history

[shrewd pecan]

PRSM will feature anti ship capability alongside other features

[manic latch]

No concepts for a mobile carrier of NSM?

[shrewd pecan]

no idea what the aussies are going with for that

All I know is you saying HIMARs can’t attack ships isn’t exactly correct

on top you know

HIMARs being a useful fires asset able to reliably strike targets out to 75 KMs with standard GMLRS alone

[manic latch]

But ships are moving

[shrewd pecan]

yeah but islands don’t move

And tend to feature things like command posts, airfields and other squishy things

On top of the fact HIMARs are high mobile easily transportable weapon systems

That can roll off a C-130 and be ready to fire within 15 minutes

[manic latch]

I was expecting Australia to do something like this
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/K-300P_Bastion-P

For NSM

Guess Himars can work too ye

Not for NSM or Lrasm yet

[shrewd pecan]

yeah but the HIMARs are a multi purpose platform

that are a useful artillery asset

[subtle prawn]

https://twitter.com/NavalInstitute/status/1663194460593741825

U.S. Naval Institute (@NavalInstitute)

#OTD in 1940, the Vought F4U Corsair flew for the first time. In 1943, the Corsair and F6F Hellcat (AKA the "Terrible Twins") destroyed 5 enemy planes for every U.S. plane lost. This 1944 photo is of factory-fresh Corsairs and Hellcats being prepared to be shipped to the Pacific.

Likes

430

Twitter · May 29, 2023, 2:43 PM

[desert agate]

LRASM-SL will be launched from HIMARS

we've also been developing hypersonic missiles that can be launched from HIMARS

[manic latch]

Welcome to Hypersonic family

[desert agate]

Australia's been in the hypersonics game longer than most

some of the earliest experiments with hypersonics were conducted at Woomera

the first successful Hypersonic scramjet was tested there in 2002

[manic latch]

Hypersonix

[spring briar]

Looks like a steam train

[desert agate]

Australia's also been working on air launched hypersonics for a long time as well

plan to enter one in service by end of decade

afaik even earlier, 2025-27

[manic latch]

https://www.aviacionline.com/2023/05/incommunicado-collaborative-combat-between-rafale-and-f-35-is-impossible-dassault-ceo-says/

While there is “interoperability” with the F-16 and F-35 fighters, this is primarily facilitated through data exchange via the U.S.-designed Link 16, which is available to NATO forces. French fighters are equipped with Link 16, allowing data link with an F-16.

However, compatibility with the F-35 is more challenging because it adheres to an American, non-NATO standard and remains a closed system. Trappier humorously commented that if allied nations wished to achieve interoperability with an F-35, the easiest way would be to purchase one.

F35 use MADL but wiki says she did had Link-16 as well. So I don't get it

It's CEO of Dassault so I trust he knows what he is claiming about Rafale

[shrewd pecan]

French F-35 squadrons when

[manic latch]

Ok learned from a pilot

The general difference is within the throughput values in which F-35 using MADL has a higher throughput of data than Link 16 which is around 30 to 120 kbits/s
The article is stating that MADL should be implemented more on different platforms, but the problem is that no country actually wants to pay for implementing 1 mbit/s speeds of datalink between aircraft

[shrewd pecan]

Biafra war

[tough quail]

begone

[spring briar]

Global security

shows 9 flags

(This is a meme)

[ivory ridge]

[manic latch]

Rip

[runic prairie]

Try all you want you can’t make me unslurp the Harpoon juice.

[subtle prawn]

https://twitter.com/NavalInstitute/status/1663317496911331334

U.S. Naval Institute (@NavalInstitute)

#OTD in 1958, USS Stickleback (SS-415) was holed on her port side in a collision with USS Silverstein (DE-534) near Hawaii. The sub had been going to a safe depth but lost power and broached 200 yards ahead of the destroyer escort. The entire crew was rescued before the sub sank.

Twitter · May 29, 2023, 10:52 PM

[grave ravine]

Those are the partner nations AFAIK

[manic latch]

He is joking about those 9 flags= world

[subtle prawn]

https://twitter.com/NavalInstitute/status/1663339007529439232

U.S. Naval Institute (@NavalInstitute)

#OTD in 1944, German U-boat U-549 torpedoed and sank USS Block Island (CVE-21) near the Canary Islands. Block Island was the only U.S. Navy carrier lost in the Atlantic during World War II. The U.S. Navy avenged the loss of Block Island by sinking U-549 later that night.

Twitter · May 30, 2023, 12:18 AM

[wind laurel]

https://youtu.be/4AdcvDiA3lE

[tribal mortar]

Isn't Chen Hai and Hwah Jah kind of a self own putting them under Dragon Empery by their Japanese names instead of their Chinese names?

[eternal veldt]

Thought its Chen-Hau because of Wade-Giles system?

The bespoke way is to use the actual moonrunes

[eternal veldt]

Huh, never quite realized that New Orleans basically stole Minnie's #1 turret so she could get back into action faster.

Fortunately the same batch as well, so no complications compared to other members

[hidden flame]

Those sound nothing like Japanese names the way I pronounce them. If they didn't bother to change the kanji I guess you could consider them the same name though

[subtle prawn]

https://twitter.com/NavalInstitute/status/1663556943829663744

U.S. Naval Institute (@NavalInstitute)

#OTD 1942, USS Yorktown deployed from Pearl Harbor for Midway after 1400 men worked around the clock for 48 hours to repair the severe damage the carrier had suffered at the Battle of the Coral Sea. The Japanese thought it had been sunk or too badly damaged to return to action.

Likes

155

Twitter · May 30, 2023, 2:44 PM

[subtle prawn]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P_VbQGJi7Ms

[subtle prawn]

https://news.usni.org/2023/05/30/authorities-detain-chinese-ship-suspected-of-salvaging-u-k-wwii-wrecks

[frozen kestrel]

This does put a smile on my face

[wintry moat]

Good

[subtle prawn]

https://twitter.com/NavalInstitute/status/1663697690390151168

U.S. Naval Institute (@NavalInstitute)

#OTD in 1922, the Lincoln Memorial was dedicated. #DYK that it was damaged by friendly fire during WWII? A soldier manning a .50 caliber machine gun that was part of DC's air defenses accidentally fired 4 rounds, 3 of which hit the memorial. At least 1 bullet hole still remains.

Twitter · May 31, 2023, 12:03 AM

[subtle prawn]

https://www.navalnews.com/naval-news/2023/05/us-navy-discloses-155mm-advanced-gun-systems-preliminary-fate/

[manic latch]

So it's gonna rot in storage

[dapper parcel]

Probably will ends up in dahlgren

or china lake, idk

[desert agate]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8HJCDEQGyc&ab_channel=TheAustralianArmour%26ArtilleryMuseum

[subtle prawn]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5f-nfoLqdO0

https://news.usni.org/2023/05/31/marines-prove-ch-53es-can-resupply-ballistic-missile-submarines

[subtle prawn]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W5HhCd8i9xc

https://twitter.com/NavalInstitute/status/1663913555316318217

U.S. Naval Institute (@NavalInstitute)

Happy 93rd Birthday to Clint Eastwood. While in the Army in 1951, he hitched a ride on a Navy Skyraider that ran out of fuel and ditched off the coast of CA. He then paddled a raft for 2 miles to safety. 4 years later he made his 1st credited appearance in FRANCIS IN THE NAVY.

Twitter · May 31, 2023, 2:21 PM

[spring briar]

Coastal defence ship Furieux

[thick timber]

When will we get the ice carrier in azur lane

[pseudo crystal]

you talking about the iceberg carrier?

the rigging would be massive and her health would be like 0 lol

[subtle prawn]

https://twitter.com/NavalInstitute/status/1663945373935648770

U.S. Naval Institute (@NavalInstitute)

#OTD 1918, Lt. Edouard Izac was captured by U-90 after his ship was torpedoed. He gathered intel about German sub operations and then attempted several daring escapes from POW camps, finally succeeding disguised as a guard. Awarded the MoH, he later served five terms in Congress.

Twitter · May 31, 2023, 4:27 PM

[delicate beacon]

Who had habbakuk on their bingo?

