feedback-discussion

[vital fractal]

Damn did it really happen? Nice

[snow cipher]

I know, like I don't want people to quit the game, that's the issue. That's why I had said the buff thing lmao. I'm glad you liked the other suggestions though!

[thin remnant]

tbh buff 3 doesnt sound bad, im sure a lot of people would like it and that's what you want. the majority.

[snow cipher]

Honestly, martialist is a slight buff to the katana, but it will be strong either way lol. I am not sure there is a great way to actually nerf the thing, which I never really struggle against it anyway, but I get some people do

[snow cipher]

That's great to hear, thank you for the feedback and everything!

[thin remnant]

i definetely think necro needs a change. at very least the price
np

[queen jungle]

You'll get downvoted cause taking 80 seconds to get up is insane and plenty time to burn someone making necro mega weak.

[thin remnant]

lmao you read it wrong.

[queen jungle]

You're right, what happens when I'm reading stuff at 7am.

[thin remnant]

a lot of dislikes are probably gonna come from the same thing haha

go to sleep.

[queen jungle]

It's usually how it goes with almost all necro rework suggestions tbh.

[thin remnant]

my suggestion to increase the cost wasnt too controversial, but thats not a super dramatic change

[queen jungle]

Don't think I've seen a positive voted one in a long while.

Like I'm talking full positive or close to.

[thin remnant]

even if its a good suggestion, theres always that one group of solos who rely on it super heavily and dislike any suggestion to change it

[queen jungle]

tbf it's already tough for solos as it is,

if I'm reading this suggestion correctly this time , this would be rough going down within 5 seconds if there's a trap on you that you could get through then get back up after. https://i.imgur.com/iVtUBoR.png

Yeah there's the exception in point 3 but still, would be rough.

[snow cipher]

Yeah, the issue is that like KEEY_BHOARWD_SNMMASH said, some people just do not want to play without it the way it is and so they are not usually fans of proposed nerfs

[snow cipher]

And yeah, it is a bit rough, but that's kinda the intention. I think that necro right now is a little too forgiving and I want that to change

That is why I made point 3, just to make it so that solos would not get completely cheated out of this. Like, I do not want people to be super unhappy, I just do not think the state of necro is great

But I do get your point too

[thin remnant]

Imo that's the fun of playing solo.

[unborn dagger]

^

[queen jungle]

Trying to find the dev stream, but it was at least three years ago

[queen jungle]

Here it is, Update 1.4.4 - telemetry showed many players stopped playing the tutorial after discovering the spider lair
https://youtu.be/Jxf89dB47GI?list=PLsKEs3FIMwi1RSKW7o0ZomjO7ipE6EDIB&t=1959

Man I miss the old dev streams. Far more relatable and less artificial than the highly scripted videos we get now.

[crystal plume]

I prefer the info being compacted into shorter videos instead of an hour long stream personally

[queen jungle]

Sometimes I wonder if you have supernatural senses because criticism towards Crytek is a reliable way to summon you to its protection

[crystal plume]

Weird take considering I just said my opinion on the matter and emphasized that I just think so personally

It makes it easier for me to quickly find info as well if I want to quote something when the videos are organized into different topics and don't take long to scrub through, with older streams it was a nightmare to go through the vods when I remember something vaguely being mentioned and want to confirm

You are free to prefer whatever yourself, I just prefer easily accessable information

[thin remnant]

maybe they should consider an arachnophobia mode?

[unborn dagger]

Ahh there we go, well that's a better alternative than giving a crappy toggle to change the design.

[dusky tapir]

@normal topaz #game-ideas message the mako and the winchester 1895 work completely different

they're different weapons

[normal topaz]

i just want the winchester 1895

whether its a skin or separate weapon

🙏

[dusky tapir]

that's a bit different then, don't you think

[normal topaz]

i think they're more likely to add a monetizable skin than a free weapon

[dusky tapir]

...how can you say this when we literally just got two new weapons

😟

[normal topaz]

because i aint played the game in a long time and didnt know when those got added

[vital fractal]

I mean in the time we got two weapons we did get more dlc skins/bb skins

It’s just Hunt doesn’t add free weapons unless it’s an event/seasonal/quest active

Which is fine

They don’t need to spam the arsenal, especially since even they themselves say they recognize they went a little over board (ie ammo) and even variants

[vital fractal]

There is a great way to nerf the katana into balance, make it a two slot

Very simple change that fixes it just about 90% of the way through, martialist tweaks to not work out of stamina and reduce the range a bit gets the last 10%

I am not saying make katana useless when I say nerf, I say make it balanced

[queen jungle]

TBH I'm not sure it'd be worth it. In a sandbox title such as Hunt, players can actively avoid the spider if they feel uncomfortable about it and while being one of the most widespread phobias, arachnophobia still only affects a low single-digit percentage of the global population (according to some quick research).

Somebody suffering from arachnophobia should of course seek professional psychological treatment.

In unrelated news, I had forgotten South America region has servers located in Miami as part of their network.

Digging through old patchnotes really holds interesting knowledge.

[radiant river]

That is also the case in valorant, so I guess it's a semi-normal thing

[visual leaf]

the katana is for people who literally can't aim

[hardy coral]

it's a melee weapon

Maybe move backwards a little.

[analog sigil]

Its a melee weapon?

[tiny cobalt]

It is actually a low tier shotgun

[tardy wren]

I haven't played Hunt for a year now (about). Got tired of playing solo against teams. I'll be back when I am able to play against my friends (2-6 teams versus). Would like to buy gear also, but to show who? For unknown random killer to loot? No thanks. But it is a good game though.

[gritty sky]

Is there a way to report someone whos clearly cheating / using glitch and got recorded by me?

[analog sigil]

yes

!report

[marsh garden]

If you would like to report a player, you can do so on the Team Details tab on your Match Summary screen. It is also accessible in the Last Match tab at any time. If you have additional proof you would like to provide, you can find out how to reach out to official support here: #customer-support

Please note that you can still report people even if you don't have their SteamID by providing your own SteamID, time of the incident with a time zone and region. Hiding statistics/profiles does not prevent reporting.

[tribal wyvern]

@valid mango
The limitation is a good thing & i think it's so easy to solve, yet people seem to make a whole chicken coop out of a feather.

All majority really want is for the "choose region" to be completly locked.
But it doesn't necessarily block you from inviting a person from the US if you're EU. It's just the option to decide where you land is not on you, but on the game.

Trio - all from diff regions, it picks the best one for you 3.
Trio - 2from EU, 1 from NA, it will pick EU.
Duo - from diff regions, the game will pick the best for you 2.
Solo - You can't choose.

That's it.

[gritty sky]

I did that report on the site but even though they answered that they will look into it, the guy can still play. Either they never looked into it or a video is not good enough proof. :/

[tardy wren]

It sometimes take time and more reports. There are plenty of hack accounts with zero friends and Hunt Showdown as only game. These are obvious ofc. Smarter ones hide their details. I have followed few accounts that I reported, and it took few days until hacker was banned.

[queen jungle]

@lucid lion You talk about all play styles being viable and not forcing people to play a certain way and then suggest to force people to play a certain way 🤔

[hot vigil]

It is an interesting issue, bc it feels frustrating to get 200m sniped by someone who doesn't seem to have any intention of actually playing for the bounty.
But on the other hand it is also very frustrating that EVEN if you survive a match you can still lose a sizeable amount of money due to consumable costs.
And forcing objective sure would fix the first issue, but make the second one way much worse and vice versa

[floral nova]

I'm not sure about the halved stats. Maybe I'd prefer a probability of getting stuck and needing a button press or two

[vital fractal]

I think the melee blocking is a decent idea but super hard to implement

If it was implemented they could add a few mechanics based on size (slots) and type of damage to see what has priority

[thin remnant]

^

[tiny pivot]

This is unbelievably funny and totally real lol I absolutely could see this

Not to mention them explicitly being like "ah yeah lets swap that over" made me giggle

[hot vigil]

Melee blocking with these trade windows?
Not sure if that is ever gonna feel good.

Either it gonna be the easiest thing to pull off or the most impossible thing to do.

[vital fractal]

Yeah, as I said- incredibly hard to do but would make sense

Guess it’s more of a dream than reality to achieve

[hot vigil]

I think it is more than beyond "hard" because the game is simply not built for it.
And on top of that, the 400ms trade window and client site hit reg gonna make it hell to actually discern who is getting a hit in and who is getting a successful parry.

[flat sandal]

I really hope that crytek uses hunt to showcase new and shiny multiplayer game capabilities of their engine and that these thigs will be possible then

[hot vigil]

Doesn't really change with the updated engine, it is the "rules of the game" that needs to be changed

[flat sandal]

yea but I assume the rules were sub par for a shooter so far because the engine wasn't really built for it. if not, I don't know why it was so much worse then in other games. even sea of thieves manages parrying

[hot vigil]

Sure, but sea of thieves is also (intended to be) a more casual experience.
Basically to make melee feel good, you'd need to lower the trade window a lot, but that would make long distance shooting feel worse as your bullets would disappear in the air.

[flat sandal]

why would they disappear?

could you not handle melee and shooting differently?

[hot vigil]

Because, the hit validation system used in Hunt.
In Hunt, the hit validation system starts client side.
So if I shoot someone on my screen, the information is send to the server that then validates the shot.
The shot is validated if it hits before 400ms have passed after my death.
Due to a mix of the distances and (generally) low muzzle velocity, people in the early days, would see their shots leave their gun and create blood splatter on their enemy as they went down, but deal no damage due to the "window" being much lower than 400ms.

[flat sandal]

there has got to be a better netcode right?

[hot vigil]

Most likely not, to my understand most shooting games melee attacks are actually just a very short range "gun shot" + hurtbox, all the swinging are just animation flair.

[hot vigil]

Well, Hunt's trade-window is very widely discussed, but "better netcode" is a very wide and hard to define state.
It is just systems created to do what it needs to do and this being a shooting game (primarily), just have systems that benefits that the most :)

[flat sandal]

if I were crytek I would develop my engine towards better shooter performance seeing they have a shooter live service going

[hot vigil]

Well, Cryengine is a shooting engine.

Primarily

[flat sandal]

like, the hunt guys are probably like, pleeeese engine people^^

but more single player

at least most cryengine games are single player focused afaik, might be wrong

[hot vigil]

Original Farcry and Crysis did have multiplayer too.

[flat sandal]

I know I played that a ton, the game was singleplayer though

and CS ppl hated it

[hot vigil]

It was just different back then

Games were primarily Single-Player with an multiplayer added ontop of it

"Pure multiplayer" only was not really a thing back then or at least far from the norm.

[flat sandal]

hunt may well be the first with bullet velocity

[hot vigil]

Naw, ARMA, PUBG and many others had that waaaaaay before

[flat sandal]

if so why would the engine handle it well?

okay fair^^

guess i dont know my cryengine games^^

[hot vigil]

Ah none of those are CryEngine games, it was just in general

[flat sandal]

oh I meant first cryengine sry

[hot vigil]

But yeah, to my understanding what the CryEngine struggles a lot with is having a lot of players and a lot of AI running at the same time.

[flat sandal]

maybe they learnt from the development of star citizen. kinda funny CIG would use this engine then

[hot vigil]

That is a whole other story haha.
But yeah S.C. made it very evident of the engines short comings in that regard.

But yeah, in short, yes, Hunt could get a parry/block system, but with current netcode "rules", I would project it feeling VERY inconsistent and bad.

