math-and-meta

[ornate echo]

i need 20 concrete beams a minute, the math is easy but is there an higher amount wich would be simpler without underclocking or weird amounts?

[vapid gorge]

you'll have to describe more what you're trying to do - are you trying to cram waste water back into fresh? an actual over head image will be needed

[wheat tundra]

So, I get that valves store a value in a byte. But why then, divide by 254, to compute actual rate ( more math than that, but that's the general idea.)

I did note that 254 seems to match my rates very well

[vapid gorge]

no idea. in general they serve no function so just avoid them

[still cloak]

Is there a guide or something to show the most efficient way of getting turbofuel for power?

[vapid gorge]

you can look at the recipes on the wiki and decide what you mean by 'efficient', some recipes use less oil but more coal/sulfur , another recipe will use more oil and sulfur but no coal

there's also recipes that change the first steps

[vapid gorge]

you can play with this tool and turn on alt recipes to see wht you come up with https://www.satisfactorytools.com/production

[still cloak]

I think the issue im having is that I have all the alt recipes before tier 8. I'm hit with blender w/ diluted fuel and turbo fuel, but also have alt turbo fuel recipe in foundry. Having issues mathing which gives most MW per oil

Ok, I'll check that out tomorrow when I wake up. Might help what I'm looking for

[vapid gorge]

per oil you want heavy oil residue, diluted fuel, base TF

but you'll have to import coal cause no spot has all three. I like the blender recipes in the centre of map. sulfur and oil next to each other

[still cloak]

Ok, that sounds cool. I'll look into it, thank you

[prisma kraken]

TF doesn't use foundries at all, are you thinking compacted steel?

[still cloak]

Typed foundry, meant refinery

[prisma kraken]

also, oil power at a glance:

[still cloak]

Oh that's cool

[prisma kraken]

pretty much what you were looking for?

[still cloak]

Yah, and the path to get to that, diluted fuel pretty much sums it up

Because blender

Er I'm tired

[prisma kraken]

DPF is alsy in there at the bottom, you can see there isn't much difference in the power usage

same yield, just a couple 100 mw difference btw the blenders and a packaging loop

i feel a lot of that is statistical noise that varies based on water extractor clocking

[still cloak]

Yah, looks like straight blended turbo fuel has the least mw usage and most out put

[prisma kraken]

for simplicity, all numbers just treat water extractors as being clocked at 100% and do not count the cost of the oil extractors

[still cloak]

And it's the easiest lol

[prisma kraken]

i'm a fan of blended tf for its simplicity and increase yield

[still cloak]

So it's got 40k mw, are they just overclocking all the gens?

[prisma kraken]

but my thinking is that if i'm making a fuel plant and have unused sulfur, i might as well get 10gw more out of it

[still cloak]

What other use is sulfur for?

[prisma kraken]

for blended tf, it really wants to be sized as 900 oil+600 sulfur, and that results in 3 fuel making modules doing 300 oil+200 sulfur; each module supplist 40 gens at 213.33333% iirc

whatever the clock rate that gets their consumption to 10/min, i think its 213.333

compacted steel, gun powder, nuclear, and instant alum scrap

[still cloak]

Oh sulfur is for batteries /uranium stuff

[prisma kraken]

oh, batteries too

max nuclear takes ~2800 sulfur/min

6800 on the map

so there's quite a bit of it for other purposes

[still cloak]

Ooh ok.

[prisma kraken]

600 sulfur makes 400 classic batteries, so you're going to want 1-2 normal nodes for that

the rest of it is really free for whatever you want

[still cloak]

Interesting

[prisma kraken]

i'm also a fan of using a node of it for compacted steel

600 compacted coal = 2000 steel ingots

its a great way to get more steel out of the coal available in either north forest or grass fields

[still cloak]

Hmm.

This one?

[prisma kraken]

instant scrap, while it simplifies the alum production chain and is one path to getting the best yield out of bauxite, is not something i like using because there is another path to maximizing bauxite that doesn't require coal or sulfur

yeah, that recipe, its pretty good in a couple of niche cases

like if you're starting in grass fields, you have the 2 pure coal nodes there that are intended to be used for steel making, you can make a lot more steel with them and the available iron by turning 600 of the coal into compacted coal than otherwise

i.e. you can make ~3000 ingots from that coal instead of ~2200

[still cloak]

Currently working on getting my infrastructure in new base to start on tier 8 final thing. I got like 720 steel from coke steel ingot and I think 600 from the one where you need iron ingots + coal

[prisma kraken]

solid steel

[still cloak]

Yah

[prisma kraken]

most steel in my world always ends up being solid steel, but i don't mind using compacted steel in some places and coke steel in others

[still cloak]

I'm basically just bussing in ingots from wherever.

[prisma kraken]

like making steel in the swamp, you kind of need to use coke steel for that unless you want to run a train in for coal

there's like just enough oil in the swamp to support making all the coke you'd ever need for the nuclear production chains

[still cloak]

Yah, i kinda bussed coal and sulfur to do a combo of steel coke and turbo fuel plant using 2 impure coal nodes

And like 450 coal/sulfur

[prisma kraken]

something else never mentioned much... coke transports via truck/drone/train much better than coal b/c it stacks to 200

[still cloak]

Having major power issues, but i think after adding like 50 fuel gens, I think we got it under control for a bit

Hmm that's a thing

Never used transports

[prisma kraken]

if you're having power issues stop building factories and just focus on building power to whack your generation cap up a quantum level, you have much more fun in the game if you're always sitting well below your power capacity

[still cloak]

Prly should look into it

Yah, I'm gonna hit that power problem this weekend

[prisma kraken]

it took me a few playthroughs to get into really using vehicle transport b/c of its complexity & learning curve

and it is time consuming to use them

but the choos are cool

[still cloak]

Lol

So how do drones work?

[prisma kraken]

also past a certain scale, i think you don't really have an option

each drone has a home port and belongs to that port, it can have a single remote destination port

remote ports can either have a drone or be drone-less

so you can have multiple drones all pointing at the same remote destination

i distribute batteries across my world by doing exactly that

but besides that, drones can take 9 stacks of items between the ports and carry a load in both directions

[still cloak]

So the ports are just like a container and use smart splitters to distribute where you need?

[prisma kraken]

they are exceptionally well suited to fetching compressed nitrogen and returning empty cannisters to the nitro well

or to take hmf's to make fmf's and return the fmf's

[still cloak]

That's cool

I'll look into that for sure

Def beats conveyor

[prisma kraken]

they absolutely suck at transporting ores & ingots

[still cloak]

Oh yeah. I figured

[prisma kraken]

you're lucky to get 200/min from a 100-stack item with a drone

[still cloak]

I assume most transport bad at that

[prisma kraken]

50 & 100 stack items generally just suck to transport, lol

trains and trucks are the way to go for moving raw materials from mk3 miners

[still cloak]

But you gotta drive the truck one time to make it work?

Or build a path?

[prisma kraken]

yeah, well driving trucks sucks, i won't lie and yep, some cussing & fussing getting the paths recorded 😛

[still cloak]

I pass lol

[prisma kraken]

they work for simple things

if you don't try to push vehicles past what they're good for, they'll do an adequate job

[still cloak]

Train just feels daunting

[prisma kraken]

but i wouldn't try to create a big centralized shipping center with a lot of truck routes

they are at first... i feel an area of improvement for the game would be to make the initial layout of your first train loop a little easier to do

[still cloak]

I appreciate the talk, but i gotta sleep. Need to be up in 5 hours

[prisma kraken]

at this point, with experience, i use trains everywhere

k, np, tc

[still cloak]

I def got a ton of questions

[prisma kraken]

happy to answer after the sun chars the other side of the world and comes back to us 🙂

[dense oriole]

Heyo, is there a tier list for all alternate recipes? So I know which one to prioritise?
Cheers 😊

[quaint ridge]

https://satisfactory.wiki.gg/wiki/Hard_Drive#Alternate_recipe_analysis

not exactly a tier list

[vapid gorge]

There’s a few recipes that I would argue have more common use cases - but they all have pros and cons depending on your situation and needs

[deft lichen]

all of the lists are just some guy's opinion, they don't represent if a given recipe is good or bad

[quaint ridge]

then there is compacted coal for turbofuel

[deft lichen]

turbo blend fuel on top

[dense oriole]

Okay 😅 Thanks guys

[prisma kraken]

what you really want is the table here https://satisfactory.wiki.gg/wiki/Hard_Drive#Alternate_recipes which has a list of what's unlocked by what

i find that useful to sort on the 'unlocked by' column

if you have any questions about gaming the RNG for alts, i'm pretty knowledgeable on it, and can tell you the order you should research things when to get a specific recipe

[fathom sleet]

With todays updates, what's the most turbofuel you can get out of a 600m³ pipe? and what's the chain?

[thorn bane]

diluted fuel -> default turbofuel but it uses a shitton of sulfur

[fathom sleet]

And power and space lol, that's 71.1 refineries to handle that 1600 fuel/min

[deft lichen]

use SFTools

[primal flicker]

Default turbo gives about 122% more power than diluted fuel, but turbo blend is easier to build, costs fewer resources per GW, and gives something like +33%.
Either way, it's "cheaper" (by resource WP) to just turn more oil into normal fuel to get to the same power output.

https://satisfactory.wiki.gg/wiki/Turbofuel#Fuel_vs_Turbofuel_Efficiency

[vapid mesa]

I usually refer to satisfactory-ranker . Com

Can't post the link, but I can DM if you can't find it

[deft lichen]

https://satisfactory-ranker.kpwn243.com/

I heard the idea years ago, it's nice it actually exists

[vapid mesa]

That's the one, thanks mate!

