Aphrodite Areia
(*kinda rhetorical, ngl, I do see it, but I'm curious for the reasoning)

[thin laurel]

do you have success with non-winner's circle circe? cause if so lowkey I'd recommend anvil ring, it plays the most similarly to normal circe

grabbing a ranged cast of some kind may also help you out if you want to do Ωcast gameplay

tbh I might also just say take jpom and grab whoever 🤷 apollo, poseidon, hera, and hephaestus are all great winner's circle casts. ares won't do double damage in single target but he has some good omega cast stuff, and demeter's cast is nice for safety + omega cast stuff + arctic gale

[thin laurel]

she does share it now yes! prob because it's wartime

• also ares and aphrodite are certainly uh..... associated with each other in mythology

[rustic basin]

Do I go Momus, Nergal, or Persephone for the next 62F

Can’t decide on which to get out of the way lol

[thin laurel]

I'd go Momus cause I think it's kinda fun, but it's probably the weakest of the three
Persephone is definitely the easiest if you want something not too hard

[rustic basin]

I’ve got Arti, Eos, and Nyx lined up so I’m not too worried about having any easier ones to destress

[thin laurel]

I'd find arti annoying but I hate that aspect 🙃 so. just a me problem

[rustic basin]

Momus might be a case of Void II / Wards 0 tho

[thin laurel]

momus I think it depends if you want to try to use some amount of omegas versus just play aspectless staff with good hammer rng

I'd prob want to either ocast or oatk at least a bit, but that's more annoying to deal with

idt wards should be too bad tho

[rustic basin]

Yeh, I mostly just hate ignoring Aspects

I did it for Selene and Shiva but the former was because Selene lowkey sucks and Shiva’s main gameplay is just not built to handle Wards all things considered lol

[rustic basin]

Also shouldn’t be too big of a deal since Blades with the auto-fire tech are just stupid strong as a whole. It’s worse than Mel in that aspect (heh) but should make up for it a decent bit if I’m smart about Riposting

[thin laurel]

tbh I just personally suck at blades, trying to get better but rn the non morrigan aspects give me crazy timer issues even with a good start smh

[rustic basin]

Mel has been practically free wins nonstop but Pan did give me a bit of a headache for the first two attempts since I haven’t been allowing myself to take Trick Knives (nor do I want to anyway)

Will say that balancing how I deal with Revenants has been very nice for the Blades since their in-fight mobility is pretty passable, so that may be nice to hone in generally vs. timer

[thin laurel]

revenants don't tend to be an issue for me I think, more just. wards + AoE
but also when I was doing every aspect 40f I heph blast gimmicked my way through mel blades lol, so. idk. I'll work on it

[rustic basin]

Wards on Blades tends to be the least of my worries unless it’s non-ignored-Aspect Pan and utilizing Arti crits, but it does depend

The auto-fire stuff really, really helps with it too, though, and also with the AoE issues since the Spesh has that range you’re looking for. Cannot recommend it enough

[noble sapphire]

ah, yeah, okay
Aphrodite tells Ares to side with Troy in the Trojan War, among other details

the Sophist teacher Libanius "makes the apple sacred to Ares", and apples are one of Aphrodite's sacred fruits

[wintry wharf]

Alright! I beat R4 Typhon for the first time just now! Wooo. That's every Rival bested

[dreamy socket]

aredite mention 🤤

[noble sapphire]

Yeah, I think that when you explore the epithets of the Theoi, you unlock a hidden world of perspectives on them

They may not be as universally attested as critical myths like the Golden Apple or the birth of Dionysus, but like
Heck yeah tell me about Zeus eating a cthonic fertility snake god

[dreamy socket]

mythos aside their cults were also intertwined in antiquity

[noble sapphire]

I would really love to learn more about the mystery cults
If you have any sources you recommend I'd be in your debt

[noble sapphire]

BTW, I'm referencing Zeus Meilichios here, a depiction of Zeus as a giant snake associated with purification and fertility