[flat sandal]

two more monthes and we'll know more 😄

would love a good melee system

were you could get stuck in a sort of longerish stale mate (if you dont fail your locks) and have to shout for your teammate to shoot the guy

[queen jungle]

@signal silo Hunt's solo mode is Quickplay/"Soul Survivor"

They tried solo only Bounty Hunt in the past and it was an atrocious experience

[hot vigil]

Always disliked referring to the past solo event as an evident that it is bad.
Game is much different now, especially with solo traits + we, as a player base just have a better understanding and skillset now than 6 years ago.
So wouldn't be shy to try it again, especially if people wish for it :)

[flat sandal]

hopefully the game will be sort of more nimble as well so they can quickfire try a bunch of things. I mean, why not try these things for a few weeks if you can make these changes easily. Judging by the fact that mistakes can even happen when doing something simple as switching between single bounty only and double bounty, this doesn't currently seem to be possible^^

[hot vigil]

@tall night these are wildly ranging suggestions and it is hard to approve and disprove the suggestion as a whole :)

[thin remnant]

Want feedback, tbh it's just because it's fun to talk about hunt suggestions, but ye #game-ideas message

[hot vigil]

Seems like a eh addition, like it wouldn't break the game, but also, it just ain't gonna do much either that would get little use.
It is a lot of set up for little payoff, if you can shoot at the vial, you can most likely shoot the hunter.

• making people burn is already in rather toxic state, so will weary about adding more of it

[signal mural]

Honestly, burning has - IMO- gone beyond the toxicity of old days and now is just standard - to the point where if someone doesn't burn you, you're surprised and maybe respect the sportsmanship of them all the more for it...

[hot vigil]

Had some game yesterday where I got the feel that people are kinda tired of it.
Usually if my team didn't burn, the enemy team didn't either.
That said, if we killed somone with the shadow of a doubt it was solo, they got roasted.

[signal mural]

It only turns toxic again once VoIP shit-talking & vindictive self-rez enter the mix.

[hot vigil]

I play with no enemy VoIP 😌

[signal mural]

Same. I had my fill pretty early on... granted I can't hear alliance offers or funny banter either but it's well worth it not to hear the -phobic hate speech players.

[hot vigil]

Eyup, and I know this is quite snobby, but bad audio quality irks me so much, so hate to hear someone talking in a tin can to me lmao.

But back at the topic on burning.
It is an issue on how available it is, but also needed bc it is so mandatory for solos.

[signal mural]

Yeah honestly the complaints about fuses and flares igniting is IMO void because it's only enough to eliminate one Solo if they consistently revive when lit aflame.

[hot vigil]

+/- how many on the team have flares.

And dunno that feels more like an edge case and I will try to be fair about the state of solos haha

[signal mural]

Yeah, I mean there are a multitude of ways to deal with a solo necro - but honestly 2-3 slots of a loadout dedicated to the elimination of one enemy is too much. That or a hell of a lot of patience.

[hot vigil]

Yeah, I have no option for tools nowdays unless I have melee variant, then I can choose one tool slot for what feels flavour lol.

[signal mural]

Yeah, I know that feeling well. I know we've both hatched out a lot of alternatives to how Solo Necro should/could work, so it's maybe beating a dead horse at this point - but I don't think I have ever actually had a reasonable debate with a solo necro defender.

@tall night Your suggestion with the barrier is really poor gameplay design that would be a huge disadvantage to anyone playing a single shot weapon.

[hot vigil]

Something something if you cannot beat solo, something something skill issue? :V

[signal mural]

Forcing extractions to not spawn near boss compounds makes the boss compounds easier to target without using clues and decreases the likelihood of player engagements in compounds near extractions.

[signal mural]

You dunt know how hard its beings a Solo. Gitz gud.

[hot vigil]

https://tenor.com/view/oh-the-misery-oh-the-misery-everybody-wants-to-be-my-enemy-gif-25368312

It is quite interesting how most solos, no matter skill level, ends up in 2-3 stars due MMR fuckery.
Think the lower you are to 1 star, you lose less MMR per death even if you are equally ranked.
So "bad" solo players doesn't divulge further down, but it also means that high skill players also kinda floats there as as soon you try to get to high 3 star/4 star a death does net you a greater MMR loss vs high 2/low 3 stars.

[queen jungle]

@bold valley Looting money is a special reward if you manage to take out an opponent without using any tools or consumables.
In the past you looted money more easily and it made PvP too rewarding, causing players to just extract after a fight instead of continuing.
So in total such a change would reduce PvP in Hunt.

[signal mural]

Yeah, the MMR fluctuation is really absurd. I was quite pleased when my suggestion to make Solo Necromancer negate the MMR drop garnered a lot of support. I think it would alleviate a good portion of the frustration with the solo's gameplay lately.

[thin remnant]

I agree with this ^
would combo with shotguns pretty nice

gtg

[hot vigil]

wat

I agree that I don't like your suggestion???

[queen jungle]

You just made a convincing point I guess

[hot vigil]

[signal mural]

I got to say it is refreshing when people can accept a good argument

[flat sandal]

Maybe they'll address all our speculations around this topic. would be nice to see how wrong/right we were

perhaps show some nice graphs

[spiral robin]

hey, can someone explain me how this damn damage algorithm works? because here, it's just illogical. 26% in headshot and still alive?? i sometimes got killed by 5% in the butt at 10m!

[signal mural]

I believe it is 26% of the pellets... so a grazing headshot - dealing 108.

[spiral robin]

and do not hide behind the "Beta" aspect, it's been here for almost a year, and it's just displaying server info that are used to calculate if we died or not

[spiral robin]

yeah, that's exactly the problem. i sometimes take 5% in butt 10m far and take 150 damage

and that's a fucking headshot, stats say that you can headshot 12m far

so what does the algorithm exactly?

[signal mural]

Yeah, I'm with you on the mystery of trying to interpret shotgun damage reports. It often feels like the most baffling OHKs or lucky survivals come from shotgun plays.

[rotund obsidian]

!multipliers

[marsh garden]

Hunt: Showdown hit multipliers (please note that damage values in the menu are given for the upper torso with 1.3 multiplier already applied): https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/420219125198225408/833012157188145162/latest.png

[rotund obsidian]

shotguns get a very small headshot multiplier, 1.5 compared to upper torso's 1.3, so 26% of pellets just isn't enough to kill, even to head.

[thin remnant]

Yeah I agree that it's a meh suggestion, wouldn't change much in the game. Sticking it into players would be pretty useless unless you have shotgun or explosive, maybe would be a bit stronger if any damage like falling damage would trigger it, but that might be too strong.
I just make whatever suggestion comes to my mind, doesn't hurt anyone lol
Thanks for being chill about feedback

[spiral robin]

then explain me why i wometimes got killed by 5% in the butt please

something's missing here

[rotund obsidian]

If your hitpoints are reduced to 0, you will die 👍

[thin remnant]

facts

[rotund obsidian]

Do you have a screenshot of a kill with 5% of pellets or something? cause my only explanation for that would be that the damage log sucks and is often inaccurate

[spiral robin]

guys, taking 150 damage by 5% in the butt.. don't act as if you didn't understand

[hot vigil]

No worries and end of the day, I'd rather have new things that doesn't kill other strategies.
So if it got added I wouldn't mind it, just hard to see when it would be relevant and then comes the question, is worth adding dev time to it :p
But hey, it might be the start of a good idea, that just need a little revision :D

[hot vigil]

Well, butt can be lower torso.
That is almost the same as the upper torso multiplier.

[thin remnant]

there should be a butt shot multiplier

[spiral robin]

might be that XD

[signal mural]

'I used to be a Hunter just like you until I took those shotgun pellets to my... buttocks.'

An arrow to the knee should be OHK.

[astral citrus]

would it be a valid suggestion, that the option to, when starting with dual wielding 2 pistols, to only lift one, and then when reloading you pick up the other one? this would allow for fanning, even when you take 2 pistols with you in one weapon slot; though only possible to be done when you got a specific trait like quartermaster or ambidextrous

[rotund obsidian]

People are pretty against it, it's been suggested a trillion times. All this does is make dualies flat out better than single pistols, in both total and loaded ammo, with no weaknesses.

[signal mural]

I just wish Ambidextrous would let you ADS with one primary gun and fire both...

[hot vigil]

It would just make it better than one slot pistol.

[astral citrus]

what about unused weapon slots would add x amount of bullets to the specific weapon with extra slots?

[dusky tapir]

ammo stacking already accomplished something similar and it made some weapons have ludicrous reserves

[astral citrus]

yes, but that was for dual wielding weapons

e.g. if you carry a sparks rifle, and a sparks pistol, with quartermaster and and got an extra slot, it would only add the amount of ammunition that the sparkpistol would add that you gain from ammo crates in the open world, so for long range it would be 2 extra bullets

so if you carried a scotfield for secondary, and leaves an open unused slot, it would give you 6 extra medium ammo

a better way to visualize this, would be if you had 2 spark pistols in each weapon loadout slot, with quartermaster, for the first weaponslot you would get 4 extra longrange bullets, where for the second slot, you would gain 2 extra bullets, adding a total of 6 extra longrange bullets to your disposal

[hot vigil]

Giving long ammo a venue for more ammo without sacrificing having to dual wield either spark pistol or Uppecut is a bad idea

Hunt atm, doesn't need more venue for ammo

Already think long ammo gets too much for the standard 15 they get

[astral citrus]

it doesn't have to be specifically for long ammo, if same would be done with 2 nagant pistols, you would get 24 extra ammo

ofc it can be discussed if it should be 8 or 4, for compact, or for long ammo, 2 or 1

[hot vigil]

Yes, but it is gonna benefit long ammo the most

[astral citrus]

for only adding a top of 6 to 3 extra bullets?

[queen jungle]

Less ammo overall would be nice. Or at least disconnecting the weapon slots so they don't pool.

This would possibly encourage players to use more creative loadouts instead of having a secondary that matches the primary for the sake of ammo.

[hot vigil]

That was why the ammo rework happend.
And the % bullet loot + dualies got nerfed.

[astral citrus]

ofc, if you carry 2 weapons, the extrabullets would be reduced

[hot vigil]

Adding 6 bullets is 40% more bullets for your your mosin.

[astral citrus]

if you carry a mosin, and got quatermaster, you would only add 2 extra bullets

tops

if you used a sparks pistol

[hot vigil]

Okay, then I'm not sure how it works

Why only 2?

[astral citrus]

because, the mosin takes up 3 slots in the primary weapon, which leaves 2 weapon slots left for the secondary, this do not compensate the value for a sparks pistole, so you would add the sparks, and leave one extra slot open, adding only 2 extra bullets

[hot vigil]

eeeeh

Not sure man

Again we don't need more ammo

in hunt

Marathon + Conversion already give you 57 FMJ bullets for the Marathon

[astral citrus]

most of the time using, medium, i've come across lacking bullets, due to the small ammopool

[hot vigil]

You have ammo boxes for that

And which medium?

[astral citrus]

hold on in a game rq

[steel comet]

That is already too much ammo than necessary tbh.

You get so much ammo for medium ammo from in-game boxes.

[astral citrus]

cenntenial

[steel comet]

And if you run special ammo, an ammo box consumable replenishes your ammo

[hot vigil]

It does have a low ammo count, but that is kinda the drawback of the gun :)

[astral citrus]

sad

[steel comet]

I don't think it's low, 22 bullets in total for centennial? Or am I misremembering

[astral citrus]

plus this would only add 8 extra bullets if you had quartermaster

[astral citrus]

am i just this bad at hitting?

