balance-feedback-discussion

[tender ermine]

It was indeed too long, but it was cool

[viscid mica]

It nuked omni viability

You’d legit get stun combod by half the roaster and die instantly

[tender ermine]

Nah, you just had to actually hit your pounces, but the timer was too punishing

Bit like how pachy has a self stun rn for missing ram

[viscid mica]

Pachy is considered one of the worst playables rn

It’s barely played

[tender ermine]

Clunky playable

[viscid mica]

Cuz it self stuns….

[tender ermine]

Too long a self stun, should be reduced

It’s only an issue because most other playables don’t have the same kind of recovery for big moves

[viscid mica]

[tender ermine]

I think all playables should have recovery on their big moves tbh

Like ceratos charge bite

[viscid mica]

So basically you want legacy combat

[tender ermine]

Lmao, thanks for informing me you aren’t being serious

[viscid mica]

Brudda you want everything to be pachy clunky

There is a reason why stuff doesn’t have self stuns and timers

The design isn’t bad combat for 99% of playables flows smoothly

The biggest reason I think cera losing its body buff just cuz it gets knocked down is cuz it does NOTHING for its health or its purpose as a corpse bully all it does is let herbis harass them more as barely if any carnivores have stuns

Like the major reason people don’t like pachy is one of 2 reasons
1 self stuns
2 its self stun creates a cool down to its main attack
(Plus it’s a wee slow)

It is clunky to play and feels unrewarding as even when you succeed you lose

[hasty coyote]

3: about 2/3rds your rams literally dont even register

[viscid mica]

2/3rds like 1/3rd don’t register lol

I swear I’ve had 10 of us hitting a cera and not a single break

[hasty coyote]

I have been a lone cera getting jumped by 4-5 pachies. They only landed 2 rams, body fractured me, and I killed 2 before they gave up and ran. I remember seeing at least 5 rams that played the hit animation, but did 0 damage. There were probably many more near miss rams that should have hit me as well. Pachy has just been left to rot for over a year now because its near impossible to balance with fractures being this op.

[elfin night]

My feedback about growths is kinda outdated now

Trike apparently not takes over 9 hours to grow on 100% boost

Newest patch.

I am in 120-140% boost and it’s been around an hour and I’m not even 10% lol

[waxen trench]

10h probably

great game

[elfin night]

Is this sarcasm?

[waxen trench]

yes

[obtuse ocean]

10 hrs for that crap lol

[elfin night]

Trike and potentially Rex taking 10h is a good thing lol

Ofc assuming they perform as they should

[waxen trench]

its good if its hard to grow, its not good if its boring to grow

idk being weak for like 7h isnt fun imo

[obtuse ocean]

Its not hard to grow in this game,made for noobs lol. Food water everywhere

Even as carni killing a small little dibble can feed an army

[elfin night]

I haven’t checked yet if the growth curve has been touched since in still a bit too small (it seems they have), but honestly at 7h you’re probably gonna be a powerhouse for most of the roster

[elfin night]

No longer in HT really if you want to max your diet

[obtuse ocean]

Diet? Im meaning food. As fully grown

[waxen trench]

maxing ur diet is just waiting for ur hunger to drop from 100% to 90% then taking another bite

[elfin night]

You could just make migrations an actual thing and then make ai harder to catch. And so it would be acceptable and engaging

Although to be fair the new bushes are gonna be pretty good for Rex as they make noise if you touch them and they’re almost everywhere

[tender ermine]

game needs more survival elements so balance talk isnt only about how strong something is in a fight

[obtuse ocean]

Hard for who? Juvis? Still easy to get food as grown. Its so people cant be like 6 allos surving on AI and a random small dibble here and there. I they should be snack

[elfin night]

I doubt that’s gonna be the case

Unless they add dinosaur ai that I hope they don’t

130kg boars are gonna feed late juvi allos at best

[obtuse ocean]

Yea talking about corpses, if your in a decent pack it should push you to actually go for something big. Sure solo can survive on small stuff

[elfin night]

I think Rex is gonna be fun with 12 hours though

[obtuse ocean]

90% gonna get nested in neways then. If 12 hrs. Free food and protection

[elfin night]

Gonna be fun

To spend the very least a couple hours to enjoy each Rex niche

Hopefully more than that

[obtuse ocean]

Yea hopefully you are correct

Wonder what that new trike attack is supose to do, i can go make a coffee and drink it. Then come back and dodge it

[viscid mica]

If you think trike is weak for the majority of its grow your crazy your gonna be dibble sized in roughly the same time even with the changes

Most your life your just a dibble that gets progressively better until your a apex slayer

[viscid mica]

All apex’s are gonna have murkier growth phases

[fierce marlin]

And then you get a dopamine explosion at 8 hours because you're barelly unbeatable

[viscid mica]

They legit walk through EVERY weight class at some point in their life

[elfin night]

not really. You're a tad smaller but almost the same speed and better bleed in 3 hours

unless there's a spike at 2-3 tons and you get those quickly

[fierce marlin]

Overall apexes should be weaker in some aspects because they are way to popular

[viscid mica]

Oh they fixed it that’s good your still thou trike is fairly strong after 2Ts

[elfin night]

19% trike is 2 tons and like 29-30kph after 2 hours

[viscid mica]

Oh ya your balling then

So 2 hours then you can start scrapping

[fierce marlin]

Its way to strong

[elfin night]

although in all fairness, trike can keep a 180% or even more diet more easily than any other herbivore in the game currently with a patrol at hand

[fierce marlin]

It should be around 1.5

[elfin night]

it's perfectly acceptable because I remained alive for 2 hours or more while also keeping a +130% growth boost for most of that time

especially when rex and allo are around

[viscid mica]

2 hours at 2T? It’s growing slower than dibble now that’s 100% fair game

It’s basically gaining 1T a hour

[elfin night]

if anything trike is going to be very hard to grow when migrations work as they should and you are forced to walk AND compete with other herbivores at a not so great size so you can stop being apex fodder

[viscid mica]

That’s totally fair

[fierce marlin]

Yes, thats the only issues you have to deal with
You don't need to get food or anything like that, just hide and let someone protect you in 90% of cases.
A ceratosaurus grows in about 2 hours, a triceratops being as strong as one in two hours is unfair

[elfin night]

and this is not even true because you get to like 700kg in an hour in normal conditions. There's a small spike past 10% or I just really started ramping up with my diet

[viscid mica]

??????

[fierce marlin]

Migration will be such a good mechanic

[viscid mica]

How is that unfair

It’s matching every weight class weight by hour grow

[fierce marlin]

How many time does cera takes to grow

[elfin night]

ceras, dilos, omnis and even troos are still problematic broski

a 1.5-2t trike is such a free kill unless it is cracked or always sticks to places where it can easily hide

[vale brook]

2hr10min iirc? for cerato at 100% growth rate\

[viscid mica]

Much*

Roughly 2hours

[fierce marlin]

And How much does it weight

[elfin night]

and it's less in practice cuz carnivore scavenger

[viscid mica]

2T ain’t that much health you can easily chunk through that as almost the entire carni roaster

[viscid mica]

2 tons

Same weight class as cera just abit more weight

[elfin night]

and also you dont have full slide nor the same damage as dibble

a teno can cook a 2t trike easily

[viscid mica]

Trueeeeee

[viscid mica]

Tbh the top tenos can cook dibbles 1-1 lol

[elfin night]

and trikes are more free than dibbles of their same size

growth isn't something linear dude

[viscid mica]

In the same time it takes dibble to FG your smaller, weaker, slower AND can’t drift tech

[elfin night]

cera gains over half of its weight at 40%

[fierce marlin]

The point of the triceratops is that after several hours it becomes very strong, if it is already strong and as strong as the creature that takes the same amount of the stage it is in, this will become unfair

[elfin night]

trike needs a full hour for that same mark and still 25-27 kph

[viscid mica]

Not deino gaining 50% of its weight in the last 30% of its life

[elfin night]

yeah

[fierce marlin]

Like, in two hours my ceratosaurus weighs 1500, but the triceratops weighs 2000 and after a while it will reach 10,000.

[fierce marlin]

He has to be weaker at the beginning and stronger at the end.

[viscid mica]

That makes no sense, it’s matching the weight and power gain of each respect weight class. Meaning for a solid part of its life it’s more than free 99 for each specific weight class

And mind you most things grow faster to FG so they can catch them hands

Dude a solo omni could smoke a trike with no drift

That’s under 3 tons

[elfin night]

but you see. Just like a carno is not completely helpless hunting as a subadult, younger stages should still be viable. If a 2 hour trike couldn't stand any chance against a 2 hour cera, it would be extremely unfun, one sided and unfair because a trike of that size is noisier, slower and wouldn't be able to fight so that it is "fair". Apexes NEED viable young stages more than anyone else because being useless for over 9 hours is not fun for anyone

[fierce marlin]

A fg cera matchs a trike of the same time of gameplay
It shouldnt be 50/50 at all because the trike still growing more and more

[viscid mica]

For its final stats that is weaker at the beginning

[elfin night]

and trike is FAR less likely to make it to fg

also much harder elder

[viscid mica]

It’s a hyper defensive herbivore, it’s MORE THAN FAIR especially with a heavily limited kit at that level

[fierce marlin]

Its suposed to take skill, Hide from the Ceratosaurus, don't let him see you
It's unfair that you have a much more powerful second mode and are as strong as the base stage.
You're putting fun over balancing, it's not going to be fun handling a trike knowing it's stronger

[elfin night]

Consider that I reached 2 tons WITH A 150% diet on average because every plant is on your diet in HT. Trike is gonna be hell and much longer to grow than that when migrations are the only way to get food with diet besides sanctuaries and some patrols every now and then

[viscid mica]

Can you 1v1 a 70% dibble as cera

[elfin night]

cera on a constant 150% hits fg in like one hour and a half I think

[fierce marlin]

You are a god X Machina, and honestly, I don't see that difficulty anymore since you can rival a creature of your size in the younger stages.

[viscid mica]

Easily

[viscid mica]

Ya and they can easily rival you?

