Poll 83 - Early/Midgame QoL

[winged grove]

right but that requires doing ratcatchers 💀

[tribal kettle]

And yet you can't clip clop them together to make horse noises

[lusty jetty]

Yeah that quest blows lol

The guards alert radius are so broken

[eager ledge]

An integrated ui to help with organising clan events, allowing teams to be formed, exp gains/drops to be tracked etc. it’d make it for clans to host botw/sotw/bingo events etc and encourage player interaction which in turn makes the game more enjoyable AND would help early-mid game players feel part of a community where they can ask for tips, see what everyone else does etc

[sharp vine]

I think an updated tutorial island would be great. Few added features could make the difference to a new player. Maybe explain member skills and give them a try, so you could gain a possible new member to switch to members. Add skills like hunter,slayer, and farming.

[stable sage]

im more ok with the set taking longer to get, vs the lantern taking longer than said whole set on average

longer as in how long it currently tkes, not longer than that

[wet seal]

Menu swapping left clicks/taps for C++/Mobile would be worth porting from RL, I'd dare to call it a literal mid-game pain point compared to playing with the third party client's feature

[carmine verge]

Make Abyssal Pearls more common but drop in lower quantities.

Alternative, guarantee 1 pearl per pull and lower the amount of you get with the random pearl drop.

[limpid torrent]

Been yelling about that for many months... No need for all the extra bs just get rid of the door and after 2 points obtained be eligible for that

Next to noone is gonna neglect the start, ppl won't do 1 point and afk and it'd make the rng miles way less dogshite while keeping the grind similar in length

Lantern should just be flat out easier to get. An item made to help w a minigame being obtainable after you get everything else from the minigame is stupid

[carmine verge]

Also, make big guardian fragments not count towards the mining cap

[limpid torrent]

Amulet of the eye should also be a regular drop not from pouches at the same rate as it's from pouch

or imo after x clears guaranteed

[eager ledge]

Ok but… why?

[carmine verge]

Because the solution offered in the Minigame poll to inconsistent pearl drops solves absolutely nothing

There's a reason why it only got 76.9% yes votes

Like it's not a bad change but it misses the point

[eager ledge]

And 1 per pull solves it how?

[peak tundra]

I don’t even think it was a good change, it didn’t change the expected drop quantity at all per pull

It changed nothing at all

Hence my no vote

[carmine verge]

Maybe it should be 2 but even 1 would reduce the dry streaks you can get

[quartz quail]

I tend to get annoyed by the reward perspective of GotR. The aim of the minigame should be to provide an activity for those that like to train skills (in this case, Runecraft) via a minigame, and then after that, provide the player with unique rewards that can help generally train skills elsewhere (in this case, Runecraft).

But the way GotR works in its rewards - the Abyssal pearls aren't obtained often enough. They need to be obtained more often in order to promote both the Raiments as a unique of GotR, but also since pearls are used to repair pouches.

The Abyssal lantern only works in GotR, which is a disappointment since some of the effects could be useful outside of GotR, and it would provide a nice larger connection between Firemaking and Runecraft.

Meanwhile, GotR not only has you runecrafting runes within the minigame (which is good), but also spits out piles of runes from the Rewards Guardian (which is not good, because players prefer the uniques instead).

It feels like a very weird giant crutch for Runecraft, which takes away from the traditional Runecraft experience of runic altar running. I feel like GotR is doing too much, and that we should be trying to spread Runecraft out a bit more.

[limpid torrent]

Made a comment explaining it

[trim oxide]

is this even on topic anymore?

[trim oxide]

https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Tutor

im not sure about a new tutorial island, but i would agree with an expanded tutor list to help teach some of the skills you mentioned that can be a little confusing for a new player

maybe even have a new tier of tutors at a intermediate level to teach a littile more than just the basics to help bridge the knowledge gap?

https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Adventure_Paths

could even add the expansion onto the paths so people get hand held a little more at the start?

would help move the info they need from being a bunch of wiki text, to in game npcs teaching you

[eager ledge]

Can repair pouches with contact npc spell btw… also, gotr is optional. You’re still able to train via the traditional method if that’s what you prefer?

[eager ledge]

Ye but mathematically it changes almost nothing? I agree the lantern should be more common given it’s only used within the minigame though

[quartz quail]

Yes, I would say so to some extent. The topic is about improving the early/mid-game via QoL, and I'd argue some of the direction Runecraft has down via GotR has been a little detrimental to the skill. Some QoL to try and repair Runecraft's traditional runecraft and focusing less on GotR, I think would be beneficial.

