wiki-chat

[dusk star]

Is

That

Lol

[pale dock]

le gasp

[dusk star]

Le gasp

[stark crag]

Some questions:
-Are these names the ones used internally by the game?
-What would be an example of a Large Sustain versus a Huge Sustain? The naming here is really similar, and I'm wondering if "Medium" is appropriate instead of Large for the 2nd tier of S scans

[jolly yarrow]

those bigger s scan are usually only in thunderdomes

[trim grove]

afaik yeah thats the name used (although i could be thinking about something else)

and example of a "huge" sustain would be the ones in e2's class 6 alarms, the 2nd and 3rd alarm in r4e1, etc

[jolly yarrow]

yeah: not very common otherwise

i can look at datablocks later, but a lot of the internal names are a little silly

[trim grove]

i think the large S scans actually might be the rarest

I cant think of one rn for some reason

[pale dock]

r4c1?

r8b2s?

no wait r8b2s would be small fuck

[dusk star]

Thunderdomes? Actually don’t answer I wanna experience that for myself

[stark crag]

Asking because on the R4E1 page, likely need to update Step 4 and Step 5, I'm positive that the 2nd and 3rd alarms of the Error aren't 25 second scans with a full team, want it to match Bioscans page as currently those are listed as Large instead of Huge

[stark crag]

R6D3 Overload reactor shutdown within the mixed alarm there maybe?

its definitely not used often

[jolly yarrow]

there’s like 60 scans and like 9 you see in every alarm

[trim grove]

yes those are 100 second alarms

[trim grove]

huh?

[pale dock]

r4c1 overload door, think its the first S in the game too

[grizzled crater]

slendi what

are you thinking of R4B3

[pale dock]

maybe tbh

[trim grove]

yeah i was gonna say

[pale dock]

r4 confuses me

[stark crag]

awesome, appreciate if you are able to look when you get the chance

I don't mind cleaning up the articles to define Small Large or Huge S Scans, just as long as we know its the correct name

[jolly yarrow]

the small s scan is called CP_Bioscan_sustained_small_RequireAll

i'm not able to pull up my unity project to check the time it takes for the scan speed values but those look correct

[urban olive]

Are scan speed boosters good

To deal with those or does it not make much of a difference

[jolly yarrow]

they are generally very good

[jolly yarrow]

but like, it’s a mouthful. small s scan is sufficient imo

[stark crag]

yep just small S scan

[trim grove]

pretty broken boosters

[cyan coral]

hm I could've sworn my manual timings of the scans led me to think the timing for huge S scans in duo was 120s and not 125s, time to look at a video again ig

[trim grove]

you're right

they are 125

[cyan coral]

So am I right and they're 120s, or am I wrong and they're 125s? I don't speak in contradictions

[dusk star]

Lol

[stark crag]

@trim grove @grizzled crater so I just went into R4B3 Overload with a full team and those are both 100s alarms, is Large Sustain just unused then? I even checked R6D3 for that mixed Sustain Alarm and those are small sustains

[trim grove]

nvm i thought you said they ARE 125

yeah they are 125 you are wrong

[trim grove]

you could search for an instance of that scan type in the data block

[stark crag]

alright, looking into it. gotta learn sometime. R4B3 page will need to be updated

[trim grove]

im down to test level shit for the wiki

i have time

[stark crag]

yeah I was mainly wondering if amongst all the speedrunning experience if offhand you could name an alarm with a Large since sustains are the absolute slowest scans aside room or T scans

but every single one I've been able to think of at the moment is just either Small or Huge

[trim grove]

im fairly certain they exist

[stark crag]

they're far more rare than I thought they would be

[trim grove]

if i can get a list of levels that need double checking for these sppecific things i can go through and get the data

[stark crag]

Types of Sustain Scans:

Small: CP_Bioscan_sustained_small_RequireAll Small S Scan
Medium: CP_Bioscan_sustained_Medium_RequireAll Medium S Scan
Huge: CP_Bioscan_sustained_Huge_RequireAll Huge S Scan
MegaHuge: CP_Bioscan_sustained_MegaHuge MegaHuge S Scan
Thunderdome: CP_Bioscan_sustained_geo_scan Room Scan

Large is not mentioned in the datablock

@trim grove can you test R8B3's sustain(s)

[trim grove]

the 3 different ones?

it should say on the wiki

[stark crag]

yea

[trim grove]

geo is probably full zone, geo meaning geode

[stark crag]

alright, do you agree with those exact durations

[autumn girder]

its probably the one thats specifically on the floor

[stark crag]

i dont have access to that level

[autumn girder]

unless thats huge S scan?

is r8d1s green shit a sustain

[stark crag]

T-Scans are CP_Bioscan_Big_Moving

[stark crag]

CP_Bioscan_sustained_geo_No_Graphics_R8D1

[autumn girder]

funny

[stark crag]

this is where I think wiki has "Huge" from

CP_Bioscan_sustained_Huge_RequireAll

R8E1 is MegaHuge

[trim grove]

what is the last scan in r8e1

the fucking like 1 second s scan

[stark crag]

CP_Bioscan_sustained_MegaHuge_RequireAll_R8E1

[undone compass]

guys why is the snatcher infobox picture the gangnam style video

and why have i only just found out about this

[trim grove]

LMAO

[jolly yarrow]

oh?

[autumn girder]

I think I saw that snatcher once

[autumn girder]

he snatcher bugged jish

[undone compass]

https://gtfo.wiki.gg/wiki/Snatcher

[autumn girder]

LOL

[stark crag]

This feels like something DarkEmperor would make

[jolly yarrow]

[pale dock]

i guess it's the easiest way to put a horizontal enemy on a vertical image

[undone compass]

yeah true

[indigo quiver]

@grizzled crater Do you recall which specific scans the scan timings were taken from when I added them from you

[stark crag]

OK, so within ChainedPuzzleTypeDataBlock sustain alarm types have these following PersistentIDs:
53 46 13 62 48 49 50 32 17 33 36 35 59 44 40 37 34 47 18 14 16

Most of these are R8 or thunderdome specific room scans and the R8B3 special ones

14 corresponds to Small S Scans
13 corresponds to what appears to be another S Scan entry, just with a default name
32 corresponds to Medium S Scans
17 and 18 corresponds to Huge S Scans, R5B3 Secondary and R5C2 Overload
The rest correspond to MegaHuge S Scans

Within ChainedPuzzleDataBlock, which actually utilize those IDs above in the field PuzzleType, I have mentions for:
13 14 (these two are used by far the most, which lines up with how often Small S Scans are found)
48 49 50 16 17 33 35 40 37 34 47 59 18 46

PuzzleType 32, the ever elusive Medium S Scan, is only found in what appears to be a Class 6 Mixed Alarm and is not part of its own dedicated alarm or label on any door, and another alarm in R8E2

PuzzleType 17 and 18, the Huge S Scan, are the early versions of Thunderdomes that were introduced in R5, and before R6 introduced the fancy version with graphics that display on the doorways instead of just being displayed on the floor

All those other PuzzleTypes are just various thunderdomes, R8B3 special ones, or narrative scans

[stark crag]

We can note that Medium S Scan exists only in what appears to be 1-2 Mixed Alarms, and not by itself
In R5, Huge S Scans are how they did the Thunderdomes, and only 2 entries of Huge as a PuzzleType exist
In R6 onwards, Thunderdomes started getting assigned unique IDs for each one that was made
MegaHuge as a Sustain type appears to be mainly a narrative assigned Sustain type in R8

So that leaves us with just normal Sustain Scans as PuzzleType 13, which are the Class I Sustain Alarms with 100 seconds (with a full team standing in them) that we all know so well

[jolly yarrow]

that about tracks with my modding cheat sheet

[stark crag]

So using this, PuzzleType 17 is just the longer thunderdome pre R6?

[jolly yarrow]

[stark crag]

I'm glad it tracks, just want to doublecheck my notes with that cheat sheet

[jolly yarrow]

you could look in chained puzzle db to see if puzzle type 17 is used. and then level layout or warden objective for the particular level that has that cp

[stark crag]

Oh I see it now

Puzzle type 17 is R5B3 Secondary, puzzle type 18 is R5C2 Overload

[jolly yarrow]

ah those ones

[stark crag]

adjusted my notes to correct for that

yeah OK, that now lines up perfectly with the cheat sheet

[jolly yarrow]

if you want to exact times for specific player counts. i can’t get that anytime soon. you have to go into unity to look at them

they’re not in datablocks

[stark crag]

Gotcha, I'm just glad we now know what the deal is regarding the Sustain scan type names

Now comes the question on how to translate that to the wiki pages

[jolly yarrow]

as long as the normal scans and cluster scans and small sustain scan is on the wiki page for bioscans, i think that’s sufficient. and then for certain levels such as r5c2 a mention somewhere of the scan lengths

[stark crag]

Small Sustain scans exist in a lot of places
Normal Sustain Scans exist in a lot of places, but they are large, could keep that vernacular to discern better
Medium exists in 2 places only in Mixed, and until we get exact times, they would be less than Normal Sustain Scans
The rest are Thunderdomes

Editing the Bioscans page now to reflect these names and notes, not editing times atm

[stark crag]

