h2-discussion

[craggy totem]

They're talking about the one for non-Great CB or CA.

[red agate]

there's one that says "two chaos trials" I think you have to do them back to back?

[nova oar]

No?

[red agate]

oh really? that's a relief

then this is the last one that seems hard then

[nova oar]

Not sure what achievement you're talking about

[craggy totem]

Improbable Outcomes

The one for Chaos ___ trials that are not Great

[red agate]

yeah this one

[nova oar]

Ohhhhhh

[fathom kindle]

on room 11, if i get offered chaos and shop, is there any benefit to taking chaos? (for speedruns tehe)

[nova oar]

Not really

[drowsy briar]

why is hephaestus so annoying in double boon rooms :(

[nova oar]

CLANG

[drowsy briar]

also is there any difference in the rarity depending on who you go for first

[nova oar]

No

[thin laurel]

REAL. he is my least favorite god to deal with and idek why, he’s just annoying

[drowsy briar]

good good. so its just "who sucks the least to go against"

[nova oar]

Yep

[carmine dragon]

I really like the Cast for Hephaestus because if you listen to his dialogue, thats all he does in a dark cave alone is bang his hammer, and the sound youre hearing when you cast is the sound hes making all the time lol

[heavy peak]

I might be out of my depth here but I think that chaos is rarely a good idea for speedruns, he can give you some great bonuses but he'll almost always force you to play slower because of the debuff

[drowsy briar]

i thought he'd be like zeus but... the time to react from his AoE appearing is just way too short

how i went 40 hours without ever encountering him in a double boon room, I have no idea.

[carmine dragon]

Its kinda funny, when I played Hades 1 I always wished I could see the gods in person or go to olympus......so glad it finally happened for most of the gods anyways....still missing some

[devout cairn]

hephaestus hurts and he really forces you to play in his rhythm

[heavy glen]

twilight curse does not work on talos cause it's not alive, but it was zeus-charged and id a boatload of damage anyway

[little mason]

its alive

[covert badge]

she's alive!

[craggy totem]

Speedrunners have talked about taking Chaos rooms deliberately! I believe the rationale is that it basically skips an encounter. But the reason that it's not suggested in the context of the question that person was asking is, probably, that a shop is already not an encounter

[neat frigate]

I will deal with two hephs at the same time before I pick against hera

[thin laurel]

it’s a lot faster than clearing a full room, and some of the chaos curses are no big deal (and one is even helpful lol if you play on huntress)
doing it without rerolls is risky since you can get stuck with three choices which are all bad, but chances are at least 1/3 curses is doable, and even if the bonus is awful the time save is worth it

[neat frigate]

https://tenor.com/view/kris-pronouns-deltarune-kris-deltarune-deltarune-kris-pronouns-they-them-gif-6074482569525867005

Damn gifs don’t work 💔💔

[thin laurel]

you wouldn’t take chaos over stuff like shops and arachne which fully pause the timer, but they’re great for speeds most of the time tbh (also getting them room one of fields is amazing imo)

[covert badge]

also chaos's boon ||gives chunks of money if using time piece (fates whim run)||

[little mason]

why not just abuse pause on the start button

[drowsy briar]

this run is a little crazy but i also popped off this run. i beat chronos by only taking damage once

[thin laurel]

pausing by opening the menu doesn’t make it faster to clear an encounter, it just saves time while you make choices like which door to pick, but it doesn’t make you kill enemies faster

[neat thicket]

about to beat 24F typhon with the most scuffed circe build to ever scuffed

[neat thicket]

tidal ring and glowing coal is the entire build, at level 4 and 10 respectively, no winners circle, no damage boosts, nothing

[broken glen]

Level 10 glowing coal is crazy

[neat thicket]

+4 to start and i never once saw tidal ring on a pom

[crystal fossil]

tidal ring

[broken glen]

If only you got the ares duo

Fireball with wounds

[little mason]

didnt use rerolls?

[neat thicket]

the game didnt want me having cast boons otherwise lol, i went all the way to 2nd charon shop in rift with no cast boon because ive got fates whim on

[crystal fossil]

fates whim runs are kinda weird

[little mason]

f fate and f there whims

[neat thicket]

i love fates whim, i havent used rerolls a single time on this file lmao

[crystal fossil]

its like big number vs synergy

[little mason]

im sick of all these fates on this mf whimsplane

[neat thicket]

17 minutes for a 24f surface run aint bad considering how awful the build was lol

oh not even full 17 minutes, 16 and a half

[little mason]

is that a world record for the slowest run?

[neat thicket]

my slowest run in a while, not particularly slow compared to some people though

[devout cairn]

someone did a toula only run that took 300 minutes or something

[little mason]

now thats someone with no life would that be you by chance?

[neat thicket]

there we go, ody prophecy obtained now to take off pom for the first time in a long time

[devout cairn]

nope i have many friends and am loved by thousands of people

[little mason]

people say vortex you are very loved and by so many people too.

[covert badge]

The legend says someone has been running afk on Erebus' first room since day 1, and is still going to this day...

[pallid cradle]

... The dedication is immaculate.

You think they would've entered chamber 2 out of sheer curiosity.

[neat thicket]

im going to eat their power cables.

[devout cairn]

and then when it's about to end they get caught by a time bubble and die to chronos' oneshot

[pallid cradle]

Standard Nergal player behavior tbh.

[neat thicket]

all i know is bonk, all i want is bonk, all i need is bonk, all i am is bonk

[little mason]

throwing shaded-ed-ed-ed

[pallid cradle]

Y'all probably do runs while munching a box of Crayolas.

[thin laurel]

in the wise words of echo:
bonk, bonk, bonk

[little mason]

only grape

[neat thicket]

twistables actually

[broken glen]

I love psychic whirlwind cycling!

[pallid cradle]

Fair enough

[pulsar bluff]

Does anyone know what I need psyche and ashes for after after being done with arcana

[little mason]

but you probably suck on those smelly felt pens

[neat thicket]

my username is made even funnier by the fact that i havent even unlocked nergal on my update file yet

[pulsar bluff]

I haven't even seen anything that requires them in like a week but it still says needed

[covert badge]

incantations and stuff, if it shows as needed resources on the wretched broker UI, just keep them for now

[thin laurel]

two aspects are upgraded via those mats
some incantations, some decorations

they're cheap enough that if you want to sell them rn you can, but they don't give much kudos either 🤷

[meager walrus]

you might still need shadow for something

[pulsar bluff]

Ohhhh decorations is probably what it is

I've done like two

[robust hare]

Whats the fastest way of getting nightmare? chaos trials?

[craggy totem]

Chaos trials give Stardust, don't they?

[robust hare]

oh right

[covert badge]

testament, broker and charon pre-order

[robust hare]

ok ok ive been doing that, ig i should just keep playing

[pallid cradle]

Correct

[robust hare]

i need like 10 more to max out all aspects

[pallid cradle]

The first time you complete them anyway. After that they give bones.

[proper forge]

Hi, just wondering if there are any post-1.0 interviews from anyone at Supergiant? But especially Greg or, I know the odds are low, Gavin. But really just looking for any.

[rotund fossil]

Are the chances for Story Room's options weighted in any way?
I've been trying, actively, to get Life Savings from Narcissus, to finish my very last Prophecy
And the game just wont give it to me

I'll either go , counted, 30 runs through oceanis and NOT see Narcisus
Or, when I do see him, he wont offer me Life Savings ever

[broken glen]

Life savings requires death defiance to be on (if you’re running strength)

[rotund fossil]

I'm aware, I've been trying all month,,

[broken glen]

Oof, sorry

[pulsar bluff]

I need to get the death defiance refill boon from Athena

[rotund fossil]

At least with athena you can gurentee you'll find her with her keepsake

[pallid cradle]

All month? Brother it is the 21st and you haven't seen the boon? Damn.

[rotund fossil]

I have to do a run
Go to oceanis, and restart when i get to scylla or go to narcissus and he wont give me life savings

[robust hare]

are there legendary fish like there were in H1?

[rotund fossil]

This has been at least 30 hours of my gameplay

[covert badge]

i think you have to spend at least 1 dd?

[rotund fossil]

I have been, i die on purpose to hecate every run

[covert badge]

oof

[pallid cradle]

You're hitting undo night then rerolling your fate right?

[rotund fossil]

Mhmhmhm

[broken glen]

Unluckiest man alive

[covert badge]

lord have mercy

[rotund fossil]

I'm getting different seeds, just none of them ever either have narcisus, or it'll have him and it wont give me life savings

[pulsar bluff]

My problem is that I need the one that replenishes dd, which you can't have if you're running her keepsake

[pallid cradle]

Well damn.

[rotund fossil]

Oh , yeah fair enough i thought you were talking about the one that primes 100 magick for a dd

at least athena can be rerolled,,
im considering installing a mod that lets you reroll story rooms b/c im getting kinda fed up with the rng

[covert badge]

there's also a mod that guaranteed story room

[rotund fossil]

Oh?

That would make my life a lot easier, if only to just have installed for this one prophecy

[pulsar bluff]

Also I need Hephaestus godsent hex thingy

[rotund fossil]

What's it called?

[pallid cradle]

I know how to fix this actually.

Send me your PC/Switch/Steamdeck. I'll let my girl do a run on your game. She'll probably get it.

(I let her do 1 run on my account and she got 2 legendaries + 3 duos)

[carmine dragon]

Wow people really think they made Hades 2 just because Hades 1 was successful? Clearly havent seen the video on the devs thought processes behind when it comes to making their next game. If they just kept making hades 3/4/5 it would quickly lose its value. I think after Hades 2 its going to be done otherwise it will turn into any other overplayed story.

[covert badge]

PonyQOL2

[stiff burrow]

Wow a 15:13 that's a new record for me

[stoic urchin]

wow glorious disaster REALLY is the worst duo

[little mason]

its so bad

[lusty burrow]

whats glorious disaster do

[nova oar]

Nothing

[stiff burrow]

pair it with channeling omega cast 100% faster apollo???

While having the 50 damage minimum zeus infusion

Damn that really is horrible

[lyric zenith]

Worse than nothing, p sure it prevents you from omega casting unless you channel longer

Or at least I had issues procing prominence flare the one time I had it

[wispy storm]

is suffering on sight equal chance for all values?

[glass condor]

And it costs more mana

[lyric zenith]

^ it can kill an omega cast build

[stoic urchin]

wasnt it good af in like

a handful of patches ago in early access

[little frost]

when it could be triggered by charon yea

[stoic urchin]

damn

[covert badge]

4% 999 damage
8% 100-998 damage
88% 1-99 damage

[stoic urchin]

so basically it sucks 💔

[covert badge]

it auto clears 1 wards tho

[craggy totem]

Good point

[heavy glen]

omg
twilight curse works on typhon's eyeball

[craggy totem]

YEP. It's a super high utility hex!

[stoic urchin]

thats the morph?

[craggy totem]

Mhm.

It doesn't work on the main "body" of the minibosses but it works on the big rolly eyeball that Eye of Typhon spits out

[little frost]

works on some minibosses, any that dont have a title and boss health bar

[craggy totem]

Most minibosses, even. Super handy for the annoying ones.

