feedback-discussion

[queen jungle]

I have friend all over the globe and yeah, I play on EU with 300 ping

And NA with 200 ping so

Its doesnt matter much if you never use shotgun

Also, lower ping still have advantage that you see the higher ping players first, so if you died to a higher ping player mean you are standing still for them to shoot

[knotty ore]

This is just not true. Anecdotally, hundreds of players will tell you that laggers are way harder to register hits on, and that they have a massive peak advantage.

At what point will it stop being anecdotal? How many players have to tell you their experience with region violators before its believed?

[native kiln]

Eu server is dead?

[jagged crane]

Same issue in US here

[native kiln]

here we go again

https://tenor.com/view/ah-shit-here-we-go-again-ah-shit-cj-gta-gta-san-andreas-gif-13933485

[knotty ore]

"Servers are working as intended, something wrong with your system."

[native kiln]

"my internet and my setup is better than you would expect don't put the blame on it". Lol

[night quarry]

yes, again

[queen jungle]

[timber timber]

Dear Devs, The new detailed damage breakdown is appreciated. However a major downside is that i'm now very aware of how massively broken your hit detection code is. There has been at least multiple cases every single day where i'll get a hit marker and sound from the game notifying me that i've landed a shot. Then following another inglorious death I see that nothing was registered in the system. I can only conclude that either the feature doesn't work (you do claim that it's a beta) or that the hit detection code is broken. I personally feel that it is the game code as I cannot imagine how you'd stuff up a simple display of the game data compared to the rat nest of server coding.
...
the hit register code is a joke just play on the basis there is non
the game revolved around RNG shooting

[iron trench]

@fringe dawn Stop using Gunslinger mode 👍 🙂

[fringe dawn]

? Why

[iron trench]

So that way you'll always be in lowered state

[fringe dawn]

Yeah but I don't want to be in lowered state and press 2 buttons to aim down sight

I would love if there was a button to lower/raise your weapon

Other than Q

One dedicated to it you know

[iron trench]

@crystal plume I'm sorry for mentioning you, but i don't know why.. but i can't send interactions and post images anymore... i thought for a second that it was a channel thing, but i see people sending images and emotes and i can't, idk what is happening.

[knotty ore]

Its a class thing. You are not in the right class.

Could be just the reds hatin'. I can't post emotes either.

😆

Wait yes I can lol

[iron trench]

Makes sense...

[knotty ore]

Just can't reply with emotes.

[vital drum]

@hybrid forum I don't think the reasons for canning that ToD were technical, so I wouldn't expect the engine update to affect anything here.

[iron trench]

i can't.. no emotes, no images, no interactions

[whole python]

when will i be able to post pics again? i need help for troubleshooting

i get the cryput.dll error cannot be loaded error

cant start hunt

any ideas how to fix this? direct x is up to date

[vital drum]

Ask in #troubleshooting and if you don't find a solution, contact #customer-support

[iron trench]

Thanks, my friend... i was sending a suggestion and couldn't post images to explain better my thoughts...👍

[knotty ore]

Bruh just make sure you dont download dlls online lol

[vital drum]

https://www.artstation.com/artwork/aReYKq

Yeah they specify here that it's because of gameplay

[silent tartan]

If its because visibility, does it matter much? I feel like dusk has the same issues

from the screenshots it seems fine 🤷‍♂️

[vital drum]

I don't really care about that part, just mentioning it because it's another engine-related rumour

[silent tartan]

true, I see now

[knotty ore]

I wish they'd equalize Hunt settings. I play on high viz settings and my partner doesn't. Sometimes, I have to yell, "he is right there" because he can't see people and I can eagle spot people at like 200m.

Which is fundamentally unfair. I'm willing to take the hit and not spot people easily if that means everyone has an even playing field, but it seems doing it now is a huge disadvantage.

[karmic bear]

I just wished they would have a proper random skilled matchmaking setting. I understand skilled based matchmaking I do. But come on I remember when random matches were fun. Skilled based feels like it belongs in ranked type style games. People wouldn't cause MMR abuse if this was resolved.

[iron trench]

Maybe he is just blind...

[knotty ore]

Naw. There is a maaaaaassive difference between settings in terms of visibility. Especially, with things like fire. Effects high v low is a difference between seeing through smoke and not.

When people toss chokes, I can see shit right through them. Looks like I'm looking through thick glass. For my partner it looks like he is looking through smoke. Settings need to be equalized imo otherwise its fundamentally stupid to play at high settings in high MMR.

[iron trench]

idk, man... i think that this is a major problem in all games... low settings is always an advantage...

[knotty ore]

To some extent, that's true. Hunt encourages rat play, so spotting people is super necessary.

[karmic bear]

Aren't they trying to upgrade to there newest engine because Hunt is Graphically and Optimized held back?

[knotty ore]

But, if you force some effect/geometry settings to stay at high, it would go a long way to even the field. It would affect low spec players though.

I just want to be able to trust effects like smoke and fire to block vision, but at my MMR that's almost never the case.

[vital drum]

Primary reason is likely the current gen update for consoles. That requires DX12 support. Plus they've been working on the new engine version for a while, so it will come with some new bells and whistles.

[knotty ore]

Hopefully they force some of those things on by default on PC. I also want them to ban using crosshair overlays. Right now almost every content creator uses them. That's how you see they pull accurate and quick transition. Their crosshair placement is perfect because they have crosshair overlays. I've tried it out, its cheap as fuck. Improves your aim by a lot for $7.

[karmic bear]

@vital drum Ahh better lighting, gun details, character details, Maybe better rendering... I hope.

[knotty ore]

CrosshairX should be an auto steam ban for Hunt imo

[karmic bear]

@knotty ore Whats CrosshairX?

[vital drum]

Out of those only object rendering might require an engine update tbh. DX12 might bring in CPU optimizations that will allow them to render more stuff farther.

Hunt already uses a fairly sophisticated SVOGI system that can be just bumped up a notch in resolution for some ultra setting. Same with details.

[knotty ore]

Its a crosshair overlay. Lets you put like a small dot where the center of the crosshair is. So, when you transition from hip to ironsight, you can pre-place the crosshair and pull thr trigger super fast. You know how a lot of videos from content creators when have insanely fast quickscopes and followup shots? Yeah thats a crosshair overlay.

[karmic bear]

Finally my CPU Intel I7 10700k won't feel like it does nothing

[knotty ore]

Also really useful when you use a shotgun while jumping if you have a dot in the center.

[vital drum]

I mean newer stuff like DLSS, FSR, better more modern TAA, partially fixing the problem with screen space reflections.

Obviously back end has been mentioned, so preparation for stuff like custom lobbies and general improvements.

[karmic bear]

@vital drum Can... Can we have random skilled based matchmaking plz.. I'll give you bloodbonds.

[vital drum]

I mean, Hunt's matchmaking already allows for skill variation. It doesn't really push things into the classic ranked category, just helps less savvy players.

[karmic bear]

Hmm maybe it's because players don't find a need to prestige. Its a very common issue. I just prestiged to see number go up.

[knotty ore]

I don't because I don't want to lose my 30 mosins avtos nitros uppercuts etc.

[vital drum]

Wait, how is prestige related?

[karmic bear]

@vital drum If you prestige your gear is completely reset. Making players start from the beginning again. Most weapons aren't that bad on the start and evens out the playing field for most hunters.

[vital drum]

Yeah idk, prestiging didn't really affect things much for me. Either way, there is room for a "free-for-all" mode, of course. But current MM allows for some variation at least.

[karmic bear]

@vital drum Whoa wait hol up? Variation? Most matches I've been in had and I wish I was kidding Long Ammo and Shotguns.. No joke I've only ran into one hunter using dual wields

[vital drum]

I mean skill variation primarily. Types of weapons will of course change quite a bit between brackets

[karmic bear]

@vital drum Between Brackets??? How are they determining this? Are they just randomly spinning out a prize ball machine and selecting random players around regions and just praying that they won't DC as long as there MMR is close enough? Surely they can bring back the old ways of hunt with random matches can't they?

[vital drum]

You are matched with players in the region you selected based on your MMR.

[karmic bear]

@vital drum Will they bring back an option to turn off MMR skilled based matchmaking?

[vital drum]

I don't know.

[karmic bear]

@vital drum It's okay. I'm not mad about removing rng matches. But I'm not gonna lie it hurts to see it gone

[north sleet]

@knotty ore Unenforceable.

There's no way to enforce "no crosshair overlays", in any capacity. Especially when someone could get around it by putting a dot on their screen, or turning on the crosshair dot present on some monitors.

[open night]

So.... Apparently if your teammate DCs and dies you cannot get the bounty from them.... just lost a bounty due to this BS

Can we get a fix for that?

[unborn sandal]

Burn them out

No penalty to you other than waiting a bit

[open night]

couldnt they were in water with no water firebombs left

we had two teams on us

seems ridiculous to have to burn your teammate out

[unborn sandal]

Don’t play with randos

It’s very situational

[open night]

situational or not it is still a bug

i wasnt with a rando either it was my buddy who couldnt reconnect

[unborn sandal]

Rare to have a teammate
Have bounty
Die in water
Disconnect

[open night]

rare or not

still a bug

bugs are not dependent upon rarity

[unborn sandal]

Whether they get fixed or not is

If it’s extremely rare and/or doesn’t impact gameplay much it’s not gonna get fixed

[open night]

losing ability to get a bounty is non impactful.... 🙄

lmao

[knotty ore]

I think some monitors also have built in overlay. But, at least an official statement that it can warrant you a ban can dissuade a lot of people.

[unborn sandal]

I’m saying generally

In this case it’s just extremely rare

[north sleet]

If it was remotely enforceable, I'd say go for it. Like, if there was a 1% of a 1% chance of being able to enforce it.

But there isn't, and the people who want to use crosshair overlays.. Will. And there's no way around it, honestly

[river pawn]

Can we get a choice to only go into a match on US East or whatever server we have the lowest ping on? playing on US West on 98 ping is horrible

[crystal plume]

You can deselect your secondary region, so yes

[river pawn]

I didnt know ill try it. i think i tried to do it before and it would just switch it to my primary server

[sterile cliff]

@hot acorn The devs mentioned that smoke bombs wont be made because of performance limitations

[hot acorn]

ah

[hot acorn]

well the new engine update could fix the issue

[sterile cliff]

The engine doesnt do the networking side of the game so probably not

[hot acorn]

after all it would be a overhaul of the current version

[sterile cliff]

And im pretty sure c++ stays completely the same even on a newer engine version, so there probably wont be a sudden appearance of tools that allow for performant smoke in multiplayer

[crystal plume]

I'm fairly sure that performance wouldn't be the limiting factor when it comes to smokes 😄

[hot acorn]

i mean the textures already exist in the dynamite bundle kind of all they need to really do is take that part

and slow down the smoke effect, make it darker and add a SFX of hissing smoke

[sterile cliff]

Having smoke that is active for much longer and is synced between all clients is very different to making something that is active quite rarely and for not too long

[unborn smelt]

@fringe dawn The aperture scope is diffrent on other guns.
In comparison to the nitro, you can fold it down on other gun and thus switch between a zoomed in mode with a blurry outside - or a regular ironsight without any blur or zoom.

[hot acorn]

i Just had a game where 3 teams threw all the chokes into one building and it was chaos i think it would work

[hot acorn]

whats the key bind for that?

[sterile cliff]

Then perhaps you could tell the developers what method of implementing it youre thinking of so that their limitation of performance doesnt hold them back from making a smoke bomb anymore.

[hot acorn]

wish i knew how to get ahold of one of them

[unborn smelt]

Should be the same as switching between shotgun and pistol on the LeMat

Can't recall the name of the keybind in the menue tho

[hybrid forum]

I mean, dusk exists right now. And nighttime n inferno are worse when it comes to visibility

[hybrid forum]

Tbh If the visibility was bad, they could turn it into a wildcard, like nighttime right now

[fringe dawn]

Doesn't change the fact that the scope is still horrible to aim with

[little carbon]

Hundreds of people proclaim the earth is flat or that covid didnt exist.
There is a reason something isnt seen as a fact just because an amount of people believes in it.

And especially the situation you are describing just cannot happen with Hunts network system, since its only your client and the server that matter for registering shots, and if you are playing on low ping, those two arent apart by that much.

And regarding crosshair overlays. On what basis do you want to ban? Because legally you cant really ban for something like a crosshair overlay under German law. The issue is that it doesnt interact with Cryteks product (their game's code) at all.
And then there is also the detection method. You would need invasive anticheat to even detect an overlay, since again, the overlay wont interact with Hunts code/memory space. And that is yet again not possible under German law. (And thats a good thing. Laws allowing invasive anticheats would open doors for privacy reductions outside of gaming that better remain closed. )

[nimble swallow]

@uneven turret that was a bug. You can't self revive anymore in qp. See #pc-announcements

[uneven turret]

I literally just got killed by a dude that I just killed before.

