general-feedback-discussion

[icy lion]

when you said grab i was imagining like, picking something up haha

[manic flint]

Lol yea for Utah maybe

But like a pin would be great

Allo sized and down
Sucho is actually quite a bit larger than Allo huh

Allo will be even more screwed than in legacy against it

[lyric pilot]

Why the dislikes on my merc suggestion, what would y’all like to see?

[paper oriole]

Isle of dragons 9500

Your merc suggeation seems 50/50 on like to dislike ratio, personally i think completing a set of missions and then ‘getting off the island’ would be a nice merc alternative to the elder system

Assuming said missions are challenging and will take time, akin to elders

[odd sedge]

I know I'm late and the topic is already over but how on earth would Hypsi climb?

Herrera has claws, I can imagine Those climbing. But Hypsi has little mittens

[weak dune]

Goats have hooves but they can climb better than most clawed animals lol

It would be a different type of climb than Hererra is all

I don't exactly expect Hypsi to be climbing like a squirrel even if it kinda looks like one lol

[valid zephyr]

Hypsi has already been mentioned to be climbing by the devs.

[paper oriole]

Doesnt seem too bad, his arms and hands look extra pathetic because theyre fuzzy

It wouldnt look awful climbing if they do it right

[weak dune]

Plus it looks like there's some minor creative liberty the devs took on the Hypsi model making the claws look more rounded than the skeleton of the actual thing

Which is fine

Not like we know what it looked like outside its skeletal structure anyway

[lone kite]

as for stego and deino being unbalanced currently i see your point but bolth dinos are 5 hours or longer to grow so the real trick should be get them when there young atm there like elephants

[fathom idol]

Remember dryogang that most Deinos can grow at pond were they are safe, or are still in groups larger then their limit. Stegos only have to go for water, if their bush is empty they will graze.. yes 5 hours is long but easy to do if youre growing at the dam were no normal soul is going nowadays 😫

[gusty remnant]

Does anyone have the link for the roadmap?

[weak dune]

https://trello.com/b/G5tsb4XI/public-roadmap

[gusty remnant]

Thank you

[steep warren]

@haughty citrus Why do u think my suggestion is not good?

id like to know

cuse i dont really see a reason this shouldnt be added

@haughty citrus ?

[haughty citrus]

I think that such a structure breaks the general aesthetic that the devs are currently having regarding human structures.

[steep warren]

how we already have broken down buildings

[haughty citrus]

looks too post-apocalyptic and not modern

only partly broken and quite futuristic for our time

[steep warren]

Its called the only image i can find

im baseing it off of that image

Just because i put that photo there dosent mean i want THAT photo right there in game

[haughty citrus]

So without the intention of offending, I recommend you, to give a better example in your argument, to investigate a little more.

[steep warren]

How would you put it

[steep warren]

If you were writing it how would you explain it?

id like to know so i can change mine

[haughty citrus]

yeah give me a minute, im searching examples on artstationg and pixiv

[steep warren]

k

[steep warren]

U think thats the photo i should put?

[haughty citrus]

i think and is only my opinion

it looks more like the aesthetics of the game

[steep warren]

il put a link to it at the bottem

[haughty citrus]

your photo is cool for mad max concept art, number 9, metro, mistborn etc

It is difficult to find appropriate conceptual art for an aesthetic as specific as it happens in the isle

I hope I've been helpful

[steep warren]

thx for ur feedback

[tight lantern]

@severe aurora Cannibalism will not be a diet thing for "bastard cannibal Utahs" when diets roll out. At the moment, there is not much of anything a smaller Utah can feasibly hunt/locate often other than other Utah players. At the moment it's just something that needs to be dealt with by keeping your head on a swivel and not trusting many. Wallow is your friend. So is crouch instead of resting, as resting makes sound and gives your location away when hiding. Thank you for coming to my Ted Talk. It's a hard knock life for a Utah and I feel your pain.

[real kraken]

The game is laggy, Connection and FPS, is this a bug or something as it was never a problem 5 months ago when I last played (Evrima btw) (Also I know that this is feedback discussion)

[clever urchin]

@still estuary Currently servers are region locked. In order to play on servers outside your region there's a trick you can do. You have to check the "Hide empty" or "Hide full" servers, maybe even try both

[clever urchin]

A lot of people, even on high end rigs are experiencing FPS issues. I'm planning on hopping back on Evrima after Update 4 releases and then I'll be able to see how bad the FPS dropped

[real kraken]

Ah ok, yeah because when I used to play I could run 200fps no problem without any drops or the pc overheating struggling to keep up

[clever urchin]

I'm running a Ryzen 5 5600X and RTX 3070

Was able to run Max settings at around 80+ fps

Well, pre update

[wraith verge]

@clever urchin see you in 2 months than

[clever urchin]

Yep WHEEZE

[still estuary]

That's bud. Will try that

[still raptor]

@limber hull since HP and Weight are directly correlated, I think having Cerato be at 1,300kgs/HP would be more beneficial to creatures like Magy and the rest of the roadmap roster.

Especially since you want it to be a brawler

As for biteforce, since Carno is 200N atm, I wouldn't go as far as 300. Maybe 180 or 190N biteforce would be more appropriate given the size of the creature and what it can and can't do. Grow time given it's nature should be on par with Teno at 1.75 Hours IMO

But other than that, your speed and what you want for Cera look great.

[sonic cloud]

Sounds like your Cerato would just be Carno’s punching bag

1300hp with 190 bite? lmao, that thing’s getting bullied

[paper oriole]

Why make dryo even worse by giving galli its ability?

Galli should be fast as fuck, dryo deserves the insane agility much more

[still raptor]

Sounds like you want Cerato to be Ceratorex.

Cerato's niche is bullying small tier creatures.

And 50/50 Magy ofc

[manic sun]

id say 60/40 it since it´s main survival strat is not being tasty to most of the carnis

[paper oriole]

If cerato is slower than carno with less attack and lower hp he sounds kinda trash

Tasting bad is also an awful survival strat it will not deter kfs

[still raptor]

Well Magy is fucked for viability anyways

[paper oriole]

Magy should honestly just get deleted lmao

[still raptor]

Yea

Well you could also make Carno's agility fucked where it's like Utah. Has to rely on it's special kit for survivability. That being its charge.

[barren zephyr]

To something be viable it either needs to fight or escape danger. Look at Magy and tell me if it is capable of one from the two 😂

[paper oriole]

I think sea cucumber magy may be our only option for its viability, truly a pity

[still raptor]

People are so against Carno using it's charge lol. Yea, sounds totally fun for other players if I chompa chompa with a ridiculous alt bite speed and great agility.

Make it into an actual carno

But anyways I digress.

[paper oriole]

If its bite is still better than cera's youre encouraging it to bite instead of make use of its charge

It should be able to get the upper hand on cera with charge but its bite should be lower than something indended to be more of a defensive and a bully

[still raptor]

Then maybe 210N?

Or 220

[paper oriole]

Could work yeah

If a carno walks up to it like a moron and tries biting it to death in an exchange it should lose

[icy lion]

whats carnos current bite?

200?

[still raptor]

yes

It's fine

But Carno as a whole is just

[paper oriole]

Cerato should also stack on fracture faster than carno

[still raptor]

Carno's Alt bite speed needs to be nerfed

Way to fast.

Way to fast.

[lavish quail]

Wdym

Barely useful

[still raptor]

What

[lavish quail]

I use it for sharp turnstile

[still raptor]

Have you played the new patch?

[paper oriole]

Have you seen the vid its literally flailing around biting like its rabid lmao

[lavish quail]

Utah’s made of paper

[still raptor]

Well as it should

[lavish quail]

You don’t even need ult bite

Just 1 shot 5 at once with ram

[barren zephyr]

I think Pre-current Patch Carno alt bite was really slow, however right now it's really fast. How about just put it back where it was and give it extra damage? Extra damage for a change of speed.

[paper oriole]

The only issue with utah now is the shortage of small game for solo raptors

[still raptor]

So I think you're confusing Speed to damage

[lavish quail]

Sad really

[lavish quail]

And the paper health

[still raptor]

so?

[paper oriole]

It should be kinda paper

[still raptor]

It compensates for it's insane bleed

[lavish quail]

[pulsar lake]

Utah isn't Chonk

[paper oriole]

It should avoid hits and use coordination in a hunt rather than dogpiling

[pulsar lake]

We don't have this

[lavish quail]

It can only kill dregs lmao

Stefan

Stegs

[barren zephyr]

Stefan

[lavish quail]

Idk

[paper oriole]

Poor Stefan he will he missed

[lavish quail]

POV Utah

[barren zephyr]

Povtah

[paper oriole]

Yes utah is rat

[still raptor]

This is ridiculous for its size. I don't want it as slow as before, but meet the middle ground.

[lavish quail]

Just to clarify that’s a rat I caught in a box

[paper oriole]

Prisoner

That carno is me when there is a mosquito in my room

[lavish quail]

When are you standing still as carno tho

[paper oriole]

When you are being attacked by a utah pack, perhaps

[still raptor]

doesn't matter, it's still very quick and oppressive.

