balance-feedback-discussion

[late hatch]

Then people gotta stop playing it like a rex lol

[alpine plover]

and gators are not particularly fast on land

And more likely than not it is going to be food for rex

[crystal wharf]

taran, what ever essay you're typing most definitely isnt going to do much to change my mind, but i'd love to hear about what you have to say

[brittle ice]

@crystal wharf U see a Deino can not grab a full Stego. Today I saw 1 Stego taking on 5-4 Deino adult's and won. Dose that seem a bit funny to you??? that a Stego that toke 5 hour's to grow and the Deino that toke 5 hour's to grow and some how the 5 hour stego can take on 4-5 five hour deino's . Im not saying you sould give the deino more bite but instead give it a bit more HP so say maybe 2-3 Deino's can kill a Stego?????

[late hatch]

It depends on where it was. If it was on land, the stego is still going to have the upper hand

[brittle ice]

yes.

that if fare

but it seem's more fare for say... 2-3 deino's can kill a stego?? Maybe?

[spare badger]

Fare? Do you mean fair??

[brittle ice]

Fair* XD

yea my bad it's 4AM here

[spare badger]

Well in water if the deinos are smart they can body block a steg and get headshots. A deino should never win on land unless there's like 10 cause it ain't a rex, it's a croc

[full ocean]

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[crystal wharf]

deino already 4 shots stego on the head, and deino shouldnt be hunting stego, at all, grow time is irrelevant if deino can kill anything near instantly if it manages to grab it, literally anything below 4 tons is turned into powder by an adult deinosuchus, 80% grown stego, gone, full adult carno, gone, sub adult deinosuchus, gone.
It needs no buffs at all, to none of its stats, learn stegosaurus has always been outside deinosuchus prey range when its standing, and it will always be, if its swimming, you kill it, dont go chasing it, dont try and taunt it, respect the stego's tail range and you will never worry about them

[full ocean]

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[crystal wharf]

that will never happen

[full ocean]

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[late hatch]

Idk what they even are looking for, any smart dino can take down a full rex

[full ocean]

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[brittle ice]

that was not me so idk :/

[full ocean]

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[brittle ice]

i respect his point of view

[spare badger]

A deino shouldnt attack a stego. Even tho the deino is huge a stego is slightly larger than an African elephant

A bit too big for it to make sense to me anyway

[late hatch]

Again, grow time doesnt matter. Why do people keep thinking it ahould matter lol

[full ocean]

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[crystal wharf]

@onyx wyvern since you love reacting, explain your point of view, why do you want to play an alligator like a land bound tyrannosaur

[brittle ice]

@crystal wharf okay, here me out here maybe make it so the Deino bit's a tiny and I mean tiny bit faster???

[full ocean]

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[spare badger]

They talk about growth time because usually the growth matches up. Ex. 30 min Utah = 30 min Teno I think. As in their balanced with eachother

[late hatch]

By that thought process i shouldnt be able to kill a full deino on land as a full carno. And yet, here i am

[onyx wyvern]

just laughing at you that think an 8 ton gator couldnt crush the head of a stego. a deino shouldnt fight on land but a stego should be claped near water

[crystal wharf]

its bite being faster... maybe, its already pretty quick, the main issue with deino rn is that its hitboxes are a little broken, meaning that you phase through things you should hit, and hit things you shouldnt

[brittle ice]

@onyx wyvern that's what im saying

[full ocean]

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[spare badger]

It's 4 head shots whichakes sense for Game Balance

Irl it would be different

[full ocean]

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[spare badger]

But their trying to balance a video game

[crystal wharf]

"i LiKe CrOcOdIlE, wHy DoEsNt It PlAy, LiKe ReX, wHy CaNt I bItE eVeRyThInG tO dEaTh"

[spare badger]

So you can't use that as an argument iny opinion

[full ocean]

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[stark knoll]

@spiral verge deinos can grab tenontos and carnos

[onyx wyvern]

because its little dumb head in the water has already been made into jam

[crystal wharf]

lets put this in same argument on another animal

buff utah bite because i dont want to use the pounce on a dryo, why cant i just kill it instantly with a headshot

[full ocean]

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[spare badger]

...

[full ocean]

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[crystal wharf]

come on @onyx wyvern tell me how this argument isnt the same as yours

[full ocean]

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[onyx wyvern]

a utah should one shot a dryo with a head bite

if its head can fit in your mouth it should be dead

[spare badger]

Same logic, carno should 1 shot stego with a head shot

[crystal wharf]

deino should 1 shot brachi confirmed

[late hatch]

If 5 adult deinos and 10 plus babies couldnt kill a stego, thats the players problem for not knowing how to play the dino

[onyx wyvern]

carno didnt have a bite force enough for that but it should really hurt it

[full ocean]

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[spare badger]

Which makes sense

[full ocean]

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[onyx wyvern]

yall dont understand ambush predators at all

[crystal wharf]

mhm, so you are straw manning an argument out of your ass because you cant come up with a reason why it should 1 shot something of equal growth time and higher power tier

[full ocean]

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[spare badger]

Crocs irl don't even insta kill most things they drown them most of the time unless their very small

[spiral verge]

Croc shouldn't one shot stegos but when a stego rolls up there shouldn't be a health bar showing up and boss music playing

[spare badger]

Rexs are ambush predators

[onyx wyvern]

the deino cant even drown things they just swim away unless theey have no stam

[brittle ice]

@crystal wharf @onyx wyvern maybe instead of down right grabbing a stego and yeeting it into the water like nothing. Maybe the deino could grab it by the head and slowly pulling it in the water and the stego slapping it's tail into the deino but it dose a bit less damage

[crystal wharf]

adult deinos can 4 shot adult stegos, and you can steal anything below 4 tons in weight

[full ocean]

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[late hatch]

Crocs irl cant even one shot a zebra, hell zebras can even escape a croc on occasion

[crystal wharf]

tug of war mechanics are very hard to get right in a multiplayer game

[full ocean]

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[spiral verge]

You actually can not fight adult stegos

You really really can't

[spare badger]

They can drown them if the deinos at full stam

[brittle ice]

@crystal wharf it's just a thought.

[onyx wyvern]

if you cant drown it and cant hit hard how the hell is the water bound dino suppose to hunt?

[late hatch]

Dont hunt stegos?????

Thats how

[spare badger]

It can drown thing tho I've seen it

[onyx wyvern]

ive watered several carnos jusr swim away

[crystal wharf]

it most certainly can drown them, you hold right click, and unless you wasted all of your stamina they will never escape, because not only does it drain the o2 of the grabbed animal, but also the stamina so even if they escape you can still bite the shit out of them

[full ocean]

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[brittle ice]

that's okay

[crystal wharf]

alright lets run down the roadmap and see which animals deino can, and cant drown

[spare badger]

If you run on land first and have no Stam of course you can't drown it but I've seen videos of deinos drowning tenos

[late hatch]

Again, you cant blame the game for not knowing how to play a dino lol

[onyx wyvern]

omg im not saying you cant

im saying its way to hard to pull off if thats you only way to kill things

[crystal wharf]

cant

adult deinosuchus
adult stegosaurus

can

literally everything else coming in any of the future updates

wow guys, deino needs to be buffed omg guys

[full ocean]

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[brittle ice]

XD

[full ocean]

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[spare badger]

Unless magy is suuuper heavy which I doubt

[full ocean]

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[stark knoll]

1.2 tons

[onyx wyvern]

that does no good if they just tank your bites and swim away once youve drug them in, and if the water isnt deep enough it gets away

[spare badger]

Then do it in deep water?

[full ocean]

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[crystal wharf]

its really not, its only hard to pull off if you never use it correctly
you do the slow water walk towards the animal near the water
hold right click when you are close enough
grab them
turn around
sit underwater for around 15 seconds
eat

[full ocean]

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[onyx wyvern]

805 of the time even if you do that it gets on land and runs away

[full ocean]

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[onyx wyvern]

\80%

[brittle ice]

okay.... keep going

[spare badger]

If your having that much trouble eat utahs

[full ocean]

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[late hatch]

Just wait until they add shant, cant wait for people to complain about deino not being able to take a shant lol

[crystal wharf]

no, it doesnt, it really really doesnt, literally never in fact, because it drains stamina and oxygen, meaning even if you let them go, which is clearly what you have been doing, they still sink and drown, the only way you could possibly be loosing all of your grabs is if you are sprinting towards them, sprinting back, then once you get to the bottom letting go

[full ocean]

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[spiral verge]

I don't think it should be practical to hunt stegos as dieno, stegos should be able to destroy that angry log, but it should not be able to face tank three adults is all. The grabbing of things would be great if it would actually land, it's stupid hard to grab anything. You often could be right on target and not do anything.

[alpine plover]

grabbing needs a better hitbox

[full ocean]

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[late hatch]

I fully believe that spinos will be deino killers

And i will relish in it

[alpine plover]

and why can't the models themselves be used as the hitbox areas instead

[spiral verge]

Spinos should be deino killers

[spare badger]

Yes

[crystal wharf]

its really simple actually, locational damage, deinos really often go onto land and try and bite the ass of the stego to kill it, when if you bit the head, it would in fact, 4 shot it, meanwhile the stego is hitting all of the deinos for maximum potential damage with its swings

[brittle ice]

yes

[full ocean]

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[spiral verge]

No.

