Release Candidate 0.30.0 - MELTDOWN UPDATE

[rapid galleon]

Oh wait

That's just a radiator

[eternal solstice]

can superpower it with connected boost thruster + capacitator

[kind swallow]

Okay, what about this: ores (and, rarely, rock) could drop slag when smelted: this could be directly processed into a choice of basic resources.

That way, thermal weapons become a way of recycling less useful asteroids into more useful ones.

[eternal solstice]

S? no, Copper
Hy? no, Copper
Fe? no, Coppe- wait..

though sometimes i wanna melt iron into copper anyway

[rapid galleon]

time for more mining lasers!!!!

[vital briar]

there is still the bug with the lasers, that it shows u can attach cooling to the back but when u do its overheating

[merry badger]

I have a question: does the new surrender thing for career acccount for the strength of the ship surrendering only? Or all ships nearby?

i've been seeing 2 ships start to gang up on me then one of them surrendering because they think they couldn't win the fight, when solo they couldn't but with their duo they had a decent chance

[rapid galleon]

its peam

mining laser op

[hollow prairie]

Any idea why Diamond factory doesn't have a overclocked option

Quite weird

I guess it is capped by animation speed or something like that?

[regal pier]

Playing career code on the RC. Started from the beginning. It is very satisfying to destroy a large station via destroying it's exhaust ports. Normally I'd have trouble with it.

[prime thicket]

it works instantly once enough resources are inserted, for all intents and purposes

not much point increasing the speed of something instant

[past sonnet]

1. when you turn on OC on the Engine room all connected thrusters get OC too.
   BUT when you switch the ER's OC off all connected thrusters stay overclocked. Since they may not be connected to the heatpipe system (like on the screenshot) they overheat now!
   This cannot be intended. Plz change!

2. Sometimes when a ship strafes thrusters facing in opposite direction all thrust almost fully, instead of only one side thrusting slightly.
   It is like that for a long time but more obv in the meltdown update.
   Not pretty and also not "cool" like in cooling system 😉

3. Damn you need a lot of Radiators! XD

[dull marlin]

https://youtu.be/a6KuHI8ll6E
in this some OC flak is used and the battles with it are very boring, while OC flak may not be overpowered its complete shut down of all enemy weapon systems makes for uninteresting combat, kinda like missiles vs pd but more boring

[rapid galleon]

scrapped

[hollow prairie]

That is interesting and somehow a pitty

[quiet dune]

Did it not ever rotate towards you?

[regal pier]

It did. I sent it a larger ship just out of range and smaller ship on the flank where exposed radiators were.

To be honest, I think the AI should turn off overclocking once last of its radiators is gone. At least if it contains a device that constantly produces heat. Well, there are always ways to cheese, though.

[quiet dune]

Very clever of you. I hope you know that I'll be adding shields to the sides to at least delay that strategy, if nothing else

I agree that it would be a good AI change to automatically turn off the overclocks of systems that have no storage or heat dissipation, but AI changes are presumably planned for the future

[eternal wave]

per-ship ai customization even if exclusive to modding/coding for career only would go a long way but idk how would be executed

[regal pier]

Btw, I saw an "AI tournament" on youtube, which was just ship-design-for-ai tournament. Anyone knows if modding actualy AI is planned or perhaps even exists?

[regal pier]

roadplan has at least some info about that, i.e. it mentions a couple of predefined modes.

[quiet dune]

The issue with AI changes is that it's both a yawning void of problems to solve, and secondly that I believe it's one of the oldest systems in the game, meaning that it will likely have to be rebuilt from the ground up

If it happens, it will probably constitute a major update and is **definitely **out of scope for the meltdown update

[rapid galleon]

cooked

[regal pier]

Of course, I should have kept this to a general channel.

[quiet dune]

You're fine 😁

[eternal wave]

i mean more of allowing the existing ai system to be coded differently for specific ships if the architects so want

[quiet dune]

That being said, if you happen to easily cheese any other of the new ships or stations and think that they need tweeks, feel free to say so, Xilexio. Your feedback lets me directly improve them

[eternal wave]

eg. disable the feature of "ignore attack defaults at 50% hp" specifically on some rammers or orbiters

by making a copy of the normal ai but setting that number to 0

[regal pier]

So far I tried specifically targetting radiators i some early ships (the initial system), but just killing weapons did the job done faster. Especially that most of them generate hit only when firing at me, which is not what I want. I'll see if I'll have more success with larger ships later on in the campaign.

One thing that slightly concerns me is that I basically don't need a booster thruster now, since I can just overclock a regular one for a bit, just before it starts fires, and get out of range.

[eternal solstice]

having the preferred engagement details panel like in Battlefleet Gothic would be nice other option, if only because it's easier to vary ranges that way than with the attack option default

[quiet dune]

Boost thrusters still have a niche because they won't directly kill you. That sounds more like a fun emergent mechanical risk that you can take, to me

[regal pier]

I suppose they are way more reliable than overlclocking for a bit.

[rapid galleon]

oc mining lasers are so funny lol
slap em on a rammer and say goodbye to any enemy armor

[rapid galleon]

peak

[grave shard]

Has anyone tried for a new top speed using overclocking?

[ashen galleon]

The drag equation was reworked so it's a loooot harder to achieve super fast speeds despite more available cost-effective thrust options

[grave shard]

Evil

Big meanies 😭

[ashen galleon]

hardly, it killed these things

[silver jay]

probably one of the worst things ive ever seen

[ashen galleon]

i thought it would be a lot more annoying for career due to ships transiting slower at the same game speed but in practice it's really not a problem
the top speeds of ships around 100 m/s are only slightly lower, the only things affected are super fast ships that were literally capable of outrunning weapon projectiles

[grave shard]

Was that changed in meltdown or before?

[ashen galleon]

part of the meltdown update

otherwise OC thrust would make a borderline unplayable speed meta into an unplayable speed meta

[grave shard]

Soooo how do OCed MRT systems compare to pre-mektdown MRT systems?

[ashen galleon]

OC MRT isn't any stronger in raw thrust terms but it's better at ramping up quickly - in PvP it's meh but for AI ships it's quite a bit better

the logistics are annoooyying tho

[dull marlin]

is thruster heat damage going to be implimented in meltdown?

[fallow zealot]

Yeah, that's a long time ago for many of us. 😛

[regal pier]

Destroying ships by destroying their radiator is satisfying. Well, I had to destroy most of the ship on the way, but still, more to salvage.

[grave shard]

If you can't reach the radiator, cutting the pipe can be just as effective

[lethal wraith]

funny thing, the update reeled me back in and ive been obsessing over pre-patch stuff that's always been here again without having actually gotten into any of the new heat mechanics

im about to sink my teeth in and design my first heat-utilizing ship now after playing around with some of the io constructs in creative and seeing how they utilize heat distribution systems

also, i dont know how new the ui adjustments to the direct control mode are, but having roll and thrust vector visualization is lovely and wonderful

also, it'd be nice if we could have some more detailed tooltips on specific stat differences for overclocked parts ? some even seem incomplete:

for example, the overclocked tab mentions a fire rate increase and a reduction in damage, but i dont seem to see the reduction in damage detailed here

if its not prevented by some limitation then it might be nice, instead of displaying the overclocked tooltip to the side, to overwrite the normal statistics tooltip with the overclocked one

the numbers modified by the overclocked variation could be tinted different colours to display statistical increases/decreases at a glance and it would reduce screen clutter

[prime thicket]

that's a situation in which the description is wrong

[prime thicket]

eh, i'd rather be able to see both variants at once without having to toggle overclock

[lethal wraith]

i dont imply a requirement to toggle overclock on to see said stats

as is, you simply press control to toggle the overclocked tooltip addition; it would be the same control, just a toggle between the two tooltips instead

[lethal wraith]

oh, i see, thank you !

[prime thicket]

fair, but it's still handy to be able to do a (literal) side-by-side comparison

possibly having what you suggested as a toggle could be good, but imo the current implemenation works fine

[lethal wraith]

seems to be disputable as an improvement ^^

here's something more objective; the description of the diamond smelter blueprint doesnt seem right, at least in the english locale:

[prime thicket]

yeah that's been reported i believe

it's at least been mentioned

[lethal wraith]

should i remove it to avoid duplicate reports ?