[lavish quail]

I mean just run and 1 shot em

[still raptor]

Charge a teno, knock it down. Alt bite 4 times to the head. Dead.

[paper oriole]

You can if they are buffoons

Deino gave his old alt bite to carno as a gift

[lavish quail]

Tail slam a carno tail slam head 2 times boom dead

Tbf all fights are fast in evrima

Except skilled Utah fights

[lyric pilot]

I’m gonna alter my merc suggestion and repost it see what it is the community dislikes

I’m gonna alter my merc suggestion and repost it see what it is the community dislikes

[still raptor]

still working on mine

[paper oriole]

I thought the merc idea was pretty good

[still raptor]

link it?

[paper oriole]

#general-feedback message

Completing a set of tasks and then getting off the island

Could be sort of like dino elder system

If the mercs complete their tour they can gain perks, skins and new missions perhaps

[lyric pilot]

Yea right I would love it that’s why I made the suggestion lol I made a better one now I think

[paper oriole]

As a poor example it could be something like

Rank 1 mission set:
Retrieve x foliage samples
Repair x facilities
Locate x nesting sites (low tier)
Examine x sets of tracks/leavings

Rank 2 mission set:
Retrieve x water sample
Retrieve x foliage sample
Repair x facilities
Extract x eggs (low tier)
Tag 1 x (low tier species)

Rank 3 mission:
Extract x dna sample
Extract x eggs
Locate x nesting sites
Tag x (multiple species)
Repair x facilities

Each tier scoots more in to pvp territory with a greater selection of perks and collectable skins/trophy cosmetics for each tier completion. Offers replay value for mercs

[odd sedge]

I think the swim speeds are fine tbh

The rivers are just not wide enough if anything

Sure, Hypsi Is still a speed demon in water but it drowns simply by jumping in

[paper oriole]

If we got another lazy river like in legacy v3 itd be great

[odd sedge]

Exactly

Those things will be deino safe spots though.
Well. As safe as a cannibal croc can be

[urban flax]

Also assuming spino won't be able to swim

[odd sedge]

True true, although our spoon looks like it would sink like a rock

[urban flax]

If hippos can swim, then it can swim

[odd sedge]

Hippos don't swim though

[vale pawn]

[odd sedge]

They walk in the river floor

[urban flax]

Where the hell did you get that from ? They are excellent swimmers

[vale pawn]

they kindof just bounce themselves off the floor

[urban flax]

No, no, hippos can actually swim very well
I guess it's less tiring to stay on the river bed but hippos are good swimmers

[vale pawn]

i forgor 💀

[odd sedge]

That's what I was told all my life as well

[manic flint]

Well
They sink
So they run on the bottom
But they can swim

[odd sedge]

Still, our spino looks a little too terrestrial to me

[paper oriole]

i wish we got tap spino it looks like it can swim

[odd sedge]

I'll accept it if it swims because I know it's supposed to but just... looks off

[manic sun]

yea they should make it as scientifical accurate as possible

not like a JP3 ripoff

[paper oriole]

scientifically accurate spino would get rekt on the isle but tap's spino was a cedent inbetween

[odd sedge]

I don't even care about it being accurate

I want it to be realistic

[paper oriole]

sadness

despair

[odd sedge]

Now that thing looks like a swimmer

[bronze vault]

Yeah just look at the croc tail

[paper oriole]

it looks badass and actually like a spino

he's still got mean claws for defending himself and wouldnt look stupid as fuck escaping into the water

our spino looks about as good at swimming as a giga

[bronze vault]

Maybe if spino adult was more like a boat and couldn’t dive

[odd sedge]

[paper oriole]

sadness

[manic sun]

it probably did tho

[odd sedge]

Yeh spino is gonna sink

Like a rock

[paper oriole]

basically just baryonix rex

[manic sun]

if it had to dive to get some fish

but it mainly lived in the swamps of egypt sooooo

[paper oriole]

looks too slow to fish unless its catching like a sun fish or some shit lmao

[odd sedge]

Sounds like an unholy hybrid from Jurassic world

[manic sun]

they are sick tho ngl

[paper oriole]

our spino could probably catch a beached dolphin

[bronze vault]

Spoon probably fished in shallow water like a heron

[manic sun]

yea

[odd sedge]

This spino ain't a spoon.
It's a spork

[bronze vault]

So maybe make a shallow marshes area?

[manic sun]

also shouldn´t that thing also have a high biteforce? Since it´s related to crocs?

[odd sedge]

[paper oriole]

all dinos are distantly related to crocs arent they, dont think spino is any closer than an allosaurus or something

[bronze vault]

Spino should have a pretty high bite force, but now too high, enough to distinguish it from other apexes as a fisher

[regal elm]

In reference to the cerato overview, i think the grapple ability is more suited to rex bc of its jaw structure

[odd sedge]

Not directly

[bronze vault]

Rex is already getting a pin down attack

[manic sun]

yea and make it´s second attack like a claw swipe which deals lotta bleed maybe

[bronze vault]

That’d be interesting

[hoary dawn]

i swear

[manic sun]

i just want to see spino using its claws i malded at legacy spino not being able to use its claws

[bronze vault]

Also that spino will apparently be able to destroy deinos so it’s gotta have a pretty high bite force to be a incredible threat

[odd sedge]

Not biteforce, but claw swipe

[bronze vault]

Then claw swipe will be pretty op

[regal elm]

I dont think spino should have a high bite force compared to land predators because its jaw structure isnt made to withstand powerful force. It should definitely have considerably more than say, sucho, because it has a much more robust jaw than twigmouthosaurus, but nothing rivaling apexes

[odd sedge]

Low damage bite
High damage claw swipe

[bronze vault]

Maybe claw slap could make low tiers go flying kind like pce spino

[regal elm]

Oh rad, wouldve liked to see it grab and shake small prey tho

[manic sun]

not completely useless bite tho it´s legit a 2 legged crocodile with a funny sail

[regal elm]

Nah it has a fish eating mouth

[bronze vault]

It’ll be kinda like that scene from Jurassic park where the T. rex pins down the galli

[manic sun]

but yea good idea overall

[manic sun]

u can say the same for deino I believe

[paper oriole]

actual spino has conical teeth for cripping right, it could have a drag/grapple using its teeth and hands, usable on things up to deino size if it gets their neck or tail maybe

[manic sun]

that´d be sick

[paper oriole]

so it doesnt really need a high bite force, just to deal claw damage while grappled

[odd sedge]

The only problem I'm seeing now is... Sucho could very well end up being a small spork if both of them have low bite, high claw damage and a wader playstyle

[manic sun]

kinda like the rex pin but more flexible

[bronze vault]

Spoon grabbing deino by the tail and pulling it onto land would be sick

[manic sun]

u could make such good memes out of this i swear

[paper oriole]

would be cool to see a spino dragging a deino by its neck while raking it sort of like a jaguar (even though our spino looks stupid as fuck)

[regal elm]

Sucho should have a chance at a jaw fracture if it tries to bite big things since it isnt built for that

[bronze vault]

“Your coming to Brazil”

[manic sun]

lmao

[bronze vault]

Hmmmm that’d be interesting but kinda broken

[regal elm]

Not really, deino jaws are built with the intent of taking on land prey whereas spino is a dedicated fish/small prey eater

[paper oriole]

the jaws of spinosaurids like bary and spino could just be more vulnerable to fracture than other dinos rather than them damaging themselves

[manic sun]

yea but still it should be able to defend itself with the bite but kill with claws

[regal elm]

Realistically it would be bullied by every other apex but devs'll wanna make it badass

[odd sedge]

I could see dinos like bary or Sucho ambushing and then holding down smaller prey with their hands while they bite them

[bronze vault]

What if spino claws also had a fracture chance on mid to low tiers? Bc I mean just look at those hands you do NOT wanna be hit by them

[manic sun]

not really, i mean it was the biggest carnivore had some sharp claws and a decent bite and it didnt even really had to hunt stuff it just preyed on fish or stuff which dared to attack it

[paper oriole]

they hould totally be able to just shove people over with a broadside push and go crazy on them yeah

[bronze vault]

Maybe also making low- low mid tiers and humans go flying

[manic sun]

why should it´ve been the biggest carnivore if it didnt had to kill other apexes or defend itself against them at least

[bronze vault]

That’s actually a pretty good idea

[odd sedge]

Make Sucho bully other creatures

[paper oriole]

broadside knockdowns would work for a lot of dinos really, spinosaurids, cerato, hadrosaurs

[bronze vault]

Sucho should be pseudo apex

[odd sedge]

Para shoulder check

[regal elm]

Everything about irl spino was not built to engage land predators; likely relied on intimidation and being able to swim away to survive

[paper oriole]

para shoulder check, shant head shove, that type of stuff yeah

[manic sun]

sure but who would most likely win in a fight, carcharadontosaurus or spino?

