history

[ivory ridge]

give an example that doesnt include lying under oath, grifting for money or literally assaulting the white house

[strong plank]

congress, not white house

[manic latch]

Gigachad

[strong plank]

but same idea

[tough quail]

holy shit are we doing trump takes now

[ivory ridge]

whoops

[shut wren]

uhh

[ivory ridge]

yeah mb

[shut wren]

pew pew violence

[frigid karma]

oh hi silver

walked in on a fine time

[eternal veldt]

What a nice day to peek in here

[stone sorrel]

trump didn't start any new wars but yes he was a horrible president

[shut wren]

bozo getting arrested

[frigid karma]

cool, now

[tough quail]

stares at iran

[frigid karma]

shut the fuck

[eternal veldt]

And politics and modern events, stunning

[tough quail]

we gave it a shot

[frigid karma]

up about him

[manic latch]

This is why I need a good steak

[maiden citrus]

coming right up

[manic latch]

tho steak prices getting higher on world

[maiden citrus]

you think that will stop me

[manic latch]

[strong plank]

man that reminds me

[stone sorrel]

putin price hike lol

[eternal veldt]

I see Maka's...got beef with you.

[manic latch]

Nom

[strong plank]

I had what was probably the best hotdog I can remember about an hour ago

[maiden citrus]

oh? where from?

[stone sorrel]

new york has decent hot dogs

[strong plank]

dining hall

[eternal veldt]

I saw someone put banana, honey, all shoved in a hotdog bread earlier.

[strong plank]

well it was less about the hotdog itself

and more

[manic latch]

Let me be frank, don't start beef with The Frank
Who hangs with B. Franks, giving ladies beef franks

[shut wren]

the hotdog truck outside hospitals are the best

[shut wren]

History rap battle reference

[maiden citrus]

dining hall where

[stone sorrel]

especially when you have your blood taken and need protein

[maiden citrus]

I'm a connoisseur

[shut wren]

nah I do stupid shit and get sent to the ER

[strong plank]

it was less the hotdog itself and more I'd been awake since 5:30am and had only eaten a breakfast wrap the whole day

and it was now 7:30 pm

[shrewd pecan]

what has the chat devolved into now?

[stone sorrel]

don't die, also hot dog is peak american cuisine

[maiden citrus]

actually correct, would swing by the large hot dog place outside the hospital when my mom was done and treat us both to hot dogs and ice cream

[tough quail]

we've moved on to food

please do not bring up the prior topics

[maiden citrus]

I used my super power to make it hot dog related

[strong plank]

what driving for 11 hours does to a mf

[shrewd pecan]

eh the Z should tell me enough

[tough quail]

please

do not

[shrewd pecan]

ok have fun

[strong plank]

and I didn't even get a pic of Indiana's anchor

[delicate beacon]

Maka where can I learn this power

[tough quail]

bring up the prior topics

[strong plank]

big sad

[tough quail]

its my birthday and i prefer not having my brain lacerated

[maiden citrus]

repetition, hard work and sampling

[frigid karma]

@eternal veldt i know you meant here is the ww2 one but

[eternal veldt]

Start talking about stroopwaffel

[frigid karma]

yeah

[delicate beacon]

280mm

[maiden citrus]

oh happy birthday friendo you should've told me

[shut wren]

Turns out slamming into a metal sign on a bike at 12 mph is not good

[shrewd pecan]

happy birthday

[tough quail]

yeah i meant to mention it on the other server but ive been busy

ty ty friends

[shut wren]

Damn nice fr fr

[stone sorrel]

[maiden citrus]

best part is that super good hot dog place is ww2 themed

[shrewd pecan]

https://tenor.com/view/ronald-gif-21619958

[shut wren]

Happy birthday

[delicate beacon]

More of a fan of Dutch Shortcake

[maiden citrus]

army though not navy

[strong plank]

oh yeah so there's a sports stadium in Indiana I drove by

[maiden citrus]

ah indiana

haven't been there in a while

[delicate beacon]

12mph? Why so slow

[eternal veldt]

Why the fuck are you digging that up now?

[strong plank]

I was there for a fencing event

that was

an experience

[shut wren]

Wasn’t steep enough for 20 mph

[strong plank]

arrive in Fort Wayne after 11 hours on the road and half the city has no power

[tough quail]

qwerty has this strange habit of like

[delicate beacon]

I go 20 on flat terrain.

[tough quail]

time traveling at random

[shut wren]

E bike moment

[maiden citrus]

I tend to go 16-20 on flat terrain too

[frigid karma]

i scroll fast

[strong plank]

oh I did see a surprising number of international fencers

[eternal veldt]

No, Im more worried why we has an exact time stamp on that very message

[shut wren]

This was when I was 8 don’t ask

[eternal veldt]

And why he somehow documented it

[maiden citrus]

I also use my recoilless rifle as neccesary

[strong plank]

I say surprising bc it's a college fencing championship so you wouldn't expect foreign fencers

[frigid karma]

discord has timestamps for everything now

[strong plank]

there was a romanian there

[frigid karma]

is this it?

[shut wren]

[strong plank]

a chinese and a taiwanese fencer too

[maiden citrus]

close

also dang now I'm hungry

[strong plank]

and a south korean guy who I beat 5-0

[manic latch]

Yoooo happy birthday

[maiden citrus]

luckily I have some haagen daz in the fridge

[shut wren]

Cheap stop and shop ice cream sandwiches the best

[eternal veldt]

Would be nice to actually have good food

Unfortunately my body tells me to be sick

[maiden citrus]

I will cook for you friend

[eternal veldt]

[delicate beacon]

Get well soon

[maiden citrus]

you stay in bed and get better

[eternal veldt]

Stay in bed? Good joke. Back to the gulag.

[frigid karma]

stay safe

[maiden citrus]

do have quite the experience to them

[frigid karma]

but feel free to sneeze at any particularly annoying child

[maiden citrus]

I remember a small shop that opened up near here a while ago that was run by two immigrants and they were ice cream makers, would make it right in front of you by hand

[frigid karma]

turkish ice cream?

[maiden citrus]

it wasn't particularly good

but it was very interesting

[shut wren]

The other day some dumbass nearly drove his car off the roof of stop and shop

[maiden citrus]

probably, it's been years so I can't quite remember

[strong plank]

dunno how hot a take this is

frozen custard > normal ice cream

[maiden citrus]

that's not a hot take

that's correct

[frigid karma]

i've never had frozen custard

looks good though

[shut wren]

No idea what that is

[frigid karma]

couldn't tell it apart from ice cream

[delicate beacon]

Huh I dont remember this one

[maiden citrus]

custard is mixed better and has no ice crystals

superior taste

[maiden citrus]

visually it can be a little hard to, so that's fair

custard is ussually very smooth looking due to mentioned ice crystals not being present

[tough quail]

very cold you're talking about frozen desserts dumbass

smh

[shut wren]

[tough quail]

hot takes are for hot dogs

its in the name

[cinder escarp]

The superior answer is of course, Dippin' Dots.