[prime thicket]

nah definitely leave it here

actually i don't think it's been put in #1019741923893858305 yet so maybe do that

devs may have missed prior mentions here

[dull marlin]

i just made a bug report about it

[dull marlin]

description is right, stats are wrong actually

[prime thicket]

huh, didn't think that was the case

admittedly i haven't tested it since the RC

[tired flower]

OC SC is 125% speed and 100%*3 damage

DPS is 3/2, IIRC

(because half fire-rate)

[dull marlin]

the shot speed (as in bullet velocity) is slower than non overclock

[tired flower]

It definitely shouldn't be

[dull marlin]

but the stats are missing that information

huh

[tired flower]

OVERCLOCK
{
    SPEED = (&~/Speed/BaseValue) * 125%
    RANGE = (&~/Range/BaseValue) + 50
}
Speed
{
    BaseValue = 240
    BuffType = Overclock
    BuffMode = Lerp
    MinValue = &BaseValue
    MaxValue = &~/OVERCLOCK/SPEED
}

Overclock off = 240
Overclock on = 240 * 1.25

[dull marlin]

maybe test it in game to see if something got messed up?

[tired flower]

If it's not the case I'm going to bite you

[dull marlin]

that's not the threat you think it is

i chew on my arm cause it's interesting sensory wise

[tired flower]

Queer people 🤝 biting

[dull marlin]

oops

[pseudo crystal]

Masterful gambit

[dim kestrel]

grok is this true

[tulip pulsar]

bruh, just saw the announcement when I was doing so well in my 'pacifist' mining lasers only run

this is a legit 'let em cook' moment

[empty canopy]

like for example this used to go about 50-70m/s faster

but anyways i'm not complaining i feel like i can somewhat exploit it with tbs to kite and stuff

[lost onyx]

i had a ship which lost 100 m/s

used to go 275

this thing

[kind mountain]

My fleet of 180m/s rapid responders begame 90m/s paper mache craft 🙏🥀

[visual torrent]

it depends how you define ai

and how smart you want it and how deep you are willing to hack the game

[potent finch]

that happend to me at one point, i think i have a gif of it

found it

[sullen laurel]

i hate finding bugs in release candidates man. in beta versiosn its fine but in RC's

it just delays the release. (for completely sensible reasons but im impatient now )

[sullen laurel]

as you have the gif would you mind putting a big report in if you havent already please?

nvm someone else did it already

https://discord.com/channels/314103695568666625/1398521646096060477

[visual torrent]

early delay: \😊
late delay: \😡

[sullen laurel]

my feeling on bugs as we approach release

[empty canopy]

i assume we're at the bad stage right?

[sullen laurel]

yes.

we're at the point where I secretly throw tantrum behind keyboard any time a bug that seems like it will delay release pops up

[hollow siren]

"when its ready" 😄

[lyric sail]

I don't understand.

[quiet dune]

Customizable settings to make ships automatically fight in certain ways

[regal pier]

There was a Cosmoteer AI tournament where players supplied ships to be controlled by AI, as opposed to what I'd actually consider AI tournament, i.e., ships being controlled by custom AI mods.

I made this atrocity for grand admiral + starwright PvE, trying to optimize crew usage and use the thermal tech to start fires at the enemy with missiles. Considering swapping it for thermal lance, but that won't help with a surprise attack from the side. Is it only me or is overclocking good for improving crew efficiency?

[regal pier]

I was planning on supplying myself missiles from stations for now, but it seems thermal missile parts are missing from the current one. Is this the case for all?

[lyric sail]

Ah yes, I'm the host x3

But I agree it would be way better if we had custom AI

but I don't know any mod that would allow custom AIs to be made

[regal pier]

I think we will get there, but not in the near future.

[rapid galleon]

mining laser !!!

[eternal solstice]

noice layering

[eternal wave]

i think making status effects automatically adjust how many tiles they spread (that could be turned off with a modding option to ignore) for bigger ship classes is important

lol

not sure how that worked

[dull marlin]

are astroids super easy to melt through?

if so should that be changed

[eternal wave]

yeah i'm trying to mod something as a suggestion but the status grid being the same size as the ship's grid is a bit wonky with megaroids because of this

[dull marlin]

asteroids are a bit less meltable than armor (1x1 armor vs 1x1 soft asteroid)

[visual torrent]

although it currently is possible (in multiple ways and degrees of freedom too!), cosmoteer "basic" ai modding is already jank as hell and i really doubt more than 3 people would participate (fully use all available tools) even with the most basic of ai moddingb

[regal pier]

How do shields handle melting?

[eternal wave]

armor has negative thermal resistance compared to any other part

thermal = -25%

for some reason

otherwise the status applying so much makes little sense tbh

[regal pier]

I'm searching for any built-in ship with thermal lance. I don't see any in IO. Is there one somewhere?

ok, found barbatos, but that is a large ship.

[visual torrent]

visually looks worse toh u h

[eternal wave]

what no i screenshotted because its a visual bug

idk what happened why it did that

[eternal wave]

i made something to try to fix that
can you give me your opinion on this mod i made about that #1372023145753612349 message

[regal pier]

I was doing some testing and do I understand it correctly that thermal energy from thermal lance goes inside shields if they block it, thus causing them to overheat easily?

[visual torrent]

yeah pretty much

[fallow zealot]

@everyone A new release candidate is now ready! Thanks for your testing and feedback!

• Added 3 new Great House Io combat ships: Thanatos, Loki, and Malphas.
• Added 4 new Great House Io stations: Med Ionian Arms Depot, Med Ionian Arms Depot II, Large Ionian Arms Depot, Large Ionian Arms Depot II.
• Misc other Great House Io ship updates.
• Loading blueprints can no longer be used to bypass having to buy overclocks in Career mode.
• Engine Room no longer forces overclock of attached thrusters.
• Engine room now generates heat on battery delivery.
• Increased Engine Room power distribution efficiency from 140% to 150%.
• Added minimum status thresholds for showing heat and scorched tutorials.
• Added tutorials for heat management and overclocking.
• The mass display toggle is now properly disabled when in blueprint mode.
• Translation updates for all supported languages. (Work in progress.)
• Fixed the description for the Diamond Smelter.
• Minor tooltip adjustments and fixes.
• Bugfix: The Small Imperium Trade Station III was missing its standard resource loadout.

[fallow zealot]

(FYI, we are aware of a few crashes and are looking into them.)

[knotty epoch]

engine room generates heat on power delivery now, darn

[neon token]

Added 3 new WHAT now

[prime thicket]

ships for the new faction that got added (with like 100 ships) when the RC first came out

[neon token]

dear god

well time to play again

[rapid galleon]

hopefully we can still pipe out heat from the thrusters themselves to not get that nasty heat bonus

[quiet ridge]

Is the heat bonus removed?

Idk I'll have to look in game

[hexed jetty]

engineroom changes are interesting

[rapid galleon]

just realized that mrt nozzles have 10k thrust compared to huge thrusters 8k, but they use 0.1 less power

hmmmm

[vestal hinge]

cool

[silver jay]

the rampdown time is rough though

i think

i barely notice it

[rapid galleon]

its 2 seconds

[summer shale]

Were OC efficiency bonuses for factories tried and decided it was too OP?

[rapid galleon]

if you oc it its 1.5

[quiet ridge]

It wasn't realistic

[eternal solstice]

simulate the great factory fire

[quiet ridge]

(previously we had 2x efficiency on OC factories but creating extra matter out of thin air isn't really realistic lol)

[summer shale]

Realistically, 1 kg of iron ore wouldn't make 1 kg of iron either. lol

In Career mode, I always feel like I have way more resources than I know what to do with (as I'm a hoarder). I'd be interested in some kind of de-buff to the factories to make resource processing more involved or require more of an investment.

I have a 8x12 (or something similar) blueprint that I just throw into any mothership I have, containing only one of each factory, and it always gets the job done.

If the factories were half as efficient and required cooling to work at normal efficiency and/or worked at a significantly slower rate (requiring you to build multiple of each to keep up with ore supply while mining), I think mining would be more of an investment and logistic challenge than just being unlimited free resources as it currently is.

I actually want to try modding the (non-ammo) factories to reduce their speed down quite a bit and see how it feels. It would be cool to have bigger processing ships with arrays of factories or something.

[hexed jetty]

why does your game say MJ/shot

mine doesnt have that..

[silver jay]

are you on unstable or previewpreview

[hexed jetty]

oh probably still in preview, i thought it would auto switch to unstable

[silver jay]

nope

[tired flower]

An industry / factory rework/expansion is something I really want to work on. Probably not until after the economy itself is more interesting, though

[tired flower]

A fair few people felt like it didn't really make much sense, which is valid

[summer shale]

Yeah, that's reasonable. My response to that would be (as part of a mining/factory rebalance):

Refineries (ore factories) shouldn't produce 1:1. I'd be curious how the gameplay would feel if it was nerfed to 2:1, 3:1, maybe even 4:1.