[nimble swallow]

Oh, classic bug showdown

[fleet ember]

@zealous citrus Sooooooo why is playing Duos, with a duo not worth it anymore? You get So little money or rewards for it unless you're on a night map and when you are on a night map usually the server is empty or quiet af. On the regular bounty maps they are full which is GREAT, but the payout is barley worth the risk? is this by design or not? If it is by design then the choice to do so is killing duo's mode. My 1 friend and I only play duos and it is really sad to see how little we make at the end of the hunt. I think this whole update is great and I love how responsive you guys are, this is my favorite game and I've been playing it for years now. I really hope this issue gets addressed because I do not see my self ever playing trios especially if I am forced into it. Thanks for your time.

[tawdry plover]

If you report a player ingame, will you be teamed up with him again?

[fleet ember]

@tawdry plover i think you gotta block them on steam as well. also check the #game-questions for a quicker responce

[warm zephyr]

@chilly wren bruh qp is solo only. Self rez is meant to level the solo vs team playing field

[chilly wren]

So what? 2 Solos can also meet in bounty hunt. Besides, that is already what the MMR difference does + you get an underdog bonus because you extract with bounty rarer (as you are suppose to because you are a solo). Solos are not suppose to have a "level playing field" - they are the equivalent of smurfs in other games and therefore already had enough bonuses pre-devils moon

Besides, nobody forces you to play solo. It is your choice

[warm zephyr]

there isn't a solo only mode in bh. You'll still encounter duos or trios.

[chilly wren]

Thats not the point, if let's say Solos with Necro get a wallhack, then not having it is not worth playing solo, same goes for self revive now

[warm zephyr]

higher skill level just doesn't make up enough for the obv advantage of having teammates. I agree that having to watch over solos after they die is quite a design flaw but currently i think the self rez is an acceptable second chance for solos considering how wonky the foundations of the game is

[warm zephyr]

wallhack is another matter entirely

solos deserve their own playing mode. crytek just doesn't want to invest in that so what we have now is what makes most sense to most people

[chilly wren]

But why do we stop there? Why not go further then? Let solos have 2x as many tools, consumable, HP. You see how ridiclious this sounds. And it is as ridiclious as self revive currently is. It doesn't necessary needs to get removed, but nerfed until it is not a necessasity

[warm zephyr]

missed me with that slippery slope fallacy.

if you wanna give a suggestion, make sure your argument holds water

[chilly wren]

Wdym, it never leaked a single drop?

Also here's a full list:
https://www.reddit.com/r/HuntShowdown/comments/11mrh83/list_of_arguments_why_current_solo_revive_is_bad/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3

[warm zephyr]

the things you say only sounds ridiculous only because your logic is ridiculous

[chilly wren]

Self res up to 4 times is ridiclious with the previous solo bonuses + the new bonuses

[warm zephyr]

what the redditor says makes more sense than what you've said for the past 10 minutes

[chilly wren]

I am the author xd

[warm zephyr]

that said, i see what the gist of the point is. It promotes a frown-upon playstyle

ah i see

your logic or flow of thought isn't consistent then

[spiral robin]

fact is, when you can revive yourself when being solo, it will just lead to an insta burn approach

it's already a plague in the eu servers

[warm zephyr]

yeah but snipers though

I do agree with some of the tl;dr points he had on that post

with the current solo advantages it isn't worth playing duos

[spiral robin]

snipers will just keep looking at the corpse, nothing will be done

[chilly wren]

well seems like this discussion doesn't serve a purpose anymore. It is very consistent. Solo revive is too strong for you to play without it, and the further buffs to serpant and mapgie aren't justified. Nobody forces you to play solo and many like the "hardcore" aspect of it.

[warm zephyr]

i meant solo sniper players

[warm zephyr]

crytek did

by not having solo bounty hunt

that said, it's not a simple solution to fix

[chilly wren]

Solo Bounty Hunt existed for a brief time you know.

[warm zephyr]

imo crytek tends to overcomplicate things

[warm zephyr]

well it doesn't exist now

I mean it's a very core issue of the game

[chilly wren]

Would it really have enough player numbers to justfy it? Wouldn't it be better for teams to be able to opt out of solos?

[warm zephyr]

yeah i think that'd be a neat option but there won't be enough players to play with solos

There's no easy way out of this. and adding crytek's stubborn "knows-best" attitude doesn't help either

[spiral robin]

i'll be on old fashioned way of talking, but in my opinion, it was much better before Necro and Magpie modifications

Solo players knew what were the consequences of being alone, but right now, there are no more consequences

finally found a meathead in central compounds, after 5 games! Crytek, you changed their spawn rate right? because yesterday, 1 was the minimum, and it could go up to 3

[cedar helm]

that quest sucks but i rly think it's totally random.
i looked for days and didn't have a single one spawn in the middle but yesterday I was blessed by the Hunt gods with 2 @ Lock Bay and then 2 matches later one at sweet bell

[chilly wren]

Crytek be like: Wolfshead Arsenal has 5 Meathead spawns (sounds like a joke but it really does)

[warm zephyr]

questlines are simply the love child of crytek and gacha game mechanics

[nova musk]

Can a player stand up 2 times directly in front of my face? You can correct this misunderstanding. Make it so that they can resurrect only if there is no one nearby (at least at a distance of 100 meters). But the possibility to stand up 2 times is idiocy.

A person stood up right in front of me and was able to kill me with a knife, I don't even have time to reload.

[crystal plume]

They have to wait 10 seconds before reviving, I'm sure that's plenty of time to reload 🤠

And now you'll know to watch out for it

[spiral robin]

if necro has a range to revive a mate, it should be a similar condition to revive ourselvves. same range should be clear. Because trust me, 10 seconds when you're fighting someone else than the one you just killed, it's really a short timing

[nova musk]

I totally agree because I already took out the boss and killed the player, but the guy stood up once on his own, I killed him, then he stood up again behind my back. It left me with a very negative balance. Let him finally die and go to the next game)

You don't even have time to find a lamp to set him on fire.

[spiral robin]

exactly. 10sec + clear in 25m range should help balance this and would not make it a must as solo. Otherwise, when i'm myself playing solo, i'll have to insta burn ennemies if i didn't located any mate. IT has been 1 year i didn't take fire bomb in my setup, but not, as long as i'm alone, i'm taking one with me just in case

[vestal cedar]

I'm curious about community opinion concerning "trading window". I, for one, am tired of it.

[main rampart]

so i cant be the only one who thinks flash bombs should no blind you or at least not as much if they land behind you right? seems a little dumb that its pretty much a guaranteed blind as long as its within the same room or area as the player. ive died so many times where my back was to the bomb but i still get the full duration blind effect

[karmic ivy]

It is a byproduct of mitigating latency. In Hunt, we can aim at what we see on our client without leading our aim the amount of our latency.
This way, the timing of visible actions is precise and preserved. For me its mostly about the timing. In other games with another style of networking. It often feels like the enemy didn't need the standard amount of time to kill me. Here in Hunt, its always predictable. If you see a player aiming at you, you can mentally calculate how much time you have to maneuver before he gets a bead on you. Not so in other games, the visual side of ones client does not match the timeline of the events.

I am willing to accept one to get rid of the other. And I am not looking to go back the way I came. I hope more games catch on to the idea that mitigating the latency client side, makes the experience much better.

I play shotguns aggressivly, I like to get close and I move around a lot. And with that said. I don't get many trades. So its definatly not a bother. I think once you learn the timing of Hunt, you can avoid it.

[glad dock]

Idk as a solo who both gets the benefits and has to deal with them by my self I don’t think there is any issue with it especially after needing to wait 10 seconds if you are at all paying attention or just careful you don’t need to worry about the body or needing to adapting your loadout to have a firebomb or traps or whatever in my findings of playing against it as a solo without the perk myself if you just are a little more careful you won’t be caught off guard

[rapid jewel]

One of my fav dual wielding types is the pax. But for some reason, i can't equip Jekyl and Hyde. The skins for the gun, is this a glitch as i used to be able to before the new patch.

[glad dock]

Also I’m surprised you don’t trade much I play shotguns crossbows and melee all the time and trade pretty damn often I find it very annoying because I am solo most of the time so a trade isn’t a win it’s a loss with a benefit of a kill gets very annoying very fast

[karmic ivy]

Thing is you need to identify the situations in which you trade and shake up the timing. Do it different.
For one, don't put yourself in a position where you are pretty sure its going to be a trade, unless you are ready to accept it.
Then,

move a little different, take a different angle. do something to change the timing of when they can shoot you.

[glad dock]

Tell me what I should have done to avoid this trade (other then say shoot them) https://medal.tv/games/hunt-showdown/clips/RDyy8Ufo0yx_5

[karmic ivy]

There are many things you could have done different to avoid a trade.

Too many to list.

[glad dock]

If I wanted to kill him with a pitchfork

What should have I done

[little jackal]

you did kill him with a pitchfork

[karmic ivy]

accept that you might trade, personally I would not use the pitchfork in that situation.

[glad dock]

Melee shouldn’t be off the table because I have a higher risk of trading

In that clip can you see why trading may be a little unfair

[karmic ivy]

Its not in all cases

but in that one yes

[glad dock]

Thank god I was on a team who could win for me

[little jackal]

if it weren't for their high ping, chances they would've killed you without even trading

[glad dock]

If I was solo there it woulda been the end

[karmic ivy]

Seems fair to me.

[glad dock]

How? The guy was dead not looking at me and managed to headshot me

[karmic ivy]

It works both ways

it is symmetrical.

[karmic ivy]

He was on his client/screen
you want to ignore that?

[glad dock]

From my perspective does it seem fair

[karmic ivy]

But your perspective is not all there is. So we can't balance it based soley on that.

We each have our own time line in the Hunt match, they differ from eachother and from the servers timeline.

It is a fact of multiplayer gaming

[glad dock]

Why should I be punished for someone else having higher ping? It doesn’t make sense in no other game is trading this bad or this big

Trading exists in games

[karmic ivy]

There is no punishment.

[little jackal]

Again, you were rewarded, not punished. Equally low ping would've killed you before you got close enough.

[glad dock]

They probably would have just died

[little jackal]

nope

[glad dock]

There is though I feel like I have been robbed of a kill because of this trade on my screen I saw him die yet I still get killed

[karmic ivy]

then you are punishing yourself. The fact is the GAME didn't punish you.

[glad dock]

It punished me for playing against a high ping player

[karmic ivy]

But there was literally no punishment. You were in fact rewarded with a kill.

So were they, because on their screen... they saw you die

You see how its symmetrical?

[glad dock]

On their screen they had a reasonable trade but on mine it looked like total bullshit that is not symmetrical

[karmic ivy]

how do you know what it looked like? just curious.

[glad dock]

What do you mean? I was there playing it??

[karmic ivy]

on their screen, as you said above.

[glad dock]

Because had they died on their screen I would have lived clearly they must have been seeing me run at them stab them and they headshot me

[karmic ivy]

Well man,
there is the water. Drink it if you want.
But I don't think I am going to be able to help you see the flaw in your reasoning. You are being selfish and naive, in short.
No worries, you just have not seen what I have seen. Good luck, and good Hunting.

[glad dock]

I’m not at all I’d be down to have the trade window be lowered a bunch and deal with some of my things “not hitting” so long as stuff like that doesn’t happen I deal with the same trading you do and I still play the game I’m just pointing out in no other online game I know of is trading like this that bad unless you are lagging

In which case it’s on you and bad ping / internet

[karmic ivy]

You are missing the part about how each of us has his own timeline, within the match.

[glad dock]

I just don’t get that

Why is that a thing if it only causes issues

[karmic ivy]

Its easy to learn about.

Its a thing, because it is the way the universe works.

Things, take time.

its like a law.

[glad dock]

I get that but there is no word on fixing this

I doubt they will

[karmic ivy]

Just one more thing then I am headed out. Its not a perfect world, and when you want one thing, you often have to pay with another. No game can have it all.

Good luck, and good Hunting 😉

[crystal plume]

It's not really up to Crytek to figure out how to remove latency from the entire world

[glad dock]

That’s not what I’m asking

Again no other online game has this issue as far as I’m aware

They did not fix latency

This is like a big point of mine I think people are missing

[crystal plume]

Every game has some form of it, there's different ways to "mitigate" it, usually with some drawbacks, but every single game will have delayed actions for each client because of how latency works

Some decide to believe the server over the clients every time, some believe the client over the server, some believe the client but have the server verify

[glad dock]

Yes I know that but again for example r6 I been getting into recently I have traded like a few times but we shot at the same time I have never been killed by a dead player unless it was to a trap

I’ll take the repercussions that come with a trade window being closed more I just don’t think trading makes for fun gameplay

In the end that’s what we are after when playing games I doubt trading is fun for anyone really

I know pretty much anyone else that had a trade like that would have a similar reaction

[crystal plume]

People shooting on their screen but it never being registered server side because they were already considered dead is not fun either, we used to get constant reports of "hitreg" issues which were usually caused by that

There's a good middle ground there for sure

Not sure myself where it is, but either side will probably end up suffering in some form

[glad dock]

Yeah and that’s what I’m asking for

The trade window will never be 0 but that trade clip up there, there was a imbalance between us and who probably had the worse outcome

[karmic ivy]

I don't see why they will not tweak that number as necessary. And I agree that is the best approach. Give them more time to gather data.

