Vehicle - Feedback

[desert cove]

Have you not played a tank?

[acoustic vale]

On jod Rev you're ruining my peace talks

[desert cove]

If its not allowed, enfore it then. You are a mod or what?

[limpid flame]

What

[desert cove]

You mods dont enforce few rules too much.

[coral citrus]

I think it's time to drop the slowmode on these mfs

[acoustic vale]

lemme cook

[small flint]

So you are letting him break the rules?

[limpid flame]

Fair

[past widget]

Mod bias! Unequal enforcement!

[worthy wave]

honestly, we're damned if we do, damned if we don't. but this isn't a feedback post for mods, it's for vehicles. i am monitoring the channel

[worthy wave]

there's no slowmode in here

[acoustic vale]

i mean is it better than getting one tapped by snipers?

[worthy wave]

is there a slowmode for you?

[coral citrus]

No, I was just saying you probably should activate it if they keep it up with their drama :P

[acoustic vale]

I really do think that people will get better over time and that the problem would've solved itself

[limpid flame]

None of us starting a drama

But couple people here deliberately attacking us both

[coral citrus]

You get an indicator of where it was shot from and you almost surely know that guy is gonna stay in that area so you can go hunt him if you feel so inclined.

[worthy wave]

if drama or toxicity continues i'm just gonna permanently lock the post. i had to spend 30 minutes yesterday purging messages with drama in here and i've already locked this post once before for toxicity and decided to give ppl another shot, so- this is the last chance to be civil lol.

[past widget]

The toxicity in here reflects how toxic the vehicle gameplay is in the game

[small flint]

The funniest thing is the Littlebird is done cause of next week's patch and the upcoming AA. So no matter what @limpid flame @acoustic vale say they already know they lost. Instead they come here crying acting like it's gonna stop the Littlebird being kneecapped.

https://tenor.com/view/clown-gif-25799821

[coral citrus]

I don't see no tank or APC players being toxic my man 😌

[acoustic vale]

Bro please man I'm tryna find common ground

[storm shell]

Their job has always been chasing as many dudes out of the game as they can man

[limpid flame]

Sure xd

[thorny mason]

had an armed lb spawn camper whine in chat that i was constantly going to repair while i was in a transport lb lmfao

my bad you can shred me in 2 seconds flat

[opaque lily]

It's 100% damage. A Tandem rocket will always 1 shot the helicopter.

[thorny mason]

yeah that's been my experience as well, have yet to survive a tandem

[desert cove]

Just ban few individuals and problem solved

[worthy wave]

easier said

[desert cove]

3 clicks if I am correct

[limpid flame]

3 button clicks

[worthy wave]

not labor-wise. it needs to be a valid infraction lol. we can't make up rules

[limpid flame]

On first sight there is a lot of valid infractions, im not a mod so i cant point fingers at people but sometimes it's just painfully obvious my guy

[small flint]

You already do this tho do I need to do a Rev0s and make reddit thread showing how you wont warn Jopskin for stirring shit

[graceful void]

Maybe break out threads by land, sea and air

But we definitely need vehicle feedback threads

[limpid flame]

Maybe just make separate feedbacks for each vehicle yeh

[graceful void]

Even moreso than any other part of the game

[limpid flame]

cause rn these kids just spam LB blah blah and there cant be any valuable take on other vehicles

We have/had separate feedback for every gun so run it for vehicles too

unless there is some unexplained difference lol

[graceful void]

The infantry and overall experience of the game has improved massively, but the same can't be said of vehicles

[graceful void]

yeah that too

[limpid flame]

i mean just look how many messages in this thread 💀 i think it speaks volumes

[worthy wave]

reporting other users doesn't happen in a thread or on reddit. if you have concerns, use the proper channels and make a modmail.

[limpid flame]

This is discord, not reddit, plus neither of us trying to stir "shit" here but giving valuable info and opinions

I do not need to defend Jopskin even tho he is my fellow clan member cause i speak for myself and he is speaking for himself

[acoustic vale]

All i got is 3 clips from isle 1 with BTR 2 with DMR

It's hard finding matches at this time it seems

[limpid flame]

in fact i have widely different view on the topic than he does

[crude anvil]

No worries, for what it’s worth I do think it means a lot that you went to try the other perspective.

[small flint]

You just said you don't apply the rules fairly, it wasn't a question about another user. It was about you and how you mod. Because you are probably concentrating hard learning how to code loops for the first maybe didn't understand what I said.

[limpid flame]

lol

[acoustic vale]

if i could @ everyone I would

[worthy wave]

people are in here trying to discuss vehicles genuinely and you are complaining about moderation. if you have concerns, bring it to modmail. this, respectfully, is not the place for it. it's off-topic and disruptive.

[acoustic vale]

one message is red and it doesn't say why

[coral citrus]

Huh, you can take an LBs tail rotor out?

[acoustic vale]

that's crazy right? if only everyone else knew that

[coral citrus]

Never happened to me or to my targets despite multiple APC hits.

[limpid flame]

Yes you can Just like any other heli

[past widget]

The chances of hitting a LB from a skilled pilot, especially with an APC, are so low, it doesn't even matter

[coral citrus]

Yeah, sure, I just assume it's extremely unlikely to happen.

I'm not a skilled pilot and get hit often and have never lost the tail rotor lol

[limpid flame]

@acoustic vale massive w music choice xd

[acoustic vale]

incorrect that's exactly the mentality why everyone thinks they're overpowered

[limpid flame]

Happens to us a lot.

[acoustic vale]

I've shot down fallen many times and grote too, especially with the new patch it's gonna be easier than ever before

[limpid flame]

It's Just two different points of view really

[past widget]

Mentality? It's a fact that fast moving objects are harder to hit with slow moving, inaccurate rounds

[acoustic vale]

It's harder so what?

fact is that you can, and I'm not even good at BTRs someone with more time than me will have minimum 70% success rate

[past widget]

If something is harder for you but easier for them that represents an imbalance

[crude anvil]

The chances are low, though. Unless the pilot doesn’t know you’re there they can avoid your shots pretty easily.

[limpid flame]

If players want vehicles to be weak And easily counterable by a single user then what is the point of even having vehicles in the first place, Just delete them And alienate a huge fraction of players that actually enjoy the game with vehicles, let the game be infantry only jesus. You see how bad of a take is this?

[acoustic vale]

that's unlucky dude, It would be nice to reduce the spread a little but ion even wanna think about the balance on that

[past widget]

rock paper scissors and all, some things counter others, but across the board, if someone has an easier time getting points than others, it means it's imbalanced

[acoustic vale]

Maybe I'm bad but i think that a good BTR would keep every FlyAce memeber out of the game

[past widget]

the first problem with that is that BTR rounds don't go where you aim them

[crude anvil]

I don’t see most people arguing for that, though. That feels like a misrepresentation of the feedback that’s being given.

Furthermore, because this is a more arcade style game rather than a milsim, people don’t really work together very often. If teamwork is needed to shoot down a little bird, then they won’t get shot down very often at all.

[limpid flame]

Yes And no, vehicles have long timers for respawns And are limited, so the power they exert on the infantry should be high with hight reward

[crude anvil]

There are already plenty of good apc users though, so what’s up with that?

[acoustic vale]

One of em switched sides lmao

[limpid flame]

@desert cove since you are a BTR god, how easy it is to tail rotor a heli

[crude anvil]

Vehicles absolutely should be powerful, that’s the point of them. The issue is that most of the player base feels like they don’t have a viable way to counter the little bird. Call it a skill issue if you want, but if most players are not able to effectively counter that play style then changes are needed so that the player base as a whole has a more enjoyable experience.