For example: increasing the number of Abyssal pearls obtained, means the rewards are obtained more easily, meaning the rewards can be used outside of GotR earlier, which arguably improves traditional Runecraft slightly.

Having said that, I gather the idea of Poll 83 is to improve non-minigame areas. Especially since GotR was already part of a poll.

[quartz quail]

That's not the point. My point is that players will go down the path of least resistance. And right now:

• Contact NPC spell is far better than Abyssal pearls for repairing, making the idea of repairing via Abyssal pearls somewhat obsolete.
• Training via GotR is far better than traditional runecraft running, making traditional runecraft running fairly obsolete.

It would be nice to balance things out a bit more, to put things in a better place.

[carmine verge]

Training via GotR is far better than traditional runecraft running, making traditional runecraft running fairly obsolete.
I don't think this is true, it's just that GotR has some really powerful rewards.

[eager ledge]

Better in terms of?

The exp rates are about 1/4-1/3 of what is available via traditional means

More enjoyable? Sure

[quartz quail]

All of this stuff: #1270043276342464642 message

[eager ledge]

More rewarding? Sure

[modest lichen]

I dont think GoTR is considered better since Lava runes and ZMI provide more xp and stuff like blood provide more GP/hr

[eager ledge]

But i don’t think we can say it’s better cause there’s comparisons where it comes off worse

[carmine verge]

Also not everyone enjoys GotR

Despite reddit memes there's people that do like traditional Runecrafting

[modest lichen]

This might be going outside of the scope of just a qol update into a bit more of a rework territory though... But I think your suggestion should still be considered

[carmine verge]

Though I agree that Runecraft should be better for obtaining runes especially the lower ones

[quartz quail]

I'll clarify my opinion.

In the case of traditional Lava running, sure, that's definitely better than GotR in terms of XP. And I don't think there's anything wrong with it.

In the case of high level runes like Blood running, they might also be in a good space over GotR.

But for the other altars, I'd like their traditional running buffed in some way, such that GotR doesn't overtake it easily.

[quartz quail]

I'd say that's sort of the same thing. Or at least the perspective I'm going for - that GotR is too powerful.

[quartz quail]

I do agree with this though - probably too large for a QoL poll.

[trim oxide]

yeah i strongly disagree with this.
the needle is the only reward within GOTR that impacts your xp rates in different places. This is not a factor until 85 runecradting so its irrelevant to early/mid game.

the outfit is there to boost GP/hr , but doesnt actually impact your available methods or how effective they are to train. all the other rewards are cosmetic in nature & self contained to the mini game.

changing the pearl rates & easier rewards will do almost nothing to the actuall runecraft training progression. GOTR will still remain slower & less profitable than ZMI and other methods & have a crowd that finds its gameplay loop more enjoyable

anyone who feels forced to go there for some kind of xp progression is just misinformed

[azure vale]

GotR is not too powerful. pre-77 RCing sucks.

[eager ledge]

They’re updating it so the needle works at all levels btw

[trim oxide]

tldr: nothing forces you to go there in terms of progression until you hit 85. which is not early/mid

[trim oxide]

its a game jam proposal, nothing set in stone

[eager ledge]

But honestly i think rc is in a very sweet spot right now

[trim oxide]

or was that in the prior QOL poll?

[eager ledge]

I’m pretty sure it was just polled and passed unless i’m misremembering?

Let me check

[quartz quail]

That's an argument for GotR being too powerful. Because pre-77 Runecraft sucks, it means that you head towards GotR because you believe other methods suck. Which means it's too powerful compared to other methods.

[trim oxide]

blogs mushing together in my head so i could be wrong 😅

[trim oxide]

it sucks in terms of fun/enjoyable

in terms of xp/hr and leveling up to a goal, almost everything is faster

[azure vale]

[trim oxide]

if your argument is that GOTR is too fun compared to other methods, then yeah

[limpid torrent]

It does quite a lot actually... The matter isn't to make the grind shorter but to incentivise contribution and game completions which are an issue as jagex stated
Most of all it would kill immense dry streaks which is what people have been advocating about due to the ridiculous amount of pearls needed adding too much variation to it all

• It'd arguably make NPC contact less of a necessity which isn't bad considering you don't even make astral runes within the minigame

[eager ledge]

Ye just passed, poll #82

Should we change the Colossal Pouch so that its capacity changes based on the pouches you can currently use? Values for capacity at the various Runecraft level milestones are described in full in the blog.
Yes
86.4% (47,0

[limpid torrent]

Problem with gotr is that you are absolutely forced to do it if lvling RC this gutting the skill it's meant to help

The fact that changing the lobby door to not be dogshit needs to be polled is stupid af as is tbh but yeah... We getting borderline out of topic here lol

[azure vale]

GotR is more bareable because it's less brain dead and until 77 there are no non-active options.