[vale brook]

cera is such a nice grow

[fierce marlin]

But you can defeat them

[viscid mica]

But you can

I’m bouta hit bro with it AVA

[fierce marlin]

Cera's strenght is capped
Trike isnt

[viscid mica]

Yes and?

[elfin night]

you cannot at all. 3 ton dibble rolls 3 ton trike. And so would a stego to a 6 ton trike honestly, it stands a good chance and that's crazy because stego has an abysmal matchup against ceratopsians.

Just you wait for migrations to work properly and being forced to move away from hiding spots as a juvenile trike, competing with other trikes and other adult herbivores that want you dead so you don't eat up the migration when you grow

[viscid mica]

Ones a apex ones honestly not even a mid sized it’s more high end small than anything

[fierce marlin]

Just to remind you something, how long does a Diablo fg (around 3 shades) take to grow compared to a triceratops?

[elfin night]

and cera wont lose 8 hours of progress when ambushed by a rex as a fresh adult lol

[elfin night]

like a third

[viscid mica]

2 hours to FG ish on a great diet

[elfin night]

less than a third

[viscid mica]

Aka by the time that trike is 2T you should be FG minimum

[elfin night]

I've grown dibbles in a little over 2h, trike on 150-180% boost is like 10h

[fierce marlin]

Trike to 3 tons

Not fg

[viscid mica]

You’ll have your full kit as dibble far before a trike does if you start same time same spot

Imma let Ava answer the exact math on trike 3T as I haven’t gotten to test most recent update

[elfin night]

both with the same diet? okay

dibble on 100% is 3h 30m

trike on 100% diet is likely around 4 hours at least

[viscid mica]

Sounds reasonable

[elfin night]

absolutely

[viscid mica]

Thou it’s far easier to maintain a higher diet on dibble sense your stomach empties faster

[elfin night]

because a competent dibble would roll a trike of that size

only advantages trike has are potentially damage, stamina and bleed

[fierce marlin]

Should be Slightly more still
Around 4:30

[viscid mica]

I mean dibble can threaten even 5T trikes with side hits

[fierce marlin]

I Also forgot that cera isnt a fighter exactly

[viscid mica]

Why

[fierce marlin]

Lets wait 4 cera

[viscid mica]

I mean any actual mid tier carni like allo or Alberto will completely demolish a trike under 4T

[fierce marlin]

Because once dibble hits 3 tons It gets capped
Once trike hits 3 tons it will still growing up to 9

[fierce marlin]

The cap, the stages

[elfin night]

I said at least. Because according to my estimates. I should be hitting 3 tons at around 27-30% growth and the total time of a 100% diet is around 13-15 hours from what I calculated

So a third of that growth is at the very least 4 hours and 20 minutes, and a maximum of 5 hours

that is insanely long

[viscid mica]

^^^^

[elfin night]

5 hours to be half the size of a stego is BRUTAL

[viscid mica]

You basically reach mid tier size a hour or 2 later than every other mid tier

Like I doubt allo grow will be more than 2-3 hours

And allo is meant for punching way up

And that’s roughly the same weight too

[fierce marlin]

I Also think stego deserves a growth Nerf anyways, It was Said that It works different by a developer tought
Idk how, but i dont changed my mind

[elfin night]

trike growth rn feels more linear (although I haven't completed it but absolutely looks that way after 20% growth being equitative) and with that length it is gonna be a huge ordeal

So trike better perform properly as a fg and be basically untouchable for anything but apexes

I want a stego "nerf" too, increasing its growth and that of deino to slightly bridge that gap

[viscid mica]

Stego isn’t a apex per say weight wise it’s only large

[elfin night]

something like needing one hour or one hour and a half more

[viscid mica]

I mean large groups of smaller stuff will always be a threat

Like you can only do so much against 10 omnis XD

[elfin night]

of course, but regardless trike and rex for that matter should absolutely pose a threat and not fall easily at all

[viscid mica]

Oh 100%

[elfin night]

if they're gonna need 10-12 hours of growth with good diet management

[fierce marlin]

Even anky is taken as a Apex

[viscid mica]

Like if what your saying about trike change is true and it’s growth is more linear than it’s totally balanced for a apex

[fierce marlin]

Can we make allosaurus anax?

[viscid mica]

We are talking by game standards not 1-1 irl yes irl stego is a apex but in game it’s 6 tons and your not really a apex by weight class at least till 8

[viscid mica]

It’s gonna be the middle one I think so somewhere between 2-3T

[viscid mica]

To add to this stego does have apex punching power so combat wise it’s 100% apex worthy

[fierce marlin]

3.5

[elfin night]

I have no reason to lie. Just showing you the numbers I could remember or write down

I spawn in highlands, run to west rail as my diet decays to like 30-40% I believe and I get there in like 15-20 minutes, I start griding the diet and scaling it up to like 130%, in one hour I am about 700-800kg. I keep scaling the diet until I hit consistently above 170% and I logout approximately over two hours later at 1929kg

[viscid mica]

The most popular number that people wanna see is 2.8 allo

[elfin night]

if anything I am concerned about trike not being strong enough

for taking over twice as long as a steg

[viscid mica]

I mean we’ll have to see as we need proper mid and large tiers to get a good feel for it

[glossy elbow]

haven't a few devs called stego an apex?

[viscid mica]

So we need allo and either Sucho or acro carni side

[elfin night]

to be fair trike rolls everything in the game now

[viscid mica]

1-1 yes

[elfin night]

but still, I wanna see it performing vs rex

[fierce marlin]

So giga and spino wont be a apex??

[viscid mica]

Like I said by combat capacity it is but not by weight

[viscid mica]

Giga is gonna be well over 8ts and if what we’ve seen spino might be dam well over 10

[elfin night]

reasonable

[fierce marlin]

In 10 Hours your trike Will be like this and the Diablo will still a 3 tons dino

[viscid mica]

Don’t use IRL values

[fierce marlin]

Not using

[viscid mica]

Ya knocking over stuff that big is mad cringe

[fierce marlin]

Just dont think giga Will be 8 tons

[viscid mica]

Why!?

Giga will probably be almost 9 almost as big as Rex weight wise?

[fierce marlin]

It seens to be fast but skinny

[fierce marlin]

Hell nah

[viscid mica]

Ye but that don’t mean he small lmao he a big and long boy

[elfin night]

spino is likely 11-13(?)t considering our rex is 9t. THE tank of the carnivores

[fierce marlin]

I doubt its more than 7

[viscid mica]

I doubt it’s under 8

That would mean deino is bigger than it and I can’t see that happening

He’ll acro will be like 7 tons

[elfin night]

I need to see a trike knocking a giga

[viscid mica]

And giga is way bigger than acro

[elfin night]

it would be so funny

[viscid mica]

Certain you could probably knock them down before they hit FG

[elfin night]

Acro is gonna be 6-7t yeah

So I'm betting giga will be around 8 if not a little more

[elfin night]

you can knock things your weight bruv

[viscid mica]

IMO if they want it lighter than Rex like 8.8

[fierce marlin]

Its not

[viscid mica]

[fierce marlin]

Acro is fat

[viscid mica]

HUH

[elfin night]

it really is

[elfin night]

or at least stunning which would be hilarious regardless

[viscid mica]

Google legacy giga and legacy acro giga is taller and just as thic only difference is bro is lanky and doesn’t stand up straight

The models are different but not that different

[elfin night]

acro may be fat, but it is one dimension out of three

[viscid mica]

Fair I mean if trike and Rex are getting sparring I wouldn’t be suprised if all apex’s can spar (except deino cuz the ambush apex can burn)

[elfin night]

and also 8t ACRO would be cringe

[viscid mica]

Insanely

[elfin night]

I really wanna see that sparring

[viscid mica]

Me too

[fierce marlin]

No, legacy acro Was bugged, without the bug it was similar still
And this acro is chunky

[viscid mica]

This HT will take atleast another 3 weeks

[viscid mica]

Giga is def bigger

Bro THEY BOTH ATTACK A CAMA AND THE GIGA IS AT ITS NECK ACRO HAS TO STAND ALL THE WAY UP

[elfin night]

Acro is big and potentially an apex

still giga is significantly larger and has more reason to be competing with rex

[elfin night]

more than that

[viscid mica]

Minimum wise

Probably another month or so

Though I think we’ll see allo very shortly after

[viscid mica]

I think acro will be like stego and be large weight apex combat potential

[elfin night]

I think the same

[viscid mica]

I appreciate that no one questioned me having both concept arts just casually on standby

[elfin night]

lol

I mean they aren't entirely accurate, just an ability and niche representation

But I can argue with logic why acro doesn't need to be the same size as giga

[worthy steeple]

i doubt it will be, i don’t see acro as an apex

more like semi-apex, almost apex type of dino

like stego, it’s not quite there

[glossy elbow]

stuff like this is why tiers can't be an in game thing since tiers differ so much person to person so theres always gonna be people who agree or disagree.

[worthy steeple]

yeah, i mostly agree, but apex is still an apex

tho when i say mid tier or apex i usually think about the current roster, not the whole planned one

like for me the teno is mid tier, dibble is apex but its obviously only for now, we don’t have an actual complete roster

[viscid mica]

It’s why I go by weights

[viscid mica]

@topaz elm I mean they are still faster thou…? I dunno maybe? Maybe not?

[topaz elm]

they are faster after 23%

before that they are slower than an adult deino

[viscid mica]

[topaz elm]

its also a little bs that if a diablo and a trike are the same %, before diablo gets its speed later in life
a young trike will be faster and weigh almost 2 tons more

a 22% trike is what 2.1 tons and a 22% diablo is 700kg
but the diablo moves much slower

[trail kestrel]

are there any changes comin for pteranodon?