Updated. I did not add the game files names for the room scan thunderdomes, as knowing they are called huge s scans and megahuge s scans serves little purpose when they're basically the same thing, only with duration being the difference based on what that mission/scan wants it to be

Unless we would want to note that Room Scans are Sustain scans

[trim grove]

I think separating them makes sense as it’s easier for beginners to understand. They function the same, but aren’t the same kind of thing. But I think it’s worth noting for them that completion time varies per level

And that each level has a unique one

[stark crag]

alright, I can add that to the page as well EDIT: done

[stark crag]

@wary hollow thank you for that wiki edit I caught that last night, but was too tired to get back to my desk and log back in. Looks great

And on this note, with the updated Sustain Scan information, cleanup should be far easier with less articles to fix since it was just that page with technically correct but incorrectly classified names. What people encounter almost all of the time is Small or Large if not a room scan so it would just be designating if it's Small or Large in most instances, and some pages already have Large Sustain. I just edited the R4E1 again, to reflect that the first alarm and the last in Main are Small Sustain alarms

[sly narwhal]

You are welcome 🙏

[limber canopy]

could someone fact check that the T scan in R6C1 zone 152 spawns hybrids? didn't see a single one both times i did it

[stark crag]

On this note, what does the T in T Scan even stand for

[limber canopy]

probably travelling

[stark crag]

in the code I saw them as Mobile/Moving

[stark crag]

this makes a lot of sense. Travelling, Transport, Transfer... Traveling/Travelling feels strongest

I can test R6C1 real quick

[stark crag]

yes they do spawn, just RNG between the smalls and Flyers

I got one immediately

[limber canopy]

i guess i just got real good rng to not get any 2 times in a row

[pale dock]

it does rarely i believe, i think i remember seeing one when i played it

teehee

i should read before answering

[stark crag]

Yep, you did. There are 0 enemies sleeping in that room by default, anything that spawns is from the alarm

[limber canopy]

if there's an objective with no enemies (R6C3 sec), for the drop down enemy list just put "none" or not put the enemy list for it

what i mean is either
(main enemies)
| secondary enemies
none
(overload enemies)

or
(main enemies)
(overload enemies)

[trim grove]

its worth it to say that there are no enemies in a sector

/zone

[dusk star]

^ frosty (chicken jockey) is right

[limber canopy]

guys the nightmare babies dont have a page, very important i swear

[stark crag]

@verbal knot Just added a section to bug tech support page if you want to take a look. I figure it should cover the supermajority of the most common issues for people visiting the page

[regal bluff]

Does the nightmare giant have one, it's the most important enemy

[limber canopy]

yes, the potato does have one

[regal bluff]

Potato shall get his page

[limber canopy]

i yet again have noticed something of utmost importance, "potato" doesn't redirect to the nightmare giant page

[sly narwhal]

go create the redirect then 🙏

[limber canopy]

i dont know how though :(

[sly narwhal]

https://gtfo.wiki.gg/wiki/Potato?action=edit&redlink=1
create the page, with this as the content: ```
#REDIRECT [[Nightmare Giant]]

[limber canopy]

it exists now

[sly narwhal]

[[Potato]]

[rough widget]

https://gtfo.wiki.gg/wiki/Potato

[sly narwhal]

🎉

[limber canopy]

should i make redirects for every alias given to each enemy since rn only some actually redirect to their page

[undone compass]

probably a good idea yeah

[pale dock]

probably only the ones u see most used

redirecting to a spitter as wallsack idk if its very useful

[limber canopy]

I kinda do call them wallsacks…

[undone compass]

at least its not moisties

[dusk star]

[[BBC]]

[rough widget]

https://gtfo.wiki.gg/wiki/BBC?action=edit&redlink=1

[dusk star]

Damn

Would be funi

[limber canopy]

big black chargers

[limber canopy]

[[BBC]]

[rough widget]

https://gtfo.wiki.gg/wiki/BBC

[limber canopy]

it is funny

i finished adding a bunch of redirects for enemy pages for what i thought was actually used/ a name beginners would make up

[winged charm]

I will forever use only that link from now on to access the wiki.

[limber canopy]

halfway done with strategy sections in R6 🎉

[limber canopy]

i don't know if it's a case of me having crazy rng again, but in my 2 R6D1 runs i haven't seen a single enemy spawn south of the Class VI M Alarm inside of Zone 85, can someone check that?

[trim grove]

Their chance to spawn there might be very small

If you need to you can ask tru as he can get the spawn percentage chance

[pale dock]

dont they spawn in ur room at the sides?

[undone compass]

@indigo quiver

[indigo quiver]

Can check later, should also release my spawn analyser so other people can do it

[stark crag]

I would be very interested in utilizing the tool, the more accurate the wiki the better

[dusk star]

W’s

[undone compass]

how would we feel about having audio versions of non audio logs?

[indigo quiver]

https://thunderstore.io/c/gtfo/p/tru0067/SpawnAnalysis/ now released, this is the "mod" to find out spawn probabilities

[indigo quiver]

Oh I didn't realise which alarm this is.

This alarm just uses spawn points, they spawn in the top level of really big room, towards the corners

spawn points:

[dusk star]

that one meme TTS bot lol

[limber canopy]

oh that's why the defenses i set up both times didn't do shit...

[dusk star]

its not a bad shout

[humble oracle]

Like TTS? It could be good, though I'm not sure how valuable it'd be without the entire website being able to be read in TTS for disability purposes.

(Because they'd have to find their way to those logs in the first place)

[dusk star]

I think it might be more so that people can listen whilst they read (or do smth else)

Idk

[pale dock]

tts idk how i feel about it, it wouldn't be able to emote very well for some logs i guess, but the alt is finding someone that has a good mic and voice kdmsk

[undone compass]

Well the reason I brought up the idea is cuz I’m practicing my voice work by reading logs (killing two birds with one stone) so I’m gonna have recordings of me reading all the logs

My idea was putting the audio through some distortion things to make it sound roboty and shit so it’s not just a monotone British guy

It’s not exactly useful but kinda adds a little life if you want to be read to

[dark citrus]

Imho as Long as its Not AI i am down for it

[undone compass]

But also I haven’t figured out a good way to filter the voice yet so yknow

[undone compass]

Oh yeah If anyone suggested ai I’d shut it down

[dusk star]

^lol dm this

[limber canopy]

not the bri'ish!

[undone compass]

I mean tts is different to ai imo

[dusk star]

🤷‍♂️

[undone compass]

Still don’t want to use it but it’s not immoral like ai is

[dusk star]

fair enough

(soy why is "halp i haz no frens & am soloing disabled?)

[undone compass]

its been disabled for years

cuz people would just sit in it and not do anything and it would cause arguments

[dusk star]

fair enough

[dark citrus]

Just make it into a "Created Team of 1" sorta VC.

[undone compass]

bot dev would actually have to make that a feature and something tells me he has better things to do rn lmao

[limber canopy]

we missing resource amounts in R6D2

[dark citrus]

I am thinking about adding a Line about Flyers teleporting in your room If you are too far away from them, but Not Sure If its intended or R6D2 Jank

[limber canopy]

when would that ever happen except when they spawn above you in the secondary alarm

[dark citrus]

If for some reason you try to Kite the Flyer alarm

[limber canopy]

im not going to consider kiting as an actual strat for individual missions that would need to been on a general strategies page or something

[dark citrus]

Nah i mean to the Flyer page

[limber canopy]

oh ok

haven't seen them teleport to me in R6B1 so it's probably R6D2 jank

[pale dock]

i never seen them do that

even in r6b1 which u outrun easy

[limber canopy]

R6D2 has jank and the R6D2 page was janky to update.

[trim grove]

if you need resource amounts for any level dm me

[limber canopy]

R6D3 was worse somehow 😭

[limber canopy]

a bit cursed but it works

[pale dock]

theres not any other way it couldve been done its ok ksdmkms

and i think it looks good ngl

[limber canopy]

gotta wait until i actually finish the rest of R6 before i do the remaining strategy sections lol

[jolly yarrow]

nice, though

[trim grove]

something that could be added to the kraken page is that all of its attacks are based on LOS and if you hide away from the kraken and dont make LOS it will never use its attacks

this doesnt include flyers and those will spawn no matter what

[dark citrus]

Added the Foam values to foam consumables so peeps dont have to Wonder how many they need to foam certain enemies, appereantly it was Not on the Wiki page

[[C-Foam]]

[rough widget]

https://gtfo.wiki.gg/wiki/C-Foam

[dark citrus]

For now Just a Main Page tweak, once i am Back Home will edit Further Infos in and other foam adjacent pages

[dusk star]

Is the foam amount per enemies on the wiki?

Like x amount of foam to foam an enemy

And how long it’s foamed for

[dark citrus]

Yes

The Chart bellow the C-Foam enemy section

[dusk star]

W’s

[jolly yarrow]

where does los origin start from on the kraken?

