#satisfactory

1 messages · Page 463 of 1

wicked nacelle
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it's 10:20 pm in seattle

stable prairie
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I'm in Florida and I've had friends in cali that were 6 hours behind

wicked nacelle
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there's only 4 time zones in continental us

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so ca and wa for example are -3 from you

stable prairie
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3 hours behind, noted

wicked nacelle
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anyhow, if I'm around tomorrow I'm happy to help

stable prairie
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If I see you, I'll ask

wicked nacelle
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otherwise anyone who is offering to help can certainly help to. Signals are weird til you understand them then they're super easy

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but until they 'click' they're like black magic

stable prairie
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Every tutorial I've seen on them explains them in different ways, but never the same way

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It's like every player has a unique system of using them and the physics involved change from person to person

wicked nacelle
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we'll get you figured out -- just don't delete your rail until you understand if you should 🙂

stable prairie
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Can do

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See y'all tomorrow

wicked nacelle
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I need another cat

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let's see if I can hip hop him off of it

fervent sand
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No. It's 10

wicked nacelle
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there's 2 kind of people in this world people who know binary

quick hound
tall rune
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Is there a way to make suggestions?
Cause I think a bulldozer for land clearing would be cool and within the vision of the game

wicked nacelle
quick hound
wicked nacelle
wicked nacelle
quick hound
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HOLYFUCK THAT IS A FAT CAT

quick hound
wicked nacelle
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so disresepectful. he's like 9 pounds.. Pumpkin spice.

quick hound
quick hound
sullen gull
quick hound
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Wait I thought we were talking about me

wicked nacelle
quick hound
sullen gull
wicked nacelle
whole drum
sullen gull
wicked nacelle
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ooooooh wrong window

sullen gull
quick hound
steel kelp
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No way rocket fuel counts as a gas right

whole drum
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Why wouldn't it?

sullen gull
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RF is a gas...

steel kelp
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That’s so weird

silk ocean
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I just got removed from dedicated-servers? For what.. helping people?

sullen gull
fringe ginkgo
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Question: a single refinery of turbofuel can fill how many industrial fluid containers?

silk ocean
whole drum
fringe ginkgo
sullen gull
fringe ginkgo
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Fill at least 3 industrial fluid containers to the top to stack up when I unlock drones

sullen gull
whole drum
fringe ginkgo
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Got a refinery of turbofuel divided in packaging and the trio of horizontal containers on the ground

whole drum
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The production stops when there's nowhere for the output to go--storage getting full, for example

median geyser
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Drones use packaged fuel, you can just store that in ISCs

fringe ginkgo
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Containers have some amount of turbofuel but middleone while connected doesn't get filled, right one is filled, and left is emptying itself alone

whole drum
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They don't just empty. They have to be connected to something.

sullen gull
wicked nacelle
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he got kickified

median geyser
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  1. Fluid buffers you generally want to avoid except for a few specific reasons. Just store it as packaged fuel for when drones happen.

  2. Love the Bloodborne reference

wicked nacelle
sullen gull
wicked nacelle
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oh wait no

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did you click the little thingy by the thing?

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discord has this dumb thing where things get hidden

sullen gull
wicked nacelle
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click the little arrow thingy by "satisfactory chat"

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it's super dumb and it just hides ...some... channels?

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I've never figured out what it's supposed to do

random garnet
median geyser
wicked nacelle
fringe ginkgo
open swallow
wicked nacelle
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and trains take less power to move WAY more

random garnet
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So drones are good if you need a smaller amount of items taken somewhere

open swallow
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correct

sullen gull
median geyser
wicked nacelle
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only rate matters. raw numbers in this game are a red herring almost always

steel kelp
random garnet
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I personally use industrial fluid buffers at my train station where my train drops off crude oil. Very pointless but ohwell

fringe ginkgo
wicked nacelle
sullen gull
wicked nacelle
median geyser
wicked nacelle
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liquids package 1:1 and you get twice as much in a car but then another car to transfer empties (unless you have a second stop for loading empties)

wicked nacelle
median geyser
sullen gull
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Buffers also screw people with headlift a lot

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Unless aware.

wicked nacelle
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liquid buffers are worse than pipes until they're full and then they're just "not worse"

sullen gull
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Though, more just confusing than worse imo

wicked nacelle
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I thought it was flow rate too

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just get rid of 'em regardless

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they're a noob trap. this game has too many noob traps

fringe ginkgo
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So it's better to destroy the buffers and sent the fluid straight into whatever machine I need the fluid for?

wicked nacelle
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yes -- you either have sufficient production rate or you don't

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and either way buffers don't help

whole drum
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The problem is that buffers are back-end storage that hide issues that may be going on until they empty, when realistically you should store the end products--whether that's packaged fuel or maybe power itself in some batteries--if you're going to store anything at all. You arguably don't need to store much of anything in this game.

wicked nacelle
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a buffer for your dimensinoal depot is fine. but not in your produciton path to the next machine

sullen gull
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😏

median geyser
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Because the one in line with your production machine does nothing

sullen gull
median geyser
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Its either always 100% full because your lines are backed up, its 100% empty because you arent producing enough to meet your current demands, or its in limbo, serving no real purpose, filling as fast as it empties

median geyser
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SatisFactory not SatisWarehouse

wicked nacelle
whole drum
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Almost the entirety of storage you actually need is met with DDs.

wicked nacelle
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for something that builds slow but you may want a bunch all at once -- yeah have a littel buffer for yoru DD

whole drum
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The rest of the need is just buffers for trains

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And little else (if anything)

median geyser
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I genuinely cant think of a single case where youd want other storage once you have DDs, unless there is more unique items than there are mercer spheres?

sullen gull
# median geyser SatisFactory not SatisWarehouse

A single ISC of an item is not "out of the realm". Especially when one is doing MUCH more than just laying down a slab and throwing machines. So far I have run out of concrete, steel beams, and trigons/TC's with building

median geyser
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Oh wait Ive got one, the line container hooked up to a sink for random item dumping

wicked nacelle
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well for things like concrete you may want more in a small period of time than your production can make -- but not more than an ISC

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if you hook up 6 uploaders or whatever you may only be making 300/m ... or whatever. where you could be limited by production not upload

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or maybe rubber if you just have a small spot uploading rubber vs somewhere else for production

fringe ginkgo
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Can you set up fluid direction within pipes besides pumps?

median geyser
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No

wicked nacelle
whole drum
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Valves, but pumps work better

steel kelp
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Theyre actually so terrible to work with

wicked nacelle
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fluid goes to where there are empty pipes and there are empty pipes where it's being consumed

whole drum
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I'm not advocating they should be used. They just technically exist for that purpose.

steel kelp
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Unless you figure out the integer thing they work on

steel kelp
wicked nacelle
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fluids WANT to go where you want them to go

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until they slosh

whole drum
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Fluids go where there is imbalance and where you allow them

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Sloshing is usually the result of imbalances existing on both ends

wicked nacelle
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fluids are almost really awesome in this game except for they suck the buttox

wicked nacelle
median geyser
whole drum
sullen gull
wicked nacelle
whole drum
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You feed your inputs into both ends of a system before it feeds into the output

wicked nacelle
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bad game design or just... "we didn't give a shit to test" game design

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if you believe their "we didn't know about the fluid flow rate issue" bs explanation they gave

whole drum
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No, fluids just behave in a certain way that takes getting used to. Once you understand that it's basically just a pressure system with gravity, it becomes a lot simpler.

sullen gull
wicked nacelle
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the simulation is too advanced for a game and way too limited for real life. It's the worst of both worlds.