[spare badger]

If you bite the head 4 times you win it's just that people can't play deino yet due to it being new

[full ocean]

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[crystal wharf]

people seem to be really used to legacy where they can bite somethings ass for full damage and phase right through them to escape

[brittle ice]

no

[full ocean]

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[brittle ice]

maybe

[alpine plover]

I would like to happily bite the head of something to kill it

being realistic here, if you were to be trying to kill a stego, you should aim for the head not the rump.

[full ocean]

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[crystal wharf]

its not a bug, its a feature

[alpine plover]

because you would end up getting impaled if you tried attacking the rear

[full ocean]

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[stark knoll]

stego had its headshot damage intentionally raised

[crystal wharf]

its not

[late hatch]

Exactly. Its like how in legacy face tanking a theri was a horrible idea, but attacking the butt was an easy win

[spare badger]

Which makes sense cause its head is so small

[alpine plover]

except with a theri it has claws in the front

so you would be better off trying to attack from the rear or the side

[late hatch]

Yes i know, thats what i was saying XD

[crystal wharf]

in all likely hood it exists because of how small all other animal except for deino and stego are, it may very well be lowered when things like rex are added

[full ocean]

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[alpine plover]

god fighting in the isle is so bloody awkward when it comes to stats...

[full ocean]

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[late hatch]

Pls no

[full ocean]

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[late hatch]

Honestly when rex comes to evrima i better not see it being the only thing with leg break again

[full ocean]

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[late hatch]

That was some bs

[full ocean]

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[full ocean]

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[late hatch]

Thank god

[alpine plover]

but there will be fractures

and they will be regional

[brittle ice]

it look's like me and Bork sparked a war here XD

[alpine plover]

as far as I am aware

[full ocean]

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[late hatch]

Then i better not see rex be the only dino who can fracture

[stark knoll]

it wont be

[late hatch]

Oh yay

[full ocean]

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[late hatch]

Thats good to hear

[full ocean]

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[brittle ice]

@full ocean idk no more XD

[late hatch]

Pachy getting its bone break taken away was terrible

[brittle ice]

yup

[full ocean]

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[late hatch]

Someones you gotta break the homies legs if they being foolish

[brittle ice]

wow the chat got dead!

it feel's weird in a way...

[late hatch]

Give it time, people always find reason to complain haha

[full ocean]

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[late hatch]

Honestly even when it does come, people will complain that deino cant 2 shot a spino XD

[full ocean]

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[late hatch]

People already complaining about balance in the general feed back channel XD

[full ocean]

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[edgy root]

hit twice

[cold palm]

Ah yes, because having to 2-3 shot an utah that's like 14 times smaller than you is balance. Get out of here.

[cold palm]

not only that but you can't even one shot a hypsi as a sub deino. I get it, we need balance, but right now it makes no sense.

[cold palm]

one more thing, it's almost impossible to lunge at small things because the animation is broken, you gotta bite.

[brittle ice]

yea

[sturdy cove]

not sure where to ask this, i guess its kinda about combat balance. how exactly does deino's lunge work? i cant find any explanation. do you hold down right click to keep hold of the target? can you bite while you're holding right click?

[left scroll]

It's meant to be used to drag things into/underwater. Either drown them or if they get free, just bite them because everything else swims so slow

[full ocean]

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[cold palm]

this is called "balance-feedback-discussion" for a reason, lets keep this just for sugestion and keep ur dumb ideas to yourself.

[full ocean]

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[crystal wharf]

i love how people instant go to, "BUFF ANIMAL BECAUSE I CANT HIT ANYTHING WITH ITS STRONGEST ATTACK" instead of asking for the hitboxes to be fixed

[slim dragon]

When a bug breaks the game, balance the game around the bug instead of fixing it. This is really what all game devs should do 😛

[safe anchor]

errr what?

[golden coral]

@safe anchor I think they mean that most people want to buff the deino damage and all that instead of asking for the hitboxes to be fixed. Since right now hitboxes seems messed up, and it's hard for deino to land both normal attacks and the lunge, which would contribute to it's issues with handling things. That as well as whatever river parts there are that seem to be "death traps" for deinos, since people hunt them there, which could probably do with some fixes, so terrestials can't just hunt the deinos like that.

[safe anchor]

the lunge isnt easy to use at all and takes time to get use too.keep in mind that deino can grab you and just drown you if it gets a hold of you 0 fight back

deino is a surprise predator not a run a round on land creature

[golden coral]

Well, a lot of people, or so it seems, are apparently unhappy with how it is as of right now, and I suspect there's at least something to it, even if it might not be what they think the issue is.

[safe anchor]

say you buff the bite force to be able to fight steggo right at that point whats the point in being in the water at all other then to get around the map

[crystal wharf]

exactly

deino already does enough damage to be able to kill most animals that it cant lunge with only bites, and if it can lunge something they have no chance at escape unless the deino player doesnt play well

[golden coral]

I do not disagree, I don't think deino need a buff, and if it gets one, it should just be another 100 or so, so it still does not oneshot a utah, even on headshot. That way you still have to grab for a guaranteed kill, but you would be slightly more scary to fight in general. Aside from that, maybe work on multipliers, could make the deino a bit more tanky, while still making it a bad idea to fight on land due to low damage. But there also seems to be other issues, some map parts that might be difficult to be in, and the hitbox issues, unless all those claims are just people making other sorts of mistakes I suppose.

[craggy frost]

yea, for example if you are over a certain weight, you just out right win the engagement, but if the targets within a closer bracket lets say just 300KG above or below you, you don't just fling them into the air and drag em off, but instead you end up grabbing a leg and then start the power struggle, if they win you lose a load of stam and they get away, if you win you get them onto the ground to then initiate the drag which they are still able to try struggle out of but with much greater effort on their stamina, provided the Deino has the stamina to be able to take the target on they might end up miss judging the size of the intended prey and they will lose because they just are not strong enough to down the prey.

[rapid bison]

did stego's health get buffed or was it only the weight?

[craggy frost]

but everything changes if the prey is in the water, because if they are swimming, suddenly the deino is going to have the massive advantage unless the prey is something very very big, but then you can in fact have multiple deinos latch onto the same target to help bring down even very large prey.

[golden coral]

No idea, I've heard both yes and no to it, so.. who knows! :p

[rapid bison]

if it wasn't buffed, then the current 500 damage for deino doesn't sound too bad if they just fix the hitboxes for the bite and lunge

[novel tulip]

^

The goal of deino is to get its prey into the water, where its blind and drowning

Not follow it on land and bite it to death

I get the lunge being buggy rn but thats something thats fixable (I've also seen some successful lunges that killed the sub carnos i was with, those were smart deinos)

[mighty knot]

Everyone pulls the "Deino is supposed to be ambush predator" card out as soon as someone suggests buffing the bite damage..

And sure, sure, it is

but a crocodile like that

CAN hold it's own on land against a pack of smalls

like utahs or even carnos

Now if you think upping the bite damage is gonna turn it into some legacy rex (it won't) then just nerf it's stam and speed on land

Just nerf the stam

so that it can for example, run into the water if it's basking, or chase down the thing it just crippled for the finishing blow, but not so that it can get out of the water and ambush that ptera that's sitting 40 meters away

It won't be a short rundown hunter if it's both one of the slowest sprinters, and can only sprint for let's put it at.. 6 seconds.

But if you go out on to land like I do as a Deino, to bait foolish utahs into trying to attack you

because you know Deino has the power, and turn speed to do it

and health to tank failed hits

especially now

[slim dragon]

But maybe deino would be able to defend itself on land with just fixed hiboxes

[mighty knot]

when being an ambush deino is literally the worst thing you can do

[slim dragon]

We can't tell if an increase in bite damage is necessary when its hitbox is broken

[mighty knot]

maybe not

but 500!?

dafuq?

This is the kinda thing a rex should fear being bit by

and yet carnos can shrug off 3 bites

It's stupid

nerf deino's stam into the ground

make it useless on land

but bite force is something it can have anyway

it's something that the crocodile is made for really

they usually have more bite force too XD

so what are you proposing

if you want realistic Deino than give it all 26000 newtons of biteforce it had

lmao

Yes

It should be able to run at the speed it does

for like

5 seconds

for balance

but

maybe

just remember it can't be able to hunt on land like that

BUT

it better bite harder than a rex

and better bite much harder

even legacy rex had 1200 biteforce

and I dont think we need to nerf it

again

speed

rex couldn't run IRL

why should it marathon sprint ingame

Yup ^

[slim dragon]

Biteforce isn't what makes a bite devastating or not
The fact they're using it in-game to calculate damage is wrong in many ways

[safe anchor]

okay we give the croc 18k bite force enjoy dying in one hit no matter where it bites you does that sound fun? the answer is no, keep in mind this is just a stress test for servers not to test out the new creatures.

[mighty knot]

I'm not proposing 18k biteforce that's stupid lmao

yes

but Deino 4 shotting something that weighs a 4th as much as it

AND being a crocodile of all things

is pretty stupid

as a suggestion that someone made earlier

rexes should fear this thing

it bites harder, and has the advantage at the water's edge

[safe anchor]

okay look at it this way do you see croc irl bite something and then let go and bite again and repeat this no, they bite clamp down and drag its prey into water where the croc has all the advantages.

