feedback-discussion

[knotty ore]

The amount of fucking terrain you get stuck on for no reason in this game is insane. Crippled jumping for absolutely zero reason is horrible. Can you spend some time on making your game better please?

This game is unreasonably jank for 2023.

[alpine fractal]

@arctic jacinth literal skill issue, sorry but its true. Double chain pistol is actually pretty trash in pvp scenario

[arctic jacinth]

@alpine fractal I play console and I see it more often than I'd like, especially with dum dum ammunition. Trying to find a spot to stop bleeding while being fired at with over 30 rounds with barely any health to try and get away is more than aggravating

[alpine fractal]

Im on console too and i rarely see it. Maybe its popular lower mmr but at higher mmr u cant get away with using them because by the time u fire ur 2nd shot if you havent killed them then ur dead. If you’re having issues with them then use a slate and just 1 shot them before they can even fire a bullet

[arctic jacinth]

I sit around 4-5 mmr and I see it just often enough that I despise anyone and everyone that uses it. I always see them with dum dum, never anything else, so there's that extra heap of annoyance being constantly bled.

[royal grove]

we do it because it's really funny but it's also pretty risky to spam compact sooooo

[alpine fractal]

Tbh now ur making me want to use them ngl 😂

[fathom canyon]

Fix MMR pls

[vernal haven]

If it makes you feel any better, all dual wielding is losing half of its spare ammo in 1.13

Not counting what comes loaded in the guns

[warm zephyr]

@ocean lava do we not already have delay to fire for da pistols?

[unborn sandal]

No

[warm zephyr]

are you sure?

[unborn sandal]

Yes

You realize he means a delay after you click not the delay between shots

[royal horizon]

Which is a very bad idea, btw

[warm zephyr]

feels like there’s a delay though. DAs just doesn’t feel as snappy as SA in this game

[unborn sandal]

Right now the officer is just straight up better than the base nagant

Most things in this game are supposed to be a tradeoff

[balmy spindle]

whats wrongg with servers

??

im literally skating on map as my friend

[hardy coral]

Much prefer jump peeking to leaning.

[warm zephyr]

yeah buff base nagant not nerf the perfectly fine officer

[frozen crater]

the only exception being the base nagant can be fanned for the second (arguably third) best fanning in the game

[full jewel]

exactly, 7 rounds n still 2 tap to upper torso at close

but yea i do find it kinda funny that a relatively modern handgun compared to the others in hunt is the weakest n the startin one

its also funny how its opposite for rifles, one of the strongest options is mosin

[queen jungle]

@alpine fractal Leaning (and going prone) were suggested in the past but rejected by Dennis as the devs prefer more direct, western-style encounters instead of tactical peeking around corners or lying on the floor to have a smaller silhouette

[crystal plume]

And there already is a penalty for jump spamming

[obtuse nest]

I held down the click and only one pistol was firing.

The dual wielding system seems to be supporting unpaired handguns to an extent. Why was it not implemented? There are even perks that insist on having two of the same pistols, like Ambidextrous.

Though, imagine an Uppercut with Bronheim.

[queen jungle]

More xp/cash, facing people of lower MMR , and self revive. Its easier than playing in teams even more so in trios unless you are six star MMR its a walk in the park. Why should you get a cash/XP bonus when the game already nerfs your opponants and gives you unlimited revives until no bars.

[tribal wyvern]

If it's so easy, why don't you just farm solo & get a couple of million hunt dollars in a week.

Because reality check, it's not that easy dude, you're full of shit & just mad you died to a solo.
Majority of games you will die & be farmed. Because when people notice you're solo, they camp your body.

And it's not like you face 3 stars as a 5 star solo. You face 4-5stars.

[queen jungle]

I just played a game at 5 star and there was not a single 5 star in the lobby except for another solo

[tribal wyvern]

Then you're bottom 5 star, prob 3.5 solo mmr

[queen jungle]

I not long dropped out of 6

[tribal wyvern]

But how many ks did u make?

[queen jungle]

when

[tribal wyvern]

the game u had

[queen jungle]

When I dropped out of 6?

[tribal wyvern]

This one

[queen jungle]

killed a trio

then left

Just finished a game there, 1,348 dollars made, 6,150XP and all I did was kill the small bounty, then extracted because the trio camping me with snipers did not want to push a solo shotgun lol. I did literally nothing pretty much and I made way more than I would playing in a team. I didn't even get a single kill. In and out in 12 minutes

Just hopped into a duo match using the matchmaker. You'd be lucky to see this sort of reward with a server wipe and the big bounty

[little jackal]

well, bounty money doesn't depend on the number of kills

[queen jungle]

Why do solo players still get to keep all the benefits of playing solo that were in place before despite recent changes removing the Risk/Reward factor of playing solo? Its stupid.

There should be no bonus nor MMR change while self revive is a thing.

[little jackal]

I mostly play solo and I haven't noticed any significant income boost after the changes

guess in my lobbies people know how to handle dead bodies

[queen jungle]

As far as I can remember solo players have always got a bonus to XP and CASH on top of being placed against opponants of lower skill. Since the addition of self revive, this should have been removed.

[little jackal]

maybe, idk

[queen jungle]

I remember using quickplay to get free stuff. Now I just solo into trios because I know 75% of the time I'm making it out with a loadout and cash because the people in the lobbies are absolute shitters, Even if I die, I can wait til they extract and then self revive and go grab weapons from other bodies before extracting.

[little jackal]

personally, what I die from usually is just the number of enemies, not their mmr, it doesn't feel too different whether they're 4 or 5, so I can live without match mmr handicap alright

[jagged wagon]

Yeah, 4 and 5 don’t feel very different at all right now, got flick headshot from a 3 star at 120 meters yesterday, could be a lucky shot, or could be someone who has just recently down ranked, the mmr system is so easy to manipulate who can say..

[queen jungle]

Another thing self revive is good for, purposely going into trios and self rezzing to die 3 times in one lobby to those of lower MMR rather than going into quickplay and dying on purpose lol, Self revive is so broken

[tribal wyvern]

Did i not say u were bottom 5 star? 😄

That is like 3 deaths away from goin to 4 star

Absolute edge to 4 star is the 3star team mmr as solo

[queen jungle]

I don't think I've ever been in a solo game as a 5 star and see an entire trio of 5 stars. Im not saying it doesnt happen but regardless, There should be no nerf to MMR when solo que. This is Hunt and its suppose to be unforgiving and rage inducing but every update it gets less and less so. No bonus to cash and XP either.

[tribal wyvern]

You have to admit it was a little bit comical.
But they could look over the amount of reward you get. Adjust it a bit, with the self revive in mind. But you do not always have it. You have to win games or after 1.13 either buy legendary hunter or get a hunter with it to trade up your traits as u can remove em for free.

But the "unforgiving & rage inducing" only applied to like 2-3k max players.
After scrapbeak event & constantly adding more QoL saw the rise in to what we now have is 13k+ concurrent players.

People QQ on matchmaking now, imagine with 3k players.

[queen jungle]

that 2-3k players was the entire playerbase back before launch, I remember the game peaking at those numbers even on weekends.

[tribal wyvern]

After scrapbeak event it was 8-9k concurrent players.
It wasn't until the later events that they peeked to 13k concurrent.

[queen jungle]

That was marketing not gameplay changes. When events started being hyped up with trailers and big youtubers actually showing off the game along side, the game started to pick up

[tribal wyvern]

I do not agree it was only marketing

[queen jungle]

100% was, Never saw hunt advertised anywhere but steam page and youtube channel. when the events started it was all over facebook,insta and youtube ads

[karmic ivy]

maybe played a part, but its not the whole thing.

[tribal wyvern]

I personally did not see the game heavily advertised until after the new map.

Also marketing might explain peaks, but not concurrent playerbases over a long period of time.

Thats why im not linking peaks.

[full jewel]

@hot vigil 100 ms is way too low, would make atleast for me to play with my american friends impossible task even with my better net nowadays

125 maybe? or slightly higher chinese have over 200 most times so it would still stop em from joinin

[hot vigil]

Well, the system have always been that you can join friends no matter distance

Just that you cannot queue up for a server region outside the ms cap

[full jewel]

if so then i hsve no issue, i myself dont know internal mrchsnics of hunt as well

[hot vigil]

fair enough :b

[rustic heron]

I just had a new bug. You do not stop beeing poisened and your health is therefore also not regenerating. So it basically is the poison vision bug, but even worse.

[tribal wyvern]

Not new unfortunately

[unborn sandal]

It happens if you banish the boss while taking poison damage

[alpine fractal]

Ah ok

[alpine fractal]

I don’t mean literally spamming it but jumping every 2 seconds wont set off the forced walking animation

[karmic ivy]

@merry bough Do you think you can record them?

[tidal moss]

@midnight moon ~Krag Gang~ Hi I was just curious why you disliked my idea? I'm hopeful to improve it and would appreciate your feedback

[tribal wyvern]

@stray horizon

Seriously tho, no more of that inferno, it was a nice "wow" at first, but got annoying very fast

I never wanna see it again

[queen jungle]

@blissful parcel Please use this channel to comment on or reply to posts made in #feedback and keep that channel for original feedback posts only.

[crystal plume]

Well you wouldn't have to if it was put in the wildcard system that they are experimenting with to begin with

I'd like to see it every now and then, would be a waste not to see it anymore

[tribal wyvern]

That really depends, If they put rain for example in the future in it, I would have to.

[merry bough]

One f my friends has been doing that. where do we put the videos?

[karmic ivy]

Huntshowdown.com

I use a google drive to host the video files themselves.

[queen jungle]

@queen jungle Such a feature would entirely ruin the experience and immersion of Hunt since you never know whether or not there are still other players around unless you count bodies (and even then people can return with self-revive these days)

[queen jungle]

To sneak around when being alone on the server is not cool and my update would imo be a acceptable trade even if you find it cool since it saves time.
I have honestly gone to the extraction atleast 15+ times just because I know that We swiped the server and now is the boring part of banishing two bosses and waiting for them to poop.
Like, respect peoples time.
Imo

[light badge]

If it wasn't for solo rez I'd say I think the speed up when you're all alone is a super acceptable "immersion break" where the "tension" guaranteed to never be broken didn't really amount to much

But it's a little awkward with self rez. Probably just have to do it so it only occurs if there's no rezzes available. But that might out a solo just laying on the ground if someone counted the bodies and knows its lobby, and then goes and burns the solo

[queen jungle]

I mean like when everyone have left the server permanentely

[queen jungle]

When you start a match of Hunt, you choose to invest a certain amount of time and that includes the time to kill, banish, and extract (which is the main objective of the game). Speeding that main objective up wouldn't make sense at all and as I already said it would ruin the suspense of not knowing whether or not there is still somebody around.

The game is already quite heavy on the time-between-happenings which is cool since it builds up tension but to add these totally unneccessary waiting parts like the one I mentioned makes the game quite rude in a sense, I have places to be and ribbons to cut.

[queen jungle]

My objective opinion is the right one

lol

An opinion is never objective

My opinions are

And like I said, if you start a match of Hunt you choose to invest a certain amount of time. When you start the matchmaking, you fully know how long the mandatory processes are going to take if you want to fulfil the objective.
Of course there is always the option to extract prematurely if you run out of time.

[queen jungle]

I think my latest suggestion (check it out) is something that we can both agree would be a nice addon.
Tried to meet you guys half way with this one.

[queen jungle]

Obviously it is a difference between banishing a boss and rigging doors, anticipating a possible attack and so on to just standing there like some bot looking at the procentage ticking while punching the wall.

[light badge]

Sure, but I will say in my hundreds of hours I've only had a single game I felt would not have been improved by sped up timer if there were no people left on the map. It kills a tiny bit of suspense (unless you wiped and counted, which isn't terribly uncommon in trios at least) but the "add" of tension that's not going to be broken is minimal at best

I think a bigger potential problem is using banish as a "scouting" tool to find out if there are people still on the map, rather than some notion of sitting at the banish is fun

[queen jungle]

I'm sorry that's your experience

[light badge]

To clarify, I don't think it's terrible as is or anything. Just (at least for games I have any way to confirm on) most games don't start the banish with nobody else in the lobby, and the ones that I'm pretty sure did, I was 90%+ sure were empty and treated it as such (even so far as tabbing out of the game to watch YouTube during the banish). I feel like starting banish with nobody on the map and not being pretty dang sure of that is a rare case (at least with full lobbies, it's much less sure in the late night lobbies)

[queen jungle]

It's two against one .Finall.
You have to change your opinion now.

