general-chat

[keen sparrow]

Hey, everybody, I am brand new to this ada fruit stuff. I am trying to build a portable retro pie handheld and I need contact audio amplifiers to give reliable sound. But I'm not sure how the boards work. How do you adjust the volume on boards like the tpa2016? I'm trying to put together a parts list, but I'm not sure what parts to buy.

Actually, if there was a list of products that are useful for my build, I would like to check them out. Thank you!

[ebon dew]

do you mean a transducer?

Something like this? https://www.adafruit.com/product/1784

To adjust the volume you'd need some type of external input like a rotary encoder or 2 volume buttons.

# Setup your I2C bus and pins for the TPA
# Set initial gain levels
tpa.max_gain = 0
tpa.fixed_gain = 0
# volume up/down
if button1 pressed:
   tpa.max_gain -=1
if button2 pressed:
   tpa.max_gain +=1
``` something like that

disclaimer: not a working example, theory example only.

[rain cradle]

Could also do fancy (branch-less and 1 line shorter) with:
gain += pressed (and -=)

[ebon dew]

also recommend reading the learn guide: https://learn.adafruit.com/adafruit-tpa2016-2-8w-agc-stereo-audio-amplifier/python-circuitpython

[rain cradle]

Ie: Not pressed >> false >> 0

[ebon dew]

yeah they need better examples for a basic real world demo... this is disappointing to see

https://github.com/adafruit/Adafruit_CircuitPython_TPA2016/tree/main/examples

That's a cool ampifier though. Includes parameters for attack, release, noise gate, etc.. https://docs.circuitpython.org/projects/tpa2016/en/latest/

[sick apex]

aight so most of my menu is complete but there is one thing

i need to figure out

how can i declare the menu outside of the setup function

i tried to do it by just declaring it at the top

then i declared a pointer to one

and that didn't work

wait i might have figured it out

nevermind i haven't

[sick apex]

magic

if this OLED was 2px taller i swear

that would make my life so much easier

there is 16px of yellow

and 48 px of blue

and each of my menu items are 10px tall

i might make them 12 px tall so i dont have to deal with the issue

[urban arrow]

^^ I have like 4 of these. Yeah small, but love the price. Quite useful. I use my larger Ada OLEDs and TFTs for more permanent fancy projects 😀 Gotta draw the spending line somewhere...

[sick apex]

lmao fair

i need to figure out how to navigate the menu now

like i can do it already

i programmed navigation

and that works, i set it to delay 1000 then nav down

to test

but i need to figure out how to call that function on the press of a button

i tried an interrupt

but that just gave me a massive stack dump

[fossil dawn]

maybe you can't write to the screen during an interrupt

[sick apex]

well it stack dumped before i called the interrupt

[fossil dawn]

ah lol 😭

[sick apex]

yeah and it didn't even let me call the setup function

so

[sick apex]

is there a way to run code while a condition is true but only run it once

im thinking if i digital read the pin

kinda like unreal engine's Do Once blueprint

oh also, interrupts dont let you call functions from pointers

[raw jasper]

you can have a global to record which button was pressed, update the global during the interrupt, and leave the interrupt handler; this is unlikely to trigger the watchdog

[sick apex]

oh so like make it set a variable to true

then in the loop if the bool is true

set it to false

and move the menu

[raw jasper]

Moving menu stuff etc etc should be done outside the interrupt handler

[sick apex]

noted

[fossil dawn]

maybe

if(condition && globalVar){
  doThing();
  globalVar = false;
} else if(!condition){
  globalVar = true;
}

Basically have a boolean that you set to false once you did the thing once. And then when the condition is false again, reset that boolean to true

[raw jasper]

Only the bare minimum code should be inside an interrupt

Because essentially you are under a timer

[sick apex]

yeah i knew that but i totally forgot that i was drawing the OLED in that function

[exotic cedar]

Hey folks, general Adafruit question here. Recently I found when trying to log in a message saying my account is “banned until: indefinitely”. They’ve given me no methods to contest the banning.

I’ve reached out to [e-mail] about 3 times in the last month and it’s just a black hole. There is not a phone number on the site I can call to be like ‘yes I’m a human and no I haven’t behaved badly.” Being as my activities on their website consist 100% of reading tutorials and buying stuff I’m very confident blocking was an error.

Anyways, do any of you have advice how to get in touch with a human at Adafruit to restore an unjustly banned account?

[late fulcrum]

Does it actually "banned", or "access denied" or something else? Is there any more information on the screen?

[exotic cedar]

It says banned, just a one sentence statement.

[sharp nexus]

Can i take a function generator and reprogramm it?

[sick apex]

wdym?

[sharp nexus]

It doesnt have waves in it but the output IS perfect

[sick apex]

wdym doesn't have waves in it

im lost

someone else is probably got a better idea of what you mean

[sharp nexus]

Sine, cos and stuff like that

[dusty citrus]

Can you rephrase your main question, by being more exchaustive as possible? I have no idea of what are you talking about either

Make an example, may be helpful

[sick apex]

i thought you was talking about like someone saying hello

or water

or radiowaves

lmao

[sharp nexus]

I understand

Basic pro function generator -

To show waves because somebody player with the code before

[sick apex]

is this hardware or software?

[lucid arch]

I had 2FA for a while and I go into Microsoft Authenticator app just like normal and now I put in the code and I get the error 'Invalid Authentication Token. Ensure your device's clock is accurate. ' I did change phones since I lasted logged in I think but I'm bringing up my old phone just to try it out.

Any idea or how can I resetup my 2fa

[umbral phoenix]

Adafruit? Account >>> Account Settings >>> Security & Privacy >>> Edit two-factor authentication settings

[lucid arch]

it doesn't allow me to when I put in my password it instantly ask me for my 2fa

[umbral phoenix]

maybe with your old phone, then you can change it

[lucid arch]

didn't work with the old phone auth app either

[late fulcrum]

That's what I was going to ask. The old Wavetek function generators make gorgeous waves, but they do so with carefully designed analog circuitry, nothing to program.

[sick apex]

yeah

[raw jasper]

ha. Looks like another gaming community successfully used "glorbo"

I'm surprised the bots haven't blacklisted the word yet

[late fulcrum]

I wondered what that was all about. It didn't occur to me that it's this year's Snowbonk.

As I am obviously not an AI, and I exhale carbon dioxide periodically like any other normal human.

[glad ruin]

Sometimes the old waves are still the best waves.

[late fulcrum]

Quite.

Yeah. I repaired another scope.

[rapid geode]

seems broken still. the lines arent straight.

runs

[late fulcrum]

There's very little that's straight in this household...

[patent hemlock]

https://giphy.com/gifs/agree-AR0MThYLSnmGQ

[exotic cedar]

The message says: “Your account has been banned until: indefinitely”

There is no email traffic from them warning about some behavior. I haven’t interacted with them on any social media besides here in years. I just go on the website and buy stuff and read their learning articles. No comments, no posts in the forum.

[rapid geode]

possibly banned a range targetted at someone else and you got stuck. have you tried from a different computer on a different internet connection?

hmm

[exotic cedar]

I’ve tried a different computer but not a different location. I usually don’t buy stuff at work.

[rapid geode]

yeah probably not relevant anyway, as it says this on login i assume,

[tardy badger]

ISPs sometimes reassign IPs when the do updates. It’s possible you happened to get reassigned a banned IP

Which would be odd

I remember when my parents had centurylink, any time the power in the area went out, we’d get a new IP which messed up my Minecraft servers at the time

[glacial wigeon]

for my ISP, it tends to reset if the modem is off for an hour i think

[tardy badger]

Yeah, it’s definitely not consistent

[glacial wigeon]

yeah, every ISP runs by diff rules

[tardy badger]

I definitely dislike IP based bans for this reason

[blissful roost]

Ugghh... I'll have to arrange my own internet connection when I move into this new apartment. 😦

[tardy badger]

But I suspect there’s probably something more buggy going on rather than it being a deliberate ban

[blissful roost]

I'm hoping the cable work is already done, but I neglected to check that.