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you have to know which "real life" they use and which 'real life" they completely ignore

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which is dumb as all hell for a game

whole drum
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I think people just let it intimidate them. There is a logic to it that is understandable.

sullen gull
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I always love how peoples personal issues with things are always the fault of the developers 🤣

wicked nacelle
whole drum
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It's like 16 pages, lol

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And mostly illustrations

wicked nacelle
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thank you for proving my point

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the problem is the game doesn't expose the information other than "it doesn't work" nor does it give you proper tools to deal with it and its drastically unlike every other part of the game which completely ignores "real life" and "just works"

whole drum
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Your point is poor logic, my friend. Lots of games have 3rd party guides that are super useful. It's not always a design issue.

The mechanics are actually fine. The only design "flaw" imo is that the manual isn't in the Codex in game.

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That's a communication issue--not design.

wicked nacelle
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the behavior is obtuse. Belts aren't realistic at all yet they "just work" -- but suddenly fluids you have to know "real life" except it's not "real life" it's just some algorithm they just randomly implemented

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that partially resembles a simplifeid version of real life (it's still not -- even the sloshing is drastically simplified)

sullen gull
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"I just want to plug A in to B and it woooorkkk!!" 🙄

wicked nacelle
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it's like those old kings quest games where you just had to guess what the developers were thinking. There's no logic to it it's just "guess right" or 'wrong"

whole drum
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Just to use another game as an example, Path of Exile. Damage conversion and calculations are not explained in the game at all, but there are many 3rd party sources for how they actually function. This isn't a design flaw, it's a communications flaw. The actual design is what makes room for so much fun in the game.

wicked nacelle
sullen gull
median geyser
# whole drum Your point is poor logic, my friend. Lots of games have 3rd party guides that ar...

Lots of games needing third party resources is not a point in your favor here. Bad design is EXACTLY why third party guides exist. If the design was good, it would be clear to interpret from gameplay, or at worst, explained properly in-game so that any stand alone user can make full use of the mechanics in question.

I dont know or care how this applies to the above chat about water physics in the game, thats way above my pay grade, but saying "other communities do it too, so thats a sign that this is well designed" is the opposite of whats happening

wicked nacelle
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it just makes it needlessly frustrating so you have to do the magic incantation to maybe make it work as expecged

whole drum
wicked nacelle
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there's nothing about a logistics game that says "you have to learn the special way to do X" that makes it fun. Logistics make it fun. Not hidden requirements

wicked nacelle
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Terribly terribly wrong

whole drum
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No, what he argued didn't actually have much to do with my point

wicked nacelle
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well, it responded to what you typed - maybe you didn't type what you meant.

whole drum
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No, I think he missed my point

median geyser
# whole drum I don't think you understood the point I was making, tbh.

You're saying its communication, not design. Im saying they are one and the same, as design is HOW the game communicates to us. Feedback to our actions, etc. Good design communicates mechanics. Bad design makes things happen because TrustMeBro(TM) and then you go to a community made discord to have someone like Xaxxon teach you all the reasons the mechanic is frustrating and what the best way to handle your problem is

wicked nacelle
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anyhow, the fact that we constantly have to help people shows the game design is trash.

whole drum
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I think people commonly misattribute bad communication by devs as "bad design," when that isn't true.

wicked nacelle
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and that people here even have copypasta they send people for these questions

wicked nacelle
whole drum
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No, communication and design are not the same. This is why UX Design is a profession, lol

wicked nacelle
median geyser
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If the devs need to publish a review journal on how the mechanics work, they designed them poorly

sullen gull
whole drum
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The system can work flawlessly (great design) and still not be intuitive or easily understood (poor communication).

median geyser
wicked nacelle
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You don't understand "game design" if you think tha'ts okay

whole drum
wicked nacelle
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everyone here likes the game but it's okay to say that there are parts that they just missed. Fluids are one of them. It works drastically unlike other parts of the game provides no insight into why and breaks the fundamental part of the game for most players which is logistics

whole drum
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This whole thing is just "I don't like it, therefore bad design," even though it actually works the way it's meant to (outside of some bugs).

median geyser
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"Car has no brakes, this is dangerous"

"Car goes places, as intended. Good design, just admit you dont like not stopping"

whole drum
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That's called a Straw Man and isn't the point you think it is.

median geyser
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That's called applying your own logic to a different context to show the ridiculousness of the statement

whole drum
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No, that's distorting my logic.

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My logic is:
The car functions how it is intended to, but not everyone understands how to drive it without reading the manual or having someone teach them.

sullen gull
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You all keep talking as if fluids are somehow "broken". Yet, I feel the main issue is that the game just doesn't give "coloring book" style "demonstration" of how things "work" and that's the "issue"? Show me one scenario though, where you think fluids are "broken" ?

median geyser
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Its not though. Fluids "work", barely, which is good enough. It doesnt crash the game (at least any more than anything else you can do 😂 ). That is not the bar for good design. On the other hand, we have Xaxxon arguing that by working illogically compared to everything else the game teaches you, and blatantly refusing to explain how, why, or give you the tools to work with this new logic, the devs left something in a poor state

whole drum
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They failed to communicate the design, yes.

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How well it works is purely subjective, btw.

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And it has been known to have bugs--which CSS have addressed as things progress along.

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But the actual design works as intended.

median geyser
# sullen gull You all keep talking as if fluids are somehow "broken". Yet, I feel the main iss...

I dont think they are. I think the devs literally gave us a handholding tutorial with belts, machines, and most other things, and then for fluids, they just pulled a Todd Howard and said "here are pipes. They just work. Stick round in round hole, bubble bubble". There is minimal to no explanation of the additional mechanics, what they mean, how they work, etc.

Hell even ADA's passing comments on stuff like belt throughput are more educational than whats given in-game.

So, with no information shared, a player would logically assume it works like real life. And then they will be plagued by mysterious, infuriating issues with flow, and will then either give up at coal generators, or end up here/on youtube looking up 3rd party explanations

whole drum
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Hmm, it sounds like they failed to communicate... something.

median geyser
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Poor communication is a game design failure

whole drum
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Wrong

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It's a communication failure

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That's like saying a whole forest is dead because a few trees fell over

median geyser
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I cannot have a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent, and my every attempt to arm you has failed

whole drum
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And if I were a dev and people come at me with "This is bad design," my response is going to be, "Deal with it. 😎 "

If instead they say, "Could we maybe get some in game resources on how this works?" it's a lot more likely that I can address it.

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Dude makes a bad argument then blocks--in a discussion about bad communication. I just can't even, rofl

sullen gull
# median geyser I dont think they are. I think the devs literally gave us a handholding tutorial...

And the issues are always the same, usually a headlift issue or "pressure" issue in the case of trying to run long dead head manifolds. Each of which the game gives ample tools to "discerns" what may be happening.

However, A game company CANNOT be expected to put out a manual that caters to every level of comprehension. (not that pipes are really that difficult to begin with) It's just not possible. Yes, some greater explanations on some things that could be warranted perhaps (namely with buffers and the way headlift works and that pipes don't opperate the same as belts in regards to manifolds and the like) Though, looking through all the ADA messages, there is very little said in the way of belts or pipes, which leaves me to believe that the game developers "assumed" that trying dictate one way of doing something over another, since there a a few days to achieve the same end goal, wasn't warranted. And being upset or blaming the game devs because they didn't "do what you want" is just projecting imo.

I can totally understand the "growing pains" some may of had in early EA, but that's not now and the mechanics have been improved/fixed since.

whole drum
# wicked nacelle everyone here likes the game but it's okay to say that there are parts that they...

