feedback-discussion

[crystal plume]

How are dolch and officer useless

Bornheim is the only underpowered option out of those

[unborn smelt]

I think what's mean is the new pistol is essentially a dolch at 90$

[crystal plume]

Officer needs something else going for it now with the new pistol sure but it was a top tier pick prior to them even adding that

[unborn smelt]

thing has 97 dmg, same as the Dolch, nearly the same range because for pistols compact and medium are very similar (and it has FMJ to be more deadly than a dolch)

It shoots very fast with currently low recoil altho not quite at dolch speed

It's compact ammo as opposed to special, so easy refilly - it has abnormally much ammo at 3 reloads for a semi auto

[crystal plume]

I was specifically referring to him saying they got nerfed to the ground

[unborn smelt]

it has a swing out cylinder for faster reloading and removing drum spins on partial reloady

All those things combined make it currently outclass pretty much all semi autos including the Dolch IMO

[native lodge]

Dolch is still the most powerful option imo, but its price point is making less and less sense

[unborn smelt]

Why tho ?

At this point i'm convinced people don't care about stats or facts - it's just crying because they don't like the Dolch

(which is understandable i hated it too)

But the new pistol quite literally gets dolch dmg and then FMJ to get even better range

[native lodge]

more ammo faster rof, it does the job I use a sidearm for better

[unborn smelt]

at 90$ for the gun and 35$ for FMJ

[unborn smelt]

I mean you get a faster Rof but and a bigger mag, but overall the ammo is way less and way harder to resupply

you also get significantly more sway and recoil

and thing costs 7 times the money for performance that's this similar

[native lodge]

hard not that much harder to resupply if comparing fmj

[unborn smelt]

18 spare vs 10 spare

and you can easily stack lots of compact fmj

you get what 50 spare if you pair it with FMJ winnie

[native lodge]

the price point is the biggest thing that the doesn't make a lot of sense

I mean if I'm using a dolch chances are I am using long ammo

so long ammo going to be my go to for most things

[unborn smelt]

you can still run new army fmj + long ammo

and get 18 ammo spare

[native lodge]

but upclose and personal the dolch is out competing it still

and still has more ammo than I need to kill people

[unborn smelt]

so the 750$ dolch needs to push into essentially shotgun range to outperform the cheapest doubleaction

Sry but that's a pretty darn bad excuse IMO

[native lodge]

so it does what I except a sidearm to do slightly better, but not at the cost that make sense

I mean the dolch is better in what I consider pistol range

[unborn smelt]

Like we're in areas where we nitpick about a 750$ gun being slightly better than the 125$ at most gun

[unborn smelt]

no it's not...

It's better up to what 30m if were generous ?

[native lodge]

I mean if I can put two bullets into someone faster than they I consider that better

by how much, not lot, but its an edge

30m is about pistol range yeah

beyond that I use primary

and may swap to finish them off

in which case the damage difference isn't that impactful

[unborn smelt]

Yes but then a Bornheim is way better isn't it

[native lodge]

no because it doesn't have that damage

[unborn smelt]

Dmg is enough for a followup, Rof is even higher and it doesn't have the bad recoil or special ammo

[native lodge]

follow up isn't the only thing a dolch does though

is double taps at pistol range faster than any other pistol

while still being a decent follow up

[unborn smelt]

I mean sure - but then again many fights don't allow you to use all RoF either because cover is a thing

[tribal wyvern]

@spiral dust
Which new dlc? The latest one is on steam

[spiral dust]

Bundle for women day

[unborn smelt]

And the New Pistol with FMJ has enough RoF in both an open confrontation and FMJ allows it to spam through cover as well as maintain a very good range for potential range use

[tribal wyvern]

Oh so not a new dlc, but a new bundle

[native lodge]

cover but the dolch can still pen decently enough for me to consider the rof worth the trade off

fmj is really good too, but spamming it through cover unless you have build built around ammo pooling for it

I wouldn't recommend

and if you have an all fmj build you are deadly but not as deadly as long ammo and dolch imo

but again its more of the price point

I do think the dolch is better, but not 7ishX better

which if you pool money anyway who cares, but not everyone does

[fluid locust]

I'd rather have the dolch slightly undertuned than OP like it has been for like 90% of it's lifespan

[native lodge]

oh yeah dolch doesn't need a buff, all I am saying is although I consider it one of the best pistols. the price point of the New army is Way better for the job its doing

and I expect to see it often if it remains as it is

but if money is no concern I am picking the dolch

[frosty garnet]

@tacit falcon, your post below has been deleted, as it doesn't follow the required format.
You can find all guidelines pinned in the ideas channel.

Please feel free to re-post your idea using the correct format:
Matched regex in message in #game-ideas (#suggestions-ideas, 524577494863708180):

hey idk if this has already been brought up before but id love an honor system. at the end of a match id love to be able to honor a team member, or even an enemy, if they did well or if the fight was fun. maybe could tie in rewards with this but there are some super cool people ive met in the hunt community and they deserve to be recognized by other people if theyre consistently fun to play with.```

[covert bloom]

I like the idea. Simple enough to add a +rep system. Maybe a few cool skin rewards. Would be neat, and seems pretty harmless. Would encourage some nicer VOIP behavior and reward people who don't play like buttholes 🙂

[karmic ivy]

Like a mark that can be given and tracked? could be anything but basicly a giftable GG?

its an interesting thought. I think there are aspects of the way it is that I like. and by that I mean like the aspect where there is no communication after death at all. In many ways, that is healthy for hunt. I think you idea is interesting, but challenging. Good luck and good hunting.

[potent quartz]

@narrow narwhal I dunno about the hat but regarding the glasses. Since hunt doesn’t have any blinking animations for them I’d rather have glass to hide that fact. Otherwise I’m always staring into cold dead eyes

[narrow narwhal]

That IS a good point indeed mate LOL .....but still i always have a good laugh when staring into Cain beautiful eyes.....and feels like every new character now, comes with a pair of glasses....

[rough wyvern]

nahhhhh CRYTEK!!! why u made my man "black coat" a freakin EMO!!! Black finger nails..... are u serious!!!! common DENIS!!

[mint coral]

yeah I second that, what happened

[vague patio]

the black finger nails are cool tho

addssome character

[mint coral]

wait what

[rough wyvern]

nahahhhh you not sane man!!!

hes an ice cold killer..... common not a emo playinn cain in a bush

[mint coral]

who are we to assume black coat's taste in music

[rough wyvern]

nahh man we are in 1897 or somethin..... black fingernail on man!! common.... give him pink nailss.... suits him mb more -.-

[vague patio]

as if astone coldkiller cares what the society thinks

[frosty garnet]

@sullen igloo, your post below has been deleted, as it doesn't follow the required format.
You can find all guidelines pinned in the ideas channel.

Please feel free to re-post your idea using the correct format:
Matched regex in message in #game-ideas (#suggestions-ideas, 524577494863708180):

restige cap for leaderboard, maybe reduces kda hunters```

[calm hawk]

XD you made my day

[ruby magnet]

@queen jungle I feel for the terminus but slapping a bayonet on it seems silly and the talon attachments is arguably the worst melee attachment bar the striker attachment.
Longer barrel... I don't even know what this is supposed to look like.
I feel all the gun needs is minor tune ups. Even with the traits it feels like a slow clunky mess. A blast to lever, but ads cycling, reloading, even single shot levering feels just.. slow and cumbersome.

[soft tendon]

@queen jungle the Slate doesn't have a better accuracy then the Terminus

They should have bove the same spread

[odd oasis]

What about a mace on the Terminus? Bayonet is kinda weird on such a small length(striker would fit more). I know mace is seldom used on the Mosin as it is but adding it to another weapon that acts in close quarters might be cool. Maybe buff mace if people feel its bad

[queen jungle]

Whatever the case, I propose a slightly tighter spread, pennyshot and the rest can have the original buckshot spread.

[ripe basalt]

Reminder that #feedback is for actual feedback and still has to follow our #discord-rules. I just deleted a large collection of random pictures, bug reports, ect.

[prisma elbow]

@untold prism They did say they'd be reducing trade window AND region lock/ping limiting would be coming

[half stag]

@prisma elbow they did say in the Q&A section that they are reviewing all skins for potential issues

[prisma elbow]

Thanks, I wasn't 100% sure. I didn't watch the dev stream and was relying on the reddit stream screencaps

[frosty garnet]

@quick sleet, your post below has been deleted, as it doesn't follow the required format.
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Please feel free to re-post your idea using the correct format:
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Found the whiner```

[ripe basalt]

And this conversation is going to end because it can't be civil.

Tarps indeed

[quick sleet]

❤️ Izo

[ripe basalt]

All for conversations and discussions regarding different opinions

But please keep it civil

[quick sleet]

[pliant wren]

Cause the game is called Hunt, not run around with Shift and W held down until you see bright flashing color you could recognize from the moon, i.e. 1/2 of the legendary skins. The Witch Hunter is literally a strobe light when she's running at you (white sleeves on a jet black vest.) There is no skill in seeing her, and that was the issue with Cain. Seeing the good skins requires you to actually look, not just react to moving colors you could only miss if you were born without eyes.

You don't need to nerf to get balance. You can buff all the terrible skins instead.

Imagine using Carter and not standing out like a beacon against everything but a wheat field. His clothing is so bad, turning on lanterns in a building actually makes him blend in better. Turn down those insanely bright leathers until they actually look like leather. Throw a black shawl over Llarona's shoulders, back, and arms. Take that box off the researchers back and give him a backpack that doesn't look like a briefcase. And just throw away Dead Blessings hat. It's that simple.

[grizzled sedge]

Just dont use the bright skins then?

[pliant wren]

Exactly, nobody does. Nobody even buys them unless they're steeply discounted. Dead Blessing is so bad they have to bundle her with another character and weapons.

The only bright skins that people use are the ones purposely made to be bright and noticable. Phantom, Red Shirt, and the Redneck, they're used as a challenge. But the ones I mentioned earlier, some of them I've never run into in game, alive or a corpse.

[late wind]

I haven't seen one person running the new Witch Hunter skin. And I suspect people won't be running the nun eituer. Why? They're not jet black hooded, veiled, masked hunters who blend in.

(Most) People are only buying skins because they want an edge. Not becaue they think that skin looks cool. So making the other hard to see skins more visible will shift that trend away from people trying to buy their way to victory.

[grizzled sedge]

Lol skins for an edge, boring

[pliant wren]

You're right about the Witch Hunter. She's one of the most contrasting skins they've ever made. And that makes her a disadvantage compared to a Tier 3 hunter.

Why would people pay for the privilege of making sure people can see them better in a game like hunt? Unless you're going for a challenge, all you're doing is making it harder on yourself. And only a small subset of players is going to want that.

[late wind]

Exactly my point. So stop making the paid skins a direct advantage. Engage with the market if you want. Not because you have to to remain competitive. There's plenty of tier IIIs for the sweats.

[pliant wren]

Tier 3s don't make them money though, and nerfing the DLC makes them into nothing but a disadvantage. You have a good chance to get a worthless trait on them, and you have to pay for their full loadout separately. Nobody is going to pay for that.

DLC is the lifeblood of this game. When it stops being profitable, Crytek will kill it. And if DLC isn't something worth paying for, nobody is going to buy it.

[fluid locust]

Pay to lose is better than pay 2 advantage

[pliant wren]

Pay to not play Hunt cause they shut down the servers, you mean?

[fluid locust]

Hunt has like 30 dlcs and most aren't pocket change. Plus the more recent changes making bloodbonds harder to get I highly doubt they're hurting on money lol

[pliant wren]

Lol, are you suggesting there's a corporation out there that would actually say. "Oh we're not making money on that anymore? Ahh well, we made enough."

