math-and-meta

[oblique hollow]

it should be with the fuel gens

[thorn bane]

jetpack though

[fringe pawn]

Or jetpack

[oblique hollow]

packager

[bleak pulsar]

I have a lot to discover in this game except the damn stinger

[vapid gorge]

hmmmm. I'm not sure that's a huge deal.

[thorn bane]

so fuel unlocked in packager?
but then what about fuel gens

[oblique hollow]

you need the packager milestone anyway

and that needs basic oil

[bleak pulsar]

Im scared of spider an archphonobia mode made it even scarier

[remote ice]

they call it arachnophobia mode because if you weren't afraid of spiders before, you will be now.

[thorn bane]

also fuel gens milestone is expensive af
50HMFs 100 computers????

[oblique hollow]

or, if anything, the residual fuel recipe should be in the fuel gen milestone

[bleak pulsar]

I need mod that remove stinger

[remote ice]

milestones are expensive?

[thorn bane]

that one yes

[bleak pulsar]

Just like subnautica lol

[thorn bane]

i dont want to setup computer and HMF automatization just to get my jetpack?

[vapid gorge]

There's one that just makes no agressive creatures? Peaceful Mode or something

[bleak pulsar]

Noice

But i still dont like seeing them,but making them peaceful is good enough

[remote ice]

AKA update 6

[oblique hollow]

again, i changed my mind to residual fuel recipe

you get your basic oil to fuel recipe

[remote ice]

my world is so quiet now. Peaceful, but quiet...

[oblique hollow]

but no heavy oil to fuel until fuel gen

[thorn bane]

oh sure

[vapid gorge]

I haven't done experimental yet, did they add a feature you could turn off the fauna?

[remote ice]

no they just broke creature spawns. I have literally not seen a single creature that is not a hatcher or tamed lizard doggo. They're all gone.

[vapid gorge]

XD

[bleak pulsar]

That is just too good to me

[thorn bane]

@oblique hollow i guess its the same as unlocking the blender but no recipe for it

[oblique hollow]

kinda......

[copper stag]

plese help i need to split from 60 items into 20 conveyors of 3 per minute

[still trout]

don't

use a manifold

[copper stag]

ill give it a shot i guess

[remote ice]

3 per minute

[cinder silo]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GW_Iu_upgCA&list=PLQo-FPWWaZE-jn38NUxfxh5S2VyJNjnO3&index=19 1-20 load balance tutorial.

[remote ice]

imagine splitting a mk5 belt into 3 items/minute without a manifold

[cinder silo]

Unless doing balancing radioactive items to cut area irradiation I think its better off just using a manifold.

Though some huge manifolds take ages to start up, there is a good argument to having several parallel manifolds fed by a 1-3 or more balancer to cut startup times from half an hour to a minute or so.

[tawny chasm]

M A N I F O L D

C O M P L Y

[wind spade]

🇲 🇦 🇳 🇮 🇫 🇴 🇱 🇩

[cinder silo]

Hah, C'mon you guys know I manifold pretty much everything, except fuel rods 🤣

[tawny chasm]

yeah when i finally do nuclear power i want to use a balancer and probably pick the number of power plants to make that easier

not strictly necessary but should minimise radiation, right?

[wind spade]

just blenders 1:2 or 1:3 (based on recipe) to nuclear plants 😛

no balancing necessary

[gentle berry]

To minimize radiation just build all your nuclear stuff in an isolated area

[tawny chasm]

neato, i haven't crunched the numbers or plans yet at all

i'd like to think i'd have spotted that though, upon finally looking at it in more detail 😄

[opal flicker]

how do y'all start to planify builds ? I want to make a big power plant but I'm fairly certain I'm going to end up lacking space, or maybe just it ending in a mess 😅

[wind spade]

map is gigantic and you can utilse 3D space, it's very unlikely (almost impossible) to run out of space

[opal flicker]

I mean run out of allocated space, for instance the platform I initially built isn't big enough

[glad vigil]

Find large flat surface

For example, ocean

[ember shale]

Intentionally oversize your platform and then downsize on build complete.

[glad vigil]

You will never run out of space while building there

[ember shale]

tl;dr, Cropping

[opal flicker]

fair enough to both lmao, I was planning to make that plant on ocean tbh, will need so much refineries and stuff I hope I can make it not look like a mess

[ember shale]

That is the joy of the game. No prototyping, we do it live

[opal flicker]

you don't say

[ember shale]

lol

[opal flicker]

my latest attempt at an oil plant was an awful mess, it just didn't work

[ember shale]

I made my coal plant on update 4 when i started, and was so proud. So neat and clean, no clipping issues

Then they added soft clipping and floor holes and my factory was suddenly an abomination

It was a great day for science.

[opal flicker]

yeah I remember that moment

[ember shale]

(I am not science.)

[opal flicker]

it hurt a lot

[ember shale]

But, good luck out there. Don't let a rogue wave take you out.

[opal flicker]

thanks, i'll build sea walls

[oblique hollow]

wha... since when are external emotes allowed

[opal flicker]

good question

[oblique hollow]

well thats interesting

[ember shale]

Bug

[oblique hollow]

#BlameHannah

[gentle berry]

Can walls even block water? Or is it just for aesthetics

[ember shale]

Better. It's for memes.

I don't think water displaces though, I accidentally made room under my coal plant when building to the lake floor, and it remained full of water despite being completely enclosed.

[gentle berry]

When will limited terraforming (you build a box in the ground, and it’s hollow, no ground inside) and water displacement be a thing?

Would be cool to build underground things

[ember shale]

functional underground things.

[gentle berry]

Yes

[ember shale]

Can already build useless underground and underwater things, lol.

[gentle berry]

Also, pulse cluster gas nuke nobelisks when

[ember shale]

C'mon modbois

[gentle berry]

No, in vanilla

[ember shale]

O

♾️

[opal flicker]

Automating cartridges is absolute hell wtf

[ember shale]

Like, rifle ones? (I don't know if there are even other kinds, so I ask in ignorance)

[median heath]

Not sure what you're finding "hell" about rifle bullet automation tbh.

[median heath]

I'm doing more testing but I believe they fixed mk2's in U6.

[worldly vector]

what mk2? Miners?

[median heath]

Pipes.
Mk2 miners have always worked.

[worldly vector]

What did you test with them?

The backflow?

Or other things like sloshing

[median heath]

sloshing. It's still there but more stable than it was.

[light fox]

quick question, how would i balance 120 to 45 (120 from the source, smelter is 45 for 15 per minute)?\

[viral raptor]

do you have splitters and overclocking available?

[light fox]

uh yeah

that would probably change it

[viral raptor]

so what i do is have 3 smelters. 2 going at full 45. with last 1 underclocked to 30

[light fox]

oh i just overclocked the miner, but thanks for reminding me about the fact that overclocking and underclocking exists

[viral raptor]

yea. i usually underclock for power reasons.

and you dont need powercores to underclock

[median heath]

Manifold it.

[gentle berry]

Does this math make sense to y'all? I got 4 belts with 75 ppm and 3 with 120 ppm. I split each of the 75 ppm into 3, giving me 12 belts of 25 ppm, and each of the 120 ppm belts for 6 60 ppm belts then each of those by 3 for 18 20 ppm belts and merge 12 of those with the 25 ppm belts giving me 12 belts of 45 ppm and an extra 6 20 ppm belts

[wind spade]

It doesn't make sense to me, why would I do that

[gentle berry]

Just realized I messed up my calculations

[wind spade]

if I have belts with items, I connect those to existing buildings 🤔

[zinc eagle]

what is manfolding? sounds very manly

[soft scarab]

!wikisearch manifold

[shadow prairie]

https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/Special:Search?query=manifold

[zinc eagle]

ah

this works only when u have more input that u actually need

but im using this for output

like always

its a nice way to merge stuff like this

[soft scarab]

It works when you have the exact amount of input as what you need

[burnt wraith]

unless there's a bottleneck, the ratio of input:output is the same regardless of how you connect the belts to the machines

[crisp perch]

2x2+#+cal+sh+1+2001+2001 what is this math meta or noot a meta

[burnt wraith]

load balancing just synchronizes the machines

[wind spade]

It works no matter what

[zinc eagle]

whaaat how?

ohh smart splitters? :thonk?

[soft scarab]

No, just regular splitters

[tropic hawk]

So it works like this: machine 1 takes half the input until it's buffer is full and the belt packs up. The next machine repeats it and so on until finally the input amount is balanced among the machines.

[crude coyote]

Thanos plays Satisfactory. Demands balance in all things

Disappointed to hear of splitter duplication.

[tropic hawk]

Found another one!

[vapid gorge]

It balances itself out. The first machines fill up faster and the overflow goes to the next and so on

[zinc eagle]

oh i see that makes sense

[median heath]

Simpler math:
4x75=300
3×120=360
300+360=660
780>660

Merge to single belt and manifold.

[median heath]

Rarely need smart splitters until you get into mixed belts. 😁

[maiden musk]

is an iron plate or iron rod factory more important to make in the early game

[zinc eagle]

both

[maiden musk]

to make first

[vapid gorge]

Both. Best to find 1 node for screws 1 for plate and one for rods

If you go hunting for a few hard drives now you might find the recipe for cast screws.
Skips the rod step

[maiden musk]

I usually make one for rods and screws and one for iron plates

[median heath]

And then you get more recipes so you stop using Screws 👉👉

[brittle flint]

what recipes do i need 2 stop using screws because im crying right now i need 400 screws per minute so i closed the game thinking dang i need 10 screw constructors 😭

[median heath]

What tier are you in?

[brittle flint]

all escept 4

how many thousands of hard drives do i need

this is the numbers chat

you should know

[median heath]

That's not how tiers work...

[brittle flint]

teir 8

i need the last thing

[median heath]

Stitched Plate or Adhered Plate takes them out of RIPs.
Crystal Comp or Caterium Comp takes them out of Computers.
Heavy Encased Frame takes them out of HMFs.

