#Engaging Skilling Content

1 messages · Page 4 of 1

cobalt vapor
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Tbh, they should implement forestry style skilling to rs3 along with the rockertunity/sprite system to all gathering skills.

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Whenever you skill with mora than 5 ppl or somethign random events can happen which players can participate on to get extra rewards

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Tho, Im not sure about the events being random, they should probably follow some schedule

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Maybe just eliminate evil tree

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and some random tree becomes an evil tree

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whenever 5 ppl are there and they can kill that evil tree there

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Have both individual and group rewards, but more so individual rewards

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For fishing, i would like to see players going to sea more

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but Ig some random sea monster could spawn and you have to throw harpoons at it or something

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Tbh they could even repurpose some mini game rewards as rewards for these new forestry style skilling events

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Like you can have sacred clay and trouble brewing rewards there

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Or add some gameplay mechanics of those mini game for some of the events that happen

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Idk if I fully agree with repurposing mini games like this, but maybe it could happen to those mini games that are really just bad or dont have that many ppl playing them at all

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Some obv exceptions would be cwars and soul wars

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but there are a lot of rewards in like fist of guthix such as the herb and fish gloves that could repurposed and added as rewards for these random skilling events

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tho I personally do like fist of guthix, I'm sure there could be more discussion about this

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Stuff happening makes sense too, it makes the world feel more alive. Are we just expected to believe that we could chop trees all day or for weeks and nothing happens around?

cobalt vapor
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You could also possbily get components or materials for skilling offhands through these events

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Still lots of offhands the game could use, this could seriously boost skillings profitability. Especially if rock fragments or woodshavings or whetever else you could get from skilling could be used to make new skilling offhands

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Shoot, talk about progression, you could also get auras through some currency obtaind from these events

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and you could upgrade your aura as you progress through your skilling journey

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Make skilling outfits available for purchase maybe

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Shoot there is already a currency you get from skilling actually, it's what u get to make the elite skilling outfits

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Just remove those from invention and add them as buyables from new shops or something

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make it so u get this currency at the start of your skilling journey

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not at lvl 70

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Y'know what maybe sentinel fragments and such are tradeable

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and you use that to make the outfits and so you can even sell those on the ge too

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they could possibly be like chronotes

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This way people could either skill for the outfits or auras or they could buy them

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by buying the currency from ge

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and skillers could make even more money selling this currency, and from the random events too by possibly getting components for skilling offhands

cobalt vapor
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Some minigames that could prob be removed and repurposed without people complaining are prob vinesweeper, trouble brewing, fishing trawler, sorcerer's garden, and Impetuous Impulses, possibly temple trekking.

hollow herald
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impetuous impulses is more so a training method than a minigame

cobalt vapor
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Tai Bwo Wannai Cleanup too

hollow herald
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temple trekking is just fun

cobalt vapor
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Yeah, I like temple trekking too

hollow herald
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vinesweeper's fine as a minigame, but just needs a tuneup

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to be worth the time

cobalt vapor
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Ill be honest with you

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that is a piece of content i have never done

hollow herald
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it's minesweeper but as proactive farming

cobalt vapor
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and i've never heard anything about it from anyone

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that makes sense

hollow herald
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if they combined the store with the manor farm beans

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and improved the xp scaling a bit

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it'd be a decent low / no input farming method

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as it stand though

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it's just not worth putting in time

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unless you don't wanna rng a specific seed

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from a low droprate

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lota seeds missing from the store too

cobalt vapor
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Idk maybe one day vinesweeper was popular but in my head it never has been. I even remember pyramid plunder popping off back then

hollow herald
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never was the most popular thing, but it used to be pretty decent for getting a specific herb seed

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back when the alternative was slayer mobs or master farmers

rose grove
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vinesweeper has a niche

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it is by far the fastest way to get some specific seeds (whiteberry springs to mind)

cobalt vapor
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so it does have a use

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i guess mostly for irons now

rose grove
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yeah I assume they're about 400gp each on ge

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(or whatever the generic 'seeds' floor price is given pof/root)

cobalt vapor
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new wc currency could have a base price for seeds

stoic bear
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agreed its not a proper solution to active skilling. However I do think its a fine addition to have as a bandaid middleground. The few times I afk, I slap on Alt1 and move for timesprites still

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Absolutely, I dont think anyone that is "pro active skilling" is "anti afk skilling" just atm to me it feels imbalanced especially pertaining to gathering skills. Gathering also seems like the easiest to solve by finding ways to make the process involved with the player, I think Artisan and even Support skills are where the trouble would lie.

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Yes absolutely and those are fine and dandy as ways to still allow people to afk but be rewarded for being moderately involved. But, to me, active skilling involves the player in actually playing with game mechanics to gather or create items/xp

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Yeah and I think there isnt enough for those that want to be "very active" for the skilling side. Thats definitely there for pvm (with a high skill ceiling as well)

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going with @cobalt vapor 's categorization of very afk, afk, active, very active; I'd put safecracking in active leaning inactive. Obviously the lil shimmer system to rapidly crack the safe is there, but you dont HAVE to interact with it to open a safe.

stoic bear
stoic bear
hollow herald
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will admit it was more fun when it was properly balanced

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another casualty of eoc

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still entertaining though

stoic bear
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Another thought on the "bandaid" solution would be to integrate the stamina system into the rest of the gathering skills? could also find a way to revamp stamina a bit to really make it the "active" players friend

brazen jackal
stray sonnet
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Rather have fewer of those methods, as they aren't meant as fun gameplay

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Connecting afk skilling to active skilling by having like a portal to the active activity next to the afk activity, that I would like

stoic bear
pale mural
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I think Temple Trekking is still super fun tbh. Solid rewards still and lots of unique strategies for completion.

stoic forge
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I still need to find finish of TT. Everyone just levels up slowly

stray sonnet
stoic bear
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It's okay to split content

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"This upcoming update is an active method, the following update will be an afk method"

stray sonnet
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But you said you like being active like with rockertunitinies. I'm just saying this is a better way to do it where the active option is actually meant to be fun

stoic bear
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I said its a fine bandaid solution. And also I don't see how making an active involving skilling method is fun by having a portal for an afk version

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To me that just says that everything in the game should be afkable or in the case of bosses soloable/groupable. And that's just not healthy, it breaks down the game. That's why skilling kinda sucks for a lot of people that enjoy playing actively, its been all too catered to the afk mentality and completely redundant to try to do it actively when it doesn't really benefit you to do so

stray sonnet
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I feel like rockertunities are kinda like that. You design 1 thing to be everything at once where it's afk first and then an active option added on top. So it ruins the vision of the active content by being tied down to an afk option

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That's why you need an actual active option that was designed to be active first next to the afk option

stoic bear
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Yes im just lost on why you mention a portal then? Cuz everything you said there is what I want. The portal thing is what throws me off.

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Like if you release a new grove of trees that actual require you to very actively cut them down, where does a portal come in and actually make sense in the world?

stray sonnet
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Like why have rockertunity/time spirte/fort focus gameplay for an active variant when you can just have the portal

stoic bear
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I don't want a portal. Just add a new method

stray sonnet
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Why not both

cobalt vapor
# stray sonnet Like why have rockertunity/time spirte/fort focus gameplay for an active variant...

I don't think anyone will disagree with more active and engaging Skilling content. But we also need a better and improved system for gathering skills, a standard if you will, for any tree, for any rock, for any fishing node. No one will disagree with new engaging content that is outside the standard of how gathering skills normally work. But the base system itself of how players gather resources could also use a touch up and the sprite/focus system offers some variety while not necessarily taking away for those just want to afk. My suggestion for events was also to even add more variety to gathering Skilling through events. But this only happens when a lot of people are in one Skilling area. This is heavily inspired by osrs' forestry update to wc. Which basically does that.

Without events this kinda already has been implemented to divination. On which the more people there are the higher the chance for enriched springs and the longer they last. This could happen with other skills too. I'm not entirely against a portal that takes you to a place where more active content happens, but what, were just going to have portals at every Skilling location? Wouldn't that be a little silly? Besides that, like I said, the base system of how resources are gathered could and should probably be improved too.

stray sonnet
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The portal idea by itself could be silly indeed if not done right but I think the focus option is a bit silly too and doesn't take away from afk either. Both could be in a sense a necessary evil for the sake of having better design. I think even removing rockertunities but having a portal to a new mining minigame instead (like safecracking) would offer greater enjoyment overall.

cobalt vapor
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Well only you can see the sprite when your Skilling, a portal would probably be visible to everyone even without Skilling. Also like I said something should be done with base gathering Skilling too

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I'll give you this, maybe it isn't a portal, maybe it could be a hole you could go down under to some new activity or something. Something more natural

quiet surge
stray sonnet
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It needs to be a fun version of the skill though

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Like a hole to a safecracking place in this case

cobalt vapor
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Might just be me, but I find guthix caches more fun than safe cracking

stray sonnet
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For sure, group elements always help. Either competition or teamwork mechanics

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Just a shame that it can't be done all the time

cobalt vapor
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What do you like about safecracking? You've been bringing it up. I ask cause I don't see it to be much different than time sprites in practice. You either afk them or you gotta click ig the glowy thingies and eventually you can move on to another safe or just stay there. I guess moving to more locations add variety to safecracking.

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I guess clicking the glowy thingies do require more attention and precision

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in safecracking

quiet surge
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i think there's a range of how active and afk these activities can be, and how players prefer them.

there could be a short and quick vote on how each player ranks each activity on a scale of 1 to 10 (1 = most afk, 10 = most active), while also including how much they enjoy it

stray sonnet
# cobalt vapor What do you like about safecracking? You've been bringing it up. I ask cause I d...

4 things.