[fluid locust]

They're not going to go bankrupt because Cain got nerfed. There's people that literally only buy skins to support the game. And plenty more who buy because personal tastes. Most skins are relatively dark anyway.

[pliant wren]

It wouldn't take bankruptcy, all it will take is them comparing the overhead of development costs, server and game maintenance, ect. Then comparing it to their profits. If that profit margin isn't substantial enough for a long enough time, this game gets shut down.

[late wind]

I bought skins because I liked the vibe. But the fact is most people buy them for a direct, tangible advantage.

I'd like that to not be the case. If Hunt was free I wouldn't care about pay to win. But for a paid game, I expect for the game to be balanced around a paying customer who bought the game as is.

[pliant wren]

Except when you compare the good skins to a tier 3, it's not really an advantage. Most Tier 3s are basically the same color scheme that Cain will be after the changes drop. He is competitive with them, not better than them. And that's how all the DLC could be. (apart from the challenge skins, of course.)

The devs have a choice here, nerf the few good dlc skins that are worth their normal price until they're only worth getting in a bundle or highly discounted like all the rest. Or buff the mediocre and bad skins until they're competitive with Tier 3s, making them and the already good skins worth more. Only one of these options makes more people buy DLC and extends the life of the game.

[smoky mica]

@queen jungle i def think a 400rof bornheim match avtomat would make using anything on the bornheim tree worth it. it's basically completely obsolete outside of finishing a long ranged sparks shot with hvs, and even then switch speed got gibbed when qs got removed so that'd trash too lol.

@fleet atlas frags do have their own fuse sound, it's shared with sticky bombs and chaos bombs, though. go into training mode and throw some frags and compare the noise to a dynamite stick. it's higher pitched.

[queen jungle]

@late wind ammo resupply rules have nothing to do with ammo type or anything

it's to do with the amount of reserve ammo

taking an uppercut with a lebel will boost your resupply too

[late wind]

Yeah well the point is they ought to. The Berthier and Lebel use the same cartridge. So they ought to adhere to the same ammo resupply rules.

Because as it stands the Berthier is so stupid good you'd be a fool not to run it.

[queen jungle]

they do adhere to the same ammo resupply rules

it’s purely based off the amount of reserve ammo the weapon has

also your comment on DPS is meaningless for a game like hunt

[late wind]

Yeah so change it.

[queen jungle]

a winfield can down a hunter faster than a berthier within range

[late wind]

Lmao so then falling is meaningless too, huh?

[queen jungle]

considering most fights are engaged at full health

if you’re killing someone with one hit DPS doesn’t matter

what matters is hits to kill

berthier is far from overpowered

mosin is still better

[queen jungle]

the devs are not going to completely change how ammo resupply works over a weapon that is far from too strong

[surreal orbit]

if anything the berthier needs a price drop with some tweaks to the ammo pool lmao

for being a "cheaper lightweight lebel" and having only 3 bullets compared to the lebels 10 or however many it holds and being only like, what, 30-40 hunt bucks cheaper? makes no sense

should be made cheaper with like -3 to the ammo count or something not price increased lol

[queen jungle]

lebel has a far slower reload though even for a single bullet

[surreal orbit]

doesnt really matter when you have to reload 3x less often

[queen jungle]

depends

lebel ammo economy is also worse

[surreal orbit]

a lebel has enough ammo to fully put down a team even if you aren't hitting all your shots

[surreal orbit]

yea for sure

lebel has shit ammo economy

but in everything except terms of reload speed the berthier is a straight downgrade from the lebel

every time i look at the berthier and consider buying it, i look at the price tag
realize it's 40 bucks cheaper than the lebel
then just buy the lebel for the extra rounds

because im fine with paying 40 hunt dollars for an extra 7 rounds in the magazine

considering thats enough to kill an entire team even if you're hitting only body shots + room to miss

berthier does have faster reload time, but you're reloading 3x as often, and reloading = several seconds where you can't shoot at enemies who are shooting at you

and thats rlly all it has to offer

you cant even drive the price that its cheaper because its by such a negligible amount , its literally like 1.5 medkits cheaper 💀

[queen jungle]

it has a better firerate

and better irons imo

[surreal orbit]

a better firerate for 3 shots, sure

[queen jungle]

all you need to put down a team xd

[surreal orbit]

you and me both know that nobody is gonna casually kill a trio in 3 shots unless they're either god tier or the other team is running in a straight line down a road

in a 1v3 i'd take the lebel over the berthier any single day solely because the lebel allows me room to miss a shot or two and still have enough ammo to 2 tap the entire team

[late wind]

You literally only disagree with stuff because I said it. I've literally seen you upvote the same suggestions when someone else says them. So yeah. I blocked a troll. Be mad.

[surreal orbit]

but in all honesty i dont use either lebel or berthier
im a chad vetterli user

[late wind]

The vetterli is awesome. I want a full length version bad.

[surreal orbit]

its current version is fine
at that point it'd have to be a medium ammo equivalent of the mosin to really be worth it

the vetterli is probably one of the best balanced guns imo

pretty good irons, pretty good range, pretty good damage, pretty good reload, pretty good firerate
overall pretty good versatility

really one of my favorite guns if not my #1 favorite

its good at pretty much all ranges including close, bc im 90% sure it has a faster ROF than the scottfield

[queen jungle]

vetterli has crap irons imo

[surreal orbit]

i like them, or maybe im just used to them

they can be a little obscuring at times and they arent the greatest at longer range fights for that reason, but i wouldn't call em crap

[late wind]

The vetterli has some of the best irons in the game what???

[queen jungle]

no it doesn’t? those little bars suck

[pliant wren]

I love those iron sights, at medium range I use the outer notches on moving targets and it works quite well.

[late wind]

Yeah but you can actually see targets through them beyond 100m. Unlike other rifles.

[queen jungle]

name one

[late wind]

The Lebel. (Whose sights the devs internationally fucked up) The Trapdoor Springfield. The Fat Winnie. And likely others I'm currently forgetting.

[queen jungle]

Winnie sights are good

Springfield has notoriously bad sights

and lebel sights aren’t good either

[late wind]

Yeah so compared to those rifles the vetterli's irons are amazing. And you can track/lead moving targets at longer ranges.

Plus. I recently had the opportunity to hold a real Swiss vetterli. And like. Damn. The devs nailed the sights on that rifle in game. They're amazingly accurate to real life. So Idk why crytek selectively gets weapons right or wrong compared to their real world counterparts.

[queen jungle]

you picked like the only 2 other rifles worse when winnie, mosin, berthier, ect are all better

[late wind]

The nitro is worse. And so are most silent rifles (which is good imo).

[queen jungle]

vetterli silenced is better than base vetterli lol

as far as irons go

[late wind]

Not even going to disagree.

[late wind]

It's the same irons. Just raised slightly to clear the can.

[queen jungle]

which gets rid of the annoying wings

[pliant wren]

I would say the Nagant Carbine's irons could use some work.

[queen jungle]

I like them, probably because I’m used to the rust revolvers irons

[pliant wren]

They feel cumbersome to me.

And when the deadeye's just there

[queen jungle]

I think that’s more to do with the carbine having more recoil than the regular officer

[pliant wren]

Might be.

[queen jungle]

which makes no sense!

[late wind]

They're still there though...

Also they need to seriously tone down the nagant's recoil in all its forms. It's insane right now for how wimpy it is.

[pliant wren]

Yeah, definitely for the starter Nagant.

It should have some advantage over the Officer or you only pick it up when you're wanting to go silent on your secondary.

[late wind]

Ads accuracy shouldn't be laser beam in Hunt. That way guns with awful triggers like the officer wouldn't be pinpoint accurate compared to simple single action weapons like the pax or base nagant.

Seriously. You aim down sights and pull that 20lb trigger and be pinpoint accurate. Not happening lol.

[ruby magnet]

Unfortunately the moment you shift the accuracy bit to even more degree of realism you get people complain even MORE about RNG even though on a frame by frame their shots lined up well..
Not even to mention the rampant complaints about people calling hitreg doesn't work.
The moment people catch on there's guns with godawful triggers those guns will either never get picked or need to have an fire rate to offset the missed shots and well get even more complaints about spamdown

This is one of the cases where even more realism will actively hurt the game since a stiff trigger and your weapon twitching is something completely out of your control. Much like the sway patern when using a Winfield vandal deadeye... damn that thing almost gives me motion sickness

[late wind]

That is a double edged sword and I fully acknowledge that. I'm just trying to think of ways to balance thesr guns everyone whines about without simply raising or lowering damage numbers.

[late wind]

You can't go and say though that realism alone would hurt the game. Imo the devs' interpretations of these guns have made the game unbalanced enough as is. May as well go the extra mile for authenticity.

[queen jungle]

officer is hardly unbalanced

[ruby magnet]

@weak lichen while I agree with the sentiment that there should be settings for the visually challenged people to enjoy their hobbies and games, IRL or behind the desk/ console. Coming from a practitioner of ophthalmology.

But giving equal settings to tweak for both the visually impaired and the clear sighted people will not bridge the gap between those two. It will only optimise the visuals for the clear sighted people to gain an advantage... while the impaired might get a boost to a sense of normalcy. The gap remains.

Trying to police put how visually impaired someone has to be for them to use the filters calls for immense workloads that people wanting that edge will try to circumvent the rules set in place. It's one of the reasons the paralympics is such a hassle to organise... how impaired do you need to be to qualify for a certain bracketed match.

They simply settled on just not allowing it at all to have the lazy people not get outclassed just because some filters weren't on that were meant for people with visual impairment while they themselves weren't visually impaired... just lazy.

[ruby magnet]

Well the guns are afaik modeled as close as possible to their real life counterparts. A game still needs to be a game though. Yes there are gun enthousiast that watch Garandthumb talking about triggers on various firearms and how that will affect accuracy downrange, but were all playing hunt showdown, the videogame.

To ask. What unbalance is there that comes from the realism they tried to implement so far? Is it the vetterli winged sight debate? Or Is there a different one as well?

[late wind]

Imo the sparks is too powerful due to it being nearly 200 m/s faster than it's irl counterpart. The lebel has nearly unusably bad sights at ranges over 100m. The nagant recoils too fiercely compared to other, more powerful handguns. Shotguns just kinda suck period. Black powder doesn't smoke, giving it an undue advantage. The mosin is too good due to artificially improved sights and bent bolt handle.

I could go on and on, but these are the most glaring examples I could think of off the top of my head.

If I don't respond I've likely passed out.

[ruby magnet]

Fair but these things are things that you could change without touching accuracy randomness. As for the lebel sights... are they faithfully modeled though? If so. Then they added realism that hurts someone wanting to play it over 100 meters. Which gives the gun a place in the roster. Good at range b to c, but not at a or d and onwards
And don't worry 😉 get some rest

I do admit that the black and smokeless powder thing is done in this way, but I suppose its to make all weapons feel powerful in their own setting.
Else you can simply say smokeless powder >>>>> black powder. Which is true.... but no one with money will play black powder weapons to win the game. Except for the masochists who pistol start every level in Doom Plutonia experiment on ultra violence.

[green lagoon]

Sparks velocity isn't too far off if we consider it being 45-120 instead of 45-70. A lot of Wikipedia listings are wrong or just don't provide enough info. The Bornheim says a velocity of 380m/s but the cartridge performance is 240m/s. The only source I could find for 380 Bornheim was some Russian site listing the caliber as 7.63mm which it has never been chambered in.