[brittle flint]

ok

i will try get them

thanks 😃

[median heath]

Only thing Screws should be used for is Copper Rotor.
But if you want to completely eliminate them, use Steel Rotor (but it is less efficient)

[glad vigil]

Steel rotor takes them out of rotors

[brittle flint]

ok

[forest blade]

recipes unlock based on what tier and goods you can produce, so if you want to eliminate some screw stuff for early game production try to get some early to not be subject to the 80ish alt recipe pool once you're late game

or produce screws locally if absolutely necessary

or import precursor ingredients to the factory needing it

[brittle flint]

ok

[gentle berry]

Turns out I actually only needed 2 120 belts. Was setting it up last night, and connected them to a splitter, but forgot to split again so I only had 6 of my 25 belts recieving items so I thought I didn’t have enough.

[median heath]

540 is still less than 780.
So put on one belt instead of doing complex splitter stuff. 🤷‍♂️

[gentle berry]

I only need 540

[median heath]

That's what I just said.

[gentle berry]

And I can’t put on 1 belt, I only have mk 2

[median heath]

Clarify that at the beginning of your question next time.

[gentle berry]

Ok

[median heath]

Because if you just ask how to split things, we are going to assume you have mk5s and tell you not to.

[gentle berry]

Why is that?

[median heath]

Because the only reasons to ever do balancing are:

1. Reduce radiation in nuclear facilities
2. Because you feel like doing them and making things more complicated for yourself

Nodes are infinite.
Everything can be manifolded because it will autobalance itself with time.

[gentle berry]

Oh ok

[hollow juniper]

sorry just want someone to check this
got 5.5 copper being produced
1092 goes to one array and the rest goes to another

if i have 1X780 conveyer and a 480 conveyer smart spliting overflow to the Other array

that means the 1092 overflows into the Other array right?

and i can just load balance the excess

first big factory so im just wondering

[dense zinc]

So i shouldnt have to worry about manifolding when my input is equal to my need if i fill the belts before starting?

[burnt wraith]

manifolding works whether you have less, equal, or more than what you need

[dense zinc]

oop yeah i think i got you

I'm still new to satisfactory, so to make sure, does the splitter like remember where to output next thus even if there was longer delay it would split equally?

[burnt wraith]

The splitter outputs to each output in order. If it can't, it skips that one.

[dense zinc]

I see, thanku ❤️

[median heath]

You have 5.5 Copper.
Then you magically have 1092 Copper.

Confusion.

[hollow juniper]

no sorry im still having my brain melt over numbers

5.5k is how much im producing for my factory

thats then going to 2 other machine arrays, 1 needs 1092 copper, the other needs the 4k~

heres the factory tools link https://www.satisfactorytools.com/production?share=PiWBgpo5nO5pDzCBoZaD

copper is closer to the bottom

[median heath]

Oh yeah, if you need 1092 you can send 2 belts that way and either reroute excess back to main, or have the second belt sent as a smart that prioritizes that direction and sends excess back with the other 4k.

[hollow juniper]

i had this all last night but ofc me at 4am is a totaly different person

ok cool thanks

[vapid gorge]

Just looking at your chat- my suggestion : if you have those 2 groups of ingots you need going then set up your refineries to be clocked so you can send the 1092 on two belts without needing to do overflow.

It’s a bit of a neater way to do it and I feel it’s good practice to keep production lines as seperate as pos

[fierce ruin]

i surely wonder what i spawned

IT FUCKING WORKS

[proven sphinx]

anyone here familiar with satisfactory tools?

[wind spade]

a bit, why?

[proven sphinx]

nvm

im stupid :D

[wind spade]

what happened?

[cedar mica]

I assume that if the calculator says I will need around 200GW, I should not attempt to overclock it?

[proven sphinx]

i just looked at some numbers and iddnt get them to add up, but they did after i got some fresh air

[tropic hawk]

I mean you could... But it would be more power

[cedar mica]

250% OC is 5x the power? So 1TW is needed then

[zinc eagle]

as i can see

uranium is pretty limited

is the math of max atomic generator pinned somewhere here?

[small shoal]

will manifold reach 100% efficiency even if the constructors are consuming different levels of items

[cedar mica]

It will self balance, given enough time

[tropic hawk]

252 reactors at 100% clockspeed

With zero net waste

[zinc eagle]

thank you c:

[timber flare]

If i remember correctly such a setup requires 6300 quickwire/m Its a big but fun project

And thats just one thing

[topaz hedge]

rookie numbers :p

Ah, the spire coast rebuild. The curved arrows between the recycled loops are new.. that's a nice touch

[median heath]

True.

[wind spade]

well... new = like 6 months old 😄

[vapid gorge]

250% oc atm works out to be about +1/3 overall power I think

Which isn't a heck of a lot

[cedar mica]

It seems to be a little over 4x the amount of power, at 250% vs 100%.

[vapid gorge]

But you require far fewer machines

[cedar mica]

Yes, but when I push 200GW with base clock speed, its not really possible, even if I can squeese in nuclear to find the 800GW needed

[vapid gorge]

Again, if you are overclocking X amount of machines making Y number of items, OC 250% per machine does work out to be 400% but you need to then reduce the number of machines at thta power since you need fewer machines if each is doing 2.5 the work.

Last I looked it worked out at about +1/3 extra power from based

[cedar mica]

2 machines at 250% replaces 5 machines worth of product, yet uses the power of 8-9. Saying it like that, puts it at closer to 2x...

[vapid gorge]

it uses the power of about 4 and a bit machines

Then you divide by 2.5 in number of machines saved. And that's the MAX number

It'll be lower than that because in practical reality you won't get manifolds all needing to be at 250%. Because the way recipes work mine tend to sit at 220% on avg and that's a significant decrease in consumption

So at most you're looking at like (200GW * 4.1 power ~) / (2.5)

but again in practical terms it'll be less since you won't have everything at 250% realistically

[cursive garnet]

It's 4 times as much power but you're only reducing the number of machines by 1.5, making it incredibly inefficient

So essentially, you're using 2.5x the power to produce the same amount of items

[vapid gorge]

if you have 10 machines at 100% and want to do the same job overclocking them at 250% you only need 4 machines to do the same work.
So you divide the total number of overclocked machines by 2.5.

I'm not looking at the numbers but from memory I think a machine clocked at 250% might be around 430% power, but since you divide the number of machines by 2.5 it works out to 72% more power used. However you're never likely to overclock every recipe by nearly that much just because numbers don't match up.

If you would like to provide the math at how you get 'it uses 250% more power' go for it. But I'm pretty certain I'm right here just from my own figures and from the multiple people who've talked about there being more nuclear power available on the map than an extremely massive and overclocked world production can use

[frosty owl]

One machine at 250% consumes ~1.8 times what 3 machines consume (100+100+50)
Also @cursive garnet I guess

So, less than double the power in the worst case scenario

Someone in #off-topic-general might be willing to help you with homework

[cursive garnet]

Ima just say this, machines clocked at 250% use ~1.7 times the energy per item compared to a machine clocked at 100%, meaning it's less efficient to OC machines than it is to just leave them at 100%. Meaning no matter what, if you OC the array of machines that requires 200GW, it WILL consume more power (1.7ish times as much)

[frosty owl]

Define "less efficient"

[cursive garnet]

It's extremely obvious that in the context of that message, I'm referring to the efficiency of power usage per unit item produced. While more SPACE efficient, I specifically mention "energy per item". Please stop being intentionally dense :)

[frosty owl]

Please stop assuming people are acting some way... Especially if they're not 🙃

[cursive garnet]

Idk man, context clues :)

[frosty owl]

I guess context wasn't enough to make an accurate assumption on my tone 🤷‍♂️

But yeah, underclocking is power efficient, overclocking is not. That is the basic with OC (and a big reason why there were talks about chanign it)

[vapid gorge]

I mean you did literally say 2.5x the power rather than 1.7x

Also ignoring that’s a theoretical maximum in that your manifolds won’t be clocked all at 250% because recipe numbers don’t match like that

[frosty owl]

So, bottom line: is overclocking your machines "efficienct"?
Power-wise? - No
Time-wise/buildcount-wise? - likely and yes
Why? - power is <20% of total building count. If one OCs everything at 200% they'll require 1/2 of the 80% of machines and keep the remaining ~20% but with double clock to provide double power

[cursive garnet]

Debatable if it's truly more efficient time wise because you have to factor in the time it takes to collect the power slugs (potentially 3 power shards per machine with potentially hundreds of machines) it could take 10s of hours just running around the map and collecting all of them

[frosty owl]

To clarify: the "likely" referred to time efficiency, "yes" to buildcount

[cursive garnet]

I'm aware

And that "likely" is what I was referring to

[frosty owl]

Just clarifying.
I though it was obvious that one's playstyle would impact that

[cursive garnet]

If you're talking just the building and OCing, yeah, it takes less time, but take into account time spent gathering power slugs and there's no way it is

I can't really think of a playstyle that would mean you have hundreds of powershards by not going and intentionally looking for them tbh

[frosty owl]

Eh, debatable, just as you said.
If one can gather shards easily enough, the math says time can be saved, that's my point.
If overclockedmachines consumed (just throwing numbers) ~4 times as much instead of x2, I wouldn't be making such a point

[vapid gorge]

Sprint through the landscape for a couple hours with blade runners and sensor. You rack them up

[cursive garnet]

A) they do consume 4 times as much, just about 4.3 times as much actually, compared to a machine clocked at 100%. The difference is energy per unit of item (which is only 1.7 times as much.) B) Even if you're using the map and trying to optimize to gain power slugs, collecting enough to get say, 300 powershards is still going to take quite a while, and that would only be enough for 100-150 machines (clocked around 200-250%)

When you're at the scale of hundreds of GW, you would need a truly massive amount of shards

[frosty owl]

Sure... That's taking a specific example to make the point though 🤷‍♂️
Generally speaking, given aviable shards, overclocking is a good way to save on time.
I believe the "collecting shard" part should be kept out of the convo if we want to keep it generic, as everyone will collect however many however fast they like

But I think we can safely assume that anyone might have some shards to spare, at which point: is it efficient to use it on machines to save on machines....? (yes)

[vapid gorge]

You can get a thousand pretty quickly? There’s 1400 available w/o doggo farming.

And again, that 70%+~ relies on every machine in a manifold set to that. Which is unlikely.