[trim grove]

not entirely sure

cconsole might show that idk

[jolly yarrow]

no i don’t think so

[dark citrus]

his face

[pale dock]

i see that we are doing enemy types two ways, with a section on the page or in the orange box of the right

which one should be the one

[stark crag]

if we talk about enemy types do we list animation sets, like how Shadows are never found crawling and use many alternate animation sets that make them mimic how Hybrids or Shooters move

[pale dock]

i mean more in like in level pages

like R1A1 and etc

[stark crag]

oh

[pale dock]

sorry shouldve specified ksmdkm

i didnt realized how vague i sounded

[limber canopy]

i'm changing it to the orange box on any page i do since it's like that in R1

[jolly yarrow]

it’s been bothering me that the [[Objectives]] page kinda clumps some objectives together

[rough widget]

https://gtfo.wiki.gg/wiki/Objectives

[jolly yarrow]

namely missing: gather terminal, corrupted uplink (i think it’s worth separating from uplinks), empty/other objective

and some levels have chained objectives

some items like mem stick and r8 datacubes/microdrive might be better labeled as global team items, bc they don’t technically go into the player backpack inventory (on the objective items hud).

[stark crag]

they function pretty much like colored keys

[jolly yarrow]

not necessarily

the player with a keycard has to unlock the door

anyone can insert datacubes or the memstick

[pale dock]

the thing is that "other/empty obj" can be just clumped with "clear a path" or "terminal command" as per most of rundown 8 uses those two

r8b2? command, r8d1? path, r8d2? collect item

also the datacubes in r8 migt act like the drive, but also as an objective item

is not so worth to separate the page just to specify that technicality

[jolly yarrow]

fair enough

gather terminal ≠ terminal command obj

r6d2

[pale dock]

id argue those are also commands tbh, and if not- that is still the only time that it appears in that format, with only r8b2 being sort of similar?

[jolly yarrow]

i’m more referring to the objective type for the levels’ objective datablock

it’d give me some peace of mind to have the exact enum somewhere

they are internally different objectives

[trim grove]

bio having a max 50m range for pinging enemies should probably be added

[winged charm]

https://gtfo.wiki.gg/wiki/Schaeffer in this page here the info is based on OG, rather than Alt. Level names should be changed or clarified. Fun fact: it just caused frosty to waste quite a bit of time in eva's bingo xd

[pale dock]

whats diff now

i thought it was just maddox name crossed out again

also that section is based on OG thats the point theres a section below talkiing about ALT

[winged charm]

Ehhh, imma modify it quickly to make the distinction it is original rundown 6, as there definitely is reason for confusion

[dusk star]

Whiteboard isn’t hidden? You have to go to the hideout to actually complete the objective and it’s not really ”hidden” like the wiki described it

Edit: I misread disregard this message

[limber canopy]

defo needed cause i was confused looking at that screenshot why it said CX and not BX

[fallen vessel]

Pretty sure all names were crossed out in OG? The only error I can see is that it's labeled CX and not BX

[trim grove]

The problem isn’t that it’s named CX because that’s what it is but that it isn’t obvious it’s talking about OG R6

[pale dock]

then we only have to change "During OG Rundown 6"

[dusk star]

And maybe put ”during ALT://” before the ALT text about it?

And maybe have it link to a page which explains ALT and OG universes

[undone compass]

Just a heads up guys, the wiki is no longer "official" cuz the devs dont actually have any involvement in it

[cyan coral]

time to get someone to put their signature on the landing page

[jolly yarrow]

soy’s signature

[dark citrus]

Just Upload a Pic of yourself in a Business Suit, should be Official enough

[dusk star]

And we can’t even get like Calle to sign off on it?

[undone compass]

Calle is the one who told me to remove it

[dusk star]

Oh

Well

Unfort

[jolly yarrow]

does that mean we can call it the official unofficial wiki

[winged charm]

it is the official official unnofficial wiki since soy agrees with this wiki

[pale dock]

i thought to be official it just had to be labeled as so

without involvement

but

oh well

:[

[undone compass]

Yeah I thought so too but eh

[sly narwhal]

It's the least unofficial GTFO wiki :^)

[stark crag]

@undone compass is the fandom supposed to still have "official wiki" on top then too?

[undone compass]

nope but we cant do nuthin about that really

[stark crag]

gotcha

[humble oracle]

#Legal

[dusk star]

Too much resources prolly

On just nothingburger ™️

[dusk star]

Have y’all planned anything on redirecting [[r5a3]] (ie levels you’ve typed with lowercase letters) to the proper R5A3 page?

[rough widget]

https://gtfo.wiki.gg/wiki/R5a3?action=edit&redlink=1

[dark citrus]

Ig you can Just make it Not Case sensitive

[sly narwhal]

nothing stopping anyone who wants to make those redirects and has the energy to do so from making them

[dusk star]

And there isn’t a general way to do it for every?

Like automatically

[stark crag]

@humble oracle Wanted to ask, is mentioning despite being speculative, to clear out confusion that Infection Mechanic isn’t NAM-V, that the only (naturally found) enemy that causes infection could be mold/spore based? Noting the log which mentions Santonian mentioned pathogens found within Garganta, plural

Spitters have a spread to them where they are anchored on the wall much like various molds, and when they explode, aside the infectious spit, they also create a small cloud of particulates that resembles spores, which is common even outside Overgrown environments

[dark citrus]

"Nam-V is a fungus"

[trim grove]

THE ZOMBIES ARE COMING

[dark citrus]

I think in R8 we have Seen a couple of corpses that were very similar to spitters, so i would assume they are still related to Nam-V even though they Look funky

[stark crag]

they definitely coexist at a minimum, for sure. Spitters don't trigger off angry sleepers, but can alert them if players and the spitter are really close to a sleeper

which corpses stand out as examples?

(in case anyone was wondering, it's about adding more details to Spitter and Infection pages descriptions)

[dark citrus]

Need some time to Boot Up everything

[dark citrus]

Tbh they do shreik pretty loudly, No Wonder they would ge annoyed by that

[pale dock]

do u mean the r8b1 ones

cuz if so thats not the complex is a different dimension and it could just be how they mutated in there

same as how nightmares seem to be such a different breed of sleepers, disconnected from them

[stark crag]

oh yeah, those ball things do kind of resemble spitters

[dark citrus]

mutated into...there is no end stage for that in nightmare dimension

[stark crag]

I do consider nightmares as a different breed, since the game does set a precedence of nightmare dimensions vs more typical

but nightmares begin to be found more commonly ofc

[pale dock]

i mean samee as flyers

teeleported into our dimension cuz wee goofy

[dark citrus]

personally i would say the difference is more in the span of time. i could consider that over time they twist into being nightmares, since shaeffer already explained that some worlines time flows at a different rate

same could be for the flyers, after they evolve for thousands of years adapting to the harsh enviroments of the sands

although with them its kinda whack

[stark crag]

worth noting too that Nightmares don't attack normal sleepers, they see each other as one and the same collective

[dark citrus]

we do see some sleeper corpses there, tho it is unclear if they are left behind by another team or them cannibalising eachother

[stark crag]

hmm, good point

[dark citrus]

could speculate that it was the team originally sent there with the datacubes, that inevitably met its demise

but we have no info to work with

[stark crag]

Yeah, don't wanna get too speculative. Just observing what's directly visible and/or heard, which is what led me to the whole "Spitters/Infection seem to be based in ecology much like various types of mold"

[dark citrus]

i was thinking to add a balance history to the weapons

but does anyone even have old weapon stats?

the "DMR:

• Slightly increased ammo capacity
• Increased fire rate
• Shorter recoil
• Shorter time to aim"
  in the patchnotes is not helpfull

[trim grove]

if someone wanted to put in the effort its easy to get them

you can just download the depot

for each version lmao

[dark citrus]

isnt it only for the big updates? like release R1 etc

[trim grove]

no they did smaller updates with weapon changes

[dark citrus]

if its every single update then its going to be a pain to find all the right version codes

[trim grove]

and also some weapon changes arent even in the patch notes

[trim grove]

you just go on steamdb

[dark citrus]

great. now i know what i will do tonight

[humble oracle]

Entirely unknown. We can only guess at what the poppers are.

[rocky wolf]

dm'd you something to help that

[dark citrus]

Are my dms even Open? I dont demember

[rocky wolf]

well i was able to send it
it's probably just a message request thing

[dark citrus]

Oh the manifests. I have already found them on Steam DB, but still thank you!

Rn my biggest concern is actually getting the values Out of the Game since i am a coding potato lmao

[stark crag]

speaking of potato, I have just updated the Nightmare Giant page

I was thinking we should get a screenshot of it in the mission it's found in, the current screenshot seems to be from someone who spawned it in R7C2 starting room (which to be fair is a well lit room)

If for any other reason that there's only 1 of them in the game, and it's in that one alarm

[[Nightmare Giant]]

[rough widget]

https://gtfo.wiki.gg/wiki/Nightmare_Giant

[trim grove]

i think having that picture as the main one is fine

can add additional ones tho

[pale dock]

it would be pretty hard making it as good as that main one tbh

cuz its a pitch black zone and ur in an alarm

not rlly worth

[stark crag]

I can run around with cconsole god on with an LRF and see what I can get

[pale dock]

even with an LRF the main pic on it itss a well lit room

if u want u can take one and add it to the gallery

as in like (the room where thee Nightmare Giant is fought)

also checking the changes i see "rewritten immortal page as plural"

but like not even the tank page iis written like that

so like huh?