[tardy badger]

Especially if they’re just benign in their overall behavior/interactions

[tardy badger]

I’m look into switching to a slightly slower but symmetrical speed service from another company that’s much cheaper than I pay currently

[glacial wigeon]

somebody has taken up irc spam as a hobby again
and my irc network (with a grand total of 1 user, lol) has been getting hit hard, and IP bans arent event effective, he has too many

[blissful roost]

Sym would be nice, but needs the download speed. 😛

[glad ruin]

IP bans make no sense. They aren't the end-all final nuke ban that "gamers" think they are. IP assignments are dynamic unless you pay for a static IP (this used to be common if you wanted to host a website/server); but today there's no real reason not to use a dynamic DNS service.

[glacial wigeon]

the spammer even spammed an apology, then kept spamming, lol

[tardy badger]

I currently pay for 800 ⬇️/ 25 ⬆️

[tardy badger]

Despite not being very effective, they’re still used

[glacial wigeon]

decades ago, i kept evading a wrongful ip ban on an irc network, they gave up trying to get every ip, and filed a false abuse claim to my ISP
then the modem stopped working!

[tardy badger]

Mostly on broader scales than singular IPs though

[blissful roost]

"1130Mbps average download speed
104Mbps average upload speed"

Not bad.

[tardy badger]

Like geoblocking IPs from certain regions

I’m looking to get a 400Mbps symmetrical link that’s fiber

[glad ruin]

200/50 for me.

[tardy badger]

$70/m rather than $96 from comcrapst

1.2TB data cap

[blissful roost]

.... "cap" ???

Wassat ?

[tardy badger]

If I used more data than that, they charge me $10 per 10GB over

[blissful roost]

wut... ??

O_o

[tardy badger]

Yeah…

[umbral phoenix]

I pay $64/month for 5Mbps DSL with a 150GB cap.

[tardy badger]

Hence comcrapst (comcast)

[blissful roost]

Seems like a scam to me.
Someone should tell them that cables don't have a total transfer limit.

[glacial wigeon]

i think i had 600/300, plus tv and phone

my dad talked to the isp, and tried to cancel the tv/phone

they somehow talked him into getting a new cable box, 1500/1000, and half the bill

[tardy badger]

It’s a metered connection meaning their hubs track packet usage into my network

[glacial wigeon]

as far as i know, there is no data cap

[tardy badger]

Though their estimates are always more than what passes into my network server

Last month they said I was nearing my 1.2TB cap, network server said it only registered like 850GB of traffic

[glad ruin]

I didn't know ISPs actually applied data caps.

[glacial wigeon]

the problematic part, 1500mbit down, what cables can handle that? lol

[glad ruin]

CAT6

[blissful roost]

Fast ones. 😛

[glacial wigeon]

i think the ports on the router are only 1000mbit

[glad ruin]

Could be.

You'd need a router with 2.5Gbps ports.

[glacial wigeon]

an SFP module plugs directly into the router

and the fiber runs into that, for the WAN side

[tardy badger]

My Dream machine pro has a SFP+ port

[glacial wigeon]

the router has its own speed-test gui

[tardy badger]

10G SFP+ and 8x GbEth

Can do 3.5+Gbps routing which is cool

[gritty galleon]

$65/month 1Gbps symmetric over fiber, no data caps

Yeah the UDM Pro is pretty great

[tardy badger]

Though I used all the neat tools for network security so my max will be 3.5Gbps

[exotic cedar]

Gotta have behaviors/interactions to ban someone. Until I discovered this 3 weeks ago it had been over two months since I’d been on the site… when I bought something!

[glad ruin]

I'm going to be getting an apartment pretty soon, and am hoping to have a server there that connects to my server here at home.

[tardy badger]

Seems like a mistake that can be fixed. How have you tried to email them? The support form? Direct email?

[exotic cedar]

Two emails, one support form. I waited several days between attempts to contact, but I’m starting to get impatient. There doesn’t seem to be a shortcut to ‘talk to a human’ unless their attention is gained by other means.

[exotic cedar]

Like, what if I want more RP2040’s?

[tardy badger]

Hmmm

I’m not sure, you might post in #help-with-community

I’m not sure outside of that where you could get more attention 🤷‍♂️

[ebon dew]

Just heard a nice sonic boom from the falcon booster re-entry.

[lusty fossil]

Check out this big beefaroni

[late fulcrum]

I wish I had options like that. Where I am, the options are 60/20 from comcrapst, 3/1 from verizon, or ?/? point to point radio link with random fade from Roadstar.

Or really expensive and fairly slow satellite internet from Hughes

[tardy badger]

Have you thought about getting WISP equipment and renting bandwidth from a local data center

[late fulcrum]

Given that I live in a valley, point to point wireless would be tricky. While there is an AT&T site at a peak near here, they have zero interest in dealing with small customers.

I do have enough land to put up a tower, and I live in the land of data centers. There's a major fiber trunk that runs across the street from me, but nobody is offering fiber hookups (due to an old political agreement that basically gives the existing providers monopoly status)

[tardy badger]

If you can find a data center willing to let you rent a space in their roof and a small chunk of bandwidth, you could set up an internet cooperative with your neighbors

Just use Ubiquiti UISP equipment https://uisp.com/uisp-overview

[late fulcrum]

Heh, I've dealt with Ubiquiti before, I'm not eager to do so again

The problem is the data centers are east of the ridge, and we're west of the ridge.

[south light]

Most of the ubiquiti gear can be flashed with OpenWRT if that helps in any way

[late fulcrum]

It would probably be easier to just move to Vermont where I can get 10Gbps FTTH

There is a local coöperative in the process of starting up (I'm supporting them), but their first deployments won't be until next year at the earliest, and I'm probably not in their initial service area.

[tardy badger]

I have personally never had issues with Ubiquiti, when’s the last time you used them?

They are significantly better than they were

[late fulcrum]

About a year and a half ago, when I was extending wireless coverage to the yard to run security cameras. Or at least, I was trying to do so.

[tardy badger]

I’ve done that

Fairly straightforward with their nano beams

And I was doing that in 2017/2018

[late fulcrum]

I was using a NanoStation locoM2 and it really wanted to use its own nonstandard protocol.

[tardy badger]

Sorry nanostation

Nano station just uses a beefier 802.11ac protocol, as do most point to point setups consumer accessible

[late fulcrum]

Admittedly, it might have been easier if I was using Ubiquiti at both ends, so they could agree on their own proprietary modulation, but I had standard WiFi clients that were ... unhappy with the signal provided.

[tardy badger]

That’s not necessarily a feature of Ubiquiti but unnecessary regulations by the FCC from ye olde times of television

[late fulcrum]

My next security camera deployment will probably be a wired one.

[tardy badger]

The FCC unfortunately takes a layered approach to regulation, not really getting rid of old stuff and layering on new stuff

[late fulcrum]

If they'd only get off their duffs and regulate phone scammers. They stood up the Robocall Mitigation Database, and now require phone companies to not connect calls from networks that aren't on the database. But they're not updating the database...

[tardy badger]

Here’s one point to point Ubiquiti install

Did PoE pass through

To do the PoE pass through I had to have a Loco M5 on the camera side, and then just used an M2 on the building side

[tardy badger]

Yeah, the speed of bureaucracy

[keen sparrow]

Good morning, I'm building a retropie handhelds and was wondering what components to buy? I already have a pi 4 and pi pico for controls

[fair summit]

Did you see this guide? https://learn.adafruit.com/retro-gaming-with-raspberry-pi

[keen sparrow]

I did not. I will look at it

[fair summit]

there are some other Retro Pi - related guides too; worth searching

[keen sparrow]

Are those guides also on the site?

