balance-feedback-discussion

[dusky surge]

extremely high

[warm flax]

thank goodness I gave him some good scratch and kicks (Im at 800kg atm)
he bit me in the head and i was in yellow

[faint robin]

https://youtu.be/5ooGmCVquIQ?si=oovBSdLUl9Pq4ZK3 smartest rex players in the isle
(Its prob that hackers playing rexes)

[thorn mountain]

its not hacking lol

[faint robin]

Rex is not out

[thorn mountain]

also those rexes stinked

[thorn mountain]

not officially no, unofficially yes

[faint robin]

Unofficially is hacking

[thorn mountain]

the devs dont think so

soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

[faint robin]

Where did they state it

[thorn mountain]

look through punchs messages and you will see him say its not hacking they left the things in the files and players found out how to use them

thats it lol

[faint robin]

Alr

Still those rexes were the worst and ig rex is nowhere near finished

[thorn mountain]

yeah the rex we have rn is 6 months old. HT will be better lol

[faint robin]

Still glad trike actually wins if it faces rex which is fair

[sweet estuary]

rex is so cool gng

[elfin night]

L rexes

[slim dragon]

@latent coral The concept of blocking making you take more damage, even if it's just bleed damage, is hysterical
Also you may have noticed that ceratopsians' frills do NOT get filled with blood during sparring

[latent coral]

Why can’t we just imaging it, we don’t know Herrera or hypsi were climbers

[latent coral]

It just makes sense, sparing is already way to overpowered, it needs some weakness

[slim dragon]

Sparring doesn't reduce damage, blocking does
Also wdym sparring is overpowered ? That's the only thing that makes ceratopsians viable

[slim dragon]

Things aren't meant to be accurate in this game, like, at all

[latent coral]

I mean that as long as you keep your head turned to your opponent, then you take like no damage. Sparing might not be too great against packs, but Rex will have no chance against trike if it can’t get behind it since it will almost always be a 1v1

[slim dragon]

It won't always be a 1v1, also yes, that's the point. Rex should try to get behind trike in order to win the fight. That's precisely how their interaction is meant to go. That's why rex is an ambusher. Because it ambushes things.

Being unbeatable when facing their opponent upfront is the very core of ceratopsians' identity and literally the only thing they're good at

[elfin night]

Mfw evolving a giant spiked shield as a face actually makes me good in fights head on

[stark ether]

Yeah that’d be as odd as making anky suffer a penalty from successfully breaking a Rex’s teeth/leg with its back/tail respectively.

Ceratopsians entire gimmick is that fighting them head-on is bad.

Their vulnerability is their rear, so they need to position with allies/terrain carefully. That’s their downside.

[olive zinc]

I always thought the new watering holes were in preparation of seasons. Filled up during the rainy season, empty during the dry season, and mudpits inbetween.

[strong crypt]

i think they are a setup for rex because if you think about it there is alot of bushes near all watering holes

[strong crypt]

idk if it will be agile enough to do that, i wouldnt think so. i feel like ambushes in Evrima are way worse than in Legacy beccause of tail ride idk what it will be like in this tho

[slim dragon]

In legacy you had ambush speed and yeah, tail ride
Both of which were absolutely terrible mechanics

But ambushing is still very much possible in evrima, if not more so because of abilities designed for it

[strong crypt]

yes and i think that rex will have a very good ambush however a 1v1 scenario will most likely be impossible for rex from what i can tell so far

[slim dragon]

It will have to ambush
Which is a good thing

[strong crypt]

i disagree but it is what it is

[slim dragon]

There is something very wrong if rex can win a facetank against trike, the dedicated facetanker

[strong crypt]

Not a facetank but a fight. like matchup being unfavourable but not impossible

[slim dragon]

Unfavorable yes
I didn't say impossible

[strong crypt]

no but i did above

[slim dragon]

And in the fight as a rex the way to win is to do everything you can to hit trike on its sides or back instead of its face

[strong crypt]

yeah it shouldnt win hitting its head

[maiden temple]

#balance-feedback message
Stress system could be fun, but this kinda kills ambushing for carnis

[eager saddle]

Exactly

[maiden temple]

I can get really close on my troo sometimes, don't need the game to tell my prey I'm around

I would enjoy seeing my teno stress out when I'm being circled by ceras though

[eager saddle]

“Hunting reduces the meter” I would need the feedback to show me what the tangible way of defining hunting is. Because standing next to a stego that’s camping a wall is also hunting.

[maiden temple]

Yeah..

[eager saddle]

You would have to develop a whole metric for this. It isn’t a simple thing to solve, that’s why it’s been taking the devs ages

Imagine this for a deino. Deino is all about waiting in ambush. Imagine if it slaps the water with the tail due to this mechanic

[maiden temple]

'oooh sorry got too excited there'

[eager saddle]

Gl. Everyone now knows you’re here and will tell this to everyone of their species.

[maiden temple]

And the other deino is already on his way

[eager saddle]

Wonderful

It’s not a good system. It sounds doable on paper, until you take about some words that need clarifying

Still, at least they tried

[eager saddle]

“That’s okay man, I didn’t need food with this red stomach icon anyways “

[maiden temple]

Yeah everything that has a detect/cirlce of influence area is usually very.. eh

[thorn mountain]

#balance-feedback message this is crazy

[elfin night]

https://youtube.com/shorts/5SNzGO9qtEQ?si=w2-2fmfEmCvtpgdE is this the future we want?

[strong crypt]

i mean faster yeah longer no

[thorn mountain]

It is faster though

[strong crypt]

yeah i heard it will be faster but stamina drain heavy right

AMBUSH STANCE after sub addult

[strong crypt]

also these are hard to answer balancing questions about a dino that has not been released

[thorn mountain]

yep

[dusky surge]

Nono I swear its fair because stegos deserve it

[elfin night]

Many people would unironically demand that 💔

[dusky surge]

Shouldn't have played your favourite animal idiot

A classic blunder

[slim dragon]

STEGO GETS PINNED LOL
And doesn't stun rex

[dusky surge]

Oh and its slower

Both in sprint and in trot

[slim dragon]

https://tenor.com/view/skill-issue-kongming-paripi-koumei-zhuge-liang-ya-boy-kongming-gif-25399830

[elfin night]

Certified eat grass and die moment

Ran down AND pinned

[dusky surge]

So there's nothing a stego can do except pray for the sweet embrace of death

But don't worry

You can totally herd up with all the other stegos

That will 100% be playing the "die instantly to rex" animal

[slim dragon]

I'm sure there will be a ton of them now that they have a proper threat

[strong crypt]

i mean by the look of it the T-rex was like 2 body lenght away when it started sprinting

[dusky surge]

I'll be real man

The footage isn't my primary conern

[strong crypt]

this one idk patchy is in a good spot tbh

[dusky surge]

I know the unofficial is laggy as hell

[dusky surge]

WILD claim

[strong crypt]

does fine for its weight class

[dusky surge]

Pachy is about as garbage as stego in a post-rex world

[dusky surge]

Bold claim

[strong crypt]

this is 100% untrue and you dont know how to play the dinosaur

[elfin night]

I already told you

This take is so out of touch. Quit watching nickboay

[slim dragon]

Free food = fine when it comes to herbivores

[strong crypt]

maybe start looking at your kit ???

[dusky surge]

I know how to play the dinosaur. In fact, I know how to play it so well that I know the most viable option as a pachy is to kill myself and play a better dino (i.e. teno, dibble, stego, trike)

[strong crypt]

apparently not since i have no trouble at all with raptors

[dusky surge]

ah yes

because all pachy ever deals with is raptors

and nothing else

[strong crypt]

well you think it should win vs a twice its size carno?

[dusky surge]

i forgot the rules saying no one else but raptor is allowed to attack pachy

[slim dragon]

Having a chance to survive would be good enough

[strong crypt]

you can survive you just dont know how to play it

[slim dragon]

sure

[strong crypt]

if you know how to trigger Head fractures and Leg breaks consistantly then u will be fine most of the time

[dusky surge]

im certain thats true

[strong crypt]

now you being in a 1v1 vs carno i mean not dilo not raptor will survive that why should patchy?

[dusky surge]

i love how everyone else can survive with relative ease, but if you can't survive with pachy, that's a skill issue

what changed i wonder

[slim dragon]

Dilo and raptor can both survive an encounter with carno pretty easily

[dusky surge]

maybe i swapped to a garbage animal

[strong crypt]

you have same survival chances as a raptor

[slim dragon]

lol not at all

[strong crypt]

tell me why not?

both have jump both have equal size both have about same speed and turn speed

[slim dragon]

Because raptor is faster, more agile and has a better jump allowing it to get out of range more easily (or even jump above a charing carno)
Also if things go really bad you can pounce it and be invulnerable until you jump off

[slim dragon]

https://tenor.com/view/mentira-detector-de-menitira-lie-lie-detector-meme-gif-775595597915534232

[elfin night]

Where’s my post dude

I just pressed enter

[slim dragon]

Pachy literally gets outran by cera with a mutation

[strong crypt]

41.8 vs 46.8 so it is 5 faster

[slim dragon]

Yes, that's a lot

[strong crypt]

carno will still catch you

[slim dragon]

Pachy doesn't have nowhere near the agility of raptor

[elfin night]

#balance-feedback-discussion message

dude, I know you wanna be the super strong apex predator super ferocious destroyer of worlds dipping dumb herbivores in nitric acid but they’re so overpowered because omni cannot kill an elder trike 1v1, but to say pachy is good is such a terrible take that is not in touch with reality in the slightest

[strong crypt]

how is that valid its a 2vs1 not relevent if patchy is good or not

[slim dragon]

The second raptor wasn't necessary tbh

[strong crypt]

2x something thats equal your strenght

[elfin night]

It is because it has zero means to reliably defend itself even after one raptor pounces it 15m away from a tree

I also have footage of that

[strong crypt]

also first thing i see is him missing headbutt

[elfin night]

And it shouldn’t be the same strength too

[slim dragon]

That's the thing
Raptor should not be equal in strength to pachy

[elfin night]

Pachy has no escape options against omni, it needs to be able to fight against it and even other things such as dilos

When omni does not need to face pachies or dilos

[strong crypt]

Really? raptor is longer growth time patchy is same weightclass?. i mean considerd raptors speed and patchys bonebreak they are even

[elfin night]

Trying to push the narrative of pachy somehow being a good pick is something only someone extremely sore about herbivores would do

Unbelievably sore in fact

[strong crypt]

honestly ive started playing patchy alot recently i kinda love it

[elfin night]

It’s funny once you get the ambush and can batter someone to death

But pachy is just bad for survival

[slim dragon]

Raptor doesn't have a longer growth time than pachy
It's faster therefore it should not be equal in a fight

[elfin night]

You’re locked into two mutations to not be F tier and instead just be D

And for a specialized low tier brawler, pachy getting one shot by a single omni is very pathetic

One damage pounce and you’re down if you’re not basically next to a tree

[strong crypt]

so patchy is 3h 10m no diets raptor is 3h 24m no diets.
and whilst raptor has more speed if hit by 1 off patchys Headbutts it is probably dead

[elfin night]

Also 85% pachy gets ran down and pinned by omni

So good and strong bro

And as said, if you don’t get locked into photo tissue then you’re cera fodder

And if you don’t lock into congenital then you’re carno and dilo fodder

[strong crypt]

seems like your problem here is that its a lesser played playable and you get 2v1ed because of that not because of patchy being bad

[elfin night]

That has nothing to do with the message you replied to

And also as I said above all it takes is one pounce and the pachy is dead

Also basically zero tools vs carno unless you get lucky with a leg break

And locked into a mutation to not get absolutely massacred by ceras

[strong crypt]

well yes if you let him do his entire pounce without bucking or using trees but that is a really unsmart way to argue

[elfin night]

And then dilo is a gamble too

Since all it needs is no leg break to kill you

[elfin night]

Bucking is rng and it burns through your stam. It is a lose lose situation

And then pachy gets so massively slowed down that even if you’re a distance as short as 20 meters away from a tree or water, you’re simply not going to reach it before dying

And if it’s less you’re going to be very wounded regardless

[strong crypt]

then dont get pounced to begin with or stand really close to a tree

[elfin night]

“Just don’t get pounced bro”

[slim dragon]

"Don't get pounced" was possible back when pachy could parry pounce

[elfin night]

And also, so good and meta right?

