math-and-meta

[oblique hollow]

6 G 3 E is just a waste of water

you already have the capacity for 8 G, why not do it

[main atlas]

8G, oof

well i only have one coal miner producing 120

[dull widget]

Can somebody please tell me what I'm doing wrong

[oblique hollow]

8 G need 120 coal

[main atlas]

ah

[oblique hollow]

i thought we went over all this an hour ago

did you forget it?

[wind spade]

what's wrong with it?

[main atlas]

no lol i wasnt prepared to build 8G somehow, idk why

gotta move these then

[oblique hollow]

... is that a mk 1 belt feeding coal in on the right side?

[tropic beacon]

But you said youd do 8G, 4-4 jensbot?

[dull widget]

Pure coal with a mk1 for 120 - 2 splitter for 60 - 2 splitter for 4x30 - 4 splitter for 8x15. 8 coal generators taking 15 a piece. For some reason, they're not getting fed enough coal

[main atlas]

yep i forgot and started doing my old way

[wind spade]

do you have mk2 belt?

[main atlas]

somehow, idk

[dull widget]

All mk1

[wind spade]

well that can only do 60/min

[tropic beacon]

Mk2 has a throughput of 120/min

Mk1 is 60

[dull widget]

Ahhh

[wind spade]

(also, you can just put a row of splitters instead of what you did here, it's called a manifold)

!wikisearch manifold

[shadow prairie]

https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/Special:Search?query=manifold

[wind spade]

you can just keep what you have now, but it's good to know that manifolds exist and work

[oblique hollow]

eh, the splitting is fine

[wind spade]

because in the future, you may find them more useful

[dull widget]

Ahh, okie. Ty

[tropic beacon]

When you have the space to extend them, manifolds are easily scalable

[main atlas]

classic moment when you overflow the power grid

[dull widget]

Sweet stability

[main atlas]

so since this takes a lot of space up, where should i buy the next 8 gens?

[oblique hollow]

right next to them

you easily have space there

[tropic beacon]

G+G G+G
G+G G+G
G+G G+G
G+G G+G

[main atlas]

so just build in the center of the valley there?

[tropic beacon]

Yeah why not

[main atlas]

hmm i could build here if i remove the trees n stuff

[tropic beacon]

Even wirh them there you can build other buildings above them

[main atlas]

true but the poles are annoying

[rigid jay]

Hey guys how much product do you lose in General bringing material by Rail or Trucks. I have a ton of trains and I am supplying more raw material then my factory needs but they are struggling to keep up . Looking for suggestions for my problem

[wind spade]

you don't lose any?

if they are struggling to keep up, add more trucks/trains

[vapid gorge]

if they are struggling to keep up you haven't set up enough throughput for it all

Are you using buffers at your inbound and outbound train stations?

[rigid jay]

I am buffering everything

[wind spade]

industrial storage container connected to a platform with both belts?

[vapid gorge]

so at your train station you have something like 1x mk5 belt into an ISC and 2x mk5 belts into the platform?

[rigid jay]

No I am using MK 5 belts for everything

[wind spade]

that wasnt the question...

[frosty owl]

How are you judging that everything is "struggling to keep up"?
What are the "symptoms" you see?

[vapid gorge]

'Sushi Thruster' is awful xD

[wind spade]

do you have it set up like this when loading onto a train? and similarly for unloading? (arrows are belts)

[rigid jay]

I guess I need to look through my belting to machines again maybe I am bleeding over on one to another which is causing a platform to drain to much

[wind spade]

ISC = industrial storage container

[rigid jay]

but I have been at this for 2 weeks lol every time I stress test my factory trains can't keep up on a few materials

[frosty owl]

OR you just have enough buffers after the station to completely unload it

[frosty owl]

If items back up at the loading station, you either need more trains (for the same freights) or to distribute the load between more freights
(Assuming the items are NOT backing up at the unload too!)

[vapid gorge]

well the picture greeny shared is very valuable if you don't do this for outgoing and incoming parts

You need the 2 belts to make up for the down time while trains are loading/unloading items and belts don't move

[rigid jay]

No I am using a double station so when station is being loaded , the other station is running

[wind spade]

for unloading as well?

[vapid gorge]

I'm not sure what you mean by that. It'd probably be a lot easier if you shared over head shots of your set ups at both ends

[frosty owl]

What I said applies to each freight of each station

[rigid jay]

Just for unloading

[vapid gorge]

show where they are going underground

[rigid jay]

The buffers are underneath both stations ore feeding the same buffer

[frosty owl]

With ISCs below I assume, right?

[vapid gorge]

are the 2 belts feeding 1 ISC that has 1 belt going out of it?

[rigid jay]

They come down get merged and go into a buffer

[vapid gorge]

it looks like these 2 belts from different stations are merging on the left?

[rigid jay]

Yeah this is the top

The trains are running the same route to collect material

[vapid gorge]

ok but if you merge 2 belts coming out of the platforms you're cutting each belt throughput in 1/2

[rigid jay]

I have 2 trains on each station total of 4 trains bringing product in

Yep , I only need 1560 going in to a buffer and coming out of a buffer

[vapid gorge]

ok but in the picture I replied to I circled 2 belts that look like the belts are merged before they go to an ISC?

[main atlas]

guys how should i automate copper i got 4 smelters

[rigid jay]

Yes, each belt is the same, I do this so when the station pauses I get product from the other station so there is no pause entering the buffer it's always at 1560

[main atlas]

like, i need those copper plating and stuff

[rigid jay]

I am wondering if you lose out on material using trains

[vapid gorge]

no you just haven't set up your buffers right

[rigid jay]

example a mine is producing 780 and you move that by rail, do you not get the whole 780

[vapid gorge]

from the train platforms have the 2 belts go directly into the ISC w/o any merges and then have 1 belt out of it.

[rigid jay]

In my set up for example 3 quartz buffers have 1200 going in and I am using 1200 out so I think maybe I am feeding to much with one belt which is causing the shortage. I just wanted to make sure trains bring product quick enough lol ,

[vapid gorge]

are you merging all these belts together or something?

[rigid jay]

at the bottom yes, so this way the buffer always stays at a constant speed when trains dock.

[vapid gorge]

so you're trying to merge 1200 parts per minute onto 1 belt?

[frosty owl]

There is no item loss (or duplication) in the current game in its entirety 👍

[vapid gorge]

So I think you probably have several issues on hand but I’m going to bed.

Am easy solution is to set it up so you have two platforms each having a belt of 600 ppm feeding it like this

[rigid jay]

Thanks , I look at my game plain again

[vapid gorge]

P is train platforms

[frosty owl]

Have you tried/considered adding more trains serving the same stations yet?

[rigid jay]

I have 2 trains on each station so 4 total

[vapid gorge]

It vaguely sounds like you’re someone who tries to merge all the things together before trying to send it somewhere?
I don’t personally recommend doing that - it takes a LOT of planning and sorting and doesn’t really benefit you

[frosty owl]

Not knowing the distance, I cannot say wether 2 are enough or not, so I point you back to my question.

If the items back up at the loading station(s) leaving the unloading stations to starve, it means that the train(s) serving that station aren't enough

(It could also mean that you're trying to put too many items/min in a single freight, but since it's 600x2 that is clearly not the case)

[abstract stirrup]

Train max consumption should be 110 MW everytime right?

That’s so much

[main atlas]

First time above the 1000MW lol

stable power

[sharp lion]

Congrats!

[main atlas]

thanksss

i still need to automate copper 💀 Anyone got tips?

[vast jungle]

Just look at the default ratios, copper is very straight forward...

[main atlas]

well i meant in terms of space

took me a full day to get this sorted out

[vast jungle]

If you need more space y just build more foundations

It's more a matter of how much copper you want to process

[main atlas]

i know but i mean how im supposed to build something good

[vast jungle]

Worry about build anything to get done resources... You can improve our just add a second factory later

My first few attempts always look chaotic too 😉

[mystic moon]

For an early save, that actually looks very good

The biggest recommendation that I can give you to improve your aesthetics is to

1. Make a custom color palate
2. Anything that's floating will immediately look much better with some sort of support

[fierce ruin]

would a factory making 7.50 HMF/minute be sufficient for some time (im at phase 3) or should i consider making a more efficient one instead?

[magic island]

that should be plenty

[crystal venture]

I finished phase 3 with 5 per minute

and I still have more than I can use in phase 4

[fierce ruin]

alright then, thanks guys

[crystal venture]

(soon to not be the case)

[opaque oak]

So going to need 530 Assemblers, 84 Blenders, 207 Constructors, 47 Foundries, 260 Manufacturers, 26 Particle Accelerators, 489 Refineries and 17 Smelters for the Fuel Rod production and Waste handling...

[cold jasper]

overclock

[opaque oak]

Will look at the actual implementation tomorrow.

And I'm starting with just producing 2.4/min fuel rods and storing waste. Just have to try to do floor plan for the whole thing first.

First row of 12 reactors on separate system for restart purposes and 20 other rows as larger block(s).