[cedar helm]

Yes, cent gets 9+1/12 = 22 and it gets back 6/ammo box iirc

[steel comet]

Long ammo does well with only 15 bullets. Centennial even got the opportunity to ammo stack easily with spitfire/pax

[cedar helm]

It's in a p good spot ammo wise imo and that's using spec ammo on it because fmj is base ammo for cent

[astral citrus]

i dont think people get the general idea of how this idea works

[steel comet]

Fmj basically turns cent into long ammo

I'm pretty much against extra ammo. I think it's too easy to spend too much ammo for low risk wallbangs and get your ammo back

In the current state of the game

And ammo box consumable is really great at replenishing ammo if you really do have ammo problems

[astral citrus]

but the idea at discussion only adds a margin of ammo to the game, in compensation for unused weapon slots

[queen jungle]

I haven't run out of ammo in a long time tbh, so there's definitely too much ammo provided.

[cedar helm]

I would rly like to see this.

The disconnecting the weapon slots so they don't pool

[astral citrus]

i agree, as most weapons that share ammo pools, dont actually share the same type of ammo

[steel comet]

Yeah so you can't just grab a Mosin and an obrez cause they are both rifles.
Like the idea

(Though thats one of the few that makes sense realistically)

[cedar helm]

lol ya

[steel comet]

But it's just a way to stack spitzer ammo

[astral citrus]

sparks pistol and mosin would make more sense

oh

forget my mention then

but then again, back to the idea that i mentioned, in relation to the mosin and oberz, this wouldn't add extra ammo to the weapons based on my suggestion

[steel comet]

QM is already a very nice trait, don't think it needs a buff like that 🤔

You have the option to remove QM if you're not using it

[hot vigil]

We get you, but we disagree there should be a venue for adding more ammo into the match :V

[astral citrus]

even in such small amounts?

[hot vigil]

Yes

Again, we here talking about lessen the amount of ammo

[astral citrus]

and it's to the general game, not to a specific trait

but why the less ammo?

[hot vigil]

Because people just spam it

It is very easy just to never concern about running out of ammo

[astral citrus]

i dont see the problem in that, it would add up for aggressive gameplay

[steel comet]

Theres guns in the game that's supposed to have the pros "hit hard" and the con " low ammo"

But right now it doesn't have that con at all

So it's spammable and it's frustrating

[hot vigil]

Well, issue is that it doesn't really do that. It just enable 57 FMJ bullets that wallbang you

[astral citrus]

hardly come across anyone being able to kill me that way yet

and i got 600 hours

[hot vigil]

And I got 1.6k hours :v

And play in the 5-6 star mmr bracket

[astral citrus]

congrats

[steel comet]

You might also not pay much attention to the amount of shots people take, since that's not usually the first thing one got on their mind in a firefight

[hot vigil]

My point ain't to show off, but to tell you what happens in my end of the spectrum.

[astral citrus]

we play in the same spectrum my dear friend

but yea, i see your points as valid, just want to get more details

[hot vigil]

More ammo doesn't make people play more aggressive in my experience, it just make the play more safe bc now they can wallbang more.

[steel comet]

I tend to bring ammo box with me when I play cent fmj, or a weapon like Krag.
It's not every game I get to use it but it really helps out when you get into a spammable wallbang situation.

[astral citrus]

i see, so the wallbanging is the the problem?

[steel comet]

And of course if you can't land a shot at all, it just helps out that you have an easy ammo replenish

[hot vigil]

Well, not only that, but among other aspects

Long ammo doesn't need a venue for more ammo

And compact neither

[steel comet]

I like the wallbang mechanic in hunt, not fully agreeing that long ammo gets every benefit there is to the game but I still like wallbangs.
Ammo economy is just promoting volume of fire (spam) over precise shots.

[hot vigil]

So if medium is struggling, then we should focus on that

[astral citrus]

i cant see the problem in this

it's 2 different playstyles

[hot vigil]

Would love to see FMJ (compact/medium) pen getting nerfed, but buffing the base pen for those two ammo types slightly.

[astral citrus]

that i highly agree on

[steel comet]

A base pen buff would be sick

[hot vigil]

And ofc long ammo damage nerf, just to close the gap a little between thet ammo types

[astral citrus]

an idea for this would be heavy damage dropoff over distance, no?

[steel comet]

Good talk folks, I gotta scram 😔

[astral citrus]

thanks for the discussion, love these kinds of talks

[hot vigil]

In general (non-single shot) weapons in hunt should have their damage normalized to 100-120 damage, like 110 compact vs 110 long ammo would still matter due to the pen, mv and damage over distance.

[hot vigil]

Well, FMJ adds the pen AND extend the damage over distance, which I don't mind.
It is just the pen that is insane on FMJ imo.

[astral citrus]

yea thus heavy damage dropoff after wall penetration

currently the damage only get reduced

[hot vigil]

Don't think there is a need to complicate it that much.

THink the damage loss is fine

[astral citrus]

it doesn't really complicate it by a big factor, just make the damage exponently drop over distance after penetration

[hot vigil]

Well it complicates it from an onboarding perspective.

[astral citrus]

how so

[hot vigil]

Well, it is another mechanic to consider and learn

[astral citrus]

yes

[hot vigil]

Now it is simple (ish) with "lose damage when pen" and really, how much different is it gonna be?

[astral citrus]

snipers in real life take this into consideration even when shoothing through glass

[astral citrus]

quite big

[hot vigil]

That it is either "lost 40% damage" or "lost 10% damage and an additional 30% over 5m"

[astral citrus]

equations are here to do the job

e.g. use of sigmoid equation could be used for this purpose

[hot vigil]

I was more thinking as a gameplay impact

Like think it leads to more "what the fuck I got a hit marker, why didn't they die?!"

than actual fun and engaging mechanics

[astral citrus]

i think you take account for that the dropoff is so extreme that even if you stood next to the wall, that they wouldn't die, the mechanic itself only account for people on long distance, so if you used compact fmj and tried to hit someone that is > 25m away, the fmj compact would be obsolete

as the currect game mechanic, you would do the full damage of that distance, and reduce the damage by whatever the percentage is after wallpenetration

making any distance after wallbanging a problem for the one receiving damage

that said, the idea of dropoff would allow full damage of the fmj when the enemy is close to the wall, istead of getting a flat percentage, and as you said, at 5m this might not be a significant dropoff but it's less from when close to the wall, and higher than if you were 5m away and used the current flat percentage, and if 25m away, the damage would be insignificantly low compared to if you were closer or used the old system

a visual example would look like this, where y is damage multiplier after wall penetration, and x is distance travelled after the initial penetration

[queen jungle]

@thin remnant Adding people you met as friends after a match is why the Steam Profile button exists.

[floral nova]

@thin remnant #game-ideas message
I like the idea of leaving explosives and incendiary stuff laying around, ready to be damaged or shot. I'd love if we could lay down all our consumables. It yould also combo with the alarm trap or the concertina trap.
I'm not sure about the part about sticking into hunters. It would be like a throwing knive, but heavier? Like a sticky dynamite, but you cannot remove the sticky dynamite I think.
Maybe it could be implemented like a sticky dynamite but with a vial/bottle inside, like the hellfire or fire bottle, without the fuse.

What about using the alternate fire button to be able to launch the consumable without lighting the fuse? I'll make a post for it.

[rotund obsidian]

Alert tripmine + unlit dynamite = instant death

[thin remnant]

Loll

[thin remnant]

Difference between it and the throwing knife or sticky is the sticky is harder to throw and hit but is a much more likely kill without needing something else to confirm the payoff. Throwing knife is probably easier to throw, not sure, but has an instant damage payoff. Also comes in a larger pack and is a tool instead of consumable

Ty for the feedback

The alternate fire idea sounds interesting, could be very strong with certain combos like tacomanx said, but I like the idea

[vernal plank]

@floral nova this would open the door for c4-like traps

[thin remnant]

The one thing that'd be pretty busted is dynamite imo

[floral nova]

It could be a tool, small like a throwing knife. It could set on fire and burn 20HPs once triggered, 1 damage on hit, coming in a pack of 3, 4 w/ Frontiersman.

[thin remnant]

This could be interesting too for sure

I feel like the throwing without lighting thing would be realistic and fun to play around with but would need extra balancing so you don't get one shot by traps, I think crytek has been careful to avoid instant death traps so far

[floral nova]

well, right now the death trap is the poison + concertina and it cost the attacker 2 tools slots. Easy if you carry a pistol with the puncher. This would cost you a tool slot and a consumable slot, for one trap. Four traps for one tool and 4 consumables. I think it would be fairer than the poison-concertina. Also you can take in your inventory the explosive and use it against the attacker. (that would be probably a bounty defender)

Oh, it would also be nice if thrown and inexploded things could be takeable.
E.g. you defuse a dynamite, you take it and you can throw it without lighting it or if you light it the fuse is shortened.

[thin remnant]

Fair points

Btw want to clarify I didn't specifically say vials would be burst by concertina, might be pretty strong and I could imagine them not being burst by it irl so could be not added for balancing

Not trying to get defensive or argumentative btw, I see your your points. Needing two slots would balance it a bit, but I wouldn't enjoy it if I walked into a wire and I just died instantly.
I'm trying to think of ways this could be balanced cause frankly I think this is a cool idea

Btw sorry if I write something that doesn't make sense or misread its late im tired

[floral nova]

If the vials were to burn only by being shattered, it would be fine if they only do 20HPs of insta burn and set burning status.

[floral nova]

A trap with alert next to a red barell kills you. The barrel is very visible, but during a fight it could be that you don't notice the trap. I've done a kill with it just last week, at mmr4 I think.

What I think would be cool and possibly annoying is snipers trapping a boss compound, going afar and shooting at big dynamite bundles.

[thin remnant]

I love doing that lol
One problem is just a bomb is less visible

[floral nova]

what do you mean?

bomb =?

[thin remnant]

Dynamite and frag

Could just make it so trip mines only light the fuse and they explode after a couple seconds instead of instant, idk if that's what you had in mind already

Like fire bombs and such are instant but fused bombs take a little bit, just enough time to react if youre really fast

[floral nova]

you mean to be thrown lit vs to be placed unlit?

[floral nova]

I thought about that, but I think the fuse is too long. You can easily run away or defuse them.

[rotund obsidian]

I kinda like the idea of throwing unlit firebombs to leave oil patches, but I think doing it with explosives would just be too strong. We sorta had this before, with the way explosives worked when thrown into water. I believe it was patched out, since people were just leaving a bunch of sticky bombs or something in water near boats and then setting off a nuke with an explosive round and wiping a team on extract.

[floral nova]

but you couldn't take them, right?

right now you can place insects jars in the water and then shoot them

[rotund obsidian]

I mean they weren't exactly easy to see. That's kinda the whole point. A nearly invisible bundle of dynamite or frag bomb hidden somewhere that can be detonated with a weak aoe, like an explosive bolt or bullet?

I like to think that dauntless deleting projectiles from existence instead of just extinguishing the fuse (and leaving a live explosive sitting somewhere) is an intentional balance decision specifically to avoid those exact scenarios.

[flat sandal]

I'd be fun though. like laying a trap with a bunch of dynamites in a row. imagine the chaos

[thin remnant]

The fuse could be shorter than usual is what I mean. Same kinda deal as frag arrows, you can react if you're fast and in a good position, but it's hard.