Originally a daimon honored in Athens, syncretized into Zeus as an epithet

The best way I can describe the epithets of the Theoi is like, if we can wear multiple 'hats' as human beings, they can wear multiple 'hats' as divinities

[dreamy socket]

i don't have think i have any specific cult articles saved but i do have a bunch of general classics pdfs

minored in it and i still love them

[noble sapphire]

Like Apollo Smintheus (Sminthos meaning "mouse") is Apollo acting as a god protecting crops from mice and people from plagues

I love the Epithets, they're like learning the Greek gods have all these titles and certificates of their honor and mastery transcending what a human lifetime can accomplish It truly makes them both larger-than-life yet relatable in a way

[dreamy socket]

sooo true

[noble sapphire]

In a way it reminds me of the Patron Saints, how they have umbrellas of things they represent and facilitate
I'm not religious myself, but I study comparative religion as a hobby

I think that there are ripples from one cast stone (repetition, syncretism, co-opting a pagan belief) and then there are underlying waves of ideas that just repeat through human society, and parsing them as separate can be difficult
but that's just me

[opal garnet]

Random question but what would a fresh file completion equal to in fear?

[craggy totem]

Well, it's basically max Void aint it

Though the thing is that Void isn't worth many points of Fear despite having a huge impact

[opal garnet]

I mean difficulty wise. I should e made that more clear, sry.

[craggy totem]

Well, what I'm saying is that Fear level is a poor proxy for difficulty due to the fact that the points don't directly represent difficulty on a consistent scale

[noble sapphire]

whenever i look at achievements like beating summit and see less than 30% of players have unlocked it i just sit back like that pikmin meme and go "im good at video games?"

[opal garnet]

Fair.

[opal garnet]

lol

[noble sapphire]

always kind of assumed i would be dogwater at this but
well, life finds a way, i say, looking at my run having and consuming at least 4 DDs if not 5

however i will say playing without death defiance so you proc strength and athena is intoxicating, living on the edge again and being rewarded for it feels really good after relying on death defiance

[opal garnet]

But I mean, would it be as difficult as 50f or 40f? Or something kind of like that. Not really asking what the exact equivalent would be but how the difficulty compares to beating another specific fear number.

I suppose that is kind of hard to know though.

[craggy totem]

I mean, that's the thing though. People doing 40F are usually doing "the easiest 40F". They wouldn't be taking Void.

[thin laurel]

yeah idk how to compare that
you could in theory turn on pain for the eris curse, max void for no arcana, and then... idk, enough grit to counteract your aspect bonus, and don't use keepsakes or familiars? but it's a different sort of challenge for the most part

but I think that's the best way to compare it, specific vows not fear levels
since you can make a 20 fear that's proooobably harder than 40 with the right combo of vows lol

[craggy totem]

Like the whole reason that 62F exists as a category that people discuss as its own thing is because of One Specific Vow (Void), not because the number 62 inherently indicates a particular difficulty level

Grit kinda makes sense as the thing to approximate no aspect bonus for staff I guess, since Mel staff's most salient feature is just "lol have some power"

Keepsakes and familiars and all that jazz tho 🤔

[thin laurel]

tbh you can probably just do something like take chrolex and never use it, or take apollo keepsake and never use the rarify so it RLY mirrors the first run lol
and you can do no familiar runs

[noble sapphire]

i think one of the big like, midgame challenges of hades/hades 2 is figuring out which heat/fear things your boons, keepsake, weapon, and frankly, playstyle can cope with

like, i can handle large swarms because i prioritize either hypermobility/crushing swift blows or range

i use high attack rate weapons so a point or two of shielding isn't as bad as it could be, since it clears in any one instance of damage no matter how big or small

[grave gorge]

I HAVE BEEN SUMMONED TO AGREE WITH USER RENSIXX

[craggy totem]