1GW emergency coal plant with stored water and coal (or start with burner, in planning stages), 600m^3 oil turbofuel plant that can be started in stages from empty with that coal plant, then smaller nuclear plant that can be started from zero with the turbofuel plant and that can be then used to start rest of the nuclear plant.

[cold jasper]

You are a very plan intensive person...

I'm kind of jealous

[opaque oak]

Mocking up the power plant area. Rails are temporary. Right edge is ready with single row of 12 reactors, their water and then the 4+4 manufacturers and 3 drone ports in the south end building for the uranium stages.

Space reservation for producing the items necessary for the final assembler stages of uranium fuel rods.
Will probably do the radioactive stages of the water processing east of the power plants, and again supporting stuff to the south.

[cold jasper]

❤️

[opaque oak]

Older screenshot with some of the work on the building outside still to be done.

[opaque oak]

And yes, my factories are still just boxes. Want more than just foundations in the air but quick enough to get something done.
Concrete walls for utility spaces and normal walls for production machine floors.

[abstract stirrup]

cave entrances on this side of the map?

[leaden depot]

I need to evenly split 10 full pipes into 14 output pipes. I don't feel super confident this is enough:

is there a better way?

definitely a bottle neck on the ends, I need to connect to the outside as well, but aside from that...

[sharp lion]

Could make it 5/7 idk i hate pipes

[cold jasper]

You have 2 rows of junctions, extend the bottom one to be the same length as the top one

[leaden depot]

yeah, 5/7 is simpler

[abstract stirrup]

Guys how can a dog help me to generate slugs??

[cold jasper]

Yeah, but if the 10 pipes are full, you can't merge them

[abstract stirrup]

Strange question but apparently is possible

[cold jasper]

Just check the inventory from time to time

[abstract stirrup]

Omg lol

[cold jasper]

Just beware, nuclear waste

[abstract stirrup]

Haha I’m not that kind of person

I kill them instantly instead

😅

[leaden depot]

This feels better: testing throughput with magic machines

[cold jasper]

Why are there conveyor lifts with pipes?

[sharp lion]

Conveyor lifts pipes??

[leaden depot]

that's magic machines mod

[sharp lion]

Looks cool tho haha

[leaden depot]

gives me constant output to test

I hate pipes so much. I wish they'd average the throughput over a longer window

[neon wraith]

For MAX plastic production, is it still Crude Oil => Heavy Oil Residue, to Residual Rubber to Recycled Plastic?

[leaden depot]

with diluted fuel in the mix to make a recycling loop

residual plastic -> recycled rubber -> recycled plastic * 2

then take output from the overflow of plastic

[neon wraith]

ohhh

I'm trying to design a set up for a Max 600 input of crude oil, but I think a lot of my old math is now wrong

[leaden depot]

this is a bit long, but he explains the ratios well: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p1EsyGnT0IY

[neon wraith]

cool, thank yo umuch

that hasn't change since update 5?

[leaden depot]

from the plumbing manual, I think this is the best 5:7 pipe balancer:

[leaden depot]

no, the recipes still are good

[neon wraith]

cool thank you

[abstract stirrup]

How do I tame a dog

I’m being stupid

[neon wraith]

drop a berry in front of it

[cobalt meteor]

there should really not be a need for a pipe balancer that’s just not how pipes work

try a manifold with some injecting instead, i think that’ll produce better results

[wind spade]

remove one line of junctions, remove valves. Works nicely

[wind spade]

best pipe balancer is no pipe balancer

[magic island]

if 5 pipes can hold it all, you didn't need 7 to begin with

[leaden depot]

My factory has 14 lines, each needing ~430 oil, and tuned that way to keep later products under a full pipe.

So total consumption is 5 pipes, but I need to distribute it.

I think I have a simpler method sort of working, but I need to test more

[vapid gorge]

you don't is the main thing, pipes self balance so this will not evenly split and may cause flow issues

[vapid gorge]

omg, don't do whatever this is, especially not with valves

why do you hate yourself?

[wind spade]

the only method that you should be using is "connect everything with single pipe"

don't ever try to balance pipes, it doesn't work

[leaden depot]

Well I’m in too deep now. Gonna have to make it work.

Just connecting everything is not so simple since I gotta make sure no single junction exceeds capacity.

[wind spade]

well first question is if you even need to connect everything

if you need X pipes, just produce X pipes

[vapid gorge]

that's why you don't have unnescesary merging and splitting with pipes.

And you could just not connect and split them, it would take less space

Just remember - if you care about not having a stuttering production line you're going to have to tear all this down anyway

[leaden depot]

All this is because my spreadsheet it was wrong. Each pipe needs more than the 300 I thought they would

And I spent way too long building circles to re-organize that now

So I’ve never said this before, but I think I’m gonna have to bail my self out with packagers

[vapid gorge]

Look, I can't see your whole set up but you're just digging yourself further into a hole it sounds like. Seems like it would be simpler if you just tore out the pipes and clocked your machines differently

[leaden depot]

I’ll share more pics later

[vapid gorge]

oh shit - is your solution to 'load balance' pipes by puting them in packagers and unpackagers?

[leaden depot]

Hehe. Haven’t resorted to that yet. But I’ll take splitter math over pipe math any day

[vapid gorge]

You don't even need to do that.
How much do you need in each pipe at the end?

and what recipe are you using?

[leaden depot]

I need 14 pipes of 425

[wind spade]

that's weird, I don't recall a recipe that needs 425

[leaden depot]

Each one turns into just under 600 turbo fuel

[wind spade]

eh turbofuel 🤢

go nuclear if you need this much power

[vapid gorge]

ok so have a group of refineries clocked and merged to produce 425 fluid and only have those connect to a pipe.
Boom. Done.

If you want simplicity in fluids, which will save you head aches, have systems that produce X fluid to the next system that uses X fluid.

[leaden depot]

That is all the turbo fuel I can make, Out of the sulfur left over from making all the nukes possible

I am away from my computer, I’ll share more details if I can’t get it going tomorrow

[wind spade]

why do you make turbofuel if you have nukes

[leaden depot]

There is no why. More power!

[wind spade]

More power is aplicable when you have something to use it for

Nuclear gives you enough power to run basically anything

[vapid gorge]

Eh, if someone’s production goal is ‘all the power’ why not?

Sounds kinda fun xD

[fluid heath]

guys how tf do i make 30 per min go to 24 per min with splitters

is it possible

[leaden depot]

split into 5 lines of 6 and merge 4 together?

[fluid heath]

but

splitters split in 2 or 3

[leaden depot]

split into 6 and merge one back into start

thats a 5 way splitter

[fluid heath]

ok

so split into 6 and get 4?

[leaden depot]

what are you gonna do with the other 6 items / min?

[fluid heath]

idk put em back in storage probably

[vapid gorge]

Don’t bother then?If your line only uses 24 then anything over will fill storage

[fluid heath]

but

i need overflow so smart splitters?

[leaden depot]

I've used smart splitters to move excess to storage, but at that volume, just let it back up, or produce less

[vapid gorge]

Meh, if you wait your storage will fill and it’ll balance

[fluid heath]

ur 5 lines did not work

[vapid gorge]

Tbh early on I just have an over flow container for every part. All your machines will eventually back up anyway

[leaden depot]

https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/Tutorial:Prime_splitter_arrays#1/5th_Splitter

[fluid heath]

oh wait i think i did something wrong

[patent dirge]

can someone help me with a question related to liquid flow, and how bad back flow can cripple a production line

[mystic moon]

dontasktoask.com

But probably yes

[patent dirge]

thanks pal, coulda just said use valves

[barren elm]

Valves are weird

Use unpowered pumps instead

[vapid gorge]

There are few times valves are needed. Most of the time they screw up flow

[mystic moon]

Yeah, I would reccomend agains valves unless you know exactly what you're doing

Same with buffers

[oblique hollow]

no, powered pumps

Unpowered is always a bad idea

Having 0 head lift on the other side is bad

[heavy gust]

Am i just dumb or are trucks just not worth it? By the time it takes me to setup a highway for the trucks, record the track and build the stations i would be done just putting down a belt highway with blueprints.

wich has better throughput and wont get stuck on corners

[vapid gorge]

Lots of belts everywhere can be ugly
Higher use of computer resources
Throughput loss on belts

[heavy gust]

yeah but why does setting up trucks be such a pain

pretty sure ill just skip to trains

those at least "just work"

[vapid gorge]

I avoid the issue by having bases use local resources for the most part and run extra belts as needed under train lines

[vapid gorge]

My brother in production, have you met trains?