[analog willow]

Unfortunately, that system you’re presenting, while it would make that team that is FOR SURE they are the only ones left on the map have a slightly faster banish time, and less “time wasted”, the opposite effect would also happen. Teams and players that are unsure whether or not there is someone on the map would now have confirmation there isn’t anyone else, and so now the match feels like a “time waster” when otherwise they would have been tense and vigilant.

TLDR: Having a way to confirm you are the only one left would INCREASE the amount of players, and the overall amount of time, people feel is being “wasted” on an empty map

[analog willow]

2 to 2 😋

[queen jungle]

No, bro...
If the empty server time was sped up in the way I presented that "wasted" time you talk about would be alot less so it is a win win.
I think you only argue with me because you guys are a little embarrassed.
you are embarrassed that you didn't come up with this idea first.

no need to feel that way, you get the next great idea champ

[unborn dagger]

Exactly the point I was thinking

[vernal haven]

It would be PERCEIVED as more wasted time, as people would know for sure that they're alone and not waiting for anyone.

[vernal haven]

There is the separate issue of the spectate button disappearing for solos, which can confirm that there is nobody else

[unborn dagger]

There shouldn't be anything like that in a game like Hunt. Fear of the unknown is one of the things that makes Hunt, Hunt.

[queen jungle]

you know what, I will sleep on it and see if I can make sense of what you are saying in the morning.

In the meantime, go ahead and give my Sled suggestion a thumbs up. I think we can all find common ground with that one.
Those that want can tab out and those with infinite time to waste can drag around the sled and do all bounties and look for cash registers and what not.

Would you, drag the sled around for 15% of the tabbed out players earnings?
It doesnt slow you down, but it takes up both hands.

[light badge]

it's not really unknown with fixed lobby sizes though. especially in trios. duos have a lot more flexibility there because of increased amount of teams and how spread out they are. Trios it's not all that uncommon to know for a fact lobby is empty because you can count all 9 bodies

[alpine fractal]

Lmao i got a glitch with lemark 2 pistol

I died and someone took it off my body and then they died and i took it back

And the fanning hip fire was like ads accuracy. Was so funny

I was like fanning headshots from 20m away on zombies

[tidal moss]

@midnight moon ~Krag Gang~ ~Krag Gang~ Hi I was just curious why you disliked my idea? I'm hopeful to improve it and would appreciate your feedback

[brittle sierra]

hey guys i actually just joined the server. so heres what i did, as im entering, i did CTRL ALT DELETE, and it actually worked! thank me later? LOL

[teal briar]

That 100% worked for me

Plus the daily deal Vetterli popup is gone as well

[grim anchor]

So...this just happened.

Just tossing it out there. Adding my toothpick to the haystack of mmr system complaints lol

[night cradle]

seems within normal range for hunt mm

all 5s?

that's a fair game lol

[woeful fulcrum]

^

[queen jungle]

@night cradle That was briefly possible on the test server when contraband was introduced and quickly removed as it entirely destroyed the economy of Hunt and made PvP far too rewarding compared to the main objective, the bounty.

[night cradle]

makes sense, but unlucky for me i guess lol

Guess i'll be rage running through 20ish avtos before the patch lol

[light badge]

Donate your avtos to new players so they can try it before the funny loadout goes away!

I've donated a few avtos to friends I got into the game and the reactions have been very funny. One loved it, one was terrified of their own gun lol, and one just hated it because of the burst fire and trouble controlling the recoil haha

[hardy coral]

If you don't want the contraband gear then don't pick it up.

If I switch a gun in a match it'll be because I want to use it.

[tribal wyvern]

I assume we talkin bout selling contraband weapons.
Keep in mind, it was when items were worth 75% on sellback, not 50%.
But I'm not in favor of it or anything. Just wanted to add that.

[little jackal]

an interesting solution could be to extend the flash "charge" time

to align it with explosives in terms of time to react

but tbh any nerf to the flash is also a buff to angle-holding, and I'm not sure what's worse

I'd pick proactive gameplay any day

[crystal plume]

I agree that the intended functionality is needed but it has become too much of a crutch in it's current state

Back in the day you at least had a chance to 1v3 when getting pushed by playing smart, now if you're left alone you just get 1-3 flashes spammed at you until one connects and you have no chance to fight back anymore

Unless the enemies majorly mess up and miss their shots I guess

[tribal wyvern]

Well you can add a counterplay to it, like looking away, you're still not making them able to hold an angle & it's not a broken consum.

[little jackal]

turning 180 sounds way faster than charging and throwing a flash, it likely won't make them give up the position they're holding

[tribal wyvern]

It still gives u a small flashed vision from white to clear & affects sound

[crystal plume]

I'd rather see a charge up time or make it so that it doesn't break on impact but instead gets brighter when it lands so you can a second or two to move further from it to not get the full flash effect

Since directionality makes it more luck based in some situations

[unique osprey]

honestly reduce the full flash timer to like 3 sec

[tribal wyvern]

Tho @little jackal how is not any other consum angle breaking?

I dont think u hold an agle with a dynamite in ur face

or hive bomb

just as much as a flash

[little jackal]

explosives are "symmetrical" so to say, you can't push right after the throw

[tribal wyvern]

Aight fair point

[little jackal]

and hive bomb is fine, just not as reliable

[tribal wyvern]

Decoy fuse i guess would be the other option

[fading kindle]

run bulwark, suicide charge the explosive praying that I don't get hit with the full blast

[little jackal]

decoy fuses are great, love em

[little jackal]

or dauntless

ultimate chad

[fading kindle]

dauntlesses my own explosive to get a worse decoy fuze. genius.

[tribal wyvern]

Well frag fuse is alot more convincing & scary

[fading kindle]

true.

[tribal wyvern]

I just want consums to have a counter play.
Making a mathmatical calculation on directions I have to run after im blind is not one of them.

Go W 2 seconds, SW 1.4 seconds, then sprint N for 5seconds.

Also not a fan of consums that removes the control of my char

[dusky tapir]

honestly

I'm not sure why HUNT flashbangs ignore your look direction

if you're looking at it, you should eat shit

but if you manage to look away it should be lessened

CSGO does this for example and it has its whole slew of tactical implications

[bronze quail]

Cause if they worked like cs flashes would have been totally useless on hunt

Hunt fights can't be compared to cs

Anyway i think that flashes need a huge nerf, but I think that making them work like other games would completly delete it from the game

[dusky tapir]

being blinded and losing your point of aim sounds to me like a pretty nasty side effect regardless

as well as introducing some counter play

you didn't really explain why that'd be a bad thing.

I think either losing your point of aim or losing your vision for maximum amount would be a better choice than straight up being fucked

[bronze quail]

Cause flashes are easy as fuck to avoid, the only thing that makes the flash good on hunt is that you can tag easily everybody. Avoiding flashes is ultra easy on every game, even on cs they are used more to force people to look away for half a sec rather than actually flashing people, at least on high ranks

Are easy to avoid by looking away*

I'm not saying that are easy to avoid atm on hunt

[dusky tapir]

except I'm sure you did :p

[bronze quail]

But they would became super easy if they change it like cs

[tribal wyvern]

Anyone noticed an increase in teaming on night maps during wildcard events?
Just met a duo + trio running along side eachother shooting at us.
Then after game, they both have same clan names....

[dusky tapir]

the only thing that makes the flash good on hunt is that you can tag easily everybody.
and yeah at nearly six second blind per flash hit that's kinda why everyone is bitching about them.
Remember that the higher you go in MMR the higher likelyhood they'll know exactly where to flash for maximum effect

if you look away that's still having the flash do something that goes against the camper / victim

while introducing a bit more agency to the victim

right now your only agency as a flash victim is hoping you don't run into the enemy

not very fun

considering hunt flashes also give off hitmarkers

[bronze quail]

That's the problem, 5 seconds off full blind are bullshit + you get a flash almost at every toolbox/loot

[dusky tapir]

looking away to lessen duration sounds like a decent compromise to me

want to risk losing your sight picture in exchange for a shorter blind ( e.g. for 2s )

or even give them an added use as a tool to force people to look away while someone else pushes

[bronze quail]

It's not 2 seconds, it's literally half a second or if you are close enough you can just run straight to the one who tree it without even getting flashed

A nerf like that would make flashes totally useless, at least at high ranks where people knows how to play

[dusky tapir]

this is the wonderful thing about games

you are free to balance as you wish

notice how I keep implying HUNT flashes should still blind you some

[bronze quail]

As I said, i wouldn't balance it like that, just reduce drastically the full flash time + reduce the chances of getting it by looting ecc. Atm everybody have a flash cause you can find it literally everywhere. There is no need to nerf it to death (even if I would like to totally delete it from the game)

[hardy coral]

Or you could remove it...

[light badge]

I think looking away to cut flash time in half (so 3 seconds if you were going to be full flashed) would be a fine nerf? you're potentially losing some of your bearings and lined up shot on a door or whatever to reduce how long you're flashed, but you can't completely avoid it which would just be kind of free with hunt's significant audio queues

[knotty ore]

Its a bit funny that New Army Swift is coming. You guys do know that its the most used high MMR pistol in the game, right? Buffing it might not be necessary. But, you do you.

It would be like buffing the uppercut with a higher bullet capacity.

[little jackal]

is it buffing tho

[analog willow]

Putting my thoughts in on possible flash changes:

1. Cooking a flash to affect the duration of the effects
2. Increase the duration of the deafness effect
3. Looking away decreases the effects of the white out, but does nothing to reduce the "deafness" effect.

[little jackal]

dunno why everyone talks about deafness, who cares about that when using a flash. Number 1 sounds cool, not too radical for a nerf, simple and intuitive

[analog willow]

I can only see and hear this game. Hearing is 50% of the information I receive. Losing that, I could be pushed from a different direction than where I was flashed from without knowing it

[little jackal]

yeah, more like 5 or 10 or something. I don't think people would be having a hard time choosing between a consumable that deafens and any other offensive consumable.

[royal grove]

That's the whole point of a flashbang

The solution is to not get flashbanged

3 is good

[analog willow]

But it doesn't just deafen, it would still flash too

[knotty ore]

The only downside of the army is the reload speed and capacity so yeah. You fix both with swift.

[knotty ore]

Flash is fine. We currently have zero anti-corner holder counters. We need flash to work otherwise shit is a permanent stalemate.

Shoulder peeking a shotgun doesn't work, you just get walled. Breaching right now is pointless with any weapon. Its better to just wait. At least flash allows you to even the odds up to 70% likely to die breaching 30% success.

We need spots in the boss building walls that can be destroyed with explosives.

Or, boss building needs to slowly fill with poison cloud emanating from the boss body to force bounty team to make plays as they've got truesight.

Tired of games where nothing happens for a long time.

Crytek needs to decide who has the, "ball" and give us tools to make plays. Right now its super skewed towards camping.

[little jackal]

trading the ability of partial reloads (capacity, in fact) for a speedloader for when you find yourself in such a terminally bad position you need to fire more than 6, well, idk

[analog willow]

You could accomplish that push with many explosives, throwables, wallbanging, and options other than flash. Flash would still function very well with the proposed changes I presented. My thoughts were on balancing the effects of blind and making flash a more "skill" weapon than such an easy answer it is now.

[light badge]

Honestly just taking away the hit marker for the flash could be a potential large nerf that changes how it plays

[light badge]

To be fair, with ammo change and new army refilling 8 bullets from an ammo box, tossing some extra bullets for partial reloads might not be terrible

[little jackal]

true, but have to drop fmj then

even then I'd still take the no-swift version tbh

[light badge]

Or dumdum for the strugglers, but even with special ammo, the boxes are less prevalent, but 8 ammo box helps cover at least one wasted partial reload pretty well

[unborn sandal]

Cru5her you definitely either missed or hit a metal slat in the fence next to the kennel

[knotty ore]

You always fight one guy at a time? That's weak-sauce.

[knotty ore]

I sometimes wonder if people play the same game I do. You can't accomplish it with many explosives because it takes too long to toss them. They will push you instead of running back. At best, you both die. Its too easy to tell fake nades from real ones. Most people don't insta-throw dynamite. Most people don't even bring dynamite, because its trash compared to frag/flash/tina bomb. You won't out-wallbang someone holding an angle because you need to see their relative position first, and they aren't moving. You shoulder-peek to see where they are, you die. Or, at the very least take damage to where they can push you if they want to. Flash has to remain as is, otherwise this game will turn into a bigger camp-fest than it already is. At high MMR (5-6), I spend more time waiting due to lack of breaching options. Running up to the building is death. Breaching is death. Finding other teams first is bad strat as the bounty will leave, or third party.