[slim dragon]

tug-of-war is being tinkered

[mighty knot]

Yeah, lunge is awesome, but it causes issues in all honesty

your either 1 shotting something, or it's totally useless

of course if it's 50% of your weight you can literally just grab it and pull it under

that's alright

the thing your grabbing should be able to do damage though

so it's not a free 1 shot

but bigger things

a tug of war needs to be a thing

lunge needs to be a battle

not a win or get cucked by this stego because it barely reacts to the 8 ton prehistoric murder log running full speed into it

yeah

They can hit you 4 more times as you do xD

Deino is a bit of a joke right now

with fixing to the lunge hitbox

and alt bite hitbox

it may be a little better

but still

[brittle dirge]

rn hit/hurtboxes need to be fixed for Deino

[mighty knot]

it's a pretty big joke either way

nobody fears it

[rapid bison]

i was once hit by a ptera while completely submerged in water...

[mighty knot]

Yup ^

[brittle dirge]

same honestly lol

[mighty knot]

I've been headshot for 25% health by a stego swining randomly at the top of the water

after retreating

underwater entirely

stego just totally beats the crap out of everything right now

and yeah yeah it should it should

but seriously

it's not fun at all

Having the entire shallow river being closed off because a stego is patrolling it

is totally ruining gameplay for Deino

Yeah a decent carno can destroy a Deino on land

well not really

^

Deino is such a joke and it's really sad

it's not worth 5 hours just to have your entire playing area nullified by a single stego

that teams up with anything that isn't a deino

to make your life hell

because right now it's everything VS deinos

and everything is winning, even without help from eachother

Thats a given

but they don't need to be smart now

they just go to shallow river

or stick with a stego

and a deino literally can't do jack

or you place a pair of stegos at Y

and the deino's just starve to death

Actually

ambush predator is the worst thing for deino to do now

gets you no food

it's better to run on land and fight a pack of carnos

or eat fish

or other deinos

[brittle dirge]

Because Stego's bully Deino in their own element and every other herbie is gonna use Stego's like a meat shield the only things Deino can reliably hunt is younger versions of itself, Ptera's, fish, and maybe a stray juvie if it gets lucky and is big enough to grab it.

[mighty knot]

I have only seen one deino get a kill with lunge ambush

and it was me, just once

I killed another adult deino first

took a meat chunk and plced it at the shore

and waited for 20 minutes

for all that effort I was rewarded a juvie carno

[brittle dirge]

not to mention with how oxygen works rn sitting at the bottom of a river isn't really a good idea cause it takes just as long to regain oxygen lol

[golden coral]

@pallid palm I'll just say, carno and utah should not go near a deino unless in big groups (for utahs maybe slightly less, since they do have their pounce for big game), but the same goes just as well for stego. Neither deino nor stego is something a carno, even a group of them, should look at and think "yes, this is prey to me", and even utahs should have to come in at least 6+ numbers to go "yes, lets try and hunt the deino that is basking/stego that is grazing over there on the plains". But as of right now, neither of these things are that, because game balance.

[lament cloak]

i agree deino needs a buff to damage, but deino isnt terrible, it has an attack that essentially oneshots 3/4 of the the entire current roster, and you can easilly run to the water as long as your not too far from it. most deinos die to being cocky and running too far from water, underestmating stegos, or other deinos. so as long as your not underestimating the power of other things, your only going to die to your own kind

a buff to deino damage so that it oneshots utah to the body and a tug of war mechanic for animals from 3-6.5 tons would be good. deino would just pick up anything smaller

[mighty knot]

I think that's basically a perfect world there ^^

[lament cloak]

the problem is i dont want the tug of war to be, click this button to win, so idk how they would do it

the biggest thing I see deino effectivly hunting in a tug of war is para, even though para and stego are around the same size, the stego could still be stabbing you while your pulling, though it would have a small chance to pull something bigger

technically unofficial but everyone goes by this, para is only 3/4s of a ton lighter than stego, and at weight that high that isnt too much of a difference.

to be fair, buffalo don't have a frill protecting their neck, so its would be way harder to actually grab a trike

[late hatch]

Why are there so many deino apologists here lmao deino is PLENTY strong enough. It in no way shape or form needs a buff. You cannot say its too weak just because you personally do not know how to play the dino yet. Its new. Its a learning curve. A deino 2 shotting with a bite and 1 shotting with its lunge is more that powerful enough.

Stop comparing a gator to a rex.

And also for the love of god. As a deino. DONT FIGHT A STEGO. You can take on every other dino and even stego below like 80%, theres always gunna be something you cant take on.

[rapid kestrel]

deino must 1 shot a utah...lunge must rework...8 from 10 hits fail...alt leftclick the same...i think/hope that the devs overwork the deino a bit...

[late hatch]

Deino doesnt need to take full stegos. It doesnt matter if its a bit smaller. The issue with utahs just means you rework utahs and give them a nerf. Deinos can take just about everything with ease in the water, which is the point. Stop trying to make deino a rex when its not.

Stegos are actually comparable to african elephants, not hippos. Crocs dont take elephants in the wild for the most part. So crocs shouldnt take stegos by comparison.

Its the same with legacy. Shants were not a threat to rexes at 100%. Thats fair. Apexes shouldnt be able to take everything with a similar growth time with ease

[misty sable]

I agree with your point, but man are you wildly incorrect about that shant vs rex part, I remember two years ago shants could easily trot rexes down and would hunt them down in packs That was super unenjoyable for rex players tho

[late hatch]

Thats what i meant, im multitasking atm and missed a couple words XD

[dim radish]

There will be more dinosaurs, like Maia and stuff which Deino will be able to hunt, pushing it to hunt stegos does seem a bit ridiculous, since stego will probably be buffed in the future

[late hatch]

I meant that rexes arent a threat to shants, as a shant main i cant believe i messed that wording up DX

Stego isnt immune to it tho

Deino can take out adult stegos with headshots easy

[misty sable]

wait has locational damage been added in this update already?

[lament cloak]

yeah idk about the "shant being immune to rex" sure its over 5 tons heavier, but it has no weapons other than size

my point was that shant has nothing going for it other than size, and while size is very helpful, it can only do so much

especially when fighting something with an extremely powerful weapon

its like humans vs utah, sure the utah is much bigger, but the humans have an extremely powerful weapon (aka a gun) so you might just get your head blown clean off your shoulders. so while i think shant should be stronger for balance reasons, I wouldn't be surprised of a rex would win most of the time irl. but thats real life and this is a fantasy game so idk

[late hatch]

Its because stegos are as big as elephants lmao

[alpine plover]

Shant would be the more likely victor, especially if it happens to form herds.

Hadrosaurs have been found to have used their tails as rudimentary weapons, though they have also gotten damaged in the process.

But deino Vs stego

Deino has the upper hand in water, Stego has the upper land on land

And in a fight the Stego should, realistically, keep it's tail in front of the Deino if it doesn't want it's head ripped off

[limber elbow]

That’s just a different species of stegosaurus

[limber elbow]

Look up stegosaurus armatus, 9m long , 4m tall can’t find anything on it saying anything is outdated. If you thing the above stego is stenops like the size chart you referenced then of course it’s not as big as an elephant but armatus is up there in size

[alpine plover]

The Isle uses S stenops

Armatus is not real, there are only two Stego species

Stenops and ungulatus.

[limber elbow]

I got an article on it Bc I tried looking that specifically up and couldn’t find one

U*

[alpine plover]

Ungulatus just has more pointy spines than Stenops.

[dim radish]

Ptera is so pathetic in it's attack, if you want to nerve it's hitbox, might as well remove the attack all together.
Ptera doesn't need a nerf, tf. It's annoying but just live with it that's a player problem of people wanting to troll other players, that'll always happen

[modest carbon]

nerf ptera lmao

might as well nerf hypsi while you're at it

[nocturne zenith]

Ptera bite is perfect

You will be fighting other pteras most of the time so its not an issue

[civic moth]

Ptera fighting

should not happen

I mean

other creatures

like it is fine if they fight against each other ones but Pteranodon killing other people is

idk

[nocturne zenith]

The only thing ptera can kill is hypsi and other pteras,and fresh spawns

[civic moth]

it doesn't feel right as a such fragile animal with such weak attacks.

Killing Hypsi is fine to me like it is much smaller.

[untold sable]

teh fuck u talking about figh inside the same species is something normal

[civic moth]

I mean yeah

but Ptera fighting each other to death

with peaks

that's the same as Dryo

[modest carbon]

Have you seen their spear beaks? Ptera v ptera is fine

[sinful cove]

Reduced interspecies fight damage sounds so abusable and reduces punishment for fucking up pack coordination in a hunt

[ember hearth]

alright im not saying dieno needs a buff but i will say that it seems dienos like hitbox maybe bugged? like i lunged at 4 utahs and didtn grab a single one. i just went through them and it seems like this happens to me more often than not.