The brawler bruiser herbivore cowering under a tree because of a single pack hunter dinosaur

[strong crypt]

well if you dont put hours into the game you will never learn mechanics to counter Pounces from the side with the front of your body

[slim dragon]

Now you're locked into just dodging an attack that may never come and never attempting to even charge a ram because if you do you're nuking your own ability to tank a pounce and if you miss it it's instant death

[slim dragon]

Why should pachy put hours into the game to stand a chance against a raptor who launched the game for the first time ?

That's why we say pachy is bad
It requires extreme knowledge, perfect timings and precision to simply survive against something it should counter

[strong crypt]

well this is the case in many instances some playables are more easy maybe patchy isnt for you

[slim dragon]

Maybe pachy is just bad

[strong crypt]

it is not for your weightclass and im willing to prove it aswell

[slim dragon]

I really want to get back to playing pachy
But I don't want to waste hours growing one just to get mobbed on and killed by a bunch or ceras or a carno because I don't play the meta mutations

[strong crypt]

awesome im looking for a playtrough with it lets do it

[slim dragon]

If it loses to raptor on equal skill level, then it's bad

[strong crypt]

why does it have to be equal skill this is rarely the case with any other dinosaur?

[slim dragon]

It doesn't have to
I'm mentioning skill because you seem to value it a lot

[elfin night]

You have been for a very short time here but have already farmed and endless parade of balance Ls

Pachy is not good or meta or very solid when you need to do an intensive monk training or cower underneath a tree 24/7 to not get one shot by someone who maybe started playing that very day

And the funniest part is that we never addressed the part to nearly fg pachies getting pinned, or what is Pachy supposed to do when elder omni comes around, or what can it do besides a leg break against carnos in the open, or how to deal with filos that you didn’t ambush

[strong crypt]

i like skillfull playables thats why overtuning patchy when its a skillful playable would just lead it to being broken in the right hands and unfunn for everyone

[elfin night]

The skill in question: hide or die

Amazing brawler dinosaur

[strong crypt]

vailiant i urge you to play on pvp servers and find 1 player that agrees on your takes on matchups

[elfin night]

I play a lot in PvP servers when I’m bored bruh

[strong crypt]

you do not this is a lie

[elfin night]

And I play pachy quite a bit

However not everything is going to be an honorable 1v1 in a flat area on the beach against a fight that I decide to pick. The game isn’t balanced around being a gladiator arena

[steep gazelle]

Pachy is just in a stupid state currently, not to mention that he was even more nerfed in the last update xd

[strong crypt]

and if you did people who are good and tend to win their duels do not agree with your guyses veiwpoints

[elfin night]

And it’s funny because even in deathmatch servers, pachy dies to anything that didn’t get to see coming other than tiny tiers

[elfin night]

^ every PvP server arena dino duel gladiator 3000 survivor battle royale is a worthless argument because of this

The main game mode is survival

[strong crypt]

there was this one guy called rapadex who actually joined a server. he was thinking patchy was bad i showed him and im pretty sure he now agrees that its good for its weightclass

[elfin night]

Pachy is helpless against anything that ain’t one omni, galli or dilo that it got to see coming and accepted the fight with in a flat area

Also another pachy ig

Again, the game isn’t just gladiator arena PvP 1v1

Other factors come into play for survival

[strong crypt]

no but your stating it is bad when it is not compared to others in a 1v1 arena. what i see is you saying that it dies to anything that isnt 1 of the carnivores but patchy is not supposed to be played solo

[slim dragon]

A there it is

The only true argument

[elfin night]

You just proved my point

Thanks for the self goal

[strong crypt]

okay so we agree patchy isnt bad good then

[elfin night]

lol

[slim dragon]

If pachy is so good in herds, then where are all the pachy herds on official servers ??

[elfin night]

If something is meant to be played in a group in the isle, it is automatically bad

[strong crypt]

people dont play it for other reasons

[elfin night]

Because this isn’t a game where you are always going to have teammates. This isn’t league or R6 where you always get matched with players who will remain with you until the end of the match

[slim dragon]

Could it be that... they're playing something that is both strong in groups AND also viable solo ?

[elfin night]

In this game the default is solo, people can log out or die at any time and grouping is both optional and dependent on what people are playing

Therefore pachy’s viability is inconsistent

[strong crypt]

same goes for raptors why should patchy be stronger then?

[steep gazelle]

Do you agree that Pachy should be weak to this point even though he should literally be Omni counter?

[slim dragon]

Yes, because there are simply better options

[elfin night]

It is not self sufficient so it needs to crutch on something else that the game isn’t balanced around

[elfin night]

Except that Raptor is only stronger in groups, not helpless

[slim dragon]

Same does NOT go for raptors, a raptor can survive solo just fine
By hunting pachies for example

[elfin night]

Raptor can fight or flee from everything

[strong crypt]

exactly why play a 500kg playable when u can pick 3t dibble and be unbeatable

same reason there is cera invasion

[slim dragon]

I mean why play the extremely weak and hard-to-play pachy when I can play as anything else and have more fun with less headache and less relying on the luck of never encountering a raptor that is not alone ?

[strong crypt]

also where is it stated its supposed to be an omni counter?

[elfin night]

Dibble can fight or flee from anything when grown

Pachy can’t

[steep gazelle]

Same weight class, runs 6km less and can't even defend himself from a simple solo Omni?

[strong crypt]

yeah because dibble has no predator and is extremly overtuned however patchy is more balanced

[cosmic pelican]

Literally seen manhandling omnis and troodons

[steep gazelle]

A brawler who doesn't know how to fight, that seems very strange to me xd

[elfin night]

Dibble isn’t overtuned lmao, and there are things currently that can obliterate it, yet it has the means to escape or fight

However pachy is at the mercy of many things unless it locks into mutations or keeps hiding

Pachy is so good in fact that it has one of the lowest pick rates in official servers in the last year

Top picks being (don’t recall the order) cera, stego, dibble, omni and herra

[strong crypt]

look why people dont play somethign and it being balanced are two diffrent things. maybe people dont like being a vulnerable herbivore playable that can die really quickly if not carefull. maybe if you are gonna play a 500kg playable you would rather play dilo or omniraptor because you like hunting more than eating grass

[elfin night]

They can be correlated with gameplay value

Pachy is conceptually fun especially for aggressive players, which are the majority of the playerbase as carnivores, yet it is abysmal so no one uses it

Dryo is barebones mechanically and that’s why no one uses it too

Gameplay quality/balance and pick rates are inherently correlated

[slim dragon]

A lot of people played pachy back when it was good

[strong crypt]

correction. alot of people played patchy back when it was OP

[elfin night]

True

U6 pachy was super common

Like deino when it could do more than just sit in the water and it was a makeshift Albertosaurus as a subadult

[cosmic pelican]

Almost 40kmh sub deino lmao

Hell yeah

[slim dragon]

Deino is still more common than pachy currently despite people yelling that it's now "unplayable"

[elfin night]

look why people dont play somethign and it being balanced are two diffrent things.

So you just betrayed your previous statement…?

[slim dragon]

With enough stam to run 100m inland, grab someone and run back to the water and drown them

[elfin night]

To be fair it has been for a while but big carnivore bias carried it to be marginally above pachy

[slim dragon]

That's also when, with no apparent correlation, people started asking to be able to lock their growth at subadult

[strong crypt]

not exactly since people do tend to play more OP stuff but since patchy isnt OP and it is just balanced then they dont play it

[slim dragon]

Hypsi is literally more played than pachy

[strong crypt]

and other reasons aswell

[elfin night]

If pachy is balanced, then why isn’t it as played as everything else you would classify as balanced?

[strong crypt]

hypsie just got a new climb function

[slim dragon]

It ironically has better chances of survival now with climbing

[strong crypt]

because 1 its a smaller playable
2 its a herbivore
3 its not OP

[elfin night]

Do you think maia is balanced? Because it has twice the pick rate of pachy at the very least

[strong crypt]

4 its not new

[slim dragon]

Yes, making it a better playable than pachy because it can actually survive against predators

[elfin night]

And also has something interesting to work with

Pachy has the interesting concept but it’s just bad so no one wants to play something that is meant to be a bruiser but it’s just hiding or dying

Or grouping up

Troodon and Omni are not reliant on groups to survive, and they thrive

[slim dragon]

Also pachy has the extra downside of being clunky to play as

[elfin night]

Mhm

[strong crypt]

last time i played patchy i died to 6 carnos. now will i go say patchy sucks because i cant escape that? no.
maybe if i had not been running in an open field it wouldnt have happend

[elfin night]

Even in the forest you would have been shredded by 3 carnos

[strong crypt]

but it seems to me more than patchy being bad ur arguing that its being not played and thats another issue

[elfin night]

And even then we can just go and move it to any other matchup where pachy is helpless

[slim dragon]

The two are correlated

[elfin night]

I am arguing that it is bad and therefore it has an abysmal pick rate on officials

[strong crypt]

maybe

[elfin night]

Its scarcity is evidence of that

[strong crypt]

i mean also another reaon people dont play it
5 its hard

[elfin night]

And it is confirmed when comparing its many matchups and the fact that you openly stated even as a defender of its current state that it needs a group

That fundamentally is not how playables are balanced

[slim dragon]

It's hard because it's weak
Pachy isn't even mechanically complex to justify it being that hard

[elfin night]

Maia also used to be very hard before the buff, maybe even now still

Yet it is so much more common that pachy

[strong crypt]

this is not true. it needs a group in order to beat another group or bigger playable is what i meant

this is also the case you wont see a raptor beat 2 patchys i bet (90% of the time)

