game-update

[fringe rivet]

Or maybe, here's an idea

[tender peak]

repair kits, planks, cannonballs and the like

[umbral wind]

how is it at all interesting? sailing back and forth between the same places hundreds and hundreds of times with 0 rewards, imagine there was bonuses for hitting x whirlpools on the way, or making a delivery in x time, literally anything to give it some dynamics

[fringe rivet]

Ball Vouchers

[obsidian venture]

So from 42-99 should be your argument. Then you have to see when you unlock 2 crewmates which I don’t remember off the top

[south void]

I was salvaging since lvl 15 on all my ironmen accounts. Saying you aren't salvaging at all until 42 for the station is incorrect.

[tender peak]

sounds like a horrible valentines day gift

[fringe rivet]

Trade in the Voucher to Iron Bill for C-Balls

[obsidian venture]

It’s not incorrect it’s just you doing something inefficient is all

[fringe rivet]

that way people can stop hoarding Bill's Balls

[obsidian venture]

It’s ideal to salvage when you unlock the station on the boat. You can also just do so beforehand at diminished rates

Which you did

[south void]

Your opinion is that having fun playing a game in a way that isn't what you consider efficient is wrong because it's an option?

[hard axle]

holy hell

ur salvaging BEFORE 42???

jesus christ

[obsidian venture]

What

[tender peak]

isn't iron bill locked behind a hard 50 sailing req?

[hard axle]

that's like... 60 fucking salvages u have to cart back to the port

each time

[tender peak]

and port tasks are introduced to you at level 1

like you have to do one for the quest

[hard axle]

unless ur 1.5t salvaging, which isn't what we're talking about

[south void]

Your initial statement was this. "Regardless of xp it’s 30 min afk"

[fringe rivet]

eh, bronze balls are cheap and plentiful until then

but I see your point

Point is, Port Tasks need to reward us something

[placid ridge]

Do we have any idea when todays blog post is suppose to come out?

[tender peak]

oh yeah absolutely

the coins are a pity present

[fringe rivet]

I'll probably do some anyways for the chance at Soup, but still

[hard axle]

i wouldn't even commit to salvaging pre-55 if ur going the crewmate 30 minute afk special

[plain crag]

The reward is the friends we make along the way

[hard axle]

xp just outright doubles

[tender peak]

might put together a game suggestion for that after I finish my current stuff for the combat rework

[hard axle]

however, post changes

[fringe rivet]

I'm not bothering with suggestions for now cuz everyone is to focused on the exp changes rn

[obsidian venture]

Inserting fun into the convo is also dumb. No one gives a fuck for what you find fun. You’re tryna argue from 15-99 when it’s highly suggested to start from 42 on. I’m also specifically talking about 30 min afk from when you unlock 2 crewmates

[south void]

Have you already lost the conversation point. Salvaging whether you consider it "inefficient" personally, does not disuade from the fact that it's available from lvl 15-99. That does not mean it's fully afkable for 30 full minutes until you reach the sailing level and boat upgrades to be able to do so. That was my entire premise of what I was saying.

[hard axle]

its super meh to just sort salvaging

[fringe rivet]

https://discordapp.com/channels/324132423636090880/1445636900009414777
Like I made this right before the nerfs and woops, that was a bad idea

[obsidian venture]

Salvaging is still afk even without 2 crewmates, it’s just not uninterrupted

[fringe rivet]

gets overshadowed by current events

[hidden valve]

if you stretch the meaning of afk, sure it's afk

[obsidian venture]

People consider redwoods afk when you’re still clicking a log when the previous one is cut

Yet it’s afk

[south void]

The issue he's having is not understanding the length of afk is significantly less now including lower levels not just the higher levels

[hidden valve]

yes but you are also talking about 30minute afks - generally people conflate the 2, even though both of which got gutted xp wise

[obsidian venture]

Yes I’m disagreeing that it was cut

[fringe rivet]

30 minutes of afk lets me take a shower

or walk the dog

or vacuum and mop the floors

or do laundry

or... anything else

[obsidian venture]

30 min of afk is still insane compared to anything “afk” in game

[meager flame]

its 55

[gritty frigate]

How much longer for the OSRS team to revert the sailing nerfs

[obsidian venture]

Ty

[meager flame]

and honestly i wouldn't really salvage until like 53 probably

[fringe rivet]

during leagues, I would afk mining pure essence

[hidden valve]

yeah it was very strong, but its a new skill so they can set w/e precedent they want

[fringe rivet]

or afk karabwans

[obsidian venture]

For sure

But they clearly don’t want 30m afk for 90k

[meager flame]

then your net relevant upgrades are 60 and 85 for the level 4 crewmates

next*

[obsidian venture]

If it’s 5 min afk then maybe

[fringe rivet]

salvage xp should be like, 50-60% of courier run xp

for how low-effort it is

[hidden valve]

yeah thats fine, but they added 4 nerfs at the same time that compounded and decimated salvaging across the board apart from 1.5t. Then set drop rates at 1/20k which irons want to go for

clearly people will be annoyed

[hard axle]

no, the true afk rate BEFORE/AFTER the nerf for 30 minute/2 npc salvaging afk was 60/40k, which is still miles better than some of the other existing rates

[meager flame]

i think their numbers do what they thought they would do aside from the increased downtime

[obsidian venture]

The drop rates are another discussion but yes it’s bad

[meager flame]

i think the downtime was an accident

[south void]

I click once on demon tears for 35 full minutes of afk and 5k/hr wcing xp. Just because you don't agree with that, it's available as an option in the game. The same can be said for salvaging. The update ruined the afk-ness of the activity and no, you cannot click once to fully salvage and sort for 30 minutes.

[meager flame]

so that like ~10% of the exp is probably coming back

[hard axle]

anyone who brings up extractor usage for "afk" will have their balls whacked

[meager flame]

then they'll make whatever adjustments probably

[main kestrel]

its never been 90khr 30min thats crazy your cargo wouldnt even hold that much xp if you had the ideal uptime

[hasty shard]

why tf do i get no xp mining coal wtf jagex

[fringe rivet]

it doesn't take long to sort

[south void]

Everyone can agree extractor isn't even apart of the conversation as Jagex was going to remove it anyways.

[hidden valve]

your cargo usually capped at like ~110-130 merchant salvages if you let yourself afk log

[fringe rivet]

and personally, I just bank my salvage

[hasty shard]

insanely intensive 1 click tab out

[fringe rivet]

it takes me 3 minutes to go to port, bank, and go back

[small anvil]

You used it when salvaging after the afk kinda but that's only 5 mins per 40 or so

[hasty shard]

ngl theres probably some watchdog plugin to force focus other tabs after you click 😭

[fringe rivet]

It's actually faster for me to bank my salvage than it is it sort it

[small anvil]

When sorting*

[hidden valve]

there's a screen flash one for it

[obsidian venture]

I don’t mind whatever option you choose. I’m just saying you’re complaining about the length of afk. You’re own argument for demon tears shows it’s not about the xp/hr when in fact that’s what everyone is pissed off about

[meager flame]

just thinking about that idk if i believe it ngl

[hard axle]

you can even make the argument that the **truest**afk method is actually quick dropping the salvage, which would make it 50k/hr/30k/hr before/after changes, which is still NUTS for 30 minute afk.

[fringe rivet]

I'll just sort it in Uank later, 2 tiles away from a sortnig station

[fringe rivet]

give it a shot man

[south void]

That's what others are pissed off about, that's not what I am pissed off about. You are putting their opinions onto mine.

[hasty shard]

i literally cant think of longer afk methods still besides infected roots

which are at least like 5k/h unironically

[hard axle]

yep

that's what technically it should be lmao

[hasty shard]

nmz needs you to click back every 20 minutes or so

[small anvil]

Combats are 20 min right

[hard axle]

it should be an exponential decline

[fringe rivet]

It's actually faster to bank sorted salvage at Uank, cuz you can just click the "bank everything" button

[meager flame]

its not even the distance travelled even though that is a thing

[hasty shard]

but man this is a whole hour 😭

[hard axle]

yep, its like 75k/hr vs 230k/hr

[obsidian venture]

Perhaps but there’s a lot of chatting to go through

[hard axle]

afk vs active

[meager flame]

its the part where you have to get off the boat and unload im assuming over 200 cargo

28 at a time

[hasty shard]

if im insanely pedantic i can say even longer with worse hooks and less crew

[south void]

I can agree some are upset because they want better afk exp. That's not the only issue or pain point in the conversations we are having as a whole. As a whole, the mechanics of salvaging were fine as there were before the update. Extractor, XP rates, and player laziness aside, they changed the core mechanics of how it was before and that's the part that I disagree with.

[meager flame]

then get back on the ship

[hard axle]

and people have bitched and moaned about nmz for DECADES

[fringe rivet]

you.... don't know?

@meager flame I'm going to show you something really, really helpful

[umbral pumice]

So are we getting that update today or ...