[tough quail]

oh no sarc dont scroll up

[maiden citrus]

custard uses egg yolks as an ingredient too to help with making it

dippin dots are mid as all get out

[shut wren]

It turns out Rae egg yolks don’t taste good

[maiden citrus]

if they were twice the size it would do the food a lot of favors

they don't each individually carry enough flavor for their size

[cinder escarp]

I do my best to not verge too far off of topic.

[maiden citrus]

custard also takes way longer than ice cream to make, but it is essentially super ice cream, so that was not a hot take at all

[frigid karma]

custard's last stand

[maiden citrus]

ice cream can be almost, or even more than, half ice crystals, while good custard can be less than one fourth ice

[shut wren]

[maiden citrus]

it results in an ice cream that looks somewhat like, and feels like, pudding, just with the powerful taste and cool temp of ice cream, it's super smooth, and does not freezer burn

[stone sorrel]

are there varieties in flavour of frozen custard

[shut wren]

Since when did this become #icrcresmhidtory

[maiden citrus]

ice cream history

lol

[stone sorrel]

why not

[maiden citrus]

yup, you can make it with a lot of flavors just like ice cream

[shut wren]

[stone sorrel]

[maiden citrus]

it's mostly ingredients at the base stage (egg yolk) and type of cooking and tolerances that produce it

[ivory ridge]

for a moment i forgot you're a fencer

and thought

you were talking about the plane

[shut wren]

Gib pic of plane

[ivory ridge]

the su-24

[manic latch]

Soviet F-111

[tough quail]

tandem gang rise up

[shut wren]

I hate my life

[shrewd pecan]

https://twitter.com/I_Corps/status/1642955839832207360?s=20

I Corps (@I_Corps)

Need more #motivation, today?

How about this footage of Bravo Battery, 1st Battalion, 94th Field Artillery Regiment showcasing the quick-strike capability of the #HIMARS during #JPMRC in #Alaska?💥

#JPMRC2302 #MotivationMonday #ArcticTough

▶ Play video

Twitter · Apr 3, 2023, 6:22 PM

[shut wren]

Have a tortument apr22

[maiden citrus]

as for some history about it, napoleon's favorite food was custard, though custard as an ice cream shares its cooking type (egg and slow stirring) with many other foods, going all the way back to ancient rome

for custard ice cream, it evokes a familiar name, coney (the same mostly accepted origin of the hot dog), as it was first made there (coney island sure does like to make good foods)

[shut wren]

NY gang rise up

[maiden citrus]

the french in particular enjoyed custard style foods, because they are cool

[shut wren]

Baguettes

[manic latch]

[shrewd pecan]

I both hate and somewhat admire that thing

[manic latch]

I think it's the most expensive MBT design

[maiden citrus]

wedge

[tough quail]

das uber wedge

[shut wren]

who comes up for the NATO nicknames for shit

[shrewd pecan]

👁️ its turret makes me wish they slapped a unslanted version on a different tank

[shut wren]

like Mig-15

[manic latch]

English Dictionary

[shrewd pecan]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_Force_Interoperability_Council

[cinder escarp]

I've never actually figured out the exact process, they must have a list they chose from.

[shut wren]

[cinder escarp]

I know the rules of it

[manic latch]

They can't pick a too good names tho I think

[cinder escarp]

But the exact contents of the list are a mystery

[shut wren]

slight question

[tough quail]

lately it's definitely just picking what sounds cool

felon

skyfall

[shut wren]

how do plane numbering n shit work for the PLAAF

[manic latch]

Like you can't use "Beauty" for bomber. Since it's too "good". So you choose like Bear

[shut wren]

one day we gonna get "bozo"

[manic latch]

Booze

Brother would be cool but also unlikely

[shut wren]

[shrewd pecan]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NATO_reporting_name also the wiki article sums it up pretty decently

[tough quail]

killjoy for kinzhals is also really funny

aw man they intercepted our thing this is bullshit

[ivory ridge]

i wonder if anyone tried adding the su-75 to that list

👁️

[shrewd pecan]

Frank & Fred

[cinder escarp]

Felon fits the rules though

F for fighter, two syllables for jet

(props are single syllable)

[tough quail]

did the su-75 get a reporting name?

[shrewd pecan]

I hope to god the checkmate gets a NATO callsign

[ivory ridge]

no

but there is the meme one

[shrewd pecan]

so we finally have something else to call it other than checkmate

[cinder escarp]

Hence single syllable Bear for Tu-95 as a propwagon, but two-syllable blackjack for Tu-160.

[shut wren]

Do nato have call signs for chinese aircraft or nah

[shrewd pecan]

yes they do

[tough quail]

huh

[cinder escarp]

They do, but they're not all known.

[tough quail]

i didnt know the syllable rules

[frigid karma]

Probably?

[manic latch]

I think you need to fly to get a name. Like Yak 141 got it with Freestyle

[ivory ridge]

the su-27 derivatives are just flanker

[tough quail]

oh yeah thats probably it

[tough quail]

freestyle is also pretty good

[cinder escarp]

J-10 is firebird

oddly enough

[manic latch]

Was Yak-38 forge

Ah Forger

[shut wren]

is J-15 Flying shark

[shrewd pecan]

odd J-20 doesn't have a public one

[shut wren]

or nah

[ivory ridge]

su-27 derivative

[shrewd pecan]

J-15 is just flanker

[stone sorrel]

isn't firebird just a pheonix

[shut wren]

[frigid karma]

Fun fact

[shrewd pecan]

its NATO callsign is firebird

[frigid karma]

Going by Al lore

[manic latch]

Fright would be cool

[frigid karma]

P-38 and F-35 are the same person

[frigid karma]

As both are lightning

[cinder escarp]

They don't make the designations public until they get listed at some point in a document.

[frigid karma]

F35 is even called lightning II

[ivory ridge]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/372267338663198720/1091061460643364986/1034723981825159228-1.gif

[tough quail]

thats

irl lore

[frigid karma]

So they are canonically the same person thank you for coming to my Ted talk

[cinder escarp]

There most certainly is a callsign for J-20

[stone sorrel]

lightning and lightning 2 which opens a lot of posibilities

[stone sorrel]

mighty dragon or something

[manic latch]

Black Widow II

[frigid karma]

This also means the p47 is the same waifu as the a10

Jesus

[shrewd pecan]

its ok the YF-23 had the faulty weapons bay anyways

[frigid karma]

[stone sorrel]

that think has the giga chad chin

[cinder escarp]

Much lesser known bit of lore: F-22 was originally given lightning II as the name

[stone sorrel]

wish it won over fat amy

[cinder escarp]

Before HQ/USAF overruled lockmart to have a "bird of prey" name.

[shrewd pecan]

YF-23 had numerous issues with its bomb bay, worse flight performance over the F-22 and other issues

that made the F-22 the obvious choice

[manic latch]

[stone sorrel]

as long as it looks good

[cinder escarp]

They've actually ran out of letters by the way - J-15 is Flanker-X2

[tough quail]

F-22 being "lightning 2" would be really weird

[manic latch]

Both 22 and 23 looks good. Boeing F-35 was puke worthy

[tough quail]

given it's about as potent at air to ground as a drop bear

[shut wren]

which bozo names it

[shrewd pecan]

it can still drop JDAMs and SBDs

[tough quail]

i didn't stutter

[stone sorrel]

true if they made it look less compact maybe it would have looked better

[shut wren]

It can drop SBD-3 dive bombers?

