game-update

[true talon]

Big shame to, because DMM is some very fun content an some of the best money in the game.

[tacit wharf]

only thing that changed was, they changed bmr with leagues release

[true talon]

This was the most casual DMM ever an it was great

[meager flame]

yeah but you can't even argue in the defense on this

[ashen yarrow]

So incendiary cannonballs burn target for 120% of your cannonballs damage as extra damage in 6 hits after, first burn instantly on hit and 5 over the next 15 ticks i think

[meager flame]

they have video footage talking themselves about how thats bad and that they shouldn't do it

like lol

even jagex doesn't think this is good

[ashen yarrow]

i changed my mind, rubium splinters will have high value even after the changes

[true talon]

Id rather leagues 6 be pushed before BMR to give BMR more time than rush it

[ashen yarrow]

these burning cannon balls out dps shadow and are stronger than dragon cannonballs

[true talon]

Dunno why the special effects cant be applied to dragon cannon balls?

[meager flame]

yeah everyone would rather have literally anything instead of nothing but it doesn't really change that they messed up the content pipeline

[analog crow]

Yeah I want them to take their time with big releases

[true talon]

sometimes things are over promised and then when you get into the weeds its like ohhhhh this might take longer

[meager flame]

they actually streamed themselves talking about doing this exact thing in 2021

and how they don't want to do this and shouldn't in the future

its actually crazy how similar the situations are lol

[true talon]

If you work for a company what someone says an what is possible is two different things trust me lol

[tacit wharf]

back in my day, we didnt know what the year was going to hold for content

[meager flame]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZawSRhibvNs&t=3378s

its this

they basically fully explain what happened then for the most part and its like

so similar that you can probably just assume the same thing happened again

[analog crow]

they should have let nex cook for another 10 years

[meager flame]

tbf we probably shouldn't compare to those days

because thats the version of jagex that did smaller updates but actually produced an insane amount of them all the time

[tacit wharf]

im just saying, sometimes we (community) act like we aint spoiled brats about knowing what content is to come, when we could just have radio silent

[meager flame]

i dont really think we're spoiled like that its a good thing jagex doesn't look at it that way because

we're only here because they ruined the game once already

and we have all of this interaction because they couldn't do their job

and its how they won people back

so for them its like

necessary for doing business

they were forced into all of this

[sacred oracle]

I miss getting small pieces of content on a regular basis

People say that you shouldn't care as long as you still have old content you can do

But 1) not everyone wants to do every piece of content, so maybe you've finished all or most of what you want to do already; and 2) new content is fun because it's a communal experience that everyone gets to participate in at once

[true talon]

Well you got uhh.

1. people want no power creep.
2. people want no improved xp rates.
3. people want bosses to be 50m/h without uniques
4. people want nothing to cater to irons.
5. people want nothing to make your life better in shape or form.

All these factors make making content next to possible

[sacred oracle]

Well, that's an exaggeration and doesn't really contribute anything

Except for 4

[analog crow]

It will be funny to see the reaction to raids 4 rewards

[sacred oracle]

I do not want anything to cater to irons. That's accurate.

[ashen yarrow]

incendiary cannonballs cannonballs burn for +120% damage dealt over 15 seconds (5ticks per hit splat). However the burns do not stack and only highest damage dealt burn deals damage to enemy

[true talon]

other than scar ess i dont consider any content catering to irons

[sacred oracle]

Wow

[true talon]

I judge iron catering as an update which is only used by irons and strictly for irons. scar ess fills that but it also has several times been one of the best runecrafting money makers.

Just because it benefits irons, does not mean its iron catering

[minor whale]

If its main point is to soothe iron pain points it's catering to irons

[meager flame]

tbh i dont really think iron catering updates are bad like

gotta improve the game

[true talon]

wrong

[minor whale]

Ok

[meager flame]

if something sucks for irons but not mains it probably should have an iron only update somehow

[minor whale]

Lovely discussion with Tass as always

[meager flame]

otherwise you're just fucking around with other people's experiences

[tacit wharf]

problem is iron pain points, tend to be game pain points, as well

[true talon]

This

[meager flame]

even better

[minor whale]

Mains don't have issues with all these iron pain points
They have issues because they can't trade to interact with the game like everyone else can

[meager flame]

then you're just making the game better for everyone by addressing it

[ashen yarrow]

i would say extracts are mainly for ironman. mains can use them for some things but most runes can jsut be bought at ge for same or cheaper price

[meager flame]

ya it is

[final valve]

the sad truth that trade accounts dont wanna accept is that by fleshing out the game for ironman you flesh out the game for all players

[meager flame]

its because runecrafting as a skill is tragically ass and doesn't actually support people using runes

its been the fundamental problem with rc since the start

[true talon]

the blowpipes was fucking cool on my baby pure to train range

at low lvls

[final valve]

[meager flame]

and since you dont make enough runes

[final valve]

I still use it to tura skip on my UIM it's nice af

[meager flame]

its awful to make your own runes for real

thus shops with rune packs and so on

[true talon]

yes thats why bosses drop so many lmao

[sacred oracle]

I think if something sucks for irons but not for mains, that's normal, because the normal main game is different than the special challenge mode and is explicitly balanced around the ability to trade

[analog crow]

I kinda like gotr but maybe I'm unhinged

[sacred oracle]

Sometimes main updates are also good iron updates

[narrow folio]

Depends how much it sucks

[sacred oracle]

A lot of times, the challenge mode makes normal updates harder for irons

And that's fine

[meager flame]

yeah but a lot of people get hung up there not realizing that the game isn't good as is in any mode

[narrow folio]

Making irons able to pick up cox pots from bosses was a catering update

[tacit wharf]

gotr was most of my 1-90 rc grind, it isnt as bad as most make it out to be

[meager flame]

they have to keep improving and adding things

like

[narrow folio]

Should that have not passed then

[meager flame]

if we said irons were a challenge mode and we shouldn't change anything for the mode

they would just be locked up in 2014 with no content additions

[analog crow]

Jagex has moved away from the mentality of iron as a challenge mode iirc

[meager flame]

a separate client

etc

[tender harness]

When 90% of shit is immune to burn how is it a better dps increase 😭

[meager flame]

truth is jagex just gotta improve balance and create for multiple game modes now

[true talon]

its still a challenge lmao

[meager flame]

because they exist

[analog crow]

I mean in the sense that they try to balance for it now rather than just balancing for ge-man mode

[true talon]

well ya it needs to be balanced an realistic

[analog crow]

ironman is the future
vote no to updates that cater to mains

[true talon]

i dont

irosn dont care about main catering

we are mains who cant trade

Majority of any main update would be a benefit to us

only one that wouldnt be is one that reduces rates of something

[meager flame]

tbh if jagex had been a little less insane way back in the day

they probably would've been tweaking rune costs and crafting rates from the start

instead of figuring out how to drop them from npcs or add to shops etc

so that people would've actually just went to rc to get runes

[analog crow]

I'm convinced that they were just at the right place at the right time but they were actually pretty bad at game design back then

[ashen yarrow]

law runes used to be rare drops from "hard" enemies in classic with no shops selling them and no runcrafting skill

[meager flame]

ya im pretty sure thats where the fundamental issue started

[analog crow]

8 law runes reward from monk's friend was actually hype back then

[meager flame]

rc didn't exist so they built out other ways to get runes for magic

and then they weren't willing to make rc the way to do things once it got in

[ashen yarrow]

spending 1 hour killing mob to teleport to varrock 2 times

[meager flame]

they somehow kinda kept up the arms race forever too

[analog crow]

The real big bucks was in smithing rune items

[meager flame]

stuff like barrows came in and started producing runes like crazy

then it continues into osrs where they add the diary to buff the runes even more and so on lol

[analog crow]

they probably also are trying to maintain the gp cost of using magic, so they can't realistically make runecrafting much better
that's just my speculation though

[ashen yarrow]

not sure about that one, every single pvp minigame they add has rune drops that bots abuse to crash blood/death/soul prices

well some time ago they did at elast remove runes from those tables

[analog crow]

yeah they did that precisely to reduce the supply of runes to keep up the price

[meager flame]

i think its one of the more obvious moments where they put economy before gameplay and it never really helped the game

they do that a lot especially now because they're scared to rock the boat basically

[hard axle]

If you spent 3 years on a single main game update, while jacking the price up, people have a right to be pissed.

It's really not that hard to add rewards in the big 2026: Powercreep older gear by dropping a new item that can be used right off the bat, and then it gets more stats/power by eating up old BIS. This effectively kills any concerns about progression AND balancing because you can't just skip over older items.