We need to be able to create sight lines into the building, more than just blowing up doors. Some compounds are ok, some are just awful.

[ripe basalt]

@grave hare Your post in #feedback was deleted becuause it was a bug report. Please utilize the correct channels. For Playstation, you can use #bug-reports-ps. Thanks.

[brisk timber]

#game-ideas message
@tired barn
So wheres the downside? What would it make a balanced addition?

As it is its just a straightup powercreep gun that would make rival and romero irrelevant.

[tired barn]

Same stats but a bit tighter spread and and a bit longer range

[brisk timber]

Oh so even more powerful?

[tired barn]

If its a romero same stats as the normal one but with an extra barrel but if its a caldwell look at the response above you

[brisk timber]

I dont think you dont have balancing in mind here

This gun is op
Would make romero and rival irrelevant and probably the other shotguns aswell

[tired barn]

Right now my brain no work its 4 am

[brisk timber]

#game-ideas message
One of my suggestions.

Your gun need some downsides
You cant just give a gun pure positives

[tired barn]

Slower to reload and you can only reload both barrels and bullet grubber will not work with it

And melee 24

Pellet damage 130 up to 40 meters

[brisk timber]

Aiaia

Could it be that you just want a damn strong shotgun? XD

[tired barn]

I just want a proper shotgun not that tiny rival or slow to reload Romero

[brisk timber]

Specter?

[tired barn]

That just eats ammo and you are kind of required to have bullet grubber to use it

And it’s clunky and bulky

[brisk timber]

i still dont see it. A long barreled rival would really powercreep. This thing would be a monster and even surpass a crown and king with its fire rate.
Sounds to me like a Nitro light

[tired barn]

We can give it the same damage as the derringer

And worse spread than all the shotguns combines

[brisk timber]

You start to getting it

[tired barn]

And the range to 0.1 meters no special ammo and an apature sight to aim with you can’t fold down

[brisk timber]

Why not make it 300dmg on 40m?

[tired barn]

Its not a nitro

[brisk timber]

If you start beeing silly that can go both ways

[tired barn]

I am just neutering it

[brisk timber]

Getting serious again...

I can see this gun if it would trade its OHK range for the gained precision/range/firerate. If its like a romero and rival combined then it would atleast need to have its OHK range reduced. Working more like a midrange sparks and closerange kill only in something like a 10-5m range.

That sounds to me like a fair tradeoff

A bit like the soon to be released Drilling

[tired barn]

Its a double riffle with a shotgun

[brisk timber]

I know. Thats why i said "a bit"

[tired barn]

And i also wanted something to counter the crown and king

[brisk timber]

If you want a gun that is a jack of all trades you gotta make it master of non
You cant just slap all the good things on it

[tired barn]

And i was thinking make the “Romero new model/ caldwell huntsman*”a separate weapon and unlockable at bloodrank 90

[brisk timber]

I dont think the crown and king needs any more competition. Already strong af
Any stronger and we are in nitro territory

[brisk timber]

Thats cool but are no factors to balancing

Tbh i think you just want a straight upgrade instead of a cool variant / sidegrade

Shotguns are already strong as they are especially with slugs

No need for even more powerful ones

[tired barn]

I am gonna get some sleep i got four hours left before i need to go to work

[zinc solstice]

@willow crow you missed

[willow crow]

You must have failed to read the whole thing.

[zinc solstice]

no i read it all

you missed

[rotund obsidian]

yeah sounds like you missed

[soft river]

@tired barn idk if as much people as you say actually wants this + there are more shotguns then there are medium and compact rifles combined

we do not need more shotguns

[brisk timber]

Just today i had exactly this happening to me again. Killed the first, the second and the third just managed to throw a flash in my general direction. Its just so extremely frustrating to have no counterplay in any way.

As he pulled out the flash the game was basically over for me.
No mindgame or tactic i could have pulled.

This is what makes the flash so massively frustrating. You hear this sizzle sound and know its a deathsentence if the enemy doesnt screw up. The more skilled the player the less likely to avoid death at all.

[outer wedge]

Flashes, imo, just need the CS:GO treatment, if it was possible. Its skillful both ways.

[keen oak]

We need more content in general

And in all fairness it's good we have a lot of shotguns here

Hunt is one of the very few fps games that doesnt make shotgun pellets disappear after 10m mark

[unborn dagger]

True

[knotty ore]

Yeah, I'd love to cancel 90% of the throw animation, jump out backwards and as it goes off I'll 180 and headshot everyone.

[light badge]

Csgo flashes don't work as well when they're audible being pulled and thrown from liek 50m away, you get one, and they travel as slow as molasses

[outer wedge]

ok, but well, at least put in a version where we can't be full blind for 5s if turn the back on it... because atm its the most op throwable out there..

[old fossil]

@shadow jacinth What is your feedback about the suggestion?

[dusky tapir]

I have no idea why you are being downvoted @old fossil

if I deal 136 damage + bleed to someone, and they get killed by a grunt they have aggro'd, I am pretty fucking sure that should count as a kill in my favor, and not some freak AI death

(this is one of many examples of this )

[dusky tapir]

nah it's after 15 🥴

[dusky tapir]

another one that bothers me is being tagged for 130+ by a bolt action which results in a death by fall damage
If I put you in that situation by landing my shots I should be getting the credit

Feels like it'd need some damage treshold tuning ( BF4 and "assist counts as kill" are a perfect example scenario) but it would be much more fair to everyone

BF4 and "assist counts as kill" - you had to leave enemies on the brink of death, dealing around 76% HP damage for it to count ( in HUNT this'd be around 115 dmg give or take, so some compact weapons might not count )

[old fossil]

I believe you may still get an assist in that case
So people who are cheated of a kill by AI finishing off someone or them dying to fall damage, etc will still get a "kill" (as an assist)

It could be nice to see that an AI or environment finishing kill could count as a normal kill
but at least for now, I want to address the fact that people who suicide to save KD aren't going unpunished and artificially inflating their KD (by escaping situations that would count as a death)

[little jackal]

they take dishonor before death, who cares about their kd

[old fossil]

They don't care about a dishonorable suicide, they care about their KD

[little jackal]

so I guess everyone's happy in the end

[old fossil]

Not quite. If someone gets caught in a bad situation, then they put themselves there. They deserve to either go down getting killed by an enemy player or clutch the fight.

I am being cheated of a kill and the player gets away "free", by the player blowing themselves up while I rush toward them to finish them off

and not just me, any player in this situation

[little jackal]

forcing someone into a suicide is way more satisfying than just a kill in my book

[old fossil]

you're talking about what you are acceptable with

it is an objective value take

Factually it makes no sense that someone gets away "free" by committing suicide in mid PvP

[jagged wagon]

You still came out on top though, threat eliminated, so now it just sounds like you care just as much about gaining KD as they care about losing it.

[old fossil]

Not quite. I want a fight, or to be clutched against. Not someone to worry about their number and suicide for being the lat one alive after their two teammates were PvPed to death

last*

A similar scenario would be if you were playing Rock Paper Scissors first to 3 with someone
You win 2 out of 3, and then your opponent takes their bet back and walks away because they're afraid of losing on the next throw

[worthy knoll]

Or about cheating you Out of the Dopamin of Killing Them 😉

[old fossil]

Also, even if I did say that I care about gaining KD, it would still be true. Your statement isn't a counterpoint.
Someone who pressures an enemy player into suicide still "killed" them. Of course you should get credit.

[little jackal]

I'm not pro or against that suggestion, but now that I'm thinking about it, with its current state you get to see the personality of your enemy. Some are cool and brave cowboys and fight till the last bullet, while others are trembling cowards. Another perspective to online experience to chat about after the fight.

[worthy knoll]

Its Not free, they loose their Hunter, Gear and any Money they picked Up. You can even loot Them. You in the other Hand "loose" an oppurtunity to gain KD

[old fossil]

Suicides don't follow you, especially if you can change your Steam identity but keep your KD

[old fossil]

They don't care.

They value saving their KD more than their gear. You're focusing on that I said "free"

You're right, it isn't "free" for gear, but it is "free" for their KD

[hardy coral]

It really isn't such a big deal, people who have been damaged recently and kill themselves still count as your kill afaicr.

People accidently kill themselves after the map has been wiped or just do so for fun, don't think that should count in the KD. I can't remember the last time I had guy attempt to or actually kill his own hunter to avoid dropping KD.

[worthy knoll]

Thats an asdumption.
There are other reasons Like wanting to Not give you the enjoymemt. For example my KD is negative. I dont Care. If I big bundle myself, whats my reason?

[old fossil]

It happens frequently in high 5-6 MMR matches

[old fossil]

Then you still "died to a player" which is yourself.

Killing yourself out of spite should not be rewarding

[hardy coral]

I have literally never seen this.

[old fossil]

frequently is an overstatement, but a good number of players if asked would say that they have experienced a scenario somewhere at least

I have seen at least 3

and that is the ones I witnessed and am certain of being a suicidal KD save

[little jackal]

okay, I reread the suggestion, and it's not about you getting that kill. I would be totally fine with it then, mid-fight or not, suicide is death.

[worthy knoll]

And it isnt.

[old fossil]

And before I get asked the "what if I like killing myself anyway or accidentally die to AI mobs and not PvP?"
thats why there is the "combat logging" approach

[old fossil]

It saves your KD if your goal is to save your KD. Why is it saving your KD?

[little jackal]

still leaves some space for those loosers who'd rather suicide than grant a kill

[old fossil]

Bro, you guys are trying to nitpick what if and if nots

So you are agreeing to the possibility of a "combat log" approach, but "what if"-ing that they abuse the time duration and wait until they can kill themselves scot-free

other games have "combat log" durations depending on the speed of combat in the game
it is tuned to be appropriate

[little jackal]

nah, what's the point of these complicated heuristics. Suicide is a death, period. Unless you also need a kill to your board.

[old fossil]

the kill to your board is an afterthought, don't care about that yet, as that is another layer

suicide is a death, would be nice. The "combat log" solution is a way to address concerns about "what if I die to only AI" since the death statistic is called "killed by player"

[bronze quail]

And what about stop fucking caring about deaths and just play?

[tidal moss]

@old fossil I'm a 5 star and I've not run into this. I die plenty to random shit though. I must have a grunt set off a damn barrel, or miss judge a frag through at least once a day. I'd be pissed if they punished me for that in an attempt to stop something I've not seen in 2700 hours of game play more then twice.

[old fossil]

like I said, if it's self inflicted not during PvP, the combat logging solution

[tidal moss]

Your post was specific about people killing themselves in combat to avoid kda loss

[old fossil]

Yes? Your concern if I understand correctly is it being a a "killed by player" increase by dying to a torch grunt + red barrel (which I am assuming wouldn't be within say 30 seconds after you just got shot by an enemy player)

and even if you did, you would have healed up by then, and the player would still not get an "assist" by your AI caused death (as how assists work currently; assists only happen if the player is killed without healing)

but if you didn't heal up, and the enemy inflicted damage was still on you when you died to AI or environment, then the enemy should still receive an "assist" and you a "death"

[tidal moss]

No I'm talking about misjudged explosives

[old fossil]

isn't that a skill problem?

I'm not trying to meme, it's a real response

[tidal moss]

I don't disagree but I don't like the idea of being punished because your worried someone is killing themselves.

[tidal moss]

I don't see the problem your talking about but I see people go to throw explosives all the time and get aim knocked or miss a crack and die. If you want to are they should be counted as kills on their own merits that's one thing but to count them because your afraid the miniscule nearly non existent minority of sweaty hunters are using it as a loophole to protect kda is an accusation against the honor of those of us who have even miss clicked

[old fossil]

killing yourself with a dangerous throwable is still a death or killed by player

you're talking about what is currently familiar and not liking to change from it

again, you can still pull your normal PvE deaths without getting punished on stats (suicide bombing the boss without taking PvP damage recently, dying to PvE without taking PvP damage recently, falling and dying without taking PvP damage recently, etc)

[tidal moss]

No I'm not. Let me be clear

You said you believe you encounter people using explosives to kill themselves to avoid damage to their kda

I said that happens to me any many others as legitimate fuck ups

[old fossil]

but if you manage to blow yourself up while in PvP and after taking some player-inflicted damage and not healed yet, which is your scenario, you still deserve to be counted as a "kill" since that player "assist"-ed in you being killed

[tidal moss]

I am fine with counting this as deaths but I do not like the implications that you put forth that im commiting suicide

[old fossil]

again.

combat logging.