[deft lichen]

the problem is that it's kinda a popularity vote

[wind spade]

yeah, popularity has nothing to do with "goodness" of a recipe

f.e. cast screws are actually good only for a few hours and then outranked by every other screw recipe

let's write a bot to make cast screws go down

sad autominer noises tho

[deft lichen]

adhered plate is 64th, steel coated plate is 67th, insulated cable is 72nd, coated cable is 75th
all of these are excellent recipes, but they use oil lol

[wind spade]

yeah, in most cases people don't research recipes enough

[vapid mesa]

It's not perfect, not a proper tier list; but I find myself agreeing with the ranking more often than disagreeing. I thought it would be worth linking as it's helped me a lot when I'm uncertain

[deft lichen]

adhered plates are the only way to mass produce RIPs without going insane, for example

it appears the popular recipes are the simpler recipes

or, at least perceivably simpler

I also believe there will be a bias to pick an alt for a simpler part over a more complex part, because it shuffles all choices

[dense oriole]

I'll give it a try, thank you 😊

[deft lichen]

now, lemme do some voting

[vapid mesa]

What's the advantage of adhered iron plates over stitched with iron wire? Is it really worth introducing oil products into the system?

[wind spade]

oil products are insanely cheap with proper alts

[deft lichen]

113 buildings, 1044.44 iron

[deft lichen]

78 buildings, 40 oil, 540 iron

it looks super unintuitive, right? 😄

• you will most likely be producing oil already, so you incorporate that in your plan, without needing extra logistics

[wind spade]

there's no "perfect" tier list (and tier lists are by definitions "I like/use X over Y", not "X is better than Y")

How do you even compare two completely different recipes? "Is Diluted Fuel better than Wet Concrete" is a weird question, since each recipe does something else

and that's the main point of alt recipes - they each do something and whether or not you like that something is up to you. There's no objective way to compare two completely different alts and very few objective ways to compare almost equal alts (e.g. bolted iron plates vs RIPs - same resources, same building, just different amounts).

And finally - most of what is "good" about a recipe comes from combinations of recipes, so what you should be asking is "what's a good production line to make X" over "which recipe is best for X".

[vapid mesa]

But you'll also have to get HOR alternate, Diluted Fuel, blender, recycled plastic & recycled rubber recipes

[deft lichen]

yeah, but you'll want them for everything else that uses oil products

they're not specifically good for adhered plates, but for anything that uses oil

[wind spade]

(and if blender is an issue, it can be replaced with diluted packaged fuel for same/similar result)

[deft lichen]

the key point is the scale

it would be nonsense to make like 10 adhered plates/min unless you're already importing rubber in a larger scale for something else

[frigid sandal]

whats the ratio of alum casing to alum sheets? I should be producing

[wind spade]

as much as you need

there's no generic ratio, just build what you need now

[median heath]

☝️

[frigid sandal]

well i have 2000 alum ingots and i want divide them but idk is 50 /50 too much?

[median heath]

Why did you make 2k ingots without knowing what you were going to do with them?

[frigid sandal]

Idk I wanted sheets for conveyors

[wind spade]

make those then 🤷‍♂️

[frigid sandal]

yeah but i can spare some for alum cases

[wind spade]

sure

[frigid sandal]

are sheets or cases used more

[wind spade]

depends on recipes you use and things you make

[deft lichen]

don't make either until you have a use

just leave the ingots

[wind spade]

(and next time don't make even the ingots until you know how much you need and for what 😛 )

[deft lichen]

you can make 1 machine of sheets and casings for storage/building

[frigid sandal]

hmm good idea ill take half for sheets then ill keep the other half

[deft lichen]

eh, I disagree, decentralizing aluminum is ass

[wind spade]

I didn't say decentralise aluminum tho 🤔

[median heath]

!wikisearch Ass

[brisk shore]

https://satisfactory.wiki.gg/index.php?search=Ass

[frigid sandal]

i didnt want to redo the math all the time

[median heath]

[wind spade]

redo what?
just build new 😛

[frigid sandal]

i just wanted enough ingots to last a long while

[deft lichen]

making ingots and waiting until sheets or casings are needed is the most optimal way to handle aluminum I'd say

[median heath]

Not wanting to do math in a math game? 👀

[frigid sandal]

its fun but not the same problem for month

[wind spade]

there's also production planners

[frigid sandal]

yeah ive been using it

its been a lifesaver

anyways thanks for the help

[lament jolt]

Does anyone want to give feedback on an idea of mine? I have envisioned a mega factory designed to go through all the Space Elevator parts for employee of the planet with a single train bringing in every resource from scratch. (Not automated , just a single dropoff) For extra clarification, storage buffers would be used, and all machines would be overclocked to max belt/pipe output per line. I'd build the factory and train in creative mode. Would this be possible? I know map limits are often used in some players factories, but I'm not talking about mining every node. Just one train, probably very long, with all raw resources spawned in.

[primal flicker]

You're going to tank your FPS unless running top tier hardware.
Trains with lots of cars have poor acceleration and can't go uphill easily. Or at all, with too many cars.
No one actually reaches map limits of resources. Their CPU and GPU would melt themselves. See above.

[lament jolt]

Who said anything about going up hill? I've built a set of 250 wagon trains on one of my saves. From 0 to full speed takes less than 55 seconds on flat tracks. That is with 10 locomotives.

[vapid gorge]

if you keep it to few final space parts you might be able to? multiple stops makes throughput drop like a stone though

like 1/1/4/4 of hte final ones

[lament jolt]

Not multiple stops. One single train dropping off EVERY thing needed from raw

[vapid gorge]

yedah but it nees to pick them up - multiple stops surely from that

[wind spade]

yeah, it's imo a very bad idea, but if you want to do it as a challenge, who are we to stop you 🤷‍♂️

[vapid gorge]

so w/o alt recipes you'd be looking at this much in raw but you could cut it down for 1/1/4/4 https://www.satisfactorytools.com/production?share=9iVVYl22TuTSo8XRYvng but that's still a looooong ass train since it'll have to stop a few places

[lament jolt]

I'm going to say this again: one train to bring in everything ONCE. One train to deliver everything raw. One train to rule them all

[vapid gorge]

ok so how are you bringing all the resources to the one station the train is picking it up from?

[lament jolt]

No pickups, all raw stuff spawned with AGS

[wind spade]

if it delivers once, your production is limited to what one train can deliver, which is very little

[vapid gorge]

oh mods. eh whatever then, not a challenge

[wind spade]

AGS is not a mod 🙂

[vapid gorge]

whats ags?

[wind spade]

advanced game settings

[vapid gorge]

... yo ucan spawn nodes with that?

[wind spade]

no, but items

[lament jolt]

A challenge to me. It's the getting all four lines empty in under an hour.

[vapid gorge]

ok so you're not going to automate stuff for a permanent factory?

[wind spade]

doesn't seem so based on this

[lament jolt]

No, this idea of mine is purely a time based run. One train, one hour to go from raw ore/packed fluids/packed gas to get EotP done.

[vapid gorge]

main issue I see is fluids work best with full flooded pipes which you aren't going to get like that

but you might as well just spawn it at the factory since you have total control of where the train station is so you're just setting up 'how much time it takes to trigger machines'

[wind spade]

as a challenge it seems you're already set on doing it that way no matter what we say, so go for it 🤷‍♂️
as a normal playthrough I heavily recommend against it

[sacred orbit]

i want to see if my idea with these pipes will work. the HOR exiting these pipes should total 150 m3/min. if i pump them into these refineries which each take 50 m3/min, will the system work fine?

does output into pipes(10m3/min vs 40m3/min) affect the pressure from that output?

[wind spade]

yeah (it will work)

[sacred orbit]

these three are making plastic and total only pushing out 30m3/min into the total pipe system. the other three are straight up producing HOR, totaling 120m3/min. would the HOR coming out of those push back into the segments pushing out 30m3/min?

[wind spade]

if you have a system that makes X/min and consumes X/min, it will work without issues

no matter how you connect it

[sacred orbit]

okay, so, the answer is "yes, but it doesn't matter"?

[wind spade]

(as long as X fits into pipe throughput obviously)

yes, you can have backflow in pipes, but it usually doesn't matter

[oblique hollow]

you are way below the limit of the pipe

why wouldnt it work

[sacred orbit]

here i go opening Paint again...

[oblique hollow]

pressure from machines is fixed and cannot be "overriden" by other pressure from other machines

so you cant "choke" a machine output

unless you make it so the pipes cannot empty themselves, which would be by using a valve with restricted flow or similar

[sacred orbit]

that's what i was looking for

[wind spade]

(which is not recommended, valves and buffers are usually sources of issues)

[wheat tundra]

is there a math formula, for how long a manifold line takes to reach 100% efficiency?

[oblique hollow]

yes and it is stupud

literally unusable

[wheat tundra]

Stupidly complex? Like a series?

[oblique hollow]

yes

[sacred orbit]

the time is "yes"

[wheat tundra]

Wow, lol!

[oblique hollow]

this is stupid and useless

[wind spade]

there have been some attempts at making it, but it's usually easier to simulate

there's an old manifold calculator I've made back in the day, which should still be valid to this day - https://satisfactory.greeny.dev/machine-fill

[wheat tundra]

I think that's damn cool though

[oblique hollow]

so the true answer for mortals is "use the tool greeny made"

[wind spade]

(don't use the site otherwise, it's super outdated)

[oblique hollow]

i dont, its stupid and i hated it from the day i made it

[sacred orbit]

the true answer for sane people is "yes, the manifold will fill"

[wheat tundra]

Well, there may not be a way to simplify it

[oblique hollow]

hence why simulation is the better choice

[wheat tundra]

Obviously a Python program can do it ( sim method)

[oblique hollow]

its kinda what the greeny tool does

[wind spade]

except last two machines (if input = required)

[oblique hollow]

for the last two it is "they will run at 100% efficiency but their inputs will never fill to 100% capacity"

[sacred orbit]

how should i run this line to a station? should i have a long, slow turn into a station, or should it just dive right into the station with no time to slow down?