[subtle prawn]

https://news.usni.org/2023/05/31/navy-f-5-crashes-off-key-west-pilot-safely-recovered

[spring briar]

Dévastation

[maiden citrus]

Perfect

[spring briar]

hotdog turret

[maiden citrus]

Yum

[manic latch]

Meeting of Soviet and American soldiers on Elbe

[strong plank]

Some pics from the US Army museum at Randolph Battery

[manic latch]

@spring briar shells

[spring briar]

I know

I’ve saved them already

[subtle prawn]

https://twitter.com/NavalInstitute/status/1664060618263896066

U.S. Naval Institute (@NavalInstitute)

#OTD in 1944, the destroyer escort USS England (DE-635) sank its sixth Japanese submarine in 12 days using the "Hedgehog" Anti-Submarine Projector. For its remarkable success as a sub killer, the ship was awarded a Presidential Unit Citation and the CO received the Navy Cross.

Twitter · Jun 1, 2023, 12:05 AM

[autumn sorrel]

Why does it look so cute? That bow and that stubby turret

[subtle prawn]

https://twitter.com/NavalInstitute/status/1664084001273925632

U.S. Naval Institute (@NavalInstitute)

#OTD in 1916, the Royal Navy Grand Fleet met the Imperial German Navy's High Seas Fleet in the Battle of Jutland. It was the largest sea battle of the WWI. Both sides claimed victory. The Royal Navy suffered much higher losses but succeeded in containing the German fleet.

Twitter · Jun 1, 2023, 1:38 AM

[eternal veldt]

Something is wrong alright

Where the fuck are your flash fire doors

Where are your signals, Beatty

[maiden citrus]

where are your good bcs beatty

oh look, they're on the german's side

[eternal veldt]

Where are your good shells

[wintry moat]

cries in no green boy shells

[autumn sorrel]

T-55M3 test firing
https://twitter.com/annquann/status/1663777543798013952?s=46&t=VmBPf9V3wtTffwschA-ygw

Lee Ann Quann (@AnnQuann)

"Spot first, fire first, hit first"

T-54M main battle tanks of Vietnam People Army engaging mock targets. Featuring TIFCS-3BU FCS of Indra (Spanish), T-54M outmatches T-54/55 in terms of hit probability. The gun of T-54M is still D-10T (100mm) to make use of existing ammo stock.

Likes

154

▶ Play video

Twitter · May 31, 2023, 5:20 AM

[tough quail]

log equipped, ready to party

D-10T reigns eternal

best tank gun 1944-2023

[autumn sorrel]

I won’t be surprised if we somehow use D-10T against alien

[runic prairie]

Along with the M2 Browning

[desert agate]

you just said that

[autumn sorrel]

My connection is really bad here, dunno why but discord keep bugging

[autumn sorrel]

Such a beautiful gun, Ma Deuce. Truly, John Mosses Browning best legacy!

[grave ravine]

Best part is that the last submarine had been hunted for like 30 hours by the other ships in the task force, with over 20 Hedgehog and depth charge volleys fired at the submarine, before England arrived and one tapped it with a hedgehog volley

[supple sandal]

Anyone have more training images like these

[supple sandal]

Some equipment from the second Indochina war made it way to Afghanistan and then back to US

[manic latch]

AL Zarrar is likely the strongest T-54

New turret with 125mm

[grave ravine]

No, its probably the Type 59Gs being used by Chad, it's a similar vehicle but with probably better armor and supposedly a more powerful engine

Or if we are including prototypes, the Ukrainian T-55AGM

[manic latch]

Ah that

[tough quail]

i love you weird black eagle

[neon oyster]

T80u Halloween costume

[grave ravine]

No that's not the Black Eagle, that's the Ukrainian T-55AGM prototype, which was an export upgrade package for the T-55 aimed at Peru

[neon oyster]

That thing looks terribly overweight

And I know it’s a t55 just looks kinda like a t80u

[grave ravine]

It's got an upgraded engine, the 5TD

But yeah it's 10t heavier than a base T-55

[tough quail]

it looks like one because it's using t-80u parts

also the funky bustle

so yeah it's a weird kharkovite budget black eagle built on a t-55

[remote monolith]

@desert agate wake the fuck up Gondwanan https://edition.cnn.com/2023/05/31/australia/oldest-pterosaur-bones-australia-scn-intl-hnk/index.html

your time to shine in the Cretaceous has come

[subtle prawn]

https://twitter.com/NavalInstitute/status/1664255919453097985

U.S. Naval Institute (@NavalInstitute)

#OTD in 1914, General Order No. 99 banned all alcohol on U.S. Navy ships. Ships have remained dry except on very rare occasions. Meanwhile, the Royal Navy's aircraft carrier HMS Queen Elizabeth has its own pub. "The Queen's Head" beer selection includes "Carrier Ale".

Twitter · Jun 1, 2023, 1:01 PM

[desert agate]

the officers bar/mess on HMAS Choules has beanbags

[desert agate]

holy based

[maiden citrus]

nobody did, one was on infamous blunders from the battle (and mine that I prefer german bc design principles)

https://puu.sh/JI8eP.png

I've stated previously I like german bcs better

[manic latch]

Didn't live long I assume

[shrewd pecan]

for the era that came out

that was the top of the line tank destroyer

[manic latch]

Actually first time I heard these

[maiden citrus]

inspector gadget inspiration

[shrewd pecan]

same hull I believe (for most of them)

with the MILAns being the same mount in both images

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hotchkiss_M201

[delicate beacon]

Basically a modernised towed AT gun.

[shrewd pecan]

I mean..

[desert agate]

the French also mounted a bunch of ATGMs on a universal carrier

[shrewd pecan]

that sounds incredibly cursed

[desert agate]

sorry, it's German mounting French missiles

my b

[shrewd pecan]

that is just

[desert agate]

no T-55 is safe from the ATGM carrier

wait wdym the French are nuking us?

[shrewd pecan]

ah the warthog but real is making progress again

https://taskandpurpose.com/tech-tactics/army-infantry-squad-vehicle-improvements/

[shrewd pecan]

sorry the only acceptable form is the one with HOTS or Kornets

[spring briar]

[subtle prawn]

https://twitter.com/Aegean_Monitor/status/1664317330690654230

Aegean Monitor (@Aegean_Monitor)

Just in: US Congress approved the sale of the F-35 fighter jet to #Greece. Official congressional notification from the State Department is awaited.

Greece aims to acquire 20+20 F-35A Block 4s. Deliveries are expected to start in 2028.

#F35 @StateDept

Twitter · Jun 1, 2023, 5:05 PM

https://twitter.com/NavalInstitute/status/1664352803051978752

U.S. Naval Institute (@NavalInstitute)

#OTD in 1939, HMS Thetis sank during trials and took the lives of 99 men. Thetis was salavaged, repaired and recommissioned as HMS Thunderbolt. In 1943, the submarine was lost again when Thunderbolt was sunk by depth charges dropped by an Italian ship.

Twitter · Jun 1, 2023, 7:26 PM

[manic latch]

[delicate beacon]

Interesting mascot

[supple sandal]

Greece about to borrow Germoney again it seem

[subtle prawn]

https://news.usni.org/2023/06/01/navy-issues-boeing-200m-long-lead-super-hornet-award-ahead-of-planned-20-fighter-award

[subtle prawn]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4v_Jk9pnDU

[manic latch]

For me it's Montana

While I would normally prefer 457mm guns, 406mm does ease things alot and usually enough

While 28 knot speed is not best and should be improved to 30 knots if you accept having more weight

[stiff mauve]

So basically the 33kn version

[manic latch]

33 is too much

30 would make her engines more modest

[ivory ridge]

Longtana

[eternal veldt]

That's one too fine bow

Going to drown like Iowa

Chonkers unite

[maiden citrus]

[strong plank]

Did you know that during Japan’s surrender, the Canadian representative signed on the wrong line

and thus everyone after had to shift their signature down a line

[maiden citrus]

it's an amusing error yeh

[dapper parcel]

Huh, did the design even actually specify 6 shaft?

IIRC one of the BB65-7/8 problems was putting that much power into 4 shafts

Friedman mentions turboelectric drive, which at least imply putting more turbines into fewer shafts
Idk if that passage was General Board or his own opinion

[charred coral]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Festa_della_Repubblica

[ivory ridge]

Waiting for the parade to be like

A Centauro 2

A freccia

And a couple of Pumas

[supple sandal]

Ball gunner kinda suck

[gentle pecan]

i have a question, what is the basis for the PR ship HMS Monarch?