Half of your points are super outdated and idk why you regurgitate them when I've explictly pointed it out to you AND you agree.

I guarantee you if Jagex allowed you to upgrade Dragon Claws into Burning Dragon Claws, there would have been ZERO concerns about Burning Claws to begin with.

[meager flame]

they should still do that

i have no idea why burning claws are allowed to just like

[hard axle]

And I didn't even mention the pro-ironman benefits of this system, which is adding value to dupe Ancestral pieces since any 2-3 dupe pieces lets you progress to Ancestral 2.0.

[meager flame]

be so good compared to everything thats so much harder to get

[true talon]

they have not spent 3 years on a single update lol

[meager flame]

it would make way more sense if they could be attached to d claws and that made the real dps spec weapon if you could hit the target with it

[true talon]

Burning d claws

[hard axle]

Yah, 5 fingers instead of 3 or 2.

3 dragon claw fingers, 2 bone claw fingers

Even if there was 0 stat increase and it just added a burn, dragon claw's higher accuracy would make it a dps increase by default.

Since it would apply burn much easier.

[meager flame]

yeah it doesn't even have to add stats or anything it would just be better game design

instead of creating a situation where its like i could get d claws as a minor upgrade or i could just get these free claws that are almost as good

and that just being the state of things

[hard axle]

[tacit wharf]

still annoys me that they didnt have the elder maul and dwh combine to give the elder maul a spec

[hard axle]

Especially when they nerfed DWH to 1/3k afterwards lol

it's like.. okay lmao

[meager flame]

i also feel like jagex really doesn't lean into spec weapons enough

[minor whale]

It'd be unfair to expect ironmen to get dragon claws to get a good dps spec, just like it's unfair to expect hcim enter the wilderness so here's a budget Voidwaker

Oh man Elder Maul and DHW are both hated grinds why don't we make the dhw more common and make the elder maul useful for those people who oopsied into getting one

[meager flame]

i think its really easy to make them exciting and a little crazy because they're honestly used sparingly compared to regular weapons

[minor whale]

Burning Claws rolling accuracy based on what you chose as attack style is so silly and half the reason it's so dumb as a weapon

It's so clearly a "here's something easier to get for those of you who can't get the other things"

[meager flame]

like as long as they make sure to separate tuning for pvp

[minor whale]

Like 95% of spec weapons don't follow that accuracy logic

[meager flame]

they could release incredibly insane specs

and it wouldn't even change the game much

but it would be fun

[hard axle]

Don't forget Arkan blade

[obsidian venture]

Ironman mode turned this game into babiesrus

[meager flame]

its just weird that they honestly have a lot of runway for specs and dont seem to realize it

[ashen yarrow]

Dont worry next quest will give crush version of voidwaker

[meager flame]

like if you released an ags that hit 100% harder than the current one it would look insane

and also often times not really change pve in the game

so they just have this huge field of potential new items or changes

and just sit on their hands lol

they'd rather increment your regular attacks by .5 dps instead

[ashen yarrow]

That one needs to be balanced for pvp so cannot have it

[meager flame]

yeah just disable them for pvp honestly

or just tune them so its like +1 max hit or whatever silly shit they feel they need to do for it but outside of that

where most of their players actually play

they can really do a lot

[narrow folio]

Dhw being way cheaper and almost the same as kodai dmg is funny af

Randomly added ancients autocast for no reason

[meager flame]

thats another two items that probably should've been able to be combined

or kodai just needs a rework honestly

[obsidian venture]

Sure

Would maybe add % dmg maybe

To show its “mega” status

[meager flame]

i want them to try something interesting like

[obsidian venture]

Maul consuming dwh

For maybe 40% def

[meager flame]

makie it work like the harm staff but only for water spells

[obsidian venture]

Is ok only due to the status

[meager flame]

assuming they'd ever be willing to do the other elements the same

[obsidian venture]

If it was a new item that did that outta nowhere then just delete these two

[meager flame]

just so harm can be free to be good without being the single option for elemental weaknesses

[obsidian venture]

I have a theory

What if they made elemental spells busted in leagues, so that they can push for that in raids 4

As they mentioned elemental robes

Would be funny

[meager flame]

they should let my iron dual wield the harm staves it has after the league im convinced

[obsidian venture]

[tacit wharf]

testing out "effects" to specific elements

[meager flame]

nah but really stuff like kodai could be cool if it had an elemental theme

it already slightly does but its useless

[hard axle]

Crush Dragon Claws, you mean??

[meager flame]

it could even steal from the league

let it take that little node that made ice spells function as water spells or something like that

[hard axle]

Please.

When it was released, the only thing competing was SOTD/SOL, but that had to be manual cast, which was fine back then since autocast had that delay.

[ashen yarrow]

It will roll %min-%max like voidwaker based on accuracy checks

[hard axle]

Now we have NM Staff, Ancient Sceptres, Ancient Sceptre with Gems, DHW all in between.

[meager flame]

i wonder if that would have any practical application in the regular game

if you could ice barrage something with water weakness

[ashen yarrow]

Well technically also similar to dragons with multiple different values based on accuracy check but also has higher
minimum hit

[true talon]

False

Main is significantly easier than ironman by miles.

[meager flame]

so after looking at it

i actually think

[hard axle]

It wouldn't be broken, no.

The dps is lower than Ayak

[meager flame]

ice barrage counting for water weakness could actually be a real thing

[hard axle]

but you would take away reason to use any other Water Spells

that's the only downside

[meager flame]

especially if you also let it combine with a dhw

because it could pretty quickly turn into a dragon/tzhaar/demon slaying weapon

[obsidian venture]

It’s easier sure but the updates that have been released in recent years have been because of irons

Also ttk for max is not even that far off

Between mains/irons

[meager flame]

it would be pretty interesting though if they made a set of wands to go with the kodai and each was for its own element

harm already does that but people hate harm for pretty good reasons lol

[obsidian venture]

Some good qol and then just straight buffs for 0

[narrow folio]

Did u know blood barrage olm with dhw is actually not bad dps

Sounds cursed

But its a thing

[hard axle]

good for saving supplies if ur focused on speedier clears and doing no preps with the boys

[ashen yarrow]

Sounds like ironman method to replace sang

[hard axle]

i believe it's less dps than earth spells

but like

[narrow folio]

Sang at h(olm)

[hard axle]

[true talon]

no the updates was released to flesh out the early/mid game, nothing to do with irons

Mains benefitted from every update released as well as irons

outside of scar ess but eve then scar ess had 2 money makers

[obsidian venture]

Nope

We have had this convo before

[true talon]

name an update that was ironman only that no main of any account status benefitted from?

[hard axle]

scar essence

[true talon]

i already covered that 1

[hard axle]

death mechanics, 50% cost, full ge value when sacrificing items

[true talon]

Scar ess was so they didnt add insane amount of blood runes from blood rune crafting.

[hard axle]

they didn't need to add it at all

[warm quiver]

don't irons actually get more value when sacrificing

[true talon]

shopscape was doing an insane amount of damage to their game

the amount of server hopping alone was stressing it out

[hard axle]

don't think that was confirmed at all

the amount of irons in need of blood runes to the extent that they're hopping excessively frankly isn't that high

[true talon]

Blood rune packs would have been the alternative

they made scar ess to make it more fun

[hard axle]

105% of ge value, same as mains, but kind of ludicrous to benefit at the ge price while having 50% value

[warm quiver]

ah okay

[hard axle]

esp when it's being used beyond death costs now too

instance costs get taken out of coffer first and i won't be surprised if they suddenly decided to allow bank slots to be purchased this way

since no gp or physical items enters back into the system, so technically its okay

[true talon]

death cost are not really relevent anyways

[hard axle]

only cuz ur not paying full value

[hard axle]

and it benefits the game more if u just sacrifice a tbow to buy max bank slots over raw gp

same for nex, yama, delve dupes being sac'd instead

[meager flame]

i mean they should allow bank slots or bonds or whatever to work that way

pretty much shifts between being a fine gold/item sink or a small qol update so you aren't dropping to another account

in fact

specifically when it comes to bank slots

i'd say the way its set up is extra dumb

[true talon]

Bank slots are crazy expensive to

[meager flame]

because you dont really care about gold sinking irons

you should care about item sinks though

[true talon]

even with 800m i think i only buy up to 20m

[hard axle]

bonds are a problem because the gp coming out of coffer goes to someone else

I think using dc funds to convert it back to tradeable would be fine though

[meager flame]

yeah but its not even really a problem

[hard axle]

no no, it absolutely is

[meager flame]

because you just drop to main and do it anyways

[hard axle]

because we have instances where items are worth materially less than their ge prices

[meager flame]

yeah but the reverse is also true

and since these are irons it would just flip flop both ways

[hard axle]

the reverse is less of a problem because it can't be abused and prices will stabilize eventually

that's why jagex started setting starting prices as super low recently if u noticed

[meager flame]

thats why i think for bonds it should just sell items on the ge and put the money in a bond pouch

it could do that for all of this too

that would solve the market problem

but

if you want to use things as an item sink which is probably more beneficial for the game

you probably just accept some weird value stuff happening occasionally

because an iron is almost never going to spend the actual gp in their bank

so the best you're gonna get out of them that matters to the wider game is item sinks

so like death fees or bank space purchases

its probably better to just allow an item sink

[true talon]

all my gp goes to blood,death,soul, choas runes lol

[meager flame]

like in my bank right now i probably have like 200m gp

but if i dropped my dupes into the main game

its like

4b in items

[hard axle]

1.05x 4b = 200m extra credit on top of that

[meager flame]

actual raw gp generation on irons is like

actually pretty well balanced

[tender harness]

Would someone please let Jagex know that there is 6000 tick in an hour and there always has been.