[heavy gust]

once in my first world yes

but that was wayyy easier than trucks

worst part is that i cant edit the track once its there. (only being able to delete a mark doesnt count)

[vapid gorge]

Can only imagine it’s easier if you sloppily lay down tracks on ground with 1 train going back and forth

[heavy gust]

yeah thats what i had

and thats only what i need atm

[vapid gorge]

If you’re that low tier don’t bother with blueprints. Just slap down a few sloppy belts to unlock tech

[heavy gust]

im close to finishing tier 5 and 6

[vapid gorge]

Ehhh depends when you’re comfy having infrastructure you don’t think will change. Tier 7 and 8 changes things considerably

[vapid gorge]

Though to be fair you could do some proper train infrastructure and just expand it later

[heavy gust]

anything but trucks

first time i touched them, and never again

but ill do belts for now. Only need to move 300 rubber, and 300 plastic and some fuel

[oblique hollow]

@gleaming plank

depends on your recipes, but if you use normal recipes its the top left image

[gleaming plank]

ok ill try this, thx

[vast jungle]

Interesting... I use sloppy+normal, but I use 3 refineries, not six. A 40%/60% split sloppy aluminium and a 100% normal scrap refinery

[oblique hollow]

that works too of course

the images dont depict smalles scale

just the general ratio in sorta whole numbers

for every refinery. making solution, you need 1.5 to recycle

40 * 1.5 is 60

[vast jungle]

Still I like to add a fluid priority merger to prevent this thing to overload itself

[oblique hollow]

so that is exactly this

[oblique hollow]

it physically cannot

i tested these setups

they are just as stable as stuff that uses a VIP

[vast jungle]

I had trouble when the output of the loop is blocked

[oblique hollow]

the water output?

[vast jungle]

No, the scrap output

[oblique hollow]

when that one stalls the recycling refinery stalls too after a while

[vast jungle]

The freshwater fueled seemed to produce additional liquid, which clogged the inner loop to the point where it could not run anymore

[oblique hollow]

you just run full of solution

and yeah, even with vips you can clog the alumina lines

but the machine idle times. should resolve that

[vast jungle]

Liquid feedback can be a pain 😁😭

[oblique hollow]

its only the middle alumina section thats an issue, but it sorts itself out

just needs a few minutes

[vast jungle]

Most important thing is the damned new factory works reliably 😉

But"now" I have to extend my electronics production as preparation for some tier 7/8 items... Old factory only produces small amounts of everything, so I need a new extendible design. Maybe time to get back into blueprints...

[opaque oak]

So a six uranium waste processing lines per 5 rows of power plants...

Ah, and that leaves the first row to have complete processing line for itself \o/

Two lines.

21 rows of power plants with 12 reactors each.

Packages really nicely for single processing cell.

[heavy gust]

If i have the diluted fuel recipe and heavy oil residue can i just do this: 600 Oil -> 800 Residue -> 1600 fuel.

[opaque oak]

Yes.

And that is the basis for later game power setups running on oil and plastic and rubber production.

Multiplying what you can get out of each m^3 of crude oil.

[heavy gust]

i thought nuclear power would take care of that

didnt get that far yet

[opaque oak]

Power setups running on oil.

like the line says.

I personally have 600m^3 of crude to turbofuel to generators as middle plant between coal and nuclear I'm building now.
Some people never build nuclear and just run lot of crude to fuel or turbofuel.

via that multiplier combo.

[oblique hollow]

those people usually cant be bothered by or hate nuclear

[heavy gust]

ah i forgor turbofuel exists

[noble current]

Did they fixed the max throughput issue for pipes? If I recall correctly, there was an issue with the mk2 pipes managing the full 600m³/min didn't they?

[snow dove]

don’t think so

[opaque oak]

Depends on your piping basically. Simple ones can do full throughput currently. Even if it is 3km long pipe.

Or at least that one can do 599.4 that I need from it with current clocks.

3km long pipe coming from extractor and doing U under the refineries, with junction below each refinery and pipe feeding up through pipe floor hole and into the refinery.

So doing everything wrong.

Need to work on the overclocks to get closer to max once first bank of nuclear is online.

[oblique hollow]

its a mixed thing

if it works it works, great, but if it fails then thats that

[oblique hollow]

Best i got is a 10 km pipe doing 600/min

[frosty owl]

Is this interesting?

Some math about recycling loops calculated based on a specific rubber or plastic output:
P is Product/min desired (either plastic or rubber)
B is the Product/min (part of T) needed to be recycled
T is the total amount of Product that needs to be produced) excluding Res)
R is the "counter-Product" needed to be produced to feed the refineries making Product
"Res" is "Residual Rubber", which is the recipe with the best conversion for Polymer Resin (the Plastic version takes double the Resin for the same output). Polymer Resin equals 1/8 of the Fuel aviable, as 3 Oil = 2 Polymer Resin + 4 H.O.R. (= 8 Fuel).

PLASTIC

T = (34/27)P
Res = (1/9)P = (1/8)F
B = T-P = (7/27)P
R = (1/2)T - Res = ((34/27)/2)P - (1/9)P = ((17/27) - (3/27))P = (14/27)P = 2B
F = (1/2)T + (1/2)R = (17/27)P + (7/27)P = (24/27)P = (8/9)P

RUBBER

T = (32/27)P
Res = (1/9)P = (1/8)F
B = T - P + Res = ((32 - 27 + 3)/27)P = (8/27)P = (1/4)T
R = 2B = (1/2)T = (16/27)P
F = (1/2)T + (1/2)R = (17/27)P + (7/27)P = (24/27)P = (8/9)P

​

540 Plastic/min example (P = 540 Plastic/min)

T = 540x34/27 = 680

Res = 60

B = 680-540 = 140

R = 140x2 = 280

F = 540x8/9 = 480

540 Rubber/min example (P = 540 Rubber/min)

T = 540x32/27 = 640

Res = 540/9 = 60

B = 540*8/27 = 640/4 = 160

R = 160x2 = 320

F = 540x8/9 = 480

Given a Fuel amount of 480/min and Residual Rubber of 60/min, we can extrapolate from either that this project would take 480/2/4x3 = 60x2/2x3 = 180 Oil/min for both examples.

[wind spade]

this is known already, with correct recipes you can convert 1 oil into 3 plastic or 3 rubber.

[oblique hollow]

i got an excel calc doing all this already

i even had the math written down at one point

[frosty owl]

1->3 is very well known
It's the breakdown and ratios between output and intermediate products that is the focus though

[frosty owl]

Someone made a post today about this on Reddit, it might be worth linking it there

[wind spade]

isn't it always "convert everything to diluted fuel, PR into rubber and then into plastic/rubber loop"?

[neon wraith]

For Max Crude Oil Use is my Math Right? 81 Refineries and 16 Blenders?

[frosty owl]

It's specifically with numbers tuned to get "Max rubber" or "max plastic" making use of Residual Rubber (the number and clocks of machines follow accordingly)

[neon wraith]

Lol I see I just joined same convo lol

So my math is right 1 oil into 3 Rubber/plastic

I'm trying to figure out if it's possible to make it more compact? Or a Single 600 pipe will need 81 Refineries and 16 Blendors?

[oblique hollow]

I do NOT remember where the bottom 11.25 thing comes from

[neon wraith]

I was just trying to figure that out

I think my Math is 100%

[oblique hollow]

aaah its Crude / 11.25

[neon wraith]

so 600 Crude = 81 Ref / 16 Blend

[oblique hollow]

it was a mistake

[neon wraith]

hmm that would put it at 53.33 Refine for 600 crude?

[oblique hollow]

ideally i guess

[wind spade]

83.333

[oblique hollow]

thats the number of refineries for rubber and plastic

the 53.3333

[wind spade]

unless you mean just refineries for recycled

[oblique hollow]

yeah just recycling

[frosty owl]

Is step 4 (and similar steps) made up of 10 refineries at 66.6666% or 7 refineries?
Because if you planned for ten, you can already cut down the numbers there

[oblique hollow]

this sheet specifically takes in oil and spits out the entire math for 50/50 rubber plastic

thats it thats the math

when you substitute and simplify:

[abstract stirrup]

Anybody has all the possible recipes for computers?

I wanna see if it’s worth to go around and find some more hard drives

[wind spade]

just for computers?

here https://u6.satisfactorytools.com/codex/items/computer

[neon wraith]

Yea I can def do that twice

[neon wraith]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/14nrZB3mwtmYEkgayibFlrlJnZpW_77jI5dJsasB6Dx4/edit?usp=sharing

Yea I did the math wrong before, It was 91 Refineries.

So I got 85 Ref and 16 Blend for a perfect 600 Crude oil to Plastic

I now understand what he Ment by 53.333 Refineries fore 600 Crude

That's the amount you need to burn the 1600 fuel

[fluid hornet]

what's the most efficient setup for plastic and rubber?

[neon wraith]

You'll still need the others tho

I believe so according to my math.

[fluid hornet]

does this still work?

