🐺┃primalist

[patent dock]

Werebear maul is a great way to use laup's, either for shatter or for totem/vine scaling

Not sure if I've seen anyone try upheaval totems laup yet

[winter ivy]

I think my build choices are between Totem-Vine Werebear or Thunder Laup Shaman

[winter ivy]

For Shatter Bear, Attunement or Strength?

[high stratus]

I've given it some thought but I keep wondering how the player stays upright, spriggan form totems not only gets you more thorn totems total they also solve healing/sustain for you and recover enough mana that you can use Seed as a defensive item too.

[high stratus]

str for the flat spell I would think

[near leaf]

Str for Flat spell
You can go lightning and get some attunement aswell for the lightning pen in shaman

[vapid canopy]

What about hazel root + cleaver solution + madness conversion and stacking str+att?

[wise leaf]

eeeh even if you're doing 150 attunement that's only 50 flat spell

67 flat spell damage on an item isn't incredible really

also it's flat phys spell which is generally gonna miss out on some other damage modifier or bucket you're scaling

as typically primalist isn't doing phys spell

sometimes it is but cold or lightning is more common

the main phys spells would be phys converted storm bolts and phys converted maelstrom/tsunami. Both of which typically need crit chance help from gear i believe which hazel root + cleaver solution ain't giving you

if you want flat spell from an attribute then palarus is just straight better at 1 adaptive flat spell per 2 str

plus you can slam 50 flat spell onto it

[vapid canopy]

Ah true, palarus is really good here

[spiral lichen]

Morning all. just leveld my Shaman. I was thinking of going Tornado route as I like 1 button builds. Is there a general concensus on what build is decent for season 4?

[near leaf]

Spriggan forms totems is good

Tornado, I believe Maxroll has a version

[winter ivy]

How does Shatter Totem scale? Something like Event Horizon won't affect it, right? It's specifically melee damage and not "damage for melee skills" or w/e.

But something like Brutality would work?

[limpid veldt]

brutality works

use wand and paralus

stack insane strength

bypass 200 is ok since you will rely on regen and health from the skill itself

[mossy coral]

brutality works but it's a spell, so melee damage won't apply such as event horizon

[lone gorge]

Hello, i'm looking for a bees build

[winter ivy]

Melee Crit and Melee Crit Multi wouldn't apply to Totem Shatter, right? It has to be generic, spell, or on the tree itself to apply?

[mossy coral]

Nope it's just a spell like any other normal spell

Brutality would be the only exception

[winter ivy]

Shatter Totem converts to cold if Upheaval is converted?

[thin lance]

if my Bear creates a claw totem via swipe, does the totem use my stats or his?

[mossy coral]

yeah

[mossy coral]

your minion stats

[winter ivy]

How effective are Brutality and Madness for Totem Shatter?

[near leaf]

Very much

For a full dps setup its super strong

I am trying to farm an exulis like that to kill Uber

[winter ivy]

I wonder if Laup's + Earthquake has any viability. You save on mana for putting down totems and can aftershock around the totems.

You could leap, then EQ and benefit from Aftershocks. Might not be worth the skill slot though.

[patent dock]

You can do both at the same time with Bhuldar, as BM or in bear form, would be smooth for an aftershock build

[winter ivy]

I thought about Bhuldar, but you probably want to go spell for aftershocks

The rate limiting on Bhuldar might really hinder the output too

[high stratus]

bhuldar conversion is awkward

doesn't convert the aftershocks IIRC so you're stuck on fire but you also have to take the fire conversion on the skill tree

[near leaf]

You sure?

[near leaf]

So what you are saying is spell fire dot Aftershock divining totems

[high stratus]

nope but I read it on here

if someone says something doesn't work on this discord I give them benefit of the doubt I'm afraid

[mossy coral]

yes we already established it

[near leaf]

I had never heard it before

[wise leaf]

to explain why brutality works: it's a spell, but it's a subskill of upheaval, therefore it inherits multis that apply to upheaval on use, such as brutality

[patent dock]

Why spell?

[near leaf]

Because Str Stacking for more Flat

[raven sluice]

Idr, how did you shatter the totems? Upheaval on maul?

[patent dock]

Ah, for bear form

If you use Bhuldar's, you'll be really struggling to make up the difference, may as well just stay melee imo

[patent dock]

Yeah, upheaval on maul + on fury leap, totems from laup's path

[sly bobcat]

Ignite EQ will be a thing one day i swear

[thin lance]

is this bugged? my avalanche is physical, but my bears is cold

[near leaf]

?

[thin lance]

the bear using earthquake does not use the avalanche skill tree

my avalanche is physical and causes fissures, the one my bear does is still the basic avalanche

[near leaf]

Ah yes

I belive it's doesn't get passed down

[sly bobcat]

i can't decide if I should try and grind my wind shaman to a point it can kill observer

[thin lance]

[sly bobcat]

or if I should try to make a real build

i genuinely don't even know where to go with the build at this point to get more damage out of it tbh

[patent dock]

Yeah, minion snowcrash doesn't use the skill tree, might be intentional to prevent infinite loops, might not be

[sly bobcat]

https://www.lastepochtools.com/planner/QDxZRjzR anyone got ideas on the obvious stuff to upgrade?

[unkempt thistle]

Shaman, Level 100

:white_check_mark: This character build is verified

Game Version:

Season 4: Shattered Omens / 1.4.5

Class:

Primalist (20) / Beastmaster (10) / Shaman (68) / Druid (15)

General:

▸ Health: 3,510, Regen: 315.34/s
▸ Mana: 1,068.51, Regen: 21.2/s
▸ Ward Retention: 14%, Regen: 0/s
▸ Attributes: 19 Str / 15 Dex / 7 Int / 127 Att / 7 Vit
▸ Resistances: 64% / 105% / 88% / 121% / 64% / 71% / 81%

Defenses:

▸ Endurance: 72%, Threshold: 1,012
▸ Dodge Chance: 39% (1369)
▸ Armor Mitigation: 24% (998)

Used skills:

Tempest Strike / Warcry / Maelstrom / Tornado / Summon Spriggan

[raven sluice]

I don't understand the woven omen echo. I try to activate all the omens immediately and just kill them. Is droprate of the observer echo not guaranteed?

[thin lance]

since my mana is being drained even if my minion uses the skill, i dont think a loop is even possible

and minions cant use channeled skills (u need channelled avalanche to chain back into earthquake)

[near leaf]

It is

[raven sluice]

Hmm

[near leaf]

Do you have all 3 open at the same time ?

[near leaf]

Rain dance ?

[sly bobcat]

you open them all simultaneously

[unreal field]

Do all sub skills work like this until stated otherwise?

[raven sluice]

The first thing I do when entering is open all 3

Did it twice now, on like 100c and 629c

[sly bobcat]

had them in my stash from a nemesis, they're decent survivability when you're dodging a lot

I'm sitting at dodge cap most of the time

[near leaf]

Then either bug or your lootfilter is hiding it

[raven sluice]

I'll try another time

[sly bobcat]

are any of them timing out? they don't encompass the whole arena

there's very little overlap initially

[near leaf]

Yes, subskills inherit applicable More Dmg from the parent tree

[raven sluice]

Ah, so I gotta sit in the middle?

[sly bobcat]

I did A for a little bit while it expanded, then B and sat in the overlap between them, then C once they were big enough that I could fit in all 3

[raven sluice]

Hmm

[near leaf]

Yeah, if one times out its failed

[sly bobcat]

you don't have to open them all immediately. they just have to all be open simultaneously at some point

[near leaf]

So you havent completed all 3 at the same time

[raven sluice]

Is there no timer or anything to let you know you're outside of one of them?

[winter ivy]

Anyone ever try a Fire EQ Swarmblade? Bhuldar allows EQ to proc on evade. Maybe Werebear works better?

[sly bobcat]

there is. it's on the progress bar

[near leaf]

There is

[sly bobcat]

it turns red from purple and has a 10 second countdown

[raven sluice]

I guess I can just not cast thornshield while the first and second expand. But might still be hard to survive in a smaller area unless I lower corruption

[near leaf]

just above your skill bar

[sly bobcat]

the countdown resets every time you enter it

[sly bobcat]

they don't finish all that fast, and they expand by progressing them not time

[unreal field]

Okay I guess applicable is the tricky part. More melee damage should not increase spell damage, right?

[sly bobcat]

just do what you normally do and pay attention to the size of the circle

[near leaf]

Thats the tricky part indeed
Brutality doesnt say More MElee Dmg
But More Dmg for Melee Skill

So Upheaval is a Melee SKill

It gets a generic More Dmg

[unreal field]

I see

[raven sluice]

Hmm. GS can't cost mana. Else brutality angle

[near leaf]

Shatter Totem looks at Upheaval and see that More Dmg and gets it

[unreal field]

Thanks, now I have to look at all sub skills more closely again

[sly bobcat]

yeah brutality was explicitly written the way it is so that it would benefit subskills and ailments

[near leaf]

I dont think there is a lot of cases like this in Primalist at least

[sly bobcat]

Tempests are all technically subskills

[near leaf]

Right

Furnace too

[unreal field]

Yeah but like ice spikes from shatter strike?