[elfin night]

It needs a group to not be eviscerated by omnis unless it lives hidden and hugging a tree

Or by a single dilo that didn’t get a leg break

Or one carno that didn’t get a leg break

[slim dragon]

Or one cera that won't get a leg break anyway because it has fracture resistance lol

[strong crypt]

omnis play the same way if alone

[slim dragon]

This is completely false

[strong crypt]

not at all

[elfin night]

Not in the slightest

[strong crypt]

also ur faster than it

[elfin night]

You just made that up

Name ONE matchup where omni can only hide or die when spotted

[strong crypt]

carno

[elfin night]

Gets brutally outmaneuvered and omni has the jump to get over rivers or on a rock

[strong crypt]

you say this like patchy dont have a jump function lol

[elfin night]

Try again

[elfin night]

Significantly inferior, and also significantly inferior speed and agility

Making it much harder to evade carnos

[strong crypt]

okay then lets get on a server prove it to me

[elfin night]

Can’t now

[strong crypt]

its clear to me you dont know carno drifting xD

[elfin night]

Also CARNO CATCHES PACHY IN THE WATER 💔 💔

Like come on

If the river or lake is big enough it gets swam down

[strong crypt]

i mean what lakes are you jumping into to escape xD

[elfin night]

True

We can still go with river

[strong crypt]

you can jump over most of the parts of rivers which makes carno unable to catch up to you in water

all im saying is that its very doable to beat omni and dilo as patchy also escape single carnos(it is harder than beating dilo or raptor) and it being low player count is not because of it being bad rather it being a smaller herbivore that has had nothing new happend to it for a while and also has a higher skill cieling than one may think because of Bonebreak and what each bonebreak does besides just visuals

[crystal stream]

Hate to say it but when you put an animal like Carno into a game and then complain when it kills things then why even have it in the game

Esp when it’s whole niche is to catch smaller things

Dinosaurs in general were not balanced so don’t expect them to always be fair esp when talking about creatures that would realistically stand no chance

As much as it does suck to die as a Dino where you at a physical disadvantage however playing in a group can help diminish chances

It’s the same way I feel about Stego v Rex with an animal as slow as Stego that realistically not be a apex gets destroyed by Rex and that’s not a balance problem those are two animals are extremely hard to find a way for them to coexist because they didn’t coexist

If we had everything realistic Carno would destroy almost everything except for steg and maybe dib but they nerfed it into the ground a gave it a new purpose

[strong crypt]

This i agree with

[strong crypt]

also another thing making patchy unpopular is it having all its MZ and spawns in the northern part of the map, I would say there is alot more players in the southern parts and most other playables are played in the south, now this makes it so if you want to be a part of the funn and go down south you wont find almost any other patchys there simply because they do not spawn there and do not have migrationszones there, and in my opinon if i dont go down south tis an afk eating simulator

[carmine tundra]

mcga

i think this gobbler idea could have some huge potential though, they also might buff its weight too because its a little awkward if a 1300 kg animal could swallow a 450 kg

prime carno tho was update 3-4, while update 5-6 being the most balanced

maybe not the most balanced because it could get bled out from a single omni pounce

[crystal stream]

I agree completely

The first iterations of Carno was the most realistic depiction I’ve seen in a while

[strong crypt]

this is also kinda true and the thing is it sufferd from same thing as i would say dibble or trike does now which is that there wasnt really something to fight it

although i didint play back then ive only seen videos and stuff

carno used to be that it hunted stuff smaller than it, now it is that it hunts small stuff

[edgy moon]

@silent drum I think that, in theory, the reason swamps are so difficult for big deinos to navigate is so that the area acts as a pseudo-sanctuary for young deinos--in practice those young deinos will, of course, starve to death. However, swamp is deserted as it is, making it easier for deinos to navigate will only further disincentivise dinos from going there, in my opinion.

[silent drum]

the area sucks for small deinos too. no fish spawns, no reason for any other dino to go there. its just useless

[edgy moon]

the only reasons to go there as deino are spawning there, or using it as a staging point to travel west

The island to the east of swamps is also a cool concept, but completly useless in-game

[hasty coyote]

It’s almost like this is a video game and not supposed to 1:1 with reality. Saying things “should be unbalanced” is just a cop out that will just make the game worse for everyone. All that ends up doing by is making some Dino’s unplayable and one or 2 played by everyone. We can see this now with most carnivores playing cera and very few playing stuff like pachy.

And “just group up” simply does not work for a LOT of reasons. Namely the fact that people don’t want to spend hours just to die on sight. So less people play that dino and more instead play the op dino. Which makes the fodder dino suffer more because they can’t find a group AND have more predators. And then the loop repeats until you get a playable that is used by all of 3 people, meanwhile the op playable is used by 2/3rds of the server. It’s happened with carno when it was op, it’s happened with carno when it was fodder, and it has happened every single time.

[elfin night]

Rap already said it, but that was a pretty bad talking point

Realism should never be considered don’t be balance discussion channel of a video game that is clearly not realistic and was never supposed to be

[elfin night]

They “nerfed” it because what you are saying would lead to so many clones in the roster and a +50 playable roster into one of only 10 worthwhile picks

[elfin night]

U6 carno?

Wasn’t that basically one of the main rulers of spiro alongside deino and pachy?

[cosmic pelican]

U6 sub carno could easily 1v1 todays op cera without a sweat

Same size as cera, 60kmh sprint, 200dmg charge that instantly stuns and has the hitbox of a small bus

[elfin night]

Right as I remembered

So fair and balanced

[elfin night]

Although the funniest part of U6 for me is pachy dogwalking 3 carnos at a time or fresh adult deinos chasing a stego in land like dollar store rexes

[crystal stream]

It’s not realism it’s hard to balance playables that are at severe disadvantages

I’m not saying it shouldn’t be unbalanced but it’s hard to find balance with playables that would realistically stand a hard chance this doesn’t mean you can destroy a animal and completely change it for the sake of balance

Also because it’s not a pvp game means it has to be balanced

[crimson crater]

@brisk slate stun durations got increased globally, omni has one of the fastest recovery as is

[crystal stream]

Combining animals from all over the world and time periods and expecting them to always be perfectly balanced will never work and while you can change the animal to make it balanced but you cant stray to far

[crystal stream]

You act like I meant to insult the reason I said nerf is because it was a genuine nerf to the real life animal it wasn’t bad it was simply a nerf

I think it’s ok there finding new ideas just trying to hard can kinda ruin the whole dinosaur

Esp with a animal like Carno who like I already stated would destroy the ecosystem

[slim dragon]

You can tho
Look at teno, beipi, stego, carno, omni, herrera
They're all completely different from the real animal in order to have a unique niche and fit into balance

[hasty coyote]

It’s a pvp survival game. Which means it needs to be balanced where everything can survive, not just kill each other. You’re the one who wants carno to be stronger just so it can kill more things it has no reason to kill.

I can understand wanting carno to stand more of a chance against cera/teno, but you’re gonna have to buff it specifically against them, because carno already is an absolute menace to anything smaller. Yet at the same time, you have to make sure this buff isn’t too strong so that teno/cera still win the fight more often than not, because they don’t have the option to just avoid a carno, but carno can easily choose to not engage.

[thorn mountain]

@cerulean vault for one fracture is never a fun idea for 2 rex will have paleo calls for 3 crouching is super silent for 4 yes rex is super OP rn but thats because crush does no stam cost + its doing 5500 damage and a faster walk/run speed will just be meta

[cerulean vault]

It has nothing to do with fun, it should be able too. yes crouching is silent but again it didnt crouch everywhere. And thirdly your last comment shows you didnt read what I said because i did mention that the current rex on unofficial isnt actual rex.

[thorn mountain]

hang on lemme reread it LOL

oh ik its not actual rex

if you mean the crush stuff that was saying on official release it wont be that so rexes wont storm the plains

also I dunno about making rex a canni they will just kill anyway out of necessity even if bites were shown

[cerulean vault]

It shouldn't be a plains hunter to begin with not saying those hunts never happened if they did it was more then likely in dusk evening, or late night

[strong crypt]

honestly i would really like rex to be canni since you would get the real king of the hill feeling from it

[thorn mountain]

you will still kill other rexes you know that right?

[cerulean vault]

Do you really think a rex would pass up a meal

[thorn mountain]

no thats why they will kill other rexes but making them not a canni will make them not overpack

[cerulean vault]

it could scavenge and kill both have been proven

[strong crypt]

yes but with a clearer conscience

[thorn mountain]

what

[cerulean vault]

no making them not canni would make them overpack, The logic there dosnt follow. Again my evidence is irl.

You realistically can not feed a huge rex pack

two adults and a a juvi or twoo

that was the same in legacy

[thorn mountain]

its a game not irl people will overpack why? because with rexes you will be able to just kill another rex as 1-3 rexes and just feed all of you to atleast 50-60%

[cerulean vault]

People do that anyways with trikes deinos cera's and any dino

I got killed as a trike fg by three trikes fg two dibbles and a Deino

[slim dragon]

Why do you use irl evidence in a game that works nothing like real life

[thorn mountain]

yeah they do it with deino because you can just live off other deinos if you find them they do it as trike cause it is a herbivore same with dib and ceras do it cause they can eat everything

[cerulean vault]

Because most if not all are based off irl

[strong crypt]

this is a little annoying tho that carno is this thing that yes would destroy the eco system so they nerf it, and then realese for example dibble who clearly destroys the eco system 😦

[cerulean vault]

and this is the closet Dino game to realism there is

[strong crypt]

that its okay with certain playables and not others and people put on this its not supposed to be realistic standard to some animals and not others as they argue that dibble is 3t and should kill everything

[slim dragon]

Doesn't mean it works like real life at all
First very important difference that plays a lot in how cannibalism works being that in this game, dinos just pop into existence
Which doesn't happen irl

I don't get why people think cannibalism is somehow a debuff
If it was, there wouldn't be a mutation that allows you to turn into a cannibal
Cannibalism is NOTHING but an extra diet option

[crystal stream]

This argument had nothing to do with carno specifically

[cerulean vault]

All my evidence is from Real life so this comment makes no sense

[crystal stream]

And now it’s a PvP game when all I ever hear is it’s supposed to only be survival you can’t always have the best of both worlds dude

[cerulean vault]

and again its a video game and in my comment if you read it i mentiond game balance for the sake of game balance

[slim dragon]

Do you know the difference between real life and videogames ?