[honest sparrow]

Probably carchar

[odd sedge]

Again, I am a big fan of the
Para shoulder check + trample damage × herd combo.
Makes a stampede of paras actually threatening

[manic sun]

it was as big as an allo

and spino is bigger than any carni and has claws which are as dangerous as a theri ones

[paper oriole]

para should be a cc king, hadrosaurs should be top tier tramplers in general as well

[honest sparrow]

Na man I’m giving this one to carchar

Like spino claws are dangerous, but given they were relatively short and not really in the best position to be slapboxing anything really

[odd sedge]

Hadros in general need some love

Imagine you could make creatures go slightly deaf for a couple of seconds after you broadcast close to them as a para

[paper oriole]

maia was a beast in legacy, but i hope para doesn't end up in the same condition that he was in when he comes to evrima

[manic sun]

still man these things were sharp and caras teeth were designed to rip out chunks of meat and not cutting it

[paper oriole]

i think i made a feedback for a para horn daze a while back too

[regal elm]

Carchar without a doubt

[odd sedge]

Para should give creatures tinnitus

So they don't mess with 'em

[honest sparrow]

And spinos were designed to hold fish in place

[paper oriole]

1. Parasaurolophus horn. Para's booming 3 call dazes other animals in its direct area, this will blur their vision and reduce their turn radius for a few seconds, giving the para time to flee. To make it so this is not spammed, it can only trigger the mechanic once every 30-60 seconds.

was a while back

[manic sun]

and for what were it´s teeth used then?

[odd sedge]

Oh I love this

[honest sparrow]

Idk, maybe tearing up what it ate, which was primarily aquatic life that was smaller than it

[paper oriole]

i think there should just be a diminishing return on dazing and stuff plus the fact that calls are supposed to get hoarse when spammed that could make it unabuseable

[regal elm]

But large predators hardly ever actually fought each other; territorial disputes usually end at intimidation and rarely resort to blows; fights to the death were seldom

[honest sparrow]

Vs charcar, which actively hunted large land animals

[regal elm]

Spinos teeth were also for fish

Because it ate fish

[odd sedge]

So the more you spam, the less effective it is

[paper oriole]

yeah basically

[manic sun]

it mainly ripped out meat chunks, against like big sauropods

[paper oriole]

also dinos who are under the affect get a diminishing return too so a para herd cant just lock it

[honest sparrow]

Considering they gave teno stun lock, probably not gonna happen

[paper oriole]

does teno still stun lock?

[regal elm]

I think para 1 calls should cause an ear ringing sound point blank but shouldnt trigger the daze effect because boy it was Loud

[honest sparrow]

I think so, haven’t got hitten by one in a while tho

[odd sedge]

Alright but now imagine this.

You are a solo carnivore in a canyon and a truck load of paras comes storming towards you, being so loud that your dinosaur gets so stunned that they just run over you like a train

[paper oriole]

if it does they should just add stun/knockdown/daze diminishing returns in general

[odd sedge]

That would be hilarious and horrifying at the same time

[paper oriole]

roadkill

[odd sedge]

Imagine getting run over by a dinosaur

[honest sparrow]

Also ngl I really don’t want to turn this into overwatch where literally everything has a stun and you aren’t allowed to move

[paper oriole]

imagine a maia counters your pounce as a utah and just runs you into the dirt like a plastic bag stuck to the grill of a car

stuns should mainly just be utilized by defensive animals and ambushers, rather than everyone

with diminishing returns on getting stunned so there are never any more stun locks

[odd sedge]

I wish Maia or something had some kind of side kick.
Like, imagine Utah tried to pounce your side and absolutely get kicked into the stomach by the Maia

[honest sparrow]

I just want maia to shoulder charge

[paper oriole]

a back kick, moving shoulder check and a head ram that disrupts your momentum would be a good attack set for maia

[odd sedge]

Plus trample

[paper oriole]

low damage, moderate fracture defensive attacks

yeah trample is sort of a passive, hadros should have great trample

[odd sedge]

That's right, Maia has a lot of blunt force attacks that will probably deal a ton of fractures

[paper oriole]

and if his headbutt disrupts momentum he could still be a speedcow without being a menace like he was in legacy

i remember slaughtering a whole dilo pack with maia once

[odd sedge]

It should have quite the high blood pool though

Or para

Either of the two should tank bleeders

[paper oriole]

maia was sor tof like that in legacy, he could brush off attacks relatively well

[odd sedge]

And grow in no time

[bronze vault]

Para kick attack should deal pretty high fractures against mid tiers

[paper oriole]

Why would tribals be able to talk to dinosaurs

They arent exactly humans either, they are like orc dudes

Probably humans mutated beyond being able to be called a human

[meager tiger]

@broken thorn only 1 velo on proto or all animals? Don't you think it'd be funny watching something bigger have like 20 angry velos swarming it's back lol

@errant sandal all dinosaur? Nah. How about a perk like a final finisher perk for max level or the end of the trer and you pick 1 dinosaur to talk too. Because all dinosaurs at the start is OP

@glad dirge it should be based on relative velocity between the target and yourself. A dinosaur drinking will get much more hurt rather than one running around top speed.

[errant sandal]

yeah maybe not ALL dinos
at max maybe 2 would be good

[meager tiger]

Two for tribals

One for mercd

Mercs

Mercs can have maybe a final tech option for translation

But not speaking

Just listening

[errant sandal]

i can see that being cool
that paired with merc missions that are species specific seems useful

[meager tiger]

Wait how can something as random as player chatting as a dino and a merc is gathering intell and listening for a merc mission?

[errant sandal]

the idea i had was is you're a merc with a mission to collect X amount of DNA samples, X amount of eggs, and document X Y and Z behavior, it'll help to be able to listen to what they are saying

especially if all those missions are for one species

if you have to take pictures or a video of Petras fishing and you overhear them saying they they are hungry, it would help to start lookng for the ripples in the water and wait by one

[meager tiger]

Ohhh

Nice good idea

Well I gtg break is over nice chatting

[swift dew]

@errant sandal tribals aren't humans btw, they are 9 foot tall orc like monsters

[errant sandal]

i understand
having something being able to expend a perk to cooperate with other creates creatures would be awesome roleplay wise

[feral solstice]

Uh

[errant sandal]

imagine one of them breeding a pack of utahs

[feral solstice]

You do realize they aren’t “cooperating” right?

Tribals will beat your Dino into submission

[errant sandal]

yes they could do that
or they can breed dinos like dogs and have a pack of them follow the tribe

having an option for interspecies cooperation would be cool

[feral solstice]

A pack could kill a tribal

The entire point is to make their diet worse so they can make you weak and enslave you

[errant sandal]

and a pack of wolves could kill a person

[feral solstice]

So like enslaving a rex by capturing it and making its diet poor

[errant sandal]

yes, enslaving is an option too

and so is cooperation

hence dialog

[feral solstice]

But the tribals were confirmed to enslave, meaning that’ll probably be their only option.

They aren’t supposed to be the nice creatures

They won’t breed Dinos, they’ll enslave them

[errant sandal]

you don't understand
players will be players

they don't give AF what the developers intended

if the only 'enslave' option is to have a food nest, then they players who want to cooperate won't do that
thell simply set up normal nests next to each other

[feral solstice]

What

[swift dew]

what

[errant sandal]

what

dino chickens

food nests where eggs are harvested

how else would you 'enslave' a dino

[feral solstice]

Beating into submission and forcing the Dino to cooperate or else it’ll die?

[errant sandal]

then as a player ill just let him kill me so ill respawn

[feral solstice]

So you’ll let tribals kill your 6 hour rex

[swift dew]

and you will lose your progress

[feral solstice]

^

[errant sandal]

boo

hoo

better to die free then live a slave

[swift dew]

if that is what you want then ok

[feral solstice]

Hey, if you don’t care about your Dino, more food for the tribals

[errant sandal]

all I'm saying is that there should be an option for cooperation because players do it anyways

[swift dew]

I guarantee this wont be your mindset after you finally got to 60% on your 20th try as a rex

[errant sandal]

why fight that

[errant sandal]

i will
ill try again

[swift dew]

that is what you say now, but once you try 50 more times, and never reach that growth again, you will be regretting it

cause apexes are going to be hard af

[errant sandal]

you keep raising the number
it won't change

[swift dew]

well yeah, thats kinda how trying again works. the number of tries goes up

[errant sandal]

people will play the game the way they want to

I'm saying that cooperating should be an option

[swift dew]

doesn't mean the devs have to help them

[hoary dawn]

there's no real way to have tribals enslaving players that would actually work

[errant sandal]

yeah

and i believe the devs SHOULD help them
opening the game to different playstyles encourages players to come back to the game

no reason reason not to

[swift dew]

mixpacking is not a playstyle that the devs want

that is literally what you are asking for

[paper oriole]

I dont really get the upvotes on that suggestion. What stego is out there killing for sport lmao why would it need more stamina drain for running its slow as shit. Defensive herbivores are already slower than their predators they dont need to have garbage mobility too

[swift dew]

just because they are tribals doesn't exclude them from that

[errant sandal]

yet people do it anyways

[swift dew]

your going to have a tough time staying healthy doing when when diets come out

[errant sandal]

how

[swift dew]