[tough quail]

yes

[frigid karma]

Yep

[shrewd pecan]

in your imagination it can

[stone sorrel]

flatter planes look better than rounder planes

[frigid karma]

It’s an aircraft carrier

[cinder escarp]

I'm not sure how it could be said that YF-23 had bomb bay issues... when the YF-23 didn't have functional payload bays. It was built purely as a demonstrator to validate modeling, unlike the near-production YF-22.

[tough quail]

it works like those weird soviet parasite fighters

[shrewd pecan]

I'd have to find the reports but I recall the weapons bay design having issues

[stone sorrel]

F15 still the best looking US jet though

[shut wren]

nah

F-16

[manic latch]

I miss the first proposal of F-22

[manic latch]

Tfw lost 2 missiles

[shrewd pecan]

its ok we can rebuild him

[manic latch]

[shut wren]

it looks more KSP the more you go right

[shrewd pecan]

anything beyond FB-22-2 is a mistake

[shut wren]

mfs having it look like star wars

[stone sorrel]

its evolving but backwards

[stone sorrel]

the NGAD looks like it is going through the F 22 process as well

[shrewd pecan]

ace combat probably has the best representation of the FB-22 in terms of what it may of looked like

[shut wren]

what if

F-16 with replaceble air intake

cuz why not

[stone sorrel]

have I ever posted the F 22 video that I took at an air show?

never mind file too big

[shrewd pecan]

getting some interesting results on google images

yeah I don't think that's how that works pal

[manic latch]

I got Brainfart from this

[shut wren]

what the fuc-

but thanks i guess

would help

[stone sorrel]

wtf

[shut wren]

scrape some of the stealth paint and slap it on the J-20

[shrewd pecan]

🤨 I don't think 40 year old RCS paint is gonna do you too well

[shut wren]

Maybe its better than the ones we currently have

no idea

[shrewd pecan]

man if the PLAAF hasn't advanced passed F-117 grade stealth tech then what the fuck have they been doing

[stone sorrel]

the air force is the youngest child

they get what they want

[shut wren]

fucking around with making the J-15T,then looking for replacement of said J-15

[stone sorrel]

although I think the navy gets the most money

because boats expensive

[shrewd pecan]

we grow closer to this every day

[shut wren]

PLAGF should get more

[manic latch]

True

[stone sorrel]

oldest child gets nothing

[shut wren]

we need more 99As

[BLEEEEEEEEP]

[shrewd pecan]

🤨

[stone sorrel]

honestly just have the KMT get elected

and talk it out like ma ying jeou said

[shut wren]

stop dreaming,you traitor

[stone sorrel]

lmao

[shut wren]

im having you shot for treason

[stone sorrel]

as long as DPP does not get elected again

everything will be good

[shut wren]

bruh

[stone sorrel]

DPP is the most cringe party they were literally founded by a Japanese larper

[shut wren]

oh boy

aint all the highest officals all have one japanese parent because of

uhh

R word

[stone sorrel]

think tsai ying wen's grand father was Japanese

[shut wren]

yep

[stone sorrel]

which makes too much sense if you think bout it

[shut wren]

we should prob stop before the mods shut us down

[shrewd pecan]

🤨 perhaps

[shut wren]

^ what he said

new topic uhh

lets talking about

umm

pew pew

guns n shit

[stone sorrel]

history would be a cooler place if more people knew ancient history and not the recent stuff

who are the top ten hottest female historical figures

[shut wren]

uhh

cleotpateria

fuck

cant spell

[stone sorrel]

maybe young catherine the great

[shut wren]

that last empress of ejpyt bitch

FUCK

I CANT SPELL

[stone sorrel]

or josephine Napoleon's wife

[shut wren]

i see

I cant spell for shit

[stone sorrel]

definitely not the british monarchs

[shut wren]

if theres timespan I would like to live in from the pass

it would be anchient china or 50000 years ago

[shrewd pecan]

what a engaging conversation, have tank instead

[stone sorrel]

bruh

[manic latch]

Autoloader Abrams

Finally based

[shut wren]

so

[shut wren]

they just fucking removed the buff guys

im thinking what if

[shut wren]

the PLAGF removes the auto loader

and put buff chinese dudes

with blowout panels instead

[stone sorrel]

short tank operators are better than tall tank operators

[shrewd pecan]

turret room issues, finding suitable amounts of tankers up to standards

so on and so on

[shut wren]

bruh

[stone sorrel]

get short dudes

[shut wren]

theres like 1.4 billion people

also all a bunch of chinese homies are short

other than me kinda

[shrewd pecan]

being short doesn't qualify you for being a tanker

[shut wren]

get people who do

[stone sorrel]

it is a good start

more room in the tank if you are short

[shut wren]

I mean

[shrewd pecan]

that's not gonna solve the fact you'd have to rework the type 99s turret to allow for a suitable bustle rack

[shut wren]

it reduces the chance of turning to ground beef when hit

fuck the 99

[shrewd pecan]

also you can just do a bustle rack autoloader instead

[shut wren]

get something else

[shrewd pecan]

also people tend to forget how physically demanding of a job being a tanker can be

[shut wren]

true true

but if you sign up

[shrewd pecan]

and how height isn't actually that great of a limiter on someone's ability to be a tanker

[shut wren]

you're expecting that shit

[manic latch]

Conscription is the problem part

[shut wren]

we dont conscript

[manic latch]

Easy when there is no war

[shut wren]

still easy cuz we have a huge population base

[stone sorrel]

PLA is 100 percent volunteer army

[manic latch]

Like from what I know. US is suffering badly from getting people into military. And might be the reason they are looking at manless turret Abrams

[shut wren]

^

[stone sorrel]

since it is almost a tradition at this point

[shut wren]

yep

[manic latch]

With 3 crew instead 4. You get 1 more crew for every 3 tank

[shut wren]

what

you get a extra tank from ever 3

stoopid

[shrewd pecan]

I don't think abrams X is gonna end up getting adopted for a few reasons

[manic latch]

3 tank of 4 crew= 12 guy
3 tank of 3 crew= 9 guy

There 3 extra

[shut wren]

yes so you can crew a extra tank

[shrewd pecan]

beyond that the Chinese are suffering their own issues with lowering recruitment standards, worsening demographic so on and so on

[manic latch]

True

Asia is at worst demographic

[shut wren]

we needa start clapping more cheeks

[shrewd pecan]

also why would you go with a manual loader

over a bustle rack loader

[stone sorrel]

fix the issue wit drone swarm

[shut wren]

Cuz

[stone sorrel]

with

[shrewd pecan]

you still need to maintain and have someone to operate said drones

[shut wren]

https://tenor.com/view/madagscar-penguins-kaboom-gif-9833865

[shut wren]

Get the war thunder mfs

[shrewd pecan]

bustle rack autoloaders can have blowout panels???

[manic latch]

Like Type 10

Or Leclerc

[shut wren]

so like

the current 99As cant?