Using this information, you can figure out that if an action takes you 4 ticks, you can do it 1500 times in an hour. If that action happens to give you 150 smithing experience, that means you will get 225,000 experience in an hour.

[meager flame]

lmao i read that on reddit earlier

they aren't wrong i had a similar reaction to them being surprised by exp rates

[tender harness]

#game-update message
But they knew a year ago

There literally is no excuse

[meager flame]

i mean they shouldn't even need feedback

at least not for that

its not even hard lol just

if they tried to do the math at all

it wouldn't be like this

its neglect

[tender harness]

Beta? Thats what production is for

[hard axle]

still good to let the monkeys to voluntarily limit test

(we are the monkeys)

[tender harness]

Yes let the train lovers test

[meager flame]

its actually bad enough that i suspect that whoever set those rates

actually knew exactly what they were doing

its kinda hard to believe they put some random numbers out there never checked it and it just so happens to line up that well with other mining methods

[tender harness]

They just straight up didnt care

[meager flame]

i think maybe they just didn't care and wanted it to be pretty good and then the rest of jagex said wait hold on now wtf

once they saw it for real

[tender harness]

Like 90% of sailing

Jagex just ignored it

The ostrich theory

[warm epoch]

somewhere in the code from the beta

//todo adjust exp rates

[minor whale]

Unfortunately Claude didn't catch that one

[languid tundra]

I can’t help but think IF they remove the xp from incendiary cannonballs, is there actually going to be anyone apart from maybe irons actually making them

[nocturne hull]

https://tenor.com/view/always-have-been-always-will-be-tracy-jordan-30rock-forever-and-ever-now-and-forever-gif-21884305

[languid tundra]

Can I also just say that so many things in the post today contradict another

“Economic concerns over volume of them entering the game, splinters would inevitably become far less valuable over time” in one sentence to let’s increase how many of them you get per hour from 2100-2500 up to between 6300 and 7500 whilst also irradiating the entire demand of players wanting to use them for smithing xp? I agree action was needed but damn I can’t see a way for them to do this where it’ll remain viable on all fronts or not become dead content due to over correction

[bronze kernel]

"We don't want them to lose value by people over farming them, so let's increase the volume"

How does that even make sense?

[nocturne solstice]

From my understanding, instead of volume coming from a handful of players after BiS mining xp, "everyone" would benefit from increasing the drop volume. This way people mining it normally still make decent profit based off unit sold not price per unit kinda thing.

[ashen yarrow]

I do think incendiary cannonballs could have kept some of the smithing xp, assuming new xp is like 1-5 xp per action. It is mainly ironman side of thinking though since making cannonballs is only 66% of the xp of smithing normal items so incendiary could have filled the gap of xp per bar

After testing the incendiary cannonballs in ship combat they are strong enough to keep value even if players generate more rubium splinters after the change. Assuming players start using ship combat more

Rune incendiary cannonballs should be higher dps than dragon cannonballs since they burn 20-40% extra damage before next shot lands. When player is shooting cannon*

[timber pollen]

I think they should keep tick manipulation for rubium, but change how it works. I think the changes they make to the normal rubium rocks are fine, disable tick manipulation on those, w/e. However, I think they should change how rubium deposits and the geodes work, in a way that would make them more rewarding while restricting how much Rubium you get from them if you are tick-manipulating.

Specifically:
Increase the chance of obtaining a rubium geode so that you recieve them every 3 or 4 ticks, and the xp you gain from them to ~26
Increase the number of rubium deposits (the rocks)
But increase the number of ticks required to crack open a rubium geode, giving you the same or possibly less splinters
Then, add a second option which opens the geode instantly, but which has a chance of receiving 0 or 1 splinters, and restarts your skilling timer (however that works)

The increased xp per action will benefit people who are looking to afk (It's abysmal as it is compared to shooting starts & the like), which can be balanced against the time needed to fully break an inventory of them, whereas fast-break will allow you to tick manip for higher xp on the deposits while getting next to no rubium splinters, while Rubium rocks remain a decent intermediary & the meta for obtaining splinters w/o tick manipulation

[serene lodge]

🤢

[tender harness]

Someone watched gnomonkey

[serene lodge]

they said they didnt want it to be a form of money or xp just a way of obtaining splinters for the cballs so i dont see what the problem is.

[hasty shard]

so dead content

[lost tulip]

still trying to figure out the issue with xp rates on smithing

[serene lodge]

woosh

[minor whale]

It was just unbalanced overall efficiency wise
You had a resource you could smith into cannonballs, a resource you could mine for solid XP that stacked, and then you could use that resource on the smithed cannonballs to double dip on xp

[lost tulip]

isnt that also a gigantic time investment?

[minor whale]

It was still pretty macroefficient double dipping the resources
It's why Giant's Foundry takes away a portion of the bars that make up already smithed materials

[lost tulip]

again these are ridiculous time investments though, you gotta make the bars, make the cannonballs, mine the rubium, then finally make the incendiary and your still gonna be slower than just doing 3t granite and gold ore blast furnace

What is the negative aspect being applied to the game, assume im a noob

rubium xp rates i get it, too profitable too much xp at once

[minor whale]

It gave ~200 XP per bar with runite, equivalent to if a rune platebody gave 1000 XP per smith.

Time investment is irrelevant when it's still over double the XP per bar

Rune platebodies currently give 375xp for 5 bars

Actually no
It was 300 per bar just from cannonballs

[lost tulip]

again whats the negative, what is the outcome that makes the game worse

[minor whale]

150 XP twice since each bar makes 4 balls and each smith takes 2

[lost tulip]

rune platbody already rewuires 99

[minor whale]

Ok look at it from the angle of rune dart tips

Same speed as incendiaries cannonball

75 XP per bar

Incendiaries give 300

[lost tulip]

incediaries require a 2ndary ingredient

[minor whale]

That's an absurd amount of extra XP per bar use

A stackable one that is extremely fast to gather and decent mining xp on its own

[lost tulip]

r u saying this highly devalues rune bars..?

[lost tulip]

it takes 7 hours to do 1k cballs right?

[minor whale]

And they're about to triple the rates of gathering Rubium

[lost tulip]

Okay so dont triple the stupid ass rate lol, nerf the gathering xp to not blow mlm out of the water

[old shadow]

Why would having an alternative to mlm be bad lmao

[minor whale]

They want this to be a way to make new better cannonballs

They don't want it to be a new smithing method

They just want irons to be able to easily acquire better cannonballs because dragons are hard to get

The method was never intended to be so strong for XP at all

[lost tulip]

We werent intended to 3t or red x but here we are

[old shadow]

What’s the rate gonna be at 96 mining

For afk

Like 60k?