[acoustic vale]

M110 is also super good now against them or any DMR for that matter

[desert cove]

Yeah, tail rotor HP is a joke

[acoustic vale]

That's why I'm saying that the average player skill will rise and the nerfs will just hurt in the long run

[crude anvil]

I’m super excited to try the m110, I haven’t been able to play much since the changes but I’m hyped. It’s been my favorite since I started playing.

[desert cove]

Too easy to destroy

[limpid flame]

That is why we are coming to this conversation, im not gonna call it skill issue cause there in fact is a reason to talk about it

Bruh take off slow mode:(

[desert cove]

Under 200 meters esier than using Vector. Above 200m its just slightly inconvenient

[acoustic vale]

You have DMR in your name so I bet you'll have fun, just try to shoot at helis and i bet my left nut that you'll clap them easily

[crude anvil]

Average player skill doesn’t really increase, though. The majority of players aren’t playing that much. If there is an increase in average player skill it will likely come from a shrinking casual player base instead of anything else.

[acoustic vale]

I don't agree, Valorant keeps getting an influx of new players yet compared to last year the majority have gotten wayy better (granted it's a completely different game)

[crude anvil]

To be honest, most of the time I get a few hits but the pilot will just head back to base, heal and repair, and head back out with little to no difference being made.

[acoustic vale]

You only need 2 shots now big man you'll manage

[limpid flame]

It really is not hard, i just think people dont even try and rather go on and complain about most of the issues in this game

[crude anvil]

On the pilot sure, but most of the time you get hits on the vehicle not the pilot.

I think a point of great irony is that most of the issues the little bird has would be alleviated if the ground attack aircraft role was taken by a fixed wing aircraft rather than a helicopter. I know they don’t intend to add fixed wing aircraft, but the fact is that it would be much less of an issue.

[limpid flame]

as a youngling pilot i cried about APC being busted n shit for shooting me down but as i grew in skill i learned that it's a pretty weak vehicle overall so out of my experience i can say skill affects how easy the game is or should i say, it allows you to see what is truly broken and what isnt

i cant say LB wasn't broken but devs gave it to us this way and refused to change it for the longest time so we used it

[acoustic vale]

You right on that, cause it's the only thing in the air

Some blackhawk buffs would come in handy

[crude anvil]

I was thinking it would be mostly because you would need to point the aircraft at what you want to shoot at. The thing that makes little birds to hard to deal with is the acrobatics and side slipping they can do while they shoot at targets.

[limpid flame]

if you think jets, then oki has deliberately say he does not intend to add those, if you think attack helicopter it was not denied nor confirmed but i too believe that would eat a lot of the issues from the community

you just cant expect the infantry to be good at dealing with an aerial vehicle, there really should be a dedicated vehicle to fight with those

and im pretty sure i have said it here ages ago

[crude anvil]

A fixed wing aircraft is a plane. Doesn’t necessarily mean a jet. I did also point out that I am aware that they don’t intend to add planes. It wasn’t a suggestion, just something I thought of.

[acoustic vale]

A guy on the reddit thread suggested a complete rework of vehicle physics that'd be nice too

[limpid flame]

plane or jet, doesnt really matter, fact is, oki doesnt want those for some reason

[crude anvil]

I know lol that’s why I mentioned twice that I’m aware they don’t plan to add them and I’m not suggesting they do.

[limpid flame]

cool

[acoustic vale]

Is the BTR supposed to get ragdolled when it gets hit with anything remotely explosive?

[crude anvil]

The btr does have a tendency to get yeeted when hit with anything explosive, I don’t think it’s intended but rather a quirk of the physics design that hasn’t been addressed yet.

[limpid flame]

indeed typical apc gameplay consists of doing a bit of spins

[acoustic vale]

yeah so all vehicle physics should get addressed soon™

[limpid flame]

i mean nothing new, look how quads/humvees react on terrain

[acoustic vale]

Arma 3 type beat

[desert cove]

Spins you said?

[crude anvil]

Look at how they react when they bump into each other and immediately become stuck

[acoustic vale]

i love it when a driver hops out while going mach 3 and it just stops without giving a single fuck

[limpid flame]

apc vs apc fights is beyblade vs beyblade

[past widget]

you should get points for doing spins in a BTR

[limpid flame]

tony how style lmao

[crude anvil]

Tony hawk pro skater type thing

[acoustic vale]

Been a nice convo Bob, I realized that I actually don't really care, now I'm just gonna be mad about something actually important.. the lack of content.

[crude anvil]

I am very curious how the little bird will play with the damage changes to the gun.

[crude anvil]

Okay lol I wish you luck, I’m excited for the new guns coming myself.

[acoustic vale]

I'll delete the reddit thread, It doesn't really matter how many numbers they tweak anyway

Got my negative karma too

[crude anvil]

Yes you did lol

[limpid flame]

it will be a lot of hitmarkers and longer TTK plus forcing us much closer thus making LB even easier target to kill, TLDR very hard for new/medium level pilots, ace pilots possible will have harder time but we will use certain tryhard playstyle that forgen has been pioneering ages before it was considered good so uh

idk we'll have to see once it fully lands tbh

[crude anvil]

What playstyle is that?

[acoustic vale]

I personally can't even explain it

[crude anvil]

Unless it’s top secret 🤔

[limpid flame]

it really is hard to explain xd

[acoustic vale]

Nah dawg you're welcome to try and figure it out, i wanna know myself too

[limpid flame]

just imagine a very annoying mosquito

[crude anvil]

Ah, the ol’ shoot n scoot

[limpid flame]

nono

[crude anvil]

No no? Acrobatics?

[limpid flame]

this playstyle consists of being always at the face, not even trying to hide, while doing a lot of very odd movements

idk i cant fully explain it, you have to see it to know what i mean

[acoustic vale]

To me it looks like he just stands still and shoots I don't get it

[crude anvil]

When you say at the face do you mean closer than usual?

[limpid flame]

well, by the fact that the nerfs are landing and the fact that he is basically always still in the same spot,yes

but even tho he doesnt die at all becaues of how odd this shit is

[crude anvil]

Weird. I Guess I’ll have to wait and see

[acoustic vale]

I'm kinda gonna miss the acrobatics tho, it was fun to do

[limpid flame]

i mean that was the fun factor but oh well, it is what it is

[opaque lily]

Exactly. I kill littlebirds just fine in the blackhawk. I'm sick of people crying about the littlebirds but then never doing anything to contest them.