LMAO

[noble sapphire]

i generally use wards 1 since it plays ok with my muscle memory but i can probably handle wards 2

i'm very fond of aspect of pan lim and oros

[thin laurel]

also yeah, wards is SO weapon dependent fr
anything with fast hits or multihit just shreds it 🤷

[grave gorge]

Daggers my beloved 💜

[noble sapphire]

admittedly it took me quite a few runs to realize that Cast was not just a way to trap enemies you ran past, but to keep them away if you use range and are squishy

it makes the lack of an 'aim Cast' boon less painful if i use the latter function

[grave gorge]

Cast is also a great to clear wards if you're on a slower weapon and you got a cast like hestia or demeter

[noble sapphire]

however i also really like the ranged casts. a lot.

[craggy totem]

Most of them are p fun

[noble sapphire]

because sometimes a good stack of cast boons + a ranged cast boon is just
"Everybody over there needs to suffer and not escape"

also, like
cast can do absolutely hilarious things to rushdown bosses like hellifish

I like this game because it's not exactly an equal climb in difficulty vs strength
Sometimes you beef it and get by on the skin of your teeth, sometimes you faceroll the unmodified game
Oath of Night can make you Afraid again, and I like when games have this push-and-pull

[gritty kettle]

Just here to say that i love Circe

Bye

[noble sapphire]

"Pft, Unrivaled Hecate was easy. How bad can Unrivaled Polyphemus be?"
[beat]
RETURN TO SHADOW NOW

[noble sapphire]

she's an utterly delightful representation

[grave gorge]

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

[noble sapphire]

circe has such like, fun weird aunt energy
not the wine aunt, more like the crime aunt

in your family tree there are two crime aunts. one is the girlypop. the other is the goth /j

[grave gorge]

I do love feeling like I've fine-tuned the game's difficulty to exactly what gives me a fun, challenging time without being too easy or punishing

[noble sapphire]

yeah the oath of night/disciplinary measures from the first (i didn't complete hades 1) are a really fun way to be like
"Oh, this would be okay for me", vs, "This would screw with me really hard and forces me to shore up a weakness in my playstyle"

If you amp an aspect of enemies to the point you can't ignore it and live, it forces you to become better at the game in specific ways

[oblique hemlock]

holy moly fine line on nyx coat is awesome, fastest clear ever

[noble sapphire]

yknow i haven't actually field tested selene or nyx coat, i should
i didnt even figure out how to use nyx coat on schelly properly

[grave gorge]

Selene is fun

[noble sapphire]

do the beams home at all when used around real enemies

felt very isaac crack the sky when i tested it in the training ground

[craggy totem]

Apparently it's hard to control the split special hits, but you are theoretically able to control the split attack hits

[grave gorge]

They're instant hit, so they don't need to track the enemies, but they do have a very limited range

[noble sapphire]

oh yeah no when i say homing i mean, the selene beams target rather than just random dispersal

[craggy totem]

Oh you were talking about Sky Fall not Nyx djfjhhdsjf

[grave gorge]

Yeah, they autotarget random nearby enemies

[noble sapphire]

short range is fine i just was worried they were indiscriminate so a pop of the hex could be genuinely useless if you were unlucky with rng
good to know they target

besides xinth is literally one of the close-up melee roflmao Arms, short range is par for the course

[dreamy socket]

sky fall 🤤🤤

[grave gorge]

Also make sure you take Ares at some point for the godsent

[craggy totem]

Yeah, apparently some people were taken by surprise when they saw that Sky Fall was melee range

[noble sapphire]

i mean i can see it if they depend heavily on the rockets instead

but for those people i have one argument and solution in twain

launcher frame

launcher frame is one of the daeds that literally made me laugh when i saw it

[grave gorge]

I do get less mad at the rockets being useless when I don't have to press the button to launch them, yes

[noble sapphire]

'what do you mean i just shoot rockets WHILE punching people instead of as an alternative'

[merry whale]

launcher frame is stupid good for just turning ur gameplan to spamming atk

[noble sapphire]

'hello? aphrodite department? yes i'm in close range. yes forever now. thanks.'

