satisfactory

[regal lantern]

What about belts, all volumes and all distances if you're insane enough?

[hybrid nymph]

The aluminum plant is only about 600 m away from the quartz

[silk ocean]

I'm not a huge fan of drones because you still have to have a backend logistics network to deliver fuel to the drone ports, or at least one of them on the back-forth route

[ripe basin]

Sometimes yes sometimes no
If you want to move your resources in small batches and not worry about obstacles - use drones.
If you want to move large amounts of tresources fast - use trains

Oh hey there

[rose tulip]

guys we have a problem

[gusty bronze]

belts require a special touch of insanity, but yes they are the fastest period

[rose tulip]

turns out my friend has arachnophobia

[coral glacier]

I wish Satisfactory had dimensional teleporters for materials.
It'd be far superior than using drones.

[hybrid nymph]

Then I guess I'm using trains.

[gusty bronze]

settings as a button for that

[rose tulip]

Whos telling him

[regal lantern]

I've done nothing but run mk6 belts everywhere now. I have one train and it just goes around the edge of the map carrying a random amount of plutonium waste

[split trench]

y'all have any posts regarding pipes/fluid mechanic that you wanna share from reddit/QASite/YT ? Can drop in my DM ty 😄

[rose tulip]

wish he knew earlier

[hybrid nymph]

Okay, well it's 3:00 a.m. for me. I should probably be heading to bed.

[gusty bronze]

I think it turns the spiders in to bunnies or something

[rose tulip]

cats

[ripe basin]

Hello mister developer

[split trench]

Pinging me is fine.

[rose tulip]

ok

[gusty bronze]

no more pipes, start working on satisfactory 2: the search for nekos money

[rose tulip]

or make glider keybind

[silk ocean]

If you wish to look at my gold coast turbo blend plant, I seem to need to add additional crude even though I am making and consuming 600 it doesn't seem to be able to support all, I've had to inject an additional 300 ish

[coral glacier]

Not talking about the Dimensional Depot that you can use to quick-grab for your inventory, i mean dimensional teleporters For materials to get from one belt to another that is across the world without making a conveyor that long. :P

[rose tulip]

separate from jump

[ivory condor]

Well about that. I presently have mk2 pipes that aren't behaving

[split trench]

Yes, as last resort if everything fails to solve your problem...

[rose tulip]

u can use it for that

[coral glacier]

Oh!

[rose tulip]

I AM BEGGING make the glider have its own adjustable keybind

[gusty bronze]

mk 3,4,5,6 pipes when? mk X oil pumps when? when can we start pumping liquid hot magma?

[coral glacier]

That is very useful.

[regal lantern]

I never solved my issue with my original oil setup and I can't tell if pipes and sloshing were the issue at this point

[ripe basin]

It will ruin the balance and fun

[gusty bronze]

https://tenor.com/view/dr-evil-austin-powers-scream-gif-15611984

[rose tulip]

upgraded version at least

[gusty bronze]

somewhere in the days of yor under screen shots I have examples of how to prevent sloshing and effecient pipe splitting, just look under my name, the pipes were color coded

[rose tulip]

is there a dev active on discord or did he abandon us

[regal lantern]

It's fine, I worked around it by changing all the fluid transfers to be packagers and by removing some of my manifolds for loadbalancers

[reef basin]

devs aren't usually active on this discord

[gusty bronze]

I'm a dev, just not this game, does that count?

[regal lantern]

Nothing else seemed to work and it may not have been pipes as a problem since the oil never backed up in the pipes, it was containers in my first set of unpackaging

[rose tulip]

i need that glider on a separate button

cant move with it

[reef basin]

if you want to give feedback, use the QA site where they read the messages (but don't usually reply)

[fossil ice]

Satisfactory Questions

You can send Questions, Feedback, Suggestions, and Bug Reports
https://questions.satisfactorygame.com
<3 @unborn gyro

[ripe basin]

Whats the difference between oil (for cooking) and butter? When you translate it to russian, both are Масло

[gusty bronze]

oil for cooking is animal or plant fat, butter is milk fat

[rose tulip]

one u can put out with water

one burns one melts

[ripe basin]

Okay next question
Whats the difference between chips and crisps? My english teacher asked

[gusty bronze]

chips is americian english, crisps are british english, same thing

palm products are sustainable now, they are farm grown

got a recent news post to the contrary I'd gladly read it

[true mulch]

pinging @green fiber just in case

[green fiber]

Would a collection of save files as a google drive link work too?
Together with QA posts of course

[grave burrow]

LOL that would be hilarious and terrifying 🤣 😂

[rose tulip]

should I be scared of mk2 pipes
I heard they are difficult and bugged or sth

[regal lantern]

Just depends where they get used and how the fluids go

And to remember pipes aren't conveyors

[rose tulip]

why are they different from mk1?

[silk ocean]

Be afraid... be very afraid 😉

[regal lantern]

They're twice as big

[silk ocean]

They are fine xD

[rose tulip]

Need more pumps?

[regal lantern]

No, they function the same

[silk ocean]

Pumps are only for headlift

[regal lantern]

Just twice the throughput

[rose tulip]

then what

would the problem be

[regal lantern]

600/m rather than 300/m

[rose tulip]

a lot of people struggle apparently

[silk ocean]

It's probably just more like by the time they have unlocked Mk.2 pipes they are inherently doing more complex plumbing setups, at a guess

[regal lantern]

You can avoid them all by building an unhealthy amount of packagers and using millions of containers

[rose tulip]

thanks

so I can just replace every mk1 with an mk2 but this time I can add more crossings?

dont need pipe guide

I‘m a casual player

[regal lantern]

It'd just mean the pipes have higher capacity, they just function the same. You can have the same amount of crossings, or more, but this will increase complexity and may result in bad flow

[silk ocean]

Pipe guide can still be useful for casual play, e.g. when you get into alumina that requires re-processing of fluids etc

[rose tulip]

so I need more extracting power

and pumping power in general

[regal lantern]

No more pumping power unless you add more pipes and go up. Pumps are just for lift, making your pipes pump upwards towards the sky.

Added extracting, sure. That happens anyway though

[green fiber]

They are faster and thats troublesome in certain cases*

[regal lantern]

And don't be scared to run pipes at 600/m, I have a few. They're just simple pipes running single resources like oil to a single setup and it's never the designed bottleneck

[rose tulip]

alr

trains

[silk ocean]

If all your plumbing is relatively level, less than 10m of headlift, you shouldn't really need any pumps, it's just a waste of power

[regal lantern]

You probably don't want two tractors going through the same thing in opposite directions (I'm assuming they're going opposite)

Unless it's the same direction at different speeds, at which point you'll need to move one or accept they'll get stuck

[reef basin]

they are not really much different

and not really bugged (meaning there's no specific bug with mk2s). They can be run at full capacity when dealt with properly

[regal lantern]

Might be worth building ramps and a some platforms to make a track where they won't need to go through the same choke point

[rose tulip]

regarding ficsit tickets

save up or nah

[reef basin]

depends on what do you want. Save for things you want to buy 😉

[silk ocean]

Depends what you want to buy

[rose tulip]

unlock all blueprints first right?

then stuff like gates?

[dense violet]

Blueprints? You make those

[silk ocean]

There's nothing in the awesome shop that is required to progress, so really just whatever you want

[rose tulip]

make the ladder one then

[dense violet]

Things like sockets, lasers, wall mounts for pipes and belts are practical

[reef basin]

wow we got lasers? 😄

[rose tulip]

and the thing that counts /min on belts

[regal lantern]

It's worth getting things like the management and foundations, if you plan to use them

[dense violet]

Then prob just grab whatever you fancy

[dense violet]

Those are pretty useless tbh

[rose tulip]

recommend sth then

elevator?

[reef basin]

(and there have been reports of them not being accurate)

[regal lantern]

Things on the management tab have the most practical uses

[dense violet]

I did. Everything apart of those you can easily manage without m

[reef basin]

what you personally want

practically all of them are just QOL and not really needed to play the game, so depends what you feel like using in your factory

[regal lantern]

Nothing in the awesome shop is required though. It's personal choice

[rose tulip]

I am peak efficiency

[silk ocean]

lizzard doggo statue max priority item xD

[rose tulip]

no design whatsoever

[unkempt blade]

woah woah woah, I'm just here to spread the gospel of factory cart not play any games

[regal lantern]

Gold factort cart?

[rose tulip]

how will you get the resources to factory carts

[unkempt blade]

beautiful! classy! useful! just like regular carts

[regal lantern]

Just annoys me that removing a golden cart results in a normal cart getting returned

[unkempt blade]

yeah but does he use factory carts? if not he might just be a tricky devil pretending to be our lord and savior

[rose tulip]

is there a limit to player amount in a world

[unkempt blade]

4 by default but I think you can still increase it in a config file (at your own peril)

[rose tulip]

if not why not make a world for the whole server (lame idea) (bad idea) (I am bored out of my mind)

[silk ocean]

wiki.gg says: "Up to 127 players are theoretically possible, but not practically."