[stark crag]

Was going to change that page next. The Immortal’s page was written as though there was only 1 Immortal in the game, a reocurring nemesis to the likes of say Mr. X from Resident Evil 2

But there’s several immortals shown in-game

[pale dock]

i mean its just a matter of ur talking about one enemy, and i think it looks much better talking like "The striker" rather than "Strikers", at least in some sections

like the intro, the appearance

[stark crag]

I mean, I didn’t change every instance, same applies to Nightmare Giant page

But I see what you are getting at and I think I can reword better

[pale dock]

i dont think a reword is necessary id tbh just, revert the immortal page and then only change a few details
i think it just looks more ominous, more elegant, better when u say "The immortal" in some parts

maybe im being like too picky

[stark crag]

I wouldn’t revert, I added and cleaned up a few more details regarding Trivia and behavior description. I’ll edit the page now

[stark crag]

@pale dock

check page now

is this more in line with what you envisioned

[pale dock]

yeah i tihnk that looks better

sorry for makin u rewrite it kmskdm

[stark crag]

no, you brought up a valid concern, and I changed the possessives to read more cleanly so people dont think theres only 1 immortal and it still lines up with other pages

the Immortal versus The Immortal, an Immortal

the only enemy theres actually one of is Mega mom and Nightmare Giant

[sly narwhal]

There's a git repo with the GTFO datablocks in it (forgotten where exactly it is, I think there's a link to it in the HTML comments on some of the weapon articles on the wiki), look at the revision history of the ArchetypeDataBlocks.json file for the previous internal stats of the weapons.

Granted, you may need to do some sleuthing to figure out which weapon is which, and do some Maths to translate some of those stats into actually useful ones (like the shot delay and the bullet cost stats), but that might save you the hassle of trying to extract the files from the game again

I think there's also that spreadsheet by rayolot72(?) which may have had some of the older stats as well? I forgor

Found it. https://github.com/UntiIted/OriginalDataBlocks/blob/master/ArchetypeDataBlock.json

Oldest revision on there is from April 2021 (might be from R4 extension?), looks like you'll need to manually extract the stats from older versions yourself (unless there's another repo with the older stuff or something)

[zealous bay]

Nerd shit^

[sly narwhal]

true.

[stark crag]

Kinda feel like adding that Nightmare Baby Striker page. They are actually different than normal Baby Strikers; they don't have a head, just like Nightmare Giant, only a back multiplier

they also appear to be lithopedions

[dark citrus]

Nah they are Just a Human Body compressed into a ball

[stark crag]

I see it now, though it is in a fetal position

I feel like this page would be another way to differentiate the new wiki, as neither has had a nightmare baby striker page. Wanted to bounce the idea off of everyone before I just go create a whole new article and grabbing screenshots

[limber canopy]

when i asked about that i got fish reacted

[pale dock]

i got cool images about nbabiies but idk how

useful it is to make a page about it

like the ngiant has one cuz its a very unique enemy even if it appears only once, acts somewhat like a boss

nbaabies just literally appear for u to die but i guess in an alarm too but

i mean

idk as u decide

[stark crag]

yeah I really like the Nightmare Giant's premise, even if it isn't a huge threat where it is found. I partly think that because there's just one of them; imagine if there was a few of them or a large sustain scan where you don't want to move, and with the very long and persistent barrage, you'd suddenly have a really tanky high threat

[stark crag]

please do show

[pale dock]

teehee

[stark crag]

hmm, first one is best

but we may want a different angle

[verbal knot]

the roombas are real?

[pale dock]

but these ones move weird

[dark citrus]

fun fact: the brown thing is just a shell, its just a baby striker wearing a costume

technically they do have a head like any other nightmare, its just hard to hit because of the body hitbox

[stark crag]

yeah, it's kinda funny there is just a normal baby striker in there

they have no head hitbox though, just a back multiplier designated by the lines for angle

(if it had a head there would be a red sphere in this example)

their "back" is actually that black spot between the folded limbs

correction

they have a head, but you can never hit it

[dark citrus]

discord just shat itself and decided to do a update

[stark crag]

it's completely enclosed inside the biggest green sphere (had to noclip)

[dark citrus]

i tested it with a slash with knife. here is the comparison with a baby and another baby slashed at the back

honestly no idea why it dealt even more damage since i did it from the front

[stark crag]

normal baby striker for comparison

[stark crag]

unsure, testing on my end

[dark citrus]

good that we came to the same conclusion

[dark citrus]

i am on my laptop, so probably since i used touch pad it could have held the charge just a slightly bit to increase the damage

[stark crag]

that's what I wanted to doublecheck, since I've done that too. getting a solid 2 damage from slashing with knife on nightmare baby striker from front

[dark citrus]

i noclipped inside of him

[stark crag]

oh, yep

valid hitbox for a head

just cant hit it without noclipping

I agree with you

[pale dock]

im encountering a dilema

wait i mightve talked about this already ho,d on

ok no but kinda
basically ive been putting the enemy types of a mission in the template of the side, but for missions that have * to the enemies [like for example saying Shadows* (Shadows only spawn from Scout waves)]

i cannot put those in as the template only allows me to list them

im not sure if i should just clump up all the enemies or do something more

[dusk star]

Id prolly do a ”specials” section where its enemies with special req needing to be meet for them to appear

And just what the req is

And like a link to the enemy page

Nothing too fancy I’d say

(Idk if this is feasible with the format)

[grizzled crater]

Just saw this

But iirc infinite screaming scout bug has a vanilla fix (once it happens)

Would need to be tested/confirmed. but appearantly cfoaming the scout helps?

[stark crag]

In your experience, is there a particular mission/set of conditions that has a tendency to trigger it? I've personally never had it happen even vanilla, happy to add if I can reproduce it

[grizzled crater]

It seems to be most likely to happen on r7d1 (ovl) and r8c1 (main)

but Ive also only had it twice ever

[stark crag]

alright, R7D1 is likely the fastest of those two. I can just walk into ovl and just shoot at the ceiling (will be testing solo)

[pale dock]

i tried on r7d1 and it didnt do nothing

and i was host, 3 bot run

[stark crag]

oh you got it there already?

[pale dock]

when i was trying to get my cool pic u helped me with

its very easy to activate scout screaming bug if u open the ov and then wakee it up

not sure what triggers it- i dont think we know in general

but i had it 3 4 times in a row

[stark crag]

we could definitely at least add that it has a tendency to happen on those particular missions

[pale dock]

yeh

[stark crag]

#831651015388037171 message

This is straight from the creator of ScoutScreamFix, I'll add the details now EDIT: added

[stark crag]

@pale dock Can we add redirects to the Big Charger, Big Shooter, and Big Shadow pages and or change the page names and alias list?

Shadow Giant is the most common name I can see historically, to the point where renaming the page could be in order; really no one uses Big Shadow as a name, that's only the internal name, Striker_Big_Shadow

Big Charger is used somewhat, but Giant Charger/Charger Giant feels more correct. Striker_Big_Bullrush is their internal name

Big Shooter is the most common community name for these enemies, Giant Shooter being the second. No one uses Shooter Giant

My point being, you can't find these pages if you don't specifically use Big Shadow, Big Charger, or Big Shooter in the searchbar

[trim grove]

I think these names are there for consistency

Because like, the most common names for Big Charger are probably BBC and Giant Charger, and one of the most common names for Big shooter being Chicken

I think you should still be able to find these pages using these terms

Although I dont know how that is implemented in the site

[verbal knot]

I think they're listed in the other names section right

[stark crag]

They are yeah. But if you search you need to use Big (suffix name)

I was thinking to add their most common names as redirects. The Big (suffix) name consistency as pagename is a fair point

as an example of precedent, we already have a redirect for Snatchers under the name Taker, which can be found if you try searching

[trim grove]

who tf uses taker

[dusk star]

isnt tanker a tank?

[limber canopy]

You can add redirects if you want

[[Potato]]

[rough widget]

https://gtfo.wiki.gg/wiki/Potato

[urban olive]

there's only one in the game what the hecc?

[limber canopy]

It only appears in R8A2 sec

[urban olive]

meet unique life forms and kick their ass

[dusk star]

hey ive seen that guy

[stark crag]

No idea; I saw it when I was searching "Tank". It doesn't match their internal name, which is Pouncer

[limber canopy]

would be redundant though if typing in Giant X still shows big X

i wonder

[[Dog]]

[rough widget]

https://gtfo.wiki.gg/wiki/Dog

[limber canopy]

good

[stark crag]

alright, I'll start adding the redirects for their most common names to their current pagenames

(I also don't mind if we just get rid of Taker)

It looks like the page was created by someone who I can no longer find, that created the Nightmare Shooter page as well

practically no one in the community uses Taker though, and Snatcher has basically overtaken the internal name entirely in the community

when I look up "Taker", I see lfg requests for "any takers", in reference to discussing about expeditions to join. It's not even listed in the aliases and it shouldn't be

[limber canopy]

i already did a bunch of those that i figured would be popular

[stark crag]

Which ones?

[dark citrus]

[[Daddy]]

[rough widget]

https://gtfo.wiki.gg/wiki/Daddy?action=edit&redlink=1

[dark citrus]

A shame

[dusk star]

BBC’s should get this redirect so TGB can call them daddy

Amirite?