[shrewd pecan]

the reason why the type 99 and T-72s can't

[manic latch]

They are not bustle

They are carousel

[shut wren]

oh

[shrewd pecan]

is because the carousel is right underneath the turret

[shut wren]

oh ok

so

new tank time?

[manic latch]

Yes

But need to mass produce

[shrewd pecan]

its why this keeps happening

[shut wren]

yep

[manic latch]

Ammo in hull means turret will fly ye

[shrewd pecan]

since tank turrets are primarily held down by gravity

[shut wren]

welp

time to scrap the 1200 type 99As

[manic latch]

Warship style. Unless having locks

[shrewd pecan]

also its not really like

[shut wren]

NEW TANKS,PEOPLE

[shrewd pecan]

China's tank fleet really matters in the grand scheme of things

[shut wren]

true true

[shrewd pecan]

all of China's neighbors are operating similar tanks

and the type 99As wouldn't see too much action in a SCS or a Taiwan fight

[shut wren]

Taiwan abrams when

[shrewd pecan]

they already got their first 4

[shut wren]

Unless later stages when the beachhead is stable and they can ship some?

or like they capture a airfield and fly em over

[shrewd pecan]

man I don't even think US forces Pacific or the CHinese navy would even exist after a Taiwan or SCS fight

[manic latch]

If China air force can't deal with Taiwan army units then it would be pretty bad

[shut wren]

get the Y-20 and yeet it out

[shrewd pecan]

due to the pure amount of cruise missiles and ballistic missiles both sides would be flinging

[shut wren]

lets hope somebody doesnt press the big red button

[shrewd pecan]

it would be untold death and destruction for both sides

[shut wren]

more for China cuz

population density

all the mfs are on the coast

[shrewd pecan]

I'm not talking about nukes

I'm talking pure conventional

[shut wren]

oh

yea true

[shrewd pecan]

since the Chinese have the ability to basically knock out almost all US bases in Japan and else where in the first island chain

and the US has the ability to counter strike with its fleet and bombers

[shut wren]

it seems and sounds like a very bad idea

[manic latch]

Tho rule about tank turrets are as long as you have enough explosives pushing under with enough force, turret will always fly

[shut wren]

Abrooms

[shrewd pecan]

wonder if the Iraqi crew survived like the American one did

[shut wren]

nah cuz they aint fat

[shrewd pecan]

IED powerful enough to force the turret off

tho everyone lived

[manic latch]

Mines overpowered

[shrewd pecan]

I think the tank also returned to service later

[shut wren]

how the fuc-

[manic latch]

They bothered fixing this?

[shrewd pecan]

just send it to the factory for a rebuild

[shut wren]

america wasting more tax dollars

[shrewd pecan]

still a perfectly good tank

[shut wren]

true

so you know how T-72 goes kaboom

can we drag it to a factory for rebuild

[manic latch]

Can M88 carry whole Abrams?

Or just turret and hull

[shrewd pecan]

I don't think it can carry the entire vehicle

[shrewd pecan]

depends on a lot of factors

again the IED explosion I referenced was powerful but didn't do much beyond putting the tank into two pieces

[manic latch]

Maus style

She was fixed by Soviets since explosives just blow the turret off

Tho second hull was used

[shrewd pecan]

usually T series style ammo explosions are gonna ruin the hull

tho nothing really stops the tank from being useful to scavenge bits and pieces from for other tanks

[shut wren]

i see

[manic latch]

Likely how this thing was born

T-72B1 turret
T-72B3 hull
2 T-62 wheels while 4 T-72 wheels

[shrewd pecan]

probs

[shut wren]

nice little target there

theres a fucking white cross telling you where to shoot

[shrewd pecan]

Ukrainians have been creative when it comes to their equipment so doesn't surprise me

[shut wren]

war time measures yo

[manic latch]

Abrams has shining panels for thermals so

It's to prevent ally killing

[shut wren]

b r u h

I mean it does happen

[manic latch]

Even abrams got ally killed ye

Somehow

[shrewd pecan]

god where's the Chinese media video of the T-72 turret popping

[shut wren]

wydm

[shrewd pecan]

few Chinese journalist caught a Russian T-72 turret popping on video

and the turret just flew directly up

[shut wren]

oh

new question

what would the US do if a important piece of equipment gets captured

like say

F-22

or F-35

[shrewd pecan]

if a F-22 or F-35 is getting captured odds are its a wreck and not of much value

[shut wren]

GODDAMN

[shrewd pecan]

if a major piece equipment gets abandoned

[shut wren]

But like

intact

[shrewd pecan]

usually they just bomb it or scuttle it

[shut wren]

I see I see

[shrewd pecan]

again war is chaos so you can't always scuttle or recover abandoned equipment

[manic latch]

Isis once Captured Iraq Abrams but they recovered it

[shrewd pecan]

tho usual thing the US does is either scuttle or airstrike if it can't be recovered

[deep apex]

It went 273 meters high

[shut wren]

so

If it fails then

shit

[shrewd pecan]

idk what are you gonna do if a abandoned abrams gets charted off behind the lines by the enemy

[junior trench]

why the fuck are there so many Zisabled posters in here

[shut wren]

C u r i s e m i s s i l e

[junior trench]

the fuck happened since I was last here

[shrewd pecan]

its cancer I'm choosing not to touch on it right now

[manic latch]

https://www.militarytimes.com/news/2018/02/08/nine-abrams-tanks-fell-into-the-hands-of-iranian-backed-militias-during-anti-isis-fight/

[shrewd pecan]

also that reminds me

remove the Z, k thx

[shut wren]

whats wrong with Oreos

[junior trench]

you're not clever

[shrewd pecan]

they make you fat and are as addictive as cocaine

[manic latch]

Fucking Oreo shakes

[shut wren]

[manic latch]

Imagine drinking that

[shut wren]

Man,

cant have shit in #history

[shrewd pecan]

man I'm just gonna say this now

you know everyones attitudes here

you should know better than to start throwing the the Z markers in your name

[shut wren]

Yeah shoulda know

[shrewd pecan]

🤨 since we all know what there referring to

[manic latch]

Modern military vehicle talks is very hard to talk about without involving politics. That's why usually ww2 discussions are preferred

[shut wren]

alright so uhh

lets talking about stalingrad

[junior trench]

I mean

we also know what the O in oreos is for

[shut wren]

bruh

[junior trench]

because you're not as clever as you think, and people have memories

[shut wren]

cant even have oreos in #history

[shrewd pecan]

🤨

[manic latch]

HAVE A BRAIN

Ahem

[shut wren]

LET ME HAVE OREOS IN PEACE

[manic latch]

Yeah I agree Stalingrad was a sexy designed cruiser

[shut wren]

mf

I mean the battle

not the boat

[manic latch]

Yo tato

Why M1 TTB had carousel

Space saving?

[shrewd pecan]

it was a test bed meant to have a low profile crewless turret

[manic latch]

Can't have that with bustle?