I am a carno, I like to eat tenontos, tenontos like to eat food in the top right corner of the map. so I go to the top right corner to eat tenontos to stay healthy. you are a utah, you like dryos, dryos like food at the bottom left corner of the map, so you are going to go there to eat those dryos to stay healthy. we cannot be together and both of us stay healthy at the same time

you skip your dryo meals? you will get debuffs

that is the gist of it, but a little more complicated

tribals and mercs are not excempt from the diet system

[errant sandal]

OR it between tribals and dinos, and not between tendos and utahs
none of what you're saying matters

the pack travels then

so what

now players have MORE of a reason not to play bush simulator'

[swift dew]

you're pack manages to go to one corner of the map and hastily make your way to another corner, and then back, and then back, and then back and then back. if that is what you want to do then go for it, I for one, and im sure alot of people agree with me, don't think that is fun

[hoary dawn]

i can see tribals and dinos working together

[errant sandal]

or

get this

it'll be hella fun

[hoary dawn]

people will absolutely do it no matter if its encouraged or not

[swift dew]

obviously, but its going to be much harder to do than just 3 rexes and 2 gigas chilling with each other like in legacy

[errant sandal]

that sounds awesome to have a survival game feel like that you are, ya know, surviving

[swift dew]

keep in mind its also more complicated from just one area to another, you will have to address multiple areas to keep both of you healthy, if you mange to, then good job

[errant sandal]

yeah.
I do realize that.
This game isn't dino-deathmatch-simulator, it's trying to have players live and be a part of a full ecosystem. differing survival strategies need to exist for this to happen

purposefully depriving players a survival strategy in a survival game isnt smart, especially if players are doing this strategy anyways right now

[swift dew]

the devs don't like mixpacking, YES I realize there isnt anything they can do to stop it completely, but just because we already have it, and its a "survival strategy" doesn't mean that they have to encourage it, there are going to be things to discourage it, you can disagree, and if you do idk what to tell you

[errant sandal]

if the devs are seriously going to go full blizzard and discourage something their playerbase wants, then this game deserves to die.
game development isn't about the dev's opinion, it's about whats best for the game. As much as the devs hate it, mixpacking happens, and they can either alienate their playerbase or give it a controlled environment to exist. Tribals are the perfect opportunity for cooperation base playstyles to exist.
and yes, it should be hard, diet wise, but sometimes fun things to do in games are difficult.

[hoary dawn]

mixpacking isn't good for the game tho

at least not in most combinations

[errant sandal]

which is why balencing the pack's diet should be a chore

[hoary dawn]

with tribals imo its really not that bad, cuz i mean what's a tribal gonna to do to help a dinosaur

but mixpacking in general is not good for dinos

[modest wind]

but 60% of players don't like mixpacking

[feral solstice]

Wait so, discouraging mixpacking is a bad thing to you?

[feral solstice]

They aren’t supposed to help a Dino. They’re supposed to force the Dino to help THEM.

[hoary dawn]

i doubt enslavement system will exist

[feral solstice]

That’s what Dondi wants so idk

[errant sandal]

if there is a debuff to stats for having a poor diet, then the pack has 2 choices
1- slightly starve, but make up for it in the mixpack dynamic
2- travel insane distances or go through dangerous territory, risking the pack as a whole to balence everyone's needs

[hoary dawn]

and yea they aren't supposed to help dinos, but really who is gonna stop them

[feral solstice]

I mean the whole point of enslavement is keeping their diet bad and making them so weak they can’t fight back, therefore allowing the tribals to enslave them.

You’ll still be able to escape the tribals if the time comes

But you’ll also risk dying.

[hoary dawn]

yea but a player would just kill themselves or log out

[errant sandal]

exactly

how whould you implement an effective enslavement system

[feral solstice]

If the player kills themselves then that’s meat for the tribals

[errant sandal]

so?

[hoary dawn]

and if they safe log

[feral solstice]

also

If you try to safe log they’ll kill you

So trying to escape means you’re likely going to die

[feral solstice]

So resisting enslavement will make you lose your progress

[hoary dawn]

yea so instead of an enslavement system you just have another way for tribals to kill stuff

[errant sandal]

where does the "enslavement" part come in, because this just sounds like an atrocious form of dev sanctioned trolling

and a horrific feature to add to any game, really

[feral solstice]

Enslavement is beating them into submission, keeping their health low, and their diet poor, and forcing them to do your bidding. Using the dinos for transportation, combat, etc.

[hoary dawn]

too few people would play along with it for it to be worth doing

[feral solstice]

Which feeds the tribals

[errant sandal]

again

dev sanctioned trolling

[feral solstice]

People who care about their progress would follow through and find a way to escape

[feral solstice]

How is it trolling lol

[errant sandal]

how exactly would this be fun for the person being enslaved

[hoary dawn]

yea so why have an enslavement system when most of the time no enslavement occurs

[feral solstice]

I doubt it’ll be most of the time since people growing a rex wouldn’t like their Dino dying

[errant sandal]

how is beating a player just because and not killing him anything but trolling

[hoary dawn]

its just tribals beating up stuff and then getting food when the player decides it has better things to do than be a slave

[feral solstice]

Because you’re using them for other means? Not doing it as a joke? Lol

[hoary dawn]

so they can only enslave dinos with long growth times

[errant sandal]

absolutly noone will capitulate, i'll tell you that now

[feral solstice]

Longer would be the better word

Carno could be enslaved aswell for fast transport

[hoary dawn]

carno does not take long to grow, people would start over

[feral solstice]

So they’ll die? That’s on them not the tribals

[feral solstice]

2 hours and 30 minutes. Hmm, I’m sure some will try to cooperate and find a way to escape in order to not die

Or was it an hour and fifteen

[errant sandal]

if someone is in a position where they are enslaved, they player would say "my dino might as well have been killed, lets try again" then attempt an escape, then die

then no enslaving happens

or

[hoary dawn]

how long do you think they'd have to wait for a chance to escape, if any chance actually presents itself

[feral solstice]

Depends on what they’re doing

[errant sandal]

they will log off and just walk away from the spot and wait until the night

[feral solstice]

If you can kill a tribal, evade the tribe and then run into the forest far enough to not get tracked, that’s an opportunity

[feral solstice]

How will you log off without being killed though?

[hoary dawn]

it does, and that means if you get enslaved you have no idea how long it will be before you can continue playing normally, and you have no idea if you will even have a chance at escape

[feral solstice]

That’s why you cooperate and look for a way to escape.

It’s not going to be the easy way out

[errant sandal]

it doesnt matter, the dino that is enslaved is a write off anyways

[hoary dawn]

the easy way out is to start over

[errant sandal]

exactly

[feral solstice]

Sorry

No easy way out without losing progress

[errant sandal]

if this form of "enslavement" is added to the game, i have plenty of other games that aren't autistic

[feral solstice]

So people will either lose their progress or cooperate and find a way to escape, therefore saving their progress

[errant sandal]

thats's dumb

[feral solstice]

No really

Not

[errant sandal]

just kill the prey

dont torture players

[feral solstice]

Just kill the prey and lose the benefits like transportation and combat?

Nah

[errant sandal]

or

get this

no

[feral solstice]

Or get this

Yes

[hoary dawn]

when you present a player with the options of
-starting over
or
-being unable to play freely for who knows how long, until maybe, just maybe you find an opportunity to escape, which you then have to actually accomplish without dying

people will choose the easier option

[feral solstice]

That’s on the player then

[errant sandal]

nah man, that's a horrific idea that goes against any common sense for making a game fun

[feral solstice]

Some people will try to save their Dino

[errant sandal]

no

man

they wont

[feral solstice]

Especially if it takes hours and hours to grow

[errant sandal]

nop

man

they wont

[feral solstice]

How do you know lol

[hoary dawn]

i guarantee it would not happen enough to justify the mechanic's existence

[feral solstice]

I disagree

[errant sandal]

because other games try this stuff and players either choose the easy out or stop playing the game

[feral solstice]

Higher growth times means players will be more desperate to survive if all else fails.

[hoary dawn]

most of the playables tribals would actually be able to take down do not have very long growth times

[feral solstice]

Nothing I can really tel you about that
I want this mechanic in, only by being programmed properly

[feral solstice]

Tribals would be able to take down and restrain a rex lol

They’re 9 feet tall, have weapons, etc.

There’s even CONCEPT ART where a rex is restrained with a mouth lock.

And being ridden

[modest wind]

i has this idea a long time ago
maybe tribes could steal eggs before they hatch and hatch them themselves and you would know if your hatching into a wild dino or a tamed dino

[hoary dawn]

i imagine that would be a very rare occurance

[errant sandal]

bruh, no one will allow that to happen to their dino

ever

[feral solstice]

Of course not

That’s why it’s forced

[errant sandal]

no

like

suicide before it does because that's annying as hell

not

fun

[feral solstice]

Well then you lose your Dino?

You think being killed is fun?

[clear carbon]

fib this is a dumb argument they would never add this lol.