[clever vessel]

Every time i wake up some new drama got dragged in here for no good reason

[wide relic]

Honestly just scroll down every time now once I see it same old

[clever vessel]

Ngl, i feel like that’s where a lot of those novice LB pilots start and die anyways - they do get close because it feels natural, ergo ‘i should be getting close and killing these guys’ and when they invariably get shot down by one among the gigantic crowds enough times they quit

[clever vessel]

Also the spinning has become bloody unbearable - to the point where i’ll see other apcs and we’ll give up on one another after maybe a single magdump both ways

I guess it’s gotta be a relic of the milsim direction of the game that, much like couriers in the trenches of Picardy, I have gentleman’s agreements with half of the APCs not to fire at each other

[desert cove]

Invisible RPG nerf is unberable, ffs, can't even get a clue from where it comes

[clever vessel]

Is it meant to be intentional? Or is it just a torrential bug

[topaz basin]

this already happened sometimes at release and subsequent patches, it's even more annoying now because it happens more often with no sound either, you just get the blue marker

[limpid flame]

that was the skill difference between a bad pilot aka new pilot and an ace pilot.

so by all those nerfs the skill ceiling for LB was lowered so low and actually made even harder for people to use it that only current ace pilots will know how to use the LB. just my opinion. cause i honestly dont see how someone wanting to become a pilot will want to learn after all those nerfs cause they will simply die instantly

see those nerfs at the same level as community wanting to delete air strafe for infantry or idk, lean spam

[desert cove]

it's a price for repair tool working i guess

[digital pier]

its sad the skill cieling for little birds via movement is destroyed now - its now more difficult to evade + attack and dogfights are way less interesting now

[clever vessel]

I’m on peanut’s side with this one tbh, I think the LB just needs a new gameplay loop that can be balanced in tandem with inf on the ground

[limpid flame]

Community wants the skill ceiling for EVERYTHING in this game to be lowered so i guess natural cycle

this is what catering to casuals leads to, instead of having a balance between listening to sweats AND casuals

[digital pier]

this is my experience for me sofar

[clever vessel]

The whole skill ceiling isn’t really that important to balance as much as what it does, and atm the LB’s just annoyingly oppressive but in my experience just badly integrated into everything else

[graceful void]

True of a lot of vehicles sadly

[limpid flame]

yes, so how oki handles the nerf that it im ngl deserved, was butchering a whole part of the game?

all those nerfs came out of okis ass to cover himself because of that reddit drama, he got pressed, he did it in a rush, not even tested

[clever vessel]

not unique for it at least, basically none of the attack vehicles have the kind of breakout power you’d expect for their role, and conversely the two ground ones have five easy counters; the one in the sky can’t really be nerfed ‘well’ because its playstyle is a parody of the problem on the ground

Also rev can we drop the ‘community wants this’ and the ‘oki is covering this’ tbh? Know you’re pretty decently chill and all it does is attract dramamongers

[limpid flame]

true, my bad

[clever vessel]

Yeah no problems my dude

[clever vessel]

But the APCs and the Tanks have the good grace of having differentiable roles that with buffs can be pretty effective; conversely, the LB just has a minigun which doesn’t seem to pick people off quickly at the best of times

When i’ve seen the 100-0 helis i see them picking up like 4-6 kills a minute over time, so they’re very good killers but they’re not exactly going to stymie the blob washing over isle C

Like ignore the ‘1%’ or the ‘skill issue’ or the skill discussion for a moment - the LB as it exists in most games is just a ticket drain you won’t register except for the several times it gets you with little warning

[limpid flame]

idk, even if i played against fellow ace pilots, i died to them max 2 times and purely becaues of my stupidity, if somebody died to LBs multiple times a row that cant be an excuse for calling the nerfs, there had to be an error on his part like bruh

[clever vessel]

So you force it closer - 75m range - you make it fairer for infantry but you don’t really solve the problem that this doesn’t actually change that relationship

[limpid flame]

it was definitely a bad nerf, but i dont care, not a nerf for my playstyle, just feel sad for anyone that wanted to become a pilot

[desert cove]

That's the worst part

Oki seems dead set on nerfing one clan personally, to appease reddit dipshits, and by that he is raising skill floor of LB to a point that learning how to play is too hard for what it's worth

[limpid flame]

i have never seen a nerf that lowers a skill ceiling a lot lower but the skill floor is so high now aswell xD

[desert cove]

it's impossible

you are supposed to counter high skill celling assets with counters and detterents

[limpid flame]

not in BBR i guess

[past widget]

Now littlebirds have to get closer, and players will therefore have an easier time shooting them down. Seems fair

[limpid flame]

You say fair but you see one side only, and ignore the bigger part of balancing entirely

[past widget]

What's the other side?

[limpid flame]

uh, the vehicle players???

[past widget]

Something that they have that is overpowered is now less so. What's the problem?

[limpid flame]

everything that was said prior just explain it

you just didnt read it well enough

[past widget]

okay then

[clever vessel]

imo the issue is (and pls clown me on this one if it's off too much)

LB is actually a low risk low reward vehicle. But they're increasing the risk and it's still the same reward; some players were able to effectively leverage the low risk to obtain ridiculous rewards over long periods of time, but the nerf doesn't change that before all of that the LB is kinda low reward

we talk about kills and K/D a lot but we have to admit kills are like. an awful way of gauging whether something is balanced or not. And I have to admit - i've seen two high-kill LB players over my playtime. You'd barely notice them outside the scoreboard

[desert cove]

Yeah, kills and KD aren't the best way to gauge effectiveness. Especially on vehicles, which notoricly allow for high KD gameplay in few games and franchises, and it's like that for a decade if not more.

KPM is much more important, that why all the "pro" clans require very good kpm and strive to improve mainly that. Even littlebird pilots would struggle with achieving kpm of good inf players, I haven't seen pilot above 3.0kpm, which is like a minimum to join ether.

[clever vessel]

it's literally the BFV thing where medics would always dominate the scoreboard but the vast majority were useless fucks just kinda scattering around taking dumb gunfights, and there's no real way to represent that by K/D

[desert cove]

Then there is also score per minute, which vehicles also don't have high for the amount of kills they get. One again, inf players outperforms ANY vehicle in second most important statistic to gauge effectiveness/impact on the game.

[clever vessel]

the guy who went 11-19 but held most of the conq points on Arras was the most impactful player. You wouldn't recognize that tho just looking at a scoreboard where he's hidden away in middle

[clear lagoon]

ETHER doesnt even play BBR anymore except Robocat

[desert cove]

Doesn't matter, they were one of the best, thier standards were high, higer than any vehicle player achived, as far we know of.

[limpid flame]

i did this on infantry and we still lost by a lot, kills dont matter

[desert cove]

This

[limpid flame]

like we actually lost by 1k tickets

[desert cove]

Playing The FUCKING Objective matters, and most vehicles cannot really do that. Littlebird have the most impact in PTFO out of all combat vehicles, but any transport heli have it much more, because droping 10 guys at back cap is very powerfull strategy

[clever vessel]

that's like such a major thing with the scoreboard imo

It's the only readily accessible source of game info in game atm. And conversely, it's also one of the worst in any game. So a shit info source is being privileged beyond belief

[desert cove]

And then infantry can PTFO all the time, because the game and maps are designed to allow as much for them, and limit vehicles as much as possible.

[clever vessel]

and then the only ways vehicles express any impact is by doing killing and even then they don't because they're being forced to sit back at spawn, peek out of the safe area for like 10 seconds and then run away

like. this is the ultimate problem, where the things players are encouraged to do is just get high kd ratios, the game is designed around rewarding players who don't defend and roam gormlessly searching for kills, and the only thing people can see is the kills, deaths, and score

it doesn't really mitigate that when you include a hi-score screen at the end for one class' ability use (which is still a good thing)

the thing that holds big ass games like this together is the PTFO. the thing that's getting neglected is the PTFO

[cedar ember]

I went 0/1 as a blackbird with an 80k score. We were fast capping points all game. One of those rare games where there went 25 LAVs or engis trying to shoot me down.

[desert cove]

Yeah, Blackhawk is probably the most "OP" vehicle, realisticly speaking.
One player can win a whole match if he can fly well. But it doesn't do big numbers, so most monkeys we call players don't see them as "op" even tho they can carry 126 players to a win.

[clever vessel]

yeah a good BH will win games on its own

it's the best backcap vech, is fast enough to escape even after getting low enough to drop off inf, and is a relatively versatile tool even without good attack capability

[cedar ember]

Only OP if by some miracle you get teammates that spawn on you and people don't try to shoot you down. Recently i have been having trouble staying in the air for longer than 2 minutes.