[elfin night]

yes

lemme bring the caption and some proof holup

[trail kestrel]

Thanks alot, I got tilted on my current session with pteranodon. I think the stamina buff you get from food didnt kick in so i couldnt do anything fun but sit hide and chill

[elfin night]

sorry, screenshot* Ptera has an incoming rework that will fundamentally change how it plays out, and even it was said that flight is being changed. They are basically redoing the whole thing even though there's some leaks about early progress with it https://youtu.be/NZ6u9wngids?si=CcIg7HPIolXJ-Uhd https://youtu.be/90Xa6UOMOEQ?si=kT6eqpYMRCBxzaIM

[elfin night]

problem with ptera really is that you need to take off for every movement even though stamina efficiency with the flight is just fine. This will be solved in HT by giving wind currents to increase height without any stamina costs, and also better ground movement so not always you will be forced to take off to not spend too long walking to some place

but we don't know much about the details. Just know ptera will be VERY different after this rework

[trail kestrel]

Nice interested all I really wanted to play as was an aerial camera drone with like minimum interaction just towatch everyone punching on haha. Couldn't even manage that 😢 Is hordetest available to try whenever? or only like certain periods

[elfin night]

hordetest is always available when the devs enable it. It is to put it simply an anticipated testing branch of the game, that you select just like you selected evrima and has a few officials available, and they are all removed after the testing is over and things are added to evrima public branch. Pteranodon and Tyrannosaurus are not enabled yet but rex will be soon replacing trike temporarily, and ptera for sure is getting the rework this hordetest

no estimated time of arrival, things will be released when they are ready, but this is 100% coming rather soon

same goes potentially to hypsilophodon climbing as some devs have said

but I'm guessing rex and trike are the top priorities rn

[trail kestrel]

Very good thank you very much ❤️

[elfin night]

np

[carmine tundra]

@dusky surge tell me why you disagree

[dusky surge]

because individually readjusting the already existing math for each attack is exceptionally tedious and difficult to balance

[carmine tundra]

1 sure its probably tedious but its still possible nonetheless 2nd its not that hard to balance

[dusky surge]

also idk why stego should do no damage lol

[carmine tundra]

because it already does an insane amount of damage with its power swing, plus it would realistically miss the dinosaur if it hit its tail

[dusky surge]

its hitting tho lol

[carmine tundra]

compare the spikes to somethings tail like an omni, you cant tell me realistically that would hit

[dusky surge]

like realistically, if you hit the tail you hit the tail

[carmine tundra]

so you think that stego, a 6 ton slow animal should swing its tail over a raptors tail and boom its just instantly dead is crazy, maybe if it was the torso thatd be more believeable but it isnt

[elfin night]

funny thing is

if you get hit up to a certain section of the tail, you can technically survive a power swing

[mint star]

me :3

[elfin night]

you too yeah

[dusky surge]

the tip of it, yes

[elfin night]

so it would be rather tedious to further amplify this just to get the same result again

because it would look like it hit you in the tail again at times but the stego saw it differently

[carmine tundra]

thats actually the case for people complaining about carnos hitbox, although i think that they are completely right about it, i just think that carno should do 0 damage in general if you hit the tail because it just doesnt make any sense

maybe the main base of the tail that leads right into the torso but i just dont see the rest counting

[dusky surge]

you still HIT the dinosaur tho, so it should do damage

[elfin night]

^ dunno why carno's special ability should not be following the laws of the game

if it hits you in the non base section of the tail it can't cc you, so it is already losing something for bad accuracy or a dodge from its target

[carmine tundra]

i suggested that carno should do more damage when you ram the torso, i personally think it should be more rewarding for actually hitting your target that seems believeable and plus something 1300 kgs running at you 49kmh would hurt like hell irl if you were the same weight, whatever carnos body shot damage i think it was 125 i feel like it should do more

[elfin night]

so there would be less of a reason to bite then

[carmine tundra]

i personally dont think you should be biting unless you knocked it over or stunned

biting is just the cherry on top for landing a stun or knockdown

[elfin night]

I sure love when a playable gets vestigial organs of an old age where they actually mattered

[glossy elbow]

its still a video game why should it matter whether or not its believable or realistic? if you get hit you get hit as simple as that

[elfin night]

turning your bite attack into a glorified ceratopsian thrash is so

If anything charging should do less damage

just a pure cc or health chipping move

[carmine tundra]

i was told the isle was suppose to be a "realistic" hardcore dino survival game maybe i was told wrong but if so then that proves my main point wrong

[dusky surge]

its not realistic is your first mistake

[glossy elbow]

oh it doesn't really try to be too realistic no.

[carmine tundra]

aside from stats, dino sizes and bugs tell me what isnt realistic

mutations also dont count

[dusky surge]

dilo venom, troodon existing, herrera climbing, hypsi tropical spitter climber, beipi penguin, carno charge, pachy ram, omniraptor existing

[carmine tundra]

those dont count either, that was just made by the developers to make every single dinosaur unique, im talking about actual quality because its possible that they were engineered in the game lore to have these abilities

[glossy elbow]

it tries to be immersive not realistic if that makes sense?

[dusky surge]

so besides the many, many things that you admit make the game unrealistic, it's not unrealistic? lmao

literally saying "that doesn't count" to a ton of things that make the game unrealistic is hilarious

[mint star]

the term is accurate-to-life

[dusky surge]

immersive, ye

[mint star]

much like monster hunter, in that its not realistic, but the monsters move "accurately to life"

[dusky surge]

its immersive, not realistic

[mint star]

youre immersive

[dusky surge]

if it were realistic it'd be a lot more boring

[carmine tundra]

you could argue that it is realistic, they probably dont have a spec of their real life dna in them and like i said they were engineered to have these special abilities, stego being 6 tons instead of 4 carno being 1300 kgs etc

[dusky surge]

4 ton stego is less realistic what lol

[dusky surge]

yea google first result aint doing it for me lol

[golden coral]

Meanwhile, could be up to 8T according to other estimates, or so I've been told at least

[dusky surge]

ive seen documents that state it capable of reaching 8 tons

[elfin night]

that's not very scientific

[golden coral]

Also funny that our first stego model was surprisingly accurate xD

[carmine tundra]

if i see these "documents" that come from actual legit scientists that studied and explain how it reached up to 8 tons ill admit im wrong then

[golden coral]

Anyway, game isn't really realistic, it's immersive. And it seems a bit strange that you argue that a hit shouldn't count as an actual hit, despite being a hit. If you just want lower damage or some such, sure, that could be argued for, but you can't go "it hit, but it didn't hit".

[carmine tundra]

although i dont know you and you dont know me so you dont have to prove anything

[glossy elbow]

are we missing a lot of stego's fossils or something? the weight estimates im finding are quite random and all over the place

[carmine tundra]

i feel like stego was like humans when it came to weight, they couldve either been 4 tons at full grown or 8 like the other guy said

[golden coral]

If you want tail hits to do less damage, shouldn't that apply to all playables for that matter? And apply to their mechanics as well, maybe?

[carmine tundra]

it would depend on their attack abilities

[golden coral]

Such as? And why would it depend on that?

[carmine tundra]

ceras charged bite makes more sense on dealing damage to the dinosaur if it hits their tail compared to something like carnos charge

im gonna be fr i dont even know why im arguing, not in a thousand years the developer team takes any of the balancing feedback into consideration like nerfing ceras charged bite or adding dilo to carnos diet despite how requested both of those are

[golden coral]

Seems a bit arbitrary to me. But alright. And you're wrong, they do take feedback into consideration, but it tends to have to align with what they're trying to do. Popularity of a suggestion does not mean it fits the vision.

[fierce marlin]

Its way to realistic still

[cosmic pelican]

#balance-feedback message No.1 way to make troodon instantly less unique and just even more of a "worse omni"

[worthy steeple]

yeah lol

[crimson crater]

ah yes, the daily omni buff suggestions

[cosmic pelican]

https://tenor.com/view/spongebob-patrick-star-mmm-cheesy-cheese-cheesy-gif-19257011

[neon willow]

I hate to admit it, but I actually can see the thought process with that specific example. Cera (or any Dino's bite really) makes sense to do at least some minimal damage to the tail because the teeth are piercing/slicing/grinding (depending on morphology) the flesh of the tail. Whereas if you look at something with a flexible tail like teno, if a carno hit the tail tip with its ram, the tail might just be pushed out of the way entirely and minimal damage is done. Whereas dinos with stiffer tails (omni for example) would probably get spun around due to torque on their tail which can't flex out of the way of the blow

[elfin night]

I like HT troodon

been trying it for some time and honestly I think the diet changes made it so that it doesn't really matter that you are that slow at the start

and even then you gain speed so quickly

all you need is finding some taco (not necessarily killing, one bite and it will drop food for you), a crab or a frog and congrats, you are now going to be a subadult for sure

[vale brook]

the issue is the food it's holding is bugged

got tricked by so many unedible frogs and rabbits in HT this morning

[elfin night]

sometimes yeah

I noticed that

[vale brook]

i smelled so much S and thought i was blessed

no, it was a curse

[elfin night]

with 6 corpses lying on the floor that couldn't be eaten

but on paper troodon is goated now even with that

one bite to a taco and boom, a whole rabbit for you

[vale brook]

yah i agree

i still want omnivore troodon though grrr

[elfin night]

same

I've also been trying to grow that one trike and man

I am on a 250% diet

like when I logged

so I'm guessing apexes are getting laughably long growth times to encourage people to use and optimize their diets so it takes around 8-9 for a trike instead of thoe +12 on a 100% boost

will prolly be the same with rex

[untold coyote]

What to the "fixed knockdown durations" actually mean? Did they lengthen or shorten them for the listed dinos?

[steep gazelle]

Dibble, trike and stego have a much shorter time to get up now and probably fixed the infinite Stun that could be done as well

[untold coyote]

That sparks joy

[dusky surge]

#balance-feedback message

lol

[lilac leaf]

The only thing I don't like about that stego tail suggestion is if it's the same both ways around. If stego cannot deal damage to a dinosaur's tail and must hit the body, that will make things like omni exceptionally strong against it , it could arguably make stego an easier target for anything agile than teno or even pachy... while I agree the damage should be reduced So that adult stego is not immortal like it is now, I don't think it should be nullified entirely

[dusky surge]

i dont see why though. it seems like an awfully unfair change to give that downside only to stego on the virtue of it being stego

[uncut jewel]

@dusky surge @carmine tundra I saw your Steggo weight conversation I have this values. Many pages says they was between 5- 7 Tonns.

so 6 tonns ar good how it is in game

[lilac leaf]

Because Omni could just deliberately run through its tail constantly to bite with no repercussions lol

[dusky surge]

no, as in, why have it that stego does even LESS damage to a tail than it already does?

everything already does reduced damage to a tail

[elfin night]

@proper berry Mfw the brawler herbivore 300kg heavier than my cera can put up a fight

If teno should

Eat grass and die

[worthy steeple]

i cried reading that

i wonder what carnivores teno is hunting, the only dino in the game that is almost purely defensive

[hasty coyote]

bad cera players who dont know how to juke as they always run in a straight line at their prey and have never been the hunted. So they just get tail ridden and bit to death or tank kicks to the face.