Most of mine set up for smallest space tends to be 220% on avg which is actually a significant drop from theoretical maximum

And completely ignoring that, this was first about someone saying it was 400% more power total after everything
Second you going on about it being 250%

You are free to go ‘farming them isn’t worth it’ but that’s a subjective opinion

[cursive garnet]

"Significant drop" incorrect sir, power per item goes down from ~1.7 times normal to ~1.6 at 220% so meh

[vapid gorge]

Are you now trying to say 10% of an overall system use isn’t significant xD

[cursive garnet]

You're taking those numbers out of context so seeing as how you don't care about truth, I'm gonna end this here :)

[vapid gorge]

Which still deflects from you not going ‘oh damn, it’s not 250% the power , my bad’

[cursive garnet]

What?

[frosty owl]

||Username checks out
**[sarcasm disclaimer, this is a joke] **||

[cursive garnet]

Granted yes, I was wrong, but then again I was also going off incomplete data (which is why as soon as I decided to go to the wiki and do the math myself with the actual formula for the stuff, it chained)

Crazy how proper data can change answers

[strong patio]

Can someone help me with how to spilt the iron rods? Output is 295/min

[magic egret]

build a manifold

[strong patio]

K

I'll search it up

[magic egret]

basically have one belt with the rods and the constructors in a row with a splitter going off the main belt for each constructor

[glad vigil]

It doesn’t matter how you split these, eventually everything will start working properly as long as the belts throughput allows

[tawny chasm]

basically if you manage supply and demand accurately, you don't need to perfectly split/balance things

but yeah, manifold 😄

!wikisearch manifold

[shadow prairie]

https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/Special:Search?query=manifold

[cedar mica]

I have started doing a hybrid. I still use manafold, but try to use all the ports of the splitter/merger. More logistics is in theory more lag then more belt usage.

[magic egret]

thats just the inversion of the double manifold, with the splitters in the middle and the mergers outside

works fine too

[cedar mica]

Mergers on the outside, has 1 port free, most of the time. I try to reduce that as well

[tropic cape]

Is it really a good idea to give the MAM a bunch of AI Limiters? What if ADA reverse engineers them and finds a way to bypass them?

[magic egret]

haha

theyre not to limit ai, they work with ai

its an ai powered limiter not a limiter for ai

[tropic cape]

The description says they prevent AI from evolving in malicious ways

[magic egret]

oh really

ive never actually read that but the other way makes more sense

[frosty owl]

Well, an easy way to have close to "ideal" beltwork (amount-wise) would be just having all your production in a series of double manifolds (referring to the picture/link above)

[tropic cape]

It does make more sense the other way. That's what I assumed it was too

[cedar mica]

The ideal, would probably be as close to direct feeding as you can. Minimizes belts and logic needed.

[frosty owl]

Direct feeding and manifold can compete quite well...
I'm not sure one can always win over the other in this regard

[cedar mica]

The main problem with direct feeding, is the amount of space you need, in 1 location

[frosty owl]

If you include layoung out belts nicely, manifolds has an advantage all the time

[magic egret]

connect every machine output directly to a machine input and have lots of machines

1m belts only challenge

[frosty owl]

Eh, belt-wide it doesn't mean much... Unless you need to extend many belts to reach locations that become c"farther away" due to building like that

[cedar mica]

Dont work with multi intput, given the space each machine needs. Like 4 assemblers into a manufacturer.

[cinder silo]

I'm guilty of extended belts of many, too long to even weld them without crashing the game.

[frosty owl]

Try me
||Don't, I'm in burnout||

[cedar mica]

I mean like making turbo motors, from ore to finish product, in 1 location.

[cinder silo]

I've looked at trucks & trains but always ended up back at the belts because I could never seem to keep throughput constant.

And the stations take up a ton of space.

[cedar mica]

Also, 1m is 1/8 of a foundation, so thats machines "kissing". Which further makes it "impossible" with multi input/output machines. I'm sure somewhere there is a clipping setup that makes it work, but good luck.

[magic egret]

i wonder how long it takes for one mk1 belt to carry an item all the way around along the edges of the map

i thought the foundations are 4m wide

[cinder silo]

LGIO conveyor weave just within the grassy fields took coal three hours to traverse (mk1 belt)

[frosty owl]

Oh, got it now
But still, the output is just ~one belt. Not much of a big deal (logistically) to bring wherever, right?

[magic egret]

belts cost fps though

so if you have a ton trains would be better

[cedar mica]

Belts costs FPS yes, but splitters and mergers probably costs more per foundation filled.

[frosty owl]

Imo, the ideal would be a mix of (leaving ~10% of beltwork for pure "transport belts" from places to factories):

1. Manifolds: lots of them, maybe >30% of total beltwork
2. Direct feed: I think this could work for <30% of beltwork
3. Load-balancing: <20%
4. Sushi-load-balancig: <5%

Rougg numbers, but I'm fairly confident in the order they have

Though, again, I'm a bit on the edge between manifold and direct feed....

[frosty owl]

Dunno...
The only time Devs mentioned it they were vague and didn't seem to think splitters (or even smart splitters) could cost a noticeable amount more than belts in terms of game resources. I think it's fair to think of them as 1 or 2 belt segments each (2 for programmable ones...?)

[cedar mica]

Its the "check where resource are and where they are going part", that might make lots of splitters and mergers, slow the game down.

[frosty owl]

I would think so too, but they never confirmed that 🤷‍♂️

Tbf, I don't think it's that obvious between who requires how much more CPU resources than who between "constantly check what goes where" and "move stuff and render it/make it interactive"

[cedar mica]

Guess you would need to make a map with the extreme of each version and see if there is any FPS difference.

[proven sphinx]

im in a bit of a dilemma with my setup for copper, i need 3165.17 copper ore pr min to go into 210.994 refineries (Pure copper ingot) , i place them 26 in each row and providing 50 with input from the middle.
That means i need 520 water for each row and 780 ore per min, but i still have 3 more refineries to put down , and i can't overclock without needing an extra belt to provide the last ore cause im using 780 on the input ore..
how would you split 211 refineries in a ocd friendly way ?

[remote ice]

you need 3165.17 copper ingots per minute? If so that number is way off, pure copper ingots is 35/min in a refinery

90.433428571428571428571428571429 refineries, not 210.994

oh im dumb it's 37.5/min not 35, so 84.40453_ refineries

[vapid gorge]

Depends how tight you define ‘1 location’. I’ve got raw goods from not tooo far a distance coming in and I’m pretty sure my planner for turbo motors is crafted ore to final product in one spot

[proven sphinx]

Thats copper ore , i need 7910,4 Ingots per min, sorry if i wrote my question badly .. x)

[remote ice]

hmm. Well personally, i'd just overclock them all to 250%

but setting up the infrastructure for slug production is... involved.

[proven sphinx]

wait, i can make a production on slugs? x) or did you mean my setup with slugs?

[remote ice]

sorta

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e8mMBFtCWdU

this isn't actually the final version of it, so if you want to make one i can show you the improved version

[proven sphinx]

so you make a script making your charater doing that automatically, and u also would need a huge amount of lizzard doggos ofc

[remote ice]

yes. Specifically, that's all of them

well, all except 2, because i originally had it set up for a multiple of 8 i think

[proven sphinx]

xD our doggos are just bugged.. we had 5, they stopped giving us stuff

[remote ice]

i spent dozens of hours collecting every lizard doggo on the map

it was a involved process. I even had to make a tool to make a map of where they all were, since there wasn't one available.

[proven sphinx]

you are my hero, but thats to much work for us to be honest!

[remote ice]

fair enough

still, it's great for pure recipe setups

2.5x less refineries

[proven sphinx]

also since 5 of our doggos isnt even working im assuming thats a lot of work for nothing in the end if they all do that

[proven sphinx]

true, but we need 2600 buildings in total, and thats not taking electriicty into mind... so overclocking is our last resort

[remote ice]

doggos not working is odd... maybe it's a update 6 thing? Never happened to me on U5

[proven sphinx]

most likely amongst other bugs, they got out of our closure and stopped giving us stuff all 5 of them

[remote ice]

multiplayer is a lot more bug-prone so that might be a factor too

[median heath]

Multiplayer Broken. Plz Fix .

[cursive garnet]

I probably wouldn't rely on mk5s to do exactly 780. I'd probably set it up so each one is doing 750ish/min

[remote ice]

is there a issue with MK5s at full throughput?

[median heath]

There is an issue with all belts at full throughput, you just don't notice it until mk5s.

And it happens at belt-to-belt connections, so there are ways around it and you can get the full 780 if you build properly.

[remote ice]

does it happen at belt-lift connections?

[median heath]

Not 100% sure on that tbh.

[remote ice]

or for that matter, lift-lift connections

finally a use for horizontal lifts

[finite sun]

all of the throughput issues (mk2 pipes, mk5 belts) are at least partially performance-related. Meaning, depending on your PC and setups, you might not experience them. Or you might.

[magic island]

I think it would happen anywhere two segments connect (whether they're belts or lifts). if it's an issue with the transfer of items from one segment to another, lifts wouldn't be exempt

[cedar mica]

I think its the same issue, that causes duplications using splitters. The game tries to figure out where the item is and gets it wrong. Be it 2 places at once or no place.

[waxen moss]

I have finally completed my map wide circuit

[zinc eagle]

how much waste produces/min in a 100% uran generator?

[cinder silo]

Hmm, I get 1050 uranium waste from 21 fuel rods per minute, I can't recall the max rods per minute though so calculating it just didn't work.

[remote ice]

i know the max plutonium waste per minute is something like 250

[zinc eagle]

ooof ill have to check it

[cinder silo]

The number of uranium waste is probably like 2500ish, I run 100 reactors, I've seen people going on about having 252, but I don't know if that also includes plutonium or not.

[zinc eagle]

for 1 reactor

/min on 100%

[cinder silo]

Oh crap, I thought you meant 100% maxed uranium not one reactor.

[zinc eagle]

i couldnt find the output here :c

[remote ice]

oh you mean for one reactor?

[zinc eagle]

yes xD

[cinder silo]

50 waste per 10m iirc

[remote ice]

uranium rod is 5 minutes, plutonium rod is 10 minutes. 50 waste per uranium rod, 10 per plutonium rod iirc

[zinc eagle]

so 5 /min?