[sly bobcat]

the best Primalist subskill

[raven sluice]

The uncomfortable part of brutality imo is that it nukes armor. Seems easier playing around apathy even, if you ask me

[sly bobcat]

it's really only a problem for primalist trying to utilize brutality since your base types tend to be light on armor

my brutality SW planner still has like 6k armor

[raven sluice]

Ah, I read this as the other str class is more sentinel, while primalist is just generally quite primalist

[patent dock]

The mana thing does prevent infinite loops yeah, but the channeled node doesn't affect individual boulder procs at all, that's how scorpion is able to proc earthquake

[sly bobcat]

brutality doesn't care if the melee skill itself scales with strength. all it cares about is
a) it's a melee skill
b) it has a mana cost

if it meets those two conditions, then brutality will buff it and any subskills or ailments from it

[unreal field]

This is not exclusively more but also increase right?

[near leaf]

In the case of Shatter and Upheaval yes

Because Upheaval has an innate str scaling

[raven sluice]

I wish gathering storm had innate str scaling

Not just melee

[sly bobcat]

hey what relic should I use for my wind shaman? the only things i really need on my current one are the DoT and attunement

[near leaf]

You can have it cost mana ... its just not melee anymore

[raven sluice]

Lmao

They thought of everything. "And stay down! @ primalist"

Altho BM is hardly primalist tbf

Idk what to compare to. I didn't play other classes yet. But it mainly feels like shaman is a real disaster, druid a bit awkward, and BM quite nice

[sly bobcat]

shaman has some cool stuff going on but it's undertuned and lacks a cohesive identity

[raven sluice]

Also no defensive options, poor ward retention availability, and attunement sucks with normal mana regen

[sly bobcat]

I honestly think that at the core, primalist has the best mechanical overlap between its masteries. Just from a design PoV
Shaman: Spells and Minions
Druid: Spells and Melee
Beastmaster: Minions and Melee

[raven sluice]

So you got like glass cannon storm totem, unless you stand on pool (of blood) guy every 20 seconds so he don't despawn and use foot of the mountain

[sly bobcat]

shaman's defenses are fine. maelstrom gives a ton of endurance threshold, you get health regen for stacking your damage stat, you get to utilize things like seed since you're stacking mana most of the time anyway

i'm sitting at 80% dodge at all times on my shaman rn

[mossy coral]

"a ton", it's not good enough

[sly bobcat]

you can cover your health bar in threshold how is that not good enough

it's just straight up 60% DR

[raven sluice]

My experience with shaman is like, don't expect to be comfy in 600c no matter what you do. While other classes can build to work in way more

[unreal field]

We should just stop comparing and enjoy our favourite class. I really like melee shaman with gathering storm. Yes it could do more damage but theory crafting around this is really fun, for me much more than if it would easily one shot and clear everything. So I don’t envy op classes - this way the game offers a lot of challenging content 😄

[raven sluice]

Cuz not all builds generate maelstroms, and foot of the mountain mechanics at least I find very frustrating. Spriggan too

[sly bobcat]

shaman's biggest issues are how schizophrenic its damage scaling is. he wants to scale three different elements, and three different damage types

[sly bobcat]

i'm right there with you playing with wind tempest strike of all things

but he definitely needs buffs. they've already said they're working on it and that all the shaman-related changes are coming at once

[mossy coral]

30 maelstrom stacks is 600 ET, druid passive gives you health and %health as ET

Just having that flat health regen also isn't good enough, with str you at least get armor which you will lack as a shaman

[near leaf]

I guess thats nice to lvl with

[mossy coral]

t7 mana POG

[raven sluice]

Tbf, my favourite class is BM, and I think it's fine. I never got into druid cuz it seems a bit awkward, and tried some shamans but it feels like it promises stuff but always falls on the fact that attunement is bad and I don't like foot of the mountain or summon spriggan

[sly bobcat]

i also really wish shaman had at least one shaman-specific companion node somewhere. druid gets one even if it's bad

[high stratus]

no minion uses avalanche anyway, they trigger boulders which works just fine if avalanche is channeled

[unreal field]

Yes, curious what season 5 will bring.

[patent dock]

Give me "storm totem grows legs and follows you around, it counts as a companion and has no duration"

[worn venture]

Is there currently and endgame wearwolf build? Is wearwolf even a thing or is it only wearbear?

[near leaf]

Werebear, spriggan form or Grasshopper form

[raven sluice]

Give me summon elemental as the skill shaman doesnt have, and let it specialise as an earth elemental with taunt, giga tankyness, and taking dmg for you

[high stratus]

howl of the west wind looks like something a wolf furry might wear IRL, that's about as close as you get to werewolf

[high stratus]

don't give it legs, give it arms and have it t-pose around

[raven sluice]

Water elemental should cast maelstroms on you

[near leaf]

Nice drawing chatgpt

[high stratus]

upheaval totems now use maul unique when

[raven sluice]

And they get bear helmets

[high stratus]

yep

and you can totally spec it so that upheaval totem summons upheaval totems, it's just bad

[mossy coral]

-You. Are. Welcome. 🤖

[sly bobcat]

there was a reddit thread where mox asked for a bunch of unique ideas. one that I had was "Your bear now carries one of your totems."

[raven sluice]

That would be cool

Give bear a node that makes it scale with attunement

And a node that makes spriggan not-paper

[sly bobcat]

i could see it going on the stormbear node

[patent dock]

That would be cute, too

Can it wear the totem as a little hat?

[sly bobcat]

sure

greg does so bear can too

[patent dock]

[near leaf]

Like bro

Really

[patent dock]

It be trollin for real

[raven sluice]

Lmao

I had a thing make an island from a cemetary, despite me circling it with woven boss echoes

And I didn't know if cemeteries were still bugged

[sly bobcat]

is there concept art of the companions anywhere? I kinda want to see if my printer's slicer can make a model out of it

need my lil primal raptor for my desk

[raven sluice]

Raptor did have some if you just google "last epoch companion concept art" and click the image of a raptor

https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-m&hs=IMlp&sca_esv=8eb5eb78efc6b1d8&sxsrf=ANbL-n4qx71FJ0jmtkRACMYYySEAIYavAg:1776971861883&udm=2&fbs=ADc_l-YGrpJMQtvjQ6h14rj-dfIrqfs6rS3LkWZuYQkP3fXtribaFsrT2gsast6iWy1hnC1JyZgN1sBRYLMklJryc2M_-NYjaJhPYL0qZExuF-nb4PGTlq6KIQ47qUL3aIbSUQpTGIaisLSErecXMhTyNKyFsJUEQGFqIJ08jNWv7OVQRnf09KjSBdrxB4feMd6ByWTxvNZi&q=last+epoch+companion+concept+art&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjsnOmE2ISUAxXgTlUIHSHvM_sQtKgLegQIEhAB&biw=134&bih=153&dpr=2.86#sv=CAMSZBoyKhBlLTcxTW40TDY0aGFmeXJNMg43MU1uNEw2NGhhZnlyTToOMFlEOTdsZm5USlUySE0gBCokCg5jSU1oa1gwZkhfd3k4TRIQZS03MU1uNEw2NGhhZnlyTRgAMAFKBAgBEAIYByDP0dcOSggQAhgBIAIoAQ

[near leaf]

Maybe in the press kit

https://lastepoch.com/media

[near leaf]

Wait a minute

The actual web is different from the Cemetary machine

[near leaf]

That will be a sweet lvling

[sly bobcat]

get artor's legacy and you've got the whole wolf leveling setup going

imagine having +8 to wolves from the get-go

[sly bobcat]

found some stuff in there from artstation, thanks. i'll play around with it at some point. need a nap right now

[patent dock]

Yeah, pretty sure it's posted on official forums somewhere when they were showcasing their upcoming visual overhauls

[sly bobcat]

that's probably where the art station images came from too. artist put it there when the remakes were announced or something

[raven sluice]

#suggestions message Updoot if you approve. Or, maybe even better, add your version of ways to make shaman nicer instead (in the suggestions channel)

[sly bobcat]

honestly an elemental companion would be cool

it would also put a companion in every mastery

[raven sluice]

Yup

[sly bobcat]

idk if you push it into the 25+ point range for shaman exclusivity or do like VK does and just have 3 sub 20 point skills

[raven sluice]

No idea tbh. Could be a cool minion for BM too, as long as it doesnt steal the show

[sly bobcat]

which is still really weird to me. devouring orb has next to no synergy with either FG or Paladin

yet it's available to both of them

[raven sluice]

Druid could be cool with some unique making it like a huge treant

[sly bobcat]

they should give it a fire conversion node that changes time rot to ignite and makes it deal fire DoT. give FG some fire dot spells to play with

flavor it like "Forge's Heart" or something and make it scale with your armor since abyssal echoes has the paladin flavored conversion.

[high stratus]

you can get void essences & a global more multi for your meme void paladin/FG (sacrificial embrace channeled spell healing hands!)

[raven sluice]

I wonder if there was a node to make the elemental companion a treant, should it benefit from spriggan tree?