I expect them to lower the threshold after they see how effective their ping limits were. but one comes before the other I would imagine.

[little jackal]

narrowing trade window is essentially soft region lock

[glad dock]

Yeah a good thing I’m sure keeps people in similar ping areas

[little jackal]

fine for everyone except those who fall under that

[karmic ivy]

I trust them to find the sweet spot. They have a large interest in keeping Hunt a worldwide game.

[little jackal]

yeah probably

[glad dock]

Or just get more servers I know I would probably have more issues seeing as the lowest ping I can get is 83

Though I guess 83 isn’t bad

Depends on how much they tighten it

[karmic ivy]

Did you know that more servers, is not good for matchmaking. Player density goes down, when you add more. At some point, its counter productive because of low population regions becoming barren.

For example here in the US. Games with and East and West server are better for finding west coast matches than games with a East, West and Central server.

The west coast is pretty dead, even in Rust!

Its better to get central and the other two regions to mix.

So in our case, 2 servers is better than 3.

[glad dock]

That is good enough for over here but over in the EU more may be needed

I live up in Canada and get a even 83 ping from both US east and US west

[cedar helm]

45-50 on us E from central Ontario . Us west is 100+

[karmic ivy]

I get 70ms average.

[cedar helm]

I just stick to E

[glad dock]

Odd I’m over here in Alberta yet I don’t get too much higher ping in east

Thus I play both interchangeably

[cedar helm]

I only have 20mbps download, fwiw

[glad dock]

Ah

[karmic ivy]

Your ISP has much more to do with your latency than your geographic position. They posses the ability to prioritize your traffic ahead or behind others... You can see how that leads to extra latency at busy times on their network.

[glad dock]

Probably why then

[knotty ore]

Your distance from server has a much higher impact on latency than your connection speed.

[glad dock]

Whatever I’m sure there is a sweet spot for everything and hunt will find it just it’s been a long time already I enjoy this game and play the game by myself a lot trading doesn’t make for fun gameplay and I’m just looking for some change

[karmic ivy]

I guess we are not that far appart then. I am in north idaho. not far south of you.

[karmic ivy]

some ISPs make that statement false.

[glad dock]

I don’t know my US states very well but I’ll take your word for it

[glad dock]

Also I should mention self reviving I fully believe is their temporary bandaid for trading

And I appreciate it

I advocate for it fully because of it and I thought it was fun and had no issues countering it when I played against other solos

[knotty ore]

Speed like that is unavailable to most end users. I've used a 5gig t1 line at work and you still get 100ms delay pinging a server on the other side of the country

I get the same delay on a 1gig line. Distance matters more than bandwith unless you have a direct fiber connection and its just one line.

This is why I laugh when people claim that cross region play doesn't matter. You are literally adding 100-300ms delay to the data you are sending and recieving from the server. Validation is ostensibly useless as your positional data isn't going to be accurate. Which is why people have trouble hitting people playing out of region.

[crystal plume]

It doesn't affect hitting people though with client sided hitreg and server side validation, which Hunt has

I've only had hits not register when my own ping was high by accidentally joining SA servers

But as long as your own ping is fine, you can shoot where you see your target on your client and the server will generally validate it as a hit if you actually hit them on your screen as well

[knotty ore]

The issue occurs mostly when you fire a shot and you don't get a hit marker when you should be getting one. Because there is a slight difference between what you see and where the character actually is due to the massive delay on the round trip between server and client.

So server doesn't validate your hit because its technically not a hit

Or, it validates a miss if you will

[crystal plume]

It still prioritizes the shooter's pov IIRC

[little jackal]

the server literally validates your hits even if you're dead

let alone position fluctuations

[crystal plume]

I haven't personally experienced any hitreg issues on players playing out of their region, I have only seen it when I myself was out of my region unintentionally, saw blood on my client but server didn't register the hits

[knotty ore]

That is directly contradictory to your previous statement of validation based on your POV.

The server validates your hits if your client registers a hit. The issue when it doesn't register one when it looks like it should be a hit.

[crystal plume]

No it isn't, because when I'm out of my region my delay between the client and server will be much higher, leading to the server being more likely to not validate my hits due to the difference, but if I'm in my own region, it's much more likely to validate them, because it still prioritizes the shooter

[slim forum]

Think they need to merge standard and wildcard thing, don't want to split player base too much

[crystal plume]

Favor the shooter as they say

This says it better I guess, especially "matching the delay at which that client is seeing the world" part since that explains why the shooter's ping being higher leads to more invalidated shots

Since it has to match a much higher and often unstable delay

And I feel like this touches some of the complaints you've had regarding dying behind cover

[knotty ore]

Dude read that again, but slowly. Its deemed valid based on server state history. The cross region player affects server state because their state is delayed. Their entire system, by their own admission is variable. Any predictive systems are flawed by nature. Couple that with abhorrent 30tick servers, meaning they refresh slower, how can you say this system is flawless?

How are people defending this system?

[crystal plume]

When have I said that it's flawless?

It has it's trade-offs like pretty much everything else in life

Some of which are shown in the screenshots I just sent

[knotty ore]

I've not seen one red, or dev admit that cross region play affects these interactions.

[crystal plume]

But I prefer this system over having to lead based on my ping

Or having my shots disappear if I shot right before I died

I'm willing to have the trade-offs in favor of those

[knotty ore]

Yes its probably better than other setups

[crystal plume]

It's not perfect and it can probably be still adjusted regarding trade windows, but I still much prefer it over what I've experienced in other games over the years

[knotty ore]

Like, this could be an okay compromise. But, that's not the point. Someone always fights me on my experience with cross region players. They gaslight me by saying that cross region has zero affect on native region players lol

Because if they admit there is an impact they have to consider region locking.

[karmic ivy]

I have seen this at play as well. In other users reports.

[crystal plume]

There is an impact, generally in the form of delays regarding different actions and events, but I have not experienced other people's ping affecting my hitreg in any instance

The most visible impact is dying behind cover, which obviously feels unfair to the person who has it happen to them, but technically it was completely fair on the shooter's pov as they saw you for the same amount of time and had the same amount of time to react, but with a delay

[karmic ivy]

I concur! this is a big deal to me. I know its not for everyone.

[little jackal]

just show us one example of those notorious hitreg issues with cross-region players to base your point on something

[little carbon]

It does. For invalidation only the shooters ping matters. Cause if you shoot at t=0 your shot will get validated against the data you see on your screen on t=ping

[little carbon]

People aren't saying that there is no impact. They are saying that the impacts you describe aren't latency issues.

[knotty ore]

Yes, not MY latency as my latency is great. Its people who play out of region to get an advantage.

I've played games on EU just for shits and giggles and EU 6 stars have issues hitting me.

[crystal plume]

And you are sure that is because of your latency because...?

[knotty ore]

I get 15-20ping without any packet loss on a gig fiber line. Obviously the exception is when servers are dying, but that doesn't happen often.

I get about 150ping on EU, and I've noticed players have issues landing a hit on me, at least with the few games I've played on there. I stopped because it seemed OP. There was delay in my registration too, but my hits still registered after a delay. So, I could peek and shoot someone and their shot back at me would happen after I've moved. Then they would die like 500ms after.

[shell peak]

I dont know why my suggestion idea gets deleted all the time i do it as the pinnend commant says
so ill post my idea here now:
Titel: Add a spectate button to Blackmarket
Description: The Weapons in the black market are kinda small and when you wanna inspect them you have to go to the store.
So adding a Spectate button at the Black Market would be kind helpful.

[sharp veldt]

you're spelling Title wrong.

[shell peak]

i spelled it in german....im stupid :)

[sharp veldt]

nono, just the bot can't tell it's the same word with wrong spelling 😄

[shell peak]

oh i see :D

[knotty ore]

Terminators are moderating the suggestion channel

[knotty ore]

I'm so glad that night time is no longer in my games. Please keep it that way. I don't want to increase my gamma in order to compete with full-black clothed hunters who hide in bushes.

I never want to play a night time map again, separating the queue was a huge win for me personally.

[lethal mango]

@sinful gate it already does

[queen jungle]

@dense fossil According to the devs when armores hellhounds were introduced, they are actually supposed to be dangerous and more than a mere nuisance like other AI.

They should he avoided if possible, even more than other AI.

[dense fossil]

Doesn't address the flawed hitbox. These are large animals but I have more luck hitting a beetle.

It feels like their hitbox is either dragging on the floor between their legs or just WAY too small

But honestly the game has too many AI enemies in my opinion anyway. 2-3 immolators or hives RIGHT next to each other is not okay, and when special enemies are everywhere, they're no longer special.

And it's hard to avoid Hellhounds when there is, once again, 2-3 packs in one area

[steel hamlet]

I'd have to agree with @dense fossil. It makes it kind of hard to 'avoid if possible' when there are at least 3 packs of them surrounding a compound. That's not even just mentioning the armoured ones. Hellhounds in general are just too much. Got a pack of four to deal with, then you walk ten paces and have another pack of three, then you're in the middle of a fight only a dozen paces away from THAT and you get jumped by two or so more.

That example - believe it or not - is an actual experience I just went through in the game.

[dense fossil]

And it's not the only time stuff like that happens.

[sudden mantle]

Speaking from 4-5 star elo. Just kill the ai slowly but methodically and leave some up for your enemies ;). None of the ai is too difficult to deal with and may help you from time.to.time. it's why I always run some silent ai killing tool.

Lanterns /fire are really effective in killing those dogs.

[steel hamlet]

Congrats on having 4-5 stars, I guess? But that's not the point here. The point is that there is too many in general. Hounds, Hives, Immolators, all of them. You can take it slow, sure. But that really doesn't help the fact that there is just too many.

Also, thank you, Master Hunt Player, for telling me basic tips of the game. Hard to find a lantern in the middle of the woods (Where the Hounds usually are) and I'd rather save my fire bottles due to the fact that Solos can now pick themselves up.

You also - in these packs of oversaturated dogs - have ones that cannot be slashed or shot in the head because of some fancy helmet, which is yet another thing to add onto the already unbearable amount of them.

Same with Immolators taking a near full stamina bar to kill with melee. Sure you could argue that all you need is poison, but if you don't have that and face FOUR of them in one compound? What are you going to do?

[fleet ember]

On top of that, being 4 to 5 star elo is not the basic skill set of every player. So I agree with you there. On @sudden mantle side however I agree that the Ai is not to hard to deal with, I think it's tedious af and they just slow down the game now.

9 time 0utta 10 you can just melee the dogs. They're a 2 shot kill. It isn't that hard

[steel hamlet]

No, not all of them are technically hard to deal with. You can dispatch a pack of hounds in less than half a minute. It's just the overall amount of them that gets annoying.

[little carbon]

You might need to analyse how you die a bit more. AI in most cases is not a direct threat but mostly dangerous due to being loud.

Are you by chance still relatively new to the game? Because for a lot of AI knowledge is somewhat crucial. That and then adapting based on your knowledge.
For example, if you struggle with immolators, take dusters or the knuckle knife as your melee. They can deal with them safely for low stamina costs.

Generally consider learning the knuckle knife, its by far the best melee option

[fleet ember]

I can agree to that. Again it's just become tedious due to the sheer amount. It almost feels like because of the lack of xp we are getting now they added more mobs to balance it out, which I hate!

[steel hamlet]

Do you know how to read? Respectfully. My point isn't that they are hard to deal with. It is the AMOUNT of them that is annoying. I know that Immolators are easy to take out with certain tools. I've got triple digit hours in the game. It's the amount of them in places that is frustrating.

[little carbon]

They didnt reduce any XP gains

[fleet ember]

They did. If you run duos all the time.

Which I do.

[sudden mantle]

We're trying to help don't be rude. If there are too.many for you to deal with. Come up with a way to push the other team into them.

[dense fossil]

Again none of that is really the point. I very rarely die to AI, but I just had to fight four immolators in a single compound. But I guess that's okay?

[fleet ember]

Agreed

[little carbon]

They didnt reduce anything as far as i know, but feel free to point me to the part of the patch notes

[fleet ember]

It's not. @little carbon is missing the point

[steel hamlet]

You'd understand my rudeness when your 'helping' is completely ignoring my actual point I'm trying to make. I've explained it 3+ times now and you're still stuck on trying to give me basic tips on how to deal with these enemies.

[fleet ember]

It's literally on the bounty hunts themselves. You can see how much your getting 75 - 150 for a duo basic hunt. That's Hella low compared to before

[dense fossil]

We know the weaknesses of the enemies, what we don't get is why there has to be SO many of them everywhere constantly.