I can imagine a fuse going faster from an explosion vs lighting it with a little spark

[unborn sandal]

I really don’t understand why people want to stop friends from queuing with each other

I can understand limiting people from solo queuing into higher ping lobbies I guess but there’s no reason to stop people from queing with friends

They aren’t doing it to get higher ping

[thin remnant]

It's because it could be abused to highten the ping limit. Just make an alt account or get another ping abuser on your team and you're instantly allowed to ping abuse again.

[unborn sandal]

Ping abuse isn’t a thing. The only thing that high ping can do is make you trade more often. There’s no more peeker’s advantage with 200 ping then there is with 20 ping. You peek for the same frame of time, just you appear to peek later on your opponent’s screen. It has been proven by some of the hunt staff like nixatek:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=MX4fbGVvrVA&pp=ygUSbml4YXRlayBwaWJnIGFidXNl

People just use so-called ping advatage as a scapegoat for all their problems

[thin remnant]

well then there you go, if they use it as a scapegoat, that's why it's disliked.

[unborn sandal]

I’m not saying crytek is using ping abuse as a scapegoat, it’s just been so widespread among the community that they’re giving into the pressure to please people. The community just needs to be better informed about it and let up on the nonsense

[snow cipher]

I upvoted your suggestion. I can tell you from the perspective of someone who has been having internet and ping issues lately, high ping is not an advantage, in fact it is quite the disadvantage cause your inputs are not always registered when you want them. I can't imagine trying to make a shot in this game on 300 ping. I think people are just mistaking actual cheating for "ping abuse"

Now, lag switches can sometimes be a way of cheating, but that is a momentary ping jump and that can be done by anyone anywhere, so stopping friends from playing together is probably silly

And I am not someone who plays with people from across the world, but I don't have issues with people that want to

[thin remnant]

I'm personally not against the idea, I'm just explaining why it's downvoted.

[bold valley]

@floral novai like the idea of leaving around dangerous objects like unlit bombs or firebombs or hive bombs or whatever to be triggered by various means, with the following caveats

1. Even if it's unrealistic, explosives don't get immediately set off, just their fuses. Meaning that if you dropped off an unlit dynamite stick next to an alert tripwire that later went off, or someone shot at it, it would take that stick several seconds to go off. Explosive damage just shortening fuse time rather than being immediate.

2. Different types of dormant throwables have different counters or incompatibilities. So that you can't stack up traps too badly without them interfering or becoming more dangerous to you than the enemy.

sry pinged wrong person

[thin remnant]

Yeah, the one thing I'd be scared of is the instant one shot without the fuse thing.
I get my suggestions previously for the vials would be instant, but it wouldn't one shot. The biggest worry about them would just be the debuffs they apply.
For the vials I previously suggested I think alert trip mines would set them off but not concertina to prevent instant one shot traps.

Ah you pinged the wrong guy lol

[snow cipher]

Oh yeah, no worries, I was not trying to jump you or anything lol

[thin remnant]

yeah ur all good bro
that message was just for clarification

Flyingdebris I gotta say you have some good takes

[snow cipher]

Awesome, just wanted to make sure everything was all good

[bold valley]

i mean i know we dont really have trap incompatibility or these kinds of counters right now. but hypothetically. if the green poison "juice" ruined dynamite, it would at least prevent the current kill traps from becoming more killy

[thin remnant]

thats a cool idea, you mean similar to choke bombs?

[bold valley]

yeah, but maybe like a shittier effect. like tossing through the cloud does nothing to stop a fuse, but if the dynamite was present when it "poofed"

[thin remnant]

interesting suggestion

[bold valley]

or if fire burned away poison

i dunno

[thin remnant]

that's interesting too..

you talking about like

If fire went off in the poison cloud it would all go kaoifjsaofjsaojsoifjsadoj and ignite

could be really strong if paired with dragon breath and the similar ammo types

[bold valley]

well, like if fire went off in a poison cloud and the poison cloud evaporated away

[thin remnant]

The idea of an interaction between fire and poison is pretty nice

[bold valley]

not really for any purely rational reason, mind you. but just thinking in terms of making certain interactions that start to limit the kinds of trap combos you can create

as allowing droppable bombs opens up a lot of options

[thin remnant]

hold up can you make a death trap by just combining two concertinas or a concertina with a poison mine

[bold valley]

yes, but like that does require you to dedicate half your tool slots (i would know, it's my standard loadout) mix in placing hivebombs, or unlit dynamite, or oil slicks, or concertina bombs, etc, and it can get a lot nastier

i would for sure start keeping dynamite sticks in reserve just for clearing traps though, that's for sure

trust me, i would love to see more trapping options, cause i would use the shit out of it. but i know that it needs to be a cheese resistant mechanic

[rotund obsidian]

two concertinas wont instakill but a concertina+poison is typically lethal, since they're slowed by the conc inside the poison aoe

[floral nova]

That could be a good way to balance it.

[floral nova]

1. That's fine, if it's not 4s, but like 1 or 2s.
2. Could you elaborate on the "incompatibilities" and "counters" part?

If there's a fuse, dauntless can be used. For traps it would render them null.

oh, you explained more in the next messages

Yesterday I was inside brinery, I placed a poison+concertina trap at the upper door. A guy entered, didn't die, pushed me with a katana and killed me. I had rival w/ slugs, missed because I was going on the left of the wall, and he came from the right.

probably he was on antidote

Lately I'm dying a lot from insects jar because poison it's really fucking up your vision, and people aren't dying on my traps. I used to throw away my jars. Now it seems better than any explosive.

I proposed that explosions extinguish fires, and I'm totally fine with fire burning poison.

Another possible interaction between explosives in a trap is that some of them explode before and send the others flying off before they explode.

[bold valley]

that is a good point, if dropping a bunch of big dynamites somewhere with the intent to set them off meant that an errant bit of splash damage or the first explosion might send the other explosives ricocheting around before they go off, could discourage holing up somewhere with too much boom ready to go off.

"congrats you helped teamwipe yourself as your dynamite stack bounced through the boss lair"

although....oh man. imagine a team that has a base rigged to blow, then leaves to let it get occupied

coming back later, knowing they can set off a chain reaction

[flat sandal]

@night sinew I think it would be cool if it was some sort of rescource. Never having any traits on fresh hunters and using it to get upgrade point on hunter could be a thing. It would make sense lore wise as well which is good as the option to get immersed and engaged with gameplay outside of the matches is important imo

I wanna feel like running some sort of org^^

I wonder what would happen if that was the only payoff from "bounties" and you don't get money for it. maybe unless you sell it. that would give all the weird skins more meaning as well as you could better understand why they are there.

dam you got the juice flowing again with your suggestion 😄

[night sinew]

😅👍

[wary spire]

#game-ideas message

[flat sandal]

awesome, just got killed by katana from 2m away. too many bs death become offputting really quick

[empty oasis]

Only after the match is over

[floral nova]

It has been suggested many times. It's clearly a nice feature, but implementing it has a cost and is not that immediate. I hope they planned for it in the august update.

[thin remnant]

Hive bomb is so good bro I feel like it just overshadows other explosives

recently I've just been bringing double hive bomb instead of hive bomb and a frag or other explosive

although other explosives are probably better at kills, i tend to use them to push enemies out of their position anyway

or distract them while i push

#game-ideas message why is this disliked

[empty oasis]

Because it completely negates one of the balancing downsides of duals

[thin remnant]

They take two slots

oh wait

quartermaster

lmao

I kinda wrote the dualy thing subconciously the main recommendation was just dropping in general

do you think the dualy thing is the only reason its disliked?

[empty oasis]

Most likely

I'd recommend just deleting and reposting. People, being as they are, will frequently just hop on the train and downvote because theres already downvotes

[thin remnant]

lol, i really think dropping would be good

isnt reposting banned

[empty oasis]

I'll give it a go ahead this time. I shouldve removed it before because it was more than 1 idea in a post

[floral nova]

I dunno, people seem to dislike every kind of change 😂

[thin remnant]

Am I allowed to send multiple ideas in one post?

Just a bunch of qol changes

Pinging on the map, dropping items, etc

[empty oasis]

One idea per post

[thin remnant]

k

so uh

i made a post about pinging from the map like a year ago

would posting that idea again be not allowed

[floral nova]

pinging on the map yes, but only on the map and not synced on 3D, eh. I'm watching ya.

[thin remnant]

why not on 3d

[floral nova]

https://tenor.com/view/tommy-walking-pathos-tommy-walking-pathos-peaky-blinders-peaky-blinders-gif-22139139

because it detaches you too much from the environment

[empty oasis]

I'm not sure if there's a time limit tbh but if you already have one then I'd just link to it here if you want discussion

[floral nova]

@thin remnant 👀

[floral nova]

wow that post has 38/3/4

the refuse ress is not bad too

I think the best is the spyglass rework, but that's not mine #game-ideas message

It sould really be this think https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stereoscopic_rangefinder

[thin remnant]

Here's mine #game-ideas message

not very good lol

[floral nova]

wait, I could have linked the wrong one

I mean the one with the split vision

[thin remnant]

i have an idea for a spyglass rework

idk if this is what ur suggesting rn

but make it into one of those ones that can peek over cover

could make it a little more useful

[floral nova]

probably an analogic implementation of this would be fine, without the game tellign you the exact distance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stadiametric_rangefinding

[floral nova]

I've linked the post here

[floral nova]

deathmatch?

I meant this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coincidence_rangefinder Invented in 1778

given the short distances, we could have a small version, more portable

[queen jungle]

Spectating is already inaccurate and not great for finding cheaters, a replay would be worse judged by replays we've had in CryEngine games in the past.

[floral nova]

@uncut loom #game-ideas message
This would need to have a random output place, or else all the out places would be trapped as hell 😂

[tribal wyvern]

It's the recommended way by Crytek themselves.
To add a bit more. If the player actively tries to hide it, ye might be difficult.
But blatant cheaters theres no issues finding with spectate.

The latest update video was quite disappointing. Left alot to be desired.
In no other multiplayer game when i find cheaters do i need to go through so many hoops just to get someone banned.

It's like please fill in these 10 rows of information, contact support, upload a video to youtube, then give us link.

Why can't the ingame report just collect timestamp, region, etc
Then give you a website ticket number, where you can add more information should you want to.

Would make hella alot more sense.
Atleast theres some steps they're working on. But theres no information what this new team did since last winter. Just buzz words.

People who actively looked for cheaters didn't notice much of a change when they were in the works.

But i do like that Crytek actually admitted that ping do matter & makes games unfair if theres a big difference between yours & the opponents.

[uncut loom]

You can choose a location in a certain area 😉

[floral nova]

eeeh, that's too powerful

hunt leverages a lot on the fact that you can control an area, hearing others approaching

being able to get anywhere without notice would disrupt the gameplay

you could have a sound and have it in advance. It would be less OP but still, the gameplay would be completely changed

[thin remnant]

Wait did you...
Did you thumbs up your own suggestion

[uncut loom]

Yes, i did. What a shame. JK, wanted to the reaction system; It was my first post and i got confused with already 1 vote on every Emoji. Next time, i dislike my post 😉

[thin remnant]

Ok lol fair enough
I'll hold you to your word btw, if you dislike your next post I'll like it if I remember to despite if I think it's good or not

IF I remember

[uncut loom]

Try to think of it as a larger version of Shadowleap. But it's probably too OP.

[floral nova]

@thin remnant #game-ideas message wait, explain to me the think about bulletgrubber

also, isn't that post more a #feedback than a #game-ideas ?

