math-and-meta

[serene crescent]

Do you have an oil factory

Polymer resin refining+plastic refining+water=more plastic production

[oblique hollow]

Consult the cable wiki page to receive decisive information on alt recipes

Or also the polymer resin page

[oblique hollow]

Actually making plastic from resin has no benefit over just making it directly from crude oil

Polymer resin is only good for rubber

[stiff gust]

guys I have a question, I have a line of 250 and need it to go to 3 outputs that need 80 and one that needs 10. How do I do it?

[wintry aurora]

Just manifolding works fine. Not sure how you’d use a balancer here.

[stiff gust]

dont even know what manifolding means xd

[wintry aurora]

Give me a min to get wiki page.

[thorn bane]

!wikisearch manifold

[shadow prairie]

https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/Special:Search?query=manifold

[wintry aurora]

Oh hey Zyra.

https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/Manifold?so=search

[stiff gust]

So its gonna work but it takes a while?

[thorn bane]

it needs to fill up first yes
you can also manually fill it up if you want

[stiff gust]

yeah youre right

[thorn bane]

but ye dont do this
use a manifold

[stiff gust]

my god

[thorn bane]

can probably do it a bit smaller but this works

[knotty spruce]

is this a good way to place pipes?

[wintry aurora]

Sure, that's basically how I do it.

[jade minnow]

This won't work with 8 generators. They need 360 water, but your pipe only holds 300 max

[wintry aurora]

Actually, wait, with the way you're setting it up, you'll need to double the MK1 pipes.

[jade minnow]

You have to feed the water on two different spots into the long pipe leading to the generators

[wintry aurora]

Although if you put the other two generators on the ends and leave the middle one in the middle, should be ok?

What I do during that phase is use two parallel rows of MK1 pipes.

[jade minnow]

That's another solution

[knotty spruce]

also i have another problem

the splitter isnt quick enough for 120 0re

it only splits 60 a minute

[wintry aurora]

The issue isn't the splitter, it's the belt that's not fast enough.

[knotty spruce]

ho bruh i just saw it

a small lv1 belt

[wintry aurora]

Check if you missed a belt upgrade. Sounds like you have a chunk of unupgraded belt.

[knotty spruce]

btween the level 2 and the splitter

yeah i fixed it

[floral gale]

i am trying to figure out a factory chain for a nuclear setup with zero waste ( sinking plutonium fuel rods). currently i am really struggling to find the balance for uranium ore for rod production and waste removal.
or is the best way to get the waste removal factory without uranium ore?

[wintry aurora]

Those small chunks are the ones that tend to get ya.

[wintry aurora]

Um, you can't have nuclear waste without the nuclear, get what I mean?

Unless I'm misunderstanding what you're trying to get at.

Never done nuclear yet, so....

[knotty spruce]

100% efficient now! thanks for the help

[stark vortex]

Excellent

[floral gale]

tried to use the satisfactorytools production chain for calculation (my brain hurted in my own sheet after a while).
the recipes it suggests there for max ouput is that all 2100 uraniun goes into Uranium fuel rods. and none into the recycle part so i am not sure if that is correct (used the recipe with uranium ore in my own spreadsheet)

[jade minnow]

Don't use maximize if you're using satisfactory tools. That won't calculate the production chain for least ore usage

[wintry aurora]

I've never done nuclear, so, I'm of no help here.

[wintry aurora]

Useful for when setting a limited amount though.

[thorn bane]

unfortunately satisfactorytools has no way of automatically recycling the waste but you can do it kinda manually
you add the 2520/min youre making as input
and then set it to make 12.6 plutonium rods (25% of Urods)
that way it will use up all the waste
you just have to make sure you disable the alt recipes for plutonium since then it wont use all the waste
also dont do fertile uranium its better to just use the silica
the planner would look something like this:
https://www.satisfactorytools.com/production?share=rm5w0pFXJVBpzmcHSrLj

[wintry aurora]

Plus it does weird things logistically with wastewater.

[jade minnow]

To avoid that you can break the big production down into the single production steps, so you can kind of dictate yourself where the water goes

[floral gale]

oke ty! thought i would use the fertile uranium, just looked better on first glance

[thorn bane]

the issue is that its making more non-fissile uranium from the waste
so you have more stuff you have to recycle
that means more particle accelerators more resources etc.

[wintry aurora]

I've also added stuff into the input section to make it recalculate the water.

[floral gale]

ah ic. ye was a bit afraid of the accelerators ngl

[thorn bane]

oh the loops are fun 🙂

[floral gale]

i mean ye they look great. just a bit powerintesiv 😛

from what i had with 38

[remote ivy]

producing 800m3 of heavi oil residue, and using the heavi fuel recipie

how much fuel i can make per minute

and without and with overclock how much refinerys i will need to have

FUEL POWER (nuclear power soon)

[slim cosmos]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wpD8WYWGzZ0&ab_channel=TotalXclipse
https://www.satisfactorytips.com/layouts/no-nuclear-waste-nuclear-layout

These are the two links i used to set up nuclear when i did it. it worked pretty good

just multiple numbers given for how many sets you need

[floral gale]

tyty! will check it ou 😄

[remote ivy]

somebody can help me with this

[wind spade]

There's no heavy fuel recipe. Either you're producing turbofuel or you have different recipe that makes fuel

[fierce ruin]

What about a Light Fuel recipe?

[frosty owl]

Bruh, that's way too many splitters
11 splitters, 7 mergers and what I'm assuming is a programmable splitter at the top for a total of 19

You could do all that with 2 splitters, 1 merger and 1 smart splitter @stiff gust. Still more complicated than a manifold, but much less than 19 splitters/mergers 😅 😆

[thorn bane]

smart splitter?
you just manifold
3 splitters ez

[frosty owl]

Sure 👍
My point is that balancing that output requires one to add 1 splitter, not to quadruple the amount of splitters

[thorn bane]

wait how would you balance that?

[frosty owl]

Smart split with the items on 2 sides with mk2 belts, overflow (10/min) on the other
Merge the mk2 belts, then split in 3 to have 80*3

[thorn bane]

ah ye that works

[remote ivy]

im talking about the recipie of make fuel with hevi oil residue

[proper karma]

I need to somehow split 32 iron rod constructors into 48 constructors for screws evenly.
Anyone have an idea of how to do that easily?
Floor layout: #screenshots message

[fierce ruin]

Other people have seen they changed the node color under stations?

[faint mauve]

finally learned that my 3 merging coals into an mk2 belt and then splitting to a bunch of things was not using all of the coal due to math. >.< lol... now I have 3 stacked belts instead of one main belt

[brisk turtle]

Personally ide max out 18 of your iron rod consts. And split them between 2 of the screw consts and ide imagine that would make up the diffrence.

[patent briar]

This is frustrating tbh, I seriously wish the logger thing for power would show my power usage moment that /actually/ tripped the breaker, because this data is basically useless. There's no reason my breaker should have tripped here

I have 2 grids (that should be 1)

When I disconnect A from B and flip A on, thats what you see on the left.

When I connect B to A, that jump up in max consumption is grid B... but the consumption value doesnt jump up

So why on earth is the breaker tripping then?

[brisk turtle]

it could be because of lack of fuel to your generators possibly

[patent briar]

Nope

The Production value only drops because the breaker flips there

You arent seeing Consumption > Production on that graph

so the breaker shouldnt have flipped there

if my generators were dying my production would have dipped below production, then the breaker would flip

[brisk turtle]

hmmm do you have any thing thats running off B in idle and randomly flicks on? that could be causeing your spike

[patent briar]

B isnt on til I connect it

Its purely consumption on that grid

I think the core issue is the fact that the graph wont actually log your real consumption the moment the breaker flips

it only logs your consumption before it went over, but misses the vitally important moment of flipping

so you just see your consumption still < production, and then suddenly everything dies on the graph with no indication why

Im gonna just build a bunch of batteries for now, I think if I add those to the grid it will let me see what is happening

[brisk turtle]

thats odd, wonder whats causing the prob. hope your able to get it worked out homi

[wind spade]

well the "why" is because you used more power. I'm not sure if there's some more info the graph would give you 🤔

[patent briar]

According to the graph I didnt though

Thats my point, on the graph you never see my consumption > production

[wind spade]

well the only way the breaker breaks is that you use more power. My point is that "if the breaker breaks, then you used more power"

[patent briar]

the graph "dies out" before that, failing to log that moment so I can, for example, see how much I went over

[wind spade]

and I'm not sure if giving you that info on the graph would change anything

[patent briar]

did I go 20 mw over? 100 GW over? Who knows lol

Because if I know how much I went over, then I can build more supply to accomodate potentially if its a small amount

[wind spade]

isn't that what the max consumption is for?

you just build enough so that you don't go over max production

[patent briar]

the max consumption seems to be wildly inaccurate

I have no idea why but, my max consumption is absolutely ridiculous now

also n that graph it says my max consumption is 10,609 and my production is 13,397

So... that once again is useless because its obviously not true if the breaker flipped

[wind spade]

if the graph shows invalid values, how would showing the last tick help then? 🤔

[patent briar]

... those values arent invalid

those are just the valid values /before/ the breaker flipped

but its not logging the values /during/ the breaker flipping, when consumption exceeded production (when I connected grids A and B together)

[wind spade]

you just said the graph shows max consumption and production that are invalid

[patent briar]

They are valid but 1 tick before

Its failing to log the tick that matters

[wind spade]

the max consumption seems to be wildly inaccurate

[patent briar]

The "tick" when my power actually /did/ go over because the grid changes

Aight, adding some batteries was the trick

Thats the crucial data I needed there

And yeah I still have no idea wtf is up with that bonkers max consumption

I guess perhaps its due to trains? I dont have /that/ many trains though

[buoyant flame]

It's because of me

Sorry

[cinder silo]

I know this is an old post now but I gave that splitter/merger thing a shot on my longest belt, it seems to hard lock the game after I got several kilometres down towards my bauxite refinery.