[minor whale]

Ye

[minor whale]

This has been in the game less than a week
Fixing it early is good

[lost tulip]

the community is excited for a new training method and again WHAT IS THE NEGATIVE??

what makes osrs worse

ok a runite bar is more efficient with cannonballs. Whats the impact that requires a nerf

[old shadow]

Osrs is good because things tend to be balanced

Community throws a fit because they don’t want the balance they want ease

It’s why people don’t like that mechanics are designed increasingly towards prayer flicking

It’s also why people threw a tantrum because they balanced salvaging rates arguably fairly

[vivid ruin]

I feel like gathering skills are fairly dead due to drops from so many monsters

[lost tulip]

im still waiting for the negative impact to be explained

[minor whale]

The community is always happy when unbalanced shit gets added

[tacit wharf]

i mean, the other side of the token to this is, that it also hinders what they can give for prayers

[old shadow]

It’s also why people don’t like when stuff comes from pvp or the idea of locking things behind late game content

[minor whale]

Thankfully the devs don't give a shit about that and understand balance is more important

[lost tulip]

what is balance breaking here??? costs r high and xp rates are still lower than the meta

[old shadow]

Damn guess what happens when more people mine rubium

Costs get low

[minor whale]

Each bar becoming worth over 3x as much xp is unbalanced dude

Like I don't genuinely understand what you don't understand

They didn't want this to be good xp

[old shadow]

It’s afk and high exp

It was just unbalanced

[tender harness]

It was also high cost

[minor whale]

If they released this next week instead of this week with the correct rates would you be bitching that it's not good xp or would you just accept that's how it was on release

[minor whale]

was
Shit was gonna crater

The number of people who want tens of thousands of incendiaries was gonna be so much lower than the number of people afk mining Rubium

[wet smelt]

Happens with every xp method, why do you think rune dart tips are like 4x the cost of rune darts?

Do you think they should nerf dart making to make rune darts profitable?

[lost tulip]

maybe im mentally deficient, but if no1 wants incendiary cballs or too many in market that means that means resell value tanks..?

[tender harness]

Incendiary has no use. 90% of shit in sailing is burn immune regardless.
Its supposed better dps? But havent seen the calcs

[wet smelt]

Tbh I don’t think they should try to control the outcome of training methods. If it becomes cheap, so be t

[vivid ruin]

Is the problem with this new activity tick manip lol?

[minor whale]

That wasn't an argument he was making for them being balanced
They're 3x the XP per bar than other bar uses
He wasn't saying them becoming cheap is how they would be balanced

But just that using "they're expensive" as a reason to keep things unbalanced is bad

[lost tulip]

brother in fucking christ tell me the negative impact on the game

[minor whale]

Because there's no guarantee they remain expensive so that balance goes out the window

[tender harness]

The tick manipulation issue is literally this was granite but easier and better in every way while also offering the same rates as granite

[minor whale]

I've told you about a dozen times but you just plug your ears and go lalalala

[tender harness]

Ofc that was broken

[minor whale]

The bars giving over triple the XP of other uses for the bars is unbalanced

That's bad for the game

[lost tulip]

better xp per bar, okay then what happens? it still remains expensive

[wet smelt]

I personally think they should remove tick manipulation in general so that there can be training methods that are fun and rewarding

[minor whale]

That's not what would happen lol

They wouldn't make anything better by removing tick manip

[wet smelt]

Everything gets nerfed for tick manipulation purposes

[vivid ruin]

I dont see why they dont just throw a buffer in to tick manip methods so that people just cant do it? Skills shouldn't be forced to revolve around those methods. People shouldnt* be rewarded for it, either.

[wet smelt]

It’s annoying for everyone else

[minor whale]

No it doesn't lmfao

[tender harness]

This is so wrong 😭

[minor whale]

They literally said they balanced Rubium around power mining iron rates

The tick manip was unintended

[lost tulip]

Highly sought after training method? ye that remains expensive

[tender harness]

This was a buff to the casuals and a fix to something that should had been fixed from beta

[warm quiver]

if only they knew about this issue last year

[wet smelt]

Anyways, as the saying says, abuse early abuse hard or some shit

[tender harness]

I mean you can still do it now the fixes arent live yet

It's just why bother

[wet smelt]

Smithing xp is getting dumped too

[lost tulip]

gagex ruining everyones fun again

[tender harness]

It should. But smithing like most skills need a fucking overhaul
If my choices are blast furnace which blows chunks, Addy plates, or giants foundry none of those are fun

Crystal armor costs a metric fuck ton

[wet smelt]

I think they should nerf dart tip xp and fletching unstrung bows so that people finally string their bows

[tender harness]

No

[wet smelt]

It’s ruining the game integrity guys don’t you see

[minor whale]

I love when people get so angry over being told something is unbalanced they start doing this ^

It's happened like 5 times this past few days and it's always funny

[tender harness]

Vale totems are a good enough alternative to darts that you dont need to destroy your wrists on mobile

[wet smelt]

You can get like 2.2m xp/h guys it’s bad for the game

[tender harness]

Go post on reddit and farm updoots with the general brain rotted community there posting blatantly wrong information about rubidium

[wet smelt]

How am I wrong

The xp rates are fine, don’t say high rates are bad just because it’s new

[tender harness]

You've been told repeatedly you just choose to ignore it.

[wet smelt]

Remove tick manipulation and leave the xp rates as is

[tender harness]

That solves nothing and is a reddit take

[wet smelt]

Crazy how saying Reddit makes you right

I should take notes

[minor whale]

JMods have said they wouldn't change current methods if they removed tick manip lol

So you're asking for something pointless

[wet smelt]

Blog post says they are nerfing xp rates for both

Smithing xp to “token amounts”

[minor whale]

Overall
Your favorite mining method won't be better XP just because tick manip is removed

Are you like
Capable of understanding that they literally did remove tick manip from Rubium
And still nerfed the non tick manip method?
Because they thought the afk method was too high xp for something so rewarding

[wet smelt]

And 20% less xp to mining without tick manipulation

[minor whale]

Making tick manip a Boogeyman when it's not even relevant to this discussion is wild
They removed it just like you wanted from Rubium
And they still nerfed Rubium overall because it was unbalanced without tick manip

[wet smelt]

So you said they aren’t changing the other parts, then you say they are but that was already said so it doesn’t count?

[minor whale]

You think if they removed tick manip from granite they'd suddenly make mining Rubium 90k/hr?

[wet smelt]

I think if they removed tick manipulation from EVERY METHOD it would allow them to make skills that gave xp

[minor whale]

They think Rubium is too strong at current rates for how rewarding it is

[minor whale]

They've said this isn't true

They'd have to create a method that is as intense as tick manip to get similar rates

[wet smelt]

They are removing the xp to making, and removing the xp to use them, so why would anyone spend so much when the dps of them is like +1

[south void]

Jagex is using tick manipulation as the "upper threshold value" for balancing xp rates, so if it was removed I'd wager that yes, the "normal methods" would see increased rates from newer content and wouldn't have an "upper threshold value" being taken up by tick manipulation "sweat" methods.

[minor whale]

They haven't had any ideas of content that would fulfill that and said tick manip isn't stopping them from doing it

It's why tick manip barb fishing didn't stop them from adding leechfin which will be higher XP than barb

[wet smelt]

So, the product is bad, the xp is bad, and the methods are bad. Wow I sure hope I enjoy my crumbs

[minor whale]

Because it'll be similar intensity

[lost tulip]

end of day, this

[south void]

Maybe so, but their version of leechfin wasn't going to be similar intensity.

It was proposed as moons fishing, which is not as intensive as tick manipulation barb fishing.

[wet smelt]

+1 dps at best doesn’t sell me on it

They should just dumpster accuracy on non cannon damage to sea monsters

[austere mulch]

That’s such a lowball approach to thinking of anything

[wet smelt]

And let cannons be better

[austere mulch]

+1 dps is a wildy different story when your dps is 3 than when it is 15

Relative increase is what matters

[minor whale]

Also I don't think I've seen calcs anywhere saying it's +1 lmao

Burn damage is insane dps

It's why burning claws are better than dclaws in a ton of places despite on paper dps being lower by like half

[lost tulip]

burn damage isnt working atm right?

on fishes

[minor whale]

People just catastrophizing to be upset over stuff
Nah they fixed it

It works on most things now

[lost tulip]

cool ill go try it later i want the tp jar drop

[wet smelt]

Each burn does .4 damage a second and caps at 5 times, capping at 2dps

That’s IF you roll positive on all the hits

It’s going to be 1dps unless you high roll every time and are 100% accurate

[south void]

One of our use cases for burning claws over d claws was Verizik p3. If 4/5 people died p3 but dumped burning claws specs, we'd still complete because the burn lasted past player death. Cheese wins.

[minor whale]

Cannonball burn doesn't work like that btw

[wet smelt]

If it would reach 2dps, at most it will cut like 40 hp on the highest hp sea monster

[austere mulch]

If verz js still alive* after dumping that many specs, that means she healed hella and would’ve been better off with the players dying before the heal 🤣

[wet smelt]

Tell me how I’m wrong instead of saying I’m just wrong

[south void]

4 man learners+me broskie, shit is rough 😉

[austere mulch]

Also yeah, isn’t cannonball burn not capped at the usual 5?

