Let's FINE TUNE Deity! (Small nerfs only please)

[deep harbor]

Deity is Chad, we'll find a way

[worthy phoenix]

I mean deity's have exactly 3 tiers of classline

[ripe folio]

I was going with you get all the spells from the classline screen including hybrid classes

[worthy phoenix]

If we started at t5 we'd be screwed

[ripe folio]

No other way of getting spells other than gear

[worthy phoenix]

Eh we've got enough spells tbh

It's more so just the perm buffs

[ripe folio]

Yeah and with no buffs it’s gonna be kinda rough

[worthy phoenix]

I mean the only place we'd struggle again is raids and endless

We'd still have Trev staff

So we'd still nuke horde content

[ripe folio]

Yeah. Dungeons Dara is probably gonna be ok. Dursa idk

[worthy phoenix]

D.ursa would be fine

[ripe folio]

Is Trev better than swangsong?

[worthy phoenix]

For 0 buffs 100%

For low mag less so

But pretty sure bl2 is one of the highest if not the highest t1 damage skill (aoe for sure) not sure about all skills

And Trev is easier to build for since it's mag only and crit

The idea is Trev staff will fall off in anguish 2.0 and didn't work for 1.0 past ang 40 or so because the pen is low (m1=.6 or something like that) but has one hell of an m2 something like 1.3-1.9? I'm sure someone has better numbers/exact numbers I'm going off memory of what I think I've seen tho

[ripe folio]

🤷‍♂️ idk I just only got a famed one so I’m rolling with swangsong

[deep harbor]

Don't forget we still have manyalus for horde content. It's iffy but exists haha

[ripe folio]

Gonna be honest I straight up forget that exists

With how much aoe is in the game now do you think we can get that changes so positive status effect duration boosts it?

[deep harbor]

I wish. It would open up so many builds for Deity. Wouldn't have to rely on CS or a two hander and leave those skills to their respected classes more

[fervent cedar]

I just want dex 😭 and deity gets 5% base crit, a tragedy

[echo hornet]

if what you want is dex and 3% more crit then maybe just play Deity

[dim shard]

We could do this on ara. It doesnt profit from low mana, but it would technically be a nerf so ppl have less reasons to make our class less fun :)

[worthy phoenix]

it wouldnt be a nerf d.ara doesnt really nead mana

[ripe folio]

It would be a nerf because you lose half your mana for a second chance instead of basic second chance

[worthy phoenix]

but we dont need mana?

most of the stuff we run including raids we dont need that much mana to achieve what we need

[ripe folio]

It’s not a major nerf, but it definitely is a nerf. There would be a con to second chance. Just a downside as Dara doesn’t have blue line

[plush owl]

Personally I find deity outclassed by everything in terms of damage and survivability without any ascension levels. Literally all the other classes can hit for hundreds of thousands of damage. Meanwhile deity has to spend like 10 turns buffing to reach that.

[soft tundra]

Hot take

[primal dew]

That's for raids. Deity is slowest raider at begin, and one of slowest even at the end. Only deep ang raids he is really good, cuz he is tanky a lot.

Deity is usually bad for any fast content - fast raids, turn 1 dmg, etc. The longer it takes, the better Deity is. And even something as long as regular dungeon run - Deity is best there cuz of its passive (DAra to say).

[soft tundra]

I would love to see a new deity raider try to raid as anew gilga.

[buoyant shuttle]

deity is best at fast dungeons

[worthy phoenix]

correction fast horde dungeons horde content as a whole diety is fast with

[simple forum]

The coping in this thread goes hard, deity is literally the best class for horde dungeons / towers, endless, anguished raiding + arisen waygate raiding. Deity also isn’t far behind in all other types of content. I’m pretty inactive because deity killed my motivation to progress on other classes and a small nerf probably won’t be enough to bring that god class in line

[mortal surge]

Lol

And he cooks very well too

[mint raft]

Gs main, this has never not been the case. 😅

[worthy phoenix]

Deity's aren't the best awg raiders were only decent at high anguish but gilga still beats up endless were passed by grand summoners but they take more time to get depth. We are only best at horde content because of the temp buffs but without us being best at horde content we'd be just another crappy class like we were before rework. If you take deity's hordes away then you'd have to take rs and heretics base crit factor away youd have to nerf the hell outta gilga and beo is just as broken if not more so than deity is due to hybrid on hydrus. So deity would return to the worst class in the game instead of having a reason to be played.

[gaunt mica]

Afaik deity still holds depth endless record, and of course it's the best at orn endless. Are you suggesting gilga is better at endless?

[worthy phoenix]

old gilga with the ward scaling for depth yes for orns no

gilga is a pvp and 1v1 fighter when ward is an option

and had better ward stats than most characters in the game pre celestial release

gilga use to be the class people recommended to get endless 400

[dreamy crag]

guy is living years in the past

just keep it real, deity is the best endless class

(behind gs technically, but speed is king

[ripe folio]

Wasn’t that when Dara passive was glitched to be infinitely scaling?