[sly bobcat]

Nah. I'm all for companions helping each other but they definitely shouldn't have shared trees

[raven sluice]

Makes sense

Then it'd get very weird like, they shouldn't coexist. Tbh spriggan is the treant. Might be more fitting to make a node in spriggan tree that makes spriggan significantly larger and tougher

Like Oakbeard Treebeard

[sly bobcat]

A shaman companion should have synergies with totems too. Something that buffs the totems or itself based on totems. "More damage per minion you control that shares an element tag." Or however it would be worded

Phys and Cold can both get a bunch of minions through thorn totem

[high stratus]

more damage per limited duration minion you control

synergy with bees and totems

[raven sluice]

Spriggan needs bees tbh

[high stratus]

though it should probably include coldstone elementals too

memes though they are

[raven sluice]

But yeah, an elemental companion should definitely interact with totems a number of ways. Sharing tags might work

[high stratus]

giving coldstone elemental a skill tree would be a decent alternative to full on elemental companion I guess

[raven sluice]

If "summon elemental" had a coldstone branch connected to earth and water that let the big elemental summon them, it could have some nodes to buff them

[sly bobcat]

If they wanted to keep it specific to totems just make it a single node.

X% more cold and physical damage per thorn totem
Y% more lightning damage if you control a storm totem

[raven sluice]

True

[sly bobcat]

Wind elemental was supposed to be the damage dealer anyway right?

[raven sluice]

Kinda, doesnt have to be only that, but I figured lightning

[sly bobcat]

I mean I can dig it

Most of the earth flavored stuff has some amount of defensive aspects going on. Old tempest strike gave you armor with the rock proc iirc

Upheaval has earth armor buff

[high stratus]

any minion that can trigger tornado at a good rate would be goated (tempest strike totems do not summon them at a good rate & you have to pay for them!)

14 storm bolts per tornado triggered

[raven sluice]

Earth should be tanky, Water should prolly be related to maelstrom, so that's dmg, ET and dodge already, and Air could also be giving a lot of dodge, but for existing skills it's mostly offence

[sly bobcat]

Maelstrom is also healing. The healing is non-negligible when specced out

[raven sluice]

I didn't even consider tornado. Air should prolly definitely have synergy with that

[raven sluice]

Yeah

If they made tempest strike better, they could make a node that let summoned elementals use tempest strike

Or if just 1 then the 1 can use it

[sly bobcat]

Honestly just allowing companions to be able to cast the tempests might be enough if the elementals had good modifiers

[raven sluice]

True

[sly bobcat]

Upheaval was solid on sabertooth before the update

Tempest strike has about as many multipliers as upheaval

[high stratus]

a storm elemental casting the lightning tempest while you have a storm totem out could get decent scaling maybe

[sly bobcat]

And similar ADE

[high stratus]

How about a unique which converts shock into electrify if the target has 10 stacks of shock on them?

[raven sluice]

Someone said electrify is very holy themed or something, but I'd dig more electrify on primalist

[high stratus]

it's basically paladin exclusive, no other mastery has even passable electrify support afaik

[sly bobcat]

Yeah that's intended from what I understand

[raven sluice]

Maybe they could uncap shock but let the effects stay capped, and let some shaman skills zap based on number of shocks up to a much higher value

[sly bobcat]

Electrify is just paladin's things

[near leaf]

Electrify is yellow lightning

I dont think we will see it outside of paladin

[high stratus]

if electrify is holy which god is it for? Lagon only?

most of the references to Lagon on skills are for shaman

[sly bobcat]

More like the righteous side of Rahyeh

[high stratus]

the electric conversion on smite does reference Lagon

[sly bobcat]

He wasn't always a jerk

[sly bobcat]

Also true. Could also just as easily be flavor mismatch from when they hadn't fully flushed out the lore

[raven sluice]

Just make a debuff that shamans can apply to enemies they shock and let it do things

[high stratus]

most Lagon references seem to be storm bolt related

[high stratus]

It would be nice if the giga overcap we get on shock on most builds did something

[raven sluice]

Yeah

[high stratus]

maybe a node in GS which storm bolts something (or even better gives you a storm stack) for every nth shock stack applied.

[raven sluice]

Like, 100% of shock chance is also chance to apply nature's wrath or something.

[raven sluice]

Yeah, GS gaining stacks from shock would also be cool

"Number of storm stacks gained (except when gaining a charge instead of losing a charge) is increased by you shock chance at 15% per point, say 5 pts"

[high stratus]

could be something like 1 storm stack per X shocks where X is the number of times this effect has triggered recently so you can really juice it but never break the scaling

[patent dock]

Does ignite applied by a holy skill display holy fire vfx? I was kinda thinking it might, they could split out a non-holy electrify for other classes if they want

[sly bobcat]

Don't think so

Pretty sure it's just normal fire

[sly bobcat]

It's been a while since I used non-cosmic smite though

[patent dock]

Hm, maybe it's just the death vfx I'm thinking of

[sly bobcat]

They definitely have different death vfx for holy kills

[raven sluice]

This would be giga if the rolls were good

Still decent prolly, grands cap at 8%

[high stratus]

I wonder if bleed crows could work? just on the strength of aspect of the boar, onos tull etc

[raven sluice]

I've been considering Onos Tul, easy high LP iirc?

For spriggan form saber bleed

Pale Ox is still hard to compete with, but it did get nerfed

Bleed crow I've considered as well. Just never mathed it

[near leaf]

Holy !!

I almost want to wait for a 3lp cleaver

😢

[raven sluice]

Idk why storm crows look insane for bleed

[near leaf]

WTF is my guy doing

[raven sluice]

Their tree makes them insane for crit though

[mossy coral]

Posing

[near leaf]

He was walking like that

[winter ivy]

He's doing his Bane impersonation

[near leaf]

HOLY !!

[mossy coral]

It's perfect

[sly bobcat]

that's called a display of dominance

[candid topaz]

what would you guys do? wear the exalt or try and slam onto the 2lp death rattle?

I think I want to move away from the exulis

[lofty rover]

Do you have a better exalt? 2 lp death rattle is not that rare so you can farm more if you need

[candid topaz]

sadly no

[candid topaz]

Like this is what I am using now. with the turq I am dropping in dps but I also gain all my armor and other things back. I think if I get the slam on the death though I will be sitting even better than I would with my exilus

huh.. I got it. well I will go do some more testing and be back

so it was still less but I added some juice

I forgot that I needed one more peace to be corrupt to get my 14 to all att chest to be active

I think I found my new neck

its alittle less dps but now I have 76% armor over -12% lol

So it is about 5 seconds faster at killing the boss dummy

[high stratus]

Title: aftershock being triggered by upheveal.
Suggestion: Aftershock can be triggered by Upheaval while in Werebear Form. Add this to Werebear Form passives or to Upheaval itself, or include it as an Idol modifier without negatively impacting the balance of other skills. or/and And let the Aftershock trigger from Upheaval spikes (where they land or on enemies), not from the player’s location. the idea of this change would be increase a bit the clear of mobs while using maul and have more satisfying clear.
from the suggestions thread, I was reading it and thinking that replacing shockwave with aftershocks would be a really cool unique.

upheaval doesn't really have any unique support as things stand

also an aftershock totem (behind aftershock repeats on the EQ tree?) would be sweet

[sour locust]

@near leaf Hey friend got a treat for you in the video shoutout 🙂 ME SMASH !

[near leaf]

Let's go!!!

[sour locust]

It's so damn fun !!! God bless Season 4 !

[near leaf]

Yup

No swipe?

I haven't watched the video, just the planner

[sour locust]

nah bro no time to swipe 🙂 Roar and Maul !

Uber Abby looked lost 😄

[near leaf]

I 'need to try the cold version

I have been playing phys

See I can beat Uber with it

I just got a nice bruta madness exulis

[sour locust]

i think both versions are good . matter of preference , had some cold weapons ready from my Ava build 🙂

oh nice i have a perfect exulis 🙂

[near leaf]

Maybe with throne it's a bit more dmg

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/480944533937324046/1496979253135278281/image.png?ex=69ebda12&is=69ea8892&hm=c2cc92ededb7b9088a57a09549d7c892531c9e99fa8344e2255f2f47c8e88cb6&

[sour locust]

ye Throne tips the scales a bit , although it's akward in the pyramid

[near leaf]

Look at that

[sour locust]

nice nice !!!

ye i been grinding a bit this season 🙂

[near leaf]

Me too

But only on that build 😏🤣

https://www.lastepochtools.com/profile/PvtVlad/character/Pop-Pop-Pop

[sour locust]

oh that cleaver corruption is giga

need to farm that for meself 😄

[near leaf]

Oh wtf I didn't realise

[sour locust]

one reason i didn't go with swipe is warcry caps ur crit so easily . can go full dmg on gear and ofc extra Invuln

[near leaf]

I thought it was melee dmg

[high stratus]

Why don't you use any thorn totem idols vlad?

I know you have laup but can't shockwaves blow up two rounds of totems?

[near leaf]

Not really

[sour locust]

it's the same wording as Brutality , so it should work . the %melee dmg prolly not though . Crit multi is just safe bet

[near leaf]

The timing is weird

[sour locust]

Laup's give u max totems instantly so can't have more out or blow up more unfort

[near leaf]

Yup

[sour locust]

even with Warcry then maul you only blow up one sequence

[near leaf]

Should work

[sour locust]

need to see what's more dmg that or crit multi , but i think crit multi is better . got multi on my cleaver

[near leaf]

Well, you already have a ton of multi

[sour locust]

only 750% 😄

[near leaf]

Did you count madness?