  1. It has progression so it feels natural in the world as something that you do all the time. Low level safes and high level safes, just like big game hunter.
  2. It was designed to be active first and afk second. You listening to the unlock sound and clicking on time was definitely designed active first since it automatically unlocking sometimes doesn't sound like something that was designed afk first. Like it's not natural design.
  3. Since it has progression, it can be expanded upon, like potentially new safes with 110 thieving. This means that JMods have a clear foundation to work on with 110 thieving. We need more of these minigame-ish foundations, baselines for the skill that are easy to expand upon. Though 110 could still add an extra mechanic.
  4. Besides listening to the blue box thing that also has a visual telegraph, it's also fun teleporting around the world doing different safes, kinda like clue scrolls and then the listening bit is kinda stationary enjoyment in between.
stray sonnet
cobalt vapor
# stray sonnet 4 things. 1. It has progression so it feels natural in the world as something t...

  1. Progression as you go to low lvl safes and then high lvl safes? Or that you unlock higher lvl safes as you lvl up theiving? Is it that low lvl safes remain somewhat relevant in the training method? and that feels like progression? I ask cause depending on what you mean, every skill has some form of progression, as you lvl up you get access to new rocks or new skilling content. I assume you mean the relevance of including low lvl safes in your trips to high lvl safes?

  2. I mean idk how it was meant to be designed but you certainly have to pay more attention to the cues to unlock safes. If anything I suppose safe cracking is active skilling. So I suppose you like that it requires players to listen to the cues to unlock safes.

  3. I mean there could be new trees too or rocks or fish too, that can be progression too. Idk if i'd call safecracking a mini game. It just has you travelling around to different safes and unlocking them by listening to the cues. Like there aren't teams, and you're not going against anyone or anything necessarily, there's no score, there aren't rounds.

  4. Yeah, the visuals and sounds do help. Arch and mining have them too. The only difference is you don't necessarily have to time them. And yeah travelling is fun as it kinda gives you a break from what could otherwise become a grind.

So yeah, idk about the progression thing and mini game thing. But I think your biggest point is that safecracking is active first and afk second. I think you're right. For the most part safecracking isn't as afk as mining or arch. It certainly requires more player attention to keep on safecracking. I don't think this is necessarily a bad or a good thing. I think it could be an issue if there wasn't a completely afk way to do thieving but pickpocketing has become the afk method for thieving.

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I think a main issue here is the decision whether they should introduce new methods which are more active vs. improve the current methods so they could give players various options on how afk or active they want to be

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Tbh, I think they should do both

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I think you may also mean that you like that you make progress in unlocking the safe?

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Every time you click the safe at the right time?

stray sonnet
# cobalt vapor 1. Progression as you go to low lvl safes and then high lvl safes? Or that you u...
  1. Meant that it has progression for safecracking, so you can have fun with the skill early on and that defines the fun part of the skill. Instead of being a random level 90 minigame. Feels natural since it's the whole journey, fits into the world and that's what you remember the skill by.
  2. Basically safecracking is fun while doing it actively, so you can kinda deduce that it was designed active first.
  3. The point was that we want fun skilling, so it's easier to design if it has progression too.

What I mean by minigame is just an innovative way to train the skill

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Progression is that there is a safe at level 60 but a different safe at level 90

cobalt vapor
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I think I get what you mean, yeah. I think for active content the safecracking methods of clicking at the right time do make it more fun as it requires the player to be engaged, by having to listen and then that is rewarded by making progression in unlocking the safe.

Still tho, people do like afking, it feels nice to make progression as people do other irl stuff. I don't think this should change, I really like it and I'm sure many people who play the game do too. Time sprites allow for more variation when doing regular skilling, without necessarily forcing people to be active. They give players the option to be active or just afk in regular skilling. Even more options could be added if events were introduced. Being afk and having the option to play how you want to play is one of the big things that make runescape awesome, specially now with mobile. Like I said, I wouldn't argue against one or the other. I think the game needs both.

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But yeah, new content like safecracking for other skills sounds awesome.

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It probably helps that you can get like what, 1.5m xp an hr base safecracking too, lol

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That makes it worth it and rewarding, if safecracking gave like 200k xp an hr, it might be a different story.

stray sonnet
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Didn't mean progress by unlocking the safe but rather progress through the skill by only doing safes if the player enjoys safes a lot but something like that.

I still don't think having a portal is all that different than time sprites. Maybe when you're at work you just afk pickpocket and actively click once every 15 minutes but when you have some free time you actively engage with the game by going through the portal and doing something different but still leveling the same skill

stray sonnet
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I'm not sure about events. When I have time to engage with the game then I want to be constantly immersed

cobalt vapor
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Yeah, I don't think most people would disagree with this, I don't think.

stray sonnet
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Need safecracking but mining version too

cobalt vapor
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Yeah!

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I still think the current methods need to be improved tho

cobalt vapor
# stray sonnet Maybe, I'm just talking about the design rn

Oh it does matter. There is a lot of fun content the game has, like mini games, great orb project can be really fun. But people just don't do it because the rewards aren't there it's just not worth it. We're older now, we have less time to play and we want to get out times worth

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Specially on an mmo were progression is like basically the top thing

cobalt vapor
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Thank for pointing that out, I do think you made a very good point.

stray sonnet
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Mhm and then there can be a fun sole method just like that for every skill and you can hop between them or go afk for a bit if they get burnt out of 1

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But ye I try

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I try to sponge up all the design information and make my deduction lel

stoic bear
stoic bear
stoic bear
stoic bear
stoic bear
# stray sonnet Didn't mean progress by unlocking the safe but rather progress through the skill...

Also I want the activity for an active method to be differentiated from an afk method. Like safecracking vs pickpocketing, which is also why im thrown off by you mentioning a portal. I dont want it to be just pickpocketing but more active, I want it to be something entirely different that simply requires the player to interact with the game constantly more than just clicking a single guy on repeat. (Thieving example but spans to every skill)

stray sonnet
stray sonnet
stray sonnet
stoic bear
stoic bear
# stray sonnet I don't really get the point here

because its just new content, i dont just want them to rework how mining works as a whole just so i can actively hit a rune rock. I want something that is completely different from find rune rock and hit rune rock

stoic bear
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I just dont want it to be a one and done "engaging skilling content" done

stray sonnet
stray sonnet
stray sonnet
stoic bear
cobalt vapor
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I mean the portal could just be a piece of jewlery that teles u there ig

stoic bear
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imma crashout if someone mentions anymore portals

stray sonnet
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It needs to be an accessible portal that everyone can use to opt-in into being active to do something fun, unlike rockertunities

cobalt vapor
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I'm not sure I fully understand how time sprites and the portals are the same? Is it cause u can just go from afk to active quick ig?

stray sonnet
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Yeah and the active option is actually fun

cobalt vapor
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I mean I think we're discussing 2 different ways of doing things

stoic bear
stray sonnet
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Rockertunities aren't designed to be fun

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So they can just be done in a better way

stoic bear
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because they were designed on top of an afk first method

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i dont want to take away from afk players

cobalt vapor
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Yeah, i dont think most will argue that they

stoic bear
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i want something new that was designed for active play

cobalt vapor
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re fun

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but they have their place

stray sonnet
stray sonnet
stoic bear
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brother

cobalt vapor
stoic bear
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rockertunities arent supposed to be afk, thats the point. its an option on top of an afk thing to reward you for being active

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just like you wanted

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where you're working so you afk for a bit

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then you have some time

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so you interact with the rockertunity

stray sonnet
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No, I want the active option to be designed to be fun

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And also to be opt-in

stoic bear
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yes and we want that too so we're saying to add that as well

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theres no reason to remove rockertunity because its fine

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just make a new mining method thats also active

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completely new from the existing afking rocks

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with no portals

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emphasis on that last part

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i dont want the new content to be afkable

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at all

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otherwise its not an active method

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thats the point of active play, you dont opt into afking or not with it

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if you want to afk, you go do the existing afk thing

stray sonnet
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Active content should be opt-in

stoic bear
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thats why its new yes

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if ur doing the content at all

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ur opting in

stray sonnet
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No you're walking there for 5 mins

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Thus, a portal

stoic bear
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-.-

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do you just want to be able to sell stuff to the ge from the rocks too or?

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and bank at the rock

stray sonnet
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I want streamlined design

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And I don't think rockertunities add anything

stoic bear
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so you want to be able to chose what type of rock is infront of you

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click the rock, make it a bane rock and hit it

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then swap that rock to animica when ur lvl 90

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disable movement in game

stray sonnet
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I'm confused

cobalt vapor
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I don't think the portal thing is feasible either. There are 20 something skills in the game should there a portal at every afk location for them?

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Just to access the active content?