[heavy glen]

i got it to work on charybdis' tentacles, it was quite funny

[little frost]

hellifish and dracon and yargo are my biggest miniboss sheeps

[craggy totem]

This might be a hot take but if Selene offered me half moon Twilight Curse vs full moon Wolf Howl... I've come around on Wolf Howl to some extent but I'm still taking Twilight lmao

[little frost]

and of course any adds in boss fights

[heavy glen]

typhon, father of all sheep

[craggy totem]

They should rename it Twilight Blessing (it blesses Melinoe's twilight, because she doesn't have to deal with as many annoyances)

[stable marsh]

Does ||waking Hypnos actually do anything (I know he just leaves)? As in, does it unlock an incantation or anything needed in the future, or can I just leave him there basically forever without missing anything?||

[heavy glen]

you get a prophecy done if you wake him

it gives 2 nightmares

and sometimes characters will talk about him
that's it

[craggy totem]

Spoilers...

[covert badge]

manifesting lv 10 aspect mods

[craggy totem]

Anyway, it's funny that Melinoe is the one goddess who definitely would rather have nightmares than sweet dreams

Yeah, yeah, it's her divine domain, but

[bronze stream]

That's probably the #1 dichotomy between EA players and non EA players, whether they're bothered by the Hypnos questline ending or not

[craggy totem]

Imagine she gets a wee bit offended if you say 'sweet dreams' to someone in her presence

[neat thicket]

at some point i should try setting up a build with insane magick cost, i have it really fun to have 55 magick cost axe specials and i can definitely get it way higher

[heavy glen]

i was non ea and saw people complaining so i knew it was coming but still felt kinda sad about it

[little mason]

What does she say about wet dreams?

[craggy totem]

I think that's Poseidon's territory

[stable marsh]

ah okay. I guess I'll just do it.|| I like the way the crossroads cosmetics look around when he is there though||

[heavy glen]

he leaves some toys behind so it's not barren

[stoic urchin]

is there a way i can find all hades sound effects? specifically chaos's

[stable marsh]

Yeah I'm just picky haha

[pale pier]

Wrong chat

[stoic urchin]

whom

[craggy totem]

Besides Fine Line, what are the other boons that increase magick usage? There's that one skull hammer, though it's mana loss rather than usage, there's that one with the fireball special...?

[neat thicket]

fireball special, cut above, ocean swell

[covert badge]

Apollo: Exceptional Talent: +30 Magick
Demeter: Weed Killer: +10 Magick
Hera: Fine Line: +15 Magick
Poseidon: Ocean Swell: +5 Magick
Ares: Cut Above: +5 Magick
Hestia: Controlled Burn: +10 Magick
Icarus: Explosive Intent: +10 Magick

[stable marsh]

Any tips for Vow of Rivals Eris? Got beaten down by her like 5 times before I just barely won once. Genuinely find it the hardest of the boss fights (I just unlocked VoR 3 so haven't tried those). Although I find Polyphemus VoR is also hard. The vow certainly makes bosses way harder than Extreme Measures did

[craggy totem]

Backstab her as much as possible (semi-metaphorically). What weapons/aspects are you using?

[heavy glen]

so far i found VOR eris easier than normal eris because the lasers were easier to dodge than the spread shot, but i haven't faced her with every weapon combo yet

You can destroy her landmines before she shoots and then dash behind her.

[stable marsh]

I think I tried with Axe, Blades, Torches and Skull (Medea), but I can't remember as I last played a couple weeks ago. I feel like my builds are generally good and I follow rough guides/tips I've found

I just take too much damage against her

[heavy glen]

https://hades.fandom.com/wiki/Eris/Combat#Vow_of_Rivals

[craggy totem]

try coat but no yeah, just always be tagging behind her as much as possible, dash like the very blazes, and if you have Gale unlocked that could help with survivability

(As a certified coward I also always try to have at least 200 health and hopefully some armor by the time I hit Eris)

[stable marsh]

I think I already knew about all those attacks. iirc I get destroyed by the bomb things she leaves behind. Feel like some weapons don't have the range, or if they do I still get smacked by the delay before they explode and disappear while trying to dodge her shots

[little mason]

Nah you have an impossibly cautious debuff

[craggy totem]

LMAO

[heavy glen]

i think toula can destroy bombs? or at least get eris

[neat thicket]

funny enough this build is gonna be a fun one to use the unseen arcana card on

[stable marsh]

I've actually only used coat like 2 times lol, I should start trying it. I feel I've been doing what you said but I'll give it a few more goes

[heavy glen]

good luck!

[craggy totem]

I'm partly joking because most players seem to not like the coat, but also partly, hey, maybe you'll be One Of Us (weirdoes)

And having a weapon you actually like can be a help on its own 😆

[little mason]

I use unseen arcana if I use the fear that kills boons because I never choose mana boons

Coats like one the easist weps

[stable marsh]

haha I was wondering. As far as I've read the best way to use it is generally just weave in attack and special and ignore omegas, but I may be wrong. I'm sure omegas can work obvs

[little mason]

Yeah I use the button on my controller that let's me spam attacks or specials

[neat thicket]

alright, bets on how high magick usage i can get my axe special?

[stable marsh]

Is it weird I've always played Hades 1 and 2 on MnK?

[craggy totem]

I am no pro, but IMO there's plenty of time to prep coat omega special while you're waiting out Eris' invulnerability periods. The omega attack shield can also be useful in some circumstances.

[little mason]

Mnk?

[craggy totem]

Mouse and keyboard. No, it's not odd.

[little mason]

Not odd just special

[stable marsh]

Walking animations probably look nicer on controller lol

[covert badge]

im full keyboard for both games
ye not weird at all

[little mason]

What a clown

[stable marsh]

good to know it's not just me then

[craggy totem]

Another KBM player here 🖐️

[nova oar]

You just use autoaim?

[stable marsh]

Yeah it's good between waves and such but I'm pretty sure special outdamages the omega with how quick you can use it

[nova oar]

I play controller but want to learn mnk

[craggy totem]

Become a MNKey 😈

[stable marsh]

Whatever default is personally. Apparently aim assist is on. Hmm I wonder what it is like with it off

[covert badge]

ye noob issue ik i like soft lock-on function in games

[little mason]

What's next another player plays with a joystick and some arcade buttons

[neat thicket]

dont tempt me to bind my cast to my foot pedals

[little mason]

Return to mnkey 🐒

[nova oar]

Nooooo ion wanna

[craggy totem]

Or I guess the alternative is to be a KBooMer

[nova oar]

I'm too attached to my xbox controller

[little mason]

Tbh if super ghey games made an arcade machine with hades 1 and 2 I'd buy it.

[stable marsh]

what is the best attack to use with the dark side hex? I feel like it is abysmally bad, even upgraded

[neat thicket]

oh hey i just realized im gonna get to use the hestia ares duo with this build since controlled burn

[crude dragon]

Pretty high if you roll all the things

[neat thicket]

working on it rn, got giga cleaver and 3 of the gods i need

[crude dragon]

Not after they lobotomized the job in Dawntrail, I won't

[craggy totem]

It's considered to be a hex that tanks your damage output, yeah. IDK if there's a best per se

You're not guaranteed to get the "attack boon on DS attack" upgrade in your tree, right?

[neat thicket]

gonna have to use keepsake to get hera and poseidon i think

[nova oar]

Maybe I should see if I can plug my fight pad in

[covert badge]

any on-hit effects, if you put blitz on special, its quite fun with romantic

[crude dragon]

Time to lab Hades 2

[covert badge]

blast also works as its fast enough for chain to trigger, both atk and spe

[craggy totem]

The Aphrodite/Zeus duo or

[stable marsh]

Do the attacks in the hex have the effects of your boons? Didn't realise that

[craggy totem]

They do not unless you specifically stat in to the upgrades that give it that

[little mason]

Does hermes winner circle f up legendary hestia boon with smolder lol

[nova oar]

The game won't recognise it 😭

[craggy totem]

That's why I was saying this earlier ^

There's also upgrades for putting your special boon on the DS special, and cast boon on DS cast

[crude dragon]

It's also not even technically your attack boon that it copies, it's your attack effect

[craggy totem]

Oh it doesn't even transfer damage ups? :\

[neat thicket]

fine line obtained, 2 of my magick usage buffs obtained now

[crude dragon]

So IIRC, it won't do anything with, say, Aphro attack

[craggy totem]

Boooooo

[covert badge]

i think they fixed the % dmg dark side thing in 1.0? iirc its on the patch notes
(still prefer on-hit tho)

[crude dragon]

Going for Exceptional Talent as well?

[craggy totem]

Oh, okay, that's a relief to hear!

[neat thicket]

yeah 2/3 requirements for that, i need that, controlled burn, cut above, and ocean swell

and more magick because i am eating through it even with unseen lol

[crude dragon]

I mean, if you're doing it on Charon as you should be, then you should have Lucid Gain

[neat thicket]

also im realizing ive never had exceptional talent and giga cleaver at the same time so i wanna see if it works the way i think

[covert badge]

pike/heartthrob lessgooo

[neat thicket]

nah, didnt want to have to use my cast, just on than axe

[crude dragon]

But triple Cast explosions

[neat thicket]

meh

[crude dragon]

And also the Lucid synergy

[covert badge]

disintegration..

[stable marsh]

alright, ty for the help

[neat thicket]

EXPLOSIVE INTENT LETS GO ICARUS

up to 70 cost and its gonna get higher

i might have to take silver wheel for summit lol

[stable marsh]

Probably the strongest or most fun run I've had was Moros with Fine Line, Ocean Swell, Righteous Pike etc.

[still dagger]

rival cerberus feels unfair. some patterns or attacks feel impossible to dodge

[glossy shadow]

What is the highest fear where it's reasonably possible to no-hit to the end?

[crude dragon]

67 :)

[neat thicket]

a lot of fear doesnt actually change the difficulty of nohitting

[nova oar]

No hitting is just pure skill atp

[crude dragon]

Also gotta remember that numbers lower than 62 can have a lot of variance in what Vows are active

[merry echo]

Chronos does way too much damage

[crude dragon]

Did you stand in bad

[merry echo]

Maybe

[crude dragon]

Don't stand in bad, stand in the part that isn't covered in bad 👍

[merry echo]

Didnt know those lines he does hit you later

[glossy shadow]

I will say that I've never got slow time + phase transition + chronos didn't slow down when he slowed me down besides the one time

[crude dragon]

Oh, yeah. All of his scythe slashes have aftershocks

[nova oar]

Very annoying sometimes

[neat thicket]

got cut above right before prometheus, seems unlikely im leaving this run with everything i want lol

[humble urchin]

oh my god thanks to this tip i managed to clear 67 fear! thank you so much

[nova oar]

Practising vor4 max pain for 60f and tf is this dawg https://imgur.com/a/8i8VMvE

[humble urchin]

but nah fr practicing dodging well is one of the biggest things you can do to improve your game

[humble urchin]

one dmg over your health too

what do you have off for your 60f setup? less grit/hordes or scars 2?