[hasty shard]

theres a right click option on your crew at the port to bank all cargo iirc

[meager flame]

yeah i know but like

oh sorry

im talking about when you clean it

[hidden valve]

now you mention it, yeah the bank all cargo option should be removed. It is too player friendly

[small anvil]

What's the closest bank to salvage station

[meager flame]

like you've gotta be wasting time right?

[fringe rivet]

there's a bank next to most salvage stations

[small anvil]

Or do you use bank boat

[sharp cave]

Its rather funny how hard of a 180 thia update has done

[meager flame]

yeah but like

[south void]

If lvl 48, Ruins of Unkah

[meager flame]

the only time save is when you pull out 28 vs like

idk

[fringe rivet]

2 tiles

[sharp cave]

Its also rather funny how easy it is for them to do a 180 again

[tidal lark]

when are they going to add the ability to club seals

[hasty shard]

theres a deposit box at every port pretty much

[meager flame]

24 or whatever that you would've been doing on your ship

[small anvil]

Thanks I didn't really sort on land so I have no idea

[sharp cave]

We will see if they do it or not I guess

[fringe rivet]

Khazard is like, 5 tiles

[meager flame]

like

[plain crag]

Post is up

[hasty shard]

salvaging without the boat facility would 100% need a crate like trawling

[south void]

Barracuda salvage where at lvl 48 sailing, the salvage spot, dock, bank, and salvage table are all within 50 tiles. I'd like to at least see more salvage areas setup as nicely as this area was appropriate to sailing lvl and progress in regards to them stating the on-boat salvaging station was a last minute add-in.

[fringe rivet]

anyways, lets see how long it takes for me to bank my salvage

[meager flame]

basically im questioning how banking the salvage is really helping you

[fringe rivet]

I'm getting the timer out

it's so I can do it later and get full loot to

[small anvil]

Easier than dropping would be the case for it I guess

[south void]

Well, the real question is if you want the resources or clogs or not.

[meager flame]

nah hes sorting it eventually

its just adding in the loop of sailing there and back

to the sorting process

[small anvil]

Gets to bank everything I guess

[south void]

Banking may be faster than dropping also depending if you are using crewmate or not and how close the bank is.

[hasty shard]

oh my diddly they actually reverted xp

im eating a metaphorical shoe

[meager flame]

lets see what they said

[small anvil]

Lol wait

It was that drastic

1/3

Lol

[obsidian venture]

Link it

[meager flame]

and yes the nerf was wild

[small anvil]

I didn't look at numbers

[sharp cave]

Wow so i guess its fine now

Lol

Now we just need them to fix combat and look at dragon parts drop rates

[small anvil]

So was it just a buff?

[analog crow]

? Link pls

[small anvil]

Besides extractor nerf

[obsidian venture]

It’s not in #game-news ?

[worthy hazel]

https://secure.runescape.com/m=news/an-update-on-the-sailing-xp-review?oldschool=1

It's real

[main kestrel]

ok suggestions are relieving

[obsidian venture]

Ty

[hasty shard]

this almost gave me a heart attack 😭

that not is carrying a mountain on its back

[hard axle]

Increase the number of active shipwrecks by 1 at each hotspot.

[meager flame]

okay i actually think they're doing everything i wanted them to do when it comes to how to change the exp

[hard axle]

Jagex, please make sorting salvages viable for pet rolls, ty

[sharp cave]

I still think that the better solution to crew salvage exp rates is not to nerf their exp but instead, make is so they go afk themselves after 10 mins and your character has to click on them to get the going

[fringe rivet]

@meager flame Tested it, took me 3 minutes 40 seconds to bank my cargo and go back

[sharp cave]

"Oi, jobless jim! Stop slacking!"

[tall yarrow]

They pretend this is a buff but in the end still a nerf to salvaging

[south void]

Welcome back, they posted the blog update 😉

[sharp cave]

It needed a nerf? It was too strong. This is now reasonable

[stark moss]

yeah as a working dad I agree it needed a nerf

[fringe rivet]

damn, I must have wrapped into the future

[meager flame]

yeah that part i actually kind of believed the part that i wasn't sure about was actually me kind of misreading what you were saying

[south void]

https://osrs.game/Sailing-XP-Changes-Update

[sharp cave]

Really wish they buffed the cannon drop rate thought

Seems so silly

[winter hearth]

This is an option available to us if our tests tomorrow result in it overperforming - but that's one for us to evaluate once we're testing bits!

[hard axle]

https://tenor.com/view/lizard-lizard-lizard-button-lizard-tom-the-lizard-pixar-gif-17194109322617058326

pet rolls on sorting salvaging when

[winter hearth]

Also a consideration as part of a wider drop rate discussion, and is something that we would've offered today were we not also making salvaging quicker and keen to see where it shakes out

[stark moss]

pretty sure combat is a whole thing they are planning to rework

[tall yarrow]

should be buffed more
Get 99 quickly and then never train this again

[meager flame]

overall though i think that you guys actually did listen and did everything you reasonably could have to meet the feedback in the middle

[winter hearth]

Also on our list to chat about, just trying to work on the bigger issues surrounding XP atm

[obsidian venture]

Appreciate the change

[echo trail]

ayy they fixed the stuff! well tomorrow i guess

[wind cobalt]

Thx @winter hearth

[hidden valve]

drop rate wise, is there any plans on that front? Some of them are absurd

[meager flame]

they do talk about having that discussion after this

[sharp cave]

Nice, thanks for the communication that its actually under consideration, defenitly eases my mind a little

[south void]

Thanks for listening and appreciate you popping in!

[obsidian venture]

It def leads into a bigger convo on where you want afk to be in this game and the rates/effort

[winter hearth]

Part of a wider discussion we need to have, just more pressing issues at the moment

[ancient nebula]

Thank god, hail jagex

[frozen lion]

what about exploring whole world charting with crystal extractor? its nerfed as hell

[small anvil]

Do you mean vs other methods?

[hard axle]

ty ty

[radiant wasp]

So when will this go into effect?

[small anvil]

Cuz it does roll on sort

[echo trail]

for everyone else- i am using this time before they fix salvaging to get my sea charting done!

[hard axle]

yeah, sorting salvages has no pet rolls atm

[reef shale]

Thank you, this is Exactly what we asked for 🫡 great recovery on this one Jagex

[small anvil]

That can't be right

[fringe rivet]

Hello Goblin

[meager flame]

this is actually very strange to me because honestly

[fringe rivet]

still reading it rn

[meager flame]

i think people should roll a pet if they're getting exp basically in all circumstances

[hazy linden]

You guys did good with sailing . There’s no reason y’all had to kill the skill after 3 years of dev work all within 2 weeks .

[meager flame]

and thats generally how most pets work

[small anvil]

Did Jake get it fishing or sorting

[meager flame]

and when they dont its usually more of an accident

[hard axle]

yah

it should be all sailing xp drops tbh

[small anvil]

Zaena iron got it from sorting they said

[frozen lion]

charting with crystal excavator is nowhere near as satisfying now, you should increase charting xp

[small anvil]

But no screenshot

[hard axle]

likely salvaged

by themselves

[small anvil]

Do you mean crew salvage you sort?

[hard axle]

crewmates salvaging + sorting not proven

[small anvil]

Oh

I don't think they have a different item

For crew obtained vs player

[hasty shard]

has zaena like shown the pet drop screencap idr

[fringe rivet]

@winter hearth Has the idea of allowing the extractor to only charge during boat movement been discussed?

[small anvil]

They don't have auto screenshot but I trust them

Charging during boat movement sounds too technically challenging

[fringe rivet]

I think it'd be fine if they include an exception for Trials

[small anvil]

And requires overhead

[frozen lion]

nerfed xp on crystal extractor and only during movement? woah there bud

[fringe rivet]

well the idea originally was only during movement before the exp nerf

[ornate sierra]

The broken dragon hook droprates must be broken 😄

[winter hearth]

It has been discussed yeah, just the point around 'we don't want to do too many things at once and make life harder for ourselves' from the blog holds true here

[analog crow]

@winter hearth today's changes fix a lot of the issues imo
Thanks for listening!

I wish we were let in the loop before the changes went live, I think that would have made the feedback much less emotional

[austere pike]

Crystal extractor should only give 10xp and every activity after level 73 sailing gets its xp buffed

[fringe rivet]

Fair enough. I'm sure the office has been very stressed and you guys want to approach things carefully from here on out

[placid ridge]

Props for the timely damage control, look forward to sailing tomorrow

[frozen lion]

i have so much charting to do i wanted to do with crystal extractor, now this seems disappointing to do

[silver rain]

Tomorrows update is a huge Win, keeps super afk xp low and rewards active salvagers close to what we were getting! surely we are all happy with this! 😄

[weak lichen]

Holy shit I did not expect such a swift turn around and fix from the team. That's actually so relieving.

