math-and-meta

[ashen girder]

If your pipes aren't piping: rebuilding the adjacent pieces often fixes it.

[cedar mica]

Floor holes stopping flow, is a bug. Can have pump right under and still not get flow. If that happens with latest patch, is unknown.

Also why the whole "dont feed from underneath" meta exist.

[ashen girder]

See previous mentions of pipes not piping.

The whole "don't feed from underneath" meta exists because there is very objective weirdness that has literally nothing to do with floor holes.

[proud totem]

Just add 600m of headlift

[ashen girder]

370 by last count. 😂

[proud totem]

Oh yeah, that's what it was 😂

[ashen girder]

But yeah. Basically. It's got to do with machines eating fluid faster than pipes can fill up the input pipes.

[proud totem]

And somewhat with junctions reducing HL too right?

[ashen girder]

Man, I dunno. 🤣

Maybe?

But yeah, it does seem like junctions eat head lift like candy.

[proud totem]

I dunno. Maybe?
I think that is the overall consensus regarding bottom feeding

[ashen girder]

That doesn't mean I agree with it. 😛 And it doesn't entirely make sense given the body of evidence we've accumulated.

I'm absolutely convinced there's a separation between head lift and work pressure, and it's work pressure that matters. But some people don't even agree that those are different things.

[cedar mica]

"Fixed a bug where connecting a Pipeline Junction, Pipeline Pump or Valve to a Pipeline connected to a Pipeline Floor Hole would make it lose connection to the Pipeline Floor Hole." So is that main issue with floor holes, pipes didnt connect?

[proud totem]

We just need to see the code (or at least full logic) at this point

[proud totem]

That's what I've seen people comment about

[ashen girder]

Yeah, aside from the goat sacrificers, that's the actual issues I've seen with holes in general.

And like I said, that issue is incredibly obvious IMO. Pipes stop piping.

[cedar mica]

Guess thats why after enough rebuilds, it worked at some point, unless you gave up floor holes and just ran straight through the floor...

[ashen girder]

Yep. Depends on build order, too.

Because it was specifically a pipe already connected to a hole getting a thing put on it.

And also why it didn't actually affect as many people as you'd think: generally floor holes are connected only to junctions and machines. People aren't usually attaching stuff directly to the pipes off them when building manifolds.

[cedar mica]

The junctions are somewhere, so yeah, it depends on build order.

[magic island]

I assumed "don't feed from below" was unrelated to headlift

like, what I figured was that fluids will prioritize downward flow where possible, so even if the fluid can move upwards, it won't do so until the lower pipes are full

[ashen girder]

So, the reason why it might be, is because we know for certain that you can use pumps to make it work consistently.

And from there, you can add a buttload of head lift from gravity to also make it work.

[magic island]

my guess with pumps is that they're coded to have a higher priority than gravity.

so the fluid's flow preference would be:
pump > downward pipe > lateral pipe > upward pipe

[ashen girder]

If it's because of that, you'd expect Mk1 pumps to also fix it. That's not the case.

[cedar mica]

Pumps "reset" headlift, from what I gather.

[gleaming mulch]

guys its just 1312,5 turbo fuel per min

[magic aurora]

rookie numbers

[gleaming mulch]

for a first time play thought

[spare jolt]

Building amounts are not round, REEEEEE!! /jk

[rapid hedge]

Add a 0 fixes the amount not being round simple really

[fast juniper]

found an insanely broken bug
hold space with the jetpack and take a photo it will boost you up

[oblique hollow]

thats just jetpack + lag in a nutshell

[fast juniper]

yea but you cant control lag

[plain fossil]

welp i did it

2 HMFs/min

and ofc the first problem is me forgetting lift floor holes dont upgrade both sides for some reason

[topaz hedge]

there's another one where the jetpack will run without fuel.

[fast juniper]

it doesnt consume that much fuel

its pretty good if you want to climb something

[topaz hedge]

? not the bug I was talking about.

[magic island]

perhaps the priority weights scale relative to local headlift?

so if the setup is a considerable distance below the headlift max, it can fight gravity easily, allowing upward junctions the same priority as downward ones. but the closer to the cap, the more it'll prefer downward flow? hence Mk1 pumps not being able to out-prioritize gravity

[topaz hedge]

There's one where it runs out of fuel and you keep flying

[fast juniper]

oh i read wrong

my bad

[topaz hedge]

what you described is kind of normal. game lags while flying up, you keep going up during the lag. happens during autosaves too.

[plain fossil]

NOOOOO

there was a tiny piece of mk3 belt hidden inside a merger that should have been mk4

no wonder it was struggling

now everything is perfect

[magic island]

oh yeah, if I'm threading a merger/splitter onto a belt, I never put it too close to the connection point. don't want those tiny belt slices to cause trouble

[ashen girder]

That's possible, but see: that's not just head lift, now there's some other variable involved.

[brisk smelt]

its fine if the belts will never be upgraded

[plain fossil]

they were, and i paid the price

a solid 2 minutes of nonefficiency, Ficsit will be mad

oh

[ashen girder]

Is....is that why they abandoned us here?

[plain fossil]

found a mk1 that should have been a mk2

[ashen girder]

Because of your inefficiency? 😭

[plain fossil]

IM SORRY

but its fine now, these modular frames just made me lose my mind

and im happy these 1 to 5s work

i should build them in my MFs factory bc there i succumbed to the manifold

oh my god i need to make fluctuators and oscillators now

the suffering is real

[magic island]

well, one way or another, since it's all just chained containers passing a numeric value around, it's all got to boil down to the logic of how connections & junctions decide which pipe to increment and which to decrement. and since they don't do it evenly all the time, there's a priority calculation somewhere in there.

maybe there is a separate "work pressure" variable involved. Or it could just be that the headlift variable gets used in two parts of the calculation (determining whether the fluid can progress at all, and also affecting how gravity is weighted)

[ashen girder]

It's not just passing a numeric value around. That's part of the problem.

At minimum it's passing both volume and pressure.

[thick heart]

is packaged turbo fuel decent for drones?

[ashen girder]

It's between P. Fuel and Batteries/Rocket Fuel.

[thick heart]

is turbo bad tho?

like i have tons of it

[brisk smelt]

and nuclear fuel rods ofc :p

[ashen girder]

Nuclear fuel rods aren't in there. 😛

P. Fuel < P. Turbo Fuel < Batteries = Rocket Fuel < Ionized Fuel < UFR < PFR

[brisk smelt]

huh wdym

doesn't nuclear fuel rod = UFR/PFR/FFR

can you even put fisconium into drones

[ashen girder]

If I say "C is between B and D", saying "F is too" doesn't make any sense.

[brisk smelt]

oh i misread your statement lol

[ashen girder]

I haven't gotten confirmation of yes or no to FFR in drones yet.

[brisk smelt]

i thought u meant that as in like, p.fuel and batteries are the best lol

mb

[ashen girder]

TL;DR: it's not the worst, but it's not great at all. Rocket Fuel would be much better.

[thick heart]

aight yeah ill do that

[magic island]

kinda wish they'd kept some kind of special advantage for batteries for drones. there ends up being no reason you specifically need them for anything

[brisk smelt]

they should be re-chargable

with the t9 buildings or something

and you can fill em with different battery fillings idk

just like AA, L-Ion and nimh's

[glossy ether]

Isn’t the advantage faster speed without needing nuclear?

I guess it’s still not faster than rocket/ionized.

[magic island]

previously, batteries were the only drone fuel, so the logistics of making them was baked into the infrastructure of having a drone network

now they're no longer needed for drones or project assembly, so they're just this weird tertiary part that isn't super worth the setup compared to other fuel types

[white wasp]

been planning to remake my steel factory so here's little scheme I got. What do you think?(Planning to make 1 Thermal Propulsion Rocket)

[brisk smelt]

their only use now is SC's

[magic island]

versus making rocket fuel in bulk, and then being able to send some of it to generators and packing up some of it for drones

[brisk smelt]

is OC or SSC better as of v1.0 anyways

[magic island]

I think OC is good now, or at least better than it used to be? cooling system / RCU synergy is good because you want to make lots of those anyway these days

[quiet breach]

Would 50-100 be a solid amount of them?

[thick heart]

is there a rocket fuel alternate that doesn't use nitric acid?

[quiet breach]

Rocket fuel uses the gas

Iirc

Nitro **

[magic island]

nitro rocket fuel skips the acid and just uses straight gas

[thick heart]

the hunt begins

[fleet pumice]

what's the best rotor alternate recipe

[spare jolt]

better than fuel but worse than rocket fuel, simple as that

[wind spade]

how do you define best?

[spare jolt]

as people said - nitro rocket fuel uses the gas but takes fuel and twice as much sulfur

[fleet pumice]

most efficient one

without useing screws

[spare jolt]

steel rotor

[wind spade]

what efficiency are you talking about? 🙂 power? space? one resource? sum of resources? weighted resources? complexity?