[neat thicket]

controlled burn on the last miniboss, heres hoping shop gives me apollo

and this game doesnt love me

at least my 85 magick specials do crazy damage

easy typhon kill

[hybrid birch]

Anyone ever just have builds that don’t come together and kinda get worse as you go but you still win? 😂

[neat thicket]

yep

[hybrid birch]

It was terrible. Started as Apollo, then got heph on staff and some attack hammers. Just..never really got much else feeling into it, just random gods. Then sacrifice boon to Zeus attack and it was very.. meh

[thin laurel]

shiva has max scars off for 60f iirc

also god, I haven't had a good high fear/speed attempt day in like a week at this point 💀 just playing badly
built up a sleep defeceit ig and need to recover, but it's annoying, I'm not making progress

[craggy totem]

Sleeb

[tranquil vine]

So I guess TYPHON isn't that much of a channel when you walk in with like 400 hp and 200+ armour 💀

[thin laurel]

part of it is chatting w people here in vastly different time zones lol, rn is too early for me to sleep but being up way past midnight needs to stop I think 🙃
I should also do some practice at just rivals 4 frenzy 2, rn high fear is rough in general so getting there to practice is a pain

[tranquil vine]

ive bonked the big fella thrice now hehe. its a fun fight

[thin laurel]

also yeah, typhon is scary at first but he ends up just being a big easy to aim at target, and with enough max hp and armor you can def tank him

[craggy totem]

True as hell, I used to tank my sleep schedule talking with later-timezone people when I was doing team games lol.

[tranquil vine]

i have more trouble with that hecking brood miniboss 😡

[thin laurel]

oh yeah that thing is annoying
I much prefer the twins

[tranquil vine]

yeha

[thin laurel]

also the eyeball is somehow one of the most free minibosses in the game I think, like... I guess the root stalker is easier? but. it just sits there...

[tranquil vine]

the eye and the tail are both kinda easy

[craggy totem]

What's the brood miniboss

[thin laurel]

eye and tail are both p chill but the tail at least makes me dodge, whereas the eye I just kinda stand at a distance with torches and go "goodbye :)"

[tranquil vine]

the bull charge guy

[craggy totem]

AH right right

[thin laurel]

spawn of typhon, or something...? the non twins/eye/tail summit miniboss

[tranquil vine]

ya know which miniboss gives me the most trouble?

itys that goddamn coin purse before chronos lmfao

[craggy totem]

Oh bro I would take that guy over tail any day, I've never died to him but that damn tail....

[thin laurel]

also I could not tell you what changes in the eye fight w shadow on
ik it adds some shadow enemies with projectiles to tail, but with eye.... uhhh it does something?

[tranquil vine]

the eye just sends out a booger kekw

[hybrid birch]

The others are all pretty easy to me but I’m too impatient and it makes the eye harder

[humble urchin]

if it’s the bosses you’re struggling the most with, savestate practice is not a bad shout

if it’s just general stuff then yeah it just needs throwing more runs at it

[tranquil vine]

ive beaten underworld with 10 heat.

ive not beaten surface with 1 heat 💀

[craggy totem]

Put one tick into Time. There, you've beat it with 1 heat :P

[thin laurel]

I rly should just look into how to make one
like to be clear the past few days it's just been "I'm playing all around worse cause I'm not sleeping well enough"
but when I'm playing well the issue is just gramps, I can pretty confidently get to p3 gramps at 62f but then I just immediately choke

[tranquil vine]

i think i can do the timer yeqa. i play very speed

[thin laurel]

maybe I can ask someone on the speedcord if they have a savestate sitting around... is it a thing you need a mod for or like. idk, I need to look into it lol, I've been lazy abt it

[humble urchin]

yeah p3 feels like a whole different fight

at my current fear level i can do sirens without losing a dd (if not charybdis feature) and then take 500 damage in chronos

so in my case i really need to practice chronos

[tranquil vine]

probably a mod

[tranquil vine]

chronos is a fun fight. i love grandpa even if i kinda bully him now

[thin laurel]

I've had an attempt or two where I might have won if I'd played p1 and p2 perfectly, but if I burn lovers/armor/worst of all a DD then it's just doomed rn

[humble urchin]

oh yeah, but rivals chronos on frenzy 2 is a whole different monster

[tranquil vine]

ive not fought him on that 🫢

[thin laurel]

yeah, normal chronos is very fun to bully but turning on rivals is another story 💀 at least with frenzy maxed, idk

[bronze marlin]

couldn't even beat the guy with frenzy 1 👀
I'm scared since then

[hybrid birch]

Just need to get used to it

[craggy totem]

I couldn't beat him with zero vows other than Rivals lol

[thin laurel]

idk, I'm getting decently consistent with getting to him so I should just sit down and practice a ton.
less sure how to improve on speeds tho, I pretty consistently finish at ~6:30 and I want to do better

also because shiva beat my pb and then beat her own bp so now I'm sweating trying to catch up lol...

fun runs are still fun tho 😤 and I'm not going to stop doing those
there are still some legendaries and duos I def haven't explored enough

[verbal silo]

am i allowed to discuss the ending/epilogue in this chat

[tranquil vine]

which is the shiva aspect? I keep hjearing about it

[humble urchin]

if you consistently finish around your PB you mostly need that one run to have crazy room rng probably

watching some runs on your aspect of choice and asking top end runners might give you a slight edge on something you weren’t aware of

[craggy totem]

Yes but spoiler it

[bronze marlin]

coat hidden aspect

[tranquil vine]

man i really dont know how to play that weapon

[craggy totem]

You can do that by typing like this ||spoiler goes in here||

Which looks like ||spoiler goes in here||

[thin laurel]

I suspect there are also some general things I can improve, like movement and knowing fields layouts
with great rng I could definitely beat my pb, but I think I can improve my average if I figure out the areas I need to work on the most. but I'm less focused on speeds rn, brain stuck in fear mode

[tranquil vine]

i pretty much only use the spear, the 🪓 and the 🗡️ 💀

[thin laurel]

oh also to be clear when I said shiva I meant the person on this server who goes by shiva lol, not the aspect, we've been competing back and forth for a bit for personal bests
but she's named shiva because her name for a bit was "#1 shiva enjoyer"

[craggy totem]

Wait what is the spear

[humble urchin]

oh yeah that comes with just more overall practice

this is a very rough figure but i feel like mastering the basics should net you a sub 6, maybe even low 5s

to get into sub 5s is where you probably need all the small nuances that shave of a few seconds at most at a time, but do add up

[tranquil vine]

staff.

i need coffee

[craggy totem]

OH okay I just assumed Hades 1 slippage haha, that makes sense

[tranquil vine]

circe staff is hecking bonkers

[thin laurel]

circe staff is so good
my aspect of choice rn for everything hard lol, and also great for fun runs

[tranquil vine]

puts of circe staff

"hmm"

puts on storm ring

"oh we doing this"

puts on double strike

"feeling daring are we"

[thin laurel]

and I haven't had a king's ransom run on circe for a bit, but when you do.... ⚡

[tranquil vine]

then go hera and kings ransom 💀

*I can't take it anymore. I'm sick of Zeus. I try to play Scorch. My Blitz deals more damage. I try to play Poseidon. My Blitz deals more damage. I try to play Blast. My Blitz deals more damage. I want to play Demeter. Her best team has Zeus. I want to play Ares, Hera. They both want Zeus.

He grabs me by the throat. I Pom for him. I reroll for him. I give him the Cloud Bangle. He isn't satisfied. I pick Extended Family. "I don't need this much Damage %" He tells me. "Give me more Poms." He grabs Echo and forces her to Pom Pom Pom. "You just need to pop Blitz more. I can deal more damage with King's Ransom."

I can't pick King's Ransom, I have no Hera core Boon. He grabs my Fate Dice. It declines. "Guess this is the end." He grabs his lightning. He says "It's over, young lady." There is no hint of sadness in his eyes. Nothing but high flat damage curse application. What a cruel world.*

[dusky mountain]

Love it and Anubis too

[crude dragon]

"Zap!"

[dire plank]

I can’t get behind Anubis, it’s really difficult to run. My goats are Circe and Hel.

[ruby thistle]

how does the improbable outcomes prophecy actually work? i've done great chaos below, great chaos above, chaos below, and chaos above without fail and then did another great chaos below trial (so i have a streak of 2) and i still haven't gotten the completion. do they need to be immediately back to back? i haven't failed any of them but i'm seriously wondering if i need to ignore everything else and just do them 2 nights in a row but idk if it needs to be a non great trial either

[crude dragon]

They need to be the same trial done back to back

[dire plank]

Chaos Below twice or Chaos Above twice

[crude dragon]

Indeed

[craggy totem]

?? I did Chaos Below followed by Chaos Above and it procced for me

[dire plank]

Can’t mix em it’s really dumb

[craggy totem]

I did not repeat any Chaos trials. Y'all sure this didn't already get changed in 1.0?

[dire plank]

Oh maybe it’s fixed then?

[crude dragon]

I know that it was a problem during early access

[ruby thistle]

so you just can't do a regular run in between, you have to spam the trials

ty for the confirmation!

[dire plank]

Still need to beat Great Chaos Above. Got to Typhons last phase in one run and had another run end immediately when I got the white antler.

[stable marsh]

What are the requirements for the spirit mixer incantation to show up?

[craggy totem]

Noooooo

[stable marsh]

I also still haven't gotten the one that allows your familiars to rest

[dire plank]

This is my 2 runs out of the like 20 I reset because the starting combos and vows were so bad

[craggy totem]

I feel that lmao

[dire plank]

But I’m very picky and want Death, Wayward Son and Persistence in every run

[ruby thistle]

the chaos trials can be really dicey, i enjoy them a lot and have gotten relatively consistent having played a fair amount during early access but man i wish they gave you better rewards

[stable marsh]

Is this one still in the game?

[dire plank]

Maybe Strength instead of Death. Usually when it’s one it’s both though and it wastes grasp 💀

[ruby thistle]

I think they removed that

[craggy totem]

What was it? :U

[dire plank]

Never encountered anything like that

[ruby thistle]

there was an incantation that, if you swapped between familiars regularly (aka let them 'rest' for a night by using another familiar), they would be stronger

or something along those lines at least, to encourage using different familiars

[craggy totem]

Ooooh, interesting.

[dire plank]

Oh sounds good they removed it. Bad enough grave thirst is forcing my hand with my weapon pick (not really).

[craggy totem]

Guess 1.0 familiars are just full of energy :D

[crude dragon]

That one got Thanos snapped

[craggy totem]

Thanatos snapped, surely

[crude dragon]

Nah, IIRC, you had to not take any for a run

[ruby thistle]

really?????? thats wild, i never used it much when it was in the game haha

[craggy totem]

Oh that would be so painful. The other idea I was like "hm" but this I'm glad they removed lol

[crude dragon]

Can't, he's in a Halo bubble

[dire plank]

||Last time I played I encountered Nyx and she said Thanatos might want his scythe back soon. I think I have to kill Thanatos.||

It’s my scythe now.

[craggy totem]

He's a reasonable guy, you can probably just do the Nem thing and outperform in a fight :P

[stable marsh]

Ah okay thanks. I'd seen it listed on sites and the wiki recently, but just checked and its been removed from the wiki now so I thought that might be the case

Also seems like the requirements for the spirit mixer incantation to appear are now listed

[scenic gust]

Most useless duo boon for Magick user -Brave Face. Stealing mana ain't a happy sign for your run

[craggy totem]

I think someone mentioned it could actually pair quite well with Tough Gain

I've not had the opportunity to try it out yet meself but it sounds intriguing

[novel turtle]

I just hit the final shop with 7k gold...