[shrewd pecan]

would of likely enlarged the turret by a large degree

combined with the desire of testing different types of autoloaders is my main guess

[manic latch]

[junior trench]

unmanned low profile turret where the gunhouse is thinner than the diameter of the turret ring

[shut wren]

hmm

[junior trench]

means you could have blowout panels to each side of the gunhouse but within the diameter of the turret ring and rotating structure

[shut wren]

what if

tankless tank

you get 100% less tank with each tank

[junior trench]

as well as using the existing hull blow out panel mirrored to both sides

[shrewd pecan]

in terms of blowout panels for a test bed I don't think they would of been really worth it

[junior trench]

sure

but there's room for them

even with a carousel

which is amusing

[shrewd pecan]

thinking about it

why haven't more people tried the M8 AGS's style of autoloader

AGS does have blowout panels

[subtle prawn]

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/KSRcTP98t1U

[desert agate]

oh the resident fuckwit is being a fuckwit again

hey dipshit go be a fascist somewhere else no one else wants you here

[strong plank]

<------ suboptimal

[humble mulch]

@shut wren @stone sorrel Please refrain from political nicknames and trying to start/allude to politically driven conversations

[fierce sparrow]

[desert agate]

https://twitter.com/DefenceAust/status/1642995429154381830?s=20
https://twitter.com/DefenceAust/status/1642995448490196993?s=20
https://twitter.com/DefenceAust/status/1642995470644436994?s=20

Defence Australia (@DefenceAust)

Well equipped ship, multi-skilled crew ⚓ HMAS Choules recently conducted both helicopter flight trials and tested her Mexeflote barge system. <1/3>
📸 ABIS Rikki-Lea Phillips

Twitter · Apr 3, 2023, 9:00 PM

Defence Australia (@DefenceAust)

The trials have been part of ongoing training to facilitate the development of ship’s MH-60R Seahawk helicopter operating limits.🚁 The Mexeflote is a large landing craft, secured to the hull of Choules and used to move vehicles and stores between ship and shore. ⛴️ <2/3>

Twitter · Apr 3, 2023, 9:00 PM

Defence Australia (@DefenceAust)

Choules provides a significant capability to embark a sizeable group of people and vehicles, transport them to a destination, land them safely ashore without relying on the availability of shore infrastructure, and sustain the group for a period of time. ⛴️ <3/3>

Twitter · Apr 3, 2023, 9:00 PM

[fierce sparrow]

scrolling up and I see JS KAGA with a new form in the making..

[tough quail]

china will grow smaller

[manic latch]

Look at this beauty Horse

Has a smol fren

[tough quail]

excellent

I love he

[manic latch]

And yes she is a seaplane

[desert agate]

https://twitter.com/AWMemorial/status/1643028131291312128?s=20

Aust War Memorial (@AWMemorial)

ANZAC forces landed on Gallipoli on 25 April 1915. What had been planned as a bold stroke to knock Turkey out of the war quickly became a stalemate, dragging on for 8 months, with both sides having suffered heavy casualties. 🔗https://t.co/Vm6oE6UnlL
#AnzacDay2023 #AnzacDay

Twitter · Apr 3, 2023, 11:10 PM

[manic latch]

Impressive how Churchill's career survived from this

[desert agate]

basically only survived because he decided to blame everyone else for the problems he created

[manic latch]

Likely

I assume he wouldn't if he actually lost QE

[desert agate]

It also helped that the media fiasco surrounding the campaign didnt actually paint the campaign in a bad light for months

[glass trail]

AND the norway fiasco

[desert agate]

since the intense media censorship made it nearly impossible to get the actual story out, and it took a young Keith Murdoch and his friend Ellis Ashmede Bartlett to smuggle a letter out of the theatre and into the hands of the British Prime Minister

[manic latch]

[desert agate]

there was even more fiasco surrounding that since the British Army actually arrested Murdoch and confiscated Bartletts letter (which was personally addressed to the prime minister) forcing Murdoch to forge his own media connections in London to try and get the letter to him, instead of relying on Bartletts influence to get him to 10 Downing Street

[manic latch]

Damn

[desert agate]

and it was that letter and effort telling the truth of what was actually happening at Gallipoli that led to the decision to withdraw

it's a damn shame Keith Murdochs son used his inheritance from a great man to be the worlds biggest piece of shit but thats not a discussion for this channel

[spring briar]

Bouvet
Irresistible
Ocean

[subtle prawn]

Planning for this strike on the Tirpitz, Operation Tungsten, began in December 1943 after intelligence revealed that the damage done to the ship by British X-class midget submarines during Operation Source on 23 September 1943 could soon be fully repaired. You can learn more about Operation Source from our post from 23 September.



After other options were deemed impractical, Vice Admiral Sir Henry Moore and Fleet Air Arm Wing Leader Roy Sydney Baker-Falkner organized Force One and Force Two, composed of two fleet carriers, two battleships, and four escort carriers.



Intensive training for the operation began in February 1944 at Loch Eriboll in northern Scotland. Aerial reconnaissance and radio interception by submarines revealed in mid-March that Tirpitz would depart for high-speed trials on 1 April.



Both Force One and Two departed Scapa Flow on 30 March. On 1 April, decrypted radio messages revealed Tirpitz's departure was delayed until 3 April, so Force One and Two rendezvoused on 2 April.



At 0437 today, the first strike wave heads toward Kaafjord. The smoke generators at the port fail to hide the ship from the F4F and F6F fighters, which fly low over the mountains and strafe the deck. At 0529, the Fairey Barracudas score ten direct bomb hits. However, none of the armor-piercing bombs penetrate as the pilots drop them at too low an altitude. 



Between 0635 and 0637, the second strike group attacks Tirpitz, and the Barracudas score eight hits.



By 0758, all the aircraft return, losing only two Barracudas, one F6F Hellcat, and nine aircrew killed. Vice Admiral Moore decides against launching another raid.



Despite not suffering significant damage to her machinery, Tirpitz is out of action for the foreseeable future. The upper deck is completely destroyed, and 15% of the crew (122 killed and 316 wounded, including the captain) are casualties.



Pictures: Fleet Air Arm crewman chalks a message on the 1,600-pound bomb carried by a Fairey Barracuda of HMS Furious; Battleship Tirpitz struck by bombs

Sources: IWM A 22640 and A 22633```

[manic latch]

Tch missed a joke

Tirp-itz yours

[thorn trail]

Wait hold that Murdoch is related to the Keith Murdoch?

[frigid karma]

@delicate beacon https://www.omroepbrabant.nl/nieuws/4255865/ongeluk-gebeurd-met-atoombom-op-vliegbasis-volkel-zeggen-wetenschappers

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/468719321087082516/1073284933059104798/F96E2D69-E588-49B2-9B3D-E026BE5BCB3A.gif

[desert agate]

yep, his father

keith made the media empire that his son controls

[thorn trail]

Were there other instances where a carrier was in the battle line? I know of Formidable joining the battle line in the battle of Cape Matapan but nothing else

[night heart]

hi

[subtle prawn]

https://twitter.com/NATO/status/1643156970575130624

NATO (@NATO)

🗓️ #OnThisDay in 1949, NATO was born.