[sinful cove]

What is “buff hypsi” even supposed to mean that's so vague

Buff what? It's hp, its damage? It doesn't need either of those

[novel tulip]

Hypsi should one shot stego

[sinful cove]

Hypsi spit should dissolve your face and make your brains spill out

Also why they put (crocodile) after deino lmao what else could deino mean that they felt the need to specify

[alpine plover]

Deino the not crocodile- obviously :0

[alpine plover]

Hypsi could use a fall damage reduction buff and its "super jump" should take less stam

but other then that its fine imo

[sinful cove]

personally i find its spit dumb too, it should be a conical aim and not a stream

it doesn't nee any hard buffs, just mechanics fixing

[spare badger]

Yes

[slim dragon]

Ptera stamina drain is perfectly fine as an adult, you can almost fly forever

[spare badger]

Unless your going up and down over and over but like what do you expect

[alpine plover]

As an adult, yes

But when you start.. Ptera has awful stamina drain

Well, all through really

Hatchling pteras lose all their stamina as soon as they take off

At least make them recover stamina while gliding

I agree that Ptera has a lot of stamina problems rn

[sinful cove]

Ptera doesn't need regen while gliding, especially when they get around to adding thermals which they were testing a while back

[dim radish]

Yeah I agree.
Some people wish for it, some don't and personally I don't really care but can live with both.
Ptera doesn't need stam regen. There are a LOT of places where it can land safely, vibe there for a minute and then fly across the entire map in one go.
Sure, if you go up and fly fast you'll use your stam.
That's the entire point

[slim dragon]

The fact baby ptera runs out of stam as soon as it takes off is the only thing that makes it somewhat balanced

You should be happy that ptera can fly from 1% growth and not need to wait 100% or "learn to fly" by watching other pteras fly as people have suggested

[cedar shore]

@knotty venture Adult ptera stam can last for a long tile as long as you use it efficiently (aka not directly upwards)

[dim radish]

^ This.
Do people expect baby Pteras to fly very long?
If you take off from the spot you're standing on, you can fly up just a tad and then glide until you find a good place to land and sit.
A baby ptera doesn't need more, since it can also sit on a rock until it's juvi without starving, where flying works 100 times better

[toxic crypt]

deino hunting baby deinos is normal

[cosmic hamlet]

https://discordapp.com/channels/401464048610312193/778350260027129865/833582183511752714 @knotty venture People don't like stamina regen in the air. I think that flying big distances is more something for the quetz, which already has endless stamina as a dev creature. Ptera can manage to fly with low stamina. If regen is added, it should be not more than half of your growth percentage and after that, it stops. But actually, forget it

[dim radish]

I personally wouldn't say hold to rip would be very favorable, since most scavengers probably just want to snatch a chunk of meat and bail. Making it a short tab makes it more... idk, it makes more sense to me

[modest carbon]

Ohhhhj

Gotcha

You're right

Like a quick thing verses

Yup

[dim radish]

Rip and run versus grab and drag

[modest carbon]

Yeh! 👍

[knotty venture]

oh yeah def agree with both of you @cosmic hamlet @cedar shore I have yet to reach full grown I only wish the stam was a tad better. I see countless feedback on the croc but hardly any on ptera.

[sinful cove]

It's very easy to reach full grow on ptera esp if you aint trying to fly into orbit or something lol

[stark knoll]

dont hold space, shift, or w while flying and you can go forever

[knotty venture]

haha yeah it is and I nearly got to it once but decided to try croc. last time I was getting close to it but my z break was broken

so I spent last night trying to fix it i still dont know if deleting the file worked or not. but i will find out at a later date.

[cedar shore]

Im not sure how you are flying tbh but you might wana change it a bit. Dont hold shift or space for unnessecairly amounts. As a full adult pteranadon i can fly from radio tower to quite littearly any spot on the map in one go.

[fallow wagon]

wrong. Just don't hold Space any longer than you need to, don't go any higher than you need to. It's only bad if you need to go over a hill/mountain, but hey once you get to the top of that you're golden. Fly for distance, not height. Give it about 15 minutes before you start going for altitude, maybe more. Just gotta know your limits and know how to efficiently fly

[alpine plover]

I'm not even trying to go for a hill, just want to at least be at trees level.. or around there

but Ptera wastes so much stamina even that is hard to do

[fallow wagon]

above the canopy? Yea that's just too high for a freshspawn

and don't ever hold space to gain altitude, that definitely is a waste

tilt your camera up lightly with W for gradual gain w/o losing momentum

maybe tap shift to gain altitude quickly w/o using much stam

[alpine plover]

well, as a hatchling pressing shift just wastes one third of your stamina in a go.. so, yeah

[fallow wagon]

so then don't do it as a fresh spawn

[alpine plover]

I understand that going upwards should drain stamina, since you're going against the wind.. but

Ptera has a really hard time with stamina levels

it's not efficient, at least imo

[fallow wagon]

Ptera grows so fast and your stamina gets so much better so quickly

[alpine plover]

gliding should at least recover a bit of stamina

[fallow wagon]

it's honestly perfectly fine

[alpine plover]

it is true that it requires skill to fly, but.. yeah

[fallow wagon]

you just gotta be good w/ your stam

[alpine plover]

I like the fact that at least when you're skimming the water and want to gain altitude it doesn't consume stamina when you press space

[fallow wagon]

if you're trying to go super high and hold space and hold shift or constantly go up and down and up and down then you're just throwing stam out the window

[alpine plover]

once a Ptera is more of an adult, yeah.. Stamina gets more manageable, still wastes quite a bit.. but more manageable

as a hatchling.. yeah

[fallow wagon]

before you take off, think about what you wanna spend your stam on this flight, and jus be smart w/ it

[alpine plover]

it's definitely way too much imo

[fallow wagon]

nah

it's perfectly fine for a fresh spawn

i've flown from the beach all the way to center in a single launch as a fresh spawn twice now

and i coulda gone further if i wanted, i jus chose to stop at center

[alpine plover]

well, I don't know how you do it.. but, that is not possible for me

and I'm not the only one that believes Ptera wastes way too much stamina

[fallow wagon]

I believe many players are just not being careful enough w/ their stamina and are expecting something like BoB Ptera and are surprised when they can't fly forever and be invincible

[alpine plover]

I don't want to fly forever

but I also don't want to stop a minute or two after I took off

which is what's happening right now to a lot of people

[slim dragon]

As a ptera you can just release the W button and glide without using any stamina

[fallow wagon]

because they're wasting their stamina w/ poor flying

[slim dragon]

Adult ptera really has a lot of stam, it doesn't need any more, nor stamina regen

[fallow wagon]

if you need to stop flying two minutes after takeoff then you must have used all your stamina doing something silly

like forgetting to let go of shift or gaining altitude w/ hard pressing space

[alpine plover]

I don't even press shift anymore because I know that's just a waste of stamina

precious stamina a Ptera needs

and I noticed that the more you hold space the more stamina consumes, so if anything.. I'm trying to tap it

[fallow wagon]

there u go

[alpine plover]

but as a hatchling, take off already wastes 50% of your stamina

it's not efficient

[slim dragon]

Actually shift is pretty useless
It consumes a lot of stamina whilst you never really need to go fast

[fallow wagon]

because you're meant to fly for distance and not height as fresh spawn

[slim dragon]

The fact you can fly as a fresh spawn is already a great thing

I expected much worse

[fallow wagon]

when i said i flew from the beach to center twice

i was not high up at all

it's a distance flight

at most i was skimming the top of the canopy because the land beneath me lowered in elevation, i didn't do much to gain any altitude

tapping space or tilting your camera up w/ the camera and W are the best ways to gain altitude, holding space loses too much momentum and uses up so much stam

imma go play Ptera now and try to make that flight a 3rd time lol, it's fun

[alpine plover]

well

even pressing W while flying straight loses stamina.. which is, dumb

at least for me

but yeah

[fallow wagon]

because pressing W is active flying

jus glide

no W

no stam lost

[alpine plover]

I guess it's meant to be a skill based Dino.. going to take some practice, as everything

[fallow wagon]

if you jus wanna fly straight then don't press W at all

only W for turning w/ the camera or for tilting up

don't even needa do it for the first one tho coz A/D/ctrl work fine for left right and down, tho i sometimes like the feel of turning with camera so i do it instead. Idk if that uses stam or not i cant remember

im not tryna shut you down or anythin, you really do jus gotta learn the limits and nuances of Ptera stam management, otherwise you'll jus be wastin stam

[north fractal]

I think there were some upwinds planned that will help in gaining altitude without consuming stam

[alpine plover]

that will come in handy

[knotty venture]

I have been plenty careful when flying, but it wastes so much when you have to constantly hold space bar so you dont drop into the water when trying to fish.

[fallow wagon]

but you don't have to

you just tap it gently @knotty venture

tap tap tap

just enough to keep your lower jaw submerged

[modest carbon]

☝️

[alpine plover]

Any tips for flying? I just spend almost an hr just trying to fly around the darned cliff to get to water, and now I'm dying. Flying anywhere takes soooo long!

[slim dragon]

You can scroll up a bit, Jenna was giving a ton of advice for flying to someone else

[alpine plover]

Really sucks, I'm almost full adult and haven't drank or eaten even once because I spawned at a bad part of the map and am too slow to get around, lol.

[pale cloak]

Honestly flying is more of a matter of practice and experience, especially fishing, you gotta tap that spacebar, but too much and your going hungry, too little and the deino get a easy meal, kinda wish when fishing you could glide instead of tap space every 3-4 seconds

[slim dragon]

I don't know how really, ptera flight is the fastest way to get around in the game. I've never had any problem finding food or water as one

[pale cloak]

The tricks gliding, don't press w while aiming up or down, don't hold space, or shift, just glide, no energy loss.

[alpine plover]

Well I spawned at Northwest, then was a dumb dumb and flew north, alll the north around the mountains. Since I can only stay in the air for a lil bit, and regaining stam takes so long, I didn't get around to water before dying.

I use all my stam just getting a decent bit up in the air tho ^^'

[pale cloak]

Resting faster recovery for stam

[alpine plover]

I know

[pale cloak]

Also, you don't gotta get over the trees, if you want to do that, jump off a mountain

You can fly from north mountain to center mountains easy

just don't try to land on the center mountains, I already learned my lesson

[alpine plover]

Can't get up high enough to get on a mountain xD

[pale cloak]

I honestly don't have a issue flying tree top level into a mountains base then running up it.