[unborn smelt]

In this case its the english wikipedia page for the Bergman 1896

Listing a velovity of 380m/s for the No 3 model

[green lagoon]

The wikipedia cites that Russian website with the 380m/s

@unborn smelt http://www.fire-arms.ru/germaniya-pistolet-bergman-1896-3-foto-opisanie-harakteristiki-istoriya.html The website in question. Bergmann No 3 (Bornheim) was never chambered in 7.63mm (which is Dolch cartridge) unless in this case some guy had his rechambered or had one custom made.

[fleet atlas]

@feral crag Old West Home alone might be the best way I’ve heard quickplay described as, props

[unborn smelt]

The thing here is we don#t quite know where they take the velocity from as there's multiple sources listed - but no index shows which one was used for the velocity

And the source they cite here is something diffrent

[green lagoon]

The Bergmann No.3 was only chambered in 6.5mm Bergmann which has the following performance:

Modern reproductions get anywhere from 220-280 but I digress.

[feral crag]

Keep the change, ya filthy animal.

[unborn smelt]

I'm not saying your wrong, but quite literally the first thing people would check lists the 380 m/s valocity - even tho it is wrong

[green lagoon]

Yeah, maybe I'll try to find a better source and update the page.

[weak lichen]

@ruby magnet well, we are able to advance our visuals by using a software called reshade(atleast i'v heard its not bannable thing to use) but i meant is that easier way would be just to use nvidia filter which is not allowed. There is a clear conflict within the logic not allowing one but the other, which actually could be even better for providing visual advantages.

As you said the gap remains between visual impaired ppl and those who has a clear vision but just in competitive matter. I believe visual impraired ppl in gaming community unterstands that they have a visual disadvantages and in a way accepts that(atleast those i know). What i meant is the following: Enjoyment is the context here. Ppl with visual problems may enjoy the game more when noticing that they were able to better the picture for their eyesight. The game has many other aspects than the competitiveness and hunting/shooting, it is the way to get rid of a reality and have a human contacts and enjoying gaming overall. So the gap remains between those who are visual impaired and those who has a "normal" eyesight(even amongst the "normal" there is notable differences, that was one of my points) but still the enjoyment itensify.

About the clear sight and "normal" ppl, everyone has the option to use reshade to better their visuals thus there should be no problem with fairness. I merely meant that it would be better to use an offical software that you already have and not to be "forced" to download suspicious or additional softwares if you want to go after better looking visuals.

compression: Allowing ppl to use nvidia game filter means that ppl don't have to download reshade or any other Allowed softwares. And intesifying the enjoyment (overall) for visual impaired ppl and even for others. except those who are too lazy to figure out how nvidia or reshade works.

[ruby magnet]

The tricky part is that these filters wont be used for the visual enjoyment, but to crank out an edge over others who are not using it. Where it's altruistic to be used for people who are visually challenged, it will be used as a way to get an edge over others when comparing people with normal eye sight that's a 3rd party program.

[weak lichen]

yeah but even tho we both have that option to do so

[ruby magnet]

only for those who aren't lazy

so you're penalizing the lazy who just play the game in a more casual way.

[weak lichen]

Well i guess you can think it in that way but nvidia game filter is pretty easy to use and optimise it for your eyes.

and you can do it already

ppl has the edge already

at the moment there is filthy casual player fighting against guy with a reshade on: D

but still the casual player if he wants, can download it too and make it even

[ruby magnet]

I'm honestly really against the use of these reshaders being used to make the game's image clearer... especially on a competitive level.

the fact one system works, but the other doesnt doesn't make the use of it right

[weak lichen]

yeah all of them should be banned or allowed

[ruby magnet]

agreed.

[vague patio]

i know its a bit shitty to say it, but damn i wish suggestion of new wepons balance shouldnt be allowed until a week after the implementation

[queen jungle]

true

look at the people who jumped the gun on the spitfire and said it was op

but it’s merely decent

[spice topaz]

Here I was thinking the test server was for testing new things and giving feedback on them

[frosty garnet]

@queen jungle, your post below has been deleted, as it doesn't follow the required format.
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Add Lewis Mark I Weapons and Shelby DLC 👌🏻```

[vague patio]

point is, the officer doesnt need a buff when the new army is on test server

same iwth the specter

ortalking about what variant should come

like first the feedback should be given to the new weapons specifically

and more thoroughly instead of saying after three hours if being available to stampit in as op or too weak

especailly saying its op is just...

what does it even mean

[unborn smelt]

I mean this is important tho. how a gun is perceived is important and ideas for balance can be helpful - so i'd disagree strongly with not allowing people to present just that.
However i agree that Crytek shouldn't act too early in the majority of cases.
With the new guns on thest i thing changing stuff early isn#t as bad because they are announced to not come with the patch and stay on test for a while

Hey if it still is as cracked as when it was added they can still adjust it

But giving it enough time on live helps getting better data without the influence of the hype of it being new or even worse in some cases getting actual data from regular gameplay and not events tailored around using this specific weapon...

[wispy snow]

In theory I agree with giving things some time, but given the really quite slow pace of Hunt's balance changes, if something's a problem, it's only going to get changed if people kick up a fuss early and often.

Like there's acting too early, and there's acting too late. We saw how bad acting too late can get with the explosive ammo problems on console last year, or how long it's taken them to reign in other things on occasion.

[unborn smelt]

The issue is people kick up a fuss no matter is smth is OP or not

they always do - so you really need some time to let the initial fuss that's always there die down

[vague patio]

point was,suggestion about weapon on live shouldnt be effected by weapons on test

imo both weapon have been too good, but it doesnt make sense to then bufff every other weapon

[unborn smelt]

And i do disagree

[wispy snow]

Absolutely, but people being defensive given how long balance issues get left as is in Hunt is a fair reaction. Not to mention the reaction in this case, with the slate and slugs and a new semi auto gun, are something that has been going on longer than just these new guns.

[unborn smelt]

they should only consider changing the weapon on live once the new gun has been on live for a while tho

[vague patio]

it doesntmake sense to say live weapons need a buff when the test weapon is too strong

they arent implemented and it is not clear if they stay like that

[wispy snow]

Buffing other weapons is an option to be considered, just like nerfing the current new ones. both should be on the table.

[unborn smelt]

Well yes - but we still need to base suggestions on the current state of th gun

and one way to do so is buffing an existing gun, to make a room for the new one. However the actual changes must not happen before the new guns wen't live, IMO preferably for at least 1 patch, or if it's extremely obvious

[wispy snow]

I'd say the test server is plenty of reason to make such changes go live at the same time.

[unborn smelt]

So i agree that it'd be a mistake to preemtively buff the officer before the New Army ever goes live

[wispy snow]

That's what it's for, testing. Waiting to get the same data on live that you'd get on test is just a waste of time.

[unborn smelt]

(I think buffing the officer at all is a mistake too, so there's that)

[wispy snow]

With you on that one tbh. I think terminus and specter adjustments against the slate are more fair.

[vague patio]

ywa, i can not make myself understandable so id rather stopthis convo

[unborn smelt]

But for example saying to give the new army the 90$ price slot it could use some nerfs and the officer could be buffed to be worth say 200$so both guns find a place in the meta would also be a way to go about it

[vague patio]

new army is just... weird. I can see how they might have balanced it. Less ammo in chamber, but faster reload. More damage, but way lessmuzzle velocity. But with the special ammo it gets unreasonably strong.

and generally i dontlike to have new double actions that just stright up outclass the single actions

[wispy snow]

It needs to cost more, be a later unlock, and have more recoil than the officer if they don't change current stats too much.

[vague patio]

the joke is its said troo be slower in the notes, but it just as fast effectively

[wispy snow]

That's cause of the lower recoil.

[vague patio]

like at maximum it should be something like 80 rpm

[wispy snow]

In general I wish everything in hunt just shot a little bit slower.

[steady vapor]

it's gonna (already is) get hated on but saw a streamer talk about a money cap in hunt and think it's an interesting idea

[wispy snow]

It's been mentioned a lot over the years, and the main problem seems to be what the cap actually is. IMO unless the money cap was really low and really strict, it's not really going to matter for most people. But make it really low and strict, and people will complain about not being able to run the stuff they want.

Add to that the problem with just buying up weapons and stockpiling them to get around the money cap.

[steady vapor]

Its a pretty nuanced discussion with a lot of implications, not sure if it could be implemented this far into lifespan without revolt, but maybe if they ever dis a sequel lol

Infinite scaling makes the economy a non factor tho

[wispy snow]

It's not necessarily infinite scaling on its own, it's a whole load of factors, that's why I'm not sure a limit would actually really do anything unless it was very, very low.

[fluid locust]

like people saying the bow was op lmao

[steady vapor]

Yeah thought that was a little bit of an overreaction, not that changes were completely unwarranted

We could definitely use some tuning but I don’t feel like the game is in a dire state of balance

[fluid locust]

mostly everything is relatively balanced. the dolch and avto were probably the most busted things in the game and now they're in a good spot for the most part. precision dolch still a little strong but it does require QM and like $800 almost

[late wind]

Make the initial cap 4k. Because that's what you start with. And plenty of money to buy three or four busted loadouts.

Then raise the cap by 1k every prestige. So a prestige 100 player will have a $104k cap.

Boom. You've simultaneously made prestige worth it, and curtailed the problem on people sitting at rank 100 prestige 0 with 80k so they only ever run the most expensive loadouts.

Two birds
One stone

Check please.

[fluid locust]

literally nobody would like that lol

4k is like nothing

[late wind]

So prestiege.

[fluid locust]

prestiging is a waste of time

and effort

grind for the sake of grind

[late wind]

That's an odd way to say "I can't do well without my frags and uppercut."

[fluid locust]

nobody likes using like 50 vitality shots and antidote shots to unlock shit lol

[plush ledge]

Prestige right now is a waste of time, did this failure 50 times

You get nothing for it

[late wind]

Yeah. It does suck. But if prestieging raised your money cap then you have a very compelling reason to do so.

[fluid locust]

or they could just make prestige worth it without gimping the game for everyone else lol

[late wind]

Nobody would be gimped. You can do very well with 4k.

[vague patio]

its a terrible idea

there is already such a thing as gear fear

[late wind]

Oh yeah people are afraid of losing their OP loadouts that's why only every other person is running an uppercut, frags, a mosin ect. Lol what game are you playing?

[vague patio]

you are not a person worth a discussion

[late wind]

In Tarkov or other games where it's actually difficult/time consuming to get good kit sure. But hunt? Dude no. This game gives out money/weapons like candy.

[vague patio]

an idea like that is just out of touch, especialy regarding new players

[late wind]

Free hunters exist.
You can buy many many powerful weapons with 4k at prestige 0.
Pluse trainee mode is still a thing. So new players won't lose everything instantly.

I also love how you managed to twist an idea that prevents older players from sitting on 10 mosins, 10 uppercuts, and rolling 3-4 frags a game, into something that would hurt newer players who might not yet have access to any of that.

10/10 bro. Gold medal in Mental Gymnastics goes to you.

[nova granite]

I really envy people who are good with throwables. I need to practice that. I’m sure it’s not even that hard, but sometimes I just feel like as soon as I hear certain people cook a frag I’m fucked cuz he can hear me so good and I won’t be able to put enough distance before it lands in kill range

[dusty otter]

its easy, just esp like they do!

[maiden pelican]

If its a frag thats just because they have a frag, people who are good with throwables know how to kill with dynamite sticks

Frag throws are basically just hope the game doesn't consider there to be a LOS block between the bomb and the person otherwise you get a free kill

[unborn dagger]

Yep

Wish it was a different type of throwable.