[rose tulip]

imagine the lag 😭

[silk ocean]

Epic xD

[rose tulip]

lgio would approve

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O-qqgRjfo3s&list=PLrBjj4brdIRwRkGTLKqH5hlS_mlMYn_J0

(this guy)

can some admin make links have the preview window

[dense violet]

only admins can have hte previes on this channel

[rose tulip]

aw

[reef basin]

no, because thish channel has disabled embeds intentionally

(mostly due to gif spam and people using this channel instead of #screenshots and #1038092680493801533 )

[silk ocean]

It's busy enough without embeds and images xD

[rose tulip]

fair enough

[limpid cairn]

Isn’t it mainly because people join and post random stuff thsz isn’t allowed

As in gore, 18+ stuff etc

Or wait

You meant embeds not pictures etc

[reef basin]

no, that's separate thing that's handled by whitelist of urls

[reef basin]

pictures are also embeds

[clear wadi]

the more i build this power grid the more i want to tear it down and build again from scratch

😭

its a mess

[dense violet]

messy power plants are a problem, yes

[clear wadi]

i think manafold is possible here

[regal lantern]

Better to wait until you unlock more/build a higher level of generator to rebuild it

[clear wadi]

if i give each section a bin and lot of canister

[versed mesa]

Hello I need help please how do I unlocked Tier 3 ive completed Tier 2 milestones

[clear wadi]

i need 8.375 row of 8 refinery

[regal lantern]

Space elevator

[versed mesa]

What about it ?

[regal lantern]

You'll need to feed it some things

[split trench]

Saves >>>>>>>>>> QA post

[versed mesa]

Lije I said ive completed whats all needed within tier 2 but tier 3 has not unlocked

[regal lantern]

Yes, you'll need to feed some items into the space elevator to unlock more

[clear wadi]

u can put 3 assembler next to it and throw material into a bin and sombersloop them =))

[versed mesa]

Like what because it's not telling me todo anything more

[dense violet]

build the space elevator, it tells yhou

[versed mesa]

Ive got a pic but can't currently send here just yet

[regal lantern]

Look at the space elevator or the top right. It'll have a goal like 50 smart plating

[versed mesa]

I completed the goals thats what am saying

[clear wadi]

did u sent the cargo?

[versed mesa]

All is ticked off

But tier 3 still locked

[regal lantern]

Yes, you'll need to complete the phase in the space elevator and send things to unlock tier 3 and 4

https://satisfactory.wiki.gg/wiki/Space_Elevator

[versed mesa]

No can do because I completed

[dense violet]

so you put 50 smart plate in the space elevator? cause it sounded like you had no idea what the space elevator was before

[regal lantern]

You need to do Space Elevator things to unlock more tiers

[versed mesa]

Its that ship that take complete task up to space

[regal lantern]

That's your HUB, not the space elevator

[versed mesa]

Ive just did my last one but it never went onto tier 3

[regal lantern]

Build a space elevator and do what it commands

[unkempt blade]

did you go to the elevator and pull the lever?

[versed mesa]

One moment let me look

Ah maybe I do need to build the big elevator then

[unkempt blade]

yeah you send stuff to the elevator then you interact with the elevator and pull the lever to send the materials you gave it to space then you'll get the next research available

[versed mesa]

It dies actually say at top objective build space elevator I did see this earlier on into the game

Thanks very much

[clear wadi]

[versed mesa]

Am new to the game so ive just been working on understanding it

[clear wadi]

u'll like it but dont forget to sleep like me

[gusty bronze]

they did some time ago also add a reminder to drink water and take a break

surprised it doesn't just shut down after playing 20 hours straight

[limpid cairn]

i recommend sending stuff to the elevator via factory carts

[solemn igloo]

hello guys i am new here

[gusty bronze]

Hi new, I'm mom

[carmine aspen]

satisfactory? nuh uh
cable management simulator

[limpid cairn]

small advice, use the double wall power poles

if you connect power to one side, both sides have power

[signal shale]

I kinda wish they had a through-floor double-ended power pole.

[carmine aspen]

i want a firemans pole

[ivory condor]

Imagine thinking mk2 pipes are actually reliable

well there is one way they only seem to be sort of, anybody like making more pipe loops

I sure love how the game does not tell you at all, that you really need to start using pipe loops heavily once you get to mk2 pipes, or great suffering awaits

[silk ocean]

As in take the end of the manifold and run it back to the start?

[ivory condor]

Yes I have made that mistake many times and experienced great suffering later when I realized, oh this all isn't reliable at all

[silk ocean]

I've yet to have a need to do a loop but I think I'll do them for the excitement value xD

[ivory condor]

Even a 6 blender rocket fuel setup needs a loop, i made a mistake not doing it, and well this isn't ending well

[silk ocean]

I have 4 x 6 blender for blended turbo fuel but it mostly seems fine but I'm gonna loop dat up XD

[ivory condor]

Is that outputting for a total of 600m3, because that is where the great suffering seems to await

[astral gyro]

I got my first plastic and rubber up last night

[silk ocean]

600/min of Fuel yea

[ivory condor]

ok, your suffering is coming soon

[astral gyro]

I was using excel to plan, am I right in my math that if you are using the straight plastic and rubber recipies (that let out heavy crude oil) that you get 80 more mw for using petroleum coke into coal gens than using the heavy oil into fuel?

[silk ocean]

Well the plant has been in operation for 2 days now and still waiting for suffering XD

[astral gyro]

4 making plastic, 4 making rubber, the 120 heavy crude makes 360 petroleum coke that can go into 15 coal gens with 3 down clocked to 60 mw making 1080mw total, but it was only 1000mw with my math turning that heavy oil residue into fuel because it could only power 4 fuel gens

[ivory condor]

don't worry its coming im sure, i already found my suffering with my 6 blender total that outputs 600m3 and mk2 pipe cannot handle it

it can only handle it with a pipe loop

[silk ocean]

I'm retrofitting loops as we speak

[fluid sapphire]

You also could have built generators after every blender separately instead of merging your outputs

[ivory condor]

Well you could just wing and see what happens, could be fun

[silk ocean]

Nothing has happened in 2 days I don't think anything is gonna happen XD

[ivory condor]

I thought the same thing to, until everything happened

[fluid sapphire]

If it's been running for 2 days it's probably fine (unless it's my aluminum factory)

[cosmic garden]

I am doing a round map loop dual train track (already built), Now that I want to use signals to segment the track to prevent collisions, is there a way to bulk place (mod?) signals at a set interval? (length of a locomotive and 4 carriages) it is super tedious to drive a bit, place, drive, place

[silk ocean]

And that's literally 2 days because my LAN server runs 24/7 regardless if logged in or not XD

[fluid sapphire]

Just ballpark it, you don't need to measure

Your blocks can be longer

[cosmic garden]

Ohh I am roughing it, Some are way longer then the train lol. I just want to see if there is a way or mod that can do like 5 signals in 1 go

[ivory condor]

idk how am i supposed to make that work for 58 fuel generators

well each blender outputs 100m3 so time for more math hmmmm

[fluid sapphire]

One generator at 240% consumes 10 rocket fuel

[ivory condor]

so I need 9.59 fuel generators, this math doesn't seem clean to me

well 9 fuel generators and the last one i need some weird clock value for I guess

[fluid sapphire]

Huh

[ivory condor]

well the last one would be set for 6.22 fuel consumption, fun

[fluid sapphire]

What? You said a blender makes 100 per minute, right? I said one generator at 240% uses exactly 10, that's 10 generators

[ivory condor]

but it should be fine, i could probably just ignore some of these decimals hmmmm

[ivory condor]

oh I use max clock speed generators at 250%

well i could make that work, problem is though my entire rocket fuel plant would need to be rebuilt, not nearly enough space for that many pipes hmmmm

so this is all theory as i would need to rebuild it all, i have alot of blenders each, so i would need alot of space for that many pipes, still would be alot if each blender had its own dedicated pipe to lol

[silk ocean]

There is some nasty clipping going on with these two loopbacks

Can't be seen in the stack

Out of sight out of mind XD

[ivory condor]

yep XD

i just ignore some clipping now also....

this is fine

[silk ocean]

The other 2 x 6 have a double vertical space between the pipes and the belts, it's almost like I drempt of loops without realising

[warm phoenix]

i found the 20 iron ingot to 5 steel pipe alt recipe
is this good one

[signal shale]

that can be a very useful one, yes. It's part of a combination that lets you make motors with nothing but iron.

[gritty zealot]

Does anyone else masturbate to their own factories

[silk ocean]

Doesn't do that for me even if I do like it

But each to their own

[gritty zealot]

That just means your factories aren't good enough

[silk ocean]

Well I can say it's probably not good enough in general

[gritty zealot]

Have you tried giving it curves

[silk ocean]

There is one somewhere but I prefer right angles

[fluid sapphire]

If you insist on 250% then you are making your life more difficult for no reason but sure

[gritty zealot]

I also does this, what's the problem

[silk ocean]

I clock at 250%

[hard ivy]

? why would it be harder? if anything, it's easier

[simple pier]

Is there a way to kill or just remove the flying eel or whatever it is, they called it steve somewhere lol. It just aggrivating watching it fly through my structures, its very annoying to the point Im just gonna stop playing the game.

[gritty zealot]

It might be a mod

[fluid sapphire]

It doesn't matter, I just like nicer numbers, easier to work with

[silk ocean]

How is the flying eel so annoying that you're gonna stop playing the whole game XD

[gritty zealot]

It's a flying mantis btw

[silk ocean]

Don't build in the grasslands xD

[coral glacier]

S p e e d

[gritty zealot]

You live up to your name

[hard ivy]

there's nothing nicer than max speed

[coral glacier]

Build in the Rocky Desert, nothing except beans live there.

[fluid sapphire]

There is to me

[silk ocean]

My 250% fuel gens are kinda bugged - they are all showing green, until I interact with them and they turn white

[coral glacier]

And the occasional lizard doggo

[hard ivy]

that's a server bug I noticed

[signal shale]

white is fine, just means it's running overclocked, iirc

[silk ocean]

Ah it's a server bug, gotcha

[signal shale]

how do you make a bean go away? One of theem fell into a hole in my foundation and nothing is budging it.