[fair summit]

yes, use the search box on https://learn.adafruit.com

there are several thousand guides on our site (not all retro pi 🙂 )

[keen sparrow]

Thanks very much!

[valid marsh]

on a side note, I really with retropie wasn't so awful from a UI perspective

literally every single function you need to access is on a CLI ascii program...

for all the effort that's gone into making an admitedly quite pretty front-end, I can't help but think a tiny bit more would have allowed that frontend to actualy be used to access all the functions it simply points to.

I know, open source, if you want beter do it yourself and contribute etc (and if I was any ghood at the frameworks that retropie uses I proabbyl would)

[tardy badger]

https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/raspberry-pi/RASPBERRY-PI-4-MODEL-B-8G/12159401

Biggest drop of Pi 4 8GB as of recent

Over 1000 units

[valid marsh]

still too pricey for my likes

twice the price of the 2GB for extra RAM

it bodes well for future supplies tho...maybe we'll finally see a 4A

[glad ruin]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/421066866543427604/1134497672649252925/2mEnuua.png

[violet parcel]

I like the smirk and the in-built provocation of "Im a cat catch me if you can"

[glad ruin]

😼

[sick apex]

this was complicated but what do you guys think?

first proper Arduino sdk project

headphone warning: music is playing

the arrow indicates a sub menu, no arrow means it's an application of some sort

[sharp nexus]

Hey guys, I need to redesign a howland current pump, any advice? 🙂

I need it to tolerate +-30V and output +-3mA at aby DAC 🙂

[late fulcrum]

What's your power supply voltage?

[sharp nexus]

+-24V

Easy, reliable and stable

[late fulcrum]

You aren't going to get ±30V from a ±24V supply

[raw jasper]

I'm curious why a boost converter would not work here. I obviously do not know what I am saying, and would like to learn, not to suggest anything 😅

[late fulcrum]

While it's possible to use a boost converter, that becomes the "power supply" at that point, as far as I'm concerned.

I'm guessing you'd need some sort of bipolar boost converter as well, in which case it may be easier to just have a single supply powering a boost converter producing the positive and negative voltages, instead of two separate boost converters, one for positive and one for negative. But I'm less sure about that.

[sharp nexus]

Sounds amazing but back to the Basics under the situation that i have +-24V and want to convert it to +-3mA

[tardy badger]

I think you are not understanding that voltage and current are related and conversely dependent on one another

In the context of circuits that is

Current = Voltage / Resistance for linear circuits.

But trying to go from a voltage source to a current source would not be smart.

It’s better to provide a set voltage like 24V and regular down to the lower voltages you need and let the circuit draw up to the current it needs.

Constant current sources generally are good for things like LEDs

Rechargeable batteries also require constant current sources

Unless a part specifies needing a constant current source, don’t use it

I highly suggest looking at learning an introductory circuit analysis course, something like Khan Academy. It’s going to provide some important fundamentals that are important for circuit design. And it will give you some tools like ohms law, kirchoffs laws on voltage and current.

[keen sparrow]

Is there a 5v power distributor pcb out there I can use for a portable pi?

[tardy badger]

Is it a pi W?

If so, you might consider this: https://www.adafruit.com/product/5705

[keen sparrow]

Pi 4

[raw jasper]

It is strangely fitting how, just like some retro computers, so many pi addons include an RTC

[keen sparrow]

That looks perfect!!

[glad ruin]

I've said this before and I'll say it again: RPF really needs to rethink their power design. 5V over USB isn't enough over cable lengths beyond ~1m.

[glacial wigeon]

i think the best option, is to start using the PD protocol, and add a buck converter to the pi

12v over usb-c, problem solved

but that adds to the board cost

oh, right, and more direct conversion...

the DS9121 is being used in some models to generate the cpu core voltage...

dang, 5.5v max input

the MX7704 is also used on other rails...

[tardy badger]

Over USB C it’s better than micro b

[glacial wigeon]

5.5v again

[tardy badger]

But still not great

[glacial wigeon]

so you cant just 12v->3.3v

[glad ruin]

They are drawing more power than is reasonable at 5V without sense lines to make sure there's actually 5V reaching the board.

[glacial wigeon]

yeah, i keep saying, more things need sense lines

but everybody is being an idiot, and just sets the psu to 5.1 or 5.4v

[glad ruin]

5.1 or 5.2V is fine. I'm pretty sure 5.4 is out of spec for USB.

They need to either dump USB power and use sense lines, or use USB-PD and negotiate something >5V.

[glacial wigeon]

the problem is when people just keep cranking the voltage, until the pi gets 5v

but when idle, it gets too much

just use sense lines!!

[glad ruin]

https://tenor.com/view/exactly-correct-yup-thats-right-dr-emmett-brown-gif-16500686

[glacial wigeon]

it should even be simple to do sense with usb power bricks!

get your standard 4 core usb wire (power+data)

wire the data pair to the power pins!!

[tardy badger]

USB actually is spec’d to deliver up to 5.5V

[glacial wigeon]

reuse data as sense 😛

[glad ruin]

Not without repurposing pins.

[raw jasper]

At this point, you aren't doing USB anymore

[glacial wigeon]

if its a power brick, it had no use for data

[raw jasper]

Yeeeeah, and when the user accidentally connects their phone in

[glacial wigeon]

so you just wire both power and data, to the + and gnd at the usb-c/micro-b port

and boom, your now getting 5v at the connector

[glad ruin]

Up to. That doesn't mean it can (or should) always deliver it. That's the maximum acceptable voltage.

[raw jasper]

And the phone tries to negotiate with the "data lines"

[glacial wigeon]

dont connect power to the data pins

reuse the data WIRES for sense wires

[glad ruin]

In USB-C it's the CC lines.

[tardy badger]

It’s spec’d for that because of expected voltage drops over typical distances

[glacial wigeon]

at the usb connector, solder both power and "data" wires from a standard usb cable, to the power pins

[tardy badger]

350mV drop over 5m for a typical cable

[glacial wigeon]

add whatever normal resistors you use, on the real data pins

[glad ruin]

Those will still get the supply voltage across them, and be tied to whatever additional biasing circuitry is there for communication.

[glacial wigeon]

if its a power brick, there is no actual data going on

just the resistors for normal charge signalling

[glad ruin]

Yes, but what happens when you connect a device expecting data on the data pins?

[glacial wigeon]

nothing, same as when you connect a normal charger

because the "data wires" are not on the data pins

[glad ruin]

Also, having additional components like that defeats the purpose of a sense network.

[glacial wigeon]

i think youve missed what i said to do

[glad ruin]

... so now you'd need a specialized, out-of-spec USB cable.

[tardy badger]

Texas Instruments has a application note that states 5V +/-5% for USB

[glacial wigeon]

no, a brick with a permanently attached cable

[glad ruin]

That takes away a lot of versatility, plus it doesn't work for anything beside that specific brick.

[tardy badger]

https://www.ti.com/sc/docs/products/msp/intrface/usb/pwrdist.pdf

[glacial wigeon]

https://cdn.sparkfun.com//assets/parts/1/4/0/2/3/15448-Raspberry_Pi_Wall_Adapter_Power_Supply_-_5.1VDC__3.0A__15.3W__USB-C_-01.jpg

[glad ruin]

The last thing anyone needs is out of spec USB hardware.

[glacial wigeon]

basically, use 4-core usb wire in this cable

but reuse the data pair, as a sense pair

now you always get perfect 5v at the connector

the device at the connector will notice no changes

the voltage will just be better

[glad ruin]

I understand what you are saying, and I disagree. If you are going to set up a connector with sense wires, it should not be USB.