[worthy phoenix]

Speed isn't only king the ability to get depth of 2400 on gs is crazy and d.ara is only at like 2000 iirc when the passive was 200% scaling or infinite scaling instead of how it's supposed to be

[dreamy crag]

The world record for gs is like 1800 with old stasis or smth with summon prot

Idk where 2400 came from

[gaunt mica]

In orna the deity record is 2200+

[worthy phoenix]

You were talking about broken passive for broken passive

Gs use to have the ability to gsa summon

And then swap to gsh

[worthy phoenix]

And BP endless

[dreamy crag]

oh boy

@spare oracle when was the last time you updated endless leaderboards on ol

probably should have pinged in the channel mb

[spare oracle]

I update them every time someone tells me to update them

[dreamy crag]

oh

[spare oracle]

Is that your record @gaunt mica ?

[gaunt mica]

No krawmerax, from a while ago

[dreamy crag]

teach me your ways sensei

[gaunt mica]

With dara

[worthy phoenix]

Ascend higher young one lmfao

[dreamy crag]

Only the wisest players know this one trick

[worthy phoenix]

I mean what more could you do tho for d.ara endless everyone knows the ways of it now it's just getting 300 als

And perfect gear

[dreamy crag]

I was referring to gsh lol

[spare oracle]

Cool that makes updating it nice and easy lol

[dreamy crag]

how do you sustain summon hp

[worthy phoenix]

Gsh BP was crazy

[dreamy crag]

pauldrons don't give anything lol

[worthy phoenix]

Life pact

[dreamy crag]

and you get otked surely

[worthy phoenix]

Nah life pact on hydrus heals crazy amounts

[dreamy crag]

I meant the player gets brutally murdered

[worthy phoenix]

And when you're doing a BP build you already build for pact %

Summon protects

[dreamy crag]

lmao

ok

[worthy phoenix]

Uh @gaunt mica you got any deep endless vids with bp

Back when gsh could use passive on gsa summons

[gaunt mica]

Never done bp endless

And gsh can still use gsa summons for bp in endless, but the gsh combat passive has been broken for over a month now.

[worthy phoenix]

They changed it I thought like gsh BP bonus doesn't work on gsa summons for damage

[gaunt mica]

It's only in party play your pact multipliers dont work with other peoples summons, but if you swap in endless it's still your own summons

[worthy phoenix]

Isn't it a passive thing like d.ara passive falls off for d.ursa

[deep harbor]

As a Deity main who's recently tried other classes you are wrong. BeoH is hands down the best Turn one tower class followed by Gilga doing CS then Deity. Raiding Deity is beat by Gilga until SUPER late Ang and it's only because of meta amities and Deities tankiness. Otherwise we hit like wet noodles that high anguish. Dungeons it's tied between Deity and Gilga. Endless Dara obviously but people act like HereticC and RS etc are eons behind

The fact that this thread is still going is mind boggling. The only thing Deity is king at right now is Dara endless and extremely late anguish raids

How about buffing RS and heretic and fixing summoner before we go for the other classes. Maybe fix pet and summon anguish passives to start. Give RS shadowveil finally, GS Hydrus rework. Like theres other stuff to do

[buoyant shuttle]

i want deity nerfed so I don't feel forced to hoc to it when they will nerf BP, only to have it nerfed after I move. but right now deity is too broken, with beo slightly behind. only thing that keeps deity in check on paper is raiding where it's mid, but as mentioned with broken amities it's actually the best at that AS WELL at high agony. if I was as interested in playing a lot as I was in the past (I am not as I don't feel I can commit again to something only for it to be nerfed again) I would be deity already. instead I stay GS and farm raids because BP is still broken (at very high AL, i am 190), but u literally did raids only for the past 20 days + (and only like one hour per day only). with wyrmhunt I guess I'll have to do towers again for the new drops. but lol at the deities claiming that because deity isn't top1 in every form of content means it doesn't have to get nerfed. being in the upper half AT EVERYTHING, often in the top2, is oppressively dominant and requires nerfing as well. a class basically should either have a glaring whole (something important in the game the class utterly sucks at), like gilga for orns, or It should not be top at anything (like rs/heretic). having some class that is at least decent at everything and top at something is just broken, given the others aren't like that (which is why the counterproposal is to buff everyone else). and yes ofc beo has to be nerfed as well. but pet raiding has been nerfed already. we just need beoH hybrid to work like lines, on pre-AL stats

[mortal surge]

I don't agree with all said here, but I agree with a good part of it, and especially the end. And it tends to makes me think the deity mains who joined the thread early to share some specific changes were just right. No need excess on one side or another, there are ways to balance.
Again, I can't agree more with the fact AL scaling things have to go at some point, there will just need some good idea to keep things fine.

[deep harbor]

After switching to other classes for things I can still say it's wrong and for the casual gamer which most of orna is most don't have god tier amities to even make it work. I didn't do raids for the past 20 days if that's to me you're also wrong again. Beo is still VERY good and doesn't even have pet stats in anguish yet. Gilgas only thing stopping it is Orns which is a VERY good class and better than Deity at things. Most of the Deitys here are good with tweaks and fine tunes, but this discussion has literally gone no where from the start after the polls. Just people complaining over and over with no real context and actual changes. Beo and Deity don't need nerfs, maybe small tweaks but for the love of everything how about fixing the other classes before messing with functioning ones.