For 74 years, #NATO has ensured the freedom and security of all Allies

Likes

1437

Retweets

325

Twitter · Apr 4, 2023, 7:42 AM

[manic latch]

Microsoft was also found today

[manic latch]

@ivory ridge ok so

Does this thing has 203mm

If so, is it a light cruiser?

[autumn sorrel]

Why do it look like it can go 40kn?

[manic latch]

Long hull + big machinery space usually means fast ye

[autumn sorrel]

Hmm, I know the Izmali Battlecruiser was denied the Carrier conversion due to Red army take all the budget away but how feasible is the conversion if it was approved?

[spring briar]

These are pretty famous

[manic latch]

I think best way to compare is using Bearn. Who is also converted and more similar to tonnage of Izmail.

Let's see

Displacement 33k for Izmail, 28,900 tons for Bearn

Speed 21.5 for Bearn, 27 for Izmail

Planes: 32 for Bearn, maybe around 40 for Izmail

Weapons, 8 155mm, 6 75mm, 8 37mm, 4 550mm torp for Bearn.
8 180mm, 8 102mm for Izmail

Izmail has massive speed advantage and %30 ish more planes

[autumn sorrel]

Hmm, the air group look really light, I assume Soviet don't really have any aircraft for the carrier

Does the plan conversion design still exist or is it lost in the Soviet archive somewhere?

[manic latch]

I mean you don't need converting planes yet if carrier isn't being build

[autumn sorrel]

True

[spring briar]

Béarn is based

[autumn sorrel]

Bearn kinda meh

[spring briar]

Looking at her in ww2 definitely

But in 1928 she was fine

A tad slow

But that was deliberate

[manic latch]

Fucked her potential in ww2

[spring briar]

Atleast we had a carrier

[manic latch]

Did that helped you?

[autumn sorrel]

Layout is normal ig for early conversion, maybe she will get further refit during the interwar, I do wonder, would she look more like Lexington or Akagi-ish

[spring briar]

Yes

A lot

[autumn sorrel]

By ferry gold away?

[spring briar]

Experience

[manic latch]

But

British gave you new carrier

[spring briar]

At the end of the war

[autumn sorrel]

I thought USN give France Indep CVL and some Cassablanca postwar

[spring briar]

Also post war

[spring briar]

Like, argh and krem, I get you think Béarn was useless in WW2, and she was for the most part
But that doesn’t mean she isn’t based

[eternal veldt]

In general, none of the fleet carriers Im aware of. Even Formidable was ordered to bug out as soon as the firefight started.

Smaller ships, I only recall the CVEs at Samar, where Gambier Bay was the last carrier to be sunk by surface gunfire.

Special mention goes to Unicorn for using her guns to bombard Korea and scare the living shit out of a few RoC gunboats during the Korean war.

[chilly osprey]

Formidable was only in line at that point in time because they were not expecting a fight

The British knew where Pola was, and were expecting to be investigating a cripple

Even if they did not know exactly what type of ship Pola was

The appearance of the rest of 1st Div with the other two cruisers and four destroyers caught them completely by surprise.

The key to that action was that the British spotted the Italians first and reacted first because of it.

[manic latch]

Delta III and Kilo

[glass trail]

baby

[autumn sorrel]

Kilo is such a nice ship

[subtle prawn]

https://twitter.com/NavalInstitute/status/1643278616183070721

U.S. Naval Institute (@NavalInstitute)

#OTD in 1949, the Tench-class submarine USS Pickerel (SS-524) was simultaneously christened and commissioned. This is the Pickerel performing an emergency surface test from a depth of 150 feet with a 48-degree up-angle near Hawaii in 1952.

▶ Play video

Twitter · Apr 4, 2023, 3:45 PM

https://twitter.com/ronkainen7k15/status/1643170983073955842

Ronkainen (@ronkainen7k15)

XM1302 Mobile Protected Firepower-BAE Pilot Vehicle 2

Likes

259

Twitter · Apr 4, 2023, 8:37 AM

[frigid karma]

https://twitter.com/FinMissionNATO/status/1643265221799157760?ref_src=twsrc^google|twcamp^serp|twgr^tweet

Finland at NATO (@FinMissionNATO)

31 Allied flags are flying today at #NATO headquarters in Brussels, including a new blue and white addition.

Finland is a full member of the North Atlantic Treaty Organization.

#WeAreNATO

Likes

561

Retweets

111

Twitter · Apr 4, 2023, 2:52 PM

[shrewd pecan]

https://tenor.com/view/nato-flag-gif-20870371

[subtle prawn]

https://www.navalnews.com/naval-news/2023/04/dutch-navys-asw-frigates-to-enter-service-in-2029/

[manic latch]

Another vehicle ruined by stealth geometry

That turret shape pukes

[deep apex]

Cope

[manic latch]

You like FDG shut

[deep apex]

Ooh

We're gonna go that route, huh?

Stealth is needed

And if that means sacrificing looks

Then so be it

[manic latch]

So what do I see this ship in radar as?

A mosquito?

Nope

Even best Zumwalt do was being a fishing boat level and that's after she did almost everything for stealth focus

[deep apex]

You see

I don't know about you

But I love being the size of a silver dollar

On a radar scope

[manic latch]

Are you sure this thing seen as silver dollar on radar?

[deep apex]

Have you seen how big a silver dollar is?

[manic latch]

Especially considering waves will move this girl up around alot unlike planes who can fly in a straight line

[deep apex]

I'm talking about the blip size

Not the cross-section

[manic latch]

So this frigate's blip

Will be corvette level

[ivory ridge]

it's because it's self contained

it's a 76mm sovraponte

above-deck

it doesnt penetrate the deck

so all the ammo is inside it

[manic latch]

Holy shit why

Actually

Makes sense

This girl is ASW

She doesn't need much ammo

[ivory ridge]

i mean, Italy made it to be put above hangars

like on the PPAs

the fact other nations are using it as main gun is

[manic latch]

Zumwalt had those weird 30mms ye

[manic latch]

Oh damn

[spring briar]

Looks like a big orange slice

[manic latch]

It's Undef's orange storage

[spring briar]

Krem

[cerulean ice]

🫖

[shrewd pecan]

that still makes it far harder to identify and locate Zumwalt

[manic latch]

But Zumwalt needs to be alone for that to even work right

[shrewd pecan]

you know how common fishing ships are right?

[manic latch]

No way Zumwalt still follows "solo" doctrine

[shrewd pecan]

there's three zumwalts

[manic latch]

Ye rest is cancelled

[shrewd pecan]

three that can function as a long range fires formation that can sneak up to enemy coasts to penetrate deep into enemy airspace with tomahawks and hypersonics

[manic latch]

So it will hope it doesn't get spotted after shooting her missiles?

And run away in time

[shrewd pecan]

considering the range of her missiles

she can still outrange coastal batteries

[manic latch]

What bout enemy air force and anti ship missiles

[shrewd pecan]

coastal batteries as in

[manic latch]

Ah

[shrewd pecan]

land based anti ship launchers

[manic latch]

I guess it's better to hide mobile anti ship launchers nearby hangars for this situation

[shrewd pecan]

additionally compared to other ships

enemy aircraft are gonna have a much harder time trying to locate and identify the zumwalts

[manic latch]

Hmm

[shrewd pecan]

Zumwalts also still have the ability to defend themselves

[manic latch]

Inferior to Burkes no?