@coarse breach #game-ideas message I like to compress all infos just when I am ressed, in case I get killed again. E.g. "spark sniper poison 31m!"

but if you're on discord you're OP vs who's not

[hot vigil]

Every weapon in hunt will remain in Ironsmith/scope if you hold down the shoot button after a shot.
It is only when you release it your Hunter starts to cycle the next shot.
So Hunt have a mechanic to not lose a bullet if you shoot, keep holding down the shoot button and then press reload.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QL7Xvd5VjOk

[floral nova]

THE FUCK? Why I didn't know that? Is it a glitch or an official design point?

[hot vigil]

Offical design that got added later

Personally I don't like it as it kinda removes the thing that made long ammo have a downside

[floral nova]

this video says you have to re-tap R during the reload

ok https://youtu.be/Bho9TT_-eMc

[dusky tapir]

Hold down the Fire button to prevent the action from cycling. Press R to initiate the reload

Alternatively, hold down Reload after firing to queue a reload without chambering a fresh round

..

This does not work with semi automatic firearms and - to my knowledge - likely wont work with levering

[rotund obsidian]

yeah levering just keeps shooting if you hold the fire button, so that won't work

[queen jungle]

You don't have to go through those hoops. Press the report button, select a reason, give a description, done.

[tribal wyvern]

Ye if i want nothing to happen sure or i want the guy banned in 10 months. They're not asking for all that information because it's funny.

[queen jungle]

Using the report button creates a cheater report just like a manual report on the website. There is no difference whatsoever between people reported via the button vs those reported on the website. Crytek's customer support has the tools necessary to identify cheaters even without videos and stuff.

[tribal wyvern]

So David wanting us to give timestamps etc, is according to you pointless ?

Because the tools already exists. If so, somebody should tell him.

And him asking for further evidence, like video, is again, pointless ?

I'm genuinly curious, because he wants us to jump through all those hoops on reports.

[queen jungle]

I don't know why he'd say that, except maybe for making customer support's work easier when people send in videos/streams.

What I wrote above is what we were told to tell people publicly when I was still a mod for Crytek and I'd be surprised if that massively changed over the past two months for some reason.

[tribal wyvern]

For some reason finding hunt showdowns youtube channel is an adventuer in and of itself so i timestamped Huuges video because it came up as i searched for hunt showdown
https://youtu.be/WM79gW9gk9g?t=503

They want Game ID, exact time, time zone & region you played in.

[queen jungle]

Makes sense since otherwise they'd have to search through endless logs for the match you're reporting.

Using the report button most likely includes all that info automatically

[tribal wyvern]

That last part is not mentioned in the video.

[dusky tapir]

"just to report someone who's cheating" - that's just bullshit on the video author's part

[tribal wyvern]

And if you want to bring a video, you HAVE to go to the website

[vital drum]

That's only relevant for when you report someone using the exploit that prevents you from giving support their SteamID

[tribal wyvern]

Afaik not mentioned either.

[dusky tapir]

the report process could def go smoother, although I can't think of any other game that allows you to attach report data from in-game

[queen jungle]

You can trust Arricado if he tells you

[tribal wyvern]

Ye i know, i'm just saying

[dusky tapir]

I have a feeling you misunderstood the point addressed in the video.

the very first thing addressed in the video is using the in-game report feature.

[tribal wyvern]

Watch it & make your own assumption.

[dusky tapir]

https://youtu.be/HZuKaAHkxdQ?feature=shared&t=156

[vital drum]

There's a reason why support only asks you for SteamID and David talks about explots and hidden statistics right after going over the additional information you can supply with the report.

[tribal wyvern]

ye and to provide a video you do by website no?
And video is requested to help identify cheater.

And then you need to jump through those hoops regardless.

Why the ingame doesn't make a ticket for you to add additional info to is quite interesting when they want more info.

[vital drum]

I agree that it's not worded in the most clear way, but we added information about that to the #customer-support channel specifically after the appearance of this exploit and the rise in complaints about players feeling like they can't report through customer support if a player has their profile hiddden.

On the topic of providing additional info, you can do so in the text window of your in-game report.

[flat sandal]

if they come through with the plan to give feedback on reports this all changes anyway

[flat sandal]

the way we percieve that stuff that is

this topic gets annoying tbh, there are cheaters and ppl who make them, ppl are outraged and devs have to manoeuvre this bs somehow. It's not rocket science so take of your tin foil hats y'all and assume that the people who make games are trying to make the best of a bad situation.

also finding a contradictions in statements doesn't mean sh*t

[empty oasis]

@vernal canyon #game-ideas message

Why would it get split shotgun ammo? That makes no sense

Split rifle ammo is fine

[vernal canyon]

because drillings in real life have split shotgun ammo

a lot of them

pretty sure

I'll change it

[vital fractal]

We just had a discussion about a drilling shotgun

It’s literally just a Rival Plus unless the damage on its long barrel is so poor that there’s no reason to use it

In fact with 190 damage, it’ll be the worst performing Long Barrel buckshot shotgun beyond the crown or, if medium barrel, just slightly better than a Terminus- in which case, why bother with the thing?

As said in the last discussion, it’s a cool gun yes- it just doesn’t have a defined place among the current arsenal tbh

[queen jungle]

Yeah I'll believe it when I see it. People are going to find something else to complain about, it's always been that way.

[flat sandal]

true but if done right, the way the player base judges the efforts can clear a certain threshold I think. hopefully the "task force" doesn't turn into a meme. No pressure 😄

[unborn dagger]

@bitter jewel Seriously it happens way too frequently.

[bitter jewel]

i need to control myself not to burn these players. Someone of them are running directly to an exit

[unborn dagger]

I've had that happen as well. Right next to an extraction and they decide to extract immediately

[vital fractal]

I mean it may suck but like at the same time it’s their choice

[thin remnant]

@vernal canyon #game-ideas message
Too similar to rival with the shotgun barrel, maybe nerf the cycle time so rival keeps its identity and stays "the two tapper" shotgun

I also don't think it should have slugs tbh

[stark fulcrum]

I actually like flams idea. The drilling should've been 2 shotgun 1 rifle from the start imo

The real life models are that way most of em

[thin remnant]

Well yeah I like it too, but it shouldn't overshadow the rival.
Stats could use some work

[stark fulcrum]

True

I do love my rival as well

Could maybe separate through ammos and price

Idk

[thin remnant]

I mean, buckshot rival still shouldn't be overshadowed by buckshot this thing. Ammo types aren't a reason to ignore balance.
I think the cycle time should be nerfed as I've said, that's kinda rivals whole thing

Maybe reload speed is reduced too idk, wanna make sure rifle barrel doesn't overshadow Springfield or anything either haha

It's tricky at this point with how many weapons there are trying not to make others pointless (cough cough pax)

[stark fulcrum]

We are sadly past that lol. We have a lot of weapons you gotta ask yourself why use it over something else around the same price.

Yeah pax is kinda there

Tru shot is beast though

[vital fractal]

Pax has its position, it’s just the ammo options on it/the Schofield obscures it

Again, crytek has been bulking variants and custom ammos a bit too much for too long now- they desperately need to lose some ammos at minimum

[unborn sandal]

Crytek just needed to not do the special ammo explosion

When everything only had 2 or maybe 3 types of special it would make you use say a vetterli if you want medium ammo hv

Now if you want medium ammo hv you have 3 3 slot options and 2 pistol options

they needed to keep it so only 1 or 2 weapons had each special ammo type per caliber

[vernal canyon]

alr

[thin remnant]

^ this.

[unborn sandal]

@tidal sand with you 100% this ping change is bullshit

[tardy rapids]

Jesus christ this channel should be renamed to "complaining about every mechanic"

"Solo necro is op it's way too fast of a recovery, and um it's too low of perk points 🤓"
"I want region locking because I'm vsing so many Chinese players"
"This guy is definitely cheating he killed me and is better"
Only legitimate complaint would be cheaters just add a replay of 10 to 15 seconds to a kill cam and it would fix reporting these players easier. And if they get banned and come back crytek gets more money since they have to buy the game again or an account rust has the same problem. Every online multiplayer game has people connecting from other countries deal with it or play around it. As for necromancer there are beyond so many counters to it just use them, concertina, burning etc. If you wanna nerf reviving altogether limit revives to 2 per person and only get more with bounty equipped at the cost of health chunks. (I only agree with too many revives per person 4 is so fucking many )

P.S. "ping abusers" lmfao the guy connecting from Australia doesn't have anyone to play with he just wants to play the game after a work shift. Majority of the time it's because their region has no players (there are exceptions to the rule but they make up 2% at most of the total population those are the "ping abusers"). God this game has complainers like league.

[unborn sandal]

Vindicator I agree with you about the ping thing I’m not complaining about “ping abusers” I complaining that they’re lowering ping limits and blocking out oce and sa players

[thin remnant]

The channel is literally for giving feedback on the game.. If it maddens you that much don't read it lmao

[tardy rapids]

Constructive feedback =/ complaining constantly. And as you said I'm giving feed back

Now if it was renamed to complaining discussions that'd make a lot more sense. Rarely does this channel and feedback actually have well formulated feedback. Majority of the time it's just complaints (Of issues that will not change people complaining about ping abusers in a multiplayer game lol. Region locks only work for bigger population games otherwise those "region locked servers have no players") not actual feedback such as "Unga bunga necro bad" which defeats the purpose of the channel.

Suggestion ideas actually has people giving feedback/ideas to add. This channel is supposed to be discussing them when like 8/10 times there's always a conversation in here about the same 3 topics I listed earlier which just becomes a complaining channel call it "game rant" or something.
(Don't get me wrong it's fine to complain at times but if it's the same topic everyday why play the game if it frustrates you?)

[thin remnant]

Just because someone's feedback is bad doesn't mean it isn't meant to be constructive.

Someone can try to make a good suggestion and fail

[tardy rapids]

So it's complaining and not feedback

[thin remnant]

No?

[tardy rapids]

Yes

If I type in feedback

[flat sandal]

perhaps they should add to the sticky that they are well aware of the issues by now and delete all feedback about ping abuse etc. I would't judge them. just phrase it properly so the angry person feels heard 😄

[tardy rapids]

"Unga bunga add ping limit I hate vsing Chinese people"

[thin remnant]

Complaining = BRO THIS GUYS HACKING HE KILLED ME WAHHH
Bad feedback = Medkits are too strong you should increase the price due to high pick rate

[tardy rapids]

Hey buddy

[thin remnant]

yeah and thats a legitimate complaint for them, just cause it doesnt effect you doesnt mean they cant speak their mind

[tardy rapids]

That's all of feedback rn

That ain't feedback

You just admitted it's complaining

[thin remnant]

i admitted theyre not the same thing

[tardy rapids]

❔

[thin remnant]

you said that failing to make a good suggestion isnt feedback, my argument is that it is, just not good feedback

do you remember what you wrote lol

[tardy rapids]

I do remember what I wrote

And the example I gave of bad feedback

Was the complaining example you typed

Not the medkit one

I know the difference between the two

[thin remnant]

i misunderstood ig

[tardy rapids]

Half of feedback channel is people "complaining" about adding ping limitation lol

[thin remnant]

I've personally never seen it, but if people do that that's a bit silly goofy

i misunderstood you mb

[tardy rapids]

Np if you scrolled up in feedback

You can see 3 posts about ping limitation about adding and not adding it

Idk I feel like it defeats the purpose of a feedback channel

[hot vigil]

Yes, which makes sense.
As not wanting/wanting it is a feedback.