[worthy steeple]

😭😭😭😭

[iron tree]

Cera can literally just stop and alt bite

[worthy steeple]

and get kicked to the face right after

[crimson crater]

that guy has been consistently posting awful takes lmao

[iron tree]

depends

[worthy steeple]

it doesn’t, never do that as cera you will get kicked

[iron tree]

wdym

if a teno is chasing a cera it can quick-stop and alt bite at the same time if they know the tech

[worthy steeple]

and get kicked to the head imminently after

i’ve done that million times, ceras think that’s a good strat, but it never actually works

[iron tree]

It does work for me

but I tend to take the fight to the water

if I am being jumped by a teno herd

[glacial apex]

https://tenor.com/view/spongebob-patrick-patrick-star-mmm-cheesy-cheese-gif-19257097

[cosmic pelican]

Its spreading 🙏

[crimson crater]

https://tenor.com/view/spongebob-patrick-patrick-star-mmm-cheesy-cheese-gif-19257097

[void wind]

not sure what youre talking about, but if you are playing teno purely defensive you are not nearly using teno to its full potential

a good teno dictates the fight and is the most oppressive opponent

People love to cry about Cera being overpowered, but teno is the jack of all trades equivalent of cera on the herbivore side. It excells in too many areas.

[worthy steeple]

BRO

[worthy steeple]

yes, teno cannot be offensive, it’s only offensive attack is 35 damage bite

the rest of the attacks are defensive

[void wind]

Teno has a kick that can be performed while running and dragged, it has a massive hitbox (about doubled in one of the recent updates) and it costs 2% stam so it can be spammed without thought until it hits.

The alt claws come out super fast and the bite speed is a lot faster than raptor at over half the damage.

The only purely defensive move is the tailslam.

Teno used to be skillfull and defensive, absolutely. On spiro.

[worthy steeple]

good, now use alt attack or kick offensively

if carnivore doesnt want to fight you it wont

[void wind]

I am, kick has never failed me

[worthy steeple]

you can’t

[void wind]

You can force every cera to fight you

[worthy steeple]

if cera doesn’t want to get kicked it just runs

can’t do anything about it

[worthy steeple]

not at all

[void wind]

You can tailride bite a cera until its forced to fight back and then you can just kick it

Done it a million times, stopped playing like this when i realized how cringe it is.

You are faster than a cera and you outtrot it. If the teno wants the cera to fight it, it gets the cera to fight it

[worthy steeple]

i did it too, smart sera will run left and right, good luck killing it with that 35 damage tail hit that is like 1 damage

any smart cera runs to the bushes where i can’t track it or water where it can kill me

[void wind]

Smart teno can run left and right too, keep spamming bite since its free and when the cera makes only one mistake the kick hits. Its really that simple.
And no, tailbite damage is not 1 damage. And even if it is 1%, it will kill the cera or atleast stress it out. Teno is faster theres no way for the cera to get out of that if they both start on similar stam.

[worthy steeple]

it’s not 1% it’s like 0.1%

[void wind]

Bushes never stopped a teno and a river id not always there.

[void wind]

You are faster, you will hit the base of tail in no time and thats decent damage

[worthy steeple]

yeah nice, cera gets into the water and they you can’t do anything about it

[worthy steeple]

you do realize it’s 0.1%

simple left and right movement lets you easily get away from the teno

[void wind]

Then cera is in the water? If its a river you cross somewhere, if its a lake you wait it out.

Cera had to run a ton of its stam and flee into potential croc water

[void wind]

Nope. Not if the teno has half a brain

And base of tail is not 0.1% lmao

If the cera goes left and right you will hit the body more often than not aswell

Teno is one of the best dinosaurs in the game, offensive and defensive. Theres a reason why everyone and their mom mains it on pvp servers like norden.

[worthy steeple]

i tested this million times, if cera doesn’t want to fight it won’t, there’s million ways to not to.

find a bush, find any water source, start running when you see teno pack they can’t track you

teno is not offensive, it literally can’t be lol

[void wind]

This is factually so wrong that i wonder if you ever played teno 😂😂😂

But is fine

Imma go sleep cheesy, have a good one

[worthy steeple]

yeah sorry, i mostly play cera and deino

i should probably start playing teno

but i just don’t like herbivores in general

[lilac leaf]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCr-N5ubI7Q&t=910s here is an entire video of a consistantly non-defensive teno lol

granted Acronym is an extremely skilled teno player but still

[worthy steeple]

not a single time in that video teno was offensive

[hasty coyote]

from playing cera, heres my main strats if a teno gets on my tail:
first feign a turn: start charged bite, stop, turn like 45 degrees, and then just start sprinting again. If they fall for the bait, you now got some distance. If they didnt fall for the bait, then just bite them next time. Don't alt bite because that leaves you open.
second use bushes: if you run into a bush and the teno blindly follows, you can turn and bite them. If they realize what you are doing and keep distance, then you now have distance to use to escape or put the teno on the defensive. If they predict the turn and kick you, then next time keep running through the bush or do a feign.
third use water: if you know a river is safe (or have no other option) you can easily fight a teno in water.
fourth put the teno on the defensive: once you get distance or before the teno gets on your tail, you want to try and force the teno to play defensive, this gives you agency over the fight and is a solid advantage.

basically, don't be dumb and predictable, thats how you get hit by a rear oriented attack lol

[worthy steeple]

if it was give me a time code

[worthy steeple]

i’d say using water and bushes is probably the most effective strat, teno got more stam than cera so cera needs hide before it runs out of stam.

sometimes i kick ceras like 3-4 times and they just cross the river and camp the other side so i cant really cross or do anything. and then they just run and hide in a bush

and that’s super annoying xddd, because when they’re in the water there’s really nothing you can do about it

[hasty coyote]

also yeah teno can be offensive against stuff like stego since its slow, but against a cera (which is practically the same speed as teno) its impossible to hit the rear oriented or stationary attacks unless the cera tried to attack you. If a cera just holds shift+w, you arent landing a single kick on it unless its holding shift+w towards you. As you can see with those omnis, he never landed an attack unless the omnis got near him first.

[worthy steeple]

tbf yeah, teno can be offensive against slower things, that’s for sure, but we were talking about carnivores and all of them are faster or in case of cera basically same speed

i kicked some dibbles and stegos, but even then it’s not the easiest task since you’re fighting something that can either one shot you or kill you in 2 combos

[hasty coyote]

imo its a pretty fair fight, it really depends on who can outplay who. I have fought tenos who just died on the spot to my cera, I have fought tenos who absolutely destroy me. again, its just that many people who play cera lack the knowledge of how to get something off their tail because they never played something small enough to get hunted, so they just panic and die to tenos who know how to abuse that panic.

[hasty coyote]

yeah good luck trying to fight a competent diablo or stego, even with a group lol

[worthy steeple]

yeah that’s true, i can confirm that. some ceras are wild and some are just really bad, it’s honest 50/50 fight that depends mostly on skill

[kind plume]

#balance-feedback message
Why would you want diets off tho ?

[dusky surge]

hes playing extremely defensive in this video

moving away via trot to force them to use stam to keep up, waiting for them to make a move to punish them, trying to keep them at a range where they can land a quick attack

idk what you mean by "non-defensive", this is textbook skilled teno play. Patient, and using all of its tools to its advantager while not just mindlessly chasing around its predator

[dusky surge]

#balance-feedback message

how are 7 dibbles going around killing every carnivore, they're literally slower than every single carnivore besides the gator

genuinely i dont understand what is happening on these servers that carnivores are dying to megapacks of dibbles unless they go "nah i'd win" against 21 collective tons of ceratopsian rage

honestly what exactly can you even add to deal with 7 dibbles lmao. Even a rex would be just surrounded and beaten up the moment it tries to pin dibble number one

[viscid mica]

Real

[floral mauve]

The carnos in HT are overtuned with the stam combined with speed. Carnos are mostly fine where they are at. As they have the ability to engage or disengage anything as it is.

Dilo clones need work. Summons shouldn’t reset so quickly. They should have to engage more often. The clones should be able to reset after venom timer is up

[dusky surge]

I mean, carno still has a terrible turn radius and basically zero punch up potential. I think it being an endurance hunter as a plains critter makes fine sense

[worthy steeple]

#balance-feedback message 300 damage tail slam back hell yeah totally balanced…

[wanton edge]

if the kick would do 145, that's not unbalanced at all. it actually pushes the attacks to be used for only specific scenarios. + cooldowns play a factor as well

right now you literally have zero reason to use the tail slam lmfao

[worthy steeple]

yes, but for other reasons

[wanton edge]

being?

[worthy steeple]

short knockout, especially fighting omnis, low 100 damage and animation lock

[wanton edge]

yes, that's what i'm getting at. i'd prefer for the kick to retain its current everything but just do less damage. you could pretty much just wildcard go crazy spam rmb to a pack of raptors and finish w tailslam if the damage values are changed.

[worthy steeple]

i’d say kick should be main damage dealer, get buffed back to 275, significantly nerf bleed, change stam cost to 2.5%

significantly buff alt attacks bleed damage in return.

change tail slam damage back to 150, increase the knockdown duration

[wanton edge]

even then, there's still no reason to use tail slam and the knockdown duration is not the issue. because as said, you can just charge spin and kick and do just as good damage without subjecting yourself to a stun lock. a more fair compensation for the abyssmal dps and stun lock of tail slam is simply it doing insanely high damage.

[worthy steeple]

knockdown lets you do additional 2 kicks, not to mention range that tail slam gives

[wanton edge]

and obv the other side of the coin is the kick with visually less force being exerted whilst also being completely mobile during it is it doing way less damage

[wanton edge]

mm that's if you hit like mid range/close range which still its just more effective to charge and 180 once the target turns around to retaliate.