[cinder silo]

Oops misremembered

[remote ice]

and this all doubles at max overclock (the times, not the relative waste amount)

[cinder silo]

10 waste per min hah, 50 per rod

[zinc eagle]

okay 10 waste/min thanks

[remote ice]

the figure of "250 plutonium waste per minute" i was talking about is if you use all the uranium on the map to make as much of it as possible

[ember shale]

Nice. Very jealous of your time to be able to do this kind of stuff... Takes me forever just to unlock a train in the first place, lol

[glad vigil]

1 reactor is 10/min

Uranium waste

10 reactors is 100 waste/min, which is enough to supply 1 particle accelerator at 100% speed making plutonium pellets if you use default recipes

[fresh mesa]

Need some help figuring the math on this. 50 coal gens, all OC'd to the max. Three pure coal nodes are nearby. What is the ppm needed to maintain a constant feed for them?

[burnt wraith]

check how much coal 1 gen needs and multiply by 50

[deft lichen]

OCing isn't linear so beware very ugly numbers

one coal generator at 250% requires 30.35281 coal / min and 91.05844 m3 water / min

[fresh mesa]

so 30.5 (just to be safe) x 50 would be about 1525

[deft lichen]

there is a clock speed that gives precisely 2x rates (this is roughly 2.02x), if you want nice numbers

[thorn bane]

so OC to 2^1.3 so its 2x input and 2x output

[deft lichen]

"246.2288%"

[thorn bane]

"100*2^1.3"

[deft lichen]

then one takes 30 coal and 90 m3 water per min

[median heath]

Is this rounded?

[median heath]

Damn.
Is there any setting that the clock % is within the 4 decimal limit that actually gives a decent number?

[burnt wraith]

100%

I really don't know why generators are like this

[median heath]

Power isn't linear.

[fresh mesa]

so if you double 246 due to them being all OC? Both miners need 492ppm?

[burnt wraith]

power is definitely linear unless you change clock speed

[deft lichen]

make it exactly 246.2288%, then it acts as if one generator was two at 100%

there are plans to make OCing linear and I think they're asking the community for feedback

[burnt wraith]

I understand making production buildings nonlinear but I can't think of a good reason to also make generators nonlinear

[median heath]

OCing overall doesn't need to be linear.
Power generators and mainly their UI is the primary issue.

[thorn bane]

pretty sure thats impossible due to exponentials returning irrational numbers

[median heath]

Sad face.

[proven prawn]

wow the production planner is even more broken now somewhow....Unfortunately we couldn't calculate any result, well ok then

[deft lichen]

yeah I concur that it's not a big problem with production buildings as it makes bigger factories more challenging, but generator numbers are plain weird

I'm not saying "make it easier", rather "make it less weird"

[proven prawn]

it like everytime i look at this, it just gets more and more broken, which is great👀

[magic island]

yeah, whether it's linear or not, I would just like the formula for OC power generators to be tuned so it has clean numerical breakpoints with each added shard.

and also to accurately display the resulting power consistently, instead of showing the real number vs the fake number

[wind spade]

246.2289% is pretty good tbh

[median heath]

When have I ever settled for "pretty good"?

[vapid gorge]

How dare you leave yourself wide open like that

Here I am, trying to take the high ground…

[wind spade]

idk, don't overclock if you're not happy with imperfections that are nothing compared to game's imperfect precision 🤷‍♂️

[median heath]

That's why I don't OC gens 😉

[magic island]

if they are discussing ways to make power easier, I think it'd be fun if turbofuel actually boosted the amount of power a generator produces. would give it more of a kick when you upgrade.

the disillusionment when you first realize "yeah it's the exact same power output, you just make more generators for it" is a real bummer. when I hear the word turbo I want turbo results

[median heath]

They would have to change how every other fuel in every other type of generator worked... so I'm gonna have to say their vote would be no.

[wind spade]

nah they could just make a turbo gen 🤷‍♂️

[median heath]

Or they could not because there is no issue 🤷‍♂️

[magic island]

its just a regular gen with lightning bolts painted on

[median heath]

Because if turbo gen, why not compacted gen?
Why not coke gen?
Why not plutonium gen?

[wind spade]

that's what you say, but I think there is an issue with turbofuel 🤷‍♂️

[median heath]

You get introduced to the concept of "different things burn at different rates" the moment you put wood into a biogen instead of leaves.
If you were expecting turbofuel to behave any differently thats 100% entirely on you.

[wind spade]

no, I'm expecting turbofuel to be actually a viable option 🤷‍♂️

[median heath]

It is.

Just because nuclear is better doesn't mean turbo isn't viable.

Compacted Coal is the only non-viable fuel type.

[wind spade]

well yeah everything is viable, but it should feel viable 🤷‍♂️

currently it's mostly just ok fuel type with not much advantage from fuel (especially diluted)

[median heath]

It does.
It's more power than fuel, simpler than nuclear, no waste to deal with.

[wind spade]

agree to disagree I guess 🤷‍♂️

[magic island]

I'm really just talking from the fun/satisfaction standpoint anyway, not any serious beef with how fuel works in the game. It would be enjoyable for a fuel named "turbofuel" to turbocharge the generators that you pump it into. Or have other notably turbo use-cases

[median heath]

Bullets.

[frank mesa]

For me Nuclear is not an option yet, I play on a Dedi Server, and thus can't use mods to get rid of waste. So Turbofuel and Diluted Fuel are my options.

[median heath]

Recycle Uranium Waste to Plutonium Rods and sink.
Zero waste.
No mods.

[mystic moon]

You can get rid of waste via plutonium

[frank mesa]

That would be an option, after EA gets beyond Update 6, I would hate to redo Nuclear because of recipe changes

[mystic moon]

No recipie changes in u6

For nuclear anyways

[median heath]

You're going to have to redo everything due to recipe changes either at or before 1.0 when they do the recipe balance patch.

[frank mesa]

hence the "beyond" U6

[mystic moon]

IMO, it won't be feasible to keep a current salary e all the way through 1.0, so why not just play?

[median heath]

^

[frank mesa]

Redoing recipes and balances is less of a hassle in a non-nuclear world

[median heath]

Redoing your entire world is less of a hassle than redoing your entire world?

Ok...

[mystic moon]

For all you know, they might introduce whole new building in fuel processing and hardly change nuke. That'd be just as difficult to fix, and you could still advance in the meantime.

[median heath]

Or just build now knowing you're going to do a full hard-reset later. 🤷‍♂️

[frank mesa]

That's a decision I can make in the future, for now I've got plenty power non-nuclear.

Starting over is "plan-Y", where reconfiguring all existing factories is "plan-F"

[mystic moon]

I'm looking forward to an excuse to do a full reset

[burnt wraith]

sending package 4 is a good excuse to start a new world

[finite sun]

starting a new world doesn't even need an excuse anyway

you just start over and build new stuff. Or old stuff, if that's your fancy.

[mystic moon]

I'm dragging my feet a lot in current world, just don't want to start over yet

[frank mesa]

For now teaching my co-players sound building practices & logistics is "plan-A" 😉

No need to start over yet

The concept of building a large factory and using up all resources in up to a 500m radius (or slightly beyond if so required) still eludes them

This includes decision making in which recipe to use. Do I use the base recipe or the alt depending on the mix of resources available for a given rate of production of desired items.

That said, it's how we play the game, it might not be your style.

[burnt wraith]

that's a lot to learn in one playthrough

[frank mesa]

It's a work in progress, factories are built, and torn up.
Also I don't expect them to learn all in this playthrough

Mostly a "yes, nice factory, but I've built a better one" experience

And trying to showcase concepts of scale and modularity

[fleet turtle]

you don't need mods to get rid of nuclear waste, there are recipes for that to convert it and use awesome sink

[topaz hedge]

Yeah, I missed that. unless you burn plutonium (reprocessed waste) clean nuclear is a thing now..

[stone jetty]

I got a big question with a lot of different paths n recipes. But given Batteries, using all nodes on the map overclocked, power generation and everything else be damned. What is the highest possible battery per minute?

What resource would i cap out at first?

[soft scarab]

Try https://www.satisfactorytools.com/production

[stone jetty]

thanks

[stone jetty]

Does the calculator use overclocked buildings? If not, can I adjust that in the calculator? I want to max production and use as few buildings to do so.

[topaz hedge]

No

It shows how many machines you need at 100% clockspeed.

[stone jetty]

ah ok

[burnt wraith]

if it says 2.5 machines you could completely overclock one

[topaz hedge]

So, if it says you need 10 machines, if you overclocked them to 200% you'd build 5 and so on.

[burnt wraith]

up to you how you want to clock the buildings

if it says 34.6 machines you just need one machine at 3460%

[stone jetty]

I'll just do the bit of math to overclock at 250% Trying to use as few buildings. I'm gonna try maxing Uranium rods, store the power for a hour worth. Turn off everything, including rod production and go all in on battery for about a hour till the power storage runs down. Then turn uranium rods back on. going back and forth. So 3160 battery while rods are producing at max. Then 1,400 more for the hour with rods off.

[vapid gorge]

The maths won't work out in a way that every building will be at 250%, the recipes just match up for that to work evenly

[stone jetty]

Yae i realised that.

[stone jetty]

I am trying to use drones to collect Every node on the map at 250% It will be at a battery lose. But Just for nodes for uranium fuel rods and battery production, is at a battery gain. So it'll run at a battery loss till low, then go into battery making mode, refilling supplies. Cycling between max battery and max uranium rods. Still working on the math. But I think the drone powers on all nodes with 8 drone ports for pure, 6 for normal and 4 for normal. So a total of 213,000 power use for drone ports. Not including packed liquids. Not gonna pack water thou.

When do drone ports use power? all the time? or just when landing and taking off?

If i'm wrong please let me know XD

[vapid gorge]

All the time but I also think people have said you can generally do 1 drone per 150 pm so 2 drones on one landing pad should be fine for 1 poor quality node

[stone jetty]

I got a question about 2 drones on one port. but I'll go ask those in the questions n help section. I might be using 1 more drone then I need to deliver batteries to both ends on drone hubs.