[subtle prawn]

#history message

Refer to the link in that message

[neon oyster]

https://youtu.be/faWVjPau5R4

[neon oyster]

Perhaps Ariete if we’re lucky?

[fierce sparrow]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VlEp-Grb9qQ

[manic latch]

If it's 4 shaft for 320.000hp power

Then it's 80k hp per shaft, this is even higher than 70k hp per shaft of Soyuz,Stalingrad, Project 24 warships, which people already say they have too much

So yeah I think 6 shaft was always the logical choice for her

[remote monolith]

@royal quail @gilded girder

how our numbering system developed

[royal quail]

Ooh

interesting

[gilded girder]

[ivory ridge]

Seems like i was mostly right
https://twitter.com/NichoConcu/status/1664571501134204928?t=opyagkmUradhMawQ11OPcQ&s=19

A-129 Mangusta (@NichoConcu)

Festa della Repubblica. 🇮🇹😉🎉

Likes

186

Twitter · Jun 2, 2023, 9:55 AM

A Centauro, a Freccia and a bunch of Linces and Orsos

[neon oyster]

Less tanks than victory day fr

[neon oyster]

At least Centauro is sexy

[dapper parcel]

When EI itself forgot Ariete exists

[ivory ridge]

They can't use tracked vehicles on that road

In past parades the Dardos were on trasport trucks

[ivory ridge]

I wish they did so they wouldn't spend so much money on its MLU lol

[neon oyster]

Makes sense

That road is really narrow too

[neon oyster]

I’m 90% sure Italians also forgor it existed

[manic latch]

Some roads just get butchered by tank tracks and weight

That road is one of them

While I think stones in Moscow road can handle up 50 tons for each

[neon oyster]

I remember seeing some t34s or whatever absolutely tearing up a road in Moscow

[manic latch]

You usually should use rubber pads ye

Not every road can handle it

[neon oyster]

T34s never got them sooo

Someone had a bad day

[manic latch]

Asphalt roads aren't good for them ye

[dapper parcel]

It'l still teared up even with rubber. Asphalt simply got too much adeshion

[manic latch]

You can see the rubber pads here

And similar to China

[dapper parcel]

We douse the road with water if a tank for whatever reason absolutely need to pivot for a public display

[neon oyster]

Basically every modern tank has rubber pads

Just t34 is old

[ivory ridge]

Pics not mine

[dapper parcel]

The main problem wasn't necessarily the track, it's the pivot turn

[manic latch]

Turning is horrible ye

[desert agate]

T-55 also didnt feature rubber tracks

generally the Soviets thought their tanks would spend a lot more time on the plains than in cities so they didnt prioritise rubber tracks

[dapper parcel]

Italy actually display vehicle wights instead of MLC classes in the circle huh

Wait, no way Centauro is MLC44
What they slap on her?

[neon oyster]

Old tonk problem

[ivory ridge]

Most of the times ive seen it with the same 32 on the Freccia

Not sure why it's 44 there

[subtle prawn]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bq66pBjvuNw

[tough quail]

why are centauro turrets so dope

[solid mango]

[ivory ridge]

Ok i found the reason

Tldr

It's over the 32 ton class

But we dont have any class between 32 and 44

For transport vehicles

So it just get slapped to 44

It's likely a version with add on armor that puts it over the 32

And the 44 tons transports exist because they were the ones for the old Leopard 1s

[dapper parcel]

Huh, I guess they indeed list the class

Tho probably using uncommon classes since it's usually go in 20-24-30-40-60 or something

[ivory ridge]

Here you can see it with the old 32

Same as the one on the freccia

The B1 gets 28

Sometimes 25

And the B1 120 also got 25, at least on its prototype

[manic latch]

Sexy

[dapper parcel]

That exhaust tho

[ivory ridge]

La creatura

[tough quail]

Horrifying

Surprisingly not bad shape wise

[ivory ridge]

Gaijin pls

[solid mango]

Fishr

[manic latch]

Fren

[solid mango]

😦

[manic latch]

Dead fren

[solid mango]

Storm veri bad

[manic latch]

Snowi

[manic latch]

Undef

Does Italy MRE has pasta

[delicate beacon]

I think Dutch MREs do

[manic latch]

Found Italian one from 2007

[ivory ridge]

Yes

[manic latch]

Smoll pasta but

[manic latch]

Perfect

[manic latch]

Still same after 16 years I see

US ones keep getting smaller

Tho they use new techs like air vacuum etc

Nvm new CCAR 24 was for FSR replacement not MRE

[alpine onyx]

You said snow?

Just walk over to bote

[manic latch]

Did Germans had special icebreaker modification for destroyers like Soviets did

[humble mulch]

What in the fuck is this

Like field rations?

[deep apex]

Uh

[manic latch]

Prototype CCAR, 24 hour ration

[deep apex]

Yes?

[alpine onyx]

Destroyers didn't get those afaik, not needed

[humble mulch]

The chicken has me worried

[manic latch]

Needs some special drugs or storage to prevent spoil ye

[humble mulch]

Yep

[deep apex]

It also has to fit in a bag

[humble mulch]

Yeah

[deep apex]

Because cans sound better, but they aren't when you're hauling ass literally everywhere with them

[manic latch]

They used air vacuuming for more space

[humble mulch]

Yep you'd definitely want to do air vacuuming

Just idk used to how MREs at least look when cooked so that threw me off

[deep apex]

Also for food storage

The moment food is exposed to air, the rotting process starts

[humble mulch]

Yeah, these things are real usefull during natural disasters and other emergencies

Wanna have good storage solutions and what not for them

[manic latch]

More of these for civilians actually

Stufflebeem said that since the program had been started on October 7, 2001 the United States had dropped 785,000 rations.

[humble mulch]

Yeah, was more addressing modern ration systems. Feel they'd piggy back off each other well, both civilian and then military

[subtle prawn]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NDtmDym0E20

[desert agate]

Australian MREs are made in New Zealand

because the NZDF is quite literally a support force for ADF

[sullen canyon]

At least it wasn't K-Rations?

[deep apex]

K rations were actually extremely advanced for their time.

They were literally more expensive to produce than a C ration

[frozen kestrel]

okay, real quick, what's RM24?

[alpine onyx]

The Marinewaffenamt

Office for naval armament

[frozen kestrel]

On invenio?

[alpine onyx]

Mhm

[delicate beacon]

Yes

[frozen kestrel]

well, that makes my life a little easier

[alpine onyx]

They have plans for the turrets themselves

Like a detailed plan of Hipper's turret armor

Exact thickness, and armor material, and dimensions

[delicate beacon]

Find me the Dutch guns Sirene or I will shoot.

[frozen kestrel]

[alpine onyx]

I have not had the time to really dwell in archive material since I started work

I need more hours in a day

[manic latch]

New patent for China VTOL

[manic latch]

Honestly it looks sexier than F-35, if end product stays same

Can be useful for Type 75 and 76

[strong plank]

Look at the RCS on that intake

[manic latch]

If X-32 was designed with stealth, then it looks fine tbh

[delicate beacon]

I thought Mainland China didn't have powerful enough engine technology for single-engine fighters?

[manic latch]

Who makes their J-10s then

[delicate beacon]

Sorry, phrased wrong. For first line fighters.

I'm not implying it's not possible, just that it's not ideal.

[subtle prawn]

https://twitter.com/NavalInstitute/status/1664751840775241730

U.S. Naval Institute (@NavalInstitute)

#FirepowerFriday
USS Missouri (BB-63) fires her 16-inch guns in this undated photo. The Missouri was the only Iowa-class battleship not to have a turret altered in the 1950s for W23 "Katie" nuclear projectiles. All the W23 projectiles were withdrawn from service in 1962.