[elfin night]

@autumn wasp brug, rex is right around the corner, so is allo too

And even then, I find it a bit argumentatively flawed to use a large herd of dibbles as a justification because the same logic could be applied to a lone dibble running into group of 6 ceras

I agree that we need something in the carnivore roster but that way of saying it was just not it

LMAOOOOOOO

YOU READING THAT??

[dusky surge]

@iron wind carnotaurus on the horde test is one of the best balanced animals in the game, it doesn't matter if it can or can't hunt tenonto

it's extremely powerful at hunting small game, and extremely fun to use. try actually playing it on HT, it's a genuine blast

irl, dibble was 1.5 tons, and in-game, it's 3. Real weights really do not matter here, nor should they if the game is balanced better off fictionality. Also, if you want a "large land predator like allosaurus", there's always going to be allosaurus. Or albertosaurus if that more suits your fancy

also they're not "trying to male the game easier for tenonto", most of these changes were made because of cerato getting completely rocked by carno

you wanna blame anyone, blame cera

if you want an animal to be a "hunter on par with larger herbivores", don't pick the one animal that was designed to not be that

[elfin night]

#balance-feedback message @iron wind

1. Bashing other players in your suggestions is not acceptable

2. Golden rule of balance feedback: realism matters nothing. Carno being 2 tons irl is completely meaningless as an argument because we are talking about balancing in a game with creatures from so many different places and time periods, it forcibly needs to be fictionalized. Also, “like allosaurus”

3. Similarly to the second point, BALANCING. You waste extra stamina for the sake of game design and balancing as you are using an ability that very much gives you a free kill on many small animals or at the very least a free 300-400 damage on something

4. You don’t need 500 extra hp to hunt small game, you shouldn’t be trying to hunt tenos solo

Carno is not supposed to be taking on large herbivores

If you want to do that, play cera currently or rex/allo when they release

But carno is meant to be an absolute menace to anything dilo sized or below. And it really is especially in HT

[dusky surge]

playing carno as its intended is a literal blast on HT. shame people are too fixated on seeing the biggest thing in the room and slamming their skull into it, then getting upset when that doesn't work

you nuke juvis, obliterate smalls and contol open space like no other

[elfin night]

They think Disney carnotaurus was a real thing

And because it is a real thing, it MUST be put in the game

[dusky surge]

especially with everyone playing triceratops lmao, those juvis are just free food and organs

[elfin night]

Carno players are gonna be eating good with all the juvi rexes around

[dusky surge]

oh juvi rex is going to be terrified of carnos lol

[elfin night]

As it should be

[dusky surge]

even if it CAN go at 55km/hr, carno is STILL FASTER

the thing about being a small game hunter is everything is small at some point in their life, and you can totally capitalise on that

[elfin night]

Just make it like Dondi showed with 45% rex (on a 300% diet which is laughably optimistic that could maybe get close to 4 hours of growth) is 900kg

If you wanna play rex, you gotta master the small agile carnivore first

[dusky surge]

also carno has the rare but incredible ability to f around but then NOT have to find out

thanks to the speed and stam

[elfin night]

True

So free to play now

Only thing really holding me back from playing it a lot in HT is growing trike and also the random rubberbanding on HT servers

I can survive just fine but guh

[dusky surge]

yea. carno feels like freedom incarnate now tho. you just run fast, kill small things, and keep running

[elfin night]

I wanna give it a shot eventually

Although I already did

And potentially getting canni mutation

[void wind]

So you saying its a bigger galli now?

[elfin night]

If you want to put it that way

[dusky surge]

given that galli used to be the best small game hunter in the game, yea

honestly being a bigger carnivore galli is pretty damn good imma be real

like how raptor is just a bigger dryo with a pounce i guess

or trike is just a bigger dibble

[void wind]

And Allo is just gonna be bigger Omni

Yeah nah, thanks

[dusky surge]

yea as it turns out on a game with 55+ animals there might sometimes be an overlap

by that logic rugrops is just a smaller bigger galli which i find funny

[elfin night]

Slopsaurus 💔

And the worst part is seeing all these hyped fanboys

Hyped to pin others with no skill and enjoy their little soy bait slop

[void wind]

Current carno is basically rugops

And yeah, who thought that a roster of 55 dinosaurs would be a bad idea, hm

[dusky surge]

current carno is basically carno

[elfin night]

^

I like the current planned roster

[dusky surge]

also i dont know what exactly is wrong with our roster lmao

oh no some things sometimes overlap but they're so different in size/abilities that it doesn't really matter

[elfin night]

Exactly

[void wind]

A 2t+ dino demoted to a 1.3t small game hunter ^^
Thats not carno

[elfin night]

Brother

CARNO IRL WAS A SMALL GAME HUNTER

[slim dragon]

You do
It's carchar

[elfin night]

so even more of a reason to be one besides the size and speed

[slim dragon]

Name one accurate-to-life dino in this game

[elfin night]

Also that

[void wind]

Currently?

A bunch of herbivores that got no direct counter, and an overpowered scavenger thats the bedt hunter

With the final one?
A lot of non-unique dinosaurs other than looks

[slim dragon]

Guess trike somewhat does it, apart from the high mobility

[void wind]

No it wasnt?

[void wind]

No im just saying that carno fills rugops place now, theres no need for rugops

[dusky surge]

a 1.5- dino promoted to a 3 ton powerhouse
that's not dibble

a 2+ ton dino demoted to a 90kg penguin
that's not beipi

a 350kg animal demoted to a 175kg drop bear
that's not herrrera

a 900kg animal promoted to a 1300kg rot wagon
that's not cera

[elfin night]

Yes it was. Tell me what kind of big game hunter carnotaurus had with that flat face and a relatively weak bite force, as well as an evolutionary focus on mobility

And well, you need to know the very wrong implications of turning a 50kph carnivore into a creature capable of taking on larger herbivores

And you don’t even know what is rugops going to get exactly

[void wind]

Dibble shouldve never gone above 2t either, was 0 need for that

[slim dragon]

Rugops may at best be 1/3rd of carno's size

And also it most likely won't have the same niche

[dusky surge]

rugrops is almost 1 ton lighter tf are you on lol

besides, rugrops is planned to be agile and a capable swimmer, two things carno no very good at

[void wind]

It hunted sauropods, not the massive ones, but still no rats like the ingame one does

[elfin night]

Source?

And still, I wouldn’t like to entertain this discussion because yet again

Realism. Matters. Nothing.

If we wanted to make everything accurate so everyone’s favorite dinosaur is the cool badass unstoppable powerhouse, then only a dozen playables at best would be viable

[void wind]

And the 900kg dryo promoted to a 1600kg warhorse, thats not teno

Glad we are one the same page

[void wind]

No i agree, realism matters nothing

[dusky surge]

yea, we are. nothing is realistic, so we can live knowing that things will be the wrong weight and will do things because it is a game and not a documentary

thus, carno being fun and balanced > carno being big and realistic

[elfin night]

Well then, we should both acknowledge that it is fine for carnotaurus to lean into hunting small game especially with that speed

[void wind]

I can still be unhappy with the devs force pushing carno into a niche that it doesnt need by giving other animals mechanics that make no sense, no?

[dusky surge]

it was always meant to be in that niche

literally before it was released in U2, it was advertised as a small game hunter

[elfin night]

Carno was always meant to be there, so if anything you may have probably walked into the game without knowing what you are getting

[dusky surge]

and that niche is also the healthiest for the rest of the roster to have to deal with, because it is ALSO the fastest land animal in the game

[elfin night]

It was meant to hunt small game even in legacy 😭

Carno has never been a brawler or a good big game hunter

[void wind]

Ah yeah. I KNOW that it was supposed to be there. Yet, it should not be forced to only hunt small game by givung other animals mechanics they dont need ^^

[dusky surge]

its a very delicate balance for carno because it has all this speed

[elfin night]

^ and this, either you butcher carno’s speed demon identity to make it fit into that power fantasy or you keep it as the speedy unique small game hunter

[dusky surge]

tbf, those mechanics were added BECAUSE carno was too dominant and disrupting the ecosystem

[elfin night]

Such as?

[dusky surge]

it was carno that caused that

[void wind]

I have played over 3k hours since update 6, not once have i seen carnos dominate to a point where nothing could stop them

[dusky surge]

cera and teno's stun resist were added because they were getting steamroilled by carnos

[dusky surge]

did

did you actually PLAY during U6 because taht was probably the worst example of it

[void wind]

Tenos auto stunning of carnos by the tip of their tail after they performed an action.

I am all for tenos being able to stun carnos out of attack IF they actually land the counter.

[elfin night]

Maybe it’s confirmation bias

[dusky surge]

U6 was the 3 big boys

carno, pachy and deino. Everything else was fodder for those 3

[void wind]

Yeah, mained teno

Fun times, carno was a good fight but totally doable

Granted, i played on officials back then and the skill level is pretty low there

[dusky surge]

there is no WAY you had a good time as U6 teno. That was one of the worst periods for teno lmao

the big 3 destroyed teno in every way

[keen plover]

tbf teno was slightly better than carno in a 1 v 1. Carno took no skill though but if both were good it was teno sided.

[void wind]

What, because it was balanced?