[snow dove]

holy that’s a lot

[fluid hornet]

that's 300 crude to 900 plastic or 900 rubber depending on what recipe you use

[wind spade]

yeah, it's still the same

[neon wraith]

yep

[fluid hornet]

ok

[neon wraith]

just half of what I did

I think doing the full 600 saves on like 1 Ref

[wind spade]

it shouldn't

unless you count underclocked refinery as 1

[neon wraith]

yea i think you save one underclocked

Now trying to figure out how to create this in a nice package

[wind spade]

it's double refineries no matter what. Just the amount of physical buildings may be different. But it's hard to say that, as you can clock them at any speed, which saves/adds refineries

[neon wraith]

for a 600 set up, the lowest i think I can go is 85

[oblique hollow]

if you do blenders you save refineries

[neon wraith]

still 85 Ref and 16 Blend for 600

[oblique hollow]

600 with blenders should drop all refineries for fuel, and 1600 fuel is like 30 refineries

[neon wraith]

is what I have. 30 to start, then 55 Ref to burn the 1600 fuel

[oblique hollow]

30?

[neon wraith]

55, because a 3 are underclocked

[oblique hollow]

why not 20

you only need 20 for 600 oil for heavy oil

[neon wraith]

20 to make crude into heavy

10 to make the polymer into the initial rubber.

[wind spade]

unless you overclock 🤷‍♂️

[neon wraith]

true, but all my slugs are in nuclear, so I do everything @ 100% except for extractors

[oblique hollow]

BPD inventory before i load a blueprint.....

the BP i load....

the BPD inventory after i loaded it

this is very dumb and also funny

[wind spade]

does it disassemble the items into intermediates? 🤔

[oblique hollow]

no

[wind spade]

or what

[oblique hollow]

it just consumes all relevant stacks

regardless of BP cost

"oh this costs motors? 20? nah, all motors"

and it refunds only 20

[wind spade]

well now we can sink items without sink

[cold jasper]

Not all

Something like leaves might not work

[wind spade]

those you sink in trash can

[oblique hollow]

make a BP with a biomass burner with leaves in it

wait... does this work with nuclear waste? 👀

[wind spade]

https://tenor.com/view/monsters-inc-mr-waternoose-stop-him-after-him-get-him-gif-21483674

[cold jasper]

We can post gifs?

[wind spade]

why couldn't we?

[oblique hollow]

lets see....

[cold jasper]

I thought I saw some conversation about only mods being able to or something

[cold jasper]

You should make it need 1

[oblique hollow]

LMAO.

WASTE BE GONE

[cold jasper]

All hail the CUBE

I can't write cube with letters

It just turns into 🇨🇺🇧🇪

🇨 🇺 🇧 🇪

[oblique hollow]

https://questions.satisfactorygame.com/post/639b7c9cca608e080352969e
heres the relevant QA post again

[glacial hemlock]

That's a brilliant way to delete uranium wastes

[oblique hollow]

abuse it while you still can

[oblique hollow]

also plutonium waste 👀

[main atlas]

How can i make this go up faster cuz downwards its going like light speed

[wind spade]

well downwards gravity is helping you, upwards it's against you

[main atlas]

yes but how do i make it go faster

i saw rocket boost and stuff but it doesnt work for me

[wind spade]

you need higher entry speed

[main atlas]

and how do i get that

[snow dove]

the cannon

[wind spade]

any way of improving your character speed 🤷‍♂️ blade runners, whatever

[main atlas]

i already got blade runners..

[snow dove]

i recommend using a hypertube cannon

[main atlas]

doesnt make it go up faster

well how do i make a cannon

[snow dove]

though it's going to increase your speed of exit too

one sec i'll show you an example

[main atlas]

doesnt matter that it goes faster on exit

walls are there for a reason xd

[wind spade]

it's abuse of unintended game mechanic, you put several entrances after each other

[main atlas]

i tried making entrance logic but it doesnt want to power up

[snow dove]

Ends up looking like this

[main atlas]

that makes them go both ways? how tf

[snow dove]

oh one sec i'll make a better example

first you make something similar to this

then you add entrances to every available part

[main atlas]

ye

[snow dove]

oh my lord they changed hypertube entrance hitboxes to be hard hitboxes

[main atlas]

?

[snow dove]

it'll look something like this when done

oh yeah, they made hypertube entrances hard hitboxes instead of soft

[main atlas]

;/

[main atlas]

i cant get them closer also the speed is gone within a second of being in the tube

[snow dove]

one moment i'm experimenting to try to replicate your setup

it does appear they nerfed hypertube cannons a bit

[wind spade]

finally

[snow dove]

not majorly, but i'd say it's about a 1/2 decrease in boost

(not an exact number by any means)

[main atlas]

this pushed me up to 1/3rd of the thing ;/

[snow dove]

idk how you pulled that off ngl. there should be some tube inbetween those entrances

[main atlas]

it doesnt work

i cant put one inbetween, space issue

[snow dove]

do it just like that example

with a two snap point's worth of tube between entrances

[main atlas]

i did use 2 snap points

[cold jasper]

You don't need both side having hyper entrances, and then you can make them closer

[snow dove]

at minimum one snap point here

[main atlas]

you do, it doesnt work otherwise

[snow dove]

i've gotten stuck a handful of times without the second entrance

[main atlas]

oh didnt see that

[cold jasper]

Delete the stand

The tube itself still works

[wind spade]

also why you have yellow lights on them?

[snow dove]

i believe dan meant this entrance to be specific

[snow dove]

seems to be far lesser upon further review

[main atlas]

this?

[cold jasper]

👍

[main atlas]

nope

i get stuck

[wind spade]

it seems that it needs to be entrance-pipe-entrance-gap-repat

the pipe connected to both entrances

[cold jasper]

Place the stands first, and then place them like this {stand} {gap} {stand} {stand} {gap} {stand}

And then connect the stands

[snow dove]

upon even further review, they didn't nerf the speed boost, they just changed the soft hitboxes of entrances to hard hitboxes.

[cold jasper]

But not the ones with the gap

Then place entrances in the directon you need to go

[snow dove]

this is what happens when you accidentally add a new independent variable and then assume that the dependent variable changed because of the original independent variable and not the one you accidentally added

[main atlas]

nope appearently not

even boosts worse now than the first one

[snow dove]

okay i'm gonna spend some time beautifying my train network, cya!

[snow dove]

and trying to get over a headache i've had for the last 35 hours

[main atlas]

guess itll be a slow elevator then

god this takes forever

[cold jasper]

Add more segments to the cannon

The more segments, the faster it goes, though the first 13 don't seem to change, it suddenly takes off in speed

[main atlas]

yeah idk how thats supposed to work with the space i got

[pulsar edge]

riddle me this, batman

if i have 4 fully maxxed pipes

like each with 600 water per min, for certain

that should be able to power (with some balancing)

10 nuclear reactors

because each one takes 240

*10 is 2400

600*4 is 2400

right?!

[mental basalt]

yes

[pulsar edge]

ok

must be one of my other nuclear plants that's making my production graph bumpier than a pubescent teen's forehead

[noble current]

But can we sink nuclear that way?

[cold jasper]

Just that they said it could sink everything, and I realize leaves also do work

[noble current]

Nice, so we can finally waste?

[oblique hollow]

yes

[oblique hollow]

#math-and-meta message
see this and the messages below that

[neon wraith]

Man, I'm almost done building out my 600 Crude to 1800 plastic/rubber....

I got it pretty clean and compact too.

[sonic palm]

Just a real quick question : is it better to use packeted diluted fuel then unpack or to just use blenders and create diluted fuel. I am pretty sure they use the same amount of crude and output the same but just asking cause I am quite new with fuel power.

[wind spade]

it's the same in terms of crude oil -> fuel. Depends if you have blenders or not, with blenders it's simpler, but they are also later in the tech tree. So if you don't have blenders, just go with the packaged loop

[sonic palm]

Alright thanks

[glossy aspen]

whats every radioactive item

[wind spade]

pretty much anything with Uranium or Plutonium in name

[glossy aspen]

anything else?

[wind spade]

well uranium nodes and deposits are radioactive as well, but those are not items

[mystic moon]

And also have uranium in the name

[steady dome]

Given a freight platform with two different kinds of items stored in equal amounts, let's say copper and iron (ingots). How do you best extract the two items from the platform so that they both have the same constant throughput?

I tried using a smart splitter that splits the input belt in two belts, one for each item type. But since the platform's content is 'sorted' (first half is full with copper, the other half full with iron), the belt first extracts all the copper and then all the iron. Therefore they don't both have the same constant throughput.

Ideally, each item type's belt would get 1 item alternatingly. Hence both have the same constant throughput.

[glacial hemlock]

Also blender itself is quite difficult to unlock / build without gathering the necessary high tier components.

[opaque oak]

Not possible. You will always get full stack of one type at a time. And next stack type will be semi-random.

Just use two train cars and platforms.

[glacial hemlock]

Impossible. Don't mix.

Your idea is only be possible in factorio.

[steady dome]

Well, I don't really have the space for two, so I guess I'll build 2 containers as buffers.

Generally, I'd also just go for multiple platforms.

[vapid gorge]

if you have the belt throughput and train throughput for it why does it mater?

Just have a sorter on the other end

Have a reasonable buffer at the destination with a sorter and a sink for overflow if the destination sorted buffer gets full

[steady dome]

I'm talking about the destination. I'm basically using that system but it's not working. At least not the way I built it (there's also no buffer yet).