The only feedback is please just be more transparent next time about expected changes. Like we gonna nerf the extractor. BUT WAIT FROM THE TOP ROPE ITS THE WHOLE SKILL

[fringe rivet]

Well since you're here Imma drop this idea here for crew member passives
https://discordapp.com/channels/324132423636090880/1445636900009414777

[frozen lion]

someone takes ur 10$ and gives u back 5$ and ur happy? 🤔

[onyx pasture]

Okay, after reading through the update; not a bad set of changes and seems to more appropriately target the super afk salvaging path

[worthy hazel]

Mandatory, when will these be implemented? 🙂

[tacit galleon]

just nerf the extractor working while ur stationary and leave salvage exp and crew alone with the current fixes without the nerfs.

no one asked for a salvaging nerf besides random dudes on reddit.

still feels like now having 80+ sailing is pointless if the dudes with deckhandiness 4 give me less that half the xp when they were already barely 70%. some of us have jobs and not only that our own character doesn't auto salvage when the salvage area goes up or down so im losing exp there too. like idc bout the boost from the extractor but the average joe with a job gets nerfed exp rates i dont understand

[obsidian venture]

Tmrw

[silver rain]

Its all about balance, the main issue was the crystal extractor, that has been dealt with (in a way)...

[analog crow]

Yeah being let in on what the team is thinking before changes go live would be good

[strange idol]

Still no word on UIM cargo changes?

[hasty shard]

it'll be so funny if the crewmate nerf on hooks also nerfs trawler net xp

[frozen lion]

well tbh only courier task seems to get buff, everything else got nerf in the end

[fringe rivet]

The only thing I'd really want to be "different", to align with the whole xp vs reward philosophy, is to get more XP from on-land sorting compared to on-boat sorting, since boat sorting encourages more afk

[silver rain]

plus to keep a semi afk method at a reasonably high xp rate i think is good

[small anvil]

Hmm overall gonna be getting more salvage in now right

Slightly less XP slightly more salvage processed

From pre change

[analog crow]

I'm gonna salvage so hard now

[brazen tundra]

abuse early now

[silver rain]

they are bringing gwenith back to the XP people were previously getting ish, i would of loved for it to stay as it was pre nerf dont get me wrong, but im happy with the rebalance coming tomorrow

gotta take what we can get lol

[frozen lion]

anyone would be happy to get even part of what was taken instead of nothing, its still not good though

[fringe rivet]

I wish the trials actually hurt your boat. It's weird only the first trial hurts it and has a cost to doing so

[frozen lion]

id rather have fully afk activity gets punished more than crystal extractor which was used with combo with all other methods as well

[wind cobalt]

read

[hasty shard]

1 hour afk being buffed 💪

[rich jasper]

@winter hearth Thank the team for being willing to admit their mistake. These new changes are more than fair. Fully afk gets nerfed but actively we get to keep close to the same rates. W

[radiant wasp]

Lmfao alright cool guy

[silver rain]

true but then again 1 click every 90seconds for 600xp is still mad, even if i loved it

[gray crown]

30min afk should be the same xp no? we were not clicking extractor every minute anyways only sorting

[hard axle]

look at the npc nerf

[silver rain]

less xp no? the crew mates are getting xp drops

[hard axle]

it'll be the same as it is now

[tacit galleon]

yea ur losing 30% even if they are on it now when they change it

[small anvil]

It shifted XP from crew to cleaning

[ancient otter]

@winter hearth now please fix the flick box coming that got changed behind the black trials on marlin with whatever adjustment was made to maneuverability.

[hard axle]

30-40k fully afk is still pretty good, especially if they're offering to add the cargo hold destroy.

[fringe rivet]

Honestly my biggest gripe is how Port Tasks are supposed to be the bread butter, but the gains from salvage are to good in comparision

[small anvil]

I want to pay my crew in the trash items

[frozen lion]

they could always make boat moving load extractor faster, would make it better for active people and less xp for fully afkers

[small anvil]

Let each crew have a designated item they take from you

[fringe rivet]

where do you think all the d-cannons are going?

[wind cobalt]

jenkins gets all the dupe mouldy dolls

[small anvil]

Crew shrinkage strikes again

[dawn jackal]

listen to yourself you are embarassing to be in the same community with

[glossy compass]

Please consider adding salvors paint to the other higher shipwrecks, fremmy or merchant. Makes no sense its only on 1 specific shipwreck especially considering its super rare @pallid gorge

[tacit galleon]

slap in the face really

[meager flame]

yeah i feel like the people that would go for a paint should be the people doing what im doing for a dragon cannon barrel

and i should be killing some kind of sea boss or something

for the barrel

lol

[small anvil]

? I'm totally fine with that

[sharp cave]

Man that random dude called goblin is gonna be confused why he's getting pinged about the paint drop rate

[fringe rivet]

I do find it kind of weird you only get the paint from 1 type of wreckage while Angler's you can get from all

[brazen tundra]

I want my 30min afk back no nerf please jagex

[frozen lion]

I think extractor loading faster with boat moving would seriously balance it, less xp for afk, more xp for active swimming, instead of same charging speed for all

[ember token]

We can confirm that a variety of items are bugged, causing them to drop more frequently than intended.

lol

[small anvil]

Feathers and stuff

[meager flame]

im actually kinda confused about that

[small anvil]

I guess

[meager flame]

how are drop rates bugged exactly

did they have to invent a new drop mechanic

[small anvil]

The intended rates were lower I guess

[meager flame]

you'd think that of all things would just be plug and play

[south void]

https://www.reddit.com/r/2007scape/comments/1pdv5o8/comment/ns8rspb/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button

[small anvil]

If you man mechanically

[fringe rivet]

Ray Barbs were bugged to be 1/16, but were supposed to be 1/100

[south void]

Read the above ^

[meager flame]

yeah mechanically like

[south void]

For everyone wondering "how the drop rates were bugged" Mod Goblin stated how and why in that post.

[meager flame]

how does that occur basically

[fringe rivet]

spaghetti

[south void]

"Have already been making a bunch of notes on peoples' thoughts more broadly on drop rates to talk through with the team, but wanted to quickly jump on the point around some of the blogged numbers being incorrect!

Those numbers came directly from developer tickets and these posts are proof-read by developers, but in this specific instance there are a handful of drops that are rolling twice (or otherwise bugged) rather than the stated roll, meaning there are a number of items that are considerably more common than we'd anticipated. While this is technically a bug with a handful of items, we're not looking to make any changes to the actual in-game rates yet beyond tidying up the code so that they match the rates players are experiencing - for anything in the blog that feels off, the Wiki will be closer to reality." -Mod Goblin on Reddit #game-update message

[meager flame]

unless they have to do something on the items end when they're adding it in and someone maybe didn't know how to use whatever they do

and just made the same error over and over bc they thought that was correct

which is super possible

[small anvil]

Wiki more accurate than the devs is funny though

[fringe rivet]

same reason great whites weren't dropping keel parts

[languid tundra]

So basically at merchant ships theyre removing 60xp from your crew catches, and adding 61xp to the sorting of the salvage, or am I working this out wrong lol

[south void]

Actual realtime test samples, vs. coded rates.

[worthy compass]

Next time just play test your exp changes instead of spreadsheet goooping. This is a live game. You don’t paper trade the same way you trade with real money. A very concerning mistake on your part jmods

[meager flame]

basically yes

while also fixing the spawning situation

so thats where the 10% uplift comes from

[small anvil]

Yeah the better uptime is gonna be huge

[weak lichen]

If I could roll crates like WT when finishing a port task I would be in heaven

[narrow folio]

How are merchant salvage rates now with self salvaging?

[echo trail]

this def fixes the issues that they broke - as someone who active salvages this should be good

[narrow folio]

So overall its like a 20k xp nerf from before? So what, 90k an hour?

[small anvil]

Higher salvage throughput tho which is good for irons looking for barrel

[narrow folio]

Including extractor

[brazen tundra]

Can we get 60k hr at shooting stars cause it’s not as afk as sailing ?

[meager flame]

i think everyone should be happy with it basically to some degree

it will be better for everyone tomorrow than it is today

[fringe rivet]

to some degree

[meager flame]

maybe not as good as it was but

[small anvil]

The hard afk will still be sad

But it was over tuned in that way anyway

[stark moss]

I mean let's be real it was too good for an afk

[meager flame]

yeah it'll be like ~42k

[narrow folio]

95% of prenerf rates is basically the same but extractor basically got cut in half

[gray crown]

we should actually

[fringe rivet]

I still think salvage rewards to much for the amount of effort compared to courier, but whatever, one step at a time

[tacit galleon]

how bout they make it where we can auto start salvaging like the npcs

[small anvil]

Lol

People will ask for anything until they're asking to buy maxed accounts

[echo trail]

i mean... we shouldnt be happy haha , as someone who works in tech, if we break something and then fix it.... the customer just returns to baseline.... we can be happy when a good improvement or optimzation happens

[worthy compass]

There is actually some pretty afk 60k per hour mining methods now post sailing

[gray crown]

only reward sailing has is xp, all drops are trash

[narrow folio]

Guess ill have to self test

[small anvil]

There's money in salvage

Literal gp

[tacit galleon]

if ur a normie

[small anvil]

And plat

[fringe rivet]

more gp than courier runs will ever give lmao

[spring moss]

Revert everything to pre nerf

[gray crown]

like what 200k gp/hr?