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I don't think Bologna disagrees with more methods like safecracking either that have that progression. It's just that we also wana keep the options for afking and semi afking too

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I keep accidently hitting enter :c

stray sonnet
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I'm imagining 2 baselines for the skill. For example pickpocketing afk and safecracking active. You would have it for every skill, so you would want a quick transition between the 2 cores of the skill which should be obvious

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Like an obvious method to interact with both

cobalt vapor
stray sonnet
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I didn't think much about semi-afk but big game hunter and safecracking kinda have afk parts

cobalt vapor
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Well yes, but the whole basis of bgh requires u to be active, to hide, make, load the ballistas, get poison from the frogs, fire the ballistas. Even tho bgh or content like it has afk parts, I wouldn't call those semi afk

stoic bear
stray sonnet
stray sonnet
cobalt vapor
stoic bear
stray sonnet
cobalt vapor
cobalt vapor
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This way you could easily teleport to locations without portals by just right clicking your axe or ur outfit or something.

stray sonnet
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If it's a bronze axe then that would be pretty core to the gameplay I suppose

stray sonnet
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Leaning towards a no but still thinking about it

cobalt vapor
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I see it as just giving people more options about how they go about gameplay. I don't think there's anything wrong with that, more benefits than anything imo

stray sonnet
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Like options just for having options?

cobalt vapor
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options will be used

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Like I said, I find myself doing the sprite more often than not

stray sonnet
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There needs to be a point to it though. Like maybe you'd rather be being afk and enjoying something else but in the back of your mind looking forward to that portal and doing bgh instead

cobalt vapor
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Sometimes people don't wana be active liek do bgh, sometimes they dont wana be completely afk

stray sonnet
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I'm not sure how often people feel like that, like it might get kinda tedious

cobalt vapor
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Well that's the thing once you don't feel like it, u just dont follow the sprite

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or ig u do something more active

signal rune
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There's appeal to all 3 for different groups and moods

stray sonnet
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If you're doing the sprites kinda temporarily, I'm not sure if it would offer like, a big portion of enjoyment though

signal rune
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you have afk, you have low-effort but "I'm doing something" lean forward, and you have something more skill based and exciting/non-afkable

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which would usually be minigames or something unique

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RS has usually done 1 and 2, OSRS has usually done 2 and 3 then started introducing afk unlock activities as unique cases

cobalt vapor
stray sonnet
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I still think it sounds a bit silly. Like I wouldn't actively think I'm in the mood to be semi-afk

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Like I'm always doing the rockertunity but like I'd rather have a portal. I pretty much never go completely afk

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It's a strange topic

cobalt vapor
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I don't think there's a problem with having both

stray sonnet
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I feel like it's a bit bloated for overall design

cobalt vapor
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Nah

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A lot of this stuff is already implemented

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In mining, arch

stray sonnet
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Those don't have a big game hunter and safecracking variant

cobalt vapor
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Yeah, they can have that too

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We can have 2 things at once

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I meant the sprite thing

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just have the outfit tele u to active content

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outfit teles u back

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once the active content is there

signal rune
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why is there a portal instead of someone just saying "I want to go do the active activity"

stray sonnet
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For streamlined design

signal rune
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no

stray sonnet
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?

cobalt vapor
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I think he means no portals

stray sonnet
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Confusing

signal rune
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you don't need some heavyhanded "change everything you're doing on a dime for a new activity" setup for most of the game

stray sonnet
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That's rockertunities

signal rune
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no that's not

stray sonnet
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Seems so

signal rune
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if you can't see the difference between opting into clicking a glowing rock/4 ticking the rock in the same environment because it's all one system and "I'm afking grabbing lizards, guess I want to stop afking time to walk through the big portal next to me to enter bgh" or something, idk what to say

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there's plenty of more elegant solutions than that

stray sonnet
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Just talking about the concept, don't need to be elegant when talking about the concept

rose grove
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rockertunities are an essentially afk way of skilling

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they're predictable, have an audio cue etc

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hitting a rockertunity is far less jarring than going to a high-intensity method (which mining DESPERATELY NEEDS it's just bad atm)

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nobody is bothered about it taking a full minute (it's rs3, 5 mins is unrealistic) to go from afk to an active method

stray sonnet
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If the active method is the core of the skill, shouldn't it be connected to what you are doing most of the time which is afking?

Also if cutting out rockertunities, I feel like people would have more fun with skilling overall. For example cache isn't jarring in the way it looks or anything. Just imagine that was a constant minigame

signal rune
rose grove
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base mining could do with being nerfed by about 20% such that 4t could be about a 40% buff

cobalt vapor
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I suggested player owned castles and towns in a player owned island for construction as a way to make construction a better avenue for player creativity. But it has also made me think of the possibility of crafting also being an avenue for player creativity in the game. Being creative is engaging. Could it be possible for players to design clothing? I feel there should be something. I know you're able to color rune & steel helms and shields with ur crest via cosntr, but I really feel this could be expanded

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I know there should probably be limitations, but I think it be interesting to have pieces of clothing players could design and change the colors of. They could even be the clothes our characters wear

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Could be boots, pants, shorts, shirts, skirts, blouses, coats, hats, players could choose different lengths, buttons, etc.

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It could be necklaces and amulets too, there could different colors of strings, and different shapes design for the gem

signal rune
rose grove
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afk needs to be compared to being logged out rather than any actual method of engaging with the game

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if it gains any progress? pretty good, gz on your 20k xp/hr

quiet surge
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i don't know if mindless "active" gameplay is a good design to go with.

while it can be considered "active", it is absolutely boring and un-engaging.

active gammeplay should be engaging

4t mining is nowhere close to being considered as engaging, which i strongly think is the problem with designs and approach about "afk versus active"

therefore, the whole point of this discussion (i guess), should be "non-engaging versus engaging", right?

signal rune
#

there's room for lots of things

#

but it's correct that if they added "spam click on digsites to get faster arch mats" would not thrill me compared to something exciting/unique gameplay

quiet surge
#

cos i see the parallels of the discussion between skilling and combat. which is why i think combat team has done a great job in the past 14+ months in making combat more engaging - something skilling has not yet achieved so far, seemingly focused on "active" rather than "engaging"

stoic bear
#

at this point as long as a portal aint involved, i want it

stray sonnet
#

?

supple rampart
#

I would agree that rockertunities etc just make you stare at the screen while waiting as opposed to something else while waiting. There's no role play thinking or strategy thinking or story thinking. Arch was better in that you would have a constant narrative you wanted expanding by progression, like what's with the random door or just daydreaming about the wider world the writers were creating.

#

As much as I can't do elite dungeons, people said they did the same as me and sort of roleplayed the idea of sneaking in and sniping off enemies as they went. You need something in your head while playing.

#

Chat works on launch for keeping something engaging but then the space empties and you're left with just the content you realise it's tedious for most skilling.

foggy anchor
#

Imagine mining had multiple types of resource gathering methods:

  1. AFK rockpile mining. Low exp, randomized resource payout with a high yield of low-tier resources (coal, clay, sandstone, etc) and occasional clumps of rarer ores. Prospecting different rock sections allows players to prioritize rare ores, similar to the 'tears of guthix' minigame. Rockpile is 'replenished' (randomizes yields) periodically, with minecart deliveries of unsorted rock.

  2. Enriched competitive ores that deplete, similar to elder trees. Slow respawns, can be located in dangerous places. Decent yield of specific resources, Decent EXP. Not AFK, but not high intensity skilling.

  3. Tunnelling 'minigame' (hopefully not actually a minigame because the main problem with Dung was it being divorced from the overworld economy). Huge, sprawling randomized 'dungeons' that all players can explore/excavate over the course of a day/week before the next reset. Similar to dung, but in much smaller map squares. Progressing requires prospecting walls to find enriched ores/unstable earth/impenetrable bedrock. Build reinforcements to prevent cave-ins, burn off poison gasses that otherwise cause poison damage, lay track to have minecarts deposit directly to your ore bank. Bring your mining headlamp to see. Create air totems to maintain oxygen levels. Common loot include Ores, bones, and archeology components (type dependent on the mine's location). Stumble upon elder-roots, divination rifts, underground rivers, unpassable ravines, angry rock golems and long-lost dungeons filled with undead. Find long-lost 'treasure rooms' locked with puzzles, but full of valuable rewards (available to all players who have contributed to reaching the treasure room). Further rewards could include a furnace-cart, allowing you to auto-smelt ores you gather before banking them (no exp rewarded). This activity would be both collaborative and competitive, and encourage creative, engaging gameplay.

#

High EXP, Decent yield of various resources, with 'boss level' loot value/rarity and risk.

rose grove
#

especially since jagex hasn't yet found the special sauce on making engaging content appealing to the whole constituency who want it

stoic bear
# foggy anchor Imagine mining had multiple types of resource gathering methods: 1. AFK rockpi...

i kinda dig (no pun intended 😉 ) the idea of some sort of world centric "minigame" that resets like once a week or so that everyone participates in. I'd imagine we'd get a dedicated server for this activity that is high intensity where maybe you kinda use construction as well to prevent cave-ins while also creating this massive quarry with the entire world. I could even see a thing where they keep a record of how far the world can dig before the reset which would add its own external interest driver to the activity. Im imagining players get contribution (maybe up to some cap) and at the end of the week you get a big ass reward of mining supplies ranging from anything within your level bracket (potentially even a bit higher).
I could also see a scenario where as the world is excavating, we'd periodically uncover your "rockpiles" ( or just regular ores that we currently know in game) that also incentives afkers to participate on the world when they have time (shout out to @stray sonnet to have your 'opt-in' experience)

stray sonnet
#

Needs to be active 24/7 but something like that

stoic bear
#

as long as the content is fun and keeps up in xp/output as regular mining, i see no reason it wouldnt be active 24/7

quiet surge
#

ya, i agree with it needing to be 24/7, rather than limited time slots only

stoic bear
#

yeah my interpretation is that is always going so long as people are actualyl doing the activity (like artisans or just community div)

#

and both of those as examples is that people are willing to hop worlds and do the stuff around other people as long as it benefits themselves as well

#

even wintertodt from osrs proves that

quiet surge
stoic bear
#

yeah i mean im an iron so i lowkey forgot about portables but yeah that too

minor halo
#

You mentioned ‘leaves, woof shavings, …’ > I would love skilling events like osrs forestry ingame

#

Get such drops while afking but also (more and maybe other items during the skilling events which occur randomly)

#

Some side rewards like a whistle to transform your … (skill) pet into a fox, is lovely

#

Mining could have a tiny meteor, sprites wandering and need to ‘catch’ them,

Those activities/events could come in personal and community.

Where community not necessarily means you need other players but other players can also interact.

#

Giving some boost for those for see it and are more active or just active compared to afkers.

#

When the Woodcutters’ Grove was announced I thought this would include OR even be something like Forestry in osrs.

cobalt vapor
# minor halo You mentioned ‘leaves, woof shavings, …’ > I would love skilling events like osr...

Oh for sure. At first I didn't think much of the Osrs forestry update to wc but after participating on this jmod topic, I'm really starting to see the genius behind it. Boosts when more people are together does well to bring the community together.

Players obtaining something else other than logs like leaves does well to reward players further and it makes sense that you'd get other stuff. Really hoping that they add leaves, wood shavings, rock fragments or something cause the idea of these being tradeable/being like chronotes and used to buy Skilling outfits, possibly auras, and more like pieces for Skilling offhands would do great to boost Skillings profitability per hour.