[tardy rapids]

If complaints are flooded through it

[thin remnant]

stuff about pax
shotgun drilling
Extracting issues
cheaters

i found the cheater complaints

lemme see if they look like good complaints

[flat sandal]

ping limit happens a lot as well

cause of the trade window i guess

[tardy rapids]

Frequency of an issue brought up only to complain should just be a complaint channel

Otherwise I don't think they actually take it seriously

[thin remnant]

i dont see a problem with nerdings feedback

[tardy rapids]

Which tbh their updates show they don't

[hot vigil]

Sure and people have their reason to voice their opinion about ping limit.
I don't agree with their standpoint or opinion.
But its feedback.

[tardy rapids]

Complaints =/ feedback

Complaints = opinions which is fair

[thin remnant]

If someone complains about necromancer being too strong and they want it to be nerfed, that is by definition feedback

even if their take is garbage

@tardy rapids can you link me a message that you would consider complaining and not feedback

[tardy rapids]

The point I made was the same washed up feedback that gets typed like "Necro op nerf"

[thin remnant]

so i can see what u mean

[tardy rapids]

Why did you @ me? Lol

I can see you typing

[thin remnant]

cause im talking specifically to you

[tardy rapids]

Go for it tho idm

Sure one sec

#feedback message

#feedback message

#feedback message

#feedback message

[hot vigil]

All of that are feedback.
Might not be well constructed or well worded feedback, but it is feedback.

[tardy rapids]

#feedback message

I don't take anyone seriously who considers complaints as feedback sorry mate

At that point it's just spam

Which is why they don't take it seriously

[thin remnant]

I don't agree with these peoples takes at all

I think they're both feedback and complaining

[hot vigil]

That is to crytek decide if their feedback is unfounded or not.

[thin remnant]

cause they are giving feedback on how they think the game could be better, but yes they are complaining

[tardy rapids]

Thank you captain obvious

[hot vigil]

And yes it is presented badly

[tardy rapids]

As for you

[thin remnant]

uh oh

[unborn sandal]

Complaint and feedback aren’t antonyms. There’s some overlaps

[thin remnant]

whats he gonna do to me

[tardy rapids]

Ima just say it again my original point

[unborn sandal]

You don’t have to offer a solution for it to be feedback

[tardy rapids]

Just make this channel the "complaints" channel

Lol

[hot vigil]

Yes, but you being an arbiter for "right and wrong" feedback just makes you seem dismissive.

[thin remnant]

But all the things people say are feedback, yes some are complaints but not all of them, but they're all feedback. So feedback works perfectly.

[tardy rapids]

The original point of this discussion before you jumped in

[unborn sandal]

I agree that people shouldn’t just be whining in there and should be trying to offer solutions but what can you do

[tardy rapids]

Was pointing out this channel being used more for complaints lately rather then feedback

[tardy rapids]

This^

But incoming cat man to say

But it's feedback

[hot vigil]

Again what is the difference between a complaint and a feedback?

When does one start and one end?

[unborn sandal]

a complaint is feedback. As much as I don’t like most of McRee’s takes they are right

[tardy rapids]

Big difference between the two is one provides constructive feedback on the negatives aspect about a mechanic intended for a game. And before you get antsy phislophy major. Complaints are opinions formulated by someone to convey their message via frustration.

One is logical the other is frustration

Which is why filtering spam exists in customer service

[thin remnant]

im outta here lol

[tardy rapids]

If you wish to agree with an opinion about being right feel free to! Doesn't make them factual as his points are argumentative.

[unborn sandal]

Probably wise

[tardy rapids]

🍿

[hot vigil]

Yes there is difference between feedback and constructive feedback.
But complaining can be part of both of them.
Example: "I'm fucking tired of this reload bug that have persisted in the game for 8 months now, I hope those monkies at Crytek pull the finger out of each other arses and start fixing the FUCKING issue! Because it makes me don't wanna play the game!"
Sure it is negative, complaining and not offer a constructive solution.
But it is still a feedback: "This long lasting bug ruins my enjoyment of the game"

And that is what smart people can do, deprive meaning from text

[tardy rapids]

Refer back to my previous statement as to why filtering spam exists

And last notation as you seem the 🤓 to argue incentives no this applies to the original argument which you half way butted in without reading prior. (I am assuming so based on you arguing only the incentive about feedback and complaints).

Anyway toodaloo!

[hot vigil]

No, I just STRONGLY disagree in your nonchalant way of dividing complaints from feedback and lack of understanding and nuance even "complains" can provide.

[tardy rapids]

You argue incentives rather focus on the actual point of the argument. Anyway have a wonderful night.

[tribal wyvern]

@unborn sandal
Well Crytek have themselves confirmed & admitted that pings do matter & makes the games unfair.

So clearly it's not as innocent as you think.
In this case i'd rather trust the developers of the game, than you.

[flat sandal]

Gotta say, having the dicord open while playing actually makes the game better^^

did they say it makes it unfair?

[tribal wyvern]

Yes

[tardy rapids]

Crytek have also defended keeping the crosshair lowered and not fixing the spread on shotguns to match the crosshair as it makes game design better.

[hot vigil]

While I'm not sure about "unfair" is the right word, but yes, like literally any other (real time) game is affected by ping, so I'm amazed some people don't think that applies to hunt.

[tribal wyvern]

Not at home so can't check the video for timestamps. But David mentions it in the video when talking about ping limits.

[tribal wyvern]

Their words, Again i'm trusting developers more than people throwing opinions & videos around in the discord.

[tardy rapids]

Fair. However, crytek themselves have also fumbled in some regards

[tribal wyvern]

I'm refering to ping abuse deniers/believers, who posts videos back and forth.

[flat sandal]

but.. but... I thought we established that a high ping isn't an advantage TT

[hot vigil]

Sure, I was also agreeing that NOT having a ping limit is weird choice that affects the quality of the game matches

[tribal wyvern]

Ye ye i'm not saying you're wrong

I was just specifying

[tardy rapids]

Advantage probably not. Annoying yes

[hot vigil]

It's a double edge sword, it give some good and some bad.
That is crux of the issue, it just make the match worse for everyone.

[flat sandal]

yes, I thought it's more about that

[tardy rapids]

Necro situation all over

[unborn sandal]

“Our intention is to keep matches as fair as possible” is all they said, which is pretty vague. This whole thing with the ping is just to appease the community frankly.

[tribal wyvern]

So you implement a change to make things fair, is that not implying that something might be unfair?

[flat sandal]

100% fair in any situation would be 0 ping

and you have to balance ping limits with accessibility for players

[tribal wyvern]

I can't watch video atm, at work. So can check later

[hot vigil]

Think actually just equal ping is what matters. Sure lower to 0 the more "consistent" it will feel.
But if both players have a 50 ping or even a 200 ping it would be equally fair too.

[crystal plume]

There's also a difference between something feeling unfair and something actually being unfair, dying to high ping players doesn't feel good since you can pretty much always tell but when looking at the interaction objectively, nothing was actually in their benefit compared to if they had lower ping as all they experienced was a delayed interaction

[unborn sandal]

The problem is that fair is such a vague term. The only thing that ping can do which might be deemed unfair is force trades to happen more often in some situations, which really is not much of an advantage unless you can’t get kills at all

[hot vigil]

But it is tho? turning a one sided kill into a trade is always better in team play.

(for the person who would otherwise had died)

[unborn sandal]

The higher trade window works both ways though

[flat sandal]

I#m not good with that stuff but I have a feeling it may depend on the situation. even with same ping if one is aiming and one running behind or out of cover or whatever. but you may be well right 😄

[tribal wyvern]

My question is why do people play on servers with higher ping intentionally ?
Not just in Hunt, but in other games to.

There is something to gain, maybe theres a lose to. But i think denying that it makes any difference at all i think is blatantly wrong.

[floral nova]

Can someone ELI5 why high ping would give you benefits?

[tribal wyvern]

And David did not say "we want to make games feel more fair."
He wants to make the game more fair.

[crystal plume]

It doesn't really

[tribal wyvern]

Maybe a buzzword to make it sound better

But thats speculation

[unborn sandal]

If you have high ping sometimes you get a trade that you don’t deserve and sometimes the enemy gets that trade. It doesn’t benefit the person with high ping any more than the person with low ping, it just benefits the person that shot last in real time

[crystal plume]

Removing trades also won't make the game objectively more fair, the main reason behind the increase in trades is their change to allowing projectiles to exist after a person was deemed dead server side. Before that change was made we received a lot more "hitreg issue" reports which were 99% of the time cases of their shot being invalidated because they died right after which was/felt unfair to them however you want to see it

Basically there is no "everyone's happy" solution

Not that you could entirely remove trades either way since there's situations irrevelant of ping that lead to trades

[unborn sandal]

I think they’ve made the best of the cards they were dealt as is currently

Lowering the ping limit is a mistake

They just need to be more transparent with the community on why things are the way they are

[tribal wyvern]

Trades are not in and of itself a more fair/less fair. It's how the trade happened.

[crystal plume]

I'm fine with lowering the ping limit as long as it's something reasonable

Lowest I would go is 180

[tribal wyvern]

If someone can shoot you 3 seconds after, thats prob not as fair.
But if you both shot at the same time, it's fair that you both died.

[crystal plume]

No offense but I doubt you experience 3 second delays or if you do then it's extremely rare or caused by something on your end as well, possibly packet loss or such

Only times I have seen extended delays is when packet loss was involved

[unborn sandal]

I know people in Australia and the Philippines that get 200 on us west and play that as their main server because oce is dead. Lowering the ping limit to 180 wouldn’t affect me personally but I think it would do more harm than good

[crystal plume]

I mean if they were limited to their region then more of them would play on their own region as well 😄

Combined with the expected player count increases, I don't think it would be a problem necessarily

The issue of their region being "dead" only gets worse with them playing on other regions

[unborn sandal]

It would probably be pretty difficult to code but if they were able to calculate the lowest mean ping region for a team and allow them to play on that region regardless of their ping that would probably be the best way to go about it

[floral nova]

hehe, I actually want an explaination from the people that think it does

[tribal wyvern]

It was just an exaggerated example

Not an actual realistic event

[crystal plume]

Well, exaggerating doesn't really help with the argument 😅

[tribal wyvern]

It was mostly just to point out that trading itself isn't what makes a fight fair.
But the timespan allowed.

If in cases where the time is very long, it's not fair that someone can still trade while having so much lagg.
But when you have similar ping, it is a fair trade.

In this case, an exaggerated example doesn't harm the argument.

[floral nova]

I remember that Overwatch dev said that making so that who shoots is right, is the best solution. Because you hate if you see your bullet hitting someone and them not dieing, but not so much if you think another player shouldn't have hit you and you die.

[tribal wyvern]

As it should be. Playing in other regions should be something rare, rather than the norm.
You should not on your own be able to change region. But if someone invites you to play, you should be able to, if they're in that region.

Already this way you'd massively decrease the amount of asians in US, or EU in Asia etcetc.
People can work around it, sure i guess. But they probably can now aswell even without the restriction. But i guess the point is to make it alot harder.

If ping really had 0 effect, didn't matter, why even have regions to begin with ? Just make it 1 big open region for everyone,

[crystal plume]

Because you generally still want to have good ping yourself?

[tribal wyvern]

Why? Ping doesn't matter in pvp.

[crystal plume]

Things feel delayed and not as snappy

Even meleeing grunts feels worse when you have high ping

[tribal wyvern]

Ye but you'd have 10x better queue times, mmr will be more balanced, bigger pool.
All you give up is that the game feels less snappy.

My point is ping matters, for you, for your enemies.