[minor whale]

Incendiary Cannonballs burn for 120% of the damage of your hit on proc over the next 15 ticks

And it gets refreshed instead of applied again

Incendiary Rune cannonballs end up being higher dps than dragon cannonballs assuming the target is burnable

[south void]

Burning Balls sound awesome. Guess I should get into some boat combat for the first time ever since Sailing was introduced.

[minor whale]

As seen here, I hit a 55 and the burn damage does 20% of that, 6 times total

It's substantial dps increase

The fact it only gets refreshed or buffed if you hit higher is HUGE for the dps

So 1 hit of 55 means you'll deal 55 + 66 for 1 single cannonball shot

[austere mulch]

And ignoring flat armor is crazy too

Surprised they said no to the dragon variant

[lime geyser]

Did they just kinda forget about the poll passing to change poison dynamite from three belladonnas to one?

[tacit wharf]

why would they forget

[south void]

Lol at me mentioning yesterday that the trouble brewing rum is 2 tile bank distance, and overnight someone is merching them.

Good thing I bought what I needed over months for my mobile times, you aren't pulling a fast one on me homie

[hasty shard]

reminder incendiary balls only work on birds and a quest mob

wait i was lied to

did they fix it

[south void]

This looks cool, I just find it hilarious water creatures are able to be set on fire.
Guess there is some tar or something sticky mixed into the burning balls.

[tacit wharf]

oil based fire dont get put out by water

[minor whale]

Must have, even the wiki states they're still immune lol

[sacred oracle]

I don't know why tick manipulation is such a boogeyman. I wonder if people who are super upset about it have even tried it.

It's just clicking. It's not some mysterious, hard thing. It's just high-intensity clicking, not really different from any other high-intensity method.

If it didn't exist, there would simply be other high xph methods added on the top end with equal amounts of clicking

It's not like removing it would suddenly elevate the xph of every other method and make the game lower intensity for equal xph

[hasty shard]

people would immediately shut up if it was diegetic like jims cloth

they may as well atp

gnome puzzle box time

[sacred oracle]

Gonna replace beware of dog sign on my fence with tick manipulation and never get solicitors again

[hasty shard]

like fuck me do people think this is the only game where you can manipulate an action queue

[true talon]

Standard 416 expierence, waiting for those healing her to die so you can finish.

[quartz anchor]

I think tick manipulation should give 1 dragon arrows per action so we can have a consistent way to get dragon arrows

[vernal valve]

The crazy part is I'm not sure there would be for the most part, tbh

[south void]

They already get more xp/hr, you should say 1 dragon arrow per action for the afk methods like the 25-35 minute demon tears wcing

[vernal valve]

Like, they don't really release intense skilling methods intentionally. Like at all. Probably because they're just not actually popular? Like, most players just do not want to do even moderately intense skilling.

[south void]

Replace all tick manipulation with spam clicking. This would warrant more xp/hr (based on effort=reward) while allowing the "normal" methods to prosper from higher rates but still not as high as spam clicking. (This was meant as humorous).

[obsidian venture]

Basically folks are afraid of using their hands

Sad playerbase

[hasty shard]

congrats you invented trawling

[obsidian venture]

Also I love that folks keep showing they are unable to read

They legit mention that a higher xp method would be just an engaging as current "tick-manipulation" methods

So you will be clicking more anyway and not as rhythmically which is what tick manip is

[hasty shard]

no you see theyd buff all mining xp

and people would 100% do said meta of vm/bm/zalc

:clueless:

[vernal valve]

the mining complaints really get me, i'm ngl

of the gathering skills it probably has by far the best variety of viable methods of varying types, xp rates, interaction rates, etc.

but people constantly complain about it and not like, woodcutting, which is 99% trees with minimal meaningful distinction

[obsidian venture]

People are basically bots themselves

[vernal valve]

because what they actually want is afk mining to be like 2x or 3x rates and have even less friction

[hasty shard]

i honestly think fishing is the worst one

[obsidian venture]

They have the inability to think

[tender harness]

Spam clicking trawling nets SOO FUN

[obsidian venture]

The thing is

[hasty shard]

there is just no xp variety

[obsidian venture]

Folks want "modern rates"

[tender harness]

The fuck does modern rates mean tho

[obsidian venture]

What they fail to understand is that this limit is placed by Jagex

Modern rates means faster xp/ buff to methods

[hasty shard]

50k/h 1h afk like salvage

[vernal valve]

at least fishing has drift net and temp but yeah it's pretty bad too

[obsidian venture]

think mixology/ bone shards/ salvaging

[tender harness]

Buh

Salvaging was a mistake

Id die on that hill

[obsidian venture]

Anyways

[vernal valve]

ig wc has forestry now but idk that's basically it

[hasty shard]

salvaging shouldve been like martial wreckage but for every spot honestly

[vernal valve]

and sulliusceps but that's pretty generous

[hasty shard]

its just weird how entirely uninteractive it is

it is literally the most afk training in the game

[tender harness]

Sulliusceps are kinda chill atleast

[hasty shard]

unless you want to count guthans afk

[vernal valve]

Yeah I do like them honestly

But like

[minor whale]

Partially Jagex's fault for constantly catering to the lowbobs in every scenario except skilling, so people get picky and whiney about skilling not being good because there's no afk 400k/hr methods

I really wish they'd put out a statement other than on Reddit that they balance skills intentionally and other than mistakes to rates, they're done with a purpose.

[obsidian venture]

Jagex has an umbrella of what they deem to be on the top. They could increase rates of everything if they chose. However they stand firm on higher xp, to the top of their umbrella, needs high activity

[vernal valve]

They're not THAT different from just cutting Any Other Tree

They're different enough I'll count them as a distinct method but still, lol

[minor whale]

People just believe Jagex is beholden to the HLC skilling sweaty elitists which is just hilariously untrue

[obsidian venture]

They need fingers to point

[minor whale]

If it were, we'd have had 3 more ToBs and Infernos by now

[tender harness]

300k/hr gwenith is afk 😭 surely

[hasty shard]

i can tell you with like 60% confidence there has not been a peep with the more in-the-know people about it because it does not matter

[minor whale]

Jagex has done a really really good job with skilling overall
So many methods for so many intensities people could want

[hasty shard]

lily could tell you with more confidence if she was here 😭

[obsidian venture]

Most top end skillers I know just said " ok"

no complaints

[minor whale]

Anyone complaining about rc these days is just ie

[obsidian venture]

it gets nerfed

[minor whale]

Or mining

[obsidian venture]

and they get blamed for 0

[minor whale]

Legit even when I made the post I wasn't like THIS IS BROKEN JAGEX FIX

[vernal valve]

I think RC is turbo cracked in current year but I at least understand why someone wouldn't really like any of the current good methods tbh

[tender harness]

Hunter sucks worse than rc and mining

[vernal valve]

Mining I think is just showing your whole ass lmao

[tender harness]

Tbh

[hasty shard]

tick manip LITERALLY has nothing to do with it it was getting adjusted anyways

[minor whale]

I literally just said "hey this is granite rates but easier and this was brought up in the beta I think you guys oopsied"

[hasty shard]

how do people miss that in the blog

that is why they are adjusting the xp and removing 3t

[obsidian venture]

Because the iq is in the bin

Avg osrs player

speak first think later (maybe)

[hasty shard]

.

[bronze kernel]

Aren't the rates they gave also like with every single possible enhancer?

[hasty shard]

yes

you need stardust

[bronze kernel]

And for granite, I don't think you need any of that?

[tender harness]

I dont even understand the complaints about skilling in the lord year of 2026
Rc is fine
Mining isnt bad either
Agility people hold onto trauma from 10 years ago, but its fine, seppy or rooftops and just chill

Shit like hunter tho makes me pull my hair out

[hasty shard]

stardust is NOT sustainable they absolutely nuked the gather rate on it

[minor whale]

Even without, it's ~125k/hr

Which is crazy for a stackable resource

[vernal valve]

I (mostly) agree, my biggest complaints with most skills is that they desperately need more variety

[tender harness]

Its just easier granite

[minor whale]

Honestly them just making it stackable from the jump was the issue
Why didn't they just make you have to crack open a geode

[tender harness]

And they made it clear in the blog they arent opposed to more granite methods but this was never meant to be one

[vernal valve]

Like Agility is a skill I think would heavily benefit from a few more Sepulchre-lite courses or something similar

[minor whale]

It'd be just as afk for the people mining normally
Make the big rock give splinters

[hasty shard]

agreed its just kind of annoying to need to have two stances on this because its a) why the fuck did this get missed and b)tick manip is not the issue

because people will just assume very polar things

[minor whale]

Big rock slow XP give stackable splinters
Small rocks decent xp give geodes need to hammer open

[tender harness]

Beta feedback? Whats beta feedback

[bronze kernel]

If the stackability is the problem, maybe just make it give the geodes you have to crack open to slow things down

[minor whale]

Like why is it backwards

[bronze kernel]

Easy fix

[minor whale]

Ye

[bronze kernel]

As for the cannonballs, I would say just leave the chain method as is

[hasty shard]

im kind of hoping they didnt do this because its shitty

[south void]

Thankfully salvaging was a method, or else I'd be lvl 1 sailing still (although I'd probably be happier never having chosen to touch that damn skill to begin with).