[heavy glen]

anything good?

[novel turtle]

no going to fight chronos with 5k burning a hole in my skirt

[nova oar]

Worst feeling fr

[craggy totem]

Where's Paid Dues when you could use it smh

[heavy glen]

it's post-credits and i still don't really get the point of infusions

i get they have a gameplay mechanic, it just seems...undercooked

[nova oar]

Nah they're funny little bonuses

[heavy glen]

sometimes i get a rock infusion in ephyra and think of charlie brown's halloween

[nova oar]

Not really worth aiming for but you mostly get them accidentally

[heavy glen]

where the whole town gave him rocks

[bronze marlin]

worst infusion I can think of at the moment: if hit is bigger than 20, reduce damage by 10.
and I usually like to get a bit more defensive with boons and stuff. don't see the reason to pick this one

[nova oar]

Good for high fear but at high fear infusions are super hard to aim for

[bronze marlin]

I can see that. if everything does like 25, this sounds pretty good

[unkempt zodiac]

If it triggers its good

[nova oar]

When the difference is between chronos doing 70 and chronos doing 60 it doesn't feel like much

[unkempt zodiac]

When its the difference between chronos doing 35 and chronos doing 25 its alr

[hearty timber]

Getting the Aphrodite poseidon duo is soooooo good on max pain

[nova oar]

I play circe i'm not going for that or trying for a duo

[hearty timber]

Poseidon cast on circe tho, probably not the best but it gets the job done

[nova oar]

Nah I need Zeus or hestia

[hearty timber]

Zeus hestia are the best yess

[nova oar]

I've made aphro and Demeter work it's just best with those 2

[hearty timber]

Demeter gust + storm ring hits hard

Bonus points for ares omega cast but it's very hard to get all on a high fear run

[nova oar]

If I get Zeus/hestia cast by itself i'm normally chill

[stable marsh]

Can a boon you give up to Nemesis show back up?

[covert badge]

yes

[nova oar]

Anything else is a bonus

Aphrodite has to be my least favourite god

[craggy totem]

Counterpoint, Rapture Ring is bonus CC and her Hestia duo is funny

Also wielding a shield while stark nekkid is a Choice

[nova oar]

Counterpoint, almost all her support boons are defensive and her cores can be replaced with apollo

There is not a single use case where I would take aphro over another god unless I had to

[meager walrus]

shamless attitude is actually quite good as an offensive boon

secret crush is an offensive boon as well, it only works on attacks so its sort of like extra dose

i do think extra dose probably scales better with rarity/poms though

[nova oar]

Shameless and the bonus damage to weak are fine, secret crush feels placebo to me

Not saying she's bad I just don't like her lmao

[meager walrus]

secret crush is actually often more damage than extra dose on attacks
main downside is that its unpommable so with jeweled pom starts extra dose makes up a lot of the ground

also extra dose can proc on hit affects a second time

tbh aphro and apollo are both just solid all around gods to me

they do some damage have some survivability, but are ultimately unexciting

[rotund hearth]

Hey. I can't move to the other side from Charon's stall in Oceanus

[meager walrus]

you can dash over the gap in the water

[rotund hearth]

oh... Why didn't I think of that🤦

[meager walrus]

in general your dash goes through enemies and terrain, as long as there is a spot to stand on the other side

can also dash through small walls and pillars, for example

[rotund hearth]

Thank you. I only know dash in combat. Forgot you can use it for actual motion

I'm guessing the skull paths lead to ||Scylla||? I've been hearing her singing voice (yes I looked up spoilers)

[meager walrus]

a skull on the door with a boon is just a miniboss

you will know when it is the boss door because the icon will be unique

[rotund hearth]

Oh. Right. Yeah

Dammit

Farthest I've gone though

Nearly won. Would've won if I was at full health. Sorry, does this mean I run through Erebus again to get to Oceanus or? (It's been a while I played the first game lol)

[bronze marlin]

fun way to use aphro on medium/low fear with fates whim:
healthy rebound, you pretty much win the game unless you struggle with a single boss.

[crude dragon]

The white skull is just a miniboss, the region boss has a red skull

[crude dragon]

You will need to get through Erebus again, yes.

[nova oar]

yes

[crude dragon]

The first game was the same way, you couldn't just skip Tartarus and go straight into Asphodel (nor would you want to, all things considered)

[rotund hearth]

Yeah I just realized that. I don't mind though. Keeping health through the run is like my only concern but I love the story too much to mind

[crude dragon]

Unlock the Wayward Son card as soon as you can

[rotund hearth]

I think I can unlock it. During my next night I will. It's a 5 right?

[crude dragon]

It's a 1-cost

Unless you mean the Ash amount, in which case I have no clue

[rotund hearth]

This is what I meant. I think I have it unlocked

Also using Dora's keepsake

[crude dragon]

Yeah, it's only 1 Grasp and gives you 3-5 HP on leaving a room, depending on tank

[rotund hearth]

Wait, sorry last Q but does that mean... Another Hecate boss fight?

[crude dragon]

May I recommend Engraved Pin?

[rotund hearth]

Whose is that?

[crude dragon]

It will, which you'd be wanting to do anyways even if it were optional since you need a ton of Cinder for weapon and Arcana upgrades

[rotund hearth]

Whoops looks like I'm there and Arachne's dress just broke... Wish me luck lol

[craggy widget]

||moros||

[rotund hearth]

Oh. Don't think I've interacted with him outside that... Place thingy with the lines and stuff

[craggy widget]

||may need to do some incantations so he comes to crossroads||

[rotund hearth]

Apparently he's here now but not visible. I'll wait

[stable marsh]

Is there any list of everything stardust is needed for, considering it seems to be a limited resource outside of spending 1500 bones?

[glad lake]

Circe staff is interesting

[bronze marlin]

||you can get more from narcissus once the relationship is high enough.||
familiar treats, a cosmetic or two, more ambrosia/nectar.
could be more that I forgot right now. can't really use it the wrong way, even once you exhausted chaos trials.

[glad lake]

can't you buy it from the broker

[stable marsh]

I'm more specifically looking at how much is needed for cosmetics, appreciate it though

[stable marsh]

yeah but it is 1500 bones each

[tranquil vine]

i love boning

[glad lake]

BONE

[bronze marlin]

ah okay. the only cosmetic I remember is a cauldron which costs 5.
||you also get more in tartarus/summit if you play on 12 fear or higher sometimes.||
as long as you don't create a billion treats, you should be good hah.
point is: it is not limited, use it

[uncut sierra]

in hades 2, how does limiting your arcana with fear work? if i use 11 of my arcana limit and then make it only be able to use 40% of it, how does that work? also, can i use the cart that makes you gain arcana cards after each guardian?

[buoyant matrix]

both are correct

[stable marsh]

Thanks for pointing that one out. Looks like you need 6 for crossroads cosmetics. I did create most of my treats with stardust, but I've fully upgraded all familiars now. I actually have 6 more trials left... so I guess I won't be using any stardust for moondust then|| (unless I find some in tartarus/summit)||

[uncut sierra]

meaning my arcana cards are active rn? even though its limited to 40%?

[buoyant matrix]

void limits your max grasp. 40% of 30 is 12, so you can only use 12 or less grasp
judgement and pig completely bypass the grasp limit

[buoyant matrix]

you get 12 grasp, every card you pick in that 12 grasp limit will be fully functional

[uncut sierra]

nice nice. im trying to do 32 underground so thats why im asking

[buoyant matrix]

why are you running void for 32 fear

it has the highest difficulty/fear ratio of all vows, you're better off putting that 2 fear elsewhere

[uncut sierra]

idk. seemed like a better idea than some other fears.

[buoyant matrix]

it definitely isn't

i can recommend an oath setup if you feel like you need help

[stable marsh]

how many chaos trials are there?

[uncut sierra]

yea sure. hit me.

[buoyant matrix]

https://h2crossroads.pages.dev/FearCalculator/?vows=WzEsMSwyLDAsMCwzLDIsMiwyLDIsMiwwLDYsMCwyLDIsNV0=
what do you think about this

can drop 3 fear and do fangs2 if you can handle the harder perk combinations

[meager walrus]

I normally suggest this (-6 fear in whatever you dont want to do)
https://h2crossroads.pages.dev/FearCalculator/?vows=WzAsMCwwLDYsMCwzLDIsNSwwLDIsMiwwLDYsMCwyLDIsOF0=

[uncut sierra]

damn. i never used debt and scars, and also rn i cant activate anything more than 1 guardian rivals, but this is def interesting. i will try it.

thanks

[buoyant matrix]

rivals2 is definitely challenging so if you haven't tried it you should do rivals1 fangs2

could also try what silly sent without frenzy

[uncut sierra]

i mean i havent unlocked it yet. but yea sure. i will look into it

[meager walrus]

yeah you'll need to do more runs to unlock rivals 2

need to beat both rivals 1 I think as well as have seen a particular surface miniboss

which can sometimes be a bottleneck

[uncut sierra]

if you mean the boss that names start with Z, i have beaten him

[meager walrus]

no, need to see the alternate thessaly miniboss

[stable marsh]

wdym 3 fear

[buoyant matrix]

have you won a run yet

[stable marsh]

I've beaten the game, it's just you said drop 3 fear as if fear was one of the vows

[meager walrus]

all of the vows are fear :^)

[buoyant matrix]

fear is the "point" you get for different vows, signifying how hard the following night will be

[stable marsh]

I know that

[bronze marlin]

I read "drop 3 fear" as " drop timer3" 😛
dang it, I just can't shut up about it. moving on

[buoyant matrix]

drop 3 fear means drop whatever combination of vows that add up to 3 fear, by your own choice

[stable marsh]

Were you just saying drop 3 fear from that layout however you want, and add it back through fangs 2 if you want?

[buoyant matrix]

correct 👍

[stable marsh]

that's what I assumed at first

How does one deal with the bombs on the ground in VoR Eris with asepct of Medea?

[hazy parrot]

no frenzy at all? id suggest maybe putting on atleast 1 frenzy and dropping some combination of debt and return. ideally dropping both return and 1 debt

[buoyant matrix]

frenzy is nasty for people that aren't used to it, especially if you suddenly turn it on when there's already so much fear elsewhere

[bronze marlin]

the fear system is great. so many different ways to get to 32. much more fun than "yeah I beat the game on normal/hard/extreme"

[buoyant matrix]

there's only one way to get to 62

[bronze marlin]

knowing myself, I would still run timer2 even on 62 (and then complain, that this is too hard hah)

[hazy parrot]

hmm yeah fair. but even so, it doesnt feel like a huge difference between frenzy 0 and 1. id still recommend atleast frenzy 1

[stable marsh]

Only one I think is stupid and they should've removed just because it makes it unfun/a different game, is vow of return

[hazy parrot]

well TECHNICALLY,,

[fresh kelp]

How do u guys play with || anubis || staff?