[errant sandal]

you might as well, so yes

they better not

[feral solstice]

Dondi already stated he wants it, and he’s the owner so it’s probably going to happen

[errant sandal]

i'll ask for a refund if they do

[hoary dawn]

to enslave a rex, tribals must first find a rex, actually take it down with it killing them or them killing it, and then keeping it constantly weak enough to not fight back while also fed enough to not die.

that just is not the kind of thing that would happen enough

[feral solstice]

You’re going to ask for a refund even though tribals will be enabled or disabled LOL

Funny

[clear carbon]

its not on the road map\

[feral solstice]

But it was also stated by the devs

[errant sandal]

it's a horrific direction to take the game

yes

i will

[feral solstice]

So then play on servers without tribals enabled

[errant sandal]

when

if tribals are dev sanctioned trolls, i will just stop playing the game

[feral solstice]

Its like players refunding over humans being added. Okay, play on servers without humans enabled. What the fucks the point in refunding when you can do just that?

[feral solstice]

Well then do that

[modest wind]

thats just cause they don't know when they are going to do it and when they do it will be in a very long time

[errant sandal]

have fun playing your dead game when it happens

[hoary dawn]

its not even trolling, its just another way for tribals to kill things, most enslavement attempts would end in the dino dying

[feral solstice]

Lol it’ll still have a bunch of people

They’ll be playing on servers with no tribals

[errant sandal]

then why add something if noone will play with it enabled

[feral solstice]

I’m sure there will be servers with it enabled

[errant sandal]

it's not even tribals, it's just your dumb as hell idea for enslavement

[feral solstice]

Okay bub

Keep talking

[errant sandal]

yeah

you too

[modest wind]

cause the devs want to and its the're game

[feral solstice]

^

[errant sandal]

what's the better option here for ridable dinos?
1- literal player abuse
2- player cooperation

[feral solstice]

I’d rather it not be ark

Yeah

[stable spire]

actually that seems fun

[errant sandal]

i'd rather play a game that isn't autistic when it comes to multiplayer game design, so nah

[modest wind]

you do realize any dino is going to curb stomp humans

[hoary dawn]

its not a good idea, its a mechanic that looks good on paper, but then when you think about it like 99% of the time when people attempt it the dino would either kill themselves or die trying to escape. so only a small fraction of the time it would ever actually work, and all of that just so tribals can carry some extra weight or move a tiny bit faster

[errant sandal]

and wolves can curb stomp humans, but we have dogs

we dont have dogs because we abused them to submission

[modest wind]

but dogs where bred to be pets

not just fed them

[feral solstice]

Die trying to escape

They probably won’t kill the Dino, just damage it enough that it’ll die in one shot or be forced to cooperate

[errant sandal]

and with the advent of nests, that can be a thing

[clear carbon]

@feral solstice why would a player just be cool with being beat into submissions, fibs take on it is better lol.

[feral solstice]

Nobody said the game is supposed to be easy

[feral solstice]

If they want to keep their Dino then they’d cooperate until they CAN escape

It’s not permanent enslavement

[errant sandal]

no, but it is still a GAME and neems to be FUN

[feral solstice]

So play on servers without tribals

Ez

[hoary dawn]

that would be the state of the dino while its captured, if it tries to escape they would kill it

[clear carbon]

wouldn't it be better and easier just to add idk, like a perk that lets them communicate?

[errant sandal]

or just dont make tribals autistic

[feral solstice]

No that would be the state DURING the capture

[modest wind]

sorry but thats never going to happen

[feral solstice]

Sorry but that’s the games design. Go cry about it to the devs or play on a server without tribals enabled

[feral solstice]

No then that promotes mixpacking which the devs highly discourage

[hoary dawn]

they would have to keep it weak the entire time its under their control

[feral solstice]

Yeah

Force it into a poor diet

[hoary dawn]

so if it tries to escape it would die

[feral solstice]

Keep its health low

[stable spire]

i like the idea

[feral solstice]

Well if let’s say there’s forest beside you, and a couple tribals aswell, kill one of both of them and run the hell away until they lose sight of you

[hoary dawn]

they are threatening it with death if it does not cooperate, so if it tries to escape they follow through on their threat

[errant sandal]

ANY sane player is just going to log off and not let that happen, no matter how many hours are sank into that particular dino

[feral solstice]

Any SANE player won’t log off because they’ll end of being killed during the log out

Also

[errant sandal]

what

[hoary dawn]

that's if the tribals are dumbasses

[feral solstice]

If you don’t safelog your Dino is kept in the game for 5 minutes

[clear carbon]

most people would just say screw it unless they want to follow a tribal lol.

[errant sandal]

bro
that WILL NOT happen

[feral solstice]

So really youll just be pissing them off and they’ll kill you then and there

[modest wind]

its not impossible to escape but once your caught if the tribe stays on top of you you will prob die if you try

[feral solstice]

Go cry to Dondi then

[stable spire]

it would. actually.

[feral solstice]

Yeah. This entire game is BASED around being smart

Don’t be smart and you die

Same with tribals trying to enslave

[stable spire]

that's the same with survival irl

[errant sandal]

why would you just let yourself be abused

[stable spire]

if you're smart you live easier

[feral solstice]

So you can cooperate and find a way to escape? And if you escape, save your Dino?

[errant sandal]

or you just die and respawn somewhere they are not

[feral solstice]

If it’s a 6 hour long Dino, I doubt you’ll just let them kill you

A lot of people would try to escape

[stable spire]

that's assuming the player is small and not something with actual time into it..

[hoary dawn]

tribals trying to enslave wouldn't be that dumb, in a week there would be tutorials on how to most effectively keep a dinosaur contained

[feral solstice]

Like

[modest wind]

that is very true

[stable spire]

it seems like a really great way to encourage player-player interaction

[errant sandal]

i've played big dinos to full adult, I WILL NOT just let myself be abused by trolls like that

[feral solstice]

Imagine there’s tribal alliances. You enslave a carno and have it as a transport Dino to get to the other tribe

[modest wind]

then you fight them before they catch you

[feral solstice]

Sure

[stable spire]

so have i, multiple times.

[feral solstice]

Like I said. The enslavement isn’t permanent. If you have the opportunity to escape, do so.

Or else die and lose your progress

[modest wind]

it won't be that hard to resist

[hoary dawn]

its not, its going through a lot of work to annoy another player while barely gaining anything of value for yourself

[stable spire]

eh. that's probably just me then

[errant sandal]

better player-player interaction will be communication and cooperation not trolling and literal slavery

[feral solstice]

Sorry but they won’t allow mixpacking

[stable spire]

have both

i mean it's not impossible

[hoary dawn]

its a neat interaction, i will not deny that. i wish the mechanic could exist without having all the loopholes but there is no way they could do it right

[stable spire]

tribals could help the player by giving them food, in return the player helps them

[hoary dawn]

what

[errant sandal]

the point ricardo is making is that there will be ONLY slavery
which is dumb

[stable spire]

but it relies very heavily on the players

[feral solstice]

I don’t think there’s a righter way if the tribals are confirmed “brutal” and “merciless”

[clear carbon]

they don't allow mix packing cause it breaks immersion not because they don't want cooperation, they are two different things.

[feral solstice]

Exactly

But if you mixpack you gotta cooperate to survive as a mixpack, no?

[hoary dawn]

tribals being ruthless badasses cant help an inherently flawed mechanic

[errant sandal]

that's the cooperation
ricardo is saying that there should be ONLY beating they players attempting to log off, starving them, and abusing the player to submission

[stable spire]

for me, if a tribe was feeding me and making my life and growing a lot easier i'd cooperate.

[hoary dawn]

tribals having a more symbiotic relationship with some dinos is a much more possible idea

[stable spire]

yeah that doesn't make much sense

[stable spire]

agreed.

[feral solstice]

But how would a tribal have a more symbiotic relationship without it being absurd, ridiculous, and game breaking?

[errant sandal]

we already went over this
Diet

[feral solstice]

All your points were irrational or didn’t make sense

[stable spire]

and plus, a tribe of people wouldn't be able to support more than one or two dinos.

[hoary dawn]

no idea, that's why tribals mixpacking with dinos isn't a good idea

just stick to killing them

[stable spire]

idk, even then it might still happen anyway

[errant sandal]

they have to travel rediculus distance to keep the diet or suffer from being overall weaker but made up for in mixpack

[feral solstice]

That wouldn’t work lol

[stable spire]

do you mean ridiculous

[feral solstice]

You have to feed the tribals AND the mixpack member

[errant sandal]

thats literaly a point you arleady made in diets
how would it not

[feral solstice]

Because we don’t know how different tribals and dinos diets will be?

For all we know

They become piscivores lol

Even then, it’ll just turn into ark but the Dino would have a mindset instead of being so.

Ai*

[hoary dawn]

a dino gains nothing from hauling around a tribal

[feral solstice]

That’s the point

A tribal forces the Dino to haul around for its own benefit

[clear carbon]

@feral solstice its not conceptually a good game design idea cause of the extra energy to develop such a feature, in addition to player resistance. The feature would be abused and miss used likely, games that have developed features like this often have that feature miss used to its full extent.