#GetRidOfCritMalus

[buoyant shuttle]

no I was talking about myself, I did raids only last 20 days (I am explaining why I didn't hoc to deity even if I know it's broken). I also do not have the ultra broken amities (HOA issues). yes beoH is too good I addressed that already. but the only reason is hybrid scaling semi quadratically so you keep pace with anguish scaling much better than anyone else basically.

[deep harbor]

BeoH hybrid monster is great. The trade off you get hit you shatter like glass and one status happens literally every turn lol

[finite vector]

Hybrid scaling is a Beo, Gilga and Deity problem though not a purely Deity issue

Kind of like Spiked Shield not being just a gilga issue

[buoyant shuttle]

if AL mattered less class balance would be a BIGGER problem. you would move from "heretic needs 20 Al more than beo/deity to do the same" to "eheh beo/deity is just better and there is nothing at all other classes can do ever".

[deep harbor]

I agree with that. But hybrid scaling doesn't really take much effect imo since celestials get outclassed fairly quickly. So again it comes down to God tier amities. Was cool with changing the offensive stats on Dara and Dursa

[finite vector]

Or we could get classes balanced properly 🔥

ALs shouldn't be a primary factor

[buoyant shuttle]

impossible in a game of this complexity unless the variations are only cosmetic.

[finite vector]

I guess it depends on what you mean by balance

[buoyant shuttle]

beoH has hybrid passive which is why it matters that it scales too well. it should scale on base stats like all lines

[buoyant shuttle]

doing the same content in the same time

[mortal surge]

If some class/skills scale differently with AL it's also an issue 😅

[deep harbor]

And the only thing it's good at is towers 🤷.

And hordes but you are GLASS

[finite vector]

Excelling at one content and being weak in another is a kind of balance - see Heretic and sorta Realmshifter and to an extreme Grand Summoner but they have only one real content

But I see what you mean - especially if all content is not equal in time/efficiency, etc.

But that's also why I dislike ALs forcing the most efficient play at all times if you want to be truly competitive

[mortal surge]

According to what you just said here I think we agree

[buoyant shuttle]

one shotting aoe high hp targets in dungeons matters as well

[deep harbor]

They won't survive high anguish. I can guarantee that. Dara does it at 40 with extreme risk

[buoyant shuttle]

there isn't only 0 or 40. there is 15-20-25 as well

beoH can one click aoe for longer than other classes except deity

[mortal surge]

Absolutely agree with anc L here

[deep harbor]

It goes down....like everything else

[buoyant shuttle]

sweet spot is higher and more rewards with 0 difficulty

[deep harbor]

Which I agree with and will never be fixed

You can do it with Gilga and Deity just the same

[buoyant shuttle]

if you can farm at 0 effort and full relax at 23 and other classes at 14 that's a balance problem

[deep harbor]

Which is with RS , GS that's it 🤷

The classes that need help

People here acting like Gilga CD isn't busted

[mortal surge]

It goes down, clearly, but first it's :

• later
• there s also unschack, meaning you can push AL to increase the ang you can run unschack with more ease if it's stronger

[buoyant shuttle]

gilga can AoE one click mammons at Mel 20? shackled?

[deep harbor]

CS to SS3

[buoyant shuttle]

if you can't aoe sweep the floor we aren't even talking the same game

[deep harbor]

Deity can't sweep the floor either at high Ang sir

[buoyant shuttle]

the moment you need to change to CS it's another curve of comparison

[deep harbor]

Mid tier yeah

[mortal surge]

(Don't underestimate gilga on late ang tho, that's maybe a class that may shine with a revive of CS+colat)

[buoyant shuttle]

you can higher than the rest

except beo

[deep harbor]

Maybe give melee an actual usable AoE?

For starters

[buoyant shuttle]

I am talking breakpoints, highest Mel you one click braindead 0 effort 0 risks sipping coffee never look at screen

what you need to do 100 dungeons day ok?

[deep harbor]

RS redline with avidity and an non envy AoE would lay waste

We need class balance no nerfing 1-2 classes

[buoyant shuttle]

being able to do anguish 38 better than others is irrelevant if it's humanly impossible to do that hours per day

balance is needed for activities that can be mass farmed at very low effort because it's those activities that make up the bulk of the economy

[deep harbor]

I knew I shouldnt have come back into here. Lol

[mortal surge]

Agree. That's why balance is important. And that's also one of the reason why I don't really like the new system, because AL allow too easely to.... break breakpoint because when you hit a wall schackled, you can just run unschack as long as you have the AL for it, meaning meta is AL +++ into unschack and increase the ang you can run it. In a game with way to Bump Al with debatable mechanic, it's a bit sad

[deep harbor]

This discussion is a waste of time imo. Arguing over everything and no actual input on what to change

Should delete this thread and move the entire conversation to the class balance one

Or forward the polls back down here and give to NF/Orn to work with.