Twitter · Jun 2, 2023, 9:52 PM

[zealous gull]

I forgot to thank you about this earlier, but I did my presentation yesterday with the help of the resources you sent and absolutely aced it

The person assessing was a previous navigation officer and said that my description of events and explanation of navigation principles was brilliant and way above what was expected, so good stuff

Also unrelated, but spotted this while taking the commuter ferry the other day and thought people here might like it

[delicate mesa]

*handsome cartoon guy laughing

[manic latch]

If only

What purpose? Nobody knows

[humble mulch]

That looks so fucking cursed

[dapper parcel]

I wonder if its fuel cell would even certified for carrier operation

[ivory ridge]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/858825164313854012/1114268589961269269/100523_Bergamini2.jpg

[solid mango]

Bofor 👍

[subtle prawn]

https://www.navalnews.com/naval-news/2023/06/kongsberg-receives-new-nsm-order-for-the-u-s-navy/

[delicate beacon]

Cute, but where da rest of the mount

[thorny patio]

So in my head, when i look at all the ships in my dock classified as a CA... I want to think "tough armor"...

But then i look at most of my RN CA's and find out that they only have LIGHT armor ratings

[desert agate]

this is a certified County Class moment

[eternal veldt]

Duquesne and Tourville:

[desert agate]

oh boy I love having 3 inches of magazine box protection on my heavy fucking cruisers and no armour belt

[thorny patio]

LNT shenanigans i assume

[desert agate]

WHY ARE YOU SO BAD

[desert agate]

yeah, 10'000t cruiser displacement and needing actually viable cruisers with enough range to move across the empire seriously hampered the class

[thorny patio]

Okay, but there had to have been something to separate them from being reclassified as CLs... Or am I missing something XD

[desert agate]

8in guns

[thorny patio]

Thaaaats right

[desert agate]

LNT defined a CL as being armed with 6in and CA with 8in regardless of protection

[eternal veldt]

Spid is armour

[desert agate]

Admiralty design board when you tell them there will be either massively underprotecting or massively overprotecting (for no appreciable gain) your interwar warships at the function

[eternal veldt]

The solution is not to armour your ships

Then cram 4 triple 203s on it

What London should have been

If your ship blows up, just court martial the captain and try him for cowardice

[ivory ridge]

[thorny patio]

Then u had the Germans... Either disregarding the treaty limits entirely or simply building ships with the intention of swapping for bigger guns

[eternal veldt]

Yea, no. Deutschland was marginally within the limits.

They were also not a signatory of WNT or LNT.

[desert agate]

(i just made that)

[eternal veldt]

Hippers are immensely bloated, yes, principally due to the amount of redundancy and the clusterfuck of workshops on board.

[desert agate]

Scharnhorst wasnt designed for bigger guns afaik

they had to make some serious modification

[eternal veldt]

You dare use my own spell against me?

[eternal veldt]

No, the 38cm gun option required the bow to be lengthened extensively.

[desert agate]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/224051664787603467/998295239510995034/Conte_di_Cavour.gif

[eternal veldt]

The original brainy plan was to take the 28cm guns out, unfuck them, then put them on the P-class

But moustache man pulled the funni too early, and the P-class fuckfest never ended

[thorny patio]

Ah plan z

wait...

PLAN Z

Sorry i just remembered this scene XD

[eternal veldt]

Real talk though

IJN cruiser turrets

No better than cardboard as protection

At least the UK had what, 38mm frontal plates?

IJN: 25mm all the way

[ivory ridge]

[alpine onyx]

are you telling me that applying the same equipment quantity requirements as the battleships (which were internationally already above average in that regard) is exaggerated on a cruiser? I am shocked. Shocked!

[spring briar]

[eternal veldt]

Remove your beer hold then.

[dapper parcel]

Bruh, this was a feature!

[alpine onyx]

Need this one edited

[eternal veldt]

with a bubble?

was exactly thinking that.

[alpine onyx]

Yep

Wanted to say bubble, but struggled between speech and speach, English hard

[eternal veldt]

Turret armour is unnecessary

[thorn trail]

what ship is this from

[dapper parcel]

Haruna

[manic latch]

@ivory ridge https://youtu.be/0JZ0U-oNRes

[ivory ridge]

[spring briar]

[autumn sorrel]

Why’s Drach bad?

[dapper parcel]

He's mostly fine when not talking about technical stuffs
Which is weird, I thought he was an engineer...

[delicate beacon]

Drach is, like any single person operation usually would, biased.
He's also producing a lot of content in a short time so his informations are frequently citing propegated misinfo.

[final idol]

grass

[manic latch]

He does talk with lot of hindsight sometimes

For example I noted down his Yamato ranking

"Relatively efficiently designed ship"
There are individual flaws you can pick up, like torpedo defense system, but that's not about engineering efficiency but competency

For an 18 inch gun platform she isn't too bad, N3 class was about 48-49k tons but it has many weight savings and less anti airs compared to. And also had thinner belt set up, thinner turret armor setup, slower. All that for 48500 tons.

Let's say if N3 tried to reach Yamato's level stats it would be around 65k tons which is Yamato's lower end displacement.

She is certainly not ineffectient as Bismarck in terms of firepower vs displacement (seen this coming)

There is one major bone to pick, that's her secondary battery. Additional weight and stability problems those 6 inch would cause would since if Yamato didn't had those superfiring 6 inches they could have make turrets closer to each other thus result in shortening the armor of belt and deck which would save more weight that can be used to increase armor if you want or use it somewhere else. Choosing triple 6 inch was a dumb choice given hindsight, ideal would be 100mm but it wasn't designed by the time she was laid down.
So Yamato could have gone US/British style by choosing only 127mm and given her size she can do 6-7 twin 5 inch mounts by some pushing. Even 5 would be fine.

So in 0 to 10. Yamato is a 7

[manic latch]

But British around the design times also had a mixed battery design like Yamato, so Drach shouldn't judge her by not having more focus on DP

And Yamato was designed as a anti BB focus BB so 6 inches were good choice for her

[spring briar]

He’s not bad
Just was using very outdated information in his earlier vids

He’s better now

[delicate beacon]

"better"

I haven't watched any recent videos since the topics don't allign.
His Q&As feel as if they go into basic topics more often and the remaining interesting ones often receive a "non-answer" or generic talk. But maybe that's just me.

[maiden citrus]

His technical info and related opinions are sometimes downright hilarious

[eternal veldt]

5.25" is great

[delicate beacon]

Just don't let his community know the 3,7cm is actually quite decent.

[dapper parcel]

which 3.7cm?

[eternal veldt]

The German one?

[dapper parcel]

There's like two dozen different 3.7cm

[delicate beacon]

German ones.

[dapper parcel]

SK C/30?

[delicate beacon]

Honestly I don't know the details

[dapper parcel]

Now I'm concerned

I guess it's good if your AA doctrine involves sniping attacking aircraft one by one

[delicate beacon]

It's not the best out there, may not even be great.
But I certainly wouldn't advocate for IJN 25mms being better 1:1 like they would.

[dapper parcel]

I'd pick 25mm, at least I can walk the tracer

[delicate beacon]

Keep in mind, you still have your 20mms at that point

[dapper parcel]

What's 20mm have anything to do with walking the tracer?

[delicate beacon]

Wait, what does walking the tracer mean?

[dapper parcel]

correcting your lead by looking at tracer

ain't doing that with a manually traversed semiauto

[delicate beacon]

Fair. But the 3,7cm is operating with director and at further range.

Having only undirected 20/25mms until the heavier calibres leaves a significant gap in your defenses.

[dapper parcel]

On another note, was there a specific reason why they didn't use Flak 18 instead?

Can only speculate that either there was a problem marinizing the action, or KM just really want that muzzle velocity

[delicate beacon]

Perhaps Sirene knows.

[manic latch]

Hide this

It's Midway with 16? 152mm

[delicate beacon]

Hide what?

[maiden citrus]

lol

and it depends on which version of the 3.7 tbh

[manic latch]

Worst ww2 AA guns of navies

Japan: 40mm/62 Type 91 (not sure if they kept it on ships) if not 25mm
US: Chicago Piano 3"/23
Italy: hmmmmm 3"/40 Armstrong 1916
British: QF 2-Pounder Mark II
Soviets: Either British MG Mark III or 45mm/46 21-K
Germany: 37mm SK C/30

[maiden citrus]

I'd say worst us aa gun in ww2 is the 3''/23

it has a very low muzzle velocity (short barrel), less fire rate than the 3''/50 and is old as dirt

it's basically a very bad 3''/50

[manic latch]

Oh damn it was still used in ww2

[maiden citrus]

yeah

not a ton of them but it was around

it has less aa ceiling than the chicago piano too

despite being a 3'' round

[manic latch]

"Some major warships carried 3"/23 caliber guns temporarily while awaiting installation of quad 1.1"/75 caliber guns"

Yeah even worse than Piano

[maiden citrus]

veeeery outdated weapon by that time

I can name several us aa guns worse than the chicago piano (which was honestly a good weapon of the age) but I think the 3''/23 is the worst

[autumn sorrel]

I want this so bad

[ivory ridge]

[autumn sorrel]

What? A man gotta dream alright, and quirky weapon system is my thing!