[tidal moss]

Again no

[old fossil]

If you blow yourself up while having taken PvP damage and not healed up, you got "killed"

[tidal moss]

I'm fine with them implementing self kills as kills

[old fossil]

whether it was intentional or not it cannot be determined

[tidal moss]

I will not accept it being added as a punishment for killing yourself when I most definitely did not intend it to happen

Your entire post was predicated on the idea of it being a self kill for deceitful reasons

[old fossil]

so what is your angle?

[tidal moss]

I'll be damned if I'll let you lump me in with those people

[old fossil]

the last two ideas you have presented contradict each other
you accept self kills as kills

[tidal moss]

No you are completely missing the obvious

[old fossil]

let me clear this one up to be sure, what exactly do you mean

[tidal moss]

If they want to implement this as a normal thing. Hey if you kill yourself by accident that's still a death. I'm fine with that. But I won't accept it being added because you want to punish a subset of people I don't even believe exist

[old fossil]

"self kills as deaths" or "self kills as enemy gains a kill"?

[old fossil]

that you dont believe exist when I have seen them do it?

[clever island]

So you are okay with the actual feature, not the reason for it ? Feels like a non-issue then.
Implement the feature, and do not label it as punishment for supposed bad behavior.

[tidal moss]

Your essentially accusing anyone who died of a miss timed grenade of being so sweaty ass kda farmer

[bronze quail]

Stats ---> Hide
Solved

[old fossil]

there, you have seen it with your own eyes

[tidal moss]

First time in 2700 hours. Hardly seems endemic

[bronze quail]

Why introducing all that dumb things when you can just completly delete all the stats thing that literally makes no sense on a non competitive game

[tidal moss]

I'd be fine with that. I won't be accused of a crime I've not committed though

[old fossil]

just because it doesn't seem like an issue to you, doesn't mean the issue doesn't exist or can grow

[clever island]

Kills also give XP. If I tag someone with my springfield and they fuck up and die to fall damage, I want my 400 xp toward my next ammo unlock

[bronze quail]

Or make that you can only see your stats on the menu so you can jerk on top of it when bored

The issue are statistics, not players suiciding to save KD

[old fossil]

even if it rarely happens, it's a problem. the fact is that it's a problem.

[tidal moss]

I don't think theirs a Mafia team hunting me either. Should I be worried it could grow? That's the logic your proposing

[tidal moss]

I think we have bigger issues like actually endemic cheating, reshadeders and exploiters to worry about without chasing down your niche suicidal sweat lords

[old fossil]

the issue is how the statistics are affected by suicide; they aren't affected by suicide, therefore people suicide to save KD

how*

[bronze quail]

No, the problem are statistics that make no sense on a game like that

[old fossil]

your suggestion is to remove statistics altogether. That is a different subject.

I am working with what exists currently, and proposing an alteration.

[tidal moss]

You seem as worried about their kda as they are.

[bronze quail]

And you are talking about a super rare problem that happened to me like 5 times in 3k hours playing at 6 stars.
What I'm saying is that we shouldn't argue about suiciding being counted as a death but we should just argue about removing the whole thing

[old fossil]

And it doesn't matter if I am or I am not.

[tidal moss]

If kda doesn't matter then why worry about it at all

[old fossil]

because the fact of the matter stands. Everything I have said isn't subjective. it is factual. I take care to do so

[tidal moss]

It's assumptive and accusatory

[clever island]

But the MMR and K/D aside, you are still deprived from xp reward for kill with weapon and end of match accolade, when people suicide.
Unless you will argue xp and unlocks should be removed from the game too ?

[old fossil]

And I proposed a solution that doesn't lump or accuse PvE (purely AI or environment) deaths or deaths where you manage to blow yourself up without being involved in PvP as intentional

if you manage to blow yourself up in PvP, you still fucked up in PvP and died.
What? Am I supposed to be "oopsie I threw the dynamite into the wall" after getting shot, and went from remaining hp to 0 and go unpunished?

[brisk timber]

@old fossil upvote. Youre completely right.

[tidal moss]

If that could actually be made to work. Which I can see that being challenging to dial in I would be fine with that. Though I will say with all the much more pressing issues facing hunt this hardly seems a good use of time. It's like changing a light bulb in a burning house.

[brisk timber]

And if we are at it make QP deaths count and seperate QP MMR from BH MMR

[tidal moss]

Now that's something I've seen a shit load of people do. Go to quick play die a bunch to lower BH MMR then go seal clubbing in the lower lobbies

[old fossil]

if your skill of throwing a dynamite is bad enough to blow yourself up accidentally, you would have been killed by that enemy player

[tidal moss]

Assumptive

[bronze quail]

Already fixed on the new patch

[brisk timber]

?

[tidal moss]

The one coming up? Because I was doing well in quick play yesterday and my MMR was not affected

[bronze quail]

qp is no longer going to affect elo on bounty hunt after the next patch. At least thats what devs said on the live stream

[clever island]

Neat

[tidal moss]

Ok that's a really good fix!

[brisk timber]

Oh thats some good news than

[tidal moss]

Kinda amazing they actually did something!

[bronze quail]

Yeah after 3 years

[old fossil]

again, here is the difference
150 hp, throws dynamite, blows up to 150 dmg, dies, no punishment
gets shot, takes 120 dmg, at 30 hp, throws dynamite blows up, dies, is +1 "killed by player"

[bronze quail]

A couple of patches like these and the game can finally get out of beta

1 death on KD is a punishment for you?

Lol

[old fossil]

for the KD savers it is, therefore they choose to suicide in unfavorable situations

not my own values.

[tidal moss]

I'd be totally cool with that. That makes good sense and does not make an unfair accusation.

[old fossil]

this is what I've been saying by "combat log"

[clever island]

You shouldn't frame it as punishement for the "self killed" player, but rather reward for the player that created circumstances leading to it (the killer). And it's fine

[tidal moss]

I'm saying though hunts severs struggle to load grunts before I get to them. Idk how well this will work in practice.

[old fossil]

huh?

[brisk timber]

love it when this happens.
Go into random hut and suddently 3 grunts spawn around you

[tidal moss]

The old Pentium 3 at Crytek headquarters screams in agony as it summons forth the armored to smite the player that passed through the region 10 minutes ago

[old fossil]

I wish I clipped a grunt waking up from an enemy running by the building outside, while I'm stealthing unmoving inside, and the grunt locks straight on me

unrelated, but within the realm of grunt bs

[brisk timber]

i swear i have so much situations where i feel like im the AI magnet

[tidal moss]

I love when you kill a dog with a silent shot and the whole pack imidiatly makes a b line for you

[old fossil]

they don't always. if you're far enough away, they go into "aggro" mode but they aren't locked on you

within a certain distance they do lock on even if silent yes

is how my experience is consistently with them

[tidal moss]

Pedantic but yes. Though it was a comment in jest and not ment to be a serious critique

[old fossil]

it might seem so; I'm just laying the whole thing out, whether you knew it or not is something I don't know

[fading kindle]

Does anyone else feel like the trade window in this game is too high as is? Tbh it makes running shotguns and most close quarters engagements unfun for me. I get that a favor the shooter system is a compromise the team has to make for some very valid reasons, but I feel like the window for it (800ms as far as I know, if I am wrong please correct me) seems a bit too wide. I feel like something within the 300-400ms range would be a better balance between favoring peoples' shots but without having people die from people that they killed on their screen.

[tidal moss]

I forget the exact reason so perhaps someone can jump in on this but they said it's because of latency issues, and that they see no way to correct it.

@compact dew "higher damage less range" what were you thinking for the range and damage, and how would you differentiate it from a shotgun?

[karmic ivy]

Iv havn't seen it either, 2.5 years. I am sure it happens, but I do not think it is an issue that needs addressing.

[karmic ivy]

^

[keen oak]

Tell me you dont play with shotguns without telling me

[tidal moss]

I can still get on board with the idea of "if I hit you and make you throw your frag into a wall and it kills you" that should count as my kill, but the stated reason for needing to add it as a punishment was really thin.

[dusky tapir]

3star speech

sorry, got it out of my system now

[keen oak]

Kek

[tidal moss]

But like I also dead hunts potato servers would be really hard pressed the crunch the numbers to do that with any kind of accuracy

[dusky tapir]

if you're sniping people with buckshot I really want to hear what shotgun you are using

because past ohk range damage drops like a rock

[karmic ivy]

the less punishment in a game the better.
It is far far better to encourage the behavior you want as a dev, than to punish players for behavior you don't.

[fading kindle]

I feel like generally if you do 70-90% of someone's health and then they go and die by other means it should still count as your kill.

[keen oak]

I wasnt talking about OHK only. You can comfortably 2tap people with shotguns in 20-25m whereabouts if your shots are on point

Depends on the shotgun as well

Plus slugs exist

[rotund obsidian]

🥱 buckshot

real gamers use pennyshot

[tidal moss]

Yeah I agree with that.

[dusky tapir]

man

I guess red orchestra has spoiled me

[fading kindle]

Why Dragonsbreath Romero is a really fun casual pick

[dusky tapir]

onetapping people with a wad of buckshot at 50m with the trench gun was some real shit

THAT was a realistic shotgun

[keen oak]

There is not a game in sight that will offer you that experience

Unless making it a complete simulator

Hunt is as far as you comfortably go with shotguns without going nuts

[rotund obsidian]

insurgency sandstorm has some pretty nutty shotgun range

[keen oak]

And most games dont exceed 8m effective so

[karmic ivy]

But can you say you KNOW why they choose 800ms in the first place? It is a hit validation system. It has purpose and Ill bet the 800ms has a purpose. If you don't know what it is, how can you say it should be cut in half?

[fading kindle]

I'm not a developer, I don't know all their reasonings and thought processes for solutions but that doesn't mean I can't offer some feedback or invite discussions.

[little jackal]

pretty sure it's connected to the Earth radius somehow

gotta change the planet

[fading kindle]

The 800ms hardcap they stated in this article (https://www.huntshowdown.com/news/the-state-of-hit-registration-in-hunt) is just kinda given without explanation. I have no idea why they chose it. it just seems a bit high.

[bronze quail]

Same as ping limit being totally nonsense

I can play on every region except oceania lol

[karmic ivy]

Certainly!, I was merly curious about how you choose the number you did, and wanted to see if my surmise was correct. that you did not know the reason it is 800ms to start.

[keen oak]

Fair enough, but modern day shooters bore me

[karmic ivy]

How can you say its high when you don't know why it is what is is? its a little confusing. Just curious really, not a big deal or anything.

[bronze quail]

It's one second of trade window, you don't have to be an expert to know that it's high, specially when hunt it's literally the only game with such a huge trade window

[karmic ivy]

It is a hit validation system. And that ^, does not explain why it is what it is, 800ms. Until someone can identify that, I don't see how anyone can judge it as high or low.

[rotund obsidian]

i mean they also used to invalidate hits from (significantly?) after your death according to the server, but a while back they removed it, i think? so the 800ms window wasn't intended for trades, but for stuff like moving behind walls and such when the shooter has high ping

it would be like csgo (and most other shooters) where you shoot someone on your screen but the bullet is eaten by the server since it happened after you died. now you basically have free rein to shoot someone as long as you want up until your client receives the info that you're dead

[bronze quail]

It's a hit validation system based on the client, that means that the server look what happens on your client and validate it. That means that if i shoot on my screen and i kill someone, that other player has a window of 800ms to kill me with the server also validating his kill.

I have 100ms and the enemy has 100ms for example.
I shoot, after 50ms the server register the shot and after other 50ms the server sends that information to the other player. On that 100ms window between me shooting and the server actually giving that information to the other player everything can happen.

[bronze quail]

This, a couple of year ago they switched from the server validation system to the client validation system that we have rn

[karmic ivy]

Yes that seems correct ^. So as you can see the 800ms is not even used in this case. I surmise its 800 because that is the highest expected latency spike that should occur. And they want to cover some of those extreme cases as well. But the ping limit of 250ms prevents players using 800ms of "trade window".

[bronze quail]

The problem it's here, even 100ms is a lot, the problem is that rn if i fight a player with 400ms ping he can also get his shot registered even if i shot him on my screen half a second before

[karmic ivy]

You cannot

250ms is the limit.