I didn't get to address this earlier, but I actually agree this is an issue. When I was new I really struggled with how unintuitive it is, because I didn't understand the mechanics and the game only gives you "Water doesn't flow uphill on its own." Gee thanks, ADA.

This is why I constantly suggest the manual should be in the Codex and I just link people to it whenever they show they are really new and just getting started with pipes.

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I get voicing frustrations/criticisms, but we still have to consider the practical side of what we want to happen, or can reasonably expect if the devs are taking feedback.

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Then again, maybe the devs are okay with not communicating that in the hopes that people will experiment more or that the confusion will nudge them toward the community.

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It could be intentional

median geyser
# sullen gull And the issues are always the same, usually a headlift issue or "pressure" issue...

I agree, they cant be expected to write comprehensive guides for various levels of understanding. So just write one, maybe not even that comprehensive, but enough that the average player can, at least, establish why their 300/min water from their extractors isn't flowing in their 300/min pipes to their array of generators. Add some "common mistakes pioneers make" where ADA takes a few digs at us like she always does, etc. Something more than what we get.

And yes, that would be considerably more than we got with belts. But belts work as described. The description of a belt tells you the speed a belt will move items in items/min. A pipe gives the same. However their are additional mechanics directly impacting pipes. There are not for belts, belt issues are production issues. So if they are going to be more complex in order to work the way the devs want it to, then they should be given more information available to a player.

I also agree that very little is said about either of belts or pipes. My point wasnt that belts got a huge thesis in the Codex, it was that the little bits the game does provide actually helps, by comparison to the pipes which get functionally nothing to explain the unique aspects of flow.

My entire point has been "Having unique mechanics that arent explained in some capacity is bad game design". Thats it. I just think they dropped the ball there, and it could be improved with reasonable effort on their part.

dense violet
whole drum
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And that's all this is. L2P

ocean frost
median geyser
# dense violet there's 'bad' and 'takes a bit of effort to learn'. It's very easy to get consis...

My point all along has been that not communicating unique mechanics is a bad game design choice. Better information for the player about the mechanics should exist, as well as an expectation of agency and willingness to learn by accessing said information are required. But a willing player dealing with pipe issues early on wont have any information that isnt 3rd party to guide them, and will just try random stuff until it works

whole drum
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I guess the old Mega Man games were "bad design" too

dense violet
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Yeah a basic guide hasn't been added to the wiki. The pipe manual is .. half a guide? More describes some mechanics but not proper layouts

wicked nacelle
median geyser
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I also acknowledge that making a "basic" guide isnt easy

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Its HARD to write something that most people can comprehend

ocean frost
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The issue with SF is if you played in EA you had each mechanic exposed to you slowly, fluids, trains signals and we learnt but by bit.

For new people it's just overwhelming to be exposed all at once

pine ore
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how much turbo fuel does 1 fuel generator "eat"/min ?

dense violet
raven axleBOT
wicked nacelle
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!wikisearch fuel_generator

raven axleBOT
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https://satisfactory.wiki.gg/index.php?search=fuel_generator

Official Satisfactory Wiki
Index.php

The Fuel-Powered Generator is a power generator building that generates power by burning liquid fuel (Fuel, Liquid Biofuel, Turbofuel) or gaseous fuel (Rocket Fuel, or Ionized Fuel).
At 100% clock speed, one Fuel-Powered Generator produces 250 MW. The type of fuel does not affect power production, only...

dense violet
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page with fuel gens has the info

pine ore
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ty

median geyser
wicked nacelle
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did cobalt really just link the wiki front page with ! wikisearch and tell someone to find it themselves? what the actual F

median geyser
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Im done all my Phase 4 unlocks and just got fuel/turbo fuel power up and going, and am now working on backtracking and setting up proper factories for early mechanics

wicked nacelle
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instead of typing in like 12 letters?

dense violet
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eehhhh fluids were there from the start of EA, the only new thing really there is signals. Which you can just use block signals and be done with it. No mystery

whole drum
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The difficulty of writing the guide is already solved anyway. They can either use the Manual (with author's permission, ofc) or write one similar

sullen gull
median geyser
# dense violet eehhhh fluids were there from the start of EA, the only new thing really there i...

For a brand new player, speaking as one of many such players, it is very overwhelming at first. So many things, many rapidly unlocked with basic materials, and its extremely easy to just follow that "complete the objective in the corner" and not realize the game expects you to spend a bunch of time with each unlock before you proceed, and end up overwhelmed and unsure what half your stuff does.

I dont think theres a better way of handling this tbh, it just is what it is

ocean frost
dense violet
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I mean every tier throws new things at you. It's all going to be a lot

wicked nacelle
dense violet
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like the tiers are a very good tutorial going step by step, but if your brain doesn't work a certain way it's going to be a lot

wicked nacelle
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learning curve doesn't mean "every steepness is the same"

dense violet
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you've been here for years - you know how to build them 😛

sullen gull
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"Two days, and I get to use my bps

ocean frost
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I have a blueprint you can use

sullen gull
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All 12,300 of it 😏

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But, gotta have the crater lakes open 😛

wicked nacelle
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the coal is nice, for sure. but it's not enough to process all of it I don't think --in fact I know it's not cuz I built there and it wasn't

sullen gull
feral geyser
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I have a blueprint for a Broke Boy Blender that I never used, but would hate to go to waste.

sullen gull
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Namely how to manage a flow rate higher than max pipe capacity.

whole drum
sullen gull
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Though, I can admit, probably not immediately intuitive for sure.

whole drum
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There are many valid ways to, but the obvious first inclination of "just feed it back into itself" is potentially faulty if they don't know the right way to

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And the right way isn't intuitive

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Once you understand it, it's not hard either

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  1. Bring the fresh water in higher than the recycled water.
  2. Let the recycled water fill up in the machines and pipes, then turn down the extractors to match flow rate.
sullen gull
whole drum
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That's basically the same idea via different method, lol

sullen gull
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The gravity issue is the part that isn't always "intuitive" imo.

whole drum
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I do like your approach tho

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Simple and elegant

sullen gull
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That and I have found when bringing fresh into the "center" of a recycling loop helps as well.

whole drum
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Having a pump at the end of the recycled right before it joins the fresh helps as well

green fiber
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The thing about merging fresh and byproduct water is that the system usually has trouble recovering if you are missing bauxite or coal or of the scrap or silica back up

whole drum
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Avoid mixed backflow

sullen gull
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Heh, was wondering if/when the author was going to poke in 😛

green fiber
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So its a lot of dependancies

whole drum
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True

sullen gull
green fiber
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Precise layout matters of course

sullen gull
whole drum
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McG -- If CSS wanted to put your Manual in the Codex, is that something you would give them permission for?

green fiber
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I dont think the manual is up-to-date enough anymore

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We learned a lot more about pipes in the time since

whole drum
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Is there anything in it that no longer applies?

sullen gull
green fiber
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Im working on a more helpful troubleshooting guide to supersede the manual in a way

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But that will take time

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And im actually interested in how much 1.2 will change pipes

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So ive cautiously kinda put that on hold for now

whole drum
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I'm hoping it fixes the pipe connection bugs

green fiber
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I hope it fixes a bunch of other stuff

whole drum
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Like when you place stuff onto the pipes and it sometimes breaks the connections

green fiber
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Theres a bug where when you load the save the pipes kinda pause flow for a moment

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which frequently causes nukes to stutter

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And then theres the jank of junctions....

whole drum
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And floor holes

sullen gull
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I feel like there is a bug with the blueprint designer window adding about 100k UOBjects every time it's loaded/opened 😛

sullen gull
whole drum
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That's what they said, but I've had to redo them on several occasions

green fiber
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New ones or old ones ?

whole drum
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All after 1.0, if that's what you're asking