[oblique hollow]

doesnt matter tbh

[vapid gorge]

they slow down as needed.

[oblique hollow]

trains can full stop at stations from any speed

[vapid gorge]

if you want aesthetic suggestions I'd need a more overhead shot with maybe rough sketch on where you want the station

[wheat tundra]

Roughly this hard coded Python code works

Oh, too long to paste

Anyway, took me 5 mins to write

[wind spade]

doesn't discord convert it to file attachement?

[wheat tundra]

Not for me it didn't

Basically, loop infinitely, splitting off half of incoming load, but capping on "bucket" size. If all buckets fill, terminate loop, print count

[oblique hollow]

2 buckets at the end never fill

[wheat tundra]

It "seems" to work, but a lifetime of software development has proven to me, that's not always true 🙂

[oblique hollow]

they can only reach the 2x the target amount they need to start working

[wheat tundra]

I will think upon that which you say

But my program seems approximately correct, and the loop terminates

[wind spade]

have you checked the tool I've sent?

[wheat tundra]

I will do that, I just wanted to write the Python code for practice

Hah, your UI already showed me issues with my code 🙂

[wheat tundra]

We agree given identical initial conditions

The main issue my code had, was that I was not consuming on each step

[sacred orbit]

can Turbo Fuel be used in Fuel Generators?

[wind spade]

yes

so can liquid biofuel

[sacred orbit]

is it better? how much can one take per minute?

[brisk shore]

Official Satisfactory Wiki

This is the totally awesome community driven wiki for Satisfactory!! Come on in and check it out!
<3 @wind spade

[sacred orbit]

should i do as i have set up here and push all 120 tfuel through one pipe into a manifold or should i just split each output to two packagers?

[vapid gorge]

why would 1 pipe not be enough?

[prisma kraken]

i don't think it really matters much, but as a design principal, keeping fluid networks as small as possible is always my preference

incidentally, why are you packaging so much turbofuel?

(i mean, i know turbo rifle ammo goes pretty quick, but not THAT quick :D)

[sacred orbit]

jetpack fuel

can't keep buying it

[wind spade]

biofuel

[vapid gorge]

you'll only need a few packaged pm, it builds up faster than you think

[sacred orbit]

turbo fuel is fast accention

[sacred orbit]

so how many would you recommend?

[vapid gorge]

purely for jetpack use? 5pm. Imagine the amount of time you spend building and running around like a maniac - plus I don't think you burn more than 5pm with jet packs

[sacred orbit]

so just one packager?

[vapid gorge]

yeah that'd be enough. Now if you want to run trucks and cars that are automated off of it you'd do more

but even a personal truck wouldn't use much

5pm would still be fine since you'll either be only driving the car or using the jet pack, both of which I think it's hard to outconsume 5pm

[sacred orbit]

are cars faster with turbofuel?

[wind spade]

no

[vapid gorge]

afaik no, but a stack of TF will last longer than a stack of regular fuel

[wind spade]

vehicles don't care about fuel type

[vapid gorge]

personally though I explore the world with blade runners and jet pack, generally faster

[sacred orbit]

same

[wind spade]

the only difference being fuel's energy, which translates into how long it lasts, in that regard batteries are best anyway

[vapid gorge]

Plutonium would like to have a word with you

[wind spade]

don't want to drive a radiation death ball thx

[vapid gorge]

boooo

I'm planning on using a bunch of trucks for a big HMF factory that'll run off p rods 😄 3/4 just for aesthetics

[sacred orbit]

so i need a TON of fuel generators then...?

[vapid gorge]

if you're doing it to power your factories? yeah. But I think one of the reasons it's like this, even with fuel, is to push you to nuclear if you want lots of power

[sacred orbit]

i was doing this JUST for packaged turbofuel. i had no intention of using it for power

[vapid gorge]

oh right, then why were you asking bout a ton of fuel gens?

[sacred orbit]

because if i'm not gonna be packaging it, then what else would i use it for?

[vapid gorge]

Ah sorry missed the ‘had’, and yeah you’ll need a bunch of gens but at least more power is good right?

[sacred orbit]

lacking the resources to build said gens isn't good...

[wet python]

oh yeah... those heavy frames...

[vapid gorge]

Automate 😄

[prisma kraken]

btw, for jetpack fuel, making a container of LBF lasts FOREVER, i tore down my production line for it all +1000 hrs ago in the game and still have plenty

[sacred orbit]

what difference does LBF provide?

[prisma kraken]

slower, longer burn in the jetpack

[faint atlas]

LBF?

[prisma kraken]

one stack of it lasts quite a while

[sacred orbit]

liquid biofuel

[faint atlas]

oh

is it worth using over regular fuel

[prisma kraken]

i think so, i much prefer it over normal fuel

[sacred orbit]

but how fast/high do you ascend?

[faint atlas]

might be nice, I currently run out of fuel pretty easily if I'm not careful while using hypertube cannon

[prisma kraken]

its a slower ascent that is actually the highest climb of any fuel, and longest hover

[sacred orbit]

higher than turbo fuel?

[prisma kraken]

slightly higher

tf in the jetpack pisses me off, it burns way to quick

[sacred orbit]

then why does it exist?

[prisma kraken]

so people will stop asking for it 😛

[sacred orbit]

but from what i'm hearing, it's garbage

[prisma kraken]

some people who think the game is a combat game find tf better in the jetpack for its manueverability

[sacred orbit]

ah. that's why i've been liking it. schmovement

[prisma kraken]

i personally just hit things with big booms and call it a day 😛

nuke hogs aren't very tough when you can just over over them and shoot them with ex-rebar

*hover over

[true junco]

I like TF in the jet pack. But i keep putting off setting up biofuel. 😆

[vapid gorge]

if you're using jetpack for vertical climb you're using it wrong

[fierce ruin]

are frame recipes being rebalanced?

[worldly sinew]

I have a question

how do I get a (120 per/min) to a (45 per/min)

[fierce berry]

...sink 75/min into the AWESOME Sink, I suppose

[maiden mantle]

divide it to 2 and again both to 2 and one of the 30ipm to 2 then merge one of the 15 to other 30 and its 45

and do whatever you want to do with
the left 2x 30 1x 15

[sand epoch]

Use a splitter and let it fillup and overflow the extra 75.

[worldly sinew]

thx

[prisma kraken]

or you can just use a normal splitter if both sides of the split consume exactly 45 & 75... the 45 side will get 60/min until it overflows to balance out the rates

i'm not a huge fan of doing that b/c it takes a long time for 200 & 500 stack items to overflow, but it does work and is simple

[deft lichen]

@trim river

both brackets are a minute long, 5 is one cycle, 6 is your measurement (reduced numbers for brevity)

if you want to measure barrels/min, you have to start measurement when you insert the rod, not at the first barrel

[undone ocean]

Why do factories fed by manifold take so long to completely spin up? especiall screw machines?

they appear to never completely run

even though I calculated numbers properly

[static zenith]

cause the machine holds 500 screw in its storage

so it take long to over fill them

[deft lichen]

each machine has to fill up first

[undone ocean]

rods-screws

those lines take forever

[wind spade]

don't manifold them

[deft lichen]

that's the only downside of manifolds to balancers, but you can counter it by pre-filling the machines

[wind spade]

direct input for screws

[faint atlas]

Is it bad that I use manifolds for everything

everything.

[wind spade]

it's not bad. But sometimes direct input is just better than manifolding

[vapid gorge]

screws being one like that

[wind spade]

screws, wire, quickwire

and by default anything that can be made into nice ratio with next step is a candidate for direct input

[trim river]

@deft lichen thank you for the Help with the next batch thas solves my Problem

[compact otter]

I've been singing that song 🎵 for a long time and it's nice to find someone who agrees. If I read you right. I call it direct feed, worked it out several thousand hours ago and have not transported a single screw since.

Steel beams are replaced for screws in all of my factories which require them.
In between the supply and target machine is a constructor making screws.

In my heavy modular frame factory 🏭 this is 2 constructors per manufacturer and a total of 14 manufacturers, each requiring 390 screws per minute.
Direct feed was the solution to feeding screws to that number of machines.

It feels to me that this is a deliberate problem inserted into the fabric of the game by the devs given the constraints of a mk5 conveyer.
And as you stated around ratios; it can be applied to any material which stacks in 500s and has a high demand.

I have it applied to the following additional factories; high-speed connector, beacon, AI limiter, encased uranium cell.
The new Stator factory I'm planning will be using it for a total of 96 assemblers, (4x24) for the quickwire.

[vapid gorge]

you could just not use screws

[compact otter]

I worked it out with screws that's all.
No recipe is off the table because of it.
And it allows for a much larger number of machines by removing high demand limiting materials from the factory planning process for me.
None of the additional factories mentioned above use screws, it's applied to quickwire.

[burnt bone]

how do water pipes work? does the game treat it like wires where there's a max input or are there physical amounts of water

asking because i put 3 pumps into one pipeline, providing 360m^3 for a 300m^3 pipe, yet all the outputs are filled at 360m^3 across the outputs

can you treat any ratios with pipes as 1 main input?