[glacial wigeon]

yeah, the limit with my trick, is that its only sensing at the back of that first connector

so if you add extensions, it wont help

[raw jasper]

*more out of spec USB hardware ;)

[glacial wigeon]

and then you need a new spec, for extending the sense wires

[glad ruin]

Or... just run at a higher voltage and regulate onboard like everyone else. Don't get me wrong, I absolutely love having sense lines, but it isn't necessary here.

[glacial wigeon]

yeah, thats just using PD to ask for 12v, and buck-regulating down

and assumes you can boot enough to speak PD, while on just 5v

or just go old-school

barrel jack and 12v, lol

[tardy badger]

I prefer mind powered

[blissful roost]

I built a USB PDU a few years, for my solar setup.

I have to supply that with 5.25v, because of the power drop.

[glacial wigeon]

linear or switching? per port or shared?

[blissful roost]

Shared, not sure about the first part. 😛

I'm using a DC/DC converter, to step-down from 12v.

[glacial wigeon]

12->5.25, and then exposing 5.25 over usb?

[blissful roost]

The output on the ports is only 5v

The input needs to be higher to compensate for the drop.

[glacial wigeon]

ah, then there must be another regulator inside that

[blissful roost]

There is a capacitor on the PDU.. I think that's causing the drop.

[glad ruin]

There are chips that do exactly this. No need to power on the entire processor.

[glacial wigeon]

yeah, thats a shortcut

[glad ruin]

There's a diode after the USB port I believe.

Regardless it's a poor design.

[sick apex]

i've just realised that all the work i've done isn't actually going to work

i dont think

can someone just confirm or deny

here is the menu

it mainly relies on pointers

and i want the applications to display as menus

so say i open up an SSID Scanner application

is shows each SSID it finds as a menu item

then i can open that menu that it generates

to get a list of actions i can do to that SSID

but when i do this ```cpp
#pragma once
#include "../../Application.h"
#include "../../../Menu/Menu.h"

namespace Wifi::SSID_Scanner {
constexpr auto Type{EApplicationTypes::Wifi};
void Run();
inline Menu* SSID_List = new Menu("SSID List", true);
}```

i get a core panic (store access fault)

[rain cradle]

spoiler: everything is a pointer 😛

[sick apex]

yes

anyways im not going to be able to predetermine how many SSIDs it picks up

so i cant just create that many pseudo item pointers to do it

so im always going to get the register and stack dump

right?

or is there something im missing

[glad ruin]

https://tenor.com/view/inception-deeper-go-deeper-we-need-to-go-deeper-leonardo-di-caprio-gif-16756828

[sick apex]

it doesn't help that this is very uninformative

[glad ruin]

It's pointers all the way down. Page tables are a thing.

[sick apex]

would that make it work

what are they

idk

im lost

[fossil dawn]

maybe you could dynamically generate menu items? Like when scrolling down generate the next page

[raw jasper]

I think the esp32 has a line by line debugging facility. I'm not sure whether that'd work w/. arduino, but you could use it to troubleshoot what's going on in your code

[sick apex]

it does but you need a JTAG debugger

which i lack

[sick apex]

well i cant even generate the menu item

[raw jasper]

How much would that set you back? It sounds like an useful investment if you keep working with that line of micros

[sick apex]

so its structured like i have a generic Menu pointer

which is the current menu

so i can handle everything generically

to do with the menu

that works fine

[sick apex]

i dont know, i need to find a good one

[fossil dawn]

maybe some callback function 🤔

[sick apex]

i've spent hundreds on equipment so far

and i have thousands to spend on it so if i need to buy one i'll get one

i dont really care, money is useless to me atm considering i dont pay rent

omg you gave me an idea

[fossil dawn]

RP2040 = ❤️ because you can use a second RP2040 as debugger for only 4€

[sick apex]

yes exactly

what if i use one of my picos

to debug

would that work?

some like jtag interface binary must exist that translate jtag to the PC on the pico

[raw jasper]

If it can provide a usb to jtag bridge, it can probably do it ;)

[fossil dawn]

No idea. I've also been kinda curious (but not curious enough to actually look it up) if you can use picoprobe with other MCUs 😆

[sick apex]

well it must be able to because picos can debug other picos

i assume its over JTAG

and its interfaced with the pc over usb

[raw jasper]

picoprobe is SWD :(

[sick apex]

oof

that ruins my idea

screw it

amazon time

[raw jasper]

https://hackaday.com/2022/04/11/need-a-jtag-adapter-use-your-pico/

hmm

[sick apex]

i'll try this first

i dont have the pico sdk installed so i beg that there is a precompiled uf2

omg there is

[raw jasper]

I just love the photograph, with a $4 pico being used to debug a probably $1k+ Xilinx Zynq FPGA (board)

[sick apex]

ah crap

i dont have another micro usb cable

im just gunna buy a jtag debugger

[raw jasper]

hah. Looks like this board goes for ~200$

[sick apex]

😭

[raw jasper]

Cheaper than a microUSB cable?

:P

[sick apex]

idk

i probably have one somewhere

i just dont know if i do

i brought one

when i got my first pico

that was it

now i have 3 x esp32s

an esp32c3

[raw jasper]

I mean, it's worth it to look?

[sick apex]

a pico w

[fossil dawn]

SWD is one debug protocol and JTAG another? Some MCUs use SWD others JTAG? Or what even is that stuff 😆

[sick apex]

a pico H

i have too many

[raw jasper]

I think SWD is an ARM-specific variant of JTAG

Dialect? :P

[sick apex]

but the esp32 is ARM

[rain cradle]

nop

[fossil dawn]

ah 👍 thanks

[raw jasper]

esp32 is xtensa

[sick apex]

lemme find a micro usb cable

oh, i have an arm compiler

[rain cradle]

XTensa and RiscV(C3 iirc)

[sick apex]

i guess they just work i guess?

idk

[raw jasper]

Yeah, the new one (will?) be riscv

It's the new trend with chips coming from the Mainland

[sick apex]

it's times like these when i wish i had usb c micro controllers

[worn elm]

Howdy folks. I signed up for 2fa a while back but I'm not clear on what the forum wants me to do to login now.

[sick apex]

i have like 10 usb c cables

[raw jasper]

https://i.redd.it/6xnnuqoq1jp51.jpg

[rain cradle]

that's not much (i've read that as binary)

[sick apex]

i found one

[sick apex]

that's still 10

[fossil dawn]

that's a lot (i've read that as roman numerals)

[sick apex]

also i found a micro usb

i have 10!

lmfao 😭

[fossil dawn]

that's a lot (I've read that as factorial)

[raw jasper]

Hilbert USB port

[sick apex]

3628800

[blissful roost]

There is definitely not. 🙂

[sick apex]

alright so i have the jtag thingy

but i dont know where or how to connect things

i plugged everything into the pico

where it should be

ah crap

im using the jtag gpio pins for something

already

ugh

wait

am i

im confused

this diagram is confusing

[raw jasper]

Your board doesn't seem to be exposing the JTAG GPIOs over there?

[sick apex]

wdym

[raw jasper]

You need GPIO12, 13, 14, 15

[sick apex]

ohhhh

so which pins do i connect

[raw jasper]

I don't see those GPIOs on the pinout your posted

Does your board have a JTAG header somewhere?