[fleet ember]

Agreed

[steel hamlet]

I know HOW to deal with them. The problem is the amount of times that you HAVE to deal with them.

Exactly what the two above said.

[runic crypt]

If you play bounty hunt, you could extract with a single small bounty worth 75 bounty tokens and up to 150 bounty tokens for a big bounty. It is how the game worked since they added small and big bounties years ago. They just reflect that now in the menus, the amount of bounty tokens has not changed.

[little carbon]

it seemed to me that in your previous statement you were writing about how you have troubles dealing with immolators and hounds. Needing a full stamina bar for dealing with an immolator is inefficient and something most people dont need.

And they also didnt increase AI spawns in any of the more recent updates

[little carbon]

This

[steel hamlet]

I'm sorry for being rude, but are you serious? You have to purposefully be glossing over my point with how many times you've done so. The point is that there are TOO MANY THAT SPAWN IN. I am well aware that the most recent update did not change that, but that doesn't change the fact that it is still a problem.

You walk into some compound and are met with a total of four Immolators in one place, as Coop mentioned. Cool! You have the means to deal with them! You've got knuckles or poison or whatever the hell else. That's great! But the issue is the amount of them that are there. There needs to be a more restricted limit.

I had a game where - between two compounds that are within Tomahawk distance of each other - I was met with not one, not two, but THREE hound packs. Got one done and stopped the bleeding. Walked a little and got another out of the way and stopped the bleeding again. Then the third was right at the compound and attacked us before we could even get inside. There was even a fourth pack inbetween 2 and 3, but luckily that one was far enough away.

[queen jungle]

Please don't be condescending towards others.

Personally I think the spawn rate of AI is fine, although I would like to see the old AI difficulty return, nowadays most AI just isn't a threat anymore after the nerfs.

[steel hamlet]

THAT is what you respond to?

[dense fossil]

People have been condescending to us during this whole convo

[lethal silo]

#game-ideas message I am confused doesn't it already do that? I could test this out very easily in training mode but I'm pretty sure if you stabbing with a Poison Arrow it does poison and it instantly kill AI enemies

[wary hinge]

last I remember you couldnt stab with poison arrows with dewclaw

[lethal silo]

you have always been able to do that

since day one

I'm really only asking because maybe it's a recent thing maybe a bug since a person is asking for it to be able to poison maybe no longer works because I have played a lot of Bow and a lot of claw and it has always worked with normal Arrows and Poison Arrow

[wary hinge]

Might be simply a bug then. Last I remember I couldnt stab with poison arrows with dewclaw but I may be misremembering the other arrows.

[brisk timber]

@verbal swan #feedback message
Its because nighttime is a really dividing map. Some extract right away and some love to play them more.
To please both its good to make it exclusive.

[lethal silo]

I just tested in a match Dewclaw poison and it worked fine hitting Ai kills them immediately

the enemy AI react like if it's normal poison ammo or poison Arrow they fall to the ground quieter then if you killed them normally

[chilly nova]

fuck shotguns

[chilly nova]

Make a no shotgun contract. People would play that way more than night maps

[stark fulcrum]

Only if they also make a no long ammo contract lol. Bush wookie sniper campers ruin the game more than shotguns.

[hazy quartz]

@hot acorn
i know, but that's not the point, someone doesn't suddenly have more skill because they brought resilience, MMR fails to measure a players skill in some cases and that needs to be changed.

[vital drum]

Dang that's a wall of text, but I see a , so thank you.

[hazy quartz]

yeah i really wanted to go in depth with this issue

[dim heron]

I was just about to say something XD

[vital drum]

There's an issue with ?!

[hazy quartz]

no :)

[vital drum]

Phew okay, we're good then

[hazy quartz]

[dim heron]

I agree with the majority of what is written

[hazy quartz]

i am curious to read another point of view, what do you disagree with?

[vital drum]

That's concerning, there's so much contradicting stuff that is written. Like, some people write that cheese is the best food. Some prefer oreos.

[dim heron]

I mean, that's why I said majority

there's some stuff that's just wrong

duh

[vital drum]

Yeah, but even half of it is still contradictory

Let alone the majority

[dim heron]

see, if you only intake 3 things 2 of which being agreeable then I agree with most of

[vital drum]

Okay I think we've derailed this enough, our moderator job is done

poofs

[unborn dagger]

I would like it if like Dead Rising, Dying Light, etc. Would have it where night time increases the difficulty of the AI.

[dim heron]

[hazy quartz]

moderators just entered the derailment story arc

[dim heron]

I don't mind the solo vs trio mmr drop. I see it as just another risk

otherwise I agree

[hazy quartz]

i feel bad for the players who encounter that solo who dropped just a little bit too low. I can see the point of it being a risk but purely from the point of view that the main purpose is to create fair matches i don't think it is fair for the other players to fight against someone who is vastly more experienced/skilled.

[unborn sandal]

@young river it’s just how much damage it took to kill them. They only had 41 health left

[jovial skiff]

Could just make the match making off of K/D.

[pallid quail]

https://youtu.be/AUmg-pJs2Mg

Can someone on the dev team discuss this trade with me I think it's a little BS

[jovial skiff]

Bug reports go to #bug-reports-pc.

[pallid quail]

thank you

[outer wedge]

i know its BS, i dislike it too, but devs want it like that, so just move on onto next match

[hazy quartz]

KD changes slower and slower the more kills and deaths you accumulate and sometimes you can make sudden jumps in skill due to learning something new, new hardware allowing you to perform better, or illness, real life stress or sudden disabilities dragging you down.

If you have thousands of kills your KD will not move in any significant way anymore leaving you hardstuck inside a matchmaking bracket you don't belong and you can't get out without massive changes in your KD which will require thousands more kills and deaths.

KD can just not keep up with your skill development at some point.

also KD doesn't take into account the quality of the kill, farming lot's of lower skilled players does not require as much skill as killing lots of highly skilled and experienced players.
some people have a high KD but are hardstuck in a lower MMR because they have never developed the skills to be able to compete in higher ranked lobbies but are very dominant in lower lobbies.

[young river]

I didn't kill them.

[young river]

They were still alive.

[little jackal]

it literally says "deathblow"

[hazy quartz]

it's a beta feature, it could be wrong.

i've also seen someone posting a screenshot and it showed a centennial doing 1 dmg at 10 meters or something.
looks like damage values are probably a bit whacky sometimes

[digital nacelle]

to be fair you could implement a "recent k/d"

obviously lifetime k/d would be a poor metric

and all the kill farmers deserve each other, good riddance

[hazy quartz]

that's what MMR is supposed to be basically, MMR but also rates the quality of the kill/death it just needs a few adjustments

[knotty ore]

I love how reporting hackers means nothing. Same dude from Egypt with 5kda is still around on NA servers. Awesome sauce dudes. Good job.

[runic crypt]

Do you have proof they are cheating?

If so, you can submit a report with proof to Hunt's support site

[knotty ore]

How would I access their PC to get the proof? Everything is questionable from the receiving perspective.

He isn't 100% cheating, but like solid 90%. If he isn't he is better than all the streamers combined.

You would either have to admit that cross region play gives you significant advantage, or that he is hacking. Pick oine.

[runic crypt]

Well I don't have to but if it isn't cheating then that's probably why he isn't banned 😛

[knotty ore]

Stop being purposefully obtuse, neither Crytek, Steam, or EasyAC is good at banning cheaters. Assuming that someone isn't cheating when they have a 5kd with like 10k+ kills is perpetuating the behavior.

[runic crypt]

Yeah I've seen those kill counts and high K/D on streamers and legit players alike + K/D farmers are a thing.

[knotty ore]

I'm pretty sure even Rachta doesn't have 5 k/d

[runic crypt]

RachtaZ is good. Like REALLY good. But he doesn't play for the K/D (he messes around a lot) and he isn't the best player either. I've met non-streamers that were more consistent than Rachta

[knotty ore]

Lol ok, he is better than most 6 star players worldwide

He is probably like top 10 players in Hunt imo.

[runic crypt]

If you think streamers should be the top in Hunt then I can't convince you of anything. But either way I wasn't trying to be "obtuse" I was pointing out that even you pointed out other potential factors that could be the cause of that player's high K/D which means there are other reasons for them not to be banned.

[runic crypt]

You haven't seen some of the closed communities man 😛 You'd be surprised at how much effort they spend compared to streamers and they don't even make money off of it.

I sometimes run into those K/D farmers and make it a point to try and dent their KD coz they care about it so much for some reason, and they always have between 4-5 KD

[knotty ore]

No matter how you play, if you can maintain a 5kd at 6 star with a lot of kills, you are hacking. Killing snipers isn't that hard. If you have some grasp on math, you'd understand how insanely unlikely a 5kd is at high MMR.

[runic crypt]

Yeah well I don't need math to see some of the techniques these players use to maintain a high KD without cheating.

Hunt isn't like other games, there are unfortunately ways to pad out high KD without needing to face risk.

[knotty ore]

Yea high 3 kd is doable. Not 5 over 10k kills.

[runic crypt]

Well agree to disagree.

[knotty ore]

Its not a matter of agreeing, or disagreeing lol

You are just wrong

[runic crypt]

Okay...

[unborn dagger]

If some one is good at the game they are hacking... great logic buddy

[knotty ore]

You can get a 5kd making a new account and just rolling everyone. You can't maintain a 5kd at NA 6 star over 10k kills. No one is like 70% better than every other 6 star on NA. That's just not how it works. You can only do that if you are hacking.

Even if you are playing ultra-safe, you will still go up against other snipers.

[runic crypt]

You know that KD farmers often farm 2 star lobbies right?

[knotty ore]

You do know that to go down in MMR you have to die, right?

[runic crypt]

Yeah.. So you don't know about it 😛 Well I can DM you how they do it but, and even though it isn't a big secret, I really don't want to encourage the behavior by typing it here

[knotty ore]

I've queued with a 4 star as a 6 star we still get majority 5-6 star lobbies. I've seen one 1 star and two 6 stars in my lobbies. They think they can game the system, but it doesn't work.

[runic crypt]

That's not it

[knotty ore]

No matter what it doesn't apply as this guy was in a 5-6 star game.

[runic crypt]

Yeah they can decide to play normally after they've farmed

Sometimes they sell those accounts

[rugged iron]

Tbh 4+ kd isnt unusual in 6*

[knotty ore]

Naw, a good 6 star KD is 3:1. Not 5:1.

I've never seen a 6 star with more than 3.5kd

and I've played like 700 hours at that MMR

[rugged iron]

Than you havnt been in 6 for long enugh

[knotty ore]

I have like 750 hours played 700 of it has been in 5-6 star.

[runic crypt]

I mean I've had legit non-farming players at 4+ KD

[knotty ore]

Newer accounts, sure. All the time.

[runic crypt]

No

Accounts that have been active since release

Some since 2021

I know a few actually

They just live and breath Hunt every day

between 6000-8000 hours each

I remember them being in the top 100 in the leaderboards, some being higher than streamers like Rachta

[knotty ore]

Yes, some people hack

that's the point

They don't get banned

[runic crypt]

Okay buddy 😛

[rugged iron]

High kd = hacks

[runic crypt]

Immediately to the hackusations without knowing them

[rugged iron]

[runic crypt]

They are just so incredibly consistent + your average 6 star isn't super amazing at the game, if you put in the effort you can get to a 5:1 ratio in 6 star

Remember 6 star is the widest ELO group

And it isn't like the current MMR is perfect either

[knotty ore]

You can, just not over long period of time. No one is that consistent.

[rugged iron]

Ppl can lol

[runic crypt]

Right. I don't have a grasp on math I forgot. I'm uneducated and I am wrong 😛

[rugged iron]

It even gets easier

[knotty ore]

In a game where you can easily get nade spammed, you won't maintain that KD.

[runic crypt]

Nade spammed?

[rugged iron]

The more kills you get the harder it is to fall in kd

[runic crypt]

When is nade spamming a big issue?

[knotty ore]

Lol da fuq

[rugged iron]

You just get flashed and avtoed but not nade spammed LOL

[knotty ore]

Depends on your positioning, but people nade spam boss buildings. If you plan to never be in one, you can still get out-sniped.

[runic crypt]

Yeah well we are playing different games then

Never been screwed by a nade spam while I'm in a boss compound

[knotty ore]

You've never played 3s?

[runic crypt]

I only play trios

[rugged iron]

Dosnt even matter if you die at that point. If you kill 4 ppl before that lol

[knotty ore]

5

[runic crypt]

I even play duos v trios

[knotty ore]

You have to kill 5 per death to maintain 5:1 KD which this guy can do over 10k kills on his account.

[rugged iron]

No you dont. You just dont die every round

And that isnt hard at all

[knotty ore]

Holy motherfuck why am I even talking to you

You literally have to get 5 kills per death to have a 5kd

[runic crypt]

Idk man clearly your experience is much different than ours

[rugged iron]

Yes you do but if you dont die in a match and even just get 2 kill it ads up

[runic crypt]

5:1 KD being mathematically impossible to maintain, nade spamming, that's a different Hunt than the one I live in 😛

[rugged iron]

And ppl that have a 5kd which is impossible to have

[knotty ore]

5:1KD over a long period of time is hard to maintain. The longer you play the harder it is to maintain. That's the nature of KD.