[desert cove]

There must be something with Helis hp, or players can shoot down BH easily, but not LB, for some fucking reason

[cedar ember]

Recently I feel like I have been getting blown up much much easier than I used to...

[opaque lily]

RPGs are bugged. They are invisible and scilent.

[limpid flame]

I cant tell how many Times i died in heli today, cant tell if it's bugged, shadownerfed or Just community finally learning to shoot at me, but I Just wont play LB at all, too much effort for basically no reward,I can achieve higher kill games on inf by 10x now Just by chilling

https://tenor.com/view/sweaty-sweat-heat-hot-wipe-sweat-gif-17716050

Meanwhile playing LB rn feels like this for

Plus i already saw people playing LB from the redzone cause they are scared of dying xd

Decent pilots might i add lul

[clever vessel]

inb4 'pls nerf redzone the vehicles are too overpowered camping there'

sometimes, it's ignorance - other times it's wiilful dishonesty of incredible proportion

[limpid flame]

It is what it is

Another fucked up vehicle, that once used to be good, nothing new for oki, it's a Pattern at this point

@clever vessel @desert cove to further harden the argument that kills dont matter at all

Look at the ticket difference And look at enemy top scoring person xd Brother was only running from point to point, and rezzing his team And healing them

[desert cove]

Tanks and APC never were good as far as I am aware

[limpid flame]

I remember vaguely tanks being slightly better with more ammo And easier HE shot. APC i think never Got touched? Might be wrong

So I guess you could Say tanks were slightly better in that regard

[clear lagoon]

BH and Ka60 have like 30% of the mobility of the LB. The LB manuverability is what make it so hard to take down.

Transport heli have a hard time to even accelerate

[flint escarp]

Feels so good seeing the LB players cry after swearing blindly it wasn’t broken lmfao

[clever vessel]

Please don't take the bait istg

[acoustic vale]

it's "hard to kill" or because it's "too oppressive", but I have never had that as infantry

I don't like the direction that because someone is having a hard time with the littlebird then let's nerf the littlebird instead of buffing or adding tools against it

[clear lagoon]

The little bird deserves an hp nerf, not a gun and mobility nerf

[acoustic vale]

That's what I said also but well

I think hp nerf and then limited AA would've been fine for everyone, wouldn't even need flares since the mobility would've added outplay potential and skill expression

[clear lagoon]

The whole reason why LB is so tanky is because back in the playtest, people don't know how to fly it proficiently yet, and it was easy to shoot an untrained pilot LB. Then Oki basically double the HP, give the pilot damage reduction, and now everyone is good at flying it became a fortress

[past widget]

in Arma you could shoot a LB with 7.62 and it would pierce the metal, hit the engine or rotors and break stuff. Good times

[clear lagoon]

Fun fact: You need to hit the BH 5 times with HEAT to bring it down

[opaque lily]

Not true. It's even more. Far more.

[cedar ember]

Eh BH is struggling though... They get nocked out of the air so fast.

[clear lagoon]

If they dont have an engineer on board, sure. But if they have an engineer with repair tool, especially with the new 98% repair buff, they are pretty much a flying Achilles, and you need to hit the rotor to bring it down before it gets back to base for repair. Also pilots are a big factor of survival, since BH fly so slow it's common for new pilots to lose altitude and hit objects, signigficantly reduce their health

[patent edge]

https://tenor.com/view/mike-o'hearn-what-is-love-baby-don't-hurt-me-gif-12723256336994168017

Literally me

Lmao chat cooldown in this thread xD

[clear lagoon]

Since groty boy is gone, can we lift the slow mode pls

Pretty pls @kind sinew

[patent edge]

Grote hasnt been talking in this channel tho?

[clear lagoon]

A vehicle discussion without grote? No way

[clever vessel]

Idk what that guy was doing elsewhere but he was only in this thread like
For two weeks?

The cooldown’s for people still doing bait and drama shit

[clear lagoon]

Basically he's FlyAce CEO, and he got some strong stances

[clever vessel]

No not that ik about that; but i meant as in ‘what grote was doing in other feedback threads’

He wasn’t much of a presence here, rev’s been the permanent flyace rep

[clear lagoon]

Ah ic

[limpid flame]

Ohno, nonono, do not Say i represent my clan, my views are very different from theirs, but we have common experiences And we all can tell what shouldve had happened And what not. I May have few Wild opinions here n there that May leave a bad Shadow on FlyAce....then again...I domt think it can be worse xd

[clever vessel]

Sdjalskdj chill man you decent

[earnest ocean]

If you did not played in 2020-21-22 then you can just speculate that is was never, because you did not play earlier.

[clear lagoon]

Old oil dune hill tanks

[rancid hound]

they were, but they were nerfed to shit

[cedar ember]

i seem to die to random tail hits all the time

Often cross map lucky shots

[limpid flame]

Oki has Just simply killed the fun in every vehicle now, Just my opinion

And it's only cause he doesnt know how to balance them at all

[heady jewel]

Didn’t you say you wouldn’t care about the lb nerf or something

[limpid flame]

I dont really care as much as you think due to two things:

1. Is that i still do similar scores on infantry while enjoying this
2. This game is already on it's way to die out so giving more than two flying fucks about this is borderline pointless

Doesn't stop me from giving valuable feedback on the issue of vehicles

[warm abyss]

Kinda surprised how many copters survive no tail rotors

decided to do some auto cannon AA yesturday

shot down approx 10 and all 10 didn't get destroyed on impact with the ground (this is from varying heights and include some other hits as well)

[limpid flame]

They are not meant to Explode instantly after crashing, this is why u have that mechanic where crew is "stunned" And have a "chance" to escape the crash alive

[warm abyss]

Well in my experience the chance is if near or at full HP, otherwise you tend to die

otherwise it is a case of a BH or LB falling from a pretty good altitude surviving hitting the ground & not exploding at all from what I could tell (only got XP from the tail rotor & the hits , but not transport destroyed nor any player kills, which I found odd) mixed with no player deaths at all just seems odd ya know

[desert cove]

And it's fucking infuriating. I can shoot down few helis per game, bur I get kills or assists only from 20-25% of those. Destroying tail rotor should auto tag assists. Even if they didn't get 75% dmg during crash

[desert cove]

They were better than now, or objectively good? Because there is a difference.

They could be better than now and still be poorly designed and implemented

[clear lagoon]

I think I have an APC clip from early 2022 in an old HDD

[storm shell]

way back in 2022? old man

[desert cove]

That's like, ancient lore at this point

[limpid flame]

Real, all that work to not be rewarded for

[desert cove]

No work tbh, only 1000 xp, but you doing something that contributes to your team more than 1k xp is worth

[limpid flame]

Yeah well, point still stands, it should count

[coral citrus]

Half the problems vehicles have are problems inherent to other systems. C4 being widely available, very fast to deploy and completely silent; squad respawning making ammo limits irrelevant.

[warm abyss]

Pretty much Lucuma

it is a case of you have effectively unlimited ammo with the current squad spawns + full restock on a respawn

[desert cove]

Yeah, the fact that inf doesn't really struggle with ammo, but vehicles have like 3 min trip back and forth few times in a game is fucked up

Unless you are a sniper, or have pocket medic to ress you constantly, you will run out of nades and that's all, like, vast majority of playerbase will not steuggle with ammo

[crude anvil]

If you’re making the trip back and forth several times in a match then you’re not dying and probably getting a lot of kills so that seems pretty reasonable to me.