[drowsy peak]

just in case anyone needs it, here is a 4 into 4 load balancer that, after preliminary testing, appears to work. will take 4 different rate inputs, and produce 4 evenly split outputs.

I also have more and better screenshots of that, and other load balancers I've made if anyone wants to see them.

[stark bronze]

true legend
best of both worlds

[wind spade]

looks nicely, shame it's almost never needed

[frosty owl]

Ooof, that's NOT a good thing to hear. I kinda expected it, thus why I don't plan ta make more than ~100m of such a belt, but still...
Scawy

[proper karma]

Thanks for taking time to respond!
I would of done that but I figured this looks better:
What I did is combine every 2 iron rod machines and then split them into 3

[cinder silo]

The trouble is some of my belts extend 4-5km, I didn't even know there was a throughput issue until after I started looking in to unexpected shortfalls at the far end, the runs and build in general is so far along I'd have to start over, so I tried the merge thing.

[wild thistle]

Where can I find information on coal plants and how to balance overclocked coal with water extractors? I'm producing 960m3 of water but somehow can't supply 4 coal generators that are only consuming 91m3 each... math doesn't make sense and I'm getting frustrated trying to figure it out

[wild thistle]

Is this potentially because my pipes max flow is 300m3 and I'm exceeding on one pipeline?

[frosty owl]

Very possible

!wikisearch coal generator

[shadow prairie]

https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/Special:Search?query=coal generator

[frosty owl]

The wiki has plenty of info ok how to set up coal power plants ^^

[wild thistle]

Thank you!

[wild thistle]

Thanks!

[empty glade]

!wikisearch manifold

[shadow prairie]

https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/Special:Search?query=manifold

[empty glade]

What?! Where's the summary pic?

https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/Manifold?file=Manifold_Schematics.png

That's even more strange

[versed violet]

Check my math moment - to build single snow dispenser, I need ~21.07 gift trees?

also:
Is there a calculator that includes the fix-mass items? @wind spade ?

[fierce ruin]

You guys think there is enough iron on the map to justify spending 4700 of it purely on Stators? 😂

[whole harbor]

But why?

[fierce ruin]

Well I need 600 Stators/min.
Currently planning how to accomplish.

QW is honestly a decent route given the volume, but I can't find a location that suits QW Stators 😭

QW recipe for this volume needs 1 Pure Ct, 1 Pure Cu, and x2 Fe of Normal or better.
Problem is, everywhere that occurs there is a host of other shit that just gets wasted because the outpost won't use it 😭

Swamp looked really good until the damn Cu node I wanted was NORMAL.....

Like this spot would be perfect if those 2 Cu nodes were flipped... 😭

[thorn bane]

i wouldnt do quickwire stator

[oblique hollow]

Fun fact about trains (more specifically freight platforms) : according to the math, they are slower at transfering items than a truck station

It "transfers" items at a mathed 76,8 stacks/min vs the 120/min of the truck

[fierce ruin]

Indeed.

[frosty owl]

That's what happens when you have the same throughput, but no loading/unloading off time

[fierce ruin]

Same throughput?

[fierce ruin]

Haters still gonna hate out of ignorance.

[fierce ruin]

@wind spade question about Tools and a future function possibility:

Would it be doable to make the system use a "priority recipe"?
Example A: Circuit Boards
-I have a limited amount of Silica and Caterium, I want the system to make <defined amount> per minute, but I want it to use the Silica alt first and then use the Caterium alt for the remainder of said amount.

Example B: Iron Ingots
-Available Copper and Water in the area, I want the system to make <defined amount> per minute, but I want it to use the entire Copper node in Iron Alloy before switching to Pure Iron for the remainder.

So the system is still doing its whole optimization thing, it's just pushing priority to a certain recipe first before considering other options.

[median spindle]

probably isn't useful to anyone rn but 83.33% efficiency for a water extractor is ~100m output

[fierce ruin]

120 x 0.8333 = 99.996 =/= 100

[median spindle]

yea I just said that so people don't have to do the math and have a result

also I didn't use math just trial and error lol

[fierce ruin]

But it is not "exactly 100m output".

[median spindle]

yea

[fierce ruin]

Exactly 100m output from a Water Extractor is impossible.

[median spindle]

happy?

[frosty owl]

One should clock at 83.3334% to have the machines requiring water not starve

[median spindle]

eh I just found out I can use 5 100% water extractors instead of 6 83.3*% water extractors

[fierce ruin]

Indeed.

[median spindle]

I'm making a super wet concrete plant rn

4320 concrete/min if it works properly

[fierce ruin]

Just to make sure you understand this about ppm on the UI --

The little box that lets you set exact ppm or even tells you ppm is there solely to make you feel better about yourself. The game does not care about it. The only thing that matters to the game is the clock %, which is why 100/min from an Extractor is impossible. 100/min would require 83.33333333333-%, and the game stops counting after the 4th decimal.

@median spindle

[median spindle]

yea

I realised that by the 1st message

[wind spade]

I don't think there's a nice way to make this work. Maybe setting custom resource weights would be enough for that?

[fierce ruin]

What's the metric for recipe selection currently?
Like code-wise, what's the line for "use X recipe" look like?

[wind spade]

It's basically "choose a path that leads to least weighted resource cost"

[fierce ruin]

And somewhere along that path it has to make a decision for which recipe has the least cost, no?

[wind spade]

It uses linear programming solver to solve for best path

I don't really have any code that selects recipes

[wintry aurora]

I’ve noticed that it does use two different recipes for the same thing sometimes (aside from the recycled rubber+plastic loop), but I’m not sure what the conditions are for that. So, the algorithm is certainly capable outside of the recycled rubber+plastic loop from appearances, there just isn’t a controlled way.

[wind spade]

it always picks the most resource efficient path, no matter what the recipes are. It isn't limited to a single recipe per item produced

[wintry aurora]

‘K

[fierce ruin]

Why is copper so spread out 😭

[wintry aurora]

The nodes or....?

If greeny's tools, it's usually pipes that get spread out because there's so many things using them.

[fierce ruin]

The nodes.

Need 3k for an outpost and there isn't really a spot on the map that fits that in terms of "locally".

Highest concentration I can find is 3 Pures. But that's barely over 2.3k.

[wind spade]

Trains?

[fierce ruin]

Will have to be done via truck or train but that requires my figuring out the rules for this exception clause.

Up till now "outposting, locally sourced only" has held.
HSC's are breaking this atm.

Unless Silicon ones require less Cu...

:hmmmm:

[oblique hollow]

has nothing to do with that.
truck station has a transfer rate (station to/from truck) of 2 stacks per second.

Freight platforms moves an entire 32 slots in 25 seconds, so thats 1,28 stacks per second.

its simply inferior speed, no matter if it locks up or not

[fierce ruin]

I have only 3k total Qtz left to work with though, so I have to be strategic about how I use it in both Aluminium and if I do Silicon alts.

[fierce ruin]

25s? Isn't it 27ish?

[oblique hollow]

according to wiki 25, if its 27 then hoo boy its even worse

[fierce ruin]

27.08s iirc. Lemme look.

Yeah 27.08s @oblique hollow

Ondar needs to update that.

[oblique hollow]

that means its a tranfer "speed" of 1.1817 stacks per second

[fierce ruin]

Truck superiority 🎉

[wintry aurora]

Ouch.

[fierce ruin]

But haters still going to hate.

[oblique hollow]

means: a freight platform has a transfer index of 59.08 MW stacks/second
vs truck station's 40 MW stacks/second

lower is better

[wintry aurora]

Trucks/explorers are still great for high throughput stuff over distances that are too short to be worth using a train on.

[oblique hollow]

transfer index is power usage during transfer times the transfer speed in stacks per second. an ideal index would be 0, as that implies no power usage

[wintry aurora]

Trains are good for high bulk and medium/low throughput.

[fierce ruin]

Longer distances just means more trucks to handle the delays tbh.

Provided round trip is one fuel stack or less.

[wintry aurora]

But more fuel.... there's pros and cons all over the place.

[oblique hollow]

actually im doing the fuel math on that

a single "full" train stup (2 stations, 10 freight platforms, 1 loc with 5 full cars) is 155 MW + 500/roundtime

[wintry aurora]

Don't you need 1 loc for 4 cars?

[fierce ruin]

That isn't going to accurately compare to trucks though.

[wintry aurora]

So, it'd be two locs.

[oblique hollow]

for truck its, at best, 40 MW * dock time/roundtime + 75 MW * (5 seconds / round time)

[oblique hollow]

5 can work, its an average case

[fierce ruin]

Truck vs. Train is Truck vs. 1 Loco 2 Cars

[wintry aurora]

'k

[oblique hollow]

see the lookup tabel for train car weight

5 is the most average case

for full cars

and not-too-extreme slopes

1 canister of fuel = 150 MW for 5 seconds or 10 seconds of truck driving

that 150 MW doesnt even cover the stations or platforms running for 25 seconds

[wintry aurora]

Where is the break-even distance?

[oblique hollow]

thats what im trying to find out

theres probably multiple break-even points, one for throughput and one for power

[wintry aurora]

Which of course, assumes absolutely perfect driving, but that's never the case

[fierce ruin]

Break even would also be per-fuel-type.

[oblique hollow]

im assuming average power usage of a single loc is 55 MW

[wintry aurora]

True.

[oblique hollow]

not really since fuels can be equally exchanged

the MJ value can be interchanged

[fierce ruin]

:hmmmm:

[wind spade]

Maybe tqo outposts then instead? 🤔

[oblique hollow]

you just need to formulate it all to be based on rountrip time, throughput and MJ

[fierce ruin]

Also just to clarify you're doing Truck vs. 1 Loco 2 Car, right?

[oblique hollow]

to be at equal throughput per drive, it would need to be 1 truck vs.... ermmmmm

[wintry aurora]

I figure long distance, high bulk, and medium-low throughput would be best on trains, but there's lots of inbetween where it works as well.