[sour locust]

aye with Madness

[near leaf]

I wonder if Palarus is better than Ladle

I need to bonk the dummy

[sour locust]

100 flat is superb. Seen palarus and ladle but i prefer palarus and cleaver

[near leaf]

Yeah, 100 flat is nice but 48%More Dmg could outweight that

[sour locust]

Aye got some 3 lp ladles gonna have to try them out for sure

[near leaf]

Just watched the video
You have crazy gear!
5k hp and more dmg that what I have

[sour locust]

Need to fix my armor though. But we doing good ye . Bear needs to be bigger

[light root]

if i'm using the Sky Opener node in the tempest strike tree, do the storm bolts cast this way also benefit from other damage increase nodes in the tempest strike tree?

[near leaf]

No

[light root]

I see thanks

[near leaf]

It's because storm Bolts already have a skill tree > gathering Storm

So the only node in Tempest Strike that affects it is this one

Because it's calling it directly

[light root]

yeah that makes sense, thank you!

[raven sluice]

Did some calcs, if anyone is interested

It's all for bleed. Only more multipliers

I didn't factor in that at minimum, solo companions have access to spriggan form thorn shield that is like... prolly makes companion go from 300-600 bleed chance, to 2k-4k, depending on cast speed. Plus maybe doubling your increased dmg factor. So solo companions probably have an edge unless you trigger spirit wolves or crowstorm on rapid fire

[near leaf]

Tinder
Water in the usb port
LinkedIn

[high stratus]

solo saber seems pretty competitive and has much better clearspeed afaict

[raven sluice]

I ddosed myself on tinder 💀

[high stratus]

how? do you have a botnet all trying to swipe for you?

[raven sluice]

Yeah, it's also got it's full dmg when spriggan form directly scaled by attack speed, good attack speed in its tree, doesn't require earthquake and 15 points in shaman, only 2 skill specialisations. Bear is more dmg if you pump all its skills, but you need minion CDR, can barely fit aspect of the viper, attack speed scaling is questionable, etc

[raven sluice]

Nah, I wrote some off the walls stuff plus some other things just to see what would happen

[high stratus]

how is that a DDOS?

[limpid veldt]

Still I wonder if bleed bear/sabertooth has more single dps than bleed squirrel

[high stratus]

does ddosed have a meaning I'm missing other than distributed denial of service attack

[high stratus]

probably not. Spirit wolves vs thorn shields doesn't seem all that different to me

you can maybe get 4x as many bleeds with thorn shield but you're getting a lot of spirit wolves

@raven sluice btw are u sure about howl on squirrels? thought they got a different active skill with diffferent effects

[raven sluice]

I've been thinking for a long time: "don't get off the reservation". Figured what the hell, I'll see what can happen on tinder. Now I got like 48 matches and 93 likes after maybe 10 days, and I bet not a single one is interesting

[lavish star]

How can I make my sabertooth cast upheavel more often?

[subtle lodge]

Cooldown recovery for minions?

[lavish star]

Dunno

[high stratus]

Trigger swipes more often, use fury leap, get minion attack speed idols

[near leaf]

No, it's a procc chance

[vapid canopy]

build idea: Phys gathering storm BM, using cleaver solution, palarus and an exulis with int -> madness conversion
stacking a lot of STR and attack speed

[high stratus]

storm bolts don't get the % increased from strength do they?

you're just getting flat at half the rate you'd get it from attunement

Scaling:
Per point of Strength:
4% increased Melee Damage
Per point of Attunement:
+1 Spell Damage

[vapid canopy]

still some attunement

and I have a 4 LP palarus, could put flat spell also

[high stratus]

unless you do the aoe/shotgunning nonsense that rusty(?) was doing idk if you'll get much damage out of it even so

[raven sluice]

Ngl, Exulis seems like insane amounts of attributes plus +2 all skills. Would it be worth wrecking dex and vitality just to get the stats on the item?

Neither guile nor rampancy is exactly bad for me either. But I don't scale dex or vitality particularly much

[high stratus]

storm bolts unfortunately just don't hit very hard

if you have 1k mana for excited bolts they cost more than boulders from aftershock idols and do less damage usually all else being equal

[vapid canopy]

man the bugs in this game are killing me

went from sanctum to echos just to get failed echo opening which requires relog

after relog i get the "connecting" bug

forcing me to restart with alt f4

[vapid canopy]

build kinda works for echos tbh

but single target eh

[crude breach]

https://www.lastepochtools.com/planner/BM6x1zlL I'm trying to make this memeholic thing currently, exulis is awesome on it as I got frenzy from maul

[unkempt thistle]

Druid, Level 100

Game Version:

Season 4: Shattered Omens / 1.4.2

Class:

Primalist (20) / Beastmaster (21) / Shaman (15) / Druid (57)

General:

▸ Health: 3,842, Regen: 827.28/s
▸ Mana: 293.41, Regen: 0/s
▸ Ward Retention: 82%, Regen: 0/s
▸ Attributes: 85 Str / 48 Dex / 41 Int / 72 Att / 48 Vit
▸ Resistances: 104% / 119% / 119% / 123% / 117% / 90% / 52%

Defenses:

▸ Endurance: 61%, Threshold: 1,162
▸ Dodge Chance: 7% (201)
▸ Armor Mitigation: 61% (4,560)
▸ Crit Avoidance: 111%

Used skills:

Werebear Form / Swipe / Earthquake / Fury Leap / Upheaval

[lavish star]

how can I play frogs if I dont have "The land before"

wont I have all other minions up?

[mossy coral]

You'll just have less frogs

[lavish star]

how hard is it to get that idol? Is it a specific drop or anywhere?

[mossy coral]

just random like everything else

[near leaf]

It's pretty common

I got a couple without trying

You can do adorned prophecies

[lavish star]

im not in corrupted mono yet so drops should be low here

[raven sluice]

If you're MG, maybe just buy it. If you're CoF, probably just get like 10 unique idol prophecies and if you don't get it I would be giga surprised

[subtle lodge]

You just play and have less frogs / companions

[high stratus]

Do you think an aftershock totem would actually be good?

[sly bobcat]

fwiw usually you don't have to relog for failed echo opening. you can just zone out to the end of time and then come back into the monolith

that fixes it pretty consistently in my experience

[mossy coral]

Man why does divine flare in symbols of hope have to be so scuffed, probably same thing as less frequency of storm stacks

Probably does calculations on the fly and can't keep up

[open ravine]

they do on squirrels 😄

since they get your scaling and double tree scaling

[vapid canopy]

today everytime after I did sanctum or aberroth and went back to monoliths I got this LE 66 error and echo doesnt open

[open ravine]

and they are global skill not a subskill

[mossy coral]

But that skill will trigger like once or twice per second

[open ravine]

the only bad part is proc rate , but maybe you just say screw the solo companion nodes and run the army version

[high stratus]

sure but 5 points for a 10% chance to trigger a single bolt is diabolical and retal bolts aren't much better

[open ravine]

nah it triggers more than that, with retal and the 10% proc

[sly bobcat]

lightning wolves with storm bolt was good once upon a time

[mossy coral]

ew! Retal isn't real, not reliable

[open ravine]

it's like a sub 1m dummy kill on single t7 gear

[high stratus]

if you're on 1000 mana (& paying 10 mana per bolt!) w/ the 32% more mod too then it's a bit better than a 600ADE skill with no multis

[sly bobcat]

bro imagine playing a build that can kill the dummy in a reasonable amount of time

this meme made by tempest strike gang

[open ravine]

[high stratus]

is that from bolts or lightning melee?

[open ravine]

I still haven't seen anyone do the wolf variation with the helm

[mossy coral]

Killing dummy? Not in my game!

[open ravine]

bolts, they hit for 18-20mil

[mossy coral]

Tried to meme with divine flare, turns out to be bugged like everything else I look at 😒

[open ravine]

divine flare lmao

now that's a funny one

[sly bobcat]

skyfall is my favorite paladin meme

who doesn't want an orbital laser? it's cool af

i was thinkin the other day i might try a melee manifest armor setup. i've still got my primal cadence with a lot of flat phys on it from when i was playing upheaval

[mossy coral]

Yeah
Technically it could hit 3 times/second while you use other skills in the meantime and it could echo, with 80% of your screen coverage.
But EHG doesn't like fun so it does neither of those things besides area.
(Gain rate bugged or just isn't coded correctly, echo is bugged it does nothing)

[patent dock]

They don't get your scaling, just the wolf/squirrel scaling plus GS tree

[mossy coral]

Pretty sure he meant your scaling as the mana thing

[open ravine]

I mean like the weapon scaling, mana, attribute, and storm bolt idols

it's all assumed by the Storm Bolt skill itself, which they cast to also get their multis.

[patent dock]

I see, that's just the GS scaling so I thought you meant something else

[open ravine]

well I meant like idols and attributes are kind of weird in this case

the mana and weapon dmg is also kind of weird for that skill until they did mage hungering soul and kind of confirmed that's how they intend it to work when minions get skills

[mossy coral]

The only way for GS to get increased AND flat from attunement is wolves, kind of funny

[patent dock]

What is the flat from?

[open ravine]

this was the bastion endgame planner I made testing it at 3k and it's alright https://streamable.com/iqfquc

[karmic bison]

Stormbolt wolf's are fine, not great though, same with squirrels.

