math-and-meta

[glacial peak]

yeah im just leaving enough room for when i get mk3 mines

to expand it

[oblique hollow]

i think you would only need one vip if done right

if you even wanna use a vip that is

[glacial peak]

what is VIP again cause it's not very important person

[unique cypress]

Varialble input priority

priority merger for liquids

[wind spade]

*magical priority merger for liquids

[glacial peak]

if only i actually understood pipework 😅

ill try not to mix the water cause i dont know how to input the recycled water in the system without issues

[oblique hollow]

would a 4th refinery for the 3:4 at 250% really be a dealbreaker?

if you put it in a mk 3 BP you'd have room for 8 anyway

[unique cypress]

Eh, I guess I could OC them to 150% and 200% instead

[oblique hollow]

250, 250, 25 | 225
alternatively: 200, 200, 125 | 225

for alumina. that way you wouldnt need to worry about where to put a VIP

otherwise... well its still just a single input of 450/min fresh water

[unique cypress]

man this sucks. if I do 3:4 @250%, the output is 1500 ingots/min. 2x750...

[sand epoch]

And thats bad why?

[unique cypress]

because it doesn't use mk6 belts effectively

but maybe it'll be fine

depends how many belts of alu ingots I'll actually need

[unborn dome]

Aside from mandatory uses for converters (EPM, DMR, ficsite ingots), does anyone use any of the mineral conversions as a regular practice, or mainly only in a pinch?

[gloomy shoal]

The problem with the conversion is even as a "Fuck, I'm out of limestone" solution is you still have to get at least the SAM over to the factory
At which point you can probably just run the real material over instead

[unborn dome]

Yeah that's what I'm seeing too, hardly seems worth it.

Unless you just happen to have a SAM node right there anyway

[gloomy shoal]

Or a spare train running the stuff everywhere

[unique cypress]

I used it in my equipment factory. It needed basically every single resource, but in laughingly small amounts. So I dragged over half of them, some SAM and made the rest. That's the only practical use I can think of

[unborn dome]

That's a good point, like for an ammo factory

[unique cypress]

And the non-pracrical use is maxing out nuclear and making more uranium than would be normally available

But using all the natural uranium is already a 100+ h project

[unborn dome]

Actually that's kinda perfect for making ammo, iron ore turns into sulfur and coal

...Or I just build the ammo factory in the southwestern blue crater where all those nodes are already

[glacial peak]

the main reason why im making my ammo attached to the oil factory is cause sulfur and everything else is within a stone's throw

the western side of the lake will have ammo the eastern side is the refineries and generators

[unborn dome]

My main oil refinery is on the northern coast, but I'd debated building a smaller secondary oil refinery down there for turbofuel and whatnot, so ammo factory there as well might make sense.

[main shuttle]

has anyone compiled a list of the absolute minimum amount of mats needed to get to game completion?

[old hearth]

Do you mean resources or resources types

[main shuttle]

i guess both

[vapid gorge]

0.0001 pm of most resources will eventually get you there

[supple gazelle]

it doesnt all fit on one screen but i think this is enough to show the uhh, byproduct issue @vapid gorge

[vapid gorge]

use this to paste the actual link 🙂

[supple gazelle]

im making time crystals elsewhere but for some reason its insisting on using them on something and i dont know where its grabbing those from, or how to tell it not to do that. this is new behavior.

https://www.satisfactorytools.com/1.0/production?share=QyqBAvwcuIGKgAM1ctIE

[vapid gorge]

it's also a good way to keep track of your plans by placing them in a spread sheet or something

so my guess is you have all these inputs in here not getting used and doing something weird.

and that borked it a bit.

there's a few quirks in SFtools behaviours

[supple gazelle]

right yes, thats how im keeping track of whats already being made that is in the bigger plan. it didnt do this last night

[vapid gorge]

edge case quirk I'd imagine. I'd use a spread sheet to manage all that and the final plan web links you land on

I've never had so many unused manual inputs in a tab myself xD

@wind spade might be interested in it? or probably something he's seen before

[supple gazelle]

i will most definitely make a clerical error if i can't keep it all in one place (i will have an input i forget to use, and duplicate the factory). its more work but i guess i can transfer it all to satisfactory modeler, since that seems to be the new hotness

[vapid gorge]

eesh, do yourself a favour and just type a few numbers into a spread sheet

takes a 1000x as long to make anything in modeler

the only reason it's hot is because the author spammed it onto steam and doesn't have a learning curve. But that's because it lacks huge utility.
tools has a small learning curve but the UI is fantastic

[crimson moat]

you could, but it was incredibly janky and unsupported technically. You had to abuse a bunch of game behaviours in a way that they weren't intended to be used which took a lot of space and complexity, and any of them being changed at a later date (such as how items were unloaded by containers) could break all of your stuff. Now all of that is handled in 1 tiny and officially supported building with a few UI clicks.

[cyan cypress]

Can you not change color of ceiling lights ?

[vapid gorge]

use a light switch

[cyan cypress]

What’s that I’ve never used it

Ahh I found it

[oblique peak]

I just started fase 4 and this is what my plan is

Any idea how to do I without geting anyware nere spiders

[vapid gorge]

https://tenor.com/view/no-pixels-cant-see-ben-chang-community-ken-jeong-gif-17361588

though as it looks like modeler, more pixels wouldn't really help much

[gray flower]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-cat-math-math-cat-numbers-cat-funny-gif-13385485103134761656

[oblique peak]

Yea it’s also just spread out a bunch for the pic

[vapid gorge]

modeler also just has a terrible user interface for anyone else who doesn't already know exactly whats on it, being the main issue

[oblique peak]

Ahhh, I just like to have a plan ant I suck at bacic math so having the numbers right thare helps

[vapid gorge]

I recommend https://www.satisfactorytools.com/1.0/production , has a small learning curve but is a million times faster

plus you can share plans easily, save them as links, and the UI is very readable by anyone you want ot consult with

[oblique peak]

Thanks I will check it out

[vapid gorge]

just as a thing, you'll want to either turn off the converter machine in options or untick SAM ore as an input.
the conversion recipes are considered base so it'll often try using those. But other than that there aren't really any hurdles

[frosty owl]

The combo of SFTools and Modeler can be quite handy indeed~
One covers for the shortcomings of the other.
Personally, I prefer using both rathe than just one: SFTools to make math, Modeler to "draw" the resulting factory/recipes chains while still having a tally of all resources

[wind spade]

Since input is considered "free", Tools use it if possible. It's kinda featurebug

[high saffron]

is this good for a phase 3 power plant?

[frosty owl]

Yes...?
What are you unsure about?

[high saffron]

unsure if it the most efficient design

[frosty owl]

If you don't have Blenders, there shouldn't be any doubt about that

[high saffron]

alright then thanks

[split sierra]

you are confined to 1560 coal and sulfur right?

[unique cypress]

Tools optimizes for lowest resource usage. That's it. Manual inputs are not resources and are considered free. Because your "byproducts" are made entirely from inputs, making or not making them costs exactly the same amount of resources. 0. So if it's allowed to make something for free, it just might.

[supple gazelle]

That’s great, I’m more interested in restoring the old behavior before it started doing that, but it seems nobody knows how. Thanks anyway

[wind spade]

tools haven't changed behavior in this matter since the release

[unique cypress]

I don't know the internal workings of the optimizer, and I don't know how it chooses between different plans of the same "value". I'm guessing it's "random", i.e. whichever "lowest cost" plan it finds first, it'll spit out that one.

The only way I can think of to reliably get rid of those, is to just disable recipes. But also, any change to the plan could make the optimizer stumble on a different plan first, one without byproducts (if I'm right about how it works)

[supple gazelle]

It also seems to change my numbers sometimes when my browser closes, but that’s not new behavior, just a great test of my bad memory.

[unique cypress]

I think for new tools, you should re-optimize the plans for power or something after they've been optimized for resources. It'll get rid of this, and those random canisters byproduct plastic/resin often gets turned into. Unless you have some better plan for it already

[wind spade]

the solver should™ be deterministic

as for "multiple different plans", the behavior there isn't defined, but from what I've seen it usually tries to optimise for lowest amount/total sum of variables (meaning lowest amount of byproducts, so it processes things to make the byproducts be less)

[wind spade]

you can't really "reopitmise" a plan 🤔

[unique cypress]

... You optimize for one variable, then set it to be exactly that, and optimize for a second variable

[wind spade]

yeah, so for the second reoptimisation, I'll need to set the byproduct to be the same

[unique cypress]

not sure why that'd be the case but sure

[wind spade]

well because otherwise the production wouldn't match?

[crimson moat]

The whole point is to make the production not match, so long as the thing that we want to produced is matched (and it always will be, as maximise proved that amount possible) then that's all that matters.

The rest of the plan changing to something which uses fewer resources (as it does when copying from maximise mode to regular mode right now) is explicitly desirable and the reason for this feature (or for copying from Maximise mode to regular).

The feature would just save you from having to make it in the equivelant of V1 tools Maximise mode, then copying that production amount of your desired item to non-maximise. That is really bad and unneccesary UI wrangling at the moment.

[wind spade]

if the production doesn't match, then it's no longer optimised for resources though?

[high saffron]

confined from the sulfur due to being at the blue crater area

[wind spade]

(at least not necessarily)

[split sierra]

to round up the refineries and maximize oil consumption you could sacrifice a couple of somersloops to boost production

(very controversial)

[unique cypress]

I'm not asking for byproducts. I'm asking for outputs. Only outputs need to match. Idk why byproducts would need to

[high saffron]

on which machines? to deal with decimals i usually just build a few more machines and underlock them

[tepid kettle]

I would say save your sloops for assembly parts

[wind spade]

if outputs match, but you optimise for power, you'd get power-efficient production, not resource-efficient production

[crimson moat]

"Maximise" doesn't optimise for resources. KYO wants a "two pass" option which will maximise, and then optimise it for resource usage without changing the output.