[sick apex]

ohhhhhhhhh

it should be gpio 10

but there is only one

[raw jasper]

JTAG is not a 1-wire protocol

[sick apex]

i know

if you look

[raw jasper]

o_o

[sick apex]

coincidentally the pins i use to navigate my menu

[raw jasper]

aaah

it's a esp32-c3

Not plain esp32

[sick apex]

yes

[fossil dawn]

lmao 😭

[raw jasper]

Yeah, the pins are correct

lol sorry :(

[sick apex]

im being serial

[raw jasper]

Yeah, you can't use those pins while using jtag

[sick apex]

that was terrible

i'll see myself out

[sick apex]

i dont need them really anyways atm

i should be able to just

switch the wires elsewhere

[raw jasper]

Just comment out all the code that uses them or switch them to other pins. Also this:
https://docs.espressif.com/projects/esp-idf/en/latest/esp32c3/api-guides/jtag-debugging/index.html

[sick apex]

they're all digital read so its not like i have to use them

[sick apex]

but then i cant nav the menu

so i cant find runtime errors that occur outside of the main menu

[raw jasper]

Why not call the function that messes things up directly?

[sick apex]

i'll just move them

[fossil dawn]

but using the debugger you can edit the variable values 😆

[sick apex]

bahaha

i dont need to

the moment i compile with that one line of code

i get hit by a train of core panic

[sick apex]

oh, like live programming?

[fossil dawn]

not sure what exactly is possible with such debuggers

but I think I could just set any variable to any value 🤔

[sick apex]

im using platformio, im not too familiar with the debugger

its openocd

but i dont know how to use it

[fossil dawn]

same 😆

[sick apex]

this is what i have

[glad ruin]

Gotta be careful when you do that though because it is very easy to put the entire program into an invalid state if that variable affects the execution path.

[sick apex]

then i get this

undefinedC:\Users\user.platformio\packages\toolchain-riscv32-esp\bin\riscv32-esp-elf-gdb.exe: warning: Couldn't determine a path for the index cache directory.

Reading symbols from c:\Users\user\Documents\PlatformIO\Projects\ESP32-C3.pio\build\esp32-c3-devkitm-1\firmware.elf...
PlatformIO Unified Debugger -> https://bit.ly/pio-debug
PlatformIO: debug_tool = cmsis-dap
PlatformIO: Initializing remote target...
Open On-Chip Debugger v0.11.0-esp32-20220706 (2022-07-06-15:48)
Licensed under GNU GPL v2
For bug reports, read
http://openocd.org/doc/doxygen/bugs.html
adapter speed: 5000 kHz

Info : tcl server disabled
Info : telnet server disabled

wait why tf is it using telnet

that's like the most insecure protocol ever

[raw jasper]

It doesn't matter if you only bind to loopback ;P

Besides, it's disabled :)

[sick apex]

i cant figure this out

[raw jasper]

Where does it err for you?

[sick apex]

i dont think it does error

it doesn't look like an error

[late fulcrum]

But Spy-Bi-Wire is a 2-wire protocol that appears to be similar.

[sick apex]

then again

it hasn't init my OLED

oh yeah

because im being railed by stack dumps

[raw jasper]

Ha, reading this, I though the name was some sort of pun, and then I googled it 😅

[fossil dawn]

Off-topic: There is an Arduino Telnet library https://github.com/JAndrassy/TelnetStream

[sick apex]

which goes where

im lost

they have different names

[raw jasper]

From https://docs.espressif.com/projects/esp-idf/en/latest/esp32c3/api-guides/jtag-debugging/tips-and-quirks.html#can-jtag-pins-be-used-for-other-purposes

[sick apex]

thank you

so i only need those 4

[raw jasper]

* four

[sick apex]

• Thoes

• Four

gramer

lmfao

[raw jasper]

Connect Reset too

[sick apex]

to en?

[gritty galleon]

I haven't done this myself, but the ESP32-C3 should be able to do JTAG over USB for chip revisions after 0.3. At least that's what the documentation says. If the CPU revision is older than 0.3 you have to use a JTAG adapter with the GPIO pins. JTAG over USB doesn't need any additional hardware connection.

https://docs.espressif.com/projects/esp-idf/en/latest/esp32c3/api-guides/jtag-debugging/configure-builtin-jtag.html

[raw jasper]

I've never done this, but a natural guess would be RST->RST ;)

[sick apex]

omfg it works

[raw jasper]

Congrats!

[sick apex]

there isn't a reset pin on the esp32-c3

the rst button goes to EN

[gritty galleon]

There is, it's called EN

[sick apex]

if that's what you mean

thats what i said

[gritty galleon]

yeah sorry I hit return between your messages

[raw jasper]

That's a strange name for a reset pin. Sorry, as I said, not really familiar with this MCU

[gritty galleon]

EN is the opposite thing, it just means "ENable"

[tardy badger]

There also isn’t technically a “reset” pin on the rp2040. It’s labeled “run” on the pinout

[sick apex]

i was confused

[tardy badger]

But it is functionally reset

[raw jasper]

Ah, so it's RST_N

[gritty galleon]

I wish we could put the bar over the text here like in a circuit diagram... yeah, when you disable enable it's reset 😉

[sick apex]

well it did work

until i connected rst

undefinedC:\Users\user\.platformio\packages\toolchain-riscv32-esp\bin\riscv32-esp-elf-gdb.exe: warning: Couldn't determine a path for the index cache directory.

Reading symbols from c:\Users\user\Documents\PlatformIO\Projects\ESP32-C3\.pio\build\esp32-c3-devkitm-1\firmware.elf...
PlatformIO Unified Debugger -> https://bit.ly/pio-debug
PlatformIO: debug_tool = cmsis-dap
PlatformIO: Initializing remote target...
Open On-Chip Debugger  v0.11.0-esp32-20220706 (2022-07-06-15:48)
Licensed under GNU GPL v2
For bug reports, read
    http://openocd.org/doc/doxygen/bugs.html
adapter speed: 5000 kHz

Info : tcl server disabled

error

[raw jasper]

You can probably do it with cursed unicode stuff nowadays ;)

[raw jasper]

Well, then, don't connect reset ;)

[sick apex]

now its broken again

[raw jasper]

I guess you could restart it?

[sick apex]

im gunna clean it

then run a debug build

i just replugged the rpi

[fossil dawn]

̅N̅ or ̅Ndoesn't look quite right 😦

[gritty galleon]

Or you can try JTAG over USB and not worry about the pi or any GPIO connections

[gritty galleon]

close though!

[fossil dawn]

a̅

[sick apex]

my pc fans are blazing rn

[fossil dawn]

n̅

🥳

[gritty galleon]

ū

[sick apex]

what this mean

[gritty galleon]

"Target disconnected.: Success" is peak computer message

[sick apex]

im lost

it worked

then i plugged rst in

then it broke

then i unplugged rst

[sick apex]

and now its broke again

[raw jasper]

I guess windows, the raspberry pico "JTAG Adapter" or the platformio debugging stack, or some combination of the three are unreliable

[sick apex]

possibly

[sick apex]

i think its because my PC doesn't have the drivers

[raw jasper]

I don't think you'd need drivers for that?

I wouldn't know. I do all my embedded stuff on Linux

🐧

[sick apex]

fair

[gritty galleon]

And if you did need drivers it would never have worked even before you connected reset

[sick apex]

oh yeah good point

[fossil dawn]

or windows installed the correct driver at the first connect. At the second connect it noticed its mistake and quickly fixed everything by installing the wrong drivers 😭 Happens to me all the time

[sick apex]

im gunna reduce the debug frequency

check if that works

[raw jasper]

yeah, that can help, especially with kludgy stuff like this

[fossil dawn]

... but "target disconnected" means that the driver is correct. It can communicate with the debug-probe but the debug-probe can't communicate with the device. At least that's how it is for me and picoprobe

[sick apex]

good point

same error though

[raw jasper]

perhaps you need to "reset" the esp32?