[rugged iron]

The longer you play the easier it is

[runic crypt]

On paper YES absolutely. In practice, games differ.

[knotty ore]

People who don't hack, or exploit don't have 5KD

[runic crypt]

In Hunt, it is doable compared to something like CS:GO.

[rugged iron]

I take like 10 loss rounds in a row to drop 0.01

Depending on how often you die per match

[little carbon]

I have seen people with a KD of 4.something that were legit and not KD farmers. You can get insanely consistent in this game if you invest enough determination and talent.
And those people still had some flaws in their gameplay that they acknowledge.

And more generally, regarding cheaters. If you are sure that someone is 90% likely to be a cheater then there is your answer why they aren't banned. Banning without concrete proof is bad practice.

@bold flax the bomb lance is hardly broken, being one of the worse weapons in the game.

[bold flax]

Totally understandable point of view as well. Thanks for bringing up in the discussion.

I disagree with steel balls, it's a silenced shotgun and ive had too many events where I bulldozerd trios with the melee. It can kill 2 with 1 swing, no slowdown in between swings and swings are same speed as knife swings. Don't sleep on the bomblance hah. Full team wipe with melee is hard to swallow vs dying to an actual gunfight imo.

Maybe I'm wrong and it's totally balanced. Just brought it up as something I've noticed

[little carbon]

Its a silenced shotgun, yes, but its also a shotgun that cant shoot through fences or anything thicker than glass.
And getting into melee range usually means the other guy misplayed hard, consider that while you are melee rushing they can freely shoot at you without risk.
Best case the bomblance performs as well as other shotguns. Worst case there is no reason to ever take the lance over say a rival.

[signal mural]

@little jackal That K/D isn't unbelievable. 1.7 when looking at thousands of kills & deaths stands to be reasonable.

I play mostly Bounty Hunt, having played Quickplay primarily to get the achievements ticked off or when my finances were really suffering after a Prestige. I had a 0.7 K/D in Bounty and have slowly clawed my way to 1.12 bouncing between 3 & 4 MMR. My QP MMR remains at a .59 because I played fast & reckless to get Rifts Closed & try for the trophies. I often got 3rd partied or out-gunned and I just never really went back after I got the last trophy done. Anyway - point is that not everyone with a decent K/D is abusing MMR via QP- and I think under a 2.0 with a few thousand kills & deaths is pretty legit. I think given another 4-5k kills/deaths that I too might have manage a 1.5-1.7 without MMR-twinking.

[chrome steppe]

can you tell me where i should put a pingabuse? i can hardly put it in feedback neither in bug reports

or am i dumb rn

[signal mural]

You can't name names. You need to use the in-game report system, when at all... but there's a high ping cap so it's not really abuse.

[little carbon]

You can report people through the ingame report function or through cryteks website afik.

Although keep in mind that ping abuse isnt a thing.
Using a lag switch would be, but those two things are seperate.

[chrome steppe]

i can send you the video.... i was around a wall and got killed from a conversion... from where i was standing the compact bullet shouldve pierced through a big wood wagon and 2 stone walls as well as a hedge

and the game said it was a clean shot without pericing a wall

[little carbon]

That is a result of latency, yes. On their screen they killed you before you entered the cover.
Keep in mind that their kill needs to travel to the server and then to you, so you see it delayed

[crystal plume]

And on their screen you weren't behind the wall yet, not because they are able to see your for longer but because of the delay

That's not abuse

It sucks feeling wise to die to, but it's not abuse

[chrome steppe]

but you cant tell me they have such a huge lag that im not in cover when they shoot me

[little carbon]

On low ping they would have dies as well. This way they got some extra frames to maybe kill someone. In the end its free value for low ping players

[little carbon]

Also keep in mind that the killview isnt accurate and might show the killer at a wrong position, because it shows you the position the killer was in your client at the moment of your death

[chrome steppe]

@crystal plume i can send you the clip if you want to and when you still say its the damn latency or anything im playing on the fucking east coast from now on instead of my home servers EU

[little carbon]

You can just upload the clip in this channel, that aint forbidden

[chrome steppe]

then i shal do so

[crystal plume]

I mean, feel free to play in whatever region the game allows you to, I don't mind

[little carbon]

If you want some people to look at it and potentially explain what hapens

[signal mural]

I'm sure it feels like garbage but sometimes we all just got to shrug it off. No doubt there are cheaters out there and it's awesome when people record gameplay and report them but latency arguments are usually difficult to prove.

[chrome steppe]

but i mind when someone with 200 ping has the biggest advantage EUW just because they come from the middle of nowhere

[crystal plume]

It's not an advantage though 🫠

[little carbon]

They see you come out of cover later and go in later. Its delayed, not longer

[chrome steppe]

where is the problem then that i get killed by something that shouldve killed me in the first place?

[chrome steppe]

i want to understand what happened. but you cant help me to clarify what the heck happened there. what is the reason in the first place that this is even happening?

[little carbon]

With your clip, you died just after entering cover. Lets say there is a total latency of 0.5s between both clients:
you exit cover at t=0s and enter the other side at t=1s
They see you exit and enter at t=0.5 and t=1.5
They then kill you 50% through your walk at t=1
that kill will be shown on your screen at t=1.5

[chrome steppe]

"you were not behind the wall on his screen" okay fair. but WHY is that happening

[little carbon]

But you were out of cover for 1 on both screens

[crystal plume]

Because noone sees the game world in real time

Even you see it with some delay

[little carbon]

Cause information takes time to travel

No ones screen shows truth (or in hunts case, everyones screen shows truth for their shots)

[chrome steppe]

thats obivous but why does the result deviate so heavily from one to another?

[little carbon]

Could you specify what deviation you mean here?

[chrome steppe]

the information of me getting killed

from what i understand it the information from the first sight up to getting killed needs to travel 3x when im counting right for the input on the other players screen

[little carbon]

It isnt that far off. If we assume that he killed you right before you entered the cover then your death was delayed by less than a second.
consider its 2x(ping_a + ping_b) in delay
1x for the information of your movement reaching the other player
1x for their shot reaching you

[little carbon]

2x since you dont need "answers" from the other client

[chrome steppe]

so if we say the person having a ping of 200 it takes 400MS on average to get the info back to the player that has the ping?

[little carbon]

And if you have a ping of 50 and they have a ping of 100, thats already 300ms of delay, 1/3rd of a second. And that without any classical high ping

[little carbon]

Well, its their ping plus your ping for each way

[chrome steppe]

thats what im working with because of bad internet

[chrome steppe]

so it would be 500ms or half a second

[little carbon]

Around-ish, not calculating in other effects

[chrome steppe]

so stuff like packet loss

[little carbon]

Cause technically there is also extra delay cause the information gets processed at the server

[little carbon]

Kinda, packet loss makes things even more complicated, since that is the total loss of info and needs packets to be resend or ignored depending on how important they are

[chrome steppe]

so basically ANY information gets botched by like a second if we take max ping into account from what im understnading nopw

[little carbon]

Partly, yes. Information on your screen however is accurate in the sense that you dont have to account for ping in leading your shots, since the enemy position you see is considered truth for that

Thats why high ping players dont like doors

[crystal plume]

It's not just pure delay, there's systems in place to try and mitigate it as explained here

[chrome steppe]

so i can expect a variation of results of up to half a second where its for the opponent a second

[little carbon]

Yes, although that kinda becomes wonky the higher the ping is

As it usually is the case with prediction

[chrome steppe]

so im just going with "all up to one second into the past can still lead to death"

[little carbon]

pretty much. More precisely, you can go with 800ms + your ping can still lead to death, since 800ms is the limit after which old information does expire

[crystal plume]

At least based on the 2019 blog post, the 800ms value I mean

I don't know how accurate the values in the blog post are anymore

The validation/invalidation percentages at the end of the blog post definitely aren't accurate anymore since that was before the changes to projectiles disappearing when you're dead server side which lead to most of the "hitreg issue" reports back in the day

[signal mural]

I got stalked by a "new" player yesterday. He was playing Night contracts as a solo MMR4 with a silenced Winnie at Bloodline lvl 22 (no prestige), Steam profile lvl 0, no friends. He avoided the Boss being banish, engaged my duo team at Wolf's, we disengaged, went quiet and went in search of Gator Traps. This Hunter stalked us over 3/4ths of the entire southern map, waiting and following - 3 compounds, dropping dead still as soon as he came within range. He executed two headshots from over 70 meters in the dark, through foliage, without expending more than 5 shots (also against Madame Mae skin). There's no way that was beginners luck. Even while report him his K/D jumped from a 3.something to a 5. - he wiped the other Bounty holder team. I suspect he was using that so called ESP cheat that shows player location on the map and such. But a gameplay capture from my side wouldn't show anything suspicious because of the darkness... Only the Kill perspective and post game stats & profile could be seen as weak "evidence".

[little carbon]

Could potentially just be a smurf. The distance in itself isnt indicative of cheating. Plenty of people can see in night basically as well as in day (even without stuff like reshade, good hardware makes a lot of difference). If he is a cracked 6* smurfing to farm KD it could be legit. But of course this is still somewhat suspicious.

What does sound weird is them taking forever to engage. Most KD farmers would have just murdered you and be done with it

[crystal plume]

@granite jacinth Do you have any examples of the reload bug happening? Because as far as I can tell it was already fixed in 1.12

[signal mural]

Nah, he was a "clean" slate character. Less than 3hrs played on Steam. I think his stats were two bounty extractions, 5 Kills - by the end of me reporting him. I guess he had a 1v1 server one game before where he nabbed a double bounty. He missed a few shots but both his hits were headshots.

I don't think K/D farming 6* would completely restart a fresh Steam profile just to smurf some stats.

I dunno. I wish people's IP addresses would get banned from the servers on top of them losing their account access. I know people can get VPNs and whatever but anything to just make it more of a pain in the ass to cheat would be great.

@granite jacinth I play a lot of Single shot weapons. I have to say I honestly think 1.12 did fix the reload bug.

Now the audio quality though... that's a whole nother thing.

[bronze quail]

Yes they do, and after thousands of hours a restart can be kinda fun. I also have a second account but it's at the same Elo of the main. O just switch from one account to another depending by the day. Hunt atm is not that expensive and it's kinda easy to start a new account. I know people who bought a new one just to see how they improved for example. But there are so many reasons to buy new accounts

[little carbon]

Thing is people dont need a VPN to get around IP-bans. For a long time now static IP's arent a thing anymore, meaning every day your router requests a new IP

[signal mural]

Well then Godspeed to that Hunter. I hope he gets back to the MMR and the Meta where he belongs.

I know everyone's brains don't tick the same but I wouldn't go through the hassle of a fresh account. I'd take a notepad, label & date it, note my current stats and then Prestige and check back on a given date or once I hit 100 again to see the differences. Also if I started a second account I'd send my friends invites, party up - but I'm a social gamer.

I admit there's a chance it was a legit play from some pro on a new account but that doesn't change that it sucks for the other players involved. So the question arises: why is it kinda fun and for whom?

The idea of needing a clean slate to see your performance is also a fallacy. If you have a fresh start you're playing primarily against opponents without the same in-game knowledge. You'd be stat boosting, completely throwing off your statistical data.

[little carbon]

Or on any restart

[runic crypt]

Yeah but people that care about the stats in the sense that they want to see big numbers they usually don't want to think too much about fallacies 😛

[little carbon]

If they are "professional" smurfs then they probably have lots of those accounts. They enjoy the feeling of stomping noobs and having stats to brag about. They just feel good about winning without thinking about the fact that that win doesnt mean anything or makes them more skillful

[signal mural]

Smurfing is just trolling by a different name.

[runic crypt]

Maybe but it would be difficult to try and deal with smurfs

[bronze quail]

Yeah same, i bought a second account cause of boredome but i play it the same way as the main. Anyway is super easy and fast to climb back to the correct rank. With the Smurf i've reached 6 stars around lvl20, but i agree that isn't bullshit for the low ELO players that have to deal with the Smurf account climbing up.
And now with Qp deranking + solo revive is way more frequent to fight against fake low ELO players

[vestal cedar]

Oh, I'm talking about how I can hear and physically see the opponent die. There is enough time for me to observe the death animation and even catch a glimpse of victory over them...and then I die. I do understand the concept of "mitigating the latency client side" and the byproduct as you called it in connection to server-side issues that everyone can see all across the board is nothing more than annoying...leaving the field without a winner. The majority of players don't know the concept tho, the reasons behind it, etc. and they don't have to. I play Hunt a lot, I love Hunt and main this game. From my and my friend's observations, there is a massive influx of trades. Only during the last couple of months, we started to get curious and investigate places where a showdown came to an abrupt stop, and we find full teams dead because of trade kills.