[warm abyss]

more like pocket support at this rate as well

[crude anvil]

Very reasonable, actually

[warm abyss]

Will say this again , I am 100% up for making ammo (both infantry & vehicles), armor repair (same idea as ammo) and medical resupply stations near friendly points (constructable even)

[desert cove]

Or you miss all shots and don't get any kills at all. Also possibility

[warm abyss]

depends on range & one in question I suppose

[crude anvil]

With how survivable and powerful you are in a vehicle I don’t think needing to go back for ammo is a problem at all.

[crude anvil]

To some extent, yes.

[desert cove]

Not to mention that no matter if you get kills or no, pushing further than C point is stupid on most maps because you run out of ammo very fast

So you can't really support your team after that

In all vehicles, except LB, you are limited to the closer half of the map

Because otherwise RTB takes to long and extending that far is very risky overall

Capped C point should have ressuply station, for the team that controlls it

[crude anvil]

That might actually be great to encourage vehicles to push forward and camp at the rear less, really interesting idea

[desert cove]

Yeah, i agree with that, seen it proposed many times alredy

[crude anvil]

Probably shouldn’t also repair though because otherwise you could just sit next to it and constantly be resupplied and repaired while fighting

[coral citrus]

In many maps, it is almost a requisite to take down half of the trees and walls along your way to not be ambushed and have clear sightlines. You can spend all 200 APC rounds just clearing out the area right outside of south spawn in Valley for instance.

[coral citrus]

Isle has these stations on the first points you encounter, this is solved by applying a 60 second cooldown that prevents repairs after you have fired.

[crude anvil]

If you decide to spend all of your ammo knocking down trees to ensure your invincibility I think that’s your own issue

[desert cove]

This cooldown is fucked up, you can get in BTR there right after the game starts, but then you se 60s cooldown alredy

I think it's global, not per vehicle

[coral citrus]

Yeah I think it's way too high. But the point is it's already not an issue.

[desert cove]

Same on Dustydew

[desert cove]

Imo, it's only ressuply for tanks, it should work like main base, because tanks can't go to main

APC'S can, but it's extremely inefficient

[coral citrus]

You can wait until infantry start using them to shoot you from instead, won't change the fact that you spend half a clip taking down cover and the other half trying to hit the player. You're absolutely not raking in kills from that.

At any rate, whether you think going back for ammo is reasonable or not (I wouldn't mind if we were a higher ammo capacity to start with), the end result of that decision is that it's far more convenient to stay as close as spawn as possible at all times.

[crude anvil]

Right, and it would make sense to have that change by having a resupply point out in a neutral area someplace.

I really don’t think it should repair at all though, especially with the repair tool buff. The one issue with that is it would require you to get out of your vehicle, so maybe you could have an option to lock the vehicle for a short time (20 seconds or so) to allow you to hop out and repair without worrying about it being taken. That also would mean you don’t have to worry too much about players locking vehicles the whole time so nobody can use them.

[desert cove]

It's very convenient to stay close to spanw, and game where your team is pushed on last point are best kills games. But you will loose

[coral citrus]

Personal record with apc is 83-0 on Salhan because they had us permanently pushed all the way to north spawn. Absurdly easy to catch clusters of people walking along the path right next to the water.

[desert cove]

RU spawn?

[limpid flame]

Salhan is a onesided map tho

[desert cove]

Mine PR is 86-0 on azagor, very fun match, I stayed near C all the time, with occasional RTB

[desert cove]

For US

And most maps are one sided, RU loses very often

[crude anvil]

RU loses very often

Milsim game fr

[desert cove]

XDDDDDDD

[storm shell]

Milsim game would have RU shooting back with sticks

[desert cove]

No joking, RU does lose more often than US, maps are made to favour one side

[storm shell]

skeptical

[desert cove]

Man, I play RU only since releas, to get my kills on BTR only and I have terrible winrate, even tho I am always in top 20

And I have too much games to say that I am unlucky with teammates

[cedar ember]

While i don't think the game is dead, i think the balancing of major parts of the game is bad enough to see it fail if the devs don't fix it.

[limpid flame]

Not dead yet , it is well on it's way for it with current balancing and content road

Well well well...

[crude anvil]

Cubic gravity lmfao

[storm shell]

https://tenor.com/view/well-bye-later-see-you-bye-gif-16004210

[desert cove]

Problem is that nerfs are stupid. It's just damage control to appease reddit at this point

LB needs counters and detterents, and worse sustain

[crude anvil]

Nerfing something isn’t always a bad idea though.

It doesn’t make sense to only ever make things stronger

[desert cove]

In this case is, because it's obvious that Oki wants to target top1%, FlyAce especially, because reddit is on the witch haunt for them

And it will ruin LB for the 99% that's left

[crude anvil]

Little bird will still be strong though, just not practically untouchable.

The point of the changes isn’t to punish flyace or pilots in general.

The whole point is that the majority of the player base feels like they have little to no counterplay for little birds and that feels very bad.

So the little bird is being changed so it doesn’t feel as hard to deal with.

[storm shell]

it'll be fine

[opaque trench]

What’s even the counter argument? On Wakistan especially the only way to counter it is either a good Blackhawk or like 10 people with AUGs or LMGs, and both of those are unachievable unless you have a big well coordinated squad

[storm shell]

the counter arguement is "I like being invincible in my helicopter"

[opaque trench]

I agree it’d be better for them to add another counter rather than nerf it but, that takes dev time and they need a fast fix

[storm shell]

dudes found the lowest common denominator game with broken physics that caters to their autistic grasp of flying and want to keep it, it'll be fine just like the smg rebalance was

if they had some semblence of self control for the last 2 months they would be able to keep it, but they didn't and this is why they can never have nice things

[limpid flame]

bad map design and no actual deterrents available for infantry. It is not the issue of LB being OP blah blah but the issuue of lack of counters available. this nerf was purely targeted at us or other ace pilots but in turn fucked up gameplay for everyone = very bad choice in the long run

It would be far better to spend some time in development to actually create balanced ways of counters instead of instantly saving his ass from reddit mob

[storm shell]

which is more likely

-that you actually want air deterrents
-that you know that air deterrents will take quite a while to actually impement and the game will be dead by then

[crude anvil]

The nerfs were not targeted at you. The point wasn’t to make you guys have less fun. The point was to make the average player feel like they were able to actually fight back against the little bird. You guys don’t have anything to do with it.

[limpid flame]

Like give them stingers - ok you kinda deal with LB but also fuck up transports plus it may be very hard to balance overall for different gamemodes.
Give AA, actually decent point but spend some development time to actually figure out the numbers to make it balanced for all sides
give another vehicle - as fun as it sounds it can be very hard to balance

[opaque trench]

Yeah, so when they have time to do that they can revert the nerf?

[limpid flame]

They literally were, oki was not even concerned about LBs at all before that reddit drama and he had to do those changes immediately because people were crybaby leaving the game

[limpid flame]

Plus it actually kills some fun, the movement nerf, but add it up with the damage falloff nerf and it makes it unfun for LB, make the vehicle the free xp box flying around the map

[crude anvil]

You’re not getting what I’m saying. The point of the nerfs wasn’t to make it harder for you guys. The whole point was to make playing against a little bird less frustrating for infantry.