[vagrant wyvern]

Hi, I'm new to the game and was trying to find out a way to solve this problem, could you help me, please?
I'm currently building a factory split into two parts, one makes reinforced plates and the other half makes rotors. Everything runs on a pure iron node (which will eventually be overclocked), as I'm limited by the mk2 belts right now I can only activate one half at a time. Is there a way to have a sort of "toggle switch" in order to turn on and of respectively the first half or the second half of the factory?

[magic egret]

you could turn off or disconnect the machines connected to the node in one half

or find another node so you can run both

[wind spade]

ideally you want all your machines to be running all the time, so yeah, if you can - find another node and hook it up to it

if you can't or don't want to, I'd just make it run roughly 50/50

[vagrant wyvern]

I'd like to find a temporary solution if possible as everything is designed to work on that single node once the mk3 belts are unlocked. Is there any way to automatically disconnect half of the machines with only one remote command?
Other than that I was interested to know if there's a way (either vanilla or modded) to control remotely more than 1 machine at a time.
Thank you for your answers, by the way. 😉

[magic egret]

you can only do that with mods

[wind spade]

there's no automatic controlling of factory currently

[vagrant wyvern]

Do you know which one?

[wind spade]

probably best to ask in modding server

[shadow prairie]

Ask for mods over at the [official modding discord](#welcome message). - <3 @wind spade

Jun 21, 2022, 10:16 AM

[magic egret]

i havent tried either but theres the remote factory mod which gives you a remote control, and the ficsit networks which gives you full automatic control but you have to code the behaviour you want in lua. for questions about those, try the modding discord

[vagrant wyvern]

Thank both of you very much. 😉

[vagrant wyvern]

Oh, one last thing. As everything works with manifolds I assume the right way to do that is to underclock everything at 50%, right? So everything overflows in the right way.

[wind spade]

that's up to you really. You can also just put a splitter before the two manifolds to split it 50/50

[vagrant wyvern]

Mhh, wouldn't the items get stuck at the first machine as it would never overflow? 🤔

[oblique hollow]

splitters overflow tho

they dont enforce a constant 50/50 or 33/33/33

if one side backs up, the rest gets moved to another side

[vagrant wyvern]

I see, perfect.

[frosty owl]

Honestly... I don't know (for sure) how... Not yet

The issue becomes quite complex when trying to find a conclusion valid for any or even most productions: even assuming using the same "metà" recipes, adding even one product to the production chain or one aviable node... anything could possibly cause the result to change if the layout is remade and optimized taking the new production/input into account.

That makes even choosing an acceptable "base example" to draw conclusions on very hard: such an example should not only be good enough that minor changes in output/input needed/aviable wouldn't necessarily change the whole layout, but also allow for a fair comparison between all different logistic methods used (manifold, direct feed, balancing, sushi-balancing. I'm including sushifolds into manifolds)

Anyway, it's a topic a find quite interesting and I'm excited to explore it further

I attempted to make a good case for sushi-load-balancing in my nuclear save, but ended up sort of ruining any serious data collection by making the factory needlessly "fancy" with extra belts for show and tons of decorations 😅

[cedar mica]

I guess the only thing we can say, is that more stuff is more lag. Its just a question of to what degree

[magic egret]

could try it on that custom map thats just a blank plane to get more accurate results

[median heath]

Just use a Power Switch.

[magic egret]

that doesnt do what he wants and i doubt he even has them at this stage

[wind spade]

that does exactly what they want

[median heath]

Well 2 of them.
One for each half of the factory.

[magic egret]

yeah he was looking for a one switch toggle though

power switch is just an easier way of manually disconnecting

which he didnt want

[wind spade]

they were looking for a way to toggle between two factories, they didn't mention single toggle

[magic egret]

he literally said "Is there any way to automatically disconnect half of the machines with only one remote command?"

[vagrant wyvern]

Thanks, that's what I was looking for! With a basic logic with ficsit networks (as suggested by hb) that should work fine. Even if I'm not able to use it right now (haven't researched yet), it's useful to know it can be used for future projects.

[magic egret]

well yay if it works

[wind spade]

the question before reads

Is there a way to have a sort of "toggle switch" in order to turn on and of respectively the first half or the second half of the factory?

[median heath]

Even without mods it does what you want.

One switch for each half. Have only one on until you get to the mk3 belt then have them both on.

[vagrant wyvern]

Perfect, thanks!

[median heath]

If you're wanting something that diverts all flow to one side until the storage for that item is full then it diverts to the other, that's even simpler. Just use a smart splitter.

[vagrant wyvern]

Being dumb I thought it could be a good idea to have both factories mixed up as they both need screws, so all same machineries are togheter (such as a zone with all the smelters both for rotors and plates, etc) and a single manifold which feeds all the constructor (for both products) to balance all the things. Maybe the smartest move would have been to separate the two productions, right? 😅

[median heath]

Yes.

[wind spade]

well there's no "wrong" in this game, but you could just plan for current belts and build more buildings separately when you need them 🤷‍♂️

[magic egret]

eventually youre probably going to rebuild it anyway as you unlock better logistics and alternate recipes

[wind spade]

*build new productions

[wind spade]

What is the best item to put into the AWESOME sink? Rn im putting in crystal Oscillators...
@stuck coyote depends what items you have available, here are all that are better than oscillators

[stuck coyote]

ohhh i didnt know xeno bashers were better, may starting putting them in

thanks :)

[wind spade]

the problem with those is that they are not possible to be automated 😛

[stuck coyote]

i dont mind a good old bit of manual crafting hehe

[muted crypt]

you're going to be hand crafting a lot of items if you want to make any significant number of tickets that way.

100% not recommended to take that route.

[versed violet]

The S.I.N.K. Project is progressing - only Coal/Copper/Lemonstone/Iron left to tap. And maybe oil after that 🛢️

Also: wohoo - I'm processing all bauxite on the map into aluminion ingots. I'm so proud of it.

[real lichen]

How many iron i need to produce all items?

[versed violet]

That question is ill-formed. How many items are you going to produce?

[real lichen]

like all items

but 1 overclock min

[versed violet]

then you will need all the iron?

[real lichen]

but

no like, im contruting a new factory but idk how many iron i need in total

[versed violet]

use the calculator https://www.satisfactorytools.com/production

[real lichen]

but i need to add evry item

and add the amount 1 by 1

[versed violet]

Yes.
It is not possible to answer your question, if you can't give the exact amounts of what you want.

[wind spade]

A: I need to go shopping, how much money will I need to buy the stuff I'm gonna buy?
B: what are you gonna buy?
A: I don't know yet

[median heath]

Ah, another person solving forwards...

[topaz hedge]

Oh, this is going to be pain.

I guess this will work out. 3 lines of 300 oil to feed 5 lines of consumers eating 180 oil.

So.. 3 to 5 split, Maybe it won't be too bad. I might not be ready to start building this quite yet.

[wind spade]

pipes don't work like belts tho 🤷‍♂️

just this will also be enough

[topaz hedge]

should, in theory.

[wind spade]

even in practice imo

worst case you loop the pipe from left to right for added safety

[topaz hedge]

In theory. I'll probably do that. it's just the how I haven't decided on.

This is going to be a big production line.

Actually, maybe not. 6 machines making hor, 3 when overclocked. might not be too bad.

[timber flare]

Im going to start building my new worlds first oil power setup above the water fall by coal lake. lets gooo

60 refs doing diluted fuel

Thats 3/4 of the gold coast oil going trough HOR refs

[timber flare]

Currently burning 480*3 coal /m

[tropic hawk]

1440 coal/min. Because if you are burning 480 sets of 3 coal per meter, then you need to look at your factory again...

[timber flare]

Minute

[analog oak]

how much coal does a powerplant take pm?

per min

[frosty owl]

The baseline would be a savefile with a set powerplant and a set location/footprint for the test factory, that would be enough as a testing environment. But designing such a factory...

[frosty owl]

Coal generators take 15 coal/min and 45 water/min

[waxen moss]

Okay, another train problem. I need wire to go a factory that requires 1360 wire a minute. Round trip time adjusted for docking times is 10.15. So that means I need to fill a train car to ~86% capacity with Wire using only Mk4 belts within 10.15 minutes

With two mk4 belts going into a single platform, I can fill a container to about ~61%

So, just two carriages instead of one?

[median heath]

Yes, that takes 2 cars.

[timber flare]

Check round trip time with 4 cars and try that out. It might get you a better throughput

[median heath]

If 2 can handle it why would 4 give better?

Round trip time would be the same regardless of number of cars.

[sterile shard]

this thing is simple: smart splitter 2 overflow : mk1 belt + mk2 belt: 60+120=180

[topaz hedge]

it's oil.

[sterile shard]

....

[topaz hedge]

But it's been awhile, and I might've been overthinking it.

[sterile shard]

oh !

just use valves

[topaz hedge]

I'm just glad that 180 goes into 900 lol

[sterile shard]

nah spreadshit

[topaz hedge]

I don't need them, I can triple feed a manifold and it should run fine.

and it'll be 6 oil pipes per 10 mk4 outputs. so that'll put me needing 12 total.

right? err..

this is not right..

greeny.. you're alright but.. your tool still does strange things on maximize.

[sterile shard]

in theory it's a 1 to 3 ratio

use the polymer resine to make plastic /rubber

[topaz hedge]

no. lol

[sterile shard]

why ??

[topaz hedge]

I will, but I don't include that in my main plan

[sterile shard]

oh

[serene burrow]

just missing 60xResidual Rubber for an extra 1200 rubber/min

[topaz hedge]

Like I said, I don't include that in my plans. I don't deal with by products unless I have to.

Unless I'm fulling using the main product, or sinking excess anything produced from the resin isn't a guarantee. also mixing residual into your recycle loop is just a bad idea..

[serene burrow]

So like you disable the Residual Rubber recipe? If so, then what do you see wrong with the screenshots above? Looks good to me?

[serene burrow]

works for me 🙂

[topaz hedge]

I do disable it, because this is how I setup my recycled loops.

[topaz hedge]

it's just a bad idea, for one, you're forever stuck with whatever your setup makes, and overdrawing on one side and causing it to run low can drop the output on the otherside.

That more depends on how you build it.. I like simple.

I also like that if I decide I need more plastic.. with the way mine's built, it takes 5 minutes to flip the output from rubber to plastic.

[serene burrow]

OK, so with residual rubber and plastic disabled, the plan shown above is the best plan to maximize rubber output, or am I missing something? What is strange about it?