Though I do wish certain actions wasted less energy

[earnest robin]

A great way to practice a nice big glide as a fresh spawn ptera is to spawn “north” and then get as high up as you can. You can then glide all the way to the rocks that meet the river in the same direction as the radio tower off in the distance (I don’t know th location names yet haha). If you’re using mouse and keys, definitely take everyone’s advice on the W key so you don’t waste too much stamina. I’ve made that flight countless times and typically hang out over there to grow all the way to adult! It takes some practice but once you get the hang of it you’ll be a pro ptera c:

[pale cloak]

unless you're unlucky like me and spawn back end of the mountains....

[alpine plover]

Thanks, just really have a hard time seeing how I can do anything with this little stam. Just getting in the air and up a bit drains it all.

[pale cloak]

As you grow the drain is less and your stam increases

[earnest robin]

Oh yeah it’ll be 100% empty once you take off in the way I’ve explained. But it’ll carry you to that location. You may need to rest to regain some stamina back but yes, as you grow so does your stamina. Then you can take off without using as much stam as you would being a wee baby.

[pale cloak]

It's their so people can't full power fly up to the world cap, or just spend all day mountain height, gives a balance so even the pters gotta struggle to survive like everyone else

Plus as a pter you're gonna want to be near the water anyway

For fishing

[alpine plover]

Well by dead birb was almost 100% adult and it didn't feel much better xD I guess I'm too used to BoB, flying in that game is the best feeling. Anyway, I'll just keep trying to figure it out, thanks for your replies. 🙂

[pale cloak]

Honestly, just don't try to fly higher than your standing shift+space take off and you'll fly for a long time.

Unless you George of the jungle into a tree.

[alpine plover]

Eep, how do I fish? ^^' Can't see it in the controls.

[slim dragon]

Right-click when close to water

[stark knoll]

#announcements message

[slim dragon]

You can also just bite the water, it's faster but kinda random

[pale cloak]

Hold right click while slowly tapping space over water around ripples in the water, when you can grab a fish, you'll get a prompt, then release and right click again quickly to catch it.

Don't worry, you fly mildly slower while in this animation

[alpine plover]

Are there ripples in all water, or just some? Cause I can't find it xD

[stark knoll]

fish spawn in all water but the ocean, it can be tricky to find them though

[alpine plover]

Are the ripples easy to see?

[stark knoll]

pretty easy, but you have to be close to the water, if youre too high in the air you wont be able to see them

[alpine plover]

Well, been flying up and down waters for almost an hr now, not a single ripple and now I die xD

Then I spawn in at another part of the mp and immediately, fish. Seems to me like they don't really spawn in swamps and small streams.

[sinful cove]

Personally think dryo speed should be lowered to 50-52 and its dodge should be overhauled to not be useless as fuck

[spare badger]

It's dodge has been useful to me in the past. Why do you think it's so bad?

[sinful cove]

50km/h dryo, good stam, a dodge that is omnidirection aimable and doesn't stop you in your tracks after using it, maybe even gives a short speed burst

Dodge rn is kinda lame because it costs stam to jump a bit to the side in an inconsistent direction and then stop your acceleration

Aimable like utah's lunge while in motion, short speed burst, this would make it a worthy ability and not a waste of stam like the current one

[spare badger]

It does kinda stop you it's a bit weird but I'm still able to dodge Utah pounces.with it but I agree it's direction makes no sense

[golden coral]

Can't you jump left/right by looking that way? Isn't it only random if you're just looking forward?

[spare badger]

It's weird I look one way and dodge right but I did it again but I jumped left that time even though I was still looking to the right

[golden coral]

Strange. Last I played it (update 2) it worked pretty well for me, never ended up going a way I wasn't looking, but maybe it's more finicky now or something

[civic moth]

How long is the timer in #balance-feedback ?

[mighty knot]

@alpine plover It actually accelerates faster than a utah, I think that's the main problem. It's full speed sprint turn is actually much worse than the one in legacy, and if you turn any tighter than 10 degrees in a second you loose speed, it's really really bad turning. And compared to other thing's in it's tier, it turns in place pretty slow too.

[golden coral]

Even at the weakest multiplier, you'd do that much damage already I think. Also not sure, I'd rather just the biggest hitbox count. Make it more valuable to keep your vital areas out of actual reach, instead of using tail to "block" them.

[spare badger]

That's when I did too

[random bramble]

I feel like the Deino is no where strong enough. 3 Adult Deinos killed by 2 adult carnos

[alpine plover]

must have been trash deinos

[jolly osprey]

Yeah... those Deinos are ass.

[alpine plover]

Deinos on land get killed by everything and even running into the water carnos can follow and tank a few bites before escaping alive. A deino isn’t trash if it’s killed by something that it can’t hit. The player is simply to stubborn to retreat, or not chased into the water then killed cause it can’t put enough damage on a full health carno to kill it before it gets killed.

And if you’d like to argue otherwise grow a deino of NA7 where I have an adult carno and I’ll gladly kill you to prove a point

Say ‘trash deinos’ like your better than the people that died then please prove it.

Lmao I had a ptera ass ride my juvi deino once just because I wasnt able to turn around

Rip man

not a huge deal, just a tiny bit annoying

[lament cloak]

maybe you should have used your nifty little alt bite, but i guess "good" players dont use that

[alpine plover]

oh i was trying to

it was like riding my tail, every time i used it's alt bite i couldnt really hit him

Alt bite can’t hit a good player who knows how to ride a deino

im sure theyll balance deino and movement a lot more in the future

We can only hope

[slim dragon]

@alpine plover Why do you even want to kill a stego as a ptera ? You're literally a paper plane trying to attack a tank
Even if it's a tiny tank, it's completely out of your league

[sinful cove]

People seein' ptera on the carni roster and thinking that means it should hunt something that can beat up a utah when they weigh less than a dryo

[dusty fable]

@alpine plover ptera isnt supposed to? its basically a spectator/adventurer, not a fighter. to be viable it doesnt need to kill anything

[sinful cove]

They also upvoted their own suggestion

Ptera is a fisher and a scavenger. Maybe it can beat up compies and juvie hypsis when they come out lmao

[dusty fable]

thats it, sure itll take an opportuning to kill a nest spawn maybe but thats about it

[slim dragon]

Hey that's funny because I'm about to make a buff suggestion about ptera

@stone flax Just wait for spino and you'll be satisfied

[stone flax]

Meh :c i prefer gator. Spino looks nice but it should be half land half water. Be able to eat and get fish but not be a water ambush predator and be able to walk long distances on land like a normal threopod.

[slim dragon]

But what you're suggesting is literally stealing spino's niche in favor of deino

[stone flax]

I dont want spino to literally just be a bigger better deino cus wtf is the point of deino if they play the exact same

[slim dragon]

Except for the stamina part

[stone flax]

Nah spino is not an aquatic ambush predator

[slim dragon]

Spino is made to bully deinos though, it'll probably be slower in water
And impossible to ambush with

[stone flax]

Its a terrestrial apex predator who works more like a jaguar i would say. It can find food in water but wont be as good in it as deino but still much better than other terrestrial dinos

I really dont want spino to just be a deino 2.0. If its better in water and also can run around on land without worry then there is no reason for deino to exist

[slim dragon]

You could say the same about Utah and Carno, or Carno and Allo, or Allo and rex

[stone flax]

Utah is a pack animal that uses pounches and bleed to kill prey carno is bigger and uses its horns and speed to ram its prey and hit and run tactics.

Allo is more tanky and hunt larger prey.

Rex is much slower and is am ambush predator

Literally none of these are as simular as deino and spino in terms or gameplay i would say

[sinful cove]

The isle's spinorex honestly looks like it'll be trash in water and just be able to walk on deep lake/riverbeds like a dumb looking hippo, mainly using water as an escape route and not to hunt

They made it so terrestrial in its build

It would honestly be a crime to make that abomination better than deino in the water

[slim dragon]

Deino has ambush and water speed, spino has sheer strenghth and land efficiency

[stone flax]

Im happy as long as thier gameplay is not the same and spino is not a deino 2.0 bigger and better.

Dondi wanted a jp3 spino so thats why its so terrestrial looking

[sinful cove]

Yeah dondi likes jp a bit too much sometimes

[stone flax]

@slim dragon yeh so why you say deino would steal spinos nishe?

I literally suggested to make deino better in the ways its supposed to be good and be worse on land and thats stealing spinos niche i am confuse

[slim dragon]

Because you're making it the size and strenghth of spino

[stone flax]

Dude its the size its supposed to be not my fault evolution made it so. They said they were gonna make all dinos the maximun size in evrima so im sure spino is gonna be fucking huge aswell. And besides spino has strong arms and claws and terrestrial speed so he is not a pushover anyways

[slim dragon]

Spino's gonna be around 13 meters

[stone flax]

Im asking it to be the maximum size it is suspected to be not make it 30% bigger than its maximum size

Im sure spino will be bigger tbh

Rex is what 12m in isle? And its gonna be bigger in evrima

Anyways thats my thoughts. We will just have to wait and see how spino will be tbh. I am excited for that fella aswell

[knotty venture]

@fallow wagon Tapping gently wasnt working I had to hold it a tad longer then tapping to stop myself from dropping into the water

[slim dragon]

You'll get the hang of it

[vernal sentinel]

Yes make ptera lose even more stam than it already loses

[slim dragon]

Ptera stam is far from being a problem

And it'll only change things if you are fighting

[vernal sentinel]

[slim dragon]

I was asking if people find ptera's stam is bad

[cedar shore]

@slim dragon Perhaps hold alt for a heavy peck

[slim dragon]

Doesn't seem very practical

[rapid charm]

@lyric ice because there are no rules

[lyric ice]

i mean it in a sense why cant i do shit about it?

why cant i fight back?

just because i play the croc does not mean ppl should be able to hold me hostage...