Unless you cheat of course. as in a lag-switch.

[bronze quail]

I know that the server validation system can be way more frustrating (and it was a lot, specially in close range fights) but having that huge trading windows it's still frustrating

As i said, also a 100ms trading windows is not fine

Same as 250

Or whatever

[karmic ivy]

That is subjective.
and not related to the original subject of the hit validation system and its 800ms window of opperation.

[rotund obsidian]

it's so bizarre that one of the biggest sources of trading is shotguns, when that should be the least likely to trade

[bronze quail]

And anyway it's way more dumb that they implemented a 800ms trading window even with a 250ms cap, meaning that a player who is lag switching can still get his shot registered

[karmic ivy]

I use shotguns often and don't trade much.
you learn the timing of the combat and how to avoid the risk of trading kills.

[bronze quail]

It's not subjective, it's not fun peeking, killing a player, going back to cover and then die from the same guy that i already killed without even having heard him shooting

[fading kindle]

The frequency of trading with shotguns makes me (primarily a solo player, so trades are even more punishing) never want to touch them, even when the guns themselves are very fun to play with at times.

[rotund obsidian]

I think like 99% of my trades (besides stuff like explosives or bleed) are at point blank range against a shotgun

[karmic ivy]

It is, I am having fun. So that means our preference for what is fun is subjective, as we play the same game.

[bronze quail]

Well what can I say, we don't have to like shit only cause you love it. Probably your qi is way lower than the average, see ya

[rotund obsidian]

I feel like the risk of pushing a shotgun should be getting blasted before i can kill them, not after.

[karmic ivy]

Insults?

[karmic ivy]

True in the ideal case, but in the real world we have latency.

[fading kindle]

I mean, I see Duncan's point---my specific idea about the 800ms hardcap doesn't really fully grasp all the technical details at hand, I'm sure the actual solution will involve some much more complicated ideas, but the essence I am trying to get at is this---the frequency and seeming window for kill trades feels bad to play with in its current state. Frequently I am killed by people after they've died, especially at close quarters with shotguns.

Something should be done to try and reconcile the issue though, imo. It is not in a state which is beneficial to the game.

[karmic ivy]

I see, part of that can be avoided by getting more familiar with the timing, such as exactly when you opponent can shoot and kill you and exactly when they cannot.
The other part cannot be avoided, because of the lag switching cheats. And the fact that on even a good connection a hit validation system needs a buffer of several hundred milliseconds to deal with incidental latency spikes. You don't see them, but they are often there if your internet service isn't top notch.
If you get killed after they are on the ground, its probably lag switchers.

[fading kindle]

Forcing the players to specifically play around the intricacies of a hit registration system seems like the opposite of the intended effect of a properly functioning hit validation system.

[karmic ivy]

In my opinion you cannot do it any other way with a client side hit registry.
And the results are much better than the alternatives I have played. Rust is a good example. Hunt's gun-play is much much better than Rust's.

So in the end, its just a case of not all players like all games.

Hunt is not for EVERYONE. Just the Hunters really.

[rotund obsidian]

I think latency spikes SHOULD cause your shots to be eaten instead of still going through when you've already died according to the server. I feel as though the simplest way to mitigate the effects of what you believe to be lagswitchers would just be hardcapping trades to reject those shots at very high ping after you've died.

[karmic ivy]

You might feel differenly is you were stuck with internet that is only Par.

I felt it in the past, with other games like the orininal counter strike.

[old fossil]

Combat logging measures have never detracted from PvP games.
They are rules emplaced to discourage people from nearly instantly poofing themselves out of a disadvantageous situation, whether it be disconnecting or suicide.
Being a poor sport in PvP should be punished. If you or your enemy is put in a bad spot, that person should either strive to clutch out of it or die trying. Not take a suicide in order to dishonestly preserve their statistics for appearing prestigious.
Accidentally killing yourself or dying to PvE with no PvP around at that moment is not punished.
If you aren't someone looking to forfeit a fight by intentional suicide, then this change won't impact your enjoyment of the game.

[karmic ivy]

It makes you appreciate Hunt.

[karmic ivy]

I just think its a non-issue for Hunt. So no need to go punishing people.

[old fossil]

I've went over this already with someone else. Just becase you think it's a non issue, doesn't mean it's not an issue at all.

[karmic ivy]

I think what I think, I didn't say what it was. Don't put words in my mouth (old saying)

[old fossil]

and it's not a difficult change, just a small addition to the programming

[rotund obsidian]

? saying you think something is a non-issue means that.. you think it's not an issue?

[karmic ivy]

Yes, I think it is a non-issue. That is different that saying, It IS a non-issue. I am always fallable, as we all are.

[old fossil]

"it's a non issue" is saying that my proposed subject is nonsense

[karmic ivy]

I think your proposed subject is a non-issue

But only Crytek knows

[old fossil]

not an issue.

it's not a major issue, but still an issue. not a non issue.

[karmic ivy]

By issue, I mean, something that NEEDS to be fixed.

[rotund obsidian]

I think it's an issue, but I don't know if I've ever encountered it. It stands to reason that one COULD exploit self-kills to avoid K/D changes, so there's no reason not to change it to prevent that.

[karmic ivy]

so when I say non-issue. I mean we don't need to change it. I don't think it would be worth the expense.

[old fossil]

non is a direct word for "not"

[karmic ivy]

I just gave you MY definition, as I am using it.

[old fossil]

How is it supposed to be understood that you are saying differently from "not an issue"?

[karmic ivy]

we don't need to argue about "non"

[old fossil]

...

there are no "my" definitions

[rotund obsidian]

apparently we do, if you're using it in that context and expecting anyone to understand

[dim heron]

He said it, then explained it, move the discussion on.

[rotund obsidian]

Y'all think poison bombs should be buffed? I would love that.

[dim heron]

flashes need to be buffed

[unborn smelt]

should have been buffed ages ago

oh and yes buff flashes

[fading kindle]

I don't think I've ever used poison bombs for anything other than PvE and a light suggestion at crowd control that most players just ignore lol

[old fossil]

thank you, simplest and best way to say it

[rotund obsidian]

I propose something akin to a choke-bomb burst of poison status when it lands, transitioning into the cloud.

also remove flash hitmarker, if you wanna bumrush a blind man you gotta be confident it hit him

[dim heron]

that would be cool

I agree with the flash bomb hitmarker.... I never see it anyway 😦

[old fossil]

it being the same hitmarker for a light flash or full flash effect, should it stay this way or should it be more distinct?

[rotund obsidian]

I thought they already made it so the hitmarker only shows up for a full flash

[dim heron]

yea it should be just for full flash iirc

[unborn smelt]

I don't think you can. Afaik you still get a death accounted even if self inflicted

[old fossil]

ah someone told me otherwise

[unborn smelt]

the only thing that happens is the "killer" only gets an assist instead of a kill

[old fossil]

that an enemy could be flashed and hitmarkered for the short effect

[unborn smelt]

It used to be diffrent IIRC

[rotund obsidian]

It doesn't count as a "death to another hunter" does it?

[unborn smelt]

in the past you also wouldn't get an assist for dealing the dmg before they die

but they patched that a while ago

[fading kindle]

I think an "Assist as Kill" system could be implemented where if you deal 70-90% of someone's health and they die by any means it counts as your kill. Mostly just adds to players' self satisfaction.

[unborn smelt]

i don't think it does. But we don't know if it even matters.

It may matter but it also may not - depending on how assists work in that edge case

[tribal gulch]

the matchmaking of the game is rubbish, the servers leave a lot to be desired and above all the hackers make life impossible in the game

[rotund obsidian]

yeah i suppose it could use some testing to see exactly how it works, since i'm not sure

[old fossil]

Currently, if someone suicides, the enemy player who assist-damaged the player gets an assist credit
but the player suiciding doesn't get a death counted
Is this incorrect?

[unborn smelt]

As far as i know yes - the player that dies does also gets a death counted

[rotund obsidian]

I can't even find the kill/death count in the menu 💀

[old fossil]

Hmm, so why do people do it then? they're not aware?

[rotund obsidian]

oh i see it's a hover on the k/d in stats

[unborn smelt]

maybe they fuck up - especially in the case of being flashed

maybe they just want to deny someone satisfaction

[rotund obsidian]

yeah the stat says "Killed by Player" and honestly i think any sort of self-inflicted death should count (explosives, poison etc)

[unborn smelt]

I may be wrong - gonna ask next time i get the chance to

but i thought you get a death applied...

[rotund obsidian]

I don't think you get one for flat-out suicides

I'm not sure if an enemy assist at all changes that

[unborn smelt]

issue here is it's hard to differentiate for an automated system to differentiate between a suicide and a genuine mistake, i think

[old fossil]

I got my information from asking higher MMR players throughout playing, they say it happens
I've played for 7 months but Hunt only consistently to 2k hr, had 3 distinct suicides I remember because they were the last ones alive in trios.
Each of them huddled into a corner, and either fully cooked an explosive in hand, or dropped it at their feet and sat still

[rotund obsidian]

I mean, i'm of the opinion that even a completely accidental self-inflicted death should count, even when an enemy player isn't involved.

[unborn smelt]

ofc it will happen.

i wouldn't ever deny that

however for assessing if it needs changing noe needs to weigh against each other how often it happens purposefully and how often accidentally, and then try to wigh the pros and cons of punishing it vs not being very punishing in regards to that

[rotund obsidian]

I think it's less a punishment and more just a bigger scope of condition for reflecting stats accuracy. If I get aimpunched and my dynamite hits the top of a doorframe, I'd say that counts as a death. I think it should always be the case when i've been damaged in any way by another player and proceed to blow myself up somehow.

[fading kindle]

Does shooting a corpse with incendiary/dragonsbreath ignite it?

[tidal moss]

According to Crytek they is no true skill based match making right now. It will "attempt" to find an appropriate match but if it can't do it quickly it throws its hands up and throws you to what ever is in the que.

They said they are looking to change this potentially in the future

[unique osprey]

no and technically this should have been asked in the game question channel

[queen jungle]

They make no sound(or very little) when you throw them so if 2 or more players are close to eachother it can be a good first attack since they wont know where you threw it from.

[tribal gulch]

and the servers that are garbage? and the hackers that it is impossible to play in 5-6 stars? They are going to fix that too or they are just going to continue taking out skin and profiting from the players without them fixing anything

[rotund obsidian]

@fading kindle I think igniting bodies with incendiary or dragonsbreath would be very strong (especially with the new incendiary buff coming with 1.13). Next patch, we are getting a hand crossbow ammotype that seems to act like a firebomb, and can be used to ignite bodies.

[tidal moss]

You will have to buy 6 more skins to unlock that answer please provide proof of purchase to proceed

[tribal gulch]

xd

there are fewer and fewer players xd in the end the hackers are not going to have someone to kill hahahaha

[crystal plume]

Mfw fewer and fewer players

[rotund obsidian]

bad news

100% real and legit screenshot of current day hunt population

[crystal plume]

Damn

[rotund obsidian]

lmfao we on the rise now boys

[crystal plume]

Damn the years do be going down the drain

[tribal gulch]

counting secondary accounts? xdd

[hardy coral]

Game is dead.

[tidal moss]

Game is fine but I know it's growing a lot slower then it ought to. It's got an awesome base but ton of major and minor issues that make player retention rough. O ly 64% of players get the debut achievement (kill your first hunter) meaning lots of people get the game and never go beyond the tutorial

[crystal plume]

It's active players, not total people who own the game

That number would be much higher

[tidal moss]

And include a sizable portion of people who never played beyond the tutorial.

[crystal plume]

Achievements didn't even exist since the beginning

[clever island]

That is true of most games. A lot of people buy them on sale, or get them in bundles and never launch them

[crystal plume]

Their percentages are hardly accurate

[tidal moss]

This event it going to be massive litmus test. If a new boss and event doesn't get us a new record player count idk what will.

[tidal moss]

That's the evidence the devs site. And if those people were still playing they would have earned the achievement the next time they played after it was added so they are either gone or never played beyond the tutorial

[crystal plume]

Yeah there's a big portion of players who probably played before the achievements were added and not since

Since the beginning of Hunt was pretty rough performance wise and all that

[tidal moss]

Considering they already own the game that seems like a ready made audience for Crytek to try to get back into the game. It's basically a different game now compared to what it was before the achievements. But idk how you could reach them in all honesty

[crystal plume]

I've seen some OG players coming back lately

[tidal moss]

That is good to hear. More people is the answer to 90% of the issues facing hunt.