[vapid gorge]

depends on the lay out - if you have 360 going into 1 pipe you won't be able to get all of it used if any point goes over the throughput

and it's not like wires, fluid physically travels back and forth along

[burnt bone]

this drawing sort of not really explains what my idea was:

could we have a pump sequentially along the pipes inputting to top up the physical level

[vapid gorge]

so the reason things like this work is because the coal gens consume some fluid - so at no point is there more than 300 fluid needing to mvoe

[burnt bone]

yea, if we input enough fluid along the line to constantly be topping up the water it'd work for any length of pipe, correct?

if we had 2/5 of the water being used every machine, we could add another pump every 3rd machine

[vapid gorge]

sure but in general you want to keep to a 'keep it simple' rule for pipes

the reason why the diagrams show 3 extractors to 8 gens is because they produce and use the same amount w/o any clocking. Simple chunks of generators

[burnt bone]

currently we have 3 gens per 8 yea

split in the middle, two sets of 8 coal gens

[vapid gorge]

things tend to be fairly different later on with fluids. Keep it simple and pre flood systems and make manifold loops for hte pipes

[burnt bone]

pre flood being fill before use?

[vapid gorge]

basically leave 1 machine off in a line so that everything else gets totally flooded and then flip the last machine on

[burnt bone]

so manifold type fluid?

[vapid gorge]

the manifold is looped to the start to help deal with back flow

bed now though, gnight!

[burnt bone]

have a good night mate thanks for the help

[chilly oak]

Anyone time their geogens to get a steady power supply like we were talking about a few days ago? My first attempt...1000mw fluctuation sadface...

[true junco]

Idk if anyone actually tries to do that. Sounds like more trouble than its worth. "Real power graphs have curves" anyways.

[stuck ingot]

Why am i getting so much lag with this ?
I am down to like 5-10 fps when looking at the factory
To be fair my laptop isnt the best with a ryzen 5 5500U and integrated amd radeon graphics but it
should be able to handle it right?
the gpu is at like 98% permanent tho

[wet python]

Just add a bunch of batteries and forget about it

[wet python]

Seems gpu related. I don't think these integrated graphics can handle much

[oblique hollow]

big factories, no matter what pc, cause reduces performance when you look at it. The fact that you have a laptop doesnt help

Better pcs can handle it better of course

[wind spade]

integrated GPU does not help at all 😄

[oblique hollow]

yeah integrated is pretty much the bottom of performance

[primal flicker]

I think they changed it so that we can no longer do that. Check #patch-notes .

[zenith willow]

Am I reading this right it's 2 point 308 steel beams a min

it can't be 2308

[stuck ingot]

well fck

[oblique hollow]

you can tune down your graphics to minimum and also screen scaling to like 60%

[stuck ingot]

my graphics are at the lowest already but i will try the scaling

[faint atlas]

yeah its 2 point 308

[main dirge]

So much for that 🥲

"2000+ hours" I'm over here getting it at 320

[vapid gorge]

you sure it's the same one?

[main dirge]

It's identical except the string under work\

Line 388

Happened twice today, have just put in place the fix listed on wiki

[2023.12.30-21.58.55:624][ 42]LogWindows: Error: appError called: Assertion failed: Index >= 0 && Index < MaxElements [File:C:\BuildAgent\work\607eee041ab2bfcf\UE4\Engine\Source\Runtime\CoreUObject\Public\UObject\UObjectArray.h] [Line: 388]

Regretting setting autosave interval up to 30m but saving takes quite a bit now

Ofc it happened 25m after the last autosave though

[vapid gorge]

only 300 hours and you have that many obj?

[main dirge]

I could send map file but you'd have to wait for my internet to work 😅

But yeah I'm surprised as well, thought it may be an issue later but defo not rn

[vapid gorge]

did you just pave the world?

[main dirge]

Last save was 25m before the most recent crash 😢

Had one earlier today as well but assumed it was bc the world had been up several hours, saw something about an object count leak in U8 when looking up

Oh wait you actually meant pave not save

Also no

[oblique hollow]

the crash has become a lot more common than it should be for some

i still assume theres a leak somewhere

[main dirge]

I think I'm at like 2-3k buildings? Though obvs foundations I've significantly more of

Screw it just gonna burn the mobile data to get the numbers

Like, big but not insane numbers or anything like paving the world for 300h straight

[vapid gorge]

that map doesn't look like it should have 50k foundations

lots of floors I guess. Only constructors?

[main dirge]

The bigger buildings are all 5-10 floors

SCIM just shows constructors as the icon for all buildings

It's probably mostly refineries xd

barely

50k seems like a lot but the building I'm at rn is 36x36 (1.3k foundations) for each of the 6 current floors so

Adds up fast

The rail is another ~2k*7

[vapid gorge]

oh you kept foundations under teh whole way? yeah i delete those

[main dirge]

Not sure how good an idea increasing the object cap is though if there's a memory leak somewhere, surely that'll just lead to the issues that come with the increased object cap real fast

[vapid gorge]

you could always try copy pasting your world to a fresh map with SCIM and unlocking the same things - see if that changes anything since it'll technically be a new world

it's not actually hard to do - the longest process is just making notes about what you've unlocked and which alts you have already

[main dirge]

Everything

Except nuke nobelisks bc I'm working on nuclear rn

[main dirge]

but pretty sky bridge 🥲

[vapid gorge]

then it would be super quick to transfer teh 'save' to a new one

your factories aren't sky factories right?

[main dirge]

Nah, also transferring would mean the pain of trees through my base and resetting all collectibles right?

Still a little sad that U8 reset collected slugs, takes away a lot of incentive to expxlore when you can just go to the slug-richest areas a couple of times

[vapid gorge]

well if you have all alts collectibles shouldn't be a real issue right? and power shards are already basically infinite with doggos. Honestly I just spawn more in for myself. Trees might hav eto deal with a bit. But if its possible it fixes a bad bug worth a shot. Can always go back to the old save if it doesn't

[main dirge]

Yeah fair

Shouldn't be the hugest issue either, just bc of the scale I'm building on almost everything is elevated for flatness or on top of water anyway

[vapid gorge]

hmm ok so over the years whenever someone has sent me their save to inspect or try to fix something the ones that have always killed my computer resources were the ones with large amount of foundations in the sky causing shadows - more resource consumption than their world should have realistically used.

I've seen things like that in other buildable games where floating structures just strained the comp. I'm not sure how much floating platforms above water will hit it? Shrug

[main dirge]

Think I saw there was a mod for displaying object limit too, mb should look for that and if it's on U8

[vapid gorge]

you could try building down into the water and terrain with more foundations so the camera never has to look at it and might not try to processes shadows

but that won't help if this is the u obj bug

[main dirge]

Hmm interesting

[vapid gorge]

but aside from u obj bug - all the saves with floating structures hit my comp hard.

and they were all less obj heavy than my saves

[main dirge]

There does seem to be a cutoff for how far it renders shadows, though ig it still has to actuall fo that cast to figure that out

[vapid gorge]

I'm not an expert - but all things considered it might still force calculations on 'unseen' shadows or figuring out where and when they should show from what altitude.

computers are weird

[main dirge]

And it's defo not a performance issue - PC resources are fine and the game can take quite a bit more than it is most of the time as demonstrated by it tanking every time I go to the 300 refineries in spire coast 😂

[vapid gorge]

oh yeah your specific thing rn now sounds like hte u obj thing

this was just generally about floating stuff

which I don't think is a huge issue for you atm from the map you shared

[main dirge]

No yeah but it's defo something to keep in mind

[vapid gorge]

like even the factories over water that might contribute to that aren't nearly as expansive as some of the nonsense I've seen

[main dirge]

I mean the majority of water to the east just exists over a void from what I can tell so

Can't really build down there

[vapid gorge]

from the map I didn't think you were over the ocean void but I'm not super familiar with it

[main dirge]

The void starts somewhere under this building, and directly to the right there's patches with fake water

[vapid gorge]

surprisingly close to land

[main dirge]

Figuring out how to fit in all the extractors there without hitting the void or using a non-repeatable build hurt 🥲

[vapid gorge]

hmm how fake does the water get? could you put foundations zooped from the beach and the extractors over them?

[main dirge]

Nope, there's no water there

Think I tried that but could be mistaken

Would have to re-check to be certain

[vapid gorge]

Mods would be the solution then. Micro Manage (when it gets updated)

to have it under your system anyway

[main dirge]

Eh I'm p against using mods long-term in SF specifically rn. Too much hassle with being in EA and wanting to jump to experimental, plus the goal I'm going for is dependant on the limits of vanilla so it feels against the spirit of why I'm playing rn

[vapid gorge]

well with MM placed extractors you can uninstall it straight after and it works fine? an option anyway

[main dirge]

If I hadn't figured out how to fit them all into the space I had sure, but that's done now and I shouldn't need extractor space again 😛

[vapid gorge]

oh right, fair enough

[main dirge]

Unless there's the same issue in the NW but seems much better over there

Plus max uranium nuclear needs 3.14 times as much water as max copper so everything hereon is much smaller for water demand

(I will take every opportunity to bring that up)

https://ficsit.app/mod/Th3UObjectCounter

Can use this to diagnose if object limit is the issue though

Will get around to at not midnight right before exams xd

[clever thorn]

Hi I'm new to the game and wanted to ask, how I can manage that exactly the 7,5/min Iron Ingot go to the Iron rod Constructor and 22,5/min go to the plates Constructor?

[wind spade]

one splitter

[clever thorn]

yeah

[wind spade]

that's the answer

[clever thorn]

but I did that and it doesn't work

[wind spade]

wdym doesn't work?