[feral solstice]

It’s not supposed to benefit the Dino

[errant sandal]

simple
make the diets convoluted for mixpack between tribals and apexes, but more feasible with tribals and a smaller dino

[feral solstice]

Explain how it’s be misused

[hoary dawn]

an enslaved dino wouldn't benefit a tribal much if at all either

[errant sandal]

how will it NOT????

[feral solstice]

Because you’re forcing the Dino to help you? And they’ll die if not? How is that a abusive lol

[feral solstice]

I mean if you enslave a carno for transport that’s a lot of benefits

Finding other tribes, food, etc

[hoary dawn]

carno would kill itself

short growth time

[feral solstice]

2 hours and 15 minutes? Dunno

[clear carbon]

@feral solstice I would imagine it would often lead to the domesticated target often resisting even to the point of logging off. You can't really force a player to do anything, they can choose to turn off the game lol. However a player could choose to be domesticated.

[errant sandal]

No man
a troll and his buddies join the game and "enslave" dinos, just to watch them starve and die because it's hilarious to them
it's going to be nothing but trolls and asshats doing tribal

[stable spire]

like me who'd do it for fun and variety.

[vale pawn]

The Isle

[hoary dawn]

any dino with a growth time of like 2 hours or less would most likely kill itself, especially an animal like carno that wouldn't have that much issue growing again since its the fastest land carnivore

[feral solstice]

Well

Turning off the game while not logged out keeps your Dino in the game forever
Logging out without safe logging keeps your Dino in for 5 minutes (more than enough time to kill you)

[clear carbon]

@stable spire some players would do it for fun certainly.

@stable spire and it would be a good role play mechanic, however it would be much easier to add just a simple perk system that allows communication maybe only to specific targets or to all dinos as a hole.

[hoary dawn]

tribals talking to dinos makes no sense and has no benefit

[clear carbon]

@hoary dawn not everyone agrees with your sentiments always lol.

[feral solstice]

Again, enslaving would be for gaining benefits. What would be the difference with that and being a Dino and killing everything because it’s hilarious?

[errant sandal]

not all dinos, but taking a late end perk for one or two species would be coon for

[feral solstice]

Though

[hoary dawn]

idc if people agree, i care if they have good reasoning for their opinions

[feral solstice]

Now that I think about it

[clear carbon]

@feral solstice what would be the point of enslaving a player that doesn't play along. lol. Its literally the same as killing them.

[errant sandal]

because trolls who go stego and murder everything exist, even with no benefit to them

[feral solstice]

Tribals trying to “tame” troodons by giving them food in return for working with them would be pretty cool

[hoary dawn]

symbiotic relationship

[errant sandal]

thats call ed cooperation

[feral solstice]

So there’s no different to that and what you said about tribals?

[errant sandal]

not slavery

[errant sandal]

yes

[feral solstice]

Exactly what I just said about troodons

[errant sandal]

exactly

[clear carbon]

however having some kind of domestication might be kind of cool. but out right enslaving players seems like it would be silly to add lol.

[feral solstice]

So then that point for enslavement is null when it’s the same for kosers

[errant sandal]

trolls would just use this as a vector to just be horrible trolling players who get a rise out of pissing everyone else off

[stable spire]

that's a good point tbh

[feral solstice]

If you kill them because they don’t cooperate, then you get food. If they cooperate, you get different benefits depending on the Dino enslaved

[feral solstice]

That’s not the games fault though. The same could be said for KOSing. That pisses people off too does it not?

Again, using trolls as a reason for no enslavement is not a good one

[hoary dawn]

at most you get something to carry your luggage

[feral solstice]

When they exist the same in the form of dinos

[errant sandal]

if you're designing these features you have to be sure they wont be exploited or abused and drive players from not coming back to your game

[clear carbon]

and what if the en-slaver just decides to say ill let you go if you do x y and z, and never feeds them they do x,y,z all of it and they die to starvation XD,

[hoary dawn]

tribals would only be able to use enslaved dinos to carry heavy things

[errant sandal]

it's actually a fantastic one

[feral solstice]

Not really

[errant sandal]

yeah

it is

[feral solstice]

Disagree

[errant sandal]

okay

[feral solstice]

Same could be said for dinos

So it doesn’t make any sense

[errant sandal]

it's objectively wrong, but okay

[hoary dawn]

its not a good reason compared to the major flaws in the mechanic if done without trolls

[feral solstice]

I don’t think they’d “say it. They’ll likely have body languages like if they’re riding you, they’ll yank you to a specific direction

Also there would be no benefits to starving out a Dino other than food. You’d be enslaving the Dino for benefits. The Dino could escape whenever they see a chance to do so

[hoary dawn]

what benefits

[feral solstice]

Transportation, combat (if it’s an apex), etc.

[errant sandal]

what does the dino get

[hoary dawn]

combat wouldn't make sense

you are keeping the dino weak

[feral solstice]

Wel if you use a rex to take out an Acro then that’s putting it to use

[feral solstice]

Have you not been listening

[hoary dawn]

a weak rex would lose to an acro

[feral solstice]

Enslaving doesn’t have any benefits for the slave

[errant sandal]

evidently, you havent'

[feral solstice]

I’ve been listening fine and disagreeing so there’s that

[errant sandal]

and if a player is in that situation, they'll stop playing

[hoary dawn]

even a wild rex at peak strength could lose to an acro

tho its more in the rex's favor in the wild

[feral solstice]

Punch confirmed if you had a poor diet you still wouldn’t be weaker in a 1v1 with a member of your species with a better diet

[hoary dawn]

acro isn't rex's species

[feral solstice]

Hell no
Acro is a pseudo apex
There’s no way a rex would lose in a fight

[hoary dawn]

could

not would

[feral solstice]

But that also disproves your point with a “weaker rex” losing in a fight with an acro

[errant sandal]

how would THAT have any less game breaking balance issues that mixpacking doesn't already present

[hoary dawn]

if a weak rex can win a fight against another powerful carnivore then why follow your diet at all when you reach adult

[feral solstice]

Because mixpacking, let’s use trike as an example, mixes with a rex, creating an unstoppable killing force ravaging the map, would be hella bad

[feral solstice]

Following your diets would give you benefits such as faster growth and better stats?

That’s more than enough incentive to make a player follow their diets.

[hoary dawn]

I said when you reach adult, and better stats dont matter apparently since you can still wreck an acro

[feral solstice]

So what’s the problem then

[errant sandal]

fun for the players

[feral solstice]

The tribals can still use the rex can they not

[errant sandal]

keeping the game not dead

[feral solstice]

Play
On
A
Server
Without
Tribals

[feral solstice]

How would tribals kill the game

[errant sandal]

NOONE WILL PLAY TRIBAL SERVERS

[feral solstice]

Actually a lot of people I know on this server would

And I think a lot more aswell

Including humans

[errant sandal]

tribals wont, your dumb slavery idea will

[stable spire]

i would play them

[hoary dawn]

it doesn't make sense for them to be able to use a rex for combat when to keep the rex contained it has to be weak enough to not beat them in combat

[stable spire]

[feral solstice]

Sorry that it doesn’t help your “easy game and ark role play fetus”

Also complain to Dondi about the idea cause this was his after all

[hoary dawn]

if an enslaved rex has enough strength to kill an acro then it sure as hell would be able to take down its tribal captors

[errant sandal]

what autism did you just say?

[errant sandal]

such an idea that isn't even on the roadmap

[feral solstice]

I mean with the concepts, they’ve shown cannibals clamping their mouth shut, so idk about that

Tribals I mean

Not cannibals

[hoary dawn]

roadmap does not contain all the ideas for the game, its just for the foreseeable future

[feral solstice]

Just because it’s not in the roadmap doesn’t mean it isn’t confirmed

[stable spire]

also can we stop using the autism shit? i'm actually autistic and it's really irritating

[tawny juniper]

taming players would break the game

[hoary dawn]

good luck killing an acro with your mouth tied shut

[feral solstice]

That doesn’t stop them from letting the rex open it’s mouth to deal with the Acro lol
You’ll have an Acro AND tribals to deal with if you resist

Plus the tribals would have bows and arrows, spears, etc.

Hell

Maybe even specific artillery idfk

[tawny juniper]

as in guns

[errant sandal]

my apologies
i'm trying to get the point across that this slavery idea will drive players away from the game SO FAST
cooperation will get people to want to play
risking playing a game where you sink hours into just to be enslaved at peak performance for your dino will not

[feral solstice]

Not fund

Guns*

[feral solstice]

If you have the option to play on servers without tribals, it won’t drive them out. Sorry

[tawny juniper]

Having an option for a players dino to be captured and still force player to be dino would be not good, Neither would capturing ai, overall the idea of dino taming/capture would not work out at all

[errant sandal]

kinda dumb to make an entire server where you would WANT to be enslaved
those servers will be dead all the time by anyone not a tribal

[feral solstice]

But if you can have a means to escape, that means you can survive? Does it not?