[topaz hedge]

the calculator was acting funny when I told it to maximize for 3600 oil.

I guess it's still a little wonky when you tell it to maximize an input. it's all good tho

[versed violet]

Using residual rubber has the upside of 'priming' the plastic refineries easily, then its just a matter of balancing what rubber/plastic ratios you want. If you accidentally run your setup dry, because fuel supply stopped, it will not start back up without you manually putting rubber/plastic in.

[topaz hedge]

If fuel suddenly stopped (which has never happened) it won't run dry, because there's no fuel on top of that, the loop has priority over the output. It won't run dry, or drop output even if it's connected to a sink.

You're right it's not self starting, and it does have a couple minutes of warmup after switching recipes, or when it's first built before it's ready to go.

[median heath]

Pre-feeding primes things too 🤷‍♂️

[wind spade]

also what's the deal with switching recipes? 🤔

[topaz hedge]

me? If I built it as a rubber setup, I clear the belts, and swap recipes on the refineries and it'll make plastic instead.

Not something that you'd really do often. Still nice if you find out you need more plastic or rubber than you planned for.

[wind spade]

ah so it's a case of "I'll build ahead even though I don't know yet what I'll need" 🤔

[topaz hedge]

If you want to call it that, you can. :p

[wind spade]

you could just do residual rubber + recycled plastic separate to make equal of each and then from rest of fuel make the setup you do

[topaz hedge]

And I don't know what I'm going to do with half of the 9600 rubber/plastic I plan on making. I've got a direction to go. but I'm not sure which road I'll take.

[wind spade]

raises a question if you shouldn't wait with building this until you know your goals 🤔

[topaz hedge]

absolutely not. I need it now.

[wind spade]

then you should know what you need and in which ratio 🤔

[topaz hedge]

Yes, 9600 rubber/plastic. (:

If I need more, I have 3600 fuel ready to make more. If I don't need it all, I'll save some steel and make heavy flexible frames.... and use it all

[wind spade]

I'm confused how can you need it and at the same not know which of the two you need 🤔

[topaz hedge]

We could look at scim and see what it says.

[wind spade]

well then you know you need 3851.25 rubber 🤔

[topaz hedge]

Yes, but just making that much won't get me closer to the goal of 60 ads/min

[wind spade]

then you need 3851.25 + [amount needed for 60 ads/min] 🤔

[topaz hedge]

Which I haven't looked at the path to get that in awhile. I know I'll need at least 9600 rubber/plastic.

[wind spade]

well if you would look at the path, you wouldn't have to solve the "I don't know what I need" issue 🤔 but it's your game, I'm just trying to help 🤷‍♂️

[topaz hedge]

I know, and you and your tool is the best help there is.

[eager geyser]

is this a bug or am i being dumb?

[cursive garnet]

replace the pipe, see if that fixes it

[eager geyser]

i did and it didnt do anything

(also, the fluid buffers are empty and all the generators in this row are empty so unsure what is going on, will try a flush actually)

okay not sure what was going on there but it turns out i forgot to connect a water pipe at one small point and power for overflow for resin so everything there got backed up 🤦‍♀️

[devout flax]

Kinda an odd question, but what is the burn rate for compacted coal in a coal gen?

[wind spade]

7.14286 / min

[eager geyser]

who hurt the coal generator thats horrible

[devout flax]

So compacted coal can provide for 2 coal gens in place of the 30 regular coal? I ask just to verify the numbers, in case I need to go with compacted coal gens prior to getting fuel gens online

[eager geyser]

https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/Coal_Generator#Generators_fueled_by_Compacted_Coal seems more like 4.2 coal generators for 30?

[wind spade]

and how much is 30/4.2? 😛 7.14286

630 MJ of compacted coal, 75 MW production, 630/75 = 8.4s burn time per compacted coal

which results in 7.14285 per minute per gen

honestly you should be fine with just coal for coal gens, there's so much coal all over the map

[eager geyser]

TIL satisfactory follows E=pt

[wind spade]

yeah each item has energy value and burn rate is always calculated

(as burn rate also depends on gen power production, which depends on clock speed)

[proven sphinx]

i've got 2 pipes that's in need of 400 each, would you make 4 extractors giving 200 each, or split it on 3 that gives 800?

and also of the end of the pipe is the same height as the start, do i need a pump ?

[magic egret]

you need a pump if any part of the pipe is 10m higher than the extractors

or the water wont go past that point

and id build 4 extractors

[remote ice]

you are on water, you could just run the pipes under the tracks instead of over

or through. Trains can't actually hit obstacles (aside from other trains)

[proven sphinx]

yea i tried but im to close to water to even manage to put the pipes there

[remote ice]

you can build underwater though. It's a little tricky but you can zoop foundations downward, remove the upper ones, then build on the underwater foundations

[median heath]

The burn rate of Compacted Coal in a generator is you should never.

[soft scarab]

Nothing wrong with compacted coal in the early game. We’ve covered this before - it’s more energy per unit of coal when you have no other use for sulfur

[median heath]

We have covered it before.
Multiple times.

The conclusion is always that it should never be used as a fuel source.

[cursive garnet]

Hot take, let people play the game how they want to play it because after all, there is no "wrong" way to play the game

[ember shale]

Controversial take, man.

[wind spade]

I'm fine with that, I'm not fine when people then present their opinions as "best" 🤷‍♂️

[ember shale]

I mean, this is the math channel. On the math, there is always an objective best in a limited/constrained system (which Satisfactory inherently is)

But, at the end of the day, it's still a game.

[wind spade]

there is, as long as you specify what the "best" means

"X is best recipe for Y" is just wrong. "X is most resource efficient recipe for Y" is the way to go

[ember shale]

For a generator it would be energy in vs. energy out, I think.

You'd spend more energy to create compacted coal versus just using a higher quantity of coal.

[wind spade]

all generators have 100% efficiency, so it's irrelevant in this case

[ember shale]

Yes, but the energy to run a miner, versus a 2 miners (sulfur and coal) and an assembler to compact it, are not equal

[wind spade]

ah, I wouldn't consider that "energy in" 🤷‍♂️ I thought you're talking about the energy of the fuel vs electrical energy produced from it

[ember shale]

Energy into the fuel generation, as opposed to energy produced by the generator. net energy is what's left, sorry for not being cleaerer!

[wind spade]

this is assuming infinite resources available, but there's a limit of how much you can produce (both locally and globally)

[ember shale]

Well, it's also assuming you would want or need to run coal power at the scale that that coal limit becomes an issue.

[wind spade]

local limits may be e.g. one node 🤷‍♂️

[ember shale]

If you have coal and sulfur right next to each other then yes, but if not then the local limit argument is already invalid.

You'd either route sulfur to solve the 1 coal problem, or route more coal

And then the more coal is less energy expensive again.

[wind spade]

if sulfur is 200m far and coal is 1km far, some players may prefer the sulfur 🤷‍♂️

[ember shale]

Right, "right next to each other" is a bit relative, lol

[wind spade]

I agree with the math you posted, I just don't agree with that being the only relevant argument for choosing which fuel to do

[ember shale]

No, not "only"

Just as mentioned, a mathematical "better solution" for the net energy, on paper, is "use coal directly"

[wind spade]

yeah, that's fine with me 🤷‍♂️

[ember shale]

Mathematically better is not always situationally better or translatable to reality. So I get you

[oblique hollow]

while yes, if you go by assumption of equal amounts of stuff, compacted is dumb.
if you wish to save coal tho, its an ok choice

[tawny chasm]

totally agree with greeny here for what it is worth, answering questions in the manner of 'x is better than y' is not particularly helpful, showing your reasoning for your statement (i.e. x is better than y based on weighted resources, or power consumption, or space usage) is the way to go, imho

show your working, as they say 🤣

[oblique hollow]

If you care about equal effort, coal is easier and more effective.
100 coal vs 50 coal and 50 sulfur makes coal win

if your intent is to safe coal, its a fair trade to choose compacted

[ember shale]

I definitely agree saying there's 1 way to do it at all, or that there's a universal best way is a bit nutty. But there are various bests depending on what your variables are/where your concern is.

At the end of the day the game is called Satisfactory. And the best solution is the one which brings you the most satisfaction.

[mint cliff]

I mean depending on your priority, there's definitely a "best way"

[ember shale]

That's what I said.

[oblique hollow]

as far as power in vs power out goes (i will NOT do energy math), normal coal is a bit better suited

[thorn bane]

nothing wrong with not playing optimal
honestly almost no one plays time optimal except speedrunners

[ember shale]

I wouldn't even know time otpimal if I saw it.

[oblique hollow]

fun optimized gameplay, now thats meta i wanna see

"Best transport method? just yeet trucks through the air with jump pads lol"

[mint cliff]

tier 8 speedrun

[thorn bane]

playing optimal IS the fun part

[ember shale]

I do like yeet.

[thorn bane]

epiphane did a 4 package speedrun in 29h
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OY_7HaKeQFI
im not done yet with my U6 playthrough but its probably gonna be between 40-50h
for most its probably 200+ xD

[ember shale]

Yeah, it takes me forever. ADHD baby.

[thorn bane]

ye and the amount of spaghetti he makes is kinda alot 🍝

[small kayak]

Nice speedrun! I'm still on my first world and after about 200h I finally unlocked the age of aluminium. With no wandering aimlessly across the biomes and the knowledge of where good nodes are my guess would be that 50h could be doable for me. Faster would probably be a miracle 😁

[remote ice]

why? If you're using all your coal already, and you have no uses for sulfur (and you largely don't before batteries), there's no harm in using it. You could be directing all that sulfur into a awesome sink for all it would matter, so you might as well get more power out of it.

if you aren't using all your coal, yes you should probably just use more coal. But if you are...

[median heath]

Using... all your Coal...
Before getting to Fuel Power...
Somehow... managing to use ALL your Coal...

I'm trying to merely comprehend this... and I cannot.

[remote ice]

i ran out of coal in the dune desert before fuel power.

only 1 sulfur node to work with so i didn't bother with compacted, but in retrospect it would've helped

[median heath]

Even at mk1s..
You were consuming 990 Coal/min prior to Fuel Power?