[wind spade]

there's only one screwless rotor recipe

[fleet pumice]

resource wish

[spare jolt]

yea my bad, thought copper rotor takes rods

[brisk smelt]

use whichever one the calculator recommends you

[fleet pumice]

my bad

[brisk smelt]

thags the most efficient

in terms of output/input

[wind spade]

the one that is screwless is also lest resource efficient

[wind spade]

not many calculators recommend recipes

[fleet pumice]

thanks for the help

[brisk smelt]

doesnt ur calculator choose the most efficient one

[magic island]

don't be afraid of screws imo

once you have alts they're a very easy part to deal with

[fleet pumice]

i'm just started to get into the game

[spare jolt]

thought it allows to produce rotors and motors from iron ore only

i have a build that produces 5.9-something of rotors, stators and motors from 2-3-ish iron nodes only

[wind spade]

no

It chooses recipe path that leads to least weighted resource usage. However weighting is global, which most people don't care about

[wind spade]

very expensively 🤷
at that game stage you should be building steel anyway, so no reason to limit it to iron only

[magic island]

copper rotor is a great recipe, the only catch is that the copper is non-negotiable, so it's less resource-flexible than the others

[spare jolt]

i knew it was expensive and I had steel, I just wanted to show off to myself

one of those things you do when you're bored because you just can

[warm ferry]

EXAMPLE!
Should I put the Valves at the point where i want the liquid to Divide or it doesnt matter?

[wind spade]

you should never use valves

[warm ferry]

and why is that

[ashen girder]

n e v e r

[magic island]

they are janky and won't really do what you want them to do

[warm ferry]

but they do?

[ashen girder]

If you want to imprecisely reduce flow, they're pretty good for that.

[warm ferry]

i had a coal farm that the water kept beheaving wierdly and after i added valves to spread the water it worked fine?

coal gen* not farm

[ashen girder]

Imagining you watering a coal node with a watering can.

"One day. 🥺 "

[warm ferry]

itll grow into a coal tree

yeah but do valves really not work or did they fix them and now its just an old rumor that keeps going around?

[ashen girder]

What do you think valves are supposed to do?

[warm ferry]

stop water from flowing in one direction based on the Liquid/M you set them to

[ashen girder]

Yeah, not really.

[magic island]

they can't really hit the target flow accurately, it'll always end up being some amount less. fluctuations will always work against you

[ashen girder]

Whether they just plain don't or just appear not to is.. an open question for me.

But they're not backflow preventers. They're valves.

[spare jolt]

no, it's just some guy in CSS is a lazy arse and assigned valves' flow limit to discrete values, which they did not bother to fix ever

[warm ferry]

gimmie a second let me go to my coal factory real quick

wdym discrete values?

[spare jolt]

https://satisfactory.wiki.gg/wiki/Valve

[warm ferry]

how did they get the number 102 and 15 tho?

i get the 2.3622 but what about those?

As for my Coal Factory, i did this and it fixed my issue

[ashen girder]

36/600 * 254 = 15.24.

240/600 * 254 = 101.6.

[warm ferry]

and then round up to the closest number goti t

let me try something

90/600 (Coal Generators 200% is 90water/m) * 254 = 38.1 (Rounding it to 38)
38 * 2.3622 = 89.7636

so each pipe Valve transfers that number instead of 90?

[ashen girder]

In theory, at least.

[tiny leaf]

So theoretically could we not reverse calculate to get our desired numbers?

[oblique hollow]

head lift and pressure used for flow rate is entirly seperate

[warm ferry]

but to be fair

isnt the number too small to worry about?

[oblique hollow]

yes

[tiny leaf]

No it eventually does add up

0.24/min of loss essentially

[oblique hollow]

the only way you can use valves is set them to be a little bit more than you need.
Which isnt helpful for aluminum water recycling

[spare jolt]

theoretically you can, but practically this will limit your throughput and production in long term

[warm ferry]

mmm another question

will they fix this or is it not counted as a bug?

[oblique hollow]

we dont know

its just the way the valve is implemented

so not really a bug just very much not explained

[tiny leaf]

I see man the fluid system in this game is a whole blackhole of knowledge

[spare jolt]

technically it's not a bug, but will it be fixed? who knows

[fleet pumice]

in satisfactory calculator how do you make it so that one miner is a pure ore vane and the other one a normal ore vane

[oblique hollow]

"hey btw the valve doesnt have infinitely many small values"

[warm ferry]

so IT WILL be fixed

nevermind you corrected it

[ashen girder]

Let's not pretend that 1024 wouldn't be more than adequate.

[spare jolt]

if you're one of those min-maxers - yes, but imo what the game tells you is enough for regular playthrough

[warm ferry]

I'll just build with valves and pray that some day they fixed this issue

[oblique hollow]

cant do 60 with that, you get 59.7 or 60.4

[warm ferry]

ill ignore it for now

[spare jolt]

no one knows. i'm not even sure if this was acknowledged by devs

[barren lynx]

why wont my train pick up quartz from quartz and drop it off at fishpow.co

[oblique hollow]

is the station set to load and fishpow set to unload

[ashen girder]

Or, hear me out, store the actual target flow number. Then you don't have any decimals to deal with.

Then you can only have 60 or 61 instead of 60.4.

[oblique hollow]

store it as a float

[ashen girder]

Or do that. That's probably fine right?

[oblique hollow]

flow rate is already a float

[barren lynx]

yeah

[ashen girder]

Yeah. I do find it interesting that they chose to do that with valves.

[thick heart]

is it bad to have two drones going back and fourth from two drone stations or no?

like will they get stuck

[spare jolt]

does one of the stations have power? are all the tracks connected to each other? does the station even have anything to load?

[tiny leaf]

Okay so i know trains have a 27.08 or something second delay because of animation but theoretically if i have a factory producing x/min and another needs x/min of the same item is there ever a scenario where the train will cause a loss of efficiency?

[warm ferry]

ok so ignoring the whole Valve issue at hand right now, Should i place them at the START of the point that the liquid will Divide or does it not matter?

[keen moss]

I've never seen this bug before

[barren lynx]

tracks are all good but train just stops at the station doesnt load then go to nezt station

[oblique hollow]

if you have storage containers to buffer input you can usually compensate. But the longer the train route the more likely you will run into the limit for trains

[tiny leaf]

Is there any calculator for this to determine how many trains you need etc?

[spare jolt]

I don't remember if both stations have to be powered, but try to connect the quartz station to power - the station can't load if it lacks power

[oblique hollow]

there is none, theres only the wiki page

[warm ferry]

I tried this in another world and it was the opposite, for some reason the output (factory) had MORE liquid than needed

[oblique hollow]

you have to math it out yourself or just YOLO it

[tiny leaf]

Guess ill have to do some math myself 😔

[magic island]

the main annoyance is having to time the train route yourself

from there, the math is pretty easy

[proud totem]

The old nice use for valves was when you could set it to 0 flow to have a static water tower to give you completely free headlift

[barren lynx]

both stations now powered and it just ploughs through

[tiny leaf]

Well i mean that makes sense the input will have less since the train is transporting more than x/min

[tiny leaf]

Yeah i guess ill have to use a stopwatch on my phone or something

[warm ferry]

thats not how it works, if you use buffers/storage (fluid/items)

[wind spade]

#math-and-meta message

[barren lynx]

ive placed the frieght station in front of the station, could that be a probelm

[warm ferry]

?

[wind spade]

link to message about why not to use valves

[tiny leaf]

I mean it is since the output buffer will have more than the input buffer

[spare jolt]

ah, yea it might actually be the one - i always installed freights after train stations and had zero troubles

[warm ferry]

im NOT reading allat but i did read the Picture images. It makes sense now why its a small amount less you're right, but i feel like for a game like satisfactory they wouldnt keep it in the game, you know what i mean right?

[proud totem]

#math-and-meta message
This was a pretty good summary from earlier about calculating train throughput

[wind spade]

I mean if you're not reading it that's on you 🤷
but vavles shouldn't be used, whether you read why or not

[tiny leaf]

Definitely saving that for later

[warm ferry]

i mean, dont the picture images explain the text above it?

[proud totem]

There was a pretty good conversation surrounding it too that would be worth reading

I kindof want to put together a simple train manual to explain buffers, throughput, and their limits

[oblique hollow]

the entire fluid system is a bit janky.
Valves are simply a bit too niche to use in any factory.
You cant use them for precise limits cause they arent accurate enough
you cannot fully stop backflow as a pressure surge wave will affect the input side anyway

So now the valve basically doesnt do anything you would use it for

[plucky violet]

is my calculation off to a bad start about my factory's build? I ran out of concrete like 5% into starting the first level logistics floor XD

[wind spade]

the image is just one of 3-4 things that's problematic with valves

[oblique hollow]

which leaves it as a decorative piece in the best cases

[warm ferry]

i just read allat and damn

[subtle goblet]

how do you place path signals?

at exit or entrance

[barren lynx]

so is this alright?

[thick heart]

is it bad to have two drones going back and fourth from two drone stations or no?
like will they get stuck

[oblique hollow]

entrances.

[warm ferry]

about the "Full pipes are happy pipes", what if im using a liquid fleight to transfer oil/water? If my input is 50/m and my output (factory) is 50/m wouldnt the factory eat up all the liquid and make the pipes empty?

[oblique hollow]

Yes

if you have 0 verticality, it doesnt matter

[subtle goblet]

like so?

[oblique hollow]

but with verticality you need full pipes in some places (usually the lower ones) else you just dont get any flow

[warm ferry]

who is this for?

[wind spade]

pipe fullness is different thing than pipe throughput

a pipe moving 50/min can be full, or can be empty

[oblique hollow]

you

[warm ferry]

ah thanks

[oblique hollow]

yeah. you need exits too. block signals are usually for exits

[wind spade]

I would also recommend not using roundabouts, instead use normal X junction

[subtle goblet]

hm the youtube video didnt do that

[wind spade]

youtube videos aren't always correct

[warm ferry]

yeah but like mmmm
Lets say my input/output is 100/m and im using the "Full freights then leave" method (Someone told me if i do it like this they work like HUGE Conveyor belts in a way), wouldnt the factory just consume all the liquid before the pipes get full? or would the train have to do a couple of rounds so that the pipes get full and then it will all get stabilized by itself?