Also fix GS Hydrus, Bloodpact, RS love

Please make new sword AoE for melee ♥️ not upward strike

[buoyant shuttle]

i gave a very precise input: beoh Hybrid should only scale on base stats. as for deity: Dara passive should get to 60% (charged 15% per apex skill). and deities should lose the tbuff duration buff

[deep harbor]

Oh the thing they are centered around and help actually do any damage? With garbage apex skills minus maybe 2-3?

[buoyant shuttle]

the +100% passive got too broken now that we have longer content

and orn farming on Dara is too broken

all it takes is one useful apex skill btw and you just use that

[deep harbor]

Lol

[worthy phoenix]

Let us keep our dura you can have the negative status dura -% as a trade

[obtuse spire]

Even at mel 14 i can't aoe sweep mammon let alone 20 😂 and that's unshackled

Of course mammon resist envy

[ripe folio]

I love how every deity thread turns into an absolute dumpster fire with like 10 times the amount of messages 🤣

Also turning down Dara passive to 60 is a wild solution like geez man it already got turned down . You don’t need to cut the legs out from under it too

[dreamy crag]

oh yeah ofc

[ripe folio]

One more thing, this may be a crazy idea but wouldn’t this all solve itself eventually seeing as all the other classes keep getting gear to enhance their class abilities?

[dreamy crag]

scary, because buffing flasks too much = instakill raids
avidity = game becomes hell

[ripe folio]

Like look at all the ways you can affect collateral, advidity and mana flasks. Deity has hippo eyes which no one uses cause of how bad they are and some sucky pieces of gear

[dreamy crag]

yeah if apex was an actual spell that wasn't just haha chan barri deity would be even more crazy

[ripe folio]

The flasks are slowly getting more gear to buff as well as advidity

That’s not what I’m saying. Apex is pretty much this is what you got here’s what you can do with it. It’s pretty cut and dry

🤷‍♂️ idk if I’m explaining myself well I’m tired 😅

[dreamy crag]

yeah i understand, but there has to be some way to balance the hypothetical apex buffs

[ripe folio]

I mean leave it as it is and let the other trickle up. Or add the buffs as a spec with some negatives like benefactor

[obtuse spire]

I'll just leave it here so the next time someone trying to compare deity to gilga in dungeons has some insight instead of just "trust me bro"

[dreamy crag]

can you post a ss without tatt and against similar enemies

[primal dew]

1MIL / 2 (at+++) = 500k / 1.5 (att++) = 333k / 1.25 (att+) = 266k / 2 (DC) = 133k 🤷‍♂️

[burnt sparrow]

You should calc the ALs too

Btw, are we not done about how strong deity really is? Or we still cherry pick some situations where deity lose to 1 or 2 classes so we can ignore the fact that deity need some nerfs?

[primal dew]

Well, SaltySid appeared here to be Salty. And noone should really take otsego seriously, that is known. Imo majority of ppl said enough things before.

[obtuse spire]

No lol, I can't prevent the buff from coming out

[spare pasture]

oh yeah, my turn my turn ! i love to compare random stuff !
Hera AL 28 VS Dara AL120, tried to have to same buffs

One Dara screen swithout any T.buff too, which happen more often than people think too btw, but most people think deity alway have t.buff+/++/+++ always actives 100%time x)

[simple forum]

Remove the temp triple up and lock deities passive to only give temp buffs when you have none

[worthy phoenix]

Why are you comparing both to bg. Resistance to no resistance and 3t temp att buffs on floor 20 vs floor 11 votg without class passive up.

[worthy phoenix]

Negative. Just buff other classes it's simple

[spare pasture]

A good start would also be to give att classes some equivalents for BL2 and Aaru robe for exemple...

[obtuse spire]

I wouldn't even bothered comparing stuff if someone doesn't trying to shift the conversation from deity to gilga.

As for your questions, it's about class potential in horde, as you can see deity has far more potential than gilga in terms of AoE, that's the peak of gursa power unless I'm tryin to play like deity and started equipping gears or followers that gives t.buffs.

[primal dew]

(and tbh I wouldn't even touch horde with DUrsa when there is DAra... 👀 )

[worthy phoenix]

Right but uh gilga powerful with single target enemies and rs have infinite turns so why is deity's ability to proc temp buffs any differentv

[simple forum]

Because deity literally has temp buffs up all the time, there is no trade off for getting temp buffs and the stacking makes every build automatically better on deity

But you screaming gilga just shows the deity agenda is strong in u

[primal dew]

Just to be said, I guess I play different Deity. But my temps are all the time only if I wear 2x50% pos duration. If I have none, I'm more time without them then with them. 👀

[worthy phoenix]

Do you play deity? I might have 1 of 3 temp buffs up in a dungeon per floor and maybe 2-3 floors see 2 at the same time with one having all 3

[obtuse spire]

I know and i don't have beef against any class, just clarifying things.