Like, plug it out and back in?

[sick apex]

done loads

[sick apex]

it does that on compile

but its worth a shot

with the reset button

or like

bootsel

i did both

[raw jasper]

......restart your computer? Running out of ideas tbh :P

[sick apex]

maybe

i'll restart vs code

first

also someone needs to make a ghidra x vs code extention

[raw jasper]

Since you already have the code, I cannot imagine why you'd need ghidra

[sick apex]

well i like ghidra

its useful

it helps me figure out how other things work

i dont mean for my stuff

but i hate loading it

its ugly asf

i'd prefer to be able to open an exe with vs code

and see the asm or c code

like that

idk

maybe im weird

[raw jasper]

language :)

[sick apex]

ugly as frick

alright im gunna watch dave garage's video cause i know he uses platformio and he has a video on jtag debugging

[sick apex]

it was the driver

i have to install winusb

to enable ftdi

jtag debugging

[raw jasper]

o.o

[sick apex]

i already have them installed from a previous project

so it must have picked them up

then gone ah no this isn't a usb device

have no driver instead

[raw jasper]

windows is strange

[sick apex]

i agree

if i could i'd use linux

but i teach unreal engine, which does not play well with linux

at all

[tranquil swallow]

I keep windows around for the edge cases

[sick apex]

and i have to use my PC and i really cba to duel boot

i just use wsl if i need linux

[tranquil swallow]

Linux is for pleasure and Mac is for everything else

[raw jasper]

makes sense :)

[raw jasper]

linux is nice. Shame the GUI is a mess

[glad ruin]

That—that just hurts my brain. Why would they do that?

[tardy badger]

Because when it’s not pulled low, it knows to run the code lol

[glad ruin]

That's still just an active low reset, unless pulling it low still preserves the system state.

[tardy badger]

Nope lol

[raw jasper]

then... it's just an active low reset...........

[glad ruin]

No, it's active high run.

[raw jasper]

https://tenor.com/view/monty-python-dead-parrot-john-cleese-michael-palin-not-dead-gif-24087365

[sick apex]

i have spent so long trying to make the pico work with jtag debugging again

and it still isn't working

it worked the first time

[burnt pine]

Where's the best place to submit product feedback and suggestions?

[glacial wigeon]

maybe it would work better if you use SWD debugging?

[sick apex]

i had it working to use a pico to debug an esp32

but now i cant

and i dont think the esp32 has SWD

[glacial wigeon]

ah

do you have a scope or logic analyzer?

[sick apex]

nope

[glacial wigeon]

a second pico?

[sick apex]

i have 2 picos

[glacial wigeon]

you can configure one pico as a logic analyzer

and then snoop on the jtag traffic, to debug that

[sick apex]

but only one has pins

[sick apex]

there is no jtag traffic

its openocd

that's being weird

[glacial wigeon]

ah

[sick apex]

it just doesn't connect

i was using dirtyjtag

and it worked

once

then i was told to connect a reset pin

i did that

[glacial wigeon]

ive always used the sysfs_gpio or rpi_gpio driver in openocd

[sick apex]

and it hasn't worked ever since

[glacial wigeon]

and just bit-banged the jtag directly from the pi

[sick apex]

even after disconnecing it

im just gunna give in and buy a mf esp prog

i swear

[glacial wigeon]

does the pico show up as a storage device, when you hold the bootsel button?

[sick apex]

yes

[glacial wigeon]

then its not cooked

[sick apex]

then i drag dirty jtag onto it

and it does its business

but what confuses me

is that windows doesn't give it a driver

i tried using zadig

[glacial wigeon]

open up device manager, and look at what device shows up, when you plug it in

[sick apex]

to install something

[sick apex]

it doesn't have a driver

[glacial wigeon]

right click, properties, tags i think it was? last tab

[sick apex]

i cant figure out which driver it wants though

events?

[glacial wigeon]

details

[sick apex]

aight

[glacial wigeon]

what other properties are there?

there should be one showing a vid/pid

[sick apex]

thse are all the options

[glacial wigeon]

hardware id's i think?

[sick apex]

what does the hardware id gotta do with anything

its the ID of the board

[glacial wigeon]

that tells you which driver is needed

[sick apex]

it has no driver

[glacial wigeon]

yep there, 1209:c0ca

[sick apex]

yes

[glacial wigeon]

https://github.com/phdussud/pico-dirtyJtag/blob/master/usb_descriptors.c#L49-L50

which is also what shows up in the source

[sick apex]

yes

what about it

[glacial wigeon]

https://github.com/phdussud/pico-dirtyJtag/blob/master/usb_descriptors.c#L99C35-L103

[sick apex]

am i supposed to install the InterBiometrics driver or something

[glacial wigeon]

no

depending on build options, it will either show up as a single vendor device
or a vendor+serial port

[sick apex]

it shows up as one device without a driver

im installing libusbK

i'll see if that works

[glacial wigeon]

https://review.openocd.org/c/openocd/+/7344/23/src/jtag/drivers/dirtyjtag.c

reading the source here, i can see it doesnt use a driver

openocd uses libusb to just talk directly to it

so, you need a copy of openocd, that was build with libusb and dirty-jtag support

[sick apex]

and where would i find one of those

[glacial wigeon]

by building the source from https://openocd.org/

[gritty galleon]

You don't need to use the pico to do jtag with the C3

You can run it directly over USB without any extra hardware. The ESP32-C3 supports JTAG over USB.

You don't have to use a pico or any other hardware.

https://docs.espressif.com/projects/esp-idf/en/latest/esp32c3/api-guides/jtag-debugging/index.html#jtag-debugging-how-it-works

[sick apex]

i have to chop up a usb cable

[gritty galleon]

The only requirement is that the C3 revision is greater than 0.3

[sick apex]

how do i know

[gritty galleon]

the bootloader messages that the C3 outputs when it boots will show the revision number. You watch them in a terminal window set to 115200bps

[sick apex]

ah

[gritty galleon]

you can't use the same USB cable as you're using with the pico?

[sick apex]

that isn't chopped up

[gritty galleon]

why do you think you need to chop up a USB cable?

[sick apex]

i chopped one up earlier

but its confusing

[sick apex]

because it said that i need to plug usb D- into pin 18

and D+ to pin 19

[glacial wigeon]

i once decapitated a usb cable, just by dropping a 12v battery on it

nice clean cut, looked like it was done with scissors, lol

[gritty galleon]

The USB port on your ESP32-C3 is almost certainly already wired that way

[glacial wigeon]

i'm lucky that wasnt my foot

[gritty galleon]

you shouldn't need to do anything but plug the USB cable into it

[sick apex]

then why the fffffffffffffffffffffffffff did it tell me to that

[sick apex]

now i am confused

[glacial wigeon]

what said you need to do that?

[sick apex]

i've been trying to debug this little mf for about 5 hours now

its 4:30 am almost

lmao

i swear why is the openocd website so mf confusing

where the is the source code

to build

[glacial wigeon]

https://openocd.org/pages/getting-openocd.html

the big button that says getting openocd

[sick apex]

its weird

why cant it just use github

like everyone else

who tf uses sourceforge

[glacial wigeon]

because they decided to use sourceforge

[gritty galleon]

Sourceforge predates github. OpenOCD has been around for a long time. GDB even longer.