[slender sandal]

trying to decide between rocket fuel and batteries as my primary fuel source for trucks and drones right now, anyone have insight or advice on which is more efficient to use?

[wind spade]

if you have trains, you want to have buffers on loading and unloading sides

[barren lynx]

@spare jolt so turns out its becuase my train doesnt dock

how do i fix it?

[warm ferry]

(please ingore the valves... ill still use them even tho i know they are flawed...)_

yes im transfering water, my future factory is quite thirsty

[spare jolt]

not sure if it would even stop at the station if it can't dock. i can't check the exact reason right now, sorry

[barren lynx]

its okay

[snow maple]

if it's stopping and immediately leaving again, it can't load/unload. check that the freight platforms are set correctly and that any platforms meant to load are receiving items to load.

also any platforms in front of the station you're docking at are ignored

[vital garden]

i know almuninum numbers are fun and cool, but holy numbers

[oblique hollow]

using pure doesnt much help with the bauxite cost there. you lose 25% of ingots

[unborn ermine]

Yeah its the conjunction of sloppy you go for, well sloppy and electro scrap, you get a 1-1 ore to ingot minimum

[warm ferry]

Ok i have a serious question right now.
A train that has 1 Loco and 4 Cars that are empty
and
A train that has 1 Loco and 4 Cars that are full

Will they move at the same speed regardless of the incline?

[oblique hollow]

no

full cars weigh more

[warm ferry]

so what ratio should i use?

[oblique hollow]

depends on the slope / incline

[proud totem]

Does that mean they also hold their speed better after coming down a hill?

[oblique hollow]

they speed up faster downhill and also slow down faster when going uphill

!wikisearch freight+car

[brisk shore]

https://satisfactory.wiki.gg/index.php?search=freight+car

[warm ferry]

should i just use a 1:2 ratio to be safe?

1 Train per 2 Full Cars

[oblique hollow]

1 to 4 might work, but corkscrews add a lot of curve resistance

if it was a straight ramp it would work fine

[warm ferry]

alright then ill go with a 1:2 ratio just incase

[short comet]

is it normal that the manufacturer loads the items slower then the belt is delevering them?
edit. nvm was stupid i had a normal splitter in the chain not a smart one :D

[subtle goblet]

i dont understand signals 😔

[ashen girder]

Block signal: "if there is a train in this block, I can not go there"
Path signal: "if the path is clear through the next block signal, and I can go to that block, I can reserve a path and go there."

[short comet]

if you dont have any crazy interceptions you can do everything with block signals only

[spare jolt]

when playing satisfactory I miss my factorio train intersection blueprints I shamelessly stole from one youtuber

[ashen girder]

Can't shamelessly steal them again?

Oh, factorio. 😂

Look up the Community Railway Sets.

[spare jolt]

i will as soon as I'm gonna be using at least one intersection

[warm ferry]

Ok.

So im making a train that has 40 Freights to transfer Water and i tested the time for it to come and go to be 6 minutes long, but when i calculated my production and consumption rates i found out i need MORE freight cars. Wouldnt that make the Railway LONGER? therefore INCREASING the travel time? THEREFORE INCREASING THE AMOUNT OF WATER I NEED TO TRANSFER? so i can keep up with the consumption rate?

[ashen girder]

Adding cars shouldn't make it take longer, no. You just might need to add more locos too.

[snow maple]

use more, smaller trains. 40 cars is massive

[ashen girder]

See? More locos.

[warm ferry]

Yeah but that would make the Railway bigger

[plucky lance]

Aye. Split the time it takes for a load to get there. More trains, not as many cars. More consistent shipments.

[warm ferry]

Therefore increasing the time...

[ashen girder]

More locos wouldn't do that.

[warm ferry]

By more locos you mean more trains? As in, not locos on one single train.. right?

[ashen girder]

No, I mean more locomotives on one single train.

[warm ferry]

But that would increase the railway tho

[magic island]

imo if you need that many cars to transport your water, consider building that factory on the water instead

whatever you're adding water to is gonna be a heck of a lot easier to transport

[ashen girder]

How?

[snow maple]

how much water are you moving, and what is the track distance

[snow maple]

what do you mean by "increase railway"?

[warm ferry]

By... Adding space so that the loco fits in the railway station?

[ashen girder]

It doesn't have to fit in the railway station.

[warm ferry]

Around 13.5k per minute and the time is like 6 minutes

[snow maple]

if you tack locos on the back of the train, they can hang out the end of the station

[warm ferry]

But then it wouldn't look nice :(

[subtle goblet]

not fully sure how to properly set this up

[ashen girder]

What.. wouldn't look nice about it?

Anyway, I've answered your question in the scenario you've posited. 😂 I agree with everyone else: just don't.

[warm ferry]

Having them go 1 train 2 cars 1 train 1 cars looks nicer than 1 train 40 Cars 10 trains (numbers are for an example(

[ashen girder]

I mean, that's.. more or less right. 😂

Are those all path signals though?

All routes out of the intersection should be block signals.

Generally you want all path signals to go to a block signal.

[warm ferry]

Sure I want trains that transfer items but that doesn't mean I don't want them to look good while they do it

[ashen girder]

Then make 10 stations that each run 1+4.

[snow maple]

idk what to tell you dude, fluids are hard to transport via train in the first place, and you're doing 5 figures. maybe do two parallel stations alongside each other, 20-30 cars each?

[warm ferry]

Mmm yeah I think I'll do that

But question

[subtle goblet]

i put blocks between stations path at entry and exit

[ashen girder]

Block at exit.

[magic island]

based on the volume of water needed, I'm guessing this is a nuke build?

you should always build those right at the water source, it will save you from whatever you've got going on right now

[subtle goblet]

but that means if a train is on the way to a station nothing can enter the track

[warm ferry]

Would it be better if I calculated the travel time to always be 10 minutes (even if it's 1, 2 or more (less than 10 minutes though)

I'm gonna use the "Full freights and then leave" method so I feel like it would be better to add more time and based on that time set up the trains so that if they need less time it doesn't matter since they'll wait until they get full, but if it's more time then you're kinda ducked

[ashen girder]

Are you saying that's currently different?

[brisk smelt]

why are you moving water and not the other way around...

[warm ferry]

Listen. I have a dream.

And water here is an example

[ashen girder]

Turns out dream logic isn't real life logic.

[warm ferry]

I can't make my dreams come true in real life, but I can make them in satisfactory and I WILL.

[warm ferry]

But please tell me if my logic here makes sense

[snow maple]

if you can guarantee less than 10 min RT time, go for it, it's always safer to overbuild trains than under

[amber jacinth]

Is your dream to co-star with Adam Sandler in The Waterboy 2?

[subtle goblet]

can go in

cant must wait

[ashen girder]

We're talking about this, not that.

[warm ferry]

let's GOOO, also sorry but this would work even if the liquid is slow like.. example: Oil at 120/m right?

[snow maple]

all liquids are the same speed with respect to trains

[warm ferry]

I need 13.5k/m water, but it would work with less /m right?

The "set a 10m road time just incase" method that I thought of above

[snow maple]

path signals work almost identically to block sigs, you only need paths on the entrances to the orange block, all others will behave as blocks

[snow maple]

the theory is sound, but adjust the road time based on travel distance. gold coast to dune desert nitrogen well is probably more than 10m RT depending on track layout

[warm ferry]

Yeah I know I set it to 20 minutes for now

[magic island]

doesn't make a difference. the max throughput calculation is the same no matter what you program the train to do

programming the load/unload behaviour comes into play for stuff like:

• saving power on a low-volume route by reducing the frequency of trips the train takes
• improving distribution when trains arrive at a station in succession (so if one train empties out the station, the second train will wait around until there's more to collect)

[warm ferry]

Anyways after this factory I won't really build anything else huge until I get to tier 9

[brisk smelt]

yummy 55 HMF/min, soon to be 45PCC+10FMF

[ember fractal]

I want to squeeze out the most quartz crystal and silica from my quartz nodes. Is quartz purification -> distilled silica the best chain for me to use?

[cedar ivy]

it's a great alt to get more of both. But your ratio of consumption may still need more of one or the other from another recipe

and it is a good deal more complexity for something you may not be using all of your quartz for yet, anyways

[magic island]

you get a 5:9 crystal/silica ratio no matter what, but the yield is excellent. so if you need a healthy amount of both, it's a good choice

[ember fractal]

Yeh, I'm planning to use the crystal to make a tonload of Crystal Osc, and the Silica to make circuit board, hight speed cons, nuclear fuel.

So I kinda need a lot of both

The added complexity yah, but I feel like it gives a good amount of product per raw quartz

Especially if I 250% OC and sloop the refineries

[cedar ivy]

that may be low on the product chain to get value out of sloops... but it's not a huge jump of more complexity anyways

[magic island]

one handy thing is that if you make 5 Distilled Silica blenders (which is what you'd use in processing 1200 Raw Quartz), you only need to give one of them fresh water. The other 4 can run off the collective byproduct water

[ember fractal]

cool

[thick heart]

if a drone station is full, will the drone just stop going back and forth until it starts to empty?

[amber umbra]

@thick heart If a drone docks, trying to unload but is unable to unload due to a full drone port, that drone will just sit until it can unload.

[brisk smelt]

i am going to kill myself

[edgy leaf]

wheres the problem?

[brisk smelt]

24k copper

640 fucking refineries

320 if i sloop 160 if i double sloop

oh wait fuck the particle accelerators are gonna pull 300GW too

and i need 400Gwh of batteries

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

[amber jacinth]

But why would you do that to yourself

[brisk smelt]

for 50 nuclear pasta/min.

wait, will i even have copper left for the rest of the spelevator parts

i leave only like 6k copper on the map

i can cheat a bit and summon a thousand sloops to cut that in quarter

[thick heart]

thanks

[edgy leaf]

why.