[open ravine]

I think they are pretty good tbh

pretty slept on

[mossy coral]

bolts themselves, the 1/attunement

[open ravine]

Most builds I saw didn't even build them properly

[mossy coral]

4% increased damage because of wolves passive, that's what I mean

[patent dock]

That's your attribute scaling, not wolves'

[karmic bison]

But compared to solo bear/raptor/sabertooth nothing is even close lol

[mossy coral]

Yeah I know, but if you combine the 2 you get that

[patent dock]

Wolves don't get flat per attunement because they don't have attunement

[mossy coral]

Right, but they do for storm bolts since it's the spell and your attributes

[patent dock]

No they don't

[open ravine]

what's the dps on those builds hmm?

[patent dock]

They do get flat and inc per str though, inc from wolf scaling and flat from the BM passive

[karmic bison]

All 50 to 100million in 2lp gear

[open ravine]

I know bear and saber are good, I suppose raptors are too. It's probs like 60m+ dps for sure

[karmic bison]

Just get a primal cadence with double t7 flat

[open ravine]

yeah the squirrels with just attack proc is like 20-30m

[karmic bison]

Test all crit setups easy

[open ravine]

I can't calc retal dmg

[karmic bison]

Yeah thats circumstantial

Wolfs/squirrels still good but I prefer less screen clutter

[mossy coral]

They get increased per attunement when you take that node, you sure they don't get the flat for storm bolts from your attunement?

[patent dock]

Yeah, when minions use skills, they get no benefit from those skills' attribute scaling because they don't have attributes

[open ravine]

the only thing they get that's sorta weird is the flat damage on idols

[mossy coral]

Huh, kind of weird then

[open ravine]

I wonder if the shaman node works for them or if it's just myself

[mossy coral]

The shared flat?

Shared pen?

[open ravine]

no the recast node

[karmic bison]

Ahh lag

Isn't storm bolts broken with spending and generating storm stacks?

[open ravine]

what do you mean

[sly bobcat]

it does not

only on your own storm bolts

[open ravine]

yeah tested the skill tree one adn it didn't but didn't test shaman, just did

in fact did not work

[karmic bison]

Someone i guess was testing in a bit ago and was saying it crashes the game if you have too many storm stacks expended at once

Ive never tried playing that way though ofc

[open ravine]

oh, idk how much you can get to expend tbh

[karmic bison]

Yeah I dont remember who made the build

[open ravine]

interesting

[high stratus]

It was using increased area and effects that have a chance to repeat storm bolts on hit with shotgunning multiple targets at once

Once you net more than one bolt per bolt it quickly crashes

[open ravine]

ahhh

that makes sense haha

[near leaf]

It was @winged swallow

[karmic bison]

Gotcha

[winged swallow]

? what did I do?

[near leaf]

You crashed the game with GS

You

[winged swallow]

oh. yeah

super fun build

volatile tho. explosive results may vary

[uneven pagoda]

does anybody know if the ancestral sabertooth benefits from the summon sabertooth tree? like can it use upheaval etc?

[mossy coral]

No and no, it only benefits from these nodes and the 2 solo companion nodes in BM tree. (It also scales with str/dex/attunement, it's not your minion and won't deal any damage nor do armor shred or anything useful)

[uneven pagoda]

oof unlucky

[mossy coral]

Yeah unfortunately they got a buff but still sucks

[raven sluice]

actually no, but I was just giving squirrels the benefit of the doubt

[winged swallow]

nice now I just need to find a T7 attack speed spear with physical damg on it

and my hybrid melee/spell werebear can pop off

[sly bobcat]

rift beast dropped a 2lp harmony for me the other day and i have no idea what i want to use it for

[mellow kestrel]

Is it good? Must be quick cooldown for mail

Maul

[plain condor]

Is there any reason why going into Werebear form would reduce my armor%? The amount stays the same, but it goes from 62% to 42%

[near leaf]

You must have the Str node in the passive
It gives you %Armor per Str when you are human, and %Melee Dmg in bear

[crude breach]

no it's not good, for some reason my damage sucks

[plain condor]

That is it, thank you!

[raven sluice]

Brutality must have the strongest alternate attribute effect right? Problem with brutality and madness though, is the usual effect of the base attributes are like way stronger than the other attributes?

[raven sluice]

Sad that the primalist only corrupted relic basetype is kinda odd. Mage and rogue did get some interesting ones at least

I'll prolly go for rampancy/guile exulis anyway. The loss of base attribute functionality seems worth it on those two, for a build that's just permanently in spriggan form casting thorn shield with a solo saber

[sly bobcat]

i would argue that apathy has the strongest effect compared to the base. mana regen is tough to get normally

the downside is rough though

[raven sluice]

fair, I think apathy might be the best alternate attribute

but it's partly cuz strength is so much better than attunement imo

[sly bobcat]

yeah

i honestly don't think the armor loss is too bad. sentinel just gets crazy high base armor on its items. primalist has a lot of extra DR sources or ways to give itself armor

[winged swallow]

Yeah Primalist has the take 20% less when below 35% HP which combos with your endurance, Boar stances 15% less damg taken, and the 16% damage taken from nearby enemies node

Top it off with red rings, a null potent, or a titan heart. Primalist is quite beefy

I believe my GS primalist has 51% reduced damg taken at all times or something?

Primalist is a chunky boy

[raven sluice]

with boar up, I have 49% less taken at all times, without boar I have -8% xD

and my idols are kinda bad

but 83% DR from armour, most of which applies to dot and most of which applies to non-phys, is a lot

I just corrupted a legendary nihilis to max rolls

and hit t7+t6 on a cleaver

this is nice

[sly bobcat]

Oh yeah I'm not gonna say it's not. I just don't think it's too much of a loss

Especially with how much damage you're getting in return

[raven sluice]

I guess, if you have a lot of other mitigation

I wonder if I'll be comfortable farming 1000c now

Got a vessel of strife, so now I have 2.2k ward

[winged swallow]

My GS primalist is at 800 currently and nothing even comes close to killing him.

[raven sluice]

I died twice iirc, on like 600c plus just farming

In maybe 50-100 echoes

But that was on worse gear I wouldn't think a homebrew should necessarily be able to kill harbinger gauntlet with on 300c

Did it on 600c+ though

[bold eagle]

if i have more than 100% aftershock chance can you cast multiple aftershocks per hit?

[winged swallow]

no

aftershock procs aren't programmed to do anything above 100% chance

This is why I use a idol altar with prefix boost so I can get 100% chance from just two adorned idols

to free up a insane amount of idol altar space

[bold eagle]

ya haha thats exactly what i was asking for, ocular altar it is!

last question; are upheaval subskills (shockwave, shatter totem) converted when upheaval is? like in the tree or with the new idol

[high stratus]

they should be

shatter totem is but the cold one where frozen enemies you kill explode probably not.

[raven sluice]

I think I need to try uberoth. Then I could let myself go MG, buy infinite stash, and actually organise stash

My saber without proper ramp gets julra to like 40% before first blast, then she dies like a few seconds after I phase back in. How does that kind of dmg measure up against uberoth?

Saber might sit on 15 shields or something, when it should be like 30, plus it's bleed. So dmg should be far higher in a longer fight

[mossy coral]

I think she needs to be killed in 1 frame or if you have ramp damage then Idk doesn't matter I suppose

Actual DPS I've no idea about

Either way you need to have really high DPS to kill it

Or it's a 30 min fight lol

[lofty rover]

Julra is a joke if you want to measure proper dps vs uber dummy is your best bet

[karmic bison]

it's all measurable. It's like 20million dps to kill t4 julra before explosion.

[karmic bison]

Test damage on dummy. In decent gear fully buffed crit sabertooth should be hitting for that much, but in goodgear goes to 40million

[raven sluice]

Ah, hmm. Sounds like my dmg is probably quite a bit too low for uberoth then. But I'll test how fast it kills dummy

[tawny spoke]

Guys listen

I think EQ auto attack is as good as sentinel

Landmower build

[tawny spoke]

No but you can cast another aftershock if you have the 100% chance to cast another aftershock if it hits

[winter ivy]

Anyone tried using the Berserker Belt with Serpent Strike? Serpent Strike got nerfed, but with the belt + brutality, maybe it could do crazy damage again? You can get Frenzy from Maelstrom easily too.

[wise leaf]

serpent strike did crazy damage by stacking (bugged)more multi's on serpent venom

because serpent strike is a 0 cost attack and the damage is from an ailment, neither brutality nor the belt affect it

[winter ivy]

oh right, I forgot about the mana part of Brutality

You could still get some mileage out of Rampancy and Frenzy for the build though.

oh, no stacking on serpent venom either

[wise leaf]

correct

all frenzy is doing will be buffing your melee damage output

which is nooooooot enough to make that good

[winter ivy]

yeah...

Guess I'll go back to looking at EQ with the Brutality + Rampancy Combo. Would the Aftershocks benefit?

[wise leaf]

if you're casting EQ directly it'll benefit from brutality + the belt, if not then only the belt

[lofty rover]

Earthquake can potentially one shot with the combo uber

[near leaf]

0 x infini =0

[karmic bison]

Eq summon bear already does 100million dps

It be far more interesting to test it on an under used melee skill that has decent aoe.

[lofty rover]

Like tempest strike

I think it can do good damage with the combo

[near leaf]

Tempest Strike???

[winter ivy]

it has mana cost, but what would you even do with it?

[near leaf]

I mean, I would be happy to be wrong

[lofty rover]

20 mana cost even when getting rid of 1 tempest and the pathing nodes to get the 2 24% more damage nodes

So brutality applies full,then frenzy belt rampancy stacking,plus aspect of the shark

Not saying its gonna be amazing cause the skill tree itself aint very good on multis but it can work somewhat

[near leaf]

How do you plan on sustaining a 20 mana cost attack?