[buoyant matrix]

scorch attack aphro special

[hazy parrot]

scorch on attack, stack scorch effects like pyro technique. you can go for duos like burning desire or freezer burn (if youre doing this, do NOT take cold storage). static shock, electric overload are really powerful on it as well

as for the combat loop, i drop my cast, drop an omega attack, and use the specials to draw enemies into the aoe. once the cast or omega attack ends, i drop another one

[buoyant matrix]

use ospecial for beeg damage

[hazy parrot]

yeehaw

[fresh kelp]

Wait how is glamour gain a duo?

[hazy parrot]

obviously the other standard stuff like get a good magic regen, get origination allat

[hazy parrot]

i menat burning desire mb

[fresh kelp]

Ty for the build time to chonk

[hazy parrot]

ez clap go for it

[buoyant matrix]

burning island my beloved 🫀

[dusky mountain]

ok hot take incoming

[crude dragon]

Splash attack, Hitch special

[bronze marlin]

too hot for dyno apparently 😛

[dusky mountain]

my god

[stable marsh]

wait you can't swear here?

[tranquil vine]

I gotta level some of my keepsakes smh

[stable marsh]

swearing is like a whole part of how Australians speak/type smh

[dusky mountain]

Ok so after trying Morrigan for at least 5 times, i still dont like it, it just feels bad to use. Blood triad takes too long to proc on smaller enemies, and being forced to omega always opens you up for damage so easily when your playstyle is melee. You dashstrike -> hold to channel, but that just leaves you open to eat a hit so easily.
So i cant understand the morrigan hype, its one of my least favourite aspects

[fresh kelp]

Have u tried heph on it?

[buoyant matrix]

ignore blood triads and either play scorch, apollo attack with final slice, any %boost attack with sweeping ambush

blood triads are still good for bossfights though

[bronze marlin]

or chunky elite enemies

[hearty timber]

This basically, just hit them with basic attacks and save blood triad for the high health enemies and bosses

[thin laurel]

blood triads are strong and fun, but you never have to use them against small enemies! if I'm dealing with a swarm of fish I'm just dash striking then doing a follow up attack, tbh
I don't really get the appeal of Heph on Morrigan (at least not more than any other weapon) altho I've heard a few people recommend it, but stuff like scorch, apollo, or hitch can be fun for nice juicy attack numbers

[tranquil vine]

What to build with than axe? Aphro? Which duo etc

[hearty timber]

Scorch goes so hard on morrigan since the final attack hits thrice

[swift flare]

Listening back to Hades 1 OST:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOJwOmiKavY
Bro, I feel like excluding Scylla lyric song, most OST arn't as good as Hades 1

[buoyant matrix]

hera or apollo on attack, look for psychic whirlwind or seething marauder
there's also the forbidden ospecial build

[thin laurel]

personally I really like weaving blood triads in even when I don't strictly have to, but don't feel like you need to use the mechanic constantly just because it's there! morrigan is pretty versatile, it can do a lot of things well, and at the end of the day it's just daggers with high base damage and some good multi-hitting and AoE

[hearty timber]

Does anyone have thoughts on charon axe for 55 fear?

[dusky mountain]

i just generally dont like the sister blades, Pan is probably the absolute worst aspect in the game rn with Momus for me. I enjoy even Selene a lot more than those

[crude dragon]

Works fine

[crude dragon]

Funnily enough, it's the least bad of the base 3 knives

[swift flare]

the jackpack feels really fun to use overall than dual blades

[buoyant matrix]

if you're good enough at playing the aspect just start jpom and grab whatever you get offered

[stable marsh]

Is it worth skipping Hermes in Ephyra since he usually shows up later?

[rare temple]

I need help with forging Odysseus bond, already did the quest but ||he left to find his family|| and i havent seen him again, does he come back after some time?

[buoyant matrix]

only gameplay tip i can give is if you get giga cleaver, remember to double dip your enemies in cast

[hearty timber]

I have a lot of experience with axe in 30-40 fear but never bought it to 55 fear, I've been using the "meta" i.e. Medea and Circe but having skill issues

[buoyant matrix]

you can watch a few 62 runs to see how others play the aspect, the most optimal build is apollo special and gain plus anything that opens his legendary, best hammers are giga cleaver and sudden cleaver

in case of denial or bad rng, any high %boost on special is good (mostly hera) and any fast high reg gain is good (mostly tranquil or born)

[stable marsh]

Flood Gain or Born Gain to deal with the high magik usage of Possessed Array? Currently have Ares attack Zeus Special

[hearty timber]

Sounds good, I'll go do that

[crude dragon]

Yeah

[hearty timber]

Born gainnn

[crude dragon]

Flood Gain won't trigger on PArray, so Born Gain to open up King's Ransom

[quick knot]

Do yall just be getting yourselves killed early some runs if you dont get some of the stuff youre looking for by a certain point

[crude dragon]

You won't want Born either because PArray is genuinely a case of "you can instantly prime out with Born Gain regardless of your max MP"

[stable marsh]

you can use an omega to trigger ig but yeah I'll go born gain

[bronze marlin]

nope. I try to win everything. having a terrible build is the best practice to avoid things, as every fight takes way longer

[hearty timber]

Yes, essentially undo night followed by alter fate

[crude dragon]

Nah, not when I could be getting resources

[stable marsh]

So what would you suggest?

[crude dragon]

Honest to God? Tranquil

[stable marsh]

Also what's the best way to go about King's Ransom? Try to get lots of Hera boons and not many Zeus ones + then have to go without born gain once it is sacrificed?

[tranquil vine]

Got apollo attack, whirlwind hammer. What next?

[crude dragon]

Best way to go about for Ransom is to get all the boons you want pommed first, then go for a few Hera boons, then cash out

[stable marsh]

Hasn't tranquil always been considered horrendous? Don't know when you can find the spot in certain fights to stand still for that long

[crude dragon]

It had the regen/second buffed (as well as pom scaling) and you now only need to stand still for half a second rather than a full second

[buoyant matrix]

spin to win, beyblade style

[stable marsh]

fair enough

[stable marsh]

I see, thanks. Just for theorycrafting purposes, what would the ideal other two gods be for aspect of Medea when you have Ares attack, Zeus special if you don't mind me asking?

[crude dragon]

You want Apollo at some point for Light Smite, then Hera would still be good to find for Ransom

[stable marsh]

Yeah I was deciding between two of Apollo, Demeter and Hera. What would the solution be for magick in this case (I have possessed array)

[limpid oar]

It's still an option if you don't get a better gain, right? At least it'll give you a nuke at the start of the room before you prime out

[buoyant matrix]

yes you do, just start stacking max magick like crazy

daiyu's 62 surface run with mel skull revolved entirely around Parray and born gain and exceptional talent

[crude dragon]

I assume that works exactly how I think it does and it explodes twice?

[buoyant matrix]

yes

with parray you want to stack as many "your omega moves/attacks also do x" effects because they don't increase the magick cost

[stable marsh]

Born Gain still the best option out of those 4 gods then? (and try to get it back after ransoming I guess?)

[crude dragon]

Of those 4, yeah. Ares regen is dogwater, Zeus regen is too slow, and Apollo regen is too little

[hearty timber]

Ares regen is soooo bad it's not even funny

[buoyant matrix]

grisly "haters" when they get profuse bleeding (it's suddenly infinite magick)

[crude dragon]

Anyone bringing up his Legendary oughta realize that it shouldn't take a Legendary to make a core boon good

[buoyant matrix]

nah you don't need his legendary to make use of his gain

that's just for qol and hitting the 100% limit asap

[hearty timber]

They should buff ares gain to like 30 magic and heph damage negation to 15 or 20

[stable marsh]

Thanks. Who'd be a better god than Ares in the attack slot?

[crude dragon]

Aphrodite's more consistent at the cost of not leading into the funnier boons

[hearty timber]

Aphro attack maybe for medea

[buoyant matrix]

aphro, apollo, hera
all good

[hearty timber]

Lol so true, although I like weak a lot especially on high fear

[crude dragon]

Yeah, but you can't get Weak on her attack

[hearty timber]

Problem is her gain turns off your huntress effectively

[stable marsh]

I guess I would be forgoing the revenge duo boon build for that tbf

[stable marsh]

nvm I did it hitless

[buoyant matrix]

next time, do

1. use oattack
2. use ospecial
3. ignore them and bait eris into shooting them

third is last resort

[stable marsh]

I mainly used O special when there were a lot of them

but yeah ty. Why oattack over ospecial?

[hearty timber]

It has a bigger radius

[stable marsh]

I feel like the ospecial basically clears the entire arena though

[frank eagle]

I think one of my issues with this game is how many of the magic regen boons just feel completely useless

[thin laurel]

which others feel useless to you? ngl I find that most of them are either universally good or good in their niche

[real scarab]

I only use lucid/born/flood with the torches

the others all suck

[thin laurel]

you can also use cardio unless you pump in too much channel speed, and technically tranquil and ionic work but I dislike them for torches
but also that's just for torches 🤷 different weapons like different things, cardio is amazing on Eos and Anubis for instance, glamour gain is good on non-magick aspects for weak and on aspects with only moderate magick usage, tranquil is lowkey the only thing that can sustain possessed array on the skulls... etc etc

I don't personally like ionic or tranquil gain but they're objectively good for regen
rly the only ones I find kinda bad are ares and heph, and heph is at least damage resistance so you can take it if you don't need magick

[sweet cove]

Is there a mixing issue for Scylla’s songs in the OST? Clawing your eyes and Coral Crown sounded really muddled especially in the choruses

[thin laurel]

not that I'm aware of? but also if you're talking about in-game sound, the ost for that fight is affected by how the fight is going

[buoyant matrix]

grisly and born are good too

[buoyant matrix]

depends on if jetty and roxy are alive

[sweet cove]

Sorry I need to clarify, the in game songs sounds fine but the OST release itself from steam sounded off

[thin laurel]

hm, I haven't listened to it via the steam release just the youtube playlist from SGG, but there at least it sounded fine to me

[sweet cove]

The YouTube sounded fine too I should add, it was my playlist at work. Was surprised on how clawing your eye’s chorus just gonna muddles when it hits the chorus. It’s very obvious if you listen from there. It’s strange

[frank eagle]

Hera just delays you running out of magic.
You have to disengage from combat to use zues's
Aphrodite gain is painfully slow
Hapheastus is fine, but i'm naturally drawn away from stuff that requires you to take damage as a part of the build
Same with Demeter where it's very practical but doesnt fit with my playstyle at all
Ares takes way too much setup to make work well

I found Poseidon and Hestia to be the only ones that i felt could really mesh with my playstyle

[thin laurel]

hera is basically the strongest magick regen in the game, if you grab max magick a couple times you effectively never run out 🤷
I kind of agree with you on Zeus and Demeter since they regen a ton but feel awkward to use and interrupt combat, but the others all have a niche, and Poseidon and Hestia aren't rly universal

finding what meshes with your playstyle is definitely a good thing! but hestia's can be literally useless on some weapons, since you need to fulfill a specific condition for it to work. if you're playing charon axe it's abysmal, for instance

[frank eagle]

I find that omega attack typically refills it by hitting enemies, though for bosses thats a different story

[sweet cove]

Glamour Gain isn’t really a magic regen it’s more like a curse only boon, also cracked with Island Getaway

[buoyant matrix]

i don't consider hera the strongest since its ea nerf

tranquil I'd say has the highest pure regen potential, also don't have to worry as much about hubris

[stable marsh]

Is it worth doing kings ransom near the end of the run (so won't get born gain back), when Possessed Array is doing so well?