[hasty shard]

as in, pleae i dont want to spam click open things training

[minor whale]

Incendiaries are a bit silly especially on the lower tier balls

The XP per bar is so high

[bronze kernel]

Regardless

[hasty shard]

theres a reason nobody touches aerial fishing besides the absurd grind and shit xp

[minor whale]

Like a steel bar is normally 37.5 XP

Steel bars into cannonballs into incendiaries gives 175

[bronze kernel]

Of where you stand in this, we all can say how pathetic of a look it is when they already knew about this stuff before release but conveniently forgot to change it

[minor whale]

For 1 bar

Oh yeah absolutely

[tender harness]

Incendiary bout to be the new aerial fishing of smithing

But no clogs

[minor whale]

Really really shit they knew this feedback and did nothing

What was the point of the beta

All that feedback on everything and they legit changed nothing

[tender harness]

That was like 90% of sailing issues tho

Legit reported and never fixed

The beta was an insult to time

[south void]

Best high effort training method I like is spam clicking ardy knights for theiving.
But, of course using the unintended method of splashing and blocking them into a corner in the bank.

[hasty shard]

them genuinely missing it doesnt absolve the fact that they unintentionally ignored feedback lol

i already had no faith that they read shit thanks for the confirmation 😭

burning claws blood moon

[minor whale]

Some guy in here has had knowledge of a game breaking poh bug that can be used nefariously

And he's reported it daily for weeks now

[hasty shard]

been thinking about that guy too

[minor whale]

He checked last update and it still works

Like ffs

[hasty shard]

razmire shop got fixed after yknow

a fair while

and theres another one iirc

think its the deepfin mine shop

[minor whale]

Yup

Only 100 JMods they're stretched thin

[hasty shard]

i called out snowy knight mixes being absurdly broken and wouldnt you know it, varlamore released and they were 1:1 what i expected

and they got shadow nerfed

[minor whale]

Corporate has gotta be just non existent

[hasty shard]

which is why they suck ass

[minor whale]

20 middle managers per person actually working on anything

[austere mulch]

Fang on this list too lol

Pre-release, plenty people said fang would be op (basically all got downvoted) with its original mechanics

Some even told them through direct channels / dm conversations

[hasty shard]

im still kinda struggling to understand why fang came out besides being a better corp weapon

[tender harness]

Please be patient price has to be hiked 5 more times for anything of value

[hasty shard]

marlins are almost under 4k

laughing

[tender harness]

Trawling casually getting killed

[south void]

Let me know when they get under 2k so I actually feel the need to use them

[obsidian venture]

if you're broke just use anglers

[tender harness]

Use dark crabs

[south void]

Yup

I can't put the new fish in my lineup, it'll look so odd.

[hasty shard]

should 100% use halibut over karams

[true talon]

They were 6k lmao.

They should fix the exploit were you can have everyone operate the same net on the boat and catch fish

[meager flame]

Tbf they shouldn’t really cost that much in terms of gameplay impact

It’s one of those artificial things where the gameplay is just so ass the supply wasn’t really there

Kinda hard to take them over anglers if you think about it

[south void]

Karams are free from me afking them, I'll never go trolling. If I ever run out, I may then buy/use halibut

[meager flame]

It was probably smallish market held up on combo eating for pvp almost entirely

[hasty shard]

they were 8k

[meager flame]

The secondary usage for stams is there too

[south void]

If I can do the same gameplay for less cost and same effort, I'm going to stick with that option.

[meager flame]

Genuinely I think the overheal on anglers is probably just a better idea a lot of the time

[south void]

Sounds like fishing charters irl. What if people don't want to buy their own boats or do any of the other sailing reqs, but they want to fish?

Maybe make it cost to use another player's boat, that'll fix it

Pay per charter, coming to sailing soon!

[hasty shard]

when are we gonna get overheal karams

i beg

[south void]

$19.99/month

[tender harness]

[south void]

And here I am just anxiously awaiting the biggest update of the year, bingo integration.

[tender harness]

Im just waiting for goal posts to shift

When bmr inevitably fails and is buggy again like everything else

What people say then

[south void]

Once BMR fails I'll complain it's dead content cause I don't need bis range buffs to help my poor pvm skills

[tender harness]

Leechfin being reworked basically 2 times? Three?

[hasty shard]

i hope they add a weird shared hp enemy like moons so we get blood moon burning claws 2

[tender harness]

A new boss that will almost guarantee be bugged

[south void]

When raids 4 has rewards I'm not interested in, I'll go back to other raids and wait for raids 5.

[tender harness]

You assume we will get raids 4 rewards before fall

Raids 4 is probably q2 2027

Delayed if we get another league

[south void]

It's another dmm, and leagues get it right

[tender harness]

Leagues 7 and still no sailing

[south void]

When sailing was an April fools joke and they took it seriously

I thought the vote was April fools 2.0

[south void]

I'm not assuming anything until I get the 12 or so pings that'll come from constantly reworking the reward polls.

[south void]

Sandwiches are difficult, look how hard Sandwich Lady works to bring us her goods!

Which brings me to, add leechfin sandwich to sandwich lady random event as a rare chance and when you choose it she takes the bread off and calls you an idiot sandwich.

[sacred oracle]

If halibut get down to only two or three times as much as bwans, I'll use them

[south void]

I can hear the stale baguette cloggers screachhhh at adding another rng into her

[sacred oracle]

Marlin would be usable at 3k I think

[tawdry folio]

The trawling fish are so good in general

I think people undervalue yellowfin and bluefin

[sacred oracle]

Well, I say that but I'm sitting on 20m in those fish that I forgot to sell before prices cratered

I like bluefin. They're reasonably priced for what they are tbh

I use them at Kree'arra for a smidgeon of extra pp

Since I never overheal there

food at kree is just for emergencies, not to overheal at start of kc

[south void]

My personal rule is never buy new items, regardless of what they are. I wait 6-8 months before ever considering it.

[tawdry folio]

I like them at Duke to sustain from the chip damage from the slams

[sacred oracle]

I'm rich so my rule is I just buy it if I want it

That's how you end up with 650m avernic treads

And then you spend the time between content releases regenerating the gp you blew on the last one

Except now we never get content so it doesn't matter what you spend because you get half a year to make your money back

[hasty shard]

for pvm theres like not really ever a reason to not just use moonlight

[south void]

While I paid 170m and continued using echo boots with 20 extra recharge crystals I bought at 1.2m each lol

[sacred oracle]

moonlight antelope is a food that looks good on paper but I never actually use

[south void]

To each their own, I'm just a "wait until it goes on sale" buyer

[sacred oracle]

Just depends on how much gp you have

If you won't miss the money, you're just having less fun for no reason

[south void]

I like doing the content for drops on my iron men while buying for bottom prices on my main

[sacred oracle]

If you're saving to buy other things it makes sense

Usually the logical move is to just buy it day one or day two if you're going to grind the content

[south void]

Yea, my main only ever has 20-30m liquid cash. Everything else gets put into upgrades as they drop to bottom prices.

[true talon]

not healthy to assume the worst possible outcome on literally everything.

[sacred oracle]

Well, I mean, Jagex have priors at this point

It's not an unreasonable assumption

I hope blood moon rises is good though

[tender harness]

Sure it is.
Look at their track record the past year and tell me what launched with out issues

That was a major update

[true talon]

I mean everything this year has been stable

[south void]

I'm assuming BMR voting polls should be open after leagues?

[true talon]

cow boss was fine, leagues was fine, dmm was fine

Sailing probably shouldnt released with combat, so it be less hated.

[south void]

Or did they settle on everything they wanted? I can't even remember if we did reward blogs for it other than range upgrades.

[true talon]

the overall concept of sailing is great, opens up new content with islands and monsters.

also adds barriers to prevent the content from being botted to hell

[tender harness]

Leagues had issues, they flat out said some issues they are not fixing this league
Cow boss isnt content let alone major content
Doom had issues
Yama had issues
Sailing had beta feedback ignored willingly

[true talon]

I dont consider minor things issues..... nothing can be perfect

[sacred oracle]

Tassili, every single one of those had bugs

[south void]

I don't hate sailing because of combat, I hate sailing because I wanted it to only be combat. I wanted effectively what is called "pirating" to be what sailing is.