[lofty rover]

Good question ,any mana tech on primalist or you guys rely on mana regen for everything

[near leaf]

I guess we can say 15 because there is the nod to get 5 mana

That's primalist biggest issue

You can maybe swipe in between

For Mana, more dmg, crit multi

[lofty rover]

You can get rid of 2 tempest ,that would make it 12 mana cost so not full but still decent brutality scaling,

[high stratus]

mana is the main issue for primalist yeah. You can get tons of max mana easily but recovery is tough

[near leaf]

We need aspect of the trout
Get every 3 hits, get one mana per enemy hit in the last 3 hits

[wise leaf]

"get tonnes of max mana easily" translation: sometimes attunement is your damage scaling attribute which means you scale a bunch of max mana you have no synergies for and get sweet screw all else from the attribute cos attunement sucks

[high stratus]

I think you'll find it's totally fair and balanced that basically every mana damage scalar in the game works off max mana but gathering storm uses current mana.

[near leaf]

@patent dock Yop, how is your vinebear doing? Did you finish it?

[raven sluice]

Primalist simply primalist (derogatory)

[high stratus]

mage also has a few current mana nodes but they seem to be mostly on skills that aren't used much or ones that recover mana rather than cost you loads of it

[raven sluice]

Guide to primalist imo:

1. Click beastmaster
2. Click a companion that scales with strength
3. Try fitting cleaver solution
4. Pretend the rest of the class doesn't exist unless you have written druid guide

[raven sluice]

Mage has a lot of cool mana stuff from what I heard, so it sounds less messed up by default anyway

[karmic bison]

Druid totem explodey is a good option

[raven sluice]

Yeah, I realised I was giving druid too little credit, even if it feels like it's still very wonky

[karmic bison]

And reflect shaman, tornado shaman we basically have it all

[raven sluice]

Is tornado shaman on the same lvl as tornadobear though? Maybe now that bear is nerfed I guess?

[karmic bison]

And then theres rogue :d

[karmic bison]

Yep does like 50million dps rn

[near leaf]

Oo

[high stratus]

tornado, totem and their avalanche shaman all seem alright tbh, but they jump through so many hoops to just be alright

[raven sluice]

Are they using foot of the mountain and spriggan?

[high stratus]

xylem, foot of the mountain, no spriggan

[karmic bison]

Yeah remember any a tier build is over 20million dps

[raven sluice]

Damn

[karmic bison]

B tier is less then 20mil

C is 10million less

[raven sluice]

Foot of the mountain but no spriggan almost sounds playable

[high stratus]

defensively they seem a bit suspect though, the amount of EHP you give up by using urzil's pride as your chest armor is significant and only on 3.6k HP

using a thorn totem idol just for the defensive benefits shaman gets from having totems lol

it's on the same tier as (self cast) smite paladin but I'd rather play the paladin any day of the week than avalanche shaman

[near leaf]

You got so much screen and off screen coverage though

I don't think you'll see any mobs

[high stratus]

these two significantly reduce the full screen clear. The storm bolts don't do much damage and the avalanche is much better for ST but with less coverage

lightning smite offscreens with the best of them anyway

if you have your mouse at the edge of the screen, hold down smite and walk with WASD you won't even see enemies in most monoliths

[near leaf]

Ah I was talking about Tornado mb

[raven sluice]

Tornado coverage is insane. I forgot which node in Avalanche was the bugged giga dps one. 📝

[wise leaf]

for real all EHG has given us is mana when we use a spammable melee and mana regen

that's it

the other mana trick we had got killed at the start of the season

[subtle lodge]

That trick was kind of silly though but yeah, not getting any alternative solution sucks

[unreal field]

And even that is not nearly enough for exciting bolts. Especially against larger groups I’m oom most of the time :/

[high stratus]

excited bolts is like paying 3.333 mana per extra bolt, which isn't entirely terrible but it's a worse rate than casting Tornado gets you & requires you to scale max mana to even access it let alone pay for it

[tender trout]

Hello, any cool Swarmblade build in 1.4 out there?

[raven sluice]

When werebear still reset mana pool, it was basically the option between mana efficient bolts on shaman, or "free bolts" locked by transform CD on werebear, with more lightning dmg and exciting bolts (which was and prolly still is worth on tornadobear)

[crude breach]

frostbite swarmblade?

[raven sluice]

Now tornado costs like 3 less mana, and ladle and foot can make it 10, it's very nice. Meanwhile bear that was prolly stronger is nerfed

[high stratus]

yeah if you can pay rage instead of mana they're basically free

[tender trout]

No clue tbh, my only interaction with Primalist was bleed Swarmblade and lightning werebear in like 0.8/0.9 😄

[crude breach]

https://maxroll.gg/last-epoch/build-guides/frostbite-swarmblade-druid-guide

actually it's really powerful

not as powerful as before nerf but still..

like really tanky as well

[raven sluice]

Yup

[crude breach]

I have yet to see build using this part of tree

[wise leaf]

i'm sorry 8 points

what the hell

is that

idek what skill tree that is for

[wise leaf]

what skill is this for?

oh derp it's passive tree

ofc

well yeah cos it's the shapeshifter buff portion which sucks incredible amounts of ass

actually wait

why doesn't tornado bear use this?

it still sucks but like

[near leaf]

Nothing new for the bug
Tornado Frostbite is the best out there

Tsunami might be fun

[raven sluice]

Ngl, it looks kinda interesting to just use all the fire minion gear with Rahyeh body armor. But is it actually enough to make the archetype decent?

I feel like, to justify fire over lightning or cold you need a punchline, not just some increased minion fire damage. To justify ignite over bleed they'd have to delete aspect of the boar?

[high stratus]

yeah, I was looking at what fire crows get and thinking how is this better than bleed?

[raven sluice]

What's good is you have a bunch of items supporting it. Dragonflame staff, rahyeh body, spirits of fire amulet

But it feels like you still can't compete with bleed. Maybe you can compete with cold or lightning on crit?

[glad hinge]

im currently using it, never played regular crows so cant really compare

the health on hit affix on rahyeh is really good, thats one advantage i guess

[raven sluice]

For bleed, you should already be stacking like 70% boar effect on idols. It's still probably better dps to just get another 55% boar effect from wings of discord than using onos tul, despite onos tul otherwise being the glass cannon option for bleed minions. Side effect of stacking boar is you take like 65% less dmg and your minions take like 80% less dmg. Ignite doesn't realistically stand a chance, at least on BM. But crit or non-BM maybe

[high stratus]

is boar effect really better than onos tull when you could use nest?

[raven sluice]

Nest + onos tul is probably ultimate glass cannon, unless you got another relic. I use vessel of strife, but that's not glass cannon so I guess invalid argument

It does depend a bit though. If you fit like 4 perfect roll omen idols, then you can probably not compete against nest. But if you need or want weaver enchants, then you don't want only omen idols

[patent dock]

It went well and accomplished everything I wanted to do (Abby and Observer), so I would say it's finished since I started making alts for meme builds afterward

[raven sluice]

A single enchant on wings of discord can make your spriggan form permanent. A single other enchant can give like 7 seconds of haste. Then you have 2 omen idols anyway, that don't get an enchant. I'd say get a 2x2 unique idol with the stats you like most from those available. All of these in juiced up slots. Then a 1x1 idol in a bad slot but still 100% effect on it from wings of discord. Assuming pyramidal altar anyway, idk if there's a better one

[patent dock]

Ocular is better than or equal to pyramidal for wings for many layouts, but depends on the shapes you want.

[raven sluice]

Huge is kinda meh, but prolly better than Land Before/Throne of Ambition

Maybe not baseline, but with effect

40% aspect of the viper duration is nice, when you keep it up with triggering maelstroms that trigger stormbolts + triggering avalanche boulders, cuz spriggan form

Unless you go the gathering storm on evade belt and friends of the tempest

For what I'm doing atm anyway

[patent dock]

I think you can run a layout using every shape except huge on either ocular or pyramidal, might be better on ocular, but can't remember off the top of my head.

And that would be every possible shape that can roll boar effect

[high stratus]

#🐺┃primalist message

[raven sluice]

Iirc, pyramidal gets like:

• 1 Tall Omen (Large)
• 1 Wide Omen (Grand)
• 1 Ornate (widest)
• 1 Adorned (2x2)
• 1 empty slot top
• 2x2 of empty slots below

[high stratus]

can't fit the ornate in

[raven sluice]

From above:

• 1x1 (x)
• Grand Omen (xxx)
• Large Omen (x), Adorned (xx), Adorned (xx)
• Large Omen (x), Adorned (xx), Adorned (xx)
• Large Omen (x), Ornate (xxxx)

All get good slot except 1x1

Nest can do it too though. But better replace the 3x4 grid of adorneds and ornates with as many omens as possible and a large/grand normal

Maybe the unique adorned can somehow be replaced with a stout+humble, and then your 1x1 is eterran/lagonian due to pyramidal implicit. But I didn't manage to do that

Anyone in game and able to post a screenshot of ocular?

[patent dock]

On ocular you can have a 1x1 and both 2 slots, plus a dedicated needle slot

but can't fit the throne

[raven sluice]

Idk

I guess the orange or red can be an omen instead

I guess this is it?