Did not fight pachys so dont know, deinos were in the water and carnos were a fair fight

[dusky surge]

pachies turned teno into crushed mince, carnos could just ram back and forth, and sub deinos would roleplay oversized kapros and steal you from 50m inland lmao

[keen plover]

I still think it was unfair though. Teno had to do all this work to beat out carno but carno just had to press one button and flip it for free

[dusky surge]

yea

[void wind]

Now neither carno, cera or teno take skill

[dusky surge]

carno takes a lot more skill than it did tbh

i prefer versatility in my abilities over it doing one thing

[keen plover]

Honestly most dinos have been dumbed down imo. It's more about what you're playing than your skill

[void wind]

No it doesnt

Its hold rmb, drift, hold rmb again against small stuff

Against big stuff it does still, i agree

[void wind]

Agree

[iron wind]

Guys you misunderstood what I was trying to say at the beginning I didn't say that I wanted the carno to be just like the allo the carno being a small game hunter sounds good and gives the animal a personality but it's also annoying that it doesn't stand a chance against large herbivores In my opinion it doesn't even stand a chance against the cerato anymore what I was trying to say was that it can't even stun a teno with a full charge 1300 is so brutal for this animal that it looks funny when viewed from the outside At least if it was 1500 to 1600 tons it could be a more settled and versatile animal

[elfin night]

Thing is, carno should not be anywhere close to having a 50/50 matchup against a teno

It’s a basic rule of fight or flight balancing in this game. Because the one that is 20kph faster can just f around as much as it wants and never find out whereas the other is forced to take it

[fallen cradle]

You hunt small animals and juvies with a charge hitbox that is EXTREMELY forgiving. All you do now is spam rmb

[keen plover]

Maybe if this was legacy tbf. Teno has the ability to jump and swim. Also teno has always edged out carno since like update 3

[elfin night]

1. Small game hunter but it doesn’t stand a good chance against large herbivores…hmmmm

2. Do you think more health is going to do anything for carno to fight a dibble or stego more easily? Even teno will still win

[elfin night]

Jump and swim are not omnipresent options like running is

[void wind]

If you remove the arbitrary stun on teno carnos definitely have a fair chance

I mean the no-skill automatic one

[keen plover]

Yeah and the matchup was never 50/50 though. Teno has usually edged out carno

[dusky surge]

i think the "skillless" argument applies to cera and dilo for sure, there's literally nothing going on there, but there's a lot more versatility in other moves

troodon's pounce can be used for cheap movement and damage output, carno's charge can be used to engage/retreat/damage/traverse/immobilise, raptor can grapple/bleed/damage pounce, teno can still combo into moves, deino's lunge can be used for a speed burst or a grab/ambush, herrera's ability is movement + high damage potential and relies on a skillshot

it goes on. I prefer versatility, which is why I do hate dilo and cera's core abilities

there is no depth to cera or dilo they're nothing abilities

[iron wind]

No probably because these animals directly counter carno but it can give him a better chance against animals like teno and maia yes

[dusky surge]

like i genuinely despise the current state of dilo and cera because they have no versatility. They are glorified legacy playables

[elfin night]

Define better chance because two competent carnos can put up with a teno already

[keen plover]

Tenonto used to be challenging when it had something that could realistically hunt it as well. Now there's nothing to do but wait for a predator that will likely just autowin vs it

[void wind]

No argument from me here either, i miss ceras slide step

[dusky surge]

eh, i hated the slide

it's the same as why i hate pachy's stupid-ass self-stun

[void wind]

And when it had to actually care about stamina or aim its kicks

[dusky surge]

clunkiness doesn't make for good balance

[void wind]

It made cera think before using the chargebite, not make it its primary tool

[iron wind]

Bro if that teno realy know how to play the "teno" even 3-4 carno not have chance against him

[void wind]

It was a good way to balance it

[dusky surge]

it's still on the same vein as pachy self-stun, which i think is just garbage, and as much as i hate cera, i dont like the idea of it getting a similar pachy-esque treatment, because it already sucks on pachy

i'd prefer cera be slowed while charging bite, but gain a stun resist akin to tenonto's tailslam

[iron wind]

1300 ton is realy brutal carno look like big rooster right now

[dusky surge]

less icky

[elfin night]

Carnos are incompetent then 😭 😭

[dusky surge]

and yet on the HT it's extremely powerful

[keen plover]

Eh. 2-3 is the limit for a really good teno

[elfin night]

And yeah, you don’t realize how extremely good carno is at hunting small game in HT

If you want to hunt tenos and dibbles just play something else

[keen plover]

It's really good in the most unfun way though I'm going to be honest.

Carno charge will never be fair. I'm pretty much convinced at this point

[fallen cradle]

THIS. Being anything small gets you absolutely steamrolled by the charges with nothing you can do about it.

[keen plover]

active hitbox while holding down a button. Speed is a recipe for latency rolling you as well. So many clips from people being sniped from the tail

[dusky surge]

but that's ALWAYS been an issue with carno, irregardless of weight

[keen plover]

That's because the mechanic sucks on such a fast animal

[dusky surge]

you're right, but that's a carno problem

honestly i'd prefer a headswing that has confirmed knockdowns on smaller things (no runup needed), but you actually need to time it

make charge a pseudo-stance

[keen plover]

Timing is 100% needed. It just isn't fair without it

[dusky surge]

make it operate almost identical to maia biped shove tbh and we're golden

[keen plover]

Pretty much. You may as well just alt f4 if you're in a field with a carno. Even if they're bad, they can keep going over and over again. That latency will eventually kill you

[keen plover]

✅

[dusky surge]

it would also solve the annoying runup issue

you can knock down faster but it relies on actual timing

[keen plover]

How would that interact with cera and teno though

[dusky surge]

i mean, i'd give it the same weight ranges

that it has now

[keen plover]

so stagger them?

I mean if it's timed I think it's fair enough but should probs cost something

[dusky surge]

carno can't stagger teno can it?

[keen plover]

It can.

It staggers/knocks all animals from the same range

[iron wind]

No it cant what

[keen plover]

Carno can stagger teno wym

[dusky surge]

im inclined to believe the QA member

i didnt know it could stagger teno

[keen plover]

Stagger = stun. Not knockdown

[iron wind]

I thought it couldn't do this after the weight nerf

[void wind]

It can stagger everything up to 1950kg and maia up to 1625kg

[dusky surge]

wait why is maia an exception lol

[void wind]

Supposedly some stun resistance, shows it in the artwork too

Or simply bc its the first dino added since the rework, but who knows

[iron wind]

I still support Carno being at least 1500 ton .d

[dusky surge]

given the current state of HT carno, that would absolutely push it over the edge and force it to get nerfed a bunch lol

[iron wind]

I think this would make him at least equal to mid-heavy herbivores becuse when Allo comes it will probably be in a position where can easily hunt all heavy herbivores (not trike maybe) Carno used to have really fun and equal pvps I want Carno to be in a position where he can at least fight with those animals not just hunt them like allosaurus or albertosaurus

[void wind]

I just want arbitrary crutches to go so i can atleast have a fair fight with stuff outside my range.

If the teno deserves to live it has all the means to work for it, it doesnt need auto invulnerability.

[iron wind]

✅

[dusky surge]

but the game isn't just about hunting herbivores

this would screw over cera HARD

aka the entire reason carno got 1300kg in the first place

they'd have to nerf carno AGAIN to compensate for that matchup

[void wind]

Tbh, if cera was the reason carno got nerfed this hard thats a horrible reason

Cera had a higher pack limit and needed something to keep it in check

With a body cera was doing well enough against carnos

[iron wind]

Once you reach full grown you have no other option but to find a large animal and pvp yes it is fun to hunt animals like galli or pachy like cheetahs hunting antelopes (that's what I meant by hunting) for food but it would be more fun to be able to challenge a herbivore of equal size when you are full grown

As a result these players are fighting for PVP not to eat each other like the Cerato vs Carno PVPs i dont say large herbis would be food source for carno again

[dusky surge]

the higher pack limit shouldn't really determine anything. the issue is cera is MEANT to be able to consistently defend from carnos, that's what they want from that animal, and it's not particularly fun to be at the whim of something you can't really contest all too well because of how fast it is

[void wind]

It should not, yet it is a balance factor.

And while carnos were maybe a bit too strong against cera, just the biteforce being nerfed would have fixed the cera problem.

Cera could defend really well with a body and thats where cera should be able to defend itself

[dusky surge]

honestly i'd rather carno just have an equal group size to cera imma be real

[iron wind]

As a cerato main carno is still so annoying to deal with that headbutt but i can still defend myself at the past

And it is a survival game not everything would be equal to deal with

[dusky surge]

sure, but nothing should feel unfair to deal with

[void wind]

It does have on petits, 4 carnos absolutely obliterate any small game pack.

Should have honestly reduced cera instead

[dusky surge]

eh, cera is fine in 4 imho

[iron wind]

He is right you can just defend yourself aginst carno by going into the forest

Carno is 1300 ton but it is still turning like food truck

[void wind]

The forest is absolutely not a safe place from carno

[void wind]

Cera literally only has to know when to release the charge and then you can counter even the long charges

[iron wind]

İt is not right now yes but then trees make charge useless

[elfin night]

Long charge with stun to a cera cancels the charged bite

[void wind]

Nope, if you release the chargebite before the carno hits you will hit the carno. Ceras bite box works like that, extends forward.
You will get stunned but the trade favors the cera.

[iron wind]

Fighting Carnotaurus in the open area is still stupid in my opinion .d

[elfin night]

Mfw the carno just presses a or d before hitting

[void wind]

Cera can do the same and is more agile..

Imagine, combat where you have to react to what the opponent is doing

[elfin night]

Except that it doesn’t know where you’re gonna tilt in the last second

[void wind]

If you tilt last second its too late, cera will hit

[elfin night]

Git gud

[iron wind]

Nah it is wild .D

[elfin night]

Either way what is a carno doing against a cera

[void wind]

?

Im speaking from the pov of the cera lmfao

Carno is a good cera killer too, especially in a pack

Its not really a one sided fight

[elfin night]

Well

[iron wind]

Not realy now i can whoop carno ass with cerato carno is not able to facetank damage right now and headbutt vs charge bite trades always end it up for cerato

[elfin night]

Good thing

[void wind]

Now, most ceras cannot counter your head on charges because they dont know when to release or they will run around panicky giving you free charges to their behinds

Obviously, like most outcomes of a fight, its a skill difference

[iron wind]

Carno not able to stun in short range is a + for cerato too

[iron wind]

This is why carno needs buff too dude .d

1300 ton for carno is joke

[elfin night]

No????

Carno shouldn’t be trading with a cera bro

[void wind]

Carno is doing fine in the cera matchup honestly

[elfin night]

If you don’t want to hunt small game why are you playing carno

[iron wind]

Yeah but carno can able to fight aginst heavy animals too right

[dusky surge]

carno does not need a buff. It is the most balanced it has been on HT

[iron wind]

Carno is weakest right now for me in (heavy tier)

[dusky surge]

i mean... i guess? i have no idea what (heavy tier) even means in your context

[iron wind]

Cera is scavenger but still good at fight with big animals

[iron wind]

1000-2000 ton maybe

[elfin night]

And cera is fighting things if shouldn’t be fighting

[viscid mica]

@autumn wasp have you tried walking in the other direction?