[trim oxide]

yeah thats fair. so now it becomes a progression item that you want 300 points to unlock give or take

[eager ledge]

You’re not forced to do it?

[azure vale]

Heapped on top of the skill being slow as icecile growth and very non-profitable/negative profit pre77 outside GotR.

[modest lichen]

the outfit doesnt give xp so I wouldnt exactly call it forced

It does help out a lot with diaries though

[azure vale]

It's 60% increase in GP though.

[eager ledge]

The outfit doesn’t give exp, the pouch allows for an extra 3 ess per trip which isn’t going to offset the time taken to get needle etc

[trim oxide]

so needle i can see the QOL argument for in making it align/reasonable for people at a lower RC level since its no longer a lvl 85 item.

everything else about GOTR was just a personal dislike rather than actual issues impacting early game players

[eager ledge]

It’s certainly far from forced

[azure vale]

Also it only really helps with one diary it takes so long to get.

[carmine verge]

Also Pouch is irrelevant at Arceuus RC right?

[eager ledge]

True

So realistically, the most efficient rc method is still lavas, then bloods/souls or some shit

[modest lichen]

Well for the majority of the time you arent making any GP and its only for a couple of runes you'd make any sort of decent money. If we're talking about GP you'd make more from plenty of other activities. It still doesnt make the outfit forced.

[eager ledge]

Which certainly doesn’t force you into gotr

Gotr is a nice viable alternative if you want to sacrifice exp for some nice to have rewards

[modest lichen]

I think there's several craft X amount of Y rune tasks for diaries though

[azure vale]

Fair, it's very important if you want to make good money the last 22 levels. But it's not forced.

[limpid torrent]

You absolutely are... Unless you want to do any long term runecrafting without the outfit and abyssal pouch which would be trolling

[eager ledge]

Why would it be trolling?

[limpid torrent]

You might as well shoot yourself in the foot and go for a sprint pb

[modest lichen]

Yeah and by that point you should have got the outfit already from gotr so I dont think any change in pearls would be necessary

[limpid torrent]

Would you stay with a bronze axe if dragon axe was behind a quest

[azure vale]

Yes but only one is high enough level that the outfit is reasonable expectation while also using runes the outfit can affect enough.

[eager ledge]

That affects exp rates, outfit does not. Moot point.

[limpid torrent]

And again... Colossal pouch

[eager ledge]

Colossal pouch gives you 3 extra ess per trip, it doesn’t offset the time taken to get needle

And isn’t used at blood or soul rcing

Again, moot point

[limpid torrent]

proper blood it is tho

And that is again more xp and you gotta account for the clicking too etc

Which adds up

[eager ledge]

Who tf runs traditional blood runes?

[limpid torrent]

If we talking XP who tf runs any blood runes

But if it's about money then again you're trolling cuz no outfit

Full circle

[eager ledge]

You right, fastest exp is still lava runes 23-99

Which pouch is minimal for

And outfit is useless

[limpid torrent]

Which also benefit greatly from pouch

[eager ledge]

Cause lavas worth like 1gp

[eager ledge]

It’s 3 inv slots per trip.

[azure vale]

I guess this is an issue that I missed what you were replying to originally sorry . But ya donig mostly GotR I think I am going to get the outfit about level 75.

[eager ledge]

It means every 15 trips you do you have to do 1 more, at approximately 20s per trip

[limpid torrent]

It's 15k xp/h more

Lil more if optimal

[eager ledge]

Not a chance

Nowhere close

Let me calc it quickly

[carmine verge]

Did this get started because of the more consistent pearls suggestion.

[quartz quail]

I think so

[lusty jetty]

This might make the biggest impact of anything. The only reason my account is where it is today is because I found a cool clan pretty early on and made a lot of friends

[quartz quail]

everything else about GOTR was just a personal dislike rather than actual issues impacting early game players
An early game player is much more likely to do GotR over traditional runecraft running. That's why I'm complaining about the relationship between the two - since I think it does impact early game players.

Maybe that's out of scope for Poll 83, but it would have been nice to see GotR be in a better position w.r.t. Abyssal pearls and its uniques. As of right now, I don't really think it's in a good position.

[eager ledge]

Okay so 72k exp/h crafting lavas translates to 6,857 lavas crafted per hour. 6,857 / 64 ess per trip = 107 trips per hour. 3 less ess per trip * 107 trips/h = 321 less ess per hour. 6,857 - 321 = 6,536 lavas per hour. 6,536 * 10.5 exp each = 68.6k exp/h. So there’s a 3.4k exp/h difference in having pouch.