[cerulean vault]

How about you read and understand before commenting

[slim dragon]

no

[strong crypt]

well the isle isnt compleatly ficton based so they do take examples from irl. also they are trying to create a ecosystem which is based of irl ecosystems

[cerulean vault]

Then i will no longer respond to your conversations as you are not bringing anything to the table outside of just being a bit wierd

[slim dragon]

I did, you just ignored it

[cerulean vault]

This

[strong crypt]

idk how you act like the isle is compleatly ficton its a balance between

[slim dragon]

It's not identical to real life and never will

It's not a simulation

[cerulean vault]

Dont bother just move on they are not willing to have a proper conversation

[strong crypt]

well its heavily inspired by it

[slim dragon]

Just like all games duh

Except things like Hylics

[thorn mountain]

the game is aiming to be immersive iicr

[slim dragon]

Yep, that's a different thing

[thorn mountain]

ye

[crystal stream]

Very good point but these ideas for these animals are all unique and very important to make the ecosystem work except for a select few other times just making a Dino stronger or weaker to balance is not fun

[strong crypt]

theres a diffrence between lord of the rings for example and a dinosaur game with actual names of dinosaurs that exsisted i hope you can see that

[slim dragon]

It's very important, and it's also more fun for everything else as they don't have to deal with something that is overpowered

[strong crypt]

whilst both are inspired by real life 1 strive to be more accurate whilst the other is compleatly fantasy

[slim dragon]

But the Lord of the Rings also uses names of things that existed or still exist
Just fictionalized

[slim dragon]

One is fantasy, the other is science-fiction
The two are very similar things

And tbh the Lord of the Rings is aiming for realism much more than The Isle is

[strong crypt]

i think this says it all

[cerulean vault]

yep

my brain just died

[strong crypt]

piece out lol

[cerulean vault]

I am done yall have a good one

[slim dragon]

If you don't believe me, then it really shows you don't know what realism means

[cerulean vault]

Ancalagon the black crushing 3 moutain ranges by dying isnt realistic at all

XD

[slim dragon]

Neither is the matriarch

Which would probably crush a few mountain ranges upon dying as well

[cerulean vault]

I am going now Vicke carry on good sir enjoyed the conversation with you and frolo

[strong crypt]

its drifting a bit from the isle here not my intent with lotr remarks xD

[hasty coyote]

It can be both… if it wasn’t PvP then what are large carnivores supposed to even eat. Idk about you but I don’t think my Rex is living off boars alone lol.

The main thing most people are saying is this game is not a fighting game. Aka, a game where all things are balanced to be able to kill each other. Instead, as a survival game, it’s balanced around survival. If you can’t flee, fight. If you can’t fight, flee. If you can’t do either, then have a gimmick or be unviable. Prime example should be pachy. Pachy can’t run from Omnis, so it should bully them. Pachy can’t bully a cera, so it should just run. Pachy can’t run or bully a carno, so it uses a gimmick to remove its kneecaps and run. Compare that to fighting game balance where these all should be equal fights.

[strong crypt]

you also have weightclasses and groups

for example i can see a troodon not being able to run from or actually rarely win vs fg raptor

[hasty coyote]

Weight class is more of a general rule and not always the case. Like with Maia who can be soloed by things 1/3rd of its size.

[slim dragon]

Troodon is good enough at hiding to escape raptor

It just needs to not run in a straight line

[hasty coyote]

Troodon uses a gimmick called being smaller than grass and disappearing after every 3rd turn.

[potent fox]

Tbf that’s bc Maia is kinda complicated and before the patch was rlly underpowered

[crystal stream]

As I said you can’t have the best of both worlds not everything is going to be completely balanced when talking about real life animals from all around the worlds luckily the isle does a great job by making unique adaptations for animals that realistically would be complete meat sacks however sometimes it feels like make this guy stronger so that way there’s no hope in fighting it

[hasty coyote]

It’s also because Maia has PITIFUL damage (other than stomp) because it’s so fast and tanky. Otherwise it would be the best hunter in the game.

[strong crypt]

i feel like this game is really unbalanced having 4 playables being dibble tenon cera and trike being so far ahead of the rest of the rosters

[potent fox]

Je fair weight class isnt that relevant. Some punch above theirs some below so it’s inconsistent

[slim dragon]

What are dibble and teno doing in here

[strong crypt]

or you could say dibble tenon cera and trike are balanced and the rest is bad whichever way you like

[slim dragon]

There is no such thing as a perfectly balanced game, unless they provide every player with the exact same tools

But it should be an objective regardless

[elfin night]

Nah

Cera is broken and then trike could need some refinement

But we just need more playables in the roster

Teno is already not that different from cera and it’s gonna have a hard time with Rex and allo around

Same goes for dibble and trike

[strong crypt]

there is not but it is clear when some playables are way ahead of others and to deminish that gap is very doable

[hasty coyote]

It def isn’t always going to be perfectly balanced, but that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t try. All games have characters that end up too strong or too weak, but they get buffed/nerfed so that they can be on par. Like cera def needs some nerfs, but the issue is that it’s so 1-dimensional that its main survival strategy is just having better stats than what it’s fighting. So that’s why they have to be careful not to over nerf it like they did with pachy.

[strong crypt]

i would like to think that the goal with every playable is making it as funn and intressting as possible

[potent fox]

People also tend to feel that playables that punch above their weight class are op. Which is kinda fair bc it goes against the general more growth time = more power and size thing but it’s obviously good that some things can punch above. If dilos worked correctly people would complain about them much more aswell.

[strong crypt]

so when people say cera should only be viable around corpses i can say that would not be funn for cera. however it being stronger around them is nice

[elfin night]

I predict teno and especially dibble are gonna have a significant dip in the meta after Rex releases

And if there’s no buffs, stego will be pachy tier

[maiden temple]

What are they gonna do? Roar as I trot away?

[potent fox]

Tbf I think it would be fun for some cera players and those should be its target audience. The problem is just that we have no predator that’s more consistent rn.

[maiden temple]

I'm sure cera lovers will still play, I feel like teno will always have something to fight

[elfin night]

Erm….

3 ton sub rex running at like 45kph with ambush

[maiden temple]

I can jump, he can watch me from the ground as I bark away

[elfin night]

Although water teno will shine

So I think teno is gonna be still good. At worst A tier

Dibble however…

And then stego is cooked

[hasty coyote]

Imo, the issue is less the difference in weight, and more the fact that there’s generally a major speed difference. Plus the fact that if you’re able to kill something with 3x as much health as you (and generally more damage), something may not be right.

[maiden temple]

I assume it will sound heavy asf too, I'm not missing that. Unless I walk into it while it's already hiding I'm not dying

I am worried for stego lol

[elfin night]

At least we can agree dibble and stego are cooked

[strong crypt]

idk i think a well balanced dinosaur with a niche is funn. not a usless dinosaur unless niche

[elfin night]

Op my ass. They’re getting dunked on by Rex and even allo in the case of dibble

[maiden temple]

Stego needs siege stance v.v

https://tenor.com/view/siege-tank-starcraft2-transfor-terran-deviantart-henryphung96-gif-16176441

[strong crypt]

i can see this working tho with more playables but not as it is now

[hasty coyote]

No it’s far worse for stego. Pachy at least has a chance if the stars align and it’s like an hour grow, stego just flat out dies after 5 hours of growing.

[slim dragon]

With artillery attacks ?

I agree

[maiden temple]

Nukes.

[slim dragon]

Makes sense

[elfin night]

True

Stego is gonna suck so much in a post Rex world if it doesn’t get massively buffed

[slim dragon]

Maybe rex won't actually pin stego once it gets released
We can hope

[maiden temple]

Pachy neerds a whole rework even now, I think it's just left for later maybe with some bone break changes?

[elfin night]

Still it’s gonna get walked down, headbutted and obliterated

[maiden temple]

Fractures are SO dangerous right now, as they should be, but having pachy be the ultimate cc without having them murder carnis is hard

[potent fox]

I’m not sure what you mean be the first part. Yes speed is probably the most relevant stat in the game im saying people feel as tho weight should play a big role while some Dinos are designed to specifically kill things bigger than itself (ofc often in packs but even then the enemy often has a stat advantage). I’m not saying it’s a good or bad thing I’m just saying that’s what makes people mad, when their Stego is killed by a dibble that half their weight. And je things shouldn’t punch to hard above their weight but sometimes the skill difference is enough

[slim dragon]

Tiered fractures will make the entire system so much better

[maiden temple]

I remember wrecking the op versions of carno as a duo and while hilarious it was just nastyyyy

[slim dragon]

It would mean that

1. dinos other than pachy could benefit from fracture attacks without said fractures being pointless or straight-up OP
2. It makes hitting an already fractured part not a waste of your precious blunt damage as you can fracture it further

[slim dragon]

Right after pachy's release I would stroll through the plains and groups of carnos would run away upon seeing me

[strong crypt]

the direction its going like killing babies as a carno (niche being a small game hunter) sounds cool but after a few minutes its not rewarding not funn and it almost feels toxic. the second you try hunting something else it feels impossible not really hard impossible almost. and of course it should not beat a dibble since its litrally the counter against carno, i mean a charge vs a shield

[maiden temple]

I also avoided pachies at all cost

[elfin night]

Adult dilos and Omnis are small game yk

[slim dragon]

There's also plenty of grown animals in carno's hunting range

And many more will be coming in the future

[strong crypt]

i know they are

[crystal stream]

Thank you you finally get what I’m saying

[maiden temple]

Hunting smalls is fun, not the tiniest of juvis, but just smaller versions of the dino

[potent fox]

True but I think with a big enough roaster it’s fine to have weird niches. I don’t enjoy playing carno bc of exactly what you said but some people do. Currently it just sucks bc people want big carnivores but the choices are super limited

[strong crypt]

its really one sided and not rewarding at all if you ask me

[maiden temple]

Nah, it's thrilling. Especially when the smalls are visually tiny but already weigh a ton

[strong crypt]

yes with a big enough roster we could say hey dont pick carno it sucks unless u wanna kill small dinos but this is so far into the future

[slim dragon]

A chase can be intense, maybe you just don't like it

[crystal stream]

As much as I already know ppl don’t agree but carno does seem a lil lackluster I did love old carno but im hoping gobbler Carno will be perfect

[maiden temple]

Except trike, I found a mini trike and it turned out it was like 3 tons already

[potent fox]

Agreed tbh it’s hard to find a balance for a carnivore this fast when the roaster is still limited

[maiden temple]

It's hard to spot them and you have to use tracking, it's fun in its own way

[strong crypt]

depends on what ur hunting and this becomes another argument that i cannot prove to you other then getting you into a server with me and then fighting it out but if a dibble or tenon weights under 1t its like face tank if they weight 1.5 or smth its like they kill you

this statement is not 100% accurate

because dibble and tenon fights diffrently

[hasty coyote]

Imo, pachy itself has a fine kit. The issue is the numbers and self stuns are horrible because fractures are op. Once fractures get nerfed, pachy itself can be much better. Tbh I worry for future fracture Dino’s because of how op fractures are atm

[elfin night]

It’s so awful that pachy is very much forced to take damage when attacking

[strong crypt]

for me the issues with patchy is that desync making u miss attacks even tho you hit on your screen and also fractures being inconsistent for example i can cleary hit the part of the head on a carno and he will get body fracture

so mostly lagg stuff

[crystal stream]

Vicke you tryna add me I wanna play the isle with ya sometime

[strong crypt]

O_O

[maiden temple]

Smaller tenos are really fast but still small so it's not easy to kill them. Unless they end up running into plains. A 1T teno can stun you so there's a bit of a fight as well.
Carnos and raptors are the only thing I fear when I'm growing teno, I tend to get away easily though, most people don't want to spend too long hunting :c

[strong crypt]

whenver growing something carno is the one to fear xD

[maiden temple]

Yeye, I just hide more on bigger stuff so they rarely have a chance to spot me at all

Since most playables are miserably slow most of their growtime

With teno once I'm over 43km/h I feel mostly safe to roam

[crystal stream]

I still think carno needs my charge idea lol

I hate how the current one plays

[maiden temple]

It's back to being rather brainless with kite charge kite charge

[strong crypt]

now having 3 carnos u can defo kill a tenon and you pick the fight aswell if you find it and it cannot run from you

and here people will argue tenon cannot do anything.