[main kestrel]

👀 26m coins from the mercenary alchs omw to salvor

[small anvil]

Lol the hard afkers spend more effort complaining about salvage than actually playing the game

[spring moss]

XP rates never needed a nerf in the first place

[fringe rivet]

yes they did lmao

[spring moss]

Why?

[tacit galleon]

maybe the extractor for sure

[spring moss]

Certainly not

[small anvil]

Hard afk was over tuned for sure

It was the fact that regular players got collaterally hit that was the issue

[fringe rivet]

crystal extractor does and still makes you feel like a clicker monkey

[meager flame]

sailing is just gonna be the most interesting skill in the world for awhile

just wait until they finally make an island where everyone wants to be

[gray crown]

sorry for not wanting to do water sepulcre and and tick manipulation

[meager flame]

and then people realize they have to have a sailing level for it

[fringe rivet]

and salvaging has to little effort for the amount of exp you get compared to other training methods

we may as well build oil rigs at these salvage spots

[meager flame]

and they're gonna have to do it because like

if they weren't going to make cool places to sail to

[small anvil]

Paying attention and salvaging is the same

[meager flame]

they wouldn't make the skill lol

[dawn jackal]

the tick manipulation comments make me laugh every time

[acoustic robin]

The only reason I really have been touching sailing is because it potentially locks content with how they limit island access by sailing level

[dawn jackal]

JAGEx forced me to put the knife on the log!

[fringe rivet]

if anything having on-board sorting is busted

[dawn jackal]

i had NO other options!!!

[fringe rivet]

you never have to leave

[dawn jackal]

Tick manipulation for 11 minutes gave me RSI!!!

[worthy compass]

On board sorting should have its tick rate slowed IMO

[small anvil]

Kinda reminds me of apm talk related to starcraft

[spring moss]

Are they going to address the abysmal drop rates?

[small anvil]

People will come up with all sorts of things to justify not trying

[dawn jackal]

there are legitimate wrist stress issues they will almost certianly not be caused by doing 3t salvaging and if it hurts your wrist dont do it?

[small anvil]

You can do port tasks

[dawn jackal]

It seems so obvious lol

[small anvil]

You can salvage and pay attention for basically the same XP

[tacit galleon]

i mean if ur trying hard on 2 accs and then get a huge nerf to almost all aspects that arnt uber eats or boatgility yea i can see why are upset

[small anvil]

It's hard afk that got nerfed and that's it basically

[acoustic robin]

don't particularly like the trials, think port tasks are too unrewarding, combat is meh, want to do trawling at some point; salvaging is nice and relatively chill which I appreciate tbh

[small anvil]

It's not a huge nerf if you look at your screen once every 15 s

[dawn jackal]

this is already just a false statement you aren't "trying hard" by salvaging

[gray crown]

?????? everything was nerfed?????????????

[worthy compass]

You clearly didn’t salvage post nurf

[small anvil]

Did you not see the recent update?

[tacit galleon]

salvging actively without an extractor on 1 acc while doing gwenith marlin on the other

[small anvil]

Theyre reverting cleaning

[languid tundra]

So basically at merchant ships they're removing 60xp from your crew catches, and adding 61xp to the sorting of the salvage, at fremmy ships they're removing 48.6xp from crew catches and adding 43xp back to sorting xp, but they're fixing the active shipwrecks issue too and putting your own salvage rate down to 4 ticks from 5 ticks

[meager flame]

i mean they were going to nerf

[small anvil]

And they left the increased success

[meager flame]

this is just the way better version of them doing that

[main kestrel]

1.5 and then sorting a full cargo will be nice vs 1.5 dropping no breakss

[languid tundra]

Did remove a good chunk of the crew catches though, but still overall it should be a nice slight buff to rates

[humble granite]

when is the sailing changes getting reverted?

[echo trail]

tomorrow

[main kestrel]

no promises but trying for tomorrow

[small anvil]

Let's revert the revert!

[austere mulch]

with particular attention being drawn the the recently shared drop rates and whether or not they feel fair fr

the the

[small anvil]

To the I guess?

[meager flame]

some of that let me type while i talk or read something else

[austere mulch]

Buffed the shipwreck issue, even.

Instead of 60% of them being up before the changes, it’ll be 75% at any given time

W

[narrow folio]

I hope if they nerf extractor even more, the xp wont just disappear lol

[small anvil]

Uh it'll be 66% on individual but with guaranteed double

It's higher

[austere mulch]

4/6 u right idk why i was thinking 3/4

Still a buffer

[small anvil]

Really it's 1-(2/6x1/5)

[weak lichen]

Ok with like 3k/hr so 50xp per click bc some xp is nice to see to know that it worked during a trial

[meager flame]

i mean the extractors future i think is kind of obvious

they're going to hopefully delete all of its exp within reason outside of a very small token amount

and then find an active part of the gameplay to put it back into

thats just a lot of extra work for today

[small anvil]

Vs 1-(2/5x1/4)

So it's basically 14/15 uptime from 9/10?

[austere mulch]

With 4t salvage and higher catch rate, I’m prob gonna just hit the extractor when sorting ngl

Is it just the player going back to 4t or is crew also

[small anvil]

Well that assumes random actually which it isn't

Ya I turned my extractor off being 99 lol

[languid tundra]

Uhhhh, Idk if this is a old bug or not but my boat literally just teleported to port sarim from prif lmfao

[sturdy wolf]

i really like the proposed changes atm tbh. means that the 100% complete afk will be still overall worse - which is kinda good since it was quite bonkers lol, but less moving/world hopping either needed. and if you are actually active with your own hook etc. youll get nearly the same exp rates as before

[eager flax]

did these changes go through today?

[meager flame]

tomorrow if things go well

[eager flax]

hopefully

[sturdy wolf]

"To be clear, we're aiming for these changes go live in-game tomorrow (Friday, December 5th) as early as possible, but we may need additional time depending on your feedback and how our internal testing goes."

[narrow folio]

hope they like, buff salvaging player rates or something again in turn because tanking another xp loss for nothing doesnt seem good

[small anvil]

They did?

[meager flame]

they probably would put it on the player salvage if they nerf the extractor again

[small anvil]

They left the success rate up and moved back to 4t

[meager flame]

although they have to be careful

they need to also make sure they don't go too far and then make people drop salvage again

so it might have to get split between them

[fringe rivet]

as long as the future nerfs are slow and one at a time while giving us bits of new content here and there, I think the hoards will be calm

[small anvil]

No way, 2 successive nerfs will have people screaming

[fringe rivet]

and by new content I mean rewards for port tasks

[fringe rivet]

that's why you gotta give them the carrot from time to time

[austere mulch]

Combat first pls

Add cannonballs to port task rewards and call it a day ezpz

[heavy ledge]

I’m upset I don’t get to be upset /s

[fringe rivet]

combat is not something easily fixed

[meager flame]

i do think they should get to drop rates and combat like yesterday

they're working on things they should be working on but like

[fringe rivet]

Evolution of Cannons will take time

[sturdy wolf]

this is the only table you need to look. The current nerf is good imo, its not ideal in the end ig, but better overall perhaps, since the 100% afk with 2 crewmates WAS semi strong lol.

[meager flame]

that whole topic needs help lol

[austere mulch]

Combat can be significantly improved though even without a huge revamp

[meager flame]

plus its probably way more fun for jagex to talk about

because its basically gonna have to be all buffs everyone will cheer for

if they do anything

[sturdy wolf]

so the 100% afk with 2-crewmates will get about 10% exp buff and you need to move/hop less cus of the increased spawns. which is good. and self salvaging will be almost as good as it was with the OG rates.