[brisk smelt]

fluctuations

my grid does 110k rn, will do 600k after i copypasta all the reactors

1.3 after plutonium but that is hell

[unborn ermine]

wouldnt that like, entirely waste the effort of the rest of it

[brisk smelt]

mhm

is there a way to copypaste these rows of reactors using SCIM

[quiet breach]

Why do you need 50/min

[brisk smelt]

i never said i needed it, i want it :D

i need to set some real goals or i js get bored

[spare jolt]

factory games are those where you scale not because you need but because you can

[cerulean stratus]

While refineries are pretty good, check out foundries. Copper alloy is really strong

And you can fit more of them in a bp

[brisk smelt]

wouldnt that be like 15k cu and 15k fe

[cerulean stratus]

Beats making 1600 refineries

Still though, I do not think it's good for you to do this
You're just asking to get burned out

[brisk smelt]

if i figure out scim copypasting

[pastel obsidian]

Iron is easier to deal with than pipes of water

[brisk smelt]

fair enough

oh fuck off calculator...

[wind spade]

I mean it reuses extra water 😛 😄

[edgy leaf]

evisensi

[wet python]

how many Crystal Oscillators do you have per min? is 45/m too much?

[magic island]

if you want to make Alien Power Matrixes, that'll make life easier. If not, it may be overkill.

[torpid gorge]

why??????

why would you ever wanna do that lol

[brisk smelt]

because i can.

[spare jolt]

It's like turning the entire map into a giant ballistic warp drive sink

Is there a reason for this? No. Can you do that? Absolutely.

[flint rapids]

The little light-blue Signaled Block of rail on the right side - is it needed or useless? Will it break pathing? (in case it is hard to see - that right-most rail is signaled P>B>P>B

[distant aurora]

it will slow down any passing train cause the path isn't reserved until the train is in the block before the path signal

you should be able to remove both of those signals and it'll work better

[sturdy arrow]

the setup is a bit confusing

[brisk smelt]

remove those two signals

pointless

[flint rapids]

So with small stations attached to pass-through roads it is better to keep that middle part "same single colour"?

[distant aurora]

yeah basically

[flint rapids]

Okay, cheers

[spare jolt]

according to satisfactorytools, this is the max amount of warp drives you can produce, which is equal to about 211,414,393.346 points per minute

[sturdy arrow]

post the setup again after you remove the signs @flint rapids

[brisk smelt]

not really, that will just end up running off biofuel won't it

[spare jolt]

Nobody said this amount would be feasible

[supple hull]

which is the best circuit board recipe?

[spare jolt]

Best for what?

[sturdy arrow]

i dont know how to fix it, but it doesn't look like two trains could go past this station at the same time in different directions. also looks like the left path signal is angry. the left path enters at the far site, and the right path enters at the far site too, right?

[spare jolt]

There's not many recipes in SF that are direct upgrades (I can only remember cast screw and solid steel ingot)

[sturdy arrow]

if you are willing to elevate the track, you could have the two straight paths occupied at once

what about this?

[slate wraith]

Okay. Pipes fixed. I can run these forever on OC.

WOOOOOOO. I now have 12MW of power.

It turns out however I might, just might be able to run more fuel gens.

[sturdy arrow]

i assume one path is one way, and the other is the other? like northbound and southbound

[flint rapids]

This setup is right-hand drive, Left path enters from far back - southbound, right path enters from under me - northbound.
The far away path signal on left track is in norma "waiting for reservation state"
I understand eliminating crossings with elevation - that is possible, but don't quite understand the rest and these letters.

[sturdy arrow]

ah, i meant B for add a block signal, and P for add a path signal. although, i dont have all the detail. Do you ever want trains to go by here, or does each one need to visit? cause if that's all orange, then only one train can pass the station at a time

i would try a path signal on the right side of the right road, between the two intersections, so the rail can check if the station is free. also, a block on the right side of the left path, and a block on the left side of the left path between the two intersections, so trains can go on either side. following the principle of "after every decision, put a block. before every decision, put a path"

[vocal lagoon]

What’s the math to calculate uranium fuel rod to uranium waste?

[amber jacinth]

rods/min * 50 = waste / min

[sturdy arrow]

this would do the same job, but it would remove some signals. essentially, the components of your big circle would switch sides

[vocal lagoon]

What about waste per min?

[flint rapids]

I follow. I'm going to test that part with 2 dummy stations as is

[vocal lagoon]

Is it *10?

[amber jacinth]

each reactor burns 0.2 rods, so it's 50 per min for each rod (as one rod/min fuels 5 reactors, producing 10 waste each)

[wind spade]

neither of those are direct upgrades

[sturdy arrow]

every rod you make will eventually make 50 waste, is another way to think it

[slate wraith]

Looks like my oil refineries toward the end aren't getting enough oil, but the 12 gens at max OC with basic fuel are running.

Without issue. So I assume some piping changes and then maybe, just maybe it'll turn out well? I dunno. It works like a charm right now.

[distant aurora]

smelters take up next to no space and use next to no power, and solid steel can also chain with pure iron or iron alloy to further increase production. it's one of those recipes that's as close to a straight upgrade as jt gets

it also has nicer ratios

[torpid gorge]

yeah im ngl solid steel is like as direct upgrade as it gets

[wind spade]

it's not "direct upgrade" then, but "direct upgrade if you choose to ignore some facts that you chose to ignore"

[flint rapids]

You are right - thrain wasn't able to pass on the right when left track is occupied. I fixed by adding two middle sections instead of the one small one I had before.
They are passing fine now.
I think at worst it might cause a small pause.

[torpid gorge]

its more like the other way around.. it is really hard to actually make solid steel worse than vanilla

[brisk smelt]

sloppy electrode?

[sturdy arrow]

much better looking. if you have the patience, you can always add another block signal after a decision, and see if the new colors make more sense. good work!

[distant aurora]

electrode uses oil which is rarer than coal. it's more of a sidegrade

[wind spade]

easily - it's more complex

[distant aurora]

also adds a lot of complexity in turning the oil into coke

[brisk smelt]

it uses like 1200 oil to 10000 ingots, pretty worth it

actually, like 600 if you loop properly

[torpid gorge]

but its literally one smelter.. a 1 to 1 machine..

[wind spade]

... which is still more complexity

[distant aurora]

yeah i mean it's really good, but not nearly as much of a straight upgrade as like solid steel or encased pipes yknow?

[brisk smelt]

also pure aluminum ingot

isnt that a pure upgrade

[wind spade]

no

[sturdy arrow]

unless you want the silica

[wind spade]

there's no "pure upgrade" recipe in Satisfactory

[distant aurora]

pure aluminum reduces output and speed

[sturdy arrow]

for me, anything that turns a manufacturer into an assembler is huge cause it saves me 2 sloops hehe

[fringe pawn]

Encased pipes is probably my vote for closest to a direct upgrade, because you can switch to it by only swapping recipes on machines. But it's only 4ppm versus 6ppm.

[distant aurora]

even if you're making a lot of EIBs the difference in speed isn't that huge

[sturdy arrow]

ingot -> screw instead of ingot -> rod -> screw is also like an insane QOL for me

[wind spade]

I'm not saying the recipes are bad, I'm just saying they aren't direct upgrades 🤷

[distant aurora]

it's not a 100% straight upgrade when you consider steel rods -> default screws being more efficient than steel screws, but it's still extremely OP

[slate wraith]

I'm going to use steel screws over cast iron tbh.

[distant aurora]

but yeah if you're not using encased pipes or solid steel you're leaving efficiency on the table for no benefit

[spiral wigeon]

If I need to transport ~4800m of water upwards like 90ish walls whats the best way to transport it up since I need multiple pipes thats a lot of pumps to set up

[brisk smelt]

12 pipes not too bad

[sturdy arrow]

only need one pipe that pumps high enough

[brisk smelt]

not 12 what am i saying

you can package it and send it up via 4 lifts if u want

[distant aurora]

if you dont mind kinda cheating you can use the closed valve headlift trick to give free headlift to the whole network

[spiral wigeon]

whats that

[distant aurora]

make a pipe or buffer that has fluid as high as you want the head lift to be and connect it to the network through a closed valve

[sturdy arrow]

only need pumps on the big hump

[distant aurora]

it's like a water tower but free

[prime axle]

Hello! Does anyone have a blueprint of a coal plant?

[distant aurora]

you're not gonna get a full coal plant in a blueprint

[spiral wigeon]

thanks

[brisk smelt]

use the standard 8-3

[distant aurora]

also your fun is valid you play however you want™ but i think downloading blueprints kinda spoils the game

[wind spade]

And probably will break since it's using valves and buffers

[prime axle]

Maybe I expressed myself wrong with "plant"

[distant aurora]

the valve is just there to completely stop the flow. you're just passing the headlift from the buffer over to the rest of the network. no valve jank is involved here

[brisk smelt]

blueprints are useful for 1. vip 2. rail segements 3. road segments 4. rail spirals (greeny i know they suck) 5. building (manifold) templates

like, who wants to build their own vip junction amirite 😉

[prime axle]

What are you talking about?

[distant aurora]

i built my own VIP and got two people to put like 10+ hours into figuring out what the hell is wrong with it

[distant aurora]

3 water extractors feed exactly 8 coal gens

[prime axle]

ty!