[hoary dawn]

once tribals take down a rex they better have an immediate use for it or else they wont get to use it for anything while they're playing, so to use a rex for combat you would have to either know what you want to kill and where it is, or just happen to run into something with your rex in only a few hours of play

[feral solstice]

So you’ll play a server to be enslaved.. tf is your point

[errant sandal]

it'll still be annoying as hell and not fun to play

[feral solstice]

Just because you play a server doesn’t mean tribals will be abundant af

Idk where you got that from

[errant sandal]

any new release playable will be

[hoary dawn]

its almost laughable how low the chances are of using a rex for anything other than bragging rights

[feral solstice]

How the fuck

[errant sandal]

how not?

[feral solstice]

Okay apparently you are starting to make way less sense

[tawny juniper]

So your saying you would rather have basically no control over your dino with the tradeoff of not having to go and find food/water

[errant sandal]

and you've made none from the start

[feral solstice]

I’ve made a bunch of points yes. Takes you to understand them, which you do not even after I’ve explained them multiple times, yes. I won’t bother anymore

[errant sandal]

AFK simulator!
better than staring at the bush waiting to grow!
now you have NO control

[errant sandal]

good.
stop talking

[tawny juniper]

gameplay would not be exciting for the dino in the situation at all

[stable spire]

dude chill..

[feral solstice]

Enslavement means you’re going to be forced to do their bidding until you can manage to find an escape to get your freedom back. The tribals would feed and give them water, but only if they cooperate and decide to not resist, also be kept a poor diet.

You CAN escape, but that’s risky

If you can though

Do it

[tawny juniper]

And whats to stop the dino from literally not doing anything for the humans, better than staying captured. What's to stop players from just taming dinos and driving them off cliffs

[feral solstice]

Why would you drive your slave off a cliff

[hoary dawn]

cool down, your points so far have not been much better than rickardo's

[tawny juniper]

So the entire gameplay aspect is that you sit and wait for an opportunity to go do something fun for who knows how long

[tawny juniper]

trolling

like "oh I got you, too bad you have to restart now"

[feral solstice]

Well then try to escape?

Nothings stopping you

[errant sandal]

people dont like being forced to watch cut scenes in games, how would they like this, have fun with this, say "i want to do that again" or recommend a game where you are literally helpless to other players literally enslaving you

[feral solstice]

Well

[errant sandal]

it would kill the game so quickly

[tawny juniper]

the tribals are

[errant sandal]

the tribals could be fun for dinos, too

[tawny juniper]

If you are a captured dino, you sit in a pen or something, weakened and probably with the bare minimum nutrition, so you can do what? drive around a bunch of tribals. Where is the fun aspect on the dinos side

[hoary dawn]

even on the tribal's side its not much of a gain to just have a ride

[errant sandal]

a weakened ride, at that

[tawny juniper]

and what's to to stop the captured player from not doing anything, I would argue that dying and restarting is a lot easier to accept than the fact that you're going to be enslaved for the next couple hours

And if you try to log out will the tribals just kill you because you can't be used anymore?

[errant sandal]

he wont listen to this point
I've been trying to make it for a bit now

[tawny juniper]

In the end it just adds up to a bunch of problems that are definitley going to happen

A lot of people who like the game don't have a whole lot of time to run around and grow something, much less sit in a pen for hours at a time

[hoary dawn]

lets see
possible things a tribal could gain from dinosaur enslavement:

-a slightly faster ride: tribals are gonna have a lot of movement options including climbing trees and will most likely be very capable runners on the ground, so going through all the work to enslave a dinosaur would not be worth it

-a weapon: if the whole thing with keeping a dinosaur is making sure its too weak to fight back then how tf is it supposed to fight things that your tribe can't

-carrying cargo: using a massive animal that is too weak to defend itself to transport things that you cannot is a good idea, it would work well for large tribes, ofc the issues with enslavement itself are still present but at least there's a chance you can benefit from it

[sacred moat]

Why do people want a taming system for dinosaurs? Lmfao this isn’t Ark survival evolved. Besides no one is stopping you and your friends from carebearing each other as a spino and tribal mix pack.

[limber hull]

Cerato on Isle size charts is shown to be 1600kg. Also, making the health and damage that low would make it a punching bag, and not the brawler it should be. It needs to be so good at standing its ground that nothing on the roster, outside of a fully grown deino/stego, thinks about getting between it and its food

[still raptor]

Size charts for weight aren't confirmed whatsoever.

[limber hull]

Once allos and such get added, then it'll be a much scarier story for cerato, since there's no way it can punch up that

[still raptor]

An allo should fuck up a Cerato. So should Carno

[hoary dawn]

idk about a carno fucking up cerato

[tawny juniper]

^

[limber hull]

I think cerato should 100% put up a fight against carno. If we add cerato and make it easy carno prey, nothing is achieved

carno is still the apex

[feral solstice]

The point of enslavement is to beat a dinosaur into submission, and trying to keep its diet poor enough to where it’s harder for the slave to resist, enabling the tribals a way to keep them as slaves to do their bidding such as transportation, luggage, combat, etc.
You’ll have the chance to escape if the time comes:
Breaking out of your pen at the right time
Killing tribals and running into wherever
Etc
The entire consensus is that if you resist, you’ll have a hard time doing so due to your weakened stats and hp.
Trying to logout won’t do you any good cause you likely be speared to death during the logout.
If you use a Dino for transport (let’s say Carno), you can use it to head towards another tribe as fast as possible, look for food or other potential slaves, etc.
For luggage, you could hold other weapons, materials, etc.
For combat, it would need to be strong (or a brawler) enough to take down other creatures even with weakened stats (so a trike, rex, etc).
The point of enslavement for tribals is to help them with their own tribe by taking advantage of the dinosaur to do other things that would benefit them, not the dinosaur.
If you’re going to be put in a pen, try to look for an escape. It doesn’t have to last “hours” just for you to find an escape. Just try and find one, even if you have to cooperate with the tribals.
If you’re weakened by the tribe, you’ll likely be too slow to fight back or too weak to withstand the tribals themselves. There will be a bunch of tribals. The point would be to weaken the dinosaur to where it’ll be hard af to resist, but not too weak to where it can’t be used for slavery. Weakening a rex to where it resisting wouldn’t bring too many casualties and make it easier to kill, but also not too weak to where it has no use

Read it if you dare

[limber hull]

Cerato should make anything around its weight class afraid to fuck with it, this includes carno. Carno hits and runs, takes the food from the kill. Cerato does the opposite, it either scavenges kills or scares something away from a kill, as it's not really a hunter, and cerato needs to be big and strong enough to scare carnos off, because being stomped by carno and deino as a "bully" doesn't make it feel like a bully to me at all.

[still raptor]

It should be able to fight a Carno. The fight should be in the Carnos favor. In a 1v1 the Carno should have the upper hand. In a 2v1, Cerato should have the upper hand. There is also a difference between being an overall brawler and a small tier brawler. Cerato by concept is a small tier brawler, meaning it bullies small tier animals with the exception of Tenonto (which would also have its way with Cera) and Magy (which would be a 50/50 shown in concepts). What the community wants is Ceratorex where it punches up to strong midtiers like Allo, or even apexes like Stego. In this case making it a general brawler which it doesn't fit that title. Something like Acro would as an example.

[limber hull]

Deino should fuck up ceratos, tbh, and will 100% be one of ceratos biggest predators because of the whole swimming thing

[feral solstice]

I’ll explain my points in more detail if you’d like

[hoary dawn]

im sorry dude but there are too many problems with the idea

[feral solstice]

Like

[limber hull]

Comparing the mouths, cerato having a higher biteforce would not feel too alien to me, I def think it should be able to bite down harder than a carno can. But carno's hit and run tactics should be weakened by ceratos close-range brawler, and its grapple. Carnos can EASILY escape ceratos, so having the matchup be in the carnos favour makes it very much an easy fight to take, if you don't want to lose, you can just leave the fight, cerato won't catch up.

[feral solstice]

I’d like an explanation before i agree

[hoary dawn]

like everything i said when we were talking

[still raptor]

Realism is a good base, but it shouldn't determine balance.

[hoary dawn]

none of my points have been disproven yet

[feral solstice]

Okay then just say one thing and I’ll explain mine

Yknow what lemme just reply to messages

[hoary dawn]

there is an fantastically low chance of actually successfully enslaving a dinosaur

[still raptor]

I still stick with the obvious observation that the majority of this community wants Ceratorex to return.

Which is bad. Very bad.

[limber hull]

I don't think the game should be balanced for carno to win in a cerato v carno matchup. Cerato cannot hunt, the only way that fight is going to start is by carno agreeing to it. Cerato should absolutely be balanced as a big bully who can pick on most of the dinos currently on the roster, but can't hunt for the life of it

I'm only designing around what I read and see from concept art and dev statements. I actually have no idea what a ceratorex is.

But if cerato loses to carno, IDK how to feel about that, since it would easily make cerato extremely weak on arrival.

[still raptor]

I said the Carno should have the advantage. The advantage being 200 kg (1,600kg estimate) or 500kg (1,300kg estimate) heavier. IF a cerato fucks up in the fight, it dies. No matter the weight estimate. However, if you gain a duo or a trio to fight one carno, the cerato will obviously have the upper hand.