[buoyant matrix]

no

[thin laurel]

imo it's the smoothest when playing something like torches
I think whether it's the #1 strongest is debatable, but especially if you're talking about all levels of fear instead of just high fear born gain is crazy good

[buoyant matrix]

I've been loving lucid since the rework

and jpom makes cardio viable on more aspects

[frank eagle]

Kings/queens ransom is such a funny gimmick boon and definitely made hera being in this game worth it

[thin laurel]

also to be clear re: this
cardio gain only triggers on non-Ω moves, so if you're using something like Charon which rarely if ever uses those moves it does nothing

[frank eagle]

Oh didnt know that

[thin laurel]

it's very strong in its niche! it just still has a niche

[covert badge]

still 3 hits from special tho

[buoyant matrix]

can actually get consistent regen with jpom if you don't have giga or cost increase boons

[thin laurel]

ehhh I mean. I feel like it's pretty easy to outpace that with stuff like hammers, fine line, apollo legendary etc etc

[frank eagle]

The line between what is attributed to omegas and their retrospective attacks/specials/casts is sometimes not specified heavily enough

[thin laurel]

attack/special/cast singular = not omegas
attacks/specials/casts plural = both
Ω X = just the omega version

[buoyant matrix]

attackS/specialS means base and omega because they're plural. attack/special is just base

[frank eagle]

Hmm

[thin laurel]

and idk, I think in a pinch you could make cardio gain work on charon but it comes with enough downsides that I'd never recommend it when so many boons work without caveats
like. idk, anti synergy with increases to magick cost, anti synergy with ranged cast builds which may leave enemies outside the range of your special...

it's workable but when lucid, born, tranquil, ionic, and flood gain exist (and hestia isn't rly someone I'd reach for on Charon anyway) I'd usually try not to settle for it 🤷

[frank eagle]

I got the double omega special hammer for a charon run recently and found out that the gimmick effect triggers twice hitting an omega cast with that hammers effect

[thin laurel]

I'm also a glamour gain lover but mainly for inflicting weak when I'm not using magick much, or for stuff with very moderate magick usage like Nyx where you want some regen but you can get away with very little

[buoyant matrix]

before 1.0 i did a tranquil gain run with charon, everyone ran lucid then because jpom didn't exist
maybe i should now do a cardio gain run

[thin laurel]

lmk if you do! it's probably workable, I just wouldn't recommend it to new players (or myself lol)
I don't like cardio on torches either, even tho it's objectively quite good, because I don't want to ever have to purposefully skip channel speed bonuses for fear of turning off cardio gain

which like.... is niche and likely won't come up in my run, but not taking a boon I'd normally want because of my gain bugs me, even hypothetically lol

[buoyant matrix]

channel speed? just do two base specials and you're up for an ospecial

[bronze marlin]

tranquil gain imagine standing still while you COULD move hah. never procs for me unless the game forces me to stop moving

[thin laurel]

if you have enough channel speed that every attack is an Ω attack while channeling then it gets weird 🤷

[buoyant matrix]

the ever reliable base special:

[buoyant matrix]

just take wolf howl 🔥

[thin laurel]

my ever reliable refusal to do that if I'm playing moros because it feels weird and janky

I do take cardio sometimes I'm just like. if I have someone better in the pool I'd rather not

also idk, I like ripple effect and trying to use cardio to fuel ripple effect moros with 2+ sources of attack channel speed is.... not very fun, imo

[buoyant matrix]

if you like stacking channel speed on torch and using omega effects why not just use mel torch 😂

[thin laurel]

I do that too sometimes 🤷 I like all torches and use them all a lot lol
but it's not like omega attacks are bad on moros

[buoyant matrix]

moros playstyle is for me just beyblade spin to win

[dusky mountain]

Hey Pizza

Can you please send me some RNG or skill so I can get Great Chaos above done

ive failed this 4 times now and its hurting my ego, i thought was good at the game and expected to clear it first try no matter what i got

[frank eagle]

Was moros aspect ever reworked? Thinking back i think its one of the only aspects thats functioned pretty much identically since launch

[dusky mountain]

no, but the torches themselves which affected moros a bit (special changes)

[frank eagle]

Oh yeah i guess the base and omega special changes happened

[bronze marlin]

the "new" special is so much better on the torches. love it. couldn't hit anything with the EA special

[thin laurel]

the omega attack sequence also went from constant omegas to 2 normals into an omega
aka why cardio can now work with torch a lot better

[covert badge]

torches rework is an indirect nerf to moros, because more gap between attack and o.special, and overall less o.atk proc rate
it works with cardio now tho

[hearty timber]

Yup although fine line was funny with torches back then

[thin laurel]

I still love doing that lol it just takes more effort... some combo of the right hammer + racing thoughts + chaos channel speed can recreate it 1:1 p much

[hearty timber]

Yesss!

[buoyant matrix]

my brother in zeus I'm just a stinky college student

[covert badge]

manifesting eos and zeus special

[frank eagle]

I remember getting this with a ton of poseidon knockback boons and not being able to tell what was happening on my screen

[thin laurel]

also the change to lucid for 1.0 is one of my favorite things they've done lol, makes it so much more versatile

[frank eagle]

Does lucid gain apply twice for circe?

[thin laurel]

I like that hera (who some ppl took just for her gain) got her sprint buffed with more AoE so it can slot in anywhere
and apollo (who some people took just for easy orig from blinding rush) now has a more universal gain
they got buffed in the other one's niche, in terms of core boon slots, perfectly balanced as all things should be

[bronze marlin]

same for me. went from "urgh, why would I want that" to "okay, apollo for the gain now" almost every run I use magick in

[thin laurel]

also I'm not sure...? probably pretty easy to test tho with apollo start

[merry whale]

yea lucid procs twice

[frank eagle]

Forgot to mention appolo earlier but yeah his gain definitely one of the best ones

[merry whale]

apollo gain is very simple but very good

[thin laurel]

honestly the only gain I truly dislike is zeus and it's just cause I find it awkward
I never take ares and avoid heph but I like. understand them. zeus just annoys me for no good reason

[merry whale]

gets the job done for light or mid magick consumption builds

yea zeus is ass i'm not about to stand still to pick up a ball i'd rather have demeter where i can do it anywhere

[thin laurel]

I also like that more builds have a reason to take winner's circle randomly even if they aren't focusing on cast damage
since it just speeds up lucid 🤷 it's neat

[hearty timber]

You should be able to automatically pick it up tbh

[covert badge]

yes

[thin laurel]

or attack it, or anything other than hit a button I otherwise never do in combat
I refuse to hit E zeus, leave me alone 😒

[hearty timber]

Exactly

[frank eagle]

I find that zues is good for stuff like axe builds where you dont typically need to care about magic costs outside of boss fights

[bronze marlin]

hey, zeus can't be the best at everything! shocking I know! (sorry)

[thin laurel]

I just imagine the lucid gain thingy spawning somewhere awkward and making me take damage, and the mere possibility of that makes me hate it 😔 perhaps unfairly

[covert badge]

i like the old version of ionic though, just make it regen while channeling and faster rate

wait this is just flood lol

[hearty timber]

zap

[thin laurel]

also I've seen a lot of tough gain believers, I'm not rly one, I grab it on no magick builds sometimes and feel like it does nothing 🤷 but I'm glad it has fans.
I am a glamour gain fan forever so. idk. 🤝

[hearty timber]

Cries in huntress arcana

[bronze marlin]

tough gain and heph/hera duo is pretty funny. not good, but you absorb a ton

[frank eagle]

Tough gain and glamour gain are probably way better for magic passive axe builds thinking about it

[thick lagoon]

can anyone explain me what heyula IX stuff does?

[thin laurel]

ah. that is my main critique of glamour gain yes
altho I don't even super like tough gain for huntress
ngl you know what I take when I want huntress to always be active? ionic 😌 so I can ignore it and never accidentally turn huntress off

[hearty timber]

Aura farming

[covert badge]

If you mean the rank system (like Nightmare X and so on), it doesn’t affect gameplay at all
It’s basically just a post-game resource dump for flexing

[thin laurel]

but also I think the nerfs to weak's duration were an indirect buff to glamour gain, since now it's just by far the best for sustaining origination and stuff like burning desire
(in exchange for her dash being great for her legendary, and ig her cast being somewhere in between...? idk, weak is neat and weird)

[covert badge]

still not work great with island + nervous tho

[hearty timber]

Yes glamour gain is great to keep weak on 24/7, so the trade off is dealing 50% less damage on attack and special vs taking 30% less damage (can get increased to 46)

[dry pebble]

Damn how do yall remember every boon name thats crazy to me 😭

[thin laurel]

300 hours of playtime 🙃 I did not memorize them fast

also I still forget some, like truly I have no idea what aphro's + max magick and hp boon is ca- wait. spiritual affirmation? is that it...

[covert badge]

1.4k hrs

[thin laurel]

someone made a "how many boons can you name from memory" quiz like a week ago and I got 99 of them and missed a bunch, notably aphro attack and special which I just could not remember. but now I do (because I looked them up in shame after)

[thick lagoon]

is it help anything or just useless?

[bronze marlin]

for completionists basically. it does nothing

[onyx thicket]

what happens when you reroll a double-heart or double-mana room ? Is there more chance to get something nice like a hammer or another double-reward room?

[covert badge]

you mean in tartarus/the summit?

[onyx thicket]

in Ephyra

[rotund hearth]

Oceanus man...

[thin laurel]

"oceanus man" as in "smh, oceanus, man.... 😔"
or as in "the man in oceanus (narcissus)"
if the former, what's up

[covert badge]

ohhh Ephyra is all major finds (boon, hammer, hex), except money and pom

[rotund hearth]

Just my latest roadblock that's all

[thin laurel]

ahhh yeah. final boss? or the region overall

[onyx thicket]

ok thx

[covert badge]

you'll able to find artemis in double health/magick room btw

[rotund hearth]

The region overall. Hard to find health in time to not die before I actually get the story lol

I'll power through tho lol

[thin laurel]

if there's a specific enemy which is giving you trouble than feel free to ask for advice! but in general good luck
you still get items to power up back home each time you fail a run (like unlocking new cards + the ability to have more active at once), so it's still progress even if you feel like you're stalled rn

[bronze marlin]

best tip I can give: always use the cast. hide behind it if a billion fish start showing up

[thin laurel]

I was thinking that tbh
the cast is already very good against the wailers in erebus, but the fish swarms make it feel really rough to not use it
just dropping it down to stop enemies from moving gives you a lot of breathing room

[rotund hearth]

It's more or less that I've beaten Erebus (Hades 1 brain always typed Tartarus first lol) but then I'm always low on hearts after fighting Hecate and there's not much to add so it usually means that once I start fighting in Oceanus, it'll only take like 3 encounters before I die and I won't get to meet Eris or Narcissus or any of the others that live here

[rotund hearth]

Thank you! I'll do that. It's the billion fish part that kills me lol

[thin laurel]

hmmm what keepsake are you using, also, assuming you’ve unlocked them? idk if you have the ability to swap between regions yet either

but that could help a lot, there are some great defensive ones you can get early

[rotund hearth]

I switch between the onion and the pin

Oh new weapons, umbral flames. Yippie

[thin laurel]

those are both very solid! esp if you feel confident abusing pin to heal up once per room.
skelly tooth is also very safe

and ooooh I love the flames/torches… very magick hungry and kinda weird, but I adore them lol, I like range

[covert badge]

can you send a link?