[faint atlas]

as long as the machines you set up are consuming only as much as you need, they'll fill up and distribute the iron ingots as you want them to automatically

[clever thorn]

Now my Iron plates constructor only works to 50% and my Iron rod constructor to 100%

[wind spade]

what happens when you put 15/min into something that needs 7.5/min? 🙂

[clever thorn]

Yeah, but my Iron Rod constructo need 15 not 7,5, so instead of the 7,5 I want it takes all 15 that it needs and the iron plates don't get enough

[wind spade]

then underclock it?

in the image above you've been told to build 0.5 constructors, not 1

[clever thorn]

Yeah, how do I do that?

[faint atlas]

You may want to calm down a bit on making all this so precise when you're this new to the game

[wind spade]

nah, that's fine

underclocking is unlocked after/with overclocking in MAM

[clever thorn]

ah ok so that's the problem thx, I haven't unlocked that yet

[mellow cloud]

is there a place whee i can reccomend stuff?

[brisk shore]

Satisfactory Questions

You can send Questions, Feedback, Suggestions, and Bug Reports
https://questions.satisfactorygame.com
<3 @snow dove

[burnt bone]

ive lost my numbers thinking

we have 16 constructors outputting 30 wire/min, wanting to make some stators using 40 wire/min per stator

ideally we use 4 constructors to make cable for cable, and the other 12 for stators

should i just pipe them all into a industrial storage then redistribute? i honestly cant think abt these ratios

[vapid gorge]

is it just 1 belt of wire?

[burnt bone]

it can be

we have 3 floors in a 5 by 7 area, with the top floor having the 4

[vapid gorge]

then you can just have 1 line of 4 constructors and 12 assemblers and feed them

or merge the right number of Wire Constructors to feed cable on one line, and merge the rest to be sent to stators

[burnt bone]

yea i'm thinking we shift the second floor down to the ground level and merge the 12 outputs onto a mk3 or smth

[vapid gorge]

merging all of a thing and then respliting it is usually the most annoying and space using option

doing a bit of pre planning where you figure out what needs to be grouped where at every step is usually worth it

[burnt bone]

seems i need 4 constructors per even ratio

if they're each producing 30, then i can semi manifold 4 at a time

[vapid gorge]

I have no idea what you mean by 'even ratio'
you can always change the clocking of machines

[burnt bone]

the way i thought it could work was just merge all 6 and split them, but doing that would give 45 where it only needs 40

[vapid gorge]

if you want merge them all onto one line you don't even need to split them, just line up all the machines that use them on that one line, it'll self balance

[vapid gorge]

but like I said if you want splitting into different groups mergeing eveyrthing first and then dealing with it is probably the most work

[sacred orbit]

your "easy" solution before overclocking and underclocking is to just build two sets of the system.

[sacred orbit]

i do that

is this what is meant by a "buffer system" for train unloading?

[vapid gorge]

hard to tell exactly but looks right?
platform - 2 belts into isc - 1 belt out ?

[sacred orbit]

yes

[vapid gorge]

you can manage to pump through more than 1 belt per platform depending on distance/item , and you can do calculations for it - but I can never be bothered personally

I think max theoretical throughput of a platform is around 1200?

[sacred orbit]

all i know is that having two belts out of each station keeps the stations empty.

[vapid gorge]

well it's important how you're buffering it at teh loading station too

[sacred orbit]

oh, i'm not. i'll ride it over to set that up

[vapid gorge]

gotta buffer both ends like that

[sacred orbit]

input is one belt into storage into two belts into station?

[vapid gorge]

that works for all but very very long return trip times

[sacred orbit]

okay. i only built the factories on the output side to take in the exact amount that the input side can produce, soo...

[vapid gorge]

Unless you had a bunch of extra buffered on the drop off point they'll be stuttering

and if that's the case it'll chew through the extra pretty quick

[sacred orbit]

i do

[outer tangle]

Good evening everyone. I got a question regarding turbofuel and satisfactorytools. Everytime i try to get the site to calculate buildings needed for turbofuel it just breaks and says it cant do that calculation. Any idea why?

[vapid gorge]

share the plan that is 'broken' ?

[outer tangle]

Here you go. Also quick note same applies to packaged as well

https://www.satisfactorytools.com/production?share=bGHwtCeNQMAryzSBlkMO

"Fuel" works fine and trying to do alt recipe for turbofuel changes nothing on default fuel.

[vapid gorge]

you need to select one of the turbo fuels - they are an 'alt recipe'

[outer tangle]

Yep just tried that it still giving the error.

[vapid gorge]

for that one you'll ahve to select the 'compacted coal' alt as well 😄

[outer tangle]

OH

Thats fixed it thank you.

[vapid gorge]

are you fairly early on in the game?

[outer tangle]

You just saved me lots of headache

started new and just got to oil and unlocked turbofuel

[vapid gorge]

ah well there is an argument to keep going with coal until you get better oil recipes that gets more power per oil - but it all depends what's fun for you 🙂

[outer tangle]

Thats honestly fair

Coal is quite easy to set up as well

[vapid gorge]

everyone wants different things - Like a lot of people don't bother with TF and just use the very efficient diluted fuel recipes.
I like the Blended TF recipe so I wait until I get blenders just cause I like the process. And there's a spot in the centre of hte map that has oil and sulfur so I don't need to move stuff around

but some people like shipping sulfur and coal around to a oil complex to burn it all 😄

[outer tangle]

wait where is this spot?

I was goingto do bottom right

[vapid gorge]

near the centre of the map, there's a lake in the mountains. There's oil and sulfur right next to each other. It's a great spot for Blended Diluted fuel that only needs sulfur + oil. And if you really want there's some coal on a cliff not too far away

I'd get the Heavy Oil Residue and Diluted Fuel alts first though

[outer tangle]

Yep both me and my GF are going harddrive hunting tomorrow

[vapid gorge]

the biggest issue though, imo, is that for a nice large set up you need hundreds of generators to chew through all that fuel. I think I had about 350 there w/o the coal that stretched out the oil.

and hundreds of fuel gens are just hideous

[outer tangle]

wait hold up how much fuel does a fuel gen process a min?

i forgot about that

because if i make 300 turbo fuel a min how many does that power

[vapid gorge]

300/4.5

[outer tangle]

thats umm 66 fuel generators

holy moly

[vapid gorge]

it's probably why a lot of people make a long field of them over the ocean. But I think they designed it this way to push people to use nuclear power

66 isn't bad!

you could probably make something not hideous if it's only 66

[vapid gorge]

I'd consider over clocking all of them just to not have it be so massive though

[outer tangle]

I guess i also better learn about fluid buffers etc.

so lots of youtube videos to watch

[arctic ice]

hello, everyone. How do you save downloaded blueprints into steam? I cant seem to find my save folder

[vapid gorge]

ah the lengthy lesson on fluid buffers:

Don't use them

[vapid gorge]

the path is in #faq but you also will have needed to have created a bp in your game for it to create the folder in the first place

[outer tangle]

tbh fair. I heard having a drop off a 1 wall sized drop is also good

[arctic ice]

Thanks a lot!

[vapid gorge]

drop off?

[outer tangle]

pipe going from packager down a small drop

[vapid gorge]

oh not needed if the system is flooded

the only real place fluid buffers have use is for train station buffering - and maybe some extremely niche sushi load balancing

[outer tangle]

however will need to learn how to send said pipes to 66 generators because going down a long lines probably not recommended

[vapid gorge]

eh it's fine - just need to learn the basic pipe rules #1190597884681396296 message

[outer tangle]

@vapid gorge Thanks for all the help

However i will need sleep its 6:40am

[vapid gorge]

the rules in the link aren't iron clad - but those are steps that should work for any system. If you know what you're doing you can bend them somewhat 🙂 get some sleep!

[languid grotto]

just a newbie question. um. what kind of math do you apply in Satisfactory... or what topic of math could be useful to know?

[wind spade]

it's just standart math

multiplication, addition, etc.

unless you want to get into optimisation algorithms, but for those it's better to just use some online tools

[main dirge]

*runs a simplex optimisation on every recipe and resource for the truly optimised base*

[prisma kraken]

i've found that a little bit of a background in abstract algebra and modular ring arithmetic is somewhat useful

[soft trail]

The what now?

[prisma kraken]

most of the numbers in SF are all generated from the prime numbers 2, 3, 5, 7, 11, and 13... every number in the game is some fraction or multiple of those numbers

[main dirge]

Tbh you don't really need to do much math at all since machines parse maths expressions

Me in the FICSIT Advanced Maths exam forgetting what 6*7 is and placing a manufacturer in middle of the exam hall to check

[prisma kraken]

its really not necessary at all to go into it all, but i've found that if i approach the ratio problems of recipe combination in the game with a bit of knowledge of that and can categorize things as a recipe dominated by one of those numbers, it helps me quickly see how many machines are needed to make a balanced production line

like 2.8125/min is actually 45/16

or 195/min = 60*13/4

you can of course, just memorize such numeric relationships, but understanding a bit more of the theory of these numbers and how to manipulate them can be useful from my experience

what abstract algebra essentially is is the study of taking a numeric representation system, and the operations you perform on it, and generalizing the meta of it into a collection of elements and operations on those elements

example: any recipe that requires multiples of 5 or 10 machines can be clocked to 125% to turn it into multiples of 2^n machines

(or 250%)

you can definitely get to that result with common sense, but formalizing the result on a more meta level is more general

[main dirge]

All's fun and games until you have to bust out Dirac notation for fluid handling

Fr though it's mostly down to how you prefer playing. I play that way in Factorio but not SF oddly enough