Crappy match making? More people gives a greater chance of not getting chucked in a crappy match up by the match timer

Cheaters? More people will help make the match making better, meaning you face off against less 6 stars, cheaters tend to rise up to 6 star because well they never miss or play with unfair advantages. So by that nature they end up unfairly joining the upper echalons but the actual 6 stars are more likely to be able to handle them until Crytek can screen them out.

[crystal plume]

I honestly do not see nearly as many cheaters as some people make it seem like

And I am consistently 6 star

[tidal moss]

I think an unskilled cheater probably just looks like a normal 6 star

[crystal plume]

At that point, call me ignorant but does that really matter?

[clever island]

The secret is to be 3*. no cheaters down there (or at least they quickly get bumped up)

[crystal plume]

If I don't feel cheated out of my match, does it matter if there was a shitty wallhacker? Like obviously they shouldn't exist and deserve punishment for even trying, but I personally wouldn't care about their existence in my match at that moment

[tidal moss]

Yep. As long as they get matched against people like you it doesn't matter much. But when the match making timer runs out and it builds a random round and shoves then in a match with a bunch of 4 stars we'll that just sucks

[dusky tapir]

this is steam CCU...

[tidal moss]

But at that point it's less of an issue with cheaters and more of Crytek making a bad call to prioritize match making speed over match balance.

Something they have said they are looking to readdress soon

[crystal plume]

I know a lot of people who are more turned off by long matchmaking times, myself included

[tidal moss]

Because theirs no downside for you

[crystal plume]

Sure there might be some middlegrouond there for both side's benefit

But I do not want too strict of a matchmaking as priority

[tidal moss]

Your at the top so no mater who you match against theirs no bad matches for you just even fights or easy wins

[hardy coral]

Since I've started playing again in the last 3 weeks I haven't found a cheater or had bad matchmaking.

[hardy coral]

You'd think all the supposed cheaters would be at the top?

[clever island]

Well the people that were pissed by long queues and half empty lobbies are now silent, so it seems like there is no argument for the other side.
But the change was not malicious on Critek's part, it must have seemed like enough of an issue at the time

[tidal moss]

It's easy to forget the vast majority of hunters are not in such a privalahed position

[tidal moss]

I think most end up there at least until they get banned.

[clever island]

Granted it feels like an over correction, hence the upcoming tweaks I guess

[tidal moss]

That's a big thing I've noticed though the 6 stars don't care about match making because to them their is no match making that works against them. Either they face off against their peers and even match, or they get to curb stomp the lowe ranks and work off some stress. It's very much like a rich person looking down at someone and saying the gas prices don't bother me I'd rather pay a little more to save the environment. Heedless of how the economically disparaged do not have the luxury of making such a lofty call.

[hardy coral]

That's just how matchmaking works? If you're literally the best then you either only face the other best or people slightly worse than you.

[tribal gulch]

I personally love the game and that's why I keep playing it even if it's bad or there are hackers, but if it's true that ends up burning you and in the long term it makes you play much less or stop playing it

[tidal moss]

Which makes it easy to say "I don't care about skill based match making" but their are people who need that and care a great deal. Just because they are privaged not to care about such things do not mean they don't mater to the majority of others. And last time I looked they are a tiny minority of players

[hardy coral]

[clever island]

The fact that they are a minority is part of the issue tho, depending on time an region it's hard to fill a lobby with 6*

[tidal moss]

Yep so you have to find a middle groud

[hardy coral]

I care about skill based matchmaking because I face those of equal or higher skill than me so I can get a good match and improve. This is the case for everyone else.

[tribal gulch]

You don't care about the matchmaking because it's not right xd, if I were correctly sure you would see all those hackers that people talk about, but the matchmaking is wrong and it gives you 3, 4 or 5 stars, I'm also at 5 and 6 stars and it's like that

[crystal plume]

Saying that I don't care because I'm "privileged" is also simply not true 😄 I have actively helped new players and tried to give them the best experience possible, I'm simply standing my ground with the fact that longer queue times would hurt my and my friends enjoyment

There can be a middle ground for both

[tidal moss]

Theirs a middle road. Hunts current approach of 15 seconds then scream yolo and random fill the lobby is an extreme path one they have acknowledged needs improved

[hardy coral]

Just because there's no 7-8-9 star doesn't mean there aren't better players. 6 star is from 3k up to 5k MMR. I face some people that blow me away sometimes even though we're both 6 star.

[crystal plume]

I'm just always against ideas like making matchmaking wait until it finds a super balanced match or such since that would most likely lead to double or triple the loading times we have atm

[crystal plume]

I haven't had any 3 stars in my matches in the last week as far as I can remember

Mostly 5-6 stars

With a rare 4 star here and there

So yeah

[clever island]

Afaik it varies greatly depending in regions. I oscillate between 3 and 4*, in EU, and in 400 hours of play I have yet to see a 6* oustide of quickplay.
But, I'm in the most populated MMR bracket, in one of the most populated server region

[hardy coral]

There's no skill-based matchmaking in quickplay.

[clever island]

My point exactly

[hardy coral]

If you didn't already know.

[tribal gulch]

Yesterday I played with 2 3 star friends, most of the games were with 5 and 6 star players and many with automat killing you through walls and knowing where you are at all times

[tidal moss]

I agree but this is the current state which is wholly unacceptable

[crystal plume]

I've seen screenshots like that I don't deny that those matches seem to happen, but my matches have not had 3 stars and 4 stars have also been quite rare

So could be a regional thing, who knows

[tribal gulch]

and like those many

[crystal plume]

Doesn't happen to me on EU even off peak hours, played a lot during like 2-3am even

[clever island]

It's definitely regional, people in OCE are the worst off, afaik

[tribal gulch]

It could be a regional thing, I get it, but they should improve that because I play in Europe, which is a big server and that happens often

[tidal moss]

Nae at 6pm est on a Friday peak time. Match making is just crap no excuses for kt

[karmic ivy]

I play US east/west, usualy a little in the morning, and a little in the early evening. No trouble matchmaking. And I like the matches.

[keen oak]

it's not EU problem because the bulk, or at least circa 50% of the playerbase is EU

[solid inlet]

@valid mango you'll be able to get only 50 BBs weekly, not 150 💀

[valid mango]

now you have 50 and after the change bd 150 as they were going to increase it but it is still a ridiculous number

[rotund obsidian]

i've heard nothing of them increasing it, afaik it's gonna be 50 per week after the patch on wednesday

[valid mango]

On the economy video they said they will increase quantity but remove in-game acquisition 🤡

[rotund obsidian]

yeah, they're buffing it from 25 to 50 for the weekly challenges

right now, in 1.12, the weeklies only give 25 bloodbonds for a whole week of challenges

[solid inlet]

no, you are wrong. Now you get 25 for weeklies, and they are doubling it to 50 and that's it

[light badge]

Sorry the timing for this was just perfect
Diiba right after saying they're usually 6* "yeah I don't mind getting paired with free food" I couldn't help but actually laugh at loud

[valid mango]

2.5 skin per 1 year xDDD

[solid inlet]

Great numbers, innit?

[crystal plume]

Excluding dark tribute, BB pouches/registers, events, I don't remember if questlines had BB rewards but they might, and the fact that BB skins get frequent sales

[rotund obsidian]

dark tribute will be a non-insignificant factor to bloodbond gain, but honestly i think bb pouches and registers have made up such a ridiculously small percentage of my total bloodbonds it's crazy

pretty sure questlines don't have any bb rewards, just hunt dollars and copies of weapons and stuff (outside of the final tier reward of a skin or whatever)

[valid mango]

playing last week after 6h a day I hit only 1 pouch and zero gold cash registers. all the time looking for bags of $.... by the way, from the daily extract every week you gained 25 + weekly +25 which will be the same as the new weekly +50 and so currently from the game alone easily 150-200 bb you could get! simply by playing -.-after the patch they take it away from us and skins are expensive because they cost +- 1000bb which means that even after promotions are 3 skins per year and every event they give you battlepasses that cost 1000bb which means that to collect for battlepass you have to do missions for half a year to collect it.

[outer wedge]

They gave to many BB anyway, if you played regularly, If it all means we can get better servers, its good, but i think they should make BB purses and Gold Register not lost on death, or else people just going to insta extract if they find one xD

[valid mango]

they said they weren't going to buy better servers because the current ones are sufficient

so there's no way they can buy better servers, and please don't explain it to yourself like that

[worthy knoll]

yes, but a game should not be balanced for the benefit of the best but the majority, i.e. 3-4 stars.

[tight delta]

When has ever the extra revenue from AAA-game be invested back into the game that's generating it 😅

[outer wedge]

One can dream! xD

[analog willow]

@brisk timber I like it!👍 #game-ideas

[tight delta]

True, I'm just being cynical. Hopefully the BB-changes result in a better game 😉

[outer wedge]

Hopefully!

[rotund obsidian]

surely all the extra revenue won't go towards crysis 4, right guys?

[queen jungle]

Man I'm really looking forward to that one!

[worthy knoll]

but who would ever siffon money from one game to make another game hoping that it will surely be as good and as much of a succes as the first one of its kind and then be dissapointend when it does not.

[queen jungle]

I'd argue Hunt has been a reasonable success. Not sure whether it was close to Crysis, but certainly one of Crytek's more popular titles.

[royal grove]

https://tenor.com/view/cr1tikal-penguinz0-meme-woo-yeah-baby-gif-19316511

chri5six — Today at 2:36 PM
Title: Full damage to team
Description: damage dealt to team mates should be the same as to enemy hunters and should not be reduced in any way. Dealing full damage to team mates encourages higher skill level in combat, with more care needed so as not to injure your team (many other games have friendly fire, hunt should be the same)

[solid inlet]

@brisk timber good stuff

[worthy knoll]

I meant to say that IMO a new crisis will Not be the Hit the First one was.
Its a Shooter With pressumably great graphics (that a Lot of people will Not be able to Play properly because of that).

[unborn dagger]

Shoots both my team mates in the face and then extract.

[tacit raven]

Finally get the avto out of the game

[royal grove]

report?

[unborn dagger]

I don't know if I'd report my own team mates after shooting them but I suppose that's an option

[royal grove]

what are you talking about

[unborn dagger]

Learn to understand a joke my dude

[royal grove]

it sounded sarcastic, learn to convey humor my dude

[unborn dagger]

Not my fault you can't understand a very obvious joke lol but you do you pal

[royal grove]

god bless

[brisk timber]

This is exactly why i think its not a good idea to begin with

Maybe for premade groups

But randoms could do too much harm with this

[unborn dagger]

Exactly, it's just not good unless the devs remove matchmaking which would kill the game

[brisk timber]

its already exploitable with frag nades

[unborn dagger]

Also it would just be immensely frustrating.

While in a gunfight specifically

[alpine fractal]

@celest spindle thanks for being the only person to support my suggestion…at least someone else knows good suggestions when they see it 👍

[light badge]

don't forget you're using 2000 a year for battlepasses

[soft river]

@glass sundial The bullets that gun shoots are not medium ammo tier

This gun would be a compact gun

[light badge]

I would love separate ladder keybind, trying to res a teammate that died on the ladder often ends up painful

[fickle plover]

man just getting destroyed in 6* lobbies even though we are only 4*s

this mmr change really grinds my gears

[celest spindle]

Such a controversial change to the games playstyle and rewarding system, but could be funny lol

[queen jungle]

@celest spindle There are some issues with 4-player teams.

a) The game was and still is made and balanced for duos as duos is Hunt's core mode. Trios was added upon popular demand, but the devs have since emphasised repeatedly that "the rule of two" aka duos, remains in focus.
Three players in a team already makes Hunt a lot easier than duos since PvP and AI are balanced for duos, four would break the balance even more.

b) 16 players on a map would be 60% more than what the game and maps were originally designed for. 12 players is already 20% more than that and it gets really crowded at times tbh.

I recommend you and your friends form two duo teams and play that way (without teaming of course as that violates the code of conduct).

[celest spindle]

but what if the game finally gets a map and ai expansion? then that way it wouldn't be that effecting to the experience, or squads could have their own set of game rules such as tougher mobs, larger maps (basic maps but expanded)?

if those changes do happen then it wouldn't be much of a problem to implement teams of 4 in my pov

but i definetly get what you mean

[queen jungle]

That would require massive development effort as the devs would essentially have to support two versions of tha game for a feature that isn't really necessary.