If it makes things harder for you guys that’s a side effect

[limpid flame]

If not for us, then it made it harder for every aspiring pilot, core identity of LB revolves around it being oppressive for infantry, the freedom of gameplay it has allows it, even to this day, just so severly limited , it is not fun for me, nor for the infantry. I dont even wanna think how it feels for aspiring pilots lol

[storm shell]

let me get this straight

[limpid flame]

but i dont care much about the nerf, i still do my games like i said before, it's just sad for aspiring pilots

[storm shell]

you're saying that "aspiring pilots" just learning how to fly, fly upside down a lot?

thats , at a minimium, completely stupid

[small flint]

yeah you don't know? The "aspiring pilots" for dead game according to him

[crude anvil]

If you think the whole point of the little bird is to be oppressive to infantry then I’m not surprised you’re so frustrated.

The little bird is, I’d argue, supposed to be for fighting light vehicles and also infantry. That does not mean it should be oppressive.

[storm shell]

no its not dead yet, it'll be dead once people can actually play the game without said pilots XD

[limpid flame]

You clearly never even tried learning LB if you think that it involves flying upside down a lot, at most it's used as movement tool cause hitting shots while being upside down was very hard, only the best of the pilots knew how to aim like that. but the nerf affected the overall speed of LB which makes it an easier target for RPGS/BTRs, cause previously tilting forward would lead to speed gain, now it leads to speed gain and entire height loss, which is the easiest way to get killed, be closer to the ground. there is also an entire mechanics of circling around enemies which is now slightly nerfed. Littlebird 1v1s turned from outskilling other pilots to RNG cause you cant do any evasive movements, it's either jumping the other pilot by surprise and guaranteeing the win or doing a face off on range where you cant avoid much. there is so much more to this nerf and you dont even understand, cause you dont even try.
Bob im not frustrated, as i said, i still drop my games XD it's just sad for new pilots lol

[storm shell]

Okay, so the nerfs wont affect anyone then, according to you, so yeah, cool, we're good then and you're done caterwauling right?

[limpid flame]

You are so tone deaf and dumb you just misunderstood everything lol whatever

[storm shell]

I didn't misunderstand you're just making moronic bad faith arguments like you usually do.
If LB's get worse, if you were actually good, you'd take is as a challenge to overcome them

but you're not, you're just in here to screech and get attention

[limpid flame]

are you blind fam

[storm shell]

You dont care about new pilots

[limpid flame]

lol as if you knew lmao

[storm shell]

how many new pilots are in your little guild and you're crossteam exploiting to get them into choppers to learn them?

just name one

[crude anvil]

While new pilots won’t be as hard to kill as they were in the past, they’ll still be able to learn and have fun. It’s not like the little bird is totally dead.

[limpid flame]

67 members and we have around 15 ace pilots, everyone else is still learning.

[storm shell]

so name one

[limpid flame]

Juicebox, MissFish, Peksi

[desert cove]

Adding tools to work against LB would be MUCH better option in situation you discribed.

Nerfs are just lazy damage control attempts

[limpid flame]

dumb accusations around the topic that was already sorted out, stop trying to start shit, you and desh are literally only here to attack me for whatever i say without giving ANY single good bit of feedback @worthy wave can we start moderating people like this, it's getting annoying

[worthy wave]

yeah

this post is done

no more skill issues here, have casual conversations in battlebit-eng

[lusty meteor]

So, I'll re-open this, be civil, and respect the rules, otherwise, it'll just be closed again.

[desert cove]

Thank you

We are so back, can we get slow to 5 sec tho?

Soo, we have 2024 now, game released 6 months ago

No tail rotor buff
No Night Vision for APC (after more than a year of asking)

Spinning bug not fixed

Tandem and C4 still OP and reign supreme

Tank vs tank is still 60sec slap fight

APC still sucks

Boat is still unfinished and honestly boring to play

But we got new skins, and we will get charms!!!

Still no skins or customisation for vehicles...

And no vehicles im shooting range

Did I forgot about something?

[worthy pewter]

Nerf spawn tanks, apc has infinite range, remove heli bouncing off the ground instead of crashing

[desert cove]

Elaborate

There is no "apc with infinite range"

Spawn Tanks? wtf

[livid mirage]

i think they mean tanks that camp in spawn.

[desert cove]

Ah yes, this myth again

[livid mirage]

i mean, i get it, but maybe fix infantry explosive spam first. see where that goes at least.

[desert cove]

That's the resonable way

But we all know its better to nerf things that you don't like instead of fixing the underlying issue

[livid mirage]

like quickly nerfing snipers and other playstyles rather than finally nerfing versatile fast-paced smg C4 spam so that playing anything mid-range is no longer a chore, then more people are encouraged to cover more ground while making it overall tougher for snipers to find positions - oh im sorry, im not supposed to post this here. this thread is for vehicles. my bad.🧂
in short, i agree.

[desert cove]

The 🧂fits here lol

[carmine flume]

ammo counter for m2browning humvee would go hard

[desert cove]

No

If a tank would sit in spawn zone, you are definetly safe 300m from it

You really need to be close to spawn border to be in LOS from it

[worthy pewter]

Add javlin

i see it writen there pls make javlin shoot spawn tanks from 1km and they go boom just like russia tanks irl

[desert cove]

Javelins would turn the vehicle expiriencs 180 degree

There are better wasy to solve your percived 'problem'

[cedar ember]

I think by far c4 is one of the biggest issues for vehicles.

And reading the c4 feedback thread, its also a massive issue for infantry as well.

The #1 first change I would like to see is a c4 nerf.

Second is to change the tail rotor to be a damage multiplier on the main vehicle's health, not an instant kill.

[livid mirage]

they should consider strongly decrease its throwing range. it just functions as a better grenade at the moment and has no reason to be thrown other than for ranged kills. if people really want to throw C4 that far, then maybe add a function where the player would need to hold down the button to throw it further - throwing multiple c4 would then be significantly slower than placing multiple.

[desert cove]

Basically invalidates any attempts at getting close to the point, pushing, entering proximity of any building, making PTFO very hard if even possible. Makes some areas of maps unaccesible, unless you are suicidal, and presence of vehicles on maps like Lonovo, Frugis, Tensa is a mistake

[cedar ember]

Yeah, anytime I push near buildings somebody jumps out of a window and c4s me in a second.

[carmine flume]

tbh vehicles in urban combat are gonna have a rough time regardless if it’s heat tanden c4, or av nades. unless they are made immortal

[desert cove]

But this is a game, and not very realistic one too. People don't like vehicles camping, but that's only thing they can do. So, for everyone fun, fuck realism and copy BF4

[hearty palm]

gameplay or balance should never be compromised in favor of realism

anyway, roundhouse kick C4 and tandem into the concrete, thanks

[desert cove]

Even Squad doesn't do that

[cedar ember]

There is SOME counterplay to tandems/heat. I deal with those quite often, and with good infantry you can survive.

But c4? Even surrounded by competent teammates a single person with c4 can kill your tank before a single teammate can respond.

[desert cove]

The counterplay I found is, shoot at engis first, pray they can't use it, try to minimalise your profile

Focusing on that makes you more vunerable to C4, to which there is no counterplay

[cedar ember]

Really good use of smokes and positioning can also help.
The smoke buff was really decent.

Sometimes you just can't help it if 3 engis with tandoms insta pop you (tandems are hella op, but that is a different topic). But when dealing with heat, you can keep yourself alive for a while with good support.

But yeah, c4, ggs. Last time I played I died 10 times to c4 and once to RPGs lol.