[trim grove]

why

[winged charm]

yes

Daddy must redirect to BBcs

[dusk star]

Why not

[limber canopy]

sorry i didn't respond, but check first using the search bar to see what i added, dont know off the top of my head

[pale dock]

i fee like the only redirect for big enemies should be "big striker" for giants

[dark citrus]

I have never Heard anyone calling them that

Maybe a couple of times

[pale dock]

also who uses "taker"

[dark citrus]

It should be "Giver" instead

[stark crag]

PMother created current thank Tag: New redirect
Queen created current thank Tag: New redirect
Birther created current thank Tag: New redirect
Dog created current thank Tag: New redirect
Spicy Meatball created current thank Tag: New redirect
Big Meatball created current thank Tag: New redirect
Meatball created current thank Tag: New redirect
Child created current thank Tag: New redirect
Bullrush Scout created current thank Tag: New redirect
Big Bullrush created current thank Tag: New redirect
BBC created big black c****** current thank Tag: New redirect
Bullrush created current thank Tag: New redirect
Frank created current thank Tag: New redirect
Feeler Redirected page to Scout current thank Tag: New redirect```

[dark citrus]

[[Frank]]

[rough widget]

https://gtfo.wiki.gg/wiki/Frank

[dark citrus]

Not Frank the Tank?

Sad

[dusk star]

Wuuuuuuut

[stark crag]

I like some of these redirects; but I feel as though some of these are search bloat and should just stick to being aliases on their pages

For example I don’t think we need Bullrush as a redirect

[limber canopy]

tbh most of those except bullrush and queen are ones i use

[stark crag]

and Spicy/Meatball as good as they are; should probably stick to being strictly an Alias

[trim grove]

bullrush is a dev name

like frank the tank

[stark crag]

yep bullrush is for charger variants

[limber canopy]

bullrush would defo be ok to send back to the abyss

[stark crag]

I’m totally okay with every commonly used community name as an alias; but redirects should be the most common and second common name, so people don’t think the wiki is too vandalized/unserious when it isn’t, when just trying to search stuff

pMother as a redirect I’m surprised we didn’t have until you added it

since that’s a canonical name (R2A1 expedition description)

[pale dock]

frank is a dev name?

[trim grove]

frank the tank is what the devs called pablo

[pale dock]

damn

i thought frank as the giant

i never knew where that came from

[jolly yarrow]

the p stands for pablo

[pale dock]

the p stands for piss

[stark crag]

Here are the redirects I intend to keep/add/flag to de-clutter search:

Keep/Add:
Wallsack, redirects to Spitter
Pouncer, redirects to Snatcher
Big Striker, redirects to Giant
Feeler, redirects to Scout
Child, redirects to Baby Striker
Birther, redirects to Mother
PMother, redirects to Big Mother
Floater, redirects to Flyer
Big Floater, redirects to Big Flyer (not currently a redirect)
Giant Shooter, redirects to Big Shooter (not currently a redirect)
Giant Charger, redirects to Big Charger (not currently a redirect)

Questionable:
Queen, redirects to Big Mother (is this widely used enough for it to be a search term? can of course remain an alias on page)

Flagging for deletion, all of these can however remain as an alias listed on page:
Taker, redirects to Snatcher (is currently flagged)
Frank, redirects to Giant
Chicken, redirects to Giant Shooter
Pablo, redirects to Immortal
BBC, redirects to Big Charger
Meatball, redirects to Flyer
Big Meatball, redirects to Big Flyer
Spicy Meatball, redirects to Big Flyer
Bullrush, redirects to Charger
Big Bullrush, redirects to Big Charger
Bullrush Scout, redirects to Charger Scout```

[zealous bay]

Interesting, can you make it so "your mom" redirects to(pretend i doxxed whoever is reading this's moms house on google maps)?

[stark crag]

Have you ever posted something productive in this channel or just here to shitpost

[limber canopy]

Not bbc 😔

[trim grove]

Frank, redirects to Giant
Chicken, redirects to Giant Shooter
Pablo, redirects to Immortal
BBC, redirects to Big Charger

i think thesse should stay

these are very common names used by the community

[stark crag]

the biggest one I'd want gone of that bunch is BBC, that should really be strictly an alias instead of a search term due to the explicit innuendo implied by it that really goes against being informative

(for people that use wiki that dont ever join this server, for example)

[pale dock]

i think it's fair to keep queen in deletion

[trim grove]

ig but the innuendo part of the name isnt really applied anymore and A LOT of people use the name as an actual name for the enemy

keeping it as an alias is fine tho

[pale dock]

out of all of those in deletion tho i think it's fair to keep "chicken" maybe? it is one of the few i see used by newer people but also it's debatable

[trim grove]

chicken is extremely common

it might be the most common name used

[stark crag]

the reason I'm against Frank and Pablo specifically as search terms is bc they are actual person names and they might think it's a character in-lore

immensely common alias though

there's no doubt about that

[trim grove]

thats fair

[limber canopy]

Frank (giant) rename?

[stark crag]

I have a specific pretense against a rename of the redirect to that too, because of a similar scenario on the Bioshock Wiki, where Mark Meltzer is confirmed as one of the Big Daddies, but he isn't listed as a redirect to the Big Daddies page or Rumblers page (he is a Rumbler model Big Daddy), and there's no redirect to him or the Rumbler page, but he does get a footnote linking to his main page on the Rumbler and Big Daddy page

And I just think that’s likely among the best way to handle it, don’t redirect with real names

[limber canopy]

I am confused

[stark crag]

(Unless it’s a disambiguation page)

[stark crag]

In Bioshock 2, Mark Meltzer is an unseen character who is somewhat similar to Schaeffer, following along on the protagonist’s journey and he’s never encountered until after he’s turned into a Rumbler Big Daddy. On the wiki, they did it like this:

Mark Meltzer page, full biography and deeper lore about his long life

Rumbler page, simple footnote that Mark Meltzer is a Rumbler Big Daddy and linking to Mark Meltzer page

Big Daddy page, simple footnote again like on the Rumbler page linking to Mark Meltzer page

None of these redirect to each other

When it comes to the scenarios regarding names that are actual names, in the interest of de-cluttering searching I don’t like redirecting names unless it’s a disambiguation page, such as if there were multiple characters from Santonian Industries (or others like Nyxos or Omneco) in logs named Frank

[pale dock]

well more so the issue as i see it is not the names clashing with lore names cuz realistically no one is searching those. the wiki has a page for Minor Characters i think where some r listed but they aren't pages nor redirects to nothing but their logs

the issue for "frank" or "pablo" is just being community names

names that are here a lot but u won't see pretty much anywhere if ur just playing the game normally

and i understand not wanting to make a redirect for those

[dusk star]

Chicken, BBC and meatballls is crazy imo to delete from the redirects

[pale dock]

either way the community also knows the other name it has, giant, or immortal or whatev else it's named

[dusk star]

and pablo

[pale dock]

well bbc has a reason, it's vulgar

[dusk star]

fair enough

[pale dock]

gtfo is a vulgar game but cmon kfmsk

[dusk star]

(also pablo i didnt even know was called immortal within my first like two months)

[pale dock]

i mean that's just one being involved with the community, and realistically that's not its name either

it's name it's tank_boss i think

[grizzled crater]

thats just one of the abbreviations

[grizzled crater]

Theres an actual reason some people (me for example) say pablo over immortal

Its to avoid spoilering people

[grizzled crater]

The ingame name are typically quite wack tbf

[dusk star]

did we see pablo in R8A2 sec?

[pale dock]

i mean yes but u understand my point

[dusk star]

yea, anyways the rest ive said could stay

was there three types of mothers?

[pale dock]

yes

one of them is an exclusive boss for a level

the other two are more common

well 'common'

[dusk star]

which one is last one?

[pale dock]

thee mega mother

that's the exclusive exclusive one

[grizzled crater]

Twice even

[dusk star]

and thats not abbreviated?

[dusk star]

funi room and which one?

[grizzled crater]

It spawns at the end when you enter death room

[cyan coral]

on the run to "extract"

[pale dock]

i don't believe so
the name Pmother comes from r2a1

cuz i think in the files it's called something different

[cyan coral]

you're unlikely to see it

[pale dock]

but i don't remember well

[cyan coral]

i remember hearing that this had nothing to do wirh the actual enemy

[grizzled crater]

its pmother samples

People just decided to associate that with the bigger mom in r3d1

[dusk star]

i thought pregnant mom

[stark crag]

regarding meatballs: several of the loremasters in server use “floater” and the most common collilliqual (and official internal name because it isn’t too long or vague) is Flyer

Also we aren’t Pizza Tower Wiki (amazing game btw)

[cyan coral]

ya, reading back that is what was said #gtfo-lore message

[pale dock]

yeah it has nothing to do

but the name stuck either way

i mean same as the snatcher is technically another enemy in gtfo that never came out

the names pouncer, but now it is how it is

[stark crag]

Snatcher is a very… interesting case

[cyan coral]

omg schaeffer og r4e1 log

[grizzled crater]

Snatcher makes way more sense than pouncer tbf

Considering its main thing is snatching people

[stark crag]

Yep. It’s a more menacing name, as Pouncer just implies that it jumps

(Which it doesn’t do)

[limber canopy]

Never heard pouncer before

[stark crag]

That’s the internal name

[dusk star]

ive never heard that either

[stark crag]

Yeah, it’s so uncommonly used that Snatcher has become the defacto name

With Hunter and Dog as other aliases

[limber canopy]

i should maybe finish the R6D3 main strat section i've been putting to the side for a bit too long...