[junior trench]

Director in the sense there's small rangefinder and a FTP. Which... Really doesn't do as much good as you seem to think it does.

It's all well and good to allegedly be able to aim your weapon with accuracy by 1930s standards at the moving aerial target, but there's so many steps beyond that with AA fire that it's lipstick on a pig

[stiff mauve]

I thought that was the Iowa to CV blueprint

[maiden citrus]

battle carrier

[manic latch]

Are you a man of constant sorrow Undef?
Have you seen trouble all your days?

Hmm

[ivory ridge]

Yes

[manic latch]

What if you changed all Yamato's 25mms with 20mm Oerlikons

[ivory ridge]

The 25mm is still a different class of weapon

The 20mm is light AA
The 25mm is just small medium AA

[manic latch]

37-40mm
406-410mm
457-460mm
These are minor difference and yet

20 vs 25 changes the class

Interesting

[ivory ridge]

Because 40 is not enough to be classified as anything else

And 406 -> 410 is less than a 1% difference

20 to 25 is 25%

Also this is more about doctrine than the number itself

[manic latch]

wait

Is medium AA of ww2 changed between 25mm to 76mm

Since 127mm is long

Then long AA changes between 90mm-133mm

[maiden citrus]

hm, I think I'd still consider 25mm light aa, but it's an interesting discussion yeah on which navy considers what what

[dapper parcel]

25mm is quite unfortunate caliber

it's way too heavy to be used on a pintle mount like oerlikons

but too light to warrant a full powered mount like bofors

[manic latch]

What a waste, likely my favorite AA from ww2 era and it barely has any photographs since only Vanguard had them

Missed the action as well

[delicate beacon]

Not BUSTER or STAAG

[manic latch]

6 barrels>>> 2

[delicate beacon]

*removes Kremlin from MySpace friendlist*

2 barrels aimed at the target > 6 that are not

[manic latch]

Spread > Laser

[maiden citrus]

right, it's definetly right up against that 'you need popeye to aim this one' wall

@spring briar was looking at something unrelated and this scrolld by

firecracker sounds fun

[thorn trail]

this is the shells of the 16" guns right?

[maiden citrus]

yeah

[thorn trail]

Actually was wondering

Why does lower muzzle velocity usually have better plunging fire?

[maiden citrus]

has slightly less horizontal energy, so when fired at still optimal angles, it plunges better vertically due to having less horizontal movement

[thorn trail]

Ah

[ivory ridge]

Depends on what you want to call the german 88

[spring briar]

Yes

Better

Not great

But better

[manic latch]

Hmm

Long

Since Italian 90

[maiden citrus]

I posted shell bait for you

[spring briar]

Shell??

Where?

[delicate beacon]

in #al-lore

[maiden citrus]

above

[desert agate]

no lore?

[spring briar]

Smollest shell

[stiff mauve]

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/2f/Iowa_class_aircraft_carrier.jpg

[solid mango]

Mor bofor

[delicate beacon]

What a cuties

[maiden citrus]

pewpew

[solid mango]

Okae, now sad

[maiden citrus]

[subtle prawn]

https://twitter.com/NavalInstitute/status/1664995253806407680

U.S. Naval Institute (@NavalInstitute)

#OTD in 1996, the Japanese destroyer Yugiri accidentally shot down a U.S. Navy A-6E Intruder with a Phalanx CIWS during a training exercise. The Intruder crew from VA-115 ejected and were recovered. It was the first foreign plane shot down by Japanese forces since 1945.

Likes

255

Twitter · Jun 3, 2023, 1:59 PM

[solid mango]

[subtle prawn]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9VA31NLyVc8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KCOTP9R7-F4

[manic latch]

Horse

Name this

[unborn wyvern]

R-Ryan?

[tough quail]

@delicate beacon fat

[delicate beacon]

Why ping me?

[tough quail]

... how the fuck

[manic latch]

[tough quail]

discord had a seizure I guess

mb

[delicate beacon]

Sounds about discord.

[tough quail]

though now that I've scrolled back yes I would also advocate for the 1:1 barrel superiority of the japanese 25mm over the German 37mm

very stinky gun

not worth the steel that made it

the mid war actually automatic ones are fine tho

[manic latch]

@ivory ridge

[ivory ridge]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/684721152739770371/1113956707073282199/image0.gif

[strong plank]

random question unde

does the Italian navy still do their anti fouling in green?

[ivory ridge]

no

[manic latch]

@spring briar Forgive

[spring briar]

Never

[delicate beacon]

Next IB UR

[ivory ridge]

you mean Tirpitz 2?

[delicate beacon]

[spring briar]

I shall destroy it

[delicate beacon]

The damage a single smol shell can do

[spring briar]

A mere fraction of its power

[sullen canyon]

Stop dropping your damned Nokia from orbit damnit

[dapper parcel]

definitely well funded and planned

[delicate beacon]

At least the ordered 7" guns actually arrived.

[manic latch]

So

Were sailors allowed to sleep long as they want during peace time or

It's your typical military discipline where things are always same

[dapper parcel]

The only rest is when you're on port call

Otherwise shifts might get relaxed, but you definitely don't sleep through it

Engineering for example don't really get a lot of wiggle room since the amount of reports they have to do stays the same

[chilly osprey]

Your sleep cycle is going to be determined by your watch rotation.

Generally speaking, you were usually on watch for four hours and then off for the next eight hours.

Though, there are reasons this could vary.

[dapper parcel]

Ye, USN is on 6+6+12 hour rotation, some other are in 8+8+8 hours

[chilly osprey]

And any time action stations/general quarters were called, though, the whole crew would be mobilized

[manic latch]

Warships also don't have comfy beds to not make you too comfortable right?

[eternal veldt]

They're bunks, if I recall

Fold down ones even, on the museums Ive visited in Australia

[zealous gull]

You want discipline to be strict even during peacetime, so no plentiful sleep

since people fall back on their training and habits during wartime rather than rise to the occasion and magically develop good self discipline

Also you want the least number of people on your ship possible to do all the tasks without sending anyone into the red on their sleep management

Australian submarines with their 6h on, 6h off, 6 on, 6 off rotations

[dapper parcel]

It vary greatly between navies and ships

You won't find a bed on any submarine for example, unless you're the CO/XO

CV/LPD/LHD etc are much more comfy

...unless you're the embarked marines, but eh

OPVs are usually comfier than average DD/FF

[dapper parcel]

6+6+6+6 is the worst smh

especially if it shifts during the week

heck rolling shifts should be human rights violation

[strong plank]

Bofors 40mm quad mount my beloved

[eternal veldt]

Bofors this, bofors that

Where is the Mark 51 director?

[dapper parcel]

Huh, they moved the rescue chamber there

[thorn trail]

Wait the thing behind it is a rescue chamber?

Thought it was a water tank or smth lmao

[zealous gull]

Especially since you sometimes have to do paperwork afterwards, and also must have to have finished your handover prior to your watch starting

So you end up with effectively 5 hours sleep by design

How that got past the fatigue management awareness stuff I have no idea

Also I spotted a Royal Australian Navy minehunter while kayaking

Wasnt too keen on getting close to it in case I got into trouble

[desert agate]

HMAS Cairns?

[zealous gull]

Gascoyne

[desert agate]

No I meant the base

[zealous gull]

Nah creswell

[desert agate]

Ah right

Security on Creswell is a bit hit or miss

But yeah probs best not get too close

[strong plank]

he did it boys

he said the thing

[desert agate]

I said the thing

[zealous gull]

Well I did go past a no boating buoy but I figured if I was in a kayak it didnt count

[desert agate]

Not much Westfield Security can do about it anyway

Should be on Creswell next year myself

[zealous gull]

Oooo joining the navy?