[gritty zealot]

Murder

[dawn sun]

You can kill them, it just takes a while

They're chonky lads

[topaz shale]

And less machines needed to build. Especially once you get to rocket fuels. Need so many damn machines.

[dawn sun]

I raise you my insanity: clocking to round out production numbers so that I can max speed most machines

[hard ivy]

you can just max OC everything 🤷‍♂️

[dawn sun]

I could, however, I could also make something that actually works efficiently

[hard ivy]

the difference in power efficiency is like 1%

not worth the effort to actually calculate the clock speed

just clock everything the same

[silk ocean]

Loopback report - before loops all generators running. After loops, all generators running. Can confirm project great success

[dawn sun]

The starving machine I had to place because I was desperate to overclock a machine to 250 instead of 240 just to squeeze out 0.05 more items per minute out of my factory raising max consumption every once in a while

[ivory condor]

Not sure how its making things more difficult but ok but yes it would make most the sense to clock the 9 generators at 250% and probably underclock the last one slightly

[dawn sun]

Not even mentioning just the fact that it's satisfying if everything runs at 100% uptime efficiency

[hard ivy]

that's a you issue 🙃
I don't care

[dawn sun]

Then stop pushing your opinion if the ones of others don't even matter to you.

[ivory condor]

Good to hear, its mostly to ensure that in the long term generators stay running at 100%, mostly because I have always seen throughput issues with mk2 pipes and only things like loops seem to give them any sort of reliability

Everytime I try the simpler way aka manifold with no loop backs, it just doesn't end well

[silk ocean]

There do seem to be some issues with Mk.2 pipes yea, like producing 600 but somehow some seems to "disappear"

[ivory condor]

well for me I havent seen that, its more pipes cannot move fluid through the pipe manifold fast enough for whatever reason, why that is i cannot say, the pipes are rated for 600m3 but in practice dont seem to be able to deliver that

[silk ocean]

It's probably more that yea, like the last ones in the manifold seem to get starved even though there should be enough flowing in

[ivory condor]

that can happen to, output and input can have similar issues, either output out of a manifold cannot move fast enough or input manifold cannot move the fluid through it fast enough either

its actually really similar as far as what is sort of happening, aka the pipes might say its 600m3, but in reality that really isnt true

[dark raptor]

I was wondering about 600 /m through pipes, I know this can be an issue with fluids, but what if we do this with a gas?

Like putting 4 blenders with rocket fuel 150/m to get 600/m, would that work?

[silk ocean]

Yea I smell a rat somewhere in the plumbing xD

[dark raptor]

I think that is because the maximum throughput is 600 and if the machines spurt out their bit of matter at the same time it Goes over that 600 and Some machines black for a bit and then it drops below 600 already

[dawn sun]

There's a (iirc) pretty comprehensive pipe bs manual in #math-and-meta in the pinned messages- I believe it touches on that issue as well

[dawn sun]

I'm no fluid wizard either but I believe it's something like this, yeah. I think flowrate is involved with it as well but I'm not 100% sure so take it with a grain of salt

[dark raptor]

Yeah i wil, but gas also is a fluid right, so it will behave similarly in this case, yet it will have no head löss

[silk ocean]

Could be nice if machines had larger output buffers and they target maybe 50% buffer level, so they can absorb production bursts but maintain a steady output

[dark raptor]

Yeah that would be amazong

[lost cloak]

do we have a list of all the crash sites? the one on the wiki only contains a few

i need steel pipes specifically

[ivory condor]

No. This I have tested with gas to, aka rocket fuel, it has the same issues

[plush dawn]

well gas expands to fill its container so i would assume that there is no "gas sloshing" in satisfactory, dunno so please do not quote me on that

[ivory condor]

it doesnt matter if you use gas with pipes or not, at least in my testing the same issues are present, aka 600m3 for mk2 pipes isnt true

[hard ivy]

gas is much easier to deal with

[ivory condor]

true normally it should be, but does nothing for the throughput issues mk2 pipes seem to have

[plush dawn]

mk3 pipes when

[hard ivy]

I had no issues getting 600 nitrogen/min for my RF plant all through one pipe

[dark raptor]

Yeah i also felt like this, but in the end of the pipes are limited to the 600/m and the machines want to spurt their matter out, there might not be space for the matter when the spurting quickly exceeds the limit

[dawn sun]

Gas sloshing in pipe systems is kinda still a thing because of pressure and densities- if the prior machine suddenly starts pushing out less of a gaseous product it'll generate a vacuum that is filled by the gas currently in the pipe (irl at least)
I believe in Satisfactory they still just work as gravityless fluids, but again don't quote me either- check the manual 😅

[dark raptor]

I found the nitrogen is not a problem but from machine outputs through pipes regularly delivers headaches

[hard ivy]

machines shouldn't be any different from the extractors

[ivory condor]

seems to hit be or mess, have plenty of issues here even with 6 blenders outputing 100m3 rocket fuel each, mk2 pipe cannot keep up, blenders going idle, because the pipes cannot move it through fast enough, etc

[green fiber]

The only difference between machines and extractors is the recipe ratios

[plush dawn]

adding a buffer would help

[green fiber]

Some Machines make a lot of fluid at once, big batch, so the flow rate tends to be higher

Guess what else is higher when flow raze is higher

[ivory condor]

only one i could fix it at all was using a pipe loop, which btw isnt something the game even says you need to do, so more undocumented rules.....

[green fiber]

Its not a rule its a community-found workaround for a limitation we faced

[dark raptor]

So I reckon Ill just put three blenders a pipe... 24 pipes...

[silk ocean]

Maybe injection manifolds are a better solution than a loop xD

[green fiber]

And it only works the same way a normal junction split would work: you have more pipes that have more flow rate capacity

[ivory condor]

yeah but given how necessary it seems to be, i think its becoming more of a actual rule now, if its the only solution that seems to work anyways

[green fiber]

Either its that or you do balancers

Which given all the pipe math there is are actually more likely to work

If they slosh then so be it, better than manifold still lol

Go on, balance 600/min rocket fuel

[green fiber]

Thats called not using the pipe to its max capacity.

Which works and is a way to avoid it

Thats what the coal gen 3:8 pipes usually do

[silk ocean]

Yep, I've had good success with injections

[lost cloak]

why is all the resources online so outdated?!

The crashsite, at 300, -250, located in the "dune desert", its not even CLOSE to the dune desert. its on almost other side of the map

[green fiber]

Which resource specifically ?

[lost cloak]

BP_DropPod1_4

[green fiber]

Wtf is that supposed to be

[lost cloak]

the name of the pod

sorry i meant crash pod

[silk ocean]

It's right in the middle of the Dune Desert lol?

[ivory condor]

I think I have done somethings like that in the past, but I would rather just use a general solution that I know should work

[atomic notch]

You can get hard drive scanning in the quarts research tree

[green fiber]

I dont care about the pod, i meant the "online resource"

[lost cloak]

isnt dune desert the area north east?

[ivory condor]

aka ill probably just loop all of my pipe systems, that way hopefully everything does work

[green fiber]

Yes dune desert is the north east area

[silk ocean]

Yep same, just gotta do what you gotta do I guess xD

[ivory condor]

and well deal with anything that might happen after that

[lost cloak]

and the coordinates is west

[silk ocean]

Yep and 300, -250 is right in the middle of it xD

[lost cloak]

the desert?

[green fiber]

Where are you getting this info from is what i wanted to know

[lost cloak]

the desert is at 2800, -1500

[silk ocean]

Yea, well slightly to the northern end but definitely well within the Dune Desert

[ivory condor]

yep, well its better than my mk2 pipes running out of gas/fluid right

[lost cloak]

its 2500 meteres outside the dune desert, what you mean?

[unkempt blade]

if you're having trouble finding them and don't want to use the scanner thing I'd just pull SCIM up and compare where you are on the map to where the icon is in SCIM

[lost cloak]

dune desert: 2800, -1500
Crash site coordinates: 300, -250

[silk ocean]

See my #screenshots

[atomic notch]

What

[lost cloak]

then wtf is going on with ingame coordinates

[blissful atlas]

upgrade dimensional depot stack limit first?

[unkempt blade]

I kept them about even as I upgraded, not sure which I did first

[lost cloak]

why is the ingame coordinate system completely different

[unkempt blade]

different than what?

[atomic notch]

I mean idk why ur complaining if ur just looking up crash site coords then running to them kinda cheaty and a lil boring tbh

[silk ocean]

It's actually the same

Just 1 order of magnitude greater numbers

[lost cloak]

so the wiki is going off the system of a 3rd party fan made browser tool, instead of the actual ingame coordinates?

[silk ocean]

300 / -250 SCIM is just 3000 / -2500 ingame

[green fiber]

Ingame is in meters, SCIM uses centimeters i think?

[blissful atlas]

Everyone plays the game differently
Would argue better than just save file editing
I mean once u unlock the scanner for hard drive it's the same

[hard ivy]

the game uses centimetres, and so does SCIM. it's just the map displays meters instead

[green fiber]

Thats what i meant with "ingame"

[lost cloak]

im not using it to cheat, i specifically just need steel pipes so i can unlock dimentional storage. then ill start playing the game

[green fiber]

I kniw the engine uses cm by default

[lost cloak]

i dont even care about the drive, im just getting the pipes

[compact karma]

Is it just me or does satisfactory is down rn?