[stark crag]

go ahead, I'll take a look once you're done because I did make edits to that page on fandom before wiki gg

[limber canopy]

i dont think im going to make a strat section for R6D4 and maybe R6CX since mine were defo not the best and probably wont help

[dusk star]

i thought yall would take inspo from scaler lol

[limber canopy]

i do cross reference

[stark crag]

Scaler is very right about some things but wrong about others. It's indeed best to crossreference

[dusk star]

yea lol

[limber canopy]

it's just sometimes either it's a bit outdated or i disagree

[dusk star]

"shotgun sentry"

[limber canopy]

shotgun sentry best sentry because it shoots such powerful shots so fast

[stark crag]

let me recap the redirect convo results:

Adding:
Big Floater, redirects to Big Flyer (not currently a redirect)
Giant Shooter, redirects to Big Shooter (not currently a redirect)
Giant Charger, redirects to Big Charger (not currently a redirect)
Nightmare Feeler, redirects to Nightmare Scout (not currently a redirect)

Flagging for deletion, all of these can however remain as an alias listed on the respective page:
Taker, redirects to Snatcher (is currently flagged)
Queen, redirects to Big Mother (Queen Birther is an uncommonly used name, pMom is far more common)
Frank, redirects to Giant (reason: is a real person name, without referring to a character)
Chicken, redirects to Giant Shooter
Pablo, redirects to Immortal (reason: is a real person name, without referring to a character, and is specifically used in community to avoid spoiling players, largely defeating purpose as an an additionally accessible search term)
BBC, redirects to Big Charger (reason: vulgarity for searching purposes, but is an extremely common alias)
Meatball, redirects to Flyer (reason: too offtopic for game content, but can remain listed as alias)
Big Meatball, redirects to Big Flyer (reason: too offtopic for game content, but can remain listed as alias)
Spicy Meatball, redirects to Big Flyer (reason: too offtopic for game content, but can remain listed as alias)
Bullrush, redirects to Charger (reason: while the internal name, is not used in community, or any wiki page descriptions or expedition outlines)
Big Bullrush, redirects to Big Charger (reason: while the internal name, is not used in community, or any wiki page descriptions or expedition outlines)
Bullrush Scout, redirects to Charger Scout(reason: while the internal name, is not used in community, or any wiki page descriptions or expedition outlines)```

Also do I need to correct the citation about pMother?

I know I added that, but is it on the wrong page?

[dusk star]

Pablo, redirects to Immortal (reason: is a real person name, without referring to a character, and is specifically used in community to avoid spoiling players, largely defeating purpose as an an additionally accessible search term)

fair enough

buuuuuut

i think its kinda yanno

like if someone wanna know about pablo

and cant [[pablo]]

[rough widget]

https://gtfo.wiki.gg/wiki/Pablo

[dusk star]

yanno

[stark crag]

It's really about being uniform with precedent

like the Nightmare Giant is Fred as an alias

but we don't redirect that

[limber canopy]

never saw anyone use fred

[dusk star]

yea but ive never heard of fred

[stark crag]

prolly would be more common if there wasnt only 1 of them in the game

[dusk star]

was that one also in R8A2 sec?

[stark crag]

yep

[dusk star]

oh so thats the potato

[stark crag]

R8A2 sec has a lot of unique stuff

[dusk star]

yea

nightmare babies are they unique to it?

[stark crag]

yep those too

we don't have a page for those either atm

and Nightmare Child could be a redirect to such a page

(to be uniform with Child as a redirect to Baby Striker page already)

[dusk star]

yea

also i thought they were only called babies lol

[limber canopy]

child i feel is a name a beginner could give in addition to baby so i put that

[dusk star]

oh shi lol

[stark crag]

yeah it's fine, it's informative, isn't reminiscent of vandalism or shitposty in nature

ultimately by decluttering search I'd like wiki gg to be of higher caliber in quality than fandom

[dusk star]

(also does nightmare scout not have a "first seen in"?)

[stark crag]

I can add that

[dusk star]

im guessing thats also sec?

[stark crag]

yes

[dusk star]

lol

ive seen all da enemies

eva carried tho

[stark crag]

Something else not mentioned on the wiki other than on the R8A2 page is that GTFO does in fact have a lockdown mechanic

[dusk star]

? wats dat

[stark crag]

at the very end of R8A2 Sec, the security door at the far end of the hall is covered in mutated flesh preventing exit

[dusk star]

oh shi lol

[stark crag]

(once you reach Z77)

[dusk star]

any way to feasably see this?

[stark crag]

cconsole because its pretty difficult to get past the swarm of nightmare babies and immortal

[dusk star]

yea

any other level?

[stark crag]

not that i am aware of

[limber canopy]

ok i just finished writing the main strat for R6D3 just gotta wait until i get home to add it to the wiki

[dusk star]

[[Flesh Wall]] could possibly be a redirect

[rough widget]

https://gtfo.wiki.gg/wiki/Flesh_Wall?action=edit&redlink=1

[dusk star]

prolly wouldnt be used that much

[dark citrus]

Chat, can we redirect with this from GTFO to Terraria?

[dark citrus]

R7E1, or any Mission with Spaghetti ceiling

Earliest is R1C2

[dusk star]

chat is this a fish moment?

[dark citrus]

In R7E1 it is in one of the reactor Spawn rooms, with it genuenly used as a barrier to prevent you from Spawncamping

Too Bad there is a hole you can climb through

[trim grove]

This is not the reason it is used

[dusk star]

Eva said they used it for that

[trim grove]

Well, I don’t think it’s used for that now

At least no one uses it for that reason

[trim grove]

Also nightmare scout is first seen in r8c1 ovl

[jolly yarrow]

if it’s worth anything the unity gameobject for that is called inner matter 2 or something

iirc

[zealous bay]

Tf is a nightmare scout

[jolly yarrow]

[limber canopy]

any news on that?

[pale dock]

i have one of those :D

[pale dock]

r7e1 which has a flesh wall

from where enemies spawn

oops they said it

[dusk star]

Well gonna have to see it one day

[pale dock]

:D

[trim grove]

Erm technically 🤓 ☝️

[stark crag]

Fun new trivia fellas

This corpse is in R8B1 Z141D

it's a dormant nightmare baby striker

they are completely identical in appearance after the nightmare baby striker retracts tendrils after it dies

[jolly yarrow]

inch resting

[verbal knot]

Roomba foreshadowing?

[sly narwhal]

nope

[stark crag]

[[Tank]]

[rough widget]

https://gtfo.wiki.gg/wiki/Tank

[stark crag]

Unlike the heads of enemies, damage performed to the Tank's weakspots (its tumors) is capped per damage-instance by the maximum HP of the tumor.

This makes weapons such as the Scattergun substantially more effective against Tanks as client rather than as host, as it is often able to deal its entire shot's worth of damage (~338 damage) to the Tank, while only breaking a single tumor.

I think this is just incorrect now

[dusk star]

Is this not true cuz clients deal 100% of the dmg?

Yea

[stark crag]

I am testing as host with cconsole and nearly breaking a tumor and I am dealing full damage on the hit that breaks the tumor

(Whittling it down with a fully auto weapon then unloading with scatter)

@trim grove does that info sound right/wrong? I know this is very relevant to speedruns

[dusk star]

When a tumor breaks the rest of the shots still go forwards/hits something else I believe

So it could be ur breaking it, 95% of pellets hits a tumor and rest doesn’t

[stark crag]

I dont think so

Because the tumor I chose didnt have any tumors behind it

[dusk star]

Oh

🤷‍♂️

Mb chief

[stark crag]

because take for example the NM scout, if I shoot that thing in the back tumor with Sniper I do 160dmg, leaving it on 1 HP

the tumors of a NM scout each have ~80HP

[trim grove]

Those tumours are different

[stark crag]

oh?

[trim grove]

But I’m pretty sure the scatter thing is correct

Like, all the pellets hit the tumour before it registers the tumour being broken

But with host the update is instant

I could be wrong

Tru would know specifics

[stark crag]

alright

If wiki is correct, then one of the common plugins is breaking tumor gating when it shouldnt be

Found the culprit: it's HostEnemyLimbDestroyFix

You can just get more damage off with that plugin enabled, as Host

[dusk star]

🐟

[stark crag]

In vanilla, you can't 1 shot a NM Scout with Scattergun as host

but with that plugin, you can

(to the back tumor)

trying the same in vanilla leaves the NM Scout on ~8HP

and similar effects can be observed on Tank and Mother tumors

[dark citrus]

you can, you just have to look into a very specific angle

so possible, but not viable

[stark crag]

it's not at all precise with the plugin

[dusk star]

isnt there a spot in the neck or sum?

[dark citrus]

i mean vanilla

[stark crag]

yeah

[limber canopy]

maybe dont have mods other than cconsole when looking at stuff for the wiki lol

[stark crag]

I usually dont, but I need to for the Bug Support Wiki. Sorry about that, but I'm glad the wiki is still correct

[dusk star]

does sleepers wake up quicker when shot vs when just waking up from a shot?