This exists in Tools right now and gives you an objectively better plan than using Maximise alone, but you have to fight the UI and use 2 different modes in series to do it.

[unique cypress]

You optimize for resources, keep used resources fixed to what you got in the first step, optimize for power

[split sierra]

one machine should be enough, i set the turbo fuel refineries to 88.888 to round up to pipe limitations

[tepid kettle]

Phase 3 turbofuel power plants are so complicated

[high saffron]

oo ty

[tepid kettle]

With the unpackaging and stuff

[split sierra]

without the packaged which i added arbitrarily for trucks and personal use you get about 6.66 more generators than the original plan

[wind spade]

that's not what we're talking about, I know how maximise works (and I also don't want to change this on existing tools, as stated multiple times in the past, because it would change people's plans)

we're talking about tools using input to create random byproducts

[crimson moat]

Another thing: Being able to input custom weights for resources would be a massive upgrade. They can default to the same now, but if somebody can just set their weights (and tweak them) then it saves A LOT of time when e.g. optimising for region or world resources.

[wind spade]

I think this may lead to non-resource efficient builds 🤔 but I'm a bit confused right now and trying to visualise it

especially when using maximise mode

[wind spade]

new tools will most likely have something like that, old tools technically have them but it's not in UI, not planned to be added to old tools though due to lack of free time and not wanting to waste more time on old tools

[unique cypress]

For items/min mode:
Step 1: do what you're doing right now - fixed output, optimize for resources
Step 2: freeze the resources used to be exactly what step 1 produced
Step 3: fixed output, fixed resources, optimize for power

For maximize mode:
Step 1: maximize for output
Step 2: set the output to be exactly what step 1 produced
Step 3: do all steps from items/min mode

[vapid gorge]

Could just do a bunch of diluted fuel. Much simpler

[high saffron]

ill probably do that with the remainder of the oil in the area

[vapid gorge]

Or just that. Saves importing a ton of crap and it’s lots of power

Plus you could build more diluted on another node

[unique cypress]

Yeah, unless you really want the improved oil efficiency, Turbo is not worth bothering with. Even if you have all the resources nearby, it's more work per MW than diluted

[graceful tundra]

wa- you don't need to unpackage

[tepid kettle]

With diluted packaged fuel

[tepid kettle]

Which is like 4x as efficient for oil with the HOR alternate

[graceful tundra]

Diluted fuel exists yk

[tepid kettle]

Im talking about phase 3 here

[graceful tundra]

OOOOO

[tepid kettle]

You dont have blenders at that point

[graceful tundra]

I forgot

[tepid kettle]

They get wayyyyy better in phase 4

And you unlock rocket fuel at phase 4

So 5 refineries 8 blenders( with alternates) and you get 37.5 GW

[graceful tundra]

Yeah... should've used that because turbofuel sucks

[tepid kettle]

The crater lake is so good for it

I can get almost 200GW from it

[analog socket]

can any1 help split 116.25 into 3 smelters at 100% and 1 at 87.5%

is there anything that lets you split something into a specific amount without having to use a bunch of splitters and mergers

[unique cypress]

A single splitter

Wait no 2

That's 4 smelters total

Basically manifold it

[analog socket]

how long would hte manifold take to fully fill up

[noble timber]

Not very long

[unique cypress]

Also, I wouldn't bother with underclocking unless you really need to

[analog socket]

i mean i can produce 240 iron but then my miner is doing too much

should i jusat settle for inputting like 120 iron ore into it

[noble timber]

Manifolds only really take a while to fill if its like 20+ buildings and your input isn't very large

[analog socket]

or should i fill up the manifold before i even start the machine

[unique cypress]

Even with nuclear, if you do it correctly, it only takes a few hours

[noble timber]

Exactly

[unique cypress]

If you want to. You don't need to

[noble timber]

But a manifold for 4 smelters will fill up in a few minutes

[analog socket]

should i just manifold everything

[noble timber]

Pretty much

Saves a lot of headache

And space

[analog socket]

the problem with the amount i need is like everything is an odd number i literally cant load balance it

im doing a smart plating factory

[noble timber]

Smart plating numbers are generally pretty nice but as a rule of thumb just manifold everything

[vapid gorge]

just clock things so you have an even number of machines to feed, easy to load balance

not that load balancing anything is mechanically useful

[severe girder]

A loop is 12km so each train can do 10 loops a hour at 120kn/h. each train is 6,800 items so each train can drop of 6,800 items every 10mins. But I need 6,800 items every single minute. And we need to factor in the 1 or 2 mins to pickup and drop off the items

Whats the most efficient way? I am able to have multiple trains on multiple rail ways

[noble timber]

you can use this as a ballpark to get the number of cars you need, then divide it by a size you think is manageable for you and maybe add on an extra one for safety

Having 1 big trains vs multiple smaller ones doesn't really impact efficiency unless your train line is saturated

[severe girder]

Im looking at this and don’t rly understand it

So it it saying 26 items a second, and it takes 300 seconds for each trip

Then how many items in a stack and stacks in each train section

[noble timber]

You need to know the throughput you want and the round trip time between your stations

[noble timber]

32 stacks for 1 car

[severe girder]

If you I’ve a large train route does it tell you the full time or just to the next station?

[unique cypress]

Measure the actual time it takes the train to drive the loop, with all the stops and loading/unloading

[noble timber]

No you need to time that yourself

You also need to remember that a freight platform only has 2 outputs so the max throughput on that platform itself will be 2 times whatever the fastest belt you have

With the volume of stuff you are moving I suspect that will be your bottleneck

[severe girder]

Idk of the top of my head so a good guess is. So I need 6,800 a min. So 114 a second. Round trip is 15km, Thats about 7.5minutes, and let’s add 2.5mins for loading and unloading. And everything Im moving stacks to 100 and there is 32 slots

So, 114 x 600 / 100 x 32?

[unique cypress]

What belts?

[noble timber]

You can't just assume your train is at 120 km/h all the time

[severe girder]

480

[severe girder]

Sorry, it’s mostly flat and I’ll be using more front ends than I need to go faster

[noble timber]

Doesn't matter. They could slow down due to signalling, and you also aren't accounting for accel/deccel periods

[severe girder]

Alright

[unique cypress]

With mk4 belts, you need at least 9 platforms to move 6800 items/min total with stack size 100

[severe girder]

Let’s assume Im correct in saying 10mins tho. 114 x 600 / 100 x 32 is 21,888

[severe girder]

could I have 4-5 and use 2 trains?

[unique cypress]

No

[noble timber]

No

[severe girder]

Alright

[unique cypress]

9 platforms minimum

[noble timber]

your platforms can only handle 960/min

[unique cypress]

Because you need 18 belts

[unique cypress]

They can't even do that, actually

[severe girder]

Is this the items per train?

[noble timber]

If I were you I would go for 2 trains of 12 cars each

Or 4 with 6

But potentially a little more to be safe

[unique cypress]

Assuming 9 wagon long trains, you'll need 3 of those to move 6800 items/min 10 minutes round trip

[noble timber]

No, that is the number of cars you need to move your items at the throughput you want

[severe girder]

Did I do it wrong then, it says 21,888

[noble timber]

As a minimum

Yes, it's 21.375

[severe girder]

Alright, sorry for my bad math. I just googled 144x600/100x32

[noble timber]

So as a minimum you require 22 cars but in reality you will need a bit more

[noble timber]

I totally forgot about the pause for loading/unloading lol

[severe girder]

For each train section, doesnt that have 2 in and out, so if a train was 2 long, it could input (480x2) x 2

[noble timber]

Nope

[severe girder]

Or does it just have 2 in and out per whole station?

[noble timber]

True throughput of a station is a bit less as they don't input/output items during loading/unloading

And the more trains you have running through your station, the lower the station throughput will be for that reason

[clear blaze]

guys im planning on making an iron factory what items should i make?

[noble timber]

Everything

[noble timber]

#math-and-meta message This is what you need but if you are like me and like nice numbers you will go for 10 wagon long trains and have 3 of them to have your desired throughput

[clear blaze]

so iron plates, iron rods, reinforced iron plates, and screws? am i missing anything?

[latent swallow]

anyone got a list/link for good performance settings without being potato? the mega projects killing my frames

[severe girder]

Sorry Im new to the game

I may stick with long conveyers a lil longer but I’ll look into this some more

[noble timber]

Depends what you have unlocked, but generally you will need to automate everything

[severe girder]

Frames

I think there called

Modular frames

[clear blaze]

im in phase 2 i just finished all of tier 5 and have nothing unlocked for tier 6

[unique cypress]

You need 2 belts out of the platform into an industrial storage container, then 2 belts out of that to your factory. But you'll only get about 420 per belt. Which is why you need at least 9 platforms. 6800/420/2 = 8.1, rounded up, that's 9

[severe girder]

So 3 trains with 10 wagons along 9 stops?

[noble timber]

9 stops?

[unique cypress]

Why 9 stops?

[severe girder]

9 platforms i mean

[noble timber]

10 freight platforms

+1 station

[unique cypress]

The number of wagons in each train should match the number of platforms

[noble timber]

Or 9 if you are using 9 wagons

[unique cypress]

Why 10? 9 is the minimum. Plus an 18:18 balancer is easier than 20:20

[noble timber]

because even numbers are nice

[unique cypress]

Oh, and did I mention you'll need a balancer to consistently get 420/min/belt? Yeah, you will

[noble timber]

@severe girder If this is your first train setup I wouldn't bother with it tbh

Go for something smaller

[severe girder]

It absolutely is

[severe girder]

Belts 😭?

[noble timber]

What is it you are transporting?

[unique cypress]

Why are you even moving 6.8k of something 5 train minutes away with only mk4 belts?