[sick apex]

then why it still on version 0.10.0

or whatever it said

tbf i wasn't paying attention that might be some other thing that said that it would let me debug my controller

[sick apex]

i downloaded expressif's

and apparenly there is an error

in their cfg files

C:/Users/user/Downloads/openocd-esp32-win32-0.12.0-esp32-20230419/openocd-esp32/bin/../share/openocd/scripts/target/esp_common.cfg:4: Error:
at file "C:/Users/user/Downloads/openocd-esp32-win32-0.12.0-esp32-20230419/openocd-esp32/bin/../share/openocd/scripts/target/esp_common.cfg", line 4

[glacial wigeon]

and what is the contents of that file?

[glacial wigeon]

how did you run openocd? is the include path set to include the scripts dir?

[sick apex]

from the DIR

the rest are env vars i think

[glacial wigeon]

what CLI args did you launch it with?

openocd -s /home/pi/openocd/tcl/ -f rpi4-to-rpi1.tcl
ive ran it something like this before, so you need a -s pointing to that scripts dir

[sick apex]

exactly what it told me to

openocd -f board/esp32c3-builtin.cfg

i just deleted the catch line

that worked

other people did that too apparently

now i just got Error: esp_usb_jtag: could not find or open device!

probably because its in use atm by the serial monitor

nope

Open On-Chip Debugger v0.12.0-esp32-20230419 (2023-04-18-22:02)
Licensed under GNU GPL v2
For bug reports, read
        http://openocd.org/doc/doxygen/bugs.html
Info : only one transport option; autoselecting 'jtag'
Info : esp_usb_jtag: VID set to 0x303a and PID to 0x1001
Info : esp_usb_jtag: capabilities descriptor set to 0x2000
Info : Listening on port 6666 for tcl connections
Info : Listening on port 4444 for telnet connections
Error: esp_usb_jtag: could not find or open device!

its because you have to cut up a USB cable

i knew it

[glacial wigeon]

where does it say you need to do that?

[sick apex]

you need to use pins 18 and 19 for D+ and D-

also it wont connect normally

[glacial wigeon]

and which website was that on?

[sick apex]

it says it in the expressif docs

somewhere

nevermind

im so lost

i followed every step

exactly

and it isn't working

[timid wave]

Hey guys 👋

so this is a power meter + logger I made using Pi Pico + INA219 current sensor + SSD1306 display +SD card holder

On display, it shows Voltage, Current and Power in first three rows
On bottom row, the first section shows time since power up, the second section shows if SD card is present or not (if SD card is present , it just shows SD as shown, if SD card is not present, it shows SD), the third section shows the battery voltage, so you get a rough idea of when to charge this thing

the time since power up/reset is the time for which data is being logged to SD card. I used Pico's on board RTC for this purpose and is accurate for upto 30 days (Which is totally not necessary 😂 )

the current sensor can measure upto 26V and plus minus 3.2A

The voltage, current and power get logged to SD card along with the timestamp

I am gonna mount everything on a prototype board. Do you guys have any suggestions as to which some feature i can add or smth ??

If you guys want , ill share my code and wiring (its really simple so idk if someone actually wants that 🤷‍♂️ )

Let me know if you have any improvement suggestions 😄

[random ether]

Hello, I have a question, I am currently using Adafruit HDMI 5" Display Backpacks - Without Touch [ID:2232] and am looking for a compatible video player. Does anyone know of one? I currently have a Sprite player, but it is not compatible and does not output video to the display.

[patent hemlock]

iirc OMXPlayer is the default on the Raspberry Pi

[random ether]

Thank for your kindness. I'll try it.

[limpid sedge]

how can i mount RFM9X LoRa? it doesnt seem to have screw holes

[ebon dew]

@limpid sedge which one? the stand alone module or breakout?

the feathers have mounting holes so i'll assume you mean the breakout.

generally, the breakout is designed for breadboard use. for permanent mounting use a 3d printed enclosure or some other type of hand made enclosure.

[late fulcrum]

There are board edge clips available

[ebon dew]

if you use the sidelaunch sma then you can drill a hole through an enclosure and the antenna becomes the mounting point

if you use the ufl connector to sma then throw it in a little plastic box, drill a hole, and attach the antenna.

the breakout is really designed to a breadboard prototype for designing your own pcb, when you have the prototype working then you order just the module and add it to your PCB

if that's not your goal then it's best to get the RFM95 Feather instead.

[limpid sedge]

breakout

part number 3072/3073

[ebon dew]

Yup, then my advice was on point.

[rapid geode]

keycap 3d printed parts in the mail. yaaaay.

haha

soon i will conquer the world

[ebon dew]

one keycap at a time, sounds like a plan.

[limpid sedge]

im trying to make a prototype PCB though, so i dont really have an enclosure...

[ebon dew]

You can design your PCB with through holes, you can use the breakout to drop into a PCB as well, just need to ensure the through holes are correctly spaced.

[limpid sedge]

ah, and then can make a hole into the breakout and connect it?

[ebon dew]

yup

https://learn.adafruit.com/adafruit-rfm69hcw-and-rfm96-rfm95-rfm98-lora-packet-padio-breakouts/downloads

would be the same as stacking feathers. as long as the through hole spacing is the same you can stack them. so you'd stack the module right onto your pcb.

[limpid sedge]

good to know, and also if i want to make a final stage pcb, and end up using just the module, I need other supporting componenets right, like whatever else is on the breakout also goes on my pcb?

[ebon dew]

yes and can add whatever other peripherals you might want, that's the benefit of designing your own pcb, make it however you want.

[limpid sedge]

i mean can i just t ake the module a nd put that on the PCb and be the end of it?

or do i need resistors and capicitors and other stuff

[ebon dew]

the benefit of the feather is that it's got a lot of great features already on it including lipo battery charging, ldo, lots of GPIO, stemma, etc..

if using the module itself you would want to replicate what the breakout schematic has at the very least for powering it safely.

referencing what the rfm95 feather schematic does would be a good idea too

because the rfm95 feather uses the module not the breakout 😉

[limpid sedge]

ok

good to know thanks!

im making prototype rn so using breakouts,

ideally wanna make final one smaller cause breakouts waste space

[ebon dew]

for more help with hw design i recommend asking in the #help-with-hw-design they specialize in hw design in there. 😉

[tardy badger]

I decided to revisit my SAMD51P19A board because i couldn't get it to show up before.. fresh board and now it's programmed with a USB UF2 bootloader.

feels good. nearly a year later

[limpid sedge]

does adafruit sell antennas to use with LORA 915Mhz radio and the side mount SMA kit?

915 MHz LoRa compatible antenna basiclly does adafruit sell this?

does this work

https://www.adafruit.com/product/1858

[raw jasper]

nice! Problem is, I can't find anything in google or mouser for "SAMD52P19A".. Perhaps a typo in the part name?

[tardy badger]

yes

[raw jasper]

Alright, got a datasheet. Thanks! :)

[tardy badger]

finger hit the 2 instead of a 1

unfortunately the chip is out till at least april next year

because it's the TFBGA package

[raw jasper]

oof, you managed to solder that?

[tardy badger]

yeah 🙂

2 layers too

[raw jasper]

it still has atmel branding. Interesting

[tardy badger]

yeah

[limpid sedge]

what is a uFL antenna that works with LORA 915mhz?

[clever reef]

so is the keeboor basically a pico but in the pro micro footprint?