Pouch is certainly not mandatory

Nor is outfit

Nor is lantern because, as we’ve identified, it’s useless outside the minigame

[eager ledge]

I agree. Plus friendships help with player retention, win win

[eager ledge]

Personally, i disagree. It’s far more chill to level rc at gotr and the rewards are nice but balanced. I think gotr and rc in general is in a great place right now. Lots of variety and training methods available offering different exp rates and rewards

Not to mention daeyalt which gives 50% more exp and zmi and arceus rcing etv

[azure vale]

Massive pouch is only 1 essance better (accounting for inventory) until 85.

[eager ledge]

@limpid torrent

Thats based on normal ess

So 5k difference if daeyalt

[azure vale]

It has nuiance and some challange it deserves to have better rewards than basic low level essance running.

[quartz quail]

Ok, let me come at this from a different direction, because maybe I've missed something.

Suppose you're 44 Runecraft. How does doing GotR compare to crafting Nature runes at the Nature altar via traditional runecraft running?

[azure vale]

More xp less gp harder needing more attention

[eager ledge]

Couldn’t say, I’ve never crafted nats the traditional way pre 91. Also, when you say traditional are we talking abyss? Or unnoting at karamja gen store?

[quartz quail]

I don't have a problem with GotR providing unique rewards - I have a problem with the rewards taking a long time (at least in my view) whilst simultaneously providing a lot of runes (specifically via the Reward Guardian).

[eager ledge]

But either way, gotr rewards are far from mandatory for it

[eager ledge]

But why? You’re rune crafting? It should produce runes? And a rare chance at a nice to have item is better than 0 chance via traditional means

Unless you purely want exp, in whcih case you do traditional and sacrifice chance at a nice to have item

[azure vale]

Everything has filler rewards. And RCing's filler reward have damn well better be runes.

[eager ledge]

Snd only get runes

^

Should bandos just drop his armour every kill? Or should you get random pvm drops to fill it in?

[quartz quail]

I don't have a problem with runecrafting the runes during the minigame. I dislike that you get a lot of runes via the Rewards Guardian. Especially compared to the lower rate of getting uniques from the Rewards Guardian.

[eager ledge]

Or a pity piece of bandos each kill that you can smelt into a chestplate once you got 100 kills?

[lusty jetty]

Exactly, so if they create more interfaces to help with grouping and clan events etc, it’ll make the process of meeting and connecting with people much easier

[azure vale]

Woulf you rather have hundreds of cabbages?!?!?

[quartz quail]

Sure, but personally I think the rates could be changed to provide fewer runes from the Rewards Guardian and more uniques from the Rewards Guardian (at the very least, Abyssal pearls).

[quartz quail]

No - I want more focus on the uniques.

[azure vale]

That is not happening.

[eager ledge]

I see, do you feel the same way about pvm bosses that people have gone 6000 dry on?

[lusty jetty]

The runes are an Ironman thing

[azure vale]

They want a balance of filler.

[eager ledge]

Should we compartmentalise their drops and give a small guaranteed part of their unique every kill?

everytime you kill nex you get 1 torva piece, 200 pieces you can craft a chestplate?

[quartz quail]

Right, but at least to me, the balance between filler vs Abyssal pearls is at least off.

[eager ledge]

You get on average 2.14 pearls per search. That seems pretty decent to me

With binding necks and magic imbue you can get 16-17 rolls per game

[azure vale]

It's a slow outfit sure. But it's one you get while getting a tone of other stuff.

[eager ledge]

Exactly. I’d rather get eye set 100 times over than get angler 100 times

[quartz quail]

I'm not really concerned about PvM when comparing to GotR. Or any minigame really.

I'd compare GotR to other minigames, or at most skilling bosses like Tempoross.

[eager ledge]

Its the principle, if you wouldn’t want pity drops on pvm, why would you want them on a skilling minigame?

[quartz quail]

At least when I go to the Rewards Guardian, I'm very likely to get runes and talismans, when I would much prefer Abyssal pearls.

Especially since, during the minigame itself, I'm already getting runes.

[azure vale]

Not possible. 12/13.2 energy is max per game. That number is close to 3 times that.

[exotic mango]

GOTR actually kinda breaks the standard formula because it's all untradeables that rely on RNG. there's very few instances of that in-game. most minigame rewards don't rely on RNG at all

[eager ledge]

When i go to nex im more likely to get bones when i would much prefer torva… whats your point?

[azure vale]

But you can get 4/5 pulls per game soloing without combo runes.