#

It also means returning players with 99 or even 120 who never got the outfits could buy them

#

And be better prepared for future content that could require these things

minor halo
#

not every currency/reward should be bought, just different ways to obtain the stuff

#

some bought, some traded, some drop (rng), ...

cobalt vapor
#

I agree, Skilling outfits and possibly auras should probably be able to be bought imo. Just like arch outfits. Ideally tho, I would like to see outfits from this currency and auras from related mini games.

Even to make time and space mattock it's not like you buy the entire mattock from the arch shop, but you buy a necessary component for it.

minor halo
#

Something 'small' but still something I wanna add, active vs afk players. If I play osrs I see that burning logs seperately (making lines of fire) awards more xp each log, using a bonfire (afk) gives less xp, which is perfect and makes sense. Active and making lines awards more xp but in rs bonfires gives more xp compared to single fires (lines).

minor halo
stoic forge
#

If I have a low number of logs to burn then line of fire.
If I have heaps then I see Violet for a bonfire.

wild oak
#

does anyone know the link to the pre-launch blog for augmented rc and thieving? the official news post on the website (of 25.4.2025) says literally "We will talk more about this update in a prelaunch blog the week before the update" but I can't find it anywhere

#

only 3 days until the update, so the blog must be somewhere

wild oak
#

finally it's there

stoic bear
wild oak
#

yeah pity they don't make prosper also work with rc

#

but maybe that's added at a later stage
so far, it works for any skill that has augmentable tools, would make sense to have it with rc and thieving too

stoic bear
#

Yeah i mean the assumption would be that any general augments that dont state specific skills SHOULD work but we'll have to wait for them to reply and or try in game

cobalt vapor
#

Has the Jagex team ever thought about making different tiers of fishing rods? Like regular fishing rod, oak fishing rod, to Eternal magic fishing rod, and maybe a fishing rod of life and death?

It makes sense that a player would need stronger fishing rods for bigger fish that might pull harder.

You could use fletching to make the base and just string the rod. It could help up the price of logs if you could make something else with them.

stoic bear
#

Im not opposed to that idea but thays not exactly engaging skilling related

cobalt vapor
#

It could be 😮

#

Adding different tiers of rods could add more complexity and mechanics to certain fishing content

stoic forge
#

IRL do rods actually matter? Isn't bait much more important?

stoic bear
#

Rods and lines affect your actual reeling power. If your rod can't handle high tension it'll snap, same with the line

#

Bait would only really determine what species you actually attract.

#

Fish fingers does a fairly decent job of diving into that complexity for a 15 minute match

quiet surge
#

i would envision it to be like ore box and wood box upgrades. you just build the first level, then upgrade it throughout your use of the skill, rather than creating separate individual ones?

or would that apply to "fish box" instead?

cobalt vapor
#

There should def be a fish box, I mean i guess there's the tackle box, but fully upgrading it sure takes a whole lot of fish flingers. There should also be a potion box where you can store your unfinished potions and secondary ingredients to make invs full of potions

stoic forge
#

How would you make a fish box? And it should be a fish net?

cobalt vapor
cobalt vapor
#

Tbh, they could get rid of harpoon fishing. You can fish tuna, swordfish, and sharks with fishing rods. They just have to be heavy duty fishing rods which a new tier of fishing rod could replace.

#

I suppose they could keep both and just allow you to also use strong enough fishing rods to fish tuna, swordfish, and sharks.

#

Same thing with mackerel, cod, bass, seerfish, and sillago, you don't specifically need a fishing net for those, you can use a fishing rod.

You could get rid of the big net fishing tbh. This one might be a bit too much, but you can also fish lobsters and crayfish with nets. So you could remove lobster and crayfish pots and just have a net for both of those

#

So there's definitely room for different tiers of player made fishing rods.

stoic forge
#

Barbarian Fishing as a fishing section, so you can't get rid of Harpoon fishing.

hollow herald
#

basically only have 4 tiers atm

#

basic, fish-o-matic, crystal and tavia

cobalt vapor
#

I mean they could keep heavy rod fishing for barbarian training I suppose

#

or just keep everything the same and make it so you can fish big net and harpoon spots with strong enough fishing rods

rose grove
#

honestly it's criminal that experientially fishing is identical regardless of tool

hollow herald
#

lobster / karambwam fishing should have a fish version of rockertunities

#

fly fishing could use the stamina from mining, with it slowing down when u don't click for too long

boreal parcel
#

Im sure a lot of this is in the cards for 110 fishing

hollow herald
#

wonder if it's gonna be escaped heim crabs

#

pretty limited selection of crustaceans outside of daemonheim

#

beyond lvl 1

#

Coconut crab would probably be a decent meal

cobalt vapor
#

I do think fishing should have the fishing rod solidified as its standard tool of usage. I don't think we should get rid of harpoons or nets, but imo these have the opportunity to be applied to different active fishing methods and content with different mechanics

#

Like what if we are able to cast nets at possibly moving fish or something

#

or harpoon them

#

could be fun

cobalt vapor
#

How do you awesome ppl feeling about 2 handed skilling tools? Could add some variety into skilling

#

There could be content that first requires the greater force of a 2h skilling tool to break some outer layer, then the better precision a 1 handed tool to gather said resource or something

stoic bear
#

Would really just depend on what exactly a 2h tool would accomplish. All the gathering skills would definitely have to have different purposes as to what and why they are 2h tools. Not to mention straight up I don't think arch could have a 2 handed mattock. As for fishing technically I'd say fishing rods would have to already be 2h, can't exactly cast a line properly one handed.

quiet surge
stoic bear
#

lol

rose grove
#

much as I said in your suggestion thread - I think it would need to come with mechanical changes. click node + afk is essentially a finished product, there's no benefit or need to add more variety to it at this point; it's that core interaction that should be revised/amended by tools at this point

indigo rapids
#

I wish there was more to skills like agility, this entire skill just got its leveling progression wiped out on main accounts because of silverhawks

#

Without silverhawks its a active but not rewarding skill, and with silverhawks you just dont engage in it at all

stoic bear
cobalt vapor
#

We got stone spirits and wood spirits

#

but have y'all ever thought bout fish spirits?

#

it certainly make more sense since all the fish we fish are dead

#

i hope

stoic bear
#

fish are not dead when you initially catch them

stoic forge
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They are dead. Put the (alive) Fish back in the water after catching will give you a message saying that fish was dead.

stoic bear
#

i meant irl

#

i would imagine a fish would eventually die if i stuffed one into my pocket

stoic forge
#

Yes fish do try to stay alive when they leave the water.

stoic bear
#

yes

indigo rapids
cobalt vapor
#

See, they eventually die. I mean fish would have spirits right? Imo probably more so than trees and rocks

#

Tho if anything, pvm should probably drop bait for fish like worms or monster meat or something

#

I suppose specific types of fishing bait could replace fish spirits

#

Like there could be different types of worms inside the guts of monsters

stoic bear
#

I could see a rework for bait considering we dont use bait these days anyway with the pawnbroker. Bait could either just increase success rate even further, or give double catch idk. I would be more inclined for it to work differently to woodcutting and mining since fishing does function differently to those skills as well anyway.

rose grove
#

I would like to see blubber spirits and don't have a need for anything else

#

but tbh it's kinda besides the point here

#

fishing is unengaging even if you double the output

stray sonnet
#

Make double the output a reward from something engaging, like fish flingers

cobalt vapor
#

hmmm...

#

It be interesting if fishing bait played a roll in engaging fishing content

#

Closest thing I could think of is the way fishing is done in fish flingers

#

Maybe bait switching if you want to optimize the fish you get per hr?

#

Like maybe the tackle box could hold dif types of bait

stoic bear
cobalt vapor
#

I think having like random big fish biting could be neat. Like maybe you have to press an extra action button or click it to reel it in. May this big fish could provide some extra boost when eaten or heal slightly more xp than the regular fish

#

I think having random fishing swarms appear in other places could be cool too

#

So if you're like a lower lvl u can get a chance to get higher lvled fish

#

emphasis on random

#

players would have to keep an eye out for them

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I think the fish flingers mechanic of having like a random player get a really big fish and needing other players to help reel it in would be cool too

#

maybe those who help could get something too, like a fishing xp boost or some new fishing item used to food or something

stoic bear
#

those sound interesting for sure but it also doesnt necessarily fall in line with the talks we had prior about what it means to be engaged in skilling

#

my initially thinking about engaging fishing would be kinda like stardew where you have that "power bar" that determines your cast distance then also you have to reel the fish in by maintaining your power at certain levels (think "The Elder Kiln" quest) then once you successfully reel it in, you'd get x# of fish based on your cast distance

#

but thats just a spitball, and im sure we could easily implement both a random swarm and random big fish event into it as well

cobalt vapor
#

Tbh, I think it be really cool if we could cast the fishing line

#

Like with our mouse or something

#

The strength skill could even help with casting further or something

#

Fishing has tons of possibilities tbh

#

Out of all the gathering skills, it's probably the most exciting and full of potential

#

I'd be surprised if they mess that up or don't cook up something amazing

stray sonnet
#

Fish flingers has other engaging parts too besides bait switching

cobalt vapor
#

Fish flingers is awesome

#

Remove champions tackle box trim req and add getting fisherman's outfit as a req instead imo.