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Though... hmm? Maybe it's the ones between 1.0 and 1.1 I had issue with. I'm not actually sure.

sullen gull
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I have only ever had one placement type bug since , but that was chocked up to something I did as I couldn't repeat it. Never had one "broken" since very shortly after 1.0 (there was a patch that fixed)

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Where the pipe would snap to the bottom of the floor hole ..

whole drum
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Oh, yeah. If you mouse over it a certain way that can happen

sullen gull
whole drum
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Man, having such bad luck in D2R tonight 😢

fiery pewter
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The closest I have ever been to finishing a turbofuel plant was not too long ago

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I had everything connected and stuff

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To then find out, right before I turned it on, that the (un)packagers for the packaged fuel recipe had no belt output connected

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-# muffeld screaming

whole drum
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So belt them 🙂

fluid sapphire
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indeed, that sounds like a minor problem, much less of an annoyance than having to rebuild stuff

wicked nacelle
sterile blade
sullen gull
sterile blade
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Some don't even use 1m foundations, so it can fly below many radars

sullen gull
whole drum
whole drum
sullen gull
whole drum
sullen gull
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Err, no, it was Ressurected ... But, yes lol

wicked nacelle
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anyhow, just popped into my head randomly from long ago. fun song in the game

whole drum
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Ah, I was more of the Guitar Hero/Rock Band type

sullen gull
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I could totally picture xaxxon holding on to the rail going for that Expert 😛

fluid sapphire
#

i built two train stations to a factory spot, then continued building the next day, completely forgot why i built the second one, then deleted it, finished the building... and remembered why i built the second station

whole drum
#

Playing solo Offline because my friends didn't want to play this Ladder season, and my sorc is able to do Hell Andy and Lower Kurast runs, but I need a breakthrough drop or two to take this char to the next level

sullen gull
fluid sapphire
#

i could have just named the station and this could have been avoided

sullen gull
fluid sapphire
#

i will somehow duct tape my way out of this xd, i dont feel like rebuilding, i dont actually need the second station right now, it was just to export SAM for the future

whole drum
#

When people talk about SAM I think of "Sammy," the Samsung girl--who was instantly goonified by the internet not half an hour after official debut

fluid sapphire
#

never heard of that

whole drum
#

It's hilarious

sullen gull
#

Now, if you had mentioned Flo .... 😛

fluid sapphire
#

i have a very particular set of rules for building rail, on one hand this kinda sucks, on the other.. maybe something cooler will come out of this

sullen gull
fluid sapphire
#

if only they could be called skills, it wouldnt take me endless hours of experimentation to line everything up nicely every time i need to make an intersection or offshoot

whole drum
#

Just search "Sammy Samsung" and you can see what I'm talkling about. The funny part was that Samsung announced her as a mascot for their advertising and there was already R34 content within half an hour.

sullen gull
whole drum
#

Apparently the ahem "Hub" is reaaally efficient

sullen gull
whole drum
#

She was meant to be kind of like M$'s Cortana

fluid sapphire
sullen gull
#

Take a look at Hornslets CRS and others

fluid sapphire
#

its adapted to the terrain

#

and this particular situtation

#

i am talking about the spacing and layout

#

not individual pieces

sullen gull
#

The "rail system" can be made super quicky, and added on to, via blueprints, no mater the terrain, what you build "connecting it to said terrain" will vary where blueprints may or may not help depending on design. But not the base rail system.

fluid sapphire
#

thats just word salad arguing semantics, what i was saying was that in that kind of situation blueprints are little help

wicked nacelle
#

of course if you use non-standard (larger) sized blueprints they can become more useful

fluid sapphire
#

i often end up needing a custom solution where there are multiple buildings

#

aluminum is a big player for sure

wicked nacelle
#

do you have trains? aluminum and trains play very nice together to get it where it actually needs to go.

fluid sapphire
#

notice that basically all bauxite is in a straight line in the middle of the map, east to west

wicked nacelle
#

plastic/rubber and aluminum/casings are both great things to deliver by trains to the plcaes that need it that's closer to the other exotic resource types that those things will also need

novel heath
#

id prefer to focus more on getting copper and quarts (If you dont have alt recipes) nearby

fluid sapphire
#

there are many ways to skin the cat is that is aluminum

#

your life will get easier once you embrace trains

wicked nacelle
#

trains are super powerful once you get used to them. but like everything else there's a bunch of ways to do stuff

#

I consider trains to be the most interesting part of the whole game

#

I'm doing my current game without trains and it's awful

fluid sapphire
#

consider your options for making aluminum, there are some great alt recipes that can make life easier in some ways, but introduce some other work

wicked nacelle
#

aluminum without "pure aluminum" is annoying. All the others are all preference.

fluid sapphire
#

i like sloppy alumina and pure ingot, it makes the whole thing stupid simple

wicked nacelle
#

anyhow, just keep your eyes open for pure aluminum. no one will say that you don't want that

fluid sapphire
#

note that with the recipes i mentioned, the only thing you will have to deal with is the water, there are also a few ways to deal with it, no doubt you will be back with that

#

its bauxite

strange mica
#

Just did the most spaghetti bus for the 3 quartz & 1 SAM node I found in this cave because the farm for them wouldn't fit inside bhwahahahah

#

All in all I hate the spiders

#

Nightmarish things of horror

hard steeple
#

just got a jetpack and my first batch of Turbofuel... I predict my death very soon

novel heath
fluid sapphire
hard steeple
#

is there a way to prevent fall damage, if im pummeting due to a lack of fuel?

fluid sapphire
#

nor is quartz

fluid sapphire
hard steeple
#

ok, ill see if i can remember to do that lol

sullen gull
#

It will always want to put "health items" in the first spots

hard steeple
#

oh dang! i never knew that

sullen gull
#

Or least it seems that way with me anynow.

#

Works also when building machines and inserting power shards.

#

So long as the shards are in your inventory, and not the DD of course.

hard steeple
#

as someone who just discovered you can type in overclock speeds, including decimal ones, these tricks are so great

fluid sapphire
hard steeple
#

wait, really? lol

fluid sapphire
#

if you want something like 889/1200, that box is your guy

hard steeple
#

oh thats great

fluid sapphire
#

note there will still be rounding errors, but it can be easier than typing out 4 decimals sometimes

hard steeple
#

very cool, i guess i dont need the calculator anymore

#

i know fine tuning this early is prolly overkill but.. i need it perfect!

fluid sapphire
#

those use well pressurizer and extractor, tier 7 i think, maybe 8

#

they just give water, they are usually a bit away from normal water location wise

#

nitrogen primarily

sullen gull
hard steeple
#

I did see those buttons lol

#

im so lazy, i need to untangle my rats nest

sullen gull
fluid sapphire
#

ctrl+c , ctrl + v, use it all the time to set up rows of machines

hard steeple
#

oh neat

sullen gull
odd fox
#

just got my t6 conveyers , they so fast

fluid sapphire
odd fox
fluid sapphire
#

same for pasting

#

my screenshot isnt directly related to that, rather the placement of machines as blocks

sullen gull
fluid sapphire
#

i underclock often

sullen gull
fluid sapphire
#

loads of machines is my usual MO

#

i do too, where i can

#

why build 150 machines when you can build 200

odd fox
#

Agree with you 100 percent there

#

Always underclock

hard steeple
#

seems like tapping space is better than holding it down with the jetpack

#

or amybe im just making it up

whole drum
#

No, it often is

odd fox
#

used less fuel

#

found a floating purple power slug

#

do i leave it alone or harvest it

near thicket
#

Wait the merger is locking onto vertical belts does that...work? Can you put splitters and mergers onto vertical belts?

fluid sapphire
near thicket
#

That's so clutch

odd fox
#

wait thats awesome

fluid sapphire
south sinew
#

there's some glitches with them but yeah it's pretty decent

hard ivy
#

Though they're a bit janky

south sinew
hard ivy
#

And good luck figuring out which way a vertical smart splitter is rotated

hard steeple
#

omg you can upgrade belts directly

leaden turret
hard steeple
#

just running around everywhere upgrading!