[hallow rose]

you can just swim away

[lyric ice]

you cant swim away if you are at the pond in the south

[stone flax]

I like how every suggestion with deino gets a

and a ❌

I dunno i blame stego mains for this i just do

[modest carbon]

If you went into the pond yourself that's on you if ur stuck

If you spawn there then that's different

[frosty heron]

Just wait til big carnivores come out and you will see a lot of those reactions

[lyric ice]

8 ton croc not a big carni?

[frosty heron]

It's not a land hunter, I'm talking about big theropods such as Allo or Acro

Deino it's indeed big, but it shouldn't be as strong as a land predator and so not be a danger outside the water, and for the current roster its ok that the Deino can't take on a Stego 1v1. The issue with Deino it's it gets bullied by the entire roster right now and self defense doesn't seem like a real threat (hitbox issues and the low damage)

[nocturne zenith]

Thats cuz carno is op

Amazing agility,amazing power and good health for a 2h growth carni

[frosty heron]

I have to disagree, Utah right now it's better than Carno

[nocturne zenith]

How

[frosty heron]

Carno it's far from OP, has a 50/50 fight against Tenos which are on the same weight class, Stegos can give them a good fight, and Utahs just bullies them with the superior agility

[frosty heron]

Utah turns sharp and it's agile enought to dodge Carnos bites, you can even somehow "tailride them"

While sprinting I mean

Also Utah has better chance hunting Stegos than Carnos just because the pounce

Carno might seems better now because the netcode it's way better with the powerful servers and makes it easier to land bites on small targets tho, but I never count lag in balance stuff.

[crystal wharf]

carnos lack of stamina and completely abysmal matchup against tenonto, deino, and stego, automatically make it a much 'worse' animal in current evrima than utah

[modest carbon]

100%, utah is definitely in a great place rn

[old hull]

i see so many paragraphs about the deinos damage and i swear all of them are just "REE REE i cant facetank a stego , croc weak REE" worded in a way where it would almost trick you into believing it

[modest carbon]

The amount of yo buff up the 8 ton croc so it can wreck everything is ridiculous lol

But honestly it's bite force is the only thing keeping it in the water

[old hull]

exactly , its damage is fine , they cry that it cant 2 shot a carno when they refuse to use their damn lunge which can if used correctly insta kill a carno

[modest carbon]

If you were to buff the bite force why would it have to stay hidden to drown stuff when you can just run up on land and yeet everything

[slim dragon]

Oh people dont like my idea of buffing ptera damage
Too bad I really wanted to kill things as a paper plane 😦

[old hull]

exactly i swear the amount of stupidity i read on there is insane , thank god the devs know better then to listen to such nonsence

[nocturne zenith]

i agree with Utah Being better now that i think about it,but isnt carno better than teno?

[modest carbon]

Yes, but no. Teno is more overall balanced but dies purely because carnos attack doesn't take stamina like tenos tail slam. And also cuz its faster and can run away to go heal or something

[drifting thorn]

Can you put More AI food for Land Dinos....PLEASE... unless other player die there is no dam Food......

[modest carbon]

Wow what a repeated post 👏

[frosty heron]

It isn't if both players know what to fight each other, Teno can tail slam the shif outta them if they fall onto a Stun attack, in the other hand if Teno goes for a frontal offensive attack it probably might lose

[lyric ice]

how you drown a swimming dino?

[modest carbon]

By crying

[lyric ice]

huh?

[modest carbon]

Hopefully they do something about not being able to grab something that's swimming

I made a suggestion earlier about having some sort of grapple for swimming dinos

[lyric ice]

i like that idea

[modest carbon]

Sometimes you can position yourself at the bottom of a river and catch them if the river isn't too deep

[lyric ice]

i hope they implement that

[modest carbon]

Yeah

[lyric ice]

would make sense at least

i mean why shouldnt you be able to do so in the first place?

[modest carbon]

It's in general feedback somewhere but I suggested be able to weigh down bigger dinos if they are swimming so they sink under the water

Since you can't really grab em

[earnest robin]

I think that would be a neat idea.

Anything that’s big enough to not be 1 shot by a deino that’s swimming in deep water should be at risk to be slowed or pulled down by a deino. And as I believe you mentioned, the Deino would be forced to let go once said dinosaurs feet touch the ground. That way not everything that’s being pulled down is immediately drowned, and still has a chance to get away. But if their stamina is already low from say running away from being hunted and they risk crossing, it may either save them or end them.

That would make for interesting gameplay since it would make the player that’s crossing the river make a calculated risk if they’re really needing to cross. It’ll also make players really learn the map as well so they can decide if they should head for perhaps more shallow waters or take a longer route to avoid being a potential meal for deinos. I think that would encourage a little bit more traffic away from rivers to give land carnivores a better shot at hunting as well.

Maybe that would provide a more balanced carnivore, both land and semi-aquatic, hunting experience 🤔

[modest carbon]

yes!

[onyx wyvern]

I think it's funny that stego players think it's perfectly fine that a Herbie gets to body guard and terrorize carnis without being checked, the stego is OP period no Herbie should be body guarding and KOSing.

[modest carbon]

is it... really that bad? Like if you get yeeted by a stego thats on you lol

unless its in that stretch of shallow water

but I guess its still kinda on you

[onyx wyvern]

Herbies should fear carnis that's how animals work herbies are prey, they shouldn't get to do what they do

[golden coral]

Stego is in no way OP, not to mention that everyone KoSes and bodyguards. You can also just grab bits from a carcass. And just.. go hide for a moment, pretend you're giving up. Most people aren't going to stay around forever. But as long as you're there, of course someone will try to be an asshat.

No. Just no. If you make herbis just fodder, no one will play them. If anything, you as the carnivore should have to hunt properly.

[modest carbon]

big herbies should not fear anything lol

[onyx wyvern]

Stegos take no skill to play it's just hur dur swing my tail till it dies and it works because they are OP

[golden coral]

No, they should, proper numbers or other big carnivores Tyn.

[modest carbon]

well yes true, but they shouldnt* be built just to fear all carnis

[golden coral]

Considering how much the attack suck, its amazing people actually die to it :p

[onyx wyvern]

Herbies should have to be in herds to survive like real herbies

[golden coral]

And I don't see how swinging tail is any more or less than just biting, clicking RMB/holding, like the others do.

No, just no. Do not balance anything on pack or herd, herbi or carni.

It's fine to balance for pack for hunting x or y, but not for survival itself.

[modest carbon]

theres not enough people who play herbies for them to be reliant on big herds without ai

[onyx wyvern]

A lone Herbie should be fodder just like a deino on land should be fodder

[golden coral]

A solo utah should be survivable on it's own. Sure, it might need a pack to hunt a big thing, but it should not need a pack just to survive.

But that's just it, it's an active hunt, it does not, nor should it, need a pack for survival on it's own. Nothing should require someone else to be survivable.

[onyx wyvern]

Stegos can clap anything at the moment, all they gotta do it stick their head into something, a really good carno player is their only challenge

[golden coral]

Besides, if you think stego is "OP", then you've yet to meet a tenno that knows what it's doing. If theres any herbi that's a bit too good, it seems to be the tenno as of right now.

[modest carbon]

Actually, utahs are more of a danger to stegos than carnos are

[golden coral]

You're wrong. Stego bleeds out in 2 utah pounces or less, utahs are stupidly good vs a stego, probably better than carno.

[onyx wyvern]

If yall cant see that as OP but dont think deinos should 1 shot a Utah when stegos do yall are dumb

[golden coral]

Not that a single carno should pose a threat to stego anyway, nor should only a few utahs, but hey, balance is as balance does. Same goes for deino not oneshotting utah.

You know why deino does not do that, and it has to do with them having the grab and all that.

[onyx wyvern]

A teno takes skill to play a stego does not

[modest carbon]

stego takes skill against skilled opponents

[onyx wyvern]

I kill stegos all day long with my carno

[golden coral]

Stego takes as much skill as everything else, if anything. Tenno is interesting, sure, but not that complicated.

[modest carbon]

teno takes timing really

[golden coral]

So what's the issue if you're just killing them all? As a solo carno? Yeah, and you want to say stego is OP. As a small game designated hunter killing them :p

[onyx wyvern]

Stego takes no skill when you clap everything in 3-5 hits

[golden coral]

Now I'm fine with deinos oneshotting utahs, even carnos, on headshot, as long as stegos do the same to carnos.

But stegos did not oneshot carnos on head last update, not sure if they do now with new bleed. So yeah, balance comes first.

[onyx wyvern]

You need to be a decent carno player to not die to a stego

Again all you need as a stego is to hur dur swing tail

[golden coral]

And then deino would take no skill if it oneshot utahs? :p

No, you just need to walk away from the stego to not die to it ^^

And if you think it's just swinging your tail, you've no idea how bad the attack really is.

Damage wise, sure, it's powerful. But as for a good attack, not so much.