[elfin night]

So we don’t need to make carno an overtuned carnivore just so we can have 2

[iron wind]

İ can matchup with teno easily with cerato

[elfin night]

Duh

Yup, duh

[dusky surge]

grass is green, sky is blue, cerato is overpowered

[viscid mica]

@steep gazelle that’s not the size of omni hitbox that’s the fact it can hit your tail

I swear you copy pasted that suggestion from someone else

[dusky surge]

unsurprising

[iron wind]

Nah bro it is "balanced"

[elfin night]

Because cera is punching in a way it is not intended to do even though it should stand a chance vs teno because it is about the same speed

[viscid mica]

@wanton edge teno is by far the most balanced Dino in the game so far leave it alone

[iron wind]

Yeah it is

But carno is fkd

[dusky surge]

carno is fine lmao

genuinely PLAY IT on Horde Test

it is a completely fine animal

[viscid mica]

@iron wind maybe we wait and see for when bigger things come but personally carno is great on HT feels amazing

[slim dragon]

Carno was never meant to be 1v1ing tenos

[iron wind]

Why tho

[viscid mica]

By the devs design yes it’s possible if the teno is inept

[dusky surge]

because they're not even supposed to be sharing an environment lol

[viscid mica]

Cuz they want carno to be a bully to all things smaller than it

[iron wind]

Yeah i dont say opposite

[dusky surge]

one's a water-loving brawler that is capable of defending all of its flanks, and the other is a water-hating endurance hunter that suffers poor agility and succeeds at punching down below its own weight

[elfin night]

Carno is fine. Cease this apex carno copium already

[viscid mica]

Vomit is over powered*

[iron wind]

İ just say carno able to defend itself like cerato

[elfin night]

NO?????

💀 💀 💀

[viscid mica]

Yes it can it’s called SPEED

[dusky surge]

ehhh

honestly i dont think vomit is its strongest tool

[viscid mica]

running is a form of self defence

[elfin night]

Bruh

[dusky surge]

carno is BETTER at defending itself than cera

[viscid mica]

Getting stun locked for atleast 2 free hits pretty strong if you ask me

[dusky surge]

"oh no, an army of 5 maias"

cera: gets stomped to death and dies
carno: turns around and sprints. it lives

carno genuinely can defend itself better than cera

[viscid mica]

Tbh if you get good with carno you can always win a 1v1 with cera

[iron wind]

Why bro you want to hunt little mf after being a full grown theropod

[iron wind]

İ dont think so

[viscid mica]

I don’t think I’ve lost a 1v1 to cera as carno in ages

[viscid mica]

I do it all the time

[dusky surge]

because that is the specific animal i chose that does that and i could pick literally any other fully grown therapod if i didnt want to

[viscid mica]

Hell I’ve won 2v1s

Drift tech and cycle charging go brrrrrrrr

[dusky surge]

i pick carno because i want to hunt little mfs. i'd pick something else if i didn't want to do that

[viscid mica]

I pick carno when the dilo and omni population acting up

[elfin night]

Dude, do you also realize the implications of allowing carno to fight off a teno? What would a teno do vs two carnos then? Or a cera stumbling into a carno or trying to bully it off a corpse??

[dusky surge]

its simple

die

ACTUALLY, fun fact about that, concept art depicts tenonto fighting off 2 carnos pretty well, which is really funny to me

[viscid mica]

Tbh skilled carnos are scary

I’ve seen carnos better than me who openly 1v1 half decent tenos

[iron wind]

What would 2 carno do aginst 20 teno then bro i dont see solo teno even after 300 hours

[viscid mica]

Teno is a brawler so I don’t think teno should be losing if you know what you doing

[elfin night]

Laughable exaggeration that outrageously fails at undermining the question I posed to you

[rapid flume]

they could run away

[elfin night]

It is perfectly doable for a competent player

[viscid mica]

To be fair name 1 Dino that isn’t getting jumped by 20 tenos and dying if they don’t run

[viscid mica]

If the teno is good it’s a whole other story but ya he done it before too bad tenos are light work

[dusky surge]

run. lmao

my fave part about that question is the 2 carnos actually do have an option

if the roles were reversed, it'd be worse for the 2 tenos vs 20 carnos

[viscid mica]

Like what is anything doing against 20 tenos chat

I don’t even think a Rex is surviving that

That’s ALOT of DPS

[iron wind]

No bro you say what single teno see 2 carno yeah maybe it will die or just go and stand near a water or hide in forest idk

[viscid mica]

Bro I’ve seen 4 man tenos merc 3 man dibble groups (I was a teno hehehe)

Teno is all about the smoke

[iron wind]

Teno is not weak even before the carno nerf it can still defend itself in every way possible

[elfin night]

And it sucks that those escape options are situational

[viscid mica]

Tbh unless your a really good teno most tenos do that anyway?

[iron wind]

Yeah running is sucks too

[viscid mica]

2 carnos can easily smoke a solo teno that isn’t skilled

[dusky surge]

this has nothing to do with carno also not being weak

hell, i wouldn't even call it a carno nerf

everyone focuses on "oh muh weight" but carno got a higher top speed, better stamina efficiency, and now faster grow time, better bleed rate and even MORE stamina efficiency

[iron wind]

Now idk 3 kick from face is kill a single carno it is not balanced

[dusky surge]

how is that not balanced

[iron wind]

Becuse it stunlock

[dusky surge]

you're fast enough to not put yourself in a position where you get kicked 3 consecutive times in the face

[viscid mica]

Ngl HT carno goes hard

[iron wind]

No becuse it stunlocks

[viscid mica]

Don’t get hit

[viscid mica]

It can’t stun lock you that was fixed ages ago

You get stunned once for afew hits but you’ll be fine hurt but alive

[elfin night]

If you give carno better fighting then you’re creating a powerhouse that can roll a significant chunk of the roster who cannot escape either

“Carno should fight off tenos”

So then what would happen to tenos, ceras, magy, sub allos, some sub rexes, bary, sub theris, kentro and the like below the 2 ton mark?

[iron wind]

Tail still stunlock bro teno is simple you see 3 carno ok go to water direct your ass on your back and just stay still when stunlock you can easly kill a carno with head kicks and you have 2000 health so you can did this soo long time

[viscid mica]

You think carno can fight sub Rex

Sub Rex is like 3-5 ton range

[elfin night]

I think it shouldn’t. I was exposing the ridicule of this #balance-feedback-discussion message

[viscid mica]

Yea but atleast be fair to the guy

He is clearly new

[elfin night]

I am

[viscid mica]

It takes time to be good the game is hard bruh

[elfin night]

And I am also explaining and taking my time to show why carno shouldn’t be a brawler

[viscid mica]

SUB THERIS

naaaaaaaa bros trippin

[iron wind]

İ have 133 hours in the game bro i think im not new in this game anymore .d

[elfin night]

You are

133 is rookie numbers in the isle

[viscid mica]

It’s why you shouldn’t go after teno if your not confident you can win and evade its tail, play to your strengths carno has the power to pick its fights it’s faster than EVERYTHING

[elfin night]

+300-400 is kinda experienced

[viscid mica]

Your new compared to a lot of us lol

400+ is where I’d say your not new

[elfin night]

I have over 1k hours

[viscid mica]

1k is experienced

Beyond that I can’t say as I’m just under 3k hours

[elfin night]

Would say 2k and above is good veteran

[viscid mica]

I plead the 5th

[elfin night]

Will 100% grow a trike

[iron wind]

İn the past you can i still can kill a experinced teno with cerato but dying a teno with carno is not skill isues right now

[viscid mica]

All my grows are white so like…

[dusky surge]

oh hell yea im above 2k i win

[viscid mica]

Mmm I’d disagree a experienced teno “should” never lose to a cera

[elfin night]

Yep

[iron wind]

No it can headshot charge bite is still so overpowerd

[elfin night]

Nerf cera then

Don’t buff carno

That would be so defunct to do. That whole thought process is

[iron wind]

İ play more like pvp servers like norden the teno players in that server is like always have 1k hours

[elfin night]

Carno is where it should be!

[viscid mica]

If your a skilled teno and time your slams and kicks well you’ll completely roll a cera

[iron wind]

You cant survive if you dont know to play it bro teno is most skill based dino in game

[viscid mica]

To be completely fair thou I hella know tenos id classify as. Top 1% who can take on entire groups of ceras without braking a sweat

Teno is scary

[iron wind]

Yeah it is

But it is skill isues

[viscid mica]

100%

Most tenos ain’t that good

[iron wind]

Same skilled teno vs cerato is 50/50 for me

[viscid mica]

I’m not that good with teno

I can do like 2 ceras at once max

[viscid mica]

We talking low end middle or high end of skill?