Oh, give tanks a 3rd type of shell, smoke.
Would further allow tanks to work along side infantry.
(I would imagine you would switch between your secondary 50 cal and a smoke launcher)

[nocturne meteor]

Probably don't know enough to make suggestions on gameplay impacting features and statistics, but please I beg of you devs, give the vehicle guns more menacing and louder sounds! I am always so incredibly disapointed when I can hear footsteps over an LAV autocannon firing a few meters off to my side. The psychological aspect alone will make vehicles much more intimidating to deal with. Please deafen me for a short while when a tank fires near me. Let me know loud and clear, that a 50. cal machinegun is pinning my position down. Similar to how the sniper rifles got their sound range to be basically map wide recently. How this would translate into gameplay is that people who didn't think the vehicles were good enough, when it comes to armament, could be magically silenced with just changing the sound and feel of these weapon systems. Infantry would be more likely to keep down and not posing a threat to the vehicle itself giving it much higher chances of survival despite the amount of armor or any other aspect not being changed. That is after all the point of covering fire in a vehicle like that. Respect the psychological aspect of warfare in games!

Example 1; The A-10 Warthog. People adore it despite it being quite hilariously impractical in most cases even when it comes to close air support, its only real quality. That 30mm cannon ripping the air apart is such a strong psychological effect, that it more or less stuns the enemy and gives a gigantic moral boost to its allies.

Example 2; The BTR-82A fitted with the 2A72 30 mm autocannon, like it is in the game, has such a menacing sound in real life. People are terrified of it even though the thing has basically paper thin armor! It's a hilariously terrible APC, but it has such a presence with that cannon going off, you wish to not face it in battle. Even more outragious is the new-ish BMPT Terminator, but that's more or less the same argument. All bark no bite, but still people are horrified to hear it go off!

[opal compass]

On Invasion there is a countdown on vehicle repair/ammo boxes, the time seemed arbitrary to me and what even causes it, does anyone know?

[carmine flume]

I think it's because you fired recently

[desert cove]

That or someone was there ressuplying short while ago. I really can't get that

[acoustic fractal]

The only thing you can do against c4 is hear the footsteps and dismount. I got some kills that way

[wraith girder]

please add a identifyer for gunner seats

[digital dune]

idk about infantry, but I know the vehicles used to be much louder when you were inside them. I get that it was probably annoying for some people, but I'd love if there was a vehicle-specific volume slider so I could have my deafening vehicles again

[rancid ridge]

please reduce tank respawn time. takes more than 5 mins as it is now - thats rediculous. should be more like 2 mins max, especially seeing how easy it is to take out tanks with a halfway coordinated rpg squad

[short dock]

proposal: Green, yellow, red zones.

Here, the green zone is impervious to all antitank weapons whether C4, RPG TAND/HEAT, or tank HE. It can only be damaged by tank AP.

Yellow area takes semi-normal damage? 4 hits with HEAT, 3 with TAND, possibly a damage resistance to C4? Red hull zone deals 2x damage, red turret zone deals normal damage but destroys most of the tank's reserve ammo.

The idea is two parts

• tank is more durable, much more durable, for pushing. will win most headons just because with decent position/situ awareness, you can just lol lmao a lot of damage and control how fast you die

• tank is more possible to withdraw with, so tankers are encouraged to take risks. at the same time, they are still vulnerable.

the ideal situation is that you force the tank to withdraw when it hits like 50-25% health, or maybe you punish the tank crew for sticking around by coordinating a huge attack somehow.

might come with a nerf to dispersion of HE shells to really hammer home "no, stop using this as an artillery vehicle"

[rich spruce]

Unfortunately, making the tank strongest on the front actively pushes it to further ranges, so it’s not ideal for what the community seems to want tanks to be

This is better for realism but I’m not so sure about fun.

[desert cove]

Well, nothing exept its removal from the game is in line with what community wants it to be

[short dock]

Hmm, fair point. Those who don't want to risk it will just sit back and take advantage. Opinion retracted.

[desert cove]

That's why vehicles should get buffed in survivability from rear and sides. Also from top. Top should share survivability of front, to not allow for frontal hits to ignore armour hitbox and deal side damage.

That's how MBT's survivability is done in Planetside 2. This is HEAT equivalent.

Side and rear damage is much lower, which is reaonable, given the sheer amount of enemy players near you, easily 99+ enemies during a proper fight, so scale is very simmilar to BBR.

With that amount of enemies, you will get flanked quickly, so the vehicle design needs to account for that.

It's also worth noting that Ps2 vehicles are much more available and expendable than those in BBR, and infantry has less options to fight against them, yet they still die quickly, and can be dealth with without any problem, unless you meet armour collumn of half a dozen of them. Vehicles are also much more efficient against eachother.

Here's how effective AP shell is against enemy MBT's

[rich spruce]

I agree, this system seems a bit better suited to BBR than what we have now

[desert cove]

Yes it does. Because it was designed to work and be fun, unlike BBR, when vehicles are here only to check a box on "things to have in FPS game" list and not to offer players a good and fun expirience.

Because that's irrational, no one does that, right?

Right?

[short dock]

tbh this sounds pretty good
maybe im just too inoffensive brained
ppl want to be able to kill tanks on their own
when they're functionally a team asset here...

[rich spruce]

It’s ok to be able to kill it on your own, just not in two seconds starting as soon as you get near. Should be something of a boss fight tbh

[desert cove]

Exactly. Everyone wants to and can ba a super soldier than can solo a fully crewed MBT, and that happen often enough to contribute to thier poor gameplay. This is teamwork game, but there is no incentive for teamwork when everyone can do everything.

[desert cove]

Suuure man. The only way I see it happening in teamwork focused game is if enginerr will spec out thier loadout solely for AT purpose, we talking about becoming OTP here, and then only when tank or IFV is afk and not fighting back. Otherwise if you allow everyone to engage vehicles at even ground, with no class requirements, we are at the point we are now.
Terrible gameplay, infantry is very much favoritised, and 127 guys can fuck up your game just by happening to be nearby you at the right time.

[short dock]

pfft
realistic tank* when
shrug off like 20 hits but they can take out the machinegun turret, optics, etc

[desert cove]

Hardcore maybe?

[cedar ember]

As is tanks just can't push with infantry. I tried, but it's just not possible. And the long respawn times punish you for trying to push.

[desert cove]

"tanks shouldn't push, it's not realistic (it very much is since 1916). You should be sitting on a hill camping"

Says every mf complaining about vehicle camping and being "op", whatever that means

[rich spruce]

tanks in their initial forms kinda had to be for pushing as they couldn't hit anything over a hundred meters away and longer range anti tank weapons didn't exist

Moving into an insecure area with limited sightlines kinda defeats the purpose of a tank as they are currently built

[desert cove]

Yet they do that every time there is a need for it. Like, really, there is A LOT of pictures, videos, any kind of proof that they do.

And this is a game so aggresive pushing >>>>> obnoxious camping

[rich spruce]

Also a lot of them being blown up in such scenarios

by concentrating armour frontally and having a limited rate of cannon rotation there is a natural bias to fight at as long a range as practical

[desert cove]

Well, BBR is a game tho

[rich spruce]

A game where tanks have concentrated frontal armour and limited turret rotation speeds

That would need to be improved upon to make them viable closer up

[desert cove]

No one ever said vehicles are well designed

[cedar ember]

You could argue that the aiming system in the tanks we have is so bad, it isn't effective at range lol.

[desert cove]

You know what? I will argue that.

If tanks are supposed to be fire support assets, not intended to push with infantry, why can't I aim precisely my HE shots? I need to guess when it will land, and I will probably guess wrong. HE has 'effective' range of 150-200m, above that drop off takes more luck than skill.
If I am supposed to sit on a hill in relative safety, because pushing and aggresive gameplay is a NO, why I can't do that right? It defeats the purpose of such platfrom in the first place.