[noble timber]

This is what im wondering lmao

[severe girder]

Im not, not yet thats why Im looking into trains. But I probably will :(

And that’s all I have unlocked.

[noble timber]

Can those items not be made at the place you are trying to take them?

[severe girder]

Per Minute :
216 Caterium
630 Copper
1215 Coal
3472.5 Iron
720 Limestone
180 Crude Oil

[noble timber]

Oh...

[severe girder]

There the natural resources, then taking them all to 1 mega factory type place

[clear blaze]

wait what would be a reasonable amount of iron plates, iron rods, reinforced iron plates and screws to porduce

[noble timber]

And you can't get all of that where you are building?

[unique cypress]

Yeah, that ain't all going into 1 train/station

[severe girder]

Not, it’s all through i tiny bit of the map

[noble timber]

That's not an answer we can give you. It depends on what you need and also what resources are available nearby

[unique cypress]

Unless you want it to be huge

[severe girder]

Bc I only have tier 2 miners just for the iron I need 15 pure nodes

That’s why it’s all a lil spread out

[clear blaze]

there are 8 pure iron nodes nearby

[noble timber]

Either use belts or turn the raw resources into other things that you then have less of and transport those instead

[unique cypress]

Because the 6.8k/min values I gave before assumed 6.8k of one item

With multiples, it's much worse

[severe girder]

Most of it is screws and that turns it into more i think:0

[noble timber]

Again, not really an answer we can give you. Do what you want

[severe girder]

Oh Im sorry, should have made that clear

[unique cypress]

If it's gonna become screws, you could probably cut your iron usage in half by using something else lol

Make sure you use all relevant alts if you're building something big

[noble timber]

I also assume that you have multiple pickup locations and all of these resources aren't at the same place at the moment?

[severe girder]

Huh? I don’t have ANY alternative recipes

Idk how to get….

[severe girder]

Lmao

[latent swallow]

hard drives

[severe girder]

Thanks

[latent swallow]

you will never use screws again when you do

[severe girder]

I do have a few already

[unique cypress]

Using sub-optimal recipes can make your factory insanely large and expensive. 1 missing recipe can make it 2x larger in the most extreme cases (HMFs)

[severe girder]

Arnt the random recipes you get on hardrives?? Do you just find more hard drives till screw is an opinion?

[noble timber]

Copper rotor enters the chat

[unique cypress]

The only good screw-using recipe, really

[wind spade]

based on your subjective preferences

[latent swallow]

why would you add copper into the production of rotors and then motors when you can just use steel rotors, iron wire and steel pipes?

[wind spade]

Steel rotors are very expensive

[noble timber]

Because copper rotor is the most resource and space efficient way to make rotors

[unique cypress]

Based on a lot of people's subjective preferences, from what I gathered from different conversations

[severe girder]

^

[latent swallow]

thats valid, id rather take the more expensive recipie and simplify the production chain tbh

[unique cypress]

Unless you want to cheese rescans, yes you need to gather HDDs until you get the alts you want

[noble timber]

You get 2 recipes when you scan a HDD, if you don't like them then you can do 1 re-roll for another 2

[latent swallow]

all just preference ig

[wind spade]

Still doesn't make it objective 🤷 and definitely doesn't mean all people think that

[severe girder]

Thanks guys

[wind spade]

Which is completely fine 😉 just saying why I personally wouldn't bother with it. Abd tbh the other options aren't really more complex either

[severe girder]

Also is the speed you can get to by slide jumping a bug?

[noble timber]

In what way is it simpler? You either introduce coal (and hence, steel) or have to use iron pipe which takes up a lot more iron

And usually where there is iron, there is copper

[latent swallow]

iron pipes with pure iron ingot is easier imo, after making 380 refineries for copper just for copper powder in my current project i dont mind a couple more for iron

i deff might try copper rotors after this convo tho

[noble timber]

Copper rotor is just over 50% less resource intensive as steel rotor

Although if you are not resource maxing I guess that may not be very appealing

[unique cypress]

Steel rotor + default stator and you've got motors out of just wire and steel pipes

And with iron wire and iron pipe, motors out of just iron.

Sometimes it's easier than copper + screws

[noble timber]

For that case I guess

[unique cypress]

Iron is very abundant in a few locations. Might as well build your motors there and not touch copper

[latent swallow]

thats the logic ive used making motors from just iron, typically i try and simplify the amount of different inputs just for simplicity, never rly thought about resource maxing because i dont think my pc would cope

[unique cypress]

I usually care about resource efficiency, but mostly because more resources = more effort. If more resources = less effort, then I will happily pay the price

[latent swallow]

fair enough, my logic especially now that blueprints are a thing is less total inputs = less effort

[latent swallow]

im having a lot of trains run slow due to the signaling at my T intersections, am i better off using a roundabout or similar design?

[unique cypress]

Post a pic?

[latent swallow]

there is also another one just over the hill you can just see, the problem is when one reserves the path the rest wait for it to complete it which causes them to stop (Right hand drive)

[hard meadow]

Consider not using path signals

[latent swallow]

i just watched the gridlock disipate so thats not there

[latent swallow]

replace with block signals? ngl i have little clue how signalling works tbh

[unique cypress]

You've got some weird-ass signalling there

[latent swallow]

im ngl i just copied some stuff off the wiki bc its my first time actually using trains

[deft lichen]

we have signalling on the wiki?

I don't see the signals being wrong, just maybe too frequent

[unique cypress]

Duplex signalling rules are fairly simple, even if there's a lot of them

1. Path signals at entrances to intersections where rails cross. But actually cross - one rail goes straight through another
2. Block signals at exits of those intersections
3. Simple splits/merges do not really benefit from path signals - block signals are good enough
4. Large and/or complex intersections may benefit from having extra path signals inside them.
5. If one rail goes entirely over/under another in an intersection and they do not cross, it's probably best to treat it as a series of splits and merges and use multiple block signals. Especially if the intersection is large. But using crossing rules (path in block out) do work too
6. On long straightaways, block signals every 100ish meters. The exact spacing doesn't matter, you just don't want kilometres of signalless track
7. Path signals create no-stop zones between them and the next block signal - it might be useful in some cases
8. Path signals need space before them, completely free of block signals. If a train is passing through a block signal and then a paths signal, in that order, the distance between those signals needs to be longer than the train's braking distance. Otherwise the train will slow down or even stop when approaching the path signal

[deft lichen]

On long straightaways, block signals every 100ish meters
can easily do with 300-400m intervals

[unique cypress]

Technically, I'm pretty sure the closer the better, but I do 100m, because

1. There's very little benefit from going closer
2. That's the max length of a track segment

[deft lichen]

I've heard people complain about "having to spam signals too often"

it works and there's nothing wrong with it, a matter of preference really

(and yeah, by 300-400m I do mean 3-4 track segments)

[unique cypress]

The distance between trains (front to front) is gonna be signal spacing + braking distance (~200m) + train length. The denser the signals, the denser your trains can be

Though with 1-4 trains, the difference in density between 100m and 400m spacing is 1.8x

[deft lichen]

that's true

it depends how busy your railway network is

most parts of my network only see like 3 trains total, so 100m signals would be overkill

[sly nest]

Good morning, my powergrid just exploded and I'm trying to restart it (manually u.u)
I'm at a power switch to turn more parts on but it crashes there the entire time O.o
Power Grid A has Prod 2.2GW and Max Cons of 1.1GW.
Power Grid B has a max Cons of 520MW.
Why would it explode/crash if I try to activate thta part?
My own math says that no matter what, 2.2GW should be able to power a 1.6GW factory thinking

[latent swallow]

Thank you, I will read this in detail tomorrow I have to sleep for work

[queen slate]

With some thinking - try placing priority switches.
With a lot of thinking - good luck debugging!

[sly nest]

I don't have the priority switches yet
But powerplant and these switches were next on the menu ^^"
Just that the powergrid went down the moment I decided on going there after reaching Phase 4

[wind spade]

fyi, kMW doesn't exist, use GW instead 🙂

[vapid gorge]

physically disconnect your power station from your factory grid,
restart power station
reconnect

[sly nest]

Well ... the game shows MW xD
No clue how this community handles it so both kMW and GW are somewhat correct D:
After all I know a couple of games that uses kk instead of m.
But ... I can fix the remaining kMW to GW xD

[wind spade]

yeah, it doesn't show kMW 😛

and GW is how you should handle 1000 of MW 😛

[sly nest]

That's what I did.
And made it work (I just planted one more fuel power generator ... the biggest section of my consumers had 5 more MW Max Cons. than I had Production D:
So on startup it exploded despite never actually using that much.
Next is making the grid more robust ... and moar power.
Ty for the help ❤️

[old hearth]

@rocky cypress

[spare laurel]

First time messing with signals. For this design I think I need both a path signal and a block signal in the red circles, but can only place one. Is there a way to do this kind of intersection that I don't see, or do I need to separate the intersection to place both signals?

[wind spade]

I'd rather design it better tbh

[spare laurel]

RIP

also is this the right channel?

[wind spade]

this looks like it will have deadlocks all the time

yeah it's fine (though if I had to choose, #1038092680493801533 would be a better pick imo)

[spare laurel]

Yeah, I'm realizing that too. Might have jumped the gun building so much of this without troubleshooting first

[unique cypress]

I'd probably place a path left of the left circle, and a block right of the right circle.

IF there was only one of these

But alternating path and block signals with less than 200-300m between them is a terrible idea

So actually, placing path signals everywhere except behind stations is probably better

But that'd mean trains just passing by would delay everything massively

So yeah, this is not a good design

[amber umbra]

To mention, it’s recommended to just watch a guide on trains, signaling. “Toaster gaming rails satisfactory” on YouTube is pretty good.

Then pick one of the couple good rail setups and consistently implement it in game.