It's an important aspect, that it is as low as possible, a close to yours as possible.
We cannot affect people paying for a 10mb/s internet or a 1000mb/s.
But we can affect where in the world you play against or with.

I think there is a reason why people play with high ping willingly.
Maybe to piss you off, maybe theres some advantages. There is something.

[rotund obsidian]

I figure it's generally more of a "i want (filled lobbies, better matchmaking, etc) and the game doesn't really punish me for having high ping enough so it's worth it to swap regions"

[tribal wyvern]

Might be

But people do it in other games to, that arn't dead

[rotund obsidian]

most shooters will just eat your shots if they reach the server after your death, but since hunt doesn't, a lot more people are willing to play at higher ping

[tribal wyvern]

Or well dead is an exaggeration, but low pop

[tribal wyvern]

Ye not allowing trades above like 150ping or something would pretty much stop that.

Crytek has, if they collect such data, what ping people have when they queue cross regions.
See what that ping is, block the shit out off it.

[rotund obsidian]

quite frankly i dont think the game should allow trades just because your ping is high, but that's kind of a whole other thing

[analog sigil]

The game allows trades because people cry about bad hitreg

Maybe the same people that now cry about ping limits

[hot vigil]

Well, maybe if they cannot go to the other side of the world the OCE servers wouldn't be dead? 🤷

[unborn sandal]

If they do lower ping limit the people that queue on us west from Oceania will probably just stop playing. I’ve seen that sentiment very widespread

[hot vigil]

Okay, but then they those people killed the game for themselves not the ping limit

[unborn sandal]

I don’t think you understand just how dead Oceania and South America servers are. During peak times you get two teams in a lobby

[hot vigil]

Again, if everyone is NOT playing there

Ofc they are dead

Like it is a death spiral of "no one is playing there, so I'm gonna bounce server"

[unborn smelt]

even if they play there, the population is just far smaller than the others.

which means wider Matchmakling brackets

which means less fair matchmaking

[thin remnant]

@sullen wraith #game-ideas message
I like this, but what happens to starshell?
I feel like it's already weak enough, could keep strong burning imo

[unborn smelt]

I'm fairly confident however they can still choose a better populated server than their own tho, but we'll need to wait and see how exactly it will look

[hot vigil]

Sure, but you ain't growning one if you keep not playing there

[unborn sandal]

This just the chicken or the egg problem

Did the low pop or the moving to other servers happen first

There’s not really a way to know

[thin remnant]

Unrelated, but pretty sure the chicken came first

Although it depends what you think counts as an egg.

[unborn sandal]

If they do this ping change and fuck over Oceania players then there’s no going back

the Oceania players quit hunt

As I’ve seen many say they will do

[hot vigil]

Okay

but then

like

that is their choice

[thin remnant]

I hope they don't, we have enough trouble finding matches already.

[hot vigil]

Lmao

If people don't wanna play on their own server that is provided I struggle to see how that is bad?
Small communities exists for so many games.

[unborn sandal]

Not ones with sbmm

crytek is the one creating this problem and alienating Oceania and SA players if they do decide to go through with this

[unborn smelt]

While i agree with you on a personal level, in the video they said they do want to allop people to still play with friends and that you may not be able to play with people all the way across the world anymore

[hot vigil]

and you can argue they are alienating people who plays on their own server and gets a worse match experience due to high ping?

Like

[unborn smelt]

this doesn't sound like they lock people into their regions to me, just further increase restrictions

Which i'm not a fan of personally, but i understand why they'd do it

[unborn sandal]

I live in na west. I play with friends in Europe. If I can’t do that anymore, I’m not gonna be a happy camper

[unborn smelt]

I agree

[sullen wraith]

Maybe, but since the developers have now equated the starshell ammo with the signal pistol charges, it would be logical to weaken them as well

[hot vigil]

Well, I mean, most likely you both gonna be able to queue into NAE then

[thin remnant]

What? I don't understand

you mean the flare gun?

[sullen wraith]

yep)

[thin remnant]

Imo starshell should be stronger than flare gun

even if not realistic, from a gameplay pov at least

[sullen wraith]

You're probably right, but then again those ammo are now being added up, so in the context of the proposal would also be weakened. Or would need to separate them again)

[thin remnant]

That's a fair point

idk I feel like most people don't bring starshell AND flare, starshell is mostly used to save up a tool slot that would be otherwise occupied by flare, so i dont think itd make much of a difference

[sullen wraith]

Yes I think the use of this ammo is quite rare, much more profitable to take dragon's breath)

[thin remnant]

^

feel like its only good on short barrel cause db has no range

[lemat]

[astral citrus]

me and some lads began memeing over king and crown shorty, and what effects it would imply to the game, is this a bad idea?

[queen jungle]

@hot vigil sorry buddy I don't have notifications on, but yes it did get nerfed, it was quick as hell when it first came out

[astral citrus]

what got nerfed?

[hot vigil]

Oh I know, just not sure if your suggestion is a good or bad one :)

[queen jungle]

@empty oasis sorry bud don't have notifications on, it's spread was loosened and pellets made to be more random. Go look at old patch notes if you boys think I'm wrong 🤷‍♂️

[hot vigil]

I think muffle/silencing jumping with lightfoot is too much.
It is the premium tool to dodge headshots and I think the sound emitted from jumping is fair for that.

[queen jungle]

@hot vigil it's okay if you think that, I've had several suggestions be implemented into the game, I've been giving them since alpha ☺️

You can thank me for the poison trap lingering cloud 😘

[thin remnant]

Never heard of suggestions actually getting added

[hot vigil]

Yeah me too, again wouldn't mind a point reduction to the current lightfoot, think 4 points are fair, if it goes down 3 it just feel too crowded with all the other 3 point traits lol.

[hot vigil]

I suggested the Berth :V

[thin remnant]

Huh cool

[hot vigil]

Other had ofc also done it before me, but it seemed like it kinda became what I wrote :p

[queen jungle]

@hot vigil lol we've been asking for the berth before 1.0 my guy 😅

[thin remnant]

They probs add things that they see a lot of people want

[hot vigil]

yes and no, as they David said himself, it is 33% part of the consideration : )

A lot of people can still have the same bad idea after all

[thin remnant]

I mean instead of one person recommending something, the biggest impact our suggestions have is just what they see in highest demand.
Necro change, burn change, that stuff, then figure out what needs to be done
That's what I think anyway

Not that they'll add something just cause a lot of people ask

[hot vigil]

Well, Necro haven't been changed since it got added.

And boi there is a lot of people that want it changed

Same with long ammo meta

[thin remnant]

Solo Necro was a change to necro

[hot vigil]

Yes and people wants changes to solo necro

[thin remnant]

Yeah a lot of people lol
We better stop talking about Necro, we all know what happens next

[hot vigil]

Haha yeah

But like all the other issues are slowly getting fixed

[astral citrus]

you guys hate solo necro that much?

[thin remnant]

OH NO

ITS HAPPENING

[astral citrus]

nono

i've been asking myself lots of times for ideas on how to approach solo necro, in terms of taking out solos effectivly.

[thin remnant]

Don't say the n word
(Haha yeah you know the n word I mean ok?)

[astral citrus]

necrophob

[hot vigil]

Don't hate it, just think necro in general is affecting Hunt's match quality.
But feel less strongly about (solo) necro as I feel about long ammo.

[astral citrus]

what about a skill that lets you burn the victim with dark sight, like inverted necromancer,

[thin remnant]

Sounds super strong

[astral citrus]

that also prevents them from resurrection

well idk

just a quick idea

[thin remnant]

Im gonna stop saying the word necromancer lol

[astral citrus]

the skill does the burning slower, but keeps them in place

bruh

[thin remnant]

Summons a debate about it every time
Not that I'm annoyed abt it btw just funny

[astral citrus]

to be frank, idm the necromancer skill

thought it was a topic of discussion

[thin remnant]

I mean it's not that bad

Yeah discuss it all U want idm

[hot vigil]

Issue is usually not the power (or lack of) or locking down solo necro, it is all the knock on effects it creates.
We had 2 cases of a pact (and its traits) breaking in half bc solo necro, the current burn meta is because of solo necro and dealing with solo necro takes a lot of time out of your match.
And worst thing is that solo necro ain't strong or OP, it is just a trait that makes both the solo and team think "well, this sucks!".

[thin remnant]

✓

[astral citrus]

thus why i'm fine with it

[analog sigil]

Nah

[thin remnant]

It's actually happening
What have I done

Imma head out btw have a good day/night

[hot vigil]

Again, I can see that, I just want it to be better.
So we remove the polarity of it and not risk breaking pacts traits in the future :)
But honestly think most of my solo necro gripes is even more the issue of MMR fuckery than anything else.

[astral citrus]

as in people who go on suicide missions just to drop in mmr?

[hot vigil]

That is one aspect, but the issue is more that even people who play well and wins can still just be in a standstill of MMR gain/loss.

If a trio player have a KDA of 1.5 per match, they will rise in MMR, but if a Solo have that, they will likely fall in MMR.

Even with 2KDA per. match.

[astral citrus]

i see your problem, i dont really think you can balance that off only based on necromancer

[hot vigil]

Well, there are some suggestions I favor:
1: Remove the inital MMR decay for solo matching into trios/duos, the argument is that solos now have a lot of tools (in form of solo traits) that makes the able to go head to head with similar MMR.
or
2: Tweak the gain/loss for solos that gets killed out of a fresh solo necro revive, some says reduce the MMR loss, other say negate it for 2 seconds. Just to lessen the blow of MMR decay for trying to go again from a losing position.

[astral citrus]

the first one sounds better compared to the second one, as for the second one, the duration can simply just be waited out before killed again.

[hot vigil]

I can see that, tho usually a solo dying from a failed revive usually die withing the first 2-3 seconds either to a hunter camping or a trap placed on them.
If they don't it is because they kill the hunter camping them.

[astral citrus]

yea, but that leaves the question, what duration should you give the mmr protection, if its 2 seconds the traps would kill you after the 2 seconds if they place constantina and poison traps goes off, thus still losing mmr, if on the other hand were lower mmr reduction between kills, you would be off safer. might even be a good option to mix the 2, but this might imply a big problem in balancing the mmr

you could also say that certain levels mmr, is locked off by the KDA

or is weighted by the KDA

[hot vigil]

Yeah, but that would be to start messing with the MMR system as a whole, which should be revised.
But then in that case I'd rather just wait for that happend to all types of play and go with the "quick fix" of no MMR reduction when queuing as a solo.

I think we have a major balance issue when solo into trios is seen as the "easy mode" for solos.

[astral citrus]

no mmr reduction, puh, thats a...

every bushcamper solos are gonna jump through the roof

[astral citrus]

maybe reduce the overall chance of getting into trio fights 🤔

[hot vigil]

Eeeeh, it was not the MMR reduction that did that to begin with.
Solos in trios were more sniper heavy when they didn't have solo necro.
So I believe that removing the MMR reduction will not change that aspect of play

Issue is more that a 5 star gets matched against 3 stars that just get murdered

[astral citrus]

a freewalking butcher with rifles

but yea, i dont really think you can change it by such means that it becomes more fair for everyone, other than reworking the mmr system by some mean

i've an idea, but i'm not sure how to put it into words

progression locked contracts for certain levels of mmr?

[hot vigil]

Huh=

?