[feral solstice]

Good point
Of course. The point is IF you manage to enslave them (meaning they didn’t run away or massacre your squad) you’ll have a slave. Dondi stated it would be pretty hard to take down a rex and enslave it, though I can’t remember the statement too well to explain how many tribals it would take to bring one down.

Carno would probably have to somehow be trapped to keep it in a position to try and enslave it

[hoary dawn]

not low chance as in hard, low chance as in way too many things have to go a specific way for it to happen at all

[limber hull]

Cerato, as I designed it, is a brawler that can put up a fight anything that is willing to engage it (as long as they are of similar size) and scavenges whatever it can find, but cannot hunt easily at all (of course this also begs the question if cerato is meant to hunt magy but also meant to be a defensive brawler, how fucking slow is magy going to be but I'm trying not to think about the logistics of magy rn because we are not getting into that whole debacle)

[still raptor]

I think the majority of the community like you misunderstood Cerato's concept and nature. It bullies/brawls small tier animals solo with the exception of Tenonto.

[still raptor]

But you are making Cerato something it isn't.

[feral solstice]

Well, specific ways to follow in order to enslave something does constitute it being “harder”. You’ll likely have to follow in with a plan in order to somehow enslave a dinosaur, such as trapping a carno to prevent it from running, and finding a way to not get hit by the dinosaur while trying to beat it down.

[hoary dawn]

its not ways you have to follow that i am talking about

[feral solstice]

Explain

[hoary dawn]

k

one sec

[still raptor]

"Cerato, as I designed it". You are changing the idea behind it. As I explained before, there is a difference between a general brawler (Acro as an example) and a small tier brawler (what Cerato's concept is).

[still raptor]

Ceratorex was a strongly overtuned Cerato that had it's time against Apexes like Giga and Rex.

[limber hull]

oh absolutely not, cerato as I design it would absolutely be stomped by anything of that weightclass, I want nothing of that sort

I just felt the defensive playstyle was something I would like to see, and would combine well with cerato's iron stomach (find food, scare off hunters, stay around food even if it rots, make sure nothing takes your food). Also, a nice juxtaposition to the hyper-aggressive hunters that are utah and carno. However, I'm interested how you would balance cerato to fulfil your style of cerato, since I'm always open to new ideas (I'd be a shitty game designer if I wasn't)

[still raptor]

And to be frank here, every scenario that I previously mentioned about match ups is balanced by average players.

should've clarified that in the beginning.

[limber hull]

Lockjaw was an ability inspired by the fact that in three drawings in the concept art, you can see cerato either grabbing something by the neck or going for the neck, and a "tug of war" attack for those who enter close range would be really interesting to me.

[still raptor]

I do like the Lackjaw ability.

[limber hull]

Lockjaw is something some animals do to confirm kills irl (some dogs do it), they attack and have it that their mouth clenches down fully on their opponent with intense strength, making it EXTREMELY hard for the opponent to get away

[still raptor]

But other than the match ups and balance in your suggestion, Wavepool, I do like it. (hence the maybe)

[limber hull]

I still think lockjaw should be at least effective against a full grown carn

Since it would suck ass as a fighter without it, and fights would be much more interesting with it

[tawny juniper]

ok but how is this fun for the dino being enslaved

[limber hull]

Parrys are... Weird, IDK how they'd be done

That doesn't help me lmao

I know

Just

I don't see it working in my head too well

[vale pawn]

un-shielding on a hit

https://tenor.com/view/smash-bros-smash-little-mac-gif-14436777

[limber hull]

Just, a parry like SSB seems weird, how would it work animation-wise, mechanically, so on

For a fighting game maybe, but for the Isle, it's very strange

I try to think within the realm of possibility

[feral solstice]

It’s not supposed to be. This game is supposed to be horror and hardcore survival, so this is apart of the “horror” aspect

[limber hull]

I might do more concepts like my cera one, I just like game design lmao

[feral solstice]

Sorry I’m trying to make pretzels so I can respond as quick

[limber hull]

Its fun to make concepts

[tawny juniper]

If it isn't fun it won't be added

[feral solstice]

I mean fun for the tribals I guess?

Let me make my pretzels

[tawny juniper]

It's kind of supposed to fun for everyone

[hoary dawn]

things that have to happen for you to enslave a dinosaur:

-first you have to find and/or trap a dinosaur, this is not a process that is guaranteed to work so its up to chance whether it does or not

-once the dinosaur is where you want it you have to subdue it without killing it, this means having enough manpower to take it down, this part of the process is the most skill based but could still go either way if you are taming something big

-after you subdue it, there is a high chance it'll just let itself die because no one wants to waste their time being a slave. you only get to keep the dino if by chance the player is not okay with losing progress they have a high chance of losing anyway

-now you have enslaved a dinosaur, you must now keep it weak so it does not have the strength to fight back. of course, there's only so much you can do with a weak dinosaur so the whole endevor is only worth it if you can find something to use it for

-you could technically use it for combat on things that aren't as strong as it but that also is completely dependant on the chance that you find something to fight it in the time you have it captive, which would only be a couple hours since maintaining it would not be fun after a period of time

all of these extremely unlikely things all have to happen one after the other for you to reap the very limited rewards of enslaving another player, a better way to implement this mechanic would be to let an ai take control of the player's body when the tribals subdue it so the player can accept that they lost a fight and move on, and the tribal still gets their slave.

[feral solstice]

Though how could an ai slave work?

Like is it just an ARK tame essentially?

[tawny juniper]

You're not supposed to see a difference between players and ai

[hoary dawn]

i dont want it, its just better than player slavery

[feral solstice]

https://tenor.com/view/we-shall-see-leonardo-di-caprio-smoking-gif-10168634

[hoary dawn]

i doubt ai is gonna be that good

[feral solstice]

It’s almost impossible to make ai that good

[tawny juniper]

it won't be

But that's the intention

[meager tiger]

Rickard you're still arguing about this stuff. Jesus lol

I went on break and I come back after my shift

[meager tiger]

@dire mulch it should depend on what kind of herbivore. Like those chicken ostrich things are runners

[paper oriole]

defensive herbivores like trike, steg and anky will/are already be balanced by their shitty speed. flight herbivores should have good stam, and aggressive herbivores dont need to be ruined

ruining herbivores wont stop kfs it will only change what dinos people use to do it

[meager tiger]

what about the ostrich ones

[paper oriole]

like galli? good speed and stam, no strong running attacks

[meager tiger]

Naked skinny thing

[paper oriole]

easy

[meager tiger]

Yea

[paper oriole]

no machine gun kick galli, as fun as it was

[meager tiger]

I agree

Its a runner

Its first instinct should be to run

[paper oriole]

it could still stop to kick some defenseless juvie to death, just not while sprinting

[honest sparrow]

Agreed, give it actual machine guns attached to its legs

[vale pawn]

have the machine guns shoot legs

[paper oriole]

excellent idea

[meager tiger]

Would gally even be smart enough to attack something smaller

i picture it a bird brain moron

and runs even after the slightlest threat

[paper oriole]

have galli detach its limbs to reveal gatling guns in the limb sockets

[honest sparrow]

Birds are pretty smart, and I think Galli is smart enough irl to stomp the ever living shit out of something

[sacred moat]

Have tribals tame Gali and use machine guns while they ride into battle

[vale pawn]

give galli rocket boosters so no one is safe

[meager tiger]

wait are gallys closely related to birds

or just raptors

[paper oriole]

galli needs emu animations

[sacred moat]

If I’m not mistaken I think they are theropods

[meager tiger]

I know they are in the same hip branch lizard hip vs bird hipp

[paper oriole]

https://tenor.com/view/emu-jump-freakout-gif-5329771

[icy lion]

galli is an ornithomimid

[paper oriole]

i need this

[meager tiger]

which branch are birds from

[karmic plank]

lol

[meager tiger]

did all of todays birds come from one dinosaur

or multiple

[honest sparrow]

multiple

[paper oriole]

just make galli flail like a maniac while it runs some poor juvie down and stomps them into the shadow realm

[sacred moat]

Also is it just me, or does it feel like Utah isn’t moving fast enough to do the drift thing

[meager tiger]

wait theres mutliple bird ancesotr species

[dire mulch]

Tenos mainly

They choose to hunt carnis way too often

[honest sparrow]

dryos also hunt everything

[paper oriole]

carnis are faster, they can get distance and wallow lol

i think dryo is done with its reign of bloodlust

[dire mulch]

Utahs aren’t faster

[honest sparrow]

stego and hypsi simply don't have the capability to effectively hunt

[paper oriole]

arent utahs like 6kmh faster

[dire mulch]

Nope

[honest sparrow]

utahs are faster than tenos now

they were the same speed briefly

[dire mulch]

Ive been caught up as a Utah so many times

In a straight line

[icy lion]

utahs are faster than tenos

at least theyre supposed to be

[dire mulch]

I can never outrun them

[honest sparrow]

then idk what to tell you

[dire mulch]

And their stam lasts longer than a carno I swear

[icy lion]

it doesnt

wait

yes