[craggy totem]

I mean you can already spam special and attack together normally

[merry whale]

the alternative is spamming specials which is still stupid good

[craggy totem]

It's one of the things that I think I'm screwing up badly on Shiva, because you can't do that on Shiva, you just interrupt your own attack and stand there stupidly if you try

[noble sapphire]

the aphrodite boon that applies weak and magic regen paired with xinth/lim and oros, and optionally swarm, is like
"who needs the unseen arcanum"

"i literally just get meteoric mp regen for doing what i was going to do anyway"

[grave gorge]

close range

[noble sapphire]

there are many roads to ephyra

[craggy totem]

No there aint there's only one I take it all the time smh

[noble sapphire]

btw question, does ephyra ever like, have a higher number of doors open or is it purely a random set every time of a specific number

[craggy totem]

Always the same number

[noble sapphire]

ah okay

[craggy totem]

But I think the number of "extra" backrooms, the optional ones, miiiight be flexible?

Not 100% sure on that

[noble sapphire]

i was going to say, now that i think about it, having all the pylon doors open removes a lot of the opportunity cost

and the cost of fates whim which is a big deal

though i dont have any fates whim keepsakes yet

like, if strength/athena disincentivizes using dd, fates whim disincentivizes using dice

i could actually take or leave the dice because i'm not really optimizing my runs much and i didn't hate the lack of dice THAT bad in the no arcanum hecate run

. . partly because i forgot major and minor finds were separate categories that couldn't reroll between each other with dice

[grave gorge]

I mean
You can still use dds with strength, you literally can't have the dice arcana on for FW

[noble sapphire]

no yeah

besides strength can just pop when you're losing dd, you don't have to start without it

that said, athena's keepsake won't proc if you have any dd iirc

[craggy totem]

You can but ehhhhhhhhhhhh

[grave gorge]

But honestly, I prefer FW most of the time

I get it about not wanting to give up the dice, but remember that's, what, 8 grasp you're getting back to use on other things?

[noble sapphire]

you can frontload strength and just be the roflcopter or you can use it in a panic scenario

[grave gorge]

Oh I didn't mean to imply you should

[noble sapphire]

yeah that's a really good point

i have maxed grasp and 8 more grasp is absolutely nothing to scoff at

plus the dice arcana are like, loaded in the corner and split among grasp costs in a way they don't contribute to the 0-costs (no row/column activation, risks equal costs)

[craggy totem]

That was something which actually surprised me when I was watching a speedrun earlier -- "why didn't they convert the minor boon in early Erebus?" then I realized that speedrunners run rerolls and that probably doesn't leave enough grasp for Artificer

[grave gorge]

Except for the 0-cost in the bottom right, which I forget what it is but I rememver it's good

[noble sapphire]

wait, do you actively get the ability to reroll minors into majors with artificer?

i assumed it just turned a couple random minors into majors

[grave gorge]

No, it's active

[noble sapphire]

oh my god

oh my god i thought it was dookie it's actually really good

[grave gorge]

You get three rolls

[craggy totem]

You actively choose to convert the reward after you have earned it by beating the encounter

[noble sapphire]

afterwards?!

[grave gorge]

It's REAL good

[noble sapphire]

i assumed it was just 'invisibly converts your seed to giving you x majors where they would have been minors'

[craggy totem]

Nup

[noble sapphire]

that's
WAY
BETTER

is it me or does the text absolutely not inform you of how good that arcanum is

[grave gorge]

AND
it doesn't count as dice
So it doesn't turn off Fate's Whim

[noble sapphire]

You have 1/2/3/4 chance(s) this night to turn any Minor Find into a random Major Find.

okay, with hindsight, i see how this would imply it's voluntary, but definitely not after getting the reward already

[craggy totem]

Yeah, the second part isn't clear at all from the description

[grave gorge]