[vapid gorge]

well it would absolutely only work with a buffer system and sink.

So do the regular 2 belts from platform to ISC
1 belt out of ISC to a spliter for the items to go to their personal buffers.

Have over flow on both those belts go to a sink. Depending on your usage you may need a dedicated sink for both - but you'd have to gauge that from your set up

[glacial hemlock]

For space issue you can either relocate the station elsewhere, or lift up the entire station to upper floor.

[opaque oak]

Or just the third output on the sorting smart splitter going to the sink?

Platform -> unload buffer -> smart splitter -> 2x sorted ISC and 1x sink.

[vapid gorge]

....yesssss? I can't think of any downsides off the top of my head for 1 sink

[opaque oak]

Only works for two items.

[steady dome]

That's my setup, doesn't work.

[vapid gorge]

True

[opaque oak]

You need those buffer ISC:s downstream from the smart splitter, and they need to be full when you start the system up.

That you were thinking of adding.

[steady dome]

It first extracts the copper, then the copper belt is full and goes into the overflow. And once the copper is gone, the same happens with the iron.

[opaque oak]

You will lose parts of the first new loads coming in, but it will stabilize with the downstream buffers alternating between almost full and closer to empty.

[vapid gorge]

You have this?

[opaque oak]

That is how I understood, without even that single ISC atm.

[steady dome]

Yes, well, without the buffer but I don't need many per minute.

[opaque oak]

So need to add that first buffer ISC, and then a ISC on each of the outgoing lines to left and right of the smart splitter.

[vapid gorge]

the first ISC? You need the ISC there to make up for the lost load time from the train station

[steady dome]

Oh, yeah, right.
Nonetheless, the issue with the smart splitter still persists. So I probably need those two buffers for the respective items.

[opaque oak]

Yes, because even if the belts bringing items to the loading train station, you end up with 100 of each item being output at time at the unloading station. Then switching to the other item.

So you need to buffers after the smart splitter to even that out.

[steady dome]

Worse than that, they're sorted.

[opaque oak]

And if the loading isn't even, then you get longer times of one item.

[vapid gorge]

You could always have 2 sorting belts coming out of the first ISC?

[opaque oak]

Yeah, so the unloading will then output all of one type before the other.

[vapid gorge]

but shouldn't be needed once your processing evens out the flow

[steady dome]

What difference would that make? Isn't that only relevant for a higher throughput?

[opaque oak]

Yeah, ISC is bigger than a train car or the platform.

[vapid gorge]

it would just get through the sorting to the other item type stacks faster

but like I said - once you have your consumption machiens using product and have the buffers post SS filled it won't make a dif

[shy mist]

i m going to tier 8 and 7 some tips do you have?

[vapid gorge]

There’s good bauxite alts? It’s a vague question

[opaque oak]

Sloppy + Electrode + Pure \o/ (unless you need more than that can provide, or want to use Coal instead of Coke)

And so on.

[oblique hollow]

Instant Scrap for that compact aluminum setup

[fluid heath]

Wet concrete is good right?

[snow dove]

good way to rid yourself of water

so yeah it’s useful

[fluid heath]

Since it’s unlimited

[snow dove]

i meant more so for dealing with water you have as a byproduct

not sure how good it is for actually making concrete tho

[wind spade]

depends what is your definition of good
it is more complex and needs fluid input and more power, but produces more concrete per limestone

[arctic willow]

it produces double the concrete... but ultimately limestone is fairly abundant throughout the map; i can't think of too many scenarios where a concrete shortage is going to be a constraint on a build
maybe i'd consider using it for production if there happened to be water nearby but usually it's best used as an easy water disposal (as mentioned already 😃 )

[vapid gorge]

I find it useful to not have to bring in extra concrete for some large factories and not have to import it - and the recipe produces butt tons of concrete so you can overclock like 2 refineries to accomadate 1 limestone node

[vast jungle]

I am working on a set of templates for a vertical factory design, something that make it easy to extend factories later... is this the right channel to talk about this?

[tropic hawk]

yep!

[vast jungle]

this is my current "template playground"... each of the templates contains a 32x32x32m cube with a single type of machine... and an extendible vertical manifold for input and output

[tropic hawk]

out of curiosity, why only one direction of tileability instead of 2/3?

[vast jungle]

the idea is that you have a 4x4 foundation sized tower for any single item you make, as long as input/output fits on a belt/pipe. If you need more, you just add a second "tower"

I tried to find a design which you could extend in 2 or 3 dimensions, but it consumes much to much space for the manifold parts...

vertical manifolds are already a bitch ^^

let me grab a closeup for the manifold for the Manufacturer template

similar (but simpler) on the other side for the output going down... you just connect the lower manifold to the belt-hole of the next floor and contact power to an existing "below the floor" contact...

I have a template fore Constructors, Assemblers, Manufacturers, Refineries, Blenders, Smelters, Foundries and one for Packagers

what do you think?

[barren elm]

Surely there's a better way

You've managed to turn a job that requires like 11 belts into a solution that uses like 40

[vast jungle]

@barren elm if you have a better idea for a vertical manifold I am looking forward to see it

[deft lichen]

complex designs in blueprints aren't a problem (because... it's a blueprint), only if they're an unnecessary waste of materials

is it possible to fit splitters and lifts in front of the manufacturer's inputs? @vast jungle

if yes, it should be far better

[barren elm]

Sorry, 10 belts to manifold a manufacturer, not 11

[vast jungle]

@deft lichen you mean rotating the manufacturer 90°, facing it towards the input manifold? Hmm... could work and save some belts...

[deft lichen]

I have no way of showing you what I mean unfortunately, but I think it should be possible to build this simpler

[vast jungle]

I will look at a rotated design later...

want to see a detail-view of a different template (different work machine)?

[deft lichen]

I've not reached blueprints in my U7 save yet but once I do I'll have a lot of fun experimenting with designs

feel free to share

[vast jungle]

I use them a lot for placing train tracks...

which machine would you be interested in?

[deft lichen]

assemblers

[vast jungle]

similar manifold design (just two belts), plus two assemblers on each floor

[deft lichen]

is this intended to stack only vertically?

[vast jungle]

yes...

if you want to "stack" them horizontally, you just start a second tower of the same machine type

the idea is that every tower can be extended until one of the input (or the output) belts is full... I want to build my second "Electronics" factory this way, so I can easily add more machines if I need them

[deft lichen]

why not attach the lifts directly to the splitters/mergers?

I don't understand the reason behind the lift setup in beside the machines (in the center of the image)

the same applies to the manufacturer setup

I'm just thinking how to make this more compact, it's entirely possible what I'm thinking of doing simply isn't doable

[vast jungle]

I started with the Assembler template... when rotating them by 90°, the input manifold for the assemblers sometimes don't fit with the placement of the vertical manifold... in the Assembler case it was easier to rotate them this way and I kept it for most machines where possible

I think I tried to get 3 Assemblers per floor in, but the belting was making a mess all over it

[deft lichen]

if I'll remember I'll try to ping you if I come up with a different design

[vast jungle]

this is what 3 rotated Assemblers would look like

not sure you can place the input manifold there

maybe with some custom vertical manifold placemelt... hmm

[deft lichen]

it should be possible but it'll look insane lol

[snow dove]

this went well, figured out a good design, and fixed my support blueprint which was a bit short

[snow dove]

this sadly didn’t go well

[snow dove]

sushi or clipped manifold would fit

[vast jungle]

I tried not to clip it...

[snow dove]

then sushi, or a weird vertical one

[vast jungle]

and (I just tried) even if I move the input manifold left/right, there is no enough space for a set of splitters and... hmm

hmm... I think I got an idea

[snow dove]

do one input manifold just below the other one

[vast jungle]

yes, I already tried that

[snow dove]

that should’ve worked…

[vast jungle]

the space is too short to have a belt going down to the assembler... even a belt-lift doesn't fit in

[snow dove]

if you don’t mind just a bit of clipping, you can do one manifold at level, and then one above it using lifts

that should work

[vast jungle]

missing 1m of space ^^

[snow dove]

place the splitter higher

[vast jungle]

the conveyer is still 1m inside the splitter... but I think I found some space elsewhere... let me try

I think I found a way to save 4m of space on the receiver side 🙂

Front:

back

6 Assemblers instead of 4... still have to redo the lower floor and the power wiring...

and without visible clipping 🙂

thank you for the feedback...

Now I am wondering if I can do more than 12 Constructors in this system... will come back to the game after dinner

[shy mist]

what to do in tier 7 and 8 first. I don t know where to start with this please help

[vast jungle]

Aluminium

You need alu sheets and casing for everything in tier 7/8

[wind spade]

check out milestones, pick whatever you want. There's no "best" choice really, get what you want

if you find yourself stuck because you don't have a resource, unlock that resouce

[vast jungle]

It's there any milestone in tier 7/8 you can unlock without aluminium (basic nuclear power maybe?)