[eager ledge]

Angler, prospector, graceful

I can’t think of one skilling outfit that isn’t rng tbh?

[limpid torrent]

The rng is beyond ridiculous of that amount of time needed on the grind

[exotic mango]

I was more talking about the needle and lantern, I don't really see issue with the pearls tbh

[eager ledge]

But the items provide very little benefit and are completely optional to grind for

[azure vale]

Prospector and graceful are more reliable in thier RNG than pearls. But ya similar.

[eager ledge]

3k exp/h when crafting lavas

Lantern only used inside gotr

Skilling outfit doesn’t affect exp

[azure vale]

Farmer 🙃

[eager ledge]

It’s literally entirely skippable

[eager ledge]

True, good spot

[quartz quail]

@eager ledge Skilling and PvM should function differently. The traditional concept is that skilling should be slow profit but consistent, wheareas PvM should be inconsistent but can be rewarding due to RNG uniques.

When it comes to GotR, all I'm saying is that the rate of getting Abyssal pearls feels too low. I'm not saying there shouldn't be filler items.

[eager ledge]

I do think lantern should be more common seeing as it’s only used within the minigame and by the time you get it on average you’ve completed the minigame

Needle is fine though, the benefit is marginal it just saves a few clicks per banking session

[azure vale]

That isn't pvm that is specifically bossing.

[trim oxide]

you;re lucky tempoross and wintertodt are called bosses for some reason 😒

[eager ledge]

Pearls and needle shouldn’t get touched, lantern could be sped up

[quartz quail]

Personally I think bossing and PvM are the same - it's the concept of combat.

Not sure how relevant that is to GotR anymore though.

[azure vale]

No they are miles apart. Bossing has high risk both in danger and the fishing for the rare loot. Non-boss style pvm is much more relaxed and reliable.

[quartz quail]

Sure - but I think they have the same methodology when it comes to loot.

I don't think non-bossing PvM is like skilling.

[azure vale]

Basic pvm you can literally go kill that and then tab out and wait for runelite to tell you the thing is dead.

[azure vale]

It's actually a lot like mining

[limpid torrent]

Why would you calc off xp per hour first and not trips? And I'm honestly confused about the just 3 ess diff you speak of ngl

[eager ledge]

Primarily because i haven’t memorised how many trips/h you can do at lava

I have tracked exp rates though

So i can divide that exp rate by exp per action

And boom, trips/h

Quik maffs

[limpid torrent]

72k sounds slightly low
But my concern is that 3 ess less

[eager ledge]

That was normal ess not daeyalt, but why 3 ess is confusing?

[limpid torrent]

Am I high or isn't colossal 10 more ess +3 off inv space

Could be high

[eager ledge]

Colossal is the sum of the 4 other pouches

[limpid torrent]

Not rlly?

[quartz quail]

How so?

At high levels, for mining you still want the ore. You always get the ore.

But even for non-boss PvM, you don't necessarily want the bones. You may be wanting the variety of items (such as herbs, gp, etc.) but also any rarer items.

[eager ledge]

So if you take colossal, you don’t have to take 4 pouches

So you save 3 slots

[limpid torrent]

30 over 40 unless I'm missing smthing

[eager ledge]

Interesting, you rigjt

Right*

[azure vale]

You might not want all the stuff but you will want a reliable enough selection of it that you will make a solid profit. It's kind of like mlm in it's output and like normal mining in how you do it.

[eager ledge]

Bit of an oversight on my part

[limpid torrent]

That's why I'm so confused by it lol

13 ess is... A lot

[eager ledge]

Ye certainly bigger difference when 13 not 3

Hmm

[limpid torrent]

even just not having to work w multiple pouches makes a diff tbh

That's why it's so vital

[azure vale]

https://tenor.com/view/love-you-universe-just-a-little-gif-15905172

[limpid torrent]

Should have been Fortnite

[eager ledge]

Ye i certainty understand your perspective more now

[limpid torrent]

Anyway we getting vastly off topic lol

But smthing to kill the severe inconsistency is neccesary

Tis all

[quartz quail]

I agree with that. But personally, that's what leads me to say non-boss PvM and mining are not the same. Since traditional mining would not be the same, and it's only really specific stuff like MLM that's comparable.

[azure vale]

to general with this convo

[quartz quail]

Fair enough

[vivid onyx]

You could teleport to Ardougne, take the boat to Rimmington, then take the boat to Brimhaven. Then run to the charter ship to Port Sarim.

[azure vale]

or draynor village glory teleport...