[hard ivy]

satisfactory cannot be "down"

[silk ocean]

Do you mean your dedicated server?

[polar quartz]

Before i start building this factory is it feasible to transport low volumes of roughly 20 or so items via 2 train stations with 3 freight cars each. The plan was to use smart splitters with sink overflow to avoid backlog but i dont want to build this factory and then figure out its a logistical nightmare.

To be clear this factory will be taking "high level" parts and manufacturing space elevator parts only. zero raw materials other than plastic and rubber if that counts

[compact karma]

oh okqy so it4s just ;eM

[unkempt blade]

20 different items or like 20 items/min?

[lost cloak]

i think you may need to move ur hands on the keyboard to decrypt this

[polar quartz]

20 different items , majority of them very low quantity. Most of them are under 30 items/min other than a couple at about 120 or so

[silk ocean]

What do you mean by "down" ? It's an offline / single player game, you don't need connectivity to play it

[unkempt blade]

it's possible but I think you'll probably have headaches trying to do it. You'd need fancy sorting on the output station and I think over time you'd have unbalanced loads on the input station

[astral gyro]

Even sushi belts scare me lol

[polar quartz]

It doesnt need to be perfectly efficient as the factory is only producing space elevator parts. I just dont want to start a build and have to abandon it due to logistical infeasibility

[compact karma]

no I mean it's not connected to epic maybe because the satisfactory cloud was down (I don't no if it's the epic or satisfactory cloud)

[unkempt blade]

I'd keep the train throughput higher than you actually need + make sure to hook up overflows on the output station side of things

[silk ocean]

I have the steam version so not sure about Epic but my Epic client seems OK atm

[unkempt blade]

that should at least handle the majority of issues I'd think to watch for

[astral gyro]

My thought is if one item is flowing more than the rest the station overtime will be overloaded with that one and only be shipping that one but I havent used trains yet so idk

Ive noticed my wire tractor service is already backed up on wire and would be impossible to ship anything else through it

[compact karma]

ohh okay..

[unkempt blade]

Yeah that's what I was getting at in my initial response. I think over time there's a decent chance you'd have increasing problems but extra throughput and a sink on the output station side should handle jams from that it just wouldn't guarantee good efficiency for item usage

[silk ocean]

Could just be your provider or region, some temporary problem maybe

[polar quartz]

Alright will do , Its my first world trying to use majoritively train logistics and im not 100% on the possibilities. Would it be possible to have for example 1 train coming from a electronic factory ( computers , supercomputers , ai limiters etc) and another coming from a heavy frame factory and them both unload at the same station?
provided of course you had the sorting systems on the recieving end.
or would i need a seperate station for each material

To be clear i have a couple light mods that allow me to fine tune allowed throughput so loading specific parts/m shouldnt be an issue

[compact karma]

oh yeah mb

[silk ocean]

Do you need the cloud, do you not have a local save?

[unkempt blade]

you could unload at the same station but you'd just want to make sure you're not filling the station all the way up right as the second train tries to drop stuff off too

[polar quartz]

would the train not wait for space then?

[unkempt blade]

depends how you're configuring your route

[astral gyro]

And what if over time the train in front catches up and crashes lol

[polar quartz]

hm theyre decently long routes each but i can see how theres a possibilty of 2 trains arriving at the same time

[silk ocean]

Should never happen with proper signals in place

[astral gyro]

Jk I am assuming you are using signals and stuff to avoid crashes

[unkempt blade]

might want to read https://satisfactory.wiki.gg/wiki/Electric_Locomotive#Stop_settings real quick for an explanation of settings

[polar quartz]

even with block signals at the factory entrance that would still be an issue yeah?

[dawn sun]

You could build an artificial delay with block sections, but that large of a block section would become inconvenient in a global train network, so you'd need a splitoff dedicated route for that delay

[astral gyro]

I was just making a joke

[dawn sun]

In general a separate station per train would be smarter,

[unkempt blade]

block signals are there to keep a second train from running into the train in front of it. They won't be any help with how your routes work for timing/load settings

[astral gyro]

I havent even gotten to trains yet, I understand them IRL but havent gotten to them in game yet, I just finished phase 2 for the first time yesterday

[polar quartz]

the issue is im sort of limited for space. I like to build aesthetically so i only really have enoough room for 2 stations 3 freight stations each in the bottom floor

[polar quartz]

surely with mk6 belts and an average of 20-40p/m incoming the stations should empty quick enough?

[atomic notch]

Try it dude if they keep crashing then you need signals

[unkempt blade]

depends how frequent/fully loaded the trains are but mk6 should be pretty bulletproof unless you're really pushing the limits https://satisfactory.wiki.gg/wiki/Tutorial:Train_throughput

[polar quartz]

max input is 300p/m of copper powder for pasta however i may produce that offsite since that quite a bit. Second highest is copper wire at 125p/m and then the rest is sub 40

[unkempt blade]

you're probably ok, just make sure to leave room for all the smart splitters 😄

[polar quartz]

to be honest i only really wanted a nice looking "central hub" for personal use and thought of producing sep there and its starting to be a bit more of a ballache than i signed up for lmao

[polar quartz]

fair enough thanks a bunch

[plush dawn]

i found a street named "somers loop"

[silk ocean]

Find a parking space on that street, you get 2 😉

In theory

[rose tulip]

guys

[silk ocean]

You'd just need quite a few Iron veins

[rose tulip]

are alternate recipes the same product

but crafted differently

[leaden turret]

https://communityhighlights.satisfactory.video/meta-search/?q=warehouse+AND+architecture

[rose tulip]

WHAT

[smoky forge]

they are better

and some worse

[silk ocean]

...and often involve using a different machine, like a Refinery instead of a Constructor

[hard ivy]

screws crafted via cast screws and via default screws are the same screws

[rose tulip]

I am so happy I got the encased industrial beams one

[smoky forge]

get the diluted fuel one

[rose tulip]

can make them out of pipes

[rose tulip]

no fuel yet except coal

am omw to get oil

[leaden turret]

the only ones that are an exception are coal, compact coal, and petro coke.

more alternate fuels than they are alternate recipes tho

[smoky forge]

then plan on having a few hard drives ready for oil alternatives

[rose tulip]

should I build a hard drive scanner

[silk ocean]

It's just a MAM, you should have one already?

[rose tulip]

ofc

but to find hard drives

[silk ocean]

Oh yeah, probably wouldn't hurt

[smoky forge]

needed

[signal shale]

uuugh, now I have to belt or train plastic and rubber to my factory... no way around it, but I just don't want to. Time to take a break.

[astral gyro]

Build a super highway and use trucks

[true mulch]

how is that ANY better

building a road in the first place defeats any advantage trucks have

[astral gyro]

Because its fun? Idk man im not even gonna use trains this playthrough until the very end lol

[plush dawn]

i had a much harder time with trains than plastic and rubber

[astral gyro]

Right now im just using tractors for short hauls instead of belts

[primal pecan]

its a simple question so ill just ask here, whats the difference between power pole and power tower? (new to the game)

[plush dawn]

use a blueprint with a double layer conveyor support and connect them

[plush dawn]

bigger

[signal shale]

nah, the routee from my oil field to my factory is not truck-friendly, so it's either trains or belts, it's just eeither a pain in the rear of dealing with the belt stanchions or rails over water... and I have to leeave room for thee aluminum plant so trains would be difficult to fit in.

[astral gyro]

Power tower big and you can zip line without jumping around every pole, i think the cable stretches farther between as well

[signal shale]

if a power pole can go 50 feet, a power tower can probably go 300

(and 50 feels generous for power poles.

[true mulch]

power poles have a 100m range and are designed for use in factories, power towers have a 400m range but can only connect to other power towers in that range

[primal pecan]

oh so just that? nothing that affects factory performance/ energy consump?

[true mulch]

power is lossless

[signal shale]

Oh! One other advantage - if you're ziplining along on a power tower, you're 99.9% of the time safe even from jumping demons.

[astral gyro]

No, its for longer stretches of power cable, and it has the tall points to connect to other towers, and a short point in the middle to connect to local power poles

[plush dawn]

99% of my factory uses mk1 power poles

i have no need to upgrade to higher teirs

[hard ivy]

insane behavior lmao

[astral gyro]

It took me like 15-20 power poles to get to my coal gens before power towers, its only 3 power towers to get to my coal gens lol (im probably not using them efficiently though)

[hard ivy]

mk1 poles are so annoying to use why would you use them any longer than you have to

[dawn sun]

Usually you don't really need to upgrade, especially if you prefer organised cable setups, but power towers are nice to bridge the space between factories

[astral gyro]

Ive been using floating double wall outlets to connect up all the machines in my factory, i just use one per machine anyway to have the cables organized

[white dawn]

I nearly always just "manifold" my power poles; it's quite rare I need more than mk1s

(I actually generally blueprint a wall connector onto the machines and daisy-chain 'em that way inside the blueprints)

[dawn sun]

I've picked up a trick from Snutt, the old community manager. If you mess around a bit with moving walls around, you can usually slap a wall outlet on the machine itself, remove the wall, and create a 'manifold' like that. Really nice for blueprints too, yeah

[astral gyro]

Thats what I do but I do it manually each time lol

[white dawn]

I do certainly use mk2/mk3 in some cases where I do need the extra connections, but I generally don't bother changing my hotbar from the mk1s

[signal shale]

mk 3s I don't often use, but mk 2s I definitely use a lot.