[acoustic summit]

What are those green and red stuff? 😅

[warm breach]

those are highlighting areas of the railway tracks in editing, so you can see what conditions are happening according to particular colors

[acoustic summit]

Ohhh okay

[unique cypress]

Signal segment colors. You don't need to care what the color they are exactly, other than whether it's the same or different

[warm breach]

different is good if theyre all different, especially in ones used by multiple trains coming from any direction

they need to stop if there's a train in there to avoid collision, or take alternate route

[vapid gorge]

have them in a line like this and you'll save your sanity

[past igloo]

more of a noob question.. How do I distribute the the Iron ingots in the amounts I need after they leave the foundries?

[fallow siren]

manifold

they will self balance when the 30/min line is full

you can also load balance by adding a line of mk1 belt and split into 2 so you get 30 30, merge back 1 30 and the last 30 can be connected to copper alloy

or simply just have 1 smelter that produce 30/min and has that single line goes into alloy foundry

[past igloo]

that was my plan for the copper foundry, thanks for confirming

my problem for a manifold is that I'm limited to the T3 belt

[vapid gorge]

the other main method, thats usefull if not all the locations you want to deliver to are in the same spot , or you don't have a fast enough belt, clock groups of machines to deliver what you need exactly onto abelt

[fallow siren]

mk3 belt has 270/min throughput

more than enough for your current plan with iron

[past igloo]

but I have 308.704 Iron ingots leaving the 5 Iron alloy foundries, so what is the answer to figuring out how to get them all onto a single manifold?

Or am I meant to use two seperate manifolds?

Sorry, still trying to wrap my head around the mechanics

[vapid gorge]

"or you don't have a fast enough belt, clock groups of machines to deliver what you need exactly onto a belt"

this will break it up onto multiple manifolds

[fallow siren]

break it into 2 line?

[gloomy shoal]

Oh, yeah you've got a stupid decimal in there, I'd say injection manifold

[vapid gorge]

injections manifolds are just multiple manifolds linked together. For no real reason

[past igloo]

so the answer could be to use two of the five manifolds to make the 103.704 for the Iron wire, and clock the 3 remaining foundries to produce the remaining 205 ingots I need for the remaining constructors?

[vapid gorge]

clocking is your single most powerful logistics tool you'll have the entire game

[unique cypress]

I'd do a 2:2 balancer and then 2 lines on each side. No need to worry about doing math exactly, it'll work as long as none of the belts' capacity is exceeded

[past igloo]

what is a 2:2 balancer?

[unique cypress]

Split each belt in half, merge the halves

[vapid gorge]

not something useful in this situation since you're not trying to get 2 belts of the same volume? I don't know why it was suggested to you

[unique cypress]

But not merge the same belt back together, merge one half of one belt with one half of the other, repeat for the second halves

[gloomy shoal]

I think the theory is that if one belt clogs, then it'll balance onto the other belt
Theoretically bypassing the item throughput limit

[past igloo]

I think I understand

[vapid gorge]

you could jsut do that with any 2 belts

[unique cypress]

Balancer doesn't mean "equal outputs" tho

[past igloo]

A useful trick, but not necessary in this instance

[vapid gorge]

no, it's baffling

[unique cypress]

To you, maybe 🤷‍♂️

I use it all the time. Very useful when I can't be bothered to do math. Which is always

[fallow siren]

green line is the manifold

grey is the splitter that goes into both manifold line

you get equal line in this way

[vapid gorge]

I don't think they are trying to have 2 even belts.... ?

Unless I missed something

[fallow siren]

theyre trying to do 308.704, which cant be done in 270 belt, so i suggest to do 2 manifold and have the machine does the exact rate for it

[vapid gorge]

I guess. I don't know why you're linking them if you're clocking them exactly right

you could but I think that would take an extra step of calculations? a minor one, but still an extra step

[past igloo]

so Im going to : 1. split off a 60 line for the copper ore line and the iron line both, then split each 60 into 30s, relinking 30 each to the original ore lines and sending 30 each to the copper alloy smelter. 2. Clock two Iron alloy foundries to produce 103.704 ingots for the Iron wire line. 3. Clock the other 3 remaining Iron alloy foundries to produce 210 ingots for the main manifold line to supply the rest of the factory? Did I get it right?

[unique cypress]

Correct. A balancer allows you to kinda have the capacity of multiple belts in one. Except you do not actually have the belt and have split on/off it with your actual belts. But as long as you don't exceed belt capacity on either of the inputs and outputs, a properly designed balancer will work, regardless of the exact numbers involved, thanks to clogged belts overflowing onto empty ones

[fallow siren]

you can do that

[past igloo]

Thank you to everyone who took the time to help me out, I assume this channel typically doesn't see many beginner logistical problems, I appreciate it, this game rocks.

[unique cypress]

You'd be surprised. The answer to a lot of people's questions is "manifold it". You at least couldn't just manifold it due to belt speed limits.

[fallow siren]

if 1 manifold line couldnt keep up with the production, do 2nd manifold line

[past igloo]

hahaha

[fallow siren]

i worked with 3k screw with just mk3 before (dont ask me why)

[gloomy shoal]

Generally, my goal is to make smaller modules that require more acceptable numbers per module, and then scale those

[past igloo]

how do I divert 60 copper ore off my line in order to be split into 30 when the line only contains 71.827?

Seems like it's not possible with a line lower than 120 units.. is there a clever way to do this i seem to be missing?

Is this where smart splitters come in?

[wind spade]

Single splitter and let it self-balance

Or just never merge and have it separated

[vapid gorge]

yeah clocking the machines is prob simplest and least braining move

[quick gorge]

The logical part of my brain has fallen asleep.
What is the best way to connect these 3 converters (500 EPM/m) to the 10 Encoders (150EPM/m) (Power shard) while

[vapid gorge]

make it 9 encoders

[quick gorge]

no

[vapid gorge]

is it just outputing photonic stuff?

you could try a pipe ring and 3 inputs?

it might not be the worst

[quick gorge]

I can't think of anything else that would be better

[vapid gorge]

9 encoders 😛

[fierce prawn]

yeah, ring and just space the three inputs out

shouuuuld be okay?

[quick gorge]

I'm needing those 125 power shards/m
112.5 is not good enough kek

[vapid gorge]

you could clock it so you still get that?

[quick gorge]

I'm not sure how much...less bad valves are nowadays?

[vapid gorge]

put powered pumps on.

to be safe

or not powered since it's a gas I guess

[quick gorge]

The 10 of them are already at 250%

[vapid gorge]

but I'm unsure how much that effects back flow, the unpowered bit

yeah figured. could do it 12 then?

I mean the ring will probably work fine. Probably.

[fierce prawn]

are you doing ionized fuel plant?

madman

[quick gorge]

6 at 108.333333% could work

[quick gorge]

Looping the loop-organ

[vapid gorge]

well, 108.3334 anyways

[quick gorge]

I'll see how it looks, since this is meant to be very demanding of aesthetics

[fierce prawn]

jeez

[fierce prawn]

i forget, what is the power production you need to have to make those worth the crafting?

[quick gorge]

I don't care about power.
I care about the aesthetic

[fierce prawn]

hell yeah

[quick gorge]

https://tenor.com/view/metal-cat-scream-head-bang-thurston-waffles-gif-15809057

Maybe a tad much

Yeah something like this

[old hearth]

Oh my

[old hearth]

60gws or more

[quick gorge]

And all this just to make a cool build, not even the power

[old hearth]

How much ionized fuel

[quick gorge]

.. 80

[old hearth]

I think I've got a bit more

(ignore the turbo fuel my math was wrong)

[quick gorge]

I have split the 125 shards into two halves, 120 goes to APM and the 5 overflow goes into Ionized for Drone/jetpack fuel

[ruby shoal]

I'm (hopefully) finishing up my first aluminum setup, and I'm having an issue with my water. I need 600 water for the Bauxite - Alumina processing, and I'm producing 360 water at the Alumina - Scrap processing. Adding two water extractors at 120 each gave me exactly the 600 I need if I loop the 360 back into the first pipe.

Though it seems like after a while, the pipes (which were already full) fill up entirely and the entire system stops. Why does this happen? How can I fix it?

[wind spade]

Separate fresh and recycled water

[ruby shoal]

How? And why would that fix it?

[fierce prawn]

pipes don’t (really) have priority! Unfortunately, the amount you have looping back is not the first to be consumed by the system, so the loop ends up slowly filling up from your pumps. While it makes sense on paper, this loop system would require perfect 100% uptime forever on every machine to stay balanced and unclogged. You are much better off pumping in all 600, then using that 360 in leftover water in some other recipe!

[vapid gorge]

like this

blue is fresh, red is waste

[ruby shoal]

Ah, I think I get it then! That's probably the best solution for me, since I don't have another recipe I need water for that I can make nearby, I don't think.

Actually, that creates some slightly screwy numbers, since 360 doesn't perfectly supplement 400

[fierce prawn]

over/underclocking should be able to even things neatly

[ruby shoal]

Hmm, this is gonna need a little redesigning then lol

[vapid gorge]

it's mostly clocking work. 🙂 example ratios depending on what recipes you're using

[ruby shoal]

Alright, this makes a bit more sense. I'm using the Sloppy Solution and Normal Scrap. The only problem with repiping and changing the clockspeed, is I already built the rest of the production line lol, so I'd have to change everything I already have

Or, no. I could just see if it's possible to redo the refineries

[oblique hollow]

Its thankfully quite easy, if you already have all refineries present, you just need to redo some piping

The ratio of solution to scrap refineries doesnt change, only the ratio of how many refineries get fed byproduct water

[latent swallow]

thank you again, my problem was definately overuse of path signals, i will be utilising more of these thank you

[vapid gorge]

@quartz sleet if you scroll up you can see a discussion on splitting the waste and fresh

[quartz sleet]

thanks

[vapid gorge]

while directly feeding waste into fresh is possible it's fiddly and depending on your choice of how, somewhat unreliable

and this is super easy to do

[latent swallow]

for priority pipe mergers the merger needs to be vertical on the line yes?