#

get out of here you fat whale giraffe thing!

whole drum
hard steeple
#

oh thats cool

sullen gull
sterile blade
#

At the cost of risking a minor spoiler as the game doesn't mention it (iirc): ||holding CTRL, you can replace mergers and smart/programmable/normal splitters too, as well as walls and windows||

fluid sapphire
#

i would hardly consider game controls a form of spoiler

sterile blade
#

To each their own 😆
I'd love it if the game included at least all controls in the in-game tips and tooltips jace_happy

sullen gull
fluid sapphire
#

thats what i am saying, this knowledge should be spread at every opportunity

sullen gull
#

Though, still not a "spoiler", in the regards that one didn't "stumble" upon it themselves lol

fluid sapphire
#

its a pretty complex and feature packed set of controls

sullen gull
#

I feel SOO bad for console users and never knowing the ❤️ of infinite nudge 🤣

mortal ginkgo
#

best brotherman ever cute_doggo

leaden turret
mortal ginkgo
#

here is another thing that newbies don't know: ||impure limestone nodes are important <3||

#

dont check it out if you are a beginner

fluid sapphire
leaden turret
vague flame
#

How do I make a hypertube branch go out to the right and not the left?

fluid sapphire
fluid sapphire
vague flame
fluid sapphire
# vague flame how?

mousewheel, if you are on pc, or whatever button is "rotate hologram" after you have placed the hologram

vague flame
#

but it places it instantly

#

I dont have a hologram

#

nvm I got it

fluid sapphire
whole drum
#

I like ocb, wut you talking bout?

#

Makes laying out foundation super fast

#

Belts ez too

leaden turret
#

@void gorge running floods or running fjords? mikaelsmile

void gorge
#

froords

whole drum
#

Did someone say Foods?!

reef basin
#

no it was Frodos

whole drum
#

If there's more than one, Sauron doesn't stand a chance

reef basin
#

This is getting out of hand, now there's two of them!

leaden turret
void wedge
#

will there be winter sales??or nah?

leaden turret
#

👃🏞️
🦶

void wedge
#

ma friend wants 2 bui the game

leaden turret
quick hound
pine ore
#

since i couldnt find any info about it on wiki can someone tell me how much turbofuel does one 250% overclocked fuelgenerator needs per minute ?

#

i know the stock one is 7.5

dense violet
#

which you seem to know

pine ore
#

so 18.75 ?

dense violet
#

if that's what 7.5 x 2.5 is 🙂

#

clockign machines have linear consumption and production

#

clocked at 50% ? uses 50% of the material pm it normally does

pine ore
#

so i need to find space for 36 fully clocked generators 😭 alr

dense violet
#

you can make multiple floors. But that is the downside to fuel stations.

#

I tend to stick to coal until like ... tier 7 personally

leaden turret
pine ore
quick hound
#

HEY COBALT!!

dense violet
#

yo

quick hound
#

How are you?

dense violet
#

bout to head to bed 🙂

quick hound
#

Lucky fucker

dense violet
#

its almost 1am 😛

quick hound
#

It’s almost 7 am for me

pine ore
leaden turret
pine ore
leaden turret
dense violet
pine ore
elder light
#

omg im exhausted with this pipe lines system 😭is there anyone who can help me plz

dense violet
elder light
#

ok thanks

quick hound
dense violet
#

north west

leaden turret
quick hound
leaden turret
#

[comment redacted because #rules ]

elder light
quick hound
gentle lion
#

Interactive map and in game divide int by 100 or something like that?

fluid sapphire
#

wym

gentle lion
#

Coords on interactive are way longer than in game

fluid sapphire
#

does it make any practical difference?

gentle lion
#

I'm at -578, something and inteecative was 57,000 something

fluid sapphire
#

cant say i have ever paid any attention to the coordinates on SCIM

#

its not an official tool, there are bound to be some small inconsistencies

gentle lion
quick hound
old bramble
#

Okay question is stock piling the raw ore with trains a good idea to move it to a better location for building vertically?

reef basin
#

why would you stockpile raw ore? 🤔

quick hound
#

Hi GREENY! How are you?

leaden turret
old bramble
gentle lion
reef basin
leaden turret
old bramble
reef basin
#

the train platform has own storage

#

buffering the platform is a good idea though

quick hound
#

How you doing Greeny?

old bramble
#

Still storing it in the train depot though. I know it has its own storage. But it has to store ore inside it to load the train. You can’t load the train if there’s nothing in the depot/station

#

Like what I’m saying is I’m putting ore in the station to unload. Maybe I’m phrasing it wrong?

#

Or am I just overthinking it and I shouldn’t be moving the ore at all and instead parts.

quick hound
#

oh no… I just watched my lizard doggo fall off a cliff..

old bramble
#

Reminds me of the Amazing Spider-Man 2 scene in the clocktower.

remote cedar
#

am i being stupid or can you just not use satisfactory tools to plan how to get rid of the uranium waste from nuclear, just get unable to calculate reseult whenever i put plutoneum fuel rods in the planner

reef basin
#

there's no recipe for waste in the game, so you need to tell it you have waste available

remote cedar
#

oh my god

#

thank you haha

#

also W website in the firstplace aswell

candid marsh
#

sup... question

thorny prawn
#

it is a well

stoic steeple
hasty dragon
#

The little ones have the purity. The middle one is the hub

candid marsh
#

ohhh i see

#

thx guys

#

I'm still trying to find some sam node T_T

ornate saffron
candid marsh
#

forest

sullen gull
#

Curious, a save will retain every pioneer that connects to a save in a sitting position right? Or does a save only keep the last "so many" that has joined a save? Like last 10 or something...

ornate saffron
candid marsh
#

oh damn! thx

ornate saffron
# candid marsh oh damn! thx

Np, I also started there this playthrough. Out of the 6 times of completed the game. This was my favorite start

ornate saffron
candid marsh
#

I don't remember which one was, but the only time I found sam was right at the beginning

quick hound
candid marsh
#

teh good thing is I've been farming a lot of slugs and hard drives

ornate saffron
quick hound
whole drum
quick hound
#

GILGAAA! How are you?

candid marsh
#

bruh... 342hs playing and only saw a single sam node in my life T_T

sullen gull
whole drum
#

Don't feel bad. I was 120hrs into my first factory before I discovered it, lol

shell lava
#

OMFG, I hate this block signal and path signal thing

whole drum
quick hound
whole drum
#

I think Forest actually has the most natural SAM sites to easily locate

unkempt blade
quick hound
#

hey it’s factory cart man. Did you know you can get GOLDEN factory carts?

candid marsh
mortal ginkgo
quick hound
sullen gull
unkempt blade
whole drum
quick hound
candid marsh
whole drum
ornate saffron
quick hound
candid marsh
whole drum
#

The extra blade runners are worth a few points in the sink

#

There's like 2 not far from your landing area

sullen gull
#

That's farther south

ornate saffron
candid marsh
quick hound
#

I need to GET ALL THE DOGGERS

stoic steeple
#

I love doggos!!!! cutedoggo

candid marsh
#

I just let em be... just tamed one and I don't know where is it

sullen gull
# candid marsh I have em

Yes, but there are those and more stuffs, scattered around Lizard doggo nests that are "free points" or can be saved for "guests" or backups. blade runners, Xeno Basher, and other various items.