[plush dawn]

i use mk2 and mk3 for when i really cant be bothered to add another mk1 and make it ugly

also for hypertube cannons

[astral gyro]

Well that's what I started doing, I'm not going to go back to my already built factories until I need to redo them later

[upper gale]

You just connect an mk1 pole to 2 machines each. If you stick to that you can manifold it easily

[rocky coyote]

Yea pretty easy way to remember is to just subtract 2 from whatever your max connections are

I always keep that in the back of my mind

[upper gale]

Yup

[true mulch]

whaaaaaat mk1s are unbearable

mk2s as default always

only restraining myself from researching caterium to get the right alts in the least amount of drives early on

[fluid sapphire]

the wall is not really needed these days since you can nudge in any direction, i do something similar - have a connector clipped into my machine, then a wire clipped through the machine into the foundation below (into another wall connector), then daisy chained to other machines in the same blueprint, so i daisy chain blocks of blueprints and if you stand far enough away, like 20m, you dont see any cables anywhere

[trail onyx]

gusy whats a good cal for satisfactory?

i forgot

[fluid sapphire]

whats a "cal"

[hard ivy]

calorie I'm guessing

[trail onyx]

calculator

? yk any good ones?

[hard ivy]

satisfactory tools

[fluid sapphire]

https://www.satisfactorytools.com/1.0/production

[trail onyx]

yall 100% sure

[hard ivy]

yes

it's the only one I use

and I tried several different ones

[fluid sapphire]

same, i find every other one has a bunch of bloat i dont need

[trail onyx]

i cant

[fluid sapphire]

just give me a graph and i will take care of implementation details

[trail onyx]

send picturesbruh what does the 11x mean tho

[fluid sapphire]

hover over it

[hard ivy]

bro if you have issues with that, no calculator will help you

[trail onyx]

OH.

IM DUMB BRO IM SORRY

[plain gate]

wish greeny made a toggle to divide everything by 2.5

doing mental math is terrible 😔

[fluid sapphire]

how dare you speak javascript in this building

[lost cloak]

I think it would be cool, for a building to be able to extract objects from the dimentional storage.

Make it extremely slow, like 1 item per minute, and have it scale with the speed upgrade in the mam, going up to i think it'd be 16 per minute.

The biggest application for this, would be for very small scale production of very nisj objects, that you dont want to set up large belt networks for.

i dont think it'd be overpowered, thus the slow speed

[feral geyser]

Then install the mod that does that

[upper gale]

It failed at that from the start it is already op

[feral geyser]

But they should not do it in the base game.

[trail onyx]

GUYS HOW do i know how much production i need mostly for a item etc

[hard ivy]

Guess

[trail onyx]

BROO I jsstrcame back im to new foreverythign again

[dawn sun]

It's very strong, sure, but the limitations it has to basically only affect building and not factory lines keeps it in line. It's basically an unlockable QOL improvement, not the backbone of your entire factory network.

[winged walrus]

your nickname is unclickable in compact mode

[trail onyx]

wym

[winged walrus]

i can't look at your profile

[trail onyx]

click my pfp 😭

[dawn sun]

Look at recipes that use the object in question- or just make however much you want/can and make another factory when you need more

[winged walrus]

compact mode doesn't have pfps

[lost cloak]

its not OP, it serves its purpose of being convenient, and a solution to inventory management.
What i suggested, expands on it. Its just like, you rarely use Sam Fluctuators, so build a thing near a sam node that takes steel pipes and copper wires from the dimenitonal storage, and make sam fluctuators and put it back into storage.

The catch is, its extremely slow. Like VERY slow. So its only applicable when its very nish items

[upper gale]

It can def work yeah, within limits and it's not a bad idea although I'm sure they've thought of something similar. For right now it's drones for smaller loads but once you unlock it ofc

[lost cloak]

wait what now? :incert emoji cause satisfactory dont allow external emojies:

yeye but who

the nameless guy?

ye just ignore it, some people didnt get enough attention in their life, so they crave it online. Lots of those. I dont think its an age thing

same with the people who use wacky fonts

[white dawn]

Heh, I've certainly got nothing against the higher tiers. I just personally rarely need 'em, is all

[lost cloak]

Comic sans is goated. But with great power, comes great potential for abuse

i had the best power point presentations at school in 2008

[limpid cairn]

the question now is, did you use the 2008 power point version or an older version?

[lost cloak]

most likely the older one

the yank one, with the CRAZY title fonts

and epic slides 😄

nooo dont 🙁

im not old yet 🙁

[dense cave]

im sure that the hypertube infinite acceleration bug feature is pretty well known right?

[atomic notch]

Proll bc a lot of ppl dont use trucks all too much

[dawn sun]

It is

[dense cave]

aight

[upper gale]

I add in tractor or truck only because "it'll look cool here"

[dawn sun]

This. People usually find that any distance a truck/tractor does better than a train is overshadowed by the consistency of just belting it, so a lot of people barely use trucks and tractors. I personally like them to transport components between facilities in one factory area (let's say I'm making circuit boards on-site in a computer factory, I might use a truck to transport them to the facility where the computer itself is made), but that's mostly an aesthetic choice to make the factory seem a little more alive

Belt clusters would be just as if not more practical

[upper gale]

Only thing about belts and busses is that it takes more resource

To build

[white dawn]

Maybe try a #1038092680493801533 thread w/ a photo of the problem area?

I've not had any problems with tractors deadlocking each other so long as I don't have two going head-on into each other; I've found that 90° crossings, at least, seem to basically always resolve just fine for me

[shy mulch]

That's generally a non-issue though, it's pretty common for people to automate all the building materials first

[white dawn]

I am quite fond of tractors-as-logistics, though yeah, a lot of people do avoid them, 'cause there's a fair bit of learning curve to know how to build them out reliably

[limpid cairn]

why use tractors when factory carts exist?

[white dawn]

I generally dislike seeing long belts; my shortest tractor route on my 1.0 save was something like 200m. :D

[plain gate]

tractors take too much infrastructure and setup

railway you can branch stations and download a global megaprint and you can move anything acrross the map with 2 clicks

[white dawn]

boo @ global megaprint. Make your own stuff, IMO! :)

[plain gate]

ehh its my third time, i'll get sick if i have to make any more railways lol

[shy mulch]

making railways is fun

[limpid cairn]

yeah

[upper gale]

Also another thing, lots of belts with lots of items on it = more demanding for your pc's performance, if you're concerned about that

[plain gate]

naur it really isn't, the amount of work you have to do to get curves properly is just ridiculous

[dawn sun]

Designing railway structure blueprints might honestly be one of my favourite things to do, but yeah curves suck 😭

[plain gate]

ESPECIALLY grade seperated junctions

those are just horrible to build

[shy mulch]

Maybe I just haven't got bored of it "yet" and it will come in time. I'm only at 1200 hours so a relative newbie to most people here

[dawn sun]

I love roman aquaduct-style elevated train networks, but those are usually horrendous to make curves for

[limpid cairn]

i have 111h in the game

im a newbie next to you

[shy mulch]

there are lots of people around here with 5k+

[cursive crane]

hours for a game like this is a terrible measurement though

[upper gale]

Result of an old but addictive game

[cursive crane]

like how much of that is you personally playing the game, and how much is leaving the game running

[shy mulch]

for me it's almost all playing, I've never felt the need to leave it running, there's always something to do if I need to wait for something to complete I'll go do something else while waiting, exceptions are a few times when I've fallen asleep haha

[upper gale]

If you're waiting and bored, just go hand craft something (no one will do this, ever)

But real suggestion is research mam/collect hard drive or mercer sphere

[limpid cairn]

how do you invest 5k hours into this game

isnt it getting super repetive ?

[shy mulch]

I guess that's mostly people who started in early access and started again at each update, also youtubers etc

[upper gale]

The next time will be bigger/better/more optimized/more organized/more aesthetic

[shy mulch]

I mean I have a 200h save that's still on phase 0. People with imagination can do weird things

[dawn sun]

Was about to say lmao. Every playthrough is an opportunity to apply what you learned right from the start

[upper gale]

Yeah that's it's main replayability appeal

Or just doing it co-op ect

[white dawn]

There's also a lot of various build strategies/styles to explore. Lots of ways to play the game.

Obviously accumulating 5k+ hours in the game also requires that you're the sort of person who continues to get dopamine hits from the game loops. Not everyone's gonna respond to the game with that much enthusiasm

[hard ivy]

Leaving the game running to accumulate resources is a skill issue

[shy mulch]

Yeah I have a personality that is especially susceptible to short term dopamine leading to long term habits

[shy mulch]

either skill or patience

[lavish lance]

just make enough items/second

[upper gale]

Or you could be stuck in a vicious cycle
Frustration -> quit for 3 months -> return and make new save -> frustration

[dawn sun]

In my last bunch of playthroughs I've kinda kept everything humble and focused on improving logistics in relatively speaking small-scale factories. I'm considering bumping up the bs and making massive factories with big numbers in my next playthrough, and maybe improve my aesthetic building skills as well given the greater amount of space to decorate

[limpid cairn]

maybe they’re addictive

I have a friend that apparently has like 60k hours in another game

Forgot to mention that he’s addicted to the game

[tiny kiln]

Has there been a Steam update?

[white dawn]

I've actually been considering going against my usual in-channel advice for my next playthrough and going heavily into centralization, so I create some logistics nightmares for myself. :D

[upper gale]

He's married to the game

[white dawn]

#patch-notes

[shy mulch]

it's hard to believe that's not mostly afk time though, unless that's been over an actual lifetime, how old is the game / how long he been playing?