[vapid gorge]

yes.

though it's not a super reliable option

it's probably the most reliable of the direct feed options

[latent swallow]

yeah ive used it before just thought id check ty

with how weird fluid can be it is a good option

[vapid gorge]

I mean, I would argue because it's less reliable it's a less good option. It works off magic basically

the keeping waste/fresh split options (above) is objectively the most reliable.

you can also split the waste to an entirely different process like pure ingots or something. But more effort

@tall dawn add in all the final outputs you want, end product items, it'll create the path

[latent swallow]

yeah lowk i need to do it properly but im 40 hours into this project and im at the end, im ready for it to be over

[vapid gorge]

shrug I would argue it's very fast and will save you more time keeping it split because sometimes you just need to keep rebuilding VIPs but you do you

[latent swallow]

time is completely out the window for me rn, i automated from scratch all of the final space elevator parts with 10, 10, 1 and 1 /m of each, would have been quicker to box craft but i was in it for the journey no the destination

[crimson moat]

Split water is definitely the most time and space efficient way to build aluminum.

You can actually make perfect priority systems now via packaged water and priority merger - they have significantly improved functionality but are more complex and time/space intensive to build properly.

this is a packaged priority system for 6x600 bauxite, with forge ingots powered by cheap silica (all processed in the module)

[umbral current]

where is this img from ?

[crimson moat]

i screenshotted it yesterday 😄

[umbral current]

from ingame?

[crimson moat]

ye

mk6 belts glow

[radiant terrace]

@vapid gorge

[vapid gorge]

well hard to tell, but are you feeding 3 generators from 1 water extractor?

[radiant terrace]

Yeah kinda, will take care of it rn tho

[vapid gorge]

well 1 water extractor makes 120 water, 3 generators need 135 water pm

so that's one issue. But you really want to make your power stations very neat and tidy. especially with pipes

also this is west , go between the N and W for north west

[radiant terrace]

Thank you

[candid steppe]

anyone know of any tools for making rate limiters?

[slate kiln]

Smart Splitters ?

[vapid gorge]

once the belt is saturated a smart splitter will over flow elsewhere, meaning only X parts per min will be sent down a path

or you know, use clocking to rate limit

[candid steppe]

no but like i have a 1200/min output from industrial storage but i cant use mk5 or it will take to much

[vapid gorge]

once hte system fills up, the smart splitter will overflow the rest where ever you want.

what is the issue?

[candid steppe]

mk5 conveyer does 1440

[vapid gorge]

780

[candid steppe]

which is taking too much so eventualy the factory wont beable to rpoduce enough

[vapid gorge]

ok how much do you need to send down the belt?

[candid steppe]

(2 of them)

[candid steppe]

1200 in total

[vapid gorge]

ok so you know what happens when all those machines are full if you use 2x mk5 belts?

they will only take 1200 pm. So it'll work out.

[candid steppe]

ok but like i dont have that factory yet im just prodcucing the 1200 and would like to keep it at that level

[vapid gorge]

that will happen.
if you clock your machines that consume the parts to consume 1200 pm it will run smoothly.

is there some aspect of this you don't understand? the machines themselves will control the rate moving on the belts

[candid steppe]

i dont have those machines!

[vapid gorge]

what machines need 1200 pm?

[candid steppe]

eventualy 60 assemblers

[vapid gorge]

ok clock those constructors to consume 1200 parts per min.
that will mean your belts, even though they are mk5s, will only move 1200 pm

[candid steppe]

yea i know i will do that but at the moment i dont have those

[vapid gorge]

so why do they need to go anywhere? if you jsut need them to keep moving jsut sink them

you don't need a rate limit a sink if you want it all sunk

[candid steppe]

so i just want to sink but if i just use 2 mk5 they will just take too much and ill have to wait ages for it to backflow again

[vapid gorge]

do the overflow before the buffer, that way you'll have a big buffer

[candid steppe]

same problem

[vapid gorge]

no? you'll have a giant buffer of items, and extra will go to sink?

if you are making 1200 ppm incoming, and you want it to keep flowing, you'll be just as empty of items behind the buffer if you 'rate limit it' or not

[candid steppe]

yea no but thats the problwem if im empty behind the buffer they manifold will empty and i wont get peak production

[vapid gorge]

empty output manifold does not impact 'peak production' in any way shape or form

[candid steppe]

an input one sure does

[vapid gorge]

that's why the full buffer that feeds the eventual input will be full

and even if that weren't he case you'd just wait for hte spin up time
but that's not the case, the buffer will flood the system you make

[candid steppe]

the 1200 comes from another factory

[vapid gorge]

so? you feed the input manifold from the giant buffer.

or sink the overflow BEFORE it gets on a vehicle, that way the delivery point is full full. Lots of ways to solve this with essentially zero effort

[crimson moat]

@dusky dust This is the system that needs a valve to operate properly

(side view)

Any water level high enough to feed the machine on the left will clog the output of the machine on the right.

like this

however if you valve it, this happens

water goes leftways through the valve, even when the left pipe is fuller/higher.

and it doesn't come back

The simple way to fix it so that you don't need shenanigans is to put the output machine at a higher elevation than the consumer. Even 1 or 2 meters works great.

HOWEVER in P4 there are several buildings which both input and output fluids and can loop into eachother to reduce resource cost, so it's impossible to keep the input above the output because that would require building B to be both lower and higher than building A, which can't be true simultaneously. For me this was Non-Fissile Uranium consuming liquid acid and outputting liquid water.

Valve radically improves flow for those.

Aside from that, in every test i've done, valves with no flow rate limit either did nothing or improved flow. I've seen that from several water enthusiasts too

Another thing that does is using low-capacity pipes in the direction that you want less flow to go for uneven splits

e.g. turbofuel manifold, you want 7.5 to go one way and 592.5 to go the other way, you put a mk.1 pipe on the 7.5. That makes the system want to split 400+200 instead of 300+300.

[wind spade]

pump would be better here 🤔

[crimson moat]

The only difference in functionality between a valve and a pump in this circumstance is that the pump requires power. The valve does not, and they do exactly the same thing - so the pump is just strictly worse.

[wind spade]

more headlift can't hurt

[crimson moat]

no, but there's literally zero benefit. There's also some increased risk - if you forget the pump powerline somewhere then the system bricks completely due to unpowered pump headlift resetting at the bottom of the pipe system

[thorn bane]

would a non powered one work? or would it prevent the machine from getting fluid

[crimson moat]

Non powered sets the headlift to 0m, it actually REMOVES the headlift which is already there

Given the location (equal height or below the recieving machine/s) that would cut liquid flow to zero

[wind spade]

I mean forgetting to power anything is problematic 😄

[velvet bramble]

one of these or reroll?

On T3/4 rn if that affects outcomes

[wooden jasper]

wire!!!

[crimson moat]

Yeah, but it's another point of failure for something which has literally zero benefit from needing the power in the first place

a valve is just a pump that doesn't need that power connection

they are otherwise identical here

[wind spade]

depends purely on you. You can get all recipes, and all recipes are useful in certain scenarios

[velvet bramble]

Might just sit on it then, just now getting coal/steel going so we’ll see if that alternate helps

Not really hurting for wire/copper atm

And no caterium reasonably nearby

[old hearth]

how do i get these back machines to stop stalling

[crimson moat]

you're trying to push more through your pipes than they can handle

[old hearth]

( they arent at 600 per min)

[crimson moat]

mk.2 pipes can only handle about 400/min in some situations, the picture above being one of the worst of them

[old hearth]

what i did which seems to now be working is seperated it and reatteched it at a later point

[old hearth]

?

[crimson moat]

middle out works better than connecting at one side, yes

[crimson moat]

backflow consumes flow capacity too.

[old hearth]

ah

[crimson moat]

so if 500 flows forward and 100 flows back, you have 600m3/min of flow while only 400 actually moves

and the pipe chokes on that because it's @ 600

[old hearth]

how to properly acount for backflow?

[wind spade]

loop the pipe

[old hearth]

also hot to let manifolds properly move?

[old hearth]

no space for what i w as doing there

[wind spade]

literally has space for the image above

[crimson moat]

it's difficult to predict manifold flow rates, but generally splitting your pipe in half before the manifold (so a 600 into a pair of 300/600's) is the easiest way which requires the least knowledge i think.

[old hearth]

i thought it would be more anoying

[crimson moat]

If you want a pipe to send 270 one way and 30 the other way on a junction, putting a mk.1 pipe on the side that you want only 30 will also help.

[old hearth]

however would be annoying as hell

if i just keep thorughput rates in the pipe low can i treat them liike belts kinda?