Then, overclocking it could up the efficiency from 2:1 to 1:1, or from 3:1 to 2:1, etc...

Alternatively, a separate tier of factories just called "refineries" or whatever could provide the increased efficiency but be larger and more cumbersome, while the overclocking still increases speed.

In either case, I still feel like the speed at which the ore factories/refineries can process ore should be nerfed to make refining more logistically challenging, require more space, and a bigger investment in terms of materials. All we need right now is an 8x12 blueprint to paste into one ship and you're set for the whole campaign.

[tired flower]

Tiers are somewhat antithetical to Cosmoteer's design philosophy. My hopes are more along the lines of modularity. Upgradeability via adding more parts to the factory construct as opposed to replacing the parts with more powerful variants

[dim kestrel]

I agree that refining should be more logistically challenging, but I’d argue that having over clocks be more ore efficient would still be too easy.

Modular factories is definitely a sick idea

[summer shale]

Too easy in the senes that overclocking itself is too easy? Or too easy to make too many resources?

[dim kestrel]

I love modular everything

[summer shale]

If we got some sort of conveyor belt/automation system...

Obviously it'd have to be done right. Maybe just with factory blocks feeding into one another or something.

[dim kestrel]

Over clocking itself is too easy. Hook the factories up to a small number of radiators and a couple heat batteries and its hardly a nuisance especially as you scale up

[tired flower]

I'm a big fan (at least conceptually, I'm not good enough so it gives me a headache) of From the Depths, which has largely very simple parts but they're almost always parts of a more complex whole

[summer shale]

Agreed.

Maybe that's a good bit of insight to solve the concerns with the weapon overclock variants.

You guys ever played Starmade?

[prime thicket]

i do also really like that game, though i don't think its design philosophy is entirely a good fit for cosmo

[summer shale]

It's been a long time since I played Starmade, but I think it has 4 basic types of weapon blocks and 4 or 8 weapon augmentation blocks. But then you combine those to make all kinds of different weapons.

[visual torrent]

now though, they use 5 billion crew (also problem before) aaaand need a bunch more suppliers

[tired flower]

I don't think it is 1:1, but there are great lessons to be learned

[prime thicket]

at the very least, cosmoteer's logistics systems add another layer of functional complexity of having to connect things together which FTD just lacks, so approaching an FTD level of modular weaponry/parts could get to be a bit much for cosmo

also hearing that you're an FTD fan does explain some things about the TRL

[tired flower]

I agree. That's why the TRL is the way it is and not... FtD lasers

The TRL could've been much more complex lmao

[summer shale]

Logistics crew in career is always a pain because they're my buffer between how many crew my other ships need to function and my max crew due to fame.

And the work priorities for logistics guys are never right. Either they ONLY do logistics stuff and sometimes I want them to help with other tasks or I have them capable of helping with everything and they can't keep up with factories because of other miscillaneous stuff to do.

I know how the crew assignments and priorities work. It just seems like sometimes the game bugs out and the wrong crew get assigned and the whole organization falls apart lol.

[tired flower]

I did look into producing denser ammunition nuggets, but it's just not technically viable atm. It seems like something that might be useful for other things in the future, though, who knows

[visual torrent]

yipee

[summer shale]

What are your guys' thoughts on conveyor belts (or similar) for automating cargo storage, factories, loading guns, etc?

Before you jump on my case, I know it's not a simple question and has major gameplay/balance implications. I just want to hear your thoughts. ❤️

[dull marlin]

not even with designating it as a completely seperate resource?

[visual torrent]

i think i can mod it super jankily, will try when i get home

[dull marlin]

like making nuke part and nuke part x2

[tired flower]

All ammo receivers would have to duplicate their storages/consumers for the separate resource

[summer shale]

If missiles were more powerful, it would be a good excuse to require a factory to make missile boosters and separate factories to make missile warheads.

[tired flower]

It's possible, but it's janky

Also would need to somehow link the storage of bullet and bullet2

[dull marlin]

if its janky and it works properly it isnt janky

[summer shale]

Isn't that how factories that require multiple ingredients already work?

[tired flower]

works properly is carrying all the weight there lol

[tired flower]

They have separate storage stockpiles

This would be having two storages for bullet and bullet2 on top of eachother

[summer shale]

What would the difference between bullet and bullet2 be? Ammo type or just a bigger stack (like how batteries work)?

[tired flower]

Batteries work... strangely.

[summer shale]

Also, I don't think I've ever realized how comical it is that we power our space ships by manually carrying batteries by hand to every independent system.

I guess that's also how Void Crew does it. Partially.

[tired flower]

The parts would have to convert bullet2 into 2x bullet

Which is trivial in itself

[summer shale]

Just, uhhh... port Factorio over to Cosmoteer. Assemblers, inserters, furnaces... problem solved! 👍

[dull marlin]

pretty sure someone made a mod for that

i dont agree with modding a work around for the main game mechanic but it is what it is

[tired flower]

if people enjoy it that way ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[summer shale]

What is the cost / purpose of crew in Cosmoteer? (Abstract question I guess... should have just deleted this question in hindsight. )

If we were to have conveyor belts that could automate moving cargo, loading/unloading factories, or even loading guns, how could that be made as an alternative to using crew without being explicitly better or worse than just using crew?

If they were slower than crew and, of course, took up tiles that wouldn't be (as) usable as hallways, it doesn't seem that unreasonable. One item per second could be reasonable for ore processing or slowly refilling a gun, but wouldn't keep up in combat. Could also cut down on a lot of excess crew usage (helping crew tasking performance), but would also circumvent the fame limit in career quite a bit.

[eternal solstice]

or relatedly, using manipulator beams since factories already have roof openings

[summer shale]

That's not a bad idea. Would require being stationary though.

[eternal solstice]

yop

plus it would give less of a downside for having iron stuck all the way down there in the moving warehouse

weapons do NOT have roof openings though, so that's a balancing factor

plus as you mentioned, space transport of resources is very slippery in motion

[summer shale]

Would make it even more justifiable to nerf the production speed of refining factories as you could have factory arrays being fed by manipulator beams without worrying about crew congestion/crew running marathons through the warehouse.

[kind swallow]

I personally would approve of conveyer belts and arms, Factorio-style.

[eternal solstice]

I may also need to take a look at how airlock movement is done

[summer shale]

A conveyor system could operate on the same logic as crew tasking actually. Space Engineers style. Just connect everything up and the conveyors move things as requested. Big ships could have a spinal conveyor so ammo could be passed along.

However, each input/output interface could have a limit of one item per second or something.

[safe patio]

is the Savnock supposed to light itself on fire after flying for a little bit? found it after it had burned, decided to give it a few crew and take it to a station, but before it got there it caught itself ablaze

[summer shale]

That whole ship only has eight radiators?

[safe patio]

yeah

[kind swallow]

Well, that would explain that.

Not enough radiators, and nothing to shoot at.

[eternal solstice]

i understand how the small thrusters on the very edge of the exchanger burnt, but everything else...

[summer shale]

Well, it also has thermal rockets, but I guess if you're not actively using them, they're not doing much.

Would be a nice feature if you could toggle those to auto fire when the heat network is at maximum.

[eternal solstice]

two aren't lit up

[summer shale]

Do those pass heat through or only absorb it? I thought weapons didn't pass through except for the... TRL?

[safe patio]

heat does pass through

[eternal solstice]

pass through

[safe patio]

i tried to scrap the ship and it made my game crash

[summer shale]

It's cursed.

[safe patio]

the ship's cursed i guess

i shoulda typed faster

[summer shale]

Tell that to Demon's Eye

He answered the question you already answered 10 ms earlier.

[safe patio]

on my end i was faster for that one at least

[eternal solstice]

and it was indeed enough time for my end to be later

[safe patio]

guess i'll go make a bug report in a few minutes

[summer shale]

When's Cosmoteer getting VR support?

I'll see myself out now.

[prime thicket]

personally i wouldn't go with conveyor belts and arms, but something that might fit cosmoteer better is pneumatic tubes

would fit the game's retro sci-fi vibes and emphasis on crew really well

[kind swallow]

Fair. I just like conveyer belts—and I'm not really sure how pneumatic tubes would work in the game.