[fierce ruin]

Vs. What I just described, lol.

[oblique hollow]

its 1.7 cars then to match a truck

[fierce ruin]

Trucks max at 1560. It takes 2 cars to do that.

[oblique hollow]

so 2 yes

[fierce ruin]

🙃

[oblique hollow]

wait a single car can do 2 outputs too so

[wind spade]

It depends on train loop time doesn't it

[fierce ruin]

Single car is incapable of 1560 given docking time.

[oblique hollow]

its can do that but not continuously

[fierce ruin]

Car throughput is asymptotic (if that is the word)

[oblique hollow]

yes thats a word

approaches some limit but never reaches

[fierce ruin]

Yes.

Even if you somehow made an hour long loop it only reaches like 1548.

[oblique hollow]

train is also asymptotic then but has an offset

[fierce ruin]

Car = Train Car

[oblique hollow]

oh

[fierce ruin]

Truck throughput is not asymptotic.

Truck throughput is simply hardcapped at 1560.

Truck stations don't lockout during load/unload. Flow is continuous.

Well... they lock out a single stack but meh.

[oblique hollow]

right, then it simplifies math to
2 stations, 4 freight platforms, 1 loc and 2 cars
means 155 MW + (5416 MWs / roundtrip time)

[fierce ruin]

Aye.

[wintry aurora]

Like my roughly 800m line here, would be considered truck distance, but due to the relatively low throughput, and the fact that I split the copper into two platforms, makes it work.

[oblique hollow]

155 is of course some generous assumption for the train

[wintry aurora]

I know there's two extra platforms, I did that in case I needed to expand further.

[fierce ruin]

He's solving distance atm 🙃
But most likely yes.

[oblique hollow]

im solving power break even rn, actually

but that can probably be reformulated for distance

[fierce ruin]

Which gives distance for the truck.

Power break even.
Compare power to fuel distance. 🤷‍♂️

In terms of cubic footage. Trucks win outright on anything less than 1560.

[wintry aurora]

Question while we're on the topic of this, is 24/m per vehicle or is that all vehichles on the route?

[fierce ruin]

Oh don't get me started on how inaccurate this screen is.

[marble shore]

Okay, I am curious. I'm sure someone has done the math, but assuming access to coal, sulfur, water and alt recipes, what is the best combo to make the most power from fuel?

[oblique hollow]

diluted blend turbofuel probably?

[fierce ruin]

Most power is the base Turbofuel recipe. All other oils to Diluted Fuel.

[oblique hollow]

oh right base tf has most power

[fierce ruin]

But also consumes ALL sulfur.

[marble shore]

Really? Ohhh

[oblique hollow]

in short: base turbo bad

[fierce ruin]

That's why Turbo Blend is "better".
Less MW, but less Sulfur because you need that for other things.

[wintry aurora]

I know the outgoing transfer rate is inaccurate as it swings wildly as things get picked up as fast as they arrive.

[fierce ruin]

Also just doing a massive Diluted Fuel plant saves you all Sulfur, gives massive power, and will hold you until Nuclear.

[marble shore]

Good to know, thanks

At the moment the only sulfur I use is for instant scrap

[fierce ruin]

Oof

[oblique hollow]

power wise...... there is no break even

x is roundtrip in seconds

and 24/60 is the maximum time it takes to fully fill a truck

so that mean X axis scale here is in minutes

and y is MW

[fierce ruin]

Trick always better?

Truck*

[oblique hollow]

power wise, yea

[fierce ruin]

🙃

[oblique hollow]

if the math here is correct

train simply has a higher base power usage

[fierce ruin]

Driving. Will look more in a bit.

[oblique hollow]

so it cant even approach truck's 40

i can try to math out power usage over throughput in that case

yeaaaaah no even if base power over travel time is accounted for truck wins

meaning trains will always cost more power / fuel / resources

and since we can quite easily actually expand truck routes now (give a truck the same route via loading, and if you need more throughput attach another truck station to the route)

[wind spade]

truck uses 75 tho

[fierce ruin]

Each truck added increases fuel cost though.

So as the distance increases (which increases trucks needed) the cost of trucks goes up.

[oblique hollow]

can be accounted for via travel time

[oblique hollow]

the station uses 75 MW? u sure

[wind spade]

no, the truck

[oblique hollow]

75 what

[wind spade]

75 MW

[oblique hollow]

wha

[wind spade]

when accelerating

so pretty much all the time

[oblique hollow]

saying "truck uses 75 MW" is pretty odd thing to state

since you know, fuel

[wind spade]

well it uses MJ/s, which is MW 🤷‍♂️

[fierce ruin]

1. Freight Platforms also take 50 MW each? Jesus....

[oblique hollow]

doesnt the fuel usage only depend on how much of the route has been completed now?

aka it precalculates usage and then just does "how much of the route have you completed"

im pretty sure someone said the truck switches "usage mode" when you drive em manually

[wind spade]

no idea 🤷‍♂️ but it still has to be calculated somehow, right?

[oblique hollow]

yea, might now be an equation for "MJ per meter"

[wind spade]

I thought it's based on the recorded route's consumption

[fierce ruin]

Are you guys talking about the refueling mechanic?

[oblique hollow]

yea, how is it mathed

[fierce ruin]

Trying to see relevance to current equation..?

The "trucks are 75 MW" is from the fact 1 unit of fuel is worth 750 MW and a truck can drive for 10s on 1 unit of fuel.

Fuel as in the orange kind.

[wind spade]

before U5 it was "when you're pressing W, it uses 75 MJ/s, when you're not pressing W, it uses nothing". And autopilot pretty much pressed W all the time

[fierce ruin]

Yes.

But you're also ballparking train MW consumption given that varies too.
So just using trucks as 75 MW and locos at 67.5 MW is fine imo as long as " *results may vary depending on flatness of terrain" is in the findings.

Where trucks have the advantage going uphill given they max out at 75 where a train going up hill can hit 110.

[wind spade]

trains use variable power based on how much energy they need to go. Trucks (at least before U5) were always "full or nothing"

[fierce ruin]

Yes. And for the majority of a long truck route they will be holding W.

[oblique hollow]

oh, that, took that into account, thats the 375 MJs

[wind spade]

yeah I didn't read the whole convo I just came here and saw "trucks use 40" which sounds wrong 🤷‍♂️

[oblique hollow]

truck stations

2 of them

20 MW each

[fierce ruin]

I missed where the 155 + 5416 comes from.

[oblique hollow]

155 = 50 MW continuously for a train station x 2

• 55 MW average mean train power usage

and 5416 = 200 MW (for 4 freight platforms, 50 MW each while active) times 27,08 seconds

so another MWs value

might need to tranform both to minutes

[fierce ruin]

Ok breaking THAT down...

[oblique hollow]

hmmm wait its a wrong assumption....

should be half

[fierce ruin]

155 =/= 50 x 2 so I'm lost there...
Also as I mentioned earlier do the Freight Platforms also cost you 50 per when active? (Wiki says yes, can't confirm though atm)
Where is 55 the mean when the average of 25-110 is 67.5?

[oblique hollow]

155 = 2* 50 + 55

55 is the mean power usage for one loc over a round

so assumed "constant"

since loc power is very dynamic

[fierce ruin]

Ok.
Platform MW usage?

[oblique hollow]

50 MW when active

[fierce ruin]

Re-reading.

Sec.

[oblique hollow]

will have to halve the 5416 value as it assumes all 4 platforms runn at once for 27.08 seconds

aaaaaand barely affects anything

[fierce ruin]

In minutes the platforms are at 90.2666666-

I think you have to set a distance for this to work.

[oblique hollow]

yea since it assumes equal round trip time

which is not true

[fierce ruin]

Because the total time the platforms are using power is only a fraction of the round trip time.
And if you don't have a round trip time then you don't know your total MJ used by the train.

And you can't compare to the truck accurately unless you're plugging in a distance, because that round trip time will be different given the speeds are not equal.

[oblique hollow]

i could simply test this ingame by just using power storages

buuut the results will vary

[fierce ruin]

True. But I'd say easiest next step is to compare assuming a totally flat environment.
Get said result then can be tweaked to account for terrain.

[oblique hollow]

right, time to build a test track

[fierce ruin]

You need to build this?

[oblique hollow]

i have to

to verify data

or: to simply measure roundtrip time

[fierce ruin]

I'm doing rough maths and we shall compare then 🙂

[oblique hollow]

doing distance based fuel consumption is very rough to do

thats why id rather just pit the 2 against each other in a test

[fierce ruin]

How fast does a train go on flat terrain?

@oblique hollow

I believe I have simplified it.

If you give every advantage to the train you still have a 1873 MW gap to make up before it costs less than trucking.

Regardless of distance.

Which would be competitive only if the distance is great enough that you need nearly 20 trucks to handle the throughput.
And I do not believe there is a long enough route to make that possible.

[slate prism]

Is there a known bug with programmable splitters? I've done some searching and it seems people have had issues on servers, but I'm playing alone and the programmable splitters are acting the same as regular splitters, even with all the materials set in to the lists.

[fierce ruin]

Yes.

Poggers are not entirely reliable atm.

[slate prism]

righto. Thanks

[fierce ruin]

Then again they shouldn't really be used in the first place.

Hyper-specific use-cases for them to be optimal over just chaining smarts.

[slate prism]

To each their own :)

[fierce ruin]

That really isn't a to each their own thing though.... it's objectively true.
Which is why they will most likely change poggers before 1.0

[fierce ruin]

Basically trains are trading power and space for convenience of not having to fuel them if you're in a comparable throughput range where trucks are relevant.

[oblique hollow]

120 km/h of course

[fierce ruin]

I've only ever reached that on a downhill 😬

[oblique hollow]

btw, funny enough.... i have a track of roughly 450 m, and both truck and train take 1 minute and 45 seconds xd

[fierce ruin]

Also see the above simplification of comparison.