[prisma kraken]

yeah, well, fortunately SF doesn't require any diff-eq's, lol

it totally isn't a necessary thing, and i wouldn't recommend to go audit a college class on abstract algebra to understand the math in the game

but i find, having a background in that stuff does allow me to understand some ratio problems in the game a little better

i don't wish to belabor the point

really though, when you see odd numbers in the game for rates in the higher level components, usually you can multiply the number by 16 to see why the number is what it is

(any number ending in a 5 as the last decimal place)

oscillators, computers, hmf, turbomotor, for instance

what i've found is that i can usually work backward from a goal of production once i realize the numbers and then understand how the devs intentionally made the ratios for things ugly and impossible to line up

its always by adding a recipe that involves 7 or 11, lol

examples of recipes with a 7 in them: default oscillator, encased pipe, default & caterium circuit board

alt oscillator also has a 7 in it for the rubber

11 is less common, but you'll find it with silicon cb, find concrete (if anyone ever uses it), and there perhaps is one other somewhere

there's a few recipes that are also dominated by 13 - mostly ones that take screws or steel screw that makes them

if you're the type of person that cares about 100% efficient factories and never having things pause b/c of fp math drift, knowing when your dealing with 7, 11, and 13 is sort of important

all that being said, i think just a good memory and a bit of napkin math is all the game really needs for successfully constructing efficient factories in the game

if you are building on a large scale, using a spreadsheet for calculations can be useful, but that's work that i don't find you really need to do to successfully get a gold cup

[carmine basin]

Hello, I am having issues with my coal power generation and would appreciate some help. I have a mark 2 miner in a coal node producing 240 coal per minute, which is conveyed to the system by a series of mark 3 conveyor belts transporting 270 per minute. The coal is then split in two for steel production and power, leaving 120 coal per minute. The remaining coal is then run past 8 conveyor splitters where half is channeled to a generator and the rest is brought to the next splitter. Generators 1-5 and 6-8 are each supplied with a pipeline hooked up to two water extractors.

If I understand the game correctly, then each generator should one by one be filled with coal to capacity, bringing the rest of the coal on the conveyor belt forward to the other generators, eventually resulting in the system being 'saturated'. However, it seems that around the fourth or fifth generator coal is being used faster than it is supplied and the previously described effect is not happening.

I do not understand why, and though it may not be possible to help without seeing the situation represented visually, but any perspectives as to what might be wrong would be greatly appreciated.

[vapid gorge]

it takes time for a manifold belt to fill up machines - also it's generally recommended not to blend factory parts and power generators on the same system

[prisma kraken]

check the belt speeds of the belts between the splitters, you may have a slow belt in between jamming it all up, but also, in your description, you say generators {1, 2, 3, 4, 5} are being supplied by one water extractor, and {6, 7, 8} are being supplied with another?

[carmine basin]

No, both of those sets are being supplied by 2 extractors each.

Also I made sure all the conveyor belts in between are also mark 3.

[fierce cypress]

try disabling all the coal gens until the belt backs up, then turn them back on

[prisma kraken]

i'm guessing your problem is water, take a look at one of the generators that is cutting on&off to see if it is running out of coal or water

[carmine basin]

I am fairly certain the problem is not water-related, all generators seem to have sufficient water, whereas I can see coal numbers go down.

[carmine basin]

I would but generator number 5 powers both the water and coal.

[prisma kraken]

also, 8 generators only need 3 water extractors if you build the pipes nicely, see #design-and-architecture message as example

[vapid gorge]

"it takes time for a manifold belt to fill up machines" - if it's built right you probably haven't waited until it's balanced

hand fill some stacks of coal and see if they still run out after

[fierce cypress]

then leave that one running and all the rest off

also 1 coal gen = 75MW
4 water extractors + mk2 miner = 92MW

[carmine basin]

I have tried that several times and they do indeed deteriorate immediately

[prisma kraken]

i'm also going to toss out there that building an 8-way split for coal gennies isn't very much space and saves you the problem of manifold warming

[vapid gorge]

because that's so much faster than quickly hand filing some coal - don't try to toss load balancing on a newbie

[carmine basin]

That may be a point, but still it seems that water and coal are still being produced at normal rates

[prisma kraken]

its an 8-way split, come on, its like the same thing you do 2x for basic iron!

[carmine basin]

Well I have considered that, and while it doesn't take that much space, it is hard to make work considering the orientation of the generators

[fierce cypress]

would it be possible to get an overhead screenshot of the system, could be useful to identify issues

[carmine basin]

But for some reason the 5th generator says its providing 14 MW instead of 92, that seems wrong.

[vapid gorge]

they're having issues with the concept of manifolds - don't throw extra things

[fierce cypress]

have you changed the clockspeeds?

[prisma kraken]

now this is getting interesting... generators should provide 75 mw, do you have the clock rates for them set irregularly?

[fierce cypress]

or can you send a screenshot of the power graph?

[carmine basin]

what are clockspeeds

the generator is producing 75 MW, its just only 14 MW is being used.

So I don;t get how it can be attached to water and coal.

[fierce cypress]

its possible that you haven't unlocked them yet - they're unlocked in the MAM

[fierce cypress]

can you send the power graph?

or a screenshot of the generators?

[prisma kraken]

um, maybe you are missing some power cables connecting things?

[fierce cypress]

^ if only 14MW is being consumed

but that doesnt make much sense since water extractors are 20MW and a mk2 miner is 12MW

neither of them are 14MW

[carmine basin]

I may have also accidentally attached a hyertube entrance to it

But I checked and it appears that all water extractors are attached to the generator and are fully operational

[fierce cypress]

only explanation of this i can see is 75% OC on extractors = 13.7MW
4*75% extractors = 360 water/min

[carmine basin]

Umm Im not sure I understand that

[fierce cypress]

if you've never seen overclocking before, don't worry about it too much

[carmine basin]

I checked the extractors and they all say 100% clock speed.

[fierce cypress]

are you able to get screenshots?

because theres only so much troubleshooting we can do based on a verbal explanation

[carmine basin]

thats the graph of generator 5

I have to admit that a lot of this was built by my more experienced friend and I can't actually see how the generator is connected to the grid.

[fierce cypress]

that seems, very wrong

[carmine basin]

In essence I dont understand my own system anymore

[fierce cypress]

if anything - i'd ask your friend because you've probably accidently changed something or they did something wrong

and they'd probably be able to assist the best

otherwise a screenshot of the system would be useful

[carmine basin]

I think I have accidentally connected the extractors to the main grid, because the consumption spiked at one point and I didn't know why, and then I connected the 5th generator to different stuff

[carmine basin]

I would love to but I dont know how to do the overhead one

should I build a lookout tower?

[fierce cypress]

yes that would work

[carmine basin]

ok hang on

[fierce cypress]

and you said each pipe has two extractors on it?

[carmine basin]

Yes

[fierce cypress]

that doesn't seem right

but if they are all on 100% then you're overproducing water anyway

[carmine basin]

That's true I suppose...

[fierce cypress]

you said you couldnt see how one of them was connected to the system

see if you can connect it

[carmine basin]

The fifth one I think is connected under the platform, but I can't see where the cable is so I can't disconnect it

But thank you so much for your help, I will just have to ask my friend.

[fierce cypress]

ok

[carmine basin]

By the way, I've fixed it now, it turns out that the conveyor lift I used to bring the coal to the platform was still mark 2. Thank you for all the help, and I'm sorry I bothered you for something I could have fixed on my own.

[tribal dove]

if i'm understanding this correctly, one single pure node on mk2 can handle 6/16?

[vapid gorge]

6/16?

[tribal dove]

6 extracts 16 coal gens. sorry.

[vapid gorge]

depends on miner and clocking and belt

no idea where you pulled that image from

[brisk shore]

@tribal dove Your link has been removed. In order to combat spam, only whitelisted links are allowed on this server. If you think this link should be whitelisted, please let a moderator know.

[tribal dove]

the wiki.

[primal flicker]

16 coal gens? That's 240 coal/min.

[vapid gorge]

probably the old abandoned wiki link

!wikisearch miner

[brisk shore]

https://satisfactory.wiki.gg/index.php?search=miner

[vapid gorge]

the top chart is based off 100% clocking - so you can figure out how much you could get overclocking

so for example a mk1 miner on a normal node OCed to 200% could do 120 coal pm

[nimble python]

happened to me too lol

[sacred orbit]

3 water extractors to 8 generators. or one generator at 150% for every 4 generators.

[sonic tundra]

can someone help me make a rotor factory that uses 120 iron per minute

[vapid gorge]

https://www.satisfactorytools.com/production?share=KiRSBuFmXGpKRj4U1X9X

[sonic tundra]

thx

?

how do i make .667 of a constructor

[vapid gorge]

research clocking

[sonic tundra]

i alr have that

[vapid gorge]

so clock 1 contructor down right?

[sonic tundra]

like this?

[vapid gorge]

type in the % field - make it 66.6667 to round up

[sonic tundra]

ok did it

im stuck on this part

[sonic tundra]

how can i split 90 coal so every coal generator gets 15 coal

[sand epoch]

Just split it and let them fill up. It will balance on its own.

[sonic tundra]

ok

[sand epoch]

Manifold is your friend.

[fierce berry]

Although considering most ratios, 15:90 is pretty easy - it's a 1:6. You can just split the incoming belt into two, then split each belt into 3 for a perfect load balance

...but yeah manifold is easier

[sonic tundra]

gonna do that

[fierce berry]

Just note that as you get better belts, it will be desirable to expand your coal plant a little before you dip your toes into fuel generators. It will be far easier to expand a manifold than tear down a load balancer down the line

[vapid gorge]

load balancing gets wildly time consuming and complicated as you go - just let teh system fill up on it's own

for example - if you do a load balancer now for your coal gens you'll have to rip them out entirely and rebuild when you have faster belts with more on them.