It's ambiguously worded for sure

[noble sapphire]

i just assumed it could pop randomly, x times max

[noble sapphire]

i ignored an entire arcanum because of how i assumed it worked

and it's a good arcanum

[grave gorge]

But no, it works the way you would hope unlike concave stone

[craggy totem]

What was the phrase.... "many such cases"? :P

[noble sapphire]

my binding of isaac brain must have assumed it would just be loaded in the most like
"If this helps it's purely random chance. Pound sand" way

[craggy totem]

TBF you can still roll suboptimally, like maybe you're on a low magick aspect and it just converts the bones you earned into..... max MP

[noble sapphire]

Heartwarming: This Roguelite Is Not Actively Trying To Screw You Over (You Do That Exclusively To Yourself)

[craggy totem]

Or maybe you're currently under the effect of the "no money" Chaos curse and it converts it into money lmao

[noble sapphire]

in half my runs max MP might as well literally be a minor find, ngl

[grave gorge]

Yeah, fair warning for this

You don't get to reroll the roll, so be prepared for mostly mana and hearts

[noble sapphire]

i meannnnnn if it can give me hearts that would be really nice

[grave gorge]

But sometimes it rolls exactly the boon you needed

[noble sapphire]

turning random metagame scrap/scrip into max health for the night sounds good

[craggy totem]

You do have the incant that gives you a tiny bit of max hp for ashes right

[noble sapphire]

like if i want ash i'll farm ash, if i want bones i'll use gravethirst generally

[noble sapphire]

qhar

i've never seen that before

[nova oar]

My body is a machine that turns room 2 ashes heroic blitz

[craggy totem]

Okay you'll probably unlock it later

[noble sapphire]

ngl when i hit 50 incants i was convinced there were almost no more to unlock

[grave gorge]

Rookie numbers

[craggy totem]

There's a later-game incantation that gives minor "within this run" bonuses to the metagame minors

[noble sapphire]

like i have the lifesprings, a lot of the crossroads features, almost all the story necessary ones up to firstclear of typhon and 5clear of chronos

[craggy totem]

Ashes are +5 max HP, bones +5 max MP, nectar a random pom (you don't get to pick what it hits)

[noble sapphire]

oh my god
oh my god nectar poms????

[grave gorge]

Nectar real good

[noble sapphire]

if nectar = pom i would take it WAY MORE OFTEN

i went wide not tall on the social links so far because i wanted keepsakes immediately

[grave gorge]

Esp early in a run if you have specific boons

[craggy totem]

TFW it just hits your rush boon or something

[noble sapphire]

ugffhghughughgu i have got to figure out how to unlock that incant

[grave gorge]

Room 1 epic heph special
Room 2 pom
Room 3 nectar
BUILD ALREADY FINISHED, RUN IS FREE NOW

[craggy totem]

I think the person who was working on updating the wiki said they'd gotten the incantation requirements up to date, you could try checkin it (I have not and cannot in fact confirm anything there)

[noble sapphire]

ngl i was convinced i was at the point where the only latitude i had to reduce the difficulty was never touch fear and always upgrade my keepsakes and arms

an incant that makes minor finds actually useful beyond currency is incredible stuff

okay, they're unlocked by gathering enough of the relevant minor finds, you get all three when you get the right amount of each

[grave gorge]

Get to farming!

[noble sapphire]

would the statistics shade tell me how many i've collected of each

[craggy totem]

I don't think so

[noble sapphire]

cries in nectar

[nova oar]

No

[noble sapphire]

i want to say if anything it's the nectar holding me back

there's no way i've gathered 50 total

i guess we're nectarmaxxing

i wonder if that counts brewed nectar

[grave gorge]

If you really wanna count you can go through your codex and count relationship levels to see how many you've given away

[noble sapphire]

huh, good point

[grave gorge]

Ah, nvm, this would probably screw with the count

[noble sapphire]

well i havent though