Tanks can't push like in any BF, tanks can't do proper fire suport/AT like in Squad or Ps2. What are they supposed to do then? Look good in trailers and be easy to kill because developers don't like them?

Oh, wait...

That's it it seems

[cedar ember]

Exactly my thought.

Though IMO, give tanks bullet drop sight system. Just at its base this is necessary.

Really they should give bullet drop sights to all vehicles.

[hard palm]

RPG, tank and BTR hits should not exert an impulse on vehicles. It's completely nonsensical that an RPG can cause a BTR to spin a full 90 degrees, likewise for a tank shot, likewise for BTRs shooting LAVs. It neither makes sense nor makes for enjoyable gameplay

[tawny merlin]

The tanks and APCs featured in the game have elements that seem to lack consistency with reality. Poor visibility is considered as a weak point of the vehicle, while the effectiveness of anti-tank weapons is insufficient, the anti-tank capabilities of the vehicle are insufficient, and the low power of the high-explosive projectiles fired. These inconsistencies can also be problematic in terms of game balance. In such cases, the vehicle should be given a more appropriate weakness rather than its current one.

The "proper" weakness is related to operability. This may detract from the casual gameplay, but it's important to make the vehicle's controls more realistic. For example, constraints on operation may be introduced, such as the operation of the shifting lever or the reduction of the rotational speed of the turret ring. Another option is to make AIM with the mouse impossible and use the keyboard for everything.

The point is that vehicles are never infantry bait or extras. These vehicles play an important role on the battlefield and should have a good balance of their abilities and weaknesses.

[desert cove]

Literally not in this game man

Half of the playerbase are bots, no one will do gear shifts

[rich spruce]

“The effectiveness of anti tank weapons is insufficient”

No, they are unrealistically easy to use and potent. Almost every player carries equipment on them to kill a tank in two seconds if they get close enough.
Reducing turret rotation speed pushes tanks to further ranges still, which is not what we want for them to be interesting.

[cedar ember]

I mean if we were talking real life, modern tanks are basically mobile artillery lol.

But if we look more at the WWII tanks, they were a beast and infantry feared them.

[tawny merlin]

Anti-tank weapons refer to AP shells for tank guns, not infantry-portable anti-tank weapons.

[rich spruce]

In that case I agree.

[desert cove]

Yeah, that's weird as fuck. In every game vehicles are very good if not the best at fighting other vehicles. Yet in BBR medic is better at anti tank role than a MBT. That's at best, questionable design choice, probably something more.

[cedar ember]

It is quite literally a strategy to fire one tank shell and then hop out and finish it off with a tandem. its almost 6x faster.

[gritty jungle]

Are the devs going to do something with the vehicles, are they going to fix them???

[desert cove]

Honestly, with thier record of vehicles changes is past year and a half. I doubt

They nerfed APC at one point

[cedar ember]

They nerfed pretty much all of the vehicles at least once, if not more.

But yeah, I already moved on from this game. Its clear they are going for a COD like game, not a Battlefield like game.

There has been LOTS of great feedback in this thread, but alas to many of us it seems to fall on deaf ears.

[shadow obsidian]

I don't know if this was suggested before, but rappelling ropes in helicopters should be deployed by default. Many people don't know how to use ropes and, unfortunately, not everyone speaks English and I'm tired of being stuck in a heli, 50m above ground while the pilot hovers over the objectives (not capping them, just above them), it's annoying. And I bet it's annoying not just for me but for other people in said helicopter.

If the pilot would like to roll up the ropes then they would be able to do that, but the ropes would be deployed by default so that the passengers could actually use the helicopter instead of being stuck in the air.

[tough nimbus]

I feel the implementation of an Anti-Air vehicle could be lots of fun.

[desert cove]

We don't have enough aircraft, especially combat ones to add AA

[rancid hound]

Hello. Probably many have already encountered allies who deliberately destroy allied equipment. Example: You have taken an advantageous position in a jeep with a machine gun and begin to destroy the enemy, at this moment, your ally gets into your vehicle and deliberately drives straight towards the enemy where you die.
What do I suggest? Add the ability to purchase vehicles for points and also add the ability to close purchased vehicles.

[tough nimbus]

I certainly do agree that that is a good and viable argument. However if not AA then maybe a rocket launcher that can lock onto aircraft could be the better alternative? Little Birds/Hermits are absolute menaces that are difficult to deal with if in the hands of a good pilot and they just wrack up kills with very little to no deaths. Thoughts?

[desert cove]

Rocket launcher that can lock onto aircraft is the AA we are talking about

[tough nimbus]

Well before I was referring to an actual AA vehicle.. cause we are in a vehicle specific feedback channel. 🤷🏻‍♂️

But I also haven’t been following updates and other info and feedback channels all that much lately since I’ve been busy so if that is what you are referring too then that’d be cool

[desert cove]

Imo, AA vehicle has more sense, because they can be used against ground targets. The problem is with giving everyone acces to AA. There can be one gun based AA per team, especially if it can effectively target things other than helis imo

[warm abyss]

we already got the APC's autocannon which can one tap them I suppose

So would the AA be only missiles or?

[desert cove]

No. No kind of missles would work currently if at all. Guns only.
The thing with APC's is that they shouldn't be as good at killing helis with rotor one tap. That's kinda brokes and super easy to do. Definitely needs changes.

So if that would be solved, and APC would need to go for main body, it will be much less effective in AA role

Then you could have something like LAV-AD and Tunguska, so high rate of fire, high velocity, medicore L vehicles damage vehicles in mainly AA role, than can do some fire support at ground level, like destroying jeeps, quads, and killing infantry.
That would work, but still there is no reason for it thb

[proven tree]

I know it would be a colossal amount of work but armored trains for each side would be sick. you could load up a tank on it and carry it to flank the other team or use it as a mobile resupply. some mg/mk19 turrets on it. specific spots that you can destroy rail and need an engineer to fix or the train will derail. simply, some train play would be cool

[acoustic fractal]

trains would be cool, there are rails and trains models already on the game, so it makes sense

[undone perch]

Armored trains would be out of place given the setting and that only the Russians would use them.

[desert cove]

The latter thing is ok imo. I would welcome some asymetry in the game

Makes things more intresting

[acoustic fractal]

This game is not trying to be realistic, so i don't see the problem

[ionic patio]

Horn is unpleasant to use

[undone perch]

Asymmetry based on IRL:
Russians: We get an armored train.
Americans: Our ammo packs actually have ammo, our medkits actually heal, and we have an AC-130 on speed dial.

[acoustic fractal]

Just give it to the americans too

[undone perch]

Bro the last time the US used armored trains was the American Civil War in 1865.

[undone perch]

Having asymmetry would certainly make things more interesting, especially with the tank and APC.

Generally, the US vehicles could receive more ammo and more accurate weapons but slower firing and reloading weapons while the RU vehicles have faster reloading and firing but less accuracy and ammo capacity. Bringing elevation angles consistent with the real vehicles would better set them apart.

The Abrams should have better elevation and depression angles than the T-90M but with substantial gun depression restrictions to the rear, and of course is much larger. BTR gets better gun elevation with 70 vs the LAV’s 60, but LAV gets better gun depression at 8 vs the BTR’s 5.

The US vehicles would be better suited for more passive play where the elevation angles allow for better use of cover, while the RU vehicles are better at going “fuck it yolo.”

[shrewd trellis]

atvs should not be at the front of spawn as trying to drive through the sea of them at the start is near imposable at times. and the amount of times ive gotten through all but one and getting mariocarted is going to make holes in my wall