[shrewd pecan]

they don't have the full range of anti aircraft missiles but they still have plenty of ESSMs and ESSM ERs

[frigid karma]

Yes almost as if that’s

The point

[shrewd pecan]

on top of you know

[frigid karma]

Do you think 5th gen stealth aircraft are completely invisible to radar too?

[shrewd pecan]

advanced electronic warfare and jamming capabilities

[manic latch]

Just saying I doubt Burke replacement will focus on stealth high as Zumwalt did

[frigid karma]

Possibly because that’s not their intended jobs?

[shrewd pecan]

Zumwalt's design is mostly a one off

but again its not like low RCS features on ship are useless

[frigid karma]

I mean if the various decisions to rag on zumealt

Stealth is an interesting one

[shrewd pecan]

again reducing the range that your ships can be detected from is ideal

[tough quail]

its fun to rag on because it made the ship hideous

[shrewd pecan]

even the Burkes integrate low RCS features in their design

[manic latch]

Burke production did stop because of Zumwalt's construction right? Only started again when their project died.

[frigid karma]

https://cdn.wikiwiki.jp/to/w/wowscs/Zieten/::ref/Zieten.jpg.webp?rev=47d50e83283bfcc8c9ca2a620fd52f01&t=20220904063445

[shrewd pecan]

Burke production kept going

[frigid karma]

Any more hideous than this?

[shrewd pecan]

the program for Zumwalt called for additional burkes regardless

[tough quail]

yes honestly

both are ugly but that still has stuff to actually look at

instead of being a plastic slab

[manic latch]

Wait a minute

[frigid karma]

Fair

[shrewd pecan]

Zumwalts would of been more a replacement for the Spruances

than the Burkes

since flight III Burke was apart of the program that originally birthed the Zumwalt

[thorn trail]

wouldn't the Zumwalts be more of a replacement for the Ticons?

[chilly osprey]

No

They weren't Aegis platforms and weren't meant for area air warfare

[thorn trail]

[chilly osprey]

They were picking up the ASW and strike role of the Sprucan's

[shrewd pecan]

if you were going to take original original Zumwalt

the 134 VLS one with actual ballistic defense capability

you could consider it a Ticon replacement

tho overall the program turned into a Spruance replacement

[thorn trail]

what's gonna replace the Ticons then

[shrewd pecan]

Burkes

[manic latch]

This one

"USS Michael Murphy (DDG-112) was originally intended to be the last of the Arleigh Burke class. The class was scheduled to be replaced by Zumwalt-class destroyers beginning in 2020. However, an increasing threat from both long- and short-range missiles caused the Navy to restart production of the Arleigh Burke class"

[shrewd pecan]

I'll get the Burke thing once I'm done being toxic in war thunder

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SC-21_(United_States)#Program_approved

[chilly osprey]

Zumwalt was always a Sprucan replacement, there was a parallel effort to replace the Tico's - CG(X) (which came out of CG-21)

[chilly osprey]

That said

Yeah, Burke production was ended for Zumwalt

[delicate forge]

Isn't that thing still a nightmare to maintain?

[chilly osprey]

The 'last' Burke was laid down in 2010, and then that was supposed to be it

Hence there

[manic latch]

But why

If both has different doctrine

[chilly osprey]

Because the USN had 62 of the damn things

[desert agate]

Burke flight 3 is the tico replacement

[chilly osprey]

And the Tico's were supposed to be replaced by CG(X)

[thorn trail]

62?!??!

what the fuck

[manic latch]

In spite of the production restart, the U.S. Navy is expected to fall short of its requirement for 94 destroyer or cruiser platforms capable of missile defense starting in FY2025 and continuing past the end of the 30-year planning window.

[chilly osprey]

At the time the decision was made, it was assumed this would be more than enough for the future

[thorn trail]

wait hold on

the requirement is 94?!??!!

what the fuck

[desert agate]

USN still has more capital surface combatants than the rest of the world combined

[chilly osprey]

The situation changed circa 2008 when it became the PLAN was going to become a serious surface threat

[thorn trail]

how many frigates does the US Navy have

[manic latch]

China's ship spam

[chilly osprey]

Which played a major role in the Zumwalt-class being cut short

[desert agate]

DDGs being capital combatants in the 21st century

[chilly osprey]

And Burke production being restarted

[thorn trail]

or still have

[chilly osprey]

Because China is primarily an air and surface threat for the USN

[thorn trail]

Wait someone please tell me why do most guided missile ships don't go that big

[chilly osprey]

None

OHP's were retired without replacement because of the LCS program

They cut steel on their first new frigate in August 2022

[thorn trail]

like what's the main limiting factor of having a ship the size of HMS dreadnought for example in a CG form

[chilly osprey]

Which should enter service in 2026

[manic latch]

Type 54A Frigate for example. China build 30 of them in since 2005

[desert agate]

Because they're meant to work together, plus if you need more than about 70 cells, it's really just overkill

[shrewd pecan]

there already getting that big

[desert agate]

Unless you're the USN and you need global staying power

Also quad packed missiles

[chilly osprey]

A combination of cost, manning requirement, and effective use of armament relative to their sensor suite. Also motive power

[thorn trail]

Ah

[chilly osprey]

Ex, you don't want to give a ship more missile capacity than it's likely to effectively use, and you also don't want to stick too many eggs in one basket

[spring briar]

@maiden citrus ...
Maka
We've got an Island to burn...

[thorn trail]

Ah another question. In the off chance a Battle of the Atlantic style campaign happens again, how would it be fought nowadays?

[chilly osprey]

If you have a 256 VLS ship, for example, any time that ship is not available - maintenance, out of theater, battle damage - that's a huge chunk of firepower gone

[thorn trail]

Would escort carriers be still a thing to use

[desert agate]

Why build 1 ship that weighs 20'000t when you can build 2 ships that will have the same radar as the first, relatively similar weapons suite (albeit smaller) and will collectively weigh the same amount

[desert agate]

FFGs and helicopters fulfil the role that escort carriers used to

If you need more than a few Romeo's, you're doing something wrong

[manic latch]

*If you can't have it in decent numbers

[thorn trail]

Romeo?

[desert agate]

MH-90R

Seahawk

[thorn trail]

Ah

[manic latch]

Like British choose 2 Medium carrier over 1 Super for too many eggs thingy

[shrewd pecan]

MH-60R*

[desert agate]

Oops

[shrewd pecan]

beyond the FFGs and helicopters

[manic latch]

US doesn't worry about it since they have 10

[shrewd pecan]

ASW planes would also play a big factor

[manic latch]

Or 11

[shrewd pecan]

such as the P-8 and P-3

[desert agate]

Sorry the Taipan has killed my brain

[chilly osprey]

You actually do still have escort carrier equivalents

[shrewd pecan]

NH-90s have a tendency of killing brain cells

[chilly osprey]

Ex, the Hyuga and Izumo-classes are explicitly designed for this

[chilly osprey]

They're the core of the JMSDF's ASW capability, which is the primary role of their blue-water forces

[desert agate]

Such excellent platforms

[chilly osprey]

That said

[desert agate]

Such atrocious logistics

[chilly osprey]

You will not see another Battle of the Atlantic with today's technology

Submarines simply are not designed for that kind of fight anymore

They're not cheap tools you can use in an attritional battle

The entire concept of how submarines operate is radically different than in WWII

Now, they're primarily anti-submarine and anti-surface (warship) platforms.