[trim grove]

It’s the same

[limber canopy]

well if you trigger a short range aggro by shooting another sleeper next to em (idk if long range can trigger), it will do the wake up animation

[dusk star]

nah its just shooting vs shooting sleeper type shit

[cyan coral]

As malefic said it is possible, but fucked
you either need to aim precisely from the back and hit enough pellets into both the neck (which is unarmoured, for some reason) AND tumour
or shoot from the side and hit enough pellets into front and back tumour

[grizzled crater]

For the first you only need neck

Its still hella precise tho

[stark crag]

Adding to NM Scout page

Also found where Medium Sustain Scan is used.... R6D1 Class VI Mixed Alarm and in R8E2 on one alarm

[pale dock]

gaming

[dusk star]

tbh if he wasnt in our squad it wouldnt cross my mind

[brave rivet]

i hav done it befor to experiment

foamed a nightmare scout then stood literly inside of him and scattered

theoretically its possible but he would definitely wake up before u can get the perfect shot in practice lol

[grizzled crater]

I have done tests on this for about 1 hour (about 300 total kill attempts)

Its doable, just not smth youd realistically go for unless solo host, with no foam and you got to kill it with no wave

[jolly yarrow]

why risk it, anyways. just bring foam or sniper damage booster 👍

[indigo quiver]

Key phrase:

per damage-instance
Scattergun, with 32 pellets, has 32 damage instances. None of these are individually capped.

Client still experiences damage capping, they can just damage the same tumor more times than host can due to the delay on the tumor registering as broken.

[stark crag]

Thanks tru

There’s been a rich history regarding damage capping I’ve been taught today

I’m not editing tank page; or the section on Nightmare Scout

I know Nightmare Scout tumors work a little differently

[indigo quiver]

I also wouldn't necessarily call this behaviour a bug. It is just a direct consequence of how the game handles most consequences of damage on the host's side.

It is also already documented in [[Dealing Damage]] as a mechanic.

[rough widget]

https://gtfo.wiki.gg/wiki/Dealing_Damage

[stark crag]

Well said; I was pretty confused earlier. The patch notes from Feb/March 2024 also made me wonder what had exactly happened

[indigo quiver]

The line between "unintended mechanic" and "bugged behaviour" is pretty thin, so I don't think it is necessarily bad to document it in both places, but definitely good to cross-link between the two places if that is what happens.

[indigo quiver]

Prior to those patches the capping behaviour differed between clients and host. Client would be capped by tumor max HP, but host would be capped by tumor current HP, leading to situations where host would deal very little damage while firing e.g. Sniper at low HP tumors.

They tried to fix this behaviour, but inadvertently removed damage capping entirely, and we had a week were Sniper was 3-shotting mothers.

Then they fixed that and we have the behaviour we have today: both client and host have the same damage capping behaviour.

[stark crag]

that lines up with what Dino told me

Same damage capping behaviour; Scattergun isn't capped due to so many individual damage instances, consequently leading to it being a naturally prime choice for clients on speedruns

[dusk star]

So this is where your sniping skills were trained lol

[indigo quiver]

We did speedrun R5E1 during that window and got a PB using Sniper to kill one of the 2 moms

[dusk star]

Lmao, wish I was here for prime GTFO

Feels like 400+ hours missed out on

[stark crag]

There's a scan type we still need to list on the Scans page

@dusk star and I were attempting R6C3 Prisoner Efficiency yesterday and during the Overload Objective, the Terminal Command spawns a Large Team Scan which seems to be functioning very similar to a Large Sustain Scan, but with an even bigger area to stand in, and these are different than the Blue Full Team Scans found in R8E1. I know how to look into the datablocks, but how were the exact value scaling for each scan type based on the amount of allies present in them extracted?

[dusk star]

Also its duration was very long, like extremely long

[stark crag]

The Team Scan section of the Scans page will probably end up looking like the Sustain Scan section of the page if we consider the ubiquitous one on most doors to be a Small Team Scan, the Blue Team Scans in R8E1 to be Medium Team Scans, and the one found in R6C3 Overload to be a Large Team Scan

[trim grove]

data blocks pretty sure

kenny did shit to do with extract scans so he might know

[stark crag]

paging @steep wind

In the meantime, I am making a small update to the Sustain Scan section of the page now since we now know where the Medium Sustain Scans are at: The Mixed Alarms in R6D1 and R8E2. I'm surprised they don't use that one more often

[steep wind]

wut

[stark crag]

Would you happen to have the knowledge of where to look in the datablocks for duration scaling on scans

[steep wind]

WardenObjective DataBlock

"ChainedPuzzleAtExit": 11

"ChainedPuzzleAtExitScanSpeedMultiplier": 0.5,

The IDs for chainpuzzleatexit are (as far as I know)

11 (main one used for 95% of levels) - Scan Type 7
186 (R8C1 Group Extraction) - Scan Type 41
294 (Something to do with E2) - Scan type 49

If you want my notes on what I've researched so far (It gets iffy around either R6 or R7 I forgor)

[stark crag]

Thank you very much, I will take a look 👍

[limber canopy]

[[Snatcher]]

[rough widget]

https://gtfo.wiki.gg/wiki/Snatcher

[pale dock]

me when i

[limber canopy]

i had to get an image

[pale dock]

i like gtfo as much as not hte next person but this feels like extreemely high praise kmskdm

[verbal knot]

Would anyone actually even look to the wiki for recommendations for this game anyways

[pale dock]

i mean eliminate the page then i guess

[void prawn]

What does kmskdm even mean?

[pale dock]

its a lol

i swear yall have like never met aa bottom smh

[void prawn]

I mean I've met myself

I just dont use abbreviations much

[pale dock]

but its not an abbreviation :[

[void prawn]

wha

[rocky wolf]

My understanding is it's one of them new fangled typing quirks

[dark citrus]

The Kreek–McHugh–Schluger–Kellogg (KMSK) scale was developed to quantify self-exposure to opiates, cocaine, alcohol, and tobacco.

[dusk star]

It’s just a giggle

[void prawn]

[jolly yarrow]

who used chatgpt to write this lmao

[stark crag]

It’s supposed to garner interest, being the front page

As for reality, are we supposed to say “nah these missions are so miserable you’ll never want to play them again”

(Which to be fair is the reality of R4B2 PE)

[pale dock]

but cuz we all hate b2
idk i had something writen before that but i guess it was 'too negative'a

[stark crag]

R4B2 PE is… not great. Even if you roughly know where to go and what to do, there’s too little ammo in the level, you can’t even see for a majority of Main while there’s an Error for 99% of the level so you have to melee waves a lot, Overload has a zone that screws you over, and plugging in cells into the gen cluster makes the fog even worse until all cells are plugged in, which no other gen cluster in the game does

[pale dock]

i just think its boring

it has enough ammo in my opinion u dont shoot error anyways

and the fog thing is funny

[stark crag]

it's deranged

and yes, boring

I can rewrite something in that section so it doesn't seem too ChatGPT. I sure hope nobody has been using that to write articles

[void prawn]

GTFO is a video game. bottom text

[stark crag]

Replayability
Grinding R2E1 with 3 bots is a fun time

[void prawn]

So much fun you would spend 40+ hours grinding it just because, why would you ever want to beat any mission when this one is the best

[stark crag]

you'll have as similar time in R4B2 PE with 3 bots too

that whole ammo problem becomes a super harsh reality because the bots will never ever melee the error waves so as long as they have any ammo at all

[void prawn]

i highly doubt i'm gonna do PE for every mission

[stark crag]

you can't give the bots ammo outside of the Alarms if you do R4B2 PE, they will immediately flush it down the toilet

there's only enough ammo in the level if you don't shoot the error waves

[stark crag]

and fair enough

[void prawn]

i think i've been able to do it with one mission though thing that was an A tier mission

[stark crag]

people have done some C and D tier PEs with 3 bots... I dont know if they did it vanilla though and I know its a similar degree of immense suffering

Letter tiers in general get really messy when it comes to alt sectors, especially PE

they usually only apply to Main clears, but a couple levels are an exception to this, like R6C2 Main is really not that much more difficult than R2B4, just longer

Then you do Sec and it starting stepping on the gas

[grizzled crater]

R4B2 is pretty good tho?