[narrow folio]

Yeah that would be a buff, but im saying they still didnt compensate for nerfing extractor. If you compare rates without extractor to before its basically the same

But extractor still got cut with nothing in return

[fringe rivet]

honestly ship sorting should be inferior to land sorting

[small anvil]

It's 95% with extractor accounted for

According to their numbers

[desert granite]

[narrow folio]

Its with accounted for? Hold on

[hasty shard]

you pinged a random guy and not mod goblin 😭

[narrow folio]

Nevermind

[meager flame]

sooki with the scrongle

[small anvil]

Is that the marni? The clogger extrordinaire

[narrow folio]

5% nerf isnt the end of the world i guess

[small anvil]

It's totally reasonable for active

"active"

[austere mulch]

Remove or improve crew scaling
Remove or improve normal combat damage scaling
More cannonballs per resource used to create
Slightly increase LOS for cannons (roughly 1/2 tile is even great)
Add minimum hit to dragon cannon that scales with cannonball type (eg. 5 with dragon, 3 with rune, 2 with addy, 1 with Mithril/granite, 0 with reset)

• potentially the hardest one, add smart targeting for crew where they will only try to attack something you’re attacking if it’s within their LOS, otherwise they’ll keep hitting current target or remain idle

Bam, instant improvement to combat

[small anvil]

Click once per minute

Then a bit of dropping

[narrow folio]

I misread "do" into "dont"

[small anvil]

Restart the eyes plugin

[narrow folio]

Meanwhile deep sea fishing got dumpstered

[fringe rivet]

and now you just threw dwarf cannon c-ball economy into a mess

[austere mulch]

How, but also lol

[eager flax]

isnt deep sea fishing like 50k sailing and fishing an hour? plus having insane food

[fringe rivet]

"More cannonballs per resource used to create "

currently it's 4 c-balls per 1 steel bar

[dawn jackal]

should be back to like 120k / hr

pretty crazy for something that is akin to chopping willow trees

[austere mulch]

Isn’t it a different mould for ship cannonballs

[hasty shard]

no

[fringe rivet]

nope

[austere mulch]

💀

[fringe rivet]

balance is hard

[hasty shard]

with a rosewood hull
that is over a 100m investment

[fringe rivet]

that's why guthix struggles so much

[restive siren]

when i did it prenerf it was like 30k fishing 45k sailing so with extractor nerf probably 30/30

[narrow folio]

Personally I didnt put an extra crew on to salvage while i was sorting

[eager flax]

gotcha, i havent gotten to it yet but thats a little low for sure

[hasty shard]

black chinchompas give an insane weapon yet are best hunter xp

vyres/elves give like 200k/h and good gp

sepulchre

[narrow folio]

And they nerfed crew rates, so relatively speaking i think im losing out on less now by not doing it

[austere mulch]

They should’ve just never added 87 cannonballs but either way, dwarf cannonball economy is a meme imo

[restive siren]

yeah it should be the worst method but like at least 50/50 seems fair

[narrow folio]

Yeahh an active method like that being beneath salvaging seems wrong

[eager flax]

when i first heard of it i was hoping it would be a low xp but high rate of fish kinda method

[hasty shard]

like most skills have high gp high xp options lol

its such a weird design philosophy currently, it did not work for infernal shale

[eager flax]

like if you really want you can fish sharks with trawling and get way more per hour but absolute shit xp

[dawn jackal]

most don't really, its kinda only black chins

[eager flax]

at least the fish are great though

[dawn jackal]

and even then if you wanna get in the weeds they are no longer the best hunter training

[eager flax]

bluefin seems like craaazy good food

[dawn jackal]

seph you lose 20k xp /hr or so looting

[hasty shard]

isnt sep like 2m gp/h no looting

[dawn jackal]

i don't believe so anymore rings are cheap

but yea you do make money unlike any other form of agility i suppose thats true

[hasty shard]

mining you can do zalcano and still get uniques/shards
woodcutting is eh but you might get a decent amount of gp from sawmill vouchers
farming is farming
rc i dont think i need to explain, although i think aether runes are pretty good xp/gp
cooking has moonlight antelopes for decent gp iirc

as i said thieving has vyres/elves which are p good

theres not a whooole lot of good skilling moneymakers that also don't give decent xp

[dawn jackal]

yea but none of those are the best xp - almost always for the best xp you are sacrificing gp

[hasty shard]

they also dont need an over 100m gp investment

like 100m+ gp is JUST the hull, not including nets keel etc.

i dont mean this snarkily but did i imply it should be best xp or did someone else xd

like i think it should probably be about 80k fishing xp/h max personally

[austere mulch]

Maybe if they made oath shards untradeable which should’ve been the obvious choice, shale wouldve been worthwhile and oath wouldve held value longer

[dawn jackal]

no maybe i misread

i was typing just to see myself type

turns out

[hasty shard]

just man we get stuff like shark bait added to the game and its like
for who

[small anvil]

Cloggers

Moon key hunters

[hasty shard]

what cloggers they nerfed the pet rate 😭

[small anvil]

Isn't it for moon key half

[hasty shard]

i mean kinda

but it also just sucks to get sharks ngl

[small anvil]

Like they're holding value ok

[hasty shard]

and you get them passively from stars anyways

[narrow folio]

I wouldve liked it to be like manta bait and introduce new manta fishing

[hasty shard]

manta nerfs need to be reverted ngl

[small anvil]

Now there's Marlin

Trawling was solid but clicking the net is annoying

But it's so worthwhile to click

[hasty shard]

^

[small anvil]

Like double the fish?

[hasty shard]

it really sucks also considering theres like no deadzone for setting heading

[small anvil]

But then sometimes I'm clicked off and can't raise my net

[hasty shard]

imo you can prop up their value by increasing how much fish offcuts are used

[small anvil]

Cutting Marlins is profit as of yesterday lol

[hasty shard]

so just like, do that if giving it at all reasonable xp would cause it to crater which definitely happened to other skilling methods 100%

wtf i didnt profit cutting squids

why do marlins get to be

[small anvil]

Marlin scales for extended stam

[hasty shard]

jagex smh

[small anvil]

3 per fish

[hasty shard]

rosewood blowpipe is objectively more useful than extended stam

/s

[oblique mesa]

this but without /s

[small anvil]

Double your amylase

[hasty shard]

honestly marlin trawling is the best looking skilling method

boat fishing out in a frozen sea 🔥

and it has a nice flow state but goddd the chafing points

[fossil mural]

WTB a slow afk version of marlin fishing.

[hasty shard]

oh right to say it for like the fifth time if they dont want people training at the shoals to devalue fish why is there a big fish clog for every tier and a 1/16k paint drop

[chilly zealot]

Can someone tell me if the reverts happened already or they just will be reverting it?

[sturdy wolf]

arent the marlin spots hella awkward thou? thers only 2 of them? second one goes near/through vampyre krakens and the second one moves really really fast giving you basically no time to afk/wait?

[fossil mural]

Bad exp, bad fish but don’t make me chase around a fish pod.

[hasty shard]

surprisingly not a ton of damage, just stock up on some repair kits

its through armored krakens i think

granted i wasnt doing the other spot

[sturdy wolf]

from the blog right at the start: "To be clear, we're aiming for these changes go live in-game tomorrow (Friday, December 5th) as early as possible, but we may need additional time depending on your feedback and how our internal testing goes."

[hasty shard]

taking like 20-40 kits probably suffices for an entire holds worth of fish

[chilly zealot]

Ty I'm illiterate and my dog read it for my and skipped that part. Day is saved

[hasty shard]

like giant krill are already 300 gp 😭

[sturdy wolf]

i mean... thats cus the rate to get them with trawling is really fast, so tons of them enter the game - they have no special usage and other food that heal 16-17 HP are all priced already at 148gp-400gp lol so they are just about the same priced

[tidal wren]

anyone got an idea of xp projections for salvaging when update goes live tmrw based on current numbers

[hasty shard]

i thiink its cheaper than monkfish

monkfish are done dirty constantly

why does whisperer drop 1000 of them 😭

like i cannot fathom actually fishing krill as a noob when its only like 100k gp/h

also the shoal runs through tiger sharks because why not

[dusky scroll]

Why do we eve get experience for our slaves… I mean crewmates… doing actions? Take that away and give us full sorting exp

[sturdy wolf]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/433756990989402112/1446199012767305970/image.png?ex=69331d49&is=6931cbc9&hm=907d605e05e14d0355931a2395fca8fd2541521dfc2ea5086a45821e0f4334a5& listed at the blog

so can count from there easily approximately what exp you will get tomorrow then

[limber briar]

atleast tree fiddy

[hearty oak]

Is the new update live??

[tidal wren]

i havent salvaged yet myself was just genuinely curiosu ik it was like 130k pre-update. just was asking cuz im genuinely shocked they actually caved for once on pushing out an xp nerf

i could care less about them reverting it and making shit easier but its kinda funny that they cave on this, a fully AFK method and eyeballing it it still looks faster than every RC training method except lavas and ZMI (just an example ik theres other bad skills 2 that ppl have complained about for ages)

[sturdy wolf]

it was 130k/h if you were actively playing and moving constantly between spots or getting very lucky with world hops. so that you had close to 0 downtime and it wasnt as afk tbh, since you had to be on the hook yourself and clean constantly. I was getting about 50k/h with completely afk and closer to 68k/h with sometimes cleaning 1 inv and clicking the extractor. 110k/h was more common with interacting with the game, so something akin to those rates tomorrow

[azure burrow]

cherry picking one of the slowest xp skills in game to compare it to doesnt seem correct. maybe go in the middle of all skills : )

[sharp cave]

They are already giving us back full sorting exp...

Read the new blog maybe???

[azure burrow]

I CANT READ

[sturdy wolf]

also for this yeah good thing that jagex would want the skill to be good with actual decent exp rates and not a shit skill thats just antifun to train overall with absolutely dogshit exp rates 😂 people wouldnt complain half as much about rc or agility if it was something like 400k/h which you can get in some other skills if you really sweat so yeah.

[tidal wren]

plenty of skills in the game where the best afk methods fall in those ranges. no one trains some of them that way cuz there is usually a way better way to train them but yeah.