[manic latch]

anti land with cruise and nuclear missiles

[chilly osprey]

That capability exists too

Though, in terms of nuclear capability, that's more strategic

Which itself was massively important in defining the nature of underwater warfare, tbf

Ex, a lot of the large Soviet ASW ships that NATO called cruisers were originally designed to do ASW in the North Sea or Atlantic to keep NATO SSBNs from being able to get into positions where they could launch against Russia

Which obviously was only relevant for a short period of the Cold War

Later on the Soviets became effectively solely focused on defending their SSBN bastions in the Arctic and Pacific

[desert agate]

These days if you want to interdict trade you just park an FFG on a trade route and that's a solid few hundred kms around that ship where nothing is willing to go through

[thorn trail]

actually hold on. speaking of trade

[desert agate]

Although the political and legal ramifications of a modern war on shipping like we saw in WW2 are very complex

[chilly osprey]

I think nowadays it will be a case of seizing ships and diverting them with prize crews

[manic latch]

Khabarovsk is the weird one. Full focus on 6 Poseidon torpedos. No VLS function

[thorn trail]

how effective would it be if instead of a convoy of multiple escorts in the Battle of the Atlantic, you replace it with one modern FFG

[chilly osprey]

Ex, how Iran sometimes tried to play in the Persian Gulf

[thorn trail]

Would a modern FFG be able to escort an entire ww2 convoy by itself?

[desert agate]

Is that even legal under a flag of convenience?

[desert agate]

Easily

[chilly osprey]

Defending a WWII convoy against WWII subs?

A modern FFG would clean house on the opposition easily

It would be butchery

[manic latch]

Bruh just bring a Typhoon class for ww2

War will end in single day

[shrewd pecan]

making berlin burn

[chilly osprey]

That depends on whether your country cares about that kind of stuff (ex, Iran, not so likely to).

I think it would be interesting to see how the US and its Allies would play that in a hot war with China.

[thorn trail]

I'm just thinking up random ideas of what's the smallest modern naval group you can bring to ww2 scenarios and still be effective

[chilly osprey]

It's still a strategic capability, even if kind of a moronic capability to invest into

[manic latch]

Problem with these time travel changes is longer you operate it worse it will become since there no parts to maintain the ship in 1940s

[thorn trail]

Yeah I'm only assuming for that singular scenario

[chilly osprey]

It all depends on the type of mission you're looking at

[thorn trail]

not the long term implications and such

[chilly osprey]

Ex, single FFG escorting a WWII convoy against subs is a lot easier than, say, 'single DDG must defend against all kamikaze attacks off Okinawa'

[desert agate]

The only limiting factor there would be ammunition

Laffey can attest to that

[chilly osprey]

Pretty much

But it's a lot easier to run dry against aircraft than it is submarines

[desert agate]

A Burke would take out at least 100 kamikaze before it ran out of ammo

Assuming a mixed VLS load of mostly quad packed SHORAD

[shrewd pecan]

probably more than that when you throw in its CIWS and its gun

[frigid karma]

one submarine even with non nuclear weapons would roflstomp just about anything

even the japanese would probably sue for peace if they saw an entire battlegroup just disappear

[chilly osprey]

Well, depends on the type, a lot of SSKs have pretty limited ammunition capacity

[desert agate]

The 30mm wouldn't last long tbh

[chilly osprey]

But still fucking terrifying, yeah

[shrewd pecan]

yeah but the Phalanx and 127 MM will

[desert agate]

Send in the Collins

[chilly osprey]

You would probably just want to use them to snipe capital ships

[thorn trail]

actually another what if but not involving like modern to ww2 time travel:
If the US Pacific Fleet in Pearl Harbor was at sea much like the British Eastern Fleet was in the Indian Ocean Raid, would the US Fleet try to intercept the Japanese Fleet just like Somerville tried to do?

[desert agate]

1 Collins vs the entire IJN
How many Japanese carriers could it take out before the Collins broke down and caught on fire

[chilly osprey]

Depends on how far the Collins is into its service life before we send her

Early Collins service is definitely a bit more risky than where they are now XD

[thorn trail]

Like what would have been the call of the admiral at that time taking into account US doctrine and practices

[chilly osprey]

Of course, if you want to send a modern sub that's truly buggered, send the Canadian boats

[desert agate]

Mmmm 1 boat reliability rates

[spring briar]

@delicate beacon French Holtzer shells in 1885 had 20mm more penetration than Krupp shells

[thorn trail]

also what's the likelihood of success if they do manage to attempt to intercept the Japanese fleet in this scenario

[desert agate]

Kido Butais no good terrible absolutely bad day

[chilly osprey]

That sort of depends on how much the US Fleet knows about where the Japanese are

[spring briar]

btw test happened in La Spezia

wink wink

[chilly osprey]

And where Lexington and Enterprise are

[desert agate]

There's also a fair degree of luck involved for both sides

Since early Pacific war carriers tended to enjoy becoming fuel air bombs on both sides

[chilly osprey]

Absolutely. Big advantage for whoever finds the other first, when it comes carrier fights

[desert agate]

The Americans probably have the home field advantage there since even in 41 Hawaii has a lot of Catalinas present for recon

[thorn trail]

Hmm. What if it was the same kind of intel as the British had i.e. the US knows the Japanese fleet was nearby but underestimates its strength by half

[desert agate]

Doctrine isn't at its best in 41 but when is it really

[delicate beacon]

Yes but those 20mms came from mobyldeen cheating

[tough quail]

sounds like the typical german skill issue

[spring briar]

no these tests were in 1885, the molybdenum test was in 1912

[chilly osprey]

I mean, they'll definitely be gung ho about intercepting it, if given the go-ahead

[spring briar]

no wonder Italy was buying Schneider

[chilly osprey]

But it all depends on who finds who first

There's also the whole sticky issue of the US and Japan not yet being at war

So, if the Americans do find the Japanese first, yeah, it's definitely a "Hey, cool, we just found you looking really guilty next to the cookie jar"

But technically speaking, until the Japanese hit or declare war, they can't actually physically do much

[spring briar]

happy birthday to you horse, this historical shell data is my gift to you

[tough quail]

meanwhile, the kido butai

🇯🇵

[tough quail]

❤️

[spring briar]

phoenix if I find anything spicy about Italian shells I'll send it to ya

[chilly osprey]

Awesome

[spring briar]

omg
Holtzer shells

[chilly osprey]

OH

wait

that reminds me, I do have something you'll like, but I can't share it here

[spring briar]

oya

DM's are open

[spring briar]

Horse, lay your eyes on 370mm AP shells

[thorn trail]

Ok I'm curious. what would be the pros and cons between a full flush deck BB and one that isn't