[night arrow]

Maybe it would be exactly like heat tubes, but for items, and it would also need a module that would receive and dispense the items

[summer shale]

I think this is a good solution.

I wanted to think of a game that uses the same mechanic as reference but unless you guys play a lot of modded Minecraft, I've got nothin'.

I could name at least half a dozen (independent) Minecraft mods that use that mechanic but can't think of a single other game. Closest could be Space Engineers but that doesn't have input/output nodes. Everything just connects directly to the "pipe" system.

[night arrow]

I don't know whether I'm remembering this right or not, but aren't SE pipes instant?

Like, the moment an amount of resource is requested by a factory, it is immediatly pulled?

[prime thicket]

i don't think exactly like, but something comparable would be good yeah

ideally imo each 'endpiece' module should have an outgoing resources slot and an incoming resources slot, and have 2 input pipe points and 2 output pipe points

probably a 1x2 part

no pipe splitting/merging either, just have a direct connection

[tired flower]

Factorio fluid handling is actually inspired by Thermal Expansion pipes

[summer shale]

Thermal Expansion is my favorite (family of) mods.

[eternal wave]

First came Factorio
Then minecraft mods
Then Factorio takes from minecraft mods ideas
Isn't it so fascinating

[eternal wave]

i have a mod exactly for something like that 😭

honestly i have no clue if these could get use of new meltdown features, idk if network sheninigans would be better for this and worth the hassle

first thing i can think of is using the new valuesprites instead of janky resourcesprites for some of the display panel counters

i guess i could add an overclock for them? but they dont have doors...

[prime thicket]

nor do radiators but they still connect to thermals

[eternal wave]

true

[eternal solstice]

overclocked radiators??????

would actually be a peak melee weapon

[summer shale]

Oh my, is that AE2?

That's definitely AE2.

[eternal wave]

inspired

yea

[summer shale]

Well, yeah...

I didn't think it was the Minecraft mod AE2 loaded directly into Cosmoteer. haha

How does that even work? Does it just keep all of the items on a single tile with infinite storage slots?

On second thought, I assume Cosmo has a virtual "item provider" that crew can use for task item demand.

[grave shard]

OMG IS THAT AN APPLIED ENERGISTICS SYSTEM?

[eternal wave]

drags you two to #modding

[visual torrent]

don't - just assume it's always shooting for testing purposes and have it convert in the gun

overflow can just be delrted

for balance testing it shouldn't matter tooooo much

[tired flower]

Deleting resources sounds like a terrible idea

[eternal solstice]

could even just be from storage to storage

[visual torrent]

that is true, but it would work for testing, no?

the idea itself might not even be very good even if it sounds good, so better to just make it work (badly)

[tired flower]

We're beyond the point of testing new features/reworks for Meltdown at this point

[visual torrent]

can just bundle it into the next rebalance mod

[tulip pulsar]

I can't quite tell but do overclocked rooms still emit waste heat even if they're idle?

[jaunty void]

no

however, overclocked shields produce heat when they lose power, which includes the passive power drain

[tulip pulsar]

so far the rooms I like to overclock are pretty much just the reactors

[visual torrent]

it depends on the room

[tulip pulsar]

weapons?

ngl it's kinda funny how we can overclock fire extinguishers

[visual torrent]

the ones with strong alpha strike potential do

[tulip pulsar]

we kinda need a bigger room that's just a tall fire hose so we can do firetruck stuff on other ships

[tulip pulsar]

I see, I've only tried out the chainguns and deck cannons

[silver jay]

from what i know

[silver jay]

all overclocked shieleds emit 40 heat passively
oc reactors only emit waste heat when they regen power (for something like a control rool, this can count as idle)
oc deck guns emit 40 heat passively
oc capacitors emit i think 50 heat passively

i think thats it

[inland mulch]

What factory-builder games have you tried for ideas? Factorio, ect.

[tulip pulsar]

I've tried OC'd PD turrets and they're kinda all over the place, I can't tell if its just cuz they're so close to each other, heating each other up with waste heat or I'm doing heat management wrong

[silver jay]

OD PD only generates heat when its generating energy, so if its full no energy is wasted. however, post your PD setup, i can maybe help troubleshoot

[tulip pulsar]

dang...I just closed my game 😅

[silver jay]

dwdw

all good

[tulip pulsar]

it's basically just a normal 4 PD setup with a capacitor but has like 4 heat exchangers and radiators on em

[silver jay]

whuh

[tulip pulsar]

just the 4 PD modules and some exchangers and radiators around em

[potent finch]

thanatos alredy was added

[graceful kiln]

you can connect overclocked systems to heat pipes directly

otherwise, keep in mind that heat exchangers have a limit on how much heat they can collect per second, and them collecting heat makes more heat

[tulip pulsar]

dang...that's probably it

I relied on exchangers cuz there's just no compact way to pipe the PD modules

I'll try again later

[graceful kiln]

I think one exchanger is enough for about two PD's?

I'm not 100% sure on that though

[tulip pulsar]

with direct piping? probably

[graceful kiln]

oh no not radiators

one radiatior can provide 4 easily

[tulip pulsar]

I see

[smoky wolf]

I remember Oneye telling me in an official design contest that mining lasers were not allowed, double standard >:[

[potent finch]

with how stronger the oc ones are i hope we'd be able to use them

[rapid galleon]

deck weapon with low power usage and no tall part dead zone in theory sounds busted

its low range makes up for that

[potent finch]

that and haveing to figure out how to pipe them

[rapid galleon]

if youre low on space one heat exchanger can work on 2 lasers

[eternal wave]

one question

is Io supposed to be like "stronger" than imperium in terms of difficulty for the player to deal with

or are the more of equals

or is imperium still the one supposed to be the harshest

[potent finch]

Due to overclocking being stronger, they are suposed to be stronger

even more so with the funny bit about them imediately beating up imperium when they showed up

[eternal wave]

ohhhhhhh yeahhhhhh

now i'm not sure if i add a new boss post my imperium boss for my mod, or keep the imperium boss as the final one

[quiet dune]

I don't know if that counts as straight up beating given that they had surprise against an exceedingly unprepared opponent

[potent finch]

ture, plus it could have been a 1/3 chance of another faction

true*

[past pebble]

i mean nukes still perform well against overclocks

maybe io had flak tbh

[empty canopy]

they just invaded while oc flak was busted

[pseudo crystal]

I dunno I think imperium has 5x the weapons per ship when compared to io

and oc weapons are 2x stronger at best

[tidal lava]

I think part of it is just that OC changes the defence calculation in a way that wasn't accounted for by the other factions when they were made.

My TRL ship punches far above its weight class in career for just this reason

[lyric sail]

OC ships are gucci meaning you get more dakka in a smaller ship

[tidal lava]

I haven't played with OC rail recently but IMO they're busted

Back when I did use them, they made my railfan into a delete a rectangular section of ship button

[foggy fractal]

what is this mod?

[eternal wave]

#modding message

[foggy fractal]

thanks

[past pebble]

okay but oc flak

the universe itself had to nerf it for a reason

[kind mountain]

Why is OC Electrobolt spam effective as an offensive option 💀

It just ignores armor and damages internals

[eternal solstice]

only for smaller ships that don't use cannons

[potent finch]

i think it has to do with being able to pierce, so instead of only 100dps, you get more then that

with suport it actualy is scary

theres a io ship that uses 4 of them plus a thermal lance and the thing is honistly realy strong

this one

[kind mountain]

Uhuh?

Oh god it's even better with a TRL supporting it

OH GOD

[eternal solstice]

O

[kind mountain]

Does TRL reduce penetration defense+HP??? That's the only thing I can think of

[silver jay]

yea

it does

heat reduces penetration resist and increases damage taken

also, does anyone else have the issue of:

selecting soemthing to be salvaged like a ship part, but it doesnt automaticlaly suck up the rseources like in stable?

[tulip pulsar]

Do OC'd rooms in a line automatically connect to the heat network even if only the ends are piped? I can't tell just yet

[eternal solstice]

nope, though non-OCable heat parts generally do if there's more than one

[tulip pulsar]

I see, not even if the orange ports align? guess a PD wall needs way more pipes than I thought

[eternal solstice]

yuppe

or lots of heat exchangers if that doesn't fit

[tulip pulsar]

That's pretty much my only option rn

[eternal solstice]

(going on about manip beams and storages and factories)
it even sorta happens if I strategically deconstruct storages that have , it just doesn't happen naturally

[eternal solstice]

it's especially tricky to get a swift truce with an overclocked ion beam

[visual torrent]

and due to the way eb pen works in the first place it should be extra strong

[kind mountain]

This is terrifying

I just need better uptime on my TRL

[tired flower]

The disruptor pen damage is a bug - it will only deal damage to the first hit part, so enjoy it while you can

[kind mountain]

😭

NOOOOO

back to my original design 😔

[eternal solstice]

will still be terrifying on small ships

[kind mountain]

Madame Celeste can we please please please please keep the disruptor pen damage 🙏🥺

[eternal wave]

no

[eternal solstice]

keep a tenth of it

or perhaps if possible make it only damage parts it also drains

[fallow zealot]

@everyone Thanks for your continued testing! RC4 is now ready!