[brisk urchin]

neither, just let it sit in the library to not get them in the next drive

[wind spade]

no, you shouldn't treat pipes as belts

[old hearth]

i mean not have to doi annoying shenaigans

like looping

[wind spade]

no, pipes work differently than belts

and looping is not annoying tbh

[old hearth]

if im having to do it over the whole damn thing

[crimson moat]

If you don't move more than half of the pipes flow rate limit then mostly, yes

[old hearth]

thats what i was saying

[crimson moat]

400/600 might always be fine, but it's getting near danger zone for the worst setups

[wind spade]

it's a good habit to loop the pipe always. It's not always needed, but it can't hurt and usually helps

[old hearth]

iver just the machines or all the way to the destination

[wind spade]

just the manifold

[old hearth]

oh then ill do that in the future bp's

[wind spade]

but as shown in the image - ideally vertically, feeding from top and connecting to machines at the bottom

[old hearth]

i mean hey what i did has let it work so far

[old hearth]

what about loops like the alumina ones?

how do you do them normally

[wind spade]

aluminum is easiest to do by separating fresh and byproduct water

[old hearth]

what about vip juction or whatever they are called

[wind spade]

I wouldn't trust that black magic

[crimson moat]

they don't work reliably unless you have package and unpackagers w/ priority merger

[old hearth]

so what if i do 3 water systems, the first only runs on fresh water, the second runs on waste waster from the 1st and the 3rd turns it into wet concret to sink

so i guess 2 systems really

[wind spade]

you don't need to sink/wet anything

the 2nd system is all the waste water (including the one from the waste refineries)

[old hearth]

hjow the hell do i get rid of the extra water if i dont want to mix fresh and waste water

ah

[old hearth]

then how do i do the pipe loop thing(cleanly) for blenders?

and do i need to do that for gasses

and i f i do the loop thingy how much can it reasonably let through

[wind spade]

600

[thorn bane]

there have been recent new designs for vips and their mechanisms that do seem to be consistent
https://www.reddit.com/r/SatisfactoryGame/comments/1lr5p8p/solved_how_fluid_priority_actually_works/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button

[old hearth]

can it go the full distance of a manfold

[wind spade]

just make it as in the image

[old hearth]

i mean as a blueprint

[wind spade]

that was once said about McGalleon's VIP as well 🙂

[old hearth]

page not found

[thorn bane]

does https://www.reddit.com/r/SatisfactoryGame/comments/1lr5p8p/solved_how_fluid_priority_actually_works/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button work?
reddit is being weird

[old hearth]

ik

it worked

[old hearth]

just for inputs or also outputs?

[wind spade]

what?

[old hearth]

loops

[wind spade]

why replying to message about VIP tho 😛

[old hearth]

idk

[wind spade]

inputs need it way more, I've heard some people saying they needed loop for output as well, but I can't confirm or deny that

[old hearth]

so both to be safe

[thorn bane]

hm there arent many low throughput output fluid recipes right?

[wind spade]

if you want, sure (though for outputs the main pipe should be at the bottom, not top)

[wind spade]

what do you define as low throughput?

[thorn bane]

like <50

i guess default rubber/plastic but people rarely make 600 HOR of that

[wind spade]

battery recipe outputs 30/min water if that counts

alt HOR needs 30/min

[thorn bane]

but you almost never have 600/min output water from batteries

i guess HOR

[wind spade]

quartz purification needs 10/min

[thorn bane]

thats input not output

[wind spade]

turbofuel needs 22.5/min

[old hearth]

outputs 18.75

[wind spade]

ah, talking about output?
turbofuel still - low output

ionized as well

[thorn bane]

i guess in most TF systems is kinda already output looped since you interconnect it with the gens

[wind spade]

nitric acid

encased uranium cells have byproduct

[old hearth]

how th do i get this to work for something with both solid and liquid input?

[wind spade]

you... connect belts and pipes?

[old hearth]

i mean can it be slanted junction or does it have to be flat

i need this to be scalable

[wind spade]

as long as the feed pipe (bottom one on the image) is level with machines or above, it's fine

[old hearth]

ok

and im making a bp for it can it go the whole length and i connect it at the ends?

or does it need to be small

[thorn bane]

imma go with "someone should really test this"
and obligatory @oblique hollow ping
(tldr do you need a loop for 600/min output, like making 600/min nitric acid all merged in 1 manifold?)

[oblique hollow]

Shouldn't be needed.
Merge manifold prefers if you keep it mk 1 until you actually have more than 300/min tho
All sidelines out from blenders should be mk 1 too
And add a pump for good measure at the final output pipe that moves 600/min

Splitting flow back up is the part that needs the loop / the equal split

[thorn bane]

so a 570/30 merge is stable?

[wind spade]

Should be imo, as if it isn't, the 30 pipe backs up and is more than 30 and becomes stable

[thorn bane]

ye i guess the 30 pipes acts as a buffer so theres always enough to supply 600/min

[vapid gorge]

Might be a bit late but if you process nodes of bauxite individually your manifolds for waste and fresh water tend to be very short and don’t need a loop

[old hearth]

im in phase 3 your not too late

[crimson moat]

"two pipes which look the same but are segmented in different places behave differently" strikes again.

I find that behavior quite problematic

[old hearth]

i just wanna be able to make my solid aluminum rotors at max effieciency

[vapid gorge]

But yeah, process the nodes individually, split the fresh and waste water refineries in two groups. Simple and effective. Also one of the few places you tend to not need the loop

[old hearth]

fortunately that works well with my base polanning

[old hearth]

( im sad he didnt notice the solid aluminum rotors)

[thorn bane]

i think its more "have different number of segments"

so its like which pipe has more segments
that one has prio

[crimson moat]

Yeah, but you can build a 6 segment pipe and a 2 segment pipe which physically look identical.

but one of them has behavior X, and the other has behavior Y

[thorn bane]

ah ye true

wait that explains so many "works on my machine" situations

[crimson moat]

so if somebody takes a screenshot or video of that pipe and they aren't in the salvage menu, you can't see why it's working (or not working)

[crimson moat]

Yes it does

[vapid gorge]

No I saw it 😛 and a few days ago when someone posted the chain

[old hearth]

probably me

[vapid gorge]

Prob xD

[old hearth]

i am genuinly going to make them

mostly cause i need to use all alts

and im using them in the only production chain where rotors dont make motors

nuclear

and iug smart plating but mod engines use motors

[glacial shadow]

is Fine Black powder better than black powder?

[unique cypress]

https://satisfactorytools.com/1.0/production and check

[rich totem]

what am I doing wrong with path signals? First time using trains

[unique cypress]

what's the error?

[rich totem]

Signal loops into itself

[unique cypress]

oof

[unique cypress]

pull out a signal, and look for a place where the color on the rail is the same before and after a signal

replace every rail touching that signal

though that's assuming you built your rails/signals correctly and got the glitch

[rich totem]

will try, thanks a lot

[rich totem]

well they are spaced properly at least

[unique cypress]

well, the "signal loops into itself" is meant to appear when it's possible to drive from one side of a signal to the other side of it, without passing the signal in question or any other signal

if you can do that, you need more signals

if you can't, something's glitched

[sage belfry]

When I select all alt recipes in 1.0 tools, how does it choose which alts to use or to use a base? Is it minimizing the number of raw resources used, the % of each resource it uses of its total, or is it just picking the first or any arbitrary alt? For instance, if I want to optimize/make it easiest on myself to build X ballistic warp drives, Y ai expansion servers, and Z biochemical sculptors, what will tools optimize for in the tree computation?

[unique cypress]

it minimizes the total % of the world's resources used

[dusky dust]

It attempts to optimize for resource usage, based on weights derived by what KYO297 just said. :D (ninja'd!)

[unique cypress]

unless you're in maximize mode

[sage belfry]

Is it generally recommended to follow its suggestions, or would I regularly find that doing so complicates setups and/or requires more transportation of intermediates given that it won’t necessarily optimize for less number of unique required raw resources and/or their map spread?

[unique cypress]

I'd say, on average, the most resource efficient alts are usually the ones that minimize effort, especially if they're far up the chain
but not always

[sage belfry]

I imagine it would always choose alts like wet concrete or other water-dilutions that increase production, which many low tier items have, so that’s a lot of water piping

[dusky dust]

Nah, you should build however you want. I often end up tweaking recipes and such to match what I end up wanting to build in the end

sftools' biggest benefit isn't necessarily just that it solves factory production for you, but that it makes it so easy to tweak exactly how you want to do it

[unique cypress]

I often deviate from tools' plans by about 10% of the recipes

[dusky dust]

Like if it solved using a recipe you don't want to use, just deselect the recipe. Or if you want to avoid using Copper, go deslect copper. Or if you've already got HMFs being produced somewhere else and want to use those, you can add 'em as inputs, etc

It's kind of rare that I'll accept sftools' very first suggestion, but that's also because I'm pretty familiar with the game's recipes and have my own preferences and such (and more knowledge than sftools has about the local nodes that'll be near the factory I'm building)

[sage belfry]

As a first-playthrougher, I am actively struggling to know what I want and lack the familiarity to make any sort of reasonably informed decisions. There’s an entire thread in the questions channel about this 😂

[dusky dust]

Though that said there's also nothing wrong with just accepting sftools' first graph and making that. Up to you, in the end!

Heh, for sure

As I say, nothing wrong with just taking its suggestions and going for it

I tend to keep a tab open on sftools which is just for copying, where I've selected all the alts that I've found so far in the playthrough. When I start up a new factory I'll copy that tab

That way I'm not always clicking on recipes and such

[unique cypress]

if you're making iron-only rotors, always disable default rotor, and if you're making iron-only modular frames, always disable default frame

those 2 default recipes are less than 1% more efficient than the next alts it'll choose (steel and steeled), but require significantly more machines

the rest is up to your preferences tbh.

[dusky dust]

Note that especially for petrochem stuff (rubber/plastic/fuel), if you've got the necessary recipes, it'll always try to optimize for oil efficiency on those, which leads to the most complex petrochem loop. That one's a bit wild, so keep in mind that producing rubber+plastic doesn't have to be as complex as sftools will often suggest

[sage belfry]

I see. I just know I’m going to run with something and get absolutely destroyed with the lack of organization and foresight.