[hearty oak]

Oh ok the 5th my bad

Port tasks for now

[tidal wren]

yeah no i agree completely fk the anti-fun skills its just funny to see where things are chosen to be fixed and wheres things are told yeah fk this deal with it

[subtle merlin]

sigh, glad they made some changes back, but really. deckhandy 4 went from 70% to 40%... ouch

[heavy ledge]

Can someone ask Goblin (the mod not that poor guy someone @ed earlier) about this tomorrow cuz I'll prob be asleep when they do the changes https://discord.com/channels/324132423636090880/1443503458253672528

k ty

overall W update imo tho

[sturdy wolf]

i mean... its a new skill, would make sense that not all skills are extremely slow ass shit skills, and granted those skills have been YEARS in the game already, so that would produce a wayyy bigger outcry from the playerbase if jagex suddenly granted blood rc like 3x the exp rates or introduced a new rc method which is more afk than bloods and 2x the exp rates lol... I wouldnt mind something like that since rc is so ass atm imo even with gotr and blood rc but since sailing is completely new i think its good that they tune out the exp rates as quickly as possible to be "decent" and not too OP

[heavy ledge]

They also literally stated beforehand that it should fit in as a "faster" skill to train

[subtle merlin]

i thought the aquanite hopper was supposed to have 2 range str instead of the 1 it has now.

[sturdy wolf]

not a big lore thing or anything tbh - nor do I doubt any actual jmod might answer that but the crystal extractor needs a heart of ithell to be able to be crafted - which says: "The seed of a great fallen ship owned by the Ithell Clan." in the lore the crystal seeds can be sung into things. crystal shards in the game say: "A shard of the finest crystal, from the crystal city itself." the "heart" of a big ship is reasonable enough imo that it can be crafted into the extractor then - which slowly doesnt gather from the air nor from the water itself any crystal shards but we know that crystal seeds can be sung into bigger things - the entire city of priffdinas was a very large crystal seed that was "sung" into the huge city itself

so I assume the extractor is slowly "singing" the heart into making more shards from it - like the heart originally was sung into a large ship. We know also that you can crush crystal weapons into large amounts of crystal shards so we know that all crystal items are made from crystal shards/can be crushed into crystal shards ultimately - so the heart is slowly re-making the ship, but we are greedy bastards and just take the small shards that it makes lol or due to our limited crystal crafting abilities the heart can now only make shards instead of being sung into a larger thing

[heavy ledge]

Alright I can kinda live with that

Still kinda weird you can get it without SOTE but I doubt they'll ever address that

[worthy compass]

Maybe an avenue for crystal gear for skillers?

Sailing 2? A crystal boat

[bronze kernel]

Wiki says shards aren't generated until after SotE.

[heavy ledge]

I meant that you can get the extractor in general and it for some reason doesn't give you shards. If you read my post, it's more clear what I meant sorry

[heavy ledge]

What about the crystal tool seeds?

[keen oak]

Really good job amending xp rates tomorrow (assuming that it goes to plan) but there was no mention of the shadow nerf to sailing combat
The smart pathing of npcs to counter the safe spots means now we still have to do thousands of kc with piss poor dps, but we have to row to a bank chest and back and chew through our repairs kits (which irons have to make themselves) just to try and get the better hook
That really needs to be rolled back until you can at least get a better solution in mind to buff sailing combat for the player

[tender peak]

I was going to say divines should stay locked behind sote but I forgot they're tradeable lmao

[heavy ledge]

And they still are for irons anyways

[bronze kernel]

Just reduce the damage penalty to dealing maybe 50-60% if your full damage.

Especially since it seems the combat is also kind of balanced around your boat HP and stuff

[heavy ledge]

Man I have nothing left to be upset about now lol

[worthy compass]

Afk exp rates still to high

Let’s protest that tomorrow

[heavy ledge]

Not imo

If afk'ers wanna afk let em

[keen oak]

Not sure I fully get what you're saying but yeah I have a sloop that is maxed - dragon/rosewood and I get chewed out by great whites

[heavy ledge]

what's the harm?

[worthy compass]

Nah. Post crewmates exp nurf. The xo rates will be at good place for fully afk

[heavy ledge]

Wait maybe I'm misunderstanding your 1st point. Did you just mean they're too high rn or the proposal is still too high?

[worthy compass]

They are too high until tomorrow 🙂

[heavy ledge]

Gotcha

[thorny kite]

I do wish they reverted the crew mates gather rate though. But if they are gonna increase cannon barrel drop rate then I don’t mind

[tender peak]

sailing combat needs to be changed from the ground up, but honestly I'm fine with waiting a bit for that

Not too long though. Future content should be balanced around the version of it that is fun

[heavy ledge]

There will be a part 2 to sailing but who knows when

[tender peak]

I've seen plenty of different takes on what they could do and I'm even putting together my own right now

it definitely needs to be discussed

[heavy ledge]

But Goblin did say they want to look at that, just more pressing issues rn this was cope, I can't find a message from him saying that lol

[worthy compass]

At sailing release they were pretty open about the fact that sailing combat was not at a good place and that it needed play testing ingame to be able to fix

[keen oak]

I agree but until that, they need to revert the shadow nerf to sailing npc smart pathing

[worthy compass]

I think sailing 2 will be a good thing for boat combat. They will have had a lot of time and data to mull over. And hopefully play tested it in live servers themselves

[heavy ledge]

nvm

I feel like a good idea would've been release sailing without cb, let us do some skilling, then do a cb beta test, and then ship cb

[main kestrel]

i wonder what value the exclusive drops would be like if they disable combat until its redesign, making them temp unobs

[fringe rivet]

I think the number one thing is to raise the damage and hp numbers. The time to kill and sailing exp rewarded should stay the same, but there are two main reasons to boost the numbers:

1. It feels better. People like consistent numbers even if it is functionally the same.
2. You earn less magic and range experience due to the reduced numbers, which makes it economically bad to kill things when you could get better exp from land based combat.

[woeful stump]

I’m confused does the chart in the latest xp blog post include the crystal extractor xp rates or not?
They said it doesn’t, but yet the trails xp rates go from: pre 100-> current 85-> purposed 100. I thought they did not touch the trials xp on yesterday’s update.

[small anvil]

It says it does

In the chart

Above*

[icy relic]

extractor nerf shaved 20k off trials

they added it back via the 1250 per lap + horizon lure working

in a sense it's even better if you weren't clicking extractor on cd

[austere mulch]

Weird they have port tasks at 105% when they took a larger xp/hr drop from extractor than they got gain from the buff

Unless that’s isolated to pre extractor tasks

[lone swan]

I agree they should undo the smart path thing, however many choose to ignore the combat aspect because its not enjoyable so there is a much dimmer light shining on it. Jagex might not even notice it

[austere mulch]

At least the two shark safespots south of pest control work

Gg with krakens tho

[keen oak]

Agreed, hoping they notice lack on people engaging with the content and relate them to these messages

[austere mulch]

Ayiza said on Reddit that combat prob not getting touched till next year so wouldn’t be hopeful for a revert

[lone swan]

They werent gonna touch it but the smart path screws most "safespots" so it makes combat even more anoying

[heavy ledge]

What was rate before this week's update? They took 20k/hr off crystal but buffed the tasks themselves by 15%

Thought I remember someone saying around 200k/hr so that would make sense to be at 105%

Although only at the highest level hmmmmm

Yeah wiki says 200k/hr rn for rosewood hull, so 10% off with the crystal extractor and then 15% boost makes sense to be at 105%, but only for maxed boat speed

[[Guide:Sailing Training: Courier Tasks 200k/hr+]]

[ornate wolf]

Wiki links found:
https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Guide:Sailing_Training:_Courier_Tasks_200k/hr%2B

[heavy ledge]

Also [[Guide:Courier Task Optimizations (Getting max XP)]]

[ornate wolf]

Wiki links found:
https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Guide:Courier_Task_Optimizations_(Getting_max_XP)

[thick beacon]

are crewmates going to be 4tick tomorrow or are they still remaining 5tick?

[heavy ledge]

They did also specifically say it was only a boost to the "completion XP" so they must be seeing rates above 200k/hr or that 105% just doesn't make sense

[brazen tundra]

the player so meaning you

[heavy ledge]

Still 5 tick

[brazen tundra]

4ticks

[heavy ledge]

he asked about crewmates

[brazen tundra]

i cant read

im a dumbie

[thick beacon]

thanks guys

[heavy ledge]

no read emoji lol

[brazen tundra]

when 😭

okay were the 4tick before nerf?