[crystal summit]

Again. Keep poh in remmy

[boreal plume]

This has gone way off topic lol

Fs to the jmod

[trim oxide]

yhup

bound to happen though

just takes 1 off tangent point

[boreal plume]

It would be mid game qol for my chambers locked Ironman to get run energy from overloads like salt :p

[trim oxide]

seems we need to have threads within a thread so that we can minimise the off topic conversation

[boreal plume]

I feel early and mid game is really good, the only qol you can give it is make leveling faster on certain skills

Currently if you start a new iron the worst thing you will face is teleports and early transportation

And walking everywhere

Reduce the time you can use home an mini game teleports could be decent qol early game

Why it’s 30 mins is beyond me

In terms of gear progress they nailed early and mid game with all the updates last year and this year

[low hinge]

Brewing beer. The times are way too long and the chance to make bad beer is incredibly high. In addition, there are only two locations. Please consider adding more brewing stations to: Valadmore/Kourend, Mos Le'Harmless, Brimhaven/Karamja, and other locations.
Why? I enjoy passive cooking exp and I think it make sense location wise on where these guys make their beer at. So much beer but yet, no production. Hmmmm.

[vivid onyx]

I wouldn't mind seeing it as a pseudo-tree run for Cooking.

Also think Cooking Guild and Relleka would also be prime locations. As for Varlamore/Kourend, it has to be at Lovekenj and Cam Torum. No other spot would be acceptable

[still herald]

From the perspective of tutorial island, I can see (in terms of getting information out to the player) setting expectations for each skill and the reasoning for how and why they are positioned as such in terms of XP could be beneficial.

Thiis means grouping skills based on how they impact the character/world around them to not narrow in on how long a skill should take, but to give a rough idea of how these things work.

An example is comparing something akin from mining to woodcutting, where they both represent gathering type skills whilst (for all intents and purposes) mining resources were designed to be more profitable than most woodcutting resources, meaning the xp to get to much higher and higher profitable ores is less to compensate for the reward (high mining blast mining for instance is relatively a profitable activity for instance).

This can also contrast between a skill such as agility and smithing, where the processing of smithing materials is relatively expensive (to what it takes to do agility and various other skills) and either doesn't always assume profit in most circumstances (gold being high xp but is done exclusively at a loss as an example) and in small amounts near the end of the skill.
Contrasted with agility to which the skill is relatively self contained, while it doesn't produce anything significant in terms of gp value with sepulcher and the wilderness course, the skill is self contained with no necessary input cost and pure xp output as a resultant.

This is a lot but to sum this up, showing that each skill in terms of usefulness, how it's trained, and input to output ratios early on can give players a grasp on why things are positioned the way they are.

[real carbon]

Fix Barabarian Assault recruitment system, it’s so old rn

Improve the gambling points at barbarian assault too, I think that’s one of the ways the minigame will be more playable

Allow players to which their role(s) to healer when they reach wave 10

[boreal plume]

Ba is not even a mid or early game activity

[peak tundra]

?

[[Fighter torso]]

[warm notch]

Wiki links found:
https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Fighter_torso

[peak tundra]

[[Granite body]]

[warm notch]

Wiki links found:
https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Granite_body

[peak tundra]

Oh that’s so weird

[quartz quail]

Is it an end-game activity then?

[peak tundra]

Pet hunting and boosting will be an end-game activity no matter where you go xd

[quartz quail]

Sure, pet hunting will be.
But I presume the suggestion of BA is for the Fighter torso, and by extension the Penance gear.

[real carbon]

BA needs to have some fixes anyway

And the rewards for high gamble points

I remember how popular it was back in the day just full of people

[boreal plume]

Gear progress for mid game is very good why waste time on torso when you can get blood moon

[quartz quail]

At least for me, I don't think the progress is that good, since I think there's gaps.

[real carbon]

You play BA? It’s fun but gets irritating when people randomly leave while you’re halfway through the minigame

[quartz quail]

Not really since I find BA annoying personally.

I think it's out of scope for a QoL poll to add more to the progression within the game. But I do find that after Rune gear, the next transition isn't obvious.

[boreal plume]

There are no gaps in gear progress early/mid they all been filled.

[quartz quail]

What's the next gear after Rune for progression?

[boreal plume]

Bloodmoon

[quartz quail]

That's a large Strength gap

[boreal plume]

?