[frosty garnet]

@viscid violet, your post below has been deleted, as it doesn't follow the required format.
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Matched regex in message in #game-ideas (#suggestions-ideas, 524577494863708180):

you guys  should add a long ammo lever gun like the winchester 1894, that would be cool. Or maybe a muzzle loader, but in trade for the reload time, it would one shot and have medium effective range. Maybe add guns that are more accurate for the time.```

[half edge]

I hardly get killed by throwables

[young egret]

Only time I get killed by throwables is when someone throws a bomb lance into my face

[tribal wyvern]

@solemn turtle
Don't worry bout not claiming it, you still receive the items.
But ye they should 100% be in menu to.

[maiden pelican]

Console or PC, also depends on MMR I would say

On PC myself and depends on how memey I play but I am usually low 5 star/1 match of 4 star because it's the most fun area

When I get to the point right before fighting 6 stars thats when frag spam is king

Literally every person pushes while cooking a frag

[steady vapor]

@sharp arrow or fire aarows 🤔

[sharp arrow]

Fusees for bow, fire arrows for crossbow maybe.

[steady vapor]

while were at it, let me swab the pitchfork with a flaming cloth lol

[sharp arrow]

Flaming arrows with dew claw would be really cool.

If you don't finish off a hunter with a melee jab, they are still vulnerable to sparks for a few seconds

[frosty garnet]

@ornate elm, your post below has been deleted, as it doesn't follow the required format.
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Matched regex in message in #game-ideas (#suggestions-ideas, 524577494863708180):

Tittle: healing bolt for hand crossbow

Description: custom ammo type for hand crossbow that allows you to heal your teammates. Restores 75hp like small vitality shot. Doesn’t deal any damage to enemy hunters or AI (or maybe 1 point of damage like flash and choke etc)```

[feral crag]

@keen bolt I have to say, I understand some peoples' frustration over 'campers', but the game is called 'Hunt'. It isn't a shooter in the traditional, run-around sense. It probably should have camping. A lot of times, that's what 'hunting' is. Get where you're coming from, though.

[young egret]

Camping is a part of the game and always will be. Making it infinite will not change anything about camping

If they wait till last 15 minutes, use that to your advantage. Set up the external to make exiting the area harder for them

They may be able to see you, but you also know they're inside

It's the disadvantage of not being first

[keen bolt]

@feral crag @young egret I was actually a beta player tbh where it used to be even worse as in you can even camp clues but as of right now from what I've noticed 4 star matches are actually better than 5 or 6 star ones

The main reason being you actually had gunfights and not camp the downed guy for 10 min from 100m

I am actually the one against red boss ping mechanic but right now it's even worse

And I'm still against boss ping mechanic -_-

I think that's also one reason people don't wanna be first at the boss anymore

[young egret]

4 star matches are the best, where people actually know how to play but don't take the game like it's life or death. I almost purposefully stay in 4 star so I can actually have gun fights and not have to sit outside a bounty area for 30 minutes. I won't say I haven't camped inside the bounty area for a long time, but it is annoying to have it happen every round. People are waiting for someone to make the first move and the unfortunate problem about having 1 hour time limit is that it's more about who's patient in that senerio. It's unfortunate but it is how people play and I do not think there is really a way to change that

[keen bolt]

Sigh

I agree with you on it

Tbh at this point my team being 6 star

And we hate it

Tbh I kinda hate spiderman pointing meme moment "you're the camper" while one guy waits in the lair with shotgun and that mosin sniper just won't stop camping the boss lair exit

Like Shotgun guy won't go out because he would be free kill

And vice Versa

I used to HATE shotgun player who plays like that till I decide I'll just try shotgun to see what they play like

And then noticed I can't fight anything more than 60m effectively

And was annoyed by getting pinned down constantly

Then it Turned into a Hunt: camp warfare

[frosty garnet]

@fast maple, your post below has been deleted, as it doesn't follow the required format.
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So...what about ammo boxes that explode like the barrels. Also sets off shrapnel bc the bullets where ignited. Special ammo boxes have double the boom. 🤔```

[pure jewel]

@neon basalt I think it would be cool if they also reverted some changes to certain mechanics in the gamemode as well, such as how you would only gain 50 health back from banishing, no more bounty revives, no more replenishable bounty darksight etc. Except the anti-camping ones.

[ruby magnet]

I agree with poison ammo needing more tuning to be used in pvp. Yes the devs stated that it's a pve round and at that it works but basically in the same way fire ammo works.
Buffing damage I'm not sure though... sparks has poison rounds and being left at 1 hp with INTENSE poison and not having an antidote shot is even more pressure than dumdum does (not on the sparks specific because that'd be a oneshot). @queen jungle

[burnt mulch]

isn’t 22LR a compact-level round?

I’m pretty sure people have been shot by 22LR rounds and not noticed.

[queen jungle]

@rough field While it would be nice seeing those features (especially DLSS and Raytracing) added to Hunt, I highly doubt that'll ever happen. Crytek games are always also showcases for CryEngine and Crysis Remastered having gotten these features i doubt Hunt will ever see them.
Especially with Crysis 4 being in development, which I believe will also come with the next major release of CryEngine and all the new graphics features.

[rough field]

I never talked about Raytracing, and i couldn't care less about it.
DLSS would be a workaround for the horrible Anti Alising issues this game has. And since DLSS has been implemented into Crysis Remastered, they have some devs in one of their studios which could help out getting it implemented too. Otherwise NVIDIA would be glad to help if they have another game to showcase their features.
Shouldn't be a big deal at all, the main question is if they bother getting the horrible AA fixed.

**Crysis 4 blog post states: **

so we want to make sure the next instalment in the franchise lives up to all of your expectations
Which screams "CryEngine Updates".
Hunt could even take advantage of that, even if that's still far away and most game devs never bother about updating their game to utilize the latest engine releases.

[queen jungle]

Right, you didn't mention ray tracing. Just something I'd love to see in Hunt
Still, Hunt is four years old and I doubt it'll see any major graphics updates in the future. But that's just my own opinion based on past Crytek releases.

[rough field]

Hunt is their first live service and competitive online game and still fights performance issues.
The mentioned features would help the game to grow in all aspects and possibly bring more players into the game due to NVIDIA feature advertisement. I wouldn't compare it to any of their single player releases. And the fact that one of their games recieved a DLSS update later down the road is promising.
In any case, it would be a smart move.

https://tenor.com/view/lord-of-the-rings-lotr-gandalf-white-pippin-gif-15253908

[queen jungle]

Crysis didn't receive a DLSS update, the trilogy was remastered and re-released, most likely because C1 takes place in 2020 and C2 takes place in 2023 and to kick-start the development of C4.
There still the original Crysis without any DLSS or RT.

[rough field]

The official Crytek Blog Post that i linked literally states that Crysis Remastered added DLSS support in a free new update. It wasn't initially released with DLSS. Eitherway it doesn't make any difference, it means one of their studios worked with it before and implemented it into a game that's running on CryEngine.

Nothing is impossible, it just needs devs, the will to do it and some time.
As stated before, Hunt is a live-service game. It should be in their interest to get it into a state in which competitive players don't have issues with visuals, as they are mandatory to see tiny heads lurking in the dark woods.

[pliant wren]

Has a PC that is technically below required specs Please, make any graphical upgrades optional, I'm tap dancing on a house of cards here as it is.

[queen jungle]

Ah I get what u mean, so maybe it should get just under full damage then

Like ~130 for long ammo poison, ~80 for compact ammo poison, and ~110 for med ammo poison

Just so it’s less oppressive without an antidote shot

And speaking of, antidote shots still need a rework

[ruby magnet]

changing damage is one way of approaching it, but I think the poisoned status effect itself has issues.

On one end the status effect is as powerful as to completely prevent healing from any source at all so it's oppressive when stacked sufficiently.
On the other hand an antidote shot immediately kills that advantage outright.

There's also the issue that light poisoning is just a minor inconvenience, but intense poisoning feels like an eternity

[austere stone]

Reason I like the idea of the dual vandals/handcannons

Is you literally need Quartermaster to just bring a pistol

[ruby magnet]

Dualwielding handcannons xD that sounds hilarious, worrisome with the rival handcannon and impractical with the specter compact.

Although.. the compact isn't a handcannon.. soo....

[latent willow]

someone else has the opinion that the added grass hills look a little bit weird and out of place ^^ like they could just turn them around and turn the root/earth side to the compound would already help ^^

[frosty garnet]

@topaz whale, your post below has been deleted, as it doesn't follow the required format.
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On the topic of preset loadouts; add an 'ignore legendary' tickbox, to allow contraband or other variants to be used when equipping  a loadout```

[wispy lion]

#game-ideas message why does so many people downvote night ideas??? i want to play night maps with flares and fusees but i cant. its a gamble always if i get one.

[plush ledge]

I guess because most people dodge night or use reshade to make it playable. Night map means most people who play them will crouch in a bush waiting for you to move first. After some time and deaths to a dark skin out of Bush which was pitch black you learn to hate night and start dodging it. In the meantime I'm playing night map but only because reshade allows me to finally also see the enemies at 130m without problems

With a little tweaking night looks almost like dusk now, still awful but playable

[unborn smelt]

To be brutally honest - the "it's a night match so everyone camps" is likely just not true.

Many people believe it because it's a convenient excuse as to why it was somehow not your fault you die...

[grizzled sedge]

My second favorite is, "you cant see anyone"

[unborn smelt]

If you look at what night realistically does, it means visibility is reduced, which means you being stationary with a shotgun is not affected as you can still clearly see within shotgun range, and camping with a rifle is way less useful because you don't see as far as on high vis maps

For shotgunners the cover of darkness also allows then to play more agressive because they are harder to spot when doing a rotation for example

Now a valid concern is that filters can make nightmaps pretty unfair to play, and some people have significantly worse vision on nightmaps because of for example background lighting (light streamer lights for a facecam for example)

[unkempt scroll]

Any update on fixing texture issues on console? What about the purchasing bug?

[stoic vapor]

@late wind the risk of necromancer is proper communication. You can waste your partners revive and some health if you arent 100% sure he is safe to be revived

[late wind]

That argument holds no water because so too does a regular revive require proper communication.

Necromancer eliminates the exposure aspect of a revive with no other drawback.

[stoic vapor]

yeah thats the point

its meant to help when youre pinned

its a risk

as it should be

[unborn smelt]

Takes longer and reduces hearing and vision in the meantime

not huge downsides but downsides none the less

[late wind]

Doesn't matter when you're in cover.

[stoic vapor]

thats the point

youre taking a massive risk and if they decide to push youre handicapped

[grizzled sedge]

so someone cant go over to your cover then

ofc

cause feet dont work when u necro

[unborn smelt]

Yes exactly...

you need to get into cover for a long time to get it off

[stoic vapor]

imagine getting pushed by a sparks in the middle of a revive

[unborn smelt]

you need to play around the downside

[stoic vapor]

youre just dead

[late wind]

You act like it takes a year to exit dark sight. It doesn't. It's instant.