stoic steeple
#

I tame them, then load my save into SCIM and change their position to where my base is so I don't have to spend a 100 hours moving doggos

sullen gull
ornate saffron
stoic steeple
candid marsh
#

what I actually want is use my chainsaw to kill spiders

#

they are so annoying

stoic steeple
ornate saffron
whole drum
#

Or those poison towers

sullen gull
#

Gas noblisks I hear work well.

candid marsh
#

meh, poison is not that bad... just gas mask and some nobelisk

ornate saffron
whole drum
#

I'm saying I wish the chainsaw worked on them

leaden turret
#

although that'd technically be doom gal

candid marsh
#

I mean... that was the first thing I tried to do

ornate saffron
#

Now if we could get a animal crossing helmet we'd be set

whole drum
#

Shame it doesn't work. Would do a lot to justify gas masks--which are otherwise extremely optional.

sullen gull
candid marsh
stoic steeple
ornate saffron
#

Doggo slides

sullen gull
stoic steeple
#

You can launch them on jump pads

sullen gull
#

Yeah, true.

whole drum
#

I want to launch them via railgun... into the moon

candid marsh
#

have you seen the huge doggo on aprils fool?

whole drum
#

No... but I'm gonna need a bigger moon

ornate saffron
native marten
#

what do you guys do when water flow rate just vanishes between segments?

ornate saffron
whole drum
#

Redo the connecting pipes, make sure I have enough headlift, and turn off input machines that draw water until the pipes fill up

craggy vector
#

They should add bigger spiders

whole drum
#

Double check my input/output math for the system, make sure I'm not using stupid things like valves or buffers, and make sure I have power to all my extractors

unkempt blade
stable prairie
#

I think my issue with the train signal system is that I'm using a singular track in multiple directions and it's all technically a single loop

#

It seems that the signal system is meant for parallel tracks that go only one direction

whole drum
#

It's just meant for any time multiple trains need the same space of track, so they don't try to occupy it at the same time

ornate saffron
whole drum
#

If you build bypasses for the stations (like you should), then yes

stable prairie
#

I have bypasses, but I can only place the block signals a specific direction, you can't switch them

#

That makes destinations unreachable

#

If the blocks weren't directional, then you could use bypasses and a single track system

whole drum
#

I think a path signal between the station and where it rejoins the track should work--but I'm not the resident train expert

stable prairie
#

Path signals haven't worked for me, they always face opposite directions and don't work

#

I've never been able to successfully set a path

whole drum
#

Block signals should be enough for a loop tho--just build a couple extra so that your train doesn't have to wait for the one in front to reach the next station before entering the track

ornate saffron
#

At the least you'll have ground meat

stable prairie
#

I finally got a train to move after 14 hours of working on this track and it bypassed the only open track to collide with a train on an occupied track

leaden turret
native marten
#

reconnecting the segments and replacing the pumps seem to have helped, thanks for the replies

whole drum
charred sandal
#

Like. wtaf.

stable prairie
charred sandal
#

somethings fucky with my factory

stable prairie
#

All those conversations also are about parallel rail systems that are unidirectional

#

Mine is a single rail multi-directional setup

ornate saffron
#

They are delicious. I had some Jerky on the weekend

frail sleet
stable prairie
#

Which is my entire issue

frail sleet
#

the advice is: Yeah, they do that, don't build that way

stable prairie
#

I have to scrap my entire rail system because I only have space for a single rail

frail sleet
#

how did you manage that

ornate saffron
whole drum
stable prairie
#

A lot of the areas I fit the rails through are tight, like arches and tunnels

whole drum
#

You can loop ends around and raise up the return track.

frail sleet
stable prairie
#

Unless I start stacking rails on top of one another, I'll have to deal with only one train going to 7 stops

mystic oriole
stable prairie
#

I'd probably need about 8,000 meters of foundations placed

mystic oriole
stable prairie
#

You got me lost on that one

frail sleet
#

1000 foundations is not really a lot, the game can handle a million

stable prairie
#

But building a foundation across the whole map though, that's so resource and time intensive

ornate saffron
mystic oriole
whole drum
#

Build your factories the same way

ornate saffron
mystic oriole
#

just play the game your way.

#

although I must say that the game feels way different when you aren't trying to figure out resource placement, and restrictions are lifted.

fast pivot
#

It is hour 2: I am removing leaves
It is hour 60: I am removing leaves
It is hour 477: I am removing leaves
It is hour 989: I am removing leaves

candid marsh
#

if you don't mind using mods, you can use the mega chainsaw

ornate saffron
#

Ive been using cluster bombs.

candid marsh
#

devs should add the holly bomb here

mortal ginkgo
leaden turret
#

we got snowball grenades already

mystic oriole
#

my brother showed me a mod that turns trucks into harvesters.

candid marsh
fast pivot
#

no matter what it always comes back to removing leaves

#

this game is a lumberjack simulator

mystic oriole
#

I'm way too much of a purist about the game, which is weird. I say no to mods, but bring on the cheaty blueprints and clipping.

candid marsh
#

bruh... just killed a hog and it made a backflip before dying

fast pivot
#

that's the goat simulator engine

candid marsh
#

Now I feel bad for killing such a talented specimen

fast pivot
#

in order to fully and properly enjoy Satisfactory, you should have played Goat Simulator. Satisfactory is the true sequel to Goat Simulator. Goat Simulator 2, if you will. /jk

candid marsh
#

to be fair, that's the average behavior of herbivorous

feral geyser
fast pivot
#

yeah that's the joke

feral geyser
#

Glad that at least I got it 😭

#

I have that graphic novel

fast pivot
#

it's good

uncut coyote
#

I feel like I did something stupid by not having my Tier 3 parts being made right at my steel mill, and instead having them brought to my main "factory" to be made

ornate saffron
uncut coyote
ornate saffron
#

Ive always disliked encased beams

ornate saffron
uncut coyote
ornate saffron
candid marsh
#

honestly, this time I only build the hub when I need it

#

so I can have it anywhere

ornate saffron
# uncut coyote I feel like I should do that now

I put my hub where ever my focus is. If I am making a monster powerplant I put my hub there. If im pilfering the dunes for there resources I put it there. This way when the indigenous life or (most likely) i fall to my death I spawn near

whole drum
#

I like to use the HUB and Elevator as navigational landmarks when I'm exploring around. The HUB shows up on the compass and you can see the Elevator from anywhere.

candid marsh
#

I need to start using more markers honestly. Every time I think I'll be able to memorize everything and fail lol

ornate saffron
#

I turn every run into a challenge run by setting goals and rules

ornate saffron
candid marsh
#

I mean.. I am. that's why this is my fourth world lol

stable prairie
whole drum
#

I play a bunch of saves because I like the progression curve. I'm not one of those single save forever types.

#

Just sloop the save

candid marsh
#

excuse me mr space giraffe... did you just stomped me?

ornate saffron
hoary rose
#

Can a push pull train go on a normal one way track

candid marsh
#

I had a little jumpscare... I was rolling a cig and suddenly everything gets darker and a long ugly foot shows up in front of me

hoary rose
#

Ok

ornate saffron
hoary rose
#

Idk just wanted to make sure it would work thx guys

zealous mesa
#

Refuse to jumpscare

ornate saffron
candid marsh
#

now that i think about it... is smoking considered damage to ficsit property? 🤔

ornate saffron
fallow lantern
#

But it may improve efficiency

pine patrol
candid marsh
fallow lantern
candid marsh
#

I was about to mention you run faster in that game lol

#

but yeah... even when I smoke, I don't find it right to encourage smoking in any way

pine patrol
candid marsh
#

you mean to the game or nicotine?