• More translation updates for all supported languages.
• Misc updates to existing Great House Io combat ships.
• Removed bonus heat diffusion speed from structure to empty space (was 400%). (We may revisit this mechanic after the stable 0.30.0 release.)
• Removed the following Great House Io ships/platforms because they used structure-cooling techniques that are no longer viable due to the above change: Cleeia, Ipos, Seir, and Small Laser Platform.
• Reduced flak shrapnel field damage pool (2000→1600).
• Fixed Overclocked Tractor Beam ‘Overload’ not disabling on death and getting stuck on after repair.
• Fixed loading of old statuses triggering a huge number of effect ticks, freezing the game.
• Fixed Part Network null reference crash when splitting a ship with ToggledComponents containing certain network components (eg. T.C.M. Launcher).
• Fixed Thermal Resonance Lance ‘flickering’ causing it to not drain (pump) power or generate heat.
• Fixed ResourceConverters resetting progress when losing operationality on the same tick they would have otherwise converted.
• Fixed Overclocked Disruptor bolts dealing damage to every penetrated part instead of only the first.

[rapid galleon]

nooooo

[kind mountain]

NOOOOOOO MY OVERDOSE DISRUPTOR :despair:

[silver jay]

rip structure cooling

[dull marlin]

sorry to ping you but are you currently aware that the OCSC description/stats are currently incorrect and missing information
description says shot speed and damage are lower
stats say shot speed is higher and doesnt list damage

[timber nimbus]

it would make sense if structure cooling were balanced by having structure be a lot easier to melt with heat

[safe patio]

structure cooling makes sense for a 0.30.1 type thing. i'd love to see it come back

[silver jay]

this was fixd

i think

i read it in game recently, it seemed to be fine

[eternal solstice]

huh, opportunity for gotp stuff from modern...

[silver jay]

"fires in a salvo burst and increases firerate, produces heat as a waste product" or something, idr

[prime thicket]

it or something like it probably will make a comeback at some point

it's too cool of a mechanic to entirely drop, imo

[silver jay]

also 20% nerf to oc flak 🙏🏻

we used to pray for days like these

[dull marlin]

oh it was fixed, my appologies

[silver jay]

all good, i think it was a shadowchange

[lost onyx]

which ships were removed? (now that i can't see them anymore)

damn i loved structure cooling

[silver jay]

Cleeia, Ipos, Seir, and Small Laser Platform.

[lost onyx]

maybe nerf it slightly but why remove it :(

[lost onyx]

i mean the files

[silver jay]

oh thats kind of my worry as well

that the save wont load

[tired flower]

The ships themselves are still saved into the file, just their original blueprint is removed

[eternal solstice]

otherwise lost ships would crash games

[silver jay]

appreciate that, ty

[dull marlin]

now my really neat ship doesnt work cause of structure cooling changes :(

[silver jay]

speaking of holy wow oc small cannons are really fun and hit like a tiny island

[hollow siren]

dont delete those designs. set them aside for now. as stated, structure cooling might come back later

[dull marlin]

ik

why was it removed

[tired flower]

Rather not be stuck with a potentially half-baked mechanic that deserves more time and thought. We thought it was cool, too, so hopefully we'll see it back in some form in the future

[grave shard]

heheh, "cool", heheh

also yea, active cooling is soooo much cooler if passive cooling exists

[tulip pulsar]

Any chance we're getting fire fighting turrets in the near future? Would be cool to have as like a quest as well for rescuing ships on fire

[grave shard]

after-cooling 😆

[vestal hinge]

huh yeah a ship rescue mission would be baller

[vestal hinge]

-# distress signal ability from starsector

[late walrus]

Is already somewhat planned and hidden in the game

[scenic thorn]

any particular reason the heat faction is called what it is?

[prime thicket]

why not?

[scenic thorn]

read the codex. cool

meant the lore reason

[visual torrent]

the codex gives the lore reason? it is the great house of io

[late walrus]

Io (Jupiter Moon) has high Vulcanic Activity aka to live there they had to tame it's heat. (Short Version)

[prime thicket]

ah

[silver jay]

small rounding error

[visual torrent]

unplayable

[prime thicket]

do you have small thrust?

[vestal hinge]

what

[silver jay]

actually that might be it

ill check rq

[silver jay]

you'd be right, what the fuck

[vestal hinge]

i need supplies and fuel :)))))))

if it comes from your ships when i blow them up it works just the same :)))))))))

mmm space war crimes

anyways, any notable changes with last update? i see the structure passive cooling thing, is it full removal or is there still some extra

[prime thicket]

structure no longer dissipates extra to space

[vestal hinge]

shiiiiit

thats gonna fuck with some Io ships isnt it

[prime thicket]

i'm not sure if there's still extra diffusion into structure

[prime thicket]

that's why those ones have been removed

[vestal hinge]

oh

funky

[prime thicket]

the patch notes are pinned btw

[vestal hinge]

looks like the only notable is that structure thing yeah

shame

[prime thicket]

OC flak and OC disruptors were also nerfed

[vestal hinge]

oh? lemme see

[prime thicket]

well technically the disruptor one was a bugfix

[vestal hinge]

oh yeah the pin didnt show the whole message

oh yeah they actually fixed oc disruptor lol

[prime thicket]

they also gave it a new bug

doesn't apply its debuff to shields

[vestal hinge]

was wondering when someone was gonna do something abou—

[prime thicket]

it's just a 100 damage projectile

luckily celeste already knows and it'll be fixed

[vestal hinge]

oh ok

[grave shard]

I'm getting chaingun flashbacks

[vestal hinge]

uh oh :))))

the forbidden word :))))))))

[full hinge]

nooo my flaks :(

[sullen laurel]

Nooo disruptors my beloved. come baaack 😢

[full hinge]

wait the disruptor change makes my 8dc finaly free from the cheky attack welp thats a hell ye

[silent cedar]

Still possible to stunlock the ship though

[silver jay]

if theres a single shield it gets fucked, because oc disruptor is bugged rn

[full hinge]

ye but not killed using them

[sullen laurel]

so overclocked disruptors do damage to the first part but disable/drain the other parts right?

[full hinge]

I think so

[sullen laurel]

ok

[celest wind]

they should add these back but only on the lowest difficulty, that would be pretty funny I think

[sullen laurel]

yeh lol

pirate ships that slowly self immolate

[celest wind]

a worthy opponent for new players

[sullen laurel]

indeed

months of raging on forums before they realise they can just run away and win

[tired ore]

I guess now I know the answer to "is there any non-cosmetic difference between heat pipe and heat pipe structure" 🙃

[silver jay]

i dont think there is?

[tired ore]

Not now no 🙂 but sounds like before this patch, structure could offer passive cooling?

[late walrus]

Well heat pipes don't spread heat anyway? Just Transport

[kind mountain]

No.

It really is just aesthetic difference.

You don't expect a closed water pipe to irrigate your fields, no?

[late walrus]

But heat would dissipate actually.... /J

[tired flower]

Structure heat pipes did not have the bonus dissipation. They are intended to be a purely cosmetic variant

[tired ore]

So how did structure cooling work? You would just... put structure areas near oc stuff?

[lost onyx]

oh yeah celeste pls nerf the oc disruptor power drain effect on control rooms 🙏

getting stunlocked isnt very fun

[lost onyx]

^

[silent cedar]

Yea the structure absorbed the heat from the part and dissipated it quickly if next to empty space

[sullen laurel]

how does it work now?

[lost onyx]

it doesnt

it has the same cooling speed as any other part

[sullen laurel]

so no structure cooling at all now

[lost onyx]

well it still cools

just not well

[sullen laurel]

so small ships need pipes etc for everything?