[fierce berry]

If you're waiting for your generators to fill up, just grab a portable miner or two and get some coal from there

Oh - and it's a good idea to let your pipes and generators back up with water before putting in coal and turning them on: full pipes are happy pipes

[sonic tundra]

the pipes are full

[fierce berry]

Then it's the coal - go ahead and manually fill 'em up

[sonic tundra]

this is slavery

[fierce berry]

...mildly inappropriate analogy, but sure. You can always just AFK for a while if you don't want to fill them up yourself

[sonic tundra]

i left one conveyor at t1 🤦‍♂️

[fierce berry]

Ah well, we've all made that mistake

[sonic tundra]

its fixed now

[fierce berry]

Lovely!

[mighty depot]

Is my math just not mathing or is it true that you can get 60/min rubber from only 45 crude oil if you make plastic first 🤔

Refinery: Plastic
in: 45/min crude oil
out: 30/min plastic, 15/min heavy oil residue

Blender: Fuel (heavy oil residue + water)
in: 15/min heavy oil residue, 30/min water
out: 30/min fuel

Refinery: Rubber
in: 30/min plastic, 30/min fuel
out: 60/min rubber

So you just add the 30/min water and you half the amount of crude oil you need. Standard recipe needs 90 crude oil for 60/min rubber if my math do be mathing (and also has that extra oil residue you gotta mess with if you dont do this).

[versed violet]

you can also type 2/3 and it auto converts (actually, 200/3 because percent)

[sonic tundra]

How do this

[versed violet]

usually, just manifold it, aka do splitters without regard to ratios. As long as the machines consume the same you are providing, it will even out. the machines that get full will have the belt stop and the resources go through the other belt.

if you mean the 94.5 iron ore, you can just type that into miner.

[sonic tundra]

im gonna use math for it

nvm too hard

[golden smelt]

any tips for trying to balance my conveyors

[fierce berry]

Manifolding is practical, space-efficient and extensible

[vapid gorge]

does it round up?

[vapid gorge]

don't.

And it's not being mean - every balancer is it's own unique solution.

[versed violet]

not sure, I think it rounds to nearest, which will be 67 for two thirds.

[vapid gorge]

if it rounds the last digit up that's fine then - but would have to confirm

[versed violet]

try it out. the box accepts formulas.

eg 3*15+7

[prisma kraken]

giving you a bit of guidance, my intro rotor build ends up being very different from what you have laid out in sftools

early on, you do not need many rotors, and there's some tricks that will allow you to build one a lot more cleanly/easier

first trick: the cast screw recipe alternate takes 12.5 ingots to make 50 screw/min

cast screw is very easy to obtain as an alt recipe in phase 1, before you unlock part assembly, you have a 1 in 2 change of researching it on your first hard drive

the probability on it for the 2nd, 3rd and 4th hd you research go to 3/5, 3/4, and 3/3 for the 2nd, 3rd and 4th hd you research

second trick: default rotor takes exactly 45 ingots to make the screws & rods you need for 1 assembler, or 90 ingots for 2 assemblers; you need exactly 3 smelters to provide ingots for 2 assemblers

third trick: you can underclock a rod constructor to make 10 rods/min

fourth trick: 10 rods and 50 screws fill a mk1 belt; an assembler has 2 inputs

[frosty owl]

Iirc it rounds as you would expect it to.
Eg: 16.66665 - > 16.6667 or 13.33334 - > 13.3333

[prisma kraken]

it sometimes gets it incorrect, i've noticed

on a concrete constructor, if you enter 13.33333/min as the output rate, it'll set the clock to 88.866666%

where it should instead be 88.88888%

i doubt that makes much difference, but imho,its annoying

[vapid gorge]

then not reliable if you want it to always round up

[prisma kraken]

proof:

even more annoying is entering '40/3' to force it to highest precision math still results in the same

[frosty owl]

Considering that's not what I expect happens when I talk about "rounding", that's not surprising to me ^^

[vapid gorge]

no it's not, just means it's a better habit to tap it out in the %

[frosty owl]

I mean... It makes a difference where it should minimize/remove a difference... I think that's plenty annoying

[frosty owl]

If you don't follow the "numbers get rounded up only when equal or greater than 5" rule, that would be the case

[vapid gorge]

sure but might as well just use one method that idn't much different in any other way

[primal flicker]

Rates are rounded to 2 decimal places.
Clock % is rounded to 4.
So it's calculating clock speed from 13.33, no matter what you put in the rate block.

[prisma kraken]

kinda sorta dumb 😛

[primal flicker]

I'm not a coder or developer so I have to assume there's good reasons for it

[prisma kraken]

it all comes back to the 50 yr old C library function 'sscanf'

i'll pass on writing a lengthy diatribe about it all, but because very few standard library functions exist for dealing with floating point numbers, programmers use what's available to them quickly, and the functions for dealing with it all sorta suck

[primal flicker]

Either way, it's why I use the search bar calculator to come up with clock speeds.
100x(750/40/21)=89.2857...

[prisma kraken]

i find that if i enter the clock speed as a rational number, like in the case of concrete we've been talking about '4000/45', i get what i want

its an annoyance that you have to add the extra 2 zeros into what you mean to deal with percent conversion, but what can ya do?

[primal flicker]

Percent is essentially a unit conversion. But without it we'd be stuck with clock speeds like 0.8333 instead of 83.3333 and lose two orders of magnitude of precision.

[wheat tundra]

Are drones or trains cheaper for low rate mats?

[onyx perch]

trains just need power, drones constantly need batteries

but trains need HMF's

still cheaper in the long run

[wheat tundra]

Only need HMF to make the locos though. I don't know how much power is needed for drone batteries. But I know Drone stations consume a fair amount of power full time. But I guess so do train stations

[onyx perch]

yeah

trains will use 25 MW when not in use, so be careful of that

[median heath]

Power shouldn't be a factor in your decision-making.

[wheat tundra]

Power isn't really a problem in any case for me. I was just curious to know what other people figured out. Probably hard to figure out without a power tracker over time, and a setup on it's own grid, where you can switch between the two options. Sounds like a lot of work, so not sure anyone has done it. Although, I guess you can compute power without actually building stuff, by making some assumptions.

Drones are easier to do than trains, in my experience, as setting up rails over challenging terrain is time consuming. And drone ports don't take up much room, I just put them on top of factories

[primal flicker]

Odd question:

What do you think is the part that yeilds the most awesome sink points per building involved in production?

[wind spade]

no, it comes from limited float precision in computers. So devs are most likely saving clock speed as integer or decimal with 4 decimals accuracy, so that the calculations are fixed and deterministic

[primal flicker]

But why are rates limited to 2 decimals?

[wind spade]

they are not

game doesn't work on rates, it works on cycles

the displayed rate is rounded just for clarity, but the actual number is never used

[primal flicker]

Going back to moons example, if you put math in the rate block the answer is truncated to 2 decimal places, which results in the clock speed at 4 decimals being imprecise.

Now I wonder why we can't manually input cycle length as another option...

[wind spade]

that's... not how it works

if you put thing into the input rate, it calculates the clock % needed for that and saves only the clock %

(but it rounds the clock % needed to 4 decimals)

[primal flicker]

The example was concrete. Say you need 40/min from 3 constructors and you want equal production. You type "40/3" for the rate, and it returns 13.33 with clock speed of 88.8667 (accurate for exactly 13.33/15) instead of 88.8889 (accurate for 40/3)

[wind spade]

you should input it in the % thing tho, not in the rate thing

[primal flicker]

The point is that the rate block gets rounded, and affects the clock % proportionally to the two decimal limit.

Which is what moon was complaining about, and which is why I DO only manually input clock speed, unless the resultant rate is expressed cleanly with 2 decimal places or less.

Sometimes it really is easier to enter "102"

[median heath]

Me, wishing for the days when the rate block wasn't even there.

Better times.

[primal flicker]

Just leave it there but take away the direct input function from it.

[odd sand]

hey so I have a question, what were the ratios of miners mk1 to smelters depending on ore vein purity?

[oblique hollow]

depends on the ore type

Iron / Copper / Caterium / Quartz (not processed in smelters) ?

[odd sand]

my bad I forgot, iron and copper if possible

[wind spade]

open codex and check how much the recipes want 🙂

[oblique hollow]

the bottom 3 are available as info in the ingame codex

[vapid gorge]

!wikisearch miner

[brisk shore]

https://satisfactory.wiki.gg/index.php?search=miner

[vapid gorge]

you also have to deal with clocking and what belt speed you have - you can't go smelter to miner

[odd sand]

cool, thanks

[primal flicker]

I'm still curious what the answer is for this question: #math-and-meta message

[vapid gorge]

it's a weird question - prob need to fiddle with sftools and experiment

Its likely just the end phase 4 items though - they need a ton of processing and are the most valuable

[primal flicker]

They do, but also require a lot of machines due to complexity.
I was initially thinking about supercomputers, especially using silicon circuit boards, silicon HSCs, and crystal computers as intermediate steps..

[vapid gorge]

shrug maybe? but they are worth hundreds of thousands of points too

[primal flicker]

remembers that beta TOOLS exists
Huh.
Turbo motors, plus fabric as a byproduct. (It actually says resin, but it doesn't include the much more efficient current polymer fabric recipe. The rest is probably accurate enough.)

[primal flicker]

It turns into TPR once you max aluminum. Then ADS. But for anything below about 40M points/min, it's all turbomotors. Neat.

[vapid gorge]

@still notch what are you trying to build with that water piope?