[stoic vapor]

still have less health and cant tell whats going on during that period

[unborn smelt]

It's not about entering or exiting it

necro takes more than twice the time of a regular revive - so it's way easier to push somebody necroing and interrupt the revive

They are also less likely to hear you approaching or see you because of the visual and auditory effects of being in darksight

and you can't protect the one that's being revived either

Yes necro is a get out of jail free card in some scenarios, but that's literally it's purpose

[calm hawk]

you can say that about a lot of things ppl complain about

[unborn smelt]

well yes - because that's usually what people do

[calm hawk]

oh that reminds me

after a lot of thinking i think i agree with you

one shot tool slot melee is bad balance

[unborn smelt]

Meh it's been a long time since i last truely believed that.
While i still wouldn't hate it - i think you could also make melee work with toolslots being OHK

[vague patio]

80% of the time they are anyway

or atleast the knife

more effort to not hit the head

dont know how the hitboxes are

[calm hawk]

with that said , i strongly disagree with you calling bf1 melee system better than hunts

[unborn smelt]

Did i call the entire melee system better, or only one aspect

because i strongly assume the latter

and not BF1's either because i didn't like BF1 all that much

Because IIRC what i meant was i like the fact that in BF you can't just sprint at somebody and OHK them with a knife attack

But you instead need to sneak up on them to come from the right angle (or seriously outmaneuver them)

[stoic vapor]

the way attachments work in bf1 is similar to hunt funnily enough

[calm hawk]

bf1 had some great things

it seemed like they wanted to make a uber balanced game

and later sprinkled in cheeze

[frosty garnet]

@still citrus, your post below has been deleted, as it doesn't follow the required format.
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Matched regex in message in #game-ideas (#suggestions-ideas, 524577494863708180):

the problem with cain is the color, same pallet as dirt, other hunters are all either darker or brighter, only cane is exact same as mud, stand still and you look like a three stump!```

[coarse geyser]

@spiral steeple for your in arsenal suggestion. you should already be able to type "owned" into the search bar and it will only show guns you have in inventory.

[queen jungle]

has anyone else noticed that the reconnect feature is super slow? just had a match where i crashed and it took me 4+ minutes to reconnect.

[unborn dagger]

You are in place reviving someone from a distance, you lose health in the process, and lose hearing and sight. It does not need any other nerf.

Like seriously you are an open target where you can do nothing

[late wind]

Like 25 health that can't even kill you is some steep price to pay lol.

[stoic vapor]

like leaving yourself open, and vunerable to be OHK is not a steep enough price to pay lol.

[unborn dagger]

Yeah tell me that next time when you get shot by a sparks afterwards lol

[late wind]

You're not in the open. You're behind something bulletproof. How is that vulnerable?

[stoic vapor]

youre dense as fuck my guy. how many times do we have to tell you YOU CANNOT HEAR OR SEE ANYTHING IN DARK SIGHT YOU CAN EASILY GET PUSHED COVER OR NOT

[unborn dagger]

^

[stoic vapor]

how often do you use necromancer?

[unborn dagger]

I would know cause it happened to me a couple of times

[stoic vapor]

im assuming never

[late wind]

Do you not have ears? You can absolutely hear someone sprinting while in dark sight.

[stoic vapor]

with the noise from necromancer?

with how fucking muffled everything is in darksight?

[unborn dagger]

Keep in mind that you also can't just keep doing it. If your partner is out of chunks, you cannot do a necro with a bounty

[stoic vapor]

sure thing buddy.

[late wind]

I've heard people flanking while gathering clues/necromancing people. It's not hard. Maybe if you're on TV speakers it's challenging, but if you're playing with a headset (as crytek recommends during the game's launch) it's really not a difficult feat.

[stoic vapor]

ok sorry the average player doesnt play on maxed out fucking volume

good for you

[late wind]

I don't.

[stoic vapor]

sure.

ok.

[late wind]

Whatever helps you sleep at night, buddy.

[stoic vapor]

now youre using my lines.

smooth.

[late wind]

Lol you copyrighted it? Show me the paperwork.

[stoic vapor]

Lol youre obviously doing it cause your argument is invalid

[late wind]

How is it my problem that you can't hear people?

[stoic vapor]

thats the point

thats the entire fucking point

[late wind]

How does your lack of hearing invalidate my argument?

[stoic vapor]

necormancer is supposed to be done discreetly letting everyone and their third cousin know defeats the purpose

and since when did you have to run to rush?

[late wind]

I never said that it should be a fog horn.

[stoic vapor]

last I checked crouching and walking were a thing

[late wind]

Now you're making up points I didn't make.

[stoic vapor]

pushing doesnt mean youre running

necromancer leaves you with your pants down which is enough

[late wind]

If someone's that close to you, you shouldn't be going for the revive anyway...

[stoic vapor]

how the fuck would you know since theyre crouching

[late wind]

Oh I don't know... maybe your dead partner was evidence of enemy presence or something.

[stoic vapor]

damn really?

[late wind]

Well you seemed lost.

[stoic vapor]

its as if i meant you dont have exact callouts how the fuck would you know

its almost as if youre fucking stupid and cant even tell what im talking about

[late wind]

Lol you call me stupid but can't listen for other players.

Mr. Big brain over here.

[stoic vapor]

Lol youre just like the ubisoft dev team who thinks if something is even slightly good it should be nerfed

Mr. Big brain over here

you know I realized something

you can hear people running while using necro

but you forgot darksight makes a motherfucking noise

[late wind]

What? Doesn't even make sense. I guess anything and everything should just be net boons with absolutely no drawbacks huh? Why not unlimited ammo for everyone too?

[stoic vapor]

it has drawbacks youre just to dense to understand them

[late wind]

That darawback if sitting behind something bulletproof and getting a free revive. Yes. So many drawbacks.

[eager widget]

Guys, enough with the insults.
I can hear people running while in dark sight and using necro. Darksight makes noises. And also you are losing health while doing a decently long animation that, yes, you can cancel. But typically you're a one shot to Medium/long if you cut it even quarter way, usually.

[stoic vapor]

thank you

ive been looking for a way out of the stupidest argument ever

[late wind]

Cause you couldn't make one without insulting me.

[stoic vapor]

youre repeating your single argument

stfu

[late wind]

Cause you haven't refuted it. Just called me names. So I'll keep on keeping on.

[stoic vapor]

no I have

pushing.

pushing

pushing doesnt mean running

[eager widget]

I don't think necro needs nerfs. I think it's in an alright place. There's counters to the revives. You know where that person's body is. Put concertina or traps on him, or keep an eye on him and kill him as he stands cause he's at most got 100 health.
And please, just stop the insults. It doesn't get you guys anywhere.

[stoic vapor]

not to mention it makes a noise when you get revved

[eager widget]

Besides, if you know he's got necro, that gives you even more info on that body and what to expect.

[stoic vapor]

thank you for an evaluation that isnt skin deep

shallow as a fucking puddle of piss

[eager widget]

Stop.

[stoic vapor]

now I dont want to

The FitnessGram™ Pacer Test is a multistage aerobic capacity test that progressively gets more difficult as it continues. The 20 meter pacer test will begin in 30 seconds. Line up at the start. The running speed starts slowly, but gets faster each minute after you hear this signal. [beep] A single lap should be completed each time you hear this sound. [ding] Remember to run in a straight line, and run as long as possible. The second time you fail to complete a lap before the sound, your test is over. The test will begin on the word start. On your mark, get ready, start.

[late wind]

You don't know he's got necro until after his partner has gotten up. That's the point. Unless you're completely omnipotent, you couldn't possibly know. Most other aspects have direct counters/drawbacks, I'm wondering why necro ought to be exempt.

[stoic vapor]

darksight makes a noise.

why else would someone go into darksight in a gunfight

[late wind]

Only on entering/exiting.

[stoic vapor]

yeah

exaclty

as it should bne

[eager widget]

I've explained the drawbacks to necro. And it's not as safe as you think it is. It's got its own risks.
And if they are bounty carriers, they now got no dark sight boost.

[late wind]

Oh gee I don't know. Maybe they have the bounty.

[stoic vapor]

you would know cause of the lighting bolt

what is that argument

really

wait are you a solo?

[late wind]

Dude. What? Literally that's a reason to go into dark sight mid fight. Maybe you have the bounty and they're trying to track you back. Or they're trying to necro. You don't know until they've res'd their partner and you hear them get up.

You can't ask for refutations, then act smug when you get completely legitimate ones.

[stoic vapor]

if no one has the bounty and one is downed and you hear darksight

a lot of being good at any game is assumptions

[eager widget]

Then they wasted their seconds. Expect the unexpected. In this case, if they're holding their seconds for a bit, then you'd hear it.

[stoic vapor]

its not hard to ask yourself questions like who is downed, does anyone have bounty etc.

youre entire argument is best case scenario for necro

most of the time isnt best case

are

you

a

solo

[eager widget]

They're hurting themselves more in the process because now they have no DSB, and they have to hope you ignore the fact that they might have necro.

[late wind]

Are you really gonna sit here and simultaneously act like you can't hear in dark sight, but can hear someone going into/out of dark sight in a gunfight? Pick a side, because you can't have both.

Me being solo has literally zero bearing on this.

[stoic vapor]

no that tells me everything

[late wind]

Even though I play with my friends/brother. So no, I'm not.

[stoic vapor]

that tells me you cant except the fact that the game is balanced around groups

[late wind]

Even if I was a solo, the point would remain valid.

[stoic vapor]

that tells me you dont communicate with your team to watch the body or burn to put pressure and for safety

[late wind]

But I play in a group....

[stoic vapor]

okay sure. that doesnt imply you go solo a lot

[eager widget]

Who are you in a gunfight with? A trio? The only way I can see the argument having any semblance is if you were the only one up and fighting 2 people. One steps out, while the other keeps you distracted. In which case, you didn't deal with the one you were fighting quick enough, and the other probably was safe to rezz anyways.

Or another team pushes in, in which case, push away and let them fight it out. They're weak, let a team finish them off and don't get greedy.

[late wind]

Something tells me you absolutely need every possible advantage to do well, and even the slightest threat to that sends you into a fevered rage. Calm down man.

[stoic vapor]

the only reason im agitated is because I have little patience for idiocracy

[stoic vapor]

this is normal behaviour for anyone 3 star and above

[late wind]

I'm usually fighting with 2-3 other teams, simultaneously. There's a really major teaming problem on console.

[stoic vapor]

not hard to do

[eager widget]

Maybe on XBox. But I've seen 2 cases of teaming in my entire life.

[stoic vapor]

of course you need every advantage. the game is unforgiving THAT IS THE POINT

[late wind]

Me and my friends are between 4-6* and we run meme loadouts. So no. We're good.

[eager widget]

If they are all teaming against you, what's necro going to change?

[stoic vapor]

screenshot

do it

[eager widget]

9v3. report them, go into a different game.

[late wind]

It's the existence of a party system on consoles. Let's parties of 3+ talk together and queue snipe. I don't know if it exists on PC.

[late wind]

Yeah but that never gets anything done. We all report when we can.
But not once have we seen a ban.

[eager widget]

Again though, what's necro going to change? They're probably a safe rezz anyways since you're dealing with not one team, but 2 or 3.

[stoic vapor]

wait did you take down the suggestion cause it wasnt liked?

that didnt tell you the change was needed?

[eager widget]

He didn't.

[late wind]

It'll at least force exposure.

[stoic vapor]

where is it

[eager widget]

#game-ideas message

[stoic vapor]

still 25 dislikes

all you need to know on the matter

done.

im leaving cause i have better things to do with my time

[late wind]

Cope.

[eager widget]

I'm sorry, Stag. I can go on and on about my dislike of the suggestion and why I think it's incorrect that Necro has no have drawbacks. But I personally wanna go do other things as I've been at the computer all day. So, hope you have a good day!

Bruh, can't english.

[late wind]

You're cool, Rat. You're polite about it.

While I disagree, you brought actual points to make your case. I don't buy it. But you didn't resort to name calling.

[stoic vapor]

I resorted to very little name calling because you shrug off necromancer's drawbacks

cope.

bye,

[queen jungle]

Going into darksight to necro someone makes noise. If you kill someone and then hear their teammate go into darksight, you should be checking the body anyway. It's not that hard, people.