I believe if you're purely talking about MW and staying within the realms of realistic builds, trucks always win.

[oblique hollow]

ok though, but for roughly 500 m, 1 train with 2 cars and 1 truck are completely equal

in terms of throughput

i have yet to do the power test

[fierce ruin]

500m is round trip or point-to-point?

[oblique hollow]

500 m is the round

so 250 m roughly

[fierce ruin]

Using Fuel the truck's max value is ~91 MW for that trip.

Without factoring truck stops.

[oblique hollow]

it takes 2 fuel for that trip

which.... means fuel is more efficient in auto

20 seconds versus 1.45 minutes

[fierce ruin]

Yes, but I'm doing things in terms of Max Truck and Min Train to give train as much of a chance as possible.

If train never wins even when using the Max MW from Truck and the absolute unrealistic Min MW from Train then you don't have to waste time solving for precision of when one is better.

[oblique hollow]

hmm.... correction: the route is 950 m

so the entire loop

.... yet the distance is only 225.... wha

eh, round should be 450 m, there

igonre 950

i think wait time might be calculated into this for some reason?

[fierce ruin]

Wait time is just unloading time.

So if it is spending 24s on each end unloading that could be where the total 950 thing is coming from?

[oblique hollow]

ok the route calc is useless

it increases every time i change the wait time

[fierce ruin]

Lol

You notice the new node color?

[oblique hollow]

yello?

[fierce ruin]

Yeah.

Wasn't in any of the notes.

Makes me think they are getting closer to having a specific "docking node".

[oblique hollow]

ok so fuel calc seems right it just does invisible rounding

also my truck refuling system seems borked

it just loads full every time

[fierce ruin]

Declare what I am assuming is true then solve your other issues 😛

[oblique hollow]

also nope, may be based on averaging truck travel distance and updating it every so often

in any case it doesnt seem to actually reflect the calculated fuel consumption

as thats handled by some other logic

[fierce ruin]

Station UI has been borked since they added the new parts to it.

[oblique hollow]

else it would consume 2,6666666 fuel for 478 m distance, yet suddenly write 1800m path length

seeems 1 fuel is like.... 175 m?

[wintry aurora]

Talking about the fuel calc?

I was confused by that earlier after I had added more vehicles to the route and I thought I had been using enough, but not sure if the polymer clog was the cause of them running out or I really needed to do more, so, I left the increased production as is after fixing the clog.

[fierce ruin]

1 fuel is 10s, so depends on how fast you're going for 10s.

[wintry aurora]

Could reduce it back to test of 40/m really wasn't enough or not.

Course though, the problem is that it's also transporting the batteries, so, the vehicles will try to eat the batteries.

[fierce ruin]

I also think you're getting hung up on fuel calc.

[wintry aurora]

Me?

[fierce ruin]

No.

[wintry aurora]

Mostly just curious if 40/m actually is enough, but most likely not.

[oblique hollow]

yea but.... 10 seconds for a 1:45 minute route? yea sure

[fierce ruin]

Returning to this:

Yes, but I'm doing things in terms of Max Truck and Min Train to give train as much of a chance as possible.
If train never wins even when using the Max MW from Truck and the absolute unrealistic Min MW from Train then you don't have to waste time solving for precision of when one is better.

[oblique hollow]

ok the true travel time is only 57 seconds

[fierce ruin]

🤷‍♂️ if this is something to solve cool, but I don't see relevance to the main point of truck vs. train given the above simplification.

[oblique hollow]

soooo 3 fuel for one minute

aka....... 1 fuel for 20 seconds

[fierce ruin]

If you completely advantage one and disadvantage the other but trucks still win, solving specifics is pointless imo.

[oblique hollow]

i just wanna know how fuel calc works now

i already understood trucks beat trains in power efficiency

[fierce ruin]

.............................................

Me saying it and you "understanding" it doesn't declare it for the rest of the interested parties though...

[oblique hollow]

what else is there

[wintry aurora]

Isn't it supposed to load full? There's no option or anything?

[oblique hollow]

formulating the math properly?

[oblique hollow]

its only supposed to take 3 fuel, thats it

[fierce ruin]

You agreeing to my declaration instead of it being solely my declaration 🤷‍♂️

[wintry aurora]

Is that cargo or the fuel?

[wintry aurora]

I noticed too.

[oblique hollow]

fuel

[wintry aurora]

You mean it fills past 100?

[oblique hollow]

no, i mean it fills the fuel to 100 when its only suppoed to go to 3

because,remember, station does smart refueling now

supposedly at least

[wintry aurora]

Really? How do you do that? I didn't know that was a thing.

Probably won't show up on this route though as fuel is only on one side.

It might have happened earlier when I was having fuel problems and the cars started trying to eat the batteries.

[oblique hollow]

?? what do you mean "how do you do that"
It just decided to yank all the fuel it can fit into the fuel slot and goes

even if i take it back out, the station fills it up to 100

[wintry aurora]

If you mean it's only supposed to fill as much as the vehicle needs. It's also filling them up to max for me.

[oblique hollow]

yes its only supposed to fill them to what they need on auto

im already writing a report

[fierce ruin]

Mine are still doing only what they need 🤷‍♂️

[wintry aurora]

I've been looking at the cars with deconstruct and mostly it takes 4, though there's some fudge factor with it taking 5 occasionally, to do a full round trip.

[oblique hollow]

because it does rounding

it may actually need 4.5

[fierce ruin]

I'd round up if I was them too tbh.

[oblique hollow]

its only rounded for display

it still does math with the true value it seems

else 1 truck needing 3 fuel would turn into 3 needing 8

[fierce ruin]

Yes but it cannot deposit half an item into the fuel slot.

So if it needs even 4.1 it will (SHOULD) deposit 5.

Unless I am misunderstanding your meaning.

[oblique hollow]

yes thats the thingum it should do

not take 100 fuel when it should take 3

[fierce ruin]

Indeed.

[wintry aurora]

I just tested it with the other route that only has one car (since the other one has 6, and so, huge pileup) by taking some of the fuel from it and instead of inserting in 4 (as the route info claims it would), it filled up to 100.

[oblique hollow]

https://questions.satisfactorygame.com/post/61c23022831c8520523669c5

[wintry aurora]

'
May be a bug related to them now refueling "as normal" when players control them.' Possibly? Since I had to fill it up manually first as I couldn't put it inside the station, but now that that bug is fixed....

[oblique hollow]

actually i cant find anything about the manual refueling changes anymore......

[wintry aurora]

'
May be a bug related to them now refueling "as normal" when players control them.' What do you mean here? I thought you meant that it does what it should be doing to automated vehicles, but it still fills up fully when manually controlled, which is maybe what you meant.

[bright sparrow]

Assuming you set up the non-pipe pieces prior to pipe placement what overall thruput should I expect from 600 pipes on average? Does it matter if the produced liquids are falling from the source, height kinks in pipes or climbing?

[oblique hollow]

depends on pipe length and fps

short mk 2 can easily do 600

[fierce ruin]

I read that as 600 individual pipes. 😬

In which case the throughput is limited by how many of each kind make those 600.

[bright sparrow]

Haha no, referring to the MK2 pipes. And mostly trying to calculate for distance builds

[fierce ruin]

Pipelines are de wae

[bright sparrow]

@fierce ruin as in break up 600 lines into 300?

[fierce ruin]

Don't have to. Pipelines of mk2 can work.

[terse umbra]

my current copper sheet factory has a source of 60 copper ore per minute and 2 contructors but 20 extra ore is wasted since i use the default recipe (20 ore per minute) so is there any way i can redirect that extra 20 copper ore to make something like wire?

The only way i think i can split materials is by half with the splitters

[past cedar]

So I'm kinda new to the game, day 3. Could someone come on my save at some point and help me out with 100% efficiency

[terse umbra]

i can only get 15 ore per minute from each coveyor belt transporting 30 ore per minute which wouldnt be enough to supply the contructor's 20 ore per minute

[stuck iron]

60 ingots will feed 3 constructors making copper sheets

[terse umbra]

yes, however i do not need that many copper sheets as i only need 40 for the production of copper rotors

[stuck iron]

You can sink the rest or store some? Or under clock your miner to produce less ore

[terse umbra]

alright sounds like a good idea, thanks

[stuck iron]

But aren't you short 2.5 sheets per minute?

[terse umbra]

oh crap

i misread my copper sheet as 20 per minute by reading the ore per minute instead

thanks for pointing out my mistake, sorry to make you go through all this

ill just make 30 copper sheet per minute

[sand epoch]

you don't need to design based on how a split happens.. just let one side fill up and the remaining will balance out :/

[fierce ruin]

@sand epoch idk why but I read that as "split happens". 😂

Like take out all the other words.
Just your reply being "split happens bro"

😂

[stuck iron]

I see a sick t-shirt.

[sand epoch]

seek help 😛

[fierce ruin]

No u.

[sand epoch]

i'm beyond help

[proper karma]

How would you take two 480 belts and split it into one 900 belt and one 60 belt?

[cinder silo]

900 belt isn't happening, the max a belt can move is 780

If you want to siphon off 60 though, use a splitter on one of them with a mk1 belt, that carries 60,

[fierce ruin]

That's the neat part.

You don't.

[proper karma]

:c

[proper karma]

Will try that, thanks

[cinder silo]

Small nitric & sulphuric acid combo refinery, will be overclocked because there is no room to build a full size one in the space I provisioned, construction room at the bottom of the waterfall is getting to be a pain.

[patent briar]

Is there a formula for how fast flow rate in fluids ramps up to max? It seems to be logarithmic

[oblique hollow]

So far there isnt.

[patent briar]

I might need to create some kind of train loop to simply just test the fluid throughput of my trains. I think if I just have enough fuel generators though I can make it work, see what I actually am putting through.