[dusky tapir]

@glass sundial I like how you even made variant pitches for your suggestion

I feel like crytek might no longer want to exclusively stick to real world weapons ( given uppermat ) but given the pump traits ingame I'd like to see the colt lightning as something else that can take advantage of them

[hardy coral]

Uppermat is sort of real.

[obsidian narwhal]

@glass sundial so when you're bashing someone with the mace you can just yell over VoIP "YOU'VE BEEN.... THUNDERSTRUCK"

[silent turtle]

does t his game kick your or someting if you go above 200 ping...

[little jackal]

nope

[hardy coral]

Centennial is already balanced @frail shard . It's the vetterli that needs a buff.

Vet should deal more damage than it already does (non silencer variants). Even as much as 140 tbh.

[half stag]

On top of that, it is actually chambered in 40-60, as seen on top of the breech area. Also, it already fires faster than the vetterli with iron repeater, the base hipfire is just bugged.

[hardy coral]

The max firerate for both guns is closer than you think but without cheating via a dot onscreen you'll never be really able to take advantage of the vet firerate.

Centennial is just extremely reliable with the follow ups like the regular winnie is with the bonus of medium ammo and medium FMJ dropoff alongside that great velocity.

[frail shard]

Interesting. So iron repeater does buff the speed? It’s not just the ability to remain in iron sights?

[half stag]

All iron traits buff ads rof

[hardy coral]

Those traits buff the firerate for all guns they effect by at least 10% afaict.

Same for the scopesmith traits.

But hardscoping is a terrible idea.

[little jackal]

curious what the "bonus of medium ammo"

[hardy coral]

It has more pen and less dropoff than compact.

Not the same jump up as medium to long but it's still a noticeable difference.

[half stag]

Uh huh, if we're talking about headshot range, then I'd agree, but the body shot damage is a joke

[hardy coral]

It's still better than compact.

[half stag]

Still don't feel anything from medium past 30m, unless they're running fmj, which compact can also do

[hardy coral]

Compact FMJ still isn't as good.

[little jackal]

I'd pick compact over medium any day

[hardy coral]

Vetterli is trash but Centennial has its place.

[frail shard]

That’s curious for me to hear, I feel like I run into a ton of vetterli users and hardly any centennials. I love me some centennial though.

[hardy coral]

People running vet are making a mistake tbh. There's nothing good about the gun over others.

[brisk timber]

sorry but this is the weirdest take i have read in a looooong ass time on this discord

$100 medium ammo 130 dmg
can take out targets with 1 HPBar missing
Compareable fast to krag and cent
Has access to HV ammo which makes it MV nearly as fast as long ammo guns

Vetterli right now is in a really good spot

[hardy coral]

If you want a cheap gun with a high velocity you'd use cent or winnie HV, if you want one taps you'd use a sparks/martini for cheap or just chalk up for a proper long ammo bolty. The gun is only comparably fast if you don't aim at all and just spam it, the cycling animation makes it difficult to exploit the max firerate.

It's a jack of all trades gun and imo in hunt that's a bad thing sicne you can't push any advantage at any point and so are at the mercy of your enemy.

More an 8 of all trades with how powerful it actually is.

I can only really think of it as a gun with a niche with FMJ since then you can actually make use of the 130 damage to drop already downed hunters but at that point you're just using a mosin/lebel with half the velocity and similar ammo economy.

Also the vet is losing its ammo resupply with the patch too.

[glass sundial]

@soft river

1- There were many iterations of the same rifle chambered for diferent calibers.
Personnally i suggested it primarily as a medium ammo option cuz of the photos of the Colt Lightning Express "large frame" i found looked better in my opinion, and the regular one looked...puny, and too thin and fragile to fit a mace head on the pommel stuff like that.

@dusky tapir

2- Thank you, i try to follow naming_conventions to think of variants. Although it does annoy me a little how the sawed-off versions of the long weapons follow almost none of them: Compact, Vandal, Shorty, etc.
I like to think ahead of what could fit as a complement on the long run: theres no other Mace variant, theres almost no Aperture variants, etc.

@obsidian narwhal

3- That sounds so much like a Homereel gun review type of joke jaja.

[ionic beacon]

Did you guys say if rockjaw is comming to revular rotation after the event?

And you were unclear. In the wildcard. Can rotjaw be on maps with two other boss targets making 5 total bounties.

[light badge]

510 hunt dollars for the drilling? Guess I'll never be seeing the cool new gun in games after the event :/

[unborn dagger]

@azure osprey I am in agreement with you on it and am hoping that the trait is only part of the event and nothing else. Same with death cheat

[tribal wyvern]

Did they release the prices for the new weapons?

See ppl complain bout the drilling one

[wind stream]

510 for drilling

[tribal wyvern]

Whew

Thats

Cheap

[wind stream]

and 440 for uppermat

[hardy coral]

440 for uppermat is insane, why ever use that?

[unborn dagger]

That's a fair price for uppermat

[tribal wyvern]

Did not expect a 510 for a medium ammo wep

300 maybe

[hardy coral]

Drilling price makes sense.

[wind stream]

its weird that its more expensive than the 1 slot uppercut

being 2 slot is a huge downside

[unborn dagger]

Drilling rifle is kinda fucked tho with its price

[spring hound]

It has a shotgun

[tribal wyvern]

so does lematt carb but its not 250

[spring hound]

Drilling is a two tap chest at the same speed as the rival.

[light badge]

My guess is "free" quartermaster because of respeccing is supposed to be the justification :/

[wind stream]

the fast double tap with the drilling will be strong

and it has a romero attached

instead of half a rival like the carbine

[upper hearth]

@unborn sandal I agree the drillings price point is high. However, I don't agree with your comparison of the lemat carbine and officer carbine. The medium ammo and the quick two tap it can provide at further rangers than standard compact is a slight justification for it. The shotgun aspect was compared to romero giving it 15m roughly for one shot range with buckshot. So that is also very nice. not counting the custom ammos you might get. EDIT: I also, don't think "two" rounds is a good argument for it being cheaper. Mosin, vs lebel being 100 dollars less but not needing to reload nearly as often. Sparks vs springfield. The ammo type and damage range plays a bigger role in the pricing than the amount of shots it has before reloading.

Again I agree the price is steep. They did the same with terminus, slate and centennial. iirc, all of those weapons saw near 100+ in decreases. I think drilling should be in the 300-350 range. You are getting a extreamly versatile weapon and good ammo pool, good resupply numbers, and good custom ammo.

The dev team seems to take this approach often. Over nerf things via price, or gameplay nerfs such as reloads, fire rates, etc. Then slowly buff it again in the middle. Sort of an overcorrection strategy. Personally I am okay with this. Because when you overcorrect and bring it back somewhere in the middle you get less complaints about it being to strong. Cause most players got to experience it at its weakest and realize this is a good spot. If that made sense. Fortunately for me hunt dollars is not an issue and I will be running this weapon a lot. I absolutely love it and have been asking for almost a year for it.

[unborn sandal]

My point wasn’t that it should be as cheap as it’s competitors, but that it shouldn’t be that ridiculously expensive

[light badge]

I'd rather they do with with stats than price. Price means nothing for high skilled players but new players and low MMR hunters just don't get to use the fancy thing, with is super unfun

[unborn sandal]

It’s still a single barrel shotgun and medium rifle, both of which have very limited capabilities

Medium doesn’t have that much better two tap range

Have you ever tried using a centennial without fmj

[upper hearth]

i dont disagree. price isn't a good balancing mechanic.

[unborn sandal]

It’s like shooting nerf darts

[upper hearth]

I went a month only using centennial before the buffs and yes i use it with and without fmj depending on what i am feeling and pairing it with. FMJ doesn't really change much for me. But I try to aim only for heads. if i am having a bad day then its body shots and fmj is better at that point.

[unborn sandal]

But your point earlier was the two tap range

If you headshot it doesn’t matter

Medium ammo two tap body range isn’t significantly better than compact

[upper hearth]

The two tap is still better than compact was my point.

[upper hearth]

I may have missed it, did they show the damage stats for it. Cause that will play a factor as well. if it does 130. your two tap is farther and you downed hunters become 1 shot.

[light badge]

I think this feels extra bad because there's obviously a noticeable boost to the price for the shotgun underbarrel, but it's not like we have ANY non-nitro double barrel to play with if we don't need the shotgun attached to get the price down to a sustainable spot for players not rolling in money

[upper hearth]

Again my reply to Basil, wasn't disagreeing the price is too high. I was pointing out the carbine(s) compasions isn't a good one. and having more shots before reload isn't a good one either.

I think it should over around the 300-350 range.

[unborn sandal]

That’s still too expensive for what you’re getting imo

it’s a Romero with two springfields strapped on top ostensibly

[light badge]

Oh yeah I'm not disagreeing with you. Just trying to put more thoughts for anyone that relays info to devs if they include this. I was super duper hyped for this gun but at this price it's effectively DOA for basically everybody that I play with. And I'll probably rarely see it on other hunters unless I try to rank instead of staying out of higher ranks playing fun builds

[unborn sandal]

I understand that it’s a powerful combo

[hardy coral]

It is, with the damage it's likely getting alongside FMJ it'll have an 85 metre two tap range and the shotgun is a long one, they said so.

[light badge]

I mean, just double barreled Springfield is really good and worth a LOT more than 2xspringfield cost. But I was predicting 300 and thought that was reasonable

[hardy coral]

Current price is reasonable considering how strong it'll be on launch. They'll probably nerf it and reduce the price later.

[upper hearth]

thats where i was with it. 300-350 range i wouldn't complain. two springfields + romero would be amazing if the damage stats for the medium ammo rifle follows the springfields. 132 damage. you are two tapping at good ranges.

[light badge]

I 100% expect nerf and no price decrease

[upper hearth]

i think price point is because everyone will try to run it during event. then like every new weapon during events they are OP really only cause everyone is trying it. but everyone then cries they are too strong. Bow as a horrible casualty to the event situation

[light badge]

But why would you not want people to be able to run one of the biggest parts of an event regularly? That's literally the main reason my friends get back on hunt for new events

[unborn sandal]

68 meters according to damage charts

If you can hit both upper chest

Which is easier said than done considering how much arm hit boxes enjoy getting in the way

also there’s no way it will do 132 damage

[upper hearth]

68 meters if far. I have been doing a full damage chart with the shooting range so we can get accurate hard numbers. My numbers are slightly better and worse on some of the weapons compared to the chart you are referencing.

[unborn sandal]

I can almost guarantee you it will be more akin to a centennial

[light badge]

Also it's not going to be like close range where you can be super sloppy controlling the recoil aince the distance will be so much higher.....

[unborn sandal]

it will also have the same problem officer carbine has if you try to shoot it to fast. Good luck hitting your target

[upper hearth]

I agree, but i am so sick of seeing everything being listed as OP. just because everyone uses it during an event. I agree price is too high. it needs to be brought down.

[unborn sandal]

the lemat carbine was fine from day one. It even got buffed post event

[upper hearth]

i don't have this issue with nitro and i hardly run that gun. I don't have this issue with carbine either.

[unborn sandal]

I’m talking for the average person mr elite gamer

We aren’t all hornet

[upper hearth]

Carbine gets crazy if you spam 3 shots back to back. and i am far from elite. i am no where close to hornet or any of those guys.

I played against hornet once to my knowledge and sadly appeared in one of his videos. he destroyed me and my team.

It wasn't even close.

[upper hearth]

I am slightly above average at best. but controlling recoil in shooters isn't difficult to me. I am average because some days I cant hit the damn ground if I was looking at it. My aim consistency is bad not recoil control.

Again we both agree it needs to drop in price based on info we currently have. Even then not much new info could convince me it needs to stay at 510. But less than 300 imo would be amazing, but too cheap for what you get.

[rotund obsidian]

well, conversion fmj has better falloff/range than pax fmj

[stark fulcrum]

Thats sad, 510 for drilling i mean.

Was hoping to include it on my normal loadouts

[rotund obsidian]

ikr, it should be minimum 700

[stark fulcrum]

Lol

[rotund obsidian]

the thing gets PENNYSHOT, crazy ass gun fr

[stark fulcrum]

What ammo types does the medium include on it

Dum dum?