[desert agate]

Assuming DFR isn't completely braindead

Yep

[zealous gull]

I won’t say anything 🤐

What PQ?

[desert agate]

MWO

[zealous gull]

Ah of course

[desert agate]

Wanted INTELLO but don't have the high school grades

And it'll take way longer for me to get in

[zealous gull]

MWOs a pretty good gig these days

Just make sure you’re good at mental maths and memorising the rules of the road

[desert agate]

Never been a better time to join the navy tbh

I've done my skippers ticket a few years ago

[zealous gull]

Lots of exciting changes to the MWO roles and training continuum too

Oh in that case you’ve got a pretty good advantage in the training then

[desert agate]

Yeah

Well technically I didn't get the ticket because I didn't do the assessment but I did all the training
Covid hit and put a halt to it all

[zealous gull]

So I take it you’re looking at Nav rather than PWO?

[desert agate]

Unsure as of yet

Leaning towards PWO

[zealous gull]

Ah geez another one

[desert agate]

😎

Either way plenty of sea time for me

[zealous gull]

Well I’ve seen a couple PWO hopefuls playing world of warships with azur lane commanders constantly in the common areas so you’re in good company

[desert agate]

Lmfao

Yeah I've heard from my mate at ADFA

Fighter pilots of the Navy

[zealous gull]

You mean the aviation warfare people?

[desert agate]

Nah MWOs are the fighter pilots of the navy
Got the mannerisms and everything

[zealous gull]

Ah I get you

[desert agate]

Works for me since as a kid I wanted to be a fighter pilot

Still rocking the aviator sunnies

[zealous gull]

Well, lots of egos thats for sure

And lots of aviator sunglasses about

[desert agate]

You in training yourself?

Or just in the area?

[zealous gull]

Yeah I’m at Creswell

Why do you think I was asking for history essay help for a very specific navy history topic haha

[desert agate]

Makes sense lmao

You probs know my mate then

He's not on your course but he was ANF bearer on his graduation

[zealous gull]

Probably not tbh

But if you do the flags for grad you’re pretty good

Since those roles are chosen based on how well you did for neoc overall

[desert agate]

Yeah he's always been super academic unlike myself

Perks of ADHD lmao

Should be on either the first or 2nd neoc next year anyway

I hope

[thorn trail]

What was the highest muzzle velocity for a naval gun in ww2?

[eternal veldt]

@spiral cedar Monty, official armour values at machinery

Frames 48 -58, Magazine area

[maiden citrus]

[eternal veldt]

also available on my drive, along with Salem and CVS-10

what appears to be six bofors tub on the stern, sheesh

[manic latch]

@spring briar

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_cruiser_Émile_Bertin

She is in WT files

[spring briar]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/944777910336753736/960230654895882270/izumothisisfine.gif

[shrewd pecan]

they’re adding so many vehicles I want

Im gonna be John tomcatting

[ivory ridge]

open twitter
holocaust denial in the first post i find

Thanks Elon

[manic latch]

Rumoured a few days ago, here is the first clear image of wha could be „075 The segment of Ship No. 4 (or Ship 076 1) is about to be docked for construction, and the LNG civilian ship on the left has been launched and docked on May 31.

[desert agate]

https://youtu.be/IH2J1Ai8i98

[manic latch]

Her biggest flaw is not coming with a offical body pillow

[shrewd pecan]

US Blackhawk with UN colors during the Bosnia war

[neon oyster]

They really need to chill out

[manic latch]

Then USN would catch on to them

[neon oyster]

How many LHDs do they have atm?

[manic latch]

8 Type 75 planned 3 is active

[manic latch]

This one will be 4

They start construction of this class 2018 do mind

So it's pretty fast

[neon oyster]

So they built all of this in a 5 years time frame

Meanwhile the usn has only completed 2 America class

[manic latch]

Well as I said, they do have good pace and shouldn't slow down

Or else US might catch them

[neon oyster]

Where did all the public funding go ?

[manic latch]

Careful to not touch on Politics Rick

We lost qwerty for such reason

[neon oyster]

Idk building this many this quickly seems largely unnecessary

Unless they’re planning something

[manic latch]

You build your military against potential enemies

Everyone does this

[neon oyster]

Eh who knows

I wonder will they start mass production of Fujian class

[manic latch]

Type 004 is Either clone of Fujian or an improvement

Will see

[neon oyster]

But PLAN LHDs don’t have VTOL aircraft so perhaps a bit less capability there

[manic latch]

We saw Fujian first time in 2013, so it's hard to confirm if a nation is building a supercarrier since they are build by blocks

[neon oyster]

I’m betting more on a clone, going to completely new ship when not all the lessons from previous has been learnt doesn’t seem smart

[manic latch]

This is the new Vtol patent of China

[neon oyster]

Strange su75 looking thing

[manic latch]

Now that you mentioned

It does look a bit like 75

[neon oyster]

Which in turn looks kinda like x-32

[subtle prawn]

https://twitter.com/NavalInstitute/status/1665426926847098880

U.S. Naval Institute (@NavalInstitute)

#OTD 1942, pilot LCDR Wade McClusky from USS Enterprise followed a Japanese destroyer to find the enemy carriers near Midway. He ordered the attack that led to the sinking of Kaga and Akagi. McClusky died in 1976 and is buried in front of the Naval Institute's HQ at Beach Hall.

Likes

293

Twitter · Jun 4, 2023, 6:34 PM

[strong plank]

la creatura

[runic prairie]

UGM-73 Poseidon SLBM Bus, warheads, and fairing.

Mark 3 reentry Vehicle (inert) with 40kt W68 warhead (not included).

Given that at least one is missing from the outer ring I would guess the one on the opposite side is missing (for balance). This means it has at minimum eight reentry vehicles but could have up to 12 if the central 4 spots are filled. Given that these are low yeild warheads the figure of 12 warheads is probably more likely.

That being said practice was generally all or 10 but with 12 it could have a range of somewhere within 2700-2900 nautical miles, give or take depending on pen-aids.

Specifically this is a C3 model as the C4 model was later designated Trident I.

A C4 would have a blunter nose for an additional stage.

[strong plank]

From the Pearl Harbor Submarine Museum

which is really well put-together

[cinder escarp]

I recommend making it up to keyport some day as well.

They have a full SSN command room.

It's all of the kit of the old USS Greenling.

[spring briar]

[subtle prawn]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qBNJuPdGwJI

[subtle prawn]

https://twitter.com/Stella_Hoshii/status/1665604220798779397

Shu-Stella🔞 (@Stella_Hoshii)

These are 4 of the current "Frankenstein" series of weapon designs.
I don't have too many ideas at the moment, tell you what you want to see.

Likes

1193

Retweets

185

Twitter · Jun 5, 2023, 6:19 AM

[manic latch]

@tough quail name this

[ivory ridge]

la creatura

[manic latch]

[shrewd pecan]

returning to Ukrainian tradition

[manic latch]

At least no turret ERA on this one

[shrewd pecan]

it looks like they reinforced the turret armor I will point out

[shrewd pecan]

-inverts your airframe-

[manic latch]

https://tenor.com/view/rotate-gif-25402076

[spring briar]

@spiral cedar dang
France testing at 30° obliquity in 1914

[manic latch]

That's old news

[spiral cedar]

How many calibers

[spring briar]

16cm
19cm
24cm
30cm

against thick and half thickness plates

and up to 40° for the 305mm in one test

[spring briar]

yes, about 109 years old!

[ivory ridge]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/684721152739770371/1113956707073282199/image0.gif

[spring briar]

https://tenor.com/view/you-and-i-are-not-so-different-raimi-meme-green-goblin-spiderman-gif-20908369

[spiral cedar]

I meant calibers as in like 0.5 caliber plates

But yes, neat

[spring briar]

ah

[spiral cedar]

Homogeneous or facehardened plates?

[spring briar]

facehardened

[spiral cedar]

Neato

[spring briar]

French APC shell requirement is

• penetrating a same caliber cemented plate at 15° obliquity when the impact velocity is 60mps higher than the minimum penetration velocity at 0°

I've also found correct projectile lengths

I should send them to Tony

btw french APC shells were called R
and SAPC shells were called R/2
hence semi-rupture

having to only penetrate half the thickness of the APC shell at the same angles

but the difference is that the SAPC shell has to be able to do the same against homogeneous armor

these shells are all equipped with double action fuses

or a Schneider 32/40 mle.1910 fuse

jaboo
look
underwater cap

[humble mulch]

What is the purpose of flipping these planes?