[flint rapids]

Added two more signals in the space between the main lines.
They didn't work when they were Block, but are working fine now that they are Path.
Feels weird to have a section that has a Path on two entrances, and also sections that have Path both on entrance and exit, but it works.

[wind spade]

don't really need those path signals there tbh

[sturdy arrow]

before adding those, if a train exits the station, it wont let the other line go

[distant aurora]

if it's exiting the station toward the top of the pic then yeah obviously, that's gonna happen either way

if it's exiting towards the botton then it should only block the track next to the station

but it'll stop ot either way

i recommend just leaving it how it was after you removed the little blue block

[distant aurora]

like this just leave it like this

at most a pair of path signals between the 2 intersections

[brisk smelt]

why signal like this...

all you need is two paths and two blocks

[distant aurora]

three paths. one coming out of the station

[flint rapids]

Like that if I had a train anywhere in the orange section - another couldn't enter even if it was on opposite line.

[distant aurora]

if a train is coming into or out of the station through the right track it's gonna block both tracks no matter how you signal it

if it's using the track on the left then that one will be blocked but the right track should still work

this will happen pretty much no matter what your signals look like, and the pic with the big orange block is the simplest solution

ok I actually quoted the wrong pic. forget about the signals in the middle that koobz suggested, just 3 paths in, 3 blocks out

[brisk smelt]

do water extractors pasted by SCIM not work

-_-

[wind spade]

seems to work and be full of water? maybe pipe connection is broken?

[brisk smelt]

never mind they werent connected to power lol im so stupid

i did an oops too while pasting...

this kinda pisses me off 😭

[vapid gorge]

@tropic hazel example ratios using different recipes

example of a 780 sloppy electrode set up and some clockings

[distant aurora]

i used 4 making electrode at 100% and 3 making sloppy from byproduct at 70%

no shards

[gusty edge]

But only with mk2 pipes, unless you do some shenanigans

[wind spade]

Easily with mk1s

  G  G  G  G
E-+--+--+--+
E-+
E-+--+--+--+
  G  G  G  G

[gusty edge]

Makes sense

[fringe seal]

I might need to rebuild my 36 refinery setup completely

[edgy leaf]

fun !

i hate liquids in this game

[fringe seal]

same

[edgy leaf]

adding pumps makes them work

just, pumps everywhere. even if it makes no sense. all the pumps.

[sturdy arrow]

Liquids are here as agents of satan

[fringe seal]

it works, apparently, if and only if you knew some arcane knowledge about irl fluid dynamics

[edgy leaf]

no, its really simple. add pumps. theres no reason or logic behind it. pumps make everything work.

[sturdy arrow]

Fill your pipes before using em

[edgy leaf]

that doesnt help.

[fringe seal]

my personal rule is that you never do 600 on a 600 pipe

[edgy leaf]

its very simple to do 600 on a 600 pipe

[sturdy arrow]

It absolutely helps

[fringe seal]

this mirrors my experience

[edgy leaf]

i can start my setup that feeds 600 water to 16 refineries (bottomfeeding) dry and it warms up to 600 rather quickly

it just needs 370 meters of headlift

[sturdy arrow]

Didn’t say it was mandatory, it helps.

[edgy leaf]

the 10 meters of the water extractor arent enough to move the liquid up 8 meters. the 20 meters of the mk1 pump also arent sufficient. not even a mk2 pump is able to push liquid up 8 meters.

[fringe seal]

oh and loops never worked for me

[fringe seal]

hmmm

[sturdy arrow]

If a pipe isn’t filling, there’s your issue. We’re talking about people who are having issues, they aren’t masters, it helps them when they don’t immediately have sloshing

[edgy leaf]

yep.

[analog shadow]

valves help

[edgy leaf]

370 meters of headlift to lift fluid up by 8 meters

[edgy leaf]

valves didnt help at all, 370 meters of headlift did make it run perfectly

[analog shadow]

O.O

[edgy leaf]

well, i tested iwthout pump, then with a mk1 pump, then with a mk2 pump, then with 370 meters of headlift

No pump water extractor efficiency:
42%
41%

MK1 pump water extractor efficiency:
71%
74%

MK2 pump water extractor efficiency:
97%
89%

370 meter headlift water extractor efficiency:
100%
100%

theres EIGHT meters of height difference. eight. all i did was add headlift and that made it work. WHY.

[analog shadow]

what do you mean when you refer to headlift

[edgy leaf]

the headlift is the number of how high fluid can go

[sturdy arrow]

Head lift is a game and real life concept. It’s the vertical distance a pump can send water. The mark 2 adds 50m

[pastel obsidian]

What are we looking at

[prisma kraken]

yeah, laura is pointing out some jank in how fluids in the game work

[proud totem]

Do hypertube wall holes not actually make a visible hole through the wall?

[analog shadow]

Oh ok, thats what i thought it was, i just got confused when you said you added headlift. are you refering to adding more pumps?

[edgy leaf]

yep. i got 370 meters of headlift by building up 80 foundations (320 meters) and placing a mk2 pump at the top (an additional 50m eters)

then i built the pipe all the way back down to the machines.

[fringe pawn]

The upside of the game's unrealistic fluids is that pumps are also infinitely powerful in terms of liquid volume, and you can get one pump to affect thousands of cubic meters per second.

[edgy leaf]

that resulted in 100% efficiency

[fringe seal]

without any more pumps inbetween?

[edgy leaf]

with pumps inbetween, obviously. otherwise i wouldnt have gotten 100% efficiency.

[fringe seal]

ah alright

[sturdy arrow]

Don’t need pumps on the way down of course

[edgy leaf]

adding a pump on the way down makes it stop working of course. because it resets the haedlift and u dont have 370 meters of it anymore.

[analog shadow]

I only pump down, then it come back around from the sky

[prisma kraken]

as the saying goes, s*** rolls downhill

[fringe seal]

it's only realistic when it wants to?

[edgy leaf]

heres my test setup

[edgy leaf]

the game is made with dark magic designed to tortue the people that play it

[analog shadow]

ahh organization....

[edgy leaf]

oh thats just a sloppily bashed together test setup.

[analog shadow]

lmao

looks 1000% better than what i try and accomplish

[fringe seal]

only the pipes probably

[edgy leaf]

my oil setup is /chefskiss/

[edgy leaf]

yea belts have been working perfectly for me. everything has been, but pipes.

[thorn bane]

what the fuck

[analog shadow]

this most recent iteration, i made a BUS based off a youtuber. It worked well but man......straight lines and I dont get along

[edgy leaf]

yep. im sure it could work with less than 370 meters of headlift, but 50 wasnt enough so i went to 370

[edgy leaf]

noooo not a bus setup.

[prisma kraken]

something i'll mention, no idea if it is a thing that you are running into, but pipe networks sometimes don't recompute their headlift when you are adding and removing pipes. to eliminate that, i'd recommend deleting and rebuilding all the pipes for each test configuration, including the extractors themselves

[thorn bane]

#TeamMainBus lets goooooooooooooo

[edgy leaf]

that possibility can be excluded due to the test results.

[thorn bane]

what did you think about it?

[prisma kraken]

i've seen pipes do some strange things with 'memory' of previous headlift. things i can't reproduce or even posit an explanation for

[analog shadow]

it was really surprising to realize just how little material actually gets used in the game

[thorn bane]

i know right?
i feel like so many people overbuild

[edgy leaf]

haha, i would never...

im definitely not going to consume all but 37.6 of the oil on the map

/USA theme song can be heard playing in the distance/ (yes im calling it a theme song)

[analog shadow]

granted, making 2500 Copper Ingots, 1200 Alluminum Ingots and 480 Time Crystals.......was rough

[edgy leaf]

im even transportnig 600 oil per minute in a single train car

[magic island]

this would support my theory that in addition to setting the vertical limit of fluid flow, headlift is also used to weight the priority of flow between upward/downward paths

so even if there's enough headlift to reach the destination, fluids will still prefer to go lower the less headlift they have, resulting in inefficient sloshing around instead of traveling upward to inputs

[thorn bane]

this is only if you feed from below though right?

[edgy leaf]

yep, i think so. at least i never had these issues when feeding from above or from the side. my hypothesis is that refilling a vertical pipes /eats/ headlift. if junctions ate a static amount of headlift than the ones further back wouldnt get any fluid, but they do, just not enough.

[analog shadow]

cant you just underclock everything to 1% so everything fills up completely then turn it back to 100% and not have an issue? No slosh?

[edgy leaf]

no that doesnt work. flooding the system is useless. the tests i did were WITH flooding, it was still 41% efficiency.

[magic island]

I think if you were to feed a single machine from below, it would be fine because that's the only path it can take

it's when you have manifolds with lots of junctions, creating lots of paths for the fluid to choose, and "gulps" of fluid being taken from various places along the pipe. that's when the the fluid will slosh back and forth as much as it can before it'll actually go up

[sturdy arrow]

Hmm. If that’s true then I take mine back

[thorn bane]

i should really start feeding my fuel gens from above and not straight...

[analog shadow]

or make 1 less fuel gen

[sturdy arrow]

Same

[edgy leaf]

feeding straight or from above doesnt make a difference in my experience

[edgy leaf]

nah, thats a waste.

u can make 600 work. just add pumps.

adding pumps between machines oslves basically all problems

[analog shadow]

lmao

[edgy leaf]

should it solve them? fuck no. does it? yes...