[hasty coyote]

I just think there’s a lot more factors than weight alone, but yeah most people just think “I’m bigger therefore I should always win”

Diablo v stego in particular is an issue because Diablo just constantly stuns the stego out of its attacks. Even without the stuns it would be a solid threat because of its damage reduction, which is fine imo.

[strong crypt]

which i dont think is wrong since every herb is herd and mixpacking is common so you being alone kinda is the problem there tbf

[maiden temple]

Most people I stumble upon are solo, but I avoid hotspots so I mostly find players that are growing, heading to a hotspot or just wanna chill away from everyone else

I wish all the servers were bigger than just 100 players

[strong crypt]

definetly agree here that weight isnt the only factor. example maia has weight as a defensive stat more than it being stonger than everything smaller than it

[strong crypt]

if you press the unofficial search tab for the server searching mechanism u can find servers like paetit peids that regularly have about 290 players on

but maybe you wish they had official servers for it ik, but maybe this is a good comprimise 🙂

[maiden temple]

No thanks, I have enough awful experiences with privates

Official has its charms, along with the downsides

But no power tripping admins/carebearing friends are def the best perks of officials

[crystal stream]

Can you play the isle with me sometime

[crystal stream]

Idk what I did to you but calling me brainless is not cool at all esp when referring to a discord server get a grip

[hasty coyote]

If I'm open at the time, then sure.

[crystal stream]

Even more so dealing with a opinion that I feel very strongly about

[maiden temple]

You took it way too personal, I called carno gameplay loop brainless

At least compared to what it used to be, charge kite charge kite is not fun nor imaginative

[crystal stream]

Oh mb I genuinely thought you where talking about me but I think the Carno charge idea is perfect but that’s just my opinion

[crystal stream]

Ok jst lemme know

[maiden temple]

Yeah it seems like opinions are really divided for this playable 😄
You're fine

[crystal stream]

I was trying to find a way to make my self happy by making a lil easier to take on larger things and get rid of the current charge what plays and looks rlly bad while also making small teir players happy by making carnos charge take a lil precision

[maiden temple]

Any change at all would make it more interesting, I just don't like it how it is rn

[crystal stream]

For sure

[viscid mica]

@manic spire don’t go near omnis as things that can get pinned everything else can buck or use other surfaces to knock em off

Everything omni can pin does or is planned to have a way to escape or simply stay out of sight

[strong crypt]

carno is one of the dinos with higher skill cieling LULE

[maiden temple]

When did I ever comment on skill ceiling for carno

Either way it's much lower than it used to be, and that's partly my issue with it :x

[manic spire]

I still think it's dumb. I appreciate knowing there will be other ways to escape, though. I definitely dont deserve clown emoji's because i think the pounce sucks right now. its in a better spot than it was, but, again, that doesnt mean it's good

[strong crypt]

maybe i misunderstod this

[wanton edge]

@jade prairie dryo's a small flight oriented prey animal what's the point of encouraging them to stand their ground against similarly sized predators?

[jade prairie]

because sometimes you cant run or youre protecting a nest/offspring and the potential to fight back can ward off attacks.

[crimson crater]

the bleed made zero difference

[cosmic pelican]

(It had below average bleed anyways)

[jade prairie]

i found it made a fair difference

albeit not enough

[crimson crater]

honestly, i think dryo is fine as is, it isn’t a brawler and should hide in its burrows (when it gets it) if anything it needs a nerf

[wanton edge]

i mean dryos can still dodge and it'd be best to simply steer your hatchlings to hide bc they're undetectable in bushes. dryo needs nothing more to be added to it.

[jade prairie]

but in any case, if its something so inconsequential that it supposedly didnt matter, then why remove it

[crimson crater]

dosen’t make any logical sense for a blunt attack to cause something to bleed, guess that’s why

[jade prairie]

it has claws, they do not look blunt

[crimson crater]

i’m not just talking about the kick it does

[jade prairie]

i can understand the tail whip and bite not doing bleed, but the claws?

[cosmic pelican]

I wouldnt really call them claws tbh, its pretty much the same shape as an elephants nails

Not really something Id imagine being able to rip skin to inflict bleeding wounds

[crimson crater]

i can’t blame him for thinking that, up close dryos claws look kinda sharp

[jade prairie]

its not though?

if you look at it from the side, they are very clearly pointed

[cosmic pelican]

I cant help but notice the uncanny resemblence to human nails

[crimson crater]

these aren’t jello-bags, we are talking about dinosaurs with thick skin and scales, can’t see something so minuscule penetrating it lol

[crimson crater]

^

[cosmic pelican]

(Yes thats a dryos foot, dont ask why I have it on hand)

[jade prairie]

you would be surpised at how much of a punch a small reptile can pack in its claws

[cosmic pelican]

To human skin, sure. Even the tiny little nails of rabbits can feel uncomfortable, but the dinosaurs were talking about have generally much thicker skin

[jade prairie]

a bipedal, burrowing animal with claws is still going to do damage

and here is a better screenshot of a dryo feet from the side. it looks nothing like elephant feet

[cosmic pelican]

Yeah, and it does, a kick from a dryo does as much damage as an omnis bite, which is enough to 1 shot a troodon (on the body) and beipi (to the head)

[jade prairie]

but why remove the bleed

[cosmic pelican]

Sure the bleed could be added back, but dryo would find 0 benefit in it aside from "yeah thats a thing too I guess"

[cosmic pelican]

Dryos alt attacks were completely broken hitbox wise last update, I guess the devs revisited them and found the bleed to be a mistake too

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/855527844670865438/1357801733333582075/8FE4E01.MP4?ex=686c2267&is=686ad0e7&hm=2bf6b51c0699db167f5acb1aabb6bef5edbea9d0c4f4584eb057efbaa94a8d48&

Video as reference

The tail attack had broken hitboxes as well, but I dont have footage of that sadly

Wait nvm it shows at the start, mb

[jade prairie]

tragic

would be nice to have the burrowing added and the weird shoulders when sniffing fixed

instead of bleed removed

[viscid mica]

Ignore those 3 they never post, never talk and downvote everything they wouldn’t know what balancing is if it hit them in the face they got the iq of a walnut

Anyhow I disagree a single playable that you should avoid as things smaller than it isn’t world ending

[manic spire]

I think we can agree on that, actually

[viscid mica]

[steep gazelle]

One thing I find really funny is this... Dryo was bugged and was fixed even though it wasn't a problem for practically anything, but Cerato has been op since its launch and still nothing has been done, It even got even more op in the last update xd

[dusky surge]

i dont understand this "toxic" mentality

"rex should be a canni because otherwise it's toxic to kill other rexes" or "carno shouldn't be designed around small game hunting because its toxic to kill babies"

no it isnt? Rex should be killing other rexes for the sheer fact that other rexes present the greatest risk to its ability to eat and live another day, and I never understood the stigma around killing babies. They're small, slow, rarely seen out of sanctuaries and haven't put basically any time into their animal, so its not even really a loss to have it die.

[crystal stream]

Is Rex being able to 2 shot trike final or is it planning to be changed or something

[dusky surge]

given that this rex is over 6 months outdated i would assume no thats not final lol

expect nothing to be final with this rex

[crystal stream]

Oh okay I jst wanted to make sure some ppl in this game playing as Rex where saying “well it is a apex” 🤡🤡

Like bro apex doesn’t mean it should two shot another apex

[dusky surge]

i'll be real there's a ton of stuff left to do before this rex can be properly added to the game tbh, namely its matchups with other creatures of its size tier

it being able to pin other rexes, 2 tap trikes and completely invalidate stego are all things I think need changing

also the sub being like, as fast if not faster than a carno, also probably not great

[crystal stream]

Allo is faster than Carno but allo is nowhere near done

[dusky surge]

but again, not final so im not gonna pretend like all these things are meant to be 100% set in stone

[dusky surge]

nah, allo's the exact same speed, because its literally just using carno stats

it even has the carno calls

the only changes are BF and weight

[crystal stream]

Oh ok I kept turning that’s probably why it was faster

[dusky surge]

allo is even less finished than rex lol

[crystal stream]

Oh by a mile

Allo doesn’t even have a proper turn circle

Jst shows how much goes into this game

[steep gazelle]

Allo speed will probably be 39km

Or 38

Above that it will completely break the game balance

[hasty coyote]

I'd prefer 38 personally, becuase 1kph speed difference would be like pachy v cera, which already feels awful.

[dusky surge]

(also hypothetically a 39km/hr allo could take a speed mut to run down teno/cera lol)

[hasty coyote]

even at 38 it could

wait no

it would need to be 38.2+

but speed mutations need to be removed regardless for that exact reason

[crystal stream]

Bro I feel like such a scumbag because I keep bringing it up but I rlly hope Carno gets anything to help it fight teno when gobbler comes ik it shouldn’t because it’s a small game hunter but you can’t tell me that Carno v teno is not a peak matchup 😂

Even now with carno heavy HEAVY disadvantages it’s still fun jst not fair at all

[dusky surge]

i still think gobbler will only worsen carno's chances because it's a complete 100% "small game" adaptation

[crystal stream]

I really don’t care how carno feels against cera or any other playable just something about teno

[crystal stream]

Probably only good thing is maybe buffing its weight a lil and getting rid of the god awful charge we currently have

[dusky surge]

whats godawful about it?