[shrewd pecan]

structural testing I think, I'll have to go back to the thread/article I got it from for the exact reason

[humble mulch]

Ah OK, I thought it would be for something along those lines

[spring briar]

tea

[humble mulch]

[ivory ridge]

[spring briar]

@delicate beacon 10E+1999 petajoules of energy

[humble mulch]

so how do you do your ballistic tests with wood?

and how comparable is it to ones done in the past?

(I know fucking nothing on shell development)

[spring briar]

Not very comparable

I just do it for fun

[manic latch]

Weird hobby ngl

It's like mineral collection I guess

[spring briar]

Not a hobby
I had some wood and decided to shoot my shells at it

[humble mulch]

Ah ok
Thought so but figured there could be a real reason

[spring briar]

Nah, wood is a terrible analog for steel

Just looks neat

The only analog is that shells with angled caps are better at penetrating the wood at an angle

As they would on steel

If you know chainsaw man

I am basically the shell devil

[runic prairie]

@manic latch @tough quail

South Lebanon.

[tough quail]

science

[manic latch]

Cute

[runic prairie]

Conventional Trident D5

[subtle prawn]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sjaITUKwazc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utWxjDPNUtI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c0AKc7xxQQk

[subtle prawn]

https://www.navalnews.com/naval-news/2023/06/japans-new-asev-ships-will-boast-an-impressive-128-vls-cells/

[spring briar]

@spiral cedar ok so French APC shell requirements in 1909 is perforating a same caliber plate at 18 degrees obliquity at ~600mps

So the entire projectile has to pass through the plate

[wet geode]

Is this a pic of Ise with a rear deck?

[solid mango]

Quick search points it towards Battle off Cape Engano

[solid mango]

Found the exact image in NHHC, it do be indeed Ise.

Battle off Cape Engano, October 25, 1944. Direct bomb hit on the Japanese battleship Ise during air attack by AG-15 from USS Essex (CV-9).

[eternal veldt]

Allied warships of Bombarding Force 'C', which supported the landings in the Omaha Beach area on June 6, 1944.

The column is led by USS Texas BB-35 (left) with HMS Glasgow C21, USS Arkansas BB-33, George Leygues and Montcalm following.

[molten karma]

hello, does anyone have any book recs on German destroyers?

[alpine onyx]

Do you speak German? If so, Gerhard Koop's book on German destroyers 1935-1945

[molten karma]

I don't unfortunately

[eternal veldt]

I'm sure Koop's book is in English

[molten karma]

oh okay it's the one I was looking at then

[eternal veldt]

quite incredible

[molten karma]

the hardcover edition isn't that expensive, that's nice

thank you

[spring briar]

German DD’s

Good to see the bottom of the naval food chain is getting some love

[dapper parcel]

You'd be hard pressed to recall off memory what they're even doing during wartime

[molten karma]

I'm just slowly compiling a list of all the books to buy when I actually have a stable source of income that isn't allowance

[manic latch]

Rich

Show me the best 406mm shell for to be used against Montana/Iowa

[spring briar]

Smol shell

[spring briar]

Honestly, some sort of high capacity HE shell until you get to ~15k yards

And then a good APC shell

[manic latch]

[spring briar]

But in terms of an all in one shell

Eh

French 431 mm

[brave elbow]

Texas raiders b-17 before it crashed last year sadly

[alpine onyx]

I haven't yet read the English versions, or could even confirm that their contents are the same

So I stick to the hardcover book I have

[alpine onyx]

Depends on what you count as a destroyer, but if you include the 1923s and 1924s (which per the terms of the Treaty of Versailles were destroyers) you do get a bunch of ships that were doing mine warfare and escort duties almost non stop and that would eventually succumb to the meat grinder that was the German surface fleet post October 1943

If the Ftbs 1937 and 1939 join the list... whelp, same story, but with a lot more bloodshedding

[spring briar]

I think it’s also a case of so many of them sinking before really having the chance to even report whatever they were doing

Also let’s be honest the type 23’s being called destroyers really isn’t as ludicrous as it sounds once you actually look into their specs

[alpine onyx]

Last 1923s were sunk shortly after DDay, after they made attack runs on the landing forces and the Allies decided to bomb them and the entire harbor into oblivion

[spring briar]

[alpine onyx]

It isn't entirely ludicrous to call them destroyers, but when they are by treaty locked to 800 tons (realistically were 900 tons, but who'll blame them?) they are basically 80% of a FlushDecker

[spring briar]

6 torp tubes

Ok, only 3 guns

But really a 105 isn’t gonna increase displacement that much

They actually got lighter with the type 35’s

Iirc

[alpine onyx]

The Type 1935s sacrificed two of the guns

But I did mean that literally when I said 80% of a Flush Decker

[ivory ridge]

[spring briar]

Call the type 23’s type 26’s as well

[alpine onyx]

But regardless, the 1923s are precious

[spring briar]

More precious than those actual DD’s for sure

[alpine onyx]

The situation they were thrown into was not solvable, but the ships are not to blame for that

[spring briar]

Not the Möwe’s atleast

[alpine onyx]

Raubvogel and Raubtier class are cute

[spring briar]

Every time I hear a “least defensive kriegsmarine enjoyer” say
“X” was armed like this in order to alleviate lack of light cruisers
I take a shot

To what extent is this actually true sirene

[alpine onyx]

Lacking primary sources stating one way or another, and only relying on secondary sources, there's a good bit of truth to that

And it going back further than just the 1936A

A bunch of SMS destroyers also got 15cm guns with a similar logic (which holds up when looking at the layout, aft focused for the expected engagement which is retreating)

[spring briar]

Is it too far fetched to say that they should’ve just made more CL’s?

[alpine onyx]

Building destroyers was cheaper, and in theory allowed more flexibility

in practice, they were barely usable as destroyers, and couldn't hope to match light cruisers even when being numerically superior

[subtle prawn]

https://twitter.com/xaviervav/status/1666073940492681217

Xavier Vavasseur (@xaviervav)

This edition promises to be EPIC... Here is a small preview... (On top of my head, drone carrier, arsenal ship with ballistic missiles, CATOBAR CVX and XLUUV)... More in our day 1 coverage. Stay tuned to @navalnewscom ...

Twitter · Jun 6, 2023, 1:25 PM

[ivory ridge]

ROKN going from nothing to an LHD plan to nothing again to a light carrier plan to nothing again to a medium carrier plan to nothing again to a full carrier in the span of less than 5 years

how long before we are back to nothing?

[spring briar]

Do not think of this, think of her instead:

[manic latch]

wait for it

[shrewd pecan]

if I was in the cyberpunk universe that stupid Arasaka carrier is getting the Arasaka tower treatment

https://tenor.com/view/cyberpunk2077-keanu-we-have-a-city-to-burn-handsome-shades-off-gif-16336796

[runic prairie]

The late 1920s called, they want their multi-level carriers back.

[dusty kraken]

goddamnit Japan not again

should've made a cyberpunk Fuso tower instead

[alpine onyx]

Error 404, brain stuck thinking of Karlsruhe

[spring briar]

it's kind of funny tho

the K class

Karlsruhe is basically normal, while her sisters are starved, sleep deprived crackheads

[unborn wyvern]

Brad

[tough quail]

thats the secret part

its always actually nothing

[ivory ridge]

[subtle prawn]

https://twitter.com/NavalInstitute/status/1666129421445607432

U.S. Naval Institute (@NavalInstitute)

#OTD in 1944, the invasion of Normandy began. Because of the variety of aircraft involved, Allied planes were painted with "invasion stripes" to help distinguish friend from foe. For the 50th anniversary in 1994, A-6E Intruders from VA-34 were painted with stripes as a tribute.

Likes

256

Twitter · Jun 6, 2023, 5:06 PM

[runic prairie]

https://youtu.be/NNVA6tl4Im4

[minor wadi]

What carrier is this?