[lost onyx]

yeah 😔

[sullen laurel]

poo.

i was looking forward to that

[full hinge]

or you can make a small 1-time use ship that will shoot and when its out of ammo/energy it just dies like this ones (at least I think they still work like intended)

[worldly agate]

where is thermal canister missile emoji

[empty canopy]

where is great house io

[weary pagoda]

you need to start a new game

[empty canopy]

i forgot to put emoji at the end

[full hinge]

also thows 2 ships are used bu me for the new pvp type hive mind pvp

that I played only 2 times

[weary pagoda]

was it this? 🥀

[full hinge]

wilt the rose

[empty canopy]

no like the actual emoji word
"where is great house io emoji"

[weary pagoda]

ah ok

[full hinge]

idk maybe this? "? lo |_|.io"

idk how to make house or great in text without saying it

[neon token]

Wait, it's already live?

Was structure cooling reverted back?

[quiet dune]

It was removed, yes

[boreal meadow]

congrats on the release!!
joy and sadness, as all the mods break.. lol

[eternal wave]

oh no

[potent finch]

-# Laughs in mod that doesint break due to basicly only haveing ships in it

[eternal wave]

Why is the update video unlisted 😭

[quiet dune]

Probably because it was created pre-launch and Walt forgot to unlist it

[summer shale]

Laser Blasters [when overclocked] fire instantaneous energy beams at high speed, trading individual shot power for an overwhelming volume of fire.

"instantaneous energy beams"

aka, a Laser.

[potent finch]

best part of the video is the bit where the TCM has 3 misiiles then it cuts to it haveing 2

[sullen laurel]

is it worth me starting to minmax a new build yet or shall i just wait for it to be released

[fallow zealot]

Thanks for pointing that out. I had set the video to go live automatically but I guess that didn't work for some reason. (I probably just don't understand YouTube, lol.)

[summer shale]

It'll go live July 30, 2125.

[eternal wave]

drumroll to check the modded collider bug 🙏

[fallow zealot]

Haha yeah, some of the footage is obviously a little out-of-date. One of the hard things about needing to record all the footage weeks in advance.

[potent finch]

lol

[eternal wave]

NOOOO

[summer shale]

No bigons. Only polygons.

Bigons are just lines.

And past grievances. Or something.

[empty canopy]

the launcher remembered where in a missile famine and can't afford more thermal canisters

[severe coyote]

GRAMMAR ERROR!

@walt

[lethal wraith]

thermal resonance lance is now easily my favourite part

with no contest

[severe coyote]

four hours, not fixed. estimated damage: millions

[severe coyote]

my thoughts exactly

[tulip pulsar]

is there an option to make the orange ports always visible? kinda bothers me that I'd have to build the rooms first and OC them before it pops up when I prefer making things in blueprint mode

[tired flower]

You can toggle OC on the blueprint when you're holding a part for placement

[tulip pulsar]

so we'd still have to OC the blueprint first? was hoping for a builder setting to just make the ports always visible regardless if we OC em or not

[tired flower]

Yes, you'd need to still enable the OC toggle when the part is in your 'hand'

[kind mountain]

Just me or does it feel like PD doesn't hit the targets as frequently as before?

[prime thicket]

projectile speeds were increased

PD and flak have had their damage increased to compensate i believe

so yeah they won't hit as often but it'll be more impactful when they do

[visual torrent]

i think hitscan pd should be tried, even if not in this update

it shouldn't have too much actual change beyond very fast projectile (nuke and hypersonic missile mainly), which should not actuallyhave too big an impact

[silver jay]

i advocated for oc pd to be hitscan for performance reasons

[visual torrent]

normal should be too

[tired flower]

In my ideal world, PD projectiles would be slower. I want my Expanse PDCs, damnit

Them missing more often has been mentioned a few times. Not sure what's going on there. I haven't looked into it

[jaunty void]

i propose a compromise, that every odd PD shot is hitscan, and every even PD shot isn't

[tired flower]

PD random velocity between 0 (literally just floats there) and hitscan

PD is a performance problem for sure, buuuuuutttt there's a super hopeful potential improvement in v3 of the physics engine that ours is derived from. Problem is porting it over (it's in C), but I really hope we can try it at some point, because v3 apparently hugely improves on the performance of 'bullets' (Continuous Collision Detection objects)

[timber nimbus]

ah yes i was noticing how badly it sometimes lagged when on e modding weapons that you had to take use of by directing its projectiles to a target through outside means

[smoky wolf]

PD being the most useless and problem child 'weapon' in the game and creqting the most technical challenges too is so in line. Maybe we should just replace the whole thing with a laser defence systen.

[pseudo crystal]

or another chaingun

[visual torrent]

turning pd into a modular system would be nice i think

[eternal solstice]

the roof beam 360° point defense that can strike many things once but only in synchronized fashion

[sullen laurel]

to overclock rails do i have to attach pipes to every segment or does one attached anywhere work?

[quiet dune]

Latter

[sullen laurel]

ok thnks

does the thermal lance act like a pass through pipe or will it separate the network unless the pipes are connected elsewhere?

[fallow zealot]

TRL is pass-through, unlike most other parts.

[sullen laurel]

excellent

thanks

[potent finch]

same with TCM

[sullen laurel]

what other pass through parts are there?

[silver jay]

true

chaingun now shoots down projectiles. surely celeste wont give the thousand yard stare when looking at the chaingun file this time

[tired flower]

Any with heat network lines

[sullen laurel]

ah so the meet in the middle of the part

thanks

[neon token]

When placing tiles, you can see by their graphics if they're pass through.

You can tell by seeing if the yellow line is split at every output, or connected in one point.

[sullen laurel]

can someone explain to me the difference vetween oc rail and regular please.

[eternal wave]

Oc rail: variable charge time, stops penetrating once it's total stored damage is exhausthed, has no diminishing returns on railgun length, generates heat per segment attached

Normal rail: instant fire, no charge time, keeps penetrating and dealing lower damage (may not completely destroy a block) when damage pool is exhausthed, gets less damage bonus per length as you add more

[quiet dune]

It does slightly more than twice as much damage for prohibitive heat cost and a longer firing cycle, the firing cycle also scrambling when it fires so they can't be fired in sequence on the same target like you can with regular railguns

[sullen laurel]

is it worth ocing a short rg?

[eternal wave]

Normal rails can be "railfanned" by moving back and forth targetting a point precisely and taking advantage of the points above ^

[sullen laurel]

honestly considering the low rate of fire of rails anyway id be surprised if ppl arent just switching between modes for convenience

[dull marlin]

honestly really not a fan of the OC thruster flame, id rather have shock diamonds which look much cooler

[smoky wolf]

Having them get a different shade at least would be nice, like a deeper orange or even red.

A slight bluish hue to fit with the magnetic-based radiators could also work.

[eternal solstice]

sorta blank yellow but that's confusible with boost thrusters

[sullen laurel]

this would be nicer instead of elongated tails cos the e-tails cover up the ship. it dont look right burning yourself like that imo

[smoky wolf]

True.

[prime thicket]

vfx for a good bit of meltdown stuff is definitely not final, afaik OC thrust is one of those things

[dull marlin]

yay

[prime thicket]

i do also want the mach diamonds, but the VFX devs have been quite swamped lately so patience is necessary

[pseudo crystal]

Anyways with heat finally being a thing could thruster exhaust zone finally cause heat dmg? Would be cool if oc thrust got a longer exhaust zone as well

[quiet dune]

Absolutely not do you know how many built-ins that would break 😅

You could say "I want to stab saris" and I'd be more onboard

[prime thicket]

well the first part wouldn't cause issues for builtins

[quiet dune]

Yeah that would be fine, I'd be chill with that

[pseudo crystal]

Just in the exhaust zone, if you're talking about the increased oc exhaust zone then I absolutely understand and am willing to back down

Yeah

[prime thicket]

but yeah OC thrust having longer deadzones would cause a whole host of issues

[pseudo crystal]

I would make the exhaust heat cap at a fairly low amount tho to not cause too much trouble

[quiet dune]

There's like 400~600 ships in the game by now, and more than half would be broken 😭

[dull marlin]

i mean it wouldnt break builtins if heat was only applied in the exclusion zone

which is what i think is being asked for

[pseudo crystal]

It is

[dull marlin]

being able to get around a thrusters exclusion zone is actually a pretty big buff so it should probably have a high amount of heat

[pseudo crystal]

Yeah but there may be friendly fire issues

[dull marlin]

true

[pseudo crystal]

Hmm

Maybe it should only apply heat when close to 100% thrust?