[remote ice]

i think i was using MK2s overclocked, but yes? I'd have to double check. I had... 20+ coal plants at 250% i think?

lemme open up a old save on a map

[median heath]

@wind spade I appreciate your neutrality but I am becoming more convinced that it is objectively possible for people to play the game wrong.

[remote ice]

yeah, 20 overclocked

600 coal/minute

[wind spade]

if you're having fun, can you even play the game wrong? 🤔

[remote ice]

and that power was underbuilt by a factor of like, 3.

if i had my factory sinking i would've drained the batteries dry in a hour

[median heath]

I'm beginning to think "yes".

[remote ice]

underbuilt by a factor of 2, my bad

so yeah between that and steel i was very much out of coal

... wait, did i have geothermal up at this point

i did, right! Those 20 gens are only 3GW. Okay so if i wanted to power everything i'd need another 60-ish of them. Not nearly enough coal there for that.

i forgot how helpful getting those geothermals up was tbh

[tawny chasm]

this was with three other players though right?

[tawny chasm]

all depends upon the player's reason for playing the game, right? different perspectives and all. If their sole reason for playing the game is to have fun...

[thorn bane]

nah solo

[oblique hollow]

hm.... just noticed

fine black powder is actually a bad deal

basic black powder is 1 coal + 1 sulfur to 2 black powder
fine = 3 sulfur + 1 coal to 4 Black powder

[remote ice]

yeah its weird

[versed violet]

wiki says basic powder is 1 coal + 2 sulfur

[timber flare]

Save on coal i gues ?

[versed violet]

Fine black powder is 0.75 sulfur + 0.25 coal per one powder

[wind spade]

saves on coal 🤷‍♂️

[remote ice]

i don't think that's correct for U6, don't have the game open ATM but pretty sure it's 1-1.

[tawny chasm]

Are you sure? He did a video about how they planned it out and each built a phase 4 part factory in a certain location. Lots of planning

[thorn bane]

that was before, this one is solo

[still trout]

no you muffin, normal is 1 coal + 2 sulfur = 1 powder while fine is 1 coal + 3 sulfur = 4 powder

it saves on both?

[oblique hollow]

wiki be wrong

the recipe seems to have changed in U6

[timber flare]

Wiki rn

'

[oblique hollow]

Wiki outdated

[still trout]

in that case, i apologise, i was going off the wiki

[oblique hollow]

carefull or this muffin might bite you in the ass on day

[tawny chasm]

ahhh, thanks 🙂

[oblique hollow]

@median heath look what they did to Fine Black Powder

[burnt wraith]

you will be wrong once U6 comes to EA

[oblique hollow]

ooooh its rain time!

[median heath]

Need to switch worlds, one sec.

[oblique hollow]

beautiful

Rain meta

[ember shale]

Your coffee is getting wet.

Put a lid on it.

[median heath]

@oblique hollow what changed? I don't have the old recipe memorized?

[oblique hollow]

nothing, but normal black powder is now better

[wind spade]

https://u6.satisfactorytools.com/codex/items/black-powder doesn't look too bad tbh 🤔 for saving on coal

[oblique hollow]

so fine has been effectively murdererd

[median heath]

?

[oblique hollow]

saving coal for black powder?

[still trout]

dietz nuts

[wind spade]

saving anything on anything 🤷‍♂️

[median heath]

Oh yeah... Fine is almost useless...

Why CSS 😭

[wind spade]

the only recipe that was ever completely useless was alt plastic in U2 times

[median heath]

Instead of 2 C + 2 S = 4
You have 1 C + 3 S + More Space + More Power = 4

Trade isn't worth anymore because 1 Coal isn't worth that much.

[median heath]

Biocoal and Charcoal still need to be removed from the game.

[wind spade]

1 c + 3 s

[median heath]

Was typo. Fixed.

When it was "costs less Coal but more power and more space for increased production" = trade
Now it's just "save Coal but cost more of everything just to cost more of everything" =/= trade

[wind spade]

eh, I'd argue they are situational. And they are also a good lecture of "not every recipe may be worth for you"

[median heath]

The amount you're leveleraging against a single piece of Coal now?
Come on.

[wind spade]

converts useless biomass into useful coal for e.g. steel 🤷‍♂️

some people may find use for it

[median heath]

Oh I thought you replied about Powder.

[ember shale]

When you take out all the bad options and leave only the good, then there is no choice or feeling of accomplishment for doing the right thing. If there is no wrong thing, how can anyone do the right thing?

That is why Biocoal exists.

[median heath]

No. In no world will you be able to even pay me to say that Biocoal and Charcoal should remain in the game.

[wind spade]

there's no good or bad tho

[ember shale]

You're right, in no world would I pay you to.

[median heath]

"When you take out all of the bad options and leave only the situational ones"

FTFY

[remote ice]

that's not how i would say alt recipes work. They're alternatives - neither better nor worse, merely situational.

you use a alt recipe when you look at the tradeoffs and decide that it's better for your situation, and ideally alt recipes are built so that there's a relatively even 'spread' of situations where you would want it vs wouldn't want it

[ember shale]

It was more of a sarcastic remark, but everyone's taking it as actual philosophy. This pleases me.

[oblique hollow]

but..... Bionuclear Fuel Rod

[median heath]

The only 2 recipes you can argue are objectively better right now are Encased Industrial Pipe and Heavy Oil Residue.

Pipe's balance comes from either more things using Steel Beam, or Steel Beam having an alt.
HOR just straight needs a nerf.

[remote ice]

(as a example of this, fine black powder is currently a bad alt recipe because its useful in the situation where you have more sulfur than coal, for a low-demand consumable. Hard to imagine when you'd bother with it)

[median heath]

Old comparison for Fine Powder made it an excellent option if you could spare the sulfur given the low production rate of the base recipe.
Increasing production of base nullifies that.

[remote ice]

that too

[glad vigil]

If you use biocoal to make steel for encased industrial beams and electromagnetic control rods which are later used in uranium fuel rods

Does that count as bionuclear fuel rod?

[zinc remnant]

did this whole mess as my first tiem back since update 3

but i don't get why it all makes sense on the math front, but some things aren't working properly

such as my 4 rotors per minute outproducing my 5 reinf per minute into the smart plating creation

[somber zinc]

Spaghett

[somber zinc]

Are you trying to make green energy even more green homie?

Bro, that’s illegal, you can’t be doing that

[zinc remnant]

its so satisfying finding whats causing the major error in your design

i finally found it, i accidentally disconnected a single belt for screws that was causing a massive backup throughout the entire thing

[soft scarab]

I actually have a factory set up to convert biomass, leaves, or wood into black powder. Works great because I don’t need a constant supply of black powder

[wind spade]

killing aliens to get more ammo to kill more aliens 🙂

[ember shale]

Sustainable meat economy, right there.

[proven sphinx]

Is there a "best recipe" page for each material ? when it comes to alternate recipes ?

[magic egret]

no because it depends on your needs

but theres alternate recipe analysis

on the wiki page for each item

[fierce cypress]

@proven sphinx check out these for the wiki's analysis (keep in mind that analysis's may be subjective)

https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/Hard_Drive#Alternate_recipe_analysis
https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/Hard_Drive/Alternate_recipe_analysis - (previous analysis, heed the aforementioned warning)

[frosty owl]

Wiki analysyses are gospel, there's no subjectivity in them

[magic egret]

you need the BEST recipe so you can be #1

out of 1 on your world

[fierce cypress]

not the old one

[proven sphinx]

also, is it 5 nuclear plants to 1 rod a min ?

[wind spade]

there's no best/worst, all recipes are situational, any analysis or ranking you find is subjective and most likely won't agree with other analysis/rankings.

Ideally you want to check what the recipe gives you and if you can make use out of that. If yes, then the recipe is "good" for you.

[proven sphinx]

thanks, just hard to chose when using your calc what recipes to make

[wind spade]

well my calc chooses for you. It optimises for least resource usage

[proven sphinx]

so, if i just click "all" on the alternate recipes and base ones, it will optimize?

[wind spade]

yeah

and then you can disable recipes you don't want, if it shows something you don't want to deal with

e.g. technically most resource efficient plates are the coated plates, but not everyone wants to use oil on iron plates, so you can disable those when the tool suggests to build with them

[keen mantle]

what is a good calculatersite?

[proven sphinx]

i removed the fertile uranium (making plutonium rods) while the non-fissile uranium is still checked and now it says i cant calculate

[proven sphinx]

Satisfactorytools.com ofcourse

[keen mantle]

thx

[wind spade]

I assume the problem is not enough waste, but you can always send me the production line to check

[magic egret]

yeah you have to set a waste input for the plutonium rods or it wont work

[wind spade]

(that is fixed in beta version, but beta has it's own problems so it's not yet released)

[magic egret]

greeny do you think you could make the calculator say whats missing when it cant get a result

[wind spade]

it's not really possible, since the tool doesn't know it

[magic egret]

ah

[wind spade]

there are some plans on at least trying to figure it out though

[magic egret]

for cases like this where it needs a waste input for example

[wind spade]

in beta waste input is no longer needed

you just need to check "uranium fuel rod" in nuclear plant

[proven sphinx]

gah, looking at the production line .. im in for a "few" hours of work xD 6 uranium into 1.5 plutonium xD

[frosty owl]

What about this?

1. Tool caches a copy of last solution before calculating the new one (impossible)
2. Tool loads back the previous solution and adds raw resources to extend the current production to reach the desired output
3. Tools gives the "impossible" error, adding how much raw inputs would be needed based on previous solution

[wind spade]

that would only work if the solution is impossible due to increased demand

but there's also stuff like changed recipes, input, power production, etc.

[frosty owl]

Which is always the case when one is tsmpering with the "production" tab, right?

[wind spade]

well yeah

at least in current version, in beta it's more complicated

due to production of sink points and power

[frosty owl]

Tbh, just a "what lacks" feedback from impossible solutions due to changed production goals would be quite nice imo

I could use it right now as I'm trying to change inputs to maximize a production and an easy way to balance them (the total must be 3 full belts) is increasing production to compare ore demand through the different solutions

To give a better picture of the issue I'm trying to solve: given 3 full belts of ores, what's ideal balance of ores to get the max space elevator parts I could possibly make?