[ocean fulcrum]

Dev stream today or not?

[shy mulch]

bear in mind being logged in permanently 24/7 is only about 8800 hours per year

[limpid cairn]

Hes been playing since start of the game (2015) and the game is ark survival evolved

[upper gale]

Ark 60k hours is understandable lol

[shy mulch]

so, 16 hours per day, every day, for 10 years

[dawn sun]

I want to try something adjacent to that at some point- not really heavily centralised factory mess, but a central logistics hub where (excess) production is gathered and exported to other factories to use

[limpid cairn]

Yup

[shy mulch]

when does he earn money?

or is someone supporting him?

[limpid cairn]

Too real, I myself have 16k hours 🥴

[dawn sun]

So like- imagine I'm making a metric heccton of plastic at an oil site, I want to bring that to one place that then distributes it to for example my computer factory and my oil refineries for bottling. Considering how much I enjoy logistical challenges, I think it could be interesting

[limpid cairn]

While playing I guess he was like the best player on the game imo

Some servers paid you when you were the best on the server

[shy mulch]

I see. I consider myself quite good at some things, but never made more money that I'd put in to any game

[limpid cairn]

it’s really hard to make money with games tbh

Unless you’re a big YouTuber

[shy mulch]

that's making money from youtube though

making money in a game, for me, would mean selling items that you have collected, such as in an mmorpg

[plain gate]

you would make much less than minimum wage even in the us doing that

[rustic hare]

I just realized, long light rays will absolutely crap the performance of the game

[plain gate]

maybe if you're in SEA? but not in a first world ctounry

[shy mulch]

In an old game I played there was a well known player from Phillipines who quit his job and made the same money by selling items he found in game, just played it 24/7

[ivory condor]

Its worse with path tracing, some games are already starting to implement that and my gpu is definitely not ready

[terse parcel]

uuuuh they didnt fix the convoyer in straight which isnt straight 🙁

[ivory condor]

well

[rustic hare]

I prefer to not know it

[mortal ginkgo]

"long awaited fixes" = 2 fixes

I was like, did they miss the actual patch notes?
I am still happy for our multiplayer folk nonetheless.

[ivory condor]

[dim dock]

2GB update just dropped. is it the language/localization? seems kinda huge for that.

[ivory condor]

the patches are typically that big usually

[limpid cairn]

Because the us is a developed country, if you live in poorer countries you usually can live of selling stuff in game

[dim dock]

if they're prepacked files then it makes sense i guess. i was just worried about more stuff breaking... tracks still z-fighting 🥹

[mortal ginkgo]

the way Unreal Engine patches things can be either very nice or very weird depending on references. Unreal considers everything should be updated if there are hard references etc.

[clear wadi]

i figure out a better setup but still have to tear my 5h work because i didnt organize them which made me run out of space when im soo close to finish it

sad

🥲

[mortal ginkgo]

go vertical brotherman

[ivory condor]

btw i wanted to do that thing, but then realized i had no idea what you meant, well you have the save file so you can figure something out if you want to

[limpid cairn]

Btw is anyone using vertical manifolds?

[shrewd palm]

plutonium fuel rods would be so much cooler as a fuel source if they didnt irradiate the surrounding biome

[dim dock]

oh definitely. but a framework to append to existing archives, overwriting older references by being content aware is possible. And finally doing an optional cleanup run could reduce network traffic for the same. But again, not really necessary unless updates are extremely frequent.

[mortal ginkgo]

it is Nuclear power brother.

[plain gate]

you would think 4 meter thick concrete walls would stop some of it

[mortal ginkgo]

there are ways to do that indeed, so the patch will be either 69GB or 69MB depending on how "good" your code structure is.

[ornate harbor]

hey uh i have question, is there any Glass Foundations?

[feral geyser]

Yes

[feral geyser]

Awesome shop unlockable, frame foundations

[ornate harbor]

Thanks, where can I get them?

[dim dock]

yes there is a 1 meter version i think

[ornate harbor]

ohhhh thanks

[ivory condor]

just dont ask for coated concrete walls

[mortal ginkgo]

some silly youtubers have a glass foundation that got no steel rod beneath in the middle, thats a mod.

we have a glass foundation but its not pure glass per say

[dim dock]

Or glass material roofs

[steady glade]

ever since 1.1, i've taken to stacking multiple machines into a blueprint to save time and space, for example, i'll have 3 assemblers stacked on top of each other in a blueprint

[ornate harbor]

Okay thanks guys

[mortal ginkgo]

I want half foundation ramps

[steady glade]

i want half wide or 1m wide walls

[dim dock]

half wide walls+

[feral geyser]

Both exist in mods

[steady glade]

im a purist

[mortal ginkgo]

also can we have Inverted Roof Corner Ramp please?

Devs literally forgot it. Foundations have that but Roofs don't.

Cmon devs, its just the inverted version of roof ramp

[limpid cairn]

But nuclear power is safer than a wind generator and doesn’t harm the environment irl 🤓👆

[dim dock]

i prefer stability, and that makes me a purist too i guess.

[clear wadi]

thx ill try find some refinery blure print

[ivory condor]

you know i would take a mod if it had coated concrete walls but alas😔

[mortal ginkgo]

we got half wide wall at home = large beams 😛

[feral geyser]

Architecture+ is very stable

[clear wadi]

mine are too chonky

[mortal ginkgo]

ATTTCCCCCCCCCCHHHHHHHHHHHHHHUUUUUUUAAAAAAAAALLLLLLLLLLYYYYYYYYYYYYY

[dim dock]

i've been using beams for the very same reason!

[feral geyser]

It also gives us curved walls

[mortal ginkgo]

Curves are cool

[steady glade]

woops, wont really work with refineries, their hard hitbox goes high enough that you cant stack them up inside the blueprint designer

[clear wadi]

🥲

[dim dock]

even 6x6 blueprints?

[feral geyser]

You can still fit refineries in blueprints

[limpid cairn]

You forget the nerd emote with the finger pointing up after saying actually 🤓👆

[clear wadi]

i need like 67 for diluted fuel

[feral geyser]

You just can't stack them.

[steady glade]

its a matter of height not width

[plain gate]

just use blender bp then

[limpid cairn]

Six…seven…?

[feral geyser]

No, sixty seven

[clear wadi]

sixty seven

[dim dock]

i assumed they gave bigger heights too. but i restarted since 1.0 came out so i haven't got there yet.

[mortal ginkgo]

Isn't the Blender version is WAY simpler? I wouldn't purely yolo for the meh recipe. Just make as much as you need I say

[plain gate]

your only choice for that then is megaprints, not blueprints

[clear wadi]

sad

[limpid cairn]

67 is a meme number like 69 in the newer generation btw😔

[feral geyser]

67 is just 69 by rounding, and 69 is 3×23. Make your blueprints by 3s (merger/splitter on output/input)

[clear wadi]

i demolish the floor 3 time to change the high of each floor

[feral geyser]

You can pre-load pipes and belts and power cables and all, then just tile your 3s

[clear wadi]

i think i need to do it again

[steady glade]

by 8m per upgrade ye but not enough to stack refineries

one refinery is already 32m

[feral geyser]

Refineries floor should be 10 wall segments high

[clear wadi]

ok ok

first floor gonna be on the ground with extractors and packagers

build 7 block high to build a second floor for diluted fuel

then 10 more block for heavy oil residue and compacted coal

[feral geyser]

Sounds decent

Also, mass dismantling is much easier with blueprints, so if you do redesign, it'll be easier.

[mortal ginkgo]

Did you guys know that if you package your fluids you don't need to worry about head lift as you go vertical?

THE MORE YOU KNOW~

[feral geyser]

Negligible for buildings less than 100m tall

[clear wadi]

i should build each row 8 refinery for diluted fuel yes? cause they give exactly 480 fuel

[clear wadi]

thats what im trying soo hard to do

[silk ocean]

Because it's super hard to stick a pump on the pipe XD

[clear wadi]

rebuild this power grid exhaust me

[rose tulip]

can trucks drive up routes covered by 4 meter ramps

or did I mess up

[silk ocean]

They can do yeah

[feral geyser]

It would probably take you more power to package the full throughput of the vein, than it would to just put a pump or two on a single pipeline.

[rose tulip]

is the ore scanner infinite

[feral geyser]

No, I think it shows the nearest x amount or something.

[rose tulip]

or do the different ores and sources have different reaches

[clear wadi]

range?

[hard ivy]

It shows the nearest 3 nodes/groups of nodes

[feral geyser]

Range is infinite, i think, maybe?

[hard ivy]

Regardless of how far the 3rd nearest one is

[clear wadi]

no no i think its about 2.5k m range

[rose tulip]

I have to bring oil home

or just products

[feral geyser]

Very American of you

Easier to bring products

[clear wadi]

not milk?

[rose tulip]

so will a truck be enough or is it too inefficient

[feral geyser]

Depends how far to home

[clear wadi]

train can do better

[rose tulip]

dont have train

2.5 kilometers

belt or truck

[white dawn]

Honestly, if you've unlocked oil, trains are practically right there in terms of unlocks, nowadays

[fluid sapphire]

whats so far that you need to transport it 2.5km

[dim dock]

2.5 km isn't that small. a localized train isn't that bad

[rose tulip]

OIL

and no trains yet

[white dawn]

Oil products are generally an ideal choice for your first train lines. :)

[dim dock]

oil and trains are in the same phase, no?

[rose tulip]

ever thought about how you need oil to unlock trains?