[next grove]

Okay, so it's been a while since I last played, and I decided to start a new save for Update 8... iirc, you should always set the coal miners' clock speed to maximum for coal generator setups, right?

[vapid gorge]

you should set it to however much coal you want to use

also mining more than your belt can move is pointless

[primal flicker]

Generators are linear for power/fuel ratios. You don't get any more or less power from any kind of fuel by adjusting clock speed.
Just keep the ratio of generators and water extractors where it needs to be, and you'll be fine.

[whole kestrel]

!wikisearch nuclear

[brisk shore]

https://satisfactory.wiki.gg/index.php?search=nuclear

[next osprey]

Is there a tool to help with balancing conveyor belts? Specifically how to make it so the a certain number of parts go down each belt in a system? Need to feed fuel rods to reactors in an uneven distribution but only want to use 1 belt for each wing of the power plant.

[wind spade]

not really, since most people just use manifolds

for nuclear plants it's a nice 1:2 or 1:3 ratio depending on recipe iirc, so you can just hook the machines to power plants in ratio

[next osprey]

Ugh. I really should have worked this out on paper first.

[wind spade]

if you insist on balancing, pretty much everything is "split to something that's a multiple of 2 and/or 3 and route excess outputs back to input"

e.g. if you want to split to 7, you split to 8 (which is 2x2x2) and route one of the outputs back to input

[next osprey]

Well, I just found out that I've messed up anyway.

[rancid topaz]

anyone willing to take a gander at what this is?

[median heath]

A floating construction with no support.

[rancid topaz]

i guess you would be right

ill fix that later

hint: has something to do with screws

[onyx perch]

a screw factory

[rancid topaz]

cold

[onyx perch]

i have no idea what you would do with just screws and constructors

[median heath]

When you fix it and make my current guess false, I will guess again. 🙃

[rancid topaz]

its an input of 120 iron ore/min to a output of 480 screws/min

[onyx perch]

THATS A SCREW FACTORY

[rancid topaz]

no just the iron ore factory

or iron factory?

whatever

[median heath]

If it is making Screws, which you said it is, it is a Screw Factory.

[rancid topaz]

no it makes more than that, this whole factory will use most if not all the nodes on the map

that was just one node for the screws

but i guess you are right

its a mini screw factory

[wind spade]

obvious question I guess - why are you making screws? and why so many?

[onyx perch]

im making 430/min just to optimize everything else

[wind spade]

not sure what screws have to do with optimising other things 🤔

[onyx perch]

its so that i use all 1800 iron coming in from my full OC mk 2 drills and i dont have to worry about weird numbers

[rancid topaz]

i wasn't trying to, i was just testing out an idea with if i get an optimized 100% for every machine could i use it with the ore output/min

if that makes any sense

[wind spade]

better to make something more useful than screws I guess

[rancid topaz]

will do

planning to have this thing make the most complex stuff only made with iron here

[onyx perch]

yeah but i kept running out on my old save, and its a dedi server for multiple people so we need a lot

[wind spade]

screws are hardly needed at all

there's a finite amount needed for progression and then only thing that needs them is awesome shop, of which you build like one at most 😄

[rancid topaz]

yep

thats why im only making it for the essentials

but hey, it works!

[wind spade]

(and some equipment, which you usually not make a lot of anyway)

[rancid topaz]

love the surprise that came out of Crasher412 though🤣

[onyx perch]

how tf would i do this

also apparently im making 800 screws

430 rods

[wind spade]

don't merge them to 450

[onyx perch]

wait i didnt show the entire split

[wind spade]

merge 350 and 430 and 120 respectively

[onyx perch]

i have 6 belts with 150

[wind spade]

don't make 6 belts with 150, make 3 belts, one with 350, one with 430 and one with 120

[onyx perch]

thats the farthest back i can go, i can get the 120 with a MK2 but idk

[wind spade]

you can get it with merging to 120 (clock speed)

[onyx perch]

lowest i can go is 6 belts with 150, i can get the 120 with MK2 belts but how would i split up the rest?

wait im stupid i can just use overflow

[wind spade]

120 is 8 machines
350 is 23 machines + 1 machine at 33.3334%
430 is 28 machines + 1 machine at 66.6667%

[onyx perch]

i have 24 full OC machines making rods

[wind spade]

then you have to change clock on a few of them 🤷‍♂️

[onyx perch]

bruh

this is the setup#screenshots message

ill just use overflow and lower tier belts and see how it'll work, then ill try screwing with the machines

[wind spade]

120 is 3 machines at 250% + 1 machine at 50%
350 is 9 machines at 250% + 1 machine at 83.3334%
430 is 11 machines at 250% + 1 machine at 116.6667%

[rancid topaz]

ahh look at all you fooling round with your shennanigans

love to see it

[wind spade]

it's just [amount that you need] / [amount made by one machine] = [amount of machines needed]

[rancid topaz]

yep

that adds up

[onyx perch]

i changed the color to purple and my game crashed XD

[turbid elk]

I know its not a specific item, but is there a way to make a priority merger?

[rancid topaz]

smart merger?

[turbid elk]

The best I can figure is to use different speed input belts

Yeah basically. As in use one input over another

[wind spade]

there's not, and shouldn't really be needed anyway

what kind of situation requires it? 🤔

[oblique hollow]

likely there is a way to resolve your problem more easily without a priority merger

[turbid elk]

One of the main uses I can think of is the silica return from aluminum processing.

You can achieve an input priority with the water by using the fluid z levels, but for silica you have to sink the overflow instead of just prioritizing the return as input over the new supply.

[oblique hollow]

that is kind of misleading

[wind spade]

iirc the silica fits exactly into next processing step?

[oblique hollow]

ideally, you seperate the silica

you have a set amount of silica from the refineries, right?

just check how many foundries can be fed from that

[wind spade]

(and yeah, most feedback loops are best solved by not doing feedback loop)

[oblique hollow]

thet you feed that many foundries with it

and for water.... the best way to handle that is similar: keep it seperate

feed as much water as possible into however many machines you need to and then use other machines with fresh water

[turbid elk]

You can do exactly that with the water supply but not the belts, lol. Its not about what is the "best" just whether its possible.

[wind spade]

or put the "recycled" water into a completely different production line

[oblique hollow]

well it isnt possible with belts and you want a solution, dont you?

for the water, the feedback loop is not due to Z levels

nobody really knows how fluid priority works, just configurations that do prioritize for some reason

as for how to solve the water, this is my recommendation:

every recipe combo has a ratio of machines to it

most setups dont even need to be reconfigured a lot, just need to adjust the pipes and adjust clock speeds a bit

[oblique hollow]

yeah i know that this abomination exists

and it dont think its a great problem solver

[turbid elk]

It's great, and simplifies the build significantly, allowing it to just work without needing to layout specific ratios.

[oblique hollow]

I just dont like it

[median heath]

Hating the thing you wrote a book about.

Are you my father?

[oblique hollow]

Documentation and celebration are 2 different things

[turbid elk]

That's your problem. Does anyone else know if such system is possible with belt mergers

[median heath]

Ok dad...

[oblique hollow]

there is no way to make a 100% priority belt merger any easy way, only approaching 100%

[median heath]

Priority Mergers are never needed.

Mod if you want them.

[oblique hollow]

and thats just a shit ton of mergers

and, in any case, are NOT an easy solution

[onyx perch]

i love optimizing, then destroying my failures, then optimizing again, and destroying again :D ||D:||

[oblique hollow]

if we go by how easy it is, then not trying to make belt merger priority is the simplest solution compared to all the other alternatives

which is where it comes down to what we told you before: split the silica usage up

this is what the approximation looks like

something like 90% priority for one input

[turbid elk]

But it just relies on the belt speed ratios, yeah?

[oblique hollow]

nope

it relies on merging one belt over and over and over

compared to a single merge for the non-priority belt

mergers give equal priority to all input sides
if thats 3 sides, thats 33.33% for all sides

if you now split a belt into 2 and feed those outputs in at 2 sides of a megrer, thats 66.66% priority vs whatever else is connected to the third input

[onyx perch]

i did this and i dont even know how it works but it splits like this

[oblique hollow]

now you repeat that a shit ton and you approach 100%

but never truly reach 100%

[tired viper]

I can't see how to type in a valve. Any time I put any value, it's just jumps to whatever last number was.

[oblique hollow]

remember to press enter

after you typed in a value

[tired viper]

Obviously that's the problem, after intro it just changes the value.

😆

[oblique hollow]

do you simply type in a new value or do you mark and delete the old one?

also.... are we talking about like a 0.1 value change?

[tired viper]

Neither ways seems to work

[oblique hollow]

seems your valve doesnt like you

[tired viper]

It seems so

[oblique hollow]

yeet it then

[tired viper]

https://gyazo.com/7843f8eda278d8a1188db2fdee2e6cfd

[wind spade]

just don't use valves 😛

[tired viper]

But I want to :(

[wind spade]

they are not very reliable anyway

[tired viper]

If they work how I imagine they work

[onyx perch]

i did the thing in my own weird way and it works extremely well + looks good

with the splittrs

[wind spade]

valves have very limited amount of values that you can set and they usually require previous pipe to be full to work well anyway, so at that point the valve is pretty much pointless (and you want all pipes full as well 🙂 )

[oblique hollow]

yeah if it doesnt work remove it or restart the game

else: avoid it if you cant use it

[tired viper]

So If I want an specific amount of oil from a manifold pipe, it's better that I just make a separate "refinery section" for that?

[oblique hollow]

just wait for the pipe to fill up

the machines take what they need

if you build a machine array that takes more oil than you supply.... why even build those extra machines

[tired viper]

No, I'm builñding the exact amount i need