[rotund obsidian]

dumdum and fmj

[stark fulcrum]

Ah ok

Taco where you see all this info i wanna go look

[rotund obsidian]

you can probably get a lot from the infographics and short summary videos but here's what they spoke about towards the end:
Drilling: 510 hd, dumdum + fmj, slug/penny/flechette
Railroad Hammer: 15 hd
choke beetle : 22 hd
medpack: 35 hd
toolpack: 70 hd
slate riposte: 359 hd
uppermat: 440 hd, poison+fmj and probably the existing lemat shotgun types

[stark fulcrum]

Lackluster

[rotund obsidian]

i think the thing i'll use the most out of these is the slate riposte tbh

[stark fulcrum]

No one gonna run uppermat except if they pick one up or for a clip

I mean 2 slot ruined it

[rotund obsidian]

eh i think we'll see plenty of both guns for a while, and eventually i imagine the prices will get reduced after the usage rate drops off post-event

[stark fulcrum]

just use an obrez

For sure everyone will run both but after event I dont expect to see many

Uppermat just feels really weird imo

But then again I'm a pax man

For life

[rotund obsidian]

I'm a little disappointed it's so high, since I love running double medium slot setups from time to time, but I do kinda understand. Darn quartermaster crippling two-slots always

[stark fulcrum]

I'm in the same position with drilling

Would love to run a double barrel rifle

But 510 is a bit high for me to use consistently

Sparks it is

With fire ammo

[upper hearth]

@azure osprey
I understand where you come from. Sound is an extremely important aspect of this game. While showing off some of the best sound design in all of gaming. However, I disagree that instinct destroys this need.

“It's a bad idea to add this trait in game, because it ruins a lot of fundamental basics in game and kills an stealth/ambush type of gameplay.” It does not kill this, and here are some retorts. First, I think you misunderstand how far 75meters is in this game. It’s a radius and not a single direction. You are also unable to determine location nor are you able to identify distance (to my knowledge).

” In my opinion this trait should not be added to the game, i think i will quit playing the game because it kills my style of gameplay” **It does not ruin that playstyle. This trait 1 is only for the event, two it is referenced to act like glowing clues, and boss lair flashing red. Again, lack of directional knowledge of someone’s location and a much wider radius of 75meters. If it functions the exact same way as the other two mechanics. Then use beetles to screw with people. They will think of someone within 75 meters when you could be over 100 meters away. Also use the lack of directional knowledge to your advantage using decoys blank fire, or regular ones. To cause Ai to get rowdy and to make them think you are where you are not to line them up for your ambush. You could cause them to panic and be confused more with this. **
Finally, don’t quit. Learn to use this to your advantage. You can still ambush. I see this trait not being that good ultimately.

Additionally, Bows max 1 shot range is more than 10 meters.

[wintry comet]

i just want to dig this suggestion back up so it doesnt get lost in the pile, this is a genuinely good idea and i would love to have first party support for postfx #game-ideas message

[worthy knoll]

so garbage 124 dmg, great gun cucked again

[worthy knoll]

agreed. Why choose this over the Uppercut? for the shotgun that nobody used on the regular Leat except maybe for flare guns as a meme?

[hardy coral]

The slug is decent, you get 3 more shots and the stats are generally better than an uppercut from what I'm seeing. Issue is that it's 2 slot and costs more than uppercut.

[upper hearth]

i think like the drilling it will ultimately be cheaper than the starting price.

[worthy knoll]

So vor the Chance of using s Bad Shotgun (that needs slugs??) I get a worse obrez. Why Not Take the much cheaper obrez and Play a regular Shotgun instead? I am running quartermaster either way

[hardy coral]

You can use the lemat to stack more shells/slugs for your shotgun. It'll have less harsh sway than obrez and likely a higher ROF so closer up it'll 2 tap faster.

Obrez is still ofc better if you want to reach out and compete against proper long ammo rifle players with a shotgun loadout.

But uppermat isn't terrible, just doesn't square up too well against the uppercut. Those 6 points are better spent elsewhere in a loadout.

[worthy knoll]

So in conclusion its Not horrible, except the Name, but its Not good in Any way either.
Because I May be mistaken but the shown footage showed heavy revoil etc.
Again, misdesigned Gun. No real niche, No competition for anything.

Same With the Drilling 510 Base (dumdum 50 i guess) i get a Mosin for that....

[soft river]

@proud narwhal the lemat is priced that way because
it can use slugs
it is a single slot
it doesn't need quartermaster for a large gun

theres more to pricing other than raw stats

[proud narwhal]

ITS LITTERALLY 2 SLOT WHAT ARE YOU SMOKING

[soft river]

its 2 handed

not 2 slot

[proud narwhal]

ok, let me know when you see it tmrw xD

[soft river]

it also has more ammo

[proud narwhal]

ill set a reminder to ping you when youre wrong

i meant to reply to the two slot thing

it IS two hands

[soft river]

oh it is medium slot

damn

drilling price is bad I agree

[proud narwhal]

XD

[soft river]

still it can use slugs and has more ammo

[gaunt garden]

for the love of God, can we please get some sort of ping limit? there is no reason players from around the world should be ping-abusing this game. what is the point of having regions if people don't have to play in them?

[unborn sandal]

“Ping abusing”

[alpine fractal]

@prime ibex i don’t agree with that suggestion tbh. That perk is already too strong and makes poison virtually useless

However a new perk that reduces coughing in choke bombs, reduces grunts of pain when being shot and falling from big heights could be interesting as a perk

Maybe it could also reduce the distance ur yell can be heard when you die to make hunters second guess if they killed you and should push your teamates for the 3v2 or not

[stark fulcrum]

Big nope on the last one

[prime ibex]

Bring Antidote, don't need to worry about poison then. If anything it makes the perk 30% more useful cause you get a (~3) second time of not taking any damage from poison. The devs already buffed Salveskin, so why not Mithra? At least it serves a stronger use than just being a time reducer.

Literally no one picks up mithridatist cause there's better perks like Salve or Bloodless that combat even stronger problems. To even the extent that Antidote given at any time completely wipes out the use of anything poison related.

[light badge]

Ou God, a perk that just reduces the sound of your death cry would be interesting, and by interesting I mean absolutely mindfuck

[hybrid owl]

Especially with the solo revive X): did I just heard someone die? 2 sec. later there's a guy rushing you with a Shotgun

[light badge]

Hey now. Solo revive is 10 seconds. Don't give the nErF sOlO rEvIvE'rs more fuel :p

[brisk timber]

its absurd how people still calling for nerfs
10s already is so much that you really only use it if sniping or to leave the map if people dont burn your corpse. Getting back up after 10sec and you already have 3 guns pointed at your face.

[zenith wagon]

Would be cool if your hunter makes the death sound when on the last bar, but makes a louder healing sound when on the last bar

[hybrid owl]

That's not what I meant, I do find solo revive fine and already hoped during the initial event that they would keep it for solos!

[steady prism]

@wise tiger
Point 3) doesnt make sense... Your objective in Hunt:Showdown is to track the boss, kill it, banish it and carry the bounty home...

Thats it. Quite literally.

Sure there is a PvP element there but thats not your goal. Not lore-wise and not gameplay-wise

[queen jungle]

Agreed, PvP is intentionally unrewarding because it would distract people from the objective

[steady prism]

Precisely that... Killing people is MUCH easier than killing, banishing and leaving with bounty

other hunters are not your target... bounty is... other players are just an obstacle... like grunts

main purpose of giving players MUCH MORE money for returning with bounty compared to killing players is because it wouldnt make any sense to care about bounty in the first place

[brisk timber]

I think that argument, while true and should be respected from a gameplay perspective - the real motivation why people come to play Hunt is always the social interaction via competition.

The objective of the bounty is the theatrical stage for that to happen and should always be nourished but without belittle the pvp aspect as the motivational factor.
Both go hand in hand.

[steady prism]

people would just go somewhere near the middle... bush camped few hunters and left

[steady prism]

i agree... u need PvP in hunt for it to be fun

but the bounty is here for a reason... it serves the same purpose as blue zone in PUBG

it forces people to clash with each other... but your priority is not to kill other players but to deliver bounty...

[queen jungle]

Yes, PvP and competition are major aspects of the game, I agree. But there are already players who just leave once they are certain nobody else is aline instead of playing the objective. Making PvP more rewarding would incentivse such behaviour.

[steady prism]

ie be the one winning team that brings the bounty back... and everything that happens in the match is unimportant as long as you carry the bounty home... ie. you win

[brisk timber]

Indeed.
Im one of the guys who always pledged to increase the attractiveness of getting the hands on the Bounty - i think thats still a part of the game that is a bit unrewarding.

[brisk timber]

Definitely.

[steady prism]

yes i agree... its still a bit unrewarding

imho they should rework avto and introduce other weapons to be awarded as a boss drop

that way the bounty would be even more rewarding

but thats a long stretch

[hardy coral]

People simply not understanding the pricing lul

[brisk timber]

oh they will soon if the get shot by a rifle and if they push get shot by a shotgun

[hardy coral]

I can't see what makes the drilling bad? I guess it can hurt if you only land 1 hit with the rifle and have to reload but you're quite freed up to take whatever sidearm you want to help counteract that.

Could even take an obrez or such as your secondary and use the drilling primarily for close range punish.

Uppermat is a bit much since medium slot has always been rightly seen as awkward but the respec changes that massively.

[brisk timber]

i think even tho the tenor often here is "money is no concern lul"
thats a bit of an assumption that maybe holds true to some people
so $510 for many people is a price range where you usually dont buy it yourselfe but rather loot it from other rich people

I think $510 is reasonable tho - but for people who wanna play the new hype gun thats a bit offputting

[hot vigil]

Eh, it is classic Crytek, both the Slate and Centennial released overpriced.

[hardy coral]

Centennial was obviously overpriced. It was bad on paper and in practice.

Drilling is good on paper and obviously good in practice.

And slate got reduced in price by what, 50 bucks?

[steady prism]

wait that new thingy costs 510 dollars?

isnt it just asingle shot medium ammo rifle combined with single shot shotgun?

[hardy coral]

It's a two shot medium ammo rifle combined with a romero basically.

[steady prism]

two shot

ok that makes sense

imho thats still a bit steep for a skill cannon... but we will see

[celest wedge]

Honestly with 120 damage it has no business being this expensive

[steady prism]

the thing is... you can two tap people quite fast

but you have to hit both...

and i bet that centennial or vetterli will still be better for this

[left rose]

it is medium ammo dropoff and only has 120 dmg... 2 hits aren't usually enough sadly

[hardy coral]

It gets FMJ and Dum Dum does it not?

FMJ with that damage brings the two tap out to around 82-85 metres while Dum Dum would kill downed hunters up close.

[left rose]

sadly 120 is never enough for 2 arm shots to kill, which is a major downside
even centennial can do that

which also has access to fmj

[hardy coral]

And fires slower and doesn't have a good shotgun attached to it. I am yet to see the issue with the drilling.

[left rose]

the issue is it can't compete with the top guns

crytek hates medium ammo

[steady prism]

i dont think that its going to be a "good" shotgun

[left rose]

but hey, at least it's better than springfield so I can play a different rifle for the dumdum challenge

[steady prism]

for example LeMat carbine is dismal despite having a massive barrel

i bet that the drilling would be the same

[fallow sandal]

what in the hell have you done to the officer carbine I didn't know that we have a second avto in the game this thing does not miss make it as it was before

[steady prism]

i love the idea of having a universal skill cannon... but i doubt it would be worth 510

[steady prism]

what exactly is the issue with nagant carbine?

[rotund obsidian]

i think its fine, offloads a bit of price for people who dont care about the hunter anyway but still wants the pass skins

[brisk timber]

Thats already the baseline wrong thought here.

It isnt meant to compete its meant to expand and add versatility to the armory. The drilling is a jack-of-all trades. That means its peak power in all of it aspects need to be a bit lower to not be the solution to end all.
Thats balancing 101.

[left rose]

a bit lower

not bad

[brisk timber]

You basically have a long barrel rifle and a long barrel shotgun in one. Thats a hugh upside already. You have the second slot open to do whatever you like. Taking a handxbow for utility as example.

[left rose]

see the winfield, that's a great allrounder

[brisk timber]

A winny cant OHK with slugs tho.

[left rose]

has 16 bullets with levering tho

[brisk timber]

Not in the same department.

[left rose]

aim punch + trading window

[queen jungle]

@granite mango There is no such way. If you have an issue and need support, check #customer-support
Otherwise, your feedback does get seen on this Discord 🙂

[gilded dune]

The new Steam UI made it unable to invite 2 players at the same time anybody has the same issue?

[fallow sandal]

too accurate it barely has a kick