[fluid sapphire]

process your oil locally

[white dawn]

Yeah, train unlocks once you have oil is quite easy.

[clear wadi]

i dont know cause i just automate the product then use ender chest

[dim dock]

Ah make a localized setup, get the oil, unlock trains, voila. make your proper setup after

[rose tulip]

n how do I br9ing it home

[white dawn]

Trains used to require HMF and some other more advanced parts, but 1.0 made them much easier to unlock

[dim dock]

that or you can package oils for transpo with trucks

it's highly inefficient though

[rose tulip]

actually..

might

[fluid sapphire]

you dont, you keep going until you unlock trains, then transport stuff

dont have a home, make stuff where you can

[clear wadi]

ender chest op

[rose tulip]

so no conveyors?

[rose tulip]

expensive

[white dawn]

I mean, it's your save -- you can do logistics however you like

[dim dock]

if you package, you can use oil with conveyors yes.

[rose tulip]

oh right

[white dawn]

I've done tractor routes further than 2.5km, so sure, that's certainly possible.

[rose tulip]

and oil products?

[white dawn]

As is belting (though personally I'd hate belting that far)

[rose tulip]

process there?

would in that case belts be better

[fluid sapphire]

decide when you need to process oil products further

[plain gate]

that expands it 3x

lot of volume...

[white dawn]

The usual recommendation is to process fluids right near where they're extracted. Transporting fluids across distances for processing is rarely worth the effort

[plain gate]

what do packages stack up to

[clear wadi]

u can make power and the resin can be use for the product

[rose tulip]

referring to what?

[fluid sapphire]

packaging is extra work, but its legit

[plain gate]

oil products

[rose tulip]

need oil products for power unlock

[clear wadi]

oh yeah

[rose tulip]

sure packaged oil is worse?

[fluid sapphire]

im not sure its worth packaging it right away honestly

[dim dock]

in terms of throughput it's bad.

[clear wadi]

i forgot i just pick all the things i need when hunting for harddrive

[rose tulip]

question is, bring oil liquid or its products home

[rustic hare]

I usually don't transport oil, just gases, which like nitrogen, have a 4x compression ratio, I process oil on the spot and transport it's products

[white dawn]

As I said above: The usual recommendation is to process fluids right near where they're extracted. Transporting fluids across distances for processing is rarely worth the effort

[clear wadi]

explore the map give immense benefit

[white dawn]

Though, again, it's your save. Do what you want!

[rose tulip]

thats helpful thx

[rose tulip]

man I came here for help

so I dont mess up

[fluid sapphire]

you cant mess up, whatever you mess up, you can delete and do over

[white dawn]

There's no way to "mess up" the game. If you're having fun, you're playing it properly. There's literally no "pressure" in the game; you can take as long as you want, build however you want, and you never actually lose anything

[unkempt blade]

if you're really serious about satisfactory though you'll package the fluids and transport them with a factory cart

[white dawn]

The only real pressure is in Phase 0 when you're stuck with manual biomass collection for power

[rustic hare]

even if you don't mess up, it'll also become obsolete as you progress

[rose tulip]

I can lose time and mk2 pipes can be messed up pretty easily

[fluid sapphire]

well, try having one problem at a time

[rose tulip]

ok

[white dawn]

Sure, time is a finite resource, but that's the point: if you're having fun, your time isn't wasted

The only point of the game is having fun, so if you're having fun, you're playing it properly

[fluid sapphire]

for me, i transport plastic and rubber (via train)

[dim dock]

normally, early game, i make a local facility to produce plastic, rubber and fiber directly at the oil site (or closeby). rubber-plastic recycle loop, and a resin recieve station that produces fibers first, then merges with the plastic-rubber loops, and if there's still excess, just.. sinks it.

[rose tulip]

not having fun when I mess things up and do stuff over

[white dawn]

And yes, you've received various bits of advice now. My point was just that if you don't feel like following that advice, don't!

[rose tulip]

ok thx

[white dawn]

You can play however you want, and the advice you get in here is just people's opinions

They're not objectively right or wrong, it's just how people like playing their game

[silk ocean]

Unless using sushi belts 😉

[rustic hare]

I'm in the nuclear phase, and currently revamping every single factory I've ever built lmao, not because they were badly designed, just because I needed to scale up massively. So tbh, just do whatever you want and let the game come to you

[white dawn]

And you might enjoy playing it differently. Ask for advice all you want, of course, but you're not bound to it. And you're under no obligation to actually follow any of it. :)

[fluid sapphire]

you really think you can go through the game without some major fuckups that require a serious rebuild? thats some real confidence 👏

[dim dock]

sushi belts 💖

[fluid sapphire]

i would say, do not get too attached to what you build, while you are building it

[dim dock]

never be afraid to tear down your factory to make a better one. remember it's quantity over quality. or you won't enjoy the game.

[reef basin]

fyi there's no space between k and m in kilometer/km 😉

[silk ocean]

Don't worry too much about "am I making enough of x,y,z", just make enough for now and room to expand if needed in future phases etc

[clear wadi]

if u have hyper tube cannon u can go there and take the resourse urself =))

[reef basin]

or don't even expand, just build new

[white dawn]

And as a sort of illustration of what I said before: personally I wouldn't bother ever tearing a factory down. Just build new factories elsewhere, is my own advice. It's rarely worth it to take the time to dismantle things.

[clear wadi]

hypertoop is soo fun

[rustic hare]

just tore down a city that I took weeks to build without it ever being fully functional

[white dawn]

(ie: you're always gonna get conflicting bits of advice, so it's up to you to decide how you want to play. :)

[fluid sapphire]

big oof

[clear wadi]

0_0 weeks?

[dim dock]

For efficiency!

[rustic hare]

but tbh, I would never be able to progress if I got attached to that build, it had no space for bigger logistics loop

a city that each block makes one product, with a huge belt-based logistic network underground, but it had no space for trains, or to expand in width or length when I ever need to scale up, the only way is up, and that make some buildings get oddly thin

so yes, don't get attached to your builds, scrap anything that's slowing your mandatory fun fun fun down

[fluid sapphire]

aah. thats why i dont ever really do anything thats like a mega mega project

[inland zealot]

is there a way to output from dimensional depot or is there a different structure for that

[silk ocean]

Depot in input only

[rustic hare]

I guess there's some mods to do that? afaik vanilla you can only get products manually

[topaz shale]

The ability to have blueprints autoconnect is freaking amazing for when I need to build some belt highways. Also, after learning the technique building rails with the beams, I now love trains.

[dim dock]

i dont do mega projects because it's bad for the pc. i just make modular factories with mega capacities.

[white dawn]

Correct; Depots are for your own personal build-gun use only (or manual withdrawals)

[fluid sapphire]

i do everything modular, and there is usually some jank way i can retrofit new stuff or if i overlooked anything, and sometimes it leads to cool stuff

[inland zealot]

further down the mam is there no depot that allows you to automatically remove with conveyor?

[feral geyser]

No

[dim dock]

modular is always the best. figuring out the logistics is half the fun.

[inland zealot]

ah

[white dawn]

Correct. Pasting what I said, again: Depots are for your own personal build-gun use only (or manual withdrawals) :)

[topaz shale]

I always do modular but only on my current build am I doing anything remotely close to a mega build. Still modular though but big.

[topaz shale]

Belt highways for the win

[white dawn]

Depots were never intended to be a logistics solution

[dim dock]

train simulator 😎

[inland zealot]

do you know the max capacity of depot?

[feral geyser]

5 stacks at max, of as many items as you care to upload

[white dawn]

At start: 1 stack with a replenishment of 15/min per Depot. At max upgrades, 5 stacks with replenishment of 240/min per Depot

[fluid sapphire]

like this intersection for a plastic and rubber factory, i didnt think i could jam extra rail in the area, it seemed a bit tight, usually my system is pretty rigid, but idk, it turned out kinda cool xd
#screenshots message

[dim dock]

I'm actually trying something out. trains for most stuff, but if there's a lot of nearby nodes, then trucks help the resources converge into a hub, which the train then takes over from.

[inland zealot]

oh so each item has a capacity got it

[dim dock]

but i do need to unlock drones for that (drones deliver batteries)

[rustic hare]

I do a mix of modular and centralized, some items like fused frames just use so many various sources of items that I bundle it at the main base, things like plastic, rubber, alu can be done modular

[white dawn]

Note that Depot capacity is by resource, not by uploader. By the end of the game you'll want multiple uploaders for Concrete, for instance, so that its replenishment happens quickly. But it'll still just be 5 stacks of Concrete globally, no matter how many concrete uploaders you have

[topaz shale]

I have yet to use any of the trucks and stuff for moving items. I haven't even used the drones either. Just trains for long distance items or belts for closer or if I don't want to bother making a rail network.

[limpid cairn]

Why does a max depot only upload 4 items per second 😔

[feral geyser]

Drones >>> any other vehicle in game

[red sun]

which is why you shouldn't have multiple resource types going into the same uploader. made that mistake the first time i played with them

[white dawn]

Disagree; all the logistics options have upsides and downsides, and niches for which they work well

[ripe basin]

this is incorrect

[white dawn]

Game balance? Also: you've clearly not built out a robust Depot network yet, if you're complaining about its functionality.

[feral geyser]

Imagine that, two wrong people in a row

[white dawn]

The Depot system is, if anything, extraordinarily OP.