[snow dove]

i am pretty much positive nuclear requires aluminum

[shy mist]

no

[snow dove]

the actual power plant requires alclad aluminum sheets

[vast jungle]

Might be a good idea to buy enough resources in the awesome shop to unlock and build the hoverpack

[oblique hollow]

no lol

[snow dove]

just produce the items for it, you’ll need them later anyways

[vast jungle]

I personally disagree because the hoverpack makes building so much easier because of the different perspective

[snow dove]

not really worth the tickets

[tropic hawk]

It appears s you are playing modded

[vast jungle]

Modified (and finished?) 6 Assembler Template for a vertical stacked factory... 🙂

[cinder silo]

Vertical stacking made simpler thanks to the ceiling conveyor mounts 😄

[vast jungle]

ceiling mounts are just great, yes

[cinder silo]

My old method involved a temp floor build 4 metres below the ceiling and routing belts that way.

[vast jungle]

or one below the floor... which is the same in a multi-floor factory...
I usually called them "crawling space" 😉

[cinder silo]

True, I usually have frame foundations along the ceiling, wiring and ceiling belts go above those, and light arrays hang from them.

[vast jungle]

Semi-organized (non-clipping) chaos... 16 constructors with vertical manifold in a single template

Optimized 2-Manufacturer template with vertical manifold.

(less belts than before)

[vast jungle]

templates are dangerous... the more you work on one, the more ideas you get

[deft lichen]

seems to be better 👍

[fluid heath]

Excuse me, artillery gun?

[shy mist]

mod

[fluid heath]

I figured but what does it do

[shy mist]

is the same like a factorio

[fluid heath]

So it goes on rails n all? Nice

[shy mist]

yes

[fluid heath]

Does it shoot fr

[shy mist]

yea

[fluid heath]

From far or do you call a strike

Can i just have the mod page that’ll be simpler

[shy mist]

wait a second

this

[fluid heath]

I cannot open the mod page bcs game is running

Do you have web link

[shy mist]

https://ficsit.app/mod/TrueNukes

[fluid heath]

I am sold

[sage void]

I just want a bit of feedback. is this good for a starting setup? its two normal iron deposits and mk.1 belts

[wind spade]

either produce to storage or for other parts, don't take things from storage via belts like this

[sage void]

ok i guess this doesn't need a backup storage now that i think about it thx

[glacial hemlock]

Storages in satisfactory are overrated. Only store what you need. Buffers can be minimized

Ingot is the example of what is not needed

[vapid gorge]

unless they introduce an ingot hucker that just fires ingots across the landscape

just lob 50kg hunks of iron everywhere

[gusty nexus]

you should only use storage for things that you need outside of the context of a production chain, like the iron plates/rods you need for construction

[tropic hawk]

Given that the ingot by my memory is about 2/3 meter tall and about a meter wide/long, that would be about 5300kg/item (numbers may be slightly different, but it is definitely more than 50kg)

[tropic hawk]

Or if you plan on disrupting the processes somehow, in which case planning in the buffers should be utilized planning for making it so you can't disrupt it.

[vapid gorge]

ingots are 2/3 of a m tall?? wild xD

[tropic hawk]

I don't have the game open, but iirc that is about how tall they are. If you can put one next to a 1 m wall, and do measurements I can get you the exact weight

[tropic hawk]

Also the pioneer is around 2m tall

[tropic hawk]

Also, good <INSERT TIME OF DAY HERE> to you.

[mystic moon]

This game is kinda wack on scale

[tropic hawk]

Oh without a doubt. The hitbox is 2m tall, but your eye level is 3m high. And don't get me started on acceleration.

[opaque oak]

Eye-level is less than 2m tall now. They changed it in U6(?)

Little more than 1.5m now

[lunar cliff]

I've calculated that @37.5/m you need 12.8 refineries to consume 480/m wire. With the coated wire recipe. Now I'm somewhat unsure of myself with the heavy oil residue, would I just multiply that one's consumption by the number of factories (12.8?)

[tropic hawk]

You would find the process's ECS (Equivalent Clock Speed) and how much it consumes per 100%, some simple math, then you got consumption per minute

[lunar cliff]

That gives me 192 oil consumption/min, but I would expect a larger number

[tropic hawk]

The numbers in this game can be deceptive. That may seem like not a lot, but it is quite a handful.

[lunar cliff]

It seems straightforward, 12.8 machines consuming 15 HOR/m. I'm just second guessing myself because I'm tired lol

[tropic hawk]

There is a neat in game calculator you can use by pressing 'N'

But 12.8×15 is 192 m^3/min

[lunar cliff]

Hm, I forgot I had the pure copper ingot recipe. This is a whole new world of pain

[tropic hawk]

You realize there is production line calculator sites, right?

[lunar cliff]

Yes but if I don't do the math myself, where is the challenge?

[oblique notch]

Oh trust us. It's there

[lunar cliff]

I'm punishing myself for never doing my homework in school

[oblique notch]

The math is the easy part

[tropic hawk]

Logistics.

But if you want to do the math yourself, more power to you.

Just making sure you are aware of resources at your disposal

[lunar cliff]

I've got logistics out the wazoo, the math is the part I don't have practice with lol. For me it would be like downloading a Spanish learning game and just always plugging the results into Google translate

[tropic hawk]

Alright. If you ever need help, don't hesitate to ask, this community is (usually) happy to help. If not, @tropic hawk and I'll help.

[lunar cliff]

Thank you. Mostly just asking for help when my brain starts to send off sparks lol

[tropic hawk]

We all do, hence why this is here in the first place

[vast jungle]

brainstorming is a fine way to generate new ideas on all sides

(and to prevent to repeat stupid common mistakes)

[vast jungle]

Ugh... prototype for a "6 packager" (instead of 4) template... not sure the complicated beltwork is worth the increase...

[wind spade]

I'd rather see a 1:1:1 module for diluted packaged fuel

Unless you want to package something else

[vast jungle]

the problem is my "typical" approach to DPF is a bit too long for a template... I use a refinery and than stack a packager/unpackager directly in front of it, that all three of them fit into the width of the refinery, allowing to stack them easily sideways

I maybe could make a template for the packager/unpackager part...

This is from one of my DPF Powerplants... 1:1:1:1 (75% HOR, DPF, Packager, Unpackager)

very easy to build, extend and debug

I use the same design in my plastic and rubber factory

@wind spade do you think worth to make a template from it?

[wind spade]

if you use it often 🤷‍♂️

[vast jungle]

I now have the blender, so the complexity is a bit high

[frosty owl]

Throwback to the "complex item category for blueprints" convo ^^
I'd probably make 3 blueprints, one per refining step and one for the packagers (though, I just blueprint Fuel refinery and packagers in one blueprint, leaving the HOR in a different setup/line)

[vast jungle]

Even the packager plus the dpf refinery plus the belts in between us more than 4 foundations 😭

[frosty owl]

Which is why I think it'd make more sense (if you don't want to change position of the machines) to blueprint the packagers by themselves and then add the connecting belts

You still save on plenty of build work. You could even take the chance to add some more details like:
Adding some space between packagers and refineries, you could have a walkway along the top level packagers, from which you can overview the whole refining section

[vast jungle]

And to be fair, the numbers of the DF blender don't fit the numbers for plastic/rubber production very well

[frosty owl]

They can be easily clocked to match though

[vast jungle]

yes, but if you underclock a blender to 60% (to match the 30/60 output of DPF) its a quite huge beast 😉
and overclocking it to 120 takes a slug

[frosty owl]

I still think you could give yourself more space :P

[cinder silo]

With some slugs respawning on reload, using one isn't an issue.

[frosty owl]

Look at it this way too: bigger buildings make fitting stations easier, as those are huge too

[frosty owl]

Or doggos :P

[vast jungle]

I sometimes think oil setups are the only factories much larger than the necessary train stations 😉

[barren elm]

I'll never understand this new trend of trying to cram a bunch of junk into the tiny 4x4 blueprint area

Could just save yourself the effort and make a standard manifold blueprint that looks better, ultimately takes up less space, and doesn't look visually indecipherable

[gusty nexus]

does anyone else make multiple blueprints of the same layouts, just with the manifolds moving in different directions?

[oblique hollow]

Yes

I have 3 seperate blueprints of refineries piped and belted in 3 different ways, just so i have variety

[vast jungle]

@wind spade I hope this is more interesting for you 😉

a 2-2-2 DPF/Pack/Unpack block... built with Tier 4 tech

[oblique hollow]

I think i could place all that on one floor

unless this is like 2 DPF setups in one

[vast jungle]

like I said, its a 2-2-2... 2 DPF, 2 Packagers, 2 Unpackagers...

[vast jungle]

See it like a puzzle... Always building the same manifold design over and over can be boring

[oblique hollow]

which is why you make variants

[clear echo]

Is there any calculators out there which will help you figure out the output ratio of items based purely on the input ratio of items?

[wind spade]

You still need to know what product you want

[clear echo]

Yes I know that. In my case my input is iron rods, iron plates and screws for which I know the rates going in. My desired output is reinforced iron plates, modular frames and rotors.