[dull marlin]

there was a whole elimination pvp archetype built around smushing a ship together to make it smaller and ignore thruster deadzones, in its time it was pretty strong

[dull marlin]

the heat applied value should be some combination of thrust and distance

[eternal solstice]

well isn't that what the OC thrust-heat would do anyway

[eternal wave]

hmmmm hypothetically i coullld try something
idk if i can make the gradient work OR make it react to how strong but maybe

gradient might be possible by having 2 plume sprites together

[pseudo crystal]

Actually thinking about it more I'd maybe ignore thruster heat dmg until the ai update so that collision avoidance is improved first

Because I could see a civ ship getting stuck on a station and melting it

[eternal solstice]

time to make every station burn for no reason

[past pebble]

yeah prolly
like a 10 10 255 situation

[eternal wave]

it would be awesome if these automatically happened with hotter and hotter thrust boosts instead of directly attached to overclock yknow

a modded 400% thrust multiplier would get that applied instead of the normal plume hyper stretched

[past pebble]

thatd be hard to vfx

[eternal solstice]

proobably not as hard

[eternal wave]

higher than 100% activation: heavily slow down how much extra thrust makes it alongated
higher than 150%: begin fade in shock diamonds and purplish tint
higher than 200%: finish fade in and blue with finishing purple

i'm not sure how fading in and out the effect plumes can really work but something like that makes sense to me

i think the fire particles can get the value of intensity and apply to that maybe

color shifting

[hollow siren]

diamond thruster flames you say...

[silver jay]

-# solve my rubix cuBE HOLY SHIT THATS SO MANY TINY CANNOSN WHAT HAVE I DONE

[hollow siren]

inspired one of the fastest built Rekyu vessels to date.... these normally take me hundreds of hours of overoptimizing and some dont actually reach their final forms

[vestal hinge]

the abomination frfr

[rapid galleon]

abomination reference?!?!?!?

[severe coyote]

heat brick my beloved

[eternal wave]

factory_ammo doesnt have specifying its fire its just status chance of nothing

another bug: seems like Resonance beam turret's DestroyedHeatEffects dont get affected by anything?

missing FactorHitEffectsWith = HeatStorage like the thermal battery

[silver jay]

i dont know if im doing something wrong, but OCHLs feel a bit underwhelming to me

[quiet dune]

Balance or spectacle-wise?

[dull marlin]

balance wise they deal more damage even though the numbers say less
aoe is funky like that

[topaz inlet]

agree that the ochl effects don't look super impressive rn

[silver jay]

both. for how long they take to fire, i dont think they deal that much damage. i am firing them all at once, so its possibly overkill damage doing its thing. the explosion is nice, but i dont think its worth. i could be very very wrong

the effects are also not great, but i know a really simple fix is just slowing down the charge animation instead of actually lowering the firerate directly (inverse of small blaster basically). i imagine there'll be other stuff too

[silver jay]

actually, i imagine with TRL + like 8 of them, itd be better to alternate fire instead of fire at the same time

[eternal wave]

another bug: ion emitters dont have firing animation for overclock

as seen by the harsher red in the non oc

[prime thicket]

they also don't have the firing sound

[silver jay]

the firing sound seems intentional

[tulip pulsar]

https://discordapp.com/channels/314103695568666625/1401430093850480691

Just saying

[weary pagoda]

i agree that that would look epic

[dull marlin]

https://discord.com/channels/314103695568666625/1401523700531986524

[eternal solstice]

is OC FTL gonna be one activation (tractor beam) or all activation (FTL jump)

[hollow prairie]

If I use Mining Laser as a weapon, should I overclock it?

[quiet dune]

It's arguably unusuable as a weapon non-overclocked

[hollow prairie]

When overclocked the stats show that it deals half as much damage...

[quiet dune]

It deals aoe, meaning it hits multiple parts, dealing that damage more than once

[prime thicket]

not even necessarily multiple parts, multiple 1x1 grid tiles of the same part can be hit

so a 2x1 armour thing will take the damage twice

[quiet dune]

I didn't know that, nice

[silver jay]

oh. thats why they deal so much damage

[eternal wave]

ok maybe i should compile small bugs i posted here and little suggestions into a proper post

[dull marlin]

at some point a dev pointed out what inspired how cosmoteer radiators work (based on a real technology iirc) and i cant find it for the life of me

[prime thicket]

curie point radiators, iirc

[severe coyote]

yes

[prime thicket]

#1370799036591898837 message

[dull marlin]

tysm!

[lost onyx]

@tired flower weird question but were there any change to OC rails whatsoever in the past few days?

or would that appear as a bug fix or something

[tired flower]

Nope, no changes

[lost onyx]

huh

no bug fixes or anything

i was doing this consistently yesterday but i cant seem to get a single good volley now

its probably just a skill issue

[sullen laurel]

how are you supposed to counter overclocked flak!?!

[rapid galleon]

more flak

[dull marlin]

theoretically overwhelm it or run it out of ammo, shooting a bunch of lasers or PD may work

it's in a very powerful state rn

[safe patio]

best i've found is to use a TRL to cook some of the armor on the sides of the ship, then let the thing burn while the ammo runs out

[visual torrent]

you don't

either you can outthrust and outpilot the opponent or use tb on some ships to flip it

otherwise there's not much counterplay

[sullen laurel]

maad

my test platform ship with 8cgs, 6oc mining lasers,2 oc railg , trl and thermal missiles just got cooked by an io ship a fraction of its size cos 4 flak blocked essentially all outgoing dps

[dull marlin]

jfc

[sullen laurel]

i wasnt even testing combat readiness 😭 i was supposed to be functionally testing weapon output. (i.e does everything work at once and will it set itself on fire)

[silver jay]

i think we need to straight up kill oc flak

[visual torrent]

https://discord.com/channels/314103695568666625/1401653358770786394 isforme

[sullen laurel]

oc flak should be something else lol

it feels like you always need it

and thats a problem imo

[weary pagoda]

thats smart

[lost onyx]

its also very difficult to do

[smoky wolf]

Boo, mainstream narrative.

I won a tournament using them.

[eternal solstice]

non-clocked mininglazors have similar advantage to ion beams, now combine that with thermal soften-everything...

[smoky wolf]

(It was a joke FFA tournament but POINT STANDS)

[smoky wolf]

Bad weapons don't get nerfs, and ML got a nerf in meltdown to deal less damage to alive parts.

[visual torrent]

sadly walt broke the record of having ml as the strongest weapon that only got buffs

[empty canopy]

no, you won with bribery

[quiet dune]

Intentionally making yourself look weaker and thus less of a threat via mining lasers doesn't seem a compelling argument if the foundation of their usage is ineffectiveness 😆

[empty canopy]

that wasn't the point of them i think nick just made an armor brick and then told people to help him for paintjobs and it worked, the ml was just back up weapon

[quiet dune]

Ah, FFA my beloved

The place where dirty tactics are not just expected but mandatory

[empty canopy]

that's why i love it but it is sad that it's less popular

[quiet dune]

Its truly a fantastic gamemode because it self balances

[empty canopy]

is it intentional that hiding a layer flips the currently selected decal on that layer?

[eternal solstice]

huh...

had to doublecheck i didn't delete shoot.wav

but for some reason it only works with overclock

[silver jay]

did we get an update?

i think we go tan update but im not sure becuase theres no notes or mentions (couldve just came out)

[fallow zealot]

We got a hotfix, patch notes should be on Steam.

[past pebble]

😭 i thought we stopped using AreaDamage as a vanilla thing

[silver jay]

@eternal wave you finally got your fix

[eternal wave]

https://tenor.com/view/ascending-energy-galaxy-gif-17739196

[visual torrent]

very bad

imo

[lost onyx]

Wait wha?

[eternal wave]

explosive damage (raycasts from the center go out and go deeper depending on parts)
area damage (deals damage to everything in its radius regardless if line of sight is blocked)

[lost onyx]

Oh

When was that changed?