[signal mural]

The c. bomb blocking shots is really ridiculous. The slow and the bleed is enough. Any ammunition should either pass through or at least break part of the wire.

[karmic ivy]

I am talking about the same thing. It can be annoying, but it is much preferable to having my kill invalidated wrongly ( I shot them with a kill shot, but it dosn't count because of the timing and the effect of delays), or having to adjust my aim to the degree of the latency.

[ashen nest]

is the reload bug fixeD?

[karmic ivy]

Sounds like it.

[proud helm]

@novel pecan No, they do not need to compensate us, just go for a walk in the downtime

[wooden bramble]

crytek is bad

[crisp ice]

Why is there latency on EU servers since the new update ? It says i have 13 ms of ping but it feels like i have 50, i get killed behind cover and the death cam shows i'm behind cover and there's no wallbang @hard minnow ???

[little jackal]

imo, saying Hunt is doing great is the opposite of hate, but equally as bad. I'm fine with them making money with dlcs, but if the product quality is lacking, customers should not stay silent. If not a single match can be played without encountering a bug, and for 1 bug fixed we get 2 new ones introduced, there's definitely something wrong with at the very least release management. That David guy looks like a big pro tho, hopefully we'll see improvements one day.

[unborn sandal]

They’re constantly doing updates and server restarts to try and counter the problem. Whining won’t do anything to help them; they’re already doing all they can

[dense schooner]

whining puts pressure on them. better than staying silent

[unborn sandal]

They’re already working on it. Also I assure you they don’t get their server issue updates from discord goblins having a fit. They have a team monitoring that and all the mods here on discord are for is to quell the baby rage when some no lifer’s only form of entertainment is briefly taken from them

[crystal plume]

By using ModMail

That's odd, maybe something on your end then?

[knotty ore]

Diiba and Dart once again here just blocking feedback and gaslighting players. Playing out of region is an advantage. Its clear to anyone who has to put up with it.

[crystal plume]

There shouldn't be anything blocking you from messaging ModMail as it's a bot

Does it give any errors or anything?

[unborn sandal]

All higher ping can do is force a trade. Only other advantage would be you are used to delayed hits and weird glitchiness but your opponent isn’t expecting it. You look just as laggy to them as they look to you

[fathom pier]

someone maybe mentioned this already but.. I like the new system with the weapon instance. BUT you messed with the charms. I use different charms on different skins on the same pistols. depending on the skin etc. now I have to change charm everytime i change skin on the weapon im using

[knotty ore]

Higher ping is a delay in communication round trip. It exacerbates other issues, like a low tickrate for example. It gives you a longer peekers advantage window, but also increases the window where you receive damage behind cover. While you can say its a tradeoff, one is significantly more important than the other.

I have, it feels like I'm cheating.

So, I don't.

[crystal plume]

I play on US East often to play with my US friends and it feels horrible at times

[knotty ore]

I could record it. Is there anyone who is native to Europe that wants to do this experiment. I need you to have a decent PC that can record while playing. PM me.

We can do a side-by-side recording and compare what each player sees. It would be mega interesting. We'll queue up for night map in off hours so its very likely we'll be in the same server.

[crystal plume]

That has already been done IIRC

[knotty ore]

No reds please.

[crystal plume]

Let me see if I can find it

[knotty ore]

I speak Russian/Ukrainian/Polish if that helps.

[crystal plume]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MX4fbGVvrVA

[lean estuary]

@flat oar Big Heck yes to putting the ladder aperture sights on the Sparks

[unborn sandal]

Video seems pretty conclusive. No peeker’s advantage. Each person has the same amount of time they can see the other

[crystal plume]

There is peekers advantage

And the video is not trying to show that there isn't any

[little carbon]

So now moderators are automatically wrong?

[crystal plume]

In the context of the clip it seems to be less than people think, but still definitely there

[little carbon]

But its fully symmetrical

therefore no advantage for anyone

[crystal plume]

I mean in a way yeah, but technically the advantage is always for the peeker, hence the name

But it doesn't matter whose ping is higher in that context

[little carbon]

Yes. That wasnt what i meant as well. I was referring to latency increasing peekers advantage, but for both players

so there is no advantage for high ping

[crystal plume]

Yeah

There's also the whole perspective aspect of how close the peeker or the one getting peeked is to the corner that is getting peeked, but that's a whole other topic

[chrome steppe]

on paper there issnt but in practice the one that does the first move gets the bonus time window

i had a game today where i was about to explode because i got killed with dum dum just after hitting cover and that was the peeker adv most likely

[little jackal]

time dilation amirite

[little carbon]

Yes, generally peeking will always be better then being peeked.
This can also be a good thing tho, as this way around at least promotes active play

[knotty ore]

No, I just want an unbias observer which the moderators don't qualify for based on my interactions with them here.

You wouldn't either technically, so not just the reds.

[crystal plume]

I mean, from our perspective you're the one with the bias, but I get it 😄

You do you

[knotty ore]

I am. But, I'm not gaslighting players experiencing widespread region related issues. No matter what they may actually be.

[crystal plume]

Not sure what you think my bias is though considering I want what's best for the game, so if there is an actual issue, I'd like for it to be solved or brought up to the devs to look at, so if there was genuine proof of actual ping advantages I'd be forwarding that to the devs and all that

Which I have done multiple times in the past with different bug reports and such

[knotty ore]

Its not ping necessarily, it could be a dns communication thing. It could be a lot of things. Meaning if someone played on their region with high ping it may be fine.

All we can observe is that cross region players ruin the experience for everyone native to that region.

[crystal plume]

Which would still need proof, which I have not seen so far, or any sufficient ones at least

Dying behind cover, trading and all that are topics that have already been gone through thoroughly multiple times

So there's nothing there really

The only thing you have claimed advantage wise is that hitting people with higher ping is harder

Which again, lacks proof

[knotty ore]

No, they have a higher peeker's advantage window

And they affect registration on recieving hits.

[crystal plume]

No they don't, when the person with lower ping peeks, it takes the same amount of time for the person with higher ping to see them as the other way around

Since it's the combined ping that matters in that instance

[knotty ore]

Its funny because there is plenty of evidence with other games on latency affecting peeker's advantage.

At least on how its perceived on the recieving end.

[little carbon]

We are not gaslighting your experience. We are explaining why ping / cross region play isnt causing the issues you are having.
I wont deny that you possibly have issues, but if it is so they arent caused by that.
Its two different things, naming issues you are experiencing (trouble with hitreg), its another to name a cause of that, especially if that claimed cause contradicts the statements made by the developers and the known theories of network engineering.

[little carbon]

No, the peekers advantage window gets larger for both parties synchronously with a higher ping difference

[little carbon]

Other games have other network models, or even if they use the same model, their implementation may differ. Therefore results can, and will, vary based on the game.

[crimson trout]

Not so good of an argument for new players, how can you "get better" if every lobby has experienced players that one shot you? xd
And I'm not talking about 1 or 2 prestiges, I'm talking about 20+

[knotty ore]

Prestige just means time, not really skill.

Sure, you get better with time, but only if you choose to.

[knotty ore]

What I'd recommend is finding someone on this server who is higher MMR than you and just have them mentor you a bit. Maybe watch some videos online, there are plenty.

[knotty ore]

If getting hit makes gives you aim punch, it should also prevent your movement for a fraction of a second.

[steel monolith]

Is anyone else having more trouble hearing whether someone is up or down after the indoor sound changes?

[knotty ore]

The sound is absolutely fucked sometimes I will hear someone 30meters out and they'll just appear next to me.

Happens kinda rarely though and usually when its at higher pings

[steel monolith]

I just had someone in Kingsnake that sounded like he was upstairs but dude came from downstairs

[unborn sandal]

Dude you blame all your problems on ping. You’re ridiculous

[knotty ore]

Because it matters a lot?

I get audio issues when I play on NA East, where I have like 80ping

This is the feedback channel, no?

[unborn sandal]

You’re blaming problems on ping that have literally zero to do with ping

You’re making up these evil ping abusers

Claiming it gives a massive advantage and your evidence is shit that happens with 20 ping

[knotty ore]

Hold up. When tournaments are conducted, why are they all played on local with zero ping?

[unborn sandal]

Because it gives a better player experience and results in less trades and confusion

[knotty ore]

Ok thanks

cya

[unborn sandal]

I never said that ping cant cause problems

I’m saying it doesn’t give this massive advantage you keep claiming

[knotty ore]

Low tickrate and high ping players are my main issue with this game. And, its never addressed. So, yea I keep bringing it up

[velvet dawn]

sounds like you need to get gud

[queen jungle]

#PROGAMER

[chilly nova]

I'm so sick of smurfs

[chilly nova]

Legit just died to a guy after his entire death animation. It needs to be addressed

High ping players shouldn't be able to trade with me like that

[analog galleon]

What about the servers? Lost a hunter. Reason: packet loss on the server. 3 icons were burning on the top right. I lost $1000 on ammunition. Why don't you return what you've lost? Where is the rollback due to technical errors on the server,!

[pale gorge]

I'm tempted to ask for bulwark to be nerfed or removed. I run it as my third most important trait, and I love it when it saves me from thrown explosives. But having the trait makes the bomb lance and explosive crossbow and things so weak. You can survive being stuck with a bomb lance harpoon, and in a recent match I was hit twice directly with an explosive crossbow but didn't die because of bulwark. I imagine it felt terrible for the crossbow user. Curious what others think

[unborn dagger]

For bomb lance users? Yes, for crossbow users? Fuckin hell no.

[unborn smelt]

Yeah also for crossbow users - afterall they were talking about two direct hits

They also presumably play on PC where explosive ammo types of all sorts have always been memes

[signal mural]

Honestly if you are a good enough of a shot with the crossbow to be landing 2 direct hits with an explosive bolt, you should know better than to use them for anything other than destroying or flushing people from cover.

[little carbon]

Or just be using shotbolt

If you have enough consistency hitting targets it's by far the better ammo

[signal mural]

True. I prefer half normal & half shotbolt.

[little carbon]

That's what, less than a second? Also considering that on their screen you killed them after dying as well.

And in the end most trades are in favour of the low ping player, meaning if the same encounter happened realtime only the high ping player would have gotten the kill.

I know it's not fun to be dying after you think you are safe. But it's the fairest implementation.

[autumn plank]

Hi, I have a question, I’m the only one who is disappointed about the amount of PVE..? So much dogs or torchman or others who are near themselves etc ! And often it ruin the fight with others players and ruin the game experience in my opinion..

Just tell me your opinion guys !

[tawny meadow]

I personally think that AI adds spice to those combats

[autumn plank]

I’m okay and it always add some spice to combats, but I have the feeling that is too much from some months. Sometimes we have multiples AI all together and it’s impossible to progress on the maps without getting attack by them..

[tawny meadow]

You can kill them first.

[tacit rampart]

Agree with krunzi, TOO MUCH PVE KILLS PVE. And before there was more surprise in the layout of the AI, now we know what we will find in advance at each important point of the map ...

A slight adjustment would be perfect

[fringe dawn]

@sturdy flicker What the F is that shotgun suggestion lmao

[little carbon]

@rotund oasis the difficult part would be to transfer the complete gamestate data for that time interval from the killer to the killed, since you can't use the data of the killed player cause of client Side hitreg or you will have inaccurate kill cams. (like the kill view right now is already inaccurate).
That means every client has to keep the last x seconds of data cached and then you need the infrastructure to send that data.

While this could of course be implemented it's not as trivial of an implementation as it could seem on first glance

[rotund oasis]

Yeah. I thought it could maybe work by having the server run a ten second replay buffer (Like OBS does for example) and when someone gets killed, they send them the movement data of the killer, so the killcam would render it client side. It wouldn't be all that much data. Mostly just position xyz, rotation, items and actions. If saved in a very compact format, that could send really fast. I mean most demo files (which is what this would basically be) of the original doom are much longer than ten seconds and are barely a few KB.

[queen jungle]

I fully understand why they didn't add a kill cam to Hunt after the kill cam they had in Crysis 3.

[queen jungle]

PvE is a core part of Hunt's experience, so I don't know how it could possibly ruin said experience. It's a PvPvE game, not just a PvP game and knowing how to deal with PvE while fighting other players or avoiding PvE is part of being a skilled players in Hunt.

[fringe dawn]

Kill cams are ok as long as it only shows the killer and the killed. Gathering info about teammates on killcam would be too much IMO

[queen jungle]

Spectate is already an inaccurate representation of events and judging by past kill cams in Crytek games, it wouldn't be any different in Hunt

[fringe dawn]

oof

[little jackal]

pve you say

[rotund oasis]

Well that's why it would be replacing the kill view. Because you can only pull that up once you/your squad is full dead.