Bloodmoon is same as bandos

[quartz quail]

Bandos is 65 Defence
Blood moon is 75 Strength and 50 Defence

[peak tundra]

Why skip torso when it takes an hour and doesn’t have any upkeep cost

[boreal plume]

Torso does not take 1 hour you are high

Unless you pay for it

[peak tundra]

It does if you have a competent team

I actually enjoy BA

1hr a bit of an underestimate unless actually speed running but like 2 hours tops

[boreal plume]

Void then

[peak tundra]

Void is pretty useless

Outside of chinning and ranging in tob

[boreal plume]

I didn’t k ow Bloodmoon had 75 str requirement but 75 stats is mid game anyways

Void early game is insane stop being end game minded

[peak tundra]

Bro literally torso and bgloves beats void

And a nezzy

[boreal plume]

It doesn’t

[peak tundra]

D’hide beats void on anything with any level of defense until you get like 85+ ranged

[boreal plume]

Gear progress for mid and early game is very good state right now

[peak tundra]

The main issue with void is that you also kill extremely little without wearing a slayer helm until later game when your gear outclasses void by a lot

[quartz quail]

75 can be mid-game, but I think it's at the upper end.

I think part of the poll idea would be to make the transition smoother, if focus is on both early and mid.

[boreal plume]

Also mixed hide is also really good

And it has 2 str

[languid panther]

i feel the worse books from horror of the deep could be improved in general, it would be nice if book of war was a nicer option pre defenders, law, darkness and unholy are good though

[stable sage]

what if a reward was the ability to make contact npc tabs?

i didnt realize people talked so much in the past 5 hours

one idea i had was for gotr to supply something to help xp/gp rates crafting runes traditionally, in place of the normal runes

kinda like how camdozaal golems have chaos cores, or how nex and other stuff with blood essence

there could be stackable stuffs that get consumed when making specific rune types that grants bonus xp/runes, stacks with daeyalt

[quartz quail]

Personally I was imagining:

• Outside of GotR, players use NPC Contact rather than Abyssal pearls
• Inside of GotR, players use Abyssal pealrs rather than NPC Contact

But, I wouldn't mind if NPC Contact tabs were a new thing. Though I don't know how useful that would be in tablet form.

Maybe I'm wrong, but to me, the Abyssal pearls feel so valuable, that I'd prefer to cast NPC Contact to repair a pouch rather than sacrifice an Abyssal pearl.

[peak tundra]

The pearl repair is 500% targeted at people that can't use NPC contact and you'd be a fool to sacrifice the main thing you're there for to use pearls to repair

[quartz quail]

The Raiments help out gp wise for traditional runecrafting. I was just hoping that we could get a higher rate of Abyssal pearls, so that the Raiments could be obtained earlier, so that it might encourage players to do traditional runecrafting more at earlier levels.

It would be interesting if there were more ways to help out traditional runecrafting, especially non-GotR ways.

The Camdozaal cores seem interesting, but they're sadly too slow to obtain.

[limpid torrent]

Idk what the topic is but more like over 90

[peak tundra]

This was where the discussion started, not much more to it

[limpid torrent]

Yeah void after rune is beyond wild

[eager ledge]

Maybe because torso takes 50 minutes and can be done much earlier than blood moon (on an iron) plus pet, clogs, level 5 roles for diary, etc

[eager ledge]

Void early game is next to useless these days.

[boreal plume]

who is doing torso in 50 mins that isnt paying for it???

[eager ledge]

People who know how to play ba

I used to sell leaches back in the day, got the pet, etc… it’s very easy to ba once you know how it works

[boreal plume]

and new players know how to effeciently play ba?

[eager ledge]

New players no, maybe hour and half

[boreal plume]

l0l. if you can get a pug torso in less than 1 hour i will give you 100m.

i mean picking up anyone randomly in the offical BA world

[eager ledge]

Bet, when im going for torso on my hc ill use 306 and time it

The main issue tbh is defenders

The other roles are mostly braindead

But regardless, even if it took 2 hours, you can access a torso much earlier in the game than you can do pm

You can’t do pm till you have some decent tank

[winged grove]

really minor but I would like to be able to combine half-pie slices

[limpid harness]

Just like they do at the local Denny's

[low hinge]

Runecrafting skill guide doesn't tell new players how to unlock/use the skill. Herblore does this.

[stable sage]

when i say the new drop helps with more gp, what i really mean is that in the end youll get the same number of runes as before, extra, but now you have to craft them yourself, at a faster rate

itd be sorta like getting brimhaven agility tickets, but for rc, that get consumed during normal rcing

[trim oxide]

Finally , some QOL

[low hinge]

Not a quick and easy but over-time, benefitical. An NPC where you can type what you are looking for and they provide you with "rumor" source locations. For example: Lamp Oil. The NPC could be like, "I heard of a chemist West of Port Sarim might be able to help".
This is helpful for players who have limited usage to the wiki, who heard of an item in passing (through players or through quests), and for fun easter eggs.