[rotund hearth]

Idk if I'll even use pin because I suck at the game and the ten extra seconds won't do much lol

[thin laurel]

yes actually one sec, will take a moment to find it

[rotund hearth]

I'll get the skelly tooth now

[thin laurel]

a good way to use pin is: if you know the fight is about to end, you can purposefully die then beat the last enemy to heal up to the amount pin lists! 60 when fully ranked up
i.e. if hecate has like 5-10% hp left and you’re confident you can beat her in 10 seconds, it’s basically a free heal

pin can activate once per room, so if you’re sure you’re down to the last enemy you can squeeze a lot of healing out of it

[broken creek]

oh damn i didnt know pin is just stubborn defiance thats cool

welcome back hades1 high heat stubborn defiance strats ig

[rotund hearth]

I'll just go Skelly's. The shield thing is great.

[thin laurel]

it's also 10s of invulnerability vs bosses, but it's that + stubborn defiance for non-boss rooms, it's neat! was crazy op when combined with strength for that reason lol
altho afaik it won't trigger outside of combat, so you can't die to traps/lava intentionally, you have to actually die to an enemy and defeat them in time

@covert badge here, found it! #h2-discussion message
it's a v simple quiz someone made, just "type the names of every boon from memory on a timer and see how well you do" but I was curious how I'd do lol

[merry whale]

it also 10 straight seconds of dps rushing bosses it's awesome

[hearty timber]

I took down 40% of cerb rivals hp during those 10 seconds saving my dd, it's crazy what you can do when you don't have to worry about dodging lol

[bronze marlin]

it's a better knuckle bones if you run death defiances. that's how I use it at least

[thin laurel]

it's such a good keepsake... I didn't realize how good it was until right after it stopped working w strength lol, I was so sad. still op tho

[hearty timber]

Lol I remember when it worked with strength that was the ideal biome 4 play

[broken creek]

ill probably see abt using it when i try my 40+ fear runs =3= i did my 32 fear stuff with just jeweled pom so atp i should at least try to branch out

[thin laurel]

just jeweled pom? like the whole run long? 👀

[broken creek]

yeah

[thin laurel]

ehehehe. so.
jpom's effects keep working even after you take it off

[broken creek]

OHHH ok thats actually so stupid lmfao

[hearty timber]

Jpom and time piece both, unless you take a god keepsake (we don't do that in this house)

[thin laurel]

making it even more crazy op
it only stops working if you take a god summoning keepsake (so core boon givers or athena)

[broken creek]

good to know tyty ill start switching it off after area 1

[hearty timber]

Take jpom first region, time piece second region and you will be set for the rest of the run, you can take athena in region 3 if you are running strength

[vagrant trail]

finally gonna play hades 2 today

[thin laurel]

calling card too, all three post-credits ones last the full run lol they're absurd
I usually go jpom => chrolex => whatever I'd normally pick for regions 3-4 (like selene, experimental jammer, pin, etc etc)

[bronze marlin]

and if you HAVE to use athena, do it. you will keep the pom levels on your boons, just new boons won't have them

[thin laurel]

yesss taking athena or another god summoning keepsake won't remove any bonuses jpom already gave you, it'll just stop them from affecting new boons

[hearty timber]

Love the chlorex

[broken creek]

ahh okok, isnt white antler also a pretty potent pick if you have good armor gen from heph??

[hearty timber]

Yes white antler becomes the pick if you have huge armour

[sudden sandal]

does anyone know if coral crown plays in any other time you fight scylla other than the first? or is it just claw your eyes out after that 😭

[thin laurel]

yesss absolutely
last region imo is usually either 1. defensive stuff like pin, tooth, knuckle bones, or 2. temporary offensive buffs like fang, droplet, fleece, antler

[broken creek]

its random between the 2

[sudden sandal]

i just have back luck then LOL

[thin laurel]

every time she sings a new song it gets added to the rotation and is chosen at random when you enter oceanus!
you can also tell which one she's going to sing the second you enter the region, because each area theme is a more chill cover of the boss theme with different lyrics but similar melodies rhythms and chords

[hearty timber]

Tbh droplet outdamages fleece and plays better considering the channel speed and other speed buffs

Fleece is somewhat situational

[thin laurel]

I pretty rarely take fleece for that reason lol yeah
but still, that general category of keepsake

[hearty timber]

Yessss

[sudden sandal]

i need to start doing runs with different ones LOL i often just go with coin purse > somethin else > something > tooth

[broken creek]

i genuinley think i havent switched off of jpom since i got it unless i was low on dd's by area 4 😭

so nice to know its just a knowledge diff at least

[thin laurel]

before the end credits I normally started with a god keepsake tbh, for some level of build control.
I’m kinda torn on what to run region 1 when you don’t have jpom yet but want to embrace a fully random god pool…?

gorgon amulet if you’re running strength is a fun keepsake to start with.
but for DDs I was never quite sure

[hearty timber]

Jpom is so damn strong since 4 levels on all boons is a huge early game power spike

Plus if you get super lucky you get gigaros dash

[bronze marlin]

still expecting a nerf to that thing would still be good if the extra poms only worked for one region

[thin laurel]

yeah, it’s easily my most used keepsake at this point.
I just remember pre-1.0 being kinda stumped on what to start with on a Death build if I didn’t want to start with a specific god lol

[nocturne grove]

Dude getting legendaries is so hard

Sometimes it just never goddamn happens

[hearty timber]

Not being able to control your build at all is a big enough tradeoff, hits even hard when you have denial on

[nocturne grove]

I keep taking it hoping arachne has special dialogue for if you have athena boon

[rough horizon]

Why, though? It's a postgame reward that rewards a unique playstyle where you don't control your build and use rerolls. It'd be a nerf just to reduce fun.

[nocturne grove]

Actinf like people dont just reset if they get a god they dont like

[bronze marlin]

that's fair

[broken creek]

isnt some high high end fear literally reset until you get the one thing you need 😭

[hearty timber]

That's why alter fate was invented

[thin laurel]

you can reset at the start but at some point in the run you’ll end up with something not ideal
and with vow of denial no rerolls makes it veeeery hard not to lock yourself out of a boon you’d want

(aka me running circe and having to give up on both sources of blitz to get storm ring 🥲)

[hearty timber]

Literally me yesterday

[solemn mirage]

what’s a Jpom? 😭

[thin laurel]

jeweled pom, a post-credits very op keepsake

[hearty timber]

Blitz is so good on circe or mel staff since you can dash attack special to pop it every time

[solemn mirage]

ohhh i see

appreciate it boss

[hearty timber]

I feel it was made to help folks get 32 fear done

[thin laurel]

oooh maybe
I think it’s also low-key a response to the common EA complaint that arcana was unbalanced

since like. now you suddenly have a way more valid reason to take stuff like eternity, excellence, and even unseen since rerolls are off the table

[hearty timber]

Yeah lol the dice arcana were always put in, that freed up a lot

Love excellence 💕

[thin laurel]

taking unseen still feels so weird but coldshade recommended it when trying for 62f with eos and. yeah, it feels good actually, that’s a situation where you can leave erebus without a gain boon

[hearty timber]

Depends on the aspect yes but I'd rather not turn off huntress when I am on a non omega build

[thin laurel]

yesss for sure
high fear Eos is like… the exact use case for it, since it’s omega heavy but not SO magick hungry that it’s worth prioritizing a gain boon asap, it can survive very easily with just unseen

[covert badge]

yo it was fun lol ty

[bronze marlin]

are super high fears always done with raki or gale?

[thin laurel]

welcome!! how did you do 👀

[covert badge]

126/126 9 min left

[thin laurel]

hell yeah

[bleak scarab]

depends on what you mean by super high

[hearty timber]

Raki for circe definitely, gale on other aspects but I think toula and frinos are good as well

That 6% dodge can save you when you least expect it

[bleak scarab]

but mostly yes, sometimes people also run toula or hecuba

[thin laurel]

imo Gale is hypothetically the best, but only if you play well enough to save your barriers for bosses where they rly matter.
toula and frinos offer more unconditional defensive buffs with no rng involved
and then hecuba is sometimes needed for magick hungry stuff

personally idt I’m good enough to use raki at truly high fear, I need the hp/dd/barriers from defensive familiars lol, but if you’re confident then ofc crit is good

[bronze marlin]

was just thinking about the unseen discussion up there heh. "why not just use hecuba". that's where my raki/gale question came from.
"super high" = 55+ or so.

[hearty timber]

Raki goes hard on circe, he's always in the face of the enemy

[thin laurel]

ahhh yeah, hecuba works too
coldshade’s rec for Eos was actually toula + unseen and tbh it felt great
hecuba would also work tho

I also rly like how Gale plays with Circe, it kinda changes how it works since Gale follows you, but it makes it easy to layer casts
Frinos is the main familiar that feels weird to me on Circe lol

[hearty timber]

Ohh man that info might change my entire 55 fear run

I thought gale was like frinos just running around randomly

[thin laurel]

try it out!! it can be riskier since you want to be up close, but layering casts on bosses feels great + you can dash away and drop a cast right after to put two right next to each other

[hearty timber]

Yup double smolder/storm ring time

[thin laurel]

also you’ll be ahead of me if you clear 55 👀 my pb is 54

[bleak scarab]

gale is the best for circe imo

[thin laurel]

altho at this point my mindset is “screw it, full 62 and suffer until I succeed” which will take ages but is slowly working lol

[hearty timber]

My pb is 50 lol I've been having trouble with 55 but I'm too stubborn to dial it down

[thin laurel]

what’s your fear set up?

for me 54 was everything maxed but 0 void grit and pain

[hearty timber]

At 55 it's max everything + scars 2. No void or pain

[thin laurel]

ooooh

[hearty timber]

I can probably cancel out pain 1 with aphro gain but idk if it's worth it

[thin laurel]

personally I was most scared of grit since it can make timer harder
and pain is turning out to be tough, but max scars without pain wasn’t too bad…? idk

[hearty timber]

Timer requires me to get lucky with skips, both in erebus and Oceanus

[thin laurel]

I feel that… there’s also just a lot of luck in terms of boons
ik I rely hard on artificer in erebus lol to get my build online, but sometimes it rolls max magick

[hearty timber]

Thankfully erebus has 4 skips so it isn't too bad and I can get through hecate with 30 seconds

[hearty timber]

Yup artificer is one of the big cards that have been very useful since I switched to jpom

With artificer and time piece 7 minor rewards are now major ones + gold

[thin laurel]

yessss
fate’s whim honestly made so many meh mechanics feel great

even boons tbh, starting with some less impactful boons at lv4 makes them way more appealing to me

[hearty timber]

Yup since boons have diminishing returns, lvl 4 makes them quite strong without you having to go for poms. Instead can go for magic or health

[thin laurel]

yessss and at no opportunity cost of “I could have used that pom room reward on a different boon”

like. I would not pom up power surge almost ever, but built in lv4? yes please

[runic plume]