[signal mural]

I thought PvE density was also part RNG (per map) and part player population related. Less human players in the server = more AI

[fringe dawn]

To me it feels like there is too much AI sometimes in a compound

5 grunts + 2 hives nearby in a ceiling + 1 meathead

like oof

Sometimes an immolator is nearby too

[eager dragon]

Got 7 kills but at the end the game says I only got two (even though I've got 7 timestamps)

[unborn dagger]

Exactly

[unborn sandal]

Redskulled kills don’t count towards your kills so you probably killed a guy on his last health bar 5 times

@left marlin ping abuse isn’t a thing

[wooden bramble]

crytek is bad

[jaunty jolt]

I think the best way would be to make killcams only available when spectate is.

Spectate doesn't do its intended job anyway, and is FAR worse as far as being easy to exploit for advantage. I've had people invite me to chat to try giving an in depth play by play of the team who killed them. It's bad, especially on console where it's so much easier to just invite people to a chat

[fringe dawn]

Yeah, a proper implementation of a killcam would be SO good to the game

Idk if we will get that at one point but I have faith

[eager dragon]

No way those were redskulled kills, I couldn't body tap them with a centennial

[weak sparrow]

has anyone else noticed that since this last patch it is now possible and quite frequent to get wall banged with ammo that has no pen. so far i have died to a dum dum wall bang and i got hit by 2 poison rounds through a brick wall. ands thats just today. i want to go back to before this patch when they broke basically everything

[atomic cipher]

@sudden ruin Can't be intentional? LOL

[sudden ruin]

Yeah, I don't think making a quest impossible except for kiting a meathead from a neighbouring compound over the border (I'm not even sure if that's possible) seems like such a tedious game design choice I doubt Crytek would put that in the game.
@atomic cipher

[atomic cipher]

Crytek has "0" cred with how they let the game run. So another extremely poor (intentional or not, doesn't matter) quest design is well expected at this point. At least I knew some like thing would happen even before looking through the challenges. And they did not disappoint

[sudden ruin]

Well, whether it's intentional or not, as long as this BS persists I guess I'll be running up and down the riverbanks looking for checks notes 16 (!) Gator Traps...

At least I'm familiar with the rat grind, I even got the Plague Doc way back when.

[crystal plume]

I got the meathead quest done in one match

[atomic cipher]

sure sure. mods and devs must be just more lucky than us mere mortals

[unborn sandal]

You’ve got a month to do the quests you don’t have to grind it out in 5 days

[marsh dagger]

@brave violet The Mosin Avtomat exist already. People want the Mosin-Avtomat nerfed to the ground, so adding a machine gun that has better reload will not be better recieved

[knotty ore]

I do because I hate the quests and I want to get back to playing the game in a fun way.

[unborn sandal]

Just play the game normally

[knotty ore]

Then I can't ever finish the quests.

[unborn sandal]

Only thing you gotta change for is weapons

And occasionally look for gator traps

[knotty ore]

Really? Because running around the map in dark sight looking for shiny sky lights is mandatory to complete the quest chain. Same with making sure you don't accidentally headshot someone to complete quests like, "make hunters bleed" ... etc.

[unborn sandal]

I never went looking for gator traps purposefully and I finished the questline

Just every time I ran across water I did a quick scan

[knotty ore]

Yeah, not my experience at all. I cleared the server and looked for traps after because otherwise you just get insta-ed by snipers running around in darksight looking at the sky.

Its also funny that the quest design is, "use this trash loadout because its the only way we can make you use these weapons you wouldn't otherwise buy".

Ok to be fair, I would meme with some of those loadouts.

[unborn sandal]

Only thing I had trouble with was incend ammo

I use berthier and scottfield regularly

I hate ammo that has no pen

[knotty ore]

Fire damage? You just get Birther Emily and put fire ammo in it.

Same with poison damage, but at least Sparks with poison ammo is pretty decent.

I think I almost never use the scottfield unless I have fanning or something. While Spitfire is not that bad, I find that its not as good as alternatives in most loadouts. Uppercut, New Army, Dolch, Officer, and even Bornheim are better options. But, its preference really.

[unborn dagger]

I don't know whether it's the sights or the sway that is just making me not like the Schofield. It feels like crap to use compared to the Pax

[knotty ore]

Its because the model is super tall for no reason. It takes up so much screen realestate that I hate it with a passion.

At least the spitfire is.

[unborn dagger]

I haven't tried the spitfire much but I think it is

[knotty ore]

It feels like the dude is holding the spitfire by the very end of the grip

Like dude look at this, why isn't the person holding it higher? Can you even reach the hammer from this position?

Normal Scottfield looks normal...

[little jackal]

because of the additional finger grip under the trigger maybe

still a mystery to me how it helps with recocking

and at this point I'm too afraid to ask

[knotty ore]

The guard under the trigger is not for your trigger finger, its for the middle finger though. I think.

[little jackal]

yeah

[knotty ore]

For recoil control you'd probably want to palm it higher? I don't know, but it bothers me enough to never use that gun lol

[unborn dagger]

Yeah I don't like that lol

[haughty cargo]

Is it me or does the double or nothing DLC not have Jekylls description on there

[worthy ferry]

We need hunt dollar costs to be shown with skins and not just the base items!

[upbeat axle]

I love how broken hounds are now. I just got killed because hounds agroed onto me, after an enemy shot at them.

[prime sierra]

Huh- broken in what way

[crystal plume]

!range

[marsh garden]

A shooting range is in the works, possible optional PvP with your squad has been teased. More details here - https://youtu.be/PkrXpJRvyiw?t=2087

[crystal plume]

@drifting hound ^

Also you can bring your own loadout into the advanced tutorial already

[drifting hound]

Thanks! I did see a shooting range mentioned on here but after the patch I thought that they were referring to the one in the tutorial! Not ideal 😂

[pulsar moat]

when it comes to naming things pertaining to weaponry like, "vertelli karabiner silencer", It is better to name it "vertelli karabiner silenced", the silencer is just a part of the rifle , so when you read it it sounds like "oh just 1 part of a gun" for example, If i have a five-seven pistol with a silencer on it , Im not going to say "this is the five-seven silencer" , im going to say "this is like five -seven silenced"

[wooden bramble]

crytek is bad

[little carbon]

Are you able to make a full statement, like hypothesis, reasoning, proof?

[worthy knoll]

@cold pasture

The Katana skin should be added, agreed. And it should be a Saber (definitly Not a Machete!)

[agile pelican]

You could have two skins, a katana for the saber, and a wakizashi for the machete

[frail marsh]

yeah
i mean its kinda whack that they hyped up a katana with the dlc desc but then gave us throwing knives

[crystal plume]

Katana wouldn't fit the saber animation wise

[unborn dagger]

Wat?

[crystal plume]

It's more of a 2 handed slicing weapon, not a 1 handed stabbing weapon

[unborn dagger]

I mean eh? I don't think that really matters when it can still be used as an effective stabbing weapon

Besides you can still use the light attack as a slash instead of a stab

[worthy knoll]

I dont care,(almost) Nobody really does. The simple fact is as a Machete its Garbage that Nobody plays. And the light Attack is a slice.

[worthy knoll]

Yes. I essentialy have bought the DLC for the Hunter since axes are better than knifes and i suck With the bow.

I used the bomb Lance as a 'knock of Naginata" which would be a culturally appropriate weapon for a Woman. Kind of.

[crystal plume]

Even machete wouldn't fit

Honestly, combat axe has almost spot on animations for it

2 handed and slices

[tribal wyvern]

Torborg is a males name, atleast here in Sweden.
Probably same in Germany aswell.

@latent nova

Though in some other websites it says female name. So i would argue it's neutral.

[unborn dagger]

@atomic cipher "Make it 20 min max" Lmao

[atomic cipher]

lmao indeed

[atomic cipher]

@left rose The best time was right before they added it to the game. Today, years later it's kinda too late. 0 balance but perfectly in line with beloved "spam no skill" idea by devs

[unborn sandal]

@regal gulch you can map jump and vault separately already

[wary hinge]

The damage indicator thing has been known to show damage and body hit locations wrong

[unborn sandal]

I don’t think there are any cheats to reduce damage. The damage history is know to be buggy and you probably hit him in the shoulder

[small wolf]

I'm actually just going to start killing every random teammate i see camping in a bush. its getting out of hand. almost every single game, like their K/D is tied to RL income.

on damage history comment yes its in beta

[ornate crater]

I think especially the "Kill Meatheads at Sweetbell, Forked River or Lockbay"-Quest leads to many people sitting around there in bushes just waiting for people to complete the quests. It's nice when you actually have a big fight there, but often its just 3-4 solo campers around the compound waiting. Since I am done with the quest I only go there when the boss is actually there.

[ripe basalt]

@celest solstice What server are you on right now?

[feral radish]

@celest solstice That looks really unplayable Needs to be fixed.

[celest solstice]

US West

[ripe basalt]

Danger, do you have warning symbols enabled?

[celest solstice]

Of course

It's not my connection

[ripe basalt]

Warning symbols show up regardless of whose connection

[celest solstice]

No warning symbols. This is purely the server just being horrible

This kind of stuff is happening game after game

Unplayable imho yet I queue up again constantly giving the game more and more chances and it continues to let me down

[ripe basalt]

I'll let them know. I was having high packet loss on East/West about three games ago as well

It's why I asked if you had the setting enabled or not

[celest solstice]

I always have it enabled. This definitely needs to be addressed

[haughty cargo]

Imagine having an issue with fanning in a game that is the wild west in the bayou

[crude karma]

honestly, i wish the chain pistol wasnt able to be fanned, but im pretty sure thats just me. dont really care about anything else being able to be fanned.

[queen jungle]

@haughty cargo But wouldn't that entirely ruin the use of solo revive? Because then you knew they could get up and their advantage, i. e. being able to get up once it's save to at a later point, would be entirely negated.

[haughty cargo]

Perhaps, but if the alternative is always wasting the time to either babysit or use my tools on hand

Then that is exhausting for even other solos fighting other solos

When you are up against a duo or a trio, generally you at least have a good idea that when they are all dead they are all dead

Self res isn't OP or anything, it's just really fucking obnoxious

[unborn sandal]

He just has an inexplicable hate for solos that circumvents all rationale

[queen jungle]

Or you could leave and keep in mind that this person might possibly get up later on - at a disadvantage of course due to having lost a health bar.

If you want to rule that possibility out, you'll have to invest the time needed. That's just a fair trade-off in my opinion.

[haughty cargo]

I would say it could use some work to be less annoying

We not only have to worry about solo rat players trying to third party constantly but now we get to worry about any solo player getting back up so it's either use your consumables or babysit them in the back of your mind

[queen jungle]

It's a fair trade-off. You want them out of the back of your head, use your consumable. It's what they're there for.

[haughty cargo]

I disagree, but it is what it is

[haughty cargo]

Why would this be a bad addition?

[unborn sandal]

I think most of the people perusing general chat and update discussion chat are also the ones voting on ideas, and a lot of them are probably just sick of you specifically whining about solo necro and it has branched into a general distaste for you. Maybe not, but that’s just my guess since the same idea has received mostly positive reception in the past

[queen jungle]

To be fair, it's not uncommon for the same ideas to be received differently one time to another. Depends on who happens to be around to vote, etc.

Really just shows that the votes in #game-ideas are an indication, but not representative for the community as a whole.

[unborn dagger]

I don't think it will be a bad idea if it is locked to bounty darksight with a trait

[haughty cargo]

So, bitches then

[queen jungle]

@viscid ice Crytek are constantly hiring new talent for Hunt, just last week AleaS became the new Community Manager for Hunt Brazil!
If you'd like to contribute, head over to https://www.crytek.com/career

[atomic cipher]

@royal chasm Seems like you are done with paying devs for a very long time then. No sign of them removing that "gun" in the future

[royal chasm]

If i'm getting killed by that shit a few more times i'm just done with the game. D4 looks nice

[little carbon]

Because it isn't op. You can make an argument for the ammo reserve to be a bit overtuned.
But most people that constantly loose to avtos do so because they refuse to adapt and learn. Because enough people can deal with it consistently

Like, just for a week put aside personal feelings for it and when you die, analyse your plays, your positioning, your decision-making and try to figure out what you could have done better.
In general probably the best thing one can do after a loss, at least if you actually want to improve.

[little jackal]

or just pick an avto yourself and you won't need to do any of that 😏

[royal chasm]

Why do you think i complain about the avto and not about the crown or the Dolch or any other cring gun? You cannot ajust to getting hit by a volley of long ammo. You in the open? Bad luck because you can't run after beeing hit and can't count on having half a second to aim and shoot back because there is no fucking delay for a avto to cicle the next shoot. You in cover? Does't matter because long ammo. You feel safe because you managed ti get a bit of distance? Wrong again because the first shoot is accurate. And if that gun isn't gong off before you have no clue that it is there. So waht exactly should i adjust? The only ajustment for me right now to avoid beeing killed by an avto to simply not play.