[analog shadow]

i mean if i need power, 250MW is not the dealbreaker compared to scratching my head over design issues

[thorn bane]

ye im just gonna keep using 550 max in mk2 pipes

[thorn bane]

just make 500 fuel instead?

or 700 and 2 pipes

[edgy leaf]

u can trade 8mw for 250 tho..

also its not even guaranteed that that would fix the flow issues

[thorn bane]

ye 580 is kinda close

[analog shadow]

Idk i always fill my 600, never had an issue

[edgy leaf]

no even with less ive seen issues. ive had issues pushing 400 through a mk2 pipe.

[analog shadow]

but then again im never doing pretty designs where the pipes go up slightly

my game is built different😂

[edgy leaf]

sidefeeding or topfeeding avoid most of the issues ive talked about

[analog shadow]

thats 600 nitrogen and im using all of it....

but to your point.....pumps....all the pumps

[unborn ermine]

Yeah two options, pumps or loops.
I remember another user a day or so ago fixing problems with rocket fuel using a looped pipe.

[thorn bane]

or dont do 600/min

[edgy leaf]

loops dont really help with bottomfeeding issues

[edgy leaf]

400 =/= 600

[thorn bane]

ye im talking about topfed setups

[analog shadow]

i used to try loops with alluminum and water but then i got tired and wanted to move on so i just made wet concrete and sunk it

[unborn ermine]

I did that with an oil node by accident and it hasnt ever stopped working

[edgy leaf]

what did u do by accident?

[analog shadow]

looping it around the junction?

[unborn ermine]

Fed a manifold and looped it above, but fed from the bottom pipe.
(I could also be misreading terms, im not in here too-too often)

[analog shadow]

yup

[unborn ermine]

I had meant to feed it on the upper pipe that was the loop

[edgy leaf]

if it worked then it probably wasnt bottomfeeding

[unborn ermine]

explain what bottom feeding is

I will look for the screenshot

[thorn bane]

if it splits into 5 machines or something then its really easy to get 600
its only an issue for large sets of machines

[analog shadow]

thats bottomfeeding

and that didnt work without that loop?

[thorn bane]

dont really need a loop if you connect it in the middle

[unborn ermine]

it did kinda, the loop made it stable and I kept it

[analog shadow]

i love that your sn is dont do 600

[sturdy arrow]

If the top pipe has water in it…

[edgy leaf]

nope thats not bottomfeeding.

[unborn ermine]

so glad you explained it

[edgy leaf]

the main pipe is at the same levell as the machines.

bottomfeeding is when a pipe goes up from the main line for each machine

this is bottomfeeding, the main line is below the machines and a pipe goes up to feed the machines

[sturdy arrow]

Bahroth, you could just have raised the pipe to the limit of your pump, then sent it back down to your loop

[unborn ermine]

Actually then I did this opposite by accident
That was what I was going to do but autopiloted, then added the loop.

[analog shadow]

yeah idk how you can do that without a loss

[thorn bane]

do yall not use blueprints?
i just have it elevated by default in my refinery blueprint

[edgy leaf]

i do use blueprints. i choose to have it below because its perttier. the thing in the pic is my blueprint.

[thorn bane]

[analog shadow]

oh you know you could build a water tower to create a higher head lift

[edgy leaf]

pumps. unnecessary pumps. that blueprint (but repeated 4 times) is what needed 370 meters of headlift to work

[edgy leaf]

if headlift gets eaten then id have to build a water tower for each row, which would be equivalent to just placing a few pumps between the machines but uglier

[plucky violet]

I stated making my factory 😄

[unborn ermine]

I like a mix of above and below myself (but I havent went ham with BP because PC is crap)

[plucky violet]

uh oh, i just got a 'cloud error'

[analog shadow]

are those coal generators?

can you send me that blueprint?

[wind scaffold]

Where is this from?

[edgy leaf]

refineries

[edgy leaf]

from the pipe manual, its in the pins and in #welcome (i htink its the pipe manual, it looks kinda unfamiliar)

[weary lotus]

if i have 8 belts with varying amounts (totalling 4320 items pm) how can i easily merge them into a bundle of mk 5 belts

[weary lotus]

specifically 3 400 belts, 4 600 belts and one 720 belt

[analog shadow]

Bus is always the answer

[edgy leaf]

wdym?

use a train as priority merger /foreheadtap.gif/

[analog shadow]

Either that or abuse the overflow function of smart splitters

[thorn bane]

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1_rXrJ8CWyjNExcayArby3HjRpDUXV5sd8QvFrdNZxBc/edit?pli=1&tab=t.0#heading=h.i4mh5jaa6ir1

[analog shadow]

But that would be a mess, but a fun mess

Heyyy

Yup that's what I was thinking and I didn't know it had a name

[edgy leaf]

currently making 4800 plastic and 600 rubber.

out of 1800 oil

[analog shadow]

So pretty

[sudden hornet]

Are SAM-based ore conversion recipes ever useful?

[analog shadow]

If you need bauxite or uranium

[thorn bane]

not really imo
sam is kinda scarce

[analog shadow]

But there's already so many resources on the map

[edgy leaf]

this thing is going to need about 2500 powershards

[analog shadow]

Don't forget to somersloop your powerslugs in a constructor

[sudden hornet]

If you run out of bauxite or uranium mines, you're doing something very extreme...

[analog shadow]

Oh wait nvm

[edgy leaf]

im automating them

[edgy leaf]

yes. i love extremism

[sudden hornet]

writing production planning checks your CPU can't cash (cache?), eh

[edgy leaf]

wdym?

ooohhh

yea i plan to buy a computer just to play satis better lol

[edgy leaf]

fuck yea got the third slice running, still 100%

15% of the games oil being flawlessly processed in one location

[prisma kraken]

oc supercomputer has become a lot more viable with the change to the cooling device recipe

[edgy leaf]

i plan to use the default recipe. not sure why i chose that, i think because it uses more oil

[prisma kraken]

past game versions, superstate was the only way to really fit lots of turbomotors & supercomps into a world, things there have changed a bit

the cooling system alt recipe (device) actually became good

[edgy leaf]

this is oc

and this is normal

[prisma kraken]

i think OC still uses too much aluminum & HSC's aren't cheap either, but it isn't horrible and the sloop factor changes that a bunch too

[edgy leaf]

it trades quartz and bauxite for a bit of caterium and lots of oil

and i want to use as much oil as possible

here are the other alts it uses. all chosen to max out oiil

[past temple]

how do i turn multiple fluctuating belts into full ones/an overflow one? I cant use compressors, due to the fluctuating output and balancers have slight gaps if you try to fully fill them if i understand right

[prisma kraken]

what i'm wary of with the default isn't so much oil, but copper

[edgy leaf]

eh, my everything facotry barely uses any copper

not even 10k

[prisma kraken]

i'm not using tons yet, but i will be

[edgy leaf]

whatre u going to use it for?

[thorn bane]

you need a bigger buffer on the any line, so either make the belts longer or add a container

but this isnt really an issue 99% of the times

[past temple]

i need almost exactly 2 full belts for something, where does the buffer go? its kinda unclear

oh wait nvm

and thanks

[vocal lagoon]

what is the formula/maths to calculate uranium waste from reactors?

[vocal lagoon]

so what would the number be if i am making 24 uranium rods per minute?

[amber jacinth]

24 * 50 = 1200

Or more specifically,
24 / 0.2 = 120 reactors
120 * 10 = 1200 waste / min

[vocal lagoon]

ok thanks

[hexed crown]

Quick question about sinking and tickets. Is it more worthwhile to sink more advanced products than basic ones? I.e. if I had say leftover iron ore would I get more tickets per ore making it into iron plates and more again for reinforced iron plates or would it work out the same? To be really pedantic if its better, is it still better when including the power cost I.e. the sink value of whatever fuel is being used to generate the power?

[river night]

yes, you gain more points from processed products

[hexed crown]

Thanks

[prisma kraken]

in general higher tier items multiply the point values but there's exceptions

because i just recently did the math on one such instance, rubber concrete is worth less than the points for the rubber you use

[thorn bane]

for default recipes the value doubles
as in 30 points of ore turns into 60 points of ingots turn into 120 points of plates

[vast jungle]

just split all fluctiating belts with a smart splitter into normal/overflow, then merge all normal and all overflow ones?

[thorn bane]

from the wiki "Eight alternate recipes actually provide less points than all of their ingredients combined: Compacted Steel Ingot, Coke Steel Ingot, Rubber Concrete, Steel Coated Plate, Coated Iron Plate, Caterium Wire, Plutonium Fuel Unit and Automated Miner. "

[prisma kraken]

I'm thinking that statement hasn't been updated since 1.0's release

yeah 'steel coated plate' doesn't exist anymore

[thorn bane]

that doesnt work if a recipe outputs multiple items at once like pure iron outputting 13 ingots
if you have 2 lines outputting 13 ingots at the same time then it will overflow some of those, even if the belt is otherwise empty, resulting in too few items on the "any" line

[vast jungle]

you could add a buffer between the splitters and the "normal" mergers if you worry about this a lot

[prisma kraken]

automated miner is still a pessimization on points, but not nearly as bad as it was

[thorn bane]

yes thats what i suggested

[vast jungle]

still, that many buffers might be a bit much... you could also input limit each belt so the combined output belts are just fast enough to handle it

[azure blaze]

does this mean i get 5 plates per minute or 15?

[vast jungle]

you get 5.625 per minute

in batches of 3 (roughly every 1.8 minutes)

[wind scaffold]

Sounds about right

[velvet mauve]

Someone help me design a factory for this

I cant, I suck at this game 😭

[slate wraith]

Well. Now my pipes act up. Fuel itself is being slower on arrival to the fuel which means, gens run out of fuel.

About to just cut down refineries and just overclock a few lol.

[vast jungle]

maybe start with describing your problem when you started doing this diagramm from one side (most likely input) to the other one (output)...