And even if you didn't hear that, you would hear them gasping and getting up which is basically a free opening to push on

And even then, you shouldn't be giving people an opening to necro in the first place. Play aggressive and necro won't be a problem.

[unborn dagger]

Facts

[vague patio]

necro came to be a thing cause people relentlessly camped the body

suddenly they dont and thats the problem?

[neon basalt]

Thanks for kind answer. I agree, the mix of different mechanics could increase the difficulty but also the rewards and the fun!!!

[pliant wren]

Yeah, necro is only a real issue if you're sniping, and even then, the smart move is to keep shooting the person being rezzed. You're draining one person's health cause they're necroing, and you're deleting chunks from the other person at the same time. Taking an enemy team's chunks as a solo is a huge advantage.

[oak quartz]

@frigid folio i love your idea, but even something smaller like making the damn perk for 1 trait point would do.

[pliant wren]

Edited to reign in the range on the harmonica pistol

[frigid folio]

Yeah, just something to make it worth taking xD Like it could be a really nice perk and either reducing the cost to 1 or keeping it at current cost but reducing the stamina consumption slightly would be really good

[tribal wyvern]

@young egret
Keep replies here, they will just delete it in feedback.
So my suggestion is to either
A. Remove headshot multiplier entirely.
or
B. Only allow dual pistol to headshot up to 20m.

[young egret]

That doesn't make sense though?

[tribal wyvern]

It does

[young egret]

The gun still fires the same range

No matter if you duel weild or not

[pliant wren]

Yeah, holding 2 doesn't somehow make them share the powder.

[tribal wyvern]

Yes but dual pistol as a feature has to be defined.
What type of weapon is it?
Short, medium or longrange.
You can't have dual pistol as a medium range pressure and also headshot up to 67m. Thats absurd

[tribal wyvern]

What?

[normal horizon]

duals are medium range

[pliant wren]

Bullets are propelled by powder.

[tribal wyvern]

Iam aware, but i still don't understand what your point is.

[young egret]

Yes you can? Most pistols are effective at the range

[tribal wyvern]

Yes single pistol.

[young egret]

Does it somehow change for a duel?

No

It still has the same effective range

[pliant wren]

Single pistol is the same pistol as the dual ones, you just have 2

[tribal wyvern]

Again, iam aware, but my point is to change it

[tribal wyvern]

Im done with your troll posts.

[pliant wren]

Stating obvious facts are troll posts?

[tribal wyvern]

Yes, because you're not adding anything to the discussion.
Its as if i say "dual pistol deals dmg."

I think everyone knows

[eager widget]

I don't agree with treating duals any different than regular pistols. Besides making them at most twice the speed of one.

[pliant wren]

The only way the same gun can have varying headshot distances is if you load it with ammo that has less powder, otherwise it makes no sense that it doesn't have the same range.

[young egret]

That would be stupid, no offense. To make a pistol function differently just because you have two. You can't aim which is the downside of having duel pistols so it makes them inaccurate, it doesn't make them uneffective at their base range though. It's like saying "Yeah, the winfield can only shoot this distance but once you put a deadeye scope on it it can shoot farther than originally even with no further changes to the weapon"

The ammo type changes the range, yes, but were jsut talking about the same pistol, but two

[tribal wyvern]

I think that comparison does not work at all, because in one you're adding an extra, in the other you're simply adding a scope.

But i see the point. However considering what you gain from using 2 pistols.
Besides a more rng in where they hit, it should not be that powerful as they are.

[young egret]

Making it so there is no headshot multiplier isn't the way to go about it though

[tribal wyvern]

I did say 2 options

Not just one

Either reducing the range or removing it.

[young egret]

Both effected the headshot multiplyer.

[tribal wyvern]

Yes, but the other one does not remove it

With a reduced or removed headshot multiplier you could go bk to making them more reliable again.
As they'd be a good rof pressure weapon. Instead of what it is now.

Rng that either F's you or your opponent without much change in input from the user

As it's entirely based on rng

[young egret]

So? The bullet still travels the same speed and distance! It is not realistic in the slightest. I can understand increasing the spread, but not the damage to the head because someone is 20 metres away. Maybe something farther, like 200, because most pistols are effective around 80 metres.

[pliant wren]

They've been nerfed already, if you got hit by someone, it's cause they were lucky, or you let them get too close. Trust me, I've tested the spread multiple times, the new spread hits outside the center more than inside.

[tribal wyvern]

What does realism have to do with anything? 90% of the game is unrealistic

The only thing realistic is probably the gun sounds & the look of the hunters

[young egret]

But at least it makes sense

[tribal wyvern]

Ye but your argument could might aswell be used to remove reduced headshot dmg overall.
Since why should a bullet kill at head on 80m but not 81?

It's not a realiable argument.

Same with uppercut explosive

Why cant it headshot?

It's for balance reason

Same as should be considered in this case

[pliant wren]

I'll give him the explosive ammo thing, it should pop heads like watermelons.

[tribal wyvern]

It was nerfed yes, but i wanna remove the rng from it.
By removing a headshot multiplier & making it more reliable overall.
So you can put the body dmg pressure, but not rng hit ppl at max headshot distance.

How is that fun for anyone?

Ofc cant remove rng entirely from a hipfire gun.
But reduce it

[native lodge]

if I can make a 80m headshot with one conversion pistol fmj, why does holding two suddenly make it not headshot

[tribal wyvern]

To me the dual pistol is not a defined weapon at all.
It can hit at any distance, even headshot at 97m ( i think uppercut is at)

[tribal wyvern]

Balance reasons.

Do not argue realism.

Explosive uppercut says hello

[native lodge]

balance that flys in the face of consistently

wasn't a fan of the way they nerfed the explosive uppercut

could have just removed it tbh

[tribal wyvern]

I think explosive is just a meme that i generally do not care about it.
But i do feel bad for the console players where it plagued them like hell

[pliant wren]

I think the biggest thing we should be asking is, why can't we just lower one of the two guns and aim with one of the pistols we're dual wielding? Like, that's probably the most unrealistic thing about dualies.

[young egret]

I agree

[tribal wyvern]

I've seen that, that is a good idea to.

[normal horizon]

so there would be no point in ever bringing a single sidearm when you have quartermaster

not sure that is such a good idea

[pliant wren]

IF you have quartermaster.

[tribal wyvern]

You mean like precision?

[normal horizon]

it would make quartermaster a must have for easy close/medium range and long range capability

[tribal wyvern]

Or a single pistol. Cuz why would u bring a single pistol with quatermaster?

[native lodge]

do you mean that duelies should be allowed to do that AND keep the rof and hip fire accuracy or it a one or the other kind of thing?

[tribal wyvern]

I guess higher rof, more sway & needing to ADS to make any accurate shots.

and u get more ammo

[native lodge]

firing two pistols semi accurately would slow your rof, but give you more ammo

[pliant wren]

Personally I already feel like it is. But even if we lower one pistol, there's nothing keeping the one we're aiming with from having worse than normal accuracy, like increase the sway because we're holding double ammo and another gun on us.

[tribal wyvern]

Depending on the range you're shooting.
Close ranger you wouldn't need to slow down much. But longer range probably.

[native lodge]

imo if duelies got ads they should lose rof and hipfire accuracy

[pliant wren]

I would be all for having 2 modes for dualies, one out or two out.

Essentially holster one.

[tribal wyvern]

Ye holster one & fire one, then switch to the other

[pliant wren]

If you get caught with only the one out, you're not benefitting from having 2, and if you got 2 in the hands, you're not worried about ADS.

[tribal wyvern]

Quatermaster would actually work with fanning

[pliant wren]

And yeah, that would make carrying one pistol a worse option, but are we pretending that just about any loadout doesn't benefit from the options quartermaster provides? I.E. if you have the chance to get it, would you ever choose not to?

There are hunters I've recruited simply because they have Quartermaster and that's 7 free upgrade points.

[tribal wyvern]

Ye if u have big shotgun, u can have obrez or vandal.
And if you have mosin, winfield, vetterli, you can bring a small shotgun

Or return the points ye & pick up fanning or deter/greyhound

[jovial lodge]

Quartermaster is 6 points

[tribal wyvern]

That is true, then deter & packmule!

Kolchak tricked me

[pliant wren]

My bad, either way, lots of free trait points.

And maybe switching from holding one pistol to holding two or vice versa takes about 3 or 4 seconds to keep people from panic switching when they get ambushed, it would be better than having to sit there and go "Do I want to lose all my accuracy on my secondary just for the ammo and fire rate?"

[tribal wyvern]

Well i don't think we can keep the type of dual wield we have now.
It's unsatisfying, rng heavy, frustrating to fight, unreliable.

You can spam 20 bullets hit once, or shot 5 & hit all.
Or shoot 2 and headshot 2 ppl after eachother, while aiming on the exact same area.

I understand the fantasy of dual wield is cool and all. And it's on the banner of the game.

But it's in a shit position.

Theres no way to outplay or outmove a dual wield pistol, because you can stand still & be fine or jump around & be fine or get headshotted after 1 shot on both.

[pliant wren]

Well, I mean, technically, rushing someone while juking and wiggling should be more effective against that than it is someone with reliable aim.

[tribal wyvern]

Well it isn't more reliable against dual

[normal horizon]

I personally never bring quartermaster because it does not benefit my playstyle

[tribal wyvern]

I've done alot of wiggling/jumping & being headshotted on his first shot

It's just rng

[tribal wyvern]

I mean, thats fair point.
Some ppl hate the small obrez/vandal cuz they sway more & like uppercut.

Or ppl play with just completly diff loadout

[normal horizon]

I don't have a reason to ever bring a vandal or obrez because I do not play shotgun

I have no reason for quartermaster with a rifle

[tribal wyvern]

or crossbow?

[normal horizon]

I play a pistol with my crossbow

[calm hawk]

you play?

[pliant wren]

I can understand that, but at the same time, if you pick it up as you're leveling cause it drops from a meathead, would you really remove it? And if you do, what trait would replace it?

[native lodge]

sometimes take duelies with my long ammo when I start seeing a lot of sweat in my lobbies'

[calm hawk]

so always

[normal horizon]

I dont remove traits I just wouldnt pick it up from the meathead

[native lodge]

not always but more often than I before

[calm hawk]

magic of sbmm

[tribal wyvern]

Personally i just hate rng in gunfights.
Fanning, levering & dual wield are my most disliked mechanics in the game.

It more than often F's you than it helps you. And i prefer to trust my own aim

[pliant wren]

I guess what I mean is, you're not picking it up, so you have some other trait in mind that you want in that slot more than Quartermaster, is it purely on a build by build basis, or is it a specific one?

[normal horizon]

I don't min max so I only usually take the traits I always bring when I have points for them most times I either forget or don't know what to bring

only loadout traits I ever bring would be bolt thrower

I am not competitive enough to want to have the most streamlines build

I just go in to shoot people

[pliant wren]

Okay, I can understand that.

[calm hawk]

nixa likes to have fun

[tribal wyvern]

@sharp arrow
Having no ads on a shotgun is pointless eitherway.
So even if you can or cannot, it won't affect the weapon.

[pliant wren]

I like taking the Bear Leg with HV as a secondary along with either a Martini Deadeye FMJ, or a Vetterli Deadeye Incendiary Primary. I basically put Quartermaster on every build that can take it.

[plush ledge]

Now I'm curious why you would run fmj on a martini but incendiary on a vetterli? Isn't medium ammo already bad enough, why would you make it even worse with incendiary?

[pliant wren]

It's reactionary. Fucking dogs. I hate them. They're the bane of my existence and it feels like they go all the way across the map to find me. And it's always when I'm either falling back from a duo that's trying to pincer me, or it's right after I get ignited some how and I have 2 chunks left.