[patent briar]

Okay so I have this setup here to test fluid platform throughput:

It seems to be varying on its "item transfer rate" anywhere between 884 to 900 even after running for 30+ min

I cannot fathom why the transfer rate has variance, the trains are set to "wait until full" and are always sitting and waiting, there's never a time they are late to the platform

the left platform is the pickup and the right is the drop off

so the train simple just picks up 1600 on the left, then immediately drops it off on the right

I think maybe its because "Wait until full" has variance on pickup time.

That is to say, it seems to be triggering and docking anywhere between 1601 full and 1700 full

By my math this shouldnt even be physically possible

it shouldnt be capable of exceeding 896, unless the numbers for docking time are shorter than we estimated

[frosty owl]

The "production cost" of fuel varies greatly (considering the cost a combination of effort needed and resources needed)
Eg: running your trucks on liquid biofuel requires as much effort than running trains on turbofuel imo

[frosty owl]

Technically, a single FREIGHT is
One could just have a car go through multiple load/unload freights and load/unload much more than 1560/min total

[oblique hollow]

Theres variance, 899 is close to 896

Also, wait until full takes the waiting time into account

Is it AND or OR?

[fierce ruin]

I'm not understanding what you're saying.

[frosty owl]

A freight has a limit lower than 1560/min, a car shouldn't

[fierce ruin]

Car = ?

[frosty owl]

A train car

[fierce ruin]

What's the difference between a freight car on a train and what you're labeling as a "train car"?

[frosty owl]

A freight is a station, a car is the rail-following container that moves items between freights

[fierce ruin]

A station is where the locomotive docks. Nothing is transferred there. 🙃

[frosty owl]

Whatev, you get the point

[fierce ruin]

I'm assuming this is just a language thing. Because I have never heard a Freight Platform referred to as a "freight" in any context in my entire 30 years of life.

And if you're tracking a single freight car across an entire loop where it does more than 1 pickup and drop-off cycle then yes, unlimited throughput.
But per cycle between pick-up platform and drop-off platform they cannot reach 1560 and most of the time will barely go above 1400.

[frosty owl]

Just have 2 pick up stations and 2 drop off stations (perfectly viable depending on needs and preferences) and the freight car will have a loop for (possibly) >1560/min

[fierce ruin]

That's what I just said?

But it's also a longer way of just having the same 1 train with 2 cars. 🤷‍♂️

[frosty owl]

You could have one train with 2 cars each carrying >1560/min though 🤔

Downside is more stations, upside is shorter trains

[fierce ruin]

Downside is also having to make sure you've got the multiple pickup stations in correct places to make things work.
Which means you're planning your buildings around your logistics instead of your logistics around your buildings.

[reef belfry]

How shorter trains is an upside? Long trains are bae, in using 16 cars + 4 locomotives currently, very majestic

[stuck iron]

need really big blocks to accommodate big trains.

[patent briar]

1271.27 should be the max for a single platform with 2x mk5 belts

Or wait sorry, thats for 100 stack size items.

Max throughput for freight platforms is functional of stack size

[wintry aurora]

Not really, you can just use regular size blocks. Remember that the trains can't enter a block until the block is empty, so, a long single block may actually cause more issues.

[wind spade]

you don't need to fit a train in a single block really

[patent briar]

In other news, can anyone help me with tweaking my signals if possible to improve my train speed? Theres one problem spot I have and I dont know if theres a better way to set the signals up, lemme snap a pic

[wintry aurora]

Chaining path signals? I've been told that's one way to speed things up.

[oblique hollow]

chaining signals means the train doesnt have to wait in the middle of the route you chained

aka if you start your "path" at the top of a hill and chain signals along the way, it doesnt lose speed

[wind spade]

it means that the trains frees the parts of path earlier

[oblique hollow]

nothing to improve there tbh

[patent briar]

So my problem arises when a train A is docked in the green section, and a train B is going by on the red section, it slows down a fair bit as it approaches the path signal, then speeds up once it hits purple

[oblique hollow]

put the path signal where the block signal is on the end of the blue track maybe

[patent briar]

If no train is in the green section though, train B will blast through at full speed no problem

[patent briar]

Ill give that a go

that seems to be smoother

thanks!

trying to figure out the ideal path signal setups for all these trains has been interesting

[versed violet]

WTH did they do with "vertical" mode on hypertubes? Can no longer get the horizontal then go down shape, getting ramped instead. Only goes the 'old way' on shorter distance, which is no go, as I don't have a spot to snap a support on.

[patent briar]

Gotta rotate the support end to be vertical

Use scroll wheel after the first click

[tranquil ember]

Could I get a double check on my math here? Ive got a pipe full of heavy oil residue (300 per minute) being fed into 10 refineries all at 75% producing Petroleum Coke (900 per minute), and this fills 36 coal power plants? I feel like this was another ambitious build...

[versed violet]

That does not solve the issue with hypertube not going horizontal then all way down. [and will, in fact, cause a severe damage/death on landing]

[patent briar]

Is this what you are looking for?

[tranquil ember]

I think more of the hard 90 degree angles

[patent briar]

I mean you just get that if you place them in the right spots, I just throw it together

[tranquil ember]

the 2d build mode is a little funky depending on distance and direction of build, sometimes you gotta go from the opposite direction

[patent briar]

looks like noodle mode is best way to get a tight turn

[tranquil ember]

btw how much better is turbo fuel over normal fuel?

[fierce ruin]

what is tree feeding

[wintry aurora]

Not sure the context that's in.

Feeding stuff via a tree of balancers?

[fierce ruin]

ive heard tree feeding just thrown around, i didnt realize it could be applied to multiple things

[wintry aurora]

I have no idea what you mean by tree feeding though. I'm gonna guess it's not in an agricultural context.

[fierce ruin]

no, i think it has to deal with load balancing?

[faint ember]

It is much better, but the diluted fuel recipe is a more efficient use of oil to power and doesn't bring in sulfur.

I think if you really max it out, you can get like 25% more power out of turbofuel

[tranquil ember]

ah ok, had a alt recipe for coke+oil I think

[patent briar]

Hmm, I need to fit.. ~240 fuel generators inside of a 33x26 foundation grid, with 8 pipes of fuel coming in

So about 30 fuel generators per pipe

[cinder silo]

Multi floor ?

[patent briar]

yeah it will have to be

[cinder silo]

I'm still working on getting sulphur from the top right of the map, all the way down to the bottom left, it's been an engineering project and a half.

[patent briar]

There isnt a way to swap what mark of power pole Power Line places for you is there?

Cause if I could swap it to defaulting to mk2 poles that would be wonderful

[modern sail]

Can I post an excel doc here for someone to check my math?

[wind spade]

sure

[cinder silo]

Not that I'm aware of no.

[frosty owl]

A shorter train is more convenient than a long one, excluding other factors, for the same job. They have smaller space requirements for the stations and don't require much distance between signals

Visual preference wasn't mentioned as that's different for everyone :P

[patent briar]

I mean you should just use the train size that matches your needs, calculate what your throughput is, and using the stack size of that item calculate the min number of platforms needed to handle that

[versed leaf]

hey guys I'm a new player looking to just chill but I want to know what would be more optimal;

is it better to have nodes far away conveyor all the way back to the main base and have machinery there or have different factories built throughout the world and transport the finished materials back

currently on tier 3 about to get steel and wondering how I should go about coal/iron foundry and stuff when nodes aren't placed near each other

[patent briar]

Both are fine, the big thing is whether the processed materials take up more, or less, room on the conveyor belt

For example if you have 3 belts of raw materials you can downsize to 1 belt of processed material, its better to have a satellite factory handle it

whereas if processing the material makes it go up in belts, you will wanna do that closer to the point where you consume said material

[versed leaf]

in what case would this occur besides making screws?

[patent briar]

lots of alt recipes do this

[wind spade]

pretty much none

well yeah the pure recipes also do it, but you build those on water usually

[patent briar]

for example, Pure Iron Ingot takes in 35 iron/min but puts out 65 ingots/min

[versed leaf]

that's from hard drives right?

[patent briar]

thats the other big thing, designing your factories to be modular and built with alt recipes in mind

[wind spade]

anyway, I'd say build a factory that makes final products from nodes around, but there's obviously more ways to play 🤷‍♂️

[patent briar]

Personally I have an entire dedicated factory for each item individually, I dont pull items off from existing factories

Until I hit end game and then I swapped to my totally different "this is gonna take months to finish" project

Im 3 weeks in and I dont even have copper or iron ingots yet, but Im nearly done getting stable power up and running, then I need plastic and rubber, then I can finally move on to copper and iron

[versed leaf]

yeah still trying to figure out everything this is so overwhelming but I love it so much

[versed leaf]

thank you guys!

[muted ermine]

Spaghetti factory ftw

[manic compass]

is there a limit to how many players can join a server

dedicated server

[fierce ruin]

Base game - 4.
If you modify that requirement, no.

[frosty owl]

Signals setup question: Can I add a rail between the rails leading from spiral to H1 and H2 to allow trains to travel from H2 to H1 (making part of the Spiral-H2 connection a 2-ways rail)? Names described below

I have 3 train areas to connect. One is a one-way track (Spiral), the other 2 are "highways" with 2 one-way tracks going in opposite directions each (H1 and H2)

How I set it up: I have connected Spiral to H1 and H2 by having a block signal, splitting the rail in 2 rails (one for H1, one for H2)
The rail going to H1 has 2 segments before reaching a path signal that splits it to merge with the H1 tracks
The rail going to H2 goes for a while longer (can have as many segments as I want) before reaching a path signal to be merged on H2.
The trains coming from spiral can reach correctly any of the tracks on H1 and H2

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/553550566991724545/923218157659910196/Cattura.JPG

[fierce ruin]

You can do anything you want.

And you can signal it to be 2-way if you wish.
Only question is if it will cause delays in your traffic.

[frosty owl]

That shouldn't be an issue given the traffic in the area. But when I tried making it 2 ways tye signals started showing looping warnings

Are there some things I should look for in particular when trying to solve the looping issues?

Any advice would be appreciated~

[fierce ruin]

The above screenshot isn't really helping me see where all your signals are to diagnose the issue.