[dim dock]

rail networks are fun. but it's not something you make dedicatedly. just have a standard, and then add to it as you go. the best part is, it will use the existing pathways you've set up in previous needs. very efficient. and you can set trains to wait at their stations until unload/load is complete, so they don't clog the pathways

[topaz shale]

I really enjoy belts and trains simple because I don't need to have to make sure that my logistics solutions are fed with fuel. Trains need power but they get that wirelessly from my network.

[ripe basin]

Hello apocalyptech

[limpid cairn]

I need to have 17 cement depots to place 10 foundations (normal concrete foundation) per second 😔

[feral geyser]

Well, not wirelessly, there is a wire into the station 😭

[white dawn]

Good thing you've got ~200 depots you can create. :)

[red sun]

that and rails are really good for linking everything to power

[topaz shale]

Oh definitely. I'm using my trains atm for just a few items that I don't really need to worry about train congestion. And if that happens, more rails until fixed lol

[silk ocean]

298 mercers

[rustic hare]

the biggest downside to train imo is the investment put into constructing the network itself

[dim dock]

precisely. and that's why trucks only become feasible after drones are unlocked. the minimum requirement is only hubs get fuel package deliveries done with drones.

[silk ocean]

Lotsa depots

[topaz shale]

Technically, only need the one wire to send all the power to the rest of the world.

[feral geyser]

Is that after using the ones for research?

[silk ocean]

No a few for research

[limpid cairn]

Are you trying to say I should use 200 cement depots to see how long I can spam a fully build concrete block bp?

[placid stirrup]

That's why I set up a fueling distribution station at the TF plant. You can have drones carry out fuel to any new drone port you set up with minimal effort

[feral geyser]

If it needs even one, it's not wireless

[red sun]

at the same time though the same network can be reused by tons of other trains at the same time. once it's built, it's built, you don't need to do it again. just add some branches and you're basically set

[rustic hare]

yep

[dim dock]

the network is build as you go.

[white dawn]

I'm not saying you should do anything. What I'm saying is that the Depots, as they are, are S-tier and solve gigantic classes of "problems" which used to require more creative solutions in the game.

[topaz shale]

I still have not been bothered to set this up but maybe once I get a rocket fuel power plant going. For this playthrough, may just game it out and belt everything and train a few things.

[white dawn]

By about midway through my 1.0 save I was literally never taking anything "manually" from storage

[upper gale]

Drones carrying batteries is the way

[rustic hare]

but it's still an investment compared to like, recording a path

[topaz shale]

I just build with the flow of the land. Only needing the items for the rail and maybe some other stuff for making it look nice. Nothing too crazy.

Looks nicer to me, imo

[rustic hare]

feeding balancers into manifolds feels wrong

[placid stirrup]

It certainly made life much easier if drones were the obvious logistical choice, fueling aside.

[hidden sparrow]

im bored rn so i'll just destroy satisfactory

[dim dock]

the problem is you have to worry about pathway collisions if you have multiple paths on the same route. really hate seeing the random accidents or traffic jams.

[topaz shale]

I'm sure once I get them set up, I'll be saying how amazing they are.

[feral geyser]

They teleport back to path if they get out of range for too long, so it's almost a non-issue

[unkempt blade]

same with the exception of concrete and iron plates for the really big builds

[gusty bronze]

the appropriate number for those exceptions is Yes

[white dawn]

Nah, that just means you've gotta buff up your concrete+iron replenishment. :D (I mean, unless you've constructed a blueprint which literally requires more per blueprint than the depot can provide)

I had a few depot-replenishment-specific factories by the end of my 1.0 playthrough

[placid stirrup]

6,127 signs BP pokes head out of the corner

[dim dock]

unlock more-stacks nodes in the MAM 🤕

[gusty bronze]

that 1.1 patch fixes this issue, you can take your BP and split it in half now and it should automagically attach the belts, haven't tried it yet but my 1 trillion storage bp is waiting 😄

[clear wadi]

i first time run out of item when i switch to concrete foundation

[unkempt blade]

Yeah I think it depends how much overflow people are ok with all the time except while building. I just had a large storage going straight into a concrete uploader so it could accumulate while I got drives and stuff

[feral geyser]

Like this?
#screenshots message

[red sun]

when you're a certain distance away, i don't think it even "teleports". it just simulates something or other to calculate how many of what went where

[white dawn]

I am aware of MAM Depot upgrades. :) It's possible to construct blueprints which require more than 5 stacks of a resource, though.

[gusty bronze]

more than max stack BP

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/553550313533997057/1314958245776855151/image.png?ex=68b84d4c&is=68b6fbcc&hm=2384f0f8fb0c89db4a0bf4ace398b999774fc22b4ce14cd6e6f4b47ee0cb404a

[red sun]

can't remember when i heard that but i think snutt explained it at some point or another

[feral geyser]

No, I mean if you are watching them and they crash, they will teleport back onto path.

[placid stirrup]

Thanks Jace, very cool

[red sun]

sure, i'm just explaining how it's even less of an issue beyond a certain distance

[white dawn]

Heh, yeah, power storage eats up wire like mad. Requires some adjustment to your blueprint design, if you're making banks of those, for sure. :)

[unkempt blade]

I have a blueprint for that too but I made it rainbow 😄 #screenshots message

[feral geyser]

This one takes over 110 stacks of items. It's unbuildable

[gusty bronze]

giving me mario kart ptsd

[feral geyser]

I did a 64-count single layer also.

[white dawn]

Yeah, I always back my Depots with at least one ISC. Personally I was fine with a mere six concrete uploaders, though I admit that I had some nuclear power plant blueprints which could outstrip my concrete replenishment, after doing a whole line of 'em. Though I only had to wait for a few dozen seconds before moving on to the next line, and at that point I had power to connect anyway, etc

[topaz shale]

I'm surprisngly only half way through my phase 4 mega factory. It does help that I'm only producing a single machine's worth of items per elevator part. Very exciting to be finishing phase 4 fairly soon.

[cunning glade]

My rubber factory still backs up

I hate everything

[regal lantern]

Whats your setup?

And where does it back up?

[cunning glade]

Hor

Keeps backing up so rubber stops

[regal lantern]

I have an extreme solution if you've given up on sanity

[cunning glade]

I have 30 refineries

All making 20 rubber

And then 10 refineries making fuel

And then 20 gens burning the fuel

[regal lantern]

Are you using mk2 pipes?

[cunning glade]

Now yes

I wasn't but I had 2 separate pipes

[regal lantern]

Is it the fuel or the residue backing up?

[cunning glade]

Both

Cuz there's too much fuel

[regal lantern]

Have you tried building more generators to burn it?

[upper gale]

Sometimes I have to drain the pipe system before it starts working correctly

[reef basin]

process the HOR then 🙂

[cunning glade]

I am

[regal lantern]

It should all add up, might be jank with the pipes, so you might wanna add more MK1 pipes

[cunning glade]

My numbers should be numbering

[reef basin]

process it fast enough 🙂

[regal lantern]

Rather than mk2

[late wagon]

good night everyone :)

[sick dragon]

It might help if you post a q and a post with screenshots of our layout

[regal lantern]

And yeah, they should be numbering. I've got overclocked refineries so I assumed you were doing mad amounts of fuel rather than 40 per when I checked one for reference

[cunning glade]

I'll try my best

[sick dragon]

As well as what ratios. Eg x amount produced to go to y for z processing

[sick dragon]

And heck im about to start my lunch break if you drop the save file I can take a look in a few as well

[regal lantern]

I'm starting to find that pipes work best if you don't merge a bunch of stuff and working things around

[sick dragon]

Perks of wfh

[cunning glade]

How can I do that

I'll gladly drop the save file

[regal lantern]

Maybe I'm just mad though and I've gone too far down into the packager rabbit hole

[sick dragon]

https://satisfactory.wiki.gg/wiki/Save_files

[near frost]

fun fact there is 5300 power shards on the map (if u get every power slug and duplicate the output using the slooops)

[sick dragon]

Grab it from it's location. Drop it in the post

[near frost]

and i only have 100

[regal lantern]

There's way more when you start making your own

[green fiber]

too much fuel? its only 400/min
20 generators should usually be enough.

[near frost]

ik but that is super late game

[cunning glade]

thats what i thought

[near frost]

for most of the time its gone be only he 5300 power shards

[green fiber]

are the generators full or empty

[cunning glade]

made the post but they full

looks like 21 gens helps and fixes it

but i fear itll cause issues later

and if it does my whole grid goes down i think idk tbh

[regal lantern]

You'll just have some fluctuation

[shrewd palm]

nothing better than checking in on my nuclear plant and finding out that the waste is backing up

[hidden sparrow]

I think i broke smth with the game LMAO https://youtu.be/FkqmfmsJU4c

[silk ocean]

What is this monstrosity, a trash can for trains? XD

...and I just noticed the horror of your plumbing in the distance lol

[limpid cairn]

@glad drum you got competition in spaghetti building

[shrewd palm]

how is it that im feeding a full 1200 belt into something that only needs 720 and the last machines are getting enough

[hidden sparrow]

i think ive got one of the worst base in the entire game, period

[silk ocean]

What happens if you need to change some pipes at the bottom, do you just cut them off and build a new one on top? XD

[limpid cairn]

because you feed more items into a machine than it needs

[hidden sparrow]

#screenshots message boo

[hidden sparrow]

why cut em off if i can just build on top

[shrewd palm]

yeah but its a manifold so it shouldn't matter

[limpid cairn]

thats a spidernet atp

[shrewd palm]

everything should be getting as much as they need, and any extra goes somewhere else

[silk ocean]

Good god xD

[hidden sparrow]

yea i warned ya