[simple forum]

Then you playing deity wrong lol, put on status duration amities and watch them never leave

[primal dew]

Ugh, I would rather take 2x40% crit than pos - for dungeons ex. - as it is just solid x2 dmg. Temps are still temps. And if you have 40+50, okay ...I don't think many ppl (if any) has those. But having god tier amities affect all classes.

[worthy phoenix]

Crit damage better. How you gonna tell a 50 Al deity they're playing deity wrong when you play gs

[primal dew]

To AoE petentional, it is same as "deep anguish" Deity potential with raids. Saying Deity is maybe mid in raids, but best(2nd) in deep raid anguish. Similar is for dungeons. CS is still viable and for deep anguish dungeons (with 100% proofs drop) it will be go to skill, as AOE will not be enough there. 🤷‍♂️

(and who will rock CS best there?)

[simple forum]

I’ve mained deity on AL70 for quite some time, then changed back to gilga. But yea can’t discuss with you I see

[worthy phoenix]

Yah crit damage is better than pos stats and d.ursa is worthless for most content. And discussing with me and telling me I'm playing deity wrong is 2 different things

[simple forum]

Saying dursa is worthless is wild

[worthy phoenix]

In most content

Base deity for towers d.ara for dungeons world farming d.ara is better and raiding is the only place d.ursa shines over the others

[spare pasture]

well, most endgame player will use it only to play SS or RS2. So mostly Raid only and only for those builds.
And it still suck at it imo, unless you're abyss at ang40 with godtier amity and loadout and doing screenshot when stars aligns with all t.buff and DC👌

[worthy phoenix]

I use to only use d.ursa until I was shown the path of d.ara

[simple forum]

As long as chanelanus is a 1 turn cast, it will also be overpowered in (anguish) towers. What about removing the option to wear either thief or warrior gear

[obtuse spire]

Gear restrictions isn't an option unless devs release more deity gear, the same goes with valhalan

[simple forum]

What about a heavily decreased def for dara and heavily decreased res for dursa, like gait of lvls decreased

[echo hornet]

90% decrease in defense ? See, that's why many people see this thread as a hater thread. 90% is unreasonable. Same with 60% Dara passive or limit tbuffs to one...

[simple forum]

Temp buff nerf is the best suggestion imo, capping the Dara passive is also a good move. Both would bring the class in line

Nothing unreasonable about that

Also while we are at it, remove Selene hands free 10% hybrid monster passive

[primal dew]

restrict apex gain 20% per round (big nerf to horde content, as you would be able to get +20% passive every 6th round if full AoE)

channealus 2 turns (so still 1 turn for DUrsa and DAra/Seq)

temp buffs only +/++
active t.att/t.mag +++ buff from apex

or just read it whole #1390521880124981266 message 🤷‍♂️

[simple forum]

A combination of your suggested nerfs should be the bare minimum to create an equal playingfield 👍🏻

[primal dew]

A bit better formating of original post, it suppose to be all that at once + some pick of SF nerf. It is not bare minimum. It is actually quite lot. We can move from that to Beo once it is done, since Deity is in this state for a little over year, but Beo is in his since tower release. 🫡

Looking at my friend list for instance, recently active 250:

• 22x Beo
• 18x Deity
• 6x Heretic
• 4x GS
• 4x Gilga
• 3x RS
  😅

(and before Deity rework, it was Beo > more than combination of all others lol)

[simple forum]

That’s something I’d support

[buoyant shuttle]

beo is better than deity for "non-true-endgamers", it works very well without insane gear. Deity gets more optimized with top gear/amities

[primal dew]

You are talking about single to double digit numbers of endgame players, while as Odie recently stated, average AL is like ...20? 30? 🤷‍♂️ Even I'm not true-end game player you are referring to and I'm ahead of 99.9% playerbase imo.

[buoyant shuttle]

nah i am talking AL 80-90+

At AL 60-70 unless you farmed AL very slowly but got incredible gear , beo can often still be better

[worthy phoenix]

There are less of them then there are Al 40+ making it again apart of the 10% of the world instead of the majority of the player base

[dim shard]

But if you buff other classes and fix them, then people cant mob on a combined enemy anymore and then, we would have to actually be constructive :'(

This thread goes on for ages and spins in circles, while the RS community asked for a breakcrumb, and got critical poise on corvus.
Odie has stated clearly with this that he is down helping classes that the data shows need it. If Deity really was this over dominant jack of a trade best of everything class that one half of this discussion wants to make it out to be, it would have been burned a long time ago.

Instead of a smaller part trying to make a part of the community miserable about their class choice and what they value, how about we work together bringing all classes into a shape so the people who cherish them can enjoy them as they deserve?

Im genuenly tired of this "lets remove the fun from one part of the community instead of trying to make it more fun for everybody" mentality this thread embellishes, and i have enough trust in odie to know that there is no need to defend deity as is.
I hope that one day we can pull on one string and try to make Orna the most enjoyable game it can be, instead of trying to push those away who are ~~playing the class the have the most fun with ~~ abuse whatever is strong.