[plush ledge]

Okay problems with ai but how do you get ignited?

[pliant wren]

My PC isn't really supposed to be running Hunt, i've got a 970 I think, and when I play, oil trails tear into the floor. So I shoot a meathead or an armored with incendiary who falls and suddenly the fire comes to meet me. Or an armored hits the lamp I'm standing next to, ect.

[plush ledge]

Tbh this sounds like you made those problems yourself with using incendiary. The armoreds wouldn't be on fire in the first place without incendiary. I admit I never thought about AI being some kind of problem at all

[pliant wren]

Yeah, the fire damage is more my fault, but the dogs aren't and when I've got incendiary, they don't kill me. Without it, it's a crapshoot. Some days I can take on a full group of 5 with the large knife, other days I miss every single one and am consumed with hatred.

[plush ledge]

Many new players struggle with ai but it gets better over time. After some hours you look at dogs and ai in general as a push over,annoying at best

[pliant wren]

Lol, that's just it, I'm not new, I'm nearly done with prestige 3, I have no excuse to die to those damn things, but I do. I'd rather face off with people over the dogs any day.

[plush ledge]

I consider anyone below 400h as new to the game and with almost p4 I guess you're like 80-90h in? Anyway it's normal that you make mistakes or have such problems and that's exactly the reason why I say 400h is the learning phase of most people

[spiral steeple]

good for a start xD thanks

[pliant wren]

320 hours actually, I've been spend a month or two just enjoying level 50 between prestige s, and I usually only have time for 1 or 2 matches a day, if I have the time to play at all.

(I also have a bad habit of leaving the game running while I go do other things.)

[plush ledge]

I guess I've also like 300h lobby and 150h afk time so far

[lilac storm]

@scarlet acorn I have to tell you simply because. Before scrapbeak was added to the game, we had a contract system. Basically, it would tell you what bosses, what map and hwat time of day. It gave you less bounty score tho afair so :/

[scarlet acorn]

@lilac storm oh interesting. Well honestly that would be awesome if they did that same thing but make them harder. Lol with more reward

[lilac storm]

I am holding out hope they do but I dont think they will unfortunately

[scarlet acorn]

Well I hope they do something
Either do something with the tab or get rid of it entirely. The damn thing is an eye sore and a waist.

[lilac storm]

Agree

[scarlet acorn]

Thanks for the info homie

[lilac storm]

You are the welcomes

[bronze quail]

Contract system was removed way before the scrapbeak

[lilac storm]

Either way, it was removed and its unfortunate it was

[frosty garnet]

@trim bough, your post below has been deleted, as it doesn't follow the required format.
You can find all guidelines pinned in the ideas channel.

Please feel free to re-post your idea using the correct format:
Matched regex in message in #game-ideas (#suggestions-ideas, 524577494863708180):

Please, PLEASE! Make sure that new shotty launches with Dragon's Breath.```

[vague patio]

@unborn smelt seen you arguement against the new army, comparing it to the strength of the dolch. Do you only think that on with fmj or also with normal compact ammo?

[unborn smelt]

I think that even normal it's pretty close to the Dolch, but FMJ blows it out of the water in comparison.
now Price completely aside i think the base Dolch is ofc still stronger than the base new army, but as of now the new army is 90$ and thus the cheapest semi auto, and the Dolch is 750$ and as such the most expensive sidearm by a huge margin

[unborn smelt]

To be very specific.
The Dolch deals 97 dmg post nerf with medium falloff thatshould be ~ 39 to 41m 2 tap to chest (110 dmg Dolch 2 tapped to 45m, as Pax does now).
The New Model army deals 97 dmg with compact falloff, which we know 2 taps to 34m (same as a LeMat), this range diffrence is pretty smol. that's a 5% HS range and 15% bodyshot range increase.
and that's just base before FMJ interferes!
Rof at 107 is fast enough for pretty much any scenario, altho the Dolchs 164 are noticably faster, but the dolch has also received multiple recoil and sway nerfs to make effectively using that Rof significantly harder. So overall while there is a good increase, past nerfs really minimize the actual gameplay diffrence in a game outside of just a sheet of paper.
From there reload speed, the Dolchs reload is very sluggish post nerf, it's still good at 6s with the stripper clip, but topping it off is painfully slow - imo comparable if not identical to many revolvers, and you can only use the stripper clip with at least 10 spare which is the entire reserve. The new army at 10 sec is fast for a revolver and also can effectively top up without the cylinder spin as well as it's ammo being very easily available when using compact or compact fmj, at it has over proportionally high reserves at 3 full reloads compared to the officers and spitfires 2 reloads, and the Dolchs 1 reload.

So to summarize, nearly identical dmg which can be increased with FMJ, less shots per mag and slower reload from empty, but in return way better ammo economy than any of the semi autos, not just the Dolch. Easy to handle and fast enough Rof for the vast majority of scenarios (you shouldn't try facetanking a Dolch or officer without cover tho, but as soon as cover and positioning are a factor you can very very easily play around having "only" 100 Rpm)

And seeing as people claim the Dolch is plenty strong at 750$, or even still OP (altho i see that rarely nowadays) there is no way a weapon this similar should cost under 300$ (assuming people judge the Dolchs power right)

TL;DR yes it's even plenty strong with just basic ammo and IMO comparable to a Dolch (altho significantly less stronk)

[vague patio]

alright

you think the muzzlevelocity accounts to any significants?

and would you say officer rivals dolch?

[hot vigil]

I mean, back when Dolch was all the rage, it there were a lot more officers too. So I would say yes.

[unborn smelt]

I mean it's fdefinetly a concern and a downside for the New model arm - but so far low velocity on pistols seems to not matter for many

especially not much up to ~40m for the body 2 tap

[unborn smelt]

to a degree yes. I also think if the officer is priced well at 96$ - the Dolch is no way deserving of 750$ post nerf

but less than the new model army - because it deals another 6 less dmg for a bit less range, has no fmj, has a fixed cylinder and lower ammo count

[vague patio]

i guess its kind of a mentalblockade that i think of every revolver seperatly then the dolch

i never realizedhow close these two weaponsare rn

[wispy snow]

IMO the new army just needs more recoil. Price is hard to balance by, but as a raw point of comparison to the officer and the dolch, it should probably be in the $200 range, give or take $50.

[vague patio]

id like it to shot slower

[half stag]

I don't think the new army should get a nerf. Price should be adjusted. Nagant officer should be buffed (and the bornheim in the mean time too)

[vague patio]

maybe even get it back into a single action with reallygood firerate instead of double action with bad firerate

[wispy snow]

Buffing semi autos and fast shooting ADS pistols is a dangerous thing.

[half stag]

In terms of buffs for the two, I mean like minor things

[vague patio]

i realy dont know why everyone wants to buff the officer. its way strong as is

[unborn smelt]

But semi autos are so much better already

[half stag]

Nagant officer recoil should be further smoothed out, price adjusted

[unborn smelt]

Buffing the other semi autos just leavs singe action even further in the dirt

[half stag]

Bornheim needs just one buff imo, and that is extra reserve ammo

[unborn smelt]

propably all but the uppercut

[wispy snow]

Officer recoil is in a decent place, the new army is the outlier being so smooth.

[unborn smelt]

Bornheim needs a bit of love - yes

but not officer nor spitfire imo

they are strong enough

[wispy snow]

Also that little bit of extra damage the new army has is deceptively massive.

[hot vigil]

Yeah Semi-guns ain't in the need for buffs. I'm rather interested to see how we can make 1-wielding single fire revolvers more viable. (Uppercut is not included and needs be taken down a notch).

[vague patio]

i was already weirded out that they made the spitfire so fast

[half stag]

That's a whole other discussion (they would be sitting in a fine place imo, if it weren't for the dual wielding ammo reserve nerf a while back)

[wispy snow]

IMO spitfire could slow down a touch.

[unborn smelt]

And the Dolch is overpriced on purpose so i'd not touch it either

It's been a constant source of complaints inthe community and as such propably a pain in the ass for the devs

[vague patio]

select all -> delete

[hot vigil]

tbh the only buff I would love to see for the Bornheim is just give some more ammo. It have about the same ammo count as Mosin.

And it feels real bad of going for the Bornheim Match and only get 15 compact bullets for it.

[wispy snow]

Bornheim has the worst ammo efficiency of any weapon in the game.

[hot vigil]

Then we have the uppercut

well

That gun needs to chill.

I never buy it bc if I want one, they are all over the map.

[late wind]

Remember. A 2% pick rate means a gun needs to become a paperweight. But a 50+% means it's perfectly balanced lol.

[grave harbor]

Someone is having ping issues?

[hot vigil]

Eyup, once again.
Bornheim: 15 compact bullets.
Uppercut: 15 long bullets.
why?!

Make uppercut be 12 total at least, 6 in your gun and full reload.

[wispy snow]

Nerfing ammo reserves with the dualies update was just completely ass backwards.

[half stag]

Hard agree

[late wind]

Or make it a two slot. You should need quartermaster to have a rifle in your pocket.

[hot vigil]

I can see the reason, but I also feel like this a little too over the edge.

Feel the uppercut can be tweaked in other spaces. Like how going from a Conversion to a Uppercut only lose you 4rpm (from 44rpm to 40rpm), yet goes from 104dmg to 130dmg.

[half stag]

There needs to be more stuff competing for the uppercut place (like a single shot, long ammo pistol or an actually decent long ammo medium slot) but that would require more work and take a while for crytek to do

[late wind]

It just needs something done.

[unborn smelt]

the issue with that is then there is very very few range secondaries

[late wind]

We had a pistol that went toe-to-toe with the uppercut. But people ree'd so hard that it became pointless.

[hot vigil]

I'm not really all grand for armsracing against the upper, it makes guns like the Pax left even more in the dirty.

[unborn smelt]

It's already super easy to take a range rifle, even a cheap one and add a CQC pistol in pretty much any price class

fanning, Dualies, semi autos, LeMat, handcannons.

For range - there is really only CCP FMJ, Uppercut and obrez.
The variety is heavily skewed towards making a rifle CQC capable not a shotgun range capable

[hot vigil]

Nagant Deadeye is a ranged secondary :b

And while I don't like the Deadeye, the Nagant Precision is not bad at all. Like, feel it gets more hate than it should.

It is a very stable rapidfire medium option.

[unborn smelt]

The nagant precision is great with the RoF boost it gets

the issue with the deadeye is that the need for scopesmith makes it loose the Rof traitless, and you strafe at hald the speed when aimed because it has a scope

also the 73m HS range is kind of restrictive

[half stag]

I would have said the same, but schofield precision is much better once you get used to the m/v. Doesn't help that it has fmj as well

[wispy snow]

Nagant precision rocks, but yeah nagant deadeye makes it lose almost everything good about it in exchange for a little bit of zoom that really isn't useful for its effective range.

[unborn smelt]

honestly i don't think so - the nagant P gets a very high RoF

at base it has more than a Winnie with iron repeater

[half stag]

Yea . . . But what's the fastest gun with a 50+ rpm fire rate in ads, the winnie

[unborn smelt]

and the stock makes it very easy to use the full RoF

[half stag]

Even then schofield is slightly faster than it, just barely enough to edge out if your aim is good (52 rpm vs 50 rpm)

[unborn smelt]

well no - the nagant P is a good bit faster

at 63 Rpm IIRC

[half stag]

Yea ik

[hot vigil]

Not the biggest gripe, but to reach that you'll need a perk, Iron Repeater to gain the full benefit?