[heavy ledge]

(b)read emoji, enjoy

[heavy ledge]

yes but they said that was a bug

idk that we were 4 tick before

[brazen tundra]

okay i see

[heavy ledge]

wait hold on it never said crew were 5 tick, it just said they were bugged as 3 ticks, which was slower than player 4 tick. and then they said players would be 5 tick, nerfed from 4 tick and then they reverted that so idek

"a bug where crewmates are actually salvaging every three ticks, making them faster than players, who salvage every four ticks." is all it actually says on crewmate slavage

slavage lol

[brazen tundra]

it will all balance with %

[heavy ledge]

lmao what if they just left thr 3 tick bug in

that'd be fun

[heavy ledge]

yeah the only % that seems a little fishy to me is the port tasks 105% as mentioned above

[brazen tundra]

if im reading this correctly on the first nerf it said crewmates will salvage at the same rate as players rather than outperforming captain

so maybe they will be 4tick

but thats also when they made everyone 5 tick

[heavy ledge]

Yeah I'm guessing they're 4 tick but they never specifically mentioned that they fixed the bug or if they were gonna be nerfed down to 5 tick with players, so I'm just hoping they forgot about it lol

[brazen tundra]

ye i mean im gonna be on the hook this time so i dont get hit with the second nerf in the new years

they will def come back to sorting xp and slash it a little but thats my thought

[heavy ledge]

Also the 2 crew full hold then sort AFK only went from 41.6k to 42k per hour but I don't really care (33.6k AFK+8k salvage vs 19.2k afk+22.8k) <- this is actually not accounting for the increased salvage rate although that doesn't matter if you're literally just leaving it till logout then coming back

[brazen tundra]

do that and complain that you didnt get 99 the time they fixed it and re nerfed it

[heavy ledge]

also assuming you get a full hold worth of cargo

[brazen tundra]

not saying you just in general

[heavy ledge]

Yeah I was mostly super salty cuz I recently acquired a niece so a few months ago I specifically planned to take off work and OSRS for 11/19 to 12/3 so I was getting massive post-FOMO all day yesterday

[brazen tundra]

all is right until its revisted most likely next year cant imagine team do anything else before holiday

[heavy ledge]

Bet they'll revisit it after combat is in a better spot (well, hope)

[heavy ledge]

that's not clear lol, I hope they don't revisit it at all but if they do, hopefully it's after we have better methods like combat

[brazen tundra]

hopefully its fast i need raids 4 on the sea

[heavy ledge]

Doubt they release sailing raids until 2027 tbh

Will def have bosses before then tho

[winged mantle]

Ty for listening to the community jmods 💜

[heavy ledge]

Also really appreciate that they're giving us a day for feedback

Even though it kinda hurts today, it makes sense given the context and sets the right precedent

[winged mantle]

This should be the standard

[austere mulch]

Ngl didn’t realize 200+ was there. If people are actually getting at or around 200/hr, then 105% makes sense

Just looked at that wiki article and holy hell, that does not look enjoyable 😂😂

[heavy ledge]

Yeah there's a lot to it lol, but also they'd have to buff the port tasks between extractor and rosewood hull more than 15% to make up for the 20k xp, since the 200k is only with rosewood

[sacred skiff]

I still don’t understand how people are even getting 140k with port tasks, much less 180-200. I felt like I was sweating really hard and was only getting 110-120, with camphor hull and 5 tasks when possible

It’s a bummer when you try to get another task going like to Lunar but you already have another task carrying e.g. fish and you certainly can’t fit more fish crates

[lusty kelp]

its the aba meta

[sacred skiff]

I tried it based on a video + wiki and my rates were kinda cheeks

Certainly not worth the equal effort to trials for half the xp

[lusty kelp]

I feel ya

[sacred skiff]

So I figure I must be missing something, but I’m getting ABA tasks to Lunar, then teleing down to Aldarin/Deepfin and working my way up like (I think) is the strat

[zealous sand]

im so glad ive been banking all of my salvage lol. W change on the update

[quick dome]

i just found a bug with the aquanite hopper

when using a sunlight hunters' crossbow, when the aquanite hopper effect triggers, it says "you can't use that ammo with your crossbow" and stops your auto-attacking

[zealous sand]

#1435267698979242145 id post in there tbh

[quick dome]

its not exactly sailing related, but if thats more for the sailing update as a whole then

[zealous sand]

Its content that released with sailing tho. doesnt hurt to try

[quick dome]

👍

[heavy ledge]

Also there's a bug reporting feature in-game if you right click on the report abuse button

[quartz canopy]

Where can I cast my vote on this upcoming update?

Thought they requested feedback before implementing

[heavy ledge]

I think the feedback is supposed to be just generally in here/on reddit/on twitter

here being discord, not necessarily this chat, although this is a good spot for it

[quartz canopy]

Ah. When will they officially be announced or implemented

[heavy ledge]

Tomorrow, says at the top of the blog lol

[chrome lantern]

Disappointed they're not even doing any stopgap changes for combat now that they removed all feasible options to safespot krakens

[austere mulch]

Wym you don’t like getting pegged on your boat by sea monsters while you tickle them?

It’ll be addressed in January and changed in June!!

[heavy ledge]

Only if they take me out to dinner first

[austere mulch]

Calamari, perhaps?

[heavy ledge]

I like where this is going

[meager flame]

they'll probably make some small changes before they're really gone

[reef laurel]

Salvaging changes are sort of a W, unsure if the xp rates will still be super crazy. Hopefully combat and/or drop rates are addressed later.

[fringe rivet]

well, I did about an hour of port tasks

someone tell me how much was the self-salvage + sorting rates were before the nerf?

(Merchants ships)

[small anvil]

Around 120 I think? If playing actively

[fringe rivet]

jesuschrist

that's

[tacit wharf]

with 2 crew on hooks and pretty consistent extractor clicking, was getting 80k, 45k after nerf

[fringe rivet]

I said self-salvage, not afk

a 5% nerf towards self-salvage + sort is not enough to make port tasks worth it

[small anvil]

Port tasks should be less clicking I think

But more thinking

At last until the plugins get smart enough to do the thinking for you

I wonder if better routing will make tasks better XP too

[fringe rivet]

118k an hour doing a-b-a

and self-salvage being the same

I'm starting to think Jagex was right with the nerfs (except with the sorting part, that shouldn't be full but not 30%)

[small anvil]

I don't think aba is necessarily the best XP

But yeah

Salvage definitely deserved the nerfs imo

[fringe rivet]

and they're asleep right now

afk/ez-scape wins again

[small anvil]

Port is going to be the best pet rate

And if you chart while doing port it makes the completion XP for charting take less time theoretically

[tacit wharf]

ports also closer to 150-180 with rosewood and knowing what to do

[small anvil]

Who's getting rose sloop though

[tacit wharf]

skiff

the play

[small anvil]

Skiff you have to carry cargo more

Cuz fewer crew

[tacit wharf]

??

u get yr crew when loading/offloading

[small anvil]

You only get like 2 crew

[tacit wharf]

only on the boat

not at dock

[small anvil]

With skiff I think

[hasty shard]

rose sloop is like mainly for trawling imo

and trawling sucks 😭

ooh yeah let me drop 100m that i cant get back to catch fucking fish

[small anvil]

Yeah it's sad lol

I want it but I'm not dropping 100m on hull

[tough nacelle]

are all of them gone, or just the ones that can cannon too

[tacit wharf]

watching it in action right now, as well

[small anvil]

Hmm I tried using skiff and only 2 crew picked up maybe I did something wrong

[chrome lantern]

I haven't tested but I wouldn't be shocked if the NPC safespot still works with 0 cannon

[small anvil]

Swapping between boats gets funky

[meager flame]

it doesn't matter what the exp is within reason

[chrome lantern]

I think you're still able to freeze and position boat but cba

[tough nacelle]

they hit too hard to tank

[meager flame]

if its not better than trials you're just supposed to do trials if you can sit there and actually pay attention

you can do them casually/poorly and get around 200k

[hasty shard]

swampbark bis batchest

[chrome lantern]

Yeah I just gave up and have to hope they fix it

[tough nacelle]

Im def not the average player but feels weird salv got buffed

[fringe rivet]

yes it does? low-activity shouldn't be flat out better than higher activity

[chrome lantern]

Ship combat, I mean

[tough nacelle]

I wonder what itll be

but the xp rates were so broken

[meager flame]

yeah thus do trials

[chrome lantern]

What feels weirdest to me is buffing Trials tbh

[tough nacelle]

why

[meager flame]

port tasks are the low activity

[tough nacelle]

they got nerfed

[fringe rivet]

Courier runs are literally supposed to be the in-between

Port Tasks are higher activity than salvage

[tough nacelle]

Courier runs still need a mega buff imo

[chrome lantern]

I felt like Trials were already too much more XP than alternatives

And should be nerfed

[hasty shard]

i feel like port tasks need to be a bit higher tbh

[tough nacelle]

see I didnt find that

[fringe rivet]

I have to actually think about my route and avoid some obstacles

[tough nacelle]

salv was 120k, trials 200k

[meager flame]

yeah im just saying trials aren't like cutting edge difficult content

[fringe rivet]

But salvage I just sit there

[pliant dirge]

i’m 100% fine with salvage being really low rate as long as it’s extremely afk

[meager flame]

go miss the timer by 40 seconds who cares blow port tasks out of the water

its easy

[tough nacelle]

nah theyre def not hard, theyre fun

[hasty shard]

if they're like 120k/h currently thats still half of gwenith

[chrome lantern]

Trials aren't hard or fun they're just memorization and extremely boring

[meager flame]

thats why nobody will ever do port tasks as they are if they think about it

[tough nacelle]

Oh I enjoyed trials

brain off

[hasty shard]

also just port tasks not rewarding shit 😭

[chrome lantern]

Doing them once was fun

[meager flame]

you have an actual low effort method that gives 100k and you have an easy high end method for 200k

[hasty shard]

oh boy! coins!