[frosty owl]

I added the signs I have in black (the letters show the side of the track the sign is on), the ones I tried adding in red and in white some of the rails segments

There's an additional path sign eventually on the right, similar to the one leading to H1

[hardy plaza]

aye i need a bit of help

so i made a factory that makes 400 plastic and 400 rubber p/min

• fuel for 20 fuel gens and more for the trucks and so on

but because i dont want to use the 400 plastic im building a second floor over the one making fuel, and by using the stock plastic recipe (the one that makes HOR) i convert the HOR in Petrolium Coke

what could i use the P coke for? i have the circuit board recipe but im using the silica one

[oblique hollow]

coal generators

coke burns in generators

25/min

[hardy plaza]

how much does 1 coke last?

[hardy plaza]

ok

else what can i do?

cause by doing the math ill get 90 coke p/min

[oblique hollow]

nothing unless you got aluminum or steel recipes

[tacit ginkgo]

Coke steel ingots maybe? It’s an alt: 75 iron ore + 75 p coke for 100 steel ingots /min

[oblique hollow]

coke usage is very limited

[hardy plaza]

yea

[oblique hollow]

consider making more fuel?

[hardy plaza]

at first i was thinking to just trow it in the awsome sink tho idk

[hardy plaza]

i dont think i will, this factory is taking me weeks to finish and i dont really want to add other stuff

[oblique hollow]

i mean turn the HOR to fuel instead of coke

[hardy plaza]

but then ill need to either use it for more fuel generators wich i cannot build rn cause im redoing all the factories and need to make a Computer one, or to use it for veichels but then ill need to use more plastic for the packager (ik theres the iron one but the factory is in a place where theres no iron or at least near enogh)

[oblique hollow]

recycled recipe would be useful now....

else throw the coke into the sink

[hardy plaza]

yea

[hardy plaza]

i do think i have both of them actually but im not sure (the plastic and rubber ones)

[whole sapphire]

EN текст

[reef belfry]

following issue has arisen: I have 5 MK5 belts, each supplied by 12 pure iron ingot refineries, thus making all of them saturated

said belts then feed iron wire factory, 312 constructors needing 3900 iron ingots in total, which is exactly 5 saturated MK5 belts, however at the very end of my manifold, about 6 constrctors are idling, despite input belts never stopping for a split second

I have also noticed that sometimes some of my pure iron ingot refineries are idling, due to iron ingot backing up, thus my question:

are MK5 belts REALLY 780/min, as advertised? because from my experience it seems more like ~770

[oblique hollow]

combine all belt sections of the mk 5 into one section via mergers
by snapping a merger at the boundary between belts, you can fuse them by deleting the merger again

[reef belfry]

I see, you mean like this? @oblique hollow

[oblique hollow]

yes

you just fused 2 belts

do that for all belts that are not connected to splitters or mergers

[reef belfry]

okay, I guess there is something bugged about belt sections?

[oblique hollow]

its just inaccuracies

devs stated often enough that many belts or pipes after each other (especially short ones) are very taxing on throughput or stuff

so one very long one is better in that regard

[reef belfry]

I guess I need to watch more QAs, thanks

any trick for elevator / belt connections?

[oblique hollow]

not really

[reef belfry]

damn this is some long belt >.< I dread to think of modifying it

I think I won't bother with this at the moment, I'll just set up everything so math checks out and then count on devs fixing it

quick and dirty solution would be to raise belt throughput by couple percent, but keep advertising them as current

to give wiggle room for this issue to smooth out

[versed leaf]

how did you make the one belt so long without making many sections?

[reef belfry]

McGalleon described it couple messages earlier

[near zenith]

does anyone know offhand how many water extractors you can fit in the south eastern lake in the dune desert? the one that's directly north of the swamp

[cinder silo]

Combining sections on some of my colossal belts hangs my game 😦

[proper karma]

Anyone know of a 1 to 10 even split?
nvm found this
https://youtu.be/UJ3gE-3DcFQ?t=448

[wintry aurora]

Attempting to go beyond 780?

[cinder silo]

Nope, just wanting 780 out when I put 780 in, I used the splitter trick to merge segments and after so far my game just hangs, no error, just quits responding.

[wintry aurora]

Some kind of optimization issue? Or maybe it's the belt bug kicking in with a venegance because the precision is multiplied and the game doesn't know wtf to do.

[cinder silo]

That precision bug is costing me aluminium which is why I tried to merge belt segments like that to eliminate it, the game just didn't like it.

I don't know if it would do any better if I tried to merge segments with the belts empty or not, I'll have to go shut all the bauxite mines down and test it again, the bit I dislike is merging all those belts is a ten hour job.

[wintry aurora]

Maybe the bug is more serious/complicated than we realize? Although it doesn't cause anybody elses game to slow down, that I'm aware of.

[cinder silo]

Also I can't put water extractors there! wtf, the water should be plenty deep.

[wintry aurora]

Does it have to be on every single section for it to work or can it be every other section?

[wintry aurora]

Where is that? looks like edge of a waterfall.

[cinder silo]

It is, I had to build the extractors about 40 metres above that spot located here.

They are to feed the combined acid refinery below.

[wintry aurora]

Actually, is that the uranium cave waterfall? Maybe you attempted to place where the hole to the void is.

[cinder silo]

Nope, this is the big waterfall in the grasslands, southwest corner of the world map, just below my nuclear power station.

[wintry aurora]

Oh, the one that empties into the void? Might be some weirdness at the edge.

[cinder silo]

Clearer picture of the issue.

I can swim in the water, it just isn't water as far as the extractors are concerned.

Got another fun project in front of me, can I put a silica plant with 14 machines in the space between the particle accelerator building on the left, and the cliff wall on the right. spamming foundations will soon tell me 😄

[wintry aurora]

There's a whole ocean to use back there anyway.

[cinder silo]

True, I do want the silica next door because of the proximity of the blenders.

[wintry aurora]

Insofar as ocean we can access anyway.

[cinder silo]

I aimed to put the nuclear processing in the void below uranium fuel production, even though the radioactivity is nowhere near as bad as I expected it to be, I'm continuing along with it simply for the rule of cool now.

I might be able to fit it between the particle accelerators and the void shaft.

[wintry aurora]

Where are you pulling the quartz from? The nearest ones are over two kilometers away. Though the one north of grasslands might be just under 2km away, depending on starting point.

[cinder silo]

Believe it or not, the quartz is being pulled from a location that is 10km (as the tunnel goes) along with my last remaining sulphur mine.

Good thing I need nowhere near 780 or the belt bug would utterly scupper the thing.

Reckon a small factory will fit between those 😄

[wintry aurora]

Could just split it into two belts from the beginning if you needed to. or use trains.

[cinder silo]

Poor planning ahead is the cause of the immense sulphur trek, the pure sulphur node that is closer is reserved by the aluminium refinery for batteries.

I'm going to widen it by 8 metres because of perimeter clipping issues but yes a 14 machine silica plant fits between the particle accelerators and the void shaft with room to spare 😄

[frosty owl]

"We" just found out a few days ago via a year's old Reddit post... Sometimes info is hard to find 😆

[frosty owl]

The point is to avoid having 780/min pass BETWEEN 2 BELT CONNECTIONS, so one should merge ALL the maxed out segments. Clearly, this works only up to a certain point 😅 (<1km?)

Saturated sushi shenanigans

[fierce ruin]

I am a newfound believer in the Base Recipe for Supercomputers.

🙏

[wintry aurora]

Still, I wonder what causes it to bug out further, the same bug or something else.

[frosty owl]

Probably the game not liking "very long" belt segments for whatever reasons

[cinder silo]

Very long belt segments, yeah that crashed my game twice when I tried it.

Stupid 780 belt glitch!

[frosty owl]

It makes sense (to me) that extending a segment over a certain distance can cause issues with the rendering at the very least

[signal nimbus]

...hoping others can appreciate my headache atm. In another server, saw a picture of someone's first coal plant. 4 gens, 3 extractors. Thought it was odd, and it just got stranger. Apparently they overclocked their gens and extractors to 200%.

...I was able to let them know that they don't need to run their extractors that high, but I'm running out of ways to tell them that since they're already supplying their four gens with 120 coal, if they just overclock to maybe a bit less than 250%, they can get more power with... no effort. But... for some reason... they're waiting to upgrade to bigger miners and belts. And saying they have another node nearby. And they need coal for steel. And they only need enough power to run their steel mill.

...literally zero effort, they even have the power shards from the formerly overclocked extractors.

[oblique hollow]

Quite honestly, no clue whats left to tell them. If you cant convince them that they dont need to do that, nothing left to be done. Not your problem if they wanna do things that way

[reef belfry]

Is there any reason to use diluted packaged fuel over blender diluted fuel? I see some people insisting on using packaged, am I not seeing something obvious?

[upbeat tide]

Nah. Once you have blenders and blended fuel its far easier to deal with

The old DPH system still exists but its...aggrovating at best to get setup

[tribal flint]

hey, i'm actually having trouble, let me explain:

I have a convoyor belt carrying 240 units/seconds. and i want to divide it in 5 equal parts, how do i do this ?

[fierce ruin]

1. Why?
2. Google 1:5 Balancer Satisfactory if you don't want to do a manifold.

[tribal flint]

Because i need to feed 5 different building...

[fierce ruin]

Manifold.

No math required outside of putting the right amount on the belt.

[tribal flint]

what is a manifold ? (i'm french sorry)

[fierce ruin]

Just connect all 5 machines to the one line.

[last fossil]

https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/Manifold

[fierce ruin]

First 4 will fill up and the last one will get the remainder.

[last fossil]

I did nothing but balancers too at first, Manifolds open a whole new world

[tribal flint]

it's that easy ?

[fierce ruin]

Infinite resources.

[tribal flint]

wow

[fierce ruin]

Welcome to Satisfactory.