[magic island]

you can use S Tools, turn off all the raw resources, punch in the items you're inputting, and pick what you want to make

[wind spade]

Tools can help you with making equal amount of all 3

But I'd recommend you start solving backwards, not forwards

Decide how much output you want and then figure out the items needed for that

[tropic hawk]

If you start the other way, your I/min is generally less than 1

[clear echo]

How do I go about doing that? It's very open ended and I don't know how much of anything I want to produce. I would end up going in planning loops until end-game production would I not?

[tropic hawk]

Nope. Just think 'how often do I use this?' then adhere to the 45-81 rule, and your production should be nice and clean

[clear echo]

What is the 45-81 rule? I just want to make efficient factories, the adherence to how often im using something is null.

[tropic hawk]

#math-and-meta message

In my opinion it should be pinned, but I'll keep people aware of it

[wind spade]

It's pretty easy to estimate how much of something for building stuff. You can also just build random low amount and build more in case you find out storage going empty often

[wind spade]

It's a rule for people that are angry for 0.00001% inefficiencies in certain products because of clock speed being limited to 4 decimals. Imo not relevant for most people, so I wouldn't bother with it, unless you really want

[pliant current]

what would the best way be to split 5 belts into 7 equal parts

i found an old reddit thread recommending a manifold, but im not sure i completely understand the pros and cons of that

or even what it is entirely

from what i get, i think its just a method of plugging all of the input resource into a long splitter line in the factory

and waiting for it to even out

[wind spade]

Manifold is when you have a belt and splitter in front of each machine

Disadvantage is it has a startup time

Advantage is simplicity, extendability and can work with different machines/inputs

If you can merge all 5 belts into one, then it's probably easiest

[pliant current]

on this save im at t4 so none of my belts are high enough capacity

could i inject multiple belts into it?

[wind spade]

Other way is to just have each of the 5 belts go into exact amount of machines

Then youdon't need to merge anything

[oblique hollow]

heres something fun for any Valve users:

[opaque oak]

Why they are pretty useless for trying to limit flow.

[wind spade]

limiting flow is pretty useless

[opaque oak]

Doesn't prevent people from trying to divide flows and handle byproducts... Even when it is useless to try with valves.

[vivid fossil]

I'm trying to split a line of 70 into 2 of 25 and 1 of 20 but can't figure it out... Anyone could help ?

[mystic moon]

Why arent you using a manifold/overflow?

[wind spade]

well you can always just use a single splitter

[vivid fossil]

Yeah but I just wanted to ask if anyone had a splitter like this already done

[mystic moon]

That would be a pretty big pain

[vivid fossil]

You'll have to cut the line 2 times then cut those 2 into 7 each to get to 5*14 to then merge, if I did the maths right

Can't think of a better way + good luck splitting a 1:7 equally

[tropic hawk]

It does actually make the machines clock speeds a lot neater though.

[tropic hawk]

Split it into 14 belts of 5 and combine 5 belts and 5 belts into one each and the remaining 4 into one

[wind spade]

it does, but again, only relevant for people that need that kind of efficiency precision

[topaz hedge]

Keep in mind that with those, there are rounding errors. so.. might be better to have +0.1/min extra for a happy production line

[wind spade]

just round up to nearest 0.0001% clock speed

[topaz hedge]

typically that'll solve it yeah.

[wind spade]

or don't, the difference is literally ~2 items per day

(well, depends on which item are we talking about, but it's mostly around that much)

[topaz hedge]

sometimes it matters. and at worse you'll end up with a single machine on standby once every hour or so

[wind spade]

well that's not really bad anyway 😄

[topaz hedge]

no, and in my experience I've never seen it. I'm assuming the game makes rounding errors on just about everything.

[lunar cliff]

I will soon be producing 2160 cable from one (1) normal copper node

[frosty pawn]

im saving as much copper as i can. im using those 4 pure iron nodes in NW northern forest in refineries to make as much iron ingots as possible, then solid steel foundries, then some plates with plastic from the oil nearby and hella iron wire

[vast jungle]

has anyone a strong opinion on the Turbomotor vs. Turboelectric Motor recipes? I am trying to plan a production for Radio Control Units (and maybe EM control rods) and don't want to extend it when I am going for TMs...

[frosty pawn]

my strong opinion is that you should choose the one that is most complimentary to your existing production. once you get that far, power and space is not as much of a limitation as spinning up new cooling system, radio control unit and electromagnetic control rod production

also rubber and plastic is almost free if you do recycling right - you can make soooo much of that stuff

[vast jungle]

I dont have a complementary production which can produce the necessary parts... I have a reasonable amount of rubber/plastic (540/min of each), but the factory will need to be (mostly, except for Aluminium parts) self-contained...

[frosty pawn]

then you need to figure out the full production schematic for each and decide which one is less hassle for you

also important to decide how many turbo motors per min you want

this is my favourite tool for this kind of thing https://u6.satisfactorytools.com/

[vast jungle]

I know this tool and using it... but I am still unconvinced whats the pro/con of electric turbomotor

[frosty pawn]

turbo electric is faster which just means less manufacturers at the end of the line. your other alts make a big contribution to which turbo motor recipe you choose to use

personally i would go with turbo pressure motor because it uses nitrogen which isnt used for a lot of other things

and requires way less radio control units which i always have trouble with (maybe just me)

[vast jungle]

but on the other side it needs pressure cubes... hmm

[frosty pawn]

fused modular frame + 2 radios. it has no alts so no worry about how to optimise

[vast jungle]

the "Turbo Pressure Motor" Recipe is strange, consuming Packaged Nitrogen Gas... ^^

[wind spade]

well, manufacturer has 4 solid inputs 😛

[vast jungle]

and Blender only 2...

[wind spade]

yea

[vast jungle]

still a strange design 😉

[vapid gorge]

You can play around with tools and other alt recipes to see if you can minimize the number of type of resources you need for the chain so you can build it on one spot?

Like, the right recipe set let’s me make 200 super computers pm on one spot

[vapid gorge]

It’s often considered a useful recipe for people who are pushing the limits of other resource types by using nitrogen instead - as generally you’ll always be swimming in excess gas

[abstract stirrup]

Difference between smart splitter and programmable splitter?

[wind spade]

programmable splitter can have multiple filters per side

[abstract stirrup]

Can I tell the programmable splitter to like put stuff on the left if right is full?

[wind spade]

you can do that with smart splitter as well

[abstract stirrup]

How

[wind spade]

there should be "overflow" filter

[abstract stirrup]

Ahhhh ok thanks

[hot pumice]

how would i split 59 to 45

[neon wraith]

I've done it. Perfect set up for 600 crude to 1400 plastic and 400 rubber a min.

[hot pumice]

😮

👏

[neon wraith]

Now to begin working on my 1000+ battery's a min facility... Then Drones.. so many drones

[wind spade]

one splitter

[hot pumice]

what

[abstract stirrup]

Modded jetpack?

[wind spade]

split into two belts, it'll self-balance

[neon wraith]

Wall behind me with Electric wire going high

[abstract stirrup]

How

[hot pumice]

i need to try this

[abstract stirrup]

It is phase 3?

[neon wraith]

That's wall I used, I just put wire with wall mounts

[neon wraith]

when one gets FULL, the splitter diverts all to the other side.

[abstract stirrup]

I don’t understand, I’m stupid

[hot pumice]

doesnt that = 24.5?

[wind spade]

yeah but the side that needs less will get full

[wind spade]

which overflows the extra items to the other side

[hot pumice]

oh...

[neon wraith]

see that MIDDLE spliter, its fed from bottom, soon as RIGHT gets full, it will send all others top

thats a smart spliter, but its same concept.

[tropic hawk]

It's called a hoverpack.

[abstract stirrup]

I mean I just unlocked jetpack and it’s completely different from what he has

[tropic hawk]

It is... That's why I said Hoverpack

[abstract stirrup]

Ok just searched on the internet, they are two different things

Yeah sorry

[gusty nexus]

man, i thought instant scrap might be neat to let me do perfect ratios on a rubber/plastic/fuel plant and not spend oil on petrocoke, but it sucks ass, no building space savings and no bauxite efficiency over sloppy + electrode and spending a lot of sulfur

[tropic hawk]

Yep. There are quite a few recipe duds, and quite a few that are obviously diluting the pool if recipes (biocoal, I'm looking at you)

[gusty nexus]

it is cool that you can hook the water byproduct into the sulfuric acid plants and not have to fiddle with water input/output mixing

but how could they make it worth spending the sulfur like that, more bauxite efficiency?

[tropic hawk]

Some people have use cases. Personally sulfur goes to Nuclear, batteries, and other processes in that order.