[tender harness]

What was minor about yama contracts being unkillable

[sacred oracle]

And there were crippling bugs in main game almost every update between those things

Your memory appears to be quite selective in this case

[true talon]

i mean thats because no1 played the contracts without jmod cheats X

as all aspirtational content that involves entry keys no1 is going to do

[south void]

I just assume bugs are around every update and don't play on days that ends in Y until I see they fixed them and I get that nice little ping saying it was fixed, then reddit also saying it was fixed.

[tender harness]

Doom issues were ironically worse than yama

[true talon]

Probably, the code is absolutely ancient.......

[south void]

My main account was made at the time they released/updated in game names list, when people were renaming themselves like 300 zezimas, and other obscene things, and during that 30-60 minute interval.

At the time I created it, there was so much going on I didn't find out until I went 8346kc for a bronze defender drop (had to contact Jagex support and wait months) and then after they looked into it I got the drop.

After that I just won't log on for updates ever again because the statistically improbable happened and I have PTSD now.

[true talon]

8346 kc lmao

Dont forget when nightmare released its uniques was turned off XD

You act like these problems have been new to jagex..... its actually just difficult because of the code.

Anyways, i will be enjoying a nice break from OSRS with POE2 this upcoming friday.

Should be a good downtime to wait for BMR

[thick beacon]

feel like there is to much complaining rather then looking at all the good jagex has been doing

[true talon]

^ This

[thick beacon]

if its really that bad ppl should quit im sure that will make them start caring when they lose money

[true talon]

Its what i did to blizzard, the direction of their game was not very good and they continue to double down. so i ended my sub and started playing poe2/osrs.

[sacred oracle]

There's some truth in that, but at the same time if you eat at a restaurant 30 times, and 27 times you saw no rats but on 3 visits you did ....

There's a reason people point out bad things that happen

I would not eat at that restaurant again.

[true talon]

ehh thats 90% success chance which is basically an A

[sacred oracle]

I hope the department of health feels that way!

[narrow folio]

If I see a rat one time im never going back

[sacred oracle]

(this is based on a real-life example btw)

[hasty shard]

you should be happy they even give you the chance to find a latex glove in your sandwich in the first place

[narrow folio]

Because then what about alm the rats u dont see

[true talon]

what if the rat just showed up? not like you can keep them out 100% of the time at all times.

[thick beacon]

feel like the diffrence in osrs is ppl still play. they will complain and play. it hasint gotten to the point where they are giving up on the food yet

[narrow folio]

Err....

[hasty shard]

i think i have seen one rat my entire life

[thick beacon]

a lot of important bugs have been fixed with a lot of that content imo

[tawdry folio]

Nothing will stop me from going back to the local "Blood Popeyes"

[true talon]

People really do have an entitlement problem.

[tawdry folio]

Rats are hungry too

[true talon]

When i worked for COX doing IT support, i had people call an ask for compenstation, because they were unable to use their internet for 10 minutes.

[thick beacon]

but ye i dont mean to say dont shout at jagex if theres problems say it. just rarely see anyone say good atleast recently in this disc

[tacit wharf]

https://tenor.com/view/spongebob-riot-pitchfork-torch-bikini-gif-5846528199736014419

[true talon]

Hilarious stuff ngl

[ashen yarrow]

must be US thing with the customer is always right policy. I heard people complain about even the slightest inconvenience because they know they will get compensation 90% of the time

[true talon]

Ya, i just laughed at them an sent them to billing, the time they spend asking for compenstation costs them more than they will get XD

[true talon]

Anyone think OLM be more interesting if you could react to its magic/range attacks?

Or do you like being hit 40s randomly

[thick beacon]

i liked the approach to nex to an extent

like just force it to use same cmb style for 2-3 attacks 3 seems a bit much

but atleast 2 attacks before it jads

[true talon]

Ya and to balance it maybe make it do a auto special every 3 hits or something

acid walk/flame wall/crystals/bombs whatever he does

Not very fun to eat an auto off pray constantly

[thick beacon]

swear u have to chance urself sometimes cuz of rng

or lose dps on brew

generally im against making content eaiser but olm is like one thing that could use tweaks imo

[ashen yarrow]

yes, remove head running so everyone is forced to tank

[minor whale]

I don't think it's entitlement to expect a service without constant bugs of various degrees that negatively impact the playerbase
Pretty much every update this year has had bugs

I think the content Jagex delivers is usually solid but the current rate of content is piss slow and the bugs surrounding it are numerous

Every time

Brutus's update post looks like this btw

[true talon]

ehh i like this part, i just dislike the taking massive damage without doing anything wrong.

[minor whale]

Do you not remember Brutus update breaking your poh

Like it made people's house layouts not let you move lmao

[ashen yarrow]

it was issue with the wildy poh theme itself not really the update

[minor whale]

I'm going through every update for each week since 2026 started and I'll post each week that didn't have bugs

[vernal valve]

I'll never forgive them for nerfing the portal nexus into this tiny baby one that's in the game now...

[ashen yarrow]

probably need to to go all the way to the update where they started adding the issues to top of update

[true talon]

Like if verzik hit you for 40 every hit at random, i dont think youd have much fun.

[tender harness]

You dont get it. Youre entitled to expect halfway decent updates for the game you pay for bugs are expected

[ashen yarrow]

basically every game will have some bugs that come with each update, most games just dont post them at the top of update page. That doesnt excuse some of the bugs that got to the game though

[tender harness]

Two entire updates in our lords year of 2026

One was a meme

One was bad objectively

Quest giving a fucking clog

[warm quiver]

didnt they go on vacation one week, or was that christmas

saved you some time probably

[minor whale]

January 14th - This update was solely bug fixes and UI updates. No bugs created on this day, but several bugs that were said to be fixed weren't.

February 18th - Birthday update, no bugs introduced.

April 7th - Mobile Character Switcher added, no bugs introduced.

April 29th - Leagues only fixes, no bugs introduced.

That's it

That's all

[tender harness]

They dropped sailing and left for holiday

[warm quiver]

ah

[hard axle]

You can’t negate 90% of verzik’s attacks, you have less supplies, and the fight is generally longer though. Off-pray verzik is 30s and melee can hit you for a high 50.

[minor whale]

There's been 4 total updates in 2026 without bugs requiring hot fixes or cold fixes

[tender harness]

Mobile players in the corner just seething about their issues

[warm quiver]

April 7th - Mobile Character Switcher added, no bugs introduced.
i swear people were posting issues about this though, didn't it sign you completely out of your account every time you closed the game or something

[ashen yarrow]

wasnt birthday update the one where we got yellow water in varrock

[tender harness]

Mobile has been a hot mess all year

[hard axle]

and overloads are busted cuz you can heal without dps loss

[hard axle]

Menu swaps still broken iirc

Custom menu swaps still on top

[tender harness]

[minor whale]

Yeah I'm not counting purely visual

[ashen yarrow]

mobile character switcher was added outside of normal update day and it did have bugs

[true talon]

I guess, fighting olm for 25 minutes to be hit off pray constantly is just annoying as hell lol.

[ashen yarrow]

they replaced one of the scheduled maintenances with random mobile switcher update

[true talon]

Not like you doing anything wrong, your just being punished by 50-50 rng

Could slow the projectile down to give you 1 tick to react to it

Like how phosani works

[tender harness]

People are just tired and rightfully so of how absolutely shit the last year has been.
And this community has some weird thing about shitting on people who point out the laundry list of issues while pretending jagex is fine

[minor whale]

Oh right
Lmao

Ok so we're down to 3

3 total updates this year that didn't require hot fixes or cold fixes to content

So, unrelated, but sorta related
Is underwater theiving/agility just broken

Wearing medallion

My breath literally never goes down

I know it's supposed to be 5x slower but I'm sitting here in the middle of no air bubble

And it's staying 100

[ashen yarrow]

probably rounding the 1% to 0%

[minor whale]

What the fuck

It's the chests

Searching chests makes me go up to 100% again

lmfao nowhere near a bubble, 100% oxygen

Surely this is bugged, right?