Ammo is completely fine, you can play and are supposed to play aggressive and while the fog is a big of a hassle in the 2nd alarm of main its not rly a backbreaker

[vestal crest]

the fog is annoying in the one alarm and nowhere else, if anything i think it makes the level more interesting even if it is a bit annoying

[stark crag]

Main? yes PE? Absolutely not

I don't particularly enjoy not being able to see for extended periods of time

[grizzled crater]

Its a very short period

PE adds an error that just means you dont want to play slow and ovl itself is quite fun, even if the objective itself (gather) is meh

[stark crag]

you probably know the Zone I refer to with Overload, it's the mom zone

[vestal crest]

yeah the mom zone is optional

[stark crag]

If you know to not plug in the cells until having all of them, in PE I just avoid Main obj entirely and just beeline for Overload

plugging in cells makes it just impossible to see during the latter zones of Main

[pale dock]

i mean as ur supposed to

[stark crag]

there's nothing that tells you that though other than a previous attempt

it's very funi but there's no way to know that without having it mess you up once

Especially when every other gen cluster introduced up to that point does the opposite

[vestal crest]

no, this gen cluster also lowers mist
it's just that overload is lower than main, and the fog starts above you

[stark crag]

it does, yeah, but by lowering it, the elevation of Main makes it worse

[vestal crest]

yeah

[stark crag]

I don't think it affects overload, too low elevation

[vestal crest]

it does affect the overload

but point is

you know the mist is above you before plugging first cell

and you by experience know that it lowers

[stark crag]

can't debate that... it's just the first (and only instance I am aware of) where plugging in cells makes things worse for your team

Well I suppose there's R4D2 Sec

but that's a bit different because there is no effect until after completing it

both of those missions are horrific experiences with bots, as per usual if I had a team to tackle those it wouldn't be nearly as awful

[vestal crest]

r6c2

each cell kinda does different stuff there but two of them makes the fog rise

[grizzled crater]

Its a puzzle in a different way than r2d1

[stark crag]

for R6C2 you at least have almost no required combat before the Checkpoint and a Turbine not too far in

they give you repellers as well

I don't think R4B2 gives you any repellers

[vestal crest]

well it is infectious so it's more dangerous in r6c2

[stark crag]

infectious and no error until Sec

@pale dock i finished the edit to main page

pls proofread

[stark crag]

hang on I'm looking at that wiki page now, this doesn't feel right

Picking up the HISEC Cargo will open the door to Zone 247 and trigger an Error Alarm spawning 3 Hybrids every ~90 seconds for the rest of the expedition.

[vestal crest]

it\s shorter than 90 seconds

but it is 3 hybrids

[stark crag]

that's what I thought, no way is that error 90 second intervals

maybe it was originally

checking...

[trim grove]

r4b2 is fun

[stark crag]

here is what I got for R6C2 Sec:
~20 seconds after picking up the HISEC Cargo, an Error alarm will initiate, spawning 3 Hybrids every ~45s for the rest of the expedition

[stark crag]

what kind of prioritizing do you do for PE, do you stick around for Main or do you beeline to Overload

[vestal crest]

just overload first

[void prawn]

when you're good at the game most of it fun

[trim grove]

you do overload first before main

[trim grove]

nuh uh

[pale dock]

i beg to differ

r3b1 is still just as unfun

[void prawn]

corrected

[pale dock]

now u will be told carrots dont improve ur eyesight ⚡ ⚡

[stark crag]

isn't this like the 1 level in all of GTFO that does nothing new, since Uplink was introduced in R2

unless you don't do the alarm to extract in advance, i guess

[trim grove]

Something about mother baby caps is probably useful on the wiki

[indigo quiver]

[[Enemy Attacks]]

[rough widget]

https://gtfo.wiki.gg/wiki/Enemy_Attacks

[trim grove]

ah

[indigo quiver]

Birth section

Can probably be linked to on the mother page itself if someone wants an ez edit

[trim grove]

yeah fair

[pale dock]

ill put it in there i guess

this reads ok, right?

its 5 am i sleept like 3 hours

[regal bluff]

Yeah it reads okay

[brave rivet]

but there is a mom that has damaging attacks

[stark crag]

Does anyone have an updated version of a map for R5D2? the current one on Wiki is of non-ALT R5D2, which has different zone numbers

oh hang on

there's two maps on the page...

removing the OG version

Now I need to double check the res amounts, because it's listing OG version zones

@trim grove can you assist when you have the chance

[jolly yarrow]

i have maps of every level

if you can wait until tomorrow i can get them to you @stark crag

[stark crag]

Yeah please do, I removed the OG one but I want to make sure the current one is accurate as well

[jolly yarrow]

they are very very large images, ftr

[limber canopy]

unless there's some random one before R6 i didn't see, every mission has their resource amounts (why was R7 not done since its release)

[stark crag]

Oh thank you

[jolly yarrow]

@stark crag

[limber canopy]

@stark crag in the recent edit of R7E1 you did, you wrote:
# Upon return, the [[Immortal]] will be gone. Enter '''Zone 451''' [<nowiki/>[[Cocoon|RESPAWN ZONE]]].
the [<nowiki/>[[Cocoon|RESPAWN ZONE]]] should instead be {{sb|[[Cocoon|RESPAWN ZONE]]}}

[stark crag]

Good catch… sometimes when I am rapidly switching between visual and source editing I miss something

[pale dock]

i did the change to fully source i just check the preview like 100k times :D

[stark crag]

Fixed the sb templates on R7E1 page, still need to add a wikitable to clean up Step 11 so it resembles R4E1 page

Please do correct info on the extract error if needed, I was watching it for a couple mins in debug

[zealous bay]

I have a question about the wiki, it says that chargers have 30hp and not headshot bonus. And a charged spear does 26~ damage max. But if i hit a charger in the head with a spear i ca. Kill it in one hit. Am i missing somethjng?

[stark crag]

chargers have a back multiplier of 2x

[zealous bay]

Oh, i thought that 26 was the max with the back multi💀

[grizzled crater]

Spear does 17,5 base

Thats 35

Hitting Head doesnt do anything extra to them

[stark crag]

Will do some cleanup on Charger page later, working on R3D1 page over lunch today

[stark crag]

#gtfo-media message

@limber canopy

That is worth testing

If there’s a difference between fully relaunching versus just exiting the session

[limber canopy]

i got a lil bit of time to test that if you wanna

(can't really do that alone since it requires leaving and rejoining mid game)

[stark crag]

I’m still out unfortunately but I’ll be back within an hour

If you aren’t by then I can ask this guy @dusk star

[dusk star]

mid game

[stark crag]

@limber canopy are you still available to test

[limber canopy]

im doing a thing rn

[stark crag]

Couple of notes for wiki:
-P-Mother is official name of the enemy, designated by Steam Achievement "Swift" calling her such
-Snatchers is an officially used name, mentioned in patch notes

[dark citrus]

same with the guardian angel achivement

[stark crag]

true

searching patch notes further...

Chargers/Big Chargers is official name, same for Flyer and Big Flyer, Shooter, Big Shooter, Hybrid

[limber canopy]

@stark crag you want to test the thing from yesterday?

[stark crag]

Yes

[limber canopy]

https://discord.com/channels/408196129470152705/749737595558166528

[dark citrus]

i am thinking about adding a page for hitmarkers

but there is also not that much to say about it and just can be added into the back multiplier and Precision multiplier pages

[stark crag]

I do already discuss hitmarkers/kill indicators on Bug Wiki page, what else did you want to add to wiki about them

[brave rivet]

would it be much work to add a list of levels by appearance in the enemies pages?

i wanted to check which level introduced bbc first (couldv just asked i suppose)

[fallen vessel]

r4d1/r4c3, depends on what counts as "first", as they're both unlocked by r4c1

[grizzled crater]

well r4c3 is the expected intro

R3D1 is now the earliest anyway

[stark crag]

I have a few rules I've been using since giving a passthrough of updating enemy pages:
-I am removing mentions of OG content except on Trivia sections (check Shadow page for an example) because those pages are for past content that isn't accessible anymore without downgrading the game, which is not something a vast supermajority of people will do and going down the OG page rabbit hole isn't conducive to traffic which should be directed more at what is present in current patch with ALT:// Rundowns
-I don't mention Nightmare enemies except on their enemy pages and expedition pages specifically, because of R8 spoiler nature that the wiki still has, following suit with that format (Scout page doesn't have a link to Nightmare Scout page)
-I don't list helpful Exploits possible on each expedition/enemy page except on the Bug wiki page where modded fixes exist to give resource for hosts to enforce for lobbies if they want (Enemy Culling -> EnemyAnimationFix, Door Bug -> NoDoorCheese, Silent Shots -> SilentShotFix)

[pale dock]

then the hel rifle page needs fixing

it mentions like about every enemy in the game

[stark crag]

good catch

[trim grove]

Honestly I think after 1.5 years r8 content shouldn’t be spoiler’d

Like what do you expect from looking at the wiki

It’s more useful imo if people can get all the info they want

[stark crag]

I'm fine with it either which way, just not a decision I would want to just decide to do on my own especially since I have only been here a few months. You can technically still get to them anyway right now with each enemy page due to the template at the bottom with the show spoiler option, but obviously that's tucked away

[pale dock]

i think there's always new people and i don't think it's that necessary
like if the enemy page just included the level they are introduced in [cuz this was all from the enemy page having the list of introductikns] it would work

[limber canopy]

i had a bug i just noticed isn't on the wiki a few weeks ago on R7B3 sec:
I picked up the first data cube and before i warped (don't know the exact timing) i grabbed onto a ladder and when the warp occured i got left back in the complex with everything unloaded while my team got sent to the survival section.
This feels like it could be replicated in other levels where warps happen and you are able to get within a ladder's reach
watching the replay, it seems i may have grabbed it the frame the warp happened.

[stark crag]

I can try to replicate it

[cyan coral]

sometimes people desync and don't get teleported

happens sometimes following r6d1 kraken fight too

so someone can be stuck in alpha or whatever forevermore whilst everyone else gets ported back to the complex

[limber canopy]

but i was host

[pale dock]

how do u grab a ladder at the same time as a datacub

cuz the datacube pickup is immediate

[limber canopy]

warp isn't immediately after data cube pickup in r7b3

it's like 1 or 2 seconds delay

[pale dock]

oh damn

iiii probs will get around doing all of r7 soon so

loke strats and enemy types so

ill put it in