Since it's symmetrical by 90 degrees or however you express that, you can swap ornate for huge

[patent dock]

Yeah, exactly

I'd post screenshots of my sheet if I was at home

[raven sluice]

xD

Ocular looks quite good tbh

The class idols are all in refracted slots. It's the weaver idols that aren't, but they're still doubled by wings of discord

And a slot for needle is just QoL

2 of the non-mini weaver idols with 100% effect should be very easy to beat a unique idol on, if you don't actually build around a unique idol

[patent dock]

Yeah, if you don't specifically want throne, ocular is nice

[raven sluice]

Yup

[near leaf]

Sweet, do you have a planner of your final char?

[patent dock]

This is where it ended up, I will admit I definitely did not bother optimizing this character much at all, just slapped stuff in there, body armor is a random drop, etc.
https://www.lastepochtools.com/profile/FatherToast/character/Thorn_Totem_Toast

[near leaf]

Wow only 9 deaths!

[patent dock]

I think it's a pretty solid build since I didn't even need to do any of that to breeze through 400c

[near leaf]

What kind of ward do you get with bones?

Yes

[patent dock]

Oh yeah, really good suvivability

I wanna say I sit at around 4-6k ward in combat? I rarely dip into health (which is nice because I don't have great health recovery lol)

[near leaf]

Think Quetzeri is needed?

[high stratus]

are big vines just worse?

[patent dock]

Nah, it's totally not mandatory

[near leaf]

Yes because they can't shotgun as ranged

[patent dock]

For vinebear, I think so yeah, unless bugged you'd only get 2/3rds of a vine per maul

[high stratus]

rly? I thought they were just using spirit thorns which can shotgun

[high stratus]

yeah I realised after posting that it probably counts as indirect cast even though the maul/fury leap is direct

[patent dock]

Thorn totems are most of my dps, so that double cast speed for 1s on maul does help a good bit, it's nice to have low cooldown on maul

Also the sad thing is, while frozen vengeance can proc on every maul, which is really cozy for clearing, it procs before the summons from that maul

[near leaf]

Oo

So totems never gets it

[patent dock]

So you can slightly optimize single target by proccing it with swipe, doing maul, and then swipe immediately after, not a super huge gain so I rarely bother

On the flip side, maul procs laup twice for some reason, so I get two totem pops every maul lol

[raven sluice]

Hmm. Do nemesises cap out at some lvl for LP calculations?

[patent dock]

Yes, level 100. I think they added downscaling too for very low player or area level, I don't remember details though

Yeah, found it

Cannot add T5+ affixes to unique or legendary items if your character is below level 24.
Cannot add exalted affixes to unique or legendary items if your character is below level 51.
Lower levels are used for sealed affix tiers if your character is below level 40 (from level 33).

[raven sluice]

Ah, but I mean like, is it worth going to 1000c for farming nemesis towers?

Difference vs 4000c seems negligible, so probably not worth it on most if any primalist builds

But just the calculator I found in here

https://lastepoch.tunklab.com/lp-chance?u=julras_obsession&cof=true&lp=true

[patent dock]

For exalts maybe, for LP no corruption makes no difference

[shy juniper]

Hello there Primalists! 👋 🙂

I just started a Primalist and I don't know which Mastery to go for.

I hate pets and DoT damage and prefer melee attacks. Doesn't have to be melee, but pets and DoT builds is a no go.

Any suggestions?

Ehem, please? 😦

[high stratus]

beastmaster is usually the best melee mastery for primalist even without using pets, but druid has one or two good builds using werebear

shaman has some meme stuff but it's just so incredibly squishy and other than the avalanche skill tree enabling some meme interactions it doesn't really offer anything

[shy juniper]

@high stratus I see. Thank you very much for the information! I think I'm gonna go with Beastmaster then 🙂

[high stratus]

any decent melee BM is probably going to pick between these mutually exclusive ways to use earthquake & you'll very likely want to use wolves just because howl is such a good melee buff

[shy juniper]

Yeah I'm gonna have to read up on the class and mastery to get the gist of it. Think I'm gonna go "Upheaval" because that sounds like fun :)

[high stratus]

druid is better for upheaval afaik because werebear can trigger it and scale the shatter totem subskill but YMMV

[shy juniper]

Ok that's weird because I see a "Upheaval Beastmaster Guide" on Maxroll.

[high stratus]

There's a shatter totem build on the way in the tier above that iirc

[raven sluice]

Ah, I remember now what I was gonna do on tsunami. Just scale cast speed and reduced mana cost. 7.5 from legendary sceptre with weaver set, 6 from foot of the mountain. Puts it on 3.5 mana cost? No need for apathy. Plus realset weaver ammy gives a ton of crit

But I wanna do a shattered lance build

Even a tsunami build should prolly cast through scorp which is funny

Ladle things

Altho, no ladle cuz you need sceptre and neither can be off handed

[near leaf]

Mana cost on sceptre and weaver set ?

There is no weaver Sceptre

Is there ??

[patent dock]

I think people say abandoned set is bugged to apply to all weapons, not just WW ones

[near leaf]

[patent dock]

When/if they fix that, T8 -mana is 7

[raven sluice]

yup, bugged

seems all legendary mods are 1.5 with weaver set

at least if you have ring and legends entwined

it would be giga weird if primordial ring did any difference though

[lofty rover]

Yep and btw it applies to all uniques not only weapons

Fyi

As long its weapon slot and offhand

[raven sluice]

damn

giga bugged, seems we can finally block cap on primalist

[lofty rover]

Primordial ring doesn't matter for this

You just need set i did this

Even better stuff like rive foe cleaver double bonus stats on weapon loves this tech

[patent dock]

Shouldn't affect foe cleaver

[lofty rover]

It may be the 50% effect

Kinda shocked that offhand works with it

[patent dock]

since bonus stats like that are not "on" the weapon, should be additive with foe cleaver basically

[patent dock]

Yeah, more surprising they whiffed that condition than the WW part lol

but both checks already exist in other mechanics in game, so idk how they messed up either

[raven sluice]

I got an omnis finally. Corruption was all rolls set to minimum

[patent dock]

Oof lol

[raven sluice]

Kinda of a rip lmao

[raven sluice]

How does the confluence farming work? Is it just imprint, remove all corruption, do 1 echo, hope it spawns, otherwise do shade and get all corruption back. Repeat?

I allocated the node that removed corruption from shades, thinking with a lot of gaze and a much higher corruption timeline, you get shades (and hopefully confluence) anyway, but then I just got a shade on my first one. Is that just bad luck or is that how it works?

[lofty rover]

The trick is to use the chain node on the weaver tree and imprint confluence ,at around 400 corruption to be max efficient, I am guessing you trying to farm omnis ? .basically you reset timeline and see if it spawns if it doesn't you reset again and you check again,and you keep going until it spawns you dont do any maps you just hope it spawns as soon as you reset ,you need the node memories of the observer for it to spawn like beside the chains

[lofty rover]

The catch up shade is no good for loot ,cause it scales with distance but confluence doesn't really for some reason if it did then wwe wouldn't be able to obtain omnis at start of the timeline

[raven sluice]

I'll test this

[lofty rover]

If it helps bina made a video about it, and there is a disclaimer about confluence in comments

[raven sluice]

I'll watch this again, more thoroughly as I intend to farm it myself now

[crude breach]

hulk...smash!

[crude breach]

I mean...DETROIT SMASH

does even some build use this...

[near leaf]

Some decent meme mage

I could see it on vk now with the new VO ring

[unreal field]

Like this one https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1uhXcplCh6c

[near leaf]

Exactly!

I think I am cooking smth

[crude breach]

don't forget to turn off gas when you are done

[near leaf]

It might be overcooked

[crude breach]

smells like chicken

[near leaf]

I need to go home and do it on the pc

Forge Guard Void Shield Throw with the spear

[unreal field]

I have one more in mind: Together with Gaspar's Decimate - more meme, less decent 🙂

[near leaf]

And volcanic orb ring

[limpid veldt]

https://maxroll.gg/last-epoch/build-guides/shatter-totem-werebear-druid-guide

so they added it

[near leaf]

😭😭

[limpid veldt]

?

btw the amulet is not the one I expected

since well

we all know that brutality exulis is the way better choice

[near leaf]

It's less tanky
And harder to get

Weaver is nice and easy

[near leaf]

They made a guide, now I don't want to play it anymore

[limpid veldt]

but you played it before a guide existed, no?

[near leaf]

Yup

But now it's too mainstream 😅

[limpid veldt]

so just stick with it

[limpid veldt]

it has been mainstream way before the guide tbh

literally more than half of the ladder uses the build already

[near leaf]

I have been playing it since 1.2
Before it was a thing

[limpid veldt]

ah I see

I wonder

will the same happen for crit HS mage in 1.5?

[near leaf]

Crit HS mage?

[limpid veldt]

hungering soul skeletal mages

OP but almost no one plays it now

[near leaf]

Well, that's a Acolyte question

[limpid veldt]

oh

ok

still I feel that it's just wrong to have shatter totem without exulis

almost all ladder builds use it

[near leaf]

Imo it's fine
It makes you less tanky by a bunch

And you can do 1-1.5k corruption without it

But it is a lot more dmg for sure

You go with Cleaver too and it's bruta madness

[limpid veldt]

hmm btw

primalist seems to have crit cap problem

at least it's hard to reach crit cap without slamming some t7 increased crit chance

[near leaf]

It kinda depends
Warcry can give you a lot

Aspect of the Lynx has a lot of Flat

[wise leaf]

yeah it's more some skills have issues hitting crit cap

[mossy coral]

You usually get close with warcry

[crude breach]

as I once made singing barbarian in D2, I want to make singing bear

[near leaf]

Well good luck 🤣
Warcry doesn't deal dmg

Closest would be bear tsunami I guess?