[royal chasm]

Wow such smart

[little jackal]

worst part about the avto controversy is that people complain without even knowing how it works exactly, thus devaluing others' legit points

[atomic cipher]

Man don't event try. You will immediately attract all the avto defenders (maybe users? ) who like to ignore reasoning or enjoy saying L2P. Avto is op and cringe in the game that is supposedly built around skill-based weapons. But spam meta is not new and devs like it very much.

[karmic ivy]

@drowsy galleon but... new player are not gone. There are more than ever.

[digital nacelle]

I wouldn’t hate it if people didn’t die in water so often

but then you’re just screwed if you don’t have tripmines

can’t burn

[obsidian narwhal]

@frail torrent that's actually coming in late 2023 according to the roadmap video released in early 2023

[frail torrent]

Ohh that´s nice! I must have missed that my bad 😬

[obsidian narwhal]

no worries 😄

[hazy quartz]

!plans

[marsh garden]

Some of the plans for the future of Hunt with references:

Servers are the number one priority to address in 2023 - https://youtu.be/PkrXpJRvyiw?t=756
New map is in the works, will be a new biome - https://youtu.be/PkrXpJRvyiw?t=2439
New boss this summer, a wild target outside of compounds - https://youtu.be/PkrXpJRvyiw?t=1285
Shooting range, possible optional PvP with your squad - https://youtu.be/PkrXpJRvyiw?t=2087
New event this summer, starting a new event trilogy - https://youtu.be/PkrXpJRvyiw?t=1462
Update to Cryengine 5.11, DX12 and current gen console support - https://youtu.be/PkrXpJRvyiw?t=2292
New modes and custom lobbies are considered for 2024 - https://youtu.be/PkrXpJRvyiw?t=2506

[echo forum]

sound is absolutely a bysmal now.

[tribal wyvern]

So night only, with buffed bounty gain, was a flop.
How bout we take the hint & just remove it entirely? Clearly no one wants it. And people want to play a mode where they can see shit.

RachtaZ was able to plan his own events in that mode because it was dead ass empty.

[unborn dagger]

Quite the terrible take my dude.

[little jackal]

make avtos only available on night maps

battle of two titans

[echo forum]

tbh it's true that basically no one wants to play it

[tribal wyvern]

Can think whatever u want bout my take, what i say is true.
It wasn't played at all.

[unborn dagger]

Yeah since the community is a huge baby about it. Doesn't mean it should be taken out since there's still people thay want to play night including me

[echo forum]

not really being a baby about it. The mode is simply ripe for people abusing the graphics or running TN panels lol. On an OLED monitor with proper color calibration you can't see shit. You can't see people playing camo skins etc. This is why reshade is so popular. People butcher gamma and black levels just to see on regular maps let alone night maps

[unborn dagger]

So my point still stands the community is a baby about it because they can't see anything so they cheat their way through.

[tribal wyvern]

Yes everyone who dislikes night = babies.
What was it bout takes again?

[steel hamlet]

Community must be a baby about daytime maps, too. Given that cheaters are prevalent in all modes.

[tribal wyvern]

It's an unfun mode that completly fucks with your vision.
That promotes a boring playstyle that the community collectively hate, besides the few.

And people use whatever they can to their advantage to minimise the effect of night. Because it just isn't fun.
In a pve mode, sure. But not for pvp.

[unborn sandal]

I think you are just a meta abuser and can’t see that people want to have fun with fire ammo

[little jackal]

surprisingly, the night wildcard felt pretty good for a change. The problem was the players that I encountered. For some reason they were convinced that if it's dark outside, they absolutely have to sit in the bush and make no move 😄

[tribal wyvern]

And i think you're just full of shit.

Go use ur execuses where someone cares.

[unborn sandal]

Very helpful. Great talk

[unborn dagger]

Fire ammo at night is awesome dx

[tribal wyvern]

Yes calling someone a "Meta abuser" helps alot.

Good logic

[unborn sandal]

Clearly you’ve never use dragons breath at night

[tribal wyvern]

Clearly i have

[unborn sandal]

You don’t even need to shoot people. Free fireworks

[echo forum]

that's the point. Why would I go into it when I can't see and get killed by people who can? If this game did proper night, like in Rust you would need actual reshade cheats to see and not just tweaking your black level and gamma.

[steel hamlet]

I know for sure that a lot of people like to sit around and do nothing on the night maps. Just sitting up in towers and bushes, not doing the objective at all and choosing to bodyguard everything.

[unborn dagger]

That is fair

I still feel like they need to implement a dynamic westher system.

[steel hamlet]

Rain would be very nice

I've been waiting for it for a long time

[unborn dagger]

Same

[echo forum]

man idk what happened but I literally can barely get kills after this last update. The server feels fucked. I keep getting 1 tapped by players that don't even have a 1.0 K/D. Feels like I'm 3 seconds behind the server.

[unborn dagger]

I don't know it still feels the same for me tbh.

[echo forum]

I would love it but wouldn't count on it being done well. They need to bake these in to the world so they can't be abused like the foilage can with settings

[steel hamlet]

I feel like the devs haven't added rain for some weird, obscure reason. Sure, it could be technical limitations. But I also feel like it'd be for some "Visibility in PVP" thing

All I'd really see rain being good for is for a wildcard bounty where sound is not your ally

[crystal plume]

It's not a technical limitation

So we can leave that out

[unborn dagger]

That's what I thought when the inferno maps happened

[steel hamlet]

Can't ever know with the Devs, so I just threw it in there for good measurements

The CryEngine has to be one of the more rough engines out there, so it's certainly something they'd be able to say

[crystal plume]

Crysis already had rain in older engine versions 😄 And they had working rain in Hunt already while prototyping fog which they showed on stream

[steel hamlet]

Not a single one of you better start up with something about the engine being good, or so help me God. Hahaha

[unborn dagger]

Well hopefully they make a wildcard event for rain just to see how it goes.

[echo forum]

well visibility is already quite poor in the game. Lots of washed out colors and skins that have very little difference between environment. the game has an inherent blur problem. 99% of my gameplay is looking for jaggies moving

[steel hamlet]

Oh yeah. Visibility is certainly not the strong suit of the game. Especially if you have skins like The Reptilian and such running about.

[echo forum]

which I think actively makes the game worse. Sound has been getting butchered with updates and then you have skins that basically blend into the map + the brutal eye adaptation when you look out from a window. The game is still good but lots of janky shit should be fixed. The way that " camo" and eye adaptation work are not realstic and just make the game worse. I think footstep volume should be lowered too. Way too easy to defend in this game. When you push your own foosteps deafen you. Then you need to try and enter the compound that has terrible visbility when you look in from outside + tarps and bullshit all over. I basically feel like I'm flipping a coin when I breach a compound. Is someone going to ADS the entrances with slugs? 50/50. Most compounds only have 3 max entrances too which makes it quite rough.

I also trade roughly 7/10 of my games as a solo ever since the trade update. Makes the game quite rough. I used to play like 20 hours a week. Now I play for a few weeks then uninstall for a few months and repeat.

[little jackal]

pushing head-first into an entrance is a coin flip as it should be

[hallow thorn]

do we have any middle east players in here? I recently got the game and I've been enjoying every second of it but its always frustrating to die and lose your hunter due to bad latency

[queen jungle]

There are a few to my knowledge

Personally, I've played with people from Saudi Arabia and Iran

[hallow thorn]

yeah Im from iran and apart from the sanctions the ping is very bad

I wonder if crytek will ever add middle east servers

[queen jungle]

In the past they've stated that it would require regions to have a high-enough player count for servers to be added there

[hallow thorn]

doesn't hunt need only like 10-15 players to start a match? so its not like other games that need 100+ players

but what do I know

were the players that you played with from Iran random? if not can you please give me their discord so that I ask them what they do about their ping

[queen jungle]

It's 12 players in a match, yes. But you need a few thousand at least to make sure there's always somebody around to play with or you end up with empty matches all the time.

[queen jungle]

It was via #eu , but also a while ago so I don't remember their names

[hallow thorn]

I mean last time I checked the game had about 40k players so couldn't atleast 1000 of them be from middle east?

[crystal plume]

Having enough people for matchmaking is not the only factor, server infrastructure gets very expensive very fast

So having enough players to make investing in that is also a factor

Maybe even more so than whether or not there's enough people for full matches

[echo forum]

Not really lol, you can do it in every other game in a fair way. In this game you can hear someone walking 50m away. Kind of insane. There is also a huge discrepancy in player sound. I've had time where my ambient sound is louder than everything else but my partner has no ambient sound. I think a lot of the sound is client side.

[queen jungle]

I think the loading screens are a bit too short for the amount of text displayed. It only really lasts about 3 seconds regardless if its one sentence or three.

[steel hamlet]

To be fair to this point... since the forced MMR change, it's been incredibly hard to find matches with players, regardless of where you are. From someone who plays US East/West, it went from common instant queueing, to having to wait almost a full red bar every single time.

[analog galleon]

Man killed me through a brick pillar

crytKEK

[queen jungle]

It's pretty dark, but looks like there is an opening

[steel hamlet]

Depends on where the body is, there. There IS an opening, but I can't tell if the body is in front of or behind that wall behind the bars.

Also good to take into account that the 'kill cam' is not the most accurate tool in the game

[analog galleon]

In this location, there is a column of bricks in the basement. Behind it is a window with a lattice. I was standing behind a column and in my monitor I saw a shelter, I was in a blind spot...everything on the right and left is closed. But the campaign engine of the game is playing against the players. He probably saw my elbow or the whole side. But I didn't see anything from my side..I was completely shut down...

[hot vigil]

I know long ammo can pen thru -some- stone.

[hazy stump]

Hunt Showdown has three maps - Stillwater, Lawson, and Desalle and sometimes it seems like you get one map more often then another. Well, i decided to track this and see what the percentages are between map types. Data was taken from 30 days of playing (not straight) over a few months with a minimum of 15 games per day I played. Compiled in the images are the games played per day over that 30 day period and pie charts showing all the different map types/times of day and then just the map in general. Why do this you ask, well cause why not i guess... Personal opinion - you get Desalle a quite a bit more then the others in general. Crytek could you please up the percentage of Stillwater some please. 🙂

[digital nacelle]

I have noticed that desalle is more common

thank you for collecting this

[errant vortex]

Time of day should not be the "wild" condition. It's ought to be like the Inferno event, and other map changing conditions. Rain, Storm, Snow, Flood, Eclipse, Inferno.

[haughty cargo]

I assume that will be the case eventually

They just needed to stop people from complaining while also getting it ready, hopefully

[hushed bane]

well we don't HAVE those yet so Wildcard being the Completely random contract mode makes more sense

[tired depot]

The legend himself

[haughty cargo]

I think rain at the very least should be in normal rotation

Windy stormy weather, having night taken out of the rotation was silly

[errant vortex]

We already have a completely random contract, wildcard makes no sense at all unless it's going to have a chance for Inferno.

NA West server has ONLY had the random contract for years now.

[iron trench]

@whole grove@unborn sandal Tell me my friends... why you disagree...

[unborn sandal]

It’s already extremely strong

That’s coming from someone who loves Flechette

[iron trench]

Naaah... flechete sucks... i always peek when i know the guy is using flechete, because he CAN'T one shot me... the flechette ammo is probably the worst special ammo in this game (after explosive ammo).

[whole grove]

Flechette is well balance, further up it would be better than slugs

[unborn sandal]

Except he can one shot you if he aims well

Also if he hits a meat shot and fake pushes you’ll bleed out trying to defend yourself

[tight delta]

I don't see why it needs a rework. I love running Specter + Flechette. Nerfing the bleed in favor for longer HS-OHK potential and tighter spread doesn't sound like something I want to see.

[unborn sandal]

Also also 2 tap range is insane as well as great cleanup for a pistol shot at midrange

Honestly it could probably use a nerf as you said to make it only light bleed

[iron trench]

My idea was to make it a headshot only at 20 meters... the long barrel shotgun slugs can one shot people to the upper torso at 20 meters.. the flechette would not.

[unborn sandal]

The heavy bleed is so crippling especially when you’re missing a good chunk of your health from what caused the heavy bleed

[whole grove]

it's 15m meter upper torso for slugs at 15m meter with flechette you do 125 dmg + bleed it's enough

A winfield terminus with flechette is already a distroying maching even at long range

[unborn sandal]

It’s not static. Totally depends on the shotgun

[iron trench]

Except the fact that you'll kill the guy if you use the regular buckshot..

[tight delta]

You can't apply any meaningful damage at medium ranges, while with flechette you can.

[whole grove]

Yeah you trade damage for a debuff witch is better outdoor but worst indoor. That why I say it's balance, a good alternative but not superior

[iron trench]

For long barreled shotguns the headshot effective range is 26 meters...

[tight delta]

I don't see why ammo designed around applying bleed and having more consistent damage over medium ranges needs a close-range buff.

[iron trench]

The flechette only works in trios... one guy makes somebody bleed and the rest rushes; playing flechette in duos or solos is always a disadvantage.

[unborn sandal]

It’s really not