[wind spade]

yeah and the problem is that many things can lack... a recipe to produce something, resources, enabled byproducts, enabled power production, ...

it's not easy and in some cases close to impossible to figure out what it is

[frosty owl]

If the previous solution was valid, when changing production goal wouldn't only resource requirements change?

[wind spade]

(in reasonable amount of time)

could be new added item that needs different resource or different recipe

[frosty owl]

Sorry, I worded that badly.

If the previous solution was valid, couldn't the tool use it to "force" a solution simply by increasing the raw inputs as needed?

[wind spade]

same answer, could be a recipe or something else

[frosty owl]

Fair. But one could restrict that to just amount changes

[wind spade]

at that point it's almost pointless tho. "you increased amount and tool said no solution"

it's pretty clear what the problem is

and you can always use maximise to figure out the max possible amount 🤷‍♂️

[frosty owl]

It's not clear what the resources needed to reach the amount would be

Btw, I might have found a small bug?
Increasing the Coal aviable in this plan over 152 keeps giving me "impossible"...
https://u6.satisfactorytools.com/production?share=cYfPfpBBdo2wdzQyv8g7

[wind spade]

there's no definitive answer to that either - in some cases there are multiple resources that are missing, in other cases it may be "any of these resources can increase the amount produced", etc.

[wind spade]

yeah there are some issues with u6 atm. I think some changes from beta were accidentally passed to u6, not sure. I'll check it out when I have time

[full snow]

So today I found out I still have copies of ALL my saves that i ever made. EVERY TIME I closed the game id make a new save... From the first public alpha save, to just a few hours ago. i have more than 360 save files taking up more than 600Mb of space........ So I did some quick math on my playtime, these are my findings:

I've spent just under 500 hours making spaghetti alla factory. 19 days, 22 hours, 25 minutes, 39 seconds.
Each save basically a different update, I find it amusing that for every new session/save, the number of average hours played each day per save increases each time. I've not analysed it too hard, but from a gut-check, just a theory, it's almost as if the more content is in each update, the more hours I put in.
Also, of note, I've played an average of 4.3 hours EVERY DAY on my most recent playthrough??? This seems like a lot...
Quality game 10/10

[topaz hedge]

yup. 10/10 time vampire

[stray quartz]

Speaking of, are there any plans to make "maximize according to a given ratio" an option?

[small kayak]

hmm, should work

but why not just let the left 200->200 and 400->400 be a straight line?

[teal wadi]

no reason, just unnecessary complexity. It is currently set up in a more reasonable way. Just thought this might look cool lol

[zinc remnant]

im feeling super dumb today, how do i get a line of 18.75 items per minute out of a line of 30 items per minute

[median heath]

With a splitter.

The 11.25 side will fill and then send exactly 18.75 down the other side.

[zinc remnant]

i don't have programmable splitters..

only default splitters.

[median heath]

Read what I said again.

[zinc remnant]

yeah, i got what you said.. but i don't have programmable or any over the stock 3 way splitter

[median heath]

Where are you getting "programmable" from?

[zinc remnant]

well, i forget theres two teirs

i have neither of them, my caterium research and personal messings with it is too bare minimum

[median heath]

Where are you getting anything other than default splitter from what I said?

[zinc remnant]

because a default splitter i wouldn't be able to get exactly that out of a single splitter

i guess the question is how?

[median heath]

What happens when you split 30 in half?

[zinc remnant]

15 and 15

[median heath]

Is 15 more than 11.25?

[zinc remnant]

yes.

[median heath]

So 11.25 would fill?

[zinc remnant]

the 11.25 is overflow

[median heath]

And then you'd get exactly 18.75 down the other side.

[zinc remnant]

so wait could i just do it

so 18.75 i overfill and exactly 11.25 comes out the other side

[median heath]

If you need the 18.75 side to fill first just split 30 three ways, combine 2 of them into 20.

[zinc remnant]

i have no idea why i didn't think to use splitters in this way

that makes a whole ton of sense

[median heath]

Probably because you're thinking in terms of how other games work 🤷‍♂️

[zinc remnant]

well i also hate overflow

so that might just be me

[median heath]

So clock the 30 down to 18.75?

[zinc remnant]

that would take clocking down a whole factory

[median heath]

Overflow is a key mechanic of the game, so (not being rude) I'd advise you get over hating it.

[zinc remnant]

i prefer when items arrive exactly on time

makes the math more even and easy on paper

[median heath]

When you build storage, you're going to have it fill. Then you need the overflow to go elsewhere.

The only way to not deal with overflow is if you intentionally have yellow lights and machines stalling out.

In which case, professionally, I hate you.

[zinc remnant]

well i mean my current iron factory has all items reach their destination the second its needed so theres 0 yellow lights

and 0 overflow

[median heath]

All of that goes to something though.
Which is then stored.

When that storage fills you will have overflow.

[zinc remnant]

i don't produce enough to fill up my storage

[median heath]

*YET

[zinc remnant]

i have 50 personal storage sized boxes for each item

and i have overflow on the backs of each of them to control the circuit, but thats not my concern

im trying to branch off for a small amount of encased beams off my steel production

im producing 45 and i want to underclock it to exactly meet the production of a pure concrete node with a level 1 miner on it and send the rest of the steel straight to storage

[median heath]

Personal storage boxes don't have belt inputs.

[zinc remnant]

well, the full sized ones, i don't use industrial and was unsure of the name

honestly havent played a large amount since update 3

[median heath]

You're using 50 normal containers per item instead of 25 ISCs because... you just enjoy inflating your game's item count?

[zinc remnant]

yeah i enjoy the framerate dropping through the floor

but no, it was because i built my array before i had access to isc

and its significantly more work than im willing to do to swap them out

[median heath]

Oh you're going to have fun later...

[zinc remnant]

sure, i play on lows anyway

i can handle it, the dedi server im running it on can handle it

[median heath]

No like, deletion and rebuilding better is another core game mechanic.

[zinc remnant]

my dedi has dual 2699v3's

uh, yeah but im not spending like 6 hours to take down something that functions

and doesn't cause me any issues, when im still in need to build more resource creation

[median heath]

6 hours in the scope of a couple thousand is.. eh 🤷‍♂️

[zinc remnant]

i don't have the time to get addicted to another game, i already have more than 3 years active hours in fortnite stw, another pve game

6 hours in a 25 hour save is not worth my time

thats a game i was really addicted to, still am i guess

[still trout]

18k hours

how the hell do you manage that

as it says thats two and some years of nonstop having that open

[vapid gorge]

A lot of people somehow get locked on to having to manually split belts to numbers rather than doing the overflow method. Not sure why.
If you don't like the spin up time you can just hand fill the machines before starting it up so your system is flooded right at the start?
I don't recommend load balancing at the start

[zinc remnant]

@still trout its more near 22 thousand now, that pic was a year ago

@vapid gorge i just like the pretty even belts, but i need to start using overflow

[vapid gorge]

Over flow method can still have some belts that have continuous movement.
Show off the main belt to a place and if you time it right it should always be moving. Then have the branches under neath and lift fed if you don't want to see stop starting items

[topaz hedge]

max belts never stop. 🙂

[ripe quarry]

They still need to fix the precision issues with mk5 belts and mk 2 pipes before i'll trust them at full load

[vapid gorge]

they apperently may have done a fix to mk2 pipes to make it easier to get full flow

you can also fix the belt thign by not having belt to belt connections

Mcgal was doing some pipe testing a bit ago

[ripe quarry]

honestly imo for the pipes they should just have a check to disable sloshing if the input matches the output and the pipes are full

that would go a huge way to help

[vapid gorge]

But full flow on 'old' mk2 pipes still wasn't a huge issue as long as you did careful pipework

[wind spade]

just loop the pipe, easy fix

[ripe quarry]

i don't usually have room to loop it xD

[vapid gorge]

I'm not sure you could do it that way.

[wind spade]

can be even vertical 🤷‍♂️

[vapid gorge]

vertical loop!

[ripe quarry]

yep. I stack my solids above and run buswork beneath

i'd have to go real far down but then i have head issues

[wind spade]

always feed fluids from above

[ripe quarry]

i run them in-line

[wind spade]

that's good too

[ripe quarry]

so my liquids are always at ground level rather than doing multiple levels down

[vapid gorge]

don't listen to him! Always run your pipes from under! #design-and-architecture message

[wind spade]

running pipes from below brings more issues that you have to deal with 🤷‍♂️

[vapid gorge]

true but it's prettier.

and solvable 😛

[ripe quarry]

boo hiss

[wind spade]

I don't like the look of pipes feeding from below

hides all the pipework underground

it's a factory, it should look like a factory

[ripe quarry]

i'm on the fence about it. i don't like the pipes coming from below but it looks better than the solids hanging out above

[vapid gorge]

Most of it underground yes.
I like having featured sections with pipes and belts

[ripe quarry]

so if liquids come from below, solids can come from ground level

i tend to do vice versa of that

[vapid gorge]

Both from below! 😄

[ripe quarry]

or that xD

[wind spade]

nothing from below!

[vapid gorge]

Below Gang 4evs!

[wind spade]

ew circles

[vapid gorge]

Get Out.

See? TONS of pretty visible pipework 😛

[wind spade]

this is #math-and-meta , not #design-and-architecture 😛

[vapid gorge]

I have 5 machines being fed from below

[wind spade]

here we just do factories that are efficient and we don't care about looks 😛

[vapid gorge]

5 is maths

I would know. I have a piece of paper that says I know Maths.

[wind spade]

I don't 🤷‍♂️

[vapid gorge]

See? It's illegal for you to use maths w/o it

[wind spade]

oh sorry

deletes sftools

[vapid gorge]

I won't call the fuzz, dw

[median heath]

Mathsen

[oblique hollow]

thats the problem with sloshing, its not intentional and happens when pipes get full. junctions have no priority for a pipe at max flow and one that isnt flowing when it comes to merging

[ripe quarry]

sloshing IS an intentional feature of liquids passing between sections of pipe. But in the real world, if there is no air, i.e. the pipe is full, then by definition you can have no sloshing. you can have hammer, but that's a different issue that satisfactory couldn't have

[median heath]

I like that it happens.

[ripe quarry]

but in satisfactory, air can come out of nowhere in the middle of your network