[half stag]

Was abt to say

But the dmg drop off on the nagant precision makes me sad

[half stag]

Yea

[unborn smelt]

So while it won't outvalue a winnie it makes for a magnificent medium slot option - one of the best IMO

[hot vigil]

Also Winnie is a Large slot, so hopefully it is better than a medium slot Nagant :v

[unborn smelt]

Scottfield P is great too - don't get me wrong

and which one you prefer most likely depends on what you want it to do in your loadout and on your playstyle

it has a good bit more range even without FMJ, and it hits a good bit harder

But the nagant P is better for 2 taps up close, or to bring HV and use all of the HS range of the little devil

[half stag]

For sure

[hot vigil]

Yeah feel I haven't gotten the "aha!"-experience with the Scottfield P.
It always seems like I would have wanted a Spitfire instead.

[unborn smelt]

that's also my main issue with it

If the spitfire wasn't a thing i think the scottfield P would be much better

[cold dune]

I still stan the bornheim match as a medium slot gun

absolute menace at short to short-medium range

[unborn smelt]

the spitfire is de facto a single action so it lacks the "anti spam sway", it has the full dmg/range and an even better Rof than the Precision

It just steals the Scottfield precisions show IMo

[cold dune]

Hot take get rid of the spitfire

[hot vigil]

I wanna love it, but the gun is a big ask for giving you only 15 compact bullets. . .
Also personally I hate the iron sight on the Match vs. regular Bornheim.

[cold dune]

Bam the officer is relevant again until the New Army drops and the rest of the scottfield variants are viable

[unborn smelt]

the officer is still very much relevant

[cold dune]

The ammo thing means that you either don't take HV or you have to take dual nagants or w/e for extra HV but goddamn the bornheim just mulches people

Also I'm the exact opposite I vastly prefer the Match sights

[unborn smelt]

the spitfire 2 taps slower, and has worse velocity as well as it stacks diffrent ammo

[cold dune]

Fair but you get what I mean

[unborn smelt]

and the price diffrence between the two isn't exactly huge either

[hot vigil]

I can see that, still think it is a little overkill for the gun.
Think we could easily add a mag (5 bullets) to the match (and base Bornheim) without it tipping any scales.

[cold dune]

Really wish the bornheims got an extra 5 rounds in reserve though

Yeah

[hot vigil]

Yeah!

lol

[cold dune]

And make the base bornheim and the extended cheaper

The match is pretty reasonable at 224 but why the hell does the extended cost 306

[unborn smelt]

I think the reason the extended is so expensive and the ammo is so low is to reduce the frustration of people just spamming shots at heads hight and getting that random headshot

that was a big issue back when the extended broheim was only 130$

[hot vigil]

Then why do we have dualie? :)))))))))))

[cold dune]

It used to be 130?!

[unborn smelt]

because dualies can't actually aim which makes them far less reliable as well as them needing a medium slot as opposed to a smol slot making them far more restrictive for loadout choice

[hot vigil]

Yeah, still feel they qualify for the random headshot frustration as you stated :b

But alas it was more of jest than anything else

[unborn smelt]

And i still think Dualies should fire significantly slower, but be caipable of aimed shots

[cold dune]

maybe fast aimed fire with high recoil?

[unborn smelt]

like reduce the Rof overall by 25% to 33% - and replace the aimed fire with alternating between left and right ADS, with even further slowed down RoF (somewhere between the base and precision version)

[cold dune]

Like you're alternating between left and right so you still have high aimed RoF but its less spammy

Same idea gdi

[unborn smelt]

this would make hipfire headshots exponentially less likely (you loose a lot of precision by loosing the "aimed" hipfire, and you loose Rof on top)

[cold dune]

And then for hipfire idk make it less accurate but with full RoF or something

[hot vigil]

Not sure if I think that is the solution. But at this point I'm open for any suggestion :b

[unborn smelt]

And it would increase their skill ceiling by a good bit as you can actually use your aim skill now to be better

[cold dune]

Like the uh R8 in CSGO

Where you have the primary fire that sacrifices RoF for high acc and the hipfire that has 0 acc whatsoever but shoots real fast

[unborn smelt]

kind of yes

but that's essentially fanning with slight diffrences

[cold dune]

You have a point

I see duelies as a more extreme version tbh

You're trading stability and recoil for even more firepower

[unborn smelt]

My "issue" with them is right now they are unreliable if you've go good aim and thus overall weak, but they still create a tonn of frustration in the community

[cold dune]

My idea would be allowing perfect acc ADS fire with most if not all of its RoF but with high sway and recoil

Hence rewarding good aim

[unborn smelt]

I take issue with the sway part

[cold dune]

maybe not sway but you get the idea

[unborn smelt]

we have high power high sway medium slots and many people just don't play them because of the sway

[cold dune]

Very poor handling in exchange for improved RoF

[unborn smelt]

But i can absolutely see the idea

making them hard to control

[cold dune]

Actually since I've been on this wagon for a bit too long, add a new mechanic

Two iron sights

And you swap between the two

[unborn smelt]

With what purpose

[cold dune]

Mechanically challenging, rewards good aim by allowing you to chain shots

[cold dune]

when you ads you get two iron sights on screen, one for the left gun one for the right

[waxen elm]

Can someone please explain that to me, I die every time, no matter what, they always need two bullets, no matter where, and I need more than three

[cold dune]

You got hit with a frag bomb at very short range

[unborn smelt]

Well the frag bomb is tied for the most lethal consumable with the big bundle

and the distance on the killscreen, while maximally useless, is to the person throwing not the explosive

[hot vigil]

Frag (arguably too) strong and shreds and destroys a lot.

[unborn smelt]

As far as you neeeding more shots then enemies - limbshots. if they only need 2 they either play long ammo for the insane dmg, allowing 2 taps to even limbs, or they don't actually hit limbs, while you do

[waxen elm]

Yes but I have bulwark and the grenade has a range of 20m and was killed from 23m and the part behind crates and bulwark still got all 150 damage

[cold dune]

bulwark helps a lot less than the description implies

Its honestly primarily useful against explosive bolts

[wispy snow]

Bulwark does nothing against frags or frag arrows.

[cold dune]

Aren't those considered explosive?

[waxen elm]

No, they don't play ammunition

[cold dune]

Or am I going mad

[wispy snow]

They're explosive items but don't deal explosive damage.

[cold dune]

Gotcha

[wispy snow]

Yes it's dumb.

[cold dune]

Well that's why

[unborn smelt]

well lemme link you my message again: https://discordapp.com/channels/350201607788429323/367785159933689857/953018383241216011

[wispy snow]

Yes it should have been changed ages ago.

[cold dune]

Also you were way closer than 23m to the frag bomb

[unborn smelt]

the distance on the killview is to the hunter throwing it - not the actual explosive

so cain was 23m away from you

the fragbomb was way way closer

It's not great but sadly it's like that

[cold dune]

And while its hard to tell I don't think you were behind crates

[unborn smelt]

Also Bulwark doesn't help against frags at all

[wispy snow]

Distance to the hunter is still helpful, but it's something you can add together from the weapon stats.

Frags can one hit kill anyone within 28-34 meters, roughly.

[unborn smelt]

Frags deal rending dmg, so they can cause bleed - bulwark reduces explosive dmg

[cold dune]

Also the sharps should two shot to anywhere really

like, it hits damned hard

[waxen elm]

Ok

[unborn smelt]

The first hit is a leg shot

[waxen elm]

Yes, but trodem hard he brought three things like that more often

[cold dune]

As far as the second clip, leg, wood pen, bodyshot

[unborn smelt]

second shot is also to the legs

2 shots to the legs is the only way long ammo can fail to 2 tap

[cold dune]

Is legs still a 0.7 mult?

[unborn smelt]

yes

head on long is 4x, upper torso is 1.3x, arms is 0.8x and legs 0.7x

[cold dune]

....shouldn't that still two tap? 130x0.7 is 91

Oh wait 130 to upper torso

[unborn smelt]

But remember the store dmg is already to torso

[cold dune]

So 100 base, 70 to legs twice then the bodyshot to finish

[unborn smelt]

so the base dmg of say an uppercut is 130 / 1.3

[cold dune]

Ye

Forgot about the 30%, mb

[unborn smelt]

So it's 130/1.3 =100 and 100 x0.7 = 70

so 2 leg hits deal 140 dmg point blank

[cold dune]

Right because long doesn't drop off till the second pen

So 70, 70, 130

[unborn smelt]

yes and assuming sub 40m

or in uppercuts case 20m

[waxen elm]

Then I ask myself how do people do me with the Winfield from 30-40 m with two balls and that from the side

[cold dune]

Winfield will two shot from the side

Bullets will pen arms to hit the chest

[dull canyon]

I been experiencing problems with the bee lady . I shot her 6 times with full metal and she did not die

[cold dune]

The damage isn't applied twice but you get hit for torso damage instead of arm damage

[cold dune]

what gun, what range, where did you hit the hive?

[unborn smelt]

because there is limb pen - if there is the torso behind the arm it's torso dmg

[wispy snow]

I think AI, at least hives and armored, are not subject to limb penetration like players are.

[unborn smelt]

and the winnie can 2 tap out to 43 m with 2 hits to chest

[dull canyon]

The 56 dollar sniper gun up close

[cold dune]

the springfield marksman?

Hold on thats 73

[dull canyon]

No other one

[cold dune]

Winfield marksman?

[dull canyon]

Yes

[cold dune]

.....did you miss some shots?

Also in general AI are tankier than you'd expect unless you get a headshot

[dull canyon]

It happens on Sunday when I play ai on steroids

[cold dune]

So that's probably why

[dull canyon]

No I did not miss any shots it wasn't a head shot

[cold dune]

Yeah that'd be why then

[dull canyon]

Thankyou

[cold dune]

AI are generally pretty resilient but with the exception of armored die to headshots

fun fact dogs can take a shot of long ammo

[wispy snow]

Fun fact AI actually have different damage modifiers for different ammo types.

[cold dune]

Its not fun I hate dogs so much

[wispy snow]

Water devils die to 2 long ammo shots but take 4 compact.

[dull canyon]

I think there are a lot of cheaters on hunt I hear thy got this device called Cronus max thy say alot of YouTubers use it

Some times I play they seem to know we're you are at even if they don't see you

These hunters getting perfect head shots from long distance 153 meters

[hot vigil]

I mean, there will always be situations where you feel there is cheaters.

But eh, we can never truly know

[dull canyon]

I just hate when i play the game and you get far from them and they track you down and kill you

[hot vigil]

Like I've pulled off things where I'm sure I got reported for hacking afterwards, bc it seems SUPER bs, but sometimes we just pull those lucky shots.

[dull canyon]

I am just saying there are really good players out there and they spend alot of time playing the game

[hot vigil]

There is

It is scary

[dull canyon]

They know we're you are going to be at

I just need to get better at shooting the guns

[frosty garnet]

@dull canyon, your post below has been deleted, as it doesn't follow the required format.
You can find all guidelines pinned in the ideas channel.

Please feel free to re-post your idea using the correct format:
Matched regex in message in #game-ideas (#suggestions-ideas, 524577494863708180):

I would like them to add a train in hunt show down that runs to these sites```

[hot vigil]

Or you could switch to explosives :b

[vague patio]

wouldnt even bet an eye on that

[heady gorge]

I would love to have the kill cam be the last 15 seconds up to your death or something.

Also the trade window is weird to noobs. At first I was confused how I got killed, my body is nowhere near where the ground animation shows I was shot. Its because I was shot half a second earlier when I wasnt hidden, etc. Seeing the video up to your death from the killers perspective would help eliminate a lot of the times I feel a player is cheating, esp, etc,

Also wallbangs with high velocity rounds. How did that guy headshot me from 70+ while I am totally hidden.