[chrome lantern]

Mobile minimenu swap is such a disappointment

[chrome lantern]

Hey that’s a lot of oxygen :)

[real fiber]

Hahaha

[maiden marsh]

pls @ jagex, add the ,,teleport to last boat" option to the teletabs aswell if possible

[tender harness]

Please @ jagex dont add the above to teletabs

[quartz anchor]

please @ jagex ignore the person above me, add the teleport ,,teleport to last boat" option to teletabs, but make it unusable

[tough nacelle]

And a total of 4 updates all together

[winged raptor]

we had 2 updates, cow boss and red reef. if you count things like upgrade to herb sack or bugged gem bag that gave UIMs infinite gems or something then we had 4

quality of patches is beyond embarassing at this point. i remember when sailing dropped and there were issues like skill description said you need 62 to build and use boat facility, but it needed 64 (random numbers, i dont remember). it also took them more than 1 week to fix it btw

[vernal valve]

these still aren't 100% fixed actually

Camphor Hull Parts are correctly documented as requiring 53 con to make on the wiki, but the ingame skill guide lists them as requiring 59 con

[winged raptor]

bruh

[hard axle]

Venom Clouds at Zulrah is still bugged after like 5 weeks

[restive siren]

bugged bad or bugged good

[hard axle]

Bad. Venom clouds do a double damage splat, which if you’re doing efficient or afk, there are times when you preemptively run into clouds

[restive siren]

damn unfortunate

[tough nacelle]

Jagex has just grown a lot

And I imagine there’s a lot more red tape with how much the game has expanded

[tender harness]

This isnt an excuse for absolute sub par releases, lack of releases or just broken releases. Nevermind missed beta feedback

People are jumping through hoops to defend jagex when its abundantly clear the last year has been rather laced with some big doozies

[tender harness]

Red reef was insulting for an update
15 minute quest
You get a clog for some reason at the end
Cow boss was a meme and isnt a real update
There is a laundry list of issues not fixed
And people's biggest complaint is rubium WHICH WAS FLAGGED IN THE BETA FOR BEING BROKEN that jagex ignored and goes oh this rate surprised us. Mfers it didnt you just ignored the feedback

[true talon]

Dunno why people complain about rubium at all.

[warm epoch]

because what was released wasnt what was polled

[obsidian venture]

Not hard to understand

[hasty shard]

theres reasons to complain for every side :clueless:

[serene lodge]

people still beating the dead horse

[maiden marsh]

i hate u guys :/

[vivid ruin]

Everytime i look at the game suggestions thread. I let out a big sigh

[maiden marsh]

well hate is too strong. but y u do dis to me :c a brother just wants to train rc with astrals cuz less clicky clicky

[ashen yarrow]

gave too much xp, players wanted it to be less xp than previous methods. There would still be group of players complaining that is wasted update because it doesnt bring best training methods anyway

[true talon]

yep lol

Didnt see anyone QQ about rune keel parts being 320k+ smithing exp h or the new con methods from hull parts

[ashen yarrow]

repair kits got -50% xp though since it was too afk

[true talon]

yea repair kits was prob to strong

Its extremely difficult to develop a skilling method that is both new and not better than old which i dunno why we would try to preseve granite mining anyways

[chrome lantern]

The problem was never that a method existed that competes with granite, the issues were that it was unpolled, gave a useful product/resource, and was less effort than granite while also being competitive with granite

[true talon]

Quest an activity was polled right?

[chrome lantern]

Rubidium as a mining training method competing with granite was not polled

The resource was polled, the resource being 134k xp/hr to gather with no downsides was not

[ashen yarrow]

basically it is issue because the xp rate competed with the skilling top method of 3tick granite. people only have issue if it is competing with the optimal top xp/h method

[chrome lantern]

And using specifically the language Jagex uses

It is disproportionately high xp for being lower effort and higher resource/reward than granite

[ashen yarrow]

ironwood was new best afk method for woodcutting without needing to drop logs, but wasnt competing with 1.5tick teaks so its fine

[true talon]

ironwood was how i got 99 woodcutting after sailing

[warm epoch]

activity was polled to not have a focus on xp

[true talon]

eventually you gotta start letting new methods be better than old

[chrome lantern]

Yeah and you do that by balancing methods properly

Like they’re trying to do with leechfin

Not by having something that’s competitive with existing methods while also producing a resource and being lower effort

[true talon]

Like trawling should give some of the better fishing xp..... than it does. because its way more active

[ashen yarrow]

ironwood did just that, it jsut didnt compete with tick manipulation meta

[warm epoch]

the trawling ive seen is super afk

[ashen yarrow]

trawling while paying for someone to drive uber is very chill

[true talon]

trawling is not afk if you want the most exp/fish/h

but it has the option to be afkish

it also takes a considerable amount of investment

you need high sailing + boat an facilities

[warm epoch]

Yeah and so you can't really buff the exp part of it anymore

[true talon]

Surprised no1 complaining about crab fishing

crab catching is actually some of the best hunter xp int he game early

There is always selective outrage over skills like rc/agility and mining for some reason

[chrome lantern]

Crab trapping is pretty inconsequential, you wouldn’t really ever do it beyond what you need for potions, even on an iron

[true talon]

Ya but its like 2x as good as any hunter methods at that lvl

[chrome lantern]

At what level

When would you not just be doing birdhouses anyway unless you’re trying to target specific resources like hunter rumors loot or chins

[true talon]

I meant more for main hunter training

i was looking at the crab for early hunter for my baby pure

iron youd just do bird houses for sure

[chrome lantern]

Those don’t even seem that high idk

[[Hunter training]]

[ornate wolf]

Wiki links found:
https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Hunter_training

[true talon]

its high for early

esp 45k-50k in the 20s

[chrome lantern]

You can’t get that at that level though

Not enough traps

[true talon]

30k with 2 traps is still really good at lvl 21

going to 45k at lvl 40

early hunter is one of the worst skills by far till you get to swamp lizards XD

[chrome lantern]

Or you just do a birdhouse run every few quests and ignore it after like a day

Like when you get anywhere relevant of a hunter level the crab trap rates you posted are worse than just the hunter xp alone from drift net, for example, to say nothing of the fishing xp

Slightly better than swamp
lizards is still in the irrelevant tier, and it’s worse than other salamanders to crab trap

To say nothing of other methods

[ashen yarrow]

well razor-backed kebbits are best xp/h for hunter at 48 hunter, after they buffed ring of pursuit

[true talon]

Do people hate sailing as mains? because it doesnt really do anything for you lol.

I cant think of what if i was a main id use sailing for.......

As an ironman its actually a great skill

didnt really add an craz money makey or boss, didnt add any crazy methods to train skills. the resources are pretty meh you can buy them off GE.

[patent magnet]

well you need it for clue steps

trawling with the multi person boat is cool

ironwoods are afk wc

not a lot but some uses

[true talon]

so kinda same for irons

[restive siren]

personally i enjoy it a lot more than most other skills

like you say what youd even use it for but ngl thats every skill

like most skills are way more useless

[true talon]

i dont really care about training it, but the unlocks were good

[restive siren]

its in my upper third of skills i enjoy

but i dont really like skilling general so

[tender harness]

It has almost zero integration into the rest of the game
So yes I hate it
Gwenith glide ruined any positive vibes I had for sailing
So many resources from sailing are just useless

[restive siren]

as a main its pretty much as integrated as every other skill

[true talon]

I mean the island stuff can become more in the future.

[restive siren]

you dont need it whatsoever unless you want a couple unlocks that are gated behind it for no reason (clues and diaries)

[true talon]

the biggest thing sailing did was open up the map to put stuff all over the place

new islands new dungeons new things to explore

[tender harness]

Arguably 90% of the islands are empty filler for a map with nothing of substance
Combat has been a mess since it went live
I will forever be salty about how bad trials were.
Sailing cape is terrible but they refuse to nerf the sailors amulet or fix the cape

[patent magnet]

skillcape perks were a mistake

[true talon]

majority of skill capes are bad

[tender harness]

Doesn't matter

[true talon]

what do you think the sailing cape should do?

[tender harness]

Have the sailor amulet teleports fkr start

[patent magnet]

why

[true talon]

why do you hate sailor amulet??

[patent magnet]

just bring the amulet?

[tender harness]

Because ammy is OP

Teleport boat shouldnt just summon it back to pandamonium

[patent magnet]

also it skips actually getting it

[tender harness]

And empty your cargo hold

[patent magnet]

if you just 99 to get cape instead of having to get amulet from salvaging

just bring the amulet

skill capes are not meant to be a good, but theyve been in for so long theyll never get reduced to what they should be

100/99

[tender harness]

brother sailors amulet is broken

[patent magnet]

then bring it

wherever you need it

[tender harness]

No fucking nerf it

1 law rune shouldnt give 10 charges

It shouldnt be so close to a bank