#

Tbh, I think it be cool if fish flingers mechanics at least most of em could just be implemented to all of the fishing skill. The fish flingers area could be reworked as a mass fishing Skilling boss or something

pale mural
#

Flingers is a pretty solid DnD imo. I think 3 ticket rule needs to be removed and just the numbers updated for modern gameplay exp wise since its great active gameplay. I would like if it had a bit of a reward that we can actively chase for that has a good long term benefit that can't be powercrept like what happened to tackleboxes/fishing set with porters/shark mtx set. I think something like us getting skilling supplies from the shop as a reward pull would be good like how temple trekking has it but that would conflict with the fishing trawler loot table too.

rose grove
#

yeah fish flingers would be a great target for a qol sweep

#

it needs a lot less than shooting stars/evil trees (even after changes shooting stars still aren't in a great place)

stray sonnet
#

The fun part is also finding the bait and hook with alt1, swapping lakes and the special catch fish which are a community event for social skilling

pale mural
#

Even upon its release once I unlocked everything from it, I never went back to replay it which is its main problem even now. I feel like a small touch up as a game jam like Shooting Stars had and it would be a great fix up.

stray sonnet
#

I think it mostly needs a reward buff, like fishing stone spirits

keen shale
#

that reminds me

#

would be nice for naturalist to proc the 100% extra fish buff

#

it's a lot weaker for mining and fishing compared to wc rn

cobalt vapor
#

Is having 2 fishing consumables too much?

stray sonnet
#

No thoughts on non-minigame bait tbh

foggy anchor
#

@delicate wave
110 Crafting is looking pretty well done so far. I appreciate that it appears to bring some value back to the skill (and others, besides) and rewards active (though not necessarily engaging, too early to tell) gameplay.

That said, I see no point to requiring thread past level 99, given the Cape's current perk... Would personally love to see different tiers of thread introduced, and the crafting cape's perk replaced with something... else entirely. But that's probably beyond the scope of this update.

stoic forge
#

Thread has a use for those who are boosting to 99+.

foggy anchor
#

--
I think the biggest difference between this update, and the mining/smithing, or runecrafting updates, is the jewellery is potentially adding items of value (we'll see) that retain their demand rather than being made once by/for every relevant player, and thereafter losing value. Platinum jewellery potentially fixes the supply/demand problems of mining as well, if handled correctly.

Not super excited about the primarily exp-rate based jewellery perks... would rather something more.... tangible. But it's the right principal.

Would be really neat to see some degrades-to-dust jewellery that can be enchanted with the effects of two other pieces of jewellery (by using those items on it; would not sacrifice the originals).

Would create a high demand for the resources, for PVMers and skillers alike, without having to get too creative.

cobalt vapor
#

I think if there were to be different types of thread it should be limited to specific content. Ex. Algarum thread for sirenic.

That or we use specific flower thread to make specific cloth for magic armor, but we still use regular thread to sow it altogether. Ex. Spin a flower> you get flower thread> use flower thread to make pieces of flower cloth> Combine pieces of flower cloth with regular thread to make magic armor.

I honestly wouldnt want different tiers of thread, notably when there're already different tiers of hides. If anything I wish we just had an endless thread item that we could attach to our toolbelt

vital sedge
#

If there were different tiers I think it should be by band, like 1-40 is thread, 50-70 seasonal thread (from POF seasonal sheep), 80-90 Algarum or w/e

stoic bear
#

i dont like the idea of different threads

rose grove
#

fine with different threads for items which you make very rarely - algarum thread is fine

#

but I think the core crafting tools should remain normal thread

keen shale
#

Algarum seems too much for the thread consumption mechanic proposed

cobalt vapor
#

So real question

#

how come we dont have pasta in rs? We have wheat, flour, water, stoves. Pasta is just boiled dough

#

I would like to see more proper dishes, plates, and meals in rs!

#

Could make for some fun engaging content

stoic forge
#

I can see Pasta coming with 110 Cooking.

hollow herald
#

Agility with timed tosses to make da dough

#

Well timed toss makes the pizza dough faster

#

Make a sauce with tomato in a bowl

#

Add the meatballs

#

Fletch and dry the pasta with some fire

#

Toss in iron pot with water and salt

#

Cook to perfection

#

Stick the pasta on a porcelain plate, and add sauce

rose grove
#

yeah it'd be cool to see dishes having failure predicated on player action rather than an rng roll

#

maybe you can even unlock kitchens with multiple workstations so you can cook multiple dishes at once if you want to trust yourself with the timing

#

seems like a good way to reward skilful, risk-taking skilling

stoic forge
#

Cooking should absolutely be the most engaging skill to train.

Having methods to collect and prepare items, then combine those items together, are the best parts of any Artisan skill.

quiet surge
#

was there a statement provided for the rationale for not implementing eternal magic tree mechanic to all trees?

quiet surge
stoic forge
quiet surge
#

not sure about the "worth the time" part. as there wasn't an official vote for the feature (before and after implementation), i can only take the recollection from chats that it was a requested feature and question (before and after implementation).

rose grove
#

idt it would be good rolled out across the skill - it would necessarily increase a lot of time to fell values, and would extend rockertunity replication syndrome

kind flicker
#

Same reason they havent retiered fletching (yet! bless be Breezy & Stu)

stoic bear
#

That should be apart of the scope imo. Especially since these updates currently have only brought 1 thing into the actual level bracket of 100-110

kind flicker
#

It's been answered multiple times tho. These are only able to come to the game as they have, because they arent reworks.

stoic bear
#

I know, but that doesnt change how I feel about it

foggy anchor
#

@cobalt vapor Holy heck. I knew it was bad. But the stats Jagex just shared...

Glad it sounds like they're actually going ahead with this, and that someone there has acknowledged it as a real problem that needs solving, despite the fuss a small minority will kick up.

I greatly appreciate them sharing the stat that Zamorak alone drops 2x (or more, up to 4x) blood runes each day than are crafted by players. Kinda wish similar stats were given for other items, but w/ev. I would speculate that it's the same trend.

And they're bringing Bakriminel Bolts are back?! I know a few people who're gunna be thrilled about that.

Starting to dare to let the optimism take hold... I've been a sceptic that this'd ever get fixed, for so long...

cobalt vapor
pale mural
#

I honestly wasnt worried about the alc machines since I always viewed the skill ceiling between pvm and skilling as the main issue. The alching machine was a massive save on time or utilizing the General Store for efficiency sake. The bigger issue was high end combat was rewarded while a lot of skilling was devolving to more afk content. And when it becomes more afk focused, it obviously can't compete with the high intensity gameplay rewards from pvm. Its why Croseus/Gate/Runecrafting are solid money makers because their high intensity has great loot tables and you can't just afk grind something to get those special items.

heavy coral
# foggy anchor <@477942756099227676> Holy heck. I knew it was bad. But the stats Jagex just sha...

Yea this news post made me come out of my lurk cave.

I had the very unpopular opinon that the nerfs were not only justified but should have been done a long time ago. When I was playing runescape I lived, breathed, and slept PVM and Zamorak was just too good. The statement they made about the progression was completely true.

The group iron man I played in, the first 2 things we did were gear up for Croesus and Glacor. You could skip almost all other low level bosses.

heavy coral
foggy anchor
# heavy coral The problem is not the problem. The problem is Jagex's attitude about the proble...

And it doesn't help that PVMers have become so entitled to reaping unbalanced rewards that they're pushing back against fixes the game desperately needs, rather than wanting the game as a whole to be playable.

That jagex is looking at addressing core gameplay health is a very, very good first step towards what I'd hoped this thread might contribute towards seeing accomplished. Still need more engaging skilling gameplay, but no point creating it if all rewards from it would just be thrown to PVM problems like Arch Glacor after a year.

brazen jackal
#

So upset about Mod Jack 😦

cobalt vapor
#

What happened to the goat?

rose grove
#

no longer with jagex

#

I didn't agree with him on everything about his vision for the game but he did a lot of really important structural work for the game's long-term health. hopefully he's put his successors in a position to absolutely knock it out of the park

cobalt vapor
#

Wait what

#

I thought he was the boss

#

Well dang, that's def a loss

foggy anchor
#

Hadn't heard he'd left... hate to think our conversation had something to do with it, but not impossible =/

#

It's only thanks to him we even have this thread/are beginning to be heard, as skillers, imho

stray sonnet
#

I never really asked about what type of gameplay is his favourite, I think he likes logistics gameplay but it's hard to say. Definitely hard to design cool active content but it also didn't quite seem like he left by choice, so it's also hard to say on that one.

#

It was also hard to justify a lot of quests from what I remember

wild oak
# stoic forge Cooking should absolutely be the most engaging skill to train. Having methods t...

that's how Arc soups already work
would be interesting to see more recipes with several components added at once, I'm not a big fan of the layered cooking where you add 1 item to a pie shell to make a first stage of an unfinished pie, then add a further item to make the next stage of unfinished pie, and then a final item and then bake it, when the intermediate steps aren't worth much xp

#

for Arc soups, already cutting the shrooms and turning the fish into oil gives xp, then making the soup itself gives xp again

stoic bear
#

Yeah, that sounds good but I personally would also want a proper cooking process that the player is involved in.

wild oak
#

suggestion: can we please color some of the skilling tools? like we can with eof, pernix quiver or passage of the abyss
it would help a lot if we could easily distinguish our differently-perked hatchets and binding rods

brazen jackal
static hound
#

I'd love to suggest an update to the statue collection bag so when rocks are sent to bank they can be auto deposited into it. Better yet, introducing an unlock of some kind allowing the statue and skill collection bags to be added to the toolbelt.

delicate wave
#

for me personally it's a big mix

stray sonnet
#

I imagine it's easier to design if you also enjoy it and have deeper knowledge on what makes something fun but yeah, we all have our preferences

delicate wave
#

yeah that's definitely true

#

that's a big part of what I mean by "what does RS do well"

stray sonnet
#

Probably a lot of experimenting there, trying to find the core immersive experience and then finding new ways to expand on it

delicate wave
#

I can't think of a consistent pattern for my tastes

#

I'm quite flighty due to a short attention span but even so I've played some very long, grindy games

#

(not by the standards of the sort of person who gets 200M all but by "normal" standards)

#

I have hundreds of hours in stellaris

#

(and many other strategy games)