What's the benefit of doing an omega cast? I almost never do it compared to other moves

[thin laurel]

extra damage
imo it’s usually not worth it unless 1. you’re specifically doing an omega cast build, or 2. enemies are spawning in and you have time to channel it before they appear

doing a normal cast will uuuusually be better, purely because it’s faster (and will still trigger your cast boon + lock enemies in place)

[covert badge]

3. glorious disaster and hostile environment are very pog

[tranquil vine]

Just unveiled the first statue for clearing fear and.. lmfaoo

[thin laurel]

…does howling soul start lock you out of hostile environment lol? or do they interact in some weird way

[thin laurel]

lmao
is it everything you hoped for and more
is it magnificent

[tranquil vine]

Had to place my controller on the desk and softly cackle for a solid 10 seconds

[humble urchin]

it is one of the designs of all time that’s for sure

i’m sure Icarus would be a fan

[tranquil vine]

Also I beat typhon with 10 fear which is goated

(Tho it's probably cus of how busted circe staff is)

[runic plume]

I figured it was about useful for the reasons you mentioned, but yeah I'd almost always just use a regular cast and avoid the omega cast builds

[humble urchin]

i know it locks you out of the other ranged cast options (lightning lance, whatever hestia’s called), no clue about HS…good question

[graceful badger]

(That's a fair assesment)

[tranquil vine]

I also walked into typhon with like 600 coins and Hermes legendary boon

[graceful badger]

I never go chasing hermes legendary but with that one clock I should try more often

[tranquil vine]

It's really useful to shrug off chip damage. Me like

[covert badge]

iirc they're incompatible with each other? same thing as ranged cast lock

[humble urchin]

goodluck with that tho, it’s a 1% chance of showing up on your second hermes boons

Excellence raises it to a whopping….1.5%

[tranquil vine]

I've gotten it like thrice I think 🤔

[humble urchin]

you must’ve been very lucky then

[graceful badger]

Suuure, but I tend to turn too many hermes boons to gold

[tranquil vine]

My very first granddad bonk was with it kekw

[graceful badger]

Those voicelines crack me up

[tranquil vine]

Who has the best legendary boon?

Zeus?

[humble urchin]

I would say on the appropriate aspects, Apollo’s

Zeus is just funny, especially when it deletes a miniboss

[thin laurel]

kinda depends? imo the strongest ones are niche in some way, like apollo giving you 2x damage but only on certain moves

[graceful badger]

Poseidon's makes his other boons good

[tranquil vine]

Zeus is kinda goated for typhon I feel like. Helps a lot with the ads 💀

[humble urchin]

oh yeah if you’re running a poseidon build you really want his legendary, but it’s not a “universal” legendary

[graceful badger]

I couldn't stop giggling the other day after getting three in a row

[thin laurel]

the humble twilight curse oneshotting typhon eggs and charging extremely fast 😌

[humble urchin]

“Shocking!”

[tranquil vine]

Speaking of giggling

Dora is the best. I love her so much.

[graceful badger]

Perish.

[tranquil vine]

I need one more typhon kill to do the incantation

I wonder if I'll run it again with circe 💀

[thin laurel]

also hm all this chatting makes me want to try to do at least one more run before bed... fun, high fear, or speed. hmhmhm

[tranquil vine]

Dewit

[graceful badger]

Judgment pom is the funny

[thin laurel]

hmmmm maybe speed... high fear sounds stressful rn I'm sleepy

[dreamy forum]

i hate that you cant gift artemis nectar in the crossroads and have to find her in the first regions

and plus i usually run out of nectar by the time i do find her

[humble urchin]

i always liked to keep 2-3 nectar in reserve for those that you aren’t guaranteed to see every run

[wanton agate]

Huh my save has ||hidden aspects available to use but not revealed in the pool||, and ||their chaos trials up||, but I have nothing done regarding the proper way to unlock them

[dreamy forum]

yooo i got 100 coin from a treasure trove

[jaunty night]

Grand dad??

[jaunty night]

Hera is just free stuff

I really like hers

[jaunty night]

She can spawn in later regions can't she? I got her in oceans yesterday

[humble urchin]

she can spawn only in erebus and oceanus for the underworld yeah

[glass condor]

I do exactly this too

[stable marsh]

Can|| Prometheus mention Dora ||if you have vow of rivals on? The dialogue for progressing her story hasn't shown up

[prisma walrus]

I have no idea how to play any weapon NGL, I just spam scythe regular attacks.

[buoyant matrix]

yeah, at some point heracles will say something like "ok I'm gonna be silent from now on" and then prom dialogue will continue like normal

there's a lot of heracles dialogue though

[stable marsh]

And the dialogue about Dora won't play until then?

[buoyant matrix]

correct

[cobalt raptor]

how hard is beating chronos on the first night?

[rose shadow]

wtf jeweled pom effect stays even when I swap it out?? I've been wasting a keepsake slot for ages

[stable marsh]

alright, ty

[cobalt raptor]

i've got a debuff from eris making me take like 60% more damage

[dreamy forum]

i have like 5 more keepsakes to 3star then ill be free from this grind

[dry cipher]

Very

[graceful badger]

"Not intended" hard.

[cobalt raptor]

eris keeps giving me a boon to make me take more damage

[buoyant matrix]

achievable with enough practice

[covert badge]

it means you're getting good with the game
also eris will find this annoying and goes away eventually

[buoyant matrix]

leave every bossfight with less than 30% of your max hp to avoid that

[prisma walrus]

I wonder what's the minimum number of runs to actually get the ending.

[cobalt raptor]

will it stop after a few runs? i just started again

[buoyant matrix]

yes

[buoyant matrix]

https://youtu.be/5-jaaiBX1U0

[stable marsh]

Can athena spawn in the fields of mourning?

[buoyant matrix]

with her keepsake yes

[normal hound]

guys, am i dumb or does grisly gain NOT work on bosses? throughout entire eris fight i dropped one plasma (from adds) with 17% chance

[nova oar]

It does

Or it used to

[normal hound]

so you're telling me i was unlucky enough to literally drop one plasma throughout entire fight? :v

[nova oar]

Maybe? I never take it

[normal hound]

i never do so too, but decided to 'mix things up' lmao

[buoyant matrix]

it should work, what was your build

[covert badge]

it does but it only proc with weapon hit, the chance rate is also ehh

i like it with blades and torches though

[tranquil vine]

What's a fun duo boon to build around? I wanna try something new 🙂

[normal hound]

let me repeat myself 😄 throughout entire fight I procced it once and it was on an add, that's why i'm asking

[nova oar]

Heinous affront

[buoyant matrix]

burning island:
burning desire (aphro hestia)
island getaway (aphro poseidon)
glamour gain

get pyro technique as well for extra funny

[tranquil vine]

Ooo I wanna try the front to my anu-

muffled screams as he gets kidnapped

[covert badge]

well thats unfortunate
visceral Impact helps though

[meager elk]

ive always wanted to try supay beachball but im too much of a fates whim addict to try and force it

[graceful badger]

You and me both

[carmine dragon]

Fates whim seems good for speedruns and low fear, but high fear seems like a death sentence without being able to change

[craggy widget]

idk why they deleted poseidon gain only to readd it as worse ares gain 😭

[nova oar]

It's the high fear meta

[carmine dragon]

How is having less choice better? Keepsakes arent that godly lol

[covert badge]

i mean one stone kills two birds eh?
plasma AND magick, also sanguinary

[hearty fog]

With FW Keepsakes you're basically using the Grasp that would go towards rerolls for other buffs while the Keepsakes take care of what the rerolls would normally provide.

Too bad after six and a half years of injecting that sweet sweet RNG juice I can't manage without them.

[nova oar]

Plus boons give extra power which makes the runs easier

[hearty fog]

Yeah, having every boon start at level 4 is pretty insane.

[carmine dragon]

Yeah but in this sense, why use any other boons at all unless your a new player? Hate that things get left behind like that

[nova oar]

Even tho it is random you can typically get at least 1 god you want

[nova oar]

What?

[carmine dragon]

FW are best keespakes its the new meta etc etc, so unless youre screwing around. You better use FW keepsakes thats what it means

[nova oar]

Yes, but you don't unlock them till after the ending and you're not forced to use them i don't see the problme

[carmine dragon]

Problem is metas shouldnt exist, everything should be balanced well, why else make 30 keepsakes and then just end up making only 2-3 of them actually worth in endgame

[crystal tapir]

In my standards, a good aspect is one where I can play absentmindedly and still progress smoothly without any trouble.
An aspect that’s good when fully focused... every aspect good if play it with full concentration..

[covert badge]

its just one way to play the game man, Olympian keepsakes are still valid in normal run

[thin laurel]

"metas shouldn't exist" is a fine concept but idk if it's even a little bit achievable
the sort of player who cares about speedrunning or high/max fear is almost always going to care about optimization, and a meta will form via player experimentation. making the game so absurdly balanced that there is NO meta is..... debatably impossible, imo

[craggy widget]

idk I think there should be some broken stuff for the funny

like it should exist to make the game satisfying as you just melt through enemies and bossbars

[carmine dragon]

Closest game I can think of is warframe, all the frames u can play are actually usable/balanced but yeah its hard. But atleast they arent working with 200+ champions to balance like league of legends some companies doom themselves, Hades has a small pool to work with

[thin laurel]

also metas are contextual 🤷
fate's whim does rob you of some consistency, so on weapons which really care about a specific god it can still be better to start with a god keepsake. the current speedrun WR holder said (when I asked him lol) that he doesn't rly recommend doing fate's whim for speeds since extra rng and resets makes you go a lil insane

I also think that like... hades 2 is a single player game, and the vast majority of players won't touch high fear or speedruns at all. at the level like 90% of people will play at, the game is honestly very balanced
it would be cool if the devs balanced it even further at the extreme ends, but idt it's that important that they do tbqh

[carmine dragon]

I think WR times at some point literally are just RNG, skill will get every1 to the same point mostly and then RNG takes you over, thats how roguelikes are tho

And no Supergiant arent the company to tweak a game for years so I dont expect that after its launch***

[nova oar]

Not true at all, foolish is far more skilled than I ever could be

Hades only really has a meta when you get into the niche super hard content, the rest is perfectly viable to play just about anything

I think the game is very well balanced all things considered

[thin laurel]

WR times definitely involve some level of luck, but also a lot of skill, and not using fate's whim eliminates part of the rng so it's less dependent on luck, which is why I brought it up. the meta is contextual, and if you're trying to play at an absurdly high level then removing luck from the equation as much as possible is nice
for max fear you can't have rerolls anyway since no arcana, and for that idk if fate's whim will ever not be meta just because you have so little control to begin with

[carmine dragon]

Ah yeah no arcana LOL well I dont do max fear stuff so thats not a thought to me,but makes sense now they are forced to use that stuff

[thin laurel]

but also idk, I just genuinely think that balance in a single player game is WAY less important than in pvp
even if jpom was flat out the best keepsake for every level of content I wouldn't have a huge issue with that, it's just 1/4 keepsake slots and with two dozen weapons to choose from and so many boon combos idm that much, ig. I'm more happy that jpom shifted the arcana meta away from "if you don't use rerolls you're just Wrong" lol