[sick apex]

Serial\.(print|println)\((.*?)\);``` this regex has saved my sanity when deleting my Serial.print statements

hopefully it will be useful to everyone else aswell

if you're using vscode anyways you can find and replace with regex

replace all and boom

[raw jasper]

Would you like to learn about our lord and savior, vim? :P

[sick apex]

i very much would like to pass on that

i'll stick to vscode

lmao

i tried vim

i couldn't get out of it

now i know how to

but still

i was stuck in vim for like an hour

lmfao

[raw jasper]

(you can also use vscode with vim key bindings)

It's really powerful if you get the hand of it

[sick apex]

fair

im still stuck

with that one thing

i cannot figure it out

for the life of me

[raw jasper]

Have you tried taking a break? ☕

[sick apex]

i did

but thank you

you inadvertantly gave me an idea

i have a Menu pointer which is defined in the menu class

instead of creating a new menu

what if i just

take the current menu

wait actually

im gunna need your expertise here

to tell me if this will break or not

Menu* CurrentMenu;

i have that

then say i want to create a new menu

my menu takes a pointer to a menu

so if i did this

CurrentMenu = new Menu("menuName" (bool)DisplayHeader, CurrentMenu);```

would that break

or would it pass the pointer to what current menu is currently pointing to

[hard estuary]

Yes, the Keyboar is exactly that, an rp2040 in the pro micro form factor

[sick apex]

is it possible to brick the bootloader on an esp32

first off actually, is it possible to modify the bootloader

[gritty galleon]

The first stage bootloader on an ESP32 is in ROM. It is not possible to brick it or, in general, an ESP32. It loads the second stage bootloader from flash. It's easy to damage the second stage bootloader, but if you do you can just re-flash it. What the second stage bootloader does and how you do that completely depends on the system you're working with (in CircuitPython it's a UF2 loader that makes the ESP32 appear as a flash drive to the host computer; in Arduino and ESP-IDF it's a stub that loads a bigger application from flash).

You can damage an ESP32 in a variety of mechanical and electrical ways, but not through software. You can permanently program an ESP32 to only run applications that are cryptographically signed, but you're probably more likely to spontaneously change into a cat than do that accidentally.

[raw jasper]

Does their secure boot process use trusted intermediates like UEFI secure boot, or do you enroll your own key in?

(I mean, you can also do that with UEFI, but it's kinda more involved, and I think it isn't possible in some systems?)

[gritty galleon]

You burn an RSA-3072 public key into the ESP32 using efuses. The ESP32 verifies the second stage bootloader using the key. You generate the key yourself (pretty sure Espressif provides a utility to do this for you)

The bootloader verifies the application using the key, so you're trusting the bootloader but given that you had to sign it for it to load and it's really just part of your application that should be fine.

https://docs.espressif.com/projects/esp-idf/en/latest/esp32/security/secure-boot-v2.html

I've only encountered one device in the wild that was using this - Amazon's "Smart Air Quality Monitor"... unfortunately it by default disables JTAG. Folks at my hackerspace were hoping to run their own code on it, but no such luck. I'm sure others do use it but I can't see hobbyists going anywhere near it.

(to be honest I've never calculated the odds of spontaneously turning into a cat... 😉 )

[raw jasper]

RSA-3072
That's a lot of efuses!

[gritty galleon]

yeah!

[raw jasper]

Thanks for the info. I can't see me using it any time soon, but it's nice to know

(I don't even own any esp32 :P)

[glacial wigeon]

bcm2711/rpi4 secure-boot is a bit dumber

you can create your own rsa2048 key, but that public is stored in external SPI flash
the sha256 (512 bits) of that public key is burned into fuses

the 2nd-stage loader, is then signed by a different rsa2048 key (RPF's key)

[gritty galleon]

I have a whole bucket of various ESP32s, most of my embedded controller work is with them mostly because they're so cheap and easy to get and have built-in wifi

[glacial wigeon]

so, the rom validates the 2nd-stage with a 3rd-party key

that 2nd stage then verifies the user key via a hash in fuses
the 2nd stage then verifies the next stage with the user key

[gritty galleon]

that's a lot fewer fuses though 🙂

[glacial wigeon]

yeah

from what ive seen, the biggest feature of the esp32 lineup, is the MMU before the XIP

so you can store 2 conflicting binaries in flash, and the MMU maps them to whatever addr they are compiled for

allowing you to do an A/B boot setup

[raw jasper]

Since it has an MMU, you could technically run some sort of UNIX on it.....

[gritty galleon]

it's not much of an MMU

pretty sure someone did get a really stripped down kernel running on one though

[glacial wigeon]

hey, ive ran nommu linux on a treo 650 before!

an mmu isnt required!

[raw jasper]

There is an xtensa port, isn't there?

[gritty galleon]

Minix realness 😉

[raw jasper]

ha. Minix runs everywhere

(thanks intel me!)

[gritty galleon]

https://hackaday.com/2021/07/21/its-linux-but-on-an-esp32/

[glacial wigeon]

the big negative i see, with how rpi did it

the 4 real boot keys (in the boot rom), are shared between every single bcm2711, they will never share those keys

[gritty galleon]

uhhhh someone wrote a RISC V emulator for the ESP32 and booted RISC V linux in it 🤣

[glacial wigeon]

so, if you want secure-boot, you must use the closed-source 2nd-stage binary

but by default, the rsa validation is disabled
and only hmac-sha1 validation is used

[raw jasper]

I mean, if you seek secure boot, using the closed-source binary probably is not your concern :P

[glacial wigeon]

its trivial to dump the hmac keys, and then sign your own binaries

[raw jasper]

This is so cursed 😅

Now they can try doing it natively on the new esp32! :P

[glacial wigeon]

for the current rpi4 firmware, the 2nd row (all of the .bin files) is verified with hmac-sha1 by default, but those keys are easily dumped

[gritty galleon]

The ESP32-P4 should be their highest end ESP32... dual core 400MHz RISC V, 768K of SRAM, "enhanced MMU"... maybe it'll run Linux natively and well. I'm just not sure what decade it will be released.

https://www.espressif.com/en/news/ESP32-P4

[glacial wigeon]

there is a fuse to flip on rsa2048 validation, and 4 fuses to independently revoke the 4 rsa2048 public's in the rom

the 0th key was used to sign blobs that lack secure-boot, so the official directions say to revoke that key

when an official bootcode.bin detects that rsa validation is enabled, it will then enforce the rest of the security chain
validating the user rsa2048 hash against fuses, and that you have a signed boot.img + boot.sig on your fat partition

and all future files, are loaded from boot.img (fat32, in a file, on fat32, lol)

[raw jasper]

Heh, designing silicon is hard, and so far they were using licensed tensilica IP

[glacial wigeon]

but internal files (from SPI flash), like bootmain.elf, have the expected hash baked into the bootcode.bin binary

if you modify them, the hash is invalid
and if you fix the hash, the signature becomes invalid

[raw jasper]

so, in other words, the rpi has to have some closed blobs in it for it to function

[glacial wigeon]

yep

ive been working on replacing those blobs

and i can boot linux on the pi2/pi3 without any blobs present

[raw jasper]

Well, how are you going to bypass secure boot?

[glacial wigeon]

on the pi0-pi3 range, validation isnt enabled by default

so unsigned binaries just work

on the pi4/pi400, only hmac-sha1 validation is enabled by default
its a symetric algo, the signing key is the validation key

just dump the bootrom, decompile, and theres your key

the entire family, pi0-pi400, all use the same hmac-sha1 algo

a 20 byte constant in the bootrom (unique to each model) gets xor'd with a 16 byte per-device key in fuses

however, RPF decided to use the same "per-device" key on every device in a model

so all that security has just gone out the window 😛

that serious lack of security, makes me think they wanted a checksum, not a signature

but they didnt want to re-spin the bootrom

[raw jasper]

that sounds like a quick way to get dmca'd

(at best)

[glacial wigeon]

thats why i havent posted the keys anywhere

if you want some keys, compile and run https://github.com/librerpi/lk-overlay/blob/master/app/signing-dump/signing-dump.c on your own pi4

but that only works on certain revisions of the boot rom

[gritty galleon]

Espressif uses some closed source blobs on the ESP32 line - the wifi and Bluetooth drivers are closed source, the first stage bootloader is too. Maybe some other stuff. But they also don't make a big deal about being open source (though they do a decent job with their development system)