[astral citrus]

hold on this is gonna take a while to explain

so instead of having one contract of where all players can enter, split them into 2, that follows certain rules, one for lower mmr, and one for higher mmr, could be split between mmr 4 and 5, the contract from 4 mmr and below is the one we know of so far, that follows the standard rules; the one above mmr 4, rewards more dollars

e.g.

it can be discussed if it needs to be these exact rules, but its only a general idea

this would natuarlly push good players out of the newer player games

[hot vigil]

Don't really think that would solve anything, bc high rank players will still go to low rank lobbies and mop the floor.
Winning consitntly a 400 HD payout is better than getting a 1000 HD payout every 4-5 game.

[astral citrus]

then make it so when you reach mmr 5, you cant go to low contracts

mmr 4 can decide between the 2, and mmr 3 and below can only take low contracts

[astral citrus]

and i highly doubt that people would actually do it for the hd's, as for the most part you would still earn a crap ton of hd even without the bounty

i almost got a mil

[hot vigil]

Yeah, still think it to over complicate it, think it is just better to expect people to play against people on their skill level :p

[signal mural]

To all the people worried about a ping limit... Calm down. Crytek hasn't made any clear ruling on the new ping limit and they will probably be lenient. Let's see where they add more servers and how low they set the ping limit. 250+ was way too high - I would hope we can all agree on that.

As for Oceania, maybe it wouldn't be so dead if you all played on it? 😛

[astral citrus]

yea, its the same expectation you would have when you get 2 new cats, will they fight or not, it's a 50/50

[hot vigil]

In my humble opinion, solos in trios should be rare and feared when they are there due to the prowess it takes to be successful there.
Solo necro removed that.

[astral citrus]

if you remove necro, people just gonna be mad

[hot vigil]

Did I said I wanted to do that :V

[astral citrus]

sorry misread

[signal mural]

I'd honestly be okay with that.

[astral citrus]

yea i agree

weighing the chances of solos fighting against trios should be considered

[vital fractal]

Solo necro didn’t remove the prowess lmao

I’m sorry but as someone who solos trios a lot, unless you are sniping from 200 meters or on top of a large building (usually with traps), you get downed, you are usually screwed necro or not

The flare gun exacerbates this issue, since it usually goes a little like this

hunter death noise
0.01 seconds later
Flare gun goes off
YOU ARE BURNING

It may feel annoying or even blood boiling when a solo stands back up and manages to wipe your team but the amount of times that actually occurs is pretty low, per solo at least

Now, some solos will stand back up no matter what and yes that has MMR issues but at the same time I think that’s an MMR issue not Necro issue

[astral citrus]

hench why i think a skill should be added that locks people in place after death when manually activated

[vital fractal]

I don’t think that would be good

Just remove the MMR or adjust it

[rancid pebble]

What do you mean? Stops them getting revived or what?

[vital fractal]

If someone can capitalize on a very risky moment as the team is on top of them, let them

Again, MMR issue rather than current necro issue

[astral citrus]

a skill that burns hp at a slower rate than burning, using dark sight, but locks them in place from reviving

[vital fractal]

That’s just not a good idea for anyone imo

[rancid pebble]

So a skill that stops someone reviving but costs you health? Yeah. Nah.

That’s… I don’t like that idea

[vital fractal]

People complain about the 1 minute and 25 seconds of waiting on burn

[astral citrus]

you dont use your own hp

[vital fractal]

Any more would literally cause them to buss so hard

But any less and locking revive just removes the point of necro being allowed to play based on risk

I feel again, it’s just an MMR issue not necro issue

If there was a timer for MMR loss, it would be resolved overall

[rancid pebble]

THATS EVEN WORSE!?

[astral citrus]

remove the burning part then

you just lock them in place

[astral citrus]

ge man, it's just an openmind idea

[rancid pebble]

Permanently? What do you mean lock them in place?

[astral citrus]

let me try to make a senario based on the disagreements that changes of what you guys it shouldn't do

[rancid pebble]

If you can just stop someone reviving for no cost that defeats the whole purpose of necro in teams and solo.

I mean, at least with flare gun you need to take a tool

[hot vigil]

This I do think is a legit issue tho.
I wished we could knock out bodies quicker, I cannot not choose if a solo engages on my team while the boss is being banished. So if I clap the solo, I should be able to move on quickly without risking getting shot in the back of my head 3-5 minutes later.

[astral citrus]

let me talk out before you keep bombarding the very idea of this trait

you kill a solo, and can use darksight to lock them in place, the trait can only be activated when in close proximity to the death body weighted to 5 meters, as long you look at them they become locked

[rancid pebble]

I mean… I’m sorry but I think the idea itself is not good. I’m not trying to bombard you lol.

[astral citrus]

then let me speak first before you comment on it

and now i'm done

[rancid pebble]

So what’s the point? If you have to stay looking at them, all you do is deny them a chance to stand up as you burn them. Which you do already with guns. Except with guns, the solo has a SLIGHT chance to get back up if you miss. Which is fair.

[astral citrus]

its just a sure way

[rancid pebble]

As is guns.

[astral citrus]

i know

[vital fractal]

I mean, you have to wait whether it’s a solo or trio though- in fact a trio could wait just as long if you don’t burn

It’s just fair

[rancid pebble]

The only way a solo is standing up as you watch them is if you make a mistake. At which point, it is fair that the solo gets a chance to fight back.

[astral citrus]

like poison traps, there's also poison bombs

[rancid pebble]

Just seems redundant to me.

[astral citrus]

so is poison bombs

but the effect is the same as the poison traps

it's just another way to ensure a player to stay grounded

[hot vigil]

No, because a wiped trio cannot come back.
And most trios figth to the death and IF they run away, the longer they run away, the longer it takes to come back for the body, meaning a burning trio buddy will usually be down to 50-75 hp and that point most of trios just extract.

[rancid pebble]

And why is that needed?

As has been established, shooting them does the exact same thing, without the need for a trait.

[astral citrus]

dude, there are so many ways to kill a player in this game, why not add more to other factors of the game

why are you so against the idea?

just because you can kill a character reviving a player with guns, it doesnt mean it has to be the only way

[rancid pebble]

Because it is redundant. It isn’t needed, and what’s more, it doesn’t allow for any error on the side of those watching the body. If you are watching the body, you can miss. The solo MIGHT have a chance. With this perk, that’s it. Absolutely certain, they aren’t getting up. They don’t even get the slimmest chance.

[hot vigil]

Still think either:

• Let Solo Necro have a timer to get up, if that passes, the solo is out.
  OR
• Looting a solo will remove the ability to solo necro.

Realistically, if you are burned you ain't coming back 99 out of 100 times, because people know the meta and WILL wait.
And removing revive on looting is the same idea, just removing the need for insta burn meta.

[astral citrus]

not my problem

[rancid pebble]

Except it is, since you proposed the idea.

[astral citrus]

yes, but i also play as a solo, if i die by these means, i just accept the fate

it could be implemented into an event, if doing so, you gain extra event points, or steal their their event points

[rancid pebble]

Sure. Because you usually aren’t getting up. So I don’t see why another perk is needed for this one thing when guns do the same thing already. It’s pointless, and a waste of dev time and resources imo

[rancid pebble]

…by staring at a dead body?

[astral citrus]

expanding on the base game

[astral citrus]

yes

[hot vigil]

Yeah, I also disagree with a "fix" of "have trait to counter trait"

[rancid pebble]

So instead of watching them with guns you watch them in dark sight? How is that different?

[astral citrus]

actually like that idea

[astral citrus]

only one needs to be beside the body

[rancid pebble]

And only one needs to be by them with guns. Nothing changes.

[astral citrus]

and ensures the no cost of resources

[hot vigil]

Atm the issue not resources, but cost of time

And this doesn't fix that

[astral citrus]

then implement burning of health

with the trait

[rancid pebble]

If the player is seriously concerned about resources, they can stab the solo. That’s a none issue

[signal mural]

Yeah, because it is boring and the gameplay around it isn't fun even if the solo tries to revive.

Even with either fluses or f. pistol - it isn't a guarantee that they will be dead. Most hardcore solo necros take the full deal - Necromancer, Resilience, Bloodless, & Salveskin. They fix their health bars to be the max number of small bars. You light them, they revive - kill & relight, Self-revive, kill & relight (last fuse), Self-revive, kill... and they are still alive and now you either need to have looted some fire from them or go looking... or bury them in corcentina...

So you either dedicate a multitude of tools/consumables to kill a solo Necromancer (where there's usually more than one per server)... or sit and watch them... abandoning the bounty and/or risking enemies flushing you out of your death watch. It is boring. Worse if you have the bounty because then you don't have the luxury of waiting around to burn them out.

And everyone has to tolerate this so that Solo's can spend more time in the game and not be sent back to the menu...

[rancid pebble]

Which, again, is even worse, since it doesn’t require you to sacrifice ANYTHING to get rid of the solo. It’s not even burn and watch, it’s literally just sit and perma kill the solo. Not even the slightest risk.

[hot vigil]

Goes back to my points of:
Having a trait that exists to counter another trait is awful design.
and
The issue ain't we lack the tools to burn or lock down solos, but the process takes 1.5 to 2 min

[astral citrus]

man, you can either sacrifice time, or something else

[astral citrus]

that's the point of the trait, but modulate it

if you guys think its a bad idea, let it be at that

[signal mural]

You risk standing still and using dark sight. Which if you were fighting can be risky if other hunters are looking for the gunfight.

[astral citrus]

which is one of the pros and cons of the trait

[hot vigil]

Again, point one: a trait existing ONLY bc another trait is not good design.
It becomes a mandatory trait and another trait slot.

[astral citrus]

which is another point that needs thinking

it could also just be a burn trait

you burn a trait to permanently kill one

so you only get one chance

[rancid pebble]

So this trait is: faster than burning, costs nothing, garuntees a kill with zero risk… I don’t see the downside here.

[hot vigil]

Hence my solutions to improve the necro trait are either changing necro trait itself or is tool/weapon/consumable/trait agnostic

[signal mural]

Agreed. But Necromancer is almost mandatory for a solo... especially against other solos. Which is also, bad design. 1 extra down - fine. 5 lives in total? Nah, it's a joke...

[astral citrus]

what about making the necromancer trait do this on its own, but comes with the price that it permanently gets removed from the player in the playing session

mm

or maybe not

might be too much for one trait

[hot vigil]

Just do either one of my suggestion, it would literally solve it

lol

[astral citrus]

not entirely, but i see what you mean

[hot vigil]

What wouldn't it solve?

[astral citrus]

well if you remove the necro, it would change the entire playerbase around it

[rancid pebble]

Just limit the uses for a solo mid game. Best soloution imo

[astral citrus]

or change it by some means

[hot vigil]

I didn't say I would remove it tho?

[astral citrus]

changing the mmr would solve more than harm done

[astral citrus]

being divers

[hot vigil]

"being divers"?

[astral citrus]

thinking over a wider aspect of your idea on changing the necromancer

[rancid pebble]

I am so confused rn

[signal mural]

Using a trait slot for something that otherwise has zero functionality other than not dealing with solos. Oh and risking sitting in dark sight while others may be looking for you...

I get the lil_jim's idea. I'm not saying I agree with it but you're willfully not seeing the inherent danger.

[astral citrus]

i do see the danger of it

just trying to see what up and downsights there are

hench discussion

[hot vigil]

I don't think there is a need to overcomplicate the design process.
The (solo) necro issue shouldn't require wildly new mechanics or require new traits or tools.

[astral citrus]

which is fair

[rancid pebble]

I just think it’s unnecessary. I think staying still would be situational, and not applicable to a lot of situations.

The trait slot thing isn’t a huge deal imo.