[velvet mauve]

Problem: Splitting up 67.5 ingots and 52.5 ingots respectively

and thatrs it

[vast jungle]

just don't... use a single splitter... after a while the 52.5/min will be full and the splitter will redirect more to the other one

splitters in SF are not just 1:1 splitters... they do, but when one side takes less and backs up, they redistribute the remaining stuff to the other outputs

thats the whole reason why Manifolds work...

[velvet mauve]

I know what a manifold is

I just dont want to use one 😭

Cause I always use them when I feel stupid and I want to learn to distribute the resources

[vast jungle]

(mostly) everyone uses them...

[velvet mauve]

I understand that

but If I could do the math

and cut it into thirds and such

[vast jungle]

but to get a hang on the numbers (52.5 and 67.5 in your case)... look for a small number to get a clean fraction... multiply and divide both to see whats going on

[velvet mauve]

it would be nice for me at least

I know Im being stubborn but like

[vast jungle]

e.g. take 52.5/67.5 and multiply it with something that gives you a whole number

[velvet mauve]

Im in calculus and ts hard 😭

[vast jungle]

forget calculus, its basic multiplication...

[velvet mauve]

ik

[vast jungle]

52.5/67.5 * 2 = 1.55 no
52.5/67.5 * 3 = 2.33 no
52.5/67.5 * 4 = ...

you will get to a clean number quickly

[velvet mauve]

ok

thx Ill try that and come back to lyk

OKOK I FOUND ONE NOW WHAT

[velvet mauve]

I got a clean #

[thorn bane]

67 not 57

[velvet mauve]

Crap

There

Now what?

Guh I hate math

[hazy dagger]

you dont need to split them up perfectly if you produce enough and all the ingots come from the same source it'll balance out by itself with time as long as you produce enough ingots and as long as your belt has the carying capacity to follow it

[cedar ivy]

we covered this and he's being stubborn

[hazy dagger]

oh ok

[cedar ivy]

this means 52.5/67.5 =7/9 ratio. so if you split the one belt into 7+9 (16) parts, then you can combine 7 of the 16ths into one, and 9 of the 16ths into the other

possibly with some fractional simplification so you dont need literally 16 belts.

so like, 1/4+1/8+1/16, then 1/2+1/16

draw out splitters to make belts with those fractions, merge them into your output fractions, and there's your balancer

[velvet mauve]

OMG TYSM

I GOT IT

[tender knoll]

hey, if I'm designing a factory with a few of these machines, and overclock the stitched iron plates just a bit to 6/min rates because I like round numbers instead of getting one more and downclocking that, is that stupid

[prisma kraken]

not at all, powershards are cheap

[vast jungle]

ahh wait... it should be 52.5 / (52.5 + 67.5)... because you want the total at the bottom ^^

[tender knoll]

common factor of 52.5 and 67.5 are 7.5

52.5/7.5 = 7
67.5/7.5 = 9

it's just a 60-60 split but with 7.5 moved from one to the other

just use a manifold, if you want to load balance you should do it with things that need it

also, fused quartz crystals, why does that recipe exist

[prisma kraken]

also for pink diamond

[tender knoll]

that's conversion, not the 12 coal to 3 quartz crystals alt

[thorn bane]

ye its pretty bad

[prisma kraken]

it isn't that bad, slightly worse yield than pure quartz and the numbers work very well for default oscillator

[tender knoll]

like, if I mathed correctly:
regular quartz is 0,6 crystal per raw
fused is 0,72 per raw, 0,12 extra crystal per ore for the cost of 0,48 coal (4 coal : 1 crystal)
1 coal when converted is 0,5 raw quartz
0,5 raw quartz * 0,6 = 0,3 quartz crystal per coal when converted
0,12/0,48 = 0,25 quartz crystal per coal when fused

??????

even freaking conversion is more efficient

[thorn bane]

ye idk coal is too valuable to convert to 0.25 quartz imo

[prisma kraken]

some recipes exist for a world where you don't have every alt unlocked

[tender knoll]

on one hand yes, on the other just get more hard drives, the parachute is literally a shitty jetpack because you can wallclimb with it

and I say this having gotten the diluted fuel recipe towards the end of phase 3

I've ran on 2400 MW of coal power until then, which I could literally quadruple that with the nodes I have, in seconds too because haha blueprints

[prisma kraken]

speedrunning this game is a thing

[tender knoll]

too niche to be an example imo

[prisma kraken]

my first playthrough, i didn't have much idea about the alts

[tender knoll]

the goddamn 27 ref residue to diluted setup I made took forever, then I made blueprints for the turbofuel and I slapped that setup together in no time compared to that

[prisma kraken]

nor about exploring very well either

[tender knoll]

same, but a few alts, even in early access have made my brain's gears turn. Sure, making stators with quickwire instead of regular wires is more expensive, but I get twice the amount of stators for overall less steel... And then I noticed that steel rotor is a thing, same ingredients as a regular stator. I could make a simple stator setup to make both recipes

[prisma kraken]

yeah, but if you're making motors, honestly copper rotor+default stator is kind of the way to go

[tender knoll]

there's also reinforced iron plates, stitched iron plates seemed so bad until I noticed that it outputs 3 plates per operation, very cheap on the iron, and that's without the iron wire alt but I wasn't using the copper for other stuff

[prisma kraken]

stators suck no matter what you do though

[tender knoll]

preach. I personally prefer quickwire because double output before I get into the weeds with circuits and computers

[prisma kraken]

yeah, stitched plate is very good early in the game

the quickwire alt is more for making ECR's for me

it isn't very good as a thing by itself

but when you look at the cost of them with fused wire and quickwire in the mix, default stator becomes a lot more compelling

[tender knoll]

mhm

[tender knoll]

what is ECR

[prisma kraken]

electromagnetc control rod

i really dislike making them: a part with very few uses that you need an annoyingly large amount of made from parts with very few uses that now are needed in annoyingly large amounts 😛

[tender knoll]

yeahh

[thorn bane]

wait ECRs are great
they make super state computers
nuclear power
motors

[tender knoll]

I feel similarly about AI limiters

[prisma kraken]

that's one of ecr's ingredients 😛

[tender knoll]

wack recipe and alt, quickwire hog, overall limited uses

[prisma kraken]

or the alternate that replaces ai limiters for hsc's

which just suck to make

[tender knoll]

yeah

circuit boards are already annoying

mostly the ratios but also beause needs oil products

[vast jungle]

I am so happy I just "finished" my electronics factory... so I already have AI-Limiters and HSCs 😉

[prisma kraken]

silicon cb

i'm still making cb's out of coke & rubber though, lol

[thorn bane]

ye electrode isnt so bad anymore

[tender knoll]

compelling but I'd rather save my copper and go for caterium boards, it's actually cheap on the plastic

[tender knoll]

I noticed that coke is part of multiple recipes and that it's quite cheap

[vast jungle]

plastic/rubber is quite easy to scale up

[thorn bane]

with quart purification, silicon circuit board is just the best

[tender knoll]

cheap silica my beloved

[prisma kraken]

electro cb still sucks for making volume, but if you grab the recipe when you're first building oil, it saves you some headaches

[tender knoll]

also, I keep running into the issue that I need a ton of concrete in the midgame, which recipe is best for that? I'm partial to rubber concrete because it gives such a good conversion rate, but limestone is often plentiful so I can just go for the water route

[prisma kraken]

ofc, the fact that you don't need cb's anymore for building makes that kind of moot

[past reef]

Is there a 2100 nitrogen pm well on the map I only found a 1800 and 1950 on the north side of map

[prisma kraken]

above blue crater is 3000/min

(like center of map)

[past reef]

Wet concrete I'd say, you want the big per machine from that recipe, 240 pm into depot is good enough

[thorn bane]

wet concrete is nice
even though it slurps water like a mf

[prisma kraken]

if you have access to tons of limestone nodes, default is pretty simple to build & you can just run a truck around to grab it from constructors sitting next to the miners

[past reef]

Oh cool thanks, hard to check on scim cause separate nodes

[tender knoll]

it's great for late game when you want to get rid of water

[tender knoll]

I am afraid of using trucks and tractors for some reason

[thorn bane]

idk you get 2x as much concrete from wet

[tender knoll]

dunno really why, like please tell me they work properly

[prisma kraken]

yeah, its just you need to build wet near a water source

[tender knoll]

simplicity often beats efficiency, you usually have nodes aplenty

[past reef]

I dont particularly like rubber concrete because drone export for rubber want around 300 pm, and rubber use too little to break a production line

[prisma kraken]

rubber concrete is great when you're making tons of hmf's

that added yield is really helpful

[thorn bane]

wait did they buff rubber concrete in 1.0?

[past reef]

I keep the rubber for heavy flexible frame, that 300pm rubber makes 15 hmf at the end, but anyways

[prisma kraken]

nah, still the same

wet concrete has always been 2/3rds and rubber has always been 9/10ths

[past reef]

Rubber always more yield compared to wet iirc

[tender knoll]

what are opinion on heavy encased frames, 8 modulars to 3 heavies and replacing screws with yet more concrete

[past reef]

But you barely want 200pm concrete into ISC depot, so rubber usage is super low I only use it for manual

[thorn bane]

Patch 1.0:

Fine Concrete
    Changed recipe craft time from 24 to 12 seconds
Rubber Concrete
    Changed recipe craft time from 12 to 6 seconds

does that mean its 2x the output?