[unique cypress]

the issue with a less efficient oil processing is that it's a lot less efficient

[dusky dust]

(I know that it's just sftools doing what it's told, but I'm always amused when I'm making a factory which needs, like, 20/min plastic or something, and sftools goes all most-efficient-oil on it. Like, it's fine, sftools. I'll just use a bit more oil. :D)

[unique cypress]

I'd just disable oil at that point

[dusky dust]

Sure, though the most efficient loop is likely to be a bit wild for someone still getting to grips with the game. And even though the other options are less oil-efficient, your average user is highly unlikely to ever actually exhaust oil on the map, so it doesn't really matter in the end

My real favorite "sftools doing what it's told to do" thing tends to be anything involving Nitric Acid, since it'll optimize the f#@! out of those miniscule amounts of Iron Plates, unless told not to

All Coated Iron Plate and Pure Iron Ingot goin' on

Like come on, I need 20/min Iron Plates, I'll just smelt some iron. :D

(again, this is not a complaint; I'm just always amused by it when I see it)

[unique cypress]

I'm more annoyed by not being able to disable it with just one click

Like SAM shenaningans can be disabled with one click in 2 different ways unless you're making a tier 9 item

same with the blender before T7

[sage belfry]

which alt(s) in particular would I disable? and are there any alts you'd recommend always disabling? or is it just totally dependent on the situation

[sage belfry]

seems that way; https://www.satisfactorytools.com/1.0/production?share=ylPTZtwLzPsD71cZWM5N uses 60% of the map's oil when no alts are selected...

[dusky dust]

Totally dependent on situation. On a playthrough I may end up using every single available alt for a material, depending on the situation of the exact factory

[unique cypress]

you should usually disable all resource conversion recipes, unless you specifically want to use them. search for ( in th default recipes section to show all of them (though not only them so don't disable everything under ()

or just disable SAM entirely if you don't plan on using it for anything

[dusky dust]

If you want to disable the most-oil-efficient petrochem loop, the alts involved are: Heavy Oil Residue, Diluted Fuel (or Packaged Diluted Fuel), Recycled Plastic, and Recycled Rubber

Though personally I just leave all my available alts selected at first and then disable as I see fit

[sage belfry]

thumbs up though I did use both HOR and DF for the nitro rocket fuel power plant...

[dusky dust]

Right, everything's dependent on your situation. Rocket Fuel builds probably nearly always involve those two

(Also, I'd personally recommend keeping graphs for "big" stuff like that broken out as much as possible, regardless of what tool you're using to help solve for it. Obviously that's a bit more difficult with Phase 5 stuff since there's a lot of resource interaction, but for instance if it were me I'd probably have a separate graph just for Trigon production, etc, and probably break up that plan into three separate factories (making use of the "inputs" tab to manage exports between 'em))

[unique cypress]

one advice regarding inputs: Tools considers them free. plan everything in one tab first, then split it up, making sure to keep recipes the same.

starting your plan with inputs could mean tools will waste them

or don't split it up at all. I don't

[sage belfry]

Right. I was trying to do that for computers as a seemingly reasonable "one or more sattelite factories" based on the recommendations i got in #1393623558596329616 message, but then I got tripped up on deciding "well which alts do I use, do I need to worry about resource consumption %s that I'll need for other recipes, etc).

[dusky dust]

Like on my 1.0 playthrough I did have a joint Superposition Oscillator + NQP factory, but I'd had separate inputs for the Alclad, Crystal Oscillator, and Supercomputer inputs to that chain (and was exporting those products to the separate factrories which needed 'em)

[sage belfry]

Yes, this also made my brain panic as I was trying to do so.

[dusky dust]

Yeah, what KYO297 said about the inputs. Doing that first pass with a huge ol' unwieldy graph is handy to know what inputs those sub-factories might want; at that point you can split 'em out

Also, keep in mind that for the Phase 5 SE parts in particular, you definitely don't need to be building that much unless you want to. You can save yourself some time by decreasing your numbers a bit; the absolute number you have to deliver to the elevator is pretty small for all of those. They're handy for coupons afterwards, of course, but you'll probably have finished the SE delivery for one long before you finish building out the rest of the factories to do the others, etc

Not that those numbers are crazy, of course. :D

I tend to just target a 2-hour-ish completion time for Elevator parts

[sage belfry]

I mostly based it on the base rate of a single building, scaled up slightly, but well below the maximum rate of that item the game could take, to be on the lower end

[dusky dust]

Yeah, fair, and the game's been sort of encouraging that approach in past Elevator steps anyway

For Phase 5 I've found that if all you care about it just completing production for each part in ~2hr or so, though, you can often get away with even less. (Though now that I think about it, I may have slooped some of those outputs as well)

[sage belfry]

I certainly want the golden nut

[quick gorge]

sigh
I'm trying to figure out my pipe logistics
I would use take the 1500 and use that first but each one of those PA drinks 497.78 so each pipe of 500 would overflow 2.22 and last time I checked overflowing a gas isn't that fun unlike liquid

[vapid gorge]

why can't you clock?

[quick gorge]

I mean I could but I want to balance the plutonium and that would eventually lead to it building up in one of the less clocked PAs

[vapid gorge]

but can't you send exactly 497.78 to them? and left overs somewhere else?

[quick gorge]

So valves?

[vapid gorge]

can't your machines just make 497.78?

and anothe rmachine to make the excess?

[quick gorge]

I was going to take the 12 shard encoders and do this with the 2.22 overflow, if I clock the PA to 250 I could use it all

[vapid gorge]

god I hate modeler. Or how you've laid this out.
or both

It's be much easier seeing this in tools to see where everything's final goal is

so much of logistics organisation benefits from a holistic approach

[quick gorge]

I can't use tools for actually laying things out, I've tried

[vapid gorge]

oh I know, but being able to see the full flow is so helpful to organise clockings and groups

[quick gorge]

I changed the 10 shard encoders at 250 to 12 at 208.333 and it's much better and seeing how that looks in modeler just works better with out how I process things

And' fuck it;
8 PA at 250 and 1 at 240.

[vapid gorge]

xD I have no idea what is going on but I hope it'll work out

[quick gorge]

I've heard this a lot when showing people my plan :)
"chaos can be found within Order can be found within"

[vapid gorge]

I mean it's probably fine, but seeing a tiny bit cut up everywhere doesn't tell the story well

[quick gorge]

Spoilers, here is the ending

[keen breach]

the last 2 arent working

or barely working

[old hearth]

just be patient

the first 6 machines need to fill up fully before it works

[keen breach]

ok

[glacial peak]

just spent the time doing the math i will need 150 smelters for the aluminum 💀

das... a lot

[old hearth]

i think like at least 30 can fit in a blueprint

[glacial peak]

i still got only mk2 BPs which is unfort

but yeah it's still gonna be a lot

[old hearth]

I think you can fit 36 in mk 2

i fit 12 in mk2 with no veticality

[glacial peak]

and plus ill have to figure out the layout for how many belts ill need cause it's 9k scrap

ill have to figure out how to split everything actually so it doesnt look like a royal mess

[old hearth]

wait i thought you were using all the bauxite in the world

[glacial peak]

yeah but this is the first half

[old hearth]

ah

[glacial peak]

i need a start

cause i have no aluminum

for mk5 belts

[old hearth]

i was about do say how did you lose half your scrap

[glacial peak]

i haven't got it to the factory yet

only like 8 of the nodes

[old hearth]

i mean in calcs

[glacial peak]

ah. i haven't added those it's right above the screenshot

unconnected for now

fun fact you can drag water from the refinery straight to your trashcan. basically dumping water for free

[old hearth]

and in a machine like distilled silica which has the same output as input you can move it directly from output to input

[glacial peak]

huh

neat

how does the pioneer do that tho and just move hundreds of galons without a bucket

does she drink it

[old hearth]

(yes she drinks sulfuric acid)

[glacial peak]

yippee

ok im dead going to bed

gn

[old hearth]

@thin ermine

dont go to the red areas its too dangerous

and stay out of the red jungle

[thin ermine]

i already went through there before

[old hearth]

the red jungle or the red bamboo forrest

[thin ermine]

b o t h

[old hearth]

if ur well enough equpied go through there

and the titan forrest

[velvet bramble]

Solid Steel Ingot or Steeled Frame?

[old hearth]

solid steel is one of the best in the game

get it

it saves power and reasources

[velvet bramble]

sold american

i was leaning that way, the frame one didn't seem to alleviate any problems

[warm granite]

Yeah, that's overcomplicated. Just package it all and then you'll be able to priority merge recycled water before you introduce clean water

[old hearth]

nah im just goingg to ahave a clean and recycled system

not wasting space with packager shenanigans

[vapid gorge]

way too much work

splitting fresh and waste refineries is dead simple

[warm granite]

And I got two templates in the works that more than fits in a mk2 blueprint

[vapid gorge]

... so?

this fits with essentially jsut the refineries

[old hearth]

i will give credit, packagers add flair to the build

[vapid gorge]

shrug put random aesthetic shit around it.

you could just have a couple packagers take up less space and just exchanging packages ad infinitum

I don't even think you need to hav ea priority merger for what their talking about, just clock both packagers to package the right amount of fluid pm

[old hearth]

not the same as a machine with decent purpose, I can put any two package loops anywher but it aint authenitc

[warm granite]

Actually I did design a plug-in system

[warm granite]

Put 150 Bauxite/Min, 60 Pet. Coke/Min, and 45 Water/Min and you get 150 Aluminum Bars a min. Only shame was I'm not the best at making it pretty, but I got it within an Mk2 Blueprint to scale

But It can be a plug-n-play system one can scale with in a blueprint. No worrying about recycling needed

[crimson moat]

or the much more problematic "doesn't work on my machine" situations

where it's like.. they look identical from the outside, but "you should have used 3 segments to go from A to B; however you used 5, and actually two include verticality when it should be only one". If you go to help someone and start speaking like that it just sounds like witchcraft, and honestly kinda is.

i just try to avoid systems which can be affected by that as much as possible

key difference between systems which can work, vs systems which cannot fail. Liquid VIP is one of those "can work" things, while solid achieves "cannot fail" status because the priority merger has absolute reliability.