The more you Warcry the more you get to cast tsunami

[crude breach]

it does not?

[near leaf]

Can you see any "warcry deals More Dmg" nodes?

[crude breach]

I got challange for you: sing so bad that ubberoth rather die than hear you sing

[near leaf]

I don't think we can sing loud enough for him to hear us with that big beast mount legged thing under him

[crude breach]

https://tenor.com/view/kenichi-mightiest-disciple-siegfried-anime-gif-17921136029672661014 void knights can sing while spin so why not primalists

my naming sense suck

[crude breach]

can aftershock from totems hit one target multiple times?

from totem shatter bear

[near leaf]

There is no Aftershock

[crude breach]

oh it's shockwave...rip

[near leaf]

Shatter explosion yes

Melee shockwave from Upheaval no

[near leaf]

It's not shockwave either

Shockwave is a Melee aoe

And cannot shotgun

Shatter Totem can shotgun

[crude breach]

I meant this one

[near leaf]

This, no

[crude breach]

could be interesting maybe with event horizon since maul does not care about atk speed

[near leaf]

Because it's shockwave

[crude breach]

oh but it has mellee tag

so event horizon boosts it

lol

[near leaf]

And EHG in their wisdow decided to make shockwave no able to hit the same target

Because that's not shatter Totem

That's shockwave

[crude breach]

boo

[near leaf]

Shatter Totem is on another node

[crude breach]

I mean kinda bs since if 5 grenades explode around me than I get full force, maybe even more

[near leaf]

The shockwave can't even hit a target already hit by Upheaval

[crude breach]

that's even more bs

[near leaf]

All because they tick a box when they coded the skill

They could change that in 1 click

I asked Mike a little bit ago

[winter ivy]

Upheaval woulda been very playable long ago if those shockwaves could hit the same targets

[crude breach]

meanwhile I'm BEARing with it around

terrible weapon tho xD but I like the mechanics of it

[winter ivy]

EH is one of my favorites. Just a goofy weapon to play with

[crude breach]

still no idea why maul hits only so weak...maybe cuz I'm just tanky fluff of bear meat and have almost no % melle damage apart from str.?

it takes like 2-3 minutes to kill harbinger at 100 corruption

and despite leeching tons the belt does like...nothing

[winter ivy]

"More" needs some "increased" to multiply.

The leech thing is probably a useless gimmick

[crude breach]

https://www.lastepochtools.com/planner/oR6q2GXL

[unkempt thistle]

Druid, Level 86

:white_check_mark: This character build is verified

Game Version:

Season 4: Shattered Omens / 1.4.5

Class:

Primalist (20) / Beastmaster (21) / Shaman (15) / Druid (43)

General:

▸ Health: 2,927, Regen: 424.27/s
▸ Mana: 408.22, Regen: 10.72/s
▸ Ward Retention: 80%, Regen: 18/s
▸ Attributes: 89 Str / 45 Dex / 40 Int / 60 Att / 46 Vit
▸ Resistances: 51% / 80% / 72% / 100% / 88% / 42% / 48%

Defenses:

▸ Endurance: 51%, Threshold: 624
▸ Armor Mitigation: 55% (3,420)
▸ Crit Avoidance: 9%

Used skills:

Swipe / Fury Leap / Werebear Form / Upheaval / Earthquake

[crude breach]

I should change shattered world for +4 swipe and helmet for +4 werebear one...

but still that''s only 200% at max roll

[near leaf]

Have you considered Quetzeri boots?

[winter ivy]

Are the aftershocks doing much? I don't see a source of chill/freeze. Not taking the upheaval node in Fury Leap for the more damage gains?

[near leaf]

A solo Wolf could be a nice extra dmg

[crude breach]

I have uphveal from this

[winter ivy]

I wish EQ had a cold convert... instead it has fire.

[crude breach]

aftershock crit only for 40K with max stacks from EH

[winter ivy]

If you take both nodes you get a 30% more damage modifier.

[crude breach]

and no boots maul has 2.2 sec CD

is like 1.8 with boots

not big difference since it doesn't scale with ATK spd

take a while for bear to jump

rather's it's more like meme for me

I just thought that afer 10 stacks of dissolution aftershocks should hit harder...same for maul

honestly 150% mroe damage for such abysmal atk speed is bad trade and IMO that weapon should be redesigned

I even traded lots of HP for better frenzy from maul

still swiping at speed of drunk bear

I think I will move on and make a dinosaur build with raptors and tyrranosaurus

since for this update I'm going primalist

[mossy coral]

Ask him to untick the box so we can hit totems for damage 🙏

1 skill with low multi hitting 1 time on an enemy isn't cutting it anymore

[near leaf]

Don't forget where you are

In #🐺┃primalist it's fine

In #🔪┃rogue it's not

[patent dock]

That's like 20% more dps, that's pretty good

[patent dock]

It's super great for things that don't scale with attack speed like shield bash or maul. The real downside is the move speed and that you can't use evade.

[mossy coral]

I'm just dreaming for buffs

[near leaf]

Rampage too

[patent dock]

Looks like you've forgotten

[raven sluice]

does confluence of oblivion get worse loot if you die in it?

I just had one where I dropped like 3 LP0 rings, 2 LP1 rings, 1 LP0 belt, 1 LP2 axe

no omnis

700c+

[patent dock]

Pretty sure rewards from woven echoes are never affected by dying in them

[raven sluice]

Just bad luck then I guess

I don't even want a +3 omnis 🙁 Just a maxrolled

My bricked minrolled one was idk res, +1. That wouldn't be enough either, even if it might have been an upgrade vs perfect nihilis

Perfect Nihilis with +34 life regen

[mossy coral]

I can never forgetti, primalist spaghetti

[sinful scaffold]

I assume that primalist is the go to for a bee build, ye?

[near leaf]

Yeah

[raven sluice]

I wonder if jasper's upheaval can be playable

170% cold pen, cold pen from strength, not the worst DE or multipliers anymore

Also I just realised cold swarmblade can easily get like 400% cold pen for frostbite from attunement

Also, I might be mistaken but it looked like some part of sabers triggered kit scaled with an AoE shrine on me?

Shattered Lance Reforged + Gavel + Weaver set, that combo should unfortunately go earthquake cuz you need a staff for 170% and cold pen on upheaval, and you also turn off attack speed scaling meaning you want a staff even more

[patent dock]

Isn't jasper's mainly about stacking fire stuff? Or you mean using it just for its one flat roll?

[patent dock]

All allies near a shrine get the buff when the shrine is activated, not sure how the "skill shrines" specifically work for that though

[high stratus]

Jasper's is cool but no attack speed roll is really rough and idk why you'd try cold with it unless it's just because throne supports both cold and fire at the same time

[raven sluice]

Just for the flat roll, because Upheaval wants you to be using a two handed staff to get 170% cold pen. Plus then have no attack speed scaling to get 120% more dmg. Without those things it deals like 25% of EQ dmg per mana, with those things it deals slightly more, on like 50% extra cold pen from strength

[high stratus]

is damage per mana really the right frame of reference for a 1.1aps no speed scaling skill?

[raven sluice]

no idea 😅

[high stratus]

surely triple slam EQ with spam filler is better

[raven sluice]

Ah, hmm. Seismic Tide is just 2s CD

82 mana for 295% dmg

that would put EQ far ahead again, but it's uncontrollable

and usually obscene overkill

[high stratus]

don't make it a cone and it'll still clear pretty well

[raven sluice]

hmm

might have to try that

also, frustrates me that bear can just trigger upheaval for 108% more dmg, and werebear can actually obtain rage

while self-attack is 120% more dmg

[high stratus]

is upheaval mana cost even an issue?

[raven sluice]

ah, werebear still pays the mana cost, no idea if it's an issue

I would want some extra faultlines at least

[high stratus]

shockwave seems to do a decent enough job to me

[raven sluice]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

I guess upheaval can essentially cost no mana

no brutality then, but I personally dont like brutality anyway, at least on primalist

at least upheaval slamdunks swipe now

well, with a 2h staff...

[mellow kestrel]

Hello

[high stratus]

Even with just the base 8 mana/s you'll spend it slowly at 10 mana 1.1aps

[raven sluice]

I assumed no attack speed scaling would mean 1.375 APS (what's listed on LEtools). Maybe just account for weapon base speed? Or not even that?

[near leaf]

Imo it should not even could the weapon attack rate

[high stratus]

Oh my bad i thought it was 1.1

[raven sluice]

Wish there was a cold melee staff

Jaspers with big crit, flat cold, weaver set, would be kinda nice at least. You can reasonably get like 345 flat cold iirc

Berserk seems very wonky without attack speed scaling though

[raven sluice]

And berserk alone is 48% increased attack speed of more dmg you're giving up by using the 120% more dmg node. You probably deal more dmg without that node easily, you just need to also sustain mana

[crude breach]

I look like templar from poe

no pants