#

oh yes... it's horrible honestly. I would like to quit but don't wanna deal with abstinence again

mystic oriole
#

you know it's not just the nicotine in the cigarette's that's addictive. There's like a whole family of chemicals in a cigarette that's super addictive. Like there's more than 600 chemicals treating a tobacco leaf.

ornate saffron
#

I smoked for over a decade. Some of the most creative times of my life. Its horrible for your body and the addiction sf_screw your mind

ornate saffron
whole drum
mystic oriole
whole drum
#

Yeah, fair enough. I've enjoyed a few cigars in my life, but was never a habitual smoker.

mortal ginkgo
#

Cigars are bad for your health, but not impure limestone nodes!

#

Tap'em if you see'em! 30/min limestone can go a long way! ❤️

pine patrol
steel kelp
#

You just end up smoking a lot of cigars which are probably worse for your health and definitely worse for your wallet

mortal ginkgo
#

Nothing else is better than "not stopping"

#

it is meant to be hard because you are trying to tell your brain that it doesn't need it while it fights back at the same time

#

Its like that Impure Limestone Node you want to tap but your brain says no (terrible)

whole drum
candid marsh
#

Damn I wanst expecting to start a debate T_T

mortal ginkgo
#

Off topic can go a long way I suppose...

whole drum
#

If you want a debate, convince me tomatos are fruit--you can't.

mortal ginkgo
#

someone @ mods. We got a heretic

honest sleet
#

i really hope that Coffee Stain fixes lizard doggos despawning if you die far away

candid marsh
honest sleet
#

i had like 3 and i lost them all 🙁

mortal ginkgo
honest sleet
mortal ginkgo
honest sleet
#

i have no real buildings yet

quick hound
#

the fuck did I return to?

mortal ginkgo
# honest sleet no, they were running around

thats the issue, they can run REALLY far away and they despawn if you are far away (like regular mobs).

you dont need buildings for them, you just need to cage them while having foundations around them so that their respawn location updates

quick hound
#

hi hey wassup limestone

honest sleet
#

and that makes me rlly sad

quick hound
#

I returned to a debate about eating cigarettes or something, I didn’t read too much

mortal ginkgo
honest sleet
quick hound
#

how do you tame lizard doggos again? I low-key forgot

candid marsh
#

when they look at you, place a fruit on the ground and wait until it eats

pine patrol
#

Okay the time has come i need to upgrade my factory to the point of tearing it down/ rebuilding it. My question is should i abandon it (leaving it to do its thing forever or putting the machines on standby) or tear it down and rebuild?

mortal ginkgo
#

you can go delete later on if you want

pine patrol
#

okay!

#

Is there a place you suggest building my factory is gonna be making Phase 5 parts mostly/entirly frok scratch

mortal ginkgo
candid marsh
pine patrol
stable prairie
#

Apparently if you just slap down block signals completely randomly, not caring about direction, it starts working

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My trains haven't collided and can actually move on the track

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Single track multi-train railways can work, but it makes no logical sense.

If it's not working, spam block signals

whole drum
whole drum
stable prairie
#

Just weird how the signals are so convoluted

whole drum
#

They aren't meant to be

white dawn
stable prairie
#

I've got 5 bypasses for one area for 2 trains to go around each other, so fingers crossed

candid marsh
hard ivy
stable prairie
#

It works so far

white dawn
#

If you've got multiple trains on the same bits of rail, doing a dual-rail system is sort of the only way to go, if you want to be able to trust your train deliveries

stable prairie
#

The space is too tight for a double rail system, and in some areas it's too tight to even double vertically

#

Apparently block signals don't work randomly now

white dawn
#

Regardless: you're going to have deadlocks

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Anyway, enjoy it while it lasts! :)

stable prairie
#

For some reason they're not allowing trains past that were previously able to go down that path

candid marsh
#

so... I'll finally have dimensional depots for the very first time 🥲

stable prairie
whole drum
#

I think single rail pretty much only supports 2 trains (if you have the stations/bypasses set up right), but this means the entire stretch between stations is one "block" and you may have a train waiting quite a bit for its turn to enter.

stable prairie
#

It's crazy to think that single rail tracks actually function IRL

leaden turret
#

<@&370483737957236737> Satisfactory is nominatable for "Labour of Love" in this year's Steam Awards

whole drum
#

That's because there's a communication system behind it

stable prairie
whole drum
#

But also, those "single rail" systems are part of a vast network--not truly singular

stable prairie
#

Hopefully they'll expand on the train signal system to more than just paths and blocks to make single rail systems possible

#

Still seems like I need separate, isolated railway systems with one train each to actually get things functional

primal obsidian
#

is it path signal on every valid entrance and block signal on every valid exit or the other way around for an intersection

stable prairie
#

How does one determine if an entry/exit is valid?

whole drum
primal obsidian
#

like trains are usually going in one direction on one rail so you cant go backwards, unless its a train with 2 engines facing different directions

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ok thanks

stable prairie
#

The tracks have loops at every end that feed back into the rail so the trains can turn around

hard ivy
whole drum
#

Kyo knows way more about trains than I do. Listen to him.

stable prairie
fluid sapphire
#

you can avoid most signaling headache if you design a 2 lane system, i think thats much easier to signal than alternatives

stable prairie
#

It'd be easier if I just switched to trucks

#

Up in the north areas, you really can't fit a parallel rail system

whole drum
#

Yeah, you can use splits and merges to help allow trains to get around each other, but at that point you're basically just half-assed doing the 2 lane system anyway, so just do that instead.

fluid sapphire
#

you can fit it just about anywhere

stable prairie
#

I might just have to manually control all of my trains seeing they can't operate automatically

hard ivy
stable prairie
#

I can't figure out how to fix that

fluid sapphire
#

and again, you can avoid 99% of deadlock possibilites with a 2 lane system

stable prairie
#

Afaik, there's no intuitive tutorial out there to explain path and block signals to idiots

ornate saffron
stable prairie
#

I can't tell if the signal system is too complex or too simple

hard ivy
stable prairie
#

I'll definitely have to switch to trucks then

fluid sapphire
#

3 basic truths:

area between 2 block signals only allows 1 train in at a time

area between a path signal (or chained path signals) and the following block signal is a no-stop zone, that only allows multiple trains to occupy it provided their paths dont cross

all entry signals to intersections must be of the same type

hard ivy
stable prairie
#

2 rails won't fit in that screenshot I posted, I'd have to move everything away from that area to a more open coal mine

fluid sapphire
#

build on supports, higher up

stable prairie
#

I might be able to move my fuel train on a rail down the coast and leave the only congested path at the station

hard ivy
fluid sapphire
#

this is no different than the usual design-around-the-terrain problem

#

there is always a way

stable prairie
#

I just don't see how I can make that junction any smaller without removing it entirely

#

I'd have to make the junction smaller to allow a second rail that doesn't cause the trains to collide

fluid sapphire
#

build at a different location, where there is more room then?

steel kelp
#

My factory makes 10 bwd a min so i think its doing okay

hard ivy
steel kelp
#

And blocks are super intuitive once you get past the silly wording they use. If you have blocks A, B and C. A train in block A wont progress to the next block unless the block is empty. You can literally intuit junctions and such from there

steel kelp
#

Like unless you have some crazy intersection block signals are probably fine imo

#

Thats not the only situation ofc

hard ivy
whole drum
hard ivy
#

path signals require 200 ish meters of space before them, so that could create extra spacing between trains

whole drum
#

I would see path signals as more vital if you have a larger, more elaborate junction system

steel kelp
#

Yeah i have like an 8 way “intersection” and block signals work perfectly fine for me