Stego needs a proper swing, as well as a swing on the move. And deino needs to be able to grab swimming things, and so on.

[earnest robin]

Stego is from what I understand in QA, an “apex” herbivore. Thus it isn’t an easy thing to take down, especially if it knows how to play in its role. Think about it like African hippos and crocodiles. Hippos when fully grown adults can bully crocodiles all day. But when they’re smaller, they’re at risk of being killed by crocodiles. Since Evirma is a game after all, there needs to be a balance in power between both stego and deino. Deinos should not be able to destroy everything, and stego can still be killed by not only deinos, but other dinosaurs as well if the player understand how to fully utilize their dinosaurs abilities. The body guarding thing that you’re upset about, I agree is pretty silly. But since these are QA servers, it’s anyone’s game and people can be as wild and unruly as they’d like to. Just have to wait for servers with rules against that sort of thing when the time comes, ya’ know?

[onyx wyvern]

Stego needs a nerf period

[golden coral]

No it does not.

If anything it needs proper attacks, and most likely a health buff, it still only has 4K health apparently.

Deino probably could use a buff, but it has far better viability, especially if the rivers get a bit touched up to not have such huge stretches of shallow water and all that.

[onyx wyvern]

I can see your a stego main scared that you might actually need to have skill to play your dino if they change it

[golden coral]

As well as getting its hitboxes and other issues fixed

Right, I'm a stego main, which is why I know you're wrong.

[onyx wyvern]

Nah it just means your bias

[golden coral]

I am, but I also know what I'm talking about.

But in that case you could argue that you're just as biased, for wanting a nerf

[onyx wyvern]

No you really dont

[golden coral]

Or any deino player for wanting a buff

[onyx wyvern]

And no I'm really not I play most of the dinos

[golden coral]

Oh but I do. I've played stego plenty enough to know how it works.

But you're fine to disagree

[onyx wyvern]

I'm tired of stego players thinking it's fine to just KOS all carnis and basically get away with it because if your not a skilled player your gonna die to hur dur tail swing

[golden coral]

I'll still argue for stego to be the proper "pseudo"apex it should be at the very least. But I also understand it won't be that way until we get bigger things in the game, such as allo and bigger, that can hunt it properly.

See, people KoSing has nothing to do with it

You can do that on any dino

And everyone does for that matter

[onyx wyvern]

Ya but you get clapped as any other dino if you do it

See the issue

[golden coral]

And if you die to stego tailswing that's more on you, since the stego can't exactly chase you in the first place. Unlike some others.

Not really, everyone else can escape a stego anyway

[onyx wyvern]

A stego can hit deinos a stupid length in the water

[golden coral]

Far better than they can escape KoSing carnos or utahs or what have you

Yes, and if you read, I did say there's some issues with shallow rivers and hitboxes and all.

Things I expect to be adjusted and fixed. Just like I expect deino to get a bit more powerful when there's bigger things in the game, same with stego

But a stego can hardly KoS anything on land, unless said something has messsed up. It's a bit like how trikes in legacy can sneak up on people. Can they do it? Yes. But I mean.. it's a trike, that somehow snuck up on you...

[onyx wyvern]

Dude you are bias and just dont wanna loose your easy ride dino

[golden coral]

Is there an issue with stegos hunting deinos in rivers, yes. But that's not because stego is OP, but rather because there were some oversights in the stego hitbox, and mentioned river issues and all.

Oh yes, easy ride, well, as easy as any herbivore I suppose. Sit in a bush for 5 hours :D

[onyx wyvern]

That's fine but something needs to be done about them, they do way to much damage

[golden coral]

You're just as biased, and salty because you got corpseguarded and KoSed I'm guessing. Since that's what you're complaining about.

But that's not really a valid argument, is it.

[onyx wyvern]

Nerf the base dam and up the bleed

[golden coral]

To whom do they do too much damage?

Is it a deino specific issue, or do you think stego do too much damage to carno and utah as well?

[onyx wyvern]

Every dino lol jesus you can one shot a Utah and anything its size and 2 shot a carno

You can face tank and kill a deino

That is OP

[golden coral]

Right. So you don't think stego should oneshot a utah then?

And not twoshot a carno either then. How many hits should it take?

[onyx wyvern]

No o agree it should one shot a Utah

[golden coral]

You can't really "facetank" as a stego :p

I mean, deino fourshots stego on headshot so

But if you mean a deino trying to bite a stego from the ass up then well yes.. You're both biting the stego where the weapon is as well as the stego tailbox, which takes less damage..

[onyx wyvern]

And then the stego just hides its head in a tree and you can do fuck all

[golden coral]

But I sincerely doubt a stego can outbite a deino :p

Ah yes, like how a deino goes into water, or a utah up a rock. Or a ptera flies away? :p

[onyx wyvern]

Lol sure bud you keep your easy ride dino

[golden coral]

But if you're fine with it oneshotting utahs

Where's the issue then?

[onyx wyvern]

The issue is it can do whatever it wants and has no carnis that scare it

An Herbie shouldn't be like that

It's a damn prey animal

[golden coral]

Right..

Well that's just your opinion

And if that's how you want it, fine, but I disagree. Herbis can and should be as scary as carnivores. It's like saying a rex shouldnt be afraid but a trike should.

And what should scare a deino then, as of right now?

[onyx wyvern]

Nothing in the game should scare the deino unless it's on land

[frosty heron]

Stego damage is actually low compared with it used to be Legacy, and it's not spameable with 0 risk like it also was

[onyx wyvern]

If the deino is on land it should be scared shirtless

Shitless*

[frosty heron]

As Erik said, it's a hitbox issue rather than damage or the Dino itself

[golden coral]

right

So deino should be safe entirely in water?

But stego deos not get to be safe somewhere? :p

[onyx wyvern]

But if the stego is in the water or near the water it is fine has no fear

[golden coral]

Hold up here..

[onyx wyvern]

The stego can kill all the land carnis with ease so it's pretty safe

[golden coral]

First, I don't think deinos should be "scared shitless" on land, they should be disadvantaged and not want to be up there

Just like no terrestial should be wanting to be in water

And the smaller ones don't even like the shoreline, though the mechanic is a bit.. meh honestly

[onyx wyvern]

The deino should get clapped on land by a stego

[golden coral]

Not a fan of the on/off style really

And as I stated, stego is not as good as you think

[onyx wyvern]

But it should be able to ambush a stego and kill it

[golden coral]

Two utahs will kill one on land, two carnos most likely can too.

And stego can not escape them

Whereas deino can just go, you know, into water

[onyx wyvern]

Of those players are good

[golden coral]

Nah, you don't even have to be that good

[onyx wyvern]

Those players get 3 mistakes to 4 mistakes where the stego gets many

[golden coral]

Again, two pounces bleed out stego

[frosty heron]

I have to disagree, if you know your stuff you can kill Stegos decently well with the Utah, and Carno aswell

[golden coral]

And you know there's some "zoning" to it too. Ways for even a solo utah and possibly carno to take a stego

At least unless stego hides its face

Because yes, a stego should hide from a solo carno or two utahs

Despite being a plains animal

Not a forest animal

[frosty heron]

Yes you commit a mistake you get hit hard. As it should be, you're on the offense, just don't commit those mistakes. Stevo attacks are easy to bait

[onyx wyvern]

Again the stego can just spam and if the carni player isnt good the carni will die

[frosty heron]

Bruh, yeah spam with Stego and get hit between hits, pretty reasonable

[onyx wyvern]

I'm saying it takes way less skill to play well as a stego

I kill stegos that spam tail yes but do you know how many stupid carnos I see that die

[sinful cove]

Is there a problem with a bad carni player dying in a fight they had full control in starting lol

[onyx wyvern]

I'm saying there is a problem when you dont have to have skill to play a dino because of how much base dam it does

[frosty heron]

Then you just confirmed that's Carnos fault for being stupid

[onyx wyvern]

I've watched shit stego players clap good carno players simply because they land lucky hits

[sinful cove]

You do have to have skill because not every carni is a sped

[frosty heron]

Stego it's a bigger animal, of course it gonna kill you for being bad at hunting

[golden coral]

Stegos attacks aren't really that fast either, except the one side stab, that is stupidly fast. No idea why that one in particular is like that for that matter.

But saying that something does not take skill, or smarts, just because of damage is a little so so you know.

Sure, the more hits you require, that does add some skill. But at some point there's limits to what's reasonable too.

You could say deino requires no skill, it can just grab and drown

That's a "oneshot" for everything but adult stegos, more or less

But that still requires you to land the lunge and all

[frosty heron]

Side jab has good recovery but I like it because that means hunters has to force it to use front and back attacks, so a good Stego will know that and use side jabs

[golden coral]

And lucky hits can count for both sides. You're also basically saying even things like rex should not oneshot a carno then?

[onyx wyvern]

It requires a lot more skill to kill something as a deino than a stego

A stego just points its ass and swings

[golden coral]

Fair enough, I just find it a little bit odd. And yes, obviously main attack to use.

Eh.. no, deino is as easy as stego then

If you talk about damage potential

Just grab and drown

Simple

Just point your ass and swing

If you're talking the damage potential, they're both equally good at "oneshotting" stuff

[onyx wyvern]

Just grab and drown love how you skip to the easy part of that

[golden coral]

And the deino has the advantage because even if the prey slips out, it's in the water

Which is to the prey disadvantage and deino advantage

So even if you somehow mess up, you're still far better off, since nothing else can see shit underwater :p

[golden coral]

Just as easy as "point and swing" is all.