[last fossil]

The only real downside to a manifold is it takes a bit of time for everything to "warm up" aka the first few machines to fill up

[tribal flint]

so i've been breaking my head this whole time ?

[fierce ruin]

You balance if you choose to balance.
Otherwise just manifold.

[fierce ruin]

Yes.

[tribal flint]

yeah but i think 1:5 doesn't exist

[fierce ruin]

Because you also could have just Googled 1:5 Balancer Satisfactory

[last fossil]

It actually does if you needed it, you split it into 6 then feed the sixth back into the start, but it requires a belt higher than the original throughput

[tribal flint]

ok, see what you meen, what should i choose ? Manifold or balancer ?

[last fossil]

Start messing with manifolds, it helps a lot with general builds, balancers are useful for some things too. They are both tools, useful in their own ways

[tribal flint]

okay, i'll do it ^^

(what i've been making since the beginning)

[last fossil]

Does it work? If yes then awesome!

[tribal flint]

yeah absolutely ! works very nicely !

this one took about 4564897165h to think about

[last fossil]

Yeah manifolds are easier when it comes to the math, so welcome to making everything a lot easier. Good luck in the future

[tribal flint]

thx a lot !

[wanton belfry]

I'm a balancer because I'm a stinky poopoo head, can anyone help me with making a splitter that splits into 3/7 and 4/7?

[fierce ruin]

Google 3:7 balancer and then Google 4:7 balancer?

[wanton belfry]

Ok nvm

[tribal flint]

Works perfectly thx ^^

[frosty owl]

Random fact: One could get a "new pure coal node" (780/min) with little less than 60 carapaces/min

[fierce ruin]

That's even simpler if you mix the belts.

[tribal flint]

How ?

I could just throw iron and coal through one entry ?

[wintry aurora]

That’s a lot of hunting.

[ebon crater]

Yes, if you have belts that are fast enough and smart splitters unlocked(caterium research)

[versed violet]

is the 'bonk' sound when hitting glass only added for the full glass panes from U5?

[oblique hollow]

yep

[tribal flint]

i don't have it, just started a new game

[wintry aurora]

You can get to it pretty quick though if you wanted.

[ebon crater]

then no, untill you have smart spitters its not realy viable

[versed violet]

I need psychological help.
Snutt and jace joked when they said "horizontal lifts".
Right?
Riiiiiight?

[wanton gulch]

how

[versed violet]

Conveyor floor hole.
Snap a splitter/merger.
Enjoy horizontal mode.
[the lifts behave finicky, and can't be rotated, but they fucking work]

I have so many questions now...
Is this intended? Is it a bug?
Do devs know about it?
is this how they made the horizontal lifts screenshot?
Did someone on the team discover this, and they went "oh, thats cool, lets troll the players with it".
Did someone ask whether to fix it, and they had a dialogue like this?
`- should we fix it?

• does it crash the game?
• nope.
• then let em have it.`

[wintry aurora]

What horizontial lift screenshot? And I'm definetly sure the devs know of it.

[versed violet]

this (if reddit links work) https://www.reddit.com/r/satisfactory/comments/pjr5nj/new_feature_horizontal_conveyer_lifts_coming/

[wintry aurora]

Looks different, but they could probably have deleted the splitter/merger or moved them around to make it look that way.

[near zenith]

looking for some clarification on the belt throughput bug and also on manifolding massive numbers.
a) does the belt bug only happen for direct connections between two concurrent belt segments? would going belt -> splitter -> belt still suffer from it?
b) what methods do y'all use for dealing with input amounts over 780? atm i'm looking at a project which would take ~5000 steel ingots, and split it up between 4 distinct groupings, but each grouping would take wildly differing amounts (like, 4k, 300, 600, 100). Based on my concerns about question A, i'm unsure how to calculate manifold throughputs

my first thought is to set up chunks of machines in each grouping which only need, say, 750 steel per chunk, and then let any overflow recirculate through the system, and just flood the smaller lines and have that overflow also rejoin other belts

[fierce ruin]

A) afaik yes, and also yes.
B) Injection manifold.

[cinder silo]

I'm going to purge my bauxite belts completely and give merging them another shot, having my throughput curtailed like that is really annoying.

[near zenith]

with injection manifolding, where would you put injection spots, and how would you deal with throughput? or is the entire philosophy behind mnaifold/injection manifolds more along the lines of "screw it, the material will get there, just set up the machines and saturate"

[fierce ruin]

You put the injection when the first line runs low enough to handle more.
You can either add half or 2/3 of the injecting line into the main line to re-saturate.

[near zenith]

so there's no real rationale to how much a line would be holding anymore, it's only a guaranteed 780 for the first segment after a merger, and then you just kinda guess your way through?

[cinder silo]

That really does need fixing,

[near zenith]

bigfax

[fierce ruin]

? I don't guess.

[near zenith]

i mean, it's also on me for making a factory this large which requires gamebreaking amounts of throughputs but still

[fierce ruin]

Example:

My AIL outpost has 2160 Ct ore being sent to Refineries for Pure Ct.
The way I have it done is 3 lines of 720, and I did it in sections of 562.5 because it made doing water easier.

Main line 720.
First Section: -562.5
157.5
Injection: +480 (2/3 of 720)
637.5
Second Section: -562.5
75
Injection: +600 (remaining 240 and 1/2 of the last 720)
675
Third Section: -562.5
112.5
Injection: +360 (final 1/2)
472.5

I always know how much is on the main line and when to inject more.

So I'm not seeing how this is a guess? or how it has no rationale?

[near zenith]

why 720 specifically?

have you proven the throughput bug has a lower limit on error?

[cinder silo]

Because 780 isn't happening thanks to that bloody precision error that hasn't been squashed.

[fierce ruin]

Neither... 720 because it was simpler to work with 3 lines.

[near zenith]

or are you keeping the 720 because you have a refi group with outputs exactly 720

[fierce ruin]

🤷‍♂️

Comes off the train in 720's.

[near zenith]

on... a 780 belt?

[fierce ruin]

I'm just saying you can easily keep track of how much is where when planning injection manifolds.

(For belts)

The above is an example of how you can track the amount on the belt and be precise with the method. Don't get hung up on the specific numbers it happens to use.

[near zenith]

not particularly hung up on them, just amused by your assumption of 720 output from a train station on a 780 belt being fed from another train station being a constant 720 in any limit that isn't an infinite timescale

you have your level of pedantry, i have mine

[fierce ruin]

I can say I have never had an issue getting 750 out of a mk5 just building them normal.

780 you can get by various things, but if you need 750 or less don't even worry about the bug because it's not going to affect you.

[near zenith]

so, just to belabor my last point of pedantry, anecdotally, most have found 750 as a viable throughput number to assume when manifolding out of a trainstation on a 780 line

[fierce ruin]

To unbelabor you:
If you're manifolding straight out of a train to where you never have consecutive segments because it's always going to a buffer or splitter -- you will get 780.
If you've got consecutive segments you can 100% trust them up to 750. Between 750-780 I can say you'll get higher than 750 but idk the exact value in that range.

[near zenith]

you do know that first point is directly counter to the first time you answered the question about splitters right?

unless you were assuming belt segements/connections in between splitters on that first point

[fierce ruin]

Misread your initial ask. Thought you asked if belt-splitter-belt did not suffer from it. My bad.

[near zenith]

kk, that's what i was hoping

splitter chains for daaaaays time

do we know what causes the belt to belt bug anyway? just floating point bs, or something else?

[cinder silo]

Not sure, the main reason it has such a detrimental effect on my save is some of my belts are 3-4km in length with many sections, The 10km belt thankfully only has to move 350 resources.

[fierce ruin]

If they knew, I think they'd fix it.
🤷‍♂️
They'll figure it out when they decide what they want to do about mk3 miners.

[near zenith]

yea, the difference between 780 belts and 1200 possible outputs always throws me for a loop

[near zenith]

but... why. The choo exists

it's goes...

choo

https://tenor.com/view/hype-train-train-choo-choo-gif-12061880

[cinder silo]

Yeah those don't fit well in my setup thanks to close to 60km of tunnels that are 8m from floor to ceiling.

[near zenith]

well that's a hell of a design choice lol

i'd love to see what that looks like when you're finishedish

[cinder silo]

I had no idea the 780 belts won't do 780 before I had it almost all laid down 😦

[near zenith]

ohnooooo

😦 hugs of commiseration

[cinder silo]

Yeah, I wasn't best pleased, I tried the section merger trick but that hung the game when things got moving, on just two of the 6km bauxite lines.

[stuck iron]

Will trucks fit in your tunnels?

[cinder silo]

The uranium belts thankfully only move 600 until nearby the processing facility when the impure merges in, then only 700 so that isn't affected I hope!, bauxite, coal & sulphur on the other hand were built with 780 in mind.

[cinder silo]

Nope

[versed gale]

if I have 600 heavy oil residue per minute that I want to convert to 1200 diluted packaged fuel per minute, I'm gonna need 1200 empty canisters for both the water and the diluted fuel right?

or is it 2400 empty canisters

[near zenith]

1200 for fuel as an output, 1200 for water as an input, 2400 total

but you can recycle them depending on how you use the fuel, at least the water is auto recycled

[stuck iron]

I see the problem. All those pesky belts are in the way.

[near zenith]

water packaging*

[versed gale]

yes I want to recycle the empty canisters and have them circulating for packaged water and packaged fuel

[cinder silo]

The tunnels are not only too low, they are also too narrow for the traffic required to meet the throughput needs at the distances involved.

[near zenith]

i think the one and only time i tried to make a tunnel, the lack of half width foundations to put between the quarterpipes stopped me. Ended up using like, large metal pillars as an intermediary and was just disgusted by the amount of effort lol

oh silly 50hrs into satisfactory thinking using a pillar was effort

[cinder silo]

The half width foundations for the quarterpipes would be sweet, as would curved walls to have at the end when terminating in a room so you don't have the ugly exposed foundation end showing on a concrete wall because the ramps don't do it.