#

Unless you’re doing some funky stuff idrk how it gets more complicated lol

whole drum
#

Hence why the usual noob advice is "just use block signals" 🙂

steel kelp
#

Yea but thats what i mean by noob trap right

#

Is you see both of them and are like oh i have to use both

hard ivy
steel kelp
#

Or people in youtube videos recommending paths and blocks when you dont really need it

sullen gull
stable prairie
#

If you could manually set paths, it'd help

white dawn
#

Yeah, I dunno if I'd call them a "noob trap," but I generally recommend folks just stick to Block when they're first starting out, for simplicity's sake

#

If implemented correctly but "naively," the worst that'll happen with path signals is your trains slowing down a bit more while approaching the intersections, which isn't awful

stable prairie
#

If I put path signals as instructed at intersections, it claims the intersection and the entire rail system behind it, then it says that the path loops into itself

white dawn
steel kelp
stable prairie
#

You can only do so much when they magnetize to sections

#

Too far back and it doesn't recognize the junction, too close and it's a feedback loop

steel kelp
white dawn
#

(That seems to be more prevalent nowadays; it felt like folks could get away with signals on intersections more often in the past, but reports of problems seem to be more common nowadays. Possibly with v1.1 train-building patches?)

stable prairie
white dawn
hard ivy
white dawn
stable prairie
hard ivy
white dawn
#

Something to do with how I was building, for sure, but I ended up just always setting 'em back a ways

stable prairie
#

Do y'all PC players have trouble placing the signals too?

white dawn
steel kelp
white dawn
#

But we'd occasionally see folks with the same issue as well, pre-v1.1. Just seemed to be a lot less common

steel kelp
#

Which is where you can actually change the direction of the signal at will

stable prairie
steel kelp
#

Yea its pretty annoying, but just rebuild your track to where you need the signals

white dawn
steel kelp
white dawn
#

I'm not sure exactly what that minimum length is (and also I still haven't actually played the game in v1.1, so it's possible things are a bit different now)

steel kelp
#

Which i think is wheels’ issue

stable prairie
#

If y'all happen to come across a good YouTube tutorial for trains that goes in depth to how the system actually works, feel free to ping me for it

hard ivy
leaden turret
#

wondering what we'd need to bribe @green fiber to do a train manual

whole drum
stable prairie
white dawn
hard ivy
white dawn
#

Rebuilding sucks, I know, but rail's quite manageable once you've got the foundations down

steel kelp
hard ivy
steel kelp
white dawn
#

(or at least less-frequently-stop zones. :D)

stable prairie
hard ivy
pine ore
#

does anyone in this server actualy understand pipes ? they never work as i want them to 😭

dusky aspen
#

imagine being able to use somersloops on miners

white dawn
hard ivy
ornate saffron
fluid sapphire
pine ore
hard ivy
dusky aspen
pine ore
#

but i wanna delete this whole powerplant cuz of the pipes holy

white dawn
#

Since a train might be stopping. :)

#

(Just less likely to be doing so)

whole drum
stable prairie
pine ore
#

i filled the pipes to full then started the generators and pipes still seem to "lose" turbofuel in them

hard ivy
white dawn
whole drum
candid marsh
#

ok this is new... I didnt know creatures will fight eachoter. I was kind of ejoying a pokemon battle betweeng hogs and stingers until they started to atack me

random garnet
#

Is making turbo fuel hard?

whole drum
white dawn
candid marsh
white dawn
#

Turbo Fuel's more steps, sure, but at what point do you define difficulty? :)

primal obsidian
#

if i have a a bunch of machines consumin different amounts of copper will each one get enough if i just use a manifold cause the overflow will go to the next machine that needs more

candid marsh
#

The only problem was taking sulfur and coal to it but it was like 1,5 km each node from my oil node

random garnet
#

Does turbo fuel do anything special besides last longer?

Like could I make use of mroe fuel generators using turbo

primal obsidian
#

or is there like something more complicated i have to do

whole drum
pine ore
primal obsidian
#

ok thanks

candid marsh
candid marsh
random garnet
#

So it pretty much can double your gens nice

ornate saffron
hard ivy
random garnet
#

Ngl I set up my train for transporting my crude away to a differnt location for my power plant but then got completely distracted by a differnt project so may aswell jsut go straight to turbo fuel at this rate

candid marsh
ornate saffron
candid marsh
keen violet
#

someone wanna play with me im new

candid marsh
#

I don't know how long it would take me to realize all the thing I could do better

white dawn
ivory condor
ornate saffron
whole drum
white dawn
# pine ore does anyone in this server actualy understand pipes ? they never work as i want ...

Here's the advice I've got saved which will nearly always get you to working 600/min. IMO it's good advice even below that point, though the system is usually more forgiving before then. Note of course that people have gotten working systems while ignoring large swaths of this, and occasionally due to build styles or other vagaries you might still have problems even with all this. But IME it's nearly always "the pipes Just Work":

  1. Keep the system as simple and short as possible.
  2. Loop your manifolds (so: the input goes into both sides of the machines you're feeding)
  3. Feed fluid from above, so gravity does part of the work for you
    4a. Avoid valves entirely (they've been improved for 1.0, so this one might not be as important, but you still don't actually need valves)
    4b. Avoid fluid buffers entirely (except as buffers for train lines, where they are rather necessary)
  4. Prefill your pipes! Full pipes are happy pipes. Wait until the system's thoroughly saturated before turning machines on.
  5. Place junctions before pipes. If you do snap junctions onto pipes, dismantle and rebuild the pipes afterwards.

See #screenshots message for an example of 2+3 specifically. And of course, as mentioned, the fluid simulation tends to be more forgiving as the rate goes down, so keeping your pipe systems below 600/min is another option too.

#

Obviously that advice is geared more towards getting the most out of mk2 pipes, but IMO it will often help in general too

ivory condor
#

I was about to try to find what you posted yesterday as it gave a good basic run down

quick hound
#

Oh hey! How are you doing Apoc?

hard ivy
ivory condor
#

I would say 2. on that list is the most important, especially with mk2 pipes and manifolds, as that seems to lead to the most issues for players on average

keen violet
hard ivy
pine ore
quick hound
pine ore
#

it looks bad anyway

fluid sapphire
ivory condor
quick hound
white dawn
fluid sapphire
whole drum
#

I seldom do #3 because I often build up off the ground quite a ways. Just have enough pumps and you're good.

white dawn
#

If you want to accumulate some fuel in buffers for emergency use, I'd recommend filling those up first and then disconnecting them from the system once they're full

#

The reason why some of us recommend avoiding them altogether is that their behavior isn't always obvious to folks unfamiliar with them, and can cause unintended problems which are difficult to track down. (They can be used in "live" systems and have stuff work just fine, but the fewer variables to troubleshoot the better, IMO)

whole drum
#

I really struggle to see how that emergency stockpile is helpful tbh

fluid sapphire
#

if power is a concern, just use power storage

ornate saffron
# quick hound I have power storage

I find power priority switches help. Set them so that systems that are a pain to black start are the highest priority. Think power plants, aluminum and such.

This way other factories shut down if you hit your capacity. Giving you the freedom to upgrade your grid with out the pain of blackstarts

white dawn
#

The situation you want to avoid is "oh, I'm running short on fuel but good thing I have these emergency fuel buffers fulled up!" but it turns out that your system is running short because of weird interactions with your buffer

#

Like if you didn't have the buffers at all, things might have been fine. :) (And yeah, for emergency power handling, Power Storages are probably your better bet)