[onyx wyvern]

All the stego has to do is point and swing, the deino cant just run up to something and grab it because it's slow so that's a pretty bad comparison

[golden coral]

Eh.. right..

So a deino can't just you know, come up to shoreline and grab things?

Just like a stego has to manuever its slow ass to point in the right direction

And keep that up

But you're the one who mentioned damage

[onyx wyvern]

I mean if the many things that can give the deino away and scare the prey away doesn't scare it than sure it can

[golden coral]

Just like everything else is faster than stego and can outmanuever and outrun it

There are factors on both sides

[onyx wyvern]

All the stego needs to do is find a tree

And those are so rare

[golden coral]

"All the deino needs to do is swim into water". If we talk about playing defensive to survive that is.

And trees aren't that good, rocks would be better. :p

I found myself a nice little cove next to the main river, if only there were bushes in the forest I'd have a home :D

[onyx wyvern]

You know what I'm talking about you just wanna argue to argue, the balance is off and you know it, can't wait for them to rebalance so you know it takes skill to live as a stego

[golden coral]

No, I simply think you're utterly wrong. And it does take skill, since stego dies so easily to things, and have to hide it's face in a rock to even stand a chance. A stego hiding it's face vs a utah or two, or a carno. That sounds balanced alright :p

But I'd be perfectly fine if they reworked the attacks to proper swings, and all that. Give kentro the jab style instead. :)

[onyx wyvern]

You are ignoring so many things and I'm done talking to someone so bias good say

Day*

[golden coral]

Fine by me. You're just as biased though, keep that in mind :)

[onyx wyvern]

No I'm really not I feel they all need a rebalance since I've played them all

But that's fine bud keep the soap box

[golden coral]

A rebalance would probably be good. Stego really shouldn't be hunted by carnos, and require at least 4-5 utahs to stand a chance, so that's fine. Deino should also be a bit powered up, they're both big animals and should be terrifying to the smaller roster to even approach. But then that would not be balanced for current roster, so we'll have to wait for that.

[onyx wyvern]

That's basically what I was saying bro

But yall had to twist it

[golden coral]

Eh.. you wanted to nerf stego, unless I read you totally wrong? :p

[onyx wyvern]

I used the wrong words there

[golden coral]

Alright, I'll have to go read again, cause I clearly missed something if that's what you were saying

[onyx wyvern]

I should have said a rebalance

[golden coral]

Well, rebalance can mean many things

And we know they will balance as the game goes

Punch has stated as much

So no doubt both stego and deino will change in the future

[onyx wyvern]

What I was trying to say is the stego shoudknt get to stomp around like it's a Trex

Like it currently does, it should fear something

[golden coral]

But like trike then? :p

And yes, the problem right now is the deino mechanic

Since it works on such an on/off style, you can't have deinos hunt stegos like they normally hunt

[sinful cove]

No bias huh

[golden coral]

And that's down to the mechanical issues

[onyx wyvern]

The deino was meant to be the match to the stego but it fears stego like everything else

[golden coral]

But stego do fear stuff, like I said, carnos can hunt them, a few utahs can hunt them. Stegos are far from invincible.

And no, deino wasn't really meant to match stego

They wanted to make it something that drowns things, apparently "smaller" things

Midtiers and such

At least for now

And that does come down to the mechanic

Because if deino could grab stegos, then you'd have one 5 hour growth oneshotting another 5 hour growth

[onyx wyvern]

But you already have stegos killing deinos in droves

[golden coral]

Because of other issues, as I stated. I also said they need to work on the rivers, the spawnpoints, and hitboxes.

[onyx wyvern]

Do you see what I'm saying, the same way a deino cant one shot a stego the stego shouldn't be able to just terrorize deinos

[golden coral]

No I agree on that one

Stegos should not be able to go "deino fishing"

Its stupid

But you know tennos can do that too

As can carnos and utahs

[onyx wyvern]

Again I worded what i was trying to say wrong

[golden coral]

Both carnos and utahs and tennos can also fuck over the deinos, the stegos have slightly better reach yes, but a deino on land can die to all of them.

But deeper/wider river + a rework of the stego/deino hitboxes will help there

[onyx wyvern]

A deino should die on land to them

[golden coral]

I think the issue in part is because stegos hitbox from tail extends downwards, to help against anklebiters, but it also means it can hit down into the water

Which was probably an oversight

[onyx wyvern]

I mean it should be able to defend it self

But it shouldn't be a good land fighter at all

The stego hit box is also way above it's back

I've seen them kill pteras flying over their back plates

[slim dragon]

Fact
I've experienced it myself

[golden coral]

Agreed on that. I don't think stegos should be hunting deinos like currently. I don't think herbis in general should go around hunting carnis xD But that does not mean I think stego is OP because it's other matchups are fucking it over very easily if they know what they're doing. You may disagree on that, and that's fine, but we have different experiences when it comes to how stego works on that one.

And that seems good actually, otherwise you'd have pteras pecking stegos to death :p

We've seen how it goes when carno could abuse the thagomizer thing

Pteras can peck carnos as well apparently, or so I've heard

[slim dragon]

In the best of worlds, stego would be able to aim its tail up and down

[golden coral]

Utahs should be fine, they can jump, so can dryos, and deinos can obviously submerge

[onyx wyvern]

It should have to aim the tail where it hits

[golden coral]

Meanwhile, stego and carno, plains animals, get pecked :p

That would be nice Necro

More actual control over your swings, maybe over the power of them too

Could tie into a moving attack for stego

[onyx wyvern]

That would work allot better than the blanket damage it does now

[golden coral]

More dynamic mechanics in general as well as attacks would be nice

For all critters

[slim dragon]

Stego combo framework
So that it can chain a jab with a swing, and finish off its opponent with an uppercut

[golden coral]

Proper tug of war mechanic for deino

Same for utah pounce really

I still want a balance mechanic vs the bucking there

Not just stamina drain from buck

[onyx wyvern]

Or make it so if a deino gets the head of the stego its stunned for a second

The 9 second bucking thing is stupid for stegos

It's a death sentence

[golden coral]

?

I think deino lunge do stun a stego

So you can do that, sort of

What's with the bucking? Haven't had a chance to use it yet

[slim dragon]

A proper stagger mechanic would be fine too
If you take enough damage in one shot, you play a little animation during which you can't bite
Deletes any form of facetanking

[onyx wyvern]

No the lunge stuns the drink

Deino*

[golden coral]

Huh

[frosty heron]

We're going a bit too Mortal Kombat with that XD

[golden coral]

I've heard either honestly, not sure how that works with the lunge and stun

So I'll just say it stuns both and work with that :p

But what's wrong with the bucking?

[slim dragon]

Shhhhhhhh
It's been too long since last time I played For Honor

[onyx wyvern]

The bucking thing is if a stego bucks its stuck to bucking for 9 seconds

[frosty heron]

Lunge stuns both but Stego still able to attack. It's a bug I think

[frosty heron]

Oh God that game. Nightmares

[slim dragon]

Yes

It stole my soul

[onyx wyvern]

In that time it can't attack that's 9 seconds of free bites

[frosty heron]

Peacekeeper main here, I'll drop it with that because this is not the place xD

[onyx wyvern]

That's kinda dumb

[golden coral]

Oh.. so bucking locks you into that now. Yeah that sounds a bit iffy to say the least

Great.. I already didn't like that the main way was to use trees or rock, I feel bucking should be the main way to deal with pouncers, for both stego and tenno and carno and all

[onyx wyvern]

The bucking always locked you into it

[golden coral]

Does that go for tenno and carno too?

Cause they can buck too

[onyx wyvern]

Yes

[slim dragon]

Wrong
Nobushi main

[onyx wyvern]

That is why people use trees

[slim dragon]

But agree this is off-topic

[frosty heron]

Stego bucking it's so bad Stegos shouldn't even think on use it unless they're on a open field and that's death sentence, it's worthy using rocks and trees

[golden coral]

Well that seems bad that bucking locks you

No matter what you're bucking as

[onyx wyvern]

Because all the utahs has to do is bait the buck jump.off and murder you

[frosty heron]

I mean I'm Peacekeeper main 🤣

[slim dragon]

oh k

[golden coral]

Offtopic guys :p This is the Isle!

So bucking might need a rework too. Maybe that could tie into deino grab

[onyx wyvern]

That's why people dont buck, and idk why they dont have it that you can stop bucking at any moment

[golden coral]

Yeh, I know that knocking them off is more effective

[frosty heron]

Yes, For Honor what is that shit? I mean Tenonto yeah that's good thing

[onyx wyvern]

And who ever said that biting should drop the meat you are holding is ace

[golden coral]

@frosty heron Tenno is a real fighter! :p

[onyx wyvern]

Because fuck being caught with food and now spamming the drop fast enough

[golden coral]

I would love it to be a back and forth you know. Like, you pounce on, I start bucking, you'd stop attacking to hold on, I'd stop bucking to stop my own stamina drain since it would be wasted now that you're braced. So we'd both try to "outplay" the other, me trying to buck when you're attacking, you trying to get attacks in and make me waste my stamina.

[onyx wyvern]

Exactly

And that would take skill

[golden coral]

Something that would require both sides to try and outwit the other, I could be trying to move towards a tree, but that would let you get free attacks in, vs trying to stop and throw you off every now and then, or something

[onyx wyvern]

Stegos are fucked over hard by the bucking