#

I don't really have favourites, but gun to my head if I had to pick a favourite game it would probably be portal

kind flicker
#

Adhd is the name for that pattern i think ;), at least thats how i feel. I both cannot finish a single RPG, and i comped in rs3 then made a chunk-locked ironman I played for 2 years

delicate wave
#

yep

#

different games for differet things I think

#

I love rhythm action games

kind flicker
#

Different types of dopamine

delicate wave
#

but also slow, immersive stuff like subnautica or even gone home

#

my tolerance for narrative stuff has declined

#

not because I don't like narrative stuff but because my standards have risen to the point where a hundreds of hours long RPG just isn't very good because it's mostly mediocre text which feels very much like the last one

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I bounced off witcher 3 pretty hard for that reason

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(you can see me do that on stream)

kind flicker
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MOBA for "take all my attention, all of it"
Rs3 for "what im doing right now isnt engaging enough.. and number go up📈"
Dark souls for "head bashing torture followed by the sublime release when I beat the boss after 50 tries"

delicate wave
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right that second one

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that's what RS is good at

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speaking of which I've still got to do this 1 mask stormwind run because it crashed last time

kind flicker
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It is very good at being 2nd monitor content. So good that on my gim, I set a goal to get to prif, got all the reqs 6 weeks ago, and still not done the quests yet... To busy afking to quest

pale mural
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It depends since people have different ways to enjoy runescape. For a majority, yes number goes up is definitely the thing but its more about the diverse nature of runescape of what you can do. Its really the ultimate sandbox mmo imo. you can replay the game and have hundreds of ways you can self impose limitations and enjoy the game based off of what content you enjoy. Chunk mans, GIM, Taskman, UIM, IM, HCIM, Tileman, Region Locked, 1 Def, a dozen different PvP accounts, and other various accounts. I think one of the biggest loses over RS3 is the idea that people didnt need to replay the game so more folks moved to the end game without knowing about how the early game worked until they were either forced to play it or watch it through someone else play. Meanwhile osrs has glorified the idea you need to restart your account and everyone does it for whatever they enjoy.

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Leagues, DMM, all the plugin restricted accounts and various things like GIM, HCIM and IM encouraged that playstyle and its really noticeable now for rs3 where most people only 1 to 2 accounts now instead of the numerous that I know a lot of folks use to maintain several years ago

stray sonnet
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I did notice a recent first impressions video that criticised the number go up but didn't talk about it for too long

delicate wave
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especially wrt "active skilling content"

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the basic logic for me is

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if you have say two types of content

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one has a larger audience, takes less time to develop, and comes out higher quality

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the other has a smaller audience, takes more time to develop, and even with that added time comes out lower quality (often to the point where the audience it's intended for reject it)

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focusing on the latter just doesn't seem like a good idea

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it's not that that content isn't or couldn't be good content, or that that taste is invalid

stray sonnet
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I imagine it's difficult to compare due to low effort methods having longer engagement rates by nature but I like to think it's in the mental. That people are encouraged to play for longer when having the option of doing something immersive, the option being not far away

stray sonnet
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But yeah, can't go too far with it when trying to sustain the game. The 110's just seemed overly abundant compared to making new active baselines.

pale mural
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I think its really important to have 3 types of content which the game has structured towards really well this past year.

Patch Updates which is the week after a content update where the issues get resolved from the previous content release. This is how both osrs and rs3 now operate which is good since it allows for the following week to have additional updates and just good tweaks, an example is the Wood Spirit fixes or the EZK buff just recently.

Next is foundational content, things that have long term content benefits that builds on the existing frame. 110s, Combat Achievements, even certain quests that are building up to it. The problem with this update is that its not often exciting enough which leads to the third type. Exciting meaning I am not going out of my way to tell my friend this is happening in the game if they ask are there any new updates.

Exciting/Showmanship Content, which is advertising heavy content the likes of EGWD or Amascut, Leagues, New Skill, New Continent and a bit more. These are the main hooks which is great to advertise the game to hook people back into the game. They are the content you talk to your friends of all the new things that are happening.

The problem for this last type of content is that RS3 players expect content in this format since we always want new end game content. This is because most RS3 players arent playing on new accounts so they only care about the content they can do at the end game which they care about and even then that is dependent on what interests the player. For example, I care about Skilling Content, Quests and Treasure Trails but I don't care if we get a new boss like Amascut besides the relative lore implications. Because of Leagues/GIM, players are getting use to making new accounts or replaying old content again.

lucid oak
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I think adding ways to expedite progress in time-gated creation processes like fletching eternals or primals/firemaking through something like an interface toggle to skip the "create x" interface, at a slight increase to the creation time, while requiring active engagement could be a relatively easy solution without reworking the wheel. As of right now. Runescape's skilling rewards a click and forget approach, by making existing content have an option to be more interactive and in turn conferring a higher xp per hour/progression speed bonus, without changing the core xp received per item is a way to introduce faster training without affecting the economy, while priming an engaging gameplay loop.

cosmic parcel
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Osrs did it right with skilling bosses that perform similar to minigames. It solved the question of Low Intensity High Iteration vs High Intensity Low Iteration content that MMOs try to balance. It’s a great middle ground of active content that isn’t overbearing in needing your attention. Gamifying skills is the right answer imo.

bronze summit
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I feel like skills in the video game are pretty gamified already

lucid oak
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In my opinion I don't think skilling bosses performing as minigames is the way to go; as they in turn end up even further linearising the skill and the placement of the skill into one spot and activity. Using skilling bosses as the end it-be-all solution does not solve the internal pacing problem within Runescape of engaging content being equivalent to unengaging content.

Currently runescape has this problem primarily in the form of portables, and imo a skilling boss would only serve to further that kind of playstyle, while only additionally decoupling the skilling experience from the skill. Necromancy's rituals do this, and provide a method with the option to be engaging or unengaging based on the player's playstyle within the ritual mini-game while also requiring the player to get certain achievements within the skill to progress your armour and weaponry within it, making it ultimately self contained, but very well supported by the content path set within it through quests, and tasks.

This is the kind of mindset that I think is well received by players in examples such as active runecrafting vs runespan, or active vs inactive mining, smithing, cooking, etc. OSRS has this incorporated through the form of tick manipulation to magnify experience rates within the same time span. Really, I'm suggesting something alike to it as a built in system, rather than as a consequence of an engine limitation.

stoic bear
# lucid oak In my opinion I don't think skilling bosses performing as minigames is the way t...

I do agree with this ideology surrounding skilling bosses. Croesus for example can technically be done the moment you create an account (granted you need to be carried to complete a kill) you can 1-99 the skills at this boss with relative ease and decent pace compared to the actual skill. To me, any activity that is deemed an "active" method should inherently be better than the afk way in the same level bracket

lucid oak
# stoic bear I do agree with this ideology surrounding skilling bosses. Croesus for example c...

My argument is that, doing so is providing a solution within a flawed paradigm, rather than addressing the inherent lack of engagement present within the skill, or an over-emphasis on rewarding afk content within the skill. My interest was addressing content with longer creation time windows, such as Eternals, Masterworks, etc by having a method to do so faster, but much more attention focused e.g. 1/2 ticking Eternals.

Skilling bosses in a vacuum can provide value as content, but they suffer from same issue as having a generalised hub.
Reducing player experience to a single location and activity is bad design for the longevity of the activity, as being locked to the same spot for the entirety of a grind limits the uniqueness of it in the same way making one mob, in one location would if it were optimal with no other realistic alternatives for grind progression. While functionally this appeals to players seeking to go from min-to-max in the shortest span of time it would however be aesthetically, and thematically unappealing while also limiting exploration or variety, rendering it boring beyond the Skinner box exp drops due to the severe lack of variety.

Overall, I don't think Skilling bosses should give optimal XP by the same token slaying bosses should not, I think they can give decent enough experience, but these rates should be close to competitive possibly on the higher end for the level bracket to reflect its difficulty and scale, but the core focus of the boss should be its loot rewards of unique drops/mechanic progression.
With the caveat that the existence of such a boss does not eliminate the existing discrepancy in afk vs active skilling content being disproportionally rewarding.

stoic bear
# lucid oak My argument is that, doing so is providing a solution within a flawed paradigm, ...

Yeah I personally would agree that those systems are flawed and im not the biggest fan, especially since I am forced to interact with them as a more active focused player. And while I may never fully understand why people would "play" a game by clicking once and tabbing out, i don't want to remove that from them.

I think both solutions can coexist. Adding a way of making existing systems reward players for being active (think making an inventory of bars or construction frames) as well as already existing systems to have better ways of rewarding players for staying engaged with the activity (folding alloy bars). But also adding completely new content outside of that formula that still fits the thematic of the skill (heist idea/exalted rune essence mine) while adding a completely new way to interact with the skill with the intention of active play at the fore front.

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On the topic of bosses for exp, its more complex to me. In the instance of combat, these bosses are thematically speaking, the best of the best, the end all be all, the reason TO do combat. While slaying down hoards of mobs is also a fun way to interact with combat and is also its own reason to do combat, to me it is not THE reason of combat thematically. So I believe they should provide phenomenal experience even on par with mowing down hoards of 'trash' mobs, so long as you have to actively engage with the boss rather than being able to fully revo afk it like gwd1 and 2.

That being said, the argument for skilling bosses is much different to me. Skilling is not meant for the purpose of killing a tree boss. It is simply meant as a literal trade, being proficient at cutting trees that allows you to chop more difficult types of trees that inexperienced lumberjack are unable to tackle. A skilling boss' primary purpose for existing is as a fun way to get the satisfaction of regular combat encounters of bossing with a skilling twist. I dont believe is it the primary objective of the skill's identity to fell a tree boss. So when a player interacts with that system, they should be rewarded with thematic rewards of that skill (wood spirits for this example), some decent but not bis xp, and maybe some incentive to also interact with another skill (anima stones/stone spirits)

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As well as a potential unique reward as well (sana's fyretorch)

spare furnace
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Every boss is a skilling boss. The "normal" bosses are skilling bosses for the combat skills 🤷‍♂️ So that would mean you wouldn't want them to be bis xp

stoic bear
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I personally disagree. The end goal of combat skills is to fight bosses, that isn't the case for skilling

bronze summit
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Yeah it's technically true that you fight (normal) bosses with combat skills

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But no one who says Skilling boss means vorago or whatever

lucid oak
stoic bear
lucid oak
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An example of this in two separate modes of practise would be necromancy's rituals vs combat training.