[primal dew]

T10 classes exist 5+ years. Every now and then they are buffed. Never nerfed (or small nerfs). Usually everytime one class is buffed, others stay in behind. Most of other classes has working, solid passives. It is just Deity has more of them. Nerf are needed same as buffs. You can't just buff things till infinity. That is just pure powercreeping, you know that? In the end you sounds exactly same whiny as those who are saying we need nerf. 🤔

Me myself I'm usually for fast more common nerfs rather then waiting too long, before ppl get accustomed to new things and they start to be new "norm". Sadly, Orna usually waiting for way way too long.

[dim shard]

You mean you cant buff things infinitely in an infinitely scaling game with infinite difficulty endgame content :o

But jokes aside, i know what you mean. Orna does wait EXTREMELY long, and it makes nerfs always feel like a big jab to the game.
I just... cant see deity as this enourmous broken character class people want to make it out to. I see exaggerations.
I still believe that we should rather work together bringing other classes to this point, and then stop buffing classes alltogether.
Even tho i dont really see a lot buffs necessary, just people dont like adapting.
The new Wyrmhunt gear most definitely will do something for class balance.

[simple forum]

The „bUfF oThEr cLaSseS“ crowd is always really loud when their class takes a hit. But that doesn’t change the fact that it’s overtuned.

[primal dew]

You have to scale the content cuz you overshot player power. 🤷‍♂️ AMorri used to be nice end content raid, where barely anybody was able to kill her in single run and even that take a long time. Now she is a joke.

As was said, problem with Deity (and imo also Beo), is that they take 1st/2nd places in way too many content combined. Not just one or two, but all of them.

[simple forum]

Matter of fact, deities temp buffs and beowulfs hybrid stats combined with the option to run any build possible, makes those classes reach the same (or an even higher) peak of a specific build compared to the class intended to use them. If you reverse the rolls and try to copy a deity build on another class, you won’t even get 80% of the results. Only exception might be (fast) ultimate raiding because of innate crit boost.

[primal dew]

My proposition is rather about dispersing the power (switch temps into active apex skills, make choose between def/att apex skill (1 turn) or combined (DC) for 2 turns). Nerf horde content. Not nerf raid content (ultima dara/seq would remain same ...you wear aaru robe and channel still same....dursa/swash will be able to do t.att+++ instead of dc for free or cast it for turn. or less tankiness in hing ang raid, etc. etc., can continue why I wrote those points together...) I mean, some of them are trade off to hit stronger side of Deity, why not affect others.

As per Odie, Apex should be there to "break limits" - DC in 2 turns (single for seq or DUrsa) or t.att+++/t.mag+++ & t.def+++/t.res+++ (which already exist) in 1 turn (or 0 for DURsa) are all good and reasonable break limits rather than dmg skills (unusable on DUrsa anyway).

[buoyant shuttle]

apex should have a skill that gives +50% stats and is a different buff that multiplies with other stuff, to have something unique. Not an extra 1 turn DC imo

[dreamy crag]

Oh wait dursa passive, my bad

[mortal surge]

Thank you

[primal dew]

Then there is concern about even more stacking temps buffs, as it is original buff top to others. And I agree with that concern.

[deep harbor]

I still like the idea of Channel going 2 turns or making it give the T3 of respected offensive stat. Or two turns channel and a different skill for t3 entirely with apex since we have staying power

Replace on of the useless apex skills that aren't uhhh. "Limit breaking"

[dreamy crag]

so what does gods of aaru become

[deep harbor]

It still exists. Same old for other classes. The 2 turns essentially only affects Dursa

[dreamy crag]

because it becomes
dog for 2 turns chann
absolutely busted for stacking stats chann

[mortal surge]

Not entirely true if talking about horde. At some point - mel lvl - it's mandatory for some builds to use it to have some success on dung too

[primal dew]

#1390521880124981266 message
and several times more in this thread 😄

[deep harbor]

Alright I'm just suggesting what's been suggested before trying to get this back on track

[deep harbor]

I know, was more or less agreeing here

[ripe folio]

Or we just let it spiral, rename the thread to deity salt mines and start rage baiting people 😂

[deep harbor]

Did someone say salt!? 👀

[runic osprey]

Deity don't need nerfs. The passives can be a bit lackluster compared to the other classes. Seems balanced to me.

[dreamy crag]

oh no

[runic osprey]

https://tenor.com/view/oh-yeah-oh-yeah-gif-oh-yeah-meme-kool-aid-kool-aid-man-gif-18211119326397565445

[gaunt flicker]

And high anguish towers, which I personally think is more problematic

[ripe folio]

I’m guessing you’re still talking about anguish 1 towers?

[gaunt mica]

being king at those things on top of being amazing all around makes it kind of an outlier compared to the other classes though (but prob the same can be said about beo)

and the idea of buffing 3-4 other classes just to not nerf deity is kind of ridiculous imo

imo a jack of all trades class shouldnt be the best anywhere, that's the tradeoff being versatile

[spice sorrel]

Also stopped playing the game for the same reason. Havent touched the game in idk

Watching deity mains blaming beoH and gilga for deity’s strengths has been quite humorous for me at least 😆
(Im a rs main not beo or gilga)

[fickle cliff]

Is Deity still jack of all trades or even still intended to be that?