[chrome lantern]

Doing them as a training method is awful

[meager flame]

some mediocre gives nothing inbetween doesn't really work

[small anvil]

Grinding trials is probably not fun

[fringe rivet]

@winter hearth Please consider a 15-20% exp buff towards courier tasks. I was doing a-b-a tasks and if the update goes through tomorrow as is, self-salvage + sort is going to be a less intense, more XP and loot rewarding activity than courier runs.

[meager flame]

they need to put actual rewards on port tasks

[tough nacelle]

I enjoyed them because you didnt need to force timer

[small anvil]

I felt good achieving time when it finally happened

[meager flame]

like cannonballs nails etc

then people would do them

[small anvil]

Some annoyance before then

[tough nacelle]

what made me annoyed was pet chance was only happening if you hit trial time

so like ???

[chrome lantern]

I don't think they necessarily need to make courier tasks stronger just make them more simple and consistent to actually setup and do

[small anvil]

Task board changing is kinda mehhh

[tough nacelle]

it feels bad that you dont get a soup roll

unless you hit a specific time

[fringe rivet]

Port Tasks are literally supposed to be the middle ground

[meager flame]

yeah im just saying the middleground doesn't really work

[fringe rivet]

From low to high
Salvage
Port Tasks
Trials

[meager flame]

if you're conscious enough to do a port task you can just go do a casual trial

and kill the exp/hr

[small anvil]

Port not being sufficiently better than salvage to be worth doing is a point to be made

[pliant dirge]

port tasks should give like reputation with different trading companies, awarding special rewards after enough deliveries with them

[fringe rivet]

You're missing the point Turkey, it shouldn't be that way

thats why it needs to be buffed

[meager flame]

it would be very different if the trial was actually intense and hard

[small anvil]

Tho I would caution that maybe your rate is a tad low due to inexperience with the best method maybe

[meager flame]

but since its not theres just no space there

its because trials reward you for sucking anyways

[fringe rivet]

I'm a higher level than the last time I did it, and despite the "buff", I'm getting a little less exp actually due to the nerf to the extractor

[chrome lantern]

Efficient Port tasks way more mental bandwidth than trials

[small anvil]

Just have the right route and goody for you

You said you were doing aba

And I don't think that's necessarily best

Esp if it was shorter routes

[fringe rivet]

you gonna say what is the best then?

[meager flame]

tbh trials are massively op because of how forgiving the exp is

you can just be mentally checked kinda do badly but ultimately make it through your lap

and boom all exp from everywhere else is now irrelevant

[small anvil]

I'm not sure it is, but getting pickup orders is a thing then tp to start

[meager flame]

if you could actually fail it wouldn't be like that

[fringe rivet]

bruh, that is a-b-a method

[small anvil]

You can also get a-b a-c, go to b and pick up b-c

Oh I'm not familiar with the terminology then

[meager flame]

salvage is super competitive because it gives uniques and is so afk that its offering a real angle for people who didn't want to do trials

[small anvil]

Having 4 tasks you're constantly filling has to be better I feel

[meager flame]

so even though the exp is less theres a bunch of good reasons to do it

[small anvil]

But I haven't looked into port tasks that closely

[fringe rivet]

salvage also gives the best exp for the least amount of effort

[meager flame]

port tasks need that good reason and they dont have it atm

thats why i keep saying they should drop cannonballs and stuff

[small anvil]

The reason is pet chance

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[fringe rivet]

100k+ exp for clicking on a hook once every 3 minutes smh

[meager flame]

yeah but pet chasing is like

[chrome lantern]

How exactly is salvage the "best xp"

[small anvil]

Though the way to do pet chance is like

[meager flame]

some giga niche nobody actually cares reason

[fringe rivet]

for the effort involved

[small anvil]

People absolutely care lol

[chrome lantern]

Oh, so not the best xp

Got it

[meager flame]

pet chasers do exist but the number of people who actually do that

[small anvil]

I care about pet

[meager flame]

super low

[fringe rivet]

best exp for the effort

[meager flame]

its a pretty bad tuning point for just the general audience playing

[chrome lantern]

Words matter

[fringe rivet]

reading comprehension does to

[small anvil]

I think plugins will advance to tell you which tasks to take and do

And tasks might end up higher

[meager flame]

very hard

[fringe rivet]

Point is, I can get 100k exp clicking a hook once every 3 minutes
or
I can get 110k exp for actively planning a cargo route, avoiding the occassional rocks, and trying to get to port as fast as possible

[small anvil]

Ya but someone will figure out an algorithm

And it'll depend if jagex allows it

[meager flame]

no like if they can do that

[tacit wharf]

i mean u can already "mark" the good currier tasks

[meager flame]

they actually get a million dollars gifted to them

irl

[chrome lantern]

It's a lot more than 110k xp for tasks though

So that's pretty disingenuous

[small anvil]

There's finite tasks

[meager flame]

travelling salesman problem is a real thing

[small anvil]

It's not traveling salesman

[meager flame]

but like

i think you could manually come up with like

[small anvil]

Traveling salesman has to hit every stop

[fringe rivet]

I literally just tested it mate

[meager flame]

a set of you should probably do stuff like this

like if i were to say just always do xyz and then build out a decision tree from that it would execute that can be done

but it wouldn't be perfect probably

[chrome lantern]

Very vague anecdotal evidence with probably very poor efficiency

[small anvil]

It's not the traveling salesman problem, and traveling salesman is arbitrary in size

[chrome lantern]

Doesn't really prove anything

[fringe rivet]

I was doing the a-b-a method, I teleport all over the place to be as fast as I can be

[small anvil]

Were you doing one task at a time

[fringe rivet]

5 at a time

[chrome lantern]

8 days ago people were getting 150k xp/hr at courier tasks and they just buffed the rates

[small anvil]

The sailing plugin or port task plugin has info hover

[chrome lantern]

So idk

[fringe rivet]

and I grab tasks along the way if they open up

[fringe rivet]

that was with the extractor pre-nerf

[small anvil]

If like XP per tile

That was neat

[fringe rivet]

and I should know cuz I was getting those rates then cuz I was doing said tasks

[chrome lantern]

Yes but even if you took out the whole extractor xp they still did better than you

And you still get xp from it

Even if not as much

[fringe rivet]

the extractor nerf was a nerf to port tasks even with the small buff they gave

and how would you even know? You're using other people's "anecdotal evidence"

[chrome lantern]

Yes but your "data" for port tasks is a rate that's worse than if you never built an extractor in the first place

[fringe rivet]

so... your point I'd be getting even less exp if I didn't use the extractor?

what are you even trying to say?

[small anvil]

He's saying pre nerf minus extractor

Matches what you have now

[fringe rivet]

okay, and?

[small anvil]

So you would have been getting less than those pre change

[fringe rivet]

that's just more reason to further buff courier runs

[small anvil]

Aka there's some inefficiency in there

[chrome lantern]

My point is that you're doing so poorly you're getting 30k xp/hr worse than others even if you normalize for the extractor

[fringe rivet]

if salvage is 100k, and courier runs are now 110k, there's a clear gap

[chrome lantern]

35% less xp than you could be

[meager flame]

its so easy to fix though honestly just let them offer some genuine rewards

which nothing else in sailing does

[small anvil]

I don't know enough about port task efficient rates to comment tho

[tacit wharf]

courier tasks are still 150-180k/hr

[meager flame]

i just feel like their battle with the exp/hr is lost

[fringe rivet]

Etube you aren't even doing them

[meager flame]

if you have to think more than you do to do a barracuda trial for less exp its just cooked

[chrome lantern]

What makes you say that?

[meager flame]

just simply move in circle poorly

[fringe rivet]

with what method? and does that include the dummy expensive rosewood hull?

[tacit wharf]

aba

[chrome lantern]

Why would we look at efficient xp rates without using efficient methods and equipment

[tacit wharf]

and yes, with camphor its on the lower range of 150k

[chrome lantern]

Ofc you're going to assume rosewood

[meager flame]

and yeah rates are always going to include rosewood

especially that

[fringe rivet]

I am ffs you fool

[meager flame]

since your movement speed matters greatly lol

[chrome lantern]

"Guys I'm getting less than best mining xp rates when I use a rune pickaxe"

[fringe rivet]

Etube, what are you even talking about anymore?

[chrome lantern]

You

[fringe rivet]

you're making up arguements in your head

[fringe rivet]

Could you tell me a little more about that? I'm assuming the typical, Relleka, Lunar Isle, and Ect method and then tele to Adrian?

[chrome lantern]

We're talking about what efficient xp rates are and you're using worse equipment and complaining that you're further from efficient rates