[eternal wave]

i think ever since mining laser overclock existed i guess

Explosive damage with damagetype = salvage would be cool but might not be too different

[lost onyx]

Huh

[silver jay]

from what i know missiles and oclasers use explosive and ocmls use area right

[eternal wave]

oc lasers use area damage

thats how they ignore shields

i disagree with areadamage being used at all in vanilla but not sure what else could be used that would be better and more interesting

i really want to see explosions with damagetype = default and slices = 1 (this makes it splash 100% of its damage and spread to extra tiles if that tile gets destroyed, not wasting anything) on things

[prime thicket]

they apparently don't hit blocks if it impacts on a shield

[eternal wave]

how odd, might have been changed but that was its previous behaivour

[silver jay]

from what i know, they do

[prime thicket]

was changed in one of the previews or unstables

[silver jay]

OCMLs partially ignore my extended shields that are right over my larges

pretty much everything else ignores it, but OCMLs eat through it

[eternal wave]

this would be straight upgrade to ions for example
i gotta fix my ion beam damage replacer mod and suggest this
(i think i already suggested? damn)

[eternal solstice]

was this also fixed or just the ion

[silver jay]

i was gonna say i dont think ions need that anymore because oc ions are incredible at preventing overkill damage from being a thign

2000 damage per second vs 3 separate 180 damage strikes

[eternal wave]

i dont see why not add it tbh
normal ions would fall behind being less usable at high overkill levels

[silver jay]

oc ions are better in massive cores but massive cores are still a massive bitch to pipe and radiate the heat from

normal ions are probably better in that rammer sort of thing in pvp where there arent that many and they all use different prisms locked into 1 location so the damage is spread out

i think oc ions were created with that intention partially in mind

[eternal wave]

yeah id imagine

[silver jay]

that and kites

i will say i feel like the regular ions should be the ones for kiting and the oc ions should be better at close range but im not a balancer and i imagine its a technical limitation

[dull marlin]

just bringing it to your attention, capacitors and OCcapacitors dont have a listed battery pickup time

[visual torrent]

true!!!!!

i think for mining laser it's ok since it's utility but definitely not for laser

[eternal wave]

mining laser but only for junk or ores maybe

[silver jay]

have you seen how much damage ocmls do?

how does area daamage work against shields? as in the projection

becuase theres no way its 400/s

[visual torrent]

yeah

[visual torrent]

nah

[eternal wave]

it could do the equivalent damage without areadamage

[visual torrent]

only buffs for the strongest weapon

[silver jay]

true

[visual torrent]

what is sulfer

[lost onyx]

American english spelling patch notes: made it worse

[silver jay]

im american

sulfer is a fucking thing?? i thought it was a misspelling

[fallow zealot]

fixed, thanks

[eternal wave]

benefits for io: its so cool
cons for io: oh no the pirates have them

oh thats interesting io can spawn in the starting system

[potent finch]

yep

[eternal wave]

scary

[silver jay]

thankfully they dont hurt that bad starting out

unlike imperium which can have a nuke at t3

osprey...

[potent finch]

meanwhile my t1 ships, (i did used to have a t1 nuke but it got scraped)

[silver jay]

what hte hell is that deprestor ship

[eternal wave]

heat missiles

tcms i mean

Thank you Cceleste for being so awesome

[dull marlin]

OCHL are supposed to deal 1.5k damage per shot to every tile in a 2m radius right?
if so thats not how they are functioning right now

inconsitant damage amounts both on indivual hit tiles and unequal damage across the radius

[tired flower]

They have damage falloff, like other radius effects

[dull marlin]

I see, makes sense and is interesting

that doesn't fully explain the tile getting hit taking less than 1500 damage per projectile and the inconstancy tho

[tired flower]

The hit tile is not the center of the effect - it's where the projectile hit location is

Inconsistency, I'm not sure. I'm guessing just inaccuracy or something

[smoky wolf]

Actually it was such a funny moment, I won one of the games where I tore off enemy missile kite's exposed cockpit with precision (they had to ram me to not die from RoD)

[severe coyote]

OC flak crazy strong

[lost onyx]

yep

[weary pagoda]

t1s have hyperdrives so they dont become this

[severe coyote]

is it just me or oc heavy lasers are doing way too much damage versus normal large shields

[dull marlin]

they have increased damage vs shields and their aoe effect means they deal damage to shields multiple times

[potent finch]

missiles, the name is also a portamento of depressed jester

[potent finch]

most of them do, fringe has a bunch without drives, and i think io might have 1 or 2

[weary pagoda]

ah ok

[smoky wolf]

Weird that this still hasn't closed considering the official update is already out.

[eternal wave]

not really

there's no reason to unless misused like above

was using to be posting small bugs here but i havent seen new ones

[grave shard]

It's an official release now, so I would think bugs got turned in to #1019741923893858305

[eternal wave]

but what if its just a tiny nitpick 🥺

[visual torrent]

tag: critical

[inland mulch]

https://discord.com/channels/314103695568666625/1395420702470967367 bumping for new viewers

[eternal wave]

ngl i kinda wanted to do a mod or something to suggest more visible flashy projectile effects

but uh

apparently large cannon overclock kinda takes that route already
how interesting

anyway i think this would be great for missiles

[hollow siren]

god i love that projectile effect so much ❤️

[sullen laurel]

https://tenor.com/view/star-trek-first-contact-akira-class-battle-sector001-akira-star-trek-battle-gif-17317557

[regal pier]

I noticed a "bug" in Asmodeus ship - the engines on the left/right don't get any energy:

[potent finch]

The small ones in the center?

If it's those, the oc makes them not need reactor power most of the time

[regal pier]

No, the large ones on the left/right wing.

they don't get distribution of energy via supply and also in practice (tested when this thing was going after a kiter). There is access to the crew, but no one is assigned.

[uneven wraith]

Probably should post it in #1019741923893858305 too

[late walrus]

can we add structure to the subgroup of ions?

[eternal wave]

it would be nicer

unearthing this again from the depths of my mods but its just sprites of those

[visual torrent]

door optimality :(((((((((

[boreal meadow]

pipe crossovers needing doors was one of the things I modded out first for meltdown.. you can see my solution in this mod: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3008620617

[eternal wave]

i could try making my own "underground grated" pipe and submit as a suggestion with free to use/no copyright liscence (i think this is how it would be done right)

hmmmm repairtracker component left behind
dunno how to repro this though

ok this seems to happen when status is repaired

hmmm

[boreal meadow]

unfortunately not good enough spritework to remove the walls completely

[late walrus]

u can optimize that tho? just have walls blend with corridor or is that a special sprite (havent checked pipes in a while)

[boreal meadow]

and open-merging with the corridor did create some issues with crew trying to walk along the pipes

[eternal wave]

my idea/implementation would leave passability in the other way so would be innacurate
limiting doors on those ways would help but yeah not ideal since corridor still possible

[boreal meadow]

like this becomes a 'valid' walk path

[late walrus]

just have forbidden travel directions?

[boreal meadow]

^ ... didn't work without the piece having walls and doors

and trying to forbid 'along pipe movement' using [0, 0] and left/right (or up/down as that's the way its designed) caused the game to crash with pathfinding errors

[late walrus]

ForceManhattan?

[boreal meadow]

no dice 🙁

[late walrus]

offsetiing the traveldirection to the left and right cell?

[eternal wave]

yeah i also had issues with subpart walls like that

old version of datadriven

[boreal meadow]

I tried lots of stuff.. in the end had to settle for a massive negative-crew-speed-buff... to try and force the pathfinding to prefer the 'correct' direction of travel

tried //IsExternal = true, //HasNonContiguousPathing = false

tried;

BlockedTravelCellDirections
{
  //{
  //    Key = [0, 0]
  //    Value = [Up, Down]
  //}
}

and Key = [0,1] and Key = [0, -1]

the issue is them being a 1x1 part.. as if they were a 1x3 you could easily block the 0,0 and 0,2 cells.. leaving the middle 0,1 open for travel

[grave shard]

Did you mod in a solution for why the doors exist? (To prevent door access on the pipe sides)

[boreal meadow]

yes, they still needed the AllowedDoors for when the part is placed against something

and tried many combinations of 'Internal and external wall by cell'

[dull marlin]

i would really like to see this in the base game, it looks much better imo

[eternal wave]

crew still would not be able to travel through a part's heat port

so i dont see why not

like this looks fine to me, would just be a slow path to get to

in my opinion the problem tbh only ends up as door prices

if it turned from 300 to 400 and that change happened yeah i'd not bat an eye it would be fine

in ideal situations you do have to add only 1 extra door so that would be the same price

[lyric sail]

I think the sidewalls are good to keep

[grave shard]

And doesn't risk you missing one of the damn things... which I've already seen more times than not

I mean.... as they currently are, it does kinda give incentive to place them where a door already would go, to save a door. But, above all, it's kinda ugly on the interior

[tired flower]

I did try. RustyDios pretty much covered why it's not so straight-forward

[dull marlin]

alr

[summer shale]

The developers are fuckin' awesome. I just wanted to say that.

If you're a developer and you're reading this, be immersed in the love.