[tender knoll]

2x the speed

[prisma kraken]

no, just that it needs less machines

[past reef]

Better in resource conpared to normal, bad number, its a good call for 1st HMF

[hazy dagger]

yield is same but output per machine is doubled

[tender knoll]

tbh ore washing could get the same treatment, it is god awfully slow and refineries are fat and power hungry

[prisma kraken]

fine concrete still makes no sense to ever use, lol

[hazy dagger]

yeah silica is so usefull for circuit boards dont waste it on concrete

[thorn bane]

oh ye it was 45/min before now its 90/min dayum

[tender knoll]

if you find quartz early and get the alt it is worthwhile for the steel-laden midgame

granted it's only good for a short while before the computahs come in

[prisma kraken]

i'd rather make oscillators from the quartz to make more motors

[past reef]

I want a 3rd crystal oscillator alt

[tender knoll]

or you start in the rocky desert and get 2 pure nodes from the cave which is more than what you can realistically use lmfao

[past reef]

Its so space demanding

[tender knoll]

preach

also opinions on the crystal computer alt?

[prisma kraken]

in any event, i'm actually surprised they didn't buff fine concrete to have a use where it and cheap silica had some sort of synergy

[hazy dagger]

i love it

allows to use assemblers for computer instead of manufacturer

[past reef]

Good space but crystal oscillators are big so its okay

Quartz line something is still good though

[prisma kraken]

oscillators are a chonky build, but so are the other 2 computer recipes

[past reef]

It doesnt save as much as I wanted, but it does save space most I think

[prisma kraken]

you end up using less cb's with crystal computer and can actually make oscilators from just iron and quartz

[past reef]

I did a 5.25 supercomputer line from quartz, its alright actually

The CO takes as much space as computer + supercomputer lol

[hazy dagger]

i use radio control+ cooling system for super computer love this alt recipe

[prisma kraken]

yeah, it is a chonky build, for sure

[hazy dagger]

only 2 somersloops to boost the outputs

[past reef]

Radio control needs CO so w/e

[vast jungle]

I am thinking about using the standard recipe because I already have everything it needs in the factory... is it that bad?

[tender knoll]

caterium circuit board and plastic AI limiters share ingredients... with crystal computer I can make computers out of quickwire, plastic, quartz crystals and rubber

[past reef]

That alt is good for sure, I need to get over the dread of CO manufacturers tho

[vast jungle]

CO manufacturing needs a lot of space, but its not that bad...

[hazy dagger]

if you have everything ready then go for it alt recipe offer more flexibility

[prisma kraken]

the OC supercomputer recipe isn't what you want if you are building big - it sucks up a lot of aluminum and nitrogen, but if you factor in sloops, it isn't bad and is somewhat compelling

[hazy dagger]

when you dont have some components

but since you'll need radio control + cooling system at some points i like this alt recipe

[past reef]

Yeah I know, even HMF doesnt force space like that so I'm a little sad abt crystal oscillator

[tender knoll]

COs are more annoying than anything

computers are simply expensive but not very complicated

HMFs are pain but that's expected

[past reef]

They opened up northwest this patch tho, maybe I can just put a 80 CO factory over there and forget about space

[tender knoll]

the alt recipes really give this game a lot of charm because I can think endlessly about them lol

idk if this is the correct place to ask, but do mk2 pipes work properly now?

[slate wraith]

There is...A question to be had here.

[past reef]

I tested a super simple 600 setup it works, never tried longer than 3 junctions

2 250% water into 3 200% wet concrete can hold 600

[tender knoll]

what if I have like 10 junctions, how do I deal with sloshing?

[slate wraith]

So my fuel storage between gens is more then stocked beyond reason. For both lanes of 6. Does this translate to I can make more gens?

[thorn bane]

nope

[hazy dagger]

what if i have like 50 junctions with my rocket fuel 😅

[thorn bane]

only happens in longer manifolds

[slate wraith]

Better question. What happens once these industrialized liquid storages get full?

[past reef]

I have a 200m long 600pm oil split into 2 it was okay so I guess its exclusively long manifold issue

[vast jungle]

I already built Circuit Boards, Crystal-Oscillators, AI-Limiters, Highspeed Connectors and Computers (in stackable BPs)... okay, good to know I can just BP a few Manufacturers when I get to Supercomputers 😄

[past reef]

Just gonna back up producing machine

[slate wraith]

Is this the answer to the storage question or?

...So nothing happens if the liquid storage gets full?

Well so far my issue has been solved so I'm saving my game here.

[past reef]

How much diamonds do I need near the end? I just unlocked turbo/pink/oil diamonds, thinking of a place that expands eventually to 360pm maximum which grabs turbofuel from a pure oil node, limit because 600 oil makes like 240 empty canisters

[fringe seal]

Fuel -> Turbo Blend Fuel -> Rocket Fuel
4x19 Fuel
3x19 Coke = 2x19 Fuel
3x19 Sulfur -> 6x19 Turbofuel

6x19 Turbofuel
1x19 Nitric Acid -> 190 Rocket Fuel + 19 Compacted Coal


Feeding the compacted coal to standard recipe line
36     Fuel
19 + 5 Compacted Coal -> 30 Turbofuel

30 Turbofuel 
5 Nitric Acid -> 50 Rocket Fuel + 5 Compacted Coal

Total: 
150 Fuel
57  Sulfur
96 Nitrogen -> 240 Rocket Fuel

Nitro Rocket Fuel
4x19 Fuel
3x19 Nitrogen
4x19 Sulfur
2x19 Coal -> 6x19 Rocket Fuel + 1x19 Compacted Coal

Feeding the compacted coal to standard recipe line: Same as above

Total: 
112 Fuel
38 Coal
76 Sulfur
57 Nitrogen -> 164 Rocket Fuel

[past reef]

standard line takes quite a bit of space but makes so much more

[fringe seal]

seems like it

[livid valve]

Quick question, are mk 2 pipes fixed throughput-wise?

[thorn bane]

nope

[livid valve]

copy ty

[wind spade]

they don't have any bug to be fixed in the first place

and 600/min is very much possible

[fringe seal]

Making 1000 Rocket Fuel: 
TBF + Standard: 
625    Fuel
237.5  Sulfur
400    Nitrogen

NRF + Standard: 
682.92 Fuel
231.71 Coal
463.41 Sulfur
347.56 Nitrogen

[fringe seal]

but requires you to read a fanmade pipe manual, no biggie

[livid valve]

I understand that mk2 pipes were widely known to not quite throughput 600 per minute. Is everyone I've ever spoken to wrong by some misunderstanding? they say they can do 600 but it has been often reported they do not. Almost 600? Yes. Actually 600? Apparently no.

[wind spade]

no, just think about how pipes work 🙂

[wind spade]

most of those are user errors

[fringe seal]

it's a game

[wind spade]

and the physics are similar to IRL

[analog meteor]

i read it when i was waiting for a patch to download and it took like 3 hours to download.

[fringe seal]

how am I supposed to know they have actually implemented hydraulic shock

[past reef]

I tested a small wet concrete module yesterday it can keep 600 water fine

[livid valve]

What exatcly is such a common user error that major content creators have reported on the issue for years then? What to do different

[fringe seal]

and if you ask community all you get is self-congratulating "lol you can totally do it bro, you are just doing it wrong"

[past reef]

but then all my 590/600 line never had to take more than 8 junctions I never even looped the manifold

[analog meteor]

im glad pipes dont care about airlocks and air being needed to be cleared in pipes and stuff (not sure if im using the correct terms)

[fringe seal]

said famnade manual, in the first few pages it explicitly says to not apply real life fluid dymanics

[analog meteor]

no,physics dont take every little thing about fluids. just use what you know about fluids and how you expect them to behave irl.

[wind spade]

major content creators rarely know the game they play to such a depth to be able to confidently say that it's a bug

the problem is that when fluid reaches a dead end (e.g. end of pipe manifold, or a full machine, or a full pipe), it bounces back (similar to IRL, e.g. if you make a wave in a bathtub, it bounces back at the end). This "backflow" means that the flow in desired direction is reduced, and since this can happen on first machine of a manifold (once it fills), part of the backflow can go back to main pipe, reducing flow from 600 to less

simple "workaround" would be to loop the pipe manifold, and feed it from above, so that bottom parts fill first. Like the image below

[fringe seal]

the line between bug and unintended behavior is extremely thin
so thin that it might not be there

[wind spade]

well, devs said the pipes behave as intended

[thorn bane]

just realized the image doesnt feed from above

[fringe seal]

if you have religiously following the dev stream maybe

[wind spade]

it does, the main pipe is above the pipe manifold

[thorn bane]

but you want each input to be above

[analog meteor]

didnt they say smth about the calculation of very precise deciaml points being part of the issue? idk how that factors in to this

[wind spade]

not 100% required afaik

[wind spade]

that was a short-lived bug introduced and fixed in 1.0

[analog meteor]

oh ok

[wind spade]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASfKo0dKBbU

[livid valve]

I'll give it a shot! I know the fluid dynamics in this game are somewhat realistic and realistic fluid dynamics are quite complicated. I also understand that content creators are rarely the wisest of individuals but usually when called out on their bullshit they usually make more content correcting it with the community feedback, hence the reference.

Thanks for the replies, I'll see if I can make it work!

[thorn bane]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=COJV4Ubn1Ac

[fringe seal]

if they will keep the realistic-when-it-wants-to physics, then they need to implement some sort of ingame manual for user-friendlyness imo

[wind spade]

usually when called out on their bullshit they usually make more content correcting it with the community feedback, hence the reference.
I've tried a few times to correct them, either in their discord or under a video.

Got blasted by 100s of dedicated fans with "how can they be wrong / how can you be right / you don't understand what you're talking about / etc."

gave up after a few tries