Also wtb a side conveyor wall that has one hole.

[near zenith]

i mean, you can jank it with a catwalk off the back, and just never look outside the tunnel, but still, ugh

[cinder silo]

Walls can do the tunnel/halfpipe straightaways but when you go to use the halfpipe corners, there is no work around other than don't use them.

[near zenith]

yea, when i tried to make my first turn i realized that, ended up with a staggered pillar corner that was like an accordian unfurling

[cinder silo]

Seeing that would do my head in, I considered the angular look of the ramps to fix that but that brings it's own headaches, and looks terrible in passages below sixteen metres in height.

Eight metre example, the slope is too shallow.

Oof yeah that would definitely do my skull in seeing that every time I passed - #screenshots message

[near zenith]

all i want for christmas is a variable angled procedurally generated wallpiece that auto connects smoothly between two end points

pipes can do it, why not walls

[cinder silo]

The pipes though are one piece that shapes on the fly with two end points, walls on the other hand along with foundations are fixed objects and there are many in a given intersection, you would probably get all sorts of nightmarish fall through the world scenarios if they generated like that.

Not to mention any textures on the walls/foundations would look like a mess of distortions.

I'd settle for the added sections to fill in some blanks as options as opposed to radically changing how foundations & walls interact with one another & the world.

[near zenith]

nope, scrap it all and build it again

no half measures

but yea, some basic corner pieces would be a welcome addition, like something to make angled rooftops actually viable at corners

that's be nice

[cinder silo]

That's true, some areas of my nukes have spaces where corners and inverted corner glass roofing would have been godly.

Even the bridges like this can't really corner due to the lack of corner roof pieces used to make it.

[frosty owl]

I'm pretty sure that's a @oblique hollow's screen 🤔

[oblique hollow]

Nope thats from CSS, i just found a way to do it too

[brittle holly]

Can someone help me do the math for a factory im trying to make? I have the SatisfactoryProduction tab open, but some of the lines put out more per minute than the 780 p/m that mk 5 can carry

and i am struggling to find a way to split this cleanly

[oblique hollow]

Just chose a random cut-off point

Ideally one where you still have a mk 5 belt thats very full but not at 780/min

[fierce ruin]

Or just shove 900 onto a belt and complain that the devs suck 😉

[slim cosmos]

you can just split the belts how ever you like for output. if you have 800 output, you could split to 2x 400 belts and then run them in from opposite ends if the next set needs 800 input

[versed violet]

Have a SS of Yours?

[versed violet]

StructuralSolutions can fill the gaps. (at least some of them)

[oblique hollow]

#satisfactory-memes message
i have a video instead

[signal nimbus]

Can a single flow stabilizer stabilize multiple pipelines? Or does that structure need to be repeated for every pipe to stabilize them all?

[opaque tide]

guys, one question, for computers is better the crystal oscilator recipe or the caterium computer?

[wintry aurora]

I think you meant crystal computer rather than oscillator? Crystal computer is generally better, but they’re both pretty situational.

[opaque tide]

ok thanks

[thorn bane]

do you have smart splitters splitting off the 562.5? cause afaik you need them

[fierce ruin]

Nope.

[elder pebble]

anyone knows how to split 45 - 15?

60 -> 45, 15

[fierce ruin]

Split in half, then split half of it again. Merge the 1/4 back with the other 1/2.

Simple.

[deft summit]

60->30, 30->30,15,15->45,15

[frosty owl]

@oblique hollow?

[fringe pawn]

The game converts thing to 4 digit decimals, right?

I'm looking at 1102.5 aluminum scrap per minute, and the refinery configurations get a little weird.

[frosty owl]

The production is always (base production)*clock. The clock value is rounded at 4 decimals, so that decides the precision of your actual output/min

[fringe pawn]

Working on my all defaults factory, and I'm really seeing the value of power related alts.

[frosty owl]

No-Coal-Only-Biocoal challenge when?

[fringe pawn]

Plot twist: turbofuel, fed with biocoal

[frosty owl]

Urgh

[fringe pawn]

I am giving myself polyester fabric, so as not to be a total monster. I go back and forth on whether I'll add diluted fuel.

[thorn bane]

#math-and-meta message
its like a 5h discussion about manifold imjection including a test setup and all the shenanigans.
result was you need smart splitters otherwise it doesnt work

[fierce ruin]

Is that link to the start or the end of it?
Because all I can say is mine work...
Not sure how you guys were doing your injections?

[thorn bane]

thats the end
#math-and-meta message thats was the initial setup that didnt work

[fierce ruin]

Lemme see.

If you're trying to inject to where you'd max the belt out I could see there being issues.

But I never do that.

Like my given example, mk5's all the way down but I never come close to approaching 780 on the belt itself.

[thorn bane]

it has nothing to do with max belts its about the manifold not filling up correctly sind the last part in the line will clog the injected input instead of providing more for the previous block

[fierce ruin]

I don't want it providing more for the previous block though?

Gimme a bit. You're making me need to go look at the ones I have running to see if I can tell you why they specifically are working.

[thorn bane]

just check if your injection lines are stuttering

[thorn bane]

the issue is that splitter dont split 720 into 562.5 and 157.5 but into two times 360
merging that with 480 is impossible
thats why you just take a smart splitter because that will split it 562.5 157.5 after the block overflows

[fierce ruin]

"Splitter" isn't splitting into 562.5 and 157.5

There are like 12 of them... First is splitting 720 into 240x3 until the side back up, then it's 240+Remainder from sides, and so on.

Also I checked it on a test build and learned 2 interesting things:

1. Yes, you need a smart splitter before injection point, but you don't need them all the way down the line. Which, given injection manifold is being brought over from pipes, basically means you need a smart before the injection point the same way you put a valve before fluid injection points.
2. When using mk5s and splitting into lower mk belts, the manifold does indeed start to skip machine further down the line. In this example, with mk2s, the first 6 machines filled properly but machines 7 and 8 were starved and it resumed filling from 10 going backwards.

[oblique hollow]

Its a single pipe structure

It doesnt have the needed capacity (or connections) for multiple lines

[wintry aurora]

What's the flow stabilizer structure? Valve?

[frosty owl]

It's in the Piple

[wintry aurora]

Inside the pipe? lol?

[oblique hollow]

Plumbing Manual

Piple is this dumb name that some came up with. "Pipe + Bible"

[wind spade]

Re: injection manifold

I'd just not build those, rather just use what is on the belt

[wintry aurora]

I'll look at your manual thing again, maybe I missed it.

Oh that, I thought that was just a form of manifold.

[near zenith]

yea, i'm thinking to plan for 750 belts, with a smart splitter at the end on middle overflow, and let everything go back into the original containers if it manages to do more than 750 per output belt or something

[wind spade]

I don't do containers 🤔

At least not in the middle of production

Only at the end

[near zenith]

it's more a buffer after the trainstation container, plus i really dig the visual of a wall of containers just belting out stuff into a factory

[wind spade]

My factory is from ore to final product 🤷

[near zenith]

🤷

[shrewd yacht]

is it actually better to OC the fuel generators?

[near zenith]

usually, no

[fierce ruin]

All that does is save you space.

So if space matters to you - sure.

[near zenith]

nuc's are the only ones where it's "worth" it

[shrewd yacht]

so 200% is not double the output on them?

[fierce ruin]

No.

[shrewd yacht]

right ok, havent played in ages and restarted after the tier changes

[fierce ruin]

Stop looking at the bottom left of the UI and look at the middle left of the UI.

That's the actual power number.

[shrewd yacht]

havent actually built any just yet, just planning ahead

[fierce ruin]

250% is the closest you'll get to double output.

[shrewd yacht]

kind of crazy if I go with 133 generators 😛

[fierce ruin]

Medium number.

[near zenith]

doooooit

learn to love the build, go zen

[wintry aurora]

Fuel generators? That's about how many I built.

[shrewd yacht]

I kind of value my framerates though hehe

[fierce ruin]

Last fuel build I did was 504 gens.

Turbo Fuel went brrrrrr.

[wintry aurora]

It's not gonna kill your framerate. Unless potato computer or something.

[shrewd yacht]

havent done anything big after I upgraded

used to play on an i5 3570K with a 970 at first then a 2060

now I'm on a 5600X with a 3070Ti

[fierce ruin]

Flexing.

😁

[shrewd yacht]

well I've seen videos of these mad builds and the framerate is really low

[wintry aurora]

Megafactories maybe?

[shrewd yacht]

think it was kibz that gave himself a container full of shards to OC everything to save on fps

problem is hes going to need half the maps resources to power it heh

[fierce ruin]

He also did a megabase. Which is 1. Ew and 2. Why he had frame issues.

[shrewd yacht]

I stopped playing when I got down to around 30fps on my old PC

and it had some stutters moving around to fast

[near zenith]

usually you can avoid most fps issues by spacing out production locations

if you want to megabase, yea, you're going to get cpu slapped

[fierce ruin]

Was going to say. I do large outpost builds and I've never played on better than a 960.

[shrewd yacht]

oh well... still have to get RCUs going so I can build blenders

[wind spade]

246.2288%

[fierce ruin]

Normal gens?

Non-nuclear*

[wind spade]

Yeah

[fierce ruin]

Precisely .2288 or is that rounded?

[wind spade]

Convo was about fuel gens 🤷

[fierce ruin]

I'm just covering my bases.

[wind spade]

It's .2288xx, so technically .2289 to round up

But due to fluid bug I'd say just 246% is fine

[fierce ruin]

But you wouldn't do .2289 because every so often it would misfire, right?

So .2288 would be constant but eventually back up, which you can fix with and overflow hook.

[wind spade]

I'd consider gens stopping for a second once in a day or so fine, rather than them not consuming all fuel (because oil and byproducts and stuff)

[fringe pawn]

I would just crank them all the way to 250%. If you have power storage in the system, the generators occasionally stopping due to not quite enough fuel should be no problem.