[manic latch]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_aircraft_carrier_Ryūjō

Not a good carrier but

I always find her cute

[minor wadi]

I see

Ryujo

[remote monolith]

@royal quail @cyan thorn @desert agate https://phys.org/news/2023-05-archaeologists-moluccan-boats-australia-indonesia.html

[royal quail]

[primal wave]

okay, i was told to come here:

what makes a Destroyer a DD, versus and CL and a CA, historically?

Why can't a destroyer have heavy armor?
or why can a heavy cruiser have "light" armor?

[dapper parcel]

The distinction between Light Cruiser and Heavy Cruiser was created as a result of 1936 London Naval Treaty. To quote the relevant passage:

Cruisers
Surface vessels of war, other than capital ships or aircraft carriers, the standard displacement of which exceeds 1,850 tons (1,880 metric tons), or with a gun above 5.1 inch (130 mm) calibre.

The cruiser category is divided into two sub-categories, as follows:

• Cruisers carrying a gun above 6.1 inch (155 mm) calibre;
• Cruisers carrying a gun not above 6.1 inch (155 mm) calibre.

The first category becomes what subsequently known as Heavy Cruisers
The second category becomes what subsequently known as Light Cruisers

Therefore, the distinction between the two classes were only determined by main gun caliber and does not have anything to do with whether they're actually heavy or light by displacement, or how heavy or light their armor scheme are

As for destroyers

Destroyers
Surface vessels of war the standard displacement of which does not exceed 1,850 tons (1,880 metric tons), and with a gun not above 5.1 inch (130 mm) calibre.

[spiral cedar]

Cruisers are generally designed to have the range and seakeeping for independent operations, unlike destroyers, which (early-mid 20th century tech era in which AL is set) generally are much more limited in these respects and aren’t meant for long-term independent operations. As they sacrifice fuel capacity and creature comforts for lower cost and higher speeds, destroyers are much more dependent on being part of a full fleet (or at least a squadron), whereas cruisers can perform patrols and other independent operations for extended periods with or without a supporting fleet.

As for the CA/CL distinction, it has to be understood that the distinction between them is a legal one—the London Naval Treaty took what is fundamentally one category of ship and split it into two types based solely off gun caliber. Thus a CA or CL could have any amount of armor with no restrictions—only the gun caliber matters.

[wet geode]

One of my most favorite historical photos of all time

[desert agate]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5baPdQHbCkA&ab_channel=TheAustralianArmour%26ArtilleryMuseum

[charred coral]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ovu6HaQXvZ8

[runic prairie]

As others have mentioned CA/CL has only to do with armament. Indeed, some CLs have more armor than some CAs.

Other than the various treaty restrictions that defined these and Destroyers, the doctrinal role is important.

Each type takes on a number of roles. Probably one of the more significant differences is that destroyers have a significant focus on ASW while this is normally not the case with cruisers (looking at you Soviet Union).

In the U.S. this was the trend up through the Spruances with minor deviations. The Flight I Burke was the first that really abandoned the heavy ASW role though this was thankfully corrected.

Cruisers are marked by having flag facilities, ie: they can command task forces or lead a Battlegroup in a role like having an anti-aircraft coordinator and associated staff onboard.

The Cruiser in the USN has evolved really to a dedicated Anti-Aircraft Carrier escort like the Atlanta, Juneau, or Worcester classes. Ticos typically have a heavy load of SAMs while Burkes typically have more Tomahawks though this varies.

[manic latch]

USSR was also unique on their own classes

For example

Heavy cruisers were Kronshtadt, despite their size
Light cruisers were Kirov, despite having 180mm

So it usually goes by "realitivity"

Stalingrad was a heavy cruiser, then what would Soviets call the new Project 66 design with 9 220mm? Medium cruiser

Because she is smaller than Heavy Stalingrad

Heavy armed CLs and Heavy armed destroyer leaders usually makes the hardest confusion

[manic latch]

[fierce sparrow]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P0BkPwY6_18

[runic prairie]

Ah the 50s USN approach of wanting to put Polaris missiles on anything that floated.

[runic prairie]

I was more referring to some of the mid to late Cold War designs which are just… yeah.

Basically everything the Soviets built was tailored for either hunting carriers or ASW to defend the SSBN bastions.

[runic prairie]

Kinda like some of the Conventional Prompt Strike concepts.

[manic latch]

Cool

[subtle prawn]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UvroLTbhJ50

[subtle prawn]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uombw9WOIXM

[shrewd pecan]

british tendancies of being crippling broke

[subtle prawn]

On 7 February he chaired a meeting of the MOD’s Admiralty Board and explained that CVA-01 would not be built, partially on financial grounds and partially on what he mistakenly described as operational grounds. He put forward his personal view that that carriers had been useful for the operational tasks that had arisen during the previous decade, but had not been essential. This gross distortion of fact ignored the essential role played by RN carrier-borne aircraft in Korea, Suez, Jordan/Lebanon, the Kuwait Crisis and the critical role being played by the strike fleet in the Confrontation against Indonesia. As if this was not bad enough he ended by saying that he found it difficult to devise a scenario in which the carrier was essential but among the plethora of studies that he had ordered there was one. One paper had specifically noted that shore-based air cover could not be provided for the defence of the Falkland Islands but, with his customary lack of comprehension, Healey had rejected it. On 14 February 1966 the Cabinet formally decided to terminate the project to build CVA-01 and endorsed the MOD recommendation to procure fifty-six F-111A strike aircraft.

Even the Statement on the 1966 Defence Review was ineptly handled and badly edited. Part 1, the Defence Review, stated that ‘experience and study have shown that only one type of operation exists for which carriers and carrier-borne aircraft would be indispensable: that is the landing, or withdrawal, of troops against sophisticated opposition outside the range of land-based air cover. It is only realistic to recognise that we, unaided by our allies, could not expect to undertake operations of this character in the 1970s – even if we could afford a larger carrier force.’ I will refer back to this pusillanimous statement in a later chapter. Part II, on the other hand, stated under the heading Royal Navy General Purpose Combat Forces that ‘the aircraft carrier is the most important element of the Fleet for offensive action against an enemy at sea or ashore and makes a large contribution to the defence of seaborne forces. It can also play an important part in operations where local air superiority has to be gained and maintained and offensive support of ground forces is required.’ The two contradictory statements are hardly the outcome of a rational review and reflect little credit on the expanded MOD in its first full year of operation. The latter statement was probably written before 14 February and reflects the Navy’s whole argument which was couched in tones that were reasonable and which never made extravagant claims based on untested theories. The Cabinet’s decision to cancel CVA-01 was based on a growing financial crisis that eventually led to the pound being devalued. Advised that land-based aircraft could fulfil the national requirement, Ministers, who should have known better, accepted the RAF proposals at their unproven face value, thinking them to be a cheaper but viable alternative. Their successors subsequently found the flaws in the RAF concept when British forces did have to carry out an opposed landing, without allies and outside the range of land-based aircraft in 1982.

[desert agate]

QE cats soon

its cheaper than you think™️

see

thats what you think

but QE actually has the facilities to install cats

no but like

actual fittings

connection points

so they kinda did go with cats

just as a

fitted for but not with preference

will be an unusual mix of STOBAR and CATOBAR but will improve overall capability

theyve been making some reasonable decisions of late

so who knows

especially since the existing fittings will make it much cheaper

you might yet get type 83

dont give up hope

83 wouldnt be 1 for 1 because of the sheer size and capability expected of the 80 series platforms

[ivory ridge]

I hate numbered class names i hate numbered class names

[desert agate]

83 needs to have the same ASW capability of the type 26s and the same AAW capability of the type 45s
or whatever the equivalent is at the time

[spring briar]

[ivory ridge]

[desert agate]

83s will probably be bigger than a Burke

[manic latch]

British Type 55

[ivory ridge]

Most of the new designs are bigger than the burkes it shouldnt be weird

Mk41 gym

[desert agate]

They're being refit for more mk41s in the near future afaik

[desert agate]

Should bring them up to around 70ish missiles

It's an ASW frigate primarily

Albeit a fat one

[ivory ridge]

Me still waiting for more information on the italian DDX

[desert agate]

It needs to fit a full sized ASW set with sonar and weapons, and a full load out of VLS

Minimum 12'000t

[manic latch]

Small but

Cute

Actually

Isn't this 10k tons

[ivory ridge]

Over 10k yes

[manic latch]

Feels small