[gusty nexus]

you even have to spend coal at the same rate as the basic recipe!

yeah sulfur seems too valuable for other things to spend on an alt that offers so little

i was hoping to use the 540 oil well spot near the middle of the map, just north of the red forest

there is an oil spot to the east, i guess i can use that instead

[tropic hawk]

Spire Coast is arguably the best place for oil, but whatever drives you chain

[gusty nexus]

honestly, 540 oil just lets me do perfectly round ratios without having to fiddle with over/underclocking

and i haven't been able to get that out of oil so far, so yeah

nothing actually meaningful other than seeing nice round numbers on the production line calcs (except on the blenders making diluted fuel)

[tropic hawk]

Round numbers and flat power graphs are the best feeling

[gusty nexus]

yeah the setup i'm looking at needs round numbers at all levels of rubber/plastic production AND feeds a round number of generators

the only fly in the ointment is 14.4 blenders

but at least inputting 40% on one blender instead of .66666 is much less of an eyesore

[tropic hawk]

Least you have a decent clock speed instead of an irrational number

[gusty nexus]

stupid 1/3 1/7 1/9 fractions

[tropic hawk]

Or just flat out irrational numbers

[oblique hollow]

it does save space, no coke refineries and no HOR refineries

electrode needs those and thus its more machines for a full setup

and its not like you can run out of sulfur doing instant scrap

also the water loop is neat

much easier to manage than the cursed numbers of sloppy + electrode

[gusty nexus]

it just feels way worse to spend 400 coal and 200 sulfur to convert 600 bauxite to scrap when you could spend 240 coke instead for the same numbers

[oblique hollow]

one of these fits 4 blenders neatly, thats 1200 scrap

[oblique hollow]

thats a relative cost and its up to you if you wanna equate those that way

also its 120 coke vs 200 coal

[gusty nexus]

for 600 scrap, not 600 bauxite ore

[oblique hollow]

yes, instant and electrode output at 300

electrode needs 60 coke

[gusty nexus]

i was looking at the 600 bauxite number because that's what my current setup was using

[oblique hollow]

for every 300 scrap its 60 coke

In total its 6 refineries for 600 scrap vs 2 refineries 2 blenders for 600 scrap

[gusty nexus]

i said 600 bauxite ore input, not 600 scrap output

[oblique hollow]

do you have trouble reading what im writing?

[gusty nexus]

which is just doubling the numbers, so whatever

[oblique hollow]

maybe this will help you

[gusty nexus]

dude, i said i was comparing what my current setup that was spending 600 bauxite ore was using

i'm looking at the flat rate statistics per machine right now, too

i was talking about what a setup that is eating 600 bauxite ore and spitting out 1200 scrap requires as ancillary materials

[oblique hollow]

both need 300 bauxite for 600 scrap

so 600 for 1200

[pastel flax]

notsoy is refering to the other materials required to do so,
Crude Oil, Coal, Water, Sulfur, etc, etc.

[gusty nexus]

i was also talking about the particular volume i had already been working with and comparing the total volume that both potential setups would need

and when i saw that i was going to have to replace 240 coke with 400 coal (eh) and 200 sulfur (ew), i stopped considering it

[quiet knoll]

I'm trying to figure this out....You see, I have 16 coal generators but only two water pipes connected which should be under the limit of what they should be supplied with. , yet 3 of my gens are not getting supplied with water even though every other gen is max and is fully supplied even though they run later on the system. Help?

Should I just run another pipe or two?

Mainly I don't have access to mark 2 pipes for reference

[opaque oak]

16 coal generators use 720 m^3 of water, and two mk1 pipes can only supply 2x300.

[quiet knoll]

Yeah, I've just now added two more pipes meaning 1200 water so it's a good future proof.

Now I have a consistent 1200mw power supply for all my factory work! 🙂

[vapid gorge]

I hope you calculated there'd be no points where those 4 pipes connect up where flow has to be higher

[upbeat rose]

wrong channel whhops

[quiet knoll]

Mostly each one of the 4 is flowing towards 4 generators each. Obviously I don't need the amount of pipes I have, but at least it does mean I can expand or direct excess water to differen't sources.....Plus, it looks so much nicer having 4 rather than just two. 🙂

[quiet knoll]

Confused, why is my constructor set up 75% efficient even though it gets the exact amount it needs when it needs it? Is it a bug?

[opaque oak]

Output overflowing?

[quiet knoll]

I've checked and I think it's actually underflowing.

[prisma musk]

What is the best website for satisfactry calculating?

[tropic hawk]

SatisfactoryTools.com

[tropic hawk]

https://www.satisfactorytools.com

[prisma musk]

Thanks

[frosty pawn]

if you make a one-sided manifold of 8 coal gens, it's very easy to keep water supply under control. just attach a water extractor to any 3 of the junctions and there will never be a pipe over 300/min.

[hot pumice]

is there way to split this evenly? (using magnificent ratios)

[wheat tundra]

My mind is not working today. If I need to consume 900 concrete, and manufacture max amount of alternative HFM, how do I set up the ratio problem? IEB needs 20 concrete per 4 IEB. HMF needs 20.625 concrete per 2.813 HMF. And HMF needs 9.375 IEB per 2.813 HMF

I can work it out via a series of equations, but it looks like a ratio problem, but there's two sets of ratios

[tropic hawk]

Manifolds.

[hot pumice]

?

[tropic hawk]

!wikisearch manifolds

[shadow prairie]

https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/Special:Search?query=manifolds

[wheat tundra]

I always use manifolds

[tropic hawk]

Wrong one...

!wikisearch manifold

[shadow prairie]

https://satisfactory.fandom.com/wiki/Special:Search?query=manifold

[wheat tundra]

I don't see the point to trying to balance

[tropic hawk]

There we go

[tropic hawk]

It's really only useful in radioactive set ups

[vast jungle]

And it can make Debugging oil setups easier... But a clean design is better than a complicated merger/balancer

[hot pumice]

i see... so as long as the amount of input is = to the amount needed, it will automatically balance?

[wheat tundra]

Well, it will properly consume

It won't be balanced, so there's a lag time for buffers to fill

But after buffers fill, it will work perfectly

[vast jungle]

Just be careful with manifold and items that stack to 500... It make take s while

[wheat tundra]

The only slightly frustrating part is if you hang around to be 100% sure it works, and buffers fill slowly. Just come back in an hour or whatever

Then make sure all the machines are running at 100% efficiency, if that's what they are supposed to be doing

My mind is not working today. If I need to consume 900 concrete, and manufacture max amount of alternative HFM, how do I set up the ratio problem? IEB needs 20 concrete per 4 IEB. HMF needs 20.625 concrete per 2.813 HMF. And HMF needs 9.375 IEB per 2.813 HMF
I can work it out via a series of equations, but it looks like a ratio problem, but there's two sets of ratios

I guess I should just set up the hard way, if I can't figure out a simple way with ratios

[tropic hawk]

For solids, yes.

[tropic hawk]

20x=4y
20.625x+9.375y=2.1825z
67.5x=2.1825z
X=13.333
Z= 29.1

I think I got the math right, one sec.

[wheat tundra]

x is concrete needed for IEB; y is number of IEB; z is how many HMF machines?

[tropic hawk]

In theory. I plugged the numbers into SatisfactoryTools and got using default recipes the max production being 36 HMF/min

[wheat tundra]

Yeah, that math makes sense

I double checked it with something similar

[coarse forge]

Quick question how was the calculation for coal?

I have 3 MK2 with 120 each rn on MK1 belts because we ran out of power to create more steel

[wind spade]

that depends what do you want to do with the coal

[coarse forge]

Coal energy, so coal to the water/coal machine

[wind spade]

you can just build coal gen and open it's UI to see the values

but if you just want to get answers without doing work, it's ||120 coal for 8 gens + 3 extractors||

[coarse forge]

||thank you so it will be 24 gens and 9 extractors if my math is right?||

[deft lichen]

yes, you just triple the numbers

[vapid gorge]

real quick rando question for computer nerds - this is a cpu intensive game - how much of a dif do people think going from 6 core to 8 core might make?

[barren elm]

Massively depends, most games don't use all cores evenly and you almost always get bottlenecked by 1 single core

[vapid gorge]

bllllergh xD
This is why I build a new rig, run it into the ground for 6-7 years before having to go through all this again

[vapid gorge]

do you know of any hardware bottlenecks I should look out for on a motherboard with it? I've always been a bit iffy on MBs tbh

[barren elm]

Any current gen mobo +CPU runs satisfactory like a dream

I'm guessing at 6 cores you've got quite an old build

[vapid gorge]

I'm upgrading xD 6 core was going to be the upgrade

tagged you in a couple #off-topic-media for specifics

[barren elm]

Oh didn't realize I couldn't type there lol

[vapid gorge]

xD yeah gets people

[barren elm]

Yeah any of those cpus will run it just fine, mine is weaker and the only time I even get stutter is during unreal's garbage collection call

Pretty good time to upgrade too, quite a while before 8000 series comes out

[vapid gorge]

I suppose there's 'fine' to 'significant improvement' ? I pretty much don't want to think about a new computer until 2030 starts looming and my factories tend to be on the large size

I don't mind getting the ryzen 9 if it actually have the omph

[barren elm]

What's your current cpu?

[vapid gorge]

MD Ryzen 3 3200G 4 Core

This game does require beef though.