Low yes middle no high def no

[elfin night]

My record was 2 ceras at once but I did use my aqua build on a pond

[viscid mica]

You ain’t seen sweaty till you seen 4 pretty solid carnos lose to 1 teno

[elfin night]

Never seen that

[viscid mica]

It’s why I always feel out tenos to see if they are panic kickers or na

If they panic kick they free 99

If they don’t I don’t even try

[viscid mica]

I mean cheesy has also done it he has a clip

[elfin night]

My biggest achievement in this game though

Was soloing a fg dibble as herra

Nerf herra

[viscid mica]

I did the same but as troodon

You ain’t seen stam management until you seen me try and solo hunt as troodon

[viscid mica]

Glass cannon lookin

[cosmic pelican]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1156692106753101955/1284984625772494950/image-7.png?ex=67fecb30&is=67fd79b0&hm=155640675eb5dc6561439cbfc65a06613bdd49dd4478d74d8520d46f47a7bd9c& get on my level 🙏

[viscid mica]

Ya aight bro them being afk doesn’t count

Also bros barely 40%

[cosmic pelican]

Nah he was there lol and thats a fg

He got messed up by a stego and I 3rd partied

[viscid mica]

Ain’t no way

Troodon is not that big chief

[viscid mica]

LMAO

3rd partying supremacy this is why community servers suck

@elfin night 100%

Plus it makes apex’s a lot more respectable

And lets them make them strong as hell

[elfin night]

Absolutely

I think this game should be hard at least with some creatures

And things like rex or spino should be very rare powerhouses instead of things you see all the time

[viscid mica]

I’m a simple mid tier main so I’ll grave them once a blue moon

Eventually what was my monthly grow rotation will turn into prolly a bi annually as growing the full roaster every month would be agony

[viscid mica]

Ye it’s why I don’t mind deinos predicament as it’ll be fine once more water things exist

Although with current roaster deino is insanely boring

[elfin night]

Mhm, also makes the idea of deinos avoiding adult spinos a lot more warranted

[viscid mica]

I mean deino is a ambusher not a brawler spino will have a way better kit for the 1s that deino

Deino is the carno of apex’s XD

[elfin night]

Like, a spino player who has been around the water trying to avoid deinos that one tapped it for like 7 hours of its growth, just to eventually start gaining some real weight and you know that player absolutely EARNED to rule the river

Large apexes be a rare sight and indicative of skill and dedication

Same as a cama potentially mopping a giga or rex tbh

The guy totally deserves it for growing a damn sauropod for god knows how long

[viscid mica]

Cama grow time will prolly be nutty

Like def not a 1 session grow unless you don’t like sleep and live on caffeine

[elfin night]

And well, let’s now talk about elder apexes or strains

Actual brand of elite player

Someone who actually did master the gameplay loop

[viscid mica]

Alberto and that’s it

That’s a lie if I still like the game after that stuff drops every Dino will be graced despite my begrudging attitude

[dusky surge]

powercreep in action

buff carno to compete with cera, buff everything else to compete with carno

[elfin night]

(abysmal dogsh)

[viscid mica]

Why buff carno? When you could just elder it!!!!

Skill issue

Just make elder carno spiro carno XD 55km 1.8 T

[dusky surge]

idk what ur talking about tbh

[keen plover]

max paleo size elder carno would be peak

pretty much launch carno size. 2.1t~

[viscid mica]

Ah yes take me to ram ranch elder carno

[keen plover]

🥰 if elders are hard to reach and come by then I think it would be sick

[dusky surge]

i just hope elders are slower than adults tbh

let adults survive

[keen plover]

Agreed

[crimson crater]

i just know that elder omni is going to be atrocious and a balance nightmare

[dusky surge]

its amazing that pachy is the worst animal and it's gonna get it worse

pinned by elder raptor

[crimson crater]

yup

[slim dragon]

450kg Elder Omni should be fine

[crimson crater]

450.1kg

[dusky surge]

nerf regular omni hell yea

300 something kg with the ability to climb

[viscid mica]

If elder pachy ain’t got crazy ram ranch power imma be upset

[warm rose]

do you guys know how long trike takes to grow now?? (with 100 diets)

[slim dragon]

Perfection

[cosmic pelican]

~12 hours

If you mean 100% growth boost

[warm rose]

i mean like all your diets are 100%

so the growth boost would be 300 or smth

[cosmic pelican]

4 hours then, but thats not realistic

[warm rose]

cause i’ve been playing trike on 180% growth boost for 4 ish hours and im only 20% grown

[worthy steeple]

that’s peak tbh

[sacred moat]

@iron wind I think the nerf applied to Carnot is still valid. Yes, the fact that the weight values of carnotaurus were taken at the minimum boundary, and Ceratosaurus at the maximum relative to the real representations of them, is to some extent unfair, but let's not forget that the island is also a game. As far as I remember, there was no evidence that Carnotaurs hunted particularly large game comparable to them in size and weight, but rather swallowed the victims whole (there seemed to be evidence) And the developers made it pretty clear that the carnotaur's niche on the island is the role of a small-game hunter. Moreover, carnotaurus is currently quite successfully able to hunt Dilophosaurs, omniraptors, gallimimus and other, not particularly large, dinosaurs.

That's why I think we need to let go of the past and forget about Carnotaurus, who was an absolute God on the old map.

[viscid mica]

Ya it’s gonna take you anywhere between 8-12 hours (8 is like the best diet maxing possible so like 9-10 more reasonable)

[warm rose]

ohh okay thank you so much

[viscid mica]

Happy growing

[elfin night]

No

I did the new calculations. 16 hours on 100%

#isle-discussion message

[elfin night]

8 hours currently

On 300% boost

An easy way to remember things is that 300% boost grows in half the time of 100% boost

And then 100% is half of the normal

Good luck

I’ve been growing mine for like 6+ hours and I am at 60%

[warm rose]

i feel you 😭😭 i’ve been growing mine at 200% growth rate for like 4ish hours and im only 20% grown

16 hours is sooo long but makes sense since it’s an apex

[elfin night]

It’s good

I like it

Also trike has a super hard plateau

Where you literally don’t increase your weight from 50% to 60%

[knotty stratus]

gets one tapped by hacker 💀

[warm rose]

yeah it’s good cause you won’t be seeing a ton of them around, it’ll actually take TIME and EFFORT, you have to earn it.

[warm rose]

dude noooo that would suck so bad 😭

[elfin night]

Exactly

They need to be achievements, not meta picks

And as I did say, we need something that is actually difficult, some sort of optional challenge in this allegedly hard game

[warm rose]

yes i agree, you thought stego/deino was a challenge? wait till trike & rex

[knotty stratus]

this is isle thats how it is

[warm rose]

the only problem is hackers and idk the turn rate will probably be quite bad for these two and i feel like a good pack of ceras could take one down fairly easily

[elfin night]

Yup, I am only thinking about what will happen to steg then

Wondering if it will be capable of fending off a Rex with those growths or if it will get an increase too

[warm rose]

i have a feeling stego will get buffed to at least have a chance against rex, i could be wrong, they’re already really op tho. It’s also good to note that these 3 will only be playable in unofficial servers so

[elfin night]

Hope so

Wouldn’t mind 100% diet stego taking 8-9 hours tbh

Instead of 5, and accounting for some slight buff

[dusky surge]

buff it and give it that growth rate and we good

although i think it does already grow at 8 hours?

[elfin night]

Nope

5 hours is more accurate with 100% boost

[warm rose]

yep i agree

[elfin night]

You really gotta mess up to take 8 as stego

[warm rose]

i needs to take longer to grow

[elfin night]

Currently stego is around 5 and deino closer to 6

[cosmic pelican]

Even better loll

[worthy steeple]

that’s WILD

but it’s 4 hours on 300% diet right… tho i think it’s close to impossible to get that diet as the trike

[elfin night]

Double untrue

[worthy steeple]

is my math wrong

i’m not math guy

[elfin night]

300% diet boost cuts that 16 hour growth at 100% in 2, meaning that it is 8 hours

And as someone who is playing trike currently, by using the migrations and patrols right you can consistently remain above 250% diet, it’s not like stego at all, it actually rewards you a lot when you optimize your diets

[worthy steeple]

hmm sounds good

[elfin night]

So not only it is 4 hours but it is also very much possible to get close to that diet

And I am assuming this diet reward will be similar for all apexes

[worthy steeple]

so i was right about 4 hours

[warm rose]

how do you use it “right” cause i can never get that good of a growth rate

[worthy steeple]

i usually get 250+ as herbivore pretty easily

[warm rose]

i could never get higher than 180 growth rate

[worthy steeple]

just find a patrol zone next to the salt lick, overeat, then puke, heal the sickness with the salt lick and eat more plants

it works even better if you actually found some mushrooms in the sanctuary and you got good diet already

or if you were nested in

[warm rose]

ohhhh well ofc it’s easy if you do the puking method

i thought there was a diff way

[worthy steeple]

yeah why not, do it

[worthy steeple]

there is, gastroliths, it’s 5x hunger drain

[cosmic pelican]

Gastroliths + puking = infinite diet

[worthy steeple]

yeahh

[worthy steeple]

i was about to yell at you when i saw you typing, i just naturally expect mmm cheesy gif

i’m little traumatized

[warm rose]

ohh okok thank you

[worthy steeple]

first it was you and now i see this gif from like a lot of people

[cosmic pelican]

Youre just asking for it atp 😭

[cosmic pelican]

Im so cool everybody just wants to be like me

[worthy steeple]

https://tenor.com/view/stare-cat-cat-stare-fast-gif-9103868621036733672

[uncut jewel]

xD

wtf

[rapid flume]

@autumn wasp enhanced digestion is an unlockable mutation that rewards you for maintaining a good/perfect diet, I don't see you should be able to unlock it earlier, considering how easy it is to get with the new diet system

[elfin night]

You can get above 250% pretty easily by using good patrols and migrations with gastroliths nearby. Once every minute, you consume gastroliths to boost your food drain and thus be able to take more nutrients

[elfin night]

No, I got that wrong. It isn’t, it isn’t!!

For that you would need way more diet slots than three

[worthy steeple]

wait i’m confused

if 100% is 16 hours, 200% should be 8 hours and 300 % should be just 4

am i silly cat

[elfin night]

Okay

With the current diet system (where you have three diet slots that can fill up individually to 100%), your maximum diet boost is 300%, and in order to grow a trike in 4 hours you would need a lot more diet types to have a higher boost

Your base growth would be 1, 100% diet allows you to grow in 1/2 of that time, 200% 1/3 and 300% 1/4

1/4 is half of 1/2, just like how 8 is half of 16

[slim dragon]

I think your explanation makes it even more confusing

[elfin night]

Bruh

Basic math 😭

[slim dragon]

Base growth time is 0% diet bonus
100% bonus means 100% faster growth compared to base, so base growth time is 2x the time of a 100%bonus

[worthy steeple]

alright yeah i did my math too (chat gpt) yeah you’re right, crazy how silly i can be sometimes

[elfin night]

It’s okay cheesers

[worthy steeple]

cheesers🤩

[worthy steeple]

so 300% boost should in fact be 4x so 32/4 will be 8 omg im genius

my micro cat brain evolved to slightly less silly

[elfin night]

Correct

[crimson crater]

#balance-feedback message

https://tenor.com/view/bait-thats-bait-tom-hardy-mad-max-gif-5055384

[elfin night]

Real