[ripe folio]

IMO it’s a jack of all trades snowball. Once it gets rolling it’s amazing. Lowkey always has been. The issue here is that anguish 2.0 is slowing everyone else down while deity kinda just keeps chugging

[deep harbor]

3-4? Nah 1-2

[deep harbor]

Been down this rabbit hole. Not point in even going further here

[worthy phoenix]

I think this sums it up. Once you've got the gear and the als the snowball becomes as big as you want it to. And other classes struggle more from their lack of stats/ passives that they mostly makes deity gilga and beo stand out. Deity isn't the best at everything only horde content. And endless but I think all classes should be capable of doing endless depth (they all are without orn gear)

[worthy phoenix]

Fyi it's been discussed that this wasn't a practical thing it was a challenge run at best then those same people went back to running around ang 24? To grind

[simple forum]

It’s interesting to see gilga being named next to deity / beo, because gilga is Not even close to be an equal compared to those classes.

[deep harbor]

Out of your mind

[worthy phoenix]

Raiding purposes it is. And it's better than realm/heretic in the current state. Summon wasnt named because it's the only class that does what it does

[deep harbor]

I also agree with Novax on that

[simple forum]

You two are fully representing the deity agenda lol

[worthy phoenix]

Remind me you don't play deity right? Or beo or gilga

[deep harbor]

? Not at all. I agreed to nerfs and tweaks multiple times but I'm still here to call a spade a spade

[mortal surge]

This thread is getting dumb

[deep harbor]

It's been dumb

[worthy phoenix]

And I myself have also agreed to several nerfs and trade offs

But other classes need to be buffed to a similar level as deity

[simple forum]

Feels like politics, people live in a different reality I guess

[worthy phoenix]

There's no reason to make deity who use to be worst class in game due to it being out performed no matter what back to being useless again.

[deep harbor]

Melvvv might be more Salty than me

[worthy phoenix]

I played deity and started ascending deity way before apex was even a concept to the devs

[simple forum]

In germany we call 70% of this thread a „Strohmann Argument“

[gaunt mica]

unfortunately this thread will just continue to go in circles as long as people cant agree, and they wont agree because people dont want to see their class nerfed. Just like every time any sort of nerf is proposed in orna community

[simple forum]

That wasn’t the design philosophy for CS/SS and it should not be the philosophy now

[worthy phoenix]

So there's 0 reason to back track as hard as the haters want. There are reasonable nerfs and other classes need buffs but it's fair to say we don't need to butcher a class because other casuals dislike their class choice

[deep harbor]

Almost every Deity here has given feedback on how to tune the class before. The issue is people bring in other classes to compare and then go nuh uh! (Including myself being guilty)

[mortal surge]

It's not like you can't see many nerf ideas on top of this thread 🙄

[simple forum]

Who is butchering the class lol

[gaunt mica]

Well it's getting buried by useless discussions like this

[mortal surge]

Indeed

[worthy phoenix]

Ss was quad scaling the reason it was nerfed was for that reason. And I've been saying ss needs nerfed off every class but gilga. At this point make ss3 part of the frenzy thing for gilgas that only they can use.

[worthy phoenix]

People like you who want half the passive removed and think we have double temp buffs up 99% of the time

[simple forum]

If 1 temp buff at a time or 60% permanent stat passive (after casting) instead of 100% is butchering the class in your eyes, we won’t find a compromise. That’s literally the floor in terms of a nerf

[worthy phoenix]

You want to nerf our scaling that we have to charge in battle

When every class has 100% passive capabilities

[earnest shore]

https://tenor.com/view/michael-jackson-comendo-picoca-gif-9669437860846841235

[mortal surge]

People playing Beo/gilga shitting as much on Deity when their class were strong since the beginning (Beo) of ANGUISH 1 and never had a ⬇️⬇️⬇️ moment since, or received their rework reaaaally quick (gilga) and were arguably on ang dungeons way better than Deity pre rework and not worst (people forget quick !) before 2hand powercreep telling here Deity mains are crying while we all offered some ideas to tune down some particular things is just.... Well no it's just usual thread sorry 🤷🏻‍♂️

All is on top of this thread, the rest is just close to non sense

[ripe folio]

Believe it or not I’ve agreed to several kinds of nerfs. It’s just that people keep saying wild things like remove apex from towers, -90% def/res nerf and nuking Dara’s passive to the floor

[worthy phoenix]

And 1 temp buffs at a time is a huge nerf in itself because all classes can easily get 2 without self casting it. I'm cool with making temp 3 att/mag a apex skill that would be a nerf to people who Wana click a total of 2 buttons the entire time. But for the rest of content that slows us down a turn minimum. But to make us have less than all but I think a total of 2 classes scaling that's a huge nerf. And that's beoh (20% passive) but even that is accompanied by hybrid monster. And I think one of the gilgas

The majority of deity players have agreed to some nerfs like temp 3 att/mag being an apex skill and removing the negative status effect fade chance from staying power or removing steadfast. As well as a bit of trade off for d.ara having same mag with less att and d.ursa having same att for less mag. Nerfing our scaling passive that we can't even start a battle at 20% with is killer for the class and on top of that making it so only 1 temp buff can proc at a time would make the class unplayable. Deity's are the only class with no apex gear that's usable because there are better options and the only class who hasn't gotten many option to buff the apex gain or power. Every other class has more gear options for their passives than deity and doesn't get punished for using one of those over mainstream builds.