[crystal stream]

Oh you like it

[dusky surge]

i personally like it, adds a lot of versatility to carno's kit compared to prior iterations

[crystal stream]

Idk it just is very brain rot unsatisfying and looks rlly bad personally the head butt idea I bought up would look so much better but that’s just my opinion

Plus not having cc unless you run a mile before hitting your target there’s no cc and cc is what makes Carno so great

The feeling of knocking down your prey will never be topped

[dusky surge]

i like how it is compared to prior versions where it was just "melt all your stamina and it has a long cooldown but it just instantly wins a fight" was super lame to me

now its a move which allows you extra speed in chases (to catch up or escape), repositioning if you're stalking someone, damage, knockdowns if you set it up correctly, etc. Feels like something you can experiment with in your playstyle

i also think knockdown kinda doesn't really work on carno because of its speed

knockdown is usually a punishment for getting too close, but on something like carno, an animal faster than literally everything, its very difficult to balance something like that (its kinda why I think rex's new headswing tool is kind of not a great idea, especially since it can knock down stegos who are quite literally slower than it) but rex isn't done so withholding judgement

gobbler carno COULD fix this by having it that the charge is literally just a grab/swallow animation on small animals, and a regular bite on larger animals

[crystal stream]

Old charge did kinda suck but this one even when using it the way you mentioned it is not only super easy to counter but also look very bad

[crystal stream]

Sorry phone dies

[crystal stream]

While I wouldn’t mind that I think carno having cc wouldn’t hurt

Esp when dealing with stuff like teno who already have such a high advantage but keeping it small if you get hit by a carno it should be punishing

[dusky surge]

idk i feel that matchup with teno has always been insanely forced

especially given that teno's preferred biomes are generally well away from wherever carno is

even in concept art it shows a teno holding off 2 carnos lol

[crystal stream]

I could 100% see Carno v teno tho esp sense teno seems like it’s in the perfect size range

Not huge not to small jst a genuine good matchup

[dusky surge]

idk ive never thought the matchup to be all that good i'll be real

its always felt forced and not particularly satisfying, and honestly each update was always a balancing act of either teno gets nuked or carno gets nuked

i always have felt teno to be outside of the range/environment carno prefers to hunt

the matchup felt like people latched to it because it was one of the earliest "larger animal" matchups, given that carno was the first predator besides omni to be added

[elfin night]

Carno vs kentro is gonna be so funny

Carnobros are gonna be mega sore

[dusky surge]

Tbh I still am of the belief that baryonyx is the true perfect rival to teno

But every time I say that someone gets upset because baryonyx swallows fish

And apparently that eliminated it from the possibility of being a suitable matchup for teno

[keen plover]

Why would that even be a matchup though

I get that teno can swim well but like

Maybe I'm missing something

[elfin night]

💯

[elfin night]

Teno lore

[elfin night]

In fact, I was thinking about this and it’s funny because I feel like every mid tier addition will further affirm carno’s role as the small game hunter

I straight up cannot think of any medium sized creature that carno would stand a good chance against in a fight

So not only teno and cera, but also all the others will never have a 50/50 chance against the speed demon (rightfully so)

[dusky surge]

i think they'd share a lot more environments, and bary's mix of terrestrial and aquatic speed would mesh well against tenonto

[strong crypt]

i think your overthinking my statement a bit. i think it would be even harder if Rex was canni to play it which would be nice since its gonna be like the strongerst with highest payoff for amount of hours put into growing it

[dusky surge]

it would be easier, 100%

rex with rex on its diet is much easier than rex without

[strong crypt]

it would be like deinosuchus. you think deino would be easieer without deino on its diet? i can tell you there is no way it would

[dusky surge]

no, deino is absolutely easier with deino on its diet

if deino didnt have deino on its diet, that'd be the worst nerf you could give it

[strong crypt]

please explain why this is because it makes 0 sense

[dusky surge]

deino's easiest, most convinient, most filling source of food in the game is another deino. They provide diet, organs, literal tons of meat, bones, they exist in the water with you rather than running inland where you can't get them, you can grab them if they're 75% of your weight, etc

without the ability to eat other deinos, all deino has as a fallback is the fish, which we all know are not enough to sustain an adult deino. This leaves them basically entirely starving unless they are lucky enough to catch something like a drinking maia or swimming stego

cannibalism has literally been the thing that holds the deino population afloat

without cannibalism, deino would be effectively entirely unsustainable

cannibalism is only benefitial for the species that have it, which is why it's an extremely difficult mutation, because of how benefitial it truly is

[strong crypt]

well even without canni you could still kill them for food you would grow less quickly but the only threat that exsist to a deino is other deinos. now minimizing that threat is going to make it easier for deino since the chance of them killing you is lower if they find you and they would try to go for other dinosaurs instead

[dusky surge]

1 deino dies and feeds another, or 1 deino dies and the other dies of starvation

[strong crypt]

i mean look at carno how often does it die to itself since it can outrunn everything else if you never fight the hard fights ur basically unkillable.
now compare this to when it was cannibal or cerato RN and i can tell you that canni definetly was making them harder

[dusky surge]

this is my point. rex will want to kill other rexes because a 9.4 ton superpredator is not going to be good at sharing with other giant predators that vacuum up all the food. it doesn't ALSO need a dietary reward for doing so, the reward should be a lack of competition, not a meal in itself

we had problems like this before, where canni carno was so strong that you could just form entire megapacks and easily thrive

[dusky surge]

canni carno was INFINITELY easier

ngl

[strong crypt]

sorry but your wrong

[dusky surge]

i am absolutely not because i remember VERY WELL the carnopocalypse that cannibalism enabled

[strong crypt]

you can still from mega packs and still do all that just eating babies it makes no diffrence canni or not only thing thats diffrent is the fact that i almost never have to worry about other carnos

[dusky surge]

its MUCH easier to megapack as a cannibal too

megapack is starving? First dude to die gets eaten by everyone else and they're fine

i could actually bet on the fact that if cera wasn't a canni, there wouldn't be as many

[strong crypt]

also the game will never be hard no matter canni or not if you mega pack

[dusky surge]

cannibal creatures have only ever benefitted from the fact

[dusky surge]

okay so rex being cannibal doesn't matter so it doesn't need to be lol

if it makes functionally no difference to difficulty, why add it? Especially when in most people's experience, cannibalism only makes the game even easier

if you removed raptor off carno's diet, would it be harder? The answer is probably yes

If you added cera to its diet, would it be easier? Also, probably yes

So adding things to a diet = easier and removing it = harder

Now if you added rex to rex's diet, it would be easier, because more diet options makes the game inherently easier

[strong crypt]

no thats not what i said i said whenever you mega pack it makes no diffrence when your a FG T-rex if you eat another T-rex or if you eat 1 of the stegos or trikes you killed. however T-rex being Cannibal would make trust between them infinetly harder and make you wanna play solo or only with friends you trust

[dusky surge]

I would never trust another rex, canni or not

A 9.4 ton animal is going to want to make sure all the food belongs to it and not me

I'd be stupid to think just because I'm not on his diet I'm not on the execution list

[strong crypt]

i think it still works without canni to be fair i just think it would be harder with it

[dusky surge]

It would be harder without

[strong crypt]

like remove canni from cerato TBH i would never die almost xD

[dusky surge]

If a server is full of rexes, the cannibal rex thrives while the non-canni rex struggles

[strong crypt]

why of course he is not being picky with his food

[dusky surge]

Not having cannibalism moderates populations by ensuring that large overpops of one carnivore cannot survive or thrive

Ironically, cannibalism does the entire opposite of moderation of a population

[strong crypt]

so you think there would be less ceratos alive if they were not canni?

[dusky surge]

Yes, more than likely, although cerato uniquely has many other benefits to circumvent that, like the ability to eat rot and bones

Cerato has so many more options than other carnivores, which makes it thrive so much more

More food options = easier time not starving

[strong crypt]

im sure rexs will just steal corpses tbh xD

and have really good smell

[dusky surge]

im sure they will, but why wouldn't they lol

like they have their brawn to secure any meal they want

they don't also need the benefits of cannibalism

[strong crypt]

well i have a feeling that the most likely scenario is gonna be T-rex is the only thing that can kill T-rex so it being cannibal would add to that temptation. i think now most of the time if its not 2v1 T-rex they will try to avoid fights tbh

[dusky surge]

theyd still kill other rexes because every other rex is less food for your rex

[dusky surge]

t-rex would kill other t-rexes if it were a canni or not, except in the case where it's not, it's also dying of starvation on top of the other rexes

double the risk of death

[strong crypt]

yes but it would happend more with canni you can litrally see this example on carno that it is actually proven instead of us just thinking

[dusky surge]

i played canni carno. It was hell with the megapacks

like im surprised you remember that as remotely difficult

it was beyond easy to survive and prosper

[strong crypt]

megapacks happend regardless of canni or not

[dusky surge]

when they removed cannibalism, carno populations plummeted

because they no longer could support entire servers full of carnos

[strong crypt]

they will happend with rexses regardless of canni or not

[dusky surge]

they'll happen less if they don't canni

[strong crypt]

play on community servers with rules untill they fix megapacking somehow tbh

[dusky surge]

we literally have evidence for this

the carno situation quite literally proved how much cannibalism aids a creature, same with cera

and deino jesus deino

spiro deino was so supported by the power of cannibalism

i saw over a dozen deinos in one place sustained entirely off the consumption of other unfortunate deinos not part of the central river megapack

[strong crypt]

it aids you when your bigger in some sense but when you die to it 50% of the time makes each singular life harder to grow one

and Megapacks will still happend untill that problem itself is fixed somehow be it losing food quicker when staying around other spiecies or smth

or being over pack limit or smth

[elfin night]

It also only exists nowadays because it is a cannibal

If deino could only reliably live off elite fish and cooking schooling fish, no one would ever play it

It would be next to impossible to survive

[dusky surge]

That’s what I’m saying

Cannibalism is the lifeblood for deino

Personally, I only think cannibalism should be innate to three animals:

Cerato
Deino
Megalania

And also Gen 1 if we’re counting them

[elfin night]

No one else?

[dusky surge]

No that’s it

The roteaters and scavs

[elfin night]

Well, maybe I could see it but being just no spasms, without diet for some

Such as alberto

But I agree if it’s just those for diet

[elfin night]

(Mostly because it looks like the devs want that)

[dusky surge]

Oh I could care less about Alberto and don’t see the need to arbitrarily buff it with cannibalism

[elfin night]

True

I personally wouldn’t indulge that but I mentioned it cuz concept art and devs

[strong crypt]

also T-rex was most likely cannibalistic and i think it would add to it feeling rewarding aswell

[mint star]

herrera wasn’t most likely a tree climber

[elfin night]

Realism is irrelevant

[strong crypt]

jesus your impossible. im saying it would be a cool feature and realistic

[dusky surge]

(i think itd be an uncool feature)

[strong crypt]

good for you. you also think tenon is weaker than cerato

and that dibble isnt strong right

[dusky surge]

i mean yes

[vale brook]

servers that have rex right now are filled with rexes, and they're still killing and eating each other without the canni mutation

why on gods green earth would we make what is already a relatively easy grow even easier by allowing it to minmax its diet off other rexes

[dusky surge]

i dont see what that has to do with me not wanting rex to be easy

[strong crypt]

well it proves to me you dont know balancing

[vale brook]

like its not even a debate anymore

we are seeing exactly what is happening with rex even without being an innate cannibal and its achieving the same thing that it would achieve with being an innate cannibal

[vale brook]

this is the funniest thing you couldve said to wavepoole

[dusky surge]

i have a degree in game design and was lead designer and balancer for a video game in the past lmao

in reality, what it proves is my opinion is different than yours

that happens on the internet

[strong crypt]

lets hop on a server then and u prove to me that cerato is so much stronger then them

:S

[dusky surge]

unfortunately i am several hundred kilometers away from home about to head to my grandfather's funeral tomorrow so isle is not on the agenda

[strong crypt]

sorry bout your loss. lets do it another time 😉

[dusky surge]

i mean, even if we did, what does it prove? Skill levels and ping differences will make the outcome inevitably biased

[strong crypt]

well i can prove you ways to play the dinos that people do rn

[dusky surge]

For reference btw I am fully expecting to lose, regardless of if I pick cera or teno

[strong crypt]

i do not care about win or lose i want to show mecanics that make tenon stronger

[dusky surge]

Doesn't cerato literally have more mechanics that grant it an advantage

[strong crypt]

"=#)!?=#)!"?03

[dusky surge]

what

[eager saddle]

What indeed

[eager saddle]

This tbh. I’ve seen dozens of rex corpses, barely eaten from while more rexes roamed the area. They are NOT starving

[strong crypt]

this rex is very incomplete xD

[eager saddle]

That…doesn’t make the growth any less easy?