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Rituals award good exp, but much more exp if you interact with the content.

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You use the exact same components for it, as you would fully afk, for a minute and you would gain less for it.

stray sonnet
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I don't think skilling bosses should be the standard for active skilling tbh

stoic bear
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Me either. But I do think they are good content

lucid oak
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I think they can be good content, but I don't think any content is inherently good simply by virtue of its inclusion

pale mural
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Skilling Bosses are definitely a good form for engaging skilling content but I think most people who enjoy skilling dont like the component of bossing that there needs to be a pseudo death mechanic.

I think high intensity skilling minigames/dnd serve as a much better metric for engaging skilling in general. For example, Fish Flingers is an excellent high intensity Fishing DnD but the rewards are outdated due to various reasons.

lucid oak
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Hunter is a great example of this.

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Personally I would love to see more content like falconry.

stray sonnet
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Main skilling explains should have level brackets, so they fit naturally into the world and are open to expansions when 120's release

pale mural
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I always imagined Skilling Boss to have the same highs as regular Combat Bosses where the drops would be the enticer even though the items are super rare. But Skilling diversity is too locked into just its mainhand/offhand so theres no unique outfits to really create unique playstyles for high end skilling gameplay. What if a certain new Skilling attachment to an outfit (sort of like a parasite or some enchantment) could have different effects similar to invention but much stronger.

An example could be like an attachment to the torso of the camo hunting outfit where you can shave down a tick for skilling with traps.

foggy anchor
# delicate wave yeah that's definitely true

Good to see you out and about.
I think one of my big points has been that many games that do one or two things well can be held back by their weakest aspects.
Which for me always raises questions pertaining to 'what has Runescape done well in the past' and 'what can Runescape do better in the future', more so than repeating/expanding things that are already working, while other areas aren't.

Will be interesting to see what Jagex manages to pull off, given the recent... changes...
Was already worried that things sounded understaffed. Can't imagine this improves things, in that regard

stray sonnet
# pale mural I always imagined Skilling Boss to have the same highs as regular Combat Bosses ...

There's more reasons that I think skilling bosses aren't that good for skilling besides the fact that they don't fit into the natural world. For example, you expect a boss to offer some sort of challenge but as I understand, it's not in the design to focus that much on it's challenge. You don't expect this sort of challenge from something like active safecracking, so it's still engaging and fun. It's especially bad at Gate, as it lowers it's difficulty on purpose. Croesus is similar but only in isolation but not in actuality. The challenge at Croesus is the intensity of doing a role in 4man and even coordinating in public instances, which is more of a side grade in challenge compared to purposefully lowered difficulty.

In RS history, the best parts of immsersive skilling has been social skilling and more recently some additions of good gamplay like big game hunter. While big game hunter focuses on good gameplay and Croesus adds the aspect of social skilling with occasional fun coordination (while Croesus does have a flaw of not fitting into the natural world because no level brackets.), Gate focuses on neither. A lot of flaws with skilling bosses

foggy anchor
# stray sonnet There's more reasons that I think skilling bosses aren't that good for skilling ...

I agree in many ways, but I'll come at it from a bit of a different direction:

A true sense of 'skilling' or 'crafting' to me is best demonstrated when making ceremonial swords; expending mental energy selecting the best path, with more focus on a 'perfect' outcome than on how quickly you finish the interaction is intrinsic to real world master craftsmen.

I feel as though masterwork equipment was a perfect (and missed) opportunity to grow on this design, and implement some variation of this across the board, throughout the masterwork crafting process.

So, where 'skilling bosses' are concerned, Jagex is going about it backwards. Instead of easy, repetitive, no-thought-no-risk 'bosses', skilling challenges should consist of complex, communication and coordination-based challenges, with a game design emphasis on allowing enough time to communicate and plan, in the instance, rather than everyone blindly doing their own thing.

foggy anchor
#

--
Imagine overhauling Troll Invasion; building and maintaining a tower-defense style 'outpost' for fifteen minutes+ as a group of two+ players.
This minigame would involve single-player and two-player variants of most skilling tasks, with the two-player variants being critical to coordinate inputs between the players to succeed.

Woodcutting
-1 Player: Standard trees. Clear them to make room for structures, use the logs to build basic resources.
-2 Player: Oversized trees. Use a two-person saw with another player to cut these, then roll them to wherever you want to build a stronger structure

Mining
-1 Player: Mine rocks to clear space
-2 Player: Roll/walk boulders to wherever you want to build a stronger structure

Construction
-1 Player: can build simple things, repair most things
-2 Players: can build stronger structures/traps

Fletching
-1 Player: Can fletch crossbows/bolts
-2 Players: Can fletch siege-weapons and ammunition

Send ever-increasing waves of Trolls to smash themselves against our defenses, which would be manned by Burthorpe guardsmen/women. But do it with enough delay and variety that players HAVE to coordinate and react to different scenarios, every game.

Big daddy-o troll spotted by scouts to the south? Might wanna build a siege scorpion.

Lobber-trolls coming from the east? Probably want to build a spike trap.

Troll shaman setting your stuff on fire? Might be a couple guards with crossbows behind stone wall will take care of 'em.

quiet surge
stray sonnet
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I like it, I think someone suggested something like this should be in the open world

hollow herald
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Khazard battlefield contribution

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Final reward for picking Khazard's side?
He forgives you for attacking his dog

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Final unlock on the gnome side is that the gnomish amulet of defence has actual stats again

foggy anchor
foggy anchor
quiet surge
stoic bear
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^ Very rudimentary idea but you get the point. A way to not "punish" the player for endulging in something out of norm that is meant as just a time sink via the player to enjoy the GAME part of gaming.

quiet surge
stoic bear
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how do you think they failed? cuz imo its just not a minigame for me, thats it. the rewards are good. not to mention it isnt supposed to be something you do AND progress through the game. a minigame is a side thing that technically has no bearing on the actual progression. The rewards are simply there to encourage those that want to play, to play so they arent completely missing out

quiet surge
# stoic bear how do you think they failed? cuz imo its just not a minigame for me, thats it. ...

failed whereby, they basically stopped further developments and improvements on it.

and even if they didn't want to do anything further to make it better - in fact they nerfed it quite heavily because it was used for unintended purposes - they should've added more rewards to it that benefitted players, which they did not

that aside, i think the game devs measure success by a few metrics. i might be wrong, but if i recall correctly, one of them would be player engagement

foggy anchor
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I think our talks in this very chat have contributed to Jagex reassessing how they measure player engagement...

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Once upon a time, AFK time made the shareholders happy because 'moar playrz moar moneyz'

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but we've pointed out that AFKing a 'game' while actively doing... anything else... doesn't mean we're engaging with/committed to the game.... and that's a recipe for failure every time, with a subscription model attached

stoic bear
foggy anchor
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Agreed, but it's shocking how many of our conversations have been basically parotted verbatim by Jagex in newsposts since it was created

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after originally not even granting Skillers a place to provide feedback

stoic bear
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that is always a positive.

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I do know the whole starbloom idea for the new flower came directly from their thread

foggy anchor
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(shocking in a good way... not used to feeling seen)

stoic bear
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ye

foggy anchor
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the drops changes with zammy/etc almost perfectly match the conversation ... Zarudon? and myself were having at length

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'Game Health' being a topic Mod Jack and myself were speaking about at length even before he created this thread after my constant harassment xD

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will be interesting to see if Jagex implements any of the other discussion points into the new area.... I'm starting to be more optimistic, but the existing track record has repeatedly been:

Jagex releases a new area.
Players play through the new area.
Jagex forgets about the new area and moves on, and creates a new area.
New area 1 becomes 'dead content'.
Rinse, repeat.

stoic bear
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Yeah my biggest thing about new areas is like. It's an entire section of the map. I would hope/want like 80-85% of all new content to be focused around that area for ~a year after it's release

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maybe even 2 years depending on how fast content releases

foggy anchor
#

which is fine, if you're only ever really intending players to play through the latest content... but the second you have a beast like RS where 99% of the game is old content that still needs completing... they're gunna be spending 99% of their time playing dead content in locations devoid of other players. And the larger the map grows... the thinner your player population is spread. Which completely undermines the point of an MMO...

We should be aiming to have 100 players worth of active, engaging, CURRENT content within the overworld of major cities, at all times. Instead we only have these holiday hubs, wildy events, and Grand Exchange see more than a few players present at once.

Update or retire dead content, bit by bit. Fix what we have, instead of bulldozing out another swath of pretty landscape no one knows is there for the first 1000 hours of gameplay... And give every. piece. of the game (area, skill, whatever) meaningful, valuable, engaging reasons to play it. And let players return to choosing their path, instead of needing to 'max it all' to play new content....

foggy anchor
stoic bear
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Yeah Um definitely should have had a LOT more going on there

foggy anchor
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Goshima is easily the worst.

stoic bear
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I can kinda let Anachronia slide cuz, it's a gargantuan island, and it is prehistoric meaning not much was there to begin with. Maybe a lot more skilling nodes just... everywhere, I guess.

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Ive never gone to the arc aside from the 1 quest thats there lol

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plus arch cache

foggy anchor
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Anachronia didn't need to be constantly updated... but it's so EMPTY of clickable objects. Should've covered it in wild-growth herbs you could harvest for seeds...