[simple forum]

That’s factually wrong.

[simple forum]

Then you probably misunderstand the nerf suggestion, as long as you have 1 temp buff, the temp buff passive does not proc again. Ofc you can have more temp buffs up, just not buffed by the passive

[simple forum]

Deity has the option to wear and copy every build, seems like a fair tradeoff I guess. Scaling down the passive % (always on after cast) is needed

[gentle iron]

Even tho we can use every armor, we don't benefit the same from them as other classes, we don't really have any relevant gear made for the class specifically. Also since there is a lot of gear we can use we have to put way more time and effort farming those gears than the other classes, we can't really stock up scrolls for months to drop them in the event we need, because we mostly need stuff from every event.

[simple forum]

If you call having to farm more because you can wear more good gear a problem in terms of balancing, I don’t know how to respond

Temp buff stacking and dara passive nerf should be more then enough. It’s just ridiculous to have DC up for 14+ turns after casting (w amity)

[ripe folio]

So just to clarify you want to fine tune deity with a very reasonable 40% nerf and one buff at a time?

[worthy phoenix]

Show me every class who's passive is less than 100% additive with al

[simple forum]

Gila b 50/ h 55/60 can’t remember / u 20

[simple forum]

Yes, also it does need a nerf not fine tuning imo

[worthy phoenix]

So a class who's already strong has 60% and can keep up with d.ara/ursa without temp buffs

What else

[dreamy crag]

High al players laughing at Dara apex nerf (it does nothing for them)

[worthy phoenix]

Lmfao we al 50 deity's use it for dungeons to enjoy some anguish

[dreamy crag]

The al 200 overlords:

[ripe folio]

Just gonna slide this in real quick

[worthy phoenix]

@simple forum hmm that shows 120

[simple forum]

You the type of guy to believe Dara had 200% before the image fix

[worthy phoenix]

With an additional 15% for offhand

[worthy phoenix]

I think you're projecting here

Also gilga has CD on top of the passive for stats so if build properly you can do damage cap ss3 and then CD damage cap again before the raid had a turn

[simple forum]

Im going to exit this discussion because this

[dreamy crag]

Cinema

[worthy phoenix]

And that's maybe 2-3 turns for an entire raid on gilga

[ripe folio]

You’re exiting cause you got fact checked 🤣

[worthy phoenix]

Okay so do 0 ward and 100% ward check damage with same buffs

[simple forum]

Nah because we talkin deity and he screams „bUt gIlGa aNd bEo“

Have a good one bois im out

[ripe folio]

Hold up weren’t you just trying to clown me for believing what’s on the screen?

[dreamy crag]

Power between classes is relative

[dreamy crag]

Yes

[ripe folio]

https://tenor.com/view/cinema-gif-5935759059195122434

[dreamy crag]

on and off passive

Idk what cactus base res is

Yeah it's probably not 61%

[worthy phoenix]

@simple forum

[worthy phoenix]

Test on Odin someone knows the def res stats

[dreamy crag]

I'm good

Can't be bothered

[worthy phoenix]

Lol

[ripe folio]

Guys leave him alone 😂 he wants to leave, let him

[worthy phoenix]

After he is enlightened

[gaunt flicker]

It's hands down the best class for efficient tower shards gains. You can zoom through towers a little faster with other classes but deity lets you pump up the anguish.The safety and power that doubling your stats for free on any difficult fight is and always has been overtuned

[deep harbor]

Idk why you keep pinging me? I'm not arguing with you anymore so please stop. Thread has derailed enough

[gaunt flicker]

I'm just pointing out what deity is strong at, since you seem to have missed a pretty big area of their advantage over other classes in your previous post

[deep harbor]

I haven't missed anything besides why you keep bothering me after I essentially told you twice to leave it and I don't want to argue about it anymore since it doesn't affect what this thread is trying to do. Either get with tweaks and nerfs or go away. Trying to recoup here even a little bit and this doesn't help

[gaunt flicker]

Buddy this is a discussion thread, and if you post in it people are going to respond and discuss things with you. You don't have to post here if you don't like that. And you did in fact miss a major advantage of deity which I brought up again since it was conveniently being left out.

[deep harbor]

Enjoy the block (or what little I can). Stop bringing up Ang 1 stuff please. Have a nice day.

[gaunt flicker]

Double stats for free in most tower fights is still very relevant in ang 2.0. How could it not be?