[strong crypt]

to clarify people who play on pvp server usually tend to think that with bodybuff tenon vs cerato tenon is weaker but without it teenon is stronger but they dont see it as a problem because tenon can use Shift + W to get away from bodybuff

[eager saddle]

If people can grow all these rexes without diet from 90% rex servers, they can do jt when it hits live

[elfin night]

Didn’t read that in the message

So I assumed

Either way canni rex would be mega cringe

Because as it happened with carno and Wave mentioned it, with innate cannibals then a server can simply maintain a population of just that carnivore

Like how based on my research on several official servers before trike

Cera was like 60% of the global population

💀

Well no that’s an extreme example

Global would be 40 or so which is still bafflingly high for one playable out of 17

[strong crypt]

Cerato VS tenon mr rex with bile id say its 50/50 comes down to players

also apparently tenon is faster than cerato

@dusky surge

[amber wharf]

I mean, i think it would benefit. Keep apex pop not too high, rex needs to be hard to grow, just like trike right now 50/50 you run into a canni trike/trikes competing for the abysmal amount of food.

[strong crypt]

there are some servers that has old version of rex on RN and tbh i was afk for 1h came back was like 15% XD

[dusky surge]

canni rex would increase the amount of food, defeating that issue

[amber wharf]

Also, is cerato not a cannibal? (I refuse to play it lol)

[dusky surge]

cerato is a canni

its part of what makes it so good

[amber wharf]

Well also its the only competent land carnivore rn.

[dusky surge]

hard disagree with that

so many carnivores atm are extremely competent and capable

cera's just insanely goddamn strong so it comparatively makes everyone look worse lol

[amber wharf]

Herrera climbing is broken. Along with omni pouncing. 💀 The only other carni to compete with cerato would be carno, and it gets stomped on pretty easily.

[strong crypt]

i might be wrong here actually cannibal might make it easier when grown. think its harder when small tho

[amber wharf]

I'd agree but right now, half the carnivores stuff is broken so cerato is the only like carni WORTH playing right now unless you wanna die due to bugs from playing other dinos. I guess troodon is an option but at the same time, each time I play troo I always die to desync.

[amber wharf]

Ehh. Canni is easy because you usually always run into a baby of your same species. Baby fight time. 😂

[strong crypt]

tbh i want rex to be as hard as possible to grow because it will have highest reward

[amber wharf]

This. We can't bring realism up because this game ISN'T realistic but at the same time, y'know, rex needs to be like trike. A huge pain to grow because how powerful it is.

[strong crypt]

like everyone wants to be the 100% rex but getting there is not gonna be for everyone

[strong crypt]

what in this sentence had with realism to do?

[amber wharf]

i meant before someone said you can't argue 'rex would have been canni irl' lol

i think all carnivorous dinosaurs would have been cannibalistic if given the opportunity. 😂

[strong crypt]

well i dont argue from a realism point i just said it would fit in and be doable

[amber wharf]

no, I do agree with you! i just was saying someone mentioned it before and i do agree, especially with an apex like rex. it'd be weird imo if it wasn't canni. if it isn't going tobe canni, atleast make its mutation to be a canni easier to obtain.

[strong crypt]

i thought that canni would make it harder ingame but i might be wrong here im realising

[amber wharf]

it might make growing a bit easier BUT at the same time, it makes competition fierce. if rex is canni, it might seem easy at first glance before you start getting chased down by a slightly bigger rex. 😂

[strong crypt]

without canni i think that most adult rexses will try to avoid fighting eachother since high risk low reward you know

[amber wharf]

Exactly. It'll only be something rex pairs attempt to do but at the same time, solo rexes would only attempt if they are low on food/starving or get the jump on the other rex

Which even then, adult rexes will prob avoid eachother because its going to be a lengthy grow.

I think if rex is released and it is canni, people are going to be angry just because the competition and growing rex is going to be harder than initially thought but that comes with every new dino release. Baby trikes were getting slaughtered by other trikes, and they have no reason to be cannibals (i guess besides the obvious 'they have to compete for food too')

[strong crypt]

also like fighting deinos as another deino is tbh super funn if both FG and in water

and idk all other battles execpt for trike will be really 1 sided

[amber wharf]

yeah.. esp with waht ive seen from rex. i know it hasnt been officially released to HT but if you can really pin a rex then one shot it after it gets up, that's going to make apex fights incredibly boring.

[strong crypt]

but rex now is from 6 months ago. i would hope that pinning is not possible if the other rex is looking at you or smth

[amber wharf]

yeah, I mean, i honestly hope if you are an adult rex, you can't pin a rex that's also adult (full adult). that's just wack tbh.

would make apex fights actually way more entertaining instead of just pinning and winning immediatly.

it's the reason i like diablo so much, especially w/ sparring.

[strong crypt]

but rex has sparr stance against other rexses so i hope that will prevent pinning

[amber wharf]

oh does it? that's going to be awesome lol

[strong crypt]

yeah it has it against Trikes aswell its just really buggy

in this version of the T-rex

[amber wharf]

oh yeah i did see that. that was interesting.

[vale brook]

not 6 months, but it is outdated

[strong crypt]

ah maybe i heard missinformation

[strong crypt]

and very buggy

[steep gazelle]

Unfortunately. But hopefully people will start to realize how bad these mutations are for the game

[strong crypt]

they kinda are like the ones that give MS is broken damage ones change the game(makes it hard to balance carnivores) gastro is broken can perma fight and also tactile endurnace for herbs is like u used all ur stam like a noob and now u get it all back

but i feel like the only ones that really impact the game are photosyntetic tissue, nocturnal, tactile endurance and gastro

[dusky surge]

nah, congential and literally every damage mutation are also part of the problem

[strong crypt]

oh yeah congetal forgot

and yeah they are strong but dmg ones are only for carnivores and congental aswell is strong but for example gastro and tactile change the game

[dusky surge]

them being only for carnis makes them worse tbh

[strong crypt]

it really would but in this case only one that it really makes a diffrence on is cerato as far as i can see

with rex having these mutations one could only imagine

[soft mantle]

@violet cave it is unrealistic, but also bleed in general is highly unrealistic and damage numbers/hp, tho those things are needed for the game, to be a game, fun and engaging(there are many other examples but you get the point), realistically a good bleed would be enough to sicken and weaken most animals in real life, and we have animals being able to take more than 100 hits

[elfin night]

Making it an innate cannibal would just ensure that there would be food for everyone if half of the server is playing rex

Cannibalism is so counterproductive in this game because you can replenish any specimen losses instantly by respawning

It’s just age control (unless we are talking about packs), not population one

[amber wharf]

half the server isn't going to be playing rex tho. 💀

[elfin night]

if rex were a cannibal, and adding up to the fact that it is the damn Tyrannosaurus rex, yeah

half of the server would be playing rex without any issues

since half of the server would be guaranteed diet too

[soft mantle]

i agree with this

[amber wharf]

you greatly over estimate how many ppl actually care to play rex, esp when the hype is over.

[elfin night]

HUH?

[elfin night]

Are you telling me that the majority of players do not want to play as the biggest, baddest carnivore?

The natural carnivore bias applies here too

carnivore bias is also what kept cera's pick rate so high, on top of being cannibal and op

[soft mantle]

i once said rex should be cannibal in the early days of HT, but now that he's gonna be launched directly and thinking how many rexes would be adult and just eat other rexes over and over would mean the first ones to reach fg would have an enormous advantage for the next rexes

[soft mantle]

true

[amber wharf]

Then those FG rexes would have to be on constantly and roaming the map like clock work.

[amber wharf]

I didn't say a majority but it's going to be like trike. Lots of hype, then people realize how much of a drag it is to grow (even though trike really is just afk simulator it appears. atleast rex you'll have to hunt.)

[elfin night]

maybe rex growth will help, but honestly the fact that rex as a juvi and sub is meaningfully distinct and designed to be a functional carnivore on its own, then cannibalism would ensure that the landscape is dominated by what functionally is a perpetual population of Quianzhousaurus, Albertosaurus and Tyrannosaurus

[hasty coyote]

If the babies were slower than the adults, it might be. But the babies are fast, so they don’t have to worry about a bigger Rex eating them. Plus, canni means you won’t be a baby for long if you just go and eat the first other baby Rex you find, or scavenge from the 100s of dead baby Rexes. Cannibalism is ONLY a buff because it just adds more things to eat, the added canni kills will not make up for the sheer amount of potential diet food added.

[amber wharf]

if half the server is playing those select dinos, sure.

[elfin night]

they will since juvi rex likely isn't going to be a sanctuary camping useless potato

even though the growth curve is brutal

[amber wharf]

it's still going to be afk simulator on grow time, let's be real. lol

[elfin night]

not necessarily because of the reason I provided

[amber wharf]

because it won't be camping sanctuaries? ok.. it'll just camp where ai spawns. 😂

[elfin night]

or it will be hunting

come on bro

50kph isnt there to run down boars

[amber wharf]

if it is going to be that fast ngl that's insanity. 💀

[strong crypt]

on release yes 50% will be rex but with it being canni making people attack eachother with T-rex u lose it took u 10h to grow u not gonna be happy to do it again xD

alot of people will want to be 100% rex but they wont like the way to getting there

[amber wharf]

If they weren't going to allow rex to be canni/have it on preferred diet, could just make it where rex COULD eat other rex without geting sick - losing the point in cannibalizing unless starving since they don't provide any sort of diet.

[amber wharf]

Of course, like trike was. 😂

[elfin night]

it has the crush as a juvi and 700-900kg rexes are gonna be running like carnos basically. Built to kill players

[strong crypt]

you know you dont get sick from being canni u only get muscle spasm and infertile nowdays

[amber wharf]

Oh you are saying juvie. What growth is juvie for rex?

[elfin night]

like half of it lol

[amber wharf]

Yes but the muscle spasms annoying 😭

[elfin night]

if not more

[strong crypt]

idk if its speed gonna be like carno

[amber wharf]

ok i mean that's fair 😂

[amber wharf]

he said 50

maia top speed without photo in bipdeal is like 46.9kmh

[elfin night]

I've seen stat sheets of juvi rex with 57kph 💀

[strong crypt]

thats gotta be old version or cap

[amber wharf]

has to be cap, my lord..