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And non aggro giant dinos are ... sooo lame.

stoic bear
foggy anchor
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Would've loved to have dinos chase you around parts of the agility course

stoic bear
foggy anchor
#

The main problem with herb/farming is that so many herbs have been dropped by mobs that it's become redundant...

stoic bear
foggy anchor
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Sure, better than the 'stand and spam set' traps for hunter presently

stoic bear
foggy anchor
#

but I'd love to see huge player farms instead of these dinky little single-plant-patches

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aye, looking forward to it if they don't get bullied out of actually doing it

stoic bear
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yeah would be cool, just bigger plots. or even just a dedicated POF location for a massive farmland

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not to say im not content with what we have ofc

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i dont wanna delve too far into the what if rabbit hole and make myself disappointed lol

foggy anchor
#

having wild-growth herbs as a source of seeds would give a more immersive primary source than... pickpocketing farmers or killing mobs. Like, who came up with that....

stoic bear
foggy anchor
#

agreed; the what-if rabbit hole is so shiny, that it makes every thing else look... ... like 20 years of cobbled together hodgepodge....

stoic bear
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Maybe I'll go make a game-suggestion for Foraging

foggy anchor
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Sounds good to me

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Though the main problem with any skilling suggestions we make at the moment

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is that they'll effectively be taking back skilling supplies from PVM....

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So we almost need to solve PVM's monstrously unimaginative drop pool before we can safely fix skilling

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ie: feathers should be sourced from Iceynie (can't be arsed to check spelling) and such. not sold by the tens of thousands from shops.

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Dragon scales, demon horns, wolf tooths, etc need to be added to monster drops, and implemented as high-consumption items in crafting/smithing/potionmaking recipes

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Dragonkin should drop some form of gunpowder (flashpowder) instead of cannonballs... and make cannons/etc consume cannonballs and flashpowder at a rate of 50/50, so both PVMers and skillers contribute resources to cannon use

stoic bear
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Yeah, I do like the sounds of having more mob specific items be incorporated into the game. I do think we should also just work on adding/replacing more items with item multipliers like stone spirits and anima stones. Similar to what I was saying about minigames earlier, players shouldn't be punished for wanting to go a more pvm oriented route to skilling. I am of the opinion that the skills themselves should be the best supply of the given resources from said skill of course, otherwise what is the point,.

foggy anchor
#

I'd love to see porters require monster drops to make... perhaps from Abyssal Demons/etc

foggy anchor
stoic bear
#

I wouldn't want to make every item in the game, especially ones that are heavy focused on the skilling side, like porters, to be so heavily affected by pvm. Like with your suggestion for porters. However I do agree there should be more of a loop involved going both ways

foggy anchor
#

There's also a need for dramatic reduction on certain things on the skilling side. Ie: a single Gemstone shouldn't be crafted to make 12 tips. Gems are too common, and ammo doesn't deplete quickly these days. Make it 1 Gem, 1 tip, but make gems stackable.

stoic bear
# foggy anchor Agreed, though I think the multiplier objects are only a halfway successful expe...

Yeah, and I wouldn't want things like herbs, or even smithing bars (rip) to be completely removed from tables tbh. Because like I said, I wouldn't want to detract players from taking a more pvm oriented route. But also there should definitely be exclusivity on both sides, pvm obviously has all the weapon upgrades and even a few beneficial skilling items, and it should go the other way as well. Because at the end of the day, the objective is to get the player to interact with the game in its entirety.

foggy anchor
#

Ideally a circular economy style works best. PVM can provide some drops for Skilling, but PVM should NOT provide 100% of resources (gear, food, potions) for PVM, and it currently absolutely does.

Similarly, Skilling can provide things for PVM, but it Skilling should NOT be self-serving in the way that the Memory Dowser and Runic Attuner can be acquired from a skilling boss. Should've given those to PVM bosses instead.

At the very least, a crafting/forging component requiring the other half of the 'circle' should be necessary; ie: creating an Orthen Furnace Core could require collecting every type of dragon fire, while a Zuk sword should drop broken and require re-forging, including certain mining/smithing resources.

Does this need to be carefully balanced so Ironmen can still play? Of course. Should Ironmen be the priority for gameplay health? Not if that means oversimplifying item progression to the point that 95% of skills are dead content...

I'd like to see monster drops be lore-friendly and balanced. The 'value-creep' of PVM drops hasn't been a 'creep' for a while; it's been golden landslide after golden landslide, and nothing else can keep up.

stoic bear
foggy anchor
# stoic bear Yeah, and I wouldn't want things like herbs, or even smithing bars (rip) to be c...

So there's value to, say, Mages having rune drops, Dwarves dropping metal bars, druids dropping herbs, etc, etc...

But when we get to the point of:

Kerapac:

Gold Coins: Wrong economy. Does not need to purchase from or sell to non-dragonkin races.
Cannonball: Does not use a cannon.
Bolt tips: Does not use a crossbow.
Soul Rune: Does not interact with souls/Nomad/Desert locations
Fire battlestaff: Doesn't need fire runes to breathe fire. Has the staff of armadyl, why have 40 lesser staves?

Zuk:

Seeds: This guy lives in a furnace.
Sirenic Scale: Definitely not associated with Sirens
Wines: Definitely not a follower of Zammy or Sara, but okay, he likes booze.
Blood Runes: Not a mage
Herbs: Still in a furnace
Bolt Tips: Does not use a crossbow

Demons:

Runes: Unneeded for demonic spell casting
Herbs: Really? Demons are Vegetarian? In Infernus?
Lobster: Would be funnier to have them drop sandwiches.

Dragons:

Darts: The poor dragon has a splinter?
Javelin: Used as a back scratcher, maybe?
Knives: Dental implants, I guess?
Runes: Same problem as Demons
Cake: This cake SHOULD be a lie

Aviansie:

Feathers: six. SIX feathers. Count-em. Six. As a maximum.

Mammoth:

Sharks: Because what else would an iceberg-bound wolly elephant eat?
Unicorn Horns: Compensating?
Water Talisman: Slayers interrupted his GOP game
Bolt Tips & Arrowheads: blows them out the trunk like a gattling gun.

Feral Dinosaurs:

Boots: Fit human from future. Make human go faster. Great lore.
Coins: Buy all the shinnies from the future.
Blowpipe: Guess they're smoking that Cadantine?
Defense Potions: Try Pirelli's Miracle Elixir!

Araxxi:

Potions: Guess she can get 120 Herblore in 1/4th the time with 8 legs?
Rocktail: Webs... make good nets?
Coins: The only thing that should be glittering is those eyes....
Dragonhide: Well, now they're just being lazy.

minor halo
# foggy anchor

I'm still wondering, but correct me or give me more information but, the jmods who left (got fired), I guess that's a decision from the shareholders and not Jagex, right?

So to give a short example, the shareholder(s) wanted some jmods to go and not Jagex > ceo Mod North 😮

#

Nice to read this, have to think now about my Skill Guilds concept 🙂

Screenshot_2025-06-13_at_08.22.30.png
pale mural
#

I do agree drops related to bossing themes should have been a standard a long time ago however I think the ship has long since sailed to fix that. The only way I can see it is if they make it a theme going forward for all bosses in the future.

I don't necessarily agree that all boss content should be associated with different branches of the game. RuneScapes charm is delinear content where you go off on whole random tangents of unrelated contents. Having something too linear loses the charm of discovering new things.

stray sonnet
#

Mod Ryan mentioned on stream that he is looking into potentially adding more skilling content similar to minigames like cache

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Great news tbh

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Of course I hope something like this has level brackets but it's a huge step

pale mural
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that would be amazing but i hope its not timegated like cache is

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but having intense gameplay for solid rewards in modern gameplay would definitely help when Leagues goes live.

graceful pelican
stray sonnet
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That sounds great 😄 of course I have a preference for some core designs over others but I'm looking forward to it a lot regardless

stoic bear
# graceful pelican To elaborate on what I said, it was in reference to not all skilling updates bei...

Would you be willing to comment on the topic of https://discord.com/channels/303835144073248770/1020537530803814445 ? With constant additions of new content (a majority of which has been amazing I will say) bank space is constantly a recurring issue that never seems to end. @pine fractal did comment briefly on the thread at the end of last year a bit about the technical know how, but it is definitely a topic that really needs to be addressed.

minor halo
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New porcelain, nice mechanic!!!

minor halo
stray sonnet
foggy anchor
foggy anchor
# pale mural I do agree drops related to bossing themes should have been a standard a long ti...

It has long since sailed, but I don't think it's too far gone to fix, at a meaningful level. Won't ever be perfect, but swapping drops around until they start to make sense is rather low dev time compared to, say, creating a whole new patch of worldmap, with quests, bosses, and new mechanics... and can make a larger impact on improving game health & new player experiences at the core.

minor halo
foggy anchor
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pokes the chat with the understanding that The Beach / afk seasonals are not easy content to remove/replace... how many of us are actually participating in them these days? I basically can't be bothered unless there's new cosmetic rewards on offer, and in those cases, I'd rather play actively for a few hours than grind AFK for days/weeks on end...

pale mural
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Theres a right amount of afk and skilling as an activity and I think Shooting Stars did that well. Because the Hole is the only way to train DG that isnt lamping it that is at least mostly afk and ironman friendly, it will be popular for the forseeable future. I think the best solve for it is give it a good DnD similar to Shooting Stars where you can afk it but not to an insane degree and with some other limitations.

alpine elk
foggy anchor
# alpine elk I tell you what im knocking the shit out of dungeoneering in that hole w 12 acco...

A. ...Why are you training 12 accounts?
B. Are you... having fun interacting with 'the Hole'? Does this meet your criterion for what you daydream about spending your free time doing?
C. Do we expect that Jagex is tracking your interaction with the Hole as one player engaging with the content, or 12 players engaging with the content?
D. If 120 Dung is the goal for all of us, but we don't want to actually play any portion of Dungeoneering, is the whole skill essentially just a time-gate required to acquire max cape/other unlocks, and is otherwise dead content?
E. The shooting starts refresh definitely brought them back to the level of decent content with a good social/mmo side to it. So easy to revive dead content, yet here we are...