[small yacht]

electrode scrap is goated

2 pipes of oil and 2 somersloops handles the entire maps bauxite

[quiet wasp]

messing around with early game satisfactory is fun

wanted to make my first modular frames factory in the save be 40/min.

at least it should be once everything balances out. just the last assemblers left now

[quiet wasp]

and of course i forgot to even hook up one of the rip assemblers great

[small yacht]

600 pm coming in an splitting like this into 2 lines of 10 refineries. Have them looping from the end on both sides

yet some still won't stay at 100% 😦

[wind spade]

remove the buffer

[small yacht]

removed all buffers from the line, gonna wait like 5 mins and see how it does

there was also a previous buffer at a water?(oil) tower

[crimson moat]

You can't send the purple pipe upwards like that. It cannot climb the pipe without clogging the manifold, because the pipe is above the manifold.

you MAY be able to make it work if you put a valve before the elevation gain begins, but that pump on there is probably too high up to do that job

in general, it's a lot easier if you keep things either on the same level or go downhill rather than uphill

[small yacht]

the output ?

[crimson moat]

you have some refineries creating heavy oil residue yes?

[small yacht]

It comes this way into the bottom floor and then goes up on the side I showed previously. At the top floor it fills in and then flows back down. Seems to be working now, the output manifold is full but the machines aren't backing up

[crimson moat]

what are you asking for help with?

[small yacht]

The issue was with the oil input

[crimson moat]

are you 100% sure that the machines are not running because they have 0 oil

rather than not running because output is full

[small yacht]

110%

well they were, it seems to be fixed now that i've gotten rid of the buffers

Strange though that only that one line was having issues, I've used buffers before input manifolds like that before and haven't had issue before in this save

[thorn bane]

thing is if the reddit post is actually right then you can just add 20 junctions do it and it just works so it doesnt matter if the other side has 3 more or something like "add more junctions till it works"
like look at this thing

[latent swallow]

i think ive found a weird bug, 1200 belts running out of a smart splitter arent running at 1200 items/min i can tell because there is items going out the overflow

im an idiot nvm 🙂

[vapid gorge]

What is this?

[thorn bane]

picture from the reddit post i linked in the convo above
its a VIP
that uses extra junctions to deprioritize fresh water

[vapid gorge]

Ugh

[latent swallow]

at this point just use wet concrete to sink it this is insane lmao

[thorn bane]

i mean ye this is a testing setup
im sure you can make it look nice (or hide behind wall)

[graceful tundra]

dayum

[glacial peak]

if i add a mk2 pump on a mk1 pipe it can still give 50 meters of headlift right?

cause i was thinking of doing that for something instead of 3 pumps on the pipe

[graceful tundra]

ye

[glacial peak]

alrighty

[graceful tundra]

I'm pretty sure

[vapid gorge]

mk for pumps and pipes have nothing to do with each other

[deft lichen]

do these exist in the game?

[vapid gorge]

don't believe so

unless more came in 1.1 than people chatted about

probably structural solutions

[wind spade]

Afaik they are "in" the game, meaning they exist, but can't be built - save compatibility

@deft lichen ^

[vapid gorge]

wait so these are unimplemented obj? \

[wind spade]

More like previously implemented but removed

[vapid gorge]

I don't remember those being listed in the wiki under those objs

[wind spade]

But idk if that's true and if those were in game previously

But Docs list a lot of these under compatibility schematic

I'd have to check at home in the evening

[split sierra]

nice and steady

the counter where i have issues with 600 pipes doesnt need to be reset

[wooden jasper]

how do I transport gases

what are the physics like?

do I need pumps or can they flow anywhere?

[vapid gorge]

no headlift needed. don't use buffers or fluid trains

[wooden jasper]

no trains?

should I just pipe it like all the way across the map

[vapid gorge]

no fluid trains

package it if you want to move by train

[wooden jasper]

oh

this is the path btw

not "all the way" across the map

[vapid gorge]

could always drone it

[wooden jasper]

I was thinking of just piping it if trains aren't the move, but I could always package

I don't have drones yet

[vapid gorge]

train is fine if you package it

[wooden jasper]

haven't done sulfur stuff

I'm pushing to get nitric acid unlocked so rn I'm trying to get some fused frames set up

[vapid gorge]

you'd be unlocking drones soon though?

and drones run on most fuels

[wooden jasper]

I have them unlocked but I'm not using it yet

[vapid gorge]

ah, well a bit of fuel would do it, up to you

[wooden jasper]

uh.. I thought it was just batteries 💀

[vapid gorge]

look them up on the wiki

[wooden jasper]

well I have a lot of extra fuel that I could put into drones instead of power

if I'm going to end up converting it all to rocket fuel soon enough anyway

[vapid gorge]

eh, just do nuclear, it's more sane

[wooden jasper]

well I want rocket fuel as a jetpack material anyway, so hopefully I can get a mix of both

[vapid gorge]

you can just do a bit of RF to then make into ion for the pack.

but to do a reasonable FU gen station you'd need like 500 fully over clocked fuel gens. Or just like 50 nuclear gens

[wooden jasper]

I think I need to make a "second base" for uranium bc my location for the majority of my factories centers around the northern forest and there isn't much sulfur or uranium around

[vapid gorge]

drone the uranium and sulfur to a convenient location and make the rods in an independent factory

[wooden jasper]

ok

[thorn bane]

was in the same location and i just piped it

[wooden jasper]

about drones, can I use multiple in a single port? do they just hover above a port while it is already occupied or will that create problems

[gloomy shoal]

I don't know that I would recommend doing so for item management reasons, but I suppose you can

[thorn trail]

yes, multiple drones can have a single port as their destination, and yes they will circle around the port in a landing pattern if it is occupied when they arrive. It is a perfectly valid strategy for distant drones since they won't arrive and unload that often

[wooden jasper]

also do both ports need fuel or is fueling just one ok

[old hearth]

Just one

[thorn trail]

drones must receive fuel at a port, doesn't matter whether it is destination or home

[old hearth]

I would only do it for fuel carrying drone ngl

[old hearth]

My general rule of thumb it set up 1 drone port per 3 stack of items per minute you want to transport

And 1 at the destination for every drone port you place ofc

[wooden jasper]

I was considering using one drone port for my radio control unit production bc the computers and alum casing need to be brought to the exact same location

[old hearth]

And I highly recommend setting up a base with fuel and drones that you can send to other locations so you don't have to worry about fuel more than once

[wooden jasper]

low quantities of both are involved, I just want to have a solution where it doesn't clog up or fill with only one material

[old hearth]

Just place two different drone porta mixing items in vehicles is a horrible idea

[wooden jasper]

ok

I was almost even considering a belt to move computers bc it's not even that far away

I mean I only need to move 6/min

[old hearth]

Whichever, but mixing items in ports leads to major inefficiencies

[gloomy shoal]

Depends on how much of the system's capacity you're using?

If it's not likely that the port will clog then I suppose there's no reason you can't use one port for both drones, just be sure to have the equipment to deal with a mixed belt and make sure there's an overfill sink somewhere

[sharp mist]

what can i do with this crude oil?

[wind zinc]

you need a well pressurizer

Tier 7

i think...

[sharp mist]

ah see, ty

[versed violet]

What are the proportions of the supply you need to move? 1:1 or something more complicated?
You can take advantage of the fact that merger will take from each input in turn, round robin fashion, which means you can ensure a 1:1 or other small number mix going into the drone station. And use belt limiters to cap the supply exacty on how much you need or just above.

[wooden jasper]

100:6, whatever that simplifies to

[old hearth]

tier 8, though i think phases are abetter marker

[unique cypress]

One setup that might work, is one that uses drones' bi-di transport abilities. Dump the items into the loading drone port, on the unloading side, filter them out and set up overflow. Put the overflow back into the drone, send it back, and on the loading side, filter whatever was delivered, and priority merge it onto the supply belts, using up the overflow first

I have not tested if this'll work properly with drones, but it does work with supply lines

You might also want to use a ratio merger instead of a normal merger, because if you just merge 1:1, you'll be sending a lot of the Computers, back, transporting them back and forth for no reason

Alternatively, you can use rate limiters on the loading side, and on the unloading side overflow into a sink - as long as you're putting in exactly as much as the factory's consuming, nothing will be wasted, and the overflow will prevent it from clogging if something goes wrong with the factory or the supply

Or just use 2 drones

[carmine iron]

I just finished the math for my max nuclear no waste project that will be boosted by 7 Sommersloop machine (all boosted by alien power matrix) for a total of 4 580 250MW 🤣

I think I will only finish the alien power matrix factory this summer and the rest throughout the year I guess 🤣

The first afternoon was just for Marking each nodes I will use for alien boost matrix on the map with a marker 🤣

[unique cypress]

Ficsonium or no Ficsonium?

[velvet bramble]

i'm assuming steel screws here?

[vapid gorge]

unless you want to make a motor factory?

[warm granite]

Reroll

[vapid gorge]

if you want lots of motors rigor is great

[unique cypress]

I wouldn't want either

[vapid gorge]

and steel screw goes fantastic with bolted recipes

[warm granite]

Or... I would wanna keep it so other hard drives don't roll either of these

[unique cypress]

except bolted recipes suck ass

[vapid gorge]

A lot of people. not naming names, will go RECIPE BAD, without actually thinking about the situations where they are good. Like all recipes.

but basically every recipe has it's use. Pick based on what you might be making next

if that's neither? reroll and repeat

[unique cypress]

I have yet to find a situation in which bolted plate is better than stitched plate

same with bolted frame vs steeled frame

they both just seem straight up terrible

[warm granite]

In before V1.2 meta just boosts screw recipes 1billionfold in a new recipe update

[unique cypress]

I'll welcome it

other than copper rotor, screws just seem terrible compared to other options

it would be better if there was something you could gain for using them but no

resource savings from copper rotor and that's it

I actually included a bolted recipe in my mod, so I'd finally have a reason to make screws

[vapid gorge]

then you have little imagination

[wooden jasper]

I don't even make screws at all and I'm about to start on nuclear power, so I guess that's kinda true

Screws are optional 😎

[wooden jasper]

The RIP alt that uses rubber instead of screws is peak if you can wait for each assembler to fill bc there's just so many needed to make a good quantity