[smoky vine]

From my friends:

1. tutorial doesn't set people up for the early game. "it's too much to get into, idk what i'm supposed to do"

2. Wiki/youtube research reliance was discouraging

3. Minigame/clan tab was a bit confusing to them

4. They liked Mining for a bit, quickly got bored of it, they hated RC. They didn't like elements of the game that were too monotonous and slow. They liked combat because it was more diverse & cooking cuz the XP/hr "felt nice".

5. Being low levels they couldnt do much with me,
   everyone progressed/leveled up at different paces it created more of a disparity in what we can do together discouraging us from playing together where they just stopped logging in. Finishing a quest meant the other had to do it alone, leveling up meant the other fished somewhere else, etc

[tribal hornet]

DT2s supercomputer golem was interesting in this way. It would be nice to have the Lumbridge Guide or somebody actually be able to help you in some way, like 'Use' an item on him and he'd tell you something about it or some sort of progression related to it. Like if you're a new player and you use an herb on him he'll tell you to go see the druids in Taverley to learn about herblore. This is a perhaps somewhat niche fix to an unguided account or something, but it'd also help prevent the trolling/luring of new players having to ask randoms at the GE or Lumby goblins.

[velvet shadow]

I think the idea of making a miniquest for an intro to farming is a great idea!

But as people have suggested, you could take it a step further: Slayer has A Porcine of Interest, and Construction has Daddy's Home, but that still leaves a lot of member's skills unaccounted for and unmentioned off Tutorial Island. Thieving is probably intuitive enough, and Fletching may not need a whole miniquest to tell you to use a knife on a log, but Farming, Hunter, and Agility are all more complex.

Some kind of Agility microquest in the now-level 1 rooftop course Draynor (or even off in the Gnome Stronghold for nostalgia) might help serve to explain what the skill is for and how it works, Farming could come with a closer, low-level (ala the bronze anvil) allotment patch near one of the farms in Lumbridge and/or a quick tutorial with some early seed rewards, and Hunter could easily have some new, early-level creatures populate somewhere like the area behind Lumbridge Castle or the swamp (as suggested by glsm.)

[vivid onyx]

Hilariously, the candle seller outside the Lumbridge Swamp Cave out of all people does say that.

Player: How do you make lanterns?
Candle seller: Out of glass. The more advanced lanterns have a metal component as well.
Candle seller: Firstly you can make a simple candle lantern out of glass. It's just like a candle, but the flame isn't exposed, so it's safer.
Candle seller: Then you can make an oil lamp, which is brighter but has an exposed flame. But if you make an iron frame for it you can turn it into an oil lantern.
Candle seller: Finally there's the bullseye lantern. You'll need to make a frame out of steel and add a glass lens.
Candle seller: Once you've made your lamp or lantern, you'll need to make lamp oil for it. The chemist near Rimmington has a machine for that.
Candle seller: For any light source, you'll need a tinderbox to light it. Keep your tinderbox handy in case it goes out!
Candle seller: But if all that's too complicated, you can buy a candle right here for 1000 gold!

The tool leprechaun noting items is also kind of a notorious one too. It is actually in the dialogue, but it is in an inconspicuous section.

Verbatim from the Wiki

Player: What can you store?
Tool Leprechaun: We'll hold onto yer rake, yer seed dibber, yer spade, yer secateurs, yer waterin' can and yer trowel - but mind it's not one of them fancy trowels only archaeologists use!
Tool Leprechaun: We'll take a few buckets off yer hands too, and even yer compost, supercompost an' ultracompost! Also plant cure vials.
Tool Leprechaun: Aside from that, if ye hands me yer farming produce, I can mebbe change it into banknotes for ye.
Tool Leprechaun: So... do ye want to be using the store?```

[frail karma]

Would honestly help to make the wise old man bank cleaning service useful

Lots of people hold on to so much shit they don't need that he doesn't get rid of

[vivid onyx]

A simple change to his dialogue from this:
"Ah, 'tis a foine day to be sure! Were yez wantin' me to store yer tools, or maybe ye might be wantin' yer stuff back from me?"

To something like:
"Ah, 'tis a foine day to be sure! Were yez wantin' to access yer tools storage, or yez need yer farming harvest turned to banknotes?

Its like you ask him about the details of his services. He gives the details and then suddenly mentions he provides this additional service for you. And then ask if you want to have the first service.

[stable sage]

im probably terrible for that

i know i have about a million useless seeds

[flint juniper]

If butler could take my clue items out of my bank and into my house that'd be awesome

[opaque fossil]

i really like this idea

[umbral nacelle]

Make molch pearls not cbt pls

[winged grove]

I don't know if pearls are able to provide cognitive behavioral therapy 🤔