[elfin night]

dunno if accounting for the ambush, although I think juvi doesn't have it

[amber wharf]

anyone know if they are planning to give rex ambush?

[elfin night]

yes

[strong crypt]

Only Sub and adult has ambush

[amber wharf]

i know the ambush they get the speed boost.

Yeah juvie being 50 kmh is crazy. even around 45 is GENEROUS asf.

[strong crypt]

and also alot seen RN is prone to change right

[thorn mountain]

its on it rn

[amber wharf]

lowkey forgot about most of that - so i mean, im fine if rex isnt canni then. 😂 less diet for them mfs

[amber wharf]

I haven't played the bare bones / broken version of it. ❤️‍🔥

[thorn mountain]

ayyy

[strong crypt]

yeah makes little diffrence i mean if u FG same shi u food is food

[amber wharf]

I still thought eating same species made you sick - I'm adummy.

I think it's because I watched those stupid cannibal videos where thye have to over eat and throw up, didnt realize they were overeating.

mb mb

[strong crypt]

i think it used to lower ur growth rate but it doesnt anymore

[thorn mountain]

it lowered all your stat increases

[amber wharf]

think last time i cannibalized i was fg herrera and didnt even realize i was eating herrera (body was torn up, thought it was an omni or smthng) until i started biting randomly 😭

[amber wharf]

so like if you have perf diet, ur stats decrease?

[thorn mountain]

as in the like 15% bleed res and such

stuff like that not actual biteforce, speed or weight

[strong crypt]

honestly im not playing officials on rex release cant be botherd to face 2 rexses 4 trikes and 3 carno mixpack xD

[amber wharf]

yess ok thats what i thought

[thorn mountain]

ok cool

[amber wharf]

i mean i will be, just not growing rex. maybe some time in a few months after its release i might but idk. growing a trike is already horrible - being as slow as a trike is worse. 😭 edit: not comparing rex speed to trike, i just know itll also be slow

[strong crypt]

thats something to discuss like making a anti mixpack or megapack system somehow

[thorn mountain]

the devs are making one

[amber wharf]

could be some sort of debuff like POT has i think.

[strong crypt]

whilst some people do enjoy those things they are generally thought to ruin the game experience for most

[thorn mountain]

we already know thats going to be a priority soon

[strong crypt]

frolo u working on the isle?

[amber wharf]

i wish anti cheat system was a priority 😔

[thorn mountain]

no lol I just know alot about the game. More than most

[amber wharf]

you been in the disc for a year, chill big dawg

[strong crypt]

lillbro

[thorn mountain]

ive been in the discord for a year but have been keeping up with the game since 2020 😛

[amber wharf]

i was teasing. i been playing since like.. god 2015 or smthng. this game is far too old to still be in development ngl.

[thorn mountain]

lol

[lethal shale]

@violet cave players when uninteresting playables are given unique niches to give them a reason to be played:

[strong crypt]

guys its early acces wdym old

[amber wharf]

this game has been out for like... so long. 😭

[thorn mountain]

ive been playing for 2 years 🙂

[amber wharf]

damnnnn 😂

[thorn mountain]

oh

I might have more...

[amber wharf]

let me show you OLD isle.

[thorn mountain]

I got 3 accounts

[amber wharf]

look at that. UGLY AHHH

[thorn mountain]

this was before progression? Or during

[amber wharf]

This was like before even legacy 😂

This was the OG map, the OG dinosaur models

[thorn mountain]

ik

[amber wharf]

OH WAIT yes progression sorry

[thorn mountain]

lol

[amber wharf]

for a sec i was like wdym but i remember the word now 😂

[strong crypt]

honestly like not having to much AI is like kinda great vs megapacks of carnivores

[amber wharf]

those pics were actually from 2016-ish

[amber wharf]

oh yeah def.and there is still plenty of ai. you just have to move around and find it because it only makes noise when you are close, atleast in my experience.

[thorn mountain]

its just a skill issue and skill dif thats all it is. New players and players that hotspot struggle because they have never known how to actually find AI cause its usually just everywhere

[amber wharf]

well at first for alot of people it was hard i think. i took a long break from this game because ai was broken for a while, and i didn't want to play starving simulator. i didn't realize the ai was a huge issue because i kept running into it on herbivores, but then i DID realize the ai only made noise when it was close/rendered in for me it seemed.

it really isn't an issue, some ppl just hate you can't hear the ai 5 miles away. 😂

[thorn mountain]

yep

[strong crypt]

yeah i joined the Asura server on legacy not so long ago. I got invited to a group with like spinos t-rexses gigas a 10+ group and was like dahell. I asked them how can so many people survive and they said AI

and tbh having like clan wars in a dino game is not really lore accurate xD

[amber wharf]

well legacy ai is different. and the more people you have in a concentrated area, more ai spawns i think lol, for legacy at least.

[thorn mountain]

legacy also had it so if you were at a certain food % AI would start spawning

so starving was never a issue

[amber wharf]

yeah i think it was around below half, ai spawned.. and if it didn't, relogging always worked.

[strong crypt]

but i dont think a rex should be able to live of ai tbh

[thorn mountain]

and Ive seen people in AIfeedback suggest it

the issue is people want this game to be on easy mode pretty much

I sway to the other side even saying the game is TOO easy rn and not at all punishing

[amber wharf]

WDYM YOU CAN STARVE IN A SURVIVAL GAME? UNFAIR!! 😭

[strong crypt]

exactly xD

[amber wharf]

right now the only truly punishing thing in this game is mixpackers. Other than that, starving never seems to be an issue.. even for herbivores with grazing.

Grazing right now seems to be a neccessity for trikes atleast since the plant value dips HEAVILY when adult, but i think once they fix plant values, grazing you can only do once or twice before a timer is set and you have to find actual food or risk starving.

[thorn mountain]

I find it a good idea to make herbivores actually be aggresive over resouces like food and ways they could do that is REMOVE PATROLS and make less frequent larger plants in migrations

so less groups can sit in a migration and the weaker groups get pushed out and contested

or u know give diets punishing stuff if you have a bad diet

like i would be fine with making your animal borderline useless compared to others of its species and size class

[amber wharf]

this too. Especially trike - if you are a solo trike, right now the only thing that can kill you reliably is a pack of cerato (excluding omni because their pounces are very buggy rn).. so a pair of adult trikes are essentially untouchable (until rex or allo is released). A pair of trikes, even if they aren't nesting, would eat a TON - and ofc i'm going to be aggressive hoarding all this food when i need to eat a ton to even get over half stomach,.

[strong crypt]

this is so nice i really like herbs having less easy survivability when it comes to food

or over quality food

[amber wharf]

i'm a herbie player. herbie's have had pretty easy lives. 😂 people that complain they can't grow herbivores is because they always grow in hot spots (SP, highlands, west rail).

[strong crypt]

making plants that are like forexample organs for meat eaters

[strong crypt]

honestly if a pack of cerato is attacking trike id say they are pretty brave xD

[thorn mountain]

also they could do things like making your animal look malnourished (this could be with it being lighter in weight and have less colouring) so people will see you are in bad shape and can choose to target you in a fight

[strong crypt]

imagine more rare plants that give much more diet that theyd have to fight for

[amber wharf]

cerato can kill trike relatively easy in a big pack - it's just a matter of baiting their alt attacks and making them thrash (and also avoiding the stupid thrash OOE effect that seems t obe massive rn)

[hasty coyote]

That is a thing already just barely noticeable because of skins.

[strong crypt]

DONT GET ME STARTED CHOMP

https://tenor.com/view/triggered-gif-18447617

[hasty coyote]

It’s hard to tell if they are starving/weak or if their skin is just pale

[amber wharf]

this. it IS athing. you can see dinos when they are starving but it's not very noticeable.. but you can't see them being malnourished i believe from lack of diets.

[thorn mountain]

i knew it was a thing back in update 6 and such didnt know it is now. Thanks!

[hasty coyote]

I don’t think diets play a part

[amber wharf]

even right now, my friend and i growing trikes - he was saying 'before we hit around 80% we are killing any (smaller than us) trike that comes here, this is our food." 😂

[amber wharf]

yeah, I wish it did. Looking more malnourished/starving due to lack of diets would be neat.

[strong crypt]

this is good 🙂

healthy for the game to not make any packs to big

honestly nowdays plants dissapear more quickly

[amber wharf]

you also bet we going to be nesting so we going tobe incredibly aggro to any other trikes wherever we nest LOl

[strong crypt]

i was a stego having to chase away dibbles from the foods i wanted xXD

those lill dibbles just kept eating my food xD

man i wished i played during spiro carno since its my fav dinosaur

[maiden temple]

It's not pale skin, that's a thing when you lost a lot of blood. When you're hungry your ribs and some other specific bones poke through

It's noticeable when you can hang around them for long enough, close enough

Harder to see with patchy skins with high variation patterns

[elfin night]

@violet cave game isn’t meant to be realistic. By that rule of three so many abilities that make creatures unique and fun would disappear because they’re “baseless”. Body buff and bacteria are there because cera is meant to be a corpse bully and scavenger primarily

Needs those things to be more defensive and fight things off their kills

[hasty coyote]

Plus cera without those mechanics would just be Right Click Randy who can eat rot. That’s all it would be able to do to be unique.

[violet cave]

There is a fine line between unrealistic and this resistance thing. All I'm saying is it doesn't make any sense. Game does not need to be realistic to make sense. On top of that, it just complicates combat so much. I used to be one of the nerdiest legacy players. I knew every strength and weakness of every dino. Combat was simple. But in evrima? With all the perks? Combat becomes pretty random

[elfin night]

Combat is just more complex, not random

And there are many things in this game that don’t make sense and are unrealistic too, but we wouldn’t want them gone

In fact, many things in this game that are not realistic are not so because they do not make sense either

[hasty coyote]

Herrera being able to fall a good 100 feet onto another Dino, killing it instantly, and taking 0 damage from the fall also makes 0 sense. But it’s a game.

[strong crypt]

cant post links here anywhere i can?

[elfin night]

And Herrera is also one of the best carnivores right now unironically

Has been for a while

It’s just a well designed ambusher that is not oppressive and has a good skill ceiling

[hasty coyote]

If it’s relevant to a discussion you can link something.

[violet cave]

Say your oponent has perfect diet? How would you know? It would be more powerful than you anticipated. Making your calculations futile. You can't calculate how much health he has, nothing...

[elfin night]

Also. Why are we even talking about things that do or do not make sense in the balancing chat?

[hasty coyote]

And that’s why perfect diet has very minimal combat advantages at best.

[violet cave]

You replied

[elfin night]

Your opponent with perfect diet only gets an amount of minimal buffs that barely affect combat in the slightest. You also cannot determine how much health someone has exactly other than with scars and the damage they deal to you or what you’ve done to them